| 00:02.50 | Paul58 | Thanks |
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| 14:49.55 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: yeah, I noticed |
| 14:50.19 | brlcad | that was the cvs2svn conversion processing through the night |
| 14:50.37 | MinuteElectron | Ahh. |
| 14:50.45 | brlcad | six hours into it, it filled up the disks (around 8am) |
| 14:51.09 | brlcad | i'll need to make more room apparently :) |
| 14:51.15 | MinuteElectron | :D |
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| 17:26.45 | brlcad | arg arg arg.. |
| 17:27.11 | brlcad | going to take several hours to retry the cvs2svn, have to move a lot of data around and do a few system backups |
| 17:28.03 | brlcad | hopefully eta later tonight (EST) will have it crunching again though |
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| 18:26.33 | MinuteElectron | Grr, this is clearly a case against emacs saving backup files as <filename>~ because if they are in the web root then stuff can get published that you might not neccesserily want to (i.e. passwords). |
| 18:36.18 | brlcad | eep |
| 18:36.45 | brlcad | (not that there should be any passwords in the web root) |
| 18:37.26 | brlcad | just about finished with the space cleanup so cvs2svn can start again |
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| 18:39.09 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Yeah, but before moving the passwords out they were in webroot - fourtunatley you\I didn't use emacs to replace them. :D |
| 18:39.47 | brlcad | heh, true |
| 18:40.03 | brlcad | hm, I could also add an apache directive to forbid all ~ files |
| 18:40.11 | MinuteElectron | Aye |
| 18:40.52 | MinuteElectron | But probably more trouble than it's worth, as long as people know that such a thing could happen. |
| 18:50.51 | brlcad | done |
| 18:51.13 | brlcad | should now give forbidden on any ~ or .bak url |
| 18:51.34 | MinuteElectron | :) |
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| 22:25.17 | yukonbob | hello, 2008. |
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| 03:02.45 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/edit.png <---- happy new year |
| 05:33.43 | Axman6 | ow |
| 05:33.54 | Axman6 | happy new year man ;) |
| 05:37.46 | brlcad | happy new year to you! |
| 05:43.13 | fenn | iges is so much easier to understand than STEP |
| 05:43.58 | fenn | i love it |
| 05:44.18 | brlcad | you have a copy of the step standard? |
| 05:44.33 | fenn | no, i've (tried to) read the drafts |
| 05:45.13 | brlcad | i wasn't aware of any available drafts for ap203/214 |
| 05:46.37 | brlcad | iges is much easier, but inherintly more limited too .. and very much a dying format regardless |
| 05:54.03 | fenn | you used to be able to download the pdf here http://www.tc184-sc4.org/SC4_Open/SC4 Legacy Products (2001-08)/STEP_(10303)/200-299/documentation.cfm?CFID=423101&CFTOKEN=29217573&LID=10000&state=2#10000 |
| 05:57.21 | brlcad | huh, not since at least the last two years iirc, at least I was on that same section two years ago and it wasn't there |
| 05:58.07 | brlcad | at least not for 203/214 .. just the schema and some of the addendum/corrections |
| 05:58.26 | brlcad | and a few of the low-level ap's like 11 and 21 |
| 05:58.27 | yukonbob | happy new year, cadheads |
| 05:58.32 | brlcad | happy new year! |
| 05:58.43 | yukonbob | how're things, my friend? |
| 05:59.25 | brlcad | going pretty good |
| 05:59.55 | brlcad | been pushing the repository conversion forward along with debugging the hundreds of changes I coded up while on the road.. |
| 06:00.30 | brlcad | hopefully won't run out of disk space this time.. |
| 06:01.19 | yukonbob | cvs -> ??? (svn?) |
| 06:21.03 | brlcad | yes, svn |
| 06:21.10 | brlcad | that's been the plan for over a year |
| 06:21.41 | Axman6 | what's been so hard? |
| 06:22.33 | brlcad | nothing been too hard yet other than having it process for over six hours only to fill up all avail disk space :) |
| 06:23.13 | brlcad | the plan was that we'd convert for 2008 (more specifically by the end of 2007 but close enough) |
| 06:23.54 | Axman6 | haha |
| 06:25.40 | brlcad | all that should be left will be to verify that the repo was indeed fully/faithfully/completely converted over, which will take some time |
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| 08:31.32 | Axman6 | and like i said, i'm not using macports atm |
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| 12:58.19 | fenn | is archer ready for linux yet? does this sound familiar? ./lib/tkimg.so: undefined symbol: tclStubsPtr |
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| 20:47.58 | brlcad | fenn: it should be ready -- i had it compiled and working for 7.10.4 locally |
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| 02:03.22 | brlcad | now with a slew of options .. mime-types, eol settings, encodings, revnums, and more |
| 02:14.41 | yukonbob | ?hobbles |
| 02:21.14 | brlcad | hobbles off to the gym ;) |
| 02:21.21 | brlcad | or at least i'll probably hobble back |
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| 14:40.21 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
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| 16:28.50 | brlcad | so the svn upgrade seems to be working well so far -- copied, fixed, annotated, converted, dumped, imported, and now testing |
| 16:29.57 | brlcad | some interesting numbers, about 650MB CVS repo, a 2.8GB SVN dumpfile, and a 500MB SVN repo |
| 16:30.14 | poolio | alloo |
| 16:30.27 | brlcad | Total CVS Files: 20129 |
| 16:30.28 | brlcad | Total CVS Revisions: 147518 |
| 16:30.28 | brlcad | Total CVS Branches: 73241 |
| 16:30.28 | brlcad | Total CVS Tags: 281875 |
| 16:30.28 | brlcad | Total Unique Tags: 78 |
| 16:30.30 | brlcad | Total Unique Branches: 32 |
| 16:30.33 | brlcad | CVS Repos Size in KB: 516599 |
| 16:30.35 | brlcad | Total SVN Commits: 29885 |
| 16:30.38 | brlcad | First Revision Date: Thu Dec 15 19:06:47 1983 |
| 16:30.40 | brlcad | Last Revision Date: Mon Dec 31 15:25:14 2007 |
| 16:30.49 | poolio | Wow. |
| 16:31.37 | brlcad | interesting that it's cvs repo size doesn't match du |
| 16:31.45 | brlcad | s/it's/its/ |
| 16:33.03 | brlcad | also interesting that cvs2svn calculated 29885 collapsed commits while ohloh counts 27635 |
| 16:33.45 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: sounds like changing from CVS to SVN |
| 16:33.45 | brlcad | hm, or the discrepancy is branch activity |
| 16:34.06 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:34.11 | brlcad | what I've been working on the past few days |
| 16:53.14 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/rcstemplate: add a commit template that points users to the svn repo (precursor to outright preventing commits during this migration). |
| 16:53.27 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/checkoutlist: check out the rcstemplate |
| 16:56.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/rcsinfo: use the log template that informs committers that the repository is moving/moved (so should not commit..) |
| 17:01.42 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/checkoutlist: test template, sort |
| 17:13.23 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/avail: enable CVS access control, add an avail file that only allows mods to CVSROOT |
| 17:14.02 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/checkoutlist: checkout the avail file |
| 17:15.03 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10CVSROOT/commitinfo: enable CVS access control via the cvs_acls precommit hook |
| 17:16.30 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10brlcad/TODO: test acl |
| 17:58.54 | ``Erik | does that mean no more cvs commits? |
| 18:01.12 | ``Erik | ayup, post holiday diet in full effect :D |
| 18:02.34 | ``Erik | heh, "liboobs", classy |
| 18:07.37 | ``Erik | 99 little bugs in the code, 99 bugs in the code, fix one bug, compile it again... 101 little bugs in the code.... |
| 18:11.22 | ``Erik | <cesarb> Damn, every time I spawn, qf-client-x11 locks hard |
| 18:11.22 | ``Erik | <Zoid> Don't die? |
| 18:11.22 | ``Erik | <Knghtbrd> good incentive. |
| 18:11.24 | ``Erik | nice |
| 18:23.17 | ``Erik | WildCode: Debugging X is like trying to run a straight line through a maze. You just need to bend space-time so that the corners move around you and you won't have any problems. |
| 18:23.40 | ``Erik | ah, fortune, such a brilliant way to spend time as the compiles grind |
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| 19:15.47 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/xwin32.png <---- heheheh happy new year :) |
| 19:25.17 | poolio | ...another havoc eh? |
| 19:26.00 | IriX64 | heh yea havoc runs amoc :) |
| 20:11.52 | IriX64 | did you see edit.png? thats an angle-distance cursor... |
| 20:14.51 | IriX64 | your faceplate is good :) |
| 21:13.23 | brlcad | yeah, the validation is going just fine so far, so no more cvs unless a major hurdle is hit .. waiting on the dumpfile to load up now |
| 23:05.36 | louipc | nice |
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| 01:46.31 | poolio | Somewhat amusing that another project I worked on just converted repositories...svn -> git |
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| 01:54.52 | louipc | har har |
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| 03:05.59 | starseeker | git seems to be good for non-centralized projects where a lot of work goes on in separate branches and then needs to be merged back in. |
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| 17:26.02 | brlcad | hour and a half remaining on the upload |
| 17:42.08 | CIA-30 | libirc: 03brlcad * r368 10/trunk/libirc/ (AUTHORS NEWS src/ircBasicCommands.cpp): accept a patch from Barna Faragó that fixes the PONG reply to server PING requests |
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| 18:25.56 | brlcad | still has a half hour, and then however long to load (probably another half hour) |
| 18:26.17 | brlcad | nearly 3GB transfer |
| 18:26.46 | ``Erik | still on the road? |
| 18:27.19 | brlcad | nope |
| 18:27.25 | ``Erik | <-- grumpy about being back O.o :) |
| 18:27.30 | brlcad | on the couch |
| 18:27.59 | poolio | you guys still on vacation? |
| 18:32.21 | ``Erik | not I |
| 18:38.02 | brlcad | not really |
| 18:46.50 | ``Erik | "His troops would follow him anywhere ... but only out of morbid curiousity!" |
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| 00:09.19 | bjorkintosh | hmm. |
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| 00:23.32 | stuporglu1 | Could someone tell me if BRL-CAD would be an appropriate tool for the following? I want to make a TV cabinet, but I want to model it first, including a folding top and some other moving parts. If I create the cabinet in BRL-CAD, can I run it through the movements to verify that there is enough clearance for all movements? |
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| 19:19.54 | starseeker | Once again I somehow miss major news - PVS got released under the GPL. |
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| 19:59.03 | archivist | PVS? |
| 20:08.48 | fenn | http://pvs.csl.sri.com/introduction.shtml |
| 20:17.30 | archivist | hmm interesting |
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| 20:22.03 | smudla | hi folks |
| 20:24.27 | smudla | i've got some questions about brlcad, is anyone alive here? :-) |
| 20:27.31 | smudla | i'm looking for a linux 3d modeller for my design of a sailing yacht |
| 20:29.40 | fenn | for hull design or all the little bits? |
| 20:29.54 | fenn | brlcad is better for geometrically shaped bits |
| 20:29.58 | smudla | so i would like to talk to any experienced brlcad user... i was considering modelling in blender but that's really rather artistic modeller than cad |
| 20:30.33 | smudla | hull design is best to do in specialized programs like delftship etc... |
| 20:31.24 | smudla | i mean hull design in terms of stability, hydrodinamics and other marine-related stuff |
| 20:32.47 | smudla | so, for now, say that my hull (simply the hull, ie outer dimensions) is finished |
| 20:33.36 | smudla | now i need to create a precise model of whole yacht, so of course model of the hull but with all the things inside |
| 20:33.53 | fenn | why do you need to create a precise model of the yacht? |
| 20:35.38 | archivist | someone did a ship fly through movie from a brlcad model |
| 20:35.48 | smudla | heh...why are 3d models made generally... |
| 20:36.15 | archivist | better visualisation of the object |
| 20:36.17 | smudla | documentation, manufacturing data |
| 20:37.02 | archivist | I find I am faster designing in 3d nowadays |
| 20:39.08 | smudla | frankly, my boat wont be a megayacht but still, 8 metres sailing boat is too expensive thing to make it a trial-error way, so i need everything modelled before i even touch a hammer :-) |
| 20:43.22 | smudla | so, one of my questions is: is it possible to "draw" a pair of curves through precise coordinates and then to form a surface between these curves? |
| 20:44.11 | smudla | (imagine upper line of the side of the boat and the waterline for example) |
| 20:46.40 | smudla | generally irregular, non-developable surface but precisely determined using several points |
| 20:47.08 | alex_joni | sounds like NURBS modelling to me |
| 20:49.19 | smudla | exacly |
| 20:49.41 | smudla | no problem with brlcad? |
| 20:50.28 | brlcad | hello smudla |
| 20:50.56 | brlcad | smudla: are you the one that posted to the forums about hull modelling a while back? |
| 20:51.30 | smudla | no, that a different fool :-) |
| 20:51.45 | brlcad | if you can precisely define the shape of the hull in terms of existing implicit surfaces, then brl-cad will work very well for you |
| 20:52.37 | smudla | yes, i have exact coordinates of enough points on the surface to create it uniquely |
| 20:52.45 | brlcad | otherwise for arbitrary spline surfaces, you're either going to be using an experimental primitive (brl-cad has spline surfaces, but not yet production-ready) or will be using some intermediate type (BoT's with smoothed normals, for example) |
| 20:53.55 | brlcad | as for what you want to do .. drawing a pair of curves through precise coordinates .. that would usually be provided via a birail primitive |
| 20:54.04 | brlcad | which .. brl-cad does not yet have |
| 20:54.21 | smudla | maybe i dont understand the term "implicit surfaces" |
| 20:55.58 | brlcad | that's a much longer topic to explain .. but for now just think of it like whether you can construct the hull using CSG primitives instead of using a birail or spline surface |
| 20:56.53 | brlcad | here are most of the primitives supported in brl-cad: http://ftp.brlcad.org/tmp/primitives/Primitives3_grouped.png |
| 20:57.21 | brlcad | that doesn't include the developmental surfaces (superellipsoids, metaballs, and nurbs, maybe a couple others) |
| 20:57.22 | smudla | thx, i'll have a look |
| 20:59.12 | brlcad | smudla: I think you'll *really* want something that will let you model using a birail primitive if your precise dataset is pointwise, which doesn't leave you with many non-commercial CAD options |
| 20:59.20 | smudla | hmm, i can hardly imagine a hull shape created from any of these primitives... |
| 20:59.23 | brlcad | i believe blender does have a birail, but then as you mentioned, it's not great for cad |
| 20:59.46 | brlcad | smudla: you'd probably be surprised what you can make with those primitives ;) |
| 21:00.04 | smudla | yea, thats exactly what i'm coming across |
| 21:00.18 | brlcad | we do have ships in brl-cad constructed with primitives, just usually requires an entirely different design approach and thought process |
| 21:01.48 | brlcad | that said, if you're a developer, I'd be more than glad to help you implement a birail primitive :-) |
| 21:01.49 | smudla | in fact, i take brlcad as the only possibility to do my task in non-commercial cad...all other projects are significantly less developed |
| 21:02.17 | starseeker | brlcad: I'll bet the sf admins are going to shoot you when they figure out how big this svn archive is :-) I'm making a backup tarball and so far it's heading towards 8 gigs with no end in sight ;-) |
| 21:02.20 | brlcad | yeah, we're by far the most developed.. and we still need TONS of effort |
| 21:02.45 | smudla | sorry...i am a developer, but my job is hw development...so electronics...sorry :-) |
| 21:03.12 | brlcad | starseeker: the archive itself is much more compressed |
| 21:03.27 | brlcad | you're doing a checkout of the top-level? |
| 21:03.29 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 21:03.49 | starseeker | More or less by mistake - I just grabbed the command on sf's svn page |
| 21:04.22 | brlcad | e.g. if I tagged the repository 100 times, it'll be 100x size on checkout but only 1x + few bytes per tag in the repository |
| 21:04.35 | brlcad | yeah, their instructions are a bit wonky |
| 21:04.35 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 21:04.42 | starseeker | that explains a lot |
| 21:04.45 | brlcad | thought they do warn in not so many words |
| 21:05.14 | starseeker | I'm too used to the cvs side I guess... |
| 21:05.16 | brlcad | I suspect a full top-level checkout is going to be .. huge |
| 21:05.23 | starseeker | It was |
| 21:05.46 | PrezKennedy | sourceforge is turning evil |
| 21:07.54 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 21:08.23 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: how so? |
| 21:09.22 | PrezKennedy | window popped up asking me if i wanted to be notified if paid support for the program i was downloading became available |
| 21:09.23 | brlcad | looks like there is about 100 tags and branches so it's going to be about 100x the real size .. which looks like about 50-200 MB/tag|branch |
| 21:09.31 | brlcad | ewww |
| 21:09.58 | PrezKennedy | still like it for the software of course... but they just seem to be piling on junk now to make a buck |
| 21:10.25 | brlcad | some marketing weenie has gotten ahold of their web team -- they've been trying to push the new marketplace for a couple months |
| 21:11.07 | brlcad | first with some exceptionally annoyingly bright gold "button" (which they later toned way way down) |
| 21:11.14 | starseeker | brlcad: How long until the cvs repo goes away in favor of svn? few months testing time? |
| 21:11.15 | PrezKennedy | they should try making forums that dont suck... thats where most the support takes place |
| 21:12.44 | starseeker | Holiday gatherings always seem to be a guarantee of importing some exotic code germ from somewhere... |
| 21:12.55 | brlcad | starseeker: um, probably never "away", unless you mean no longer displayed .. but yeah, probably a release or two after svn is fully verified |
| 21:13.39 | starseeker | brlcad: I was just thinking if future development was taking place only in svn, having the cvs repo still listed could cause some confusion when people checked it out and saw no changes... |
| 21:13.52 | curious | starseeker, sorry for continuing offtopic , but if you will google for 'transfer factor' you can turn that bug into feature |
| 21:14.04 | curious | starseeker, there are easy immunization methods. |
| 21:14.39 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, I know that |
| 21:14.49 | brlcad | that's what I meant about it being "hidden" but not really going away |
| 21:15.02 | brlcad | i.e. it won't be deleted, but yeah, not displayed |
| 21:15.06 | starseeker | right. I just didn't know when the cvs tree would stop receiving updates |
| 21:15.19 | brlcad | that's already happened |
| 21:15.23 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 21:15.44 | brlcad | unless I run into a big problem this week |
| 21:15.51 | starseeker | righto :-) |
| 21:15.56 | PrezKennedy | murphy's law |
| 21:16.00 | smudla | brlcad: you mentioned some forum, where could i find it? |
| 21:17.15 | brlcad | already verified several things so far: successful dump and clean import, ability to extract full log, still trying to verify ability to checkout everything (first attempt failed in branches) |
| 21:17.38 | brlcad | smudla: I didn't mention any forums, but we do have forums up on sourceforge |
| 21:17.45 | brlcad | http://sourceforge.net/forum/?group_id=105292 |
| 21:17.54 | starseeker | pretty impressive, given that you're probably close to a record for size of history being converted ;-) |
| 21:18.39 | smudla | 21:50:53 <brlcad> smudla: are you the one that posted to the forums about hull modelling a while back? |
| 21:19.18 | brlcad | ooooh, so I did *blush* |
| 21:19.25 | smudla | ;-) |
| 21:19.35 | smudla | thanks a lot, anyway :-) |
| 21:21.59 | brlcad | I think I was thinking of this message: http://sourceforge.net/forum/message.php?msg_id=4351966 |
| 21:22.18 | brlcad | a skin primitive would also have helped with what you're trying to do |
| 21:24.09 | brlcad | which might change too :) |
| 21:24.26 | brlcad | right now it was all imported as a single-project repository |
| 21:24.35 | brlcad | i'm *really* not sure that I like it that way |
| 21:25.00 | starseeker | Hmm. You thinking to break out the major libraries into their own repositories? |
| 21:25.09 | brlcad | no no |
| 21:25.36 | brlcad | when you set up conversion from cvs to svn, you can do it as a single repository or as multiple projects |
| 21:25.47 | starseeker | Oh, OK. |
| 21:26.06 | brlcad | mostly impacting where the trunk/tags/branches triplets are -- one at the top-level, or one for each module |
| 21:26.54 | brlcad | difference of needing to do svn co https://brlcad.svn.sf.net:/svnroot/brlcad/trunk/brlcad brlcad versus svn co https://brlcad.svn.sf.net:/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 21:27.30 | starseeker | Got it. |
| 21:29.23 | starseeker | The more fine-grained approach does seem to make sense |
| 21:30.56 | smudla | brlcad: thanks for the link, it seems to be interesting, maybe i wont give up my brlcad-efforts :-) |
| 21:32.20 | brlcad | smudla: best of luck to you whichever path you take, of course |
| 21:32.40 | brlcad | I really do hope we get nurbs and birail primitives working soon, there's just so much to do that one has to choose their battles |
| 21:34.20 | starseeker | Niiice. The svn configure uses the system libs in all but 4 cases |
| 21:34.52 | smudla | brlcad: is there any estimation of "soon"? :-) |
| 21:35.56 | smudla | i mean if we are talking about months or years... |
| 21:37.45 | brlcad | smudla: entirely depends on how many developers are working on what .. which does tend to fluctuate drastically |
| 21:37.51 | brlcad | ~spell drastically |
| 21:37.57 | brlcad | huh |
| 21:38.59 | brlcad | I can say, however, that fully NURBS representation support is our #1 core priority at the moment, followed closely by STEP conversion support |
| 21:40.08 | smudla | so good luck |
| 21:40.15 | brlcad | that effort alone exhausts most existing developer resources for the next 6 months minimum |
| 21:41.06 | brlcad | that said .. a birail primitive wouldn't really be that hard for a dev.. probably could be fully implemented in less than a month with guidance |
| 21:41.09 | smudla | again, pity that i'm a hardware guy so i can't contribute with code |
| 21:44.59 | Z80-Boy | smudla: hehe nekdo z cech? |
| 21:46.13 | smudla | kusuj vole, be social and speak in english... i'm doing my best although my english is terrible :-) |
| 21:46.57 | Z80-Boy | smudla: where are you from? |
| 21:47.10 | smudla | Pilsen |
| 22:02.24 | starseeker | Sweet - NSIS! |
| 22:02.40 | starseeker | Good news indeed |
| 22:11.39 | brlcad | smudla: your english is great |
| 22:11.50 | brlcad | better than many westerners ;) |
| 22:12.06 | starseeker | Indeed :-) |
| 22:12.20 | starseeker | All we speak over here is American :-P |
| 22:13.32 | smudla | haha...stop making fun of me :-D |
| 22:16.18 | smudla | i cannot find any debian package of brlcad...you probably don't know about some too...? |
| 22:19.49 | brlcad | not yet properly integrated with apt yet |
| 22:19.58 | brlcad | a couple have worked on it, but nobody to completion |
| 22:20.10 | brlcad | there is a .deb for 7.8.4 on the website iirc |
| 22:21.04 | brlcad | that should work fine for a new user, otherwise you can compile from source and it'll install isolated into /usr/brlcad |
| 22:22.01 | smudla | that seems to be the best way |
| 22:23.15 | smudla | maybe i can start with older version, you're right...now i'm interested mostly in the ARS primitive |
| 22:23.45 | smudla | because "waterline" sounds quite familiar to me :-) |
| 22:30.23 | brlcad | :-) |
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| 23:02.00 | smudla | i'm browsing the documentation of brlcad but i can't find any detailed info about primitives...where could i for example learn about how to input the waterlines? |
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| 01:37.15 | brlcad | ahh |
| 02:23.07 | starseeker | ahh? |
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| 05:03.49 | Axman6 | ahh! |
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| 07:29.43 | brlcad | ahh. :) |
| 07:44.49 | poolio | oooooh. |
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| 15:31.44 | brlcad | now to figure out the apparent svn checkout glitch on cup.g |
| 15:41.34 | MinuteElectron | Drupal on new BRL-CAD has been taken into off-line mode due to a security breach, I'll bring it back up once I work out how the security breach was able to occur and have cleaned it up. |
| 15:42.13 | brlcad | eek |
| 15:42.18 | brlcad | okay, thanks |
| 15:42.23 | brlcad | what did you notice? |
| 15:43.18 | MinuteElectron | Some guy e-mailed me saying he could make himself a superuser, so i checked and there are about 5 or 10 superusers when there should only be two. |
| 15:43.32 | MinuteElectron | I know why, fixing as we speak. |
| 15:45.08 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Are you wanting anyone to be able to edit the pages? |
| 15:45.11 | Z80-Boy | Drupal is the new website? |
| 15:45.21 | brlcad | please do share why, so I can avoid it elsewhere (perhaps via pm) |
| 15:45.58 | brlcad | depends which pages |
| 15:45.58 | Z80-Boy | I had twiki on Ronja and it also security breached, despite the fact I applied the annoyingly complicated security patches they issued |
| 15:45.58 | brlcad | for most of the drupal page, no not really .. for the wiki, sure |
| 15:45.59 | Z80-Boy | Then I had mediawiki and it got filled with viagra spam |
| 15:46.56 | MinuteElectron | I accidentally set up the permissions system so that "authenticated users" could do some of the admin stuff - but since anyone can create an account loads of people became authenticated users and could do what they liked with the settings. So, my fault. |
| 15:47.58 | brlcad | you've said both those before Z80-Boy .. think you had mediawiki "poorly" configured as I've been spamfree on other hosts for nearly a year now with the right measures in place |
| 15:48.33 | Z80-Boy | it's a similar type of incident |
| 15:48.37 | brlcad | ah, so just a misconfiguration |
| 15:48.44 | Z80-Boy | I mean especially the twiki one |
| 15:48.48 | brlcad | I wouldn't consider that a security breach |
| 15:48.55 | Z80-Boy | no the twiki one was configured properly and I applied the right patches |
| 15:49.10 | brlcad | wasn't referring to you :) |
| 15:49.18 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Well, they accesed pages that they shouldn't have access too. |
| 15:49.31 | MinuteElectron | And someone screwed about with the sidebar a bit. |
| 15:49.37 | brlcad | sure, not good to have :) |
| 15:49.54 | brlcad | just no more of a breach than if I add all users to wheel on a server :) |
| 15:50.01 | MinuteElectron | sure |
| 15:50.03 | brlcad | just not good :) |
| 15:50.13 | brlcad | nice of the guy to e-mail though |
| 15:50.33 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: What is the status of moving the site to live? |
| 15:50.57 | brlcad | is everything done with the new redesign now? |
| 15:51.06 | brlcad | wrt ie6 |
| 15:52.01 | MinuteElectron | Yep, everything is good to go except for some forms in the administration pages which have a temporary hack to make them not drop to the bottom of the page - although I'm looking into fixing that. |
| 15:52.21 | MinuteElectron | oh, and I have to reenable the sidebar following our "misconfiguration". |
| 15:53.18 | MinuteElectron | Oh, right. |
| 15:53.22 | brlcad | ooh, nice ... it works better! |
| 15:53.34 | MinuteElectron | The poll didn't jsut disspaear - you set up a "Poll duration". |
| 15:53.36 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: : |
| 15:53.38 | MinuteElectron | :) |
| 15:53.41 | brlcad | almost flawless, some problems with some of the bezels |
| 15:54.35 | MinuteElectron | That is because of the alpha transparency flattening thing - there is a solution to that in IE6 w/ JS, but not without. I'll add that to the top of my list. |
| 15:54.52 | MinuteElectron | Is there anything else of concern preventing the site from going live? |
| 15:54.54 | brlcad | hrm? |
| 15:54.58 | brlcad | the header looks perfect |
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| 15:55.06 | brlcad | search and footer look perfect |
| 15:55.31 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: I thought you meant bezel as in the header, when you resize the window to very small the overlap is a bit wierd. |
| 15:55.38 | MinuteElectron | Which bezel are you talking about? |
| 15:55.46 | brlcad | only the bottom of the rounded boxes in the content area have a problem |
| 15:56.08 | MinuteElectron | Oh, yeah. |
| 15:56.33 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron: there's also a small 3D flaw :) |
| 15:56.54 | alex_joni | the text "OPEN SOURCE SOLID MODELING" is in fron of that cube.. right? |
| 15:57.08 | MinuteElectron | yes, |
| 15:57.25 | brlcad | bezel is the rounded edge on the boxes -- there's a bezel on the top menu, the search boxes, the right panel boxes, and the main page's brl-cad description |
| 15:57.27 | alex_joni | there is some other graphics behind that text and behind the DOWNLOAD link |
| 15:57.37 | brlcad | all of the bezels are right except for those last two |
| 15:58.04 | alex_joni | if you resize the browser to very small then the other graphic is in front of the black base the cube sits on |
| 15:58.18 | MinuteElectron | yeah, ok - I'll increase the minimum width to fix this flaw |
| 15:58.23 | Z80-Boy | let's model a 3D gym and then get some open source solid muscles |
| 15:58.34 | Z80-Boy | or we can at least model muscles |
| 15:58.45 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron: nah, don't worry.. maybe you can put it on another layer? |
| 15:58.53 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: I think it can be fixed just by layering it underneath the left title |
| 15:59.08 | MinuteElectron | maybe, I'll look into it |
| 15:59.15 | alex_joni | imo, it's not a real flaw.. |
| 15:59.39 | alex_joni | but since brlcad is a 3D app.. it might be annoying for CAD freaks :P |
| 16:00.02 | brlcad | right now it's over, so small windows see the overlap |
| 16:00.22 | brlcad | i could live with that one -- the bezel error is more disturbing |
| 16:00.34 | MinuteElectron | ok |
| 16:01.14 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, whats the uptime on your bz server? |
| 16:02.11 | MinuteElectron | up 116 days, 12:55 |
| 16:02.58 | PrezKennedy | the best ive managed is 50 on this windows 2003 server before i had to reboot for updates... |
| 16:03.20 | MinuteElectron | On bz there was once 499 days 10 hours. |
| 16:04.03 | PrezKennedy | its running freebsd isnt it? |
| 16:04.17 | MinuteElectron | yep |
| 16:06.23 | MinuteElectron | Ok, so from what I can see there are two design bugs that need fixing before going live. I'll do these once asap - other than that is there anything else that needs doing? |
| 16:07.36 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: the "uptime" commmand will tell you ;) but yeah, what ME said for both |
| 16:08.16 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i know... after i asked i went and downloaded putty and logged in |
| 16:09.03 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:09.11 | brlcad | you want a better ssh client? |
| 16:09.23 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: http://my.brlcad.org/tmp/bezel.jpg is what I'm seeing |
| 16:09.32 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, whats the name of it? |
| 16:09.38 | PrezKennedy | if you say linux i wont be impressed :-P |
| 16:10.12 | brlcad | only messes up the bottom bezel for the first box, then top and bottom for the next ones .. making me think it might just be an extra open/close tag |
| 16:10.35 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: heh, no .. the SSH client from SSH Communications |
| 16:10.35 | MinuteElectron | yeah |
| 16:10.58 | brlcad | the last free version they provided before they closed it up and made it pay-only |
| 16:11.38 | PrezKennedy | is it still available on their site or will i have to hunt it down? |
| 16:12.43 | brlcad | you'll need to uber super secret url |
| 16:12.52 | brlcad | and the secret handshake |
| 16:14.28 | alex_joni | brlcad: how is it better then putty? |
| 16:15.47 | brlcad | mm, hard to describe .. putty is pretty bare bones |
| 16:16.49 | brlcad | ssh's has a really nice gui with toggles for sftp/ssh, explorer-like interface, session and key management, pretty user-friendly as you can get |
| 16:17.55 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: heh, a lot of good that did me :) |
| 16:18.18 | PrezKennedy | i like it |
| 16:18.23 | PrezKennedy | thanks brlcad :) |
| 16:18.41 | brlcad | it's good stuff |
| 16:19.04 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: heh |
| 16:19.47 | PrezKennedy | when i finally get tired of games altogether ill go linux or mac :P |
| 16:21.06 | alex_joni | brlcad: do the keys work outside of it? |
| 16:21.13 | alex_joni | e.g. using ssh keys for cvs |
| 16:24.07 | brlcad | beats me |
| 16:25.45 | brlcad | it's a client circa '97 or so, before SSH Communications got all fancy and started tossing in the kitchen sink features and truely seamless explorer integration |
| 16:27.42 | brlcad | like I said, their last free version they provided .. I just find it useful for those rare times that I'm actually on Windows (but still needing to get off of Windows) |
| 16:29.20 | alex_joni | I like putty.. especially late versions are great |
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| 17:21.00 | poolio | brlcad: My school paid for it and I use the new non-free version when not in a unix-based OS :) |
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| 20:23.20 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 20:24.23 | poolio | howdy bob |
| 20:25.29 | yukonbob | hey poolio :) -- what's shaking? |
| 20:29.17 | poolio | me. got some sort of disease :) |
| 20:59.20 | yukonbob | poolio: ? |
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| 22:04.14 | poolio | brlcad: you around? |
| 22:06.11 | brlcad | often |
| 22:07.19 | brlcad | poolio: whatcha need? |
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| 01:11.14 | brlcad | blasted .. http://www.boingboing.net/2008/01/07/making-3d-models-fro.html |
| 01:35.48 | brlcad | right in line with my research idea, sans the manual user hinting |
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| 13:47.22 | ``Erik | hehehe "lynix" |
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| 14:36.06 | PrezKennedy | so i heard about this cool new thing with a penguin called lunix |
| 14:38.34 | ``Erik | heh, I vaguelly recall a "lunix" being a c64 unix |
| 14:38.56 | ``Erik | why, yes, from '93, http://lng.sourceforge.net/ |
| 14:40.06 | PrezKennedy | SourceForge -- It's forever... |
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| 21:19.17 | yukonbob | afternoon cadheads |
| 21:21.21 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 21:22.01 | iraytrace | afternoon. |
| 21:28.37 | yukonbob | :) Happy New Year... what's shaking, folks? |
| 21:28.53 | brlcad | busy day |
| 21:29.06 | brlcad | too much to do, too few devs to do it :) |
| 21:53.06 | iraytrace | So pretty much a normal day then. ;-) |
| 21:57.34 | brlcad | heh, yup |
| 22:16.54 | yukonbob | nice... |
| 22:16.57 | yukonbob | :) |
| 22:17.23 | yukonbob | how's the cvs->svn going? |
| 22:48.24 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-82-35.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 23:06.47 | brlcad | yukonbob: pretty good, almost done but a few bumps that need fixing and I'm going to reimport as a multiproject instead of the default single project structuring |
| 23:11.02 | yukonbob | brlcad: nice to hear... and then from my perspective, I'll just be using svn on my local copy instead of cvs? |
| 23:12.50 | yukonbob | chat later folks -- good afternoon :) |
| 23:12.51 | yukonbob | cd ~ |
| 23:14.14 | brlcad | ah, too quick |
| 23:15.02 | brlcad | yes, just s/cvs/svn/ for the most part, though everyone will have to checkout again |
| 00:19.44 | iraytrace | What does it mean to have a "multiproject"? |
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| 04:40.25 | ``Erik | bz's blurb is totally stolen from dod reg |
| 04:40.49 | ``Erik | iirc, it's made available to all free of license issues |
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| 14:43.42 | Defcon | hey all!! |
| 14:43.54 | Defcon | have you guys seen this: http://www.acvt.com.au/research/videotrace/ |
| 14:44.03 | Defcon | [www.acvt.com.au] Australian Centre for Visual Technologies | VideoTrace: Rapid interactive scene modelling from video |
| 14:54.10 | Defcon | brlcad ? |
| 15:11.40 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matt@74.86.45.130) | |
| 15:15.18 | ``Erik | hummmm, BRL-CAD is on "rung 1" of coverities check stuff, and apparently dept of homeland insecurity is funding testing on foss crap |
| 15:19.50 | Defcon | insecurity ^^ |
| 15:23.21 | Z80-Boy | ``Erik: what do you mean particularly? |
| 15:23.42 | ``Erik | http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/01/09/0027229 |
| 15:25.05 | alex_joni | http://scan.coverity.com/rung1.html |
| 15:25.13 | ``Erik | ayup, tha'ts where we are |
| 15:25.52 | ``Erik | I'm assuming the rungs are decided with brackets on bugs per 1k lines, since we include blt which is rung0 |
| 15:27.09 | Defcon | 0.0474 defects per thousand lines of code |
| 15:27.10 | ``Erik | amusingly, vim has more lines of code than emacs, yet vim has no listed defects... :D |
| 15:27.12 | Defcon | lol |
| 15:29.17 | Z80-Boy | So IIRC, BRL-CAD being on rung1 means that Coverity provides a mailing list for security of BRL-CAD. |
| 15:30.41 | Z80-Boy | IIRC -> IIUIC |
| 15:31.06 | ``Erik | IICFOTA |
| 15:31.07 | ``Erik | :D |
| 15:31.09 | ``Erik | O:-) |
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| 17:36.47 | PrezKennedy | haha KDE has more lines of code than Linux |
| 18:38.19 | brlcad | the "178,135 lines of code" in our Rung 1 listing is a dead give-away that something's wrong ;) |
| 18:40.44 | brlcad | yeah "Coverity Prevent SQS" was the full name, company Coverity, but it is their main/only real product so coverity == prevent for the most part |
| 18:46.32 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 18:47.29 | brlcad | hm, and i'm unable to log into our coverity report .. server must be overloaded :) |
| 19:19.23 | ``Erik | um, I think there's a port block in the way. I was able to telnet to it from another machine, so I tried running firefox remote X from there and the page came up |
| 19:23.14 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@212.15.185.1) | |
| 19:32.02 | brlcad | ahh, true dat, thanks |
| 20:17.35 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-82-35.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:30.38 | PrezKennedy | somehow they let port 22 go though :-P |
| 21:42.02 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (n=yukonbob@S010600195bd5c415.lb.shawcable.net) | |
| 21:42.15 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 21:51.04 | brlcad | howdy yukonbobbers |
| 21:51.20 | yukonbob | do de do |
| 21:51.22 | yukonbob | :) |
| 21:53.05 | yukonbob | hrmm -- /me just noticed mged doesn't run from his launcher... |
| 21:54.39 | yukonbob | (dmenu, on dwm) |
| 21:56.59 | brlcad | mmm |
| 21:57.03 | brlcad | you made a launcher for it? |
| 22:03.02 | yukonbob | Alt-P in dwm |
| 22:03.10 | yukonbob | (and dmenu installed) |
| 22:09.24 | brlcad | got it |
| 22:09.54 | yukonbob | brlcad: you a dwm user? |
| 22:10.11 | brlcad | nope |
| 22:10.21 | brlcad | used pwm back in the day |
| 22:10.37 | brlcad | and blackbox/fluxbox |
| 22:10.42 | brlcad | and windowmaker |
| 22:10.51 | yukonbob | and now? |
| 22:11.01 | brlcad | emacs in a console :) |
| 22:11.05 | yukonbob | heh -- nice |
| 22:11.49 | yukonbob | better fonts ;) |
| 22:12.01 | brlcad | otherwise I'm usually on a mac .. but then still emacs in a Terminal 95% of the time i'm not using a browser or photoshop |
| 22:12.59 | yukonbob | s/emacs/xemacs/ for me, but same thing -- /me saw an emacs WM somewhere a while ago... so you could use elisp/emacs to run X if you wanted to :) |
| 22:14.25 | yukonbob | if you end up running X, /me can recommend dwm, though -- a few lines of C and that's it -- is mostly used as a tiling manager, but supports floating too -- good keybindings... |
| 22:14.38 | brlcad | yeah, I saw/tried the new aqua emacs .. it actually really impressed me to the point that I could see returning to windowed emacs |
| 22:14.51 | yukonbob | nice... |
| 22:14.52 | brlcad | but I would miss being able to ctrl-z and run command-line stuff |
| 22:14.57 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:15.17 | yukonbob | M-! foo |
| 22:15.40 | brlcad | yeah, not the same :) |
| 22:15.46 | brlcad | same with sh-mode |
| 22:16.22 | yukonbob | (if you want multiple shells) |
| 22:17.19 | brlcad | I more miss command-line editing |
| 22:17.56 | brlcad | things like tab-completion, reverse edit searches |
| 22:18.27 | yukonbob | ah -- /me uses !!, !-2, etc, then typical emacs editing, or searches backwards through the buffer ;) |
| 22:27.54 | brlcad | just not as efficient as tab-tab when doing stuff quick |
| 22:32.23 | louipc | tab rules |
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| 22:49.00 | alex_joni | would this be a nice CAD monitor? http://gizmodo.com/341413/alienware-curved-monitor-looks-like-its-from-another-planet |
| 22:49.53 | PrezKennedy | yay! time to go home! |
| 22:50.43 | louipc | I'd want a cad monitor that looks like a drafting table |
| 22:51.04 | louipc | and the table is also the input for drawing |
| 22:52.37 | brlcad | alex_joni: sure, why not .. but pixel count is usually more important than actual size |
| 22:52.52 | brlcad | high-density big multiple displays help |
| 22:53.16 | brlcad | you'd get more bang per buck with one 30" I bet |
| 22:53.26 | alex_joni | brlcad: yeah, I guess a 9MP monitor is way more usefull.. but that one loked nice |
| 22:55.03 | yukonbob | louipc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcKqyn-gUbY |
| 22:59.59 | louipc | YESS |
| 23:02.18 | yukonbob | louipc: if you're really into it, and have a DIY attitude, there are plans to build things like this on the interweb, and "touchlib", a library (originally Windows, but apparently now ported to Linux) to interpret multitouch. |
| 23:02.47 | louipc | duude |
| 23:02.57 | louipc | where? |
| 23:04.05 | alex_joni | giyf :) |
| 23:04.31 | yukonbob | alex_joni ++ |
| 23:04.43 | yukonbob | louipc: see "led ir multitouch" |
| 23:04.50 | yukonbob | louipc: see "led ir multitouch diy" |
| 23:05.56 | alex_joni | http://www.mortalspaces.com/diytouchpanels/ |
| 23:07.08 | yukonbob | ^--- ya -- that's the one I was looking at few days ago -- seemed like a good way to get up to speed |
| 23:07.33 | yukonbob | http://www.whitenoiseaudio.com/touchlib/ |
| 23:08.15 | alex_joni | I saw a multitouch table made with some fluid filled plastic bag |
| 23:08.47 | yukonbob | this stuff is IR-perterbness measurements |
| 23:08.55 | alex_joni | webcam on the bottom of the table, light from the side, a plastic bag filled with greenish fluid.. when you push the bag it'll change colour |
| 23:09.05 | yukonbob | ??"perterbness" -- you get the idea... |
| 23:09.20 | alex_joni | perturbness? |
| 23:09.25 | yukonbob | hehe |
| 23:09.59 | yukonbob | measures if/how-much the IR is perterbed by touching the topside of a sandwich with IR light in it... |
| 23:10.10 | yukonbob | *perturbed |
| 23:10.12 | alex_joni | right.. |
| 23:10.43 | alex_joni | "Results 1 - 10 of about 36 for perturbness." <- not a real word |
| 23:10.58 | yukonbob | perturbiousity? |
| 23:11.00 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 23:11.07 | alex_joni | "Results 1 - 1 of 1 for perterbness." <- even less |
| 23:11.28 | alex_joni | Your search - perturbiousity - did not match any documents. |
| 23:11.32 | yukonbob | !nice |
| 23:11.41 | yukonbob | google whacking |
| 23:12.02 | alex_joni | heh |
| 23:14.06 | alex_joni | http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/b/f/b/bfb83a185b234f232f82573c5dd03303.png |
| 23:33.17 | yukonbob | cd ~ |
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| 10:02.42 | brlcad | svn rebuild completed a couple hours ago, but still uploading to sf.net .. eta about 4 hours to test it |
| 10:03.23 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I'm still working on the video... |
| 10:03.41 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: now I have a problem that I didn't get a permission for the end titles so I have to use a different tune that means resynchronize again |
| 10:04.06 | Z80-Boy | And I wrote a software to put backgrounds on videos of rendered models using the floating point double distance |
| 10:04.17 | Z80-Boy | Now I want to put more backgrounds which I took pictures of |
| 10:05.25 | brlcad | cool |
| 10:05.37 | brlcad | lemme know when new one is re-encoded |
| 10:05.58 | Z80-Boy | have you seen it already with the backgrounds? |
| 10:06.35 | Z80-Boy | If not, mplayer http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/all.ogg |
| 10:08.58 | brlcad | that light wall makes it a bit harder to see the brick wall |
| 10:09.09 | brlcad | seems out of scale a bit too |
| 10:10.14 | Z80-Boy | yes I want to change the backgrounds to fix this problem |
| 10:10.23 | brlcad | they're not bad, but they contrast the rendering heavily |
| 10:10.44 | Z80-Boy | Do you think they are better than a black background? |
| 10:11.27 | brlcad | maybe only layer them at 40% transparency to black so they're darker and just faint notions |
| 10:12.37 | Z80-Boy | sounds like a good idea to me |
| 10:12.38 | brlcad | otherwise, as is, I think I did like the black better, less busy, real consistent |
| 10:12.41 | Z80-Boy | I was always bad in art |
| 10:12.43 | Z80-Boy | ;-) |
| 10:12.54 | Z80-Boy | I hated how it was all computersy |
| 10:13.12 | Z80-Boy | If I got a video like that I would be bored in 5 seconds |
| 10:15.13 | brlcad | you could speed up the rotations a bit or even better maybe would be to do a bell curve accelleration where it spins fast-slow-fast like it's slowing down to show you various angles |
| 10:15.14 | Z80-Boy | What I don't like onm open source is it's often as boring as a teddy bear |
| 10:16.03 | brlcad | (e.g., try to get it under 2 min with same content) |
| 10:16.11 | Z80-Boy | If I work on my own free software I find it amazing. But if I come into contact with another one I find it boring. |
| 10:16.18 | Z80-Boy | I think the expression is missing somewhere |
| 10:16.24 | Z80-Boy | Yes I could make it twice as fast |
| 10:16.39 | brlcad | might be too fast, hard to say without seeing it |
| 10:16.55 | Z80-Boy | There's even a rule in filmmaking |
| 10:17.01 | Z80-Boy | that you should often speed up the movie |
| 10:17.15 | Z80-Boy | Because otherwise movements at natural speed are boring long |
| 10:17.35 | Z80-Boy | Like if you watch Dogtown and Z-Boys... |
| 10:17.59 | Z80-Boy | The guys look like skateboarding on a different planet because their period is too short for what I know from the skate park. |
| 10:18.04 | brlcad | transitions between the objects, even as simple frame fades/blends of next for all of 2-4 seconds would help |
| 10:18.19 | Z80-Boy | Why? |
| 10:18.28 | Z80-Boy | In movies you often have plain cuts and it looks great |
| 10:18.55 | brlcad | yeah, but they also change the camera view on every cut |
| 10:19.04 | brlcad | you're not, you're changing the model |
| 10:19.33 | Z80-Boy | are you sure they change the view? Is it some kind of rule for good filmmaking? |
| 10:19.38 | brlcad | if the camera popped around or was moving, the plain cuts would work well |
| 10:19.41 | Z80-Boy | All I know one should not change over "the line" :) |
| 10:20.40 | brlcad | ever watch an episode of battlestar galactica? they take it to an extreme where what are subtle camera movements are intentionally *very* exaggerated |
| 10:21.04 | Z80-Boy | haven't seen battlestar galactica |
| 10:22.01 | brlcad | of the ken burns effect, famous for making entire movies out of still pictures |
| 10:22.17 | brlcad | by simply shifting the camera slowly, slow pans/zooms |
| 10:22.27 | brlcad | s/of/or/ |
| 10:22.32 | Z80-Boy | Peralta uses tons of stills |
| 10:22.38 | Z80-Boy | because he simply didn't have the material |
| 10:22.49 | Z80-Boy | And it lookss amazingly earthshattering |
| 10:24.29 | brlcad | heh, peralta used the ken burns effect |
| 10:24.37 | Z80-Boy | Oh Ken Burns is slowly panning or zooming |
| 10:24.42 | Z80-Boy | No Peralta effect is something else |
| 10:25.11 | Z80-Boy | It's turning the pictures around, shaking them, zooming, panning, blending, inverting colours wildly :) |
| 10:25.42 | Z80-Boy | Peralta is a director *AND* a world class skater. He knows how to make things kick ass ;-) |
| 10:25.49 | brlcad | I'd be surprised if he was the first to do that :) |
| 10:26.27 | brlcad | at least there's no ref to it as a discernable style other than references I found that he uses ken burns a lot |
| 10:26.39 | brlcad | at least in some of his films |
| 10:27.42 | Z80-Boy | I realized we're basically punks |
| 10:28.13 | Z80-Boy | Like Iggy Pop is a punk in music, The Z-Boys were punks in skateboarding, I and lots of other free software authors are punks in computers |
| 10:29.19 | Z80-Boy | When BRL-CAD came out as free software, wanting it or not, it became a punk.; |
| 10:29.43 | brlcad | it's always been free (as in beer) |
| 10:29.56 | Z80-Boy | Isn't it something like if the US Army in 1969 suddenly said "screw killing people" and all flied from Vietnam to Woodstock |
| 10:29.59 | brlcad | and mostly-free (as in rights) |
| 10:30.47 | brlcad | basically just registration, but then you could do almost anything except redistribute including get source code |
| 10:31.16 | Z80-Boy | That's however still not free software |
| 10:31.28 | Z80-Boy | Now it's free software since 2004 |
| 10:31.31 | brlcad | it's not FOSS per OSI definition |
| 10:31.58 | brlcad | "free software" is just too generic/vague by itself |
| 10:32.10 | Z80-Boy | free software is defined by the Free Software Foundation |
| 10:32.48 | Z80-Boy | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software |
| 10:33.00 | Z80-Boy | What I like on the GPL is that it's the "Locals only" culture |
| 10:33.05 | brlcad | that would be "Free software" |
| 10:33.14 | brlcad | where I at least think the case really matters |
| 10:33.54 | brlcad | as the intent is to make it a proper noun |
| 10:34.15 | brlcad | otherwise, free is as free is defined by the dictionaries and can mean several things |
| 10:34.22 | curious | cyberpunk... |
| 10:34.33 | Z80-Boy | omg curious is also here? |
| 10:34.57 | brlcad | he's been here for quite a while |
| 10:35.17 | Z80-Boy | he talks often about diseases or biology |
| 10:37.47 | brlcad | since November apparently |
| 10:37.50 | Z80-Boy | Here is "Why "Open Source" misses the point of Free Software" http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html |
| 10:38.02 | brlcad | yeah yeah |
| 10:38.05 | brlcad | RMS's lil rant |
| 10:38.25 | Z80-Boy | how do you view this FS vs. OS matter? |
| 10:38.45 | brlcad | he's got his reasons and there's counter positions to all of them like most issues that are mostly religion |
| 10:39.35 | Z80-Boy | "Open source is a development methodology; free software is a social movement." |
| 10:39.40 | Z80-Boy | That's what I like |
| 10:40.05 | Z80-Boy | On the other way " |
| 10:40.08 | Z80-Boy | For the free software movement, free software is an ethical imperative, because only free software respects the users' freedom." |
| 10:40.36 | Z80-Boy | I wrote to Stallman what he thinks about Ronja and he said free hardware is not an ethical imperative because you can run software for free whereas for making hardware you have to pay money |
| 10:41.00 | brlcad | at least he wants it to be a social movement, a matter of ethics and morality, where in practice most of the industry sees him as a crackpot zealot that does more to hurt that same movement than he does to help |
| 10:41.16 | Z80-Boy | Which I don't agree because you still have to pay a PC if you want to run software, and the cost of material in free hardware is often laughable. |
| 10:42.02 | Z80-Boy | I don't matter if he's a crackpot zealot, but I think he should visit a visagist and buy a yearly card for a gym. |
| 10:42.06 | brlcad | the industry is still predominantly driven by the openness of the software more than it is by our "rights and freedoms" .. most simply don't care |
| 10:42.26 | Z80-Boy | companies couldn't care less about rights and freedoms of course |
| 10:42.38 | Z80-Boy | They care about the cost reduction |
| 10:43.08 | Z80-Boy | And when they even stop caring about the copyright, Harald Welte from gplviolations.org reminds them friendly through a court verdict ;> |
| 10:43.08 | curious | open patents and open hardware is what i encourage too, though from my perspective it's mainly to prevent forming of corporations and monopolies |
| 10:43.13 | brlcad | companies are snowballing the industry's accelleration but they're not the driver |
| 10:43.26 | Z80-Boy | who's the driver? |
| 10:43.51 | curious | m0 parasite ;) |
| 10:44.25 | brlcad | a couple thousand of the project leads across the FOSS industry, actual people, developers |
| 10:44.36 | brlcad | that are almost entirely driven by the sheer love of coding |
| 10:44.58 | Z80-Boy | Z-Boys claimed to be entirely driven by the sheer love of skateboarding |
| 10:45.14 | Z80-Boy | And when they switched to the sheer love of many, they went down a very steep ramp ;-) |
| 10:45.23 | brlcad | there were more than 200 of the top project leads for just about every major open source project at the mentor summit this past summer |
| 10:45.35 | Z80-Boy | many -> money |
| 10:45.47 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: what does a "project lead" mean? |
| 10:46.13 | curious | btw , #philosophy ;) chat went bit offtopic... |
| 10:46.24 | brlcad | it was noted by several of us during the conference that we had by *far* the most concentrated gather of open source leads probably ever (considerably more than OSCon) simply by the nature of the program |
| 10:46.30 | Z80-Boy | no it's on topic since BRL-CAD is free software |
| 10:46.32 | brlcad | s/gather/gathering/ |
| 10:47.10 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: who "we"? BRL-CAD? And what's an "open source lead"? |
| 10:47.41 | brlcad | means people that are principle contributors with the influence, control, authority, merit, heritage, history, respect, whatever to lead the project |
| 10:48.11 | brlcad | we is not BRL-CAD .. we was representatives from those funded by Google for the Google Summer of Code |
| 10:48.25 | brlcad | many major projects |
| 10:49.09 | Z80-Boy | "simply by the nature of the program" -> which one then when you were developers of many different programs? |
| 10:50.08 | brlcad | http://code.google.com/soc/2007/ |
| 10:51.09 | brlcad | those orgs, the likes of debian, gentoo, freebsd, linux kernel, kde, gnome, apache foundation, python foundation, gcc folks, on and on |
| 10:52.15 | Z80-Boy | I once looked at the SoC and found it heavily underpaid |
| 10:52.20 | brlcad | we had a mentor summit where the project leads for those organizations all got together to talk about the program, share our experiences, many discussions and presentations, exchanging ideas, thoughts, philosophies .. |
| 10:53.07 | brlcad | it's not meant as a get rich scheme, it's meant to let kids in school that would rather just write code all summer and still pay their bills do so |
| 10:53.29 | brlcad | which is more than enough, as the rejection ratio is already nearly 5:1 iirc |
| 10:53.54 | Z80-Boy | who rejects? Google or the coders? |
| 10:54.16 | brlcad | both in a way |
| 10:54.26 | Z80-Boy | I rejected it because of underpaying :) |
| 10:54.29 | brlcad | there are only so many student slots, so they compete |
| 10:55.00 | brlcad | students are ranked on their abilities and project proposals |
| 10:55.17 | brlcad | it's a rather long and involved process, takes a lot of time |
| 10:55.41 | Z80-Boy | I found out people with zero abilities are indispensable |
| 10:56.37 | Z80-Boy | Like if I show my Ronja instructions to someone who has good abilities then he doesn't find anything |
| 10:56.51 | brlcad | good for you ... *blink* .. but if their job is to be coding all summer, zero abilities would be useless |
| 10:56.53 | Z80-Boy | If I show it to a guy who has no clue about it he finds 50 places with missing or ambiguous information |
| 10:57.20 | Z80-Boy | He's vastly mor productive for this task than the guy with abilities, because his abilities cannot bridge the gaps he's looking for. |
| 10:57.24 | brlcad | eh, that's entirely a different domain |
| 10:57.32 | brlcad | productive to you for weeding out trivialities |
| 10:57.36 | Z80-Boy | No that's a part of free software |
| 10:57.43 | brlcad | ask him to optimize your circuit board and you get a blank stare |
| 10:57.54 | Z80-Boy | A product without manual is useless and you need someone like this to check the manuals |
| 10:58.11 | brlcad | again, you're talking about an entirely different f'ing domain |
| 10:58.16 | brlcad | it's the summer of *code* |
| 10:58.24 | brlcad | not checking manuals and looking for typos |
| 10:58.34 | brlcad | the program has a specific focus |
| 10:58.37 | Z80-Boy | But I don't need anyone to code I need someone to weed crap out of the manuals |
| 10:58.49 | brlcad | you need a janitor, great |
| 10:59.06 | Z80-Boy | I don't like this division of people into "able" |
| 10:59.10 | Z80-Boy | and "unable" |
| 10:59.19 | Z80-Boy | Everyone can do something different. |
| 10:59.21 | brlcad | that's also pretty much a possessive position |
| 11:00.05 | brlcad | i'm sorry, but that's just wrong with the domain is limited |
| 11:00.15 | brlcad | if it's not limited, then sure .. there's a job for everyone |
| 11:00.16 | Z80-Boy | The ordinary people who have barely a clue how to solder two wires together contributed so many helpful ideas... |
| 11:00.17 | brlcad | that's nothing new |
| 11:01.09 | Z80-Boy | What's a perfectly coded program good for when the user has no idea how to use it? |
| 11:01.30 | brlcad | are you just not getting it or just talking past me without listening? |
| 11:01.41 | Z80-Boy | If I use a program it's typically 1/2 day reading the manuals and experimenting and 5 minutes CPU time |
| 11:01.50 | brlcad | i'm not arguing that people can contribute in various ways |
| 11:01.52 | brlcad | sure they can |
| 11:02.02 | brlcad | that's not freaking rocket science |
| 11:02.05 | brlcad | people can be creative |
| 11:02.11 | brlcad | and useful, in many ways |
| 11:02.15 | brlcad | that's not the point |
| 11:03.29 | brlcad | this started about finding people that were "able to code" because it's a program about actually writing code, not reviewing code, not helping out, not working on docs, just writing code -- for that purpose, there are outright some people that are able and are not able to write code |
| 11:03.51 | brlcad | not about whether people were able to do *something* useful |
| 11:04.11 | brlcad | they could do that anyways, it is open source afterall .. if they want to contribute, they can go for it |
| 11:04.12 | Z80-Boy | Hmm I consider reviewing code and working of docs part of writing the code |
| 11:04.26 | Z80-Boy | pushing buttons is only one method how to get the code you need |
| 11:04.35 | brlcad | but if they're going to get *hired* to write code .. there is a damn firm expectation that they can/will write code |
| 11:04.43 | Z80-Boy | Another one is take an existing one that does something wrong and fixing it |
| 11:05.11 | Z80-Boy | And if I don't write documentation at the same moment as the code I am begging the God for an inconsitency |
| 11:05.35 | Z80-Boy | Most people on free software projects cannot write code |
| 11:05.38 | brlcad | well you may consider it part of it, but I certainly wouldn't .. it's certainly part of working on a project and developing a product .. but then it sounds like you maybe just want to argue your semantics |
| 11:05.48 | Z80-Boy | They think bullshits like "the code is the documentation" which can be easily disproved. |
| 11:06.10 | Z80-Boy | They leave bugs in code intentionally... |
| 11:06.35 | Z80-Boy | It's like a difference between painter for pictures and painter for room walls |
| 11:06.40 | curious | lot of opensource projects are so far (imho) quick sketches of what project should look like. i.e. mozilla ... |
| 11:07.05 | Z80-Boy | yes Firefox segfaults and hangs for me and bugs in the bugzilla have numbers like 200,000 |
| 11:07.21 | Z80-Boy | At least BRL-CAD knows how to write code |
| 11:07.25 | Z80-Boy | When I report a bug they fix it |
| 11:07.35 | Z80-Boy | Not just piling up shit... |
| 11:07.53 | Z80-Boy | I reported a segfault on BBC Dirac a year ago and it still wasn't even assigned |
| 11:08.05 | Z80-Boy | And Dirac is developed fulltime by a major company! |
| 11:08.07 | curious | enthusiasm and demand of users is usually what causes trouble , too much pressure to suceed while there is still just loose sketch |
| 11:08.08 | brlcad | and lots of people like to armchair philosophize and argue about what is right/wrong without actually contributing constructively :) |
| 11:08.12 | brlcad | so fix it yourself? |
| 11:08.27 | brlcad | usually just time and competing priorities |
| 11:08.28 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: you mean me? With Ronja and Links? |
| 11:08.35 | brlcad | no, I mean in general |
| 11:08.44 | brlcad | I've seen it on every project I've ever worked on/with |
| 11:09.11 | brlcad | you've had some good constructive contributions |
| 11:09.17 | Z80-Boy | If you're a good developer and you have a lack of time you create a well working program with small amount of features |
| 11:09.18 | brlcad | several as a matter of fact |
| 11:09.48 | Z80-Boy | If you are a bad one, you create a bloated project with tons of bugs which is practicably unusable, but has a lot of features in it's spec. |
| 11:10.17 | Z80-Boy | Oh these details count as contributions? :) |
| 11:11.01 | brlcad | the movie is marketing material, the bug reports get attention and discussion, and are queued/recorded and/or fixed |
| 11:11.44 | brlcad | if anything, you're a productive and interactive/responsive user, and that's a contribution no matter how you cut it |
| 11:11.56 | brlcad | doesn't have to be code |
| 11:13.16 | brlcad | that said, coders is what we're most in shortage of because we haven't yet gained enough momentum and usability |
| 11:13.21 | alex_joni | reports of people using projects are a great help to any oss imo |
| 11:13.42 | brlcad | we're in one of the biggest software domains, bigger than the gaming industry for crissakes |
| 11:14.02 | alex_joni | first it shows others that it's useable, what can be done with it, and second it gives devs the needed momentum to keep going |
| 11:14.06 | brlcad | yet our active devs are but a handful |
| 11:14.17 | brlcad | multibillion dollar industry |
| 11:14.20 | alex_joni | brlcad: and still.. you're a big project.. compared to the one I work on |
| 11:14.56 | brlcad | i mean one of our main competitors (in theory at least) is unigraphics, where they have more than 100 developers working on their code daily |
| 11:15.53 | brlcad | alex_joni: the momentum is in attracting new devs (and users, but devs most importantly) |
| 11:16.25 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: do you agree that BRL-CAD is lacking important features compared to Autocad, Pro-E and whatever modern modeling programs? |
| 11:16.53 | brlcad | blender picked up the momentum about five years ago in just under two years after going open source, for example .. not exactly the same domain, but similar skill sets needed, but then they already had usability |
| 11:17.11 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: sure, I don't think anyone would argue that |
| 11:17.42 | brlcad | we excel in several areas, but to compete in the holistic CAD domain, you have to cater to many many different usage patterns and problem domains |
| 11:18.01 | brlcad | the industry diagram on the main website gives an idea of those domains/uses |
| 11:19.11 | brlcad | our path forward is pretty clear (to me at least), but there's a lot of work before the momentum will start to accelerate attention |
| 11:19.38 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: on the other hand, a project like Ronja shows that with and oldschool approach (doing the blueprints separately), one can use BRL-CAD for serious work. |
| 11:19.59 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I wrote you something on query did you see it? |
| 11:20.33 | brlcad | needed for that is a unification of all our command-line tools, clean-up of our geometry processing engine, the addition of comprehensive BREP support, and a redesigned graphical user interface that leverages all our functionality intuitively |
| 11:20.53 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: BRL-CAD *IS* used for serious work, and has been for decades .... |
| 11:21.03 | brlcad | doesn't get much more serious |
| 11:21.34 | curious | Z80-Boy, sometimes for development of project user base is important. links can be good example, note that i.e. mobile phone /pda industry didn't noticed potential of investiment in developing potent multiplatform code for web browser and invest in taking parts of mozilla foundation code instead |
| 11:21.39 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: but isn't it an internal army work that isn't visible to the outside? |
| 11:21.51 | brlcad | the analysis domain is our strength by far, that is where we kick the snot out of most of the commercial packages |
| 11:22.10 | Z80-Boy | curious: but they at least get CSS Javascript Flash and Java and all that annoying crap |
| 11:22.37 | Z80-Boy | can you give an example of a project that uses BRL-CAD for analysis? |
| 11:22.38 | curious | yes, and social impact of this will cause phones to overheat for next 20 years |
| 11:22.43 | brlcad | our ability to efficiently represent, visualize, and analyze geometric target descriptions is pretty much unparalleled |
| 11:22.50 | Z80-Boy | Apart from Ronja where it's used to calculate the weight of the device and the components? |
| 11:23.32 | curious | btw. i also would like to see more examples of use on main website, manual is bit minimalistic |
| 11:23.43 | Z80-Boy | curious: Links cannot keep up the development pace with the tsunami of bloated crapware like AJAX etc. |
| 11:24.09 | brlcad | BRL-CAD main reason for being created, developed, and funded for so long is for analysis purposes |
| 11:24.15 | curious | Z80-Boy, ...because noone invested in it :) as opensource project it could be developed by completely separate team |
| 11:24.31 | Z80-Boy | curious: that's not true noone invested in it |
| 11:24.55 | Z80-Boy | curious: http://links.twibright.com/development.php |
| 11:25.08 | Z80-Boy | You have a table of donations there :) |
| 11:25.10 | brlcad | it's used for performing ballistic penetration and material interaction analyses |
| 11:25.21 | brlcad | like what happens when you shoot a rocket propelled grenade at a tank |
| 11:25.34 | Z80-Boy | yes but these projects are kept closed, right? |
| 11:25.37 | brlcad | vulnerability and lethality analyses |
| 11:25.43 | brlcad | of course |
| 11:25.47 | Z80-Boy | I haven't myself seen anything like that |
| 11:25.54 | brlcad | and you probably never will |
| 11:25.56 | Z80-Boy | So the public may and may not believe it |
| 11:26.18 | Z80-Boy | I'm not interested to know what happens if you throw a grenade at a tank |
| 11:26.25 | Z80-Boy | I don't have neither a grenade nor a tank |
| 11:26.34 | brlcad | it's well documented and published, just not something you get to play with directly |
| 11:26.49 | curious | personally i would like to see few examples about developing electric motors |
| 11:26.53 | Z80-Boy | But people need to see a plausible proof it's practically usable |
| 11:27.17 | brlcad | you might be interested what happens if you were to get shot by a bullet, not really much different |
| 11:27.35 | curious | i've read there is support for magnetic forces simulation, yet, didn't found even simplest examples |
| 11:27.46 | Z80-Boy | Otherwise they may think "maybe the picture is a fake made in a different program" or "armies are often inefficient maybe it took them too long" |
| 11:28.06 | brlcad | material interactions, almost any interaction that has a nearly instant interaction/response (less than a second) |
| 11:28.31 | Z80-Boy | what happens if my head hits a skatepark obstacle? :D |
| 11:28.53 | brlcad | you may think that, but the people that fund the results certainly don't think so |
| 11:29.12 | brlcad | it's not like this hasn't been going on for decades |
| 11:29.20 | brlcad | long before computers were used |
| 11:30.13 | brlcad | BRL-CAD was the first to make it even possible to visualize an entire tank on a computer (back in '84) |
| 11:32.28 | brlcad | svn dumpfile now finished uploading to sf.net, importing (eta probably 2hrs) |
| 11:35.49 | curious | brlcad, and what about more hum. peace-oriented projects? design of dams , windmills, stuff like that? :) i know brl-cad has main funding source from military... but maybe there were projects more in such direction? |
| 11:36.25 | brlcad | lots |
| 11:36.47 | brlcad | helped design one of the massive supercolliders in europe |
| 11:37.13 | brlcad | was the only cad system that could represent the entire length down to millimeter resolution |
| 11:37.48 | brlcad | hubble telescope, buildings, radiological studies, ... |
| 11:38.59 | curious | perhaps i'll sound bit like eco freak but i'm often grossed when i hear from investors that investiments like windmill research are 'not profitable because never earn for themselves' and then i see them buying f16 for taxpayer's money ...(well, guess how theywill make it 'earn on itself ' ;) |
| 11:39.32 | curious | good to hear :) |
| 11:45.41 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: but can you link URLs where it's apparent how BRL-CAD was used for these projects? |
| 11:46.28 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: did you get my query? |
| 11:48.25 | curious | Z80-Boy, btw. would you mind to record how you develop things in brl-cad ? in form of tutorial/example presentation... i am very newb. in this |
| 11:48.52 | Z80-Boy | curious: sorry, no time for that |
| 11:56.27 | alex_joni | brlcad: shoot the ronja thingie with a grenade rocket.. we all can guess what happens, but it'll look cool |
| 11:58.08 | Z80-Boy | I think it may drop one packet |
| 11:58.17 | Z80-Boy | and then continue working unharmed |
| 11:58.23 | Z80-Boy | Maybe the paint peels off |
| 11:58.52 | Z80-Boy | someone reported it working when the pipe was 1/2 full of water |
| 11:59.02 | Z80-Boy | With the electronics massively corroded and full of disgusting slime |
| 11:59.07 | Z80-Boy | Ronja is a very robust device :) |
| 12:01.09 | alex_joni | Z80-Boy: :P good to know |
| 12:01.33 | alex_joni | Z80-Boy: maybe you can sell Ronja's to the military for target practise purpose :P |
| 14:01.38 | Z80-Boy | Once it got a nearby lightning hit and I had to replace a part for $1.00 |
| 14:03.13 | Z80-Boy | But there was a bug in the shielding which I fixed in the meantime |
| 14:04.02 | Z80-Boy | Not mentioning that every lightning storm we had several network card and switches burned out |
| 14:04.28 | alex_joni | I had ones burning out even without lightning :D |
| 14:04.43 | Z80-Boy | I am sure instead of the expensive thick cables |
| 14:04.43 | Z80-Boy | they could transmit the data from nuclear tests by Ronjas |
| 14:05.25 | Z80-Boy | They would simply collect them scattered on the desert, wash and reuse :) |
| 14:28.57 | Z80-Boy | I got an idea for an undetectable detector of people's presence |
| 14:29.41 | Z80-Boy | a microphone and two speakers |
| 14:29.54 | Z80-Boy | the speakers would be at one end of the controlled line and the microphone on the other |
| 14:30.07 | Z80-Boy | the speakers would be arranged symmetrically and phased oppositely |
| 14:30.18 | Z80-Boy | so that any signal going into them would cancel out at the place of microphone |
| 14:30.35 | Z80-Boy | the microphone would have a sensitive amplifier outputting into the speakers |
| 14:31.05 | Z80-Boy | if something physical got into the space, one of the speakers would be shadowed more, they would stop cancelling and the system would start to oscillate |
| 14:31.34 | Z80-Boy | No electrical optical infrared or acoustical energy measurement would reveal existence of this device unless the alarm would be already triggered. |
| 14:32.51 | Z80-Boy | Because in silent state the device would be silent |
| 15:04.49 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
| 15:06.53 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 15:08.32 | alex_joni | I don't think you can cancel out 2 sound waves |
| 15:09.12 | alex_joni | maybe in a perfect environment (without walls and other refraction points..) |
| 15:21.11 | ``Erik | huh, rpg vs ronja? I wonder if it'd just vaporize the entire unit, or send it flying as a cone of sand... :) |
| 15:22.12 | curious | it's not made in taiwan, sorry. |
| 15:22.50 | Z80-Boy | nor in china ;-) |
| 15:23.26 | ``Erik | heh, doens't matter where it's made, I'm sure it's using soft steel and not much of it compared to, say, heavy vehicle armor plating that rpg's are specifically designed to defeat :) |
| 15:23.37 | Z80-Boy | One friend replaced the thin tin pipe (0.5mm) with a solid metal pipe like 5 or 6mm thick |
| 15:24.16 | ``Erik | ok, put a kg of c4 against a 5mm walled steel pipe and see how well it holds together.. :D |
| 15:24.53 | Z80-Boy | http://images.twibright.com/tns/lvl4/1e4a.jpg |
| 15:25.02 | ``Erik | <-- puts his money on the explosives :) |
| 15:25.05 | Z80-Boy | whole gakllery page http://images.twibright.com/tns/1e45.html |
| 15:25.28 | alex_joni | Z80-Boy: that looks soft |
| 15:25.33 | Z80-Boy | Men, if the 3rd world war comes, he'll still have Internet |
| 15:26.02 | ``Erik | what kinda steel? |
| 15:26.08 | alex_joni | well.. maybe usually is not the best thing to say |
| 15:26.10 | Z80-Boy | Ordinary construction |
| 15:26.24 | alex_joni | ``Erik: you familiar with EN namings? |
| 15:26.26 | Z80-Boy | alex_joni: you mean the gym? |
| 15:26.34 | ``Erik | not especially, but I have tables |
| 15:26.48 | Z80-Boy | I saw his Ronja it was heavy as hell |
| 15:27.00 | Z80-Boy | The RPG would probably shatter the lens |
| 15:27.10 | Z80-Boy | So you'd have to invest $1.00 to fix the device |
| 15:27.17 | alex_joni | S235 .. S5xx |
| 15:27.51 | alex_joni | ``Erik: mostly construction grade steel |
| 15:27.54 | alex_joni | nothing fancy |
| 15:27.55 | Z80-Boy | But look |
| 15:28.06 | Z80-Boy | noone will shoot rpgs at your communication device |
| 15:28.23 | Z80-Boy | more like you'll see one more sun, then you get a gust of wind where all the windows blow out |
| 15:28.36 | alex_joni | still. it will be the first target |
| 15:28.42 | ``Erik | if one goes off within a few meters, it'll probably rip apart the steel tube, shatter the lense, disintigrate the board, ... :) |
| 15:29.06 | ``Erik | and that's a light precision weapon, something like a bomb (or ww3, mebbe a nuke)... :D |
| 15:29.58 | Z80-Boy | that's a damage worth of say 30$? |
| 15:30.55 | ``Erik | yeah *shrug* but it's not gonna just drop one package and get a little water in it |
| 15:31.04 | ``Erik | :) |
| 15:31.17 | Z80-Boy | try the RPG with your wireless access point |
| 15:31.30 | ``Erik | sorry, I kinda like having a house :) |
| 15:31.52 | Z80-Boy | I don't believe it makes a mess like this |
| 15:32.09 | ``Erik | I tend to avoid silly things like bullets and hand grenades, no way I wanna be in an anti-armor event, yo |
| 15:32.55 | ``Erik | dude, an rpg is several kg of high explosives |
| 15:33.26 | ``Erik | I mean, take a dozen sticks of dynamite and light it off on something |
| 15:33.31 | ``Erik | it makes a big freakin' mess |
| 15:34.29 | alex_joni | that means no windows for a 2-3 mile radius |
| 15:34.29 | Z80-Boy | that's bullshit |
| 15:34.29 | Z80-Boy | At the place I live a dynamite factory blew up in 190? |
| 15:34.38 | Z80-Boy | It shattered the windows only in 10km radius or so |
| 15:34.55 | Z80-Boy | I assume they have more than couple of dynamite sticks in a factory |
| 15:35.23 | ``Erik | shockswaves roll off on a cubed root (surface area of a growing sphere, remember your high school physics for sound attenuation) |
| 15:35.44 | Z80-Boy | not cubed but 2nd root |
| 15:35.44 | ``Erik | and a lot depends on environment (temperature, humidity, geometry, etc) |
| 15:36.05 | Z80-Boy | surface area of a growing sphere is r^2 |
| 15:36.40 | alex_joni | The PRG-7V1 can fire 4 - 6 rounds per minute, and can be equipped with PG-7V shaped charge, PG-7VR tandem shaped charge, both are designed to penetrate over 500 mm of steel (600 mm behind ERA in PG-7VR, which can also penetrate two meters of brickwork, 1.5 meters of reinforced concrete and 3.7 meters of log or sand). |
| 15:37.24 | Z80-Boy | Doesn't this have a depleted uranium rod? |
| 15:37.28 | ``Erik | no |
| 15:37.31 | Z80-Boy | rha is what? |
| 15:37.50 | Z80-Boy | But we were talkling about RPG not PRG |
| 15:37.59 | ``Erik | a standard armor type of steel, rolled homogeneous |
| 15:38.11 | ``Erik | "rpg" is an old name for a shaped charge |
| 15:38.20 | Z80-Boy | rocket propelled grenade? |
| 15:38.41 | ``Erik | they're shaped charges, every since the paunserfaust |
| 15:38.42 | Z80-Boy | Doesn't shaped charge work only on the surface of the target? |
| 15:38.42 | alex_joni | http://www.defense-update.com/products/r/rpg-29.htm |
| 15:38.57 | Z80-Boy | panzerfaust |
| 15:39.35 | alex_joni | Z80-Boy: they also have time delays so they can explode in mid air |
| 15:39.37 | ``Erik | yeah, panzerfaust, and the bazooka, and a couple other ww2 anti-tank handhelds |
| 15:43.11 | Z80-Boy | Well no matter how thick Ronja is it always needs a lens surface exposed outside |
| 15:43.28 | Z80-Boy | Which is easily damaged by a weapon |
| 15:43.33 | Z80-Boy | And needs to be replaced then |
| 15:44.02 | Z80-Boy | Have you seen a guy making his own electron valves at home? |
| 15:44.08 | ``Erik | yeah, in france |
| 15:44.10 | ``Erik | neat stuff |
| 15:44.10 | Z80-Boy | I think this guy will surview WW3 too |
| 15:44.19 | Z80-Boy | survive |
| 15:44.34 | ``Erik | um, blowing glass ain't gonna help ya survive ww3, it'll help you survive AFTER ww3.... :D |
| 15:46.41 | Z80-Boy | Are there vehicles resistant to RPGs? |
| 15:46.55 | ``Erik | that all depends on what you mean by "resistant" |
| 15:47.05 | ``Erik | and that's all I'm gonna say about that :D |
| 15:47.09 | Z80-Boy | Apart from the Russian "Ukraina" bicycle? |
| 16:06.12 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 16:38.38 | brlcad | looks like the import was successful, starting testing |
| 17:58.43 | ``Erik | http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080109/od_nm/brothel_dc;_ylt=AkOfikAfGaTZ2oPrvqqBjwGs0NUE |
| 18:46.49 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (n=yukonbob@S010600195bd5c415.lb.shawcable.net) | |
| 19:02.47 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:10.52 | IriX64 | coulda been worse, coulda been his mother :) |
| 19:20.42 | brlcad | so far so good on the checkout validation, it's gotten past all branches afaikt |
| 19:20.46 | brlcad | now working on all tags |
| 19:45.02 | poolio | so, upgrade to git next week? |
| 19:45.29 | ``Erik | git is for gits |
| 19:45.35 | ``Erik | we're going to perforce, yo |
| 19:45.40 | poolio | ah |
| 19:45.41 | ``Erik | p4ftw! |
| 19:45.48 | poolio | hg! |
| 19:52.36 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-82-187.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:07.13 | ``Erik | hummmmm |
| 20:07.34 | poolio | ``Erik: Tell me if it's safe :) |
| 20:07.51 | ``Erik | how is this going to affect file permissions? |
| 20:08.12 | ``Erik | the adrt subdir had significan damage (many 755 .c and .h files) |
| 20:08.45 | ``Erik | ben, I'm waiting for brlcad to tell me it's safe, I'm just being optimistic ;) |
| 20:14.41 | poolio | hah |
| 20:15.15 | poolio | Do the permissions really matter in the source tree? As long as the install is correct it shouldn't really matter |
| 20:15.55 | ``Erik | it's fugly when ya have alias ls='ls -FG' |
| 20:32.55 | *** join/#brlcad illethal (n=oden@c-69-137-199-63.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | |
| 20:33.08 | illethal | Axman! |
| 20:33.18 | illethal | Battletech? |
| 20:35.35 | *** part/#brlcad illethal (n=oden@c-69-137-199-63.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | |
| 20:56.06 | brlcad | ``Erik: my full-checkout is still churning, it's not exactly speedy process |
| 20:56.23 | brlcad | i've been documenting the steps taken as well just for posterity |
| 20:58.31 | brlcad | svn keeps track of the exec bit as an svn attribute |
| 20:59.54 | brlcad | the cvs import set the svn attribute if the cvsroot file had the exec bit set, which I see now that you mention it that several libtie, libtienet, and a couple of the adrt docs had bad perms (meaning they were cvs added with wrong perms, but whatever) |
| 21:00.39 | brlcad | it's easy enough to fix that in svn after the fact, but adrt seems to be more the exception than the rule as I look through other places .. not even most of adrt was wrong |
| 21:01.26 | brlcad | it is nice, though, that all the scripts have the property set, I did validate those, archer, rtwizard, and a few others manually to make sure their perms were right |
| 21:05.05 | brlcad | probably not worth the 8+ hour turn-around to fix those perms in the cvs repo and wait for all the conversions/uploads again just for those few files.. :) |
| 21:23.33 | brlcad | it's 17GB to checkout the root |
| 21:23.33 | ``Erik | if it's fixable in svn, that's another minor win for snv over cvs |
| 21:23.40 | brlcad | it is |
| 21:23.57 | brlcad | i think we might be good to go, lemme just make sure the commit hooks are set up |
| 21:23.58 | ``Erik | it's tricky to fix in cvs |
| 21:24.20 | brlcad | it'll be svn propdel svn:executable file.c |
| 21:24.30 | brlcad | svn proplist to see the props on a file |
| 21:24.55 | brlcad | properties are tracked just like source changes |
| 21:25.57 | brlcad | that's how you can set the line ending types (CR/NL, NL, native, etc), whether it's a binary file or not (default is binary, but I set auto-props on defined file types) |
| 21:26.13 | brlcad | and the exec bit |
| 21:26.22 | ``Erik | coo' |
| 21:26.38 | brlcad | those three and setting svn:ignore on directories (the equiv of .cvsignore) are the most common usages of props |
| 21:27.37 | brlcad | for info: http://my.brlcad.org/wiki/Cvs2svn |
| 21:33.01 | poolio | Heh, exactly one commit with non-ascii. Beat 'em down. |
| 21:39.15 | brlcad | heh |
| 21:39.25 | brlcad | i actually did that commit :) |
| 21:39.47 | brlcad | knew exactly what it was when I saw the log message |
| 21:40.10 | CIA-30 | ow |
| 21:42.32 | brlcad | ahh, we're getting announced as the wrong project |
| 21:45.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29889 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: cia test commit, note that I just converted source repository from CVS to Subversion |
| 21:45.17 | brlcad | there we go |
| 21:46.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: barring any problems that you find or that crop up on our ohloh import, I think we might be good to go now |
| 21:46.58 | yukonbob | nice... |
| 21:47.00 | brlcad | cvs2svn apparently got confused a little on the props with both a mime.types file, auto-props files, and props from mime setting enabled, but those are easily fixed |
| 21:53.41 | Axman6 | brlcad: well done :) |
| 21:56.19 | brlcad | not necessarily done yet |
| 21:56.32 | brlcad | still a lot more validation to go, and I'm seeing issues |
| 21:57.53 | yukonbob | brlcad: are you saying to stay away from the svn repo for now, and I guess when it's deemed ready, you'll post a mgs here, or somewhere? |
| 22:01.13 | brlcad | i'm saying don't assume it won't get replaced yet another time if a show-stopper is found in the next couple days :) |
| 22:02.10 | brlcad | the mime.types file messed up a lot of things it seems (like our tcl files) since apache's mime type for .tcl files is application/x-tcl for example .. which makes svn think it's a binary file |
| 22:02.25 | brlcad | I can fix that easily enough, but I can't diff through the history with it like that |
| 22:02.37 | brlcad | that might be a show-stopper |
| 22:03.44 | brlcad | might have to create a custom mime.types so that we get the settings we want in the repo as opposed to what apache might want to present |
| 22:26.32 | brlcad | i'm not finding a good solution.. I think we'll have to have yet another go-round |
| 22:45.00 | *** join/#brlcad elite01_ (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-087-063.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 22:52.16 | yukonbob | brlcad: not clear about the mime issue -- I see what problem it presents, and think I understand how it works (as an svn property) -- so what's the 'diff through the history' issue? Is it feasible to get a script w/ svn bindings to go through the tree, present possible issues (ie: list all .tcl files), and optionally/conditionally adjust properties? |
| 23:18.26 | brlcad | yukonbob: I can set the property from then on and get diffs afaikt, but then if I say "diff r123 to r12" where it was unmarked as binary after r100 then it'll fail |
| 23:18.45 | yukonbob | ugh |
| 23:19.01 | brlcad | i'm running it through again without the mime.types file from apache |
| 23:19.27 | brlcad | and with extra mime types set for our predominant file types |
| 23:21.31 | brlcad | might make the default text instead of binary too if I add a mapping for all of our file types |
| 23:42.41 | brlcad | heh, there are 255 extensions in use |
| 23:43.11 | yukonbob | brlcad: in the BRL-CAD source tree? |
| 23:44.02 | brlcad | well, in the whole cvsroot, but yeah, that's 99.9% brl-cad sources |
| 23:44.46 | brlcad | http://bzflag.bz/~sean/extensions.used |
| 23:45.07 | yukonbob | right -- I guess you're counting the 0.1% as the libs, tcl, etc that are 3rd party, supplied for completeness' sake |
| 23:46.19 | brlcad | at least it's tangible |
| 23:46.47 | brlcad | i can make sure there are reasonable mime-types for any that aren't already listed |
| 23:46.59 | yukonbob | most of those are of 'text' format, though -- so can one get away w/ setting default as text (like you mentioned) and only tagging .jpg, .doc, etc for now |
| 23:47.18 | yukonbob | s/tagging/tagging for attributes/ |
| 23:47.27 | brlcad | yeah, something like that |
| 23:48.20 | yukonbob | nice... and nice to run into a problem, know what the answer is, and solve it ;) -- must seem tedious to you at this point, but at least you're making headway :) |
| 23:49.40 | brlcad | mime types have always been a nit-pick annoyance i've had with svn |
| 23:49.49 | brlcad | it's good to finally get right, but it's such a pita |
| 23:56.58 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:30.58 | brlcad | well that was tedious.. but reviewed and accounted for (or am intentionally now ignoring) all 255 |
| 00:31.20 | brlcad | there were actually a couple important ones to catch so so not a complete waste of time :) |
| 00:46.02 | Axman6 | brlcad: any leopard fixes yet? |
| 00:51.24 | brlcad | no not yet :) |
| 00:51.36 | Axman6 | dang |
| 00:51.48 | Axman6 | what were the problems again? |
| 00:51.52 | brlcad | a bit busy with this little matter of a repository conversion :) |
| 00:52.21 | Axman6 | brlcad: yeah that's fair enough |
| 00:52.28 | brlcad | Axman6: the problems are actually bugs in the Xorg X11 server |
| 00:52.44 | brlcad | a compile on your system worked just fine remotely |
| 00:52.52 | Axman6 | hopefully 10.5.2 will fix them |
| 00:53.15 | brlcad | probably will, it's been a known problem that's been discussed on the apple mailing lists several times now |
| 00:53.17 | yukonbob | oops -- got cats in wrong order... :P |
| 00:53.42 | brlcad | there is an early install that you can try out that should be the same as what apple will eventually deploy when it's ready |
| 00:54.08 | Axman6 | yeah i have it |
| 00:54.12 | louipc | apple is switching to Xorg eh? |
| 00:54.27 | Axman6 | no |
| 00:54.49 | Axman6 | just their X11.app is now Xorg based, not Xfree86 based |
| 00:55.07 | louipc | ah |
| 00:55.21 | Axman6 | X11 is a terrible system imo, i've very, very glad apple don't use it. |
| 00:55.26 | Axman6 | one of the best things about OS X |
| 00:55.29 | louipc | hehe |
| 00:55.37 | louipc | it works alright for me |
| 00:56.44 | brlcad | Axman6: you have the download from: http://trac.macosforge.org/projects/xquartz ? |
| 00:56.51 | Axman6 | yeah |
| 00:57.02 | Axman6 | that's what i did most of my testing with too |
| 00:57.07 | Axman6 | i've had it for ages |
| 00:57.41 | brlcad | they have continual updates .. last was mid dec |
| 00:58.44 | brlcad | I'd actually suggest filing a bug report with them in case we provoke some unique situation |
| 00:59.07 | brlcad | http://trac.macosforge.org/projects/xquartz/report |
| 00:59.39 | brlcad | kinda telling when you drop in the 10.4 X11 and it works |
| 01:00.41 | Axman6 | the last release came out in early december, and that's the one i have. i'll have another play, see if anything's changed for whatever reason |
| 01:05.36 | Axman6 | so brlcad, if you could use a comp's GPU for ray tracing, like the programmable ones, would that be of much benefit? |
| 01:05.52 | Axman6 | like what they're doing for folding@home |
| 01:13.29 | louipc | folding@home uses gpu? |
| 01:13.35 | Axman6 | it can |
| 01:13.43 | louipc | dang cool |
| 01:13.48 | Axman6 | they have an alpha or something for it |
| 01:13.59 | Axman6 | it's supposed to be extremely fast |
| 01:14.19 | louipc | I thought most gpu specs are closed |
| 01:14.37 | louipc | well ati just opened it |
| 01:16.12 | Axman6 | it's got nothing to do with drivers afaik. |
| 01:16.27 | Axman6 | a lot of modern GPU's are programmable |
| 01:18.00 | louipc | oh.. I figured if you knew the gpu instructions and all that then it would be no problem writing drivers for it :/, so it's some separate function eh? |
| 01:19.09 | Axman6 | yeah |
| 01:20.49 | brlcad | Axman6: yeah, it can be beneficial |
| 01:21.10 | Axman6 | are GPU's good at the kind of work brl-cad does? |
| 01:21.31 | brlcad | I've been watching and reading the research on gpu processing for over 5 years |
| 01:21.39 | brlcad | in general, no not really |
| 01:21.55 | Axman6 | could it be? |
| 01:21.57 | brlcad | you can make a customized ray-tracer that really takes advantage, but it's overly complicated |
| 01:22.01 | brlcad | in a serious way |
| 01:22.14 | brlcad | and the interface you write to is a very fast moving target |
| 01:22.19 | brlcad | changing every couple years |
| 01:22.25 | Axman6 | yeah :\ |
| 01:22.27 | louipc | hm |
| 01:23.02 | brlcad | it's already changed about three times over, so even if you get something working great today, there's really no telling if it's all wasted effort three years down the road |
| 01:24.12 | brlcad | you also have to either cut back to floating-point tolerance models too or take a fairly substantial performance hit |
| 01:24.57 | brlcad | and the code, if that wasn't clear.. is a royal custom pita to develop -- things like the gpgpu project have been making that aspect a whole lot better but you still have to write code that jumps through all sorts of hoops |
| 01:27.05 | brlcad | at which point I ask what the goal is .. |
| 01:27.56 | Axman6 | what about supporting the PS3? :P |
| 01:28.05 | brlcad | huh? |
| 01:28.07 | brlcad | what about it? |
| 01:28.27 | brlcad | you mean running on the cell processor? |
| 01:28.38 | Axman6 | well, the cell is pretty powerful... but not exactly an ideal platform for brl-cad |
| 01:29.04 | brlcad | it's pretty nice, but the price point simply isn't there (yet) |
| 01:29.23 | brlcad | for the same money, one can just buy more cores and quickly out-perform it |
| 01:29.37 | louipc | there's all kind of weird research that seems to have no point, you never know where it could lead :P |
| 01:29.41 | brlcad | then before too long, your bottlenecks are elsewhere (I/O, bandwidth, etc) |
| 01:30.42 | brlcad | it all has a point, it's research :) |
| 01:30.43 | Axman6 | i know where my bottleneck is, it's definitely I/O :( |
| 01:30.48 | Axman6 | i need a faster drive |
| 01:31.53 | brlcad | and generally research that was developed/investigated/implemented with specific intentions in mind .. a lot of research is great on paper, but horrible once put to practicalities and maintainability, others are glory moments .. |
| 01:32.06 | brlcad | that's the great part about siggraph, you get it all, and get the trends year over year |
| 01:32.42 | brlcad | gpgpu is still accellerating, and at some point it'll really start to settle as a bonefide generic vector coprocessor |
| 01:32.58 | brlcad | that's where it's all leading, along with massive cpu+gpu convergence |
| 01:34.05 | brlcad | there are places in librt today that could directly benefit from vector processing -- early evaluation of the csg expressions for every primary ray, for example |
| 01:34.29 | brlcad | I'd bet that would give a solid order improvement on our large models |
| 01:34.48 | brlcad | vector evaluation of the primitives is another, but that's a data management beast |
| 02:18.04 | brlcad | still processing |
| 02:29.21 | *** join/#brlcad aaronkramer (n=aaronkra@75-162-166-153.slkc.qwest.net) | |
| 02:29.34 | *** join/#brlcad cad81 (n=4ba2a699@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 02:29.35 | aaronkramer | is brlcad available for intel macs? |
| 02:31.19 | Axman6 | it is, but things are a little broken in leopard |
| 02:31.34 | aaronkramer | i don't have leopard I have tiger |
| 02:31.59 | aaronkramer | is there a walkthrough for compiling it in tiger |
| 02:32.02 | yukonbob | where "things are a little broken in leopard" is apparently leopards X11 implementation... |
| 02:32.05 | Axman6 | works fine then. you might have to compile it yourself though |
| 02:32.30 | brlcad | the binaries on the site work with tiger |
| 02:32.45 | brlcad | or you should get a good compile with pretty much default compilation options |
| 02:32.50 | aaronkramer | I tried it is says that the display var is undefined or something like that |
| 02:32.57 | Axman6 | aaronkramer:download the source, open it, cd into it, ./configure --enable-optimized $$ make -j2 && sudo make install |
| 02:33.00 | Axman6 | that should do it |
| 02:33.00 | brlcad | run X11 first |
| 02:33.10 | brlcad | that's not a problem with the build |
| 02:33.15 | brlcad | that's just knowing how X11 works |
| 02:33.23 | aaronkramer | I have programs that work in X11 |
| 02:33.46 | Axman6 | aaronkramer: you need to add 'export DISPLAY=0.0' to your .profile i think |
| 02:33.59 | brlcad | or .bash_profile |
| 02:34.04 | aaronkramer | how would I do that |
| 02:34.04 | Axman6 | there's no need for that in leopard, thankfully |
| 02:34.13 | brlcad | if you run from xterm instead of Terminal, then you don't need to set anything |
| 02:34.24 | aaronkramer | ok |
| 02:34.25 | brlcad | xterm sets it up automatically |
| 02:34.26 | Axman6 | that too |
| 02:35.25 | aaronkramer | do I use xterm commands the same way I use terminal commands |
| 02:35.27 | aaronkramer | like cd |
| 02:35.29 | aaronkramer | and sudo |
| 02:35.33 | brlcad | otherwise, if X11 is already running, you can also just prepend "DISPLAY=:0" to any X11 command and it should work in Terminal too (or add it to your init files) |
| 02:35.33 | Axman6 | aaronkramer: if you want to use terminal.app, add 'export DISPLAY=:0.0' to your ~/.profile |
| 02:35.46 | Axman6 | aaronkramer: it's all using bash, so yes |
| 02:35.46 | brlcad | aaronkramer: yes, they're both just unix command lines |
| 02:36.02 | brlcad | just the one in xterm initializes slightly differently |
| 02:36.09 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 02:36.13 | Axman6 | and uses X11 |
| 02:36.36 | aaronkramer | so if I compile using xterm will I only be able to launch via xterm in the future |
| 02:36.45 | Axman6 | no |
| 02:37.05 | Axman6 | the terminal app you use has nothing to do with how it builds |
| 02:37.22 | brlcad | Axman6: default account template on Macs have a .bash_profile, so editing .profile won't work |
| 02:37.36 | brlcad | bash searches in order and uses the first one it finds |
| 02:37.42 | Axman6 | brlcad: yeah, i usually advise using .bash_profile |
| 02:38.03 | brlcad | at least depends on the version of OS X.. later versions stopped defaulting a .bash_profile |
| 02:38.12 | brlcad | so depends whether they've upgraded or clean-installed |
| 02:38.36 | brlcad | aaronkramer: did that work for you? |
| 02:38.51 | aaronkramer | just a sec |
| 02:40.41 | aaronkramer | I do |
| 02:40.41 | aaronkramer | configure --enable-optimized $$ make -j2 && |
| 02:40.51 | aaronkramer | and all it does is give me a little arrow |
| 02:41.08 | aaronkramer | what should I type there |
| 02:41.12 | Axman6 | uh, my bad |
| 02:41.16 | brlcad | you're missing the rest of the line |
| 02:41.17 | Axman6 | replace the $$ with && |
| 02:41.25 | brlcad | (too) |
| 02:41.41 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 02:41.51 | brlcad | ./configure --enable-optimized --without-opengl --enable-all && make -j2 |
| 02:41.54 | Axman6 | && tells the shell to run what comes after it, if the bit before it exits cleanly |
| 02:42.06 | brlcad | then run: sudo make install and it'll install into /usr/brlcad |
| 02:42.08 | Axman6 | so if configure fails, it won't try making it |
| 02:42.43 | brlcad | type /usr/brlcad/bin/mged into the xterm window, and it should pop up the mged gui (two windows) |
| 02:43.19 | aaronkramer | okay it seems to be configuring it |
| 02:43.24 | brlcad | you can/should read the README and INSTALL files if you get stuck .. they go into more extensive detail |
| 02:43.33 | brlcad | did you add the --without-opengl option? |
| 02:43.37 | aaronkramer | yea |
| 02:43.40 | brlcad | k |
| 02:44.02 | aaronkramer | can i delete the source files after I have installed it |
| 02:44.08 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:44.15 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 02:44.36 | louipc | keep the Makefile maybe |
| 02:44.36 | brlcad | you can also run /usr/brlcad/bin/benchmark after it installs and it'll run a performance profile of your hardware |
| 02:44.50 | louipc | in case you want to make uninstall :P |
| 02:44.54 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 02:45.15 | brlcad | nah, brl-cad installs fully contained .. uninstall is trivial: sudo rm -rf /usr/brlcad |
| 02:45.29 | aaronkramer | is the xterm better for compiling programs that use x11 |
| 02:45.38 | brlcad | no difference |
| 02:45.56 | aaronkramer | because I have been trying for so long to get xaralx to work |
| 02:46.02 | Axman6 | aaronkramer: they're just different gui's for the same thing really |
| 02:46.05 | brlcad | the only real difference is that the xterm has DISPLAY set since it's tied to the X11 server |
| 02:46.08 | aaronkramer | oh |
| 02:46.19 | louipc | oh yeah, depends on how you install it |
| 02:47.07 | aaronkramer | how long does it usually take to configure? |
| 02:47.39 | Axman6 | 1-2 mins |
| 02:47.57 | aaronkramer | does it jump right into the make and install if it is succsessful |
| 02:48.13 | louipc | better haha? |
| 02:48.33 | louipc | no you have to tell it to make install after configure is finished |
| 02:48.45 | aaronkramer | hmm |
| 02:48.55 | louipc | i think configure might take 10min for me |
| 02:49.00 | louipc | but my computer is slow |
| 02:49.17 | aaronkramer | mine isn't it is an imac one of the new ones |
| 02:49.23 | aaronkramer | and it is taking awhile |
| 02:49.31 | Axman6 | takes 1:45ish on my MBP 2.4GHz |
| 02:49.37 | louipc | lots of things to check :P |
| 02:49.46 | aaronkramer | really? |
| 02:49.57 | Axman6 | that's 1min 45 sec |
| 02:50.00 | aaronkramer | it has gone on longer than that |
| 02:50.10 | Axman6 | the initial one often does |
| 02:50.16 | aaronkramer | oh |
| 02:50.45 | aaronkramer | so what do you guys think of brl cad |
| 02:51.01 | aaronkramer | is it better than the commercial stuff |
| 02:52.51 | louipc | nope |
| 02:53.23 | louipc | but most of the commercial stuff only runs on windows so... maybe yes! |
| 02:53.30 | aaronkramer | heh |
| 02:53.32 | louipc | in terms of features though... nope |
| 02:53.42 | aaronkramer | I heard there were chemical libraries |
| 02:53.59 | aaronkramer | where you could actually define a components chemical composition |
| 02:54.11 | aaronkramer | is this for real? |
| 02:54.43 | louipc | in brlcad? I don't know |
| 02:54.51 | louipc | or BRL-CAD I mean |
| 02:56.36 | aaronkramer | should I run make benchmark or make install |
| 02:56.55 | Axman6 | sudo make install, then make benchmark |
| 02:57.02 | Axman6 | just to see how fast it is |
| 02:57.29 | louipc | 1M times faster than reference machine? heh |
| 02:58.05 | aaronkramer | it took 13:18 to configure |
| 02:58.54 | louipc | nice |
| 03:00.44 | aaronkramer | should I exit the other programs befor I run the benchmark program |
| 03:01.22 | louipc | maybe if something is really using up cpu |
| 03:01.30 | aaronkramer | not really |
| 03:01.34 | aaronkramer | eh |
| 03:01.39 | aaronkramer | I won't bother |
| 03:03.11 | Axman6 | it's not something that important, just gives you an idea of how fast your machine is |
| 03:04.40 | louipc | i've only done it once I think |
| 03:08.40 | aaronkramer | how do I launch BRL-CAD again |
| 03:08.44 | aaronkramer | is it mged? |
| 03:10.19 | louipc | yeah |
| 03:10.38 | aaronkramer | its not working |
| 03:11.22 | louipc | ah right you might need to set your path |
| 03:11.30 | aaronkramer | never mind it works |
| 03:11.35 | louipc | to /usr/brlcad/bin |
| 03:11.38 | louipc | ok |
| 03:11.55 | aaronkramer | how do I do that |
| 03:12.25 | louipc | PATH=$PATH:/usr/brlcad/bin |
| 03:12.51 | louipc | it's probably a good idea to use .profile or /etc/profile .... |
| 03:13.03 | louipc | but I'm not so familiar with the mac environment |
| 03:13.09 | louipc | so it might be different |
| 03:13.17 | aaronkramer | I am not sure I understand |
| 03:13.54 | louipc | when you type a command into the shell, it looks in a variable called PATH for directories that contain programs |
| 03:14.11 | aaronkramer | but what does it mean that no database has been opened |
| 03:14.29 | louipc | it means you haven't opened a brlcad model |
| 03:15.51 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 03:15.57 | aaronkramer | I understand now |
| 03:16.11 | louipc | opendb <file> will do it for you |
| 03:16.21 | louipc | that's how you start a new file as well |
| 03:16.55 | aaronkramer | thanks |
| 03:16.59 | louipc | or you can open directly from the command line by just `mged <file>` |
| 03:17.30 | aaronkramer | I am off bed now |
| 03:17.36 | aaronkramer | see you later and thanks |
| 03:17.40 | louipc | bye |
| 04:39.39 | brlcad | louipc: 1M times? .. there's only a handful of machines on the planet that are in the "M"-times-faster-than-reference-machine range |
| 04:41.14 | louipc | yes I exaggerated |
| 04:42.50 | brlcad | the new high-performance computer that was dedicated to Mike Muuss at ARL's HPC center is presently ranked #27 on the planet and I was able to get an estimate of about 7M VGRs performance iirc |
| 04:43.57 | louipc | what do you use that one for? |
| 04:44.24 | brlcad | why emacs of course ;) |
| 04:44.32 | louipc | hehehe |
| 04:45.48 | brlcad | 7M VGRs is freaking impressive .. to think when Mike started BRL-CAD .. the VGR references *was* a supercomputer and it came in at .. 1 .. 25 years later, 7 million times faster |
| 04:46.55 | brlcad | at that rate, you could render some of the original brl-cad renderings that took an entire week to process in about a minute |
| 04:47.01 | brlcad | s/renderings/animations/ |
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| 14:15.35 | ``Erik | vax's were minis, not supers :( |
| 14:15.59 | ``Erik | but they were omfg powerful compared to the PC's that came out many yrs later |
| 14:18.06 | ``Erik | hum, appleII and commodore PET were released the same year as the vax 11/780, BSD was released that year, arcnet was developed, xmodem was developed... |
| 14:19.17 | ``Erik | cray-1 was about he same time |
| 14:20.12 | ``Erik | or, rather, the first cray-1 install was the same time |
| 14:23.14 | ``Erik | so, another re-import O.o |
| 14:58.54 | Z80-Boy | Is it true that if a foreigner comes to a US airport they always take a fingerprint from him? |
| 14:59.25 | alex_joni | yup |
| 14:59.50 | Z80-Boy | Is it possible to fly to Mexico and then go to the US with a car? |
| 14:59.56 | Z80-Boy | Or a train or whatever? |
| 15:00.07 | Z80-Boy | They don't take fingerprints on the borders? |
| 15:00.36 | Z80-Boy | What privacy risks does this fingerprinting imply? |
| 15:04.28 | alex_joni | they fidn you when you do something stupid? |
| 15:07.26 | prasad_ | they get u on fake charges and send u to guantanemo bay with the blessing of the foreign govt |
| 15:08.57 | prasad_ | wait that's harold and kumar 2 |
| 15:08.58 | prasad_ | :P |
| 15:13.11 | Z80-Boy | prasad_: that's what I was concerned about |
| 15:13.35 | Z80-Boy | Is it possible to fly to Mexico, then go on land? |
| 15:19.30 | prasad_ | *shrug* |
| 15:24.06 | ``Erik | probably be easier to bump through canada... *cough* |
| 15:34.03 | *** join/#brlcad Defcon (n=def@74.17-246-81.adsl-static.isp.belgacom.be) | |
| 15:34.12 | Defcon | hi all |
| 15:34.14 | Defcon | Declan: I dunno...I love her, but this new years is going to be uber depressing |
| 15:34.14 | Defcon | grencez: her friends are much lamer than both of you combined |
| 15:34.15 | Defcon | Declan: The thought of her getting high at a party where everyone is drunk while I sit at home and code Perl or something is kind of too much to bear |
| 15:34.18 | Defcon | CyanFlux: maybe try coding something in c |
| 15:34.34 | ``Erik | heh, paste the qdb url, not the whole damn entry, dude :D |
| 15:36.58 | brlcad | ``Erik: give the checkout another try, see if things look better |
| 15:37.16 | ``Erik | hum, do I have to purge and re-co, or do ya think I can up? |
| 15:37.55 | brlcad | no idea |
| 15:38.48 | brlcad | probably could up, should work if it's smart |
| 15:38.48 | ``Erik | and what'm I looking for, permissions in tie stuff? |
| 15:38.49 | brlcad | specially since it does the md5 thing on the root files you have stored locally |
| 15:38.49 | brlcad | whatever you can find |
| 15:38.49 | brlcad | anything wrong |
| 15:38.53 | brlcad | or different |
| 15:39.20 | ``Erik | hum, permissions in libtie are still gooby |
| 15:39.38 | ``Erik | that was the only thing I'd noticed from playing yesterday... |
| 15:39.42 | ``Erik | lemme blow it away and retry |
| 15:44.27 | Defcon | (@Dreki) I just realized something. |
| 15:44.28 | Defcon | (@Dreki) A is the 1st letter of the alphabet and H is the 8th letter, right? |
| 15:44.28 | Defcon | (@Dreki) 9/11=0.8181818181=HAHAHAHA. |
| 15:44.30 | Defcon | ohw |
| 15:44.37 | Defcon | sorry ``Erik |
| 15:44.41 | Defcon | :) |
| 15:58.23 | ``Erik | brlcad: what do you think about joining Ed and myself for lunch at olive shack? |
| 15:58.36 | ``Erik | also; perms in libtie look good now |
| 15:59.38 | ``Erik | src/adrt/doc/ChangeLog is still +x |
| 16:02.13 | ``Erik | silly nfs, you should know enough that I don't have to do "cd $PWD" |
| 16:03.08 | Z80-Boy | Do they do this fingerprint scanning also on domestic flights? |
| 16:03.31 | ``Erik | no, z80 |
| 16:03.51 | Z80-Boy | So if a foreigner flies from LA to NYC, they don't fingerprint? |
| 16:04.19 | ``Erik | I d'no about a foreign national, but I don't get fingerprinted when flying in the us |
| 16:05.02 | Z80-Boy | I think it should be possible to fly to Mexico or Canada, drive over the border or maybe take a train or a bus, and then fly the rest. |
| 16:05.07 | ``Erik | I show up with my ticket, show 'em my drivers license, take off my shoes and go through the security crap and I'm on my way |
| 16:05.27 | Z80-Boy | take off your shoes? Why? |
| 16:05.37 | Z80-Boy | Do they make an X-ray of the body? |
| 16:05.55 | ``Erik | I imagine that carrying a czech ID through a canadian/US entry will get some scrutiny |
| 16:06.07 | ``Erik | no, for the metal detector... just to be pains in the arse I suppose |
| 16:06.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: sounds shacky |
| 16:06.33 | ``Erik | they jacked up the sensitivity so far that the fucking rivets on my jeans have set them off before |
| 16:06.59 | ``Erik | so they made it standard policy that the shoes have to go through the xray conveyer, I guess too many metal arch supports or rivets |
| 16:07.27 | ``Erik | 'shacky' is lamesauce for 'yes, I will join you gentlemen for lunch'? |
| 16:07.33 | Z80-Boy | maybe you could choke a pilot with your shoe |
| 16:07.50 | ``Erik | heh, ya get 'em back after the detector/xray phase |
| 16:08.10 | ``Erik | <-- wears slip-on type shoes when flying anymore :/ |
| 16:09.33 | Z80-Boy | US airports, the little gitmoes |
| 16:09.44 | ``Erik | I would guess that xenophobia and general paranoia is going to make flying and border crossing less than enjoyable for you :( |
| 16:10.20 | ``Erik | I've read stories about people being detained for 8+ hours on suspicions... |
| 16:10.25 | Z80-Boy | This helps the terrorists reach their goal - paralyze the population with fear |
| 16:10.38 | Z80-Boy | I think the US administration should be charged with cooperation with the terrorists |
| 16:11.05 | Z80-Boy | I have read about someone who couldn't fly because he had a PIC (microcontroller) programmer where he added a resistor |
| 16:11.17 | ``Erik | <-- looks over his shoulder |
| 16:11.31 | ``Erik | it's interesting to hear a rational observation from another country |
| 16:11.32 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 16:11.32 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:11.32 | Z80-Boy | They said it's an Improvised Electronic Device (IED) and refused to allow him to take it on board |
| 16:12.03 | ``Erik | yeah, then there ws the MIT student trying to fly with a pic controlled LED nametag, she thought it'd help her chances at the job fair she was going to or coming back from |
| 16:12.17 | Z80-Boy | yeah |
| 16:12.30 | Z80-Boy | did she get beaten up? |
| 16:12.33 | ``Erik | and little LED athf ads were treated as bombs in like boston or something (where seattle just went "oh... cool") |
| 16:12.46 | Z80-Boy | athf == ? |
| 16:12.51 | ``Erik | aqua teen hunger force |
| 16:12.58 | Z80-Boy | what's that? |
| 16:13.02 | ``Erik | tv show |
| 16:13.28 | Z80-Boy | and now you have to place your medication and ointments into bags even in Europe |
| 16:13.35 | Z80-Boy | I take train instead of an airplane |
| 16:14.08 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:14.15 | Z80-Boy | Instead of walking kilometers in little gitmoes and being humiliated by procedures, I feel like changing trams |
| 16:14.17 | ``Erik | trains are more expensive than flying here |
| 16:14.29 | Z80-Boy | If you take a sleeping train you sleep through the night anyway |
| 16:14.39 | ``Erik | I can fly to my parents for 200usd or take a train for 800 |
| 16:14.39 | Z80-Boy | this one is fortunately more expensive |
| 16:14.53 | ``Erik | like 2000 for a sleeper |
| 16:15.00 | Z80-Boy | and now when the Shengen comes, I will not have to show my passport on the train, whereas in the airport you still have to show it |
| 16:15.14 | Z80-Boy | I want a train between Russia and the US |
| 16:15.25 | ``Erik | might get a bit moist for part of it |
| 16:15.44 | Z80-Boy | There is the Bering strait isn't? |
| 16:15.46 | ``Erik | also; a lot of stodgy old politicians and idiot rednecks still have an "us vs them" attitude |
| 16:15.53 | Z80-Boy | They said they want to build a bridge there |
| 16:16.04 | ``Erik | yeah, the waters a little shallower there along the alutian island chain |
| 16:16.16 | Z80-Boy | US vs them? |
| 16:16.27 | Z80-Boy | or a tunnel? |
| 16:16.30 | Z80-Boy | I don't know |
| 16:16.39 | Z80-Boy | now they are drilling a 57km tunnel here in Switzerland |
| 16:16.44 | ``Erik | I meant "us" as in the self-identifying noun, not the nation |
| 16:16.52 | ``Erik | yeah, I read about that |
| 16:16.57 | ``Erik | and a massive bridge up there, too |
| 16:17.01 | Z80-Boy | But sometimes I have a feeling it's US vs. The Rest Of The World |
| 16:17.17 | Z80-Boy | massive bridge here in Switzerland? What do you mean? |
| 16:17.24 | ``Erik | where they were actuall ybuilding segments of the bridge upside down and using them as giant barges |
| 16:17.26 | ``Erik | sweden area |
| 16:17.35 | Z80-Boy | that's not switzerland |
| 16:17.38 | ``Erik | no, I know |
| 16:17.55 | Z80-Boy | that was Oresund wasn't? That's already finished |
| 16:17.58 | ``Erik | not much use for giant water-crossing bridges in switzerland... but europe is all "over there" |
| 16:18.07 | ``Erik | and tiny :) |
| 16:20.19 | Z80-Boy | If a company says training in the US is required, do you think it makes sense to reject their job offer because of the problems associated with travelling to US? |
| 16:22.16 | ``Erik | *shrug* I d'no, all depends |
| 16:23.46 | Z80-Boy | I think EU should start taking fingerprints and naked pictures and post them freely downloadable under public domain licence |
| 16:23.51 | Z80-Boy | only of US citizens |
| 16:24.05 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:24.14 | ``Erik | do ya really wanna see naked american tourists? O.o |
| 16:24.43 | Z80-Boy | that's right |
| 16:24.43 | ``Erik | huh, 'propdel svn:executable', keen |
| 16:25.44 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 16:28.16 | ``Erik | brlcad: I'm gonna gather ed and head over there, we'll save a seat |
| 18:46.06 | brlcad | grr.. now that's annoying that CVS repository has all .sh files with exec set, prop-edit lists .sh as being svn:executable, but they end up non-exec |
| 18:58.50 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29888 10/brlcad/trunk/ (21 files in 13 dirs): more executable scripts that need their property set |
| 18:59.36 | brlcad | there we go, had to resync the commit hooks |
| 19:01.01 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29889 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: converted the source repository from CVS to Subversion |
| 19:10.43 | brlcad | woo hoo, tcl files are correct now |
| 19:35.24 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29890 10/brlcad/trunk/ (1827 files in 102 dirs): And I, for one, welcome our new rat overlords. All hail 2008, the year of the rat! (copyright update) |
| 19:50.00 | alex_joni | brlcad: heh |
| 19:51.24 | brlcad | and ohloh enlistment is proceeding |
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| 20:18.18 | ``Erik | ohno, ohloh! |
| 20:33.12 | brlcad | ohyeah! |
| 20:37.26 | ``Erik | did you just jump through a wall? |
| 20:39.41 | alex_joni | brlcad: but still.. thank god for svn.. wouldn't want to imagine how that commit report would look for CVS |
| 20:55.40 | brlcad | the summary report from CIA looks identical |
| 20:56.28 | brlcad | the big difference now is that I only get one commit e-mail instead of 102 commit e-mails :) |
| 21:02.28 | alex_joni | yup |
| 21:02.33 | alex_joni | that's what I meant.. |
| 21:03.24 | brlcad | ah, yeah :) |
| 21:09.47 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * 10svn/Windows/svn-1.4.5-setup.exe: erhm, is something filtering exe files? add it again |
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| 21:26.26 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/fb.png <---- weeee Xwin32 and frame buffer :) |
| 21:27.59 | IriX64 | ugly part is xwin32 only allows me 30 minutes a crack :) |
| 21:28.31 | IriX64 | should buy the darn thing |
| 21:34.59 | ``Erik | doesn't cygwin come with a full-up X server? |
| 21:35.28 | IriX64 | want it to work with any windows xserver |
| 21:48.43 | IriX64 | gonna install it into the root of the C drive and copy the needed dll's over and see what happens |
| 21:50.20 | IriX64 | make install |
| 21:50.56 | IriX64 | how do you install an irc channel :) |
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| 02:25.49 | mateo | hh |
| 02:26.30 | *** part/#brlcad mateo (i=west@200.92.243.117) | |
| 02:28.26 | ``Erik | hum |
| 02:28.27 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d517d9381 |
| 02:38.14 | brlcad | hum indeed |
| 02:39.02 | brlcad | how did it surmise 16 minutes of downtime? |
| 02:40.20 | ``Erik | by ordering boot times, finding 'down' times by adding boot times and uptimes, then subtracting the down time from the next boot time |
| 02:40.59 | ``Erik | ~erik/rel.scm |
| 02:41.25 | brlcad | it's only booted less than a half-dozen times ever iirc |
| 02:41.29 | ``Erik | (slightly compressed) |
| 02:42.13 | ``Erik | 6 boot times |
| 02:48.16 | brlcad | hmm.. I'm also not sure I've had that machine for 2.14 years... |
| 02:52.30 | ``Erik | /var/spool/uptimed/records |
| 02:52.37 | ``Erik | you didn't do a massive time change, did you? |
| 02:52.54 | ``Erik | files in my home directory list 2005 |
| 02:54.18 | brlcad | hm, October 18, 2004 |
| 02:54.40 | ``Erik | I'm seeing ~ files from '05, too |
| 02:54.50 | brlcad | that's when I created my account |
| 02:54.52 | ``Erik | there's one from '04 in /etc |
| 02:55.16 | brlcad | which was the first day or there'bouts |
| 02:56.03 | ``Erik | I think ya have had it that long, dude |
| 02:56.19 | ``Erik | time flies when you get old |
| 02:57.05 | ``Erik | 5.2.1 was feb 04, 5.3 was nov '04 |
| 02:58.12 | brlcad | hm, that date's not quite matching other files I'm seeing too .. so not the first days .. but within a month I think .. |
| 02:58.26 | brlcad | so still, longer than 2.14 |
| 02:58.37 | brlcad | yeah, I didn't mean less .. more |
| 02:59.24 | brlcad | so pushing 3.3 years or so |
| 03:02.30 | brlcad | sep30 2004 |
| 03:05.17 | brlcad | woot! .. "The error was on our end. I added some additional hardware to our database server today and BRLCAD's and a couple other long running jobs died in the process." |
| 03:05.52 | brlcad | ohloh import, take 2! |
| 03:06.13 | brlcad | ``Erik: maybe you installed/enabled uptimed 2.14 years ago? |
| 03:14.16 | brlcad | should show uptimes of 121 days, preceeded by 499 days at least, then don't recall what preceeded that |
| 03:18.01 | ``Erik | I'm sure |
| 03:18.07 | ``Erik | run uprecords -b |
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| 17:12.17 | aaronkramer | hey I am back |
| 17:12.30 | aaronkramer | i need help with brl-cad again |
| 17:12.53 | brlcad | hello aaronkramer |
| 17:13.01 | aaronkramer | I booted it once and it worked fine then I exited tried to boot it a few days later and it is giving me this error |
| 17:13.11 | aaronkramer | Initializing and backgrounding, please wait...Done |
| 17:13.12 | aaronkramer | no display name and no $DISPLAY environment variable |
| 17:13.12 | aaronkramer | MGED Aborted |
| 17:13.23 | brlcad | same problem you had the first time |
| 17:13.24 | aaronkramer | sorry just a sec |
| 17:13.26 | aaronkramer | yea |
| 17:13.28 | brlcad | run from xterm, not Terminal |
| 17:13.55 | brlcad | make sure X11 is running |
| 17:14.04 | aaronkramer | I try to run mged from xterm but it does not work |
| 17:14.10 | aaronkramer | it says command not found |
| 17:14.17 | brlcad | run /usr/brlcad/bin/mged |
| 17:15.21 | aaronkramer | okay it, that works |
| 17:15.25 | aaronkramer | why does it do that |
| 17:16.41 | aaronkramer | and what is a good manual for brl-cad |
| 17:21.29 | brlcad | that gets into just explaining how the unix command line paths work |
| 17:21.34 | brlcad | has nothing to do with brl-cad really |
| 17:22.12 | brlcad | when you run a command, whether it be "mged" or "ls" or "whatever" on the command line .. it searches through a list of directories/folders throughout your filesystem |
| 17:22.20 | brlcad | that list of places is called your PATH |
| 17:22.46 | brlcad | pretty much every operating system has a concept of a PATH that is searched when you run a command, even Windows |
| 17:23.21 | brlcad | BRL-CAD installs into the /usr/brlcad folder, with binaries in the /usr/brlcad/bin folder .. which is not in your PATH of folders searched by default |
| 17:23.47 | brlcad | so you have to either add it to your PATH or you have to specify the full location of the binary application that you're trying to run |
| 17:23.58 | brlcad | which is why /usr/brlcad/bin/mged works |
| 17:24.36 | aaronkramer | in xterm how would I make it so that all I have to do is type mged |
| 17:24.51 | aaronkramer | or is there a way to create a launcher like in linux for mac os x |
| 17:27.05 | brlcad | there are several ways to make "launchers" under mac os x |
| 17:27.18 | aaronkramer | would I use apple script? |
| 17:27.31 | brlcad | but one of the easiest for what you're trying to do would be to add it to the X11 menu |
| 17:27.45 | brlcad | select Applications -> Customize Menu |
| 17:28.00 | brlcad | click the Add button |
| 17:28.02 | aaronkramer | where |
| 17:28.06 | brlcad | in X11 |
| 17:28.20 | brlcad | make X11 the focused app |
| 17:28.31 | brlcad | then up on the menu, select Applications -> Customize Menu |
| 17:29.05 | aaronkramer | then I just put in the command then what I want it to be named |
| 17:29.36 | brlcad | reverse that, but yes |
| 17:29.48 | brlcad | first column is the menu name, second is the command |
| 17:30.28 | aaronkramer | I see |
| 17:30.45 | brlcad | try "/usr/brlcad/bin/mged -f" as the command |
| 17:31.35 | aaronkramer | I didn't work with the -f |
| 17:31.45 | aaronkramer | it worked without it though |
| 17:31.53 | brlcad | really? that's odd .. ok |
| 17:32.36 | brlcad | the other way to make it so that typing "mged" works is to modify your PATH setting |
| 17:32.38 | aaronkramer | actually it didn't work with either |
| 17:33.00 | aaronkramer | how do I do that |
| 17:33.02 | brlcad | hm, I've heard that the X11 launcher is a bit buggy |
| 17:33.25 | aaronkramer | Yea I heard from various sources that mac also killed X11 in mac os x |
| 17:33.57 | brlcad | run this command: ls -lad .??* | grep -i profile |
| 17:34.01 | brlcad | what does it report? |
| 17:34.22 | brlcad | that's a listing of files that start with a "." looking for any profile files |
| 17:34.50 | brlcad | should see either .profile or .bash_profile |
| 17:34.50 | aaronkramer | -rw-r--r-- 1 aaronkra aaronkra 264 Jan 10 18:51 .profile |
| 17:34.55 | brlcad | okay |
| 17:34.59 | brlcad | cat .profile |
| 17:35.37 | brlcad | that displays the contents of the .profile file |
| 17:35.45 | brlcad | what's in there? |
| 17:36.12 | aaronkramer | -rw-r--r-- 1 aaronkra aaronkra 264 Jan 10 18:51 .profile |
| 17:36.21 | aaronkramer | oops |
| 17:36.24 | aaronkramer | sorry |
| 17:36.26 | aaronkramer | it says |
| 17:36.52 | aaronkramer | export PATH=/usr/brlcad/bin:$PATH |
| 17:37.12 | brlcad | ah, so someone already helped you add it to your path |
| 17:37.29 | aaronkramer | possibly |
| 17:38.02 | aaronkramer | so why wouldn't it work |
| 17:38.06 | brlcad | run this: open -e .profile |
| 17:38.13 | brlcad | that will open up the with in TextEdit |
| 17:38.20 | brlcad | add a line that says this: |
| 17:38.24 | brlcad | export DISPLAY=:0 |
| 17:38.30 | brlcad | save the file |
| 17:39.12 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 17:39.16 | aaronkramer | done |
| 17:39.25 | brlcad | now you can type "mged" from Terminal |
| 17:39.38 | aaronkramer | I already could as long as x11 was open |
| 17:40.28 | aaronkramer | it gives me the same error when I type it in from terminal with x11 closed |
| 17:40.31 | brlcad | only because I made BRL-CAD 7.10.4 on Mac OS X specifically try to search for X11 |
| 17:40.38 | brlcad | yeah, X11 has to be running |
| 17:40.55 | brlcad | we've not made a release that doesn't need it (though one is being worked on) |
| 17:41.18 | aaronkramer | cool |
| 17:41.31 | aaronkramer | will it ever move away from CMDUI |
| 17:41.58 | aaronkramer | CMDLUI* |
| 17:42.32 | brlcad | one of the major efforts is to make it more "gui-friendly" |
| 17:42.43 | brlcad | more user-friendly in general with a new look |
| 17:43.03 | aaronkramer | that would be really nice |
| 17:43.10 | brlcad | the command line will never go away, but you won't necessarily *have* to use/learn it to be productive |
| 17:43.22 | aaronkramer | yea |
| 17:43.25 | brlcad | just like how mac os x has a command line, but you don't necessarily have to learn it |
| 17:43.49 | brlcad | as for documentation/tutorials, they're on the website: http://brlcad.org/ |
| 17:43.59 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 17:44.01 | brlcad | Documentation section .. I'd suggest just going down the list in order |
| 17:44.42 | brlcad | the really big one is the "Introduction to MGED" |
| 17:44.46 | aaronkramer | About BRL-CAD's features, I heard it had a chemical library that let you define the composition of a component is that true |
| 17:44.54 | aaronkramer | okay |
| 17:45.02 | aaronkramer | i think I will download all of those as back up |
| 17:45.05 | brlcad | that's the extensive introduction that takes you through tutorial after tutorial that will give you instruction on the basics |
| 17:46.26 | brlcad | not sure what you mean by chemical library -- we coordinate, hook into, and are USED by several major analysis packages (including for ballistics, optics, chem, bio, radar signature, V/L, etc) |
| 17:47.27 | brlcad | you can specify an objects material properties in brl-cad for computation of things like mass/weight, centroids, volume, etc |
| 17:47.41 | aaronkramer | thats pretty cool |
| 17:48.40 | brlcad | the material property basically boils down to the modeler specifying a list of material densities, marking objects as being a given material type, and then running one of our tools that performs calculations that use the material information (rtweight, g_qa, others) |
| 17:49.02 | brlcad | rtarea for projected presented coverage areas if you're looking at profile information |
| 17:49.16 | brlcad | rtcheck and g_qa for overlap/interference computations |
| 17:49.33 | aaronkramer | what renderer does it use |
| 17:51.52 | brlcad | we have a variety of renderers |
| 17:52.31 | brlcad | there's a wireframe render in mged, there are various ray-tracers (rt, rtedge) |
| 17:53.29 | brlcad | as a real quick tutorial, you can run this: mged /usr/brlcad/share/brlcad/7.10.4/db/havoc.g |
| 17:53.39 | brlcad | then in the mged command window type: e havoc |
| 17:53.56 | brlcad | then type: rt -s 1024 |
| 17:54.02 | brlcad | then type: rtedge -s 1024 |
| 17:54.35 | brlcad | (there are ways to do that all via the gui, but much easier to explain/describe it as commands |
| 17:55.39 | brlcad | got to run off, so best of luck on the tutorials -- they really are essential *just* to get a grasp of the basics |
| 17:56.09 | aaronkramer | see ya |
| 17:56.11 | aaronkramer | and thanks |
| 17:56.37 | brlcad | sure, btw, you should see something like: http://brlcad.org/images/havoc_rtedge.png after that last step |
| 17:56.41 | brlcad | (minus the box) |
| 17:56.48 | brlcad | (and smaller) |
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| 13:52.33 | curious | hmm. can brlcad operate on photors/using dynamic space-time domain? |
| 13:54.17 | curious | http://www.islandia.is/gko/EMNG04-moment.pdf photors as defined here |
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| 14:08.15 | poolio | :o |
| 14:08.54 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:12.09 | poolio | I'm disappointed by mbo's uptime :P |
| 14:14.41 | ``Erik | "mbo"? |
| 14:47.29 | poolio | my.brlcad.org |
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| 15:34.06 | brlcad | wtf |
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| 15:58.16 | brlcad | well that sucks, but apparently the ISP had a major power outage that lasted several hours, exhausting their backup power capacities too |
| 16:00.47 | louipc | ouch |
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| 18:36.38 | brlcad | well, there's a response on scan.coverity.com regarding our Coverity report |
| 18:37.26 | brlcad | we fall into that category of the projects that include other projects, related to why it's taking so long for them to get a new scan going |
| 18:44.27 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: coverity, is it possible to just submit the original files instead of the third-party support files? |
| 18:45.49 | yukonbob | ie: Tcl is already being scanned itself (and happens to be one of 11 projects in rung2, the hightest to day ;), and things like the utah raster, tcl extensions, etc. would be nice to test, but do they present too much interference to getting the original code (ie: librt) tested? |
| 18:46.05 | yukonbob | *highest to date |
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| 18:51.32 | MinuteElectron | Did something happen recently, my screen session went dead and some of my settings appear to have been altered. |
| 18:52.51 | MinuteElectron | That is quite ironic. |
| 18:52.57 | yukonbob | how so? |
| 18:53.50 | MinuteElectron | The server was taken offline a hundred or so days ago to install something to do with power, probably unrelated but if it is it just shows that meddling with something that works isn't a great idea. |
| 18:54.21 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29891 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/macosx/openUp.c: quell ohloh APSL license detection since we can't yet specify (to ohloh) that it should ignore/exempt some files/dirs |
| 18:55.12 | yukonbob | brlcad was saying the outage was a long one, and so exhausted their backups -- maybe the 100-day-ago issue was to install the backup; if that's the case, it's only "unfortunate" that the backups couldn't handle that length of outage... |
| 18:56.00 | yukonbob | as long as the host expected to be losing power soon, and could gracefully shutdown before just having it's juice exhausted... |
| 18:56.26 | MinuteElectron | Ahh, ok. |
| 19:20.05 | brlcad | yukonbob: that's the problem with the scans in general, and why ours hasn't updated -- they've been looking at how to exempt those dependency projects from the scans |
| 19:20.14 | brlcad | we're not the only project like that |
| 19:21.08 | brlcad | they don't just do a static analysis either, they need to be able to compile as their checker basically is a compiler doing path analyses |
| 19:22.25 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: yeah, the machine lost power (all machines at the ISP (hundreds) lost power) due to a major outage |
| 19:23.03 | brlcad | the thing 100 days ago or so was a new UPS for our rack and a new remote reboot port |
| 19:23.55 | brlcad | this was power coming from the grid that failed, and the brownout lasted several hours |
| 19:24.39 | MinuteElectron | Too bad, although you would think the ISP would have adaquete backups even for a very long power outage since I wouldn't be suprised if there were several mission-critical systems hosted by them/ |
| 19:24.50 | brlcad | from what I've read the UPS' only held up an hour or so, and they had problems with keeping the main facility diesel backup generator running due to a faulty valve |
| 19:25.02 | brlcad | they did, the backups failed :) |
| 19:25.13 | brlcad | rather, the backups of the backups |
| 19:25.42 | MinuteElectron | XD |
| 19:26.45 | brlcad | yeah, they have way bigger customers than us, multimillion dollar customers, that lose major money when anything goes down |
| 19:27.22 | yukonbob | !gah -- they better have a good insurance policy for that... |
| 19:27.56 | yukonbob | (or perhaps whatever electricity they could generate went to those customers) |
| 19:29.38 | yukonbob | re: coverity -- ah -- too bad (for us) -- do we need permission (from project maintainers) to have utah raster lib (for example) run through coverity -- I know you need permission to join a coverity project and see the results... |
| 19:30.42 | brlcad | many massive data centers like sago's have agreements with the power company that compensates them if they're down more than N minutes a year |
| 19:31.02 | brlcad | dunno if sago has that in place, but they should.. even still, it happens |
| 19:31.36 | brlcad | even the rackspace kings had major downtime just this past fall for several hours when a truck crashed into one of their transformers |
| 19:32.16 | brlcad | http://www.rackspace.com/information/announcements/datacenter.php fun fun :) |
| 19:32.24 | brlcad | cost them millions |
| 19:33.58 | brlcad | yukonbob: as for coverity and permissions.. huh??? :) no |
| 19:34.47 | brlcad | the permission is permission *from coverity* as they only want to scan projects that they approve, they don't want to be scanning every open source project out there or (worse) commercial customers for free |
| 19:35.44 | brlcad | they're paid by uncle sam to scan open source projects |
| 19:36.12 | yukonbob | brlcad: but I (yukonbob) can't take a look at the scan results for any project I want... I need permission from the project leads (like I need permission to commit to the BRL-CAD cvs/svn)... |
| 19:36.18 | louipc | # We have made changes to the leadership and staff at our DFW Data Center. |
| 19:36.20 | louipc | uh oh |
| 19:36.47 | brlcad | yukonbob: oh sure, that's just the nature of their scanning system though |
| 19:37.05 | brlcad | I'd give you an account if I could, but the whole login system is actually down at the moment ever since the news went up |
| 19:37.30 | yukonbob | right -- but is there an issue with BRL-CAD submitting 3rd party code and getting access to the results? |
| 19:37.49 | brlcad | just a technical issue |
| 19:37.59 | yukonbob | ie: I myself can't say "lets put OpenBSD up there" and then have access to the OpenBSD bug list... |
| 19:38.06 | brlcad | the report includes issues in all the 3rd party code as well as our code |
| 19:38.36 | brlcad | yukonbob: you could request it -- I requested that BRL-CAD be added |
| 19:39.03 | brlcad | but he's likely not going to approve someone not "in charge" of a given project, unless it's one of the unclaimed rung 0 projects |
| 19:39.16 | yukonbob | I did request NetBSD be put up -- but I don't have access to the bug list... |
| 19:39.28 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:39.35 | brlcad | well I know why that is |
| 19:39.51 | brlcad | the guy in charge of the whole thing for Coverity |
| 19:39.57 | brlcad | David Maxwell |
| 19:40.03 | brlcad | he's a core NetBSD developer |
| 19:40.05 | yukonbob | I'm not a NetBSD coreteam member... it makes sense |
| 19:40.08 | yukonbob | heh |
| 19:40.23 | brlcad | so he probably just chuckled |
| 19:40.33 | yukonbob | I guess :) |
| 19:41.02 | brlcad | heh, that's funny .. of all the projects ... |
| 19:41.04 | yukonbob | but back to example of URL (utah raster lib) -- will they give us the URL buglist, even though it's not our project? |
| 19:41.27 | yukonbob | (but is a dependency of the BRL-CAD build) |
| 19:41.39 | brlcad | yes, but it just all is attributed as BRL-CAD code |
| 19:42.04 | brlcad | e.g. they (at least originally) considered everything in our source tarball as "BRL-CAD" code |
| 19:42.05 | yukonbob | because unless a URL dev gets access to that list, we have info that may be unpatched and could wreak havoc on other projects using the URL... |
| 19:42.09 | brlcad | same goes for every other project |
| 19:42.26 | brlcad | yet often clearly not the case when it's external code (zlib is a common one many provide) |
| 19:43.14 | brlcad | for what it's worth, we're pretty much the maintainers for URT (utah raster toolkit) |
| 19:43.24 | yukonbob | ah right -- urt not url |
| 19:43.27 | brlcad | but tcl/tk is a better example |
| 19:43.41 | brlcad | they're a big package and ALSO in coverity scan |
| 19:43.48 | yukonbob | it's got 0 issues atm |
| 19:44.07 | brlcad | yet if you look at the little bit of BRL-CAD report we do have -- all those issues listed were actually in Tcl |
| 19:44.35 | brlcad | the "99 uninspected" issues at http://scan.coverity.com/rung1.html for BRL-CAD are Tcl issues |
| 19:44.41 | yukonbob | so re: Tcl -- did we need a TCT member to "sign-off" on allowing the Tcl to be included in the BRL-CAD scan? |
| 19:44.55 | brlcad | and then the coverity scanner died shortly after when it got to Tk, I believe |
| 19:45.06 | brlcad | no |
| 19:45.24 | brlcad | i still don't get where/why you think we need these sign-off's... |
| 19:45.44 | yukonbob | hrm --- if that's the way it works, so be it -- just seems like private information to me (ie: us knowing the bugs in tcl/tk, potentially before TCT members do) |
| 19:46.17 | brlcad | it just means that we may get reports for issues in code that we may or may not maintain |
| 19:46.32 | brlcad | which we could fix or mark as verified and ignore |
| 19:46.39 | brlcad | or leave out of the scan entirely |
| 19:47.10 | brlcad | which is what david has been trying to do for our code since we were first added, ignore everything in src/other |
| 19:47.28 | brlcad | just hasn't finished |
| 19:47.47 | brlcad | I imagine it took changes to coverity prevent |
| 19:47.53 | yukonbob | my reasoning is that the coverity scan seems like a powerful tool to find classes of bugs -- wouldn't want hax0rs to have access to information before it's patched, or even known by the true maintainers of the software... but if they're only allowing certain projects, and contacting the project leads for those, I guess they're assuming that all the folks being scanned are responsible people... |
| 19:48.23 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 19:49.16 | brlcad | seems like a pretty darn safe assumption to me .. i mean even with tcl getting included in our report, we might actually want to fix their issues as we do depend on them |
| 19:49.21 | brlcad | their issuers *are* our issues |
| 19:49.44 | brlcad | but I certainly don't want to fix their problems if I don't have to :) |
| 19:49.53 | brlcad | and them likewise for their deps I'm sure |
| 19:50.24 | yukonbob | right -- I was assuming Joe Hacker could submit a project that might depend on openssl, though, and then have access to classes of errors in ssl that could be used on the Wild Wild Web |
| 19:50.45 | brlcad | which is why the set up projects individually one at a time, ask who you are, etc |
| 19:51.35 | brlcad | every project they've added is manually added, takes david a couple hours per project of effort iirc |
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| 23:08.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29892 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged_dm.h: no need to define DEG2RAD and RAD2DEG |
| 23:17.54 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29893 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: enable maintainer mode for any type of checkout, not just cvs (i.e. subversion too) |
| 23:24.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29894 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/book/VolumeIV.xml: use bu_exit for the examples |
| 23:27.14 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29895 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/isst/ (master/ slave/): ignore the binary products |
| 23:39.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29896 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (41 files in 8 dirs): refactor to use bu_exit instead of bu_log+exit where applicable |
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| 01:16.36 | louipc | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/ |
| 01:16.49 | louipc | hah I was thrown off by the two brlcads |
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| 06:06.59 | curious | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minkowski_spacetime |
| 06:07.00 | curious | ;0 |
| 06:07.02 | curious | :) |
| 06:07.16 | curious | sometimes one spends shitload time reinventing wheel |
| 06:46.12 | louipc | curious: you lost me |
| 06:47.08 | curious | i admit it's messy, i can't find sth simple. |
| 06:47.21 | curious | or rather complete |
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| 07:42.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29897 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (Makefile.am pix-ci.c): remove the obsolete (irix-specific) pix-ci tool for preparing pix files for irix image processing tools |
| 07:47.06 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29898 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (Makefile.am pl-starbase.1 pl-starbase.c): also remove pl-starbase as it requires maintenance, custom headers, and hasn't been enabled (compilation-wise) in many years |
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| 13:57.54 | ``Erik | a/blah |
| 13:58.01 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29899 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: No longer need HAVE_RANDOM. |
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| 14:36.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29900 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/hideline.c: remove the UAH and redstone arsenal source address/phone number, cleanup header |
| 14:36.30 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29901 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pl-hpgl.1: remove source |
| 14:51.44 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29902 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ttcp.c: return instead of exit in main |
| 14:56.32 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29903 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: rtgeom uses/requires vmath and bu for typedef decls, so include them |
| 15:06.48 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29904 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (68 files in 12 dirs): extensive bu_exit refactoring with related cleanup on calls to exit and stderr, header cleanup along with way |
| 15:09.28 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29905 10/brlcad/trunk/ (138 files in 138 dirs): remove the .cvsignore files since they are no longer used. the ignore patterns are now svn:ignore properties on the directory and can be edited with propset/propedit. |
| 15:14.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29906 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (7 files): |
| 15:14.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: remove the various Ikonas writer utilities that have been disabled from |
| 15:14.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: compilation (now that they're all updated, ugh) since they require an |
| 15:14.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: unspecified header and need maintenance updates. until someone needs them again, |
| 15:14.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: they can stay stashed in the bowels of revision history. includes pix-filt-ik, |
| 15:14.19 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: pix-ik, pix-ikr, pix-lowp-ik, pixt-ik. |
| 15:20.58 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29907 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: pix-ci.c was removed too |
| 15:28.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29908 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (Makefile.am fix_polysolids.c): update fix_polysolids to the new API specs, massive reformat and cleanup, make it compile again. still needs more work so that it's not v4 specific and not just polysolids but any nmg/bot. |
| 15:29.51 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29909 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/: ignore fix_polysolids |
| 15:32.18 | ``Erik | I imagine this means that the svn conversion is omfg complete and we're rolling? |
| 15:34.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29910 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/tracker.sh: |
| 15:34.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: fix a bug where the page layout changed and the tracker type/name was no longer |
| 15:34.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: getting extracted correctly, also now extract the submitters description as part |
| 15:34.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: of a new COMMENT field in the output. take care to not save more than 1020 |
| 15:34.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: chars for now. |
| 15:38.16 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29911 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/ (Makefile.am news2tracker.sh): |
| 15:38.16 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: add a new script for generating the same style table as tracker.sh, but |
| 15:38.16 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: extracted from the NEWS file revision history. was written to work with svn |
| 15:38.16 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: commands, pulling the same data as it pertains to sf trackers using the commit |
| 15:38.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: history. cross references the annotate revisions per-line with the commit log |
| 15:38.19 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: messages for those lines, and uses the NEWS file's simple format as an |
| 15:38.21 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: assumption for extracting the title and assignees. |
| 15:40.05 | brlcad | yeah, seems to be properly omfg complete now |
| 15:41.06 | brlcad | have some interesting numbers on ohloh to sort out before declaring anything final, but looks good to me so far |
| 15:48.23 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29912 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: new tracker tool for NEWS items |
| 15:57.58 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 16:02.38 | yukonbob | "ohloh"? |
| 16:03.55 | brlcad | http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3996?p=BRL-CAD |
| 16:05.27 | brlcad | a pretty useful/interesting stats site |
| 16:05.43 | brlcad | our numbers are doubled right now because it includes both cvs and svn |
| 16:34.36 | ``Erik | ohno, ohloh! |
| 16:36.04 | ``Erik | neato, rt_dirbuild failure |
| 16:58.40 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29913 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (553 files in 42 dirs): |
| 16:58.40 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: delintify the ifndef linted RCSid $ variable blocks, i.e., remove them. they're |
| 16:58.40 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: not really useful any more, particularly with svn (or any modern scm for that |
| 16:58.40 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: matter), so we can make the compiler's job just a little bit easier. |
| 17:08.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29914 10/brlcad/trunk/ (401 files in 48 dirs): use consistent spacing around the common header inclusion using one and only blank line before and after. |
| 17:10.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29915 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (5 files in 5 dirs): more common.h consistency |
| 17:17.48 | ``Erik | does svn obey rcs flags? |
| 17:18.41 | Z80-Boy | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:23.45 | brlcad | rcs flags? |
| 17:27.54 | brlcad | it will expand most rcs variables if that's what you mean, whereas some others become properties |
| 17:28.46 | ``Erik | ok |
| 17:28.58 | alex_joni | Z80-Boy: irssi++ |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29916 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/htester.c: RCSid is actually used here |
| 17:50.43 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29917 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libpkg/pkg.c librtserver/rtserver.c): RCSid is actually used here |
| 18:04.44 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29918 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (103 files in 103 dirs): Minor cleanup. |
| 18:10.35 | *** part/#brlcad poolio (n=poolio@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:10.43 | *** join/#brlcad poolio (n=poolio@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:50.33 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-82-220.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:59.18 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29919 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpkg/pkg.c: for debug printing the version, use the (newish) pkg_version() instead |
| 19:00.46 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29920 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: |
| 19:00.46 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: similarly, have the service be provided the full version string (if the intent |
| 19:00.46 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: is to parse a date/time/version, there are other/better routines as rt_version() |
| 19:00.46 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: is the human-readable paragraph form, so might need changing) |
| 19:02.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29921 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/htester.c: meh, it's a noinst, just kill the (fairly useless) -v option. |
| 19:12.29 | ``Erik | well poo on you ptbtbtbt |
| 19:14.08 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:14.35 | brlcad | if there don't have to be 'exceptions', all the better :) |
| 19:35.06 | ``Erik | hummmm |
| 19:36.24 | ``Erik | brlcad, where shold I cram the point evaluation function for the mball prim for the s2 guys? it requires a little info from rtgeom.h, so I was thinking about packing it in there with the struct definition |
| 19:40.49 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29922 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Initial support for handling different evaluation methods. |
| 19:51.35 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29923 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: Prototype for point evaluation function. |
| 19:55.53 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29924 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/dg_obj.c: Mods affecting use of rt and rtcheck on Windows. |
| 19:59.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29925 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: uos not getting terminated properly. |
| 20:03.01 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29926 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libdm/dm-wgl.c: Tk_CreateWindowFromPath not properly initializing the TkWindow structure for toplevel windows. |
| 20:08.55 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29927 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/rtgeom.h src/librt/g_metaball.c): Add goo factor to metaball primitive (used in metaball and blob evaluation) |
| 20:14.02 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29928 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: Removed call to Sleep() from wgl_do_event(). This was causing a delay in wgl_close(). Uncomment/reactivate a few lines of code in wgl_open(). |
| 20:17.07 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29929 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/setup.c: Initialize dgop->dgo_rtCmdNotify. This function is called by librt when rt and nirt finish. |
| 20:18.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29930 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: Mods to get classic mode working on Windows. |
| 20:21.39 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29931 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Added dgo_rtCmndNotify member. |
| 20:57.10 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29932 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpkg/pkg.c: Minor mods for Windows. |
| 20:59.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29933 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/main.c: Mods for Windows (initialize sockets if using a framebuffer). |
| 21:03.48 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29934 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/isst/ (Makefile.am isst.h isst_struct.h slave/main.c slave/slave.c): remove vestigial headers |
| 21:04.00 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29935 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fb/ (7 files): Mods to initialize sockets. This is really for Windows (i.e. calls to pkg_init() do nothing unless on Windows). |
| 21:10.42 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29936 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/rise/ (master/Makefile.am slave/Makefile.am): forcibly disable RISE for now |
| 21:22.31 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29937 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (. main.c main.c slave.c slave.c): hoist the isst master/slave nodes up to adrt's toplevel |
| 21:23.32 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29938 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/master/ (17 files): hoist the isst master/slave nodes up to adrt's toplevel |
| 21:23.44 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29939 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: hoist the isst master/slave nodes up to adrt's toplevel |
| 21:24.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29940 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/isst/ (13 files in 4 dirs): hoist the isst master/slave nodes up to adrt's toplevel |
| 21:24.18 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29941 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (Makefile.am doc/ChangeLog): hoist the isst master/slave nodes up to adrt's toplevel |
| 21:42.29 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29942 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: Fix pre-processor mishap. |
| 21:44.57 | brlcad | whoosh |
| 21:47.41 | ``Erik | heh |
| 21:47.57 | ``Erik | bobs getting sick of me running down to his office whining about broken builds, I think |
| 21:50.38 | ``Erik | ooh, broken in tcl, neat |
| 22:01.26 | brlcad | mmm.. and now that I've taken so long to verify a mod, I get to deal with the conflicts |
| 22:04.38 | ``Erik | wait, what's this "verify"? :D *duck* |
| 22:05.11 | alex_joni | first verify *then* commit? |
| 22:05.17 | alex_joni | seems all backwards to me :P |
| 22:05.29 | brlcad | it's where my eyes bleed four a coupld hours reading a diff, knowing there will *still* be something missed :) |
| 22:05.42 | ``Erik | <-- been there, done that |
| 22:05.59 | alex_joni | brlcad: is it coloured at least? |
| 22:06.01 | ``Erik | every time I do sed coding, I go over the diffs before committing |
| 22:07.30 | brlcad | alex_joni: niet |
| 22:07.37 | alex_joni | brlcad: ouch |
| 22:07.54 | alex_joni | no wonder you get bleedy eyes |
| 22:09.26 | alex_joni | brlcad: I always prefer something like this: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/src/emc/task/emctask.cc.diff?r1=1.4;r2=1.3.6.1;f=h |
| 22:09.41 | alex_joni | (but of course.. emails are usually plain diff..) |
| 22:10.39 | ``Erik | some of us don't need crutches O:-) *duck* |
| 22:12.24 | brlcad | alex_joni: heh, my eyes would still be bleeding |
| 22:12.34 | brlcad | it's the quantity |
| 22:12.50 | ``Erik | ahhhh, interesting |
| 22:13.11 | ``Erik | brlcad, when looking for the included tclConfig.sh, it fails at configure time |
| 22:13.19 | ``Erik | as it only exists as tclConfig.sh.in |
| 22:13.19 | alex_joni | the one that marks *safe* things green, and potential problematic stuff red-ish |
| 22:13.20 | brlcad | only gets tiring because it's thousands (or tens of thousands) of lines |
| 22:13.20 | ``Erik | is that known? |
| 22:13.33 | brlcad | yeah, I noticed that a while ago |
| 22:13.56 | alex_joni | that's a replacement.. right? |
| 22:14.06 | ``Erik | it's a configure generated substitution dealie |
| 22:14.13 | alex_joni | there should be an installed tclConfig.sh |
| 22:14.16 | ``Erik | yes |
| 22:14.22 | brlcad | yeah, doesn't exist until configure .. yet you're supposed to use it in configure |
| 22:14.39 | brlcad | alex_joni: this is when building as a sub-configure |
| 22:14.44 | brlcad | not pre-install |
| 22:14.58 | alex_joni | brlcad: lost me.. but it doesn't really matter.. |
| 22:15.05 | alex_joni | good you grasp it :P |
| 22:15.07 | ``Erik | it's a chicken and egg problem |
| 22:15.17 | ``Erik | it needs to be used in the script that generates it |
| 22:15.35 | alex_joni | I used to search for tclConfig.sh a while ago, but I searched for the one installed by tcl |
| 22:15.36 | ``Erik | or a cyclic graph problem, if you wanna go there |
| 22:15.48 | alex_joni | ``Erik: I get what you're saying.. |
| 22:16.42 | *** join/#brlcad cad86 (n=caaa2a1a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 22:18.05 | ``Erik | so now --enable-all gives me "checking for Tcl configuration... configure: WARNING: Can't find Tcl configuration definitions", so I can't do a distcheck, so who knows how bad my directory moving broke stuff :D |
| 22:19.07 | brlcad | i think our configure can be reworked .. just hadn't got to that issue yet |
| 22:19.20 | brlcad | plain make dies here in it |
| 22:19.21 | brlcad | Making all in master |
| 22:19.21 | brlcad | make[3]: *** No rule to make target `all'. Stop. |
| 22:19.45 | brlcad | ahh |
| 22:19.46 | ``Erik | um, did you autoreconf and re-configure and everything? |
| 22:20.08 | ``Erik | adrt gets through a full build in both configurations for me, both fbsd and mac |
| 22:20.19 | brlcad | yeah, was out of sync with the new .am |
| 22:20.24 | ``Erik | I just wanted the distcheck ok on it |
| 22:20.55 | brlcad | the second time configure goes through, there should be a tclConfig.sh |
| 22:21.05 | ``Erik | hum |
| 22:21.11 | ``Erik | lame |
| 22:21.16 | ``Erik | but a workaround |
| 22:23.12 | brlcad | yup |
| 22:23.50 | ``Erik | ermmmm |
| 22:23.59 | ``Erik | it doesn't seem to genreate the file if it's not building tcl |
| 22:24.22 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29943 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: should use bu_strlcat/bu_strlcpy instad of strn?cat/strn?cpy |
| 22:24.39 | brlcad | yeah, have to --enable-tcl so it runs tcl's configure |
| 22:24.45 | brlcad | that's what generates the sh |
| 22:25.12 | ``Erik | fails with the same message |
| 22:25.13 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 22:25.14 | ``Erik | weird |
| 22:25.34 | ``Erik | wonder if it's because I build out of dir |
| 22:25.50 | ``Erik | anyways, time to lock up the building, hit the head and cruise home, night kids |
| 22:26.32 | brlcad | cheers |
| 22:29.23 | alex_joni | g'night |
| 23:00.48 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matt@74.86.45.130) | |
| 23:11.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29944 10/brlcad/trunk/ (619 files in 50 dirs): |
| 23:11.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: comma space ws consistency, include a space after commas in expressions (e.g., |
| 23:11.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: ', '). applied globally minus a few exceptions where the alignment was |
| 23:11.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: signficant to the formatting or on tables where it was used to indicate |
| 23:11.20 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: grouping. |
| 00:22.24 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29945 10/brlcad/trunk/ (204 files in 28 dirs): more ws comma consistency cleanup. remove the spaces before commas throughout. |
| 01:29.11 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:57.41 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:03.15 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:01.20 | ``Erik | whoa |
| 04:03.49 | ``Erik | http://www.macports.org/ports.php?by=name&substr=glpong |
| 04:17.11 | Axman6 | hmm? |
| 04:27.28 | Axman6 | ``Erik: if you're on a mac, check out http://trac.macosforge.org/projects/xquartz/wiki/X112.1.2 |
| 04:31.38 | ``Erik | axman: what I pasted was a program I wrote 6 years ago, a 1-day game |
| 04:31.51 | Axman6 | heh, awesome :P |
| 04:36.17 | brlcad | ``Erik: and points to a dead website w/ no maintainer :) |
| 04:36.20 | brlcad | you should fix it |
| 04:37.43 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 04:37.51 | ``Erik | I was poking at it |
| 04:38.06 | ``Erik | my tarballs seem broken for how macports wants to play with 'em |
| 04:38.07 | ``Erik | :/ |
| 04:40.11 | brlcad | should be nearly identical other than building on mac |
| 04:40.28 | brlcad | few macports I played with were the just copied over from ports |
| 04:40.47 | ``Erik | yeah... well, the most recent, for some reason, the mac is whining about missing depcomp |
| 04:42.36 | ``Erik | mebbe I'll push another release, the inclusion of openal in osX got me to update stuff in my cvs that hasn't been released |
| 04:52.14 | ``Erik | mmmm isla fisher |
| 04:53.12 | Axman6 | now that was an odd coincidence |
| 05:04.17 | ``Erik | ? |
| 05:07.09 | Axman6 | someone just mentioned that name in another chan on another network. like a minute before you did |
| 05:07.45 | ``Erik | hum |
| 05:07.55 | ``Erik | perhaps they were watching the same channel and saw the same commercial |
| 05:31.17 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1128543687.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 05:50.12 | brlcad | arf.. bob's commit messages are so devoid of information |
| 05:51.06 | brlcad | practically no indication of what's wrong or how his changes help |
| 05:56.01 | brlcad | heh, goo factor |
| 05:56.15 | brlcad | sticky balls |
| 05:56.29 | Axman6 | ... |
| 05:56.47 | brlcad | Axman6: hehe, a commit message to the metaball primitive |
| 05:56.49 | louipc | hot over there? |
| 05:56.55 | brlcad | has a new "goo" factor |
| 05:57.12 | Axman6 | excellent |
| 05:57.23 | brlcad | metaballs are always good for low brow humor |
| 05:57.30 | Axman6 | i'm sure smeone has a need for gooy balls |
| 05:58.26 | brlcad | hrm, don't seem to have a good screenie |
| 06:04.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29946 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: (log message trimmed) |
| 06:04.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: Bob fixed the extended rendering delays that users would see when ray-tracing on |
| 06:04.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: Windows. you could see via the log that the ray-trace would finish very quickly |
| 06:04.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: (nearly instantly sometimes) but then would stall for a minute or two before |
| 06:04.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: displaying the image to the framebuffer. the problem was actually a manual |
| 06:04.12 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: Sleep() call that was added a long time ago (heh) to the wgl framebuffer that |
| 06:04.14 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: made it interactively update the image while it rendered and made a completed |
| 06:16.19 | brlcad | army ants are awesome |
| 06:22.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29947 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: (log message trimmed) |
| 06:22.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: (reworded line) Bob fixed the extended rendering delays that users would see |
| 06:22.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: when ray-tracing on Windows. you could see via the log that the ray-trace would |
| 06:22.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: finish very quickly (nearly instantly sometimes) but then would stall for a |
| 06:22.52 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: minute or two before displaying the image to the framebuffer. the problem was |
| 06:22.54 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: actually a manual Sleep() call that was added a long time ago (heh) to the wgl |
| 06:22.56 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: framebuffer that made it interactively update the image while it rendered and |
| 07:13.32 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-82-220.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:14.14 | Axman6 | brlcad: how so? |
| 07:29.18 | curious | CIA-30, ah! well, lol, indeed, plainly clearing it took loads of time on pci based savage + dual cpu setup, lol |
| 07:30.08 | curious | it's a bot i assume ? :) |
| 07:44.08 | Axman6 | yah |
| 07:52.11 | brlcad | curious: yes, a commit reporter announcing changes to the source code |
| 07:52.52 | brlcad | (in real time) |
| 08:01.29 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 08:02.46 | Axman6 | brlcad: why makes army ants so awesome? |
| 08:12.51 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@210-9-143-190.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 08:21.43 | brlcad | mmmm.. that's a LONG discussion :) |
| 08:21.56 | brlcad | (for me at least) :) |
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| 14:01.05 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29948 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: It looks like the Windows specific call to Tcl_CreateChannelHandler() was accidentally removed. |
| 14:05.36 | ``Erik | hmmmm |
| 14:05.44 | ``Erik | svn ann NEWS | sort -nr | head -n 30 |
| 14:05.50 | ``Erik | neat |
| 15:51.01 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 16:26.21 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29949 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/attach.c: The indices for the MGED_DISPLAY_VAR were accidentally changed. This prevented MGED's status bar on the command window from being updated. |
| 16:33.29 | ``Erik | ho hum |
| 16:35.51 | ``Erik | hum, ho! hum! |
| 19:39.49 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29950 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/accel.tcl: Fixed bug in rcc-cap that shows up when using the 't' option. |
| 20:46.50 | ``Erik | *sigh* mac word doesn't seem to have a "mail merge", just a "data merge" with no mention of mail |
| 20:51.03 | brlcad | data merge should do it, ties to address book for e-mail mailers |
| 20:52.48 | brlcad | yeah, in the Merge Manager |
| 20:52.59 | brlcad | after you fill in all of the options, there's a "Merge to Mail" option |
| 20:53.45 | brlcad | sounds like it uses your entourage address book only for outgoing address(es) |
| 20:55.06 | brlcad | er, "Merge to E-Mail" specifically, under the Merge dropdown on the "Data Merge Manager" |
| 21:05.10 | ``Erik | too bad you can't change font size in ms's help crap :/ |
| 21:18.22 | ``Erik | the "filter" crap seems handy |
| 21:21.36 | ``Erik | I have a feeling it's trying to use mail.app :/ |
| 21:34.42 | ``Erik | hummmm |
| 21:36.27 | poolio | Macbook Air :] |
| 21:37.44 | ``Erik | it's pretty, but does that video chipset have the unf once would want? |
| 21:41.27 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-92-110.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:46.16 | poolio | ``Erik: I'm looking for an ultraportable to do coding and general computing schtuff. I have a desktop for the umph. My Asus just died so I'm seriously considering it...the price is a bit steep though. |
| 21:50.29 | ``Erik | any old cheap machine can work for coding O.o |
| 21:52.13 | poolio | I'm actually thinking of buying it for the sex appeal. |
| 21:56.05 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874E98.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:30.38 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, don't think I'm ever going Apple... not when the 4GB ram upgrade is $700 |
| 22:37.15 | poolio | Just buy 3rd party RAM |
| 22:37.55 | brlcad | yeah, just buy the memory elsewhere |
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| 22:38.46 | brlcad | the memory has always been a major premium .. we don't even buy it from apple for work most of the time |
| 22:39.02 | PrezKennedy | the 17" MacBook still ends up being almost $1500 more |
| 22:39.30 | brlcad | more than what? |
| 22:39.53 | PrezKennedy | my 17" Pavilion, which has more disk space and 4GB of RAM |
| 22:40.00 | brlcad | and is how big? |
| 22:40.19 | PrezKennedy | what is how big? |
| 22:40.29 | brlcad | size is a *major* factor in the price of laptops, every ounce reduction is a pretty major change in price |
| 22:40.35 | PrezKennedy | im comparing MacBook Pro to this |
| 22:40.43 | PrezKennedy | so about a pound |
| 22:40.48 | brlcad | the size of your pavillion vs mbp |
| 22:41.08 | brlcad | a pound difference? that's pretty big... |
| 22:41.24 | PrezKennedy | so is $1500! |
| 22:41.44 | brlcad | it might not be something you care about, but that's a major diff in price for any laptop maker |
| 22:41.56 | poolio | brlcad: any thoughts on the macbook air? |
| 22:42.21 | PrezKennedy | cmon, if theyre charging $700 for $80 RAM, you know they're nailing you elsewhere too |
| 22:42.22 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, I wish solid state hard drives still weren't so damn expensive :) |
| 22:42.43 | poolio | brlcad: I'm trying to find out if it is upgradeable. I preordered one :o |
| 22:43.10 | poolio | The mac fanboys are whining everywhere but I like it. They could have cut an inch off the width though... |
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| 22:43.55 | PrezKennedy | Doesn't come with a drive does it? |
| 22:44.14 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: compare the specs to a pavilion (or dell or vaio) that matches in size and components, I'd you'll find them within 10% at the base configurations |
| 22:44.51 | brlcad | poolio: I'd be surprised if it were upgradeable beyond you cracking it open for memory and HD upgrades |
| 22:45.28 | brlcad | and maybe not even that easily if it's using the ultra tiny drives that the ipods/iphones uses |
| 22:45.36 | poolio | brlcad: It doesn't have upgradeable memory, so I'm guessing the hd isn't :\ |
| 22:45.45 | poolio | And yes it is, 1.8" |
| 22:46.10 | brlcad | ah, then yeah.. you might find the drive if you hunt, but you might have to break a soldier lead to install it |
| 22:46.31 | brlcad | maybe a pin connector if you're lucky |
| 22:46.36 | poolio | The 80gb is 4200rpm, but I'm not going to shell out 1000 for a SSD. |
| 22:46.48 | brlcad | yeah, that's what I was saying |
| 22:46.54 | brlcad | the price of SSD's are just still expensive |
| 22:47.03 | poolio | brlcad: I probably wouldn't bother then. It seems like a machine that's prone to breaking and I'd definitely be getting applecare. Wouldn't want to void the warranty |
| 22:47.05 | brlcad | I mean, 1k for that drive is actually a pretty damn good deal |
| 22:47.13 | brlcad | that's the cheapest I've seen for that size |
| 22:47.21 | brlcad | newegg has one at around 1.5k |
| 22:47.22 | poolio | I guess, but the difference between 2k and 3k is a lot. |
| 22:47.55 | poolio | And they are going to have to drop in price in the very near future. I mean look at flash drives, 16mb ones use to be like $50 |
| 22:48.09 | brlcad | i'd suggest getting applecare no matter the product.. apple's support is pretty fantastic, one of the top-rated year over year |
| 22:48.23 | brlcad | yeah, but that's mb :) |
| 22:48.52 | brlcad | the gb ssd's will come down quickly .. probably in half within 8 months |
| 22:49.21 | brlcad | i see that laptop as a great mobile platform for when you already have a really powerful home system in place |
| 22:49.48 | brlcad | it's designed around access to other wireless services being around |
| 22:50.09 | brlcad | HD's, media/content, optical drives |
| 22:56.27 | PrezKennedy | Windows is stupid |
| 22:56.53 | ``Erik | it has a lot of ancient "single machine just to drive a printer" still left in it |
| 22:57.49 | ``Erik | later, kids |
| 23:04.54 | poolio | hrmph. The footprint compared with the pro is pretty lame. If only they'd gone with a thin bezel... |
| 23:12.12 | brlcad | footprint of? |
| 23:14.32 | poolio | the macbook air |
| 23:14.47 | poolio | http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2008/01/aircomp02.jpg |
| 23:20.23 | brlcad | definitely stylish |
| 23:20.51 | brlcad | makes the MBP look kinda plain .. remember it used to be the sexy beast when it came out |
| 23:21.42 | brlcad | hum, nice trackpad |
| 23:28.57 | poolio | I mean there are a ton of pros and cons. One USB port is pretty ridiculous. And because the superdrive has special something or other, you can't plug it into a USB hub. So you can't superdrive+other devices. |
| 23:39.17 | louipc | lol everyone's talking about the macbook air |
| 23:41.52 | poolio | Well, it's what I've been waiting 2 months for.. |
| 23:48.14 | brlcad | :) |
| 23:51.08 | brlcad | the apple tv actually is slightly more interesting to me now with the upgrade, one more way to stick it to comcast .. the pricepoint is so close |
| 23:51.59 | poolio | people are saying the air is going the way of the apple tv / cube :) |
| 23:52.03 | brlcad | though the new rental fees are a bit absurd (about as absurd as their non-hd movie prices) |
| 00:20.43 | brlcad | apple tv is a bit before it's time .. most folks don't have their video collections digital yet or an easy means to get them that way |
| 00:42.22 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 02:16.10 | brlcad | so the ohloh stats seem to match within reason |
| 02:16.32 | brlcad | there are discrepancies in the way SVN and CVS repositories are managed/tracked |
| 02:17.15 | brlcad | the biggest probably being that ohloh considers property changes as code changes, which increased our overall stats a couple percent |
| 02:17.39 | brlcad | looks like they properly find our bsd files now though, that's nice |
| 02:17.52 | brlcad | can't imagine why that failed with CVS, but it's working now |
| 02:18.57 | brlcad | ohloh is also better at collapsing CVS commits into one atomic commit transaction than cvs2svn, which accounts for about 1039 additional commits |
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| 04:39.17 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 04:39.18 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 04:58.15 | Twingy | neat |
| 06:29.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29951 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: (log message trimmed) |
| 06:29.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: new example footer using c-file-style so that the style is encouraged more |
| 06:29.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: strictly. setting the c-file-style effectly causes a c-set-style to get invoked |
| 06:29.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: for that buffer, with the predefined 'stroustrup' style most closely matching |
| 06:29.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: our convention (it's basically 'k&r' with 4-char indents), this fixes the |
| 06:29.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: braindead default 'gnu' style emacs uses that indents the c-offsets-alist |
| 06:29.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: substatement-open style parameter a level (i.e., open brace curlies are indented |
| 06:35.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29952 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/footer.sh: add a c-file-style to the C files and remove their corresponding c-basic-offset lines. can't override the c-basic-offset if using a style, not that we want/need to with stroustrup since it matches our offset |
| 06:38.37 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29953 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: (log message trimmed) |
| 06:38.37 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: include the list of remaining mged tasks for this release and the next, |
| 06:38.37 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: including the questions and comments mentioned at the last arl/brl-cad |
| 06:38.37 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: configuration control board meeting. immediate tasks include fixing mged i/o on |
| 06:38.38 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: puts/gets; text flooding; disabling mged auto-backgrounding; and fixing |
| 06:38.40 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: tclConfig.sh problems. next are verifying/testing pix-fb -p, clone mirroring, |
| 06:38.42 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: dbconcat with a prefix, and pushing primitives. longer term is windows smp |
| 06:41.01 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29954 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: change the ordering so the c-file-style is last |
| 07:07.08 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@217-162-111-134.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:07.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29955 10/brlcad/trunk/ (1302 files in 68 dirs): |
| 07:07.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: set a c-file-style globally in the local variables footer, setting it to the |
| 07:07.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: built-in 'stroustrup' style. that style is basically the 'k&r' style with |
| 07:07.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 4-char indents (otherwise emacs' 'k&r' style has 5-char indents), which matches |
| 07:07.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: our convention. you can't specify c-basic-offset when you used c-file-style |
| 07:07.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: apparently (at least as of emacs 21.2.1) but conveniently the 'stroustrup' style |
| 07:07.15 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: matches so we don't have to care. |
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| 10:32.30 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: how did they model the Cern od Hubble Telescope when if I model Ronja, it becomes unusably slow? |
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| 13:52.49 | ``Erik | "unusuably slow"? |
| 14:04.39 | Z80-Boy | Yeah |
| 14:04.45 | Z80-Boy | A redraw in mged takes 30 seconds or so |
| 14:05.57 | ``Erik | on ronja? O.o wow, are you using a 386 or something? :D |
| 14:06.11 | ``Erik | I've seen it take 30 seconds on a redraw, but that was on a bot with literally millions of triangles |
| 14:09.40 | Z80-Boy | No Pentium M 1.5GHz and 0.5GiB RAM |
| 14:10.44 | Z80-Boy | ronja.twibright.com/3d/comparison.g |
| 14:10.49 | Z80-Boy | and type "B comparison" |
| 14:11.48 | Z80-Boy | In multipane mode |
| 14:12.35 | Z80-Boy | And t's running on *LOCAL* X of course |
| 14:29.46 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29956 10/brlcad/trunk/src/liborle/rle.c: cleanup and restructure, apply style, remove decls |
| 14:30.09 | ``Erik | brlcad, jlo is trying ot get a hold of you |
| 14:30.36 | brlcad | k |
| 14:36.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29957 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: |
| 14:36.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: only look for the tclConfig.sh and tkConfig.sh files if we're not building tcl |
| 14:36.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: or tk and need to load the config, otherwise having TCL_BIN_DIR set isn't too |
| 14:36.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: useful (the --with/--without flags are still available). this should fix the |
| 14:36.09 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: configure exit being encountered on some systems when a system tcl/tk isn't |
| 14:36.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: already installed (i.e., the WARNING: Can't find Tcl configuration definitions |
| 14:36.13 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 'error') |
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| 15:52.12 | brlcad | ahh |
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| 15:59.18 | tarzeau | Z80-Boy: hey pitchotron has a broken download link |
| 15:59.35 | tarzeau | oh wait it works now |
| 16:05.59 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@84.135.108.220) | |
| 16:15.24 | poolio | Hmm |
| 16:15.43 | poolio | Anyone know a 5 byte long string seperated by '.' would be? Like an IP but one more, and it's not IPv5 hah |
| 16:30.45 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
| 17:01.19 | alex_joni | poolio: how many bytes in each term? only one? |
| 17:04.53 | poolio | yeah |
| 17:05.00 | poolio | I think I've got it now, GPS coordinates in a bizarre format :P |
| 17:05.06 | alex_joni | heh |
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| 17:18.29 | alex_joni | poolio: now you had me read the wikipedia GPS article :) |
| 17:20.05 | alex_joni | I had no idea they adapt the clocks in the GPS satellites based on Einsteins theory of relativity |
| 18:13.33 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-80-144.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:25.48 | ``Erik | so, uh, gps time is relative? O.o |
| 18:25.58 | ``Erik | </badpun> |
| 18:26.17 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29958 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/isst/observer/: you have to delete the directories too when they're empty with svn since they're tracked entities (you can svn rm an entire subdir as one-operation) |
| 18:26.43 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29959 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: remove the src/adrt/isst/observer/Makefile entry since the dir is empty/gone |
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| 20:53.46 | brlcad | ah, sgi cube script updated and renders now |
| 21:03.24 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29960 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am sgi.sh): |
| 21:03.24 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: add an example of creating geometry using basic shell scripting. the example |
| 21:03.24 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: shows several ways for passing modeling commands to mged, creates the .g |
| 21:03.25 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: geometry file, sets material properties, and renders the model to an image. |
| 21:03.25 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: don't install it, just an example. |
| 21:05.39 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29961 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: Hack to get "puts" working on Windows. Still need to look at this on the other platforms. |
| 21:07.43 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29962 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (dm-X.c dm-ogl.c dm-tk.c dm-wgl.c): if_name not getting properly terminated (i.e. not eos) |
| 21:19.01 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29963 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/sgi.sh: keep a png |
| 21:39.11 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29964 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Improve text display routines to provide more informative render method information as well as "good" when needed. Add functions to translate between a numeric method ID and a human readable string. Minor format cleanup. |
| 21:46.48 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r29965 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Wrapper for multiple normal methods added. Isopotential normals fixed with the help of Ed. |
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| 21:57.54 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29966 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/sgi.sh: match the cube rendering more closely lining up the center better, adding a little bit of perspective, and using a tube radius that better approximates. keep the png as sgi.png.. |
| 23:00.19 | brlcad | argh, I went to upload a big image and it warned that it was big, so I scaled it down and uploaded it. Now it says "No higher resolution available" on the small one.. |
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| 00:34.53 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/wiki/SGI_Cube |
| 00:40.12 | archivist | hmm on my screen black cat in a coal hole |
| 00:40.58 | brlcad | what is? |
| 00:41.30 | brlcad | the whole page, just the image? |
| 00:41.48 | brlcad | that png should have gamma correction |
| 00:42.16 | archivist | the image, |
| 00:43.02 | louipc | nice |
| 00:57.22 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29967 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/sgi.sh: add the same comments that were used for the wiki page so that it better explains all steps being taken |
| 02:34.54 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r29968 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/g_diff.c: fixed two bugs. One was incorrect use of strcmp. Second was not counting some differences found. Fixes bug #1865987 |
| 02:50.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r29969 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD.in: |
| 02:50.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: Install script actually shouldn't be in sources. |
| 02:50.08 | CIA-30 | BRL-CAD: No need to specify source tarball since the build scripts are included in the dist. |
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| 05:25.04 | brlcad | woot |
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| 14:11.02 | b0ef | do you need proe to convert proe files in brlcad? |
| 15:41.18 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: On the wiki? If so I'll tweak some settings to make images with a large file size (that is less than the PHP limit) upload without a warning and maybe you could install ImageMagick which I can then enable in MediaWiki and has better performance than GD? |
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| 18:38.32 | brlcad | b0ef: yes, you do -- we have a pro/e plugin that you run from within pro/e |
| 18:39.01 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 18:39.34 | brlcad | otherwise we'd have to link against granite and that's no fun |
| 18:39.52 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 18:41.06 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: imagemagick is already installed though gd's been fine so far too |
| 18:41.44 | brlcad | the warning was anything over 150kb i believe .. I'd probably up that to 1mb |
| 18:42.10 | brlcad | not too unreasonable for a CAD site to host images/screenshots/renderings that large |
| 18:42.24 | brlcad | just crazy to use them that big embedded in pages :) |
| 18:43.17 | b0ef | brlcad: right, the problem I have is that the openmoko team, which designs a cell phone, is releasing their files on the cell phone case, which are done in proe; what format do you think we should request from them? |
| 18:43.36 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-86-122.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:43.43 | brlcad | don't know if I mentioned it, but I noticed that IE6 is looking great on the header now .. except for the menu. you can't see the text -- flashes up and then is either behind the green or not displayed |
| 18:44.10 | brlcad | the menu links are still there and active, so I think the green is just in front of the text somehow |
| 18:44.33 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: BRL-CAD has some facility to calculate a movement of a 4-wheeled vehicle |
| 18:44.56 | Z80-Boy | Is it possible to use it to calculate a movement of a straight riding skateboard over a deformed terrain? |
| 18:45.06 | brlcad | b0ef: I'd say the original pro/e files as well as an iges, step, dxf, and stl export :) |
| 18:45.55 | b0ef | brlcad: why all of them?, and is DXF able to hold all the data? |
| 18:46.39 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: yeah, but it's really hard to use frankly .. some of the animation tools (that may or may not still work, written 15 years ago) will calculation movements and interpolate along specified paths, or interpolate between positions |
| 18:46.53 | brlcad | dxf and stl wouldn't be faithful |
| 18:47.13 | Z80-Boy | I'm just trying to figure out The Central Theorem of Skateboarding |
| 18:47.35 | Z80-Boy | Seems like the forward/backward error signal is actually the angular acceleration of the skateboard |
| 18:47.57 | Z80-Boy | one source of this is when the curvature changes |
| 18:48.17 | Z80-Boy | then assuming the speed doesn't change, the rate of turn (angular speed also changes) |
| 18:48.39 | b0ef | someone else to help?; is iges able to hold all the proe info and does brlcad import iges well? |
| 18:49.00 | Z80-Boy | Another is when you are riding uphill/downhill and the pavement is curved, then the skateboard is experiencing a slowdown/speedup from gravity and that translates into an angular acceleration |
| 18:52.28 | Z80-Boy | Should be possible to shape a halfpipe so that at a certain speed, these two effects would completely cancel out... |
| 19:01.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29973 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/brep_stub.c: add trailing newline |
| 19:02.41 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29974 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: turn brep stuff back on |
| 19:05.27 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 19:35.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29975 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/brep_simple.cpp: clarify the maybe comment .. and get rid of the conditional brep_simple.g creation -- always create the .g file |
| 19:55.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29976 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/brep_simple.cpp: make sure we could make the twisted cube before calling mk_brep |
| 20:46.57 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Upload warning size increased, sorry about the problems with the corners not being fixed (I know it is the last thing left) - I've been trying various solutions, but the bugs are still very odd and I've only been able to fins a fix for the bottom right corners of the sidebar blocks so far. I'll continue to look into it however. |
| 20:47.02 | MinuteElectron | *find |
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| 21:26.57 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/frame.png <---- framebuffer active :) |
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| 22:52.06 | brlcad | b0ef: iges is usually pretty faithful and preserving.. but it's also a generalized container format in which you can store a variety of representations |
| 22:52.23 | brlcad | that's why I mentioned just having them provide several conversions |
| 22:52.32 | brlcad | so you can see what works best |
| 22:53.59 | brlcad | there is an iges-g that you can try out, it has like three or four different formats it supports, one being nurbs, another being general 3D brep, another being tessellated solids, iirc |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29977 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: Closing a file descriptor after an fclose breaks on windows. |
| 23:18.56 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:21.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r29978 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: Make the default editor for windows wordpad. When writing out the primitives on windows use crlf. Lastly, on windows change the return value to 1 in editit(). |
| 23:24.21 | brlcad | starseeker: having fun tomorrow, eh? :) |
| 23:32.02 | starseeker | brlcad: Hehe |
| 23:32.17 | starseeker | brlcad: Trying to fill out the #@$@ paperwork for the security form |
| 23:36.33 | brlcad | gathered as much |
| 23:36.45 | brlcad | not many events in life make you go dig up ones life history |
| 23:50.12 | starseeker | Having to contact people I haven't talked with in years... |
| 23:56.51 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 00:19.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r29979 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: ted on an arb now displays the expected vertices |
| 00:20.06 | brlcad | john rocks |
| 00:31.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r29980 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_arb.c: added some minimal comments to rt_arb_get_cgtype |
| 00:49.30 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r29981 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: oops, sorry Bob, I stomped on one of your changes |
| 01:05.22 | starseeker | brlcad? |
| 01:10.26 | brlcad | hm? |
| 01:17.39 | starseeker | When should I be at QRI tomorrow? |
| 03:21.59 | louipc | what would that be for? |
| 03:25.23 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29982 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (72 files in 19 dirs): set svn:executable on all scripts (particularly so ./autogen.sh will work on checkout) |
| 03:55.39 | starseeker | louipc: A new form of uselessly and pointlessly expensive computer case |
| 03:56.03 | louipc | nice |
| 03:56.42 | starseeker | I can see it now - a new PC being marketed as the "Stealth Bomber" gaming pc |
| 03:58.51 | poolio | Ooo. Macbook Air + stealth technology = manilla envelope |
| 03:59.29 | louipc | hahaa |
| 03:59.42 | starseeker | Heh - there was speculation on slashdot as to what markup Apple would be charging for THIS form of black... |
| 04:00.55 | starseeker | Any excuse to bulk produce nanotubes sounds good to me - the sooner they figure out how to do miles long coherent crystals of them the sooner we can take an elevator ride into space ;-) |
| 04:30.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29983 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: CVS is no more, update the docs for SVN |
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| 05:32.57 | openartist | I'm having issues installing brl-cad on os x, after install nothing appears in the applications folder, is there someone who can help me trouble shoot? |
| 05:39.42 | brlcad | hello openartist |
| 05:39.54 | openartist | hi |
| 05:39.57 | brlcad | BRL-CAD installs into /usr/brlcad |
| 05:40.07 | brlcad | it's a suite of tools, not a single app, so there's nothing in the apps dir |
| 05:40.32 | openartist | ah |
| 05:40.40 | brlcad | there are a couple gui apps that we could put into the apps dir, but it's not really worth it until we properly decouple from x11 |
| 05:41.31 | brlcad | the easiest way to get started is to run x11 (in your apps/utilities folder) and in the xterm window run /usr/brlcad/bin/mged -f |
| 05:41.41 | openartist | i don't know why though I don't find anything in any directory |
| 05:41.55 | brlcad | because /usr is a 'hidden' directory to Finder |
| 05:42.04 | openartist | ah |
| 05:42.05 | openartist | got it |
| 05:42.07 | brlcad | you can't get to it through the finder, only on the command line by default |
| 05:42.22 | brlcad | unless you "unhide" /usr (which I wouldn't recommend unless you know linux/unix) |
| 05:42.26 | openartist | thanks, I feel like a total noob |
| 05:43.15 | brlcad | no problem |
| 05:43.34 | brlcad | there are a ton more apps that may be of interest, and a lot of docs and tutorials on the website |
| 05:43.42 | brlcad | including lots of mged docs |
| 05:43.50 | openartist | i don't know if I just overlooked something but it would be helpful if that was made explicit somewhere for mac users |
| 05:44.09 | brlcad | it's explicit in the installer :) |
| 05:44.17 | openartist | oh really? |
| 05:44.24 | openartist | i didn't see it |
| 05:44.26 | brlcad | yeah.. big bold letters :) |
| 05:44.32 | openartist | ilol |
| 05:44.49 | openartist | well I guess I just lost all credibility |
| 05:45.06 | brlcad | nah, everyone gets used to ignoring those readme statements |
| 05:45.38 | openartist | isn't that true |
| 05:45.49 | brlcad | the fix really is to decouple from X11 and let users drag-and-drop the install to whereever you want, but we're not there yet |
| 05:45.50 | openartist | so I have the xterm open |
| 05:46.02 | PrezKennedy | i got used to the README being pretty much useless for most apps |
| 05:46.07 | openartist | what's the command to run an application? |
| 05:46.42 | openartist | yeah, sometimes I would write something else instead of readme knowing that would be sure to get it ignored |
| 05:46.54 | brlcad | /usr/brlcad/bin/mged -f |
| 05:47.24 | brlcad | if you want to see an example, you could run: /usr/brlcad/bin/mged -f /usr/brlcad/share/brlcad/7.10.4/db/havoc.g |
| 05:48.42 | brlcad | then in mged, run the Tools -> Geometry Browser, double-click havoc |
| 05:49.08 | brlcad | File -> Raytrace Control Panel -> Raytrace to render the view |
| 05:49.43 | brlcad | you won't get very far exploring without going through the tutorial series.. it's pretty much *necessary* |
| 05:50.28 | openartist | <trying> |
| 05:50.54 | openartist | so I see a blue screen |
| 05:50.58 | openartist | going to tools |
| 05:51.16 | openartist | clicking on havoc open up a folder |
| 05:52.38 | openartist | okay |
| 05:52.59 | openartist | do you use brl regularly? |
| 05:53.04 | openartist | professionally? |
| 05:57.13 | brlcad | yes |
| 05:57.49 | brlcad | there's a whole team of people that do in the US Govt |
| 05:58.16 | brlcad | and teams throughout industry |
| 05:59.03 | PrezKennedy | any in the construction industry? |
| 05:59.32 | brlcad | there was a construction company down in florida that was using brl-cad to design houses |
| 06:09.04 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29984 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Bob implemented support for MGED classic mode on Windows, adding a hack that goes through tcl i/o routines (i.e. doesn't use the same read/write calls as elsewhere) |
| 06:18.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29985 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Bob fixed a bug in mged's rcc-cap command where using the 't' option didn't work due to curlie braces that wrapped a tcl var going to vadd2. removed the curlies and it now works. |
| 06:29.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29986 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: erik improved the metaball rendering with the addition of a blobbyness/gooeyness factor that can be set. also added improved text display routines. |
| 06:29.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29987 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: erik and ed fixed a bug in the calculation of normals for metaballs |
| 06:35.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29988 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 06:35.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: John fixed a bug in g_diff where differences between objects were getting missed |
| 06:35.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: due to the command not keeping track of the count of differences that had |
| 06:35.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: accummulated up to that point. there was also an incorrect strcmp call that had |
| 06:35.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the wrong truth value getting tested. this fixes a bug reported by David Loman |
| 06:35.26 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: ([ 1865987 ] g_diff fails to see BoT Orientation change) |
| 06:45.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29989 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 06:45.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: bob improved the mged ted command on windows, making the files being written out |
| 06:45.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: actually use windows line terminators so they don't wrap around as one line. he |
| 06:45.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: also made wordpad the default editor instead of notepad (user can still |
| 06:45.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: override) -- this responds to requests for functional text edit support on |
| 06:45.28 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: windows from several bnd modelers |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29990 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: John Anderson improved the way the ted command in mged deals with ARBs that are |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: less than ARB8s (e.g. an ARB6) .. instead of duplicating the points and |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: requiring users to edit the duplications, only present them with the # points |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: for their ARB#. this fixes a bug report submitted by karel/clock3 where there |
| 06:51.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: was unexpected behavior that the edits where intenional and that the user had to |
| 06:52.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: edit the duplicates ([ 1842596 ] ted on arbn6 doesn't change vertices) |
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| 12:52.03 | b0ef | brlcad: right, I'll request IGES-G, then, but am I able to extract what I need in brlcad? |
| 12:52.35 | b0ef | brlcad: along with the original proe, of course |
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| 16:20.15 | poolio | brlcad: unrelated to brlcad question :) on mbo, when I resize my local terminal, the console gets all garbled. Any idea? |
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| 19:28.43 | prasad_ | http://www.beyond3d.com/content/articles/94/1 |
| 19:45.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29991 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/brep.cpp: |
| 19:45.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: need a copy of the users brep here because wdb_export will free the brep when |
| 19:45.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: it's done with it. mk_brep doesn't need to claim the brep, so we can let |
| 19:45.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: callers keep using that brep with mods for future mk_brep() calls (with a |
| 19:45.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: different name) |
| 19:47.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29992 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (brep_cube.cpp brep_simple.cpp): |
| 19:47.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the two lines aren't needed, and the edge orientations do seem to make sense so |
| 19:47.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: remove the XXX ???'s. since mk_brep changed, we need to delete the brep |
| 19:47.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: ourselves (which is good because we had to new it in the first place) |
| 19:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29993 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_brep.cpp: |
| 19:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: provide an initial implementation of the describe command that uses the ON |
| 19:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Dump() call for describing arbitrary breps consistently. ... so nice to be able |
| 19:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: to use mid-scope decls.. *sigh*. also remove the m_object_table count debug |
| 19:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: statement. |
| 19:51.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29994 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am breplicator.cpp): add a new breplicator proc-db test app for creating a variety of brep geometry. not yet complete but it will make a brep with some points in it, saving out to a .g file. next step, create a variety of arbs. |
| 20:00.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29995 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_nurb.c: call it a NURBS solid |
| 20:01.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29996 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_brep.cpp: give the initial describe line a more informative label of BREP object. |
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| 21:40.04 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 21:41.25 | illethal | Good day |
| 21:47.15 | illethal | So are all of you math-whizes? |
| 21:47.54 | yukonbob | no :) |
| 21:48.16 | illethal | Don't you have to be one to use BRL-CAD? |
| 21:48.21 | yukonbob | (depending on definition of "whiz") |
| 21:49.04 | yukonbob | illethal: if you've got a good imagination (ie: can imagine CSG concepts) and some basic math skills you can make stuff... |
| 21:49.29 | illethal | Good. |
| 21:49.43 | yukonbob | of course, the more resources you (personally) bring to the table, the more interesting your work can be... |
| 21:49.44 | illethal | 'Cause I suck at math =P |
| 21:49.54 | yukonbob | illethal: are you a programmer? |
| 21:50.01 | illethal | Nope. |
| 21:50.06 | illethal | I'm more or less an artist. |
| 21:50.40 | yukonbob | digital or "analogue"? |
| 21:50.46 | illethal | Both |
| 21:50.47 | illethal | Haha |
| 21:51.15 | illethal | 3D, music, 2D graphic design, sculpting and all that other crap =P |
| 21:52.24 | yukonbob | ah -- /me remembers -- you've been hanging out here for a while -- you should just jump in a try it out ;) |
| 21:52.43 | illethal | Yeah I was playing with archer not too long ago. |
| 21:52.50 | illethal | Can't really do nothing but make cones and cubes. |
| 21:53.04 | illethal | http://micah.noobgrinder.com/3d/deathplow.jpg |
| 21:53.10 | illethal | This is what I'm working on in Maya as of the moment |
| 21:53.36 | yukonbob | though part (a lot) of the strength of brlcad is it's analysis tools -- assuming you're more interested in "just" getting images to screen, you might also want to check out POVRay |
| 21:53.55 | illethal | Oh yeah |
| 21:54.00 | illethal | POVRay was the first 3D prog I've ever used. |
| 21:54.09 | illethal | Never made anything with it. |
| 21:54.11 | illethal | But it was free =P |
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| 23:25.47 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29997 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_brep.cpp: remove the first line (ON_Brep:) of the description |
| 23:27.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29998 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/breplicator.cpp: create vertices, curves, and edges for the test cube |
| 23:28.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r29999 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/breplicator.cpp: use SMALL_FASTF instead of VDIVIDE_TOL |
| 23:43.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30000 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 5 dirs): more cleanup, referencing, and checking for subversion dirs where it used to check for cvs |
| 23:43.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30001 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_brep.h: fix typo, s/trin/trim/ |
| 23:44.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30002 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: dist-hook is probably busted for finding files not added to the dist, need to update for svn so leave a FIXME comment for now. |
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| 04:39.26 | iraytrace | Anybody know if svn can be used without a server? What kind of URL is used for the repository in such an instance? |
| 04:39.39 | iraytrace | Um. make the "remote repository" |
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| 20:57.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30003 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: change the IND_ routines to END_ for endian, even thou twas a funny joke |
| 21:05.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30004 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/convert.c: change indian to endian |
| 21:20.24 | yukonbob | heh |
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| 23:53.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30005 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: comment that bu_exit is intended to replace most printing statements that are merely followed by an exit() |
| 23:53.42 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30006 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (26 files in 8 dirs): bu_bomb cleanup |
| 00:12.30 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30007 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: bu_bomb's in the front ends seem to be all properly converted to bu_exit |
| 00:16.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30008 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: tclConfig.sh problems should be gone now that it doesn't try to locate those files until it thinks we're not building tcl |
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| 06:20.25 | yukonbob | you gettting a new job starseeker? |
| 06:21.51 | starseeker | Yep |
| 06:22.45 | starseeker | Headed up Baltimore way |
| 06:23.57 | yukonbob | neato -- what's the gig? |
| 06:24.05 | yukonbob | (and where you moving from?) |
| 06:50.45 | starseeker | Moving from Chesapeake VA |
| 06:51.02 | starseeker | working with our own brlcad, actually |
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| 13:19.41 | starseeker | this is it... |
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| 17:09.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30009 10/brlcad/trunk/ (965 files in 66 dirs): more ws consistency cleanup with spaces after commas and K&R style consistency distinguishing language constructs (for|while|if|switch) from functions with a space. |
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| 01:21.55 | illethal | Hello. |
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| 02:05.28 | louipc | hi |
| 02:05.47 | illethal | figured out the problem, all is well now |
| 02:06.53 | louipc | cool |
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| 03:43.58 | illethal | Hello |
| 04:10.11 | poolio | alloo |
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| 13:10.23 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 15:52.42 | MinuteElectron | The cache table in drupal has become corrupted, most likley due to a full disk, reapiring table. |
| 15:53.53 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: thanks ... I've got problems on several sites because of that.. *sigh* |
| 15:54.11 | brlcad | that was a pretty bad/long time for it to fill up |
| 15:54.26 | MinuteElectron | yeah, too bad |
| 15:55.38 | MinuteElectron | Table, repaied - should there be any further errors tell me and I'll look into them. |
| 15:57.08 | brlcad | thanks MinuteElectron |
| 15:57.15 | brlcad | ~MinuteElectron++ |
| 15:57.19 | MinuteElectron | :P |
| 15:57.38 | brlcad | really, thanks |
| 15:57.43 | brlcad | my blood pressure is still high |
| 15:57.43 | alex_joni | does he overflow if we do that too often? |
| 15:57.45 | MinuteElectron | no problem |
| 15:57.47 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron++ |
| 15:57.56 | brlcad | have to prefix it with a ~ |
| 15:58.00 | alex_joni | ~MinuteElectron++ |
| 15:58.02 | brlcad | so it gets ibot's attention |
| 15:58.09 | brlcad | ~karma MinuteElectron |
| 15:58.09 | ibot | minuteelectron has karma of 5 |
| 15:58.21 | alex_joni | ~karma brlcad |
| 15:58.21 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 15:58.25 | alex_joni | oh-oh :) |
| 15:58.25 | MinuteElectron | wow, thanks guys :P |
| 15:58.40 | MinuteElectron | I'm going to restart my computer because I just installed some tools for IE6 development so I can hopefully fix the corner problem. |
| 15:58.40 | brlcad | yeah, it's not really useful for me, but can be fun :) |
| 15:58.56 | alex_joni | brlcad: do you remember off-hand what bot it is? |
| 15:58.57 | brlcad | alex_joni: my karma is hard-coded/fixed :) |
| 15:59.02 | brlcad | ~ibot |
| 15:59.02 | ibot | it has been said that ibot is a blootbot written in perl run by TimRiker on his server. logs on http://ibot.rikers.org/<chan>/ , ibot, jbot, apt are all the same process. It uses sqlite, but mysql or other SQL storage is also supported. |
| 15:59.21 | alex_joni | ~brlcad++ |
| 15:59.24 | alex_joni | ~karma brlcad |
| 15:59.24 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 15:59.27 | alex_joni | darn |
| 16:00.26 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:00.48 | brlcad | tim hard-coded it to 1 just for fun/spite |
| 16:05.57 | alex_joni | so what does it usually do? except karma :) |
| 16:07.27 | brlcad | you mean in general? |
| 16:08.02 | alex_joni | yeah |
| 16:08.02 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: "The MySQL error was: Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/tmp/mysql.sock' (2)." |
| 16:08.03 | brlcad | ibot serves a lot of useful purposes, the biggest of which is probably it's extensive factoid database (utterly massive compared to most) |
| 16:08.04 | ibot | brlcad: what are you talking about? |
| 16:08.10 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: yeah, I'm working on it |
| 16:08.16 | MinuteElectron | ok, thanks |
| 16:09.11 | brlcad | back up |
| 16:09.19 | MinuteElectron | thanks |
| 16:09.20 | brlcad | i'd stop'd it |
| 16:09.37 | brlcad | i've got several corrupted sites to deal with atm |
| 16:10.20 | MinuteElectron | ahh, ok |
| 16:22.15 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:22.19 | brlcad | apache just reset |
| 16:22.38 | brlcad | the sites that still can't get to mysql lock up apache, and after about 20 or so lockups, apache restarts |
| 16:23.18 | MinuteElectron | ahh, that is unfourtunate - I'll do some other work while the instabilities are fixed and go back to this in a few minutes. |
| 16:23.27 | brlcad | so you'll probably get a "connection lost" or other random error once every few minutes .. but should work if you just retry |
| 16:23.34 | brlcad | i'll let you know when it should be good |
| 16:23.49 | MinuteElectron | ok, thank you |
| 16:58.11 | yukonbob | ~karma yukonbob |
| 16:58.11 | ibot | yukonbob has karma of 1 |
| 17:00.07 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: all better now |
| 17:00.16 | brlcad | ~yukonbob++ |
| 17:00.18 | brlcad | howdy |
| 17:01.10 | yukonbob | goodmorning brlcad :) |
| 17:02.40 | brlcad | not a good one, but morning to you too! :) |
| 17:03.01 | yukonbob | :P -- it's alright for me so far... |
| 17:03.07 | brlcad | yeah, hopefully to do great things :) |
| 17:03.23 | yukonbob | mathy stuff? |
| 17:03.25 | brlcad | it was alright for me too.. until I checked my e-mail and logs |
| 17:03.40 | yukonbob | shit->fan? |
| 17:03.42 | sunbleach | brlcad: what about me? |
| 17:03.48 | brlcad | the server's disks filled up last night .. so all went to hell while I was sleeping |
| 17:03.53 | yukonbob | :P |
| 17:04.29 | brlcad | mostly due to brl-cad's massive cvs2svn dumpfile and cvsroot backups that were still in place |
| 17:04.51 | brlcad | but took down mysql and httpd services for most sites on the box |
| 17:05.08 | brlcad | corrupted several mysql db's that had to be repaired |
| 17:05.10 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: cool |
| 17:05.24 | yukonbob | ah -- do those dumpfile/backups need to stay online for review or reference? |
| 17:05.38 | brlcad | i'd left them "just in case" I needed to run it one more time |
| 17:05.55 | yukonbob | ~mysql-- |
| 17:05.56 | brlcad | and yeah, I was still using them too |
| 17:06.13 | yukonbob | ~karma mysql |
| 17:06.13 | ibot | mysql has karma of -1 |
| 17:06.14 | brlcad | working with the cvs2svn devs to look into some of the things that went wrong |
| 17:06.36 | yukonbob | nice |
| 17:06.41 | brlcad | already figured one of our problems out.. they changed the behavior of the auto-props file |
| 17:06.51 | brlcad | that's what caused the bad juju on the svn:executable |
| 17:07.03 | yukonbob | re: binary encoding and +x |
| 17:07.04 | yukonbob | ? |
| 17:07.13 | brlcad | not binary encoding, but the +x |
| 17:07.17 | brlcad | yes |
| 17:07.39 | yukonbob | Opensource works, David. Opensource works, David. |
| 17:07.40 | brlcad | binary coding was the mime-type, already fixed that (that was my/apache's fault) |
| 17:08.05 | brlcad | but the exec bit was my/cvs2svn's fault |
| 17:09.16 | brlcad | they changed the behavior of the auto-props file -- if svn sees svn:executable in your auto-props.. it means make sure that file type is +x .. but cvs2svn folks changed it to mean exactly the opposite because they needed a way to forcibly unset +x |
| 17:09.46 | brlcad | I suggested seeing !svn:executable would probably be better than changing from svn's behavior |
| 17:10.18 | sunbleach | brlcad: any work for me there? |
| 17:10.51 | yukonbob | seems to have been _lots_ of cruft-cleaning and repairs done in development over last while -- is there a sched for next release? |
| 17:11.30 | sunbleach | brlcad: I wonder if you got my ":( |
| 17:11.34 | sunbleach | " smiley on the query |
| 17:11.41 | sunbleach | Because onb freenode the queries sometimes don't work |
| 17:12.40 | yukonbob | sunbleach: re: your animation -- do you have pubished notes or a blog, etc. re: the process you took to make it? |
| 17:13.03 | sunbleach | yukonbob: no but it's compiled through a makefile |
| 17:13.10 | sunbleach | so if you read the makefiles you see how it's made |
| 17:13.11 | yukonbob | smart |
| 17:13.28 | sunbleach | I think full-feature movies should also be done with a makefile |
| 17:13.47 | sunbleach | So if at the end they wouldn't like the main character they would just replace the actor and type "make" |
| 17:13.51 | sunbleach | And go for a coffee. |
| 17:13.56 | brlcad | sunbleach: I got your :( and hopefully you got my response |
| 17:14.15 | yukonbob | *it's just so much nicer typing "make" than remembering _any_ number of incatations... |
| 17:14.32 | brlcad | you should/could write up the animation how-to on the wiki |
| 17:14.44 | yukonbob | ^--- ++ |
| 17:14.55 | sunbleach | But it's a dumb animation |
| 17:15.05 | sunbleach | a shell script countsm from 0 to 359 and calls rt with different azimuth |
| 17:17.44 | MinuteElectron | The corners problems with the sidebar have been fixed on the Drupal, but not MediaWiki (yet, just need to port some of the code over). |
| 17:18.16 | brlcad | sunbleach: doesn't matter what the animation is, it's having *simple* instructions and steps for creating an animation |
| 17:18.31 | sunbleach | Oh |
| 17:18.53 | brlcad | like how I wrote up instructions for making the sgi cube |
| 17:18.54 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/wiki/SGI_Cube |
| 17:18.59 | sunbleach | How to create a simple animation from BRL-CAD with a complicated custom-written shell script ;-) |
| 17:19.13 | brlcad | it's not that it was hard at all for me, took just a few min .. but there are details in there that hardly anyone knows about |
| 17:19.22 | brlcad | and it's a nice simple tutorial on scripting with brl-cad |
| 17:19.39 | yukonbob | sunbleach: ;) -- we'll wikify it into simplicity |
| 17:19.46 | brlcad | simplify it, reduce the steps to the essential |
| 17:20.50 | sunbleach | looks complicated to me ;-) |
| 17:20.55 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 17:21.05 | sunbleach | magical mged scripting commands |
| 17:21.11 | sunbleach | but at least I could look them up in the man |
| 17:22.23 | brlcad | most everything I used is considered really *old school* brl-cad |
| 17:22.44 | sunbleach | It's the only really useful stuff |
| 17:22.46 | brlcad | they're basics that most all modelers know with maybe the exception of the cook-torrence shader I used |
| 17:23.32 | brlcad | otherwise 2/3rds of it is the procedural scripting that generates the cube |
| 17:23.49 | sunbleach | Here is the script for the animations with matte channel http://ronja.twibright.com/utils/rt_script |
| 17:24.34 | brlcad | that is nice and short |
| 17:24.43 | sunbleach | Actually not |
| 17:24.50 | sunbleach | It mattes the colours and edges together |
| 17:24.55 | sunbleach | The result is matted once more |
| 17:25.55 | sunbleach | But the C program is nonportable |
| 17:26.08 | sunbleach | assumes that the double zero is all zeroes on the architecture |
| 17:26.14 | sunbleach | Which I don't know if it's guaranteed |
| 17:26.22 | sunbleach | Can be some weird architecture where double zero is not all zeroes |
| 17:26.34 | sunbleach | Or what if the thing produces negative zero? No guarantee either |
| 17:26.44 | brlcad | "double zero"? |
| 17:26.50 | sunbleach | brlcad: is there a guarantee that rt never produces negative zeroes if the pixel hits infinity |
| 17:26.55 | sunbleach | zero in the double precision |
| 17:27.39 | sunbleach | Here is the program that makes the background http://ronja.twibright.com/utils/double_mask.c |
| 17:27.50 | brlcad | where do you write out doubles? |
| 17:28.12 | sunbleach | I read them in |
| 17:28.24 | sunbleach | In the "network" format that the rt produces |
| 17:28.34 | sunbleach | Which is the root cause of the pain in the ass |
| 17:28.52 | brlcad | i'm not seeing where you tell that to rt though? |
| 17:28.55 | sunbleach | What happens in double if I compare negative zero with positive zero? |
| 17:28.59 | sunbleach | Do I get equality or not? |
| 17:29.25 | brlcad | your rtopts are bgcolor size and ambient light |
| 17:30.55 | sunbleach | Oh that script was for stills |
| 17:31.00 | sunbleach | This one is for animation: http://ronja.twibright.com/utils/render_animation |
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| 17:31.30 | sunbleach | fixed_root=`echo "$1" | sed -e 's/\\//\\\\\\//g;s/\\./\\\\./g'` && |
| 17:31.52 | brlcad | as for +0 == -0 I believe most implementations will consider them equal though I don't think C/C++ have anything to say about it |
| 17:31.56 | brlcad | implementation defined |
| 17:32.10 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 17:32.37 | sunbleach | What I would prefer would be one byte telling if the pixel is model or infinity. |
| 17:33.01 | sunbleach | Floating point numbers turn a digital computer into an analogue one |
| 17:33.24 | sunbleach | Like the code printf("%ld",a); printf("%ld",a); printed two different numbers for me |
| 17:33.40 | sunbleach | So if I load a zero and then compare it it can already be something slightly different |
| 17:33.48 | sunbleach | Because IEEE guarantees nothing |
| 17:34.44 | sunbleach | And btw I think the rt should generate +Inf and not zero |
| 17:35.23 | brlcad | mm, that it could do with -d1 |
| 17:35.35 | brlcad | just not without it obviously |
| 17:36.11 | brlcad | that's what that default/reserved 0/0/1 is for in a way |
| 17:36.15 | brlcad | for non-doubles |
| 17:36.26 | sunbleach | But that's in-band signalling and that's bad |
| 17:36.37 | sunbleach | It corrupts the picture |
| 17:36.53 | sunbleach | If your model hits the right colour it cannot be expressed and a deviated colour has to be emitted |
| 17:37.05 | sunbleach | -> error signal is intentionally mixed in -> crap |
| 17:37.09 | brlcad | sure |
| 17:37.16 | brlcad | but then you only have three channels |
| 17:37.22 | brlcad | 24 bits of data |
| 17:37.33 | brlcad | so what do you do, without increasing the number of bits |
| 17:37.41 | sunbleach | you cannot do it |
| 17:37.41 | brlcad | in practice, its not a problem |
| 17:37.46 | sunbleach | The channel is already occupied |
| 17:38.00 | brlcad | exactly, so it does the best it can without changing the requirements |
| 17:38.04 | sunbleach | in a Microsoft-style practice |
| 17:38.30 | sunbleach | it's a kludge. A scotchtape solution. |
| 17:38.47 | brlcad | actually, it was rather carefully designed that way |
| 17:39.07 | sunbleach | By who? |
| 17:39.15 | sunbleach | It's bad style |
| 17:39.18 | brlcad | as you said it yourself, you cannot do it otherwise without increasing the number of bits |
| 17:39.27 | brlcad | you obviously don't like it, that's your right :) |
| 17:40.04 | sunbleach | It's like this http://www.getreligion.org/wp-content/photos/60324190_1678a0a1d8_o.jpg |
| 17:40.11 | brlcad | but the tradeoff would be no background distinction by default, or another output channel (which was pretty darn impossible back when it was implemented) |
| 17:40.15 | sunbleach | Yeah I obviously don't like it :) |
| 17:43.37 | brlcad | what I'd really like is a full alpha transparency channel |
| 17:43.54 | brlcad | that's really what's needed, then all background could be properly represented |
| 17:44.16 | sunbleach | yes |
| 17:44.18 | brlcad | couldn't do that 15 years ago, and still can't with some hardware, but just about everything can handle it these days |
| 17:44.24 | sunbleach | but wouldn't express the hit distance of course |
| 17:45.51 | sunbleach | If you use more rays per pixel it could generate intermediate alpha values |
| 17:45.58 | brlcad | -d already does that |
| 17:46.17 | brlcad | just needs the tweak for a miss |
| 17:46.30 | brlcad | you should fix it :) |
| 17:46.34 | sunbleach | But doesn't it break the paralellism? |
| 17:46.57 | sunbleach | I could screw it up and think I've fixed it if I had time ;-) |
| 17:46.57 | brlcad | huh? |
| 17:47.43 | brlcad | yeah, with an alpha channel and -H hypersampling turned on, you could get beautiful antialiased alpha values on the edges |
| 17:47.46 | sunbleach | can't different rays of the same pixel get scheduled to different CPUs or so? |
| 17:48.01 | brlcad | hypersampling already does that |
| 17:48.18 | brlcad | i was talking about fixing -d to recognize a miss and have it report +Inf |
| 17:48.32 | brlcad | that should be pretty simple |
| 17:48.34 | sunbleach | but maybe the code somewhere secretly assumes only the first 3 bytes are added |
| 17:48.55 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 17:49.14 | brlcad | first 3 bytes .. added .. hm? |
| 17:49.24 | sunbleach | or averaged |
| 17:49.31 | brlcad | speculation either way, but the -d code just reports the hit-dist |
| 17:49.36 | brlcad | probably just reports 0 for miss |
| 17:49.43 | sunbleach | what does -d report with antialiasing? |
| 17:49.45 | brlcad | it knows when it's a miss |
| 17:49.46 | sunbleach | Average distance? |
| 17:50.00 | sunbleach | and on the edge? |
| 17:50.27 | brlcad | actually I don't know what -d does if you try to use it with hypersample turned on |
| 17:51.33 | MinuteElectron | Ok, all stylistic bugs fixed. |
| 17:51.42 | brlcad | hypersample as it is doesn't do antialiasing, just averages the rays that do hit if the first ray hits iirc |
| 17:51.58 | brlcad | something that could be improved either way, I've never liked -H without supersampling |
| 17:52.15 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: seriously?! |
| 17:52.17 | brlcad | awesome! |
| 17:52.21 | sunbleach | When I did hypersamnpling I did it myself |
| 17:52.41 | sunbleach | Because I doubt rt takes gamma into account when averaging the samples |
| 17:52.50 | brlcad | that usually gives better results.. jack up the -s by 4/8x and downsample |
| 17:53.29 | brlcad | that way it can take neighbors into account instead of operating on a per-cell basis |
| 17:53.47 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Well, on the face of it - yes. The pages with forms on could do with some clean up\design, but I'm concerned about this taking months (I've literally been working on this since July) so that can probably come later, once it's moved over - LDAP, at least, is more important.. |
| 17:54.47 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: quite true, you've put massive (great) efforts into this -- very much appreciated if I've not said it enough :) |
| 17:54.56 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: what was the ie6 problem? |
| 17:55.17 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: It's my pleasure, I wouldn't be doing this unless I enjoyed it ;) |
| 17:55.23 | brlcad | :) |
| 17:55.34 | MinuteElectron | The IE6 problem was just rounded corners and the blue box in the middle of the front page. |
| 17:55.40 | MinuteElectron | Both of which are fixed now. |
| 17:55.51 | sunbleach | rounded corners are in today, especially combined with white |
| 17:57.19 | MinuteElectron | Once we do get the site live and have spruced up the forms a bit I'll be concentrating on commenting my code, it is now getting very complex and difficult to maintain. |
| 17:58.16 | MinuteElectron | And, of course, anyone else who may need to edit the code will need commentes too (not that I plan to leave any time soon). |
| 17:59.26 | brlcad | i mean what was the problem with the rounded corners on ie6? |
| 17:59.29 | brlcad | what was the fix? |
| 17:59.36 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: getting familiar with Babs? |
| 18:00.09 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: they were all missaligned significantly, to fix it i had to add a variety of margin and width hacks in the ie6 only css file. |
| 18:00.57 | MinuteElectron | yukonbob: babs? |
| 18:00.58 | brlcad | ahh |
| 18:01.10 | brlcad | so ie6 has it's own set of hacks :) |
| 18:01.21 | brlcad | guess you did have to do that for the header anyways :) |
| 18:01.37 | MinuteElectron | Yeah, lots of ie hacks. |
| 18:01.40 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: so many references to Barbara Jenson in the ldap docs I've read over the years ;) |
| 18:02.01 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: But they are all in nice labelled ie only css files so it is easy to maintain ;) |
| 18:02.10 | MinuteElectron | yukonbob: I'm still reading the opening paragraph. :P |
| 18:02.48 | MinuteElectron | Also I'll be expanding support for the theme into other browsers hopefully once everything else is done, at least the big 5 all work perfectly. |
| 18:04.47 | MinuteElectron | yukonbob: haha, indeed |
| 18:10.09 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: I believe I've got the first edition of this book: http://tinyurl.com/2s8832 -- which is a good (and necessary, imo) high-level view of LDAP |
| 18:10.30 | MinuteElectron | cool, i'll have a look shortly |
| 18:10.30 | brlcad | yukonbob: how're those others working out? |
| 18:11.16 | yukonbob | heh -- arrived just after I left south, and I'm only _just_ getting ready to head back ;) |
| 18:12.32 | brlcad | ahh, dumbasses |
| 18:12.38 | brlcad | they were supposed to ship separate |
| 18:13.01 | brlcad | they did say they would send two shipments, so they lied! |
| 18:15.21 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 18:40.36 | MinuteElectron | >:C |
| 18:41.55 | brlcad | so is it using skin or skin2? |
| 18:42.07 | MinuteElectron | skin2 |
| 18:42.33 | MinuteElectron | 1) I made a mistake in the IE6 fixes so need to fix some more code, 2) LDAP is weird. |
| 18:44.04 | brlcad | it looks like it's trying ldap now |
| 18:45.02 | brlcad | but is failing to fall-back to the previously existing accounts too |
| 18:45.20 | MinuteElectron | yeah |
| 18:45.27 | MinuteElectron | well, i can't test that |
| 18:45.32 | MinuteElectron | unless i make a new account |
| 18:45.34 | MinuteElectron | well i will |
| 18:45.43 | MinuteElectron | in a while |
| 18:45.54 | brlcad | i'll stop asking questions so you can eat :) |
| 18:46.05 | sunbleach | see u later |
| 18:46.08 | MinuteElectron | lol :P |
| 18:46.12 | MinuteElectron | thxs |
| 18:46.19 | brlcad | mm eating is a good idea |
| 18:46.22 | brlcad | i haven't either |
| 18:47.23 | brlcad | yay, my ReliaMed 700 shipped today |
| 18:53.45 | brlcad | the new skin is considerably cleaner.. |
| 18:53.49 | brlcad | nice work |
| 18:54.51 | bpoole | sorry bout the overflow craziness brlcad |
| 19:01.55 | brlcad | bpoole: not your fault afaik :) |
| 19:04.12 | brlcad | mine for leaving cad's cvs2svn files around, not finishing the server migration faster, and not watching the system more carefully last night :) |
| 19:05.01 | MinuteElectron | ... |
| 19:06.01 | brlcad | minor nit |
| 19:06.20 | MinuteElectron | hmm, ok |
| 19:06.21 | brlcad | so that background rendering overlaps underneath the left-header instead of over it |
| 19:06.34 | brlcad | just swapped their order in the page.tpl |
| 19:07.05 | MinuteElectron | looks good |
| 19:07.06 | MinuteElectron | (Y) |
| 19:07.19 | brlcad | and (re)fixed the clear="all" you had on the br's |
| 19:07.37 | MinuteElectron | cool |
| 19:07.38 | brlcad | but instead of a clear style, added a clear:both; to the footer |
| 19:09.35 | brlcad | hm, http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fmy.brlcad.org%2Fwiki%2F&charset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=Inline&ss=1&outline=1&group=0&verbose=1&st=1 |
| 19:10.48 | MinuteElectron | I'll take a look later, I have to go out do something now. |
| 19:10.52 | brlcad | i think it's a typo |
| 19:10.57 | brlcad | looks too |
| 19:11.30 | brlcad | yeah, found it |
| 19:11.46 | brlcad | cool, validates |
| 19:14.43 | brlcad | FYI, there is scheduled maintenance at the server's ISP on Thursday january 24th at 00:00AM EDT for at most 6 hours at their atlanta hub that may affect connectivity (maybe not) |
| 19:19.55 | PrezKennedy | who hosts your server brlcad? |
| 19:30.44 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-92-109.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:34.25 | Z80-Boy | re |
| 21:02.54 | MinuteElectron | eh? |
| 21:02.58 | MinuteElectron | What is the problem... |
| 21:03.41 | brlcad | oh snap, I think I just found it |
| 21:03.47 | MinuteElectron | :S |
| 21:06.36 | brlcad | it doesn't draw the bottom bezel if there's no width defined |
| 21:06.48 | brlcad | but then if you define a width, it's no longer properly auto-expanding |
| 21:07.02 | MinuteElectron | Which bezel are you talking about? |
| 21:07.35 | brlcad | the bottom rounding on the search boxes and the top menu |
| 21:07.57 | brlcad | the top search box was working, the bottom wasn't -- the difference was top had a width: |
| 21:08.20 | brlcad | but, like I said, if/when you define the width, you lose the resizing |
| 21:09.15 | MinuteElectron | The bottom search box looks to be working here, what browser are you using? |
| 21:09.22 | brlcad | ie7 |
| 21:09.40 | brlcad | look from one of the wiki pages -- drupal caches |
| 21:10.05 | brlcad | it works fine on the 'good' browsers |
| 21:10.51 | brlcad | i wonder if it's collapsing them because they have nothing in them.. |
| 21:11.01 | MinuteElectron | probably |
| 21:11.45 | poolio | brlcad: random question about using bz.bzflag.bz when you have time to respond :) Whenever I resize my local terminal window it messes up the characters and I have character artifacts all over the terminal. If I resize it back to where it was before and refresh the screen it's ok, but not at any other size. |
| 21:14.15 | brlcad | poolio: there aren't termcap resize events set up, so you have to log in at the size you want |
| 21:14.33 | brlcad | could be fixed, but never been enough of an annoyance to me (and screen doesn't care) |
| 21:14.47 | brlcad | you can notify a screen resize with ctrl-a F |
| 21:16.35 | poolio | ah, thanks :] |
| 21:22.38 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 21:25.33 | brlcad | hm, well it doesn't seem to be because there is nothing in them |
| 21:34.57 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: There is a similar problem on the top-right bevel. |
| 21:39.47 | brlcad | you mean the menu? |
| 21:39.57 | brlcad | i just got both search boxes working |
| 21:40.11 | brlcad | using a div similar to what you did for the right panel boxes |
| 21:41.55 | MinuteElectron | ah, gdgd |
| 21:41.58 | MinuteElectron | and yes, the menu |
| 21:43.00 | brlcad | yay, works |
| 21:43.10 | brlcad | same hack on the menu worked |
| 21:43.18 | brlcad | that work in ie6? |
| 21:43.31 | MinuteElectron | ahh, congrats. |
| 21:43.32 | brlcad | i recall it had the same rendering problem, but don't have it on this machine to test |
| 21:43.35 | MinuteElectron | IE6 was already fixed. |
| 21:43.45 | brlcad | okay, cool |
| 21:44.09 | MinuteElectron | wait, which file did you just edit to fix IE7? |
| 21:45.03 | brlcad | fix wasn't ie7 specific |
| 21:45.11 | brlcad | edited the page.tpl and style.css |
| 21:45.26 | MinuteElectron | Well, the fix broke IE6, not sure about the other browsers. |
| 21:45.27 | brlcad | to add a new sboxfooter |
| 21:45.36 | brlcad | huh |
| 21:46.11 | MinuteElectron | the main navigation base is now misalighed in IE6. |
| 21:46.26 | brlcad | what abou tnow? |
| 21:46.30 | brlcad | er, now |
| 21:46.41 | MinuteElectron | ahh, better |
| 21:46.48 | brlcad | hrm |
| 21:58.45 | brlcad | i'm running out if ideas |
| 21:59.03 | brlcad | whatever exactly you did on the left panels works right? |
| 21:59.26 | brlcad | i thought I was basically doing the same, but the position:absolute; seems to be what's borking ie6 |
| 22:05.45 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: how about now? |
| 22:06.00 | brlcad | I just made the div ie-7 specific for now |
| 22:08.03 | MinuteElectron | it's prefect |
| 22:17.44 | MinuteElectron | goodnight |
| 22:31.51 | brlcad | goodnight |
| 22:55.42 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:30.25 | PrezKennedy | hey Twingy |
| 01:13.56 | brlcad | yeah, hilarity :P |
| 01:13.58 | brlcad | :) |
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| 01:49.54 | Twingy | hello PrezKennedy |
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| 03:18.48 | starseeker | Wooo - hoooo! |
| 04:02.05 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:45.52 | brlcad | heh, looks like starseeker got his net set up quick |
| 05:11.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30010 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: check for strlcat/strlcpy for the guts of bu_strlcat/bu_strlcpy |
| 05:13.10 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30011 10/brlcad/trunk/include/db.h: include bu.h, self-contain |
| 05:13.47 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30012 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rttherm/viewtherm.c: header doc cleanup |
| 05:15.07 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30013 10/brlcad/trunk/src/canon/canon.h: need bu.h |
| 05:16.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30014 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g5-g4.c: avoid the strncpy but keep it obvious that we're replacing 'plastic' with 'phong ' |
| 05:17.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30015 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/comgeom/3d.h: remove duplicate defines already provided by db.h for NAMESIZE/NAMEMOVE, cleanup header |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30016 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/iges/ (8 files): |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: consistently treat NAMESIZE as C strings of sizeof NAMESIZE+1 for the null (so |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the max names are 16) .. only db.h uses buffers instead of C-strings (for |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: backwards compat with struct sizes). use new bu_strlcpy to properly copy and |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: null-terminate safely. |
| 05:23.38 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30017 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dbupgrade.c: replace the strncpy with explicit setting when replacing 'plastic' with 'phong ' |
| 05:24.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30018 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/track.c: |
| 05:24.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: consistently treat NAMESIZE as C strings of sizeof NAMESIZE+1 for the null (so |
| 05:24.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the max names are 16) .. only db.h uses buffers instead of C-strings (for |
| 05:24.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: backwards compat with struct sizes). use new bu_strlcpy to properly copy and |
| 05:24.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: null-terminate safely. |
| 05:24.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30019 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/objdir.h: only set NAMESIZE if we need to |
| 05:27.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30020 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/concat.c: |
| 05:27.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: consistently treat NAMESIZE as C strings of sizeof NAMESIZE+1 for the null (so |
| 05:27.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the max names are 16) .. only db.h uses buffers instead of C-strings (for |
| 05:27.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: backwards compat with struct sizes). use new bu_strlcpy to properly copy and |
| 05:27.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: null-terminate safely. |
| 05:28.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30021 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/burst.h: only define NSIG if we need to |
| 05:28.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30022 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/Mm.h: use libbu memory management and string processing |
| 05:30.27 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 06:09.07 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30023 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libcommon/canim.c: ws |
| 06:17.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30024 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/patch/patch-g.h: consistently use NAMESIZE+1 for non-db.h struct strings (intentionally treating as strings instead of buffers) |
| 06:18.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30025 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g4-g5.c: avoid the strncpy but keep it obvious that we're replacing 'plastic' with 'phong ' |
| 06:48.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30026 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vdeck/vproc.c: wow, still k&r .. update to ansi, use libbu more (untested) |
| 06:51.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30027 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vdeck/vdeck.c: tricky/risky/untested string changes to use bu_strlcpy, but do it anyways since they seem safe enough (given use and surrounding code) and there are no strcat's involved. |
| 06:52.26 | yukonbob | nn brlcad |
| 06:52.33 | yukonbob | ~brlcad++ |
| 06:57.02 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@217-162-111-207.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:00.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30028 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/nmg_class.c: meh |
| 07:14.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30029 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ttcp.c: meh |
| 07:21.38 | Z80-Boy | ' |
| 07:25.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30030 10/brlcad/trunk/ (159 files in 37 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 07:25.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: sweeping string management changes to help ensure more secure/consistent null |
| 07:25.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: termination and bounds checking. use bu_strlcpy/bu_strlcat where appropriate |
| 07:25.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: passing the size of the buffer (expected to be a NULL-terminated C-string) |
| 07:25.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: instead of calling strcat/strncat/strcpy/strncpy. this lets us get rid of most |
| 07:25.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: of the sanity/manual null-terminations. also update to use sizeof instead of |
| 07:25.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: hard-coded constants where useful. hopefully not too many/any bugs getting |
| 07:36.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30031 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: oops, typo -- line not count |
| 07:39.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30032 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/fence.c: quell warnings |
| 07:49.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30033 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/orle.h src/liborle/rle.c): |
| 07:49.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: decouple liborle from libfb (and in turn from libbu) by having it provide its |
| 07:49.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: own RLEpixel and RLEColorMap types as well as defining RED/GRN/BLU if needed. |
| 07:49.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: this should fix compilation woes being seen on some platforms (e.g. debian) |
| 07:49.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: under certain configurations -- particular an error related to not finding tcl.h |
| 07:49.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: (from bu.h from fb.h). |
| 07:53.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30034 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/librender/Makefile.am: need tcl flags (bu.h inclusion) |
| 07:54.39 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30035 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/Makefile.am: need tcl flags, opl |
| 07:55.50 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30036 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/Makefile.am: need tcl flags |
| 07:59.04 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30037 10/brlcad/trunk/include/orle.h: need COPYRGB defined too |
| 08:00.55 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30038 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/Makefile.am: include the tcl cppflags via fb.h |
| 08:04.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30039 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (7 files): |
| 08:04.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: more conversion over to the new bu_strlcpy/bu_strlcat routines for more |
| 08:04.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: consistent null-termination and bounds checking. (vls and parse are still not |
| 08:04.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: modified as some of their callers seem to be buffers instead of C-strings) |
| 08:06.20 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
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| 08:13.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30040 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/fchmod.c): |
| 08:13.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: refactor the bu_fchmod interface to only take a FILE * instead of the filename |
| 08:13.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: as that has the same security vulnerability as calling chmod() does. remove the |
| 08:13.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: chmod() call in the implementation as that was just done for Windows where |
| 08:13.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: fchmod() or a secure equivalent doesn't seem to be available. instead, punt by |
| 08:13.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: doing what cygwin does. just ignore the request and pretend it failed. might |
| 08:13.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: want to pretend it succeeded, but good as anything for now. |
| 08:19.50 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30041 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/do.c: need string.h for the ansi funcs (for memset), quell warning |
| 08:25.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30042 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/reshoot.c: need string.h for the ansi funcs (for memset), quell warning |
| 08:27.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30043 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (fb/fb-pix.c fb/fb-png.c mged/rtif.c): |
| 08:27.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: bah, second mistake almost in a row... almost completely forgot to update the |
| 08:27.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: callers to bu_fchmod to remove the filename parameter (!). time to call it a |
| 08:27.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: night before I start making other stupid mistakes at this late hour. |
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| 14:04.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30044 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libdm/dm-wgl.c: When creating a toplevel window make sure it's not iconified. |
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| 14:21.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30045 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/utility1.c: Close FILE * before calling editit. |
| 14:24.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30046 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mater.c: Close FILE * before calling editit. |
| 14:24.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30047 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgmodel.c: Close FILE * before calling editit. |
| 14:28.28 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30048 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/red.c: Check return value from bu_temp_file(). Close FILE * before calling editit. |
| 14:36.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30049 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: Minor formatting. |
| 14:54.56 | docelic | New website looks nice |
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| 16:12.47 | *** join/#brlcad poolio (n=poolio@bz.bzflag.bz) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 17:51.10 | ``Erik | dang, that razor mouse is zippy |
| 18:30.23 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30050 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/display.c: Need to include bu.h for the bu_strlcpy() macro. |
| 19:04.24 | ``Erik | had to turn down the track speed, heh :) but it's a nice enough mouse |
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| 20:13.00 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 20:13.00 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
| 20:20.56 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 20:20.56 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 21:51.54 | *** join/#brlcad cyapp (n=CYapp@85.muba.balt.washdctt.dsl.att.net) | |
| 21:52.13 | cyapp | Howdy gang! |
| 21:53.24 | brlcad | howdy cyapp :) |
| 21:59.45 | cyapp | Guess I should use my real name now :-) |
| 22:01.12 | ``Erik | didja find them? |
| 22:01.47 | cyapp | which? |
| 22:04.57 | poolio | congrats cyapp :] |
| 22:04.57 | ``Erik | huh, a rainbow |
| 22:08.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30051 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): make goo value per metaball control point |
| 22:20.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30052 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vas4/vas_io.c: Use termios tab expansion name instaed of sgtty if possible (fbsd pr ports/119096). |
| 22:57.14 | *** part/#brlcad starseeker (n=CYapp@85.muba.balt.washdctt.dsl.att.net) | |
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| 03:39.32 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30053 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (tcl/unix/ tk/unix/): ignore the stub libs |
| 03:40.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30054 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/: ignore breplicator |
| 03:42.38 | brlcad | cause afaik, vas4 is dead .. as soon as it requires maintenance, it'll probably be time to remove it |
| 03:45.59 | ``Erik | I think it was a compiler issue |
| 03:46.20 | ``Erik | I wante dto talk to you about retiring it on my way out, but you were on the phone |
| 03:47.57 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 03:48.04 | yukonbob | hello, starseeker |
| 03:48.09 | starseeker | Howdy |
| 03:48.24 | starseeker | how goes it? |
| 03:48.30 | yukonbob | not bad -- yourself? |
| 03:48.42 | starseeker | Tired :-). I'm about done with moving... |
| 03:48.46 | yukonbob | :) |
| 03:48.47 | starseeker | or it's about done with me... |
| 03:48.58 | yukonbob | What are you going to be working on when you start? |
| 03:49.01 | ``Erik | lewis black is pretty funny in his new special |
| 03:49.13 | ``Erik | yukon: fetching coffee and such |
| 03:49.17 | ``Erik | :D |
| 03:49.18 | starseeker | lol |
| 03:49.19 | yukonbob | hehehe |
| 03:49.45 | ``Erik | it'll take at least a week to get a computer account all lined up and permitted |
| 03:50.04 | starseeker | Yeah, basic stuff to start. Right at the moment I'm just doing alot of paperwork |
| 03:50.23 | ``Erik | lots of paperwork |
| 03:50.47 | ``Erik | uh, sf86, interims, aup, etc |
| 03:50.49 | yukonbob | ~karma starseeker |
| 03:50.49 | ibot | starseeker has karma of 2 |
| 03:50.56 | yukonbob | ~karma yukonbob |
| 03:50.56 | ibot | yukonbob has karma of 2 |
| 03:51.06 | ``Erik | no, the only reason I have an arl purchased coffee cup is cuz I stole it |
| 03:51.16 | starseeker | Ah :-). |
| 03:51.16 | ``Erik | from the director O.o |
| 03:51.48 | ``Erik | slad director, I stole one of pauls "slad" cups |
| 03:51.49 | ``Erik | :) |
| 03:51.50 | yukonbob | I _was_ going to say maybe when I reach starseeker's level of karma, I'll get a job @ arl too -- and we can get paid to build Saturn models in BRL-CAD |
| 03:52.37 | starseeker | yukonbob: That's a tad useless even for worst-case pork spending, unless perhaps the Smithsonian commissions a Saturn V model... |
| 03:52.52 | ``Erik | sorry, bob, you're a canuck, so us gov't doesn't consider you to be a sentient being :( |
| 03:52.53 | yukonbob | heh |
| 03:52.59 | yukonbob | feh |
| 03:53.05 | yukonbob | that's OK -- England took me |
| 03:53.07 | louipc | wgha? |
| 03:53.30 | ``Erik | sweet |
| 03:53.41 | yukonbob | will be... |
| 03:54.08 | starseeker | yukonbob: I still think the unrestricted Saturn V blueprints (if any) would be a great demo for the BRL-CAD software |
| 03:54.26 | starseeker | yukonbob: That's likely something I'll be doing in my retirement... |
| 03:54.40 | yukonbob | starseeker: indeed it would -- it'd be cool in many ways |
| 03:55.03 | ``Erik | buddy of mine, colin, did his doctorate at oxford, damn smart boy |
| 03:55.38 | starseeker | I'm getting the impression the publicly available screenshots of BRL-CAD don't even begin to hint at what it can do, but of course engineering drawings of sufficient complexity to really show it off are a tad hard to come by in the public domain... |
| 03:55.39 | ``Erik | he claims to have the shortest thesis out of the cs dept there |
| 03:55.46 | ``Erik | ohhhhhh, heh |
| 03:55.57 | ``Erik | ummm |
| 03:56.26 | ``Erik | the birdcage stryker was a BRL-CAD model converted to adt for rise, and the grass added using blender |
| 03:56.44 | ``Erik | thought I think it was a pro-e model that was converted and cleaned up |
| 03:56.49 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:56.50 | yukonbob | starseeker: I bet the public digs pretty pix like that 6-wheel vehicle (which _is_ an awesome render), and other visibly 'kewl' things |
| 03:56.58 | ``Erik | the birdcage may've been done in brlcad |
| 03:57.24 | starseeker | yukonbob: Yeah, visually complex is good. |
| 03:57.28 | yukonbob | ah -- that's the one I was thinking of -- the stryker... |
| 03:57.33 | ``Erik | we have ummm, a hubble model, a hilux truck, and an mi28 |
| 03:57.36 | ``Erik | 8 wheel, not 6 |
| 03:57.45 | starseeker | Is the hubble model in the public tree? |
| 03:57.48 | ``Erik | though it is of the lav family, which has anywhere form 4 to 8 wheels |
| 03:57.52 | yukonbob | what's a pair of wheels among friends? |
| 03:58.23 | ``Erik | stryker is a pile anyways, half of it is made in canada *cough* :D |
| 03:58.43 | yukonbob | well -- hopefully once the website is more up/running and there a wiki/gallery, pix will come out of the wordwork. |
| 03:59.09 | ``Erik | karel has some engineering grade crap on his site |
| 03:59.23 | yukonbob | url? |
| 03:59.25 | ``Erik | I'd kinda like to bust out a tape measure and model my house some day |
| 03:59.38 | yukonbob | ``Erik: /me has had that idea for a while too |
| 03:59.43 | ``Erik | http://ronja.twibright.com/ |
| 03:59.54 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 04:00.15 | ``Erik | we had a summer student come and do a model of a reasonably large house from blueprints |
| 04:00.31 | ``Erik | I THINK he managed to get all the studs in, too |
| 04:00.31 | brlcad | I have some of the old/original GSI BRL-CAD renderings that can probably finally be posted |
| 04:00.40 | yukonbob | oh -- karel == Z80-Boy |
| 04:00.44 | starseeker | That would be cool |
| 04:00.54 | ``Erik | yeah, karel == clock == z80 |
| 04:01.33 | yukonbob | ya -- that ronja stuff is pretty neat... |
| 04:01.40 | ``Erik | there're um, m1 pics that'd been public released, that was modelled entirely in old BRL-CAD |
| 04:01.43 | yukonbob | I wonder how many hours went into it... |
| 04:01.45 | brlcad | that stryker was a hybrid iirc, predominantly started as pro/e but the slat armor and some other details weren't |
| 04:02.03 | ``Erik | like in the second volume of the doc, few pages in is a "skinless" render |
| 04:02.21 | PrezKennedy | i should steal my dad's nick if ts still available on freenode |
| 04:02.34 | ``Erik | yeah, and some of the proe stuff was gutted and redone in BRL-CAD primitives |
| 04:02.51 | ``Erik | I know dwayne got heavy on doing that once I got him a clone prototype |
| 04:03.08 | ``Erik | um |
| 04:03.10 | starseeker | ``Erik: How |
| 04:03.13 | starseeker | sorry |
| 04:03.13 | ``Erik | kermit: No such nick/channel |
| 04:03.26 | starseeker | ``Erik: How'd the Hubble get a BRL-CAD model, by the way? |
| 04:03.42 | ``Erik | I think that may've been a hair lee got up his ass |
| 04:03.55 | ``Erik | he worked at nasa before brl |
| 04:04.19 | brlcad | yeah, lee was working on a project for the STSI at the time |
| 04:04.54 | brlcad | that was one of the relatively 'first' real things he modeled |
| 04:05.11 | yukonbob | is there a BNF available to describe the .g format? |
| 04:05.33 | ``Erik | no, but there's a description in a file that's sorta almost kinda recent |
| 04:05.53 | yukonbob | poolio: LaTeX is sooo 1990's -- we all [heart] DocBook now... |
| 04:06.02 | yukonbob | :) |
| 04:06.04 | ``Erik | the librt and wdb stuff is reasonably ok to read |
| 04:06.07 | PrezKennedy | \whois kermit |
| 04:06.14 | PrezKennedy | dangit |
| 04:06.21 | PrezKennedy | too much interaction with windoze |
| 04:06.22 | ``Erik | like, uh, in the libt/g_*.c files, look at the import and export 5 functions |
| 04:06.30 | starseeker | DocBook is good for very specific types of documentation - those not needing heavy duty mathematics |
| 04:06.48 | ``Erik | I like LaTeX |
| 04:07.33 | yukonbob | latex is cool -- and in fact all the docbook work I've done converts to LaTeX, then LaTeX->pdf |
| 04:07.46 | poolio | yukonbob: :'( |
| 04:08.00 | poolio | yukonbob: I have to typeset all my math homework now |
| 04:08.04 | ``Erik | I've only done a tiny bit of docbook type shtuff |
| 04:08.23 | yukonbob | starseeker: I'd be surprised if there's not math-oriented "docbook" tools out there... |
| 04:08.26 | ``Erik | both docbook and latex have overly verbose close tags imnsho |
| 04:08.56 | brlcad | the two 'Plate' renderings (albeit "misfiled") in http://my.brlcad.org/tmp/primitives/ are a nicely detailed pure-csg model |
| 04:09.09 | yukonbob | poolio: I was only kidding... :) I have two LaTeX manuals that are really nice to have -- once you outgrow the "LaTeX in 20 Minutes" or whatever that text is... |
| 04:10.12 | ``Erik | yeah, those're the m1 "skinless" renders |
| 04:10.23 | ``Erik | one of those is in one of the books |
| 04:10.41 | brlcad | both are (or at least were) |
| 04:11.22 | starseeker | brlcad: are those the ones someone worried about being on the website even though they were cleared for release? |
| 04:11.55 | brlcad | starseeker: one of them, yes |
| 04:12.21 | ``Erik | um, that was one that got striken from a poster pitch |
| 04:12.32 | ``Erik | struck |
| 04:12.33 | ``Erik | bleh |
| 04:12.34 | brlcad | once we have the new website on-line with a proper way to annotate/document the images, when/how released, with descriptions, it'll be better |
| 04:12.46 | starseeker | Yes. |
| 04:12.50 | ``Erik | lees proposalcouldn't get approved with that pic on it |
| 04:13.00 | starseeker | Really?? |
| 04:13.01 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, probably, but those are all what you get via the 'make' cmd |
| 04:13.11 | ``Erik | png has a comment field O.o |
| 04:13.49 | brlcad | different decades, different folks |
| 04:13.58 | yukonbob | poolio: I think I've got "The LaTeX Companion" and "Guide to LaTeX"... |
| 04:15.03 | poolio | I'm really upset, I can't make the QED symbol and I'm done my proof! |
| 04:15.27 | starseeker | There are some solutions for structured picture viewing - remember something called Scientific Image Database from the mists of time... |
| 04:18.10 | starseeker | OK, time to put the brain in bureaucracy recovery mode (a.k.a sleep...) |
| 04:18.52 | ``Erik | ams-latex has a proof environment that parks a qed mark at the end |
| 04:20.03 | ``Erik | google for "latex qed" gives lots of hits |
| 04:20.34 | starseeker | Too bad they can't release the hubble model - that'd be cool (particularly if the ray-tracing could interact with the optics...) |
| 04:21.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30055 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parse.c: |
| 04:21.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: one more converted over to bu_strlcpy/bu_strlcat. this one was intentionally |
| 04:21.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: skipped initially as there's a strncpy going on that intentionally is |
| 04:21.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: short-copying a buffer. didn't investigate the cause, whether intentional or |
| 04:21.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: not, but leaving alone with a note for now. |
| 04:30.03 | brlcad | possibly, but it's hard to get your hands on some of those models |
| 04:30.26 | Axman6 | the commies might get them! |
| 04:31.14 | louipc | china? |
| 04:31.28 | brlcad | I had contacts to a couple gusy for the mars rover project a couples years ago and could have gotten the model they used in the ubiquitous animation renderings, but still wouldn't have been able to make it public |
| 04:31.47 | Axman6 | lame |
| 04:32.02 | Axman6 | well... i made a paper model when i was a kid... could ou use that? |
| 04:32.07 | Axman6 | it's a little squished |
| 04:34.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30056 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: if your gonna tweak ws, might as well do the whole file |
| 04:35.42 | louipc | heh |
| 04:37.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30057 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob got all of the mged text editing commands (edcodes, edmater, wmater, ted, etc) on the windows platform |
| 04:37.59 | ``Erik | um, siggraph 05? |
| 04:38.41 | ``Erik | vgr, er, voyager might be old enough to be releasable |
| 04:40.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30058 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 04:40.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Bob also got rtwizard working on windows (at least partially -- he still has to |
| 04:40.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: add a few missing commands for some of the extended modes). also made the |
| 04:40.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: display managers behave better by automatically deiconifying if needed. |
| 04:40.37 | ``Erik | heh |
| 04:40.56 | ``Erik | I loaned dave a couple tcl books this morning, he's going to b working on rewriting that |
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| 05:40.37 | brlcad | yeah, I know .. but that's might still be months off and he might still get pulled onto something else |
| 05:41.40 | brlcad | ed had an interesting idea for a quick fix geometry conversion path by using [commercial cad package X] -> STEP/IGES -> Rhino -> 3DM -> BRL-CAD via a new 3dm-g converter that uses the new BREP primitive |
| 05:42.24 | brlcad | that has a lot of great short-term and long-term merit if it were implemented well enough .. gives a fast conversion path and a new converter all in one step |
| 05:42.34 | brlcad | I might have to work on that just as part of the brep implementation testing |
| 06:30.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30059 10/brlcad/trunk/ (172 files in 25 dirs): even MORE K&R ws style consistency cleanup. this time, make sure there's a space between the ){'s as well as around "else" statements. |
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| 07:06.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30060 10/brlcad/trunk/ (17 files in 6 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 07:06.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: refactor libpkg so that the windows-specific pkg_init and pkg_terminate |
| 07:06.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: functions should no longer be necessary. according to the msdn docs, the |
| 07:06.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: functions may be called multiple times as they internally reference count the |
| 07:06.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: number of calls to each and deallocated on the last/matching WSACleanup that |
| 07:06.04 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: corresponds to the number of calls to WSAStartup. the calls were moved directly |
| 07:06.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: into pkg_open and pkg_close (which will get picked up by all callers including |
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| 07:33.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30061 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/Sc.h: quell warnings and remove non-ansi decls by removing the oddly named _STDC_ sections |
| 07:34.47 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30062 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/unix/: ends up with a libtclstub8.5.a.E in here anyways, so add to ignore list |
| 07:38.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30063 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/: ignore librttherm.a and libremrt.a |
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| 10:41.49 | Gruni | Hideho. |
| 12:20.33 | starseeker | Interesting - apparently someone has located some of the old Pioneer probe drawings: http://www.ninfinger.org/~sven/models/vault2006/pioneerbp.zip |
| 12:21.34 | Z80-Boy | made in BRL-CAD? |
| 12:21.50 | starseeker | Don't think so |
| 12:22.09 | starseeker | these look like they either are or are based off of the 2D prints NASA would have used |
| 12:22.44 | starseeker | Naturally it doesn't seem to include much in the way of dimensions... grumble... |
| 13:36.36 | b0ef | brlcad: I'm requesting iges-g then, but are we able to use these files in brlcad? |
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| 15:31.07 | brlcad | b0ef: depends what level of use you're looking for and what sort of iges it is -- you should be able to at least bring in the model, perform basic transformations, basic analyses (it should be nirtable), and render it |
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| 16:20.03 | starseeker | brlcad: Is it still the case that BRL-CAD doesn't have a simple way to recover deleted geometry? (E.g. an undo option?) |
| 16:29.53 | brlcad | nope, there is no undo in mged |
| 16:30.36 | brlcad | there are commit actions that don't immediately apply, like solid edit mode, but once you apply/reject/accept, the action is atomic and done |
| 16:31.50 | brlcad | a long-standing request but was actually a specific design intent, at least initially |
| 16:32.23 | brlcad | i don't think anyone is opposed to the idea of undo any more, but the details to implement it properly are a bit tricky |
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| 18:20.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30064 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpkg/pkg.c: If we're going to perform a WSACleanup() in pkg_close() we also need to call WSAStartup() in pkg_getclient() and _pkg_permserver_impl(). |
| 18:23.22 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30065 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/FbPage.itk: Mods to get things working on Windows. |
| 18:25.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30066 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bw-pix.c: Tweak for compiling on Windows. |
| 18:29.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30067 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (archer/archer.bat mged/mged.bat): Minor tweaks. |
| 18:32.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30068 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (raytrace.h rtgeom.h): Moved a few metaball function declarations from rtgeom.h to raytrace.h. |
| 18:38.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30069 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/bu.h src/libbu/brlcad_path.c): make bu_brlcad_root/bu_brlcad_data both return a const char * instead of a char * so callers are more aware that they should copy the string if they want to modify it |
| 19:30.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30070 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_disk.c: Added a call to setmode() in dsk_open(). This fixes the problem where bad pix files were getting created. |
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| 20:45.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30071 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 20:45.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Bob fixed PIX image file creation bug on Windows .. this fixes a problem with |
| 20:45.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: many of the pix and framebuffer tools that render directly to a pix file via |
| 20:45.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: libfb. the problem was the file was not opened in 'binary mode', which is |
| 20:45.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: required on windows or it will perform EOL translations (wreaking all sorts of |
| 20:45.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: havoc of course with a pix image) |
| 20:46.40 | brlcad | ../../include/raytrace.h:3527: warning: 'struct rt_metaball_internal' declared inside parameter list |
| 20:46.43 | brlcad | ../../include/raytrace.h:3527: warning: its scope is only this definition or declaration, which is probably not what you want |
| 20:54.04 | ``Erik | heh, yeah, bob went moving my shit around |
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| 20:55.59 | ``Erik | he moved crap i defined in rtgeom.h (after the struct def) into raytrace.h, and a lot of stuff includes raytrace.h without rtgeom.h |
| 20:59.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30072 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: include a forward decl for struct defined in rtgeom.h |
| 21:00.11 | ``Erik | hackish, but works :/ |
| 21:07.10 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30073 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/ (extern.h glob.c lgt.c): er, not clear why lgt request the data segment address .. don't do it so we can remove the sbrk check |
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| 21:25.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30074 10/brlcad/trunk/src/remrt/rtsrv.c: remove the unused beginptr and associated sbrk() calls |
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| 21:52.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30075 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/config_win.h src/libbu/malloc.c): move the Windows-specific empty sbrk() hack into config_win.h as just being NULL |
| 22:26.49 | starseeker | brlcad, ``Erik: anybody still on? |
| 22:26.57 | brlcad | yes? |
| 22:27.09 | starseeker | Just wondering about the BRL-CAD shortcuts |
| 22:27.15 | starseeker | are they customizable? |
| 22:27.21 | starseeker | for movement, rotation, etc |
| 22:28.02 | brlcad | "BRL-CAD shortcuts"? I presume you mean "MGED shortcuts" ... ;) |
| 22:28.08 | starseeker | er, yeah :-) |
| 22:30.26 | brlcad | yeah, they can be customized -- it's all in tcl land for the bindings |
| 22:30.52 | starseeker | Cool |
| 22:31.00 | brlcad | but how easy and what exactly you have to do for a given binding or to make new ones isn't exactly well-defined or cleaned up for end-users to easily change |
| 22:31.10 | starseeker | Ah. |
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| 22:31.37 | brlcad | most people don't even know that the bindings exist other than the basics |
| 22:31.46 | brlcad | and there are different bindings for each window |
| 22:32.03 | brlcad | e.g. if you're in the command window, you sort of expect cursor control bindings |
| 22:32.21 | brlcad | the "hotkeys" in the graphics window, though, are just single keys |
| 22:33.11 | starseeker | I'm not sure it maps all that cleanly to mged... |
| 22:43.40 | brlcad | yeah, I could write a book on potential new-user usability improvements that mged could benefit from.. |
| 22:44.19 | brlcad | the issue is usually more that once you do know how things behave, you can be quite proficient .. and responsive to a wide range of modeling/analysis needs |
| 22:45.49 | starseeker | Oh, no question :-) I know I need to be patient. |
| 22:46.20 | brlcad | it's a sad result of continual on-going reprioritization .. do you stop and work on mged usability for new users (that are only new once) or work on new feature X that they need now |
| 22:46.55 | starseeker | Put that way, the choice is obvious |
| 22:47.24 | starseeker | to heck with the newbies :-P |
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| 22:52.23 | brlcad | yeah, but you can only keep saying that for so long |
| 22:52.27 | brlcad | before it's a major problem :) |
| 22:52.31 | brlcad | like it is now :) |
| 22:55.01 | louipc | you need some stats like the percentage of new users that continue to use brlcad after x amount of time, how often they use it, etc... |
| 22:55.24 | brlcad | a lot of the most fundamental problems stem from not having easy access to an evaluated representation (e.g. a csg implicit in evaluated brep form) .. which is where most of my long term plans have stemmed from (instead of stopping to tweak mged, for example) |
| 22:55.50 | louipc | I don't have much time to learn how to model in brlcad other than to toy with it once in awhile. |
| 22:56.21 | louipc | hm |
| 22:56.49 | brlcad | because I could make mged relatively as easy to use as other big-name cad packages for new users, but then there are still some critical issues like shaded displays and a clean geometry management api on the code side of things |
| 22:57.56 | brlcad | wow, this EMS is awesome .. and pretty damn strong, can't take the highest setting |
| 23:07.52 | louipc | hah |
| 23:11.04 | yukonbob | ?EMS |
| 23:13.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30076 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): finally remove the mk_poly/mk_polysolid/mk_fpoly routines for procedurally creating polysolid primitives. the BoT primitive replaced them a long while ago and have been marked obsolete more than long enough |
| 23:16.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30077 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/ (PictureTypeE.itcl PictureTypeF.itcl): Mods for running on Windows. Also cleaned up the catch statements. |
| 23:17.07 | brlcad | ~ems |
| 23:17.08 | ibot | i heard ems is an Electronic Muscle Stimulator .. see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Muscle_Stimulation |
| 23:17.50 | brlcad | fun stuff :) |
| 23:19.03 | brlcad | first tried one at my physical therapist last year when I had a rotator cuff injury on my shoulder |
| 23:19.27 | alex_joni | sounds like "10 things you can't do while beeing electrocuted" from brainiac |
| 23:19.31 | brlcad | ordered one a couple days ago, arrived earlier today .. been using it for the past few hours playing with settings while I code :) |
| 23:20.55 | brlcad | should be really nice for workout warmup/recovery |
| 23:20.57 | alex_joni | http://www.g4tv.com/brainiac/videos/index.html |
| 23:21.32 | alex_joni | brlcad: don't try it while shaving :) |
| 23:25.31 | brlcad | hm, won't play here |
| 23:25.37 | brlcad | loads but doesn't play |
| 23:26.14 | brlcad | it locks up your muscle, I don't think I'd anything that required the muscles being stimulated |
| 23:26.30 | brlcad | the contractions can be quite intense depending on the setting |
| 23:38.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30078 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: quell warnings, bu_brlcad_* return const now |
| 23:42.39 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30079 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (picket_fence.c pix2g.c spltest.c): quell warnings |
| 23:45.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30080 10/brlcad/trunk/ (9 files in 8 dirs): finally remove the obsolete write_shell_as_polysolid that was replaced by mk_bot_from_nmg during the 6.0 release |
| 23:47.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30081 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (contours.c pix2g.c): quell warnings |
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| 23:59.17 | starseeker | Huh - anybody heard of these guys before? http://www.ninfinger.org/~sven/models/guidelines.html |
| 23:59.33 | starseeker | Their archives seem to have quite a lot of drawings and photos of cool stuff :-) |
| 00:01.11 | starseeker | This is cool: http://www.ninfinger.org/~sven/models/vault2007/Voyager%20plans/BLUEPRINT_VOYAGER.gif |
| 00:18.26 | brlcad | that is pretty cool |
| 00:18.50 | brlcad | could construct it from that pretty easily.. :) |
| 00:37.16 | starseeker | Dunno what the copyright status is on it though... |
| 00:45.48 | brlcad | shouldn't matter for modeling purposes, the model itself is still an original work so long as you don't embed the image |
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| 01:10.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30082 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (8 files in 4 dirs): obliterate the old HAVE_UNIX_IO check. instead use the corresponding types/stat/whatever checks that the HAVE_UNIX_IO section protects, or rewrite where appropriate to use c89 routines instead of unix io |
| 01:11.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30083 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: no longer need the HAVE_UNIX_IO and TIME_WITH_SYS_TIME checks. the first was removed throughout the code, the latter is already provided via AC_HEADER_TIME check. |
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| 12:13.08 | starseeker | Anybody know anything about a CAD format called Inventor? |
| 12:16.35 | starseeker | I don't see anything about copyright info yet, but this would potentially make a Really Cool example for BRL-CAD: http://space.jpl.nasa.gov/models/models/cassini.dxf.gz |
| 12:29.56 | starseeker | dxf-g handles it, and the resulting .g file is pretty nifty even in all gray: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/cassini-1.png |
| 12:30.07 | starseeker | http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/cassini-2.png |
| 12:37.11 | starseeker | biab |
| 12:37.18 | brlcad | sgi inventor? |
| 12:37.29 | starseeker | Not sure - could be |
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| 12:38.06 | brlcad | inventor files are just an old polygonal file format that old sgi/irix boxes preferred for their native tools |
| 12:38.15 | starseeker | http://space.jpl.nasa.gov/models/ |
| 12:38.21 | starseeker | Fifth entry down |
| 12:38.33 | brlcad | but then there's also autodesk inventor and a few other products that are entirely different |
| 12:38.50 | starseeker | Uses the .iv extension |
| 12:41.06 | brlcad | yeah, that's an sgi file |
| 12:41.10 | brlcad | open inventor |
| 12:42.12 | starseeker | Anything we can do with it? |
| 12:42.44 | brlcad | mm, on an sgi sure :) |
| 12:43.09 | starseeker | heh |
| 12:43.29 | starseeker | That's the one with 300000 primitives - would be interesting to test it out |
| 12:43.51 | brlcad | there's an iv to vrml converter iirc |
| 12:44.00 | brlcad | i don't think we have an importer for it in brl-cad |
| 12:44.06 | brlcad | so you could .. write one :) |
| 12:44.36 | starseeker | Hehe |
| 12:44.59 | starseeker | Is there enough call for it to justify doing it? |
| 12:45.21 | brlcad | there are binary and ascii .iv's |
| 12:46.27 | brlcad | the details are somewhere in http://oss.sgi.com/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/inventor/ |
| 12:46.35 | starseeker | Just spotted that :-) |
| 12:47.31 | brlcad | i'm not sure there's any calling for it other than completeness of converters |
| 12:47.49 | brlcad | it was a fairly popular format back in the day |
| 12:47.54 | starseeker | Cool, thanks :-) |
| 12:47.54 | starseeker | Oh, well - in the meantime the dxf based one is a pretty nifty demo. I was afraid it would be 2D only but it is 3D :-) |
| 12:48.00 | brlcad | when inventor and performer were the best |
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| 12:48.42 | brlcad | having a non-polygonal version would be impressive |
| 12:49.12 | starseeker | So it might have some utility in the "preserving old work in useful formats" department... |
| 12:49.19 | brlcad | perfect situation for csg implicits from the shapes I'm seeing in your rendering |
| 12:49.37 | starseeker | Yes, I thought that too looking at it |
| 12:49.47 | brlcad | sure, if .iv has the objects and not just more surfaces |
| 12:50.21 | brlcad | e.g. whether that big ball is actually a sphere or a bunch of polygons that define a sphere's surface |
| 12:51.09 | alex_joni | brlcad: what kind of shaders are common in brlcad? |
| 12:51.44 | starseeker | If it doesn't define a sphere, is it pretty useless? |
| 12:52.28 | brlcad | alex_joni: http://my.brlcad.org/ugm2002/ShadingObjects.pdf |
| 12:52.30 | alex_joni | I saw a "nifty" shader once.. it worked a bit different than regular ones.. when you imported a model it analyzed the objects, and created a separate wireframe for the edges |
| 12:52.45 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, pretty much |
| 12:52.53 | starseeker | Huh - Open Inventor is licensed under the LGPL. Any chance it could be used directly? |
| 12:52.56 | brlcad | it might define a brep surface, that's useful too |
| 12:53.07 | alex_joni | then it displayed the objects with gourad? and placed the wireframe on top.. the result is very nice even if the mdoels are crappy |
| 12:53.42 | brlcad | alex_joni: it sounds like you're describing an rtedge overlay |
| 12:53.55 | alex_joni | brlcad: might be, I have no clue how it's called |
| 12:54.04 | starseeker | brlcad: What about a graphical utility to allow the user to select polygons and then use the polygons to "deduce" a replacement shape? |
| 12:54.08 | brlcad | that's not actually a different shader, it's a separate render pass (for the edges) |
| 12:54.10 | alex_joni | I only use the software which implements it |
| 12:54.23 | starseeker | brlcad: Annoying as all get out, but possibly easier than re-doing from scratch |
| 12:54.51 | alex_joni | brlcad: I *thought* this is a shader, because the program I use does it on the fly.. so no real rendering |
| 12:55.03 | brlcad | alex_joni: a brl-cad program? |
| 12:55.22 | alex_joni | heh, no.. a different program, not OSS |
| 12:55.24 | brlcad | there are ways to do it as a shader if you have a polygonal model |
| 12:55.49 | alex_joni | I was just wondering if something similar exists in brlcad |
| 12:56.13 | brlcad | yeah, that's not surprising, there are ways to do that effect as an opengl shader .. brl-cad shaders are ray-trace shaders (like you'd find for renderman/pixar, not opengl) |
| 12:56.15 | alex_joni | (as I've seen that most things out there can be found in brl-cad somewhere) |
| 12:56.42 | brlcad | alex_joni: yeah, something like: http://my.brlcad.org/ugm2002/RtWizard.pdf |
| 12:56.52 | brlcad | see page 11 .. the difference on the edges |
| 12:56.57 | starseeker | Well, gotta get into work - later all |
| 12:57.01 | alex_joni | still waiting on the first link.. doesn't open |
| 12:57.26 | brlcad | first one is 28M, second is 7M |
| 12:57.59 | alex_joni | might explain :) |
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| 13:46.27 | starseeker | OK, enough with the space probes, back to tutorials ;-) |
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| 14:04.05 | ``Erik | hey, brlcad |
| 14:05.04 | ``Erik | bob is going through and fixing rtwizard so it works in windows while dave is looking at rewriting it... are we getting unnecessary duplication of effort? |
| 14:14.54 | ``Erik | hehehe "The capital of Quebec is Queblowme." |
| 14:18.20 | starseeker | ``Erik: I had to duck out - did brlcad tell me whether there was any useful user-interactive manual way to convert meshes to shapes? (e.g. select all the polygons used to define a sphere by hand and then say "make a sphere using the dimensions defined by these") |
| 14:18.43 | ``Erik | nope, and I don't think there is |
| 14:18.58 | starseeker | Nuts |
| 14:19.03 | ``Erik | ben was kinda exploring a possibly way to attack that problem with beset |
| 14:19.39 | ``Erik | but the modellers here generally just write some numbers from the mesh down and start building the csg tree |
| 14:19.59 | starseeker | Yeah, I guess that's almost the same |
| 14:20.30 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 14:20.42 | ``Erik | that's one of the things clone and tracker are supposed to help with :) |
| 14:21.07 | starseeker | Indeed. |
| 14:21.32 | starseeker | Heh - well, at least I have a nifty screenshot now that isn't havoc.g ;-) |
| 14:24.20 | ``Erik | heh, um |
| 14:24.40 | ``Erik | bot models tend to do that |
| 14:24.53 | ``Erik | but it'd pipe into adrt fairly nicely I bet |
| 15:23.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30084 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Fixed i/o. Started adding "Blinn Blob" evaluator |
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| 16:08.35 | starseeke1 | Hmm. |
| 16:09.54 | starseeker | Is there a script in here somewhere that can step down a list of parts and add them one by one to the drawing? |
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| 18:40.41 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 19:10.17 | brlcad | howdy bob |
| 19:12.02 | brlcad | starseeker: which drawing? the wireframe display in mged? |
| 19:12.22 | brlcad | if you want to interactively add/remove objects from the wireframe, the geometry browser will let you do that |
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| 19:41.59 | starseeker | brlcad: I was thinking the scenario of an imported drawing with a long list of parts with automatically generated names (i.e. useless for describing what they are) you could start blank and add parts automatically in succession, printing out the current name of each as it is added - that way you can visually identify what it is and re-name it accordingly (bonus points if the script gives you an opportunity to re-name on the fly...) |
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| 21:15.49 | starseeker | lol |
| 21:16.01 | ``Erik | what? I'm being productive :) |
| 21:16.02 | starseeker | been in too many meetings? |
| 21:18.04 | ``Erik | well, the interesting part is the terminal ballistics |
| 21:18.16 | ``Erik | with a well defined boolean end state, even! |
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| 21:19.05 | ``Erik | I can make a little iua table, mkill for stick, fkill for "ohcrap, it's coming at me", and kkill for "FUCK, MY EYE" |
| 21:19.49 | ``Erik | chicks dig eyepatches :D |
| 21:46.07 | brlcad | starseeker: ah terminology delta -- 'drawings' generally refer to drafting specs and/or hidden-line renderings |
| 21:46.59 | brlcad | with autocad, that terminology is synonymous with the model and it's geometry but because autocad is a drafting package -- everything inherintly stems from a 2D representation |
| 21:47.31 | brlcad | with brl-cad and solid modeling in general, that's the "model" or geometry .. but I think I see what you' |
| 21:47.35 | brlcad | you're saying now |
| 21:48.41 | brlcad | there'd be a pretty big benefit for having an import tool that lets you do as you describe, even if only to allow an easy means to display/rename post-import |
| 21:49.58 | brlcad | many cad packages auto-name these days resulting in horrible default names, others use a part or manufacturer's number which is slightly better but still just as opaque when there are 10,000 objects named RJ82756H192 |
| 21:52.51 | starseeker | Right. Sorry about using the wrong term :-( |
| 21:53.21 | starseeker | It should be a fairly simple script to set up, unless we want to go fancy with a GUI dialog... |
| 22:23.12 | *** part/#brlcad starseeker (n=CYapp@85.muba.balt.washdctt.dsl.att.net) | |
| 22:25.29 | brlcad | heh |
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| 22:57.25 | yukonbob | hello, whirled |
| 23:05.51 | brlcad | howdy! |
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| 23:34.55 | yukonbob | hello, starseeker, brlcad |
| 23:43.36 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, not too complicated a script -- though the money would be on having an efficient user-friendly gui |
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| 01:38.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Well, maybe we can start with a script and work up... |
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| 04:05.08 | starseeker | ``Erik: eh? |
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| 06:37.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30085 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: annotate that the ogl framebuffer seems to be recently (last few months) horribly busted on at least a couple platforms (e.g. mac os x) |
| 06:41.57 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30086 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: pix-fb -p tested and works as documented, not calling the fb_close and exiting until after the sleep pause |
| 07:01.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30087 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parse.c: revert the bu_strlcpy/bu_strlcat in here, there are still string truncations going on somewhere |
| 07:04.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30088 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: classic mged seems to be busted now too.. doesn't read mged_prompt() .. need to debug/check string processing |
| 07:08.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30089 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: pushing a primitive seems to work just fine. no problems encountered. (this was done in response to recent crash bug with xpush mentioned during a CCB meeting, wanted to test just to be sure push was okay) |
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| 07:36.41 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30090 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: quell bu_brlcad_data constness warning and fix dbconcat error reporting 'concat' instead of the command actually invoked |
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| 15:58.54 | ``Erik | "I'm a programmer, I don't have to spell correctly; I just have to spell consistently." |
| 16:24.48 | Z80-Boy | I have a question regarding international NDA |
| 16:25.17 | Z80-Boy | Some company is offering a job and for the interview they are requiring me to sign a NDA. But the NDA contract party and the dispute venue (court) is specified in California. |
| 16:25.38 | Z80-Boy | That means if there were any dispute (which can be without me doing actually anything wrong), I would have to travel to California? |
| 16:25.42 | Z80-Boy | Possibly multiple times? |
| 16:28.08 | archivist | overwrite the town to your town before signing |
| 16:28.22 | archivist | and your countries law |
| 16:28.28 | Z80-Boy | I asked for that |
| 16:28.49 | Z80-Boy | And they said they will ask inside and then they returned with a reply it's not possible they cannot customize this contract. |
| 16:29.07 | Z80-Boy | So I guess if I do that they won't permit me into the building |
| 16:30.06 | archivist | heh are they worth working for |
| 16:30.06 | Z80-Boy | Well Forbes Magazine claims is the #1 company in terms how nice it's to work there |
| 16:30.22 | Z80-Boy | And multiple friends from the free software world say the same |
| 16:30.25 | Z80-Boy | But they are secretive. |
| 16:30.44 | Z80-Boy | The factical part of the NDA actually isn't overly restrictive for me. Just fine. |
| 16:31.00 | Z80-Boy | Not Forbes Fortune 500 I think |
| 16:33.29 | archivist | methinks the choice is yours (perhaps get local legal advice) especially any axtradition clases and agreements that the USA like to impose on countries |
| 16:33.36 | archivist | clauses |
| 16:34.16 | Z80-Boy | Another thing is they require a training in California so I would have to submit my fingerprints into the US system which I don't trust |
| 16:35.15 | Z80-Boy | It's actually a warning sing of company inflexibility if they are unable to change that. |
| 16:35.36 | Z80-Boy | I guess they don't need it at all because they can solve any disputes through their local subsidiary. |
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| 16:36.11 | starseeker | Boo |
| 16:38.32 | Z80-Boy | Plus during the interviews I had a feeling like "try to do something a different way that we expect and you'll see things" |
| 16:38.45 | archivist | ew |
| 16:38.50 | Z80-Boy | Isn't that a bad sign? |
| 16:39.00 | Z80-Boy | Bad gut feeling :) |
| 16:43.00 | archivist | "you will comply" in Dalek voice |
| 16:43.51 | archivist | but sometimes benefits outway the cons |
| 16:47.26 | Z80-Boy | Well a probability needs to be estimated that Google generates a lawsuit even when I comply |
| 16:47.46 | Z80-Boy | and then estimate a probability distribution of the number of court standings and multiply with airline cost |
| 16:47.58 | Z80-Boy | and multiply that with airline safety qotient and human life value |
| 16:48.09 | Z80-Boy | Then compare the result with the difference in salaries and benefits :) |
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| 20:06.52 | starseeker | Z80-Boy: Doing job interviews? |
| 20:19.20 | Z80-Boy | starseeker: yes |
| 20:19.29 | Z80-Boy | With a secretive company ;-) |
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| 04:38.33 | brlcad | the geometry browser could be so much better, feel free to "make it better" :) |
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| 11:15.05 | Axman6 | brlcad: file a ticket :P |
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| 07:51.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30094 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: erik upgraded the bundled tcl/tk from 8.5a1 to 8.5 final now that the tcl/tk folks have finally released the blessed update |
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| 21:34.48 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 22:41.11 | brlcad | howdy bob |
| 23:00.54 | yukonbob | is this for .g files? |
| 23:01.54 | brlcad | yeah |
| 23:02.41 | louipc | http://www.theonion.com/content/video/ |
| 23:02.43 | brlcad | the command already exists, but it's rather limited, picky, and uninformative .. likely to surprise the user in some cases |
| 23:02.51 | yukonbob | can distribute libraries of objects and shoot them to/from other libs/projects? |
| 23:03.11 | brlcad | now you can specify arbitrary prefix/suffix or let it auto-increment a prefix/suffix and it does the right thing |
| 23:03.38 | brlcad | and lets you know when there was a name collision if there was one |
| 23:04.17 | brlcad | yukonbob: erm, that's not exactly what dbconcat does, but there is another command in the package that does do that |
| 23:04.20 | yukonbob | hrmm -- /me has no sign of dbconcat in his 7.10.4 distrib. |
| 23:04.25 | brlcad | or is at least an example for doing that :) |
| 23:04.29 | brlcad | it's an mged command |
| 23:04.46 | yukonbob | mged ftw! |
| 23:04.49 | brlcad | if you run file->import or dbconcat on the mged prompt |
| 23:04.56 | yukonbob | ah... |
| 23:06.26 | yukonbob | brlcad: what's the sched. for next release? |
| 23:07.16 | brlcad | early feb if the remining TODO items get resolved this week |
| 23:07.47 | yukonbob | rock'n [fscking] roll!! |
| 23:07.50 | yukonbob | :) |
| 23:07.57 | yukonbob | is the TODO posted? |
| 23:08.12 | brlcad | it's in the sources |
| 23:08.19 | brlcad | always in the sources ;) |
| 23:08.26 | yukonbob | UTSL ;) |
| 23:08.44 | brlcad | https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/TODO |
| 23:09.03 | yukonbob | speaking of co |
| 23:09.12 | yukonbob | are you pretty happy w/ svn now? |
| 23:09.17 | brlcad | quite |
| 23:09.36 | yukonbob | good -- is ready for primetime production use now? |
| 23:12.16 | brlcad | svn? |
| 23:13.06 | brlcad | yeah, they've been pretty stable ever since sourceforge enabled them as an option for projects .. there were a flurry of related fixes that came after that, but then it's been pretty solid ever since |
| 23:13.19 | brlcad | and that was more than a year ago |
| 23:14.56 | yukonbob | oh no -- I mean specifically w/ this repo -- ie: there was initial problem w/ mime-types (that one obviously solved) -- otherwise this specific BRL-CAD repo is good? |
| 23:15.27 | brlcad | ahh, yeah, I've not encountered any more issues |
| 23:15.41 | yukonbob | ~brlcad ++ |
| 23:16.00 | yukonbob | ^-- even though apparently doesn't count ;) |
| 23:16.06 | brlcad | the biggest mimetype problem was just when it caused tcl files to come in as binary |
| 23:16.12 | yukonbob | right |
| 23:16.37 | brlcad | script mime types still had to be fixed because of the way they changed the handlng of the auto-props file, but it was a minor issue |
| 23:16.48 | yukonbob | did you just add a .tcl type? (ie: .sh would be handled similarly to what .tcl needs, right?) |
| 23:16.59 | brlcad | there already was a tcl type |
| 23:17.28 | brlcad | svn really likes to have mime-types, so the cvs2svn conversion tool gives you several options for trying to auto-set the mime-types |
| 23:17.35 | brlcad | which most of the time works great |
| 23:17.55 | brlcad | mpg files are properly marked as movies, for example, text files as text files, etc |
| 23:18.27 | brlcad | one of the import options was to provide a standard mime.types file (included in just about every apache install) |
| 23:18.55 | brlcad | alas, apache's *default* mime type handler for tcl files is application/x-tcl .. which rightly looks binary to svn |
| 23:19.41 | brlcad | so cvs2svn set that type on the files, which made every revision a binary file .. which is fine content-wise, except it won't let you see a binary diff |
| 23:20.08 | brlcad | so reimported without apache's help, using my own auto-props file (which is svn's way to specify types and other attributes) |
| 23:20.29 | brlcad | actually just dropped the mime.types file altogether just in case there were others |
| 23:20.41 | brlcad | and provided by own auto-props that just had exactly what I wanted |
| 23:21.29 | brlcad | then the only problem was that the cvs2svn authors changed the way that file behaves, making it do something that svn doesn't do .. but that was the binary exec bit issue that was trivial to fix |
| 23:21.48 | brlcad | just means if someone checks out an old revision, they'll have to run sh autogen.sh instead of ./autogen.sh |
| 23:22.39 | yukonbob | ah... /me has never had to deal w/ a repo (of cvs, svn, or anything) at this level (ie: setting up a project)... I'm usually a co/update user ;) |
| 23:25.06 | brlcad | :) |
| 23:25.54 | yukonbob | chat later... enjoy the rest of your sunday :) |
| 23:54.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30095 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: john anderson already/recently fixed the dbconcat of empty combinations bug, just tested and verified here that it's indeed working well now |
| 00:05.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30096 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): |
| 00:05.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: improve and clean up dbconcat's behavior, now allowing users to specify either a |
| 00:05.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: prefix, a suffix, no affix, or an auto-incrementing suffix/prefix when |
| 00:05.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: importing. if there is a name conflict on import, the user is notified that |
| 00:05.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: they didn't get what they asked for. this mod was annotated on sf bug 1816012 |
| 00:05.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: from david loman (dbconcat segfaults) that jra already fixed. |
| 00:12.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30097 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: the -g/-G aspect rt options were fixed last release, now checking for the appropriate setting |
| 00:14.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30098 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: john fixed the units command, was related to 8.5 upgrade not liking callers directly accessing interp->result |
| 00:36.01 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30099 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS NEWS src/librt/db_scan.c): |
| 00:36.05 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: mged now no longer dies in an assertion failure when the geometry file is bogus. |
| 00:36.07 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: it properly reports that things don't seem right and continues gracefully. this |
| 00:36.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: handles the simple test case of 'touch file.g && mged -c file.g units m' that |
| 00:36.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: was bombing out. now it detects/reports that it's a bogus geometry file and |
| 00:36.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: marks the file read-only. |
| 00:40.59 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30100 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: 'lt object' no longer crashes mged. presumably related to my earlier fix that made mged not crash when given lt on empty objects. |
| 00:48.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30101 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 00:48.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: calling xpush on objects with empty trees now works, probably either related to |
| 00:48.50 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the xpush of primitives fix that erik made or the dbconcat processing of empty |
| 00:48.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: combinations fix that john made. either way, tested and now seems to work just |
| 00:48.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: fine (it drops the matrix since there's nothing to push it onto). |
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| 01:58.28 | ``Erik | oh, harsh yet awesome http://www.explosm.net/comics/1156/ |
| 02:54.34 | brlcad | heh |
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| 06:37.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30102 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (avs.c backtrace.c brlcad_path.c crashreport.c): quell various additional compilation warnings |
| 06:40.05 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30103 10/brlcad/trunk/include/brlcad_version.h: quell compilation warnings about not using brlcad_ident() by making it recursive on a condition that should never be true. |
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| 08:18.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30104 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: quell warnings, use unsigned long magic checking since that's how they are treated |
| 08:19.26 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30105 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fchmod.c: include headers for fchmod prototype |
| 08:20.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30106 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bu_tcl.c: quell warnings, use NEAR_ZERO and match new unsigned long prototype |
| 08:21.30 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30107 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/badmagic.c: quell extra warnings, use unsigned long for magic checks |
| 08:22.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30108 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/crashreport.c: eek, fix an = vs == bug |
| 08:23.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30109 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/color.c: quell extra warnings, don't test floating point values directly. use NEAR_ZERO |
| 08:24.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30110 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/hash.c: quell extra warnings |
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| 12:32.18 | toxygen | hello, i would like to ask how to import ply (cyberware 3d scan) file into brlcad and convert it to some other format |
| 12:32.27 | toxygen | .obj or .dxf would be fine |
| 12:32.33 | toxygen | is this possible? |
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| 13:28.23 | jgay | ns |
| 13:32.46 | Axman6 | ? |
| 13:33.04 | Axman6 | oh, heh, forgot which chan i was on |
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| 13:43.54 | d_rossberg | brlcad: i'm afraid it's not so easy to get rid of the HAVE_UNIX_IO - MS Windows needs the O_BINARY flag which isn't standard in gcc, maybe i should create a define for it: HAVE_O_BINARY |
| 13:45.47 | brlcad | toxygen: sure, ply-g then g-obj or g-dxf |
| 13:47.37 | brlcad | d_rossberg: hm, could do something similar to what was done in src/libbu/temp.c for O_TEMPORARY |
| 13:48.05 | brlcad | that's another windows-only flag but provided in a way that it could come from a wrapper header and/or defined from configure |
| 13:50.18 | d_rossberg | ok, i've seen it, that should work |
| 13:50.34 | brlcad | i'll see if I can write a test up for configure |
| 13:56.57 | d_rossberg | this wouldn't be neccessary for the solution you used in temp.c |
| 13:57.55 | brlcad | how do you mean? |
| 13:58.42 | brlcad | idea was in case it's needed elsewhere, so you only have that #ifndef section once and can use O_BINARY as needed to specify the binary files |
| 13:59.30 | brlcad | similar to how you can specify r+b or rb on standard i/o open calls and it doesn't care, just ignores the b |
| 14:02.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30111 10/brlcad/trunk/include/common.h: how about this? define O_TEMPORARY and O_BINARY from common since they're generic and would otherwise just be included from an AH_BOTTOM or an AC_DEFINE if put into the config header |
| 14:03.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30112 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: no longer need the O_TEMPORARY block in here if common.h provides for it |
| 14:07.54 | d_rossberg | aha, i'll test it with my windows version ... |
| 14:18.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30113 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (image.c lex.c list.c): quell extra compilation warnings, be explicit on type conversions |
| 14:39.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30114 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/config_win.h src/libbu/mappedfile.c): |
| 14:39.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: open a binary database in binary mode |
| 14:39.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: (O_BINARY is only in MS Windows different from 0(?)) |
| 14:42.51 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548761F8.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:12.53 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:14.53 | ``Erik | hum, sill ywindows |
| 15:15.53 | ``Erik | Wwhxp |
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| 20:53.37 | toxygen | brlcad: alive? |
| 21:05.07 | yukonbob | wow -- slow day in here today... |
| 21:06.05 | toxygen | yukonbob: hi |
| 21:06.11 | toxygen | maybe you could help me :) |
| 21:06.33 | toxygen | do you know how to import ply object to brlcad and export it afterwards? |
| 21:07.05 | yukonbob | not off top of head -- I'd check Volume IV of the docs, though... |
| 21:07.38 | toxygen | :) |
| 21:07.45 | toxygen | well, there is ply-g utility |
| 21:07.47 | toxygen | i tried it |
| 21:07.48 | toxygen | but |
| 21:07.50 | yukonbob | if there's info about .ply, that's where it'd be |
| 21:07.57 | toxygen | serenity:/usr/brlcad/stable/bin toxygen$ ./ply-g ~/Desktop/3dscan/marian3 ~/Desktop/3dscan/marian3.g |
| 21:08.01 | toxygen | Input file does not appear to be a PLY file!!! |
| 21:08.10 | yukonbob | :P |
| 21:08.22 | toxygen | serenity:~/Desktop/3dscan toxygen$ head marian3 |
| 21:08.22 | toxygen | Cyberware Digitizer Data |
| 21:08.22 | toxygen | NAME=marian3 |
| 21:08.22 | toxygen | DATE=Wed Dec 31 16:00:00 1969 |
| 21:08.22 | toxygen | SPACE=CYLINDRICAL |
| 21:08.28 | toxygen | any idea what format is this? |
| 21:09.48 | yukonbob | giyf :) |
| 21:11.37 | toxygen | well, it looks like proprietary format, i just wanted to know whether it reminds you of anything... |
| 21:12.29 | toxygen | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:12.37 | toxygen | this is how i came across brlcad |
| 21:12.44 | toxygen | http://brlcad.org/overview.html |
| 21:12.53 | toxygen | that format is mentioned there |
| 21:13.26 | toxygen | so i would really really appreciate any hint, how to do it (or which utility to use) |
| 21:15.09 | starseeker | I'm stuck on Windows at the moment - check for any *-g commands that would use Cyberware file extensions |
| 21:16.56 | starseeker | cy or tmesh maybe? |
| 21:17.56 | yukonbob | toxygen: I don't know specfics of it -- brlcad (the person) is usually here, and is _very_ well versed with BRL-CAD (the program) specfically and how it fits w/i "CAD" and interoperates -- he's probably your best bet... |
| 21:18.12 | yukonbob | hey starseeker :) |
| 21:18.19 | starseeker | howdy yukonbob |
| 21:18.24 | yukonbob | what's shaking? |
| 21:18.38 | starseeker | another day, another dollar |
| 21:18.57 | yukonbob | another 8h contract, and 32hours spent :) |
| 21:19.30 | yukonbob | bbiab |
| 21:20.46 | starseeker | OK, I see it in the src tree - it looks like cy-g may be the command name |
| 21:51.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30115 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (mappedfile.c temp.c): Mods to get things working on windows with the latest common.h mods. |
| 21:55.10 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30116 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (bw-pix.c bwmod.c pix-bw.c pixmatte.c): Mods to get things working on windows with the latest common.h mods. |
| 21:56.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30117 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (do.c viewedge.c): Open up the command options on windows. |
| 21:58.01 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30118 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fb/fb-pix.c: Mods to get things working on windows. |
| 21:58.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30119 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (incrTcl/itcl/generic/itclInt.h tcl/generic/tclInt.h): Mods to get things working on windows. |
| 22:14.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30120 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Initial check-in. |
| 22:18.09 | *** part/#brlcad starseeker (n=CYapp@85.muba.balt.washdctt.dsl.att.net) | |
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| 22:20.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30121 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: Add new files to dist |
| 22:36.07 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30122 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/PictureTypeF.itcl: Fixed a few of my own sloppy typos. |
| 22:46.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30123 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Mods to copy rtwizard.bat to installDir. |
| 22:47.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30124 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libtcl/libtcl.vcproj: Updates related to latest Tcl. |
| 22:52.34 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30125 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Added bw2pix, bwmod, pix2bw and pixmatte. |
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| 23:22.02 | brlcad | toxygen: marian3 does look like a cy/cyberware data file |
| 23:22.15 | brlcad | basically it's a 3d point cloud from a laser scanner |
| 23:22.40 | brlcad | usually a horrible format for most purposes without lots and lot of data processing/cleanup |
| 23:23.28 | brlcad | it's not bringing it into an ideal brl-cad primitive, will come in as an ARS which is a faceted/waterline solid type in brl-cad |
| 23:24.00 | brlcad | give the converter a try, from there you should be able to convert to a number of other formats once its in .g format |
| 00:00.27 | yukonbob | *brlcad, even |
| 00:19.25 | toxygen | brlcad: still alive? |
| 00:19.32 | toxygen | i was able to make .g from it |
| 00:19.40 | toxygen | i loaded it into mged |
| 00:19.45 | toxygen | i see the red lines |
| 00:19.49 | toxygen | but cannot render them |
| 00:20.01 | toxygen | how to make .obj from it? |
| 02:42.49 | starseeker | Try the g-obj command |
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| 03:52.36 | brlcad | toxygen: cannot render? |
| 03:55.33 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 04:10.41 | brlcad | toxygen: if you see the red lines, then you should be able to render.. try "rt -F/dev/Xl" in the command window .. should pop up a window with a rendering |
| 04:30.47 | ``Erik | or click "file", then "raytrace" and play with that |
| 07:21.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30126 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/tie_define.h: eep, wth is DOUBLE_PRECISION? quell warning and make it TIE_DOUBLE_PRECISION. |
| 07:59.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30127 10/brlcad/trunk/ (32 files in 11 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 07:59.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: accept markus elfring's sf patch [ 1864112 ] "Improve const-correctness" where |
| 07:59.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: data items that are const are so annotated. while there are undoubtedly hundred |
| 07:59.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: (if not thousands) of such cases across the codebase, he provided a patch for |
| 07:59.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: several dozen that were in adrt, fbed, lgt, nirt, burst, and remrt. patch was |
| 07:59.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: half manually applied as too much had already changed since the 7.10.4 source |
| 07:59.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: release it was based off of. credit him with thanks for finally making a proper |
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| 14:21.30 | ``Erik | just breaks things? :) |
| 14:36.52 | Z80-Boy | I reckon BRL-CAD could be ideal for machine-generated kinematic animations |
| 14:37.18 | Z80-Boy | For example write a program that would take a music .mp3, break down into 7 frequency bands and animate 7 dancing figures |
| 14:37.40 | Z80-Boy | Then output them in BRL-CAD format, render with rt, encode into a video and add the original tune as a soundtrack. |
| 14:37.51 | ``Erik | hrm, it's kinda weak in animation stuff, though... |
| 14:38.02 | Z80-Boy | what do you mean? |
| 14:38.29 | Z80-Boy | The program would output it in .g frame by frame |
| 14:38.29 | Z80-Boy | For that a simple rt call suffices |
| 14:38.43 | ``Erik | well, like we don't have any ik type arrangement or any "keyframe" or I think bezier curve animation like a lot of packages do |
| 14:38.46 | Z80-Boy | I mean actually in asc and call asc2g to every frame |
| 14:38.57 | ``Erik | ohhhh, a seperate top for each frame? eck |
| 14:38.57 | Z80-Boy | bezier? |
| 14:38.58 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:39.03 | ``Erik | yeah, like uhhhhh |
| 14:39.04 | Z80-Boy | OMG dancing people behave by bezier curves? |
| 14:39.17 | Z80-Boy | Come on, this is for cheapo consumer grade Autocad-like packages :) |
| 14:39.19 | ``Erik | no, it's just a convenient way to do a path |
| 14:39.26 | Z80-Boy | We're like serious oldschoor |
| 14:39.34 | Z80-Boy | oldschool |
| 14:39.36 | ``Erik | dancing people would need some kinda ik to position limbs correctly |
| 14:39.37 | ``Erik | hrmmm |
| 14:39.42 | Z80-Boy | ik == ? |
| 14:39.47 | Z80-Boy | inverse kinematic? |
| 14:39.49 | ``Erik | bezier path the hands/feet/head and ik it together? |
| 14:39.50 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 14:40.33 | Z80-Boy | One can make them rubber |
| 14:40.41 | Z80-Boy | elastic |
| 14:40.49 | Z80-Boy | bouncing all around that's computationally inexpensive |
| 14:41.19 | ``Erik | I d'no, spring&weight systems and ik systems can be done pretty cheap |
| 14:41.47 | ``Erik | I mean, old "unreal tournament 2003" did both interactively while running a game on reasonably low powered hardware, the "ragdoll physics" |
| 14:42.19 | Z80-Boy | then put some venetian blind window and cast shadows on them |
| 14:42.23 | Z80-Boy | To show how mighty we are |
| 14:51.52 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matt@74.86.45.130) | |
| 15:13.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30128 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (4 files in 2 dirs): fix const-incorrectness (shouldn't mark things const when they're changed) |
| 15:13.39 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30129 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/display.h: missing const |
| 15:19.28 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30130 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/prnt.c: minor casting fixes to quell warnings... |
| 15:19.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30131 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/fbed.c: need the length for snprintf... |
| 15:22.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30132 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: cast to quell warnings |
| 15:23.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30133 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vdeck/vdeck.c: quell cast size mismatch warning on 64b builds |
| 15:30.26 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30134 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/rtwizard.bat: Initial check-in. |
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| 17:04.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30135 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/display.c: prototype fix for building w/o sdl |
| 17:16.33 | brlcad | ``Erik: so is python gone from adrt? |
| 17:16.43 | brlcad | i didn't see an isst_python.* |
| 17:19.11 | ``Erik | aum, at the moment |
| 17:19.43 | ``Erik | tim gave me a wad that has a lower level python binding |
| 17:20.08 | ``Erik | and, uh, in reading this 'bug', I see what you mean about the troll |
| 17:33.27 | Z80-Boy | This channel is so intelligent |
| 17:33.31 | Z80-Boy | Compared to some others... |
| 17:33.53 | ``Erik | heh, sorry, we can try to be more like #skateboardstoners or #pokemon if that'd make you more comfortable |
| 17:34.02 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:34.22 | Z80-Boy | NO I mean like intelligent = better |
| 17:34.38 | Z80-Boy | Like sometimes they label me a troll just because I have a minority opinion |
| 17:34.44 | Z80-Boy | Or because I have a lengthy discussion |
| 17:35.02 | ``Erik | opinions and discussions are good |
| 17:35.11 | ``Erik | pointing out obvious stuff in an insulting fashion is not |
| 17:36.33 | Z80-Boy | Never heard about that :) |
| 17:36.43 | ``Erik | (though it might kinda be a cultural thing, I've seen more than a couple german code weenies come off like that) |
| 17:37.00 | Z80-Boy | Banning insulting people always ends up like in the football |
| 17:37.20 | Z80-Boy | If you want to annoy someone then you act like having been insulted and this way you can make him get punished quite reliably |
| 17:42.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30136 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): remove SDL and python shtuff. |
| 17:47.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30137 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/scripts/shiva.sh: trivial script depends on hosts, other unpublished scripts and old binary names... let's just can it. |
| 17:48.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30138 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/scripts/Makefile.am: trivial script depends on hosts, other unpublished scripts and old binary names... let's just can it. |
| 17:49.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30139 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/Makefile.am: add scripts/ to subdirs |
| 18:11.22 | *** part/#brlcad starseeke1 (n=CYapp@85.muba.balt.washdctt.dsl.att.net) | |
| 18:24.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30140 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/ (355 files in 17 dirs): upgrade to tk 8.5.0 release |
| 19:27.24 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30141 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/ (MGEDpage.itk PictureTypeE.itcl PictureTypeF.itcl): Mods to fix getting/setting/using ghost intensity. |
| 19:32.20 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30142 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/rtwizard.tcl: Mods to activate the image and help menus. Also handling WM_DELETE_WINDOW protocol so bwish is not left hanging around. |
| 19:35.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30143 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/Wizard.itk: Initially the Image and Help menus are disabled. Added activeMenu method. |
| 19:38.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30144 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/DbPage.itk: The OK button is now disabled until a file is selected. Added the activateOKButton method. |
| 19:40.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30145 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/rtwizard.bat: Mods to handle an argument. |
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| 19:50.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30146 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libbu/Makefile.am librt/Makefile.am proc-db/Makefile.am): improved dependancy handling |
| 19:51.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30147 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: set openNURBS to auto |
| 19:51.22 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30148 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/Makefile.defs: echo dependancy name before recursing |
| 19:52.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30149 10/brlcad/trunk/include/wdb.h: minor re-arrangement of metaball point in anticipation of line controls |
| 20:04.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30150 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/rtwizard/lib/DbPage.itk: Minor improvements to the activateOKButton method. |
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| 22:56.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30151 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: needs to ignore the .svn dir too |
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| 08:21.01 | toxygen | brlcad: thx for hints |
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| 09:49.09 | brlcad | well that should take care of the space problem |
| 09:49.32 | brlcad | server was accummulating nearly 400GB/day in backups and logging data |
| 09:49.37 | brlcad | moreso backups |
| 09:49.52 | brlcad | er, s/GB/MB/ |
| 09:51.02 | brlcad | maxing out just before the beginning of a month (e.g. now) when the mysql backups get rotated .. was using nearly 12GB just for one db alone |
| 10:01.13 | archivist | at least you have backups, it #mysql its amazing how many do not "how do i get my data back?" |
| 10:01.20 | archivist | it/in |
| 10:07.53 | brlcad | yeah, it's all good .. it was just a big excessive for that one db |
| 10:08.41 | brlcad | changed it's profile so it'll only backup every three days now, so it'll only use about 3GB in a given month for the level 0's before they're condensed to a level 1 monthly |
| 10:08.51 | brlcad | er, level 0 monthly |
| 10:09.02 | brlcad | daily to monthly |
| 10:09.12 | brlcad | it's late/early, I know what I mean at least :) |
| 10:13.32 | archivist | we often recomend replication which can be used as a continuous backup (hot slave) and then backup the slave |
| 10:14.02 | archivist | a mysql nicety |
| 10:16.48 | brlcad | yeah, that would be a nice thing to do for the server in germany |
| 10:16.59 | brlcad | maybe after the migration completes |
| 10:18.21 | brlcad | that's been part of the idea since that server's entire purpose is to (eventually) be a semi-hot-swap backup for bz should it be needed |
| 10:19.24 | brlcad | like to perform an OS upgrade, just update DNS, backup server is on-line responding while old is worked on picking up where it left off |
| 10:19.58 | brlcad | hoping to get fully symmetric backups for that (and not just mysql), maybe pipe dream but still tbd depending on the effort |
| 10:27.51 | brlcad | toxygen: you're welcome -- how're things working out? were you able to get the cy data file imported and ray-traced? |
| 10:39.53 | brlcad | toxygen: I saw the .g you uploaded... that sure doesn't look right to say the least. their format may have changed, I'll see if I can play with your data files this weekend |
| 10:40.18 | brlcad | is there any difference between 1, 2, and 3? |
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| 13:04.58 | toxygen | brlcad: thank you very much |
| 13:54.52 | ``Erik | hummm, my rdbms's are all single instnace dealies, I have the backign files marked "no-backup", and my nightly backup script does a database dump into a file before running dump |
| 13:55.50 | ``Erik | chflags nodump on bsd, um, linux uses some like chattr command with cryptic letter codes iirc |
| 13:56.18 | ``Erik | nodump on the files that shouldn't be backed up saves a LOT in space :) |
| 14:08.14 | brlcad | I backup offsite, I have absolute no space problems there -- the problem was local mysqldump backups where there are dailies for the current month and monthlies for all prior months |
| 14:08.49 | brlcad | the mysql backups were what has been filling the disks .. one of the db's has a ton of data |
| 14:09.09 | ``Erik | ah, I overwrite my sql dump file |
| 14:09.11 | brlcad | even with a ton of data, that just all goes offsite without a problem |
| 14:09.52 | ``Erik | still no point in moving a lot of the larger unnecessary files, like the binary mysql files when you have ascii dumps handy *shrug* |
| 14:09.53 | brlcad | offsite is at home, I can just buy extra TB as I need it |
| 14:10.15 | ``Erik | speaking of, I should probably buy another disk, I'm getting crunched again |
| 14:12.14 | brlcad | probably would be, but I don't really worry about it -- I just have it sync the entire fs, /dev and all, periodically |
| 14:12.46 | brlcad | more practical (to me) than running dump as the files are just sitting on the remote and can be reviewed/restored really easily |
| 14:13.23 | ``Erik | ah, I tend to dump and pipe through bzip2, so I have a good history |
| 14:13.33 | ``Erik | I've had people whine that they over-wrote a file a week ago and need the old version b ack |
| 14:15.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30152 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/ (10 files in 5 dirs): these files don't exist in tk8.5.0 |
| 14:16.20 | brlcad | was stashing configure and a few other gen'd files intentional? |
| 14:16.43 | ``Erik | no |
| 14:17.25 | ``Erik | cleaning things up now |
| 14:17.26 | brlcad | and yeah, I really don't care about those whiners, their low-level f'ups are their own issues .. I just care about easy non-invasive data-preserving high-level backups |
| 14:17.39 | brlcad | k |
| 14:19.10 | ``Erik | svn holds things different, so my old cvs fu doesn't work the same |
| 14:19.26 | alex_joni | brlcad: seen rsnapshot? |
| 14:19.28 | brlcad | toxygen's .g file with an ARS is either taking hours to prep or is stuck in an infinite loop .. 3 hours and counting now |
| 14:19.55 | ``Erik | O.o interesting |
| 14:20.37 | brlcad | alex_joni: no I hadn't, that is a bit interesting.. and familiar *ahem* |
| 14:21.30 | brlcad | but only tinglingly interesting.. that would safe size on the remote, but that's utterly low on the list of things that need improving |
| 14:21.54 | ``Erik | yeah, need to do server migration first O:-) |
| 14:22.16 | brlcad | just having a full fs copy is what is needed 9/10ths of the time a file/dir needs restoring |
| 14:22.23 | brlcad | yeah, maybe with new server, give it a go |
| 14:24.02 | ``Erik | I'd say "it's ok, she'll come back next time you're asleep", but knowing you, it's probably a code dream |
| 14:28.05 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874023.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 14:29.59 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:39.23 | alex_joni | brlcad: it saved me getting to know rsync & co.. setup was painless (on a new install) |
| 14:47.41 | ``Erik | <-- is a luddite, likes dump/restore :( |
| 14:48.04 | ``Erik | (and 'interactive restore' is nice) |
| 15:06.39 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30153 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (load.c load.h slave.c): begin abstracting the load path |
| 15:54.26 | brlcad | howdy Maloeran |
| 15:54.52 | Maloeran | Fine fine, I'm presently in Venezuela, it's a bit tricky to stay connected on a regular basis |
| 15:55.10 | Maloeran | Since a laptop is worth about an year's income here, it's not something you want to take out too openly, and wireless internet networks don't exist |
| 15:55.49 | Maloeran | I'm also trying to commit a huge piece of code and Survice's CVS server keeps throwing me "waiting for cvs's lock in ..." |
| 15:56.15 | Maloeran | How are things in your region of the universe? |
| 16:05.51 | ``Erik | hah, greetings, mal |
| 16:06.59 | ``Erik | ("the dead" is already plural, no s... english sucks) |
| 16:07.34 | Maloeran | Oh. :) I'm more busy with learning spanish these days |
| 16:07.58 | Maloeran | Grah, stupid cvs lock thing |
| 16:08.14 | Maloeran | All right, I'm off to climb a 5000m mountain |
| 16:08.29 | ``Erik | later, dude, don't fall off :) |
| 16:08.35 | Maloeran | :) *waves* |
| 16:10.13 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@210-11-146-161.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 16:51.23 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 17:12.02 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30154 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/librender/component.c: use the adrt.h mesh defines instead of libcommon/adrt_common.h |
| 17:13.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30155 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libcommon/Makefile.am: don't build libcommon |
| 17:23.37 | brlcad | Maloeran: va bien, que haces en Venezuela? por que estas alli? vacciones? |
| 17:28.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30156 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/Makefile.am: don't use libcommon |
| 17:30.08 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30157 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/rtarea.1: separate names with a newline |
| 17:33.23 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30158 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/unix/configure: remove generated configure |
| 17:53.57 | ``Erik | oh, heh |
| 17:54.02 | ``Erik | I got a bunch of stuff in tk that I svn rm'd |
| 17:54.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30159 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (28 files in 7 dirs): use libbu's memory management routines |
| 17:55.23 | ``Erik | sync |
| 17:55.23 | ``Erik | ls |
| 17:55.26 | ``Erik | bahhh |
| 18:00.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30160 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/image.c: allow the save_ppm func to build (used in isst) |
| 18:15.34 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.113.211) | |
| 18:16.57 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-77-242.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:27.50 | *** join/#brlcad Gruni (n=gruni@rootgeek.org) | |
| 18:28.50 | ``Erik | uh |
| 18:29.08 | ``Erik | wow |
| 18:43.57 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30161 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/tie_kdtree.c: fixed a couple random crash bugs, improved memory manage messages, etc |
| 19:10.14 | Maloeran | brlcad, ya que trabajo a distancia, viajo un poco para ver el mundo. Vivir aqui esta mas barato que Montreal, includido los tickets de avion |
| 19:10.57 | Maloeran | I begun learning spanish a month ago ( but very intensively ), I'm amazed by how easy it is to learn a language |
| 19:12.10 | ``Erik | I know in US highschools, spanish is "the easiest" foreign language class and french is historically thought of as "the hardest" |
| 19:12.35 | ``Erik | (though japanese and chinese are showing up more and more, and the different writing systems add a dimension of complexity) |
| 19:12.47 | Maloeran | I don't think the spanish grammar is really easier than french, they are somewhat similar actually |
| 19:13.50 | Maloeran | It's amusing how they use certain tenses which, in french, are exclusively found in elaborate litterature... and vice-versa |
| 19:14.08 | ``Erik | both have distant ties to latin *shrug* |
| 19:14.35 | Maloeran | Bah, I'm really tired of these CVS lock errors |
| 19:14.48 | ``Erik | moreso than english, which has heavy influences from german and gaelic |
| 19:15.07 | Maloeran | I think that whenever I ctrl+c a cvs commit, because I forgot to add a file or whatever, the cvs server gets stuck because some "lock" file was not removed |
| 19:15.10 | ``Erik | someone probably has to shell into the cvs server and remove the lock files manually |
| 19:15.13 | Maloeran | And I have to yell at Survice until things work again |
| 19:15.42 | ``Erik | fire code? or rayfarce? |
| 19:16.02 | Maloeran | Rayfarce, we are supposed to ship some binaries to Disney soon |
| 19:16.19 | ``Erik | you should put it in the BRL-CAD repository, well maintained, accessable, using subversion now... :D |
| 19:16.20 | ``Erik | *duck* |
| 19:16.38 | Maloeran | Eheh :) |
| 19:17.48 | Maloeran | That's really a stupid bug if the cvs server can not handle a broken connection, a ctr+c or whatever else |
| 19:23.52 | Maloeran | Die cvs, go join your friends autoconf and libtool and die! |
| 19:24.16 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:26.15 | Maloeran | Rayfarce is pretty much Linux, BSD and Windows only now |
| 19:28.37 | Maloeran | With 3000 lines of amd64/SSE3 assembly among other things... :) |
| 19:28.41 | ``Erik | obviously :D |
| 19:28.51 | ``Erik | and I imagine windows requires cygwin, not mingw32 |
| 19:28.59 | Maloeran | Ah no, it runs in mingw32 |
| 19:29.02 | ``Erik | otherwise autoconf/libtool would be hugely beneficial |
| 19:29.04 | ``Erik | :) |
| 19:29.06 | Maloeran | With pthreads-win32 |
| 19:29.56 | Maloeran | It also uses its own "cpuconf" tool which probes the processor to get the size of the caches, the cache width, instruction timing, etc. |
| 19:30.15 | Maloeran | cache line width, that is |
| 19:30.28 | ``Erik | hm, I thought windows (nt4.0 and later) had a pthread implementation (but not exposed in any headers, and with minor name munging) |
| 19:30.57 | Maloeran | Ah possibly, I just used pthreads-win32 |
| 19:31.36 | ``Erik | <-- still waits to see it go open source :) vagually recalls something in some contract somewhere about that ... O:-) |
| 19:32.37 | Maloeran | True, Lee and Mark agreed on something else in the end |
| 19:33.13 | ``Erik | hehehe, but that was verbal, so the paper over-rides it... :D |
| 19:34.22 | Maloeran | Eh well. It could be fun to get into some parternship with Disney on this |
| 19:36.04 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30162 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (master/Makefile.am slave/Makefile.am): rename isst_{master,slave} to adrt_... since it's now generalized |
| 19:36.26 | ``Erik | meanwhile I'm stuck with this O.o :D |
| 19:37.01 | Maloeran | Aw :) |
| 19:37.47 | Maloeran | The CVS change log I had written is so huge, I just want.. to... commit... |
| 19:44.57 | ``Erik | heh, later dude :) |
| 20:03.49 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30163 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/load.c: now approaching critical ugliness |
| 21:08.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30164 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/librt/dg_obj.c src/mged/rtif.c): |
| 21:08.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: get/check the exit code of the process so that rt doesn't just say it completed. |
| 21:08.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: have it report that it failed if the return status is non-zero. mods include |
| 21:08.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the calls for windows so needs some testing. implemented in response to user |
| 21:08.41 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: confusion over failed rt runs that die early or never start and having mged say |
| 21:08.45 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: they completd. |
| 21:08.57 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874023.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:09.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30165 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): |
| 21:09.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: make openNURBS a build requirement, so we have to either build it or use a |
| 21:09.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: system openNURBS library now .. will need to test/fix compilations on other |
| 21:09.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: platforms but this does hopefully fix some of the linux build problems john was |
| 21:09.41 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: seeing on ubuntu. |
| 21:52.33 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30166 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/Makefile.am: update dependancy |
| 21:55.26 | brlcad | tclcad depends on blt? |
| 21:55.36 | brlcad | oh, Blt_Init maybe? |
| 21:56.10 | brlcad | in that case, also depends on tcl, tk, itcl, itk |
| 21:57.05 | ``Erik | those're handled recursively I think |
| 21:57.35 | ``Erik | adding blt fixed the compile error (make clean ; cd target ; make depends all) |
| 21:58.20 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 21:58.25 | brlcad | just curious |
| 22:01.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30167 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: parker has made mods to the intensity handling for ghosted images, the main display no longer displays the extra/premature/misleading menu options (Edit, Steps) |
| 22:02.12 | ``Erik | heh |
| 22:02.14 | ``Erik | pimp my cad |
| 22:14.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30168 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: parker also added/ported several missing framebuffer tools including those needed by archer. includes bw-pix, bwmod, pix-bw, pixmatte. probably others. |
| 22:53.41 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 23:42.21 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:56.17 | brlcad | such a great presentation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSFDm3UYkeE |
| 02:44.36 | yukonbob | eta 50minutes -- :P |
| 02:47.07 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:47.31 | brlcad | it's worth it if you've not seen it and you participate in an open source project's community |
| 02:47.40 | brlcad | (which you do) :) |
| 02:47.46 | yukonbob | hey -- saw the books, and the notes :) -- thx |
| 02:48.27 | brlcad | ben and brian are pretty well spoken, some fairly straightforward points, some obvious, some not so obvious -- but they put labels and emphasis to some behaviors that is useful ;) |
| 02:48.37 | brlcad | really? |
| 02:49.10 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-094-019.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 02:49.11 | brlcad | yukon up in .ca ? |
| 02:49.16 | yukonbob | yup |
| 02:49.29 | brlcad | nifty -- you work there or live there or something? |
| 02:50.33 | yukonbob | that's where Whitehorse is -- living -- not too much for work up here for me, so I'm an online geek -- "working" in/with Vancouver, Seattle, Toronto, UK, Australia... |
| 02:50.55 | brlcad | nice |
| 02:52.38 | yukonbob | my gf brought us up this time -- she's a cultural anthropologist doing her fieldwork up here... |
| 02:53.11 | brlcad | being able to telework from anywhere has to have some major perks |
| 02:54.35 | yukonbob | well, it makes it possible ;) -- it really is pretty impressive, though... I remember my first 'puter (Vic20), and introduction of faxes, BBSs, internet, etc. -- surely impressive how far we've come along -- and at same time, what's stuck around -- ia32 architecture, *nix... BRL-CAD ;) |
| 02:55.51 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:56.09 | yukonbob | Tcl ;) |
| 02:56.15 | brlcad | i'd say good things die hard, but then that doesn't explain ia32 :) |
| 02:56.30 | yukonbob | ya -- it's a notable odd-duck in that list... |
| 02:56.48 | brlcad | duck duck duck *goose*! |
| 02:57.35 | ``Erik | dos/windows |
| 02:57.40 | ``Erik | mice |
| 02:57.42 | ``Erik | ... |
| 02:57.55 | ``Erik | bad things die hard, too :D |
| 02:58.36 | ``Erik | hehehe, bbs's... hayes 300baud modems on the card type rs232 |
| 02:58.39 | ``Erik | pheer |
| 02:58.56 | ``Erik | so badass, you don't even need an audio coupler and telephone to log into the bbs's! |
| 02:59.27 | yukonbob | howdy ``Erik :) |
| 02:59.54 | ``Erik | http://www.zimmers.net/cbmpics/cbm/modems/1670.gif |
| 03:00.06 | ``Erik | <-- had one of those, and a 300 that looked the same but had a black slide switch on the top |
| 03:01.27 | ``Erik | heh |
| 03:01.28 | ``Erik | uhhhh |
| 03:01.36 | ``Erik | compuserve ? uhhh, qlink? |
| 03:02.23 | ``Erik | poke 53280,0 |
| 03:02.27 | ``Erik | poke 53281,0 |
| 03:02.31 | ``Erik | leet hackr commodore now |
| 03:02.39 | yukonbob | hey, leave my screen alone! |
| 03:02.43 | ``Erik | :D |
| 03:02.44 | yukonbob | top item -- |
| 03:02.56 | ``Erik | those were usually the firt two commands I did on start |
| 03:03.44 | ``Erik | me too |
| 03:03.50 | ``Erik | on a c64 actually |
| 03:03.53 | yukonbob | yup |
| 03:04.26 | yukonbob | on vic20, I changed char sets to the "double-tall" and re-bitmapped them... that was the extent of my "leet" hacking... |
| 03:04.39 | yukonbob | oh -- and filling kb buffer to autoload programs |
| 03:05.15 | ``Erik | heh, I remember putting a joystick routine into the isr vector, don't remember what I ddi with it |
| 03:05.26 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 03:05.36 | ``Erik | and things like incrementing the background color registers |
| 03:07.18 | ``Erik | heh "the hare club for men" |
| 03:08.08 | yukonbob | (lightpens read light, don't emit) |
| 03:08.11 | ``Erik | hehehe, I had a light pen, too... always seemed twitchy |
| 03:08.23 | ``Erik | and the mouse I had was crap |
| 03:09.37 | yukonbob | then of course moved to Amiga (more awesome), and then PC's, and luckily, Linux very early on... |
| 03:12.42 | brlcad | compuserve ftw! |
| 03:22.20 | ``Erik | heh, I clung to my commodores until '96 when I had a ~6mo bout of windows, then immediately fled to linux |
| 03:24.54 | yukonbob | A2000, A3000 -- shoulda kept A500 -- cute machine |
| 03:26.04 | yukonbob | from an era when machines were cool... |
| 03:27.26 | louipc | are bananas expensive in the yukon? |
| 03:28.34 | yukonbob | louipc: I was just in Crowsnest Pass (s. of Calgary) and remember picking up Milk in a gas station for $5-something -- and same size up here in grocery store (where you'd expect cheaper) was $6-something... |
| 03:29.00 | yukonbob | expect cheaper == gas station vs. grocery store... |
| 03:29.57 | yukonbob | though, around Calgary is a weird economy anyway -- oil is doing very well, and everything is inflated... |
| 03:30.03 | louipc | yea some of those convenience stores offer cheaper milk |
| 03:30.28 | yukonbob | Whitehorse can still be an expensive place to be -- I much prefer Toronto... :) |
| 03:31.04 | yukonbob | though, Whitehorse has better fishing |
| 03:31.40 | louipc | hah yeah you can't eat lake ontario fish |
| 03:32.57 | yukonbob | fishing in Whitehorse/Alaska is best thing going for it for me... used to be the girls, but I've got a steady gf now, and a kid, so those days are over |
| 03:33.29 | yukonbob | s/Whitehorse/Yukon/ |
| 03:33.53 | louipc | whoa yukon for the girls eh? nice |
| 03:34.01 | yukonbob | yup -- it's worth a trip |
| 03:36.36 | louipc | Spring Break Yukon! |
| 03:36.49 | yukonbob | LOL -- look out Florida |
| 03:37.14 | yukonbob | speaking of Ottawa, /me wonders if he'll get to BSDCan this year... |
| 04:04.40 | ``Erik | bastage |
| 04:05.13 | *** join/#brlcad Winny (n=KyleVE@unaffiliated/winny) | |
| 04:05.25 | brlcad | mm. bsdcon |
| 04:05.45 | brlcad | if solid modeling wasn't in new york this year, I'd be inclined to press for either it or gamedev |
| 04:06.03 | ``Erik | bsdcon went away long ago |
| 04:06.13 | brlcad | sry, usenix |
| 04:06.15 | ``Erik | it's all bsdcan or nybug |
| 04:06.34 | ``Erik | <-- shakes fist at usenix for dropping bsdcon |
| 04:06.43 | brlcad | i saw it as absorbed into bsdcon, not dropped :) |
| 04:06.51 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 04:06.51 | brlcad | er, usenix |
| 04:06.53 | brlcad | damnits |
| 04:06.57 | *** join/#brlcad Winny8 (n=63f0fb6c@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 04:07.01 | ``Erik | bsdcon was part of usenix |
| 04:07.08 | ``Erik | like, "sponsored by" or something |
| 04:07.15 | ``Erik | and during it, iirc |
| 04:07.16 | Winny | brlcad, your CGI:IRC is broken. |
| 04:07.17 | brlcad | bsdcon "absorbed" into the greater usenix |
| 04:07.28 | brlcad | Winny: looks like it's working for you |
| 04:07.36 | ``Erik | kinda like the vatst/vis dealie |
| 04:07.40 | Winny | brlcad, I closed that windows 10 min ago. |
| 04:08.23 | brlcad | Winny: I reset apache about 10 min ago or so to reload a config .. that would have hosed cgi:irc connections |
| 04:09.10 | Winny | hmm, it wasn't connecting, so I closed the window, 10 min ago on my watch. |
| 04:09.24 | ``Erik | hopefully the next apache hiccup will involve new hw :D |
| 04:45.06 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 05:00.34 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 05:02.23 | yukonbob | interesting video |
| 05:40.05 | brlcad | yeah, good stuff |
| 08:14.13 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@rikers.org) | |
| 08:14.13 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
| 09:33.15 | Axman6 | you can do it! |
| 10:50.47 | brlcad | never! |
| 10:57.15 | brlcad | poolio: fyi, I'm presenting beset today, I'll see if I can get you a copy of the presentation I whipped up later |
| 11:09.19 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-094-019.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 15:12.13 | poolio | brlcad: wowza! shoulda told me, I had the start of a presentation lying around...Hope it goes well :) |
| 16:30.47 | *** join/#brlcad Lisper (n=Lisper@unaffiliated/lisper) | |
| 16:30.52 | Lisper | hi |
| 16:37.22 | *** join/#brlcad Lisper (n=Lisper@unaffiliated/lisper) | |
| 16:49.06 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548774AC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:00.32 | *** join/#brlcad Lisper (n=Lisper@unaffiliated/lisper) | |
| 17:28.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30169 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: |
| 17:28.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Added the following projects: asc2pix asc2nmg bot2bldxf bot2raw bot_shell2vtk |
| 17:28.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: cy2g dxf2g enf2g euclid_format euclid_unformat euclid2g g2acad g2adrt g2dxf |
| 17:28.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: g2euclid1 g2euclid g2nff g2nmg g2obj g2shellrect g2tankill g2var g2vrml g2x3d |
| 17:28.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: g42g5 g52g4 nastran2g nmg2bot nmg2rib nmg2sgp pix2asc ply2g poly2bot tankill-g |
| 17:28.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: vg2 |
| 17:45.55 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 17:46.34 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30170 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (dxf2g/dxf2g.vcproj g2dxf/g2dxf.vcproj): Upgraded to MSVC 8.0 |
| 17:47.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30171 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (66 files in 33 dirs): Initial check-in. |
| 18:02.58 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30172 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/viewpoint2g/ (. viewpoint2g.vcproj): Initial check-in. |
| 18:54.44 | louipc | holy shite |
| 18:57.23 | yukonbob | poolio: beset is your contribution, right? |
| 19:34.36 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548774AC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 19:36.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30173 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: Added a few project files to EXTRA_DIST. |
| 20:07.20 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548774AC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:14.27 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548774AC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:16.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30174 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Included fcntl.h and added a few #define. |
| 20:16.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30175 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Added declaration for nmg_vlist_to_eu(). |
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| 21:05.57 | poolio | yukonbob: I suppose :] |
| 21:59.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30176 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (31 files): Mods to get things working on Windows. |
| 22:03.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30177 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Change uintXX_t #defines to typedefs. |
| 22:09.53 | ``Erik | "what makes you think we're andorian?" "well, you're too big to be a smurf" |
| 22:10.13 | poolio | I think you've lost it ``Erik |
| 22:11.03 | ``Erik | :D |
| 22:11.26 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30178 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/tclcad.c: On windows, include fcntl.h to quell warnings about O_BINARY macro redefinition. |
| 22:12.57 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30179 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: Remove unnecessary includes. |
| 23:13.50 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30180 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/dg_obj.c: Added missing retcode in the windows section. |
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| 02:05.17 | ``Erik | once again, incremental backups have saved my hind |
| 02:05.33 | ``Erik | (mental note; update on a large table with no 'where' clause is bad) |
| 02:07.31 | ``Erik | O.o I thrashed a web page database |
| 02:37.11 | yukonbob | :) |
| 02:37.51 | yukonbob | kinda like "rm -fr / home/erik/foo" as root |
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| 04:32.06 | PrezKennedy | so i dont think accounting will be sending me a christmas card this year |
| 04:32.54 | PrezKennedy | i only hosed them up for 6 hours the past 2 days... plenty of time for them to master minesweeper at least |
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| 14:27.49 | ``Erik | wow, my freshmeat 'changes' chunk went through without editing |
| 14:42.32 | ``Erik | http://www.xkcd.com/ |
| 14:42.39 | ``Erik | "real programmers use..." |
| 15:08.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30181 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/image.c: PPM save support |
| 15:08.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30182 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/ (Makefile.am image.c image.h): libbu is now responsible for saving images |
| 15:34.14 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30183 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/image.c): change image data type to be unsigned |
| 15:40.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30184 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bwdiff.c: use bu_exit() instead of bu_log (I think that's what was intended) |
| 15:42.24 | Maloeran | Eheh, nice comic |
| 15:43.18 | Maloeran | And woohoo, the commit went through finally. +30000 lines, -13000 lines, you could say it was about time |
| 15:44.07 | ``Erik | heh, saw the email O.o :) |
| 15:44.21 | Maloeran | :) |
| 15:52.27 | Maloeran | Oh erik, any idea how other OSes will react to mmap()ing gigabytes of read-only memory? |
| 15:52.47 | ``Erik | um, archaic ones might freak out |
| 15:52.53 | Maloeran | The idea is just to reserve big chunks of consecutive addresses for further uses, of course |
| 15:52.53 | ``Erik | windows will probably flip |
| 15:53.05 | Maloeran | Oh? It's a free operation on Linux obviously |
| 15:53.23 | ``Erik | opensolaris and fbsd should be "right there", linux probably is ok with it after 2.6, |
| 15:53.30 | Maloeran | What about the other Unixes? |
| 15:53.37 | Maloeran | I see |
| 15:54.13 | Maloeran | I don't want OSes to try to reserve 128gb of swap space or something |
| 15:54.24 | Maloeran | As Linux would if the memory was initially read-write |
| 15:54.27 | ``Erik | mmap is a pretty trivial operation on any half-sane unix, the biggie is being able to address it |
| 15:54.34 | Maloeran | ( without MMAP_NORESERVE, etc. ) |
| 15:54.38 | ``Erik | yeah, linux is pretty stupid about swap management |
| 15:54.40 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 15:54.53 | ``Erik | the bsd family all does COW even on mmap'd stuff |
| 15:55.08 | Maloeran | COW? |
| 15:55.11 | ``Erik | so you can mmap a terabyte file with only 128 megs around |
| 15:55.13 | ``Erik | copy on write |
| 15:55.34 | Maloeran | Ah sure, so does Linux obviously |
| 15:55.50 | Maloeran | The point is that the OS may try to "garantee" that the memory exists, as it won't segfault when trying to access it |
| 15:55.56 | Maloeran | Hence reserving the swap space for it |
| 15:56.22 | ``Erik | hm, I've never actually seen an oom on bsd with mmap, and I do big mmaps on small machines |
| 15:56.34 | ``Erik | I've seen linux crap itself readily and badly in that kinda situation |
| 15:56.51 | ``Erik | (if it's mmap'd, it's backed by the FILE, so only a fucking retard would reserve swap space... typical linux, tho ;) |
| 15:56.53 | Maloeran | But I'm talking about a mmap that is not backed by any file |
| 15:56.57 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:57.03 | Maloeran | Like 128gb of MMAP_ANONYMOUS mmap |
| 15:57.03 | ``Erik | uh, what're you mmapping? |
| 15:57.18 | Maloeran | Nothing, just reserving memory space for further uses |
| 15:57.27 | ``Erik | hrm, I d'no, I don't use those |
| 15:57.41 | Maloeran | I need a big chunk of consecutive addresses and I have no idea how much of it I will actually use |
| 15:57.48 | ``Erik | have yet to see where they offer any advantage |
| 15:57.53 | Maloeran | Linux does not mind if I reserve a tetrabyte that way through mmap() |
| 15:58.18 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 15:58.35 | Maloeran | Any thoughts? |
| 15:58.35 | ``Erik | linux doesn't have memory management routines that cope with demands of contiguity? (is that a word, even?) |
| 15:58.49 | ``Erik | like, I'd use contigmalloc() on fbsd |
| 15:59.09 | Maloeran | Hum, no.. Not sure what that does |
| 15:59.36 | Maloeran | I do my own memory management anyway, but I need big chunks of packed addresses for certain things |
| 15:59.39 | ``Erik | (tho phkmalloc guarantees singly malloc'd chunks to be contiguous iirc.. no mmap hackery that opens up security holes out the wazoo) |
| 16:00.18 | ``Erik | you don't trust linux's LAB mapping? :) |
| 16:00.55 | Maloeran | That's not the point, the memory addresses *must* be tightly packed in the virtual memory space |
| 16:00.56 | ``Erik | so just malloc in multiples of page size |
| 16:01.22 | Maloeran | There's absolutely no garantee there |
| 16:01.55 | brlcad | korean in 30 |
| 16:02.28 | Maloeran | How do you think BSD will react if I mmap() 128gb of MMAP_ANONYMOUS read-only memory? |
| 16:03.02 | ``Erik | d'no, haven't tried it |
| 16:03.07 | ``Erik | don't you have a bsd machine? :) |
| 16:03.09 | Maloeran | Or does it offer any other mechanism to reserve a big chunk of virtual mapping? |
| 16:04.01 | Maloeran | Linux offers plenty of mechanisms to manage the virtual mapping, I was trying to find a Posix-compliant way with the mmap stuff, without using any Linux-specific options |
| 16:38.15 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30185 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: the bug of mged outright not working is no longer a problem |
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| 18:14.20 | ``Erik | <-- hasn't worried about big mem crap like that, doesn't know *shrug* |
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| 20:52.16 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30186 10/jbrlcad/trunk/ (14 files in 13 dirs): |
| 20:52.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Moved geometry, preppedGeometry, spacePartition, numerics, and samples |
| 20:52.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: directories to src directory. Moved test.asc file to test directory. |
| 21:00.31 | ``Erik | O.O |
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| 21:29.23 | ``Erik | leebert |
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| 22:06.20 | obfucius | Where can I submit a bug rep? |
| 22:07.19 | brlcad | http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=105292&atid=640802 |
| 22:07.41 | brlcad | more specifically, http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=add&group_id=105292&atid=640802 |
| 22:08.44 | iraytrace | evenin |
| 22:08.49 | brlcad | howdy |
| 22:09.15 | iraytrace | saw the jbrlcad commit. Way cool someone's working with it. |
| 22:09.59 | brlcad | a bit of a flurry regarding it over the past couple weeks |
| 22:11.33 | obfucius | no geometry display window is appearing in mged, but I think I might have to just compile with glx support because I'm running with an nvidia glx driver under linux |
| 22:12.25 | brlcad | obfucius: does the command window show up? |
| 22:15.07 | obfucius | well I'll run mged from the command line like %mged -n project.g and it asks wether I want to use nu, X, or ogl. I've tried both ogl and X but nothing happens. |
| 22:58.56 | yukonbob | obfucius: what's your platform? |
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| 00:44.29 | obfucius | oh, I'm running on a x86_64 notebook with opensuse 10.3 |
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| 05:47.00 | ``Erik | aa /blah |
| 06:57.04 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30187 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: cleanup and reorganize. organize/group together and annotate the various sections and the make note of the bogus defines that are really bad/counterproductive hacks. add fcntl.h too since it needed with io.h |
| 06:58.13 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30188 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h config_win.h): check for _MAX_PATH in bu.h |
| 06:59.00 | brlcad | Gruni: problems? |
| 07:44.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30189 10/brlcad/trunk/include/machine.h: meh |
| 07:46.01 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30190 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (42 files in 14 dirs): header cleanup, remove fcntl.h inclusions that don't seem to be needed |
| 08:16.38 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30191 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac src/nirt/nirt.c src/remrt/rtsrv.c): remove check for fcntl.h |
| 08:51.09 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30192 10/brlcad/trunk/ (63 files in 19 dirs): protect all of the unistd.h inclusions for portability |
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| 19:01.19 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 19:42.31 | brlcad | howdy |
| 19:43.27 | yukonbob | how's your day today? |
| 19:44.43 | brlcad | not half bad |
| 19:45.19 | brlcad | dragging a bit, but about to hit the gym hopefully to get some energy up |
| 19:50.50 | yukonbob | a business dude? |
| 19:51.34 | brlcad | sounds about as exciting as meeting an accountant |
| 19:53.48 | poolio | Macbook Air :) |
| 20:11.10 | brlcad | ahh |
| 20:11.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 20:20.46 | poolio | Poor guy. |
| 20:40.20 | brlcad | poolio: http://my.brlcad.org/Beset_Overview.pdf |
| 20:41.16 | brlcad | that was part of a bigger presentation given last week based on the work and your final report |
| 20:49.28 | poolio | Ahhh. My / is full and it won't download :o |
| 20:51.43 | yukonbob | poolio: rm -fr / |
| 20:52.04 | yukonbob | (please don't, if you don't get the joke ;) |
| 20:52.11 | yukonbob | ^--- pedantic, but... |
| 20:52.35 | poolio | yukonbob: heh, it worked, thanks! |
| 20:52.43 | yukonbob | np :) |
| 20:53.14 | yukonbob | poolio: are you a *nix weeny like the rest of us? |
| 20:54.59 | yukonbob | brlcad: good looking presentation :) |
| 20:59.39 | yukonbob | kewl |
| 21:01.02 | poolio | yukonbob: aye. although I almost converted to OS X :) still kind of a *nix? |
| 21:03.02 | poolio | brlcad: That is friggin awesome. |
| 21:03.09 | yukonbob | well -- considering Apple ponied-up and spent the $$ for testing (and passed) it's arguably more Unix than Linux or the *BSDs... I'm still a *BSD fan, though -- and I _like_ X |
| 21:04.55 | poolio | brlcad: I'm really really impressed. I'm sorry I didn't get to do it, but I doubt I could put together as nice a presentation :) |
| 21:06.07 | poolio | yukonbob: Yeah I have some friends who went from Linux -> Os X and really like it. I was considering etting a Macbook Air but I'm not so sure about that anymore... I've mainly just gotten sick of Linux/BSD/etc... because of all the extra work it takes to get thinks working that should just work in thef irst place. And now I no longer have massive amounts of time to tinker, and I just need things to work ... |
| 21:06.50 | yukonbob | "things to work" -- such as? |
| 21:07.49 | poolio | Video cards, peripherals, wireless drivers, etc.. |
| 21:08.19 | poolio | And sure, with time and effort you can get most things you want done, but it is much more difficult |
| 21:08.23 | poolio | (or atleast time consuming) |
| 21:09.18 | poolio | Take for example getting an ipod working or getting ATI cards working, yes there is software out there for the ipod, and you can get the ATI card working, but ... effort :P |
| 21:09.52 | poolio | And when I'm trying to get software running so I can finish a certain assignment on time... it may be those few minutes, hours, etc ... make a difference (that's a pretty far-fetched scenario but it happened to me last week) |
| 21:11.25 | yukonbob | well -- it's ea. person's experience that counts -- but I'm sticking w/ NetBSD :) |
| 21:15.12 | poolio | Heh, it's been ages since I've used NetBSD. |
| 21:21.41 | yukonbob | poolio: your 'beset' reminds me of http://www.sciencenews.org/articles/20010421/bob18.asp -- are there any similarities? |
| 21:22.57 | poolio | Just skimming it, it looks somewhat similar in the sense of packing shapes, but that's not exactly what beset is supposed to do (although that's one of the few things it can do right now) |
| 21:24.00 | poolio | It also seems to approach it with mroe standard algorithms, less crazy evolutionary mumbo jumbo |
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| 22:45.51 | toxygen | brlcad: hello |
| 22:45.53 | toxygen | alive? |
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| 00:22.21 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/workmode.png :) |
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| 02:03.14 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/rt.zip <---- whats this? |
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| 02:07.33 | IriX64 | :) |
| 03:07.03 | brlcad | toxygen: yes, hello |
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| 03:50.02 | Axman6 | ... |
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| 03:50.09 | Axman6 | Gruni: quit it! |
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| 03:51.36 | Winny | ...heh |
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| 03:54.13 | Axman6 | Gruni: wtf! |
| 03:54.25 | Axman6 | rawr |
| 03:54.37 | Winny | I agree |
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| 03:58.24 | Axman6 | Gruni! |
| 03:58.32 | Axman6 | fix your client@ |
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| 03:59.36 | Winny | my lord |
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| 04:00.28 | Axman6 | brlcad: can you do something about this? :( |
| 04:00.44 | Axman6 | like yell very loudly |
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| 04:07.18 | Axman6 | URGGGGGGGHH |
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| 04:19.15 | Winny | ... |
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| 04:22.44 | Axman6 | brlcad: yt? |
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| 05:36.00 | brlcad | bleh |
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| 05:36.19 | brlcad | Axman6: yeah, srry |
| 05:37.22 | *** mode/#brlcad [+b *!*gruni@rootgeek.org] by brlcad | |
| 05:37.35 | Winny | \o/ |
| 06:05.32 | Axman6 | phn#@pm? k? |
| 06:05.35 | Axman6 | >_> |
| 06:05.46 | Axman6 | wow, even i can't read that |
| 06:09.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30193 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 06:09.42 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: Bob added the rest of BRL-CAD's geometry converters for the Windows port. looks |
| 06:09.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: like it's all of them, or pretty close. he added asc2pix asc2nmg bot2bldxf |
| 06:09.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: bot2raw bot_shell2vtk cy2g dxf2g enf2g euclid_format euclid_unformat euclid2g |
| 06:09.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: g2acad g2adrt g2dxf g2euclid1 g2euclid g2nff g2nmg g2obj g2shellrect g2tankill |
| 06:09.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: g2var g2vrml g2x3d g42g5 g52g4 nastran2g nmg2bot nmg2rib nmg2sgp pix2asc ply2g |
| 06:09.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: poly2bot tankill-g viewpoint2g |
| 06:10.17 | Axman6 | nice |
| 06:12.26 | brlcad | they're asking that you give your phone number in a PM, k? :) |
| 06:12.34 | Axman6 | well done |
| 06:12.45 | Axman6 | though i'm not sure you should be proud of that |
| 06:12.51 | brlcad | heh |
| 06:13.11 | brlcad | see a *LOT* of that from the bzflag kiddies |
| 06:13.21 | Axman6 | haha, yeah i'd bet |
| 06:14.09 | Axman6 | t was a very odd day when i decided i wanted to build both brl-cad and bzflag on the same day, then came in here and found you |
| 06:14.32 | brlcad | sum a dem dont no how 2 tlk wif out da srtcuts |
| 06:14.58 | Winny | ausom sight on a scms |
| 06:15.41 | Axman6 | i swear, if apple don't make mds less crap, i'm gonna stab them |
| 06:53.04 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1088753968.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 09:26.21 | toxygen | brlcad: hello. i just wanted to ask whether you was lucky with converting that 3d cyberware scan to any format... |
| 12:10.18 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5487793C.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:03.58 | brlcad | toxygen: I'm actually still working on it |
| 13:04.34 | brlcad | I pretty much have a grasp of the problem, just writing and testing new code |
| 13:05.00 | brlcad | there are scan settings in that cy data file that we'd never encountered, so it's not accounting for it correctly |
| 13:38.22 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30194 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: quell warning about free shadowing free() |
| 13:50.07 | toxygen | brlcad: aha |
| 13:50.09 | toxygen | i see |
| 13:50.17 | toxygen | ok, good luck with it :) |
| 13:50.34 | toxygen | in case you suceed, could you please mail me to toxygen1@gmail.com? |
| 13:53.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30195 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: |
| 13:53.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: considerably revamp how the header is processed. make NAME be the name of the |
| 13:53.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: db object created. stash header lines as _GLOBAL attributes (probably belong on |
| 13:53.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: object, but close enough). improve error handling and supported header element |
| 13:53.37 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: processing. clean up the style and ws while we're at it. |
| 15:36.23 | ``Erik | a /det |
| 15:42.12 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-014-216.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
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| 17:06.17 | *** join/#brlcad EdSchouten (i=ed@palm.hoeg.nl) | |
| 17:06.18 | EdSchouten | hello |
| 17:06.40 | EdSchouten | i don't use BRL-CAD, so if i sound like an idiot, excuse me :P |
| 17:07.24 | EdSchouten | anyway: as you might know, there is a FreeBSD Port for brlcad, which means folks can easily install brlcad from the package manager |
| 17:07.38 | EdSchouten | i'm currently trying to convert as much applications as possible from the sgtty terminal interface to termios |
| 17:07.54 | brlcad | you're the guy that made that first patch? |
| 17:07.57 | EdSchouten | brlcad uses sgtty by default on freebsd. that's not the problem, because -DHAVE_XOPEN fixes this :) |
| 17:08.12 | EdSchouten | yep, but it only seemed to work on my testing machine, where there is no sgtty.h |
| 17:08.37 | EdSchouten | it turns out the #ifdef's in vas_io.c in the bottom are the opposite of the ones at the top, where we do the #include's |
| 17:09.18 | brlcad | iirc, this is all in jove, no? |
| 17:09.47 | EdSchouten | jove? |
| 17:10.09 | brlcad | ah, never mind |
| 17:10.19 | brlcad | that's in the vas4 ikonas driver interface |
| 17:10.33 | EdSchouten | well, the file is called vas_io.c |
| 17:10.47 | brlcad | er, lyon lamb vas4 animation controller |
| 17:11.03 | brlcad | yeah, sorry just getting patches confused |
| 17:11.08 | EdSchouten | np :) |
| 17:11.15 | brlcad | jove does some termios |
| 17:11.27 | EdSchouten | anyway: i've got a sort of hackish patch for FreeBSD, but i'll write something more generic for you folks |
| 17:11.36 | brlcad | okay, great |
| 17:12.13 | brlcad | need anything from our end? |
| 17:12.21 | EdSchouten | not really. :) |
| 17:12.31 | brlcad | the best kind of fixes :) |
| 17:17.55 | EdSchouten | http://junk.g-rave.nl/vas_io.c.diff <- still have to compile-test this |
| 17:18.06 | EdSchouten | brb -> food :) |
| 17:18.11 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30196 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/tcl.h: quell compilation shadow warnings |
| 17:30.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30197 10/brlcad/trunk/ (AUTHORS src/vas4/vas_io.c): apply a patch to vas4 from Ed Schouten (provided over IRC) that fixes an sgtty vs termios mixup in the # inclusion/define foo. |
| 17:31.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30198 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: quell float comparison and alloc type warnings, print the header line |
| 17:40.36 | EdSchouten | it worked? :P |
| 17:41.08 | brlcad | :) |
| 17:41.35 | brlcad | I don't have a vas4 device on hand any more to test it |
| 17:41.53 | brlcad | vas4 is actually a borderline dead chunk of code |
| 17:42.04 | brlcad | i was just now officially marking it as deprecated |
| 17:42.29 | brlcad | if someone is actually using it, they'll let us know and we'll hear if it's working :) |
| 17:42.38 | EdSchouten | :D |
| 17:42.44 | brlcad | otherwise it does compile without a hitch on a couple plats |
| 17:43.03 | EdSchouten | well, i would suspect you could already ditch the sgtty and termio code |
| 17:43.14 | EdSchouten | almost any UNIX-like system that was released after 1995 supports termios |
| 17:47.47 | brlcad | yeah, that tool was developed in the late 80's -- the arcane code is merely portability to ancient systems |
| 17:48.01 | EdSchouten | brlcad: woops - it seems i left some code in that patch that shouldn't have made it in |
| 17:48.04 | brlcad | most of brl-cad still compiles and runs on original 4.2 bsd, for example |
| 17:48.05 | EdSchouten | -vtty.c_oflag |= TAB3;/* output tab expansion ON */ |
| 17:48.06 | EdSchouten | +vtty.c_oflag |= OXTABS;/* output tab expansion ON */ |
| 17:48.24 | brlcad | what line? |
| 17:48.30 | EdSchouten | around 100 |
| 17:49.03 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30199 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/deprecation.txt src/vas4/vas4.1 src/vas4/vas4.c): officially mark vas4 for removal, deprecated as of the 7.12 release. if nobody complains or has a good reason for keeping it, the tool can be removed after a few minor releases. |
| 17:49.17 | EdSchouten | :D |
| 17:51.56 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30200 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vas4/vas_io.c: s/OXTABS/TAB3/ in the HAVE_TERMIOS_H section where tab expansion is turned on |
| 17:52.01 | brlcad | done |
| 17:52.28 | EdSchouten | thanks :) |
| 17:52.35 | brlcad | thank you |
| 17:52.56 | EdSchouten | this is one of the few applications where i managed to get my work committed |
| 17:53.12 | EdSchouten | a lot of applications which i ported to termios already seemed to be a little dead... :( |
| 17:53.37 | EdSchouten | anyway, have a fine day (or night) |
| 17:53.41 | EdSchouten | bye :-) |
| 17:53.45 | *** part/#brlcad EdSchouten (i=ed@palm.hoeg.nl) | |
| 18:14.17 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30201 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: |
| 18:14.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: add support for the rest of the cy header entities seen on a sample scan |
| 18:14.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: provided by toxygen (via irc). this includes detecting DATE, NAME, LGMIN, |
| 18:14.23 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: LGMAX, LGINCR, LTMIN, LTMAX, RMIN, RMAX, LGSHIFT, SCALE, and RPROP. (in addition |
| 18:14.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: to the others that were originally supported: NLT, LTINCR, RSHIFT, SPACE, NLG, |
| 18:14.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: and DATA) |
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| 00:11.43 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30202 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: stash everything into a var for now just in case we do try to use it, presume rprop is a radius scale factor and use 'scale' for the delta_z scale factor |
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| 01:02.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30203 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/openw.tcl: |
| 01:02.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: since the directory is being pulled dynamic from bu_brlcad_data, don't pay any |
| 01:02.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: attention to what is in the .mgedrc (probably shouldn't write it out). more |
| 01:02.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: importantly, don't use the -display option with the $mged_browser so that it'll |
| 01:02.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: actually work. need some better way than calling up tcl_platform(os)...freakin |
| 01:02.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: fugly. this does, however, make help finally work on mac os x. |
| 01:06.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30204 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 01:06.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: fixed mged's browser-based help on Mac OS X. multiple problems causing help to |
| 01:06.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: not work including users' .mgedrc pointing to a non-existent previous install as |
| 01:06.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: well as trying to invoke with the open command while still using the |
| 01:06.36 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: X11-specific -display options that mozilla obeys. |
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| 03:12.50 | dm132 | Hello |
| 03:14.52 | dm132 | I'm new to both IRC and BRL-CAD |
| 03:17.06 | dm132 | Does anybody use this channel? |
| 03:17.14 | dm132 | I'm not looking for help now, but might be later on. |
| 03:18.55 | louipc | yep |
| 03:19.13 | louipc | this is a pretty active channel |
| 03:19.18 | dm132 | Nice to hear. |
| 03:26.01 | Axman6 | louipc: what've you been smoking. active? |
| 03:26.16 | dm132 | So it's not active? |
| 03:26.23 | louipc | Axman6: sure it is |
| 03:26.28 | Axman6 | dm132: brlcad is one of the main devs though, so it's a good place to get help if you're patient |
| 03:26.50 | louipc | brlcad is THE main dev |
| 03:27.09 | Axman6 | ok then, THE man |
| 03:27.13 | louipc | just watch the commits |
| 03:27.20 | Axman6 | yeah i know |
| 03:27.56 | dm132 | Is there a users channel? |
| 03:28.04 | Axman6 | yep |
| 03:28.06 | Axman6 | you're in it |
| 03:28.08 | louipc | this is it pretty much |
| 03:28.13 | dm132 | I'm not really a developer; I know some C++, etc... |
| 03:29.14 | louipc | me neither |
| 03:29.18 | dm132 | Ok, I've got a question now... I understand BRL is a lot of different tools put together... |
| 03:29.26 | louipc | I would like to start though |
| 03:29.34 | dm132 | but which is the main one? |
| 03:29.44 | louipc | mged is probably what you want |
| 03:29.56 | Axman6 | i'm going to uni in like two weeks, i'll be learning some programming |
| 03:30.01 | Axman6 | probably java though -_- |
| 03:30.11 | louipc | fail! |
| 03:30.26 | Axman6 | very much so |
| 03:30.26 | louipc | learn C instead |
| 03:30.33 | louipc | yeah I learned java too |
| 03:30.34 | Axman6 | i'd really like to learn Objective-C |
| 03:31.08 | louipc | I can't believe they still teach java |
| 03:31.20 | Axman6 | it's still big in some places |
| 03:35.33 | Axman6 | well that shut you up |
| 03:36.06 | louipc | not |
| 03:37.42 | Axman6 | anyway, looking forward to doing Engineering/IT |
| 03:39.28 | louipc | cool |
| 03:39.51 | louipc | mechanical engineering? |
| 03:39.58 | Axman6 | dunno yet |
| 03:40.16 | Axman6 | i'm glad i get to do some more physics though |
| 03:40.24 | louipc | ah |
| 03:40.47 | Axman6 | think i start to specialise after the first year or two |
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| 03:45.53 | dm132 | Apparently one of the top-rh keys (UIOP) is the shortcut for "make my screen blink then shut down my computer" |
| 03:47.15 | Axman6 | excellent |
| 03:50.54 | *** part/#brlcad dm132 (n=mark@cpe-68-201-102-40.rgv.res.rr.com) | |
| 04:16.50 | louipc | oh yeah |
| 04:29.52 | yukonbob | we may never know |
| 04:30.05 | Axman6 | one of life's great mysteries |
| 04:30.18 | yukonbob | for some definition of "great" sure ;) |
| 04:30.45 | brlcad | if someone is wanting to get into programming, they really should learn several languages (in depth) |
| 04:31.03 | yukonbob | speaking of great -- what's the sched for the next release? |
| 04:31.13 | brlcad | learning any single language is just a recipe for hammer-nail problem solving |
| 04:31.40 | Axman6 | brlcad: any you suggest? |
| 04:32.42 | Axman6 | i learnt a bit of ruby, Objective-C, C++ |
| 04:32.43 | brlcad | depends what you want to do, but I'd suggest learning one in each of the major types being more important than any particular language in that type |
| 04:32.47 | Axman6 | nothing in depth though |
| 04:33.31 | Axman6 | i always reach a point where i go "wtf? did you just skip a year's work?" and can't get passed it |
| 04:33.39 | Axman6 | Objective-C was the worst |
| 04:33.54 | yukonbob | does apple still use obj-c? |
| 04:34.07 | Axman6 | of course |
| 04:34.22 | Axman6 | they introduces Objective-C 2.0 with leopard |
| 04:34.49 | Axman6 | with 'fast enumeration' and some other crap |
| 04:34.54 | Axman6 | oh, garbage collection |
| 04:34.57 | brlcad | e.g. C/Tcl/Perl/VB for procedural, Smalltalk for pure OO, C++/Java/Python/Ruby for a OO/procedural hybrid, Lisp/Scheme/ML for functional, etc |
| 04:36.46 | brlcad | I'd recommend learning them in that order too, but that's just personal bias |
| 04:37.48 | Axman6 | i did VB at school, and hated it. a lot. |
| 04:38.12 | Axman6 | nothing frustrated me more than using "VBcolor.Black" |
| 04:38.13 | brlcad | and sry, ruby falls under pure OO too iirc, along with a handful of others |
| 04:38.27 | brlcad | VB is "special" |
| 04:38.32 | Axman6 | very |
| 04:38.52 | Axman6 | it was ok with VB six, kinda fun. but VB.net is retarded |
| 04:39.45 | brlcad | that starts involving toolkits and standard APIs .. the language itself is what I was referring to, just the features of the language |
| 04:39.48 | Axman6 | could also have been the copy and paste nature of the book we were using too |
| 04:39.51 | brlcad | (.net that is) |
| 04:40.11 | Axman6 | they've tried to go OO, and failed pretty hard imo |
| 04:40.15 | brlcad | even v6 and earlier - if you want to get at the core, run the old quickbasic or something |
| 04:40.54 | Axman6 | quickbasic = Qbasic? |
| 04:41.05 | Axman6 | i never did that, but friends in high school did |
| 04:41.15 | Axman6 | i did learn some forth though |
| 04:41.50 | Axman6 | and pascal |
| 04:41.58 | Axman6 | robotics was awesome |
| 04:42.00 | brlcad | still, VB/Basic is a language with some pretty 'interesting' features worth recognizing as one learns the landscape and reasons for one vs another |
| 04:42.08 | brlcad | quickbasic is not qbasic |
| 04:42.16 | brlcad | qbasic was an ide iirc |
| 04:42.31 | Axman6 | fair enough |
| 04:42.36 | Axman6 | like i said, i never used it |
| 04:43.02 | brlcad | still, close enough |
| 04:43.10 | brlcad | you basically learn BASIC with it |
| 04:43.41 | Axman6 | was it basic they used on things like the apple II? |
| 04:43.43 | brlcad | in the procedural batch, though, there's a lot more value for learning C imho |
| 04:43.52 | brlcad | at least learning it first or early |
| 04:44.32 | brlcad | you learn how a language relates to the actual hardware much better than just about every other language (other than assembly of course) |
| 04:44.44 | Axman6 | yeah |
| 04:44.47 | yukonbob | BASIC, then C -- learn loops and decision-making, then bend your mind with pointers and references... :) |
| 04:44.55 | Axman6 | hmm. |
| 04:45.06 | Axman6 | yeah pointers and stuff messed with my head when i tried C++ |
| 04:45.16 | Axman6 | i think i'll be doing Java next year :( |
| 04:48.59 | brlcad | learning C, Smalltalk, Lisp, C++, Perl, Python, and Java in that order would probably give a pretty solid practical programming foundation |
| 04:49.45 | poolio | brlcad: It's pretty much taught in reverse at most universities |
| 04:50.05 | Axman6 | yukonbob: it's pretty cool from what i know of it. it's Apple's frameworks that makes it awesome though |
| 04:50.09 | poolio | And would you choose Lisp over Scheme? |
| 04:50.33 | brlcad | Axman6: yeah, if you had problems with pointers, then I'd say you basically didn't finish .. should continue with C till it does all make sense |
| 04:50.42 | brlcad | poolio: meh, same difference |
| 04:50.51 | brlcad | for someone learning languages, the differences are petty |
| 04:51.01 | Axman6 | never did straight C, tried C++. i should try C |
| 04:51.12 | brlcad | there is no try! |
| 04:51.16 | brlcad | there is do, and do not! |
| 04:51.26 | Axman6 | if only i'd decided this three months ago when i didn't have a week before going to uni -_- |
| 04:51.29 | Axman6 | yes master |
| 04:51.35 | yukonbob | trouble (for me) with Lisp/Scheme is that there are _so_ many implementations -- and now esp. w/ the r6rs being so divisive, scheme's an even tougher landscape... |
| 04:53.05 | brlcad | so many implementations because not even the lispers and schemers can agree on what they want the language to be, everyone has their own little pet peeves over nonsensical languages features |
| 04:55.08 | Axman6 | ruby is quite nice. |
| 04:55.16 | Axman6 | reads how it works when written well |
| 04:55.23 | yukonbob | ...and apparently relatively easy to build one's own implementation -- ``Erik was saying to me "what's the difference between the Scheme's and the diff't C compilers?", but I don't get the same "vibe" ... |
| 04:55.31 | Axman6 | and if you know what you're doing, can be concise |
| 04:55.59 | brlcad | if you know what you're doing, the language doesn't matter much |
| 04:56.17 | brlcad | that's the point of learning multiple languages |
| 04:56.52 | brlcad | all the bickering and debates of language A over B over C is really lame, they all have their purposes and can all be put to pretty good use by good programmers |
| 04:58.07 | yukonbob | well -- except wrt scheme, things seem to get so weird, you're really programming in $Implementation of a lisp-like language -- but true, re: language debates -- no need to use the language as a crutch... |
| 04:59.18 | yukonbob | on to brlcad-ness: http://www.methodlogic.net/flat/gfx/newhub.png and http://www.methodlogic.net/flat/gfx/edgehub3.png are from the same model -- but notice the ring in the edge model -- Comments, brlcad? |
| 04:59.45 | yukonbob | s/edge model/edge rendering/ |
| 05:02.23 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah... |
| 05:03.16 | brlcad | that's interesting.. should only drawing an edge if those two are different regions |
| 05:04.06 | brlcad | could be the same bug that's causing the specs |
| 05:04.24 | brlcad | if it is, you could probably finagle a workaround |
| 05:05.06 | yukonbob | re: work-around -- that's fine -- but just an interesting aspect from this model -- getting good mileage out of it for potential bug-tickling :) |
| 05:05.09 | brlcad | e.g. adding another subtraction object on the inner hub that subtracts from the negative primitive that ends there |
| 05:05.44 | brlcad | i think it's the same bug .. just being exposed in a completely different (more obvious) way by the edge raytracer |
| 05:06.16 | brlcad | that whole hub "should" be just one solid region |
| 05:06.27 | brlcad | it's one chunk of contiguous metal |
| 05:06.33 | yukonbob | correct. |
| 05:06.35 | brlcad | or whatever material |
| 05:06.46 | yukonbob | unobtanium |
| 05:06.53 | brlcad | :) |
| 05:07.29 | yukonbob | anyway, we went through the "specks" bug some time ago, but if this helps w/ the bug tracking/fixing, you're welcome to that img as a reference too... |
| 05:07.40 | brlcad | if I recall correclty, you have some really interesting torus and cylinders being used to make that outer blend |
| 05:08.01 | yukonbob | ya -- you commented on it before... |
| 05:08.09 | brlcad | where their surface edge intersects is where that edge and the specles are occurring iirc |
| 05:08.23 | brlcad | yeah, thanks for the image |
| 05:08.47 | yukonbob | is there an ETA on 7.12? |
| 05:09.52 | brlcad | as soon as the items in TODO are done |
| 05:09.55 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/TODO |
| 05:10.02 | brlcad | if they're slow to fix, slow to release |
| 05:10.14 | yukonbob | ah -- I asked that before and you replied the same way... sorry :) |
| 05:10.16 | brlcad | otherwise, hopefully .. the plan is .. this month |
| 05:10.58 | brlcad | yeah, that's always the release plan .. something might get pushed back to the next release, but most of those items are pretty important |
| 05:12.54 | yukonbob | ?what's the [incr tcl] pathing issue, and the puts/gets stdout/stdin mged i/o? |
| 05:16.09 | Axman6 | brlcad: seen http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikibooks/en/f/f8/C_programming.pdf before? ok place to start with C? |
| 05:16.55 | yukonbob | Axman6: get kernighan/ritchey "The C Programming Language" for ANSI C. |
| 05:17.07 | Axman6 | $? |
| 05:17.16 | poolio | yes. worth every penny. |
| 05:17.17 | brlcad | yeah, the original is still pretty great |
| 05:17.36 | poolio | Even after you've read it, it's good as a reference. |
| 05:18.01 | brlcad | that writeup doesn't seem too bad at a glance, but no I've not seen that pdf before |
| 05:19.01 | brlcad | yukonbob: if you compile using system incrtcl, but compiling tcl/tk, it doesn't end up performing the right itcl/itk init it needs at run-time |
| 05:19.37 | brlcad | just a build settings issue for the most part, but it needs to be fixed |
| 05:20.55 | yukonbob | true -- kind of an odd situation though, where one would use a local implementation of a Tcl extension but choose to rebuild Tcl... still a bug, if it doesn't work... |
| 05:21.39 | brlcad | the mged i/o problem is a bigger issue -- the output handlers aren't working right, related to the background/foreground options and what file descriptors are left open/closed, tcl's output channel setup, and our logging hook |
| 05:22.27 | brlcad | I don't recall if it has anything to do with compiling tcl, the problem might just be using a system incr |
| 05:23.45 | yukonbob | ok -- well, I use system _everything_ related to Tcl and as much as possible -- I'll see if I can find time to clone my env. and build in a chroot, teasing-out details... |
| 05:23.47 | brlcad | either way, it's a default compilation problem and getting those resolved is always important or they just fester into other problems and can cascade other problems down the road |
| 05:24.23 | yukonbob | s/and as much as possible/and every other lib as much as possible/ |
| 05:25.38 | brlcad | three configs I always try to make sure work, everything on, everything off, and default auto-detect on standard configs (e.g. mac os x or solaris out of the box) |
| 05:26.54 | yukonbob | make sense |
| 05:26.57 | yukonbob | *makes |
| 05:52.20 | Axman6 | hmm, this wikibook is terribly inconsistant |
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| 16:48.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30205 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Mods to get things compiling again. |
| 16:51.11 | brlcad | huh, that's odd |
| 18:39.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30206 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Added b to the flag parameter of fopen(). |
| 18:52.00 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30207 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: ValTab[] should not be const. Also added b to the flag parameter of fopen(). |
| 19:11.37 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30208 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tkstub/tkstub.vcproj: tkStubImg.c no longer needed. |
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| 21:29.12 | New2BRLCAD | Hello All |
| 21:39.28 | yukonbob | hello, New2BRLCAD :) |
| 21:41.59 | New2BRLCAD | I have a wicked n00b q |
| 21:42.06 | New2BRLCAD | feel like a t00l asking it |
| 21:42.17 | yukonbob | oh ya? |
| 21:43.06 | New2BRLCAD | I'm looking around for an auto-cad like open source software for a little home project ( map out floor plans of my house and diagram electrical and plumbing) |
| 21:43.21 | New2BRLCAD | I used an auto-cad like software in high school but its been awhile |
| 21:43.39 | New2BRLCAD | would brlcad be something I could use to accomplish that? |
| 21:43.43 | New2BRLCAD | or is this too indepth |
| 21:44.05 | New2BRLCAD | I checked out the website, sourceforge. wikki |
| 21:44.35 | New2BRLCAD | looks like I'd be trying to kill a ant with a bazooka but just wanted to make sure before I made that assumption |
| 21:44.50 | yukonbob | well -- BRL-CAD uses Constructive Solid Geometry to do it's job -- I'm not an autocad expert at all, but it's typically a 2d line-drawing oriented tool, no? |
| 21:45.19 | New2BRLCAD | right .. most of the drawings were 2d but I was thinking about doing it 3d |
| 21:45.21 | yukonbob | People _do_ use BRL-CAD in construction, but it doesn't have tools for annotated line-drawings |
| 21:45.24 | New2BRLCAD | for funzies |
| 21:45.38 | yukonbob | for fun, sure, why not use BRL-CAD? :) |
| 21:46.12 | New2BRLCAD | the program I used most of the construction items , such as windows doors etc.. were all in the app |
| 21:46.34 | New2BRLCAD | I'm assuming I would have to start making those things first before stepping into the floor designs |
| 21:47.14 | New2BRLCAD | what I'd like to do is eventually be able to design out an addition to scale |
| 21:47.34 | New2BRLCAD | then provide that to a contractor to say build me one of these |
| 21:47.47 | New2BRLCAD | ok thats kewl |
| 21:48.25 | New2BRLCAD | I just wanted to get a feel for brlcad |
| 21:48.31 | New2BRLCAD | so is creating a library involved? |
| 21:49.07 | yukonbob | re: contractor -- like I said, you won't end up with a blueprint -- there are many ways to render, and lots of things you can test w/ BRL-CAD, but you may need to print-out your renderings in 'edge' format and then annotate yourself to give to a contractor... |
| 21:51.03 | yukonbob | eg: see http://www.methodlogic.net/flat/gfx/newhub.png and http://www.methodlogic.net/flat/gfx/edgehub3.png for two diff't renders of the same object |
| 21:53.00 | yukonbob | re: library -- I don't think there's any special format involved -- you'll create your objects using CSG methods and can then swap them back/forth to whatever projects you want... |
| 21:53.20 | yukonbob | New2BRLCAD: what platform are you running? |
| 21:54.45 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 21:54.59 | New2BRLCAD | Ubuntu |
| 21:55.04 | New2BRLCAD | on my PS3 |
| 21:55.05 | New2BRLCAD | =) |
| 21:55.32 | New2BRLCAD | and then I have a macbook pro or a work issued IBM thinkpad that I could move it too |
| 21:55.57 | New2BRLCAD | if the PS3 starts to cry |
| 21:56.15 | yukonbob | Z80-Boy: runs on a 4 cores? ;) |
| 21:56.50 | yukonbob | New2BRLCAD: so -- are you hoping to run BRL-CAD on the PS3, or MBP, or ? |
| 21:56.59 | Z80-Boy | runs on 4 urethane wheels |
| 21:57.18 | Z80-Boy | or 2 metal edges |
| 21:57.20 | New2BRLCAD | prob the PS3 |
| 21:57.29 | Z80-Boy | or, like most of contemporary IT technology, on water. |
| 21:57.33 | New2BRLCAD | my IBM is pretty loaded |
| 21:57.48 | yukonbob | is the PS3 using a Cell processor? |
| 21:58.50 | New2BRLCAD | yep |
| 22:00.59 | New2BRLCAD | 256M of main XDR mem and 256M GDDR3 for the NVIDIA RSX |
| 22:02.13 | ``Erik | I think BRL-CAD tops out at around 512 processors, then funky locking issues start showing up and slowing things down |
| 22:02.21 | Z80-Boy | yukonbob: BRL-CAD is here for 30 years |
| 22:02.33 | ``Erik | I use it with 8 core machines all the time :) |
| 22:02.49 | Z80-Boy | im buying now a core 2 duo machine |
| 22:02.52 | Z80-Boy | Just because of BRL-CAD |
| 22:02.52 | yukonbob | I'm not talking about #cores, but the CELL architecture... |
| 22:02.58 | Z80-Boy | Because I know the renders will be hell slow |
| 22:03.13 | Z80-Boy | Hey, you should finally fix the 218x slowdown with the half-cut bolts |
| 22:03.39 | Z80-Boy | brlcad said he'll definitely need to look into that, that it's suspicious. That it shouldn't create a slowdown orders of magnitude |
| 22:05.18 | Z80-Boy | BRL-CAD, the ultimate 21st century oldschool! |
| 22:06.53 | Z80-Boy | Hey, can I get a BRL-CAD sticker for my snowboard? |
| 22:16.29 | ``Erik | the csg tree must be extremely poorly arranged for that kinda slowdown, with a horrible space partition happening |
| 22:18.11 | Z80-Boy | yeah I suspect some worst case to hit or something like that |
| 22:18.17 | Z80-Boy | is the csg somehow balanced? |
| 22:18.49 | Z80-Boy | I mean is the csg tree balanced? |
| 22:19.01 | ``Erik | well, if you blast something like a half through a complex geometry, the space partition tree will balloon like mad |
| 22:19.07 | Z80-Boy | or is it left unbalanced and hoped for a statistical spread? |
| 22:19.18 | ``Erik | the csg tree itself is built how you define it |
| 22:19.20 | Z80-Boy | I blasted a rpp ;-) |
| 22:19.50 | Z80-Boy | well every single cylinder of the thread gets cut in half |
| 22:19.55 | Z80-Boy | but it shouldn't slow down 218x |
| 22:19.58 | Z80-Boy | It should slow down 2x |
| 22:20.17 | Z80-Boy | I guess the bounding boxes are maybe deoptimized? |
| 22:20.47 | ``Erik | are you using the half operator? |
| 22:21.15 | ``Erik | might be better to use an arb8 (or several arb8's) |
| 22:21.16 | Z80-Boy | I don't know what a half operator is |
| 22:21.25 | Z80-Boy | I use a rpp to do the cutaway view |
| 22:21.40 | Z80-Boy | if you mean a halfplane, I never used a halfplane |
| 22:21.44 | ``Erik | hrm, odd |
| 22:21.52 | Z80-Boy | you can try it the .g is online |
| 22:22.04 | Z80-Boy | And in the bug database |
| 22:22.20 | Z80-Boy | http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/headcut.g |
| 22:22.26 | Z80-Boy | do |
| 22:22.27 | Z80-Boy | "B headcut" and rt |
| 22:22.30 | Z80-Boy | it will become hell slow |
| 22:23.25 | Z80-Boy | going sleeping good night |
| 22:31.05 | louipc | Axman6: I'm using C Primer Plus right now |
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| 23:16.26 | Axman6 | louipc: yeah when i tried C++, i used C++ Primer Plus (terrible name). it was really really well written |
| 23:18.55 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/work.png |
| 23:19.05 | louipc | woohoo integer overflow |
| 23:19.21 | IriX64 | use float :) |
| 23:19.24 | louipc | looks like you have to be very dilligent with C to make sure things are going right |
| 23:19.30 | louipc | diligent |
| 23:25.40 | ``Erik | "unit testing for xml" *boggle* |
| 23:26.48 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/play.png <grin> |
| 23:28.55 | louipc | I use dosbox to play old games |
| 23:29.08 | ``Erik | I've done that, too |
| 23:33.06 | IriX64 | how many dos's come in that box ;) |
| 23:59.39 | ``Erik | sid meiers pirates!... the original one, not gold |
| 23:59.49 | louipc | IriX64: enough of them to run games? |
| 00:00.09 | Axman6 | ``Erik: i hope that's not related to the movie pirates |
| 00:00.27 | Axman6 | …not that i'd know what that is… |
| 00:02.21 | louipc | does anyone know how to discover vhosts on a domain? |
| 00:03.29 | louipc | aha I think I found something |
| 00:03.29 | ``Erik | um, it came out in '87, axman... |
| 00:03.37 | louipc | Axman6: haaaah |
| 00:04.11 | Axman6 | heh |
| 00:11.33 | IriX64 | vmware is good....sound fx and music work |
| 00:12.32 | Axman6 | yeah VMware fusion is really nice |
| 00:12.51 | IriX64 | using workstation |
| 00:12.54 | IriX64 | 6 |
| 00:13.43 | Axman6 | big improvment on using Qemu on a PPC i can tell you :P |
| 00:14.43 | IriX64 | gotta buy this thing, they'll get sick of giving me eval licences eventually :) |
| 00:20.53 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:21.01 | ``Erik | qemu x86 on an x86 is pretty decent |
| 00:22.57 | Axman6 | ``Erik: it almost perfectly emulated my 133MHz pentium 1 router thing. speed and ahrdware. i was pretty surprised |
| 00:26.07 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 00:30.20 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30209 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtienet/tienet_master.c: use bu_fgets for win32 portability |
| 00:37.51 | starseeker | Hmm - did the changes made in incrTcl to support Tcl 8.5 in the tree render it unusable with 8.4? |
| 00:53.06 | starseeker | shaders.rt.pix 0 off by many - anyone else seeing this fail in the regression test? |
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| 01:20.32 | ``Erik | yes |
| 01:20.42 | ``Erik | the internals changed between 8.4 and 8.5 |
| 01:20.49 | ``Erik | and incr pokes at internals |
| 01:55.49 | starseeker | OK, configure needs to select internal now if it detects 8.4 - it barfed on my machine |
| 02:03.30 | ``Erik | if the system has the correct incrtcl installed, it can use 8.4... |
| 02:03.45 | ``Erik | the issue is between incrtcl and tcl, not anyhting of ours |
| 02:09.29 | starseeker | Hmm. OK, BRL-CAD on my system has never liked the system incrtcl |
| 02:14.56 | starseeker | It's trying to use the BRL-CAD version, and configure is checking the system version of tcl/tk and saying "oh, OK, 8.4 is fine." Then it doesn't like my system incrtcl and Bad Things happen... |
| 02:26.27 | starseeker | Cool - the simple brep example is fun to play with |
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| 03:14.27 | brlcad | starseeker: 0 off by many isn't a failure |
| 03:15.05 | brlcad | and .. which simple brep example? :) there are three of them |
| 03:15.27 | brlcad | need to get rid of one of them as soon as some more testing gets done |
| 03:26.59 | starseeker | brep_simple |
| 03:27.14 | starseeker | brep_cube is crashing for me atm |
| 03:27.27 | brlcad | really? that's odd |
| 03:27.33 | brlcad | same file, just different values |
| 03:27.38 | starseeker | ERROR: NULL struct db_i pointer, file db_lookup.c, line 237 |
| 03:27.48 | brlcad | ooh |
| 03:27.57 | brlcad | it's expecting an argument |
| 03:28.03 | brlcad | i forgot about that |
| 03:28.07 | brlcad | i fixed it in simple |
| 03:28.19 | brlcad | just not yet in cube |
| 03:28.26 | starseeker | heh - brep_cube --help works :-) |
| 03:28.38 | brlcad | cube is the one that should go away |
| 03:29.14 | brlcad | breplicator is the third -- it basically performs the same steps as brep_simple but in a linear fashion so you can see more explicitly what's going on |
| 03:29.53 | starseeker | I can't rotate the brep_simple in mged, but subtracting "normal" primitives works :-) |
| 03:30.26 | starseeker | Generates a nifty screenshot, but I can see raytracing these suckers is going to be resource intensive |
| 03:31.02 | brlcad | that's very much experimental, what's currently being worked on |
| 03:31.10 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:31.15 | brlcad | not been optimized at all, still working on implementation |
| 03:32.32 | brlcad | ray-tracing breps is probably about 90% done |
| 03:34.14 | starseeker | Nifty! |
| 03:47.13 | starseeker | Meh - archer doesn't like Linux atm - Error in startup script: invalid command name "bu_brlcad_root" |
| 03:50.07 | louipc | starseeker: did you ever get it to run in linux? |
| 03:50.37 | starseeker | not so far |
| 03:50.39 | starseeker | bbl |
| 03:50.47 | louipc | yeah me neither |
| 03:51.17 | brlcad | run bwish, does bu_brlcad_root work there? |
| 03:53.03 | brlcad | otherwise, you're either not running archer through bwish or Bu_Init isn't getting called |
| 03:53.48 | louipc | bu_brlcad_root to specify what? Usage: bu_brlcad_root subdir |
| 03:54.10 | brlcad | usage is what it should say |
| 03:54.18 | brlcad | it's a function that returns the location of the root |
| 03:54.20 | louipc | yep ^ |
| 03:54.24 | brlcad | or an item in the root |
| 03:54.31 | brlcad | bu_brlcad_root . for example |
| 03:54.41 | louipc | ok |
| 03:54.43 | brlcad | bu_brlcad_data db/moss.g |
| 03:54.55 | louipc | it gave the usage message with a blank argument anyways |
| 03:55.36 | brlcad | which is why invalid command name should only happen if it's not bwish/btclsh |
| 03:55.46 | louipc | there's some problem with tkimg.so and pnglib in archer. I was actually tinkering with it before to try and figure out what was going on |
| 03:56.34 | louipc | ... well for me anyways |
| 03:57.20 | louipc | Error in startup script: couldn't load file "/opt/brlcad/lib/tkimg.so |
| 03:57.35 | brlcad | is it there? |
| 03:57.46 | louipc | yep |
| 03:58.12 | louipc | I think I got it to load before but I was still having png_read_destroy error |
| 03:58.20 | brlcad | run bwish and type "load /opt/brlcad/lib/tkimg.so" |
| 03:58.24 | brlcad | what's it say? |
| 03:58.54 | louipc | undefined symbol: png_read_destroy |
| 03:59.03 | louipc | couldn't load file "/opt/brlcad/lib/tkimg.so |
| 03:59.30 | brlcad | that'd be why |
| 04:00.11 | brlcad | it's got an unresolved symbol to that png function, and the libpng that it's finding probably isn't exporting it |
| 04:00.44 | louipc | oh so I'd have to rebuild my libpng or something |
| 04:01.16 | brlcad | that's my guess |
| 04:01.30 | brlcad | could also be something in tkimg, if that's not a libpng function |
| 04:02.11 | louipc | could be deprecated *shrug* |
| 04:02.42 | brlcad | yeah, looks like it might have been removed from libpng |
| 04:02.49 | brlcad | http://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-extras-commits/2007-October/msg07881.html .. |
| 04:03.26 | brlcad | that removes it |
| 04:03.26 | brlcad | (from tkimg) |
| 04:05.49 | brlcad | have to look into it more later, but you can probably work around the problem with --enable-libpng |
| 04:06.01 | brlcad | since our libpng is explicitly set to export it iirc |
| 04:06.21 | louipc | I think I'll try to make an archlinux package for tkimg |
| 04:06.29 | louipc | I didn't even notice it was there |
| 04:06.48 | brlcad | it's a small/simple little extension |
| 04:19.21 | louipc | ah OK I remember what happened |
| 04:20.00 | louipc | LoadArcherLibs.tcl line 65 I put the path of my libpng.so which got rid of that error |
| 04:20.14 | louipc | but there was a new error Error in startup script: couldn't find procedure Png_Init |
| 04:29.45 | starseeker | Ah - it looks like archer is trying to use my system tcl/tk despite BRL-CAD having built its own copy |
| 04:30.02 | starseeker | mutter mutter... |
| 04:30.18 | louipc | starseeker: do you know anything about Png_Init? |
| 04:30.35 | starseeker | ziltch, I'm sorry to say |
| 04:30.40 | louipc | shucks |
| 04:31.15 | louipc | I just grepped the libpng source tarball and it comes out null |
| 04:31.31 | starseeker | It's probably a TCL/TK routine |
| 04:31.41 | starseeker | where does it grep out in the BRL-CAD tree? |
| 04:32.21 | louipc | tkimg.so! |
| 04:32.36 | starseeker | OK, so the tkimg src is the place to look |
| 04:32.54 | louipc | yep I'll go about making a separate package when I get the chance |
| 04:34.08 | starseeker | Where's the magic where mged selects the local tcl/tk packages? |
| 04:34.26 | louipc | mged? i dunno :P |
| 04:34.35 | starseeker | It's doing it but archer isn't |
| 04:35.29 | louipc | whoa mged is binary |
| 04:36.51 | starseeker | Grr |
| 04:37.21 | starseeker | Just trying to run /usr/brlcad/bin/bwish outright results in the /usr/lib/tcl8.4 libraries being used |
| 04:37.37 | louipc | hmm |
| 04:38.46 | starseeker | grr - rtwizard does the same thing! |
| 04:39.06 | starseeker | Wild - it looks like only mged (so far) is doing whatever the "right thing" is |
| 04:39.47 | starseeker | and I still can't get itcl/itk to work from the system side |
| 04:39.58 | louipc | hah I thought mged used bwish |
| 04:40.18 | louipc | I'm not even going to bother with that :D |
| 04:40.34 | starseeker | grepping in src/mged doesn't have a single match with wish |
| 04:40.41 | louipc | my knowledge is too limited |
| 04:40.55 | starseeker | confound it |
| 04:41.34 | louipc | could be a configure thing though |
| 04:41.53 | starseeker | Maybe... |
| 04:42.01 | starseeker | I'll build clean |
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| 05:25.18 | brlcad | louipc: the Png_Init (and pretty much any [lib]_Init) function is a tcl hook function that gets automatically called during a load or package require |
| 05:26.10 | brlcad | it's not a png function, tkimg provides one because it has a png image loading interface, so there's a Png_Init for that submodule to tkimg |
| 05:27.29 | brlcad | mged does not use bwish, it has an embedded interpreter just like bwish does |
| 05:28.51 | louipc | ah mged's command interface seemed identical to bwish |
| 05:29.08 | brlcad | it's very similar |
| 05:29.20 | brlcad | though not strictly identical |
| 05:29.34 | louipc | is there a reason for having both? |
| 05:29.47 | brlcad | they serve entirely different purposes |
| 05:30.13 | louipc | oh |
| 05:31.05 | brlcad | bwish is basically "wish" with brl-cad resources preloaded so you can write brl-cad tclscripts more easily and have access to many of the same commands that are in mged (like bu_brlcad_data) |
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| 05:32.07 | brlcad | as yukonbob_ noted, we could probably get rid of bwish/btclsh if someone(tm) makes the appropriate pkg files so one can do the appropriate package requires |
| 05:34.06 | louipc | like a tcl script? |
| 05:34.27 | brlcad | there are already the needed [lib]_Init() routines, just need the pkgIndex.tcl files to get written/generated |
| 05:35.13 | louipc | right I was looking at archer scripts I think I know what you mean |
| 05:35.35 | brlcad | ghost |
| 05:35.43 | yukonbob_ | boo |
| 05:35.55 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:35.59 | louipc | i have an alias to ghost/id |
| 05:36.05 | louipc | all in one go |
| 05:36.26 | louipc | I learned this when I was having those horrible connection issues |
| 05:37.52 | brlcad | sure you didn't typo? |
| 05:37.54 | brlcad | works for me |
| 05:38.16 | yukonbob | ya! |
| 05:39.06 | yukonbob | no -- nickserv give me nothing -- :P -- I talk to nickserv to authenticate my username all the time -- dunno what's going on... |
| 05:39.12 | yukonbob | *gives me nothing |
| 05:40.50 | brlcad | no console messages? |
| 05:40.54 | brlcad | maybe being filtered |
| 05:41.00 | brlcad | but nickserv is supposed to be unprotected |
| 05:41.37 | brlcad | either way, it's just /msg nickserv ghost username password |
| 05:41.57 | brlcad | that will kick username off the network so you can /nick |
| 05:43.29 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:43.35 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:43.38 | brlcad | latter |
| 05:44.06 | brlcad | you can ghost *from* any callsign |
| 05:44.14 | brlcad | I could ghost you if I knew your password |
| 05:44.40 | yukonbob | it's "brlcadr0x" |
| 05:44.46 | yukonbob | the "0" is for security. |
| 05:45.10 | brlcad | 00:44 -NickServ(NickServ@services.)- Password Incorrect |
| 05:45.11 | brlcad | ;) |
| 05:56.24 | brlcad | you just got here! :) |
| 05:57.08 | yukonbob | :) -- I'll think about getting those b[wish/tclsh] addressed and maybe start tmo... think while I'm sleeping :) |
| 05:58.36 | yukonbob | q: is the brep (ie: brep_simple) support only in HEAD? |
| 05:58.46 | brlcad | afaik, all that's needed is making a tclcad_Init() and a pkgIndex.tcl script for tclcad, bu, bn, rt, dm, fb, and pkg |
| 05:59.04 | brlcad | yes, only in head |
| 05:59.34 | brlcad | it was in the last release, but won't compile by default without editing configure.ac |
| 05:59.58 | yukonbob | ah -- /me gets "...support is not available..." |
| 06:00.15 | brlcad | cya |
| 06:01.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30210 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/comgeom/cvt.c: mark file as binary for windows |
| 06:02.27 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30211 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: add some comments about what some of the header fields mean |
| 06:03.04 | *** join/#brlcad alex_jon1 (n=juve@81.196.65.201) | |
| 06:03.10 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30212 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.1: be explicit that the .cy file format is what cyberware is calling their Echo file format |
| 06:05.10 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30213 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/fast4-g.c: they're file POINTERS not file descriptors, so use fp instead of fd when stashing fopen() pointers. fd's are for open(). |
| 06:21.11 | louipc | how does one read while asleep!? |
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| 08:21.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30214 10/brlcad/trunk/ (108 files in 26 dirs): |
| 08:21.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: large conversion/specification of the fopen callers as to whether the file is |
| 08:21.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: binary or text in order to help the Windows port along. Unless specifically |
| 08:21.18 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: certain that there is no binary fields or EOL assumptions in the file reading, |
| 08:21.19 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: the files are marked as binary in order to preserve format with other platforms. |
| 08:21.21 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: also, be more consistent on using fp for fopen'd file pointers instead of fd |
| 08:21.23 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: (which would be an open'd file descriptor). |
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| 12:21.17 | starseeker | OK, that's progress. I must have not cleaned the tree after that first build attempt, and specifying to build internal tcl/tk didn't trigger a re-build of components built using the system tcl/tk |
| 12:21.40 | starseeker | After a clean rebuild, I'm now reproducing the error about png_read_destroy |
| 12:26.12 | starseeker | ``Erik - is there some autoconf magic that can/should be auto-rebuilding in a case like that? Just curious. |
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| 13:01.34 | ``Erik | a/det |
| 13:13.49 | starseeker | OK, now we're getting interesting. After selecting the internal libpng, I get a window and the message "Failed to load plugins can't read "Archer::pluginMajorTypeWIzard": no such variable |
| 13:14.56 | starseeker | After I tell it OK, the flash screen appears very briefly and then I get bad path: ".file.rt" does not exist. "rt" not valid |
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| 15:41.47 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30215 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: overhaul comments and style throughout so that all routines look and behave similarly. inject spacing throughout for grouping and readability. |
| 15:48.25 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30216 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: consistently make all magic numbers unsigned long integers. this helps quell warnings aside from just better representing the nature of the magic. |
| 15:51.37 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30217 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (badmagic.c bu_tcl.c list.c magic.c): quell warnings, more consistency conversion for using unsigned longs for all magic numbers |
| 15:53.08 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30218 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bomb.c: need fcntl.h for open() |
| 16:36.12 | toxygen | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:52.26 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30219 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/fbserv.c: Need code to increment the socket layer's reference count.\n |
| 16:52.51 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30220 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/fbserv_obj.c: Need code to increment the socket layer's reference count.\n |
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| 19:42.39 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30221 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/temp.c): make bu_temp_file take a size_t |
| 19:45.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30222 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (19 files): quell a slew of compilation warnings regarding unused vars, type mismatches, and more. |
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| 20:11.35 | ``Erik | crap |
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| 20:19.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30223 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (3 files in 3 dirs): add TCL_CPPFLAGS for bu.h |
| 20:26.03 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30224 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: Initialize dbip->dbi_fd in db_open() to -1. |
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| 21:29.42 | ``Erik | *yarghn* |
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| 22:29.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30227 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (fb2cmap/fb2cmap.vcproj fb2rle/fb2rle.vcproj): Changed the executable's name. |
| 23:01.25 | ``Erik | gettin' to be release time, yo |
| 23:04.10 | louipc | nice |
| 00:13.20 | brlcad | it is, but mged is still somewhat busted |
| 00:14.04 | brlcad | failing regression test on head atm too .. trying to track it down |
| 03:03.22 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 03:03.25 | ``Erik | what's the error? |
| 03:03.42 | ``Erik | I fixed some tcl crap in the adrt dir today after starseeker pointed it out |
| 03:07.42 | starseeker | "Failed to load plugins can't read "Archer::pluginMajorTypeWizard": no such variable |
| 03:08.21 | starseeker | I click OK on the error box, and then I get the splash screen. Then: bad path: ".file.rt" does not exist. "rt" not valid |
| 03:41.16 | ``Erik | that's bobs baby |
| 04:02.56 | starseeker | Yep. Unfortunately his Linux box seems to be waiting on svn... |
| 04:36.58 | louipc | starseeker: damn the errors just keep flowing eh? |
| 04:50.02 | starseeker | louipc: I have a hunch that this one is mostly some sort of path issue, but I'm not enough of a tcl/tk guru (so far) to spot it |
| 04:50.21 | starseeker | (which is to say I know virtually squat about the details of packages in tcl/tk...) |
| 04:56.16 | yukonbob | starseeker: you could mv the "local" installation away somewhere (ie: mv /usr/lib/tcl /usr/lib/_tcl) and that should at least keep you from wondering which of the installs are being picked up -- from tclsh (or btclsh) the command "set auto_path" will tell you what the value of it's search path is -- and to be clear, the path is what's listed, and their sub-directories. |
| 05:10.52 | starseeker | I think the path is OK now - that was a different error |
| 05:16.29 | starseeker | Or rather, it's finding the path to the right libs in the system - now I'm wondering about the TCL/TK code itself and whether there isn't some convention in there somewhere that's Windows specific |
| 05:17.46 | yukonbob | I'm not following re: "convention" -- Windows-specific convention for what? |
| 06:23.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30228 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: |
| 06:23.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: refactor and simplify. make the header scanning case insensitive. refering to |
| 06:23.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: a reference implementation, annotate which header lines are required and which |
| 06:23.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: are optional. add checks for FILLED, SMOOTHED, INSIDE_OUT, and THETA_RIGHTHAND. |
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| 07:45.44 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30229 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/cy-g.c: |
| 07:45.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: read in the data files into an in-memory buffer before processing. this limits |
| 07:45.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: processing to models that will fit in memory, but does make things a whole lot |
| 07:45.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: easier for processing the dataset later for things like generating a mesh. also |
| 07:45.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: added a check for VOIDVAL's, but just continuing is probably the wrong thing to |
| 07:45.47 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: do. |
| 08:07.51 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
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| 09:02.50 | brlcad | :) |
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| 10:00.16 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30230 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 10:00.16 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: heh, and I just ran into that same bug myself.. Bob fixed a bug in g-dxf where |
| 10:00.16 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: it was using bu_optind as the argv[] index incorrectly. this would cause an env |
| 10:00.16 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: var to get set for the main object name (at least on Mac OS X) giving something |
| 10:00.16 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: like TERM_PROGRAM=Apple_Terminal as the object name instead of what was |
| 10:00.17 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: specified on the command line.. resulting in something rather unexpected of |
| 10:00.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: course. |
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| 15:59.21 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30231 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Added macro for strncasecmp. |
| 16:05.34 | brlcad | note to self, finally isolated bad ju ju on 30082 > BAD.patch |
| 16:05.34 | brlcad | sushi:~/brlcad morrison$ svn status |
| 16:05.47 | brlcad | er, 30081:30082 |
| 16:47.05 | ``Erik | ? |
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| 20:48.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30232 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/tankill-g.c: Another mod for windows. |
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| 21:20.58 | CIA-32 | libirc: 03blast007 * r369 10/trunk/libirc/examples/stupidBot/src/Makefile.am: Make stupidBot build on linux again. |
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| 02:18.50 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30233 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/geometry/Combination.java: Corrected import of Matrix index. Was assuming length of index is one byte, but is actually variable. |
| 02:55.43 | illethal | Does anyone know how I can add more geometry to an object and extrude faces and such? |
| 02:55.47 | illethal | in Archer. |
| 03:06.41 | brlcad | illethal: most of the commands that work in mged work in archer, maybe refer to the mged quick ref cheat sheet for a sampling of commands available (particularly the editing commands for the operations you mentioned) |
| 03:07.29 | brlcad | archer is still very much under development and not ready for production, lots of functionality missing compared to mged |
| 03:07.47 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 03:07.56 | yukonbob | what's shaking brlcad? |
| 03:08.08 | yukonbob | hey illethal :) |
| 03:10.25 | yukonbob | " |
| 03:10.53 | yukonbob | like old=path=to=file.txt is the new filename for /old/path/to/file.txt |
| 03:12.33 | louipc | use pipe :D |
| 03:13.52 | louipc | or... old)path)to)file.txt |
| 03:14.57 | louipc | actually I think comma is perfect |
| 03:15.05 | louipc | don't even need to escape it |
| 03:19.01 | yukonbob | ,old,path,file.foo |
| 03:19.13 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:19.14 | yukonbob | :) |
| 03:19.16 | louipc | hmm for some reason tab completion doesn't like = |
| 03:19.32 | yukonbob | in bash? |
| 03:20.19 | louipc | yea |
| 03:20.52 | illethal | thanks brlcad! |
| 03:20.59 | louipc | hey, comma is like a mini curved slash anyways :D |
| 03:22.08 | brlcad | yukonbob: not much shakin |
| 03:22.20 | brlcad | or :old:path:to:file.txt |
| 03:56.08 | CIA-32 | libirc: 03blast007 * r370 10/trunk/libirc/ (include/IRCClient.h src/IRCClient.cpp): s/CTMP/CTCP/ |
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| 15:02.57 | brlcad | wow, that was a really tough bug to sort out |
| 15:03.10 | brlcad | and I'm still not sure I fully understand how it's happening |
| 15:04.03 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: what bug? |
| 15:24.43 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 15:36.26 | brlcad | an issue low-level in the database handling |
| 15:36.51 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:36.53 | brlcad | nothing exposed in a userland tool directly |
| 15:37.38 | brlcad | hola ``Erik |
| 15:38.00 | ``Erik | now I'm curious :D |
| 15:41.03 | brlcad | a bit involved to explain, but it's a problem in db_open where subsequent calls on the same file can result in a closure of stdin |
| 15:41.28 | ``Erik | neat |
| 15:41.37 | brlcad | another symptom is fileno() of a valid fp returning 0 ... |
| 15:42.07 | brlcad | (and where fileno(stdin) is also still 0 and valid/unclosed) |
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| 19:26.11 | brlcad | howdy |
| 19:26.27 | yukonbob | :) -- hows your DB issue coming? |
| 19:54.15 | brlcad | think it's resolved |
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| 20:12.05 | yukonbob | nice |
| 20:12.08 | yukonbob | ~brlcad ++ |
| 20:12.15 | yukonbob | ~brlcad++ |
| 20:12.23 | yukonbob | ~brlcad |
| 20:12.23 | ibot | hmm... brlcad is like a learner wrapped in tofu best served chilled |
| 20:12.31 | yukonbob | ~karma |
| 20:12.31 | ibot | yukonbob has karma of 2 |
| 20:12.36 | yukonbob | ~karma brlcad |
| 20:12.37 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 20:12.48 | yukonbob | ~yukonbob |
| 20:12.54 | yukonbob | ~brlcad |
| 20:12.55 | ibot | i heard brlcad is like a learner wrapped in tofu best served chilled |
| 20:13.04 | yukonbob | hehe |
| 20:19.13 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30234 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: add in a feature request from jennifer lagaz (and the modeling team previously) to have rtarea report local units instead of mm^2 and to have an option to override the local units with a command-line option at run-time. |
| 20:22.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30235 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 20:22.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: need to reverify that rtarea is indeed producing correct data values per |
| 20:22.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: comments/requests/investigations from lagaz, saucier, and mallory that it's |
| 20:22.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: reporting differences upwards of several % difference (when it should be < 1% |
| 20:22.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: error for most views). also finally fix the naming convention nomenclature for |
| 20:23.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: presented/exposed surface areas. |
| 21:19.11 | ``Erik | ~karma |
| 21:19.11 | ibot | ``erik has karma of 2 |
| 21:19.13 | ``Erik | ~root |
| 21:19.14 | ibot | root is probably not a Good Thing to use when using IRC. Please use a different account. |
| 21:19.15 | ``Erik | :D |
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| 21:48.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30236 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/Makefile.am: Add start of BRL-CAD Bibliography file (BibTeX format). |
| 21:50.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30237 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: Add start of BRL-CAD Bibliography file (BibTeX format) - add actual bib file. |
| 21:57.58 | louipc | ~karma |
| 21:57.58 | ibot | louipc has karma of 1 |
| 21:58.02 | louipc | woot |
| 22:04.50 | ``Erik | w00t, starsucker finally committed something! |
| 22:10.18 | poolio | ~starseeker++ |
| 22:10.23 | poolio | allo y'all |
| 22:13.39 | yukonbob | hey poolio |
| 22:18.45 | poolio | so I'm debating putting my home directory in a versioning system :) |
| 22:19.31 | louipc | hehe nice |
| 22:20.46 | ``Erik | large chunks of mine is in cvs |
| 22:20.58 | ``Erik | and stuff I edit in /etc and /usr/local/etc end up in RCS |
| 22:23.37 | yukonbob | s/dscm in development/dscm-in-development/ |
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| 23:53.29 | starseeker | ~karma |
| 23:53.29 | ibot | starseeker has karma of 3 |
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| 01:25.11 | PrezKennedy | ~karma |
| 01:25.11 | ibot | prezkennedy has karma of 3 |
| 01:25.15 | PrezKennedy | w00t! |
| 02:08.04 | starseeker | ``Erik: heh - sucker because I suck or sucker for taking the new job? ;-) |
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| 02:56.56 | yukonbob | :) |
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| 06:39.32 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30238 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (master/ slave/): targets apparently renamed to adrt_master and adrt_slave instead of isst_* |
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| 07:17.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30239 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: bob indicates he fixed query_ray |
| 07:31.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30240 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: (log message trimmed) |
| 07:31.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: fix a bug introduced with the changeover of db_open to only using standard i/o |
| 07:31.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: for all platforms instead of unix i/o with an uninitialized dbi_fd. the problem |
| 07:31.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: was related to the failure case where null is returned, which mged intentionally |
| 07:31.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: uses to determine if a file exists, where since with unix i/o a fp and an fd are |
| 07:31.28 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: independently opened (instead of deriving one from the other) so the cleanup |
| 07:31.30 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: code was closing the other. the close code was only checking for non-negative |
| 07:33.10 | brlcad | sahweet .. dbi_fd is already documented as private and warns of change .. |
| 07:48.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30241 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 07:48.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: awesome, dbi_fd is already in a struct sections marked as private (for librt |
| 07:48.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: only) and subject to change .. so change^Wremove it. there are surprisingly few |
| 07:48.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: uses even in librt, so it seems really safe to remove the fd and avoid repeating |
| 07:48.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: the same bug of corrupting file pointer streams by closing their associated |
| 07:48.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: descriptor. go ahead and remove it, callers can always call fileno(dbi_fp) if |
| 07:48.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: they really need to do unix i/o. |
| 07:51.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30242 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 07:51.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: reprioritize to the items that are really the most critical for release, and the |
| 07:51.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: ones that are not.. live with the rt crash and incrtcl configuration issue for |
| 07:51.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: another release, but really need to fix the mged issues before doing a rollout. |
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| 08:12.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30243 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: |
| 08:12.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: rewrite bu_vls_gets() to use bu_fgets() instead of manually doing a getc() |
| 08:12.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: iteration loop by itself. this lets the routine get the cross-platform benefits |
| 08:12.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: of bu_fgets() for handling Windows files stream carriage returns aside from just |
| 08:12.39 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: simplifying the implementation. |
| 08:16.48 | Z80-Boy | I wonder when some people say "honestly,..." |
| 08:16.58 | Z80-Boy | If it means that by default they talk dishonestly? |
| 08:29.38 | alex_joni | maybe neutral |
| 08:30.02 | alex_joni | which isn't quite honestly, nor dishonestly (just not telling all the truth :) |
| 08:30.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30244 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/units.c: ws |
| 08:33.40 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30245 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/vls.c): quell all compilation warnings and convert bu_vls_strncat, bu_vls_strncpy, and bu_vls_strncmp to all use a size_t parameter instead of an int len. |
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| 18:06.05 | ``Erik | *buildbuildbuild* |
| 18:12.13 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30246 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/mged/ged.c src/mged/mged.1): foreground mode is now default for MGED. -b option added to background. |
| 18:13.18 | brlcad | that was quick |
| 18:13.28 | ``Erik | heh, yeah |
| 18:13.38 | ``Erik | it was a 4 character change |
| 18:13.44 | ``Erik | most of the effort was document updating |
| 18:29.41 | ``Erik | I feel like I should have a straw hat on and a garden claw in my hand |
| 18:39.10 | ``Erik | ho hum |
| 18:48.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30247 10/brlcad/trunk/ (96 files in 22 dirs): upgrade tcl/tk to 8.5.1 |
| 18:49.15 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 18:49.22 | ``Erik | http://www.comet7.com/ |
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| 19:16.35 | yukonbob | so mged doesn't automagically detach and background now? |
| 19:17.31 | ``Erik | correct |
| 19:17.40 | yukonbob | ~``Erik++ |
| 19:17.49 | ``Erik | and the -f option went away, there is now a -b option to background |
| 19:19.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30248 10/brlcad/trunk/ (75 files in 9 dirs): update libpng to 1.2.24 |
| 19:19.19 | ``Erik | <-- gettin' hungry :/ |
| 19:20.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30249 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: scratch off the foreground/background issue |
| 19:28.19 | ``Erik | "XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more." heh |
| 19:30.17 | yukonbob | reminds me of the jwz quote about regexes. Something to effect of: "Some people, when confronted with a problem think: 'I know, I'll use a regular expression!' Now they've got two problems" |
| 19:30.55 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:31.13 | ``Erik | jwz has said some good things and some stupid things *shrug* I think he's running a night club now O.o |
| 19:32.36 | ``Erik | bleh |
| 19:33.38 | yukonbob | DNA in San Fran, iirc |
| 19:33.58 | ``Erik | yeah, something like that... knew it was sf, I think that's the name |
| 19:34.16 | brlcad | regex ftw! |
| 19:34.33 | yukonbob | howdy brlcad |
| 19:34.37 | brlcad | howdy howdy |
| 19:36.24 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:36.50 | ``Erik | and sadly 'preg' doesn't use thompson style evaluation :( |
| 19:40.57 | brlcad | posix regex is pretty standard |
| 19:41.21 | brlcad | a few things you can't do with it as easily as you can with perl's but it's pretty damn expressive for most tasks |
| 19:41.34 | brlcad | and you can run perl in posix-mode iirc |
| 19:42.17 | brlcad | the libregex implementation in brl-cad is one of the bsd/posix impls, pretty reliable and fast |
| 20:59.24 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@rikers.org) | |
| 20:59.24 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
| 21:28.20 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30250 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/geometry/Tree.java: Added getters |
| 21:30.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30251 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/geometry/BrlcadDb.java: Added getObjectNames(), getDbExternal(). Modified scan() to show more debug info, then commented it out |
| 21:31.39 | ``Erik | who gave that tosser a commit bit? :> |
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| 21:51.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30252 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/geometry/DbObject.java: Added getAttributes() |
| 21:53.49 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30253 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/samples/GetRegionMap.java: Add GetRegionMap.java which reads a .g file and prints regions and their attributes including path from top to region |
| 23:33.40 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30254 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: Add start of BRL-CAD Bibliography file (BibTeX format). |
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| 00:12.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30255 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: More references. |
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| 12:23.07 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30256 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (adrt/Makefile.am other/tcl/Makefile.am): distcheck changes |
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| 14:21.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30257 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: include rtwizard.bat in the dist |
| 14:23.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30258 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: update the distcheck hook for finding missing files to work with Subversion |
| 15:10.53 | brlcad | ah, now that is the shizzle |
| 15:11.36 | brlcad | a quick refcard written in docbook with images and multilingual po files .. |
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| 15:53.32 | starseeker | brlcad: You mean that's first on the list? |
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| 16:31.55 | starseeker | Good lord this docbook toolchain setup is odd |
| 16:34.07 | brlcad | starseeker: hm? |
| 16:34.21 | starseeker | I can't get even a basic pdf to print out |
| 16:34.39 | brlcad | the refcard I was referring to was a diff project |
| 16:34.45 | starseeker | Ah |
| 16:34.56 | starseeker | Still, this toolchain is driving me nuts |
| 16:35.08 | brlcad | they created a refcard that used db with imagery, diagrams, and had a multilingual backend |
| 16:35.25 | starseeker | Nice |
| 16:35.33 | starseeker | Is it online anywhere? |
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| 16:47.15 | starseeker | It looks like setting up the dtd file location for building the docbook stuff cross-platform could be entertaining |
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| 16:54.07 | brlcad | yeah, it is |
| 16:54.09 | brlcad | http://people.debian.org/~debacle/refcard/ |
| 16:55.32 | brlcad | those set of web pages, the various translations, diagrams, and the pdf are all stashed in a docbook data format with some metaformats for things like the images and a diagram (which actually doesn't render unfortuantely) |
| 16:56.56 | brlcad | they use xslt instead of dsssl so the format processing is a bit different than what I'd originally had in mind |
| 16:58.11 | brlcad | i'm rather highly doubtful I could easily create the mged cheat sheet using either xsl or dsssl, but it's an interesting approach |
| 17:00.48 | brlcad | but hey, if xsl can be made to work easier, then so be it |
| 17:18.40 | brlcad | starseeker: if I haven't shown it before, here's a project that manages their docs pretty comprehensively as docbook that are a really good example to follow |
| 17:18.46 | brlcad | http://www.firebirdsql.org/ |
| 17:19.46 | brlcad | all their (extensive) docs go through their doc system, e.g. writing guide: http://www.firebirdsql.org/manual/docwritehowto.html |
| 17:19.56 | brlcad | http://www.firebirdsql.org/?op=doc |
| 17:20.26 | brlcad | they handle images, diagrams, translations, etc .. |
| 17:21.07 | brlcad | iirc, they do everything through fop (java) but provide pretty much everything you need |
| 17:21.34 | brlcad | might just work to follow them exactly at first and then diverge later as/if needed |
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| 17:26.28 | brlcad | another good example are the gentoo and debian docs |
| 17:30.06 | archivist | php and mysql are similar if not the same (I have written readers against the xml sources of php and mysql to feed my bot database) |
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| 21:34.59 | starseeker | brlcad: Just curious - how come we don't turn on the optimize flag by default? |
| 21:38.45 | starseeker | (I probably asked that before...) |
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| 02:30.35 | brlcad | starseeker: on the surface, it's six of one, half dozen of the other .. but the one main desirable trait is so that it's more useful overall that binaries built by people that don't read the docs have better debugging characteristics than it is for those binaries to run faster |
| 02:31.20 | brlcad | production binaries go out as optimized |
| 02:32.01 | brlcad | also non-optimized builds complete in nearly half the compilation time, and are by far the more common case even for cad devs |
| 03:23.42 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
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| 14:30.41 | illethal | Illethal in the house. |
| 14:31.13 | Axman6 | aiight! |
| 14:40.40 | illethal | Axman6. |
| 14:40.48 | brlcad | sup |
| 14:40.48 | illethal | You wouldn't by any change like battletech? |
| 14:40.49 | Axman6 | 'lo |
| 14:41.03 | Axman6 | i might if i knew what it was... |
| 14:41.08 | illethal | Haha. |
| 14:41.10 | illethal | Okay. |
| 14:41.17 | illethal | Cause Axman is a mech in the show. |
| 14:41.22 | illethal | A very cool one. |
| 14:41.26 | Axman6 | haha, awesome :P |
| 14:41.43 | Axman6 | nah it comes from my name, AleX MAsoN ;) |
| 14:41.58 | illethal | Very nice. |
| 14:43.16 | illethal | Can mged run in the tty? |
| 14:43.23 | illethal | Without x running. |
| 14:43.29 | illethal | just wondering. |
| 14:43.39 | illethal | Probably would have to have framebuffer or something? |
| 14:44.49 | Axman6 | eww, coral sex on TV |
| 14:44.56 | Axman6 | and people swimming in it! |
| 14:45.03 | brlcad | illethal: sure, run mged -c |
| 14:45.03 | illethal | Haha wtf. |
| 14:45.25 | illethal | brlcad: Because I have a gentoo box (I am a linux noob) sitting right next to me, with no window manager. |
| 14:45.57 | brlcad | the answere's still "sure, run mged -c" :) |
| 14:46.08 | illethal | thanks. |
| 14:46.11 | illethal | I'll remember that |
| 14:46.19 | illethal | Are you familiar with gentoo? |
| 14:46.24 | brlcad | -c for "classic"/"console" mode |
| 14:46.30 | brlcad | yep |
| 14:46.33 | illethal | awesome. |
| 14:46.38 | Axman6 | -c for "cool" mode* |
| 14:46.41 | illethal | Do you know the name I would use to search for? |
| 14:46.44 | illethal | mged? |
| 14:46.46 | illethal | in portage. |
| 14:46.54 | brlcad | it gives you the option to run the old X11 gui or stay completely command-line based |
| 14:47.12 | illethal | I'd roll with command-line. |
| 14:47.18 | brlcad | portage has a brlcad package, but it's masked iirc |
| 14:47.32 | illethal | so I'd search for brlcad? |
| 14:47.38 | brlcad | yeah |
| 14:47.54 | illethal | Hmm it says there are no ebuilds. |
| 14:48.23 | illethal | Sorry to be buggin' you guys. |
| 14:53.58 | Axman6 | ewwww, the whale sharks meet t this place to the coral spawning >_< |
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| 14:54.19 | Axman6 | to feed |
| 14:54.40 | illethal | National geographic? |
| 14:54.49 | illethal | Atleast it's not caveman pr0n |
| 14:54.54 | Axman6 | well a docco on TV |
| 14:54.55 | Axman6 | oooright |
| 14:55.03 | illethal | Hahaha |
| 14:55.11 | Axman6 | i bet cavemen knew how to treat a woman |
| 14:55.19 | Axman6 | or just rape them |
| 14:55.24 | Axman6 | yeah that's more likely |
| 14:57.40 | illethal | Not much different from chimps back then |
| 14:58.30 | illethal | I think I'll have to use wget for this? |
| 14:58.35 | illethal | And like extract all the files and such? |
| 14:58.43 | Axman6 | sure |
| 14:58.48 | Axman6 | it's pretty simple to compile though |
| 14:59.04 | illethal | Yeah but I am a newb =\ |
| 14:59.04 | Axman6 | bleh, i'm so over linux |
| 14:59.11 | Axman6 | it has no `open` command! |
| 14:59.18 | illethal | haha |
| 14:59.45 | illethal | Do you know the URL I could get the package from? |
| 14:59.56 | Axman6 | check the brl-cad site |
| 15:00.00 | illethal | k |
| 15:00.14 | Axman6 | won't be a 'package' as such, it's the source code |
| 15:00.30 | illethal | Damn sounds hardcore. |
| 15:00.38 | illethal | Take 50 years to compile? |
| 15:00.42 | Axman6 | itz totz l33t m4n! |
| 15:00.46 | Axman6 | nah |
| 15:01.24 | Axman6 | takes a little while, but you just run "./configure --enable-optimized && make && sudo make install" |
| 15:02.19 | illethal | that's for ubuntu |
| 15:02.56 | illethal | runnin' genp00 on some tiney ass mini-itx computer that was originally meant to be a car computer, but instead we decided to make it a phone server lol |
| 15:03.27 | Axman6 | what do you mean by 'that's for ubuntu'? |
| 15:03.55 | illethal | sudo. |
| 15:04.09 | illethal | But I guess it would work just fine if I was logged in as root. |
| 15:04.18 | Axman6 | there's no sudo? |
| 15:04.42 | Axman6 | sudo isn't an ubuntu command, it's been around for ages afaik |
| 15:05.34 | illethal | Ah |
| 15:05.50 | illethal | Well I've only used it for ubuntu whenever I needed to become root for a task. |
| 15:06.03 | Axman6 | it should have su installed at least |
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| 15:53.42 | Axman6 | Elperion: connection issues? |
| 15:54.07 | Elperion | Axman6: not connetion issues but power loss issues :( |
| 15:54.13 | Axman6 | yuck |
| 15:54.16 | Elperion | the third time this day ... but never before |
| 15:54.17 | Elperion | yeah |
| 15:54.36 | Elperion | it's very annoying |
| 15:54.45 | Axman6 | because you've been in and out for the last 4 hours or so |
| 15:54.53 | Elperion | ...... |
| 15:55.07 | Elperion | i also had got some problems with firefox ... -> two crashes |
| 15:55.20 | Axman6 | you mean failfox? yeah you'll get that ;) |
| 15:55.25 | Elperion | and now i'm really frustrated because i'm using linux and it never crushed |
| 15:56.44 | Elperion | *usually never crashed |
| 15:59.11 | archivist | failfox kills my debian every 2 months ish |
| 16:00.26 | Elperion | ^^ |
| 16:01.00 | Elperion | i was using firefox for very long time and never had problems :P |
| 16:01.18 | Axman6 | i'm just used to a better quality browser ;) |
| 16:32.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30259 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/URToolkit/ (cnv/rletoabA62/rletoabA62.c tools/clock/rleClock.c): quell compilation warnings |
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| 16:35.47 | starseeker | Hey, cool - the openmoko phone project has released CAD files: http://www.openmoko.com/ |
| 16:36.08 | starseeker | IGES/STEP and ProE |
| 16:37.22 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30260 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/URToolkit/tools/ (rleccube.c to8.c): quellage |
| 16:49.23 | *** part/#brlcad illethal (n=oden@c-69-137-199-63.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | |
| 16:55.49 | starseeker | Well, the IGES one sorta converts... doesn't look like it will raytrace in finite time on my machine, but the wireframe is cool... |
| 17:05.07 | starseeker | Hmm - anybody else noticing that with recent head closing all windows doesn't close the app? Is this an expected behavior with the new default settings? |
| 17:15.03 | starseeker | Just to add one more to the screenshot count: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/iges-openmoko-conversion.png |
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| 18:40.02 | brlcad | starseeker: looks like you imported via iges-g as nurbs surfaces, nifty -- does it actually raytrace cleanly? |
| 18:40.23 | brlcad | i'm sure it's dog-slow, that old nurbs implementation was never finished |
| 20:13.28 | starseeker | I can't tell if it would raytrace - my home machine doesn't have enough horsepower to get anywhere with it |
| 20:16.12 | starseeker | There was some sort of spline option on the conversion it advised me about, but when I tried that it segfaulted |
| 20:37.28 | yukonbob | starseeker: very cool, that phone. |
| 20:37.57 | starseeker | Indeed. When they produce a commercial version I'm going to have a problem ;-) |
| 20:39.00 | starseeker | That model is going to be a tough test case for a converter - iges-g sort of worked but raytrace was too slow for my machine, and now a g-dxf convert of that is bringing blender to it's knees |
| 20:39.25 | starseeker | er its rather |
| 20:40.25 | starseeker | My previous cell phones I've gotten because they were the "OK, give me a phone Verizon" options |
| 20:40.38 | starseeker | This I would want to support, but it's not going to be cheap |
| 20:41.21 | yukonbob | s/than in/that the/ |
| 20:41.27 | starseeker | On the other hand, if someone wants to develop better/new IGES, STEP and ProE converters we now have a real model to work with :-) |
| 20:41.36 | starseeker | I think the est. was around $350? |
| 20:42.08 | yukonbob | depending on the specs. that sounds cheap for an open mobile... |
| 20:43.25 | starseeker | Wait, that's the development phone - the FreeRunner will have Wifi and upgraded hardware, so maybe $450? |
| 20:43.59 | starseeker | Still not bad, since in theory you won't have to replace this phone every couple years to have the latest and greatest apps |
| 20:44.06 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-85-125.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:45.06 | starseeker | The screenshot is using iges-g |
| 20:46.01 | starseeker | Once the new opennurbs stuff comes fully online, I expect a lot of the converters will need re-examination |
| 20:46.30 | yukonbob | heh "...so many different implementations with inself that conversion ...has become a small industry" |
| 20:46.40 | yukonbob | ^-- IGES |
| 20:46.48 | starseeker | Ah, fun |
| 20:48.20 | yukonbob | nurbs == surfaces, right? |
| 20:50.09 | starseeker | I'm not sure what we've got in this import, to be honest |
| 20:50.32 | starseeker | I'm guessing surfaces |
| 20:50.59 | starseeker | Seeing as this is a case model, it would make a really interesting sold model. |
| 20:51.08 | starseeker | er solid model (why can't I type today?) |
| 20:51.52 | starseeker | It's too bad we don't have a good interrogation tool for getting physical dimensions off of individual surfaces |
| 20:52.15 | starseeker | All the dimension info is sitting right there, but only the human eye will really be able to "see" the shapes needed |
| 20:52.55 | yukonbob | maybe with beset one could hack something up... :) |
| 20:53.24 | starseeker | Heh - a "virtual ruler" moving around the model in BRL-CAD... |
| 20:54.15 | yukonbob | notes say IGES format was extended to include solid models -- so the format can be capable, apparently... |
| 20:55.03 | yukonbob | I'm sure brlcad would know, but based on this description saying a format is "IGES" sounds only slightly more descriptive than saying a format is "binary" :P |
| 20:57.39 | yukonbob | is there any clue about what was used to generate the original file? |
| 20:58.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30261 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/vert_tree.c: gah, don't include raytrace.h in libbn |
| 20:58.09 | brlcad | access to models is never a problem, real or otherwise |
| 20:58.17 | brlcad | but it is nice to have detailed ones that can be redistributed |
| 20:58.42 | brlcad | yukonbob: what table? |
| 20:59.41 | yukonbob | VolumeIV, Table 2-4 "BRL-CAD conversion capabilities" |
| 20:59.42 | brlcad | the phone did convert as surfaces, otherwise the wireframe would have been an intelligible polygonal mess |
| 21:00.05 | yukonbob | (I'm referencing my own docbook pdf build...) |
| 21:00.49 | yukonbob | s/intelligible/unintelligible |
| 21:01.21 | brlcad | er, table 2-4 ? |
| 21:01.40 | brlcad | table 1 is "BRL-CAD conversion capabilities" and it's a yes |
| 21:02.02 | brlcad | you are referring to http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeIV-Converting_Geometry.pdf ? |
| 21:02.36 | brlcad | heh, good catch .. UNintelligible |
| 21:02.58 | yukonbob | ! |
| 21:03.05 | starseeker | brlcad: True, but I like having a detailed one with no re-distribution issues :-) Makes things nice and simple |
| 21:03.24 | brlcad | do they have a redistribution statement somewhere? |
| 21:03.31 | yukonbob | :P |
| 21:03.32 | starseeker | Sharealike Creative Commons |
| 21:03.57 | yukonbob | mind-you -- I was following the .doc that was posted my way... |
| 21:04.05 | starseeker | It's on the website |
| 21:04.11 | starseeker | http://www.openmoko.com/ |
| 21:07.47 | yukonbob | glad we had this last few minutes :) |
| 21:08.10 | yukonbob | the .doc has "-" for N and blank for Y when I use antiword to view... |
| 21:08.32 | yukonbob | I must have interpretted the - as a checkmark for "Y", and the blanks as "N" |
| 21:12.14 | brlcad | heh, fun |
| 21:15.23 | starseeker | lets rather |
| 21:17.15 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there any way to have BRL-CAD display a "raytracing progress" readout, e.g. "28 of an est. 2,000,000 rays traced"? |
| 21:17.49 | Z80-Boy | starseeker: lol |
| 21:18.54 | starseeker | Z80-Boy: It'd be nice to know if raytracing that sucker could be done overnight or if it would take a year |
| 21:19.53 | starseeker | Z80-Boy: Oh, bty, where is your website with the movies you produced again? |
| 21:20.48 | Z80-Boy | starseeker: or if you need to start believing in reincarnation ;-) |
| 21:25.58 | brlcad | starseeker: thought about having some sort of command-line progress, or a means to query the active running process via port or signals |
| 21:26.24 | brlcad | feasible, not a clear best-solution though ... downsides to each |
| 21:27.21 | starseeker | Sure, but hopefully a "quick-and-dirty" X rays of Y total estimated rays would be simple to do as a command-line printout? Surely not the best solution but at least it would be something |
| 21:27.46 | brlcad | current thoughts are to make rt listen on a port and respond to a simple query protocol, so we could make some sort of status interface |
| 21:27.55 | starseeker | That would be cool |
| 21:29.08 | brlcad | could do the printout thing, maybe something like is done for photon mapping, printing out a % every X minutes |
| 21:29.31 | starseeker | That would be good :-) |
| 21:29.46 | brlcad | just that could get really annoying on big raytraces or traces that take a long time |
| 21:30.07 | starseeker | Well, it could be an option? |
| 21:30.08 | brlcad | and the junk it'd interleave if there was other output being reported like overlaps |
| 21:30.26 | starseeker | hmm |
| 21:30.30 | yukonbob | are overlaps stdout or stderr? |
| 21:30.51 | brlcad | via bu_log, which is presently stderr |
| 21:30.58 | brlcad | though working towards making that configurable |
| 21:31.14 | brlcad | so can more easily redirect to file, stdout, or null |
| 21:31.46 | yukonbob | "rt 2> my_file" would leave a clear workspace, and one could tail -f the myfile if they wanted to track errors... |
| 21:32.48 | brlcad | yeah, that's the current approach |
| 21:34.18 | brlcad | yay, finally done refactoring the magic numbers |
| 21:36.12 | yukonbob | feh -- /me needs to co the svn repo and use that now :) |
| 21:36.22 | yukonbob | brlcad: same accounts? |
| 21:37.04 | brlcad | yep |
| 21:37.15 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 21:37.16 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 21:37.24 | yukonbob | nice thx :) |
| 21:39.18 | yukonbob | ok -- /me lets that run and takes break from 'puter -- chat later folks :) |
| 21:39.25 | brlcad | the first time you check in, you'll add --username and it'll prompt |
| 21:39.41 | brlcad | you don't need to stop co |
| 21:39.50 | brlcad | first time you *ci* |
| 21:40.01 | yukonbob | ahh --- /me misread -- fine --- all's well :) |
| 21:40.02 | brlcad | you don't have to co as a user |
| 21:40.19 | brlcad | that was a problem with cvs, not svn |
| 22:35.34 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30262 10/brlcad/trunk/ (29 files in 2 dirs): convert all of the magic numbers from long integers to unsigned long integers. that in turn cascades similar changes where there is struct aliasing and pointers being stashed/used as object types |
| 22:52.52 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30263 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/ (burst.c ui.c): use bu_temp_file() for opening a temp file instead of tmpnam(), specify all i/o as binary for Windows |
| 23:02.30 | starseeker | No wonder the blender file took so long to convert - it's just a huge bunch of points |
| 23:02.43 | starseeker | er dxf file in blender rather |
| 23:02.56 | yukonbob | <nelson> ha ha blender </nelson> |
| 23:03.19 | starseeker | Doubt it's blender's fault |
| 23:03.28 | starseeker | our dxf file is probably rather... strange |
| 23:04.16 | yukonbob | starseeker: don't mind me -- I'm not really following what's going on -- I blame blender anyway. |
| 23:06.52 | yukonbob | brlcad: q: how do the cool kids do it: a) bu_exit(1, "foo\n"); or b) bu_log("foo\n");exit; |
| 23:06.55 | yukonbob | ? |
| 23:07.19 | yukonbob | s/exit;/exit(1);/ |
| 23:08.10 | yukonbob | reason I ask is that's one of the diff's that's in the current documentation and my own copy... |
| 23:08.38 | yukonbob | (where current documentation == fresh svn co of the same docbook file) |
| 23:17.57 | yukonbob | *awaits |
| 23:29.21 | brlcad | yukonbob: the cool kids use bu_exit() now, one line instead of two |
| 23:30.13 | brlcad | starseeker: there's nothing strange about our dxf export that I'm aware of |
| 23:30.33 | brlcad | in fact historically, we've had much better dxf import and export support compared to blender |
| 23:30.33 | yukonbob | brlcad: nice -- somebody else must've made that change in the CVS repo --- I'll preserve it |
| 23:30.43 | brlcad | blender's has *sucked* |
| 23:30.52 | yukonbob | <nelson> ha ha blender </nelson> |
| 23:32.19 | brlcad | we only export polygons via g-dxf, so barring a newly introduced bug (which would generally be obvious in the dxf) I'd think it more something blender is doing |
| 23:32.36 | brlcad | another test might be to run dxf-g and see what it looks like |
| 23:32.55 | brlcad | should just be a slew of polygons unless it exported some other format |
| 23:33.23 | brlcad | hm, *might* be because they were nurbs surfaces, if that old nurbs primitive didn't polygonalize |
| 23:33.41 | brlcad | but only way to tell is to read the dxf |
| 23:33.46 | brlcad | or the sources |
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| 00:17.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bharder * r30264 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/book/VolumeIV.xml: Fixed mis-reading (or was it backwards day?) of a table where all entries were reversed from what they needed to be, and a minor typo. |
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| 00:48.41 | foggy[mem] | I've downloaded the linux ia32 binary from sourceforge and am having difficulty finding the install/run instructions. Could someone point me to the directory containing these? |
| 00:52.33 | foggy[mem] | Wow it's so difficult to use no one can even point me to the install instructions! That's pretty bad. |
| 00:57.42 | foggy[mem] | Never mind found the man directory. |
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| 01:31.29 | cad56 | that's better... |
| 02:21.35 | brlcad | heh, the idea I had for implementing progress via a process symbol is actually already implemented .. send rt a SIGINFO and it'll start reporting progress |
| 02:29.03 | brlcad | implemented by mike on Wed Mar 8 06:37:03 2000 |
| 02:29.19 | brlcad | looks like you can send a SIGUSR1 or a SIGINFO |
| 02:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30265 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/rt.1: document the SIGINFO/SIGUSR1 progress signals that rt will respond to |
| 02:55.10 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30266 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: add a note for rt's documentation update just so more folks are aware that rt will in fact provide progress status if it receives a SIGINFO/SIGUSR1 signal |
| 03:25.05 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30267 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: make sure the opengl context was initialized |
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| 06:36.28 | brlcad | hello cad05 |
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| 07:15.27 | Z80-Boy | I appreaciate the binary import function in mged is now fixed. |
| 07:15.31 | Z80-Boy | It's the first time I used it |
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| 13:56.37 | toxygen | brlcad: hi, i wanted to ask, any progress with .cy files from cyberware? |
| 14:01.49 | brlcad | toxygen: yeah, a fair bit |
| 14:02.45 | brlcad | still not done, juggling against other tasks, but so far it actually looks like it's something specific with that particular cy file .. still have some more work |
| 14:03.29 | brlcad | we do properly parse the header get all the parameters and get all the data values correctly |
| 14:04.08 | brlcad | something is screwy with the actual ARS being generated, which from everything I've done so far seems to indicate that what it's showing is what the data values say is there |
| 14:04.33 | brlcad | but like I said, that's pretty preliminary .. I still have more to look into for certain |
| 14:07.02 | toxygen | ok, thanks for trying :) |
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| 16:06.36 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 21:00.13 | ``Erik | ah HA!!~#!~@~ (SB-IMPL::TOPLEVEL-REPL NIL) |
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| 22:36.48 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30269 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: Uncomment the raytrace control panel menu item. |
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| 19:12.18 | fwhite | anyone familiar with working with .dxf files? I am disabled and working on a project and need to have some parts cut I have the .dxf files but need adjustments for alignment of several parts. Can someone assist? I have no cad experience |
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| 20:16.44 | iraytrace | Gesundheit |
| 20:17.06 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30270 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/archer: Mods to set max width and height. |
| 20:17.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30271 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Only erase ground plane if it's being drawn. |
| 20:18.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30272 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: Make updateTheme and Load public methods. |
| 20:57.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30273 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/command.c: re-write backout code to actually work |
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| 20:58.54 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30274 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: nirt backout is fixed |
| 21:00.54 | magesing | Hi everyone. I just recently discovered BRL-CAD, and I'm starting to go through the tutorials. However, I am having trouble using the VI style editing in the command window. Once I hit <ESCAPE> to get into command mode, none of the letter-key commands work for me. How can I make the vim-style editing work? Thanks. |
| 21:13.26 | yukonbob | hey magesing :) |
| 21:13.40 | yukonbob | what "command window" are you talking about? |
| 21:28.25 | magesing | yukonbob: the one in which you type the commands |
| 21:29.02 | magesing | yukonbob: The title bar says "MGED 7.10.4 Command Window" |
| 21:35.46 | yukonbob | magesing: nice -- that's called "mged" -- it's a interactive editor, but not vi... |
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| 21:36.36 | yukonbob | for now, think of it more like a command prompt. |
| 21:36.52 | magesing | yukonbob: According to the documentation I'm going through, the mged editor has two modes, a VI style mode and an EMACS style mode |
| 21:37.12 | magesing | yukonbob: I'm a VI user, and would prefer to use it in VI mode then in EMACS mode |
| 21:37.18 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 21:37.23 | yukonbob | what document is that? |
| 21:37.32 | magesing | yukonbob: But the VI mode does not seem to work properly... |
| 21:37.49 | magesing | VolumeII-Introduction_to_MGED.pdf |
| 21:37.56 | yukonbob | one sec |
| 21:37.58 | magesing | which I got from brlcad.org |
| 21:38.14 | magesing | Appendix B gives the different style commands |
| 21:41.56 | yukonbob | magesing: can you give me an example of something that's not working? |
| 21:43.54 | magesing | yukonbob: Sure... ok, if I choose VI mode from FILE->PREFERENCES->COMMAND LINE EDIT->VI then type "foobar" then hit <ESCAPE> to get into command mode, I should be able to use the "h" and "l" keys to move back and forth, and the "x" key to delete... this simply doesn't happen. |
| 21:44.44 | magesing | I also am unable to get back into edit mode from command mode since A and i don't work |
| 21:46.08 | magesing | In EMACS mode <CTRL>-F, <CTRL>-B, and <CTRL>-D work properly |
| 21:47.18 | magesing | yukonbob: so, basically what I'm saying is once I get into command mode when I'm in the VI editing mode, none of the commands work for me |
| 21:50.31 | yukonbob | hrmm... it works on mine -- and we're both running 7.10.4 -- sorry for the basic question, but not a capslock issue? |
| 21:51.00 | magesing | yukonbob: well, capslock is off... let me experiment with caps-lock a bit |
| 21:51.54 | magesing | yukonbob: nope. Caps-lock does not help or hinder me at this point |
| 21:52.02 | magesing | I still get no response from command mode |
| 21:52.18 | yukonbob | ya -- only thing I was thinking is if it's on... |
| 21:52.38 | magesing | yukonbob: I know... hjkl would actually be HJKL |
| 21:52.56 | magesing | yukonbob: but I have tried lots of caps/shift combinations, none of which worked |
| 21:56.30 | yukonbob | 1 sec magesing -- I'm just checking something out... |
| 21:56.54 | magesing | yukonbob: thanks... |
| 22:06.10 | magesing | In case it makes a difference, I have installed brl-cad under gentoo-linux using the e-build in the gentoo-science overlay |
| 22:16.40 | yukonbob | magesing: I going to be afk for a bit ... bbl -- what I'm think of test (for the record) is if emacs and vi bindings work in 'classic' (mged -c) mode, and testing outside of X |
| 22:16.46 | yukonbob | bbl |
| 22:17.19 | magesing | yukonbob: hmm... I'll try that |
| 22:19.06 | yukonbob | magesing: I'm not sure how to set the mode outside of X, though -- if you find out, lemme know :) |
| 22:19.23 | magesing | yukonbob: lol, I don't know.... hmm... |
| 22:19.56 | yukonbob | magesing: I'm sure there's a way -- I was just exploring that -- but gotta run -- chat later... |
| 22:20.08 | magesing | yukonbob: thanks |
| 22:20.12 | magesing | yukonbob: another time maybe |
| 22:20.20 | *** part/#brlcad magesing (n=magesing@mechpc68.uwaterloo.ca) | |
| 23:15.22 | yukonbob | brlcad: what's the purpose of the errorCode/errorInfo -- sounds basic enough, but they're being set everytime a single character is typed... what are they checking-for/failing-on that causes that? |
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| 05:24.42 | brlcad | yukonbob: that's news to me -- they should be strings that Tcl manages with error messages in them |
| 05:25.01 | brlcad | they can be error messages for *anything*, similar to errno |
| 05:27.44 | brlcad | in mged (at least on the C side), it should only get reported during dbopen and parsing the .mgedrc |
| 05:34.31 | brlcad | and I don't see anything of relevance on the tcl side either .. |
| 06:24.11 | yukonbob | brlcad: try this: |
| 06:24.22 | yukonbob | proc vartrace {n1 n2 op} { puts "$n1: $op -- [set $n1]" |
| 06:24.22 | yukonbob | } |
| 06:24.36 | yukonbob | trace add variable errorCode write vartrace |
| 06:24.36 | yukonbob | trace add variable errorInfo write vartrace |
| 06:36.28 | yukonbob | ... new version: |
| 06:36.30 | yukonbob | . |
| 06:36.50 | yukonbob | proc vartrace {n1 n2 op} { puts "$n1: $op -- $::errorInfo" |
| 06:36.50 | yukonbob | } |
| 06:37.01 | yukonbob | trace add variable errorInfo write vartrace |
| 06:37.37 | yukonbob | ^-- type this into mged, and then watch as you type your commands... see if anything looks familiar (error-wise) |
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| 13:41.46 | brlcad | yukonbob: I'm not sure what that's actually showing me |
| 13:41.55 | brlcad | other than internal tcl garbage |
| 13:43.09 | brlcad | i'm not seeing error messages, just temp junk from the commands |
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| 15:13.27 | brlcad | well I've at least finally traced down the cause of why the opengl framebuffer stopped working |
| 15:14.23 | brlcad | it was the machine.h change that made smp work on the intel macs .. it was falling through to the static case and that apparently works |
| 15:23.02 | ``Erik | hrm, all that trouble cuz we've been putting off moving that functionality into configure.ac :D |
| 15:26.40 | brlcad | that doesn't matter |
| 15:26.51 | brlcad | still doesn't explain why it's actually not working |
| 15:27.24 | brlcad | if it were in configure, it'd still be just as broken because it's getting to the section that *should* be right |
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| 16:34.44 | clock_ | brlcad: unfortunately the BRL-CAD documentation is not very helpful when it contains errors like this: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1892876&group_id=105292&atid=640802 |
| 16:38.35 | brlcad | k, thx |
| 16:39.11 | clock_ | you're welcome |
| 16:39.32 | clock_ | I don't mean it as criticism I just want to say it's hard to learn in a situation like this |
| 16:40.02 | brlcad | understandably |
| 17:42.52 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30275 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/resource.c: ws and header |
| 17:43.29 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30276 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/do_options.c: cleanup function, unprotect since bu_avail_cpus() does the protection for us. |
| 17:47.32 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30277 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/do_options.c: if there's only one proc, don't bother asking |
| 17:50.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30278 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/resource.c: wtf, the functions in resource.c arent' even used. get rid of it. |
| 17:51.28 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30279 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/Makefile.am: remove the unused resource.c |
| 18:21.35 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30280 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parallel.c: make bu_avail_cpus() behave neatly if we're not compiling PARALLEL so that it just returns 1 |
| 18:42.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30281 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 6 dirs): |
| 18:42.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: remove/refactor DEFAULT_PSW from machine.h so that now it's really just up to |
| 18:42.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: rt_avail_cpus() to report the max and up to the user to decide how many. the |
| 18:42.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: default is now consistently set the same for everyone to the number of |
| 18:42.44 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: processors available. if someone needs to re-port to an old CRAY and specifying |
| 18:42.46 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: -P1 from userland isn't sufficient, we can refactor a bu_default_cpus() routine |
| 18:42.48 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: with better logic. one step closer to removing machine.h |
| 19:10.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30282 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/machine.h src/libbu/convert.c): get rid of IEEE_FLOAT .. the code didn't actually use it except for one case in 'cv' and was set to 1 for all platforms. if something needs to know, there are configure tests for ieee float. |
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| 21:31.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30283 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/machine.h src/libbu/malloc.c): |
| 21:31.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: remove MALLOC_NOT_MP_SAFE from machine.h, moving it to src/libbu/malloc.c and |
| 21:31.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: enabling it for all platforms. there were only a few old platforms that were |
| 21:31.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: not specifically set as malloc-not-mp-safe and it's not clear which of those |
| 21:31.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: were actually verified as safe so just turn it on for all for now. |
| 21:54.01 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30284 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (Makefile.am scat.h): scat.h seems to be completely unused, remove it |
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| 23:09.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30285 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parallel.c: ansify |
| 23:10.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30286 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): remove FOPEN_MAX from machine.h, moving it over to the only single place it's used over in libtermio. |
| 23:16.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30287 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h machine.h): with the exception of the convex (where it was 'long long'), bitv_t was set to 'long' for all platforms. so move the bitv_t typedef out of machine.h and into bu.h |
| 23:56.07 | *** join/#brlcad Genestealer (n=dennis@pool-71-112-78-93.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net) | |
| 23:56.31 | Genestealer | hey peoples |
| 00:01.12 | Genestealer | I've compiled/installed BRL-CAD from source, but I don't know what do i have to do next to run the program, does anyone can help me with this? |
| 00:02.35 | louipc | Genestealer: mged (the modeller) is probably what you want to run |
| 00:03.22 | Genestealer | k, thanks, i'll try |
| 00:03.50 | louipc | check out the tutorials on the website |
| 00:03.56 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 00:04.46 | louipc | that one especially > http://ftp.brlcad.org/VolumeII-Introduction_to_MGED.pdf |
| 00:06.13 | Genestealer | ok, i got it running, thanks for help, and for tutorial |
| 00:06.58 | louipc | cheers |
| 00:09.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30288 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): move genptr_t and fastf_t from machine.h over to bu.h including the various FASTF define limits. might later consider moving them to their own header if/when they become configurable or if bu.h gets broken up. |
| 00:17.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30289 10/brlcad/trunk/include/machine.h: IBM_FLOAT is unused |
| 00:20.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30290 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (common.h machine.h): move HIDDEN over to common.h since it's generic. could be set by configure. |
| 00:30.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30291 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h machine.h): |
| 00:30.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: move BITV_MASK over from machine.h to bu.h; remove the hypot() decl/protections |
| 00:30.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: outright even if they didn't make it to c89 (it made c99).. if we have a live |
| 00:30.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: system that has the problem, the appropriate configure foo can be added to |
| 00:30.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: provide the decl/impl |
| 00:48.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30292 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h machine.h): migrate the FAST comments |
| 01:02.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30293 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h machine.h): |
| 01:02.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: move MAX_PSW from machine.h over to bu.h, fixing the value at 1024 for now (the |
| 01:02.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: max value present in machine.h). this makes that the hard limit on number of |
| 01:02.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: procs/threads that may be spawned at a minor (trivial) memory expense when not |
| 01:02.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: in full use. ray-trace performance does not seem to be affected by the size of |
| 01:02.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the tables. |
| 01:28.32 | starseeker | brlcad: you on? |
| 01:44.56 | brlcad | yeah |
| 01:57.25 | starseeker | Where's a good example of the pattern tool? |
| 02:24.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30294 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): convert to BU_BITV_SHIFT and BU_BITV_MASK for consistency |
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| 02:49.16 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 03:53.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30295 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/Makefile.am: if building with --enable-only-benchmark or --enable-only-librtserver we STILL need to traverse into zlib, libpng, libregex, opennurb, and tnt since they're dependencies of other required libs. |
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| 06:22.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30296 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS TODO): (log message trimmed) |
| 06:22.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: annotate the results of the OpenGL framebuffer bug hunt. the problem seems to |
| 06:22.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: be directly related to SMP processing with the ogl framebuffer interface. with |
| 06:22.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: PARALLEL turned off, it works just fine; with it on, the app crashes during the |
| 06:22.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: first OpenGL write call into the glx context likely indicating that either the |
| 06:22.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: context initialization is invalid (perhaps needing to occur per-thread) or data |
| 06:22.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: needs to be semaphore protected. either way, enough progress was made to push |
| 06:34.36 | brlcad | wow, that's wicked.. |
| 06:35.10 | brlcad | starseeker: sorry, missed the question -- vol IV has a pattern tool tutorial iirc |
| 06:37.02 | brlcad | wicked, though .. is that converting our bitv_shift from being a static int to an inlined function actually increased performance measurably .. |
| 06:37.38 | brlcad | i can only imagine that it has to be alignment effects coming into play with the optimization loop, as they should be readily vectorized, but it's still pretty .. wicked |
| 07:10.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30297 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h include/machine.h src/libbu/bitv.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 07:10.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: rewrite how the BU_BITV_SHIFT is calculated, instead of using hard-coded |
| 07:10.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: constants in machine.h it now determines the value automatically at |
| 07:10.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: compile-time. this was achieved using an inlined integer log2 function that |
| 07:10.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: computes the size based on sizeof(bitv_t), using a technique from the U. of |
| 07:10.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Kentucky's Aggregate Magic Algorithms collection. a cursory performance impact |
| 07:10.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: analysis was performed testing both unoptimized and optimized compilations (on |
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| 07:27.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30298 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (machine.h orle.h): |
| 07:27.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: obliterate BIG_ENDIAN and LITTLE_ENDIAN defines.. which actually weren't used |
| 07:27.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: anywhere except one use in orle. Most of the current code presently uses |
| 07:27.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: NATURAL_IEEE and REVERSED_IEEE instead. header cleanup too, make it clear that |
| 07:27.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: machine.h is now fully deprecated. |
| 07:29.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30299 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: document that the contents of machine.h was marked as deprecated during 7.10. the file was 'officially' emptied out in 7.12 and should be ready for removal after a few subsequent releases. |
| 07:53.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30300 10/brlcad/trunk/ (INSTALL configure.ac include/machine.h): |
| 07:53.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Woo hoo.. machine.h is now gone. Refactor the last bit for defining PARALLEL by |
| 07:53.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: making a configure --enable-parallel option (which defaults to yes for now) with |
| 07:53.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: aliases for --enable-parallel-build, --enable-smp, and --enable-smp-build. only |
| 07:53.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: other bit remaining was sgi/mips settings, but at least irix6 does set them both |
| 07:53.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: with gcc and mipspro so they should be fine. |
| 08:14.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30301 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: haven't been diligent in updating the patch on this minor as big changes have occurred, but at least the machine.h change begs for it to be bumped. |
| 08:14.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30302 10/brlcad/trunk/include/Makefile.am: don't install conf.h or machine.h |
| 08:35.30 | brlcad | WHOOSH! |
| 08:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30303 10/brlcad/trunk/ (906 files in 54 dirs): this day has been coming for so long.. machine.h is dead, all hail machine.h's death. uninclude it everywhere and add a preprocessor warning for anyone else that is still including/using it. |
| 09:30.28 | alex_joni | machine.h is dead. long live machine.h ? |
| 09:30.37 | alex_joni | that's how it goes for kins usually :) |
| 11:56.04 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 11:56.04 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 14:34.27 | brlcad | alex_joni: not quite, hail it's death :) |
| 14:34.32 | brlcad | er, s/'// |
| 14:34.53 | brlcad | it's needed to die for a long long time |
| 14:37.57 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30304 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/text.tcl: Replaced Tcl's gets with a version that works with MGED's command window. |
| 14:43.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30305 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: Mods to get puts working wrt stdout and stderr. |
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| 15:40.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30306 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): undefine USE_PROTOTYPES before including rle.h to avoid redefining |
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| 17:04.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30307 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: Remove parse.c and comb.c |
| 18:19.50 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (n=yukonbob@198.235.198.234) | |
| 18:26.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30308 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (8 files): move from casting pointers to ints and printing %x to just printing %p |
| 19:05.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30309 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: didn't intentionally leave debug turned on, turn it off |
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| 20:29.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30310 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Add define for inline. |
| 20:29.43 | Attilone | hi guys |
| 20:30.33 | Attilone | I've used brl-cad for some time, any improvement in the next release? |
| 20:35.33 | ``Erik | always |
| 20:36.04 | Attilone | any improvement on the rendering side' |
| 20:36.05 | Attilone | ? |
| 20:36.13 | ``Erik | which "rendering" side? |
| 20:36.33 | ``Erik | the raytracers? |
| 20:37.42 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/NEWS?revision=30266&view=markup |
| 20:39.00 | ``Erik | * document the signals rt responds to for progress - Sean Morrison |
| 20:39.01 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:39.01 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:39.01 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:39.01 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:39.01 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:39.18 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 20:39.22 | ``Erik | heh, woops, mouse puke |
| 20:39.50 | Attilone | lol |
| 20:40.02 | Attilone | sorry but I didn't want you to report all the news |
| 20:40.11 | Attilone | I can read'em by myself :P |
| 20:41.22 | ``Erik | yeah, I was trying to paste 'em into a vim window to do a quick cut/sort/count, but hit the wrong terminal |
| 20:41.35 | Attilone | XD |
| 20:41.54 | Attilone | anyway brlcad has a good potential :D |
| 20:42.31 | ``Erik | it's kinda like vim or emacs... insanely powerful, but insane learning curve, not a "casual" tool |
| 20:42.33 | Attilone | if only would be possible to program it trough python... |
| 20:42.48 | Attilone | vim rocks! I use it all the time |
| 20:42.59 | ``Erik | w00t, another vimmer! |
| 20:43.04 | Attilone | :D |
| 20:43.12 | Attilone | we will conquer the world xD |
| 20:43.37 | ``Erik | there was a brief effort to "swigify" it, but it put on someone who lacked the experience and fundamental knowledge :/ |
| 20:44.16 | ``Erik | <-- just recently gutted what little python there was in BRL-CAD O:-) |
| 20:44.35 | Attilone | if it was on me I would put all the raytracing stuff apart and concentrate only on the 3D modeling |
| 20:45.59 | ``Erik | *shrug* I get paid to work on it, so mgmt types get to tell me what I'm supposed to work on :/ |
| 20:46.48 | Attilone | you work on brl-cad? |
| 20:48.53 | yukonbob | brlcad: the other day, I was looking for a way to switch edit modes (ie: vi or emacs) -- is there a way to do that from the cmdline? (ie: using mged -c) |
| 20:57.55 | yukonbob | Attilone: /me wonders if one could wrangle Python/Tcl together wrt BRL-CAD via Tkinter... |
| 20:59.22 | Attilone | I have no idea, maybe it could be done via swig |
| 20:59.48 | Attilone | but the program is very complex |
| 20:59.58 | yukonbob | certainly it could be done via swig -- what I'm whimisically wondering is if: |
| 21:00.21 | yukonbob | in python, import Tkinter -- which is full tcl/tk afaik |
| 21:00.58 | yukonbob | then work the Tcl to import necessary libs, source the mged tcl code and have a python window into the tcl parts... |
| 21:01.17 | yukonbob | *whimsically |
| 21:01.36 | Attilone | it would be nice :D |
| 21:02.21 | yukonbob | it's worth looking into -- could be a really cool discovery... |
| 21:03.22 | Attilone | mhhh I'm much more interested on the modeling side rather than the raytracing |
| 21:04.00 | Attilone | I would like to take just the source code related to the modelling and wrap it into pytohn |
| 21:07.15 | Attilone | yup I've used mged |
| 21:07.35 | Attilone | but I would like to do the same in python :D |
| 21:08.13 | ``Erik | I'd kinda be surprised if tkinter "just worked", we use [incr], tkImg, blt, ... |
| 21:09.00 | yukonbob | ``Erik: well -- tcl _is_ built to be embedded, and that's what python does... |
| 21:09.50 | yukonbob | Attilone: I'm still not following you -- are you saying you do want mged, or you don't? |
| 21:12.46 | Attilone | yukonbob: I would like to use a python interface rather than mged |
| 21:15.23 | yukonbob | Attilone: so strictly command-line, or GUI? |
| 21:16.20 | Attilone | both of them if possible |
| 21:16.28 | yukonbob | like mged -- but python |
| 21:16.36 | Attilone | ehm.. yes |
| 21:16.59 | yukonbob | you typically script (or try to) your modelling? |
| 21:18.40 | Attilone | just imagine: you want to extrude a profile to make a kind of solid, you type "extrude()" or push the extrude icon... |
| 21:19.02 | Attilone | then a window is displayed where you draw your 2D profile... |
| 21:19.43 | Attilone | the 2D surface is splitted in triangle, each triangle is extrude and all of them are joined in a single solid |
| 21:19.51 | Attilone | *extruded |
| 21:20.45 | yukonbob | Attilone: no need to imagine -- there is extrude |
| 21:21.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30311 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/asc2g/asc2g.vcproj: Replaced 7.11.0 with a variable. |
| 21:25.55 | Attilone | yes but it's not very usable, "extrude 1234 56" is not the best I can think of |
| 21:26.22 | Attilone | just my opinion... |
| 21:58.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30312 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: For some reason inline causes problems with some of the apps on windows. So, for the moment, it gets if'ed out. |
| 22:05.18 | ``Erik | #ifdef WIN32 |
| 22:05.23 | ``Erik | bu_bomb("broken os"); |
| 22:05.25 | ``Erik | :D |
| 22:06.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30313 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: Oops! I checked in the wrong version. |
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| 00:29.33 | brlcad | yukonbob: yes there is a way to switch edit modes from mged classic mode .. |
| 00:30.34 | brlcad | at least I think there is, lemme see |
| 00:33.14 | brlcad | annnnd, I lie.. looks like it only hooks into the tk text widget |
| 00:33.18 | brlcad | that sucks |
| 00:33.33 | brlcad | yet another reason to try and hook in editline support |
| 01:54.19 | PrezKennedy | hey brlcad!! |
| 04:42.44 | brlcad | howdy Prez |
| 04:58.55 | yukonbob | today is the day of delayed responses |
| 05:14.37 | louipc | indeed |
| 05:17.54 | yukonbob | MaoZheDong: :) |
| 05:19.28 | MaoZheDong | I spelled it wrong |
| 05:19.45 | starseeker | Arrrrrrrrrrgh SCO may go private |
| 05:22.07 | MaoZedong | what does that mean? |
| 05:22.15 | MaoZedong | i mean what are the implications |
| 05:22.28 | starseeker | It may mean SCO's lawsuits about IP in Linux can keep going |
| 05:23.21 | MaoZedong | ah |
| 05:23.42 | MaoZedong | no shareholders to worry about bad rep eh? |
| 05:23.48 | starseeker | Exactly |
| 05:24.17 | starseeker | Not to mention they have much less that they need to report to the public, that way |
| 05:26.04 | starseeker | Think of all the productive work that could have been paid for with the $$ spent on this lawsuit... |
| 05:30.26 | MaoZedong | i know |
| 05:30.44 | MaoZedong | I recently had an unsettling run-in with a lawyer |
| 05:30.53 | MaoZedong | man it gets your blood boiling |
| 05:31.14 | starseeker | ick |
| 06:28.11 | yukonbob | the info presented about the Carlyle Group is pretty freaky |
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| 13:48.54 | brlcad | yukonbob: heh, indeed |
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| 17:22.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30314 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/samples/GetRegionMap.java: Minor additions: print command line params, notify when top component isn't present |
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| 14:39.43 | ``Erik | new laptop screen cleaner... http://cache.valleywag.com/assets/resources/screenclean.swf |
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| 15:59.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30315 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/if.c: the backout() callbacks are no longer needed/used since there isn't custom "reshooting" going on. we just backup the original ray origin now. |
| 16:10.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30316 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (bsphere.c command.c): initialize negative so we can do some sanity checking, re-add the DEBUG_BACKOUT code |
| 16:12.45 | Axman6 | brlcad: everything moved to subversion now? |
| 16:14.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30317 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (bsphere.c nirt.h): reduce the style inconsistency insanity via s/ -> /->/g |
| 16:17.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30318 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (conversion.c dist_def.c if.c nirt.h read_mat.c): use vmath's DEG2RAD instead of the weak decl it was using |
| 16:23.35 | brlcad | Axman6: a couple weeks ago |
| 16:24.11 | brlcad | rather several weeks ago, http://my.brlcad.org/wiki/Cvs2svn |
| 16:24.53 | Axman6 | i just remember it was taking a while, wasn't sure just how long it was going to take :) |
| 16:27.24 | brlcad | it took about a week on and off, about a half-dozen tries |
| 16:28.01 | brlcad | nothing hard, just each try just took several hours of processing and there was a lot of validation I was sorting through to check that everything came across perfectly |
| 16:32.55 | Axman6 | didn't it fill a disk at some point too? |
| 16:36.16 | brlcad | heh, yeah -- the very first run |
| 16:37.04 | brlcad | I made a lot more room for it to work for the subsequent runs, and upgraded to a newer cvs2svn that ran faster |
| 16:38.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30319 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 16:38.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Erik made nirt's -b backout option use the model's bounding sphere as the |
| 16:38.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: backout distance instead of the hard-coded 1000 define and also made it use a |
| 16:38.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: much simpler backout method by just backing up the original ray being fired by |
| 16:38.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the model's bounding sphere size. vaguely recall there being a request |
| 16:38.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: regarding nirt's backout behavior, but don't see any hint of it. think it might |
| 16:38.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: have been a verbal request/inquiry. |
| 17:59.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30320 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO): |
| 17:59.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: per recent commits, Bob indicated that he fixed or at least hack-patched several |
| 17:59.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: of the mged I/O bugs where gets in tcl mged wasn't working from stdin as well as |
| 17:59.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: stdout/stderr going to the command window instead of to the console. |
| 18:01.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30321 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (command.c interact.c): more s/ -> /->/g on files that weren't saved before the commit |
| 19:12.33 | yukonbob | http://local.wasp.uwa.edu.au/~pbourke/exhibition/scc5/final.html |
| 19:12.58 | yukonbob | ^--- POVRay Short Code Contest (#5) |
| 19:17.05 | brlcad | yeah, I was looking at those a few hours ago :) |
| 19:19.30 | brlcad | I like bourke's actual entries (which didn't place) |
| 19:26.55 | yukonbob | hrmm... we need a brlcad contest like this... get the modellers out, create something exciting for the new website, and increase exposure... |
| 19:29.36 | yukonbob | brlcad: how does one get in touch w/ the BRL-CAD community -- is there a mailing list I'm not subscribed to? There's got to me more people than the folks who hang out here... |
| 19:34.35 | louipc | the mailing lists are very quiet |
| 19:36.15 | yukonbob | it'd be cool to have a showcase where some of the savvy modellers from ARL + SERVICE participate, as well as non-professional (or at least out of that circle), and collect the displays and code for an exposition |
| 19:36.40 | louipc | yep |
| 19:36.53 | yukonbob | louipc: do you model? |
| 19:37.14 | louipc | not really |
| 19:37.36 | louipc | I have a tough time figuring out how to do it in brlcad |
| 19:37.49 | yukonbob | louipc: do you do 3d work in other software? |
| 19:38.07 | louipc | I've used solidworks |
| 19:38.16 | louipc | and some various 3D art programs |
| 19:39.06 | louipc | hmm yeah I should put more effort into learning actual brlcad usage |
| 19:50.08 | brlcad | yukonbob: there are several hundred people subscribed to the mailing lists |
| 19:50.26 | brlcad | the biggest audience, though, hits the website .. thousands per day |
| 19:54.16 | brlcad | learning what can be done in brl-cad and how folks presently do model with it .. |
| 19:54.47 | brlcad | .. very useful steps for knowing the best ways to improve brl-cad (both on the macro and micro level) |
| 19:55.02 | yukonbob | hrmm... /me thinks that a contest (entries to be submitted by 17Mar (ie: Monday morning)) would be cool -- first one could be 'open' and then perhaps subsequents could be themed (ie: This month, the theme is "habitat") |
| 19:55.44 | yukonbob | in the time until then, do you think it'd be possible to get a pannel of experts to judge submissions? |
| 19:56.02 | brlcad | yeah, getting judges would be easy |
| 19:56.38 | yukonbob | of course, they would be barred from entering a (judged) submission... |
| 19:57.06 | brlcad | I'm actually be more inclined to hold contests that improve the tools first |
| 19:57.24 | brlcad | i've been thinking about holding a bug-fix contest, for example |
| 19:57.25 | louipc | there needs to be more documentation or help |
| 19:57.55 | yukonbob | louipc: that's the kind of thing that would be shaken out during the course of competitions, though... |
| 19:58.12 | louipc | oh yeah? |
| 19:58.13 | yukonbob | brlcad: that's cool, too... |
| 19:58.33 | louipc | how about a documentation contest :P |
| 19:58.37 | brlcad | it'd have to be in isolated contest so that the contest docs are short and sweet |
| 19:58.53 | brlcad | making procedural geometry database generators is usually a great/easy introduction |
| 19:58.59 | louipc | for instance if I type 'help p' in mged it doesn't tell me anything |
| 19:59.00 | brlcad | and results in a useful "plugin" tool |
| 19:59.04 | yukonbob | louipc: sure -- you'd get lots of mail/irc saying "I can't figure out how to do [x]", and then it's identified as a potential weakness to the community/deves |
| 19:59.05 | louipc | anything useful anyways |
| 19:59.07 | yukonbob | *devs |
| 19:59.37 | louipc | so I really can't figure out how to use this app, nevermind the gui |
| 20:00.21 | brlcad | yep, understandably -- mged was never designed to be self-teaching or discoverable |
| 20:00.26 | brlcad | things many people take for granted |
| 20:00.40 | louipc | how do people learn to use it then? |
| 20:01.00 | brlcad | going through the documentation, the tutorials and exercises |
| 20:01.34 | yukonbob | louipc: like the king said "Start at the beginning, continue till the end, then stop." |
| 20:01.45 | brlcad | there's also commercial training offered that most at ARL go through |
| 20:01.57 | yukonbob | brlcad: via SURVICE? |
| 20:02.09 | brlcad | but you can get a huge portion of the basics just from going through existing documentation |
| 20:02.15 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah |
| 20:02.46 | brlcad | they're holding a class in a couple weeks for that matter |
| 20:03.10 | yukonbob | brlcad: they must have access to awesome modellers (ie: people who model) |
| 20:03.12 | louipc | yukonbob: you mean those pdfs? |
| 20:03.20 | brlcad | expensive for common Joe, but pretty standard rate for business |
| 20:03.34 | brlcad | louipc: yes, the pdfs |
| 20:03.45 | yukonbob | louipc: yup -- I've got the mged cheat sheet on my desk, for example... |
| 20:04.03 | brlcad | but contrary to some docs, instead of skimming through and seeing what's possible, actually reading them cover to cover and doing the exercises .. there's just too much to cover |
| 20:04.52 | brlcad | from a complexity standpoint, mged's not really any different than solidworks, unigraphics, pro/e, etc .. takes about the same level of direct effort to become proficient |
| 20:05.53 | brlcad | the main difference is that most of those tools have better in-tool facilities (i.e. a better UI) for learning as you go along, some even embedding tutorials (but then they also have dozens of devs that help make that happen!) |
| 20:06.00 | yukonbob | brlcad: why does survice talk so much about being a "woman-owned" company -- and does that mean a single woman owns it, or a group of women? |
| 20:06.19 | brlcad | that's a gov't thing |
| 20:06.19 | louipc | yeah I did the mged intro one... actually that pdf has all the reference info at the end |
| 20:06.31 | brlcad | being a minority owned or woman owned company is a big deal |
| 20:06.56 | yukonbob | ahh |
| 20:06.56 | brlcad | gov't has initiatives specifically tailored towards those types of companies, to encourage them |
| 20:07.04 | louipc | woman owned haha |
| 20:07.19 | brlcad | survice engineering is owned by a woman |
| 20:07.39 | louipc | but it doesn't have any specific mission regarding women does it? |
| 20:07.40 | brlcad | her husband actually runs the company, though.. :) |
| 20:08.00 | yukonbob | heh -- sounds like a shell game |
| 20:08.06 | brlcad | no, has absolutely nothing at all to do with what the company *does* |
| 20:08.26 | brlcad | just a metric for contracting and purchasing rules |
| 20:08.49 | yukonbob | brlcad: you know lots (any) people at survice? |
| 20:10.16 | brlcad | e.g. if you want to buy a new printer, for example -- that goes out as a contract where basically the gov't solitics bids from companies -- there are federal mandates that say the gov't has to conduct N% of their annual business with minority/women owned companies so generally given offers from companies A, B, and C, if one of those is a minority they will get priority |
| 20:10.22 | brlcad | even if they're not the lowest bid |
| 20:10.57 | brlcad | yukonbob: a fair bit, yes |
| 20:11.38 | yukonbob | brlcad: is BRL-CAD a big part of what they do, a small part, or just "a part"? |
| 20:11.38 | brlcad | oh and to answer the earlier bit, the course is taught by one of the expert modelers, he's .. very .. good. |
| 20:11.59 | brlcad | somewhere between a part and a small part on the whole |
| 20:12.16 | yukonbob | do they contribute code/ideas back to BRL-CAD? |
| 20:12.25 | brlcad | yep |
| 20:12.45 | brlcad | ideas and feature requests all the time |
| 20:12.56 | brlcad | archer was entirely a contribution from them |
| 20:13.43 | brlcad | I still won't be happy until the UI is revamped ;) |
| 20:13.51 | brlcad | it's very powerful as is, but it needs a new UI |
| 20:14.49 | brlcad | the trick is how to make a new UI that leverages the power and tools that are already there, without rewriting things |
| 20:15.45 | brlcad | .. and doing something fun and promising enough to attract other/new developers |
| 20:16.15 | louipc | is there a way to see a log of the commands issued via the gui? |
| 20:18.12 | brlcad | there is command history via the cursor keys as well as the 'history' and 'journal' commands |
| 20:18.27 | brlcad | on the mged quick ref sheet under the "Getting Help" section |
| 20:30.36 | louipc | hmm doesn't write to file until you toggle off |
| 20:40.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30322 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/header.sh: leave authorship to the revision control system and AUTHORS file |
| 20:52.50 | yukonbob | heh -- /me recalls "poisonous" ---^ |
| 20:55.58 | brlcad | ;) |
| 20:56.50 | brlcad | something I've been meaning to do for a long time really, before the video, but it did give a reminder |
| 20:57.46 | brlcad | i'm not entirely convinced of the particular reasoning IFF the authorship is complete and well-defined for what gives someone the right to add their name |
| 20:58.10 | brlcad | problem is that it's rarely ever complete, and particularly for brl-cad it's out of sync with the contributors |
| 20:58.22 | brlcad | the author listed is generally just the person that started the file |
| 21:01.20 | yukonbob | but I do appreciated the "barrier to entry" argument supplied in the PPeople vid -- it may be intimidating, and then (like you say) unless the prerequisites are well defined, when does another person add his/her name, etc, etc. -- keeping names out of files _does_ simplify things immediately. |
| 21:26.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30323 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD.in: dependency and configure tweaks |
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| 01:17.26 | starseeker | Interesting - this povray image is done with CSG operations: http://hof.povray.org/Villarceau_Circles-CSG.html |
| 01:35.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30324 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/Makefile.am src/libbu/endian.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 01:35.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: initial implementation of run-time byte order detection via bu_byteorder() that |
| 01:35.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: returns the current endian type. type endian type is one of BU_BIG_ENDIAN |
| 01:35.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: BU_LITTLE_ENDIAN and BU_PDP_ENDIAN for now, and uses a simple union test for |
| 01:35.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: finding the ordering. profiling showed that it was actually faster to compute |
| 01:35.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: than to lookup from a static iff the first test is the right one (which makes |
| 01:35.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: sense, avoids a load/read). we need *run-time* detection in order for Universal |
| 01:38.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30325 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g-var.c: use the new bu_byteorder() instead of WORDS_BIGENDIAN |
| 01:40.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30326 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): add new endian.c file to the windows build |
| 01:42.32 | brlcad | and only using torii |
| 01:42.50 | starseeker | :-) |
| 01:43.06 | brlcad | that would be a cool procedural generator |
| 01:43.52 | starseeker | bbl, dinner |
| 01:55.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30327 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/endian.c: oop, save before commit. comment that stashing a static was tested. |
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| 04:23.47 | starseeker | Humph - g_qa's output doesn't pipe to a text file easily... |
| 04:25.10 | louipc | hmm yeah I can't see how it uses only tori |
| 05:52.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30328 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 05:52.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: eww, vfont handling is replicated in lgt and fbed. clean things up a bit by at |
| 05:52.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: least making them the same. probably need to 'restore' vfont back into the src |
| 05:52.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: hierarchy now that it's clear that there are actually sources that belong to it. |
| 05:53.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30329 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ply-g.c: use bu_byteorder() instead of manually guessing the endian |
| 05:53.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30330 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/stl-g.c: header cleanup |
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| 13:01.24 | magesing | Hi everone, I'm trying to follow the tutorials in MGED volume II, I'm on the goblet tutorial now. When I try to use the primitive editor to create ball2.s, I get the errors I have pasted at http://rafb.net/p/DtzFW346.txt . Is there something wrong with my brl-cad instalation? I am using mged 7.10.4 under Mac OS X version 10.5.1 Thanks. |
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| 17:13.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30331 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/getfont.c: don't need assert.h |
| 17:15.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30332 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/fbed.c: ws and style consistency |
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| 18:55.09 | yukonbob | :P -- no problem here... /me reviews error msgs closer |
| 18:55.32 | yukonbob | oh -- magesing is gone, anyway :) |
| 19:09.18 | brlcad | yeah, I couldn't reproduce it |
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| 19:21.09 | yukonbob | hey brlcad :) |
| 19:22.39 | yukonbob | post a (?weekly) image with a concept of some level of difficulty, and get people to either describe how to do it, or submit code as proofs of concept. |
| 20:02.18 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah, that could be fun .. someone would have to be dedicated to "running" it .. ;) |
| 20:05.01 | yukonbob | we'd need access to interesting pics and their methods... |
| 20:06.35 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: how tricky to setup a section like the Poll, with an img, description, and an email account for submissions? |
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| 20:34.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30333 10/brlcad/trunk/ (12 files in 6 dirs): move vfont back into the source tree so that code duplicated in fbed and lgt can be refactored into a library interface. this just moves the files into place and keeps things working. |
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| 21:09.23 | MinuteElectron | yukonbob: erm, could you explain further |
| 21:38.56 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: what I'm thinking of is a periodic feature (like the poll). It would be an image, and a description/question. People would look at the image, follow the instructions/question (ie: how would you render this picture with the fewest primitives?), and then mail their submissions in for review. |
| 21:39.50 | yukonbob | I say like the poll, but in fact, that poll has only had one question, I believe... what I'm talking about would be cycled monthly or weekly or so. |
| 21:53.19 | MinuteElectron | yes |
| 21:53.22 | MinuteElectron | that would be possible |
| 21:53.52 | MinuteElectron | you'd have to ask brlcad about an e-mail account, but i'll code something up for you if we're definitely going to have it |
| 21:54.26 | MinuteElectron | or, |
| 21:54.45 | MinuteElectron | if you want to just change it manually i can set up a block and you just change that yourself once a month |
| 21:55.24 | MinuteElectron | i could have the code bit set up in a few minutes |
| 21:55.55 | MinuteElectron | i mean not the code nbit |
| 21:55.57 | MinuteElectron | the block |
| 21:56.35 | MinuteElectron | yukonbob: would you be happy to run that? |
| 21:58.01 | MinuteElectron | Also, this reminds me, I have to find a permanent fix for the IE problem. |
| 21:58.13 | MinuteElectron | And I need to fix up this LDAP thing asap. |
| 22:00.50 | MinuteElectron | They are the last two major things IIRC. |
| 22:01.46 | brlcad | yeah, I was working on ldap yesterday, but still didn't figure out why drupal isn't responding to it yet |
| 22:02.45 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: did you happen to get the header working in IE6, last I looked that was the only 'major' IE6 problem remaining (or is that what you were referring to?) |
| 22:02.51 | yukonbob | MinuteElectron: let me explore this a bit more, and I'll get back to you -- good to hear that you have ideas for how to do it -- so consider this a "bug in your ear" and I'll touch bases w/ you again |
| 22:06.51 | MinuteElectron | sure thing |
| 22:06.58 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: The header, I thought that was fixed. |
| 22:07.06 | MinuteElectron | I was refering to the block corners. |
| 22:07.42 | brlcad | yeah, you did fix the corners :) |
| 22:07.48 | MinuteElectron | They are all out of align, I "fixed" them - but when you change the blocks it screws up again. |
| 22:07.49 | brlcad | they are all right now iirc |
| 22:08.04 | MinuteElectron | So they are alright when logged out, but fail when lgoged in. |
| 22:08.17 | brlcad | but now the menu 'contents' actually don't render (and just the menu iirc) |
| 22:08.23 | brlcad | it's just a green box |
| 22:08.26 | MinuteElectron | oh |
| 22:08.28 | MinuteElectron | sigh |
| 22:08.38 | brlcad | the links are still there, you can click on them and it goes to the section |
| 22:09.06 | MinuteElectron | On the wiki? |
| 22:09.07 | brlcad | and I think for a millisecond they actually render black before green overwrites |
| 22:09.28 | brlcad | on all the pages, the menu at the top of the header |
| 22:09.29 | MinuteElectron | I can't find the bit you're refering too. |
| 22:09.47 | MinuteElectron | It works fine in my internet explorer 6, are you at an IE 6 computer? |
| 22:09.50 | brlcad | where it has a half-box attached to the top of the display, handing down on the right |
| 22:09.55 | brlcad | yeah, IE6 |
| 22:10.16 | brlcad | i'm not on an IE6 box right now or I'd get a screenshot |
| 22:10.37 | MinuteElectron | hmm, it works fine on my computer |
| 22:11.05 | MinuteElectron | next time you are at an ie 6 computer it would be great for you to check it \ screenshot it |
| 22:11.09 | MinuteElectron | though |
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| 22:15.01 | MinuteElectron | hmm |
| 22:16.07 | MinuteElectron | oh dear |
| 22:18.15 | MinuteElectron | Tomorrow afternoon though - I'll get this sorted. |
| 22:20.15 | brlcad | having someone try the menu right now |
| 22:20.25 | MinuteElectron | thanks |
| 22:22.14 | MinuteElectron | indeed |
| 22:22.33 | MinuteElectron | Sorry I keep putting it of. |
| 22:22.35 | brlcad | screenshotting, they get it to |
| 22:23.15 | brlcad | for me, it's just in a bin with XX other hot-priorities.. I need to stop context switching so much and focus on completing a task before moving to the next fire :) |
| 22:23.39 | MinuteElectron | We all suffer from that really. |
| 22:24.11 | brlcad | here we go, thx to blast007 |
| 22:24.12 | brlcad | http://fu.sh.nu:82/brlcad.png |
| 22:24.16 | brlcad | that's what I was seeing to |
| 22:24.20 | brlcad | otherwise looks *perfect* |
| 22:24.36 | MinuteElectron | hmm |
| 22:24.38 | MinuteElectron | how odd |
| 22:24.56 | MinuteElectron | It's not a text size problem, so must be something else. |
| 22:26.02 | MinuteElectron | Curious, do you know what font is being used? |
| 22:26.12 | MinuteElectron | oh, right |
| 22:26.16 | MinuteElectron | its our defualt |
| 22:26.17 | MinuteElectron | hmm |
| 22:28.05 | brlcad | seems like it's either a layering issue or it's picking up the background color as the font color |
| 22:29.10 | MinuteElectron | possibly |
| 22:31.29 | MinuteElectron | But it's weird how it doesn't happen on my computer. I'll load up my laptop and see what happens there. |
| 22:34.49 | brlcad | they can copy-paste the text, but it doesn't hilight when they select it |
| 22:35.27 | brlcad | not sure that's really helpful, still could be css or a missing close tag for that matter, but then it'd probably not validate |
| 22:38.21 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron: mind if I report something? |
| 22:38.53 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: sure |
| 22:39.52 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: I don't get a problem on either my laptop or my desktop. If blast007 isn't too busy can you get him to clear his cache for that page (Ctrl+F5) and\or take a note of the exact version. |
| 22:39.56 | MinuteElectron | alex_joni: sure |
| 22:39.58 | MinuteElectron | sorry |
| 22:40.00 | MinuteElectron | w/a |
| 22:40.08 | alex_joni | np.. |
| 22:40.18 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: that was the first time he'd ever visited the site |
| 22:40.29 | MinuteElectron | heh |
| 22:40.29 | MinuteElectron | ok |
| 22:40.48 | MinuteElectron | In that case can you ask him to get the exact version of IE? |
| 22:40.51 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron: WinXP+Opera 9.24, I see a strange thing on the Community page |
| 22:41.00 | MinuteElectron | loading |
| 22:41.13 | alex_joni | I see the poll on the right, but it seems like the bottom part is cut-off, no submit button for the poll |
| 22:41.23 | alex_joni | (might be on purpose though?) |
| 22:41.36 | MinuteElectron | nope :P |
| 22:41.41 | MinuteElectron | Will add that to my list. |
| 22:41.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30334 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (lgt/char.c lgt/ir.c lgt/lgt.h vfont/getfont.c): modify get_Font() to be get_font() and to take a logging callback (so we can pass it fb_log for fbed) |
| 22:41.59 | MinuteElectron | I think I know why though, so it won't be too hard to fix. |
| 22:42.21 | alex_joni | MinuteElectron: same for all pages |
| 22:42.30 | alex_joni | the bottom div seems to jump pretty high up |
| 22:43.03 | MinuteElectron | Yeah, for some reason the min-height and bottom alignment doesn't work in Opera. |
| 22:43.05 | alex_joni | (if there's enough content it's not visible.. but on empty pages like Community it's quite visible) |
| 22:43.29 | MinuteElectron | yeah |
| 22:47.19 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: his version is 6.0.2900.2180.xpsp_sp2_gdr.070227-2254 |
| 22:47.24 | MinuteElectron | thanks |
| 22:48.03 | MinuteElectron | That's the same as mine, so not a version specific bug. |
| 22:48.33 | MinuteElectron | Ok, everything logged and recorded. I'll deal with them tomorrow afternoon, but now have to go to bed. Goodnight. |
| 22:48.57 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30335 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/ (15 files): convert fbed over to the new libvfont_nil |
| 22:48.57 | brlcad | cya |
| 22:49.04 | alex_joni | cia :) |
| 22:56.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30336 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vfont/getfont.c: cleanup, use bu_brlcad_data to find the installed font resource files |
| 05:57.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30337 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): make the format specifier const for bu_log, bu_flog, bu_vls_printf, bu_vls_sprintf |
| 06:44.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30338 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (11 files in 3 dirs): |
| 06:44.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: make get_font() return a struct vfont structure containing the data that was |
| 06:44.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: previously in globals. it's small enough that a struct copy should be fine, |
| 06:44.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: caller managers their own data instead of it coming from the library. |
| 07:27.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30339 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/ (7 files): quell all extra compilation warnings |
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| 08:23.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30340 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/ (18 files): quell all extra compilation warnings save for assert() |
| 08:25.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30341 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vfont/ (font.h getfont.c): quell warnings, name callback vfont_log() to avoid shadowing the log() math func |
| 08:28.17 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@195.37.106.60) | |
| 08:28.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30342 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (8 files in 3 dirs): rename font.h back to its original vfont.h name just to be consistent with it being an interface (albeit still considered 'private', hence not in include/) |
| 08:35.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30343 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vfont/ (Makefile.am vfont.h): get rid of the WORDS_BIGENDIAN use in favor of bu_byteorder() run-time detection |
| 08:52.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30344 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/html/ (ReleaseNotes/email4.4.html manuals/Install.html): obliterate some more phone numbers, even in older historic docs just in case |
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| 16:21.11 | MinuteElectron | GUESS WHAT GUYZ! |
| 16:21.21 | MinuteElectron | It's tomorrow afternoon, already! :D :D :D |
| 16:25.54 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:47.27 | clock_ | brlcad: I want to write a program where you enter vortices and it creates a polygonal plate like what you should paste into arbn |
| 16:47.33 | clock_ | Doesn't it accidentally exist? |
| 16:47.37 | clock_ | To prevent double work? |
| 17:05.53 | brlcad | clock_: yes, if I understand you correctly there is .. gimme a min and I'll whip up an example |
| 17:06.37 | brlcad | there's an experimental reverse modeling interface that lets you provide a connected loop of points and a depth and it creates a plate |
| 17:06.43 | brlcad | planar-only |
| 17:07.44 | clock_ | that's what I want |
| 17:08.15 | clock_ | Because I designed an end-plate welded to a rolled U50 channel with ahole triangle and the shape is complicated |
| 17:09.01 | clock_ | I am sure the first garage-made space shuttle will be drawn in BRL-CAD :) |
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| 17:49.19 | MinuteElectron | Ok, as far as I can tell the IE6 corners bug is fixed for the first and second side block, but continues to happen seamingly randomly on the thirs. |
| 17:49.22 | MinuteElectron | *third |
| 17:52.38 | MinuteElectron | And at the moment when logged out it goes away when you refresh the page. |
| 17:52.51 | MinuteElectron | or that could just be my cache |
| 17:52.58 | MinuteElectron | regardless it is now gone when you're logged out |
| 17:55.37 | MinuteElectron | Now working on every page when logged in, except the main page. |
| 17:55.41 | brlcad | the css isn't any different for logged in/out, so something with the content itself is provoking the style to change.. |
| 17:56.21 | MinuteElectron | There is a different number of boxes when logged in or out. When logged out there are 2, when in there are 3. |
| 17:56.49 | MinuteElectron | So whatever the problem is has to be compencated for the third box as well when logged in afaict |
| 17:57.13 | brlcad | maybe the contents of one of the boxes |
| 17:57.29 | MinuteElectron | perhpas |
| 17:57.45 | brlcad | e.g. on the main page, the main box defined as part of the contet iirc |
| 17:58.23 | MinuteElectron | yes |
| 17:58.39 | brlcad | ahh, clock left |
| 17:58.58 | MinuteElectron | ok, corners are now fixed |
| 17:59.38 | brlcad | sweet! |
| 17:59.40 | brlcad | so what was the problem? |
| 18:00.00 | MinuteElectron | I had some old CSS code for IE6 only in the page.tpl.php file. |
| 18:00.12 | MinuteElectron | It used some uneeded conditionals so i just removed it and it was fixed. |
| 18:01.17 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:01.24 | brlcad | awesome |
| 18:01.27 | MinuteElectron | This is why inline CSS is evil. |
| 18:01.40 | brlcad | wonder if that fixes the menu too |
| 18:01.42 | MinuteElectron | indeed, now on to the opera bug |
| 18:01.54 | MinuteElectron | possibly, i don't think so though |
| 18:15.12 | MinuteElectron | hell yes, opera 9.2 bug fixed |
| 18:16.16 | MinuteElectron | That just leaves LDAP, Drupal heavy Load response, and the mysterious IE bug I can't replicate. |
| 18:17.53 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: When yuo get a moment can you explain to me what Drupal heavy load response is - I still haven't worked it out. |
| 18:22.01 | brlcad | the heavy load response is what the site does if it's hit with a lot of users all at once |
| 18:22.36 | brlcad | e.g. a slashdotting |
| 18:23.13 | brlcad | so to survive the high load, the site disables portions of the site (like polling) |
| 18:23.33 | brlcad | I tweaked a lot of the settings already, so that one may be taken care of |
| 18:30.12 | MinuteElectron | ok |
| 18:31.31 | MinuteElectron | That just leaves LDAP and the IE6 bug. |
| 18:34.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30345 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: paul randal with one ell? |
| 18:51.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30346 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: his first name was apparently cormac, he just went my corey |
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| 22:45.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30347 10/brlcad/trunk/ (676 files in 44 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 22:45.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: categoric removal of the source, author, and function list sections in files, |
| 22:45.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: particularly the source file header sections. those are all sections of data |
| 22:45.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: that are more often incomplete or out-of-date than they are correct and are a |
| 22:45.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: maintenance burden that has no direct benefit. the 'source' section (i.e. the |
| 22:45.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: address) is mostly irrelevant with the open sourcing. the authorship is better |
| 22:45.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: comprehensively preserved through the SCM revision control system, and was the |
| 23:09.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30348 10/brlcad/trunk/src/remrt/rtsrv.c: match bu_log's new const goodness |
| 23:31.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30349 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/footer.sh: weird.. don't use single-line comments for headers, use comment blocks like we do for .c files |
| 23:32.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30350 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (15 files in 9 dirs): remove some remaining references to RCS vars |
| 23:35.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30351 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (burst/HmGetc.c burst/HmGlob.c lgt/ir.c): de-LINT |
| 01:30.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30352 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (155 files in 31 dirs): |
| 01:30.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: start unraveling the horrible whitesmith-pico indentation style that put |
| 01:30.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: statements on the same line as open parens (and still indenting the paren). put |
| 01:30.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the statement on the next line. also caught a few that just had comments |
| 01:30.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: following the open paren, but move them down a line too. applying auto-style |
| 01:30.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: formatting should clean up their indentation later. one step closer towards |
| 01:30.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: global consistency.. |
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| 01:57.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30353 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: add more details about the indentation/whitespace style as being BSD KNR and/or K&R style with 4-char indents. |
| 01:59.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30354 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtexture/texture_perlin.h: stragglers not saved |
| 01:59.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30355 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/comb.c: stragglers not saved |
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| 09:20.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30356 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: some C++ libraries (e.g. STL) need the inline specifier |
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| 13:23.05 | brlcad | d_rossberg: does it work for you without the #define inline? |
| 13:23.11 | brlcad | it really shouldn't be needed |
| 13:31.13 | brlcad | i'm not convinced bob really investigated why it wasn't working for him .. |
| 13:45.27 | d_rossberg | brlcad: an inline statement in the C code is deathly for MSVC 6.0, therefore i put the define in the else branch of ifdef __cplusplus |
| 13:45.53 | d_rossberg | (inline is C99) |
| 14:01.15 | brlcad | ah, except in bob's case he's testing with VS2005 :) |
| 14:01.32 | brlcad | okay, well good enough I suppose |
| 14:05.44 | d_rossberg | i think bob had the same problem, that's why he wrote the define, but it looks like Bob hasn't tested it on g_brep.cpp and opennurbs_ext.cpp, or his linker is much more generously then mine |
| 14:09.33 | brlcad | or he's not even compiling those files yet |
| 14:10.53 | brlcad | yeah, looks like he's left it off the compilation |
| 14:18.04 | d_rossberg | i wonder if VS2008 knows about C99 -- i'll learn of it this year :-| |
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| 14:23.58 | *** join/#brlcad elfantastico191 (n=elfantas@85.72.144.62) | |
| 14:24.09 | elfantastico191 | hi |
| 14:24.52 | elfantastico191 | anyone familiar with solidworks ? |
| 14:25.43 | *** join/#brlcad elfantastico191 (n=elfantas@85.72.144.62) | |
| 14:25.50 | elfantastico191 | ? |
| 14:25.59 | brlcad | elfantastico191: this isn't a solidworks support channel, sorry |
| 14:26.18 | brlcad | if you have a brl-cad question, I'd be glad to try to help you |
| 14:27.08 | elfantastico191 | ty man |
| 14:27.17 | brlcad | d_rossberg: that's what's odd about vs2005, it is compliant .. I use inline with it on other projects just fine so I'm thinking it's a setting issue or something else (in bob's case) |
| 14:27.23 | brlcad | elfantastico191: np |
| 14:27.53 | elfantastico191 | do u happen btw to know any solidworks channels anywhere i may adress to ? |
| 14:28.10 | brlcad | nope |
| 14:28.13 | elfantastico191 | ok |
| 14:28.14 | brlcad | tis a commercial product |
| 14:28.17 | brlcad | you paid for support |
| 14:28.31 | brlcad | which is done through their forums and phone |
| 14:28.55 | elfantastico191 | nah i am to far away and their forum doesnt support this simple question |
| 14:29.05 | clock_ | lol |
| 14:29.10 | elfantastico191 | :) |
| 14:29.12 | brlcad | pay me what you pay them, and I might think about answering solidworks questions, but I'd still probably just use it as beer money ;) |
| 14:29.19 | brlcad | oh, hey clock_ |
| 14:29.26 | clock_ | elfantastico191: pay an upgrade support package to be able to ask even simple questions ;-) |
| 14:29.32 | alex_joni | brlcad: that much beer is dangerous |
| 14:29.37 | clock_ | brlcad: hey |
| 14:29.49 | clock_ | brlcad: do you have that polygon program? |
| 14:29.51 | brlcad | i had that example done after you disappeared |
| 14:29.55 | brlcad | yeah |
| 14:30.17 | brlcad | i'll caveat this that you're going to be using something very much experimental... |
| 14:30.20 | elfantastico191 | ok men nice coming here for a visit |
| 14:30.32 | elfantastico191 | gbye |
| 14:30.39 | brlcad | only been used once for that matter, but it does work for very straightforward inputs |
| 14:30.42 | brlcad | elfantastico191: cya |
| 14:31.23 | brlcad | basically, there's an input processor that presently is just hooked into mged as a command that reads an input file |
| 14:31.30 | brlcad | the input file is a simple text file of sample points |
| 14:31.51 | clock_ | sample points means vertices? |
| 14:31.57 | brlcad | the format is that of a vulcan scanning system point sampler |
| 14:31.59 | brlcad | yeah |
| 14:32.16 | clock_ | what is a vulcan scanning system point sampler? |
| 14:32.18 | brlcad | the vulcan just gives you points in three-space |
| 14:32.35 | clock_ | vulcan is a name of software? |
| 14:32.38 | brlcad | you click a point, click a point, click a point .. using a wand and it records those points |
| 14:32.44 | brlcad | it's a piece of metrology hardware |
| 14:32.57 | clock_ | metrology hardware? wtf? |
| 14:33.01 | clock_ | what is metrology? |
| 14:33.10 | clock_ | Some institute that deals with kilograms and meters? |
| 14:33.29 | brlcad | like surveying equipment |
| 14:33.34 | clock_ | oh yeah |
| 14:33.38 | clock_ | like photogrammetry? |
| 14:33.46 | brlcad | not really |
| 14:34.16 | brlcad | lemme see if I can find a pic |
| 14:34.58 | archivist | also known as a coordinate measuring machine cmm |
| 14:35.09 | clock_ | is "vulcan" a name of the system or is it a system for scanning shapes or volcanoes? |
| 14:35.59 | brlcad | yeah, name of the system |
| 14:36.02 | brlcad | here we go |
| 14:36.14 | brlcad | it was developed with the X-Station Vulcan advanced surveying system |
| 14:36.25 | brlcad | which is sort of like: http://www.indoorgps.com/Configurations/Portable.aspx |
| 14:36.55 | brlcad | more like the guy in the small top right picture with a big wand |
| 14:37.06 | brlcad | you click points, it acquires them and writes them to a simple text file |
| 14:37.51 | brlcad | there's a command in mged (parse_points) that reads that file and creates geometry based on labels that would have been tagged by the vulcan scanner, but can just as easily be cobbled together by hand |
| 14:38.13 | brlcad | here being an example: http://my.brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/plate.txt |
| 14:38.32 | brlcad | so you can run: parse_points plate.txt |
| 14:39.07 | brlcad | and it should blather a bunch of junk, maybe even say it failed (this is like pre-alpha code *ahem*) .. but then actually create an extrude0 that is that plate |
| 14:39.36 | brlcad | the pattern for PLATE objects are simple .. it's a loop of planar points followed by a depth in triplicate |
| 14:40.01 | brlcad | there's a hard-coded tolerance of like 1.5 right now, so you have to scale your units if you're working with something small |
| 14:42.45 | archivist | add some probing to new toy and I might have one :) |
| 14:43.35 | brlcad | clock_: there are other object types it'll recognize too if you need other shapes, but none of it's documented so I'd just have to say what's what |
| 14:46.08 | clock_ | brlcad: there are 5 columns. Is it like point number, X, Y, Z? What is the PLATE? |
| 14:46.18 | brlcad | supported shapes are PLATE, ARB, SYMMETRY, POINTS, CYLINDER, CYL, PIPE, and SPHERE |
| 14:46.32 | brlcad | yeah, first is just an identifier that is pretty much ignored but needs to be there |
| 14:46.55 | brlcad | then x,y,z coords, then a text label that tells the parser what type of point it is |
| 14:47.41 | brlcad | series are objects are identified by the sampling convention, three samples terminates the object for example |
| 14:47.52 | brlcad | which is why the last point is listed thrice |
| 14:48.17 | clock_ | I wanted something a bit different |
| 14:48.28 | brlcad | oh? |
| 14:48.30 | clock_ | Give a loop of X,Y pairs and one number-thickness |
| 14:48.41 | brlcad | that's basically that example |
| 14:49.15 | brlcad | the Z is the thickness, 9.0 |
| 14:49.16 | clock_ | can the points be in any order? |
| 14:49.22 | brlcad | the rest are x,y points |
| 14:49.29 | brlcad | in loop order |
| 14:49.40 | brlcad | 0 connects to 1, 1 connects to 2, etc |
| 14:49.46 | clock_ | So what's the meaning of the 4th columnt? |
| 14:49.52 | clock_ | I don't understand it now |
| 14:50.06 | brlcad | the fourth column is the Z coordinate |
| 14:50.16 | clock_ | Z coordinate of what? |
| 14:50.50 | brlcad | of the plate thickness |
| 14:51.17 | clock_ | How many lines will have a file for a rectangular plate have? |
| 14:51.30 | brlcad | for your case, you really don't need to care -- just plug in your x,y values into cols' 2 and 3 with a Z of 0.0 then replicate your first point with a Z of your thickness |
| 14:51.41 | clock_ | OK |
| 14:51.49 | clock_ | replicate 3 times at the end? |
| 14:51.52 | brlcad | yes |
| 14:51.56 | clock_ | That should work |
| 14:52.00 | brlcad | that marks the end of that "object" |
| 14:52.06 | brlcad | so you can list multiple in one file |
| 14:52.35 | clock_ | And when I have the file what I do next? |
| 14:52.47 | clock_ | parse_points filename? |
| 14:53.01 | brlcad | a rectangular plate would have a point A, B, C, D, depth, depth, depth .. so 7 |
| 14:53.15 | brlcad | yes |
| 14:53.28 | ``Erik | *yargn* |
| 14:53.36 | clock_ | and it creates a primitive named after the last column? |
| 14:53.55 | brlcad | you can sort of think of this as a vulcan-g converter, and you're just describing your data in the vulcan's format |
| 14:54.15 | brlcad | no, the primitive will be auto-named, it needs to say PLATE |
| 14:54.27 | brlcad | you can rename it afterwards |
| 14:54.42 | clock_ | Aha I see you said PLATE is some kind of a keyword |
| 14:54.48 | brlcad | exactly |
| 14:55.43 | brlcad | it was a simple label convention set up using that coordinate measuring machine, which is *very* limited inherintly .. it's just a bunch of sample points |
| 14:56.31 | brlcad | but when you use it to acquire thousands of samples, it's a *really* effective way for modeling an entire object (e.g. a whole vehicle's exterior) in detail very quickly |
| 14:58.20 | brlcad | anyways, this can all be tailored if needed to .. enough effort went into the development just to get it working for a model that was being acquired, sort of proof-of-concept, so it could still use lots more lovin' |
| 14:59.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30357 10/brlcad/trunk/src/Makefile.am: vfont must be build before fbed and lgt |
| 14:59.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30358 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: minor cleanup of the DEPENDS stuff |
| 15:00.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30359 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (fbed/Makefile.am lgt/Makefile.am libbu/Makefile.am): dependancy fixes |
| 15:01.00 | ``Erik | minute said something about needing a bug tracker, should we make a 'Webpage' category in the sf bug tracker? |
| 15:05.12 | brlcad | up to MinuteElectron .. want a tracker category? |
| 15:05.27 | brlcad | the files need to get added to svn at some point too, so might be enough just to have a TODO file |
| 15:05.46 | clock_ | brlcad: The new holder contains complicated shapes plasma-cut (or hacksaw-cut) from a steel plate which were designed in a 2D editor. |
| 15:05.58 | clock_ | I can figure out exact point positions of the vertices in the 2D editor |
| 15:06.01 | brlcad | tracker isn't usually used for internal dev-reporting |
| 15:06.14 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 15:06.19 | brlcad | clock_: great, then it should come across directly |
| 15:06.23 | ``Erik | *shrug* might be worht having both, or direct issues with the web page to 'documentation' |
| 15:06.38 | clock_ | brlcad: before I had to calculate normal vectors my head almost exploded |
| 15:07.06 | ``Erik | um |
| 15:07.06 | brlcad | the website directs website issues to a contact form |
| 15:07.38 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/d/contact |
| 15:07.56 | ``Erik | should, uh, bz have an autologin vc? |
| 15:08.38 | ``Erik | (the new one) |
| 15:08.51 | clock_ | brlcad: CAD tools makes garage manufacture of complicated mechanics tremendously simpler |
| 15:09.01 | clock_ | I mean free software CAD tools |
| 15:09.05 | clock_ | proprietary don't |
| 15:09.20 | clock_ | And a laser printer, of course |
| 15:09.20 | brlcad | ``Erik: beats me, the only guys that can get to it will be isp support staff |
| 15:10.07 | ``Erik | I was doing a system upgrade on it and came across this in the mergemaster pass |
| 15:10.08 | ``Erik | -ttyv7 "/usr/libexec/getty autologin" cons25 on secure |
| 15:10.08 | ``Erik | +ttyv7 "/usr/libexec/getty Pc" cons25 on secure |
| 15:10.22 | clock_ | brlcad: with proprietary tool it would be like: Oh - my bike dynamo broke down. I see - I need a C shaped part here. Now I need to cough up $20,000 for a licence, draw it, print it, cut it out with a hacksaw, and replace |
| 15:10.30 | clock_ | Really a bargain |
| 15:10.50 | brlcad | ``Erik: not sure what that means, so whatever works for me :) |
| 15:11.01 | ``Erik | well |
| 15:11.04 | clock_ | How much does that we-can't-even-support-our-customer Sold Works cost? |
| 15:11.14 | ``Erik | alt+f8 gives a free root shell right now |
| 15:11.22 | ``Erik | the change mergemaster wants to put in would put a login prompt there |
| 15:11.40 | archivist | clock_, $4000someone said the other day |
| 15:11.41 | brlcad | all of the commercials are 5-50k a seat for non-academic use |
| 15:11.54 | clock_ | $4000 for a bike dynamo replacement. Really a discount. |
| 15:12.07 | clock_ | replacement -> repait |
| 15:12.10 | clock_ | repair |
| 15:12.19 | brlcad | there's also the base system, and then *everything* is a plugin (and costs additional) |
| 15:12.29 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:12.40 | ``Erik | want to draw a wire? no problem, just buy the wire addon to pro/e for a mere $5k |
| 15:12.40 | clock_ | lol |
| 15:12.46 | ``Erik | per seat, per year |
| 15:12.48 | brlcad | so you want to run a wire, that's another 3k; want sketches, another 5k, etc |
| 15:13.11 | clock_ | Want a 5mm hole and did only 4mm ones before? Buy a 5mm hole plugin for a wonderful discount price |
| 15:13.51 | ``Erik | not quite that bad, but "specialized" geometry is price per primitive more or less |
| 15:14.00 | clock_ | ZOMG |
| 15:14.24 | brlcad | the ability to render images, export to other CAD systems, evaluate geometry (volume/mass/materials/etc), and most advanced modeling concepts come as 'extra' features |
| 15:14.52 | clock_ | I see BRL-CAD is packed with free extras |
| 15:15.03 | ``Erik | this tty line is concerning me... how did it get there, why is it there, should it go away, does it mean a compromise and a fresh install, ... |
| 15:26.54 | brlcad | ``Erik: possibly just when it was initially set up by the staff it had that, and just didn't change it when you did the first upgrade? |
| 15:27.53 | brlcad | i'm not worried about people that can physically walk up to the console.. |
| 15:28.06 | brlcad | now if you can get to that from other means, then it might be a problem |
| 15:29.20 | brlcad | also, are you talking about old or new? |
| 15:29.55 | brlcad | because current .bz has that line as well.. |
| 15:30.14 | brlcad | don't see any harm in setting it to Pc |
| 15:36.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30360 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/header.sh: one line too many on wrapped headers |
| 15:40.37 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:40.42 | ``Erik | <-- starts pondering lunch |
| 15:41.48 | brlcad | dude, you need to eat breakfast more |
| 15:44.16 | ``Erik | heh, nah, I just like to plan early |
| 15:44.39 | ``Erik | more of a social thing than anything else, I have canned foods in my desk if I actually get hungry |
| 16:25.44 | ``Erik | got 5 for lunch, brlcad, interested? |
| 16:32.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30361 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (40 files): |
| 16:32.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the start of applying a consistent style to the sources using the (emacs-based) |
| 16:32.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: source formatting scripts. the inlined neatly aligned tabs are a real pain but |
| 16:32.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: hopefully is a one-time shift/indent change (to 4-char indents, tab stops at 8). |
| 16:32.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: still testing but looks like it's working well. |
| 16:32.44 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:33.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30362 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/batch-indent-region.el: force case-label lines to indent since that's not set with stroustrup or k&r. probably need to provide our own KNF c-style-alist settings, but good enough for now to deal with case indents. |
| 16:34.33 | brlcad | ``Erik: where to? |
| 16:34.38 | ``Erik | d'no yet |
| 16:35.03 | starseek1r | \/quit |
| 16:35.12 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:35.14 | ``Erik | \o/ he quit! |
| 16:35.21 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:35.24 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:37.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30363 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/indent.sh: ignore the m4 files. gets them pretty much totally wrong. |
| 16:37.31 | starseek1r | brlcad: How do I make irssi use all of a re-sized terminal? |
| 16:37.56 | alex_joni | what kind of terminal? |
| 16:38.02 | ``Erik | irssi doesn't handle sigwinch? O.o |
| 16:38.45 | alex_joni | starseek1r: use screen first :) |
| 16:39.03 | ``Erik | or just use bx |
| 16:39.06 | ``Erik | *cough* O:-) |
| 16:40.06 | alex_joni | starseek1r: http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Irssi |
| 16:40.11 | brlcad | starseek1r: ctrl-a F |
| 16:40.31 | brlcad | irssi just expands |
| 16:40.36 | louipc | hmm it does it automatically for me |
| 16:40.36 | brlcad | screen needs to be told to expand |
| 16:40.58 | brlcad | irssi does it auto too |
| 16:42.15 | brlcad | there is some problem with logging into .bz though and later resizing the terminal, don't think it's set up for proper resizing after logging in (so set your terminal before logging in) |
| 16:42.29 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:42.49 | louipc | screen expands auto for me :D |
| 16:42.49 | ``Erik | japan house? |
| 16:43.11 | brlcad | aiight |
| 16:43.23 | ``Erik | ok, we're leaving now, we lost one so with you, it's 5 |
| 16:43.27 | ``Erik | seeya there :) |
| 16:44.00 | brlcad | ok |
| 16:44.02 | starseek1r | brlcad: after lunch, I have a few dozen dumb questions about combination matrix editing and related issues, if you don't mind |
| 16:44.17 | brlcad | ok |
| 16:47.29 | starseek1r | ls |
| 16:48.09 | brlcad | ls: Fatal I/O Error |
| 16:57.54 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:58.14 | starseek1r | Ah, that's better - Apparently I needed an xterm to have it work :-) |
| 17:35.46 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matt@74.86.45.130) | |
| 18:11.29 | ``Erik | heh |
| 18:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30364 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/btclsh/btclsh.vcproj: Set the "Compile As" option to default. |
| 18:27.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30365 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: Mods to accomodate a few apps on Windows that still have problems with inline. |
| 18:28.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30366 10/brlcad/trunk/include/tclcad.h: Fix Tclcad_Init declaration. |
| 18:32.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30367 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/tclInt.h: Add more checks before defining inline. |
| 18:34.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30368 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/blt/src/bltInt.h: Add more checks before defining inline. |
| 18:35.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30369 10/brlcad/trunk/src/bwish/cadAppInit.c: Cad_AppInit returns an int. |
| 18:35.38 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-077-025.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 18:36.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30370 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/tclcad.c: Tclcad_Init returns an int. |
| 18:41.02 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
| 18:41.02 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 18:52.48 | ``Erik | oed told me you're a weirdo, so I guess it's mutual :) |
| 18:53.18 | starseek1r | heh - fair enough |
| 18:53.51 | starseek1r | Bob showed me a command that will translate a combination, but even after reading the Appendix A in VolII it's not clicking. |
| 18:57.57 | starseek1r | brlcad: the volII appendix gives the syntax for the oed command as "oed path_lhs path_rhs", and on a test combination "oed / testcomb/test1.s" appears to be working |
| 18:58.35 | starseek1r | What I'm not following is the reason for the first "/" and why I need to specify a primiative when I'm operating on the combination as a whole |
| 19:00.43 | starseek1r | Or, more generally, I'm surprised the command "oed testcomb.c" didn't put me in the correct mode from the get-go |
| 19:00.57 | starseek1r | Which suggest I'm missing something conceptually |
| 19:02.03 | yukonbob | starseek1r: the lhs is where the transform is "rooted" or based from... |
| 19:02.34 | yukonbob | (in my mind) |
| 19:04.18 | starseek1r | yukonbob: But isn't the transform with respect to the global grid itself? The target combination has a "starting point" inherent to its definition(?) so where does another "root" come in? |
| 19:05.19 | yukonbob | starseek1r: /me wil have to play to re-familiarize self, but I'm pretty sure it's how I came to understand it working, and thinking in that term has proved useful and correct so far... |
| 19:05.23 | yukonbob | 1 sec. |
| 19:10.00 | yukonbob | starseek1r: ok -- here's what I'm thinking... the lhs is the relative origin, and the rhs is the object itself. |
| 19:10.44 | yukonbob | so if you've got a building, you could move a light-fixture wrt the ceiling, the room, or the house, depending on the lhs. |
| 19:11.21 | starseek1r | But I thought the keypoint served the "orientation" purpose? |
| 19:11.48 | yukonbob | "keypoint"? |
| 19:14.35 | starseek1r | If in oed mode, type keypoint |
| 19:16.04 | starseek1r | If I understand correctly, that point is the "rotate about this" point |
| 19:16.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30371 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vfont/Makefile.am: need to be able to find tcl.h (for bu.h) |
| 19:16.30 | louipc | center of rotation? |
| 19:16.40 | starseek1r | Apparently |
| 19:18.31 | starseek1r | Changing keypoint also impacts translate |
| 19:19.15 | starseek1r | Which is what I would expect, but that still leaves me wondering... |
| 19:19.39 | louipc | yeah makes sense |
| 19:20.16 | louipc | you can't define a different centre for each of those operations? |
| 19:20.18 | yukonbob | heh -- /me can't get any oed to work :P -- |
| 19:21.11 | starseek1r | louipc: You mean one center for rotate, another for translate? |
| 19:21.16 | louipc | like say I had a square and I wanted the top right corner of the square to fit exactly at the top right corner of a bigger square I'd use the top-right as the centre of translation |
| 19:21.51 | louipc | like you can dynamically select the centre for the operation |
| 19:21.55 | yukonbob | ok |
| 19:22.16 | louipc | depending on what's most convenient and logical |
| 19:23.18 | starseek1r | Right, but don't you do that by setting the keypoint? |
| 19:23.52 | louipc | not necessarily |
| 19:24.09 | yukonbob | starseek1r: have you swapped components back/forth between lhs and rhs and watched their effect? |
| 19:24.43 | louipc | I don't really know what the keypoint is though |
| 19:25.51 | louipc | is it defined in the object or the operation? |
| 19:26.19 | yukonbob | I'm looking at the docs for "permute" and it mentions keypoint as has been mentioned here... it sounds like the orgin about which rot would rotate, for example... |
| 19:30.26 | starseek1r | Apparently, "/" is read as null by the oed command, since on the rhs it returns the error "rhs must not be null" |
| 19:32.17 | louipc | this oed is some higher level thinking |
| 19:32.53 | louipc | or the docs are just badly written :P |
| 19:34.46 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matt@74.86.45.130) | |
| 19:34.51 | starseek1r | Now, I can see where you might want to translate a shape only within one combination... |
| 19:35.00 | starseek1r | hmm, hang on, let me make a test case... |
| 19:38.21 | yukonbob | rhs must end with a primitive. |
| 19:40.11 | starseek1r | Right, although I still don't quite see why |
| 19:40.17 | louipc | ah I think I get it |
| 19:40.32 | louipc | it's like dragging you either from your ears or your toes |
| 19:41.20 | louipc | where are your ears gonna end up after I've dragged you 'over there'? |
| 19:43.50 | starseek1r | OK, I think I have a test case that demonstrates the usefulness of the lhs vs the rhs |
| 19:44.23 | starseek1r | louipc: You mean when you specify a destination it's for a control point on a shape? |
| 19:46.47 | louipc | erm the last primitive in the path is the reference shape :P |
| 19:47.38 | louipc | I'm just gleaning this from the VOLII heh I've never played with it |
| 19:49.41 | starseek1r | Yeah, saw that - just not sure what it means... |
| 19:50.54 | louipc | yeah it's not so clear |
| 19:52.03 | louipc | oed edits everything right? scale, rotation, position... |
| 20:02.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30372 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/fbed.c: I believe we only need SIGCLD or SIGCHLD. |
| 20:09.03 | ``Erik | brlcad, wake up, got a reasonably warm issue |
| 20:18.49 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30373 10/brlcad/trunk/ (55 files in 3 dirs): update libpng to 1.2.25 (coverity fixes) |
| 20:32.25 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@77-56-82-13.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:58.14 | yukonbob | starseek1r: post a link when you're finished writing ;) |
| 21:01.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30374 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Mods to accomodate the location change of vfont. |
| 21:45.53 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874A7F.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:40.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30375 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkimg/pngtcl/ (pngtclDecls.h pngtclStubInit.c): No longer using png_read_destroy and png_write_destroy. |
| 23:36.22 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.112.28) | |
| 00:57.31 | brlcad | looks like you all got the jist of oed |
| 00:58.48 | brlcad | the matrix is placed between the lhs and the rhs effectively modifying the object immediately to the right in the context of the object/path to the left |
| 01:01.51 | brlcad | the reason/need for specifying all the way down to a primitive is in-part to utilize an existing coordinate reference as a control point, and in-part an implementation detail of the fact that combinations don't actually have coordinates |
| 01:10.56 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@155.98.20.220) | |
| 01:17.42 | starseeker | brlcad: I tried my hand at writing a tutorial in docbook |
| 01:55.30 | louipc | did it break? |
| 02:04.12 | starseeker | apparently |
| 02:05.36 | starseeker | docbook is not plug and play - everyone stores their dtd files and whatnot everywhere, and without pointing to the correct one and invoking the correct chicken sacrificial dance options you get errors... |
| 02:06.02 | louipc | hah sounds messy |
| 02:06.30 | starseeker | When it works it's OK, but it's not NEARLY as plug and play as tetex/texlive |
| 02:06.53 | starseeker | Not that they're any less messy, but at least it's hidden from the users |
| 02:25.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30376 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/ (16 files): update the indentation ws style of the shell scripts. |
| 02:30.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30377 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/indent.sh: ignore sh/ dir scripts. it gets almost as many wrong as it gets right due to quirky scriptisms. |
| 02:33.53 | brlcad | it doesn't need to be robust, just have to set everything up once and in one place for the most part |
| 02:36.00 | brlcad | either way, like I said before -- there are several other pragmatic reasons why docbook is the format of choice (and the reason many major projects have adopted it successfully) .. |
| 02:37.34 | brlcad | never said it was easy to set the toolchain up, but having done it before several times in the past I can say that really isn't the hardest part (which is actually converting the docs in a useful manner and setting up xslt/dsssl styles) |
| 02:39.09 | starseeker | Oh, I know - I'm not arguing against docbook |
| 02:39.19 | brlcad | ESR has a really nice writeup that goes into some of the reasons in a condensed form as well as just provides a decent tutorial |
| 02:39.24 | starseeker | I'm just annoyed at whoever is building the toolchain |
| 02:39.33 | brlcad | even talks about it as it pertains to Tex |
| 02:39.36 | brlcad | http://tldp.org/HOWTO/html_single/DocBook-Demystification-HOWTO/ |
| 02:39.54 | brlcad | yeah, the tools aren't robust yet, and the format keeps getting changed |
| 02:40.13 | brlcad | like dealing with html 1 and 2 back in the days with the variety of (broken) browsers |
| 02:40.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Do you happen to have a working jadetex setup at the moment? |
| 02:41.34 | brlcad | that's probably the crux of the problem |
| 02:41.37 | brlcad | forget dsssl |
| 02:41.40 | starseeker | I'd like to sent you my oed writeup to see if it looks useful, but I can't generate a pdf right now |
| 02:41.43 | louipc | xsl doesn't seem too tough |
| 02:41.46 | brlcad | (i.e. forget jade) |
| 02:41.57 | brlcad | yeah, xsl is probably a LOT easier to deal with |
| 02:42.32 | brlcad | as it avoids the whole sgml heritage in jade that lets you set up nearly arbitrary mappings/translations but makes things utterly complex in the process |
| 02:43.51 | brlcad | apt-get install xmlto |
| 02:44.20 | brlcad | emerge xmlto |
| 02:44.43 | louipc | pacman -S xmlto |
| 02:45.43 | brlcad | probably also want xsltproc and/or fop |
| 02:46.55 | brlcad | (xsltproc is in the libxslt package usually) |
| 02:48.18 | louipc | cool |
| 02:49.29 | louipc | maybe docbook-xsl, docbook-xml as well |
| 02:50.26 | brlcad | yeah, presumably premade xsl styles for html/pdf/etc and the various xml dtd's? |
| 02:52.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30378 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/indent.sh: know what, just screw sh files. not worth it -- they don't generally matter. |
| 02:53.02 | louipc | yep |
| 02:55.50 | brlcad | just installed both on .bz |
| 03:00.17 | starseeker | Grr - who on gentoo is managing the tex environment?? |
| 03:01.08 | brlcad | installing a few more things |
| 03:01.28 | brlcad | (like tetex) |
| 03:02.28 | starseeker | Surprising - this isn't like gentoo |
| 03:03.31 | brlcad | did you see how firebird did their toolchain? |
| 03:04.02 | starseeker | I haven't had a chance to dig into it yet - this oed thing was kinda a "spur of the moment" response to the problem at hand |
| 03:04.21 | starseeker | should have realized it would open the docbook can of worms |
| 03:04.22 | brlcad | does it make sense now? |
| 03:05.23 | brlcad | mostly because there are several things that need to be known for a matrix to be applied whether implicitly or explicitly, and oed approaches it from an existing data perspective that fits in with some of the other commands |
| 03:05.36 | starseeker | Yes, I think so |
| 03:05.50 | brlcad | (arcs, btw, are paths .. that's a horrible inconsistency that can be confusing) |
| 03:06.31 | starseeker | If I ever get this tutorial converted to a pdf you can take a look - it's basically me explaining it to myself and (hopefully) doing the same for others usefully |
| 03:07.35 | starseeker | Where are you storing the dtd files? |
| 03:08.23 | brlcad | ah ghod.. that's horrible .. it's trying to pull in X11 |
| 03:08.28 | brlcad | that ain't gonna fly |
| 03:08.59 | brlcad | mm.. dunno where it put them actually, probably somewhere under /usr/local/share |
| 03:09.54 | brlcad | yep, /usr/local/share/xml/docbook |
| 03:10.24 | starseeker | heh - rather different from my /usr/share/sgml/docbook/xml-dtd-4.4 |
| 03:11.07 | brlcad | there's a /usr/local/share/sgml/docbook too but that has the sgml variants (want to use the xml ones) |
| 03:13.40 | starseeker | hmm - /usr/local/share/xmlto/format/docbook/../fo/pdf: Can't open /usr/local/share/xmlto/format/docbook/../fo/pdf: No such file or directory |
| 03:14.07 | starseeker | does exist without the .. though |
| 03:14.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30379 10/brlcad/trunk/bench/lgt.sh: ws indent style |
| 03:15.35 | brlcad | where are you getting .. from? |
| 03:15.59 | starseeker | error being spit out by xmlto |
| 03:16.07 | starseeker | on bz |
| 03:16.16 | brlcad | what's the command? |
| 03:16.26 | starseeker | xmlto pdf oed_doc.xml |
| 03:16.47 | starseeker | wait, I'm an idiot |
| 03:16.50 | starseeker | one sec... |
| 03:17.08 | starseeker | no, reproduced itself |
| 03:19.02 | brlcad | hm, well I can do the easy fix and just put fo/pdf where it's looking for it |
| 03:19.26 | starseeker | works for me |
| 03:20.09 | brlcad | hm? |
| 03:20.36 | starseeker | er - whatever you want to do :-) |
| 03:20.57 | starseeker | Given sufficient time I can probably straighten out my home box if you'd rather not clutter up bz |
| 03:21.53 | brlcad | it's not clutter, that's one of the primary functions of the box |
| 03:22.02 | brlcad | (cad-related stuff) |
| 03:26.03 | brlcad | aha! |
| 03:26.12 | brlcad | the .. is coming from within the formatter |
| 03:26.16 | brlcad | they're just scripts |
| 03:31.06 | starseeker | Hmm - now it's recursively calling ../fo and ends up with a filename too long error with a lot of ../fo s in it |
| 03:37.31 | brlcad | yeah, that was my "fix" |
| 03:37.33 | brlcad | i found the problem |
| 03:37.45 | brlcad | stale build files .. it didn't install everything |
| 03:38.18 | brlcad | dunno if i had a previous xmlto version installed or something, but there is supposed to be a ../fo/ dir (and it's in their source tarball) .. reinstalling with a patch |
| 03:40.26 | brlcad | woot |
| 03:40.27 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/tmp/oed/ |
| 03:40.53 | brlcad | missing a tool for pdf |
| 03:42.43 | starseeker | Wow that's ugly - I must have my markup messed up |
| 03:43.25 | starseeker | Thanks brlcad for powering through it! |
| 03:45.26 | starseeker | Do I need a para for each command? (ick) |
| 03:48.06 | yukonbob | starseeker: or perhaps a complete blank link between? |
| 03:49.02 | starseeker | Hmm - apparently the "literal" tag lies |
| 03:50.42 | yukonbob | programlisting may be useful too.. |
| 03:54.56 | brlcad | starseeker: it's not the tag -- that is the stylesheet |
| 03:55.09 | brlcad | you're just getting a generic stylesheet from xmlto |
| 03:55.33 | starseeker | Oh, ok |
| 03:55.37 | brlcad | but yeah, there very likely are other taggins needed |
| 03:56.11 | starseeker | yukonbob: That's the early draft - I was hoping to have brlcad tear it up first |
| 03:57.34 | brlcad | yeah, you're not supposed to actually *read* it .. :) that was just to see the conversion |
| 03:58.41 | yukonbob | heh -- should I keep the '"press accept" is extraneous when "accept" will do what you want' to myself too? |
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| 03:59.12 | starseeker | I dunno - do we want to keep the "press *" convention going? |
| 04:00.11 | brlcad | accept/reject are the only two iirc that have shortcuts |
| 04:00.38 | brlcad | otherwise there's several dozen other things you can "press" that don't have any other command that provides that feature |
| 04:04.09 | starseeker | arrrrrgh |
| 04:04.43 | starseeker | how ironic considering I thought Tex would be the stable part of this... |
| 04:04.49 | yukonbob | heh |
| 04:10.44 | yukonbob | heh -- esr's document say's "[this] is aimed at authors [...] on Linux, but should be useful for people [...] on other Unixes as well" |
| 04:22.19 | yukonbob | starseeker: did you run the xmlto, or did brl-cad? |
| 04:22.26 | starseeker | he did |
| 04:22.28 | louipc | you poor gentoo users |
| 04:22.40 | yukonbob | starseeker: ok -- good night :) |
| 04:22.53 | starseeker | louipc: Normally everything does well - docbook seems to be a weakness for some reason... |
| 04:23.34 | starseeker | louipc: I'll take a closer look at what firebird does tomorrow |
| 04:23.45 | starseeker | er brlcad rather |
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| 04:29.23 | brlcad | howdy iraytrace |
| 04:29.36 | iraytrace | Evening! |
| 04:29.46 | brlcad | how's that class? |
| 04:30.01 | brlcad | (rtrt) |
| 04:30.20 | iraytrace | 1 is a pain in the (ahem) 1 is great, 1 interesting but tedious |
| 04:30.35 | iraytrace | rtrt is great |
| 04:31.06 | iraytrace | about to do HF and acceleration structures |
| 04:32.19 | iraytrace | congrats at putting machine.h to rest |
| 04:33.10 | brlcad | still have just a little more to do, but might even get a dbupgrade that works on non-native v4 databases working soon |
| 04:33.21 | brlcad | now that it can pretty much pick at run-time |
| 04:33.38 | brlcad | as well as mac universal binaries |
| 04:33.41 | iraytrace | that would be *kewl* |
| 04:35.39 | iraytrace | Touched a MacBook Air for the first time today. It's a lot more sturdy than I had feared it might be. |
| 04:36.53 | brlcad | starseeker: the tex tools it needed are installed now, but it dies somewhere in the tex processing so more work/learning still needed |
| 04:37.21 | yukonbob | brlcad: you installed fop as well? |
| 04:37.25 | brlcad | iraytrace: yeah, I saw one in an apple store a little while back. pretty slick |
| 04:37.52 | iraytrace | What's needing TeX? |
| 04:38.34 | louipc | I need to put together a decent resume for myself hmm |
| 04:38.36 | brlcad | yukonbob: not yet, it's got a doosie of a dep |
| 04:38.50 | brlcad | iraytrace: some docbook processing tools |
| 04:39.12 | yukonbob | brlcad: that's why I ended up working through the jadetex issues instead :P |
| 04:41.03 | brlcad | just waiting on the dep to download |
| 04:41.08 | yukonbob | good luck. Enjoy the Java ;) |
| 04:42.00 | brlcad | fop is actually what we used many years ago when there were *no* decent parser tools .. and it actually did work, and worked well.. |
| 04:43.12 | yukonbob | you mean FO parsers? |
| 04:43.23 | yukonbob | afaik, it's _still_ the only FO parser |
| 04:43.48 | brlcad | I mean going from docbook through FOP to various formats |
| 04:50.42 | starseeker | Ah - HA! |
| 04:51.46 | starseeker | xmlto fo oed_doc.xml; fop oed_doc.fo -pdf oed_doc.pdf |
| 04:53.26 | starseeker | brlcad: Should we make our own stylesheet for "official" BRL-CAD stuff, or does someone out there have one you like? |
| 05:08.02 | louipc | starseeker: hey you know if you're actually serious about going to debian you ought to give arch linux a try first ;) |
| 05:09.05 | starseeker | Heh |
| 05:09.30 | starseeker | OK, this looks slightly less horrid (again a formatting demo): http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/oed_doc-draft.pdf |
| 05:17.05 | louipc | man that l (letter L) looks exactly like a 1 (number one) |
| 05:17.14 | louipc | l comb1.c |
| 05:18.45 | starseeker | I'll add a note about that |
| 05:19.14 | starseeker | And now I really do need to go to bed - at least I can sleep now :-) |
| 05:19.19 | starseeker | yay pdf... |
| 05:19.41 | brlcad | woot |
| 05:19.44 | louipc | the font it is |
| 05:19.48 | louipc | starseeker: very nice though |
| 05:24.01 | Axman6 | starseeker: i hope that was a serious yay... |
| 05:26.28 | brlcad | starseeker: 'yes' .. i'm sure there's a stylesheet out there that would be suitable if not a great start |
| 05:27.05 | brlcad | heck, even a variant of that clean one you just used isn't all that bad for starters if some of the quirks can be fixed |
| 05:37.30 | brlcad | mm.. the firebird pdf style is pretty nice |
| 05:51.41 | PrezKennedy | course we have a Russian guy writing them... |
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| 06:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30380 10/brlcad/trunk/include/opennurbs_ext.h: C++ mode |
| 06:21.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30381 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/footer.sh: C or C++ files should have the c-file-style set to stroustrup |
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| 11:18.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30382 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: |
| 11:18.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: nifty, the top-level makefile will obey a DISTCHECK_CONFIGURE_FLAGS directive. |
| 11:18.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: make --enable-all one of the things it does during distcheck so that all files |
| 11:18.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: are included in the dist and the compilation of everything is tested. |
| 11:19.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30383 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: bump to a .2 patch revision for ajem release testing (this is 7.12.0 prerelease testing) |
| 11:22.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30384 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: make the ajem test rev unique, bump it up again |
| 11:23.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30385 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/libpng/Makefile.am: extra dist mismatch |
| 11:33.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30386 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h config_win.h): this should solve the MS Visual Studio inline problem: define (the C) inline as the Microsoft specific __inline in config_win.h |
| 11:34.25 | d_rossberg | i hope this works for Bob too |
| 11:34.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30387 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (4 files in 4 dirs): few additional files detected missing from the dist |
| 11:35.19 | brlcad | yeah, I really think he was just hacking down the wrong path |
| 11:35.43 | brlcad | really shouldn't have needed those tcl/tk mods to make inline work .. they were working! |
| 11:35.44 | clock_ | They are preparing to shoot a satellite :) |
| 11:36.06 | clock_ | shoot down a satellite |
| 11:57.44 | starseeker | Axman6: Indeed it was a serious yay :-) |
| 11:57.58 | Axman6 | excellent :P |
| 11:58.23 | d_rossberg | brlcad: in standard-tcl the VS inline=__inline is set as a -D compiler parameter |
| 13:44.37 | brlcad | d_rossberg: good to know, maybe that is all that is needed for the C-side too in config_win.h |
| 13:56.03 | d_rossberg | i put the inline=__inline in the config_win.h C (i.e. !__cplusplus) branch |
| 14:21.27 | ``Erik | *yawrgn* |
| 14:21.39 | ``Erik | iraytrace stayed for more than 5 seconds! |
| 14:22.14 | ``Erik | <-- ponders logging into his box and tweaking the irc client say it plays the old 'impossible mission' intro soundbyte... "stay a while... stayyyy FOREEVVEEEERRRRRRRRR" |
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| 18:09.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30388 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/g_qa.1: Fix formatting for brlman command. |
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| 19:21.39 | ``Erik | wow, I feel retarded |
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| 22:11.58 | ``Erik | hehehe nice... "*BSD is for People who Love *nix; Linux is for People who Hate Windows" |
| 03:08.49 | brlcad | ahhh.. prime rib *woot* |
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| 05:30.08 | starseeker | OK, this is sorta cool: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/cassini-glass-titan.png |
| 05:30.44 | starseeker | fun with the projection shader (image from NASA, actually of Titan) |
| 05:32.32 | starseeker | Notice how the titan image is actually visible distorted through the glass probe :) |
| 05:35.01 | iraytrace | kewl! |
| 05:36.28 | iraytrace | Of course, you modeled that in mged, right? ;-) |
| 05:47.19 | starseeker | Hehe |
| 05:47.26 | starseeker | no, it's a dxf conversion |
| 05:47.29 | PrezKennedy | prime rib?? where?? |
| 05:48.01 | starseeker | Original is here: http://space.jpl.nasa.gov/models/ |
| 05:48.26 | PrezKennedy | starseeker, have you tried Celestia? |
| 05:48.35 | starseeker | No, actually |
| 05:48.53 | starseeker | This was more a test of and learning exercise on BRL-CAD |
| 05:50.52 | PrezKennedy | just figured id mention it if you were interested in that sort of thing |
| 05:51.15 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: was one of ze olive tree's specials |
| 05:51.31 | PrezKennedy | noooooo and i missed it!! |
| 05:51.56 | starseeker | PrezKennedy: I've heard of it and heard it's good |
| 05:52.14 | PrezKennedy | starseeker, yes it's great |
| 05:52.58 | starseeker | PrezKennedy: Not so flashy, but if you're curious about the Apollo era computers this site is awesome: http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/index.html |
| 05:53.21 | PrezKennedy | ibiblio has all the cool stuff |
| 05:55.05 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, a domain squatter is trying to sell osgaming.com for $2.500 |
| 05:55.53 | louipc | os being open source? |
| 05:56.29 | PrezKennedy | in osgaming.net's case... yes |
| 05:56.41 | PrezKennedy | for osgaming.com, they're trying to market it as off-shore gaming |
| 05:56.51 | louipc | aah off shore |
| 05:57.06 | PrezKennedy | yeah at first i had no idea why it would be so big either |
| 05:57.13 | louipc | i hate squatters |
| 05:57.28 | starseeker | Ah well, tomorrow |
| 05:57.44 | PrezKennedy | i hate em too |
| 05:59.06 | starseeker | <evil chuckle> or I could model Titan itself and heck with the picture :-) |
| 06:05.57 | brlcad | starseeker: could also try turning on smoothed normals |
| 06:07.03 | brlcad | bot_smooth or smooth_bot command in mged, forget which |
| 06:07.42 | brlcad | operates on individual bot primitives, though, so might have to script a loop to iterate over all bot primitives or set the property some other way |
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| 13:36.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30389 10/brlcad/trunk/include/brep.h: Having extern "C" around vmath.h and bu.h brings about the use of "C" linkage with templates when __cplusplus is defined. |
| 13:40.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30390 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/bwish/bwish.vcproj: Added BRLCAD_DLL, HAVE_CONFIG_H and BRLCADBUILD. Removed IGNORE_CONFIG_H. |
| 13:40.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30391 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/btclsh/btclsh.vcproj: Added BRLCAD_DLL, HAVE_CONFIG_H and BRLCADBUILD. Removed IGNORE_CONFIG_H. |
| 13:46.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30392 10/brlcad/trunk/src/bwish/cadAppInit.c: Clean up the headers a bit. |
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| 14:29.34 | ``Erik | *yargn* |
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| 19:18.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30393 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Define NOMINMAX before including windows.h to avoid clobbering std::numeric_limits<*>::min/max in C++ |
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| 22:19.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30394 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: define fmax using __max instead of max |
| 22:20.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30395 10/brlcad/trunk/src/bwish/cadAppInit.c: Include winsock2.h before any possible include of windows.h |
| 22:24.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30396 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Mods to compile brep. |
| 22:29.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30397 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_brep.cpp: Remove the ON_CLASS specifier (i.e. __declspec) for RT_MemoryArchive. |
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| 00:19.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30398 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/unix/Makefile.in: reapply the patch that installs libtcl.so and libtclstub.so, and conditionally installs the manual pages. |
| 00:20.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30399 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/unix/Makefile.in: reapply the patch that installs libtk.so and libtkstub.so, and conditionally installs the manual pages. |
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| 03:05.44 | starseeker | Shucks - mythbusters re-busted the Archimedes death ray |
| 03:07.51 | Axman6 | good call |
| 03:08.12 | starseeker | Axman6: What, the rebusting? |
| 03:08.23 | Axman6 | using BRL- |
| 03:08.26 | Axman6 | CAD* |
| 03:08.27 | starseeker | Ah |
| 03:08.30 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:09.28 | starseeker | Well, it would be an excuse to model a Roman ship... |
| 03:12.31 | louipc | yarrr |
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| 03:14.22 | yukonbob | ninjas operating archimedes deathray vs. a pirate ship (full of pirates, or course) -- two birds with one stone... |
| 03:14.30 | starseeker | In theory, it might actually be really simple to test a death ray setup if you know the properties of the mirrors |
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| 04:36.55 | brlcad | Maloeran: *ping* |
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| 05:52.16 | brlcad | is it possible to compile maxima without Tk ? |
| 05:52.43 | brlcad | the port seems hard-wired to tk84 |
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| 11:33.25 | starseeker | brlcad: Hmm. I think there is a "lisp-only" compile option that could avoid tk. tk should be needed only for xmaxima, so maybe disabling that... |
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| 11:34.07 | starseeker | brlcad: Which lisp are you building with? GCL might make the tk thing more difficult - I seem to recall they have their own bindings... |
| 11:34.19 | starseeker | I recommend sbcl if it's available. |
| 12:55.35 | brlcad | sbcl |
| 12:55.44 | starseeker | steel bank common lisp |
| 12:56.04 | starseeker | Maxima can be built with any of several lisp implementations as a foundation |
| 12:57.30 | brlcad | had four different options |
| 12:57.33 | brlcad | that installed okay |
| 12:57.47 | brlcad | it's maxima itself that has a dep set saying it wants tk |
| 12:58.05 | starseeker | OK. It might not have a disable flag - let me take a look |
| 12:58.59 | brlcad | i'm giving it a go to hack it off by hand |
| 12:59.07 | starseeker | ouch |
| 12:59.33 | starseeker | Don't worry too much brlcad - if it will take a lot of effort it's not that critical |
| 13:00.52 | starseeker | Confound it |
| 13:01.00 | starseeker | they don't have a disable X/tk flag |
| 13:06.32 | brlcad | well if you want to give a manual hacked compile a go, it should work -- all it's listed deps (except tk) are installed |
| 13:06.44 | starseeker | Cool - thanks! |
| 13:07.59 | brlcad | the ports system is in the middle of an upgrade, so things might disappear as they get updated |
| 13:08.09 | brlcad | lemme know if it looks like something is missing |
| 13:08.29 | brlcad | (but basically it's a full upgrade in progress, so even things like autoconf will disappear for a few min) |
| 13:08.57 | starseeker | Will do. My only concern so far is whether the Maxima guys stayed compatible with the 1.0.7 release of sbcl |
| 13:10.14 | starseeker | they may have |
| 13:16.33 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@212.15.177.5) | |
| 13:27.11 | starseeker | Interesting. The dumped lisp image won't load, but I CAN load the compiled fasl files and start the system |
| 13:27.51 | starseeker | Well, that should work fine |
| 13:28.06 | starseeker | Thanks Sean - appreciate it! |
| 13:28.32 | brlcad | got it working? |
| 13:28.37 | starseeker | Sort of |
| 13:28.59 | starseeker | The dumped lisp core is complaining about incorrect magic number, but I can load the system with a script |
| 13:29.13 | starseeker | eeeek |
| 13:29.42 | brlcad | "don't log out" if you use bash ;) |
| 13:29.46 | starseeker | Is rlwrap on this box anywhere? |
| 13:29.50 | starseeker | right :-) |
| 13:30.12 | brlcad | there it's back |
| 13:30.32 | starseeker | phew |
| 13:30.47 | brlcad | not too bad, none of the superuser accounts use bash |
| 13:30.57 | brlcad | so it would have been recoverable, just a pita |
| 13:31.04 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 13:31.52 | starseeker | If we can throw rlwrap on brlcad I think it should be good to go |
| 13:32.11 | starseeker | sbcl doesn't have a readline binding built in, so its default command line behavior is a bit like old style doss |
| 13:32.13 | starseeker | er dos |
| 13:33.19 | starseeker | Major system upgrades are always SO much fun... |
| 13:36.28 | brlcad | rlwrap installed |
| 13:43.12 | starseeker | Sweet! thanks much |
| 13:45.36 | starseeker | (being able to left arrow to fix a formula without erasing it is a nice feature...) |
| 14:26.00 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-020-141.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 14:38.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30400 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Added breplicator. |
| 14:40.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30401 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Initial check-in. |
| 14:42.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30402 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/patch/rpatch.f: ws |
| 14:46.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30403 10/brlcad/trunk/src/java/mil/army/arl/brlcad/ (BrlcadGeometry.java BrlcadGeometryServer.java Partition.java): add local variables footer |
| 14:47.07 | ``Erik | wait, what? fortran? |
| 14:47.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30404 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/ (footer.sh header.sh): add support for .java files |
| 14:50.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30405 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (8 files in 7 dirs): ws style updates for non-C source files that have been processed with indent.sh, making indentation consistent |
| 14:50.37 | ``Erik | what are you updating? the old bz machine? |
| 14:50.41 | brlcad | that's some old billy bob code |
| 14:50.46 | brlcad | yeah |
| 14:50.54 | brlcad | just a few things, not the whole thing |
| 14:51.31 | brlcad | portupgrade actually crashed mid-way, inconveniently leaving three ports deleted |
| 14:51.31 | ``Erik | "portupdate" like to rebuild a lot of stuff |
| 14:51.37 | ``Erik | ugh |
| 14:51.44 | ``Erik | crazy, did y ou pass it the -bu option? |
| 14:52.21 | brlcad | sorry, portmanager |
| 14:52.23 | brlcad | portmanager -u |
| 14:52.23 | ``Erik | <-- usually does "sudo portmanager -u -bu -l" |
| 14:52.47 | ``Erik | that -bu has saved my butt a couple times |
| 14:53.13 | brlcad | I was able to do the repairs before it wrecked any more havoc |
| 14:53.20 | brlcad | I don't really want the whole system to update |
| 14:53.33 | ``Erik | excuse to push the machine migration? :D |
| 14:53.50 | brlcad | just had to at least update the ports tree though, so everything will want to update |
| 14:55.17 | brlcad | did horrible on sh code |
| 15:15.05 | ``Erik | heh, ohloh got on slashdot's front page and got a lot of shit in the comments |
| 15:17.38 | ``Erik | "maybe playing strip poker against the naked robot wasn't such a good idea" |
| 15:18.59 | starseeker | Saw that |
| 15:19.36 | starseeker | I can see why people were uneasy - it's disconcerting to have people making professional judgements on you based on for-free/fun work |
| 15:19.59 | starseeker | Sort of ruins the relaxed atmosphere |
| 15:23.11 | ``Erik | plus loc is a shit metric, we've known that for 30 years *shrug8 |
| 15:23.23 | starseeker | indeed |
| 15:23.45 | ``Erik | probably the best thing microsoft ever did was break ibm's insistence on sloc for pay 25 years ago |
| 15:24.31 | starseeker | Certainly better than their "for non-commercial-use-only" doc releases |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30406 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/ (124 files in 10 dirs): |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: needs some run-time testing, but apply the style changes to the tcl sources. |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: indent.sh did surprisingly well at about 90% correctness though it was often |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: confused by embedded #'s in the sources. seeing other examples, it looks like |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: it's valid to quote the # (e.g. for upvar and #auto) and/or quote stringlists |
| 15:42.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: that have embeeded #'s but use {}'s. still needs testing. |
| 15:54.42 | brlcad | maxima is installed |
| 15:55.00 | starseeker | Cool! thank you |
| 16:00.45 | starseeker | Ah, maxima - my brain's math co-processor ;-) |
| 16:01.32 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:23.13 | starseeker | Hmm - rset var_linewidth 3 doesn't do anything to the model line drawings. Is it another setting? |
| 16:40.28 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874445.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:51.45 | starseeker | Anybody know if there's a way to smoothly zoom as opposed to clicking between large jumps? |
| 16:53.03 | starseeker | nevermind, found the zoom option on the command line |
| 19:41.53 | ``Erik | there's also "size" |
| 20:03.51 | brlcad | starseeker: there's no underscore |
| 20:03.54 | brlcad | run rset |
| 20:25.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30407 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.c cmd.h rtif.c): collapse some duplicate functions |
| 20:28.13 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.104.143) | |
| 20:36.32 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 20:49.36 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874445.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:04.13 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, duh - thanks |
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| 00:43.33 | killerflo | is there anyone who speaks german? |
| 00:44.06 | killerflo | ok i try in english |
| 00:45.00 | killerflo | i have installed brl-cad and i don't find the programm on my HD can somebody help me? |
| 00:45.10 | starseeker | try mged |
| 00:45.34 | starseeker | /usr/brlcad/bin/mged if install is in default location |
| 00:49.41 | killerflo | what is the command in terminal to show the content of /usr/brlcad/bin/ |
| 00:49.54 | starseeker | ls /usr/brlcad/bin |
| 00:50.16 | starseeker | on linux |
| 00:50.26 | starseeker | What operating system are you using? |
| 00:50.38 | killerflo | mac os x 10.4 |
| 00:50.43 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 00:51.11 | starseeker | Not sure where it is there - don't have a Mac handy |
| 00:52.00 | starseeker | Did you build it yourself or use the binary? |
| 00:52.10 | killerflo | binary |
| 00:52.37 | starseeker | Um. Did you put it in the Applications folder? |
| 00:53.34 | killerflo | normaly the programmes are installed in the application folder, but there is nothing new after the installation |
| 00:53.59 | killerflo | so it must be installed somewhere else |
| 00:54.08 | killerflo | but i can't find it |
| 00:54.19 | starseeker | What about a global search for mged |
| 01:02.50 | killerflo | i have a solution |
| 01:03.04 | starseeker | what's that? |
| 01:03.13 | killerflo | i have to run x11 and start it from there |
| 01:03.23 | killerflo | i found it in the folder u said |
| 01:03.30 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 01:03.44 | starseeker | working now? |
| 01:03.44 | killerflo | here is the solution http://www.nabble.com/Problem-with-installing-BRL-CAD-on-my-MacBook-td14826259.html |
| 01:04.30 | killerflo | yes it works thanks for help |
| 01:04.37 | starseeker | np - have fun! |
| 01:04.49 | killerflo | bye |
| 01:05.10 | *** part/#brlcad killerflo (n=5931fce0@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 01:22.59 | *** join/#brlcad Maloeran (n=maloeran@glvortex.net) | |
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| 03:15.36 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1128565083.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 03:16.17 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/latesteffort.png :) |
| 04:58.31 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@c-67-172-239-24.hsd1.co.comcast.net) | |
| 04:58.50 | brlcad | it's the same on mac as it is for linux, exactly the same other than telling users that they have to start up X11 |
| 10:13.24 | *** join/#brlcad bjohan (n=bjohan@c83-254-64-17.bredband.comhem.se) | |
| 10:13.45 | bjohan | can brl-cad be used to generate drawings? |
| 11:16.28 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-85-74.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 14:24.31 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: query please... |
| 14:30.04 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@61-69-24-178.netspeed.com.au) | |
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| 18:12.00 | starseeker | brlcad: How's this look? http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/earth-model-cutaway.png |
| 18:16.43 | starseeker | (for those of you wondering, yes it is to scale (or pretty close) and I did model the outer layers as ell rather than sph |
| 18:23.18 | brlcad | hah |
| 18:23.23 | brlcad | that's pretty damn cool |
| 18:23.55 | starseeker | Took NASA's fact page for the data, and wikipedia for rough depths of the various layers |
| 18:29.29 | starseeker | Sean, can I position the "camera" corresponding to the raytracing window? |
| 18:30.38 | *** join/#brlcad elite01_ (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-098-141.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 18:36.08 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 18:36.17 | starseeker | nevermind |
| 18:36.29 | brlcad | the raytrace view is the "camera" view |
| 18:36.32 | starseeker | I was "zooming in" on the cassini model, but it's so tiny |
| 18:36.46 | starseeker | the earth under it is one pixel on this scale |
| 18:36.52 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:37.02 | brlcad | you can probably get them both into view with perspective |
| 18:37.11 | starseeker | Ah - good idea |
| 18:38.02 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 18:38.19 | yukonbob | :) hi starseeker |
| 18:38.24 | yukonbob | having fun? |
| 18:38.30 | starseeker | Yep :-) |
| 18:38.38 | yukonbob | carry on, then :) |
| 18:38.52 | starseeker | I made a wild remark to brlcad yesterday, and he didn't let me get away with it |
| 18:39.06 | yukonbob | ?What comment? |
| 18:39.11 | yukonbob | *remark |
| 18:39.31 | starseeker | private chat |
| 18:40.38 | starseeker | working on making some docs, and my example model didn't go so hot for what I was calling it. So I said I'd call it Earth |
| 18:40.47 | starseeker | opps |
| 18:41.16 | yukonbob | nice |
| 18:41.45 | starseeker | So this morning I decided I'd give it a go, and one thing sorta led to another... |
| 18:42.35 | brlcad | did you get internal texture working or is that external? |
| 18:44.23 | starseeker | external |
| 18:44.57 | starseeker | it's actually pretty simple - a texture shader for the external sphere, then the rest as basic shapes |
| 18:46.40 | starseeker | yikes |
| 18:48.02 | yukonbob | starseeker: what images are you using? |
| 18:48.18 | starseeker | brlcad found them: http://visibleearth.nasa.gov/view_rec.php?id=7100 |
| 18:49.53 | louipc | lol @ canada vs usa |
| 18:50.43 | louipc | snow , no snow |
| 18:54.03 | starseeker | brb |
| 18:54.39 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 18:56.20 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (i=clock@77-56-85-74.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:56.59 | Z80-Boy | I just installed latest official brlcad on fresh new Linux system. |
| 18:57.19 | Z80-Boy | When I run "mged" it says backgrounding or initializing or something like that and waits for a long time |
| 18:57.25 | Z80-Boy | then it returns with "Detached" |
| 18:57.29 | Z80-Boy | no window appears |
| 18:57.35 | Z80-Boy | no mged process is running afterwards |
| 18:57.42 | brlcad | how'd you install it? |
| 18:57.50 | Z80-Boy | During the wait, one there is one mged process and one mged [defunct] process |
| 18:57.57 | Z80-Boy | ./configure --prefix=/usr; make; make install |
| 18:58.09 | brlcad | ah |
| 18:58.16 | Z80-Boy | is it wrong? |
| 18:58.18 | brlcad | add --enable-all to configure |
| 18:58.24 | Z80-Boy | then it's gonna work? |
| 18:58.32 | brlcad | make clean && make |
| 18:59.40 | Z80-Boy | OK doing that |
| 19:00.19 | louipc | hmm shouldn't it be --prefix=/usr/brlcad? |
| 19:00.28 | Z80-Boy | I don't know |
| 19:00.32 | Z80-Boy | normal programs take /usr |
| 19:00.37 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 19:00.47 | louipc | you might have borked your system |
| 19:01.03 | louipc | yeah but brlcad libs conflict with some essential linux libs |
| 19:01.11 | Z80-Boy | lol |
| 19:01.26 | Z80-Boy | isn't it freetype or fontconfig or something like that? |
| 19:01.41 | louipc | that's why the default configure; make; make install installs in /usr/brlcad |
| 19:02.14 | louipc | Z80-Boy: I think it's some kernel stuff too |
| 19:02.27 | starseeker | Anybody got enough ram to convert that 13 meg sucker on NASA's website to a PNG? |
| 19:02.37 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: did I screw my system by installing with --prefix=/usr |
| 19:02.42 | louipc | lol |
| 19:03.08 | starseeker | Z80-Boy: This is experience talking. If you're on Linux, the odds are good that the answer is yes |
| 19:03.15 | louipc | why would you convert that to png? |
| 19:03.26 | starseeker | To convert it to pix, to use it as a texture |
| 19:03.31 | Z80-Boy | Linux comes pre-borked by design |
| 19:03.46 | louipc | no support for jpg textures? |
| 19:03.47 | louipc | gah! |
| 19:04.15 | Z80-Boy | it's not a matter of RAM, but a matter of well written program |
| 19:04.18 | louipc | Z80-Boy: how's that? |
| 19:05.01 | Z80-Boy | You can do conversion without placing the whole image into the memory |
| 19:05.28 | louipc | i mean how is linux pre-borked? |
| 19:06.36 | starseeker | Well, so far the Gimp is thrashing and Imagemagick's convert refused to try |
| 19:06.44 | starseeker | what else 'ya got? |
| 19:08.59 | Z80-Boy | what is the source format of the image? |
| 19:09.05 | starseeker | jpg |
| 19:09.22 | Z80-Boy | how much tile cache do you have in GIMP? |
| 19:09.27 | Z80-Boy | What are the dimensions of the jpeg? |
| 19:09.41 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: possibly.. |
| 19:09.45 | Z80-Boy | Imagemagick is a piece of crap, very suboptimal |
| 19:09.48 | brlcad | that is why it's not the default |
| 19:10.02 | Z80-Boy | can I revert the install? |
| 19:10.08 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:10.38 | starseeker | image is 21600x21600 |
| 19:10.38 | brlcad | can you magically recreate files that you overwrote? |
| 19:10.42 | starseeker | gimp tile cashe... |
| 19:11.10 | starseeker | 1 gig |
| 19:11.11 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: the issue really depends on your system .. if you had the deprecated librt.so installed and in use, you'll have problems (as we have a librt) |
| 19:11.32 | brlcad | another common one is libbu and libbn .. but those are much more rare |
| 19:12.40 | brlcad | louipc: no support for any lossy formats |
| 19:13.15 | Z80-Boy | starseeker: to convert this image into png, you need 518400 bytes of memory |
| 19:13.22 | Z80-Boy | a strip 21600 pixels wide and 8 pixels high |
| 19:15.05 | starseeker | Hang on - looks like I might be able to use some old fashioned tools and make a pit stop in pnm... |
| 19:15.48 | Z80-Boy | lol |
| 19:15.55 | starseeker | bingo |
| 19:15.56 | Z80-Boy | you need a lot of disk space for that I guess |
| 19:17.14 | starseeker | Yep - if the other tools were trying to do that in memory no wonder it crapped out |
| 19:18.57 | starseeker | Heh - cool - the pnm and the pix formats are almost exactly the same - pnm VERY slightly bigger |
| 19:19.08 | brlcad | starseeker: they already provide png's... |
| 19:19.18 | louipc | http://freshmeat.net/projects/vips/ |
| 19:19.30 | brlcad | "Details and More Imagery" |
| 19:19.32 | louipc | for large images ^ |
| 19:19.47 | louipc | hah! |
| 19:19.52 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 19:20.23 | brlcad | mged won't care so long as you have enough memory to load it |
| 19:20.35 | starseeker | uh oh |
| 19:20.39 | louipc | hmm 473MB png |
| 19:20.41 | brlcad | it won't exceed core though |
| 19:20.48 | brlcad | (without aborting) |
| 19:23.32 | brlcad | yeah, a color pnm is nearly identical .. they have a header block and are forth-quadrant images (0,0 in top left instead of bottom left) |
| 19:24.41 | starseeker | Hmm - that image wasn't set up to map to a sphere the way the other one was |
| 19:25.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30408 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (87 files in 16 dirs): style and ws update using the indent.sh emacs formatter script. make the sources consistent with header/footer blocks and our BSD KNF / K&R indent style. |
| 19:28.02 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I did configure with extra --enable-all, make clean, make, make install, mged |
| 19:28.05 | Z80-Boy | and still doesn't work |
| 19:28.21 | Z80-Boy | Initializing and backgrounding, please wait... |
| 19:28.40 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@212.15.184.222) | |
| 19:29.12 | starseeker | What do you think brlcad - the successful model worth putting up as a screen shot? (I doubt the model is anything to write home about...) |
| 19:29.35 | Z80-Boy | write home == army slang? |
| 19:30.17 | starseeker | no - I mean I doubt the way I modeled it is a shining example of good modeling practices - it's OK but not great |
| 19:32.50 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: is there any debugging command I could use to figure out where the mged program is sticking? |
| 19:33.53 | Z80-Boy | I even tried ldconfig, doesn't help. |
| 19:34.33 | Z80-Boy | If I run rt, it prints a help message. That works. |
| 19:36.19 | louipc | gdb --args mged |
| 19:36.25 | louipc | run |
| 19:46.34 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-098-141.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 19:54.19 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, that'd be a great screenshot |
| 19:54.26 | brlcad | Z80-Boy: try "mged -f" |
| 19:57.23 | brlcad | starseeker: sure, that's a great picture |
| 20:03.35 | Z80-Boy | mged -f does segmentation fault |
| 20:15.53 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5487753B.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:31.10 | starseeker | brlcad: Cool, thanks |
| 20:44.28 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5487753B.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:54.30 | Twingy | ``Erik, brl-cad, I'm doing the March 12-13 IA training, are you? |
| 21:30.41 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: the parse_points as you said doesn't work |
| 21:30.45 | Z80-Boy | doesn't simply do anything. |
| 21:30.57 | Z80-Boy | Doesn't print error message, doesn't create any primitive. |
| 22:23.10 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there any way in viewing mode to highlight an element of the model too small to see - sort of a "it's here" pointer to follow?' |
| 22:34.23 | starseeker | meh - even the high resolution map doesn't have NEARLY enough detail |
| 22:55.21 | brlcad | starseeker: you can go into object/solid selection mode which will illuminate objects -- hit 's' or 'o' in the graphics window and move the mouse up/down |
| 22:55.26 | brlcad | it'll illuminate and tell you the name |
| 22:55.34 | brlcad | hit q or esc to cancel |
| 22:55.50 | brlcad | (otherwise it effective does an oed or sed) |
| 22:55.54 | starseeker | OK. Yeah, that's how I had been doing it |
| 22:56.29 | starseeker | Not a very normal problem for this type of software anyway ;-) |
| 22:56.56 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 22:57.36 | brlcad | or is it just something so small that even illuminated it's not clear what/where it is? |
| 22:57.49 | starseeker | zooming from something 6000km across to something a couple meters long |
| 22:58.00 | starseeker | basically |
| 22:58.13 | starseeker | the eyepoint and lookat settings did the trick |
| 22:58.31 | brlcad | center work similar to lookat as well |
| 22:59.10 | brlcad | or if you autoview one object and then e up additional objects, it won't change the display size |
| 22:59.21 | brlcad | e.g. B up something tiny, then e up the big thing |
| 22:59.28 | starseeker | Ah |
| 22:59.37 | starseeker | That would do it |
| 23:00.03 | starseeker | No biggie - even the really high resolution photo didn't have nearly enough detail for the shot I was trying to line up |
| 23:00.23 | brlcad | ahh |
| 23:01.48 | starseeker | This is kinda cool: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/earth-night.png |
| 23:03.20 | brlcad | yeah, that is |
| 23:03.51 | starseeker | Nothing you couldn't do with any sphere mapping software of course |
| 23:04.55 | brlcad | yeah, nothing special, but still pretty cool ;) |
| 23:05.01 | brlcad | you can do some other effects |
| 23:05.11 | brlcad | is that just the texture shader or stacked with phong? |
| 23:05.19 | starseeker | texture shader |
| 23:05.39 | brlcad | try the "stack" shader, and add texture and glass |
| 23:06.07 | brlcad | or texture and bumpmap.. that might be neat |
| 23:10.57 | starseeker | What should I see on bumpmap? |
| 23:11.11 | brlcad | good question :) |
| 23:11.14 | brlcad | depends on the bump map |
| 23:11.33 | starseeker | Do I enter the bump map first or the texture first? |
| 23:12.44 | brlcad | bump mapping in general fakes the impression of surface detail |
| 23:12.46 | brlcad | I'd think the texture is first |
| 23:13.11 | brlcad | adding glass or plastic on top should make it look like it's painted/glossy |
| 23:13.54 | brlcad | nasa has some topological maps, those would probably work even better, but you should get something from just using the same image as a bump map too |
| 23:15.30 | starseeker | Glass killed it somehow |
| 23:15.44 | brlcad | huh? |
| 23:15.51 | brlcad | killed as in crashed? |
| 23:15.55 | starseeker | just getting speckles |
| 23:16.04 | brlcad | hm |
| 23:16.05 | brlcad | ahh |
| 23:16.20 | brlcad | yeah, maybe not glass, it's going to let most of the light through |
| 23:16.32 | brlcad | plastic probably better |
| 23:20.24 | starseeker | hmm - http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/weird1.png |
| 23:21.05 | starseeker | it's interesting, that's for sure... |
| 23:21.23 | starseeker | stack {{texture {file world4.pix w 21600 n 10800}} {bump {file world4.pix w 21800 n 10600}} {plastic {}}} |
| 23:22.50 | brlcad | any reason the file dimensions are different? :) |
| 23:22.59 | starseeker | ooops |
| 23:23.26 | brlcad | it's not an ideal bump map either, so it may still look wonky |
| 23:24.00 | brlcad | usually it's a greyscale indicating depth |
| 23:24.14 | brlcad | heck, it may even be assuming bw instead of pix |
| 23:24.39 | starseeker | could be |
| 23:25.12 | starseeker | Yeah, that's better - not much in the way of bumpmapping though |
| 23:25.25 | starseeker | bbl, gotta put away dishes |
| 23:25.58 | brlcad | I'd imagine at that scale, you'd have to increase the bump size considerably too |
| 23:28.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30409 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (1014 files in 49 dirs): |
| 23:28.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: major style and ws consistency cleanup. apply the automatic emacs-based |
| 23:28.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: indent.sh formatting to the sources so they consistently are formatted to our |
| 23:28.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: BSD KNF / K&R indentation style (see HACKING) using 4 char indents with tab |
| 23:28.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: stops at 8. |
| 23:30.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30410 10/brlcad/trunk/src/bwish/cadAppInit.c: add footer, indent |
| 23:31.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30411 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g-adrt.c: footer, indent |
| 23:38.55 | alex_joni | brlcad: can you still use svn diff after this? |
| 23:40.01 | alex_joni | I mean .. efficiently (if you want to see what happened in a certain commit vs. an older version..) |
| 23:50.02 | starseeker | brlcad: technically, any bumpmapping that would have anything like visual significance on this scale probably wouldn't be physical anyway ;-) |
| 23:57.21 | starseeker | ah, shoot - the mapping of the image isn't corresponding to the physical dimensions I had laid out |
| 00:06.53 | starseeker | which was also why the overlay was originally inside out - dogonne it |
| 00:25.22 | starseeker | Cool. |
| 00:34.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30412 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfft/ (ditsplitc.c splitditc.c): format the sources being generated in a more readable style and include a description header |
| 00:35.32 | brlcad | starseeker: heh, atmosphere would be really hard |
| 00:36.03 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, not as atmosphere in the "show clouds" sense but just so it's there :-) |
| 00:36.27 | brlcad | ah, heh, ok |
| 00:36.54 | brlcad | I tried to simulate atmosphere once where I was trying to get the natural "fade" you see as the air gets thin |
| 00:37.22 | starseeker | We'd need to be model density gradients |
| 00:37.24 | brlcad | I finally did get something mildly amusing with highly-transparent layers |
| 00:37.36 | brlcad | but it took like a layer per pixel |
| 00:37.41 | starseeker | ew |
| 00:38.04 | brlcad | at least to get it to look really nicely smooth and avoid refraction/reflection problems |
| 00:38.33 | brlcad | alex_joni: sure you can still diff |
| 00:38.52 | brlcad | the biggest issue will mostly be folks that have patches that haven't been applied from before/after |
| 00:39.05 | brlcad | since it'll likely show up as conflict |
| 00:45.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30413 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tab/script.l: include a header and footer |
| 00:48.58 | starseeker | Actually, it DOES have a slight impact: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/earth-model-cutaway-atmosphere.png |
| 00:49.46 | starseeker | That's cool |
| 00:52.02 | starseeker | got the troposphere, stratosphere, and mesosphere (roughly) |
| 00:52.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30414 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/grid.c: get rid of the SINGLE_PRECISION sections, format it up |
| 00:57.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30415 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/do_options.c: more SINGLE_PRECISION removal and cleanup |
| 01:00.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30416 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tube.c: cleanup |
| 01:01.30 | brlcad | heh, nice |
| 01:01.55 | brlcad | there's another map that has clouds |
| 01:02.10 | brlcad | (from nasa) |
| 01:03.19 | starseeker | you mean just clouds? |
| 01:03.28 | starseeker | no earth? |
| 01:11.14 | starseeker | There we go - got a bit of atmosphere reflection going on near the lower left part of the cutaway: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/earth-model-cutaway-atmosphere-2.png |
| 01:53.09 | starseeker | There we go - finally something I can show my dad that he'll appreciate: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/earth-structure.png |
| 02:27.48 | brlcad | that looks nice |
| 02:28.24 | starseeker | Know of anyone doing a geology textbook? ;- |
| 02:29.52 | brlcad | can you put the hole a little more to the left (over the pacific), and rendered more to the left (maybe 15 deg) instead of cenetered? |
| 02:30.31 | brlcad | heh, not that immediately comes to mind, but I'm sure it could be put to use |
| 02:30.42 | starseeker | it would take a bit, but sure |
| 02:34.53 | starseeker | Should I put up the model somewhere brlcad? |
| 02:35.00 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:35.07 | brlcad | it's a great example |
| 02:35.23 | brlcad | the best place for it right now is probably the geometry tracker |
| 02:35.26 | brlcad | http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=add&group_id=105292&atid=641557 |
| 02:35.52 | brlcad | should also try to import the .pix ;) |
| 02:36.02 | brlcad | so it's standalone |
| 02:36.12 | starseeker | erm. OK, how do I do that? |
| 02:36.54 | brlcad | i think the exact name used for _DENSITIES will work |
| 02:37.00 | brlcad | s/name/command/ |
| 02:37.16 | brlcad | as that'll just bring it in as char data |
| 02:37.18 | starseeker | OK, but what object do I store it in so the texture can spot it? |
| 02:37.27 | brlcad | whatever you want to name it |
| 02:37.37 | starseeker | OK, one sec... |
| 02:37.42 | brlcad | did you specify that the texture was file, object, or auto? |
| 02:37.53 | brlcad | if it's auto, you can just name it the same as the file |
| 02:38.10 | brlcad | if it's file, you'll have to change it to auto or obj |
| 02:39.42 | starseeker | and the hard drive goes crazy... |
| 02:40.00 | brlcad | how big's the .pix? |
| 02:41.25 | starseeker | 700 megs |
| 02:41.30 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:42.00 | brlcad | eep, well I highly doubt sf's tracker will accept that no matter how it's encoded :) |
| 02:42.21 | brlcad | so maybe upload it to the web root instead |
| 02:42.32 | brlcad | maybe with a tracker that links to it |
| 02:42.40 | brlcad | can make a geometry folder or something |
| 02:44.09 | brlcad | one of the projects I wanted to get set up on solidgeometry.org is an online repository of solid models |
| 02:44.11 | starseeker | Can we upload the model with a link to the web page where the png is and instructions on how to convert it? |
| 02:44.16 | starseeker | Cool :-) |
| 02:46.05 | brlcad | tie a web interface into a repository of models that have various converted formats available, various browsable renderings, allow users to upload their own models |
| 02:47.11 | brlcad | have an interactive 3D geometry viewer option |
| 02:47.27 | starseeker | That would be awesome |
| 02:47.39 | brlcad | wouldn't actually take that much to allow mged to be embeeded into a page too, so you could do command-line edits/actions |
| 02:48.03 | starseeker | Need some good resource limiting mechanisms on the server |
| 02:48.31 | brlcad | yeah, would probably remove all of the 'expensive' commands, batch up the rest into a queue |
| 02:48.41 | brlcad | or make it actually run client-side |
| 02:48.55 | starseeker | That's probably the way to do, if it can be done |
| 02:54.56 | starseeker | brlcad: Getting an error even without the pix file: Uploaded file must be >20 and <256000 bytes. |
| 02:55.08 | starseeker | Less than 256k isn't much |
| 02:58.36 | brlcad | er .. 256k is more than plenty for a few sphers and cuts |
| 02:58.49 | brlcad | if you did the dbbinary, it's no longer < 256k |
| 02:58.54 | starseeker | I didn't |
| 02:58.59 | brlcad | how big is it? |
| 02:59.08 | starseeker | 400k |
| 02:59.37 | starseeker | maybe I did something wrong |
| 03:00.05 | brlcad | no, you probably have empty database records that need cleaned up |
| 03:00.23 | brlcad | do a g2asc and asc2g |
| 03:00.28 | brlcad | see how big it is |
| 03:00.51 | brlcad | there's a cleanup command in mged, and it'll eventually reacquire those blocks, but I forget |
| 03:01.25 | brlcad | i wouldn't expect it to be more than a few k |
| 03:01.33 | starseeker | Yep, 4.3k |
| 03:01.41 | starseeker | wow |
| 03:01.54 | starseeker | how come it doesn't do that automatically on exit? |
| 03:03.02 | brlcad | db's aren't sessioned, there's no exit actions that aren't any different than just running commands (which is why there is no save and no need for one) |
| 03:03.14 | brlcad | it does reuse dead space |
| 03:03.42 | brlcad | but you must of either hit some pathological case by deleting, recreating, over and over |
| 03:03.51 | brlcad | so it couldn't reuse it yet |
| 03:03.59 | starseeker | ah |
| 03:04.37 | brlcad | or there's a bug in the code that determines when to reacquire, always a chance of that |
| 03:04.55 | starseeker | OK, well it's up now: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1900662&group_id=105292&atid=641557 |
| 03:08.37 | *** join/#brlcad Missing_Lynx (i=Lynx@adsl-69-226-218-15.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) | |
| 03:09.21 | Missing_Lynx | Hi, I have a problem with BRLCAD on Windows XP - can anyone help? |
| 03:14.35 | Missing_Lynx | Oh, well, guess I'll try another time. |
| 03:19.00 | starseeker | Next up - Saturn ;-) |
| 03:23.43 | starseeker | how to kill a raytracer in one easy step... |
| 03:24.29 | brlcad | heh, yep |
| 03:25.30 | brlcad | that'd be one where a procedural texture shader would do nicely.. make one cylinder and have the procedure figure out what pattern to put inside |
| 03:25.40 | brlcad | sort of like what's already done for the grass shader |
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| 05:12.11 | starseeker | brlcad: Still on? |
| 05:22.03 | starseeker | Had question about Open Inventor |
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| 11:04.32 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 21:32.09 | PLC | Hi |
| 21:33.34 | *** part/#brlcad PLC (n=xXx@AMontpellier-752-1-17-179.w90-48.abo.wanadoo.fr) | |
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| 04:00.48 | iraytrace | It's quiet.... Too quiet ;-) |
| 04:01.14 | starseeker | Sunday night ;-) |
| 04:02.39 | iraytrace | That's just what they want us to think. Chuckle. |
| 04:03.27 | iraytrace | Just curious. I'd connected about 3 hours ago and hadn't seen a peep. Since it's a new IRC clinet, I was wondering. Thanks. |
| 04:04.02 | starseeker | Nah, it's been quiet today. Your client is not to blame ;-) |
| 04:40.24 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-4 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 04:45.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30418 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/unix/: |
| 04:46.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30419 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/unix/: |
| 06:09.02 | yukonbob | ...and _that_ is why brl-cad is in the position it's in. |
| 06:09.14 | yukonbob | iraytrace: did you get all that? |
| 06:10.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30420 10/brlcad/trunk/src/lgt/ (extern.h fb.c lgt.c): get rid of SGI_WINCLOSE_BUG. it's something libfb should be handling if it's necessary. |
| 06:16.50 | brlcad | yukonbob: hm? |
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| 10:04.32 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30421 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: at least MSVC 6.0 needs the min/max templates (because min/max is not contained in the MSVC-STL because windef.h already defines it as a macro) |
| 12:54.22 | brlcad | guten tag, d_rossberg |
| 13:00.25 | d_rossberg | good morning |
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| 13:44.39 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30422 10/brlcad/trunk/src/burst/ (burst.h fb.c): oop, more SGI_WINCLOSE_BUG and SINGLE_PRECISION mods that didn't get committed. |
| 14:33.24 | PrezKennedy | hallo brlcad, wie geht es ihnen? |
| 14:35.27 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 14:57.13 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30423 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 6 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 14:57.17 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: NATURAL_IEEE and REVERSE_IEEE are no longer used. instead, try to utilize the |
| 14:57.21 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: bu_byteorder() run-time checks now where possible or WORDS_BIGENDIAN where not |
| 14:57.25 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: gut |
| 14:57.27 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: feasible. while this doesn't change the behavior of htond and htonf, care needs |
| 14:57.31 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: to be taken for the floating point format not being what we expect. make the |
| 14:57.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: configure test warn more verbosely if we encounter something that may not be |
| 14:57.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: ieee 754 floating point format (which in turn might imply htond and/or htonf |
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| 15:55.07 | brlcad | heh, kimchi in space |
| 16:01.57 | clock_ | brlcad: my mged doesn't work but raytracing with rt seems to work. |
| 16:02.28 | brlcad | clock_: did you try a binary? I can only imagine it's not working due to compilation settings |
| 16:02.36 | clock_ | brlcad: do you have some tips how to investigate why is the mged hanging? mged -f you said doesn't help, tried. |
| 16:02.58 | clock_ | brlcad: maybe because I set -O -march=pentium-m -fomit-frame-pointer? |
| 16:03.01 | clock_ | I have GCC 4.1.2 |
| 16:03.13 | brlcad | any reason you omit the frame pointer? |
| 16:03.33 | clock_ | To have more registers and make it faster |
| 16:03.44 | clock_ | -O -> -O3 |
| 16:04.04 | clock_ | for example gmp fails tests with this setting and -O3 has to be changed to -O2 |
| 16:04.17 | clock_ | The question is what's buggy whether the GCC or the CPU |
| 16:04.39 | brlcad | eh, probably neither |
| 16:04.49 | clock_ | lol |
| 16:04.52 | clock_ | Who's buggy then? |
| 16:04.53 | brlcad | O3 is allowed to diverge from IEEE floating point behaviors |
| 16:04.57 | brlcad | you |
| 16:05.01 | clock_ | has -ffast-math? |
| 16:05.11 | brlcad | up to gcc |
| 16:05.21 | clock_ | oh that makes sense then |
| 16:05.24 | brlcad | as to what options O3 enables |
| 16:05.33 | clock_ | Does BRL-CAD screw up if I type -O3? |
| 16:05.35 | brlcad | usually yes, it can and often does, among many other things |
| 16:05.41 | brlcad | no, we work fine |
| 16:05.44 | clock_ | ;-) |
| 16:05.55 | clock_ | I even managed to compile Firefox |
| 16:06.06 | brlcad | gmp, i'm sure, is expecting specific floating point behaviors |
| 16:06.06 | clock_ | I felt like colleting a Nobel Prize when I finished that |
| 16:07.02 | clock_ | And, after we figure out how to travel to Alpha Centauri under 24 hours and figure out how to compile OpenOffice, we can say we have conquered the universe ;-> |
| 16:07.48 | brlcad | still, not sure what -fomit-frame-pointer with -g will mean, not that it's the problem you're hitting |
| 16:08.07 | clock_ | I know it's not gonna gdb |
| 16:08.17 | clock_ | But the rt takes hell long - I need maximum computation velocity! |
| 16:08.36 | brlcad | then --disable-runtime-debug |
| 16:08.52 | brlcad | but don't complain when you can't debug problems |
| 16:08.52 | clock_ | How many % do I gain with this? |
| 16:09.02 | brlcad | depends on the cpu, usually 5-15% |
| 16:09.07 | clock_ | When I run into a problem I recompile with full debug and try again |
| 16:09.25 | clock_ | --disable-runtime-debug goes into the ./configure? |
| 16:09.47 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:10.19 | clock_ | Does it help when I say, after the mged hanging times out, it prints Detaching and ends? |
| 16:10.23 | brlcad | the results will "invalidate" the benchmark results, but it will run faster |
| 16:10.53 | clock_ | I gues it's gonna produce at least similar looking images |
| 16:11.03 | brlcad | the images will be the same |
| 16:11.08 | brlcad | the computations are the same |
| 16:11.19 | clock_ | hmm |
| 16:11.25 | clock_ | should I try BRL-CAD without make -j4? |
| 16:11.31 | clock_ | Like just make? Could it be the cause? |
| 16:11.31 | brlcad | that just disables a slew of run-time validity checks (that would otherwise ABORT the application) |
| 16:11.44 | brlcad | no, that has nothing to do with it |
| 16:11.56 | clock_ | And, if I type mged -f it segfaults! Does this info help? |
| 16:12.20 | brlcad | yeah, that's interesting .. do you have a stack trace? |
| 16:12.26 | clock_ | No |
| 16:12.30 | clock_ | I didn't have gdb ;-> |
| 16:12.33 | brlcad | then no it doesn't help :) |
| 16:12.36 | clock_ | Have to complicate one |
| 16:13.08 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, does brlcad run on Vista? |
| 16:13.11 | clock_ | OK so my next homework is to get the stack trace from the segfaulting mged -f |
| 16:13.20 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: haven't tried it yet |
| 16:13.34 | PrezKennedy | i can try it tonight when i get home |
| 16:13.53 | clock_ | Do you use cygwin or some proprietary C compiler for Windows? |
| 16:13.54 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: given how different it is, I'd be surprised it it worked without recompiling |
| 16:14.06 | brlcad | either works |
| 16:14.10 | clock_ | wow |
| 16:15.53 | brlcad | I've made a full cygwin build several times (and that's what Irix guy keeps compiling) |
| 16:16.17 | brlcad | it usually just needs a couple tweaks but sometimes builds cleanly out of the box.. just not frequently tested/maintained |
| 16:16.36 | MinuteElectron | Irix got it running on vista. |
| 16:16.36 | clock_ | Does it work on Masox as well |
| 16:16.46 | brlcad | ~masox |
| 16:16.54 | brlcad | never heard of masox |
| 16:16.54 | clock_ | MAC OS X |
| 16:16.57 | brlcad | ah |
| 16:17.01 | brlcad | yes, of course |
| 16:17.29 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: without recompiling though? |
| 16:17.37 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: oh, right |
| 16:18.05 | MinuteElectron | i don't know |
| 16:18.06 | brlcad | i don't doubt that it'll work if you compile it on vista.. there's nothing that specifically should limit it |
| 16:18.33 | PrezKennedy | seems to work fine on server 2003 |
| 16:19.24 | clock_ | Masox is a brand name of Czech ready-made dried bouillon in little bricks |
| 16:19.50 | clock_ | That's why I call Mac OS X Masox |
| 16:20.44 | clock_ | It's like you want to make a soup so you take a pot of boiling water throw one brick in and it dissolves and you get bouillon and then you can add more stuff |
| 16:20.49 | PrezKennedy | sounds tasty like an Apple® |
| 16:22.42 | clock_ | http://www.shop.czechoslovakshop.eu/images/big/4.jpg |
| 16:23.31 | brlcad | not exactly an international brand :) |
| 16:23.37 | clock_ | not exactly |
| 16:23.56 | clock_ | but yeah it's the same as Knorr |
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| 18:19.41 | ``Erik | hm |
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| 18:57.46 | brlcad | woot, gsoc2008 finally/officially announced |
| 19:41.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30426 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: Pick the first visual with the greatest depth. Mods to disallow use of DirectColor visuals. |
| 19:41.50 | brlcad | ooh |
| 19:41.51 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30427 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (15 files in 9 dirs): windows O_BINARY setmode cleanup |
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| 21:11.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30428 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/conv-vg2g.c: include fcntl.h so O_RDONLY is properly defined |
| 21:13.42 | brlcad | hm, cadio.h or buio.h |
| 21:38.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30429 10/brlcad/trunk/include/sysv.h: no longer checking for bsdselect, no longer providing it or using it either |
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| 22:59.47 | ``Erik | <-- puts some food in him so he can stop zoning out |
| 23:01.53 | yukonbob | gsoc call for papers, or picked-projects? |
| 23:08.48 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30430 10/brlcad/trunk/include/config_win.h: Only define min/max if MSVC 6.0 and older. |
| 23:29.50 | starseeker | well, after a couple day's work I have... a wheel |
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| 00:20.13 | yukonbob | starseeker: link, please ;) |
| 00:20.58 | starseeker | yukonbob: Don't have screenshot handy |
| 00:21.08 | yukonbob | starseeker: what kind of wheel? |
| 00:21.08 | starseeker | Anyway, waiting for brlcad to look over |
| 00:21.13 | starseeker | model car wheel |
| 00:21.18 | yukonbob | ah |
| 00:21.57 | yukonbob | !Release the wheel |
| 00:22.01 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 00:22.02 | starseeker | Well, it's my job now so it's part of my training |
| 00:22.41 | starseeker | I did upload my earth model |
| 00:22.48 | yukonbob | yes, you did that |
| 00:22.49 | starseeker | Did you have a chance to poke at that? |
| 00:23.20 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 00:23.26 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:23.30 | starseeker | yes |
| 00:23.33 | starseeker | essentially |
| 00:23.51 | yukonbob | ie: no relief if i zoom in enough ;) |
| 00:24.28 | starseeker | Nah. In theory it might be able to do something with the right data, but I haven't tried real hard |
| 00:24.47 | starseeker | on the scale of this sucker, relief is almost in the noise except for the REALLY tall and deep points |
| 00:24.51 | yukonbob | would be a pretty big data set for an interesting image ;) |
| 00:24.57 | starseeker | Indeed |
| 00:25.24 | brlcad | yukonbob: neither |
| 00:26.22 | brlcad | google just announced that they are indeed going to *have* the program again, so lots to think about |
| 00:26.28 | brlcad | starseeker: :) |
| 00:26.49 | brlcad | remember the levels of detail |
| 00:27.09 | starseeker | I looked at the body today, and it's all... curvy |
| 00:27.36 | yukonbob | heh |
| 00:27.44 | brlcad | you have to simplify to the level of important information that captures the rough shape quickly |
| 00:28.12 | brlcad | think of it like a rough draft.. you need the sketch on the back of a napkin sort, refine as time allows |
| 00:28.26 | brlcad | start with the outline |
| 00:28.27 | brlcad | a box |
| 00:28.33 | starseeker | Right |
| 00:28.33 | brlcad | start cutting away |
| 00:28.46 | brlcad | yukonbob: are you interested in being a mentor? |
| 00:28.53 | brlcad | if we participated |
| 00:29.11 | yukonbob | starseeker: speaking of tough, don't know if you saw this when the query was posted some time ago: http://www.friotherm.com/impeller.jpg |
| 00:29.39 | starseeker | Uh... |
| 00:29.41 | brlcad | yeah, that's a great shape |
| 00:29.48 | yukonbob | very@! |
| 00:29.53 | yukonbob | s/@// |
| 00:30.24 | starseeker | It could be approximated with primitives, but I'm not sure how well... |
| 00:31.17 | brlcad | really begs for a birail |
| 00:33.06 | yukonbob | speaking of primitives (and procedures) -- what's the preferred way to implement these things, "ideally"? via C, or is Tcl "just as good"? |
| 00:35.16 | brlcad | it takes 10 seconds to make the box, you can spend the rest of a day refining/replacing the box |
| 00:35.36 | starseeker | Oh, I made the box |
| 00:35.40 | yukonbob | heh |
| 00:35.53 | starseeker | Actually it would be two boxes... |
| 00:35.54 | yukonbob | "imagine this is a 64 1/2 mustang" |
| 00:36.35 | starseeker | Ah, no ;-) |
| 00:56.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30431 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: need breplicator and opennurbs included in the dist |
| 01:23.56 | yukonbob | starseeker: so, is a standard steel wheel, or an aftermarket wheel? |
| 01:24.42 | starseeker | heh - if I were doing the actual model and not faking a real car, it would have to be plastic |
| 01:43.16 | yukonbob | ah -- you're modelling a plastic scale-model of a mustang ;) |
| 01:43.20 | yukonbob | what year, btw? |
| 01:59.03 | starseeker | not sure - guesses range about 67-68 |
| 02:00.22 | louipc | hehe do you remember the video of the impeller being machined? |
| 02:00.55 | starseeker | Yes, that was cool :-) |
| 02:01.35 | louipc | yeah I'd love to get into stuff like that |
| 02:02.06 | starseeker | Isn't that more in the linuxcnc/gcam side of things? |
| 02:02.44 | louipc | yeah I work in cnc |
| 02:03.16 | louipc | but much more basic stuff |
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| 13:56.06 | ``Erik | hehehe "clbuttic" |
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| 22:34.18 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:37.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30432 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Mods to update the raytrace control panel's size entry. Other mods to keep the raytrace control panel on top. |
| 22:38.42 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30433 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (libtcl/libtcl.vcproj libtclcad/libtclcad.vcproj): Added inline definition. |
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| 02:57.39 | IriX64 | any word on 7.12.0? |
| 02:59.54 | brlcad | RSN, almost freeze time |
| 03:03.24 | IriX64 | looking forward to it |
| 03:13.01 | Twingy | OS/2 |
| 03:13.27 | IriX64 | heh heres a thought, brlcad *is my os :) |
| 03:15.30 | brlcad | IriX64: ubuntu, gentoo, open solaris .. |
| 03:16.37 | IriX64 | all user friendly i take it |
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| 06:31.23 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30434 10/brlcad/trunk/include/fb.h: looks like unistd.h is actually not needed any more |
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| 18:59.45 | yukonbob | hrmm -- /me can't figure out what "page up" equiv is on this mac... can't read screen'd irssi backlog :P |
| 19:03.54 | brlcad | yukonbob: /sb goto [-+]## |
| 19:04.24 | brlcad | e.g. /sb goto -50 |
| 19:04.44 | yukonbob | mm -- good idea. |
| 19:05.53 | brlcad | there's a way to bind that to keys, but I forget the syntax |
| 19:22.21 | yukonbob | heh -- /me just used up-arrow and /sb [foo] |
| 19:24.08 | brlcad | that's tty settings before you run irssi |
| 19:24.30 | brlcad | dunno if there's a way to change it once inside irssi, but outside, stty erase ^? |
| 19:24.49 | brlcad | OS X doesn't have focus-follows-mouse |
| 19:24.54 | brlcad | but there is a setting for Terminal |
| 19:25.24 | brlcad | defaults write com.apple.Terminal FocusFollowsMouse -string YES |
| 19:26.02 | yukonbob | nice -- /me might have to set that up on his the gf's powerbook |
| 19:26.14 | yukonbob | s/his the/the/ |
| 20:37.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30435 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: Add technical report reference. |
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| 08:50.03 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30436 10/brlcad/trunk/ (319 files in 48 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 08:50.04 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: Add a new bio.h private wrapper header for consistently defining native and |
| 08:50.04 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: standard I/O interfaces provided via stdio.h, unistd.h, io.h, and fcntl.h. |
| 08:50.05 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: remove the 300+ instances of a HAVE_UNISTD_H block throughout with a simple |
| 08:50.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: include of bio.h. this change was also motivated by the need to remove all of |
| 08:50.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: the header includes from the windows-specific config_win32.h (so that winsock2.h |
| 08:50.13 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: can be included before windows.h cleanly). of course, needs windows testing and |
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| 14:04.12 | ``Erik | X11.app has a setting for sloppy focus, but it doesn't work with non-X windows |
| 14:04.37 | ``Erik | "wm_ffm" |
| 14:43.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30437 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: Finished the pixel selection feature. |
| 14:50.04 | clock_ | Has anyone already looked into the pathological case where rendering is 210x slower than normally? |
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| 19:07.45 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/sucess.png <---- got it to go :) |
| 19:08.50 | IriX64 | err success |
| 20:50.10 | brlcad | the comments are about as interesting as the poll |
| 20:51.03 | brlcad | which I suppose are all for the 'Other' option |
| 20:51.54 | yukonbob | is that a derogatory comment? -- /me thinks the poll is kinda silly, but the comments are somewhat interesting (not necessarily for their content, but what they reflect deomgraphically) |
| 20:52.27 | brlcad | not in the least |
| 20:53.16 | brlcad | it is an interesting poll, ableit highly undersampled so easily biased towards any language with the right posting |
| 20:54.08 | ``Erik | holy crap that's a lot of tcl |
| 20:54.12 | yukonbob | ah -- not sure... like I said the poll is a bit like "which is better, emacs or vi?", and it's been discussed here too, that the language itself often limited not by it's syntax/capabilities, but the component between the keyboard-and-chair... |
| 20:54.20 | brlcad | i mean, ask a thousand web application developers what their favorite scripting language is vs asking a thousand sys admins and I'd bet you'd get totally different answers |
| 20:55.47 | yukonbob | is true - but I'm assuming this is "general" kind of sample, geared to Linux users obviously -- I was there looking for details on an article I browsed off the rack (wmctrl), and found that poll... was surprised by Tcl's representationo... |
| 20:57.29 | brlcad | yeah |
| 20:58.33 | brlcad | though for as many scripting languages are represented, to have 7 big names, and then leave out one that is undoubtedly higher than the rest kinda makes it a blatent ommission worth commenting on |
| 20:58.47 | brlcad | that or some tcl group got wind of the poll and are biasing the comments |
| 20:59.26 | brlcad | or ar the only "Other" responders that are following the instruction (to comment below) ;) |
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| 21:16.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30438 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 21:16.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: Bob fixed a bug in the X11 framebuffer interface where it would cause the entire |
| 21:16.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: X11 display to go black or not depending on whether the framebuffer window had |
| 21:16.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: focus or not. this issue was related to a problem with the visual type and |
| 21:16.42 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: colormapping where a bad visual was being selected. now it selects a |
| 21:16.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: truecolorvisual (instead of directcolor iirc). |
| 21:18.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30439 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: like the X framebuffer type, Bob added the same functionality to the ogl framebuffer where the user can query the color value underneath the cursor by right-clicking in the framebuffer window. |
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| 01:20.42 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30440 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/Dm.tcl: gah, merge a fix made for 7.10.4 on the stable branch that didn't make its way back to the trunk. this fix makes the Dm class not blindly try to open :0 but instead checks what env(DISPLAY) is set to. |
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| 04:13.03 | minusinsk | hello |
| 04:13.23 | minusinsk | here only english-speakers? |
| 04:13.52 | louipc | mostly |
| 04:14.08 | minusinsk | no russians? |
| 04:15.26 | louipc | I don't think so |
| 04:15.45 | minusinsk | Brlcad have a non-english language localisation and internationalization? |
| 04:17.04 | louipc | hmm doesn't look like it |
| 04:17.28 | minusinsk | Is it possible to convert the programme into other languages? |
| 04:18.07 | louipc | of course. it might take a lot of work though |
| 04:18.42 | louipc | you'd have to patch gettext functionality in the apps or something |
| 04:23.13 | minusinsk | somebody need do it :) |
| 04:23.56 | louipc | yea :D |
| 04:25.25 | louipc | docs would be better to translate first though |
| 04:25.27 | minusinsk | who can? Who is Master Yoda? :) |
| 04:26.03 | louipc | well there are people that have the skills but are too busy doing other things |
| 04:26.26 | minusinsk | docs.. maybe i can in Russian, but i'm not a engeneer-constructor |
| 04:26.43 | louipc | did you go to brlcad.org? |
| 04:26.55 | minusinsk | yeah, i did |
| 04:26.55 | louipc | there are pdfs there |
| 04:27.16 | minusinsk | pdf is not good for edit |
| 04:27.27 | louipc | ... there are also manpages when you install the program |
| 04:27.36 | minusinsk | odf is more better |
| 04:27.48 | louipc | odf eh? |
| 04:28.02 | louipc | minusinsk: well some people are trying to convert everything to docbook |
| 04:28.10 | louipc | xml |
| 04:28.18 | minusinsk | Open Document Format ISO/IEC 26300 |
| 04:28.22 | louipc | ah |
| 04:28.37 | minusinsk | it's xml too |
| 04:29.34 | louipc | it's not really meant for conversion to different formats though eh? |
| 04:30.51 | minusinsk | OpenOffice have a many formats for export from odf |
| 04:33.25 | louipc | cool |
| 04:37.49 | minusinsk | export to BibTeX, LaTeX2, mediaWiki, pdf, and much more office formats |
| 04:38.34 | minusinsk | ok, i will try translate docs from pdf to odf and translete them |
| 04:38.49 | louipc | cool! |
| 04:38.49 | minusinsk | in my language |
| 04:39.00 | louipc | that's a huge task |
| 04:39.04 | minusinsk | it's first |
| 04:39.32 | minusinsk | after that need support UTF-8 for Brlcad |
| 04:39.44 | minusinsk | it's jobfor programmers |
| 04:39.56 | louipc | yep |
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| 05:13.37 | yukonbob | minusinsk: BRL-CAD might already have support, depending on how it's necessary... Tcl was one of the first (the first?) cross-platform languages w/ UTF support, and has good i18n support... |
| 05:19.36 | minusinsk | i'm remember that UTF-8 is in TCL/TK only few time |
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| 05:23.00 | yukonbob | minusinsk: there are also two large documents converted to DocBook format... you can retrieve them via svn (not sure if they're shipping in any distribution)... DocBook is the format that the project is using for the documentation. |
| 05:23.53 | minusinsk | ok, i can imported them |
| 05:24.39 | starseeker | I would suggest first translating the text (which you should be able to get out of the pdf) and then integrating that with the docbook markup once it becomes available |
| 05:24.50 | yukonbob | ~cadsvn |
| 05:24.51 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 05:25.09 | minusinsk | tnx |
| 05:25.26 | yukonbob | hey starseeker |
| 05:25.30 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 05:26.01 | louipc | yukonbob: those pdfs are all done !? |
| 05:26.07 | louipc | I mean to docbook |
| 05:26.13 | starseeker | not yet |
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| 05:26.27 | louipc | ah I was going to say nice job yo! |
| 05:26.41 | starseeker | IIRC, vol 4 is pretty far along, vol 2 is (sort of) started and vol 3 is on the todo list |
| 05:26.46 | yukonbob | louipc: no -- I've done volume iv, starseeker did one(?), and there's more to do... we had a _big_ push a whlie ago, but nothing lately :) |
| 05:26.51 | louipc | vol2 is a doosie |
| 05:27.29 | starseeker | Now that I'm getting more docbook and tool experience (xmlto + fop = goodness) |
| 05:27.39 | starseeker | I SHOULD be able to better convert vol2 |
| 05:28.06 | starseeker | Much of the markup in vol2 will probably need to be re-done, but it's a start |
| 05:28.56 | yukonbob | starseeker: what kind of data? |
| 05:29.10 | starseeker | US Geologic Survey geologic information |
| 05:29.44 | starseeker | Oddly enough, there seems to be some halfway decent DLG stuff |
| 05:29.53 | starseeker | which will take forever and a day to download... |
| 05:30.35 | starseeker | I had to ignore a robot file, which meant I'm throttling the download speed down to next to nothing so as not to annoy anyone |
| 05:30.49 | starseeker | Digital Line graph |
| 05:30.50 | yukonbob | hrm -- http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/02/28/2339246 |
| 05:31.46 | starseeker | That's "it's too unstable for just anyone to use, so we'll hammer on it and at the same time get good App performance for Apple apps." |
| 05:32.10 | starseeker | Unlike MS, there is a quasi-realistic hope that Apple's software will achieve stability inside the decade... |
| 05:32.45 | yukonbob | starseeker: re DLG -- what are you using it for? |
| 05:33.06 | starseeker | yukonbob: Nothing in particular at the moment - might try giving GRASS a workout |
| 05:33.07 | louipc | hehe |
| 05:34.00 | starseeker | yukonbob: All sorts of neat Google-like map visualizations that might be tried, given proper tool knowledge |
| 05:34.20 | starseeker | yukonbob: Not remotely BRL-CAD related though... |
| 05:36.48 | brlcad | yukonbob: read the comment from David Hyatt |
| 05:37.15 | brlcad | it's really a stupid /. posting, sensationalist crap |
| 05:37.31 | brlcad | there's more down in the /. comments |
| 05:39.59 | starseeker | brlcad: Just curious - has anyone ever tried doing anything with BRL-CAD + GIS data? |
| 05:40.34 | starseeker | + BRL-CAD? |
| 05:41.17 | brlcad | DSP is a brl-cad primitive type |
| 05:41.21 | brlcad | so yes :) |
| 05:41.27 | yukonbob | yup -- DSP == displacement map in BRL-CAD... DEM = digital elevation model |
| 05:41.32 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/tmp/puget01.png is an example |
| 05:41.37 | starseeker | er... |
| 05:41.51 | starseeker | s/?/! |
| 05:42.09 | starseeker | That's cool |
| 05:42.13 | brlcad | that's the high-res puget de data |
| 05:43.25 | starseeker | What DEM # corresponds to that high res? |
| 05:43.31 | brlcad | that's the 16k x 16k data from http://www.cc.gatech.edu/projects/large_models/ps.html |
| 05:44.20 | brlcad | where they'd already extracted from dem, conveniently in a format nearly ideal for dsp |
| 05:44.40 | brlcad | shoulda applied the texture too, but was just playing around |
| 05:44.47 | yukonbob | starseeker: there's other info that could be used easily -- for example, png "height shade" images (I believe that's what they're called) -- _not_ to be confused w/ "shade slope" models, though, which might look the same at first glance... |
| 05:45.32 | yukonbob | brlcad: any luck tracking that mem leak wrt dsp? |
| 05:49.45 | brlcad | haven't looked at it :( |
| 05:49.51 | brlcad | but keep kicking me, I will |
| 05:50.17 | yukonbob | :) |
| 05:51.54 | biketron | anyone have any luck using brl-cad on mac osx leopard? |
| 05:53.03 | brlcad | biketron: the X11 server in leopard is busted .. |
| 05:53.53 | biketron | ugh.. |
| 05:53.59 | brlcad | apple's got a fix in the works, but it was outright broken when they switched to X.org's R7 |
| 05:55.09 | biketron | eta on the fix? |
| 05:57.16 | yukonbob | as soon as it's finished, but no sooner? |
| 05:57.46 | biketron | :) |
| 05:58.10 | yukonbob | :) |
| 05:58.59 | yukonbob | is it reasonable to (temporarily?) install X from fink or similar? (Some Mac-head can comment whether that even really makes sense)... |
| 05:59.34 | louipc | mac ports? |
| 05:59.54 | yukonbob | ya -- whatever -- as long as you can use X w/o clobbering the 'native' install... |
| 05:59.56 | louipc | http://www.macports.org/ |
| 06:00.14 | louipc | I don't know anything about mac *shrug* |
| 06:03.49 | yukonbob | nothing to know. Push the single button mouse and your screen smiles at you. Mac folks are easy to amuse. |
| 06:14.24 | brlcad | yukonbob: i don't know of anyone that has tried and I don't have easy access to 10.5 atm |
| 06:16.46 | brlcad | 10.4's X11 works just fine ;) |
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| 10:08.03 | cad76 | hello i would like to ask how to start the program after instalation? |
| 10:08.21 | clock_ | cad76: mged |
| 10:08.56 | clock_ | actually better mged test.g otherwise it will yell it doesn't have any database open when you try to create some body |
| 10:11.54 | cad76 | terminal says - command not found |
| 10:12.13 | clock_ | updatedb |
| 10:12.15 | clock_ | locate mged |
| 10:15.20 | cad76 | i will try to reinstall :) |
| 10:16.27 | cad76 | thank you |
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| 10:37.58 | Axman6 | clock_: isn't it nice when people listen to you? |
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| 15:09.51 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:32.07 | ``Erik | Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. But light a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. |
| 15:36.09 | elite01 | hehe :) |
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| 17:42.53 | brlcad | c'mon baby light my fire |
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| 21:05.40 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30441 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 5 dirs): Add -d option to MGED tree command for limiting depth of tree printing. |
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| 22:54.49 | ``Erik | w00t, upgrade on the new bz took |
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| 16:11.24 | Maloeran | *sobs* Erik, where did your comics page go? |
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| 19:00.37 | ``Erik | the school broke it, mal |
| 19:00.40 | ``Erik | I'm moving it to b |
| 19:00.41 | ``Erik | bz |
| 19:02.08 | ``Erik | which means de-linuxing some crap |
| 19:05.39 | ``Erik | try http://bz.bzflag.bz/~erik/comics/ and let me know if anything's weird |
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| 22:17.35 | brlcad | looks good to me :) |
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| 08:22.36 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30442 10/brlcad/trunk/db/Makefile.am: keep getting parallel build problems where the exec test fails saying asc2g doesn't exist yet. try syncing the filesystem and if it does still fail, print what ls shows |
| 08:45.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30443 10/brlcad/trunk/db/Makefile.am: |
| 08:45.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: the more I think about it, the failure makes sense. the asc2g wrapper is |
| 08:45.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: kicking off a compilation which causes a failure when another proc tries to use |
| 08:45.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: the script mid-compilation. it is either deleted or is getting set -x during |
| 08:45.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: compilation. hopefully this prep phase will make it behave. |
| 08:57.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30444 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: (log message trimmed) |
| 08:57.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: add a distcheck and install check to make sure that the tclIndex and |
| 08:57.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: pkgIndex.tcl files aren't empty. there are some configurations generating empty |
| 08:57.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: files when the auto_paths are not set up correctly. the installs will seem to |
| 08:57.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: be just fine .. but are actually rather busted and will result in a variety of |
| 08:57.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: screwy run-time tcl failures when trying to use any of those routines. also |
| 08:57.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: make elapsed.sh use top_srcdir for the DATE file since it's a BUILT_SOURCES |
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| 14:03.43 | reinoud | hello folks |
| 14:04.02 | reinoud | <-- newbie to brlcad; trying to get it compiled under NetBSD |
| 14:06.22 | reinoud | Is there still a moderator for the news group? I got a reply that the moderator's email adress was bounced and thus i couldn't post; no wonder the news group was empty :-S |
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| 15:14.30 | brlcad | reinoud: there is a moderator for the news group, but you shouldn't be posting to the news list :) |
| 15:15.00 | brlcad | it's outbound-only, there is a brlcad-users and brlcad-devel mailing list |
| 15:15.10 | reinoud | ah that explains |
| 15:16.35 | reinoud | switching chat-program |
| 15:16.37 | *** part/#brlcad reinoud (n=reinoud@a82-93-219-45.adsl.xs4all.nl) | |
| 15:17.13 | brlcad | o.O |
| 16:04.01 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30445 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 16:04.03 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: bob, erik, and myself have all failed at reproducing the mged text flood hanging |
| 16:04.05 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: so the problem was either a ScrolledText widget Tk bug that was fixed with the |
| 16:04.07 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: upgrade to Tk 8.5 or it's sensitive to timing issues and isn't easy to provoke |
| 16:04.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: on fast machines. needs to be revisited on a slow machine, but that doesn't |
| 16:04.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: need to hold up the release. |
| 16:34.06 | *** part/#brlcad marco_antonio (i=marco@190.1.5.98) | |
| 16:58.42 | *** join/#brlcad niemand (i=terrylr@maria-enzersdorf.blauedonau.com) | |
| 16:59.03 | niemand | anyone here |
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| 17:02.23 | alex_joni | niemand: niemand hier |
| 17:02.48 | starseeker | And that's how we learn not to attempt opening a huge tiff file without enough swap space |
| 17:04.54 | niemand | alex_joni, hello, how goes it? |
| 17:06.38 | terrylr | alex_joni, has sean/brlcad been around lately? |
| 17:07.27 | alex_joni | oh, hi terrylr, didn't know it was you |
| 17:07.38 | alex_joni | yeah, sean/brlcad is usually around through the day |
| 17:08.00 | terrylr | alex_joni, long time no read. |
| 17:08.13 | alex_joni | indeed.. how are you feeling? |
| 17:09.21 | terrylr | alex_joni, i guess i am feeling okay. i live on morphine. |
| 17:10.02 | alex_joni | sorry to hear that :/ |
| 17:25.32 | brlcad | howdy terrylr |
| 17:28.59 | terrylr | brlcad, hello, long time no read. |
| 17:30.46 | terrylr | brlcad, last 6 aug 2007, i was in a head-on-collision accident. not my fault. i spent 2 wks in icu and 6 wks in rehabilation. since then trying to learn how to walk again. my injuries were: left hip broken, left femur broken in 5 places, right knee cap shattered, right tibia and fibia compound fracture, 4 broken ribs right side, right lung collapsed. the emts had to reboot me several times before they could get me stable enough to remo |
| 17:30.46 | terrylr | ve from the accident scene. haivng two broken legs is not fun. i do not get down to the computers that often anymore. i get around in a wheelchair so i tend to stick to the main floor of the house. |
| 17:40.12 | brlcad | yikes, and 'ouch' really sorry to hear that.. |
| 17:41.01 | brlcad | was wondering where you had disappeared to |
| 17:42.01 | brlcad | you were disabled before that as well, iirc .. talk about kicking a man when he's down |
| 17:43.31 | brlcad | terrylr: in any regard, glad to hear that through all that you are still around -- a couple folks have been in asking about some of the work you were doing, where things got left off at |
| 17:44.04 | brlcad | eep |
| 17:54.24 | alex_joni | brlcad: don't think so.. he left from other channels aswell.. |
| 17:55.12 | ``Erik | most irc clients send a disconnect before closing the socket if the window is closed or they take a sigterm... |
| 17:57.01 | brlcad | or.. he was so upset that he ran over the power cord with his chair as he angrily wheeled off |
| 17:57.34 | ``Erik | probably more likely that he did something silly like run windows or linux and it crashed out from under him O:-) *shrug* |
| 17:57.45 | ``Erik | suckass luck though, poor guy |
| 17:57.54 | brlcad | yeah, amazing |
| 17:58.32 | louipc | linux is pretty stable at least for me |
| 17:58.46 | brlcad | presuming it's not a sucker story, .. cause you know everything on the net is true .. but he's been pretty consistent regardless |
| 17:59.57 | brlcad | terrylr could very well be a 13 year old girl fbi agent |
| 18:00.30 | *** join/#brlcad terrylr (i=terrylr@maria-enzersdorf.blauedonau.com) | |
| 18:00.34 | brlcad | there he be |
| 18:00.35 | louipc | 12:58 <@brlcad> terrylr could very well be a 13 year old girl fbi agent |
| 18:00.44 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:00.53 | terrylr | sorry, more hardware failures. |
| 18:01.17 | terrylr | louipc, why don't you go play in the street! |
| 18:01.33 | terrylr | louipc, a busy street! |
| 18:02.00 | louipc | with cars? |
| 18:02.12 | terrylr | i have been plagued by hardware failures the past month. |
| 18:02.32 | terrylr | louipc, yes with vehicles. |
| 18:02.47 | brlcad | hopefully not the one your sitting in or any attached to you! |
| 18:04.11 | terrylr | my trusty old standbys strauss and johann, both lost their hda disk. strauss's motherboard has bad ide controllers now. johann, is just plain old. close to 9 yrs old. |
| 18:05.11 | terrylr | i missed what you were asking before. not sure if the logs caught it. hang on let me look. |
| 18:06.11 | brlcad | I've heard of pets mirroring their owners, but not their computer equipment (bad bad joke *ahem* .. should probably ask if you're sensitive to jokes or take it in stride!) |
| 18:06.40 | brlcad | I'd just said that I'm glad to hear that you're still around |
| 18:07.37 | brlcad | some progress and developments on the BREP and STEP fronts since you were last around (moreso on the prior than the latter) -- both being the #1 project priority (at ARL and otherwise) for the year |
| 18:07.45 | terrylr | i do not care one way or the other. i have pretty much lost interest in the computers. i have no money to keep them going and basically just watching each one die. |
| 18:08.22 | terrylr | to answer your questions from before . |
| 18:08.54 | terrylr | yes, i was disabled before the 6 aug 2007 accident, from the 26 nov 1996 accident. |
| 18:09.24 | terrylr | since 1996, i have been able to work a combined total of two years. |
| 18:09.54 | terrylr | i now have two legal nightmares the 26 nov 1996 work accident and the 6 aug 2007 head-on-collision. |
| 18:10.24 | terrylr | it appears that both legal nightmares are going to be merged into one super legal nightmare. |
| 18:10.48 | terrylr | the medical bills just keep piling up. currently at $550,000.00 usd. |
| 18:12.57 | brlcad | incredible |
| 18:13.35 | brlcad | so what are your plans? |
| 18:13.57 | terrylr | so here is what is happening with legal nightmares. 1996 legal nightmare. even though i have never received any money since i have a december 2006 ruling which awards $500,000.00 usd the medical providers want that money. the individual liable for the accident has $250,000.00 usd per accident coverage. so $750,000.00 usd combined. medical providers get $550,000.00 usd lawyers get $175,000.00 usd and the remaining $25,000.00 usd is put i |
| 18:13.58 | terrylr | n escrow to cover my ongoing medical expenses. |
| 18:14.16 | brlcad | i can only imagine that you had to of "given up" by now .. i probably would have.. |
| 18:14.27 | terrylr | brlcad, so i am worst off than before. |
| 18:15.09 | brlcad | i gathered as much .. i can't imagine how you'd be in an accident and actually get better off.. |
| 18:15.31 | brlcad | mm. otherwise people would be volunteering to do it |
| 18:15.32 | terrylr | brlcad, i spend my days in the wheelchair or bed. i try using the walker but the legs are just PAINFUL! |
| 18:16.29 | terrylr | brlcad, my interests are in the metalworking occupational therapy group and cooking/baking. tinsmithing. |
| 18:17.10 | brlcad | neat |
| 18:17.19 | terrylr | brlcad, tinsmithing is something i can do while in the wheelchair. i do not need the leverage that standing would allow me. |
| 18:19.54 | brlcad | sounds pretty relaxing though, am at least quite familiar with working with ones hands and making things -- that can be quite fulfilling |
| 18:20.54 | terrylr | brlcad, btw, on top of the two legal nightmare accidents. back in the beginning of 2006 i quit smokiung. turns out i am hte one in a billion person who once they started smoking should nver quit. when i quit smoking. a defective genetic defect was triggered on. an extremely rare genetic disease. familial erythromelalgia. my brother has had it for 25+yrs. his doctors assumed that one of his brothers may also carry the same defect. well g |
| 18:20.54 | terrylr | uess what they were right. |
| 18:22.17 | brlcad | that sucks |
| 18:22.44 | brlcad | both that you *started* smoking and that you stopped, if that was the trigger |
| 18:23.01 | terrylr | now the real kicker. since the 6 aug 2007 head-on-collision and having to be rebooted several times at the accident scene. the familial erythromelalgia has been in total remission. has the doctors baffled. |
| 18:23.19 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:23.59 | terrylr | brlcad, the doctros are 99.99 % sure that quitting smoking triggered the defective gene on. |
| 18:24.00 | brlcad | maybe it's just thinking "wtf, I'm outta here .. this is messed up" |
| 18:25.08 | brlcad | so you going to be around more often, or just a stop by to visit? |
| 18:25.18 | terrylr | but anyway, today was the warmest day in months and i was able to get down to the computers. just thought i would touch bas with you. |
| 18:25.28 | brlcad | that's cool |
| 18:26.08 | brlcad | if you happen to recall where you left off with the step work and/or have files handy, I'd love to get a peek/copy sometime :) |
| 18:26.54 | terrylr | brlcad, most of my work has been lost with the harddrive failures of strauss and johann. |
| 18:27.13 | brlcad | damn them and their vile tonal failures |
| 18:27.56 | brlcad | well if you happen to run across a copy or a backup .. you know where to find me :) |
| 18:28.14 | terrylr | brlcad, part of the reason i have lost interest in the computers . i have lost too much and do not have it in me to recreate it. |
| 18:28.38 | terrylr | busy trying to learn to walk again. |
| 18:28.44 | brlcad | we did finally get a means to get the step spec in pdf format (just recently finished actually) .. *finally* |
| 18:29.07 | terrylr | good move in the right direction. |
| 18:29.42 | brlcad | yeah, that took quite a bit of effort to set up, but then once I got some equipment in place it was pretty quick n' easy |
| 18:29.52 | terrylr | brb comfort break. |
| 18:30.40 | brlcad | so now I can set up a means to share the pdf's under some non-redistribute arrangement with folks working on brl-cad (since ISO still close-holds it as IP) |
| 18:34.17 | louipc | hah what's the point of step if it isn't publicly accessible? |
| 18:35.02 | brlcad | the entire CAD industry outside of brl-cad is very much a traditional closed industry |
| 18:35.07 | brlcad | you pay to participate |
| 18:35.17 | brlcad | and pretty much every single major CAD company has |
| 18:35.49 | Z80-Boy | closed source conservative narrowminded |
| 18:35.52 | louipc | I figured it'd be more open if they were getting ISO involved |
| 18:36.39 | brlcad | paying the thousands for the relevant portions of the iso spec is pennies when a single license to your product costs more than that (and most of your CAD devs cost 500-1000% that) |
| 18:37.01 | Z80-Boy | I always laugh at "standards" that are for money |
| 18:37.20 | Z80-Boy | The idea is that everyone should adhere to it, not only the ones that are willing to pay those money, or not? |
| 18:37.33 | Z80-Boy | otherwise it's not a standard just a piece of paper ;-) |
| 18:37.53 | Z80-Boy | plus makes code audit difficult |
| 18:38.04 | louipc | well it is a standard if all the big boys use it |
| 18:38.13 | brlcad | yep |
| 18:38.16 | Z80-Boy | if a student wants to audit he has to buy the standard to understand how the code should properly behave |
| 18:38.22 | louipc | even if the regular joe doesn't have access to it |
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| 18:39.34 | brlcad | it's like going to an office and saying "everyone must pay me 2 pennies for a license to use the bathroom" .. it might be absurd especially given pretty much everyone will *have* to pay the fee, but in the end what do you think everyone would do .. they'd cough up the 2 pennies without hesitation |
| 18:39.59 | brlcad | they don't care if people outside the building haven't paid .. or if for them 2 pennies is a month's salary |
| 18:40.08 | brlcad | they're not in the building, not apart of their business |
| 18:40.42 | Z80-Boy | I guess he would be just ignored with his bathroom licence |
| 18:40.52 | Z80-Boy | or receive some fists into his face for bullying |
| 18:40.58 | louipc | piss in the penny jar |
| 18:40.59 | louipc | ;) |
| 18:41.07 | brlcad | hehe |
| 18:41.16 | brlcad | some do, even for step |
| 18:41.24 | brlcad | but they still put their two pennies in |
| 18:41.45 | alex_joni | before or after? |
| 18:42.08 | Z80-Boy | i would flush the penny jar contents down the toilet |
| 18:43.11 | Z80-Boy | it's interesting how free standards are often technically superior to the closed one |
| 18:43.15 | Z80-Boy | PNG vs. GIF |
| 18:43.24 | Z80-Boy | Ogg Vorbis vs. mp3 |
| 18:44.01 | brlcad | it's more like an electronic penny-lock on the bathroom that won't open without a penny, you can't get at the money or otherwise vadalize it other than pissing on the walls or crapping in the elevator (at which point they just remove you from the building) |
| 18:45.21 | brlcad | eh, not a great example .. for all of its technical "superiority", vorbis has made absolutely no dent in mp3 dominance |
| 18:45.59 | brlcad | png's faired better but just because there wasn't a format that fulfilled the requirements (lossless compressed truecolor imagery) |
| 18:46.20 | PrezKennedy | png really cant be compared to gif... |
| 18:46.43 | Z80-Boy | that's because the crap always dominates |
| 18:46.45 | brlcad | i think it just goes to show that technical superiority has nothing to do with prevalence and popularity if anything |
| 18:46.53 | Z80-Boy | mp3 is more crap than vorbis, therefore must dominate |
| 18:46.56 | PrezKennedy | maybe to jpg... but even there they fulfill two different things |
| 18:48.01 | brlcad | yeah, has more to do with their usage than their technical features -- most users couldn't care less so long as the tools are integrated and easy to use |
| 18:48.53 | Z80-Boy | look how crappy the youtube videos are and how popular they are |
| 18:52.15 | louipc | yeah lets make a better site! |
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| 19:56.57 | brlcad | yeah, C and C++ have done .. pretty well .. considering they are ansi and iso standards |
| 19:59.22 | brlcad | ``Erik: you have any uncommited show-stoppers? |
| 19:59.28 | brlcad | smells like a release brewing |
| 20:04.28 | brlcad | (or anyone else for that matter :) ) |
| 20:24.08 | yukonbob | heh -- that sounds pretty bad in pretty much any other context :P |
| 20:33.20 | brlcad | hehe |
| 20:33.23 | brlcad | so true |
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| 22:01.09 | forrestv | does anyone know what libbu/vfont.c is? |
| 22:01.37 | brlcad | yes? :) |
| 22:01.49 | brlcad | it's a vector font interface |
| 22:04.23 | brlcad | reads in old vfont files and gives you back a vfont struct that can then be used for drawing the vector fonts to a given context |
| 22:04.46 | brlcad | i.e., very basic font support for things that need the ability to render fonts quickly to any given output context type |
| 22:08.47 | forrestv | brlcad: is it related to an 'ASCII vfont text'? |
| 22:09.40 | brlcad | forrestv: in what context? |
| 22:09.45 | brlcad | sounds related |
| 22:10.13 | brlcad | vfont was predominantly ascii iirc |
| 22:13.46 | forrestv | brlcad: i searched google for the file output of an old font file (of an old game) that i'm trying to read and that file came up first |
| 22:14.29 | brlcad | forrestv: it used to be the standard font file format (go back 20+ years) |
| 22:14.44 | brlcad | we have a couple sample files |
| 22:14.59 | forrestv | brlcad: ya nonie.r.12 |
| 22:15.08 | brlcad | yeah, and fix.6r |
| 22:15.11 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/src/vfont/ |
| 22:16.05 | brlcad | i believe the libbu and vfont routines do the same for reading the font, haven't looked into merging them yet .. kinda low priority ;) |
| 22:16.25 | brlcad | there are examples of using them in src/fbed and src/lgt |
| 22:18.13 | brlcad | not the best screenshot, but if you look at the lower-left graphical panel in http://brlcad.org/images/mged.jpg .. there are vfonts in action at the bottom in that display where it says sz=152.449 mm, .... |
| 23:38.13 | louipc | ls |
| 23:41.43 | brlcad | -bash: ls: command not found |
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| 00:45.35 | brlcad | forrestv: did that answer your question? |
| 00:51.19 | forrestv | brlcad: yes, thanks. i have realized that this font is not actually a vector font though :) . i'm still working on reverse engineering it. |
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| 04:53.30 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:54.03 | starseeker | Looks like it's a bit under 5 gigs - not unreasonable in this day and age |
| 04:58.50 | starseeker | The main USGS files present more of a problem - they only seem to be available through various web interfaces - it would take a project to create a mirror from that |
| 06:11.29 | brlcad | yeah, I think that's the data I snarfed at one point .. it was pretty big |
| 06:11.44 | brlcad | i might have deleted it though, have to dig for it |
| 06:12.45 | brlcad | don't recall it being hard to pull, just took a couple weeks (throttled) |
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| 10:58.48 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 14:27.44 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30446 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bio.h config_win.h): moved some windows.h related undefs from config_win.h to bio.h |
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| 14:28.17 | brlcad | was wondering how much I broke with bio.h |
| 14:30.09 | d_rossberg | brlcad: much |
| 14:30.51 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30447 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): include the new bio.h where necessary |
| 14:39.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30448 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (152 files in 2 dirs): |
| 14:39.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: unfortunately raytrace.h needs windows.h (on a Win32 platform) but bio.h has to be included right after the system includes, therefore it can not be included in raytrace.h (this would be to late) |
| 14:39.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: this are the changes for the core libraries only, there are certainly more in other libraries necessary |
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| 15:03.05 | brlcad | eep |
| 15:04.44 | brlcad | sorry about that d_rossberg |
| 15:05.29 | brlcad | what exactly did raytrace.h need from bio.h? |
| 15:06.55 | brlcad | bob's not been in for a couple days so haven't had him on hand to test/fix |
| 15:29.18 | d_rossberg | win32 processs handles in struct run_rt (actually a pointer to "something") |
| 15:30.19 | brlcad | just kicked off a win32 compile .. first time in months.. I'll see if I can weed out some of the problems :) |
| 15:30.49 | brlcad | (albeit vc8) |
| 15:31.12 | brlcad | we're getting close to release if things look stable |
| 15:31.54 | brlcad | ah.. hit the raytrace.h problem |
| 15:33.19 | brlcad | hm, that smells like a private struct |
| 15:38.29 | d_rossberg | if you have found a solution, maybe you can undo my last commit (only the last one!) |
| 15:38.51 | d_rossberg | it was all about raytrace.h |
| 15:40.56 | brlcad | yeah, though I think it's safe, i.e. not wasted effort |
| 15:41.24 | brlcad | but I think the problem is in raytrace.h |
| 15:41.56 | brlcad | looks like a half-dozen WIN32's have crept into some of the public headers that probably shouldn't be there, testing removal of one now |
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| 15:42.23 | brlcad | then i'll look at the run_rt struct later today |
| 15:42.43 | brlcad | (it'll take it a while to fully rebuild/test and I have a meeting coming up) ;) |
| 15:46.39 | d_rossberg | no problem, time to go is near |
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| 23:29.28 | starseeker | Anyone have any experience with Cavalry external hard drives? |
| 02:37.55 | brlcad | nope |
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| 06:32.38 | Z80-Boy | My infamous model: Frame 0: 4720128 rays in 26011.79 sec = 181.46 rays/sec (wallclock) |
| 06:32.46 | Z80-Boy | And that's a COre 2 Duo 2.2 GHz |
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| 08:00.45 | clock_ | hi all |
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| 11:34.52 | brlcad | wow, that is incredibly slow |
| 11:38.47 | clock_ | brlcad: I hope you can look at the model which causes this and see the cause |
| 11:38.53 | clock_ | now I am leaving for lunch sorry |
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| 13:39.18 | illethal | Hello fellow humans of Earth! |
| 13:41.11 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:41.19 | ``Erik | no hello for me, illethal? *cry* :D |
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| 15:16.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30449 10/brlcad/trunk/src/irprep/Makefile.am: put irdisp neatly under WITH_X11 condition |
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| 15:51.55 | ``Erik | quit pissing peer off, dude, he'll jack you up |
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| 15:56.45 | clock_ | brlcad: yes I have 118 pixels per second |
| 15:57.00 | clock_ | brlcad: it's the strange model that causes 210x slowdown |
| 15:57.28 | clock_ | http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/headcut.g object name headcut |
| 15:58.59 | brlcad | clock_: I'm aware of the model, and had looked at it |
| 15:59.02 | brlcad | and commented on it |
| 15:59.08 | brlcad | or have you forgotten?? :) |
| 15:59.17 | ``Erik | neat, bus error |
| 15:59.20 | clock_ | I faintly remember you have commented on it |
| 15:59.22 | clock_ | but not what you said |
| 15:59.30 | clock_ | A fact is it's still hell slow |
| 15:59.36 | clock_ | is it gonna stay this slow? |
| 16:00.44 | brlcad | it's slow for several reasons -- the biggest of which relates to how it's modeled -- you can get the same shape with a different hierarchy and probably get back much of the performance |
| 16:00.49 | brlcad | you're more than 210x slower |
| 16:00.55 | brlcad | you're mixing two different issues |
| 16:01.30 | clock_ | can't the program transform the hierarchy into the more efficient one automatically? |
| 16:01.42 | ``Erik | cuz that's insanely complex to do? |
| 16:01.49 | brlcad | clock_: go for it |
| 16:02.21 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:02.22 | clock_ | So now I have to do a insanely complex thing with my model to get back some of the performance? |
| 16:02.41 | ``Erik | insanely complex to automate correctly |
| 16:02.58 | clock_ | how should I change the hierarchy? |
| 16:03.09 | ``Erik | if we could do that reasonably, we could also convert polygon soup to csg reasonably |
| 16:04.36 | brlcad | usually just balancing the csg tree will do wonders particularly if it's deep |
| 16:05.05 | brlcad | but the better opt involves looking at the shapes and bounding boxes of the shapes being used |
| 16:05.05 | clock_ | No it's shallow |
| 16:05.07 | clock_ | like 3 or 4 |
| 16:05.32 | brlcad | er, not that I recall.. |
| 16:06.22 | brlcad | gah, it's hard as heck to chat right now |
| 16:06.30 | brlcad | isp is being attacked |
| 16:06.34 | ``Erik | well, it may be disguised |
| 16:06.51 | ``Erik | if you, say, union 16 things all together at once, it looks like one level, but it's actually at least 3 |
| 16:07.10 | ``Erik | er, 5 |
| 16:07.32 | clock_ | But it has a lot of things in one node |
| 16:07.36 | ``Erik | the actual csg structure is all leaf, unary or binary |
| 16:07.38 | brlcad | and depending on the ops and the way they're input, you might even end up with 16 levels |
| 16:08.00 | clock_ | Balancing a tree isn't an insanely complex operation |
| 16:08.11 | clock_ | It has the insane complexity of second year of the university |
| 16:08.14 | ``Erik | but it's an ordered tree |
| 16:08.25 | clock_ | what's an ordered tree? |
| 16:08.26 | ``Erik | if you change the order or even position, you change the semantic |
| 16:08.47 | clock_ | not for unions |
| 16:09.04 | brlcad | clock_: so then seriously .. code it up, you're being given the simple explanation just for sake of explaining it |
| 16:09.04 | clock_ | not for logical ANDs |
| 16:09.26 | ``Erik | ok, imagine if you have, say, a union, then you use that union to cut from another object, that makes one shape... but if you cut, then union, say through a tree balancing, it's the same operations, but you get a different shape |
| 16:09.48 | clock_ | I have an impression now that BRL-CAD contains some kind of simple straightforward unoptimized implementation that goes off on heavily unbalanced trees |
| 16:09.52 | ``Erik | and I think for simple union, we do balance? |
| 16:10.44 | brlcad | clock_: actually the csg processing is *heavily* optimized, one of the tightest you'll find anywhere |
| 16:10.56 | brlcad | but in this particular instance, there is other stuff going on |
| 16:11.20 | ``Erik | the next step in optimizing is worth a fair number of doctorates, I'd imagine :/ |
| 16:11.22 | brlcad | several issues, one being the construction hierarchy, other issues being the bounding volumes iirc |
| 16:11.40 | clock_ | Do I imagine CSG correctly as firing a ray, intersecting with all primitives their bounding boxes the ray hits, and then finding the first visible intersect according to the logical operations? |
| 16:11.44 | ``Erik | perhaps np complete, even |
| 16:12.21 | clock_ | My scene has no reason to be difficult |
| 16:12.28 | clock_ | It's a stack of cylindrical slices |
| 16:12.36 | clock_ | and the stack is cut in half with a large primitive |
| 16:12.42 | brlcad | clock_: no, it's considerably more complex than that -- there is spatial partitioning to determine which bounding boxes to test against |
| 16:12.46 | clock_ | Every cylindrical slice has a tiny bounding box |
| 16:13.00 | brlcad | if you did what you suggest of "intersecting with all primitives their bounding boxes the ray hits" it would be horrendously slow |
| 16:13.14 | clock_ | so every ray hits only through small amount of slices unless you are looking close to the axis |
| 16:13.22 | brlcad | depending on how you actually determine which bounding boxes it intersects |
| 16:13.26 | clock_ | The deadly picture isn't AFAIK looking along the axis |
| 16:14.00 | ``Erik | whoa |
| 16:14.11 | brlcad | clock_: I believe itss that large primitive that is killing it |
| 16:14.26 | clock_ | is it so complex to calculate an intersection with a cube? |
| 16:14.28 | brlcad | by doing that, it basically has to evaluate every primitive every time |
| 16:14.33 | ``Erik | does 'head' raytrace fast? |
| 16:14.40 | clock_ | yes |
| 16:14.42 | clock_ | fast as hell |
| 16:14.44 | ``Erik | (and did anyone do a tree on head? jfc) |
| 16:15.43 | clock_ | Or maybe the bounding boxes are evaluated too liberal? |
| 16:15.58 | clock_ | Like saying a tiny slice of metal with a huge negative box give a bounding box of the negative box? |
| 16:16.22 | ``Erik | Frame 0: 263441 rays in 12.24 sec = 21527.96 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 16:16.25 | clock_ | For an AND it's good to at least take the bounding box of the smaller part |
| 16:17.27 | ``Erik | definitely the massive boolean overload from having the slice at that position :/ |
| 16:17.46 | clock_ | I can't put the slice elsewhere sorry |
| 16:17.57 | clock_ | The idea is to show where the bolts are going through |
| 16:18.05 | ``Erik | without the cutter |
| 16:18.06 | ``Erik | Frame 0: 262165 rays in 0.04 sec = 6802545.46 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 16:18.18 | clock_ | why do you get 21527 rays and me 118? |
| 16:18.23 | clock_ | I have 2.2GHz Core Duo |
| 16:18.28 | ``Erik | cuz my machine is moar awesomer |
| 16:18.31 | clock_ | What do you have? |
| 16:18.35 | ``Erik | 8 3ghz cores |
| 16:18.41 | illethal | That is awesome. |
| 16:18.44 | illethal | Octcore? |
| 16:18.53 | clock_ | ZX Spectrum with a secret tape of Manic Miner picked from the wreckage of US 193? |
| 16:19.02 | clock_ | octopus |
| 16:19.02 | ``Erik | two quadcore xeons, beefy mac pro |
| 16:19.20 | ``Erik | makes a nice footrest, too |
| 16:19.21 | clock_ | OK |
| 16:19.44 | clock_ | Do you understand the mechanism of the slowdown? |
| 16:19.47 | ``Erik | if you made, say, a hundred small cutting boxes, the scnee would go much faster |
| 16:19.48 | ``Erik | yes |
| 16:20.07 | clock_ | why would making hundred small ones help? |
| 16:20.25 | ``Erik | because right now, your big cutting box is in the tree making the bounding volume include everything |
| 16:20.34 | ``Erik | so every single pixel must evaluate every single primitive |
| 16:20.41 | ``Erik | and weave all of them together |
| 16:20.51 | ``Erik | you've effectively eliminated space partitioning |
| 16:21.00 | clock_ | so if you have a 3mm part and cut it with a 1m cube, the bounding box inflates to 1m? |
| 16:21.07 | ``Erik | yes |
| 16:21.24 | clock_ | Whoa! What algorithmic motorization! Secret trick, dude: if you subtract from something, it never gets bigger |
| 16:21.49 | ``Erik | yeah, but what if that 1m cube not only clips out part of that 3mm part, but ALSO part of the other 3mm part over there |
| 16:22.12 | ``Erik | until evaluated, there's no way to know what primitives that subtraction impacts |
| 16:22.22 | ``Erik | YOU know, because you're modelling it,but the software CANNOT know |
| 16:22.47 | clock_ | OK jokes about pinnacle of development back let's assume it's really serious |
| 16:23.12 | clock_ | Let's say I have a scene with zillion tiny slices and one big cube that subtracts (eats off) half of each slice |
| 16:23.29 | clock_ | I fire a ray |
| 16:23.49 | clock_ | Now I take one primitive after another, check it's bounding box and possibly calculate intersection |
| 16:28.03 | clock_ | ``Erik: what the software knows is that the cube is always the same cube so it doesn't have to calculate it million times |
| 16:35.33 | clock_ | What the software also know is that zillion parts cut with one cutter equals zillion results of (part cut with the cutter) |
| 16:36.02 | clock_ | or more precisely can know, if programmed thusly |
| 16:38.10 | illethal | Dang how do I compile this. |
| 16:52.18 | clock_ | illethal: do you have an error? |
| 16:52.22 | illethal | I type make install |
| 16:52.26 | illethal | but it does nothing, I'm su. |
| 16:52.33 | illethal | It says no targets. |
| 16:52.36 | clock_ | did you do make before? |
| 16:52.38 | illethal | What directory do I have to be in? |
| 16:52.46 | clock_ | in the toplevel brl-cad |
| 16:52.50 | illethal | Doesn't do anything either |
| 16:53.19 | clock_ | What I do is unpack tgz, configure, make, make install |
| 16:53.20 | clock_ | it works |
| 16:53.23 | clock_ | on Linux and OpenBSD |
| 16:53.27 | clock_ | what system do you have? |
| 16:53.29 | illethal | Linux |
| 16:53.33 | illethal | Ubuntu 64 |
| 16:53.37 | clock_ | oops 64 |
| 16:53.54 | clock_ | heard that a lots of things don't work on 64 |
| 16:54.14 | illethal | Ahhhh a lot do actually. |
| 16:54.25 | illethal | Just Flash is meh. |
| 16:54.40 | illethal | nspluginwrapper crap. It works for 30 mins them breaks, then I have to recompile. |
| 16:55.29 | illethal | root@valhall:/home/oden/Desktop/progs/usr# make |
| 16:55.31 | illethal | make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found. Stop. |
| 16:55.40 | illethal | arg |
| 16:55.42 | illethal | wrong dir |
| 16:55.54 | illethal | Still |
| 16:55.58 | illethal | Doesn't do anything wtf. |
| 16:56.05 | clock_ | maybe it's a demo version |
| 16:56.10 | clock_ | after 30 seconds you have to buy a licence? |
| 16:56.21 | clock_ | My Firefox crashes |
| 16:56.29 | clock_ | That's normal that Firefox is a piece of crap |
| 16:56.34 | illethal | Everything else works fine except flash for me. |
| 16:56.38 | clock_ | oh 30 minutes you wrote not seconds sorry |
| 16:56.45 | clock_ | My flash works but often crashes |
| 16:56.58 | clock_ | And brings down the whole Firefox. It hangs and stops refreshing the window |
| 16:56.58 | illethal | Adobe needs to burn. |
| 16:57.03 | clock_ | I have to kill it lose all my open tabs |
| 16:57.15 | clock_ | Adobe is piece of crap |
| 16:57.16 | illethal | What distro you on? |
| 16:57.22 | clock_ | Linux From Scratch |
| 16:57.34 | illethal | From Scrath? |
| 16:57.39 | clock_ | yes |
| 16:57.40 | illethal | Like you made your own os? |
| 16:57.46 | illethal | Or modified/whatever? |
| 16:57.49 | clock_ | compiled |
| 16:58.08 | clock_ | LFS is a web instructions where they tell you what to type to compile everything from scratch |
| 16:58.18 | illethal | Cool. |
| 16:58.19 | clock_ | kernel, gcc, glibc,...bash,...,firefox,... |
| 16:58.26 | illethal | Ubuntu is pretty unstable. |
| 16:58.28 | illethal | Imo. |
| 16:58.37 | illethal | I think I'm going to switch to gentoo. |
| 16:58.45 | clock_ | Friend had an Ubuntu and he typed locate and locate segfaulted |
| 16:58.53 | illethal | Yeah. |
| 16:59.03 | clock_ | I had gentoo but every time I upgraded it blew up about 5 times and I had to try secret tricks from google |
| 16:59.14 | illethal | haha |
| 16:59.16 | clock_ | sometimes the tricks didn't work so I had to google up a different remedy etc. |
| 16:59.19 | clock_ | It's a load of bullshit |
| 16:59.25 | clock_ | Then I ditched gentoo and tried OpenBSD |
| 16:59.30 | clock_ | Also exploded when I upgrded |
| 16:59.31 | illethal | Well my bro uses gentoo more than ubuntu. So if I need help I've got it. |
| 16:59.41 | clock_ | So now I have LFS. I had LFS for years before and I was basically happy |
| 16:59.45 | clock_ | So now I am happy again :) |
| 16:59.49 | illethal | I havn't upgraded in a long ass time. |
| 16:59.52 | illethal | I'm still on feisty. |
| 17:00.17 | illethal | Ubuntu has such gay names. |
| 17:00.21 | illethal | Gutsy Gibbon lol |
| 17:00.28 | clock_ | Software today is piece of crap. Load of bullshit. Heap of trash. |
| 17:00.48 | clock_ | I am gay |
| 17:00.59 | clock_ | you shouldn't use the word "gay" as a synonym for something bad or laughable |
| 17:01.14 | illethal | You're a homosexual. |
| 17:01.22 | illethal | Not gay =P |
| 17:01.22 | clock_ | Yes that too |
| 17:01.28 | clock_ | No I am gay |
| 17:01.34 | illethal | You could be a manic depressed homosexual! |
| 17:01.44 | clock_ | you could be Manic Miner |
| 17:02.39 | illethal | Don't mean to offend you buddy. |
| 17:02.39 | clock_ | Yeah sure I know |
| 17:02.39 | clock_ | you just didn't care to offend all gays in the world |
| 17:03.23 | illethal | You mean homos. |
| 17:03.33 | clock_ | I know what I mean |
| 17:03.35 | clock_ | you can't know it |
| 17:03.50 | illethal | Homos are gays. Heteros are Sads. |
| 17:04.38 | clock_ | yeah you have all those wifes shopping babies etc. |
| 17:04.45 | clock_ | changing diapers |
| 17:04.49 | clock_ | kindergartens |
| 17:05.41 | illethal | Gays like to shop too I thought. |
| 17:05.50 | clock_ | Especially the camp ones |
| 17:05.53 | illethal | Could just be a stereotype. |
| 17:06.17 | clock_ | Buy a lot offancy crap to hook up on their HIV-soaked promiscuous bodies |
| 17:06.36 | illethal | Exactly. |
| 17:06.43 | clock_ | I don't like promiscuous gays |
| 17:06.45 | illethal | To each his own. |
| 17:06.53 | clock_ | I read 1 of 6 gays in the "scene" in Zurich are HIV+ |
| 17:07.36 | clock_ | sounds like I should walk only with rubber gloves protective goggles and a preservative already on in the street just for the case I passed by some of them |
| 17:08.20 | clock_ | sounds like a promiscuity is a ticket to cemetery here |
| 17:09.27 | illethal | Lol |
| 17:09.36 | illethal | yeah that's groooooooz |
| 17:09.52 | clock_ | 1 in 6 that's like the Russian Roulette |
| 17:10.45 | clock_ | If they invent a vaccine for HIV they need to excavate a lot of earth for the storage tanks in the factory |
| 17:10.58 | illethal | Haha |
| 17:11.05 | clock_ | maybe build a pipeline |
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| 17:11.42 | illethal | Isn't Zurich in Switzerland? |
| 17:11.51 | clock_ | ``Erik: did I offend you with my comment on pinnacle of 30 years of development? |
| 17:11.56 | clock_ | yes Switzerland |
| 17:12.15 | clock_ | in the news today in teh paper new in the train |
| 17:12.21 | clock_ | they wrote the price of prostitution dropped |
| 17:12.33 | clock_ | like 30 CHF (35 USD?) for a sex in the street |
| 17:12.47 | illethal | http://micah.noobgrinder.com/builda.png |
| 17:12.58 | clock_ | What's happening with our Zurich? |
| 17:13.23 | illethal | Something I was working on a while ago. |
| 17:13.27 | clock_ | Autodesk that's not BRL-CAD |
| 17:13.35 | clock_ | do you want to use BRL-CAD for that? |
| 17:13.59 | illethal | It's maya. |
| 17:14.07 | illethal | 8.5 |
| 17:14.18 | illethal | I could probably never do that in BRL-CAD. |
| 17:14.35 | illethal | All I can do in BRL-CAD is make a cube and move it's faces lol |
| 17:14.44 | clock_ | yeah |
| 17:14.59 | clock_ | nothing against BRL-CAD I like BRL-CAD even with the limitations it has |
| 17:15.05 | clock_ | But I wanted to do a polygonal plate |
| 17:15.16 | clock_ | So I asked brlcad and he advised me some secret command that was undocumented |
| 17:15.22 | clock_ | Described the syntax in detail |
| 17:15.32 | clock_ | I typed it I believe exactly as he said and it didn't work |
| 17:15.59 | clock_ | Every now and then I run into some error in the doc, ambiguity or some topic not being covered at all |
| 17:16.04 | clock_ | I also found a lot of segfaults |
| 17:16.26 | clock_ | Like - it's still great - but these can be serious obstackles during work, especially for a novice |
| 17:16.38 | clock_ | Now I have a problem if I do a cutaway view the rendering alsmost grinds to a halt |
| 17:17.28 | clock_ | BRL-CAD people are great they fix all or most of the problems shortly after I find them |
| 17:17.31 | clock_ | Especially segfaults |
| 18:07.09 | ``Erik | nah, didn't offend me, I was out at lunch |
| 18:08.05 | ``Erik | I'm hoping my contributions have removed a lot of the suck and modernized things a lot int he last few years, but *shrug* I'm only one codegod :D and smothered in bs politics and crap so I don't have much time to commit |
| 18:15.26 | clock_ | ``Erik: the problem is my model is logically built |
| 18:15.34 | clock_ | that means I first make a device like the optical head |
| 18:15.46 | clock_ | and then I say now we want to look what's inside .... cut! |
| 18:16.01 | clock_ | Thinking about the cut at the moment I make the screw is not appropriate. |
| 18:16.07 | clock_ | Also because the script is made by an automatic script. |
| 18:16.25 | clock_ | However, would it help if the cutting thing was composed of a larger amount of smaller subthings? |
| 18:17.21 | clock_ | the script is made -> the bolt (screw) is made |
| 18:46.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30450 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: struct dg_obj and supporting cast has been moved to dg.h |
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| 18:47.02 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30451 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dg.h: Initial check-in. |
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| 18:48.54 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30452 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (69 files in 5 dirs): Mods related to bio.h and the new dg.h wrt getting things compiled on Windows. |
| 18:54.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30453 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Move "drawable geometry" related function declarations to dg.h |
| 19:02.44 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30454 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dg.h: Added function declarations. |
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| 21:00.30 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30455 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/opennurbs_ext.cpp: Move include for bio.h after common.h |
| 21:05.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30456 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: Move include for bio.h after common.h |
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| 22:18.54 | ``Erik | 1http://bash.org/?10626 |
| 22:24.48 | ``Erik | minus that first 1, of course |
| 22:25.09 | archivist | cooking, whats wrong with beans on cheese on toast? |
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| 00:26.43 | Maloeran | Hey Erik, I missed your reply, where did your comic page go? :) You can say it in privmsg if the talks push the reply out of the buffer again, thanks |
| 00:31.41 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 00:32.38 | iraytrace | evening all ! |
| 00:35.30 | brlcad | Maloeran: it's up at http://bzflag.bz/~erik/comics/ |
| 00:35.40 | brlcad | iraytrace: howdy! |
| 00:35.57 | iraytrace | Howdy back! |
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| 01:41.15 | ``Erik | heh, someone needs to put a fly trap up to stick lee here |
| 01:41.46 | ``Erik | mal: math.missouristate.edu changed to euler.missouristate.edu and they didn't bother telling me until 4 days after it happened |
| 01:41.52 | ``Erik | so I've been fixing the mail handler and shit to cope |
| 01:42.07 | ``Erik | and they didn't bother with a cname cuz they're tards |
| 01:42.30 | ``Erik | but I keep the comic page in cvs, so any place with a reasonable php can take it fast... a mirror is on bz :) |
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| 03:11.33 | starseeker | iraytrace: So what's it like doing IRC on a pogo stick? ;-) |
| 03:12.07 | iraytrace | Its SoMeWhAt DiScOnCeRtInG |
| 03:25.54 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:26.05 | starseeker | Is your connection a bit erratic? |
| 03:48.22 | iraytrace | Sorry, preoccupied with /. |
| 03:49.29 | iraytrace | How's life on the coast? |
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| 07:01.09 | oden1 | Good day fellows. |
| 07:01.16 | illethal | pow |
| 07:01.28 | illethal | I use weechat-curses and it never keeps my nick name the way I want it. |
| 07:01.45 | Axman6 | use irssi, and you |
| 07:01.49 | Axman6 | you'll be fine |
| 07:01.56 | Axman6 | learn to type, and i'll be fine |
| 07:02.00 | illethal | Irssi is similar, ya? |
| 07:02.03 | illethal | Hahaha |
| 07:02.09 | Axman6 | that is, i should learn to type, not you :P |
| 07:02.17 | illethal | I should learn also. |
| 07:02.25 | illethal | I heard hooked on phonics is pretty good. |
| 07:02.48 | Axman6 | never used weechat, but it's basically considered the best cli irc client (and to some, the best irc client, cli or otherwise ;) |
| 07:03.02 | illethal | I'd have to agree. |
| 07:03.07 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30457 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (cmd.h dg.h): this will very-likely re-break the build on Windows, but bio.h is a private header and cannot be included in any public headers. (e.g. it shouldn't ever be installed.) |
| 07:03.16 | illethal | I don't know all the commands but it smokes the old mIRC I used to use on windows. |
| 07:04.14 | brlcad | shouldn't that be "i herd hokt on fonics iz prity gud" |
| 07:04.30 | illethal | ya sumtin lik dat |
| 07:06.54 | starseeker | brlcad: What's the alternative to including bio.h? |
| 07:07.43 | brlcad | not including it? :) |
| 07:08.40 | brlcad | it belongs in the app code, not the public headers -- it's just included elsewhere |
| 07:09.03 | brlcad | it's also really just a simple wrapper around a more complex set of #include logic |
| 07:09.34 | illethal | Man brlcad you're so leet. |
| 07:09.37 | brlcad | logic that provide standard and native I/O decls |
| 07:13.02 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30458 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: why are these three ifree functions needed? if they're special, they should probably be documented with a comment. |
| 07:14.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30459 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: give it a name 'just in case' someone really does need these so they can be given a cppflag that will make it all better |
| 07:16.22 | illethal | Axman6: in irssi, what is the command to join another channel, and still remain in the one you are currently in? |
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| 07:20.51 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30460 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/flawfinder.sh: add a regression test for bio.h to make sure nobody adds it to a public header down the road. |
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| 07:37.31 | illethal | Hello president Kennedy. |
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| 07:47.54 | brlcad | yay for for file in `find . -type f \( -name \*.c -o -name \*.cpp -o -name \*.cxx -o -name \*.h -o -name \*.y -o -name \*.l \) -not -regex '.*src/other.*' -not -regex '.*~' -not -regex '.*\.log' -not -regex '.*Makefile.*' -not -regex '.*cache.*' -not -regex '.*\.svn.*' -exec grep -n -I -e '#[[:space:]]*include' {} /dev/null \; | grep "\"common.h\"" | sed 's/:.*//g'` ; do if test -f "`echo $file | sed 's/\.c$/\.l/g'`" ; then continue ; fi ; grep '#[[:space:]]*in |
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| 08:27.52 | poolio | brlcad: Is that you entry in the obfuscated bash contest? |
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| 08:41.57 | brlcad | heh, no way |
| 08:42.06 | brlcad | that's pretty straightforward (to me at least) :) |
| 08:42.21 | brlcad | half of it is just the find pattern |
| 08:42.31 | poolio | It's straightforward if you try to figure it out, but at 4am and halfway through a paper, it's gibberish. |
| 08:42.40 | brlcad | i've written much much longer :) |
| 08:43.10 | brlcad | that one just does a neat thing, finds all non-lexer files that don't include common as the first file |
| 08:44.09 | poolio | I always mess up quotes and back quotes and double quotes |
| 08:44.14 | poolio | And sometimes wish I had another type of quote to use |
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| 09:33.16 | brlcad | :) |
| 09:33.54 | brlcad | d_rossberg: fyi, I'm also working/verifying the windows build |
| 09:34.17 | brlcad | last stages of trying to make sure everything is stable and working (particularly windows) for this 7.12.0 release |
| 09:34.51 | brlcad | hopefully the end of this week/weekend if there aren't any problems -- if you find anything, please let me know or mail the dev list |
| 09:36.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30461 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/flawfinder.sh: |
| 09:36.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: add another coding check for the common.h inclusion ordering. this makes sure |
| 09:36.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: common.h always comes first if/when listed in a file. alas the script isn't |
| 09:36.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: tweaked to work right if there are spaces in the path name, but then there are |
| 09:36.56 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: probably other scripts like that in regress too |
| 09:41.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30462 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (7 files in 2 dirs): some additional bio.h includes to make the Windows build work again |
| 09:42.48 | d_rossberg | brlcad: now my windows-dll build works again |
| 09:57.06 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30463 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/Makefile.am: opennurbs_zlib.h needs to be installed because of the z_stream type |
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| 14:22.02 | brlcad | d_rossberg: okay |
| 14:45.44 | ``Erik | hukt on fonix heheheh |
| 14:48.21 | yukonbob | archivist: oxford |
| 14:49.12 | archivist | Im about 70 miles north near Derby and Burton |
| 14:53.29 | brlcad | howdybob |
| 14:53.48 | yukonbob | hey -- what's shaking |
| 14:54.04 | yukonbob | (/me was waving North, to archivist) :) |
| 14:54.17 | yukonbob | :) |
| 14:55.54 | archivist | I like Blackwells bookshop in Oxford |
| 15:10.16 | yukonbob | brlcad: heh |
| 15:15.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30464 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: include/conf/DATE is in builddir, not srcdir |
| 15:15.43 | brlcad | gah, then that's version-specific |
| 15:16.07 | brlcad | I traced down one config and during distcheck, it was stashing DATE into srcdir as a BUILT_SOURCES |
| 15:16.34 | brlcad | that or something else is missing |
| 15:16.43 | brlcad | maybe DESTDIR |
| 15:27.17 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:27.17 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 15:27.37 | ``Erik | using the rhel automake, it was bitching about not finding that file |
| 15:29.48 | Maloeran | Thanks brlcad and ``Erik for the update on the comics page :) |
| 15:30.21 | ``Erik | threre're two copies now, in case one craps out... one at euler.missouristate.edu and one at bz.bzflag.bz |
| 15:34.31 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30465 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (librt/Makefile.am other/libpng/Makefile.am): update dependancy info |
| 15:34.54 | clock_ | ``Erik: would it help to make the cutting primitive from more smaller parts? |
| 15:35.13 | ``Erik | clock: probably |
| 15:36.02 | ``Erik | making the cut lower in the heirarchy with smaller cutters would be useful |
| 15:36.05 | ``Erik | i'd imagine |
| 15:36.24 | ``Erik | or just suck it up and accept the slow raytrace time *shrug* :) |
| 15:36.27 | clock_ | I don't want the cut low in the hierarchy |
| 15:36.40 | clock_ | but the raytrace takes like a week |
| 15:37.00 | ``Erik | yeah? and? :D |
| 15:37.04 | clock_ | Even when I bought a modern 2-CPU machine just for the purpose of the slow BRL-CAD renderingf |
| 15:37.52 | clock_ | would it help if the cut would still be at the toplevel, but I wouldn't cut with one big cube, but with a union of a lot of small cubes? |
| 15:39.14 | ``Erik | y'know, thinking about it now, I don't think so |
| 15:39.35 | clock_ | so to speed up it must be down in the hierarchy? |
| 15:39.54 | ``Erik | the bounding box and bounding sphere grow as you walk up the heirarchy, and the thing that's killing you is bad space partitioning, I think |
| 15:40.09 | ``Erik | brlcad knows the guts of the space partitioning crap far better than I do |
| 15:40.12 | clock_ | What is exctly space partitioning? An octree? |
| 15:40.18 | ``Erik | I'm kinda guessing based on symptoms |
| 15:40.29 | ``Erik | um, I think it's more of a KD-tree |
| 15:40.38 | ``Erik | or BSP |
| 15:40.45 | clock_ | What function does it do in BRL-CAD? |
| 15:40.53 | ``Erik | space partitioning? |
| 15:41.24 | ``Erik | it's all about culling O.o |
| 15:41.26 | clock_ | SO basically you have a function which you give a point and it returns you all objects that might intersect that point? |
| 15:42.07 | ``Erik | a ray (or perhaps a line), and all possibly intersecting geometry on that line/ray |
| 15:42.48 | clock_ | Well my case should slow down exactly twice |
| 15:42.57 | clock_ | and not 210x |
| 15:43.24 | ``Erik | noooo, in your case, it should slow down up to, um, I think 10kx? |
| 15:43.37 | clock_ | why? |
| 15:43.41 | ``Erik | I lost your .g file |
| 15:43.48 | ``Erik | your 'head' object is complex |
| 15:44.12 | ``Erik | the possibly slowdown is in the neighborhood of the number of primitives in head |
| 15:44.26 | ``Erik | possible |
| 15:44.38 | clock_ | Can adding one cube increase the complexity 10,000 times? |
| 15:44.42 | ``Erik | maybe nlg2n, I d'no the guts of the code |
| 15:45.17 | clock_ | The rt prints "20,xxx primitives" |
| 15:45.20 | clock_ | 20 thousand something |
| 15:45.24 | ``Erik | well, if I have a million sphers in a row and I shoot it from the side, it'll be very fast, because I only ever have to test one sphere per ray |
| 15:45.30 | clock_ | is it the number of primitives I have in the scene? |
| 15:45.43 | clock_ | Or does it break down the primitives further into individual intersecting areas? |
| 15:45.46 | ``Erik | but if I cut all of them in half with one huge box, every ray requires 1m+1 computations |
| 15:46.01 | clock_ | Why? |
| 15:46.08 | clock_ | I would think it requires 2 computation |
| 15:46.11 | ``Erik | if I had 1m sphers and 1m corrosponding boxes, each one cutting a signle sphere, then each ray would take 2 |
| 15:46.18 | clock_ | Once it intersects the bounding box of one sphere |
| 15:46.22 | clock_ | second times the huge box |
| 15:47.04 | ``Erik | ... in the general case, you cannot know what the total impact of that single cutter is |
| 15:47.12 | clock_ | The partitioning should return only those primitives whose bounding boxes are intersected by the ray |
| 15:47.13 | ``Erik | so you have to evaluate everything in the tree |
| 15:47.26 | clock_ | So adding one primitive adds maximum one more hit per ray |
| 15:47.51 | clock_ | Sounds like the algorithm has a bug |
| 15:47.57 | clock_ | which is triggered by my scene |
| 15:48.13 | ``Erik | um, the algorithm is fine... I get what you're thinking SHOULD happen |
| 15:48.21 | ``Erik | but there's no way to DO it computationally |
| 15:48.24 | clock_ | I don't get it |
| 15:48.29 | ``Erik | that's where the human blows the machine away |
| 15:49.26 | clock_ | So you basically do some kind of heuristics and my case is a poison case for that heuristic? |
| 15:49.37 | ``Erik | ok, i have a million spheres... and I want to cut them in half... but instead of just being discrete spheres in a row, they're now complex... they overlap, some are unions, some are intersections, some are subtractions, and multilayered |
| 15:49.40 | ``Erik | what do you do? |
| 15:49.50 | clock_ | shoot a ray |
| 15:49.56 | ``Erik | answer? no way to know. Have to bump the bounding volume and weave at the end. |
| 15:50.16 | clock_ | ask the partitioner which spheres bounding boxes intersect my ray |
| 15:50.19 | ``Erik | actually, there IS a way to know, but it'd take a century to figure out before you could even fire a ray |
| 15:50.24 | clock_ | intersect only with those returned from the partitioner |
| 15:50.26 | clock_ | weave the logics |
| 15:50.41 | ``Erik | but you don't know which spheres bb's MATTER |
| 15:50.52 | ``Erik | you can't until after you intersect them all |
| 15:51.10 | ``Erik | after you weave them, in fact |
| 15:51.16 | clock_ | that's without the partitioner |
| 15:51.26 | clock_ | the idea of the partitioner is to cull this before you have to fire rays |
| 15:51.30 | ``Erik | yeah... |
| 15:51.34 | ``Erik | it culls what it can |
| 15:51.41 | clock_ | and btw, intersecting with a cube is not much work |
| 15:52.22 | ``Erik | except it's not "a cube", it's "arbitrary geometry" |
| 15:52.44 | clock_ | if it's bounding box, then it's a box |
| 15:52.56 | clock_ | if it were a bounding elephant, then it would be in a shape of an elephant. |
| 15:53.23 | ``Erik | I assert that its' a lot more complex than you think. Please prove me wrong and provide a patch. :) |
| 15:54.26 | clock_ | Does the documentation of BRL-CAD contain any tips how to avoid running into excessive rendering time? |
| 15:54.39 | clock_ | I mean the official user documentation. |
| 15:54.44 | ``Erik | <-- doesn't know |
| 15:54.46 | clock_ | Not some comments in the code. |
| 15:55.34 | clock_ | I could try to isolate the pathological case |
| 15:55.49 | clock_ | I am trying to use BRL-CAD as a user and I fail. |
| 15:56.07 | ``Erik | we already know the pathological case... and that there's no quick fix for it |
| 15:56.10 | clock_ | The performance is close to unusable |
| 15:56.21 | clock_ | Btw if I display my model, it also takes ages to display |
| 15:56.29 | clock_ | And during the display there is no space partitioning |
| 15:56.38 | clock_ | Another example where BRL-CAD is unusably slow |
| 15:57.08 | ``Erik | *shrug* it's drawing a lot of lines, and there's no 'detail level' built in right now |
| 15:57.09 | clock_ | What is the pathological case said in general terms? |
| 15:57.36 | clock_ | I can tell you how long it should take. |
| 15:58.05 | clock_ | Let's assume all those 20,000 primitives are cylinders - most are |
| 15:58.12 | clock_ | A cylinder has 2 circles and 4 lines |
| 15:58.16 | clock_ | each circle has 8 lines |
| 15:58.18 | clock_ | that's 20 lines total |
| 15:58.24 | clock_ | 400,000 lines in total |
| 15:58.28 | ``Erik | intersection with complex geometry increases the ray trace complexity by the number of primitives involved? |
| 15:58.33 | clock_ | average length of the line is like 10 pixels |
| 15:58.36 | clock_ | that 4 million pixels |
| 15:58.47 | ``Erik | interaction, even |
| 15:58.47 | clock_ | 1 pixel is 3 bytes |
| 15:58.50 | clock_ | that's 12 megabytes |
| 15:59.27 | clock_ | let's assume the PCI runs at 100 MHz and each pixel write takes 4 ticks |
| 15:59.36 | clock_ | that's 500ms to draw it all |
| 15:59.50 | clock_ | in real it takes 30 seconds. 60 times more than it should. |
| 16:00.00 | ``Erik | for non-trivial geometry, raytracing is cpu bound, not bus bound |
| 16:00.11 | clock_ | this is *not* raytracing! |
| 16:00.18 | clock_ | This is the 'B' command - drawing the wireframe. |
| 16:00.57 | ``Erik | oh, heh, ok, each primitive is composed of many many lines, each endpoint of the line gets shoved through a matrix and then the line is rasterized |
| 16:01.12 | ``Erik | still cpu bound, drawing the pixels is quick and easy (even though fb is lametarded slow at it) |
| 16:01.26 | ``Erik | and we don't use SSE or graphics card matrix modules to accelerate it :( |
| 16:01.36 | clock_ | you don't have to |
| 16:01.42 | clock_ | My CPU is 2.2GHz |
| 16:01.53 | clock_ | What I am getting is 8-bit style ZX Spectrum drawing speed |
| 16:02.06 | ``Erik | uh not for the complexity of what you're trying to draw |
| 16:02.15 | ``Erik | remember, we have no LOD :( |
| 16:02.25 | ``Erik | so you're not drawing 400,000 pixels |
| 16:02.30 | ``Erik | you're drawing 20,000,000 lines |
| 16:03.28 | clock_ | no 400,000 lines |
| 16:03.56 | clock_ | 20,000 primitives times 20 lines per primitive |
| 16:06.24 | clock_ | In which function is a cylindren broken down into a wireframe of lines for the purpose of display? |
| 16:06.28 | clock_ | cylinder |
| 16:06.41 | clock_ | Maybe there are sinuses and cosinuses I could kick out |
| 16:13.17 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30466 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: heh, skipping 3 and 4, going right to 5 |
| 16:15.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30467 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/ (fb_obj.c tcl.c): Include bio.h for windows compilation. |
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| 16:55.34 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30468 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: Define _RT_DECL_IFREE. This is needed by asc2g. |
| 16:56.02 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30469 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/asc2g/asc2g.vcproj: Define _RT_DECL_IFREE. |
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| 17:35.53 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30470 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/Dm.tcl: Need to check for the existence of the display variable. |
| 17:39.33 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30471 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/rtwizard.bat: Update the version. There should be a way to do this dynamically. |
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| 20:00.22 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30472 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/Makefile.am: add deps |
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| 01:06.34 | brlcad | hmm |
| 01:22.24 | iraytrace | Hmmm? |
| 01:23.11 | iraytrace | :( :P :D 9.9 :) |
| 01:25.40 | poolio | :'( |
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| 06:51.54 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30473 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/libfb/if_ogl.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 06:51.54 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: remove the protections for the 'm' mode in the opengl framebuffer as well as |
| 06:51.54 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: requesting indirect buffers, now always requesting direct and seeing what we |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: get. my always doing 'multiple window mode', the code now (correctly) acquires |
| 06:51.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: and releases the opengl context for all of the drawing so that there aren't |
| 06:51.57 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: multithreaded crashes on mac and linux. bob and I tag-teamed tracking down the |
| 06:51.59 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: cause and a fix for this bug over a couple days. interestingly, the crash on |
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| 06:56.54 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30474 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (6 files in 6 dirs): common.h always comes first, there's a regression test that checks for this now too |
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| 13:55.36 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 14:01.23 | ``Erik | blah blah blah |
| 14:01.39 | ``Erik | brlcad, can we just axe vas4? I'm seeing issues with it again |
| 14:05.29 | clock_ | ``Erik: do you know which function or *.c file translates cyliders into the line for display when I do the "B" command? |
| 14:05.34 | clock_ | into the lines |
| 14:06.28 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 14:06.29 | ``Erik | um |
| 14:06.41 | ``Erik | src/librt/g_tgc.c um, "plot" |
| 14:07.07 | clock_ | Thanks |
| 14:07.12 | ``Erik | rt_tgc_plot, line 1774 |
| 14:08.01 | ``Erik | you'll notice all it does is create a linked list of points... in mged, there's a routine to take those, do matrix crunch on each point and rasterize a line... |
| 14:08.04 | clock_ | great |
| 14:10.26 | clock_ | is this linked list created every time the picture is redrawn? |
| 14:10.35 | clock_ | Or is it kept in memory and just the matrix crunch is changing? |
| 14:10.39 | ``Erik | um, I'm not sure |
| 14:10.52 | ``Erik | I'd hope the latter, and that plot is only called when you 'e' something up |
| 14:12.13 | ``Erik | if you look at the mged code, lost in a maze of twisty spaghetti code, all looke alike |
| 14:27.49 | brlcad | ``Erik: what's the prob? |
| 14:29.36 | brlcad | I believe it calls plot each time |
| 14:29.39 | brlcad | plot really takes no time to recompute for all prims except the old nurbs |
| 14:30.59 | brlcad | plus when you e something up, since all db actions are transactional, if the object was B'd or d's otherwise invalidated, it's removed from memory and reloaded from disk (in case it changed) |
| 14:34.01 | clock_ | brlcad: but if I change something in the scene it doesn't redraw by itself |
| 14:35.16 | ``Erik | old bsd tty api, fbsd7 freaks out a bit on it |
| 14:35.59 | ``Erik | and we never define HAVE_XOPEN for the termios.h style, and if I change that to HAVE_TERMIOS_H, it freaks out because it uses struct pieces that aren't there |
| 14:42.06 | brlcad | ``Erik: aiight, axe |
| 14:44.02 | brlcad | clock_: that's the mged side of things and depends on what you change and how you change it -- some actions force a redraw, some don't |
| 14:44.36 | clock_ | OK |
| 14:44.59 | brlcad | the redraws are intentionally minimized since once you get to real models, it might take several seconds to load the data (i.e. the db read is fast, the plot is fast, but takes forever to blit the damn lines over a remote X11 connection to the display manager) |
| 14:45.24 | clock_ | My model takes forever even over a local X11 connection |
| 14:46.26 | clock_ | You or ``Erik can try how fast it is on your super-machines look at http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/comparison.g and do "B comparison" |
| 14:46.42 | clock_ | That's the one that was too slow |
| 14:46.56 | clock_ | Provided that you have enough time for such experiments, of course. |
| 14:47.17 | brlcad | i'll have to try it in about an hour, this box doesn't have a gui-mged ready to go .. testing something else |
| 14:48.24 | ``Erik | took like 2 seconds for me |
| 14:48.46 | ``Erik | 3.5, sorry |
| 14:49.39 | brlcad | on a completely unrelated topic, some previews of the new BZFlag tank model being worked on: http://bzflag.bz/tmp/glasstank.png |
| 14:50.10 | brlcad | http://www.opencombat.net/files/tankv5_sides.png |
| 14:50.20 | ``Erik | wow, so I'm not gonna be able to say "at least ktank is better than the bzflag model" for much longer? :D *duck* |
| 14:51.07 | brlcad | http://bzflag.bz/tmp/newtank.png |
| 14:51.07 | brlcad | various incarnations, still working some tweaks out |
| 14:51.07 | ``Erik | is that oval on top supposed to be a hatch or something? |
| 14:51.11 | brlcad | like how big the sidewall armor plating is, where the turret actually sits, etc |
| 14:51.16 | brlcad | heh yeah |
| 14:51.45 | brlcad | there's lots of "artistic freedom" going on, but has always been loosely based on our beloved bradley |
| 14:51.48 | clock_ | ``Erik: you have 3GHz? |
| 14:52.00 | brlcad | http://bzflag.bz/tmp/m1bzoverlay.png |
| 14:52.07 | ``Erik | yeah, clock |
| 14:52.30 | clock_ | ``Erik: did you use the "B" command or some other one? Does this command take advantage of the 8 CPUs? |
| 14:52.33 | ``Erik | bradly or abrams? O.o *cough* |
| 14:52.37 | clock_ | You said you have 8 CPUs |
| 14:52.48 | ``Erik | I used 'e', and I don't believe plot is threaded |
| 14:52.56 | brlcad | sry, abrams |
| 14:53.21 | brlcad | yeah, bradley would suck as a bz tank :) |
| 14:53.31 | ``Erik | bradley would suck as any tank *cough* |
| 14:53.50 | brlcad | now that we can actually load separate tank models |
| 14:54.06 | brlcad | I'm looking forward to seeing a battlefield of abrams vs t72's :) |
| 14:54.19 | ``Erik | got a blender .py exporter for bz? |
| 14:54.26 | brlcad | yeah, somewhere |
| 14:54.37 | ``Erik | what format is bz using for tank models? |
| 14:54.48 | ``Erik | cusom? |
| 14:54.51 | ``Erik | custom, even? |
| 14:54.52 | brlcad | basic polygonal |
| 14:54.55 | brlcad | was custom |
| 14:55.03 | brlcad | now there's actually a mini obj loader |
| 14:55.06 | ``Erik | cp g-stl.c g-bz.c |
| 14:55.09 | ``Erik | *cougH* O:-) |
| 14:55.26 | brlcad | g-obj.c already does the trick ;) |
| 14:55.35 | ``Erik | hehehe, cool |
| 14:55.41 | ``Erik | wish I had the time to slap together an obj-g.c |
| 14:55.44 | brlcad | annoying we don't have an obj importer though |
| 14:55.54 | brlcad | keep having to have jeff dump to dxf |
| 14:58.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30475 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vas4/Makefile.am: disable build (but leave in dist for this release) |
| 14:59.05 | ``Erik | obj is a really simple format, but no one has time to do it :/ |
| 14:59.31 | ``Erik | an excellent "new developer" task that'd be good bragging rights for anyone looking to help with coding |
| 14:59.36 | ``Erik | *cough* *looks around* |
| 15:04.46 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30476 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: favor -lpthread to -pthread |
| 15:12.07 | brlcad | ah, vas4 was already deprecated for this release .. when the changes started .. forgot about it |
| 15:13.53 | ``Erik | <-- figures let it go out as dead files this release, if no one bitches, remove it in a release or 2 |
| 15:14.04 | ``Erik | working from home today? |
| 15:22.28 | brlcad | no, bob was coming in today and tomorrow to help test/fix for release, so I'll be in |
| 15:23.29 | brlcad | good idea for vas4 (already has a doc/deprecation.txt listing) |
| 15:26.46 | brlcad | i think i'll meet up and/or come in after lunch, though .. actually got some sleep last night so i'm a bit behind today |
| 15:27.33 | ``Erik | ah, I was asking as a lunch posse notion :) |
| 15:27.49 | brlcad | k |
| 15:29.43 | ``Erik | hrm, 'make dist' is failing for me (no useful error message, just "Error code 1" after some ugly svn related schell crap) |
| 15:31.21 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30477 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: Put back a few class variables (i.e. they fell out during the ArcherCore transition) and make a few plugin related methods public. |
| 15:33.04 | brlcad | ``Erik: cd regress && make flawfinder |
| 15:33.21 | brlcad | it'd be one of the two new shell tests in the flawfinder.sh |
| 15:34.00 | ``Erik | huh, guess I need python installed |
| 15:34.18 | brlcad | python? |
| 15:34.36 | brlcad | oooh, for flawfinder, yeah |
| 15:34.42 | ``Erik | env: python: No such file or directory |
| 15:34.45 | brlcad | so you just haven't run the test in a long while |
| 15:35.08 | brlcad | could make flawfinder.sh skip the flawfinder part if there's no python |
| 15:35.16 | ``Erik | well, after upgrading that opteron box to fbsd7, I purged all the ports and started minimally adding just enough for BRL-CAD piecewise... |
| 15:35.38 | ``Erik | aside from vim, bash, screen, emacs, portmanager, and pkg_cutleaves, that is |
| 15:37.52 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30478 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/flawfinder.sh: make sure we have a python interpreter before proceeding with the flawfinder test |
| 15:38.23 | brlcad | pkg_cutleaves? |
| 15:38.30 | brlcad | wasdat |
| 15:41.27 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30479 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: the ogl framebuffer problem is crashed, though it still needs some cleanup. it's making way too many calls to get/release the context now so it's dog-slow .. need to try what bob had which was just protecting write() |
| 15:52.37 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30480 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: |
| 15:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: woo hoo! the performance problems were simply because several of the |
| 15:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: glXMakeCurrent acquire/release pairings were .. wrong. rather, they're in the |
| 15:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: wrong place with respect to the logic sometimes only acquiring in a specific |
| 15:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: scope but then releasing in a different scope. made them all consistent and |
| 15:52.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: sure enough it all behaves spiffily now .. yay for the return of the ogl |
| 15:52.40 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: framebuffer. |
| 15:54.18 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30481 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: remove dead code, just makes maintenance a bitch |
| 15:57.28 | *** part/#brlcad terrylr (i=terrylr@maria-enzersdorf.blauedonau.com) | |
| 16:01.15 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30482 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: more dead code removal |
| 16:07.16 | clock_ | brlcad: I still also have the problem on my home machine that the mged doesn't start. |
| 16:07.25 | clock_ | The BRL-CAD version there is the latest released. |
| 16:07.31 | clock_ | Worked fine on OpenBSD I think |
| 16:07.37 | clock_ | 7.10.4 IIRC? |
| 16:07.41 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30483 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/Display.tcl: Modify rt and rtedge methods to stop unnecessarily specifying parameters like framebuffer, width, height and aspect. |
| 16:09.35 | ``Erik | brlcad: lists all installed packages that are not depended on by anything (safe to remove), also has a recursive interactive removal mode so you can trim your package count down safely |
| 16:10.06 | ``Erik | jim and dave are interested in going out for lunch, dave said korean, fyi |
| 16:11.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30484 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: |
| 16:11.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: make the wgl interface do the same as the ogl interface, fixing the various |
| 16:11.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: incorrectly scoped wglMakeCurrent calls so that they actually pair up correctly |
| 16:11.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: with the logic. also, actually make them release the context (the code was |
| 16:11.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: wrong, they just kept it) so when parallel support is added to windows, it'll |
| 16:11.21 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: actually work. |
| 16:11.55 | brlcad | ``Erik: okay, just lemme know where |
| 16:12.03 | brlcad | or call on the way or something |
| 16:12.29 | brlcad | clock_: need more info, but I'm betting it's configure-related -- try adding --enable-all to the configure line |
| 16:12.41 | clock_ | brlcad: OK |
| 16:13.16 | brlcad | if you're compiling that is .. if you installed from binary, that'd be good to know if it's not working (i've not heard that) |
| 16:14.26 | clock_ | Putiting a binary on my system? Haha. |
| 16:14.35 | clock_ | Putting |
| 16:15.01 | clock_ | Binaries can contain hidden rootkits. |
| 16:15.02 | ``Erik | um |
| 16:15.06 | ``Erik | ok, actually, it's changed to olive shack |
| 16:15.12 | ``Erik | jim veto's korean |
| 16:15.26 | brlcad | boo hiss |
| 16:15.37 | ``Erik | mebbe tomorrie :) |
| 16:16.01 | ``Erik | see ya after lunch then :) |
| 16:17.30 | brlcad | you all leaving soon? |
| 16:22.53 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-076-143.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 16:37.32 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874F28.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:39.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30485 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: Try to get a direct context (speed). |
| 16:47.06 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-076-143.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 17:54.55 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 17:56.42 | ``Erik | brlcad, no .mgedrc http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d3dfc9116 |
| 17:59.12 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 19:34.13 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@77-56-88-167.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:54.50 | brlcad | not sure about that crash .. looks kinda like a Tk bug really |
| 19:55.06 | brlcad | using a system tk apparently, tried building from our end? |
| 19:55.34 | ``Erik | ours works |
| 19:55.35 | brlcad | if you have and it still crashes, try with --disable-freetype (I think that's the opt) in configure.ac as a tcl/tk configure option |
| 19:55.40 | brlcad | ahh |
| 19:55.43 | brlcad | weird |
| 19:55.49 | ``Erik | I d'no why system 85 doesn't |
| 19:56.23 | ``Erik | system wish85 comes up, I d'no how to use it though |
| 19:57.33 | brlcad | can you pop up that stack 17 frames and see what it's actually evaluating? |
| 19:58.20 | ``Erik | oh, I already trashed it |
| 19:58.20 | brlcad | so need a tcl debugger .. though even if we had one, it probably wouldn't work with mged since it's an interpreter in itself |
| 19:58.23 | brlcad | k |
| 19:58.40 | ``Erik | I figured I'd focus more on the metaball issues |
| 20:02.08 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30486 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: note "minimal system" testing |
| 21:19.06 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30487 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: fluff up the isopotential method a bit... back to the old way, kinda |
| 21:42.43 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30488 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: Remove extra set of double quotes in format statement of rgbToHex method. |
| 21:44.09 | Z80-Boy | ``Erik: you mean the gcc that compiled compromised gcc and login? |
| 21:44.45 | Z80-Boy | Nice self-reference btw. Hofstadter would surely masterbate to it. |
| 21:45.32 | Z80-Boy | Write in machine code then. That's not compromised :) |
| 21:46.35 | Z80-Boy | The difference between machine code and compiler is like a skateboard and a tilting train |
| 21:46.46 | Z80-Boy | In a tilting train, the machine does the traction and tilting for you. |
| 21:47.11 | Z80-Boy | On a skateboard you have to learn how the machine feels, she won't learn it. But then - then you can do *ANYTHING* you want! |
| 21:52.30 | ``Erik | um, ken thompsons "reflections on trusting trust" |
| 21:53.21 | ``Erik | from '84? |
| 21:56.45 | alex_joni | there can be no ultimate trust |
| 21:57.05 | ``Erik | only as much as you can have ultimate provability |
| 21:58.34 | alex_joni | you might have some trust for your own code |
| 21:58.52 | ``Erik | trust it to do what? O.o :D |
| 22:00.02 | alex_joni | well.. probably something |
| 22:00.14 | alex_joni | most likely not what it was intended to do :) |
| 22:31.10 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30489 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: set a default "goo" value on metaballs |
| 23:32.10 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@leary.csoft.net) | |
| 00:30.57 | starseeker | Hmm - this looks like fun to model - too bad the dimensions are too small to read http://arcweb.archives.gov/arc/digital_detail.jsp?&pg=1&rn=2&tn=796236&st=b&rp=summary&nh=2&si=0 |
| 00:35.29 | brlcad | cookie'd link, can't read it |
| 00:40.37 | starseeker | pfft |
| 00:40.39 | starseeker | hang on |
| 00:41.28 | starseeker | http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/783889_001_a.jpg |
| 00:44.40 | brlcad | that would make an *awesome* csg model |
| 00:45.32 | brlcad | you don't need to read dimensions, you could print that out, pull out a compass/protractor/ruler and go to town |
| 00:47.33 | starseeker | true :-) |
| 00:47.42 | starseeker | given an overall length anyway |
| 00:50.06 | brlcad | looks like it's documented http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0060524049 |
| 00:50.18 | brlcad | (with dimensions and historic details) |
| 00:55.56 | brlcad | http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ship/images/bm-monitor-h50954.jpg |
| 00:58.30 | brlcad | https://dspace.sunsite.utk.edu/bitstream/1785/809/1/MS376p47-MonitorPlan-print.jpg |
| 01:21.11 | starseeker | Awesome |
| 01:21.41 | starseeker | The national archives may have the originals - I'll have to get in there and try to get some higher res photos |
| 01:41.47 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:16.23 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30490 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/wdb.h): deprecate mk_fastgen_comb() .. should just use mk_comb() or mk_lcomb() |
| 02:17.13 | brlcad | "In support of improved security, all SourceForge.net user passwords have been expired and must be changed upon next login. CVS, Subversion and Shell users will need to login to the site to change their password before they will be able to access these services." |
| 02:37.55 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30491 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: cleanup comments on LOS |
| 02:41.19 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30492 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/conv/fast4-g.c): |
| 02:41.20 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: make the regions being created by fastf-g default to setting the material code |
| 02:41.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: to 1 and LOS to 100 so that it actually matches the defaults that the modeler |
| 02:41.26 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: and librt use. this quick tweak implements a request from dwayne kregel (S2 SCR |
| 02:41.28 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 918) .. which I just heard about it a few min ago. |
| 02:50.10 | starseeker | Hey brlcad - the terra.dsp and terra.g files in the demo db don't seem to be happy - DSP buffer wrong size: 131592 s/b 131072 |
| 02:52.14 | brlcad | see what svn props are set on terra.dsp |
| 02:52.29 | brlcad | probably thinks it's a windows file |
| 02:53.05 | brlcad | probably need to unset svn:eol-style, or set it to something better |
| 02:54.21 | starseeker | svn:eol-style is set to CRLF |
| 02:56.50 | brlcad | yeah, that's wrong |
| 02:57.02 | brlcad | dsp files are usually msvc studio files |
| 02:57.15 | brlcad | so it was set on import |
| 02:57.40 | brlcad | should be able to just unset the prop and check it out from svn again |
| 03:23.59 | starseeker | Is this the bit where svn is difficult about unsetting the prop? |
| 03:24.06 | starseeker | s/difficult/different |
| 03:27.00 | starseeker | Bingo - that was it |
| 03:27.16 | starseeker | svn propdel svn:eol-style terra.dsp |
| 03:27.28 | starseeker | should this be fixed in the main tree? |
| 03:28.31 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:28.54 | starseeker | will a commit do it or does it need some magic on the sf side? |
| 03:29.08 | brlcad | that'll do it |
| 03:29.53 | starseeker | k |
| 03:29.58 | starseeker | hmm - weird |
| 03:30.33 | starseeker | when I display ground.r and try to run rt I get raytrace failed, but the mged dialog succeeded? |
| 03:31.20 | brlcad | what mged dialog? |
| 03:31.35 | starseeker | File -> Raytrace |
| 03:32.00 | brlcad | oh, you mean it works through the panel, but not with just "rt"? |
| 03:32.07 | starseeker | yes |
| 03:32.12 | brlcad | what's the error? |
| 03:32.17 | starseeker | Raytrace failed. |
| 03:32.26 | brlcad | heh, what led up to that |
| 03:32.36 | starseeker | trying to find an error in the message... |
| 03:33.13 | starseeker | bizarre - I don't seen an error message |
| 03:33.14 | brlcad | should be right before the failed message |
| 03:33.21 | brlcad | or it's crashing |
| 03:33.30 | brlcad | try it on the command line |
| 03:33.48 | brlcad | run "saveview" to save an rt script |
| 03:33.52 | brlcad | then run that script |
| 03:34.04 | brlcad | look at the log file and/or tweak the script to see what's going on |
| 03:34.14 | brlcad | (it's just a simple text shell script) |
| 03:34.19 | starseeker | Hmm - with the command line rt it says Segmentation fault |
| 03:34.40 | brlcad | that's not good |
| 03:34.44 | brlcad | this using head? |
| 03:35.01 | starseeker | Not the very latest - let me rebuild |
| 03:37.28 | starseeker | Hmm - the script did generate a pix file, apparently |
| 03:38.21 | starseeker | Can I do the commit on just terra.dsp or do I need to do the db dir to get the .svn props |
| 03:39.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30493 10/brlcad/trunk/db/terra.dsp: Update props on terra.dsp to avoid file size issues when running demo. |
| 03:40.06 | starseeker | wow that was fast |
| 03:40.19 | brlcad | should be instantaneous :) |
| 03:40.27 | brlcad | we fixed most of the CIA bugs |
| 03:40.32 | starseeker | Cool :-) |
| 03:40.43 | starseeker | OK, time to rebuild... |
| 03:41.17 | brlcad | common pitfall .. once you use the script, there will be a pix file with mode 400 so you have to manually rm -f the file to render again |
| 03:41.33 | brlcad | make sure it's non-zero too .. and the right size |
| 03:41.37 | brlcad | might have just stubbed a file |
| 03:41.41 | brlcad | or partial result |
| 03:41.48 | starseeker | OK - let me rebuild first |
| 03:45.08 | starseeker | brlcad: a thought (which was what prompted the dsp experiment) - could a dsp be created that had ocean wave contours and then rendered with water transparency? |
| 03:45.37 | starseeker | (say, for a ship at sea effect?) |
| 03:46.49 | starseeker | For bonus points, it could have a repeatable pattern and be mirrored arbitrarily to create larger ocean areas |
| 04:04.16 | brlcad | sure could |
| 04:04.33 | brlcad | there is a smoothed normals option on the dsp that should do nicely |
| 04:04.54 | brlcad | might look more like glass than water, but certainly possible to get old-school water probably |
| 04:06.17 | starseeker | maybe using extinction on the glass shader and a blue tint, then modeling actual ocean depth in the dsp? |
| 04:08.28 | starseeker | If we wanted to get REALLY fancy we could add a routine adding/subtracting peaks and valleys in the dsp to create wave interference |
| 04:17.10 | brlcad | and/or code up a new water shader ;) |
| 04:19.01 | starseeker | New feature - modeling tanks under water! |
| 04:19.37 | starseeker | Although I suppose it might be useful in "plowing through river" scenarios... |
| 04:20.19 | brlcad | there's all sorts of fluids that it could represent that would be useful to be able to visualize |
| 04:21.11 | brlcad | fuel and blood come to mind .. |
| 04:21.26 | starseeker | coolant |
| 04:21.36 | brlcad | oil, other lubricants |
| 04:21.54 | starseeker | Would a proper water shader have to produce gradient effects? |
| 04:24.09 | brlcad | I know we can represent atmospheric effects visually, though I really forget the mechanism at the moment (it's probably a procedural shader iirc) |
| 04:24.30 | brlcad | something similar or maybe even that same shader might give the right effect, dunno |
| 04:24.51 | brlcad | that's all experimental stuff, you'd likely be digging in code a bit |
| 04:31.00 | starseeker | Phew - latest head cvs does NOT crash with the rt command |
| 04:45.17 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1088754020.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 04:45.27 | louipc | howdy |
| 04:46.09 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 04:46.33 | louipc | svn HEAD is 7.11.5 is that right? |
| 04:47.09 | starseeker | Um - not sure |
| 04:52.05 | louipc | sweet |
| 04:53.16 | louipc | I'm going to change the included PKGBUILD so it's mostly static. I can't figure how to really make it otherwise |
| 05:03.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30494 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/ (PKGBUILD.in brlcad.install.in brlcad.sh.in): |
| 05:03.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: I'm making Arch Linux packaging scripts mostly static. |
| 05:03.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: It seems the most practical thing to do. |
| 05:03.25 | brlcad | 7.11.5 today, probably 7.12.0 tomorrow |
| 05:04.58 | louipc | oh wow cool |
| 05:05.17 | louipc | well the PKGBUILD will read include/conf/ for version |
| 05:06.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30495 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/ (6 files): Rename Arch Linux scripts, also fix md5sum in PKGBUILD |
| 05:07.13 | brlcad | saw that, nifty |
| 05:08.38 | louipc | I was wondering could there be a README on how to build packages for various distros to supplement INSTALL? |
| 05:09.02 | brlcad | louipc: if there are edits that should get made when we release, should document it in HACKING in the release steps |
| 05:09.14 | brlcad | there are platform-specific readme's already |
| 05:09.20 | louipc | eg. since you've got debian, redhat, archlinux, etc |
| 05:09.30 | brlcad | go for it :) |
| 05:09.55 | brlcad | they're in doc/README.* |
| 05:10.16 | louipc | ah alright |
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| 07:08.36 | brlcad | some fun pics: |
| 07:08.39 | brlcad | http://www4.army.mil/OCPA/uploads/large/OCPA-2005-03-10-092226.jpg |
| 07:08.49 | brlcad | http://www.arcent.army.mil/cflcc_today/2005/february/images/feb01_03/tank2.jpg |
| 07:09.03 | brlcad | that's a freaking awesome shot |
| 07:09.46 | brlcad | and yet another favorite.. http://www.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/070718-f-5622m-904.jpg :-) |
| 07:09.51 | brlcad | hehe |
| 07:12.20 | louipc | sweet |
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| 08:03.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30496 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac misc/archlinux/Makefile.am): Makefile and configure changes for Arch Linux |
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| 14:01.58 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30497 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/geometree.tcl: Remove dead auto_path code. |
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| 15:22.52 | yukonbob | hello, nerds |
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| 15:31.53 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:31.54 | clock_ | Do you know how it sounds when you play church bells with a bow? |
| 16:39.53 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 16:47.01 | clock_ | http://ronja.twibright.com/tubulars_and_bow.mp3 |
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| 18:58.08 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30498 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: Add a few menu bindings to get things working a little better (i.e. right button to bring up menu, as before, and release to invoke menu item. |
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| 20:32.14 | ``Erik | brlcad, "they" say the tcl issue is back, and want your super voodoo magic to "fix" it |
| 21:45.38 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30499 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: Added code to redraw drawn objects. |
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| 21:50.05 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30500 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 6 dirs): Update version to 7.12.0. Preparing for release. |
| 21:51.10 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/qLIWo075.html <---- checked out as of last night , good job :) |
| 21:55.20 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/latest.png <---- what that paste refers too :) |
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| 01:18.38 | louipc | At one point I used to actually like helicopters. |
| 02:14.09 | Axman6 | Twingy: i'd imagine that's pretty damn hard right? |
| 02:14.44 | Twingy | requires a pretty good understanding of control theory, embedded programming, electronics, and dynamics |
| 02:15.01 | Twingy | but yes, tough problems |
| 02:15.39 | Twingy | building the autopilot is only solving 10% of the problem, the control laws are the other 90% |
| 02:16.00 | Axman6 | the uni i'm at atm has possibly one of the world's most advanced 4 rotor helicopter prototype... things... |
| 02:16.31 | Twingy | which one? |
| 02:16.47 | Axman6 | it's like a meter across, but it's being built so it can fly right up to walls (like dams and stuff), and it can cope if a rotor fails |
| 02:16.51 | Axman6 | ANU |
| 02:16.51 | Twingy | I think CMU is working on one |
| 02:17.23 | Axman6 | i saw it on the tour of the engineering department :P |
| 02:17.42 | Axman6 | sounded a lot more impressive when the tutor was telling us about it |
| 02:18.11 | Twingy | you can make just about anything fly with the right control law |
| 02:18.23 | Axman6 | heh |
| 02:18.25 | Twingy | adaptive, fuzzy logic, model predictive just to name a few |
| 02:18.45 | Axman6 | think they said they'd been working on this for about 10 years now |
| 02:18.51 | Twingy | most students start with a basic PID |
| 02:19.19 | Twingy | most people I've met spend between 5 and 10 years on the autopilot before it flight worthy |
| 02:19.27 | Twingy | (the kind that spend 80 hours a week on them) |
| 02:19.37 | Axman6 | yeah |
| 02:19.40 | Twingy | planes are about half that time |
| 02:19.53 | Axman6 | i can't even imagine where i'd start on something like that |
| 02:20.14 | Twingy | first you decide on a platform |
| 02:20.40 | Axman6 | "everything" |
| 02:20.51 | Axman6 | universal autopilot |
| 02:20.53 | Axman6 | ;) |
| 02:20.54 | Twingy | then you build an autopilot, after that you do testing and integration, then spend a long time testing the control algorithm |
| 02:21.00 | Twingy | no such thing yet |
| 02:21.32 | Twingy | the one I'm working on interfaces with x-plane over a udp connection |
| 02:21.48 | Axman6 | i was about to ask if you'd used Xplane at all |
| 02:21.49 | Twingy | for the simulation part of it |
| 02:22.12 | Axman6 | my dad bought that for me for christmas year before last i think |
| 02:22.15 | Twingy | for the actual testing I've got about $4k in hardware so far for the parts and the platform (E-Raptor 50) |
| 02:22.31 | Twingy | the gps alone was $1500 |
| 02:22.44 | Axman6 | wow |
| 02:22.46 | Twingy | and it's not even one of the fancy L1+L2 |
| 02:22.56 | Axman6 | L1+L2? |
| 02:23.10 | Axman6 | is that using thr military channel thing too? |
| 02:23.12 | Twingy | the frequency bands the gps operates on |
| 02:23.17 | Twingy | L2 used to be military only |
| 02:23.22 | Axman6 | yeah thought so' |
| 02:23.27 | Twingy | L2 gets you under 0.5m accuracy |
| 02:23.43 | Axman6 | that was my next question |
| 02:24.06 | Twingy | the one I have is 20hz position, 20hz heading (dual antenna) with 1dof gyro and 2dof accelerometer for interpolation when gps blinks out |
| 02:24.36 | Axman6 | sounds good |
| 02:24.42 | Twingy | I was designing a USB to serial board for it today |
| 02:25.25 | Twingy | basically an FT232RL + 4 resistors + 4 capacitors and a 11-pin header, 4-pin header (usb), 2-pin header power, and a 3.3V and 5.0V regulator |
| 02:25.41 | Axman6 | brb, i have how cross buns to eat |
| 02:25.46 | Twingy | we have a circuit plotter at work, so I can juts sketch up a circuit and print it |
| 02:26.16 | Axman6 | why are you using USB anyway? |
| 02:26.27 | Twingy | because the pico-itx only has 4 usb and 1 serial |
| 02:26.35 | Axman6 | ah ha! |
| 02:26.40 | Twingy | and the serial goes to the servo board I made |
| 02:26.42 | Axman6 | i want one of those board so badly :( |
| 02:26.54 | Axman6 | pico-itx that is |
| 02:27.13 | Twingy | it's not bad, it doesn't make sense to build an autopilot around a microcontroller anymore |
| 02:27.18 | Axman6 | if it had another ethernet port, it would make an excellent router with OpenBSD |
| 02:27.24 | Twingy | everything is 0402 and all on a single chip now |
| 02:27.41 | Twingy | I can hand solder TQFP 100's and QFN stuff, but you still can't get anywhere near the size |
| 02:28.01 | Twingy | if I were to make an autopilot around an AT91SAM7S64 (32-bit ARM) I still couldn't get anywhere near the size |
| 02:28.12 | Twingy | and next year the mobile-itx will be out, so instant reduction in size and mass |
| 02:33.41 | Axman6 | awesome |
| 02:48.28 | Twingy | it's a lot of fun, but I go home with a headache just about every day |
| 02:48.38 | Twingy | it's really really hard stuff |
| 02:49.10 | Axman6 | i assume you'll be running some OS on this board right? what're you using? |
| 02:49.22 | Twingy | it doesn't really matter |
| 02:49.41 | Twingy | as long as you don't have any latencies due to buffering |
| 02:49.44 | Twingy | you are fine |
| 02:50.25 | Axman6 | any good examples? |
| 02:50.25 | Twingy | you can alleviate a lot of that by a call to fflush () |
| 02:50.25 | Twingy | or you can modify the kernel driver |
| 02:50.25 | Twingy | either way is straight forward |
| 02:50.44 | Twingy | you should look at the serial code in the linux kernel |
| 02:50.55 | Twingy | it handles data differently above and below 2400 baud |
| 02:51.10 | Twingy | you can modify the kernel so it'll obey no buffering on setserial |
| 02:51.29 | Twingy | at the moment I'm just using ubuntu server off a 2GB flash drive |
| 02:51.35 | Twingy | the drive weighs 3 grams |
| 02:51.48 | Axman6 | heh, very nice |
| 02:51.59 | Twingy | I just made some nylon 5/8-18 TPI nuts on my cnc mill |
| 02:52.05 | Axman6 | well, except that it's ubuntu, but oh well |
| 02:52.12 | Twingy | to replace a pair of 15 gram steel nuts with 3.4 gram nylon nuts |
| 02:52.21 | Twingy | saved me 24 grams |
| 02:52.43 | Axman6 | what's cnc stand for anyway? i saw ANU's cnc mill the other day |
| 02:52.53 | Axman6 | it was pretty massive |
| 02:52.56 | Twingy | I modeled the entire helicopter skid in solid works and put it into GCAM and cut it out on the cnc |
| 02:53.09 | Twingy | computer numerically controlled |
| 02:53.40 | Twingy | everything is 6061 aluminum |
| 02:54.07 | Twingy | it's cut some restitution and it's got a high tensile strength |
| 02:54.21 | Axman6 | excellent |
| 02:54.59 | Twingy | I'm terrible at dynamics though |
| 02:55.06 | Twingy | that's why I've been taking some classes |
| 02:55.18 | Axman6 | i hope you're not working on this alone |
| 02:55.27 | Twingy | the electronics and programming are the easy part |
| 02:55.47 | Twingy | I'm working with 1 other person |
| 02:55.59 | Twingy | he knows more dynamics and control theory than I do |
| 02:56.05 | Twingy | he doesn't do much programming or electronics |
| 02:56.19 | Twingy | so we divide the work accordingly |
| 02:56.36 | Axman6 | good good |
| 02:56.48 | Twingy | so he's learning and I'm learning |
| 02:57.02 | Twingy | it's a lot for one person to do it all |
| 02:57.13 | Twingy | with 2 people you can get it done in about 2 years |
| 02:57.18 | Axman6 | yeah, that's why i asked |
| 02:57.42 | Axman6 | also kinda dangerous too. need someone else to check for mistakes |
| 02:57.53 | Twingy | autopilots have been around for 20 years, but it's still virgin territory as far as I'm concerned |
| 02:58.02 | Twingy | it's very dangerous on the larger vehicles |
| 02:58.11 | Twingy | we're about to integrate one into our $250k RMAX |
| 02:58.25 | Twingy | I'm working with a $1500 e-raptor |
| 02:59.32 | Twingy | I'm still a noob as far as this stuff goes |
| 02:59.43 | Twingy | it'll be a while before I'm any good at this stuff |
| 03:17.03 | Axman6 | i was messing with mathematica last night. lotsa fun once i understoof it a bit |
| 03:17.07 | Axman6 | d* |
| 03:17.40 | Axman6 | using it for physics at uni, taking astronomical photos, using mathematica to average them to reduce the signal to noice ratio |
| 03:17.45 | Axman6 | noise* |
| 03:17.47 | Axman6 | rawr |
| 03:20.07 | Twingy | we use matlab and simulink here |
| 03:22.24 | Axman6 | ANU did a deal with Wolfram so that students can get a copy and install it on their home computers for free, which is pretty awesome |
| 03:24.31 | poolio | ahh. I have to learn Matlab over the next week :( |
| 03:24.58 | Axman6 | http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3563/microsoft_excel_revolutionary_3d_.php?page=3 <-- DirectX at its best, heh |
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| 15:21.00 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:21.05 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 15:32.31 | yukonbob | hey brlcad :) |
| 15:33.33 | yukonbob | wiress here is slower than fsck :P |
| 15:33.38 | yukonbob | *wireless |
| 15:38.37 | yukonbob | check ya later, folks :) |
| 16:02.01 | brlcad | cya |
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| 21:03.32 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 03:58.36 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 coming soon to a desktop near you | |
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| 11:38.53 | Z80-Boy | me as well |
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| 16:59.46 | starseeker | ick |
| 17:02.13 | brlcad | it's a good one |
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| 18:35.11 | yukonbob | heh -- nothing to see here -- move along |
| 18:50.44 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:50.48 | brlcad | busy day |
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| 13:04.41 | yukonbob | (probably another busy day "in the background") |
| 13:30.18 | brlcad | possibly |
| 13:32.12 | yukonbob | ;) |
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| 13:42.50 | starseek1r | brlcad: Around? |
| 13:55.46 | yukonbob | hey starseek1r |
| 14:00.53 | brlcad | starseek1r: hello |
| 14:02.03 | starseek1r | howdy bob :-) |
| 14:03.01 | starseek1r | Switched all the graphics to white backgrounds - I can send you an example pdf if you want to take a look |
| 14:03.25 | starseek1r | brlcad: working on the text edits now |
| 14:06.59 | starseek1r | brlcad: What's the trick for getting a different color background in an xterm on a Mac? |
| 14:08.07 | brlcad | same as it is for xterm anywhere else :) |
| 14:09.14 | brlcad | you can either reverse the video or set xterm .Xdefaults settings or as cmdline options on invocation, etc |
| 14:09.46 | brlcad | easiest is to probably just modify the invocation line and add the -bg color to the command it executes |
| 14:10.26 | starseek1r | cool |
| 14:10.29 | starseek1r | thanks :-) |
| 14:10.43 | brlcad | Applications -> Customize Menu .. duplicate/edit the name like with a -bg color |
| 14:11.26 | starseek1r | Ah - much better |
| 14:11.30 | starseek1r | be right back... |
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| 14:13.09 | starseek1r | brlcad: Did you want a look a the no-background option for the pdf? |
| 14:13.41 | brlcad | hm? |
| 14:14.39 | brlcad | if it's worth looking at sure, otherwise I don't recall it having a background in the first place :) |
| 14:15.48 | starseek1r | Sorry - i mean the mged screenshots |
| 14:16.49 | starseek1r | I switched most of them to white background, but I'm afraid it's the same effect as before - not clear they're separate images on the same line |
| 14:17.30 | brlcad | the black was fine (good), just needed a separator |
| 14:17.54 | starseek1r | Ah - OK |
| 14:18.28 | brlcad | could either add an image border or an image separator (actual image between them) or find a way to inject separation via style/tags |
| 14:18.43 | brlcad | yeah, if it's just one image, just edit the image |
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| 14:42.46 | ``Erik | blragh |
| 14:43.54 | starseek1r | ``Erik: Indeed |
| 14:44.25 | ``Erik | is brlcad in the office today? |
| 14:44.32 | starseek1r | Not yet |
| 14:46.00 | brlcad | ``Erik: no |
| 14:49.30 | ``Erik | aight, I'll blabber here, looking for a list of "collaborative partners" and major projects BRL-CAD has impacted O.o |
| 14:49.48 | ``Erik | shit to throw on a poster for generals and "those types" to see |
| 14:51.20 | ``Erik | <-- has managed to ignore all that stuff :D |
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| 15:28.37 | starseek1r | Friggin Mac X server... |
| 15:31.31 | yukonbob | friggin everything, somedays :P |
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| 17:40.59 | poolio | brlcad: is brlcad doing gsoc? |
| 17:48.59 | yukonbob | poolio: I don't know if it's finalized, but there's definately talk of it... |
| 17:49.55 | poolio | neat-o. |
| 17:50.16 | poolio | I hope I haven't ruined the chances of such a thing happening ;0 |
| 17:50.21 | poolio | s/0/\) |
| 17:50.55 | yukonbob | poolio: why -- did you do something to shutdown google? ;) |
| 17:52.39 | brlcad | poolio: don't know yet |
| 17:53.18 | poolio | yukonbob: in rainbows stuff? |
| 17:53.19 | brlcad | but on that note, if folks here are interested in being a mentor for a student, or even just being involved in the selection process (if we are accepted), let me know |
| 17:53.36 | brlcad | the sooner the better |
| 17:55.56 | yukonbob | poolio: no -- was some alternate kid-a |
| 17:56.12 | louipc | that's a weird album |
| 17:56.18 | yukonbob | kid-a ++ |
| 17:56.21 | yukonbob | ok-computer++ |
| 17:56.25 | yukonbob | amnesiac++ |
| 17:56.34 | yukonbob | in-rainbows++ |
| 17:56.55 | yukonbob | hail-to-the-theif wtf |
| 17:57.03 | yukonbob | bends -- |
| 17:57.13 | louipc | o.O |
| 17:57.17 | yukonbob | *theif |
| 17:57.21 | yukonbob | *thief |
| 17:57.22 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 18:04.54 | poolio | bends wasn't _that_ bad |
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| 21:22.26 | ``Erik | time to go bury a fish O.o |
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| 23:09.04 | brlcad | me is going to shoot me :) |
| 23:09.38 | brlcad | (first things first, though, ldap) |
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| 01:20.01 | ``Erik | whyfor a full redesign? |
| 01:20.24 | ``Erik | I thought it was my job to be a difficult antagonistic ass :/ |
| 01:28.40 | brlcad | because the more I use it, the more I don't like certain aspects |
| 01:28.54 | brlcad | it's a good first stab, enough to unveil still |
| 01:29.21 | brlcad | and the entire backend is slickness how he has drupal+media using the same style |
| 01:30.14 | brlcad | I spent almost the entire day today tweaking things that bugged me .. probably broken windows rendering again (can someone check?) |
| 01:31.16 | brlcad | but after release and gsoc submission, I think I'll start on a fresh redesign that is a little easier to maintain hopefully |
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| 05:12.55 | brlcad | alrighty.. drupal and all modules once again updated |
| 05:22.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30502 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 05:22.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: bob improved the keybinding behavior of the geometry browser so that you no |
| 05:22.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: longer have to keep right-click depressed while left-clicking selections. now |
| 05:22.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: you keep right click depressed and when released on an option, that option is |
| 05:22.25 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: selected. |
| 05:25.10 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30503 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob also made the Geometry Browser redraw any objects being displayed after edits are performed with a nice lil 'eval draw [who]'. |
| 05:30.41 | brlcad | holy cow |
| 05:30.57 | brlcad | 73 features since the last release .. |
| 05:31.00 | brlcad | that's the most to date |
| 05:31.23 | brlcad | save for the old releases that were several years apart |
| 07:24.27 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30504 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: include final release notes that mention the windows enhancements, clone/traker, intaval, and the mintration to subversion. sleeping on it, but should be last step to tag trunk as 7.12 |
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| 12:14.55 | Axman6 | "Boss// Can you guys go through the site and make sure there aren't any bugs. I don't want the alpha testers to be held up by any bugs." heh |
| 12:16.45 | archivist | hehe get new boss |
| 12:17.22 | Axman6 | luckily that's just a quote from the net |
| 12:21.19 | Axman6 | http://www.derailer.org/clientquotes/?qid=290 |
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| 13:29.45 | brlcad | Axman6: funny |
| 14:00.07 | yukonbob | brlcad: got some spare cycles? |
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| 14:28.57 | brlcad | yukonbob: whatcha need? |
| 14:39.48 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30505 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (tcl/unix/Makefile.in tk/unix/Makefile.in): stray @ |
| 14:39.51 | brlcad | they're not really spare, but I can answer some things ;) |
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| 15:22.34 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30506 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: Fixed a typo. |
| 15:44.45 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30507 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add note from class - request for 'last chance' checking on killtree commands with wildcards |
| 16:13.00 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30508 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: If in view-only mode, the primaryToolbar and cmd components do not exist. |
| 16:28.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30509 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add note from class - more flexibility in obj.s[num1-num2] command line file matching would be nice |
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| 17:31.24 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30510 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: Add note about button_font not being found in Linux |
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| 20:52.11 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30511 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Remove previous notes. Discussed with Sean - these behaviors are as expected given normal command line behavior. |
| 21:18.16 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 being tagged today | |
| 21:21.24 | brlcad | build testing now |
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| 22:03.07 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30512 10/brlcad/trunk/include/Makefile.am: ugh, dg.h is missing from the dist |
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| 00:02.23 | Tieku | hi |
| 00:02.52 | Tieku | has brl always been avilable as open source? |
| 00:03.04 | archivist | not allways |
| 00:03.41 | Tieku | when did it make the change? |
| 00:03.41 | archivist | nearly two years ago iirc |
| 00:03.41 | Tieku | 2004 |
| 00:04.16 | archivist | but its a 20+ year old project |
| 00:04.16 | Tieku | thanks |
| 00:05.05 | Tieku | archivist: you using the software before it became opensource? |
| 00:05.10 | Tieku | were you* |
| 00:05.11 | archivist | no |
| 00:05.47 | Tieku | in your opinion is it the best opensource option for a solid 3d modeling package? |
| 00:06.14 | brlcad | Tieku: any particular reason for the question? |
| 00:07.20 | brlcad | it's only been released as open source for about three years, though pretty much anyone could get the entire package (including printed docs and source code) for free since it started |
| 00:07.29 | Tieku | brlcad: i'm a design student with an interest in open source (even open design) and i'm looking for a cad package to learn. i've searched a few times over the years and only now come across brl |
| 00:08.09 | brlcad | design isn't one of our strongest points yet but we are probably the "best" open source option out there, particularly for solid modeling |
| 00:08.28 | brlcad | have you seen the industry diagram on the website? that gives an idea of the domains we presently cover |
| 00:08.48 | Tieku | great to hear. I am reading over the new website now |
| 00:08.51 | brlcad | design is one of the areas I'm most interested in supporting (personally), but there's a lot of work to do interface-wise |
| 00:09.11 | brlcad | http://ftp.brlcad.org/Industry_Diagram.png |
| 00:09.20 | Tieku | just out of interest. have you come across the reprap project? |
| 00:09.41 | Tieku | thank brl, looking now |
| 00:10.20 | brlcad | yeah |
| 00:10.43 | brlcad | one of the reprap guys hangs out here from time to time |
| 00:11.21 | Tieku | cool, i'm working on one for my final year project. |
| 00:11.37 | brlcad | Tieku: do you write code? :) |
| 00:13.23 | Tieku | brlcad: only in the area of internet services, php, xml, soap, actionscripting - I am hoping to make the jump towards desktop apps in the future |
| 00:13.50 | brlcad | great, maybe you'll consider helping out on BRL-CAD :) |
| 00:14.00 | brlcad | developers are what we need the most |
| 00:14.46 | Tieku | i'd love too - but we'll have to see if im upto speed first :) i'm certainly a programmer at heart. only on a design cource to better understand darn humans |
| 00:15.25 | archivist | that needs a lifetime |
| 00:15.59 | Tieku | i believe that :) |
| 00:16.03 | brlcad | I believe that problem is NP complete too :) |
| 00:16.25 | Tieku | NP? |
| 00:17.55 | Tieku | I'm saving the industry diagram, it communicates the world of cad application nicely. cheers |
| 00:18.21 | brlcad | thanks |
| 00:18.30 | brlcad | took quite a while to compose properly ;) |
| 00:28.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30513 10/brlcad/trunk/db/Makefile.am: (log message trimmed) |
| 00:28.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: yet one more stab at accounting for parallel make problems where the libtool |
| 00:28.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: wrapper script is invoked by too many threads before it has time to generate the |
| 00:28.09 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: lt-asc2g binary. this fixes the problem by creating a lockfile mechanism that |
| 00:28.10 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: invokes asc2g first on just the operators.asc file (cause it's so damn small) |
| 00:28.12 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: before running everyone else. seems to work like a charm though I bet there is |
| 00:28.14 | CIA-32 | BRL-CAD: still an exceptionally rare race condition possible if the operators.g |
| 00:33.27 | Tieku | I've just installed what i thought was BRL_CAD - What is the relationship between BRL-CAD, Archer and MGED? |
| 00:35.27 | Tieku | No worries - i think im on the trail of the answer... |
| 00:38.31 | brlcad | MGED and Archer are two of the tools in BRL-CAD |
| 00:38.40 | brlcad | BRL-CAD is a suite of tools, more than 400 overall |
| 00:39.17 | brlcad | most of them are command-line processing tools (for converting between geometry and image formats, for example) but mged and archer are two of our GUI-based tools |
| 00:39.19 | Tieku | Would it be acurate to say MGED is the primary tool? |
| 00:39.45 | brlcad | archer is a prototype of a new modeling interface, most of the power currently in use though is in mged |
| 00:39.54 | brlcad | mged is what most of the docs on the website are for |
| 00:40.08 | brlcad | there is a very extensive set of tutorials to help get you started |
| 00:40.20 | Tieku | reading now :) cheers |
| 00:40.31 | brlcad | (particularly the one labelled "Volume II -- Introduction to MGED" |
| 00:58.11 | Tieku | BRL looks very impressive. I'm gona take a break but keep working through the tutorial lessons. thanks for your help |
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| 06:11.51 | brlcad | it's a fair bit more simple now and confirmed on ie6, firefox, and safari .. still need a ie7 test if someone has it on hand |
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| 06:54.24 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30514 10/brlcad/trunk/db/Makefile.am: clear out the lockfile and any .g's we are scheduled to build |
| 06:56.13 | brlcad | if folks would kindly test the website, see if there are any *egregious* problems (things rendering outright wrong only) .. please let me know -- trying to take the site live today |
| 06:56.25 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org for the uninitiated |
| 07:03.15 | clock_ | mybrlcadspace? |
| 07:37.50 | brlcad | a temp holder until it goes live as brlcad.org |
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| 07:59.01 | alex_joni | brlcad: a minor nag on the poll |
| 07:59.20 | alex_joni | I get the sliders behind the summary on the right, snapshot in a second |
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| 08:00.11 | alex_joni | http://imagebin.org/14859 |
| 08:03.04 | alex_joni | also History for the wiki pages is not rendering greatly here |
| 08:03.34 | alex_joni | http://imagebin.org/14860 |
| 08:05.54 | alex_joni | I get the last one in Opera 9.24, Firefox 2.0.0.12, IE 7.0.5730.11 |
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| 09:35.23 | archivist | search box takes up screen space that cant be scrolled out the way |
| 10:04.39 | alex_joni | archivist: that's a feature :P |
| 10:04.50 | archivist | ew |
| 10:05.40 | archivist | on some pages its not obvious you need to scroll, so its a UI issue |
| 10:21.37 | alex_joni | guess that's personal taste, I always use the scroll button, so I don't really look if there's a scroll bar or not |
| 10:21.48 | alex_joni | otoh a resolution of 1920x1200 might hide this issue :P |
| 10:22.21 | alex_joni | brlcad: did you just change something? |
| 10:23.27 | alex_joni | not it looks like this: http://imagebin.org/14864 |
| 10:27.47 | archivist | what I see here on the debian box www.archivist.info/brlcad.png |
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| 13:48.12 | brlcad | thanks guys |
| 13:49.28 | brlcad | there are still a few bugs, and I'm not happy with the fixed footer, but the alternative was just way too buggy -- I think I'm going to change it to what I came up for IE6, which is something just a whole lot simpler |
| 14:20.23 | alex_joni | brlcad: still.. I wonder what happened as it looked fine this morning even on opera |
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| 14:45.45 | brlcad | probably reloaded your cache |
| 14:45.55 | brlcad | there were no changes until just now |
| 14:57.13 | ``Erik | on to a release, now? |
| 15:28.34 | alex_joni | brlcad: dunno about the cache, but it still looks wrong on opera (http://imagebin.org/14864), it worked right this morning (roughly 8-9 hours ago) and I haven't been looking at my.brlcad.org for a while (so I doubt I had anything in cache) |
| 16:08.50 | brlcad | ``Erik: not yet, jra had a build error I'm looking at, libbu linkage on debian |
| 16:08.56 | brlcad | alex_joni: try now |
| 16:09.20 | brlcad | there have been lots and lots of changes so it's been in flux |
| 16:09.53 | alex_joni | yup, much better |
| 16:10.15 | alex_joni | did you remove the search bar? |
| 16:10.28 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:10.34 | ``Erik | ohhhhyeah, um, I bet his error is because he ran debians busted libtool on it |
| 16:10.36 | brlcad | it was just causing way too many problems |
| 16:11.00 | ``Erik | losing the tcl link or something |
| 16:11.06 | brlcad | so search is just disabled outright for now (what the hell are people really going to search for anyways.. there's no content loaded yet) |
| 16:11.25 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, also org deadline is in a couple hours, so I'm working that |
| 16:11.39 | ``Erik | aight |
| 16:11.58 | alex_joni | brlcad: nothing else I can spot at the moment.. |
| 16:11.58 | brlcad | wanted to get the website at least stable for the submission |
| 16:12.08 | brlcad | alex_joni: cool, thanks |
| 16:12.16 | alex_joni | np |
| 16:12.18 | brlcad | ``Erik: can you do an ie6 check? |
| 16:12.37 | brlcad | i tried to avoid the things that makes ie6 cry/puke |
| 16:14.01 | alex_joni | brlcad: I tested here on Opera, Firefox and IE7 |
| 16:14.09 | brlcad | how'd ie7 look? |
| 16:14.22 | alex_joni | looks good so far (except IE7 which has an odd font for the MOTD) |
| 16:14.35 | brlcad | heh, wondered about that |
| 16:14.35 | alex_joni | but the rest looks ok even in IE7 |
| 16:14.46 | alex_joni | looks wild-west-like |
| 16:14.55 | alex_joni | care for a snapshot? |
| 16:14.59 | brlcad | sure |
| 16:15.18 | brlcad | it's set to 'fantasy' which is usually a subtle cursiveish font |
| 16:15.36 | alex_joni | http://imagebin.org/14870 |
| 16:15.38 | brlcad | cursive usually pulls up something too extreme |
| 16:15.50 | brlcad | ew |
| 16:15.54 | alex_joni | it's not quite easy to read imo |
| 16:17.48 | brlcad | what does it look like now? |
| 16:21.33 | alex_joni | way better |
| 16:22.10 | alex_joni | http://imagebin.org/14871 |
| 16:22.50 | alex_joni | even firefox is better now (not that condensed) |
| 16:23.05 | brlcad | hm, okay |
| 16:23.12 | brlcad | is that better than .. now? |
| 16:23.49 | alex_joni | now it's great on all 3 |
| 16:23.59 | alex_joni | opera/firefox/ie7 |
| 16:24.10 | brlcad | i mean which do you like more |
| 16:24.17 | alex_joni | last one |
| 16:24.20 | brlcad | okay |
| 16:24.29 | alex_joni | I mean.. the one that is right now |
| 16:24.40 | brlcad | then that's the one it'll be |
| 16:24.43 | brlcad | thx |
| 16:26.01 | alex_joni | there is another really minor thing in IE7, the toolbox on the right looks a bit different than Firefox/Opera |
| 16:26.09 | alex_joni | the text is indented a bit |
| 16:26.40 | alex_joni | it's visible in http://imagebin.org/14871 |
| 16:26.53 | alex_joni | (I wouldn't worry about that though..) |
| 16:26.55 | brlcad | yeah, I was just looking at that |
| 16:27.53 | brlcad | there, that should be a little better |
| 16:28.57 | alex_joni | yup, better |
| 16:29.34 | alex_joni | http://imagebin.org/14872 |
| 16:30.07 | brlcad | yeah, that'll do |
| 16:30.19 | brlcad | great, done for now .. now on to the submission |
| 16:34.53 | alex_joni | bbl |
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| 17:28.20 | ``Erik | ummm |
| 17:29.21 | ``Erik | hopefully no one at google is dumb enough to be using ie6 O.o :D |
| 17:30.31 | archivist | mah win2k can has ie6 |
| 17:30.53 | archivist | and mah box at home ie5!! |
| 17:31.02 | archivist | but thats not on the web |
| 17:32.01 | ``Erik | yeah, it seems to look ok... as ok as can be expected |
| 17:32.27 | ``Erik | ugh, no wonder everything looks horribly aliased, 1024x768 |
| 17:32.55 | ``Erik | no overlap issues or anything |
| 17:34.28 | ``Erik | ummm |
| 17:34.34 | ``Erik | the navigation bar in the top right corner |
| 17:34.46 | ``Erik | on firefox/mac, it looks very centered |
| 17:35.06 | ``Erik | on ie6/winxp, there's a chunk of space above the text |
| 17:42.22 | ``Erik | http://bz.bzflag.bz/~erik/mybrlcad.png |
| 17:43.56 | ``Erik | that's the only thing I could spot via my quick perusal |
| 17:44.58 | ``Erik | hrmmmmm |
| 17:45.23 | ``Erik | no alt tag on the main page image? |
| 17:46.10 | ``Erik | <-- has no style and no class, yo |
| 18:20.21 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/private/Googlefight2007.pdf |
| 18:21.02 | brlcad | funny stuff |
| 18:28.44 | ``Erik | wow |
| 18:28.46 | ``Erik | php, wow |
| 18:53.13 | brlcad | Whew! .. 7 minutes to spare |
| 18:53.34 | ``Erik | bah, that's loads of time, you coulda taken a few minutes to kick out a release |
| 18:53.37 | brlcad | yeah, php can't really be filtered .. I mean the vast majority of projects use it |
| 18:53.43 | ``Erik | all worrying about deadlines you're miles from, sheesh :D |
| 18:54.25 | brlcad | that was pretty damn frantic .. needed a couple more hours but 90% of whether it's accepted will be decided within 10 minutes |
| 18:54.31 | ``Erik | <-- notes that there's a distinct lack of information on exactly where the data came from... or how exactly it was massaged :) |
| 18:55.02 | brlcad | Googefight :) |
| 18:55.29 | brlcad | which really is just the same as searching for any of those terms and looking at the result count |
| 18:55.32 | ``Erik | iirc, someone enters two phrases to analyze |
| 18:55.38 | ``Erik | where'd you get your list of phrases? :D |
| 18:55.49 | brlcad | that is the list of phrases |
| 18:55.57 | brlcad | except where it says modified |
| 18:56.03 | ``Erik | yes, I know... where'd they come from? |
| 18:56.11 | brlcad | from last year's participants |
| 18:56.19 | brlcad | that's what *they* said their name is |
| 18:56.33 | ``Erik | ahhh, the top X of that year, ok |
| 18:56.36 | brlcad | but then of course some of them make no sense or need tweaking to get a valid result (like Gallery) |
| 18:56.53 | brlcad | http://code.google.com/soc/2007/ |
| 18:58.51 | ``Erik | <-- just thinks there should be some footnote or something that says all phrases came from GSoC '07 to clarify *shrug* was my big question on looking at it |
| 18:59.03 | ``Erik | knowwhudahmean, verne? |
| 18:59.30 | brlcad | well, the intended audience is the gsoc program manager |
| 18:59.36 | brlcad | I think she'll recognize it ;) |
| 18:59.36 | ``Erik | ah, ok |
| 19:01.05 | brlcad | some of them are heavily biased unfortunately, but then most statistics are |
| 19:01.11 | brlcad | it was included mostly for humor |
| 19:01.18 | ``Erik | obviously :D |
| 19:01.27 | brlcad | and to hint-hint-nude-nude at them that we fit right in |
| 19:01.38 | brlcad | heh, nude |
| 19:01.40 | ``Erik | 'nude nude'??? wtf goes on at gsoc??? |
| 19:01.41 | brlcad | s/nude/nudge/ |
| 19:01.49 | ``Erik | uh, nudge nude? O.o |
| 19:01.50 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:01.54 | brlcad | i know where my mind wants to be |
| 19:01.56 | ``Erik | even worse |
| 19:02.06 | ``Erik | or better, based on frame of reference |
| 19:02.28 | brlcad | creative commons is probably the most egregious one on the list |
| 19:02.38 | brlcad | no way they're that big, but their terms are so general |
| 19:04.27 | brlcad | wordpress seems massively inflated too |
| 19:08.55 | ``Erik | or a lot of those php pages say they'll release the art into creative commons |
| 19:31.33 | brlcad | removed our adjustment since I noticed too many false positives if you search way deep |
| 19:31.51 | brlcad | annotated the adjustments used |
| 19:36.33 | ``Erik | um, do you have a high res of the rise stryker and/or bradley rtwizard image? |
| 19:36.44 | brlcad | hm |
| 19:36.50 | brlcad | somewhere |
| 19:37.22 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/OLD/images/stryker_slat.png that's as high-res as he rendered |
| 19:37.32 | brlcad | so not really print-quality |
| 19:37.38 | brlcad | but maybe more than what you have |
| 19:39.50 | brlcad | hm, I apparently do have a 200dpi version, but iirc I just scaled the original and color-corrected |
| 19:51.12 | ``Erik | what about the 'best' images for the rtwizard and modeller screenshots? |
| 19:58.08 | brlcad | modeller is big |
| 19:58.36 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/OLD/images/mged.jpg |
| 19:58.45 | brlcad | for a screenshot at least |
| 19:59.25 | ``Erik | jpg? eeps |
| 19:59.54 | brlcad | rtwizard would probably be easier to just capture something new |
| 20:00.15 | brlcad | using havoc or m35 |
| 20:01.43 | ``Erik | hrmmm |
| 20:02.10 | ``Erik | neat, errors trying to start rtwizard |
| 20:02.22 | brlcad | it doesn't like system stuff |
| 20:03.03 | ``Erik | 'cept on my mac, I forced it to install tcl, tk, etc |
| 20:03.22 | ``Erik | Error in startup script: invalid command name "RtWizard::IntroPage" |
| 20:04.42 | brlcad | then maybe zero-d tclIndex files |
| 20:05.11 | ``Erik | um |
| 20:05.18 | ``Erik | it doesn't start on, uh, the middle penguin, either |
| 20:05.23 | ``Erik | which is a 7.10.4 distribution |
| 20:07.06 | ``Erik | hm, started there, but locked up |
| 20:17.41 | ``Erik | and it just plain doesn't work right there, heh |
| 20:17.46 | ``Erik | wow :) |
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| 20:24.21 | ``Erik | wow |
| 20:24.30 | ``Erik | that's bitrot and a half *sigh* |
| 20:27.01 | brlcad | it's not rotted.. it was originally implemented that way ;) |
| 20:27.16 | brlcad | it's just not got any better either |
| 20:27.26 | brlcad | most of the problems are build setup, though |
| 20:28.14 | brlcad | not actually in rtwizard .. rtwizard's biggest downside is that it was easier to add menu hooks instead of forward/backward button panels for the steps .. so it's rather counter-intuitive for the new user |
| 20:28.20 | brlcad | but it does do the trick |
| 20:38.31 | ``Erik | heh |
| 20:38.50 | ``Erik | changing settings updates the wireframe view, but does not change the rendered view. |
| 20:39.23 | ``Erik | namely the perspective big... ortho is counterintuitive I think |
| 20:39.26 | ``Erik | bit |
| 20:43.15 | brlcad | brlcad.org is now migrated |
| 20:43.19 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 20:43.59 | alex_joni | whee |
| 21:05.26 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 21:15.56 | ``Erik | http://www.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idUSL0552076620080305?feedType=RSS&feedName=oddlyEnoughNews&rpc=22&sp=true |
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| 03:58.28 | starseeker | condition isn't so hot on the railroad one, but still pretty cool |
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| 12:02.07 | yukonbob | ...reads scrollback |
| 12:07.16 | yukonbob | the attribution for 'the future exists first in the imagination, then in the will, then in reality' is to "mike muss" -- is that supposed to be "mike muuss"?# |
| 12:07.51 | yukonbob | (from screenshot at http://imagebin.org/14870) |
| 12:10.55 | louipc | hey the site is looking better |
| 13:04.03 | brlcad | that's an old stylesheet |
| 13:05.18 | brlcad | oh, or you're just commenting on the spelling .. yes, that's a egregious typo |
| 13:05.21 | brlcad | fixed |
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| 13:14.50 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30515 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/wdb_obj.c: Modified wdb_prep_dbip() to allow database creation if database doesn't exist. |
| 13:16.08 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:29.22 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:46.14 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30516 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Modified the initDefaultBindings method to not always use itk_component(mged). |
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| 16:19.16 | yukonbob | (from the Oxford rain) |
| 16:19.17 | yukonbob | :P |
| 17:26.17 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874EDE.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:39.05 | ``Erik | "certified pubic accountants" |
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| 03:21.37 | brlcad | egads .. that's just cruel... :) |
| 03:31.31 | brlcad | so we made the short list .. but we still might not make the final |
| 03:32.02 | iraytrace | Hey, short list is a great step forward!!! |
| 03:32.43 | brlcad | problem is the short list still has about 50 projects too many |
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| 13:55.54 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30517 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: tweak bounding volume stuff to cope with different methods |
| 15:01.06 | ``Erik | bwahahaha http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Stargate-Code-of-the-Replicators.aspx |
| 15:01.55 | ``Erik | I knew replicators were supposed to be evil, but damn, I had no idea |
| 15:23.22 | archivist | wtf! what did you do to the dailywtf I got connection refused! |
| 15:25.11 | archivist | I assume they dont like deep links |
| 15:50.23 | clock_ | URL is useless |
| 15:50.32 | clock_ | An URL that works for one doesn't work another |
| 15:50.39 | clock_ | work for another one |
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| 16:40.16 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30518 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Remove SDB (SURVICE Database) related code. |
| 17:04.58 | SWPadnos | ok |
| 17:05.02 | SWPadnos | argh |
| 17:10.34 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30519 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/library/panedwindow.tcl: Hack to get around the occassional complaining from the panedwindow about "identify" being a bad option. |
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| 18:13.11 | ``Erik | they seemed to have a fit of 'down' for a bit :/ |
| 18:13.28 | ``Erik | it was probably starting when I pasted it, I noticed the screen shot image took a LONG time to load |
| 18:31.19 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03g2asc * r30520 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: dpk worked for BRL. |
| 18:38.27 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03g2asc * r30521 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: Mike worked for BRL first, then ARL. |
| 18:43.54 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30522 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: cliff now contributes as qri too .. probably need a way to indicate open source contributions separately |
| 18:46.53 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03g2asc * r30523 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 18:46.53 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: Added BRL affiliation to developers Moss, Dykstra, Applin, Kennedy, Gwynn, Stay, Hanes, Butler, A |
| 18:46.53 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: nderson, Tanenbaum. |
| 18:51.01 | ``Erik | pheer teh hist0riez |
| 19:32.42 | PrezKennedy | i know most of those people! |
| 19:33.18 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30524 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/book/VolumeII.xml: Continuing xml conversion - appendix contents have been largely removed and will be re-added later. Remainder is now valid according to nXML mode, but will need more formatting work. |
| 19:43.08 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30525 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: default sweat is 1 in a metaball, not 0 (0 is not viable for Blinn method blob) |
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| 20:11.29 | ``Erik | well, no wonder it's not working... a variable is getting stomped |
| 20:11.49 | ``Erik | goes from being 1.0 to 1.99141e-314 |
| 20:19.57 | ``Erik | now who the heck is messin' with my ball sweat? |
| 20:28.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30526 10/brlcad/trunk/db/Makefile.am: |
| 20:28.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: fix a problem that bsd make made apparent where there were multiple rules for |
| 20:28.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: operators.g (direct and via .asc.g) causing a cyclic reference. Instead, use |
| 20:28.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: the same build approach but create an operators.asc2g file instead of |
| 20:28.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: operators.g; additionally make that file dependent upon asc2g so we're sure to |
| 20:28.59 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: keep updating the lt binary wrapper as needed. |
| 20:29.22 | brlcad | I ain't touched your balls man |
| 20:29.26 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 20:33.28 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 20:35.57 | ``Erik | greetings, leebert |
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| 20:43.20 | iraytrace | Hmmm. I guess that means I'm the one making it cold around here? Oh, wait, that's leibert. |
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| 20:51.10 | ``Erik | 70 minutes until vacation O.o |
| 20:51.24 | iraytrace | congrats! |
| 20:51.30 | iraytrace | How long? |
| 20:52.17 | ``Erik | just a week |
| 20:58.56 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30527 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: fix up output a little |
| 21:02.13 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30528 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/if.c: report value for obliquity if out of valid range. |
| 21:02.46 | brlcad | erhm, sounds like a NEWS change |
| 21:05.14 | ``Erik | which, the nirt one? |
| 21:05.44 | brlcad | yeah |
| 21:05.50 | ``Erik | it's a shot/normal sanity check, it shouldn't happen... O.o |
| 21:08.33 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 21:11.45 | brlcad | okay |
| 21:11.54 | brlcad | commit msg sounded diff |
| 21:13.02 | brlcad | yay, bob's done |
| 21:13.16 | brlcad | now to finish checking on the ubererrors |
| 21:13.17 | ``Erik | <-- tries to think of a valid time when the obliquity would be out of a valid range O.o :D |
| 21:14.12 | brlcad | doesn't it also report exit obliquities? |
| 21:14.21 | brlcad | s/doesn't/does/ |
| 21:14.35 | brlcad | if it does, the obliquity could be anything |
| 21:14.44 | ``Erik | um, in a flipped segment |
| 21:14.47 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 21:15.12 | brlcad | also .. what it does on an inverted arb or inverted bot |
| 21:15.17 | ``Erik | this is a bu_exit() condition |
| 21:16.12 | ``Erik | and I just added the naughty value to the fprintf(stderr,"Error: ..."); |
| 21:16.41 | ``Erik | not changing any logic, just adding a detail during flaming death |
| 21:17.08 | brlcad | ahhhh |
| 21:18.05 | ``Erik | apparently, a normal of NaN,NaN,NaN isn't useful in finding obliquities O.o :D |
| 21:18.18 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 21:18.56 | brlcad | nice :) |
| 21:20.13 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54877607.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:21.33 | ``Erik | <-- not quite sure why nirt cannot find the normal but rt works fine |
| 21:23.59 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 21:25.23 | ``Erik | <-- scratches his chin |
| 21:25.25 | ``Erik | that might do it |
| 21:33.01 | ``Erik | lee, did you see http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Stargate-Code-of-the-Replicators.aspx ? |
| 21:44.32 | ``Erik | hehehe http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s87/Evilways75/STupidMustang.jpg |
| 22:00.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30529 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: |
| 22:00.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: add protections and notification to users that installing into /usr is generally |
| 22:00.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: a pretty bad idea (particularly for those linux folks). require that they |
| 22:00.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: interactively confirm that they would like to continue (by having them type |
| 22:00.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 'yes'/'no'). there is probably additional specific checks that could be added |
| 22:00.48 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: to make sure libdir and prefix aren't different, but it's a good first stab. |
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| 06:04.29 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 06:04.37 | brlcad | what's your utc offset? |
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| 13:32.28 | Gabi | Hello, need help to draw 2d plans |
| 14:59.04 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30530 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: annotate all of the various individuals that have made non-affiliated contributions as open source contributors. |
| 15:02.10 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: utc -- back to PDT :) |
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| 20:50.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there a way to create accounts for the gallery yet? |
| 20:52.50 | MinuteElectron | as in the gallery2 on the website? |
| 20:53.15 | starseeker | yes |
| 20:53.28 | MinuteElectron | i'm sure that was already possible, let me look into it for you |
| 20:53.46 | starseeker | thanks |
| 20:56.10 | MinuteElectron | hmm - well, for some retarded reason there are already 50 users, but I don't understand why |
| 20:56.50 | MinuteElectron | i'll make you an account now (password in pm) |
| 20:57.36 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 21:00.29 | MinuteElectron | there we go. |
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| 21:01.36 | MinuteElectron | i think the excess accounts might be due to the drupal plugin |
| 21:01.38 | MinuteElectron | not sure though |
| 21:02.01 | MinuteElectron | i'm going to work on things next week thouugh - making things work in IE8, some tidying up etc. |
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| 21:21.45 | starseeker | There we go: http://brlcad.org/gallery2 |
| 21:22.39 | starseeker | Not as cool as Stryker, but it's a start |
| 21:31.03 | starseeker | Hmm - OpenMoko has put ProE files now as well |
| 21:31.45 | starseeker | for their newest phone case |
| 22:15.26 | Z80-Boy | Do you also regularly read in Wikipochondria? |
| 22:16.44 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:16.56 | alex_joni | grr.. sorry :) |
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| 03:35.06 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is on scan.coverity.com but still offline || Release 7.12.0 being tagged today | |
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| 06:43.29 | brlcad | starseeker: very nice! |
| 06:44.10 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: if you didn't notice, the site went live a couple days ago |
| 06:44.28 | brlcad | (sans ldap at the moment, and with some style simplification as you may notice) |
| 09:38.07 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 10:57.16 | MinuteElectron | oh |
| 10:57.55 | MinuteElectron | why the simplification? |
| 13:03.47 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.200.134) | |
| 14:37.20 | *** join/#brlcad norias (n=Evil@pool-72-65-215-127.pitbpa.east.verizon.net) | |
| 14:38.23 | norias | hello |
| 14:38.30 | norias | hm.. |
| 14:52.54 | *** join/#brlcad norias (n=Evil@pool-72-65-215-127.pitbpa.east.verizon.net) | |
| 14:53.27 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: mostly because it still wasn't fully behaving properly on ie6 .. and to fix ie6 *reliably* made things worse for the compliant places |
| 14:54.56 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: plus the style just really is sitting stale with me the more I use it.. so less is more ;) |
| 14:56.02 | brlcad | so it can start to get populated and the style can be fixed later .. really just wanted to finally take it live (so people could see all your hard efforts) :) |
| 14:57.21 | brlcad | in the process of fixing ie6, I just dropped the footer and simplified the blocks down to what you see, later did the same for the iphone .. then I really started to like that even more for everywhere |
| 14:57.26 | brlcad | hello norias |
| 15:01.45 | norias | hi |
| 15:02.40 | norias | how are you doing, brlcad? |
| 15:02.50 | brlcad | pretty good, thanks |
| 15:03.33 | norias | are you one of the brlcad developers? |
| 15:03.41 | brlcad | nods |
| 15:03.46 | norias | nice work |
| 15:03.52 | brlcad | thanks |
| 15:04.01 | brlcad | are you interested in development? |
| 15:04.06 | norias | just grabbed it yesterday, i'm a machinist trying to learn CAD |
| 15:04.18 | norias | i used to... maybe a decade ago... |
| 15:04.28 | norias | develop minor pieces of software |
| 15:04.37 | norias | database stuff for small businesses |
| 15:04.42 | norias | doubt i could touch this stuff |
| 15:05.27 | brlcad | oh, don't hold yourself back -- there's lots of levels and areas of development for just about any skill level :) |
| 15:05.37 | brlcad | otherwise, glad to hear it |
| 15:05.38 | norias | right on :) |
| 15:06.16 | norias | figured i'd hang out in here and see what gets talked about |
| 15:06.25 | norias | seems like a good way to get a feel for the software |
| 15:07.39 | norias | in about 24 hours, the only thing i've noticed that i'd think would be cool |
| 15:07.48 | norias | but probably not useful to professional users |
| 15:08.07 | norias | would be the capability of importing the Sketchup model format |
| 15:15.28 | brlcad | yeah, that would be interesting to have |
| 15:15.53 | brlcad | there are a slew of converters on the hopeful "todo" list |
| 15:16.00 | norias | i bet |
| 15:16.08 | brlcad | but the hot item this year is a STEP converter, and that's a pretty big order |
| 15:16.28 | norias | yeah,from what i understand of that format |
| 15:16.32 | norias | it sounds rather big |
| 15:16.39 | norias | that's the OSI standard, right? |
| 15:16.40 | brlcad | adds sketchup to http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 15:16.51 | brlcad | no, it's an ISO standard |
| 15:16.55 | norias | er. |
| 15:16.57 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:17.01 | norias | yeah, more coffee :) |
| 15:18.05 | norias | i'm playing with the DXF export right now |
| 15:19.01 | norias | it's nice that this is available for mac |
| 15:19.12 | norias | it kinda seems like mac is ignored when it comes to CAD |
| 15:19.13 | norias | of any sort |
| 15:21.26 | brlcad | yeah, I'm really hoping we can finally get native working here in the next couple months |
| 15:21.33 | brlcad | so it's not reliant upon x11 |
| 15:22.04 | brlcad | which will make it a lot easier to have it install into /Applications as well |
| 15:22.15 | norias | oh, hmm, that'd be neat |
| 15:22.29 | norias | i'm pretty unix-familiar so the current way doesn't really bother me at all |
| 15:22.36 | norias | but i can see where that'd be nice |
| 15:22.59 | brlcad | yeah, the idea would be maybe three icons -- one being MGED, another being Archer, and a third for a "BRL-CAD Terminal" |
| 15:23.06 | norias | sounds like a big project... or is the GUI pretty thin? |
| 15:23.20 | brlcad | it's fairly neatly abstracted |
| 15:23.36 | norias | i played around with OBJ-C on OS X |
| 15:23.41 | norias | seems like a really nice system |
| 15:23.54 | brlcad | mged and archer both go through Tk and AquaTk finally seems to be working now (it's been too buggy) |
| 15:24.09 | norias | oh, ok |
| 15:25.12 | brlcad | if we're accepted into the summer of code, things are going to be really busy this summer... |
| 15:25.33 | norias | the whole google deal? |
| 15:25.41 | brlcad | but we would hopefully get two or three really interested students working on some good stuff |
| 15:25.45 | brlcad | yeah |
| 15:26.03 | norias | yeah, that'd be really interesting |
| 15:26.16 | norias | i have a buddy who designs robots for a living |
| 15:26.19 | brlcad | orgs are announced tomorrow, so we'll know soon enough |
| 15:26.23 | norias | i'm getting tempted to toss him a link |
| 15:26.56 | norias | not really sure what sort of software he's using |
| 15:26.59 | brlcad | our biggest "problem" right now is that the main gui is .. expert friendly .. sufficiently efficient for those that are trained in it |
| 15:27.18 | norias | i can see that |
| 15:27.18 | brlcad | but really hard for new users to learn, very steep learning curve |
| 15:27.41 | norias | with a software suite that does so much though... |
| 15:27.42 | brlcad | that's something we've recognized for years, been working on fixing |
| 15:27.51 | brlcad | yeah, the power's mostly all there |
| 15:27.57 | norias | can you really expect to simplify it that much? |
| 15:28.08 | brlcad | not simplify, make it more friendly ;) |
| 15:28.39 | norias | friendly is good :) |
| 15:29.01 | brlcad | right now if you want to "figure out" how to do something you know it can do, you either end up needing to go through the volumes of documentation, asking an existing expert user (forums, mailing list, irc), or looking at the source code |
| 15:29.08 | norias | i think i'm trying to make this do things it's not designed to do... |
| 15:29.08 | brlcad | the app itself doesn't really help you |
| 15:29.32 | brlcad | it should |
| 15:29.42 | norias | i can see your point, which is something, is just something someone like me is willing to do |
| 15:29.46 | norias | but alot of others wouldn't |
| 15:29.49 | brlcad | it's designed to be a swiss army knife of tools for many many purposes :) |
| 15:30.46 | norias | oddly enough, my end goal is to design military-style rifles |
| 15:31.10 | norias | i became fascinated with their design during my short time in the National Guard |
| 15:31.30 | brlcad | cool |
| 15:31.52 | norias | almost makes sense to use a DoD program... :) |
| 15:33.01 | brlcad | yeah .. no money on usability, all on core features.. :) |
| 15:33.22 | brlcad | it's primarily since we've gone open source that usability has become a hot priority |
| 15:33.35 | norias | i can see that |
| 15:33.36 | brlcad | been an issue for years, but always falls under the radar |
| 15:33.44 | brlcad | s/radar/prioritization/ |
| 15:33.49 | norias | since there's in-house training, i'd assume |
| 15:33.53 | norias | for the internal users |
| 15:33.57 | brlcad | and in-house experts |
| 15:34.00 | norias | right |
| 15:34.19 | brlcad | if something isn't working right, you can walk over and talk to a core developer any time |
| 15:34.48 | brlcad | need a tweak that does X, you might get it today or be told of a workaround that's sufficient (or even better) |
| 15:36.24 | brlcad | with open source, though.. it's desirable to get more core devs from all over working on the project |
| 15:38.20 | norias | looking through your list of ideas... |
| 15:38.27 | norias | you want it to spit out g-code? |
| 15:39.27 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30531 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: include common.h |
| 15:41.03 | brlcad | yes, that has been oft requested |
| 15:41.08 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30532 10/brlcad/trunk/include/brep.h: minor cleanup investigating the C++ linkage failure seen on Fedora. |
| 15:41.44 | norias | g-code... seems like that'd take... a few steps |
| 15:41.55 | brlcad | certainly something doable, shouldn't be "too" hard really given we can fully sample any geometry |
| 15:42.38 | norias | hmmm, i write g-code on a daily basis |
| 15:42.47 | norias | and that seems.. like it'd be interesting... |
| 15:42.53 | brlcad | you'd have to define available drill bits, the limits of the cnc machine (how many axes, etc), material types .. and solve paths |
| 15:44.35 | norias | i know in theory it should work |
| 15:44.50 | norias | i'm just trying to envision how it'd play out in practice |
| 15:44.54 | brlcad | my thoughts were to use our ray-trace library, which can be used to sample geometry in any pattern desired and at any resolution to find out where there is and is not material |
| 15:45.09 | starseeker | raises eyebrows - wikileaks claims to have a diagram about an early atomic bomb design |
| 15:45.25 | brlcad | starseeker: saw that, pretty nifty |
| 15:45.44 | brlcad | would make a simple can model :) |
| 15:45.53 | brlcad | bunch of spheres and cylinders :) |
| 15:46.02 | starseeker | heh - if it really is leaked they might get a bit annoyed at us for doing that ;-) |
| 15:46.40 | starseeker | 'course, the basic designs have been pretty well known for a while now |
| 15:46.46 | brlcad | gahs at the need to install fedora just for a build failure |
| 15:46.52 | starseeker | ick |
| 15:46.58 | brlcad | anyone got fedora on hand? :) |
| 15:47.57 | starseeker | meh - that's a pretty simple diagram |
| 15:48.18 | norias | some of these "leaks" aren't much of anything |
| 15:48.25 | starseeker | no joke, that'd be a trivial model |
| 15:48.30 | norias | army "Lessons Learned" are pretty wide distribution |
| 15:52.30 | starseeker | would worry more about some terrorist nuts buying surplus Soviet nuclear weapons on the black market, disassembling them, and making the plans for THOSE public |
| 15:53.24 | starseeker | brlcad: I don't suppose you could use VMware to install Fedora? |
| 15:58.18 | brlcad | I can |
| 15:58.21 | brlcad | but that's still ugh |
| 15:58.24 | starseeker | True |
| 15:59.06 | norias | do i need to raytrace an object before i export it to dxf? |
| 15:59.14 | starseeker | shouldn't |
| 15:59.26 | starseeker | unless you want to take a look at it |
| 15:59.31 | norias | i just tried to export the sphere example |
| 15:59.39 | norias | to see what it'd look like in my 2d cad program |
| 15:59.43 | norias | and i'm having no luck |
| 15:59.50 | starseeker | what's the error? |
| 16:00.23 | norias | do_walk_subtree() FAIL on '/sph1.s' |
| 16:00.27 | norias | 288 triangle written |
| 16:00.37 | norias | i get a file, that has a sph1.s layer on it |
| 16:00.46 | norias | but i can't seem to see any information on it... |
| 16:01.11 | starseeker | Hmm - you just added a sphere to an empty database and tried exporting it, or are you using a pre-existing example file? |
| 16:01.42 | norias | i followed the tutorial |
| 16:01.47 | norias | and just made the initial sphere |
| 16:01.57 | norias | then, |
| 16:02.06 | brlcad | the failure is because it's looking for a region |
| 16:02.19 | norias | oh, ok |
| 16:02.26 | brlcad | it still wrote the sphere though |
| 16:02.33 | norias | so, i have to have a region to get anything exported, really? |
| 16:02.48 | brlcad | no |
| 16:02.51 | brlcad | it should be fine |
| 16:02.56 | brlcad | that's just what that FAIL means |
| 16:03.49 | norias | oh, ok |
| 16:03.52 | norias | hm |
| 16:05.19 | starseeker | I'm not getting anything visible when I load the dxf into Qcad |
| 16:05.31 | norias | yeah, i'm using qcad |
| 16:06.03 | norias | i get list of weird errors if i use -v |
| 16:07.04 | brlcad | not saying it's the problem here, but qcad's dxf importer has *many* bugs |
| 16:08.27 | brlcad | the dxf loads fine in blender |
| 16:09.10 | starseeker | qcad can't see the cassini dxf either |
| 16:09.17 | norias | hmm. bummer |
| 16:09.27 | norias | so it's qcad |
| 16:09.49 | norias | that puts some stones in my shoes as far as what i wanted to do |
| 16:11.09 | brlcad | there are a few things you can try |
| 16:11.40 | brlcad | edit the dxf and remove all of the slashes in the entity names |
| 16:12.16 | brlcad | sed 's/\/sph1.s/sph1.s/g' < yourfile.dxf > newfile.dxf |
| 16:12.24 | norias | hmmm |
| 16:12.26 | norias | good idea |
| 16:12.56 | brlcad | dxf spec allows for a wide range of characters in the names, qcad might not |
| 16:14.35 | norias | hm. basically, figure out what sort of massaging of the data qcad needs |
| 16:14.45 | norias | and maybe write myself a little script for that |
| 16:20.15 | brlcad | if it's something simple |
| 16:20.17 | brlcad | should be |
| 16:20.31 | brlcad | can you make a 3D sphere in qcad? |
| 16:20.51 | brlcad | (not via a revolve) |
| 16:22.35 | norias | can I? no |
| 16:22.38 | norias | can the software? |
| 16:22.41 | norias | i have no idea |
| 16:22.49 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:22.57 | norias | i use it to make 2D mechanical drawins of parts |
| 16:23.07 | norias | blueprinrts |
| 16:23.15 | norias | (wow, my typing is going to hell) |
| 16:23.18 | brlcad | you using qcad on windows? |
| 16:23.40 | brlcad | and did that sed make any difference? |
| 16:23.55 | norias | sed didn't help |
| 16:24.01 | norias | qcad on OS X |
| 16:25.09 | norias | maybe that's the root of the problem |
| 16:25.21 | norias | is that... the exported object is 3d |
| 16:25.28 | norias | and i think qcad only handles 2d |
| 16:26.21 | brlcad | could be |
| 16:26.36 | norias | i was kinda curious how that would play out |
| 16:26.39 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30533 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_system.h: try to fix the fedora linkage error (blindly). these are C headers, so protect them with an extern C declaration if we're compiling in C++ mode. |
| 16:26.39 | norias | guess i know now |
| 16:26.41 | norias | it won't |
| 16:27.12 | brlcad | submit a bug report ;) |
| 16:27.33 | norias | doesn't sound like a bug to me |
| 16:27.38 | norias | well... not for brl |
| 16:27.49 | norias | and, i'm thinking not really a bug for qcad |
| 16:27.52 | brlcad | i meant a qcad bug report |
| 16:27.54 | brlcad | and in jest :) |
| 16:27.57 | norias | because i don't think it's supposed to do 3d |
| 16:28.00 | norias | oh, right on |
| 16:31.55 | norias | hmmm, solidworks has a free viewer |
| 16:32.13 | norias | kinda helps... a little... |
| 16:33.09 | brlcad | what're you trying to do? |
| 16:33.22 | brlcad | if you're trying to better visualize, you can use the "rt" command |
| 16:33.31 | norias | hmm, basically... i'd like to lay things out with brl-cad in 3d |
| 16:33.40 | norias | then turn it out into 2d images |
| 16:34.00 | norias | that i can add dimensions etc, for working drawings |
| 16:34.06 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 16:34.21 | brlcad | run "rtedge" |
| 16:34.26 | norias | oh? |
| 16:34.48 | brlcad | that'll generate hidden line drawings |
| 16:34.52 | brlcad | e.g. http://brlcad.org/OLD/images/havoc_rtedge.png |
| 16:35.14 | brlcad | just without dimensions |
| 16:35.24 | norias | that's kinda close to what i'm after |
| 16:35.36 | brlcad | but they can of course be added to the image afterwards with fav image editor |
| 16:35.51 | brlcad | yeah, you probably want the orthogonal views |
| 16:36.03 | norias | right |
| 16:36.04 | brlcad | maybe something not quite so complex |
| 16:36.18 | norias | orthogonal views is exactly the idea |
| 16:36.38 | norias | i'm not even 100% sure, because i'm not any sort of engineer |
| 16:36.47 | brlcad | yeah, i've been meaning to write a little wrapper that generates a standard multi-view hidden-line rendering all at once |
| 16:36.51 | norias | i make the stuff, and i know what it needs to look like fore me to make it |
| 16:37.34 | norias | and, i can make those drawings with qcad or whatever |
| 16:37.51 | norias | and i can make 3d models to look at by importing them into sketchup |
| 16:38.02 | norias | (even though the dimensional accuracy is then... terrible) |
| 16:38.13 | norias | i'd like be able to go the other way |
| 16:38.49 | brlcad | something like http://c900se.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/diagram-1992_saab-900-cabriolet.gif |
| 16:39.10 | norias | yeah, vaguely |
| 16:39.24 | norias | i could toss an example of a single piece |
| 16:39.29 | norias | that i did with qcad |
| 16:39.44 | norias | (even though it's technically wrong) |
| 16:40.29 | brlcad | yeah, be useful to see |
| 16:40.56 | norias | there's too many views on mine |
| 16:41.05 | norias | i was told by a friend who's a professional drafter |
| 16:41.10 | norias | but i guess it gives the idea |
| 16:41.24 | brlcad | better to have too much than too little |
| 16:41.36 | norias | that's my thought |
| 16:41.46 | norias | but the drafting... they have their own standards, too |
| 16:41.52 | norias | so, it doesn't fit the standard |
| 16:42.31 | norias | but then, it's alot closer than i was before :) |
| 16:42.41 | norias | http://base.google.com/base/a/2422661/D6214409695575134655 |
| 16:42.53 | norias | the pdf file on that page is the actual document |
| 16:43.44 | brlcad | yeah, something like http://www.draftingzone.com/standards/standard1/ |
| 16:44.25 | norias | yeah |
| 16:44.41 | norias | not that people actually follow it... |
| 16:44.46 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:44.51 | norias | i was just making a drawing |
| 16:45.00 | norias | based on what i knew from having seen 1000's of them |
| 16:45.06 | norias | to describe an object i was making at home |
| 16:45.20 | norias | apparently i have two too many views |
| 16:47.13 | norias | i'm thinking... basically the multipane mged view |
| 16:47.49 | norias | shoved into a file |
| 16:51.14 | starseeker | Hmm - this is pretty darn cool looking: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300206000053 |
| 16:52.06 | norias | those are pretty cool |
| 16:52.23 | norias | i found some blueprints for the m1911 45 caliber pistol |
| 16:52.33 | norias | those are neat, imho |
| 16:52.42 | starseeker | I guess that price isn't too bad considering how many blueprints there are, but still... urk |
| 16:52.46 | starseeker | neat |
| 16:52.50 | starseeker | originals? |
| 16:53.05 | norias | yeah |
| 16:53.14 | norias | well, scanned pdf of the originals |
| 16:53.18 | starseeker | neat |
| 16:53.24 | starseeker | link? ;-) |
| 16:53.32 | norias | that might be one of my "learning cad" projects |
| 16:53.38 | norias | to turn them into a .dxf |
| 16:53.43 | norias | hmm, link... i dunno |
| 16:53.54 | norias | i downloaded 'em from somewhere... |
| 16:54.11 | norias | i can put them on my google base account if you want |
| 16:54.23 | starseeker | are they copyrighted? |
| 16:54.30 | norias | no idea |
| 16:54.37 | norias | good question, actually |
| 16:54.44 | norias | can't image at this point it'd be a big deal |
| 16:54.52 | starseeker | heh |
| 16:54.54 | norias | 20 thousand companies make 1911's |
| 16:55.15 | norias | it's not like the dimensions of the things are some huge secret |
| 16:55.43 | starseeker | true |
| 16:56.01 | starseeker | sees a fair number of 1911 blueprints on ebay |
| 16:56.08 | starseeker | not originals, but copies |
| 16:56.12 | norias | yeah |
| 16:56.33 | norias | i think it'd be fun to make one someday |
| 16:56.39 | starseeker | :-) |
| 16:56.41 | norias | when i get hold of a milling machine |
| 16:57.00 | norias | (or an employer that let's me use the machines on off time) |
| 16:57.15 | starseeker | That'd be interesting if you tried to register it with police - "Manufacturer? Me in my garage officer, honest!" ;-) |
| 16:57.19 | norias | i had an interview with a company that makes components for machine guns |
| 16:57.25 | starseeker | cool |
| 16:57.32 | norias | actually, in the US, it's totally legal to make your own firearms |
| 16:57.41 | norias | and in my state, there are no firearms registrations |
| 16:58.10 | starseeker | that works |
| 16:58.10 | norias | you can legally make any firearm that you could legally purchase |
| 16:58.17 | norias | so long as you do all the work yourself |
| 16:58.20 | norias | and never sell it |
| 17:00.14 | norias | nice... |
| 17:00.41 | norias | this CAD viewer opens the dxf that brl made |
| 17:01.02 | norias | now i see why it's called a bag of triangles |
| 17:01.06 | starseeker | hehe |
| 17:16.05 | norias | so, brl-cad can do ballistics simulations? or no? |
| 17:21.20 | brlcad | ballistic simulation codes use brl-cad (directly) |
| 17:21.43 | brlcad | but we don't include the code in brl-cad that does the actual penetration simulation |
| 17:22.08 | brlcad | that's a separate analysis code, one of many that use brl-cad for high-performance geometry interrogation |
| 17:22.59 | norias | so, basically... it does external ballistics.. |
| 17:23.11 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 17:23.16 | norias | i.e. if i modelled a projectile for a rifle... |
| 17:23.18 | brlcad | the closest brl-cad lets you get to that are the tools for computing weights/moments and projected areas |
| 17:23.36 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 17:23.41 | norias | i could model it's external ballistics? |
| 17:23.45 | norias | (i.e. flight path) |
| 17:23.51 | norias | or no? |
| 17:24.26 | brlcad | with what? |
| 17:24.55 | brlcad | with brl-cad, no -- it provides the fundamental geometric representation and API facilities for querying that representation |
| 17:25.01 | norias | ok |
| 17:25.18 | brlcad | there are various (other) analysis codes that hook into that API for doing the simulations |
| 17:26.12 | brlcad | those include things like simulating material interactions, energy transmission, flight-path simulations, etc |
| 17:27.26 | brlcad | so you could model the projectile for a rifle and there are codes that will simulate its behavior in a given encounter scenario |
| 17:29.52 | norias | hmmm |
| 17:29.54 | norias | interesting |
| 17:31.34 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@77-56-88-235.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:57.30 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875BFE.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:00.09 | brlcad | norias: curious, in your example, the dimensions on the center for .492 and .244 don't seem right |
| 18:01.10 | brlcad | if the base is .170 up and top of that cylinder is .260 up (right diagram), then .244 for the center of that .250R seems wrong |
| 18:04.41 | norias | it's possible |
| 18:04.45 | norias | i'm still learning |
| 18:04.53 | norias | and some of the numbers are a little fudged |
| 18:05.06 | norias | mostly because not all of the dimensionals are functional |
| 18:05.25 | norias | they are just.... to make the piece more attractive |
| 18:06.08 | norias | lemme look, though... |
| 18:07.51 | norias | i see your point... |
| 18:07.57 | norias | that doesn't seem to make sense |
| 18:08.46 | norias | at all |
| 18:09.04 | norias | also interesting that you caught that |
| 18:09.13 | norias | and the professional drafter i showed it to didn't |
| 18:10.31 | norias | yeah, the .492 should be .170 - .040 (for the radius) |
| 18:10.36 | norias | hence, .130 |
| 18:11.09 | norias | i'm set to do another version |
| 18:11.36 | norias | off some models i did of this piece in relation to the other parts in the assembly |
| 18:11.55 | norias | which gave me some different theoretical values |
| 18:12.01 | norias | close, but it makes a difference |
| 18:12.02 | norias | so, yeah |
| 18:12.04 | norias | good catch |
| 18:12.35 | norias | i think both the .492 and .244 are wrong |
| 18:16.34 | brlcad | k :) |
| 18:17.58 | norias | btw, is there a repository somewhere for free brl-cad models? |
| 18:35.57 | brlcad | norias: there are a variety included in your install |
| 18:36.18 | brlcad | look in /usr/brlcad/share/brlcad/7.XX.X/db |
| 18:39.36 | brlcad | norias: also curious, noted in your diagram that you have the top at a 5 deg incline, yet the google picture seems pretty horizontal |
| 18:42.38 | norias | i think that's just a perspective issue |
| 18:43.16 | brlcad | hm, k |
| 18:43.38 | norias | lemme look, though |
| 18:43.42 | brlcad | plays with the model |
| 18:43.54 | norias | because the picture is a just a picture of the 3d model |
| 18:44.10 | norias | so i should be able to tell pretty quick |
| 18:44.20 | norias | (the 3d model comes directly from the diagram) |
| 18:45.03 | norias | definitely a perspective issue |
| 18:47.40 | norias | just added another picture |
| 18:47.42 | norias | that shows |
| 19:08.50 | brlcad | woot, http://brlcad.org/tmp/extractor.png |
| 19:09.07 | brlcad | thats a fun lil shape |
| 19:10.00 | brlcad | created exactly per your dimensions |
| 19:18.07 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/extractor2.png |
| 19:19.42 | norias | wow |
| 19:19.46 | norias | that's really neat |
| 19:20.34 | norias | so the dimensions were good, then? |
| 19:21.00 | brlcad | i'm not an expert modeler, there's probably some optimizations that I could have used, but it was easy enough to reconstruct |
| 19:21.33 | brlcad | yeah, the dimensions seemed alright except for those two mentioned |
| 19:21.38 | norias | oh, ok |
| 19:21.59 | norias | how'd you get a center point for that radius, then? |
| 19:22.10 | brlcad | and given they were wrong, it made positioning the main arc interesting :) |
| 19:22.32 | norias | just eyeballed it? |
| 19:24.42 | brlcad | well, the overall width is known and it's nearly tangent to the outer edge |
| 19:25.17 | brlcad | that gives a horizontal -- i did just eyeball the vertical at .180 |
| 19:25.55 | norias | yeah, well, the numbers for that center point... and the size of that radius are just a "guess" anyway |
| 19:26.10 | norias | it's not at all functional, just to make it look nice installed |
| 19:26.24 | brlcad | ah |
| 19:26.27 | norias | so, .250 for the radius just because it's easy to make, and a standard size |
| 19:26.37 | brlcad | i thought you had measured one :) |
| 19:26.57 | norias | then the centerpoint found just by lining that up with the straight line for the angle, and the extractor lip |
| 19:27.06 | norias | yeah, i actually made one by hand |
| 19:27.21 | norias | by measuring where it needed to fit, and what it needed to do |
| 19:27.28 | brlcad | is that r250 angle also 5 degrees? |
| 19:27.34 | norias | and the blueprint is based off those measuremeants |
| 19:27.54 | norias | R.250 is the size of the radius on the "front" |
| 19:28.08 | norias | and the 5 degrees is also a "look" nice thing |
| 19:29.38 | norias | i have a "third edition" soon... |
| 19:29.42 | norias | based on notes, etc |
| 19:29.48 | norias | because i might make a few more of these |
| 19:30.05 | norias | considering starting the process in BRl-cad |
| 19:30.19 | norias | then moving it to my regular cad environment for the working prints |
| 19:30.37 | norias | not sure if i'll make them soon, because doing it by hand is a PITA |
| 19:30.56 | norias | or, maybe even take a good print to a local shop and get it priced for a small run |
| 19:31.19 | norias | probably not, though |
| 19:31.31 | norias | when i started this, the part was unavailable |
| 19:31.36 | norias | so, i was forced to make one |
| 19:31.41 | norias | they are available now |
| 19:31.52 | brlcad | oh yeah |
| 19:31.54 | norias | i didn't even know what it needed to look like |
| 19:32.00 | norias | just where it went, and what it did |
| 19:32.02 | brlcad | noticed another minor discrepancy |
| 19:32.05 | norias | ? |
| 19:32.27 | brlcad | on the left side, where the R.250 arrow meets up |
| 19:32.45 | norias | yes? |
| 19:32.58 | brlcad | if that's the radius, then the 119+131 below are slightly off :) |
| 19:33.00 | norias | oh, i think i see... |
| 19:33.06 | brlcad | as they are inside |
| 19:33.07 | norias | yeah, i know those are off |
| 19:33.16 | norias | i noticed that after i called it "quits" |
| 19:33.19 | brlcad | would be saying tan(5) == 0 :) |
| 19:33.35 | norias | (actually when i was trying to make one) |
| 19:34.03 | norias | it's been a learning experience |
| 19:34.12 | norias | before this i never touched CAD software, at all |
| 19:34.24 | norias | i just make things in a shop |
| 19:34.28 | brlcad | cool |
| 19:34.34 | norias | and know kinda what the prints need to look like |
| 19:34.57 | brlcad | I mostly only touch CAD software and rarely make things in a shop ;) |
| 19:35.13 | norias | yeah, eventually... |
| 19:35.25 | norias | i'm going to school to be a mech engineer |
| 19:35.43 | brlcad | if you would like to play with that .g, its also up there in the tmp dir |
| 19:35.54 | norias | i'm trying to learn/teach myself all this stuff from the ground up |
| 19:35.58 | norias | instead of the other way around |
| 19:36.25 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/extractor.g |
| 19:36.31 | norias | tempting... |
| 19:37.08 | brlcad | fixes apache's mime type |
| 19:38.47 | norias | is archer a big advance over mged? |
| 19:40.06 | yukonbob | brlcad: what's the ETA for tagging latest 7.10.x |
| 19:40.44 | brlcad | norias: usability wise, yes -- but it's lacking tons of functionality |
| 19:41.03 | brlcad | it's the start of a new user interface, a redesign, a prototype |
| 19:41.09 | brlcad | yukonbob: later today |
| 19:41.37 | yukonbob | !! woohoo |
| 19:41.39 | yukonbob | :) |
| 19:42.01 | yukonbob | prepares |
| 19:42.11 | yukonbob | is .6? |
| 19:42.16 | brlcad | 7.12.0 |
| 19:42.19 | yukonbob | ha |
| 19:42.20 | yukonbob | *ah |
| 19:42.50 | brlcad | this will actually be one of our biggest feature-wise in a long time |
| 19:42.59 | brlcad | more than 75 items |
| 19:43.00 | yukonbob | is looking forward to it... |
| 19:43.18 | norias | of course... i download the old one the day before... |
| 19:43.23 | brlcad | :) |
| 19:43.32 | brlcad | it's alright, we might not make full binaries for this release |
| 19:43.34 | yukonbob | heh -- isn't that how new releases are made? |
| 19:43.42 | brlcad | maybe just mac, linux, windows or someset thereof |
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| 21:17.40 | starseeker | Heh - tempest in a teapot - the atomic bomb "leak" was already here: http://www.nuclearweaponarchive.org/Uk/BritishBombPlans.html |
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| 00:11.06 | yukonbob | brlcad: make sure you post a note here when the 7.12 is branched :) |
| 00:22.03 | brlcad | yup |
| 00:22.14 | brlcad | still trying to get a build test to go clean |
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| 00:37.46 | yukonbob | :) -- how's it look -- unforeseen BS? |
| 01:45.18 | brlcad | it's fine, just busy doing other things at the same time, and the remaining issues aren't easily tested |
| 01:45.29 | brlcad | trying to get fedora downloaded so I can test it |
| 03:19.29 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30534 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (tcl/unix/Makefile.in tk/unix/Makefile.in): only install/chmod the lib files if they exist, hopefully bypassing an ubuntu install error where libtclstub.a doesn't exist for some (unknown) reason. |
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| 07:15.14 | brlcad | alright .. ubuntu up and running |
| 07:15.18 | brlcad | begins compiling |
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| 13:26.55 | yukonbob | pokes in |
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| 14:33.38 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30535 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (Makefile.am incrTcl/Makefile.am): if we don't have X11, then we should not be compiling tk, tkimg, blt, itk. turn them off. |
| 14:40.02 | yukonbob | wonders how the tests are going, gets ready to fly home |
| 14:40.53 | brlcad | going alright, finally got ubuntu up and running so once things are clean there, I'll tag |
| 14:42.40 | yukonbob | passes brlcad a coffee of his choice, steps back and lets the work continue |
| 14:46.36 | yukonbob | also tries to figure out how to run the svn client to pull _all_ commit msgs from ea. file over time... |
| 14:59.53 | brlcad | thanks :) |
| 15:00.41 | brlcad | it's actually a raspberry tea this morning, but caffeine nonetheless ;) |
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| 16:06.19 | brlcad | prepares the website announcement |
| 17:14.21 | brlcad | sets up an auto-notifier to know when the final org list is published |
| 17:36.27 | starseek1r | \quit |
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| 18:43.36 | cad03 | that works nicely now |
| 19:33.35 | brlcad | gets an e-mail |
| 19:33.51 | brlcad | We are accepted into the Google Summer of Code |
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| 21:42.55 | PrezKennedy | high fives brlcad |
| 21:42.58 | PrezKennedy | congrats! |
| 21:43.46 | brlcad | yeah, pretty cool :) |
| 21:44.01 | brlcad | gonna get busy in here |
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| 00:26.28 | yukonbob | re: SoC -- does that mean that certain summer projects of BRL-CAD are accepted, or BRL-CAD is welcomed into SoC in principle, and specfic projects are yet to be sumbitted. |
| 00:26.31 | yukonbob | ? |
| 00:27.06 | brlcad | the latter |
| 00:27.39 | brlcad | we talk to students throughout the week |
| 00:27.45 | brlcad | they formulate proposals |
| 00:27.50 | brlcad | we rank them |
| 00:28.12 | brlcad | we get allocated an unknown number of slots (probably 2 or 3) |
| 00:28.28 | brlcad | those top N ranked then work on their projects |
| 00:29.29 | yukonbob | nods |
| 00:30.45 | yukonbob | Are there projects listed on a SoC page on the new site that might be picked-from, or give potentials an idea of what to work on? |
| 00:30.59 | brlcad | yep |
| 00:31.15 | brlcad | http://my.brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Project_Ideas |
| 00:31.22 | brlcad | still have more to add |
| 00:31.28 | brlcad | and some cleanup |
| 00:31.31 | yukonbob | looks |
| 00:32.00 | brlcad | if you have other ideas, it's a wiki ;) |
| 00:32.18 | brlcad | (and presuming youd be interested in mentoring that idea) |
| 00:32.27 | alex_joni | brlcad: an U3D converter |
| 00:33.13 | yukonbob | looks, and has ideas, and will hopefully mentor as well ;) |
| 00:33.58 | brlcad | also links to http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 00:34.20 | brlcad | though that has plenty of ideas way out of scope for gsoc |
| 00:35.30 | brlcad | alex_joni: good idea |
| 00:35.45 | alex_joni | brlcad: makes nifty pdf's :) |
| 00:36.23 | alex_joni | and should be fairly simple using sample code from SF as a guidance |
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| 05:55.29 | brlcad | u3d added |
| 06:09.11 | poolio | congrats on gsoc :) |
| 06:09.25 | brlcad | yeah, should be fun |
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| 07:21.53 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list | |
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| 11:38.46 | alex_joni | brlcad: whee, thanks :) |
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| 11:50.30 | starseeker | brlcad: Heh - with BRL-CAD and BZFlag in the SoC mix it's going to be a wild one :-) |
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| 14:03.25 | clock_ | brlcad: is there something like a truncated sphere? |
| 14:03.48 | clock_ | For example if I want to do a weak lens, I need to use a huge sphere. It makes the model appear big and complicated |
| 14:03.56 | clock_ | also maybe makes raytracinf slower |
| 14:55.32 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 14:56.01 | yukonbob | passes raspberry tea or coffee or yerba matte or $whatever to brlcad |
| 15:18.12 | brlcad | clock_: hmmm |
| 15:18.44 | brlcad | even truncated, it's going to be huge regardless to get the curvature |
| 15:20.32 | clock_ | I don't agree with that |
| 15:25.00 | brlcad | do you mean truncated from multiple directions? |
| 15:25.28 | brlcad | like top-bottom-left-right-back but not front |
| 15:25.45 | brlcad | that's the only way I can see it not staying big |
| 15:28.08 | clock_ | truncated like hour glass |
| 15:34.22 | brlcad | hour classes are truncated on top and bottom and tapered in the middle |
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| 15:41.17 | clock_ | oh sorry bad term |
| 15:41.37 | clock_ | What's the name of the warped glass that is on a watch? |
| 15:41.48 | clock_ | Clock glass? |
| 15:43.07 | brlcad | heads to lunch, bbiab |
| 15:43.12 | brlcad | dunno that one |
| 15:43.18 | brlcad | not a watch-maker ;) |
| 15:43.24 | archivist | clock_, also known as crystal |
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| 15:43.38 | archivist | I do work with clocks |
| 15:43.56 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:43.56 | clock_ | the spherical glass on a watch is called crystal? |
| 15:44.36 | archivist | watch glass, and some are plastic, some real class, some saphire |
| 15:45.06 | brlcad | yeah, my watch is actually made from crystal .. everlasting unscratchable goodness |
| 15:45.09 | archivist | real glass also called mineral |
| 15:45.51 | archivist | brlcad, probably a grown saphire crystal |
| 15:55.39 | yukonbob | clock_: couldn't you just use a big sphere, take union, and restrict your area of interest (/me is looking up in ref for command he's thinking of) |
| 15:55.56 | clock_ | I do it |
| 16:00.26 | yukonbob | will have to look later, but there's a command to block an area as the _only_ area for the ray to take into account -- can't find reference/remember name atm... |
| 16:07.44 | yukonbob | how does one subscribe to the mailing list? |
| 16:07.54 | yukonbob | ~mailinglist |
| 16:07.54 | ibot | [~mailinglist] Asterisk mailing lists can be found at http://lists.digium.com , http://www.asteriskguru.com/archives |
| 16:09.32 | archivist | https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/brlcad-devel |
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| 16:11.32 | yukonbob | sees also: http://sourceforge.net/mail/?group_id=105292 |
| 16:59.14 | iraytrace | We made it to GSOC?!?!?!?! |
| 17:03.48 | poolio | jah! :) |
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| 19:21.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03tossup * r30536 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/geometry/BrlcadDb.java: |
| 19:21.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 'Completed scan' message now goes to System.err rather than System.out. |
| 19:21.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: Added <String> as generic type for TreeSet to remove lint warnings. |
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| 19:59.21 | brlcad | hello Ford_Prefect |
| 19:59.35 | brlcad | and hippieindamakin8 |
| 20:00.17 | alex_joni | heh, wonder where I left my towel |
| 20:07.40 | brlcad | never leaves home without his towel |
| 20:09.08 | Ford_Prefect | :D |
| 20:09.11 | Ford_Prefect | Hey brlcad |
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| 20:10.39 | brlcad | how goes it? |
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| 20:31.32 | yukonbob | peeks in |
| 20:33.43 | brlcad | peeks out |
| 20:40.43 | yukonbob | heh |
| 20:40.55 | yukonbob | dare I ask how you're doing? |
| 20:41.11 | brlcad | pretty good actually |
| 20:41.20 | brlcad | yesterday was busy |
| 20:41.23 | yukonbob | is glad to hear |
| 20:43.26 | PrezKennedy | * brlcad never leaves home without his towel -- the Vogans are coming! |
| 20:48.03 | yukonbob | likes the requirements for STEP parser "ability to tolerate bloated ISO standards" |
| 20:51.40 | yukonbob | notes: Caption for gallery picture "Mike Muss" is incorrectly spelled. (should be "Mike Muuss") http://my.brlcad.org/gallery/main.php |
| 20:53.39 | MinuteElectron | fixed |
| 20:55.07 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Do you have any intention of ever sanctioning a design enhancement, or is the current one as it will remain for the forseeable future? |
| 20:57.07 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 20:57.23 | MinuteElectron | Is the design as it will stay now? |
| 20:57.33 | MinuteElectron | i.e. should I start porting it to gallery2 etc. |
| 20:57.38 | brlcad | you mean the appearance of the site |
| 20:57.42 | MinuteElectron | eys |
| 20:57.45 | brlcad | aha |
| 20:57.46 | MinuteElectron | *yes |
| 20:57.49 | MinuteElectron | :P |
| 20:58.18 | brlcad | hm, well I do forsee sanctioning a design enhancement |
| 20:58.38 | brlcad | eventually at least -- it's nice that it's at least up and running now and is a major improvement |
| 20:58.43 | MinuteElectron | yeah |
| 20:58.46 | brlcad | been having fun populating it with data |
| 20:58.51 | MinuteElectron | :D |
| 20:59.20 | brlcad | so my own priority was to continue populating it throughout and then get back to ldap and then back onto a new style |
| 20:59.27 | MinuteElectron | ahh, ok |
| 21:00.06 | MinuteElectron | so I'll work on porting to gallery2 for now, then when the time comes to modify the style it will be even more uniform. |
| 21:00.14 | brlcad | there's no reason for that order other than -- it's not "bad" now so move on to content -- at least that was the thinking |
| 21:00.22 | brlcad | yeah, cool |
| 21:00.43 | brlcad | I also integrated the style with cgiirc, if you didn't notice |
| 21:00.48 | brlcad | http://irc.brlcad.org |
| 21:01.09 | brlcad | you might have a better way to do that, but cgiirc has very limited skinning options |
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| 21:01.13 | MinuteElectron | cool |
| 21:01.17 | brlcad | you have to edit the files directly |
| 21:01.23 | MinuteElectron | looks neat, ahh |
| 21:01.31 | brlcad | so I just linked the style.css and added the header to the internal template |
| 21:01.46 | *** part/#brlcad Ford_Prefect (i=arun@outbound.silenceisdefeat.org) | |
| 21:02.09 | MinuteElectron | yeah, probably not much of a better way to do it - but i'll have a poke around and think about if there is a way to integrate it better. |
| 21:02.09 | brlcad | you might have a better way to do it, but I went the quick n dirty route |
| 21:02.13 | MinuteElectron | yeah |
| 21:02.28 | brlcad | alas, a route that'll get blown away (for the header) the next time cgi:irc is update |
| 21:02.30 | *** join/#brlcad cad27 (n=5207211c@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 21:03.19 | brlcad | I also had to manually rewire the header since all the header links were relative |
| 21:03.34 | brlcad | and irc has a different path |
| 21:03.41 | brlcad | probably not a better way around that |
| 21:03.49 | brlcad | I think I'm just bitching |
| 21:04.17 | brlcad | because it sucks maintenance wise, given there probably aren't better maintenance options |
| 21:05.29 | MinuteElectron | ok |
| 21:06.04 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: I'm also not sure I set up recaptcha properly .. |
| 21:06.12 | brlcad | and the Notify module |
| 21:06.54 | brlcad | at least I'm getting several spam contact e-mails a day, and when I test manually it doesn't present me with the recaptcha (on the contact form .. works for the wiki) |
| 21:07.12 | MinuteElectron | I'll add it to my to do list and look into it when I get a chance, unless this is urgent? |
| 21:07.26 | brlcad | nah, not urgent |
| 21:07.35 | brlcad | I'll just forward you the spam ;) |
| 21:07.46 | MinuteElectron | :D |
| 21:08.56 | brlcad | or maybe I will buy those cellphone stocks on the forex markets while enlarging my manhood for her delight |
| 21:09.01 | MinuteElectron | heh |
| 21:09.17 | MinuteElectron | Also, Drupal 6 got released the other week; not sure if we want to risk an upgrade just yet. I could set up a test drupal and use a copy of the database to do a test upgrade to see if it works ok - then roll it out to the main site? |
| 21:09.36 | brlcad | I saw that too |
| 21:09.41 | brlcad | most of the modules aren't updated |
| 21:09.47 | brlcad | ldap isn't available for example |
| 21:10.15 | brlcad | we're using about a half dozen modules now -- when they're updated, probably a good time to upgrade |
| 21:10.51 | MinuteElectron | ahh ok |
| 21:15.10 | MinuteElectron | later |
| 21:15.52 | brlcad | cya! |
| 21:19.04 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad |
| 21:37.24 | hippieindamakin8 | nebody there ? |
| 21:37.32 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad are u there? |
| 21:42.26 | brlcad | yep |
| 21:44.14 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: did you have a question? |
| 21:44.24 | hippieindamakin8 | ya man.. |
| 21:44.36 | hippieindamakin8 | how do i get this mged program on my comp ? |
| 21:44.46 | brlcad | well, you install it |
| 21:44.48 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:44.52 | hippieindamakin8 | i couldn't find any repositories :P |
| 21:45.04 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 21:45.05 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 21:45.13 | hippieindamakin8 | ahh thanks |
| 21:47.01 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh it is automatically installed :) |
| 21:47.16 | hippieindamakin8 | with brlcad |
| 21:48.31 | brlcad | hm? |
| 21:48.36 | brlcad | what's automatically installed? |
| 21:48.46 | brlcad | that svn command obtains the sources |
| 21:49.06 | hippieindamakin8 | naah i already have the binaries |
| 21:49.07 | brlcad | if you want a binary install, there are downloads available through the website |
| 21:49.16 | hippieindamakin8 | i installed it just now.. |
| 21:49.27 | brlcad | okay |
| 21:49.29 | hippieindamakin8 | i dint know how to get this mged program running |
| 21:50.52 | hippieindamakin8 | can you help me start up ? |
| 21:50.58 | brlcad | i can help a little |
| 21:51.01 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54876385.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:51.02 | brlcad | what's the problem? |
| 21:51.18 | brlcad | if you run 'mged' it should open up two windows |
| 21:51.46 | hippieindamakin8 | it aint :( i tried it |
| 21:52.53 | hippieindamakin8 | actually after an install i tried to launch the program but couldnt do that.. :( tried to locate the files but they were there either |
| 21:55.46 | brlcad | you'll need to run it via /usr/brlcad/bin/mged if you haven't added /usr/brlcad/bin to your path |
| 21:55.54 | brlcad | by default, brl-cad installs into /usr/brlcad |
| 21:56.21 | brlcad | it *entirely* installs into /usr/brlcad so you can actually upgrade/uninstall really easily |
| 21:56.37 | hippieindamakin8 | thanks |
| 21:56.56 | brlcad | np |
| 21:58.18 | brlcad | there are extensive tutorials and documentation on the website at http://brlcad.org/d/documentation |
| 22:00.59 | hippieindamakin8 | ya started reffering them :) too sleepy at the same time |
| 22:23.35 | hippieindamakin8 | thanks it started working properly :) i was running from an account(ssh) without Xlib |
| 22:23.52 | brlcad | ah |
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| 00:13.24 | starseeker | uploads more screenshots |
| 02:26.41 | yukonbob | starseeker: are both those models yours? |
| 02:27.01 | starseeker | I did them as part of my training |
| 02:28.13 | yukonbob | nice.. |
| 02:30.14 | yukonbob | pen is using pipes for the "plastic" body and the "metal" end where the ball point is hidden? |
| 02:35.42 | starseeker | no, although that's probably a good idea |
| 02:36.00 | starseeker | I thought about redoing the pen body with pipes, but have been working on other things |
| 02:36.53 | starseeker | Pen was the first thing I really modeled, so I wasn't up on pipes yet ;-) |
| 02:37.39 | yukonbob | so what did you use? I'm just looking at it and trying to reverse engineer your work :) |
| 02:38.24 | starseeker | Ah :-). I think it was an eto at the very tip of the pen, a trc for the remainder of the "cap", an epa for the tapering tip, and then a cylinder when it got straighter |
| 02:39.53 | starseeker | since it's a glass render, you can see the discontinuity where it switches from the epa to the rcc |
| 02:40.11 | starseeker | I'm not sure, but pipe might be able to do a significantly better job of it |
| 02:40.39 | starseeker | That's cool you thought of trying pipe too :-) |
| 02:43.59 | yukonbob | it's a nice looking render even as is, though |
| 02:44.23 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 02:45.09 | starseeker | that one has more visual bang for the buck than the wheel, but the wheel was where I finally got the pattern tool to do something useful |
| 02:45.40 | starseeker | Heh - people seem to like that openmoko import screenshot |
| 02:46.53 | yukonbob | not surprising, considering it looks so "techy" :) |
| 02:47.25 | starseeker | should have put up wireframe screenshots of cassini instead of renders ;-) |
| 02:47.38 | yukonbob | re: pattern tool -- /me will have to look that up; How did you use it on that wheel? |
| 02:48.17 | starseeker | pattern tool may not be the best way to do what I did - you see the divots around the edge of the wheel? |
| 02:48.36 | yukonbob | on the tire? |
| 02:48.39 | starseeker | yes |
| 02:48.42 | yukonbob | like syping? |
| 02:48.44 | yukonbob | ya. |
| 02:49.07 | starseeker | those were done by placing one shape in the "right" place on the rim, and then patterning it around |
| 02:50.04 | yukonbob | ah.... /me would use a script to do that (Tcl)... but I haven't tried the pattern tool -- it might be the way to go... |
| 02:50.15 | starseeker | clone would probably be the right way |
| 02:50.36 | starseeker | the pattern tool gui is not at all intuitive |
| 02:56.08 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 02:56.08 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list | |
| 03:21.03 | brlcad | that background works out really nicely for the pen |
| 03:25.47 | starseeker | likes that background color - need to save the settings :-) |
| 03:28.28 | starseeker | It's so boring it will never conflict with any color anyone would actually want to use for something ;-) |
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| 11:37.24 | starseeker | (reluctantly) concludes he can't chase these, which is a shame since they look like they have a LOT of info to start modeling with: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190206088276 |
| 11:37.46 | starseeker | I need to go to old railroad ships and dig in the rubbish piles, apparently |
| 11:39.52 | starseeker | er/ships/shops |
| 11:40.09 | starseeker | needs to wake up here... |
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| 13:53.05 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30537 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/compiler.m4: allow BC_SANITY_CHECK to take an argument so we can customize the message being printed |
| 13:54.10 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30538 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: add a sanity check for the C++ compiler to make sure one is installed and working since we need one now, otherwise we'll just end up with more bizaree errors later on. |
| 15:28.14 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 15:31.39 | brlcad | hey d_rossberg -- you're enabled on the mentor dashboard now |
| 15:31.58 | brlcad | there's not much to do/see until the student applications begin being processed |
| 15:32.23 | brlcad | feel free to edit the ideas list if you see changes needed or would like to add other ideas (they don't have to go through me or anything) |
| 15:34.12 | d_rossberg | brlcad: ok, maybe i'll play with the "show may location" option a little bit ;-) |
| 15:34.41 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:34.50 | brlcad | and don't forget to pick your shirt size ;) |
| 15:34.58 | brlcad | it'll matter later.. |
| 15:35.29 | d_rossberg | this was easy |
| 15:36.20 | d_rossberg | but where can be seen the locations of the mentors? |
| 15:37.04 | brlcad | good question.. |
| 15:37.14 | brlcad | looks |
| 15:40.18 | d_rossberg | maybe the mentors will be shown in the application phase |
| 15:43.02 | brlcad | one of the admins is telling me that the map isn't published until near the end of the program |
| 15:43.12 | brlcad | but he's not sure either |
| 15:45.51 | d_rossberg | ah, as a replacement for a class photo |
| 15:46.11 | brlcad | we do that too, at the summit |
| 15:47.28 | brlcad | http://flickr.com/photos/mayhem/1518425696/ |
| 15:48.47 | brlcad | also http://www.vrmag.org/vartist/community/GOOGLE_SPONSORS_THE_DEVELOPMENT_OF_OPEN_SOURCE_PANORAMA_MAKING_SOFTWARE.html |
| 15:49.14 | clock_ | brlcad: do they sponsor BRL-CAD? |
| 15:49.53 | brlcad | clock_: yes, we're participating this year |
| 15:49.55 | brlcad | (see topic) |
| 16:28.11 | yukonbob | passes by, waves |
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| 22:09.26 | yukonbob | looks in again, waves :) |
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| 23:38.04 | hippieindamakin8 | hey while compiling the binaries.. there are loads of errors pertaining to the tk files |
| 23:40.28 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: sounds like you might not have the X11 headers installed |
| 23:40.41 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya |
| 23:40.53 | brlcad | that's a separate dev install on package-managing systems like ubuntu/debian |
| 23:40.55 | hippieindamakin8 | again the same problem pertaining to X |
| 23:41.18 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i am on ubtuntu.. |
| 23:41.32 | brlcad | so you'll need to apt get the X11-dev headers |
| 23:41.39 | brlcad | I don't know the specific package name |
| 23:42.03 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i am searching that |
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| 01:56.43 | starseeker | gets highres version of Earth image into gallery |
| 02:05.24 | brlcad | cool |
| 02:14.29 | starseeker | brlcad: Your turn ;-) |
| 03:24.41 | brlcad | upgrades gallery first |
| 03:55.16 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 03:58.24 | yukonbob | is the high-res img starseeker is talking about that earth cutaway? |
| 04:00.11 | brlcad | starseeker: you know what, screw it -- 4k images would be nice to have, I just need to configure some additional default sizes |
| 04:00.15 | brlcad | yeah |
| 04:03.05 | yukonbob | is nice model and all, but not really necessary to have much more than 1024x1024, is it? |
| 04:04.19 | yukonbob | just thinks there are more interesting models, and so for sake of diskspace (probably not that big a deal, though) and bandwidth... |
| 04:05.06 | yukonbob | hits hay |
| 04:05.11 | brlcad | *shrug* |
| 04:05.31 | brlcad | that was my original thinking, but we're not short on diskspace or bandwidth :) |
| 04:05.41 | brlcad | just needs to provide reasonable options |
| 04:06.09 | brlcad | would be nice if clicking on the image produced 1024 by default, then having an option for original only in the list |
| 04:07.20 | yukonbob | not really a big deal, but it's just not that exciting a model... such a large download isn't _that_ exciting (in the case of the cutaway earth, anyway)... just an opinion, though. I'm not managing the site, and don't have any models up yet :) |
| 04:07.41 | brlcad | the idea would be to go that big for all images as a max cutoff |
| 04:07.57 | yukonbob | ie: 1024 square? |
| 04:07.58 | brlcad | mebbie, it's fine as is now |
| 04:08.01 | brlcad | no, 4k |
| 04:08.21 | brlcad | i could see some that might be useful to have even higher though .. posters and such |
| 04:08.32 | yukonbob | nods |
| 04:08.45 | yukonbob | what we need is a poster of a bicycle hub... |
| 04:08.48 | brlcad | there we go, gallery updated to latest |
| 04:08.51 | brlcad | :) |
| 04:09.04 | brlcad | that's one for the gallery |
| 04:09.49 | yukonbob | is it "cool" enough? It's not multi-material like moste (all?) other models... |
| 04:09.56 | yukonbob | *most |
| 04:10.11 | brlcad | it's a really nice design |
| 04:10.26 | brlcad | would be nice to show the wireframe with it to get a feel for the complexity |
| 04:10.46 | yukonbob | fine... can render + provide img, sure. |
| 04:10.46 | brlcad | I like it because of some of the csg methods used |
| 04:11.23 | yukonbob | I've got some spare cycles... maybe I can knock off an interesting img tomorrow. |
| 04:12.03 | yukonbob | how's 7.12 coming, speaking of cycles? I bet you're burning way more than you figured w/ the Ubuntu, Fedora testing, etc. :P |
| 04:16.05 | brlcad | cool |
| 04:16.19 | brlcad | yeah, a little more, but mostly just too much context switching |
| 04:16.29 | brlcad | 7.12 is ready to go, but haven't had time to write up the release announcements |
| 04:16.44 | brlcad | also have to send out an announcement about gsoc asap (probably even higher priority) |
| 04:17.19 | yukonbob | feh -- yeah... Context switches are expensive -- about as effective as a hamster wheel it seems, sometimes ;0 |
| 04:19.22 | yukonbob | is heading to sleep. Tmo I need to do some work w/ my other project, a little bit of admin, and then will drop in to see if I can help w/ writing up some "stuff" for release or review, if that'll help.. |
| 04:27.55 | yukonbob | packs out -- see you tmo #brlcad |
| 04:39.38 | brlcad | cheers |
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| 05:42.21 | bz06 | hi? |
| 05:42.35 | bz06 | anyone there |
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| 11:31.32 | starseeker | yukonbob: Yeah, it's a pretty simple model - the high-res would mainly be for printing purposes, if someone wants to print it. |
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| 14:16.27 | pushkal | hi all.. |
| 14:16.45 | pushkal | are any of the mentors round here ? |
| 14:17.47 | alex_joni | pushkal: ping brlcad :) |
| 14:18.31 | pushkal | hes of with a msg "z".. |
| 14:19.32 | brlcad | howdy pushkal |
| 14:19.37 | pushkal | hey.. |
| 14:20.06 | pushkal | i am a bit confused |
| 14:20.12 | pushkal | could ya help me out ? |
| 14:20.14 | pushkal | :) |
| 14:21.07 | alex_joni | depends on the source of your confuseness |
| 14:21.12 | pushkal | ur Universal geometry converter API project is what i think i can do.. |
| 14:21.38 | pushkal | but being brand new to open source.. i dunno what the prerequisites are |
| 14:24.29 | pushkal | any1 home?? |
| 14:24.41 | brlcad | pushkal: yeah, sorry |
| 14:24.47 | alex_joni | pushkal: one thing you need to learn about open source.. be patient |
| 14:24.59 | brlcad | pretty busy at the moment and have to run out for a bit |
| 14:25.05 | pushkal | im sorry..learnt my first lesson.. :) |
| 14:25.20 | brlcad | but yeah .. be patient .. responses often won't come for many minutes or even hours later |
| 14:25.34 | brlcad | so you stay on the channel and do other things, checking back every now and then |
| 14:25.48 | pushkal | ok.. sure |
| 14:25.52 | brlcad | the prereqs are being pretty adept in C |
| 14:26.02 | brlcad | also C++ if you make an OO api |
| 14:26.21 | brlcad | there are several dozen converters in brl-cad, importers and exporters |
| 14:26.33 | brlcad | right now they are all independent binaries, very little code overlap |
| 14:27.02 | brlcad | the idea would be to make them go from being apps to being functions -- and putting all those functions together into a library |
| 14:27.29 | brlcad | then making the various binaries just make the appropriate api calls instead of containing all that logic like they do now |
| 14:27.44 | brlcad | we can go into more detail later, but I do have to run |
| 14:27.51 | brlcad | bbiab |
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| 14:32.06 | pushkal_ | !logs |
| 14:32.17 | pushkal_ | any logs of chat?? i got disconnectd |
| 14:32.31 | Axman6 | i could copy and paste if you wanted... |
| 14:32.41 | pushkal_ | please.. thanky you |
| 14:35.55 | Axman6 | http://rafb.net/p/oFYxZI89.html |
| 14:36.11 | Axman6 | tried two different paste sites, both were down -_- |
| 14:36.32 | pushkal_ | thanks ... |
| 14:36.34 | pushkal_ | :) |
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| 15:11.54 | yukonbob | pokes in |
| 15:12.48 | Axman6 | :o |
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| 15:34.09 | SamRose | Ok, so I downloaded brl-cad on both debian, and right now on mac os x 10.3.9, on ppc chip. Now what? Where did it install to? :) |
| 15:51.11 | alex_joni | SamRose: /usr/brlcad |
| 15:51.21 | SamRose | of |
| 15:51.23 | SamRose | ah |
| 15:51.27 | SamRose | :) |
| 15:51.31 | alex_joni | but if you installed from a deb (on debian) you can check with dpkg -L packagename |
| 15:51.50 | SamRose | how about on os x? |
| 15:52.03 | SamRose | I found on /usr |
| 15:52.49 | SamRose | but how do we go about starting and running the application on OS X? |
| 15:56.20 | alex_joni | SamRose: OS X is a unix-like OS, so I owuld suspect just like on debian |
| 16:45.43 | SamRose | Is there a web page that gives more info on the usage of brl-cad? |
| 17:02.52 | brlcad | howdy SamRose |
| 17:03.02 | brlcad | SamRose: there is a bunch of documentation on the website |
| 17:03.32 | brlcad | that said, brl-cad isn't user-friendly -- one of the gsoc projects is to make it more user friendly :) |
| 17:04.32 | brlcad | SamRose: running on Mac OS X is same as any other unix at the moment |
| 17:04.46 | brlcad | i.e. start up X11, run /usr/brlcad/bin/mged in the xterm window |
| 18:19.10 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30539 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-0/: Tagging release 7.12.0 |
| 18:19.30 | brlcad | wow, that's cool |
| 18:19.34 | brlcad | you can tag without a checkout |
| 18:20.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30540 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: that is pretty cool.. svn can tag without a checkout. bump patch version up to 1 |
| 18:26.55 | yukonbob | wonders what he's seeing -- is this 7.12 being put into the wild? |
| 18:50.59 | brlcad | source tarball should be up soon |
| 18:54.43 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30541 10/brlcad/branches/rel-5-1-branch/mged/dm_old/: delete dm_old, it's causing checkout problems |
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| 19:15.10 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03dgodbey * r30542 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Initial checkin of 3dm-g converter. |
| 19:24.24 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03dgodbey * r30543 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/ (3dm-g.cpp Makefile.am): Fix file properties |
| 19:40.31 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 19:40.31 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list | |
| 19:43.20 | yukonbob | does his work, watches for release of 7.12, and then moves to building a hawt render for the gallery (maybe w/ the 7.12 release?) |
| 19:43.31 | brlcad | it's tagged |
| 19:43.38 | brlcad | making the source dist now |
| 19:44.23 | yukonbob | a .tgz for sourceforge? Nice -- /me will grab that when it's posted (simplifies my build process) |
| 19:53.27 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 19:57.43 | brlcad | i'll say something here, it's build-testing now |
| 20:10.58 | brlcad | uploading |
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| 20:50.14 | brlcad | yukonbob: posted |
| 20:51.43 | brlcad | BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 is posted! (2008-03-20) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! See http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/brlcad-devel and idle/talk here |
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| 22:06.20 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30544 10/brlcad/trunk/ChangeLog: it didn't make the rel-7-12-0 tag, but it needs to be in there anyways .. update the changelog (generated via svn2cl.sh --break-before-msg -r {2007-10-24}:{2008-03-11} |
| 22:06.27 | yukonbob | returns from walk, is looking forward to testing 7.12 out :) |
| 22:19.34 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad, i am interested in the GSoC projects man |
| 22:21.36 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: glad to hear it man |
| 22:21.42 | hippieindamakin8 | i am interested in 3 of them :D .. one is OO geometry engine API |
| 22:22.03 | brlcad | there are a bunch that haven't been added yet too, be sure to check out the link in the first sentance |
| 22:22.08 | brlcad | ~spell sentance |
| 22:22.08 | hippieindamakin8 | universal goemetry converter |
| 22:22.22 | brlcad | cool, both great projects |
| 22:22.46 | hippieindamakin8 | ya.. gimme a month and i shall be able to do CSG<-> BREP |
| 22:22.59 | hippieindamakin8 | i am midway the learning of the CAD representations |
| 22:23.37 | brlcad | that one is very math intense, I'd be cautious without seeing code snippets and strong background info |
| 22:23.50 | hippieindamakin8 | i have a good idea about CSGs and learning basic representation of the curves,splines |
| 22:24.08 | hippieindamakin8 | and BREP manipulations |
| 22:24.17 | brlcad | it's mostly done for three of the implicits, the big three even (ellipsoidals, arbs, and .. one other that escapes me) |
| 22:24.36 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. |
| 22:25.05 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 22:25.06 | brlcad | are you referring to doing CSG evaluation of BREP or conversion from implicit to BREP? |
| 22:25.14 | brlcad | (or both) |
| 22:25.22 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall go through the source code pertaining to this one.. |
| 22:25.27 | hippieindamakin8 | i meant both.. |
| 22:25.42 | hippieindamakin8 | but i have just started a course in this CAD |
| 22:25.51 | brlcad | src/librt/g_*.c has our primitives |
| 22:25.52 | hippieindamakin8 | i am about to be done in a month.. |
| 22:25.57 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk |
| 22:26.02 | hippieindamakin8 | i ll chk them |
| 22:26.54 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brl what are the times u are generally on ? |
| 22:28.14 | brlcad | i'm generally on most times of day night, but usually easier to talk to around 2000-0800 UTC |
| 22:28.35 | brlcad | the dev mailing list also works |
| 22:28.56 | brlcad | though I prefer irc if we're going to have "a discussion" |
| 22:29.24 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya.. i shall get back to u.. i just started going through the codes... |
| 22:29.41 | hippieindamakin8 | and i am sleepy at the same time :P |
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| 22:30.43 | hippieindamakin8 | where are u based ? |
| 22:30.59 | brlcad | EST (east coast US) |
| 22:31.00 | brlcad | you? |
| 22:31.13 | hippieindamakin8 | INDIA |
| 22:31.23 | brlcad | were you the one that posted that (bad) message to discuss? :) |
| 22:31.49 | brlcad | what's your utc offset? |
| 22:31.49 | hippieindamakin8 | which one ? :) i dont remember |
| 22:31.56 | hippieindamakin8 | 5 and half |
| 22:32.04 | brlcad | the one about finding a project |
| 22:32.07 | brlcad | a half? wtf |
| 22:32.19 | hippieindamakin8 | 5:30 hrs |
| 22:32.44 | hippieindamakin8 | nono not me .. i already found the topic of my interests |
| 22:33.17 | brlcad | that is messed up.. half hour offset |
| 22:33.36 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 22:33.47 | brlcad | and I presume you have long-term interest in brl-cad? |
| 22:34.30 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya.. and i wanna pursue academic research too in this particular field |
| 22:34.37 | brlcad | that is one of the primary reasons for gsoc, if you didn't read that ;) |
| 22:34.48 | hippieindamakin8 | hehe |
| 22:35.22 | hippieindamakin8 | i am working under Prof.A.Saxena from Cornell and UPenn |
| 22:36.52 | yukonbob | brlcad: Newfoundland (Canada) also is .5h offset |
| 22:38.38 | louipc | they like to call it "Newfoundland and Labrador" now |
| 22:38.39 | louipc | heh |
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| 23:00.45 | iraytrace | l |
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| 23:06.28 | iraytrace | Sorry, accidentally typing in the wrong winidow |
| 23:11.53 | yukonbob | wonders "what is intaval?" |
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| 00:10.12 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: er, how so? working under him/her in what capacity? you're obviously not at cornell or upenn |
| 00:10.23 | brlcad | yukonbob: that's just whack |
| 00:10.33 | brlcad | intaval is what the note said it is |
| 00:10.42 | brlcad | a format of her majesty's government ;) |
| 00:34.41 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30545 10/brlcad/tags/rel-4-5/mged/dm-glX.c: case-preserving filesystem doesn't like that there is a dm-glX.c and a dm-glx.c .. which are exactly identical except one is missing the history. so remove this stubby one. |
| 00:35.35 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad: i am an undergrad at Indian Institute of Technology |
| 00:35.47 | hippieindamakin8 | as an assistant |
| 00:36.19 | hippieindamakin8 | i meant i am working as an assistant.. (he is a visiting faculty at these places) |
| 00:37.33 | brlcad | okay |
| 00:52.09 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30546 10/brlcad/tags/ctj-4-5-post/mged/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 00:52.43 | poolio | brlcad: has there been any interest in a new UI for brl-cad from potential students? |
| 01:03.06 | brlcad | not yet actually |
| 01:03.20 | brlcad | but I've also not got our announcements out and the big rush hasn't started yet |
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| 01:12.09 | illethal | Hello fellow humans. |
| 01:14.53 | brlcad | hello illethal |
| 01:15.02 | brlcad | human?! pfft |
| 01:15.33 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30547 10/brlcad/tags/ctj-4-5-pre/mged/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 01:25.51 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30548 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-0/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
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| 03:06.41 | brlcad | burps |
| 03:22.31 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30549 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: add new section for 7.12.1 |
| 03:32.16 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30550 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: update from rcs2log to svn2cl |
| 03:33.21 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30551 10/brlcad/trunk/README: bah, update to 7.12.2 |
| 03:33.46 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30552 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_brep.cpp: header cleanup |
| 03:39.34 | poolio | brlcad: woah...I've been digging around for an internship at JHU doing more brain/neuroscience based stuff and came across this: http://www.cisst.org/idea-highlight-B |
| 03:39.38 | poolio | Sounds quite familiar :) |
| 03:46.07 | brlcad | :) |
| 03:52.32 | yukonbob | guesses the test for itcl has changed... |
| 03:54.41 | brlcad | hrm, I don't recall it changing, though the tests for tcl have changed |
| 03:56.30 | yukonbob | is also getting a "present but cannot be compiled" error w/ regex -- and this sounds familiar... |
| 03:58.34 | yukonbob | tcl, tk found alright (if the changes you are talking about are the addition of 8.4, I noticed, and appreciate ;) |
| 03:59.36 | yukonbob | checking for Itcl_Init in -litk33... yes |
| 03:59.44 | yukonbob | :configure: error: *** incrTcl was disabled, yet no usable libitcl system library was found *** |
| 04:00.24 | yukonbob | oh... nm... /me might see issue |
| 04:00.42 | yukonbob | checking for Itcl_Init in -litcl3.3... no |
| 04:12.06 | brlcad | huh |
| 04:12.18 | brlcad | what's config.log say for that test |
| 04:13.55 | yukonbob | is comparing to 7.10.4... 1 sec. |
| 04:14.33 | yukonbob | checking for Itcl_Init in -litcl33... yes <--7.10.4 |
| 04:14.46 | yukonbob | checks log |
| 04:18.16 | yukonbob | http://www.pastebin.ca/951231 |
| 04:18.49 | yukonbob | note -- I'm hacking the build a bit -- I've removed references to all I've got natively installed, as before. |
| 04:20.25 | yukonbob | *"as before" == like I was building 7.10.4, which was successful |
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| 12:30.32 | brlcad | hm |
| 12:31.21 | brlcad | yukonbob: the error is before the | lines |
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| 15:43.23 | yukonbob | ah.... reposted: http://www.pastebin.ca/951639 |
| 15:43.59 | yukonbob | it's obvious why it thinks it's failing -- I can do some legwork and see exactly what's going on... |
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| 17:04.46 | brlcad | that's freaky |
| 17:04.57 | brlcad | a search for Itcl_InitStack yields your pastebin |
| 17:05.13 | brlcad | on the first page |
| 17:10.44 | brlcad | Ah!, I see at least part of the problem |
| 17:12.23 | brlcad | gah, and now found the "real problem" .. someone was copy-paste happy |
| 17:18.38 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30553 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: ouch, someone had a copy-paste boo boo. don't set LIBITCL during the LIBITK tests... |
| 17:19.02 | brlcad | yukonbob: see if that fixes it |
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| 19:42.27 | *** join/#brlcad Gabi (n=gabi@201-213-197-242.net.prima.net.ar) | |
| 19:47.03 | Gabi | hello |
| 19:47.50 | Gabi | Can someone uses brlcad to make plans? |
| 19:56.15 | brlcad | Gabi: it depends what kind of plans and what workflow you have in mind |
| 19:56.33 | brlcad | it can easily generate hidden line drawings that can be used to make plans |
| 19:58.56 | Gabi | Is CAD for use on Linux, but not how to use Brlcad or if I will serve |
| 20:00.19 | Gabi | I do not understand referred to with hidden line drawings |
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| 21:15.50 | alex_joni | I think Gabi referred to 2d schematics |
| 21:27.03 | yukonbob | returns from walk, see note from brlcad... |
| 21:27.15 | yukonbob | q: is the src updated, or should I patch via svn? |
| 21:27.47 | yukonbob | *src tarball on sourceforge |
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| 22:08.37 | yukonbob | grabs latest svn, gets ready to test |
| 23:04.59 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah, source tarballs are never updated unless the problem is found immediately after upload (before the e-mail is sent) |
| 23:05.22 | brlcad | should be able to get just configure.ac from svn, the patch is pretty small |
| 23:06.08 | brlcad | Gabi: I mean something like this: http://brlcad.org/tmp/extractor.png |
| 23:25.08 | Gabi | alex_joni and brlcad, I need to draw planes in 2d as autocad |
| 23:38.38 | brlcad | ah, from a modeling perspective, that would be our "sketch" primitive |
| 23:38.49 | brlcad | brl-cad does not provide strong drafting facilities |
| 23:39.04 | brlcad | we're a solid modeling system, so 3D is the primary modeling approach |
| 23:39.09 | brlcad | not 2D techniques |
| 23:39.32 | brlcad | you can do them, make 2D sketches and extrude them, but it's not at all like what you're probably used to with autocad |
| 23:40.47 | Gabi | OK, thanks. Do you know a program for 2d linux I can use? |
| 23:42.00 | brlcad | qcad is probably closer to what you're thinking of |
| 23:42.38 | brlcad | other than them and brl-cad, there's really not another option |
| 23:54.49 | brlcad | almost gets gallery integrated into drupal .. but gives up for today |
| 23:55.22 | brlcad | rather .. it does actually display the gallery in drupal now nicely, but the rewrites apparently aren't set up right |
| 23:55.41 | brlcad | also cannot for the life of me seem to get captchas working with the contact module |
| 00:04.44 | Gabi | Qcad is very basic, it is almost preferable to draw by hand. Thanks. |
| 00:05.43 | brlcad | CAD is an area of open source that doesn't receive enough developer attention |
| 00:06.59 | brlcad | we do what we can but new developers are really what is needed, if you know any ;) |
| 00:10.13 | Gabi | If I come to know one, you notice. I do not understand why not make Inkscape in a CAD, you felta very little. |
| 00:14.29 | hippieindamakin8 | i am interested in it sean |
| 00:15.45 | brlcad | well, I'd say that's partly because for drafting (CAD != just drafting), Inkscape has and does lots of things that you absolutely don't want to allow |
| 00:16.18 | brlcad | and doesn't provide the most important things that you do want to allow easily (precision inputs, connectivity constraints, 3D orientations, etc) |
| 00:16.34 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: interested in what exactly? :) |
| 00:17.00 | hippieindamakin8 | hey about inkscape.. it doesnt do all that cad softwares dp |
| 00:17.02 | hippieindamakin8 | *do |
| 00:17.32 | hippieindamakin8 | it is a more advanced paint tool as i feel |
| 00:18.03 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 00:18.25 | brlcad | now what inkscape does do great is the 2D input controls and object management |
| 00:18.33 | brlcad | but that's about as far as it's utility goes |
| 00:18.48 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Sean i dint understand the point where u said..undetermined calcultaions |
| 00:19.09 | hippieindamakin8 | the basics of brlcad are CSGs :) |
| 00:19.21 | hippieindamakin8 | atleast that is wat i read |
| 00:19.56 | Gabi | I know that architects draw any technical documentation of a building with corel draw. There is no shortage of so many things to be a inkscape CAD |
| 00:23.10 | brlcad | just because there are plenty of people that do use the wrong tool due to lack of better options doesn't necessarily make it a good tool |
| 00:24.18 | brlcad | and different designers have entirely different requirements -- architecture in particular is usually just "instructions" instead of being a steadfast representation being sent to a device that will autocreate it, for example |
| 00:24.58 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: I'm not sure what you're referring to |
| 00:25.19 | brlcad | brl-cad's heritage is in CSG, but we're becoming more and more hybrid too |
| 00:25.25 | hippieindamakin8 | the problem titled "constraints and parametrics" |
| 00:25.30 | brlcad | okay |
| 00:25.35 | brlcad | what about it? |
| 00:25.57 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:26.04 | hippieindamakin8 | *calculations |
| 00:27.43 | Gabi | I am going to dinner. Greetings. |
| 00:27.52 | brlcad | cheers Gabi |
| 00:27.54 | hippieindamakin8 | but basically i am interested in implementing a OO geometry engine |
| 00:28.04 | hippieindamakin8 | and Universal geometry engine |
| 00:28.19 | hippieindamakin8 | i wish u all a Good Friday :) |
| 00:28.32 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: constraints and parametrics both involve the ability to specify equations for parameters instead of values |
| 00:28.43 | brlcad | those are "undetermined", they have to be evaluated/solved |
| 00:29.25 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. the entire system is a set of equations in terms of parameters and the equations are to be solved for the constraints |
| 00:29.49 | brlcad | for example, I create a sphere fixed at 0,0,0 .. then I create another sphere but instead of positioning the sphere, I merely specify that it must be tangent and must have x=y=0 |
| 00:29.53 | hippieindamakin8 | in the example tangency is one of the conditions to solve |
| 00:30.29 | hippieindamakin8 | k :) thanks |
| 00:30.30 | brlcad | in that example, there are only two tangency solutions (on the z axis) |
| 00:30.37 | hippieindamakin8 | one on either side |
| 00:30.44 | brlcad | exactly |
| 00:31.20 | hippieindamakin8 | does it choose which side ? |
| 00:31.35 | hippieindamakin8 | ofcourse another condition about z is required |
| 00:31.46 | brlcad | 0, 0, R1 +- (R2/2) |
| 00:32.05 | brlcad | it's not that it has to pick, it has to know the possible solutions |
| 00:32.21 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. |
| 00:32.29 | brlcad | it only needs more conditions if you want to fully constrain |
| 00:32.43 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
| 00:33.04 | hippieindamakin8 | is the entire software coded in C ? |
| 00:33.17 | hippieindamakin8 | and tcl/tk for GUIs and stuff |
| 00:42.11 | brlcad | predominantly in C, yes |
| 00:42.21 | brlcad | most of the BREP work being added is being done in C++ |
| 00:42.33 | brlcad | tcl/tk for the mged and archer guis |
| 00:43.10 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: are you at all familiar with another geometry engine APIs? granite or acis for example |
| 00:43.17 | hippieindamakin8 | no.. |
| 00:43.27 | brlcad | k, just wondering |
| 00:43.47 | hippieindamakin8 | just reading upon these apis |
| 00:44.25 | hippieindamakin8 | i heard about JAVA 3d |
| 00:44.49 | hippieindamakin8 | but never used it |
| 00:49.35 | brlcad | yeah.. not relevant ;) |
| 00:49.49 | hippieindamakin8 | ya got it :P |
| 00:50.24 | brlcad | you should take a look at the jbrlcad source module |
| 00:50.34 | hippieindamakin8 | k sure |
| 00:50.35 | brlcad | there's a start of a new OO layer in there for Java that is really pretty nice |
| 00:50.46 | hippieindamakin8 | i ll chk it.. |
| 00:50.51 | brlcad | even for C++, that same layout is probably a very good fit for what we need |
| 00:51.01 | brlcad | as it's based on our current C API features |
| 00:51.23 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk |
| 00:54.32 | brlcad | doing something with swig where both Java and C++ are generated automatically would probably be ideal for long term mainenance |
| 00:54.38 | brlcad | presuming it could be set up cleanly |
| 00:54.50 | brlcad | otherwise there's really good justifications to work on either |
| 00:56.46 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 00:58.27 | hippieindamakin8 | i am more used to C++ to do anything :) |
| 01:48.31 | *** part/#brlcad Gabi (n=gabi@201-213-197-242.net.prima.net.ar) | |
| 02:02.57 | yukonbob | brlcad: that update to configure.ac doesn't seem to work |
| 02:20.00 | brlcad | hum |
| 02:20.03 | brlcad | howso? |
| 02:20.11 | brlcad | same error, different error? |
| 02:40.28 | poolio | my x300 is shipping :D |
| 02:40.59 | poolio | (offtopic,unrelated, but I'm giddy) |
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| 03:21.08 | brlcad | cool, yay for ultralight |
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| 05:00.42 | starseeker | decides he's had enough math for one day... |
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| 06:26.24 | iraytrace | some serious double-take |
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| 09:01.33 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/d/node/22 |
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| 12:00.52 | ``Erik_ | do/blah |
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| 16:06.02 | yukonbob | looks into potential autogen.sh issue |
| 16:09.00 | yukonbob | (at least in his env... the only chages I see are the version numbers, and some whitespace correction @ EOL) |
| 16:28.31 | yukonbob | hrmm... autoreconf & aclocal are failing me... |
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| 01:12.07 | brlcad | updates the ideas list http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Project_Ideas |
| 01:12.20 | brlcad | it's closer to a "final initial" form now |
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| 04:01.54 | hippieindamakin8 | nice list man |
| 04:02.47 | brlcad | coming together bit by bit |
| 04:03.01 | yukonbob | looks |
| 04:07.34 | yukonbob | brlcad: interested in my latest build issues, or should I plug away solo? |
| 04:10.07 | yukonbob | http://pastebin.ca/953538 |
| 04:22.06 | yukonbob | that test code needs an "#include <stdlib.h>" for exit() |
| 05:09.24 | yukonbob | (/me assumes introduced at 30538, configure.ac)? But seems completely ac-generated... wft? |
| 05:09.30 | yukonbob | *wtf |
| 05:10.17 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah weird |
| 05:10.43 | brlcad | the sanity check is missing a header it seems .. that C mode is fine with but C++ mode is adament about |
| 05:11.00 | brlcad | there was a new C++ mode sanity check added just a couple days ago (right after 7.12.0 |
| 05:12.34 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30554 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/compiler.m4: bah, need stdlib.h for exit().. C++ sanity check seems insistent on needing it. |
| 05:12.42 | yukonbob | ya -- is BC_SANITY_CHECK a builtin, or user-supplied |
| 05:13.29 | brlcad | all BC_'s are brl-cad macros in m4/ |
| 05:13.33 | yukonbob | whatever you just modded could stand to lose stdio, I believe, too -- probably somebody's finger-memory got the best of them at that point.. |
| 05:13.44 | brlcad | true |
| 05:13.56 | brlcad | stdio was providing exit() on older glibc |
| 05:14.46 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30555 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/compiler.m4: don't need stdio.h |
| 05:14.47 | yukonbob | doesn't remember that; if it does/did, so be it, but that won't matter on *BSD, etc. They'll need stdlib |
| 05:15.39 | yukonbob | might end up learning autotools if he's not careful here |
| 05:16.46 | yukonbob | does my commit-bit extend to code as well, or strictly doc? |
| 05:17.00 | brlcad | to anything |
| 05:17.01 | yukonbob | hasn't tried, and we've not talked about this |
| 05:17.32 | brlcad | don't worry about mixing up other stuff, dive right in ;) |
| 05:19.07 | yukonbob | alright; I'm still getting that itcl error that was the initial issue, but working on other stuff too (like the above c++); autogen.sh isn't liking my build env (pkgsrc), but doesn't mind a by-hand run from the shell; I'll explore that too -- (autogen itself hasn't changed, but it must include some changed files, because it used to work np) |
| 05:19.14 | brlcad | all commits are reviewed anyways and announced here so it's easy enough to see what's going on |
| 05:19.43 | yukonbob | nods |
| 05:19.46 | brlcad | does "sh autogen.sh -v" show anything? |
| 05:21.11 | yukonbob | can check; in the "environment" build, it chokes on autoreconf, then tries it's "manual config" (or whatever) and chokes on that, too. |
| 05:21.44 | yukonbob | by-hand, everything works fine... which is strange to me, but I'll track down what the offending difference is... |
| 05:22.13 | brlcad | -v will show the exact commands it's trying to run |
| 05:22.29 | yukonbob | nods, add to wrapping-Makefile |
| 05:22.50 | yukonbob | *adds |
| 05:23.23 | brlcad | which is a version check for autoconf, automake, and libtool .. then something like "autoreconf -v -i -s" .. and then individual steps if that fails |
| 05:24.22 | yukonbob | _has_ autoreconf, and even supplied it directly via the AUTORECONF env var, but no dice |
| 05:25.09 | yukonbob | runs build |
| 05:25.10 | brlcad | autoreconf can fail for lots of reasons |
| 05:25.46 | brlcad | that's one of many reasons why autogen.sh exists in the first place |
| 05:25.59 | yukonbob | out of comlete curiousity, how much effort do you think it'd take to replace auto* w/ cmake (for example) and what would keep one from doing that, besides the manpower? |
| 05:26.09 | yukonbob | *complete |
| 05:27.07 | brlcad | manpower to replicate the entire build system faithfully, I'd expect it'd take many months |
| 05:27.16 | brlcad | of non-stop effort |
| 05:27.29 | yukonbob | ! |
| 05:28.13 | brlcad | the conversion to autotools took a long time, about that long, and there wasn't really any complicated road blocks |
| 05:28.35 | yukonbob | everybody likes to complain about "autohell"; what's your take on it? |
| 05:28.42 | brlcad | it just takes a lot of work to specify the build rules for 400+ binary targets, the 24 or so libs, and various types of data files and subdependencies |
| 05:30.31 | brlcad | autohell is the way it is for many reasons |
| 05:31.27 | brlcad | it does what it does the way it does it in order to provide strict portability constraints (that really cannot be easily provided most any other way without adding dependencies) |
| 05:32.52 | yukonbob | have you ever played w/ scons (python), or cmake? |
| 05:32.58 | brlcad | yep |
| 05:34.16 | brlcad | i actually rather like cmake, their biggest claim to awesomeness is thier ability to export the various build systems (including msvc files) from one description |
| 05:34.50 | brlcad | scons is nice for small code sets but *seriously* starts to fall apart on large complex build systems -- you basically end up reimplementing autoconf |
| 05:35.16 | yukonbob | ya -- /me is ready to buy the cmake manual (just released (new version)) and check it out... |
| 05:37.29 | brlcad | like a lot of tools though, autotools really do work (and work well once you get over the learning curve) and it really starts to make sense why things are the way they are |
| 05:38.31 | brlcad | their biggest downfall has been practical usability problems (horrible error messages, bad docs, elitist responses to usability) |
| 05:39.17 | yukonbob | speaking of docs, can you recommend any? The GNU-supplied stuff isn't my cup of tea. |
| 05:44.30 | brlcad | I actually recommend just reading existing build files for projects that use the autotools -- it's fairly straight-forward seeing it in other apps as there are really only two or three files types involved |
| 05:44.35 | brlcad | the configure.ac and the Makefile.am files |
| 05:45.38 | brlcad | the Makefile.am files don't really get *any* simpler in any of the autotools/cmake/ant/scons/whatever build systems as it's just a list of targets, sets of files, and how those sets of files relate to those targets |
| 05:47.49 | brlcad | the build/feature/header tests and project identification are somewhat tricky in all the systems to replicate -- that's where configure.ac comes into play for the autotools |
| 05:48.55 | brlcad | which is just shell syntax with macros |
| 05:49.22 | yukonbob | nods -- will probably start poking this stuff in BRLCAD, and probably pick your brain too, where possible ;) |
| 05:49.32 | brlcad | feel free to |
| 05:50.40 | brlcad | I've read the GNU book and the auto* manuals, but I really never learned it until I put it to use |
| 05:51.32 | brlcad | the tools are overly flexible, making it really complicated to document since you can approach things in a variety of ways (even though 90% of projects all do it about the same) |
| 05:52.01 | yukonbob | that might be my problem -- the gnu manuals are drier than toast (and technical manuals don't have to be that way); maybe those in conjunction w/ some interesting "real life" work will click |
| 05:52.29 | brlcad | in hindsight after you've put it to use, it does all make sense |
| 05:52.36 | brlcad | even becomes somewhat overly obvious |
| 05:52.46 | brlcad | but is totally opaque until you put it to use |
| 05:56.38 | yukonbob | gets ready for sleep |
| 05:56.38 | brlcad | usually much more effective to just look at a project that is already set up (like brl-cad or something even more simple) and follow their example |
| 05:56.54 | yukonbob | nice chatting again, brlcad; probably talk tmo, or soon at least. |
| 05:56.56 | yukonbob | :) |
| 05:57.00 | brlcad | aiight |
| 05:57.01 | brlcad | cheers |
| 06:47.50 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30556 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: the dutch cad4linux site seems to be now defunct |
| 07:10.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30557 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: add devmaster to the notification list |
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| 09:00.44 | brlcad | uploads some new images to the gallery |
| 09:43.46 | brlcad | ensleeps |
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| 16:14.45 | brlcad | time for a sunday feast! |
| 16:36.04 | yukonbob | morning brlcad... happy Easter |
| 16:37.06 | poolio | happy purim :) |
| 16:37.30 | yukonbob | looks up purim |
| 16:46.01 | brlcad | likewise |
| 16:46.33 | brlcad | bah, can't find the original bradley rendering... |
| 17:10.30 | yukonbob | would love to see that |
| 17:17.23 | yukonbob | http://my.brlcad.org/gallery/gallery/s/historic/particles.jpg.html |
| 17:18.03 | yukonbob | ^-- what is this, and it reminds me of a question I've had for a while: what's the 'atom' for? |
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| 17:28.11 | brlcad | frankly I don't know really :) the image is an old one from bill laut .. don't know what he used it for, I'd have to ask him |
| 17:28.27 | brlcad | as for the atom? which/what atom? |
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| 17:35.53 | brlcad | few more images uploaded |
| 17:39.02 | yukonbob | is sure he's seen an "atom" primitive |
| 17:39.45 | yukonbob | also doesn't have a copy of BRL-CAD installed atm, and is heading out for easter brunch... chat later cadheads |
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| 21:56.20 | yukonbob | http://pastebin.ca/954422 |
| 21:56.34 | yukonbob | ^--- build failure at g-3dm |
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| 22:12.44 | yukonbob | traces to src/conf/.deps/g-3dm.Po... |
| 22:13.03 | yukonbob | ...or does he? |
| 22:17.28 | yukonbob | wonders if 3dm is only in development... |
| 22:19.02 | yukonbob | looks like g-3dm isn't ready, but it included (erroneosly) in build... |
| 22:19.31 | yukonbob | *erroneously |
| 22:26.51 | yukonbob | puts this on hold -- will return, test idea, and commit fix (if found) later. |
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| 00:44.43 | yukonbob | rebuilds, observes |
| 00:59.52 | starseeker | is liking the awesomness that is now the Gallery |
| 01:00.02 | starseeker | awesomeness rather |
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| 01:04.31 | yukonbob | likes the pics, but is missing a nice way to navigate (didn't it used to be (day or two ago) easier?) |
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| 03:03.36 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list | |
| 05:15.36 | brlcad | Axman6: still not yet -- there's not been an X11 update from Apple yet afaik |
| 05:15.44 | brlcad | and the bug is *in* X11 |
| 05:16.54 | brlcad | yukonbob: g-3dm was just added on friday |
| 05:18.57 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30558 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/3dm-g.cpp: we're no longer including authorship in source files (put into docs instead), and don't use machine.h |
| 05:23.33 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30559 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/Makefile.am: actually, there is no g-3dm. if there were, it'd probably be in the 3dm dir anyways. SUBDIRS should be sorted by alpha unless there is a dependency. |
| 05:24.01 | brlcad | that should fix it, he added a bad Makefile.am -- specified a g-3dm but never added the files for it |
| 05:24.20 | brlcad | so yeah, you had the right idea spot-on |
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| 13:07.06 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03dgodbey * r30560 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/3dm-g.cpp: Add getopt loop and trap ON_Curve, ON_Surface, and ON_Mesh. |
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| 16:17.58 | brlcad | hello pacman_87 |
| 16:22.22 | pacman_87 | hi brlcad |
| 16:23.57 | brlcad | recalls playing pacman back in '87 |
| 16:24.32 | yukonbob | pokes in |
| 16:26.26 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 16:26.43 | brlcad | yukonbob: did you get that verbose autogen output? |
| 16:27.23 | yukonbob | ya -- and now I'm failing on libtclcad.so (in mged) having undfined ref. to Blt_Init |
| 16:28.18 | yukonbob | the reconf fails, but the piece-by-piece config seems to work; now I'm into compiler errors |
| 16:30.34 | yukonbob | (blt == own installation, and I've gone so far as to rename src/other/blt to src/other/_blt in the distribution to make sure I'm not cross-contaminating (despite also supplying --disable-blt-build) |
| 16:30.38 | yukonbob | ) |
| 16:32.19 | brlcad | ah, so autogen.sh actually gets past the problem and finished |
| 16:32.45 | brlcad | yeah, I've done zero testing with a system-installed blt |
| 16:32.52 | yukonbob | it does now -- using svn co -- and I'll check if I patched |
| 16:33.09 | yukonbob | :) -- well, I guess I'll do that testing |
| 16:34.07 | yukonbob | updates to latest source (I had the references to g-3dm removed in my local copy, but not committed) |
| 16:41.48 | brlcad | i fixed that last night |
| 16:42.02 | brlcad | if you update it should merge in, maybe get a conflict |
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| 17:31.47 | cosurgi | Hi is GSoC participation limited for students only? |
| 17:33.00 | cosurgi | thinks "OpenGL GUI Framework", but he is a post-doc with little time, not a student that has summer holidays. |
| 17:51.57 | brlcad | cosurgi: yeah, GSoC is only for students (but students of almost any age and type) |
| 17:52.28 | brlcad | it's meant to be treated as a full-time job for the compensation, otherwise there's nothing to stop anyone from working on any of the project ideas ;) |
| 17:52.29 | cosurgi | is there any quick-start guide? I just installed the .deb package, and I don't know what to type inside brlterm to get anything drawn. |
| 17:52.50 | brlcad | you ran mged? |
| 17:53.09 | cosurgi | no.. brlterm |
| 17:53.24 | brlcad | ah, something the debian maintainer put together |
| 17:53.48 | brlcad | brl-cad has hundreds of binaries, but the current GUI (the one in most of the screenshots) is mged |
| 17:54.07 | brlcad | should be able to just type "mged" to start it up |
| 17:54.10 | cosurgi | yes. So .deb it's not supposed to work? |
| 17:54.15 | brlcad | it should work |
| 17:54.21 | brlcad | it's a bit old, but it should work |
| 17:54.33 | cosurgi | unfortunately command not found. I'm checking.... |
| 17:54.40 | brlcad | ah |
| 17:54.45 | brlcad | see if it installed into /usr/brlcad |
| 17:54.50 | brlcad | if so, "/usr/brlcad/bin/mged" |
| 17:55.08 | brlcad | maybe he wrapped it in mged.sh |
| 17:56.24 | cosurgi | ok... a bit better, mged is there, in /usr/brlcad/bin/ |
| 17:56.34 | cosurgi | but lots of errors :-) |
| 17:56.40 | cosurgi | ./mged: /lib/tls/i686/cmov/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.4' not found (required by /usr/brlcad/lib/libdm.so.19) |
| 17:56.54 | cosurgi | I suppose I need to build from source |
| 17:57.02 | brlcad | sounds like the wrapper is mucking with the ld_library_path |
| 17:57.04 | brlcad | try mged.sh |
| 17:57.57 | brlcad | or build from source, that may be easier regardless :) |
| 17:58.07 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 17:58.07 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 17:58.20 | cosurgi | ok. So I will use SVN :) |
| 17:58.32 | cosurgi | mged.sh apparently is not present here :) |
| 17:58.55 | brlcad | ah, well then I don't know what the hell the debian maintainer did ;) |
| 17:59.09 | cosurgi | nevermind. let's use SVN :) |
| 17:59.30 | brlcad | you've been here before, haven't you? |
| 17:59.36 | brlcad | your name is really familiar |
| 17:59.56 | cosurgi | no, never. Or can't remember - at least not on this irc channel |
| 18:00.02 | brlcad | huh |
| 18:00.09 | brlcad | maybe another channel |
| 18:00.11 | cosurgi | but I've been more or less active in cad linux related stuff |
| 18:00.17 | cosurgi | for 5 years or more |
| 18:00.46 | brlcad | ah, maybe on the mailing list then |
| 18:00.48 | cosurgi | I just seen GSoC announcement on cad-linux mailing list, and I think that maybe finally we will have some good CAD app |
| 18:01.06 | alex_joni | hmm, that didn't came across very nicely :) |
| 18:01.35 | alex_joni | s/came/come/ |
| 18:01.41 | brlcad | yeah, I'm really hoping we can get some interest and activity sparked |
| 18:01.46 | cosurgi | that statement "finally we will have some good CAD app" ? :-) |
| 18:02.13 | alex_joni | cosurgi: yeah :P |
| 18:02.15 | brlcad | brl-cad is by far the farthest along, more than 400 years effort into it, but we need a new UI and fully integrated brep support |
| 18:02.39 | alex_joni | brlcad: when things settle down a bit, I'll have to bug you about some things |
| 18:03.03 | brlcad | alex_joni: go right ahead, any time |
| 18:03.41 | alex_joni | brlcad: still the old thing that's on my mind.. getting from a .obj (or some other face-based version) to a solid |
| 18:03.48 | brlcad | cosurgi: you should be able to compile with: sh autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized && make && sudo make install |
| 18:04.11 | yukonbob | brlcad: do you know what blt facilities are used in libtclcad? |
| 18:04.20 | cosurgi | well, that's why I have some hope. There have been many efforts in the past. All died due to simple thing: no money cannot motivate enough to write CAD app - it's darn too big for single-person effort. |
| 18:04.29 | brlcad | you can test the compile with "make test" and "make benchmark", and post install with just "/usr/brlcad/bin/benchmark" |
| 18:05.07 | cosurgi | in fact IMHO I would be a good candidate to write GUI, but I have too little time :( |
| 18:05.28 | cosurgi | I'm paid to develop another GPLed opensource app |
| 18:05.44 | brlcad | cosurgi: it really is .. I chuckle every time I see someone new announce their new little project |
| 18:05.45 | alex_joni | brlcad: actually I would be thrilled if I could do obj (or stl or whatever) -> U3D (inside a pdf preferably) |
| 18:06.13 | alex_joni | cosurgi: otoh, there are countless *big* opensource projects without special foundings |
| 18:06.21 | brlcad | yukonbob: I believe it calls Blt_Init to have btclsh/bwish auto-load blt |
| 18:06.27 | alex_joni | maybe countless is wishful thinking ;) |
| 18:06.32 | brlcad | src/libtclcad/tclcadAutoPath.c iirc |
| 18:06.33 | yukonbob | nods |
| 18:07.38 | cosurgi | alex_joni: yes, countless. But not related to CAD for simple reason - developers like to scratch their itch for free. That meands writing apps related to developing. |
| 18:07.39 | brlcad | cosurgi: fortunately, brl-cad is not only open source, but development is also still funded so we're not going away anytime soon |
| 18:08.26 | cosurgi | good news, I didn't know that :-) |
| 18:09.01 | cosurgi | brlcad: do youhave any vision about that GUI? |
| 18:09.04 | brlcad | yeah, it's been actively maintained and improved for more than 20 years now -- only opensourced for the last couple |
| 18:09.05 | yukonbob | cosurgi: there's lots of "good news" associated w/ BRL-CAD |
| 18:10.30 | alex_joni | well, from what I saw there are still a couple of CAD programs.. |
| 18:10.43 | alex_joni | but if you move over to CAM, it rapidly changes to non-existant :) |
| 18:10.54 | brlcad | cosurgi: yes, I've got some architecture concepts to upload to the site soon, but the basic idea is a frontend/backend architecture where the gui frontend talks to the backend geometry engine |
| 18:11.30 | brlcad | the gui itself being obviously a 3d framework, much more of an "integrated unified environment" than mged, plugin-based architecture |
| 18:12.29 | cosurgi | I'm interested in the frontend (what the user sees). I'm sure that backend and communication is pretty clear for you. |
| 18:12.33 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30561 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-1/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 18:12.37 | brlcad | yeah |
| 18:13.16 | brlcad | the backend is actually what I care about most at this point as there's still quite a bit that *has* to happen to make arbitrary opengl shaded displays trivial |
| 18:13.43 | cosurgi | well ok. To reveal my cards quickly: I've 14 year AutoCAD experience and 15 years C++ experience. So obviously I'd go in the autocad direction when taling about autocad. |
| 18:14.07 | cosurgi | s/taling about autocad/taling about user frontend/ |
| 18:14.13 | cosurgi | heh, Freud typo :-) |
| 18:14.20 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:14.29 | brlcad | that's pretty nice, glad to hear it actually |
| 18:14.53 | cosurgi | And I deleted windows partition in 1999 and since then I used autocad only in vmware :-> |
| 18:15.12 | brlcad | autocad brings some of the most "unique" aspects to the CAD domains, with their focus on 2D approaches for drafting and design purposes |
| 18:16.04 | alex_joni | brlcad: ever tried Alibre? |
| 18:16.31 | brlcad | i'd certainly not call myself an expert in any of the major cad systems, just familiar with many/most of them -- more inclined to just get into the code and work on what modelers intrinsicly need (which is a hell of a lot) |
| 18:17.21 | cosurgi | brlcad: yes, like .xy filters, trim, extend etc, which make 2D draft really quick. And then - natural going 3D with elev, thickness, extrude, etc |
| 18:17.23 | brlcad | alex_joni: I can't say that I have used xpress, but have heard of it |
| 18:18.46 | brlcad | admits to be more appreciative of the solid modeling and 3d modeling approaches |
| 18:19.02 | alex_joni | brlcad: I use xpress once in a while, and it's quite nice |
| 18:19.10 | alex_joni | (especially the free part) |
| 18:19.33 | brlcad | yeah, but still commercial closed product |
| 18:19.41 | brlcad | i care about what we can do in the open source domain |
| 18:19.42 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:19.53 | cosurgi | ..ok svn downloaded, lets try to compile. |
| 18:20.32 | alex_joni | brlcad: I'm sure BRL-CAD can do much more, yet atm it has a steeper learning curve |
| 18:20.35 | alex_joni | imo |
| 18:20.42 | brlcad | it does, much much steeper |
| 18:20.51 | brlcad | that's part of the whole "we need a new gui" |
| 18:20.52 | cosurgi | brlcad: simple questions, do you have line, polyline, circle, arc, ellipse, spline and regions? |
| 18:21.22 | brlcad | cosurgi: yes |
| 18:21.39 | brlcad | we have a 2D "sketch" primitive that can contain any/all of those |
| 18:22.11 | brlcad | the interface in mged to deal with them is exceptionally bad, as it was mostly meant as a basic editing means for imported geometries |
| 18:22.18 | brlcad | but support for them is there now |
| 18:22.21 | cosurgi | brlcad: and does solid modelling build on top of them? (eg. by extruding regions?) |
| 18:22.23 | brlcad | and you can apply an extrude and voila |
| 18:22.49 | cosurgi | or solid modelling is done in different way? |
| 18:22.51 | brlcad | still don't have revolutions or sweeps (they're on the gsoc list) of those, but you can extrude |
| 18:24.04 | alex_joni | usually extruding and cutting |
| 18:24.51 | brlcad | what presently doesn't come across at all from the 2D models are the drafting aspects that have nothing directly to due with solid geometry and spatial occupancy |
| 18:25.15 | brlcad | e.g. an attribute that something is a "dashed line" for example, is purely a drafting / display detail |
| 18:25.29 | brlcad | so those aren't presently captured/stored |
| 18:25.48 | cosurgi | ok. Not tragic :) |
| 18:26.14 | alex_joni | how about "parametric" aspects? |
| 18:26.32 | alex_joni | can you go back to 2d sketch and change some sizes, and regenerate? |
| 18:27.15 | cosurgi | do you have layers similar to autocad layers? (1 freeze layer; 2 on/off; 3 layer linetypes; 4 layer line thickness; 5 layer colors; 6 layer names) |
| 18:27.34 | brlcad | it's not quite the same as in autocad in that you have to "regenerate" -- a 3D object based off a 2D sketch is tightly coupled to that 2D representation |
| 18:27.49 | brlcad | if you change the 2D, the 3D is simultaneously modified |
| 18:27.55 | brlcad | no layers |
| 18:27.58 | brlcad | layers would be nice |
| 18:28.33 | cosurgi | brlcad: are layers planned in the future, or this would require some glbal reorganization of the code/framework? |
| 18:28.35 | brlcad | we do have groupings, though .. you could implement layers with groups and attributes, but not something we try to deal with at the moment |
| 18:28.55 | cosurgi | ok. I'm asking to get a global picture :) |
| 18:29.18 | brlcad | sure, ask as much as you can soak up ;) |
| 18:29.29 | cosurgi | thanks :-) |
| 18:30.09 | brlcad | the big effort going on right now is bidirectional brep support |
| 18:30.10 | cosurgi | so another basic question: how the GUI frontent will communicate with brlcad? (network socket? calling another binary? shared memory?) |
| 18:30.36 | cosurgi | (it's compiling now) |
| 18:30.46 | brlcad | so you can go between implicit and explicit representations more painlessly (which also gives us evaluated CSG for opengl display more easily) |
| 18:31.38 | brlcad | idea for now is a socket operation, so local port or network connection for starters |
| 18:32.10 | cosurgi | ok. sounds good |
| 18:32.19 | brlcad | there's nothing that would prevent the API from binding directly to the library api either, but it's a nice way to make sure there's a clean separate of gui and engine |
| 18:32.33 | cosurgi | yeah, I agree with that |
| 18:33.03 | cosurgi | would it allow several people to work on the same drawing by talking to the same socket? |
| 18:33.12 | brlcad | yup! |
| 18:33.45 | cosurgi | heh :) |
| 18:33.47 | brlcad | allows multi-model repositories to be set up (e.g. per org/user) |
| 18:34.01 | brlcad | so you can have simultaneous multiuser editing |
| 18:34.19 | cosurgi | ok, another simple question - what externali libraries does brlcad use? (eg. boost?) |
| 18:34.58 | brlcad | historic design philosophy is no *required* external dependencies, so everything you need is actually in that checkout |
| 18:35.14 | brlcad | src/other has the external dependencies that are desired/used |
| 18:35.18 | cosurgi | I was expecting that. A 20 year old project had to be independent :) |
| 18:35.46 | brlcad | tcl/tk is the big one, just about everything else is extracted into libs |
| 18:36.12 | brlcad | there are a whole slew of libs I'd love to use for the new gui, just a matter of careful selection and keeping track of the dependencies that become implied |
| 18:36.59 | brlcad | i.e. their long-term "cost" has to be considered from a maintenance perspective, but there's no reason we can't add new deps if they can be managed easily |
| 18:38.28 | cosurgi | OK. for the GUI I highly recommend QT |
| 18:38.37 | brlcad | for the 3D gui, using an existing display engine is pretty much required -- there's more than enough to code without trying to take on coding/maintaining our own infrastructure as well any more than we have to |
| 18:38.51 | cosurgi | gtk is total mess, really. |
| 18:39.04 | brlcad | oh, yeah, I know ... |
| 18:39.11 | brlcad | gtk is dependency hell |
| 18:39.21 | brlcad | about as bad as it gets really |
| 18:39.37 | brlcad | aside from the api limitations |
| 18:39.49 | cosurgi | I tried both GTK and QT. Finally I used QT and 4.0 is impressive C++ masterpiece. For GL I'm using qglviewer so I'd recommend it - it's extremly simple. |
| 18:40.40 | brlcad | the biggest "problem" with Qt that I was reminded of just last week ... is the license |
| 18:40.52 | brlcad | GPL can be a problem for us |
| 18:40.58 | cosurgi | that's the app I'm developing: http://yade.wikia.com/ and there I used qglviewer |
| 18:41.08 | cosurgi | oh... |
| 18:41.14 | brlcad | I'll have to do some serious thinking and planning to get gpl to fly |
| 18:41.39 | brlcad | that's part why we abolished our own use of gpl last year |
| 18:42.40 | brlcad | yade looks pretty nifty :) |
| 18:42.58 | cosurgi | I see. It's up to you :-) Do you have any influence on the brlcad license, or it's in the "upper management" (which gives funding)? |
| 18:43.04 | cosurgi | thanks :) |
| 18:43.28 | brlcad | "yes" |
| 18:44.19 | brlcad | another aspect of the frontend/backend separation, though, is that the frontend could arguably be allowed to be gpl |
| 18:44.22 | brlcad | maybe |
| 18:44.30 | brlcad | it's the backend that absolutely cannot |
| 18:45.12 | cosurgi | In fact I'm not aware of any gui-toolkit which is not GPLed, but I'm debian-linux-centric. And not using QT (in my opinion) would be bad choice. |
| 18:45.13 | brlcad | we hook into many many closed and commercial codes, that would kill our historic user-base and shoot ourselves in the foot |
| 18:46.43 | cosurgi | I see. Heh, talking through netowrk socket shouldn't violate the licence. I can check that with a friend debian developer |
| 18:46.55 | cosurgi | he knows licencing politics quite good |
| 18:46.58 | brlcad | there are some, particularly if you start getting into custom gui toolkits ala gaming industry style custom interfaces |
| 18:47.29 | brlcad | blender, solidworks, etc style interfaces where you do pretty much everything via opengl |
| 18:49.26 | brlcad | not saying that's the way to go, but it's certainly worth considering, especially for advanced interface concepts where standard widgets really don't work well |
| 18:49.30 | cosurgi | yes. Only one simple argument against: they wouldn't attract more developers due to their lack of popularity. (I don't know if one or another is well designed and easy to use) |
| 18:50.37 | brlcad | I've heard both from people interested in the gui |
| 18:50.48 | cosurgi | ok :) |
| 18:50.55 | brlcad | some that would rather see custom, some that would rather use toolkit |
| 18:51.09 | brlcad | think it's heavily tied to what people have tried :) |
| 18:51.18 | cosurgi | of course. |
| 18:51.57 | ``Erik | finally all caught up O.o time to ignore irc for another week :D |
| 18:52.00 | brlcad | I think it'll be heavily dependent on just who steps up to the plate to work on the front-end, who's actually sticking around and getting things done ;) |
| 18:52.06 | brlcad | ``Erik: about time |
| 18:52.09 | brlcad | log in |
| 18:52.11 | brlcad | ;) |
| 18:52.15 | ``Erik | log in to what? |
| 18:52.20 | brlcad | you have mail |
| 18:52.22 | brlcad | from google |
| 18:52.27 | cosurgi | brb |
| 18:52.30 | ``Erik | oh, uh, where? on bz? |
| 18:52.35 | brlcad | beats me where |
| 18:52.46 | brlcad | whatever you gave me for gsoc |
| 18:52.53 | brlcad | should be a google account |
| 18:52.54 | ``Erik | probably my google mail thingy that I haven't looked at in, uh, like 2 years O.o |
| 18:53.50 | cosurgi | back |
| 18:54.34 | cosurgi | ok. I got linker error: ./.libs/libbu.so: undefined reference to `Tcl_AppendElement' |
| 18:54.35 | brlcad | cosurgi: for the gui, I think most users really don't care that much what the gui is done it -- they care about the usabilities and features ;; whether there's anything to be gained developer-wise with qt vs custom vs gtk vs whatever I think really just boils down to taste |
| 18:54.44 | ``Erik | bleh, why do they put legal agreements into undersized scroll boxes? |
| 18:54.46 | cosurgi | and warning: libtcl8.5.so, needed by ./.libs/libbu.so, not found |
| 18:54.54 | brlcad | you pick any of them and you'll likely alienate a substantial developer base regardless |
| 18:55.11 | ``Erik | <3 gtk+, but hasn't looked at qt in a long time |
| 18:55.32 | brlcad | cosurgi: huh, that's really odd .. you used --enable-all on configure? |
| 18:55.36 | cosurgi | and I have only tcl8.4-dev here (debian stable :) |
| 18:55.47 | cosurgi | brlcad: yes |
| 18:55.56 | cosurgi | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:56.16 | cosurgi | should I backport tcl8.5-dev ? |
| 18:56.20 | brlcad | enable-all turns off all external dependencies (other than things like libc, curses, X11 headers, etc |
| 18:56.50 | brlcad | er, turns off linking against them if they're already system-installed (default is auto-detect) |
| 18:56.59 | brlcad | so it shouldn't be using your 8.4 |
| 18:57.06 | brlcad | can you pastebin |
| 18:57.11 | brlcad | the whole error |
| 18:57.20 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 18:58.17 | brlcad | ``Erik: if you're on your mac, you can grab that lower right hand corner of any safaari textbox |
| 18:58.20 | cosurgi | sure http://pastebin.com/d611c2418 |
| 18:58.21 | ``Erik | some of these statements are a little concerning |
| 18:58.39 | ``Erik | firefox... I'm looking at the source, it's a lot more readable |
| 18:58.44 | cosurgi | brlcad: that's the end of the compilation. I can paste ALL if you want. |
| 18:58.52 | brlcad | gah, pastebin.com seems to be blocked from here |
| 18:59.16 | brlcad | cosurgi: can you pastebin it to http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/ |
| 18:59.19 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/ ftw |
| 18:59.34 | brlcad | should add a ref for pastebin.brlcad.org |
| 18:59.41 | ``Erik | we should have cnames for pastebin.brlcad.org, paste.brlcad.org, etc |
| 18:59.43 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:00.01 | ``Erik | great minds think alike, seems the flawed ones do, as well :D *duck* |
| 19:00.03 | brlcad | :) |
| 19:00.45 | cosurgi | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d5ac8be85 |
| 19:01.19 | brlcad | danka! |
| 19:01.32 | brlcad | ahhh |
| 19:01.46 | brlcad | f'ing libtool bustage on debian/ubuntu |
| 19:02.04 | brlcad | there's no -ltcl on the link line |
| 19:02.14 | brlcad | yet there is on the libtool line |
| 19:02.45 | brlcad | (for libbu as a dependency) |
| 19:02.48 | ``Erik | yeah, debian porked that up, I copy the autogen'd files from a sane host (fbsd) when doing something on debian |
| 19:03.11 | cosurgi | I see, so what is the fix? :) |
| 19:03.23 | ``Erik | they tweak it to "optimize" the link line... by something like "s/ .*//" |
| 19:04.19 | brlcad | you can fight your way through it with cflags or try upgrading libtool |
| 19:04.23 | ``Erik | don't use debian? :D or autogen it somewhere else? or install a stock libtool? |
| 19:05.04 | ``Erik | I thought we had -ltcl on the BU line explicitely? |
| 19:05.51 | ``Erik | google has a parent corp? |
| 19:06.01 | brlcad | cosurgi try: make LDFLAGS="-L../../src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -L../../src/other/tk/unix -ltk8.5" |
| 19:06.40 | brlcad | might need to add in -ldl -lm -c -pthread too down the road |
| 19:06.59 | ``Erik | erm, /path/to/brlcad/src/other/tcl/unix would be better, incase you're in src/conv vs src/com/jack for example |
| 19:07.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30562 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-2/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 19:07.24 | hippieindamakin8 | hey cosurgi u still here ? |
| 19:07.40 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: yes, what's up? :) |
| 19:08.00 | brlcad | ah, true dat .. should be the full-path |
| 19:08.02 | hippieindamakin8 | ya man u use qglviewer rt |
| 19:08.13 | cosurgi | wonders why someone needs him, since he just joined the channel ;-) |
| 19:08.21 | hippieindamakin8 | :P |
| 19:08.23 | brlcad | needs cosurgi :) |
| 19:08.33 | brlcad | needs lots of things |
| 19:08.36 | ``Erik | withholds comment |
| 19:08.39 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:08.57 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: yes, qglviewer is nice |
| 19:08.58 | brlcad | you still havent' logged in |
| 19:08.58 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i constantly get an error saying error loading shared libraries |
| 19:09.13 | ``Erik | is reading eula |
| 19:09.13 | hippieindamakin8 | ya it is simple to code :P |
| 19:09.23 | hippieindamakin8 | its really cool |
| 19:09.27 | cosurgi | http://artis.imag.fr/Members/Gilles.Debunne/QGLViewer/index.html |
| 19:10.13 | hippieindamakin8 | k |
| 19:10.48 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: is it about glut, glat, gl or such? |
| 19:11.36 | ``Erik | heh, neat |
| 19:11.37 | hippieindamakin8 | as in gl |
| 19:11.49 | ``Erik | "urchinTracker();" |
| 19:12.46 | ``Erik | that's some ugly js |
| 19:12.55 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: do you have freeglut3-dev installed? |
| 19:13.04 | hippieindamakin8 | no |
| 19:13.15 | cosurgi | try it, then :) |
| 19:13.40 | hippieindamakin8 | k |
| 19:13.45 | cosurgi | brlcad: is compiling now |
| 19:13.59 | cosurgi | no errors now. |
| 19:14.03 | cosurgi | yet :) |
| 19:14.13 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 19:16.15 | cosurgi | brlcad: is there a reference manual on wiki? I mean I'm - thinking about GUI frontend, but I have zero brlcad knowledge. |
| 19:16.43 | cosurgi | Is there any socket specs how to talk with brlcad? (I guess it's on the way? ;-) |
| 19:16.51 | cosurgi | brb 5min |
| 19:21.43 | ``Erik | ok, "pending" |
| 19:25.48 | brlcad | cosurgi: cool, what did you change? |
| 19:26.28 | cosurgi | I did make LDFLAGS="-L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tk/unix -ltk8.5" |
| 19:26.37 | cosurgi | now I have make: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 |
| 19:26.48 | brlcad | cosurgi: a good start is probably the HACKING file, doc/PROJECTS, and src/README are probably good starters |
| 19:26.49 | cosurgi | ../src/conv/asc2g operators.asc operators.asc2g |
| 19:26.50 | cosurgi | /home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/conv/.libs/lt-asc2g: error while loading shared libraries: librt.so.19: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 19:27.18 | cosurgi | same solution for this error as for tcl ? |
| 19:27.34 | brlcad | well your compile did complete to get that far |
| 19:27.40 | brlcad | but more libtool problems |
| 19:27.52 | cosurgi | yes, the compilation finished. |
| 19:28.10 | brlcad | it's trying to run a binary (src/conv/asc2g) to generate example geometry database files |
| 19:28.30 | brlcad | and failing to find the (so far uninstalled) libs |
| 19:29.21 | brlcad | lesse, what's easiest from there .. |
| 19:29.46 | cosurgi | I'm looking in the history, and I see other errors |
| 19:29.53 | cosurgi | make[2]: Entering directory `/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/sig' |
| 19:29.56 | cosurgi | /bin/sh ../../libtool --silent --tag=CC --mode=link gcc -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tk/unix -ltk8.5 -o dconv dconv.o ../../src/libbu/libbu.la ../../src/libfft/libfft.la |
| 19:30.01 | cosurgi | libtool: link: cannot find the library `../../src/libfft/libfft.la' or unhandled argument `../../src/libfft/libfft.la' |
| 19:30.23 | brlcad | ls -la src/libfft/libfft.* |
| 19:30.24 | cosurgi | ./ifftc 128 > irfft128.c |
| 19:30.24 | cosurgi | ./ifftc: error while loading shared libraries: libtcl8.5.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 19:30.36 | brlcad | did you make -k or something? |
| 19:30.36 | cosurgi | hmm, tcl still has a problem apparently |
| 19:30.47 | brlcad | it should have halted |
| 19:31.03 | cosurgi | zsh: no matches found: src/libfft/libfft.* |
| 19:31.36 | cosurgi | '-k' - unless you told me so: no. Here's my history: |
| 19:32.21 | cosurgi | svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad ; cd brlcad ; sh autogen.sh ; ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized ; make ; make LDFLAGS="-L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tk/unix -ltk8.5" |
| 19:32.35 | brlcad | that's so wierd |
| 19:33.01 | cosurgi | maybe I should make clean, or make a fresh checkout? |
| 19:33.15 | cosurgi | because the unsuccesfull build remembered sth. about tcl configuration? |
| 19:34.00 | brlcad | 'maybe', but I'd suggest installing libtool fresh if you can |
| 19:34.18 | brlcad | vanilla libtool should work cleanly out of the box |
| 19:34.43 | brlcad | i'd be glad to debug remote if you care to set up an account too |
| 19:35.12 | cosurgi | brlcad: yeah I can |
| 19:35.59 | cosurgi | which you prefer - debug remote or me installing libtool? |
| 19:37.27 | brlcad | either works for me |
| 19:38.06 | cosurgi | ok. login brlcad ? |
| 19:38.38 | cosurgi | hm, my network connection is not fast |
| 19:38.39 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30563 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-3/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 19:38.40 | brlcad | sure |
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| 19:45.04 | cosurgi | brlcad: basically you could repeat my steps, as I pasted few lines above. |
| 19:45.27 | brlcad | yeah, I'll start with those steps |
| 19:45.43 | brlcad | looking mostly for an easy work-around, or way to detect that broken libtool |
| 19:47.52 | cosurgi | that would be useful. It's a debian etch (stable) box, with few small quirks. For brlcad think of it as default install. |
| 19:52.52 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30564 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-4/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 19:53.22 | brlcad | one of the other devs reported the problems a long while ago and we've worked on it in the past |
| 19:53.48 | brlcad | but it's really frustrating because for the most part all fingers seem to point at the debian guys for messing with the script |
| 19:54.12 | brlcad | perhaps embedded into apt, maybe it all behaves better |
| 19:54.44 | brlcad | but when the exact same version downloaded from gnu usually works... it's hard to bother with |
| 19:54.58 | cosurgi | that's bad. If you can give me some technical detail I'll gladly send a bugreport. |
| 19:55.47 | cosurgi | debian guys don't fix anything unless someone files a bugreport |
| 19:56.37 | cosurgi | but if there's a bugreport they can fix it quickly, sometimes.. |
| 19:58.26 | brlcad | I'll see if I can pinpoint it, though this is a busy week to dig if it needs digging :) |
| 19:58.36 | brlcad | can probably pinpoint the cause, but not necessarily a fix |
| 19:58.42 | ``Erik | wow, something uses libfft? (we should make a parallel version, libpfft) |
| 19:59.32 | brlcad | i started to run a benchmark between our libfft and fftw a couple weeks ago, didn't finish though |
| 19:59.34 | cosurgi | brlcad: no hurry for me, in general :) |
| 19:59.48 | brlcad | s/run a benchmark/set up a comparison/ |
| 19:59.53 | brlcad | cosurgi: ok :) |
| 20:00.03 | cosurgi | but I want to help as I can. |
| 20:00.23 | cosurgi | what are the start/end dates of GSoC ? |
| 20:00.32 | brlcad | submissions this week |
| 20:00.42 | brlcad | then there's about two months iirc until summer |
| 20:00.50 | brlcad | then three months of coding |
| 20:01.10 | brlcad | http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_timeline |
| 20:01.17 | cosurgi | anyone else was interested in GUI? |
| 20:01.32 | brlcad | so far, you're the first that I know of |
| 20:01.38 | cosurgi | I see... |
| 20:02.48 | cosurgi | May 26: Students begin coding for their GSoC projects; |
| 20:02.55 | cosurgi | on May 15 I expect a 3rd kid :> |
| 20:03.12 | cosurgi | I will need to help a lot my wife. |
| 20:03.59 | brlcad | congratulations! |
| 20:04.05 | cosurgi | thanks :) |
| 20:04.43 | brlcad | how much time do you think you'll have? |
| 20:04.48 | ``Erik | wow, commits to the 5 branches? (grats, cosurgi) |
| 20:04.51 | brlcad | june-aug basically |
| 20:05.06 | cosurgi | ``Erik: uh, what branches? |
| 20:05.32 | ``Erik | brlcad is commiting to some very old versions... *point* |
| 20:05.50 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30565 10/brlcad/tags/offsite-5-3-pre/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 20:06.06 | brlcad | i'll be killing them all soon, but just hitting them up as they error out during checkout right now |
| 20:06.18 | brlcad | case insensitive filesystem checkout problems |
| 20:06.48 | brlcad | that file is probably in most tags/branches |
| 20:07.10 | brlcad | once they're gone, I'll start pruning the dead branches/tags |
| 20:07.18 | ``Erik | ah, was some fool doing cvs or svn operations on a mac with hpfs instead of ufs? :D |
| 20:07.38 | brlcad | something like that |
| 20:08.04 | cosurgi | brlcad: I'm wondering :/ Because also I have to attend lots of conferences. 28-31 May Calgary (canada), 9-11 June Ludz (poland), 1-4 July Venice (italy), 13-20 July Montreal (canada), 9-12 September Gdansk (poland) |
| 20:08.14 | cosurgi | s/Ludz/Lodz/ |
| 20:09.01 | ``Erik | if I understand, the stipend is only awarded if the project is successfully completed by the sept 01 'due date'? |
| 20:09.03 | cosurgi | And prepare presentations for them, etc. Life of a post-doc is not easy |
| 20:09.04 | brlcad | nice, that's gotta be a glast |
| 20:09.50 | brlcad | ``Erik: students that are accepted get 500 at the beginning -- they could disappear and never be seen after that, and they'd have their 500 |
| 20:10.12 | brlcad | then there's a midterm and final evaluation, performed by the org -- where the student gets 2k each time if they pass the evaluation |
| 20:10.21 | ``Erik | ah, ok |
| 20:10.56 | ``Erik | just sayin' estimate time and make sure you can fit your proposed project(s) into it |
| 20:11.08 | brlcad | it amounts to a checkbox on a web form, thumbs up or down whether we're satisfied with the student -- and then the student has to upload their code |
| 20:11.42 | cosurgi | and I already have little time for the stuff I'm currently doing. But a CAD giu is a thing I always planned to write. It's even in my current dev plans for this summer. |
| 20:11.56 | cosurgi | s/CAD giu/ CAD GUI/ |
| 20:12.11 | brlcad | cosurgi: do you fit all the eligibility requirements? http://code.google.com/opensource/gsoc/2008/faqs.html#0.1_eligibility |
| 20:12.12 | cosurgi | but I was planning to write something totally simple for yade |
| 20:12.24 | brlcad | since you mentioned something in regards to that |
| 20:12.58 | brlcad | otherwise, yeah .. I'd just say scope it accordingly to your time availability and speak to that in the application (timeline, general estimates, etc) |
| 20:13.25 | brlcad | our main goal is to attract new long-term developers, folks that are going to stick around and help make things better |
| 20:13.54 | cosurgi | If I take part in GUI and it will work I guess that I'll stick. |
| 20:13.57 | brlcad | it has very little to do with the projects themselves other than getting people to be productive, coding, and working together |
| 20:14.32 | brlcad | wonders if he can make autogen.sh detect/report when someone has a busted libtool.. :) |
| 20:15.13 | cosurgi | reads eligibility stuff... |
| 20:15.31 | ``Erik | try to build a test .la with a 'complex' dep string and compare the result to the intent? |
| 20:15.47 | cosurgi | well ok. I'm not. First sentence: "In order to participate in the program, you must be a student." |
| 20:16.00 | cosurgi | post-doc is not a student. |
| 20:17.21 | cosurgi | post-doc is a job at the university you get after defending PhD. :-) So I'm not even a PhD student |
| 20:17.38 | ``Erik | some are *shrug* one of the guys who worked on BRL-CAD a while back went and got his second doctorate, thus the lack of assumption :) |
| 20:17.39 | brlcad | ahh |
| 20:17.58 | brlcad | makes sure with leslie |
| 20:18.00 | ``Erik | or actually, I think he's doing his thesis right now? |
| 20:18.24 | cosurgi | I didn't start another PhD :> |
| 20:19.15 | brlcad | are you actually "enrolled" right now? that's what it'd amount to record-wise to google iirc |
| 20:19.56 | cosurgi | brlcad: no. I didn't enroll, or do anything in this aspect. First thing for me was to checkout brlcad. |
| 20:20.10 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Sean.. i want to work on brlcad in GSOC and later .. and all i am good at is autocad:P ; C++ and CAD (academic stuff as in mathematics and manipulations) |
| 20:20.35 | brlcad | no, I mean with your university -- whether they have you on the books as "enrolled" -- whatever that means in your country |
| 20:20.55 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: yes, you said that a couple days ago :) |
| 20:21.08 | hippieindamakin8 | so can u guide me ? |
| 20:21.22 | hippieindamakin8 | as in started looking up those libraries |
| 20:21.27 | hippieindamakin8 | as u have mentioned |
| 20:22.16 | cosurgi | brlcad: if "enrolled" means beaing employed, getting salary and paying taxes for that, then yes :/ |
| 20:24.06 | hippieindamakin8 | cosurgi: Google defines a student as an individual enrolled in or accepted into an accredited institution including (but not necessarily limited to) colleges, universities, masters programs, PhD programs and undergraduate programs. You should be prepared, upon request, to provide Google with transcripts or other documentation from your accredited institution as proof of enrollment or admission status. Computer Science does not need to be your |
| 20:24.06 | hippieindamakin8 | field of study in order to participate in the program. |
| 20:24.17 | cosurgi | hm. (I checked dictionary, no clear explanation) but I suppose that enrolled means the opposite. |
| 20:24.50 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: yeah, I've read that. |
| 20:24.59 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh :) |
| 20:27.05 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: guiding you depends heavily on what you're interested in doing -- it's a big package and not time to learn it all even before gsoc begins |
| 20:27.45 | brlcad | cosurgi: sounds then like maybe a no? could maybe enroll at a local community college :-) |
| 20:27.47 | hippieindamakin8 | :) i am interested in developing geometry apis and oo geometry engine |
| 20:28.17 | brlcad | cosurgi: either way, you're still more than welcome to help work on it :) |
| 20:28.32 | ``Erik | I'm under the impression that a lot of U's have deeply discounted courses available to employees? the google terms sound like as long as you're enrolled in a class on apr14, it's good? |
| 20:28.44 | brlcad | I could probably even sort something out in the way of compensation, but certainly not to the level of gsoc over the entire summer at the moment |
| 20:28.51 | cosurgi | brlcad: surprising for me that there is no a post-doc position in USA (you are from US, right?) |
| 20:29.02 | cosurgi | brlcad: thanks :) |
| 20:29.51 | hippieindamakin8 | cosurgi : where are u from? |
| 20:29.52 | brlcad | something like that -- they just need the "student" qualifier for legal&tax reasons iirc |
| 20:30.02 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: poland :) |
| 20:30.24 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 20:30.38 | brlcad | cosurgi: yes, in the US -- and we do have postdocs too |
| 20:30.54 | brlcad | some are faculty candidates, some are still students, some it's just a job |
| 20:31.01 | brlcad | a research job |
| 20:31.13 | brlcad | i.e., it doesn't answer the question :) |
| 20:31.29 | hippieindamakin8 | in US u can apply as an internee at some research labs |
| 20:32.10 | ``Erik | lots of companies like interns, good cheap labor O.o :D |
| 20:32.13 | cosurgi | OK. actually I'm employed at two universities, post-doc in one, assistant professor in another. A reasearch job. Clearly not a student. |
| 20:32.15 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: do you mean the geometry converter API or the OO geometry engine API? |
| 20:32.35 | brlcad | cosurgi: can you take a class this summer? :) |
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| 20:32.44 | brlcad | intro to basket-weaving |
| 20:32.51 | ``Erik | underwater basketweaving |
| 20:33.01 | brlcad | that's too much work ;) |
| 20:33.22 | ``Erik | which was that out of? berkeley? or stanford? O.o |
| 20:33.24 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad: i meant both but more interested in oo geometry engine and i think i can do it.. |
| 20:33.48 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30566 10/brlcad/tags/rel-5-0-beta/mged/dm_old/dm-glX.c: yet another case issue with dm-glX.c |
| 20:33.57 | cosurgi | in fact I always wanted to also finish the physics faculty (and get a 3rd master degree ;), but I doubt I could do it this summer :) |
| 20:34.10 | hippieindamakin8 | 3rd degree :O |
| 20:34.32 | cosurgi | sorry I don't like to boast, do you really want to hear explanation? |
| 20:34.53 | ``Erik | heh http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_basket_weaving |
| 20:34.54 | hippieindamakin8 | go on |
| 20:35.07 | cosurgi | knocks himelf in the head - shouldn't start this. |
| 20:35.22 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: then you should focus on a good proposal for OO geometry engine first, there's not much time remaining to do a good proposal for both and get feedback from you |
| 20:35.36 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk ohk.. |
| 20:35.47 | brlcad | cosurgi: no, sure, good to know .. especially if you hang around ;) |
| 20:36.40 | cosurgi | hippieindamakin8: I got two master degrees: architectura faculty and civil engineering. And a PhD in numerical modelling of concrete (with C++) |
| 20:37.31 | cosurgi | PhD was done in civil engineering faculty. Not CS |
| 20:37.38 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: for the engine, you'll need to familiarize yourself with libwdb and librt .. also read up on the jbrlcad module ; you should skim through the docs on the website and the docs/ dir in the sources to get a feel for what they do |
| 20:37.56 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk |
| 20:39.15 | brlcad | if you want me to review a draft proposal, you can post it somewhere (on your site, on the brl-cad wiki, whereever) |
| 20:39.49 | brlcad | or post it as a submission and it'll get commented on from there |
| 20:40.02 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk |
| 20:41.08 | cosurgi | brlcad: OTOH I'm afraid that starting a GUI might be too much for a student. |
| 20:41.32 | brlcad | it really depends on the student |
| 20:41.44 | brlcad | and if "starting it" is all they can do, that's a perfectly fine project too |
| 20:41.54 | cosurgi | of course, bright people are ot there :) |
| 20:42.01 | brlcad | so long as they leave things in an improveable maintainable state |
| 20:42.07 | cosurgi | if someone comes up I won't resist helping him. |
| 20:42.48 | brlcad | yeah, we had one guy working on bzflag last year that was astounding (probably one of the top 5 students in gsoc last year) .. he worked on a new world modeler for bzflag |
| 20:43.36 | brlcad | ended up writing more than 10000 lines of code while *also* interacting with the other devs, pushing out test clients to users, iterating on feedback, etc .. put in a lot of hard effort |
| 20:43.55 | brlcad | it's up to about 20000 lines since |
| 20:44.11 | cosurgi | does he want to participate this year? |
| 20:44.28 | brlcad | a complete "outlier" case of course, but at least shows what's possible |
| 20:44.56 | brlcad | yeah, he'll be in again this year in all likelihood if he applies again |
| 20:45.20 | cosurgi | ask if he is interested in brlcad ;-) |
| 20:45.24 | brlcad | there's nothing wrong with return students or students that become mentors or mentors that become students, etc |
| 20:45.29 | brlcad | ahh, hehe |
| 20:45.32 | ``Erik | looks back at his code output from ten years ago and sighs O.o |
| 20:46.44 | brlcad | bzflag already gave us the leg up for participating this year, won't go poaching their most successful student next ;-) |
| 20:47.03 | cosurgi | heh, I see :-) |
| 20:47.14 | ``Erik | notes that bzflag is a game, therefore "sexy", unlike cad software O.o |
| 20:47.31 | brlcad | finds BRL-CAD sexy :P |
| 20:47.40 | ``Erik | yes, you are a twisted monkey :D |
| 20:47.46 | brlcad | just hasn't had her makeover yet |
| 20:48.00 | cosurgi | one of the reasons there is still nothing in open-source world that can compete with autocad |
| 20:48.54 | cosurgi | several years ago I was investigating blender for that. But gave up. |
| 20:50.06 | ``Erik | and, um, how many open source games seem to be on par with modern triple-a titles? O.o :D with 8 zillion trying... big software is hard |
| 20:50.25 | cosurgi | for few reasons. Not only lack of time. blender is written in C in too stiff manner, small flexibility. |
| 20:50.43 | cosurgi | yes, obviously is hard. |
| 20:51.24 | cosurgi | after that announcement on cad-linux my hopes light up again. I'm curious what will come out of this. |
| 20:52.16 | cosurgi | brlcad: the information what to display in OpenGL with go through network socket, right? |
| 20:52.58 | cosurgi | (yes it will) |
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| 20:53.36 | ``Erik | starts packing up to head home O.o |
| 20:54.46 | cosurgi | brlcad: typical scenario: brlcad sends huge list of stuff to draw (each has an ID), then GUI answers - move ID 1234 by 10 in X direction. Extrude ID 1235 by 11 in Y direction. Select group 1. and so on...? |
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| 20:56.58 | brlcad | cosurgi: ahh, so you were part of that whole cause for blender? or at least related to it |
| 20:57.46 | cosurgi | brlcad: related, I think. In fact I didn't make any real work which you could download. |
| 20:58.18 | brlcad | cosurgi: i'm pretty excited by gsoc too -- if we're "successful" this year, it can turn into an annual event and really help accellerate development |
| 20:59.00 | brlcad | sorry, catching up in fifo order ;) |
| 20:59.16 | cosurgi | sure :) |
| 21:00.41 | brlcad | cosurgi: actually was presuming first stab would be a unix socket first, network sockets aren't much different, just adds more latency |
| 21:01.13 | brlcad | but yeah, the information to display would come throught the socket |
| 21:02.08 | brlcad | so you have a whole protocol/api of read/modify/set/write/perform operations possible |
| 21:03.30 | cosurgi | ok. So that's clear for me. I like this idea. |
| 21:03.32 | brlcad | first stab being a simple single-user read/write wrapper |
| 21:03.57 | cosurgi | When I was planning my own app it was supposed to work like that. |
| 21:04.05 | brlcad | gmta ;) |
| 21:04.10 | brlcad | *ahem* |
| 21:05.02 | cosurgi | so first step for me is to learn the commands that I can read/warite to the socket. |
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| 21:05.50 | cosurgi | first focus on reading. |
| 21:06.01 | cosurgi | load some example and try to display it in GL |
| 21:06.18 | brlcad | the api should be designed fairly generic to the actions needed (e.g. not necessarily needing to know how brl-cad does what it does under the hood just yet) |
| 21:07.17 | brlcad | lookup geometry by name, get ids/handles, get a particular visual representation, perform a given edit operation, etc |
| 21:07.38 | cosurgi | ok.. question - what there is currently on the brlcad end? Do you already have a working socket? |
| 21:08.05 | brlcad | it would be *really* cool if the whole API could be non-blocking stateless, but I'm not so sure |
| 21:09.21 | brlcad | you mean right now, no there's not a whole lot done on the brl-cad side other than our libs -- this would be a completely new layer for the new gui that sits between the existing libs and binaries and the new gui |
| 21:09.36 | cosurgi | in other words, could I start right away with coding openGL which reads brlcad socket to display stuff? Or do I need to wait for integrated brep support, or such? |
| 21:10.30 | cosurgi | I see |
| 21:10.49 | cosurgi | so as much as I can help with the GUI I'm hopeless on brlcad side. |
| 21:11.14 | brlcad | integrated brep support is what's presently being worked because without that, we can't do anything other than wireframe |
| 21:11.38 | cosurgi | are you familiar with some OpenGL data formats? |
| 21:11.39 | brlcad | we need brep to go from implicit csg -> explicit brep spline surface -> explicit polygonal |
| 21:12.02 | brlcad | yeah, display lists ftw |
| 21:12.09 | cosurgi | ok :) |
| 21:12.42 | cosurgi | so if we talk about wireframe. Can you send it through the socket, now? |
| 21:12.57 | brlcad | sure |
| 21:13.03 | brlcad | that's kinda how mged presently works |
| 21:13.16 | brlcad | just not over a socket, it just calls the api directly |
| 21:13.31 | cosurgi | good. |
| 21:15.54 | brlcad | so fully abstracted, maybe there's a "getAvailableRepresentations OID" protocol command that returns a set (text, points, wireframe) .. then "getRepresentation wireframe OID" that returns a display list for the wireframe of that given object iD |
| 21:16.30 | brlcad | most of that protocol is still TBD frankly, especially the actual implementation detail |
| 21:16.43 | cosurgi | ok.... so after I grasp how brlcad works in general I might give it a try - to display wireframe stuff by reading the secket. |
| 21:16.52 | brlcad | okay |
| 21:17.28 | cosurgi | As long as I don't need to make my hands (too) dirty with brlcad code (which is huge) |
| 21:18.45 | cosurgi | If the only thing I'll need to know - is what to write to the socked, and how to read it - I'm perfectly happy with whatever you do beneath |
| 21:19.49 | brlcad | you shouldn't -- if you need help or snippets, I can usually help in that regard |
| 21:20.35 | cosurgi | well, to have some excuse for my emplyoers - would be useful if I could export some data which yade could read :) |
| 21:20.48 | brlcad | that would be cool |
| 21:21.01 | brlcad | loves integration/collaboration efforts |
| 21:21.03 | cosurgi | but if I can display it in GL, of course I can export it :) |
| 21:21.56 | brlcad | cept wireframe display and polygonal are vastly different .. and for CSG and parametric you have evaluated and unevaluated |
| 21:24.15 | cosurgi | polygonal is different because faces have normals, or why? |
| 21:24.27 | cosurgi | ie. and becasue there are faces. |
| 21:24.47 | brlcad | ah, maybe a picture better describes it |
| 21:25.28 | brlcad | consider this wireframe: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/screenshots/extractor.png.html |
| 21:25.55 | cosurgi | yes? |
| 21:25.56 | brlcad | it's basically an unevaluated wireframe representation |
| 21:26.14 | brlcad | where the wireframe and the rendering (on the left) are obviously drasticly different |
| 21:26.33 | brlcad | (not the hidden-line rendering in the bottom-left .. that's raster) |
| 21:27.03 | cosurgi | ok. I see. Union/substraction/etc |
| 21:27.08 | brlcad | right |
| 21:27.28 | brlcad | there are a slew of other primitives involved (that have wireframe aspects) to make that shape |
| 21:27.48 | cosurgi | hmm. I prefer if brlcad does this for me. Rendering GL is easier than parsing the wireframe to union/substract :-) |
| 21:28.17 | cosurgi | (that statement was obvious) |
| 21:28.18 | brlcad | yeah, that is ideal -- which is why we're focusing on brep evaluation of csg implicits ;) |
| 21:28.50 | brlcad | implicit geometry (which is the predominant representation in use) is not a form you can feed to opengl |
| 21:29.03 | cosurgi | yes. |
| 21:29.39 | brlcad | we have a (utterly massive) system now that will evaluate the implicit geometry and dump out polygons (most of the converters do this) .. but it's fundamentally flawed, np-complete approach |
| 21:30.18 | brlcad | by going through brep we first convert the implicit objects to spline surface boundary representation objects |
| 21:30.40 | brlcad | with those breps, we can *easily* give you the evaluated wireframes that you'd expect or polygonal |
| 21:32.12 | cosurgi | hold on. |
| 21:32.34 | cosurgi | *easily* applies to what you currently have the "fundamentally flawed", or the planned new one? |
| 21:32.48 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list || GSoC application submissions are now open, submission deadline is March 31st | |
| 21:34.33 | brlcad | the approach now that is flawed is "implicit w/ CSG -> explicit evaluated polygonal" .. the approach that we're trying to get to is "implicit w/ CSG -> explicit unevaluated spline surface -> explicit evaluated spline surface -> explicit evaluated polygonal" |
| 21:34.50 | brlcad | more steps but each step is actually well-behaved and pretty fast |
| 21:35.19 | brlcad | that first step is a bit of a b!tch .. at least it's a lot of work, the others aren't so bad though |
| 21:35.29 | brlcad | especially going from spline surface to polygonal |
| 21:35.50 | cosurgi | OK |
| 21:36.06 | cosurgi | and that screenshot and the redering is using that old method. |
| 21:36.50 | cosurgi | Would it be too much data to send over a socket for GL display? |
| 21:38.13 | cosurgi | I mean using the current flawed method for the GUI. Just curious. |
| 21:42.37 | cosurgi | any progress with compiling it on debian etch? |
| 21:43.23 | cosurgi | I'll eat something and go to sleep soon |
| 21:44.09 | cosurgi | but you can stay logged in and tinker when you have time. |
| 21:45.29 | cosurgi | The only thing is that my crappy connection "reconnects" to change IP number every few days. So you might need to ssh again and again after some time. |
| 22:07.24 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
| 22:08.24 | ``Erik | *cookcookcook* yay food |
| 22:09.44 | cosurgi | ok. I just ate. Goodnight then. |
| 22:09.59 | ``Erik | night, dude, take it easy |
| 22:17.03 | brlcad | the only thing that is flawed in what I was describing was going directly from implicit to evaluated polygonal -- that's an np-complete approach, lots of N^3'd algorithms |
| 22:19.33 | brlcad | my unquantified gut feeling is that I don't think it's too much data, at least not for 95% of the time -- the client can still cache representations and only re-fetch when stamps/checksums change |
| 22:22.20 | ``Erik | if region notions are obeyed (enforced?), only regions will have to be translated, no? |
| 22:23.26 | brlcad | translated? |
| 22:25.09 | ``Erik | converted from implicits to triangles (or nurbs) |
| 22:25.41 | ``Erik | iirc, there are lame GLU functions to convert nurbs to tristrip lists |
| 22:25.44 | brlcad | nah, not just regions |
| 22:26.01 | brlcad | this isn't like the exporters, this is foundation for display |
| 22:26.06 | brlcad | so even if you just had a sphere |
| 22:26.19 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:26.24 | brlcad | and wanted to display it, it would go through that describe loop |
| 22:26.30 | ``Erik | not a whole vehicle, just every region in the vehicle |
| 22:26.36 | brlcad | yeah.. |
| 22:26.40 | ``Erik | which'll cut that n^3 a fair bit |
| 22:26.57 | brlcad | there's still a question of what to do with non-union ops above the region level |
| 22:27.05 | brlcad | they can be pushed down, but they're still a pita |
| 22:27.15 | ``Erik | does that violate the strict region notion? |
| 22:27.19 | brlcad | that's where I'd really like a CSG library that optimized |
| 22:27.25 | brlcad | not really |
| 22:27.33 | brlcad | they're usually negative booleans |
| 22:27.58 | brlcad | "subtract the engine (shape) from the hull (region)" |
| 22:27.59 | alex_joni | -FALSE? |
| 22:28.03 | alex_joni | :P |
| 22:28.11 | ``Erik | hehehe http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=612 |
| 22:29.06 | ``Erik | yeah, but you don't subtract the engine, you subtract the shape of the engine, so you'd need a comb that is contained singly in a region to be able to make that subtraction, then reference the shape, not the region, if I grok it all right :D |
| 22:29.14 | ``Erik | thus the "strict" regions |
| 22:30.21 | brlcad | that would "help" but you're still applying a negative boolean far above the region level |
| 22:30.34 | brlcad | i mean, it's not a problem, that's why we allow it |
| 22:30.55 | brlcad | functionally equivalent to applying the negative at the region level for all regions under that node |
| 22:31.00 | ``Erik | hmmm, ok, I gotcha |
| 22:32.17 | brlcad | in terms of evaluating the CSG expression, though .. that's usually horrid complexity (particularly the damn sort of subtract this massive object (engine) from this other massive object (hull)) |
| 22:32.35 | brlcad | that's where I think a CSG lib would help |
| 22:33.26 | brlcad | would be able to basically perform tree contraction so if the hull was a bunch of arbs, it'd simplify to an equivalent expression, automatically cull away all the bloat that doesn't impact the operation |
| 22:34.04 | brlcad | even if it's a massive bot, it should be possible to trim away the portions that have nothing to do with the overlapping shape |
| 22:34.54 | brlcad | there's also a whole class of functional CSG transformations we could do too where a given u + - - + u u + - might be compressible to a simpler formula |
| 23:49.53 | hippieindamakin8 | Sean is there a NSIS based installer yet ? |
| 23:51.13 | brlcad | yup |
| 23:51.30 | brlcad | there's one for 7.12.0 sitting in anon ftp that hasn't been uploaded yet |
| 23:51.46 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 23:51.48 | brlcad | and the one on sf should be nsis too |
| 23:52.03 | hippieindamakin8 | wanted to submit it for the gsoc |
| 23:52.09 | hippieindamakin8 | application |
| 23:52.31 | hippieindamakin8 | how important is the submission of a patch |
| 23:52.32 | hippieindamakin8 | ? |
| 23:53.35 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 23:54.40 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: it'll help your chances |
| 23:54.50 | brlcad | but won't strictly be a turn-down point |
| 23:55.06 | hippieindamakin8 | k thanks for the info |
| 23:55.12 | brlcad | as the guidelines say, it can be something trivial |
| 23:55.26 | brlcad | it's mostly to make sure you can checkout, make patches, know where sites are, etc |
| 23:55.34 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. |
| 23:55.38 | brlcad | if you can't make a simple patch, you're not going to be very effective |
| 23:55.48 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 23:56.03 | brlcad | even if you never have, a few google searches and a half-hour later you have a patch |
| 23:56.26 | hippieindamakin8 | kk.. i thot we were supposed to patch up the bugs |
| 23:56.36 | hippieindamakin8 | existing one |
| 23:56.42 | hippieindamakin8 | *ones |
| 23:58.33 | hippieindamakin8 | back in 2006-07 i and my friend in my university made nsis installers for ubuntu and debian from windows |
| 23:59.28 | brlcad | fixing a bug is ideal, it can show coding competency |
| 00:32.45 | brlcad | giving we're probably only going to accept no more than 4 students, maybe as low as 2, it's a good idea to impress ;) |
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| 04:17.26 | brlcad | mmm, annotations and parametrics will be really cool |
| 04:17.37 | brlcad | even believes that guy might actually be able to implement it |
| 04:22.26 | yukonbob | waves in -- feels it's been interesting chatter in here last couple days |
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| 05:19.31 | hippieindamakin8 | so how many applications have u recieved so far ? |
| 05:53.06 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@217-162-109-63.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:00.39 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: worry about yours :) |
| 06:02.31 | brlcad | I don't know if you participated last year, but your chances are considerably higher the earlier you get it in .. and chances tend to be much higher with orgs that take on fewer students (like us!) if the applications are focused |
| 06:07.33 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: I may need to use BRL-CAD to model a monitor, wall holder, a cabinet and a room corner because I want to make a custom wall holder for a monitor |
| 06:08.12 | Z80-Boy | brlcad: also, althought it might sound funny in the company of gadgets like the Hubble Telescope, Ronja has been published on a IEEE conference. |
| 06:09.15 | brlcad | cool, which one? |
| 06:09.32 | Z80-Boy | TENCON 2006 |
| 06:09.40 | Z80-Boy | Do you want to know the ISBN? :] |
| 06:10.00 | Z80-Boy | finds it funny that a design like Ronja has an ISBN |
| 06:10.24 | brlcad | in india? |
| 06:10.28 | brlcad | ooh, 2006 |
| 06:10.33 | Z80-Boy | Asia |
| 06:10.37 | Z80-Boy | I don't know where exactly |
| 06:10.59 | brlcad | hong kong |
| 06:11.19 | brlcad | http://www.ieee.org.hk/tencon2006/ |
| 06:11.44 | brlcad | so did you publish something, or one of your users? |
| 06:12.46 | Z80-Boy | One of the users did some modification - replace the LED with a laser diode - and wrote an article about it. Because I designed virtually the whole device, he put me there as a co-author |
| 06:12.51 | Z80-Boy | http://ronja.twibright.com/web.php |
| 06:12.58 | Z80-Boy | there's a link to abstract and full text |
| 06:13.14 | Z80-Boy | He put me there as "Karel Kulhavy, Twibright Laboratories, Prague, Czech Republic" ;-) |
| 06:16.36 | Z80-Boy | Someone else wrote a thesis about underwater Ronja: "the future tactical ocean environment will be increasingly complicated. In addition to traditional communication links there will be a proliferation of unmanned vehicles..." |
| 06:17.19 | Z80-Boy | Apparently the idea is to mount Ronja on some kind of combat submarines? |
| 06:17.34 | Z80-Boy | They should make sure they are big enough not to sink under the weight of Ronja :] |
| 06:18.26 | brlcad | light-based transmission would not be my first thought for underwater comms |
| 06:19.58 | Z80-Boy | you could communicate with torpedoes |
| 06:20.06 | Z80-Boy | send the "we don't like you" message/ |
| 06:20.36 | Z80-Boy | submarines use like 20kHz to connect with the land, don't they? |
| 06:47.00 | brlcad | dunnos |
| 06:53.05 | cosurgi | brlcad: good morning, I see that you are compiling :-) |
| 06:53.14 | brlcad | :) |
| 06:53.17 | cosurgi | looks through backlog |
| 06:53.26 | brlcad | and now going to bed :) |
| 06:53.32 | cosurgi | (it's 7:50 here) |
| 06:53.54 | Z80-Boy | is listening to 7 years and 50 days from groove coverage |
| 06:54.10 | brlcad | -5 here |
| 06:59.31 | cosurgi | heh :) (still reading - not easy with 2y daughter sitting at keyboard ;) |
| 06:59.40 | cosurgi | is compilation succesfull? |
| 08:03.17 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
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| 09:43.35 | F-fisher | hello |
| 09:43.47 | F-fisher | is there smeone here ?? |
| 09:44.26 | F-fisher | no, i'm alone |
| 09:58.38 | *** part/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@cpe-24-59-109-153.twcny.res.rr.com) | |
| 10:06.48 | *** join/#brlcad nmh_2Grajw (n=nmh@gw.nomh.org) | |
| 10:11.58 | nmh_2Grajw | hi, I was hoping someone could point out how to get the brlcad install process to provide libblt2.4.so (in addition to libblt2.4.a). I am installing from source. |
| 10:29.46 | cosurgi | nmh_2Grajw: debian? |
| 10:30.02 | nmh_2Grajw | consurgi: macos 10.4 |
| 10:30.13 | cosurgi | I tried this: |
| 10:31.17 | cosurgi | svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad ; cd brlcad ; sh autogen.sh ; ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized ; make LDFLAGS="-L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -L/home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/other/tk/unix -ltk8.5" |
| 10:31.48 | cosurgi | but it was on debian. Then I stumbled on some debian-related error, and brlcad is now looking into it. |
| 10:32.13 | cosurgi | but it's night in US now, so he is sleeping ;) |
| 10:33.11 | nmh_2Grajw | consurgi: well, this seems better than what I have right now. Would you mind telling me what error you hit? |
| 10:34.41 | cosurgi | sth libtool related: libtool: link: cannot find the library `../../src/libfft/libfft.la' or unhandled argument `../../src/libfft/libfft.la', /home/janek/20-Programowanie/10-cpp/51-Brlcad/brlcad/src/conv/.libs/lt-asc2g: error while loading shared libraries: librt.so.19: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 10:36.35 | nmh_2Grajw | consurgi: I will just hope to not see that myself. Thanks for the suggestion |
| 10:37.18 | cosurgi | he said that libtool on debian is broken :) |
| 10:38.01 | cosurgi | now I must do some work, but later I will either install libtool from source, or hope that brlcad will fins a fix for this :) |
| 10:38.27 | nmh_2Grajw | consurgi: have fun with your work |
| 10:40.06 | cosurgi | heh, thanks :> |
| 11:20.23 | starseeker | Z80-Boy: The Ronja screenshot would be a good one to add to the Gallery: http://images.twibright.com/images/ronja/promotion/screenshots/brl-cad.png |
| 11:21.01 | clock_ | starseeker: yes |
| 11:22.57 | clock_ | cosurgi: and I cannot start mged now - it hangs :) |
| 11:39.33 | starseeker | clock_: What's the url for checking out from the ronja src tree? |
| 11:39.47 | clock_ | starseeker: not possible at the moment |
| 11:39.53 | starseeker | Ah |
| 11:39.55 | clock_ | Is there a way how to display SVN on HTTP? |
| 11:47.46 | *** join/#brlcad cad20 (n=63fd349a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 12:39.48 | ``Erik | lock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communication_with_submarines |
| 12:39.53 | ``Erik | s/^/c/ |
| 12:40.28 | ``Erik | /t lurk, damnit. |
| 13:11.57 | clock_ | oh yes |
| 13:12.13 | clock_ | pumping tons of AC into the earth so that submarines can catch a tiny fraction of that |
| 13:12.57 | clock_ | Sime ELF communication with submarines: if the submarines stop seeing the 50Hz and 60Hz signals, they know the end of civilization has just passed. |
| 13:13.01 | clock_ | Sime -> Simple |
| 13:46.39 | brlcad | added screenshot |
| 13:47.40 | clock_ | brlcad: my screenshot? |
| 13:47.53 | brlcad | yes |
| 13:47.59 | clock_ | jumps around |
| 13:49.24 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/screenshots/ |
| 13:52.01 | clock_ | cassini, interesting |
| 13:52.41 | clock_ | did they actually use BRL-CAD on Hubble and Cassinin development? |
| 13:52.50 | brlcad | hubble, yes |
| 13:52.52 | brlcad | cassini, no |
| 13:53.06 | clock_ | Who did Hubble? ESA? NASA? |
| 13:53.19 | brlcad | hubble involved lots of people |
| 13:53.34 | brlcad | stsi, nasa |
| 13:53.38 | clock_ | what did they use BRL-CAD for? |
| 13:54.03 | clock_ | Cassini is European isn't it? |
| 13:54.28 | brlcad | visualizations, optics |
| 13:55.03 | clock_ | I guess they surely had some good pseudoreason why waste money on expensive commercial modeller, when USA have developed a free one from their state budget |
| 13:55.05 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cassini-Huygens says it was joint |
| 13:55.27 | brlcad | oh, they still spend on the expensive |
| 13:55.31 | clock_ | Designed in a THC epiphany? |
| 13:55.43 | clock_ | ("it was joint") |
| 13:56.18 | clock_ | So they actually raytraced the optics in the Hubble with BRL-CAD? |
| 13:56.56 | brlcad | we had nothing to do with that mirror ;) |
| 13:57.10 | clock_ | they used the wrong material code? |
| 13:57.17 | clock_ | assumed air instead of vacuum? |
| 13:57.36 | brlcad | no |
| 13:57.53 | brlcad | the first mirror in hubble had a flaw, out of focus due to manufacturing flaw |
| 13:57.59 | clock_ | oh for a mirror it doesn't actually matter |
| 13:58.19 | clock_ | they didn't try to focus a desk lamp on a wall first before sending it into the sky? |
| 13:58.31 | clock_ | that's how I asses lens quality |
| 13:59.21 | brlcad | "they" involved thousands of people, dozens of major companies, several governments |
| 13:59.34 | clock_ | oh companies and government, they always screw things up |
| 13:59.43 | clock_ | if it were made by enthusiasts in garage, it would surely work fine |
| 14:00.45 | brlcad | I'd already added a ronja rendering to the renderings section: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/ |
| 14:02.31 | clock_ | jumps around |
| 14:02.38 | clock_ | the hubble looks a bit like an oversize Ronja |
| 14:02.45 | clock_ | I am sure it would have a good range |
| 14:03.07 | clock_ | One night I |
| 14:03.22 | clock_ | ll climb up the sky with a ladder and unscrew secretly their mirror and put it into my Ronja |
| 14:04.26 | clock_ | We should beam the Ronja instructions into the deep space |
| 14:04.45 | clock_ | then all aliens will build it to download pr0n and we can easily detect them as planets shining in red |
| 14:06.56 | clock_ | brlcad: can BRL-CAD simulate also Fresnel lens if I use the equation to produce lots of truncated general cones? |
| 14:18.39 | brlcad | no reason why not, but wouldn't use tgcs |
| 14:19.03 | clock_ | which ones then to make those grooves? |
| 14:19.22 | ``Erik | <-- flips css off |
| 14:32.58 | *** join/#brlcad cad66 (n=6161d635@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:33.14 | brlcad | hello cad66 |
| 14:33.19 | brlcad | bye bye cad66 |
| 14:34.45 | brlcad | clock_: a fresnel lens is just a bunch of layered paraloids with sections cut away |
| 14:35.12 | clock_ | brlcad: should I model it like that? |
| 14:35.17 | brlcad | so i'd think you'd want to use layers of ELLs or EPAs |
| 14:35.47 | clock_ | brlcad: do you think they use paraboloids when they manufacture? Or cones? |
| 14:36.00 | clock_ | An ideal Fresnel should have paraboloids of course |
| 14:36.10 | brlcad | I think they just mill it out of a single sheet of glass |
| 14:37.43 | brlcad | getting the prism cuts is the hard part |
| 14:38.08 | brlcad | at least for a lens |
| 14:51.15 | cosurgi | I asked debian dev about licese problems, summarizing: brlcad licenses BSD+LGPL+public_comain indeed conflicts with GPL used in QT. |
| 14:51.26 | clock_ | AFAIK they make a precision mold and they mold it from PMMA. |
| 14:51.50 | clock_ | cosurgi: do they really? |
| 14:51.51 | cosurgi | brlcad: but, it is OK to communicate through a socket between a GPLed GUI frontend and brlcad. |
| 14:54.17 | cosurgi | his reasoning is that GUI frontend is just a client code and it can talk with anything which uses a certain socket communication API. It doesn't matter that it talks with brlcad. Also it's not a problem that the API is defined by brlcad, because BSD license is less restrictive. |
| 14:54.31 | cosurgi | if it was other way round: brlcad using QT - it's a conflict. |
| 14:54.51 | cosurgi | But the frontend GUI (eg. QT) is using brlcad - no conflict |
| 14:55.11 | cosurgi | so we have here a conflict only in one direction. |
| 14:55.46 | cosurgi | which is good for us :) |
| 14:56.59 | cosurgi | So we would have licence conflict if such GUI frontend used direct library calls. But if we talk through socket we are safe. |
| 14:57.15 | cosurgi | I was relieved to hear that :) |
| 14:58.39 | cosurgi | anyway, I'm on my regular work now. I'll get back to compiling brlcad in the evening. |
| 15:03.52 | brlcad | cosurgi: they dont' conflict in the sense that it would just require that the front-end be gpl :) |
| 15:04.11 | brlcad | ah, which you later say |
| 15:04.18 | brlcad | should read all before commenting |
| 15:05.01 | brlcad | fwiw, the sources are almost all LGPL, not BSD -- the BSD portions are the build system, documentation, and data files |
| 15:06.00 | brlcad | ahh, and it looks like laptop lid has closed, or ip changed |
| 15:06.52 | brlcad | I was able to reproduce the failure as expected with no problem (and was just now going to dig into a workaround) :) |
| 15:13.11 | cosurgi | brlcad: yeah my IP changed. sorry for that |
| 15:13.28 | cosurgi | brlcad: did you use screen? do you have my current IP ? |
| 15:13.50 | cosurgi | 77.253.129.137 |
| 15:14.21 | cosurgi | brlcad: I have no influence on my ISP behaviour. That's why I'm using dyndns |
| 15:15.30 | cosurgi | brlcad: if you find a workaround I will be grateful :) |
| 15:18.40 | cosurgi | absurd.kozicki.pl or absurd.homelinux.net should work for you. |
| 15:22.56 | brlcad | ah, cool |
| 15:23.23 | brlcad | i'm in |
| 15:24.15 | cosurgi | great. but I must leave now for aprox 1h. Get kid from kindergarten :-)~ |
| 15:24.35 | cosurgi | see you later :) |
| 15:26.01 | brlcad | cya! |
| 15:27.24 | brlcad | ahh, running screen inside of screen is .. challenging |
| 15:58.24 | ``Erik | nah it ain't |
| 15:58.29 | ``Erik | I do it all the time :D |
| 15:59.39 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d790904dd <-- makes it trivial |
| 16:02.00 | brlcad | how do you handle things like ctrl-a a, ctrl-a e |
| 16:02.24 | brlcad | ctrl-a d even |
| 16:03.42 | ``Erik | ^a a d |
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| 16:40.01 | cosurgi | brlcad: ok, I'm back |
| 16:40.59 | cosurgi | if there's anything I can help with, shoot. |
| 16:42.08 | brlcad | cosurgi: no problems, I'm just (slowly) debugging libtool while context-switching with 4 other things |
| 16:42.14 | brlcad | making progress little by little though :) |
| 16:42.23 | cosurgi | sure, I'm very grateful |
| 16:43.12 | cosurgi | making my mind on how great a CAD GUI inside yade would be :) Of course first written as a separate app, but easily embeddable inside yade. |
| 16:43.37 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:49.42 | *** join/#brlcad rcampos (n=rafaelca@micro85.comp.ufscar.br) | |
| 16:52.28 | brlcad | hello rcampos |
| 16:53.19 | rcampos | Hi there. |
| 17:05.26 | *** join/#brlcad rcampos (n=rafaelca@200.18.97.86) | |
| 17:05.36 | rcampos | hi there. |
| 17:06.25 | brlcad | heh, hello again |
| 17:06.56 | brlcad | rcampos: did you have a question, or just stopping by to check out the hot babes? :) |
| 17:07.27 | alex_joni | brlcad: forgot rendered in the description :) |
| 17:08.04 | rcampos | I do have a question... just ran into some tech problems |
| 17:08.09 | rcampos | oops... again... |
| 17:08.24 | rcampos | very sorry! i'll try reconnecting |
| 17:09.40 | brlcad | alex_joni: what description? |
| 17:11.54 | alex_joni | hot babes.. |
| 17:15.38 | *** join/#brlcad rcampos (n=rafaelca@200.18.97.102) | |
| 17:16.32 | rcampos | here i am again. everything should be fine this time. |
| 17:17.32 | cosurgi | brlcad: do you have dimiensioning lines in brlcad? |
| 17:18.28 | brlcad | nope |
| 17:19.16 | brlcad | nothing fundamentally limiting there, though -- mostly just the user interface |
| 17:20.07 | cosurgi | brlcad: what's the difficulty in adding them, say.. on scale 0..10 ? |
| 17:20.10 | *** join/#brlcad micges (n=michu@public-gprs39842.centertel.pl) | |
| 17:20.27 | brlcad | it really depends how and where they are added |
| 17:20.46 | *** part/#brlcad micges (n=michu@public-gprs39842.centertel.pl) | |
| 17:21.23 | brlcad | also referring to dimensions on a 2D or 3D view (or both)? |
| 17:21.28 | cosurgi | on which side they should be added: brlcad, or GUI frontend (unlikely for me?) |
| 17:22.57 | brlcad | well, on the gui if you just want them as a visual means for inputting values .. that's almost entirely just a UI detail to pull out lines, see the dimensions, type in some new values |
| 17:23.08 | brlcad | but then to make them persist, you have to have some sort of annotation support |
| 17:23.24 | brlcad | (hence the gsoc item for annotations) .. and that goes into the backend with the geometry |
| 17:24.01 | brlcad | on the backend, I think adding those would actually be pretty darn easy |
| 17:24.01 | cosurgi | both, I think. A dimension line should have at least: two points and a Local Coordinate System. The dimension line goes along X axis of local coordinate system from point A to point B. It also can have: a third point - the dimension line goes through this point. And other less important attributes - like font, font size, etc. |
| 17:24.27 | brlcad | probably a couple weeks at best to add the support on the backend as it's *really* similar to the way sketches are implemented now |
| 17:25.03 | cosurgi | ok, so good to hear this. |
| 17:25.42 | brlcad | the UI side of things would be more work to do anything more than display them -- add a couple more weeks if you wanted to click and drag on them, type in values |
| 17:26.10 | brlcad | that is really where it's probably better to just plan for it in the new UI |
| 17:26.55 | cosurgi | ok. Don't worry about UI now :-) I'm asking to make sure that there's place for them inside brlcad. |
| 17:27.19 | brlcad | yeah |
| 17:27.31 | brlcad | technically you can do it now through a really horrible hack |
| 17:28.04 | cosurgi | I cannot tell how far I will go (impossible) with frontend. But my motivation is to have an AutoCAD replacement on linux. So my focus is mostly on replicating AutoCAD's interface. |
| 17:28.40 | brlcad | one of the users actually implemented annotations as 3D geometry, completely tcl scripted hack but end result was pretty impressive |
| 17:28.54 | cosurgi | ok :) |
| 17:29.07 | brlcad | it would auto-label all objects being displayed |
| 17:29.32 | cosurgi | Also I don't know how slow I can be due to my time limitations. If anyone springs up in GSoC to do that - it would be great for me :) |
| 17:29.34 | brlcad | the way he did it though is the sort that makes you snort your milk if you're not expecting it :) |
| 17:29.46 | cosurgi | heheh :) |
| 17:30.17 | brlcad | he actually creates the fonts as 3D geometry, positioning them in the scene according to the given view |
| 17:30.20 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 17:30.43 | brlcad | so you have all these tiny little polygons spelling out names and labels with lines leading from the labels to the objects |
| 17:30.46 | brlcad | pretty funny |
| 17:30.53 | cosurgi | I see :-) |
| 17:31.16 | brlcad | all done as an mged tcl procedure too ... which is just bizzare :) |
| 17:32.02 | brlcad | no worries about the time, i'm a very patient guy -- some things in open source happen *very* slowly :) |
| 17:33.19 | rcampos | this is a great window for my question. i'm interested in proposing the GI renderer development for the GSoC, but I'm not that confident about the timeframe. |
| 17:33.59 | rcampos | Path tracing is quite tricky, so is a student expected to deliver it finished by the end of the term? |
| 17:36.19 | brlcad | rcampos: so long as the proposal is detailed in what you're proposing and what you see the deliverables as being, we're completely satisfied |
| 17:37.28 | brlcad | whether you can finish what you propose is based on your background and experience -- so you could conceivably be a first year student with minimal programming experience, so the timeline should naturally reflect that in how far they expect to get |
| 17:38.18 | brlcad | the focus is more on attracting new long-term developers, so there's really no problem if you don't "finish", but a really strong desire that you keep working on it and expand your interests into other parts of brl-cad development |
| 17:39.50 | brlcad | so yeah, don't promise the impossible, be conservative .. and show that you're interested in becoming a long-term contributor ;) |
| 17:41.04 | rcampos | I see. I'm very interested in rendering, so working with brl-cad in the long-run, specifically on the librt library and the GI module to be added would be great. |
| 17:42.39 | brlcad | sounds great to me too ;) |
| 17:42.57 | brlcad | I've wanted to implement that myself for years |
| 17:43.16 | rcampos | this might sound naive, but there are options in developing a GI renderer, such as the most adequate algorithm (e.g. metro or radiosity). |
| 17:43.37 | rcampos | Should major choices be made prior to project submission? |
| 17:44.05 | ``Erik | could be part of the proposal, would help focus the timeline |
| 17:44.05 | brlcad | yeah, just to show competency, you need to pick one or the other since they're such different approaches |
| 17:44.42 | brlcad | radiosity usually performs better, but is usually much harder to implement (especially with implicit geometry) |
| 17:44.56 | ``Erik | hides the path tracer already in there O.o O:-) |
| 17:45.14 | brlcad | MLT is basically bidirectional path-tracing, a much simpler algorithm, generates gorgeous picutres, but run-times are really long |
| 17:45.45 | rcampos | Maybe some research on performance tuning the MLT. |
| 17:46.04 | brlcad | ``Erik: if it were easy to use, a librt one wouldn't have made the list ;) |
| 17:46.16 | brlcad | if it didn't require facetization, a librt one wouldn't have made the list |
| 17:46.32 | ``Erik | true, that's an ugly requirement |
| 17:47.00 | ``Erik | but without a serious CSG optimizer... |
| 17:47.22 | brlcad | if someone can get one working with librt, and tie is hooked into librt for bots, then it could be a reasonable balance |
| 17:48.15 | brlcad | it's not like rise was actually fast .. and at the order it took, 2-10x longer really doesn't matter -- you're still going distributed and running for days, so throw 2-10x hardware at it |
| 17:48.27 | ``Erik | but so many models are built in a fashion that "seems right" to a modeler who doesn't know the actual cost when it comes to intersecting and weaving |
| 17:50.54 | rcampos | the CSG optimizer seems to be more important at the moment than the GI renderer. am i wrong? |
| 17:51.09 | brlcad | rcampos: nah, they're both "important" |
| 17:51.14 | ``Erik | they're just different |
| 17:51.25 | ``Erik | make it fast or make it pretty... |
| 17:51.42 | brlcad | you really need to know your stuff to work on the CSG optimizer though -- that's already highly tuned code, and changes would have to be very careful |
| 17:52.02 | brlcad | propose both ;) |
| 17:52.10 | brlcad | just not in the same proposal |
| 17:52.24 | rcampos | hum, i'm not sure. not really familiar with CSG. i am with RT, though. |
| 17:52.28 | brlcad | and only after doing your preferred first with detail |
| 17:52.45 | brlcad | csg is easy to learn |
| 17:52.58 | brlcad | the optimization algorithms for csg can be tricky though |
| 17:53.07 | ``Erik | it's just the geometric version of boolean logic |
| 17:53.09 | brlcad | and optimized csg *code* can be even trickier |
| 17:53.19 | ``Erik | "just" :D |
| 17:53.28 | ``Erik | like, academic "trivial" |
| 17:54.06 | rcampos | oh, i'm used to that! |
| 17:54.47 | ``Erik | dangit, ucw seems to have been mostly abandoned :/ almost 2 years ago |
| 17:55.32 | rcampos | brlcad: i'm very into RT, but my background supports me better on the GI front. only one well-done proposal. what do you suggest? |
| 17:56.01 | cosurgi | brlcad: is it possible to do .dxf export ? |
| 17:56.16 | brlcad | cosurgi: g-dxf |
| 17:56.37 | cosurgi | oh, so it works right now? great! :) |
| 17:56.41 | brlcad | that will polygonalize the model since dxf doesn't support implicits |
| 17:57.11 | brlcad | rcampos: i'm not sure what you're asking |
| 17:57.48 | cosurgi | yeah, I know. I asked because that would allow people to work in brlcad GUI frontend, then sell their drawings to people who use autocad. |
| 17:57.54 | brlcad | rcampos: only propose the csg optimization task if you think you could do something there -- all the items on the task list are rather important and would be great to have .. |
| 17:58.14 | rcampos | brlcad: I really like the CSG optimizer idea, but I'm afraid it might be overwhelming. |
| 17:59.06 | brlcad | I could give you some references to research papers for it probably in a day or two to give you a better feel, or better yet just search for CSG optimization papers |
| 17:59.24 | brlcad | otherwise, focus on the GI submission first |
| 17:59.46 | brlcad | you can always stub in an application for CSG and work on it or decide through next week |
| 18:00.02 | brlcad | there's a week and a half to review and expand upon the submissions after the 31st |
| 18:00.17 | brlcad | but you have to submit *something* by the 31st or you're cut out |
| 18:00.42 | brlcad | mentors will start reviewing and refining next week with the candidates |
| 18:00.57 | rcampos | brlcad: i'll have a rather detailed proposal on GI by tomorrow evening - should I submit it and alter if needed, or put it up for comments beforehand? |
| 18:01.15 | brlcad | rcampos: either way works just fine |
| 18:01.40 | brlcad | if you want, you can share it to the devel mailing list to get more eyes on it beforehand |
| 18:01.56 | rcampos | great. i'll definitely do that :) |
| 18:03.24 | brlcad | sooner would definitely be better than later, if last year is any indication it's just going to get busier and busier until the deadline |
| 18:04.41 | rcampos | yes, and that's not good. i'll have it on the mailing list by tomorrow - it'll give me enough time to review. |
| 18:04.59 | brlcad | sounds like a plan |
| 18:05.15 | brlcad | welcome to toss it up into a page on the wiki if you like |
| 18:06.16 | rcampos | another great idea. is doing both redundant?! maybe having a link on the email to the list should suffice, then. |
| 18:08.16 | brlcad | nah, it's not redundant |
| 18:08.27 | brlcad | some folks won't click a link, some will -- its up to you |
| 18:08.48 | rcampos | noted! |
| 18:09.36 | rcampos | thanks a lot for the help so far :) |
| 18:09.41 | ``Erik | but if you attach a .doc or .ppt, we'll take turns smackin' ya :D |
| 18:10.57 | rcampos | hehe, i would'nt do that, rest assured! |
| 18:22.37 | cosurgi | whoopps, my backup box just got oops |
| 18:23.56 | cosurgi | brlcad: did you get a message on screen, too? :) |
| 18:28.55 | brlcad | cosurgi: yup |
| 18:31.47 | cosurgi | It's 7y old. I figured I still can use it for something. I've put into it raid5 3*500GB=1000GB and makes backups twice per day from cron with rsnapshot. I oopses when CPU overheats, so I'm uninstalling distcc from it, now :) |
| 18:32.08 | cosurgi | s/I oopses/It oopses/ |
| 18:35.39 | ``Erik | hrm, I think my primary server at home is 9 years old |
| 18:36.06 | ``Erik | need to buy a fan for the 8 yr old one O.o |
| 18:37.40 | cosurgi | heh, I gave my box which would deserve such title, to my friend. (the debian dev I was talking about earlier). It's his primary server now and is is 9y old. Still kicks butt :) |
| 18:38.27 | cosurgi | dual PIII, 600MHz |
| 18:39.15 | ``Erik | I had a dual p133 with scsi long ago, screamed for compiling (sucked for raytracing) |
| 18:41.34 | cosurgi | :^) |
| 18:43.14 | ``Erik | make a nice coffee table, too |
| 18:43.41 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 18:44.26 | ``Erik | looked like http://members.jcom.home.ne.jp/labyrin/maniki/maniiki01/dsc0079.jpg but far more abused |
| 18:49.17 | MinuteElectron | my home server is 98! |
| 18:57.38 | ``Erik | from '98, or running 98? O.o :> *duck* *run* |
| 18:58.40 | yukonbob | or from 1910? (a difference engine?) |
| 18:58.55 | brlcad | has fun showing the tcl guys why their regex imlementation sucks |
| 18:59.17 | ``Erik | heh |
| 18:59.17 | ``Erik | uhm |
| 18:59.24 | yukonbob | regex was just reworked w/ some help from postres, apparently |
| 18:59.26 | brlcad | interesting little test pattern.. ((a{%d}){%d}){%d} ... |
| 18:59.37 | yukonbob | *postgres |
| 18:59.45 | ``Erik | I saw a report where tcl's regex smoked perls a while back |
| 19:00.08 | brlcad | with that little pattern, you end up blowing the stack quickly the way tcl implements it |
| 19:00.16 | brlcad | or running out of memory |
| 19:00.23 | yukonbob | I wish there was an emitcon for my face for that comment, ``Erik |
| 19:00.25 | ``Erik | (by pushing perl into a degredate case where it basically had to backtrack every single time) |
| 19:00.57 | brlcad | yukonbob: try this in your tclsh: set i 40 |
| 19:00.59 | brlcad | then: regexp [subst ((a{$i}){$i}){$i}] x |
| 19:01.02 | yukonbob | ``Erik: was this a single weird case, or a common pattern |
| 19:01.10 | brlcad | it should dies somewhere between 20 and 40 |
| 19:01.33 | brlcad | I thought that was pretty odd .. so I wrote a little test program |
| 19:01.33 | yukonbob | brlcad: what version of tcl are you running? |
| 19:01.42 | brlcad | 8.5 latest |
| 19:01.45 | yukonbob | nods |
| 19:01.57 | ``Erik | it was a common case pushed to the extreme |
| 19:02.00 | brlcad | like I said, this was debugging with the tcl guys just a lil while ago |
| 19:02.05 | ``Erik | something like a 4k character pattern |
| 19:02.13 | yukonbob | ``Erik: interesting -- I honestly wouldn't have expected that... |
| 19:02.27 | ``Erik | 'cept perl got too slow to wait for at 10 characters or something |
| 19:02.33 | brlcad | quite a drastic difference -- gnu's is an utter pig (takes minutes just to compile) but seems to not run out of memory here until somewhere 200+ -- bsd seems to just hit a hard-coded uchar limit but is nearly instant even at 255 -- tcl's dies around 36 here |
| 19:02.59 | brlcad | you can see the diff between bsd's and gnu's right off the bat if you compile http://brlcad.org/tmp/regtest.c against both libs |
| 19:03.02 | yukonbob | tcl regex == Henry Spencer |
| 19:03.25 | brlcad | spencer did the old bsd one too |
| 19:03.43 | brlcad | so maybe it's just been broken since :) |
| 19:03.48 | brlcad | s/broken/optimized/ |
| 19:04.06 | ``Erik | http://swtch.com/~rsc/regexp/regexp1.html |
| 19:05.21 | ``Erik | of course, you always have the jwz quote to go along with that... |
| 19:05.36 | brlcad | this must be a different sample pattern for ((a{%d}){%d}){%d} |
| 19:05.46 | brlcad | because tcl and gnu both are epic fail |
| 19:05.55 | ``Erik | Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll use regular expressions." Now they have two problems. --- jwz comp.lang.emacs |
| 19:06.09 | brlcad | tcl at least dies gracefully, gnu's starts to take down the machine and seems to inf loop |
| 19:06.29 | brlcad | bsd's doesn't seem to have any problem |
| 19:06.43 | ``Erik | mebbe try an old tcl (like 8.0?) to see if tcl screwed up their fugly cases to a slight boost in trivial cases? |
| 19:06.55 | ``Erik | up until 256 characters? :D |
| 19:07.06 | brlcad | interesting that you can see a distinct difference between the bsd on mac os x and the bsd we ship (about 1sec to compile 256 with osx, about .1 sec with old bsd) |
| 19:07.16 | brlcad | it's not characters |
| 19:07.18 | yukonbob | core-dumped on your test, br |
| 19:07.22 | yukonbob | *brlcad |
| 19:07.55 | brlcad | yukonbob: tclsh did? |
| 19:07.55 | yukonbob | yup |
| 19:07.55 | yukonbob | 8.4.16 |
| 19:07.55 | brlcad | heh, well at least 8.5 is better in that regard |
| 19:08.12 | brlcad | it should say "couldn't compile regular expression pattern: nfa has too many states" |
| 19:08.22 | ``Erik | um, which "old bsd"? there're a couple fbsd 8 boxes floating around |
| 19:08.34 | brlcad | src/other/libregex |
| 19:08.44 | ``Erik | tcl and bsd shouldn't be using nfa's |
| 19:09.10 | ``Erik | should be a big fugly dfa with a list of state pointers |
| 19:09.20 | ``Erik | iirc |
| 19:09.39 | ``Erik | tcl, anyways... I'm guessing about bsd |
| 19:10.09 | brlcad | like he said, 8.5's regex was modified |
| 19:10.13 | ``Erik | does the mac one want to work in unicode? or do you see a lot of system activity (microkernel abuse) |
| 19:11.02 | brlcad | wth are you talking about? :) .. you've not compiled that regtest.c /me thinks |
| 19:11.19 | ``Erik | no? |
| 19:11.24 | brlcad | it's nearly instant on bsd (both old and new) to compile the expression |
| 19:11.47 | brlcad | we're talking about just compiling the expression, running it on nothing |
| 19:12.08 | brlcad | the expression is very "brief", but expands nasty state-wise |
| 19:12.18 | yukonbob | my 8.4 dies SIGSEGV SIG_DFL |
| 19:12.35 | brlcad | e.g. try running this: egrep '((a{255}){255}){255}' |
| 19:12.46 | ``Erik | are you talking about the bsd impl on a mac, or the bsd impl on bsd? |
| 19:12.49 | brlcad | that will use gnu's regex lib .. should run out of memory |
| 19:13.05 | brlcad | they're not much different iirc |
| 19:13.17 | brlcad | but was referring to on a mac and our old bsd impl |
| 19:13.39 | ``Erik | ah |
| 19:13.51 | ``Erik | thought you were mixing os's, as well |
| 19:14.28 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@cpe-24-59-109-153.twcny.res.rr.com) | |
| 19:14.29 | ``Erik | huh, that stopped at 4 gigs for me |
| 19:14.46 | ``Erik | still burning cpu, but not eating any more memory |
| 19:14.51 | brlcad | there, just ran it on .bz too .. slow, but it completes to 255 with no problem before hitting the uchar limit |
| 19:16.17 | brlcad | i'm believe gnu's just get stuck in an inf loop, or it's just got some N^3'd time going on -- it's been compiling here for a half hour at 200 |
| 19:17.07 | brlcad | to run the test, just gcc regtest.c && ./a.out 200 |
| 19:17.45 | jdoliner | is anyone here a possible mentor of a project on CSG evaluation of BREP objects. |
| 19:17.53 | brlcad | hugs jdoliner |
| 19:18.05 | ``Erik | :o |
| 19:18.32 | brlcad | jdoliner: heh, yes -- there are several mentors here (and on the mailing list) |
| 19:18.46 | *** join/#brlcad rafaelcampos (n=rafaelca@200.18.97.175) | |
| 19:18.52 | jdoliner | great |
| 19:19.56 | brlcad | we do more communal mentoring, so just speak up -- you might have to hit up both irc and ml to get a response sometimes, but the mentor's role is mainly to make sure you're on track and for evaluating you |
| 19:20.10 | brlcad | jdoliner: what's your background? |
| 19:20.47 | jdoliner | Well I'm presently a mathematics major at The University of Chicago |
| 19:21.38 | jdoliner | I've also had formal education in both Scheme and C at Uchicago |
| 19:22.17 | jdoliner | And I spent the summer working at Fermi Lab where I had to do some coding in Fortran on a simulation project |
| 19:22.24 | yukonbob | reads backtrace on #tcl |
| 19:23.55 | jdoliner | Also I have experience in computer art so I've worked with both B-Rep and CSG before |
| 19:24.32 | brlcad | on a coding level or at an application level? |
| 19:25.13 | ``Erik | looks around |
| 19:25.31 | ``Erik | you can't escape us, brlcad, you're becoming surrounded by coders who like sexy curvy languages |
| 19:26.13 | brlcad | i was just going to say that I'll try not to hold the fortran and scheme against him :) |
| 19:26.40 | jdoliner | Largely on application level the closest I've gotten with them in coding is with Pov-ray |
| 19:26.41 | ``Erik | each has their benefit... scheme teaches you how to really program, and floortrash teaches you how to put up with bull |
| 19:26.45 | ``Erik | *cough* O:-) |
| 19:26.52 | brlcad | j/k, I actually do like lisp, never really gotten into scheme .. just fails on a practical level for me |
| 19:27.08 | brlcad | much like how I like smalltalk, but not practical :) |
| 19:27.18 | jdoliner | yeah the physicist are so outdated |
| 19:27.30 | ``Erik | I d'no, depends on the impl, unfortunately :( gauche is a nice pragmatic scheme |
| 19:27.50 | jdoliner | I think when the program had originally been written Fortran was new |
| 19:27.54 | ``Erik | hooks to gtk, opengl, various rdbms's, good unix extensions, etc |
| 19:28.01 | brlcad | jdoliner: hm, then how strong is your math background with respect to spline surfaces and manifold geometry? :-) |
| 19:28.10 | brlcad | doing CSG of BREP is a bit tricky |
| 19:28.27 | brlcad | i mean it actually shouldn't be more than probably a few hundred lines of code.. but it's dense stuff to sort out |
| 19:28.47 | ``Erik | classroom scheme would like C without libraries or functions, so a lot of people have a lame view of the language |
| 19:28.52 | ``Erik | would be like |
| 19:30.05 | ``Erik | shouldn've eaten today, is feelin' awful goofy |
| 19:30.15 | brlcad | jdoliner: see if you can do some searches for CSG evaluation of BREP papers -- that really is a hot topic feature, but there's no sugar coating that it's trivial -- you'll need to instill some confidence that you can implement a given algorithm for doing the coding needed |
| 19:30.56 | brlcad | ignores the language banter :P |
| 19:30.56 | jdoliner | K |
| 19:32.35 | ``Erik | brlcad: just a slew of nurbs in a complex csg (no other primitives), and evaluate it to the minimal 'union only' patch set? |
| 19:32.51 | brlcad | yes |
| 19:33.22 | brlcad | basically performing splinesurface-on-splinesurface trimmings per the csg operations |
| 19:33.51 | brlcad | hell, I bet we actually already implement a full-blown algorithm that would work just fine in the nmg sources |
| 19:33.55 | brlcad | but it's in the nmg sources... |
| 19:34.47 | ``Erik | 'would work just fine', what, after throwing it all away and starting over? :D |
| 19:35.07 | brlcad | jdoliner: another very similar but a hell of a lot more straight-forward is to propose implementing/updating all our existing primitives with a describe-me-as-a-brep function |
| 19:35.44 | brlcad | we have about 30 primitives that you'd have to work on, about a third of those are already "done" but using the wrong data structures |
| 19:35.47 | ``Erik | bot, dsp, and metaball might be challenging for that one |
| 19:36.11 | brlcad | point-sample, turn into patches |
| 19:36.32 | brlcad | bot and dsp should be trivial |
| 19:36.46 | brlcad | each bot face is a brep face |
| 19:36.53 | brlcad | it already *is* in brep form |
| 19:37.32 | ``Erik | but what it's supposed to be smoothed? like a tesselated sphere.... 1k nurbs when it should be 4? |
| 19:38.01 | brlcad | the meatball would be a little more tricky |
| 19:38.04 | ``Erik | <-- was thinking dsp and bot would need curve fitting |
| 19:38.16 | brlcad | no, bot is what it is -- those are the faces |
| 19:38.52 | brlcad | dsp would probably be five faces for the sides and bottom, and then at least one if not many sub-pieces for the surface |
| 19:39.17 | brlcad | dsp has two modes, one is flat-faced -- those would be direct to N flat-faces brep faces |
| 19:39.41 | brlcad | the smoothed version, though, would be harder -- "should" come across as just one patch with a helluva lot of control points |
| 19:40.19 | ``Erik | heh, yay for funny stuff on mailing lists |
| 19:40.20 | brlcad | undoubtedly have to localize, though, as you can have discontinuities in the dsp (zero'd regions) |
| 19:40.24 | ``Erik | > apache. Well tested, lots of features. |
| 19:40.24 | ``Erik | well, tested... :) |
| 19:49.25 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@77-56-82-60.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:06.22 | brlcad | kicks CIA-33 |
| 20:06.23 | CIA-33 | ow |
| 20:09.53 | ``Erik | annoying, the tclConfig.sh installed in the latest fbsd is broken :/ |
| 20:38.04 | *** join/#brlcad jgay (n=jgay@fsf/staff/jgay) | |
| 20:38.46 | jgay | brlcad when you get a chance, tell me what you think about http://endsoftpatents.org |
| 20:46.12 | ``Erik | heh, I originally read that as "ends of patents" O.o |
| 21:32.35 | ``Erik | wanders home, later kids |
| 22:05.14 | brlcad | jgay: in what regard? |
| 22:05.33 | brlcad | it reads like a political rant, but that's because it is |
| 22:05.53 | brlcad | I've seen that site before iirc, pretty sure |
| 22:15.20 | louipc | hehe do you think if brl-cad became a real competitor that some companies out there would try suing? |
| 22:15.22 | jgay | brlcad, cool. It's pretty new. It's supposed to be informative, kind of boring, and simple. |
| 22:17.39 | jgay | brlcad, I didn't know if anybody in this project had a position on software patents. I am helping to write an amicus brief for an important court case (In re Bilski). There are a lot of patents on CAD and related software. You are likely violating dozens if not hundreds of software patents. |
| 22:17.40 | brlcad | louipc: not likely |
| 22:18.35 | brlcad | oh, it's entirely possible, but then if they were to sue, they'd be suing uncle sam .. and uncle sam gets to decide if you're allowed to sue |
| 22:18.52 | louipc | yep that's what I was thinking |
| 22:18.59 | jgay | brlcad - not so. More likely they'd sue a company using the software or selling it inside of a distribution. |
| 22:19.16 | louipc | that might be precedent setting though |
| 22:19.52 | jgay | remember software has both copyright and patents, but they are very different laws with very different requirements |
| 22:20.12 | jgay | under copyright law you are safe, under patent law, uncle sam may be safe, but others might not be. |
| 22:20.51 | brlcad | jgay: as for a position, I'm fairly against software patents but they frankly aren't a day-to-day concern (or an issue that has *ever* really come up with major significance) .. at least to date of course |
| 22:20.51 | jgay | e.g., TrendMicro is being sued for how they are using ClamAV, a free software package that they did not develop. |
| 22:20.55 | louipc | depending on what a judge says |
| 22:21.42 | jgay | brlcad, right, you may not be personally effected, but others in the free software community (and generally programming community) are very much effected on a day to day basis. |
| 22:22.28 | brlcad | the legal concerns on our end tend to be much more heavily weighted towards issues of information security , the license terms, issues with the GPL, classification levels, FOUO data, and disclosure |
| 22:23.16 | jgay | brlcad, of course, I understand that. With software patents, however, you needn't ever know of the patents or technology you infringe upon to be found infringing upon the patents. |
| 22:23.30 | brlcad | i know others are affected, just following the headlines it's clear a lot of the problems brewing |
| 22:24.26 | yukonbob | BRL-CAD to plaintif -- let me introduce my legal team -- m1 bradley, blackhawk, and stryker. |
| 22:26.15 | jgay | so, you guys are safe, you can't infringe upon patents, because the government asks you to develop brl-cad |
| 22:26.39 | jgay | however, the government could be asked to pay damages or costs even when it claims eminent domain over the patents. |
| 22:27.43 | brlcad | do patents have to defend against prior art as well? |
| 22:27.49 | brlcad | (software patents) |
| 22:27.54 | jgay | my question really wasn't about whether or not you guys are personally effected, but whether or not anybody would be interested in signing onto the amicus brief. |
| 22:28.52 | jgay | brlcad, yes. But, there are about 70 software patents granted per day. |
| 22:29.07 | brlcad | nods |
| 22:29.36 | jgay | So, they are relatively safe because of their numbers. To look into prior art for even a fraction of those is a daunting task. |
| 22:30.07 | louipc | there are some pretty ridiculous patents and any judge with half a brain should just throw them out |
| 22:30.35 | jgay | louipc, I recommend reading over endsoftpatents.org -- we have done a good job of explaining a whole lot about software patents. |
| 22:31.12 | jgay | Anyhow, I was trying to an extend an offer that if anybody was interested in taking a stance against software patents, and hopes to see them eliminated, the time would be now. |
| 22:31.29 | brlcad | jgay: so you are involved directly with endsoftpatents.org |
| 22:31.41 | jgay | I didn't mean to flood the channel or force it down y'alls throats :-) |
| 22:32.15 | brlcad | I gathered that you weren't gloria or ben |
| 22:32.16 | jgay | brlcad, yes. I am the campaigns manager for the free software foundation. We helped launch the ESP campaign, which is a coalition effort. |
| 22:32.26 | brlcad | got it |
| 22:32.53 | jgay | It's not limited to free software or user freedom, so it's not an in house thing. But, when it comes to doing my part for the free software community, or campaigning like activities, I step up to the plate. |
| 22:33.22 | brlcad | quite noble of you |
| 22:33.30 | brlcad | that work takes a lot of time and effort |
| 22:33.38 | brlcad | and is rarely really appreciated directly |
| 22:34.01 | brlcad | (except by others that have also stepped up to the plate) |
| 22:34.06 | jgay | thanks -- I enjoy staying in the shadows most of the time :-) |
| 22:35.17 | louipc | you guys are lobbying for a patent reform bill? |
| 22:36.42 | jgay | louipc, I don't think we are lobbying, but we are recommending that congress consider reforming the patent system through legislation. |
| 22:37.02 | louipc | oh |
| 22:37.36 | jgay | louipc, 501(c)3 organizations are allowed to encourage bills to be passed and influence legislation, but they are not allowed to help political campaigns or put more than some small percentage of their budget each year toward efforts that are considered lobbying. |
| 22:38.42 | jgay | I think you might also have to justify such actions as being directly related to your mission. Clearly something that we consider to threaten the creation and adoption of free software directly threatens our mission. |
| 22:38.49 | louipc | ah that second part sucks |
| 22:39.23 | louipc | so you have to make a profit corporation to be allowed to lobby agressively hah |
| 22:39.39 | jgay | no, I think it's 501(c)4 |
| 22:40.12 | jgay | So, you don't get a tax break, but you can qualify for grants. |
| 22:41.25 | brlcad | jgay: has anyone worked on tracking down the various "patent whore" clearing house companies -- or is that akin to chasing down the storm botnet? |
| 22:41.54 | brlcad | to identify the list of companies that abuse the system the worse that file for the intention of extorting |
| 22:42.05 | brlcad | s/worse/worst/ |
| 22:42.10 | jgay | brlcad, it's just not worth it -- I mean, if in the legal community you are known as a troll -- how can it get any worse? |
| 22:42.45 | jgay | So, IBM & Microsoft hold a tremendous number of patents |
| 22:43.13 | jgay | But, some of the worst patent holders are law companies that exist for the sole purpose of suing people for patent infringement. |
| 22:43.28 | brlcad | right, it's the latter I'm referring to |
| 22:43.40 | brlcad | calls them "patent whores" |
| 22:43.43 | jgay | They collect software patents and sue big companies at critical times. In business it's referred to as "the patent tax," that you expect to pay for being big. |
| 22:44.07 | brlcad | because it's cheaper to pay than to fight |
| 22:44.21 | jgay | Right, and because there is a good chance you'll lose. |
| 22:44.33 | jgay | I mean, most everybody is infringing software patents. |
| 22:44.46 | jgay | Our list of people on the site are companies like the green bay packers, MLB.com, etc. |
| 22:45.34 | jgay | You don't have to develop software, you just have to use it to make money, or design a web site to work a certian way, etc. |
| 22:50.08 | louipc | yeah that's pretty dumb |
| 22:55.30 | starseeker | rather doubts the patent mess will get straightened out anytime soon - the money and financial incentive to the legal establishment is lined up behind making it more difficult to do anything legally, not less... |
| 22:56.07 | louipc | damned lawyers |
| 22:57.09 | starseeker | wonders how many examples in human history there are of legal establishments working to make themselves less of a nuisance |
| 22:58.02 | starseeker | Ah, well. |
| 23:00.45 | starseeker | jgay: Out of curiosity, are there websites that attempt to make a concrete case FOR software patents? |
| 23:00.55 | jgay | starseeker -- not that I know of. |
| 23:01.54 | jgay | starseeker I've actually tried to find some pro-software patent arguments that were based on facts ... but the only ones I could find rae based on generalization, like, "Patents are important for innovation." |
| 23:02.18 | jgay | All of the business case studies I've read have not found any link between innovation (even for a single case) and software patents. |
| 23:02.45 | jgay | but, I'm not as well versed as some. So i don't claim to be a definitive source of all things software patents. |
| 23:02.48 | starseeker | always comes back to that "promote the progress of science and useful arts" bit... |
| 23:03.18 | starseeker | If we're going to stop people from doing constructive work, I'd like to be sure we are getting a better return in the end. |
| 23:04.04 | starseeker | wonders if anyone making laws thinks of it in that fashion any longer... |
| 23:04.08 | jgay | starseeker - In re Bilski could be very important in helping to decide the fate of software patents. Remember, software is 1) the only thing that can have both a copyright and a patent, and 2) only started being granted in the mid-1980s. |
| 23:05.37 | jgay | starseeker people don't read bills (readthebill.org), but a lot of us (sunlightfoundation.com, www.leagueoftechvoters.org/, change-congress.org) are doing something to help improve government. |
| 23:06.10 | jgay | *granted patents |
| 23:07.02 | jgay | sorry, I wear multiple hats :-) I should leave the room. The purity of hacking and BRL-CAD is being tainted! :-) |
| 23:07.17 | starseeker | nah, my fault |
| 23:07.41 | jgay | o well, if it ever bothers anybody let me know -- I don't like being "that guy." |
| 23:07.49 | brlcad | jgay: it's good discourse |
| 23:08.31 | brlcad | all for increased awareness |
| 23:08.58 | jgay | cool, well, on to more pressing matters. If I don't get home and make dinner right now my fiance will kill me! |
| 23:09.00 | brlcad | though I'm also a champion of being responsive, not preventive .. the ones responding directly do this should be the ones being attacked (i.e. the big corporations that are being sued) |
| 23:09.27 | jgay | brlcad, yeah, most of the people we have reached out to are companies that have or are being sued. |
| 23:09.48 | jgay | actually, I've spent two days being passed around coprporate switchboards trying to get connected to the well-isolated legal department |
| 23:10.06 | brlcad | that's why I was wondering if having a list of the orgs could help .. formulate some sort of reverse class-action lawsuit |
| 23:10.44 | jgay | brlcad, yeah, as a long term strategy something like that might make sense. But, this Bilski case is actually one of the most important cases we've had re: software patents in a very long time. It could be decisive. |
| 23:11.49 | jgay | So, our amicus brief is important, because the ruling, and the exact wording of it, is very crucial to many parties, and could have a big impact on the state of software patents. |
| 23:12.29 | brlcad | well, hopefully it goes well -- when is it filed? |
| 23:12.41 | jgay | On the ninth |
| 23:12.50 | jgay | hopefully |
| 23:18.54 | jgay | ok, goodnight all! must go make dinner :-) |
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| 00:42.40 | brlcad | hello hippieindamakin8 |
| 00:42.54 | brlcad | still no review on a submission yet, eh? |
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| 00:53.28 | brlcad | hello cad24 |
| 00:53.34 | cad24 | howdy |
| 00:53.36 | brlcad | wonders who that could be |
| 00:53.44 | cad24 | wonders too |
| 01:24.20 | hippieindamakin8 | hey sean |
| 01:25.11 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall submit a proposal soon :(,, too much of academic load rt now.. the endsemester examinations are up in 20 days :( and project submissions |
| 01:25.25 | hippieindamakin8 | when can i send u a proposal by the latest ? |
| 01:25.31 | hippieindamakin8 | for a review |
| 01:26.11 | brlcad | well gsoc hard deadline is on the timeline, I presume you know when that is |
| 01:26.23 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
| 01:26.28 | hippieindamakin8 | march 31st |
| 01:26.40 | brlcad | otherwise, it's up to you |
| 01:27.00 | brlcad | just the later, the harder it will be to properly review and iterate on the design |
| 01:27.15 | hippieindamakin8 | i am going through librt right now .. and some presentations by john anderson on application development |
| 01:27.22 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i know :( |
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| 08:17.51 | cosurgi | brlcad: sorry, I had unplanned reboot. And I'm afraid that more may be coming. |
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| 12:15.16 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30568 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): updates to librtserver |
| 13:36.41 | ``Erik | blargh. |
| 13:37.54 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:38.56 | ``Erik | the '68 prediction of 2008 on slashdot right now, one of the predictions was a 4 hour work day and 2 hours home study to keep up... with lots of free time... smacksnot comment is painfully true... |
| 13:39.03 | ``Erik | "They got it almost spot on: 4 hours actual work; 2 hours slashdot; 2 hours talking; 2 hours walking around the office; 1 hour making coffee's; 3 hours replying to emails; 3 hours answering telephones; 1 hour break time; 2 hours travel time; 2 hours home study time; 2 hours sleep. Rinse-and-repeat." |
| 13:40.50 | archivist | has reduce /. and increases irc |
| 13:45.12 | clock_ | this amuses me http://blog.modernmechanix.com/2008/03/24/what-will-life-be-like-in-the-year-2008/?Qwd=./MechanixIllustrated/11-1968/forty_years_future&Qif=forty_years_future_2.jpg&Qiv=thumbs&Qis=XL |
| 13:45.29 | clock_ | electrostatic precipitators clean the air in homes |
| 13:45.51 | ``Erik | "ionic breeze" |
| 13:46.06 | clock_ | I don't have electrostatic precipitators. I leave dust to accumulate on the floor and when it's annoying I pick up a broom and broom it together and throw into the dustbin |
| 13:46.21 | clock_ | Ocassionaly, when I manage to cross the threshold of my laziness, I do the whole room with a vacuum cleaner |
| 13:46.35 | ``Erik | I leave it on the floor until my wench find it annoying and she picks up the broom O.o |
| 13:46.36 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:46.48 | archivist | whats a broom |
| 13:46.48 | clock_ | wench == ? |
| 13:46.52 | ``Erik | woman |
| 13:47.05 | archivist | the_wench is my bot in #mysql |
| 13:47.10 | clock_ | archivist: a stick with bristles at the end that is used to sweep surfaces of particulate debris |
| 13:47.32 | ``Erik | an old derogatory term |
| 13:49.39 | archivist | "serving wench" the girl that brings the beer |
| 13:50.01 | ``Erik | if that's the definition of "serve" you want to use |
| 13:50.03 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 13:51.40 | clock_ | ``Erik: wench == wife? |
| 13:52.04 | ``Erik | no, just a gf right now |
| 13:52.17 | clock_ | What I find annoying on todays world is too civilized |
| 13:52.52 | ``Erik | I find it more annoying at how incredibly incivilized it is, yet pretending it's highly civilized |
| 13:52.55 | archivist | http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=wench |
| 13:54.55 | clock_ | the civilization takes fun away |
| 13:55.12 | clock_ | Zurich is more civilized than Prague it has flat sidewalks like runways |
| 13:55.20 | clock_ | When I ride skateboard it's dead boring all the way |
| 13:55.46 | ``Erik | skateboards, such an uncivilized behavior *sigh* |
| 13:55.47 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:55.49 | clock_ | Prague has cracks and I have to jump the cracks, they are always different size differently spaced so it never gets boring |
| 13:56.16 | clock_ | In Zurich I see no nature in the street |
| 13:56.40 | clock_ | In Prague I see grass between a lamp post and the sidewalk, in the crack of the sidewalk, in the crack between the sidewalk and the road |
| 13:56.52 | clock_ | No grass -> depressive -> depression -> suicide -> bad |
| 13:56.59 | clock_ | No wonder Swiss have such a high suicide rate |
| 13:57.36 | clock_ | We are FUCKING DEPARTING FROM THE NATURE |
| 13:59.33 | clock_ | I hope US don't have such obsessively compulsively overperfect streets |
| 14:01.05 | clock_ | god bless dust cracks bugs and dirt |
| 14:01.35 | clock_ | noone has ever died from a peeling plaster! |
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| 14:19.41 | MinuteElectron | clock_: if it got infected ;) |
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| 15:50.09 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
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| 17:27.38 | brlcad | burps |
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| 17:52.34 | lifeeth | hello all |
| 17:53.13 | lifeeth | I had some queries regarding one of the gsoc project ideas..."Web-based solid geometry model repository" |
| 17:53.43 | brlcad | howdy lifeeth |
| 17:54.03 | brlcad | hang around and we can talk about it in a while .. have to run off for a little while |
| 17:54.13 | lifeeth | ok |
| 17:54.19 | brlcad | (back in like 30min I think) |
| 17:54.42 | brlcad | otherwise, maybe one of the other guys can get you set up with info |
| 17:55.22 | lifeeth | @brlcad....I have a little bit of work...I will also be back in 30 min |
| 17:55.32 | lifeeth | Thanks |
| 17:59.38 | yukonbob | shuts off lights, flips "open" sign to closed for next half hour |
| 18:04.58 | ``Erik | kicks off his shoes and leans back |
| 18:34.49 | louipc | curses because his email isn't working. |
| 18:35.55 | ``Erik | curse? sounds more like a blessing |
| 18:37.04 | yukonbob | louipc: I can send my spam to the screen if you like, for that "Thank goodness I've got email" feeling. |
| 18:37.40 | ``Erik | /dcc send louipc ~/Mail/Spam |
| 18:39.14 | louipc | yukonbob: as long as they come with the patches I want :D |
| 18:40.08 | louipc | I actually get no spam in my public email address |
| 18:41.10 | louipc | but I get some spam in my personal mail because people don't know how to use the bcc field when forwarding to all their friends and shit |
| 19:15.07 | lifeeth | hello again |
| 19:15.15 | lifeeth | I had some queries regarding one of the gsoc project ideas..."Web-based solid geometry model repository" |
| 19:15.15 | brlcad | lifeeth: so did you have a particular question in mind about the task? there's a lot of leeway in the design |
| 19:16.47 | lifeeth | I have done some web development works before.. |
| 19:17.07 | lifeeth | But I don't use brlcad... |
| 19:17.53 | lifeeth | Do I need to have a strong familiarity with brlcad if I intend to work on this project |
| 19:19.18 | brlcad | not really strong |
| 19:19.44 | brlcad | basically the web interface can be seen like a wiki for 3D geometry models .. |
| 19:20.10 | brlcad | but to manage that effectively, you really need integrated tools -- like if someone uploads a model, you want to be able to see what that things looks like |
| 19:20.33 | brlcad | so you need to generate some pictures (or integrate some sort of 3d viewing mechansim, but that's a fair bit more effort) |
| 19:20.47 | brlcad | we have ways to generate pictures, so the web interface just runs the tool |
| 19:20.57 | brlcad | have you ever looked at the backend to Gallery? |
| 19:21.23 | lifeeth | Not the backend |
| 19:21.25 | brlcad | gallery might even serve a good starting point foundation itself since it has related data management models |
| 19:21.35 | brlcad | have you used gallery? |
| 19:21.36 | lifeeth | But I am familiar with gallery |
| 19:21.39 | brlcad | okay |
| 19:21.47 | brlcad | well like when you upload an image to gallyer |
| 19:22.09 | brlcad | it generates a set of resized images including the thumbnails |
| 19:22.24 | brlcad | it does that by kicking of gd or imagemagik back on the server |
| 19:22.40 | lifeeth | I am familiar with how it does it |
| 19:22.50 | brlcad | this task would involve doing something very similar where there would be renderers and geometry converters being called on the backend |
| 19:23.26 | brlcad | you don't really need to know those tools in depth other than what's needed to use for a specific purpose on the stie |
| 19:23.37 | lifeeth | Ok. |
| 19:23.39 | brlcad | at least that was my basic concept for that task |
| 19:23.48 | brlcad | there are other things that you could also do with that idea |
| 19:24.41 | brlcad | and it doesn't have to be a module, it could be all custom, could be ruby on rails, could be python, php, whatever .. the important aspect is something that will scale well and should be implemented cleanly/maintainably |
| 19:24.41 | lifeeth | Like adding user comments perhaps? |
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| 19:26.01 | lifeeth | I am more towards using existing CMS's so that maintaining and extending the site in the future could be easy |
| 19:26.01 | brlcad | maybe |
| 19:26.15 | brlcad | sure, that's why they were mentioned |
| 19:26.27 | brlcad | that does then help with access controls, comment streams, etc |
| 19:28.22 | lifeeth | I am a bit familiar with drupal |
| 19:29.45 | lifeeth | Are there any other requirements for the project ? |
| 19:30.56 | brlcad | you should define the requirements as you see them in your proposal, we can iterate on them via the comment/review proecess |
| 19:31.23 | brlcad | otherwise, not really, there's more than enough to do to hook in any CMS with the various tools and back-end content management |
| 19:31.56 | brlcad | geometry files can be *huge* (hundreds of megs or more) or tiny (just a few bytes) |
| 19:32.30 | brlcad | it would be nice to be able to categorize your models with tags/groupings when they are uploaded (e.g. via keywords) |
| 19:33.15 | lifeeth | i think that part can be managed , |
| 19:33.41 | archivist | web 3d viewing mechansim is a nice idea |
| 19:34.24 | lifeeth | A folksonomy would also be nice on the page |
| 19:35.33 | lifeeth | The 3d viewing mechanism might require the use of flash or java which might not be a pleasant experience for some users |
| 19:36.32 | brlcad | yeah, you'd have to make that either painless or otherwise have good detection so that it could fall back to images if not supported |
| 19:36.40 | archivist | there are a few systems about |
| 19:36.53 | archivist | most windows only |
| 19:36.58 | brlcad | otherwise, there are some *really* slick 3D viewers out there, some java some flash, some x3d/vrml plugins, etc |
| 19:37.15 | brlcad | e.g. http://www.javaview.de/demo/PaViewModels.html |
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| 19:40.37 | lifeeth | There are also a couple of java script based ones |
| 19:42.07 | lifeeth | I think I have a fair idea of what all are to be done for the project.. |
| 19:42.13 | lifeeth | Thanks for the help |
| 19:42.41 | brlcad | yeah, several options |
| 19:44.02 | brlcad | proposing implementing one is another possibility too, e.g. getting mged working as an embedded backend using RoR and/or ajax techniques to manipulate the display |
| 19:44.59 | ``Erik | but then we'd need to call it TEW POINT OHHHH |
| 19:46.22 | lifeeth | But then the server needs to be powerful enough if the files are huge |
| 19:48.31 | brlcad | lifeeth: possibly, though the server assets could be throttled too (use work and user queues) |
| 19:50.46 | lifeeth | I meant rendering with mged as a back-end for each user -- If we plan to use it for 3D viewing |
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| 19:52.39 | lifeeth | i dont think the statement was clear... |
| 19:53.27 | lifeeth | I mean if we render upon each user request to rotate |
| 19:53.56 | brlcad | you'd have one mged instance, or a pool of them that stay running -- users visit a page and would attach |
| 19:54.01 | brlcad | mged is very lightweight |
| 19:54.20 | brlcad | or at least can be compiled down to be very lightweight |
| 19:55.27 | lifeeth | But if some one wanted to do something nasty...They can upload a file that takes time to render and run a DoS |
| 19:58.08 | lifeeth | I will analyze the entire requirement and get back to the channel |
| 19:58.26 | lifeeth | Thanks for the help |
| 20:00.04 | brlcad | no problem |
| 20:00.22 | brlcad | feel free to post your idea to the wiki as well when you post your submission |
| 20:00.49 | lifeeth | Sure.. |
| 20:01.05 | brlcad | for us, it will mostly boil down to the quality of the applications themselves, and the candidates interest in long-term ideas (continuing past gsoc) |
| 20:01.29 | brlcad | there's a lot of great stuff to work on, just a matter of getting excited about an idea |
| 20:01.34 | brlcad | and running with it |
| 20:03.29 | cosurgi | brlcad: if you say that this libtool problem on debian is unfixable, or you have no time for that, I'll install libtool from upstream. I think I'll do it circa before saturday. |
| 20:06.20 | cosurgi | needs to do some stuff for yade, quickly. |
| 20:08.19 | brlcad | cosurgi: still working on it, just a lot of thrashing :) |
| 20:08.34 | brlcad | since this is submission week, it's a bit hectic :) |
| 20:08.56 | ``Erik | plus 8 zillion other things to pull attention |
| 20:09.09 | brlcad | yeah |
| 20:11.29 | ``Erik | ahhhhhhhhhh HA |
| 20:11.43 | ``Erik | <-- shakes fist vehemently at debian for a minute or 12 |
| 20:14.23 | cosurgi | brlcad: understood. Thanks :) |
| 20:14.44 | louipc | is it possible to define 'views' in a .g file? |
| 20:16.58 | ``Erik | no, but mged can save seperate view files |
| 20:17.07 | louipc | maybe a modeller could define certain views: top, isometric, cutaway, etc then the web upload client would render a certain number of those or allow the user to select some and that should give a nice preview of the contents with just static images |
| 20:18.40 | brlcad | louipc: there are a the default views, and for a given mged session you can save views in the view ring |
| 20:19.06 | louipc | maybe you can use that somehow |
| 20:19.18 | brlcad | for arbitrary views, you can run saveview/loadview to save/restore views (they're stored as external ray-trace script files that will render that view) |
| 20:19.26 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@210-9-137-47.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 20:19.54 | brlcad | i just made a mod yesterday that lets you override the renderer used in the saveview (among other options) |
| 20:22.23 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 20:26.45 | ``Erik | heh, neat http://bc.tech.coop/blog/images/xo-plt.jpg |
| 20:38.59 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 20:40.58 | cosurgi | brlcad: is the "MGED User Commands" in Appendix A of http://brlcad.org/w/images/c/cf/Introduction_to_MGED.pdf a complete reference? Or there are some commands left out? |
| 20:42.22 | cosurgi | wants to find out how to do simple 2D drawfting (lines, polylines, arcs, etc) |
| 20:43.06 | ``Erik | BRL-CAD is not a 2d drafting package... if you have a 3d representation, you can use 'rtedge', or if you like pain, you can try using the 'sketch' primitive :) |
| 20:44.02 | cosurgi | ``Erik: I know it's not 2d, and I'm looking for this stuff only becasue it's missing. |
| 20:44.46 | cosurgi | hm, does such reasoning make sense? |
| 20:45.34 | ``Erik | I understand what you're saying, but it's a large domain and the software was tuned to it's niche, not that one |
| 20:46.30 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/w/images/4/44/Industry_Diagram.pdf if you haven't already seen it :) |
| 20:50.58 | brlcad | cosurgi: the support I spoke to is almost entirely encapsulated in the sketch primitive |
| 20:52.14 | cosurgi | brlcad: ok. in Introduction_to_MGED.pdf I've fouind this: "There are additional shapes available in MGED that are not listed in the |
| 20:52.24 | cosurgi | preceding table: ...... sketch.." |
| 20:52.40 | cosurgi | where can I find some info about sketch? |
| 20:52.43 | ``Erik | imagines a seperate drafting gui could be built that used the underlying libwdb/librt shtuff to make sketch laden .g files, but would make the file useless for CAE |
| 20:54.08 | brlcad | cosurgi: i'm not sure how well documented sketches are |
| 20:54.09 | cosurgi | should learn what is libwdb/librt |
| 20:54.34 | brlcad | there is a basic sketch editor in mged that exposes all of the basic types through a horrid button interface |
| 20:54.49 | cosurgi | ok. |
| 20:55.08 | brlcad | make sk.s sketch |
| 20:55.10 | brlcad | e sk.s |
| 20:55.13 | brlcad | sed sk.s |
| 20:55.19 | brlcad | that will kick off the editor |
| 20:55.41 | brlcad | there's also a command-line input iirc, run "in" |
| 20:55.42 | ``Erik | imagines it's about as fun as LaTeX "picture" mode :D |
| 20:56.12 | brlcad | libwdb is the "write-only geometry database library" |
| 20:56.59 | brlcad | librt is the "ray-trace library" which is basically the core of the geometry engine, handles most of the representation types (in the g_*.c files) |
| 20:57.06 | cosurgi | ``Erik: heh, I was using that picture mode for diagrams in my PhD, http://janek.kozicki.pl/phdthesis/kozicki_2007_PhD.pdf |
| 20:57.42 | ``Erik | guesses he wont' be able to read it |
| 20:57.43 | ``Erik | :D |
| 20:58.08 | cosurgi | thanks for explanations :) |
| 20:58.22 | cosurgi | brlcad: the "make sk.s sketch" should be issued inside mged, right? |
| 20:58.27 | brlcad | right |
| 20:58.33 | brlcad | sk.s can be whatever |
| 20:58.50 | brlcad | via the gui, you can Edit -> Sketch iirc |
| 20:59.02 | cosurgi | ok. I didn't compile it, yet :-) |
| 20:59.10 | brlcad | ah, right ;) |
| 20:59.32 | brlcad | will be back on that later today |
| 20:59.32 | cosurgi | but I have irclog, and will go back to this point, and try it :) |
| 20:59.42 | ``Erik | http://blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=1467 |
| 20:59.52 | cosurgi | brlcad: don't feel pressed. We have time :) |
| 21:00.26 | brlcad | ahh, awesome.. fracture models |
| 21:00.57 | brlcad | was on a big fracture model kick a few years back.. so want to implement support for that in brl-cad |
| 21:02.07 | ``Erik | weird, a thesis for a polish uni in english O.o but neat stuff, and I can read it :D thanks for the link |
| 21:02.49 | cosurgi | heh. I keep telling everyone around to write their theses in english, because nobody understands polish these days. |
| 21:07.21 | cosurgi | brlcad: if it was a question (the "so want to implement support for that in brl-cad") - then, honestly, I'm more interested in AutoCAD-like GUI for brl-cad than in fracture support in brl-cad :) |
| 21:10.15 | brlcad | cosurgi: completely understand :) |
| 21:10.23 | brlcad | wants a better gui more too |
| 21:12.07 | cosurgi | there is no text primitive, right? |
| 21:12.37 | cosurgi | (because currently the text was done as 3D shapes by some guy) |
| 21:13.44 | ``Erik | sometimes its' done with 3d geometry, sometimes with sketch, I don't believe most models even bother with text (outside of the programatically accessable path names and region id's) |
| 21:17.30 | yukonbob | bets most models don't use text because it's not an option :) |
| 21:18.23 | archivist | a 2d from a model is useless wthout words |
| 21:19.09 | ``Erik | most models were specifically built to use 3 pieces of software, none of which have any use of embedded text (the text woudl just get in the way) |
| 21:23.32 | cosurgi | so for annotations and dimension lines brl-cad will need to add a text primitive. Storing this (drawing) data on the side of GUI is not a good idea. |
| 21:23.47 | yukonbob | would love to see text; possibly both of something like POVRay uses (text as an object), and perhaps something that's not in the model at all, but could optionally display, as an attribute of an item in the model... |
| 21:24.29 | cosurgi | ok, sorry, replace "text primitive" with whatever, attirbute, or sth else. |
| 21:24.51 | ``Erik | we have attributes, they have no graphical representation |
| 21:24.55 | cosurgi | anything that will work for me, and will be done in a clean way inside brl-cad :-) |
| 21:24.59 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548758AE.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:25.31 | ``Erik | but you can add, query, edit, and delete them in mged |
| 21:26.07 | *** join/#brlcad ewilhelm (n=ewilhelm@71.111.48.138) | |
| 21:28.13 | cosurgi | ``Erik: so maybe just adding graphical representation info to them would be enough? (eg. font size, is facing the camera or is fixed to some coordinate system, anchor coordinates) |
| 21:28.38 | ``Erik | what about font type? |
| 21:29.06 | ``Erik | and what if the machine doesn't have that font available? do fonts have to be carried inside of the .g, like PDF does? |
| 21:29.31 | cosurgi | could be. But for start I'd just deal with simple .shx (vector) fonts. |
| 21:29.48 | cosurgi | I think that GUI provides font. |
| 21:29.56 | ``Erik | someone here was drawing fonts on the display, he ended up making each character out of (bunches) of triangles, ugly stuff |
| 21:30.11 | ``Erik | TK provides some fonts, yeah |
| 21:30.26 | cosurgi | to make things simple - solve this problem by ignoring it. |
| 21:30.36 | cosurgi | later could be improved. But not now. |
| 21:30.53 | cosurgi | OpenGL has fonts too. |
| 21:30.57 | ``Erik | aight, happy hacking on that :D |
| 21:31.02 | ``Erik | ogl has no native fonts |
| 21:31.19 | ``Erik | several extra packages exist to draw fonts using ogl, but ogl itself has no concept of that |
| 21:31.46 | cosurgi | sorry, it's in glut, the glutBitmapCharacter |
| 21:31.47 | ``Erik | GLUT has the text stroke thingy, um, what's his name did that one that converts a set of X glyphs into a texture to draw |
| 21:32.14 | ``Erik | has written his own X font to ogl texture converters as well |
| 21:32.56 | ``Erik | and a gimp thingy to generate a cell managed image of a font, fun stuff |
| 21:33.30 | ``Erik | should go on haitus and do game coding again so he can enjoy computers once more O.o :D |
| 21:35.41 | cosurgi | ok. time to sleep for me. goodnight |
| 21:35.46 | ``Erik | night, dude |
| 21:53.28 | louipc | hmm it's funny to read someone that complains that a 1.6GHz cpu + 2G RAM is slow |
| 21:53.45 | ``Erik | dual 1.6ghz |
| 21:54.00 | *** join/#brlcad Z80-Boy (n=clock@217-162-110-3.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:54.08 | louipc | dual! shikes |
| 21:54.24 | alex_joni | it ain't no 16-cores machine |
| 21:54.50 | ``Erik | kicks his slow-assed 8 core 3ghz 16GB machine |
| 21:55.35 | archivist | cuddles his dual PII 200mhz |
| 21:55.37 | louipc | yeah I saw some ads for 8cores now |
| 21:55.54 | ``Erik | actually |
| 21:56.09 | ``Erik | kicks firefox for being brainfuck slow on a smoking 8x3ghz 16GB machine |
| 21:56.47 | archivist | firefox is just slow (broken internal methods) |
| 21:56.49 | hippieindamakin8 | woah naice machini man |
| 21:57.00 | hippieindamakin8 | hey all |
| 21:57.02 | louipc | firefox is written in javascript hah |
| 21:57.21 | louipc | hi hippieindamakin8 |
| 21:57.21 | archivist | slowscript |
| 22:01.20 | ``Erik | wanders home |
| 22:13.48 | hippieindamakin8 | can somebody tell me where is the jbrlcad module.. sean are u back ? |
| 22:15.09 | louipc | https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/jbrlcad/trunk/ |
| 22:16.39 | louipc | I don't think that has been distributed as tarballs |
| 22:17.31 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk |
| 22:17.35 | hippieindamakin8 | tx :) |
| 23:03.04 | *** join/#brlcad nmh_2Grajw (n=nmh@gw.nomh.org) | |
| 23:28.52 | brlcad | yup |
| 23:28.56 | brlcad | thx louipc |
| 23:29.05 | brlcad | hello nmh_2Grajw |
| 23:32.41 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30569 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtserver.h: Added a few more declarations |
| 23:36.18 | *** part/#brlcad ewilhelm (n=ewilhelm@71.111.48.138) | |
| 00:01.37 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:02.05 | nmh_2Grajw | oh, hi |
| 00:06.47 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1178014867.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 00:23.33 | brlcad | nmh_2Grajw: have a particular question, just lurking? :) |
| 00:24.05 | nmh_2Grajw | brlcad: if it is not a problem, both :) |
| 00:24.15 | brlcad | not a problem in the least |
| 00:31.38 | *** join/#brlcad Daytona (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 00:51.54 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30570 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtserver.h: remove duplicate decls, sort lines |
| 00:52.31 | louipc | brlcad: no problemo |
| 00:57.38 | nmh_2Grajw | hmm.. I am trying to export a single shape database to ascii, but I can't seem to find the file. Is there anything special I should know about this? |
| 00:59.15 | Daytona | the mged export asks for a file name, is that how you did it? |
| 01:00.21 | nmh_2Grajw | Daytona: yeah (the menu and dialog box). I tried "test.asc" , "/tmp/test.asc" and others |
| 01:01.28 | Daytona | another way to do it is from the command line: g2asc file.g file.asc |
| 01:03.33 | nmh_2Grajw | Daytona: hmm, now I feel dumb. I tried g2asc and (thought it didn't work) I just went to doublecheck and I have test.asc sitting right there in the directory. |
| 01:04.54 | Daytona | I just tried saving from mged and it worked for me. The asc file appeared in thwe same directory where I started mged |
| 01:05.42 | nmh_2Grajw | Daytona: yeah, that is what I see now. Thanks! |
| 01:05.52 | Daytona | you're welcome |
| 01:07.57 | nmh_2Grajw | continuing with the easy stuff - when I click the mouse button in the graphics window, the view zooms out - changing stuff in the mouse behavior menu doesn't change this. Is there an easy way for me to fix this? |
| 01:10.30 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30571 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: dbconcat verified, seems to work like a charm with default, -s, -p with or without affix |
| 01:10.52 | Daytona | the settings->Mouse Behavior menu mostly applies to middle button clicks |
| 01:13.39 | Daytona | In fact, I think it only applies to middle button |
| 01:14.27 | nmh_2Grajw | Daytona: I guess I will just be careful, since I only have one mouse button. |
| 01:15.12 | Daytona | Yes, the interface is designed for a 3 button mouse |
| 01:15.27 | brlcad | heya Daytona |
| 01:15.45 | Daytona | yo |
| 01:16.16 | brlcad | nmh_2Grajw: the mouse bindings as they are are called the "shift grips", you can get different behaviors depending on whether you're clicking with various modifiers pressed as well |
| 01:17.02 | Daytona | Yes, perhaps brlcad can provide advice for users with a one button mouse? |
| 01:17.05 | brlcad | I presume you're on a mac -- if you cmd-click, it should emulate the same event as a left-click |
| 01:17.26 | brlcad | likewise, option-click will give you middle-mouse |
| 01:17.51 | Daytona | I knew brlcad would know about those macs |
| 01:17.55 | brlcad | (cmd == the command key, i.e. the key with the apple on it) |
| 01:18.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 01:19.21 | nmh_2Grajw | neato (getting something useful out of the mouse) |
| 01:19.30 | brlcad | shift-control-click will give you dynamic zoom, shift-click will pan, ctrl-option-click will rotate |
| 01:20.34 | brlcad | control-option-click is probably what you're used to, if anything |
| 01:21.02 | nmh_2Grajw | yes, control-option-click == click, it seems |
| 01:22.00 | brlcad | control-option-click(and hold depressed while moving the cursor) |
| 01:23.57 | brlcad | ah, sorry, made that more complicated -- it's the same as just control-click(keep depressed and move cursor) |
| 01:32.43 | nmh_2Grajw | ooc, how important is white space in the ascii database files? (does each put need to be on a single line, or could I have each vertex on its own line?) |
| 01:33.32 | Daytona | The ascii file is just a Tcl script, so it follows the same syntax |
| 01:35.49 | Daytona | you can extend to another line by escaping the newline |
| 01:36.41 | nmh_2Grajw | ahh, good to know (both the Tcl and the newline) |
| 01:58.40 | nmh_2Grajw | I am going to go off and poke at this some more, thank for the help! |
| 01:59.11 | brlcad | nmh_2Grajw: sounds good, drop by any time |
| 02:02.55 | *** part/#brlcad nmh_2Grajw (n=nmh@gw.nomh.org) | |
| 03:21.24 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 03:55.45 | pacman87 | after the source svn and compiling (25 minutes later), the last several lines are errors |
| 03:55.56 | pacman87 | *getting the source |
| 03:57.05 | brlcad | hey pacman87 |
| 03:57.12 | brlcad | pacman87: which os? |
| 03:57.16 | pacman87 | slackware 12 |
| 03:57.29 | brlcad | hm, haven't seen that in a long while -- what's the error? |
| 03:57.35 | brlcad | ~pastebin |
| 03:57.36 | ibot | [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste |
| 03:57.49 | brlcad | er, paste.bzflag.bz |
| 03:58.01 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.com/m4dfb88ac |
| 04:01.34 | brlcad | need more than that |
| 04:01.43 | brlcad | lines preceeding |
| 04:01.46 | pacman87 | how far back? |
| 04:01.52 | brlcad | to the compile line |
| 04:01.56 | brlcad | gcc |
| 04:02.03 | pacman87 | i ran make |
| 04:02.22 | brlcad | yeah, but if you look up the preceeding lines, one of them mentions gcc |
| 04:02.30 | brlcad | from there forward |
| 04:02.32 | pacman87 | if gcc... |
| 04:03.23 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m8c1030c |
| 04:04.01 | brlcad | ahh |
| 04:04.05 | brlcad | what was your configure line? |
| 04:04.19 | brlcad | looks like it auto-detected a system tcl |
| 04:04.25 | pacman87 | ./configure --enable-optimized |
| 04:04.31 | brlcad | but not a system incrTcl |
| 04:04.44 | brlcad | 8.4 is incompatible with our incrTcl |
| 04:04.56 | brlcad | make that ./configure --enable-optimized --enable-aa |
| 04:05.00 | brlcad | er, --enable-all |
| 04:05.26 | pacman87 | does --enable-optimized incease compile tim? |
| 04:05.29 | pacman87 | time |
| 04:07.01 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:07.05 | brlcad | no |
| 04:07.09 | brlcad | quite the contrary |
| 04:07.31 | brlcad | er, sorry -- yes it does |
| 04:07.47 | brlcad | read that backwards :) |
| 04:07.52 | pacman87 | by how much? |
| 04:08.03 | brlcad | about doubles it on most systems |
| 04:08.23 | brlcad | likewise turning it on will give about a rough 2X runtime boost |
| 04:08.30 | brlcad | (wrt ray-tracing) |
| 04:08.37 | pacman87 | ok, so i'll take it off for now |
| 04:08.44 | pacman87 | dont' want to wait another 25 min |
| 04:08.53 | brlcad | yeah |
| 04:09.11 | brlcad | sounds like you're machines not too spiffy too .. bwish is probably only about 1/3 through the compile |
| 04:09.16 | brlcad | which is where it stopped |
| 04:09.21 | pacman87 | wow |
| 04:09.42 | brlcad | tis a big package, more than a million lines |
| 04:09.57 | brlcad | lots of functionality |
| 04:10.10 | pacman87 | it's a 2.8 GHz P4, no hyperthreading, 533MHz fsb, 1280 MB ram PC2700 |
| 04:10.56 | brlcad | yeah, mildly aged .. but that shouldn't take more than a half-hour I'd think |
| 04:11.30 | brlcad | (with opt off, with it on depends on many factors) |
| 04:12.13 | pacman87 | i'm interested in applying for GSoC |
| 04:12.24 | brlcad | excellent |
| 04:12.36 | pacman87 | 3rd year ME student at UT austin |
| 04:13.13 | brlcad | so where's your interest? |
| 04:13.31 | pacman87 | i've been lookign at the new primitives section |
| 04:13.45 | brlcad | cool |
| 04:14.03 | pacman87 | even though that's not one of the 'high priority' ones on the list |
| 04:14.11 | pacman87 | it's probably the one i'd be best at |
| 04:14.18 | brlcad | a good application overrides the priorities |
| 04:14.38 | brlcad | those priorities are project priorities, not applicant priorities |
| 04:14.43 | pacman87 | i noticed your app guidelines "do |
| 04:14.52 | pacman87 | 's", says "play the game" |
| 04:14.59 | brlcad | heh, it does? |
| 04:15.02 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 04:15.08 | pacman87 | second paragraph |
| 04:15.09 | brlcad | I thought I got all those taken care of |
| 04:15.11 | brlcad | thanks |
| 04:15.29 | pacman87 | i suppose it could be taken more metaphorically |
| 04:15.33 | pacman87 | the programming game |
| 04:15.37 | brlcad | hehe |
| 04:16.12 | brlcad | our project admin is also the project admin for bzflag |
| 04:16.22 | brlcad | so the texts are ... really similar :) |
| 04:16.32 | brlcad | nice that you noticed though, seriously |
| 04:17.02 | pacman87 | finished! 6m20s |
| 04:17.25 | brlcad | wow, that's one seriously expensive optimization loop |
| 04:17.34 | pacman87 | no kidding |
| 04:17.35 | brlcad | did you make clean or just make? |
| 04:17.39 | pacman87 | make |
| 04:17.41 | brlcad | okay |
| 04:17.45 | brlcad | so that saved you some time |
| 04:17.54 | brlcad | you'll have a mix of optimized and unoptimized |
| 04:18.05 | brlcad | (which is not a problem) |
| 04:19.08 | brlcad | means you probably only had about 15 minutes left, your optimized compile is probably about 30-40 minutes it sounds |
| 04:19.16 | pacman87 | how are the current primitives handled? |
| 04:19.20 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Sean |
| 04:19.22 | brlcad | unoptimized is probably 15-25 |
| 04:20.03 | brlcad | pacman87: the librt library is the primary harbor for the primitives -- that's where they are predominantly defined |
| 04:20.11 | brlcad | src/librt/g_*.c |
| 04:20.28 | pacman87 | ok, i'll start my code reading there |
| 04:20.41 | brlcad | there's a g_*.c for each primitive type with what should be fairly obvious callbacks |
| 04:20.54 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Sean i wen through some files of jbrlcad |
| 04:20.57 | brlcad | g_xxx.c is a stubbed version iirc |
| 04:20.58 | brlcad | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 04:21.05 | hippieindamakin8 | and i seem to get a hang of that problem statement |
| 04:21.29 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: after you read through jbrlcad, compare that to what's going on in src/librt |
| 04:21.38 | brlcad | in the main brlcad module |
| 04:21.40 | hippieindamakin8 | sure |
| 04:21.59 | brlcad | you'll see that there is LOTS of overlap, it's designed off of the current C api (as we're already rather modular) |
| 04:22.21 | hippieindamakin8 | i am rt now understand the optimised ray tracing stuff too :P |
| 04:22.31 | hippieindamakin8 | ok.. |
| 04:22.55 | brlcad | pacman87: the other two places to look are src/libwdb where there is an mk_*() function for each primitive type to create them procedurally, and src/mged/typein.c and a few others have some of the editing/input methods for creating them |
| 04:24.50 | brlcad | pacman87: you also considering applying to bz? |
| 04:25.24 | pacman87 | i'm not really sure what i'd do there |
| 04:26.12 | brlcad | k, just checking |
| 04:26.27 | brlcad | now I realize why your nick was so familiar though :) |
| 04:26.35 | brlcad | been there since last winter iirc |
| 04:26.50 | pacman87 | right, that's when i started doing plugins |
| 04:35.48 | pacman87 | hmm, running /usr/brlcad/bin/mged opens the window and takes 96%cpu to do nothing - no menus open |
| 05:05.23 | brlcad | odd, not seen that before |
| 05:05.33 | brlcad | what version are you using? |
| 05:05.49 | pacman87 | 7.12.1 |
| 05:06.00 | brlcad | probably something really recent |
| 05:06.19 | brlcad | related to the non-backgrounding we do now |
| 05:06.32 | brlcad | or it's actually receiving a constant stream of events |
| 05:06.42 | brlcad | would have to profile/debug it |
| 05:07.24 | pacman87 | what would you recommend using? |
| 05:08.10 | brlcad | gprof, valgrind, oprofile |
| 05:08.29 | brlcad | gprof is pretty simple, if installed, you could recompile with --enable-profile |
| 05:08.43 | brlcad | and it'll profile it by default |
| 05:09.17 | pacman87 | man gprof |
| 05:11.40 | brlcad | basically involves adding -pg to the compile and link lines -- then you just run the binary once it's installed and it'll dump out a gmon.out file .. then you run gprof /usr/brlcad/bin/mged in the same dir as that gmon.out file and it'll generate a report |
| 05:12.08 | brlcad | you could also run mged inside gdb, and just ctrl-c a few times to see where in the stack trace it is |
| 05:13.08 | pacman87 | i've been telling myself to learn to use a debugger for a while now, but all of my programs have been small enough that printf() is sufficient |
| 05:13.46 | brlcad | very useful skill to learn |
| 05:14.02 | hippieindamakin8 | same here |
| 05:16.57 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:16.57 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:40.10 | brlcad | so run, let it go for a couple seconds, then quit? :) |
| 05:40.33 | brlcad | it should be exiting normally |
| 05:41.15 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m60fc5897 |
| 05:41.19 | pacman87 | from gdb |
| 05:42.38 | brlcad | mged's not hung is it? |
| 05:42.43 | brlcad | does it respond? |
| 05:42.45 | pacman87 | no |
| 05:42.55 | pacman87 | *no response |
| 05:42.56 | brlcad | no to which? |
| 05:43.01 | brlcad | ah, so it's hosed |
| 05:43.12 | brlcad | it'll be hosed once you ctrl-c in mged |
| 05:43.16 | brlcad | s/hosed/paused/ |
| 05:44.12 | brlcad | run "mged -c" .. and select 'nu' .. does that use cpu? |
| 05:45.11 | pacman87 | no |
| 05:45.57 | pacman87 | i get the standard "mged>" prompt, which responds normally |
| 05:48.59 | brlcad | okay, that's good |
| 05:51.29 | brlcad | next thing to try, same -c but select X |
| 05:53.20 | pacman87 | standard "mged>" in terminal, plus a dm_X0 window, and cpu is fine |
| 05:55.08 | brlcad | well that's enough to work on a new primitive *ahem* :) |
| 05:55.33 | pacman87 | i first tried brlcad 3-4 years ago |
| 05:55.43 | pacman87 | lookign for a free/open source CAD program |
| 05:55.57 | brlcad | so mged is non-functional when you start it with no options, using full-cpu |
| 05:56.03 | brlcad | do the menus respond at all? |
| 05:56.08 | pacman87 | not at all |
| 05:56.19 | brlcad | k |
| 05:56.40 | pacman87 | but i got scared away by the command line (this was before i started teaching myself linux) |
| 05:58.24 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30572 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: mged seems to be locking up at least on slackware, taking up full cpu and being non-responsive. works find with -c and X dm. reported by pacman87 (thx). |
| 05:58.52 | brlcad | yeah, our command-centric approach is really frightening to some |
| 05:59.05 | brlcad | hence the ton of priority focus on revamping the gui |
| 05:59.15 | pacman87 | UT sold their soul to SolidWorks |
| 05:59.34 | brlcad | yeah |
| 06:00.01 | hippieindamakin8 | i asked my professor here to use brlcad and he said NO :P it aint user friendly |
| 06:00.16 | pacman87 | i'm thinking the revolve would be easiest to do |
| 06:00.31 | brlcad | solidworks, unigraphics/nx, pro/engineer, and catia consume most of the cad domain with autocad dominating drafting |
| 06:00.34 | hippieindamakin8 | its the same everywhere ppl use solidworks |
| 06:01.07 | hippieindamakin8 | ya btw i used pythoncad before realising the existance of brlcad |
| 06:01.15 | pacman87 | i use solidworks at my internship/part time job at ARLUT |
| 06:02.21 | hippieindamakin8 | and i was asked everywhere to use.. autocad :P |
| 06:04.21 | hippieindamakin8 | wat do u work on pacman ? |
| 06:05.24 | pacman87 | autonomous surface vehicle for sonar testing |
| 06:06.30 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: and what did you think of pythoncad |
| 06:07.59 | hippieindamakin8 | firstly it is good enough for drafting |
| 06:08.35 | brlcad | really think so? I don't get that feeling |
| 06:08.47 | hippieindamakin8 | very simple and good interface for the students |
| 06:09.10 | hippieindamakin8 | that is wat i felt.. but yeah.. brlcad is most optimised |
| 06:09.41 | hippieindamakin8 | it has so far the best real time ray tracing as i have read |
| 06:10.25 | hippieindamakin8 | pythoncad is good enough for amatuers.. :) all my projects so far have been done on pythoncad after my freshman year in college |
| 06:12.19 | hippieindamakin8 | the problem is that it cant export to any standard stuff |
| 06:12.50 | hippieindamakin8 | i meant standard format... wat do u say brlcad |
| 06:16.05 | brlcad | a very immature project with very little practical features, but a nice interface and reasonable features for the start of drafting purposes |
| 06:17.00 | hippieindamakin8 | if u ask me to rate these i would rate pycad4.5 and brlcad 7 |
| 06:19.44 | hippieindamakin8 | cya guys.. time for the class.. i shall be back in 6 hrs |
| 06:19.51 | brlcad | cya |
| 06:47.14 | brlcad | waves g'night |
| 06:48.34 | brlcad | pacman87: one more thing to try, you can run in gdb, set a breakpoint on main or some other early-executed function, and then single-step till things go awry |
| 06:49.11 | brlcad | might get tricky as there's a tcl eval loop that kicks in, but with some patience you would eventually get to the line of interest |
| 06:49.32 | pacman87 | i'll have to do some more research on debuggers first |
| 06:49.44 | brlcad | you can use continue and breakpoints to get to the point in the code that is problematic |
| 06:49.46 | pacman87 | thanks for your help |
| 06:49.52 | brlcad | no problem |
| 06:50.13 | pacman87 | definately a steep learning curve, though (cmd line) |
| 06:51.37 | brlcad | useful gdb commands are "b file:line" or "b function" to set a breakpoint, "run" to run, "c" to continue, "l" to list the sources where you're at, "l line" or "l file:line" to list the sources in a specific place, "p variable" to print it's value, "up" and "down" to go up and down the call stack |
| 06:52.37 | brlcad | "n" to execute the next statement, "s" to step 'into' a function |
| 06:52.50 | brlcad | i think some of the common ones are summarized on the manual page iirc |
| 06:53.08 | pacman87 | yeah, and it's got a pretty nice 'help' feature |
| 06:53.35 | pacman87 | contemplates solving this as his 'bugfix' |
| 06:53.50 | brlcad | would be impressive |
| 06:54.28 | brlcad | and shouldn't be too hard .. might even be able to back up in time through the svn revisions and find a version that was working, find the commit that broke it |
| 06:54.37 | brlcad | bets it was within the last two months |
| 06:56.05 | pacman87 | i'm builing bzflag 2.0.11 and 2.99 now so i can run my servers from linux |
| 06:56.42 | pacman87 | i dual boot winXP |
| 06:57.15 | pacman87 | 2am, goodnight |
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| 13:41.46 | brlcad | notes there's another submission |
| 13:41.54 | brlcad | (and it needs more detail) |
| 15:48.18 | brlcad | d_rossberg: have you tried the 7.12.0 installer? |
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| 15:55.07 | d_rossberg | brlcad: i can see the source download on sourceforge only, where can i find the installer? |
| 15:58.06 | brlcad | ah, sorry |
| 15:58.12 | brlcad | it's on the anonymous ftp site |
| 15:58.19 | brlcad | ftp://ftp.brlcad.org/incoming |
| 15:59.27 | brlcad | we weren't going to distribute binaries for this .0 release until it was better tested .. and with good reason seeing that wim encountered problems |
| 16:01.16 | d_rossberg | i'm sorry but i'm using linux at home, on monday i'll be back in my office |
| 16:02.57 | d_rossberg | but then i can do (probable) a complete test with a new visual studio |
| 16:03.44 | brlcad | okay, no problem |
| 16:33.43 | brlcad | wonders if Balakrishnan is the guy that was here last night |
| 16:53.58 | cosurgi | brlcad: I got new GPU today, no more unplanned reboots (hopefully). My old GeForce 6600 had lost its fan one year after warranty expired, and my PC was instatenously rebooting once GPU temperature reached 110 C |
| 16:54.49 | cosurgi | so today I bought fanless graphics card :) the cheapest one with dual-DVI, GeForce 8600 GT |
| 16:55.45 | cosurgi | That GPU without a fan was a good method to prevent me from playing games. But it started to interfere with yade development (I'm using OpenGL there) so finally I had to buy a new one. |
| 16:55.56 | cosurgi | (-: |
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| 17:01.13 | brlcad | cosurgi: cool, that's a nice card |
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| 18:52.47 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Sean .. this OO stuff is awesome man.. i am too much interested in this project :) i shall send in a proposal as soon as i wake up |
| 19:06.55 | d_rossberg | hippieindamakin8: yes, make a claim for this topic, it makes the discussion easier |
| 19:08.45 | d_rossberg | there are some attempts you can use |
| 19:16.42 | hippieindamakin8 | i have been going through the jbrlcad module and the librt libraries |
| 19:17.42 | hippieindamakin8 | and i am seriously interested in implementing the OO geometry APIs. .. some of them have already been implemented :) |
| 19:18.07 | hippieindamakin8 | d_rossberg : u are a mentor too ? |
| 19:19.38 | d_rossberg | yes |
| 19:19.48 | hippieindamakin8 | naice :) |
| 19:20.44 | hippieindamakin8 | i have kind of figured out how the geometry has been rendered so far |
| 19:22.47 | hippieindamakin8 | and i would like to code in JAVA itself to continue to build the module .. i am strongly familiar with both C++ and JAVA |
| 19:24.49 | d_rossberg | i have written a c++ interface for my company's purpose, and now we want to implement a full interface as open source |
| 19:25.18 | hippieindamakin8 | company as in ? |
| 19:25.59 | hippieindamakin8 | at the same time u want to make it object oriented framework |
| 19:28.03 | d_rossberg | i would recommend to implement a c++ api first and use this as basis for other languages (e.g. i build a COM interface to use BRL-CAD in MS Excel) |
| 19:31.50 | hippieindamakin8 | COM interface what is it ? |
| 19:32.42 | hippieindamakin8 | BRLCAD in MS Excel interesting.. wat exactly u gonna do .. send some csv s or smthing ? |
| 19:32.52 | hippieindamakin8 | COM do u mean the serial port |
| 19:33.22 | hippieindamakin8 | k :) |
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| 19:57.31 | louipc | COM > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Component_Object_Model |
| 19:57.34 | louipc | methinks |
| 19:58.24 | hippieindamakin8 | :( thanks |
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| 20:20.41 | d_rossberg | COM: this was a serious question? |
| 20:23.18 | hippieindamakin8 | i knew that it was called DCOM in linux and the serial port was called COM port here :( |
| 20:24.34 | d_rossberg | DCOM is the network version of COM (similar to CORBA) |
| 20:26.21 | hippieindamakin8 | oh |
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| 20:37.33 | d_rossberg | if you want to write MS Windows modules COM maybe a good choice: they can be used im Visual Basic (for applications too), some commercial CADs are offering a COM interface too |
| 20:39.53 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh :) |
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| 21:28.56 | jdoliner | hello |
| 21:31.02 | jdoliner | anyone here |
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| 21:38.54 | hippieindamakin8 | hello jdoliner |
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| 00:13.40 | brlcad | jdoliner: howdy |
| 01:08.59 | jdoliner | brlcad: are you present |
| 01:10.49 | brlcad | i am present |
| 01:12.04 | jdoliner | great |
| 01:12.34 | jdoliner | I've been looking over some papers on CSG algorithms for BREP |
| 01:14.12 | brlcad | great |
| 01:14.57 | brlcad | so how do things look? |
| 01:15.14 | jdoliner | well the algorithms seem understandable enough |
| 01:15.57 | jdoliner | they just involve extending the features to affine spaces and then detecting their intersections with the other features |
| 01:17.27 | brlcad | please do reference the papers you read in your submission |
| 01:17.38 | jdoliner | of course |
| 01:17.52 | jdoliner | however I have a few questions |
| 01:18.02 | brlcad | sure |
| 01:19.52 | jdoliner | firstly I'm afraid I'm not yet that knowledgeable about the brlcad code base, so I haven't seen precisely what our BREP structures look like so I wonder if you could tell me exactly where in the src they're located |
| 01:21.51 | jdoliner | also are there any major constraints for the algorithm that you think wouldn't be immediately obvious, for example is it important that polygonal structures maintain quads or not |
| 01:23.41 | brlcad | okay, this is mildly complicated to explain, so bear with me |
| 01:25.26 | brlcad | we actually have two brep implementations in our codebase, one is the n-manifold support (i.e. "NMGs") in our librt library the other is through the openNURBS library |
| 01:26.26 | brlcad | our nmgs support both polygonal and spline surface breps, but there are rather significant differences between the two |
| 01:27.56 | jdoliner | such as |
| 01:28.28 | brlcad | nmgs are huge body of code in src/librt/nmg*.c and that is the code that is called if you create an 'nmg' (polygonal), a 'bot' (bag of triangles), or a 'nurbs' brl-cad primitive |
| 01:29.07 | brlcad | the code for nurbs is in src/librt/nurb*.c .. it's another rather extensive body of code |
| 01:30.27 | brlcad | we're in the process of replacing the nurbs body of code (and 'maybe' later the nmg/bot implementations) with the openNURBS library facilities via the implementation of a new 'brep' primitive type |
| 01:31.08 | brlcad | your work relates to that latter new effort, part of the 'brep' implementation |
| 01:31.23 | jdoliner | yes |
| 01:32.27 | brlcad | so as I mentioned, we're using openNURBS for that implementation -- but openNURBS doesn't provide *any* geometry evaluation routines (such as CSG evaluation) |
| 01:32.28 | jdoliner | So possibly my proposal could contain a new implementation of a 'brep' primitive and then CSG operations to go with it |
| 01:33.04 | brlcad | no, no -- you really couldn't possibly implement a new brep primitive nor do you need to |
| 01:33.07 | brlcad | we've already started on that |
| 01:33.14 | brlcad | src/librt/g_brep.c among other files |
| 01:33.18 | jdoliner | oh I see |
| 01:33.25 | brlcad | it's about 90% complete for that matter |
| 01:33.49 | brlcad | where your work comes into play is that we have about 30 other primitives |
| 01:34.28 | brlcad | those primitives are presently represented in implicit form -- so we have plans to implement the necessary "describe be in brep form" function |
| 01:34.29 | jdoliner | so the CSG algorithm needs to work on those primitives |
| 01:34.50 | jdoliner | in brep form that is |
| 01:34.59 | brlcad | right |
| 01:35.41 | brlcad | so we can take an existing CSG model, that is stored in implicit form .. ask for it in brep form, evaluate the brep-on-brep csg to generate an evaluated brep result |
| 01:36.58 | jdoliner | right that seems doable to me |
| 01:37.41 | jdoliner | what level of specificity is good for my proposal |
| 01:37.49 | brlcad | this might just amount to implementing functions that were removed from openNURBS for evaluating ON_Brep objects |
| 01:38.32 | brlcad | they removed most of their evaluation functions as they only intend/want the library to be used for reading/writing the 3dm file format -- we're extending the library, though |
| 01:39.21 | brlcad | (which is all kosher, just means we have a LOT of heavy/hard coding to do) |
| 01:39.56 | brlcad | be as specific as you care to be, the more detail the better |
| 01:40.27 | brlcad | this is a hot hot topic for us, so an outstanding proposal will easily be a high-priority contender for a slot |
| 01:41.55 | brlcad | show that you understand the algorithm and how to go about implementing it, how it relates to brl-cad (even if it includes rewording and reiterating what i've said here) |
| 01:44.22 | brlcad | you don't have to talk about what files you'd be editing, there is too much detail -- don't expect everything to be figured out, but the proposal needs to instill confidence that you understand the task, are passionate about the work, interested in long term development (which I hope you are!) :), and can communicate your ideas well |
| 01:44.41 | jdoliner | okay so basically the project boils down to: implement all of our 30 primitives as BREP objects, then implement CSG for BREP such that CSG model in implicit form could be converted into a BREP form |
| 01:45.47 | jdoliner | also where are the primitives implemented |
| 01:45.49 | brlcad | hehe |
| 01:46.02 | brlcad | well, I wouldn't include the 30 primitives |
| 01:46.16 | brlcad | focus on the implementation of the CSG BREP evaluation routine first as the core |
| 01:46.36 | brlcad | then maybe add in room to start on the 30 primitives if time allows it |
| 01:46.46 | jdoliner | okay that seems reasonable |
| 01:47.02 | brlcad | some of the existing primitives will be very hard to describe in brep form |
| 01:47.17 | brlcad | there are several, however that are already done |
| 01:47.29 | brlcad | they're just implemented using the old nurbs code |
| 01:47.41 | brlcad | all the primitives for brl-cad are in src/librt/g_*.c |
| 01:48.26 | jdoliner | right |
| 01:49.15 | jdoliner | Okay I think that's all I have for right now |
| 01:49.22 | jdoliner | thanks a bunch |
| 01:49.31 | brlcad | look forward to seeing yours... |
| 01:49.52 | brlcad | what's your background coding? |
| 01:51.24 | jdoliner | I've had formal education in both C and Scheme as I mentioned |
| 01:52.00 | brlcad | yeah, sorry -- been talking to a lot of folks, so need reminders :) |
| 01:52.01 | jdoliner | I really haven't been coding all that long |
| 01:52.13 | jdoliner | So formal in those two |
| 01:52.24 | brlcad | have you ever read/written any C++ ? |
| 01:52.58 | jdoliner | Then I spent the summer coding at Fermilab |
| 01:53.41 | jdoliner | Yeah physics programs are all very hacked together so I saw and wrote some C++, as well as Fortran over the summer |
| 01:54.40 | jdoliner | I can't claim to know the nuances by any means but I can hack |
| 01:55.07 | brlcad | fortunately, you can conceivably stick "mostly" with C .. but openNURBS is a C++ API, so to dig in deep there in figuring out the ON_Brep object structure is going to require some getting up to speed |
| 01:59.50 | jdoliner | I might have to brush up a bit before the summer starts then |
| 02:01.12 | brlcad | nods |
| 02:01.22 | brlcad | certainly not a show-stopper, it's not that much of a hurdle |
| 02:01.28 | brlcad | particularly for what you're doing |
| 02:01.57 | brlcad | and all else failing, there's plenty of C routines related to this task that you could be refocused onto if you true do get stuck |
| 02:02.03 | brlcad | s/true/truly/ |
| 02:31.04 | pacman87 | brlcad: mged works only after minimizing the graphics window |
| 02:31.54 | starseeker | tries inkscape for importing a .fig file and it seems to do pretty well - just needs a little scaling |
| 02:33.15 | brlcad | pacman87: you mean that undoes the lockup? |
| 02:33.51 | pacman87 | brlcad: yes, after minimizing, the mged> window opens |
| 02:34.53 | pacman87 | and cpu usages returns to ~0 |
| 02:35.35 | brlcad | wow, wierd .. almost like it's stuck in a loop expecting an expose event |
| 02:36.21 | pacman87 | and if i click on a menu while it's locked up, it opens the menu after it's minimized (floating on my screen) and gives the 'window not visible' error |
| 02:36.35 | brlcad | yeah, that makes sense |
| 02:36.47 | brlcad | the events are just queue'd up |
| 02:38.30 | brlcad | if you want to go old-school debug style, you could add printf's incrementally to find the call or loop it's blocking on |
| 02:38.41 | brlcad | src/mged/ged.c is where mged's main starts |
| 02:41.46 | pacman87 | what compile flag do i need for gdb? |
| 02:42.12 | pacman87 | i need to learn real debugging sometime, why not now |
| 02:44.10 | brlcad | gdb only needs -g (which is on by default for both optimized and unoptimized) |
| 02:44.25 | brlcad | so unless you add --disable-debug, it should be debuggable |
| 02:44.42 | brlcad | if it's optimized, symbols and line numbers may be off, but it should work |
| 02:56.22 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30573 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db5_bin.c: eliminated excess logging |
| 02:59.27 | brlcad | pacman87: it is really appreciated that you're working on a patch (at least it seems like that's what you're doing) but you can put in your submission in before the patch if you like |
| 03:00.34 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 03:00.38 | yukonbob | hello cadheads |
| 03:01.03 | brlcad | it is important that the application be solid regardless of the patch, the patch is then a major criteria to help differentiate the finalists |
| 03:01.11 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 03:01.22 | yukonbob | what's shaking, brlcad? |
| 03:03.20 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30574 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (make_solid.tcl openw.tcl tclIndex): added binunif to create menu |
| 03:03.45 | brlcad | o.0 |
| 03:03.48 | brlcad | not much |
| 03:04.10 | brlcad | Mr. Anderson has been busy! |
| 03:05.27 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 03:05.27 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Release 7.12.0 imminent (no really!) || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list || GSoC application submissions are now open, submission deadline is March 31st | |
| 03:05.33 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:06.19 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:06.49 | yukonbob | heh -- /me locked self out of ssh'd/screen'd session w/ ipfw -- hence the (non)garbage |
| 03:07.13 | brlcad | fun |
| 03:07.46 | yukonbob | only briefly, thank goodness -- both machines happen to be in front of me too, so not that scary. |
| 03:08.50 | yukonbob | brlcad: you catch the brief dialogue other day (I don't remember if you were directly involved) about text in BRL-CAD? |
| 03:10.19 | brlcad | musta missed that |
| 03:11.03 | brlcad | it needs to be better documented and exposed in simple routines (like "draw this text here in 2D/3D") |
| 03:11.42 | brlcad | brb |
| 03:11.46 | yukonbob | hrmm -- ok -- part of it was about displaying text, and I think there are two basic options (iiuc) text-as-objects (a la POVRay (which is awesome)), or using the attributes of objects, and some auxillary display mech. |
| 03:11.50 | yukonbob | waits |
| 03:19.46 | yukonbob | grabs other 'puter, starts playing with graphing software |
| 03:43.25 | brlcad | yeah, text-as-objects would be annotation support |
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| 03:43.46 | brlcad | you can use attributes to stash pretty much any random info, but not quite the same beast |
| 03:51.00 | yukonbob | returns -- ok -- here's my "I wonder" though: if one had text attributes, could one parse the attributes and annotate a display... so my question I guess is: "What is the display?", including the on-screen version, and a dumpted-to-file version -- does rt do the rendering and pass it off to something else, or is rt's work the end-all-be-all? Is Tcl involved in a pipeline here? |
| 03:51.16 | yukonbob | *dumped-to-file |
| 03:59.32 | yukonbob | hits hay -- ciao, all. |
| 04:18.21 | brlcad | rt is the end-all-be-all of geometric display -- it certainly "could" pass it through another filter later, but that certainly would not be ray-tracing (and doe not presently occur) |
| 04:19.32 | yukonbob | returns briefly |
| 04:20.07 | brlcad | there is also a question of what you mean by display -- there is a "wireframe" display both projectable in 2D and in 3D, and possible 3D visualization (e.g. opengl), and 3D projected to 2D rasterization (i.e. ray-tracing) |
| 04:21.14 | yukonbob | ok -- imagine if rt generated 'hints' for attributes to look-up and x,y positions to locate the attribute values, one could have the bitmap returned by rt annotated after-the-fact; not by ray-tracing, but some simple 2d-based annotation... |
| 04:21.31 | brlcad | so an object could have some textual label attribute, for example -- you could easily show a wireframe for it (perhaps even in a given font) and in 2D or 3D |
| 04:21.57 | brlcad | but then that same label wouldn't ray-trace unless you give it "thickness" |
| 04:23.17 | brlcad | which we could do too .. e.g. assign annotations a default thickness of the current rendering cell size by default |
| 04:23.50 | brlcad | so the text would rasterize during ray-trace |
| 04:24.05 | brlcad | another possibility would be a separate render pass similar to what rtwizard does |
| 04:24.24 | brlcad | where you'd have a tool that would just rasterize the annotations onto a given image context |
| 04:24.32 | yukonbob | what if rt said in it's output "here's some meta-info about what I just gave you: there's an object foo, with center-of-mass at 200x99; there's an object bar with a center-of-mass at 40x90; there's an object baz with c-o-m @ 1000x777", and some other program took that, looked up the attributes (if available) for those objects, and then printed at the c-o-m appropriate labels (gleened from attributes) on the bitmap? |
| 04:25.42 | brlcad | that would be the separate pass tool I mentioned, albeit a slight variation for it to use the output -- it really just needs the view and it could figure out the rest |
| 04:26.10 | yukonbob | is there such a tool atm? |
| 04:29.46 | yukonbob | really hits hay -- chat later :) (I'll check for response in AM) |
| 04:29.57 | brlcad | there is not such a tool at the moment |
| 04:30.10 | brlcad | there are no annotations at the moment |
| 04:30.15 | brlcad | that's why it's on the list :) |
| 04:52.14 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30575 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: john added support to mged for creating binunif objects via the Create menu |
| 05:03.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30576 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: next release should be 'soon' so only promote rtarea, clone, and itcl build support |
| 05:05.52 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30577 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (9 files in 3 dirs): consistently spell out all references to 'prims' as primitives to help usability. not documenting in news cause it's stupid.. |
| 05:15.46 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30578 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (conv/off/off-g.c irprep/all_sf.c libpkg/pkg.c): remove t parameter from open calls. it's not posix and not needed (text mode is default on windows). |
| 05:29.59 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30579 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/log.c: cleanup, remove dead code |
| 06:28.46 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30580 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pl-dm.c: make pl-dm compile once again, de knrify it, remove code not longer relevant |
| 06:33.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30581 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pl-dm.c: |
| 06:33.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: rip out the ogl and wgl code. it's highly unlikely that wgl will work without |
| 06:33.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: modifications given X is required. also, it's just a horrible way to support N |
| 06:33.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: dm interfaces .. the point is supposed to be that the dm interface incapsulates |
| 06:33.40 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: against doing this kind of stuff. |
| 06:38.09 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30582 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: add pl-dm back to the build if X is available |
| 06:39.38 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30583 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: ws |
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| 13:12.23 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30584 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 13:12.23 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: the opengl framebuffer problem on mac os x where parallel rendering was causing |
| 13:12.23 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: it to fail was indeed fixed (by adding the necessary requests for each thread to |
| 13:12.23 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: acquire the context), but something since then has changed -- it's just giving a |
| 13:12.23 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: blank window at the moment |
| 13:14.45 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30585 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: actually it is rendering, just not updating the window apparently until it gets expose events |
| 13:21.10 | starseeker | scowls at Axiom and fires up Maxima instead... |
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| 14:22.09 | brlcad | hello d_rossberg ! |
| 14:38.13 | ``Erik | *yargn* |
| 14:50.06 | d_rossberg | hello brlcad! |
| 14:51.17 | d_rossberg | i had to feed the rabbits |
| 14:58.57 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:59.05 | brlcad | did not know you had rabbits |
| 15:03.28 | d_rossberg | i don't have rabbits - i have to feed them (at least today) |
| 15:04.48 | d_rossberg | feeds the rabits of his daughter |
| 15:10.22 | brlcad | mmm.. good eating |
| 15:10.27 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:16.59 | d_rossberg | ??? i hope there is a difference between "of" and "to" |
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| 15:21.56 | brlcad | hehe |
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| 16:26.49 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
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| 19:13.13 | ``Erik | holy hand grenade of antioch? |
| 19:51.11 | brlcad | heya pacman87 |
| 19:57.03 | pacman87 | brlcad: hi |
| 20:00.47 | brlcad | make any progress on that bug? |
| 20:02.41 | pacman87 | line 570 in ged.c |
| 20:03.18 | pacman87 | then it runs into a whole mess of tcl stuff |
| 20:04.23 | pacman87 | though when i just let it run, and did a ctrl+c at the hang, 'where' told me i was in the openGL libs |
| 20:09.47 | brlcad | yeah, it's definitely related to the embedded display manager |
| 20:10.04 | pacman87 | i got the latest nvidia driver last night, hoping to improve my bzflag framerate (from 100.xx to 169.12) |
| 20:10.09 | pacman87 | and now it doesn't hang anymore |
| 20:10.18 | brlcad | heh |
| 20:11.50 | pacman87 | though when i click in the graphics window, my other open windows get messed up |
| 20:11.58 | pacman87 | and that didn't happen before |
| 20:12.36 | pacman87 | the horizontal lines seem to be drawing at the wrong height |
| 20:13.05 | pacman87 | offset +/- a bit |
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| 20:18.12 | pacman87 | brb, restarting X |
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| 21:16.56 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30586 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add first exploratory coding efforts related to tire proc-db. |
| 21:17.25 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30587 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/Makefile.am: Add tire.c to proc-db Makefile. |
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| 21:55.09 | brlcad | pacman87: hum -- you might have better experience with 7.10.4 then .. there were changes made in 7.12.0 related to the display manager (that fixed several other bugs but apparently are causing your poblems) -- it's related to directcolor and colormapping |
| 22:07.51 | brlcad | if you want another point you can break on you could probably add a breakpoint for either ogl_open or dm_open in the debugger before that 'gui' tcl eval line on 570 |
| 22:27.08 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30588 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: need tk_cppflags |
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| 23:32.41 | yukonbob | waves in, reads scrollback |
| 23:36.11 | starseeker | waves back |
| 23:39.51 | yukonbob | hey starseeker |
| 23:40.23 | starseeker | how goes it? |
| 23:41.05 | yukonbob | not bad, I guess... I've been spending too much time on airplanes, and I don't have 7.12 running yet, but I'm alright :) |
| 23:42.44 | brlcad | so there's a slim chance that there might be a gsoc submission extension -- I wouldn't bank on it, but it'll depend how many students storm in over the weekend |
| 23:43.39 | yukonbob | when is the deadline (as it stands atm)? |
| 23:43.56 | brlcad | late monday |
| 23:44.07 | yukonbob | nods |
| 23:44.26 | pacman87 | what's the current application count? |
| 23:44.51 | brlcad | last year, 75% of the submissions came in over the last weekend iirc, but apps were also open for two weeks instead of one, and easter wasn't so early |
| 23:45.25 | brlcad | pacman87: *very* few .. many orgs are at about 1/5th the level they were last year by this time |
| 23:46.03 | brlcad | so that bodes really well for the folks that have been in here and interacting for a while already ;) |
| 23:46.41 | brlcad | especially since we really only want/need about 3 really good students .. |
| 23:50.38 | pacman87 | after running through the 'mug' Mged tutorial, i'm wondering if there's a vector-scale command to stretch/shrink primitives differently along different axes |
| 23:51.54 | brlcad | primitives can be scaled non-uniformly, except the torus |
| 23:52.03 | brlcad | they can't be skewed, though |
| 23:52.09 | brlcad | that's by design |
| 23:52.50 | pacman87 | and the torus was what i wanted to scale (for a better looking handle) |
| 23:53.01 | brlcad | heh |
| 23:53.22 | brlcad | I was just talking about that earlier today |
| 23:53.35 | pacman87 | i could be done using a sweep about an ellipse |
| 23:53.40 | brlcad | I'm thinking to add in support for non-uniform scaling to torus and skewing |
| 23:53.53 | pacman87 | *it could |
| 23:54.09 | brlcad | sweeps are on the gsoc new primitives list |
| 23:54.59 | pacman87 | yeah, i figured i would start with the revolve, then do the sweep next |
| 23:55.43 | brlcad | yeah, revolve should be pretty easy |
| 23:55.54 | brlcad | sweep can get *really* tricky |
| 23:56.12 | brlcad | especially if you allow 2D and 3D sweeps and if you allow an orientation vector |
| 23:56.33 | pacman87 | path + orientation vector normal to path? |
| 23:57.15 | pacman87 | that was another question i had about using 3D shapes as the base for these new primitives |
| 23:57.17 | brlcad | i mean an orientation vector maybe not normal to path |
| 23:57.26 | brlcad | as well as a twist |
| 23:58.03 | brlcad | i.e. two vectors and the path |
| 23:59.53 | pacman87 | twist = rotation about the path, and orientation = offset between path and shape's surface normal? |
| 00:00.44 | brlcad | shape's direction normal |
| 00:00.49 | brlcad | but yeah |
| 00:01.38 | pacman87 | i'm just thinking 2D to keep it simple for now |
| 00:01.50 | pacman87 | get the terminology straight |
| 00:06.44 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 00:06.58 | starseeker | Howdy iraytrace :-) |
| 00:07.13 | iraytrace | Good evening! |
| 00:07.20 | starseeker | How's life? |
| 00:07.25 | iraytrace | Fun! |
| 00:07.35 | starseeker | Getting into trouble? ;-) |
| 00:07.36 | iraytrace | I'm a bachelor this weekend! |
| 00:07.43 | iraytrace | Lots o' trouble. |
| 00:07.51 | iraytrace | Doing ray-tracing homework assignemtn. |
| 00:07.57 | iraytrace | -ment |
| 00:08.08 | starseeker | fun |
| 00:08.46 | iraytrace | Mostly. There's a certain element of "how many times in my life do I have to implement perlin noise?" that is Meh. |
| 00:09.05 | starseeker | mmm. |
| 00:09.09 | starseeker | I can see that |
| 00:10.13 | iraytrace | Anything good on your end? |
| 00:10.45 | starseeker | tangling with implementing matrix logic |
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| 00:11.02 | starseeker | nothing fancy, but good for getting up to speed on C again |
| 00:11.49 | iraytrace | I'm going the opposite direction. Everything is in C++ for the class here. |
| 00:12.52 | starseeker | Just doing a proc-db, so C should be enough |
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| 00:13.42 | iraytrace | proc-db's are always fun. |
| 00:15.43 | pacman87 | "mged> exec fbserv 1 /dev/sgip &" fails with "no such device '/dev/sgip'" |
| 00:16.00 | iraytrace | Are you on an SGI? |
| 00:16.25 | starseeker | Cool, here we go - this dude has both side view and cross sections of an engine: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110236614029 |
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| 00:16.43 | iraytrace | pacman87: You probably want /dev/X |
| 00:17.13 | yukonbob | has been looking at airplanes a lot lately (having been flying too much, and also because the 50th aniversary of the Canadian Avro Aero happened this week)... |
| 00:17.16 | pacman87 | iraytrace: thanks :) |
| 00:18.58 | iraytrace | Blueprints are cool, but the model I would build from it is available online for $15 |
| 00:19.56 | starseeker | True :-) |
| 00:20.09 | starseeker | likes the combination of history and technical geekery |
| 00:21.25 | iraytrace | It is sweet. |
| 00:27.09 | starseeker | yukonbob: Heh - wonder if a propeller could be modeled with our primitives |
| 00:28.41 | yukonbob | well, the (dare I say it) havoc has props... I haven't inspected them, though |
| 00:29.07 | yukonbob | should spend some time and get a model of that famous (around here) impeller modelled. |
| 00:29.16 | iraytrace | With the new spline support it should be possible |
| 00:29.35 | pacman87 | iraytrace: :) |
| 00:29.42 | starseeker | that could be cool yukonbob :-) |
| 00:29.56 | yukonbob | there's a primitive called sketch, right? (/me doesn't have his manuals around, nor a copy of brl-cad)? |
| 00:30.03 | starseeker | then for bonus points have gcam take the model and make one ;-) |
| 00:30.22 | yukonbob | starseeker: do we have access to a CAM device? |
| 00:30.33 | starseeker | I don't |
| 00:30.35 | yukonbob | (ie: CNC, i guess) |
| 00:31.24 | yukonbob | starseeker: have you seen the video-clip of that 4-axis device making that impeller? |
| 00:31.40 | starseeker | is that the one you linked on youtube? |
| 00:31.59 | yukonbob | I wasn't the original linker to it, but I believe it was off youtube, ya.. |
| 00:32.22 | starseeker | that was neat |
| 00:32.25 | yukonbob | I linked to a frame from it, which gives a good detail of the complexity of the shape, but watching the process is really impressive. |
| 00:36.54 | starseeker | brlcad: did you see a compile warning about macro "DM_OPEN" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3? |
| 00:38.49 | pacman87 | anyone know any good reference books for solid modelling algorithms? |
| 00:45.09 | starseeker | starts digging into DM_OPEN, then breaks for supper... |
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| 02:22.47 | brlcad | heya Daytona |
| 02:25.04 | Daytona | hi |
| 02:26.01 | Daytona | Looks like the GSoc application deadline might get extened for a week |
| 02:29.15 | starseeker | is a bit confused - the only definition of dm_open grep finds, in dm.h, seems to have 3 args. All the uses that compile correctly have 4, and none seems to include dm.h directly. However, mged_dm.h does include dm.h... |
| 02:29.23 | brlcad | Daytona: yeah, it's really odd |
| 02:29.40 | brlcad | the rate of students is distinctly different from this time last year |
| 02:29.55 | brlcad | we were talking about it in the gsoc irc channel earlier today before she sent out the message |
| 02:30.43 | Daytona | I guess the early Easter my be the cause |
| 02:30.54 | brlcad | most of the returning projects across the board are seeing drastically lower rates (like 1/5th usual) -- the comment from that one guy about easter and holidays is probably spot on |
| 02:31.06 | brlcad | there have been fewer US/EU visitors |
| 02:31.10 | starseeker | and mged_dm.h seems to be the only .h file to also include dm.h |
| 02:31.45 | brlcad | also last year, submission week was a week earlier, went for two weeks instead of one, and easter was much later of course |
| 02:33.42 | Daytona | starseeker: are you seeing this error: pl-dm.c:1040:48: error: macro "DM_OPEN" passed 4 arguments, but takes just 3 |
| 02:33.49 | starseeker | yes |
| 02:33.51 | brlcad | last year there were 6300 total submissions, we're at roughly 1600 this year with three days to go -- so if 4k don't flood in this weekend, it'll probably get extended I'd imagine |
| 02:34.03 | brlcad | yeah, that's my bad |
| 02:34.06 | brlcad | fixes |
| 02:34.21 | brlcad | pl-dm.c was disabled (since we went to autoconf) |
| 02:34.35 | brlcad | just re-enabled it last night .. worked here, but must have missed some things |
| 02:35.04 | starseeker | is somewhat confused as to why other dm_open calls ARE working... must be one of those obvious things |
| 02:35.13 | Daytona | yeah, I just noticed it tonight |
| 02:35.52 | brlcad | huh |
| 02:36.00 | brlcad | must be another DM_OPEN .. |
| 02:36.09 | starseeker | Not that grep can find |
| 02:36.09 | brlcad | read/fixed based on include/dm.h #define DM_OPEN(_interp, _type, _argc, _argv) dm_open(_interp, _type, _argc, _argv) |
| 02:37.04 | starseeker | #define DM_OPEN(_type, _argc, _argv) dm_open(_type, _argc, _argv) is what I'm seeing... |
| 02:37.32 | brlcad | ooh, I see -- missed committing the header since it is in include/ |
| 02:37.49 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 02:38.25 | brlcad | that line is wrong in dm.h -- the interp was added years ago, but pl-dm is the only user |
| 02:38.47 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30589 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dm.h: need the interp |
| 02:41.17 | Daytona | brlcad: hate to be a pain, but now: rlcad/src/util/pl-dm.c:1046: undefined reference to `dm_configureWindowShape' |
| 02:41.29 | brlcad | eep |
| 02:42.37 | Daytona | brlcad: I'm not in any rush to get it compiled |
| 02:42.48 | brlcad | still, my mistake -- i'll fix |
| 02:43.51 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30590 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: turn pl-dm off until I can get a full clean build to verify all flags are set |
| 02:44.56 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad and pacman87 and others :) |
| 02:45.01 | Daytona | tgat fixed it :-) |
| 02:45.09 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:45.25 | brlcad | could probably rip the whole thing out, but it's the smallest libdm example (albeit weak) |
| 02:46.13 | Daytona | hippieindamakin8: hi |
| 02:50.48 | hippieindamakin8 | how reliable is this information that the deadline might be extended for the GSoC applications |
| 02:51.13 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: it entirely depends how many apps are received over the weekend so I wouldn't rely on it |
| 02:51.34 | brlcad | if you procrastinate and don't submit, there's no recourse |
| 02:51.36 | hippieindamakin8 | even i wouldnt :) |
| 02:52.19 | Daytona | I believe the decision won't be made till Monday |
| 02:53.13 | hippieindamakin8 | hey i have been going through the codes man.. OO programming has cut down the code length too :P |
| 02:54.10 | brlcad | it's not complete, it's a start |
| 02:54.46 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya i have been chking individial codes and comparing them' |
| 02:54.55 | hippieindamakin8 | for example Arbs |
| 02:57.40 | hippieindamakin8 | composed a new song last night :) |
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| 03:09.51 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30591 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: started in 2008, new header format |
| 03:16.41 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30592 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pl-dm.c: don't need the glx headers and dm_configureWindowShape no longer exists |
| 03:36.00 | starseeker | brlcad: Oops, sorry |
| 03:44.53 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30593 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: try turning pl-dm back on.. works here clean-built |
| 03:45.02 | brlcad | nothing to be sorry about |
| 03:57.53 | starseeker | Confirmed - builds here too |
| 03:58.21 | brlcad | cool |
| 03:59.19 | Daytona | brlcad: builds clean here, too (on ubuntu) |
| 03:59.43 | brlcad | cool |
| 04:00.19 | Daytona | brlcad: is my nick showing up at the start of my messages? |
| 04:00.24 | brlcad | Daytona: so I forget where things left off with ubuntu build .. does it work for you again? you'd upgraded libtool iirc |
| 04:00.35 | brlcad | 00:00 < Daytona> brlcad: is my nick showing up at the start of my messages? |
| 04:00.46 | brlcad | uses irssi |
| 04:01.01 | brlcad | similar to your bitchx |
| 04:01.09 | hippieindamakin8 | does irssi have proxy support ? |
| 04:01.21 | brlcad | ooh, you're on irssi now |
| 04:01.30 | Daytona | Thanks, I'm just trying irrsi, but my nick shows up blank here |
| 04:01.31 | brlcad | ~Daytona++ |
| 04:01.40 | brlcad | blank? |
| 04:01.54 | brlcad | sure it's not colored white or something? |
| 04:01.59 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o Daytona] by brlcad | |
| 04:02.09 | Daytona | likely |
| 04:02.16 | brlcad | do you see the @? |
| 04:02.20 | Daytona | yes |
| 04:02.25 | brlcad | but nothing after? |
| 04:02.28 | Daytona | yes |
| 04:02.41 | Daytona | like <@ > |
| 04:02.44 | brlcad | try hilighting/selecting it .. i'm guessing it's white |
| 04:02.57 | Daytona | you'r right |
| 04:02.57 | brlcad | or whatever the color of your background |
| 04:04.11 | Daytona | Back to ubuntu, yes I upgraded libtool to the latest release |
| 04:04.59 | Daytona | now using libtool 2.2 |
| 04:05.13 | brlcad | and everything then worked? |
| 04:05.27 | brlcad | hmm |
| 04:05.41 | Daytona | yes, but the defaul that is installed with ubuntu does not work |
| 04:05.55 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:06.16 | brlcad | I started working through that with one of the guys in here earlier in the week, to see if I could get a work-around |
| 04:07.00 | brlcad | I did trace down part of the problem -- they've modified it to strip out the -L linker paths, with messages to set -rpaths (which is wrong for pre-installed) |
| 04:11.47 | Daytona | Well, I know the night is just getting started for all you young coders, but it's late for this dinosaur |
| 04:12.04 | Daytona | Have a nice night, bye all |
| 04:12.26 | *** part/#brlcad Daytona (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 04:13.33 | brlcad | :) |
| 05:57.25 | pacman87 | brlcad:ping |
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| 08:47.24 | cosurgi | ok, so later probably I'll try to install libtool 2.2 |
| 09:02.29 | alex_joni | brlcad: maybe you can pass this to Daytona (if he get's back): Ubuntu's terminal by default has a white background, which makes irssi kinda odd to use. One of the first things I do is change the profile for terminal to use a *standard* white on black :) |
| 09:50.11 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad or any body here .. can somebody tell me where are the gui files located ? |
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| 10:58.25 | MinuteElectron | hippieindamakin8: binaries or source? |
| 10:58.39 | hippieindamakin8 | source |
| 10:58.48 | hippieindamakin8 | and can u tell me wat are the .1 files ? |
| 10:58.55 | MinuteElectron | no, sorry |
| 10:59.08 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh np :) |
| 11:00.59 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad or d_rossberg are u there ? |
| 11:02.52 | hippieindamakin8 | can u tell me wat are the .1 files for example the file rtarea.1 in the rt folder of the sources |
| 11:02.58 | hippieindamakin8 | ? |
| 11:04.19 | alex_joni | sounds like a manpage name :D |
| 11:06.55 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk wat does it mean ? |
| 11:07.11 | hippieindamakin8 | they are in some scripting language i guess |
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| 12:40.17 | brlcad | cosurgi: nooooo, not yet :) |
| 12:40.25 | brlcad | you were my test bed to get default working :) |
| 12:44.33 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad u back.. ? good morning |
| 12:45.18 | brlcad | morning |
| 12:45.47 | brlcad | man man |
| 12:46.18 | hippieindamakin8 | if i am not buggin u early in the morning :P tell me wat are these ascii troffs doing in the package and wat do they do |
| 12:46.28 | brlcad | man man :) |
| 12:46.47 | alex_joni | hippieindamakin8: 'man' is a system for documentation |
| 12:46.53 | alex_joni | comes from manual |
| 12:47.01 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh :P |
| 12:47.11 | hippieindamakin8 | u meant man as manual |
| 12:47.14 | hippieindamakin8 | :P |
| 12:47.28 | alex_joni | type it into a terminal 'man man' |
| 12:48.12 | hippieindamakin8 | it is manual on man :) |
| 12:49.31 | hippieindamakin8 | and brlcad i am unable to understand what do i put in the proposal |
| 12:50.05 | hippieindamakin8 | as in apart from the idea |
| 12:52.08 | brlcad | did you read the application guidelines? |
| 12:52.22 | brlcad | that should give you a big range for how to get started |
| 12:52.30 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya |
| 12:57.52 | hippieindamakin8 | incase i start rewriting the entire libraries in OOP language even the applications and programs dependant on those have to be rewritten.. |
| 12:58.22 | hippieindamakin8 | or it has to be written in such a way that nothing else get disturbed ? |
| 13:01.49 | brlcad | "rewriting" is most certainly not how I'd describe the task |
| 13:02.03 | brlcad | refactoring and reorganizing existing code is the underlying idea |
| 13:02.20 | hippieindamakin8 | ya rather porting it to the OOP form |
| 13:02.39 | brlcad | creating a new layer that leverages what is written as much as possible, cleaning it portions while working on the OO layer |
| 13:03.34 | brlcad | the jbrlcad interface was an "imported rewrite" simply because it's a different language -- for a C++ layer, it could utilize librt/libbn/libbu routines directly |
| 13:03.52 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
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| 13:11.04 | brlcad | g'morning d_rossberg |
| 13:11.06 | hippieindamakin8 | wat exactly do u xpect the student to do in this project ? |
| 13:11.14 | hippieindamakin8 | good morning d_rossberg |
| 13:11.20 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: I expect them to do what they propose ;) |
| 13:11.30 | hippieindamakin8 | :)))) |
| 13:11.35 | brlcad | it's your job to propose something, not mine |
| 13:11.45 | brlcad | i already provided the general ideas |
| 13:11.54 | d_rossberg | waves from home |
| 13:11.57 | hippieindamakin8 | i am in a mood to change everything rt from the libraries into java |
| 13:11.57 | brlcad | you're supposed to refine those ideas |
| 13:12.02 | hippieindamakin8 | :P |
| 13:12.09 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
| 13:12.21 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall be coming up with a refined idea |
| 13:13.01 | brlcad | d_rossberg: so I presume you've been watching the list -- the student rate is drastically lower this year for some reason (like 1/5th) probably due to the early easter, so there "may" be a student extension |
| 13:13.28 | hippieindamakin8 | there are many friends of mine who are planning to apply on the last day :) |
| 13:13.43 | brlcad | "Applications to PHP and Gentoo haven't been very encouraging so far - only 10 each" .. wow |
| 13:13.52 | hippieindamakin8 | so there might be a sudden rise in the applications on 31st |
| 13:13.58 | brlcad | gentoo in particular has more than a hundred by this time last year iirc |
| 13:14.06 | d_rossberg | brlcad: yes, i've read the mails |
| 13:14.32 | brlcad | debian guys reported something similar .. they're at about 20 and usually are 200-300 by now |
| 13:16.03 | brlcad | i thought that through most of the week too as cad and bz have been nearly identical interest, and bz's is *much* lower than last year (about 1/5th) |
| 13:16.12 | brlcad | turns out it's almost all orgs |
| 13:16.43 | d_rossberg | hippieindamakin8: your application should show us that you know what your are talking about, that means BRL-CAD but object oriented design too |
| 13:17.34 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. u mean i should specify my plan of action |
| 13:17.39 | d_rossberg | how do you think should an oo interface to a database look like, how should the ray-trace interface be implemented |
| 13:18.17 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. |
| 13:19.31 | d_rossberg | the database is a file, how would you handle multiple access to this file? (for example) |
| 13:19.40 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. |
| 13:20.44 | hippieindamakin8 | .. i always have been a c++ and java programmer mainly but its taking me time to understand how the system works.. given a problem i can solve that.. |
| 13:21.03 | hippieindamakin8 | i have been understanding the system |
| 13:27.04 | d_rossberg | has some guests today |
| 14:14.12 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad how many applications did u recieve so far |
| 14:16.25 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad and as far as multiply accessing the file is concerned how do u do it.. i have no idea,, i just read that u have to use some virtual base classes and stuff |
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| 17:14.16 | mib_niv7mz6n | Hello all |
| 17:26.33 | brlcad | hum hum |
| 17:26.46 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: told you before, don't worry about the other apps, worry about yours... |
| 18:27.58 | pacman87 | brlcad: is the src/librt/g_*.c code used for the CSG/BREP too? |
| 18:32.24 | brlcad | pacman87: what do you mean? |
| 18:32.42 | brlcad | the g_files are the definitions of each primitive |
| 18:33.03 | brlcad | CSG is handled is a different layer above the primitives for ray-tracing |
| 18:33.11 | brlcad | s/is a/in a/ |
| 18:33.46 | pacman87 | so the CSG uses the rt calls to do its evaluations? |
| 18:34.08 | brlcad | when you have CSG operators regardless of the representation, you have evaluated and unevaluated CSG forms |
| 18:35.07 | brlcad | ray-tracing causes the CSG expressions to get evaluated as the shot-line is traversed and primitives segments are encountered |
| 18:35.20 | brlcad | what you're proposing has nothing to do (directly) with ray-tracing |
| 18:35.41 | brlcad | you're evaluating CSG operators on BREP surfaces going from unevaluated BREP to evaluated BREP |
| 18:36.35 | brlcad | CSG isn't a system that "does" anything -- they are simply combination operators (union, subtraction, difference) that describe how shapes interact spatially |
| 18:37.09 | brlcad | does that make sense? |
| 18:37.26 | pacman87 | mostly |
| 18:38.21 | brlcad | so take a simple case of two overlapping spheres that are intersected |
| 18:39.10 | pacman87 | an intersection would be where the ray has entered both spheres |
| 18:39.20 | brlcad | with implicit geometry (i.e. what we use for ray-tracing), the CSG expression of "sphere1 intersected with sphere2" is evaluated during ray-trace |
| 18:39.27 | brlcad | no |
| 18:39.44 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constructive_solid_geometry |
| 18:40.25 | pacman87 | i meant the surface that's drawn is the second one the ray hits |
| 18:40.47 | pacman87 | so it has to enter sph1 first, then the surface of sph2 that's inside sph1 is actually drawn |
| 18:40.56 | brlcad | think of them independently |
| 18:41.07 | brlcad | you compare a ray against sphere1 .. you end up with a segment |
| 18:41.19 | brlcad | you compare a ray against sphere2 .. you end up with a different segment |
| 18:41.54 | brlcad | with an intersection CSG operation, there is an evaluated result only where the two segments coexist |
| 18:42.03 | brlcad | i.e. where they overlap and share space |
| 18:42.17 | pacman87 | ah, now it's all clear, thanks |
| 18:43.17 | brlcad | now with *brep* on brep csg evaluation, that's a totally different approach |
| 18:43.42 | brlcad | there you have surfaces.. one surface for sphere1 .. one surface for sphere2 |
| 18:44.13 | brlcad | you actually compute the intersection of those two surfaces by performing pairwise trimming operations of the actual surfaces |
| 18:45.45 | brlcad | so in the picture in the wikipedia link, the intersection result ends up with a brep that has 4 surfaces stiched together (created from the 6 + 2 surfaces for the box and sphere) |
| 18:46.45 | pacman87 | sph has 2 surfaces? |
| 18:49.36 | brlcad | yeah |
| 18:50.21 | brlcad | could conceivably have just one, I don't know how the brep control points would be like for that, if it's numerically stable |
| 18:50.43 | pacman87 | could you recommend a good reference book on the math behind csg/brep? |
| 18:51.18 | pacman87 | i'm was planning to stop by the engr lib this afternoon |
| 18:53.47 | brlcad | oof, there's a lot of material on the subject but maybe find a few papers |
| 18:54.22 | pacman87 | right, i was wonder if there were any 'classic texts' in the field |
| 18:54.24 | brlcad | http://sca2002.cs.brown.edu/~jfh/papers/Laidlaw-CSG-1986/paper.pdf is kinda one of the original canon papers on how to implement csg evaluation of polygonal brep models |
| 18:54.50 | brlcad | i'm frankly not sure that will work for spline surface brep models |
| 18:57.20 | pacman87 | allowing partial revolutions of 3D objects adds a *lot* of complexity |
| 18:59.29 | pacman87 | i'm assuming i should set the revolve up to be usable with any primitive, combination, or region? |
| 18:59.46 | pacman87 | keep it generalized |
| 19:01.24 | brlcad | erm, I'm confused |
| 19:01.31 | brlcad | what are you actually working on proposing? :) |
| 19:01.41 | brlcad | csg evaluation of breps or a new primitive? :) |
| 19:02.28 | brlcad | fully implementing a revolution and/or sweep primitive is in itself enough scope for a project |
| 19:02.57 | brlcad | otherwise, yeah, revolve and sweep should be generalized to any primitive |
| 19:04.14 | pacman87 | i'm proposing new primitive(s), and i was trying to find the point at which a new primitive was 'done', ie could be used by the rest of the system |
| 19:06.02 | pacman87 | combs and regions aren't primitives, though (are they?) |
| 19:13.41 | brlcad | ahhh |
| 19:13.49 | brlcad | then you don't need to worry about csg evaluation of breps then :) |
| 19:13.59 | brlcad | combs and regions are not primitives |
| 19:14.49 | brlcad | a new primitive is done when all of the hook functions in g_*.c are implemented librt, it has creation routines in libwdb, and it has editing features implemented in mged |
| 19:17.18 | brlcad | the big hook functions that take time are prep/shot, import (v5), export (v5), tess, plot, nurb(optional), and to a lesser extent norm, curve, and uv |
| 19:17.22 | brlcad | the rest are trivial |
| 19:17.51 | brlcad | prep/shot, tess, and nurb are usually the hard ones -- shot often being the hardest |
| 19:18.04 | pacman87 | brlcad: right, i've been looking in-depth at the g_xxx.c and g_*.c files |
| 19:20.06 | pacman87 | found rt_xxx_class() in g_xxx.c, does that just return whether the xxx is valid? |
| 19:20.36 | pacman87 | rt_*_class() returns 0 for the real primitives i've checked |
| 19:21.04 | brlcad | if you want to see all of the places a primitive is hooked, you can follow one of the existing primitives |
| 19:21.09 | brlcad | you can ignore class |
| 19:21.17 | brlcad | you'll see everyone just returns 0 |
| 19:21.41 | pacman87 | ok, just double checking |
| 19:22.43 | pacman87 | should i include algroithms for those methods in my application? |
| 19:24.09 | brlcad | example: find . \( -name \*.c -o -name \*.h \) -exec grep -I SUPERELL {} /dev/null \; | cut -f1 -d: | sort | uniq |
| 19:24.29 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:24.48 | brlcad | those are two relatively new primitives |
| 19:25.01 | brlcad | that shows you all the files that are edited that involve them |
| 19:25.21 | brlcad | with slight differences -- superell has mirror and v4 supported, metaballs don't |
| 19:25.28 | brlcad | you'd need mirror, but not v4 |
| 19:26.08 | brlcad | you should instill confidence that you're aware of what's involved in the algorithms, regardless of whether you know the algorithm itself yet |
| 19:26.16 | pacman87 | where is the generic interface for the rt_*_* methods? (assuming there is one) |
| 19:26.39 | pacman87 | so a very high-level description of the steps |
| 19:27.16 | brlcad | yeah, explain what you think you have to do, maybe include "why" (i.e. wth do those functions do) |
| 19:28.08 | pacman87 | the revolve will probably be a lot more detailed than the sweep, as i've only been thinking about rev |
| 19:28.21 | brlcad | what and how are more important than why, but can be high-level descriptions with maybe some technical references (who's algorithm/approach are you going to use? your own? some paper?) |
| 19:28.29 | brlcad | that's fine |
| 19:29.09 | brlcad | you could simply state that if you get enough done, you would then move on to the sweep |
| 19:29.33 | pacman87 | s/enough// :) |
| 19:29.44 | brlcad | it's entirely conceivable that you could hack out a new primitive in a matter of just two weeks .. or it could take months |
| 19:30.22 | pacman87 | yeah, i was trying to get a clearer idea of scope earlier so i could figure how long it would take |
| 19:30.27 | brlcad | and there's nothing wrong with either timeline |
| 19:30.37 | pacman87 | i'm thinking the rev could take a few weeks, maybe a month |
| 19:30.55 | pacman87 | then the sweep would probably take a bit longer |
| 19:31.07 | brlcad | care more about having devs working on cool stuff for the project that we need, attracting new long-term guys excited about this stuff :) |
| 19:31.35 | brlcad | s/guys/guys n' gals of course/ |
| 19:32.18 | pacman87 | yeah, working on primitives fits with my approach to problem solving |
| 19:32.28 | pacman87 | i work as a tutor for the college of engineering |
| 19:33.00 | pacman87 | and pretty much every problem/concept i teach, i start with the basic integral/derivative forms of the equations (i teach physics) |
| 19:35.18 | pacman87 | heads off to the engr library, back later |
| 19:43.31 | brlcad | cya! |
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| 22:26.15 | spike_ | hey, is anyone in here a mentor for the GSOC project? |
| 22:26.28 | brlcad | hello spike_ |
| 22:26.35 | spike_ | hey :-D |
| 22:26.40 | brlcad | several, best to just speak up :) |
| 22:27.05 | b0ef | it would be nice if NURBS was put on the gsoc page |
| 22:27.28 | brlcad | b0ef: it is in several ways |
| 22:27.29 | spike_ | i don't know too much about BRL-CAD but it seemed like a cool project, just curious what projects need to get done |
| 22:27.41 | brlcad | spike_: have you seen the ideas list? |
| 22:27.48 | spike_ | yup |
| 22:28.05 | spike_ | a lot of them look cool, i just figured i should talk to someone instead of just 'picking' one |
| 22:28.13 | brlcad | then... those are the projects that need to get done ;) |
| 22:28.23 | brlcad | actually you picking one is best |
| 22:28.31 | brlcad | they're all great ideas, lots of possibilities |
| 22:28.42 | spike_ | haha oh alright then |
| 22:29.06 | brlcad | the ones that are "most important" are identified as high priority, but a really good proposal will trump that in just about any category |
| 22:30.00 | brlcad | same goes for a project not even on the list if it fits with our goals |
| 22:55.20 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30594 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: resolved ogl crash, removed duplicate context invalidate bug |
| 23:44.32 | brlcad | woot, but fixed |
| 00:35.25 | spike_ | hey is anyone doing collada conversion for GSoC? |
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| 00:50.57 | brlcad | spike_: nobody has mentioned it yet |
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| 01:22.28 | mafm | hallo |
| 01:22.40 | Daytona | hi |
| 01:24.13 | mafm | are there mentors for GSoC around? |
| 01:25.03 | Daytona | I am a possible mentor, and brlcad is the organizer for brlcad |
| 01:25.09 | brlcad | mafm: several, what's up? |
| 01:25.34 | mafm | oh, I though that brlcad was a bot ;) |
| 01:25.50 | Daytona | He is, kinda :-) |
| 01:25.55 | mafm | I was thinking about submitting an application for the first idea |
| 01:26.07 | mafm | I know, I know, it's a bit late :P |
| 01:26.16 | Daytona | brlcad" meant that in a nice way :=) |
| 01:26.18 | brlcad | dances the robot |
| 01:26.51 | brlcad | mafm: it's not too late |
| 01:26.57 | Daytona | What was the first idea? (refresh our memory)? |
| 01:26.59 | mafm | should I discuss this in the mailing list instead? |
| 01:27.32 | mafm | the 1st idea is: OpenGL GUI Framework |
| 01:28.36 | brlcad | we can talk here, you can submit a summary or preview of your proposal to the ML if you like so the other mentors can see it (and/or to the wiki and of course eventually to google) |
| 01:28.50 | mafm | the thing is that I don't know if the requirements (C++ and OO design) is enough |
| 01:28.51 | brlcad | mafm: so what do you understand of that task? |
| 01:29.01 | brlcad | or what are your ideas |
| 01:29.23 | mafm | I'm also familiar with CrystalSpace, OpenSceneGraph and OGRE (in that order) |
| 01:29.47 | mafm | since I was developing a 3D game with the first 2, and played a bit with the 3rd |
| 01:30.29 | mafm | hmm, well, the thing is that I don't understand it very well -- let me try to explain it in my words |
| 01:30.36 | brlcad | please do |
| 01:31.08 | spike_ | bbl |
| 01:31.51 | mafm | In http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html there's the following idea under Visualization: |
| 01:32.03 | mafm | Create a 3D geometry browser graphical interface using a common graphics engine (e.g. OGRE, Open Scene Graph, Crystal Space) |
| 01:33.01 | mafm | that would be, I think, to feed one of those engines with BRL-CAD created models to see the results in real time? |
| 01:33.25 | brlcad | sorta |
| 01:33.42 | brlcad | have you ever used brl-cad yet? seen mged? |
| 01:34.41 | brlcad | that 3D geometry browser graphical interface topic is pretty much the same as the first gsoc topic |
| 01:34.45 | mafm | nope, I never used brl-cad, and that's my main question -- if it would be sensible to apply without it |
| 01:35.19 | brlcad | sure, it's sensible -- but you'll have to of course tie the idea to brl-cad though .. so you'll have some learning to do |
| 01:36.08 | brlcad | ~.pt |
| 01:36.09 | ibot | from memory, .pt is Portugal |
| 01:36.11 | brlcad | nifty |
| 01:36.17 | mafm | and about the OpenGL GUI Framework I understand to create a frontend in one of those engines, calling commands of brl-cad |
| 01:36.37 | mafm | kind of what Unix CD burner frontends do |
| 01:36.53 | brlcad | yeah, that's sort of the basic jist |
| 01:37.15 | mafm | what about .pt? :D |
| 01:37.46 | brlcad | much of the work would actually entail working on a network-based prootocol to call backend brl-cad commands |
| 01:38.02 | brlcad | then displaying the results via the gui interface |
| 01:39.09 | mafm | network-based being with sockets really, or just to describe the architecture of the tools collaborating? |
| 01:39.36 | brlcad | so one command might be as simple as "get list of available geometries" .. "get handle for geometry X" .. "get a wireframe display list" .. then display that display list with the gui |
| 01:40.21 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, some simple socket api -- you'd probably get details for the protocol and/or help develop some basic stubs |
| 01:42.08 | mafm | actually the game that I was developing was a multiplayer one, I also coded the communication part :D |
| 01:42.15 | brlcad | the focus would definitely be on the frontend gui side though -- setting up the pieces needed to display/manage geometry |
| 01:42.26 | mafm | kind of "get available characters for the account" :) |
| 01:42.32 | brlcad | maybe the start of a command/debug console for testing the API/commands |
| 01:42.48 | mafm | and then displaying it in the GUI of the client, logging in, etc |
| 01:43.02 | brlcad | exactly |
| 01:43.36 | mafm | there's already support in the backend for that, or it would be part of the project? |
| 01:43.43 | brlcad | the intent of the new system is a client/server interface, so that task revolves around the front-end thin client (emphasis on the thin) |
| 01:44.02 | brlcad | there's not already support -- it's being developed in parallel |
| 01:44.17 | brlcad | so pieces of it might be part of the project, but you could get away with just stubbing responses too |
| 01:44.59 | mafm | ah OK, sounds fun :) |
| 01:45.40 | mafm | and all that with C++ and [L]GPL license? |
| 01:46.29 | brlcad | the language "shouldn't" really matter, I could see several allowed, but C/C++ are our predominant source base and it's nice to stay consistent |
| 01:46.49 | brlcad | LGPL is ideal |
| 01:47.05 | brlcad | s/ideal/required for gsoc/ |
| 01:48.00 | mafm | it's because I like C++ better than C or Java, and those 3 engines are best suited for C++ it seems |
| 01:49.01 | mafm | and well, there are other licenses accepted for SoC, but I tend to use GPL for my projects too |
| 01:49.02 | brlcad | C++ would be my personal preference, but as a thin client, the intention really is to make it easy to wrap clients |
| 01:49.32 | mafm | :) |
| 01:49.38 | brlcad | GPL is highly problematic for us in general |
| 01:50.01 | brlcad | as we integrate and are embedded with lots of analysis codes |
| 01:51.01 | mafm | LGPL is fine too |
| 01:51.24 | brlcad | yeah, details at http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Acceptance |
| 01:52.38 | mafm | yep, I was reading that |
| 01:53.06 | mafm | you can take a look to my CV in the meanwhile if you're interested: http://www.lip.pt/~mafm/cv-gsoc2008.pdf |
| 01:53.57 | mafm | the website of the game that I've been developing with other ppl for a while is down due to hardware problems |
| 01:53.59 | brlcad | thanks |
| 01:54.26 | mafm | but here's a site with info that I discovered yesterday: http://linux.softpedia.com/get/GAMES-ENTERTAINMENT/RPG/Fearann-Muin-20516.shtml |
| 01:55.01 | mafm | (I didn't expect that we deserved an entry in such a place, being the project stalled, but well :) ) |
| 01:55.15 | mafm | it was initially in CrystalSpace and then in OpenSceneGraph |
| 01:56.09 | mafm | the most beautiful screenshots are not there though, those are with testing models and terrain |
| 01:57.42 | brlcad | so what are your thoughs on CS and OSG? |
| 01:58.01 | brlcad | nice to see that you have experience with both, that's certainly helpful |
| 02:01.36 | mafm | and OGRE too, but only playing with it for a few months |
| 02:01.58 | mafm | well, I haven't been actively using them for more than a year, so not sure about the advances |
| 02:02.41 | mafm | CS was more like a game engine, trying to integrate also sound, physics, GUI libraries and other things useful for most games |
| 02:02.53 | brlcad | having used all three, OGRE is a really strong contender to me -- and steve really has a great focus on the project that fits with what is needed |
| 02:03.31 | mafm | OSG was more like the state-of-the-art of open scene graphs, but other things for 3D applications had to be integrated |
| 02:04.01 | mafm | there are things like Delta3D trying to make a self-contained game engine with OSG as the principal component |
| 02:04.19 | mafm | and OGRE was something in between by the time, but also trying to get into the console market |
| 02:04.24 | brlcad | yeah, I looked into integrating OSG into OGRE as a scene graph manager, to get the best of both .. but there's a lot of cleanup needed to maintain that sort of integration |
| 02:04.57 | brlcad | yeah, we don't need/want a "game engine" really -- there are aspects of a CAD interface that are drasticly different |
| 02:05.03 | mafm | I think that OGRE is more close in spirit to OSG, with also one or more "game engine" wrappers |
| 02:05.21 | mafm | code-wise I think that OGRE and OSG are very good and better than CS |
| 02:05.37 | brlcad | like you can't/don't want to run the graphics update loop as fast as possible, many cad models are how many seconds per frame |
| 02:06.11 | mafm | :) |
| 02:06.27 | brlcad | I love the CS devs, but really don't want to deal with a left-handed coordinate system |
| 02:06.28 | mafm | but I don't know if they changed much lately |
| 02:06.31 | brlcad | z is up, dammit ;) |
| 02:06.57 | mafm | :D |
| 02:07.58 | mafm | hmm, I cannot find this info in the FAQs or anything -- currently who's running your project? some company? interested individuals only? foundation? |
| 02:08.28 | mafm | or still some army dept.? |
| 02:08.42 | brlcad | developed predominantly by interested individuals via open source and development is still funded by ARL too |
| 02:09.19 | brlcad | all as open source |
| 02:09.23 | mafm | and is it your 1st year at SoC? |
| 02:09.34 | brlcad | not my first year, but first year for brl-cad |
| 02:11.03 | mafm | ah |
| 02:11.22 | mafm | it's because the info is clear and very... explanatory? |
| 02:11.35 | brlcad | hm? |
| 02:12.17 | mafm | hmm, don't know how to say it |
| 02:12.40 | mafm | it's like... a very good impression for the students to see your site |
| 02:12.49 | brlcad | pues digalo en español :) |
| 02:12.59 | brlcad | ah, thanks |
| 02:13.12 | mafm | way better than many projects which already have been in past editions |
| 02:13.26 | mafm | :D |
| 02:13.49 | mafm | do you understand spanish? |
| 02:14.50 | brlcad | yes |
| 02:15.46 | mafm | are you from latin-america or something? :) |
| 02:16.37 | brlcad | getting rusty as the years go by, se me ha olvidado bastante .. but I used to be perfectly fluent, crecà en panamá |
| 02:18.25 | mafm | heh |
| 02:18.32 | mafm | not bad at all |
| 02:18.40 | mafm | you even put the accents |
| 02:19.35 | mafm | so in which projects were you mentor last/past years? |
| 02:19.51 | brlcad | i'm also the admin for bzflag |
| 02:21.16 | brlcad | we do more group mentoring than 1-1 (same for BRL-CAD) so everyone shares mentoring responsibilities regardless of who is assigned |
| 02:21.34 | mafm | ahm |
| 02:22.51 | mafm | btw, I was confuded several times with bzflag and brlcad because of the similar name and favicons of the webpages.. I bet that you copied it :P |
| 02:23.18 | brlcad | i share data between the two frequently :) |
| 02:23.39 | brlcad | tanks and tanks |
| 02:23.50 | brlcad | tanks for fun and tanks for real |
| 02:25.01 | mafm | is there any direct relationship between the two projects? like bzflag using brlcad libraries or so |
| 02:25.23 | brlcad | nope |
| 02:25.32 | brlcad | only direct relationship is my status with both |
| 02:26.30 | mafm | :) |
| 02:26.47 | brlcad | the rest of the dev teams really don't overlap |
| 02:27.20 | mafm | and as mentor of past years, do you notice some difference in the applications? I heard that there were less this year, I think that it was in #gsoc channel |
| 02:28.37 | brlcad | yeah, there is a massive difference this year |
| 02:29.18 | brlcad | which bodes well for those that get involved and submit before monday (especially if there's not an extension) |
| 02:31.43 | mafm | there was something about an extension in the channel topic, but they didn't say exactly how much |
| 02:32.19 | mafm | the only concrete fact that I saw was with X.org, that by yesterday they only had 1 application :D |
| 02:32.19 | brlcad | it entirely depends how many submissions there are by monday |
| 02:32.40 | mafm | my last years organization was no accepted this year, so I can't really compare |
| 02:33.01 | mafm | year's*, not* |
| 02:33.12 | brlcad | ahh |
| 02:34.17 | brlcad | that's a shame for aqsis |
| 02:34.40 | mafm | yep |
| 02:35.04 | mafm | and it's strange, considering that the two of us accepted finished successfully |
| 02:35.28 | mafm | and I think that the other candidate got a job at Dreamworks or something like that :) |
| 02:35.38 | brlcad | either the admins/mentors didn't do something well, outright made a major mistake, or simply just didn't make the cut |
| 02:35.47 | brlcad | leslie had a hell of a time with the cuts |
| 02:36.03 | brlcad | there were even more big-name orgs applying this year |
| 02:36.56 | mafm | cut means... where to draw the line for the ones accepted? |
| 02:38.31 | mafm | I think that my main mentor forgot to fill in necessary information in time at least once, and things like that |
| 02:38.40 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:38.54 | brlcad | ah, yeah.. that's a huge no no |
| 02:39.25 | brlcad | that's not only a failure of the mentor but of the org admin (and the org backup admin) |
| 02:41.29 | mafm | also after the first two weeks or so I spent more time with the backup mentor than with the supposed mentor :D |
| 02:42.05 | mafm | he said often that he was a disaster of a mentor |
| 02:42.07 | brlcad | interesting -- aqsis wasn't/isn't multithreaded? |
| 02:42.58 | mafm | wasn't and isn't, they didn't show much interest to integrate my branch after finishing |
| 02:43.08 | brlcad | hum, why is that? |
| 02:43.41 | mafm | I'm not really sure |
| 02:44.02 | brlcad | did you not work with their devs? |
| 02:44.39 | mafm | even when I was starting the project some of them (especially the leader) was already working in a branch which was supposed to tackle performance issues |
| 02:45.15 | mafm | so if that branch was to be merged my branch would be mostly obsolete |
| 02:45.32 | mafm | I think that they didn't get far with the branch after all |
| 02:45.33 | brlcad | who is the lead? |
| 02:45.40 | mafm | Paul Gregory |
| 02:46.19 | mafm | and I offered myself to integrate at least the parts of cleanup necessary for my project |
| 02:46.45 | mafm | eliminating unnecessary statics, globals and things like that |
| 02:47.19 | mafm | but they weren't very supportive and I started to work in other things |
| 02:48.00 | mafm | I'm still in their channel and in the mailing lists, but I don't follow the current activities very closely |
| 02:49.28 | brlcad | weren't supportive because of the other branch? communication problems? something else? |
| 02:49.55 | mafm | also there was a limitation to how many threads could take advantage of the available data |
| 02:50.38 | mafm | because of the design of many core parts of the renderer, that even my mentor in the last days was failing to understand |
| 02:51.48 | mafm | so the high-level design that he had in mind didn't fit with the way that the rendered worked |
| 02:52.22 | mafm | but well, I think that most of my code was worth if only for the cleanup, elimination of globals, const safeness |
| 02:52.49 | mafm | and the supportiveness that you ask, I'm not really sure, I never feel very comfortable in the channel |
| 02:53.17 | mafm | maybe communication problems, they're mostly people from UK who even have presential meetings very often |
| 02:54.39 | mafm | not that they were rude or anything, but I didn't feel as well as with other teammates and projects where I participate |
| 02:55.04 | brlcad | fair enough |
| 02:55.43 | brlcad | would be useful to hear abou the project from your mentor or the admin's perspective too, just to get a feel for what things might be like for us |
| 02:55.45 | mafm | this year I didn't even bother to send proposals to some projects because of that |
| 02:56.37 | mafm | hmm, well, they're often in #aqsis every day, or the working days at least |
| 02:56.48 | brlcad | i mean, it is water under the bridge -- history, but interesting to see how others are operating |
| 02:56.58 | mafm | the mentor was minty77 and the backup and leader prgregory |
| 02:58.12 | brlcad | thanks! |
| 02:58.13 | mafm | but minty77 is away most of the time and pgregory usually leaves at 16h UTC, so you might have to wake up early :) |
| 02:58.32 | mafm | maybe they have other times during weekends... |
| 02:59.19 | brlcad | not a big deal |
| 02:59.55 | brlcad | more important is your application on its own compared to the others we get, number of slots, etc |
| 02:59.58 | mafm | http://wiki.aqsis.org/dev/soc_multithreading |
| 03:00.12 | mafm | that's a summary and a detailed log at the bottom |
| 03:00.51 | brlcad | now if you were interested in doing something loosely related -- we do parallel quite wonderfully already, but distributed has long been a weakness |
| 03:01.41 | brlcad | we have a distributed rendering system, but it's all set up manually -- something like mpi would be interesting if made transparent |
| 03:02.33 | brlcad | or even a non-mpi approach, but something that's been talked about in the past |
| 03:03.48 | mafm | hmm |
| 03:04.03 | mafm | I'm still reading your acceptance docs with all this chatting |
| 03:04.10 | mafm | and it's 4am here :D |
| 03:04.30 | mafm | are you going to be around tomorrow? because at this time I don't think very clearly |
| 03:09.40 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:09.48 | brlcad | is here every day |
| 03:10.21 | brlcad | and barring meetings, food, and workouts, I'm almost on-line all day every day too |
| 03:11.07 | mafm | at what time do you get up, with UTC difference? :D |
| 03:11.27 | mafm | lives in UTC, very easy for him :P |
| 03:14.32 | brlcad | i literally have a random schedule |
| 03:15.05 | mafm | ok |
| 03:15.50 | mafm | I'll be back in around 12 hours or so, and then we can discuss more about the distributed thing, or otherwither the first idea :) |
| 03:16.11 | brlcad | just as common to find me at just about any time of day/night except maybe UTC 800-1200 .. being the closest to a sleeping window |
| 03:16.30 | mafm | :D |
| 03:16.45 | mafm | fine |
| 03:16.58 | mafm | so see you tomorrow then |
| 03:17.07 | mafm | good night all! |
| 03:17.08 | brlcad | whichever one you do decide on, looking forward to seeing it ;) |
| 03:17.11 | brlcad | cya |
| 03:21.22 | brlcad | likes the log idea |
| 03:36.47 | yukonbob | reads sb |
| 03:40.07 | brlcad | goes to get some food |
| 03:47.18 | yukonbob | good hunting |
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| 04:50.11 | starseeker | growls in frustration - the Rosin paper seems to have an equation for a and b that gives something related to the values I need but not the ACTUAL values I need |
| 04:50.39 | starseeker | Maxima and the C code now agree, but they're both not giving what I know I need. |
| 04:53.05 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30595 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Equations now calculating something other than nan, and answers agree with Maxima's evaluation of the formula, but still not returning the original parameters |
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| 14:13.32 | mafm | hi |
| 14:16.39 | brlcad | howdy |
| 14:19.03 | mafm | up only for a brief while but already tired :) |
| 14:19.23 | mafm | and you? |
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| 14:37.46 | mafm | hi Elperion |
| 14:38.22 | Elperion | hi |
| 14:48.29 | mafm | brlcad: did you talk with aqsis people already? |
| 14:56.35 | brlcad | mafm: nope |
| 14:57.47 | brlcad | like I said last night, not a priority or driving decision factor in the least (you're held to your own merits with us, not them), might talk to them at some point just for some perspective |
| 14:58.06 | brlcad | not tired, been coding for hours :) |
| 14:59.56 | mafm | huh |
| 15:00.10 | mafm | I think that I need a coffee, too sleepy |
| 15:00.22 | mafm | Google, you're stealing my sleep! |
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| 18:47.16 | mafm | quiet in here today :) |
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| 20:02.36 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, it comes and goes -- depends who all is busy |
| 20:02.53 | brlcad | lot of the devs don't make it into irc, they lurk on the mailing list |
| 20:03.36 | alex_joni | brlcad: does that work ok? |
| 20:06.07 | brlcad | alex_joni: does what work ok? |
| 20:06.18 | alex_joni | that devels lurk only on the mailing list |
| 20:06.32 | alex_joni | I'm not sure I could do that.. |
| 20:07.14 | brlcad | you certainly don't have to :) |
| 20:07.23 | alex_joni | I'm quite fond of IRC and discussing things with fellow developers in real-time |
| 20:07.28 | brlcad | likewise |
| 20:07.33 | alex_joni | it's way nicer to argue over IRC than on the mailing list :D |
| 20:07.37 | brlcad | I tend to drag them into irc when I can |
| 20:20.54 | mafm | you evil being! :) |
| 20:21.32 | mafm | hmm, I have to go for a while (90 mins or so), but maybe when I'm back we can discuss about your distributed thing and I could make the proposal at last? |
| 20:29.40 | brlcad | sure |
| 20:33.28 | mafm | good |
| 20:33.47 | mafm | another night without sleeping properly, sounds thrilling :) |
| 20:35.49 | brlcad | excellent |
| 20:36.00 | brlcad | there's plenty of time to sleep when you're dead :) |
| 20:36.11 | spike_ | hey guys |
| 20:36.27 | yukonbob | peeks in |
| 20:36.38 | spike_ | so i was looking into the blender converter for GSoC, but it seems like Collada would be way more useful |
| 20:36.49 | spike_ | that and blender is a very very weird app |
| 20:37.27 | mafm | the bad thing is that if you don't sleep too much when alive, you're most likely to get to the dead-sleep phase sooner :D |
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| 20:40.20 | spike_ | does anyone know much about collada? like the collada dom or fcollada library? |
| 20:41.20 | brlcad | a fair bit, what of it? |
| 20:42.30 | brlcad | spike_: any converter (or sets of converters) would be a valid project |
| 20:42.37 | brlcad | collada isn't already on the list? |
| 20:42.45 | spike_ | well i'm fairly new to it, was just curious what would be involved in writing something to convert its data into data brlcad can use |
| 20:43.30 | brlcad | it's a content format, not a solid modeling or CAD format so there are a variety of import issues, but it's not a hard converter to implement |
| 20:43.35 | spike_ | i figure none of the structs are compatable, so my job would be basically to create some temporary structs to grab the data from collada into a format that brlcad could understand |
| 20:43.47 | spike_ | yeah i didnt think so, since both or open source |
| 20:43.55 | spike_ | x3d would be hell imo |
| 20:44.22 | brlcad | nah, x3d is about the same |
| 20:44.34 | spike_ | interesting... |
| 20:44.41 | brlcad | x3d, vrml, collada -- all have a lot of overlap |
| 20:45.30 | spike_ | well i was looking on the wiki and it seems there are already apps to put a .blend into the collada format |
| 20:46.01 | spike_ | so i scratched the idea of a blender converter since this seemed more important |
| 20:47.34 | spike_ | for a proposal how in depth would i need to get? i dont know what else to specify besides the fact that i'd be writing a converter |
| 20:47.46 | brlcad | apps for blender? |
| 20:47.53 | brlcad | nobody has proposed that as an idea |
| 20:48.17 | brlcad | blender wouldn't be high on my list -- those are pretty much listed in order of priority |
| 20:48.26 | brlcad | s/priority/general usefulness/ |
| 20:48.31 | spike_ | yeah i noticed |
| 20:48.55 | brlcad | ah, collada is on the list |
| 20:49.01 | spike_ | yes its at the top somewhere |
| 20:49.22 | brlcad | yep, probably on par with x3d |
| 20:49.43 | spike_ | im trying to figure out what i'd want to specify on the proposal though; i mean i dont know too much about the collada format as of now but i would know it like the back of my hand if i were to try to work with it |
| 20:52.24 | brlcad | sure |
| 20:53.43 | spike_ | guess i'll just write up that then |
| 20:53.59 | alex_joni | brlcad: where's the list again? |
| 20:54.38 | alex_joni | n/m found it |
| 20:54.44 | spike_ | bbl guys |
| 20:55.43 | alex_joni | brlcad: oh, .u3d is even after blender :( |
| 21:10.12 | brlcad | mafm: for what it's worth, things are exceptionally different here with regards to project management |
| 21:10.59 | mafm | brlcad: sorry, I don't follow? |
| 21:11.25 | brlcad | process overhead, formalities |
| 21:11.53 | mafm | ah |
| 21:12.06 | mafm | you mean for the meeting or the timing issue with the branches? |
| 21:12.14 | brlcad | i mean in general |
| 21:14.33 | mafm | :) |
| 21:15.03 | mafm | the bureocracy isn't much in the project I think, but well |
| 21:15.24 | mafm | I think that each main devel was busy in some other branch during winter |
| 21:16.09 | mafm | so it's difficult to focus in the overall project if everybody is busy in their piece of terrain |
| 21:16.22 | mafm | it feels that the developement is a bit slow, I think |
| 21:18.48 | brlcad | well that can happen in any project |
| 21:18.57 | brlcad | devs tend to focus on their niche |
| 21:19.03 | brlcad | or a given interest |
| 21:19.25 | brlcad | especially when there is so much to do and only so many devs/time to do it |
| 21:27.42 | pacman87 | is there a general interface/container for access to primitive functions (the g_*.c files) |
| 21:28.33 | pacman87 | so you can call rt_*_shot() without knowing what the * is? |
| 21:29.32 | mafm | brlcad: :) |
| 21:29.43 | mafm | ok, still heading home now, be back in 1h or so... |
| 21:32.01 | mafm | later! |
| 21:39.24 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 21:55.59 | hippieindamakin8 | hey guys |
| 21:56.04 | hippieindamakin8 | hello brlcad |
| 21:58.56 | brlcad | hello |
| 22:00.16 | hippieindamakin8 | how many applications have you recieved so far ? |
| 22:04.16 | pacman87 | add one to that number (just hit submit on mine) ;) |
| 22:04.45 | yukonbob | 1 meeeellion applications |
| 22:04.59 | pacman87 | brlcad: is there a general interface/container for access to primitive functions (the g_*.c files), so you can call rt_*_shot() without knowing what the * is? |
| 22:06.05 | pacman87 | yukonbob: do you have an "off by .99999e6 error"? |
| 22:06.43 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: i've told you several times now to stop worrying about that |
| 22:06.48 | brlcad | worry about your submission |
| 22:06.58 | brlcad | pacman87: cool |
| 22:07.00 | brlcad | looks |
| 22:07.02 | hippieindamakin8 | :) i have 3 deadlines tommorow :( |
| 22:07.42 | hippieindamakin8 | made a running dog robot as a term project |
| 22:21.32 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad i would also suggest another idea |
| 22:22.01 | brlcad | competition is going to be pretty tough from the looks of things, even with low submission rates |
| 22:22.02 | hippieindamakin8 | it would be better if u have one interface rather than having 2 of them .. |
| 22:22.36 | hippieindamakin8 | smthing like kate or dolphin with kde 4.0 |
| 22:22.49 | brlcad | given I don't think we'll accept more than 2-4 students |
| 22:23.05 | hippieindamakin8 | u have a drafting space in the upper frame and a terminal in the lower frame of the UI |
| 22:23.29 | hippieindamakin8 | oh yeah u said that before.. |
| 22:24.08 | hippieindamakin8 | well i just returned from my lab :P and was worried about my grades a bit too :D and hence put that question.. nvm |
| 22:30.49 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
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| 22:45.00 | *** join/#brlcad Daytona (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 22:53.13 | hippieindamakin8 | hey daytona |
| 22:53.43 | Daytona | hi |
| 22:54.18 | brlcad | howdy Daytona |
| 22:54.34 | brlcad | happy super fun sunday to you |
| 22:54.35 | Daytona | hello |
| 22:54.54 | Daytona | super fun?? |
| 22:55.00 | brlcad | :) |
| 22:58.06 | Daytona | brlcad: just to keep you informed, I have a week in Daytona Beach scheduled (leaving on April 11) |
| 22:58.59 | Daytona | If there is no extension for GSoc applications, that should work fine |
| 22:59.23 | Daytona | but if there is an extension, I think it might interfere a bit |
| 23:01.03 | brlcad | no problem |
| 23:01.26 | brlcad | the biggest step will be ranking the applications once that opens up |
| 23:01.38 | Daytona | I think April 11 is the mentor assignment deadline |
| 23:01.38 | brlcad | just to see what people are willing to mentor |
| 23:01.50 | brlcad | as I cannot actually assign mentors, you have to say "I'm willing to mentor this" |
| 23:02.11 | brlcad | and then the actual scoring to narrow down selections |
| 23:02.30 | Daytona | OK, I can probably access the internet from the beach :-) |
| 23:02.42 | brlcad | hopefully we can narrow down selections on monday regardless of any extension |
| 23:03.15 | Daytona | Yes, I expect all serious applicants will be in by then |
| 23:03.18 | brlcad | with only 2-4 slots, and the few on the mailing list that haven't submitted yet, there's probably 2-4 good candidates that could be chosen regardless of an extension |
| 23:04.14 | Daytona | When do you find out how many slots we get? |
| 23:05.03 | brlcad | april 14th |
| 23:06.07 | Daytona | Oh.., so we score, select, assign mentors, then find out how many? |
| 23:06.18 | brlcad | yes |
| 23:06.35 | brlcad | we place an upper limit / desired count on the slots, then rank them all numerically |
| 23:06.58 | brlcad | then we get something at or below our requested count |
| 23:07.30 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@89-180-70-135.net.novis.pt) | |
| 23:07.40 | mafm | hi |
| 23:07.41 | brlcad | so depending how we rank and who all is willing to mentor what, I see requesting either 3 or 4, then we likely get anywhere from 2-4 |
| 23:07.51 | brlcad | hello mafm |
| 23:07.55 | Daytona | OK |
| 23:08.27 | Daytona | hi, mafm |
| 23:09.45 | brlcad | nice to see a stronger submissions finally get added |
| 23:10.51 | yukonbob | when is the ranked-list due to Google? |
| 23:11.26 | Daytona | yes, I hadn't seen the latest till just now |
| 23:12.29 | brlcad | by this time last year, we would have been looking at 15 like that .. that's what everyone is concerned about with the deadline :) |
| 23:12.44 | brlcad | yukonbob: by the 11th |
| 23:16.03 | yukonbob | is "negative object segment detection" that bug manifested in my hub rendering? |
| 23:16.05 | mafm | concerned about the lack of applications? |
| 23:16.42 | brlcad | not really |
| 23:16.52 | brlcad | it's just drastically different |
| 23:17.10 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeppers it sure is |
| 23:17.30 | brlcad | nice that you keyed on it :) |
| 23:17.54 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 23:18.12 | brlcad | nobody proposing it so far though |
| 23:18.24 | yukonbob | gah!!! I need to start a campaign!! |
| 23:18.37 | yukonbob | (or do it myself out of the GSoC context) |
| 23:18.42 | Daytona | brlcad: is that the bug that you and I have discussed several times, regarding boolweave? |
| 23:18.45 | brlcad | yep |
| 23:19.06 | brlcad | probably could be better-worded, but nobody would likely understand "fix boolweave" :) |
| 23:19.38 | yukonbob | waves to Daytona |
| 23:19.53 | yukonbob | I don't see you in #brlcad often (that I know of), but see your commit msgs :) |
| 23:19.53 | Daytona | hi, yukonbob |
| 23:20.32 | Daytona | I haven't been here much, but trying to be here a bit more to listen to GSoC discussions |
| 23:21.08 | brlcad | thinks Daytona should try out screen :) |
| 23:21.30 | brlcad | screen+irssi ftw |
| 23:21.41 | Daytona | I thought you would be impressed that I moved up to irssi :-) |
| 23:21.47 | brlcad | is :) |
| 23:22.34 | Daytona | I'll give it a try during a quiet time |
| 23:23.13 | brlcad | you basically run it on/from a machine that isn't powered off and it provides a persistent connection that you can detach from and reattach to easily |
| 23:24.00 | brlcad | screen .. then run irssi -- ctrl-a d to detach, screen -r to reattach |
| 23:24.24 | Daytona | What I would like is to get irssi to beep when my nick is used |
| 23:24.45 | brlcad | does it already hilight at least? |
| 23:24.50 | Daytona | I found someone's settings to do that, but it doesn't work |
| 23:25.04 | brlcad | you can set hilights with /hilight keyword |
| 23:25.05 | Daytona | Yeah, I changed the hilight color |
| 23:25.37 | brlcad | then /last -hilight to see the last hilights |
| 23:26.23 | brlcad | should work with /set bell_beeps ON |
| 23:26.46 | Daytona | is on |
| 23:26.53 | yukonbob | "beeps" are a function of irssi settings combined with screen settings combined with terminal settings -- not always easy to setup :P |
| 23:27.02 | brlcad | then of course depending on your terminal allowing audible bell |
| 23:27.49 | brlcad | what does /set beep_msg_level report? |
| 23:28.12 | Daytona | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:28.40 | brlcad | huh, it actually has an equal? |
| 23:28.46 | brlcad | shouldn't |
| 23:29.05 | Daytona | That is the setting that someone claimed would do the beeping I wanted |
| 23:29.07 | brlcad | shouldn't matter I'd think, but maybe causing a problem |
| 23:29.26 | brlcad | try just: /set beep_msg_level MSGS NOTICES DCC DCCMSGS HILIGHT |
| 23:29.51 | brlcad | Daytona: then see if this hilights |
| 23:29.52 | mafm | does your terminal beep really? :) |
| 23:30.15 | brlcad | in screen, it'll generate a wuff wuff message by default |
| 23:30.44 | yukonbob | ^A-g will toggle between visual/audible beep |
| 23:30.53 | Daytona | LOL, ^G does not beep in my terminal :-) |
| 23:31.10 | yukonbob | rather: ^A-^G will toggle between visual/audible beep |
| 23:31.32 | brlcad | irssi probably captures it |
| 23:31.39 | brlcad | yukonbob: heh, thx |
| 23:32.01 | yukonbob | and in irssi "/beep" will send a beep to the channel |
| 23:32.11 | brlcad | ah, good test |
| 23:32.15 | yukonbob | (like I've been doing here a couple times... and one more for good measure) |
| 23:32.29 | Daytona | no beeps heard here |
| 23:32.40 | yukonbob | (I just sent 3) |
| 23:32.53 | brlcad | maybe your terminal isn't doing anything with bells |
| 23:33.29 | Daytona | looks like "terminal bell: is enabled |
| 23:34.27 | Daytona | Oh well, no big deal |
| 23:34.30 | brlcad | hum |
| 23:34.39 | brlcad | which terminal? |
| 23:35.04 | yukonbob | Daytona: are you on a Mac? |
| 23:35.17 | Daytona | no, I dell laptop |
| 23:35.22 | Daytona | running ubuntu |
| 23:35.54 | yukonbob | xterm, or variant? |
| 23:35.57 | Daytona | running gnome-terminal |
| 23:36.43 | yukonbob | sends 3 more beeps, heads back to report writing for a bit |
| 23:36.52 | yukonbob | (ciao, folks, chat later) :) |
| 23:37.02 | Daytona | bye yukonbob |
| 23:37.23 | mafm | gnome-terminal? uh, probably they won't let you to configure that |
| 23:37.36 | mafm | it's too dangerous for users to mess with those things :) |
| 23:37.51 | mafm | bye yukonbob |
| 23:37.59 | hippieindamakin8 | u can configure gnome terminal |
| 23:39.47 | Daytona | I see a profile editor, and "terminal bell" is enabled |
| 23:41.21 | hippieindamakin8 | i love the terminal bell :D |
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| 23:43.19 | hippieindamakin8 | ppl on Gnome use "Tilda" and the ppl on KDE use "yakuake" :) |
| 23:43.34 | andrecastelo | hi |
| 23:43.48 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo |
| 23:43.52 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8i |
| 23:44.07 | andrecastelo | is photon mapping an option for gsoc ?? |
| 23:44.15 | brlcad | wonders if /etc/input has anything interesting for Daytona |
| 23:44.26 | Daytona | I just checked, and there is a bug report titled "terminal bell does not beep" in ununtu :-) |
| 23:44.41 | brlcad | andrecastelo: "global illumination" whether via photon mapping or otherwise is an option |
| 23:44.43 | mafm | hey andrecastelo, I see that you're following my advice :) |
| 23:44.56 | andrecastelo | hehehe hey mafm, yes indeed |
| 23:45.12 | brlcad | we actually already have an implementation of photon mapping, but it's shoehorned in and really hard to use (and buggy) |
| 23:45.30 | mafm | should get extra points for bringing more people to BRL-CAD :P |
| 23:46.03 | andrecastelo | brlcad: is fixing it and making it more functional a gsoc apropriate project?? :) |
| 23:46.23 | andrecastelo | (maybe it's almost functional, so wouldn't be 3 months thing) |
| 23:47.00 | brlcad | sure would be, as would be enhancing it .. non-trivial |
| 23:47.24 | brlcad | likewise, implementing a new global illumination renderer that does it's own path-tracing using our librt |
| 23:48.10 | brlcad | would have to show competence in that area and come up with a good proposal |
| 23:50.54 | andrecastelo | brlcad: well, i don't have experience in that area, perhaps i should look for another project |
| 23:51.20 | andrecastelo | (but i do have some understanding about global illumination and photon mapping and the motivation to study it deeper) |
| 23:52.38 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that would make things a lot harder -- there is definitely room to learn some of what is needed, but implementing either would take some time |
| 23:53.43 | brlcad | a lot of the high-level background info about path tracing or photon mapping or radiosity, etc, can be picked up in an afternoon of reading |
| 23:54.05 | andrecastelo | but the implementation is the problem, right ??? |
| 23:54.20 | brlcad | depends entirely on you and how quickly you learn :) |
| 23:55.20 | andrecastelo | it's comforting to know that :) |
| 23:55.50 | andrecastelo | the photon mapping implementation is written in C ? |
| 23:56.57 | brlcad | *completing* the task isn't the driving factor for acceptance if you intended to work long-term on the project (beyond gsoc), but you would have to instill confidence that you can in fact complete the task and make good progress over the summer |
| 23:57.04 | brlcad | yes, entirely in C |
| 23:58.56 | brlcad | src/liboptical/photonmap.c and src/rt have most of it |
| 00:00.15 | andrecastelo | thanks, brlcad, i'll do some research, take a look at the code, write the application and see how it turns out ;) |
| 00:00.24 | brlcad | sounds good |
| 00:15.14 | mafm | so brlcad, are you available now to talk about that? |
| 00:15.27 | brlcad | probably |
| 00:16.22 | mafm | good |
| 00:16.53 | mafm | so what about the distributed approach, can you please elaborate or link to some document? |
| 00:17.16 | brlcad | well we have a raytracer in brl-cad |
| 00:17.19 | brlcad | lots of them, actually |
| 00:17.34 | brlcad | all based around our librt ray-trace library |
| 00:18.49 | brlcad | we support parallel ray-tracing pretty pervasively |
| 00:19.14 | brlcad | 'rt' is the main ray-tracer |
| 00:19.42 | brlcad | we also have distributed ray-tracing via 'remrt' (remote rt) and 'rtsrv' (remote compute daemons) |
| 00:20.30 | brlcad | remrt and rtsrv basically set up manual communication pipes and negotiate packets as needed, and you have to specify all machines you want to work on |
| 00:21.25 | brlcad | what we don't do easily though is 'automatic distributed' using something like mpi, pvm, or grid interfaces |
| 00:21.44 | brlcad | it would be nice if rt inherintly had distributed capacities |
| 00:22.45 | mafm | are the computations heavy enough that it compensates to distribute them via network? |
| 00:22.50 | brlcad | so that's the basic idea, either adding the functionality to rt or giving remrt/rtsrv major updates to improve them |
| 00:23.18 | brlcad | that depends entirely on the model being rendered |
| 00:23.41 | brlcad | some are blazingly fast, others swimmingly slow |
| 00:23.58 | mafm | slow as in minutes? |
| 00:24.19 | brlcad | anywhere from subsecond to hours |
| 00:24.51 | brlcad | so it really needs to auto-detect and load-balance accordingly, know when to farm out the job and when not to |
| 00:25.17 | brlcad | the models might be just a few k or might be several GB in size too |
| 00:26.17 | mafm | typical grid jobs, for scientific grids that I'm used to, usually take hours/days |
| 00:26.31 | brlcad | the two extremes where we usually want distributed are when someone's making a movie and rendering thousands of frames or someone rendering a really high-quality detailed complex model rendering |
| 00:26.44 | mafm | and in most them the turnaround time for "hello world" is like 3-5 minutes :D |
| 00:27.14 | mafm | so the idea would be to run them withing clusters I guess, with LAN setups? |
| 00:27.28 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 00:28.25 | mafm | I have programmed in PVM a bit, only at univ for test programs |
| 00:28.29 | brlcad | as well as loosely connected LAN-based setups over slow connections (a typical office with maybe 10-100 high-end workstations available to run compute nodes with an mpi config for example) |
| 00:28.45 | mafm | and in MPI at work but only for testing, no real applications |
| 00:29.16 | mafm | anyway the theory I think that I'm OK with it |
| 00:29.25 | brlcad | MPI or a solid grid framework would probably be ideal |
| 00:30.06 | mafm | but I guess that for doing that from a ray tracer, I would have to have solid knowledge of the techniques of raytracing too? |
| 00:30.52 | brlcad | not necessarily |
| 00:30.59 | brlcad | at least not beyond understanding the data model |
| 00:31.17 | brlcad | ray-tracing generally requires the entire model for example since rays can diverge in any direction |
| 00:32.00 | brlcad | so you either have some sort of master dispatch and distribute portions of data or distribute all the data to all nodes and dispatch rays/scanlines or some hybrid |
| 00:33.31 | mafm | say that you want to render a village |
| 00:33.47 | mafm | the input are the solids represenging houses and so on |
| 00:33.59 | mafm | the output would be what, just the 2D image? |
| 00:34.20 | brlcad | yep |
| 00:34.27 | brlcad | or a series of 2D images in the case of an animation |
| 00:35.19 | mafm | say that you want an animation |
| 00:35.28 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, the download page is a little off |
| 00:35.55 | andrecastelo | it points to the 7.10.2 release (at least the source) |
| 00:35.56 | mafm | the output or intermediate calculations of one frame could be used for the second? (similar to what MPEG do) |
| 00:36.32 | brlcad | andrecastelo: thanks |
| 00:36.40 | brlcad | it needs to be wikified |
| 00:36.50 | brlcad | or made a module that auto-points to the latest |
| 00:37.05 | brlcad | mafm: yes |
| 00:37.18 | brlcad | rt already has inherint support for multiframe rendering |
| 00:37.33 | andrecastelo | (also, if i want to check the code, i get the 7.12.0 source, right?? how hard is it to compile in windows?? ) |
| 00:37.40 | brlcad | you feed it transactioned command lists and it deals with what needs to be reprepped accordingly |
| 00:38.00 | brlcad | andrecastelo: there's an msvc studio project in misc -- should be click and run |
| 00:38.25 | andrecastelo | great, thanks |
| 00:39.29 | mafm | if frames are interdependent, that turns it a bit difficult it seems |
| 00:39.42 | brlcad | they're independent |
| 00:40.09 | brlcad | it's just you can speed things up if you don't need to reprep, so rt does so accordingly |
| 00:40.52 | mafm | well yes, but if rendering them sequentially is much less effort than the sum() of separate efforts, the speedup of distributing it is not very big |
| 00:41.05 | mafm | with aqsis there was a similar problem |
| 00:41.19 | mafm | buckets (portions of the image) were in principle independent |
| 00:41.35 | mafm | but constructing the octree was very expensive |
| 00:42.23 | mafm | so if you didn't take advantage of that, and construct the octree from scratch each time, the result was that it was more expensive when using several threads |
| 00:42.56 | mafm | I think that there could be similar problems in brlcad, or you already have that part sorted out? |
| 00:43.09 | brlcad | you're thinking thread-level, we have that |
| 00:43.26 | brlcad | parallel is a done deal |
| 00:43.36 | brlcad | distributed even works, it can just be heavily improved |
| 00:44.15 | mafm | I know the difference between theads and distributed, it was an example, to be extrapolated :) |
| 00:44.26 | brlcad | so yeah, buckets of an impage are independent -- but the model itself isn't |
| 00:44.30 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo and mafm u guys might be interested in this http://www.siggraph.org/education/materials/HyperGraph/raytrace/rtrace0.htm |
| 00:44.45 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: thanks! |
| 00:44.50 | brlcad | mafm: sure, but the latency concerns between parallel and distributed are huge |
| 00:45.03 | hippieindamakin8 | u wanted to know the raytracing fundamentals rt :) np |
| 00:45.22 | brlcad | that's why the real driver is big render jobs where we know implicitly that it's going to be a benefit (huge render or tons of frames) |
| 00:45.31 | andrecastelo | also - is a kd tree implemented?? |
| 00:45.56 | brlcad | effectively, we have a hybrid |
| 00:46.04 | mafm | I see |
| 00:47.16 | brlcad | brl-cad's rt is actually the first parallel distributed ray-tracer (per all published references), an early second-generation ray-tracer |
| 00:48.02 | mafm | that's remrt+rtsrv? |
| 00:48.10 | brlcad | the distributed portion, yes |
| 00:48.11 | mafm | or the librt? |
| 00:48.30 | mafm | I mean, which parts would I have to modify? |
| 00:48.59 | brlcad | depends entirely on whether the idea is to improve remrt usability or add inherint distributed support to rt :) |
| 00:49.04 | brlcad | there are merits to both |
| 00:51.11 | brlcad | could read some of the published papers, this relates specifically to brl-cad: http://ftp.arl.army.mil/~mike/papers/95cadsymp/realtime.html |
| 00:51.14 | mafm | both them are in C it seems (browsing the repositories) |
| 00:52.35 | brlcad | more references in http://graphics.cs.uni-sb.de/Publications/2001/star.pdf |
| 00:52.43 | brlcad | yes, 90% of the sources are in C |
| 00:53.09 | brlcad | only the new BREP code is in C++ plus a few modules, along with the tcl/tk modeler sources |
| 00:53.31 | brlcad | rt stays C, remrt could be redesigned |
| 00:53.31 | mafm | is there a "central" source file in librt where the high level stuff is implemented? |
| 00:53.51 | brlcad | what high-level stuff? |
| 00:54.17 | brlcad | high-level ray dispatching is in the binary front-end, src/rt src/remrt |
| 00:55.09 | mafm | I mean an important file in librt |
| 00:55.21 | mafm | to see how scary is the code :D |
| 00:56.29 | mafm | int is_hackers_night( struct timeval *tv ); |
| 00:56.33 | mafm | :D |
| 00:56.48 | brlcad | you wouldn't really be modifying anything in librt, at least I'd be surprised if you need to |
| 00:57.50 | brlcad | otherwise, some of the core is in shoot.c, bool.c |
| 00:58.18 | brlcad | you really should start from srt/rt though -- librt is the library itself, even parallelism happens higher up |
| 00:59.16 | brlcad | src/rt/view.c do.c and most importantly worker.c |
| 01:00.06 | hippieindamakin8 | librt is all about the geometry representation and manipulations/transformations mostly |
| 01:01.55 | mafm | ok, looking at those :) |
| 01:01.58 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad .. btw wat is the function of this server ? rtserver |
| 01:04.24 | Daytona | librtserver is a C library that is loaded by a Java class to provide raytracing services for a Java App |
| 01:07.28 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 01:07.42 | hippieindamakin8 | tx :) |
| 01:08.32 | mafm | hmm, don't know brlcad |
| 01:08.59 | mafm | does this have more priority than the other idea? |
| 01:09.09 | Daytona | hippieindamakin8: If you have some ideas on how to improve that code, that would be great!!! |
| 01:09.11 | mafm | I haven't even seen it in the Project Ideas page |
| 01:09.13 | hippieindamakin8 | daytona can u suggest me an appilcation |
| 01:10.36 | hippieindamakin8 | :) i just opened it daytona :P i wanted to apply for this OO API project so was going through the places where there is a possibility of rendering some geometry :) |
| 01:10.57 | hippieindamakin8 | as i get more familiar with brlcad i sure will :) |
| 01:10.59 | brlcad | mafm: like I said -- a really solid application for any of the ideas trumps the priority aspect |
| 01:12.09 | Daytona | hippieindamakin8: The librtserver is just used in a JNI wrapper |
| 01:13.17 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh there is this jade.jar in the src :) now i am connecting pieces |
| 01:13.35 | hippieindamakin8 | in case it is connected to this |
| 01:14.08 | Daytona | the librtserver and the jbrlcad are not connected |
| 01:14.57 | hippieindamakin8 | nono.. in the src there is this folder called java |
| 01:15.05 | hippieindamakin8 | i aint talking about jbrlcad |
| 01:15.11 | Daytona | jade.jar is a units and measurments jar (now replaced by jscience) |
| 01:15.50 | hippieindamakin8 | sorry.. :P i am mistaken.. i wanted to talk about brlcad server.java |
| 01:16.11 | hippieindamakin8 | sorry.. it was a long time :P |
| 01:16.32 | mafm | brlcad: hmm, honestly, I'm not talking into getting into GSoC with BRL-CAD for being a higher priority project |
| 01:17.01 | brlcad | no comprendo |
| 01:17.02 | mafm | hmm, let me think about how to explain it... (I'm a bit tired at the moment :) ) |
| 01:17.11 | hippieindamakin8 | ~/brlcad7-10-2/src/java/mil/army/arl/brlcad |
| 01:18.43 | Daytona | looks like there is almost nothing in that class |
| 01:19.10 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i shalll go through that :) |
| 01:20.50 | Daytona | the jbrlcad has a bit more functionality :-) |
| 01:21.27 | mafm | <brlcad> mafm: like I said -- a really solid application for any of the ideas trumps the priority aspect |
| 01:21.46 | mafm | when I'm asking about the priority, I don't mean to take it as an advantage |
| 01:22.10 | mafm | I mean if you suggest that because of my relation with distributed computing at work or what |
| 01:22.28 | mafm | or if you came up with that for other reasons |
| 01:22.48 | brlcad | yes, I only suggested it as a consideration because of your background |
| 01:23.05 | brlcad | otherwise, no different than then other listed ideas |
| 01:23.12 | mafm | yesterday we were talking about other proposals, it's you who started to talk about this one (IIRC, I was a bit sleepy) |
| 01:23.59 | brlcad | there was someone (a student) that worked on an mpi layer for rt a couple years ago too, for several months, but they were learning everything from scratch and never finished anything more than job propagation |
| 01:24.36 | mafm | aha |
| 01:24.58 | mafm | so one of the reasons is that maybe I see it as a more doable proposal than the other one? |
| 01:25.18 | brlcad | right, and I firmly believe that you need to be excited about the work --figured with your background that distributed might be of interest, if not then screw it |
| 01:26.20 | mafm | well, certainly distributed computing it is interesting, but I enjoy many areas |
| 01:27.18 | mafm | working with a 3D engine to communicate with commands with a remote server is also another, making a multiplayer game it's similar in concept, I think |
| 01:27.51 | mafm | so probably this project would have more chances to succeed |
| 01:27.54 | brlcad | some loose similarities, yes |
| 01:29.38 | mafm | but I also understand that maybe it would be more valuable for you to make my application for other project, because is less common |
| 01:30.02 | mafm | so if I was accepted and finish the program, there would be more chances for other people to do that OpenGL GU |
| 01:30.03 | mafm | GUI |
| 01:30.04 | brlcad | what's less common? |
| 01:30.23 | brlcad | ah, yes -- it certainly has higher impact potential |
| 01:30.30 | mafm | the knowledge of MPI/distributed stuff |
| 01:30.36 | brlcad | it's also one that will be more critiqued design-wise :) |
| 01:30.57 | mafm | so in the case that I would go ahead, I would be beaten? :) |
| 01:32.15 | brlcad | nope |
| 01:33.45 | mafm | good to know :) |
| 01:33.47 | mafm | well, I see two problems then: |
| 01:34.03 | mafm | 1) it's more difficult for me to come up with a plan, |
| 01:34.21 | mafm | 2) it's a more risky project I think, there are more chances of failure |
| 01:34.43 | brlcad | whether you're not accepted is dependent on the quality of your application (compared to quality of others), number of slots we accept (just 2-4), the topic being proposed, as well as any details about yourself and your abilities |
| 01:34.49 | mafm | oh, and 3) I don't have the infrastructure to test the distributed rendering |
| 01:35.01 | brlcad | okay, so forget it :) |
| 01:35.07 | brlcad | not pressing the idea on you :) |
| 01:35.14 | brlcad | pick whatever suits you |
| 01:37.48 | mafm | I don't feel pressed really, I just want to make explicit that it's more risky, in the case that I would be accepted and go ahead, I think that it could fail more easily |
| 01:38.06 | mafm | and I don't know if you could provide the infrastruture or what? |
| 01:38.40 | mafm | we have clusters (not very big) at my job, but they're in production and we cannot install new things |
| 01:38.45 | brlcad | heh, you're just saying all of the reasons for why you shouldn't submit it |
| 01:38.51 | brlcad | forget about it! :) |
| 01:42.29 | mafm | sighs |
| 01:42.40 | mafm | btw, I could submit more than one proposal, you now :D |
| 01:42.46 | brlcad | that you could |
| 01:43.01 | brlcad | but better to focus on getting at least one really solid |
| 01:43.19 | andrecastelo | have you guys received lots of applications?? |
| 01:43.21 | brlcad | i'd recommend doing one proposal and putting the extra effort on a better patch .. |
| 01:43.34 | brlcad | andrecastelo: not really |
| 01:43.56 | andrecastelo | and also - i see that you are part of the bzflags community as well, will you be a mentor both ?? |
| 01:44.04 | andrecastelo | be a mentor in* both.. |
| 01:45.08 | brlcad | i'm admin for both, I hope to actually *not* mentor for either (officially) if I can get away with it ... but then still mentoring as usual group-mentorshipwise |
| 01:45.52 | brlcad | if I do mentor, it's probably be for brl-cad |
| 01:46.17 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 01:48.07 | mafm | there are no assigned/expected mentors yet, I guess? |
| 01:48.21 | mafm | btw I hope that we have some extended period to submit the patch :) |
| 01:48.49 | brlcad | there's about another week to submit a patch |
| 01:52.44 | mafm | ah, good |
| 01:53.52 | brlcad | it will be required of any serious candidates |
| 01:54.03 | brlcad | i.e. any finalists for certain |
| 01:54.33 | brlcad | if someone can't make a basic patch out of a million line codebase, that bodes very poorly :) |
| 01:58.40 | mafm | sed -i 's/BRL-CAD/mafm-CAD/g' :) |
| 01:58.56 | brlcad | heh |
| 01:59.14 | mafm | that'd be at least 1000 lines changed |
| 02:00.09 | brlcad | that'd hit every file |
| 02:00.16 | brlcad | BRL-CAD is in the file header |
| 02:00.18 | mafm | btw, now I should still submit the proposal to the mailing list, or in parallel, or what? |
| 02:00.24 | brlcad | "yes" |
| 02:00.41 | brlcad | could give a summary to the mailing list |
| 02:00.55 | brlcad | then extra detail to the wiki or as a submission |
| 02:01.30 | mafm | what if I paste the complete submission? |
| 02:01.41 | mafm | in the wiki or so |
| 02:02.44 | brlcad | you can put whatever you like into the wiki |
| 02:03.03 | brlcad | good place for full/more detail |
| 02:04.07 | mafm | going to sell his wikispace for Google ads :P |
| 02:05.36 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, i was looking at the TODO list and found this in the lower priority part: |
| 02:05.37 | andrecastelo | * center of presented area |
| 02:05.49 | brlcad | yes? |
| 02:06.07 | andrecastelo | what is it exactly ?? |
| 02:06.13 | andrecastelo | ( http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/TODO ) |
| 02:06.32 | brlcad | in a given 2D projection, where is the center of presented area |
| 02:07.42 | andrecastelo | is it simple enough to implement as the required patch ?? |
| 02:07.43 | brlcad | that task really souldn't take more than a couple days at best |
| 02:07.59 | brlcad | it's possible .. a bit heavy for a patch, might take a day |
| 02:08.17 | brlcad | (i.e. a few hours) |
| 02:08.45 | andrecastelo | hm i see.. |
| 02:10.28 | brlcad | but certainly would be impressive for a patch |
| 02:10.52 | brlcad | folks for bz have already submitted patches that are actually harder |
| 02:11.07 | mafm | I think that my router will reconnect, be right back :D |
| 02:11.14 | andrecastelo | really?? hmm.. |
| 02:11.19 | andrecastelo | we have one week to deliver, right ? |
| 02:11.26 | brlcad | yep |
| 02:11.38 | brlcad | seriously though -- make the application itself good first :) |
| 02:11.57 | brlcad | then work on the patch |
| 02:12.02 | andrecastelo | hm ok.. will do |
| 02:12.13 | andrecastelo | another thing |
| 02:13.56 | andrecastelo | i'm having a problem running the program.. tried compiling from source and at first i've got "Build: 133 succeeded, 1 failed.." |
| 02:14.10 | andrecastelo | then tried again and got " Build: 0 succeeded, 0 failed, 134 up-to-date, 0 skipped" |
| 02:14.21 | andrecastelo | tried running and got some problem with libbu.dll |
| 02:14.36 | brlcad | maybe that could be your patch ;) |
| 02:14.47 | brlcad | a build system patch, figure out what went wrong |
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| 02:16.41 | andrecastelo | hmm |
| 02:16.41 | brlcad | otherwise, that's not enough info to say anything useful, would have to know what failed, what the error was, maybe other factors |
| 02:17.00 | andrecastelo | yes, i was pasting it- http://rafb.net/p/61FfDf17.html |
| 02:17.56 | brlcad | it's trying to run asc2g to build our models and failing to find some library |
| 02:18.13 | brlcad | was that the original 1 failed? |
| 02:18.34 | andrecastelo | it fails to find libbu.dll.. but it compiled this library fine |
| 02:19.13 | brlcad | so needs a path added to the library search paths |
| 02:20.33 | andrecastelo | ok, let me give it a try |
| 02:23.42 | andrecastelo | the library compiled fine, i guess it's just a path problem |
| 02:26.30 | mafm_ | mafm: go away! |
| 02:27.21 | Daytona | hmm, two mafm's |
| 02:27.37 | andrecastelo | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/jcpiTJ88.html |
| 02:27.43 | mafm_ | Daytona: as if one was not enough! |
| 02:27.49 | Daytona | LOL |
| 02:29.00 | mafm | that'll show him :) |
| 02:29.15 | andrecastelo | brlcad: found the problem - http://rafb.net/p/5XE59Z48.html |
| 02:29.43 | andrecastelo | i guess brlcad is not portuguese-friendly ? |
| 02:30.31 | brlcad | how so? |
| 02:30.57 | brlcad | it's failing because you don't have nsis installed -- that's used to build the installer |
| 02:32.04 | andrecastelo | brlcad: true, but technically it would go to another directory |
| 02:32.42 | brlcad | que? |
| 02:33.47 | brlcad | it'll go wherever it's configured to go |
| 02:34.13 | andrecastelo | hm ok, i'll get nsis |
| 02:36.14 | mafm | "and that full nonexclusive copyright will be assigned." -- what does that mean, that we have to assign copyright as FSF requires for their projects? |
| 02:39.18 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, we use single-copyright |
| 02:41.33 | andrecastelo | brlcad: it's a minor bug perhaps concerning non-english windows |
| 02:42.12 | andrecastelo | brlcad: because english windows defaults installations to C:\Program files, and every other language version has its own "Program Files" |
| 02:43.17 | brlcad | andrecastelo: perhaps |
| 02:43.21 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i installed nsis to the default directory and the same problem occurred.. therefore we need to edit the correct file to use a "program files" system var |
| 02:43.35 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:44.06 | andrecastelo | but what is the correct file ? :b |
| 02:45.41 | andrecastelo | i don't think there's a way to do that though |
| 02:55.25 | mafm | the 3D engine to use is strongly preferred to be OGRE, anything, or not important to specify in the proposal? |
| 02:56.08 | hippieindamakin8 | wat is it rt now ? |
| 02:56.53 | mafm | hippieindamakin8: that's a question for me? |
| 02:57.12 | hippieindamakin8 | in general :) |
| 02:57.49 | mafm | that's from the project ideas, to make an OpenGL-based GUI instead of MGED |
| 02:58.01 | mafm | and OGRE listed as possible one |
| 02:58.56 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh .. |
| 02:59.10 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya rt now everything is based on MGED |
| 03:03.04 | brlcad | mafm: for the submitter to decide really, from my own experience, testing, and connections, ogre really seems to be one of the best fits |
| 03:04.43 | mafm | well, for me it's about the same if it's with CrystalSpace, OpenSceneGraph or OGRE |
| 03:04.48 | brlcad | but it could just as easily be a java3d interface with the right submittions |
| 03:05.01 | mafm | I see OGRE or OSG more suited for BRL-CAD as we've talked yesterday |
| 03:05.53 | mafm | but since for me it's about the same, it's better to let core developers decide I guess |
| 03:07.57 | mafm | so maybe I leave it open in the proposal and to be decided later? |
| 03:08.26 | mafm | btw andrecastelo, I think that you maybe this proposal is also well suited for you |
| 03:09.52 | andrecastelo | hmm |
| 03:10.16 | andrecastelo | i'm already studying the photonmap.c to see what has been done and what hasn't |
| 03:12.05 | brlcad | mafm: it could be decided later |
| 03:13.12 | mafm | another thing is, what's the functionality to replicate? e.g. 20% of MGED? |
| 03:13.16 | brlcad | more detail is generally better, but particularly if you don't have a strong justification then ogre would still be my preference as the one to start with (a LOT of time has already been spent evaluating the various options available) |
| 03:13.50 | mafm | or it's only the framework and the functionality to be filled later? |
| 03:13.54 | brlcad | yeah |
| 03:14.22 | brlcad | having a debug command console would be useful to have, logging services |
| 03:14.35 | brlcad | but mostly the console |
| 03:15.04 | brlcad | ability to get lists of geometry available, loading them, displaying various representations (wireframe, polygonal, etc) |
| 03:18.10 | mafm | loading them as in drawing a cube inside OGRE? |
| 03:18.47 | mafm | with the vertex data coming from the server backend? |
| 03:19.06 | brlcad | display lists, yes |
| 03:19.45 | brlcad | there is a client/server protocol being developed (concurrently) that will manage the geometry itself |
| 03:20.07 | brlcad | the client is a *thin* client, it just passes commands/events to the backend and gets stuff back |
| 03:20.49 | mafm | yep, but the client would have to convert the marshalled data to the 3d engine representation at list, right? |
| 03:21.21 | mafm | and the same to position the camera and things like that |
| 03:26.26 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:26.48 | brlcad | and/or make the protocol support reporting the data in the format that the engine requires |
| 03:27.40 | brlcad | camera state management is predominantly a client issue |
| 03:28.43 | mafm | brlcad: the protocol doing the translation you mean? that would be part of my project anyway, I guess |
| 03:35.22 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad.. how functional is photonmap.c ? |
| 03:35.50 | brlcad | andrecastelo: if you pray to the gods and sacrifice the right sized chicken heads, it works great |
| 03:36.11 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) paganism :P |
| 03:36.19 | andrecastelo | lol.. but do you know what exactly works and what doesn't? |
| 03:36.27 | brlcad | example photonmap rendering http://brlcad.org/tmp/moss_pm.png |
| 03:37.32 | andrecastelo | hm, that cube shadow is a little off isn't it ? |
| 03:38.18 | brlcad | andrecastelo: usability is pretty poor (it's complicated to use), effects through thin-walled objects is flawed (the photons bleed), performance sucks unless you put the objects in a box (all the photons go off into space) |
| 03:38.42 | brlcad | positionwise, no the shadows are right |
| 03:39.38 | brlcad | there's a question as to whether it should be light due to reflections, but otherwise right |
| 03:39.58 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/moss_pm_2.png |
| 03:44.55 | hippieindamakin8 | cya ppl |
| 03:45.00 | andrecastelo | cya hippieindamakin8 |
| 03:45.00 | hippieindamakin8 | later |
| 03:45.40 | mafm | laterz :) |
| 03:48.03 | andrecastelo | brlcad: so, i'd have to rewrite part of it |
| 03:48.15 | brlcad | andrecastelo: possibly |
| 03:48.59 | brlcad | implementing a bidirectional path-tracer would pretty much trump photonmapping though |
| 03:49.05 | mafm | OK, I have everything but the plan :PPP |
| 03:49.22 | brlcad | or a path tracer with photomapping aspects |
| 03:49.33 | brlcad | or a path trace option to rt directly |
| 03:49.37 | andrecastelo | at least the kd-tree functions are already implemented.. those are usable, right ? |
| 03:49.49 | brlcad | yeah, you really don't worry about any of that |
| 03:50.17 | brlcad | even for implementing some other global illumination interface, you wouldn't worry about that |
| 03:50.29 | mafm | is there some talk in the mailing list, wiki or whatever of the main features needed by the GUI? |
| 03:50.54 | andrecastelo | i see.. well, i thought photon mapping was the most realistic method to implement GI |
| 03:51.07 | brlcad | andrecastelo: read up on http://brlcad.org/wiki/Developing_applications .. talks about some of the basics of the shotline interface |
| 03:51.21 | brlcad | no, photon-mapping isn't the most realistic |
| 03:51.26 | brlcad | it's the fastest |
| 03:51.47 | brlcad | at least it can be fast |
| 03:52.26 | brlcad | bidirectional path-tracing is a brute-force solution to the rendering equation, and converges generally to a great answer |
| 03:52.46 | brlcad | that's what most people see when they look at ultra-realistic images |
| 03:53.20 | brlcad | usually MLT |
| 03:54.24 | mafm | brlcad: is there some talk in the mailing list, wiki or whatever of the main features needed by the GUI? |
| 03:54.31 | brlcad | the brazil rendering system is probably one of the best MLT implementations (http://www.splutterfish.com/sf/WebContent/Index) |
| 03:54.43 | brlcad | mafm: not really, at least not yet |
| 03:55.13 | mafm | :S |
| 03:55.15 | brlcad | for now, just think of it as a thin graphical network client |
| 03:55.34 | mafm | yep, but I was trying to think about the milestones |
| 03:55.44 | brlcad | that needs to display stuff obviously, look up geometry, display it, spin it around, etc |
| 03:55.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: those are amazing! |
| 03:56.11 | mafm | <slashdot> |
| 03:56.20 | mafm | 1) Create hello world |
| 03:56.22 | mafm | 2) ??? |
| 03:56.30 | mafm | 3) GSoC completed!! |
| 03:56.34 | mafm | </slashdot> |
| 03:56.35 | andrecastelo | 4) Profit!!! |
| 03:56.38 | andrecastelo | hehe |
| 03:57.02 | brlcad | andrecastelo: they were one of the first to make detailed pictures that seriously looked real |
| 03:57.27 | andrecastelo | i was trying to write milestones too, that's why i was asking about photonmap.c functionality |
| 03:57.59 | mafm | holy cow! those images are truly amazing |
| 03:58.10 | brlcad | the milestones aren't necessarily set in stone, it's mostly important to see that you've actually thought through a timeline and design process that we can then talk about |
| 03:59.17 | andrecastelo | what are the most important things in an app ? |
| 03:59.49 | andrecastelo | (for you guys) |
| 04:00.34 | mafm | why is the logging thing an important one? it's logging what commands go back and forth for debugging, or what? |
| 04:01.02 | brlcad | especially images like: http://www.splutterfish.com/sf/WebContent/Gallery/Image/283?category=2&perpage=24&page=7 and http://www.splutterfish.com/sf/WebContent/Gallery/Image/436?category=2&perpage=24&page=2 |
| 04:01.50 | brlcad | mafm: logging is one of those fundamental things nice to have sorted out early on, for testing, development, debugging, etc |
| 04:02.17 | brlcad | not critical for the app, I was just thinking of basic infrastructure items |
| 04:02.23 | andrecastelo | brlcad: omg, those are beautiful |
| 04:03.35 | brlcad | you can do some cool stuff with metropolis light transport, global illumination ;) |
| 04:03.55 | mafm | so milestones could be: logging, console, being able to communicate with the back-end, displaying geometries, rotating & positioning |
| 04:04.48 | mafm | displaying various representations (wireframe, polygonal, etc) |
| 04:07.03 | brlcad | plus maybe clean cross-platform build system integration, and input support (trackball, shift-grips) |
| 04:07.23 | andrecastelo | brlcad: so, what would be better, photon mapping or bidirectional path tracing ?? |
| 04:07.52 | brlcad | andrecastelo: if you have experience with neither, path tracing |
| 04:08.24 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll have to do some research to write the application though |
| 04:08.26 | brlcad | the algorithm for forward path-tracing is like 100-200 lines of code |
| 04:08.49 | brlcad | maybe 10x for full bidirectional, and then some for usability and render options |
| 04:10.03 | mafm | be right back |
| 04:12.44 | andrecastelo | brlcad: what's your timezone ? |
| 04:12.51 | brlcad | EDT |
| 04:13.05 | andrecastelo | how many hours from UTC ? |
| 04:13.11 | brlcad | -4 |
| 04:13.26 | andrecastelo | great |
| 04:13.50 | andrecastelo | i'll be back tomorrow in the morning to finish discussing the application ;) |
| 04:14.25 | andrecastelo | good night |
| 04:14.32 | andrecastelo | mafm: good night man, cya |
| 04:17.23 | brlcad | waves |
| 04:34.32 | mafm | sighs |
| 04:34.43 | mafm | maybe I'm lucky and get 3h of sleep today :) |
| 04:41.13 | mafm | brlcad: there it is |
| 04:41.28 | brlcad | there what is? |
| 04:42.43 | brlcad | ah, to the mailing list |
| 04:42.45 | brlcad | got it |
| 04:43.24 | mafm | and to the Google's webapp too |
| 04:43.54 | brlcad | looks good, gracias |
| 04:44.01 | mafm | yw :) |
| 04:48.34 | mafm | it's about time to sleep, night :) |
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| 10:56.53 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
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| 12:37.52 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad :) |
| 12:37.54 | andrecastelo | you there? |
| 12:47.03 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 12:48.45 | mafm | hallo |
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| 13:22.20 | brlcad | hallo |
| 13:34.54 | d_rossberg | brlcad: the tags/7.12.0 won't compile on windows (cpp issue) |
| 13:35.09 | d_rossberg | it looks like bob solved it for the trunk |
| 13:35.26 | brlcad | cpp issue? |
| 13:38.00 | d_rossberg | math.h is included in a cpp file but in an extern "C" section |
| 13:38.30 | d_rossberg | the problem is: math.h defines templates if it is included in a cpp file |
| 13:38.53 | d_rossberg | however, this won't work with extern "C" |
| 13:39.13 | brlcad | ah, yeah I think I actually may have fixed that one |
| 13:39.41 | d_rossberg | yes, it looks like it's fixed on the trunk |
| 13:40.37 | brlcad | the bigger question is why the .exe isn't working, haven't had a chance to poke at that yet |
| 13:41.54 | d_rossberg | which exe? the install.exe and mged.exe work on my computer (MS Windows XP) |
| 13:42.13 | brlcad | the 7.12.0 test binary |
| 13:42.37 | brlcad | ftp://ftp.brlcad.org/incoming/brlcad-7.12.0.exe |
| 13:42.40 | d_rossberg | the is what i was talking about |
| 13:42.50 | brlcad | wim couldn't get it to work |
| 13:43.20 | d_rossberg | what os does he use: xp or vista? |
| 13:43.35 | brlcad | course his e-mail apparently just died too -- him and another just got delisted from the mailing list due to bounced e-mails :) |
| 13:45.11 | d_rossberg | BUT: rt does not work (at least from mged), even a ray-trace to a file fails |
| 13:45.40 | brlcad | i believe wim was on xp |
| 13:45.56 | brlcad | what's rt fail with? runtime linker error? |
| 13:47.19 | d_rossberg | nor error, it says "Raytrace complete" |
| 13:49.22 | brlcad | then it's probably crashing |
| 13:49.34 | brlcad | does it produce any output? like the prep output? |
| 13:50.11 | d_rossberg | no, at least not on the mged window |
| 13:51.39 | brlcad | bob's finally back this week, I'll mention it to him |
| 13:55.11 | d_rossberg | maybe i could be more useful if i get my new VS running |
| 13:55.47 | d_rossberg | i got it today and at the moment i try to get my old projects running with it |
| 13:55.57 | d_rossberg | this could take some time ... |
| 14:00.59 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:02.20 | brlcad | feel free to comment on any of the submissions .. |
| 14:29.51 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=pulse@189.71.62.248) | |
| 14:29.59 | brlcad | hello andrecastelo |
| 14:30.01 | andrecastelo | hi everyone |
| 14:30.03 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 14:30.10 | brlcad | responded to your submission |
| 14:30.14 | andrecastelo | just read the comment on the app |
| 14:30.21 | andrecastelo | yeah, just saw it ;) |
| 14:30.50 | andrecastelo | you want more detail about how MTL would interact with BRL-CAD's existing libraries, right ? |
| 14:31.08 | brlcad | yeah, just a little more detail about how it ties to us |
| 14:31.36 | andrecastelo | hm, ok |
| 14:31.38 | brlcad | you've shown reasonable competency in the task itself, but there's not much in the way of how it integrates with our code |
| 14:32.04 | andrecastelo | hm, ok, i'll try to detail further and it'll be ready in a minute |
| 14:32.20 | brlcad | what library/routines would you possibly be using for example -- does it leverage existing functionality (or not) |
| 14:33.43 | brlcad | emphasis on most tools are tools that *integrate* with brl-cad cleanly, that aren't just stand-alone apps being added to an otherwise already massive codebase, replicating existing functionality for example |
| 14:34.12 | brlcad | also just to show me that you have at least done your homework on what we actually already provide |
| 14:35.08 | brlcad | you also never explicitly mention what language you'd be working in or forsee implementing this in |
| 14:35.14 | brlcad | i.e. more implementation detail ;) |
| 14:35.22 | brlcad | otherwise a good submission |
| 14:35.33 | andrecastelo | hm ok, i thought C was implicit :b |
| 14:35.53 | andrecastelo | i'll include these details, though |
| 14:36.08 | brlcad | C or C++ is preferred, but not exactly required -- that's a design decision |
| 14:36.27 | brlcad | I'd be perfectly willing to consider another language if someone makes a strong valid case (good luck with that :) |
| 14:37.00 | andrecastelo | brlcad: is it possible to implement that in C++ ? |
| 14:37.14 | brlcad | yes |
| 14:37.20 | andrecastelo | i mean, wouldn't it kind of conflict with existing code.. ? |
| 14:37.38 | brlcad | it would have to live in a directory of its own, but no |
| 14:37.45 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll add some justification why C++ would be better then |
| 14:37.45 | brlcad | we already have some C++ interfaces |
| 14:38.11 | brlcad | you should know where we use C++ already :) |
| 14:39.42 | brlcad | if you do propose C++, I'd also expect you to speak of basic performance profiling as well |
| 14:40.43 | andrecastelo | performance profiling ? |
| 14:41.31 | brlcad | sanity checks to make sure it's not spinning its wheels in abstractions |
| 14:43.16 | andrecastelo | hm ok ok.. |
| 14:44.29 | brlcad | path tracers are very expensive, the same really holds true for a C implementation too -- but even more so for C++ |
| 15:01.28 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad - would it be better for me to reuse some of the ray tracer code for the path tracer or just write one from scratch ? |
| 15:01.37 | brlcad | heh |
| 15:01.41 | brlcad | which do you think |
| 15:02.28 | andrecastelo | reuse the code for a prototype version |
| 15:02.31 | brlcad | "10:33 <@brlcad> emphasis on most tools are tools that *integrate* with brl-cad cleanly, that aren't just stand-alone apps being added to an otherwise already massive codebase replicating existing functionality for example" |
| 15:02.33 | andrecastelo | then extend it to become fully functional |
| 15:02.43 | brlcad | we already shoot rays |
| 15:02.57 | brlcad | one of the specific intents is to use librt for ray shooting |
| 15:03.50 | brlcad | see the links I posted yesterday about developing brl-cad applications |
| 15:03.58 | andrecastelo | alright |
| 15:14.15 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code and join the developer mailing list || GSoC application submissions are (STILL) open with a one-week extension, submission deadline is now April 7th | |
| 15:14.52 | brlcad | kudos to those of you that got your submissions in on time :) |
| 15:16.50 | andrecastelo | brlcad: this week will be really useful for me to get familiar with the code and detail it even further ;) |
| 15:17.52 | brlcad | andrecastelo: glad to hear it :) |
| 15:27.04 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hm, so, i updated the application with the details you wanted ;) |
| 15:27.22 | andrecastelo | i'm open to critics and suggestions now |
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| 15:37.40 | mafm | 1 week extensions??? |
| 15:39.27 | andrecastelo | mafm: yup :) |
| 15:39.49 | mafm | pff |
| 15:39.56 | andrecastelo | why pff ? |
| 15:39.59 | mafm | and I only slept 3h tonight because of that :P |
| 15:49.59 | brlcad | mafm: hehe, well it does speak well for those that got their applications in on time |
| 15:50.08 | brlcad | it's an edge |
| 15:52.54 | mafm | no need to send a box of Oporto wine to the mentors then? |
| 15:53.02 | brlcad | hehe |
| 15:53.35 | brlcad | never said he could or could not be bribed with women and alcohol |
| 15:56.06 | mafm | let's just keep the alcohol thing, you wouldn't want to meet most portuguese women :P |
| 15:56.28 | andrecastelo | mafm: great, i'll supply the women |
| 15:56.32 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:56.37 | andrecastelo | :P |
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| 15:58.22 | Daytona | brlcad: I just saw that the application extension is official |
| 16:00.57 | mafm | that's a real news flash :) |
| 16:01.27 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:01.46 | brlcad | drive by daytona! |
| 16:12.55 | mafm | <lh> brlcad: you are cruel and vicious |
| 16:12.56 | mafm | lol |
| 16:13.11 | mafm | I think that brlcad is served in the women dept. |
| 16:13.21 | brlcad | lubs the leslie |
| 16:13.46 | mafm | no luck for you andrecastelo, I think that you might better try with brazilian coffee or something :) |
| 16:14.52 | brlcad | mafm: the comments also take on quite a different tone when you've met many of them :) |
| 16:15.10 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 16:15.36 | mafm | did you go to the mentor summit last year? |
| 16:15.44 | brlcad | yeah |
| 16:15.51 | brlcad | fun stuff |
| 16:15.54 | mafm | btw, how many applications are there? ~20 for CrystalSpace |
| 16:16.42 | brlcad | fewer, but close hold until the deadline :) |
| 16:17.42 | mafm | probably they'll get more too, it was less than 20 yesterday, but probably there will be 5 or 10 today before the former deadline |
| 16:17.51 | brlcad | the interesting thing is that right now there are probably 4 really strong applicants and we were only going to accept at most 4 ... :) |
| 16:18.35 | mafm | how so? don't you want to accept more, if they give you the chance? |
| 16:18.36 | brlcad | hopefully the apps keep improving, it'll be a tight competition |
| 16:18.50 | brlcad | no no |
| 16:19.28 | brlcad | i just saying that 4 are *really* strong, so if there wasn't an extension -- the list of who gets selected is pretty straightforward |
| 16:20.02 | brlcad | now with an extension, it just becomes more competitive .. if more really strong apps come in |
| 16:20.26 | hippieindamakin8 | good morning fellows :) |
| 16:21.12 | mafm | I see :) |
| 16:21.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: how many mentors does brlcad have ? |
| 16:21.59 | andrecastelo | that seems to be the student cap, right ? |
| 16:22.19 | brlcad | we have 6 mentors at present |
| 16:22.46 | brlcad | with two potential backups |
| 16:22.57 | brlcad | but no, that's not the cap |
| 16:23.16 | brlcad | they can't all be managed effectively with that many -- that's why we're looking at just 2-4 |
| 16:23.42 | andrecastelo | but the organizations do define a max number of students, right ? |
| 16:23.42 | brlcad | takes time to integrate, review code, plan, etc |
| 16:23.46 | brlcad | right |
| 16:23.48 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 16:23.49 | brlcad | our max is 4 |
| 16:24.01 | brlcad | i don't want more than 4 for brl-cad this year |
| 16:24.12 | andrecastelo | i hope i can make my application compete with those 4 strong ones you talked about :) |
| 16:24.45 | brlcad | that's also why having students speak to what interests them in the long run becomes useful, we'd like new long-term developers not just projects worked on |
| 16:25.47 | brlcad | here's an example of a really strong application received for bzflag, http://my.bzflag.org/w/User:Jude- |
| 16:26.33 | brlcad | detailed, careful thoughts on implementation, ties to our code, timelines, etc |
| 16:31.29 | hippieindamakin8 | mafm are u dawn thomas ? |
| 16:32.25 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh its somebody else from india |
| 16:39.01 | mafm | nope, I'm Manuel A. Fernandez Montecelo (hence the acronym of my nick, not the most creative thing really) |
| 16:41.45 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 16:43.49 | yukonbob_ | waves in |
| 16:44.00 | yukonbob_ | ohh --- I'm a ghosty |
| 16:52.23 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob_ |
| 16:52.28 | yukonbob_ | :) |
| 16:52.44 | yukonbob_ | doesn't have his tail-removing instructions with him atm :P |
| 16:53.07 | yukonbob_ | it's a msg to nicserv, but I don't remember what... |
| 16:56.42 | yukonbob | what's the status of the GSoC -- on schedule, or extended? |
| 16:59.38 | brlcad | points at topic ;) |
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| 17:23.03 | ``Erik | erm |
| 17:23.06 | ``Erik | why? |
| 17:23.18 | ``Erik | lack of solid submissions? :( |
| 17:24.45 | ``Erik | <-- thought the expectation was ~50 "good" submissions |
| 17:25.13 | ``Erik | no, I have not been reading my email. |
| 17:25.14 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:47.18 | mafm | 50 good submissions?? |
| 17:48.06 | mafm | that's a lot |
| 17:51.51 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874DCE.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:54.58 | ``Erik | mebbe I had pie in the sky aspirations |
| 18:21.11 | hippieindamakin8 | i am done making a proposal |
| 18:21.48 | mafm | about what? |
| 18:36.27 | mafm | hippieindamakin8: ? |
| 18:48.35 | hippieindamakin8 | OOP geometry |
| 18:49.23 | hippieindamakin8 | its about OOP geometry engine mafm |
| 18:57.09 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-79-63.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:01.05 | mafm | ah ok |
| 19:01.21 | mafm | I had thought about that project too |
| 19:04.01 | yukonbob | re: topic, me nods, points out that the irrsi topic-line across top doesn't show novels ;) |
| 19:07.46 | hippieindamakin8 | i might put in a proposal for the web repository as well |
| 19:17.48 | yukonbob | wonders, is there an official msg from Google re: this extension -- on the gsoc (code.google.com/...) the timelines still show the deadline as 31Mar |
| 19:18.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: given how similar i'm seeing our rate is to bz's, that would have resulted in about 25 "good" ones |
| 19:18.44 | brlcad | thinks ``Erik should comment on the submissions more |
| 19:19.38 | mafm | yukonbob: do you mean if the extension is for real? |
| 19:20.31 | yukonbob | mafm: see brlcad's note to me re: topic |
| 19:20.33 | brlcad | yukonbob: depends how big your window is too :) |
| 19:20.52 | brlcad | sees it all |
| 19:21.08 | yukonbob | brlcad: heh -- not all of us are developing on 16-way multi-gpu chromium-equipped workstations ;) |
| 19:21.22 | brlcad | mmm.. 16-way |
| 19:21.34 | yukonbob | laughs |
| 19:21.39 | yukonbob | what a bunch of nerds we are. |
| 19:26.41 | yukonbob | looks for discussion brlcad and self had re: other projects... |
| 19:27.47 | brlcad | thinks yukonbob should mentor |
| 19:28.38 | mafm | why do you keep saying "re: something"? I don't understand at least half of your phrases |
| 19:28.53 | brlcad | re: == regarding |
| 19:29.45 | yukonbob | brlcad: my heart has always been 100% agreeable to that, but I've held off just for logistic reasons... |
| 19:29.52 | yukonbob | bets he _will_ mentor |
| 19:29.59 | yukonbob | do I need to register or anything? |
| 19:30.08 | brlcad | you would need to, yes |
| 19:30.08 | yukonbob | (by some deadline?) |
| 19:30.12 | mafm | ah ok |
| 19:30.24 | brlcad | by then end of the week |
| 19:30.36 | yukonbob | fine, fine ;) |
| 19:30.39 | brlcad | er, by the time we start ranking actually |
| 19:30.47 | brlcad | which is probably the day apps close |
| 19:30.58 | brlcad | I can't add you though, you have to do it |
| 19:31.23 | yukonbob | ok -- I'll do that now... |
| 19:31.33 | mafm | I guess that they'll extend it for another two weeks or something :P |
| 19:32.11 | yukonbob | mafm: 1 week |
| 19:33.02 | brlcad | yeah, just one week, mentors then still have their 12+ days to deliberate, rank, and ask for more detail |
| 19:33.25 | brlcad | then there's a community bonding time frame for about 5 weeks |
| 19:34.11 | mafm | just kidding, I was saying that by the time that the new deadline is reached, maybe they extend it for another 2 weeks :) |
| 19:34.16 | brlcad | where students get familiarized, hopefully start committing, learn what they need to |
| 19:34.24 | brlcad | ahh, heh, not likely |
| 19:35.04 | brlcad | 4300 or so applicants was probably enough to stay on schedule -- adding another week it just going to make it a heck of a lot more competitive |
| 19:35.22 | brlcad | as there will likely be 6000-8000 applicants I bet |
| 19:36.04 | brlcad | which means for a group like ours, we're going to have anywhere from 8-16 people competiting for 2-4 slots |
| 19:37.03 | yukonbob | finishes mentor application |
| 19:39.07 | brlcad | wonders wtf Avinash Dubey is |
| 19:39.18 | brlcad | rejects |
| 19:44.32 | mafm | I go now, night |
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| 19:56.22 | yukonbob | has to log-off temporarily (battery) -- chat later, folks |
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| 21:33.20 | yukonbob | returns, like he never even left (thx, screen(1)) |
| 21:50.16 | yukonbob | wonders (speaking of meta-projects like GSoC and BRL-CAD) -- is there any progress on Coverity and BRL-CAD? |
| 21:53.25 | brlcad | i emailed dave yet again, no response |
| 21:57.08 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad are u there |
| 21:57.09 | hippieindamakin8 | ? |
| 21:57.30 | brlcad | nope |
| 21:57.38 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 21:57.39 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 21:58.58 | yukonbob | likes the "against our will" description |
| 21:59.51 | hippieindamakin8 | ya wanted to submit my proposal :) |
| 21:59.54 | yukonbob | receives cattle prod, and is instructed to refrain from meta-comments |
| 22:00.25 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: submit it, and it will be commented on |
| 22:00.47 | hippieindamakin8 | :) ya |
| 22:01.29 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad can the user define his primitives ? |
| 22:01.54 | brlcad | huh? |
| 22:02.06 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: in what sense? Primitives are "primitive" -- they're the core bits that "stuff" is made from... |
| 22:02.32 | hippieindamakin8 | like in AUTOCAD inventor 3d modelling and solidworks .. i add 2 already existing primitives and they can define it as another primitive |
| 22:02.36 | hippieindamakin8 | for his later worl |
| 22:02.46 | hippieindamakin8 | *work |
| 22:03.00 | yukonbob | read vol II, iirc about regions, etc. |
| 22:03.17 | hippieindamakin8 | smthing like.. a template |
| 22:06.46 | brlcad | yes, you can do that -- they're not called primitives, though -- they are combinations |
| 22:07.01 | brlcad | primitives are the most fundamental object type |
| 22:10.57 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. like when i used AUTOCAD, it calls it user defined primitive |
| 22:13.22 | hippieindamakin8 | just sent the proposal |
| 22:14.13 | yukonbob | s/vol II/ Vol III/; s/regions/combinations and regions/ -- (http://brlcad.org/wiki/Documentation) |
| 22:15.37 | hippieindamakin8 | thanks yukonbob |
| 22:15.39 | yukonbob | np |
| 22:15.49 | yukonbob | ~doc |
| 22:15.49 | ibot | Documentation can be found at http://digium.com/index.php?menu=documentation or http://www.digium.com/handbook-draft.pdf or http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk or http://www.asteriskdocs.org or http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/asterisk |
| 22:16.00 | yukonbob | hrm... |
| 22:16.12 | yukonbob | ^-- not for you, hippieindamakin8 |
| 22:16.14 | yukonbob | : |
| 22:16.17 | yukonbob | : |
| 22:16.21 | hippieindamakin8 | ya got it :) |
| 22:16.25 | yukonbob | :), rather |
| 22:16.44 | hippieindamakin8 | hates lab reports and open office the most |
| 22:16.57 | yukonbob | hates bad coffee |
| 22:20.21 | hippieindamakin8 | is waiting for comments from brlcad and yukonbob |
| 22:20.38 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: be patient |
| 22:20.47 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk :) i am |
| 22:20.49 | brlcad | it might take hours or even days |
| 22:21.08 | hippieindamakin8 | that was just a message .. i shall get back to my lab reports |
| 22:21.11 | brlcad | work on a patch in the meantime :) |
| 22:21.27 | hippieindamakin8 | yaya.. hey is the nsis installer working properly? |
| 22:21.47 | brlcad | the patches will probably be a huge deciding factor given the extension |
| 22:21.53 | hippieindamakin8 | i wanted to do that though :P |
| 22:21.53 | brlcad | works for me |
| 22:22.05 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i understand :| |
| 22:22.15 | brlcad | could do the localization fix that was mentioned yesterday |
| 22:22.22 | brlcad | so it doesn't just assume "Program Files" |
| 22:22.30 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk... |
| 22:22.34 | hippieindamakin8 | i ll have to chk.. |
| 22:22.56 | hippieindamakin8 | i have no windows rt now.. i shall get to it in a day or 2 |
| 22:23.22 | hippieindamakin8 | wats the new deadline for the submission of patches ? |
| 22:24.59 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: you mean for GSoC proposals? 7 Apr. |
| 22:25.09 | hippieindamakin8 | no the patches |
| 22:25.59 | brlcad | technically they're optional, but you'll not likely get selected if you don't provide a patch given how competitive it's going to be |
| 22:26.35 | brlcad | given we start ranking on the 7th, it's in your best interest to have something done by then or very shortly thereafter |
| 22:31.48 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i sure want to submit a patch |
| 22:32.27 | yukonbob | go for it!! |
| 22:32.28 | brlcad | you sure do |
| 22:32.43 | yukonbob | cheers "submit a patch! submit a patch!" |
| 22:34.14 | yukonbob | also gets a glass of water... |
| 23:10.09 | poolio | hippieindamakin8: Submit a documentation patch :) |
| 23:10.18 | poolio | brlcad: how's the gsoc going? |
| 23:11.27 | hippieindamakin8 | cool :) |
| 23:12.09 | hippieindamakin8 | ya seen them in the list of TODOs |
| 23:12.17 | brlcad | code patch would probably be preferred since one of the points is to see how you code, but yeah, even a documentation patch would work :) |
| 23:12.25 | brlcad | poolio: fun fun |
| 23:12.33 | brlcad | some good proposals to evaluate |
| 23:12.36 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall try for a technical patch first and then i shall come up with docs when i am unable to do that |
| 23:14.01 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall be submitting it by 9th .. will it do ?? too many academic committments rt now with the end semester examinations approaching |
| 23:14.01 | brlcad | looking at the bug and feature requests on sf.net is also recommended |
| 23:14.06 | hippieindamakin8 | i am trying to keep a track of them |
| 23:43.44 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad: Sean w.r.t ur slashdot post |
| 23:44.04 | brlcad | que? |
| 23:44.05 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:44.19 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 23:44.20 | brlcad | doesn't mean computer science degree students |
| 23:44.34 | hippieindamakin8 | i aint :) and it is open to all |
| 23:45.07 | brlcad | the fact that they are working on code as stucents makes them "computer science students" over the course of the summer |
| 23:46.00 | hippieindamakin8 | :) thats true |
| 23:46.08 | poolio | brlcad: at some schools that's an insult |
| 23:46.42 | brlcad | the wording is actually based off of google's own original announcements from chris |
| 23:46.56 | hippieindamakin8 | ya my school considers my contribution to the firefox and imageprocessing community a big waste of time :P |
| 23:47.18 | brlcad | more power to them if they're insulted, less rediculous people to have to deal with during the review process |
| 23:47.29 | hippieindamakin8 | its ohk.. :) wat Sean wrote is actually rt but literally not :) |
| 23:47.40 | brlcad | you're missing the point |
| 23:47.47 | brlcad | literally it is the case, it doesn't say degree |
| 23:47.59 | hippieindamakin8 | aah yeah |
| 23:48.12 | hippieindamakin8 | ya that is ppl interested in CS |
| 23:49.33 | hippieindamakin8 | my school is completely ridiculous in the point that when enrolled in mechanical engg u are just supposed to take mechanical engg courses when given an option for an elective |
| 23:50.49 | yukonbob | isn't that point neither here not there, though -- the only way the school (maybe) needs to be involved is to verify you're enrolled in school... you could get a job selling ice-cream for the summer if you like, too... |
| 23:51.19 | yukonbob | ...whether it's related to your studies or not, or whether the school likes it or not... |
| 23:51.23 | hippieindamakin8 | hehe |
| 23:51.33 | brlcad | yep, in fact that's exactly what one of the bzflag gsoc students did last year |
| 23:52.17 | brlcad | (and he was ultimately failed due to lack of progress and inadequate time put forth) |
| 23:52.45 | yukonbob | heh |
| 23:53.25 | yukonbob | off-topic: how suitable would the bzflag framework be to building a virtual world, a la second life... perhaps one could have a project setting up a virtual ice-cream shop? |
| 23:53.39 | brlcad | heh, doable |
| 23:53.50 | yukonbob | makes note |
| 23:53.50 | poolio | yukonbob: Just out of curiousity, for what purpose would this virtual world exist? |
| 23:54.01 | brlcad | there's no dynamic geometry right now, that'd require modifications |
| 23:54.04 | yukonbob | feh -- same reason second life exists, I guess... |
| 23:54.13 | poolio | Although there are probably a ton of better frameworks out there. |
| 23:54.19 | yukonbob | sure |
| 23:54.27 | poolio | yukonbob: entertainment? There are some AGI people trying to hook up to virtual worlds for the purpose of learning |
| 23:54.31 | brlcad | blasphemy! |
| 23:54.41 | poolio | ... |
| 23:54.42 | brlcad | nothing is better than bzflag |
| 23:54.45 | brlcad | except brl-cad |
| 23:54.46 | yukonbob | laughs -- brlcad is agitated!!! |
| 23:54.51 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) |
| 23:54.52 | poolio | brlcad: Can I quote you on this? |
| 23:55.01 | brlcad | hehe, sure |
| 23:55.34 | brlcad | gets craving for chinese food |
| 23:56.26 | yukonbob | is interested in machinema (sp?) -- perhaps brl-cad and bzflag could provide the bulk of the framework to make a video... |
| 23:56.37 | yukonbob | meow |
| 23:57.30 | yukonbob | does bzflag support any easy-to-do articulation? (/me thinks "no") |
| 23:57.48 | brlcad | bzflag doesn't support any articulation |
| 23:57.58 | brlcad | "no dynamic geometry" |
| 23:58.04 | yukonbob | GSoC ;) |
| 23:58.19 | brlcad | not something I'd rank high on our priority list :) |
| 23:58.56 | yukonbob | can hardly wait to get a 'puter w/ hardware acceleration to get bzflag installed again... |
| 00:01.06 | yukonbob | no dynamic geom in brl-cad either, correct? so if one is modelling a vehicle w/ say wheels that need to travel up/down on suspension, the designer would need to do some of their own work to determine that the wheels don't collide w/ the wheel wells? |
| 00:01.23 | brlcad | actually we do have rudimentary dynamic geometry |
| 00:01.27 | yukonbob | ! |
| 00:01.33 | yukonbob | documented? |
| 00:01.36 | brlcad | hence all the videos, which you've probably never seen ;) |
| 00:01.50 | yukonbob | has seens ronja videos... |
| 00:02.00 | yukonbob | are you talking classified videos? |
| 00:02.05 | brlcad | we actually have like a hundred videos |
| 00:02.10 | brlcad | nope |
| 00:02.15 | brlcad | most of them are public release materials |
| 00:02.23 | yukonbob | awesome!!! |
| 00:02.25 | yukonbob | ?link |
| 00:02.40 | brlcad | just not in digital format .. sitting on shelves and in boxes |
| 00:02.45 | yukonbob | hahahahaha |
| 00:02.56 | yukonbob | ok -- so I need to order a VHS copy to see these :) |
| 00:03.04 | brlcad | for some of them |
| 00:03.05 | yukonbob | like netflix ;) |
| 00:03.21 | brlcad | some are betacam, some umatic, some old magnetic spools |
| 00:03.56 | brlcad | hopefully can get some of them digitized soon |
| 00:07.27 | brlcad | it's all mostly done via "joints", which is a manual rigging system |
| 00:07.42 | brlcad | the anim tools help perform the per-frame articulattions |
| 00:07.57 | brlcad | as well as other rt features like multirender command scripts |
| 00:08.33 | brlcad | that could easily make for a great gsoc project, but then support for constraints and parametric equations really helps that effort |
| 00:09.49 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/OLD/reports/tr-313/chapt0.html touches on some of the basic concepts |
| 00:09.57 | yukonbob | nice |
| 00:10.14 | brlcad | though that particular report doesn't cover joints, just basic transformations |
| 00:10.33 | yukonbob | it's a start... |
| 00:11.50 | brlcad | caveat warning .. last time *I* tried reproducing the results of that paper, I ran into a problem with our quaternions (i.e. our view representation) .. yet someone on the mailing list had no problems |
| 00:12.26 | yukonbob | ie: diff't axis representation? |
| 00:12.44 | brlcad | hm? |
| 00:12.56 | brlcad | how the view matrix is specified |
| 00:13.18 | brlcad | (quaternions are more compact than your traditional homogenous matrix) |
| 00:13.19 | yukonbob | for selecting rhs/lhs of object? |
| 00:13.32 | yukonbob | isn't clear on this terminology :P |
| 00:13.43 | brlcad | don't worry about it :) |
| 00:13.51 | brlcad | quaternions give everyone a headache :) |
| 00:14.04 | brlcad | cept math nuts |
| 00:14.10 | yukonbob | heh -- /me wasn't worried -- is always keen to learn new stuff, though :) |
| 00:14.15 | brlcad | and even then, it's like a mild migraine |
| 00:14.43 | brlcad | have fun: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaternion :) |
| 00:15.03 | brlcad | and: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quaternions_and_spatial_rotation |
| 00:15.04 | yukonbob | loads it, puts aside in diff't screen for later reading :) |
| 00:15.21 | brlcad | goes home |
| 00:15.33 | yukonbob | chat later |
| 00:17.15 | hippieindamakin8 | cya Sean |
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| 00:24.58 | andrecastelo | good evening everyone |
| 00:30.49 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andre |
| 00:31.04 | hippieindamakin8 | wassup? andrecastelo |
| 00:31.13 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
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| 02:05.28 | brlcad | burps |
| 02:10.34 | yukonbob | meow |
| 02:11.18 | spike_ | woof |
| 02:12.09 | yukonbob | meow you cut that out, meow-kay? |
| 02:12.43 | spike_ | meow do i look like a cat to you boy? do you see me jumpin all hibbidy-bibbidy from tree to tree? do i drink milk from a saucer boy? meow |
| 02:12.54 | yukonbob | hewhe |
| 02:12.56 | yukonbob | hehe |
| 02:31.38 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 02:32.52 | yukonbob | hey louipc |
| 02:33.45 | louipc | yukonbob: what's up |
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| 03:18.13 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30596 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/masonry.c: cleanup |
| 03:25.43 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30597 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/masonry.c: lil more |
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| 05:15.52 | hippieindamakin8 | apparently my mail bounced |
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| 05:37.35 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: how do you figure that? |
| 05:40.01 | brlcad | ah, perhaps it did, you copied me directly |
| 05:40.21 | brlcad | you much be joined and sending from the address registered |
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| 06:25.54 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30598 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/units.c: |
| 06:25.54 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: implement a bu_nearest_units_string() function that returns the name of the unit |
| 06:25.54 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: closest to the input unit. also, enhance the units table with ALL of the SI |
| 06:25.54 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: units from yoctometers to yottameters along with other astronomical units of |
| 06:25.55 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: measurements, chains, furlongs, and leagues. |
| 06:26.19 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30599 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: declare the new bu_nearest_units_string() function |
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| 07:27.29 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30600 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/opt.c: |
| 07:27.29 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: add a -u option to all of the ray-tracers as a 'units' option for specifying the |
| 07:27.29 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: desired output units. default continues to be mm (istead of local). |
| 07:27.29 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: ray-tracers still have to be manually updated to take advantage of the option |
| 07:41.34 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 07:42.42 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30601 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO doc/deprecation.txt src/rt/viewarea.c): |
| 07:42.42 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: add a new -u units option support to rtarea so that users can specify the |
| 07:42.42 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: desired output units. announce clearly that the output format of rtarea is |
| 07:42.42 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: subject to change soon as is the terminology being used. this is in preparation |
| 07:42.43 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: of addressing other user requests to fix the naming conventions, default units |
| 07:42.45 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: (using local units), and support for additional output formats (tables). this |
| 07:42.47 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: feature was requested by _many_ (most?) modelers and analysts. |
| 07:44.52 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30602 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: missing newlines |
| 07:45.08 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 07:47.41 | brlcad | someone should make patches to make -u work for all of the other brl-cad ray-tracers ... |
| 08:14.53 | Axman6 | yeah someone, git to it! |
| 08:32.30 | brlcad | ennaps |
| 11:14.02 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:17.01 | mafm | hey |
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| 12:26.18 | hippieindamakin8 | ya sent it to the developers list :) which i dont have the mailing access to |
| 12:26.23 | hippieindamakin8 | hey mafm |
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| 13:36.46 | ``Erik | blehhhhhhh |
| 13:38.02 | brlcad | yup |
| 14:25.38 | brlcad | greetings programs |
| 14:27.17 | brlcad | nice response d_rossberg |
| 14:30.09 | mafm | ? |
| 14:30.21 | brlcad | good morning mafm |
| 14:31.27 | mafm | hi |
| 14:31.54 | mafm | what are you talking about responses? |
| 14:32.06 | mafm | I cannot see anything here or in the ML :) |
| 14:32.08 | alex_joni | mafm: there are things beside IRC :P |
| 14:32.26 | brlcad | private mentor chatter |
| 14:32.39 | mafm | ah OK |
| 14:33.32 | d_rossberg | i wonder what will be the response to my response :) |
| 14:39.11 | mafm | tl,dr |
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| 15:22.04 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30603 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ged.c: Not setting cbreak_mode to COMMAND_LINE_EDITING on windows. |
| 15:25.50 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30604 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: make bu_vls_gets() behave regardless of the lines being \n, \r, or \r\n -- strip the EOL accordingly |
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| 15:51.26 | andrecastelo | hi guys |
| 15:51.30 | andrecastelo | hey mafm, brlcad |
| 15:57.21 | mafm | yo |
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| 17:00.15 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30605 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: New routine is able to return input parameters in test case - need more elaborate testing now. |
| 17:11.58 | CIA-34 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30606 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/asc2g/asc2g.vcproj: Update version to 7.12.1 |
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| 17:30.23 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
| 17:30.45 | prasad_ | greetings |
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| 18:03.22 | jdoliner | Hello |
| 18:10.47 | jdoliner | brlcad are you present? |
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| 19:08.12 | mafm | bye all |
| 19:08.41 | illethal | bai |
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| 20:19.35 | cosurgi | brlcad: is there any GSoC application about GUI frontend? |
| 20:21.34 | cosurgi | oh, good, I see on the mailing list. |
| 22:09.44 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30607 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_sketch.c: Tcl_AppendResult needs three parameters. This fixes a core dump when getting the form of a sketch. |
| 23:51.03 | brlcad | cosurgi: yeah, at least one looks promising |
| 23:51.09 | brlcad | howdy prasad_ |
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| 00:07.35 | andrecastelo | good evening everyone |
| 00:08.14 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 00:08.37 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 00:08.57 | andrecastelo | did you review the application again ? |
| 00:10.49 | brlcad | andrecastelo: not yet in detail |
| 00:10.53 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 00:11.06 | brlcad | going through them one at a time, will get back around to yours eventually |
| 00:11.28 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, ok ;) |
| 00:34.15 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30608 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fgets.c: ws |
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| 01:36.36 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30609 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/attach.c: |
| 01:36.36 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: rework the initial classic console mode attach prompt to use bu_vls_gets so that |
| 01:36.36 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: we don't have to worry about end of line issues. also, trim whitespace so it |
| 01:36.36 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: matches more easily and inform the user which selection is being used to affirm |
| 01:36.39 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: their selection. |
| 01:36.56 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30610 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/attach.c: loopy |
| 02:13.49 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30612 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 02:13.49 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: improved mged's classic mode 'attach' display manager selection, particularly on |
| 02:13.49 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: windows where it was getting the carriage return in the input string and not |
| 02:13.49 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: getting a successful match. Now it drops the EOL character(s) and trims |
| 02:13.50 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: whitespace on comparison, and affirms to the user which option was selected. |
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| 04:33.12 | pacman87 | i've noticed BRL-CAD uses a bit of magic for the rt code |
| 04:34.03 | pacman87 | #define RT_SOLTAB_MAGIC0x92bfcde0 |
| 04:34.44 | pacman87 | and i was wondering if the use of magic was documented somewhere |
| 04:47.42 | brlcad | pacman87: mmm.. probably |
| 04:47.45 | brlcad | but just as easy to explain |
| 04:48.47 | brlcad | magic numbers are simply special type identifiers -- the value of which usually has no meaningful significance other than being an identifier for that data |
| 04:50.11 | brlcad | the magic numbers are used throughout the code for pervasive detection of memory corruption -- they are almost always the first bytes in a structure so if something overruns an array, it's easily detected |
| 04:50.55 | brlcad | likewise if data is marshalled between different systems (whether through network or file I/O or some other cast mechanism), it is used to validate that types are what they should be |
| 04:51.38 | brlcad | what it all basically amounts to is that you just define a magic number for any new struct, and anywhere that struct is passed into a function, you check it |
| 04:52.07 | brlcad | so the instant there is any corruption, it's caught and processing can/should halt |
| 05:06.09 | hippieindamakin8 | hello guys |
| 05:06.36 | brlcad | howdy |
| 05:11.27 | pacman87 | brlcad: thanks for the info |
| 05:11.31 | brlcad | np |
| 05:11.57 | pacman87 | is there a list of all the defined magic numbers, or will i have to search through them all to get a unique one? |
| 05:13.44 | pacman87 | also, i noticed the primitive list has a (half) hyperboloid of two sheets, but not a hyperboloid of one sheet |
| 05:15.13 | brlcad | almost all of them are hex-encoded char strings for the struct name |
| 05:16.01 | pacman87 | would it cause trouble it my magic number isn't unique? |
| 05:16.49 | brlcad | depends, but yes possibly |
| 05:17.07 | brlcad | they are declared in their respective headers |
| 05:17.34 | pacman87 | i suppose it's easier to grep for the hex string i want, than trying to gather a list of all the ones in use |
| 05:19.17 | pacman87 | re: hyperboloid of one sheet, if i code that up in the next week, would that be an acceptable patch? |
| 05:19.35 | pacman87 | i've already done all the math for the shot() method |
| 05:19.53 | pacman87 | s/method/function |
| 05:20.04 | pacman87 | too used to java terminology |
| 05:20.51 | brlcad | grep MAGIC include/*.h | grep define | grep -v CK |
| 05:20.56 | brlcad | that'll get you most of them |
| 05:21.08 | brlcad | and you can see many of them tell you what their hex is |
| 05:21.22 | brlcad | (they all should .. but some aren't alnum |
| 05:22.42 | brlcad | hm, hyperboloid of one sheet ... |
| 05:22.59 | pacman87 | i just though it was odd to have one but not both |
| 05:23.19 | brlcad | you mean you've seen src/librt/g_ehy.c |
| 05:23.32 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 05:24.40 | pacman87 | two sheets: x^2 + y^2 - z^2 + 1 = 0 |
| 05:24.50 | pacman87 | one sheet: x^2 + y^2 - z^2 - 1 = 0 |
| 05:25.23 | pacman87 | flips which side of the asymptotic cone the surface is on |
| 05:25.49 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:26.37 | brlcad | i'm just wondering if there's a way to better encapsulate that into the existing ehy without breaking format |
| 05:28.08 | brlcad | otherwise, a hot damn cool idea for a patch -- very impressive |
| 05:28.35 | pacman87 | the math on this one is (relatively) easy |
| 05:29.12 | pacman87 | so i can learn all the structs first |
| 05:29.52 | brlcad | and you have a nearly exact example to follow.. |
| 05:30.05 | brlcad | still very impressive though |
| 05:30.24 | brlcad | (assuming you get it to work) :) |
| 05:31.26 | brlcad | Markowski would be proud |
| 05:31.49 | pacman87 | i might need a bit more guidance integrating the new primitive, though |
| 05:32.06 | pacman87 | as i haven't really looked at that part of the code yet |
| 05:32.31 | pacman87 | but i'll ask when i get there (and have read the code) so i can understand what you're talking about |
| 05:32.51 | pacman87 | Markowski is...? |
| 05:33.28 | pacman87 | Michael J. Markowski, author of g_ehy.c |
| 05:34.02 | pacman87 | though he remembered reading that name somewhere |
| 05:36.11 | brlcad | yep, he implemented a couple of the primitives |
| 05:36.16 | brlcad | he's still around |
| 05:37.02 | brlcad | i'll be sure to tell him you thought he was dumb for not doing the one-sheets :) |
| 05:39.38 | brlcad | forewarning, the one tricky part is going to be that you have to deal with multihit, which ehy doesn't have to deal with |
| 05:45.41 | pacman87 | should be a max of 4 |
| 05:46.03 | pacman87 | both bases, plus two sides |
| 05:49.01 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-235.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 05:50.05 | brlcad | yeah, two segments |
| 06:14.45 | *** join/#brlcad gedex (n=gedex@125.160.102.249) | |
| 06:17.30 | brlcad | waves g'night |
| 06:18.16 | pacman87 | good idea, brlcad |
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| 06:37.09 | brlcad | hello gede1 |
| 06:45.15 | *** join/#brlcad gede2 (n=gedex@125.160.99.10) | |
| 06:45.23 | brlcad | yikes |
| 06:47.05 | brlcad | wanders off for real |
| 06:56.22 | gede2 | brlcad: i've frozen app in my student dashboard, should i post new one? |
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| 07:13.57 | *** part/#brlcad gede1 (n=gedex@125.160.98.205) | |
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| 09:40.14 | mafm | hi |
| 09:51.27 | brlcad | howdy |
| 09:52.08 | mafm | isn't a bit to early for you? (or alternatively, too late) |
| 09:52.32 | brlcad | yep |
| 09:54.20 | hippieindamakin8 | havent u slept brlcad ? |
| 09:54.31 | brlcad | meh |
| 09:58.01 | *** join/#brlcad gedex (n=gedex@222.124.185.169) | |
| 09:58.34 | brlcad | gedex: no, you really shouldn't -- should talk to a mentor and get them to unfreeze it |
| 09:59.13 | gedex | it's fine to submit new one with same title? |
| 10:00.16 | brlcad | gedex: NO, you really shouldn't -- ... |
| 10:00.32 | gedex | so, i need to talk to Sean |
| 10:00.43 | brlcad | to a mentor |
| 10:00.55 | brlcad | any mentor |
| 10:01.42 | brlcad | iff everything seems right, then maybe resubmitting might solve things, but don't just create more work for your convenience please :) |
| 10:02.02 | brlcad | which app is yours? |
| 10:02.28 | gedex | Web-based solid geometry model repository |
| 10:02.40 | gedex | i would to create drupal's modul |
| 10:02.53 | gedex | err.. *module |
| 10:03.48 | brlcad | instead of responding with a comment, you should respond by editing the submission |
| 10:04.29 | mafm | what's the freezing problem? :) |
| 10:04.44 | mafm | students should be able to edit applications until the new deadline |
| 10:04.49 | gedex | the ineligible status made me couldn't edit the form |
| 10:05.16 | brlcad | mafm: some cannot edit until a mentor comments |
| 10:06.15 | brlcad | gedex: ooooh, you're Akeda I take it |
| 10:06.30 | gedex | yes :) |
| 10:06.47 | brlcad | title is identical to another -- you needed to be talking with us regardless |
| 10:06.53 | gedex | brldcad is Sean? |
| 10:07.15 | brlcad | status restored, try now |
| 10:07.19 | mafm | huh? don't know, but I can edit all of mine... and I thought that the mentor comments to enable application modifications were only after the deadline |
| 10:07.43 | gedex | brlcad: thx Sean |
| 10:08.42 | brlcad | gedex: word of caution -- that's an exceptionally popular topic for some reason |
| 10:09.01 | brlcad | you really might want to reconsider what exactly you propose :) |
| 10:12.11 | brlcad | and will need to be very detailed and well articulated regardless, that much is certain given there are like 6 really strong candidates already with only 2-4 slots being allowed |
| 10:12.47 | brlcad | more than 6 received, but about that many are already "really good" before we even get to rankings |
| 10:12.53 | gedex | brldcad: i just updated my app |
| 10:13.57 | gedex | i want to know what drupal's version used on main site? |
| 10:14.17 | gedex | 5.x or 6.x |
| 10:15.15 | brlcad | given one of them just came out and hardly any of the modules are converted yet, which do you think |
| 10:17.32 | brlcad | gedex: I've seen it and it's better, but I can already tell you that it really needs a lot more detail, and it needs to tie to BRL-CAD better (you haven't identified how/what in brl-cad it should be using) |
| 10:18.17 | gedex | brlcad: ok, thx |
| 10:18.47 | brlcad | to give you an idea of the level of effort being seen, not to put any of the other submitters on the spot -- here's a pretty good example of appropriate detail: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Libpg_:_A_parametrics/constraint_library |
| 10:19.37 | brlcad | another good example for a different project: http://my.bzflag.org/w/User:Jude- |
| 10:22.55 | brlcad | looks forward to seeing updates and wanders off back to emacs |
| 10:26.56 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30613 10/brlcad/trunk/ (197 files in 197 dirs): ignore generated Makefile.in and Makefile files |
| 10:34.29 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30614 10/brlcad/trunk/ (197 files in 197 dirs): bah, revert previous propsetting .. need additive, not override |
| 10:52.34 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad Mr.Rossberg says he needs a bit more detail in my application can u tell me where exactly ? |
| 10:56.12 | brlcad | nope |
| 10:56.31 | brlcad | that's for you to figure out |
| 10:56.36 | hippieindamakin8 | :P |
| 10:56.39 | brlcad | and I agree with him |
| 10:56.45 | hippieindamakin8 | sure |
| 11:01.07 | d_rossberg | hippieindamakin8: i added a question to my comment, you could e.g answer this question ;) |
| 11:01.21 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i am replying to that :) |
| 11:24.58 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30615 10/brlcad/trunk/ (198 files in 198 dirs): much better .. ignore all the generated Makefile, Makefile.in, .deps, and .libs stuff |
| 11:30.42 | *** join/#brlcad gede1 (n=gedex@222.124.185.169) | |
| 11:50.30 | clock_ | hippieindamakin8: does your nick mean hippie in the machine? |
| 11:59.10 | *** join/#brlcad gedex (n=gedex@222.124.185.169) | |
| 12:01.33 | hippieindamakin8 | clock_ it is actually hippie in the making 87 |
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| 13:13.09 | andrecastelo | hey everyone |
| 13:13.11 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 13:13.45 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo |
| 13:13.56 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 13:20.06 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 13:35.18 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30616 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/wdb_comb_std.c: Found another case where Tcl_AppendResult was not being used correctly (i.e. last argument must be a null char *). |
| 14:08.31 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hey, you there?? |
| 14:17.51 | brlcad | nope |
| 14:18.23 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 14:18.23 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 15:13.31 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30617 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/dg.h src/proc-db/tire.c): folks need to set up their subversion config file with auto-props entries. set the mime-types and eol-style |
| 15:17.24 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30618 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dg.h: fix header |
| 15:26.23 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 15:28.08 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.62.248) | |
| 15:36.05 | andrecastelo | brlcad: sorry about earlier, i had to go afk and didn't respond.. |
| 15:36.46 | andrecastelo | it's about the "center point" patch - it is necessary to implement it in the gui, right ? |
| 15:48.33 | *** join/#brlcad surya__ (n=surya@203.200.95.130) | |
| 15:48.46 | surya__ | hey guys |
| 16:11.24 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30619 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Appears to be a problem with rotation - added testing routines for equations at various points, easier generation of test cases. |
| 17:16.55 | mafm | bye all |
| 17:50.55 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:00.11 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 18:00.14 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 18:00.44 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 18:26.28 | brlcad | howdy yukonbobby |
| 18:27.17 | yukonbob | what's shaking, gentlemen? |
| 18:27.29 | yukonbob | peeks into the GSoC site to see what's happening there... |
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| 18:28.49 | brlcad | oh, trying to actually catch up on some code |
| 18:29.52 | yukonbob | heh -- nothing new there... |
| 18:30.40 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5487750A.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:31.38 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: gsoc converstations -- where are those occuring? |
| 18:32.03 | yukonbob | is currently at MentorHome->ApplicationList |
| 18:33.00 | brlcad | yukonbob: they haven't started yet |
| 18:33.05 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (i=5207211c@silentflame/member/pdpc.base.minuteelectron) | |
| 18:33.07 | brlcad | otherwise, in the private comments for starters |
| 18:34.46 | yukonbob | alright -- cool |
| 18:56.42 | brlcad | and a lot of what we're saying could/should be said here :) |
| 18:58.39 | brlcad | so yeah, if someone wants a bug to work on for their patch -- see yukonbob :) |
| 18:58.52 | brlcad | he's got a good one that shouldn't be too hard |
| 19:01.35 | yukonbob | :) |
| 19:01.57 | yukonbob | barks "Get your bugs! Get your bugs!! Bugs here!" |
| 19:02.37 | yukonbob | puts bug-cart away, heads out for coffee. |
| 19:02.41 | yukonbob | bbs |
| 19:14.37 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos (n=Me@emc/developer/SWPadnos) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 19:18.15 | yukonbob | returns |
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| 19:30.06 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 19:30.11 | spike_ | hola |
| 19:35.06 | brlcad | ciao spike_ |
| 19:35.47 | spike_ | :-D glad they gave that extension, gives me time to write a patch |
| 19:36.06 | spike_ | last week was a bad week homework wise for me |
| 19:37.09 | brlcad | nods |
| 19:39.11 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, im going to vegas next week!! |
| 19:39.38 | brlcad | i heard, vegas baby |
| 19:50.01 | PrezKennedy | i heard my bro might be there this summer |
| 19:52.23 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.62.248) | |
| 19:52.38 | PrezKennedy | you gonna have him program up a storm brlcad? make him wish he had gone into art instead? ;) |
| 20:08.04 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: hopefully :) |
| 20:08.15 | brlcad | if he ever calls that is, still in his hands |
| 20:09.23 | PrezKennedy | im talking to him on google talk, maybe he'll jump in here |
| 20:14.10 | *** join/#brlcad Stephen (n=Stephen@resnet-236-6.resnet.UMBC.EDU) | |
| 20:15.59 | Stephen | so I heard you like mudkips |
| 20:16.45 | brlcad | howdy Stephen |
| 20:16.50 | Stephen | Howdy Sean |
| 20:17.14 | brlcad | mudkip ponies |
| 20:17.20 | Stephen | heh |
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| 21:09.26 | yukonbob | rebuilds 7.10.4 |
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| 21:44.24 | ``Erik | *whew* finally all caught up |
| 21:44.29 | ``Erik | aaannnnndddd, it's about time to start getting ready to leave :D |
| 21:47.51 | yukonbob | smiles |
| 21:48.16 | ``Erik | you fools sure generate a lot of line noise in a mere 5 days :D |
| 21:52.32 | ``Erik | ok, later kids :) |
| 21:52.42 | pacman87 | bye Erik |
| 21:52.49 | andrecastelo | cya Erik |
| 21:58.29 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad... could you give me some pointers on how to implement that center point patch ?? |
| 22:19.41 | yukonbob | q: wrt to the "image and signal processing" of BRL-CAD (as described on front page of site) -- what are examples of these? |
| 22:23.01 | brlcad | andrecastelo: you mean center of presented area or something else? |
| 22:23.35 | brlcad | run rtarea and see src/rt/viewarea.c |
| 22:23.44 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yes, the center of a presented area.. the mathematics involved are rather trivial (median point) |
| 22:23.45 | andrecastelo | ok thanks |
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| 22:24.44 | brlcad | yukonbob: there are over a hundred image and signal processing tools |
| 22:25.18 | brlcad | low/high pass filters, convolutions, transforms, etc |
| 22:25.30 | yukonbob | interesting -- /me can't imagine how those work wrt visual data, or interrogating geometry, but recognizes all those from audio work... |
| 22:26.19 | yukonbob | can you tell me where one my want to convolve two signals w/i the BRL-CAD framework? |
| 22:26.40 | brlcad | yukonbob: think of basic image filters in the gimp or photoshop |
| 22:26.47 | brlcad | similar processing |
| 22:26.57 | yukonbob | nods -- alright :) |
| 22:27.44 | brlcad | some are 1D, some 2D |
| 22:28.18 | yukonbob | one more q: regarding the above -- does that type of processing typically have professional/scientific use, and if "yes", what might such a use be? |
| 22:31.16 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.70.118) | |
| 22:48.16 | brlcad | yukonbob: individually, I'm not sure I'd characterize them that way altough some of them probably have been |
| 22:49.18 | brlcad | collectively, though, they are tied together to perform more complex opertations like performing noise reduction or feature extraction |
| 22:51.05 | brlcad | src/sig and src/util have many of them |
| 22:56.05 | ``Erik | wonders how many are also used on non-optical data O.o |
| 22:56.27 | *** join/#brlcad Stephen (n=Stephen@resnet-236-6.resnet.UMBC.EDU) | |
| 22:57.04 | ``Erik | like one of the things BRL-CAD is used for is radio signal propogation (imagine every cell tower is a 'light source', now do a photon map or path trace run (or straight radio) to see where in a scene you get reception) |
| 22:57.18 | ``Erik | or radar, or ... |
| 23:14.11 | ``Erik | so, uh |
| 23:14.23 | ``Erik | I'm looking at this mentor dashboard thingymajigger, and, uh,shtuff |
| 23:14.32 | brlcad | mmhmm? |
| 23:15.41 | ``Erik | hard to find shit, they layed it out silly :D |
| 23:15.53 | brlcad | yeah |
| 23:15.55 | ``Erik | do they provide guidance on pre-submission comments? or is that project specific? |
| 23:16.02 | brlcad | it's generally accepted that it sucks in many many ways |
| 23:17.21 | brlcad | but there's really not much that can be done about it |
| 23:17.22 | ``Erik | like, is "dawn, dude, you can't call it libpg, that's postgres", or is that an irrelevent technical detail? |
| 23:17.22 | brlcad | I was pretty vocal last year, but it's really got to go through their machinery/infrastructure and just has features added as needed (and this year the web dev got in an accident so he's out for the rest of the year) |
| 23:17.29 | brlcad | comments are project specific |
| 23:17.29 | ``Erik | eck, hope he's doing ok |
| 23:17.54 | brlcad | if you want to ask him that, go for it |
| 23:17.59 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@cocoa.sci.utah.edu) | |
| 23:18.02 | brlcad | though I believe postgres is actually libpq |
| 23:18.04 | ``Erik | ok, sooo, url for mentor guidance? |
| 23:18.08 | ``Erik | oi, leebert |
| 23:18.11 | ``Erik | mebbe |
| 23:18.28 | iraytrace | evening |
| 23:19.24 | brlcad | i have ranking criteria written up, but ranking doesn't begin until apps close |
| 23:19.34 | ``Erik | someone marked on -10 |
| 23:19.36 | ``Erik | one |
| 23:20.01 | brlcad | so the point now is really just to critique them, have them explain things -- there's a section for mentor-private comments too |
| 23:20.02 | ``Erik | sees a lot of libpg and a lot of libpq for postgresql stuff |
| 23:20.07 | ``Erik | ok |
| 23:20.16 | brlcad | yeah, I think all thouse libpg references are typos |
| 23:20.25 | brlcad | postgres docs say libpq |
| 23:20.43 | brlcad | the -10 is a bug |
| 23:20.57 | ``Erik | mebbe |
| 23:20.59 | brlcad | that one was marked invalid (as it had no content) then restored |
| 23:21.18 | brlcad | can't fix it till later |
| 23:25.35 | ``Erik | it looks like all the extras like to call themselves "libpg-xxx" |
| 23:25.47 | ``Erik | libpg-java libpg-tcl libpg-perl |
| 23:26.22 | ``Erik | terse names lend themselves to conflicts and confusion, 'sall I'm sayin' :D |
| 23:27.14 | brlcad | yeah, I know bout the wrappers |
| 23:27.30 | brlcad | for the lib itself though -- I actually couldn't find a non-petty conflict |
| 23:27.51 | brlcad | otherwise, suggest something better :) |
| 23:29.29 | ``Erik | heh |
| 23:29.52 | ``Erik | don't dare me, dude, I'll be shooting my mouth off about libbrlutil libbrlmath, libbrlrt :D *duck* |
| 23:30.26 | iraytrace | ?rl? |
| 23:30.52 | brlcad | meant for the parametric equations library :P |
| 23:31.01 | ``Erik | yeah, but if I start, I'll keep going :D |
| 23:31.11 | brlcad | otherwise, highly bikeshed at rather irrelevant at this point :) |
| 23:31.16 | ``Erik | ayup |
| 23:31.42 | ``Erik | I haven't looked in depth at any applications, so I can't make the nuclear power plant, just bitch about the color |
| 23:33.09 | ``Erik | metropolis in c++? hrm, would require a c++ compiler for liboptical, but we already inflict that on librt :/ |
| 23:34.12 | ``Erik | this raspberry hefeweizen is, uh, kinda gross |
| 23:35.07 | brlcad | c++ is already a forgone requirement for brep now |
| 23:35.17 | iraytrace | Um, librt requires a c++ compiler? What has been going on this year? |
| 23:35.21 | brlcad | MLT wouldn't necessarily use optical |
| 23:35.49 | iraytrace | OK, MLT, I was worried it was Metropolis, the movie. |
| 23:36.24 | ``Erik | which metropolis movie? fritz lang's is a damn good flick |
| 23:37.05 | ``Erik | librt has a .cpp file for talking to OpenNURBS, iraytrace |
| 23:39.11 | ``Erik | oh, the rhino to .g converter "seems to work", but segs on rt somewhere in opennurbs, I threw out the idea of writing a little program to load itout of the .g and print out all the information possible so we can look over it for something we know to be 'weird' |
| 23:39.15 | ``Erik | fyi |
| 23:39.58 | iraytrace | Yeah, the Fritz Lang one. |
| 23:40.31 | yukonbob | ``Erik: re: non-optical data (ie: radio signal) -- that's interesting, because one of the things I was thinking about that's probably not a "traditional" BRL-CAD application is using it to generate an impulse-response for a room, for use with audio applications... the impulse response could be used to convolve a raw audio signal, and the results would be as if that original raw signal were "played" in the "room |
| 23:40.47 | yukonbob | " that the original impulse response were generated from... |
| 23:41.27 | yukonbob | camera == listener |
| 23:41.31 | ``Erik | that'd be interesting, but it could be challenging to handle constructive and destructive interference from reflected waves |
| 23:41.46 | yukonbob | light location == location of impulse that we'll map |
| 23:42.14 | yukonbob | no matter how constructrive/destrcutive is handled, it'd probably be "interesting", I guess... |
| 23:42.33 | iraytrace | There's been a fair bit of work on "wave tracing" out of UNC the last year or so if you're interested in sound propagation. |
| 23:42.51 | yukonbob | North Carolina? |
| 23:43.03 | ``Erik | yeah, they're a bigger name in raytracing and graphics |
| 23:43.35 | iraytrace | Yes Univ. North Carolina Chapel Hill. |
| 23:44.21 | iraytrace | Though their talent pool has gotten decimated like everyone else recently. |
| 23:45.23 | ``Erik | invidia (misspelling intentional) vs intel, wee |
| 23:45.32 | brlcad | ``Erik: the 3dm-g isn't done, just started for that matter |
| 23:46.21 | ``Erik | I know, but it "does something" and freaks rt out, so looking at the something it does seems like the next step to my uninitiated arse :D |
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| 01:09.30 | yukonbob | is there such a thing as "phase" in light? ie: if I've got two sine waves, but one is phase-shifted 180-degrees (actually making it a cosine wave), and I add them together, I get 0 at all points. Is there anything similar w/ virtual light processing? |
| 01:10.48 | ``Erik | um, double-slit experiment seems to indicate that it kinda looks that way, but afaik, there's never been any interference detected O.o |
| 01:11.37 | ``Erik | well, no |
| 01:11.50 | ``Erik | hur, double slit demonstrates constructive and destructive interference of light |
| 01:12.53 | ``Erik | <-- goes back to watching futurama and waiting for his dinner to finish baking |
| 01:13.36 | yukonbob | is just wondering more about what you said re: the interference of light, and me using it as a model of audio-processing... phase is important in that regard. |
| 01:16.21 | ``Erik | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double-slit_experiment |
| 01:16.24 | ``Erik | fun reading |
| 01:16.50 | ``Erik | early physics class material, when ya do em/optics |
| 02:09.18 | ``Erik | yay southpark |
| 02:11.53 | pacman87 | yukonbob: i'm guessing brlcad only simulates light as a particle, not a wave |
| 02:12.16 | pacman87 | and you can only get the constructive/destructive interference from the wave behavior of light |
| 03:07.53 | yukonbob | pacman87: I bet you're right re: particle, and understand we'd need wave behaviour; I wonder how one could use colour effectively as a paramter in this case... because we don't need it to represent sound frequency in this case... |
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| 03:26.20 | pacman87 | yukonbob: you'd need frequency and phase shift information for each of the current 'particle' rays in order to simulate wave superposition |
| 03:27.48 | pacman87 | you could use frequency for color. for that, you'd have to figure out how each surface affects the frequency of the sounds reflected/transmitted through it, and apply those to the material's color properties |
| 03:29.07 | pacman87 | for phase shift, you could keep track of the total 'length' of the ray from source to eye, and scale the direction vector of the ray depending on the speed of sound through the medium |
| 03:29.33 | pacman87 | where 'length' would corrolate to the total time passed |
| 03:30.12 | pacman87 | that way you could see the whole echo effect, instead of just superposition from a constant wave source |
| 03:32.18 | pacman87 | and if you're simulating human hearing at a location, you'd just use two points as the eye for the rays (or ears in this case) to get left/right channels |
| 03:33.10 | pacman87 | so you could ignore the viewing screen used for ray tracing, as you wouldnt' need an image for sound, just the superposition of all the 'rays' at the point of each ear |
| 03:33.45 | pacman87 | (sorry for the wall of text, hope that makes sense) |
| 03:53.05 | yukonbob | likes this wall of text :) It's all interesting; I'll keep all this in mind and think about it... I find the potential here quite interesting... |
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| 05:02.40 | pacman87 | yukonbob: if you've got any more questions, feel free to ask me. i work as a tutor for engineering physics, so i know my way around the topic :) |
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| 06:02.00 | brlcad | completes a flyer, albeit late |
| 06:34.44 | yukonbob | pacman87: very cool -- are you going to be around here long-term, or only for GSoC, or ?? |
| 06:35.55 | yukonbob | pacman87: in any event, I'll apply myself a bit here (I'm feeling very fragmented for quality time these days :P), and see if I can somehow get a basic model of this (or see what's entailed) and work toward a proof of concept, or at least an interesting toy :) |
| 06:46.09 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/gsoc/brlcad_gsoc2008_flyer.pdf |
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| 11:18.51 | mafm | hi |
| 11:19.39 | MinuteElectron | hello |
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| 13:18.37 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
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| 13:43.54 | brlcad | morning folks |
| 13:48.42 | louipc | good morning |
| 13:56.39 | ``Erik | is that User:Jude- page a duplicate of his actual gsoc08 submission? if so; damn impressive |
| 14:01.33 | clock_ | I wonder what is the actual Google's motivation behind the summer of code |
| 14:01.57 | clock_ | Does Google get copyright on the code produced?" |
| 14:03.08 | MinuteElectron | They don't need motivation. :) |
| 14:03.12 | MinuteElectron | *;) |
| 14:03.51 | MinuteElectron | It could just be for the hell of it, and they're getting a hell of a lot of publicity through it; they also use some of the things that are being improved by it. |
| 14:04.36 | clock_ | google has a publicity on every desktop |
| 14:04.39 | clock_ | Do they need anymore? |
| 14:04.44 | clock_ | How can Google use gEDA? |
| 14:05.38 | MinuteElectron | gEDA? |
| 14:06.18 | brlcad | ``Erik: no his submission has other (additional) details |
| 14:07.13 | ``Erik | heh, companies always need more (good) publicity, plus google gets a chance to give ms a black eye AND lets them see who can code for recruiting |
| 14:07.39 | ``Erik | wow, jude is pretty close to a gold standard there |
| 14:08.08 | clock_ | sorry |
| 14:08.11 | clock_ | BRL-CAD |
| 14:08.25 | clock_ | I mixed with a different project that is also in gsoc and I use on Ronja |
| 14:08.32 | clock_ | uses a lot of software on Ronja |
| 14:09.02 | ``Erik | toyed with geda many years ago, seemed neat but a little underpowered at the time... "promising" |
| 14:09.20 | clock_ | I use it on Ronja |
| 14:10.09 | clock_ | for the whole development from testing ideas in a circuit simulator through schematics, partlists, shopping lists, populating lists, printed boards to previewing the actual Gerber files that get sent to the manufacture |
| 14:10.41 | clock_ | I just built a wall holder for a 30kg monitor as a space frame construction |
| 14:10.53 | clock_ | But I don't think I'll take the pains of constructing a BRL-CAD model of it |
| 14:11.36 | clock_ | unless I wrote a special C program for modeling space frames |
| 14:11.49 | ``Erik | procdb ftw |
| 14:12.00 | clock_ | because adjusting every rung manually until it fits without visible artifacts is too labor intensive |
| 14:12.52 | clock_ | BTW] |
| 14:13.05 | clock_ | can you sort the following materials according to their strength/weight ratio? |
| 14:13.27 | clock_ | titanium,steel, aluminium |
| 14:14.21 | ``Erik | um, there're many forms of each of those... and different kinds of strengths... and you probably want density, not weight... the numbers should be available for the variants you're interested in |
| 14:14.37 | clock_ | density sure |
| 14:15.55 | ``Erik | quick google givs me http://www.matweb.com/ |
| 14:16.42 | ``Erik | would think that cost and easy of working with would also be big factors |
| 14:17.46 | clock_ | Seems that the web is suffering from IIS |
| 14:18.04 | clock_ | What I wanted to point out that steel is actually better in this regard than aluminium |
| 14:18.11 | clock_ | and titanium is only marginally better than steel |
| 14:18.31 | clock_ | According to a Wikipedia article |
| 14:18.35 | ``Erik | uh huh? |
| 14:18.52 | ``Erik | and it depends on the kind of strengths |
| 14:18.59 | clock_ | ductile strength |
| 14:19.03 | ``Erik | tensile, shearing, ductile, ... |
| 14:19.16 | clock_ | btw what's the difference between tensile and ductile? |
| 14:19.31 | clock_ | tensile is like for cables |
| 14:19.33 | clock_ | but ductile? |
| 14:19.36 | clock_ | For ducts? |
| 14:19.42 | clock_ | ducks |
| 14:20.29 | ``Erik | I think tensil is any pulling that breaks, where ductile needs actual necking behavior to qualify (ductile is a subset of tensil)? I d'no |
| 14:21.06 | ``Erik | I d'no, I'm not a material scientist :) |
| 14:21.49 | ``Erik | all'z I know is there's a lot more to the notion of material "strength" than one number |
| 14:21.53 | ``Erik | and now I go to a meeting :D |
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| 14:24.35 | andrecastelo | good morning |
| 14:28.30 | MinuteElectron | test |
| 14:28.41 | MinuteElectron | oops, sorry |
| 14:32.15 | pacman87 | for tensile strengths, there's the yield point strength, and the ultimate tensile strength |
| 14:32.41 | clock_ | yield point is the point of plastic deformation? |
| 14:32.45 | pacman87 | yield point is the value of stress where a material undergoes plastic deformation |
| 14:32.49 | pacman87 | just typing that... |
| 14:33.03 | clock_ | What if you reach just about the yield point, but 10,000 times an hour? |
| 14:33.11 | clock_ | Will it creep? |
| 14:33.13 | pacman87 | cyclicak loading?\ |
| 14:33.18 | pacman87 | cyclical loading |
| 14:33.19 | clock_ | Yes |
| 14:33.51 | clock_ | Do I have to derate for cyclical loading? |
| 14:33.53 | pacman87 | if you reach the yield point, the material with deform |
| 14:34.14 | clock_ | According to the table on Wikipedia, wood has much worse specific strength than steel |
| 14:35.33 | clock_ | That means, if I have a bridge of wood and replace the truss members by steel, the bridge can weight less, right? |
| 14:35.54 | pacman87 | i'm not sure what defination of 'specific strength' they're using |
| 14:35.59 | clock_ | I mean while keeping the rated strength of the bridge |
| 14:36.06 | clock_ | ratio of the strength to density |
| 14:36.34 | pacman87 | then yes |
| 14:36.46 | pacman87 | because you'd need smaller beams to carry the same loads |
| 14:36.56 | clock_ | Now the strength of the structure also depends on choosing suitable geometry |
| 14:37.11 | clock_ | If you have a small bridge over a creek in a for of a single plank of wood |
| 14:37.18 | pacman87 | but if you reduce the cross-sectional area too much, the bending moments can become a problem |
| 14:37.25 | clock_ | and replace the plank with a space frame or truss or whatever, then you can save weight as well, right? |
| 14:37.49 | pacman87 | most likely, yes |
| 14:38.07 | clock_ | Cause one structure where maximum strength and minimum weight is aimed is a skateboard |
| 14:38.34 | clock_ | Not only it is made of inferior material - wood - but also has an inferior geometry - a board |
| 14:38.56 | clock_ | If the board in skateboard were replaced by a steel welded truss, the skateboard could weight less while supporting the same weight, right? |
| 14:39.07 | pacman87 | adding a truss to the top surface would impede the functionality |
| 14:39.12 | pacman87 | possibly |
| 14:39.25 | pacman87 | so i'd have to be to the bottom to allow you to skate |
| 14:39.25 | clock_ | you could use only a thin deck with a steel truss underneath |
| 14:39.38 | pacman87 | it's possible |
| 14:40.00 | pacman87 | but it'd almost certianly be more expensive (materials cost and manufacturing cost) |
| 14:40.11 | clock_ | and it would be less flexible than wood |
| 14:40.16 | clock_ | which is good for handling |
| 14:40.16 | pacman87 | right |
| 14:40.42 | clock_ | I don't want to tell my skateboard "turn!" and him responding "wobbly wobbly wobbly rubbery rubbery nothing!" |
| 14:42.06 | pacman87 | wooden skateboards have a curved underside, right? |
| 14:42.21 | pacman87 | doesn't really know too much about skateboards |
| 14:42.21 | clock_ | some of them |
| 14:43.01 | clock_ | I built a space frame holder for my optical datalink |
| 14:43.17 | clock_ | It's lightweight but if you smash the end with a hammer, it feels like solid rock |
| 14:43.28 | pacman87 | having a pair of steel trusses underneath might make grinding down a handrail or something a bit more 'interesting' |
| 14:43.31 | clock_ | space frames seem to be awesome |
| 14:43.45 | clock_ | I mean a slalom skateboard, not for tricks |
| 14:43.58 | pacman87 | ah, then it makes more sense |
| 14:44.13 | pacman87 | you mean you dont' want sparks flying out behind you from the metal-metal contact? |
| 14:44.26 | clock_ | I should get sparks when running off curbs |
| 14:44.51 | pacman87 | well, you'd need enough energy in the impact |
| 14:45.24 | clock_ | making trusses is surprisingly simple |
| 14:45.29 | pacman87 | to shave off the small metal pieces, and give enough heat from friction to start them oxidizing |
| 14:45.34 | clock_ | you take a tape measure measure centimeters cut a stick and weld in place |
| 14:45.35 | clock_ | repeat |
| 14:45.49 | clock_ | no precision measurements, no drilling, no alignment, nothing |
| 14:46.10 | clock_ | I mean space frames |
| 14:47.15 | clock_ | space frames are used in the satellites because of the optimum weight/strength ratio, right? |
| 14:47.39 | pacman87 | probably |
| 14:47.49 | clock_ | that explains why the holder looks so "cosmic" |
| 14:49.21 | pacman87 | though if you're making a frame for your board, you'd probably want to do more calculations than just welding pieces on |
| 14:49.37 | pacman87 | so you can optimize the weight/strength tradeoffs |
| 14:50.19 | clock_ | calculations take time |
| 14:50.58 | pacman87 | how else will you know if it will break under impact loads, or whether it's way too strong (and heavy)? |
| 14:51.03 | clock_ | I can always take a plexi take some members out and replace them with a different thickness |
| 14:51.15 | clock_ | every skateboard breaks under an impact load |
| 14:51.22 | clock_ | if you stand in the middle and jump, you have suddenly two |
| 14:51.28 | pacman87 | depends on how much of an impact... |
| 14:52.04 | clock_ | if it's too heavy doesn't matter, you can use it for taking walls dow |
| 14:52.11 | clock_ | just let it runn off a hill into a wall... |
| 14:52.35 | pacman87 | battering ram style? |
| 14:52.38 | clock_ | would be fun to make a motorized vehicle in a form of a large skateboard that would be steered by leaning body weight |
| 14:52.48 | clock_ | I am sure the road authority wouldn't be very happy from that |
| 14:53.00 | pacman87 | motorized skateboards already exist |
| 14:53.44 | clock_ | with steel frame? |
| 14:55.26 | pacman87 | http://blag.xkcd.com/2008/03/14/new-electric-skateboard/ |
| 14:55.44 | pacman87 | he's got links to a few manufacturers |
| 15:03.52 | clock_ | I wonder what would happen with a lowrider clearance |
| 15:04.35 | clock_ | would probably make sparks on hitting protrusions from the sidewalk |
| 15:05.01 | mafm | brlcad: are you doing evaluations of the applications already, or something like that? |
| 15:05.48 | pacman87 | clock_: you'd wear out the bottom of your frame, but you probably wouldn't be going fast enough to generate sparks |
| 15:06.40 | clock_ | pacman87: what's are the sparking requirements? |
| 15:07.00 | clock_ | speed*pressure>something? |
| 15:07.05 | pacman87 | sparks = small pieces of metal undergoing oxidization |
| 15:07.34 | pacman87 | like lighting steel wool on fire |
| 15:07.49 | clock_ | is it oxidization? Isn't it overheating? |
| 15:08.03 | pacman87 | oxidization of metals is exothermic |
| 15:09.08 | pacman87 | and you have to increase the temperature of the small pieces to above the activation energy for the reaction |
| 15:11.19 | clock_ | so it's like thermal runaway oxidization? |
| 15:12.01 | clock_ | what if you file up like 100kg of steel fillings under inert atmosphere and then open it to the air and set on fire? |
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| 15:12.11 | clock_ | filing |
| 15:12.13 | prasad_ | waves |
| 15:12.14 | clock_ | filings |
| 15:13.10 | pacman87 | pretty much |
| 15:13.28 | pacman87 | and they have to be small enough to have a high surface area/volume ratio |
| 15:13.59 | pacman87 | because the reaction takes place on the surface, and there's a lot of heat lost to the air it's flying through |
| 15:14.18 | pacman87 | and there has to be enough heat left to continue the reaction |
| 15:22.28 | pacman87 | yukonbob: there's more primitives on the list than GSoC has time for, so i'll be sticking around to work on them |
| 15:23.52 | pacman87 | also, if my GSoC app hasn't gotten any comments, does that mean i'm perfect, or that no one's gotten around to it yet? |
| 15:48.26 | yukonbob | heh |
| 15:48.39 | yukonbob | let's say "perfect" for now, and enjoy the glow. |
| 15:52.28 | pacman87 | :) |
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| 16:15.52 | yukonbob | hello, Stephen |
| 16:16.10 | Stephen | howdy |
| 16:18.18 | CIA-35 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30620 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Solve derivative equations for zero, not -1. |
| 16:30.32 | hippieindamakin8 | :) awesome pacman87 |
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| 16:37.06 | hippieindamakin8 | pacman87 when u have cyclic loads or fatigue loads.. it is not neccessary that it fails when it reaches it ultimate strength |
| 16:37.49 | hippieindamakin8 | it follows the Modified Goldman Line on a graph of stress alternating vs stress midrange |
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| 17:18.48 | ``Erik | recalls that plastic deformation changes the characteristics... "work hardening" I think is the term |
| 17:19.46 | louipc | indeed |
| 17:20.39 | brlcad | mafm: some yes, of course -- students start being evaluated from the moment we meet :) |
| 17:20.56 | archivist | sure does ``Erik |
| 17:21.38 | mafm | brlcad: I mean that there's something about the ranking, but no comments or anything -- and anyway I didn't start to look into the patch yet, with all this deadline extension |
| 17:22.01 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah, no comments is generally a good thing .. not necessarily perfect in the least, but those applications are probably higher in the list |
| 17:22.17 | mafm | I had to rehash priorities, like filling my tax papers so the government doens't put me in jail :) |
| 17:22.18 | brlcad | mafm: understand |
| 17:22.56 | pacman87 | believes ``Erik is correct wrt "work hardening" aka "strain hardening" |
| 17:23.41 | pacman87 | the textbook that covers cyclical loads is currently being used as my monitor stand, and i didnt' really feel like pulling it out |
| 17:24.20 | ``Erik | I have documentation about it, but it's in a special niche, where there's a rapid thermal issue as well :/ |
| 17:25.18 | louipc | work hardening is very commonly referred to in the machine shop |
| 17:26.14 | ``Erik | hasn't done anything in a machineshop since an intro class 15 years ago |
| 17:26.32 | louipc | it can happen if you're cutting with a dull tool which instead of cutting actually hardens the material and dulls the tool even more |
| 17:28.31 | louipc | the principle can also be used to harden the material surface when you don't really need/want to heat treat |
| 17:29.30 | archivist | it means a minimum cut depth on a lathe to get under the previous passes work hardening |
| 17:32.08 | brlcad | wonders who costa is |
| 17:33.02 | hippieindamakin8 | hates to talk about machining.. |
| 17:33.13 | hippieindamakin8 | had a machining exam today :( |
| 17:34.14 | yukonbob | re: perfect applications -- /me was being a bit facetious, but thx for the clarification |
| 17:34.48 | brlcad | knows, wasn't commenting on your comments :) |
| 17:34.58 | brlcad | two new ones in |
| 17:35.22 | yukonbob | nice |
| 17:37.19 | pacman87 | what topics? |
| 17:37.55 | brlcad | OO API and global illumination |
| 17:40.54 | prasad_ | brlcad in gsoc eh |
| 17:40.56 | prasad_ | nice |
| 17:45.46 | brlcad | prasad_: howdy prasad_ |
| 17:46.47 | mafm | bye |
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| 17:48.05 | prasad_ | hey hey |
| 17:48.15 | prasad_ | what's the news from apg |
| 17:48.16 | prasad_ | :) |
| 17:51.30 | brlcad | oh, more of the same |
| 17:51.34 | brlcad | less of the same |
| 17:52.02 | brlcad | doesn't care -- it's all about the BRL-CAD, which is going great :) |
| 17:57.22 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
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| 18:37.20 | prasad_ | heh cool |
| 18:37.41 | prasad_ | hmm GL UI |
| 18:37.42 | prasad_ | ;) |
| 18:38.10 | prasad_ | too bad we don't support oss |
| 18:40.50 | prasad_ | who's heading to siggraph btw |
| 18:41.15 | brlcad | yeah, that's a damn shame -- you should :) |
| 18:41.21 | brlcad | that's not known yet |
| 18:42.16 | prasad_ | hopefully i get to go |
| 18:42.32 | prasad_ | think one of my coworkers is presenting |
| 18:59.29 | brlcad | can't see himself not going |
| 18:59.54 | ``Erik | bastage |
| 19:00.34 | prasad_ | ``Erik: level 70? |
| 19:01.00 | brlcad | have always seen it as a job requirement (to let me go) |
| 19:01.11 | brlcad | i'd pay my own way or consider a different job otherwise |
| 19:01.17 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 19:01.31 | prasad_ | ``Erik: no more wow? |
| 19:01.32 | ``Erik | oh, wow? uh, twice over :( |
| 19:01.40 | prasad_ | damn |
| 19:01.48 | ``Erik | pheer my nerdiness. |
| 19:01.55 | prasad_ | indeed |
| 19:02.06 | prasad_ | got a wii |
| 19:02.13 | prasad_ | stopped caring for pc games |
| 19:02.14 | prasad_ | :\ |
| 19:02.16 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:02.21 | brlcad | heh |
| 19:02.41 | brlcad | so still playing with your wii then eh? |
| 19:02.57 | prasad_ | ever since i got it |
| 19:02.59 | prasad_ | ;) |
| 19:03.03 | ``Erik | better than sucking bawls ;> |
| 19:03.18 | prasad_ | the wife plays with a lot too |
| 19:03.20 | prasad_ | so it's fun |
| 19:03.22 | brlcad | you hands must get tired |
| 19:03.49 | prasad_ | quite a workout |
| 19:04.30 | ``Erik | goes about upgrading the new bz again |
| 19:05.30 | prasad_ | is mike t still with arl? |
| 19:05.35 | prasad_ | s/with/at |
| 19:05.36 | ``Erik | yup |
| 19:05.49 | prasad_ | is he active in boost devel? |
| 19:06.11 | prasad_ | had to use it for a hashmap, but it didn't have an implementation |
| 19:06.14 | prasad_ | just proposed spec |
| 19:06.25 | ``Erik | http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Misha&n=Hurk |
| 19:06.29 | ``Erik | http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Misha&n=Slugeater |
| 19:06.32 | ``Erik | hangs his head in shame |
| 19:06.55 | prasad_ | heh |
| 19:07.05 | prasad_ | blizz is using us |
| 19:07.19 | prasad_ | hope to get some alpha/beta access |
| 19:07.31 | ``Erik | cool, can you say for what? |
| 19:07.59 | prasad_ | dont think it's public knowledge so not yet |
| 19:08.10 | ``Erik | aight :) |
| 19:08.12 | prasad_ | 2 AAA titles |
| 19:08.21 | ``Erik | meh, console shit, who cares |
| 19:08.23 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 19:08.32 | prasad_ | hehe |
| 19:08.58 | prasad_ | when they ever make d3, i'll be the first to break nda |
| 19:09.11 | ``Erik | every since the paddles were traded in for D pads, consoles suck :) |
| 19:09.37 | ``Erik | I never like diablo... was a big starcraft fan, still play it once in a rare while |
| 19:09.49 | prasad_ | well then ;) |
| 19:09.51 | ``Erik | wc2 was fun as a goofy distraction |
| 19:09.58 | prasad_ | ex blizz made hellgate london |
| 19:10.14 | prasad_ | supposedly spiritual successor of d2 |
| 19:10.18 | prasad_ | sucked bad |
| 19:10.23 | prasad_ | tech issues mostly |
| 19:10.27 | ``Erik | but, naturally, the best game ever is bzflag... O.o |
| 19:10.35 | prasad_ | didn't look as fun |
| 19:10.58 | prasad_ | we made a 'game' for gdc |
| 19:11.02 | prasad_ | in 3 weeks |
| 19:11.14 | prasad_ | came out nicely |
| 19:11.16 | ``Erik | I bet it was a lot cooler than my 1 day pong |
| 19:12.11 | prasad_ | http://www.gametrailers.com/player/31159.html?type= |
| 19:12.17 | prasad_ | flash reqd |
| 19:12.25 | prasad_ | doesn't really show our stuff |
| 19:12.30 | prasad_ | so meh |
| 19:12.35 | prasad_ | only footage loose on the interwebs |
| 19:12.52 | prasad_ | well the hud is ours :o |
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| 19:17.54 | prasad_ | hah crit happens |
| 19:17.57 | prasad_ | cute |
| 19:18.01 | prasad_ | :p |
| 19:18.47 | ``Erik | heh, a parody guild came up on the evil side, "crit doesn't happen"... have also seen "I'd crit that" running around O.o |
| 19:18.47 | prasad_ | horde ftw |
| 19:18.49 | prasad_ | all of my chars were horde |
| 19:18.51 | prasad_ | moooO |
| 19:18.55 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:19.02 | ``Erik | FRRR DE HRRRD |
| 19:19.42 | ``Erik | don't milk the tauren, they enjoy it too much O.o :D |
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| 20:57.31 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30621 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Still some edge effects when testing parameters, but much closer. |
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| 21:40.30 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30622 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (archer/archer.bat mged/mged.bat): Update version. |
| 21:41.18 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30623 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: Added desktop icons for mged and archer. Minor cleanup. |
| 21:43.53 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30624 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Added variables for keeping track of versions. |
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| 02:06.33 | Daytona | prasad_: Hey, how's it going? |
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| 02:41.13 | poolio | yikes. I accidentally just removed my brlcad folder because the box I was ssh'd into has the same PS1 :'( |
| 02:56.02 | yukonbob | :P |
| 02:57.42 | poolio | hopes he backed up everything |
| 03:14.19 | poolio | So I passed configure and when I went to building it failed because it could not find zlib.h. I installed zlib, but shouldn't configure have caught this? |
| 03:15.53 | poolio | (it correctly detects that I do not have a working zlib though, maybe it should be pointed to brlcad's zlib.h?) |
| 03:20.10 | poolio | so the problem appears to be that I had working zlib runtime and not the development headers... |
| 04:18.34 | brlcad | hello Harriss |
| 04:18.41 | brlcad | and howdy poolio |
| 04:20.14 | *** join/#brlcad wuxia (n=wuxia@unaffiliated/wuxia) | |
| 04:20.15 | brlcad | yeah, the test is technically for both libs and (separately) for headers and (separately) for run-time functionality .. at least usually those three have to pass for a given lib |
| 04:20.28 | brlcad | otherwise it doesn't have what it needs |
| 04:20.33 | brlcad | hello wuxia |
| 04:21.00 | wuxia | can anyone expain what the brlcad rendering algorithm does? i.e. does it only require that the geometry support a 'does this ray intersect with this shape' query? [I'm trying to find something similar to 'generative modeling language' or synder's 'genmod' ] |
| 04:22.35 | brlcad | depends what the "it" is in your sentence |
| 04:23.32 | brlcad | in terms of implementing or adding new primitives, they basically just have to answer the "does this ray intersect with this shape" |
| 04:23.36 | wuxia | hey, that's a good bot |
| 04:23.42 | wuxia | what algorithm? alice? elizra ? |
| 04:23.54 | brlcad | ~fishslap wuxia |
| 04:23.54 | ibot | ACTION slaps wuxia up side the head with a wet fish. |
| 04:24.42 | wuxia | a human would have kicked me |
| 04:25.18 | brlcad | so comparing against all primitives, it ends up with lots of "segments" -- those are weaved together per the CSG rules |
| 04:25.40 | wuxia | gotcha :-) |
| 04:25.54 | wuxia | is there any good interfaces between pbrt and brlcad? |
| 04:26.04 | wuxia | I feel that pbrt does ray tracing better, but brlcad is better at modeling |
| 04:26.48 | brlcad | pbrt does a lot of things fundamentally differently |
| 04:28.15 | wuxia | is there any good bridge for taking a gbrlcad model |
| 04:28.20 | wuxia | and rendering it in pbrt? |
| 04:28.31 | brlcad | if generating pretty pictures is your goal, they certainly have a better global illum model integrated -- but then iirc they are almost exclusively explicit geometry models and not a shotline-capable solid geometry ray-tracer (evaluating all the way along through materials) |
| 04:28.48 | brlcad | i'm not aware of any "good" bridge yet |
| 04:29.01 | brlcad | mostly because of that implicit vs explicit geometry issue |
| 04:29.02 | wuxia | what is 'shotline-capable solid geometry ray-tracer' ? |
| 04:30.17 | brlcad | it's a fair bit to explain, but basically a ray-trace engine that takes solidity into account -- not just surface-based or (the most common) first-hit based ray-trace interfaces |
| 04:30.43 | wuxia | for a surface-based |
| 04:30.47 | wuxia | I need only provide "does this ray intersect" |
| 04:30.57 | brlcad | brl-cad's librt ray-trace engine is a full-path shotliner that will either report first-hit or all segments along the ray |
| 04:31.04 | wuxia | what more complicated thing does "shotline-capable solid geometry ray-tracer' require me? |
| 04:31.10 | wuxia | ah |
| 04:31.14 | wuxia | and one way to do csg |
| 04:31.19 | wuxia | is to report all semgnets along the ray? |
| 04:31.25 | wuxia | and then do the csg operations |
| 04:31.29 | wuxia | to decide which one it actually hit? |
| 04:32.07 | brlcad | actually you can evaluate the csg with just first hit or with all segments |
| 04:32.18 | brlcad | that's not really different |
| 04:32.31 | brlcad | i'm talking about other purposes of ray-tracing, not just generating pictures |
| 04:32.41 | wuxia | oh |
| 04:32.45 | wuxia | like firing a bullet into a tank? |
| 04:32.57 | brlcad | sure |
| 04:33.13 | brlcad | or simply answering the question of "how much of this material is on this shotline" |
| 04:34.09 | brlcad | with an explicit ray-engine, you end up with all sorts of analytic/analysis questions that are harder to guarantee without solid geometry |
| 04:34.48 | wuxia | why is that |
| 04:34.51 | wuxia | given a boundary |
| 04:34.54 | brlcad | if you assertively have "crack-free" geometry, and aren't inside things when you start a ray |
| 04:35.03 | wuxia | why can't I get the 'solid geometry' by looking at entry and exit points? |
| 04:36.27 | brlcad | mostly because of numerics -- if your geometry isn't actually cracked (i.e. non-solid), there is a higher probability of numerical cracks due to floating point issues on the seams on the boundaries |
| 04:36.50 | brlcad | solid geometry entails a *guarantee* that there is no crack, numeric or otherwise |
| 04:37.23 | brlcad | implicit geometry implicitly guarantees this, other CAD systems provide the guarantee through "crack-free" BREP implementations |
| 04:37.38 | brlcad | something that only generates pictures doesn't really have to care |
| 04:37.57 | brlcad | anyway, why you ask? :) |
| 04:38.38 | brlcad | there are ways to extract an explicit geometry model from brl-cad geometry that you could undoubtedly feed to pbrt via one of their importers |
| 04:39.06 | wuxia | i want to render procedural sci-fi cities |
| 04:39.07 | brlcad | it conceivably wouldn't be that hard to write an exporter if you have their file format (especially if they support primitive descriptions) |
| 04:39.16 | wuxia | brl-cad looks awesome for geometry modeling; pbrt for rendering |
| 04:41.35 | brlcad | wuxia: for what it's worth, pbrt looks great because most of their shots have global illumination calcs turned on (which librt doesn't implement, though it is a gsoc topic) |
| 04:42.21 | brlcad | there's only two screenshots that use the global illum renderer we do have: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/humvee.png.html and http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/stryker_slat.jpg.html |
| 04:42.57 | brlcad | brute force solutions |
| 04:43.10 | brlcad | and required conversion to brep polygonal format |
| 04:43.21 | wuxia | why brep first? |
| 04:43.27 | wuxia | why can't global illumination be done on csg's ? |
| 04:47.19 | brlcad | there's no reason it can't |
| 04:47.41 | brlcad | it just hasn't been done yet, that's why it's a gsoc suggested task |
| 04:50.10 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 04:55.01 | poolio | brlcad: wait, so then why did it fail compiling but pass configure? in config output it says it's using system zlib, but I fail the tests |
| 05:01.04 | poolio | basically, I was just upset to see the build die :) |
| 05:04.27 | brlcad | as you should be, build failures indicate something is probably wrong in configure :) |
| 05:07.39 | brlcad | that third test -- the functionality test -- is either weak or non-existent for zlib |
| 05:10.59 | poolio | bah. I want configure to stop and print in big bold letters that I should not continue :) I ran configure and looked away, and the summary looked all fine and dandy |
| 05:13.58 | brlcad | that's what I mean -- it's probably missing a test |
| 05:14.02 | brlcad | it normally does halt |
| 05:14.44 | poolio | ah Ok |
| 05:14.49 | poolio | thanks and sorry for the whining :) |
| 05:15.10 | brlcad | hum, was just looking |
| 05:15.15 | brlcad | there is a functionality test |
| 05:15.26 | brlcad | so "something else" is wrong |
| 05:15.39 | poolio | errr, I also just realized the build failed again later |
| 05:16.17 | brlcad | can you post your build log and config.log files? |
| 05:16.22 | poolio | this is a trunk checkout by the way |
| 05:16.38 | poolio | yeah, do I uninstalled the zlib1g-dev package and am going to regenerate the broken zlib.h error |
| 05:21.19 | poolio | brlcad: build is gonna take a little while, I'm on my shiny new, not that fast, x300 :P |
| 05:23.15 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:29.20 | poolio | brlcad: config.log: http://poolio.org/files/config.log and build: http://poolio.org/files/zlib_error.txt |
| 05:38.37 | brlcad | poolio: try editing src/other/tkimg/png/Makefile.am and add: ${LIBZ_CPPFLAGS} \ after the PNG_CPPFLAGS line |
| 05:39.13 | poolio | brlcad: alright, I'm waiting for the build to finish with zlib-dev installed, so gimme a few minutes. |
| 05:39.30 | poolio | is feeling the grind of the 1.2ghz for the first time |
| 05:41.01 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30625 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkimg/png/Makefile.am: missing LIBZ_CPPFLAGS |
| 05:41.35 | brlcad | yeah, I'm betting that was the problem -- tkimg's png module's build rules didn't have the header search path |
| 05:41.50 | brlcad | the configure tests worked, failed and was set to build |
| 05:43.21 | poolio | alrighty |
| 05:47.38 | poolio | brlcad: http://poolio.org/files/htester_error.txt is what I'm getting with zlib working |
| 05:58.10 | brlcad | didn't realize you're on ubuntu/debian? |
| 05:59.14 | brlcad | they have a busted libtool, it incorrectly strips out linkage paths |
| 05:59.46 | poolio | sorry :( |
| 06:00.00 | poolio | is there an easy fix? |
| 06:00.26 | brlcad | other than installing an unmodified libtool from gnu? |
| 06:00.37 | brlcad | unmodified works without a hitch |
| 06:01.58 | brlcad | otherwise, I haven't completed debugging the libtool script itself to see if there's a good way to trick it or work around it |
| 06:22.18 | poolio | that's weird, because when I was working on brlcad last summer I was using debian |
| 06:24.28 | brlcad | yeah, the build options have changed to not be excessively redundant -- there was a recursive redundant declaration of libraries pushed down to the binary LD line instead of relying on libtool's usual dependency tracking |
| 06:25.03 | brlcad | pushed down to the binary ld option, debian's mods don't come into play |
| 06:25.27 | brlcad | but that's a bear to keep -- libraries listed dozens of times over per binary |
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| 07:07.38 | poolio | brlcad: sounds like a good dev choice, but having a source install not function on a very popular distro is a bad decision :) |
| 07:10.28 | brlcad | of course |
| 07:12.13 | brlcad | someone(tm) really needs to see if there's some way to work around the problem |
| 07:13.43 | brlcad | being popular isn't a good excuse for being wrong too, the problem has been reported by others to debian devs and they refuse to fix it |
| 07:15.25 | brlcad | we make workarounds for a lot of platform-specific stupidities, that one just isn't in the frequent testing rotation as nobody has stepped up to maintain the port |
| 07:17.44 | brlcad | so feel free to be that someone(tm) and fix it :) |
| 07:18.08 | brlcad | shouldn't be too hard to find a work-around |
| 07:22.28 | poolio | brlcad: in a month or so I'll give it a shot :) |
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| 09:53.20 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:54.40 | mafm | hallo |
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| 13:04.08 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 13:05.17 | mafm | :) |
| 13:05.52 | ``Erik | no love for twingy's photon mapping, I see O.o |
| 13:38.36 | mafm | hmm, I have a linguistic question totally unrelated to the topic of the channel, may I? |
| 13:39.43 | brlcad | go for it |
| 13:41.38 | mafm | if I'm studying a degree, say CS, what's the name of the individual parts composing it, as in Programming I, Networks, Distributed Systems, AI, etc, comprising typically one semester or a year, one hour per day or so? it's "courses"? |
| 13:48.13 | brlcad | yeah, those are your courses |
| 13:48.51 | mafm | hmm, and you're from USA right? |
| 13:49.19 | brlcad | i've lived in a number of places, and the usa is one of them |
| 13:50.23 | mafm | it's only to ask if you know if it's named the same across english-speaking languages |
| 13:50.55 | brlcad | tries to think what else you might call them |
| 13:51.06 | mafm | for some reason I was calling it "subjects", but I don't know where I took it :D |
| 13:51.18 | brlcad | courses, classes, seminars |
| 13:51.36 | mafm | maybe it's that I directly translate from portuguese or something like that |
| 13:51.37 | prasad_ | hey is daytona == jra? |
| 13:51.41 | brlcad | usually "seminar courses" are a specific type |
| 13:51.44 | brlcad | prasad_: yup |
| 13:51.49 | prasad_ | ah missed him |
| 13:52.14 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, I think courses/classes are pretty much the terms |
| 13:53.14 | mafm | good, thank you very much |
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| 14:32.40 | mafm | svn: URL 'https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/trunk' doesn't exist |
| 14:32.44 | mafm | what do you use as trunk? |
| 14:38.00 | poolio | /svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk |
| 14:44.35 | mafm | oh thanks |
| 15:01.29 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 15:01.29 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 15:04.43 | mafm | not a light download, it seems :) |
| 15:28.11 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875445.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:00.22 | mafm | hmm, the things using C++ in brl-cad are related to 3rd party tools? |
| 16:03.56 | mafm | and is it all in other/ 3rd party tools it seems? |
| 16:04.16 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 16:06.49 | mafm | brlcad: I have a problem compiling |
| 16:11.21 | poolio | mafm: are you by any chance running a debian-based distro? |
| 16:11.49 | mafm | nope, I don't run degenerates |
| 16:11.59 | mafm | I use Debian itself :) |
| 16:12.01 | poolio | debian is debian-based, no? |
| 16:12.20 | mafm | just kidding :) |
| 16:12.30 | mafm | so what's the problem with debian then? |
| 16:12.42 | poolio | mafm: So I just had the same problem earlier... brlcad says debian uses a broken libtool, and there's no easy fix other than installing a clean libtool |
| 16:12.56 | mafm | :S |
| 16:13.34 | mafm | what's a clean libtool? different versions, vanilla without possible distro patches? |
| 16:13.53 | poolio | vanilla I would guess |
| 16:14.48 | mafm | /usr/bin/ld: warning: libtcl8.5.so, needed by ./.libs/libbu.so, not found (try using -rpath or -rpath-link) |
| 16:14.48 | mafm | ./.libs/libbu.so: undefined reference to `Tcl_ResetResult' |
| 16:14.48 | mafm | ./.libs/libbu.so: undefined reference to `Tcl_SetObjResult' |
| 16:14.49 | mafm | ... |
| 16:14.55 | mafm | is this your error too? |
| 16:23.57 | poolio | Yep. |
| 16:25.40 | mafm | :S |
| 16:25.44 | mafm | version? |
| 16:26.00 | mafm | ii libtool 1.5.26-1 Generic library support script |
| 16:40.28 | poolio | 1.5.26-2 here. It's more than just libtool, I tried out a vanilla libtool and that didn't fix it |
| 16:41.27 | mafm | :S |
| 16:43.23 | poolio | mafm: Just softlink libtcl8.5.so.0 to libtcl8.5.so for now |
| 16:45.40 | mafm | what vanilla libtool did you try? I installed the one from 'stable' distro, which is .22, and it just seems to work |
| 16:46.02 | mafm | or maybe it didn't reach the part failing yet, not sure :D |
| 16:46.49 | poolio | mafm: haven't tried vanilla, sorry |
| 16:47.24 | mafm | ok |
| 16:47.30 | mafm | but this .22 one seems to fix it, yuep |
| 16:47.32 | mafm | :) |
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| 17:37.26 | mafm | does anybody know if it's worth patching the 3rd party tools for compiler warnings/errors? |
| 17:42.04 | ``Erik | yes, debian modifies libtool to "optimize" the link line |
| 17:42.17 | ``Erik | the effect is that they strip out critical information needed to compile BRL-CAD |
| 17:43.26 | ``Erik | mafm: don't worry too much about language barriers, both brlcad and I have lived in non-english speaking countries for several years, we will ask if we don't think we understand what you intend to say... |
| 17:45.37 | ``Erik | now if I recall the issues with the debian libtool correctly from last time I chased that down, a system installed tcl85 will still work... and I THINK debian just picked up 85 into testing, d'no if that's floated to ubuntu or other derivatives just yet |
| 17:45.57 | ``Erik | may have to redo the debian script in BRL-CAD to use the system one |
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| 17:55.52 | mafm | the language doubts were not meant to clear up misunderstandings, it's because I was updating my CV :) |
| 17:56.29 | mafm | well, to avoid the hassle I just put that tcl8.5 dir in the ld.so.conf file |
| 17:58.56 | mafm | bah, a new related error :S |
| 18:05.11 | ``Erik | oh? |
| 18:05.51 | mafm | before that ... in libbu you use a temp.c to make temporary files... why not use mktemp calls instead? aren't they portable enough? |
| 18:06.36 | mafm | ``Erik: the new error is: http://rafb.net/p/YDu6XN14.html |
| 18:37.01 | poolio | mafm: I got there with the system libtool, linking libtcl8.5.so.0 to .so |
| 18:41.18 | mafm | but it's not working for me |
| 18:41.35 | mafm | maybe I'm missing some additional library or something |
| 18:55.20 | ``Erik | looks like libXi.so isn't being picked up for some reason :/ |
| 18:59.24 | mafm | ``Erik: in libbu you use a temp.c to make temporary files... why not use mktemp calls instead? aren't they portable enough? |
| 19:00.07 | ``Erik | mktemp is actually bad, mkstemp is better |
| 19:00.54 | ``Erik | mktemp also doesn't work on all platforms, like old obscure ones (crayos? vms?) or stupid ones (windows?) iirc |
| 19:01.37 | ``Erik | *looklooklook* |
| 19:01.44 | alex_joni | heh, stupid :) |
| 19:02.07 | mafm | doesn't work in windows? |
| 19:02.09 | mafm | hmm |
| 19:02.23 | mafm | there was a similar issue with Aqsis |
| 19:02.28 | ``Erik | ah, looks like it's a "safe" wrapper for mkstemp() with file marshalling |
| 19:02.50 | mafm | I think that they used in there a relatively clean workaround, not so huge as in libbu |
| 19:02.54 | ``Erik | and a very low level last ditch attempt |
| 19:03.02 | ``Erik | huge as bu? temp.c is tiny |
| 19:03.18 | ``Erik | and works pretty much everywhere O.o :D |
| 19:03.23 | mafm | well, I'm talking about 10 lines or so |
| 19:03.34 | ``Erik | notes that aqsis does not work on as many platforms as BRL-CAD |
| 19:03.36 | mafm | not in the hundreds of lines |
| 19:04.35 | ``Erik | most of temp.c is error checking of some form or another *shrug* |
| 19:04.40 | mafm | well, that's the question... it's in the ToDo or Buglist to remove that code, so I thought about that... but if it's not portable enough... :) |
| 19:04.55 | ``Erik | a lot of the portability isn't NEEDED anymore |
| 19:05.05 | ``Erik | we've stripped out some vax gould and crayos code already |
| 19:05.21 | ``Erik | because no one uses 70's or 80's computers anymore |
| 19:05.33 | mafm | :) |
| 19:06.00 | ``Erik | also; few os's leave dangling file handles when an app is closed anymore |
| 19:06.07 | mafm | In the TODO: * libbu routine to make a temp file reliably/consistently |
| 19:06.31 | ``Erik | hrm, probably means brlcad spotted a place where mkstemp failed |
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| 19:08.09 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30627 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: add gillich to the contributors list for his g-sat importer |
| 19:08.28 | mafm | I see |
| 19:08.40 | mafm | well, I already produced a patch, even if not very useful |
| 19:09.53 | mafm | if I have time maybe I'll do something better during the selection process :) |
| 19:10.13 | *** part/#brlcad gedex (n=gedex@222.124.185.169) | |
| 19:11.40 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 19:12.30 | mafm | hallo yukonbob |
| 19:16.58 | mafm | have to go now |
| 19:17.25 | mafm | bye |
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| 20:58.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30629 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.bat: Mods to get rid of complaints about nul. |
| 20:58.07 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30630 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/archer.bat: Move "ECHO OFF" up in the file. |
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| 00:32.52 | brlcad | poolio: you would have had to of cleared out the build via distclean and rerun autogen.sh |
| 00:36.44 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30632 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: bu_temp_file() _is_ a secure replacement to all of the various temp file routines. remote related todo entry. |
| 00:40.41 | brlcad | ``Erik: windows does not have mkstemp() (nor anything similarly equivalent), so I implemented it |
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| 02:35.34 | yukonbob | ??What!!!! Windows is missing a useful, security feature? Unpossible. |
| 02:44.02 | ``Erik | ah, it was only windows? |
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| 03:29.10 | starseeker | breaths a sigh of deep relief - there are many quirks, different behavioral cases and a slew of features still to deal with, but the most difficult hurdle is now cleared - a proof of concept smooth tire-like surface has been created. |
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| 03:29.25 | starseeker | howdy :-() |
| 03:29.30 | starseeker | er :-) rather |
| 03:29.35 | pacman87 | hi starseeker |
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| 08:53.11 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30634 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: mike's contributions have been code -- his work on src/external/Cubit |
| 08:55.38 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30635 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): apply mafm's sf patch 1934710 that apply constness and string.h to a handful of files. |
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| 14:01.47 | brlcad | yawns |
| 14:46.26 | ``Erik | indeed O.o |
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| 17:02.33 | brlcad | hello andrecastelo |
| 17:02.42 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad ] |
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| 22:15.53 | brlcad | burps |
| 22:17.15 | alex_joni | odd sounds are coming from brlcad today :) |
| 22:20.40 | brlcad | :) |
| 22:21.07 | brlcad | pulls out the mixer and some liquors and works up something delicious |
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| 03:24.31 | brlcad | ponders coffee |
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| 05:21.31 | PrezKennedy | its hard to have a fun party when the movie line-up is two musicals, one being Rent |
| 07:18.56 | Axman6 | i think i've seen rent. not really my thing |
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| 13:41.41 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, there? |
| 13:41.56 | hippieindamakin8 | can u tell me where is the nsis installer for windows? |
| 14:08.46 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad are u there |
| 14:49.52 | alex_joni | hippieindamakin8: patience is the key word around OSS projects :) |
| 15:15.24 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 15:19.19 | hippieindamakin8 | hey alex_joni .. |
| 15:19.48 | alex_joni | 'lo |
| 15:30.07 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 15:55.38 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: of course I could tell you where it is at -- the bigger question is should I ... it's really not hard to find :) |
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| 16:50.59 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) |
| 17:09.01 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@89.181.58.171) | |
| 17:09.14 | mafm | hi |
| 17:11.50 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
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| 17:23.32 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad and mafm |
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| 18:11.36 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, there? |
| 18:18.29 | brlcad | nope |
| 18:20.33 | brlcad | seriously, humor aside -- that's bad irc etiquette -- just ask or say whatever you intended, don't ask if someone is "here" |
| 18:20.45 | brlcad | bleh |
| 18:20.51 | alex_joni | now you upset him :/ |
| 18:21.05 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 18:21.19 | alex_joni | hippieindamakin8: are you familiar with DATAJA? |
| 18:21.28 | hippieindamakin8 | no |
| 18:21.39 | alex_joni | Don't Ask to Ask, Just Ask |
| 18:21.57 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, I patched the nsi script |
| 18:22.01 | alex_joni | (means it's always better starting with the actual question you have, not asking for permission on asking a question) |
| 18:22.12 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 18:22.53 | brlcad | yeah, if you missed my earlier comment -- it's bad irc etiquette to ask if someone is there, so you know |
| 18:23.14 | brlcad | and glad to hear it (re the patch), will take a look in a bit |
| 18:27.13 | hippieindamakin8 | sorry for that :( |
| 18:27.51 | brlcad | touchy |
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| 18:46.13 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad the problem with the nsi installer was that the defaul install dir wasnt program files rt |
| 18:51.45 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:57.39 | hippieindamakin8 | hello Mr. d_rossberg |
| 18:58.58 | d_rossberg | hello hippieindamakin8 |
| 19:04.44 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: where did you post the patch? I didn't get a notification? |
| 19:04.52 | hippieindamakin8 | i am posting it rt now |
| 19:04.59 | brlcad | ah |
| 19:12.38 | d_rossberg | hippieindamakin8: i'll have a look at your posting tomorrow |
| 19:13.34 | hippieindamakin8 | its ohk Mr d_rossberg |
| 19:14.06 | hippieindamakin8 | sent it brlcad.. |
| 19:16.18 | brlcad | got the notification, thanks |
| 19:16.21 | hippieindamakin8 | addition of this line would solve the problem |
| 19:16.39 | hippieindamakin8 | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:17.05 | hippieindamakin8 | :) sorry for repeated asking if u were here .. |
| 19:19.05 | brlcad | not a big deal, just pointing it out as you've done it many times now :) |
| 19:19.31 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i know :P |
| 19:19.42 | hippieindamakin8 | i was unaware of that as well |
| 19:20.18 | brlcad | it happens more frequently to people that don't stay on irc, you shouldn't disconnect |
| 19:21.32 | hippieindamakin8 | so seen the patch ? |
| 19:59.17 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: patience |
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| 20:06.35 | *** join/#brlcad spike__ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 20:16.07 | brlcad | hello spike__ |
| 20:21.13 | alex_joni | brlcad: how goes the GSoC ? |
| 20:22.51 | spike__ | hey brlcad |
| 20:25.04 | brlcad | alex_joni: a lot of reading and commenting |
| 20:25.20 | brlcad | already been going for 4 hours today, and haven't even hit up 10% |
| 20:34.56 | hippieindamakin8 | :) yukonbob i shall |
| 20:36.42 | alex_joni | brlcad: ouch ;) |
| 20:38.47 | *** join/#brlcad sCOTTo (n=scott@124-170-152-139.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 21:05.45 | hippieindamakin8 | gnite fellas |
| 21:06.30 | brlcad | cya |
| 21:06.34 | brlcad | hello sCOTTo |
| 21:06.44 | brlcad | from down under, neat |
| 21:32.37 | mafm | brlcad: maybe you should give me privileges to review these applications... I would finish quickly! |
| 21:32.45 | mafm | reject everything but mine :) |
| 21:33.07 | brlcad | mafm: heh :) |
| 21:34.14 | mafm | is it that bad really? how many applications did you got? |
| 21:34.54 | brlcad | far fewer than levels last year, but quality is *considerably* higher |
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| 21:36.00 | mafm | what about the extension, did you got many more in the extended period? |
| 21:36.09 | mafm | i.e. this week |
| 21:36.24 | spike__ | lol, i still havent submitted mine |
| 21:36.27 | brlcad | a few |
| 21:36.59 | spike__ | extensions are both a blessing and a curse |
| 21:37.13 | mafm | some people that I've talked to said that they only got about 10% more, by Friday |
| 21:37.23 | brlcad | so far, there're probably less than a half-dozen really strong competitors |
| 21:37.45 | brlcad | s/competitors/applicants/ |
| 21:38.07 | mafm | s/applicants/gladiators in the arena/ :) |
| 21:38.09 | brlcad | competing for our couple slots |
| 21:38.33 | mafm | not bad for you, then :) |
| 21:38.41 | brlcad | so if the application is *really* strong, that already puts them in a 30-50% chances range |
| 21:39.49 | brlcad | (last year odds were around 20% for the strong applicants for bz) |
| 21:40.02 | mafm | spike__: at least I hope that they don't extend it again! |
| 21:40.23 | brlcad | not likely |
| 21:40.34 | brlcad | nobody is asking for it |
| 21:40.53 | mafm | good :) |
| 21:46.03 | spike__ | mafm: theres no way |
| 22:17.25 | sCOTTo | hello |
| 22:17.33 | brlcad | howdy sCOTTo |
| 22:17.33 | sCOTTo | sorry ive been looking after kids :) |
| 22:17.42 | brlcad | they tend to need looking after |
| 22:17.58 | sCOTTo | yup |
| 22:18.23 | sCOTTo | ur tetlling me... im 29, my wife is 20, my youngest is 6 months - eldest is 20 mnths... its hard work! |
| 22:18.44 | sCOTTo | tetlling...lol... early morning typos are always the best :) |
| 22:20.13 | brlcad | niice :) |
| 22:21.30 | sCOTTo | so anyway... why am i here? |
| 22:21.50 | brlcad | because you want to work on BRL-CAD |
| 22:22.15 | brlcad | either that, or are trying to escape your wife or kids :) |
| 22:22.33 | sCOTTo | errr... oh yes! the guys in #cam, #cad etc told me to ask YOU all a question... I dont personally work with CAD atm - i am a computer consultant who works out issues for ppl.... I have a customer that asked me a question... |
| 22:23.07 | sCOTTo | he wants to output a file from CAD to STEP or IGES - do you guys know how to do that? |
| 22:24.05 | mafm | waves bye bye |
| 22:24.14 | sCOTTo | waves back |
| 22:24.31 | brlcad | hm, never noticed #cad or #cam .. seems to be non-open-source |
| 22:25.12 | brlcad | sCOTTo: it entirely depends on what cad software you're dealing with -- most cad systems have an exporter for step or iges or both |
| 22:25.28 | sCOTTo | AUTOCAD i think - the most common |
| 22:25.39 | brlcad | heh |
| 22:25.40 | sCOTTo | this customer is building a motor design or something... |
| 22:25.43 | brlcad | the most common for CADD |
| 22:25.51 | brlcad | but not the most common overall |
| 22:26.02 | sCOTTo | i mean if you can show him WHY he would move to BRL - he might come over ;) |
| 22:26.31 | sCOTTo | im already half way there selling him on Linux as a better answer for the situation because of system resource usage :) |
| 22:27.06 | brlcad | oh, if you were asking about how step/iges relate to brl-cad -- we have an iges exporter completed, and a step exporter under development |
| 22:27.39 | brlcad | it is a non-preserving format, though -- you loose topological information (turns it into an explicit representation) |
| 22:27.41 | sCOTTo | wow thats GREAT |
| 22:27.47 | brlcad | at least for iges |
| 22:27.52 | brlcad | step preserves |
| 22:28.07 | sCOTTo | ok... so will is import his current work into itself? |
| 22:28.34 | brlcad | there are lots of issues for production use -- depends what his requirements are |
| 22:29.07 | brlcad | brl-cad's strength is actually in the CAE domain right now -- we're working on our usability problems for expanding into design and other uses |
| 22:29.08 | sCOTTo | put it this way - can i paste an email in PM for you to see? |
| 22:29.25 | brlcad | sure |
| 22:29.35 | sCOTTo | thanks |
| 22:29.56 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/diagrams/Industry_Diagram.png.html |
| 22:30.14 | brlcad | that may be useful to see where our strengths are at |
| 22:30.49 | brlcad | analysis, development, and some design (but not a strength until we improve usability) |
| 22:32.02 | sCOTTo | is brl free? |
| 22:32.08 | sCOTTo | or opensource? |
| 22:32.22 | brlcad | "yes"? :) |
| 22:32.27 | brlcad | free open source software |
| 22:32.36 | sCOTTo | awesome!!! |
| 22:32.39 | brlcad | source code and all is available |
| 22:32.57 | sCOTTo | how does it stack so far with the expensive software? |
| 22:33.12 | brlcad | that's what the diagram hints at |
| 22:33.35 | brlcad | we have a ton of functionality, more than any other open source solution by several hundred man-years of effort |
| 22:34.16 | sCOTTo | is it downloadable through APT in linux yet? |
| 22:34.17 | brlcad | but usability is a weakness -- steep learning curve, once you get over that curve we're fairly on par with the big guns for most cad purposes |
| 22:34.29 | brlcad | there's no debian maintainer |
| 22:34.37 | sCOTTo | is there an easy guide to teach someone with? |
| 22:34.41 | sCOTTo | bugger |
| 22:34.51 | sCOTTo | uses ubuntu |
| 22:34.52 | brlcad | there is lots of documentation |
| 22:35.10 | brlcad | it's pretty much requisite to get *anywhere* with the system |
| 22:35.19 | brlcad | it's not discoverable |
| 22:35.47 | brlcad | like I said, known limitation, something we're working on (a better new gui) |
| 22:36.16 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/gallery/ shows much of some of the sorts of things that are done with brl-cad though |
| 22:37.31 | sCOTTo | ok so are there windows dists yet? is it hard to install in linux? etc |
| 22:37.52 | brlcad | there is a windows dist |
| 22:38.15 | sCOTTo | im asking what i know HE will ask... if I find it to be a good project I will banner you on my website and promote the software as a better alternative to the known industry standards... |
| 22:38.16 | brlcad | it's usually very easy to install on most any OS |
| 22:38.51 | brlcad | debian/ubuntu have a busted libtool, one of the few being resolved lately |
| 22:39.16 | sCOTTo | there is the email i got |
| 22:39.28 | brlcad | sCOTTo: be interested in hearing what you think |
| 22:39.34 | sCOTTo | great |
| 22:39.45 | brlcad | like I said, there are a whole category of improvements being worked on |
| 22:39.52 | sCOTTo | is there a way to fix the libtool? |
| 22:40.51 | brlcad | CAD is a huge undertaking to get momentum on in open source -- BRL-CAD is, however, by far the most developed option available (with growing momentum) |
| 22:41.28 | brlcad | yeah, you either run libtoolize on another system with an unmodified libool, or you install an unmodified libtool |
| 22:41.57 | sCOTTo | errr im not 100% with linux yet - can you say that in english :) LOL |
| 22:43.22 | brlcad | one of our build steps is "./autogen.sh" .. that first step will fail on a stock ubuntu/debian system if you're compiling from source right now because the debian devs chose to "optimize" libtool (in a way that breaks it) |
| 22:43.44 | brlcad | if you download a source tarball, you can skip the autogen.sh step |
| 22:43.51 | brlcad | and there shouldn't be a problem |
| 22:44.10 | sCOTTo | ok - is there a DOC that will take me through an install without doing that? |
| 22:44.12 | sCOTTo | :) |
| 22:44.34 | brlcad | yeah, INSTALL describes it and/or I can walk you through it here |
| 22:44.57 | sCOTTo | ok cool |
| 22:45.05 | ``Erik | debians broken libtool isn't an issue if you get the stable tarball, I think... it's just the libtoolize if you modify stuff or check out via subversion |
| 22:45.13 | sCOTTo | thanks i will be installling into my ubuntu in 15 minutes - but first...... |
| 22:45.17 | brlcad | if you download the source tarball from sourceforge, you should be able to run ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized && make && sudo make install |
| 22:45.19 | sCOTTo | feels nature calling! |
| 22:45.49 | sCOTTo | brb |
| 22:51.53 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.69.126) | |
| 22:51.55 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 22:52.07 | andrecastelo | :) |
| 22:52.09 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 22:57.12 | sCOTTo | brlcad: pm |
| 23:00.59 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hey, can i pm you ? |
| 23:02.03 | brlcad | andrecastelo: sure |
| 23:02.11 | andrecastelo | ok |
| 23:07.00 | *** join/#brlcad spik1 (n=spike@fomalhaut.acm.jhu.edu) | |
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| 00:27.13 | *** part/#brlcad sCOTTo (n=scott@124-170-152-139.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 01:36.10 | *** join/#brlcad DaytonaJohn (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 02:34.49 | brlcad | howdy DaytonaJohn |
| 02:49.08 | PrezKennedy | howdy brlcad :) |
| 03:01.08 | DaytonaJohn | hi, I was surfing |
| 03:04.13 | DaytonaJohn | brlcad: Are you there? |
| 03:11.43 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 03:36.01 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 03:53.59 | brlcad | oops, daytona be gone |
| 03:54.05 | PrezKennedy | he ran away! |
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| 06:21.02 | brlcad | heya pacman87, how's the primitive going? |
| 06:21.32 | pacman87 | still working on it |
| 06:21.43 | brlcad | what kind of notification(s) do you get when your app is updated? |
| 06:21.44 | pacman87 | i might not have time to do full integration |
| 06:23.20 | pacman87 | email sent to my gmail account |
| 06:23.33 | pacman87 | which i dont' check all that often |
| 06:24.42 | pacman87 | the GSoC site still just says 'ranking in progress' |
| 06:24.49 | pacman87 | no mention of the new comment |
| 06:26.08 | brlcad | well, you have a question :) |
| 06:26.21 | pacman87 | yeah, i'm reading/responding now |
| 06:35.52 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30638 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Switch from attempt at derivative fixing to additional point measurement. |
| 06:35.53 | brlcad | cool |
| 06:36.04 | brlcad | heh |
| 06:38.16 | starseeker | figures that's easier than figuring out the doggone derivative mess... |
| 06:38.43 | starseeker | does it create the example for you brlcad? |
| 06:39.07 | starseeker | should look a bit more like a tire should now |
| 06:42.52 | brlcad | can't look at it atm |
| 06:43.09 | starseeker | np |
| 06:43.55 | starseeker | it's still just a shape tweak, no tread yet |
| 06:44.19 | starseeker | really should sleep now... |
| 06:53.49 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 06:54.14 | spike_ | quick Q, when exactly is the GSoC app due tomorrow? 5pm west coast time? |
| 07:02.19 | brlcad | heh |
| 07:02.43 | brlcad | have to check the timeline |
| 07:03.15 | brlcad | it is a firm deadline unlike homework assigments, nothing we can do about it :P |
| 07:03.30 | spike_ | haha, true |
| 07:04.13 | spike_ | brlcad: could i ask you a quick question? |
| 07:04.32 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 07:04.33 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 07:05.02 | spike_ | heh |
| 07:05.34 | *** join/#brlcad paulproteus (n=paulprot@wide-rose.makesad.us) | |
| 07:05.40 | paulproteus | waves to spike_ |
| 07:06.16 | spike_ | kicks Asheesh |
| 07:06.21 | paulproteus | Zing! |
| 07:06.22 | brlcad | makehappy, not makesad |
| 07:06.29 | spike_ | lol |
| 07:06.55 | spike_ | so anyways, my question is about expat and the fcollada library |
| 07:08.14 | spike_ | i *think* if i were to write a colldada converter, i would first use expat (and xml parser) to get a document tree, then i would use the fcollada utility to get the 'objects' out of the tree |
| 07:08.33 | spike_ | but i'm not really sure how they are different |
| 07:10.01 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:10.08 | paulproteus | brlcad, Nice to see you, too. (-; |
| 07:10.10 | brlcad | i'm not familiar with fcollada |
| 07:10.25 | brlcad | at least not beyond what it basically is and does |
| 07:10.40 | brlcad | whether it includes its own parser or not, the license they use, etc |
| 07:12.20 | spike_ | roger |
| 07:12.38 | paulproteus | The license compatibility question is a big one. |
| 07:13.27 | clock_ | paulproteus: problems with compatibility between a licence of brlcad and another program? |
| 07:13.43 | spike_ | pretty sure expat is open source |
| 07:14.00 | spike_ | not so sure about fcollada |
| 07:14.40 | paulproteus | http://www.feelingsoftware.com/content/view/55/72 indicates it's under the MIT License, that's good news. |
| 07:14.50 | spike_ | smiles |
| 07:15.36 | spike_ | so i think im good to go |
| 07:15.45 | spike_ | in the license department |
| 07:15.52 | brlcad | mit is fine |
| 07:16.01 | paulproteus | fcollada seems to use the libxml2 XML parser, so you won't need to separately use something like expat, it looks like. |
| 07:16.22 | brlcad | wonders if paulproteus is going to write it for him too :) |
| 07:17.02 | spike_ | shakes his head, no! |
| 07:17.10 | brlcad | :) |
| 07:17.14 | paulproteus | Nah, I'm just here for moral support and IRC chat. |
| 07:17.31 | paulproteus | I'll have enough GSoC apps to read as mentor for CC. |
| 07:18.32 | brlcad | good ol commons |
| 07:19.52 | paulproteus | (-: |
| 07:24.43 | paulproteus | Burly CAD |
| 07:25.02 | paulproteus | /join #grlcad |
| 07:25.48 | brlcad | heh |
| 07:28.16 | pacman87 | girly CAD? |
| 07:28.48 | brlcad | lolcads |
| 07:29.36 | pacman87 | im in ur .g, sweepin ur primitives |
| 07:30.44 | spike_ | laughs |
| 07:31.29 | brlcad | hehe |
| 07:31.41 | paulproteus | It's getting late, so I'm going to go and sweep. |
| 07:31.48 | brlcad | cheers |
| 07:32.06 | spike_ | cya paulproteus |
| 07:32.25 | pacman87 | i read that as 'brlcad cheers', not 'brlcad: cheers' |
| 07:35.10 | brlcad | cheers: pacman87 |
| 07:35.53 | spike_ | realizes this is probably what usually happens as it gets later and later |
| 07:37.15 | pacman87 | i should go to bed, but i'm a page deep in vector calculations, and i don't want to start over to figure out where i was and where i was going tomorrow |
| 07:38.04 | brlcad | spike_: nah, it's like this most of the time, just the topic changes or it's quiet ;) |
| 07:38.34 | brlcad | grumbles at an applicant wasting his time being lazy |
| 07:40.26 | spike_ | :-D |
| 07:41.44 | spike_ | who ya grumblin at brlcad? |
| 07:42.26 | brlcad | big hint: if I leave a comment asking for more detail .. it probably means you should provide more detail instead of giving me a mouthful about your "working principle" that amounts to blind faith |
| 07:43.41 | brlcad | just grumbling at an applicant that isn't going to get slotted |
| 07:43.46 | paulproteus | Heh. |
| 07:44.27 | paulproteus | Other hint: If you don't know what more details should be given, ask! |
| 07:44.55 | brlcad | he was told specific areas even |
| 07:44.59 | paulproteus | It's amazing how people would rather just fill text in a form rather than actually talk to the people evaluating their applications. |
| 07:45.04 | paulproteus | brlcad, Gack. |
| 07:45.15 | paulproteus | Sounds like you give better feedback than we have been then. (-; |
| 07:45.22 | spike_ | lol |
| 07:45.23 | brlcad | i read them all in detail |
| 07:45.33 | brlcad | and at least try to reply in detail |
| 07:45.48 | clock_ | forms are a sign of bureaucratization of society |
| 07:46.02 | paulproteus | clock_, People preferring forms to chat is the sign, really. |
| 07:46.08 | brlcad | even for the "bad" ones, as everyone gets at least one get-out-of-jail card |
| 07:46.16 | paulproteus | That's very friendly of you. (-: |
| 07:46.25 | clock_ | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bureaucratization |
| 07:46.37 | spike_ | hey brlcad |
| 07:46.43 | brlcad | yeah, I'm always amazed by very detailed applications from people that I've never heard a single word from before their submission |
| 07:46.55 | spike_ | if i submitted now would i perhaps see feedback before the deadline tomorrow? |
| 07:47.15 | spike_ | ive been kind of holding out because ive been wanting to research and look up stuff more... |
| 07:47.16 | clock_ | are they submissions for the GSoC? |
| 07:47.23 | spike_ | wish i had known you gave feedback |
| 07:47.27 | spike_ | yeah |
| 07:47.42 | clock_ | it's heavily underpaid isn't it? |
| 07:48.01 | paulproteus | clock_, You say that because you don't know how much CC pays our summer interns. |
| 07:48.04 | brlcad | spike_: depends on the content |
| 07:48.07 | clock_ | like a student summer job? |
| 07:48.12 | clock_ | paulproteus: CC? |
| 07:48.33 | paulproteus | creativecommons.org; we have IRL tech interns as well as some GSoC people. |
| 07:48.45 | clock_ | Do CC pay even less? |
| 07:48.58 | paulproteus | Aye, there's the rub. |
| 07:49.43 | spike_ | brlcad: ok, if you did reply though would it be through email |
| 07:49.49 | clock_ | Aren't you worried that people who are willing to work for underpaid wage will not be the very good ones? |
| 07:50.00 | brlcad | spike_: not likely |
| 07:50.13 | spike_ | on chat then? |
| 07:50.27 | pacman87 | spike_: comments on your app will send an email to your gmail account |
| 07:50.30 | brlcad | if I have to e-mail, it's a last resort just in case the web app didn't send a notice |
| 07:50.39 | spike_ | kk |
| 07:50.55 | brlcad | the web app isn't entirely reliable at times |
| 07:51.13 | pacman87 | unfortunately, they don't change the status to 'unread comments' |
| 07:53.09 | paulproteus | clock_, It's a reasonable thing to worry about... |
| 07:53.17 | brlcad | throws in the towel for the day after 16 hours of reading and commenting |
| 07:54.07 | pacman87 | that's dedication |
| 07:56.14 | brlcad | clock_: i wouldn't be -- there are plenty of high-demand CS jobs where applicants line up and are willing to be an intern for *free* for the chance to get noticed and become hired down the road |
| 07:57.15 | clock_ | brlcad: then you have a different situation than here |
| 07:57.22 | brlcad | there's also plenty of college jobs that pay both more and less -- I got paid less than GSoC my first couple years as a student |
| 07:57.25 | clock_ | Here we are scarce and we select where we want to go |
| 07:57.35 | paulproteus | I think the good ones are scarce. |
| 07:57.45 | paulproteus | 6/8 of the CC intern applicants were pretty terrible. |
| 07:57.51 | clock_ | and make goofy faces if the workplace doesn't have enough flowers, bad view etc. |
| 07:57.54 | paulproteus | checks if this is publicly logged |
| 07:57.58 | brlcad | then later got paid much much more, but had gsoc been around, I would have gladly been interested in participating -- the experience is rather unique |
| 07:57.59 | pacman87 | brlcad: wouldn't that be for jobs with low demand? |
| 07:58.05 | paulproteus | Okay, wow re: bad view, enough flowers. |
| 07:58.24 | paulproteus | Luckily the other two applicants were actually pretty great. |
| 07:58.44 | spike_ | submitted application |
| 07:58.50 | brlcad | pacman87: er, I guess I meant from the employer's perspective -- they'll have just one or two internships a year, hundreds of applicants |
| 07:59.16 | clock_ | do you have a high rate of unemployment in the US? |
| 07:59.28 | clock_ | Because of the collapse of the subprime mortgages? |
| 07:59.36 | brlcad | heh |
| 08:00.04 | paulproteus | Not yet, at least. |
| 08:00.28 | clock_ | Like there was an article in Czech news today or yesterday that it pays off for wealthier Czech citizens to buy off some cheap properties on Florida! |
| 08:01.05 | clock_ | But some people in the discussion pointed out there are hurricanes |
| 08:01.08 | brlcad | not really a high rate in the least |
| 08:01.13 | brlcad | something like 5% |
| 08:01.48 | clock_ | What an absurd idea - post-communist Czech would buy off properties in the always economically strong (discutably former) beacon of democracy! |
| 08:01.50 | brlcad | czech is probably on par or higher if I had to guess |
| 08:01.52 | clock_ | Our worlds are changing |
| 08:02.08 | paulproteus | Our words are changing. |
| 08:02.12 | brlcad | yeah, 6.6 per 2007 |
| 08:02.14 | clock_ | yes :) |
| 08:02.46 | clock_ | or there was an article the most modern trains rolling around Zurich are actually built in Prague |
| 08:03.01 | clock_ | shiny new silent doubledecker trains |
| 08:04.03 | pacman87 | finished my vector calculations, it's 3am, goodnight |
| 08:04.09 | brlcad | cya pacman87 ! |
| 08:04.31 | pacman87 | cheers |
| 08:06.11 | spike_ | 4am here |
| 08:06.17 | spike_ | /yawn |
| 08:06.28 | paulproteus | Congrats pacman87, good night! |
| 08:12.02 | spike_ | alright well, i'm ridiculously tired, i'll probably be around tomorrow after one of my tests. gnight all |
| 08:12.11 | paulproteus | Okay, that's enough for this day for real. |
| 08:12.15 | paulproteus | vanishes in a puff of smoke |
| 08:15.01 | brlcad | :) |
| 08:15.15 | brlcad | snickers |
| 08:15.32 | clock_ | vanishes in a rain of anvils and pianoes |
| 09:23.59 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:26.38 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:27.21 | mafm | hi |
| 11:25.33 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 11:42.36 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 12:14.10 | brlcad | hey mafm d_rossberg |
| 12:16.21 | d_rossberg | huhu |
| 12:18.39 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: i replied to your comment |
| 12:22.36 | d_rossberg | pacman87: i've read your answer and replied to it :) |
| 12:25.47 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: thanks for the reply. i've got to run now, but i'll answer fully later |
| 12:26.37 | d_rossberg | no problem, same to me |
| 13:00.43 | *** join/#brlcad MTee (n=MT@41.233.136.19) | |
| 13:00.57 | MTee | Hello |
| 13:02.10 | mafm | yo |
| 13:03.44 | MTee | I want to know something that's really confusing me .. am i required to know "all the stuff" before actually sending the application ? |
| 13:04.30 | *** join/#brlcad camcorder (n=draco@81.213.157.51) | |
| 13:04.51 | camcorder | hi |
| 13:05.01 | MTee | or am i allowed to state in my application that there are some topics that i'm going to learn about ? |
| 13:05.28 | camcorder | i'm postulating about web-based solid geometry model repository idea |
| 13:05.51 | camcorder | it looks like late but I just finished my exams |
| 13:06.12 | camcorder | my question is, I'm also thinking implementing 'ready object' importing from this repository |
| 13:06.30 | camcorder | but that might be fairly overbloated from the initial idea |
| 13:09.01 | MTee | are there any mentors here ? |
| 13:13.34 | MTee | what are the "Hacking" rules ? |
| 13:20.03 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 13:43.57 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54873C4F.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:56.28 | brlcad | MTee: of course not, but that doesn't prevent any applicant from providing a lot of idea about the topic at hand, paths for implementation, and doing some basic homework to see how that fits in with BRL-CAD |
| 13:57.07 | brlcad | camcorder: what is ready object importing? |
| 13:57.47 | camcorder | brlcad, ie. importing a solid design from repository (as in you can do importing code snipplets) |
| 14:00.49 | ``Erik | "hacking rules"? |
| 14:01.26 | brlcad | camcorder: for what it's worth -- there are more submissions for the web-based solid model repository than for any other idea, and most of them fail to impress -- I'd encourage considering other topics (or coming up with a really damn good proposal for that idea) |
| 14:02.53 | camcorder | brlcad, well I'm actually studying computer engineering, and would like to specialize on CAD software |
| 14:03.19 | camcorder | i've tried brlcad in past, and regular user of Autocad, Cad key for various other stuff |
| 14:03.48 | camcorder | i've never coded for a CAD software before, however i think GSoC would be a good entry point for me |
| 14:04.08 | camcorder | i wish I had my exams finished earlier and (I heard GSoC earlier) than we could discuss it even more |
| 14:04.42 | camcorder | brlcad, is there any idea that you would suggest me? for an entry level CAD software developer |
| 14:04.49 | brlcad | yeah, submitting this late is going to make it a lot harder to polish up the application -- it puts a lot more work into your hands without much time for feedback |
| 14:05.05 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
| 14:05.41 | brlcad | not really, there are ideas on the page that span from very basic to rather hard -- depends on your coding and math experience |
| 14:05.46 | brlcad | howdy psilva |
| 14:06.45 | brlcad | ~tickle prasad_ |
| 14:06.45 | ibot | ACTION jumps on prasad_, yelling "TICKLE FIGHT!!!!" |
| 14:08.41 | ``Erik | <-- covers his innocent eyes |
| 14:08.42 | brlcad | i just wouldn't recommend the web repository idea -- it's been proposed to death (probably because people "get it") |
| 14:09.02 | prasad_ | hey hey |
| 14:09.04 | camcorder | i'm afraid yeah |
| 14:09.12 | camcorder | brlcad, what about dwg importer? |
| 14:09.22 | camcorder | or converter |
| 14:09.24 | brlcad | but they don't get what is involved or how to sell it or implement it (so far) |
| 14:10.03 | camcorder | if you're here, can we discuss on my proposal? |
| 14:10.05 | brlcad | camcorder: how would you propose doing that? |
| 14:10.27 | camcorder | brlcad, dwg converter? |
| 14:10.31 | brlcad | yep |
| 14:10.45 | camcorder | (totally assumption) |
| 14:10.50 | camcorder | dwg specs are open |
| 14:10.59 | camcorder | (that's not an assumption) |
| 14:11.03 | brlcad | 'orly' |
| 14:11.18 | camcorder | orly? |
| 14:12.23 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: may I propose a web repository idea? (I actually don't know what it is) |
| 14:12.34 | SongOfTheWaves | I guess it's some kind of toolshed where you store webs? |
| 14:12.41 | SongOfTheWaves | Spider web repository? |
| 14:12.42 | brlcad | basically |
| 14:13.03 | brlcad | more of a bike shed |
| 14:13.34 | ``Erik | you can propose anything you want, the web repository one has several proposals already, though, so it'd be... competitive :) |
| 14:14.54 | MTee | what about the geometry converter ? |
| 14:15.41 | brlcad | what about it? |
| 14:15.53 | MTee | are there many proposals ? |
| 14:17.00 | camcorder | brlcad, isn't it possible to implement dwg specification? |
| 14:17.25 | camcorder | brlcad, of course it would be very optimistic to expect 100% compatibility in 3 months |
| 14:17.35 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
| 14:17.37 | MTee | I meant the "New geometry converter", specifically .dwg or .3ds |
| 14:17.38 | camcorder | brlcad, but that would be a very beginning |
| 14:17.44 | brlcad | MTee: not too many -- but it will be a bit tricky -- the ones that are most important are very hard, so the application would have to show strong competence and a good plan |
| 14:18.18 | mafm | bike shed? I suggest blue! |
| 14:18.26 | brlcad | camcorder: it's all just code, anything is possible - or at least anything can be faked with a good demo :) |
| 14:18.30 | ``Erik | would hope all proposals indicate strong competence and have a good plan O.o |
| 14:18.34 | brlcad | ~mafm++ |
| 14:18.35 | ``Erik | no way, paint it clear! |
| 14:19.05 | mafm | what's that ~ thing? is to give me points for ibot? :D |
| 14:19.37 | MTee | what are some of the basic project ideas ? |
| 14:19.41 | brlcad | camcorder: at this late, I'm not going to go into the history of why there is no (osi) open source dwg library -- but you'd have to speak to that |
| 14:20.01 | camcorder | license issues? |
| 14:20.01 | brlcad | how it'd relate, where and how you're getting your information |
| 14:20.21 | camcorder | or god damn patent issue? |
| 14:20.49 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Project_Ideas |
| 14:21.26 | MTee | brlcad : what are the ideas that are considered basic and require familiarity with C ? |
| 14:21.49 | brlcad | if you're not aware of that mired history, that'd probably be another one I'd say stay away from just because I can't see you formulating a strong proposal without that background knowledge (though it can be acquired just by a few quick searches) |
| 14:22.00 | brlcad | MTee: ... did you read the page? |
| 14:22.23 | ``Erik | ahummmm |
| 14:23.45 | brlcad | damn, permissions on ~dirs is busted |
| 14:23.59 | brlcad | bad sean, no donut for you |
| 14:24.08 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 14:24.12 | ``Erik | I was looking at that myself |
| 14:24.20 | ``Erik | what'd ya do? |
| 14:24.59 | MTee | brlcad : I've read it .. and thought the geometry converter was something good to learn on .. but you said it's tricky .. so what are the pojects that are considered to be basic ? |
| 14:25.32 | brlcad | that's really wierd |
| 14:25.48 | ``Erik | was the apache config modified? |
| 14:26.03 | ``Erik | now it seems to work |
| 14:26.10 | ``Erik | http://bzflag.bz/~sean/ideas.html |
| 14:26.23 | brlcad | ``Erik: the userdir directive .. I'd changed it to /usr/home/*/public_html .. that *doesn't* work .. but does when I change it back to what it was. /home/*/public_html |
| 14:27.02 | ``Erik | huh, odd |
| 14:27.05 | ``Erik | uhmmm |
| 14:27.06 | brlcad | which makes no sense, I see no other directive for /usr/home that would prevent Indices |
| 14:27.45 | MTee | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:27.46 | brlcad | anyways, who cares, it's fixed |
| 14:27.54 | ``Erik | wonder if it uses the systems concept of home? like if you put it back to /usr/home/*/public_html in the config and changed your home dir in passwd to /usr/home/xxx ? |
| 14:28.22 | brlcad | MTee: it is something good to learn on -- that doesn't mean it's not a lot of work though (depending on the converter) :) |
| 14:28.42 | brlcad | the most valued converters are rather hard |
| 14:28.55 | ``Erik | I d'no |
| 14:29.20 | brlcad | step, iges, dwg .. |
| 14:29.22 | ``Erik | I think a pov converter or various video game formats would be nice |
| 14:29.54 | MTee | brlcad : so what would you suggest for me to propose on ? |
| 14:29.57 | brlcad | ``Erik: apache is all directory/file-based -- it should be a literal directory rule that makes /usr/home not work, or some other /home rule I'm not finding that makes it work |
| 14:31.20 | ``Erik | mtee: only you know your ability and interest, we can answer specific questions about BRL-CAD, but we cannot think for you :( |
| 14:31.23 | brlcad | MTee: I'd suggest reading through the ideas list in detail and seeing what strongly catches your attention :) ... |
| 14:31.40 | brlcad | exactly -- I don't know you or your skills at this point to make a valid recommendation |
| 14:31.55 | brlcad | the list already says what's important and what sorts of skills are required |
| 14:39.03 | brlcad | hmm.. I need some tool that can watch several dozen httpd log files, make it really easy to provide ignore pattern exemptions, and report all non-200 non-spam queries |
| 14:39.38 | brlcad | something I could run in screen with an interactive curses console would be cool |
| 14:39.50 | MTee | brlcad, Erik : So if I have the skills required for a certain project .. what would probably lead to my proposal being refused ? |
| 14:40.04 | brlcad | a piss poor proposal? |
| 14:40.30 | brlcad | not agreeing to the development requirements |
| 14:40.42 | brlcad | s/development/application/ |
| 14:41.12 | SongOfTheWaves | would like BRL-CAD not to suddenly render 210x times slower than normal in his headcut.g model |
| 14:41.37 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: that task believe it or not is actually on the ideas list |
| 14:41.48 | SongOfTheWaves | believes not |
| 14:41.49 | brlcad | not a single submission for it yet, but it's there |
| 14:42.07 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 14:42.10 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: what's the technical name of the cause of the problem? |
| 14:42.10 | ``Erik | GOTOs don't kill applications- Programmers kill applications. |
| 14:42.46 | SongOfTheWaves | Telling a good programmer not to use GOTO |
| 14:42.53 | SongOfTheWaves | is like telling Jay Adams how he should skate. |
| 14:43.12 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: it's hinted at in the csg optimizations |
| 14:43.22 | SongOfTheWaves | We've 910 gotos in the links. |
| 14:43.55 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I appreciate you take the user feedback this seriously |
| 14:44.52 | brlcad | feel the love |
| 14:45.00 | brlcad | though it's not just for you of course :) |
| 14:45.26 | brlcad | the point is to develop a CAD system that everyone loves |
| 14:46.22 | ``Erik | mtee: bad proposal, lack of a realizable plan, having someone propose the same thing as you but better, ... |
| 14:46.59 | ``Erik | imagines that if we have, say, 6 proposals for the same idea, like, say, the web repo... only one will be on the short list handed to google for slot allocation O.o |
| 14:47.32 | ``Erik | even if the two best proposals are for that task |
| 14:47.44 | ``Erik | brlcad? |
| 14:47.58 | ``Erik | <-- never done this before, is mostly guessing :D |
| 14:48.52 | mafm | Google allows redundancy, but probably people tends to avoid it -- unless there's no other choice, I guess |
| 14:51.32 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: like the hippies in the 1969? |
| 14:51.41 | SongOfTheWaves | BRL-CAD specified to *be* *loved*? |
| 14:52.26 | SongOfTheWaves | That's an approach I approve! |
| 14:53.09 | SongOfTheWaves | LSD - Love and Solid Decomposition |
| 14:54.38 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, pretty much |
| 14:55.16 | brlcad | so if you're doubling up with another proposal that is already submitted, you're not only competiting against the other submissions, you have to be "best of breed" for that idea |
| 14:56.06 | brlcad | we're only asking for 2-4 slots at most, they're not going to be for the same idea no matter how good the proposals |
| 14:56.56 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I should be able to release the Ronja 3D models videos soon, I think I have even already fixed the final credits with the can-get-permission music |
| 14:57.05 | SongOfTheWaves | videos -> video |
| 14:57.26 | brlcad | cool |
| 14:58.22 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.7.20) | |
| 14:58.28 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 14:58.45 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 , brlcad , mafm |
| 14:58.46 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: but it's not aliased because of the 210x slowdown on one or more models |
| 14:58.52 | ``Erik | waits for a photon mapped perspective fly-through of a ronja scene :D |
| 14:59.01 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: maybe it could be later possible to rerun it on your supercomputers to make it aliased and look great |
| 14:59.08 | SongOfTheWaves | cause now you see the alias artifacts run around |
| 14:59.23 | SongOfTheWaves | aliased -> antialiased |
| 14:59.51 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I bought a Core 2 Duo 2x2.2GHz (before had 1x1.5GHz Pentium M) and it didn't help much :) |
| 14:59.56 | SongOfTheWaves | :) -> :( |
| 15:00.23 | SongOfTheWaves | ``Erik: is photon mapping computationally expensive? |
| 15:01.11 | alex_joni | I imagine the travel speed might be an issue |
| 15:01.29 | MTee | Erick, brlcad : what if i decided that I need to work more on my skills .. should I still sendan application or just wait till next year ? |
| 15:01.59 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 15:02.47 | SongOfTheWaves | If I don't specify anything and just rt, that's not photon mapping or is it, right? |
| 15:04.56 | camcorder | brlcad, i've submitted my proposal from "Onur Topsakal" |
| 15:06.15 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: you mean it's not anti-aliased? :) |
| 15:06.20 | brlcad | not being aliased is a good thing :) |
| 15:07.15 | brlcad | ah, you did correct yourself, hehe .. /me catches up |
| 15:07.35 | brlcad | MTee: send it in, you never know |
| 15:07.46 | SongOfTheWaves | rt by default doesn't do photon mapping, does it? |
| 15:07.49 | brlcad | i'll let you know if the chances aren't good |
| 15:08.22 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: photon mapping is very expensive and requires some model preparation (putting the model into a box with light sources) |
| 15:08.38 | brlcad | but rt does have the option by default, lighting mode 7 |
| 15:08.56 | SongOfTheWaves | which lighting mode is the default? |
| 15:09.20 | brlcad | 0 ? |
| 15:09.36 | brlcad | or 1, don't remember |
| 15:09.54 | brlcad | 0 |
| 15:10.08 | SongOfTheWaves | Which one has the highest realism? |
| 15:11.16 | brlcad | photon mapping performs a global illumination simulation so IFF you set up your scene appropriately, it will generally look much better, much more realistic |
| 15:12.03 | brlcad | (and take 100x longer to render, compared to path tracing which takes about 10000x times longer) |
| 15:12.23 | camcorder | brlcad, thanks for guidance, hope my proposal is chosen and would work together |
| 15:16.11 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: path tracing is even more realistic than photon mapping? |
| 15:16.25 | brlcad | to give folks an idea of what an excellent proposal looks like, here's one received for BZFlag: http://my.bzflag.org/w/User:Jude- None received for brl-cad are quite that good so you shouldn't be discouraged, but you are encouraged to put in a lot of detail about your idea. |
| 15:16.57 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: usually, it's a brute force solution to the render equation |
| 15:17.29 | brlcad | the image of stryker in a field of grass is a path-traced image |
| 15:18.35 | *** join/#brlcad spik1 (n=spike@fomalhaut.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 15:18.36 | brlcad | i.e. http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/stryker_slat.jpg.html and http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/humvee.png.html |
| 15:18.57 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: writing a proposal like this which includes an analysis of a problem is already quite some work and there is a risk you take the analysis, reject his proposal and use the work he did to program according to his analysis and save your work on his behalf. |
| 15:19.15 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: so I am not surprised people don't generally send such sophisticated proposals |
| 15:20.06 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: but is path tracing more realistic than photon mapping? Or less? Or the same? |
| 15:20.23 | SongOfTheWaves | All I understand from your reply is that path tracing is much slower than P. M. |
| 15:23.24 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: heh, I'd call BS .. most core devs have thought through the idea being proposed many orders of magnitude more than the person submitting the proposal -- and the point isn't to get something done, it's to attract new *developers* to the project |
| 15:23.56 | brlcad | what they actually propose is almost irrelevant beyond the applicant showing basic understanding and respect for the current priorities of the project |
| 15:24.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30639 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD: Remove extra options from build() |
| 15:24.15 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I am already attracted and would develop for living, but it's not organizationally possible |
| 15:24.19 | brlcad | otherwise, having a detailed application goes a really long ways towards showing that they are serious about working with the project and that they work hard |
| 15:24.24 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: so do you expect to attract volunteers? |
| 15:25.20 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: or people who have more bureaucratically favourable constellation circumstances? |
| 15:25.23 | brlcad | i entirely do hope to attract new long-term brl-cad developers, that is the PRIMARY goal of GSoC across the board |
| 15:25.43 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: you need people who live in the US? |
| 15:25.47 | brlcad | the money is just an incentive to give people that otherwise still need to pay bills a means to get started |
| 15:25.53 | brlcad | but it is still just a getting started point |
| 15:26.29 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: it sounds like you know very little to nothing about GSoC :) .. no you don't need to be in the US, most aren't in the US |
| 15:26.48 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I don't mean for the GSoC, I mean for BRL-CAD |
| 15:27.35 | brlcad | spik1: comment preferred for any responses -- you should also be able to edit your proposal if you decide you want to add more detail |
| 15:28.10 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: why would we need people who live in the US? it's an open source project, anyone can contribute whenever they like |
| 15:28.19 | brlcad | from wherever |
| 15:28.32 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I can't contribute in my working hours |
| 15:28.44 | SongOfTheWaves | so not quite whenever I like |
| 15:28.56 | spik1 | yeah thanks i saw it |
| 15:29.28 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: you "can", but there would be consequences for your situation perhaps |
| 15:29.33 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: so you are looking for volunteers because for some organizational reasons you are unable to pay people fulltime? |
| 15:30.04 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: yes there would be consequences for my ability to fill my fridge and to keep snow and rain off my head when sleeping |
| 15:30.07 | brlcad | still, I put in more than 60-80 hours a week most weeks NOT during working hours, so I don't have much sympathy .. there are 24 hours in a day :) |
| 15:30.28 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: yeah but your work doesn't suxx |
| 15:30.36 | SongOfTheWaves | cause it's not proprietary |
| 15:30.54 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:31.34 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: i'm looking for volunteers simply because I want to make BRL-CAD better, by whatever means available -- open source is the best means to make that happen, benefits everyone, and has exceptionally low barriers to participate |
| 15:32.08 | ``Erik | y'know, I'm curious... we have the ability to render multiple frames in one run, so the prep time is just hit once... does photon mapping do its map generation in the prep phase? so a multi-frame render would only map once? |
| 15:32.21 | MTee | !deadline |
| 15:32.40 | SongOfTheWaves | ``Erik: is this valid also for the default rt lighting model? |
| 15:32.47 | SongOfTheWaves | Because I call rt separately for every frame |
| 15:33.01 | SongOfTheWaves | Would it speed up significantly if I somehow coerced rt into rendering all of them at once? |
| 15:33.18 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, the photon mapping is view independent during prep -- theoretically you'd amortize that cost with multiple frames |
| 15:33.43 | ``Erik | it does multiframe with the default model, but I doubt you have much prep overhead with the ronja models |
| 15:34.12 | brlcad | yeah, depends how much of that time is prep, it's in the log file output |
| 15:34.16 | ``Erik | 300 frame photon mapped flythrough, hummm :D |
| 15:34.25 | SongOfTheWaves | only 300? |
| 15:34.30 | SongOfTheWaves | That's 6 seconds with 50fps |
| 15:34.34 | SongOfTheWaves | or 5 seconds with 60fps |
| 15:34.39 | ``Erik | that's 20 seconds at 15fps |
| 15:34.45 | SongOfTheWaves | 15fps is jerky |
| 15:34.49 | ``Erik | 10 at 30fps |
| 15:35.17 | SongOfTheWaves | I consider 30fps still jerky |
| 15:35.24 | SongOfTheWaves | First 50fps I perceive as smooth |
| 15:35.40 | ``Erik | notes that cinema is 24fps |
| 15:36.12 | SongOfTheWaves | therefore cinema must be necessary jerky for me |
| 15:36.26 | ``Erik | iirc, each cell is moved at 24fps, and each cell is flashed twice to reduce the strobing effect |
| 15:36.49 | SongOfTheWaves | I heard even about flashing 3 times |
| 15:38.29 | SongOfTheWaves | Isn't like LCD refreshed only 30 times per ssecond? |
| 15:38.32 | ``Erik | could be, my cinema class was over a decade ago, and we still use ncst over here |
| 15:38.46 | SongOfTheWaves | Cause if I play kate Ryan - Libertine music video on an LCD the movement is like "dirty", unclear |
| 15:38.47 | ``Erik | depends on the lcd, some are around 50 or 60 I think |
| 15:38.55 | SongOfTheWaves | On a CRT it's like if I was watching the dancer in real. |
| 15:39.14 | SongOfTheWaves | Maybe it's because the LCD constructers chronically ignore the Shannon theorem |
| 15:39.39 | SongOfTheWaves | When thy don't bother with proper sampling of the input signal, why should they bother with proper sampling of the frames? |
| 15:39.53 | spik1 | has class, eep! |
| 15:39.56 | spik1 | bbl guy |
| 15:39.59 | spik1 | guys* |
| 15:40.12 | SongOfTheWaves | Changing the frame rate requires massive filtering otherwise you get temporal aliasing |
| 15:40.16 | brlcad | bbq spik |
| 15:40.35 | SongOfTheWaves | The worst case is some movies in the TV which were obviously resampled this badly so they jerk every Nth frame |
| 15:40.47 | SongOfTheWaves | so Superman is flying and I want to vomit seeing the picture |
| 15:41.10 | brlcad | don't sit so close :) |
| 15:41.13 | brlcad | take some dramamine |
| 15:41.16 | SongOfTheWaves | They have whole development departments to be able to produce it with such horrible quality |
| 15:42.05 | SongOfTheWaves | any geek would be able to stitch up a frame resampler in C in few hours |
| 15:42.17 | SongOfTheWaves | Not them with their huge udgets |
| 15:42.51 | SongOfTheWaves | On the other hand when they cannot even figure out the Y'CbCr right (cf. Hyperluma and Luminaplex), why would one expect them to figure out the frame resampling? |
| 15:49.26 | SongOfTheWaves | no antialiasing helps when the details of the rendered video are damaged by the commonly used brainless rgb ->ycbcr conversion |
| 15:49.31 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 15:49.42 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 15:51.13 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: I think I should add a BRL-CAD URL into the cerdits shouldn't I? |
| 15:51.25 | brlcad | surprising how many students don't realize they're being notified of submission updates at their gmail address that they rarely ever check ... set up a mail forward if you're not going to check it folks! |
| 15:51.31 | SongOfTheWaves | into the final credits of the movie |
| 15:51.56 | brlcad | SongOfTheWaves: that's entirely up to you, it would certainly be appreciated but far from necessary |
| 15:52.11 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: cause look from the point of view of the viewer |
| 15:52.29 | SongOfTheWaves | wohoo - a free 3D that can make pictures like this - I want to make too - but where do I download the darn thing ?!? |
| 15:53.32 | brlcad | the name and a quick web search should be enough to answer that question |
| 15:53.53 | brlcad | thinks SongOfTheWaves would like seeing some of the original brl-cad movies |
| 15:54.16 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54873C4F.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:54.45 | prasad_ | is gvar still in the distro? |
| 15:54.59 | brlcad | prasad_: heh, yeah |
| 15:55.11 | brlcad | hasn't required any maintenance to preserve |
| 15:56.02 | prasad_ | need to change that to a new format |
| 15:56.03 | brlcad | also would probably serve as a good starting point for a g-ogl converter |
| 15:56.30 | prasad_ | add support to write out multiple varrs |
| 15:56.32 | brlcad | you still have commit access, go for it |
| 16:08.15 | SongOfTheWaves | brlcad: that's right people use web search today |
| 16:39.19 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, did you pull an all-nighter or do you just wake up ridiculously early? |
| 16:45.17 | pacman87 | why does the GSOC comment box have to be so tiny? |
| 17:06.45 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 17:15.10 | MTee | I need help compiling BRL-CAD |
| 17:15.31 | MTee | could anyone here help me please ? |
| 17:15.40 | pacman87 | ~ask |
| 17:15.40 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 17:17.20 | MTee | pacman : could ou help me compile brL-cad ? |
| 17:18.36 | pacman87 | MTee: what specifically is going wrong? |
| 17:19.26 | MTee | don't know where to start |
| 17:20.40 | pacman87 | ~svn |
| 17:20.41 | ibot | Subversion (aka SVN) is version control software that aims to be a better CVS than CVS. See http://subversion.tigris.org/. |
| 17:21.00 | pacman87 | not what i wanted :( |
| 17:21.08 | pacman87 | MTee: download the source |
| 17:21.16 | MTee | I did |
| 17:21.21 | pacman87 | read the readme |
| 17:21.36 | MTee | pacman : thanks .. forgot to do so :) |
| 17:25.36 | MTee | pacman : isn't brl-cad supposed to be portable and run on either windows, mac or linux ? |
| 17:25.57 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: I often only sleep a couple hours in a given night |
| 17:26.31 | brlcad | pacman87: some (better) browsers let you resize those text boxes :) |
| 17:26.47 | pacman87 | brlcad: which ones? |
| 17:27.06 | pacman87 | lynx? |
| 17:27.08 | brlcad | heh |
| 17:27.13 | brlcad | probably not lynx |
| 17:27.35 | brlcad | though I admit I haven't tried recent versions of lynx |
| 17:27.37 | pacman87 | <3 lynx for helping me get X working on my first linux install |
| 17:28.13 | pacman87 | MTee: i believe so, what OS are you running? |
| 17:29.55 | MTee | pacman : now windows. .but looks like i'm going to reboot in ubuntu |
| 17:30.09 | pacman87 | there's no need to compile for windows |
| 17:30.59 | MTee | pacman : they said that it's required that i successfully compile and run the s/w, was this intended for linux/UNIX users only ?? |
| 17:31.31 | pacman87 | MTee: you're applying for GSoC? |
| 17:31.42 | MTee | yep .. |
| 17:32.04 | MTee | why ? |
| 17:32.38 | pacman87 | so am i :) |
| 17:33.09 | pacman87 | but yeah, i'd recommend compiling in linux |
| 17:33.12 | MTee | :) .. I postulated that |
| 17:33.14 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:33.25 | pacman87 | hi d_rossberg |
| 17:33.49 | MTee | great .. thanks pacman :) |
| 17:33.55 | pacman87 | just posted a response |
| 17:36.14 | brlcad | MTee: README, INSTALL, HACKING <-- useful documentation .. |
| 17:38.42 | pacman87 | brlcad: what browser were you refering to earlier? |
| 17:38.59 | d_rossberg | pacman87: i just read it, thank you |
| 17:39.48 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: any more questions that would benefit from realtime communication? |
| 17:41.53 | d_rossberg | pacman87: questions: yes; however, i have to leave for today; i'll reply tomorrow |
| 17:42.22 | d_rossberg | it's an interesting topic |
| 17:43.10 | pacman87 | i've had quite a few different methods bouncing around my head since i started thinking about it |
| 17:43.18 | brlcad | pacman87: safari does this |
| 17:43.24 | brlcad | i believe there's an extension for firefox |
| 17:43.34 | pacman87 | uses opera |
| 17:43.35 | brlcad | https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/3818 |
| 17:44.59 | pacman87 | right in the middle of me typing a question for d_rossberg |
| 17:45.33 | brlcad | irc's really hard for some of the other devs :) |
| 17:45.50 | brlcad | to stay on-line -- they tend to be e-mail junkies |
| 17:46.02 | brlcad | mailing list of app comments are best |
| 17:46.30 | pacman87 | i prefer irc |
| 17:46.41 | brlcad | likewise |
| 17:46.58 | brlcad | can't really "require" folks use it though, not with our current developer base |
| 17:47.09 | pacman87 | much easier to ensure that your ideas are understood how you intend |
| 17:47.17 | pacman87 | when you have immediate feedback |
| 17:48.38 | brlcad | pacman87: have you looked at how the sketch+extrude primitives interact? |
| 17:48.57 | brlcad | they're very closely related to what you're proposing |
| 17:48.58 | pacman87 | no, that was my 'more research needed' line |
| 17:49.33 | brlcad | as extrude is basically a simple linear sweep, sketches are just 2D outlines |
| 17:50.36 | pacman87 | it would be trivial to add sketches to my method |
| 17:50.41 | brlcad | thinks it would be cool/better to be able to "extrude" *any* primitive, not just sketches |
| 17:50.52 | pacman87 | skip the 3D ->2D step |
| 17:51.01 | brlcad | yeah, sketches should be easier, just a subset |
| 17:53.03 | pacman87 | given his interest, i'm assuming d_rossberg could be my mentor? |
| 17:53.41 | brlcad | tbd |
| 17:53.57 | pacman87 | figured as much |
| 17:57.22 | pacman87 | goes to class, back in 5.5 hours |
| 18:03.32 | brlcad | cya |
| 18:31.52 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i wish i could do that |
| 18:32.01 | PrezKennedy | im dead tired if i get less than 6 hours of sleep |
| 18:47.30 | *** join/#brlcad MTee (n=mt@41.233.147.212) | |
| 18:50.58 | *** join/#brlcad mt__ (n=mt@41.233.147.212) | |
| 18:51.09 | mt__ | ~svn |
| 18:51.10 | ibot | Subversion (aka SVN) is version control software that aims to be a better CVS than CVS. See http://subversion.tigris.org/. |
| 18:51.42 | mt__ | hello.. i'm having troubles compiling brlcad in ubuntu |
| 18:53.10 | brlcad | either download the source tarball (instead of svn checkout), install an unmodified GNU libtool (debian devs modify libtool and break it), or feel free to provide a suitable workaround patch :) |
| 18:55.30 | mt__ | I know I shouldn't have waited till the last minute .. but I won't be able to send the app except after 2 or 3 more hours .. big deal ? |
| 18:57.53 | brlcad | the sooner the better |
| 18:58.09 | brlcad | I have extra questions for the last-minute submitters |
| 18:58.55 | mt__ | brlcad : such as ? |
| 18:59.16 | brlcad | it'll be attached to your submission |
| 18:59.40 | brlcad | http://tinyurl.com/3tjkh8 tick tock |
| 19:02.03 | mafm | bye |
| 19:02.16 | brlcad | cya mafm |
| 19:05.53 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-108-27.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:15.52 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hey, in struct mater_info (raytrace.h) it has ma_color[3] and ma_temperature declared as floats.. wouldn't it be better if they were fastf_f ? |
| 19:17.16 | clock_ | brlcad: can it calculate also chromatic aberration - if yes what's the name of the appropriate lighting model? |
| 19:17.20 | clock_ | multispectral library? |
| 19:19.00 | brlcad | andrecastelo: these days probably -- most structs are intended to have fixed sizes for v4 serialization/format compatibility |
| 19:19.18 | brlcad | not compilation-dependent sizes (and fastf_t can change) |
| 19:19.37 | brlcad | would have to investigate how struct mater_info pertains to the v4 file format to change it |
| 19:22.30 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 19:37.52 | hippieindamakin8 | hey ppl |
| 19:42.36 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 19:43.11 | andrecastelo | does BRL-CAD use Bidirectional Reflectance Distribution Function ?? |
| 19:49.28 | *** join/#brlcad spike1234124214 (n=spike@fomalhaut.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 19:54.56 | PrezKennedy | if i was still into programming, brlcad would be a cool mentor |
| 19:58.03 | yukonbob | PrezKennedy: get back into programming ;) |
| 19:58.42 | PrezKennedy | the only way i could see myself programming was if i was learning PHP to do a webapp of some sort |
| 20:00.51 | andrecastelo | PrezKennedy: why did you leave ? |
| 20:01.13 | yukonbob | PrezKennedy: why do you say on PHP? |
| 20:01.27 | PrezKennedy | andrecastelo, i think programming is incredibly boring ;) |
| 20:01.28 | yukonbob | *say only PHP |
| 20:01.42 | andrecastelo | PrezKennedy: :( it's awesome :( |
| 20:01.55 | PrezKennedy | yukonbob, first thing that came to mind... have had a little experience with it... could do python or something like that I guess |
| 20:01.57 | andrecastelo | but i won't argue :b |
| 20:02.39 | PrezKennedy | andrecastelo, i know some people enjoy it... i used to... but i like what i do now instead |
| 20:03.00 | yukonbob | PrezKennedy: ah -- and why do you say web-app, versus say, a desktop app or utility, or library code? |
| 20:08.18 | andrecastelo | PrezKennedy: and what is it you do now ? |
| 20:14.02 | prasad_ | programming is only fun if u like what u code |
| 20:14.07 | prasad_ | like not xml |
| 20:14.07 | prasad_ | .. |
| 20:14.30 | ``Erik | xml is like violence, if it doesn't work, use more of it |
| 20:14.31 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 20:15.12 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hahaha |
| 20:16.47 | prasad_ | especially when implementing adobe's broken code |
| 20:16.49 | prasad_ | sigh |
| 20:23.44 | paulproteus | Jesus Christ, PHP?! |
| 20:23.52 | paulproteus | Of *course* programming is boring if you live in PHPland. |
| 20:24.14 | spike1234124214 | wave |
| 20:24.15 | ``Erik | http://blog.mlive.com/flintjournal/newsnow/2008/04/post_moto_kid_death_story_here.html |
| 20:24.16 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 20:35.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30640 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Added inner solid fill for tire - next step is to provide proper 'cut out' shape. |
| 20:36.56 | brlcad | jeebus!.. the annual jpr cad report is 5k |
| 20:37.18 | brlcad | what a scam |
| 20:37.23 | ``Erik | that's it? I thought it costed six digits just to get a quote in this industry O.o |
| 20:37.37 | brlcad | http://www.jonpeddie.com/special/CAD_report.shtml |
| 20:37.51 | brlcad | 6 billion dollar industry this year |
| 20:39.21 | clock_ | brlcad: I have read that the worth of Linux kernel is 1 billion dollar |
| 20:40.15 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad .. does BRL-CAD use any kind of Bidirectional Reflectance Distribution Function?? |
| 20:40.27 | brlcad | sounds a bit exaggerated to me, clock_ |
| 20:40.42 | brlcad | business-wise, perhaps -- but not necessarily the code itself |
| 20:41.06 | brlcad | at least ohloh ranks them at under a 1/3 at a 100k salary |
| 20:41.33 | brlcad | andrecastelo: the phong model |
| 20:41.37 | brlcad | plastic shader |
| 20:42.20 | brlcad | shaders represent a BRDF response, there are a variety of shaders available (phong being the most prevalent) |
| 20:43.07 | brlcad | cook-torrence is also in there, but not well tested |
| 20:43.21 | brlcad | I use it when I need really pretty shiny glass |
| 20:43.48 | andrecastelo | hmm |
| 20:44.17 | brlcad | src/liboptical/sh_plastic.c for phong if you're looking for source ref |
| 20:44.28 | brlcad | the shaders are all in sh_*.c |
| 20:44.41 | andrecastelo | thanks i'll take a look |
| 20:44.51 | andrecastelo | i've updated my app though, hope i didn't miss anything |
| 20:44.57 | brlcad | k |
| 20:45.17 | brlcad | gets e-mails since he's commented on all of them |
| 20:45.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: oh lol, forgot about that :b |
| 20:48.46 | brlcad | tis going to be a really tough selection -- there are at least six strong candidates (from my perspective, other mentors may vary) |
| 20:49.06 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 20:49.23 | andrecastelo | brlcad: you should accept all six of them :b |
| 20:49.27 | andrecastelo | hehe |
| 20:49.37 | ``Erik | google won't give us 6 slots, not as a first year project |
| 20:49.39 | brlcad | that wouldn't be a good experience for the students |
| 20:49.58 | brlcad | takes time to coordinate amongst devs |
| 20:50.11 | ``Erik | doubts we'd get 4, even if we asked for that many :) |
| 20:50.44 | andrecastelo | well, i hope that i'm selected.. |
| 20:51.27 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
| 20:51.28 | andrecastelo | i'm impressed at how serious BRL-CAD and BZFLAG treats GSoC |
| 20:51.42 | andrecastelo | definetely a differential |
| 20:51.56 | spike1234124214 | well, would you want to apply to one that was less serious? |
| 20:52.35 | spike1234124214 | i wouldnt...better to be prepared than not |
| 20:53.39 | PrezKennedy | yukonbob, because the web is where i have the most experience and most interest... however if i did a crappy accounting program for construction companies... i could make big $$$ |
| 20:53.46 | brlcad | maybe we could just make the deciding factor some mged modeling task (muahahaha) .. see who survives |
| 20:54.04 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, did my brother get ahold of you finally? |
| 20:54.06 | andrecastelo | mged doesn't like me |
| 20:54.22 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: he got ahold of the right people eventually |
| 20:54.30 | brlcad | andrecastelo: it doesn't like anyone |
| 20:54.40 | ``Erik | mged doesn't particu... brlcad beat me to it |
| 20:54.56 | andrecastelo | lol |
| 20:55.02 | PrezKennedy | thats good... he hasnt quite learned yet that it takes some initiative to go somewhere... |
| 20:55.08 | brlcad | powerful but very unforgiving .. and it's not going to help you |
| 20:55.29 | ``Erik | do we have a write-up of the history of mged? mebbe that'd help people understand why it is like it is? |
| 20:58.27 | PrezKennedy | and andrecastelo, im a system administrator and IT support |
| 20:58.32 | ``Erik | *stretch* *yawn* that nap is done, time to go home :D later, kids |
| 20:58.52 | andrecastelo | later ``Erik |
| 20:59.00 | PrezKennedy | darn government workers! |
| 20:59.35 | brlcad | volume 1 covers the history/philosophy a bit |
| 21:08.49 | yukonbob | mged is user friendly; it's just particular about who it's friends are... |
| 21:11.21 | brlcad | :) |
| 21:11.46 | brlcad | nice characterization :) pretty true |
| 21:11.47 | prasad_ | was never a friend :( |
| 21:13.09 | brlcad | wishes there were a decent resolution independent opengl gui library |
| 21:13.38 | prasad_ | hmm no idea :o |
| 21:14.16 | prasad_ | heh u know we 'phased' out gfc |
| 21:14.26 | prasad_ | we only deal with rendering flash now |
| 21:14.40 | brlcad | that's sad |
| 21:14.46 | prasad_ | i dunno if they're open to releasing that codebase |
| 21:14.56 | brlcad | liked the georgia forestry commission |
| 21:15.23 | prasad_ | slash and burn cultivation |
| 21:15.24 | prasad_ | what can u do |
| 21:15.26 | prasad_ | :( |
| 21:15.35 | brlcad | you should press for it, open source it for brl-cad ftw! |
| 21:15.46 | brlcad | lgpl |
| 21:15.57 | prasad_ | codebase is pretty huge |
| 21:16.14 | prasad_ | maybe in 1-2 yrs |
| 21:16.18 | prasad_ | heh |
| 21:16.18 | brlcad | bah |
| 21:18.57 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hey isn't there a proposal to an Open GL Gui Lib? |
| 21:22.00 | brlcad | working on the GUI front-end, eys |
| 21:22.20 | brlcad | that still doesn't resolve the fact that there's not a good toolkit available :) |
| 21:22.52 | prasad_ | quite a pain to make one too |
| 21:23.03 | prasad_ | not being sarcastic |
| 21:23.06 | prasad_ | just takes a lot of man hours |
| 21:23.26 | prasad_ | at least one that can be classes as a toolkit |
| 21:23.29 | prasad_ | classed* |
| 21:25.36 | brlcad | yep |
| 21:25.45 | brlcad | that's why I want to use one, not write one ;) |
| 21:27.03 | andrecastelo | hehehe i thought the other way hehehe |
| 21:30.10 | brlcad | they could work on a toolkit all summer -- they might get a couple percent done |
| 21:30.25 | brlcad | probably better to invest effort in making something like cegui resolution independent |
| 21:38.20 | *** join/#brlcad MTee (n=MT@41.233.147.212) | |
| 21:38.50 | MTee | brlcad |
| 21:39.27 | MTee | brlcad : should I run BRL-CAD under linux .. or can i do it under windows ? |
| 21:39.39 | brlcad | you can do whatever you like :) |
| 21:40.13 | MTee | thanks :) |
| 21:42.29 | prasad_ | is diva active? |
| 21:42.35 | prasad_ | or has it been replaced |
| 21:44.07 | MTee | brlcad : should I work on a specific version ? |
| 21:45.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30641 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.bat: For the moment, put back the old START command. Without the "2>&1 nul" we lose the output from forked apps like rt. |
| 21:49.21 | ``Erik | um, diva/adrt/isst/rise/etc is all being reworked |
| 21:49.42 | ``Erik | needs to buy new tires |
| 21:50.17 | brlcad | MTee: depends what you're trying to do |
| 21:50.49 | brlcad | devs are expected to use latest svn and be competent at building for their platform |
| 21:51.23 | MTee | i see |
| 21:51.54 | ``Erik | and those who decide to use debian/ubuntu should understand how to work around their broken libtool |
| 21:51.55 | ``Erik | :D |
| 21:52.47 | prasad_ | reworked? |
| 21:52.53 | prasad_ | by mal? |
| 21:53.00 | ``Erik | no |
| 21:53.25 | ``Erik | I'm on the "isst" task, which involves folding the various forks back together and making it more robust/unified/easy |
| 21:54.21 | prasad_ | ah |
| 21:55.22 | brlcad | MTee: new devs can always get up to speed -- really depends what you're trying to do for the next couple weeks |
| 22:05.09 | MTee | brlcad : I know this sounds crazy .. but I'm really having troubles .. I'm trying but I don't know if i'll be able to patch the program and eventually send the app !!! |
| 22:05.53 | brlcad | MTee: send the app in first |
| 22:05.59 | brlcad | the patch can happen later |
| 22:06.24 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30642 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: Add shortcuts for RtWizard. |
| 22:06.25 | brlcad | better to have detail and effort in the app itself |
| 22:06.40 | brlcad | especially since the submission deadline is pretty firm for the initial revision |
| 22:07.20 | MTee | ok so I'll work on the application now and send it within an hour .. good ? |
| 22:08.36 | andrecastelo | hurry :b |
| 22:08.52 | andrecastelo | brlcad: about the app, did you have the time to take another look at it ? |
| 22:09.08 | brlcad | andrecastelo: hah |
| 22:09.12 | brlcad | no, not really :) |
| 22:09.28 | brlcad | is in like 10 discussions at the moment with the deadline approaching |
| 22:10.10 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 22:10.37 | andrecastelo | do you think you'll be able to take a look before the deadline ?? :B |
| 22:11.14 | brlcad | probably not, why? |
| 22:11.28 | andrecastelo | nah, i just wanted to refine it a bit more |
| 22:11.33 | brlcad | feel free to |
| 22:11.34 | andrecastelo | but no problem |
| 22:11.38 | brlcad | please do refine |
| 22:11.47 | brlcad | refine, detail, etc |
| 22:11.56 | brlcad | that doesn't stop with the deadline |
| 22:12.06 | brlcad | the deadline is for the initial submission |
| 22:12.11 | andrecastelo | really ? |
| 22:12.26 | *** join/#brlcad cad07 (n=94e99f3a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 22:12.32 | brlcad | we have another week to poke and prod for additional information if needed, to clean up the submissions, agree on the scope/focus/plan/etc |
| 22:12.58 | brlcad | we'll likely have our finalist by the end of this week |
| 22:13.07 | brlcad | but technically we have a week and a half |
| 22:14.05 | andrecastelo | hmm ok.. |
| 22:14.53 | andrecastelo | brlcad: one thing - in the feedback you said the first step of the timeline was a little doosie.. i've added some detail but what exactly is doosie ?? :) |
| 22:16.02 | brlcad | the scope of that effort, amount of work involved |
| 22:16.07 | brlcad | compared to the other steps |
| 22:17.11 | brlcad | sort of like "step 1: make it work .. step 2: chill with a beer" :-) big difference in what is involved for each step :) |
| 22:17.25 | andrecastelo | ah ok, i understand :b |
| 22:17.46 | andrecastelo | well, i've added some "sub" milestones and more detail, i hope it is better now |
| 22:18.40 | brlcad | okay |
| 22:19.26 | MTee | brlcad : what's the most important points to be included in the app ? |
| 22:23.59 | brlcad | anything and everything that you think the mentors should know |
| 22:24.05 | brlcad | detail |
| 22:24.33 | brlcad | especially about your proposal idea -- not just what was mentioned on the ideas page, it needs to go into detail on the idea |
| 22:25.08 | brlcad | details about yourself, execution timeline, how it relates to brl-cad features and code, etc |
| 22:25.44 | brlcad | notes this is all on the wiki, http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Application_Guidelines |
| 22:45.39 | PrezKennedy | ok this typo is ironic :P |
| 22:45.50 | PrezKennedy | "Bugs, typos, and compilation errors are to be expected as part of |
| 22:45.50 | PrezKennedy | the process of active software development and documentation, but it |
| 22:45.50 | PrezKennedy | is ultimately unacceptible to allow them to persist.." |
| 22:46.07 | PrezKennedy | unacceptable is spelled incorrectly |
| 22:46.19 | brlcad | tick tock, 75 minutes till deadline |
| 22:46.43 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: hehe ;) |
| 22:47.06 | brlcad | so now that it's been pointed out, someone (tm) should fix it |
| 22:50.35 | PrezKennedy | indeed! |
| 23:16.22 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30643 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: not acceptable! |
| 23:39.51 | poolio | hacking is not acceptable? |
| 23:43.29 | brlcad | twas quite acceptible :) |
| 23:48.20 | poolio | ah |
| 00:20.08 | andrecastelo | brlcad: question: how can i commit with brlcad (using svn) ?? i've found a typo i want to fix :) |
| 00:22.36 | brlcad | andrecastelo: you make a couple patches first to engender trust that you understand and are following HACKING first :) |
| 00:22.51 | brlcad | patches tracker is on sf |
| 00:23.01 | andrecastelo | ok, if anything burns i'll call you |
| 00:23.10 | brlcad | nods |
| 00:32.28 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, i guess everything worked as expected |
| 00:32.48 | andrecastelo | here's the patch : http://rafb.net/p/nPdkdS88.html (i've submitted it already) |
| 00:33.13 | brlcad | heh |
| 00:33.18 | brlcad | coulda just said that one :) |
| 00:33.47 | andrecastelo | i wanted to submit my first patch :) |
| 00:34.03 | andrecastelo | (this is not the patch you want me to submit though) |
| 00:34.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30644 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: it's apparently an int pointer, thanks andrecastelo |
| 00:34.47 | andrecastelo | cheers |
| 00:39.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30645 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: apply sf patch 1936200 (Selecting the environmental variables in NSIS) so that PROGRAMFILES is properly set. kinda helps the windows installer work. thanks suryajith. |
| 00:43.45 | andrecastelo | brlcad: that last patch was related to the problem i was having hehehe |
| 00:43.50 | andrecastelo | compiling brlcad |
| 00:46.04 | brlcad | really? |
| 00:46.12 | brlcad | you're on windows? |
| 00:46.25 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 00:46.32 | andrecastelo | non english windows |
| 00:46.33 | brlcad | marks down the application a few points |
| 00:46.38 | brlcad | j/k :) |
| 00:46.39 | andrecastelo | ;O |
| 00:46.43 | andrecastelo | WAIT |
| 00:46.49 | andrecastelo | i have debian installed!!! |
| 00:46.50 | andrecastelo | :) |
| 00:46.59 | brlcad | uh huh, suuure you do :) |
| 00:47.13 | andrecastelo | hahaha |
| 00:47.36 | brlcad | doesn't matter, if the mascot isn't a little daemon with a pitchfork, you're still getting marked down ;) |
| 00:47.55 | andrecastelo | :( |
| 00:48.23 | brlcad | our windows side actually needs lots of loving |
| 00:48.56 | brlcad | almost all of the work put in to date has been by folks that really don't like windows on a very deep level :) |
| 00:49.20 | brlcad | knowledgeable, but not liking working on windows does kinda affect what gets fixed/worked |
| 00:49.41 | brlcad | it gets done out of sheer demand |
| 00:49.56 | andrecastelo | i see.. i guess i'll try building the source on linux |
| 00:50.18 | andrecastelo | and on debian i've heard i have to do some work arounds |
| 00:52.20 | brlcad | finding a good work-around for default debian would be a very useful patch |
| 00:53.02 | andrecastelo | but isn't the work-around debian sided ?? |
| 00:53.22 | andrecastelo | installing an unmodified certain library |
| 00:53.42 | brlcad | well yeah, that works |
| 00:53.47 | brlcad | but that's not a "work-around" |
| 00:54.04 | brlcad | waiting for the devs to fix a problem they don't want to fix is also not a work-around |
| 00:54.27 | brlcad | our build system accounts for lots of system configuration problems so things "just work" as best possible |
| 00:55.25 | brlcad | macs have a poorly configured libtool that is useless by default, for example, but autogen.sh takes care of it |
| 00:56.20 | brlcad | there are a slew of work-arounds in configure and some of the Makefile.am files |
| 00:56.23 | andrecastelo | so, autogen.sh should detect that the system is debian and it has a flawed library, and taking care of the problem.. |
| 00:56.57 | brlcad | the failure happens during make -- so the fix could happen just about anywhere up the chain |
| 00:57.35 | brlcad | we had a work-around in there before, which involved recursively declaring dependencies for all binaries (utterly massive duplicitive link lines) |
| 00:58.16 | brlcad | that's a pretty bad work-around though, involves editing every single Makefile.am with a target |
| 00:58.36 | andrecastelo | and i guess build times sky rocket ? |
| 00:59.00 | brlcad | and had the massive link lines, slow build times, big logs, annoying link-line duplication |
| 00:59.16 | brlcad | kinda a shot-gun approach |
| 00:59.29 | brlcad | should be something that can happen during autogen.sh or configure |
| 01:01.10 | brlcad | or who knows -- maybe things have changed since then and we have a bonefide build bug that needs fixed |
| 01:01.26 | andrecastelo | i'll be afk for a minute and then i'll try compiling it with debian |
| 01:01.54 | andre|away | just a sec, be right back |
| 01:03.35 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC applications are being reviewed throughout the week, final candidates will be required to provide a useful patch | |
| 02:00.49 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've been looking at the viewarea.c and i'm clueless as to how to connect it to the standard center point idea (median of the points that form the area).. can you give me some pointers ? |
| 02:02.46 | brlcad | do you see how those are callbacks called during rtarea? |
| 02:03.23 | brlcad | pre/during/post callbacks |
| 02:04.04 | andrecastelo | i thought of using struct area, but i think this struct is a completely different concept |
| 02:04.17 | andrecastelo | (seems to be) |
| 02:04.24 | brlcad | right now it stores things as just a counter iirc -- but to compute center of presented area, it needs to also store the X,Y values -- and then average them at the end |
| 02:05.24 | andrecastelo | yes, it counts the presented hits and the exposed hits |
| 02:06.02 | andrecastelo | hm, i kind of understand now - struct area should have a list of points, is that it ? |
| 02:06.58 | brlcad | yeah, it's too simple |
| 02:07.24 | brlcad | it's also "wrong" w.r.t. presented hits if you want to fix that too ;) |
| 02:07.47 | brlcad | almost everyone uses it for exposed areas |
| 02:08.01 | andrecastelo | w. r. t. ? |
| 02:08.58 | andrecastelo | but if i just add the points and the function, how would that connect to the whole thing ?? |
| 02:09.13 | andrecastelo | i mean, i need to make the connection, right ? |
| 02:09.41 | brlcad | ~wrt |
| 02:09.41 | ibot | hmm... wrt is with respect to, or with regards to, or the Linksys WRT54G on which some people have successfully installed Asterisk. More information at http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk+Linksys+WRT54G |
| 02:10.05 | brlcad | connect? hm? |
| 02:10.52 | brlcad | if you set the values in the hit callback, they'll be available during the output/final callback |
| 02:10.55 | andrecastelo | to actually input the points |
| 02:12.49 | brlcad | the x/y/z of the hitpoint is available in the hit callback |
| 02:13.01 | brlcad | you could stash that into the struct |
| 02:13.17 | andrecastelo | the rayhit function calls the application, so that where i could get the points, am i thinking right here ? |
| 02:14.15 | brlcad | the application struct is a "ray-trace application" -- it contains details about the current ray that was fired |
| 02:14.55 | brlcad | might want to read through http://brlcad.org/wiki/Developing_applications quickly to understand the basic structures and callbacks |
| 02:15.03 | andrecastelo | hm ok ok |
| 02:15.11 | andrecastelo | but am i on the right track? :) |
| 02:15.16 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:30.31 | *** join/#brlcad spike1234124214 (n=spike@eridani.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 03:49.05 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30646 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Change variable naming conventions to match new measurements |
| 04:17.36 | andrecastelo | good night everyone |
| 04:17.38 | andrecastelo | cya tomorrow |
| 04:33.09 | brlcad | that's quite a few patches |
| 04:39.46 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there a quick clean way in C (or our utility libs) to concatenate strings? I would like to say "Shape-" + variablestring + ".s" as an argument to mk_* functions |
| 04:40.36 | starseeker | 's memories of strings and C from college are not happy ones |
| 04:40.56 | pacman87 | sprintf? |
| 04:41.35 | pacman87 | newstring = sprintf("Shape-%s.s", variablestring); |
| 04:42.33 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:42.35 | pacman87 | or try strcat |
| 04:43.02 | pacman87 | but you need to make sure your string has enough room |
| 04:43.35 | brlcad | snprintf ftw |
| 04:43.49 | pacman87 | what's the 'n' do? |
| 04:44.19 | brlcad | or bu_strlcat() |
| 04:44.26 | brlcad | n is the buffer length |
| 04:44.40 | starseeker | thanks guys |
| 04:44.45 | brlcad | snprintf(buffer, size, "Shape-%s.s", variablestring); |
| 04:44.46 | starseeker | ftw? |
| 04:44.49 | brlcad | ~ftw |
| 04:44.50 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, ftw is wtf backwards, or for the win, or for the win |
| 04:45.06 | starseeker | heh |
| 04:45.16 | pacman87 | for the win twice? |
| 04:45.51 | brlcad | ~pacman87 is astute |
| 04:45.51 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 04:45.59 | brlcad | ~pacman87 is also here |
| 04:46.00 | ibot | okay, brlcad |
| 04:46.03 | brlcad | ~pacman87 |
| 04:46.04 | ibot | pacman87 is probably astute, or here |
| 04:46.40 | starseeker | brlcad: is snprintf preferable to sprintf? (see both in the code) |
| 04:46.43 | pacman87 | is that an xor? |
| 04:46.46 | brlcad | starseeker: yes |
| 04:47.00 | pacman87 | only astute when not here? |
| 04:47.08 | starseeker | ugh |
| 04:47.21 | brlcad | ~pacman87 is also the nick for someone on irc |
| 04:47.22 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 04:47.26 | brlcad | ~pacman87 |
| 04:47.27 | ibot | i guess pacman87 is astute, or here, or the nick for someone on irc |
| 04:47.33 | brlcad | factoids |
| 04:47.36 | starseeker | doesn't care what the length is, he just wants to use the concatentated string for a shape name... |
| 04:47.55 | brlcad | starseeker: you have to put it into a buffer, so you have to care |
| 04:47.59 | brlcad | else use bu_vls strings |
| 04:48.28 | pacman87 | was wrong earlier |
| 04:48.36 | brlcad | ~forget pacman87 |
| 04:48.36 | ibot | brlcad: i forgot pacman87 |
| 04:48.39 | pacman87 | int sprintf ( char * str, const char * format, ... ) |
| 04:48.46 | pacman87 | returns int, not new string |
| 04:49.02 | brlcad | wasn't going to get all pedantic |
| 04:49.03 | pacman87 | ~blame pacman87 |
| 04:49.04 | ibot | ACTION blames pacman87 (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 04:49.21 | pacman87 | well, if he tries to use what i said, it'd blow up on him |
| 04:49.29 | brlcad | it's good for him |
| 04:49.42 | pacman87 | doesnt like lying to people |
| 04:49.42 | starseeker | mumbles under his breath about languages that can't abstract anything and starts in with snprintf... |
| 04:49.53 | brlcad | shouldn't use any function on blind faith, that's why there are manpages and headers :) |
| 04:50.37 | pacman87 | if i'm going to help, i feel obligated to help correctly |
| 04:50.54 | brlcad | starseeker: you don't have to worry about the size with bu_vls strings -- that's why they're there |
| 04:51.14 | brlcad | otherwise you're writing into a buffer of static or allocated memory and can have a corruption if you don't check/limit your length |
| 04:51.20 | starseeker | OK. |
| 04:51.29 | brlcad | you would just concat into a bu_vls |
| 04:51.30 | starseeker | takes a look a bu_vls... |
| 04:53.33 | brlcad | struct bu_vls str; bu_vls_init(&str); bu_vls_printf(&str, "Shape-%s.s", variablestring); .. then later bu_vls_free(&str); something like that, check the header for exact args |
| 04:54.34 | brlcad | or see other examples throughout the code |
| 04:55.23 | starseeker | Cool. |
| 04:55.26 | starseeker | thanks |
| 04:56.19 | brlcad | relatively high-performance heap-based string management |
| 04:57.04 | starseeker | figured there was something in there somewhere :-) |
| 05:01.39 | starseeker | is moderately bemused to note that there is no other use of any bu_vls function in proc_db according to grep |
| 05:02.23 | brlcad | not surprising, tend to just find static arrays and fault intolerant code |
| 05:04.42 | starseeker | Hmm - will mk_* functions accept a vls type? |
| 05:04.58 | brlcad | bu_vls_addr(&str) |
| 05:05.59 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 05:06.08 | starseeker | just figured out the grep that found it |
| 05:06.08 | brlcad | (see bu.h and wdb.h) |
| 05:06.13 | starseeker | righto |
| 05:08.21 | starseeker | bingo - thanks brlcad! Sorry for such an elementary question... |
| 05:09.05 | brlcad | the first ones are always free ;) |
| 05:13.04 | pacman87 | is there a brlcad elementary question market? |
| 05:18.59 | starseeker | is beginning to feel malloc stir like an ancient demon in the depths of his memories... |
| 05:27.07 | pacman87 | balrog? |
| 05:45.32 | starseeker | something like that :-) |
| 05:46.28 | starseeker | has been lingering too long in the gentle forests of Lisplorien ;-) |
| 05:46.57 | starseeker | woo-hoo: one step closer |
| 05:47.07 | starseeker | http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/tireshot.png |
| 05:48.15 | pacman87 | impressive |
| 05:48.38 | pacman87 | my revolve should make that a bit easier to do |
| 05:48.47 | starseeker | indeed |
| 05:50.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30647 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add option to append text to all components of a tire shape - allows for multiple definitions in one g file, required for curved subtraction of tire solid. |
| 05:51.07 | starseeker | should have said text to the shape names |
| 05:51.10 | starseeker | crud |
| 05:52.16 | pacman87 | you're writing C code to generate the tire? |
| 05:52.26 | starseeker | Ah, well - once I figure out the equation to automatically calculate the cutout and do some robustness testing, I should be ready for the next stage |
| 05:52.27 | starseeker | yep |
| 05:52.33 | starseeker | proc-db |
| 05:52.41 | starseeker | learning exercise |
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| 06:39.22 | brlcad | starseeker: eep, you should only ever init once -- you trunc it thereafter |
| 06:40.14 | brlcad | very nice screenshot, though |
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| 06:50.33 | brlcad | late night, eh? |
| 06:55.42 | spike_ | nods |
| 07:32.17 | brlcad | burps, sips and wanders back to an editor |
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| 08:16.04 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, thanks for accepting the patch Sean |
| 08:32.32 | spike_ | stumbles off to bed |
| 08:32.34 | spike_ | night guys |
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| 10:05.34 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:08.21 | mafm | hi |
| 11:39.16 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 11:41.12 | d_rossberg | pacman87: i've send you an e-mail to your gmail account |
| 11:43.07 | clock_ | Is this GSoC somehow connected with gmail accounts? |
| 11:43.20 | clock_ | I once wanted to open a gmail account and realized the terms and conditions are unacceptable for me |
| 11:43.39 | clock_ | is like gmail account required to participate in the GSoC? |
| 11:44.50 | archivist | gmail is good for list type mail |
| 11:45.16 | clock_ | I didn't ask about features of gmail |
| 11:46.16 | d_rossberg | yes, you need an gmail account to subscribe |
| 11:46.40 | d_rossberg | but you don't need to use them for other things/communication |
| 11:47.38 | clock_ | and if the gmail accounts terms and conditions are unacceptable for you then you cannot participate on GSoC? |
| 11:48.47 | d_rossberg | as i said: you need the account to subscribe |
| 11:49.01 | archivist | bend your principles a bit, it wont hurt |
| 11:49.03 | clock_ | OK so the participation on GSoC is bound by the gmail terms and conditions |
| 11:49.54 | clock_ | archivist: your kind request is ignored |
| 11:50.08 | d_rossberg | but the gmail terms and conditions are not bound to all of your communication |
| 11:50.47 | clock_ | whatever - I am not interested in GSoC anyway |
| 11:50.58 | clock_ | I just wanted to know how Google behaves |
| 11:51.55 | d_rossberg | i use may account for GSoC only |
| 11:53.52 | clock_ | Global System of Censorship |
| 11:59.45 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah, sorry |
| 11:59.47 | starseeker | fixes |
| 12:02.48 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30648 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Truncate the string to reset it correctly. |
| 12:29.23 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 13:02.12 | brlcad | actually, you need a "google account" -- you can turn any e-mail into a google account |
| 13:02.35 | brlcad | not just gmail |
| 13:09.09 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 13:14.30 | clock_ | brlcad: in that case you don't actually need to agree with their non-GSoC conditions to participate in GSoC? |
| 13:25.46 | brlcad | right |
| 13:27.47 | d_rossberg | and why did i created my gmail account last year? |
| 13:48.34 | brlcad | d_rossberg: my bad .. |
| 13:48.40 | brlcad | it was a pretty prevalent misconception |
| 13:48.50 | brlcad | only clarified this year |
| 13:51.29 | mafm | GSoC: We received more than 7,000 applications, compared with last year's count of 6,179; we look forward to bringing you more updates on applicant demographics over the next few days. |
| 13:51.47 | mafm | it seems that they got what they wanted, after all |
| 13:51.54 | brlcad | sorta |
| 13:52.06 | brlcad | this year fairs rather well for students |
| 13:52.28 | brlcad | student applications only increased by about 13% |
| 13:52.44 | brlcad | org/slots increased by about 30% |
| 13:53.19 | brlcad | so chances of getting accepted are considerably higher (on average) this year than they were last year |
| 13:54.38 | mafm | well, that depends mostly on the number of *students accepted*, not the number of orgs :) |
| 13:57.56 | brlcad | yes, but it's already been said that the number of slots will correspond to the increase in slots |
| 13:58.06 | brlcad | er increase in orgs |
| 13:58.32 | mafm | so ~1200 students |
| 15:04.47 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30649 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (ged.c mged.bat): Removed hack that was used to have output from rt apps show up in mged's command window in gui mode. |
| 15:39.11 | ``Erik | *yargn* |
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| 16:35.12 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.7.20) | |
| 16:35.30 | andrecastelo | hey everyone |
| 16:35.39 | andrecastelo | hey mafm, brlcad |
| 16:52.05 | mafm | hi |
| 16:52.52 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30650 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Redo the side subtractions, make tire input parameters variables |
| 17:05.04 | yukonbob | starseeker: how is this project going? Fun? Difficult? |
| 17:05.14 | yukonbob | waves in to the cadheads |
| 17:34.59 | pacman87 | waves back |
| 17:35.57 | pacman87 | yukonbob: give any more thought to your acoustic modelling? |
| 17:53.35 | yukonbob | pacman87: hey |
| 17:54.12 | pacman87 | hi |
| 17:54.25 | yukonbob | pacman87: re: accoustic modelling -- no haven't thought more about it -- I _have_ had the idea for ~1yr, though, so the idea isn't only 1week old to me... |
| 17:55.18 | yukonbob | what I need to do is start exploring the rt facilities and just "playing" -- then determining what "light models" map to what "sonic models" and sync-up parameters (I think) :) |
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| 18:00.58 | yukonbob | wonders out loud: /me wonders if the best way to process a scene would be to map single-bounce waves, and order by distance to determine the time (of audio signal), and then map double-bounces, and process the same, then triple, etc., etc. |
| 18:01.19 | yukonbob | s/waves/rasy |
| 18:01.22 | yukonbob | *rays |
| 18:03.10 | yukonbob | s/accoustic/acoustic/ |
| 18:03.13 | pacman87 | doing a breadth-first calculation? |
| 18:03.35 | pacman87 | wide and shallow first, then deeper and narrower |
| 18:04.27 | yukonbob | what do you mean by "wide" and "narrow"? |
| 18:04.48 | pacman87 | a depth-first approach would be to start with a direction |
| 18:04.56 | pacman87 | and trace it back to the sound source |
| 18:05.10 | pacman87 | with as many reflections as you want |
| 18:05.25 | pacman87 | then do the same with the next direction/ray |
| 18:05.51 | pacman87 | what you're saying is to get the first bounce from every direction |
| 18:06.00 | pacman87 | then get the second bounce from every direction |
| 18:06.09 | pacman87 | and so on |
| 18:06.57 | yukonbob | that's right -- seems most "intuitive" to me; but could just be naive? |
| 18:07.00 | pacman87 | ex: empty cubical room, with you and a sound source |
| 18:07.44 | pacman87 | yukonbob: i'm pretty sure it's faster to do depth-first |
| 18:08.25 | pacman87 | and you can keep track of the sound amplitude/volume too, and stop tracing the path back when its contribution gets too small |
| 18:09.56 | pacman87 | depth-first can be done recursively, so you keep track of the previous hit pints |
| 18:09.58 | pacman87 | points |
| 18:10.04 | yukonbob | pacman87: the way I'm imagining the processing would be doing the breadth-first, then processing all those "same level" items for time/spatialization, so it's closer to producing "serial" output |
| 18:10.34 | yukonbob | re: depth-first and too-small contributions -- that's a good point... |
| 18:11.10 | pacman87 | i'm saying you'd be redoing a lot of the work finding the second level that was already done for the first level |
| 18:11.16 | yukonbob | nods |
| 18:12.01 | yukonbob | right -- I'd end up w/ some exponential Order |
| 18:13.46 | pacman87 | for each hit, you'd need to check the direct path to the source, the reflected path (from the surface normal), and the transmitted path (through the object, direction depends on surface normal and speed of sound outside/inside the material, similar to index of refraction) |
| 18:14.14 | pacman87 | and for each of those, you'd do the same thing again |
| 18:15.49 | pacman87 | and stop when you get to your preset maximum path length to disregard the insignifigant parts |
| 18:18.58 | pacman87 | of course, this all assumes that the objects are not affected by the sound waves. i'm not sure how you'd go about modelling the actual objects vibrating |
| 18:20.44 | brlcad | yukonbob: have you looked at the brl-cad docs for writing a new ray-trace-based application? |
| 18:20.59 | brlcad | what you suggest shouldn't be all that much work to do |
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| 18:28.07 | ``Erik | http://bash.org/?854899 |
| 18:33.43 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:33.45 | yukonbob | brlcad: I've probably seen them, but haven't reviewed them critically with this application in mind.. |
| 18:34.08 | ``Erik | handling interference would be the hard part, I'd imagine |
| 18:34.46 | brlcad | basically it's a fairly simple way to write apps that need to do energy/interaction simulations |
| 18:35.53 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Example_Application |
| 18:36.18 | brlcad | or the more detailed http://brlcad.org/w/images/3/3d/Application_Development.pdf |
| 18:37.06 | mafm | bye |
| 18:37.25 | yukonbob | brlcad: cool |
| 18:37.27 | brlcad | cya mafm |
| 18:37.27 | yukonbob | reviews |
| 18:37.34 | yukonbob | ciao mafm |
| 18:38.19 | brlcad | basically it alll centers around calling rt_shootray() -- you shoot a ray and have it do this or that if you hit or miss |
| 18:39.39 | brlcad | so creating an image is basically shooting a grid of rays with rt_shootray(), for every miss you have background color, for every hit you color the pixel based on what you hit |
| 18:40.14 | pacman87 | brlcad: i just replied to d_rossberg's email, you're cc'd |
| 18:40.15 | brlcad | doing a simulation might involve shooting a "burst cloud" or rays with rt_shootray() and for every hit, shoot another burst cloud, recursively |
| 18:40.21 | brlcad | pacman87: okay |
| 18:41.03 | ``Erik | we need the grid generation crap hoisted into librt :/ |
| 18:41.06 | brlcad | I've not read the initial exchange in detail myself, but it sounds like a lot of the discussion is about sweeping, not revolutions |
| 18:41.34 | brlcad | thinks "solids of revolution" when he reads a revolve -- which are fairly well-defined |
| 18:41.36 | pacman87 | well, the revolution is a special case of a sweep |
| 18:42.01 | brlcad | sure, it's a subset, but the math behind that subset is a helluvalot simpler :) |
| 18:42.28 | brlcad | particularly for implementing things like tess() and plot() |
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| 20:21.47 | prasad_ | what's the best yacc implementation these days |
| 20:21.53 | prasad_ | bison or byacc? |
| 20:24.18 | ``Erik | best for what? O.o bison is the gnu version, byacc is the bsd version... different philosophies |
| 20:24.35 | prasad_ | ic |
| 20:25.01 | prasad_ | best for getting a passing grade |
| 20:25.02 | prasad_ | :o |
| 20:25.44 | yukonbob | prasad_ what are you trying to do? |
| 20:26.20 | prasad_ | modify the yacc spec of this compiler for my class |
| 20:26.32 | prasad_ | dling bison for cygwin right now |
| 20:26.37 | ``Erik | if the spec works with byacc, it's damn solid... bison is ... extended |
| 20:26.40 | prasad_ | so hoping it'll be enough |
| 20:27.31 | prasad_ | erik the defender of bsd |
| 20:27.34 | prasad_ | ;) |
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| 21:22.18 | ``Erik | defender of tools that "just work, damnit" :D |
| 22:43.32 | yukonbob | in prasad_'s case, the answer for "which tool" is "whatever tool that grammar is for" |
| 23:04.06 | ``Erik | I thought I'd alluded to that, but I guess I wasn't very clear :D |
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| 01:43.17 | andrecastelo | good evening |
| 01:43.18 | andrecastelo | hi brlcad |
| 01:54.03 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 02:05.04 | andrecastelo | good night guys hehehe |
| 02:05.16 | andrecastelo | tomorrow i'll be here the whole day :b hehe |
| 02:05.18 | andrecastelo | cya |
| 02:34.41 | starseeker | yukonbob: Yes and yes :-) |
| 03:34.00 | yukonbob | starseeker: heh :) |
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| 04:44.31 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30651 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Fix subtractions for ell intersections so wireframe does not extend so far beyond actual tire surface. |
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| 07:43.50 | brlcad | yay brep csg reply |
| 07:44.06 | brlcad | waves g'morning/g'night to d_rossberg |
| 08:35.23 | d_rossberg | wishes a well sleeping to brlcad! |
| 09:56.23 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:56.58 | mafm | hallo |
| 10:50.36 | *** join/#brlcad SJ (n=surya@203.200.95.130) | |
| 10:50.44 | SJ | hey guys |
| 11:00.24 | mafm | hey |
| 11:01.52 | SJ | this is hippieindamakin8 btw :) |
| 11:06.00 | mafm | :D |
| 11:18.49 | SJ | sean can u gimme a link to Mr.Mike Muuss's papers on ray tracing |
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| 13:12.19 | andrecastelo | hi everyone |
| 13:13.47 | mafm | hi |
| 14:40.58 | brlcad | yawns |
| 15:00.27 | prasad_ | arrr |
| 15:06.48 | ``Erik | yaaarrrgggghhhhhh, matey |
| 15:08.45 | poolio | brlcad: shouldn't you bet at work already? :) |
| 15:17.07 | mafm | nobody should bet at work, specially with the bosses |
| 15:19.32 | poolio | mafm: yeah yeah...I'm still getting used to this keyboard |
| 15:24.09 | mafm | which keyboard is that? |
| 15:27.56 | brlcad | poolio: yep |
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| 16:38.51 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 16:39.43 | andrecastelo | yukonbob: good morning / afternoon :) |
| 16:59.17 | andrecastelo | is there a point list structure already implemented in brlcad ? |
| 17:01.57 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 17:27.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30652 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: ReadEnvStr must be called within a function or a section. Also, PROGRAMFILES cannot be set (i.e. its a constant defined by nsis). Put the ReadEnvStr inside the .onInit callback function. |
| 18:01.19 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-82-18.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:37.46 | *** join/#brlcad micges (n=michu@public-gprs66780.centertel.pl) | |
| 18:38.19 | *** part/#brlcad micges (n=michu@public-gprs66780.centertel.pl) | |
| 18:40.26 | mafm | heading off, take care |
| 18:51.47 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
| 19:19.34 | *** join/#brlcad fi-dschi (n=philipp@p5498A033.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) | |
| 19:53.58 | fi-dschi | hello, is there somebody listening? |
| 19:54.53 | fi-dschi | I need some help as I don't succeed in compiling brlcad for arch linux i686 |
| 19:56.01 | fi-dschi | You may look at the last 263 lines of output at http://pastebin.com/m55261921 |
| 19:57.16 | fi-dschi | It seems to be a problem connected to asc2g |
| 19:57.49 | fi-dschi | My CFLAGS and CXXFLAGS are -march=athlon-xp -O2 -pipe |
| 20:48.21 | brlcad | fi-dschi: hello |
| 20:48.49 | fi-dschi | hello |
| 20:49.09 | brlcad | fi-dschi: I can't get to pastebin.com from current location, could you repost to pastebin.bzflag.bz ? |
| 20:49.16 | fi-dschi | ok |
| 20:50.43 | fi-dschi | brlcad:http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m42158c73 |
| 20:51.27 | prasad_ | who has vmware expreience |
| 20:51.34 | brlcad | fi-dschi: well the good news is that the build completed |
| 20:51.57 | brlcad | ~translate de en Ungültiger Maschinenbefehl |
| 20:52.26 | fi-dschi | in en it is invalid machine code |
| 20:52.44 | prasad_ | ~translate jp en konichiwa |
| 20:52.49 | fi-dschi | hello |
| 20:52.51 | prasad_ | boo |
| 20:53.02 | prasad_ | ~translate en jp hello |
| 20:53.10 | prasad_ | ah nice :) |
| 20:53.55 | brlcad | fi-dschi: if you run "src/conv/asc2g", what does it report? |
| 20:54.00 | brlcad | same error? |
| 20:54.03 | brlcad | or a usage statement? |
| 20:54.52 | fi-dschi | tells me how to use |
| 20:55.02 | fi-dschi | Usage: asc2g file.asc file.g .... |
| 20:55.20 | brlcad | try: cd db && ../src/conv/asc2g operators.asc operators.g |
| 20:55.38 | fi-dschi | from inside src/conv? |
| 20:55.44 | fi-dschi | ah, ok |
| 20:56.02 | brlcad | no, from inside db/ |
| 20:56.09 | fi-dschi | this gives me "invalid machine instruction" |
| 20:56.12 | brlcad | rather .. from the top level |
| 20:56.13 | brlcad | hm |
| 20:56.43 | brlcad | then from db/ try this: ../libtool --mode=execute gdb --args ../src/conv/asc2g operators.asc operators.g |
| 20:57.39 | fi-dschi | reports that there is no lobtool in ../ |
| 20:58.16 | brlcad | hopefully no libtool? |
| 20:58.24 | fi-dschi | yes, of course |
| 20:58.24 | brlcad | not lobtool :) |
| 20:58.27 | brlcad | ok |
| 20:58.53 | brlcad | that's odd .. are you building out of dir? |
| 20:59.16 | fi-dschi | no, this is done by some tools |
| 20:59.40 | brlcad | find /home/philipp/Software/abs/brlcad/src/brlcad-7.12.0 -name libtool |
| 20:59.40 | fi-dschi | but the files should be from the src archive |
| 21:00.08 | fi-dschi | ok, it is therr |
| 21:00.09 | brlcad | hello andrecastelo :) |
| 21:00.15 | fi-dschi | this was my mistake |
| 21:00.18 | brlcad | then ../libtool should have worked.. ;) |
| 21:00.22 | fi-dschi | no |
| 21:00.41 | fi-dschi | ah ok |
| 21:00.42 | brlcad | "then from db/ try this" |
| 21:00.49 | fi-dschi | i didn't understand something else |
| 21:00.52 | brlcad | k |
| 21:00.55 | fi-dschi | ../libtool: line 6566: exec: gdb: not found |
| 21:01.02 | brlcad | eep |
| 21:01.03 | fi-dschi | that's the output |
| 21:01.05 | brlcad | no gdb installed? |
| 21:01.24 | fi-dschi | thanks |
| 21:01.35 | fi-dschi | this is missing as a deendency |
| 21:01.55 | fi-dschi | ok, so I wil try again with gdb, thank you very much |
| 21:02.10 | fi-dschi | this will need some time |
| 21:02.53 | brlcad | what platform type is this? |
| 21:03.03 | fi-dschi | platform type? |
| 21:03.06 | fi-dschi | i686? |
| 21:03.06 | brlcad | hardware |
| 21:03.12 | fi-dschi | athlon xp |
| 21:04.42 | brlcad | hmm, an easy/quick test would be to take off the -march=athlon-xp option and see if the instruction error goes away |
| 21:05.01 | fi-dschi | does it compile faster then? |
| 21:05.12 | prasad_ | heh |
| 21:05.25 | brlcad | if you want a fast test compile, use the default options |
| 21:05.38 | brlcad | maybe just ./configure --enable-all |
| 21:05.43 | brlcad | no flags |
| 21:06.25 | fi-dschi | tis is all done by scripts, I normally type "makepkg" which will download the sources, compile and create a package for the pkgmanager of archlinux |
| 21:06.41 | fi-dschi | but I will try manually |
| 21:11.23 | brlcad | ahh, the archlinux guy hangs out here |
| 21:11.38 | fi-dschi | yes, thats me |
| 21:11.44 | brlcad | oh heh |
| 21:11.58 | fi-dschi | did you read the package comments? |
| 21:12.25 | brlcad | are you louipc ? |
| 21:12.31 | fi-dschi | no, this is the maintainer |
| 21:12.34 | fi-dschi | i am fi-dschi |
| 21:27.34 | brlcad | okay, fi-dschi -- sorry about that :) |
| 21:27.57 | brlcad | from our perspective, we've only dealt with lou to date |
| 21:28.13 | brlcad | he commits the archlinux changes directly to our repository misc/archlinux in your sources |
| 21:31.55 | fi-dschi | he told me to ask for help in this channel |
| 21:39.05 | brlcad | i highly suspect the problem has to do with the compilation settings and math computations, but it's really hard to say without seeing a stack trace |
| 21:39.15 | brlcad | that error just usually indicates bad compiler ju ju |
| 21:40.15 | fi-dschi | is there still a problem? I thought there was simply gdb missing? |
| 21:40.48 | brlcad | hm? |
| 21:41.34 | brlcad | gdb was just to try to figure out why it was reporting a bad machine instruction |
| 21:42.28 | fi-dschi | oh, so it should now give a more detailed error message? |
| 21:45.31 | brlcad | right |
| 21:45.36 | brlcad | to see if it was code or compiler |
| 21:45.39 | brlcad | or both |
| 21:46.01 | fi-dschi | ok, compilation has just finished |
| 21:46.10 | fi-dschi | and there are no errors as far as i can see |
| 21:46.35 | brlcad | ah, cool |
| 21:46.54 | brlcad | that would 'likely' be a compiler bug for that -march |
| 21:47.09 | brlcad | or something being provoked with non-ieee floats or something similar |
| 21:47.29 | fi-dschi | ok, i will try again with my cflags or what else can i doà |
| 21:47.33 | fi-dschi | ? |
| 21:47.53 | brlcad | try again with --enable-optimized later |
| 21:48.23 | brlcad | that turns on a lot more optimization flags, still hardware generic, but should do much better than O2 |
| 21:48.50 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669639.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:48.53 | brlcad | have you seen the PKGBUILD file loui wrote up? |
| 21:48.56 | brlcad | speak of the devil |
| 21:48.58 | louipc | :D |
| 21:49.01 | fi-dschi | :D |
| 21:49.07 | fi-dschi | yes |
| 21:49.08 | louipc | yeah I was coming in for that exact purpose |
| 21:49.17 | brlcad | howdy louipc |
| 21:49.28 | fi-dschi | did you get the post? |
| 21:49.42 | louipc | yep |
| 21:51.13 | louipc | yeah I took out any special configure flags, only --prefix is left because I had a problem with asc2g recently and was going to debug. but it worked fine with the flags removed hehe |
| 21:52.55 | louipc | brlcad: greetings indeed |
| 21:54.18 | louipc | fi-dschi: maybe the ./configure output might give a clue... particularly the summary |
| 21:54.49 | fi-dschi | for the default ./configure? one moment |
| 21:55.16 | louipc | ooh nevermind you found the problem? |
| 21:55.36 | fi-dschi | me? no. i donÃt even understand what is going on! |
| 21:55.56 | brlcad | louipc: the error is a run-time machine code error .. which is usually compilation settings or floating point data |
| 21:55.57 | louipc | does it work if you have gdb installed? |
| 21:56.16 | fi-dschi | with ./configure --all-enabled, yes |
| 21:56.43 | louipc | brlcad: yeah I was thinking something along those lines |
| 21:56.49 | brlcad | it worked if he removed his custom CFLAGS, which includes the -march optimization flag for a particular generation of athlons |
| 21:57.20 | brlcad | I suspect it's just that -march flag causing the problem |
| 21:58.37 | louipc | ah |
| 21:58.39 | louipc | nods |
| 21:59.08 | brlcad | athlon-xp is either buggy or not the right architecture |
| 21:59.16 | louipc | fi-dschi: it should work with just generic x86_64 flags |
| 21:59.44 | fi-dschi | is this used by ./configure --all-enabled? |
| 21:59.46 | louipc | well another user told me it works :D |
| 21:59.56 | brlcad | --enable-optimized should do the trick if performance is what you're going for |
| 22:00.16 | brlcad | fi-dschi: run "uname -a" |
| 22:00.26 | fi-dschi | but athlon-xp should be the optimized flag for me? |
| 22:00.27 | louipc | fi-dschi: ./configure by itself |
| 22:00.43 | fi-dschi | Linux PHPC_ARCH 2.6.24-ARCH #1 SMP PREEMPT Sun Mar 30 11:40:06 CEST 2008 i686 AMD Athlon(tm) AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux |
| 22:00.55 | louipc | :D |
| 22:01.27 | fi-dschi | some problems in the past made me think that athlon-xp was wrong |
| 22:01.39 | louipc | ya |
| 22:01.46 | fi-dschi | but my cpu is called athlon-xp |
| 22:01.55 | fi-dschi | it is even printed on it |
| 22:02.16 | louipc | oh you're running i686 cool |
| 22:02.47 | brlcad | ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized CFLAGS="-mtune=i686" |
| 22:02.52 | fi-dschi | this is the archlinux default isn't it? |
| 22:03.40 | louipc | archlinux default flags are CFLAGS="-march=i686 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe" |
| 22:03.48 | louipc | if you go with that it should work |
| 22:03.50 | fi-dschi | ok, i see |
| 22:03.52 | brlcad | that doesn't necessarily mean that gcc thinks you have what it calls athlon-xp nor does it mean that the optimization loop in gcc isn't buggy ;) |
| 22:04.43 | fi-dschi | but shouldn't i be looking for the best fit? |
| 22:04.43 | brlcad | notes that --enable-optimized is more agressive than "-march=i686 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe" |
| 22:04.49 | fi-dschi | athlon, athlon-xp, i686? |
| 22:05.14 | fi-dschi | it has a higher priority? |
| 22:05.20 | brlcad | fi-dschi: it really won't matter -- the difference is going to be minimal |
| 22:06.29 | fi-dschi | there are just so many sites telling you which cflags you should use :) |
| 22:06.40 | louipc | hehe |
| 22:08.06 | fi-dschi | another question to the above: what does "enable-optimized" do? does it e.g. use athlon-xp if this is the best fitting? |
| 22:08.44 | louipc | it takes twice as long ;D |
| 22:09.07 | brlcad | fi-dschi: in the summary at the end of configure, it tells ou the flags it'll use |
| 22:09.14 | brlcad | s/ou/you/ |
| 22:10.50 | brlcad | it basically turns on several optimization flags, almost as many as it can without modifying ieee behavior or becoming platform/hardware dependent |
| 22:10.50 | fi-dschi | so what are the settings in makepkg.conf for if the configure script can find the best flags on its own? |
| 22:11.31 | fi-dschi | does this create platform depedency? |
| 22:11.37 | louipc | it's for packages which don't have such cool configure options :D |
| 22:12.03 | brlcad | archlinux users may also just want to override the flags with their own, or make their build platform dependent (for that extra 2% performance) |
| 22:12.31 | louipc | that too, but we're generally not ricers |
| 22:12.32 | fi-dschi | ok, so let's set the flags back to default :) |
| 22:12.44 | louipc | fi-dschi: good idea |
| 22:13.49 | louipc | CXXFLAGS are the same as well |
| 22:14.39 | fi-dschi | yes, i know that |
| 22:19.04 | fi-dschi | i will try to recompile with makepkg tomorrow. If there are problems you will hear from me again :). Thank ou so far and good night. |
| 22:19.17 | fi-dschi | s/ou/you/ ;) |
| 22:19.23 | brlcad | cheers |
| 22:19.25 | louipc | alright take care |
| 22:45.49 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 22:46.19 | spike_ | is running off to the gym, brb |
| 23:06.53 | brlcad | cya |
| 00:58.56 | andrecastelo | hi guys |
| 00:58.58 | andrecastelo | i'm back |
| 00:59.00 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 01:00.03 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 01:00.15 | brlcad | was just going through more applications now |
| 01:00.20 | andrecastelo | hey, i have something to show you |
| 01:00.33 | brlcad | I hope you have your pants on |
| 01:00.46 | andrecastelo | lol hehehe |
| 01:01.27 | andrecastelo | brlcad: here -> http://pastebin.com/m1cd03a7a |
| 01:01.47 | andrecastelo | can you give me some feedback ? :) |
| 01:03.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30653 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (opt.c rt.1 view.c): |
| 01:03.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: Added a -k option to rt. Specifies a cutting plane to allow faster computation |
| 01:03.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: of cutaway images. Note that this produces an approximation of the image that |
| 01:03.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: would be produced by actually subtracting the equivalent halfspace. This may |
| 01:03.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: satisfy bug #1812560 Cutaway view 210x slower. |
| 01:05.15 | brlcad | andrecastelo: nice work |
| 01:06.08 | brlcad | the only suggestion I'd make would be instead of using that forw linked list pointer, toss in a struct bu_list * instead |
| 01:06.37 | brlcad | that's our linked list structure (technically a bidirectional linked list, there are a variety of BU_ macros related to it in include/bu.h) |
| 01:06.52 | andrecastelo | hm ok, like struct point_list { struct bu_list * point_bu_list; point_t pt_cell; }; ? |
| 01:07.12 | andrecastelo | yeah, i did notice and i first tried something that could be used with those macros |
| 01:07.29 | andrecastelo | but i didn't know it deeply |
| 01:07.34 | andrecastelo | i'll change and use the macros |
| 01:07.39 | brlcad | yeah, that's the basic idea |
| 01:07.47 | brlcad | maybe a better name :) |
| 01:08.02 | brlcad | usually hp or head |
| 01:08.17 | brlcad | or l |
| 01:08.18 | *** join/#brlcad DaytonaJohn (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 01:08.23 | brlcad | usually 'l' |
| 01:09.02 | andrecastelo | PointListHead ? |
| 01:18.17 | brlcad | struct bu_list *l; |
| 01:19.34 | brlcad | doesn't really what you name it though -- you loop via the macros and a ref to whatever you call it |
| 01:23.23 | brlcad | DaytonaJohn: did you see the message from leslie? |
| 01:28.34 | andrecastelo | do i have to declare a struct * bu_list or a struct * point_list to iterate through the list ? |
| 01:30.51 | andrecastelo | nevermind |
| 01:31.58 | brlcad | due to the good ol' nature of C, you can actually cast between the two so long as the list is the first element |
| 01:32.19 | brlcad | good ol polymorphism bastardization of C :) |
| 01:32.51 | brlcad | but in practice, you generally refer to struct point_list *my_list; then use my_list.l |
| 01:34.21 | andrecastelo | brlcad: http://pastebin.com/d59ab103c |
| 01:42.05 | brlcad | andrecastelo: looks better, so the last two things would be to fill in the list and print the CPA in the summary |
| 01:43.00 | andrecastelo | ok.. one thing - i'm having trouble with bu_list - i need a struct point_list * forw in struct point_list ? |
| 01:46.32 | brlcad | no, bu_list provides it |
| 01:46.37 | brlcad | you don't worry about forward/next |
| 01:47.32 | andrecastelo | weird |
| 01:47.43 | andrecastelo | if i don't put it, i get this error - http://pastebin.com/m2fb6cdb1 |
| 01:48.20 | brlcad | andrecastelo: there's a fairly straight-forward bu_list example in src/libbu/temp.c |
| 01:48.29 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll take a look |
| 01:49.29 | brlcad | ah, yes, you need to pass the .l to BU_FOR |
| 01:49.34 | brlcad | not just area_p->area_points |
| 01:49.52 | brlcad | so something like area_p->area_points->l |
| 01:50.23 | brlcad | it's usually not a pointer so you don't have to worry about memory allocation of your head node |
| 01:50.39 | andrecastelo | ah ok |
| 01:51.12 | brlcad | if you make it not a pointer, it becomes something like &(area_p->area_points.l) |
| 01:51.41 | brlcad | interesting, it looks like the initial slot allocations can be roughly characterized as log(#submissions)^2 * 2 |
| 01:53.17 | andrecastelo | where #submissions is ? |
| 01:53.22 | andrecastelo | ah nvm lol |
| 01:53.59 | andrecastelo | how many submissions did brl-cad receive ? |
| 01:55.06 | brlcad | more than enough :) |
| 01:55.37 | brlcad | DaytonaJohn: sending note out now |
| 01:55.45 | andrecastelo | ponders a new way to get that information |
| 01:55.55 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 01:56.03 | DaytonaJohn | brlcad: good, I'll watch for it |
| 02:00.46 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad : the center point is related to presented area or exposed area ?? (if exposed, just gather the points in ray_hit() ??) |
| 02:00.54 | andrecastelo | rayhit* |
| 02:10.55 | brlcad | andrecastelo: technically for either, but exposed is what it usually refers to |
| 02:11.06 | brlcad | that's the one they care about |
| 02:12.31 | andrecastelo | hm ok |
| 02:13.56 | andrecastelo | so, to make it versatile, struct area should have two lists of points ? |
| 02:16.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30654 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 02:16.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: john added a new -k 'kutaway view' option to rt that allows users to specify a |
| 02:16.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: cutting plane for fast(er) computation of cutaway images that approximates the |
| 02:16.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: image that would be produced by actually subtracting the equivalent halfspace |
| 02:16.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: and potentially satisfies clock's sf bug 1812560 (Cutaway view 210x slower) but |
| 02:17.01 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: still makes this an absurd-yet-fun run-on sentence. |
| 02:18.00 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yeah, if you wanted to match what that struct does, you'll see it keeps a counter for both presented and exposed |
| 02:19.23 | brlcad | the faster parellel-smp-safe way would be to utilize a fixed results array for all possible hit points, so all cpus could fill in values for a given cell independently |
| 02:19.39 | brlcad | as it stands implemented, there's massive lock contention on those counter variables |
| 02:20.01 | brlcad | that's a bigger change though, for later |
| 02:22.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30655 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: No functionality change - just adding some options for printing Maxima style equations for debugging. Committing for now so they're available if I have to throw out subsequent tests. |
| 02:22.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 02:23.35 | starseeker | Sorry brlcad, I'll back out the noise later - just playing safe in case I need 'em tomorrow |
| 02:24.27 | starseeker | finds it makes life easier if he can just cut and paste for confirmation with Maxima's linsolve... |
| 02:31.37 | brlcad | no skin off my back, it's your proc-db :) |
| 02:31.51 | brlcad | just funny matching maxima's output :) |
| 02:32.09 | brlcad | should make some libbn output formatters :) |
| 02:32.35 | brlcad | pacman87: *ping* |
| 02:33.01 | pacman87 | brlcad: pong |
| 02:33.23 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 02:37.55 | andrecastelo | the second parameter of bu_malloc() is for what exactly?? (genptr bu_malloc(size_t, const char *)) |
| 02:41.09 | brlcad | debugging label |
| 02:41.15 | brlcad | just but the name of the object |
| 02:41.18 | brlcad | "foo" |
| 02:41.24 | brlcad | s/but/put/ |
| 02:41.52 | brlcad | the run-time debugging facilities will hierarchically print out the labels for allocation/deallocation |
| 02:42.24 | brlcad | so you usually set it as "alloc area_points" during bu_malloc and "free area_points" during bu_free |
| 02:42.55 | brlcad | so you can match up allocations/deallocations (if that is what you're debugging) |
| 02:43.07 | andrecastelo | hm ok ok |
| 02:43.30 | brlcad | ranks andrecastelo's app |
| 02:43.47 | andrecastelo | shakes |
| 02:44.20 | brlcad | hmm, I still need more info from several people |
| 02:44.24 | pacman87 | brlcad: you wanted me? |
| 02:44.55 | brlcad | heya pacman87 |
| 02:45.03 | brlcad | oh, missed the pong, jeez |
| 02:45.10 | brlcad | too quick for me :) |
| 02:45.36 | pacman87 | dorm room, so i'm usually not very far from my computer ;) |
| 02:46.20 | brlcad | hmm.. what did I want you for, oh yes -- I know we've talked about it, but are you still intending to submit a patch? |
| 02:46.40 | pacman87 | yes |
| 02:46.53 | pacman87 | i'm coding now |
| 02:47.05 | pacman87 | my second test this week was tonight |
| 02:56.51 | brlcad | okay, cool |
| 02:57.14 | brlcad | if all you can get done is just one or two of the callback funcs for what you were implementing, that's certainly better than nothing |
| 02:58.27 | pacman87 | when do you want it by? |
| 03:06.43 | brlcad | I'd suggest just submitting what you have (presuming "something" works) so it can be reviewed (some of the mentors have only tomorrow to rank, others longer) and then continuing from there if you want through to absolutely no later than the 16th |
| 03:08.02 | pacman87 | brlcad: i'm not sure how 'testable' it will be without adding it to mged or the other steps |
| 03:08.34 | brlcad | testable in the sense of being able to add it to the build, get it to compile :) |
| 03:08.40 | brlcad | we can read code ;) |
| 03:08.52 | pacman87 | i'm planning on submitting it when i get done tonight |
| 03:08.58 | brlcad | okay |
| 03:09.01 | pacman87 | 'get done' = wnen i go to bed ;) |
| 03:09.36 | pacman87 | and keep working on it until it's usable |
| 03:10.49 | brlcad | cool |
| 03:30.22 | andrecastelo | well, i'm off to bed now |
| 03:30.33 | andrecastelo | i'll take care of this tomorrow ;) |
| 03:30.37 | andrecastelo | cya guys |
| 03:31.13 | brlcad | cya andrecastelo |
| 03:31.23 | andrecastelo | cya brlcad |
| 03:32.59 | brlcad | ~seen mafm |
| 03:33.01 | ibot | mafm <n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 8h 52m 35s ago, saying: 'heading off, take care'. |
| 03:33.46 | brlcad | yukonbob & ``Erik: you've got mail |
| 04:03.48 | brlcad | ~seen jdoliner |
| 04:03.49 | ibot | jdoliner <n=jdoliner@wireless-239-77.uchicago.edu> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 8d 9h 53m 2s ago, saying: 'brlcad are you present?'. |
| 04:09.07 | pacman87 | mergesort for a 4-element list is probably overkill :) |
| 04:10.56 | starseeker | growls... the solver isn't in agreement with maxima, but the difference is harder to spot this time... |
| 04:15.25 | brlcad | pacman87: probably :) |
| 04:17.50 | pacman87 | but i didn't feel like coding a mess of nested if-else blocks |
| 05:32.00 | yukonbob | brlcad: /me sees he's got mail -- also thinks he's running a misconfigured MTA :P -- gotsta fix so I'm not part of the spam problem... |
| 05:50.02 | brlcad | yukonbob: hm? misconfigured mta? |
| 06:06.41 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-200.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:02.14 | spike_ | thinks its time to sleep, night everyone |
| 07:02.56 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:41.36 | pacman87 | what are uv_du and uv_dv used for in struct uvcoord? |
| 08:19.25 | hippieindamakin8 | :( so the patch was useless |
| 08:20.22 | pacman87 | hippieindamakin8: what patch? |
| 08:21.08 | hippieindamakin8 | i submitted a patch for nsis script |
| 08:21.35 | pacman87 | non-english windows %PROGRAM FILES%? |
| 08:21.42 | pacman87 | or was that a different one |
| 08:22.10 | hippieindamakin8 | kind of yes :) |
| 08:22.36 | pacman87 | why is it useless? |
| 08:22.45 | hippieindamakin8 | it doesnt work :P |
| 08:22.54 | hippieindamakin8 | as brlcad pointed out |
| 08:23.04 | pacman87 | you know why not? |
| 08:23.18 | hippieindamakin8 | and did u submit any ? |
| 08:23.25 | pacman87 | i'm compiling now |
| 08:23.28 | pacman87 | to make sure it works |
| 08:23.39 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 08:23.51 | hippieindamakin8 | i dint chk it as i dint have windows with me.. |
| 08:24.01 | pacman87 | cross your fingers :) |
| 08:24.08 | hippieindamakin8 | which patch are u working on ? |
| 08:24.19 | pacman87 | adding a hyperboloid of one sheet |
| 08:24.31 | pacman87 | it's not completely finished yet |
| 08:24.37 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 08:24.40 | hippieindamakin8 | naice |
| 08:24.59 | pacman87 | still needs a few functions implemented, and hooks into mged |
| 08:25.58 | hippieindamakin8 | so implementing a new primitive |
| 08:26.14 | pacman87 | an 'easy' primitive |
| 08:26.34 | pacman87 | since my GSoC proposal is implementing 'hard' primitive(s) |
| 08:34.20 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 08:34.37 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall start working on another patch :) |
| 08:34.47 | pacman87 | got an idea? |
| 08:53.31 | pacman87 | my computer is embarassingly slow |
| 08:55.25 | clock_ | pacman87: ZX Spectrum? |
| 08:58.37 | pacman87 | clock_: not quite :) |
| 09:00.03 | pacman87 | 2.8 GHz P4, 533MHz FSB, 1280MB DDR2700 RAM |
| 09:02.07 | hippieindamakin8 | i have no idea looking through the bugs and the to do list |
| 09:06.27 | pacman87 | 4:04 - time not found |
| 09:34.22 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:35.26 | mafm | hi |
| 09:35.33 | pacman87 | hi mafm |
| 09:59.26 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 10:08.58 | pacman87 | ~pastebin |
| 10:08.59 | ibot | [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste |
| 10:10.12 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m4039501d |
| 10:10.39 | pacman87 | if anyone could shed some light on that, i'd be quite grateful |
| 10:14.00 | pacman87 | i'm holding off on the patch until brlcad actually compiles, but until then, here's the g_hyp.c: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/g_hyp.c |
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| 13:38.30 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.41.1) | |
| 13:38.39 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 13:40.20 | brlcad | good morning andrecastelo |
| 13:41.50 | brlcad | pacman87: uv coordinates are for uv mapping :) e.g., wrapping a texture |
| 13:45.11 | brlcad | pacman87: should post up the file to the patches tracker and link it in your app too, but looks good |
| 13:47.59 | brlcad | andrecastelo: similar for you, don't see a patch link in your app |
| 13:48.23 | brlcad | ah, found it |
| 13:48.54 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm still brewing my patch :) but i'll link to it once it's ready |
| 13:49.05 | brlcad | yeah, just remembered |
| 13:49.13 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
| 13:59.05 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, can i use rayhit() (in viewarea.c) to store the points in the areas ? could i use partition->hit->hit_point ? |
| 13:59.47 | brlcad | you shouldn't modify the partition directly |
| 13:59.57 | brlcad | other than readin git |
| 14:00.28 | brlcad | but otherwise, yes -- rayhit is the hit callback, so that's where you know what/where you hit the geometry for a given cell |
| 14:00.51 | andrecastelo | yeah, i could read the partition->hit->hit_points and store them in the respective areas |
| 14:07.30 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: did you not put your irc nick in your proposal? I don't see it (you did read the submission guidelines, right?) .. and you've not done well to answer your app comments |
| 14:08.32 | brlcad | wanders for a bit |
| 14:09.05 | *** join/#brlcad camcorder (n=draco@81.213.157.51) | |
| 14:10.06 | hippieindamakin8 | hey i am answering it rt now |
| 14:15.47 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, i am sorry .. been a bit busy with the end semester exams appraoching ya i am updating them |
| 14:17.15 | Axman6 | i has my last mid-sem tonight |
| 14:17.20 | Axman6 | on haskell! |
| 14:22.02 | pacman87 | brlcad: re; uv mapping, i know what the U and V are, but i'm not sure what du and dv are for. struct uvcoords has 4 members, not just the two |
| 14:23.03 | Axman6 | change in u and v? |
| 14:23.07 | ``Erik | dorks with this silly spreadsheet thingiemajigger |
| 14:23.13 | Axman6 | as in, delta u, delta v |
| 14:23.31 | Axman6 | or some odd form of derivitive? |
| 14:23.58 | Axman6 | wow, i've been doing way too much physics, calculus and linear algebra |
| 14:26.13 | pacman87 | Axman6: that was my guess too, but i'm not sure what it's with respect to (as in dy/dx) |
| 14:26.37 | Axman6 | du/dv? |
| 14:26.46 | Axman6 | chain rule stylez |
| 14:27.21 | hippieindamakin8 | in brlcad if i get it rt.. mged accesses the primitive from librt and that particular file in librt renders it as well |
| 14:28.16 | hippieindamakin8 | pacman87, it is not dy/dx it is delta u and delta v |
| 14:28.31 | hippieindamakin8 | its not the gradient it is the difference |
| 14:28.37 | Axman6 | whoot, i was right |
| 14:28.55 | hippieindamakin8 | ya Axman6 |
| 14:28.55 | pacman87 | difference between what? |
| 14:30.13 | hippieindamakin8 | i dont know wat u are dealing with pacman87 :) i am not sure :P |
| 14:31.44 | hippieindamakin8 | if u and v are the co-ordinated delta u is increment |
| 14:32.59 | pacman87 | right, but the increment to what? you need two points to get the difference |
| 14:34.21 | Axman6 | well, it could be used for a matrix... |
| 14:34.30 | Axman6 | 1 0 du |
| 14:34.36 | Axman6 | 0 1 dv |
| 14:34.41 | Axman6 | 0 0 1 |
| 14:34.48 | hippieindamakin8 | pacman87, i really dont know wat u are dealing with :) |
| 14:35.17 | hippieindamakin8 | pacman87, can u send me if there is some good material for raytracing |
| 14:35.36 | Axman6 | apply that to a point (u,v,1), and you'll get (u+du,v+dv,1) |
| 14:36.00 | Axman6 | learnt this today in his linear algebra lecture |
| 14:37.17 | andrecastelo | suddenly realizes he has to study linear algebra again |
| 14:50.10 | pacman87 | hippieindamakin8: the book i found is 'an introduction to ray tracing', ed. Glassner, isbn0-12-286160-4 |
| 14:51.44 | archivist | Glassner, thats a name I remember, hes done a few books (Graphics Gems etc) |
| 14:53.50 | pacman87 | this book is essentially the notes from the siggraph 88 course on ray tracing |
| 14:56.49 | archivist | we had a user in ##asm saying he was doing ray tracing in assembler yesterday |
| 15:04.02 | pacman87 | any thoughts on this: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m4039501d |
| 15:04.55 | pacman87 | i'm currently going back and re-applying my changes one by one to see what broke it |
| 15:41.34 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54877365.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:51.07 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 16:50.09 | hippieindamakin8 | thanks pacman87 |
| 16:51.45 | hippieindamakin8 | pacman87, do u have an e version of this book ? |
| 16:52.26 | andrecastelo | pacman87: i'd be interested in that too hehehe |
| 17:02.46 | pacman87 | hippieindamakin8 & andrecastelo: no, just the hard copy from my uni library |
| 17:02.49 | pacman87 | sorry |
| 17:03.12 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh i just looked up the lib database :( it aint in the library |
| 17:06.50 | pacman87 | http://books.google.com/books?id=YPblYyLqBM4C&dq=%22an+introduction+to+ray+tracing%22+glassner&pg=PP1&ots=yY581FriR9&sig=HyIgo17F5oFn7gfy_NTdKky-En4&hl=en&prev=http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=opera&rls=en&hs=eE0&q=%22an+introduction+to+ray+tracing%22+glassner&btnG=Search&sa=X&oi=print&ct=title&cad=one-book-with-thumbnail |
| 17:10.41 | hippieindamakin8 | tx |
| 17:12.47 | pacman87 | missing pieces here and there, but that's about as close as you're going to get |
| 17:13.49 | pacman87 | i found the book by looking at course websites for graphics classes, under the prof's 'suggested reading' |
| 17:13.52 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 17:13.58 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 17:14.13 | hippieindamakin8 | ill look up MIT's OCW once |
| 17:16.19 | pacman87 | got a 96 on his tuesday test |
| 17:16.39 | hippieindamakin8 | :) which subject? |
| 17:16.45 | pacman87 | circuits |
| 17:17.00 | pacman87 | second order and AC steady state/phasor analysis |
| 17:17.13 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh which major are u ? |
| 17:17.25 | pacman87 | i'm a MechE, but i'm taking EE courses for fun |
| 17:18.08 | pacman87 | i only need one more ME course, a gov, and 3 electives to graduate |
| 17:18.11 | hippieindamakin8 | hates Mech Engg. |
| 17:18.17 | pacman87 | and i've still got two full semesters left |
| 17:18.33 | pacman87 | what major are you? |
| 17:18.33 | hippieindamakin8 | sadly i am also enrolled in Mech. Eng |
| 17:18.45 | pacman87 | why don't you like it? |
| 17:19.13 | hippieindamakin8 | 3rd year Mech.Engg .. i hate Fluids,i hate Manufacturing |
| 17:19.22 | hippieindamakin8 | i hate material sciences :) |
| 17:19.56 | pacman87 | once you get navier-stokes, fluids is easy |
| 17:20.02 | hippieindamakin8 | i am interested in computer vision , CAD and robotics |
| 17:20.13 | pacman87 | woot, compile worked |
| 17:20.23 | pacman87 | forgot --enable-all on the configure |
| 17:20.44 | pacman87 | time to make the patch files |
| 17:20.51 | hippieindamakin8 | and it is just Navier Stokes equation and why dont u get a computer to solve the equations :P rather than getting it solved by the students in the written exam |
| 17:21.01 | hippieindamakin8 | congrats |
| 17:25.35 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo, this can be of some help |
| 17:25.38 | hippieindamakin8 | http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/6-837Fall2003/LectureNotes/index.htm |
| 17:29.18 | pacman87 | just realized his uv mapping ignores the top/bottom plates :( |
| 17:35.15 | brlcad | pacman87: that error is because it's using a system tcl/tk 8.4 yet compiling the bundled incrTcl (which requires 8.5) -- so you either have to --enable-all on configure (or at least --enable-tcl and --enable-tk) or you can try installing a system incrTcl for 8.4 |
| 17:38.14 | pacman87 | brlcad: thanks, i realized that this morning, when a vanilla svn co gave the same error |
| 17:38.42 | pacman87 | everything compiles now on my end |
| 17:38.49 | pacman87 | and ive got the patch files |
| 17:38.55 | pacman87 | last thing to do is fix my UV mapping |
| 17:41.32 | brlcad | cool |
| 17:57.10 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad.. i'm getting this http://pastebin.com/d47b91c2e when trying to compile this http://pastebin.com/d364f3ce5 ... |
| 17:57.30 | andrecastelo | the compile error on line 6 is the weirdest |
| 17:58.06 | andrecastelo | also, the snippet of code is inside rayhit(), in the exposed areas "for()" block |
| 17:59.19 | andrecastelo | any clues ? |
| 17:59.42 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 18:06.27 | andrecastelo | well, i'll have to go now, i'll try this later |
| 18:06.29 | andrecastelo | cya guys |
| 18:08.55 | pacman87 | patch is up: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1939611&group_id=105292&atid=640804 |
| 18:10.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30656 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Fix two bugs in matrix solver. |
| 18:17.38 | mafm | bye |
| 18:17.43 | brlcad | cya mafm |
| 18:22.06 | ``Erik | blargh |
| 18:22.44 | brlcad | hey yukonbob |
| 18:24.35 | brlcad | pacman87: heh -- for future reference, svn is way better at making patches for you |
| 18:24.38 | brlcad | svn add src/librt/g_hyp.c |
| 18:24.50 | brlcad | then svn status to see what files you've changed/added/removed |
| 18:25.00 | brlcad | then svn diff > your.patch |
| 18:25.08 | brlcad | and it'll have everything in it (including the new file) |
| 18:25.22 | brlcad | much easier to apply that way |
| 18:26.31 | ``Erik | *snicker* |
| 18:26.32 | ``Erik | During a screening interview, I was asked how I would design a bike fit for someone visually impaired. I responded something to the effect of, "What, like, for blind people?", and she answered yes. |
| 18:26.32 | ``Erik | I thought for a moment and then I responded, "Well.. a blind person riding a bike doesn't sound like a very safe idea, so I would make the bike stationary, maybe with a fan blowing in the person's face. He probably wouldn't even know the difference." |
| 18:27.08 | brlcad | hehe |
| 18:31.24 | pacman87 | brlcad: svn diff kept including all the makefiles and that sort of thing |
| 18:31.40 | ``Erik | svn should ignore the generated files :/ |
| 18:33.54 | brlcad | it should ignore anything you've not svn added too |
| 18:34.14 | pacman87 | there's a bunch of .dsp files |
| 18:34.17 | ``Erik | yeh, don't do "svn add *" |
| 18:34.19 | brlcad | you probably did edit the src/librt/Makefile.am -- that could go in the patch |
| 18:34.30 | brlcad | pacman87: ahh.. that would be your editor |
| 18:34.32 | pacman87 | i did, and it's there |
| 18:34.36 | brlcad | shame on it :) |
| 18:34.49 | brlcad | svn status shows files it thinks are modified with an M |
| 18:34.53 | brlcad | the dsp files shouldn't be modified |
| 18:34.59 | brlcad | svn revert those files |
| 18:35.11 | brlcad | svn revert any file you didn't intentionally edit |
| 18:35.19 | brlcad | then they shouldn't be in the diff |
| 18:35.30 | pacman87 | well, that's why i just diff'd the files i did edit |
| 18:35.35 | brlcad | that matters anyways for commit, if you'd svn commit, you'd be commiting those files with changes too |
| 18:36.08 | brlcad | yeah, you can always svn diff path/to/file.c path/to/file2.c ... > mypatch |
| 18:36.30 | brlcad | but those files shouldn't be modified -- that's a misconfiguration somewhere along the line |
| 18:39.12 | brlcad | pacman87: here's the config file I usually use: http://brlcad.org/~sean/subversion.config |
| 18:42.00 | pacman87 | and that goes in ./.svn/? |
| 18:42.44 | brlcad | can copy that to ~/.subversion/config |
| 18:46.39 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 18:48.19 | ``Erik | hum, in g_hyp.c, the import/export functions use ntohd/htond solely instead of using ntohl/htonl on the long ints (like magics) O.o ("shoudl work" on most current os's, but isn' guaranteed) |
| 19:02.21 | pacman87 | ``Erik: i haven't implemented those yet, what's currently there now is what was in g_xxx.c |
| 19:03.18 | pacman87 | the patch details lists the functions i've actually done |
| 19:06.23 | ``Erik | import5/export5 I meant, no one cares about v4 anymore :) |
| 19:06.32 | yukonbob | ``Erik: re: bike -- LOL |
| 19:07.11 | ``Erik | hrm? oh, clear? my favorite color :D |
| 19:09.53 | ``Erik | has been saying that since highschool |
| 19:29.45 | pacman87 | anyone care to give this a read through? http://brlcad.org/wiki/Revolve_Primitive |
| 19:34.22 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30657 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Testing new way of specifying top ellipse. |
| 19:50.27 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 19:59.46 | yukonbob | loads pacman87's post |
| 20:03.53 | ``Erik | ew, rar |
| 20:08.11 | ``Erik | thinks this is a menu driven console bank transaction program, looks like it's for a class? |
| 20:11.58 | ``Erik | ah, yeah, heh, on the page... 'simplify and simulate a bank' |
| 20:57.56 | ``Erik | wiggles his toes |
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| 01:02.04 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.41.1) | |
| 01:03.06 | andrecastelo | good evening everyone ;) |
| 01:06.47 | hippieindamakin8 | good morning andrecastelo |
| 01:25.12 | brlcad | ahhh, waht a day |
| 01:31.10 | spike_ | waves at everyone |
| 01:38.12 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 01:38.28 | andrecastelo | is there a problem if i change my mind from implementing MLT in C++ to implement it in C ??? :) |
| 01:41.45 | brlcad | andrecastelo: heh |
| 01:41.51 | brlcad | what's the reasoning? |
| 01:41.57 | andrecastelo | well |
| 01:42.33 | andrecastelo | originally i thought encapsulation, abstraction and operator overloading would benefit the whole algorithm |
| 01:42.40 | *** join/#brlcad DaytonaJohn (n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 01:43.14 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yeah, I don't see that as being a good reason to go with it -- I presumed you were merely justifying what is familiar to you ;) |
| 01:43.19 | andrecastelo | but some parts of the code written would eventually be incompatible with existing code.. part of the code written in C++ wouldn't be usable in other C code |
| 01:43.30 | brlcad | do you have a stronger basis in OO or procedural? |
| 01:43.41 | andrecastelo | and there is no need to rewrite basic structures |
| 01:43.48 | andrecastelo | in OO |
| 01:43.48 | brlcad | it just would have to be isolated as c++ |
| 01:44.33 | brlcad | yeah, rewriting basic structures would be frowned -- you'd still be expected to write classes that reuse libbu/libbn/librt as needed |
| 01:45.21 | andrecastelo | the requirement for a patch is a great thing indeed |
| 01:46.04 | andrecastelo | i'll update my application accordingly |
| 01:48.30 | brlcad | great |
| 01:54.54 | brlcad | for what it's worth, erik doesn't like OO (unless it's pure), procedural is probably a step up for him but still below functional ... he's a schemer ;) |
| 01:55.09 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad i posted a reply |
| 01:55.14 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: ok |
| 01:55.15 | brlcad | thanks |
| 01:55.28 | hippieindamakin8 | hey can we discuss it rt now ? |
| 01:56.24 | andrecastelo | brlcad: like ruby ? |
| 01:56.57 | brlcad | like smalltalk, can't speak for him re: ruby |
| 01:57.21 | brlcad | likes ruby .. about as impractical as smalltalk, but a nice language |
| 01:58.20 | andrecastelo | (is Ada OO ?) |
| 01:58.22 | brlcad | andrecastelo: either way, you still just need to be able to justify your design decisions regardless of the mentor's preference ;) |
| 01:58.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i justified it and i hope it's acceptable |
| 01:59.18 | brlcad | though I would heavily argue against a functional impl for integration/maintainability reasons :) |
| 01:59.46 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: i'm not sure what you'd like to discuss |
| 02:00.08 | andrecastelo | brlcad: you are pro C++ ? |
| 02:00.39 | brlcad | in general or for your project? |
| 02:00.52 | brlcad | I could see going either way for your project |
| 02:01.37 | brlcad | if it is C++, there are a slew of stipulations like still reusing existing libs as much possible and not mixing C++ into any existing C facilities |
| 02:03.27 | andrecastelo | i see.. |
| 02:03.46 | brlcad | andrecastelo: your app is probably at the point that it should start moving to the wiki too if you haven't started already |
| 02:04.31 | andrecastelo | yeah, it's too big ehhehe |
| 02:05.21 | andrecastelo | on a related note - i'm having some weird issues trying to compile some of the code i've written |
| 02:05.41 | andrecastelo | this is the compile log -> http://pastebin.com/d5eb121ff and this is the code -> http://pastebin.com/d1b8b3aee |
| 02:07.02 | andrecastelo | what you think is wrong ? |
| 02:07.24 | brlcad | "inconsistent dll linkage" .. sounds like you're trying to compile a file as both C and C++ |
| 02:07.55 | brlcad | or both imported and exported |
| 02:08.45 | andrecastelo | actually i haven't compile the version i'm with, i'm guessing that's the problem |
| 02:09.30 | andrecastelo | (i had that warning before and could compile rtarea) |
| 02:09.44 | andrecastelo | i'll build everything and get back to you after hehehe |
| 02:09.45 | brlcad | andrecastelo: OOh.. tsk tsk |
| 02:10.00 | brlcad | http://pastebin.com/d1b8b3aee <-- bad :) |
| 02:10.17 | brlcad | you're compiling C code, not C++ |
| 02:10.25 | brlcad | remember your scoping declaration rules for C |
| 02:13.18 | andrecastelo | bad code?? |
| 02:13.25 | andrecastelo | why exactly ? |
| 02:17.12 | brlcad | that hilighted line is an error .. think about why :) |
| 02:21.47 | andrecastelo | ehhe ok ok |
| 02:21.56 | pacman87 | brlcad: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Revolve_Primitive |
| 02:24.58 | brlcad | pacman87: I read it :) |
| 02:25.05 | brlcad | well, skimmed it for now :) |
| 02:25.59 | brlcad | i'm very dubious as to how you intend to get the profile curve of a given/arbitrary primitive or (even harder) that of a combination |
| 02:26.36 | brlcad | you don't have a reliable method to project the outline onto 2D |
| 02:32.18 | pacman87 | yeah, that's the hardest part |
| 02:32.50 | brlcad | heh, "hardest" is an understatement |
| 02:33.13 | brlcad | makes the shot() routine for sweeps seem like bubble sort |
| 02:33.40 | pacman87 | well, i could calculate it numerically |
| 02:33.57 | pacman87 | it only has to be done once |
| 02:33.59 | pacman87 | then stored |
| 02:36.10 | pacman87 | once the outline is found for each shape, combinations aren't that much more work than getting the outline in the first place |
| 02:37.28 | hippieindamakin8 | ya brlcad i wish not to mix C++ into existinc C facilities but use the existing header and dependancies as it is in the first phase of refactoring the code |
| 02:38.56 | pacman87 | since each shape has a bounding volume, i could do a grid over the plane, and check each point for in/out |
| 02:39.04 | pacman87 | and keep refining the border |
| 02:39.08 | pacman87 | until it meets the tolerance |
| 02:40.53 | brlcad | andrecastelo: hint: search for "declaring variables mid-function" |
| 02:41.03 | pacman87 | for the simpler primitives, it may be possible to solve analytically |
| 02:41.19 | pacman87 | but that's in the 'optimization' phase of my timelime |
| 02:41.25 | andrecastelo | brlcad: oooooohhh |
| 02:41.27 | brlcad | pacman87: yes, but how do you "calculate it numerically" |
| 02:41.53 | pacman87 | given a primitive, get the bounding volume |
| 02:42.16 | pacman87 | intersect that volume with the plane specified for the 2D revolve outline |
| 02:42.20 | brlcad | basically you'd end up point-sampling (i.e. ray-tracing) to find the contour.. :) |
| 02:42.28 | pacman87 | essentially |
| 02:42.35 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm building the project i'll try something in a sec |
| 02:42.36 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:42.41 | pacman87 | but i can ignore everything that's clearly outside or clearly inside |
| 02:43.17 | brlcad | pacman87: well I suppose that will give an approximation -- you'd also then have to derive and fit a series of splines to the contour .. that's not easy |
| 02:43.44 | pacman87 | i never said it'd be easy |
| 02:43.46 | brlcad | just take the case of a projected cube rotated 45 degrees |
| 02:43.49 | pacman87 | just that it's possible |
| 02:44.23 | pacman87 | cutting it somewhere down the middle? |
| 02:44.39 | brlcad | actually finding the four piecewise linear segments would be really hard |
| 02:45.24 | brlcad | especially at each corner .. |
| 02:45.26 | pacman87 | it depends on how the 2D outline is actually stored |
| 02:46.55 | pacman87 | if it's stored as a series of (r,z) points |
| 02:49.50 | pacman87 | check the midpoint of each segment to make sure it's within the tolerance |
| 02:49.56 | pacman87 | if not, add a new point in the middle |
| 02:50.28 | brlcad | hm |
| 02:50.49 | pacman87 | also specify a maximum distance between points |
| 02:51.05 | brlcad | I think there's another way that doesn't require sampling |
| 02:51.08 | pacman87 | to avoid getting (un)lucky on a segment who's midpoint happens to be right |
| 02:51.24 | pacman87 | please share :) |
| 02:51.46 | brlcad | don't know why I didn't think of it |
| 02:52.12 | brlcad | you have the right idea with thinking about it from the perspective of considering the plane |
| 02:53.00 | brlcad | you're already evaluating a given ray during shot() against some contour |
| 02:54.04 | pacman87 | shot() for the revolve? |
| 02:54.49 | brlcad | there's no reason you couldn't just evaluate that same ray against the actual primitive/combination being revolved and just using it's hit/miss characteristic as the inside/outside result |
| 02:55.59 | brlcad | the trick is that you'll have to figure out where the primitivies/combinations are situated in order to evaluate them |
| 02:56.00 | pacman87 | what if that ray is rotated away from the original primitive, such that the ray misses the original, but should hit the revolved part |
| 02:56.07 | brlcad | which is the same problem you have with sweeps |
| 02:57.49 | brlcad | you'd probably have to perform some sort of newtonian iteration to find the extents .. arg, that'd really be slow as hell |
| 02:58.34 | andrecastelo | (compiled perfectly |
| 02:58.36 | andrecastelo | ) |
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| 02:59.51 | pacman87 | for rev shot(), you're getting the segment intersected with the base shape, and checking it agianst the outline plane? |
| 03:01.04 | brlcad | sort of |
| 03:01.37 | brlcad | consider a ray being shot at a shape that is centered on the axis of rotation |
| 03:01.50 | pacman87 | symmetric shape or not? |
| 03:01.57 | brlcad | doesn't matter |
| 03:02.07 | pacman87 | ok |
| 03:02.44 | brlcad | what you end up doing is solving the min/max rotation of that shape to find the closest and farthest entry/exit spans |
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| 03:04.00 | yukonbob | 1 note while pacman87 is here -- in the into to your posting today... did you mean start and end surfaces will be "flat plates", or "flat planes" (or does it matter? typo/grammar editing is the best I can offer on that posting :) |
| 03:04.11 | brlcad | that's the newtonian iteration I was thinking of, you have to solve the aligned rotations that give you maximal extents .. and that basically amounts to shooting the same ray at that shape with different rotations |
| 03:04.53 | pacman87 | right, that method does a lot of calculation for each shot9) |
| 03:04.55 | pacman87 | shot() |
| 03:05.36 | pacman87 | yukonbob: should probably be planes, thanks for the feedback |
| 03:05.44 | yukonbob | laughs |
| 03:05.52 | yukonbob | yw |
| 03:06.05 | brlcad | pacman87: this is all interesting and something to keep thinking about ... BUT ... I have to admit that I'm lacking faith in finding a "useful" solution in reasonable time -- I'd probably say stick with classic 2D sketches being revolved first and proposing in your timeline to revisit with 3D shapes later as time permits :) |
| 03:06.31 | pacman87 | if you find the outline once per shape, then the ray intersection is a 2D problem |
| 03:06.34 | brlcad | pacman87: no more than sampling to find an outline :) .. should be less if the solver can converge fast enough :) |
| 03:06.51 | pacman87 | right, but the outline only happens once per shape |
| 03:06.57 | pacman87 | not once per ray |
| 03:06.58 | brlcad | except like I said earlier, that approach results in sampling and shape extraction problems |
| 03:07.42 | brlcad | the "real solution" is to complete brep support for all of the primitives, then you'd just project the 3D brep curves onto the 2D plan and have your exact curve |
| 03:07.42 | pacman87 | you dont need to extract the shape if you keep the outline as a set of points |
| 03:07.54 | brlcad | brep support, however, is incomplete |
| 03:08.32 | pacman87 | but yeah, i'll move the 3D shapes to the end under 'additional features' |
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| 03:15.01 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad.. i'll keep on working on the patch tomorrow |
| 03:15.09 | andrecastelo | i'm too tired, i'm going to get some sleep |
| 03:15.16 | brlcad | the real question is how you intend to solve sweeps as they're a similar problem |
| 03:15.21 | andrecastelo | cya tomorrow |
| 03:15.27 | brlcad | cya andrecastelo |
| 03:15.48 | brlcad | does not comprehend this "sleep" he speaks of |
| 03:16.29 | pacman87 | brlcad: it's sort of like being knocked unconscious, but you feel better when you wake up |
| 03:18.21 | pacman87 | the sweep will probably have to be done how you describe |
| 03:18.58 | brlcad | dunno, I felt pretty good after the only time i've been unconconscious .. wisdom teeth .. god bless those drugs |
| 03:19.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30658 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: New way of specifying the sides - hopefully somewhat more robust than previous method. |
| 03:20.36 | starseeker | ``Erik: OK, now what were your tire dimensions again? |
| 03:20.53 | starseeker | may stand a chance of getting them now |
| 03:20.56 | brlcad | pacman87: what do you think about implementing the rt_*_brep() routines as part of getting sweep to work? |
| 03:21.27 | pacman87 | that could be easier/more useful than any other way of doing it |
| 03:22.08 | brlcad | are you familiar with what boundary representation spline surfaces are, how to define/create them? :) |
| 03:23.07 | pacman87 | no, but i could learn :) |
| 03:23.31 | pacman87 | i didnt' know anything about raytracing before i started researching it, either :) |
| 03:23.32 | brlcad | heck if you just worked on revolve, rt_*_brep(), and some sort of rt_project_brep_to_sketch() routine, that would be insanely useful/cool |
| 03:23.54 | brlcad | and probably consume all summer |
| 03:24.07 | brlcad | sweeps then become just a generalized solution |
| 03:24.32 | pacman87 | yeah, i'll have to start researching breps |
| 03:24.42 | brlcad | otherwise maybe limiting both sweep and revolve to sketchs for starters, then working on rt_*_brep() as time permits to get generalized shapes |
| 03:24.47 | pacman87 | when do we finalize exactly the scope of my project? |
| 03:25.02 | brlcad | when you're happy with it and we're happy with it |
| 03:25.26 | pacman87 | sketch only first seems to be a good solution |
| 03:25.32 | brlcad | if you keep going the way you're going, there's little chance for unhappiness :) |
| 03:25.53 | pacman87 | because if i do the 3D stuff without the brep, i'd just have to redo it later |
| 03:25.57 | pacman87 | thanks ;) |
| 03:25.58 | brlcad | save for you being happy and capable of learning the solutions :) |
| 03:26.33 | brlcad | rt_project_brep_to_sketch() would be pretty math-intensive, for example |
| 03:27.04 | brlcad | even just implementing sweep/revolve with sketches isn't easy, but extrude is a good example |
| 03:27.27 | pacman87 | would you want a different project() and intersection() for total outline vs outline in a specified plane? |
| 03:28.09 | brlcad | total outline? |
| 03:28.17 | pacman87 | total outline = shadow |
| 03:28.32 | brlcad | don't see what you mean |
| 03:28.35 | pacman87 | plane outline = slice, ink, and stamp |
| 03:28.53 | pacman87 | ex: sphere |
| 03:28.57 | pacman87 | total outline is great circle |
| 03:29.03 | pacman87 | plane outline is smaller circle |
| 03:29.13 | pacman87 | depending on where the plane cuts the circle |
| 03:29.35 | brlcad | ah, you mean some sort of arbitrary cross-section |
| 03:29.40 | pacman87 | right |
| 03:30.00 | pacman87 | which could also be useful for section views |
| 03:33.03 | brlcad | not sure how useful that would be actually -- even for generating scalable vector draft images you have all curves just projected onto a 2D plane, maybe with hidden edge removal (via projecting surfaces too to 2d patches) |
| 03:33.45 | brlcad | even for revolve, you just need the projected curves |
| 03:34.09 | brlcad | as hm, that's not entirely true I suppose |
| 03:34.16 | starseeker | does little happy dance that things are finally close to Working As Desired and hits the hay |
| 03:34.34 | brlcad | you want just the projected surfaces, not their edges |
| 03:35.03 | brlcad | is thinking out loud |
| 03:36.42 | pacman87 | i'm thinking something like this: http://www.solidsmack.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/solidworks-iso-section-04.jpg |
| 03:37.05 | brlcad | nods |
| 03:39.29 | brlcad | pacman87: for that specific image, though, you have other facilities at your disposal since it's still 3D -- you basically evaluate the cut plane as a trimming curve for each surface it itersects |
| 03:40.02 | brlcad | hehe, which maybe is just what you should do too :) |
| 03:40.45 | pacman87 | right, but for a adding a section view to the drawing, you'll need the plane cut outline, not just the shadow |
| 03:40.49 | brlcad | tricky operations -- borderlines implementation of the CSG evaluation of BREP-on-BREP surfaces |
| 03:41.16 | pacman87 | wasn't BREP representations a different GSoC topic? |
| 03:41.19 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:41.26 | pacman87 | anyone interested in it? |
| 03:41.34 | brlcad | there's one proposal for it |
| 03:43.01 | brlcad | what I was saying, though, is that you can get what you're calling a plane cut outline directly .. by evaluating the intersection of the plane surface as a trimming surface on the surfaces of the brep it cuts |
| 03:43.18 | brlcad | you get a series of trimming curves in 3D .. that are all planar |
| 03:43.46 | pacman87 | so brep csg will give you the plane outline already |
| 03:44.30 | brlcad | kinda, that same operation is required to evaluate breps with csg |
| 03:45.28 | brlcad | but it also requires even harder non-planar evaluations .. two arbitrary spline surfaces intersecting in arbitrary ways generating sets of non-planar 3d curves |
| 03:45.52 | brlcad | numerically unstable and hard |
| 03:46.01 | pacman87 | really needs to get some background info |
| 03:46.10 | brlcad | but still critical for what we need ;) |
| 03:47.09 | pacman87 | so the rt_*_brep() function does what exactly? |
| 03:47.16 | brlcad | pacman87: search for "BOOLE" and "ESOLID" -- they were research from a few years ago that implemented what we need (in a manner of speaking), but not production code to say the least |
| 03:47.44 | brlcad | they are good reading material for background information though, as well as just general searches on boundary representation geometry |
| 03:48.04 | brlcad | do you recall the rt_*_nurb() function? |
| 03:48.15 | brlcad | it's the same thing |
| 03:49.12 | brlcad | just that the nurbs routines were never completed and use an obsolete data structure |
| 03:49.57 | brlcad | so the function is actually already implemented for several of the primitives, just needs to be renamed to rt_*_brep() and have the data structures updated to the new openNURBS-based structures |
| 03:51.12 | pacman87 | to summarize: start with revolve using sketch, then sweep using sketch, then rt_*_brep(), then project_brep_to_sketch() |
| 03:52.02 | pacman87 | then add 3D support to sweep (and revolve?) using brep |
| 03:53.17 | brlcad | the basic difference is implicit vs explicit evaluation -- your g_hyp.c uses implicit evaluation in the shot() routine .. the hyperboloid is defined by an implicit equation where you have x^2/a^2 + y^2/a^2 - z^2/c^2 = 1 being solved for a given t parameter |
| 03:54.26 | brlcad | another approach would be to actually have that actual surface in parametric form as a spline surface .. evaluation is considerably different |
| 03:54.56 | brlcad | pacman87: yeah, that sounds like a strong plan I'd be happy with :) |
| 03:55.54 | brlcad | even the reverse order would be fine with me, e.g. brep() then project() then revolve then sweep |
| 03:56.17 | pacman87 | the only difference between the 3D and sketchs is that for 3D, the sketch comes from the brep, right? |
| 03:56.18 | brlcad | as these are all "core tasks" with really high value |
| 03:57.15 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 03:57.57 | pacman87 | the initial problem with revolving the 3D shape was in getting the 2D outline |
| 03:58.29 | pacman87 | and project() solves that problem |
| 03:58.46 | brlcad | yes |
| 03:58.48 | pacman87 | but it's not the same as revolving/sweeping the actual 3D shape |
| 03:58.51 | brlcad | should solve it exactly |
| 04:02.11 | pacman87 | because the maximum extents of the projection could happen at different distances along the sweep or different angles around the revolve |
| 04:02.25 | brlcad | yeah, it's not the same ... I believe it is the same if you constrain the revolve/sweep to maintain the object's normal/orientation in the direction of the sweep/rotate |
| 04:03.10 | brlcad | but if you allow the more generalized case that allows the object to reorient/rotate while being swept/revolved, there's a problem |
| 04:03.11 | pacman87 | not quite |
| 04:04.11 | pacman87 | revolving an ellipse with focii at (4,1) and (6, -1) about the z axis |
| 04:05.01 | pacman87 | you can't just project it in the direction of Z cross R |
| 04:05.08 | pacman87 | because the path is curved |
| 04:05.19 | pacman87 | so to get the real outline, you'd need a curved projection |
| 04:06.44 | pacman87 | in the simple case, just take the line segment between them |
| 04:06.59 | pacman87 | if you use the linear projection, Rmin = 4 and Rmax = 6 |
| 04:07.41 | pacman87 | but really, Rmin = sqrt(4^2 + 1^2) and Rmax = sqrt(6^2 + 1^2) |
| 04:09.11 | brlcad | hm, i'm still not seeing the issue -- the ellipse you describe results in an elliptical torus, yes? |
| 04:09.29 | pacman87 | ok, forget the ellipse |
| 04:09.38 | pacman87 | just look at the 2D line segment |
| 04:09.43 | pacman87 | revolve it around the z axis |
| 04:10.13 | pacman87 | the center of the 'object' is at (5,0) |
| 04:10.28 | pacman87 | so it'd be projected along the y axis |
| 04:10.36 | pacman87 | (Z cross R) |
| 04:11.28 | pacman87 | that rotation would give you a donut with Rmin = 4 and Rmax = 6, from projection along y |
| 04:12.09 | pacman87 | you follow up to this point? |
| 04:13.00 | brlcad | probably just needs a visual aid, but so far sounds good |
| 04:13.21 | pacman87 | you get a different width if you take a paintbrush and paint | -> vs / -> |
| 04:14.22 | pacman87 | i'll throw together a diagram |
| 04:17.31 | brlcad | i think we may just be saying the same thing in two different ways too -- I was saying that you *have* to maintain the object's orientation with respect to the rotation, so your / segment (presume facing into display, for example) at the 180 rotation angle is now on the other side of the axis as \ (now facing out of your display) |
| 04:18.25 | brlcad | everything should work out if you keep it oriented, else it can self-intersect, pinch solidity, and other nasty effects |
| 04:18.56 | brlcad | (at least for 3d) |
| 04:20.37 | brlcad | starseeker: if you intend to add units support, see src/libbu/units.c |
| 04:20.50 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/revolve.png |
| 04:20.56 | brlcad | otherwise default should always be mm :) |
| 04:22.09 | pacman87 | medium blue is original shape, cyan is the projected shape, green circle is true revolve bounds, red circle is revolve bounds from projection |
| 04:23.36 | brlcad | AHA, I see what you're trying to show me now, heh :) |
| 04:23.52 | pacman87 | yeah, saved me 1k words :) |
| 04:24.16 | brlcad | I was talking about something a bit different :) |
| 04:25.35 | pacman87 | right, but i'm saying keepign the 2D plane's normal vector along the sweep path won't help my problem |
| 04:26.09 | brlcad | for the general projected 3D case |
| 04:26.11 | pacman87 | if the sweep path is curved |
| 04:26.36 | pacman87 | yes, sweeping with the 2D projection of a 3D shape |
| 04:27.16 | pacman87 | you also have trouble on the sweep if you allow rotation of the 2D outline about the sweep direction |
| 04:27.23 | pacman87 | even if the sweep direction is straight |
| 04:27.48 | brlcad | definitely |
| 04:28.50 | pacman87 | and i can't think of a 'nice' solution to these problems |
| 04:28.50 | brlcad | that's what I was getting at at first about maintaining the orientation |
| 04:29.19 | pacman87 | meaning keep plane normal in line with sweep, and no rotation? |
| 04:29.23 | brlcad | I can see one, but it's still pretty hard |
| 04:31.15 | pacman87 | if i can work out a curved project(), the revolve would be possible |
| 04:31.17 | brlcad | you end up taking your sweep curves (e.g. your green lines in your diagram) and actually create a brep surfaces using those curves and use the original object as the surface coefficients |
| 04:31.50 | brlcad | that, however, is paramount to "cheating" imo -- it's an explicit parametric solution as opposed to an implicit one |
| 04:32.41 | brlcad | could do some research in the literature on implicit sweep objects, there are some papers on the subject (that I lamentably admit I've not read yet) |
| 04:34.35 | pacman87 | the problem with a sweep is that the green curves depend on the curvature of the sweep path |
| 04:34.44 | pacman87 | which is constnat for the revolve, so it's a lot easier |
| 04:35.43 | brlcad | for sweeps, you could start by saying the swept object must be rotationally invariant -- keep if fixed |
| 04:36.49 | pacman87 | disallow rotation about the sweep path? |
| 04:37.34 | brlcad | object rotation, yes |
| 04:37.47 | brlcad | the path is still some arbitrary spline path |
| 04:38.10 | brlcad | hm, somewhat interesting http://www.unknownroad.com/publications/SweepsTRApril2005.pdf |
| 04:39.27 | pacman87 | reads |
| 04:39.46 | brlcad | files for later |
| 04:39.58 | pacman87 | s/reads/skims ;) |
| 04:43.47 | brlcad | mm, interesting http://dimacs.rutgers.edu/Workshops/CompAided/slides/blackmore2.pdf |
| 04:45.20 | brlcad | very similar to what you suggested |
| 04:45.29 | brlcad | 2D scalar fields |
| 05:01.53 | pacman87 | i didnt really read in depth, but it looks like the links just deal with 2D shapes |
| 05:05.27 | brlcad | implicit 2D shapes though |
| 05:06.09 | brlcad | you could leverage that directly with sampling if you *had* to |
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| 08:28.09 | brlcad | waves and wanders a bit |
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| 10:25.16 | mafm | hallo |
| 10:35.42 | Axman6 | o/ |
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| 11:51.17 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, thanks :-). Apparently a lot of US tire size specifications use Inches, so conversion will be needed... |
| 12:00.40 | clock_ | brlcad: I wonder have you ever modelled a ball bearing? |
| 12:00.59 | clock_ | Do the raceways have the same inner diameter as the diameter of the balls? |
| 12:01.05 | clock_ | Some people claim that I think it's bullshit |
| 12:03.05 | archivist | no balls need some clearance |
| 12:03.31 | archivist | also press fit is allowed for in the clearance |
| 12:03.52 | clock_ | I wonder how they get the balls inside |
| 12:04.41 | archivist | without the retaining plates (before they get riveted |
| 12:04.42 | clock_ | do they ram them with such a pressure that the hardened rings elastically deform and make way? |
| 12:05.07 | clock_ | you mean without the cage? |
| 12:05.10 | archivist | all metal is elastic |
| 12:05.41 | clock_ | I may need to model my skateboard in the BRL-CAD |
| 12:05.59 | archivist | yes except for crowded large ring bearings, they have a small groove to let in the balls |
| 12:06.14 | clock_ | yesterday I have mounted my superheavy 30kg 21'' CRT on a wall using a unique DIY space frame design wall mount |
| 12:06.45 | archivist | btw your quit message has an XML error |
| 12:07.11 | clock_ | Oh I see fixed thanks |
| 12:08.14 | clock_ | this space frame is amazing |
| 12:08.30 | clock_ | if you poke at the monitor with a finger slightly, it swings. |
| 12:08.46 | clock_ | But if you grab the holder with two hands and push it forth and back, the monitor stays without movement. |
| 12:08.56 | clock_ | It weighs only 3kg, but is rock solid |
| 12:09.12 | clock_ | Now I understand fully why they use it in cosmic vehicles |
| 13:49.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30659 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Clean up unused variables in new specification scheme. |
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| 14:33.18 | brlcad | d_rossberg: good morning |
| 14:35.23 | d_rossberg | isn't it almost lunch time? |
| 14:35.32 | prasad_ | indeed |
| 14:37.14 | brlcad | hour or so |
| 14:38.00 | brlcad | ~ugt |
| 14:38.01 | ibot | i heard ugt is Universal Greeting Time. Created in #mipslinux, it is a rule that states that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant. http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html |
| 14:40.04 | d_rossberg | ah, somebody spend its rare time creating a rule for it :) |
| 14:57.20 | brlcad | =) |
| 14:58.50 | clock_ | and someone else spent his rare time commenting that somebody spend its rare time creating a rule for it |
| 14:59.41 | brlcad | clock_: curious if john's -k option help your 210x report |
| 15:00.12 | brlcad | it's not a fix, but potentially a big performance opt |
| 15:00.27 | clock_ | brlcad: I don't have rt available here, what does -k do? |
| 15:00.39 | brlcad | it was just added |
| 15:00.42 | brlcad | see your report |
| 15:00.47 | clock_ | what does it do? |
| 15:00.56 | clock_ | the report doesn't say what it does |
| 15:06.59 | brlcad | it's a -k cutting plane option |
| 15:12.43 | yukonbob | morning |
| 15:13.40 | clock_ | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/04/11/us_war_robot_rebellion_iraq/ |
| 15:15.33 | brlcad | g'mornin yukonbob |
| 15:21.31 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:24.10 | ``Erik | starseeker: 255/40ZR18 (mm/aspect rating inches) |
| 15:26.29 | ``Erik | likes ruby, smalltalk, ocaml, erlang, even objc... was not trying to say "use C, not C++", was just asking for support to the argument that MLT would benefit greatly from classes, encapsulation and operator overloading... |
| 15:26.58 | ``Erik | I do *NOT* like operator overloading :D but classes, namespaces, etc, *shrug* sometimes they're the right tool |
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| 15:34.06 | andrecastelo | good morning folks |
| 15:34.14 | ``Erik | greetings, andre |
| 15:34.21 | ``Erik | jabs brlcad with a cattleprod |
| 15:35.06 | ``Erik | <-- wanders off to lunch, bbiab |
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| 16:47.59 | brlcad | ``Erik: I was at korean |
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| 17:33.14 | yukonbob | tries to figure out the GSoC spreadsheet... |
| 17:33.47 | yukonbob | ahhh... got it |
| 17:35.00 | yukonbob | (couldn't find "sheet" selector) |
| 17:45.41 | brlcad | :) |
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| 18:22.52 | mafm | bye |
| 18:23.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30660 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/htond.c: cleanup header |
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| 18:34.39 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad.. |
| 18:35.23 | andrecastelo | the exposed area center is rather straight forward - get the hit points for the area and do the median |
| 18:35.30 | andrecastelo | but what about the presented area ? |
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| 18:55.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30661 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Experimenting with ways to make reasonable tire shapes from standard input data. |
| 18:59.19 | brlcad | andrecastelo: presented is same as exposed.. just a different set of points |
| 19:00.40 | andrecastelo | yeah but for example, for the exposed area i just recorded every point in the partition->inhit->hitpoint |
| 19:00.56 | andrecastelo | because if the ray hit those points, then the area is exposed, right ? |
| 19:02.11 | brlcad | you're evaluating entire shotlines, there are multiple in/out hits along the shotline -- rays are evaluated all the way through |
| 19:02.29 | brlcad | multiple hits, not just first hit |
| 19:05.21 | andrecastelo | brlcad: so this is wrong ? http://pastebin.com/d4fd4025d (code is from line 45 to 56) |
| 19:05.41 | brlcad | can't get to pastebin.com from here |
| 19:06.07 | andrecastelo | hm ok |
| 19:07.00 | andrecastelo | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/WQdS4J26.html |
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| 19:15.57 | ``Erik | wiggles his toes |
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| 19:17.07 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, i've responded to your comment on the app |
| 19:17.19 | andrecastelo | did you have the time to see it yet ? |
| 19:17.25 | ``Erik | just read it |
| 19:17.59 | andrecastelo | what did you think ? |
| 19:18.20 | ``Erik | d'no yet, looks like you looked around and thought, which was really what I was trying to kick off :) |
| 19:18.30 | ``Erik | btw, your 'home page' doesn't work, I get a 404 |
| 19:18.34 | brlcad | andrecastelo: exposures are handled in increment_assembly_counter() |
| 19:18.41 | andrecastelo | really? i'll check |
| 19:19.55 | brlcad | andrecastelo: if you look at the struct area, you'll see there are two counters --> "exposures" and "hits" .. just follow the logic where those are incremented |
| 19:19.56 | ``Erik | <-- kinda feels unanswered wrt c vs c++... |
| 19:20.22 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hm ok |
| 19:20.44 | ``Erik | I'm not going to advocate one language or the other, I just want to know exactly why you'd choose one over the other |
| 19:21.57 | ``Erik | brlcad is trying to mkae it sound like I'm gonna ask why you don't propose to write it in scheme, heh :D I just want to know that you understand the various paradigms, the algorithm, and the existing code base well enough to make an informed decision *shrug* |
| 19:22.37 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i discussed this with brlcad the other night.. i proposed C++ because i'm familiar with it and i thought classes, abstraction and overloading would benefit the project as a whole |
| 19:23.11 | andrecastelo | and in the end, when assembling the algorithm together, the end result would be more readable and simple |
| 19:23.29 | ``Erik | yeah, I saw, and sorry, but that statement seems like fluff to me, I've done enought c++ and java and those to know the broad brush statements *shrug* :) |
| 19:23.31 | andrecastelo | but since there are already basic structures, rewriting them would be a big no no |
| 19:24.31 | ``Erik | re-writing, yes... but wrapping or interfacing is fine *shrug* |
| 19:25.06 | ``Erik | indeed, one of the ideas brlcad put forth at the beginning was a full OO wrapping of the core libraries functionality |
| 19:25.45 | andrecastelo | sorry i thought that wasn't the ideal |
| 19:25.58 | andrecastelo | i thought the general consensus was to keep everything in simple C |
| 19:26.08 | andrecastelo | (i mean standard C) |
| 19:26.36 | ``Erik | opennurbs is c++, we already have c++ in librt *shrug* it wouldn't be a huge issue to go with c++... |
| 19:27.52 | ``Erik | you made a statement that the task would benefit from using features of c++, and then some bland sales pitch on c++, I want to know exactly why those features would aid this... if it's just familiarity, that's cool, if there's something more, I want to know :D |
| 19:28.32 | ``Erik | (sorry if I seem a bit aggressive, I'm a language geek so I'm keen to understanding the various trade-offs when engineering software) |
| 19:29.06 | andrecastelo | i thought of using some oo features because i thought of them as a natural with point and vector handling, you know ? |
| 19:29.19 | andrecastelo | and because i'm more familiar with it and all |
| 19:29.29 | andrecastelo | but i have no problem programming in either language |
| 19:29.35 | ``Erik | hum, we already have point vector and matrix handling in vmath.h (and in tiemath.h, but that's going away) |
| 19:30.41 | andrecastelo | couldn't those functions and macros in vmath.h be wrapped up in a class ? |
| 19:30.54 | ``Erik | sure, what would the advantage of that be? |
| 19:32.53 | andrecastelo | essentially, it would be easier to use points and vectors by those who do not know vmath.h by memory |
| 19:33.03 | ``Erik | hummmm, possibly, I know I have to keep looking stuff up in vmath :D "is it v2add, or vadd2, or ..." :) |
| 19:33.04 | brlcad | with a new class that none of the rest of the devs know by memory? :) |
| 19:33.21 | archivist | andrecastelo, speed of running is often more important than speed of writing software |
| 19:33.33 | brlcad | you'd only know it because you wrote it, otherwise you'd still have to look up the API when you use it |
| 19:33.38 | ``Erik | heh, in this case, yes... in most cases, I'd disagree, archivist :) |
| 19:34.02 | ``Erik | most software spends most of its time waiting for users or network or disk... developer time is far more expensive than cpu time |
| 19:34.21 | archivist | except deep in graphics |
| 19:34.25 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: but he has a point |
| 19:34.44 | andrecastelo | the MLT algorithm is processor intensive, any advantage is welcome, right ? |
| 19:34.49 | ``Erik | (also; it's possible to make very very fast c++... hell, it's even possible to make very fast java if you know how to code) |
| 19:35.06 | ``Erik | <-- likes to play devils advocate, btw... |
| 19:35.10 | brlcad | vmath is very simple and high-performance simply because it's inline'd math -- it's actually rather tricky to get oo-based math that actually out-performs (usually requires some specific templatized foo) |
| 19:35.45 | ``Erik | still wants to ugly up vmath with sse/altivec intrinsics |
| 19:36.43 | brlcad | the tradeoff is maintainability and integration in this case, we have a math lib so I'd be for using that, not wrapping up some new layer for OO sake -- it's enough work to implement MLT without spending time on that |
| 19:37.50 | ``Erik | well, if the lead time in wrapping it is made up for in fast implementation (and still maintainable), then it is worth it... *shrug* that can be a hard call to be correct one, though |
| 19:37.51 | brlcad | ``Erik: that's where it actually gets kinda interesting to abstract it .. multiple impl types in macros is fugly as hell, few things that make templates actually look "good" |
| 19:38.08 | ``Erik | *nod* |
| 19:38.46 | ``Erik | I'm wondering if being compile time specified is acceptable... high performance stuff often has multiple codepaths compiled and does a runtime detect to see which one to use |
| 19:39.04 | ``Erik | so binaries can be used on a 486, but still take advantage of a p4 or athlon |
| 19:39.11 | brlcad | i'd not be convinced of the wrapper though, without lots of profile and cross-platform multi-compiler testing, and that starts adding up to weeks of work/research in itself (especially if mixing in vectorization) |
| 19:39.47 | ``Erik | that'd be a good pub topic :) |
| 19:39.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30662 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Whoops - set scale factor to one for this part. |
| 19:39.59 | andrecastelo | the math wrapping up could be something for after the summer |
| 19:40.02 | brlcad | andrecastelo: and yes .. any path tracing is slow as all hell .. it's a brute force solution |
| 19:40.27 | ``Erik | well, a statistical method, anyways |
| 19:40.50 | ``Erik | metropolis tries to cull a lot of the brute force 'waste' off |
| 19:41.07 | brlcad | it's still slow as balls compared to ray-tracing :) |
| 19:41.40 | ``Erik | hehehhee, but mlt IS raytracing :D slow compared to the simple phong+shadow rays approach, sure |
| 19:41.41 | brlcad | like one-to-two orders, the optimizations usually cull some linear time component (like /2) |
| 19:41.52 | yukonbob | ``Erik: re: run-time optimization -- I can't speak from coding experience, but in the case of mplayer for example, runtime cpu detection is available, but contraindicated... one would be better off knowing the arch that is the target and installing the proper CPUFLAGS, no? |
| 19:42.44 | ``Erik | most of my experience with multiple code path stuff comes from proprietary binary distribution stuff, yukon :( chumming with 'tards trying to make the next ultimate video game, etc |
| 19:43.22 | ``Erik | so the object bloat is accepted for the handful of common configurations expected |
| 19:48.17 | brlcad | yeah most games can take a wrapper hit, or poor design hit - they often spend most of their time in the graphics loop |
| 19:48.54 | ``Erik | heh |
| 19:49.21 | ``Erik | and I've seen too much "my game will be fast because I'm writing it in assembly" or "this is going to rock, I'm using pascal with assembly where performance is needed" :/ |
| 19:49.46 | brlcad | I actually implemented a series of vector/matrix replacements for vmath many years ago, as C++ -- it was actually rather complicated and unreliable at the time to match performance, compilers that would ignore the inline directives for example |
| 19:50.12 | brlcad | likes to write in posix shell scripting and drop to assembly where performance is needed |
| 19:50.23 | archivist | ya have to know your algorythm, never mind the language |
| 19:50.43 | archivist | used to do assembler |
| 19:51.27 | brlcad | mips assembler ftw |
| 19:51.29 | ``Erik | has layed down a lot of 6510, 6812, and 80286 assembly :( |
| 19:51.35 | ``Erik | r2k was sweeeet |
| 19:51.56 | ``Erik | the bsd guys would call it "teh sex0rz" |
| 19:51.59 | archivist | I started on 6502 oops that shows my age |
| 19:52.11 | prasad_ | ecmascript ftw |
| 19:52.16 | prasad_ | lolz |
| 19:52.26 | ``Erik | 6510 and 6511 were essentially 6502 with minor tweaks |
| 19:52.33 | ``Erik | c64, c64c, c128... good little boxes |
| 19:52.46 | ``Erik | actually, my first was a z80 cp/m machine |
| 19:52.47 | brlcad | wonders who poisoned prasad_'s coffee |
| 19:53.15 | ``Erik | ecma script because javascript has become a four letter word? :D |
| 19:53.38 | archivist | eczma script |
| 19:53.41 | andrecastelo | realizes he is way too young |
| 19:53.52 | prasad_ | archivist: sounds about right |
| 19:54.16 | ``Erik | heh, everyone was young at some point :D |
| 19:54.44 | andrecastelo | i started programming in mirc script :p |
| 19:54.46 | prasad_ | c++ is where it's at :o |
| 19:54.58 | andrecastelo | then i tried my hand with delphi when i was 13 or 14 |
| 19:55.20 | andrecastelo | i forgot about programming for a while, returning when in college, where i learned java, c and c++ |
| 19:55.21 | ``Erik | winiot *cough* O:-) |
| 19:56.04 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: the 404 is fixed (i hope) |
| 19:56.12 | ``Erik | "like Montezuma's revenge on discount taco night..." |
| 19:57.13 | ``Erik | http://www.smbc-comics.com/comics/20080410.gif |
| 19:58.20 | andrecastelo | lol |
| 20:00.18 | prasad_ | haha |
| 20:27.22 | andrecastelo | well guys |
| 20:27.26 | andrecastelo | off to class |
| 20:27.28 | andrecastelo | cya later |
| 20:31.04 | ``Erik | If you want to make an omelet, you have to kill a few people. |
| 21:04.08 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30663 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/flawfinder.sh: fix test failure |
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| 21:53.27 | yukonbob | remembers "Montezuma's Revenge" game on the C=64 |
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| 22:53.49 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/jeep.png <---- a usefull motor vehicle :) |
| 22:56.41 | IriX64 | what? nobody else here is a hobbyist? :) |
| 22:57.55 | IriX64 | ``Erik, you were right, found somebody here with 500g drive (sigh) |
| 22:59.26 | brlcad | yukonbob: http://mapy.atari8.info/l-o/montezuma.png :) |
| 22:59.57 | louipc | IriX64: too dark. You don't really get the essense of the hot pink and violet |
| 23:00.43 | IriX64 | louipc: blame brlcads photon mapping |
| 23:01.25 | IriX64 | "hot" pink :) |
| 23:01.57 | brlcad | IriX64: it's like we've told you before -- photon mapping is pointless if you're not going to put the model in a box with a custom light source |
| 23:02.26 | IriX64 | i extracetd all, thought the light source was there |
| 23:02.42 | IriX64 | ill look again |
| 23:02.53 | brlcad | eh, there's still no box |
| 23:02.59 | IriX64 | true |
| 23:03.01 | brlcad | so it isn't going to work |
| 23:03.22 | IriX64 | so you enclose it, map it and then remove the box ;) |
| 00:21.40 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: montezuma -- that's the one ;) |
| 00:23.49 | yukonbob | looks forward to IriX64 returning |
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| 05:21.03 | starseeker | is suddenly curious to learn about vim... |
| 05:25.04 | pacman87 | starseeker: http://xkcd.com/378/ |
| 06:35.23 | louipc | starseeker: you use emacs? |
| 07:34.52 | brlcad | tis a classic |
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| 10:37.34 | illethal | Good morning comrades. |
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| 14:24.23 | starseeker | louipc: Normally, yes - primarily in the past because the best/only interfaces to various programs were written in Emacs |
| 14:25.08 | starseeker | louipc: But I never really achieved true proficiency (or perhaps just sufficient finger dexterity) to make proper use of it. |
| 14:27.03 | starseeker | louipc: The time has now come when I will need to properly learn at least one good editor. Since I use the terminal instead of a graphical file manager and fluxbox instead of KDE/Gnome, I thought perhaps I should give vim/gvim another look. |
| 14:27.46 | starseeker | louipc: Last time I tried it, it was WAAAY to early in my Linux/Unix travels for me to appreciate it |
| 14:27.52 | starseeker | er s/to/too |
| 14:28.40 | starseeker | hates to admit it but he still falls back on nano/nedit often, and that just won't do ;-) |
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| 15:25.24 | louipc | starseeker: haha no it won't. I used xemacs a long time ago but then I stopped programming and forgot it. I decided to pick up vim recently just to have a taste of the other side and I'm stuck now. I am starting to get annoyed about it though from some performance and auto features. |
| 15:26.26 | louipc | but not annoyed enough to try emacs again... even though I don't recall having the same problems. It might just be some defaults in my distro I need to clobber. |
| 15:26.48 | starseeker | what's the annoyance? |
| 15:26.55 | starseeker | hasn't heard of vim performance problems... |
| 15:27.41 | louipc | like loading a 1000+ line file that has tabs displayed as spaces |
| 15:28.09 | starseeker | Hmm |
| 15:28.13 | louipc | and even when scrolling through the file will be jumpy |
| 15:28.23 | starseeker | looks for a big file to test... |
| 15:28.41 | louipc | also if moving across a line with lots of nested parenthesis and brackets is slow |
| 15:29.04 | louipc | that's when you have all the syntax foo running of course |
| 15:29.30 | starseeker | Hmm. |
| 15:29.41 | starseeker | anyone else having such problems? |
| 15:29.58 | starseeker | is doing OK with fence.c in proc-db... |
| 15:31.12 | louipc | not that I know of |
| 15:31.30 | starseeker | what distro you running? |
| 15:31.38 | louipc | oh yeah it might just be the syntax files |
| 15:31.45 | louipc | fence.c seems ok for me too |
| 15:32.01 | louipc | but php is really where it gets bogged down |
| 15:32.17 | louipc | arch linux |
| 15:32.39 | louipc | I never coded php in emacs so that might be it :D |
| 15:32.47 | louipc | only coded in a C variant |
| 15:34.14 | ``Erik | louipc: is that using gvim, or in a console, or in a terminal window? |
| 15:34.17 | ``Erik | tends to use rxvt or xterm for performance, gnome-terminal and konsole get ass slow and jumpy themselves... |
| 15:34.47 | louipc | rxvt |
| 15:35.26 | ``Erik | weird, is the 'jumpiness' due to lines longer than your terminal width, maybe? that causes vim to skip X lines to get to the next newline, LOOKS jumpy |
| 15:35.28 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 15:36.01 | starseeker | waits for ``Erik to start gloating... |
| 15:36.10 | ``Erik | about what? |
| 15:36.11 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:36.17 | starseeker | trying gvim |
| 15:36.23 | ``Erik | meh *shrug* just tools |
| 15:36.24 | louipc | no I was monitoring cpu usage once and it was kicking up to 80% |
| 15:36.26 | louipc | :D |
| 15:36.39 | louipc | I think it might be the php syntax parsing and such |
| 15:37.08 | louipc | but also displaying tabs as spaces definitely slowed it down |
| 16:51.43 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 17:02.37 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 17:07.28 | yukonbob | howdy -- how's it going today? |
| 17:26.01 | brlcad | pretty good! |
| 17:55.13 | yukonbob | nice to hear |
| 18:45.17 | andrecastelo | doubt in rayhit() : when checking for exposed areas, the code checks if the area has been seen. but when checking for presented areas, it doesn't have that check. Why ? |
| 18:55.49 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-230-69.uchicago.edu) | |
| 18:56.19 | jdoliner | hi is there anyone here I could ask a few questions about GSoC |
| 18:56.38 | yukonbob | jdoliner: yes - ask away ;) |
| 18:56.40 | docelic | you just ask your thing |
| 18:58.21 | jdoliner | good my application is on CSG on brep |
| 18:58.40 | jdoliner | and I've been commincating largely with Christopher Sean Morrison is he perhaps here |
| 18:59.06 | yukonbob | he is -- nick == brlcad |
| 18:59.25 | jdoliner | good |
| 18:59.31 | jdoliner | I |
| 19:01.05 | jdoliner | Sean you asked me to explain exactly how I foresee implementing this, particularly getting it working with the openNurbs library |
| 19:09.12 | jdoliner | so you just want an explanation of how we convert the ON_brep struct to something that is definitely usable by our system right? |
| 21:33.01 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
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| 00:52.19 | iraytrace | It's quiet |
| 00:52.47 | iraytrace | 5 hours of silence |
| 00:53.31 | pacman87 | we're all playing idlerpg. i'm losign now |
| 01:39.27 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 01:48.09 | andrecastelo | where's everyone :( |
| 02:48.24 | louipc | raises a hand. |
| 04:18.17 | starseeker | is alternating between going out and banging head with gvim |
| 04:18.57 | starseeker | has the sense that he might REALLY start to like gvim, if he ever masters basic motion in it... |
| 04:22.45 | louipc | well you can always fall back to basic arrow keys :P |
| 04:22.54 | louipc | but hjkl is much better |
| 04:23.02 | louipc | and such |
| 04:42.57 | starseeker | :-) |
| 04:52.51 | *** part/#brlcad paulproteus (n=paulprot@wide-rose.makesad.us) | |
| 05:14.03 | brlcad | tsks that jdoliner didn't stick around |
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| 07:36.15 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 09:08.52 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 09:30.27 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 10:36.20 | brlcad | mmm, time to nap |
| 10:36.32 | brlcad | now that I've royally messed up my schedule |
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| 12:30.12 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@61-69-0-182.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 13:52.10 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:53.45 | ``Erik | hjkl is only part, bBwW{}^f^b ... all important for good navigation :) |
| 13:54.08 | ``Erik | and if you have the markup set correctly, % is invaluable (matching bracket/brace/paren/whatever) |
| 14:37.18 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 14:42.19 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5487758B.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
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| 15:51.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30664 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add a little extra clipping to sides to eliminate hairline floating material. |
| 15:58.26 | starseeker | ``Erik: What do you do to set vim up to automatically do BRL-CAD style code formatting? (indents, etc.) |
| 16:09.46 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.41.1) | |
| 16:10.02 | andrecastelo | hi everyone |
| 16:11.14 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 16:39.28 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 16:44.42 | andrecastelo | morning yukonbob |
| 16:59.09 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm happy to say my patch is 80% ready hehehe |
| 17:00.54 | brlcad | andrecastelo: heh, cool |
| 17:09.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/9tL01K63.html |
| 17:10.11 | andrecastelo | i guess the only thing left is the output of the center point |
| 17:14.53 | brlcad | looking good |
| 17:21.00 | yukonbob | adds "/" and "?" to vi 'navigation' |
| 17:40.30 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, finished.. feedback?? :) http://rafb.net/p/yTmyVT38.html |
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| 18:33.47 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-81-207.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:34.12 | poolio | yukonbob: don't forget 'n' and 'p' |
| 18:38.36 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
| 18:42.44 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yeah, post it :) |
| 18:42.58 | brlcad | it'll get reviewed in detail come time to patch |
| 18:43.04 | andrecastelo | ok ok |
| 18:43.07 | brlcad | but quick glance through looks good |
| 18:44.43 | andrecastelo | hm ok thanks :D |
| 18:49.38 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i still need to do some testing though |
| 18:49.55 | brlcad | okay |
| 18:52.03 | andrecastelo | brb |
| 20:04.50 | yukonbob | poolio: re: n & p -- indeed |
| 20:15.26 | poolio | yukonbob: are you switching over from emacs? |
| 20:17.29 | yukonbob | poolio: no likely |
| 20:17.32 | yukonbob | *not |
| 20:17.33 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:17.36 | yukonbob | I use obth |
| 20:17.38 | yukonbob | *both |
| 20:17.50 | yukonbob | needs to learn to type :P |
| 20:18.36 | yukonbob | is an emacs user who know vi -- which I believe is as it should be in *nix land -- know vi, or suffer, no matter what your favourite editor is... |
| 20:19.07 | yukonbob | (if one is indeed using "unix", and is not just an end-user who doesn't happen to care what the OS is) |
| 20:19.20 | poolio | yeah true |
| 20:19.32 | poolio | I've always wanted to give emacs a go, but I've never gotten past the initial learning curve |
| 20:19.40 | poolio | I just get frustrated and go back to vim |
| 20:19.40 | yukonbob | has been saved by knowing basic "ed" before... |
| 20:19.55 | yukonbob | poolio: start at the beginning, continue to the end, then stop... |
| 20:20.13 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:20.52 | yukonbob | has been grooving on XEmacs for the last couple years, but Lucid or FSF are *basically* the same beast... |
| 20:21.07 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 20:21.20 | yukonbob | recommends poolio installs an Emacs, and just uses it for a while w/o giving up on it... |
| 20:21.25 | yukonbob | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 20:21.30 | hippieindamakin8 | hey yukonbob |
| 20:21.54 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: vi or emacs? |
| 20:22.03 | hippieindamakin8 | vi and nano :P |
| 20:22.18 | brlcad | tsk tsk |
| 20:22.20 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: vi or nano? |
| 20:22.25 | hippieindamakin8 | vi |
| 20:22.46 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8 redeems hisself, somewhat... |
| 20:23.00 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 20:23.11 | hippieindamakin8 | havebeen using Kate all along.. slowly moved to vi and gvim :) |
| 20:23.23 | hippieindamakin8 | have to get used to emacs keyboard |
| 20:23.51 | yukonbob | == nvi -- my philosophy w/ computing is "the dumber, the better" when it comes to tools... |
| 20:24.32 | hippieindamakin8 | yukonbob, emacs is installed.. but takes time getting used to it :) |
| 20:24.38 | yukonbob | *nvi, when using vi, versus vim, or the other kitchen-sink, creature-feature vi variants |
| 20:25.12 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: re: time -- that's what we were talking about just before you arrived... but some people don't seem to like to devote that time... |
| 20:25.37 | hippieindamakin8 | hehe .. started learning LISP so have to spend that time :) |
| 20:25.52 | hippieindamakin8 | but after the endsems :( |
| 20:26.23 | poolio | yukonbob: will do this summer. I've got a huge list of "Thing to learn" that has been building up this past year |
| 20:26.47 | yukonbob | thinks that learning editing via both vi and emacs is as trancendental as learning Lisp is supposed to be in the realm of programming languages... |
| 20:27.01 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-81-207.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:27.05 | yukonbob | is complete neophyte in scheme |
| 20:27.45 | poolio | yukonbob: I'm thinking of learning some scheme this summer... I used to know some Lisp, but I've heard great things about scheme |
| 20:28.01 | poolio | The functional programming course at my school is in ML but yeah... |
| 20:28.23 | yukonbob | poolio: /me thinks the scheme scene is confusing as hell... so saying "scheme" is really only a hint at what any one implementation is like... |
| 20:28.36 | poolio | true |
| 20:28.46 | hippieindamakin8 | says "Grab the force of the lambas " |
| 20:28.55 | poolio | The whole million variants to any one functional programming language is quite confusing to a newbie like meself |
| 20:29.19 | yukonbob | the grief over the recent r6rs ratification may only serve to further fragment scheme, despite the intention... |
| 20:30.54 | yukonbob | has played w/ Guile a bit, but may end up moving to Chicken because he's got online friends who are into it... |
| 20:31.41 | yukonbob | unfortunately, Chicken is one of the implementations that say "To hell with r6rs, r5rs is good enough for us" |
| 20:52.15 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 22:01.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30665 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/image.c: duplicate headers |
| 22:02.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30666 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 10 dirs): recursive lib dependency fixes for the ubuntuneers. not done |
| 22:53.37 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, there exists this code for editing the arbs in ~/librt/g_arb.c and also a similar version exists in ~/mged/edarb.c so.. |
| 22:54.09 | hippieindamakin8 | i have to implement this with OO behaviour.. |
| 22:55.22 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@61-69-0-182.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 22:55.24 | hippieindamakin8 | k then i ll wait for u or Mr. d_rossberg to return or shall reply to the comment over there on GSoC student page |
| 22:55.35 | hippieindamakin8 | hey Axman6 |
| 22:55.51 | brlcad | those two files do different things, one is representation and ray-tracing, the other editing |
| 22:56.36 | hippieindamakin8 | ya but the part of the code which deals with the editing of the primitives is the same |
| 22:56.58 | hippieindamakin8 | i aint talking about the entire code but that part at the end.. |
| 23:05.26 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: yes, there are several places (in mged and libwdb) that need to be refactored back up into librt |
| 23:05.47 | brlcad | the edit functions in mged are such functions |
| 23:05.56 | brlcad | (not just arbedit) |
| 23:06.08 | hippieindamakin8 | ya seen that |
| 23:07.52 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk.. and the one is edarb.c is customised to deal with the arbs |
| 23:08.44 | brlcad | nods |
| 23:09.52 | hippieindamakin8 | is trying to put up an answer to the qstn |
| 23:25.10 | Axman6_ | yo hippieindamakin8 |
| 23:28.29 | hippieindamakin8 | hey rt now all the models of arbs use all their 8 element space in an array meant for vertices ? smthing like say arb4 0=3; 4=5=6=7; |
| 23:46.08 | brlcad | all arbs are arb8 |
| 23:46.45 | brlcad | at least when stored to disk, when read from disk, the duplicate vertices are recognized and the corresponding arb is instantiated |
| 23:47.44 | hippieindamakin8 | ohk,, |
| 23:47.46 | hippieindamakin8 | thanks |
| 00:04.36 | andrecastelo | hi guys, back |
| 00:13.03 | andrecastelo | i have the utmost respect for the man that managed to tame mged |
| 00:13.06 | andrecastelo | really. |
| 00:23.48 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo, i guess all respect goes to Late Mike Muuss ... |
| 00:24.52 | hippieindamakin8 | he is the brain behind this.. and he apparently came up with BRL-CAD as a result of a dare he had with his collegue |
| 00:25.56 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: i guess all respect goes to him hehehe |
| 00:26.11 | hippieindamakin8 | hows it going? |
| 00:26.22 | andrecastelo | i'm trying to create a database |
| 00:26.24 | andrecastelo | to test my patch |
| 00:26.33 | andrecastelo | but i'm still unsuccessful |
| 00:28.33 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh why dont u make one using the mged interface ? |
| 00:30.09 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: hehehe i'm trying.. |
| 00:30.42 | andrecastelo | it doesn't let me create a .g file |
| 00:31.08 | andrecastelo | i managed to create a few solids in cup.g that already existed |
| 00:31.38 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh |
| 00:31.51 | hippieindamakin8 | :) this thing is ur illumination based one rt |
| 00:32.25 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 00:33.16 | andrecastelo | brlcad: do you have any .g file i could use to test this ?? |
| 00:39.32 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: are you trying for gsoc ??? |
| 00:39.40 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
| 00:40.06 | hippieindamakin8 | is flying with space oddity |
| 00:41.47 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: did you make a patch ? |
| 00:42.11 | hippieindamakin8 | ya made the windows installer patch but no positive reply |
| 00:42.32 | hippieindamakin8 | trying for another if possible |
| 00:42.56 | andrecastelo | yeah, they hate windows :{ |
| 00:43.08 | hippieindamakin8 | caught in the middle of deep academic schedule.. have my end semester exams from day after tommorow :P |
| 00:43.31 | hippieindamakin8 | tommorow for post GMT guys :) |
| 00:45.02 | andrecastelo | me too, i have three exams this week, a formal languages work due to wednesday and a presentation due to friday |
| 00:45.30 | hippieindamakin8 | u are also in the 3rd year rt |
| 00:48.20 | andrecastelo | yep |
| 00:48.40 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hi erik, busy ? |
| 01:11.59 | andrecastelo | good night everyone |
| 01:12.01 | andrecastelo | cya later |
| 01:27.32 | poolio | Heh, brlcad doesn't hate windows. It's just hard to maintain a windows port and there hasn't been enough interest (...I think) |
| 01:30.12 | yukonbob | brlcad the person, or BRL-CAD the project? |
| 02:00.36 | poolio | yukonbob: Aren't they one entity? ;) |
| 02:02.57 | yukonbob | heh -- /me isn't sure how to respond |
| 02:40.16 | hippieindamakin8 | yukonbob, i guess its about ppl in general here :P |
| 02:51.58 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: in all seriousness, there's been much effort applied to Windows, and I think the principle people involved try to operate above the leavel of "Windows is teh sux0rs" |
| 02:52.10 | yukonbob | *level |
| 02:52.19 | yukonbob | hates latency |
| 02:52.32 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 02:54.00 | hippieindamakin8 | yukonbob its not that i hate windows.. somehow i find that less interesting to those here :) |
| 03:04.28 | yukonbob | definately a *nix culture and wealth of experience, true. |
| 03:06.34 | hippieindamakin8 | :) rt here in this country Windows is the most used operating system |
| 03:22.22 | yukonbob | which country? |
| 03:26.19 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (i=root@61-69-0-182.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 03:30.48 | hippieindamakin8 | India |
| 03:48.06 | hippieindamakin8 | yukonbob, u are one of the mentors rt |
| 03:49.20 | yukonbob | "right", I am. |
| 03:49.59 | hippieindamakin8 | and i just posted a reply to the comment :) |
| 03:50.03 | yukonbob | "rt" is a bad abreviation here where "raytracing" is a popular subject :) |
| 03:50.22 | hippieindamakin8 | hehe rt :P |
| 03:51.08 | hippieindamakin8 | is so psyched about his endsems starting from tommorow |
| 03:55.51 | hippieindamakin8 | cya yukonbob , pacman87 and brlcad |
| 03:57.49 | yukonbob | ciao hippieindamakin8 |
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| 04:15.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30667 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Can now call one function and specify one set of dimensions to get the outer tire shape. |
| 04:16.36 | starseeker | needs to find a "default" tread width to tire width for cases where it isn't specified... |
| 04:21.49 | starseeker | and patterning tread would probably be good too... |
| 05:59.41 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-81-207.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:14.03 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:34.14 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:51.25 | brlcad | moin d_rossberg |
| 07:56.57 | d_rossberg | moin moin brlcad |
| 08:16.38 | *** join/#brlcad PrezzKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 08:18.38 | brlcad | salutes the PrezzKennedy |
| 09:12.51 | brlcad | ~seen mafm |
| 09:12.53 | ibot | mafm <n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 2d 14h 50m 1s ago, saying: 'bye'. |
| 09:13.12 | brlcad | ~seen andrecastelo |
| 09:13.13 | ibot | andrecastelo <n=chatzill@189.71.41.1> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 8h 1m 12s ago, saying: 'cya later'. |
| 10:07.42 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:10.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30668 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: wasn't explicit, but the intent is the same .. usually should use null-terminated instead of the strn family of funcs unless they are raw data buffers |
| 10:10.37 | brlcad | hola manuel |
| 10:16.20 | mafm | hallo |
| 10:17.01 | mafm | brlcad: not sleeping tonight? :P |
| 10:21.25 | brlcad | pfft :) |
| 10:22.21 | mafm | did you read a chat in the channel of me with somebody else (Erik?) about the creation of temp files? |
| 10:22.45 | brlcad | several days ago, yes |
| 10:23.39 | brlcad | bu_temp_file() is a secure implementation for temporary files, not something old |
| 10:24.05 | mafm | ok, so that's not a valid idea anymore :) |
| 10:24.15 | brlcad | basically it's just a wrapper on mkstemp if the platform supports it, otherwise it actually implements mkstemp for those that don't (e.g. Windows) |
| 10:24.40 | brlcad | it also has some nice automatic cleanup features, but the point is secure temporary files |
| 10:24.58 | mafm | I was trying to create a new patch based on the todo list, SF tracker etc., but I haven't found anything very suitable |
| 10:26.17 | brlcad | try the BUGS list, they tend to be more self-contained |
| 10:28.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30669 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: add options to nirt for reporting the exit points (instead of just LOS thickness) as well as the gaps between geometry (simulated air). |
| 11:06.18 | mafm | yes, but many of the bugs are very specific for some of the tools failing in some part, etc, and I can't even get it to compile |
| 11:06.30 | mafm | it still has those errors when linking |
| 11:14.13 | clock_ | brlcad: how exactly do I make 5 balls in a ring for a ball bearing? |
| 11:14.26 | clock_ | brlcad: I am not sure if Volume II has enough details to determine that |
| 11:14.50 | clock_ | brlcad: I mean without writing a C program that calculates the coordinates using sines and cosines |
| 11:15.17 | hippieindamakin8 | hey guys |
| 11:46.38 | brlcad | mafm: I worked around some of them just a little while ago (ubuntu build) |
| 11:47.17 | brlcad | mafm: you shoudl see if you update and rerun autogen.sh that it gets much further (or fix that problem as your patch) ;) |
| 11:47.54 | brlcad | it won't complete because I didn't want to just revert back to everything listing everything |
| 11:49.06 | brlcad | otherwise, there are mods that don't involve code, at this point there's something and there's nothing |
| 12:29.33 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 12:31.31 | andrecastelo | good morning folks |
| 12:31.32 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 12:31.38 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 12:55.37 | d_rossberg | mafm: try make install |
| 12:58.08 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 12:59.01 | starseeker | Hmm. |
| 12:59.55 | starseeker | darn it, screen isn't catching my terminal size when I reconnect |
| 13:00.27 | starseeker | Ah, well. Gotta figure it out sometime, might as well start now |
| 13:00.36 | starseeker | attempts to detach... |
| 13:01.05 | starseeker_home | Hmm, so far so good... |
| 13:03.46 | poolio | starseeker_home: It works fine for me when reconnecting, the issue is when I resize the terminal while connected. |
| 13:08.33 | hippieindamakin8 | Mr d_rossberg does that answer ur question or.. |
| 13:14.47 | d_rossberg | hippieindamakin8: no, or in some sense yes: you used the arb class only in your arb-edit example, therefore the conclusion would be that a class arb4, ..., arb8 would be useless |
| 13:15.26 | hippieindamakin8 | no.. they wont be |
| 13:16.51 | hippieindamakin8 | or u can model arb4 to arb 8 as objects if not classes .. and have the info attached to them using the arb_specifc function.. or smthing like arb.nm_faces |
| 13:18.21 | hippieindamakin8 | but i would prefer having some classes arb4 to arb8 for the objects of this class to be created, |
| 13:20.10 | hippieindamakin8 | for arb-edit i wanna use an arb4 object or arb 5 object which still inherits the arb class to be sent as a reference.. so the calculations and the decisions for evaluating the arb type are minimised |
| 13:20.50 | d_rossberg | these classes could not be interface classes because the internal structure could change from arb4 to arb5 and with this the class type had to change too |
| 13:21.16 | hippieindamakin8 | ya .. while passing it in i send it as an arb rather than an arb4 |
| 13:22.01 | d_rossberg | therefore these classes could be at the most something that is outside the real interface |
| 13:22.12 | hippieindamakin8 | and the main information that is sent is just the values of the 8 vertices,arbtype and cgtype along with the edit arrrays |
| 13:23.19 | hippieindamakin8 | i dint get the last statement of urs.. but i see it as simplifying the constructors.. using the classes arb4 to arb8 |
| 13:25.16 | d_rossberg | did you tried to change an arb4 to an arb5 qith the mged dialog? |
| 13:25.42 | hippieindamakin8 | no.. |
| 13:26.09 | d_rossberg | you should realy have a look at it |
| 13:26.17 | hippieindamakin8 | ya doing that |
| 13:26.52 | d_rossberg | it gives you an idea of how this element is handled in brl-cad |
| 13:42.26 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-85.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 13:44.06 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548763E2.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:57.03 | starseeker | likes this part of screen... |
| 13:58.38 | brlcad | starseeker: ctrl-a F |
| 13:58.44 | brlcad | notifies it of a resize |
| 13:58.52 | starseeker | Cool - thanks! |
| 14:04.28 | ``Erik | unfortunately, not all programs handle sigwinch :( |
| 14:04.41 | mafm | brlcad / d_rossberg: updating and recompiling now |
| 14:42.47 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 15:10.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30670 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: First cut at 'tire size spec' to geometry inputs logic. |
| 15:13.58 | mafm | brlcad / d_rossberg: same error /usr/bin/ld: warning: libtcl8.5.so, needed by ../../src/liboptical/.libs/liboptical.so, not found (try using -rpath or -rpath-link) |
| 15:16.53 | d_rossberg | mafm: so you did "make" followed by "make install"? |
| 15:18.38 | mafm | make install install things, without trying to finish things first |
| 15:19.54 | brlcad | mafm: make install compiles and installs, the idea is that the libs it's looking for are already installed by the time the next dir's link phase that depends on it |
| 15:20.17 | d_rossberg | i had a similar problem, it looks like the problem was the linker looked for the lobraries in the install directory |
| 15:22.25 | mafm | d_rossberg: exactly |
| 15:22.56 | mafm | or no, wait |
| 15:23.13 | mafm | I hacked some files to include that -rpath thing by hand, with the *building* dir of the library as argument |
| 15:23.34 | mafm | something like src/libXXX/.libs/ |
| 15:29.12 | *** join/#brlcad mib_j5frfeio (i=426217d6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-aaf33b6b871c8cd6) | |
| 15:33.32 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30671 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Switch to bu_unit for converting input, minor cleanup of unused variables. |
| 15:51.29 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've took down the patch i've made |
| 15:51.46 | andrecastelo | because it crashes rtarea :{ |
| 15:53.16 | mafm | if (a || !a) abort(); |
| 15:53.18 | mafm | :) |
| 15:58.52 | yukonbob | reads sb |
| 16:06.07 | mafm | sb? |
| 17:09.50 | yukonbob | scrollback |
| 17:09.56 | yukonbob | is finished reading sb |
| 17:09.59 | yukonbob | :) |
| 17:10.48 | yukonbob | clock_: x^2+y^2=r^2 -- Tcl can be your friend here... or, rotate about an axis |
| 17:13.03 | clock_ | yukonbob: how do I figure out from the integrated help how do I rotate a combination in another combination by 15 degrees counterclockwise when looking in direction from -z towards +z? |
| 17:13.26 | clock_ | I tried to but was unable |
| 17:13.37 | yukonbob | clock_: /me uses the mged cheat sheet |
| 17:13.43 | clock_ | all the descriptions are in the style "rotates something in some direction noone know which one ans which way" |
| 17:14.03 | clock_ | yukonbob: URL? |
| 17:14.08 | yukonbob | 1sec |
| 17:14.54 | clock_ | yukonbob: this is what you get if you attempt to look for the mged cheat sheet with google: http://www.google.com/search?hl=cs&ie=ISO-8859-2&q=mged+cheat+sheet&btnG=Vyhledat+Googlem&lr= |
| 17:14.58 | clock_ | Clutter. |
| 17:15.00 | clock_ | Useless. |
| 17:15.42 | yukonbob | is at http://brlcad.org/wiki/Documentation atm -- is their quick ref, or trifold. |
| 17:17.18 | yukonbob | quick ref is what I use (which is actually improved from my printed copy, with the co-ordinate system explained at bottom of pg2) |
| 17:17.57 | clock_ | I made the cheat into easy viewable PNG |
| 17:18.02 | clock_ | it was on the brlcad website |
| 17:18.07 | clock_ | is not there anymore |
| 17:18.14 | clock_ | How shortlived are contributions to brl-cad |
| 17:18.22 | clock_ | It demotivates you when you see your work is lost |
| 17:18.59 | yukonbob | on wiki? |
| 17:19.01 | clock_ | The cheatsheet PDF takes like 5 seconds to zoom on my 2.2GHz machine |
| 17:19.05 | clock_ | I think I stick to the C program. |
| 17:19.43 | yukonbob | Tcl has full math abilities, too -- so you can "play" with Tcl in mged interactively if that suits your styel |
| 17:19.43 | clock_ | This is the useless clutter you get when you type "mged cheat sheet wiki" into google: http://www.google.com/search?hl=cs&ie=ISO-8859-2&q=mged+cheat+sheet+wiki&btnG=Vyhledat+Googlem&lr= |
| 17:20.23 | clock_ | What about people who have not 2.2GHz CPU but 200MHz? |
| 17:20.32 | clock_ | They will need 50 seconds to zoom in the cheat sheet PDF |
| 17:20.54 | yukonbob | prints it to paper and zooms with his eyeballs |
| 17:21.08 | clock_ | yukonbob: my computer doesn't support printing |
| 17:21.13 | clock_ | because I don't have a printer |
| 17:21.29 | clock_ | that's why I made those PNGs but they are gone again |
| 17:21.31 | prasad_ | 200mhz shouldn't be running a cad package no? |
| 17:21.46 | clock_ | not a one with so badly done documentation |
| 17:22.02 | clock_ | wasn't BRL-CAD a CAD package back in the 80's? |
| 17:22.13 | clock_ | Did you have 2.2GHz back in the 80's? |
| 17:22.27 | clock_ | OMG, OMG, OMG |
| 17:22.32 | yukonbob | wonders How Low can BRL-CAD Go wrt hardware |
| 17:22.33 | alex_joni | clock_: not exactly.. but similar in performance |
| 17:22.39 | alex_joni | if you take a big cray |
| 17:22.43 | clock_ | Reasons why the user hurdle run needs to stay user hurdle run |
| 17:23.03 | clock_ | I think I soon have to make a Twibright Labs BRL-CAD website |
| 17:23.08 | clock_ | With all the missing details filled in |
| 17:23.25 | clock_ | a.k.a. "what the U. S. Army was unable to do, brought to you by a hippie skater." |
| 17:24.07 | clock_ | I suggest the PDF be zipped as self-extracting windows executable |
| 17:24.11 | yukonbob | clock_: Use the wiki, and make a personal space |
| 17:25.37 | clock_ | If I were to run the GSoC, I would give these unfinished details and hurdled user experience priority |
| 17:25.55 | alex_joni | clock_: wth would you want a self-extracting windows executable for a pdf? |
| 17:26.05 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-85.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:26.07 | alex_joni | clock_: wth would you want a self-extracting windows executable for a pdf? |
| 17:26.32 | clock_ | alex_joni: because Linux people would have to install Wine to be able to extract it |
| 17:26.48 | alex_joni | so that's an improvement? |
| 17:26.52 | clock_ | yes |
| 17:27.05 | clock_ | if BRL-CAD user experience should be a hurdle run, that's an improved hurdle run |
| 17:27.22 | starseeker | brlcad: How would I handle a multiple character option flag from the command line? Does bu have provisions for that? |
| 17:29.22 | alex_joni | clock_: the pdf loads just fine on this box (not quite the oldest machine.. but still 5 years old) |
| 17:31.16 | clock_ | These cards are great when youre a professional and have a workplace dedicated to BRL-CAD |
| 17:31.18 | yukonbob | starseeker: see (for example) pix-fb.c |
| 17:31.27 | yukonbob | (bu_getopt) |
| 17:31.32 | clock_ | But if you need edit once a detail in the work, once at home and once in the train, they are not so great anymore. |
| 17:31.44 | clock_ | Because you don't print them and carry them with you into the train. |
| 17:32.01 | clock_ | alex_joni: how long does it take to change the zoom in the pdf? |
| 17:32.57 | alex_joni | depends on the viewer |
| 17:33.13 | alex_joni | but it rages from not noticeable to 1-2 seconds |
| 17:33.34 | alex_joni | evince is worse than the adobe viewer on this old machine |
| 17:34.11 | starseeker | yukonbob - as far as I can tell, that only allows for single letter flags - e.g. pix-fb -a and not pix-fb -abc where "abc" is one flag |
| 17:34.22 | yukonbob | ~1-2 for high zoom on 1.6Ghz laptop, via xpdf |
| 17:34.33 | yukonbob | starseeker: ah... |
| 17:35.17 | yukonbob | have you built a dummy program to test that theory? |
| 17:35.37 | starseeker | I'm trying it in tire right now |
| 17:35.42 | yukonbob | isn't sure at all... but single-letters could be the case |
| 17:36.05 | starseeker | 'course, I can't even get bu_getarg to spit back the string I supplied it, so clearly I'm doing something wrong... |
| 17:36.39 | yukonbob | listens to Amon Tobin |
| 17:38.04 | yukonbob | and Boards of Canada |
| 17:39.17 | starseeker | eyes sscanf |
| 17:39.30 | clock_ | clock@sandy:~$ gimp MGED_Quick_Reference_Card.pdf |
| 17:39.30 | clock_ | (script-fu:3101): LibGimpBase-WARNING **: script-fu: wire_read(): error |
| 17:39.31 | clock_ | Segmentation fault |
| 17:39.39 | clock_ | End of attempts at making the MGED PNG again |
| 17:40.13 | yukonbob | clock_: are you looking for a high-res png image? |
| 17:40.41 | clock_ | yukonbob: yes |
| 17:40.48 | clock_ | I made one sent to brlcad and he put it on the webpage |
| 17:40.52 | yukonbob | I guess my real question is: what resolution |
| 17:40.54 | clock_ | I don't think I have it anymore |
| 17:40.58 | clock_ | but now it's gone again |
| 17:41.16 | yukonbob | can try from my end, and pass it over to you for administration |
| 17:41.20 | clock_ | yukonbob: well that's the problem it either doesn't fit on the screen or you cannot read the fine print |
| 17:42.14 | yukonbob | clock_: right -- can't have it both ways... what bout something like X=2048 (and just keep aspect ratio) |
| 17:42.17 | yukonbob | ? |
| 17:43.05 | clock_ | May I ask how BRL-CAD overlaps with ECAD Electronic CAD Electronic Design Automation Electrical Circuits VLSI? |
| 17:43.39 | clock_ | Does anyone have sources for the PDF card and can they be exported to HTML? |
| 18:14.49 | starseeker | gets help on sscanf - good stuff |
| 19:02.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30672 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Added basic command line specification behavior - tire size can now be specified - ex: 'tire -d 265/70R15 mytire.g' |
| 19:03.12 | starseeker | does happy dance |
| 19:35.14 | brlcad | andre|university: I noticed you pulled it :( |
| 19:38.00 | brlcad | clock_: jeez, talk about crocodile tears ... you did notice that there is a new site up and perhaps -- just maybe -- the image hadn't been copied over yet?? |
| 19:41.24 | brlcad | starseeker: convention-wise for consistency it "shouldn't" (re: -abc) .. have wanted to add long opt support eventually, but nobody has worked on it yet |
| 19:42.14 | *** join/#brlcad spike_ (i=[U2FsdGV@centaur.acm.jhu.edu) | |
| 19:45.05 | brlcad | in fact, the image was never removed, it's still there. it's just not linked on the wiki page |
| 19:45.09 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/MGED_Quick_Reference_Card.png |
| 19:45.36 | brlcad | less drama next time would be nice |
| 19:48.51 | mafm | bye |
| 19:53.22 | andre|university | brlcad : the patch somehow crashes rtarea |
| 19:53.27 | andre|university | i'm trying to figure out the problem |
| 19:57.28 | brlcad | figured as much :) |
| 20:10.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30673 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: rtcheck needs to call the dgo_rtcheck_cmd (i.e. the handlers associated with rtcheck expect binary vector data on stdout and text on stderr). |
| 20:40.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30674 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/mgedrc.tcl: Double quote html_dir and web_browser values when dumping mged state to .mgedrc |
| 20:57.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30675 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add comments, rename some things. |
| 21:11.56 | *** part/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 21:12.18 | *** join/#brlcad pacman88 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 22:40.56 | yukonbob | waves to brlcad |
| 22:41.07 | brlcad | waves back to yukonbob |
| 22:52.39 | andrecastelo | waves to both yukonbob and brlcad |
| 22:56.25 | brlcad | hey andre |
| 22:56.30 | brlcad | any luck on what's wrong? |
| 23:02.57 | andrecastelo | i'm getting a segmentation fault on rtarea:( |
| 23:03.24 | andrecastelo | i thought the error was in do.c but the reverted version worked fine |
| 23:03.44 | andrecastelo | let me paste you the patch and the error |
| 23:04.59 | andrecastelo | here the point of the crash ->: http://rafb.net/p/0qn7z891.html here the error message -> http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/8397/imagemkk5.png |
| 23:05.46 | andrecastelo | here the patch http://rafb.net/p/eh9YDM36.html |
| 23:06.32 | andrecastelo | (i was studying for an exam, i'm starting to work on the bug right now) |
| 23:16.46 | brlcad | more than likely related to the linked list management |
| 23:20.40 | brlcad | looks like mafm has some decisions to make |
| 23:24.19 | yukonbob | waves to andrecastelo |
| 23:24.23 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ? why's that? |
| 23:24.28 | andrecastelo | hey yukonbob ! |
| 23:24.42 | andrecastelo | also, managed to get rid of the segmentation fault. |
| 23:26.34 | andrecastelo | brlcad: where can i find a .g file i could use to test rtarea ? |
| 23:28.36 | yukonbob | andrecastelo: do you need a special .g ? |
| 23:28.44 | andrecastelo | any .g will do :) |
| 23:30.24 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-10 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 23:30.50 | yukonbob | you've got some .g's shipped w/ the distro, or whip up your own |
| 23:30.51 | brlcad | andrecastelo: there are a slew provided |
| 23:31.35 | brlcad | in the db build dir or $prefix/share/brlcad/VERSION/db if you already installed (where prefix is /usr/brlcad by default) |
| 23:32.18 | andrecastelo | brlcad: thanks, found them :D |
| 23:52.13 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (i=vedge@vedge.org) | |
| 00:29.35 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i managed to get it working, at least half working |
| 00:30.24 | andrecastelo | the thing is - it calculates the region area center but not the assembly area center :( |
| 00:42.51 | brlcad | andrecastelo: so screw the assemblies for now ;) |
| 00:43.36 | brlcad | better yet, you should be able to get it working for "exposed" .. but not easily for presented |
| 00:44.04 | andrecastelo | it is working for both of them, but only for regions |
| 01:02.09 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, i'll send the patch now |
| 02:02.06 | andrecastelo | good night everyone |
| 07:10.27 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:14.59 | clock_ | Anyone likes Hendrix? |
| 07:19.16 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 09:28.28 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:49.11 | mafm | hi there |
| 09:57.41 | Axman6 | 'lo |
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| 12:00.54 | cad70 | he? |
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| 13:40.24 | brlcad | hey mafm |
| 13:55.04 | mafm | hi |
| 13:55.29 | mafm | I'm compiling after installing tk8.5-dev and tcl8.5-dev, to know if that solves the issue |
| 13:55.49 | mafm | and I enabled warnings, and it's producing a lot of output |
| 13:56.12 | mafm | opennurbs_mesh.cpp:291: warning: comparing floating point with == or != is unsafe |
| 13:56.24 | mafm | opennurbs_mesh.cpp:1543: warning: conversion to 'unsigned char' from 'int' may alter its value |
| 13:56.38 | mafm | opennurbs_mesh.cpp:2030: warning: declaration of 'd' shadows a previous local |
| 13:56.49 | mafm | opennurbs_light.h:101: warning: type qualifiers ignored on function return type |
| 13:56.53 | mafm | ... and similar ones |
| 13:57.09 | mafm | I guess that they're there for a reason, or would it be worth investigating? |
| 14:10.03 | brlcad | mafm: any warnings in src/other aren't our concern |
| 14:10.13 | brlcad | any warnings outside src/other are fair game |
| 14:11.55 | mafm | oh yep, it's still in other/ it seems |
| 14:12.19 | mafm | our including files from other/ which cause this |
| 14:13.04 | brlcad | well those are just third party sources so unless someone is also going to push the changes upstream, any fixes would be lost the next time that dependency is updated |
| 14:13.27 | mafm | sure |
| 14:13.27 | brlcad | the sources in src/other/* are regularly updated as those packages make releases and we finish testing |
| 14:14.39 | brlcad | we've put a *lot* of effort clearing out the warnings from our main code and it's finally clean -- at least it should be clean for default warnings |
| 14:15.26 | brlcad | the next step is turning up the warnings and fixing those as well, but it's yet another major effort (probably gsoc-worthy in itself) |
| 14:17.24 | mafm | turning up? |
| 14:17.38 | mafm | like enabling non-default warnings? |
| 14:18.23 | mafm | it's just that when I produced the patch I don't remember so many warnings when compiling |
| 14:18.57 | mafm | maybe it's because "-Wall" was only enabled for brl-cad own code, not for others, and --enable-warnings enables those too |
| 14:21.01 | brlcad | yeah, if you add --enable-warnings to configure, it will turn on more verbose warnings |
| 14:21.40 | brlcad | without enable-warnings, default is compiler default |
| 14:21.43 | brlcad | so not Wall |
| 14:22.01 | brlcad | with it, it will report Wall and more |
| 14:22.16 | brlcad | -W -Wall -Wundef -Wfloat-equal -Wshadow -Wunreachable-code -Winline -Wconversion |
| 14:22.21 | brlcad | that's why it's so many |
| 14:22.48 | brlcad | shadow and undef in particular |
| 14:34.06 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@ms28-2-gprs01.net.vip.hr) | |
| 14:47.52 | mafm | now I only have 3 related errors |
| 14:48.21 | mafm | make[2]: *** [pl-dm] Error 1 |
| 14:48.21 | mafm | ../../src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XFreeDeviceList' |
| 14:48.21 | mafm | ../../src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XOpenDevice' |
| 14:48.29 | mafm | ../../src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XSelectExtensionEvent' |
| 14:48.29 | mafm | ../../src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XListInputDevices' |
| 14:49.25 | brlcad | that looks like libXi .. a -lXi missing from the link line perhaps |
| 14:49.59 | brlcad | that would/should be in DM_LIBS |
| 14:55.36 | mafm | http://paste.debian.net/836/ |
| 14:56.03 | mafm | there are about 3 like that |
| 14:57.36 | brlcad | hum, it lists -lX11 -lXext .. just not -lXi |
| 14:57.54 | brlcad | do you actually have libXi installed? (what does config.log report for the Xi test?) |
| 15:01.02 | mafm | $ dpkg -S /usr/lib/libXi.so.6 |
| 15:01.02 | mafm | libxi6: /usr/lib/libXi.so.6 |
| 15:01.34 | mafm | configure:28190: checking for XGetExtensionVersion in -lXi |
| 15:01.34 | mafm | configure:28225: gcc -o conftest -I/usr/local/include -L/usr/local/lib conftest.c -lXi -lX11 -lX11 -lXext >&5 |
| 15:01.34 | mafm | /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lXi |
| 15:02.02 | brlcad | so that thar be a problem |
| 15:10.51 | brlcad | mafm: can you post your entire config.log somewhere? |
| 15:11.16 | brlcad | I don't see from configure.ac how Xext would pass but Xi fails |
| 15:20.42 | brlcad | mafm: give that last update a try |
| 15:20.50 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30676 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: somehow Xi is not getting detected, seemingly from a failure to include the X11 include dirs. set up CPPFLAGS to see if they can be found. |
| 15:41.51 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 15:42.01 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 15:44.37 | mafm | (sorry, had to fix Makefiles for some guys @ work) |
| 15:46.18 | mafm | brlcad: that's an easy one: I have libxext-whatever-dev installed, but not libxi-dev |
| 15:46.53 | mafm | ii libxext-dev 2:1.0.4-1 X11 miscellaneous extensions library (development headers) |
| 15:46.53 | mafm | pn libxi-dev <none> (no description available) |
| 15:47.49 | mafm | that would be because some package for some reason required libxext-dev to be installed, but not libxi-dev (I didn't install anything explicitly for brlcad, AFAICR) |
| 15:47.54 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 15:47.59 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 15:52.22 | brlcad | good morning andrecastelo |
| 15:52.31 | andrecastelo | good morning brlcad :) |
| 15:53.58 | mafm | brlcad: the patch should probably work, yep |
| 15:54.08 | andrecastelo | be right back, lunch |
| 15:58.07 | mafm | checking for XCreateWindow in -lX11... yes |
| 15:58.07 | mafm | checking for XShapeCombineMask in -lXext... yes |
| 15:58.07 | mafm | checking for XGetExtensionVersion in -lXi... no |
| 15:58.12 | mafm | :) |
| 16:01.33 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 16:16.10 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30677 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: push back to next release, time to start testing |
| 16:17.32 | andre|eating | back |
| 16:43.30 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 16:44.21 | mafm | brlcad: http://paste.debian.net/843/ |
| 16:44.26 | mafm | hi yukonbob |
| 16:46.00 | yukonbob | mafm :) -- what's shaking? |
| 16:48.20 | *** join/#brlcad Maloeran (n=maloeran@glvortex.net) | |
| 16:48.33 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30678 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Exploratory work for rims. |
| 16:48.40 | mafm | trying to get brlcad to compile in debian, finally |
| 16:48.46 | mafm | with my config at least |
| 16:48.55 | yukonbob | nods |
| 16:49.41 | yukonbob | has heard that the auto* tools are one of the barriers -- Debian versions are patched, and actually "not correct" (/me not speaking from experience, just observations of others) |
| 16:50.37 | hippieindamakin8 | mafm, it compiled on my debian |
| 16:50.44 | mafm | I guess that you already considered CMake? |
| 16:50.52 | hippieindamakin8 | ya |
| 16:51.13 | yukonbob | mafn it's been talked about, but there's a big investment in auto* already, and for the most part, auto* works... |
| 16:51.43 | hippieindamakin8 | i had compiling problems on my desktop though which runs on xubuntu (which ofcourse is debain based) |
| 16:52.18 | yukonbob | is getting CMake manual soon, though, and I think brlcad has an interestest (if not an already solid understanding?) of CMake too, in general. |
| 16:54.00 | andrecastelo | morning yukonbob :) |
| 16:54.41 | yukonbob | brlcad: morning -- q: re: gui crash reporter (bombardier) -- is the bombardier the reference to the co. that makes personal rec. vehicles, airplanes, trains, etc.? |
| 16:54.51 | yukonbob | andrecastelo: :) |
| 16:55.20 | yukonbob | brlcad: (ref. TODO) |
| 17:07.40 | *** join/#brlcad jdoline1 (n=jdoliner@wireless-239-97.uchicago.edu) | |
| 17:10.02 | jdoline1 | brlcad are you here? |
| 17:10.14 | brlcad | jdoline1: hello |
| 17:10.21 | jdoline1 | hi |
| 17:10.31 | brlcad | mafm: it'll take me a few to catch up, kinda hungry ;) |
| 17:11.40 | brlcad | mafm: but yes, cmake would be cool .. but would also be a pretty big effort to fully replicate what the autotools are presently doing -- the error you're getting would not go away with cmake |
| 17:12.11 | brlcad | as that's still just leaving -lXi off the link line |
| 17:12.15 | brlcad | try adding it manually |
| 17:12.25 | jdoline1 | I'm planning on coding a patch right now to determine whether or not two polynomial chains intersect |
| 17:12.25 | brlcad | make LIBS=-lXi |
| 17:15.44 | jdoline1 | perhaps you could provide some guidance? |
| 17:16.18 | brlcad | jdoline1: not right this second, I'm kinda hungry for lunch -- though I do have a few other questions for you |
| 17:16.29 | jdoline1 | okay shoot |
| 17:17.05 | mafm | with <brlcad> make LIBS=-lXi, it works |
| 17:17.37 | brlcad | cool |
| 17:33.40 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-079-069.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 17:52.52 | ``Erik | $700 for a pair of tires, yeesh |
| 17:52.53 | *** join/#brlcad pacman_87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 17:55.25 | archivist | if you can afford the car that take that sort of tires...... |
| 18:09.53 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
| 18:17.35 | mafm | bye |
| 18:57.10 | prasad_ | still have that m3? |
| 18:59.04 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:07.01 | *** part/#brlcad jdoline1 (n=jdoliner@wireless-239-97.uchicago.edu) | |
| 19:07.49 | brlcad | and he just e-mailed |
| 19:09.03 | brlcad | yukonbob: sorry - missed your question about bombardier, no it's not |
| 19:09.48 | brlcad | I started a new generalized crash reporter tool that can kick off if an app crashes, named it bombardier |
| 19:14.27 | yukonbob | nods |
| 19:16.52 | brlcad | actually kinda nifty, should rival mozillas when it's done |
| 19:18.06 | yukonbob | one thing I don't like about cmake is the colour output - reminds me of linux distros that have colour 'ls', and 'vim' w/ syntax highlighting (ugh :P) |
| 19:18.31 | yukonbob | re: bombardier -- is C, Tcl, combo, or ?? |
| 19:24.29 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30679 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/openw.tcl: apply a modified version of sf patch 1940958 (Fix for bad paths in .mgedrc on Windows) from Elena Bautu - ebautu. |
| 19:24.46 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30680 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: More rim experimentation. Dimensions are off somewhere in wheel - need to re-factor equations. |
| 19:25.05 | brlcad | it's C, calling through to the C side of Tcl/Tk |
| 19:31.00 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30681 10/brlcad/trunk/ (AUTHORS NEWS): |
| 19:31.00 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: credit elena bautu for her patch to handle paths with spaces in the .mgedrc |
| 19:31.00 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: file. accepted sf patch 1940958 (Fix for bad paths in .mgedrc on Windows) which |
| 19:31.00 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: bob applied via proxy through dave. the patch also tests for internet |
| 19:31.02 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: exploder's existence for reading the html help files. |
| 19:34.06 | yukonbob | heh -- "Internet Exploder" in official commit msgs |
| 20:34.52 | poolio | yukonbob: you don't use vim with syntax highlighting? |
| 20:57.30 | yukonbob | poolio -- I don't use vim if I can help it, and turn off syntax highlighting when I need to use vim |
| 21:03.04 | prasad_ | bombardier eh |
| 21:03.21 | prasad_ | it's gonna keep bombing after it bombs the first time? |
| 21:03.24 | prasad_ | :P |
| 21:03.33 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.227) | |
| 21:08.28 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30682 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add patterning for subtracting holes from the wheel. |
| 21:42.24 | poolio | yukonbob: Do you just find it annoying? I find it quite helpful and nice |
| 21:47.41 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 22:14.01 | yukonbob | poolio: it makes my eyes bleed. |
| 22:15.07 | yukonbob | I prefer my tools dumb... |
| 22:15.42 | yukonbob | (might sound ironic considering I'm an emacs fan... but emacs is just full featured ;) |
| 22:25.08 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 22:34.46 | brlcad | prasad_: one can only hope |
| 22:43.05 | andrecastelo | hey cadheads :D |
| 22:48.07 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 22:50.53 | starseeker_home | gets meowed at |
| 22:58.40 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad , how you doing ? |
| 22:58.47 | andrecastelo | :) |
| 23:05.35 | brlcad | andrecastelo: pretty goood |
| 23:05.49 | brlcad | though I just lost one of our conflict students to another org :) |
| 23:05.55 | brlcad | (sorry yukonbob) :) |
| 23:07.28 | andrecastelo | yukonbob was a student ? |
| 23:07.41 | andrecastelo | i'm lost lol |
| 23:08.28 | brlcad | nope, he was going to be her mentor |
| 23:08.51 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:10.14 | brlcad | student was highly ranked at both our org and ccan, rusty and I talked into detail and the proposal was pretty much just as useful to both orgs (and the student has been one of the most responsive easy to talk to of all applicants, current company notwithstanding ;) |
| 23:10.37 | brlcad | pacman87: her application was the best of the web-based model repository proposals |
| 23:12.50 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hehehe.. what was her nickname here in irc ? |
| 23:14.27 | brlcad | she was entirely via e-mail and the app form |
| 23:19.03 | andrecastelo | oh |
| 23:21.34 | starseeker_home | Hey, cool : http://ed-thelen.org/bab/bab_tech.html#bab-t-append |
| 23:21.52 | brlcad | so -0.1 points for no irc, but she made up for it heavily with the quality of her communications |
| 23:22.02 | starseeker_home | anybody feel like cad modeling a Babbage Difference Engine? :-) |
| 23:25.15 | andrecastelo | about students, what is the thing you guys value the most in them ? |
| 23:25.33 | andrecastelo | experience? knowledge? programming skills ? |
| 23:25.53 | brlcad | andrecastelo: their interest in become a long term developer with the project |
| 23:26.53 | brlcad | passion for working with the project and their ability to communicate effectively with others |
| 23:27.54 | brlcad | experience and knowledge can be acquired, skills can be taught |
| 23:27.59 | brlcad | s/become/becoming/ |
| 23:28.20 | andrecastelo | that's really nice :) |
| 23:28.54 | andrecastelo | some other orgs don't act like that :( |
| 23:28.55 | brlcad | that said, they better not be a bag of hammers either :) |
| 23:29.08 | andrecastelo | bag of hammers ? |
| 23:29.19 | brlcad | dumb as a bag of hammers |
| 23:29.46 | andrecastelo | heheh |
| 00:03.12 | yukonbob | :( |
| 00:04.02 | yukonbob | Rusty owes me ;) |
| 00:04.34 | andrecastelo | well folks |
| 00:04.36 | andrecastelo | i'm out |
| 00:04.38 | andrecastelo | :) |
| 00:04.40 | andrecastelo | good night |
| 00:14.49 | hippieindamakin8 | hey folks |
| 00:17.03 | hippieindamakin8 | starseeker_home, that is not a problem man.. |
| 00:17.36 | hippieindamakin8 | but it ll be of no use :P modelling a babbage difference engine |
| 00:19.42 | hippieindamakin8 | we have modelled the spare parts of a car as a semester project in CAD and engineering design course |
| 00:20.28 | hippieindamakin8 | but unfortunately then i dint know about BRL-CAD |
| 00:41.58 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 01:02.02 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-230-86.uchicago.edu) | |
| 01:02.37 | jdoliner | brlcad? |
| 01:07.41 | brlcad | ~ask :) |
| 01:07.47 | brlcad | aww |
| 01:08.02 | pacman87 | ~ask |
| 01:08.02 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 01:11.38 | brlcad | ibot you should ignore emoticons |
| 01:13.27 | jdoliner | you said you had questions for me earlier |
| 01:16.58 | brlcad | i have questions for most everyone |
| 01:17.07 | brlcad | shifts context |
| 01:17.14 | brlcad | scratches head |
| 01:17.32 | brlcad | oh yeah, why'd you disappear?? :) |
| 01:17.55 | brlcad | not to put you on the spot or anything *ahem* |
| 01:18.17 | jdoliner | sorry your lunch, I had to go grab some lunch myself |
| 01:18.44 | jdoliner | your lunch ran into mine unfortunately |
| 01:19.02 | jdoliner | but I've returned |
| 01:23.40 | jdoliner | While you think, do you perhaps know what the interval in: bool ON_Intersect(const ON_BoundingBox&, const ON_Line&, double, ON_Interval*) |
| 01:23.48 | jdoliner | is supposed to be. |
| 01:24.59 | brlcad | more than likely an upper and lower bounds so that the intersection can be computed -- numerics can go to all hell for completely unbound search spaces when you're root finding |
| 01:26.08 | jdoliner | okay that makes good sense |
| 01:27.19 | brlcad | hm, though in the case of ON_Intersect(), the header defines it as something specific |
| 01:27.22 | brlcad | see the header |
| 01:27.25 | brlcad | it's the result |
| 01:40.27 | jdoliner | okay cool |
| 01:40.47 | jdoliner | do you have some questions regarding my project? |
| 01:49.13 | brlcad | jdoliner: heh, of course -- look forward to seeing that patch of course, how do you actually forsee being able to compute the surface intersections? |
| 01:50.24 | brlcad | also, one thing to keep in mind -- openNURBS is a 3rd party code that we do our best to not modify directly -- any changes should be in src/librt/opennurbs_ext.cpp or similar file outside of openNURBS itself so that we can keep their code up to date without continually clobbering changes |
| 01:50.41 | brlcad | so you have to either make funcs that take both parameters or extend from their classes with new classes |
| 01:54.18 | jdoliner | The computation of surface intersections comes down to manipulation of algebraic curves. |
| 01:54.52 | jdoliner | However as the papers suggest this is pretty computationally intensive |
| 01:55.19 | jdoliner | Solutions either have impractical runtimes for our situation or they can become a bit inaccurate. |
| 01:56.44 | jdoliner | So it might not be possible to implement exactly the solution we want, however I'm confident I can make one that is of some use, and will make integration of new algorithms much easier |
| 01:57.46 | jdoliner | actually from what I've seen the opennurbs classes are pretty good for the task at hand. |
| 01:58.30 | brlcad | boole tends to work like 95% of time time.. but that's a pretty huge error marging when it comes to cad models |
| 01:58.42 | brlcad | that means just about any given cad model will at least partially fail |
| 01:59.06 | brlcad | opennurbs is a pretty solid foundation, that's why it's the basis for our brep code |
| 01:59.27 | brlcad | you can see an example cube constructed via opennurbs in src/proc-db/breplicator.cpp |
| 01:59.54 | brlcad | there's also a couple other twisted cube examples, but breplicator was written to be relatively straight-forward to understand brep structure |
| 01:59.55 | jdoliner | does that mean on 95% of CSG trees or on 95% of the nodes |
| 02:00.39 | brlcad | it's a swag number, it's high enough that it's gonna happen -- mostly though, i think it actually fails for code robustness reasons, not actual algorithmic |
| 02:01.14 | jdoliner | explain more what you mean by robustness reasons |
| 02:01.14 | brlcad | just by the nature that esolid worked with fixed point math indicates to me that it can work with boole's approach with proper tolerance management |
| 02:02.27 | jdoliner | yes, but I think we might find that BOOLE + proper tolerance management = ESOLID |
| 02:02.30 | brlcad | e.g. taking the simple case of 1+1 (deja vu!) .. where boole's approach to solving that is something along the lines of double result = 1.0 + 1.0; if (result == 2.0) then do something |
| 02:03.33 | brlcad | esolid's approach is to turn that into fixed_float result = fixed_float(1.0) + fixed_float(1.0); if (equals(result, 2.0, 5_decimal_places)) then do something |
| 02:03.59 | brlcad | er, where + is really add_these_together(fixedA, fixedB) |
| 02:04.25 | brlcad | esolid's isn't "propoer tolerance managment", it's a cop-out |
| 02:05.28 | brlcad | proper tolerance management for the first case necessitates that you don't just check == 2.0 .. you check for distance to the value within tolernace if (NEAR_ZERO(result - 2.0, 0.00001)) then do something, for example |
| 02:05.29 | jdoliner | by that do you mean it just throws a huge amount of computation at the problem |
| 02:06.19 | brlcad | yes, it throws floating point out the window so that the mathematical equations all result in stable computations (within a given absolute fixed point precision) |
| 02:06.30 | brlcad | which is several orders of magnitude worse |
| 02:06.34 | brlcad | computationally |
| 02:07.27 | brlcad | I really think boole's _implementation_ is probably just weak (as it was really just an academic exercise, not production quality robust code) |
| 02:08.06 | jdoliner | where did you say opennurbs_ext.cpp was? |
| 02:08.52 | brlcad | hopes jdoliner doesn't really need his hand held that closely that he can't find a file by name ... :-) |
| 02:09.41 | jdoliner | don't worry I've found many files already, I'm just worried because, it seems you may have been wrong about the location of this one |
| 02:10.09 | brlcad | why would that worry you? :) |
| 02:11.02 | brlcad | there are thousands of files in brl-cad, I don't keep them all in memory -- though I was right about that one |
| 02:11.37 | brlcad | hm, 1988 files to be exact, 354 directories |
| 02:13.36 | brlcad | hope you hand around irc more often ;) off to dinner for now though |
| 02:53.35 | brlcad | aww, that wasn't very long at all |
| 03:40.12 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30683 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Use some intermediate variable names to simplify rim creation logic a bit - seems to be working now for different sizes. |
| 03:51.13 | starseeker_home | decides sleep is next on the agenda... |
| 04:15.04 | brlcad | hum hum |
| 04:44.42 | PrezKennedy | hmmmm sleep... |
| 04:45.21 | poolio | why sleep when you can code? |
| 04:45.49 | PrezKennedy | why code when you can do anything else? |
| 04:48.11 | brlcad | ~poolio++ |
| 04:48.40 | PrezKennedy | awww :( |
| 04:50.03 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:21.46 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 05:44.25 | poolio | sorry PrezKennedy :) |
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| 07:03.45 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
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| 10:17.57 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:18.42 | mafm | morning |
| 11:10.07 | brlcad | `morning |
| 12:51.47 | mafm | brlcad: are predefined mentors assigned for different project ideas, or you don't do that in your organization? |
| 12:53.57 | brlcad | depends on the mentor, depends on the idea |
| 12:58.56 | mafm | I see |
| 13:30.03 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 13:30.53 | hippieindamakin8 | hey guys |
| 13:30.55 | hippieindamakin8 | good morning |
| 13:31.21 | pacman87 | good morning |
| 13:33.42 | hippieindamakin8 | so how is ur patch working man ? |
| 13:33.58 | hippieindamakin8 | so pacman87 how is ur patch working man ? |
| 13:34.28 | pacman87 | i've uploaded it |
| 13:34.38 | pacman87 | but it's only half of what needs to be done |
| 13:35.33 | pacman87 | http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1939611&group_id=105292&atid=640804 |
| 13:36.04 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 13:36.18 | pacman87 | how's your patch? |
| 13:36.37 | hippieindamakin8 | hey tell u wat i got a project in fluid mechanics :P micro fluids |
| 13:37.06 | hippieindamakin8 | i dont know the present state of my patch man.. havent touched BRL-CAD stuff for the past 2-3 days |
| 13:37.14 | hippieindamakin8 | my end semester exams started |
| 13:37.36 | hippieindamakin8 | tryin to study hard ;) |
| 13:38.18 | hippieindamakin8 | the final year project is on micro-fluids |
| 13:38.39 | pacman87 | cfd or analytical? |
| 13:39.03 | hippieindamakin8 | it is micro fluid analysis i would say CFD |
| 13:39.36 | pacman87 | how does a mircofluid differ from a normal fluid? |
| 13:39.46 | hippieindamakin8 | the reynolds number |
| 13:40.05 | hippieindamakin8 | and the mixing charachteristics.. |
| 13:40.54 | hippieindamakin8 | our project is to design some micro mixer and laminators using the flagellar properties of the bacteria . |
| 13:41.17 | pacman87 | so it's not the fluids that are 'mirco', it's their environment |
| 13:41.23 | hippieindamakin8 | dont know how we are gonna do that .. |
| 13:41.42 | hippieindamakin8 | no.. :) the fluids with Re ~.1 |
| 13:42.20 | pacman87 | Re = rho*v/(mu*D) ? |
| 13:42.30 | hippieindamakin8 | when u try to pass 2 fluids into a tunnel they dont mix like they do normally in the macroscopic levels |
| 13:42.46 | hippieindamakin8 | correction : rho*v*D/mu |
| 13:42.56 | pacman87 | knew it was something like that |
| 13:43.07 | pacman87 | been a few semesters ago |
| 13:43.12 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) i revised it day bfore :) |
| 13:43.16 | hippieindamakin8 | had an exam today |
| 13:43.55 | hippieindamakin8 | hey u go on.. i shall get back to studies :) |
| 13:44.25 | pacman87 | good luck |
| 14:17.45 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30684 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/make_dmg.sh: include the size of the package in the dmg autosize calcs |
| 14:21.52 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30685 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/beset/ (beset.c beset.h): quellage |
| 14:37.26 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30686 10/CVSROOT/: CVSROOT is no longer needed |
| 14:40.03 | mafm | CVSROOT spies in the SVN land? :) |
| 14:40.21 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30687 10/brlcad/branches/ (VendorARL/ libpng/ scriptics/ zlib/): remove branches that have no meaning and are for 3rd-party dependencies |
| 14:40.21 | brlcad | kinda :) |
| 14:40.42 | brlcad | haven't cleaned up the svn root since the conversion, there are all sorts of conversion turds that need to be cleaned up |
| 14:49.33 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 14:49.57 | andrecastelo | good morning folks :D |
| 14:58.39 | brlcad | hola |
| 14:59.32 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 15:01.18 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 15:01.18 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 15:01.18 | *** join/#brlcad Maloeran (n=maloeran@glvortex.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 15:01.22 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 15:06.31 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30688 10/brlcad/branches/ (13 files in 13 dirs): remove unlabeled branches with uninteresting code |
| 15:09.25 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30689 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add first stab at cuts for bolt holes and center. |
| 15:10.32 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30690 10/brlcad/branches/ (6 files in 6 dirs): remove frozen branches that were 'completed' (or dead/closed) including the ansi, autoconf, bobWinPort, brlcad_5_1_alpha_patch, photonmap, and windows branches |
| 15:10.35 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:15.45 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30691 10/brlcad/branches/phong-branch/: the phong branch is dead, all hail phong |
| 15:20.54 | andrecastelo__ | finally.. cya later clones |
| 15:26.57 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30692 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 15:26.57 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: found a reference to mged contributions from Gary Kuehl in a branch. it's |
| 15:26.57 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: unclear if these changes ever made it in or if other code was related or if it |
| 15:26.57 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: was even code that was provided, but credit him with special thanks for now. |
| 15:30.02 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30693 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: dtrmenak is an open source contributor, bob has contributed as open source off-the-clock as well |
| 15:33.30 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548746D4.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:35.32 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30694 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: butler inactive for approx 17 months now (only two isolated events intaval script and manpage update), remove activity marker |
| 15:36.55 | pacman87 | brlcad: i think it's 'dtremenak', not 'dtrmenak' (re: AUTHORS) |
| 15:37.17 | brlcad | it is, just a commit log typo |
| 15:37.33 | pacman87 | ok, just making sure the real thing was right |
| 15:37.42 | brlcad | it doesn't list their nicks |
| 15:37.45 | brlcad | lists real names |
| 15:38.25 | pacman87 | i thought so, but figured it'd be best to double check |
| 15:40.21 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30695 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: shumaker has been inactive for nearly two years, remove activity marker |
| 15:42.48 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30696 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: butler's away on sabattical/training/education so update POC to be davisson for ARL |
| 15:46.02 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30697 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: yapp moves up from special thanks for gentoo/doc work to significant code contributions for proc-db/tire, on his way to being new dev (woot) |
| 16:37.58 | yukonbob | yay starseeker_home! |
| 16:37.59 | yukonbob | :) |
| 16:38.04 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 16:45.15 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30698 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (librt/mirror.c mged/chgmodel.c tclscripts/mged/help.tcl): Added the mirror_pt parameter to rt_mirror. This is the point on the axis about which the mirror action will take place. |
| 17:16.24 | ``Erik | wiggles his toes |
| 17:17.39 | ``Erik | bowling alley grub, blurf |
| 17:27.49 | ``Erik | hum |
| 17:35.49 | prasad_ | ah the bowling alley |
| 17:35.57 | PrezKennedy | which bowling alley? |
| 17:36.05 | ``Erik | on post |
| 17:36.15 | ``Erik | by the px |
| 17:36.30 | PrezKennedy | Why on earth would you eat there?? |
| 17:36.39 | ``Erik | cuz kermit wanted to go somewhere fast |
| 17:36.41 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 17:37.00 | prasad_ | heh how's the ssvt crew |
| 17:37.18 | PrezKennedy | kermit is crazy! |
| 17:37.39 | prasad_ | i went to the bowling alley once |
| 17:37.44 | prasad_ | hmm never did go back |
| 17:38.04 | ``Erik | not sure, prasad, dont' get over there much.. there was a split, and their bc now lives in the same building, but supposedly not nearly as horrible as this building :) |
| 17:38.32 | prasad_ | orly |
| 17:38.51 | prasad_ | iirc it never was |
| 17:38.52 | prasad_ | ;) |
| 18:12.35 | mafm | bye |
| 18:27.45 | ``Erik | hehehehe http://www.linuxisforbitches.com |
| 18:50.22 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 18:50.36 | andrecastelo | good afternoon everyone |
| 18:50.40 | ``Erik | wb, andre |
| 18:50.47 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 18:50.56 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 18:50.59 | ``Erik | and hippi O.o |
| 18:51.03 | andrecastelo | how are you doing? |
| 18:51.08 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 18:51.09 | hippieindamakin8 | hey ppl |
| 18:52.42 | ``Erik | huh, 21 megatons at up to 10 km/s... ow O.o |
| 18:54.29 | hippieindamakin8 | wats that ``Erik |
| 18:54.46 | ``Erik | the apophis asteroid |
| 18:55.31 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 18:57.50 | andrecastelo | we're going to die ? :D |
| 18:57.59 | andrecastelo | lol, wrong emoticon |
| 18:58.01 | andrecastelo | :( |
| 18:58.09 | ``Erik | only if you stand under it, IF it hits? :D |
| 18:58.45 | prasad_ | that guy has an issue with web services |
| 18:59.20 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 19:05.15 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=ca3fe93d@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:25.00 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30699 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Update signature of rt_mirror (i.e. added mirror_pt). |
| 20:14.13 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548746D4.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:17.45 | prasad_ | http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v686/peeweejd/kidpwned.gif |
| 20:47.33 | ``Erik | ehehe |
| 20:56.22 | brlcad | hah |
| 21:01.08 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 21:55.17 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) |
| 23:08.55 | pacman87 | hippieindamakin8: test went well today? |
| 23:16.44 | brlcad | he survived, apparently ;) |
| 23:17.13 | hippieindamakin8 | ya man :) got the answer scripts too :) |
| 01:21.45 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30700 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: Sean fixed bug in clone where cloning combinations resulted in an infinite loop. |
| 01:28.27 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30701 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Add clone fix |
| 01:29.34 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30702 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add (very) preliminary support for tread on tires. |
| 02:02.34 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30703 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: fill in contribution details for when the individual first made a commit (per ohloh stats on head). also include the committer and common IRC nicknames for those known. |
| 02:17.09 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30704 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: add terry slatter to the special thanks section as he did commit at least one (minor) tweak to pix-rle to use LOGNAME in oct 89 |
| 02:25.25 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30705 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: susan coates, BRLer per the contribution year |
| 02:26.23 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30706 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: susan was february 89 even |
| 02:30.06 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30707 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: damnits, keep getting those two mixed up. sue coates was '91 sep BRLer, sue muuss was 89' feb BRLer. also, natalie eberius and natalie barker are one in the same. |
| 02:36.07 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30708 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: special thanks to steven buckley for his '88 aug contributions (maybe as a BRL student, but unknown) .. they were a bunch (42) manpage updates |
| 02:38.51 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30709 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: special thanks to john grosh for a tabinterp tweak back in oct 93 (incrased some buf size). |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30710 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: add david godbey to the code contributors list for his work on the 3dm-g |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: importer and brep testing. while we're at is, note that jra has also |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: contributed as an altus guy in addition to his usual open sourceage goodness as |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: things pertain to librtserver. |
| 03:01.46 | yukonbob | re: fmt for AUTHORS, does "Open Source" mean no company affiliation? |
| 03:08.08 | starseeker_home | belatedly sees authors update - thanks brlcad! |
| 03:47.58 | *** part/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 03:47.58 | yukonbob | waves to starseeker_home |
| 03:47.59 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 03:47.59 | starseeker_home | waves back |
| 03:48.00 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 03:48.02 | brlcad | yukonbob: in a manner of speaking, yes - a contribution performed while not on anyone's clock after we went open source |
| 03:48.02 | brlcad | if you see something missing or in error, lemme know |
| 03:48.03 | brlcad | helps distinguish the nature of the contribution, and give special recognition to those that contribute in some manner of their own volition |
| 03:48.03 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03bharder * r30711 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: Update own record |
| 03:48.03 | yukonbob | updated nicks, own contractor time |
| 03:48.55 | brlcad | you've also contributed on your own time, no? |
| 03:48.55 | yukonbob | heh -- /me maybe should have run by brlcad first... check my record and see if it's not to spec... can re-change :P |
| 03:49.11 | brlcad | it's looks fine to me |
| 03:49.18 | yukonbob | brlcad: well, "own time" == contacting time -- MDL==me |
| 03:49.39 | yukonbob | *contracting |
| 03:50.08 | yukonbob | and now nicks reflect IRC, sourceforge, email, etch. |
| 03:50.13 | yukonbob | *etc |
| 03:56.17 | brlcad | sounds good |
| 03:57.06 | brlcad | the content of each section, and even the inclusion are up to the individual for the most part (e.g. I'd remove or leave out an entry if someone wanted to remain anonymous) |
| 03:57.32 | brlcad | just care that they're consistently grouped and as comprehensive/accurate as reasonably possible with low maintenance burden |
| 03:59.37 | yukonbob | edits for descr of "demonstates superior analytical skills and excellent design decisions, depsite lack of commits" |
| 03:59.52 | yukonbob | s/descr of/descr for:/ |
| 04:00.38 | yukonbob | plus: "is snappy dresser, with good sense of humour" |
| 04:01.05 | yukonbob | plus: "is tired atm, and abusing IRC" |
| 04:01.39 | yukonbob | ~lart fatigue |
| 04:01.39 | ibot | beats fatigue over the head with a microkernel |
| 04:06.21 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:08.12 | yukonbob | q: how much would you want to take advantage of the Tcl VM w/i BRL-CAD -- I remember a few days ago there was some disc. aobut string handleing -- that _could_ be handled via Tcl functions, but then one is quite intimately tied to Tcl (moreso than currently?)... Comments? |
| 04:08.35 | yukonbob | *about, *handling |
| 04:15.52 | yukonbob | looks into grep bug |
| 04:21.04 | brlcad | in that particular instance, it was just developer getting familiar with available routines -- we have a set of routines for variable length string processing already that are fairly high-performance |
| 04:24.21 | yukonbob | ok -- they may be higher perf. than the Tcl routines, but lets say I committed some code that ties into Tcl pretty heavily, but gets the job perfectly fine... would that be considered acceptable from? |
| 04:24.25 | yukonbob | form |
| 04:24.26 | yukonbob | *form |
| 04:28.55 | brlcad | really depends on the context |
| 04:30.44 | brlcad | adding new library dependencies, for example, is generally discouraged (or at least should be heavily justified as it's a maintenance/integration burden) |
| 04:31.23 | brlcad | currently, some of the libs already use tcl (heavily) in their implementation |
| 04:32.21 | yukonbob | the reason I ask is that one could _really_ lean on these things, and it'd make a lot of sense on one hand, no reinventing the wheel basically, but otoh, things are getting more tied to Tcl, and if one wanted to start adding Python, some Scheme, or whatever, it might basically require an overhaul... |
| 04:33.13 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:33.23 | yukonbob | ya, Tcl is a special case becuase it's so intrinsic to BRL-CAD in it's present state... but my experience (limited as it is, obviously) is that Tcl is used where necessary, but not at every available opportunity... |
| 04:34.16 | brlcad | the decision was made a somewhat mid-long time ago to do the former but the mindset has slowly been changing to begin abstracting it away so it's eventually scripting layer agnostic |
| 04:36.45 | yukonbob | thinking about that a bit, it sounds _really_ tedious (ie: it'd be a "nice and quick" to start really taking advantage of Tcl, but instead, pretty much all of it's goodness (except for the syntax), is wasted if one is going to develop in such an agnostic way (same applies to Python, Perl, scheme, etc) |
| 04:36.52 | yukonbob | ) |
| 04:36.55 | brlcad | yeah, I wouldn't just replace functionality that libbu already provides, for example, with tcl's just for the sake of integration -- there'd have to be some core reason that justified it |
| 04:37.54 | yukonbob | right -- but for future work, would you consider using Tcl facilites, or be more inclined to write your own (putting them in libbu, for example)? |
| 04:38.19 | brlcad | really depends on the feature in question and the benefit leveraged |
| 04:38.26 | yukonbob | nods |
| 04:38.27 | brlcad | i don't think there's a clear-cut answer |
| 04:39.21 | brlcad | there's also short-term gains and long-term plans |
| 04:39.26 | yukonbob | is about as impressed w/ Tcl as am with BRL-CAD -- a match made in heaven from my perspective |
| 04:39.29 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:40.04 | yukonbob | re: gains/plans: ie: ideas written down for how to steer development? |
| 04:41.05 | brlcad | there is some written down, but not posted anywhere public yet -- some big-picture project vision directions |
| 04:41.31 | yukonbob | nods -- and so not yet ready for public consumption, or just happen to not be posted yet? |
| 04:41.40 | brlcad | just not posted yet |
| 04:41.46 | yukonbob | cool |
| 04:42.50 | brlcad | needs some polish, a little wordsmithing refinement |
| 04:43.35 | brlcad | course, the document I have in mind is fairly high-level -- this hits at low-level technical (which is more heavily driven by contributors and discussion) |
| 05:15.28 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30712 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS src/util/bwmod.c): dawn thomas noted that bwmod performing a divide-by-zero no longer occurs. turns out this bug was fixed about 3.5 years ago by butler in r23494 so poof it goes, thx dawn |
| 05:22.59 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30713 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bwmod.c: don't compare floating point with ==, use NEAR_ZERO tolerancing for portability |
| 06:50.26 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 06:56.24 | d_rossberg | pacman87: have you seen my comments to your revolve article in the wiki? |
| 06:56.41 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: not yet |
| 07:00.20 | d_rossberg | you could hit the "watch" button there |
| 07:00.34 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: i thought i did... |
| 07:01.05 | d_rossberg | that's strange :-| |
| 07:02.32 | pacman87 | i missed the 'email me on watched changes' checkbox |
| 07:02.51 | pacman87 | thanks for alerting me |
| 07:03.35 | pacman87 | does the ray-tracing algrorithm already use the bounding box for short circuiting? |
| 07:03.44 | d_rossberg | i hope i've seen this checkbox (i'm not sure about it) |
| 07:04.30 | d_rossberg | rt with bounding box: i don't know, that's also a question for me |
| 07:05.06 | pacman87 | it would make sense for that check to be done at the higher level |
| 07:05.37 | d_rossberg | indeed |
| 07:05.38 | pacman87 | if so, that step can be skipped |
| 07:06.10 | pacman87 | re: shot 2.2, what you said was what i mean by "(Or store the end surface seperately to avoid the ray transformation.)" |
| 07:06.34 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:06.52 | d_rossberg | no, i don't wont to store any surface seperately |
| 07:07.20 | d_rossberg | i mean: reduce the problem to 2D and use the 2D shape we have |
| 07:07.41 | pacman87 | right, that was a copy/paste from before that i missed |
| 07:07.45 | pacman87 | s/surface/plane |
| 07:08.24 | d_rossberg | the plane is edscribed by the rotation axis and angle |
| 07:08.42 | pacman87 | and the first plane |
| 07:09.12 | d_rossberg | by the "start vector" or direction |
| 07:09.52 | d_rossberg | this is part of the "Internal Representation" work package |
| 07:10.10 | pacman87 | plane is a location vector and a normal vector, and start and end planes can share the location vector, so you'd need 1 location and 2 normals |
| 07:10.48 | d_rossberg | this would be one possibility |
| 07:12.33 | pacman87 | i think that would reduce the amount of math necessary to find the intersection with the second plane, instead of stroring a transform to apply to the first plane (which is what i think you're saying, correct me if that's wrong) |
| 07:12.55 | pacman87 | what timezone are you in? |
| 07:13.26 | d_rossberg | GMT+1 |
| 07:13.47 | d_rossberg | i.e. UTC+2 (because of DST) |
| 07:15.30 | d_rossberg | and yes, i wonder that you are awake |
| 07:15.49 | pacman87 | 2:20am |
| 07:16.12 | pacman87 | working on a programming assignment |
| 07:18.02 | d_rossberg | so you should try to finish you work for this night and get some sleep |
| 07:19.09 | pacman87 | i sleep on the weekends (taking 16 hours of coursework, and workign ~14 hrs/week) |
| 07:21.20 | pacman87 | here's the log of my conversation with sean about this: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/20080411.html.gz |
| 07:27.09 | d_rossberg | i've seen this (with this site i don't have to be logged in permanently, i.e. if you see me on the irc i'm not so far away (however maybe to lunch)) |
| 08:42.16 | d_rossberg | brlcad: is there a concept to get rid of the different win32-msvc directories? |
| 08:50.57 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 08:51.43 | mafm | hello |
| 09:46.48 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.19.77) | |
| 09:47.29 | andrecastelo | good morning folks |
| 11:03.56 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 12:37.17 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.193.20) | |
| 12:47.43 | brlcad | d_rossberg: yeah, eventually .. heck, I wish they were autogenerated off the makefile.am's (or cmake) :) |
| 12:47.52 | brlcad | the 7's can probably go away now |
| 12:49.30 | brlcad | the 6's can go away as soon as you and wim are done with them :) |
| 12:49.43 | brlcad | presuming 8 has all the same functionality merged in |
| 12:51.37 | d_rossberg | yes, and now i've 9's |
| 12:52.24 | d_rossberg | however, i wrote some cmake files for the brlcad.dll |
| 12:52.46 | d_rossberg | and now i want to replace the .dsp by these files |
| 12:54.23 | d_rossberg | perhaps it could be a base for others too |
| 13:16.40 | brlcad | d_rossberg: iiinteresting (and glad to hear you're on 9 now :) |
| 13:19.14 | brlcad | mildly unrelated but fyi, I'm about to tag the 7.12.2 release (today) |
| 13:24.16 | d_rossberg | here you are |
| 13:26.14 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30714 10/brlcad/trunk/ (33 files in 12 dirs): |
| 13:26.14 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: update of the brlcad.dll build environment for current MSVC versions |
| 13:26.14 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: because of differences in the .vcproj files for the different MSVS versions CMake is used here |
| 13:26.14 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: this does not mean that they are portable to UNIX (at least not at the moment) |
| 13:26.14 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: perhaps it could be a base to build on |
| 13:40.55 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03dgodbey * r30715 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (librt/g_brep.cpp other/openNURBS/opennurbs_bezier.cpp): Changes support raytracing of simple Rhino converted geometries |
| 13:56.19 | ``Erik | uhhhh |
| 13:58.56 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-26-22.perm.iinet.net.au) | |
| 13:59.05 | thing0 | hey brlcad |
| 13:59.46 | ``Erik | hum |
| 14:01.07 | thing0 | hey ``Erik |
| 14:04.40 | ``Erik | 'sup, thing? |
| 14:07.09 | thing0 | work |
| 14:07.12 | thing0 | and more work |
| 14:07.34 | thing0 | was wondering if you remember brlcad's website, the one where he wrote about some UI concepts |
| 14:10.16 | ``Erik | uhm, I've seen lots of his websites |
| 14:10.47 | ``Erik | are you talking about http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html ? |
| 14:15.21 | thing0 | sorry ``Erik was on the phone |
| 14:16.04 | thing0 | ``Erik: it was a wiki based one |
| 14:16.13 | thing0 | not that one u just showed me |
| 14:16.25 | ``Erik | *shrug* irc responses aren't expected to be prompt :) sometimes I respond after a week or so |
| 14:17.32 | thing0 | lol |
| 14:18.18 | ``Erik | not http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Project_Ideas is it? |
| 14:25.14 | brlcad | can only imagine |
| 14:25.35 | ``Erik | brlcad, kill the trash page ont he wiki... W/w/index.php I think |
| 14:26.02 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:26.11 | brlcad | damnits |
| 14:26.18 | brlcad | it's still not notifying me |
| 14:29.23 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30716 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/openw.tcl: this isn't C, use elseif |
| 14:30.45 | ``Erik | committer "wm" is bill m? |
| 14:30.51 | brlcad | yes |
| 14:31.10 | brlcad | doesn't see W/w/index.php |
| 14:31.24 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/wiki/W/w/index.php |
| 14:31.45 | brlcad | aw, he needs help |
| 14:33.39 | brlcad | looks like that snuck in before recaptcha was enabled |
| 14:34.50 | brlcad | ah, tsk.. I did skip wm |
| 14:34.54 | brlcad | good catch |
| 14:35.22 | ``Erik | I'm adding it |
| 14:35.24 | ``Erik | and a couple others |
| 14:39.15 | ``Erik | svn log . | grep '^r[0-9]' | awk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c | sort -nr | less |
| 14:39.16 | ``Erik | pheer. |
| 14:39.45 | ``Erik | I don't suppose svn has the notion of user aliases? |
| 14:43.15 | brlcad | nope |
| 14:43.20 | brlcad | not that I know of at least |
| 14:43.29 | brlcad | ohloh does, I've added most of the aliases there |
| 14:43.42 | ``Erik | where is g-sat in the src? I'm not seeing it O.o (was it removed?) |
| 14:43.48 | ``Erik | oh, src/external |
| 14:43.52 | brlcad | yeah |
| 14:44.05 | brlcad | it relies on cubit libraries |
| 14:44.44 | brlcad | ~fishslap mike for not writing a dependency-free sat exporter |
| 14:44.44 | ibot | ACTION slaps mike up side the head with a wet fish for not writing a dependency-free sat exporter |
| 14:47.52 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30717 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: add missing nicknames |
| 14:47.53 | ``Erik | svn locks ftl :( |
| 14:48.18 | brlcad | only cause you aborted, svn cleanup ftw |
| 14:48.30 | ``Erik | I don't recall aborting anything, and svn cleanup failed |
| 14:48.37 | brlcad | o.O |
| 14:48.40 | brlcad | never seen cleanup fail |
| 14:48.42 | ``Erik | yeah. o.O indeed |
| 14:49.21 | ``Erik | bleh, scrolled off my buffer, gave an error somewhere in doc/html about locking issues |
| 14:49.32 | ``Erik | may've been triggered by working over nfs to a shoddy linux server |
| 14:50.07 | ``Erik | a horse is a horse, of course, of course |
| 14:50.11 | ``Erik | wanders off to talk to mr ed |
| 15:10.46 | prasad_ | whoa pun |
| 15:10.48 | prasad_ | ? |
| 15:11.29 | thing0 | hey brlcad |
| 15:11.33 | thing0 | didn't see u here |
| 15:11.38 | thing0 | having a chat with someone in MSN |
| 15:15.54 | thing0 | brlcad: do u recall the website I am referring to? |
| 15:16.21 | thing0 | It was an article that you had written about how the modern day UI within windows and other applications was quite pooe |
| 15:16.23 | thing0 | *poor |
| 15:16.49 | thing0 | in that users had dialog boxes etc that stole focus, whereas it should all integrate together better |
| 15:17.04 | thing0 | and also, why do we need to save, why doesn't it do it automatically |
| 15:17.09 | thing0 | unlimited undos |
| 15:17.14 | thing0 | what else.... |
| 15:17.15 | thing0 | hmm |
| 15:17.24 | thing0 | that's why I want to read the article again |
| 15:17.25 | thing0 | :) |
| 15:19.02 | thing0 | well, I'll leave my laptop on overnight |
| 15:19.13 | thing0 | *hopefully* someone will remember |
| 15:19.14 | thing0 | ;) |
| 15:19.15 | thing0 | ttyl |
| 15:19.18 | thing0 | night |
| 15:21.53 | d_rossberg | thing0: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ |
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| 17:37.01 | ``Erik | yay for site power outages, boo for them not lasting long enough for me to go play in the grass barefoot |
| 17:46.30 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-194-214.uchicago.edu) | |
| 17:47.50 | jdoliner | Did you see the patch brlcad? |
| 18:34.07 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30718 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Try a slight tweak with the tread. |
| 19:04.21 | mafm | bye |
| 19:20.11 | brlcad | has no idea what thing0 is referring to at the moment |
| 19:20.34 | brlcad | jdoliner: yes, I did -- haven't had time to review it yet though |
| 19:20.40 | brlcad | jdoliner: glad to see it though, was getting worried :) |
| 19:29.04 | jdoliner | good |
| 19:32.22 | jdoliner | should I post a link to it in my application, or is that redundant at this point |
| 19:41.17 | brlcad | please do |
| 19:41.30 | brlcad | just makes it easier on the mentors |
| 19:41.44 | ``Erik | yes, mentors are incredibly lazy :D |
| 19:51.10 | jdoliner | k i've updated the application |
| 19:51.25 | *** part/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-194-214.uchicago.edu) | |
| 19:53.52 | brlcad | find it annoying that he keeps leaving! :) |
| 20:05.06 | pacman87 | the only time i leave is to restart X, or restart my computer to switch OS's :) |
| 20:05.33 | ``Erik | a) run a console irc client in 'screen' so you can restart X without losing your irc session |
| 20:05.41 | ``Erik | b) quit switching os's, just use fbsd and be happy :D *duck* |
| 20:06.06 | ``Erik | runs his irc client (bitchx) inside of screen on a dedicated 'server' :) |
| 20:06.33 | pacman87 | yeah, i've been meaning to look into 'screen', but haven't had time yet |
| 20:06.40 | ``Erik | and I just put a UPS on it, soooo the next reboot should be when I move :) (which I'll combine an OS upgrade with) |
| 20:06.42 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:07.20 | pacman87 | and for (b), one programming class uses MSVC to compile, so i have to boot winXP to double check my code |
| 20:07.33 | ``Erik | wine? vmware? :) |
| 20:07.41 | ``Erik | hehehhe |
| 20:07.57 | pacman87 | i've got VMware with an XP install, but my comp is frustratingly slow |
| 20:08.31 | pacman87 | and i'm not sure how nicely MSVC would play with wine |
| 20:08.46 | ``Erik | dual booted with windows when he was in college, knows the routine... always appreciated classes that either provided shell accounts on the target machines or were platform agnostic |
| 20:11.43 | ``Erik | I think the most annoying class was probably the arch class, had to make a pipelined cpu in 'mmlogic', which is a very windows thingie :/ |
| 20:12.49 | ``Erik | whoa, they made mmlogic open source O.O |
| 20:22.18 | ``Erik | hehehe http://www.linuxisforbitches.com/aol.php |
| 21:28.55 | ``Erik | "There is a difference between eating a varied diet and chowing down on a cup of lard and sugar once a day. Programmers know this instinctively: they balance their daily menu among the four major food groups: caffeine, sugar, grease, and salt." |
| 21:33.43 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30719 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: If necessary, modify the matrix to apply mirror effects to the incoming primitive. |
| 21:42.12 | hippieindamakin8 | hey pacman87 ``Erik and brlcad |
| 21:42.23 | pacman87 | hi |
| 21:45.04 | hippieindamakin8 | cya guys later :P |
| 22:00.48 | brlcad | hello |
| 22:02.42 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.193.20) | |
| 22:03.37 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30720 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Combine everything into single toplevel object, add options for naming that object. |
| 22:19.33 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@89.181.5.73) | |
| 22:19.41 | mafm | hallo |
| 22:24.58 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 22:26.00 | mafm | raining cats and dogs, and I suspect that my laptop is suffering from that |
| 22:31.08 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.77.100) | |
| 22:31.30 | andrecastelo | good evening cadheads :b |
| 22:31.40 | brlcad | howdy andre |
| 22:32.43 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, how are you doing? |
| 22:33.38 | mafm | cadheads? shut up you, tropical coconut! :P |
| 22:34.22 | andrecastelo | :( |
| 22:34.32 | andrecastelo | i just wanted to sound cool like yukonbob :b |
| 22:37.51 | mafm | :) |
| 22:38.00 | mafm | that's fine, I'm just having a terrible day |
| 22:39.35 | andrecastelo | why's that?? not enought string theory?? |
| 22:39.46 | andrecastelo | s/enought/enough |
| 22:39.48 | andrecastelo | :b |
| 22:40.31 | mafm | actually too many little annoyances happening at once |
| 22:40.59 | mafm | yet physicist are part of the problem, yep |
| 22:42.27 | brlcad | andrecastelo: doing ok, a bit stressed/busy, but good |
| 22:47.23 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.81.93.240) | |
| 22:47.42 | andrecastelo_ | i hate this internet :{ |
| 22:48.51 | mafm | yep, intertubez are lame |
| 00:38.48 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-199-227.uchicago.edu) | |
| 00:40.07 | brlcad | hello jdoliner |
| 00:46.10 | jdoliner | hi |
| 00:46.49 | brlcad | shows jdoliner the wonderous awesomemeness of 'screen' |
| 00:48.03 | jdoliner | I'm afraid I don't see the wonderous awesomeness |
| 00:49.15 | brlcad | screen+irssi ftw |
| 00:49.44 | brlcad | then you can read the log and respond/interact *much* more effectively ;) |
| 00:50.34 | jdoliner | screen+irssi |
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| 01:26.42 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC applications are being reviewed throughout the week, final candidates will be required to provide a useful patch | |
| 01:42.34 | mafm | bye |
| 01:54.34 | *** part/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-199-227.uchicago.edu) | |
| 02:19.59 | starseeker_home | is being gradually introduced to screen+irssi |
| 02:20.12 | starseeker_home | it is awesome |
| 02:55.26 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 02:57.03 | brlcad | indeedy |
| 02:57.31 | starseeker_home | upgrades BRL-CAD on home box for rt -k goodness... |
| 02:57.38 | brlcad | heh |
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| 03:44.44 | CIA-10 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30721 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add input flag for tread - default is off, -t to activate it (currently only the default test tread is available. |
| 03:45.33 | *** join/#brlcad alex_jon1 (n=juve@81.196.65.201) | |
| 03:45.33 | brlcad | yay, distcheck succeeds |
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| 03:49.44 | brlcad | howdy dtidrow |
| 04:47.08 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30723 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am tire.1): Add start of man page for tire, integrate it into autoconf. |
| 04:47.47 | starseeker_home | decides his eyes are bugged out enough for one night... |
| 05:03.57 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30724 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: don't need an array for single values, just pass in an address to that value then dereference the variable in the function |
| 05:27.47 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30725 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.1: tire started in 2008 |
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| 06:43.10 | brlcad | g'morning d_rossberg (and goodnight!) :) |
| 06:43.17 | d_rossberg | moin moin |
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| 10:03.23 | mafm | hi |
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| 10:49.22 | thing0 | hi mafm |
| 10:50.46 | mafm | 'lo there |
| 10:55.50 | thing0 | sup |
| 11:05.15 | mafm | trying to find a new laptop... I hate mine and CRC errors are no good |
| 11:11.39 | mafm | going to lunch now.. |
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| 12:36.32 | hippieindamakin8 | hey goodmorning guys |
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| 14:36.55 | andrecastelo | bom dia everyone |
| 14:39.55 | mafm | tá foda cara andrecastelo |
| 14:51.38 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo mafm |
| 14:51.47 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 14:55.20 | ``Erik | uhhhh, yo queero taco hell? |
| 14:55.22 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:55.30 | ``Erik | howdy, ya'll |
| 14:55.36 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik :D |
| 14:55.43 | mafm | ``Erik: trying to speak mexican? :) |
| 14:56.05 | ``Erik | I'm trying to mock myself with a parody attempt at it, yes |
| 14:57.52 | mafm | :P |
| 14:58.02 | mafm | we're speaking portuguese anyway |
| 14:58.09 | mafm | much better language |
| 14:58.48 | ``Erik | hehehe, amusing, the one program I did the i18n shit on, the ONE submitted translation file was brazilian portuguese |
| 14:59.52 | mafm | the amusing part is that it was the only one translation, or do you mean that the portuguese translation was brazilian variant? :) |
| 15:00.57 | ``Erik | both |
| 15:01.02 | ``Erik | the intersection of those |
| 15:01.31 | ``Erik | :) |
| 15:01.54 | ``Erik | (but, please, don't let me interrupt your convo, I'm just being goofy) |
| 15:02.12 | mafm | well, Brazil has about 200 million people, Portugal 11 million |
| 15:02.40 | ``Erik | yeah, but how many people speak, say, french? spanish? russian? chinese? indian? |
| 15:03.23 | mafm | and some african countries and scattered places around the world (as where I'm from), but those are few and not very computer-literate anyway :) |
| 15:03.31 | ``Erik | guess the portuguese speaking world is just cooler than the rest |
| 15:04.01 | mafm | spanish about 400 million people (and written is more unified than portuguese), french about the same as portuguese, mandarin chinese probably over 500 million people... :) |
| 15:05.10 | mafm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_number_of_native_speakers#Top_20 |
| 15:06.05 | ``Erik | <-- english and japanese, trying to learn a little german |
| 15:06.17 | mafm | the french is not very accurate AFAIK, the de-facto "international" language for may people in Africa and some other places is still french instead of english |
| 15:06.24 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.9.148) | |
| 15:06.33 | ``Erik | southern asia has a lot of french speaking people, as well |
| 15:07.23 | mafm | I'm native of portuguese and spanish, and then english as third language, and understanding of a few other latin-related ones like italian :) |
| 15:12.59 | ``Erik | heh, spanish and italian are both romance languages, I'm not sure of portuguese falls into that |
| 15:13.20 | ``Erik | german is teutonic, english is a horrible bastardization of 3 major families (therefore incredibly difficult to "master") |
| 15:13.40 | hippieindamakin8 | one billion people speak indian :P |
| 15:14.15 | clock_ | I found english very easy to master |
| 15:14.34 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 15:14.48 | hippieindamakin8 | and by indian .. it is hindi :) and the most used language in india is english :) |
| 15:14.57 | mafm | portuguese is a bit more close to italian than spanish |
| 15:15.20 | mafm | waves |
| 15:15.32 | hippieindamakin8 | hey yukonbob |
| 15:16.22 | hippieindamakin8 | but in all english comes to the rescue doesnt it mafm ``Erik ? |
| 15:16.34 | prasad_ | who's indian |
| 15:16.43 | hippieindamakin8 | i am :) |
| 15:16.52 | prasad_ | heh cool |
| 15:17.06 | mafm | hippieindamakin8: you mean between italian/spanish/portuguese speakers, or in general? |
| 15:17.10 | hippieindamakin8 | when parents are multilingual .. english comes to the rescue :) |
| 15:17.53 | mafm | portuguese speakers tend to understand standard spanish almost completely, and mostly italian, but the other way around much less :) |
| 15:18.01 | hippieindamakin8 | ya i had spanish and italian flatmates in sweden and it was very difficult for them to have a conversation amongst themselves |
| 15:18.13 | mafm | but lately when young people meets or so, english tends to be the common language |
| 15:18.40 | mafm | in the case of parents with different languages, usually one of them accomodates |
| 15:18.46 | hippieindamakin8 | neways .. every language has it own flavour :) |
| 15:19.28 | hippieindamakin8 | my parents from 2 different languages by birth :) i finally started using english |
| 15:19.31 | mafm | sweeden is a completely different language, I don't know its roots |
| 15:19.41 | hippieindamakin8 | it is close to german |
| 15:20.18 | hippieindamakin8 | in india there are 600 languages :) |
| 15:20.45 | mafm | well, india is very big |
| 15:21.14 | mafm | probably in whole europe there are also about as much |
| 15:21.17 | hippieindamakin8 | ya :) may be i ll try later to port the brl-cad package to hindi :) |
| 15:21.22 | hippieindamakin8 | ya :) |
| 15:22.00 | mafm | not counting immigrants of course, otherwise there are about 6k :) |
| 15:22.03 | clock_ | we have a lot of languages in Links menu but no hindi yes |
| 15:22.32 | hippieindamakin8 | but actually porting to hindi is of not much use.. |
| 15:22.57 | clock_ | we have like portuguese and brazilian portuguese |
| 15:23.03 | clock_ | bahasa indonesia and upper sorbian |
| 15:23.08 | clock_ | we should get hindi and tibetan |
| 15:23.09 | hippieindamakin8 | anybody who uses a package or computers are good at english |
| 15:23.32 | prasad_ | i8n is a pain |
| 15:23.44 | prasad_ | we finally have a good IME solution in our product |
| 15:24.07 | Axman6 | i18n? |
| 15:24.14 | clock_ | we dont have israeli probably because our system cant write right to left |
| 15:24.18 | prasad_ | yup |
| 15:24.34 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 15:24.42 | clock_ | we also cannot write from center to the edges, inside up, in a spiral or in an elephant shape |
| 15:25.12 | clock_ | but we have a special support for braille terminal |
| 15:29.13 | mafm | uh, that's cool |
| 15:29.35 | mafm | do you know if the are there any people using it? |
| 15:29.56 | clock_ | like Links or like the particular translation? |
| 15:30.33 | mafm | the translation |
| 15:30.44 | mafm | with links you mean the text mode browser? |
| 15:30.44 | clock_ | I don't know |
| 15:30.53 | clock_ | text and graphics mode browser |
| 15:31.00 | mafm | graphics? |
| 15:31.03 | clock_ | yes |
| 15:31.13 | clock_ | with -g it runs in graphics mode, without in text |
| 15:31.34 | clock_ | displays porn bettern then any other browser |
| 15:31.47 | clock_ | because of sophisticated careful image handling |
| 15:32.57 | hippieindamakin8 | prasad_, are u a POI ? |
| 15:33.03 | hippieindamakin8 | *PIO |
| 15:33.13 | prasad_ | a wha? |
| 15:33.24 | prasad_ | oh indian origin? |
| 15:33.28 | hippieindamakin8 | person of india origin |
| 15:33.31 | prasad_ | sri lankan |
| 15:33.45 | hippieindamakin8 | oh :) |
| 15:34.42 | mafm | clock_: I think that you should advertise those special features as links4pr0n |
| 15:35.12 | mafm | you would surpass Firefox market share |
| 15:35.14 | mafm | :) |
| 15:35.28 | clock_ | no we don't have CSS and Flash |
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| 15:37.14 | mafm | hmm, I can't find screenies of links in graphics modes |
| 15:37.34 | mafm | do you use X, GTK, Qt or something like that? |
| 15:37.49 | clock_ | we don't use GTK and Qt |
| 15:37.51 | clock_ | but we use X |
| 15:38.16 | clock_ | Here is the list of graphical platforms we run on http://links.twibright.com/features.php |
| 15:38.29 | clock_ | "Links runs in graphics mode (mouse required) on X Window System (UN*X, Cygwin), SVGAlib, Linux Framebuffer, OS/2 PMShell, AtheOS GUI" |
| 15:38.40 | clock_ | Not sure what an AtheOS GUI is |
| 15:38.56 | clock_ | But since I wrote a program that allegedly runs on it, I think it must at least exist. |
| 15:39.23 | clock_ | Also never seen the OS/2 PMShell |
| 15:39.36 | mafm | wow, very nice indeed |
| 15:40.27 | clock_ | It also runs on SPAD but since SPAD is not yet released yet it probably doesn't make sense to mention it |
| 15:40.37 | clock_ | on SPAD it runs at least on svgalib |
| 15:42.54 | clock_ | I should probably suggest BRL-CAD to be ported on SPAD |
| 15:43.14 | clock_ | How many places have to be changed because SPAD has filenames in the style logical_disk:dir1/dir2/filename |
| 15:43.18 | clock_ | with case-insensitive filenames |
| 15:43.29 | clock_ | it has X Window System |
| 15:43.37 | clock_ | standard gcc and so |
| 15:44.31 | mafm | I didn't know that |
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| 17:52.35 | mafm | bye |
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| 18:06.57 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30726 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: Modify f_clone() to return the name of the clone if one has been created. |
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| 18:37.46 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30727 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Tweak the zig-zag tread generator. |
| 19:14.41 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30728 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/xclone.tcl: Initial check-in. |
| 19:15.15 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30729 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/tclIndex: Add entry for xclone. |
| 19:17.52 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30730 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/Makefile.am: Add entry for xclone.tcl. |
| 19:49.44 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30731 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: Modified copy_v5_solid to use state->rpnt if specified. |
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| 20:22.33 | brlcad | for the students waiting -- just wanted to let you know that every application is very much valued and appreciated, especially the hard work that goes into them -- I wish we could accept more (and maybe next year we'll have a larger developer capacity for doing that) |
| 20:22.56 | brlcad | so if you're a student that applied, thank you *very* much for all your hard work -- best of luck to everyone and even if you're not accepted, I sincerely do hope many of you will stay/become involved with BRL-CAD development |
| 20:23.12 | brlcad | involvement throughout the year can do wonders for next year's participation too if google runs the program again, if we apply as an org, if we're accepted, etc ;) |
| 20:23.30 | brlcad | announcements should be on monday |
| 20:23.38 | thing0 | cool |
| 20:23.41 | thing0 | morning brlcad |
| 20:24.16 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections will be announced on Monday the 21st | |
| 20:24.24 | brlcad | howdy thing0 |
| 20:24.57 | thing0 | it is awesome brlcad got into GSoC |
| 20:24.59 | thing0 | :) |
| 20:25.22 | thing0 | hopefully this will speed up dev |
| 20:26.09 | brlcad | hopefully indeed :) |
| 20:26.21 | brlcad | looking forward to seeing how things grow |
| 20:26.33 | brlcad | hopefully the start of a productive tradition :) |
| 20:26.54 | thing0 | yes it would be good |
| 20:26.55 | brlcad | there are some really impressive candidates, lots of great ideas |
| 20:26.56 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:27.01 | thing0 | awesome |
| 20:27.14 | thing0 | good thing too |
| 20:27.24 | thing0 | I'm getting really sick of commercial CAD |
| 20:28.04 | brlcad | open source collaboration ftw |
| 20:28.24 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:28.28 | thing0 | exactly |
| 20:29.00 | thing0 | just the fact that all it seems they are doing, is adding just enough features to make users pay maintenance the next year |
| 20:29.23 | thing0 | I'm going to start blogging about my CAD frustrations shortly |
| 20:29.24 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:29.45 | thing0 | just been trying to make a script to clean up the output from onenote |
| 20:29.52 | thing0 | cause I keep all my notes in there now |
| 20:29.53 | thing0 | ;) |
| 20:30.03 | brlcad | of course, most commercial CAD are entrenched and "done" .. their products won't radically change or improve, they can't |
| 20:30.04 | thing0 | vendor lock-in I know |
| 20:30.06 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:30.14 | thing0 | brlcad: yeah I agree |
| 20:30.29 | thing0 | but solidworks for example |
| 20:30.38 | thing0 | just seems to be trying to fit everyones boat |
| 20:30.52 | thing0 | which it shouldn't |
| 20:31.02 | thing0 | but |
| 20:31.09 | thing0 | it is all in the name of sales |
| 20:32.36 | thing0 | I am starting to become more interested in Explicit Modeling |
| 20:33.15 | thing0 | I think that it should be Explicit Modeling with the ability to control the parts created parametrically |
| 20:33.30 | thing0 | so quickly model up the concept you want |
| 20:33.39 | thing0 | then drive the size with the dimensions |
| 20:33.43 | thing0 | but within 3d |
| 20:33.51 | thing0 | not dependent on a 2d sketch |
| 20:34.04 | ``Erik | I still can't beieve hallmark makes a "glad you're no longer a giant croc turd" card. |
| 20:34.21 | thing0 | lol |
| 20:34.26 | thing0 | but yeah |
| 20:34.38 | thing0 | just so happy I am not in design/drafting for a living anymore |
| 20:34.56 | thing0 | the tools just don't meet my requirements |
| 20:35.06 | thing0 | to optimistic |
| 20:35.07 | thing0 | :) |
| 20:35.22 | brlcad | so you going to help develop said tools that provide said requirements? :) |
| 20:36.02 | thing0 | brlcad: hehe |
| 20:36.06 | brlcad_Erik | is the, uh, thing, uh, over? am I too late? |
| 20:36.20 | thing0 | I always wanted to |
| 20:36.30 | thing0 | I cannot believe how little time I have now |
| 20:36.32 | thing0 | :( |
| 20:36.44 | thing0 | working for two companies at the moment |
| 20:36.48 | thing0 | which keep me flat out |
| 20:36.50 | brlcad_Erik | I wish I had enough time to say I have little time :( |
| 20:36.59 | thing0 | trying to get my life in order |
| 20:37.08 | thing0 | so that I can do more stuff |
| 20:37.16 | thing0 | but yeah |
| 20:37.46 | thing0 | atm, working on a software project for the second company on a casual basis which usually eats up most of my weekend |
| 20:37.59 | thing0 | need 9 days in a week |
| 20:38.00 | thing0 | ;) |
| 20:39.11 | brlcad | brlcad_Erik: it's over now, buh thx :) |
| 20:39.24 | ``Erik | ah well |
| 20:39.30 | brlcad | we only had one conflict to resolve, it was quick |
| 20:39.37 | ``Erik | okie |
| 20:39.52 | ``Erik | I remember one was handled earlier oob |
| 20:40.08 | thing0 | "Without the CoCreate software," says Kolb, "we'd end up solving many of our problems with a welding torch. That's expensive and time-consuming." |
| 20:40.20 | thing0 | we do that all the time at work |
| 20:40.27 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:40.32 | thing0 | but yeah |
| 20:40.37 | thing0 | client pays for there mistakes |
| 20:40.38 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:40.55 | brlcad | but so much more fun |
| 20:41.21 | brlcad | i suppose welding isn't fun when you do it every day though :) |
| 20:41.37 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:41.47 | thing0 | I just give the command |
| 20:41.51 | thing0 | and watch it happen |
| 20:42.08 | thing0 | construction is fun |
| 20:42.12 | thing0 | very challenging though |
| 20:42.19 | thing0 | as the industry is turning to shit |
| 20:42.28 | thing0 | clients are getting worse and worse |
| 20:42.35 | thing0 | more dis-organised |
| 20:42.45 | thing0 | no idea when it comes to procurment |
| 20:42.47 | brlcad | nah, you're just getting older and wiser, more aware of the mess :) |
| 20:43.24 | thing0 | lol |
| 20:43.27 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:43.37 | thing0 | I love the challenge thoughj |
| 20:43.41 | thing0 | plus |
| 20:43.48 | thing0 | I seem to get away with alot of things |
| 20:43.51 | thing0 | which is good |
| 20:43.52 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:44.04 | thing0 | not in a bad way |
| 20:44.05 | thing0 | more in the sense |
| 20:44.09 | thing0 | data aquistions |
| 20:44.18 | thing0 | I have setup a bit of a systems |
| 20:44.33 | thing0 | by which I can obtain almost any information I seek from the client |
| 20:44.39 | thing0 | without the client even knowing |
| 20:44.41 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:44.56 | thing0 | all information only of course.... :) |
| 20:45.03 | thing0 | not stealing it |
| 20:45.17 | brlcad | theif! |
| 20:45.19 | thing0 | people from within the client are giving away the information |
| 20:45.39 | brlcad | right off the back of their truck, honest officer, they gave it to me |
| 20:46.01 | thing0 | or there engineering department just give it too me, instead of waiting for document control |
| 20:46.02 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:46.23 | thing0 | document control = 1 month delay |
| 20:46.41 | brlcad | * control = # months delay |
| 20:49.27 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:49.30 | thing0 | exactly |
| 20:49.46 | thing0 | we have it under control though |
| 20:49.58 | thing0 | just the industry is changing |
| 20:50.40 | thing0 | but yeah |
| 20:50.52 | thing0 | time to sort my todolist for the weekend |
| 20:50.53 | thing0 | hehe |
| 20:59.51 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad and ``Erik |
| 21:03.49 | hippieindamakin8 | so the meeting for today is over huh ? :) |
| 21:12.04 | brlcad | quite |
| 21:15.35 | hippieindamakin8 | so how was it ? |
| 21:20.49 | brlcad | no problems |
| 21:24.20 | ``Erik | hey, burley, monday 0830 ccb |
| 21:25.47 | ``Erik | waits for an ack packet |
| 21:26.01 | brlcad | ack |
| 21:26.23 | ``Erik | ok, I'll let ed know you'll be there and prepared O.o 0830-1000 I assume in 250 |
| 21:26.45 | brlcad | i'll actually be in in a lil bit |
| 21:28.11 | ``Erik | ok, but we might not be here :D |
| 21:28.34 | ``Erik | and it's 200, not 250. Ed wants me to make sure you'll have the list of changes for that... |
| 21:28.35 | ``Erik | :) |
| 21:28.47 | ``Erik | doncha love the beaurocracy of it all? |
| 21:28.49 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad can we implement mouse based transformations of the geometry ? or does it support that ? |
| 21:29.22 | ``Erik | sed, click edit, click the thing you want to change (rotate, translate, etc) and use the mouse... |
| 21:29.25 | hippieindamakin8 | as in i want to select a point on the geometry and drag to another place |
| 21:29.29 | ``Erik | then accept when you're done? |
| 21:29.50 | hippieindamakin8 | and the body should deform to form a bulge |
| 21:30.08 | hippieindamakin8 | smthing of the shape pf a speed breaker |
| 21:30.09 | ``Erik | that'd require something like nurbs, which is being worked on, but not ready yet... :) |
| 21:30.23 | hippieindamakin8 | splines will do that functionality |
| 21:30.34 | hippieindamakin8 | ya :) NURBS |
| 21:30.45 | brlcad | ``Erik: no problemo |
| 21:31.03 | brlcad | hippieindamakin8: if by we you mean are contributions welcome for that .. sure :) |
| 21:31.42 | hippieindamakin8 | i actually meant me :P |
| 21:31.53 | ``Erik | well, contributions are welcome :D |
| 21:32.14 | hippieindamakin8 | i shall do that once i get to know the tcl/tk better |
| 21:32.34 | brlcad | you don't need to know tcl/tk to make that better |
| 21:33.04 | hippieindamakin8 | got this idea when i was trying to solve this question on NURBS in my endsem paper.. which is take home |
| 21:33.15 | hippieindamakin8 | i can implement the math rt now though |
| 21:33.53 | ``Erik | I think my weekend just started. Hasta la pasta :) |
| 21:34.12 | hippieindamakin8 | oh are u spanish ``Erik :) |
| 21:35.47 | hippieindamakin8 | 's friends are playing bzflag stating the reason as "experimenting with ogl" on the eve of the end semester :P |
| 21:36.11 | brlcad | makes complete sense to me |
| 21:36.26 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 21:37.57 | PrezKennedy | WEEKEND!!! |
| 21:38.00 | PrezKennedy | runs! |
| 21:38.52 | hippieindamakin8 | weekend is ruined by the stupic endsems |
| 21:39.53 | PrezKennedy | not mine! |
| 21:40.14 | hippieindamakin8 | :) mine though |
| 21:40.22 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30732 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/xclone.tcl: xclone started in 2008 |
| 22:04.14 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30733 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Still have a bug in tread somewhere - not fixed yet - uploading for further study. |
| 22:04.31 | thing0 | brb |
| 22:04.39 | thing0 | switching internet service :P |
| 22:06.36 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@203-59-26-22.perm.iinet.net.au) | |
| 22:06.51 | thing1 | and were back |
| 22:06.52 | thing1 | hehe |
| 22:10.33 | brlcad | they're spawning! |
| 22:14.35 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.9.148) | |
| 22:14.51 | andrecastelo | good evening folks |
| 22:16.39 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo |
| 22:16.52 | andrecastelo | sup hippieindamakin8 :D |
| 22:17.07 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo, how are you |
| 22:17.46 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm fine thanks, good to be finally home.. i was at the university until now |
| 22:19.10 | andrecastelo | brb :D |
| 22:29.17 | andrecastelo | ok, back :D |
| 22:30.09 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, did you see the center point patch ? |
| 22:30.29 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad, lh wants to get some suggestions about the opensource drawing software :) |
| 23:05.43 | *** join/#brlcad jimmybbl (n=jdsadf@host86-133-54-29.range86-133.btcentralplus.com) | |
| 23:59.28 | starseeker_home | growls in frustration - it's gotta be something obvious... |
| 00:02.39 | yukonbob | waves in |
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| 01:08.17 | *** join/#brlcad DevJock (n=DevJock@ppp-67-66-49-243.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) | |
| 01:09.03 | DevJock | Hello, this is my first time using IRC, please forgive me if I do something stupid. |
| 01:53.17 | starseeker_home | DevJock: welcome |
| 02:07.30 | *** join/#brlcad DevJock (n=DevJock@ppp-67-66-49-243.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) | |
| 02:27.26 | DevJock | Has anyone considered making the source code available in a .7z instead of a .zip format? The file size is way smaller. |
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| 02:42.37 | brlcad | hello DevJock |
| 02:43.02 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30734 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Rotation looks OK now, but primitives in tread pattern look off - may have sizing wrong. |
| 02:43.07 | brlcad | DevJock: no, I don't think anyone has ever cared much about the format :) |
| 02:43.20 | starseeker_home | plays whack-a-bug |
| 02:43.25 | brlcad | zip is really to appease ignorant windows users that are only familiar with zip |
| 02:44.30 | starseeker_home | is also glad in retrospect he tried a simple tread pattern before trying a complex (real) pattern |
| 02:48.28 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 02:48.33 | brlcad | hey pacman87 |
| 02:48.35 | pacman87 | hi |
| 03:00.02 | starseeker_home | brlcad: I'm getting some wireframe behavior I don't quite understand: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/primitive-oddity.png |
| 03:00.42 | starseeker_home | brlcad: It's quite possible I have the dimensions wrong, but in that case shouldn't both the wireframe and the raytrace be off? |
| 03:01.45 | DevJock | Hi brlcad, I'm using Bersirc IRC and it's nice to talk to you guys |
| 03:05.27 | brlcad | starseeker_home: i'm not sure what I"m looking at in the screenshot |
| 03:05.50 | brlcad | are those arbs? |
| 03:06.19 | brlcad | the black would normally be invalid -- looks like something twisted inside out |
| 03:06.51 | brlcad | otherwise that's a pretty harsh change in normal.. |
| 03:07.28 | brlcad | DevJock: welcome, hope you hang .. irc is more a lifestyle than an activity ;) |
| 03:10.17 | starseeker_home | yes - arbs |
| 03:10.39 | brlcad | my first guess would be that they're twisted or inverted |
| 03:10.42 | starseeker_home | It should be a fairly garden variety arb8 |
| 03:10.43 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 03:10.43 | starseeker_home | OK |
| 03:11.10 | starseeker_home | will re-examine how the arbs are drawn - thanks |
| 03:16.22 | brlcad | they'll still draw the wireframe if a face is twisted, but the normals and hits will be screwy |
| 03:18.14 | yukonbob | evening, geeks :) |
| 03:18.57 | pacman87 | we're not cadheads anymore? |
| 03:20.07 | yukonbob | evening cadheads |
| 03:20.23 | yukonbob | how's it going pacman87 :) |
| 03:21.16 | yukonbob | reviewed links after he found out our own clock was involved w/ the development, but it's page navigation is still t3h sux0rs compared to w3m |
| 03:26.54 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@123.208.35.52) | |
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| 03:38.43 | DevJock | I was told that some of the developers use an IDE to work on the source code. Could you guys specify one. I was trying to set up a Code::Blocks project to compile the code, but you weren't kidding about a million lines of code, and I have no idea how to get the Java files to compile. I'm a spoiled windows user with 6 years of C++ development experience in a Visual Studio environment. Any help, advice would be appreciated. |
| 03:43.19 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30735 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/ (. Makefile.am): ignore and clean up after ylwrap |
| 03:45.17 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 03:45.37 | brlcad | DevJock: ah, you are the guy from the forum then |
| 03:46.00 | brlcad | the java files are technically optional, you can conceivably ignore them |
| 03:49.01 | DevJock | <brlcad>: yup, that's me from the forum, okay then, I'll ignore the java files for now and just see about getting all the c files into Code::Blocks. Thanks. |
| 03:51.07 | brlcad | sounds good, look forward to hearing how it goes |
| 03:52.11 | brlcad | DevJock: there are also MSVC build files if you still prefer windows ;) |
| 03:52.29 | brlcad | the windows build of brl-cad could also use lots of love |
| 03:56.53 | DevJock | <brlcad>: Well Code::Blocks is supposed to be a cross platform IDE, so I guess if I could get that to work it really would be useful not just to windows users. |
| 03:58.56 | yukonbob | looks-up Code::Blocks |
| 04:00.07 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30736 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/jove/jove.h: string.h needs to take priority, remove the HAVE_STRINGS_H check |
| 04:14.30 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30737 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/jove/jove.h: no longer need common.h with HAVE_STRINGS_H removed |
| 04:16.28 | CIA-12 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30738 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/jove/jove.h: oops, revert .. we do still need it elsewhere |
| 04:17.58 | DevJock | Well I was sure was optimistic, I added all the c and h files to my BRL-CAD code project. Attempting to build the code produced alot of errors, the first being "\brlcad-7.12.0\src\adrt\bench\bench.c|28|pthread.h: No such file or directory|". I assume from this wiki article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/POSIX_Threads that I will need the pthreads-w32 for windows in order to get rid of this error? |
| 04:19.03 | brlcad | src/adrt hasn't been ported to work on windows |
| 04:21.10 | DevJock | <brlcad>: I assume that I can make like the Java files and for now remove this directory from my project? |
| 04:21.23 | brlcad | should be able to |
| 04:21.51 | brlcad | src/librtserver src/adrt src/external and probably src/other can/should be ignored/removed |
| 04:23.03 | brlcad | that's a lot of slashes |
| 04:23.33 | DevJock | brlcad: Thank you, I will be logging out now and spending a little quality time with this. |
| 08:10.08 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-110-78.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 14:49.05 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30739 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/Makefile.am: include wdb_deps for the debianeers. for whatever reason, it's still dropping the deps on the cxx target |
| 15:08.52 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30740 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tab/Makefile.am: eep, make sure script.c isn't a BUILT_SOURCES files if we don't have a lexer |
| 15:09.58 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 15:33.58 | brlcad | morning cadtails |
| 15:44.39 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 16:04.44 | yukonbob | heh |
| 16:05.01 | yukonbob | "cdr"'s? |
| 16:12.40 | hippieindamakin8 | hey yukonbob |
| 16:12.57 | hippieindamakin8 | good afternoon |
| 16:16.56 | yukonbob | morning hippieindamakin8 |
| 16:22.25 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-84-224.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:27.21 | hippieindamakin8 | are u from canada ? |
| 16:27.32 | hippieindamakin8 | Alberta ? |
| 16:28.32 | yukonbob | yes, Canada, but not Alberta |
| 16:28.40 | yukonbob | ?Why would you guess Albera |
| 16:28.46 | yukonbob | *Alberta |
| 16:29.13 | hippieindamakin8 | :P DNS look up says alberta :P |
| 16:29.39 | yukonbob | paste your lookup to a pastebin |
| 16:29.43 | hippieindamakin8 | just wanted ur timezone to wish u :) |
| 16:30.44 | hippieindamakin8 | http://dpaste.com/45813/ |
| 16:31.59 | hippieindamakin8 | shall get back to studies :P |
| 16:32.48 | yukonbob | I think you looked up the info for the ISP, not me |
| 16:34.10 | hippieindamakin8 | ya :) |
| 16:34.32 | yukonbob | my ass in in Yukon Territory, but the computer I'm networked to (and running my IRC client from) is in British Columbia |
| 16:35.14 | hippieindamakin8 | :)) |
| 16:36.32 | yukonbob | utc -7 |
| 16:38.18 | hippieindamakin8 | utc +5:30 or +4:30 durin light saving |
| 16:38.30 | hippieindamakin8 | yeah yukonbob are u good at splines ? |
| 16:38.38 | hippieindamakin8 | i meant the math |
| 16:40.26 | yukonbob | hippieindamakin8: honestly, I don't know -- I'm not a gfx/cad person when it comes to under-the-hood implementation |
| 16:40.45 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.199.186) | |
| 16:42.51 | hippieindamakin8 | ohh :) was looking for some texts and reference material for the proofs of the spines and Peano's theorem |
| 16:44.21 | yukonbob | post a question and see what happends, brlcad, ``Erik, and other smart people are monitoring this channel -- maybe repost when you see pacman come back... |
| 16:44.47 | yukonbob | s/see what happens,/see what happens;/ |
| 16:45.09 | hippieindamakin8 | Prove Peano's theorem |
| 16:45.11 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 16:45.32 | hippieindamakin8 | till then i ll give it a try by myself |
| 17:13.32 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.9.148) | |
| 17:17.34 | andrecastelo | good afternoon everyone :D |
| 17:23.33 | brlcad | howdy andre |
| 17:23.52 | brlcad | probably quite a long weekend for a lot of folks.. |
| 17:29.22 | andrecastelo | indeed, i'm quite anxious, can't wait for monday. |
| 17:34.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: did you look at the code?? :D |
| 17:35.31 | andrecastelo | (for the patch) |
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| 18:20.00 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections will be announced on Monday the 21st | |
| 19:01.19 | brlcad | has a fix for debian working |
| 19:56.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30741 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/patch.m4: (log message trimmed) |
| 19:56.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: This should finally (re)fix the Debian and Ubuntu builds. The problem boils down to the Debian devs insisting on modifying default upstream libtool linkage behavior. They |
| 19:56.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: do this for performance/relinkage reasons so that rebuilding and installing a base library (like libpng) doesn't necessarily require relinking all callers. They force |
| 19:56.28 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: *off* the addition of dependency libraries on the linker line by setting link_all_deplibs=no which in turn mucks havok with compilation. Their intent seems to assume that |
| 19:56.31 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: all libs are installed before a binary needs to link against them so that recursive linux dynamic link lookups will find everything needed via rpaths alone. So all of the |
| 19:56.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: dependencies listed on our (not-yet-installed) libtool archive libraries are stripped off when binaries are linked. |
| 19:56.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: This fix reverts the libtool script back to the default "unknown" value for link_all_deplibs. So libtool does properly keep track of the recursive dependency descriptions |
| 19:56.43 | brlcad | stupid nano |
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| 20:49.05 | yukonbob | brlcad: "stupid" debian -- is this libtool shenanigan documented? It seems to have taken a while to figure it out... |
| 21:03.13 | brlcad | yukonbob: actually it didn't take long at all - I just don't use debian, rarely have access to one |
| 21:03.19 | brlcad | happened to have access to one today |
| 21:03.45 | brlcad | but yes, there are at least three debian bug reports that relate to it |
| 21:05.11 | brlcad | alas, there are few big packages that build both libs and bins that utilize LIBADD dependencies |
| 21:13.21 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30742 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Bob added xclone command to mged for xpushed deep copies. scripted implementation, performs xpush then clone. |
| 21:29.01 | yukonbob | brlcad: bugs like that remind me of the jwz quote: "Browser compatibility problems are nature's way of saying 'stop trying to be so fuckin clever'" |
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| 02:29.12 | DevJock | Upon attempting to compile I received the following error ...\brlcad-7.12.0\src\anim\anim_cascade.c|43|common.h: No such file or directory| .... I could not find this file in the source! |
| 02:35.18 | DevJock | Should I also ignore this directory in attempting to build on windows? |
| 02:38.32 | brlcad | DevJock: common.h is in the include directory |
| 02:38.47 | brlcad | you're probably missing an include path |
| 02:39.03 | brlcad | there are a variety of include paths that change as the builds progress, include/ being one of them |
| 02:39.58 | brlcad | depending on compilation options, it can also include various subdirectories in src/other |
| 02:40.53 | DevJock | brlcad: oh, okay. I was only looking in the src folder, whooops |
| 02:47.00 | DevJock | brlcad: All right, now I'm getting somewhere. Only 23 errors to go. |
| 02:49.16 | DevJock | brlcad: yeah I'm getting the can't find tcl.h error, I guessing this is what you meant by having the src\other folder as part of the directories available to the compiler? |
| 03:01.19 | DevJock | brlcad: Weird, I added the src/other directory above the include directory as part of the search directories of my compiler's build options but I still keep getting ......\include\bu.h|54|tcl.h: No such file or directory|.... |
| 03:15.33 | brlcad | DevJock: it depends whether it uses system-provided libs or self-compiled |
| 03:15.54 | brlcad | src/other is our external dependencies -- they are compiled if they're not already installed on the system |
| 03:16.48 | brlcad | so you have to include the right directories, src/other is NOT the right directory |
| 03:16.58 | brlcad | that's why I said varius SUBdirectories |
| 03:25.52 | DevJock | brlcad: Well, I got better results now, I think I need to remove my project file out of the src directory, and move it perhaps one level up, also I am setting up a 6 build option in Code::Blocks, 3 debug builds for Win, Mac, and Unix, and the other 3 as release builds. Of course I'm just modifying the params to the Win builds, but this experience has already taught me more about using Code::Blocks. I'll be logging out now. Thanks f |
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| 04:47.07 | yukonbob | takes another look at latest 7.12.x |
| 05:33.59 | yukonbob | configure:10029: cc -O2 -I/usr/pkg/include -I/usr/include -I/usr/pkg/include/tcl/generic -I/usr/pkg/include -I/usr/include -I/u |
| 05:34.02 | yukonbob | sr/local/include -L/usr/pkg/lib/tcl/itcl3.3 -L/usr/pkg/lib/tcl/itk3.3 -L/usr/pkg/lib -Wl,-R/usr/pkg/lib -L/usr/lib -Wl,-R/usr/l |
| 05:34.05 | yukonbob | ib -L/usr/local/lib conftest.c -ltcl84 -lBLT24 >&5 |
| 05:34.08 | yukonbob | /usr/pkgsrc/bch/brlcad-svn/work/.buildlink/lib/libBLT24.so: undefined reference to `Tk_GetPixmap' |
| 05:34.11 | yukonbob | /usr/pkgsrc/bch/brlcad-svn/work/.buildlink/lib/libBLT24.so: undefined reference to `XFreePixmap' |
| 05:34.14 | yukonbob | ^--- etc, etc. |
| 05:34.17 | yukonbob | (I know paste bin :P) |
| 05:34.30 | yukonbob | requires -ltk84 |
| 05:35.22 | yukonbob | hrmm -- 1sec. |
| 05:41.27 | yukonbob | apoligizes for rooky noise above, continues ;) |
| 05:41.59 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:42.10 | brlcad | looks like -ltk84 and -lX11 |
| 05:42.18 | brlcad | that some configure test? |
| 05:42.28 | yukonbob | sometimes I just want my hand held :) |
| 05:42.58 | yukonbob | laughs -- maybe I should hire my own computer nerd for when I don't feel like :P |
| 05:43.55 | yukonbob | yup, configure test -- "-ltk84" alone worked in my case... |
| 05:44.13 | yukonbob | is running, will see how "things" go soon -- |
| 05:44.22 | brlcad | yeah, tk provides a few X funcs |
| 05:44.50 | yukonbob | q: re: svn, is there a "-current" in the repo, or how do you handle tags/branching, etc. |
| 05:45.04 | brlcad | trunk |
| 05:45.38 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/ |
| 05:45.48 | yukonbob | ...and is trunk quite diff't from 7.12.1 atm? |
| 05:45.57 | yukonbob | loads uri |
| 05:46.01 | brlcad | trunk is 7.12.1 atm |
| 05:46.09 | yukonbob | ice. |
| 05:46.12 | yukonbob | *nice |
| 05:46.49 | yukonbob | will get this up/running, then follow from now on so I can adjust my build-env day-to-day and keep everything happy at both our ends... |
| 05:51.11 | yukonbob | watches his compile continue, is happy |
| 05:57.53 | yukonbob | wants to comment on how well things are going, how I think some work in the BRL-CAD auto* has helped, how a little of my own work has helped, etc., etc., but I don't want to jynx the job... do meta-comments jynx? |
| 06:01.53 | yukonbob | gah :P |
| 06:03.36 | yukonbob | http://www.pastebin.ca/990550 |
| 06:03.47 | yukonbob | looks for cause |
| 06:11.55 | yukonbob | looks for c99 fmax definition |
| 06:16.31 | yukonbob | looks up NetBSD specifics |
| 06:34.20 | yukonbob | feh -- /me runs into libtool (wrt libbu) issues... close, but no cigar (yet) |
| 06:43.20 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bharder * r30743 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.h: Add test, macro for c99 fmax(), missing in NetBSD. |
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| 07:18.18 | yukonbob | hey clock_ |
| 07:18.33 | yukonbob | ...and Axman6 :) |
| 07:22.02 | clock_ | hey yukonbob |
| 07:22.39 | yukonbob | took another look at links after finding out you were a dev... /me <== usually w3m |
| 07:25.29 | yukonbob | links -g == beautify display :) |
| 07:25.38 | yukonbob | *beautiful |
| 07:32.34 | clock_ | yukonbob: thanks |
| 07:33.00 | clock_ | but yes indeed it has like proper gamma correction, 48 bit colour depth, LCD otpimization, bilinear filtering in the proper photometric space... |
| 07:33.54 | yukonbob | will give links more of a chance, but _really_ misses the 'jkhl' and other keybindings of w3m -- it's easier to get around the page w/ w3m... |
| 07:34.23 | yukonbob | no need to 'tab' through all the links to get to the one I want, for example. |
| 07:40.08 | clock_ | yukonbob: you can like scroll and click with the mouse |
| 07:40.15 | clock_ | or use page up page down for fast tabbing |
| 07:43.51 | yukonbob | mouse != what I want in text-based browser (not always running in -g mode) -- pgup/dn might work.. thx |
| 07:44.58 | Axman6 | yo yukonbob |
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| 15:59.05 | yukonbob | wow...slow day for cadheads |
| 15:59.45 | yukonbob | waves in |
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| 17:21.39 | andrecastelo | good afternoon everyone |
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| 17:35.24 | yukonbob | hey andrecastelo |
| 17:35.36 | andrecastelo | sup yukonbob, how are you doing? |
| 17:36.43 | yukonbob | not so bad -- working on getting the latest BRL-CAD distro up/running on my 'puter |
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| 21:04.07 | yukonbob | brlcad: why does the libtclcad build explictly use the src/other/tcl/*, src/other/tk/*, and src/other/blt/*? |
| 21:05.24 | brlcad | you mean the include dirs? |
| 21:05.29 | brlcad | it shouldn't |
| 21:05.31 | yukonbob | yup, and the DEPS |
| 21:05.36 | yukonbob | (for BLT) |
| 21:07.25 | yukonbob | tries a patch to Makefile.am; testing. |
| 21:07.32 | brlcad | deps are just rebuild rules, not part of automake proper |
| 21:08.02 | brlcad | i.e. don't worry too much about deps, but includes can/should probably only come from configure alone |
| 21:08.51 | yukonbob | starts another build -- is hopefully getting closer to 7.12.x on his puter :) |
| 21:14.37 | yukonbob | also isn't too impressed w/ the "open"NURBS folks as their password-protected .zip file |
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| 21:19.08 | Tieku | hi |
| 21:19.48 | Tieku | is 7.12.0 avilable for windows? |
| 21:20.17 | brlcad | Tieku: soon, there is a beta build on ftp |
| 21:20.32 | Tieku | brlcad: cheers! |
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| 02:21.24 | brlcad | wow, a branch merge that took over an hour |
| 02:44.08 | homovulgaris | :P must have been some merge |
| 02:47.22 | brlcad | yeah.. 50 fracking conflicts |
| 02:47.37 | brlcad | ah 91 |
| 02:47.41 | brlcad | damnits |
| 03:24.16 | brlcad | yukonbob: netbsd without a fmax? that's .. odd |
| 03:55.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30744 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/news2tracker.sh: need to be more exact on matching the revision number line. ran into a revision ID match in the body of one of the commit messages that referred to an sf tracker id. |
| 04:20.05 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30745 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/news2tracker.sh: properly quote the quotes |
| 04:38.06 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30746 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/tracker.sh: sourceforge continues to change the format slightly. match the category link specifically to avoid catching the earlier new javascript |
| 05:36.33 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: fmax -- indeed -- I think Open may be in same boat... |
| 05:49.35 | brlcad | tis really odd, because fmax is c99 |
| 05:49.40 | brlcad | gcc should be providing it |
| 05:49.45 | brlcad | rather, libc |
| 06:01.08 | yukonbob | -lm |
| 06:02.35 | brlcad | er, yeah, that too |
| 06:03.36 | brlcad | that makes me think it's maybe just missing a lib/header/something .. specially since it's c99 |
| 06:04.15 | yukonbob | math(3), on my NetBSD system, fmax(3) (specifically)on my FreeBSD (6.x) system, and also math(3) for the general, which includes fmax/fmin |
| 06:05.34 | yukonbob | on Net, there's no ref to fmin/fmax in the math(3) page -- I'd be interested to know if Open is same (with same results) |
| 06:10.53 | yukonbob | reposts msg to NetBSD geeks querying this issue |
| 06:15.19 | brlcad | hey, if it works, it works :) |
| 06:15.44 | yukonbob | it works now -- *and* I've got my first code commit :) |
| 06:17.41 | brlcad | yup, woot woot :) |
| 06:17.56 | yukonbob | is now experiencing issues w/ htester having undefined references to bu_exit, and htond, ntohd -- but not sure if it's my own fscking that's causing that -- is strange, though :P -- but that's for tomorrow (unless I get some clues or bright ideas and solve soon) |
| 06:18.05 | yukonbob | w00t, indeed :) |
| 06:18.34 | brlcad | sounds like libbu is missing |
| 06:19.29 | brlcad | compile problem or link problem? compile would be header path, link would be linker flags |
| 06:20.58 | yukonbob | compile |
| 06:21.03 | yukonbob | will attack tmo :) |
| 06:21.36 | yukonbob | I felt close to a working 7.12.x last night... I've since revised to optimism to "Real Soon Now". |
| 06:21.39 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 06:21.42 | yukonbob | chat later |
| 06:22.21 | brlcad | cya! |
| 06:25.15 | yukonbob | btw -- response I get from one person for missing fmin/fmax on NetBSD is "c99 sucks" |
| 06:25.20 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 06:27.13 | brlcad | heh |
| 06:43.44 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30747 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/tracker.sh: indent mishap, don't insert a tab before the csv line |
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| 08:11.59 | brlcad | moin moin daniel |
| 08:15.16 | d_rossberg | moin moin |
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| 09:37.41 | mafm | hi |
| 11:50.11 | brlcad | howdy mafm! |
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| 13:09.16 | andrecastelo | hi guys |
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| 16:09.49 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 16:14.03 | andrecastelo | morning yukonbob |
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| 16:51.41 | hippieindamakin8 | hey guys |
| 17:15.07 | homovulgaris | hey hippie ;) |
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| 17:42.31 | mafm | bye |
| 17:46.24 | prasad_ | wassup |
| 18:33.51 | brlcad | tick tick tick tock |
| 18:36.54 | alex_joni | missing a couple tick's |
| 18:37.59 | brlcad | 22 minutes and counting |
| 18:46.05 | alex_joni | reminds me of an old joke.. "what goes 9999 times tick and once tock?" |
| 18:47.38 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 18:47.58 | ``Erik | *compilecompilecompile* |
| 18:50.46 | brlcad | alex_joni: a bomb |
| 18:51.12 | alex_joni | nope.. a myriapoda with a wooden leg |
| 19:10.49 | prasad_ | haha |
| 19:12.38 | prasad_ | brlcad: looked into git? |
| 19:13.11 | brlcad | prasad_: don't get me started |
| 19:16.15 | ``Erik | pats his cvs and rcs |
| 19:19.22 | prasad_ | o? |
| 19:19.42 | prasad_ | enlighten me |
| 19:20.25 | alex_joni | git<tab><tab> |
| 19:20.36 | alex_joni | Display all 131 possibilities? (y or n) |
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| 19:30.58 | alex_joni | that always struck me as an issue :) |
| 19:46.12 | brlcad | hehe |
| 19:47.25 | brlcad | prasad_: I really don't like talking about git, maybe another day -- just realize that there are several tradeoffs to consider, some critically important depending on the context |
| 19:47.26 | hippieindamakin8 | congrats pacman87 |
| 19:47.54 | hippieindamakin8 | congrats mafm and andre castelo |
| 19:48.30 | prasad_ | github's web 2.0 veneer is nifty |
| 19:48.31 | prasad_ | :P |
| 19:48.43 | prasad_ | so where are the results posted btw |
| 19:49.22 | pacman87 | http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html |
| 19:49.30 | pacman87 | ty, hippieindamakin8 |
| 19:50.00 | prasad_ | jra mentoring eh |
| 19:50.01 | prasad_ | :D |
| 19:50.48 | brlcad | so yes, the announcements are final -- congratulations |
| 19:51.22 | brlcad | as I've been saying, seriously .. thank you to everyone who submitted and has been involved throughout the application process |
| 19:51.34 | brlcad | it really was a pretty tough choice to narrow down to just 4 slots |
| 19:52.01 | brlcad | but we did have to draw the line eventually and weigh in many factors |
| 19:54.02 | brlcad | hope you guys stick around and stay involved with the project, if you didn't make it this year I certainly hope you stay involved and consider applying next year .. one of our students that was rejected last year did just that and ended up being one of our top-selections this year |
| 19:54.33 | brlcad | if anyone would like public or private feedback, I'd be glad to provide it |
| 19:56.35 | yukonbob | contratulations GSoC-ers :) |
| 19:56.48 | ``Erik | huzzah |
| 19:57.29 | prasad_ | i should apply next year |
| 20:00.45 | brlcad | but then you'd have to do work |
| 20:01.08 | prasad_ | shit that's true |
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| 20:19.44 | poolio | oooo gsocers :D |
| 20:19.47 | poolio | congrats guys |
| 20:20.43 | poolio | Wait, is there a John R. Anderson at ARL? |
| 20:20.43 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 20:20.53 | brlcad | poolio: yup |
| 20:20.57 | brlcad | john rocks |
| 20:21.01 | poolio | Is he ... there now? |
| 20:21.16 | poolio | My cogsci advisor is named john r. anderson, I'm guessing unrelated |
| 20:21.31 | brlcad | he's on his way back from vacation down in daytona, but usually is around |
| 20:25.48 | prasad_ | jra is my hero |
| 20:27.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30748 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/ (libwdb.3 wdb.c): Add mk_arb6 command to libwdb. |
| 20:37.42 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30749 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/ (libwdb.3 wdb.c): Add mk_arb5 and mk_arb7 |
| 20:42.33 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30750 10/brlcad/trunk/include/wdb.h: Add header entries for new mk_arb commands |
| 20:44.36 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.60.227) | |
| 20:44.47 | andrecastelo | heyeveryone ;DDD |
| 20:45.16 | brlcad | hello andrecastelo :) |
| 20:45.19 | brlcad | congratulations |
| 20:45.47 | andrecastelo | thanks brlcad, i'm really excited lol |
| 20:46.09 | brlcad | great! |
| 20:46.18 | brlcad | looking forward to a great summer :) |
| 20:46.27 | andrecastelo | i was studying at the university labs when the selections were announced |
| 20:46.53 | andrecastelo | and couldn't join irc and talk to you guys rightaway.. |
| 20:47.09 | brlcad | you mean you were already too busy coding for brl-cad to join the channel ;) |
| 20:47.53 | andrecastelo | yeah that's what i meant hehehe ;D |
| 20:49.03 | andrecastelo | i g2g now, be back here in an hour :D |
| 20:49.16 | yukonbob | "It seems that you've been living two lives. One life, you're john r. anderson, program writer for a respectable open source project. You have a social security number, pay your taxes, and you . . . help your landlady carry out her garbage. The other life is lived in computers, where you go by the hacker alias 'Neo' and are guilty of virtually every computer crime we have a law for. One of these lives has a future, and one of them does no |
| 20:50.22 | andrecastelo | cya guys be back in a while :D :D |
| 20:56.15 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548749CA.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:03.40 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo congrats :) |
| 21:04.16 | hippieindamakin8 | so brlcad so this project is still free aint it ? |
| 21:04.27 | brlcad | always is and will be |
| 21:04.27 | alex_joni | how do you mean still? |
| 21:04.40 | brlcad | open source ftw |
| 21:04.43 | hippieindamakin8 | :) |
| 21:04.47 | yukonbob | w00t |
| 21:05.08 | brlcad | needs to stop saying ftw so much |
| 21:05.12 | brlcad | less ftw, ftw! |
| 21:05.23 | alex_joni | haha ftw |
| 21:05.36 | hippieindamakin8 | cya guys.. time to get back to sleep :) shall keep interacting with u guys |
| 21:05.57 | yukonbob | heh... /me thinks 'ftw' used to be a punk "fsck the world", and I also know it as a bicycle builder "Frank the Welder" |
| 21:07.00 | yukonbob | http://www.frankthewelder.com/ |
| 21:21.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30751 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Eliminate invalid arb8 face creation in tread. |
| 21:22.12 | ``Erik | brlcad ftl :( |
| 21:22.15 | ``Erik | :D |
| 21:22.32 | ``Erik | /t i can has gsoc? |
| 21:25.41 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30752 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: added more wdb arb functions |
| 21:26.36 | ``Erik | dave was asking about the big honkin' functab early :/ hope he doesn't try to muck with it too much |
| 21:29.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30753 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/view.c: Mods to set the byte offsets of view_parse at run time. Windows can't handle initializing this struct with variables that live in a library. |
| 21:35.23 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 22:01.53 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30754 10/brlcad/trunk/db/ (Makefile.am pinewood.asc): Add simple pinewood car example. |
| 22:24.41 | *** join/#brlcad Asmundr (n=jamie@h241.242.40.162.ip.alltel.net) | |
| 22:31.20 | *** part/#brlcad Asmundr (n=jamie@h241.242.40.162.ip.alltel.net) | |
| 22:33.48 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.44.83) | |
| 22:34.42 | andrecastelo | hi everyone :D |
| 22:34.53 | ``Erik | greetings |
| 22:35.20 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik :D |
| 22:37.04 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: so, how many students did you guys take ? |
| 22:37.15 | ``Erik | 4 |
| 22:38.02 | brlcad | if you're all successful, maybe some of you can be mentors next year and we can accept more slots |
| 22:38.13 | ``Erik | http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html |
| 22:38.14 | brlcad | and of course you better all be successful ... |
| 22:38.16 | brlcad | shakes fist |
| 22:38.22 | brlcad | :) |
| 22:38.43 | ``Erik | yeah, brlcad benches like 3 fiats, don't make him punch holes through you O.o |
| 22:40.02 | andrecastelo | is afraid |
| 22:40.15 | andrecastelo | actually i'm quite happy, not afraid at all lol |
| 22:40.57 | andrecastelo | seriously now, i'll do my best to complete the project |
| 22:41.09 | andrecastelo | and i have good expectations for this winter/summer :D |
| 22:41.52 | ``Erik | have you taken a good look around in src/rt ? |
| 22:43.48 | andrecastelo | not a really detailed one.. i've seen how you shoot rays and how you deal with hits and such |
| 22:44.30 | andrecastelo | also i had to look into it when i was writing the patch, have seen viewarea.c and those files that make up rtarea |
| 22:45.10 | andrecastelo | next step is definitely getting familiar with src/rt code |
| 22:47.22 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: anything in particular you want me to study ? |
| 22:48.47 | ``Erik | probably how the lighting models work |
| 22:49.40 | andrecastelo | hm ok |
| 22:49.58 | ``Erik | photon mapping has a piece in rt as well as liboptical, and I think brlcad would like to see mlt all in src/rt/ |
| 22:50.35 | andrecastelo | alright |
| 22:50.50 | andrecastelo | do you want me to set up a blog or something like it ? |
| 22:58.47 | brlcad | andrecastelo: you should be looking in src/rt as well as src/adrt/rise |
| 22:59.55 | brlcad | src/adrt/rise has a forward polygonal path-tracer (i.e. doesn't use librt, doesn't work with arbitrary/native brl-cad geometry) that might give some good insights |
| 23:00.34 | brlcad | andrecastelo: I'll send out a note about reporting requirements, but you're welcome to set up a blog regardless ;) |
| 23:02.22 | andrecastelo | brlcad: alright.. do you have any formal requirements regarding reports ? |
| 23:02.47 | andrecastelo | and i'll take a look at src/adrt/rise, thanks for the tip |
| 23:12.51 | ``Erik | hrm, adrt is radically different than librt and rise hasn't worked for a while... d'no if that'd be so great to look at too much |
| 23:13.35 | brlcad | more for just algorithmic example of forward path tracing |
| 23:13.53 | brlcad | not as a functional example |
| 23:19.44 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo congrats |
| 23:20.04 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: thanks man :D what about you ? |
| 23:20.17 | hippieindamakin8 | mhmm no :) |
| 23:20.41 | andrecastelo | hippieindamakin8: sorry to hear that :( did you apply to any other org ? |
| 23:21.19 | hippieindamakin8 | no just this.. no problems i ll get more familiar with the distro and apply again :) |
| 00:40.53 | poolio | heh, I found something on digg I found interesting: http://flickr.com/photos/kielbryant/857238875/sizes/l/ |
| 01:10.50 | hippieindamakin8 | cool man :) |
| 01:28.52 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 01:31.40 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 01:49.08 | ``Erik | hey, a bzflag release |
| 02:40.17 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (i=Axman@210-11-147-36.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 02:41.14 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (i=1000@s142-179-54-198.bc.hsia.telus.net) | |
| 03:19.57 | starseeker_home | must resist the time munching pull of new bzflag release... |
| 03:59.18 | brlcad | bzflag 2.0.10 was released back in november |
| 03:59.28 | brlcad | someone just finally got around to updating freshmeat |
| 05:05.36 | *** part/#brlcad jdoline1 (n=jdoliner@wireless-199-157.uchicago.edu) | |
| 05:52.01 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 06:22.21 | brlcad | starseek1r: should set the pinecar title to something useful :) |
| 06:54.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30755 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: cliff added a new pinewood boxcar example geometry database, modeled during dwayne kregel's surviac/survice brl-cad training course. |
| 07:19.36 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 08:02.40 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 09:30.30 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:31.49 | mafm | hallo |
| 09:40.07 | brlcad | howdy mafm! |
| 09:40.10 | d_rossberg | hallo mafm |
| 09:40.10 | brlcad | congratulations |
| 09:41.27 | mafm | thank you :) |
| 09:42.13 | mafm | I'm happy from andrecastelo too, it was me who told him to try another orgs like this one |
| 09:45.44 | mafm | there's a small mistake in the announcement of your website though |
| 09:46.07 | mafm | "Now in its fourth year running, the Google Summer of Code has brought together over 1500 students and 2000 mentors from 90 countries worldwide to open source software development" |
| 09:46.55 | brlcad | hm? |
| 09:47.00 | mafm | "official" blog says: "Today we're pleased to let you know that we're funding 1125 student developers, almost 25% more students than last year" |
| 09:47.47 | brlcad | "has brought" .. those are the stats through last year |
| 09:48.34 | brlcad | so after this year, it'd read something like "over 2600 students" |
| 09:48.48 | mafm | oh, you mean applicants? |
| 09:49.10 | brlcad | not really, mean students |
| 09:49.54 | mafm | brr, need a coffe really, now I understood |
| 09:52.24 | brlcad | students participating each year is something like 250, 500, 750, and 1125 for 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008 respectively |
| 09:54.24 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.194.59) | |
| 09:55.16 | mafm | last year was more than 800 says the blog, but yep, more or less |
| 09:55.49 | mafm | this year the t-shirt is much better, no wonder the increase in applicants :P :) |
| 09:59.33 | brlcad | yeah, those were "minimums" |
| 10:00.37 | brlcad | so the next step for all students is to add your project descriptions to a non-user page on the wiki |
| 10:01.07 | brlcad | something not in the first-person, but that talks about it as a design/plan |
| 10:01.44 | brlcad | shouldn't include your personal details that were in the apps (though you're more than welcome to put those on a user page) |
| 10:05.57 | mafm | oki |
| 10:06.33 | mafm | on other news netcrafts confirms it -- my laptop is dying :[ |
| 10:37.32 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30756 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (5911 files in 495 dirs): massive merge of HEAD to STABLE, syncing changes through revision 28909 to 30747 in preparation for 7.12.2 release. |
| 10:56.27 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-093-027.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 10:57.46 | mafm | what does the BRL in BRL-CAD mean? B* Research Laboratory? |
| 11:01.58 | brlcad | Ballistic |
| 11:02.01 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30757 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): update version to 7.12.2 and begin release, tagging from trunk since the merge isn't as well-tested |
| 11:03.24 | ``Erik | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballistic_Research_Laboratory |
| 11:12.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30758 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (archer/archer.bat mged/mged.bat util/rtwizard.bat): Update the BRL-CAD version from 7.12.1 to 7.12.2 |
| 11:16.15 | mafm | oh I see |
| 11:16.41 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30759 10/brlcad/trunk/ChangeLog: update changelog to set of changes since 7.12.0 |
| 11:17.51 | mafm | back in a bit |
| 11:20.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30760 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-2/: tag release 7.12.2 |
| 11:59.14 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875FED.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 12:27.26 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.199.191) | |
| 12:32.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30761 10/brlcad/trunk/db/pinewood.asc: Add more useful database title for pinewood car. |
| 12:40.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30762 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: Revert back to using newline on Windows. |
| 12:56.15 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@210-11-147-36.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 13:04.12 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30763 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: damnits. FreeBSD needs sys/types.h before the shm headers |
| 14:04.28 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 14:06.01 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 14:17.57 | brlcad | damn |
| 14:17.58 | brlcad | r29777 | brlcad | 2007-12-17 18:06:59 -0500 (Mon, 17 Dec 2007) | 2 lines |
| 14:18.07 | brlcad | use c99 fmax instead of max macro, might need configure support |
| 14:18.37 | brlcad | grrs |
| 14:18.50 | *** join/#brlcad kwizart (n=kwizart@fedora/kwizart) | |
| 14:20.25 | kwizart | hello all ! |
| 14:21.11 | kwizart | i'm 'still' trying to package brlcad for Fedora... get it to compile by mged fails |
| 14:21.13 | brlcad | hello kwizart |
| 14:21.28 | brlcad | was just talking about fedora earlier today kwizart |
| 14:21.37 | brlcad | what's the error? |
| 14:21.50 | kwizart | *** buffer overflow detected ***: mged terminated |
| 14:22.26 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993251 |
| 14:22.35 | kwizart | here is a more complete log... |
| 14:23.04 | kwizart | the /lib64/libc.so.6(__fortify_fail+0x32)[0x308d4ea362] make me wonder something related with CFLAGS used... |
| 14:23.13 | mafm | kwizart: were you the one trying to package aqsis a while ago, too? |
| 14:24.03 | kwizart | yep (with succed as aqsis is now in Fedora for a about year now) |
| 14:24.06 | kwizart | Pixie also |
| 14:24.10 | mafm | :) |
| 14:24.17 | mafm | your name sounded familiar |
| 14:25.37 | kwizart | :) |
| 14:26.02 | mafm | brlcad: what's the problem with that commit r29777? |
| 14:26.04 | kwizart | this patch would fix pkg_config support: http://pastebin.ca/993256 |
| 14:26.18 | brlcad | kwizart: is that the latest sources? |
| 14:26.38 | brlcad | there was a bug in bu_brlcad_data that was fixed some time ago, should be in 7.12.0+ |
| 14:26.39 | kwizart | actually it is not accurate as x11 xi etc are optionnals |
| 14:26.49 | kwizart | i have 7.12.0 |
| 14:27.01 | kwizart | "vanilla" (with some patches) |
| 14:27.23 | brlcad | mafm: nothing really, just that is what broke old bsd builds .. they don't have a couple c99 math funcs |
| 14:27.45 | mafm | ops :) |
| 14:28.11 | brlcad | kwizart: that's really odd .. lemme see if I can find anything related with a visual scan |
| 14:29.52 | brlcad | kwizart: how long is your pwd? |
| 14:30.05 | kwizart | oups you are about to relase 7.12.2 ... |
| 14:30.06 | kwizart | pwd |
| 14:30.11 | kwizart | how can i check ? |
| 14:30.21 | brlcad | pwd | wc |
| 14:30.33 | brlcad | first number |
| 14:31.01 | brlcad | I think I see the problem |
| 14:31.04 | kwizart | 1 1 47 |
| 14:31.27 | brlcad | er, thx.. it was the 3rd number anyways :) |
| 14:33.27 | ``Erik | wc -c, pheer |
| 14:39.44 | brlcad | kwizart: what does your line 602 look like in src/libbu/brlcad_path.c |
| 14:39.52 | brlcad | find this line: snprintf(path, (size_t)MAXPATHLEN, "share/brlcad/%s", brlcad_version()); |
| 14:40.17 | brlcad | change it to snprintf(path, 64, "share/brlcad/%s", brlcad_version()); |
| 14:41.58 | kwizart | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:42.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30764 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Change name creation of primitives and combinations to make it easier to avoid name collision when importing different tire models to 1 database |
| 14:42.59 | kwizart | actually i'm using /usr/share/brlcad (unversionned) |
| 14:43.43 | kwizart | BRLCAD_ROOT is /usr (yes i now i'm a bad boy that don't listen what configure tells) |
| 14:44.28 | kwizart | but librt seems a big problem actually i think it could be solved using this patche : |
| 14:44.31 | kwizart | -e |
| 14:45.14 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993276 |
| 14:50.45 | ``Erik | except we have third party consumers that explicitely link to librt.so and will not change :/ |
| 14:52.10 | brlcad | not that we'd really want to either |
| 14:52.13 | brlcad | we predate the linux lib by nearly a decade |
| 14:52.19 | brlcad | and it's a deprecated/obsolete library |
| 14:52.38 | brlcad | most distros have stopped shipping it |
| 14:52.42 | kwizart | yep but still available on most system... |
| 14:53.04 | brlcad | s/most/some/ :) |
| 14:53.16 | ``Erik | where 'some' is a subset of linux only, not most os's |
| 14:53.18 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:53.24 | brlcad | kwizart: I'm confused by your snprintf reply -- does that mean you don't have the line I pasted? |
| 14:53.30 | kwizart | anyway if your third part consumers use pkg-config (rt.pc) that will be quiet |
| 14:53.41 | ``Erik | they don't, they use, uh, xmkmf/imake |
| 14:54.08 | ``Erik | with hard linking all through all their Imakefile's |
| 14:54.33 | brlcad | there are lots of closed source codes that link to our libs and rarely ever change (and their groups get pissed off / confused if anything changes) |
| 14:55.00 | ``Erik | we're pushing to get everyone using better approaches, but we get our paychecks to make BRL-CAD work with their software |
| 14:55.23 | brlcad | they're still not the primary reason imho |
| 14:55.35 | brlcad | it's wrong, it's part of brl-cad's identity |
| 14:55.50 | brlcad | that's are core library |
| 14:56.00 | brlcad | s/are/our/ |
| 14:58.51 | kwizart | o my bad, i've pasted the line 62 instead of 602 |
| 15:00.55 | brlcad | even better, do you see the declaration for path around 561? |
| 15:00.58 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:01.11 | mafm | do the core devels still work for BRL/ARL ? |
| 15:01.14 | brlcad | change that 64 to MAXPATHLEN |
| 15:01.17 | brlcad | mafm: some do |
| 15:02.18 | brlcad | BRL -- no, BRL "went away" nearly 15 years ago, absorbed into ARL |
| 15:02.19 | mafm | so who're the other "paycheckers"? engineering companies and the like? |
| 15:02.42 | clock_ | also want a BRL-CAD payroll |
| 15:02.57 | brlcad | variety of folks, different disciplines |
| 15:03.16 | brlcad | predominantly cares about the open source side of things regardless, that's where the cool stuff happens ;) |
| 15:03.40 | clock_ | brlcad: so you believe in the coolness of open source? |
| 15:03.48 | ``Erik | much prefers the open source side, too, but has a mortgage and kinda likes to eat :) |
| 15:03.49 | brlcad | whole-heartedly |
| 15:04.09 | clock_ | I believe as well that's why I make my own open source projects |
| 15:04.33 | clock_ | I believe open source programs are like wild animals |
| 15:04.39 | clock_ | closed sources are like captive animals |
| 15:04.43 | brlcad | it's why I spent 5+ years getting BRL-CAD open sourced |
| 15:05.05 | clock_ | the wild animals can have sex with whomever they find the fittest and create new offsprings |
| 15:05.32 | clock_ | so not it's for example like BRL-CAD + Ronja = more clear instructions for Ronja users |
| 15:06.01 | clock_ | wild animals do what they want, captive animals do what the ZOO staff wants. |
| 15:06.15 | clock_ | open source projects evolve how they want, closed source evolve how financial managers dictate. |
| 15:06.37 | ``Erik | thinks real life is a hair more complicated |
| 15:08.25 | mafm | agrees :D |
| 15:09.35 | mafm | so then how's BRL-CAD "board of directors"? kind of Linux? with or without the "Benevolent Dictator"? |
| 15:09.59 | clock_ | apparently the top person is not as ignorant as Torvalds |
| 15:10.10 | clock_ | because if I point out a bug they fix it usually quickly and competently |
| 15:10.33 | ``Erik | depends on who you ask |
| 15:11.48 | ``Erik | some people think it's a handful of gov't mgmrs, reality is more like brlcad is the dictator who gets some pressure from pointy haired folk, I think |
| 15:13.00 | clock_ | has anyone done a vulnerability analysis of apointy haired boss |
| 15:13.32 | kwizart | rebuild |
| 15:14.46 | clock_ | I have a crush on a very cute intelligent chemist |
| 15:15.07 | kwizart | about the librt problem... i don't think i can prevent from this move for F-9 but i will raise the issue to the glibc maintainer, maybe we could have something different (if doable) for RHEL6. But seems unprobable as RHEL6 is supposed to be based on F-9 |
| 15:15.11 | clock_ | Could I impress him by making some models of molecules using CSG in BRL-CAD and then rendering a video of rotating molecule as two 3D images? |
| 15:15.33 | clock_ | I guess if I make spheres of various colours and then subtract them so they don't overlap that whould suffice |
| 15:16.52 | clock_ | has anyone done that, transferring molecule models into a CSG modelling program? |
| 15:17.07 | clock_ | What I seen (rasmol) the pictures were very pixeley and triangley |
| 15:17.12 | mafm | hmm |
| 15:17.19 | clock_ | BRL-CAD models perfect spheres |
| 15:17.46 | mafm | probably you can do that |
| 15:17.59 | mafm | it should be possible to create that programatically even |
| 15:18.15 | mafm | if it's composed only of primitives (spheres, cylinders, etC) |
| 15:18.29 | clock_ | just overlapping coloured spheres |
| 15:20.32 | ``Erik | heh, or get experimental and try the metaball primitive O:-) |
| 15:32.12 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30765 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/brlcad_path.c: fix a bad snprintf that was being fed an 'n' much longer than the string being printed into. instead of 64, use MAXPATHLEN. use define elsewhere to make sure the rest are consistent. |
| 15:33.21 | kwizart | ^^ yep indeed it works ! |
| 15:33.38 | clock_ | metaball is those two balls of possibly differing size connected by a cone? |
| 15:34.32 | brlcad | mafm: you have read HACKING, right? :) benevolent meritocracy .. with some very influential (and paying) users in the community (e.g. ARL) |
| 15:34.54 | mafm | I was in the process of doing it, but got distracted a while ago |
| 15:35.27 | brlcad | kwizart: if you're going to do that for librt, you should also probably do it for libbn and libbu -- they're just as likely to conflict |
| 15:36.43 | kwizart | yep but i haven't found any libbn.so or libbu.so on my system, so they shoudln't conflict |
| 15:36.51 | brlcad | k |
| 15:36.51 | kwizart | where are they supposed to be ? |
| 15:36.58 | kwizart | or come from ? |
| 15:37.04 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 15:37.12 | brlcad | src/libbu src/libbn |
| 15:37.35 | brlcad | they're two other core libraries to brl-cad |
| 15:37.39 | kwizart | what package may provide libbn or libbu other than brlcad ? |
| 15:39.06 | brlcad | ah, I don't remember the details -- there's a libbn that's a bayesian network lib, libbu is more rare but I *think* openssh had a private internal lib named libbu at one point |
| 15:39.26 | brlcad | there's also another guy with a tiny/pet librt iirc |
| 15:40.03 | brlcad | kwizart: if you can, try out latest head file for brlcad_path.c .. see if that works -- if it does, I can make a patch file for you |
| 15:40.24 | brlcad | or you can just use that one-liner |
| 15:40.42 | kwizart | brlcad, yep it works ^^ |
| 15:40.46 | brlcad | okay, cool |
| 15:40.53 | brlcad | runs off to lunch! |
| 15:48.33 | mafm | hmm, that #define is a bit strange... why would you want a larger space than MAXPATHLEN? can't that be the maximum allowed for a filesystem in example? |
| 15:49.54 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.101.60) | |
| 16:17.31 | *** part/#brlcad b0ef (n=b0ef@062016141231.customer.alfanett.no) | |
| 16:29.37 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 16:32.52 | mafm | hey :) |
| 16:58.08 | ``Erik | and then the racoon gave me rabies |
| 17:31.32 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30766 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/3dm-g.cpp: cannot assume a fresh declaration defaults to NULL |
| 17:54.08 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30767 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: remove the file pointer from the atexit cleanup crap. linux is/was crashing on a double fclose. now it just keeps track of the descriptor and closes that instead. (sean did this) |
| 17:59.37 | kwizart | hum, there is something wrong with xorg libaries detection |
| 17:59.38 | kwizart | : |
| 17:59.40 | kwizart | :X_CFLAGS = -Iyes/include |
| 18:00.03 | kwizart | X_LIBS = -Lyes/lib -lX11 -lX11 -lXext -lXi |
| 18:00.33 | kwizart | X_PREFIX='' |
| 18:00.49 | kwizart | whereas it should be -I/usr/include |
| 18:01.04 | kwizart | and -L/usr/lib64 (on 64bit system) |
| 18:01.07 | kwizart | mutlilibs |
| 18:04.42 | ``Erik | did you do something like --with-x11=yes instead of --with-x11=/usr ? |
| 18:05.07 | kwizart | --with-x11 ? |
| 18:05.18 | ``Erik | I guess that means "no" :) |
| 18:06.30 | kwizart | nope indeed, but i don't know where is set the lib subdirectory then... |
| 18:07.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30768 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: oops, don't commit debug code .. bad sean, no donut |
| 18:09.13 | kwizart | for bc_dir in "$ac_x_libraries" `echo "$ac_x_includes $ac_x_header_dirs" | |
| 18:09.13 | kwizart | sed s/include/lib/g` ; do |
| 18:09.43 | kwizart | and x_libraries="$bc_with_x11_val/lib" |
| 18:11.15 | mafm | heading home now, see you tomorrow :) |
| 18:11.53 | mafm | bye |
| 18:12.42 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30769 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (main.c slave.c slave.h): s/isst/adrt/g (unifying things) |
| 18:42.17 | ``Erik | *gardengardengarden* |
| 18:46.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30770 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/brlcad_path.c: explain why there is a +64 on the buffer size |
| 19:06.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30771 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Working towards being able to use extruded sketches for tread patterns. |
| 19:08.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30772 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (57 files in 10 dirs): remove author info, in complience with new code standards |
| 19:10.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30773 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Put factor of two in where needed. note - need to examine rotation points and subtractions to eliminate flaws. |
| 19:12.06 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30774 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (6 files in 3 dirs): remove author info, in complience with new code standards |
| 19:24.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30775 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (load.c load.h slave.c slave.h): carry back return values (for future robustness/persistence fixes). Cuddle braces. |
| 19:29.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30776 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Can't use the cutting shapes in this case - they don't repair the cut. |
| 19:33.05 | yukonbob | win 3 |
| 19:33.10 | brlcad | no! |
| 19:33.25 | yukonbob | :) |
| 19:33.36 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 19:34.17 | ``Erik | notes that 7.12.2 tarball is still not there |
| 19:36.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30777 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: users keep trying to use --with-x11 without providing a path, so prevent 'yes' getting shoved into the include dir paths. let it autodetect. |
| 19:38.26 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, bob found a nasty during extra testing today, retesting/retagging since it didn't go up |
| 19:39.46 | ``Erik | aight |
| 19:43.04 | brlcad | kwizart: that should be a fix for --with-x11 (though you really don't want to use that without a path) |
| 19:43.24 | brlcad | kwizart: so what's remaining with the fedora build? |
| 19:44.33 | ``Erik | wonders if it'd be possible to have the svn revision number go somewhere into the install O.o |
| 19:44.35 | kwizart | well... probably many things as i'm just testing with F-8 (x86_64 ) |
| 19:44.58 | kwizart | and i expect i will need some patch with gcc43 and F-9 |
| 19:45.32 | kwizart | but for patches i'm using now: |
| 19:46.03 | kwizart | as i need to re-run autotools, there is a problem with compiler.m4 |
| 19:46.18 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993667 |
| 19:46.53 | kwizart | i saw you solved this differently in svn - but wasn't working... i don't know if both def functions are needed thought.. |
| 19:47.34 | kwizart | because both gcc and g++ are tested with the same macros in my view |
| 19:48.45 | kwizart | i also need to export theses value: |
| 19:48.45 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993673 |
| 19:48.51 | brlcad | yeah, it doesn't need to call exit() |
| 19:48.56 | kwizart | as they are not well detected by configure |
| 19:49.06 | brlcad | just turn exit() into return 0 and you don't need headers |
| 19:49.50 | kwizart | sed -i -e 's|BLT=""|BLT="-L%{_libdir}/blt2.4/ -lBLT24"|' configure.ac |
| 19:49.53 | brlcad | else it wants stdlib.h, not stdio.h |
| 19:49.56 | kwizart | sed -i -e 's|bc_with_x11_val/lib|bc_with_x11_val/%{_lib}|' configure.ac |
| 19:49.58 | *** join/#brlcad jdoliner (n=jdoliner@wireless-199-157.uchicago.edu) | |
| 19:51.02 | brlcad | if you really need to export all of those, then other places in the code are failing :) |
| 19:51.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30778 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Workaround for some of the sketch tread issues - rotation handling still should be examined. |
| 19:52.42 | kwizart | i'm also using this patch between configure and make: |
| 19:52.43 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993681 |
| 19:53.02 | brlcad | kwizart: does fedora have an itclConfig.sh installed? |
| 19:53.41 | kwizart | sh %{_libdir}/itclConfig.sh (runned before configure but without effect) |
| 19:54.18 | brlcad | right, system incrTcl is still a problem with path searching |
| 19:54.29 | kwizart | http://pastebin.ca/993688 |
| 19:54.33 | brlcad | i got tcl and tk working, but not incr yet because I ran into a snag with os x |
| 19:54.47 | brlcad | there's a itclConfig.sh there along with the libs, but no header files |
| 19:54.49 | kwizart | i think the ictk value wasn't present in configure.ac |
| 19:55.43 | brlcad | so it's in /usr/lib64/libitcl3.3.so ? |
| 19:56.18 | kwizart | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 110552 déc 20 03:22 /usr/lib64/libitcl3.3.so |
| 19:56.24 | kwizart | on F-8 case - yes |
| 19:57.47 | kwizart | i think there where some improvements with F-9 and tcl/tk 8.5 because some rpm macros was defined |
| 19:59.09 | kwizart | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging/Tcl |
| 19:59.31 | brlcad | so that's a valid libitclConfig.sh, we could actually use that for your case to make the search lookups work |
| 20:00.20 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30779 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (load.c slave.c): hoist prep out into the main message handler |
| 20:02.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30780 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: Add note about surface normal lighting not working with -k option |
| 20:04.03 | brlcad | kwizart: the build presumably completes now though? |
| 20:04.14 | brlcad | as does "make benchmark" and "make test" ? |
| 20:06.31 | kwizart | is testing with make benchmark and make test |
| 20:07.35 | brlcad | they should loudly declare any failures as WRONG or FAILED |
| 20:17.35 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.68.105) | |
| 20:18.32 | andrecastelo | hi everyone |
| 20:18.34 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik |
| 20:18.44 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 20:18.50 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 20:22.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30781 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/interact.c: fmax() is c99 but several of the BSDs don't provide it, so macrofy |
| 20:24.30 | ``Erik | afternoon, andre |
| 20:25.01 | ``Erik | did not know about F3 O.o :D |
| 20:29.38 | brlcad | really? |
| 20:29.49 | brlcad | it's right next to F2 .. right before F4 |
| 20:31.25 | *** join/#brlcad kwizart_ (n=kwizart@did75-14-82-236-19-114.fbx.proxad.net) | |
| 20:41.30 | ``Erik | toys aren't cool if no one else can play with them |
| 20:41.58 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30782 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: add some initial help information for us clueless folk |
| 20:46.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30783 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-2/: revert the tag since we haven't posted source tarballs yet. bob found an mged crash-on-exit bug related to temp files and text editing, also fixed bsd build and maybe even made fedora build a smidgen easier. |
| 20:49.34 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875FED.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:56.38 | starseek1r | ``Erik : it's not ready yet ;-) |
| 20:59.42 | ``Erik | yeah, but I still wanted to play ;D |
| 21:21.44 | kwizart | arf! finally uploaded the src.rpm, doing a public scratch build here: |
| 21:21.44 | kwizart | http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/taskinfo?taskID=576324 |
| 21:22.11 | kwizart | (not started yet) |
| 21:22.47 | kwizart | quite a big queue |
| 21:26.06 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30784 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): flatten makefile structure |
| 21:32.25 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30785 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/bench/Makefile.am: disable this explicitely and put files in EXTRA_DIST |
| 21:34.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30786 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/Makefile.am: simplify (removing compile-time logic) |
| 21:35.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30787 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/main.c: initial stub for siginfo/siguser |
| 21:38.01 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30788 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: remove ADRT/SDL checks |
| 21:38.29 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30789 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/Makefile.am: chuck in a space to keep the file regular |
| 21:38.45 | ``Erik | *spaz8 |
| 21:39.27 | brlcad | good gravy! |
| 21:39.55 | ``Erik | *commitcommitcommit* woops, quittin' time *run* :D |
| 21:41.20 | ``Erik | dangit, forgot I had to run distcheck from an --enable-all still :/ |
| 21:41.21 | brlcad | i leave for an hour and all commit hell breaks loose :) |
| 21:42.24 | ``Erik | what? it's been a while since I haven't been too busy with meetings and bs! so, y'know, I kinda covered the room O.o careful, ther'es some dripping off the ceiling |
| 21:45.04 | brlcad | yeah, it's all cool |
| 21:45.17 | brlcad | looks build-benign anyways (*crosses fingers*) |
| 21:45.41 | ``Erik | uhm, some of the adrt/ makefile stuff might be risky, running distcheck in an --enable-all now... |
| 21:46.20 | ``Erik | flattening out the build infrastructure in there, taking out a lot of the conditionals, etc |
| 21:48.32 | ``Erik | poop, mine failed in I think misc/win32-msvc/Dll |
| 21:49.19 | ``Erik | wonder if it was actually a lingering aPrep/Makefile.in |
| 21:49.55 | brlcad | sounds like a stale autogen.sh-need'in build |
| 21:50.10 | brlcad | aPrep was deleted |
| 21:50.31 | ``Erik | yeah, this was just lingering stuff... full cycle time |
| 21:52.40 | ``Erik | ohhhh, had another machine building that got pukey on a missing automake-1.10 |
| 21:52.53 | ``Erik | somewhere in misc/ |
| 22:44.00 | ``Erik | heh |
| 22:44.57 | ``Erik | <-- figured he'd get back to see complaints about how he royally pooched the dist, not complete silence :D |
| 22:47.06 | brlcad | doesn't want to test |
| 22:47.19 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 22:47.25 | ``Erik | I had a distcheck running when I left |
| 22:48.05 | ``Erik | family guy is disturbingly twisted O.o :D ah lahk it |
| 22:48.21 | yukonbob | family guy ftw! |
| 22:49.18 | yukonbob | What am I supposed to do with all my good ideas? Fill a tub and wash myself with them? Because that's what soap is for. |
| 22:49.53 | ``Erik | O.o eh? |
| 22:50.27 | ``Erik | (that's an american eh, not a canadian eh, which I still kinda thing might be an abuse of aye) |
| 22:50.28 | yukonbob | ^-- Peter to Louis when Peter became producer of her stage production |
| 22:50.38 | ``Erik | oh |
| 22:50.40 | ``Erik | lois |
| 22:50.46 | ``Erik | uh, the king and I |
| 22:50.50 | ``Erik | :) |
| 22:51.18 | yukonbob | right, that's the one |
| 22:53.44 | ``Erik | y'know, googles gsoc web apps kinda bite |
| 23:07.13 | andrecastelo | hey guys :D |
| 23:07.53 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: why's that ? |
| 23:08.33 | ``Erik | cfs issues |
| 23:09.14 | andrecastelo | cfs ? |
| 23:09.58 | ``Erik | can't find... stuff... |
| 23:11.29 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 00:54.44 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.37.27) | |
| 01:00.16 | andrecastelo_ | andrecastelo: drop it already!! |
| 03:31.35 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 03:45.37 | starseeker_home | ``Erik, adrt is busted - complaint about SIGINFO being undeclared |
| 04:40.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30790 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add second test extrusion, tweak help command behavior (switch back to a plain tire command generating default tire in tire.g) |
| 07:04.40 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:14.59 | brlcad | yawns |
| 07:16.12 | clock_ | brlcad: I haven't shown my latest 3D creation |
| 07:16.21 | clock_ | brlcad: you know what a space frame is? |
| 07:17.25 | brlcad | sure, it hangs on a wall and holds a pretty picture of space |
| 07:17.32 | clock_ | no :) |
| 07:18.05 | clock_ | It's like you want a stiff and light construction of a body so you fill the body basically with tetrahedra made of sticks and that's how Stansted Airport is built and also looks like those constructions on satellites |
| 07:18.09 | clock_ | I made a space frame CRT holder |
| 07:18.50 | clock_ | http://images.twibright.com/tns/21a9.html |
| 07:18.54 | clock_ | I want to open source it |
| 07:19.34 | clock_ | For 21'' CRT. I bought a 21'' CRT for 20$ fully functional great picture because I like the picture it has better colours and better black level than LCD also faster reaction and more even picture surface |
| 07:19.59 | clock_ | But it's big and 30kg that's why I had to make a wall holder because it couldn't fit on a desk. |
| 07:21.22 | brlcad | heh |
| 07:21.43 | brlcad | kinda frankenteinish joint welding there |
| 07:23.24 | brlcad | i'd expect the weak points wouldn't be the frame itself but the connections on the wall |
| 07:23.26 | clock_ | lol yeah can you weld better? |
| 07:23.39 | clock_ | like the plugs could get ripped off the wall? |
| 07:23.55 | brlcad | yep |
| 07:24.09 | clock_ | my father once installed an antenna on plugs like that and it got ripped off by a wind |
| 07:24.22 | clock_ | But a properly installed plug holds like hell |
| 07:24.43 | clock_ | you have a prescribed hole diameter and screw diameter and length |
| 07:24.49 | clock_ | I held to all these parameters |
| 07:25.05 | clock_ | it's half inch holes 70mm deep |
| 07:25.24 | brlcad | it's one of those things though, that you never really know until you apply enough pressure to find the breaking point, but by then it's too late :) |
| 07:25.41 | clock_ | but what should break, the brick? |
| 07:26.01 | clock_ | and the holder has like a big base that means the moment is not large |
| 07:26.14 | clock_ | if the plugs were close the prying action would be much stronger |
| 07:26.16 | brlcad | the brick, the connection to the brick |
| 07:26.32 | clock_ | frankensteinish welding haha I wanted to make sure it's not the welds that break |
| 07:26.41 | brlcad | can you hang from it? |
| 07:26.57 | clock_ | I did a similar holder for Ronja and there I could hang from it |
| 07:27.04 | clock_ | the base and the plugs were the same size |
| 07:27.40 | clock_ | I weight 75kg |
| 07:27.50 | brlcad | if you can provide about 5x the load and it easily holds, then sustaining a 30kg load shouldn't be too bad |
| 07:27.52 | clock_ | The Ronja weights max. 15kg and the monitor 30kg |
| 07:28.30 | clock_ | and it's clever made 2 plugs for tension and 1 for compression |
| 07:28.41 | clock_ | if it were the other way the rating would be half because the tension is critical |
| 07:50.07 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:50.10 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:50.13 | brlcad | hehe |
| 08:25.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30791 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/main.c: make sure SIGUSR1 and SIGINFO are available first |
| 08:46.14 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslc-082-082-079-218.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 10:05.01 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:07.36 | mafm | hi |
| 10:08.10 | clock_ | brlcad: what's a penguinista cad do you mean BRL-CAD? |
| 10:09.31 | mafm | BRL-CAD -- the penguinista CAD! at least it'll be Cool! |
| 10:29.11 | brlcad | mafm: heh |
| 10:29.55 | brlcad | clock_: it was someone's comment about the army releaseing brlc-ad as open source |
| 10:35.07 | clock_ | I don't think penguinista cad is cool for me it sounds infantile |
| 10:35.15 | clock_ | BRL-CAD is a child of the army |
| 10:36.51 | mafm | :P |
| 10:38.03 | mafm | I guess that the -ista end has something to do with common names given in latin-american countries to movements |
| 10:38.30 | mafm | apart from that, I was only joking with "penguin - cool" :P |
| 10:38.45 | brlcad | found the vader comment more funny |
| 10:39.00 | brlcad | "it's kind of like darth vader bringing you cookies and a birthday present." |
| 10:39.15 | mafm | where's that comment? |
| 10:39.26 | brlcad | it was in a channel log elsewhere |
| 10:39.33 | brlcad | just someone chatting briefly about brl-cad |
| 10:39.37 | mafm | or what's referring to, to BRL-CAD as well? :D |
| 10:39.47 | mafm | it's funny yep |
| 10:40.06 | brlcad | that having the army/gov release brl-cad as open source was kinda like that :) |
| 10:40.27 | mafm | May the Source Be with You! |
| 10:40.40 | brlcad | Use the Source, Luke! |
| 10:40.58 | mafm | btw reading wikipedia I found that ENIAC was also developed at/for BRL |
| 10:41.06 | brlcad | yep |
| 10:42.31 | mafm | crazy army |
| 10:42.56 | mafm | it's starts like that, and it ends in teens showing boobs in the intertubez! |
| 10:43.28 | clock_ | I want army boys showing their muscled bodies! |
| 10:43.44 | clock_ | brlcad: do you have a muscled body? |
| 10:44.01 | brlcad | no comment |
| 10:44.05 | mafm | :D |
| 10:44.24 | brlcad | the intarwebs caters to everyone ;) |
| 10:45.06 | mafm | I mean that it's funny how inventions turn to be used for completely unexpected things |
| 10:45.22 | mafm | that probably the creators are against |
| 10:45.36 | brlcad | yeah usually :) |
| 10:46.20 | mafm | there was a series of old documentaries of BBC with similar theme, called Connections |
| 10:47.48 | clock_ | You know how to solve rape by soldiers? |
| 10:48.05 | mafm | hmm? |
| 10:48.05 | clock_ | Make all soldiers to train their bodies so attractive that all the rape becomes consensual sex! |
| 10:48.55 | mafm | no need to go that far, somebody already invented the "gay bomb" |
| 10:49.06 | clock_ | thats? |
| 10:49.21 | mafm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gay_bomb |
| 10:49.45 | mafm | you release the bomb and soldiers start "loving" each other |
| 10:51.27 | clock_ | Acetamidohexanoyl]amino}-9-benzyl- 6-(3-carbamimidamidopropyl)-12- (1H-imidazol-5-ylmethyl)-3-(1H-indol- 3-ylmethyl)-2,5,8,11,14,17-hexaoxo- 1,4,7,10,13,18-hexaazacyclotricosane -23-carboxylic acid |
| 10:53.13 | mafm | hey, that's patented information, you punk! |
| 11:11.28 | mafm | brlcad: UTC (+ 1 now, summer time) :D |
| 11:36.29 | brlcad | noticed :) |
| 12:24.15 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.68.185) | |
| 12:24.29 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 12:24.39 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad , ``Erik :D |
| 12:24.42 | andrecastelo | sup mafm, congratulations :D |
| 12:25.04 | mafm | morning andrecastelo |
| 12:25.08 | mafm | same for you |
| 12:25.09 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo, g'morning :) |
| 12:25.32 | mafm | andrecastelo: now I want 10% of your payments, I'm a good adviser :P |
| 12:25.53 | andrecastelo | mafm: yep, thanks indeed :D |
| 12:27.54 | brlcad | heh |
| 12:28.04 | brlcad | oh, mafm .. i have something for you |
| 12:28.13 | brlcad | uploads |
| 12:28.49 | mafm | scared |
| 12:32.07 | brlcad | do you have keynote? |
| 12:33.13 | mafm | don't even know what's that |
| 12:33.44 | brlcad | what OS do you work on? |
| 12:33.50 | mafm | Debian |
| 12:34.33 | brlcad | ah, okay |
| 12:38.51 | mafm | so? |
| 12:39.29 | brlcad | trying to find the version that has the explanation audio |
| 12:40.29 | brlcad | basically, it's by one of the other cad devs as a prototype design for a new graphical integrated operating environment |
| 12:41.19 | brlcad | he prepared a tutorial presentation that walks through a brief interaction example -- it's not specific to CAD, but most of the interaction aspects and basic structure are still relevant |
| 12:41.23 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/design/gui/ioe_proto.html |
| 12:41.31 | starseeker_home | grabs adrt fix and resumes building... |
| 12:41.45 | brlcad | retags before people start committing again |
| 12:42.35 | starseeker_home | never fails, does it - make a tag and the floodgates open... |
| 12:44.31 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30792 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-2/: (re)tag the 7.12.2 release |
| 12:46.55 | clock_ | brlcad: GUI with an audio help? |
| 12:47.10 | brlcad | explains the driving concepts |
| 12:47.30 | brlcad | it's pretty intuitive as it is, but there are some fundamental differences |
| 12:47.55 | clock_ | what about deaf people and people who have no audio output? |
| 12:48.34 | mafm | brlcad: it's some presentation to make a flier, or Konqueror is making strange things? |
| 12:49.00 | brlcad | mafm: neither |
| 12:49.27 | brlcad | it's an *interaction* example .. ignore the particular task example |
| 12:50.00 | mafm | I can't hear anything btw, maybe I should try firefox |
| 12:51.22 | brlcad | there is no audio in that version |
| 12:51.33 | brlcad | that was my point .. i was trying to find a version that had audio |
| 12:52.12 | brlcad | otherwise, you can get a feel for it from each of the slides alone |
| 12:52.43 | mafm | oh, I thought that you had found the version with audio |
| 13:07.17 | mafm | so it's an example of what a GUI could do for a CAD program |
| 13:07.35 | mafm | is that from a Mac? :) |
| 13:08.04 | brlcad | it's an example of a GUI for really any working environment |
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| 13:08.49 | brlcad | it has many concepts that have fundamental usability implications |
| 13:09.49 | mafm | wb andrecastelo_ |
| 13:10.32 | mafm | the GUI is very clean, I like it |
| 13:11.34 | brlcad | it's a prototype that I'd really like to explore as a foundation for a new gui interface |
| 13:12.13 | brlcad | it gives several ideas for development directions, particularly w.r.t interaction |
| 13:14.52 | brlcad | yay, found audio version |
| 13:21.43 | brlcad | mafm: http://brlcad.org/design/gui/ioe_proto_final.mov |
| 13:22.53 | brlcad | there is another version also uploaded that has some guided interaction if you are intereste |
| 13:24.06 | brlcad | it's about 17 minutes long with two or three interaction scenarios |
| 13:25.43 | mafm | goody |
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| 13:34.58 | mafm | I think I'd better start putting this things in a wiki page |
| 13:35.25 | mafm | shoul I create it somewhere specifically, or with some namespace or what? |
| 13:35.45 | brlcad | hm |
| 13:36.22 | brlcad | well if you didn't see the note yesterday, one of the first steps is to get all of you guys to migrate your proposals to a (non-user) wiki page as a design document |
| 13:36.35 | brlcad | without the personal information, not in first person, etc |
| 13:36.58 | mafm | yes, I saw that |
| 13:37.01 | brlcad | for the gui concepts of IOE, you could have that as part of the design document or in a section by itself I'd think |
| 13:37.09 | brlcad | what do you think? |
| 13:37.32 | mafm | but I'm not very familiar with mediawiki, and I don't know exactly what a personal page is, etc |
| 13:37.52 | mafm | also I think that mediawiki can work with namespaces but you seem to use a plain structure |
| 13:38.07 | brlcad | every user has a User:username wiki page |
| 13:41.37 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Listusers |
| 13:42.33 | brlcad | ours are mostly unused, but just adding that caveat "just in case" .. welcome to put any progress/updates/info on your user page though |
| 13:42.44 | brlcad | in fact I'll be sending a note out later about that |
| 13:49.02 | mafm | all of you have it mostly empty, yep :) |
| 13:51.01 | mafm | so for the Project wiki page, any special namespace or convention? |
| 13:52.18 | PrezKennedy | i didnt know you were a bureaucrat brlcad |
| 13:52.36 | mafm | btw, I see some Remi in your wiki but not in the SourceForge site? |
| 13:53.20 | brlcad | mafm: there's a template you can add, but otherwise no particular convention |
| 13:53.31 | brlcad | Remi? |
| 13:55.05 | mafm | it's one example... |
| 13:55.26 | mafm | I mean if there should be some coordination between those listings |
| 13:55.55 | mafm | "Remi" name caught my attention because I knew a guy called like that |
| 13:57.19 | brlcad | what sourceforge listing are you referring to? |
| 13:58.55 | mafm | http://sourceforge.net/project/memberlist.php?group_id=105292 |
| 14:03.11 | brlcad | ah, the sf.net users .. yeah, those are totally separate systems |
| 14:03.38 | brlcad | only way to really coordinate them would be for users that register on the site to use their sf.net name (which they're perfectly able to do now) |
| 14:03.54 | brlcad | but it still wouldn't coordinate passwords or anything |
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| 14:05.42 | mafm | yes, I know... anyway my perfectly unrememberable username is usually available in most places |
| 14:06.04 | mafm | so I tend to have same acronym everywhere :) |
| 14:06.15 | brlcad | it's pretty memorable to me :) |
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| 14:07.21 | mafm | so maybe you're more acronym-capable than my workmates |
| 14:07.25 | andrecastelo_ | brlcad: we should add our applications to the wiki and link to them from http://brlcad.org/wiki/Developer_Documents ? |
| 14:07.31 | mafm | they can't remember my mail address ever |
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| 14:18.00 | brlcad | mafm: here's the template you can add: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Template:DesignDocument |
| 14:19.03 | brlcad | andrecastelo_: yeah, please do |
| 14:23.42 | ``Erik | doh, conflict, brlcad went and fixed it up before I got to it |
| 14:24.08 | brlcad | heh |
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| 14:49.26 | andrecastelo_ | brlcad, ``Erik : http://brlcad.org/wiki/Metropolis_Light_Transport |
| 14:50.17 | clock_ | Hehe Metropolis is a name of Ronja model |
| 14:51.10 | clock_ | And Ronja works on the pronciple of light transport ;-) |
| 14:52.15 | ``Erik | reads MLT wiki page |
| 14:52.30 | ``Erik | um |
| 14:52.44 | ``Erik | andre, have you ever modelled in BRL-CAD before? |
| 14:53.01 | ``Erik | thinks a cornell box might be useful for MLT testing |
| 14:53.26 | ``Erik | and a good thing to have in db/ |
| 14:53.42 | andrecastelo_ | ``Erik: i tried once but to no success |
| 14:54.14 | andrecastelo_ | ``Erik: i agree, it might be really useful for testing |
| 14:55.02 | ``Erik | how about this, if you have a few minutes, dig up the exact measurements of the cornell box and give modelling it a shot, if you get stuck, just ask us :D otherwise, I'll eventually get around to doing it O.o |
| 14:55.48 | andrecastelo_ | ok, i'll give it a shot :D |
| 14:58.11 | ``Erik | given that it's extremely simple, has published accurate details, and still hits on several key newbie issues of BRL-CAD (regions, combinations, materials), I imagine it's a good place to start :) |
| 14:58.32 | ``Erik | opposed to, say, a pen or toy mustang O.o :D |
| 15:07.07 | clock_ | model the saint pauls cathedral |
| 15:07.23 | clock_ | then you realize how unfinished the user interface is |
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| 15:13.35 | brlcad | there's a cornell box in the distribution |
| 15:13.41 | brlcad | db/cornell.g |
| 15:14.16 | brlcad | not certain that it's actually accurate/correct, but it's there |
| 15:19.08 | andrecastelo_ | well, at first look the geometry looks right.. and the distances seem to match http://www.graphics.cornell.edu/online/box/data.html |
| 15:23.01 | clock_ | brlcad: actually, the Volume II discusses modelling goblet |
| 15:23.13 | clock_ | without actually giving in any determinate dimensions |
| 15:23.30 | clock_ | I think that's a very simple example and doesn't teaches much of what one really needs for serious work |
| 15:24.01 | clock_ | Like all I do is entered exact numbers and complicated geomtry where things must perfectly match not just somehow overlap on the screen |
| 15:39.57 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30793 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add more shapes for prototype tread. |
| 15:40.31 | brlcad | clock_: what does that have to do with cornell.g ? |
| 15:43.34 | clock_ | brlcad: nothing |
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| 17:18.25 | ``Erik | heh, when did that get in there? there're a couple I don't remember O.o |
| 17:18.49 | ``Erik | weird, '00, guess I just missed it |
| 17:19.09 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30794 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: Mods to have the image location be returned as values between 0 and width or height minus 1. So if the width is 512, the range of values returned will be [0, 511]. |
| 17:32.34 | mafm | hmm, I noticed that my mentor changed suddently? |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30795 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_wgl.c: |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: Mods to allow the user to query the pixel location and color. Also added code to |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: constrain the queried pixel location to values between 0 and the width or height |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: minus 1. For example, if the height is 512 the range of values for y would be |
| 17:46.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 0-511. |
| 17:55.20 | mafm | bye |
| 17:57.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30796 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/config_win.h include/fb.h src/libfb/fb_log.c): If _WIN32, use bu_log in place of fb_log. This can easily revert back if/when fb_log becomes as flexible as bu_log. |
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| 18:42.11 | brlcad | howdy jdoliner |
| 18:49.53 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30797 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS README include/conf/PATCH): source tarballs are uploaded, bump patch revision |
| 18:52.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30798 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: clone and incr on the docket |
| 20:23.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30799 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 20:23.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: talked to applin for a while and got some additional history. it's not clear |
| 20:23.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: that earl actually wrote any code, but did contribute to algorithms and docs. |
| 20:23.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: likewise, applin coded around 1982 (sometime before March 1983) before the code |
| 20:23.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: was under revision control and then stopped shortly after (circa 1984/1985) so |
| 20:23.21 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: he was BRL-only. |
| 20:28.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30800 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 20:28.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: note that it first went into RCS in april 1984, but applin reminded me to check |
| 20:28.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: out the original GED tech report (GED: AN INTERACTIVE SOLID MODELING SYSTEM FOR |
| 20:28.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: VULNERABILITY ASSESSMENTS - ARBRL-TR-02480 - published March 1983) which indeed |
| 20:28.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: did have additional tidbits. It says development began in 1980 and that ged |
| 20:28.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: went into production use in January 1982. |
| 20:30.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30801 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: earl weaver was there at the beginning, mark 1980 as start year |
| 20:30.18 | ``Erik | hrm, it's too bad the early history isn't better preserved... jove in '83, then rt in '84 :/ |
| 20:31.25 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30802 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: gary kuehl was a BRLer |
| 20:32.45 | brlcad | yeah, keith was saying it was all managed manually, they'd give their snippets to mike, he'd rewrite them and organize |
| 20:33.01 | brlcad | keith stopped coding shortly after it went into rcs |
| 20:39.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30803 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Misc. cleanup and comments, added tread pattern count and tread depth as options. |
| 20:39.32 | andrecastelo_ | since when do you guys code for brl-cad ? |
| 20:40.01 | brlcad | andrecastelo_: this year makes 10 years for me |
| 20:40.44 | brlcad | but the project has certainly been going for quite a bit longer of course ;) |
| 20:41.15 | andrecastelo_ | interesting! :D so you work in/with the u.s. army ? |
| 20:43.20 | brlcad | cool, I see you got the wiki page updated |
| 20:44.04 | andrecastelo_ | yup, also made some improvements in the readability of the proposal |
| 20:44.25 | andrecastelo_ | as in - moved some stuff from timeline to implementation |
| 20:44.31 | andrecastelo_ | i think it is more clear this way |
| 20:45.23 | brlcad | cool, have to read through it again |
| 20:50.27 | brlcad | isn't sure you actually need the phong model with MLT, GI kinda takes over |
| 20:53.37 | andrecastelo_ | the idea was to use the phong model to handle the reflection but i'm also not sure |
| 20:54.14 | brlcad | that could get tricky |
| 20:54.28 | brlcad | liboptical assumes it's doing things a certain way |
| 20:54.36 | brlcad | you might be able to avoid liboptical entirely |
| 20:56.25 | andrecastelo_ | what about Bidirectional Reflectance Distribution Functions? |
| 20:58.47 | andrecastelo_ | could they work ? |
| 21:06.40 | brlcad | phong is a brdf |
| 21:06.49 | brlcad | it's a simple algorithm |
| 21:08.51 | ``Erik | the phong song |
| 21:13.11 | ``Erik | wonders if he gets to count his years haetus on "that damn project" towards his count O.o |
| 21:15.08 | ``Erik | hiatus, damn my splling |
| 21:19.11 | andrecastelo_ | brlcad: didn't know that.. but isn't phong exclusively for specular lighting ? |
| 21:28.00 | brlcad | andrecastelo_: nope, ambient + specular + diffuse components |
| 21:28.19 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phong_shading |
| 21:28.56 | brlcad | but how phong comes into play with a global illumination renderer and/or MLT is a different issue |
| 21:30.30 | andrecastelo_ | why's that? i thought we could use phong in a ray_hit() function, to decide where to shoot the next ray |
| 21:49.19 | andrecastelo_ | hey, regarding development procedures, how will it happen? patches will be sent in a time to time basis, will we work in a separate branch or in the trunk?? |
| 21:52.02 | brlcad | trunk ftw! |
| 21:52.22 | brlcad | part of gsoc is learning to coordinate with the other devs as a new full-fledged dev ;) |
| 21:52.48 | brlcad | so a few small patches for the first few changes with your mentor and when they give me a thumbs up, you start committing directly |
| 21:53.29 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30804 10/brlcad/branches/unlabeled-2.5.1/: i don't wanna look at it and neither does bob. and given E/ev have been rewritten several times, this original code probably just isn't worth it |
| 21:53.54 | brlcad | so if you did little patches now, you could/should have commit access even before gsoc coding begins |
| 21:55.57 | andrecastelo_ | cool :D there are some projects that gives the branch for the student to work on and never joins it back together |
| 21:56.43 | andrecastelo_ | speaking of patches, what about the center point one, did you manage to take a look to see if everything is ok and etc ? |
| 22:54.31 | ``Erik | hiatus, damn my splling |
| 22:54.42 | ``Erik | woops |
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| 00:37.42 | brlcad | andrecastelo_: I did start to look it over, there are two ahead of it, though :) |
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| 01:01.05 | andrecastelo_ | hm ok then :D |
| 01:08.49 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:09.06 | andrecastelo_ | hey yukonbob |
| 01:09.47 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30805 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Bob added support to query pixels in the wgl framebuffer similar to what is available for the ogl and X framebuffers |
| 01:09.48 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 01:13.39 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30806 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Bob implemented support to mirror across a distance along a given axis in mged. technically he implemented it in 7.12.2 but it was left out of the release notes so mentioning it here |
| 01:14.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30807 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: -Wfloat-equal is covered by the other todo for obliterating verbose compilation warnings |
| 01:18.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30808 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: consistently refer to mged in lowercase on the individual news lines but uppercase in the english write-ups throughout the NEWS file. |
| 01:21.30 | yukonbob | nice to see lots of commit msgs, rev. bump :) |
| 01:23.14 | brlcad | likes lots of frequent commits |
| 01:23.57 | brlcad | like each commit to be "just one thing" with useful commit messages |
| 01:27.46 | yukonbob | of course, of course -- but some days have more than others -- today seems 'extra noticeable' to me... I'm always happy w/ BRL-CAD -- a bit extra-happy today, though. |
| 01:27.49 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:29.05 | brlcad | too :) |
| 01:29.28 | brlcad | suspects it'll get pretty noisy in here this summer :) |
| 01:29.37 | brlcad | and leading up to |
| 01:29.53 | brlcad | and hopefully after too! ;) |
| 01:57.52 | yukonbob | Bring the Noise!! |
| 02:19.32 | andrecastelo_ | guys |
| 02:19.33 | andrecastelo_ | i'm out |
| 02:19.35 | andrecastelo_ | good night |
| 02:19.36 | andrecastelo_ | :D |
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| 02:31.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30809 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: reword the intro header and footer for clarity |
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| 10:22.53 | mafm | hai |
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| 12:35.41 | brlcad | mafm: Fernández con acento o sin? |
| 12:43.33 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: would you happen to know why the contact page won't prompt a captcha? I can't seem to get it to work :/ |
| 12:54.01 | mafm | brlcad: I tend to not use it |
| 12:58.41 | brlcad | k |
| 12:59.41 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Not off hand, but I'll look into it later today. |
| 12:59.50 | brlcad | mafm: does "New OpenGL GUI Framework for Modeling and Visualization" sound like a reasonable summary description? |
| 13:00.07 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: okay, cool .. thanks! |
| 13:00.52 | brlcad | they're turned on and work for other drupal forms (actually they only work exactly every other time ..) but just not for the contact form |
| 13:01.03 | MinuteElectron | =\ |
| 13:01.05 | brlcad | they do work cleanly for the wiki, though |
| 13:01.06 | mafm | brlcad: what's that summary description for? |
| 13:01.08 | MinuteElectron | that's very odd |
| 13:02.00 | brlcad | wondering if it's just "somehow" misconfigured drupal plugin -- can't imagine a plugin that popular having a bug that obvious, but who knows |
| 13:02.23 | brlcad | mafm: for the masses at large |
| 13:02.44 | brlcad | announcement formulation |
| 13:03.22 | brlcad | explaining what these projects are in more layman terms |
| 13:03.53 | brlcad | pacman87: yours is "Implementing Solid of Revolution and Sweep Primitives" |
| 13:05.34 | brlcad | mafm: in fact, I think it works even better as simply "New Framework for Modeling and Visualization" |
| 13:07.12 | brlcad | hm, or not -- never mind :) |
| 13:10.38 | brlcad | mafm: oh, also as you noticed yesterday, your mentor is now the esteemed 'Bob' |
| 13:12.34 | brlcad | he's a really great guy that should be a good fit for evaluating what you're working on -- we still do group mentoring as much as possible for the technical aspects (i'm certainly always available to answer questions), but he'll be the point man for following your progress |
| 13:13.23 | brlcad | and of course, let me know if you have any questions or problems with your mentor (same goes for any of the gsocers) |
| 13:28.07 | mafm | brlcad: "New GUI Framework for [Remote?] Modeling and Visualization" is fine I guess |
| 13:34.25 | homovulgaris | hi mafm , brlcad :) |
| 13:34.41 | brlcad | howdy homovulgaris |
| 13:34.53 | brlcad | ah, right Dawn! |
| 13:35.00 | brlcad | isn't used to that nick :) |
| 13:35.09 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 13:41.06 | homovulgaris | i am pretty new to the channel :) |
| 13:41.16 | homovulgaris | so @brlcad is sean ? |
| 13:41.19 | homovulgaris | mafm is manuelo ? |
| 13:41.52 | homovulgaris | *manuel i meant |
| 13:42.19 | ``Erik | yes to both |
| 13:45.01 | brlcad | ~seen johnranderson |
| 13:45.01 | ibot | i haven't seen 'johnranderson', brlcad |
| 13:45.07 | brlcad | hm |
| 13:46.01 | ``Erik | ~seen daytona |
| 13:46.02 | ibot | daytona <n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 20d 11h 39m 28s ago, saying: 'prasad_: Hey, how's it going?'. |
| 13:46.24 | ``Erik | he had another modified variant he was in with :/ grep logs O.o |
| 13:47.28 | brlcad | yeah, that's what I was hunting for |
| 13:47.34 | brlcad | daytona isn't registered to him |
| 13:47.56 | brlcad | ~seen daytonajohn |
| 13:47.57 | ibot | daytonajohn <n=jra@c-68-55-36-65.hsd1.md.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 14d 11h 51m 54s ago, saying: 'brlcad: good, I'll watch for it'. |
| 13:48.27 | ``Erik | heh, beat me to it |
| 13:48.59 | brlcad | 6 days ago according to nickserv |
| 13:50.33 | ``Erik | I see him last here on apr 09 |
| 13:50.42 | ``Erik | ish |
| 14:07.18 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1128544174.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 14:09.14 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@70.108.244.218) | |
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| 14:26.31 | *** join/#brlcad kwizart (n=kwizart@fedora/kwizart) | |
| 14:26.34 | kwizart | ERROR: bad pointer x7fff04c190d0: s/b bu_ptbl(x7074626c), was Unknown_Magic(x2aaaaad156e8), file ptbl.c, line 72 |
| 14:27.27 | kwizart | this error occured when doing make test - lt-rt was blocked at /bin/sh ../regress/solids.sh .. |
| 14:28.43 | kwizart | actually i send a kill -9 as the process seemed to take much time (more than one hour) - but i don't know how much time would be needed anywya |
| 14:29.35 | kwizart | -> gqa.sh succeeded |
| 14:29.36 | kwizart | +++ gqa test complete. |
| 14:29.45 | kwizart | others test seems to succeed |
| 14:30.44 | kwizart | ok, done the benchmark tests |
| 14:30.44 | kwizart | Estimated time is 9 minutes, 36 seconds |
| 14:34.54 | brlcad | that's not a good sign on the make test |
| 14:35.10 | brlcad | none of the individual tests should take more than a couple seconds |
| 14:35.37 | brlcad | where did you see the bad pointer message? |
| 14:35.57 | kwizart | just after kiling the lt-rt process |
| 14:36.04 | brlcad | ah |
| 14:36.13 | brlcad | I suspect it was waiting in the debugger |
| 14:36.25 | brlcad | and that was just pending buffered i/o |
| 14:36.34 | brlcad | do you have a bomb log in that directory? |
| 14:36.43 | kwizart | 19031 builder 35 10 105m 7652 4852 S 193 0.4 12:37.17 lt-rt |
| 14:37.13 | kwizart | 193 is the CPU used - it use the dual core on benchmark but not on test |
| 14:37.23 | kwizart | look at the log |
| 14:37.59 | brlcad | there should be a bomb.log, hopefully with a valid stack trace |
| 14:39.32 | brlcad | should be something like lt-rt-19031-bomb.log |
| 14:39.34 | kwizart | yes i have 9 lt-g_qa-????-bomb.log |
| 14:40.09 | brlcad | can you paste one of them somewhere? |
| 14:40.17 | brlcad | or all of them |
| 14:40.26 | kwizart | do you want all log in the regress directory or only the bomb one ? |
| 14:40.27 | brlcad | or post or e-mail |
| 14:40.35 | brlcad | sure, that'd help |
| 14:42.42 | kwizart | will wait if bench can finish |
| 14:44.48 | kwizart | well ok - killed |
| 14:45.33 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-122-121.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 14:45.45 | brlcad | what was benchmark doing? it does take about 10 minutes |
| 14:45.48 | thing0 | hey |
| 14:45.50 | thing0 | hey |
| 14:45.55 | brlcad | should have been ticking by frames |
| 14:46.13 | brlcad | that get slower and slower in repetition |
| 14:46.25 | brlcad | hello thing0 |
| 14:46.52 | kwizart | ok - wasn't even moving |
| 14:47.58 | brlcad | should look something like http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m53901717 |
| 14:49.22 | kwizart | it goes until #+++++ moss |
| 14:49.31 | kwizart | where should i email ? |
| 14:55.05 | brlcad | damn that's one huge configure line :) |
| 15:00.27 | thing0 | how u doing brlcad? |
| 15:00.41 | brlcad | busy |
| 15:08.25 | brlcad | kwizart: ... wow, something is really hosed there for a couple of the test cases -- something is tripping up our run-time corruption detection, and correctly from the looks of the logs -- "something" is wrong |
| 15:09.08 | brlcad | ponders |
| 15:16.35 | brlcad | there was at least one useful crash log (the 'unknown' one for rt) that leads be to believe there's some aliasing problem or byte offsets are being computed incorrectly |
| 15:17.43 | brlcad | can you try a simple: "./configure --enable-all && make clean && make && make benchmark" build to see if that also hangs at the +++++ moss ? |
| 15:18.18 | brlcad | presuming ssp is off by default |
| 15:18.31 | brlcad | otherwise, turning that off as well for the test |
| 15:20.48 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30810 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/mirror.c: Apply mirror_pt to the particle primitive. Remove old line of code from the ELL/SPH section. |
| 15:25.02 | kwizart | without doing make test ? how can i enable ssp at configure ? it would be better to have accurate configure option so I won't need to build tcl8.5 buildin |
| 15:28.29 | brlcad | this is just to test the build |
| 15:28.56 | brlcad | before turning on all the various protections and worrying about what is linking with what where, I'd like to verify that the default build even works |
| 15:29.09 | brlcad | because from that crash report, it looks like it might not be |
| 15:29.40 | brlcad | for all I know, ssp may even be causing a problem (e.g. with aliasing) |
| 15:30.47 | brlcad | make benchmark is also one of our tests, a more fundamental test that validates the representation and geometric evaluation (via ray-tracing) |
| 15:37.43 | kwizart | well, there is really low chance for the configure to rich it end if i'm just using ./configure --enable-all - but i will try |
| 15:37.56 | ``Erik | has run into unexpected weird crashes from system libs when deviating from --enable-all... like tk85 straight up crashes on amd64 if truetype fonts are enabled |
| 15:38.39 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30811 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.1: Add man page description of new options |
| 15:39.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30812 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Break some things out into functions, put tire region creation inside tire function. |
| 15:41.43 | brlcad | ``Erik: he's getting a slew of magic check failures for the ptbl structs -- one happens during boolweave in the stack shader, another in g_qa |
| 15:42.06 | ``Erik | ugh |
| 15:42.15 | brlcad | starseeker_: now that it has docs, deserves the news line ;) |
| 15:42.18 | ``Erik | yeah, definitely revert to a simple configure line O.o :D |
| 15:42.25 | mafm | going earlier today |
| 15:42.29 | ``Erik | hehehe, it has a -h help, too! :D |
| 15:42.29 | mafm | bye |
| 15:42.41 | brlcad | cya mafm |
| 15:43.29 | ``Erik | notes that tire.1 is installed in 7.12.2 release |
| 15:45.05 | brlcad | ah, oh well close enough :) |
| 15:45.38 | starseek1r | brlcad: OK, I'll add it :-) |
| 15:46.04 | starseek1r | ``Erik : It is? oops |
| 15:47.08 | ``Erik | yeah, you added it to man_MANS instead of noinst_MANS |
| 15:47.23 | ``Erik | had to change the fbsd port pkg-plist for it :) |
| 15:47.27 | starseek1r | Sorry |
| 15:47.52 | ``Erik | it's all good, chances are that no one will notice it before 7.12.4 with a NEWS line :D |
| 15:48.02 | ``Erik | other than being there, it wasn't advertised |
| 15:48.27 | starseek1r | reflects that proc-db was a poor place to check on how to install man pages... |
| 15:49.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30813 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Add note about tire proc-db |
| 15:49.29 | starseek1r | There we go |
| 15:49.42 | ``Erik | I don't think we do a noinst_MANS anywhere :/ |
| 15:50.18 | starseek1r | Well, considering there was only one other man page in all of proc-db, it was still a bad place to check :-P |
| 15:50.39 | ``Erik | heh, uh, really? damn, proc-db needs more man pages! |
| 15:51.00 | ``Erik | though that idea I threw out the other day is more and more appealing to me |
| 15:51.03 | starseek1r | actually asked brlcad at one point if proc-dbs were supposed to be documented with man pages... |
| 15:51.16 | ``Erik | hoisting all the procdb's into a library and having a lean little binary that chooses what funcs to call |
| 15:52.31 | starseek1r | likes the idea of calling bolt functionality from a bolt proc-db inside the tire proc-db... |
| 15:52.57 | starseek1r | ``Erik - I agree, it's growing on me as well. |
| 15:53.29 | starseek1r | ``Erik: Do we have proc-dbs for bolts/gears/springs/other fun stuff? |
| 15:53.38 | ``Erik | if burly likes it, it should go into the TODO file, I'd imagine |
| 15:53.42 | ``Erik | I d'no, look in the db dir? |
| 15:53.43 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54877B5E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:54.44 | ``Erik | the only one in there I only have any real knowledge about is sphflake |
| 15:55.11 | starseek1r | Hmm, ducks... pyramid... tea... |
| 15:55.44 | brlcad | historically, the proc-db's are for testing geometry creation, testing new primitives or wdb routines |
| 15:56.37 | starseek1r | So is what ``Erik and I are contemplating something different? |
| 15:56.44 | brlcad | i'm not convinced they make much sense as a library.. they're not really consistent with each other |
| 15:57.00 | brlcad | other than the basic idea that they "make things" |
| 15:57.06 | starseek1r | <evil grin> yet! </evil grin> |
| 15:57.17 | brlcad | they would make nice plugins individually though |
| 15:57.44 | brlcad | i did plan to rewire then like the other 400 tools as modules |
| 15:58.09 | starseek1r | would like to be able to say "I need 5/16in bolts in this wheel" and call the bolt generation routine... |
| 15:58.40 | brlcad | that's all high-level modeling -- you could do that with them as individual plugins or in a library |
| 15:58.47 | starseek1r | after writing the bolt generation routine, apparently... <cough> |
| 15:58.55 | brlcad | there is an mk_bolt already |
| 15:59.02 | starseek1r | Ah, good :-) |
| 16:00.01 | starseek1r | Heh - libnutsandbolts would be awesome :-P |
| 16:00.08 | brlcad | i see them getting tied together at a much higher level where api consistency won't matter, nor will the backend implementation |
| 16:02.21 | starseek1r | isn't quite following - let's say, for example, I want to write a utility at some level that uses routines for nuts, bolts and curved panels to make a hull plate. The hull plate routine would depend on the nut and bolt functionality - how would it invoke them? |
| 16:02.38 | starseek1r | (sorry for being dense...) |
| 16:03.21 | brlcad | it's the "at some level" part |
| 16:03.36 | brlcad | I see that as being a pretty high level as it's almost arbitrary at the low-level |
| 16:04.05 | starseek1r | In other words, a level that doesn't exist yet? |
| 16:04.41 | brlcad | even the existing proc-db's and mk's have little to nothing to do with each other, it would take a lot of effort to make them even *able* to work with each other, and for hardly any large benefit |
| 16:04.51 | brlcad | right, it doesn't exist |
| 16:04.55 | starseek1r | ah |
| 16:04.58 | starseek1r | gotcha |
| 16:04.59 | brlcad | and making it exist is paramount to rewriting most of them |
| 16:05.36 | brlcad | so screw it and integrate them at a higher (probably scripting/plugin) level |
| 16:06.00 | brlcad | where you just need descriptor sheets for what parameters you want to allow, what the various knobs/buttons are, etc |
| 16:06.46 | starseek1r | Ah :-). And in the meantime, in the isolated and unlikely cases where it would be useful now, just throw out a .h file for the function or two needed? |
| 16:07.00 | starseek1r | sees some .h files in there already |
| 16:07.01 | brlcad | it makes a heck of a lot more sense for the images or geometry converters to be integrated into a library than it does the procedural geometry generators |
| 16:08.04 | brlcad | for most of them, "main" is the interface -- you could wrap them up so they all call some given function, but that's trivial |
| 16:09.31 | starseek1r | OK. |
| 16:09.41 | starseek1r | thinks it is making sense. |
| 16:26.25 | kwizart | Frame 0: 357882 rays in 0.81 sec = 443264.77 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 16:26.25 | kwizart | Frame 1: 715764 rays in 1.62 sec = 441760.37 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 16:26.40 | kwizart | moss.pix: answers are RIGHT |
| 16:27.49 | kwizart | world.pix: answers are RIGHT |
| 16:34.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30814 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Switch ell in instead of eto for center wheel curve - no advantage to the eto shape for this wheel design. |
| 16:35.11 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.75.27) | |
| 16:35.28 | andrecastelo | good afternoon fellow cadheads :D |
| 16:35.47 | kwizart | Benchmark results indicate an approximate VGR performance metric of 2561 |
| 16:35.47 | kwizart | Logarithmic VGR metric is 3,41 (natural logarithm is 7,85) |
| 16:36.49 | kwizart | i should have told that I have disabled some CFLAGS ( and enabled ours) |
| 16:37.35 | kwizart | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m5b9bd8aa |
| 16:37.39 | brlcad | kwizart: okay, that's good progress .. now to narrow what causes it |
| 16:38.24 | brlcad | kwizart: -fno-strict-aliasing is needed |
| 16:39.25 | brlcad | otherwise .. problems, that would explain the validation check failures |
| 16:39.46 | brlcad | -O2 ends up doing bad things with strict aliasing on |
| 16:39.50 | kwizart | that is our CFLAGS -O2 -g -pipe -Wall -Wp,-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -fexceptions -fstack-protector --param=ssp-buffer-size=4 -m64 -mtune=generic |
| 16:40.18 | brlcad | I saw that in the log |
| 16:40.29 | brlcad | is that what you used when you got the RIGHT answers? |
| 16:40.30 | kwizart | anythin that conflict with thoses need to be explicitly argued... |
| 16:40.38 | kwizart | no |
| 16:41.07 | brlcad | okay, that's making more sense then |
| 16:41.17 | kwizart | no CFLAGS where used... and i wonder if -fno-strict-aliasing remained disabled |
| 16:41.20 | brlcad | try your flags again then, but keep -fno-strict-aliasing |
| 16:41.47 | brlcad | well with just --enable-all, it would have no optimization, so it's not a problem yet |
| 16:42.00 | brlcad | if you'd added --enable-optimized or -O2 or -O3, it should have failed |
| 16:42.19 | kwizart | well i don't think i will build with optimization... what does add optim ? |
| 16:42.30 | kwizart | (other than cflags) |
| 16:42.35 | brlcad | your CFLAGS turns on optimization |
| 16:43.38 | brlcad | our optimization just adds -O3 right now |
| 16:45.25 | kwizart | we don't distribute package with -O3 for now... maybe a can add a rpm macros to ease the rebuilt of some component (not all probably) that would need -O3 to be more efficient |
| 16:46.20 | kwizart | i will need to figure out how can i split components for the brlcad rpm package.. |
| 16:46.33 | brlcad | kwizart: I'm not saying you want/need O3 :) |
| 16:46.34 | kwizart | with some sub-packages |
| 16:46.39 | brlcad | the difference from O2 is minor |
| 16:46.53 | brlcad | but either O2 or O3 without -fno-strict-aliasing is a problem |
| 16:47.03 | brlcad | any O level |
| 16:47.16 | brlcad | try your CFLAGS but also add -fno-strict-aliasing |
| 16:47.26 | kwizart | yep it build |
| 16:47.29 | brlcad | see if that results in RIGHT |
| 16:48.28 | brlcad | it could still be some odd interaction with _FORTIFY_SOURCE ssp mods, but strict aliasing is a known problem |
| 16:48.39 | kwizart | at least i will need OpenNurbs to be built externally. at least |
| 16:50.02 | brlcad | that probably won't work, we've made opennurbs modifications directly |
| 16:50.31 | brlcad | there are plans to move the changes out of opennurbs, but as it presently stands written, you can think of opennurbs as just another internal library |
| 16:50.40 | kwizart | we can disable the some cflags under certains circumstances - but we discuss that maybe that also x86_64 problem... don't know much |
| 16:50.59 | brlcad | hm? |
| 16:51.02 | kwizart | about OpenNurbs i will probably take a snapshoot from the brlcad release |
| 16:51.18 | brlcad | there shouldn't be any need to disable any of those cflags |
| 16:51.30 | brlcad | and we do work on x86_64, it's regularly tested |
| 16:51.35 | kwizart | i don't know any FOSS project other than brlcad using it for now |
| 16:51.55 | brlcad | yep, and I doubt any would .. it's pretty niche to the CAD industry |
| 16:52.44 | brlcad | maybe blender or avocado at some point, but not likely |
| 17:01.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30815 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: this has happened several times now. make a note that -fno-strict-aliasing is REQUIRED if any level of optimization is enabled (and we're using GCC as we do use and rely on aliasing and type-punning. |
| 17:01.59 | brlcad | fg |
| 17:02.14 | ``Erik | much have for bu list type punning. |
| 17:02.20 | ``Erik | punting, even |
| 17:02.28 | ``Erik | and, uh, s/have/hate/ |
| 17:02.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30816 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: leave it at that |
| 17:03.07 | ``Erik | when I was first doing the move from cake to automake, that bit me bigtime... |
| 17:03.35 | ``Erik | and I presented my argument and the point that many others have done that switch, but lbutler resisted :/ |
| 17:03.42 | brlcad | I've come to appreciate the bu_list style use, but it's the pointer tables that break with -fno-strict-aliasing iirc |
| 17:04.26 | brlcad | related to bu_list's of course |
| 17:06.26 | ``Erik | I appreciated the approach and had been sufficiently beaten down to step back and consider |
| 17:06.40 | ``Erik | there're better ways to accomplish the goal given the limitations |
| 17:06.42 | ``Erik | :/ |
| 17:06.50 | ``Erik | I could not convince lee of that |
| 17:07.46 | brlcad | such as? |
| 17:08.39 | brlcad | bu_lists are pretty damn prevalent ... |
| 17:08.41 | ``Erik | hrm? whichwhat? |
| 17:09.01 | brlcad | "better" ways to accomplish the goal |
| 17:09.03 | ``Erik | old bsd linked list used to be exactly that, new bsd linked list doesn't do that |
| 17:09.16 | ``Erik | instead using container style |
| 17:10.05 | ``Erik | when I was doing the conversion, fbsd had JUST gone through a fairly painful migration from old cast style to new LISt style |
| 17:10.40 | brlcad | it would be painful for us too, quite .. |
| 17:10.48 | brlcad | probably at least 10k instances of use |
| 17:11.08 | brlcad | non-regexable |
| 17:12.07 | ``Erik | tends to be the case |
| 17:12.17 | ``Erik | I tried to fix it back when it was easily fixable |
| 17:12.31 | brlcad | maybe as low as 877 though, if the macro wrappers are consistently used (which they're not) |
| 17:12.35 | ``Erik | lee took a moral stance on it.. I was new to the project and job, so I folded too soon :/ |
| 17:12.55 | ``Erik | "if I knew then what I know now" |
| 17:13.02 | brlcad | meh, it's rather bikeshed |
| 17:13.22 | brlcad | it's just an optimization based on a false assumption that C allows for |
| 17:13.31 | ``Erik | i'd disagree |
| 17:14.02 | brlcad | so you can feel strongly for or against it, but it's not like it's inherintly right or wrong imo |
| 17:14.20 | ``Erik | it's an optimization based on assumption that every developer is fully aware of the ugly implifications of the reprecussions that the dirty cheats C allows for |
| 17:14.47 | ``Erik | I mean, a fistful of guru C coders? SURE, bits is bits, we know how it all hammers out |
| 17:15.16 | ``Erik | the minute you throw in someone who isn't qualified to chum among the "greybeard" gurus... uh, we get little hard to track issues |
| 17:15.29 | brlcad | eh, that's not disagreeing with what I said -- except maybe that it's a "false assumption" |
| 17:15.42 | brlcad | i'm saying it's false *because* C allows for it |
| 17:15.56 | brlcad | not saying that it should or should not be used |
| 17:16.14 | brlcad | THAT is what makes it bikeshed -- if it's to be resolved otherwise, C should be modified |
| 17:16.20 | ``Erik | it's not illegal, it's dangerous :D I think we're in violent agreement |
| 17:18.22 | ``Erik | I'm a bsd junkie, I watched them expunge themselves of exactly this, I think they did the right thing in more orless the right way... *shrug* with the move from fbsd 5 to fbsd 6 iirc |
| 17:19.25 | kwizart | ok well that was my bad - it seems to work with our cflags and -fno-common -fno-strict-aliasing |
| 17:20.19 | brlcad | it's just so petty, though .. I mean say you do the whole conversion, spend the days/weeks/months refactoring hundreds to thousands of lines of code .. and *don't* actually inject new bugs .. you basically end up where you started |
| 17:20.34 | brlcad | i mean "maybe" with a percent or two optimization gain at *best* |
| 17:20.37 | ``Erik | NEEDS -fno-strict-aliasing, for exactly the thing brlcad and myself are talking about here |
| 17:20.59 | brlcad | kwizart: you shouldn't need (or care) about -fno-common on linux |
| 17:23.43 | kwizart | Elapsed compilation time: 14 hours, 56 minutes, 37 seconds |
| 17:24.01 | kwizart | ^^ what does it means: |
| 17:24.03 | kwizart | Elapsed time since configuration: 20 minutes, 22 seconds |
| 17:24.23 | brlcad | it means your clock probably recently crossed midnight |
| 17:25.29 | brlcad | or just that you started building 14 hours ago |
| 17:25.37 | kwizart | 19h25 |
| 17:25.38 | brlcad | when you first ran make |
| 17:26.10 | brlcad | it's based off of the build stamp in include/conf and if you've not ran make clean, that'll just keep getting bigger |
| 17:26.18 | kwizart | start building20min ago , unless it took distcc content... it is recreated each time... |
| 17:26.24 | kwizart | with rpmbuild -ba |
| 17:26.48 | brlcad | reiterates .. it's based off of the build stamp in include/conf and if you've not ran make clean, the compilation time will just increase |
| 17:27.34 | brlcad | *or* maybe you're pulling from a source tarball where there's a date stamp already in there |
| 17:27.58 | brlcad | cat include/conf/DATE |
| 17:29.01 | kwizart | "Wed Apr 23 04:21:07 EDT 2008" |
| 17:29.13 | kwizart | date : jeu avr 24 19:29:05 CEST 2008 |
| 17:29.19 | kwizart | get it |
| 17:29.31 | brlcad | yeah, that's a build stamp from the source tarball |
| 17:29.42 | brlcad | it doesn't know it's out of date |
| 17:36.34 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=thedawn@202.63.233.61) | |
| 17:39.52 | ``Erik | so, brlcad,what do you think of hoisting proc-db functionality into a lib with a big wrapper executable? |
| 17:40.09 | brlcad | thinks ``Erik missed a bunch of backlog |
| 17:40.18 | ``Erik | *scroll* |
| 17:54.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30817 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/Makefile.am: |
| 17:54.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: make HOST, PATH, USER, and DATE depend on brlcad_config.h so that the values |
| 17:54.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: reset every time configure is run. this way the date stamp and build system |
| 17:54.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: should match whomever is performing the build for source dist builders instead |
| 17:54.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: of the maintainer that made the distribution tarball. the downside is more |
| 17:54.16 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: frequent rebuilds of everything for internal devs. |
| 18:03.46 | starseek1r | In C, how do I generate the name of a function to call and then call it? (e.g., say I have draw1, draw2 and draw3 defined and I want to do a for loop for i = 1 to three call draw$i? |
| 18:05.29 | brlcad | you would usually use macros, have defined call-table mappings, or use dynamic loading |
| 18:05.40 | brlcad | what are you actually trying to do? |
| 18:07.40 | brlcad | unless you have dozens to iterate over, you'd probably should just call draw1(); draw2(); draw3(); |
| 18:10.21 | starseek1r | The idea is there may be an unknown (to tire) number of possible wheel or tread styles defined |
| 18:12.50 | starseek1r | I want to specify on the command line -t 8 and have tire attempt to draw tread pattern 8. I'd like the routine that attempts to draw different patterns to be generic, and not need editing each time a new tread is defined |
| 18:15.15 | brlcad | they're not unknown in code, though -- they have to be in there |
| 18:16.04 | brlcad | with that specific example, you could have an array of function pointers and -t 8 would give you the 8th function pointer |
| 18:16.39 | starseek1r | heh - bob suggested that too :-) Could you recommend a good tutorial/example on using function pointers in C? |
| 18:16.48 | brlcad | google? :) |
| 18:16.53 | starseek1r | k :-) |
| 18:16.56 | brlcad | i'm sure there are hundreds |
| 18:21.45 | pacman87 | finally caught up reading |
| 18:21.52 | pacman87 | been really busy this week |
| 18:22.30 | pacman87 | (08:09:24) brlcad: announcement formulation |
| 18:22.30 | pacman87 | (08:10:02) brlcad: explaining what these projects are in more layman terms |
| 18:22.30 | pacman87 | (08:10:33) brlcad: pacman87: yours is "Implementing Solid of Revolution and Sweep Primitives" |
| 18:23.47 | pacman87 | do i need to change anything? |
| 18:28.24 | starseek1r | brlcad: Would it be bad form to stick a libtread.c and libtread.h file in proc-db to hold tread definitions? |
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| 18:32.22 | brlcad | pacman87: nope |
| 18:32.30 | brlcad | just a nod that it sounded okay with you |
| 18:32.39 | brlcad | but too late now, the announcements went out ;) |
| 18:48.06 | kwizart | http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/taskinfo?taskID=581443 |
| 18:48.15 | kwizart | ok still try to build ppc and ppc64 |
| 18:53.43 | brlcad | woot |
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| 20:41.47 | prasad_ | hates semaphores |
| 20:43.52 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30818 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Replace lots of individual commands by a single loop for tread extrusion. |
| 20:46.57 | starseeker | loupci: Thanks, i'm good (sorry, getting the hang of irssi) |
| 20:54.20 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30819 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Oops - fix the conditional checking for tread insertion. |
| 21:14.15 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096782279.dsl.bell.ca) | |
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| 22:05.47 | andrecastelo | hey everyone |
| 23:50.54 | yukonbob | hey andrecastelo |
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| 00:16.49 | thing0 | hey yall |
| 00:19.59 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@124-169-233-209.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
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| 00:39.28 | brlcad | that's a lot of things |
| 00:43.05 | starseeker_ | anybody else seeing this build failure? make[3]: *** No rule to make target `../../../brlcad/include/brlcad_config.h', needed by `HOST'. Stop. |
| 00:44.03 | brlcad | it'd be the change made earlier today |
| 00:44.13 | starseeker_ | diffs |
| 00:51.14 | starseeker_ | You mean changing the dnl message?? That can't be right... |
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| 01:41.20 | brlcad | no.. |
| 01:44.21 | andrecastelo | good night guys |
| 01:44.23 | andrecastelo | cya later |
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| 01:53.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30820 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/Makefile.am: deja-vu -- try using the top_builddir instead of top_srcdir for out-of-dir builds |
| 01:54.02 | thing0 | blackbox on windows |
| 01:54.04 | thing0 | ;) |
| 01:54.06 | thing0 | happier now |
| 01:54.07 | thing0 | hehe |
| 01:55.27 | starseeker_ | good catch - thanks brlcad |
| 01:55.57 | starseeker_ | supposes he should quit being an oddball and build in src... |
| 02:26.58 | brlcad | starseeker: not really a good catch - not even clear that it fixes the problem. if the build suddenly breaks, you should look at recent changes/commits (which you could/should be paying attention to regardless..) to see what might be the cause for a given error |
| 02:27.17 | brlcad | building out of dir is useful for catching build issues |
| 02:27.55 | brlcad | in this particular case, though, it could just as easily be both top_srcdir and top_builddir |
| 02:27.55 | brlcad | meaning another solution needs to be found |
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| 04:55.58 | brlcad | painstakingly finishes importing and updating most of the wiki help pages |
| 04:56.51 | yukonbob | passes brlcad a tasty beverage... |
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| 05:49.54 | brlcad | FYI: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Expectations and http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Checklist |
| 06:01.42 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-106-69.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 06:18.28 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
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| 08:05.57 | yukonbob | hey clock_ |
| 08:06.22 | yukonbob | re: "procdural grass" in gallery -- can anybody tell me a bit about those renderings? |
| 08:06.52 | yukonbob | *"procedural grass" |
| 08:11.46 | clock_ | yukonbob: hey |
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| 11:45.15 | starseeker_ | scrolls back, sees he somehow didn't spot the earlier Makefile.am commit, and turns mildly red... |
| 11:59.14 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.75.27) | |
| 11:59.35 | andrecastelo | good morning :D |
| 12:01.47 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 12:02.49 | hippieindamakin8 | hey yukonbob |
| 12:04.34 | andrecastelo | hey hippieindamakin8 |
| 12:04.55 | hippieindamakin8 | hey andrecastelo hows it going ? |
| 12:05.13 | andrecastelo | i'm fine, you ? :D |
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| 13:21.42 | ``Erik | EVERYBODY DANCE! |
| 13:24.32 | clock_ | "In 2005 the Italian authorities had issued warrants for the arrest of 22 agents of the US Central Intelligence Agency in connection with the abduction. |
| 13:24.35 | clock_ | " |
| 13:24.55 | clock_ | Hmm so whose government sponsors terrorism here? |
| 13:25.26 | clock_ | I think Bush should visit Guantanamo for this and have some waterboarding |
| 13:28.13 | ``Erik | http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/M35A2-6X6-MILITARY-TRUCK_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ80765QQihZ003QQitemZ130215375180QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW |
| 13:28.20 | ``Erik | db/m35.g seems a little... crude :D |
| 13:32.04 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-209.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 13:35.22 | starseeker | ``Erik - so how long will it take you to fix it? ;-) |
| 13:35.51 | ``Erik | I d'no, how long will it take you to update the stuff so I can go tell everyone it's fixed? :D |
| 13:36.06 | starseeker | heh |
| 13:36.49 | starseeker | there must be an old m35 on display around here somewhere |
| 13:43.45 | clock_ | do you use m35s instead of the Utah Teapot? |
| 14:01.31 | ``Erik | does :) |
| 14:01.54 | ``Erik | takes a while to heat the water up, needs LOTS of tea bags, but one will last a whole da |
| 14:01.56 | ``Erik | day |
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| 14:09.38 | starseeker | wades into rt looking to add -k to other lighting models |
| 14:11.37 | ``Erik | other lighting models, or other front ends? |
| 14:11.50 | ``Erik | rtedge would benefit from it, I'd imagine, but could be... tricky O.o :D |
| 14:17.22 | starseeker | surface normals was my first target |
| 14:18.19 | starseeker | heh - somehow "I'm going to go make an M35 of tea now" just doesn't have the same ring |
| 14:19.09 | ``Erik | yeah, but just imagine a bunch of guys standing around going "CHUG! CHUG! CHUG!" |
| 14:25.41 | starseeker | hmm - a lot of the cutting plane logic for -k seems to be in colorview and view_init... |
| 14:26.33 | hippieindamakin8 | andrecastelo, almost done with my endsemester exams. :) trying to model some stuff rt now :) |
| 14:36.37 | starseeker | 's first guess is that there needs to be come sort of "common" prep for all lighting models, rather than just in colorview... |
| 14:40.40 | ``Erik | boogies to 80's pop |
| 14:40.55 | ``Erik | had to backspace to change 'poop' to 'pop' O.o hehehe |
| 14:46.02 | clock_ | Mika, The New Queen of Poop? |
| 14:47.20 | ``Erik | heh, was "til tuesday", actually :D random shuffle, pheer |
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| 15:42.34 | starseeker | OK, hmm - adding the ap->a_hit = colorview line to the light model #2 prep didn't change anything, for good or bad. |
| 15:42.40 | starseeker | must dig deeper... |
| 15:56.53 | starseeker | successfully breaks surface normals... |
| 15:57.24 | ``Erik | sweet, we can put "support for surface abnormals" int he news file D: |
| 15:57.25 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:00.10 | clock_ | surface abnormals? |
| 16:00.23 | clock_ | oh it's like the normals are deviated, haha :) |
| 16:00.49 | starseeker | thinks he knows what is going on, just not sure yet how to fix it... |
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| 16:01.35 | ``Erik | pheer my stupid puns ;D |
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| 16:21.57 | andrecastelo | folks, gtg |
| 16:21.58 | andrecastelo | cya laer |
| 16:22.00 | andrecastelo | later* |
| 16:22.02 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 16:22.14 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30821 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/view.c: Enable -k flag with surface normal lighting |
| 16:24.02 | starseeker | Woooooooot |
| 16:24.32 | starseeker | might have fixed global illumination too, if it was busted before - not sure. Checked now and working |
| 16:24.41 | starseeker | As for rtedge... |
| 16:24.51 | starseeker | Crud |
| 16:24.55 | starseeker | not working yet |
| 16:25.29 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 16:25.50 | starseeker | isn't even sure it can process the k option |
| 16:26.04 | starseeker | doesn't show up in the help |
| 16:26.48 | starseeker | not sure whether to class -k support in rtedge not being there as a bug or a feature request |
| 16:27.14 | ``Erik | meh, classify is as a TODO entry :D |
| 16:28.16 | starseeker | ``Erik is that fix worth a news line? |
| 16:28.38 | ``Erik | uhmmmmm, probably? |
| 16:28.51 | starseeker | will assume it is and can fix later if need be... |
| 16:29.24 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30822 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS NEWS): update BUGS and NEWS files for -k surface normals fix |
| 16:29.29 | ``Erik | <-- lets brlcad handle that, throws stuff in as a rough draft and stands back to see if it gets struck or reworded :) |
| 16:33.24 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30823 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: add a couple things I plan on doing |
| 16:34.56 | ``Erik | wonders if should have left "totally flip out like a ninja and kill everyone" out of that commit |
| 16:36.58 | ``Erik | (pheer http://www.realultimatepower.net/ ) |
| 17:03.53 | *** part/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@203.59.137.210) | |
| 17:08.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30824 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Gort! Metaball Barata Nikto! |
| 17:35.56 | MinuteElectron | oops |
| 17:36.02 | MinuteElectron | i promised to look at recpatcha |
| 17:36.04 | MinuteElectron | but forgot |
| 17:36.08 | MinuteElectron | now seams like a good tiem |
| 17:42.47 | starseeker | awards ``Erik the least informative commit message of the year award... |
| 17:43.53 | starseeker | unless metaballs need to be stoped from destroying the world one laser blast at a time... |
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| 18:03.42 | MinuteElectron | well that didn't get anywhere... |
| 18:04.11 | ``Erik | well, actually, yeah |
| 18:04.22 | ``Erik | that's exactly what needs to happen |
| 18:04.24 | ``Erik | ... |
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| 19:12.37 | PrezzKennedy | takes a gov't lunchbreak |
| 19:12.46 | PrezzKennedy | won't be back til next Thursday |
| 19:19.50 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 19:20.09 | ``Erik | pulls up the reg's to see if he'd been reading the wrong lunch break duration |
| 19:29.09 | PrezzKennedy | you're right! |
| 19:29.14 | PrezzKennedy | won't be back until Friday |
| 19:33.22 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
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| 19:57.53 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30825 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add first cut at different tire extrusion - use tire -t 1 and tire -t 2 to see the differences. |
| 20:16.19 | ``Erik | 185/60r18 |
| 20:25.13 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-209.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 20:55.03 | ``Erik | so, uh |
| 20:55.06 | ``Erik | this one time, at band camp |
| 21:01.54 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: any insights? |
| 21:02.04 | brlcad | did you see the double-verify it's doing? |
| 21:02.42 | brlcad | starseeker: awesome -- was that just copied from the other section for the default lighting mode? |
| 21:02.52 | starseeker | almost |
| 21:03.13 | starseeker | There were a couple of commands pertaining to setting normals that needed to be added |
| 21:03.35 | starseeker | got a really... odd render on the first attempt :-) |
| 21:04.48 | brlcad | commands? |
| 21:04.57 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-209.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 21:05.07 | starseeker | setting of normals, I believe |
| 21:05.16 | starseeker | it's almost a straight copy |
| 21:05.24 | brlcad | what i'm getting at is that I was wondering if the two sections could be combined |
| 21:05.29 | brlcad | into a function that they just both call |
| 21:05.32 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 21:05.39 | brlcad | since there are 6 other lighting modes :) |
| 21:05.47 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: no, I spent about half an hour poking about it; but i don't see any reason it's not working. i think there's somethign wrong with the drupal installation, somewhere along the lines things started to get mucked up. |
| 21:05.49 | brlcad | and things like rtedge |
| 21:06.33 | starseeker | possibly - there are two different "prep" commands for different lighting modes |
| 21:07.01 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: really? what makes you think it's the drupal install -- I would guess first just a bug either in drupal or in their captcha plugin |
| 21:07.07 | brlcad | and more likely the latter |
| 21:07.45 | starseeker | light model 0 calls colorview, and apparently surface normals uses viewit |
| 21:08.02 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: hm, in fact that gives me an idea of something else to try -- only using recaptcha instead of allowing the default captcha .. didn't think to try that earlier but that could help pinpoint things |
| 21:08.05 | starseeker | Ah - I need to add a couple RT_HIT_NORMAL calls to the viewit version |
| 21:09.40 | starseeker | from what ``Erik said, rtedge is kind of its own beast |
| 21:10.03 | ``Erik | viewedge.c, yo |
| 21:10.15 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: ok, tell me if you have any luck |
| 21:10.15 | starseeker | is looking at now |
| 21:13.31 | brlcad | starseeker: it is, there are view*.c files for each of the raytrace apps |
| 21:13.39 | brlcad | that's their entire guts for the most part |
| 21:13.51 | brlcad | so the hooks are *very* similar to get into everyone |
| 21:13.55 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: will do |
| 21:15.22 | starseeker | finds handle_main_ray |
| 21:15.31 | starseeker | erm... |
| 21:16.04 | brlcad | don't go by names, have to go by the logic flow |
| 21:16.17 | ``Erik | viewedge.c is extra special cuz I did horrible things in it :D |
| 21:20.46 | starseeker | will have to dig a little deeper to figure out where the cutting plane logic should go in rtedge's code |
| 21:30.00 | starseeker | Hmm - lighting modes 4,5 and 6 segfault with the -k option |
| 21:30.06 | ``Erik | awesome |
| 21:30.14 | ``Erik | wanders home for dinner, beer and scifi |
| 21:30.22 | starseeker | is headed that way too |
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| 22:19.53 | ``Erik | ahhhhh |
| 22:22.05 | ``Erik | fix your busted arsed tires yet? :D |
| 22:23.02 | ``Erik | fixed yet, even |
| 22:23.32 | ``Erik | amusing that my guessed one just had a tiny sliver of overlap :) |
| 22:57.34 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.75.27) | |
| 23:00.24 | andrecastelo | good evening folks |
| 23:00.29 | ``Erik | howdy |
| 23:01.39 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik |
| 23:02.55 | ``Erik | how's it going? |
| 23:06.47 | andrecastelo | i'm fine, you ? |
| 23:07.41 | ``Erik | chugging along, happy it's weekend O.o |
| 23:07.46 | andrecastelo | me too :D |
| 23:07.57 | andrecastelo | though i sill have end semester exams next week |
| 23:08.19 | andrecastelo | but on a related note, should we set up some communication schedule for gsoc ? |
| 23:08.41 | ``Erik | uhm, up to you, I assume you'll be asking loads of questions and sending patches |
| 23:09.15 | ``Erik | and I'm on irc pretty much all the time, read the backlog, just tend to ignore it over the weekend (and catch up monday or tuesday) |
| 23:09.44 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-209.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 23:10.08 | andrecastelo | so i guess there will be no problem, i'm on irc pretty much whenever i'm at home (which is practically 75% of the time) |
| 23:11.01 | ``Erik | *shrug* I'm all up for just playing it by ear and if someone isn't terribly happy, then we can figure out if we need a formalized schedule of any form |
| 23:11.36 | ``Erik | so have you made a decision about having some kind of blog or wiki status page yet? |
| 23:16.18 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i think i'll create a blog to report progress |
| 23:16.38 | ``Erik | cool |
| 23:16.38 | andrecastelo | any problem ? |
| 23:16.45 | ``Erik | nope? just curious :) |
| 23:16.49 | andrecastelo | hm ok :D |
| 23:17.05 | andrecastelo | i did migrate my proposal to the wiki as a design document, though |
| 23:18.17 | ``Erik | yeah, saw it |
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| 23:38.33 | ``Erik | damnit, screwed up my cvs roots somehow |
| 23:52.58 | ``Erik | *snrkt* http://www.collegehumor.com/picture:1802197 |
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| 01:56.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30826 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Take a try at making tire shaping more robust |
| 01:57.23 | starseeker_ | ``Erik: OK, not ready for thickness stuff yet, but take a stab at your weird European tire sizes. |
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| 03:01.04 | ``Erik | heh, was just a random size, not my fault that russia actually uses it |
| 04:16.38 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 04:21.06 | Axman6 | brlcad: yt? getting an error on OS X, and i can't remember if it's the same as what i was getting before (i installed the latest X11 update yesterday, and wanted to see if those issues had been fixed) |
| 04:22.18 | Axman6 | the error is as folows, for anyone interested... |
| 04:22.19 | Axman6 | Initializing and backgrounding, please wait...The process has forked and you cannot use this CoreFoundation functionality safely. You MUST exec(). |
| 04:22.23 | Axman6 | Break on __THE_PROCESS_HAS_FORKED_AND_YOU_CANNOT_USE_THIS_COREFOUNDATION_FUNCTIONALITY___YOU_MUST_EXEC__() to debug. |
| 04:22.46 | Axman6 | and the two lines, starting at "The process has forkedâ¦" are repeated about 6 times |
| 04:31.45 | yukonbob | Axman6: what is generating this error? |
| 04:31.58 | Axman6 | mged with no flags |
| 04:32.57 | yukonbob | hrmm.. |
| 04:33.49 | yukonbob | what's the flag to keep mged from detaching? (ie: run in foreground)? |
| 05:07.31 | Axman6 | -d? i'll have a look... |
| 05:39.27 | Axman6 | -c. and that works, but i don't get the full gui :( |
| 05:48.39 | yukonbob | -c == classic, iirc |
| 05:48.58 | yukonbob | (/me doesn't have BRL-CAD installed atm) :P |
| 05:53.48 | Axman6 | heh |
| 06:28.28 | brlcad | Axman6: that's fixed on head, should be fixed in the 7.12.2 release |
| 06:28.37 | brlcad | haven't put up binaries yet, that's this weekend |
| 06:29.06 | brlcad | otherwise, mged -f should do the trick |
| 06:36.46 | Axman6 | ooo, mged -f works fine with the version i have now :) |
| 06:37.22 | Axman6 | which is 7.10.2 apparently. i'll try installing 7.12.0 |
| 06:39.19 | Axman6 | is the aqua-tk version any good? |
| 06:40.46 | brlcad | there isn't an aqua-tk version of BRL-CAD |
| 06:40.53 | brlcad | at least not yet |
| 06:42.05 | Axman6 | hmm, ok. well configure script seems to imply there is one. |
| 06:42.28 | brlcad | how so? |
| 06:43.12 | Axman6 | --enable-aquatk-build Use Aqua windowing system on Mac OS X (default=no) |
| 06:43.38 | brlcad | ah, right -- it's because that's something actively being worked on ;) |
| 06:43.58 | brlcad | but there's still never been a release to date yet, few unresolved issues |
| 06:44.06 | Axman6 | ah, ok :) |
| 06:45.40 | Axman6 | doesn't seem to like --enable-64bit-build on my system. not that it's important though, it'd just be nice to have _something_ that was actually 64-bit on here, that wasn't Xcode, or chess |
| 06:49.26 | brlcad | 10.4? |
| 06:49.56 | brlcad | 10.4 doesn't provide 64-bit libs for a few critical libraries, like X11 |
| 06:50.55 | Axman6 | 10.5 |
| 06:53.45 | Axman6 | looks like all the X11 libraries are 64-bit here. might be building against something from macports that it shouldn't |
| 06:57.58 | brlcad | hm or something entirely different |
| 07:00.38 | brlcad | i've only built on 10.5 remoteley and it merely required a few petty patches be applied in addition to the configure flags |
| 07:01.00 | Axman6 | on this very machine ;) |
| 07:02.12 | brlcad | heh, right .. the names sometimes blend :) |
| 07:02.23 | Axman6 | s'ok :) |
| 07:02.55 | brlcad | yeah, your build worked cleanly for me -- even graphical mged via remote X |
| 07:02.56 | yukonbob | anybody mind if I ask an OT nm(1) question? |
| 07:03.20 | brlcad | which at the time basically just pointed at there being a problem with apple's X11 server still |
| 07:03.32 | brlcad | does nm |
| 07:03.47 | brlcad | s/nm/not mind/ |
| 07:04.18 | yukonbob | :) |
| 07:05.22 | yukonbob | q: should a library have unresolved symbols? It seems obvious to me the answer is "no", but I've got one that's _full_ of unresolved symbols (is related to MesaLib being updated to 7.x on my NetBSD machine) |
| 07:05.36 | brlcad | it can have unresolved symbols |
| 07:05.57 | brlcad | ld tries to resolve them at run-time |
| 07:06.06 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 07:06.14 | brlcad | hence the ld.so.conf paths and LD_LIBRARY_PATH |
| 07:06.52 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 07:06.57 | Axman6 | urgh, benchmark fails. pretty badly |
| 07:07.22 | Axman6 | i'll try out 7.12.3 i guess |
| 07:07.25 | Axman6 | if i can? |
| 07:07.29 | brlcad | ideally, libs are fully resolved/resolvable -- frameworks with dylibs attempt to provide fully resolved libs for example |
| 07:09.12 | brlcad | Axman6: how is benchmark failing |
| 07:09.23 | brlcad | (see one of the log file) |
| 07:09.36 | Axman6 | +++++ sphflake |
| 07:09.36 | Axman6 | RAYTRACE ERROR |
| 07:09.36 | Axman6 | sphflake.pix: No such file or directory |
| 07:09.36 | Axman6 | sphflake.pix: BENCHMARK COMPARISON FAILURE |
| 07:09.39 | Axman6 | :| |
| 07:10.01 | brlcad | what's near the bottom of moss.log |
| 07:10.49 | Axman6 | ah, never mind. guess it was just make benchmark that was having problems |
| 07:11.06 | brlcad | hm? |
| 07:11.17 | Axman6 | the `benchmark` command seems to be working |
| 07:11.21 | brlcad | that would be a bog if true |
| 07:11.30 | brlcad | a bug even |
| 07:11.39 | Axman6 | not sure what i did wrong, but i'm sure it's my problem, not yours ;) |
| 07:12.36 | brlcad | heh, okay |
| 07:12.51 | brlcad | the end of the log file would stil gue u; |
| 07:13.57 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:14.15 | Axman6 | dyld: Symbol not found: __cg_png_create_info_struct Referenced from: /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/ImageIO Expected in: /Users/Axman/compiled-projects/brlcad-7.12.0/src/other/libpng/.libs/libpng.1.dylib |
| 07:15.08 | brlcad | ah, right .. keep forgetting about that problem |
| 07:15.19 | Axman6 | uh, "dyld: warning, DYLD_ setting caused circular dependency in /usr/X11/lib/libGL.1.dylib |
| 07:15.23 | brlcad | the build fix is to just --disable-png |
| 07:15.29 | brlcad | s/build/quick/ |
| 07:15.31 | Axman6 | was before that, should've stuck that in too |
| 07:15.45 | brlcad | too many typos and forgettings, I must need to reboot |
| 07:16.04 | Axman6 | s/reboot/sleep |
| 07:18.30 | Axman6 | heh, there's no google sketchup importer is there? |
| 07:21.00 | Axman6 | hmm, mged won't run now. http://pastie.caboo.se/187167 |
| 07:22.35 | brlcad | yeah, that's trying to use the system libs |
| 07:22.38 | brlcad | for tcl/tk |
| 07:22.45 | brlcad | that's nfg for brl-cad guild |
| 07:22.45 | Axman6 | anything i can do to fix that? |
| 07:23.26 | brlcad | --enable-tcl --enable-tk |
| 07:24.08 | brlcad | suggests reading INSTALL if you're not already, it's not generic |
| 07:24.10 | Axman6 | cheers |
| 08:34.22 | louipc | clear |
| 08:34.26 | louipc | oops |
| 08:35.04 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669531.dsl.bell.ca) | |
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| 12:28.37 | ``Erik | hum |
| 12:28.45 | starseeker_ | hmm? |
| 12:29.23 | ``Erik | I seem to have filled up a hard drive and lost one of my miniscreen cookies |
| 12:29.32 | starseeker_ | ow |
| 12:29.53 | ``Erik | gonna try to get it back :D |
| 12:31.12 | ``Erik | even if it involved writing a kernel module O.o |
| 12:31.30 | starseeker_ | eeep |
| 12:52.53 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30827 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add size-related scaling for thicknesses and an option to override the tire thickness. |
| 12:53.37 | starseeker_ | OK ``Erik. if you can spare a sec from kernel hacking see what the next way to bust it is |
| 12:57.38 | ``Erik | that'd involve compiling it hehehe |
| 12:58.27 | ``Erik | huh |
| 12:58.45 | ``Erik | seems my process has went and actually corrupted itself slightly |
| 13:01.25 | starseeker_ | ow |
| 13:02.00 | starseeker_ | what'd you DO to it?? |
| 13:05.35 | ``Erik | uhmmm, actually, i'm not sure now, it might be fine and I'm just getting a lamed up symbol table :) |
| 13:06.29 | ``Erik | it's been running for 127 days and I may've upgraded the software without restarting hte process... O.o |
| 13:06.31 | starseeker_ | would probably reboot in disgust... |
| 13:07.07 | ``Erik | yes, linux and windows weenies share that kneejerk reaction :D |
| 13:07.32 | starseeker_ | can live with a reboot every 127 days... |
| 13:07.45 | starseeker_ | helps to test the bootstrap process of booting... |
| 13:08.42 | ``Erik | heh, might explain why linux starts doing really weird things around 200 days but bsd can stay solid over 1000 (seen sun up at 1400) |
| 13:08.59 | ``Erik | too busy testing the boot process to test the reliability aspect O.o |
| 13:09.01 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:09.36 | starseeker_ | <snort> If you want uptimes like that Debian stable might be a good place to start... |
| 13:09.54 | ``Erik | got one, kernel still pukes itself up |
| 13:10.18 | ``Erik | I wonder of that new 'pslice' thing linux has will get some progress in the reliability direction going |
| 13:10.33 | starseeker_ | dunno |
| 13:10.43 | ``Erik | I thought about implementing that for fbsd many years ago, but didn't know nearly enough about the kernel guts at the time to jump on it |
| 13:11.04 | ``Erik | and have changed my views on upgrading since |
| 13:11.30 | starseeker_ | figures for the vast majority of home users in the world the POWER will fail at least once within 200 days. |
| 13:12.57 | starseeker_ | How do you fault test for an "after 200 days" bug anyway? |
| 13:12.57 | ``Erik | (any upgrade/change that might disrupt service doesn't get blindly applied, I read changelogs and security bullitens and decide based on my usage) |
| 13:13.03 | starseeker_ | cool |
| 13:13.52 | ``Erik | things go "spooky", like I've seen a couple instances where load goes skyrocketting while cpu usage is low, context switches are low, interrupts are low... |
| 13:14.06 | ``Erik | until it crashes |
| 13:14.17 | starseeker_ | scowls at Amazon's Lisp in Small Pieces listings and wonders why ALL the used/new offerings other than Amazon's own are either the same price or MORE... |
| 13:14.19 | ``Erik | or completely siezes and gets the big red button treatment |
| 13:14.33 | starseeker_ | Hmm. |
| 13:15.02 | starseeker_ | Need good logging to be able to do anything with a situation like that... |
| 13:15.47 | ``Erik | of course, that I have the data to spot that behavior instead of just saying "it crashed and got rebooted" is not normal :D |
| 13:16.04 | ``Erik | it's "enterprisy", but good "enterprisy" |
| 13:18.47 | starseeker_ | heh |
| 13:40.51 | ``Erik | blargh, *surrender* :/ |
| 13:41.28 | ``Erik | I'm either guessing a bad 50 meg range or something's just screwey |
| 14:02.39 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30828 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add option to specify rim width |
| 14:03.48 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.205.225) | |
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| 14:40.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30829 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Change default tire size to something a little more common. |
| 14:43.04 | brlcad | he's on a roll |
| 14:51.17 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-209.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 14:53.30 | ``Erik | only as long as his tires come out round, unlike that one I made yesterday :D |
| 15:56.13 | starseeker_ | ``Erik: You want round tires? Boy, you're demanding |
| 15:56.18 | starseeker_ | :-P |
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| 16:07.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30830 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/str.c: |
| 16:07.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: only warn about the string truncation if debug is turned as it is indeed |
| 16:07.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: entirely valid for the src string in strlcpy to be longer than size. this check |
| 16:07.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: was mainly added because there was a slew of strncpy code migrated over and the |
| 16:07.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: truncation by the new strlcpy wasn't intentional (or desirable). there are |
| 16:07.28 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: undoubtedly more callers that need to be weeded out. |
| 16:08.04 | *** part/#brlcad illethal (n=oden@c-71-200-221-159.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | |
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| 16:30.05 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30831 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): the start of consolidating and long-term efforts to eliminate library globals. add a globals.c source with the malloc.c globals for starters. |
| 16:34.47 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30832 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (globals.c malloc.c vls.c): move bu_vls_message and bu_strdup_message to globals.c |
| 16:36.06 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@203.59.137.210) | |
| 16:40.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30833 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (globals.c ispar.c parallel.c): move bu_pid_of_initiating_thread from ispar.c to globals.c |
| 16:46.39 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30834 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (bomb.c globals.c): move bu_setjmp_valid and bu_jmpbuf from bomb.c to globals.c |
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| 18:10.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30835 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add second tread pattern, enable selection of pattern types at command line. |
| 18:50.07 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.227.98) | |
| 19:00.05 | brlcad | hey paul |
| 19:00.26 | csanyipal | brlcad: hey |
| 19:01.16 | csanyipal | sean: hey |
| 19:01.32 | brlcad | how goes it |
| 19:01.59 | brlcad | fyi, that write error you reported "should" be gone with the latest release |
| 19:02.00 | csanyipal | brlcad: Thank you, not so good. |
| 19:02.07 | brlcad | ah, sorry to hear that |
| 19:02.51 | csanyipal | brlcad: I have reinstalled my Debian system and must to reinstall brl-cad too. |
| 19:04.20 | csanyipal | brlcad: and the same error occure again, when I try to Raytrace the mug. |
| 19:05.14 | brlcad | the bu_log error? |
| 19:05.26 | csanyipal | brlcad: I have installed the brl-cad from the tarball, downloaded from the Sourceforge.net |
| 19:05.42 | csanyipal | brlcad: yes, the bu_log error. |
| 19:07.35 | csanyipal | brlcad: I edit the .bash_profile: export FB_FILE=/dev/Xl |
| 19:07.46 | csanyipal | brlcad: but that not help. |
| 19:08.52 | brlcad | yeah, that's not related |
| 19:09.02 | brlcad | what does binfo report? |
| 19:09.04 | csanyipal | brlcad: mybe must I to install something more, but I can't remember what. |
| 19:10.05 | csanyipal | brlcad: bu_version=[BRL-CAD Release 7.10.4 The BRL-CAD Utility Library Thu Oct 25 16:34:31 EDT 2007, Compilation 1 morrison@xoff.arl.army.mil:/usr/brlcad/rel-7.10.4 ] bn_version=[BRL-CAD Release 7.10.4 The BRL-CAD Numerical Computation Library Thu Oct 25 16:34:31 EDT 2007, Compilation 1 morrison@xoff.arl.army.mil:/usr/brlcad/rel-7.10.4 ] rt_version=[BRL-CAD Re |
| 19:10.05 | csanyipal | lease 7.10.4 The BRL-CAD Ray-Tracing Library Thu Oct 25 16:34:31 EDT 2007, Compilation 1 morrison@xoff.arl.army.mil:/usr/brlcad/rel-7.10.4 ] fb_version=[BRL-CAD Release 7.10.4 The BRL-CAD Framebuffer Library Thu Oct 25 16:34:31 EDT 2007, Compilation 1 morrison@xoff.arl.army.mil:/usr/brlcad/rel-7.10.4 ] |
| 19:10.26 | brlcad | that's still 7.10.4 .. try the latest release |
| 19:10.31 | brlcad | 7.12.2 |
| 19:11.00 | brlcad | was released last week |
| 19:11.16 | brlcad | or even better, try latest svn so I can try fixes live if you run into problems |
| 19:11.18 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 19:11.19 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 19:11.22 | csanyipal | brlcad: From where to download it? |
| 19:11.34 | csanyipal | brlcad: OK |
| 19:12.18 | csanyipal | brlcad: Thank you! |
| 19:13.24 | csanyipal | brlcad: I go now to obtain the latest svn.. |
| 19:13.50 | brlcad | great |
| 19:13.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30836 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgview.c: don't need to manually null-terminate with bu_strlcpy |
| 19:14.22 | brlcad | i made some debian fixes a couple weeks ago so it should actually build much better on debian now |
| 19:15.48 | csanyipal | brlcad: In the latest svn? |
| 19:16.07 | brlcad | hm? |
| 19:16.50 | csanyipal | brlcad: If I obtain the latest brlcad from svn then I get this fixes? |
| 19:16.57 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30837 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): move over the bu_log_hook_list too to globals.c and fix some missing declarations. make the bu_log lists non-published since nobody is using it. |
| 19:19.12 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30838 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: noticed that the graphics window in mged wasn't responding to key events properly. sends the keys to the command window even when the graphics window has focus. |
| 19:19.18 | brlcad | csanyipal: ah, yes |
| 19:19.42 | brlcad | every one of those CIA notices is a *live* change notification .. that's the source code changing |
| 19:20.10 | brlcad | if you have an svn checkout, you can "svn update" and it'll get any changes since the last time you updated or ran checkout |
| 19:20.59 | csanyipal | brlcad: OK |
| 19:33.42 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30839 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bomb.c: it was (re)published in bu.h so decl is not needed |
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| 19:48.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30840 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (getopt.c globals.c): move the bu_getopt globals over to globals.c |
| 19:56.11 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30841 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/magic.c: header cleanup |
| 20:19.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30842 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Switch the naming on the two patterns for consistency - default now pairs smooth profile with auto tread. |
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| 20:27.35 | prasad1 | brlcad, ``Erik, u guys there? |
| 20:27.50 | brlcad | nope |
| 20:30.19 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 20:30.20 | ibot | Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there, just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 20:35.52 | prasad1 | wasn't there a kyle bodt in 328? |
| 20:44.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30843 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): remove the bu_observer_cmds global by turning it into a static and wrapping it up in a new bu_observer_cmd() callback that the various callers use instead of bu_cmd. |
| 20:47.31 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30844 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parallel.c: non-global for cray |
| 20:58.30 | ``Erik | d'no if he was in 328, know he was in 238 for a bit |
| 21:34.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30845 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add a couple of default behavor tweaks for flags. |
| 21:55.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30846 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: src/libbn/axis.c claims to have been started in august 1978 by mike, that pushes his first known actual development date back a bit |
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| 02:17.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30847 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/fortran.c: doc update |
| 02:17.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30848 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/tplot.c: reorder to eliminate need for decls |
| 02:34.11 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30849 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/wavelet.c: add semicolons so indent-region works |
| 02:50.08 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30850 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): add a globals.c file to libbn to itemize all library global variables. since they're mostly all massive tables that warrant their own file, just reference the externs |
| 02:56.10 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30851 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac misc/Makefile.am misc/win32-msvc7/): remove the obsolete win32-msvc7 dir, replaced by the win32-msvc8 dir |
| 03:43.58 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30852 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): remove TINY, go for int |
| 03:46.29 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30853 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Need more clipping when hub width is manually specified - looks like dyside1 may be a poor approximation of a maximum as hub width is changed. This tweak is likely not general enough. |
| 03:59.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30854 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): move the math constants from const.c to globals.c |
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| 07:51.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30855 10/brlcad/trunk/ (13 files in 6 dirs): the start of libged. use dg_obj, view_obj, and wdb_obj routines as a beginning. the intent of the library is to hold most all geometric editing procedures. |
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| 13:24.01 | ``Erik | jabs brlcad with a pointy stick until he sees src/libged/Makefile.am |
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| 14:18.39 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30856 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: oops, forgot to add the Makefile.am |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30857 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: (log message trimmed) |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: Major change in the way ellipses are used to model sides. Instead of 1 rotated |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: ellipse per side, use two non-rotated ellipses for the top of the sides and a |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: single ellipse to take care of the bottom half of both sides. Mathematical |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: solver code is unchanged since it is quite general, but additional ellipses are |
| 14:46.20 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: being solved for and inputs should constrain them to be non-rotated. This |
| 14:46.22 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: method should have the potential to guarantee a specific tire width and may |
| 14:50.07 | starseeker_ | attempts to uncross eyeballs... |
| 15:21.13 | *** join/#brlcad thing2 (n=ric@124-169-219-13.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 15:28.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30858 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (71 files): sweeping header/comment cleanups including removal of debug.h |
| 15:30.50 | starseeker_ | Grr - is there any way in rt to make a model take up more of the rendered area (i.e. do what would be done in mged if you zoomed in on the model before raytracing?) |
| 15:32.42 | starseeker_ | is looking at man page but may not know the correct terminology for what he is trying to do... |
| 15:37.39 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I'm getting build failures in current svn - is there a .h file for the dgo stuff missing or is it expected that things won't build right now? |
| 15:40.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30859 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/iges/ (7 files): remove use of private debug.h header |
| 15:47.06 | ``Erik | src/conv/Makefile.am for libged? |
| 15:47.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30860 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (33 files in 2 dirs): more debug.h removal |
| 15:48.20 | starseeker_ | No, build failure is in comb.c in rt |
| 15:48.29 | starseeker_ | or librt more likely |
| 15:48.52 | starseeker_ | ``Erik - any idea on my rt question? |
| 15:48.53 | ``Erik | well, that was intended for brlcad, actually, I get missing symbols in asc2g that have been migrated to libged... |
| 15:49.05 | ``Erik | you can always feed it a matrix |
| 15:49.27 | starseeker_ | was hoping he could just toss it a zoom number... :-( |
| 15:49.34 | ``Erik | uhm, d'no if there's a "size" or "zoom" in rt scripting, but I know you can use -p and play with the perspective number pretty easily |
| 15:50.20 | starseeker_ | hmm |
| 15:50.47 | brlcad | ``Erik: i added the missing Makefile.am and have a clean build here but have yet to hit up a few other systems |
| 15:51.02 | brlcad | starseeker_: that's not enough info to help |
| 15:51.33 | starseeker_ | OK, I can be more specific in a sec - just wanted to know if I should expect breakage while the reorg was going down |
| 15:51.39 | brlcad | and no, it's never expected that things won't build unless a commit message indicates such |
| 15:51.42 | starseeker_ | k |
| 15:51.47 | ``Erik | didja forget to commit src/conv/Makefile.am ? I added ${GED} to asc2g_LDADD and it worked... would commit, but I can't remember my password O.o |
| 15:52.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: nope, didn't need to add GED to anything |
| 15:52.37 | brlcad | so either different symbol muckage or a few binaries weren't cleaned out |
| 15:53.12 | ``Erik | wdb_create_cmd() and wdb_init_obj are the symbols asc2g is missing |
| 15:53.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30861 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/Makefile.am: add ${GED} to asc2g |
| 15:54.35 | ``Erik | on a mac, no less |
| 15:55.42 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@124-169-219-13.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 15:56.19 | brlcad | yeah probably unclean, i have a rebuild going now |
| 15:56.38 | starseeker_ | is having to re-do, one sec..... |
| 15:56.55 | starseeker_ | doggone it, my home machine didn't used to feel so slow... |
| 15:59.41 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30862 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/Makefile.am: add libged to g_diff |
| 16:00.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30863 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (23 files in 10 dirs): remaining removal of debug.h |
| 16:00.43 | ``Erik | heats up some stew |
| 16:01.50 | brlcad | there we go |
| 16:03.32 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30864 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/Makefile.am: add libged to mged |
| 16:04.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30865 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/vdraw.c: restore the #if 0 |
| 16:04.44 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30866 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rttherm/Makefile.am: added ${GED} to rttherm |
| 16:05.20 | brlcad | notes new warnings on tire.c |
| 16:05.30 | starseeker_ | yeah, sorry 'bout that |
| 16:05.45 | starseeker_ | working on it... |
| 16:06.03 | brlcad | np, didn't know if you noticed |
| 16:06.17 | starseeker_ | me just got done ripping the guts out of the ellipse logic :-) |
| 16:06.18 | brlcad | some day we'll be able to turn on Werror :) |
| 16:06.36 | ``Erik | outside of src/other, mebbe |
| 16:07.17 | starseeker_ | Ah, there it is |
| 16:07.21 | starseeker_ | heads to pastebin... |
| 16:07.52 | starseeker_ | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m59981cca |
| 16:08.13 | starseeker_ | hmm - brep_test this time. |
| 16:08.24 | brlcad | starseeker_: so what is that error telling you? |
| 16:09.15 | ``Erik | does not like having 4+ vcs's on his computers :( |
| 16:09.27 | starseeker_ | libtool isn't finding symbols in librt.so that it thinks should be there? |
| 16:09.52 | starseeker_ | thought this was indicating a missing include file, but could easily be wrong... |
| 16:10.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30867 10/brlcad/trunk/src/Makefile.am: make libged required if benchmark (asc2g) needs it |
| 16:10.22 | ``Erik | <-- points at the C compilation pipeline |
| 16:10.53 | brlcad | starseeker_: close, it's saying librt references some symbols that are not being resolved |
| 16:11.27 | starseeker_ | Ah - need to do what ``Erik was doing earlier and include libged in the Makefile.am? |
| 16:11.30 | brlcad | missing symbols aren't include files, they indicate linkage/library |
| 16:11.46 | brlcad | exactly |
| 16:11.50 | ``Erik | creates new toplevel project; clbrlcad |
| 16:11.54 | brlcad | which may have already happened, have to make sure you're up to date |
| 16:11.57 | ``Erik | (what? if we have jbrlcad, we can have clbrlcad!) |
| 16:12.18 | brlcad | would like to buy a vowel |
| 16:12.27 | ``Erik | rbbrlcad? |
| 16:12.37 | ``Erik | pybrlcad? plbrlcad? *shudder* |
| 16:12.48 | ``Erik | ooh ooh ooh, asmbrlcad :D |
| 16:13.06 | brlcad | mlbrlcad! |
| 16:13.32 | ``Erik | ocamlbrlcad? |
| 16:13.45 | ``Erik | what does haskell like? hs? |
| 16:14.17 | ``Erik | shelves his evil musings and returns to cooking lunch |
| 16:14.43 | brlcad | munches on pistachios |
| 16:15.42 | starseeker_ | was up to date... |
| 16:15.52 | starseeker_ | adding ged got most of it, now missing TclReFree... |
| 16:16.00 | ``Erik | hunger get what hunger want *grunt* |
| 16:17.01 | brlcad | hum, cad's not responding |
| 16:17.32 | brlcad | wonders if the storm took out power |
| 16:17.59 | ``Erik | look at the uptimes of the others? |
| 16:19.57 | brlcad | yeah... |
| 16:20.01 | brlcad | looks like it went down |
| 16:20.09 | brlcad | 7 hours ago |
| 16:20.18 | starseeker_ | grr - anybody know where to get TclReFree? |
| 16:20.29 | ``Erik | grep or cscope know |
| 16:20.46 | brlcad | the prefix is a little hinty |
| 16:20.47 | ``Erik | dave g was impressed with cscope O.o |
| 16:21.07 | ``Erik | hehehe I was waiting for the "oh... dur..." :D |
| 16:21.31 | starseeker_ | right, but I added ${TCL} and suddenly my GED errors came back... |
| 16:27.25 | starseeker_ | hmm - ${TCL} isn't doing it... |
| 16:28.05 | ``Erik | http://www.collegehumor.com/picture:1796952 awesome placement |
| 16:29.15 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30868 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: Add libged to librt |
| 16:29.16 | ``Erik | http://www.collegehumor.com/picture:1796900 guh *shudder* |
| 16:29.34 | starseeker_ | ``Erik: Anything wrong with that tweak? |
| 16:29.53 | ``Erik | I d'no? am I supposed to look at it? O.o |
| 16:30.04 | starseeker_ | twood be nice... |
| 16:32.24 | ``Erik | hrm, I didn't seem to need it... the older revision works fine for me O.o |
| 16:32.39 | starseeker_ | hmm |
| 16:33.42 | ``Erik | of course, I'm only testing on mac right now |
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| 16:49.36 | brlcad | starseeker_: libged should be relying on librt, not the other way around |
| 16:55.58 | starseeker_ | hmm |
| 16:59.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30869 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: revert libged addition - librt shouldn't use libged |
| 17:03.37 | starseeker_ | OK, so guess #2 is that on my system libged is getting listed as something librt should be using by accident |
| 17:16.54 | starseeker_ | ``Erik, brlcad: Both of you had successful builds with current svn? |
| 17:20.31 | ``Erik | ja |
| 17:22.30 | ``Erik | doesn't understand what the deal with all these people painting their skin orange and spiking their hair is... like modern day oompa loompas or something |
| 17:43.02 | poolio | ``Erik: Go Os? |
| 17:47.23 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 17:58.30 | brlcad | starseeker_: no it doesn't necessarily mean that (wrt #2) |
| 18:00.14 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30870 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (Makefile.am debug.h): remove debug.h |
| 18:00.47 | ``Erik | huzzah, b'bye debug.h |
| 18:04.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30871 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): renmae global.c to globals.c to match libbu/libbn |
| 18:09.25 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30872 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/bigE.c: remove k&r dead code |
| 18:15.44 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 18:23.05 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 18:23.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30873 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/bool.c: comment consistency cleanup |
| 18:25.56 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30874 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/brep_test.cpp: remove using statement |
| 18:43.12 | ``Erik | yet more oompa loompas http://www.collegehumor.com/picture:1790181 |
| 19:01.24 | brlcad | thinks ``Erik's time would be much better spent coding |
| 19:03.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30875 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (db5_bin.c globals.c): move the binu_types global array from db5_bin.c to globals.c; make the binu_types array be static since nobody else uses it. libged needs binu_types. |
| 19:07.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30876 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db5_comb.c: comment cleanup |
| 19:16.44 | PrezzKennedy | Sunday should be the day of programming rest ;) |
| 19:19.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30877 10/brlcad/trunk/include/db5.h: DB5_EXPORT label |
| 19:25.28 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30878 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (db5_io.c globals.c): move the db5_enc_len global array from db5_io.c to globals.c |
| 19:31.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30879 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/fortray.c: the struct partition fr_global_head doesn't need to be global, make it static; cleanup comments too |
| 19:34.47 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30880 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/importFg4Section.c: make grid_pts static |
| 20:07.56 | *** join/#brlcad cad75 (n=51d5b6c8@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:09.40 | brlcad | hello cad75 |
| 20:10.07 | alex_joni | you scared him :) |
| 20:12.06 | brlcad | apparently |
| 20:30.01 | starseeker_ | PrezzKennedy: programming was just an example ;-) |
| 20:30.26 | starseeker_ | figures ``Erik's time could be better spend doing almost anything rather than looking for modern oompa loompas |
| 20:30.33 | starseeker_ | er s/spend/spent |
| 20:38.13 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30881 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Remove some unneeded orientation hackery logic that was causing bugs in some cases. |
| 20:40.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30882 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Remove the unneeded orientation option from CalcInputVals |
| 20:40.35 | starseeker_ | phew |
| 20:40.48 | yukonbob | hey starseeker_ -- how're tricks? |
| 20:40.55 | starseeker_ | not too bad - yourself? |
| 20:41.00 | yukonbob | not bad, not bad |
| 20:41.10 | starseeker_ | has got tires on the brain... |
| 20:41.25 | yukonbob | still no 7.12.x building on my system, but I think I've got deeper software issues that just BRL-CAD... |
| 20:41.32 | starseeker_ | ow |
| 20:41.39 | yukonbob | starseeker_: does the program scale to bicycle wheels as well? |
| 20:41.45 | starseeker_ | erm. |
| 20:42.01 | starseeker_ | in theory I suppose it does, but I've never tested it there |
| 20:42.02 | yukonbob | re: ow -- I think it's got to do w/ TclStubs -- so I've got a route to chase :) |
| 20:42.16 | yukonbob | adds test-case to starseeker_'s function :) |
| 20:42.47 | starseeker_ | that'd be even weirder than ``Erik's pulling up odd tire dimensions |
| 20:42.57 | starseeker_ | bike tires have their own naming conventions |
| 20:43.10 | yukonbob | re: tire dimensions -- can you pick low-profile tires, mudders, etc? |
| 20:44.16 | yukonbob | starseeker_: re: naming conventions -- sure, but if one were to map to some NCAL (Naming Convention Abstraction Layer), would a geometry look like a "real" tire? |
| 20:44.28 | starseeker_ | heh - not quite. You supply a dimensional string - e.g. 185/65R14 |
| 20:44.51 | starseeker_ | assuming I can model the tire correctly with these primitives, it would look fairly real yess |
| 20:45.15 | yukonbob | 14" wheel, 185units wide, height == 65% of width, correct? |
| 20:45.26 | starseeker_ | yeah |
| 20:46.04 | starseeker_ | it's rather silly to mix units like that, but I guess that's just The Way It Is |
| 20:46.30 | yukonbob | doesn't recall what the "185" unit is... what is it? |
| 20:46.36 | starseeker_ | mm I believe |
| 20:46.55 | yukonbob | ya -- I'd guess that -- confusing indeed. |
| 20:48.54 | starseeker_ | it's actually a lot of fun when I'm not pounding my head on some obscure bug in the ellipse code... |
| 20:49.26 | yukonbob | bicycle off-road == inches (ie: 26" x 2.125"), road == "c" (ie: 700c x 18) mostly, though I believe there's a 27" road spec as well... |
| 20:50.40 | starseeker_ | tires alone have probably got half a dozen floating around - someday I may decide to support more of them, but this little bit I can do is plenty for now... |
| 20:51.18 | yukonbob | nods -- first get it working, then add bloat, culminating in an integrated email client. |
| 20:51.40 | starseeker_ | Hehe - deleted email will be re-named "roadkill" |
| 20:51.46 | yukonbob | heh |
| 20:51.49 | starseeker_ | or better yet, spam |
| 20:52.42 | starseeker_ | probably the way to do bike tires is to look at how the heck that wheel was done, then see if it can be abstracted. |
| 20:53.01 | yukonbob | you mean the wheel in the rendering galler? |
| 20:53.10 | starseeker_ | yes - the model is up on sourceforge as well. |
| 20:53.53 | starseeker_ | probably should have studied it in the first place, before doing this... ah, well |
| 20:54.23 | yukonbob | ya -- well, to make it even _more_ confusing -- if you wanted to support traditional tubulars, that'd be one thing, but a true clincher ("typical" tire, with an inner tube) would be interesting... |
| 20:54.57 | starseeker_ | what shape are they? |
| 20:55.15 | yukonbob | wire/kevlar bead hooked into rim, sidewalls shaped at "whatever" shape, tread profile, etc. |
| 20:56.28 | yukonbob | <== would start with a torus and build tread on outside, then truncate interior and build inner-sidewall/bead |
| 20:57.02 | starseeker_ | Here's the one that's already in the gallery: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1402243&group_id=105292&atid=641557 |
| 20:59.30 | yukonbob | ya -- I've not loaded that up... |
| 20:59.39 | yukonbob | didn't realize the .g was in the distribution |
| 21:00.19 | yukonbob | will be curious to see how collisions w/ the spokes are handled... and what was done w/ the tire... |
| 21:00.45 | starseeker_ | you mean overlaps? |
| 21:00.57 | yukonbob | would have drilled the spoke holes in the rim with alternating offsets too, but that's a design decision |
| 21:01.29 | yukonbob | starseeker_: re: overlaps, ya -- as the spokes radiate from the hub in their cross-pattern, do they share space? |
| 21:01.44 | starseeker_ | I don't think so |
| 21:01.51 | starseeker_ | this is actually quite an impressive model |
| 21:03.59 | yukonbob | has part of this done /w newhub as a foundation... http://www.methodlogic.net/flat/gfx/wheel_cropped.png |
| 21:04.35 | yukonbob | is rough, but gives idea... |
| 21:04.37 | starseeker_ | neat :-) |
| 21:05.14 | yukonbob | hub == glass, hence "artifacts" ;) |
| 21:05.25 | yukonbob | was playing with mater at time of render ;) |
| 21:05.45 | starseeker_ | needs to remember to add an air volume to his tires... |
| 21:05.52 | starseeker_ | looks good bob |
| 21:06.00 | starseeker_ | yukonbob rather |
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| 21:07.26 | starseeker_ | we'll have BRL-CAD "on the move" ;-) |
| 21:07.53 | starseeker_ | someone will have to do a couple different kinds of engines now... |
| 21:10.32 | starseeker_ | has the mildly psychotic idea of using one long pipe to wrap wire around a core for an electric motor... |
| 22:09.32 | starseeker_ | With weekends like this, who needs work weeks? |
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| 22:36.13 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-222.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 23:20.32 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30883 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/many.c: general non-functionally-changing cleanup |
| 23:25.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30884 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 7 dirs): encapsulate the former rt_material_head global linked list behind a getter/setter along with new routines to fill in a vls and dup the material list. this makes the global conveniently go away. |
| 23:59.19 | ``Erik | w00t, simpsons time |
| 00:15.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30885 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: add the missing CMakeLists.txt file for libged |
| 00:17.21 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30886 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): move nirt.c to libged, it's a dgo ged command |
| 00:28.05 | ``Erik | because you can't spell slaughter without laughter O.o |
| 00:32.22 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30887 10/brlcad/trunk/include/mater.h: add header reinclusion protections and include raytrace.h for struct region |
| 00:49.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30888 10/brlcad/trunk/ (14 files in 4 dirs): move vdraw.c, bigE.c, and qray.c from librt to libged too. that should be the remaining dgo functionality. |
| 02:42.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30889 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: ws |
| 02:43.56 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30890 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/opennurbs_ext.cpp: get rid of the using statement, make namespace use explicit |
| 03:01.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30891 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (9 files): |
| 03:01.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: more migration of global vars to globals.c .. move rt_uniresource, nmg_eue_dist, |
| 03:01.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: and the three nmg callback globals: nmg_plot_anim_upcall, |
| 03:01.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: nmg_vblock_anim_upcall, nmg_mged_debug_display_hack. includes a periphery |
| 03:01.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: cleanup and conversion of some globals to static |
| 03:40.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30892 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): remove rt_nfunctab global, not really needed/useful as-is |
| 03:47.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30893 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/globals.c: rt_functab is too big to import, just reference it |
| 04:00.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30894 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: comment cleanup |
| 04:17.48 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30895 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (g_arb.c globals.c): move the arb8 globals over to globals.c including the edit arb arrays and rt_arb_faces; with cleanup |
| 04:33.52 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30896 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (g_cline.c globals.c): move rt_cline_radius to globals.c plus cleanup |
| 04:34.09 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30897 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: ws |
| 04:36.19 | poolio | Wow. |
| 04:51.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30898 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (g_bot.c globals.c): move rt_bot_minpieces and rt_bot_tri_per_piece over from g_bot.c to globals.c; with comment cleanup |
| 06:07.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30899 10/brlcad/trunk/include/magic.h: consolidate all public magic numbers into a single 'registry' so that structures can be uniformly validated in libbu |
| 06:08.30 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30900 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (13 files): consolidate all public magic numbers into a single 'registry' in magic.h so that structures can be uniformly validated in libbu |
| 06:09.42 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30901 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/rb_internals.h: push bu_rb's magic numbers up into magic.h, clean up comments |
| 06:10.29 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30902 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/magic.c: no longer need all header numbers under the sun. this should help keep libbu decoupled properly. just include magic.h |
| 06:16.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30903 10/brlcad/trunk/include/magic.h: leave a note that this header should be considered a PRIVATE header and should NEVER refer to the specific define values. |
| 06:17.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30904 10/brlcad/trunk/include/Makefile.am: bu.h needs magic.h, install it |
| 06:54.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30905 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/globals.c: ws |
| 07:00.36 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:00.50 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30906 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: seems to be pretty pervasive that the framebuffer isn't refreshing, at least linux and mac under X11 aren't behaving properly. they only refresh when the window is forcibly refreshed (dirty rect0 |
| 07:33.22 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:37.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30907 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/shoot.c: reorder functions so forward declaration of rt_plot_cell() isn't necessary |
| 07:40.12 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30908 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/spectrum.c: make global a static along with some header cleanup |
| 07:47.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30909 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: give them semicolons regardless so that they indent correctly by automatic .. might have been solaris complaining originally, but see if it's still a concern (gcc is fine with the '};') |
| 07:49.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30910 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/transform.c: cleanup |
| 08:02.38 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30911 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (globals.c tree.c vers.c vlist.c): move (last?) two remaining straggler globals, rt_initial_tree_state and rt_vlist_cmd_descriptions, over to globals.c; tidy up while going along. |
| 08:09.58 | d_rossberg | brlcad: i tried to post to the mentors-list but i got an error message |
| 08:10.19 | d_rossberg | but i can see the message appended to the thread too |
| 08:11.18 | d_rossberg | so, have you seen something from me (probable not) |
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| 10:00.52 | mafm | allo |
| 10:01.21 | mafm | if somebody tried to speak with me during the weekend, I was not here |
| 10:01.30 | mafm | it seems that the client got reconnected for some reason |
| 10:02.34 | mafm | and the log is not that big to save what you people told to me |
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| 12:00.15 | brlcad | d_rossberg: no, I had not |
| 12:02.15 | brlcad | d_rossberg: common problem on some brosers is that your session expires while composing, should make sure you're actually logged in (try changing an account setting) |
| 12:06.59 | brlcad | which thread, what error? |
| 12:07.37 | brlcad | mafm: tis alright .. if it's important, they can say it again :) |
| 12:07.44 | d_rossberg | the error was a gmail/googlemail confusion |
| 12:08.22 | d_rossberg | the subscription was for gmail but i tried to send a post from a googlemail account |
| 12:09.22 | brlcad | can you log into google groups using gmail ? |
| 12:09.30 | brlcad | or trying to post via e-mail? |
| 12:10.13 | brlcad | which thread, I can verify I don't see anything |
| 12:10.34 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 12:12.15 | d_rossberg | the thread was: Let the introductions begin! :) |
| 12:13.10 | d_rossberg | it looks like there no real difference between gmail and googlemail |
| 12:15.01 | d_rossberg | i.e. if you send something to somebody with a googlemail account with @gmail it will reach the addressee |
| 12:42.20 | mafm | there are more quirks even |
| 12:42.44 | mafm | if you have a.b.c@gmail.com, all combinations not including dots get to the same person |
| 12:43.24 | mafm | in my case, manuel.montezelo@ or manuelmontezelo@ or m.a.n.u.e.l.etc@gmail.com get to my inbox anyway |
| 12:45.29 | ``Erik | weird |
| 12:46.41 | mafm | I knew about that when a neighbor sent me a mail, she missed the dot, and it got into my inbox anyway |
| 12:46.43 | mafm | :) |
| 12:51.35 | d_rossberg | but obviously their error tolerance is limited :| |
| 13:05.54 | ``Erik | how's this for damn odd, when I originally got my gmail account, I had to put a dot in it because it said it was taken... but both the one I wanted and the one I got go to my dotted address O.o |
| 13:09.54 | mafm | yep, that caused problems sometimes |
| 13:10.01 | mafm | but I don't know how it's resolved |
| 13:10.17 | mafm | (that's what I read a few months ago, didn't put much attention to it) |
| 13:22.24 | ``Erik | pheer, fuzzy matching email addresses O.o hope you don't have important bits sent through gmail :D |
| 13:35.09 | ``Erik | awesome, a core dump out of pine |
| 13:49.20 | mafm | well, actually I use it normally without problems |
| 13:54.05 | brlcad | d_rossberg: they may be moderated/pending given that thread already has 400+ posts |
| 13:54.21 | brlcad | there was a comment the other day about how people were still posting to that thread :) |
| 13:54.26 | brlcad | after bart's message |
| 13:56.05 | ``Erik | huh, bill kendrik is in gsoc, too |
| 14:00.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30912 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (magic.h mater.h): wtf was I smoking .. don't cross the streams ray |
| 14:01.12 | ``Erik | heh, ironical that I'd just read the second on the wiki about good commit messages and bad ones *smirk* |
| 14:01.36 | brlcad | :) |
| 14:02.55 | d_rossberg | brlcad: anyway, i'll repost it today evening |
| 14:03.30 | brlcad | d_rossberg: okay, I'll ask lh if anything is up |
| 14:03.56 | brlcad | she won't be on for a couple hours still |
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| 14:05.32 | ``Erik | thinks he needs to buy a power sander and a couple cans of wood stain and sealant before he pressure washes his deck O.o |
| 14:05.45 | d_rossberg | brlcad: i hope i've successfully switched the subscription to my googlemail account, thats why i hope it will work now |
| 14:05.46 | ``Erik | sucker not only takes away the dirt and moss, but paint, stain, wood, ... |
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| 14:17.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30913 10/brlcad/trunk/include/mater.h: add DECL wrappers for C++ compilation |
| 14:18.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30914 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dg.h: add proper file header docs for what this header is and is for |
| 14:20.44 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30915 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (Makefile.am ged.h raytrace.h): add ged.h to the header list for the new LIBGED. it provides the declarations for wdb_obj, view_obj, and indirectly for dg_obj (through dg.h) |
| 14:29.22 | ``Erik | huh, dave wheeler is, too O.o lots of old faces poppingup |
| 14:32.59 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.7.205) | |
| 14:33.11 | andrecastelo | hey everyone :D |
| 14:33.28 | ``Erik | howdy |
| 14:33.47 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, what's up? |
| 14:34.20 | ``Erik | not much, relaxing at home, watching the rain and updating a few fbsd machines |
| 14:35.29 | ``Erik | reading up on this gsoc mentor traffic, sheesh there's a lot O.o sure hope it dies down a bit :D |
| 14:36.16 | andrecastelo | if you think that's a lot of traffic, you haven't seen the student list :D |
| 14:37.44 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: also, http://andrecastelo.wordpress.com |
| 14:38.34 | ``Erik | awesome |
| 14:38.39 | brlcad | andrecastelo: sweet |
| 14:38.55 | ``Erik | I was about to harrass brlcad about finishing the migration to the new machine so we could set up some blog software for gsoccers |
| 14:39.37 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 14:40.32 | ``Erik | I also had a minor brain queef this morning about a good 'baby step' for the MLT work... claiming a light model # and stubbing it to a simple flat shader or something to get a feel for the guts and small patch, and to get an 'ugly detail' out of the way up front |
| 14:41.31 | ``Erik | d'no if it's a good idea, just throwing it out there for people to comment on O:-) |
| 14:42.41 | ``Erik | woops, you're in trouble now, andré, I have that page bookmarked |
| 14:42.54 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30916 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (8 files): header and identity cleanup, add them to a libged group for doxygen. removed unused headers and clean up some comments |
| 14:43.13 | brlcad | ``Erik: you were thinking of adding it as a lighting model to rt? |
| 14:43.34 | ``Erik | yeah, why, you were thinking of having rtmlt? |
| 14:45.18 | brlcad | yeah, not strongly, but I'd thought something like 'pt' that used the same raytrace interface as the other rt* apps, but did its own thing |
| 14:46.11 | brlcad | or whatever it'd get named, that wasn't so important |
| 14:46.17 | ``Erik | hm, we seem to have two competing precedents going :) |
| 14:47.24 | brlcad | yeah, and probably either can work for this |
| 14:47.43 | ``Erik | <-- kinda figured the light model approach would be a bit easier and quicker |
| 14:48.00 | andrecastelo | couldn't we add the bidirectional path tracer to RT and the rest of the MLT to something like rtmlt?? then it would be easier later to add lighting models that use the path tracer |
| 14:48.15 | brlcad | the tradeoff is probably the fact that rt's option namespace is full and you wouldn't have to weed through as much regarding the assumptions in rt that it's not a path tracker |
| 14:48.40 | ``Erik | photon mapping offers an approach, arcane as it is |
| 14:49.07 | brlcad | andrecastelo: MLT is bidirectional path tracing |
| 14:49.41 | brlcad | photon mapping isnt' just arcane, it was shoed in totally half-assed |
| 14:49.48 | andrecastelo | yeah, the rest i was talking about is really small (the mutation part) |
| 14:50.11 | ``Erik | it's a modified bidirectional path tracing, the 'raw' pathtracing that rise does is also bidirectional path tracing, but far more brute force |
| 14:50.14 | ``Erik | iiuc |
| 14:51.30 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yeah, I don't think that distinction matters here -- the difference from rt's perspect is where you hook in the logic; rt has lighting models that modify the manner in which rays are fired, rt *apps* fully override the ray-trace 'view' interface to do something similar |
| 14:52.34 | brlcad | mlt is that, but the distinction at this point is .. pointless .. it doesn't matter for whether it's a light model or a new bin or really affect how it's named, that's just a couple lines in the docs |
| 14:53.23 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 14:53.25 | ``Erik | the state of things is a bit confusing :) |
| 14:53.42 | andrecastelo | but would mlt be chosen just as photon mapping is?? (the number thing Erik was talking about) |
| 14:55.00 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that is the question at hand.. |
| 14:55.36 | brlcad | regardless of photon mapping (which *really* is a bad example to follow) .. the issue boils down to either making another binary app for this, or hooking it into rt |
| 14:56.15 | brlcad | hooked into rt, it has to be optional and default off of course -- so that means it would have to be a lighting model and maybe rewrite some other pieces of rt that assume direct ray-tracing |
| 14:57.22 | ``Erik | (should we put "unfuck photon mapping interface" in the todo?) |
| 14:59.38 | andrecastelo | I guess i was following photon mapping example too much :D |
| 15:00.55 | brlcad | as a new application, it means you have less to deal with wrt existing code but you also loose "some" of the infrastructure that rt already provides (e.g. gamma settings, some parallel bits, framebuffer hooks) that you'd have to implement (at least some of) |
| 15:07.56 | brlcad | ``Erik: could put that in the todo .. it's about in as usable a state though as adrt was .. almost amounts to rewriting most of it for it to be actually useful |
| 15:09.23 | brlcad | even when it works, it doesn't do anything useful really and that's aside from how it was tacked in the code throughout optical and rt |
| 15:12.57 | ``Erik | <-- wouldn't mind seeing it kluge geometry by adding a bounding cube/sphere and light source of they're not found... *shrug* |
| 15:13.56 | brlcad | there are already light sources, just not with the "right" settings for photomapping to work |
| 15:14.04 | brlcad | *default* lights |
| 15:15.00 | ``Erik | yeah, the box is the killer for that one, I'd imagine |
| 15:15.14 | ``Erik | oh, and the light can't have a diameter of 0, heh :D |
| 15:15.14 | brlcad | the bounding cube/sphere could be useful but the reason that's needed was mainly because it doesn't bother to check where the model is |
| 15:34.37 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30917 10/brlcad/trunk/include/solid.h: header needs bu.h and raytrace.h to be self-contained |
| 16:03.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30918 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 3 dirs): |
| 16:03.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: add a globals.c to the build for libged with the single global it presently |
| 16:03.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: uses. removed one of the other vdraw globals by making the interface between |
| 16:03.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: vdraw and dg clean enough that the command table could be made static. |
| 16:20.35 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30919 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: generate POSIX 1003.1-1988 tarballs (256 char paths, allows empty dirs, pretty portable), not the default V7 tar format (which limits to 99 char paths and no empty dirs) |
| 16:22.34 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30920 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: bah, tar-ustar is 1.9+ |
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| 18:19.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30921 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add extra trimming for 'truck' profile to avoid tread looking like it is flaring out. |
| 18:19.55 | starseeker | now has to redo screenshots again... arrrgh... |
| 18:34.14 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30922 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Tweak truck tread to clear up cut artifacts. |
| 19:01.00 | mafm | bye |
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| 21:52.20 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30923 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/globals.c: erm, lost the header. need dg.h to calculate the storage size of HeadDGObj. |
| 22:12.21 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30924 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: needs to call vdraw_cmd(), was renamed from dgo_vdraw_cmd() |
| 22:13.03 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30925 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: declare a Ged_Init() Tcl interface for libged |
| 22:18.59 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30926 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/tcl.c: remove the calls to Wdb_Init, Dg_Init, Vo_Init from librt since they're no longer in librt ... they need to be provided by libged if needed so there's not a cyclic dependency. big ws cleanup too. |
| 22:20.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30927 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): initial tcl interface to libged so we can call Wdb_Init, Dgo_Init, and Vo_Init and provide Ged_Init for dynamic loading from within tcl. |
| 22:48.42 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30928 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: need TCL_CPPFLAGS now that there are tcl routines.. |
| 22:49.11 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30929 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: GED_LIBS needs to come *after* RT_LIBS if w'ere going to use it. |
| 22:53.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30930 10/brlcad/trunk/src/Makefile.am: librtserver doesn't need libged to move it to benchmark dirs |
| 23:34.55 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30931 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: libdm uses HeadDGObj and drawable geometry now in libged |
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| 02:02.51 | starseeker_ | Grr... librt, why do you care about TclReFree??? |
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| 02:39.25 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30932 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Tire thickness, hub width, and tread depth can now be floating point numbers. |
| 06:18.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30933 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/linkroot.sh: if the paths match up, just symlink to the basename of the provided installation dir instead of using the full path |
| 06:23.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30934 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/make_pkg.sh: yucky, icky quote typos make the dust bunnies angry |
| 06:30.49 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30935 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/macosx/openUp.c: quell warnings |
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| 07:07.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30936 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/bigE.c: libged doxygen group |
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| 08:51.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30937 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/make_dmg.sh: fix the dmg creation, it wasn't copying the background file onto the dmg for a couple reasons. add a few printing statements to keep track of progress too. |
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| 10:26.20 | mafm | hi |
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| 12:31.30 | thing1 | hey |
| 12:32.10 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30938 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/tcl.h: |
| 12:32.10 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: take the dynamic C runtime macro _DLL into consideration for the dynamic TCL library too |
| 12:32.10 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: it is not sure that a dynamic TCL library should be compiled with a static CRT |
| 12:32.10 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: but this modification corrects the CRT declarations only, not the CRT to use |
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| 14:38.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30939 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bio.h config_win.h): |
| 14:38.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: removed MSVC 6.0 exceptions |
| 14:38.02 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: this version of the Microsoft compiler won't be supported any more |
| 14:57.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30940 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/globals.c: the MS Windows build needs the types from windows.h |
| 15:05.41 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30941 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/CMakeLists.txt: escape backslash |
| 15:15.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30942 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/ (4 files in 4 dirs): |
| 15:15.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: CMake for tcl85.dll and tclpip85.dll |
| 15:15.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: (MS Windows only) |
| 15:18.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r30943 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): created BrlcadCore.dll: a kind of brlcad.dll which can make use of TCL (i.e. no TclDummies.c) |
| 15:54.05 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 17:06.00 | brlcad | humm |
| 17:10.26 | mafm | o/ |
| 17:27.05 | mafm | brlcad: my mentor never joins IRC, does he? |
| 17:36.36 | brlcad | mafm: hmm, not much :) |
| 17:36.47 | brlcad | i've been trying to get him to but he's very "old school" :) |
| 17:38.39 | brlcad | feel free to use me or any of the other mentors as backup though .. the mentors are not meant to be the sole POC for technical input/direction |
| 17:38.51 | brlcad | they're more to keep track of progress and evaluation |
| 17:44.44 | mafm | yep, I know and I already read your info |
| 17:45.03 | mafm | but I think that I should talk a bit with him anyway |
| 17:48.05 | brlcad | yeah, you should e-mail him :) |
| 17:52.42 | mafm | okie dokie |
| 17:58.03 | brlcad | mafm: oh, and don't forget the design doc when you get the chance, that gives him something to actually talk about ;) |
| 17:58.46 | mafm | sure, I have the browser open since last week, but only half the work done |
| 17:58.51 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:01.19 | mafm | I finished with most of my pending mail today and got the Slashdot's count down to less than 150 articles |
| 18:01.42 | mafm | but I guess that I should get things sorted out with my broken laptop before warranty expires :D |
| 18:15.49 | mafm | one thing about the patches that you were talking about in the documentation, in order to get commit access... |
| 18:16.24 | mafm | how is that achieved in projects tackling new areas, as mine is supposed to be? do I have to delve into other areas first? |
| 18:32.53 | mafm | well, heading home now... |
| 18:33.09 | mafm | bye |
| 18:40.05 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 18:46.04 | brlcad | oop |
| 19:03.43 | PrezKennedy | boring day at work... so im fiddling with an IRCd on my server |
| 19:28.52 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.78.254) | |
| 20:30.15 | ``Erik | heh, he ran away too quick |
| 22:01.21 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 22:01.21 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 22:03.08 | brlcad | starseeker_: could be |
| 22:03.43 | starseeker_ | that poses a problem... |
| 22:03.55 | brlcad | not saying it is true |
| 22:03.57 | brlcad | just "could be" |
| 22:04.05 | brlcad | have to look through the interface |
| 22:04.22 | brlcad | mk_rcomb used to, dunno about mk_addmember |
| 22:05.56 | brlcad | yeah, looks like it does expose it |
| 22:06.13 | brlcad | slaps starseeker_ around for not reading the header |
| 22:07.53 | starseeker_ | mutters about the man page and looks for the header instead... |
| 22:11.00 | brlcad | that manual page is considerably out of date |
| 22:11.07 | brlcad | it still refers to FILE pointers |
| 22:11.22 | brlcad | we've not used file pointers for many years |
| 22:11.32 | brlcad | you should update the header, clean it up |
| 22:11.54 | brlcad | or come up with a good/better less-manual way to keep them in sync |
| 22:19.48 | starseeker_ | Am I reading the header right that mk_lcomb does not expose the air flag, but mk_comb does? |
| 22:27.57 | starseeker_ | Ah, I think that's got it... |
| 22:30.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30944 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add air region inside of tire. |
| 22:33.13 | starseeker_ | groans in dismay as he realizes the air wireframes will significantly change the wireframe screenshots and he has to redo them again... |
| 22:33.26 | starseeker_ | ah, well, the cost of progress |
| 22:38.48 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30945 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 3 dirs): remove obsolete libwdb interfaces for strsol, reg4, and spl. this includes mk_trc(), mk_bsolid(), mk_bsurf(), mk_strsol(), mk_rcomb(), mk_fcomb(), mk_memb(), and mk_fwrite_internal(). |
| 22:39.08 | starseeker_ | is beaten to the punch by brlcad |
| 22:39.29 | brlcad | there's plenty more to do, go for it :) |
| 22:39.32 | starseeker_ | hehe |
| 22:40.00 | starseeker_ | were you stripping it out of the code? |
| 22:40.41 | starseeker_ | diffs |
| 22:41.03 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 22:44.42 | brlcad | i mean cleanup in general, there's lots of loving that libwdb could use |
| 22:46.19 | starseeker_ | indeed |
| 22:55.29 | *** join/#brlcad MTee (n=MT@41.233.133.230) | |
| 22:56.40 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30946 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add -s option to specify radius of maximum sidewall width point. |
| 23:18.48 | *** part/#brlcad MTee (n=MT@41.233.133.230) | |
| 01:34.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r30947 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): |
| 01:34.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: Added support for a variable length byte buffer (bu_vlb). Similar to bu_vls, |
| 01:34.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: but not string based (null byte is not special). Anticipated use in librtserver |
| 01:34.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: which is scheduled to change its Java return to a simple byte array. |
| 01:54.24 | *** join/#brlcad cad71 (n=74e911cf@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 02:42.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30948 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Add options to override the 'd' flag values, in order to have floating point dimensions as input. |
| 02:53.11 | starseeker_ | weird |
| 02:53.31 | starseeker_ | suddenly doesn't get raytraced output of tire, even though it was working before dinner... |
| 02:53.55 | starseeker_ | wireframe's there... |
| 02:54.28 | starseeker_ | decides sleep is in order first, and kicks off a couple fresh builds. |
| 04:18.15 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 05:38.15 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 05:42.40 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 05:57.34 | yukonbob | what's happening, pacman87 ? |
| 05:57.48 | pacman87 | last week of school |
| 05:57.55 | pacman87 | all the projects are due :( |
| 05:58.17 | pacman87 | finals week is easy compared to this |
| 06:21.56 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 06:22.15 | yukonbob | :P -- good luck w/ it all, pacman87 |
| 06:23.20 | pacman87 | thanks. i plan on cranking out some more code this weekend when it's all over and i finally have some time |
| 06:25.34 | yukonbob | very nice |
| 06:50.29 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:06.21 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 08:02.32 | *** join/#brlcad kwizart (n=kwizart@fedora/kwizart) | |
| 09:20.32 | *** join/#brlcad BeerSerc_ (n=dries@mail.psioc.net) | |
| 09:20.58 | BeerSerc_ | hi there. sourceforge is down, whereelse can I get a copy of the amd64 linux binary or source? |
| 09:32.54 | kwizart | BeerSerc_, which distrib ? |
| 10:24.39 | BeerSerc_ | kwizart: gentoo |
| 10:25.14 | kwizart | arf! at least i have a src.rpm where you might take the source from (with some patches) |
| 10:25.41 | kwizart | http://rpms.kwizart.net/fedora/development/SRPMS/brlcad-7.12.2-1.fc9.kwizart.src.rpm |
| 10:26.48 | BeerSerc_ | thank you, I'll try |
| 10:26.57 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:27.05 | mafm | howdy |
| 10:27.47 | kwizart | BeerSerc_, for the record, do you have a librt.so.1 in /lib64 on your system ? |
| 10:28.56 | mafm | still with problems creating the package kwizart? :) |
| 10:29.21 | kwizart | well, no the package works... but i guess there is still some minors things to fix |
| 10:29.28 | BeerSerc | kwizart: Yes I have |
| 10:29.53 | kwizart | at least I need to see how to deal with glibc librt.so.1 in linux system |
| 10:30.19 | kwizart | and eventully split the package between differents composents... |
| 10:30.25 | kwizart | components |
| 10:31.20 | kwizart | for example, if some files might only be needed on server side for collaborative works... and others needed for workstation side |
| 10:31.34 | kwizart | i don't know brlcad well enought to sort this for now |
| 10:38.35 | BeerSerc | kwizart: I just noticed that there is an ebuild for 7.12 in gentoo's science overlay, so installing it should not be too difficult |
| 10:39.34 | kwizart | BeerSerc, yep... i don't know how they deal with that problem thought... |
| 10:39.50 | kwizart | maybe they still use rpathes |
| 10:40.19 | BeerSerc | which problem is that exactly? I read something about glibc files, but in gentoos bugtracker, there are no bugs related to the 7.12 ebuild at all |
| 10:40.40 | kwizart | that's not a problem specific with 7.12 |
| 10:41.34 | kwizart | i would like to see this ebuild...if there is some patches from their side |
| 10:42.22 | BeerSerc | http://bugs.gentoo.org/attachment.cgi?id=149864 |
| 10:42.28 | BeerSerc | http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=77197 |
| 10:47.14 | BeerSerc | ah i found a working sourceforge mirror... so I can use the tar.bz2 ting |
| 10:47.20 | BeerSerc | s/ting/thing/ |
| 10:48.26 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@bas8-toronto63-1096669531.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 10:51.33 | kwizart | rm librtserver.so |
| 10:51.33 | kwizart | ln -s librt.so.19.0.1 librtserver.so |
| 10:57.04 | kwizart | they build tcl/tk internally ? strange for a gentoo ebuild... |
| 11:28.04 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 11:35.27 | brlcad | kwizart: bbiaw to help .. |
| 11:39.51 | brlcad | kwizart: the ebuild doesn't need to use tcl/tk internally, but there is still an issue with itcl/itck from portage iirc (and compiling them out of sync makes the build very unhappy) |
| 11:40.03 | brlcad | wanders off for a bit |
| 11:40.08 | kwizart | ok |
| 11:44.39 | BeerSerc | time for a total noobish question: How can I start brlcad? there is nothing looking like a main binary in /usr/brlcad/bin... |
| 11:51.03 | kwizart | mged ? |
| 11:52.05 | BeerSerc | ah OK. thx |
| 11:59.44 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.193.215) | |
| 12:15.43 | *** part/#brlcad BeerSerc (n=dries@unaffiliated/beerserc) | |
| 12:24.17 | louipc | heck sourceforge is down? |
| 12:24.24 | alex_joni | yup |
| 12:24.49 | louipc | heh it always seems like it just when I need to use the damn site |
| 12:25.20 | alex_joni | louipc: maybe it's just all the time, and you only notice it when you need it :)) |
| 12:25.29 | louipc | haha |
| 12:26.07 | alex_joni | google gives 450.000 results for "sourceforge down" |
| 12:26.26 | louipc | http://pastebin.ca/1002814 |
| 12:26.30 | louipc | anyways I'll stick that there |
| 12:26.46 | louipc | don't know if that's been encountered yet or not |
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| 12:45.57 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.78.254) | |
| 12:46.35 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 12:50.42 | clock_ | alex_joni: now you have to read through all of them, otherwise people tell you STFW or UTFG |
| 12:51.04 | alex_joni | clock_: sorry? |
| 12:51.33 | clock_ | alex_joni: sarcastic about the STFW acronym |
| 12:51.52 | alex_joni | did I say that? |
| 12:54.23 | alex_joni | clock_: I usually try to keep it more polite (like GIYF :) |
| 12:57.57 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 12:58.43 | louipc | hah I don't know what any of those mean |
| 13:02.54 | clock_ | AATNKWIM |
| 13:03.04 | clock_ | An Acronym That Noone Knows What It Means |
| 13:03.51 | mafm | louipc: that's funny, because in that case is perfectly applicable to you :) |
| 13:05.19 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30949 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Whoopsie, tire thickness needs dztred to be calculated first. |
| 13:19.45 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30950 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add docs for options to specify just width, ratio, or wheel diameter. |
| 13:21.02 | louipc | bwhahah |
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| 14:05.11 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 14:05.17 | brlcad | sf doesn't seem to be down now |
| 14:07.45 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 14:08.44 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:12.55 | brlcad | d_rossberg: how critical are those tcl changes? i fear they'll just get clobbered the next time tcl is updated |
| 14:13.02 | brlcad | (e.g. tcl 8.5.2 is out) |
| 14:13.36 | brlcad | and/or more importantly is there a way to work-around it that doesn't require a mod to tcl |
| 14:19.03 | d_rossberg | brlcad: don't care about this change |
| 14:19.31 | d_rossberg | if you have a new tcl version put it into the repository |
| 14:19.53 | brlcad | i don't plan to anytime soon, there's no pressing need |
| 14:20.21 | d_rossberg | if it's a problem for me i'll look after after it |
| 14:20.22 | brlcad | but just saying that someone might replace it on a whim just for the sake of upgrading (erik has that tendancy) .. didn't know if that'll break the cmake build or something |
| 14:20.29 | brlcad | okay |
| 14:21.37 | d_rossberg | the whole tcl thing is "experimental" for me :) |
| 14:22.23 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:23.55 | brlcad | hrm, anyone recall the name of the apache load testing tool? stfw isn't helping much |
| 14:26.33 | starseeker_ | jmeter? |
| 14:26.54 | starseeker_ | or apache bench? |
| 14:27.33 | *** join/#brlcad MTee (n=MT@41.233.133.230) | |
| 14:28.57 | archivist | ab |
| 14:35.57 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-122-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 14:37.04 | archivist | I couldnt get the full list of bench test tools, the bot is dead in #apache at the moment |
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| 15:29.52 | *** part/#brlcad thing2 (n=ric@203-59-26-22.perm.iinet.net.au) | |
| 16:47.08 | mafm | bye |
| 17:07.20 | louipc | ahmm |
| 17:14.16 | ``Erik | SILENCE! |
| 17:19.43 | archivist | stop shouting Im trying to sleep |
| 17:34.05 | ``Erik | oh, ok |
| 17:34.14 | ``Erik | grabs a metal trash can lid and starts banging it |
| 17:34.15 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:34.41 | archivist | zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz |
| 18:14.21 | ``Erik | thinks he spots starsuckers odd tcl link bug O.o |
| 18:14.47 | ``Erik | pretends it's a cheezburger and stalks |
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| 22:59.46 | starseeker_ | Ah HAH - http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m532f157a |
| 23:00.01 | starseeker_ | or more specifically, libtcl8.5.so => /usr/brlcad/lib/libtcl8.5.so (0xb7799000) |
| 23:00.15 | brlcad | bingo |
| 23:00.16 | starseeker_ | bad BRL-CAD, no system libtcl for you... |
| 23:00.33 | starseeker_ | now, where are you going wrong... |
| 23:00.41 | brlcad | didn't you say it was an --enable-all ? |
| 23:00.45 | starseeker_ | yep |
| 23:00.54 | brlcad | does config.log confirm that? |
| 23:01.12 | starseeker_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:01.14 | brlcad | (header at the beginning and summary at the end) |
| 23:01.44 | brlcad | oh, wait |
| 23:01.52 | brlcad | you did an ldd on an uninstalled .so |
| 23:02.00 | brlcad | that's not right |
| 23:02.09 | brlcad | you can't do that (and expect correct answers) |
| 23:02.13 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 23:02.24 | brlcad | that's why the binaries run through scripts |
| 23:02.32 | brlcad | those scripts set up the ld library paths |
| 23:02.46 | brlcad | iff you want to run the binary prior to install |
| 23:03.07 | brlcad | if you want to know the true ldd before install, you have to add it to the script |
| 23:03.21 | brlcad | e.g. to src/mged/mged near the bottom before the exec |
| 23:04.18 | starseeker_ | but the compile doesn't get that far... |
| 23:04.44 | brlcad | ah, right failing at comb? |
| 23:04.49 | starseeker_ | yep |
| 23:04.57 | brlcad | then it just amounts to what's on the compile line |
| 23:05.05 | brlcad | add that flag I mentioned to turn on verbose |
| 23:05.12 | brlcad | get the real gcc line |
| 23:05.16 | starseeker_ | --debug ? |
| 23:05.18 | starseeker_ | one sec... |
| 23:05.29 | brlcad | or copy/paste the libtool line and remove the silent option |
| 23:05.38 | starseeker_ | did that, actually... |
| 23:05.48 | starseeker_ | pastebin coming up... |
| 23:06.11 | brlcad | pastebin's getting a fair bit of spam .. someone(tm) needs to turn on recaptcha for it |
| 23:06.19 | starseeker_ | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m61107cd0 |
| 23:06.37 | starseeker_ | are we spamming the bzflag irc channel by using it? |
| 23:06.53 | starseeker_ | doubts most bzflag hackers care about brlcad... |
| 23:07.36 | brlcad | presumably there is a libtcl8.5.so in /home/cyapp/cadtoplevel/brlcad/brlcad-build/src/other/tcl/unix ? |
| 23:07.48 | brlcad | no, it's fine to use |
| 23:08.00 | starseeker_ | yes, it's there |
| 23:08.02 | brlcad | I could just as easily make that pastebin.brlcad.org |
| 23:08.10 | brlcad | it's not a symlink to nothing? |
| 23:08.16 | brlcad | it's an actual lib |
| 23:08.27 | starseeker_ | yes, seems to be |
| 23:08.40 | brlcad | then the next step is to check the lib for that symbol using nm |
| 23:09.16 | starseeker_ | goes to find out what nm is... |
| 23:09.19 | brlcad | if it's in there, then you gotta take gcc/ld into a lower level debug mode; if it's not in there, you have to look into tcl's build to find out if it's supposed to be |
| 23:10.41 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 23:10.47 | starseeker_ | I'm looking for libtcl with nm in librt.so? |
| 23:11.27 | *** join/#brlcad cad64 (n=80731b0a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 23:11.33 | brlcad | nope |
| 23:11.38 | starseeker_ | Is the presence of -ltcl8.5 harmless? |
| 23:11.52 | brlcad | you're looking at the symbols in libtcl8.5.so |
| 23:11.56 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 23:12.10 | brlcad | is the symbol it's failing on actually in that library |
| 23:12.50 | starseeker_ | 00023590 t TclReFree |
| 23:13.41 | brlcad | out of curiostiy, if you move/delete /usr/brlcad/* does it still fail? |
| 23:14.07 | starseeker_ | yep |
| 23:15.30 | *** join/#brlcad cad64 (n=80731b0a@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 23:44.52 | starseeker_ | is out of his depth here... |
| 00:09.12 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 00:09.39 | ``Erik | src/other/tcl/generic/regexec.c uses TclReFree(), but I see nowhere in src/other/tcl where a definiton for that exists |
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| 00:59.26 | starseeker_ | sigh - what's the next level of gcc debug? |
| 01:02.59 | brlcad | heh, no luck? |
| 01:03.02 | brlcad | returns with mass quantities of sushi |
| 01:03.31 | starseeker_ | it should work, but it doesn't - grrrrr |
| 01:05.25 | brlcad | starseeker_: have you tried deleting all of /usr/brlcad ? |
| 01:05.35 | starseeker_ | I moved it |
| 01:05.42 | brlcad | and still persists |
| 01:05.48 | starseeker_ | yep |
| 01:05.53 | brlcad | k (good) |
| 01:07.06 | starseeker_ | swaps in tcl 8.5.2 just for the heck of it... |
| 01:12.55 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 01:12.55 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-20 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
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| 01:12.57 | starseeker_ | nah, that just busts something else |
| 01:12.59 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (i=1000@s142-179-54-198.bc.hsia.telus.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 01:13.31 | brlcad | howd you swap it in? |
| 01:13.51 | starseeker_ | copied it in, left the parts that weren't in the tarball |
| 01:13.51 | starseeker_ | crude way |
| 01:13.51 | starseeker_ | probably not right |
| 01:13.51 | brlcad | heh |
| 01:14.15 | brlcad | yeah, not likely to work, even on a minor |
| 01:14.24 | brlcad | since it's in libtcl from what you said ... |
| 01:14.33 | brlcad | it could be ordering |
| 01:14.45 | brlcad | try running the gcc compile line directly, put the -ltcl8.5 on the end |
| 01:14.46 | starseeker_ | ok... |
| 01:15.07 | brlcad | might have to still be before -lz |
| 01:18.54 | brlcad | any luck? |
| 01:19.20 | starseeker_ | having to restore tcl... |
| 01:20.14 | brlcad | rm -rf src/other/tcl src/other/tk && svn up |
| 01:20.35 | starseeker_ | I did - rebuilding now :-) |
| 01:20.47 | starseeker_ | 's machine must be slower than brlcad's |
| 01:27.19 | starseeker_ | doesn't seem to change it |
| 01:38.56 | brlcad | does narrow the problem though |
| 01:39.22 | brlcad | next thing to check would be to search for that symbol name through the sources for the libraries being linked, see who's using it |
| 01:52.14 | starseeker_ | you mean a source code grep, or some sort of nm hunt? |
| 01:52.15 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-070-122-118.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 01:58.36 | starseeker_ | Interesting - an nm on the librt.so from rev 30848 gives a very different response than the one from the current rev |
| 01:59.54 | starseeker_ | the nm report from 30848 indicates that librt.so at that time was NOT referencing TclReFree |
| 02:04.16 | yukonbob | !go joe hardy |
| 02:06.56 | starseeker_ | the identical build command, supplied in both the old tree and the new, results in identical commands being generated (modulo path differences) |
| 02:07.07 | starseeker_ | so the difference must be elsewhere |
| 02:26.58 | starseeker_ | but where... |
| 02:27.26 | starseeker_ | is there a chance the new libged is pulling in (or trying to) something that wouldn't have otherwise been pulled into librt? |
| 02:27.58 | starseeker_ | is having a hard time coming up with any other plausible differences in librt or tcl... |
| 02:37.54 | starseeker_ | no, that's not right - librt doesn't depend on libged |
| 03:42.31 | starseeker_ | The actual gcc compilation of comb.c didn't include librt before, as near as I can tell... but compiling without that makes no difference in the new tree I can see... |
| 03:55.29 | starseeker_ | nm .libs/regionfix.o |grep Tcl |
| 03:55.29 | starseeker_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:55.42 | starseeker_ | That must be where librt is getting it from |
| 04:07.54 | starseeker_ | datapoint: removing the tcl/generic inclusion from the regionfix compile allowed the remainder of the librt build to successfully complete |
| 04:39.48 | starseeker_ | OK, beyond any shadow of a doubt this is dodging the issue (which is why I'm not committing it), but the following just got me past librt on a compile: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m7a39831 |
| 04:45.14 | starseeker_ | wonders if maybe it's as simple as switching the order of tcl/unix and tcl/generic in configure.ac, but doesn't want to interrupt the build to test it... |
| 04:50.29 | starseeker_ | Hmm, OK, now that's weird. |
| 04:50.44 | starseeker_ | I just completed a build with the previous tweak, and installed it. |
| 04:51.10 | starseeker_ | rt (from the command line) DOES work - I created a tire and raytraced it successfully. |
| 04:51.36 | starseeker_ | mged, however, segfaults immediately |
| 04:52.01 | starseeker_ | in gdb, this is the report: |
| 04:52.14 | starseeker_ | 0xb7e81ac6 in dgo_open_cmd (oname=0x8132f18 "mged", wdbp=0x0) |
| 04:52.14 | starseeker_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:52.14 | starseeker_ | 296 BU_LIST_APPEND(&HeadDGObj.l, &dgop->l); |
| 04:52.24 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 04:52.52 | starseeker_ | I don't know if this is related to the hack I just made... |
| 04:52.58 | starseeker_ | or some problem with libged? |
| 04:53.30 | starseeker_ | looks at clock, realizes it's a new day, and decides to get some sleep... |
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| 09:25.10 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 13:07.29 | Axman6 | how awesome. freebsd has a brl-cad port. it compiles fine, just can't run |
| 13:08.05 | ``Erik | what's it do? |
| 13:08.14 | ``Erik | you might have to set your ITCL_PATH and ITK_PATH |
| 13:08.41 | Axman6 | heh, well the error does mention that. what should they be set to? |
| 13:08.58 | ``Erik | uhmmm, something like /usr/brlcad/lib/it{cl,k} |
| 13:09.11 | ``Erik | should fix the mged.sh script |
| 13:11.00 | ``Erik | port comes up fine for me without having to set those O.o |
| 13:11.07 | ``Erik | and I have no reference tot he incr stuff in my environment |
| 13:11.17 | ``Erik | amd64/fbsd7 |
| 13:13.39 | Axman6 | YAY! brl-cad finally! |
| 13:13.53 | Axman6 | yep, amd64 |
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| 13:48.57 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 13:49.32 | ``Erik | now, did you have the failure when you ran /usr/local/bin/mged.sh or /usr/local/brlcad/bin/mged ? |
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| 15:03.37 | andrecastelo | hi folks |
| 15:40.33 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 15:40.38 | brlcad | how goes it? |
| 15:40.46 | andrecastelo | sup brlcad :D |
| 15:40.57 | andrecastelo | finally finished my final exams |
| 15:41.06 | andrecastelo | so i'm pretty happy |
| 15:47.15 | brlcad | congratulations |
| 15:47.24 | brlcad | did ya pass? ;) |
| 15:51.02 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-58.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:17.39 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yup, i took 5 courses this semester, passed on 3 and i'll know about the last two on monday |
| 16:24.23 | prasad_ | andre, u a soccer fan? |
| 16:37.40 | andrecastelo | prasad_: not really, why ? |
| 16:38.57 | prasad_ | ronaldo in the news much? |
| 16:41.11 | andrecastelo | prasad_: oh yeah, i've heard about it |
| 16:41.52 | andrecastelo | he thought they were girls :b |
| 16:43.47 | prasad_ | heh |
| 17:40.21 | ``Erik | jiggles his buddha belly |
| 17:41.16 | ``Erik | grats, andré |
| 17:41.56 | ``Erik | ronaldo likes his trannies? |
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| 18:58.04 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30951 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: Make sure CPPFLAGS are listed before the TCL generic directory for out of source builds - otherwise regfree gets defined by TCL and points to TclReFree, which seems to be undefined. |
| 19:10.17 | brlcad | aha, HeadDGObj isn't initialized |
| 19:11.41 | brlcad | bingo |
| 19:23.17 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30952 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/setup.c: need to call the new Ged_Init() so that the HeadDGObj is initialized. it was initialized in Rt_Init(), but no longer with the new libged. unbreaks mged. |
| 19:38.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30953 10/brlcad/trunk/ (77 files in 2 dirs): rename ged.c and ged.h to mged.c and mged.h so that the header doesn't conflict with the ged.h that was added for the new libged library |
| 19:42.03 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 19:53.03 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875A70.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 19:59.31 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30954 10/brlcad/trunk/ (17 files in 10 dirs): remove BRLCAD_DEBUG from the build, Bob says it's no longer needed. |
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| 20:58.20 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 21:18.56 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r30955 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Begin cleanup to make tire follow HACKING formatting conventions. |
| 21:20.17 | ``Erik | flicks boogers |
| 21:22.07 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30956 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: adjust Blinn method evaluator to follow existing inside/outside convention |
| 21:26.36 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30957 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: yay for magic numbers, changed constant to SMALL_FASTF for near-zero testing |
| 21:27.58 | ``Erik | scratches his head |
| 21:28.10 | ``Erik | flips brlcad off for mucking with his temporary hack :D |
| 21:28.21 | brlcad | mehs |
| 21:28.39 | ``Erik | here's one for ya |
| 21:28.41 | brlcad | temp hacks have a tendancy to outlast their hacker ;) |
| 21:29.24 | ``Erik | when I mged -c blah.g l mb.s, I get correct numbers (sweat == 1). When I rt blah.g mb.s, sweat == 0. |
| 21:29.45 | ``Erik | have any idea what's going on with my ball sweat? :D |
| 21:30.18 | brlcad | obviously mged excites you and rt does not |
| 21:30.31 | ``Erik | looks through prep |
| 21:30.46 | ``Erik | (prep is not called by mged, correct?) |
| 21:31.35 | ``Erik | I'm, uh, about to feel very retarded. |
| 21:32.01 | ``Erik | hangs head in shame |
| 21:32.22 | brlcad | tsk tsks |
| 21:32.46 | ``Erik | and damnit, some fool went and committed to my file |
| 21:33.00 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30958 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: carry the goo value into prepared geometry. |
| 21:37.23 | ``Erik | at least I got some fun ball sweat jokes out of it |
| 22:58.56 | ``Erik | flicks boogers |
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| 03:20.27 | brlcad | ahh, that was fun |
| 03:22.35 | iraytrace | isn't sure he wants to know ;-) |
| 03:23.24 | brlcad | :) nothing so controversial.. |
| 03:23.39 | brlcad | just a fun dinner at the olive tree |
| 03:23.50 | iraytrace | nods |
| 03:49.29 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:50.52 | louipc | oh no |
| 03:51.01 | starseeker_ | eh? |
| 03:51.43 | louipc | mged segfaults right off the bat on my new build :( |
| 03:51.51 | louipc | investigates |
| 03:51.53 | starseeker_ | Are you at latest svn? |
| 03:51.59 | starseeker_ | brlcad fixed a bug that did that today |
| 03:52.02 | louipc | 10950 |
| 03:52.10 | louipc | awww dang |
| 03:52.17 | starseeker_ | need to update :-) |
| 03:52.47 | brlcad | my bad, should be fixed now |
| 03:55.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30959 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): |
| 03:55.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: including all CPPFLAGS before the tcl includes could have some potentially |
| 03:55.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: undesirable side effects, just include the one we know is needed to find the |
| 03:55.43 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: right regex header. in related news, move the regex.h header out of our include |
| 03:55.44 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: dir to src/other where it belongs, updating the build as needed. |
| 04:04.09 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30960 10/brlcad/trunk/db/: ignore pinewood.g and lockfile |
| 04:07.27 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30961 10/brlcad/trunk/db/: hm try harder to ignore lockfile, somehow slipped off. also ignore the operators.asc2g temp file |
| 04:15.21 | starseeker_ | Fun with tires: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/m35-oldandnewtires.png |
| 04:19.09 | starseeker_ | wonders if it would be a good idea to stash the input parameters in attributes somewhere ... |
| 04:22.03 | brlcad | very nice |
| 04:22.35 | starseeker_ | <will smith voice>old and busted, vs. new hotness</will smith voice> ;-) |
| 04:22.37 | brlcad | you could replace them all and add a new top-level m35.new or something that has them instead of the existing for all tires, add the input params as attributes to the tires |
| 04:23.57 | brlcad | alas the m35 top-level hierarchy is a classic that can't change (but you can certainly add additional top-levels) |
| 04:24.07 | starseeker_ | cool |
| 04:24.18 | starseeker_ | would need to do something about the inner wheel first though |
| 04:24.38 | starseeker_ | quite evidently the wrong hub design for an m35 |
| 04:25.14 | yukonbob | starseeker_: do you have two new tires on that truck? |
| 04:25.22 | starseeker_ | yep :-) |
| 04:25.24 | starseeker_ | good eye |
| 04:25.33 | yukonbob | :) |
| 04:25.39 | yukonbob | and ea. has their own hub design? |
| 04:25.57 | starseeker_ | no, I just ignored the overlaps for the quick'n'dirty screenshot |
| 04:26.04 | starseeker_ | that's the old wheel hub up front |
| 04:26.13 | yukonbob | nods |
| 04:26.23 | starseeker_ | back wheel has a larger one swallowed by the new tire |
| 04:26.40 | starseeker_ | can't find any actual docs on what tires the m35 uses/used... |
| 04:26.49 | yukonbob | starseeker_: cool work -- it's neat to see the power of automation in action |
| 04:27.53 | yukonbob | hi-5s starseeker_ |
| 04:27.57 | starseeker_ | thanks :-) |
| 04:29.02 | starseeker_ | should sleep now... |
| 04:30.53 | yukonbob | prepares to grab 7.10.5, or whatever was just tagged, and try on this machine; maybe get a few hours of playing in before I hit 7.12.x again... |
| 04:31.43 | yukonbob | brlcad: q: I've got the whole svn archive on my machine now -- can I tease the latest 7.10.x out of that, or do I have to do a co of svn w/ the proper tag? |
| 04:32.45 | yukonbob | starseeker_: nn, chat later |
| 04:46.03 | yukonbob | ??wasn't 7.10.5 just tagged |
| 05:02.23 | louipc | 7.12.3? |
| 05:03.01 | louipc | hmm |
| 05:07.43 | yukonbob | no -- /me is still thinking of the 7.10.x series... (haven't got 7.12.x working on my machine yet) |
| 05:10.11 | louipc | yeah I will try to get that working |
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| 10:43.59 | mafm | hai |
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| 14:03.32 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 14:04.07 | brlcad | still eagerly awaits http://brlcad.org/wiki/GSoC_2008_OpenGL_GUI_Framework :) |
| 14:04.52 | brlcad | should probably be sans "GSoC_2008_" too, it's intended to be a general design doc |
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| 14:30.52 | mafm | brlcad: do you think so? I still didn't submit it with that name, I think |
| 14:35.49 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 14:36.14 | mafm | removing the GSOC part |
| 14:36.42 | brlcad | the intent is to have a design doc that stays on the wiki that describes the design intent long long past gsoc, developer documentation |
| 14:36.58 | PrezKennedy | howdy brlcad! |
| 14:37.04 | brlcad | it could be in the doc to say that this was part of gsoc, that you're the one working it, etc of course |
| 14:37.16 | brlcad | howdy PrezKennedy |
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| 14:38.04 | brlcad | mafm: http://brlcad.org/w/index.php?title=GSoC_2008_OpenGL_GUI_Framework&action=history :-) |
| 14:43.08 | mafm | ah ok, just that |
| 14:43.12 | mafm | so I moved it now |
| 14:45.26 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r30962 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: Blinn blob method normals added, thanks to Ed for the math fu. Lame assertion removed. |
| 14:47.08 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30963 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS NEWS): add a local variables footer so the files enter text mode and fill to column 70 |
| 15:07.34 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, how many hours of sleep did you say you usually get? |
| 15:14.26 | ``Erik | brlcad, japan house? |
| 15:14.36 | prasad2 | ah japan house |
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| 15:17.06 | ``Erik | morning, andré |
| 15:17.13 | andrecastelo | morning ``Erik |
| 15:20.02 | mafm | hi |
| 15:20.11 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 15:32.54 | PrezKennedy | mmm japan house |
| 15:32.57 | PrezKennedy | i miss chinese |
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| 17:28.50 | ``Erik | ahhh, nice long lunch |
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| 18:42.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30964 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Add mirror_origin parameter. The axis parameter has been changed to mirror_dir. |
| 18:45.18 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30965 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/mirror.c: This enhancement adds the ability to mirror using an arbitrary vector. The vector's origin can also be specified. |
| 18:47.23 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30966 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgmodel.c: Modified the mirror command to make use of the more flexible rt_mirror. The command syntax has also changed. |
| 18:59.46 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30967 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/help.tcl: Update mirror command's help string. |
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| 20:19.16 | ``Erik | scratches his pointy head |
| 20:25.35 | mafm | bye |
| 20:25.45 | ``Erik | later |
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| 00:18.25 | starseeker_ | 's eyebrows go up as he beholds the depths of m35... |
| 00:18.31 | starseeker_ | eeeeeekkkk |
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| 01:39.11 | louipc | hmm |
| 02:05.18 | ``Erik | hookers |
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| 03:43.42 | brlcad | yukonbob: nope, it's not yet |
| 03:43.53 | brlcad | we're apparently still in some "problem" category for the coverity scanner |
| 04:21.34 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:44.16 | yukonbob | fscking coverity |
| 04:47.08 | yukonbob | brlcad: "hi", btw -- hope things are going well :) |
| 04:51.05 | brlcad | they are! :) |
| 04:51.17 | brlcad | found his beloved blade the other day! .. *giddy* |
| 04:51.52 | brlcad | i'd thought i'd lost it over a year ago, presumed I'd left it in a hotel in arizona as that was the last time I'd remembered seeing it |
| 04:52.28 | brlcad | turns out it was just buried really deep in my bicycling gear (which I *had* checked as I searched for it for months) |
| 04:52.51 | brlcad | so I found it when I fully emptied out my gear bag for a ride the other day .. so excited :-) |
| 04:53.00 | brlcad | loves his kershaw knife |
| 04:58.52 | yukonbob | lost his his nice ka-bar this summer, leather wrapped handle goodness, in somebody else's clutches now, I'm sure... |
| 04:59.04 | yukonbob | *this past summer |
| 05:03.43 | brlcad | http://www.bladehq.com/images/knives/brand/kershawblurtantotacbkserr.jpg <-- spring assisted kershaw .. solid action, beatiful precision :) |
| 05:05.45 | brlcad | is curious to try a crkt assist |
| 05:19.18 | yukonbob | disconnects his screen -- internet is teh sux0rs in new digs, atm |
| 07:17.21 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30968 10/brlcad/trunk/src/README: Add a line about libged in src/README |
| 07:17.34 | brlcad | woot |
| 07:43.51 | CIA-20 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30969 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob rewrote mirror with new options for mirroring about an arbitrary/given vector specified by a direction, origin point, scalar value the given vector and the traditional x/y/z axes. |
| 09:08.59 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 09:09.02 | quentusrex | Hello |
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| 11:40.20 | ``Erik | godDAMNIT |
| 11:40.29 | ``Erik | now I'm writing book length emails. Damnit. |
| 13:50.55 | brlcad | muahahaha |
| 13:51.13 | brlcad | hello quentusrex |
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| 20:24.32 | quentusrex | hello brlcad. |
| 20:24.58 | quentusrex | I just watched iron man and that movie just revitalized my interest in MCAD. |
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| 23:03.19 | brlcad | quentusrex: heh, really? why's that |
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| 02:05.39 | quentusrex | brlcad, when you see the movie you'll understand. |
| 03:10.53 | starseeker_ | Man, the Aptera is one nifty looking car |
| 03:11.18 | starseeker_ | bets that body shape can't be made without breps... |
| 03:12.14 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30970 10/brlcad/trunk/INSTALL: Add line to INSTALL mentioning doc/README.Linux |
| 03:13.21 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30971 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/README.Linux: Add notes about building for Arch Linux to doc/README.Linux. |
| 03:26.09 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30972 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/brlcad.sh: Remove comments from Arch Linux profile.d script. |
| 03:29.50 | starseeker_ | Alright, NOW we're talking. This would make an awesome model, given sufficient insanity on the part of the modeler: http://www.vcalc.net/disassy/ |
| 03:31.38 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r30973 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD: |
| 03:31.38 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: Fix PKGBUILD: |
| 03:31.38 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: add bc as makedepends, |
| 03:31.38 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: add x86_64 to arch, |
| 03:31.38 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: update md5sum for profile.d script, |
| 03:31.39 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: properly install bdl license. |
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| 04:37.48 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30974 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/ (Makefile.am rcs2log): no longer need rcs2log |
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| 11:56.29 | mafm | hai |
| 12:49.45 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:54.34 | mafm | a sunday in the lab... no goot |
| 14:13.16 | mafm | quiet in here today :) |
| 14:35.30 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, some days up some days down |
| 14:35.33 | brlcad | busy coding ;) |
| 14:43.01 | mafm | :) |
| 14:44.06 | mafm | btw, about the commit rights... how's that supposed to be handled for projects as mine, creating new tools? |
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| 14:53.07 | andrecastelo | good morning folks :D |
| 15:02.55 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 15:06.50 | pacman87 | good morning |
| 15:15.48 | brlcad | mafm: just like anyone else working on the project |
| 15:16.29 | brlcad | you'll still have to integrate with other code and even though it's a "new" tool, it should still integrate well |
| 15:18.30 | brlcad | the idea is to be comfortable working on any part of the code, not just working on a particular piece in isolation |
| 15:19.55 | mafm | so what am I supposed to do, write patches for other areas? |
| 15:22.08 | brlcad | ideally yes, or even better for the areas that might relate to what you're working on |
| 15:23.00 | brlcad | which for yours might be something in libpkg, libged, librt, libbu, libbn |
| 15:28.14 | brlcad | great to see the wiki update |
| 15:29.02 | brlcad | fyi, i moved the comments over to the discussion page |
| 15:29.34 | pacman87 | are there any plans for GSoC student blogs/dev logs? |
| 15:29.56 | brlcad | pacman87: plans of what sort? |
| 15:30.31 | pacman87 | or just use the wiki user page? |
| 15:31.36 | brlcad | mm, well like I mentioned in the e-mail, that's something for you to sort out with your mentor really, but either someplace on the wiki or on a blog you set up somewhere would be my suggestion |
| 15:32.01 | brlcad | just something that everyone can get to ideally |
| 15:32.45 | brlcad | your user page would work great I'd imagine given that's already available |
| 15:34.10 | mafm | okish |
| 15:34.21 | mafm | the mentor didn't say or modify anything |
| 15:34.34 | brlcad | he mostly works during the week, family on weekends |
| 15:34.42 | brlcad | he was waiting for the wiki update |
| 15:35.01 | brlcad | feel free to e-mail him to let him know :) |
| 15:35.47 | mafm | I did -- that's what I meant with "he didn't say anything" |
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| 15:36.05 | brlcad | ah, okak |
| 15:37.11 | brlcad | it took you a week to upload it, I'd give him more than a day to say something ;) |
| 15:52.27 | mafm | guess so |
| 16:02.06 | pacman87 | i added links to my design document and dev log in http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
| 16:02.28 | brlcad | cool |
| 16:09.45 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30975 10/rt^3/trunk/autogen.sh: update to the latest autogen.sh script |
| 16:33.04 | brlcad | mafm: woot :) |
| 16:37.05 | mafm | it wasn't me, it was a pixie |
| 16:37.08 | mafm | damn pixies |
| 16:37.31 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:37.37 | brlcad | hugs the pixies |
| 17:34.56 | yukonbob | waves in -- hello cadheads |
| 17:44.48 | mafm | hi yukonbob |
| 17:45.48 | yukonbob | hey mafm -- I'm reading you've got the Power of Pixies on your side... |
| 17:52.32 | louipc | http://pbfcomics.com/archive_b/PBF103-Nice_Shirt.gif |
| 17:53.16 | mafm | not really, they act on their own |
| 18:23.55 | yukonbob | louipc: *exactly* |
| 18:23.57 | yukonbob | :) |
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| 19:11.56 | yukonbob | hey clock_ |
| 19:13.38 | mafm | well, going home |
| 19:13.51 | mafm | waves cad-heads bye bye :P |
| 19:42.32 | thing0 | morning |
| 19:49.12 | brlcad | howdy thing0 |
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| 21:10.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30976 10/brlcad/trunk/ (18 files in 18 dirs): |
| 21:10.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: add the -no-undefined libtool LDFLAGS flag so that libtool will ensure that all |
| 21:10.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: symbols in each library are resolved properly. this helps preserve more obscure |
| 21:10.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: portability problems for systems like windows and aix. required a few mods for |
| 21:10.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: mac os x including providing -fexceptions as a libtool -Wc compilation flag |
| 21:10.29 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: (since 1.5 strips -f options). also pass -framework options through with |
| 21:10.31 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: -Xlinker so that libtool similarly doesn't strip them from the linkage |
| 21:25.26 | CIA-29 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30977 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: add -w to the default make flags so that the path is included in the build logs for context |
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| 11:06.45 | mafm | hallo |
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| 11:34.29 | thing0 | hey |
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| 12:00.23 | Axman6 | brlcad: yt? |
| 12:01.09 | Axman6 | or any devs really... |
| 12:03.04 | pacman87 | ~ask |
| 12:03.04 | ibot | ask is probably Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 12:03.58 | alex_joni | pacman87: I assume the "against our will" applies more frequently.. :) |
| 12:07.55 | Axman6 | well i was just looking for a discussion on some stuff. i was wondering if veclib (specifically the vForce stuff) was being used in brl-cad on OS X (or whether it would be at all useful) |
| 12:10.05 | Axman6 | has functions that do things like "Set y[i] to the exponential function of x[i], for i=0,..,n-1" that uses the vector engine on 32, 64 bit, PowerPC and Intel procs, and uses them fully. |
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| 12:33.35 | Axman6 | i think i killed CIA-20... |
| 12:40.45 | alex_joni | Axman6: nope, it's beeing restarted |
| 13:00.20 | brlcad | Axman6: nope, it's not being used for anything |
| 13:00.51 | Axman6 | would it be at all helpful? |
| 13:01.14 | brlcad | where would you hook it in? :) |
| 13:02.06 | Axman6 | i dunno, you're the dev :P |
| 13:02.12 | Axman6 | i'm just the ideas man! |
| 13:02.13 | brlcad | vector libs works best when they are fully integrated vertically |
| 13:02.40 | Axman6 | what do you mean? |
| 13:03.21 | brlcad | aside from being platform specific, which historically we've avoided for longevity/portability/maintenance as they tend to come and go into popularity over the years |
| 13:03.44 | Axman6 | ah, fair enough. thought you might say that |
| 13:03.49 | Axman6 | still... it looks cool :P |
| 13:03.54 | clock_ | brlcad: platforms are like fads ;-) |
| 13:03.55 | brlcad | what I mean is that of course it's been thought about ;) but it's not just a matter of "just using it" in the least |
| 13:04.07 | Axman6 | yeah |
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| 13:05.03 | Axman6 | oh well, just a thought. seems like it's the sort of thing brl-cad would do a lot of, and the routines used here are designed to be _fast_. (not that brl-cad needs much help there) |
| 13:05.11 | brlcad | even if we hooked it into the few places in our math library as a backend, you wouldn't likely see any performance gains because it wouldn't be pervasive |
| 13:05.25 | brlcad | you'd still end up stalling the vector unit every few intructions |
| 13:05.36 | Axman6 | how come? |
| 13:05.52 | clock_ | brlcad: I still didn't do the last bit to finish the video into releasability :( |
| 13:05.59 | Axman6 | i'm not all that familiar (at all) with the workings of brl-cad |
| 13:06.55 | brlcad | Axman6: because of the way vector math works, they get their speed by keeping a vector pipeline fed and crossing the boundary from system mem to the vector units infrequently |
| 13:07.31 | brlcad | without vertical integration where you restructure all computations specifically around that, you don't get those speed benefits because the pipeline isn't fed |
| 13:07.37 | brlcad | it stalls |
| 13:07.46 | brlcad | you can actually end up running slower |
| 13:07.47 | Axman6 | i thought that the point of this library was to do that as fast as it could be done. i could be wrong though. |
| 13:08.01 | Axman6 | interesting |
| 13:08.10 | brlcad | you're just reading the marketing materials, there's a lot more to it |
| 13:08.49 | Axman6 | i'm sure this'll all make more sense once once i've finished my 5 years at uni |
| 13:09.07 | brlcad | they're intentionally written as OMG!! *FAST* ponies!?!! |
| 13:09.49 | Axman6 | well i'm reading the header file, which just tells you what it does |
| 13:10.08 | brlcad | there have been efforts to take advantage of vectorization, but that requires a fair bit of data restructuring |
| 13:10.53 | brlcad | if someone(tm) implemented all of the vshot() routines in librt, then a vector lib would be more beneficial |
| 13:10.56 | Axman6 | fair enough. i wasn't sure how data was represented in the source |
| 13:11.02 | brlcad | but just hooking it in to the math lib wouldn't help |
| 13:12.05 | Axman6 | what does vshot() do? |
| 13:15.55 | brlcad | shoots a bundle of rays at a primitive |
| 13:16.00 | brlcad | vectorized |
| 13:16.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30978 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Added libged and support for x64. |
| 13:16.30 | Axman6 | anyway, i had better get to sleep. i've got google tech talk to watch tomorrow ay ANU :) |
| 13:16.37 | Axman6 | at* |
| 13:17.01 | Axman6 | night all, and don't have too much fun or you'll hurt yourselves! |
| 13:18.00 | brlcad | cya |
| 13:18.11 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30979 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (143 files in 143 dirs): Added builds for x64. |
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| 14:34.39 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30980 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/magic.c: Include bu.h |
| 14:37.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30981 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/globals.c: Include bn.h |
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| 15:03.27 | yukonbob | waves in, packs out -- later cadheads |
| 15:04.28 | brlcad | howdy cya yukonbob |
| 15:04.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30982 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/magic.h src/libbu/magic.c): sort entries so they are alphabetical by group and consistent with the header (though noteworthy that not all in the header are listed here) |
| 15:27.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30983 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): rename BUHOOK to BU_HOOK for consistency |
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| 15:43.22 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone :D |
| 15:43.48 | prasad_ | gmorning |
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| 18:07.29 | brlcad | hello quentusrex |
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| 18:14.47 | mafm | :) |
| 18:14.57 | mafm | that looked like a tsunami |
| 18:15.07 | mafm | see you tomorrow! |
| 18:15.11 | brlcad | see ya! |
| 18:29.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30984 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/globals.c: missed commit for BUHOOK |
| 18:52.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30985 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): consolidate all of the magic functions, defines, and other logic for magic number checking over into magic.[ch] |
| 19:02.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30986 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: clean up comments |
| 19:33.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30987 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/attach.c: need ged.h for vo funcs |
| 19:39.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30988 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.h: ws |
| 19:53.26 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30989 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/clone.c: fix some places in the v4 support where NAMESIZE needs to be used instead of CLONE_BUFSIZE, make tracker pair up bu_free with the bu_calloc calls |
| 20:14.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30990 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (6 files in 6 dirs): Mods to get things working with libged. |
| 20:17.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30991 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (dg.h ged.h raytrace.h): Mods related to moving things from librt to libged. |
| 20:20.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30992 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Update to 7.12.3 |
| 20:21.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30993 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/track.c: This moved to libged. |
| 20:22.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30994 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (importFg4Section.c wdb_comb_std.c): This moved to libged. |
| 20:26.08 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30995 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (57 files in 5 dirs): Mods related to moving things from librt to libged. |
| 20:38.30 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30996 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Add ifdef __RTGEOM_H__ around rt_bot_sort_faces and rt_bot_decimate declarations. |
| 22:08.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30997 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: need importFg4Section.c track.c wdb_comb_std.c |
| 22:27.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r30998 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/regex.h: |
| 22:27.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: revert 30995 as regfree does need to be defined to TclReFree else unresolved |
| 22:27.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: symbols on other platforms. the problem (presumably on windows) is probably the |
| 22:27.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: build finding the src/other/libregex/regex.h header before tcl's from |
| 22:27.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: src/other/tcl/generic/regex.h; the include paths should include tcl first in |
| 22:27.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: order for tcl to compile its regex interface. |
| 22:32.13 | *** part/#brlcad pacman_87 (n=timothy@nat-204-179.arlut.utexas.edu) | |
| 01:42.18 | starseeker_ | gives cat catnip toy, watches as cat goes insane |
| 01:53.37 | yukonbob | gets a metric ton of msvc updates w/ his svn update |
| 02:28.21 | brlcad | thems crazy wincoders |
| 02:28.43 | brlcad | viva la revolución! |
| 02:30.21 | yukonbob | :? -- the revolution to join the Windows users? |
| 02:30.46 | brlcad | el cinco de mayo! |
| 02:30.59 | brlcad | burps |
| 02:31.14 | yukonbob | is about to get a Windows laptop (from work) that will be the first time he's sat down in front of Windows box since about 1995. |
| 02:31.29 | brlcad | the shame and horrors |
| 02:32.10 | yukonbob | it is what it is, I guess -- I'll get Tcl, Perl, Cygwin, XEmacs, etc, on there ASAP, though. |
| 02:33.10 | brlcad | there are precompiled Emacs binaries if you want to avoid X |
| 02:33.29 | yukonbob | ya -- that's the route I was planning... |
| 02:34.35 | brlcad | takes a bit more effort to get other tid bits like gnu find (M-x grep-find) and other things that some bits of emacs might expect, but it works great |
| 02:51.19 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
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| 03:19.57 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.94.89) | |
| 03:42.12 | yukonbob | ya -- there's things like diff, grep, and some other unix-y bits that are required for "normal" operation, but cygwin will provide that stuff w/o _needing_ to get into X Window System as well... |
| 03:44.37 | yukonbob | will have to see if there's a "screen" equiv for Windows... This will be interesting, in a way, to find out the utilties that I use day-to-day but don't realize that I use that often... and finding equiv for Windows. |
| 07:02.30 | louipc | well the thing about guitar hero is that it accompanies you and it doesn't give you stuff that's too hard right away |
| 07:02.37 | louipc | and it tells you what buttons to push :D |
| 07:02.55 | louipc | that would be cool if there was a program to do that on real instruments |
| 07:03.17 | louipc | then you could be shredding like a pro in no time! |
| 07:03.48 | louipc | oops |
| 07:19.46 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 08:12.40 | clock_ | By: John Anderson (johnranderson): Added -k option to rt to produce a faster (but approximated) render of a cutaway view. |
| 08:13.09 | clock_ | By: Cliff Yapp (starseeker): Cutting flag with ronja.g seems to work well - closing bug. |
| 08:13.18 | clock_ | This cutting flag -k is meant I guess? |
| 08:13.44 | clock_ | How does it internally work and why is it approximated and in which way approximated? |
| 09:56.02 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
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| 11:06.14 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:06.58 | mafm | hi |
| 11:45.51 | starseeker_ | clock_: check the source code for details, but basically it's defining where to cut at a different level |
| 11:46.27 | starseeker_ | clock_: I'm not sure what John means by approximated. |
| 11:47.31 | starseeker_ | Yes it's the k flag |
| 11:48.17 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 11:48.32 | starseeker_ | Ah, hi clock_ |
| 11:49.14 | starseeker_ | figures - didn't notice you weren't on when I responded |
| 11:51.29 | starseeker_ | Correct, it's the k flag - I'm not sure what John means by approximated, but when I tested it on your file it seemed to do well. |
| 12:07.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r30999 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: Revert back to previous revision. |
| 12:10.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31000 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged_dm.h: Needs ged.h |
| 12:49.02 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31001 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: Added include path to libregex. |
| 12:58.09 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.199.54) | |
| 13:08.53 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:00.42 | brlcad | howdy d_rossberg |
| 14:01.51 | d_rossberg | moin moin brlcad |
| 14:04.10 | ``Erik | fast PINK ponies, actually. |
| 14:06.50 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.198.225) | |
| 14:47.08 | ``Erik | hrm, -w is a gnu extention to make, not in bsd make |
| 14:53.48 | brlcad | ah, drat |
| 14:56.20 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.26.193) | |
| 14:56.34 | ``Erik | morning, andré |
| 14:57.19 | ``Erik | "subtle like a moose" |
| 14:58.38 | andrecastelo | morning ``Erik :D |
| 14:58.51 | andrecastelo | i've been a little away for a while, but i'm back |
| 15:00.09 | ``Erik | did you get your grades back? |
| 15:03.44 | andrecastelo | yup, passed everything |
| 15:04.00 | ``Erik | grats |
| 15:04.48 | andrecastelo | thanks :D |
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| 17:25.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31002 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/libutahrle/rle_getcom.c: quell const qualifier discardation warnings |
| 17:28.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31003 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/URToolkit/cnv/cubitorle.c: quell decl warnings |
| 17:30.56 | brlcad | andrecastelo: congrats! :) |
| 17:33.37 | andrecastelo | thanks brlcad :D |
| 17:39.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31004 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/dg_obj.c: Modified dgo_rt_set_eye_model()'s eye_model calculation. It's now using the diagonal length of the bounding box to back out the eye point. |
| 17:47.17 | mafm | congratulations andrecastelo :) |
| 17:47.36 | andrecastelo | thanks mafm :D |
| 17:50.26 | mafm | you're still starting the second term, right? |
| 17:53.20 | andrecastelo | yes i'm starting it next week |
| 17:54.15 | andrecastelo | hey folks, gotta go |
| 17:54.20 | andrecastelo | i'll be back later |
| 17:54.28 | mafm | I don't know if the plans of Google for a Southern Hemisphere SoC would apply to Brazil too :) |
| 17:55.10 | andre|away | mafm: it would actually be great, but we don't have that much more time in the summer than we have in winter, so, wouldn't be so different :b |
| 17:55.22 | mafm | :D |
| 17:55.28 | andre|away | mafm: cya later |
| 17:55.30 | andre|away | :D |
| 17:56.11 | mafm | inté! |
| 18:28.44 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.198.225) | |
| 19:43.23 | mafm | bye |
| 19:58.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31006 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: If windows, set an invalid parameter handler. |
| 20:10.24 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-77-212.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:12.18 | brlcad | there is also little chance (with the current web app) that there will be a southern hemi gsoc |
| 20:12.32 | brlcad | maybe after melange comes online next year |
| 20:12.56 | brlcad | so far, though, the process burden to have the summit, manage the students, etc, really does take all year for the folks involved |
| 21:28.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31009 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/ (Makefile.am brlcad.nsi copying.txt): gah, remove the incorrect copying.txt file that refers to the gpl. make the nsis build file refer to the top-level COPYING and README instead of the incorrect copying.txt and outdated html manual page |
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| 23:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31010 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: (log message trimmed) |
| 23:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Bob fixed a long-standing bug reported by Tom Browder where rt/rtedge were |
| 23:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: incorrectly clipping the render due to an invalid eye point calculation. The |
| 23:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: problem was traced down to code commited all the way back in 1997 where the |
| 23:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: longest dimension of the bounding box was used as the default eye point backout |
| 23:30.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: distance. This in turn could cause clipping if the diagonal distance was |
| 23:30.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: considerablly larger and when rendering from a non-orthogonal view. it does not |
| 00:14.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31011 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 8 dirs): |
| 00:14.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: this renames the wdb_binary / dbbinary mged command to just 'binary' .. this |
| 00:14.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: seems to be what it is actually used in archer already, what makes more sense, |
| 00:14.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: and is more consistent with other commands. happened to fix a mistake in the |
| 00:14.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: html docs in the process. also updated the command's help so that it's less |
| 00:14.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: brain dead wrong in response to tom browder's sf bug 1532699 (dbbinary -o help |
| 00:14.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: is misleading) |
| 01:09.06 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:21.05 | yukonbob | waves in.. |
| 01:36.55 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob :) |
| 01:37.02 | brlcad | clears out some bug reports |
| 01:42.07 | starseeker_ | finally gets the docbook toolchain to do his bidding... |
| 01:42.15 | louipc | hooray x2 |
| 01:44.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31012 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: try to prevent -Lyes/lib64 -Iyes/include etc from happening if the user only provides --with-jdk or --with-java without a path. |
| 01:54.42 | brlcad | woot, only three left before the bugs are back down to just one page! |
| 02:06.09 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31013 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/solids.sh: don't need to refer to $1/regress, just use the files |
| 02:06.30 | brlcad | two.. |
| 02:08.45 | brlcad | one more! |
| 02:12.00 | brlcad | woot! |
| 02:28.35 | starseeker_ | wow. |
| 02:28.52 | starseeker_ | checks in disbelief... |
| 02:29.45 | starseeker_ | #define state_of_jaw "dropped" |
| 02:33.27 | starseeker_ | nice job! |
| 02:35.47 | brlcad | has since cleared about a half dozen others .. down to only 42 open bugs woo hoo :-) |
| 02:41.45 | yukonbob | updates svn co, gets ready to do some (unrelated to BRL-CAD) Tcl work |
| 02:52.02 | brlcad | nice to see the bug list actually decrease for once .. didn't realize how many issues got fixed with the latest 7.12 |
| 02:52.23 | brlcad | down to about 40 now, few more that might be fixed but need investigating |
| 02:53.09 | yukonbob | is the dsp still on the list? |
| 02:53.27 | brlcad | thinks he needs to host a BRL-CAD Bug Zapper |
| 02:53.44 | brlcad | yeah :( |
| 02:53.47 | brlcad | well sorta.. |
| 02:54.02 | brlcad | it was never reported to the tracker, just to the BUGS file |
| 02:54.10 | brlcad | these are tracker items I was clearing out |
| 02:54.46 | yukonbob | needs to work-out "issues" w/ Tcl on his system (Tcl wrt NetBSD in general, /me thinks), including getting 8.5 up/running |
| 02:55.02 | yukonbob | ah -- |
| 02:55.57 | yukonbob | it's nice to see bugs from 1997 getting squashed... ;) |
| 03:24.13 | louipc | hmm wow sf.net wants me to run 27 jscript files |
| 03:32.21 | quentusrex | Hello |
| 03:32.25 | quentusrex | Anyone around? |
| 03:32.39 | yukonbob | nobyd -- shh.. |
| 03:32.43 | quentusrex | :) |
| 03:32.44 | yukonbob | *nobody |
| 03:33.28 | quentusrex | Do you know if there has been any progress into taking multiple pictures of a 3D object and translating that into CAD? |
| 03:33.47 | yukonbob | ?by magic |
| 03:34.35 | quentusrex | I'm talking about 3D object detection, and translation into some form of Computer modeling. |
| 03:35.20 | yukonbob | has no idea what project/task quentusrex is talking about, of if this a general "start of the art" question for the whole field of 3d visualization |
| 03:35.30 | yukonbob | *state of the art |
| 03:35.41 | yukonbob | damn latency, again (still) |
| 03:36.44 | quentusrex | Well, I have experience in video and image transcoding(which basically is just dealing with many individual frames) and I had a through. With object detection in images, what about having a video? with many frames? |
| 03:37.12 | quentusrex | If there are several images with the objects 'detected' couldn't those be modeled? |
| 03:37.30 | quentusrex | by taking many 2D 'slices' of the profile of an object? |
| 03:39.01 | quentusrex | wouldn't you think so yukonbob? |
| 03:42.20 | yukonbob | I'll qualify my answer with "I'm not an expert" |
| 03:43.54 | yukonbob | I'd be skeptical -- you'd need "perfect" lighting, perfectly configured, and work w/ objects that conform to formats you "know", I'd think |
| 03:44.25 | yukonbob | after all, video isn't 3d, no matter if you shoot images of the real world |
| 03:44.53 | louipc | har har I opened another bug report. |
| 03:46.13 | yukonbob | so it's an interpolation job... also depednds on what you expect to get out of it -- BRL-CAD specfically uses CSG, which wouldn't work well with your idea, since a _lot_ of what a CSG odel can be is not necessarily visible -- BREP, otoh, might work to some degree. |
| 03:46.16 | louipc | quentusrex: yeah I saw a program that would help do that but it didn't take slices |
| 03:46.57 | louipc | it took points on the image and somehow analysed it |
| 03:47.38 | yukonbob | guesses you'd also need to know objects material/finish, to know how light interracts w/ it... |
| 03:48.27 | yukonbob | because light is the only metric you've got when dealing w/ an image... |
| 03:50.46 | yukonbob | is inclined to find the "issues" w/ questions like this -- I'm sure it'd be a fun project, and results could be impressive. |
| 05:20.48 | pacman87 | http://www.cs.unc.edu/Research/urbanscape/ |
| 05:21.17 | pacman87 | a bit late to the discussion, but this kind of looks like what you're describing |
| 05:21.37 | brlcad | tunes in |
| 05:21.51 | yukonbob | waves |
| 05:22.30 | yukonbob | would is interested if pacman87 or brlcad have comments about the preceeding... |
| 05:22.39 | yukonbob | looks at pacman87's link |
| 05:23.50 | brlcad | i've actually had a research project directly related to what he's suggested "on tap" for several years now |
| 05:23.51 | yukonbob | pacman87: kewl |
| 05:24.11 | brlcad | lots of thoughts and ideas on the subject, it's an entirely non-trivial problem, but intersting nonetheless |
| 05:24.46 | brlcad | there are a couple groups working on model reconstruction from video/photos, pretty much in its infancy right now |
| 05:25.17 | yukonbob | s/would is/is/ |
| 05:26.00 | yukonbob | brlcad: seems interesting, but "messy" to me -- esp. when in the headspace of the precision/correctness of dealing w/ BRL-CAD -type issues |
| 05:26.13 | yukonbob | feh |
| 05:26.16 | brlcad | http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/Xplore/login.jsp?url=/iel5/10468/33215/01565435.pdf?temp=x is another group (based off research from stanford iirc) |
| 05:26.50 | yukonbob | miilitary probably _loves_ this stuff, though, for quick/dirty recon |
| 05:27.35 | yukonbob | send in automaton which sends out signal in RT... review, attack! |
| 05:27.57 | brlcad | it's the ultimate in reverse modeling techniques .. just video tape the thing and *poof*, 3D model on computer |
| 05:28.11 | brlcad | goal-wise at least |
| 05:28.26 | brlcad | it'll happen eventually (at high-res), most of the pieces are there |
| 05:28.26 | pacman87 | re: need to know objects material/finish, to know how light interracts w/ it... |
| 05:28.37 | yukonbob | well... depending on goal... is so dirty, but that may be fine... |
| 05:28.41 | pacman87 | i'd think that's only a problem for very shiny stuff |
| 05:28.53 | brlcad | shiney stuff isn't really that hard |
| 05:28.54 | pacman87 | with reflections that change depending on your viewing angel |
| 05:28.55 | pacman87 | angle |
| 05:29.04 | yukonbob | pacman87: or transparent/translucent, /me imagines |
| 05:29.09 | brlcad | in a single image it is, even with just a couple frames, you can correlate really easily |
| 05:29.25 | brlcad | soft bodies are a bitch |
| 05:29.41 | yukonbob | "soft body"? |
| 05:29.55 | yukonbob | ie: a dog, vs. a building? |
| 05:30.01 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:30.03 | brlcad | people |
| 05:30.06 | brlcad | plastic bags |
| 05:32.48 | brlcad | just about anything highly deformable (e.g. people), or with ill-defined or hard-to-detect boundaries (e.g., hair, fur), liquids, plastics under a load, something undergoing a deformation .. all not something that can be captured via video/images really well/easily/at all |
| 05:33.16 | brlcad | quentusrex: why do you ask? you interested in working on that? :) |
| 06:26.53 | brlcad | louipc: thanks for the report.. |
| 07:00.09 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:02.10 | louipc | brlcad: sure thing |
| 07:56.01 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:28.24 | quentusrex | brlcad, Well, I'm currently busy on a project that is going corporate. So for the next year or so I'll be really busy. But I'd love to work on something like this. |
| 08:28.47 | quentusrex | The next company I start I hope will deal more directly with AI and robitics issues. |
| 08:30.06 | quentusrex | Real world application for something like this would be(for the military) is flying a drone over a city and then being able to have a 3D map of the city. |
| 08:30.28 | quentusrex | and moving soft body objects like dogs and humans would just be considered 'noise' |
| 09:52.04 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:58.21 | mafm | allo |
| 10:26.19 | clock_ | What I find fascinating if you turn the view in BRL-CAD and do clockwise or counterclockwise circles with the mouse, it rotates around the axis of view |
| 10:26.47 | clock_ | the bigger circles, the larger rotation per completed circle |
| 10:27.07 | clock_ | This must be some property of the algebraic group of rotation, any explanation? |
| 10:54.37 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.23.133) | |
| 11:15.17 | quentusrex | Also, for a project like this I wouldn't expect a perfect rendering of what ever the object is. I would think it would still need a person to 'fix the fine details' but it would give a significant head start on the modeling process. |
| 11:18.13 | clock_ | quentusrex: BRL-CAD produces an almost perfect rendering |
| 11:18.49 | quentusrex | sorry clock_, that comment is in relation to a much earlier conversation |
| 16:03.32 | clock_ | Oh my bugreports are being processed |
| 16:03.35 | clock_ | I appreciate that. |
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| 17:22.45 | brlcad | any czech speakers here? |
| 17:31.55 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away (n=chatzill@189.71.62.7) | |
| 17:32.23 | andrecastelo | good morning :D |
| 18:19.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31014 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (command.c nirt.1): |
| 18:19.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Change behavior of backout command in interactive nirt - backout flag can now be |
| 18:19.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: activated and deactivated, and repeated invocations of backout will not increase |
| 18:19.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: the backout distance with each invocation. Also, change of origin due to |
| 18:19.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: backout use in shoot is now temporary - previous value is restored after shot is |
| 18:19.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: complete. |
| 18:22.09 | mafm | brlcad: I think clock_ does -- if you can wait for him to log again |
| 18:23.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31015 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Add NEWS note for nirt change |
| 18:25.11 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, I know he does as do two other guys |
| 18:25.17 | brlcad | but I don't see theem, so figured I'd query ;) |
| 18:27.54 | mafm | it's a bit confusing, since he has swiss ISPs :) |
| 18:28.54 | mafm | 1) Whitespace -- Indents are 4 characters, tabs are 8 characters. |
| 18:29.09 | brlcad | yes? |
| 18:29.44 | mafm | how can you indent to 4 characters in emacs then? |
| 18:30.02 | brlcad | there are emacs local variable footers in all files |
| 18:30.16 | brlcad | it should be automatic |
| 18:30.49 | brlcad | if you create any new files with sh/template.sh, it'll also have the correct footer |
| 18:31.23 | brlcad | otherwise the answer more specifically is you set the indentation to 4 and then just hit tab, emacs will do the right thing |
| 18:31.23 | mafm | lemme check |
| 18:31.48 | brlcad | the footers set up the indentation style |
| 18:32.16 | brlcad | there's also a vi/vim line with similar decls |
| 18:32.55 | mafm | hmm, is the "stroustrup" thing? I thought that the "tab-width: 8" was the one working for indentation |
| 18:33.39 | brlcad | yeah, it used to be explicit |
| 18:33.52 | brlcad | but then the file style was set, which for stroustrup is 4 char indents |
| 18:34.58 | brlcad | e.g. at the bottom of http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/tags/rel-7-8-4/src/libbu/association.c?revision=27207&view=markup |
| 18:35.25 | brlcad | c-basic-offset for c-mode files |
| 18:35.36 | brlcad | but since it's redundant with a style set, it was removed |
| 18:37.21 | brlcad | tab-width basically just describes where the tab stops are at, used during indentation |
| 18:39.27 | mafm | I see |
| 18:46.21 | mafm | int the_answer() { return 42; }; |
| 18:46.33 | mafm | aren't one-line functions forbidden? :) |
| 18:56.55 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:57.17 | brlcad | omfg, clock's perpend actually tessellates |
| 18:57.51 | brlcad | at least with the latest sources, so either my bot fixes fixed the dangling face errors or just better roll of the dice |
| 18:58.14 | brlcad | just took it forever to tessellate .. 15 hours |
| 18:58.25 | mafm | try to buy lottery today, just in the case |
| 19:01.10 | brlcad | :) |
| 19:01.20 | brlcad | mega millions is up to 160M or something |
| 19:03.13 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 19:07.49 | mafm | I tend to be the luckiest among my family and friends thugh, by not buying it |
| 19:07.58 | mafm | so at least I don't waste money :) |
| 19:16.37 | mafm | well, I go home now |
| 19:16.45 | mafm | or drinking a beer first, maybe :) |
| 19:17.00 | mafm | bye! |
| 19:25.15 | brlcad | png results here, http://brlcad.org/tmp/perpend/ |
| 19:30.31 | brlcad | wow, down to less than 35 bugs |
| 20:24.21 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 20:24.30 | brlcad | 6howdy yukonbob |
| 20:24.43 | yukonbob | 7howdy back, bugkilla |
| 20:45.41 | PrezKennedy | howdy y'all |
| 20:45.46 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 20:46.47 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.62.7) | |
| 20:54.19 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hey erik |
| 21:09.37 | brlcad | hola andrecastelo |
| 21:09.59 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad :D |
| 21:10.30 | brlcad | how's it going? |
| 21:10.38 | andrecastelo | i'm fine, you ? |
| 21:10.49 | brlcad | peachy :) |
| 21:10.59 | andrecastelo | i've started writing a mlt_def.h, with a few structure definitions |
| 21:11.01 | brlcad | happy that the bug reports were cut in half |
| 21:11.10 | brlcad | cool |
| 21:11.16 | andrecastelo | cool, heard about that |
| 21:11.22 | andrecastelo | but i kinda got a problem |
| 21:11.37 | brlcad | you should post it up as a patch ;) |
| 21:11.38 | andrecastelo | i'm going to use struct point_list, that i created in viewarea.c (in rtarea) |
| 21:11.50 | andrecastelo | where can i add it so that i may use it in mlt as well ? |
| 21:12.34 | brlcad | depends whether you're going the liboptical route or isolated tool |
| 21:13.06 | andrecastelo | i'm going isolated tool ;) |
| 21:13.27 | brlcad | okay, then just put it in your header for now then |
| 21:13.35 | andrecastelo | hm ok, then |
| 21:14.15 | brlcad | or keep it in its own header |
| 21:14.30 | brlcad | so it can be moved around to whereever makes sense |
| 21:14.50 | andrecastelo | ok.. |
| 21:15.24 | andrecastelo | i'll add some stuff and then upload as a patch so you can give me some feedback, can i do that ? |
| 21:15.46 | brlcad | otherwise, raytrace.h normally/presently holds most of the rendering structures |
| 21:15.56 | brlcad | yeah, that'd be great |
| 21:16.14 | andrecastelo | ok, just a minute, i need a reboot |
| 21:16.18 | brlcad | after one or two of those, should be able to get you committing directly |
| 21:16.27 | brlcad | or reboot :P |
| 21:17.10 | brlcad | notes there is an rt_pt_node, linked list of points |
| 21:17.54 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p548744AB.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:30.37 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.62.7) | |
| 21:30.50 | andrecastelo | k, back |
| 21:35.15 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've updated my working copy but i have some conflicts in misc/win32-msvc8.. my msvc updated some files in there to be compatible to the latest msvc9.. what should i do ? can i simply ignore them ? |
| 21:45.27 | brlcad | andre|afk: if you have conflicts, you can't ignore them -- it puts markers in the files |
| 21:46.01 | brlcad | should probably blow the directory away, svn up again, then cp win32-msvc8 to win32-msvc9 to update |
| 21:46.10 | brlcad | or provide a diff of the updates it made for vc9 |
| 21:46.20 | brlcad | as a patch (presuming it works with 8) |
| 21:47.21 | andre|afk | brlcad: there's no problem in deleting it ? the source code i have is different from the one in the svn, because of the center points patch |
| 21:48.51 | brlcad | you'd have to readd those changes to the build files |
| 21:49.04 | brlcad | you can try to resolve the conflicts, merge the changes in |
| 21:49.17 | brlcad | but if you've not made more than a couple edits, probably easier to just make them again |
| 21:57.41 | andrecastelo | brlcad: is it easier to use a command line svn? i'm using tortoiseSVN, is that a problem ? |
| 00:21.47 | brlcad | not a problem for me :) |
| 02:46.45 | brlcad | yay, season two of code monkeys starts up in june |
| 05:17.35 | yukonbob | ?"code monkeys" --- sounds like a sitcom |
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| 09:23.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31016 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: (log message trimmed) |
| 09:23.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: reword the nirt backout line just so that we can make the commit log more |
| 09:23.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: substantial. commit messages for NEWS lines need to be detailed as they're used |
| 09:23.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: during configuration reviews. To quote Cliff's original log message for this |
| 09:23.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: feature: Change behavior of backout command in interactive nirt - backout flag |
| 09:23.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: can now be activated and deactivated, and repeated invocations of backout will |
| 09:23.22 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: not increase the backout distance with each invocation. Also, change of origin |
| 10:31.44 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:33.19 | mafm | hi |
| 10:49.32 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 10:49.43 | brlcad | good morning |
| 11:04.43 | mafm | doing fine |
| 11:12.26 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31017 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/brlcad.1: rfbd was renamed to fbserv about a decade ago |
| 11:14.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31018 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (fbserv/fbserv.c libfb/if_remote.c): patch from pedro that reportedly helps the build on openbsd. basically need to include sys/types.h before other sys headers like sys/socket.h. |
| 11:22.47 | starseeker_ | erm. sorry brlcad |
| 11:23.04 | starseeker_ | was trying to keep it short and sweet in the NEWS file... |
| 11:23.21 | brlcad | np, NEWS needs the opposite |
| 11:25.31 | Axman6 | so... anyone here good with C? |
| 11:25.36 | starseeker_ | Ah, gotcha - you're using the commit logs that alter the NEWS file, not going back and grabbing the actual logs from commits in support of change |
| 11:25.38 | Axman6 | heh |
| 11:26.03 | starseeker_ | turns the crank on his brain to get it started, Model T Ford style... |
| 11:27.54 | brlcad | there's no direct associativity with news line items and sets of commits that correspond, so it needs to be in the commit message itself (or part of the original change/commit where the message should also be detailed) |
| 11:28.41 | brlcad | the changelog is generated, but that's simply way too much information and doesn't condense to a summary of user-visible changes |
| 12:01.01 | clock_ | brlcad: I see now a lot of my bugreports have been processed I appreciate that |
| 12:19.56 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.95.0) | |
| 12:29.03 | Axman6 | brlcad: are you free at all? i was wondering if you could help me figure something out |
| 12:32.20 | Axman6 | just wondering what the point of some of the stuff in http://developer.apple.com/hardwaredrivers/ve/downloads/vMathLib.tgz is |
| 12:35.50 | Axman6 | if anyone's interested (it's just a single, simple C file), i'm wondering what the point of uint32_t u[4]; is in the vectF_t. commenting it out didn't have any effect to the results :\ |
| 12:37.43 | mafm | Axman6: u array is not used at all |
| 12:38.04 | Axman6 | i know. so i was wondering what the point of it might be |
| 12:38.46 | mafm | that doesn't have much to do with knowing C, but with the domain of the problem :) |
| 12:39.59 | mafm | probably he just forgot to remove it, or didn't write a test for that part as he initially intended, or something like that |
| 12:40.54 | mafm | the .h is a template and not even included anywhere |
| 12:41.12 | mafm | so I guess that the author didn't care much about polishing the program :) |
| 12:42.01 | Axman6 | yeah well, it's meant to be an example of how to use some of their frameworks, and demonstrate how much faster they are |
| 12:43.24 | mafm | :) |
| 12:46.09 | Axman6 | and their vForce stuff is pretty impressive. simple interface to complex stuff, that works as fast as it can on 4 different architectures, and takes advantage of any vector hardware too. |
| 12:51.04 | mafm | it's an algebra library or something like that? |
| 12:58.20 | Axman6 | vector computations, that's about all i know. |
| 12:59.12 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.203.41) | |
| 13:00.34 | Axman6 | its functions take pointers to arrays of vectors (one or two inputs, and an output), and just dose it's thing on the inputs, putting the results in the output array |
| 13:08.47 | mafm | I see |
| 13:08.47 | Axman6 | anyway, bedtime for me. have fun guys |
| 13:08.56 | mafm | night :) |
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| 14:26.01 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.95.0) | |
| 15:21.17 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31019 10/brlcad/trunk/ (TODO doc/deprecation.txt include/raytrace.h): add to the todo about deprecating the hit_point and hit_normal members of a hit structure, the need for an RT_HIT_POINT macro and how the existing routines are/were deprecated a while ago. |
| 16:34.57 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54873ED1.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:18.22 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31020 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/: kill the old STABLE branch, going to copy from last release (easier than merging) |
| 18:43.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31021 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: More format tweaking. |
| 18:45.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31022 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/help.tcl: Update the mirror entry. |
| 18:47.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31023 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/Db.tcl: Add log and mirror commands. |
| 18:49.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31024 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/Mged.tcl: Added the mirror command. |
| 18:49.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31025 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Added the mirror command. |
| 18:50.40 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31026 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl: Added help entry for mirror. |
| 18:53.56 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31027 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added log.c and mirror.c to build. |
| 19:01.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31028 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/tcl.c: Need dg.h for declaration of Dgo_Init(). |
| 19:04.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31029 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Added a few members to struct rt_wdb. |
| 19:08.17 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31030 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declarations for ged_mirror() and ged_log(). Added a few macros that are initially being used by ged_mirror() and ged_log(). |
| 19:22.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31032 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgmodel.c: f_mirror() has been modified to use libged's ged_mirror(). |
| 19:24.31 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:35.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31033 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (log.c mirror.c): Initial check-in. |
| 19:36.17 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31034 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Added mirror.c and log.c |
| 19:37.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31035 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Added mirror and log commands. |
| 19:40.36 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31036 10/brlcad/trunk/include/dg.h: RT_DGO_NULL changed to GED_DGO_NULL. |
| 19:49.16 | mafm | night |
| 20:17.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31037 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_metaball.c: fix a_onehit handling |
| 21:56.03 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 22:07.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31038 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/wdb_obj.c tclscripts/lib/Mged.tcl): Generalized the mirror and log commands. |
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| 22:12.10 | *** part/#brlcad pH (n=1@net12.mlyniec.gda.pl) | |
| 22:24.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31039 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/: re-add STABLE branch, using the last fully-tested 7-12-2 as the starting point |
| 23:04.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31040 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: more consistent use of ws. space after comma, space after reserved statements, curlie cleanup, and don't wrap for the sake of fitting to an arbitrary column. doxygenify comments. |
| 23:08.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31041 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: remove mass quantities of trailing ws |
| 23:46.18 | starseeker_ | Heh - thanks brlcad |
| 23:46.31 | starseeker_ | sorry I was so messed up there... |
| 23:52.11 | brlcad | np |
| 23:53.40 | brlcad | fyi, the sh/ws.sh script will perform some of the cleanup for you (trailing ws, indentation, blank lines, etc) |
| 23:58.35 | starseeker_ | Ah - good to know |
| 00:46.10 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 00:46.15 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:34.54 | PrezKennedy | howdy yukonbob, brlcad, other folks i know... ;) |
| 02:47.00 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
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| 10:15.10 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:18.00 | mafm | hi |
| 11:35.11 | brlcad | moin |
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| 13:01.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31042 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/CMakeLists.txt: |
| 13:01.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Added include path to libregex |
| 13:01.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: this include path has to be before tcl/generic |
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| 17:15.54 | mafm | brlcad: one thing in the case that I'm not around during the weekend |
| 17:19.57 | mafm | I have to go to a congress next week, and I take the opportunity to go and see my folks after months of not seeing them |
| 17:20.30 | mafm | and to make a couple of exams |
| 17:20.57 | mafm | so I won't be available until the official week of starting with coding phase for gsoc |
| 17:22.04 | mafm | (maybe if I get my personal laptop back I'll connect from time to time in the meantime, but it's unlikely) |
| 17:26.35 | ``Erik | µO.o |
| 17:27.39 | ``Erik | Saying there is too much order in the universe for it to be random chance is like a puddle remarking at how well a pot hole conforms to its shape. |
| 17:27.39 | mafm | what's that? |
| 17:27.59 | ``Erik | the mu was a mistake, it should've been "O.o" |
| 17:28.27 | ``Erik | hehehehe "Linux is actually better than BSD because you can roast marshmallows over the schedular flamewars." |
| 17:28.28 | mafm | oh :D |
| 17:38.27 | mafm | only scheduler? :) |
| 17:39.06 | mafm | you can get about a dozen flames related to the kernel itself... |
| 17:39.35 | mafm | gplv2 vs v3, kernel debugger... etc |
| 17:50.08 | ``Erik | ohyeah? ext4 vs jfs vs xfs vs reiser |
| 17:50.10 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:50.39 | ``Erik | ubuntu vs gentoo vs debian vs fedora vs slackware vs suse vs ... |
| 17:50.42 | ``Erik | :) |
| 17:53.10 | archivist | SVR3 ftw |
| 17:56.28 | ``Erik | BSD43 |
| 17:56.40 | ``Erik | *fight* |
| 17:58.19 | archivist | I started with unix on an Altos 1000, a 12mhz 386 |
| 18:00.14 | ``Erik | cool, my first venture was linux on a 66mhz 486 :/ but I've gone back and installed bsd4.3 on a vax11/780 emulator (simh) to get the vm tuned to VGR |
| 18:00.44 | ``Erik | and I've done plenty with archaic machines running sunos, hpux, aix, irix, etc at various jobs :) |
| 18:07.04 | archivist | when you look back at apps designed for those old beasts, modern apps are so slow and bloated in comparison |
| 18:07.58 | ``Erik | oh yeah |
| 18:08.01 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31043 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/intaval/regtab.cpp: quell warning about deprecated conversion (declare/define using ptr instead of array) |
| 18:08.31 | ``Erik | and looking at the bsd43 source code for apps, libraries, kernels compared to the linux/gnu stack, it was short, sweet, clean, elegant... pleasant |
| 18:09.22 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31044 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (3dm/Makefile.am Makefile.am): fix broken variable names in FAST_OBJECTS |
| 18:10.16 | archivist | the database I worked on had chains/links forward and reverse and to from child parent, hardly needed to waste index lookup time |
| 18:10.18 | ``Erik | fbsd and obsd seem to be somewhere inbetween :/ |
| 18:16.53 | brlcad | mafm: okay, thanks for the heads up .. have you been able to talk much with bob? |
| 18:17.05 | brlcad | s/much/at all/ |
| 18:20.04 | mafm | he replied, but didn't say much except that he agreed :) |
| 18:21.37 | brlcad | he's a man of few words ;) |
| 18:21.48 | brlcad | more inclined to dive into code |
| 18:22.18 | ``Erik | morning, brlcad |
| 18:22.23 | brlcad | howdy |
| 18:23.15 | ``Erik | tracks yet another fine TclReFree bug O.o |
| 18:23.45 | brlcad | I tracked through the sources, tcl does define/provide it .. it's just obscured through a double-#define |
| 18:24.07 | brlcad | so if it gets the wrong header, there'll be problems |
| 18:24.26 | ``Erik | well, the one I'm seeing, I *THINK* it means to grab /usr/include/regex.h instead of $(top_srcdir)/src/other/tcl/generic/regex.h |
| 18:25.04 | mafm | who are the mentors apart from him -- erik, drossberg, sean... who's the last one? |
| 18:25.37 | ``Erik | ~/src/brlcad/build/i686-apple-darwin8.11.1/src/libsysv$ grep TclReError *.o |
| 18:25.38 | ``Erik | Binary file libsysv_la-regex.o matches |
| 18:25.38 | brlcad | bob and john |
| 18:26.05 | ``Erik | brlcad is not a mentor, he's a meta-mentor |
| 18:26.07 | mafm | bob1961 is mine... what's john's nickname here? |
| 18:26.12 | ``Erik | daytona |
| 18:26.24 | mafm | ah ok :) |
| 18:26.37 | brlcad | ``Erik: ah, yes.. opposite problem .. another lib that find's tcl's regex.h would be bad |
| 18:27.07 | brlcad | mafm: so did you sort out a reporting means? |
| 18:27.35 | mafm | sean is a kind of demiurge... his nickname even fades with the project :P |
| 18:27.39 | ``Erik | thinks bob is an old-school email guy, not irc/im |
| 18:27.55 | mafm | the first time that I joined I assumed that "brlcad" had to be a logging bot or something like that :) |
| 18:27.58 | brlcad | ~dict demiurge |
| 18:28.04 | ``Erik | we'll learn him. :> |
| 18:28.29 | brlcad | heh, learn him good |
| 18:29.01 | mafm | <brlcad> mafm: so did you sort out a reporting means? -- I think that I put a link from one page to there -- the wiki I think, I'm not a fan of blogs |
| 18:29.29 | ``Erik | I got 3 metric tons of .3dm and corresponding .g models with a mapping table (and status/notes). I asked him to send it to you, too, brlcad |
| 18:29.42 | brlcad | mafm: so to your user page? |
| 18:30.08 | ``Erik | Redmond weather reports are predicting thunderstorms, with a 90% chance of scattered chair showers. |
| 18:30.39 | mafm | yep |
| 18:30.46 | brlcad | mafm: have you gone through the checklist, any items remaining? |
| 18:30.52 | brlcad | aside from commit |
| 18:32.05 | mafm | the one of assigning copyright do needs something special, like for GNU folks with the snail-mail permission? |
| 18:32.57 | brlcad | no, it's informal understanding, shared copyright |
| 18:33.33 | brlcad | I can write up something more pragmatic if you feel it's needed |
| 18:33.35 | mafm | otherwise I think that I don't have anything else from the HACKING file |
| 18:33.45 | brlcad | mafm: I'm referring to http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Checklist |
| 18:33.49 | mafm | nope, I don't think so |
| 18:34.23 | starseeker | Yay, I can upload the oed tutorial now... |
| 18:34.38 | brlcad | mafm: so the eight bullets on the Plan are your milestones, I take it? |
| 18:35.00 | mafm | Bob agreed, so I think so |
| 18:35.09 | brlcad | okay, just checking |
| 18:37.20 | mafm | who's making the protocol for communications (something was started, at least as templates, AFAICR)? |
| 18:39.50 | brlcad | that's currently being worked on along with the geometry engine work |
| 18:42.15 | brlcad | mafm: probably the easiest to work with for starters will be to just write a simple driver backend that will talk a basic protocol that is sufficient for what you need |
| 18:42.33 | yukonbob | morning cadheads |
| 18:42.54 | brlcad | e.g. modifying/forking g_transfer to feed you the data you need |
| 18:43.47 | mafm | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Expectations#Design_documents -- the "-- Thanks --" is a |
| 18:43.54 | mafm | == Thanks == maybe? |
| 18:43.57 | brlcad | that example tool basically sends geometry to a calling client |
| 18:44.11 | brlcad | mafm: nah, that was intentional |
| 18:44.34 | mafm | ah |
| 18:44.35 | mafm | hi yukonbob |
| 18:45.35 | brlcad | wanted a footer that doesn't get added to the menu |
| 18:46.32 | brlcad | mafm: be sure to e-mail bob about your expected schedule |
| 18:47.28 | brlcad | if you can have any code/patches to review by then, that could be helpful .. so they can be reviewed while you're away on a congress and commit access can be established |
| 18:48.07 | brlcad | could even be today, they're not meant to be substantial .. the point is getting a communication process established |
| 18:48.09 | mafm | hmm, nice example that g_transfer, hadn't seen it |
| 18:49.43 | mafm | the patches can be simple ones? I thought that we'll be without commit access for the first couple of weeks or so |
| 18:49.59 | brlcad | it's doing things a "little" differently than what you need, e.g. you don't need the 'actual' geometry, you need names, values, display lists, etc |
| 18:50.26 | brlcad | mafm: i sure hope not that long, that'd indicate some problem imo |
| 18:50.59 | brlcad | they can be very simple |
| 18:52.07 | brlcad | two or three small patches that show you know how to communicate a concise non-trivial change (that conforms to HACKING) is all it really takes, could be done in just a couple hours if there's a mentor to review/apply them |
| 18:52.25 | mafm | I thought that it would be the expected time for regular would-be contributors, with project members giving the permissions instead of asking for them :D |
| 18:53.12 | mafm | which btw reminds me of IRC rules about operators of the channel and so on :D |
| 18:53.25 | brlcad | well, yeah you don't need to ask for it .. if there's a problem you could end up working all summer via patches, but if it was working out that badly, the student would probably get dropped after a few weeks |
| 18:53.32 | mafm | ok I'll see what I can do |
| 18:53.46 | mafm | if not today I'm probably going to come to the lab during the weekend too :S |
| 18:54.29 | brlcad | at least one of the students has already done enough patches and has just been on my todo to turn on their commit access already |
| 19:02.32 | ``Erik | awesome! |
| 19:02.38 | ``Erik | checking whether the C compiler works... Bad system call (core dumped) |
| 19:02.45 | brlcad | neat |
| 19:02.56 | mafm | (wait, call from physicist...) |
| 19:03.11 | ``Erik | might have to /quit irc this weekend O.o |
| 19:03.23 | ``Erik | which is sad, cuz this session has been on for 141 days |
| 19:05.39 | brlcad | the shame |
| 19:05.55 | brlcad | 15:05 Irssi uptime: 117d 3h 26m 7s |
| 19:06.25 | ``Erik | mine'd be more, but I shut the machine down when I bought the UPS for home |
| 19:06.26 | brlcad | [sean@bz (Fri May 09 15:06:08) ~]$ uptime 3:06PM up 117 days, 5:05, 16 users, load averages: 0.76, 1.50, 1.41 |
| 19:10.41 | archivist | hmm I can never keep this box running that long, crashy debian |
| 19:10.58 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:11.01 | ``Erik | pets his fbsd |
| 19:11.46 | archivist | hmm 9 days (was trying to feed it ram) |
| 19:11.52 | brlcad | archivist: .bz's last uptime was just a few hours shy of 400 days before someone kicked a power cable |
| 19:12.00 | ``Erik | "trying"? O.o |
| 19:12.42 | archivist | it didnt like the ram i stuffed in so went back to memory challenged |
| 19:12.51 | starseeker | proceeds to make up a temporary place in doc, noting it will likely change later... |
| 19:13.11 | ``Erik | *snrkt* |
| 19:13.19 | ``Erik | /* just a hack, I'll fix it later */ |
| 19:13.20 | ``Erik | *cough* |
| 19:13.58 | archivist | placeholder, another word for kluge |
| 19:14.00 | ``Erik | hm, this fbsd box is a 650mhz p3 with 128m ram, running crap including two versions of gnome stack at the same time O.o |
| 19:14.01 | starseeker | No, more like /* Doing something other than barfing png files into doc toplevel, organize more intelligently after more thinking is done */ |
| 19:14.38 | ``Erik | needs to port his ancient mail client up to gnome2 |
| 19:14.53 | archivist | dual PII here with 440meg but well into swap |
| 19:15.32 | brlcad | returns to his review write-up of Balvenie scotch |
| 19:15.51 | ``Erik | drives by brlcads place and steals a bottle O:-) |
| 19:16.00 | ``Erik | not going to daves going away shindig, I take it? |
| 19:16.47 | ``Erik | hopes they have drinkable beer |
| 19:16.50 | ``Erik | later, kids :D |
| 19:17.18 | starseeker | considers staying off the roads until ``Erik makes it back home... |
| 19:18.03 | archivist | has he crashed another car? |
| 19:18.26 | starseeker | not to my knowledge |
| 19:26.11 | brlcad | ``Erik: you should try this stuff |
| 19:26.15 | brlcad | if you drink scotch that is |
| 19:26.38 | brlcad | expects ``Erik to find coors light |
| 19:30.47 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-147-78.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 19:34.02 | mafm | sighs |
| 19:34.15 | mafm | back from service :) |
| 19:35.35 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-90.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:37.38 | brlcad | wb |
| 19:38.00 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.11.218) | |
| 19:38.12 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 19:38.13 | andrecastelo | hey :D |
| 19:38.17 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 19:38.23 | clock_ | brlcad: hey |
| 19:38.33 | brlcad | clock_: did you see the screenshots? |
| 19:38.43 | andrecastelo | sorry about not being more present but i did post a new entry in the blog |
| 19:39.02 | mafm | archivist: crashy Debian? my debian machines (even other linux) always take hundreds of days of uptime, and and restarted only due to hardware upgrades or so |
| 19:39.52 | archivist | mafm main problem seems to be memory leaks in firefox and gpdf |
| 19:40.15 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 19:40.21 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 19:40.27 | brlcad | looks for an rss plugin to mediawiki |
| 19:40.54 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 19:40.59 | mafm | but you should be able to take care of those just by restarting the app, not the system :) |
| 19:41.48 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:42.17 | mafm | and the machine has being running 2 instances of genome@home for 5 years now or so |
| 19:51.08 | starseeker | Yes! http;//brlcad.org/wiki/Documentation |
| 19:51.23 | starseeker | Or rather, http://brlcad.org/wiki/Documentation |
| 19:59.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31045 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/: Add source for oed tutorial |
| 20:05.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31046 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/oed/ (17 files): This time actually add the contents for oed tutorial. |
| 20:12.18 | mafm | configure: error: /home/mafm/Desktop/soc2008/brlcad-proposal/brlcad-trunk/src/other/tcl/unix/tclConfig.sh is for Tcl . |
| 20:12.18 | mafm | Tk 8.5.1 needs Tcl 8.5. |
| 20:12.29 | mafm | I get this error today |
| 20:12.39 | mafm | haven't updated for a while though |
| 20:13.50 | mafm | I have these {tcl,tk}-dev 8.5.2 packages installed in the system for some reason |
| 20:13.59 | mafm | so I guess that there's a conflict there? |
| 20:14.12 | starseeker | Do you need to use system tcl/tk or are you using enable-all? |
| 20:14.36 | mafm | I used configure with no options |
| 20:15.03 | starseeker | If you don't mind using the internal library copies ./configure --enable-all can save a lot of trouble |
| 20:16.07 | mafm | hmm, I better remove them from the system then -- they're not used for anything else |
| 20:16.11 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 20:16.42 | starseeker | I don't know if that's what's going on - what does your configure report? |
| 20:16.59 | starseeker | is it trying to use system tcl and internal tk, for example? |
| 20:17.16 | mafm | after desinstalling it still fails, with --enable-all is ok |
| 20:17.27 | mafm | do you want me to go back? |
| 20:17.52 | mafm | hmm, or not so... it failed again |
| 20:18.14 | starseeker | it failed with enable all? |
| 20:19.17 | mafm | yup |
| 20:19.27 | mafm | same error as above |
| 20:19.38 | starseeker | are you using latest svn? |
| 20:20.21 | mafm | yes |
| 20:20.41 | mafm | $ svn update |
| 20:20.41 | mafm | At revision 31046. |
| 20:20.49 | starseeker | Try running ./autogen.sh and then re-running configure |
| 20:20.53 | mafm | with the docbook things from you |
| 20:21.00 | starseeker | OK... |
| 20:26.59 | mafm | goody, now it works :) |
| 20:33.25 | mafm | ugh, not for long |
| 20:34.10 | starseeker | what happened? |
| 20:37.59 | mafm | ./.libs/librt.so: undefined reference to `TclReFree' |
| 20:37.59 | mafm | /home/mafm/soc2008-brlcad/brlcad-trunk/src/libsysv/.libs/libsysv.so: undefined reference to `TclReError' |
| 20:38.16 | starseeker | Grr |
| 20:38.52 | starseeker | You're building with enable-all? |
| 20:43.13 | mafm | yes |
| 20:43.47 | mafm | I had some of these problems before, I think that tomorrow I'll be able to sort them out |
| 20:43.51 | mafm | but it's a bit too late now |
| 20:43.53 | starseeker | That error keeps popping up - it has to do with tcl include flags being included too soon in the list. |
| 20:44.09 | starseeker | k |
| 20:48.13 | mafm | http://rafb.net/p/8u5Erv89.html |
| 20:48.22 | mafm | full error, if you're interested |
| 20:48.27 | mafm | ok going home now, take care |
| 21:04.52 | starseeker | When adding makefiles for the new directories, what do I have to do to make sure a Makefile.in gets created by autogen? I've added docbook as a subdirectory, and it has a Makefile.am, but the .in isn't generated |
| 21:09.54 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-88-116.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 21:20.38 | thing0 | morning yall |
| 21:32.00 | poolio | howdy |
| 21:35.05 | starseeker | ARRRRRRRRGH |
| 21:35.59 | starseeker | pulls out quake railgun and unleashes mayhem on autotools... |
| 21:49.39 | starseeker | autotools is like political process - you marvel at the amazing things they achieve while at the same time marveling that anything at all can be achieved |
| 21:59.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31047 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Add make files for new doc directories |
| 22:56.16 | ``Erik | oh sweet jeebus, what have you done, what do I have to fix now |
| 22:58.50 | ``Erik | :D |
| 23:01.43 | ``Erik | generating new Makefile.in dir's requires 'automake src/whatever/thing/Makefile', easier to just autogen if you don't know wha tyou're doing |
| 23:02.01 | ``Erik | it also needs entries in configure.ac and the parent SUBDIRS var |
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| 00:08.31 | starseeker | ``Erik: did I get it right? (or close enough?) |
| 01:19.54 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-88-116.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
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| 02:01.34 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 02:30.08 | brlcad | starseeker: looks right, but you can always check with an ./autogen.sh && ./configure && make distcheck |
| 02:30.47 | brlcad | until you know what all is going on, you basically need to run autogen.sh anytime any Makefile.am or configure.ac changes |
| 02:30.54 | brlcad | even during svn update |
| 02:33.03 | starseeker_ | had noticed... |
| 02:33.18 | starseeker_ | thanks though - glad it looks OK :-) |
| 02:34.49 | brlcad | distcheck is the money shot, it'll tell you what's missing |
| 03:10.34 | *** join/#brlcad wuxia (n=wuxia@unaffiliated/wuxia) | |
| 03:10.45 | wuxia | is there a online archive of brlcad models I can download? |
| 03:26.37 | starseeker_ | There are a couple here: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?atid=641557&group_id=105292&func=browse |
| 03:27.24 | starseeker_ | most are in the distribution in /usr/brlcad/share/brlcad/7.12.2/db/ or wherever your db folder happens to be installed |
| 03:43.53 | wuxia | thanks |
| 04:20.29 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
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| 08:00.53 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-88-116.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 08:02.47 | thing0 | heya all |
| 08:08.10 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-93-6.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:34.04 | clock_ | Is it allowed to make an elliptic cylinder by creating a circular cylinder and then applying a matrix that squeezes it? |
| 09:08.44 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex_ (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
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| 11:21.42 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@124-169-190-82.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 11:21.51 | thing1 | hey |
| 11:21.54 | thing1 | dang |
| 11:23.11 | thing1 | heard about Siemens PLM Synchronous Technology |
| 11:23.25 | thing1 | I was wondering when someone was going to come up with something like this |
| 11:23.33 | thing1 | model it using direct techniques |
| 11:23.39 | thing1 | then add parametrics afer |
| 11:42.33 | brlcad | hm, not ringing any bells of merit |
| 11:43.25 | brlcad | clock_: yeah, I believe that'll work |
| 12:52.35 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-e233ec8b0e5befbc) | |
| 12:53.09 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
| 12:53.34 | homovulgaris | Hi sean, my thesis finally got over today ;) went well |
| 12:56.28 | homovulgaris | Why am i getting a TclReFree error in the latest revision :( |
| 12:57.02 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-190-82.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 13:55.06 | ``Erik | hehehe, weird http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=33784206 |
| 13:57.45 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.67.133) | |
| 13:57.59 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone :D |
| 14:09.13 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I saw the message earlier |
| 14:09.19 | brlcad | it's an include path problem |
| 14:09.32 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 14:15.45 | brlcad | oh it wasn't your message, but same report ;) |
| 14:18.10 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-873e62dc45cf1d3c) | |
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| 14:41.31 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.59.42) | |
| 14:41.43 | andrecastelo_ | hey brlcad |
| 14:42.08 | andrecastelo_ | just sent the mlt defs patch, feedback welcome :D |
| 15:01.29 | brlcad | andrecastelo: cool |
| 15:01.35 | brlcad | i'll look over it this weekend |
| 15:01.51 | andrecastelo | k, thx :D |
| 15:01.58 | brlcad | have a road trip today and tomorrow, but should get some time in there ;) |
| 15:02.21 | andrecastelo | oh cool, enjoy it :D |
| 15:32.11 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.59.42) | |
| 16:00.38 | homovulgaris | hi |
| 16:00.51 | homovulgaris | still having trouble with tcl |
| 16:01.44 | brlcad | homovulgaris: understandably given nothing has changed in the past four hours ;) |
| 16:02.17 | homovulgaris | :) oh.. |
| 16:02.50 | brlcad | the problem is include paths, it's getting src/other/regex before src/other/tcl/generic somewhere |
| 16:06.20 | homovulgaris | in my case it asks me to recompile with -fPIC |
| 16:06.28 | homovulgaris | tclRegexp.o ofcourse |
| 16:07.06 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-95-39.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:07.30 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.77.107) | |
| 16:10.28 | brlcad | yeah, that's the problem, just verified |
| 16:10.40 | brlcad | now .. how to actually fix that |
| 16:11.01 | brlcad | homovulgaris: what platform are you on? |
| 16:12.00 | homovulgaris | Linux eos 2.6.24-1-amd64 #1 SMP Fri Apr 18 23:08:22 UTC 2008 x86_64 GNU/Linux |
| 16:12.12 | homovulgaris | debian ;) |
| 16:12.47 | homovulgaris | http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/base/amd64/howtos/index.xml?part=1&chap=3 |
| 16:12.58 | brlcad | okay, just making sure this fix will apply |
| 16:18.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31048 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: |
| 16:18.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: REGEX_CPPFLAGS MUST COME AFTER TCL INCLUDE PATHS .. else you can end up with |
| 16:18.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: unresolved regex symbols due to tcl's double #define redirection of regex calls |
| 16:18.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: from their regex.h header. Symptom of this problem is unresolved TclReFree |
| 16:18.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: symbols during linking of libs that use tcl and/or unresolved regcomp, regerror, |
| 16:18.09 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: and regexec symbols in libraries that don't use tcl. |
| 16:18.15 | brlcad | homovulgaris: test that if you would |
| 16:20.39 | homovulgaris | on it ;) |
| 16:26.33 | homovulgaris | tcl error is ok now i guess |
| 16:26.34 | homovulgaris | but i get this now |
| 16:26.35 | homovulgaris | color.c:27:22: error: X11/Xlib.h: No such file or directory |
| 16:26.42 | homovulgaris | color.c:32: error: expected â)â before â*â token |
| 16:26.43 | homovulgaris | color.c:33: error: expected â)â before â*â token |
| 16:26.43 | homovulgaris | color.c:75: error: expected â)â before â*â token |
| 16:26.43 | homovulgaris | color.c:100: error: expected â)â before â*â token |
| 16:28.45 | homovulgaris | thats ok.. ;) installed xlibs-static-dev |
| 16:31.24 | homovulgaris | its not able to find libtk.la .. let me see might be specific to my system |
| 16:31.25 | homovulgaris | i'll get back in some time |
| 16:33.39 | homovulgaris | compiling |
| 16:33.47 | homovulgaris | hey sean btw. are we going to have trac soon ? |
| 16:34.28 | homovulgaris | and eror now is /home/d/wrk/libpg/brlcad/src/libsysv/.libs/libsysv.so: undefined reference to `TclReError' |
| 16:34.44 | brlcad | not anytime soon, no |
| 16:35.55 | brlcad | yeah, I've got the libsysv error, working on it |
| 18:03.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31049 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac src/librt/Makefile.am src/librt/regionfix.c): |
| 18:03.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: yet another change to help with the TclReFree linkage errors. more details is |
| 18:03.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: that tcl doesn't need/want regex headers but all callers do need it (and need it |
| 18:03.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: before tcl's to find our regex headers), so the regex flags shouldn't be added |
| 18:03.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: to the tcl_cppflags at all really. |
| 18:04.05 | brlcad | homovulgaris: again? |
| 18:09.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31050 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/Makefile.am: oops, forgot to commit this one, another regex caller. |
| 18:17.20 | ``Erik | starts testing O.o |
| 18:20.08 | ``Erik | if this works, I'll lose an excuse for procrastinating at the office O.o :D |
| 18:38.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31051 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/Makefile.am: is regex.c really needed? |
| 18:44.18 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:45.54 | brlcad | howdy d_rossberg |
| 18:47.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31052 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/Makefile.am: don't need redata.c if we're not compiling regex.c |
| 18:48.49 | d_rossberg | waves from home |
| 18:49.30 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31053 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob indirectly added the log and mirror commands to archer via adding them to the Db megawidget. |
| 18:52.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31054 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob added the 'mirror' command to archer while refactoring it into libged |
| 18:53.09 | brlcad | woot |
| 18:55.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31055 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl: fix helplibdata typo |
| 19:19.37 | ``Erik | hehehe now I get the issue in librt |
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| 19:44.47 | homovulgaris | yeah libsysv still .. in librt |
| 19:47.26 | ``Erik | went away in libsysv for me |
| 19:48.52 | homovulgaris | isnt't it still undefined reference to TclReError ? |
| 19:49.06 | homovulgaris | i mean my error message is /home/d/wrk/libpg/brlcad/src/libsysv/.libs/libsysv.so: undefined reference to `TclReError' |
| 19:49.07 | homovulgaris | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 19:49.07 | homovulgaris | make[2]: *** [comb] Error 1 |
| 19:49.07 | homovulgaris | make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/d/wrk/libpg/brlcad/src/librt' |
| 19:49.07 | homovulgaris | make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 |
| 19:49.08 | homovulgaris | make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/d/wrk/libpg/brlcad/src' |
| 19:49.12 | homovulgaris | make: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 |
| 20:16.03 | brlcad | you'd have to do a make clean |
| 20:16.08 | brlcad | stale symbols |
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| 21:56.25 | yukonbob | afternoon, cadheads |
| 23:19.22 | yukonbob | This is a bit lame, but: http://www.pastebin.ca/1014183 |
| 23:20.54 | yukonbob | ^-- failing w/ Tcl regex... svn 7.12.3 from 10May2008, (31055), clean build -- I don't have time to look at this right now, and I _will_ say that I think my Tcl installation could be better (wrt TclStub), but I wouldn't expect this kind of error) |
| 23:26.20 | yukonbob | wonders if it's picking up wrong regex -- should be from src/other/libregex? (/me is only guessing) |
| 23:59.58 | yukonbob | using src/other/libregex/regex.h seems to fix... now onto error w/ lgt... |
| 00:10.29 | yukonbob | http://pastebin.ca/1014230 |
| 00:11.05 | yukonbob | ^-- multiple definitions of bu_bomb, bu_setjmp_valid, bu_jmpbuf |
| 00:27.21 | Maloeran | Okay, this is way off-topic but I'm really curious. Would anyone have a clue why a good desktop/server could connect just fine at the end of a 40 meters ethernet cable, while a laptop could not? |
| 00:27.35 | Maloeran | The ethernet of the 2 machines works just fine in other circumstances. Could it be that the laptop is not pumping enough current down the wire or something? |
| 00:45.54 | yukonbob | Maloeran: is it auto-detection of T568-A/T568-B in the NICs (ie: using/not-using a cross-over in incorrect situation) |
| 00:46.57 | yukonbob | packs out |
| 00:51.17 | Maloeran | Thanks bob. A friend connected the cable's ends, I guess it's possible he made a cross-over cable by mistake somehow |
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| 09:15.38 | madant | yep.. finally all tcls gone :) |
| 09:15.38 | madant | thanks sean :) |
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| 15:37.13 | ``Erik | ho hum |
| 15:44.59 | ``Erik | hrm, still seeing the TclReFree issue with librt/regionfix.c :/ |
| 15:48.52 | homovulgaris | hmm.. no Tcl trouble with me |
| 15:49.03 | homovulgaris | i used --enable-all |
| 15:51.51 | ``Erik | hrm, I have almost everything being build... I don't see this issue on fbsd, just mac |
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| 19:01.40 | ssarangi | Hi all, I am new to the the brlcad source code and was wondering if somebody could point me to some documentation for the source code. The ones which I found were the individual vc project files description on Wikipedia |
| 19:05.50 | ``Erik | hrm, there's no cohesive documentation for development afaik, there's a doxygen page somewhere (partial, was a project for a student over the summer), and something on developing applications with it, and a little info about the different libraries here and there... but really, it's a "just dig in", if you have specific questions or need a pointer for a task, just ask |
| 19:08.58 | ssarangi | ''Erik: Thanks Erik. I just realized that and started reading the code based on the individual project descriptions from wiki. Actually, I myself work on dental cad product with C and Tcl and hence got really interested when I saw this. I was thinking of getting myself familiar with the code and then thinking if it was possible to join the development team for brl |
| 19:24.40 | yukonbob | ssarangi: what's the project you work on? |
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| 21:31.09 | ssarangi | yukonbob: sorry I slept off suddenly. Well i work for a company which makes dental cad software |
| 21:34.02 | yukonbob | ssarangi: cool -- what's the name of the company/software? (ie: is there info on the interweb about it?) |
| 21:35.59 | ssarangi | yukonbob: the name of the company is GeoDigm. The name of the software if eModel. There might be a variation available on the net. |
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| 23:17.24 | starseeker_ | jeez - stixfonts released a beta, now wine is doing 1.0 release candidates - what's next, a Duke Nukem testers release?? |
| 23:24.11 | ``Erik | heh, there was a blurb saying late '08 |
| 23:24.29 | ``Erik | which got a lot of shit talkin' in the game community, naturally :> |
| 23:24.55 | starseeker_ | Heh - it would be the all-time joke of the community if it sold a huge number of games... |
| 23:25.03 | starseeker_ | copies rather |
| 23:25.20 | ``Erik | it'd be boggling if it didn't look like q2 or halflife |
| 23:25.46 | ``Erik | I'd just be amused if it came off better than, uh, daikatana |
| 23:26.51 | starseeker_ | hehe |
| 23:26.56 | ``Erik | (which is a stupid name, since, uhhh, daisho consists of daitoo (katana) and shootoo (wakizashi), iirc) |
| 23:28.02 | starseeker_ | figures all the non-stupid names are taken already... sorta like horses |
| 23:28.09 | starseeker_ | or programming languages... |
| 23:28.30 | ``Erik | *google* *wiki* ooh, I remembered correctly, just spelled daishoo wrong :) |
| 23:40.24 | starseeker_ | Well, the OO.org 3 beta doesn't install |
| 23:40.26 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 05:29.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31056 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/mirror.c: synopsis is implied first line with doxygen comments |
| 06:07.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31057 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (log.c mirror.c): with the cleanup, move the doxygen comments into the public interface header where they belong instead of in the sources. make argv an array of pointers like main() |
| 06:09.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31058 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): convert the wmater command as another test case, moving it from mged up into libged as ged_wmater(). still lots of room for improvement. |
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| 13:09.35 | brlcad | morning homovulgaris |
| 13:10.26 | archivist | hehe what a nick |
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| 13:19.31 | homovulgaris | hi everybody :) |
| 13:20.36 | homovulgaris | hi sean, i had got a mail from john.. :) military contractor sounds so spy-moviesque :) |
| 13:20.46 | homovulgaris | over the next 2 or 3 days i will wrap up the root solver test cases for the modification. |
| 13:21.15 | homovulgaris | finalizing the libpg system would obviously take most of this month i guess ? |
| 13:22.15 | brlcad | i doubt it'll be "finalized" really, but probably enough to get started ;) |
| 13:22.41 | homovulgaris | yeah :) thought as much ;) |
| 13:23.01 | homovulgaris | last 2 days i have been translating my thesis model which i made in CATIA into .g via iges :) |
| 13:23.36 | brlcad | I still have questions/comments about how it integrates with librt, but I have to reread your latest writeup |
| 13:24.05 | homovulgaris | yeah.. in fact i need to edit it myself .. |
| 13:24.07 | brlcad | what kind of iges conversion? |
| 13:24.12 | homovulgaris | i will modify it and u can go over that tomorrow |
| 13:24.22 | brlcad | polygonal or nurbs surfaced? |
| 13:24.25 | brlcad | okay |
| 13:24.26 | homovulgaris | iges-g |
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| 13:24.34 | brlcad | yeah, but which mode |
| 13:24.34 | homovulgaris | nurbs surfaced |
| 13:24.38 | brlcad | okay |
| 13:25.12 | brlcad | it'll render but that's rather experimental / unstable code, lots of issues |
| 13:25.32 | brlcad | the old nurbs code falls flat on a lot of cases (as does the new nurbs code for that matter) :) |
| 13:25.45 | homovulgaris | yeah.. only got parts of my model |
| 13:26.05 | homovulgaris | i was playing with other options of iges-g |
| 13:26.19 | homovulgaris | i'll update the wiki and send a mail to the developer list |
| 13:27.35 | brlcad | cool |
| 13:28.50 | homovulgaris | i was also reading the documentation trying to model ;) kind of a methodological change opposed to CATIA :) |
| 13:29.07 | homovulgaris | or even the more mouse-on approach of other modelers ;) |
| 13:30.03 | brlcad | quite |
| 13:30.32 | brlcad | something that is slowly being changed, but not until we have full hybrid representation support, brep in particular |
| 13:31.37 | brlcad | part of mafm's project is the start at a new gui that changes some of the fundamental methodologies that mged uses |
| 13:32.15 | brlcad | not so tightly coupled modalities |
| 13:33.14 | homovulgaris | yeah i read his synopsis at soc site |
| 13:33.23 | homovulgaris | new gui would be cool.. |
| 13:33.43 | homovulgaris | one of my friends tried using brl-cad and couldnt figure out much ;) |
| 13:33.53 | homovulgaris | we are not so high on user-friendliness :) |
| 13:33.54 | brlcad | there's no "figuring out" with mged |
| 13:34.08 | brlcad | you HAVE to go through the tutorials and training just to understand the basics |
| 13:34.12 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 13:34.35 | homovulgaris | true :) |
| 13:34.43 | brlcad | i mean it's quite powerful once you do, expert brl-cad modelers are pretty much on par with other cad systems but the learning curve is huge |
| 13:35.40 | homovulgaris | is there a repository of some of the models and works done in brl-cad ? |
| 13:35.42 | brlcad | there's a lot of power "under the hood" too that not even mged exposes sometimes, that are in other outboard tools |
| 13:35.59 | brlcad | only the same geometry databases in db/ |
| 13:36.05 | brlcad | s/same/sample/ |
| 13:36.24 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 13:36.27 | brlcad | or rather .. there is a repository, a big one |
| 13:36.30 | brlcad | but not one you can get at |
| 13:36.52 | homovulgaris | :) thought so ;) |
| 13:37.16 | brlcad | there's a model for just about any modern military asset of significance |
| 13:37.46 | brlcad | hundreds in detail down to the wire |
| 13:38.07 | homovulgaris | can imagine :) |
| 13:39.06 | brlcad | the havoc helicopter is available though, that one is in db/ |
| 13:46.29 | homovulgaris | yeah that looks pretty kewl indeed :) |
| 13:49.53 | homovulgaris | what about the snapshot at sourceforge .. that is one good render ;) |
| 13:49.55 | homovulgaris | stryker icw |
| 13:50.33 | homovulgaris | stryker icv |
| 14:05.15 | brlcad | that's using the adrt path tracer (src/adrt) |
| 14:05.36 | brlcad | but no, the model's not available :) |
| 14:05.46 | ``Erik | src/adrt/rise actually, which very much doesn't work right now O:-) |
| 14:08.01 | starseeker_ | There are a couple other models here: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?atid=641557&group_id=105292&func=browse but nothing earth shattering |
| 14:23.45 | Maloeran | The havoc model seemed to break when I tried to triangulate it with asc2g and extract the triangles long ago, some parts were missing I think |
| 14:25.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31059 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/rmater.c: Imported from MGED. |
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| 15:16.44 | andrecastelo | hey guys, morning :D |
| 15:20.04 | ``Erik | howdy |
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| 15:29.31 | docelic | Hey folks, you know what's MIPSPro's equivalent of -rdynamic? |
| 16:02.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31060 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added rmater.c and wmater.c |
| 16:02.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31061 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declaration for get_rmater. |
| 16:18.49 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i sent a patch this weekend, don't know if it's good ;) |
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| 17:14.36 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 18:00.44 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 18:04.58 | starseeker | hrm? |
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| 18:08.58 | Russ_W_ | I just installed the .deb for ubuntu but I don't see how to start brl-cad. What do you type or click to start brl-cad? |
| 18:12.35 | starseeker | BRL-CAD has a lot of tools - you probably want to start with mged |
| 18:14.45 | louipc | that question needs to be put in an FAQ or something |
| 18:19.08 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31065 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (log.c mirror.c rmater.c wmater.c): Simplify the arg handling logic a bit. |
| 18:20.05 | brlcad | howdy Russ_W_, run /usr/brlcad/bin/mged |
| 18:20.07 | brlcad | louipc: indeed |
| 18:21.09 | yukonbob | louipc: wiki it up :) |
| 18:21.39 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31066 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/item.c: Imported from MGED. |
| 18:22.03 | yukonbob | thinks BRL-CAD should install a kernel hack that displays a [START] button on the screen, specifically for mged |
| 18:23.26 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31067 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): MGED's item command moved to libged. |
| 18:24.02 | yukonbob | [Start->mged] [Start->Shutdown] [Start->http://www.google.ca?query=wtf%20how%20do%20I%20draw%20a%20tank] |
| 18:24.05 | brlcad | yukonbob: a simple terminal interface that would be preconfigured for brl-cad tools and have buttons for mged and others is on the todo ;) |
| 18:24.23 | yukonbob | !really |
| 18:24.27 | yukonbob | was obviously joking... |
| 18:24.41 | brlcad | so it would be a double-clickable item that could be installed |
| 18:24.44 | yukonbob | brlcad: via curses, or TBD? |
| 18:24.52 | brlcad | knows, but there's some merit to some of the idea ;) |
| 18:25.03 | brlcad | ideally a full-fledged terminal |
| 18:25.07 | yukonbob | "The truest thruths are said in jest" |
| 18:25.12 | louipc | hmm does that captcha on the wiki require javascript |
| 18:25.19 | yukonbob | louipc: yup |
| 18:25.19 | brlcad | I played with one in Tcl and other using pdksh with a custom terminal |
| 18:25.27 | louipc | oh heh |
| 18:25.30 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31068 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): MGED's item command moved to libged. |
| 18:25.31 | brlcad | the issue I ran into was how to neatly get a pstty on windows |
| 18:25.41 | brlcad | s/pstty/ptty/ |
| 18:25.43 | yukonbob | nods |
| 18:26.16 | yukonbob | wouldn't think Tcl is actually well suited for a screen-oriented display -- unless it's a scrolling (ie: non-addressable) menu |
| 18:26.17 | brlcad | the tcl approach kinda works around that problem, but gives me no termio controls without extra effort |
| 18:26.59 | yukonbob | :) |
| 18:26.59 | brlcad | basically a tcl/tk terminal applicaitons |
| 18:27.07 | brlcad | and in that, I'd run something like pdksh |
| 18:29.17 | brlcad | have it preconfigure the PATH, MANPATH, and LD_LIBRARY_PATH (if needed) so everything just works |
| 18:29.40 | brlcad | add in some buttons on the gui for fast-access to mged, archer, rtwizard, bwish, etc |
| 18:34.54 | louipc | FAQ item added |
| 18:46.42 | brlcad | cool |
| 19:07.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r31069 10/brlcad/trunk/INSTALL: |
| 19:07.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Fix a couple of typos. Put TOC in correct order. |
| 19:07.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Add header for Post-Installation section. |
| 19:41.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31070 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Added entries for the item and rmater commands. |
| 21:33.43 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31071 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.h: Minor formatting. |
| 22:01.59 | pacman87 | woohoo, done with finals |
| 22:02.30 | pacman87 | i'll be back tomorrow, moving back home tonight |
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| 22:19.18 | LetterRip | anyone know of software related to process simulations that is under an open license? ie simulation of tanks, instrumentation for detecting levels, valves, etc |
| 22:20.45 | LetterRip | wait think i've found one |
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| 22:54.51 | brlcad | heh |
| 22:55.05 | brlcad | ooh, neat .. dual cloaks |
| 23:02.32 | PrezKennedy | so he finds it and then doesnt even say what it is... |
| 23:15.49 | brlcad | "BZFlag" |
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| 06:18.20 | yukonbob | guesses PrezKennedy was referring to LetterRip |
| 06:19.36 | yukonbob | anybody know of a mature portable super-cool programming language with excellent libraries and multi-paradigm programming? Oh wait -- found it; bye. |
| 06:19.40 | yukonbob | :P |
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| 11:14.05 | starseeker_ | yukonbob: Lisp? |
| 11:47.17 | archivist | assembler, it can use all the other languages libraries :) |
| 13:03.37 | ``Erik | scratches his head |
| 13:04.11 | ``Erik | lithp is an assembler for a lisp machine, C is an assembler for a pdp/vax11, ... assembler is more a notion than a language per se :D |
| 13:04.40 | archivist | hehe |
| 13:05.25 | archivist | as a BSD lover did you the antique bug ``Erik http://www.newmobilecomputing.com/story/19731/The_25_Year_Old_BSD_Bug |
| 13:09.23 | poolio | heh, i saw that :P |
| 13:19.08 | Miereroma | do you use rsync to update the BRL-CAD web? |
| 13:24.21 | brlcad | Miereroma: only for backups atm |
| 13:27.45 | Miereroma | someone reported a broken page |
| 13:28.06 | Miereroma | and I found the file on the server is filled partially with nonsensical words. But in the SVN it's OK |
| 13:28.29 | brlcad | reported where? |
| 13:28.31 | brlcad | what page? |
| 13:28.40 | Miereroma | I have a strong hypothesis compressed data got corrupted on the network transmission (or because of memory error in either computers due to an alpha particle) and that generated the "speaking in toungues" |
| 13:29.00 | Miereroma | tried by hand to swap few bits in a .txt.gz file and really manifests exactly like that :) |
| 13:29.11 | Miereroma | brlcad: Ronja website, http://ronja.twibright.com/about.php but it's already fixed |
| 13:29.19 | Miereroma | seems the CRCs are not strong enough |
| 13:29.22 | Miereroma | needs more bits |
| 13:29.45 | Miereroma | when we flush billions of gigabytes down the pipes every day no wonder this happens time to time |
| 13:30.01 | Miereroma | One of the words it generated was "Miereroma" :) |
| 13:30.39 | brlcad | ah |
| 13:30.50 | Miereroma | originally was "center" |
| 13:31.04 | Miereroma | but "ter" got replaced by "oma" in several places in the file |
| 13:31.24 | Miereroma | like if the computer invented it's own new language and partially translated some words into it ;-) |
| 13:31.59 | Miereroma | Interesting case where intelligence can actually come up from mistake. Maybe our human intelligence came the same way. Maybe we're just a mistake of the universe. |
| 13:36.58 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.18.201) | |
| 14:05.04 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.70.24) | |
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| 14:40.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31072 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Added mater command to libged. |
| 14:47.06 | poolio | brlcad: so any thoughts on a project? |
| 14:53.24 | ``Erik | yes, archivist :) and I read a fair amount, and none is too terribly suprising |
| 14:54.11 | ``Erik | (alpha particle? those'll stop in a couple cm of air, or paper, they won't penetrate an ethernet wire... gamma mebbe? :D ) |
| 14:55.16 | ``Erik | brlcad, you talked to iraytrace yesterday? (apparently he missed lunch :> ) did you hear about his new acting position? :D |
| 14:57.03 | Miereroma | ``Erik: but they come from the epoxy in the memory modules and penetrate into the chip and flip a bit |
| 14:57.28 | Miereroma | I am sure BRL-CAD can raytrace alpha particle rays ;-) |
| 14:57.57 | ``Erik | hehehe epoxy emits alpha particles? wonder what the half life of the stuff is, I have an awful lot laying around |
| 14:58.42 | Miereroma | maybe russian chips they are surely molded into concrete instead of epoxy |
| 14:58.55 | ``Erik | in soviet russia... sorry, I'll stop |
| 14:59.50 | Miereroma | The Russian space shuttle buran exploded in the atmosphere |
| 14:59.59 | Miereroma | Collection teams managed to recover the following debris: |
| 15:00.10 | Miereroma | 15 cast iron manhole covers, various sizes and shapes |
| 15:00.20 | Miereroma | One broken toilet bowl, white ceramic |
| 15:00.34 | Miereroma | 3 rebar concrete window ledges |
| 15:00.44 | Miereroma | 1017 pieces of bathroom tiles |
| 15:02.41 | Miereroma | 30-ton above-life-size bronze statue of Lenin |
| 15:03.22 | starseeker | Actually, given the limitations the Russian space program does some remarkable work |
| 15:04.16 | ``Erik | <-- always been impressed by russian technology, brutally tough and effective despite poor funding and purgings of the era :/ |
| 15:04.48 | Miereroma | well I come from behind the Iron Curtain, and I created an optical wireless datalink from magnifying glasses and smoke pipes and rusty steel bars |
| 15:05.18 | Miereroma | Am sure the Westerns couldn't do it - maximum they could order a ready-made link with a VISA card |
| 15:05.49 | ``Erik | thus proving that intelligent people come from all over the world... now if only the us politicians would admit that and get their heads out of their arses |
| 15:06.15 | ``Erik | I'm sure there're many westerners that COULD do it, but why bother with all that effort when I can go buy one for two hours of work? |
| 15:06.35 | Miereroma | I would say the scarcity produced by the astronomical idiocy of the communist regime forced people to stimulate their brain if they wish to survive |
| 15:07.20 | Miereroma | Like academy of science scientists used to build their own houses from bricks with their own hands, because they couldn't afford buying one |
| 15:07.38 | ``Erik | cuba also has some impressive efforts wrt technology, a native industry that keeps 50 year old foreign vehicles on the road with no outside aid O.o |
| 15:08.19 | starseeker | cool - just like certain parts of the US ;-) |
| 15:08.31 | Miereroma | :) |
| 15:08.43 | Miereroma | Like Hawaii? |
| 15:08.55 | ``Erik | hehhe, all canadians build their own houses from brick, they stomp down the snow and cut the bricks out of it and make their houses :D *duck* |
| 15:09.07 | Miereroma | ``Erik: that's eskimoes |
| 15:09.08 | ``Erik | bada-tish |
| 15:09.36 | starseeker | actually thinks we should be looking more seriously at using compressed earth as a building material |
| 15:09.51 | ``Erik | lots of people do |
| 15:09.53 | Miereroma | I think we should excavate our houses into the ground |
| 15:09.54 | ``Erik | but we keep bombing them :( |
| 15:10.04 | ``Erik | sod houses used to be common in the midwest |
| 15:10.17 | Miereroma | you don't need to add material, plus you get thermal insulation, plus more favourable average "outside" temperature -> ecological |
| 15:10.31 | archivist | compressed earth== bricks (fired clay) |
| 15:10.51 | ``Erik | sun baked is good 'nuff |
| 15:10.54 | Miereroma | plus, you have 3 dimensions of space instead of 2 |
| 15:10.59 | ``Erik | worked in the middle east for the last 6000 years |
| 15:11.12 | archivist | heh not so wet there |
| 15:11.17 | ``Erik | mud even works with sunbaking to make a nice insulated waterproof house |
| 15:11.20 | starseeker | I think (IIRC) compressed earth uses local dirt pressed into bricks using very high pressures |
| 15:11.22 | ``Erik | it used to be very wet there O.o |
| 15:11.26 | Miereroma | middle east had the first civilization, 6000 BC ago |
| 15:11.52 | Miereroma | and now they have just one big mess |
| 15:11.55 | ``Erik | seriously, ya think a bunch of humans would move into a desert and say "gee, lets start farming here!"? |
| 15:12.09 | Miereroma | ``Erik: maybe server farming? |
| 15:12.48 | ``Erik | hehehehe, I'd put my server farms as close to a pole as possible to reduce a/c cost and risk of losing cooling |
| 15:13.22 | alex_joni | ``Erik: also get closer to superconductibility |
| 15:13.50 | ``Erik | modern IC's tend to go wonky if they get too cold, too :/ |
| 15:13.53 | starseeker | heh - here we go, open source + dirt blocks: http://openfarmtech.org/weblog/?cat=13 |
| 15:13.53 | alex_joni | learns it's actually spelled: superconductivity |
| 15:14.16 | alex_joni | ``Erik: not special purpose ones .. :) |
| 15:14.22 | ``Erik | would rather do http://www.opensourcebeerproject.com/2007/07/15/open-source-beer-recipe-finalized/#comments |
| 15:15.27 | ``Erik | special purpose IC's also don't go gimpy in cosmic radiation, so float it in an orbit that always keeps it in earths shadow, if you wanna go that route O.o :D |
| 15:15.50 | alex_joni | might be a mess to find empty spots in orbit |
| 15:17.22 | starseeker | looks for the plans for the press - wonder if they're using CAD... |
| 15:17.38 | ``Erik | I d'no if the 'always dark/light' band is cluttered.. be close to geosyncronous, but if you're not worried about that, you could move it in a bit so it fluctuates north and south... |
| 15:17.40 | ``Erik | *ponder* |
| 15:18.08 | ``Erik | atmospheric drag would require more boost to keep it in orbit, tho |
| 15:18.46 | ``Erik | *think* nah, I'm wrong, had the wrong frame of reference |
| 15:19.07 | ``Erik | far orbit lagrange point would be where it'd have to be :/ |
| 16:14.49 | louipc | hmm has anyone built the latest BRL-CAD for i386? |
| 16:25.18 | brlcad | louipc: I have/had, but didn't make a dist for it |
| 16:37.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31073 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Added edmater command to libged. |
| 16:38.16 | louipc | brlcad: ah. Did drawing a torus work OK with that? |
| 16:44.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31074 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (editit.c edmater.c): Added edmater command to libged. |
| 16:55.10 | brlcad | louipc: er, can't say that I tried.. |
| 17:08.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31075 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/edmater.c: edmater relies on editit, rmater, and wmater |
| 17:14.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31076 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libged/editit.c): move the editit doc to the ged.h header |
| 17:37.04 | ``Erik | brlcad ignored his phone, now brlcad has no sushi |
| 17:37.07 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:37.47 | brlcad | ah |
| 17:37.51 | brlcad | it's over in the other room |
| 17:38.13 | brlcad | i just finished eating some cheerios anyways |
| 17:39.53 | ``Erik | o'sake wa sugoii ii desu ne |
| 17:40.46 | ``Erik | roomaji make things look weird O.o :D |
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| 18:06.11 | yukonbob | starseeker: re: Lisp -- I was being facecious w/ that little spiel -- like LetterRip, who had an interesting question, apparently answer it but didn't tell anybody, and just left... |
| 18:06.43 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 18:06.45 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 18:07.08 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31077 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/mirror.c: Need to use bu_log when wdbp is NULL. |
| 18:36.10 | PrezKennedy | yukonbob, i found a way to make millions of dollars |
| 18:36.12 | PrezKennedy | g2g bye |
| 18:36.14 | PrezKennedy | :-P |
| 18:37.52 | louipc | I found the meaning of life and the purpose of human existence. |
| 18:37.59 | louipc | gtg bye |
| 18:47.36 | yukonbob | PrezKennedy: heh :) |
| 18:48.13 | yukonbob | Does anybody know how to make the BRL-CAD gui look like Solidworks? |
| 18:48.20 | yukonbob | Oh got it... g2g bye |
| 18:49.06 | yukonbob | foresees this being a BRL-CAD meme |
| 18:49.55 | louipc | haha are you saying that is more elusive answer than the meaning of human existence? hahha |
| 18:50.16 | alex_joni | I found the answer to the universe, life and everything.. |
| 18:50.21 | yukonbob | heh -- well no... but... |
| 18:50.37 | yukonbob | alex_joni: but the margins were too small to write down the solution? |
| 18:50.47 | alex_joni | yukonbob: no.. I'll share the solution |
| 18:50.51 | alex_joni | it's 42 |
| 18:51.08 | alex_joni | yukonbob: the issue is figuring out the question :) |
| 18:51.28 | yukonbob | What is the average flight speed of an unladen swallow? |
| 18:52.20 | alex_joni | european? |
| 18:52.38 | alex_joni | or african? |
| 18:52.47 | yukonbob | dunno |
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| 18:53.06 | alex_joni | then.. err.. no |
| 18:53.12 | alex_joni | wrong question :) |
| 18:53.25 | brlcad | knows how to make BRL-CAD gui look like solidworks ;) |
| 18:53.34 | alex_joni | yukonbob: joke aside.. never read h2g2? |
| 18:53.38 | yukonbob | isn't surprised |
| 18:53.39 | brlcad | not that that's the goal ;) |
| 18:53.55 | yukonbob | waves to brlcad; how're things? |
| 18:53.56 | archivist | yes it is :)) |
| 18:54.01 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:54.03 | louipc | solidworks has too many buttons anyways |
| 18:54.04 | brlcad | yukonbob: pretty good |
| 18:54.23 | alex_joni | wonders who knows how to make solidworks look like mged |
| 18:54.27 | archivist | sorta luvs solidworks |
| 18:54.29 | yukonbob | alex_joni: no -- I've got it, but not delved into it... of course I know about "42" though. |
| 18:54.31 | brlcad | solidworks is a great interface, closest to what we do, so definitely something to pay attention to (but not necessarily mimic exactly) |
| 18:54.51 | alex_joni | brlcad: well.. I'm more a fan of alibre ;) |
| 18:55.04 | alex_joni | nice-ish interface too |
| 18:55.04 | yukonbob | is a fan of mged and Tcl |
| 18:55.16 | louipc | I'm a fan of keyboard-driven interfaces |
| 18:55.24 | yukonbob | how much more precise can you get than saying "Do it this way"? |
| 18:55.38 | ``Erik | is a fan of writing code and making someone else model O:-) |
| 18:55.40 | alex_joni | yukonbob: way less precise.. |
| 18:55.54 | alex_joni | but in the learning curve.. maybe a bit faster to catch on |
| 18:56.05 | yukonbob | is a fan of filing bug reports and getting ``Erik to code |
| 18:56.06 | yukonbob | ducks |
| 18:56.31 | archivist | yukonbob++ |
| 18:56.43 | alex_joni | careful.. he overflows easily |
| 18:57.55 | yukonbob | ~karma |
| 18:57.55 | ibot | yukonbob has karma of 2 |
| 18:58.00 | alex_joni | heh :) |
| 18:58.18 | alex_joni | yukonbob: at least you're not binary |
| 18:58.37 | yukonbob | There are 10 kinds of people in the world... |
| 18:58.47 | alex_joni | heh |
| 18:59.06 | alex_joni | s/binary/bool/ |
| 18:59.18 | archivist | #apache and karma debian, today it was about -606 |
| 18:59.33 | yukonbob | s/bool/binary/ -- non-zero is a typical boolean true |
| 18:59.38 | brlcad | yukonbob: you should remind/annoy me to post up an architecture diagram at some point (not today) :) |
| 18:59.55 | archivist | is it done yet? |
| 19:00.31 | brlcad | it's been done for a long time, lots of detail not sorted out, but the big picture is there |
| 19:00.57 | yukonbob | should sink his teeth into something attainable again wrt BRL-CAD -- perhaps more docbook, now that my eyes are uncrossed... |
| 19:01.33 | brlcad | agrees ;) |
| 19:01.36 | yukonbob | starseeker_: what's the status of the big piece of docbook you were working on? |
| 19:01.55 | brlcad | he put one of his docs into the repo already, doc/docbook |
| 19:04.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31078 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/ (Makefile.am docbook/Makefile.am docbook/oed/Makefile.am): remove the vars, cause more trouble than they're worth; simplify build vars to just what's needed |
| 19:05.35 | yukonbob | listens to the "autechre" channel on last.fm, hits keyboard |
| 19:06.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31079 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: move the docbook items up in the list, separate out autogeneration/integration with the build system |
| 19:06.51 | brlcad | tunes in to autechre |
| 19:07.47 | brlcad | hmm.. not bad :) |
| 19:08.14 | brlcad | good coding music |
| 19:08.26 | yukonbob | :) |
| 19:09.23 | ``Erik | is a fan of bitching and whining about broken code until brlcad fixes it O:-) |
| 19:10.05 | yukonbob | ...when he's not talking about how Lisp and asm are the only True Languages... ;) |
| 19:10.22 | ``Erik | heh, I don't think I've ever espoused the virtues of asm |
| 19:10.35 | ``Erik | and I'm more of a thchemer than a lithper :) |
| 19:11.32 | yukonbob | though he wanted to be a lithsper, but then dethided sthcheme might be the way -- but has still not _really_ got into it as much as he should... |
| 19:13.50 | yukonbob | *thought he wanted... |
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| 20:16.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31080 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (if.c parse_fmt.c usrfmt.h): Some preliminary work in support of gap reporting - more pieces are needed |
| 20:33.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31081 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: make closing both the command window and graphics window shut down mged (i.e., fix unintentional behavior) |
| 20:34.03 | brlcad | adds an FAQ item about printing and expands the couple dozen related pages that topic dragged in |
| 20:40.32 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/FAQ has the new entry |
| 20:41.40 | brlcad | I also fixed RSS feeds, so feed://brlcad.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Recentchanges&hidebots=0&feed=rss will work now for example (to keep track of the latest changes) |
| 20:42.26 | brlcad | change that to feed=atom for Atom feeds |
| 20:48.50 | louipc | nice |
| 21:05.47 | ``Erik | whoa |
| 21:06.37 | ``Erik | neat, I load up a wiki page and the text is normal, highlight a word and that one line turns bold (and doesn't unturn bold if I unhighlight) |
| 21:10.15 | louipc | hooray for the internets |
| 22:01.36 | brlcad | Brothomstates .. nifty |
| 22:09.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31082 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (if.c parse_fmt.c usrfmt.h): Reporting gaps now on command line nirt - mged version isn't happy yet |
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| 00:10.45 | Maloeran | That's kind of nice. My friend messed up completely while connecting the ends of an ethernet cable, 4 of the 8 cables are mixed up, and the ethernet cable still works!... with a packet drop rate of 15% |
| 00:11.45 | Maloeran | More specifically, it only works with the ethernet of this dual-quad-xeon, all other computers refuse to work with the cable |
| 00:14.08 | brlcad | that's messed up |
| 00:14.39 | brlcad | presumably a gigE connection? |
| 00:14.57 | brlcad | since it allows for bidirectional cross-over |
| 00:15.55 | archivist | ive had broken network cables limp along, probably helps if the switch/card can auto sense reversed cable as well |
| 00:16.31 | Maloeran | Interesting. It's vaguely amusing that the cable does work, but with a packet drop rate of 15% |
| 00:16.44 | Maloeran | I would have asumed the cable would either work or not at all |
| 00:16.57 | Maloeran | assumed* |
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| 01:24.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31083 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: remove dead code related to savedit and get (which is in libged/wdb_obj) |
| 01:25.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31084 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.h: remove comment for f_list |
| 01:27.04 | yukonbob | Maloeran: maybe the send/receive are on the same wire, but it's either poorly connected or(/and) not wired to T569-A specs, which have specfic pairs designated to be connected in a certain order... |
| 01:27.43 | yukonbob | *T568-A -- not 569 |
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| 01:53.11 | PrezKennedy | hey... anyone know where i can find a compiler that compiles perfect code just from what you tell it? i hate programming |
| 01:54.20 | PrezKennedy | ah, found it |
| 01:54.23 | PrezKennedy | good night! |
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| 01:59.15 | pacman87 | i'm back |
| 02:19.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31085 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.c cmd.h setup.c): move the command table to setup along with cmd_setup so that it may be static. made it obvious that there were a slew of unnecessary decls that could be removed too. |
| 02:40.40 | starseeker_ | PrezKennedy: Not perfect, no - the closest known tool is called the grad student |
| 02:44.11 | Maloeran | PrezKennedy, I find that gas or any other assembler can produce fairly perfect code |
| 02:45.01 | Maloeran | Though that may also depend of the programmer |
| 02:58.57 | starseeker_ | Whoops, I lied - it looks like mged is OK with the new nirt code after all, once I rebuild it correctly *cough* |
| 02:59.51 | starseeker_ | getting double printing... |
| 02:59.53 | starseeker_ | hmm... |
| 03:01.48 | starseeker_ | Oh, good I didn't lie - it's busted in a different way |
| 03:01.49 | starseeker_ | phew |
| 03:06.07 | *** part/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@pool-71-164-238-31.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 03:07.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31086 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/if.c: Whoops - r_exit, not r_entry, should be preserved for gap |
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| 03:30.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31087 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: reorder to remove need for decls |
| 03:34.14 | yukonbob | brlcad: ping |
| 03:34.33 | yukonbob | is there a way to trace the assignment of a var (in C) w/ gdb? |
| 03:35.06 | yukonbob | sees breakpoints, and "collect", but I was hoping for somethin more automagic... |
| 03:35.34 | yukonbob | *something |
| 03:41.22 | yukonbob | sees (?) breakpoints might be more powerfull than he thought... |
| 03:45.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31088 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/setup.c: static -> HIDDEN |
| 03:46.56 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31089 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: tighten the _WIN32 block on % so it'll at least provide help |
| 03:49.20 | yukonbob | loads up gdb into xemacs... |
| 04:28.55 | brlcad | yukonbob: pong |
| 04:28.59 | brlcad | yes, you can set a watch |
| 04:31.49 | yukonbob | brlcad: hey -- I'm trying to solve a Segment Violation -- I can see what ptr is being used uninitialized -- I need to find out when/where this is happening... |
| 04:32.27 | yukonbob | is getting a bit of ahandel w/ xemacs/gdb (read: it's awesome), but I haven't developed good gdb-fu yet ;) |
| 04:45.58 | louipc | yukonbob: woot xemacs |
| 04:54.58 | yukonbob | louipc: indeed, indeed. |
| 04:55.12 | yukonbob | w00t screen, too :) |
| 05:40.30 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31090 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/parse.c): make the input string of bu_shader_to_tcl_list() be const, make a copy so it can still insert the nulls as a separator but just still don't modify the original |
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| 08:23.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31091 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: move the (unused) HAVE_SHELL_ESCAPE logic from rt_split_cmd() on over into bu_argv_from_string() so that rt_split_cmd() can be marked deprecated |
| 08:25.07 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31092 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/getopt.c: match the header prototype, char *[] |
| 08:26.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31093 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (remrt/remrt.c remrt/rtsrv.c tab/tabinterp.c tab/tabsub.c): convert from rt_split_cmd to bu_argv_from_string |
| 08:28.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31094 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/raytrace.h src/librt/cmd.c): formally deprecate rt_split_cmd(), callers should now use bu_argv_from_string() instead |
| 08:55.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31095 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 2 dirs): make the new ged functions all use const char **argv's so callers can be sure the library doesn't modify their data |
| 09:00.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31096 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (17 files): |
| 09:00.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: major constification of all the converted commands as well as those they relate |
| 09:00.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: to or indirectly call. ended up needing to make a heck of a lot more const than |
| 09:00.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: expected. add the start of a new 'generic' mged command parser for the new ged |
| 09:00.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: commands (unused but stubbed). |
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| 12:20.27 | brlcad | yawns |
| 12:21.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31097 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (nirt.c parse_fmt.c): Add missing break, add g to fmt options. Reading state file now works, mged still not happy. |
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| 13:04.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31098 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/3dm-g.cpp: made the code portable (using the standard string header) |
| 13:10.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31099 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): MS Windows port of 3dm-g with CMake build system generator |
| 13:13.39 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31100 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/CMakeLists.txt: we do not need neither redata.c nor regex.c too for MS Windows |
| 13:15.05 | yukonbob | !cmake |
| 13:16.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31101 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/CMakeLists.txt: revised, e.g. for CMake 2.6 |
| 13:20.46 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31102 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/CMakeLists.txt: include 3dm-g and require at least CMake 2.6 |
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| 13:22.56 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31103 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/brlcad.def: added some additional functions to the list (e.g. mk_brep) |
| 13:25.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31104 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/CMakeLists.txt: fixed a problem with dependencies and linked libraries on MS Windows |
| 13:29.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31105 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (3 files in 3 dirs): link and use openNURBS as a shared library |
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| 15:54.08 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31106 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/dbfindtree.tcl: Added a -l option to dbfindtree for returning the paths in a list. |
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| 17:21.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31107 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Add mged support for new option, set default output for gap to nil to mimic old behavior by default. |
| 17:22.00 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-67bc56efc1387c0a) | |
| 17:22.18 | homovulgaris | hi everybody :) |
| 17:22.50 | prasad_ | hi dr nick |
| 17:22.52 | homovulgaris | hi Sean, I was working on rewriting the wiki page and realised i should talk to you before writing too much arbitrary stuff :P |
| 17:25.42 | homovulgaris | i have been looking at the prospect of implementing parametrics and constraints as two connected but distinct domains |
| 17:26.48 | brlcad | howdy homovulgaris |
| 17:26.51 | brlcad | wb |
| 17:29.25 | homovulgaris | constraint definition, satisfaction and associated structures required in terms of constraint network is pretty involved in itself ;) |
| 17:29.58 | homovulgaris | so i think we should look at the parametric implementation and constraint implementation quite a bit :) |
| 17:30.22 | homovulgaris | because in the end it is the constraints which are going to be more productive ( like maintaining tangency for example) |
| 17:30.51 | homovulgaris | of course parametrics is a necesary prerequisite for constraints to exist i believe |
| 17:31.46 | homovulgaris | how i was visualising the flow was 1. you ask libpg to create a parameter based geometry ( line dependent on 2 points for example ) |
| 17:32.35 | homovulgaris | 2. libpg creates this structure in memory space and produces the necessary arguments to store it in .g file and asks librt to do it |
| 17:33.43 | homovulgaris | 3. it creates a feed so that other parametric objects can subscribe to it so that they can automatically update themselves if this object changes and they are "interested" in it |
| 17:34.00 | homovulgaris | I am still thinking about how exactly to store this information in .g files |
| 17:34.59 | archivist | in any given context only x constraints are possible , let the user choose |
| 17:35.59 | homovulgaris | that is true. i mean given n objects there are various constraint possibilities between them and the user has to choose which one to use. |
| 17:36.48 | homovulgaris | basically .g has to support new data in terms of a) parameters related to each geometry and b) new non-geometric objects called constraints |
| 17:38.13 | homovulgaris | a. further breaks down into 1. numerical parameter values, 2. pointers or reference to parents or geometry which it depends on 3. data about which feeds to subscribe to which i think is basically 2 itself |
| 17:38.27 | archivist | if user attempts to over constrain, error and allow it to be driven not driving |
| 17:41.29 | homovulgaris | mathematical definition of constraints is using a 3-tuple |
| 17:41.31 | homovulgaris | basically 1. variables 2. domains and 3. relations |
| 17:41.35 | homovulgaris | in our case this would be 1. geometry and parameters 2. range for parameters and 3. constraint type definition |
| 17:41.37 | homovulgaris | what would be a good method for storage of such data in .g |
| 17:41.41 | homovulgaris | or do u think it would be functional to store them in a different file ? |
| 17:44.01 | homovulgaris | using attribute value system would obviously be a hack method as sean mentioned on the mailing list |
| 17:44.08 | homovulgaris | so we indeed need to support two new data types in .g |
| 17:44.52 | homovulgaris | one are parametric objects ( which are non-geometric but contain geometry inside them) and two constraint objects |
| 17:46.20 | homovulgaris | archivist, in other systems ( catia for example) over constraining is generally not shown as an error but the user is notified by showing those set of geometry which is overconstrained in a different colour |
| 17:46.55 | archivist | solidworks warns and says do you want this driven |
| 17:46.57 | homovulgaris | so that the user can delete some other constraint and make it ok for example. |
| 17:48.23 | homovulgaris | either ways constraint satisfaction is far away :) i am still tackling constraint definition ;) |
| 18:23.41 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I agree .. constraints are really the end-user feature, and parametric equation support is sort of the underlying feature that supports it |
| 18:45.49 | homovulgaris | hi brlcad, i mean parameters themselves can be an end-user feature like a sphere whose radius is a parameter which the user can vary.. but i think more funtional use would be in terms of constraints |
| 18:48.58 | homovulgaris | my major concern is in terms of storage in .g |
| 18:50.18 | archivist | some of my parts are driven by spreadsheets |
| 18:53.17 | archivist | I dont like the external use of a spreadsheet, but do like the functionality |
| 18:58.49 | homovulgaris | archivist: what do u use spreadsheets for ( :) i feel like a complete noob ) |
| 19:00.55 | archivist | I draw clocks, the gear parts are driven by a spredasheet to give thickness, module center hole dia and number of teeth, there are some calcs to get dimensions |
| 19:01.29 | archivist | angles, outside dia |
| 19:01.54 | archivist | and hidden construction lines |
| 19:03.46 | archivist | so the calcs represent some british clock gear cutting standard |
| 19:27.45 | homovulgaris | so how do u synchronise the data in spreadsheets and the geometry ? using scripts ? |
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| 19:38.51 | archivist | fires up windaz and solidworks and irc.... |
| 19:40.47 | archivist_win | in a parts hierachy is a design table thats an excel spreadsheet (they use external fuctionality fom withing solidworks) |
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| 19:44.03 | archivist | named columns refer to named dimensions in a part |
| 19:44.30 | archivist | named rows refer to versions of the part |
| 19:49.07 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31108 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/nirt/nirt.1 src/nirt/parse_fmt.c src/nirt/usrfmt.h): Add option to nirt that allows reporting of gaps, per request #1933724 - includes expansion of Query Ray panel in mged |
| 19:50.07 | archivist | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:50.56 | homovulgaris | archivist: hmm.. dassault.. they have something similar called design tables in catia too.. basically one design alternative per row |
| 19:51.27 | archivist | dassault own solidworks as well |
| 19:51.54 | homovulgaris | yeah. |
| 19:51.57 | homovulgaris | whats dedendum ? |
| 19:52.10 | homovulgaris | and module the single values at the bottom i mean ? |
| 19:52.10 | archivist | root of tooth |
| 19:52.29 | archivist | constants |
| 19:52.54 | homovulgaris | hmm.. k |
| 19:53.01 | archivist | leave a gap in the rows and its free space for the user |
| 19:53.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31109 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.1: Add 'g' to man page for nirt |
| 19:54.04 | archivist | I dont draw to absolute accuracy (not enough time) |
| 20:04.49 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 20:05.49 | archivist | there is a subdir there clock which has a web 3d of a design |
| 20:06.13 | archivist | if you have windows (silly restrictions) |
| 20:08.29 | homovulgaris | :( on linux .. will check it out when i am on windows ( note to self: this is why i should get my laptop repaired ) |
| 20:09.28 | archivist | I tried serving it on debian, no go, had to proxy to the winbox (wont be up 24/7) |
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| 20:32.06 | brlcad | homovulgaris: sorry for the sporadic input, busy day .. lots of comments pending :) |
| 20:39.05 | homovulgaris | no probs :) |
| 20:42.17 | homovulgaris | is this the final draft ? http://ftp.arl.army.mil/~mike/papers/brlcad5.0/newdb.html |
| 20:47.18 | homovulgaris | and WOW.. mike muuss wrote ping |
| 20:48.41 | homovulgaris | i guess he got that wherever he went inspite of being the architect of brl-cad ;) |
| 20:52.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31110 10/brlcad/trunk/ (9 files in 4 dirs): Added make_name and make commands to libged. |
| 20:55.13 | brlcad | homovulgaris: it's close to a final draft, but it's not 100% consistent with what was ultimately implemented. some minor idents are different, some features aren't implemented (like compression support) |
| 20:56.08 | brlcad | the source is the reference, of course, librt being where the db i/o layer is implemented |
| 20:56.13 | homovulgaris | k so that draft+code would be the best approach ? |
| 20:57.04 | brlcad | the draft is a good starting point just for understanding the overall structure of a .g file -- as to what pieces you care about depends on how exactly the equations are persisted/stored |
| 20:57.27 | brlcad | as attributes there is no need to modify the db format, it all happens in the library |
| 20:57.54 | brlcad | as new object types, it depends which type and how robustly the modifications are added for the new non-geom objects |
| 20:58.49 | homovulgaris | we are using machine independent .g files right ? |
| 21:00.22 | homovulgaris | the way i was seeing it.. a non geometric parametric object basically contains geometry ( example a Line which connects two points) |
| 21:00.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31111 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Add logic to check for scripts in brlcad data directory (which doesn't exist yet) - may want to change this so local file with same name overrides global file? |
| 21:01.08 | brlcad | yeah, v5 .g files are machine independent |
| 21:01.30 | homovulgaris | so basically the PLIne is a non-geometric object which contains 1. the geometric object line 2. references to the two points indicating they are parents |
| 21:01.34 | brlcad | v4 .g files are not, nobody should be using those (and you don't have to worry about backwards support for them) |
| 21:02.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31112 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/qray.h: Removed extra double-quote from QRAY_FORMAT_NULL. |
| 21:02.59 | homovulgaris | when we come to constrain objects which are non-geometric again, then they have the three types of data i mentioned earlier |
| 21:03.05 | brlcad | reads the earlier comments to catch up |
| 21:04.23 | homovulgaris | basically 1. variables 2. domains and 3. relations ..in our case this would be 1. geometry and parameters 2. range for parameters and 3. constraint type definition |
| 21:05.10 | homovulgaris | the attribute system could work for storing the parameters but seems like a reverse method of storage. |
| 21:05.50 | homovulgaris | for constraint objects i have to figure out the v5 database more i guess |
| 21:06.00 | brlcad | you're not making it easy to catch up :P |
| 21:06.32 | homovulgaris | sorry :P |
| 21:09.01 | homovulgaris | basically there would be two types of new objects introduced |
| 21:09.01 | homovulgaris | 1. parametric objects |
| 21:09.02 | homovulgaris | 2. constraint objects |
| 21:09.02 | homovulgaris | both of them are non-geometric in the present sense |
| 21:11.29 | brlcad | to answer from earliery, don't think it's at all functional to store in a different file .. needs to be in the .g and the 'right way' is probably as new object types like you're suggesting |
| 21:12.31 | brlcad | instead of "containing" geometry, it can simply reference the geometry it applies to |
| 21:13.08 | homovulgaris | yeah i also felt that storing in a separate file is not exactly very functional |
| 21:13.18 | brlcad | the danger worth avoiding is layering in YAGF that isn't associated with existing geometry being created |
| 21:13.58 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 21:15.08 | brlcad | the parameters are known values/objects/reference points if I'm not mistaken |
| 21:16.27 | homovulgaris | most of the times |
| 21:16.44 | homovulgaris | i mean at times they maybe some value of a property not already supported by the existing geometry representation |
| 21:17.01 | homovulgaris | like if i want a point which is at a ratio 0.6 between two points |
| 21:17.15 | homovulgaris | the value 0.6 is a parameter |
| 21:17.36 | homovulgaris | but it is not part of the point object for example. but yes it is a known value |
| 21:18.19 | homovulgaris | ok.. so in .g using a different object Header / flags we can denote the fact that it is a non-geometric object type .. |
| 21:29.21 | homovulgaris | and in terms of workflow since u create geometry at the same time as constructing parameters , writing the parametric object type will also result in writing the corresponding geometry object into .g |
| 21:29.27 | homovulgaris | while reading the .g file later we will have to take care of the association with non-existing geometry |
| 21:29.32 | homovulgaris | and what about the feed system ( i mentioned earlier :) ) well basically parametrics would imply objects depending on other objects depending on other objects and so on. |
| 21:29.37 | homovulgaris | so basically instead of keeping track of the whole chain of linkages, each parametric object basicaly starts a feed |
| 21:29.42 | homovulgaris | and all the objects which are "interested" ( in other words dependent on it directly) subscribe to this feed. |
| 21:29.47 | homovulgaris | so that if due to some reason geometry a gets updated, all its subscribers will get the news |
| 21:29.48 | homovulgaris | and can update themselves |
| 21:30.03 | brlcad | so say someone creates a sphere (sph1) with radius 10 at 0,0,0 .. then later wants to add a constraint (ct1) that the sphere remain tangent to the 0,0 XY plane -- I was thinking that the ct1 object would be a non-geom object that refers to it something akin to tangent(sph1, plane(0,0,0,0,0,1)) |
| 21:30.47 | brlcad | then resolving that tangency constraint, it'd resolve that the radius and/or position can still change, and adjust accordingly as edits to sph1 are made |
| 21:32.51 | brlcad | the subscription/feed idea sounds reasonable, I could see it working like that or as a graph in memory (it still is a graph, just an implementation detail) |
| 21:33.26 | homovulgaris | yeah basically a graph. but i think this implementation would be easier to maintain |
| 21:34.16 | homovulgaris | and regarding the sphere tangency .. yep.. the ct1 object would basically have two parents or participants ( sph1 and the plane) and the condition between them tangency |
| 21:34.34 | brlcad | one thing to think about will be how to keep the two separate yet also have an update/evaluate/resolve step |
| 21:35.20 | homovulgaris | and the fact that the sphere can change 4 parameters here ( the three coordinates and the radius ) is because sph1 is an object which has been explicitly made using those parameters |
| 21:35.27 | brlcad | where that example gets really tricky, though, is now say the object is not a sphere.. |
| 21:35.47 | brlcad | say it's a rotated elliptical toroid |
| 21:36.05 | brlcad | if I can "preserve tangency" .. that's pretty darn hard |
| 21:36.17 | brlcad | at least with the implicit representation |
| 21:36.27 | homovulgaris | on the other hand imagine a parametric sphere sph2 which has the centre ( which is defined as a point on a line) and radius as the distance between two other points |
| 21:37.01 | homovulgaris | so fundamentally the ranges over which sph2 can vary is very different from sph1 because it is defined differently |
| 21:38.42 | homovulgaris | constraint satisfaction problems alll follow similar solution techniques once they have been formulated into a constraint network |
| 21:38.50 | brlcad | I think what I'm getting at is how you can go about adding support for the 30+ existing primitives in a generalized manner |
| 21:39.58 | homovulgaris | we will have one object type for each type of primitive |
| 21:40.09 | brlcad | or if it can't really be easily generalized and libpg actually ends up needing to know about all of them |
| 21:40.26 | brlcad | which is less than ideal for many reasons |
| 21:40.39 | brlcad | have one object type for each type of primitive means what? |
| 21:40.53 | homovulgaris | but since each of these primitives can themselves be defined implicitly in different ways |
| 21:41.55 | homovulgaris | basically we will have a Point Object a Curve Object a Surface object |
| 21:42.15 | brlcad | gah, see that gets back to replicating the geometry |
| 21:43.08 | brlcad | that's really undesirable as the geometry information is already there in a compact well-behaved form |
| 21:43.36 | homovulgaris | how much does brlcad use opennurbs ? |
| 21:43.38 | homovulgaris | we wont be replicating the geometry |
| 21:44.17 | homovulgaris | the kind of information i am talking about is not what is already there |
| 21:44.35 | brlcad | it might come down to getting those pieces out of a given primitive perhaps, but those routines would have to be written |
| 21:45.07 | homovulgaris | like for example a Point parametric object would simply be a reference to a line, ratio and then the reference to the line geometry object |
| 21:45.12 | brlcad | opennurbs is presently only used for the brep object type, a new experimental/developmental primitive |
| 21:45.21 | homovulgaris | so the new information we are storing are in terms of relationship we are not storing anywhere else |
| 21:45.38 | homovulgaris | yeah i was reading about brep |
| 21:46.02 | homovulgaris | how would csg and brep work together :) |
| 21:46.29 | brlcad | and the idea that another student will be working on over the summer will be implementing a new *_brep() routine for each primitive to describe that primitive in the brep format using opennurbs |
| 21:46.52 | homovulgaris | basically the new object types for the primitives i was talking about only store the parametric data ( which we do not have support for right now and hence do not store) |
| 21:46.56 | brlcad | they work together as I can ask for the object in either format and evaluate accordingly |
| 21:47.12 | brlcad | if you're ray-tracing, you'd want to use the implicit form, for example |
| 21:47.21 | homovulgaris | k |
| 21:47.40 | brlcad | if tessellating, you want to extract the brep, perform brep-on-brep csg evaluation, and tessellate the resulting evaluated brep |
| 21:48.10 | brlcad | you have boundaries and surfaces with brep, but you don't with implicits |
| 21:48.17 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 21:48.47 | brlcad | but there are still parameterizable values with implicits that should/can/could work with this system |
| 21:49.06 | homovulgaris | hmm.. never liked surface modelers.. :) sketchup for one :P |
| 21:50.24 | homovulgaris | basically to support different primitives we would need different objects |
| 21:50.26 | brlcad | e.g. if you completely ignore the brep work for starters, and say I have a blob of unioned and intersected torii .. and I want to constrain them to be tangent to some other object, say a box |
| 21:51.18 | homovulgaris | of course brep and parametrics has nothing in common as of now :) |
| 21:51.19 | brlcad | how do you forsee that working with that example? |
| 21:52.20 | homovulgaris | hmm.. union and intersection will have to be implemented for parametrics |
| 21:52.55 | homovulgaris | implemented in the sense stored |
| 21:53.20 | archivist | one uses an axis/plane from any object for its reference in a constraint often |
| 21:53.36 | brlcad | it's already stored |
| 21:53.45 | brlcad | that is, it's available to you |
| 21:53.55 | homovulgaris | so that the parametric system or constraint system can know that it is built using that particular operation. |
| 21:53.55 | homovulgaris | how is the union / intersection currently stored in .g ? |
| 21:54.14 | brlcad | it's a combination |
| 21:54.36 | homovulgaris | if that is the case then the constraint would look something like tangency( box, torii_output) right |
| 21:54.38 | brlcad | a combination object that refers to it's contituents by name and operator |
| 21:54.58 | homovulgaris | so basically our parameters would depend on how the torii are defined |
| 21:55.57 | brlcad | e.g. make tor1 tor2 .. tor100 torii then create a combination "comb1" that is tor1 union tor2 intersect tor3 union tor4 ... etc .. union tor100 |
| 21:56.07 | homovulgaris | so that variation would be in terms of the two radii of each torii.. |
| 21:56.27 | brlcad | and then as a user, I want to say "comb1 must remain tangent to tor101" for example |
| 21:56.47 | brlcad | or box or whatever |
| 21:57.30 | homovulgaris | basically in constraint satisfaction all you have to care about is ..what can you vary and how much can you vary it. |
| 21:57.40 | homovulgaris | in this case lets say the box is fixed |
| 21:57.52 | brlcad | sure |
| 21:58.03 | homovulgaris | then you can vary the definition of each of these 100 torii |
| 21:58.28 | brlcad | not really, combinations are rigid objects for all intensive purposes |
| 21:59.16 | brlcad | you might allow scaling if it's not clamped, but otherwise we're talking even just how you align the shape and actually find the tangency point |
| 21:59.17 | homovulgaris | so how do u want them to be tangent ? |
| 21:59.26 | homovulgaris | by orientation change ? |
| 21:59.27 | brlcad | s/the/a/ |
| 22:00.34 | homovulgaris | this basically would mean a datum geometry |
| 22:01.18 | homovulgaris | by datum geometry i imply the fact that the combination is fundamentally non-parametric .. it has nothing the system can vary. so the only thing the system can do is translate/ rotate and scale |
| 22:01.20 | brlcad | yes, basically by orientation .. it's finding that orientation+position that's the (really, really) hard part when dealing with the implicit form |
| 22:02.00 | brlcad | i think i'm just convincing myself that it's really not feasible to perform that sort of constraint without a brep evaluation |
| 22:02.23 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 22:02.36 | brlcad | at best you could maybe do it for the primitives themselves |
| 22:02.38 | homovulgaris | i think it would be feasible |
| 22:02.43 | homovulgaris | this case i mean in general i am not sure |
| 22:02.45 | brlcad | i'm still not hearing how though |
| 22:02.52 | brlcad | even for this case |
| 22:02.57 | homovulgaris | true |
| 22:03.03 | brlcad | say you just have two torii |
| 22:03.21 | brlcad | where one is just slightly shifted to the left/right and is subtracted |
| 22:03.54 | brlcad | so you end up with a big "C" sliver on the outside and another on the inside facing the other way |
| 22:04.25 | brlcad | if I said "make that combination tangent" to anything .. there's no practical way to found out where the tips of that C are |
| 22:04.36 | homovulgaris | basically .. given the two torii |
| 22:04.48 | brlcad | without ray-tracing the hell out of it |
| 22:05.03 | homovulgaris | after the combination given any point on the surface i can know the tangent value |
| 22:05.11 | brlcad | that's my point |
| 22:05.18 | brlcad | you don't know any point on the surface with implicits |
| 22:05.25 | brlcad | the surface is .. implicit ;) |
| 22:05.50 | brlcad | and that just gets worse (much much higher order) when you throw in csg operations |
| 22:06.00 | homovulgaris | yeah so u need the boundary representation :P |
| 22:06.12 | brlcad | you evaluate the surface of an implicit with ray-tracing |
| 22:06.32 | brlcad | you could implement some sort of newtonian search that uses ray-tracing to find the closest point, but that'd be really nasty |
| 22:07.23 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. |
| 22:07.47 | brlcad | now what could be useful is instead of the brep form, I think you might just need "handles" and there may be a generalized way to describe that for any geometry |
| 22:08.23 | yukonbob | waves in; afternoon, gentlemen (and ladies?) |
| 22:09.12 | brlcad | e.g. for a sphere, the handles are its center point and radius; for a box, it's the 8 corner points, 12 edges, and center point |
| 22:09.38 | brlcad | so you could add routines to each primitive that amount to "what are your available handles" |
| 22:10.07 | homovulgaris | hmm.. basically entities which would help you calculate stuff ? |
| 22:10.25 | brlcad | e.g. for a brep, it's all the points, edges/curves, and surfaces that define the object and a center point |
| 22:10.32 | brlcad | yeah |
| 22:12.26 | homovulgaris | but then these routines would vary widely with respect to each primitive right ? |
| 22:12.43 | brlcad | e.g. for a right circular cylinder it's the center point, 2 curves for the circular ends, two radius values for those circles, and the length |
| 22:13.32 | brlcad | yeah, each primitive would be very different, but still only amounting to a limited set of parameterizable values that can be used in the equations/constraints |
| 22:14.52 | homovulgaris | they can be used in equations and constraints but are not themselves modifiable right |
| 22:15.17 | brlcad | why not? |
| 22:15.58 | homovulgaris | they are basically for usage in equations and not for determination and definition of geometry |
| 22:16.00 | homovulgaris | for example in the case of a sphere |
| 22:16.28 | brlcad | ah, missed the dcc, feel free to resend |
| 22:16.34 | homovulgaris | we have center and radius which are two parameters |
| 22:17.15 | homovulgaris | (it was on constraint satisfaction) |
| 22:17.57 | homovulgaris | ok.. wait.. what i have been calling parameters till now are mostly generative parameters or in other words parameters which are necessary to define or create a geometry. |
| 22:18.59 | brlcad | that's a bit of a recursive definition there ;) |
| 22:20.00 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 22:20.45 | homovulgaris | ok lets call them values and objects necessary for creation of objects |
| 22:22.40 | brlcad | i don't care so much what we call everything as it really all blends together -- the main distinction I do make, though, is that we have -- say -- a sphere that is stored a point and a radius .. and now we're adding these things that we're calling parameter objects or constraint objects or widgets whatevers where I get to specify the range/domain of valid values that sphere's position and radius can have |
| 22:23.03 | homovulgaris | so in the case of the above sphere ( we have 2 parameters ( 1. center point 2. radius ) |
| 22:23.03 | homovulgaris | ( about dcc argh.. my college firewall sucks :(( ) |
| 22:23.29 | brlcad | yeah, it announces as 127.0.0.1 |
| 22:23.46 | homovulgaris | yep |
| 22:23.50 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 22:24.28 | brlcad | so in that sphere example, there are at least two objects .. the sphere itself and this constraint/parameter/equation object |
| 22:24.44 | brlcad | wrt the .g file at least |
| 22:25.07 | brlcad | the constraint/parameter/equation object necessarily refers to the sphere object of course |
| 22:25.23 | brlcad | so you have your (as yet) one-node graph there |
| 22:25.37 | homovulgaris | ( and continuing with the spere analogy: there could be other definitions of the sphere . example a sphere with center on a line and radius as the distance between some other points A and B ) |
| 22:25.50 | homovulgaris | so we have two objects additional to the sph1 object in .g file |
| 22:26.30 | brlcad | so if I impose a constraint of radius==5 or position.x = sqrt(radius) etc |
| 22:27.09 | brlcad | dude, pick a more simple example than "center on a line and radius as the distance between some other points A and B" :) |
| 22:27.11 | homovulgaris | 1 is the parametric object which stores information relating to the fact that the center is on a line and that the radius is the distance between two points ) |
| 22:27.26 | brlcad | there are way too many prepositionals in there :) |
| 22:28.17 | homovulgaris | and 2 is the constraint object ( which is basically where u can specify situations like tangency with a plane ) |
| 22:28.38 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 22:28.38 | homovulgaris | ok see in our example of a sphere with a centre and radius |
| 22:28.41 | homovulgaris | we have sph1 in .g |
| 22:29.01 | homovulgaris | we also have a parametric object in .g specifying the fact that the sphere is built using a radius and a centre or 2 parameters |
| 22:29.18 | homovulgaris | till now we dont need to do anything about constraints |
| 22:31.19 | homovulgaris | now lets say we decide that we are going to need the sphere to be always tangent to xy plane.. that is a relation with 1. another object ( xy plane) and 2. does not affect how the sphere was originally defined **directly** |
| 22:31.23 | brlcad | I don't see the point of the parametric object, can just refer to one of the object's 'parameters' .. you can implement knowledge of valid parameters into the primitives and combinations |
| 22:31.49 | homovulgaris | that is when we need a constraint object |
| 22:32.38 | brlcad | i suppose i was only seeing them as the two combined |
| 22:33.16 | homovulgaris | basically i think csg has a limited set of ways of defining the primitives |
| 22:33.37 | homovulgaris | by using the parametric system we can define the same set of primitves in more number of ways |
| 22:33.57 | brlcad | you can have constraints that refer to nothing, effectively just become named parametric equations (e.g. my_sine_obj ==> f(x) = sin(x), which has "one parameter") |
| 22:35.33 | brlcad | i'm not saying not have "the parametric system", you just said "object" which makes me think database object .. I don't see what having two database object types gives us when the first one really is just a handle on what the primitives already have |
| 22:37.26 | homovulgaris | k |
| 22:37.32 | brlcad | am I misunderstanding something about what you just referred to as the parametric object type's purpose? how's having param1 object that provides sph1's radius and center as two parameters different than allowing named convention of obj.parameter or something similar (e.g. sph1.radius) that gets used in the constraint object |
| 22:38.28 | homovulgaris | yeah i know.. but there are different methods of defining the same primitive right ( like if i take the example of a point which is not a primitive right now i guess ? 1. a point can be defined as being on a plane and specified by two coordinates, 2. being on a line specified by a ratio 3. being a projection of another point on a line 4. being a projection of a point on a plane 5. between two points specified by a ratio .. and so o |
| 22:38.29 | homovulgaris | n ) and all these points can be represented using simply coordinates as well.. so multimple definition systems can have a common storage system |
| 22:38.30 | brlcad | on disk, it's useful to remember that everything is a named reference |
| 22:40.55 | homovulgaris | like for example considering defining a sphere as one passing through 3 points.. so parametrically it depends on three points.. on the present .g system it would be stored as sph3.. using radius and centre values and the **parametric** object would have reference to sph3 and reference to the three points |
| 22:42.00 | brlcad | okay, i see that example, but that still to me are just various formulas/equations .. so if we did have a point object, he'd have one inherint "parameter" for the xyz values, if you wanted the various 1/2/3/4/5 methods, that'd be a constraint/parameter/equation object similar to my my_sine_obj => f(x) = sin(x) example |
| 22:42.19 | homovulgaris | i hope i am not confusing u between points in space and a point actually existing as a primitive |
| 22:45.48 | brlcad | for your sphere through 3 points example, it'd be the sph object and a parameter/constraint/equation object that would describe that relationship, namely you'd need some sort of enclosure operation |
| 22:46.28 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. never thought in that direction |
| 22:47.30 | homovulgaris | basically looking at the definition of the geometry as a constraining process in itself |
| 22:47.50 | brlcad | with your 3 points example, what exactly does it contain other than the reference to sph3 and the three points? |
| 22:48.12 | brlcad | it == parametric object |
| 22:48.47 | homovulgaris | in .g file yes |
| 22:49.04 | brlcad | heh, it wasn't a yes/no question ;) |
| 22:49.13 | homovulgaris | in memory basically that'd be the object calculating the centre and radius |
| 22:49.14 | homovulgaris | from the three point coordinates |
| 22:49.39 | brlcad | how/where does it actually describe/encode that the sphere needs to encompass those three points |
| 22:51.45 | homovulgaris | well a sphere passing through three points is a standard definition of a sphere and hence would be in the code |
| 22:51.58 | homovulgaris | as in if the sphere parametric object receives three points as inputs it constructs the sphere object by taking that assumption |
| 22:52.27 | brlcad | ah |
| 22:52.29 | brlcad | yuck :) |
| 22:52.56 | brlcad | that'd basically require coding in the 1/2/3/4/5/n ways for creating any primitive |
| 22:53.13 | brlcad | i was thinking of a generalized solution that applies to any object, primitive or otherwise |
| 22:53.34 | brlcad | "make this torus encompass these three points" |
| 22:53.37 | homovulgaris | yeah the part i like the least |
| 22:53.37 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 22:54.23 | brlcad | mm.. food for thought |
| 22:54.31 | brlcad | and speaking of food.. dinner time :) |
| 22:54.54 | homovulgaris | we can try that using constraint satisfaction. |
| 22:54.56 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 22:54.56 | homovulgaris | morning jogging time here :) |
| 22:55.02 | brlcad | we can continue later if you're on ;) |
| 22:55.34 | archivist | interesting read /me goes home to bed |
| 22:56.11 | homovulgaris | basically my idea is we would have some primitives for generating geometry .. for generalized solution systems i'll have to devote lots of time over the year writing constraint satisfaction algorithms for various **interesting** cases.. like encompassing for example |
| 22:56.57 | brlcad | i really think libpg (or whatever it's called) needs to not have any lists of primitive types or specific creation criteria, it can know about different types of "parameters" (this is a point, this is a non-negative value, this is a vector, etc) |
| 22:57.17 | archivist | likes "gear" mates in solidworks |
| 22:57.30 | homovulgaris | and these primitive geometry systems would server as a basis in terms of constraint solving by variationg of parameters.. |
| 22:57.33 | homovulgaris | anyways.. lots of food for thought ;) |
| 22:59.04 | brlcad | I don't want to see this library encroach upon what librt already does -- librt manages object creation, basic validity checking, knows about each primitive that is supported etc |
| 22:59.11 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 22:59.13 | homovulgaris | i will do some more groundwork :) |
| 23:00.02 | brlcad | really don't want to "replicate" that in libpg, want to overlay existance rules .. the constraint/equation solver adjusts the values on demand per what is specified |
| 23:02.02 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 23:02.29 | homovulgaris | ok.. so that way i have to only concentrate on what sort of primitive definitions are already supported right. |
| 23:02.55 | brlcad | so if you wanted to describe a sphere with three points on the surface, you'd create a constraint akin to on_surface(point1, point2, .. pointn) and tell the solver to search for a solution |
| 23:03.06 | brlcad | sorta |
| 23:03.20 | brlcad | you shouldn't have to know or care what the primitives/object types are |
| 23:04.04 | brlcad | I'm really expecting you'll need to add a routine to each primitive that describes what data values (and their types) can be modified |
| 23:06.21 | brlcad | and that's a really limited set of things you'd need to recognize: values, non-negative values, ranged values (e.g. valid -1 to 1), points (3 values), vectors (3 ranged values), edges (2 points), and planar surfaces (point + vector) for starters |
| 23:07.02 | brlcad | so each/any object can provide a named list of those recognized knobs that can be referenced |
| 23:07.22 | brlcad | then your constraint/equation system goes to town with generalized solutions |
| 23:07.56 | brlcad | really goes to dinner now, bbl! |
| 23:08.38 | homovulgaris | k :) |
| 23:08.41 | homovulgaris | on it ;) |
| 23:08.59 | homovulgaris | :) am going to run 4 kms ;) |
| 23:10.52 | homovulgaris | and this has been a really productive day .. i would have spend another 2 days thinking arbitrary stuff :) |
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| 01:53.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31113 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_sph.c: shot routine was not setting surfno of hit |
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| 02:29.02 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Is there a function in libbu to return all the files in a directory? |
| 02:29.15 | starseeker_ | Or even better, all files matching a particular suffix? |
| 02:35.25 | starseeker_ | notes, with some dismay, that dirent.h is present only in src/other/... |
| 02:46.33 | starseeker_ | Hmm... http://www.cs.fiu.edu/~weiss/cop4338_spr06/dirent.h |
| 02:48.35 | louipc | that's supposedly part of C POSIX library |
| 02:48.57 | starseeker_ | Does Windows XP include it? |
| 02:49.08 | starseeker_ | I'm seeing evidence of many workarounds for the lack of it in Google |
| 02:50.44 | louipc | I don't know |
| 02:51.54 | louipc | seems people have ported it |
| 02:52.17 | starseeker_ | looks for the license on mingw's version... |
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| 03:05.29 | starseeker_ | looks like mingw's is public domain, if I can find it... |
| 03:09.22 | starseeker_ | Ah ha - http://mingw.cvs.sourceforge.net/mingw/msys/packages/make/3.81/w32/compat/dirent.c?view=log |
| 03:09.35 | starseeker_ | http://mingw.cvs.sourceforge.net/mingw/msys/packages/make/3.81/w32/include/dirent.h?view=log |
| 03:10.27 | starseeker_ | Grr - that says it's gpl though |
| 03:12.22 | starseeker_ | How can something so simple be so hard... arrgh... |
| 04:03.50 | Maloeran | You may have to use a couple #ifdef for Posix and win32 for these things, but it's generally simple enough |
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| 08:11.56 | yukonbob | starseeker_: of course the gcc is going to be GPL'd; you may find what you're looking for in a BSD distro, though (ie: checkout NetBSD, OpenBSD, FreeBSD directly) |
| 08:12.23 | yukonbob | hits hay |
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| 12:55.14 | ``Erik | http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080514/ap_on_fe_st/odd_britain_vader_raider |
| 14:00.45 | ``Erik | bsd distros tend to come with a lot of gpl crap in 'em |
| 14:11.28 | archivist | where would bsd be without gcc |
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| 14:24.43 | Maloeran | Ahah Erik |
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| 14:52.57 | pacman87 | got all my grades back, all A's! |
| 14:54.45 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: re your email, I see why the point + two normal vectors won't work |
| 15:00.07 | pacman87 | the sketch primitive already has a point, and u/v vectors in the sketch plane. Since the revolve needs to know what sketch it's using, I was thinking about just using the point and one of the vectors to rotate about, and specifying the rotation as an angle from -2pi to 2pi for clockwise and counterclockwise rotation about the vector from the sketch |
| 15:14.07 | d_rossberg | pacman87: Congratulations! that's really impressive |
| 15:14.43 | d_rossberg | about the sketch: i see two problems |
| 15:15.22 | d_rossberg | first, will you keep the sketch as a seoerate element? |
| 15:16.13 | d_rossberg | second, how do you want to ray trace a revolve from a nurb or bezier? |
| 15:16.44 | d_rossberg | to do this you need iterative methods |
| 15:17.01 | d_rossberg | (like in openNURBS) |
| 15:29.31 | pacman87 | you read my plan to transform the ray to a hyperbola, to reduce the problem to 2D, right |
| 15:31.03 | d_rossberg | right, but above degree 4 it's hard to compute the roots of a curve |
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| 16:20.42 | andrecastelo | good afternoon, folks |
| 16:21.23 | andrecastelo | sup ``Erik, brlcad :D |
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| 17:15.39 | ``Erik | yargh, matey |
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| 18:36.51 | prasad_ | http://cgi.ebay.com/Airwolf-Helicopter-Replica_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ18836QQihZ014QQitemZ330234658865QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW |
| 18:37.41 | louipc | cool |
| 18:37.44 | louipc | does it fly? |
| 18:38.12 | louipc | aw it doesn't |
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| 19:26.55 | ``Erik | yay, javascript 'onclick' zoom for my comic page O.o |
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| 20:13.58 | ``Erik | heh, zoom code is a lot uglier, but more robust now :D no more of that funky behavior |
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| 22:02.07 | alex_joni | cia is trashing again.. |
| 22:08.41 | brlcad | probably just restarting |
| 22:09.02 | brlcad | takes cia about a half hour to fully shut down and start back up |
| 22:09.17 | alex_joni | oops.. sorry.. meant that in the channel right next to this one ;) |
| 22:09.37 | alex_joni | brlcad: lots of people flooding #cia that bots don't work, #commits is dead, etc |
| 22:09.52 | brlcad | nods |
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| 22:13.30 | brlcad | hugs CIA-22 |
| 22:13.35 | CIA-22 | hugs brlcad |
| 23:21.23 | ``Erik | heh |
| 23:42.58 | ``Erik | andre, your patch... missing terminal newlines, looks like it's doubled (two copies of diffs for one file), and you should be using the bu list stuff instead of rolling your own singly linked list |
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| 01:31.47 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: thanks for the feedback erik.. i didn't use bu list because i had a hard time compiling it in the center point patch, so i didn't use it in neither ones.. but i'll make the proper modifications |
| 01:42.10 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: and what do you think of the structures themselves, do you think they are useful? Also, should there be a struct light_source ? What do you think ? |
| 02:01.31 | brlcad | had the same thoughts on the patch, but hadn't the time to comment/apply it yet .. :) |
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| 03:30.14 | starseeker_ | reads slashdot and notes with dismay the direction the OLPC is taking... |
| 03:31.07 | brlcad | finishes mucking with CIA for tonight |
| 03:31.37 | starseeker_ | Read the wrong way, that sounds like international intrigue ;-) |
| 03:32.38 | starseeker_ | Maybe we should call the channel logging bot NSA ;-) |
| 03:32.38 | brlcad | nah, just trying to recover from the Zen-Sources activities |
| 03:32.45 | brlcad | cia was way overloaded |
| 03:32.50 | starseeker_ | ouch |
| 03:33.24 | brlcad | they seem to be merging/commiting the entire linux module repo history |
| 03:33.36 | starseeker_ | !! |
| 03:34.27 | brlcad | at least I'm pretty sure linville hasn't *actually* made 3000 commits within the past 24 hours.. :) |
| 03:35.03 | poolio | lies. they've just been busy :) |
| 03:36.00 | starseeker_ | is liking the idea of calling the logging bot NSA, except we might really freak out some people :-) |
| 03:36.42 | poolio | CIA stands for culinary institute of america, no? |
| 03:36.55 | starseeker_ | Does for (;;) keep looping indefinitely until it hits a break condition? |
| 03:37.24 | poolio | I believe so. |
| 03:37.54 | starseeker_ | poolio: Not usually, but if you regard culinary skill as intelligence I can see some manager somewhere suggesting a merger ;-) |
| 03:38.01 | brlcad | poolio: I coined it to be "commits in action" a long time ago |
| 03:38.23 | poolio | brlcad: heh. interesting how some acronyms stand for many things ;) |
| 03:38.25 | brlcad | but originally, it was a pun on our favorite big brother org |
| 03:38.33 | poolio | ah, of course. |
| 03:38.44 | poolio | Man, so I was looking through that brep stuff..seems like a pain in the butt format. |
| 03:38.49 | poolio | That cube code is quite lengthy :P |
| 03:38.57 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:39.17 | brlcad | you have to do a lot to maintain the solidity constraint |
| 03:39.43 | brlcad | that's the way in code to make it happen with arbitrary/flexible surfaces |
| 03:39.59 | brlcad | it's a bit easier for some primitives, and breplicator is intentionally duplicative/verbose |
| 03:43.09 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31118 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_ars.c: The surfno on the hit should be set to the triangle number :-) Actually, the ars shot routine is never called, since the ars prep routine turns it into a prepped bot. |
| 03:44.02 | brlcad | aww |
| 03:44.04 | brlcad | so close |
| 03:46.34 | starseeker_ | slowly begins to grok the interact routine in nirt... |
| 03:47.12 | starseeker_ | and wonders why lines are limited to 255 characters... |
| 03:48.21 | brlcad | probably arbitrary |
| 03:48.27 | brlcad | because some buffer is/was 255 |
| 03:48.34 | brlcad | magic numbers are evil |
| 03:49.09 | starseeker_ | wonders if that will come up if we start encouraging people to play with the formatting, particularly for things like html output... |
| 03:54.36 | starseeker_ | contemplates swapping in bu_vls instead of the 256 char fixed buffer, then decides to sleep on it... |
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| 04:38.39 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 04:38.52 | poolio | sleeps |
| 04:42.22 | brlcad | cya poolio |
| 05:38.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31119 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/nmg_rt_segs.c: add sanity check on the a_hit hitmiss struct before dereferencing it even though the list is supposed to be checked before it gets this far with a NMG_CK_HITMISS_LIST earlier on |
| 06:04.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31120 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (g_nmg.c nmg_rt_isect.c): maybe I can get it wrong two-for-two .. try to properly set the surfno for g_nmg via nmg_rt_isect() by using the face 'index'. I'll be surprised if that's actually right.. |
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| 06:22.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31121 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_xxx.c: provide an example for how to allocate and add a new segment if there was a hit. |
| 06:40.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31122 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_xxx.c: make the example primitive actually compile so it can be kept in sync as API changes are made. remove the obsolte v4 import/export routines since new primitives shouldn't be implementing v4 support. |
| 06:50.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31123 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (Makefile.am g_xxx.c): clean up comments, add g_xxx to the build so that it can be kept in sync with the API |
| 06:57.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31124 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_grip.c: comment consistency cleanup |
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| 07:17.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31125 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_nurb.c: add support for keeping track of a surface number for the nurbs surfaces of this primitive by simply keeping a counter over all surfaces. also make the damn curlies consistent with our style convention. |
| 07:23.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31126 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_pg.c: learn from ars debachery, use the triangle we hit as the surface number |
| 07:47.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31127 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_sketch.c: fix the curlie brace inconistency hell, match our style. this is the last of the prims that didn't reference a surfno (this one doesn't need to since it's not solid. |
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| 08:35.15 | clock_ | lol |
| 08:35.23 | clock_ | <@brlcad> section in config.log is the second line that they over-wrote the price of prostitution -- to get a seriously gay and sexually loaded version of bible |
| 08:35.42 | clock_ | <@brlcad> and yeah, I really don't care about those whiners, their low-level f'ups are their own Linux Phone |
| 08:36.17 | clock_ | <@brlcad> i'm surprised you have the tcl init problem -- you could do that with them as he fucked my puppy |
| 08:37.30 | clock_ | <@brlcad> lemme see if I can find a bf |
| 08:37.32 | clock_ | :D |
| 08:37.41 | clock_ | <@brlcad> I don't really want the whole system in 25 minutes... |
| 08:38.11 | clock_ | < Z80-Boy> brlcad: but then I just swapped the frames and I had a pool full of random waves which magically composed many orders of magnitude more than the person submitting the proposal -- and the point of view of both mozilla and vorbis is the audio component |
| 08:39.18 | clock_ | <@brlcad> and even for opennurbs, to hide it as implementation detail instead of keeping the skate or inline wheels |
| 08:39.40 | clock_ | <@brlcad> still, not sure what -fomit-frame-pointer with duct-tape. |
| 08:39.57 | clock_ | <@brlcad> our ability to efficiently represent, visualize, and analyze geometric target 1.5A |
| 08:40.53 | clock_ | <@brlcad> screen needs to be stored for 10000 years |
| 09:18.27 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
| 09:18.27 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 09:19.13 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
| 09:19.13 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 11:42.52 | ``Erik | ´/det |
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| 13:46.03 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-4-31.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 14:03.53 | brlcad | clock_: wtf is all that stuff stuff supposed to be? |
| 14:08.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31128 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added comb_color command to libged. |
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| 14:52.09 | clock_ | brlcad: that's IRC logs mangled by an AI program |
| 14:52.33 | clock_ | brlcad: the program is just a qsort and binary search. |
| 16:14.08 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31129 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added GED_DATABASE_OPEN. |
| 16:28.03 | brlcad | d_rossberg: thanks for the note, hope you have fun :) |
| 16:30.18 | d_rossberg | thanks, i'm going to the black forrest |
| 16:30.34 | brlcad | wow, nice |
| 16:31.37 | d_rossberg | i hope for good weather |
| 16:31.56 | brlcad | you far from there? few hours yes? |
| 16:38.11 | d_rossberg | 4 hours by car |
| 16:38.35 | d_rossberg | germany isn't so big |
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| 16:48.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31130 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added the shader command to libged. |
| 17:08.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31131 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/comb_color.c: Fixed typo. |
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| 17:43.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31132 10/brlcad/trunk/ (12 files in 2 dirs): GED_CHECK_DBI_NULL has been removed. GED_DATABASE_OPEN has been replaced by GED_CHECK_DATABASE_OPEN. GED_CHECK_READ_ONLY's first parameter has changed from a struct db_i to a struct rt_wdb. |
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| 18:49.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31133 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added the edcomb command to libged. |
| 19:12.28 | prasad_ | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmkVWuP_sO0 |
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| 20:16.54 | yukonbob | attends a GSoC talk at BSDCan |
| 20:21.45 | ``Erik | bastage |
| 20:22.15 | ``Erik | if you see randi, poul, mm, or skul, tell 'em I say "ZOMG HI!!#" |
| 20:22.29 | ``Erik | or any of the rest of the gang :D |
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| 20:22.58 | yukonbob | Lellie Hawthorn is presenting atm |
| 20:23.03 | yukonbob | *Leslie |
| 20:23.04 | ``Erik | I know randi went, d'no if juli did |
| 20:23.11 | ``Erik | she's a google person, not a bsd person |
| 20:23.21 | yukonbob | right. |
| 20:23.36 | ``Erik | pouts and whines cuz he's not there |
| 20:24.41 | yukonbob | ``Erik: want me to grab you some BSD horns? |
| 20:25.28 | ``Erik | meh *shrug* |
| 20:25.34 | *** join/#brlcad pacman_87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 20:25.41 | yukonbob | heh :) |
| 20:25.59 | ``Erik | I'm mostly just sitting being pissed at how fucktarded my gov't is wrt foreign travel |
| 20:26.57 | ``Erik | I mean nafta and requiring passport for travel to canuckia and mehico? O.o wtf |
| 20:27.06 | yukonbob | ``Erik: sign-up, and then ask for something like a "letter of invitation" to show the customs officers on your way across the border... |
| 20:27.42 | yukonbob | ah... |
| 20:27.42 | ``Erik | I was invited to present at bsdcan a couple years ago |
| 20:27.42 | ``Erik | but gov't idiocity screwed the pooch |
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| 20:30.08 | ``Erik | <bsdcan> we'll pay your flight and hotel and everything! <work> no no, we'll pay all that, ti's good, grats! just get the paperwork in 60 days before... (81 days before) *submit* <work> bounce! bounce bounce bounce (64 days before) <work> ok, end of bounce over semicolons and shit, but, oh, DAMN you didn't make the 65 day window! |
| 20:30.22 | ``Erik | <erik> 65? I thought it was 80 <work> HAH, fuck off, boy! |
| 20:30.49 | ``Erik | no, wait, got the numbers backwards, heh |
| 20:30.52 | poolio | Sorry ``Erik. Didn't know that work used IRC ;) |
| 20:30.54 | ``Erik | was a couple years ago :) |
| 20:31.31 | ``Erik | *grumble* |
| 20:31.47 | pacman_87 | anyone have experience setting up 3 monitors over 2 cards? |
| 20:31.58 | ``Erik | only with macs, pacman |
| 20:32.28 | pacman_87 | i have 2 on an nvidia card, and one on integrated intel |
| 20:33.04 | yukonbob | pacman_87: *nix, Windows, ?? |
| 20:33.09 | pacman_87 | linux |
| 20:33.33 | ``Erik | should be fairly easy with xinerama, no? |
| 20:34.31 | pacman_87 | the intel port works for text-only mode, but when i start X, only the two nvidias work |
| 20:34.34 | ``Erik | 3 'driver' sections, 3 'screen' sections, and the mapping bit |
| 20:37.19 | yukonbob | has had multiple displays running in 3 diff't ways over the years |
| 20:40.01 | yukonbob | (currently doesn't run Xinerama, but has two displays (ie: 0:0, and 0:1 -- mouse/kb works across displays, but can't drag windows, cut/paste) |
| 20:40.11 | yukonbob | ) |
| 20:43.29 | ``Erik | hrm, I haven't used x11 at terminal for years... been a mac running x11.app and remote X stuff for me :/ |
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| 20:52.11 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31134 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added GED_CHECK_COMB, GED_DB_LOOKUP, GED_DB_GET_INTERNAL and GED_DB_PUT_INTERNAL. |
| 20:56.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31135 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/shader.c: Modified to use new GED macros. |
| 22:13.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31136 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): |
| 22:13.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: remove FAST_NMG, turning on the plethora of additional run-time NMG checks |
| 22:13.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: provided via NMG_CK_HITMISS and NMG_CK_HITMISS_LISTS. still wrap them in |
| 22:13.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: NO_BOMBING_MACROS though so that they can still be disabled at compile-time. |
| 22:13.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: modified NMG_CK_HITMISS_LISTS to not take the iterator and removed a slew of the |
| 22:13.34 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: checks that were rather .. gratuitous. |
| 22:32.37 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik.. updated the patch |
| 23:13.12 | ``Erik | aight, in the end, it's brlcad who makes the real call, i'm just trying to steer, aight? |
| 23:21.19 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hm ok, no problem :) |
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| 23:36.26 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31137 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: looks like nobody is using BU_QFLSTR, so buh-bye |
| 23:38.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31138 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: comment on BU_QFLSTR and NMG_CK_HITMISS_LIST changes since they've been in the headers for a long while |
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| 03:03.40 | starseeker_ | uh... how very odd |
| 03:04.18 | starseeker_ | when running iges-g with the -n flag on the openmoko model, I get: Segmentation fault. 0xb746817a in ?? () from /lib/libc.so.6 |
| 03:04.23 | starseeker_ | in gdb |
| 03:07.49 | starseeker_ | iges-g -n -o phone.g gtc01-mme01_asm.igs, with the model here: http://downloads.openmoko.org/CAD/Neo1973_IGES_STEP.zip |
| 03:08.15 | starseeker_ | the 3d drawing and 2d drawing imports work but don't raytrace |
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| 06:47.19 | PrezKennedy | zomg 3am and brlcad isnt here! |
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| 15:26.18 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
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| 17:38.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31139 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/oed/oed.xml: Fix incorrect object name in push command |
| 17:48.53 | starseeker_ | hmm. Since query_ray is an alias to nirt, wouldn't it be better to use nirt as the default Base Name in the Query Ray dialog? |
| 18:39.15 | yukonbob | slowday in #brlcad |
| 19:00.42 | brlcad | yup |
| 19:01.00 | brlcad | starseeker_: yeah, query_ray should go away eventually |
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| 19:24.27 | starseeker_ | on the other hand, query_ray is more descriptive than nirt... |
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| 19:46.29 | starseeker_ | brlcad: The rset commands are dev only? (i.e. off limits in user docs?) If so, is there a non-rset command line way to turn the grid on and off? |
| 19:47.26 | brlcad | yes (and depends) and no afaik |
| 20:27.16 | starseeker_ | nuts |
| 21:33.24 | starseeker_ | decides to see what e17 is up to... |
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| 13:21.07 | yukonbob | waves in |
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| 15:23.30 | brlcad | waves back at yukonbob |
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| 22:21.14 | poolio | waves in |
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| 04:19.22 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o learner] by ChanServ | |
| 04:20.15 | learner | woo hoo! |
| 04:27.14 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 04:27.14 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 04:32.04 | learner | damn, I forgot how good these speakers are |
| 04:32.54 | learner | is glad to be back on-line |
| 04:53.14 | poolio | waves |
| 04:53.30 | poolio | What speakers? |
| 04:54.25 | learner | some harmon kardon soundsticks |
| 04:55.35 | poolio | cool cool. I've got some JBL speakers that wreaked havoc at college :) |
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| 13:20.27 | ``Erik | saw a smart car on his way into the office today O.o |
| 13:28.48 | starseeker | so did I |
| 13:28.53 | starseeker | odd little thing |
| 13:29.25 | ``Erik | yeah, looked weird moving that fast |
| 13:31.40 | starseeker | brlcad: the brlcad data directory is a good place to put nirt formatting scripts, but where should they live in the source tree? The db directory is top level, but that doesn't seem quite right.. |
| 13:32.28 | ``Erik | misc/ ? src/nirt/ ? |
| 13:33.04 | starseeker | I suppose a subdirectory in nirt would be simplest... |
| 13:33.24 | starseeker | steels himself for another autotools round |
| 13:33.34 | ``Erik | heh, just put 'em in with the source |
| 13:33.43 | starseeker | ew |
| 13:33.56 | ``Erik | we do it with docs, and it's a tiny dir already |
| 13:34.23 | starseeker | Still, I'd prefer to plan for the future - there may potentiall be a lot of these suckers |
| 13:35.18 | starseeker | needs an autotools round anyway - they do get a new directory in share |
| 13:35.21 | ``Erik | then they can be moved to another dir later? svn's big one-up on cvs (imho) is the ability to move things sanely |
| 13:35.52 | starseeker | Sure it could be done later, but I'm hoping to avoid revisiting nirt for a while once this is done ;-) |
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| 13:39.16 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone :) |
| 13:39.27 | ``Erik | morning, andre |
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| 14:03.08 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik , how are you doing ? |
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| 14:45.24 | yukonbob | morning cadheads. |
| 14:45.40 | pacman87 | good morning, yukonbob |
| 14:46.25 | yukonbob | hey pacman87. What's happening in your part of the whirled? |
| 14:46.46 | pacman87 | trying to set up a 3-monitor display |
| 14:47.35 | yukonbob | still... ugh :P |
| 14:47.46 | yukonbob | pacman87: what route are you trying to do? |
| 14:47.49 | pacman87 | but intel and xinerama dont' play nice, and i can't get xrandr to work |
| 14:48.09 | pacman87 | i've got two on an intel card, plus integrated intel (845G) |
| 14:48.20 | pacman87 | *nvidia card, not intel |
| 14:49.11 | pacman87 | right now the two nvidia screens are merged with twinview, and the intel is a seperate x sessions |
| 14:49.21 | pacman87 | *session |
| 14:51.53 | yukonbob | pacman87: can you use the same pointer between all sessions? |
| 14:51.58 | pacman87 | yes |
| 14:52.18 | pacman87 | but i cant' drag windows between them |
| 14:52.19 | yukonbob | but just no window dragging, or cut/paste (w/o something like x2x) |
| 14:52.23 | yukonbob | right |
| 14:52.24 | yukonbob | ok |
| 14:52.28 | yukonbob | that's what I use... |
| 14:53.41 | yukonbob | it's actually got some benefits as a side effect -- when I blit from workspace to workspace, I can start apps on one session (and leave the workspace I want it to appear on at the foreground) and move to the other session and navigate workspaces with interfering... |
| 14:54.41 | pacman87 | someone(tm) should figure a way to do both: drag windows, and swap workspaces independently |
| 14:54.52 | yukonbob | x2x? |
| 14:55.24 | yukonbob | no -- that won't work.. |
| 14:55.56 | yukonbob | ya -- /me wonders if the X model makes it impossible |
| 14:57.20 | pacman87 | it probably have to be with one X session, and swapping out the workspaces per display within that session |
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| 15:30.22 | yukonbob | pacman87: /me thinks it'd be a wm feature, where the wm would have an integrated launcher, and know the "ID" of the workspace that an app was launched on, and have a list of window titles for that app and withdraw the windows according to the same rules as regular workspace swapping... |
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| 15:31.21 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 15:39.15 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 15:39.15 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
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| 17:23.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31141 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt): Add missing z_dir label. |
| 17:36.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31142 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt): Change formatting for csv to add headers for ray and results. |
| 18:09.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31143 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt): Add quotes in csv for strings. |
| 18:38.01 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31144 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Check in local directory before checking system directory for sfile, in case local file is using conflicting name. |
| 19:01.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31145 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added GED_CHECK_EXISTS, GED_CHECK_REGION and GED_DB_DIRADD. |
| 19:04.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31146 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (comb_color.c edcomb.c item.c make.c mater.c): Mods to use the new GED macros. |
| 19:47.20 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-f6a97592f9beaa85) | |
| 19:51.11 | brlcad | howdy homovulgaris |
| 19:51.42 | homovulgaris | hi sean :) |
| 19:52.04 | homovulgaris | things going well ;) finally getting free from my university :P |
| 19:52.40 | homovulgaris | I thought about approaching the problem the way you said.. and yeah that is a more functional and **pure** approach ;) |
| 19:54.49 | homovulgaris | I'm editing the wiki to update the thoughts.. basically i believe we will have 3 major code chunks in terms of the constraint system. |
| 19:56.02 | homovulgaris | the flow basically is 1. reading data from .g ( to which we add the "handle" system) so that we know what parameters to modify etc. |
| 19:56.59 | homovulgaris | 2. from the set of parameters thus obtained we use (I) Domain Extractor to infer or define the range of values the parameters can have |
| 19:57.07 | homovulgaris | this results in the production of a constraint network object |
| 19:57.56 | homovulgaris | 3. the constraint network thus generated is used by the (II) Solver which results in the generation of a Solution Object (basically a vector/array) |
| 19:58.37 | homovulgaris | 4. This solution object is inturn used by the (III) Geometry updater to update the geometry via librt |
| 19:59.46 | homovulgaris | so we have Domain Extractor+Solver+Updater |
| 20:01.41 | homovulgaris | In terms of generalization I think Solver can be generalized using standard methods of approaching constraint satisfaction problems. we can always provide better and better algorithms/ methods for solving constraint networks as time progresses |
| 20:02.09 | homovulgaris | the domain extractor would be specific to the context ( variables/handles and geometry objects involved) |
| 20:02.42 | homovulgaris | the updater is also pretty generic. |
| 20:06.39 | homovulgaris | One part which is missing is the handle generation aspect and where the code should be located. |
| 20:07.09 | homovulgaris | In terms of interfacing with librt, it is basically at geometry updation |
| 20:07.29 | homovulgaris | and reading the geometry data |
| 20:16.36 | homovulgaris | Domain extractor is also the part which would specify the way equations are for example and how to interpret them once we have read all the data from .g |
| 20:16.54 | homovulgaris | domain extractor is not exactly a very apt name |
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| 22:30.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31147 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgview.c: Sean added sanity check in response to crash - more work needed |
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| 00:43.36 | andrecastelo | good evening folks |
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| 01:39.15 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik |
| 03:36.41 | learner | howdy andrecastelo |
| 03:36.47 | learner | que tal? |
| 03:37.07 | andrecastelo | learner: hey what's up? |
| 03:37.30 | learner | not much, just finished munching on some boiled peanuts, new fresh batch :) |
| 03:37.40 | andrecastelo | learner: i see |
| 03:38.01 | andrecastelo | learner: you're using translators now?? :b |
| 03:48.20 | learner | tanslators? |
| 03:48.28 | learner | er translators? |
| 03:48.59 | andrecastelo | [00:36] <learner>que tal? |
| 03:49.10 | andrecastelo | i just thought :b |
| 03:50.35 | learner | jej, ya entiendo |
| 03:50.52 | learner | y no :P |
| 03:57.04 | learner | andrecastelo: so just about ready to go? :) |
| 04:34.22 | brlcad | apparently not |
| 04:35.07 | pacman87 | hi brlcad |
| 04:35.12 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 04:35.18 | brlcad | you ready? :) |
| 04:35.24 | pacman87 | pretty much |
| 04:35.28 | brlcad | great |
| 04:35.34 | pacman87 | got a nice 3 monitor display set up :) |
| 04:35.42 | brlcad | so got it all working eh |
| 04:35.43 | pacman87 | 4480x1050 |
| 04:35.47 | brlcad | sweet |
| 04:35.56 | pacman87 | well, not exaclty how i want it, but close enough |
| 04:36.42 | pacman87 | i didnt get a chance to discuss the deliverables with d_rossburg before he left |
| 04:37.19 | brlcad | sense *gasp* private e-mails :) |
| 04:38.47 | pacman87 | and for patches to get to commit access, i'm planning on continuing the hyperboloid |
| 04:39.00 | brlcad | great |
| 04:39.25 | pacman87 | though most of the patching i'd do is changes to the g_hyp.c file, which is new |
| 04:39.30 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:40.47 | brlcad | pacman87: fyi, for future reference, you can/should combine all those patch files into just one patch file |
| 04:40.57 | brlcad | svn diff > your_changes.patch |
| 04:41.07 | brlcad | if you svn add the new file, you can even bundle in new files |
| 04:41.42 | pacman87 | right, i was keeping them seperate so i could keep track of the files i changed, but i can do that just as easily by reading the diff :) |
| 04:43.29 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:43.45 | brlcad | and patches are usually for the patcher's convenience/use, not the submitter's ;) |
| 04:44.37 | pacman87 | i'll pull them all and put up a unified patch on my next change |
| 04:44.49 | pacman87 | working out exactly what tess() does |
| 04:50.15 | brlcad | no need to rework the patches, that's just a pedantic detail "for next time" and/or others |
| 04:52.17 | pacman87 | well, if i'm doing a svn diff, they should all be there, right? |
| 04:52.24 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:52.49 | brlcad | you should run the diff for patches as well as before (all) commits too |
| 04:53.05 | brlcad | so you can do the review before you commit |
| 04:53.16 | pacman87 | right |
| 04:53.21 | pacman87 | needs to svn up |
| 04:54.01 | brlcad | which you can do now |
| 04:54.58 | pacman87 | updated to revision 31147 :) |
| 04:55.32 | brlcad | wasn't referring to the svn up :) |
| 04:56.19 | pacman87 | i'm checking to make sure nothing broke on the update |
| 04:59.37 | brlcad | always a good thing :) |
| 05:00.12 | brlcad | you should do a quick test to make sure it's set up proper |
| 05:08.02 | pacman87 | seems i have some svn setup to do; "svn diff | grep SOURCE | less" gives 1242 lines :( |
| 05:11.42 | brlcad | just usually does "svn diff | less" .. and reads |
| 05:12.20 | brlcad | it's mostly a quick review of "are these the changes/files that you intended" |
| 05:13.13 | brlcad | coupled with a compilation test and maybe a run-time test depending on the change, that's usually plenty reasonable |
| 05:14.39 | pacman87 | did src/librt/debug.h get moved somewhere? |
| 05:15.35 | brlcad | ayep |
| 05:21.05 | brlcad | to find out what happened to a file that was potentially deleted with svn, you can run "svn log --verbose src/librt | less" .. look for the src/librt/debug.h line and it'll tell you when the file was last modified, what the modification was, etc |
| 05:25.36 | pacman87 | so it was removed, not moved |
| 05:28.55 | brlcad | yep |
| 05:29.05 | brlcad | it was empty, obsoleted a long long time ago |
| 05:31.17 | pacman87 | seems there's a div by zero possibility in my rt_hyp_norm() i didn't notice the first time :\ |
| 05:32.00 | brlcad | there were a few minor issues like that |
| 05:33.38 | pacman87 | is NEAR_ZERO() the usual way to handle this? |
| 05:33.48 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:34.01 | brlcad | all floating point equality comparisons should use that |
| 05:35.15 | pacman87 | i wasn't talking about a comparison, though |
| 05:35.37 | pacman87 | the problem happens when z=0 (around the 'waist' of the hyperboloid) |
| 05:36.04 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:36.11 | pacman87 | in that case, the normal is in the x-y plane, and i can use a different algorithm |
| 05:37.34 | pacman87 | so would it be better to check z or what i'm dividing by? |
| 05:46.30 | brlcad | usually what you're diving by, or the code leading up to it |
| 05:46.43 | brlcad | since it's the div-by-zero that will cause a run-time floating point exception/crash |
| 05:46.59 | brlcad | otherwise you'll want to check both |
| 05:47.14 | brlcad | you've got a slew of potential divide-by-zero's |
| 05:47.28 | brlcad | with the right parameters |
| 05:48.16 | brlcad | e.g. if a == b == sqrt(.5) |
| 05:48.25 | brlcad | (.7071067..) |
| 05:49.26 | pacman87 | which function? |
| 05:50.00 | brlcad | at least norm, noticed a few other potentials in shot too iirc, but I didn't look too hard |
| 05:50.09 | brlcad | work in progress ;) |
| 05:50.18 | brlcad | you should still apply what you have now |
| 05:50.30 | brlcad | and just work the mods/fixes/improvements incrementally |
| 05:50.32 | pacman87 | it does compile :) |
| 05:50.46 | brlcad | that's an important first step :) |
| 05:50.59 | pacman87 | but compile != correctness |
| 05:51.26 | brlcad | sure, but it's a start and you intend to improve it right? |
| 05:51.31 | pacman87 | of course |
| 05:51.53 | brlcad | better to see the work progress incrementally |
| 05:52.06 | brlcad | you've put in a lot of good effort so far |
| 05:53.30 | brlcad | so if it wasn't obvious .. |
| 05:53.46 | brlcad | you should just commit what you have now, and keep going |
| 05:54.13 | pacman87 | right, now i'm trying to fix svn |
| 05:54.26 | brlcad | fix? |
| 05:54.40 | brlcad | you said it compiles no? :) |
| 05:54.45 | pacman87 | svn diff gives a whole lot more lines than needed |
| 05:54.49 | brlcad | ah |
| 05:55.03 | pacman87 | fix svn, not the code therein |
| 05:55.17 | brlcad | svn revert will undo changes to files you didn't intend to modify |
| 05:55.54 | brlcad | it'll also undo delete, add, and other file "events" |
| 05:57.53 | pacman87 | the full svn diff is 39189 lines, so i'll revert and reapply my patches |
| 05:58.23 | brlcad | how so? what's in the diff? |
| 05:58.50 | brlcad | "svn status" will tell you the files that are actually modified |
| 05:58.53 | pacman87 | ~pastebin |
| 05:58.54 | ibot | [~pastebin] A "pastebin" is a web-based service where you can paste anything over 3 lines without flooding the channel. Here are links to a few : http://www.pastebin.com , http://pastebin.ca , http://channels.debian.net/paste , http://paste.lisp.org , http://www.rafb.net/paste |
| 06:01.28 | pacman87 | too big for pastebin, but here it is if you want it: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/brlcad.diff |
| 06:02.35 | brlcad | yep, the usual |
| 06:03.26 | brlcad | a lot of windows line-terminated files were converted to unix line endings, usually caused by overly ambitious/invasive GUI IDE's |
| 06:03.49 | brlcad | svn revert src/other && find . -name \*.dsp -exec svn revert {} \; |
| 06:03.56 | brlcad | that'll take care of most of them |
| 06:07.21 | brlcad | again, that's where "svn status" comes in handy, it'll list the modified files and you can revert any that aren't intentional |
| 06:07.38 | pacman87 | that's exactly what i'm doing :) |
| 06:08.12 | brlcad | oh, and that should have been svn revert --recursive src/other |
| 06:08.31 | pacman87 | yeah, i picked that up when nothing happened |
| 06:15.17 | pacman87 | my g_hyp.c has mime-type: text/plain and eol-style: native, is this correct? |
| 06:18.15 | brlcad | yes |
| 06:20.07 | pacman87 | ok, here comes the commit! |
| 06:23.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31148 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): start of code to support hyperboloid of one sheet, finished prep(), print(), shot(), norm(), uv(), and free(); still need to check for div by zero cases |
| 06:23.54 | brlcad | woo hoo |
| 06:23.59 | pacman87 | :D |
| 06:24.14 | brlcad | the start of something great ;) |
| 06:24.38 | pacman87 | thanks for all your help, and sorry to bother you with the trivial stuff |
| 06:24.39 | brlcad | now you can employ the "commit early, commit often" ;) |
| 06:24.58 | brlcad | np, that's what I'm here for |
| 06:27.34 | pacman87 | 1:30am, bedtime |
| 06:27.37 | pacman87 | back tomorrow |
| 06:27.45 | brlcad | cya! |
| 06:27.58 | brlcad | should do the same, hrmph |
| 06:32.11 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31149 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: remove register keywords from public interface |
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| 13:21.09 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone :} |
| 14:22.46 | pacman87 | morning, andrecastelo |
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| 18:03.03 | poolio | alloo |
| 18:19.45 | PrezKennedy | guten tag |
| 18:23.03 | poolio | heh, it's already the afternoon :) |
| 18:51.35 | alex_joni | day's almost over over here |
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| 21:10.00 | brlcad | but but .. the night is just getting started alex_joni |
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| 22:21.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31150 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: fix div by zero in norm() for g_hyp.c |
| 22:26.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31151 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: note to self: compile first, then check in |
| 22:26.54 | brlcad | :) |
| 22:27.13 | pacman87 | missed the second arg to NEAR_ZERO() |
| 22:42.34 | poolio | pacman87: for divide by zero, wouldn't equality work? Or are you just afraid that really tiny values will lead to way too large results? |
| 22:43.40 | pacman87 | the second one |
| 22:44.06 | pacman87 | i'm using ( x/z, y/z, 1 ) as a vector, then normalizing |
| 22:45.52 | pacman87 | except, of course, when NEAR_ZERO(z) |
| 22:48.43 | poolio | ah fair enough |
| 00:33.49 | brlcad | mmm.. new bottle of scotch |
| 00:33.52 | brlcad | does a review |
| 00:52.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31152 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: don't mention SMALL as it's deprecated, use SQRT_SMALL_FASTF instead |
| 00:52.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31153 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: go even smaller, use SMALL_FASTF instead of the deprecated SMALL size |
| 00:54.23 | pacman87 | :) |
| 01:31.15 | brlcad | finishes his review :) |
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| 02:41.50 | yukonbob | waves in; hello, cadheads |
| 03:42.09 | poolio | Ah joyous day, I still have a fscked up libtool. <3 debian. |
| 03:45.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31154 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/temp.c: add a note that the routine is not thread-safe. there would minimally need to be some protections added when adding items to the auto-close list |
| 03:53.06 | poolio | Argh. I think I have a working .g but can't test |
| 04:56.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31155 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: update comment to reflect that it does more than -all_load now |
| 04:57.43 | brlcad | poolio: what do you get with: grep TCL_CPPFLAGS src/libsysv/Makefile |
| 04:59.16 | poolio | TCL_CPPFLAGS = -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/generic -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/unix |
| 05:00.21 | brlcad | that's it? |
| 05:00.58 | brlcad | should have at least a libsysv_la_CFLAGS line too |
| 05:03.56 | poolio | ah yeah, didnt realize that was relevant: |
| 05:04.39 | poolio | ITCL_CPPFLAGS = -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/incrTcl/itcl/generic |
| 05:04.39 | poolio | TCL_CPPFLAGS = -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/generic -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/unix |
| 05:04.42 | poolio | libsysv_la_CFLAGS = ${TCL_CPPFLAGS} |
| 05:04.49 | brlcad | k, thats better |
| 05:04.58 | poolio | sorry, shouldn't self-edit if I don't know what's going on :) |
| 05:05.16 | poolio | The clean build is still going...so I wouldn't worry about it for...atleast another 10 minutes |
| 05:05.48 | brlcad | does this give anything: nm src/libsysv/.libs/libsysv.a | grep Tcl |
| 05:06.41 | brlcad | as well as this: nm src/librt/.libs/librt.a | grep ReFree |
| 05:09.35 | poolio | First gives nothing, second gives: U TclReFree |
| 05:10.16 | poolio | FYI, it just errored in the clean checkout as well. |
| 05:10.20 | brlcad | grep TCL_CPP src/librt/Makefile |
| 05:10.38 | poolio | ITCL_CPPFLAGS = -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/incrTcl/itcl/generic |
| 05:10.39 | poolio | TCL_CPPFLAGS = -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/generic -I${top_srcdir}/src/other/tcl/unix ${TCL_CPPFLAGS} |
| 05:11.35 | brlcad | presumably the last TCL_CPPFLAGS there is on a third line by itself? |
| 05:12.18 | poolio | Yes. and it's followed by a \. I'm not sure why the paste picked it up that way |
| 05:12.30 | brlcad | then the next step is to recompile librt verbose so you can see the link line |
| 05:15.19 | poolio | Does --enable-verbose do enough? |
| 05:16.52 | brlcad | nm -o src/librt/.libs/*.o | grep TclRe |
| 05:17.19 | poolio | src/librt/.libs/regionfix.o: U TclReFree |
| 05:17.48 | brlcad | rm src/librt/regionfix.lo |
| 05:18.04 | brlcad | cd src/librt && make LIBTOOL='$(SHELL) $(top_builddir)/libtool' LIBTOOLFLAGS="" |
| 05:18.30 | brlcad | pastebin the output |
| 05:19.07 | poolio | http://rafb.net/p/ehk7E869.html |
| 05:19.23 | poolio | Eww, that didn't wrap, sorry |
| 05:20.35 | poolio | http://pastebin.com/d57bfa836 is wrapped :P |
| 05:21.33 | brlcad | er, you did the rm? |
| 05:21.48 | poolio | I believe, let me try again |
| 05:21.50 | brlcad | rm regionfix.lo regionfix.o |
| 05:22.18 | poolio | Oopsy, I removed the .o not the .lo. sorry |
| 05:23.02 | poolio | brlcad: http://pastebin.com/d615ae79c |
| 05:25.28 | brlcad | ah, is this a vanilla configure? |
| 05:26.25 | poolio | I think I may have actually just thrown in a --enable-verbose a second ago, but other than that and prefix, yes |
| 05:26.37 | brlcad | it's acting like gcc's been configured to search system paths before build paths |
| 05:26.51 | brlcad | ah, kay, then add --enable-all |
| 05:28.17 | brlcad | give that a go and then if it still fails, we'll go the patch route |
| 05:28.25 | poolio | so that failed but I didnt' clean |
| 05:28.49 | brlcad | you'll want to clean after an enable-all |
| 05:29.12 | brlcad | at least in librt |
| 05:34.34 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31156 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: be more specific on the signature for bu_argv_from_string, it takes an array of argvs (already allocated), not just a double pointer. |
| 05:46.07 | brlcad | pumpkinizes for morrow |
| 05:48.16 | poolio | brlcad: more errors but i must sleep. thanks for the help |
| 05:55.16 | brlcad | k |
| 05:56.36 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31157 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (10 files in 6 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 05:56.36 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: rewrite and modify bu_argv_from_string to make it more consistent with other |
| 05:56.36 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: functions. the limit now corresponds to the number of non-NULL words being put |
| 05:56.36 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: into the argv array, not the size of the array (whose size includes the null). |
| 05:56.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: this requires refactoring the function to keep better track of where it is while |
| 05:56.39 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: parsing including now the ability to have arbitrary amounts of whitespace |
| 05:56.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: between words so that it will tokenize like the command line and aren't bad |
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| 12:42.34 | brlcad | hum |
| 12:51.35 | clock_ | brlcad: how many MB does the BRL-CAD source approx. have? |
| 12:51.44 | clock_ | brlcad: I wrote a program to help searching identifiers in the source |
| 13:42.14 | louipc | wowzas 221MB |
| 13:42.20 | louipc | compresses nicely |
| 13:42.36 | clock_ | lol |
| 13:42.45 | clock_ | I think my program would explode |
| 13:42.57 | clock_ | it would take 884MB memory and if it wouldn't swap, then it would take like an hour and then it would work just fine ;-) |
| 13:43.06 | louipc | compressed down to 33MB with bz2 haha |
| 13:43.26 | louipc | clock_: sounds like you need to redesign your program *grin* |
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| 13:48.14 | clock_ | louipc: lol |
| 13:49.00 | clock_ | louipc: or implement external sort using disk files |
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| 17:01.31 | ``Erik | clock_: seen cscope? :) |
| 17:01.35 | ``Erik | morning, andre |
| 17:17.24 | poolio | howdy |
| 17:32.46 | clock_ | HHV - Human Hypochondria Virus |
| 17:51.12 | andrecastelo | hey hi ``Erik |
| 17:55.12 | poolio | brlcad: so this is the current error I'm getting: http://pastebin.com/m5db25ba |
| 18:19.24 | ``Erik | andre, where did you do the svn diff from? in src/, or top level? src/rt ? (I can't tell exactly where the header is supposed to be, or mebbe it should be in include/ ?) |
| 18:24.25 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i did the dif from src.. the file is in src/mlt |
| 18:24.58 | ``Erik | have you decided if you're going to make it as a light model or as a new rt (rtmlt)? |
| 18:25.10 | andrecastelo | i didn't think of putting it in include/ because it has definitions that may be exclusive to mlt |
| 18:25.21 | andrecastelo | as a new tool |
| 18:25.50 | andrecastelo | what do you think ? |
| 18:25.59 | ``Erik | there're plenty of pretty specific things in include/ |
| 18:26.44 | ``Erik | like brep.h, anim.h, the dm.h stuff... I d'no if this warrents a new directory |
| 18:27.51 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 18:28.11 | andrecastelo | but i intend to put the .c files in there.. even so it doesn't warrant a new directory ? |
| 18:28.45 | ``Erik | probably not? :) I imagine there won't be a LOT of C files |
| 18:29.37 | andrecastelo | yes, probably not a lot :) |
| 18:29.53 | andrecastelo | so, should i put the header in include/ and the C files in src/rt ? |
| 18:30.37 | ``Erik | I d'no, header can probably go in either include or src/rt, might be easier to put everything in src/rt ? |
| 18:30.45 | ``Erik | are you familiar with automake? |
| 18:31.18 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: no, not at all |
| 18:31.30 | andrecastelo | i'm using windows :S |
| 18:32.01 | ``Erik | ok, I'll go ahead and move the header there and update the Makefile.am for you, do you have access to a *nix machine of any kind? |
| 18:33.38 | andrecastelo | yes, i can install a linux distro in another partition |
| 18:35.01 | andrecastelo | will you be online later? |
| 18:35.50 | andrecastelo | i'll have to be afk for a while, but i'll be back in two hours tops |
| 18:37.01 | ``Erik | doh, é isn't utf-8 friendly :D |
| 18:37.08 | ``Erik | yeah, I'll be around |
| 18:37.23 | andrecastelo | ok, see you then :) |
| 18:41.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31158 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (Makefile.am mlt_def.h): |
| 18:41.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Application of initial MLT patch from Andre. Changes include location of the header as well as an automake entry. |
| 18:41.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Closes http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1961524&group_id=105292&atid=640804 |
| 18:41.51 | ``Erik | stabs svn a few times |
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| 20:56.56 | prasad_ | missed by 49secs |
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| 22:49.09 | ``Erik | <-- munches ruffage |
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| 02:36.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31159 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/ (Makefile.am redata.c regex.c): don't seem to need the old regex files |
| 02:37.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31160 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): few files missing from dist |
| 02:38.45 | brlcad | poolio: that's a missing -lXi |
| 02:38.54 | brlcad | system library, X input library |
| 02:39.23 | brlcad | should have been autodetected if it were available, but it doesn't halt if it doesn't find it (because there are many platforms that don't have it or need it) |
| 02:41.25 | brlcad | notes that we don't have to be so careful with dirs any more with svn :) |
| 02:47.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31161 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: narrowing down the items attainable in order to make a (source) release by the end of the week, pushing the rest back one or more iterations |
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| 03:08.34 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31162 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: restructure the file so there is no need to declare most of the the static routines |
| 03:08.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31163 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_ogl.c: is the undef RED still needed? |
| 03:10.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31164 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: add some notes on why the ogl framebuffer isn't refreshing |
| 03:21.56 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31165 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/mlt_def.h: should use sh/template.sh when creating new files so that the correct header/footer are created, else take more care when copying an existing file (copyright indicates when the file started, not the project) |
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| 03:38.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31166 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: warn about a frequent compilation problem. if the Xi library isn't found, the build is likely going to fail (on linux). |
| 03:38.19 | poolio | hurray :) |
| 03:52.35 | brlcad | that doesn't fix the problem, it just whines noisily about it |
| 03:52.41 | brlcad | you still have to have the lib installed |
| 03:53.02 | brlcad | and there could still be some other reason the test fails when you do have it installed |
| 03:54.54 | poolio | I'm a big fan of noise. Like loud large letters when configure fails so I don't make :) |
| 04:00.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31167 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: pause at all warnings in a moment of reverence. allow override of the BRLCAD_ROOT verbose warning by setting BRLCAD_ROOT_OVERRIDE in the environment. |
| 04:00.21 | poolio | YES! |
| 04:00.53 | poolio | ~brlcad++ |
| 04:01.20 | brlcad | heh |
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| 04:27.00 | poolio | brlcad: brlcad compiled and installed! hurrah :P |
| 04:34.09 | poolio | brlcad: Uh oh. I tried raytracing my brep and it's spamming WTF?? :P |
| 04:35.36 | poolio | Should I trust that if mged can't handle a brep cylinder then I've done something wrong, or is it possible it's just not working yet? |
| 04:59.30 | poolio | Yeah so...raytracing is definitely b0rked :) |
| 05:18.13 | louipc | another release coming out eh? nice |
| 05:41.05 | PrezzKennedy | hmm... need to get my bro back in here again |
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| 06:01.37 | brlcad | poolio: i mentioned that the ray-tracing capability is *current* development efforts |
| 06:01.48 | brlcad | far from functional |
| 06:02.41 | brlcad | so no, you should't assume anything about how it ray-traces |
| 06:03.23 | brlcad | you just have to look at the topological structure, the output of 'l', maybe try the openNURBS demo visualizer |
| 06:03.57 | brlcad | PrezzKennedy: he didn't actually say anything last time iirc, no? |
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| 13:47.11 | PrezzKennedy | brlcad, yeah he did |
| 14:52.34 | ``Erik | sighs as configure.ac forces another ugly deep cycle of auto scripts |
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| 16:06.07 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31168 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/docbook/ doc/docbook/oed/ src/libged/ src/nirt/sfiles/): ignore generated Makefile and Makefile.in |
| 16:31.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31169 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Added commands for comb_color, edcomb, edmater, item, make, mater, rmater, shader and wmater. |
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| 17:43.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31170 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libsysv/libsysv.vcproj: Update the list of source files. |
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| 18:40.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31171 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/dirent.c: Add (very) early stages of dirent related libbu functionality. Not yet in library form, which is why it's not being added to make system just yet. |
| 19:08.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31172 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/mirror.c: |
| 19:08.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Temporarily comment out the use of bu_vls_from_argv and bu_argv_from_string. |
| 19:08.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: bu_vls_from_argv fails to handle arguments with white space (e.g. the argument |
| 19:08.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: for -d might be something like {2 3 4}). So if the argument to -d was {2 3 4}, |
| 19:08.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: bu_optarg's value was 2 when it should be "2 3 4". |
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| 21:45.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31173 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (nirt.1 nirt.c): not short dammit. -s is silent mode. |
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| 01:05.04 | brlcad | yay, indy time |
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| 02:09.35 | cad38 | hey |
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| 03:52.53 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, how was indiana jones... I'm guessing that's what you went to see... |
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| 05:00.19 | learner | PrezKennedy: yup |
| 05:00.50 | learner | and guess who went .. someone you know that hasn't been to a theater in years! :) |
| 05:01.57 | learner | it was pretty good, it's in the same spirit as the others .. there were a few scenes that were pretty cheezy/contrived, but overall I liked it |
| 05:02.07 | learner | not as good as 1 or 3, but probably better than 2 |
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| 06:14.53 | brlcad | uh oh |
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| 07:45.09 | brlcad | recovers from the full disks |
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| 12:56.44 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
| 12:57.09 | homovulgaris | hey Sean, u there :) ? |
| 12:57.36 | homovulgaris | i was planning on writing the tests for the polynomial coefficient change i had done. |
| 12:57.59 | homovulgaris | what all should the test check ? 1. the limits of the root solver ? 2. comparison between pre and post patch results ? and 3. using an external solver like gsl ? |
| 13:18.51 | PrezKennedy | part 2 was godawful |
| 13:19.24 | homovulgaris | :) ? |
| 13:20.29 | homovulgaris | has anybody tried out opencascade .. |
| 13:21.08 | homovulgaris | trying to get salome running on debian unstable |
| 13:49.41 | brlcad | howdy homovulgaris -- those all sound like reasonable things to test |
| 13:50.37 | brlcad | probably in order of 2, 1, 3 |
| 13:51.31 | brlcad | as well as a macro-level test, running the benchmark to make sure the results are correct (make benchmark or 'benchmark' after install) |
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| 14:07.03 | poolio | brlcad: AH DISKS FULL. Oh, good work :P |
| 14:12.00 | homovulgaris | ok ;) on it.. |
| 14:20.46 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, it happens every few months if left unattended |
| 14:21.11 | brlcad | the machine generates *massive* amounts of log data across all services given how busy it is and what it's used for |
| 14:22.01 | brlcad | where massive is several GB/month (of text) |
| 14:23.02 | brlcad | which is all neatly compressed and managed, but still accummulates slowly .. and coupled with general multiuser system tendancy to fill to the available resources ... :) |
| 14:23.33 | brlcad | alas reason to get back to work on the system migration where the new servers have a lot more disk |
| 14:23.59 | brlcad | it does encourage/enforce me regularly cleaning up the filesystem though, so not too bad :) |
| 14:43.13 | ``Erik | so migrate already, beeyotch :D |
| 14:44.05 | ``Erik | I wonder if it'd be useful to do piecewise migration, like move named responsibility to th enew one, then mebbe db stuff to the new one, then mail to the new one, then web to the new one... over the course of a couple weeks or something |
| 14:44.20 | ``Erik | instead of one big switch |
| 15:03.18 | brlcad | yeah, thought about that some |
| 15:04.08 | brlcad | i think it's just more a matter "doing it", whether piecewise or in whole |
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| 15:16.09 | PrezKennedy | homovulgaris, i meant part 2 of indiana jones... ;) |
| 15:16.50 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, so my mom actually went? she never goes to the movies |
| 15:21.07 | brlcad | yep |
| 15:21.26 | brlcad | had a good time too, I think |
| 15:21.46 | brlcad | said she was probably good for another 5 years now |
| 15:25.10 | clock_ | brlcad: by telling your mom is alive you are giving some partial information about your age, don't you see that as a problem? |
| 15:26.01 | louipc | my mom's mom is still alive |
| 15:28.07 | poolio | brlcad: true true, my filesystem is getting messy these days |
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| 15:37.44 | brlcad | clock_: actually wasn't saying anything about my mother, but yes she is still alive and no I don't see that as a problem at all (I'm quite thrilled my parents are alive, tyvm) |
| 17:12.31 | poolio | brlcad: so I think I've got working sphere and cylinder. That's not to say I understand Brep at all, I just know how to write a few lines of code ;) |
| 17:15.16 | poolio | brlcad: Also, how is the C++ going to factor in with the existing C librt code? |
| 17:52.34 | ``Erik | notes that human lifespan runs from 0 years to in excess of 120 years, and humans are physically capable of breeding as young as ~12, so a fact like ones mother being alive does *NOT* say terribly much about ones age O.o |
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| 18:31.13 | brlcad | poolio: i'm (mentally) working that out now, ideally/necessarily they should be separate compilation units, yet we want them grouped together |
| 18:31.48 | brlcad | so I think I need to do some restructuring, move each primitive into its own subdir |
| 18:32.24 | ``Erik | opposed to simple wrapper in src/librt++/ ? |
| 18:32.25 | brlcad | and then break them up .. then your routine is just the g_obj_brep.cpp file |
| 18:33.07 | brlcad | ``Erik: he's not making an OO interface, he's implementing a single C routine for each primitive |
| 18:33.13 | brlcad | but the back-end guts to the routine use C++ |
| 18:33.18 | brlcad | via openNURBS |
| 18:33.37 | brlcad | so it's really still part of librt, just implementation detail |
| 18:33.41 | brlcad | not a layer on top |
| 18:34.05 | ``Erik | ah |
| 18:34.30 | brlcad | so instead of turning each primitive into a cpp file, I'm thinking to just break them up |
| 18:34.55 | brlcad | had that in mind for a long while actually, as a way to organize the bits already there (e.g. the 30+ nurbs files, to 30+ nmg files, etc) |
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| 19:54.30 | poolio | brlcad: cool cool |
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| 20:57.29 | ``Erik | what? seize the carp? |
| 21:29.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31174 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/rt/opt.c src/rt/rtcheck.1 src/rt/viewcheck.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 21:29.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: bob added this option way back in 2005 ( 15 Aug 2005 21:43:07 to be exact ) but |
| 21:29.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: it was never documented. this option makes rtcheck write the plot file data in |
| 21:29.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: text format instead of the default binary format. binary should probably not be |
| 21:29.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: the default, so presumably this was a first step towards that direction; at |
| 21:29.43 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: least it lets you get text instead of binary so you can avoid the tty warning |
| 21:29.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: about binary output. reduce globals by one, the code is updated to reuse the |
| 22:04.13 | starseeker_ | ``Erik: That's not how I fish for carp... |
| 22:06.37 | starseeker_ | uses pole and bait rather than seizing with hands... |
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| 22:08.06 | ``Erik | yeah, you're a wuss |
| 22:08.06 | ``Erik | :D |
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| 22:48.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31175 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: it really just causes too much confusion. z-clipping should be off by default. |
| 23:22.36 | ``Erik | http://www.explosm.net/comics/1286/ |
| 23:28.28 | starseeker_ | brlcad: What was that trick you used yesterday to capture the nirt command used by mged? |
| 23:28.45 | starseeker_ | or dump it to a file rather |
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| 23:35.25 | brlcad | nirt > some_file |
| 23:35.49 | brlcad | ooh |
| 23:35.54 | brlcad | saveview |
| 23:36.34 | brlcad | saves the view .. view scripts just happen to also be render scripts (since they have all the necessary view information) |
| 23:37.27 | brlcad | notes that nirt only needs a -o option to be compatible with the saveview script interface .. someone(tm) should add that |
| 00:20.56 | starseeker_ | output to pix file? |
| 00:26.56 | starseeker_ | Given that's nonsensical in command line nirt, should it just be a "throwaway" option? |
| 00:27.15 | starseeker_ | or did you want nirt to optionally generate an mged style wireframe as a pix file? |
| 00:28.39 | starseeker_ | comes to the belated realization he has no idea how to output a wireframe as a .pix file or even if it can be done... |
| 00:34.26 | starseeker_ | or we could teach saveview to omit the -o option when nirt is specified... |
| 00:54.02 | brlcad | i was thinking more that with -o the nirt output or other logging output would go to that file instead of stdout/stderr/bu_log .. the default ".pix" would of course need to change to something more generic (maybe .log) |
| 01:16.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31176 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: (log message trimmed) |
| 01:16.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: this has come up so many times over the year, it needs to be documented so it |
| 01:16.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: can be eventually worked on. develop a low-level tool for investigating, |
| 01:16.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: reporting statistics on, and repairing geometry database files. the tool should |
| 01:16.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: nominally perform big/little endian conversions, report number and types of |
| 01:16.12 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: objects, allow deletion/undeletion/hiding/unhiding, provide some general means |
| 01:16.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: to manipulate the packed and unpacked .g file data for performing low-level |
| 02:30.01 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I haven't looked at saveview yet, but would it be hard to conditionalize the suffix based on the command supplied? The command is already one of the arguments to saveview - wouldn't it be a quick comparison? |
| 02:30.20 | starseeker_ | .log for nirt, .pix for rt, etc... |
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| 05:15.54 | brlcad | starseeker_: sure, probably just if cmd == "rt" then ".pix" else ".log" |
| 05:16.25 | brlcad | or maybe .out or something generic |
| 05:18.20 | brlcad | since there are a variety of formats .. rt and rtedge are .pix; rtweight is text; rtcheck is binary or ascii plot data and log output; nirt default is text/log output; etc |
| 05:19.04 | brlcad | i suppose it could have knowledge of all those and behave accordingly then defaulting to something generic |
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| 05:30.20 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 06:47.47 | brlcad | starseeker_: aha! |
| 06:49.22 | brlcad | my recollection was right .. nirt did/does (used to) take commands via -e ... you inadvertently broke that behavior with r31097 |
| 06:50.05 | brlcad | i.e. before that revision, you could run something like: nirt -e "xyz 0 0 1000; dir 0 0 -1; s; q" db/moss.g all.g |
| 06:51.59 | brlcad | -e was interpreted as a script; -f reads a file, hence the type parameter to enqueue_script |
| 06:59.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31177 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: nirt -e seems to have been busted with r31097 |
| 07:29.04 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 07:29.31 | hippieindamakin8 | hey guys |
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| 07:35.46 | brlcad | howdy hippieindamakin8 ! |
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| 08:37.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31178 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: rather belated thanks to Daniel for finding/fixing the bu_ptbl memory leak that was occuring during prep where delete_regs wasn't getting freed from an rtip. this change was made in 28 Oct 2006 14:56:23 as CVS rev 14.17 |
| 08:54.54 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad wassup |
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| 15:01.19 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Ah, crud - sorry about that! |
| 15:01.34 | starseeker_ | I'll look into it ASAP |
| 15:23.45 | starseeker_ | I don't see how that could have done it - that rev was just to fix a missing break and change the displayed options - it must be elsewhere |
| 15:35.35 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace (n=iraytrac@71.31.152.84) | |
| 15:38.23 | ``Erik | well, poo, I went through all the code monkeys material on youtube |
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| 16:57.11 | brlcad | starseeker_: it basically just did a strcpy before of the script -- now, though, you have it inside the if clause |
| 16:58.19 | brlcad | i.e. look at the inputs .. the data is in 'string' .. follow where string is put into str for both cases of type == READING_FILE and != READING_FILE |
| 16:58.53 | brlcad | more paper references if you don't have them in the bib: http://www.google.com/search?num=50&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&rls=en&q=paint+the+night+brl-cad&btnG=Search (three top results) |
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| 17:09.43 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31179 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (main.c opt.c): move output_is_binary to opt so that remrt can resolve the reference |
| 17:10.29 | iraytrace | what's the appropriate way of checking out "head" these days? The SVN link on SF gets all the repositories (jbrlcad, etc) |
| 17:10.39 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 17:10.40 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 17:11.26 | iraytrace | thx |
| 17:56.48 | ``Erik | checks out "cinelerra" |
| 18:02.56 | *** join/#brlcad iraytrace_ (n=iraytrac@71.31.152.84) | |
| 18:05.16 | ``Erik | I hope it's not terribly linux specific :/ |
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| 20:03.30 | louipc | cinderella is hot |
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| 20:05.16 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
| 20:17.52 | yukonbob | afternoon, cadheads. |
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| 20:55.45 | yukonbob | hey pacman87 |
| 21:19.54 | pacman87 | hey yukonbob |
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| 13:26.06 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
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| 14:51.25 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code, see http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code || GSoC student selections are announced! See http://code.google.com/soc/2008/brl/about.html | |
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| 17:28.39 | d_rossberg | brlcad, pacman87: i'll be away on business the next 2-3 days |
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| 20:34.17 | brlcad | okie dokies |
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| 02:36.16 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 02:36.31 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 02:36.41 | yukonbob | what's shaking, online buddy? |
| 02:37.03 | brlcad | oh, finally getting back to a vision document I've been working on |
| 02:37.19 | yukonbob | heh -- drop peyote, hit wordprocessor? |
| 02:37.36 | brlcad | summarizes what we do, what we want, the path forward ;) |
| 02:37.58 | brlcad | high-level hand-waving, but useful for consolidated direction |
| 02:38.14 | yukonbob | s/useful/necessary/ |
| 02:38.21 | brlcad | heh, true |
| 02:38.49 | yukonbob | plays a bit with plplot... |
| 02:40.00 | brlcad | tries hard to not be "too wordy" while still being precise and concise with the intent |
| 02:40.47 | brlcad | i so don't enjoy writing, takes more time than coding to do well :) |
| 02:41.32 | yukonbob | :) |
| 02:47.04 | brlcad | eek |
| 02:47.37 | brlcad | suddenly realizes that he's very hungry, not having eaten anything in about 8 hours |
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| 03:00.10 | yukonbob | had that feeling the other day, after getting light-headed (s/8h/40h/) Orangina to the rescue for a temp. fix. |
| 03:44.35 | brlcad | sees the light at the end of the tunnel |
| 03:46.52 | Twingy | wonders what brlcad is doing in a tunnel |
| 03:47.22 | brlcad | I'm apparently going towards the light .. |
| 03:47.31 | Twingy | puts bug zapper at end of tunnel |
| 03:48.15 | brlcad | eats the roasted bugs for protein |
| 03:48.40 | Twingy | finishes writing arm7 asm to buffer pixel data from toshiba tcm8230md camera |
| 03:54.12 | poolio | waves |
| 03:55.10 | brlcad | waves back |
| 03:55.55 | poolio | brlcad: so I'm sorry I didn't get started last week...my gramps is in the hospital, but I'm set and ready to go for next week |
| 03:56.32 | poolio | brlcad: so I should just start going down the primitives list? :) |
| 03:58.48 | brlcad | yeah, that sounds like a plan |
| 03:59.37 | brlcad | a few of them already implement a *_nurb() callback that is very close if not identical to what you will likely be implementing, just not using the right data structure (doesn't use openNURBS) |
| 04:01.33 | brlcad | the most important primitives are ell/sph, tgc, and the arbs if you're looking for somewhere to start |
| 04:02.05 | brlcad | arbs should be the easiest .. |
| 04:02.29 | poolio | k |
| 04:19.45 | poolio | brlcad: for arbs, should I break it down case by case for the diff. arbs or try to come up with one algo to handle them all? |
| 04:21.43 | brlcad | up to you |
| 04:22.11 | brlcad | the solution for arbn might solve the arb[4-8] |
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| 19:24.36 | ``Erik | gets the urge to cook |
| 22:12.34 | brlcad | thinks ``Erik spelled 'code' wrong |
| 22:20.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31180 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: -e option works again, but supplying -f AFTER -e ignores the -f flag - need to find out why. Works if -f is used before -e. |
| 22:24.43 | starseeker_ | Oh, I see - it's doing the flags "in order" and executing the -e before the -f flag is supplied |
| 22:25.06 | starseeker_ | thinks about it and thinks perhaps this is intended behavior... |
| 22:26.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31181 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Initialization happens regardless, so only need it in one place - before if. |
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| 00:21.44 | ``Erik | heh, no, it was cook, sorry :) baking, etc |
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| 01:03.41 | andrecastelo | good evening everyone :) |
| 01:07.17 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 01:07.23 | andrecastelo | hey hi pacman87 |
| 01:47.21 | brlcad | howdy guys |
| 01:48.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31182 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: nirt -e works once again |
| 02:02.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31183 10/brlcad/trunk/ (TODO src/libfb/if_ogl.c): better to be slow and visible than vast without a refresh. haven't found why the buffer isn't refreshing yet, but it at least restores functionality. maybe bob can track it down... |
| 02:06.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31184 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: annotate that bob added a -l option to the dbfindtree command so that it'll return the paths in a list instead of the default pretty-print tree. useful for scripting, presumably something dave loman needed. |
| 02:32.40 | starseeker_ | starts having fun stringing -f and -e flags in sequence onto a nirt command... |
| 02:36.09 | yukonbob | waves in; "Hello, cadheads" |
| 03:55.10 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! The fun begins this week! (May 26th) | |
| 04:05.00 | brlcad | thoughts and comments welcome: http://brlcad.org/~sean/BRL-CAD%20Passions.pdf |
| 04:05.56 | brlcad | haven't even proofed it once yet, so I'm looking for big picture feedback, not spelling/comma/grammar tweaks |
| 04:08.12 | brlcad | the intent is global audience, high-level mission/vision/goals with some minimal background information |
| 04:23.25 | starseeker_ | how big will the display holding this be? |
| 04:23.33 | starseeker_ | or rather, how large a poster is it? |
| 04:24.06 | starseeker_ | if it's intended to be read from a distance, that's a lot of text |
| 04:26.20 | starseeker_ | Content wise, I like it |
| 04:26.48 | starseeker_ | gets the sense that about 10 slides of a presentation are living on one page ;-) |
| 04:36.14 | yukonbob | brlcad: it's sexy looking. Nice work. |
| 04:36.52 | yukonbob | Off top of head, the bottom/middle dark block might best be represented with bullets. It reads a bit "wordy" to me |
| 04:36.55 | yukonbob | . |
| 04:39.11 | yukonbob | waves to starseeker_ |
| 04:46.01 | brlcad | it's not for poster/presentation perse -- it's just an informative information sheet |
| 04:46.05 | starseeker_ | waves back |
| 04:46.17 | starseeker_ | Ah - cool |
| 04:46.56 | brlcad | yukonbob: hm, why do you say that? maybe too much jumping out? |
| 04:47.17 | starseeker_ | is brain dead atm - I'll see if I can some up with something coherent tomorrow... |
| 04:47.18 | brlcad | the intent there is to answer the "what is brl-cad" question |
| 04:47.40 | brlcad | no comment is a perfectly acceptible comment too :) |
| 04:47.42 | yukonbob | it just reads really long -- I think it'd be more digestible if the pieces were bite-sized. |
| 04:47.53 | yukonbob | Just that one block, though. |
| 04:48.12 | yukonbob | (although, the top right quote is pretty long-winded too... but what can you do with a quote ;) |
| 04:48.18 | brlcad | care to suggest something more condensed? :) |
| 04:48.37 | brlcad | yeah, the quotes are what they are for the most part |
| 04:48.47 | brlcad | they don't really read well piece-wise |
| 04:49.03 | brlcad | the right one already has a huge chunk cut out, hence the ellipses |
| 04:49.06 | yukonbob | s/,/->/, basically -- I think I might pick a good looking bullet and make a bulleted list of the points that make that long sentence. |
| 04:49.38 | yukonbob | (where "->" == my ascii bullet) |
| 05:08.20 | brlcad | yukonbob: what if it were simply smaller and/or without the fontification? |
| 05:09.04 | brlcad | i'm not sure a bullet list would really look good with the given layout seeing as there's a bulleted list right before it |
| 05:09.26 | brlcad | right now there's also a direct correllation -- four bullets, four sections |
| 05:10.00 | brlcad | could de-emphasize the what is brl-cad, or go for a much shorter version |
| 05:10.01 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: smaller a/o fontification -- perhaps |
| 05:10.25 | yukonbob | or you could simplify the whole works: What is BRL-CAD? |
| 05:10.31 | yukonbob | **AWESOME** |
| 05:10.48 | brlcad | use something like the 80 char version instead of that 512 char version |
| 05:10.49 | yukonbob | (if you don't believe me, you suck) |
| 05:10.59 | brlcad | hehe |
| 05:11.10 | brlcad | I truely did consider getting all punchy in it |
| 05:11.11 | yukonbob | laughs at self... |
| 05:11.30 | yukonbob | it's a _really_ tricky project to capture on a placard |
| 05:11.46 | yukonbob | gets a glass of OJ, too |
| 05:11.56 | yukonbob | anybody want anything while I'm up? |
| 05:12.40 | brlcad | debates caffeinating self |
| 05:15.13 | yukonbob | enjoys a square of 70% cocoa chocolate, passes one to brlcad as a cheap caffeine sub., and/or tasty treat |
| 05:18.14 | yukonbob | also has a vision of the 4 bullets in top-middle square being "pointing fingers", but that's a typographical matter. |
| 05:18.25 | yukonbob | would seem to fit the style |
| 05:23.00 | brlcad | i'll play with that idea some |
| 05:24.22 | yukonbob | just thinks that the current bullets don't do the nice underlines (ie: "<------------>", and the "bow-tie" under "BRL-C" at bottom) justice. |
| 05:24.30 | yukonbob | *BRL-CAD |
| 05:28.13 | brlcad | the <--> was a total afterthought .. it was just a line at first ;) .. and looked better with arrows than without |
| 05:28.52 | brlcad | the main point is actually the one top-front-center |
| 05:31.34 | yukonbob | -_.:Our PassioN:._- ? |
| 05:34.04 | PrezKennedy | you guys deserve 20% raises for the level of dedication |
| 05:36.04 | brlcad | yukonbob: better suggestion? :) |
| 05:37.19 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: gotta just find what you absolutely love doing, and then find someone willing to pay you to do it ;) |
| 05:37.36 | brlcad | absolutely loves working on brl-cad |
| 05:39.07 | PrezKennedy | im pretty happy with what im doing... just not something i wanna do for too much longer... |
| 05:40.19 | brlcad | that's just contentment, gotta find your passion |
| 05:41.23 | *** join/#brlcad PrezzKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 05:41.39 | PrezzKennedy | sweet |
| 05:43.26 | yukonbob | brlcad: suggestions for what? |
| 05:44.18 | yukonbob | was clarifying what you meant when you said "the main point is actually..." -- what you meant by "main point". |
| 05:45.32 | yukonbob | likes the poster -- it's good looking, and informative; /me humbly submits those two points as "improvements" (bullets->"pointing fingers", and less-wordy bottom-center, somehow) |
| 05:46.17 | yukonbob | smells the rain coming down -- apropos, I guess, since he's got the 'Stacey Earle' last.fm station on... |
| 05:46.18 | brlcad | yukonbob: ahh, yeah, that bit |
| 05:47.31 | yukonbob | laughs at PrezzKennedy's entrance... "sweet" |
| 05:47.34 | yukonbob | Kramer-like |
| 05:52.22 | PrezzKennedy | nite y'all |
| 05:54.20 | yukonbob | ciao PrezzKennedy |
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| 12:33.26 | andrecastelo | hey good morning everyone |
| 12:48.52 | ``Erik | salutations |
| 12:52.06 | ``Erik | ponders buying a new ibook |
| 13:08.11 | PrezzzKennedy | snap out of it! |
| 13:09.42 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:10.21 | ``Erik | I have a program I want to run that only works on mac or windows, and I'm not fucktarded enough to tolerate a windows machine, so it comes down to "which mac" :D |
| 13:18.26 | PrezzzKennedy | i tolerate the windows machine because the mac is overpriced and mostly useless without Parallels |
| 13:20.10 | alex_joni | ``Erik: get the Air-version |
| 13:20.12 | ``Erik | heh, useless how? |
| 13:20.33 | alex_joni | no vista crap on it |
| 13:20.39 | ``Erik | and the last ibook I bought was $700, which doesn't strike me as overpriced |
| 13:21.03 | alex_joni | ``Erik: eeePc? or OLPC? |
| 13:21.06 | ``Erik | the current ibook I'm looking at is 1300, which is cheaper than a windows laptop with the same features |
| 13:21.11 | alex_joni | way lower than half that :) |
| 13:21.21 | ``Erik | needs to run world of warcraft, alex_joni :( |
| 13:21.28 | PrezzzKennedy | does it have a 17" screen? |
| 13:21.40 | alex_joni | ``Erik: there's a version you can play with cards |
| 13:21.44 | ``Erik | the one I'm looking at is 13", not a macbook pro |
| 13:22.15 | PrezzzKennedy | i couldnt find a macbook pro with a 17" screen that wasnt less than like $2000 |
| 13:22.47 | ``Erik | the 17" is nice as a "portable" class, but too big for a laptop type, I really liked the old 12" ibook more than the 15 and 17 macbooks as far as size |
| 13:23.05 | PrezzzKennedy | my laptop is my only computer |
| 13:23.07 | ``Erik | you can use a 12" on a plane comfortably |
| 13:23.29 | ``Erik | <-- keeps servers on his lowest floor, sits at laptops exclusively at home |
| 13:23.52 | PrezzzKennedy | plays games that are new... |
| 13:24.03 | ``Erik | <-- thinking a 13" ibook 2.4gz, 2g ram, 160g hdd, dvd burner, plus a keyboard, razer pro mouse and a 20" wide screen lcd |
| 13:24.19 | ``Erik | that should keep me happy for several years |
| 13:24.47 | ``Erik | I prefer to play games that are fun :> I still fire up 'vice' to play games once in a while |
| 13:27.57 | PrezzzKennedy | the new games are quite fun... youll see in 4 years when they finally get ported... :P |
| 13:29.00 | ``Erik | heh, ported to what, mac? or linux? seems mac ports come out fast, and with apples sales screaming up and microsofts down, the critical mass for exclusion seems to be disappearing *shrug* |
| 13:29.16 | ``Erik | I don't play games too much (better things to do), but I enjoy the few I do play... |
| 13:29.29 | PrezzzKennedy | when youre at the bottom the only place to go is up... |
| 13:29.39 | ``Erik | actually, for games, bsd is the bottom |
| 13:29.46 | ``Erik | actually, no |
| 13:29.51 | ``Erik | I bet beos is lower |
| 13:29.52 | ``Erik | :) |
| 13:30.22 | ``Erik | thinks the boy has been drinking the ms gametard koolaid too long :) |
| 13:31.27 | PrezzzKennedy | you're buying from a company that seriously charges $700 for 4GB of RAM and you're telling me im drinking kool-aid? |
| 13:31.48 | ``Erik | heh, ya don't buy the memory from apple, just the base machine |
| 13:32.13 | ``Erik | then ya slap macports on it, shove your own third party memory in, light up the nfs mounts, and go to town |
| 13:33.08 | PrezzzKennedy | what's macports? |
| 13:33.34 | ``Erik | package management system, unix style |
| 13:34.22 | ``Erik | similar in concept to the bsd ports collection, gentoos portage, debian/ubuntu apt |
| 13:34.29 | PrezzzKennedy | gotcha |
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| 13:35.22 | ``Erik | anyways, mac prices are on par with dell, gateway, compaq, etc if you don't approach things too naïvely, in my experience |
| 13:36.28 | ``Erik | like... not exploring third party ram (which is the big sticker from apple, they prey on companies with graphic weenies who need macs, lots of ram, and have no clue how to take the side panel off a mac pro) |
| 13:40.08 | ``Erik | but they don't play ALL the latest games, just most *shrug* so whatever makes ya happy |
| 13:40.24 | Maloeran | From what I have seen, Apple laptops sure are more expensive than Compaq and friends |
| 13:40.43 | ``Erik | pets his $700 ibook O.o |
| 13:40.47 | PrezzzKennedy | the 17" MacBook Pro is twice what I paid for my 17" Pavilion |
| 13:41.01 | PrezzzKennedy | its not twice as nice |
| 13:41.07 | Maloeran | Eheh |
| 13:42.30 | ``Erik | mebbe the winders ones have come down in price |
| 13:42.32 | ``Erik | specs one |
| 13:43.30 | PrezzzKennedy | the processor is a bit better and i think it has an LED screen... but it has the same video card and less memory |
| 13:43.32 | Maloeran | recently brought back 5 laptops from Canada to friends in Venezuela, computers cost 2.5x times as much there |
| 13:44.04 | Maloeran | I would have brought them from Miami but the Best Buy guy said there was a limit of one computer per customer per day for some reason |
| 13:44.24 | PrezzzKennedy | ouch |
| 13:44.55 | Maloeran | Fairly good laptops for ~700$ too |
| 13:45.35 | ``Erik | hrm, I'm crunching on dell trying to find a laptop with the same cpu performance as the crappy little ibook, found one much slower at $1624 |
| 13:46.03 | PrezzzKennedy | which model? |
| 13:46.15 | ``Erik | xps m1330 vs ibook 2.4 |
| 13:46.55 | ``Erik | ok, I found 3 with the same speed, but they all only come in 17" |
| 13:46.59 | Maloeran | Got a link handy for specs on ibook 2.4? Googling |
| 13:47.02 | ``Erik | are are over 2k |
| 13:47.11 | ``Erik | sec |
| 13:47.39 | ``Erik | http://www.apple.com/macbook/specs.html |
| 13:47.57 | ``Erik | oh, they call them macbook now instead of ibook... (used to be ibook and powerbook, now it's macbook and macbook pro) |
| 13:48.09 | ``Erik | I'm using old fogey terms :( |
| 13:48.22 | Axman6 | very old |
| 13:48.36 | ``Erik | shakes his cane at axman6 |
| 13:48.37 | Maloeran | Ah, that explains why I would not find anything :) |
| 13:49.08 | Maloeran | I don't know, seems fairly ordinary to me |
| 13:50.01 | Axman6 | they're good machines |
| 13:50.17 | Maloeran | The laptops I brought for 700$ seem about as good, except with screens of 15.4" |
| 13:50.29 | Axman6 | macbook pro's are even better. they're fantasitc. i've got a few friends wi8th dells craving a MBP |
| 13:51.13 | ``Erik | but do they have the ability to run WoW as well as a full unix suite? :) do they come with video and music editing software that linux cannot compete with yet? :D |
| 13:51.32 | Axman6 | the dells or the MBP? |
| 13:51.36 | ``Erik | was desperately looking for good open source video editing software, isn't finding any :/ |
| 13:51.48 | ``Erik | mal's laptops |
| 13:51.55 | Axman6 | because OS X is unix, with a native version of WoW... and it comes withiMovie for free ;) |
| 13:52.07 | ``Erik | and garage band |
| 13:52.12 | Axman6 | indeed |
| 13:52.41 | Maloeran | Ah, so MBPs com with a bunch of good and non-unix software, I see |
| 13:52.53 | ``Erik | comes with both, mal |
| 13:52.57 | Axman6 | not free, but iWork dominates office in many ways too. nothing out there beats Keynote |
| 13:52.59 | Maloeran | The hardware is not worth the price but I can not comment on the software |
| 13:53.05 | ``Erik | I do like keynote |
| 13:53.13 | poolio | ``Erik: go for the macbook :) Just keep it off your lap |
| 13:53.18 | Axman6 | the hardware is worth the price imo, it's just so high quality |
| 13:53.26 | Axman6 | there's more than specs to look at |
| 13:53.50 | Maloeran | More than the specs?... :) |
| 13:53.52 | ``Erik | heh, I usually put the laptop on my kitchen table... huge work area with a high precision mouse, picking the thing up is a thing of the past :D |
| 13:53.54 | Axman6 | much more |
| 13:54.21 | ``Erik | yeah, the hardware is solid and if it isn't, apple is usually really good about 'just making things right' |
| 13:54.23 | Axman6 | there's so much attention to detail |
| 13:54.24 | Maloeran | There are 14" laptops for 1000$ with better processors, 3 gb of ram, a real video chip |
| 13:54.26 | PrezzzKennedy | oh yeah i crave a macbook pro too |
| 13:54.32 | PrezzzKennedy | its just twice as expensive as im willing to pay |
| 13:54.54 | Axman6 | PrezzzKennedy: s'what paents are for... >_> |
| 13:54.56 | Axman6 | heh |
| 13:55.00 | Axman6 | parents* |
| 13:55.16 | PrezzzKennedy | ``Erik knows my dad I believe... |
| 13:55.36 | ``Erik | I like my mbp, but it is a bit pricey and more than I need for the near future |
| 13:56.06 | ``Erik | PrezzzKennedy's dad only bought a home computer fairly recently, despite working with them for many years before O.o he's too busy buying movies heh |
| 13:56.07 | Axman6 | mine was pretty pricy, especially considering you can now get a faster one, for $700 cheaper -_- |
| 13:56.18 | ``Erik | I think his goal is to completely pack a whole room with dvd's |
| 13:56.31 | Maloeran | Mmhm :) |
| 13:57.45 | ``Erik | $1299 vs $1999 for... an nvidia video and 2" display... I'll go with the cheap one, it'll do :) |
| 13:58.04 | Axman6 | and IMO, OS X is an excellent OS. i haven't managed to find an thing i needed to do that i couldn't on here |
| 13:58.04 | poolio | ``Erik: If you don't need the speed you can get a last-gen macbook for cheap |
| 13:58.37 | Maloeran | Just looking at the hardware, you can find better for 800-1000$. Of course, if you really wan the software and don't mind the extra cost... |
| 13:58.40 | ``Erik | hrm, is there an online place for those? that's how I got my ibook for 700, but I had to go to the store and ask if they had any left |
| 13:58.42 | PrezzzKennedy | my dad is using my brothers old laptop |
| 13:58.52 | PrezzzKennedy | which is my old laptop... 2 iterations back |
| 13:59.04 | PrezzzKennedy | and my mom is using my old PC |
| 13:59.34 | Axman6 | my mum's using our old 400MHz G3. runs Tiger just fine |
| 13:59.58 | ``Erik | <-- cheap... not quite kermit cheap, but cheap... bought his last laptop in '03, only computer since was the cheap linux minitower from walmart, running fbsd right now... :) |
| 14:00.27 | PrezzzKennedy | my mom was using a celeron 450 mhz |
| 14:00.39 | ``Erik | and the machine I'm running irc on, a friend was gonna throw it out, so I took it... pheer the p2 650mhz 128gb ram might! |
| 14:00.54 | andrecastelo | hey everyone, sorry to bother, but i'm having some issues compiling the code in windows (i was able to compile it before) - http://rafb.net/p/LiVNR651.html |
| 14:01.10 | Axman6 | ``Erik: pfft, that's nothing |
| 14:01.11 | Maloeran | scratches his head thinking how much he paid for his dual-quad-clovertown |
| 14:01.24 | PrezzzKennedy | ran windows 95 for like 10 years |
| 14:02.02 | ``Erik | andre: did you try to clean and re-build? |
| 14:02.10 | Axman6 | 'my router's a 133MHz, 32MB pentium with a 1GB HDD. running OpenBSD 4.2 (because i'm too lasy to uograde) |
| 14:02.27 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ok, cleaning now |
| 14:02.31 | ``Erik | oh, I bet the new hyp.c wasn't added to your build |
| 14:02.44 | PrezzzKennedy | my router is a 233Mhz 16MB Asus running OpenWRT |
| 14:02.45 | ``Erik | g_hyp.c |
| 14:03.03 | ``Erik | and probably some new .c files in libged that haven't been added |
| 14:03.09 | andrecastelo | oh |
| 14:03.17 | Axman6 | PrezzzKennedy: waaayyy too many MHz :P |
| 14:03.21 | andrecastelo | i'll check the logs |
| 14:03.37 | PrezzzKennedy | it was an $80 router :) |
| 14:03.37 | ``Erik | did you make a miscwin32-msvc9\ copy? |
| 14:03.57 | andrecastelo | yeah, used the latest win32-msvc8 |
| 14:04.14 | Axman6 | mine was a $0 router :) |
| 14:04.22 | Axman6 | and i get to use pf, whooo |
| 14:04.27 | ``Erik | you should make a patch to add the new build dir so other people with msvc9 can benefit :) |
| 14:04.45 | ``Erik | once ya get the build working, that is |
| 14:05.16 | andrecastelo | ok, will do that :) |
| 14:06.40 | Axman6 | anyway, goodnight all |
| 14:06.46 | ``Erik | night, axman |
| 14:08.00 | ``Erik | andre: when .c files are added, we update the Makefile.am to reflect that, but we don't use msvc, so you're on your own to spot new .c files and add them... and since you're the only msvc9 user here, you're now the build maintainer for msvc9 :D congrats :> |
| 14:08.14 | PrezzzKennedy | night Axman6 |
| 14:09.07 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: the msvc9 converts from msvc8 format to the new one, so basically all i do is watch for modifications in the msvc8 build and update the msvc9.. |
| 14:09.47 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: one thing though - the latest .c additions to libged were all added to the msvc8 project, which i converted.. |
| 14:11.38 | ``Erik | hrm, does '__imp__' mean imported? it might be upset about librt not being build correctly? |
| 14:12.03 | ``Erik | rt_ and nmg_ all live in librt |
| 14:12.38 | andrecastelo | i guess if rt is fixed, libged will be built correctly |
| 14:13.07 | andrecastelo | but that's just a guess, the problem might be there too |
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| 14:14.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31185 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: let's see what we can break by adding g_hyp.c by hand... |
| 14:15.57 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: mmk, i'll try breaking stuff :) |
| 14:16.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31186 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: add a couple directories to the layout information |
| 14:36.06 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 15:05.45 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: got this.. http://rafb.net/p/pVfOmB11.html |
| 15:09.58 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ok, managed to fix and librt built correctly |
| 15:13.46 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: http://rafb.net/p/PK8mUw86.html .. is everything correct? |
| 15:47.21 | *** join/#brlcad PrezzKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 15:54.07 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
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| 15:59.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31187 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: Moved variable declarations to beginning of their respective code blocks. |
| 18:33.13 | poolio | brlcad: I just read through doc/brep.txt ...yikes |
| 18:37.14 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-76-106.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:42.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31188 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_anim.c: Added better checking of argc/argv to db_parse_1anim(). |
| 18:57.34 | ``Erik | heh, looks like bob beat ya to it, andre :D but yes, the code looks correct to me from a casual glance |
| 18:58.00 | ``Erik | the one thing I'd be concerned about is the shadow declaration of segp that's being removed, I'd have to look closer to see if it's an issue |
| 18:58.09 | ``Erik | basically, um, |
| 18:59.23 | ``Erik | int i = 42; { int i = 13; printf ("%d\n", i); } printf("%d\n", i); |
| 18:59.35 | ``Erik | will print "13\n42" |
| 18:59.47 | poolio | \n :) |
| 19:00.22 | ``Erik | <-- writes "smack ben upside the head" on a postit note and sticks it to his monitor |
| 19:00.26 | ``Erik | when ya getting here again? :D |
| 19:01.08 | poolio | I dunno, I'm set up and ready to go whenever brlcad feels the urge to drag me in :) I'm in no rush to waste that much gas |
| 19:06.55 | poolio | brlcad: so, would you like me to come in this weke or is this the week you're away? |
| 19:23.25 | PrezKennedy | you can see their awesome WWIII building |
| 19:28.45 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 19:34.15 | ``Erik | meditates, levitates and waits |
| 19:34.51 | poolio | PrezKennedy: WWIII? |
| 19:35.06 | ``Erik | is that nintendos next console? |
| 19:35.35 | poolio | yuk yuk. |
| 19:35.52 | PrezKennedy | no its those huts you guys work in |
| 19:36.19 | PrezKennedy | unless those have since blown away... |
| 19:36.39 | ``Erik | in the words of the wise sage wooldoor sockbat... WWEEEEEEE |
| 19:36.59 | ``Erik | hey, they're still standing, it's been a while since anyone has sneezed |
| 19:41.46 | ``Erik | what a name, "semen semenov" |
| 19:53.18 | brlcad | poolio: wow.. i'd completely forgotten about brep.txt ..... |
| 19:53.45 | brlcad | next week is the week i'm away |
| 19:54.10 | brlcad | i'll certainly be on-line though, that should be a great week of coding |
| 19:54.17 | brlcad | conferences are usually great for coding |
| 19:54.42 | ``Erik | which conf is it? |
| 19:59.08 | poolio | brlcad: so would you like me to come up this week or can I continue being a bum at home :) |
| 19:59.27 | brlcad | ``Erik: solid modeling |
| 20:00.12 | brlcad | technically ACM SPM and IEEE SMI joint conf., real small conference but directly relevant |
| 20:00.18 | brlcad | only in the US every couple years |
| 20:02.01 | poolio | Where is it? |
| 20:03.17 | brlcad | up in NY this year |
| 20:07.17 | poolio | Ah, that's no fun. They should hold it in some place exotic |
| 20:08.57 | ``Erik | wasn't it in nyc like two years ago? |
| 20:10.07 | brlcad | boston |
| 20:10.12 | *** join/#brlcad cazpa (n=cazpa@host81-159-136-48.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) | |
| 20:10.14 | brlcad | at mit |
| 20:10.28 | ``Erik | oh, I thought siggraph was in boston, guess they both were *shrug* :) |
| 20:10.30 | brlcad | before that it was in japan, then before that in england |
| 20:10.41 | brlcad | *those* I shoulda submitted a paper! |
| 20:10.44 | cazpa | Hello |
| 20:10.50 | brlcad | howdy cazpa |
| 20:10.53 | cazpa | not to bad |
| 20:11.28 | cazpa | just saw what brl-cad |
| 20:11.32 | cazpa | about to give it a try |
| 20:11.34 | cazpa | :D |
| 20:11.46 | brlcad | poolio: they do .. but getting oconus travel approved is hell |
| 20:12.09 | brlcad | have to have a damn good reason like presenting a good paper |
| 20:12.21 | brlcad | cazpa: excellent, have fun |
| 20:12.30 | brlcad | there are tutorials on the website, consider them required reading |
| 20:12.32 | cazpa | will do |
| 20:12.37 | cazpa | i will do |
| 20:12.42 | cazpa | im new to solid moderling |
| 20:12.46 | brlcad | big learning curve, but big payoff as you learn |
| 20:13.12 | brlcad | last year solid modeling was in beijing |
| 20:13.13 | cazpa | but i am a mechanical engineer |
| 20:14.26 | cazpa | so hello all |
| 20:17.37 | cazpa | is brl hard to use? |
| 20:22.35 | brlcad | it's hard to learn |
| 20:22.47 | brlcad | but otherwise, no, it's not really hard to use for many purposes |
| 20:23.04 | brlcad | (some things are *really* easy, some are hard, it's a big package) |
| 20:23.49 | cazpa | starts to read the documents |
| 20:24.13 | cazpa | im only looking to use it for simple solid moderling |
| 20:27.54 | *** join/#brlcad cadguy (n=butler@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:29.55 | cadguy | http://www.brlcad.org doesn't go anyplace useful anymore |
| 20:30.10 | cadguy | ~cadsrc |
| 20:34.17 | PrezKennedy | do it without the www |
| 20:38.07 | cadguy | yes. I just thought it ought to work *with* the www as well. |
| 20:38.18 | brlcad | ah, responder wasn't set up after migration -- should be better now |
| 20:39.52 | ``Erik | prefix? we don' need no stinkin' prefix |
| 20:43.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31189 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (Makefile.am dirent.c uce-dirent.h): Use uce-dirent to provide cross platform dirent functionality. |
| 20:44.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31190 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: Add dirent.c functions to bu.h |
| 20:45.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31191 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (nirt.c nirt.h): Add preliminary code in support of -L option for listing available report formats. |
| 20:45.23 | ``Erik | nooooooo |
| 20:45.31 | ``Erik | watches everything rebuild because bu.h got mucked with |
| 20:50.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31192 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 6 dirs): Added arced to libged. |
| 20:56.36 | andrecastelo | hey good evening everyone |
| 20:57.44 | ``Erik | wb, andre |
| 20:57.48 | ``Erik | and congrats! |
| 20:58.01 | andrecastelo | hehehe thanks |
| 20:58.03 | andrecastelo | but congrats on what ? |
| 20:58.09 | ``Erik | got a few minutes? I want to work with you for the first couple commits you do :D |
| 20:58.27 | andrecastelo | yup, i'm pretty free |
| 20:58.51 | ``Erik | ok, lets add you to the AUTHORS file first, at the end of the 'code contribution' section |
| 20:59.26 | ``Erik | go ahead and add yourself and commit it |
| 20:59.44 | andrecastelo | great, will do :) |
| 21:03.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31193 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: Added André Castelo to the Code Contributions list. |
| 21:03.37 | andrecastelo | great success! :D |
| 21:03.40 | pacman87 | congrats |
| 21:04.02 | ``Erik | ok, looks good, now lets try something a little trickier :D do you have access to a non-windows machine? |
| 21:04.30 | andrecastelo | i have a debian distribution installed |
| 21:04.39 | ``Erik | dual boot, or seperate machine? |
| 21:04.41 | andrecastelo | pacman87: thanks :) |
| 21:04.45 | andrecastelo | dual boot |
| 21:05.01 | ``Erik | ok, uhm, I guess we can do this as a two step process |
| 21:05.29 | andrecastelo | hm, ok, what do you have in mind ? |
| 21:05.55 | ``Erik | commit your misc/win32-msvc9 stuff :D you'll need to edit misc/Makefile.am and configure.ac to add the dirs (and test to make sure you didn't mess up the auto* stuff) |
| 21:06.43 | ``Erik | why, yes, going from the most simple operation you'll do to the most complex just like that, I AM quite evil :D |
| 21:07.26 | andrecastelo | okay |
| 21:09.28 | brlcad | woohoo, congratulations andrecastelo |
| 21:11.03 | ``Erik | btw... after this, if you ever create a directory without brlcad's explicit permission, we'll take turns breaking your fingers :D |
| 21:11.46 | ``Erik | <-- only brave enough to create dir's in src/adrt/ |
| 21:12.01 | andrecastelo | thanks, brlcad :D |
| 21:12.53 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ok, understood :) |
| 21:13.43 | andrecastelo | do the debian's autoconf and automake tools represent any problem for me to test the modifications ? |
| 21:14.03 | ``Erik | uhmmmm, debians libtool does |
| 21:14.18 | brlcad | notes pacman87 should add himself too |
| 21:14.25 | brlcad | i fixed it |
| 21:14.36 | brlcad | debian compile should work just fine now |
| 21:14.49 | ``Erik | explicitely adding libtcl.la to the necessary links? |
| 21:15.02 | cadguy | q |
| 21:15.17 | brlcad | nope, hack added to m4/patch.m4 |
| 21:15.37 | ``Erik | oh, cool, so the am's are still clean |
| 21:15.46 | brlcad | fixes the libtool script, turns off the link_all_deplibs stupidity |
| 21:16.02 | ``Erik | what should we do about the -w in toplevel Makefile.am? |
| 21:16.07 | brlcad | rather turns it on, instead of off |
| 21:17.04 | andrecastelo | ok, switching to debian |
| 21:17.09 | andrecastelo | brb |
| 21:23.25 | brlcad | yay, patches from dawn |
| 21:33.02 | ``Erik | :o someone commited as root in '86 |
| 21:34.54 | PrezKennedy | :o someone noticed |
| 21:35.47 | ``Erik | svn log . | grep '^r[0-9]' | awk '{print $3}' | sort | uniq -c | sort -nr |
| 21:35.48 | ``Erik | pheer. |
| 21:38.02 | PrezKennedy | shutdown now |
| 21:38.07 | PrezKennedy | real power in that command |
| 21:38.08 | PrezKennedy | mwahaha |
| 21:38.15 | ``Erik | deltree \y c:\*.* |
| 21:38.19 | ``Erik | erm, /y |
| 21:40.29 | PrezKennedy | print "Farewell files" | rm -rf /* |
| 21:40.34 | PrezKennedy | :) |
| 21:40.40 | PrezKennedy | as root of course |
| 21:40.53 | ``Erik | hehehe, I was about to su nobody :D |
| 21:41.43 | PrezKennedy | I did use Linux there for awhile, so I'm not totally hopeless. |
| 21:42.27 | ``Erik | but... you used linux... so you are hopeless ;) *duck* |
| 21:45.00 | PrezKennedy | has an apple for snacktime and runs |
| 21:45.51 | ``Erik | noms an mbp |
| 21:46.55 | PrezKennedy | seems like a valid warning to put on their boxes... |
| 21:47.04 | PrezKennedy | "Warning: Do not eat" |
| 21:47.25 | ``Erik | warning: causes excessive awesomeness on skin contact, do not consume |
| 21:47.41 | ``Erik | </fanboy> :D |
| 21:53.17 | ``Erik | wanders home |
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| 21:56.41 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.78.49) | |
| 21:58.20 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik.. turns out it's going to take a little more time - i didn't configure the distro to mount the ntfs drives |
| 22:05.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31194 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt default.nrt gap1.nrt gap2.nrt): Tweak sfiles for nirt |
| 22:08.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31195 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Add very crude listing ability - shouldn't be using fixed numerical lengths... |
| 22:11.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31196 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Whoops - use bu_vls_free for vls structs |
| 22:42.35 | ``Erik | 'sok, andre, brlcad wants to roll a tarball tonight, so it might be better to hold off until tomorrow or day after |
| 00:39.46 | brlcad | andrecastelo: do you have access to cygwin and/or a unix/linux box? |
| 00:40.31 | brlcad | one thing that is always useful to check from time to time, especially when adding new dirs is to do a full distribution check |
| 00:40.47 | brlcad | I usually do something akin to the following when it comes time to release |
| 00:41.30 | andrecastelo | not cygwin, but msys.. and i tried compiling/configuring with that and it didn't work |
| 00:41.32 | brlcad | sh autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all && make clean && make -j10 && make -j10 distcheck && make benchmark && make test |
| 00:42.02 | brlcad | yeah, msys would need a little more work |
| 00:42.26 | brlcad | I started that a couple years ago, but got bogged down with other tasks (and the payoff benefit at the time was very minimal) |
| 00:42.46 | brlcad | mostly just changing a lot of subtle assumptions |
| 00:43.13 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 00:44.14 | brlcad | okay, then no matter .. access to a linux/unix box would be ideal |
| 00:44.35 | andrecastelo | i did burn a source copy for immediate and temporary solution |
| 00:44.39 | brlcad | maybe can get you an account set up on a server here in a few days |
| 00:44.57 | andrecastelo | for putty? |
| 00:45.08 | brlcad | whatever ssh client you prefer ;) |
| 00:45.16 | brlcad | i have a better one I can give you |
| 00:45.30 | brlcad | putty works though too |
| 00:46.05 | andrecastelo | so i would compile here, if everything works, commit, svn update through the ssh and then compile through it too? |
| 00:46.21 | brlcad | yeah, something like that |
| 00:46.25 | brlcad | not for every change of course |
| 00:46.36 | brlcad | just for anything major that might break build |
| 00:46.49 | brlcad | otherwise, you can always wait for someone to bitch at you for breaking something ;) |
| 00:47.49 | andrecastelo | i was having some problems compiling earlier, and i thought i did break something |
| 00:48.36 | andrecastelo | no one was having the problem.. but turns out it was something specific to msvc :b |
| 00:49.39 | ``Erik | heh, yeah, bob had a local hack to work around it, the vcproj just didn't include it... he fixed it so it compiles, probably came out almost identical to what you posted on the patch tracker |
| 00:50.08 | ``Erik | if you want to add your mlt.c file, knock yourself out, just make sure to update the Makefile.am as well |
| 00:50.36 | ``Erik | as for the presented area patch, iirc you need to change it to use bu lists and to use the vmath routines for vector ops |
| 00:51.00 | andrecastelo | hm ok, regarding the mlt.c i'll add it together with the makefile modifications |
| 00:51.11 | andrecastelo | (the modifications to include it, that is) |
| 00:51.25 | ``Erik | name wise, you might want to call it viewmlt.c just to be consistent |
| 00:52.12 | andrecastelo | hm ok.. |
| 00:52.16 | andrecastelo | what about the mlt_defs.h ? |
| 00:53.00 | ``Erik | for the Makefile.am, mimic viewedge or viewweight for the automake and if you're slightly off, I'll fix it (I'm not gonna give you too much grief about automake, your native environment is msvc) |
| 00:53.04 | ``Erik | that can stay how it is I think |
| 00:53.56 | ``Erik | unless brlcad disagrees *shrug* he's final authority as far as I'm concerned |
| 00:53.58 | ``Erik | :) |
| 03:06.02 | starseeker_ | Does C have some function I can use to determine the length of a line in a file before I fget it? |
| 03:08.36 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-037-128.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 03:08.46 | starseeker_ | or alternatively, can I bu_vls_read a file into a vls struct and then break up the big vls into smaller vls structures according to newlines? |
| 03:17.09 | Maloeran | starseeker, the ANSI compliant way is to fopen(), fseek(), fgetpos(), fclose() to get the file size |
| 03:17.43 | Maloeran | The POSIX way would be to stat() it |
| 03:18.14 | Maloeran | Oh, length of a line. Sorry about that, nevermind, there is no way as far as I know |
| 03:23.14 | brlcad | starseeker_: "why"? |
| 03:25.21 | brlcad | you can use bu_vls_gets if you want to read an unknown length line into a vls |
| 03:26.41 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@210.212.55.3) | |
| 03:32.18 | brlcad | howdy hippieindamakin8 |
| 03:32.32 | hippieindamakin8 | hey brlcad goodevening |
| 03:40.33 | brlcad | heh, http://www.netsoc.tcd.ie/~mu/cgi-bin/shortpath.cgi?from=BRL-CAD&to=Kevin+Bacon |
| 03:48.52 | hippieindamakin8 | so hows it goin |
| 03:49.29 | hippieindamakin8 | brlcad to kevin bacon :) |
| 04:02.45 | starseeker_ | brlcad: re: why - so I can get the remainder of the description line without worrying about having some maximum character length defined for the line in advance |
| 04:03.49 | starseeker_ | the way I've got the nirt option implemented at the moment is fully as hackish as the reading of scripts in the first place... |
| 04:09.36 | brlcad | there's not really a way to do that without architecting something yourself, not that you need/want to |
| 04:11.01 | brlcad | you can either read a character at a time instead of line at a time while parsing the file; use bu_vls_gets(); or stat the file, get the file size, allocate a buffer that size, bu_fgets with that as the buffer |
| 04:11.26 | brlcad | suggests just using bu_vls_gets |
| 05:05.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31197 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/make.vbs: ws |
| 06:34.28 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-7fb70d4784e7a699) | |
| 06:35.44 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
| 06:37.40 | homovulgaris | Sean, did u check the patch i sent yesterday ? :) |
| 06:43.05 | brlcad | homovulgaris: started to |
| 06:43.16 | brlcad | alas, i'm only running on fumes atm |
| 06:43.37 | brlcad | just one hour z in about 40 hours |
| 06:44.12 | brlcad | what you wrote sounded good |
| 06:44.44 | brlcad | if you're around tomorrow, can go into detail then/there and maybe commit it first thing after the source release is posted |
| 06:48.21 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 06:48.26 | homovulgaris | sounds good |
| 06:49.01 | homovulgaris | though it is pretty clumsy .. i used fprintf instead of bu_log and my own print roots function instead of bn_pr_roots |
| 06:50.56 | homovulgaris | and one issue is ofcourse is the problem with functions like bn_poly_syntheticdivision which are both used by the polynomial solver and at the same time publically available through bn.h |
| 06:51.57 | homovulgaris | so i think for the transition stage we will need to add new functions which perform the same function |
| 06:53.19 | homovulgaris | i'll go have lunch :) |
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| 12:23.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31198 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/CMakeLists.txt: Use uce-dirent to provide cross platform dirent functionality. |
| 12:25.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31199 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/CMakeLists.txt: g_hyp.c: code to support hyperboloid of one sheet |
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| 13:10.25 | cad21 | hallo |
| 13:10.49 | cad21 | help |
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| 14:20.08 | andrecastelo | good morning :) |
| 14:38.53 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, i'm having some trouble here with autogen and configure. I have the latest autoconf, automake and libtool. Here is the paste http://rafb.net/p/QSmMDd33.html |
| 15:15.19 | poolio | mornin' |
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| 15:40.46 | brlcad | mornin' poolio |
| 17:16.01 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31200 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/ (Makefile.am flawfinder.sh repository.sh): break out the repository source consistency checks into their own test instead of keeping them bundled with the flawfinder test |
| 17:31.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31201 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/if.c: nirt should report a gap whenever the gap los is greater than zero |
| 17:57.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31202 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/ (command.c conversion.c if.c nirt.c parse_fmt.c showshot.c): ws |
| 18:04.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31203 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: Don't add pix output flag when nirt is the rtcmd - saveview should now provide a working nirt call |
| 18:04.47 | starseeker | glances at irc... |
| 18:05.03 | starseeker | oops - should I quick mucking with things for a bit brlcad? |
| 18:14.18 | ``Erik | ho hum *look* |
| 18:14.56 | ``Erik | try "bash autogen.sh" |
| 18:17.14 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31204 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: added declarations for bu_vlb routines |
| 18:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31205 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtserver.h: added fields required for use of bu_vlb |
| 18:19.11 | prasad_ | whoa jra |
| 18:20.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31206 10/brlcad/trunk/include/RtServerImpl.h: added declarations of getRegionNames() and shootList() methods |
| 18:21.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31207 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: now uses byte array to return results rather than building Java objects in C code |
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| 18:58.19 | brlcad | ``Erik: he's gone, but it's EOL problems |
| 18:59.21 | brlcad | sh not liking the windows line endings |
| 19:04.24 | ``Erik | I thought he was doing it on a debian |
| 19:05.18 | ``Erik | especially with /mnt/win/ there O.o |
| 19:06.53 | brlcad | and? that looks like a potentially mounted windows filesystem to me |
| 19:07.17 | ``Erik | yeah, windows fs being mounted from a non-windows OS |
| 19:07.27 | ``Erik | cygwin uses /cygdrive/c/, d'no myss |
| 19:07.28 | ``Erik | msys |
| 19:07.40 | ``Erik | updates firmware O.o |
| 19:18.12 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31208 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: remove unused checks for sys/unistd.h, lseek(), and regcomp() |
| 19:19.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31209 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: once again, incrtcl gets incrshafted. we're good to go |
| 19:49.35 | ``Erik | hrmmmmm |
| 19:49.41 | ``Erik | asc2g and g2asc seem very married to v4 |
| 19:59.50 | brlcad | woot, X11 forwarding to .bz fixed |
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| 22:14.09 | andrecastelo | hi everyone :D |
| 22:17.52 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 22:19.39 | andrecastelo | hi pacman87 :D |
| 23:27.57 | ``Erik | begins the long arduous path of unbreaking this poor machine |
| 23:47.17 | pacman87 | ``Erik: was that due to the firmware update? |
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| 01:00.06 | ``Erik | no, due to idiotic "enterprise management" |
| 01:53.15 | louipc | duude |
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| 03:52.11 | pacman87 | how 'usable' does code need to be for check-in? |
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| 03:53.17 | pacman87 | my hyp crashes in a few places due to poorly stubbed functions (i hope it's just the stubs), but should affect anything else that doesnt' make a hyp |
| 03:53.29 | pacman87 | s/should/shouldn't |
| 03:53.43 | louipc | usable enough so it doesn't break anything else I'm sure :D |
| 03:53.58 | pacman87 | so if it's the only thing that's broken, it's fine? |
| 03:54.23 | pacman87 | trying to balance 'commit early, commit often' with 'dont' break anything' |
| 03:55.15 | louipc | you could just keep a bunch of patches too :D |
| 03:56.49 | poolio | pacman87: branch? :P |
| 03:57.04 | pacman87 | it doesnt break anything else |
| 03:57.12 | pacman87 | it just doesnt always work |
| 03:58.17 | pacman87 | and at this point, i dont think a branch would be more useful than just holding off committing |
| 03:58.57 | pacman87 | unless someone else wants to fill in some stubs, and in that case, g_hyp.c is already there |
| 04:08.36 | andrecastelo | pacman87: g_hyp.c was giving me trouble compiling :B |
| 04:08.57 | pacman87 | what error? |
| 04:12.32 | *** part/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1128565406.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 04:13.43 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp.png and https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp1.png |
| 04:17.44 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: what sort of trouble? |
| 04:18.34 | andrecastelo | pacman87: sorry for the delay.. wasn't compiling because of the declarations not in the beginning of the function |
| 04:20.45 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp2.png |
| 04:21.47 | louipc | nice |
| 04:22.09 | pacman87 | that's all hardcoded, unfortunately |
| 04:22.21 | pacman87 | five slices, eight points |
| 04:22.34 | pacman87 | just to figure out how to do it |
| 04:22.44 | pacman87 | now i need to go back and work out the tolerances |
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| 04:31.23 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! The fun begins this week! (May 26th) | |
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| 05:31.06 | pacman87 | goodnight all |
| 05:56.23 | brlcad | cya pacman87 |
| 05:59.38 | brlcad | cool, start of a wireframe :) |
| 06:01.17 | brlcad | pacman87: nobody will be using or relying on hyp until you're "done", so as long as it compiles you should be just fine committing as frequently as possible |
| 06:02.57 | brlcad | and if they're petty compilation issues, you'll just learn to spot them as others point them out and/or fix them for you (you should be on the commits mailing list, it helps) |
| 06:08.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31210 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/Makefile.am: need to remove COUNT during distclean so distcheck will work |
| 06:15.46 | brlcad | starseeker: found a nice site with lots of relevant tidbits: http://resourceguide.eai.org/preservation/singlechannel.html |
| 06:16.31 | brlcad | good reading, lots of things I was saying and then some |
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| 07:00.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31211 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: add detailed release notes about the mirror and nirt changes as well as special mention of the cool new tire proc-db. begin 7.12.4 relese steps. |
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| 07:14.23 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31212 10/brlcad/trunk/ChangeLog: svn2cl --break-before-msg --include-rev --revision {2008-04-23}:HEAD --stdout > ChangeLog ... preparing the 7.12.4 release. |
| 07:16.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31213 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: make bumping the actual version file happen after changelog step |
| 07:16.28 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31214 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/PATCH: bump to 7.12.4 |
| 07:47.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31215 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: make -w is not portable to at least bsd make and I don't see a good way to make it conditional |
| 08:24.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31216 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: helps to use frs instructions that actually work |
| 08:29.43 | brlcad | pacman87: that's pretty much case in point by what is meant about frequent commits .. it tells a story, you can see when I'm working, what I'm doing, the good and the bad, but each step being a succint action that is functional |
| 08:30.25 | brlcad | (granted the release process has a lot of small steps, but it holds for most development code too) |
| 08:32.33 | louipc | I'm finding good committing requires some foresight |
| 08:32.52 | clock_ | brlcad: does BRL-CAD have some assembler-optimized parts? Lilke hand-coded assembler for x86? |
| 08:33.05 | louipc | I still need to develop some of that arrrgh |
| 08:33.48 | brlcad | louipc: indeed .. it changes the way you code so that you work in small incremental functional steps |
| 08:33.57 | brlcad | very effective and self-documenting to an extent |
| 08:37.33 | brlcad | clock_: there was at one point, but we tend to avoid getting architecture-specific as that's generally really high-maintenance code with minimal payoff |
| 08:39.37 | brlcad | the 30%-300% gain on some hand-coded assembler that only a couple devs can modify is washed out as soon as there's a new favorite, the algorithm needs to change, the devs change, and that performance is often what you'll have with next year's hardware anyways |
| 08:40.40 | louipc | I'm sure it was worth it in 1980 :D |
| 08:40.42 | brlcad | that said, if someone wanted to work on it, it wouldn't really be prevented/discouraged .. just would have to be entirely conditional with a "clean C" variant for everyone else |
| 08:41.20 | brlcad | nah, even back then the percentage gains were about the same |
| 08:41.34 | brlcad | you were just as likely to have a compiler that optimized better |
| 08:41.46 | brlcad | it really is high-maintenance code |
| 08:42.58 | brlcad | pays off nicely on small routines that perform some small task, but soon as you move up into application logic it really becomes a burden |
| 08:43.20 | brlcad | we could have our math libs in assembler, or the boolean evaluator in assembler, that'd probably pay off nicely |
| 08:43.38 | brlcad | but the areas of values are somewhat niche |
| 08:44.16 | brlcad | wonders if someone(tm) else can update freshmeat with this source release info |
| 08:47.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31217 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-4/: tag release 7.12.4 |
| 08:50.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31218 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/cvs.txt: include a disclaimer that these guidelines are obsolete and need updating |
| 08:52.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31219 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS README include/conf/PATCH): release is tagged, bump to 7.12.5 in anticipation of 7.12.6 next month |
| 08:55.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31220 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: give a better example of tagging a release (remote method that should always work), don't mention nonexistent cvspolicy.txt file |
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| 09:10.55 | brlcad | moin d_rossberg |
| 09:12.53 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 09:22.04 | d_rossberg | moin moin brlcad |
| 09:22.38 | d_rossberg | is out for lunch |
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| 10:59.20 | brlcad | mm.. breakfast woulda been good |
| 10:59.58 | brlcad | yawns content that the release is posted |
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| 12:17.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31221 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 5 dirs): Moved otranslate, oscale, orotate and ocenter to separate files in libged and modified by removing Tcl and changing their signatures. |
| 12:20.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31222 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Moved otranslate, oscale, orotate and ocenter to separate files in libged and modified by removing Tcl and changing their signatures. |
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| 12:44.23 | ``Erik | *yargn* |
| 12:44.56 | ``Erik | BRL-CAD had a couple hand coded assembly files, I think the last couple were removed already... a fast square root solver for a gould and something similar for a vax iirc |
| 12:47.46 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31223 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/arced.c: strchr needs string.h |
| 12:58.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31224 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (5 files): Added trace.c and get_obj_bounds.c |
| 13:57.49 | poolio | mornin' |
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| 14:33.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31225 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/get_obj_bounds.c: need string.h for various functions. Fix function signature to match header |
| 14:33.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31226 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/rtserver.h src/librtserver/rtserver.c): Mods to try to handle differences for 32-bit vs 64-bit architectures |
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| 14:53.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31227 10/brlcad/trunk/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Moved struct wdb_trace_data definition to ged_private.h. Moved ged_trace(), ged_get_obj_bounds() and ged_get_obj_bounds2() function declarations to ged_private.h. |
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| 15:31.44 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.30.250) | |
| 15:31.59 | andrecastelo | hey morning |
| 15:42.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31228 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libged/ged_private.h): Moved a few defines from ged.h to ged_private.h |
| 15:43.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31229 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Move filearray variable declaration to beginning of code block. |
| 15:45.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31230 10/brlcad/trunk/ (misc/win32-msvc8/libbu/libbu.vcproj src/libbu/dirent.c): Mods to expose bu_count_path and bu_list_path on windows. |
| 15:47.05 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik , check this out : http://rafb.net/p/vpaecY70.html |
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| 16:56.27 | ``Erik | and he's gone again, heh |
| 17:10.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31231 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/ (tie.c tie.h tie_kdtree.c tie_kdtree.h tie_struct.h): minor type (signed vs unsigned) fixes |
| 17:25.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31232 10/brlcad/trunk/ (AUTHORS src/librt/g_hyp.c src/mged/typein.c): Add mged hyp creation and plot() for basic wireframe view |
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| 21:33.01 | andrecastelo | ok, good evening everyone |
| 21:34.43 | andrecastelo | hi brlcad, ``Erik |
| 21:40.29 | poolio | aloo andrecastelo |
| 21:40.37 | andrecastelo | hey poolio |
| 21:40.44 | ``Erik | oi, andre |
| 21:40.52 | ``Erik | your auto* issues, is that on linux or windows? |
| 21:41.22 | andrecastelo | on linux |
| 21:41.29 | ``Erik | are you on linux right now? |
| 21:41.35 | andrecastelo | i've mounted the windows on it |
| 21:41.37 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 21:41.43 | andrecastelo | i've also tried the bash autogen.sh |
| 21:41.47 | ``Erik | I'm wondering if running "bash autogen.sh" (and making sure it completes correctly) might help |
| 21:41.47 | andrecastelo | same problem |
| 21:41.48 | ``Erik | ok |
| 21:41.58 | ``Erik | brlcad thinks it might be a line end issue |
| 21:41.58 | andrecastelo | let me paste for you |
| 21:42.06 | ``Erik | I saw the rafb.net link |
| 21:42.34 | andrecastelo | yeah, basically the same error -> http://rafb.net/p/xmzEcc13.html |
| 21:42.39 | ``Erik | perhaps if you checked a version out from subversion onto your linux partition (using linux) and tried there? *shrug* |
| 21:42.47 | andrecastelo | hm ok, will do |
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| 21:43.25 | ``Erik | it seems weird to me that it'd fail like that, and the error messages seem... strangely mutilated O.o |
| 21:52.34 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ok, checkout on its way |
| 21:53.23 | ``Erik | okie, I'm gonna go drive home now :D be back in a bit |
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| 23:31.36 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, i'm ready to commit the msvc9 changes |
| 23:32.02 | andrecastelo | is there anything i should wait or do first? |
| 23:40.50 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 23:41.04 | brlcad | nope, just do it :) |
| 23:41.10 | andrecastelo | hm, ok |
| 23:41.11 | brlcad | presumably run make distcheck? |
| 23:41.30 | brlcad | that'll make sure you add the dir correctly (if *nix) |
| 23:42.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31233 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: Fix hyp's plot() to draw elliptical cross sections and hyperboloids not centered at the origin |
| 23:42.23 | andrecastelo | i'm on windows right now.. but regarding the configure and autogen problems, you were right. When i added the changes manually using linux, they ran ok |
| 23:42.39 | brlcad | figured, seen it before |
| 23:43.07 | brlcad | usually it's windows folks that download a unix zip though |
| 23:59.51 | PrezzKennedy | frantically clicks download on all the files without reading |
| 00:00.10 | andrecastelo | hm, ok, msys doesn't have any autotools, so i'll switch to linux and do it there |
| 00:07.28 | brlcad | don't worry about it, just commit it :) |
| 00:07.36 | brlcad | I can test it far easier/quickly |
| 00:07.49 | PrezzKennedy | howdy brlcad |
| 00:07.57 | brlcad | and if you're on the commit list, you'll see any related fix so you'll know what to do next time |
| 00:08.00 | brlcad | howdy PrezzKennedy |
| 00:08.04 | brlcad | double zee day, eh? |
| 00:08.22 | PrezKennedy | not purposefully ;) |
| 00:08.23 | brlcad | double en day, eh? |
| 00:08.48 | PrezKennedy | every day is a double en day! |
| 00:09.18 | brlcad | participates in double arr day |
| 00:09.22 | brlcad | arrr |
| 00:09.30 | brlcad | arrrr |
| 00:09.47 | PrezKennedy | arrr! |
| 00:12.06 | andrecastelo | hm ok, hopefully i won't break anything :) |
| 00:20.59 | brlcad | nothing that can't be easily undone |
| 00:23.45 | andrecastelo | i've got a property problem |
| 00:23.58 | andrecastelo | hm let me show you |
| 00:24.00 | andrecastelo | 1 sec |
| 00:29.46 | andrecastelo | ok, here - > http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/2897/commitproblemvz8.jpg |
| 00:35.44 | brlcad | see dev page on wiki .. faq :) |
| 00:36.14 | andrecastelo | ok, will do |
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| 00:56.53 | IriX64 | http://www.irix32.spaces.live.com/photos |
| 00:57.03 | IriX64 | pick the brlcad albumn :) |
| 01:55.26 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, i managed to get the automatic properties working and nearly all files now have mime prop |
| 01:55.52 | andrecastelo | except for brlcad.sln |
| 01:56.34 | andrecastelo | i checked the msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln and it doesn't have a mime property |
| 02:09.16 | starseeker_ | growls at the oed pdf... |
| 02:15.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31234 10/brlcad/trunk/ (292 files in 147 dirs): Modifications and additions made to incorporate misc/win32-msvc9. |
| 02:21.26 | pacman87 | 292 files? |
| 02:26.24 | louipc | bah microsoft |
| 02:27.27 | andrecastelo | actually, i think svn counted the dirs as well, as there is one file per dir o.O |
| 02:36.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31235 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libbu/libbu.vcproj: Updated msvc9's libbu.vcproj to reflect modifications made to the msvc8 version. |
| 03:03.30 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:07.43 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 03:25.07 | brlcad | andrecastelo: mm, probably one I need to add to my list .. the new "vc9 solution" files |
| 03:25.26 | brlcad | it should probably be treated just like dsp and other vc files |
| 03:25.52 | brlcad | oh, sln is in my config file .. just no mime type |
| 03:26.07 | brlcad | bah, it's just text/plain |
| 03:30.47 | brlcad | andrecastelo: with that change, that's actually "user visible" |
| 03:30.56 | brlcad | so you should update NEWS too |
| 04:03.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31236 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/arced.c: sys headers before public, common before sys |
| 04:11.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31237 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (8 files): more header cleanup, use relative paths for private headers |
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| 05:15.57 | andrecastelo__ | i guess my connection isn't exactly stable right now S: |
| 05:23.06 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31238 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Added a line, in the latest release, about compilation support for the MSVC 9. |
| 05:24.18 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, you need to convince my dad he needs to upgrade the modem and the router he has so the Internet stays up better |
| 05:25.21 | PrezKennedy | it was down for a week and my mom had no e-mail... so the first night im home im troubleshooting computer stuff :P |
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| 08:01.11 | d_rossberg | a question for the C++/gcc gurus: what's wrong with line 12 in http://ftp.brlcad.org/~rossberg/test.cpp ? |
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| 08:55.46 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
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| 10:31.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31239 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: Switch from using arbitrary fixed buffer size in nirt's listformats to using bu_vls and bu_vls_gets |
| 10:41.58 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Hmm. Is it possible to assign contents to a vls like this: bu_vls_addr(&line_buffer)[i] = '\0'; or is that too low level to work? |
| 12:03.51 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 13:05.52 | brlcad | starseeker_: whethere you can do that or not ... you really shouldn't :) |
| 13:06.07 | brlcad | what do you need to inject nulls for? |
| 13:11.22 | Axman6 | everyone knows nulls take up less RAM |
| 13:11.24 | Axman6 | >_> |
| 13:14.08 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:21.40 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 13:39.16 | homovulgaris | hey sean is there any issue regarding using STL for the parametrics and constraints part |
| 13:40.23 | homovulgaris | i mean since there are no bindings presently interfacing with librt would be tricky .. but other than that ? |
| 13:41.14 | homovulgaris | also :) did u have a look at my patch :) |
| 13:47.28 | ``Erik | STL isn't ubiquitous, so it'd have to be included in src/other/... what functionality is missing from libbu that'd make STL necessary? |
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| 13:59.20 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (i=homovulg@gateway/tor/x-52525a196a47fdbf) | |
| 14:04.48 | clock_ | "What is the first version of BRL-CAD you used?" |
| 14:04.52 | clock_ | How do I figure that out? |
| 14:05.01 | ``Erik | you, uh, remember? :D |
| 14:05.21 | louipc | I misremembered |
| 14:05.24 | clock_ | May 16, 2005 |
| 14:05.27 | clock_ | which version was that? |
| 14:05.33 | ``Erik | I think a 6 |
| 14:05.43 | clock_ | I already voted, but don't know what :( Or didn't I? |
| 14:05.56 | clock_ | OK I put one 6.x vote there |
| 14:06.10 | louipc | yeah I voted for 6 but I think it was actually 7 |
| 14:06.11 | clock_ | A psychoanalyst could maybe do a deep regression |
| 14:06.39 | ``Erik | now my question would be if that means the first time you personally used BRL-CAD, or the oldest version you've used... because my first exposure was 5, but I've used 4 recently (and have dorked with 0 series) |
| 14:07.15 | clock_ | If they asked me what was the first skateboard I rode I remember that exactly |
| 14:07.22 | louipc | 7.0.2 was 20050106 |
| 14:07.33 | ``Erik | hrm, 7 came out in '04 |
| 14:08.15 | ``Erik | 7.0.2 was the first open source release, jan 07, '05 |
| 14:08.30 | ``Erik | mebbe my first was 6 *shrug* |
| 14:10.04 | ``Erik | ah, my first commit was on a 6, in the pre-7 phase :) |
| 14:11.19 | louipc | neato |
| 14:12.04 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad?view=rev&revision=22204 pheer |
| 14:12.38 | ``Erik | took away brlcad's cake O:-) |
| 14:19.53 | starseeker_ | brlcad: That's found in the nirt parser - they were doing it with a fixed buffer - I'm trying to introduce a vls to get rid of the fixed length |
| 14:20.32 | starseeker_ | not really sure why they were doing it, to be honest... |
| 14:20.43 | Axman6 | is any of the original BRL-CAD code around? |
| 14:20.53 | starseeker_ | define "original" |
| 14:21.04 | Axman6 | 1.0 |
| 14:21.15 | starseeker_ | understands the cvs history stretches into antiquity... |
| 14:21.15 | Axman6 | or... earlier |
| 14:22.11 | Axman6 | what was the original machine it was written for? |
| 14:22.20 | Axman6 | i forget BRL-CAD's history |
| 14:24.21 | brlcad | aww, d_rossberg left |
| 14:24.31 | brlcad | that was a hard one .. |
| 14:24.54 | brlcad | clock_: did you ever use it before it was open source? |
| 14:25.00 | brlcad | if not, it was a 7.* |
| 14:25.58 | clock_ | brlcad: no |
| 14:26.55 | brlcad | Axman6: all of brl-cad's code is in the revision history |
| 14:27.09 | brlcad | you can get to the "1.0" and earlier revisions through svn |
| 14:27.10 | Axman6 | heh, nice. |
| 14:27.24 | brlcad | not that they'll compile without overhauling, but the code is certainly there |
| 14:27.33 | starseeker_ | brlcad: What was that libtool trick you used to run gdb on an uninstalled binary? |
| 14:27.39 | Axman6 | how long have you been working on it? |
| 14:28.06 | brlcad | libtool --mode=execute path/to/wrapper --with whatever args etc |
| 14:28.15 | starseeker_ | thanks :-) |
| 14:28.23 | brlcad | er, gdb path/to/wrapper |
| 14:29.10 | brlcad | path/to/libtool --mode=execute gdb path/to/your/app_wrapper --with whatever args |
| 14:29.39 | brlcad | ~libtoolgdb is path/to/libtool --mode=execute gdb path/to/your/app_wrapper --with whatever args |
| 14:29.40 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 14:34.46 | brlcad | anyone else figure out d_rossberg's C++ snippet and/or interested in what's "wrong" with it? |
| 14:37.08 | ``Erik | brlcad, team lead wants to talk to you, wanna meet for lunch? |
| 14:37.50 | andrecastelo | hey everyone |
| 14:37.52 | ``Erik | (it'll compile without overhaul... if you do something like get a bsd4.3 image running on a vax 11/780) |
| 14:37.58 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm curious :B |
| 14:38.24 | ``Erik | or, 43bsd rather O.o :) |
| 14:38.30 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, whats wrong with it? even im curious |
| 14:38.50 | ``Erik | (and something about a vcr remote?) |
| 14:39.11 | clock_ | brlcad: is it easy to make animated figure in brl-cad using those blobs or how its called 2 spheres with a cone? |
| 14:39.49 | clock_ | I "just" write a C program that generateas the scene for every frame don't I? |
| 14:42.48 | brlcad | ``Erik: I'm coming in at some point |
| 14:43.27 | ``Erik | yeah, he just wants to make sure he gets to talk to you sometime today, he said lunch would work, and I like to eat O.o :D |
| 14:44.09 | brlcad | hm, that would save me a trip |
| 14:44.37 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: if you try to instantiate his CWorker class, the error message becomes a lot more clear |
| 14:45.02 | ``Erik | templates? clear? what? :D |
| 14:45.23 | brlcad | instead of just a syntax error, you see that the compiler has a choice in how to interpret AListIterator |
| 14:45.44 | brlcad | one as a value, other as a type .. it defaults to value given it's a nested class (which is wrong) |
| 14:45.53 | brlcad | so you have to tell it that you meant a type |
| 14:46.06 | brlcad | then it all works just fine |
| 14:47.47 | brlcad | clock_: depends on your definition of what consitutes easy, but I'd say 'no' for the average joe but maybe not too bad for you |
| 14:48.27 | brlcad | presumably your talking about either metaballs or the particle primitive |
| 14:53.20 | starseeker_ | 's head spins a bit - Ch is declared to be an int, but it also holds the character of interest during the parsing?? |
| 14:53.59 | brlcad | sure |
| 14:54.18 | brlcad | characters are just integer valus 0->127 for non-unicode lower ascii text |
| 14:54.56 | starseeker_ | OK, so what will bu_vls_strcat do when I feed it something like that? |
| 14:55.09 | starseeker_ | it's typed as an int, not a char |
| 14:56.13 | clock_ | brlcad: hmm which one is metaballs and which particle primitive? |
| 14:58.35 | starseeker_ | stares at it some more and notices the core interact loop is also using the 256 assumption right in the for loop... arrgh |
| 14:58.43 | starseeker_ | time to step back and rethink |
| 15:01.40 | clock_ | The new website is easy with textmode links in regard with easy access to download. |
| 15:02.06 | clock_ | 3 obvious clicks. Great. |
| 15:03.53 | brlcad | has a whole load of information to load that makes just about everything accessible within 3 clicks or less |
| 15:05.17 | homovulgaris | when will we have doxygen at brlcad.org :) |
| 15:05.18 | louipc | the weak point there is the sourceforge site :P |
| 15:05.43 | clock_ | louipc: usually I get a "download should start if doesn't click [here]" |
| 15:05.51 | clock_ | and I click [here] and it's a cyclic link to the same page |
| 15:05.58 | clock_ | But not in case of the BRL-CAD sourceforge. |
| 15:05.59 | homovulgaris | sourceforge has too many ads :( or too big ones at least |
| 15:06.17 | clock_ | homovulgaris: a smart patch into /etc/hosts can make most of them nonfunctional :) |
| 15:06.38 | clock_ | Make the ad websites resolve to 0.0.0.0 or 127.0.0.1 or something like that |
| 15:06.40 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@203.200.95.130) | |
| 15:06.48 | louipc | I mean I have to scroll a full page of hyperlinks before I get to the relevant download link on the sf.net site |
| 15:07.16 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 15:07.18 | clock_ | louipc: what about making a proxy on brlcad.org that would mirror sourceforge except that it would rip out all the ads? |
| 15:07.35 | clock_ | like forward requests so that they couldn't complain about (c) violation |
| 15:07.49 | louipc | the ads don't bug me |
| 15:07.55 | clock_ | I want sourceforge in flash |
| 15:07.58 | louipc | because I don't see them :D |
| 15:08.03 | louipc | kills clock_ |
| 15:08.07 | clock_ | louipc: are you blind? |
| 15:08.18 | louipc | no I blocked them |
| 15:08.20 | starseeker_ | considers bumping 256 to 512 until he figures out the right way... |
| 15:08.35 | homovulgaris | flash :O why :) i am on debian amd64 .. i have to chroot to run flash |
| 15:08.43 | louipc | and I don't see them in my text browser |
| 15:08.50 | clock_ | I deleted flash because 9.0.124.0 has a remote execution |
| 15:09.03 | clock_ | and there is only a limited functionality beta which is not on the official download site |
| 15:09.20 | PrezKennedy | text browser??? thats crazy talk |
| 15:09.36 | clock_ | RM(1) rm - apply security patches |
| 15:09.40 | louipc | it's cool talk |
| 15:09.57 | homovulgaris | I like lynx.. but not very realistic in todays world i guess :P |
| 15:10.34 | PrezKennedy | its crazy talk! |
| 15:10.37 | clock_ | DESCRIPTION This manual page documents the GNU version of rm. rm removes each specified security hole. |
| 15:10.52 | PrezKennedy | like listening to a high quality orchestra on a pc speaker |
| 15:12.15 | louipc | more like earmuffs in a construction site to me |
| 15:13.09 | clock_ | louipc: :) |
| 15:13.21 | louipc | css, javascript, images = noise |
| 15:13.31 | clock_ | Well - we wrote a browser that supports both text and graphics mode. So everyone can select what he likes, just with a -g switch. |
| 15:13.37 | brlcad | homovulgaris: hopefully soon -- the old doxygen docs are still up though -- http://brlcad.sourceforge.net/doxygen/ |
| 15:14.19 | clock_ | ./configure --prefix=/usr a bad idea? |
| 15:14.40 | brlcad | yep |
| 15:14.41 | louipc | possibly |
| 15:14.42 | brlcad | usually |
| 15:14.43 | clock_ | I hate how stripes run around my screen when I type ./configure |
| 15:14.56 | clock_ | and LCDs are supposed to have better picture than CRTs |
| 15:15.06 | clock_ | I would tune the LCD TV if it had a tuning knob. |
| 15:15.42 | clock_ | On the other hand, it tells me when I should switch terminals and type "make"! |
| 15:16.01 | homovulgaris | brlcad: ok :) doxygen is pretty helpful in explaining code |
| 15:16.17 | clock_ | We tried to use it but it somehow misbehaved |
| 15:16.25 | clock_ | some functions were completely missing the clickable links |
| 15:16.56 | clock_ | The call graphs are nice to tell you that everything calls everything else anyway ;-) |
| 15:17.08 | louipc | heheh |
| 15:17.50 | brlcad | it would be more useful for brl-cad if it was comprehensive and properly grouped |
| 15:18.04 | brlcad | right now i think there's about 70% coverage or so (total guesstimate) |
| 15:18.26 | brlcad | with basic grouping |
| 15:18.28 | clock_ | total guesstimate, that sounds so scientific! |
| 15:19.04 | brlcad | it could really use some attention and love to beef it up, particulaly good task for someone looking to learn/explore the code base |
| 15:19.26 | clock_ | brlcad: to explore Doxygen bugs? :) |
| 15:20.58 | homovulgaris | :) i'll try |
| 15:21.24 | homovulgaris | presently the librt pages crashes everytime when i open it in my epiphany-browser |
| 15:21.29 | homovulgaris | i mean too big i guess |
| 15:21.45 | homovulgaris | too many big call graphs probably |
| 15:22.13 | homovulgaris | sorry.. librt main page .. not pages :) |
| 15:22.38 | clock_ | homovulgaris: epiphany crashes? |
| 15:23.45 | homovulgaris | not epiphany in particular the whole computer sort of hangs.. i have to kill epiphany |
| 15:25.03 | clock_ | Eats up all the resources? |
| 15:25.51 | homovulgaris | grouping would involve basically editing misc/doxygen_structure and addtogroup in the various files in source code right |
| 15:32.10 | homovulgaris | libbn and libbu pages seem pretty ok.. rt is pretty vast :) |
| 15:32.46 | homovulgaris | call graphs are ofcourse pretty complicated in the case of all functions |
| 15:33.20 | homovulgaris | brlcad: when can i have commit access :) ( please :) ) |
| 15:33.47 | clock_ | "Elapsed compilation time: 22 hours, 29 minutes, 46 seconds" |
| 15:34.14 | clock_ | I started to compile at 18.14 |
| 15:34.17 | clock_ | ended at 18.33 |
| 15:34.26 | clock_ | and 22 hours 29 minutes elapsed in between |
| 15:34.31 | homovulgaris | i was thinking of adding a new directory called libpc in src directory which would contain all the code for parametrics and constraints .. ok libpg is now libpc :) |
| 15:34.34 | clock_ | Does BRL-CAD come with an integrated time machine? |
| 15:34.53 | homovulgaris | o o |
| 15:35.40 | homovulgaris | do i have to put all my header files in include directory |
| 15:36.01 | brlcad | homovulgaris: yeah, that's a pretty huge page .. |
| 15:36.29 | brlcad | because it's a pretty huge library .. :) |
| 15:36.54 | brlcad | but yeah, basically doxygen_structure and addtogroups |
| 15:37.04 | clock_ | brlcad: any explanation for the time travel? |
| 15:37.17 | clock_ | brlcad: my PC didn't travel at relativistic speeds during the compilation |
| 15:37.31 | homovulgaris | and yeah about STL .. :) i can use it right ? |
| 15:37.35 | brlcad | clock_: it'll do funky things crossing midnight |
| 15:37.37 | pacman87 | clock_: i think it starts the time from either autogen or configure, not necessarily the start of make |
| 15:38.00 | brlcad | homovulgaris: that depends on a lot of things .. and where it's exposed |
| 15:38.04 | homovulgaris | i think it is configure |
| 15:38.20 | brlcad | exposing stl on public interface functions can be hugely problematic on some systems (like windows) |
| 15:38.21 | clock_ | brlcad: no crossing midnight here |
| 15:38.32 | clock_ | pacman87: starting from autogen would explain |
| 15:38.39 | clock_ | starting from configure wouldn't |
| 15:38.49 | pacman87 | Elapsed installation time: 29 minutes, 38 seconds |
| 15:38.49 | pacman87 | Elapsed time since configuration: 31 minutes, 27 seconds |
| 15:38.57 | brlcad | clock_: then feel free to debug it.. ;) sh/elapsed.sh does the deed |
| 15:39.56 | brlcad | configure writes out a timestamp for the elapsed configuration time, compilation stamp is in include/conf |
| 15:40.15 | clock_ | I think the elpased config time was OK |
| 15:40.15 | brlcad | logic is in the top-level Makefile.am |
| 15:42.04 | homovulgaris | hmm.. well stl wont be exposed as such . I mean using it for internal representation |
| 15:42.48 | brlcad | you can do whatever you want for internal representation in libpg, but not in the C libs |
| 15:42.59 | brlcad | s/whatever/something within reason/ :) |
| 15:43.09 | brlcad | has to run out for a bit |
| 15:43.27 | homovulgaris | :) k |
| 15:43.43 | clock_ | the png-pix is a useful tool, beyond the scope of BRL-CAD |
| 15:44.12 | clock_ | clock@duke:~$ /usr/brlcad/bin/png-pix |
| 15:44.12 | clock_ | Usage: /usr/brlcad/bin/png-pix [-v] [png_input_file] > pix_output_file |
| 15:44.12 | clock_ | Are you intending to type in a PNG format file?? |
| 15:44.12 | clock_ | Saving stack trace to unknown-4077-bomb.log |
| 15:44.15 | clock_ | WARNING: Unable to obtain a call stack backtrace |
| 15:44.38 | clock_ | If it understands the user wants a synopsis, why does it ask for a PNG being typed in, and then bombs on top of it? |
| 15:44.41 | Maloeran | agrees, though he wishes images would not be flipped upside-down |
| 15:45.23 | clock_ | Maloeran: you can flip the png with imagemagick ;-) |
| 15:45.44 | Maloeran | :) Sure |
| 15:45.53 | clock_ | although imagemagick is slow |
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| 16:04.26 | starseeker_ | is curious to check out the new Blender movie... |
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| 16:29.29 | starseeker | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:29.32 | starseeker | whoops |
| 16:36.09 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31240 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Fixed a cast in the parameter list of a call to ged_get_obj_bounds(). If'ed out an unused variable in wdb_hide_cmd(). |
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| 17:24.24 | ``Erik | *burp* |
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| 18:45.16 | cad32 | how do i register my nick name |
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| 19:51.36 | pacman87 | aww, no sqrt(3)/2 in vmath.h :( |
| 20:39.29 | brlcad | pacman87: actually that's somewhat curious |
| 20:40.04 | brlcad | some systems do have an M_SQRT3, but I can't find a definitive answer on whether that was recently added, is posix, etc |
| 20:40.29 | brlcad | go ahead and add an M_SQRT3 |
| 20:40.47 | pacman87 | i realized i dont actually need it |
| 20:40.53 | brlcad | you'll probably need to conditionalize all of them though instead of basing them all being set dependent upon M_PI |
| 20:41.42 | pacman87 | sqrt(3) is for cos(30) |
| 20:41.51 | brlcad | clock_: what version of brl-cad was that? I don't get that usage |
| 20:42.04 | pacman87 | and i actually wanted cos(22.5) |
| 20:43.34 | brlcad | Maloeran: they're not upside-down .. it's just using "first quadrant" image coordinates |
| 20:45.27 | brlcad | sure, feed that to a tool that expects fourth-quadrant coordinates and it'll be flipped, but then the user is at fault to assume it's a fourth quadrant data .. |
| 20:49.23 | homovulgaris | starseeker: the bunny sure looks funny :) |
| 20:50.41 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I've reviewed your patches, a few comments for you this weekend |
| 20:51.05 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 20:51.30 | brlcad | as for commit, I'm waiting for john to give you a thumbs up -- as soon as he's comfortable you're not going to go hog wild nuts, he'll let me know ;) |
| 20:51.54 | brlcad | and he knows this, you don't need to ping him |
| 20:51.58 | homovulgaris | :) oh ok |
| 20:52.09 | brlcad | other than keeping him apprised of your status (e.g. daily update? :) |
| 20:52.21 | brlcad | s/daily/blog/ |
| 20:52.33 | homovulgaris | ok.. :) |
| 20:52.58 | homovulgaris | i'd do both i guess :) |
| 20:53.01 | brlcad | gets rss feeds of the updates (as do some of the other mentors) so it will get noticed :) |
| 20:53.57 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: have you considered adding a link to your blog from http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
| 20:54.06 | starseeker | breaths deeply and tries to recover from mandatory training... |
| 20:54.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31241 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Update version to 7.12.5 |
| 20:55.47 | homovulgaris | I guess i will have to start one for libpg :) is there a way to get rss feeds for a particular tag or something in wordpress blogspot etc. ? |
| 21:05.34 | brlcad | homovulgaris: any of the major blogging systems have rss feeds, your user: page on the wiki works fine too |
| 21:07.06 | brlcad | example: http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Pacman87 |
| 21:07.17 | pacman87 | :) |
| 21:08.23 | brlcad | tis a good example :) |
| 21:08.24 | pacman87 | speaking of, does anyone know how to make a sidebar on a wiki page? |
| 21:08.38 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 21:08.56 | homovulgaris | was seeing pacman's page a few minutes back :) |
| 21:08.56 | pacman87 | like a box on the top-right side of the pages |
| 21:09.00 | pacman87 | page* |
| 21:09.12 | pacman87 | that stays at the top of the page when i add new entries |
| 21:09.48 | brlcad | oh, you mean like the info boxes on wikipedia? |
| 21:09.52 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 21:09.53 | brlcad | those are templates |
| 21:10.07 | pacman87 | so will they work with the brlcad wiki? |
| 21:10.10 | brlcad | you have to create/import a template that does what you want |
| 21:10.26 | brlcad | they're generally portable if you find one that does what you want |
| 21:10.46 | brlcad | but they don't come for free, you have to create it or import one from another wiki |
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| 21:11.30 | pacman87 | something like this? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Infobox |
| 21:12.52 | brlcad | yep! |
| 21:13.09 | brlcad | you should be able to export that from wikipedia and import it |
| 21:13.20 | brlcad | (special page, export) |
| 21:14.09 | brlcad | very likely has other components that go with it usually (images, docs, etc) that it links to or uses |
| 21:19.02 | pacman87 | does this look right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Export/Template:Infobox |
| 21:20.13 | pacman87 | Permission error from BRL-CAD: The action you have requested is limited to users in the group Sysops. |
| 21:30.04 | brlcad | when do you get that? |
| 21:30.48 | pacman87 | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Import |
| 21:30.49 | brlcad | yeah, that looks right .. the export should be an xml file, you'll import that on the cad wiki |
| 21:35.27 | brlcad | what about now? |
| 21:36.46 | pacman87 | the brlcad import page is still an error |
| 21:37.26 | brlcad | and now? :) |
| 21:39.23 | pacman87 | there we go, thanks |
| 22:00.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31242 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: calculate the version dynamically. rather untested, but it should be pretty close from what the nsis scripting reference describes. one less place to update the version when it changes... |
| 22:02.50 | pacman87 | i think i did something wrong with the template import |
| 22:02.56 | pacman87 | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Template:Infobox |
| 22:03.19 | brlcad | I would agree |
| 22:03.54 | brlcad | or |
| 22:04.26 | brlcad | it could be incompatibilities between versions of mediawiki .. wikipedia don't stay closely in sync with mediawiki |
| 22:04.43 | brlcad | see if mediawiki has that template |
| 22:07.32 | brlcad | http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Info_templates |
| 22:07.48 | pacman87 | http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Infobox_templates |
| 22:16.18 | pacman87 | are there any templates already in use by brlcad's wiki? |
| 22:20.43 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31243 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: oops, fix missing goto logic .. there is undoubtedly a better way to do this, but good enough |
| 22:23.08 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Mostlinkedtemplates |
| 22:25.48 | brlcad | basically you just want a table on the right with some named fields |
| 22:26.05 | brlcad | the admin tip template might help |
| 22:28.31 | pacman87 | i dont' think it likes wikipedia's "#if" |
| 22:35.56 | brlcad | that might be some functionality that needs to be enabled, or another plugin |
| 22:36.36 | brlcad | if you find it, lemme know and I can install it, or set you up to do it |
| 22:37.10 | brlcad | there's like 300 mediawiki plugins, we're only using like 8 |
| 22:37.35 | brlcad | had to install a plugin just yesterday so I could actually have the ability to reset a user's password (!) |
| 22:38.12 | brlcad | their "default feature set" truly is minimal.. |
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| 03:48.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31244 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: Enhanced plot() with more precise wireframe, and changed from hardcoded statements to a loop |
| 03:49.41 | pacman87 | new and improved: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp3.png |
| 04:47.30 | brlcad | awesome! |
| 04:48.00 | brlcad | that's pretty cool, so does it raytrace? |
| 04:50.38 | brlcad | awn |
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| 04:56.18 | pacman87 | brlcad: no, rt fails. i haven't really looked into it that closely |
| 04:56.34 | pacman87 | i need to get import5 and export5 working first |
| 04:59.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31245 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/adc.c: reorder to avoid forward decl of adc_print_vars, replace M_SQRT2_DIV2 with M_SQRT1_2 |
| 05:00.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31246 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/chgview.c: don't need defines, vmath.h provides |
| 05:00.53 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:01.29 | pacman87 | is there a way to convert a brlcad database to human readable format? |
| 05:01.35 | pacman87 | so i can check my exports? |
| 05:01.46 | pacman87 | and my imports seperately |
| 05:02.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31247 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: deprecate M_SQRT2_DIV2 .. it's entirely unnecessary since it's the same as sqrt(1/2) and/or 1/sqrt(2) .. so M_SQRT1_2 is suitable. |
| 05:05.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31248 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: beef up the tolerances on the standard M_ math defines, add a couple that were missing, and protect them all individually for the OS's that define some but not others. |
| 05:06.06 | brlcad | pacman87: only after you implement the hook function for it |
| 05:07.03 | pacman87 | hmmm? |
| 05:11.06 | pacman87 | is the database file format documented somewhere |
| 05:11.14 | brlcad | usual means for testing an individual primitive is to implement the rt_*_print() and rt_*_describe() callbacks |
| 05:11.29 | brlcad | describe is what you see when you run "l object" |
| 05:11.46 | pacman87 | ok |
| 05:11.59 | brlcad | print is what you see during edit when faceplace is enabled (it's on the gui menu, Misc) |
| 05:12.58 | pacman87 | i'm still running classic mode, though, so no menus for me |
| 05:15.32 | brlcad | yeah, you get faceplate by default |
| 05:15.40 | brlcad | that's the gui overlay you're looking at |
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| 05:18.15 | brlcad | if you run oed (i.e. oed / primitive) or sed (i.e. sed primitive) on a given primitive .. it'll enter edit mode and display the print() arguments on the overlay |
| 05:18.53 | brlcad | generally speaking, though, l ("ell") is more flexible since you can print literally anything and faster to test with (no edit mode) |
| 05:19.03 | pacman87 | mged> oed / hyp.s |
| 05:19.03 | pacman87 | mged> rt_nul_xform unimplemented |
| 05:19.03 | pacman87 | transform_editing_solid failed to apply a matrix transform, aborting |
| 05:19.31 | brlcad | ah, yeah |
| 05:19.39 | brlcad | so stick to l then :) |
| 05:19.42 | pacman87 | that, and "mged> l hyp.s" actually works now :) |
| 05:19.57 | brlcad | you can't go into edit mode without a couple of the other callbacks |
| 05:20.14 | pacman87 | thanks, bedtime for me now. i'll pick this up later |
| 05:20.19 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:20.24 | brlcad | nice progress! |
| 05:20.30 | pacman87 | thanks |
| 05:20.39 | pacman87 | do i need to worry about tolerances for the wireframe? |
| 05:20.46 | brlcad | mind if I share those screenshots? |
| 05:20.52 | pacman87 | not at all :) |
| 05:20.54 | pacman87 | with whom? |
| 05:21.17 | brlcad | nah, the wireframe just needs to be "good enough" |
| 05:21.33 | pacman87 | so just tess() needs the tolerance? |
| 05:21.34 | brlcad | at least not until there's proper high/low support |
| 05:21.42 | brlcad | tess definitely needs it, yet |
| 05:21.46 | brlcad | s/yet/yes/ |
| 05:21.59 | pacman87 | my question was more in the 'just' than in the 'tess()' |
| 05:22.18 | brlcad | contemplates |
| 05:22.25 | pacman87 | ie, is tolerance used for anything else? |
| 05:23.04 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:23.26 | brlcad | i mean, whenever you perform a computation in any of the routines, there are a set of tolerances to take into consideration |
| 05:23.34 | brlcad | e.g. a base computation tolerance |
| 05:23.41 | brlcad | a distance tolerance |
| 05:24.09 | brlcad | you don't "have" to use them strictly speaking, but you'll just likely get bad behavior if they're not implemented |
| 05:25.02 | pacman87 | ok |
| 05:25.03 | brlcad | the extent at which various primitives properly use and need tolerancing certainly varies, so just have to use good judgement |
| 05:25.47 | brlcad | for example, in the arbs, it uses the distance tolerance to determine whether or not two points are the same point or not |
| 05:26.08 | brlcad | if those points coincide, then it's not an arb8 .. it's an arb7 or arb6, etc |
| 05:26.23 | pacman87 | makes sense |
| 05:27.49 | pacman87 | tries to go to bed again, goodnight for real this time |
| 05:34.13 | brlcad | cya! |
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| 15:05.58 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, what is the name you suggested for mlt_main.c ? viewmlt.c ? |
| 15:12.13 | andrecastelo | and the src/rt/makefile.am modifications is something like this -> http://rafb.net/p/lVjBy170.html ? |
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| 17:02.19 | louipc | bah |
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| 17:06.15 | poolio | Oh my. |
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| 17:11.46 | louipc | ChanServ: you so crazy |
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| 19:47.11 | thing0 | hey yall |
| 19:50.31 | pacman87 | hi thing0 |
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| 20:41.41 | madant | hi thing0 :) |
| 20:42.21 | madant | pacman87: ;) blog added in the wiki http:://parametrics.wordpress.com |
| 20:42.52 | madant | whoops i meant http://parametrics.wordpress.com |
| 20:44.10 | madant | oh .. and i am homovulgaris.. :) |
| 20:44.13 | pacman87 | madant: cool |
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| 20:44.37 | pacman87 | i figured that when the blog said 'libpg' |
| 20:44.55 | madant | did the template thing work out for the wiki ? |
| 20:45.11 | pacman87 | i didnt' get it working yet, any ideas? |
| 20:45.48 | madant | what exactly is the error ? the plugin not supported due to version ? |
| 20:46.42 | pacman87 | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Template:Infobox |
| 20:47.08 | madant | yikes |
| 20:47.10 | pacman87 | raw xml: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Export/Template:Infobox |
| 20:49.07 | madant | where did u receive the template from ? |
| 20:49.11 | madant | wikimedia ? |
| 20:49.15 | pacman87 | wikipedia |
| 20:50.12 | pacman87 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Infobox |
| 20:51.47 | madant | hmm.. they say it is metatemplate used to make other templates.. |
| 20:52.05 | madant | so we would have to use another template or write one to use it ? |
| 20:52.17 | pacman87 | their examples show it in use |
| 20:58.23 | madant | hmm.. |
| 20:58.52 | madant | i better go eat something :) 02:20 am here :) |
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| 23:16.18 | Gnontghol | I am packing BRL-CAD to Ubuntu, and it would help to get the source for the .deb package you are shipping. |
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| 23:20.32 | louipc | Gnontghol: it's in misc/debian in the source tree |
| 23:23.01 | Gnontghol | louipc: Thanks. Wou just saved me a ton of work |
| 23:23.38 | louipc | cheers |
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| 23:36.11 | brlcad | arrives in NY |
| 23:37.16 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yeah, something like that |
| 23:38.44 | brlcad | Gnontghol: there isn't a debian maintainer (that I'm aware of) if you're interested |
| 23:46.25 | Gnontghol | brlcad: I am new to this packing thing. I don't think I am the man. |
| 23:46.38 | brlcad | fair enough |
| 23:46.47 | brlcad | though you can certainly try to be the man ;) |
| 23:47.29 | brlcad | the .deb needs a lot of work |
| 23:47.45 | brlcad | regardless of maintainership |
| 23:48.36 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, i'll commit.. if anything goes wrong you can feel free to break my legs :) |
| 23:50.14 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: do you have a dev log up somewhere? |
| 23:50.41 | andrecastelo | pacman87: dev log?? hm don't think so |
| 23:51.44 | Gnontghol | I think the age of this project is making the life of the .deb maintainer hard. |
| 23:51.55 | pacman87 | the other three of us have our logs linked from http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
| 23:52.04 | Gnontghol | implicit declarations and name colitions all around the place |
| 23:52.58 | louipc | Gnontghol: well the default install location is safe |
| 23:54.03 | andrecastelo | pacman87: ahh.. i had a blog set up for gsoc, will link there |
| 23:54.14 | louipc | Gnontghol: /usr/brlcad/ I stick it in /opt/brlcad/ because I don't think /usr is really supposed to be populated with per-package directories |
| 23:54.58 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: cool, thanks. i like to see what other coders are workign on :) |
| 23:56.33 | Gnontghol | louipc: You are right, but making a spessial install location is a bit hackish |
| 23:58.40 | Gnontghol | I sugest that you do a total code and structure review and release the reviewed code as brlcad-8.0 |
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| 00:26.42 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad , is there a problem if i create the directory /misc/win32-msvc8/mlt to hold mlt.vcproj ? |
| 01:05.07 | starseeker | brlcad: Unless I'm totally mistaken, there is a lot about the Query Ray Control Panel that is not working. |
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| 01:05.47 | starseeker | brlcad: I'm going to try again, but have you seen any reports of the panel not working? |
| 01:07.26 | starseeker | The air flag doesn't seem to do anything either with the mouse toggle or adding it to the base name |
| 02:31.11 | brlcad | andrecastelo: of course not |
| 02:34.11 | brlcad | starseeker: no, I've not heard any reports, could always just be something recent |
| 02:34.57 | brlcad | could be a lot of things, just have to trace through the code and/or try previous revs |
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| 05:37.34 | brlcad | madant: congratulations ... :) |
| 05:43.54 | brlcad | can talk more later about some details, like how your patches aren't conforming to HACKING (but were at least mostly self-consistent) and what to do next |
| 05:44.09 | brlcad | still a fair bit of discussion to be had about how libpg integrates |
| 05:47.31 | brlcad | and some questions about those graphs |
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| 06:35.34 | madant | Hi sean, |
| 06:35.49 | madant | could u tell me about the non-conformity.. |
| 06:36.11 | madant | I am planning to edit the designer document today in the following 5 or 6 hours. |
| 06:36.25 | madant | we can discuss libpg after that |
| 06:37.24 | brlcad | yeah, later .. |
| 06:37.29 | brlcad | must nap |
| 06:37.39 | madant | time for lunch here ;) |
| 06:38.01 | brlcad | not at home on usualy crazy schedule, so I gotta get a little conformity to be up during daystar hours all week |
| 06:38.03 | madant | happy nap :) |
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| 14:28.06 | ciccero | hi |
| 14:28.37 | ciccero | i am looking for help |
| 14:29.05 | ciccero | i am trying to intal brlcad 7.12.4 |
| 14:29.43 | ciccero | and a can not 'make' the program |
| 14:30.23 | ciccero | i have this problem "/.libs/librt.so: undefined reference to `TclReFree' " |
| 14:30.35 | ciccero | any idea???? |
| 14:31.12 | ciccero | or somebody can said me where to look? |
| 14:45.14 | madant | u ran autogen.sh first right ? |
| 14:45.29 | madant | and in configure did u specify --prefix=install dir ? |
| 14:47.17 | madant | and try using ./configure --enable-all |
| 15:18.05 | ``Erik | *cookcookcook* |
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| 15:18.36 | ``Erik | howdy, andre |
| 15:19.02 | ``Erik | <-- install subversion on a new laptop, then will check out and look at your commit |
| 15:19.27 | ``Erik | I was thinking the binary would be "rtmlt" and the main C file would be "viewmlt.c" to conform to the other rt's |
| 15:21.29 | andrecastelo | sounds good, i haven't commited yet, i'll change |
| 15:22.14 | ``Erik | otherwise, the Makefile.am patch looked all good |
| 15:34.14 | ``Erik | grumbles about the long dep chain to get svn via macports O.o |
| 15:38.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31249 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (Makefile.am brlcad/brlcad.sln rtmlt/ rtmlt/rtmlt.vcproj): Added misc/win32-msvc8/rtmlt and misc/win32-msvc8/rtmlt/rtmlt.vcproj. Made modifications in misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln and in misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am in order to add the new directory and project. |
| 15:40.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31250 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Renamed the mlt project to rtmlt. Alterations were made to misc/win32-msvc9/brlcad/brlcad.sln and misc/win32-msvc9/Makefile.am to correctly rename the directory and project. |
| 15:41.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31251 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (Makefile.am viewmlt.c): Added viewmlt.c to src/rt/ and made changes to src/rt/Makefile.am to support that. |
| 15:43.04 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: is it ok to separate the commits like that? |
| 15:46.16 | andrecastelo | isn't it ridiculous how msvc9 "updates" msvc8 projects to the latest version, effectively changing 1 line and rendering the project incompatible with msvc8? i hate that |
| 15:50.39 | ``Erik | sure |
| 15:51.01 | ``Erik | you'd have to go pretty silly to commit too often, it's FAR more common for people to commit too infrequently |
| 15:52.44 | ``Erik | also; worry most about getting your code working, at least provide a heads up on new files or build system changes if you don't adjust the automake stuff yourself, but don't worry too much about doing automake wrong or keeping msvc8 in sync or anything... your mission is to make the renderer, not garden the build system... that's why I'm here :) ok? |
| 15:53.09 | andrecastelo | but if there's a problem, someone can revert and isolate the problem easily, right? |
| 15:53.38 | andrecastelo | hm ok, understood :) |
| 15:53.41 | ``Erik | well, build system problems are going to fall into two categories for the most part |
| 15:53.50 | ``Erik | either a file wasn't added, which we can spot and fix trivially |
| 15:53.57 | ``Erik | or an entire build path wasn't added, so it's no big deal |
| 15:55.07 | ``Erik | you managed to add the entire msvc9 thing, that'll be by far the hardest thing you SHOULD ever do with auto* and svn... it should all be easy now :) |
| 15:56.28 | ``Erik | you've already won the region championship in football, now you're just playing a pickup game against some friends ;) |
| 15:57.10 | ``Erik | prods his stupid laptop until subversion installs |
| 15:57.53 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hehe, nice analogy :b |
| 15:59.42 | ``Erik | figured it was appropriate :D and I even de-americanized my statement, ya probably woulda been confused if I said soccer ;) |
| 16:03.31 | ``Erik | so you've looked over, um, viewdummy.c and mebbe viewedge.c or viewweight.c (or even view.c) ? |
| 16:04.10 | ``Erik | any of the view files will give you an idea of how things go, viewdummy.c lists all the stubs you need to fill |
| 16:04.16 | andrecastelo | actually i'm right now trying to "butilize" the patch i made for viewarea |
| 16:04.45 | andrecastelo | but regarding the mlt, i had an idea when i read the Developing Applications with BRLCAD presentation |
| 16:05.05 | ``Erik | ok, that presentation is still mostly pretinent I think |
| 16:05.47 | ``Erik | the viewarea patch should just need a few minor mods to work with libbu, uhmmm, using bu lists, the vmath.h macros for vector ops and, uhhh, the bu i/o shtuff |
| 16:06.12 | ``Erik | it looked "good, but not quite our tribe" when I skimmed it :) so just little stuff, iirc |
| 16:06.23 | andrecastelo | hm ok, understood |
| 16:06.56 | andrecastelo | i wasn't being able to compile using the bu_lists so i improvised :S |
| 16:07.27 | ``Erik | other than that, the only reason I didn't commit it myself was because I'm not familiar with the quirks and uses of that certain program, I'm hoping brlcad will step in and verify it doesn't make things weird for users :) |
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| 16:33.54 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:40.23 | ``Erik | aaaand, upgrade macports to see what in my subversion heirarchy is out of date, weeee |
| 16:43.36 | andrecastelo | hehehe, is that the laptop you were talking about buying last week? |
| 16:44.31 | ``Erik | no, I didn't end up buying one, I got another one from work |
| 16:44.38 | ``Erik | another 17" macbook pro |
| 16:44.59 | ``Erik | I still might buy a 13" macbook, but I have a temporary reprieve from NEEDINg to |
| 16:54.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31252 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Fixed a bug that corrupted the file and caused an error when the used tried to edit a project's property or tried to access a header file. |
| 16:55.15 | andrecastelo | s/used/user |
| 16:55.16 | andrecastelo | :S |
| 17:02.01 | ``Erik | hum, warnings in g_hyp |
| 17:03.12 | ``Erik | got the temp cranked up nice and high on this laptop with all these builds, no crashes or anything O.o |
| 17:05.48 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik what you think about struct mlt_app having a struct application * app ? |
| 17:05.59 | ``Erik | I think it kinda needs to? |
| 17:06.06 | ``Erik | oh, wait |
| 17:06.17 | andrecastelo | yeah, i was thinking the same thing |
| 17:06.27 | ``Erik | uhmmmm, you do need a 'struct application' somewhere, uhm, I have no issue with it being nested |
| 17:08.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31253 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: make rt_functab label a little bigger to fit "hyperboloid" for g_hyp |
| 17:16.30 | andrecastelo | ok erik, here is my idea - write a function to handle hits and record the hit information in the path structure. The bouncing/reflecting would be handled here, right? |
| 17:17.19 | andrecastelo | if so, initially we can use a fixed amount of bouncing, to make it work and later the function can be expanded |
| 17:17.26 | ``Erik | sounds about right |
| 17:18.03 | ``Erik | the hit callback managing some volume of information |
| 17:18.09 | andrecastelo | hm ok, so, the rays are shot from the lightsources, right? or i can set up where to shoot the rays from ? |
| 17:18.33 | ``Erik | it's bidirectional, so some rays will be shot from light sources and some from the viewpoint |
| 17:18.59 | andrecastelo | no, i meant currently supported by rt |
| 17:19.15 | ``Erik | and it'll be interesting, since viewpoints can be perspective (single point) or ortho (grid), and "light" is a material attribute on a solid |
| 17:19.49 | ``Erik | the regular phong rt run shoots a ray for each pixel, then at the intersection, it shoots rays to each light source |
| 17:20.05 | ``Erik | I'm not exactly sure how all the futzing with shadow rays works out, brlcad would know more |
| 17:29.00 | andrecastelo | view_init() should be called when the rays are starting to be fired, once per path or once per ray? |
| 18:00.00 | pacman87 | ``Erik: what warnings did you see on g_hyp.c? |
| 18:07.42 | ``Erik | length issue with a static field in table.c (fixed it) and, uhm, a sign issue with an ntohd call on like line 700 or so |
| 18:09.56 | pacman87 | the ntohd call is in import5(), and i haven't changed anything there (except var names/types) from when it was g_xxx.c |
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| 18:18.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31254 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/g_hyp.c: minor cast fix for ntohd |
| 18:19.16 | pacman87 | ``Erik: thanks :) |
| 18:19.20 | ``Erik | np |
| 18:19.29 | ``Erik | char -> const unsigned char |
| 18:19.32 | ``Erik | fyi |
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| 18:19.52 | ciccero | hi |
| 18:19.58 | ``Erik | afternoon, ciccero |
| 18:20.09 | ciccero | thank you madant |
| 18:20.51 | ciccero | i did the 'make' with the -k option |
| 18:20.58 | ``Erik | man, I'm gonna get fat :( I made whole wheat english muffins from scratch, I'm popping these things like candy... eaten 12 already O.o I'm gonna poo like mad later |
| 18:21.05 | ciccero | keep goin |
| 18:21.34 | ``Erik | -k means "don't stop on failure", it doesn't make the build magically work, it just doesn't abort as soon as it sees a failure |
| 18:22.05 | ciccero | but when i try to install, i have the same error |
| 18:22.30 | ciccero | .libs/librt.so: undefined reference to `TclReFree' |
| 18:22.48 | pacman87 | ciccero: did you do ./configure --enable-all? |
| 18:22.52 | ``Erik | configure with --enable-all |
| 18:23.28 | ciccero | yes |
| 18:23.34 | ciccero | i did that |
| 18:23.54 | ciccero | but have the error ".libs/librt.so: undefined reference to `TclReFree'" |
| 18:25.35 | madant | make clean and do a ./configure --enable-all --prefix=install dir |
| 18:25.44 | ciccero | i am installing with the -k option skip the no working module |
| 18:29.53 | ciccero | i am using the default install dir "/usr/brlcad/". I need specify the path? |
| 18:36.21 | madant | make clean once and then run ./configure --enable-all |
| 18:38.24 | ciccero | ok madant i'm doing clean, configure and make right now....... |
| 18:58.05 | ciccero | thank you.......soooooooo much. |
| 18:58.35 | ciccero | now i have a working brlcad on my machine |
| 18:59.00 | ciccero | i need to do the "clean" before |
| 18:59.24 | ciccero | thank's for all..... |
| 19:04.14 | madant | :) have fun with 7.12.4 |
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| 20:46.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31255 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: the label is intentionally supposed to be some brief short-hand so call it a hyp (there are two hyperboloid primitives, ehy is th e other) |
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| 21:52.28 | brlcad | thinks it'd be cool if madant would re-render his graphs with a uniform scale, overlay the two data sets |
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| 22:48.24 | brlcad | andrecastelo: your viewmlt duplicates a main() |
| 22:51.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31256 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: file header doesn't match file name, use sh/template.sh for adding new files (or sh/header.sh for adding a new header). remove main since it's presently described as an rt app (which provides a main()) |
| 22:52.17 | brlcad | if you need your own main different from the one in src/rt/main.c, then your tool probably doesn't belong in src/rt as that makes it more like nirt from a structural perspective |
| 22:53.27 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i was going to change that, but you were faster than me :B |
| 22:54.00 | andrecastelo | also, i renamed mlt_main.c to viewmlt.c but i used template.sh to create mlt_main.c |
| 22:54.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31257 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/Makefile.am: disable default compilation of rtmlt until it works, can be manually compiled with 'make rtmlt' in src/rt |
| 22:54.48 | brlcad | andrecastelo: k, I figured -- that's what the parenthetical was for ;) |
| 22:55.01 | brlcad | you can fix the header by just removing it, and then running header.sh on it |
| 22:55.09 | brlcad | (or edit the two lines) |
| 22:55.13 | brlcad | nit pick of coruse |
| 22:55.25 | brlcad | commit early, commit often ;) |
| 22:56.05 | brlcad | is about to make hundreds of commits |
| 23:00.26 | andrecastelo | should i change the name of mlt_defs.h too ? |
| 23:01.08 | brlcad | up to you |
| 23:02.49 | PrezzKennedy | howdy brlcad |
| 23:02.55 | brlcad | howdy |
| 23:02.57 | PrezzKennedy | the interns keeping you busy? |
| 23:03.08 | brlcad | not yet :) |
| 23:03.51 | PrezzKennedy | i wanted a hot one to help staff the IT department... |
| 23:05.52 | brlcad | setting the interns on fire isn't usually recommended |
| 00:21.21 | PrezzKennedy | better than setting the servers on fire |
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| 02:03.38 | poolio | Uh oh. Am I going to be set on fire? :( |
| 04:38.58 | brlcad | poolio: only if you're lucky ;) |
| 04:57.22 | poolio | steps under a ladder |
| 05:27.59 | brlcad | yeesh, thousands of anonymous ftp connections |
| 05:28.50 | brlcad | firewalls the idiot with a .in addr |
| 05:53.15 | poolio | ruh roh. |
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| 07:33.57 | d_rossberg | brlcad: thank you for your reply to my C++ question |
| 07:34.47 | d_rossberg | (both e-mail and rikers.org ;-) |
| 07:36.50 | d_rossberg | i figured out that starting line 12 with "class " helps too, but i didn't know that the other compiler choice was "value" |
| 07:37.45 | d_rossberg | the thing what confused me was that it works if i replace "Type" in line 12 by "int" |
| 07:39.10 | d_rossberg | therefore it looks like the gcc needs some help above a certain level of complexity |
| 07:42.26 | clock_ | d_rossberg: are you bringing C++ into brl-cad? |
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| 07:57.16 | d_rossberg | clock_: i would like to do it, however this problem arised in my "real" work |
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| 14:10.55 | ``Erik | wait, what? we're NOT allowed to set the interns on fire? damnit |
| 14:54.21 | brlcad | d_rossberg: yeah, that was a pretty hard problem .. took me a while to figure out what was up |
| 14:54.39 | brlcad | I rewrote it a couple times testing out what the compiler was doing |
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| 14:59.08 | brlcad | wasn't until I narrowed it down to http://brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/typename.cpp that it became obvious |
| 15:02.23 | d_rossberg | brlcad: it turns out that (nested) templates need special attention in writing portable code |
| 15:05.28 | brlcad | nods |
| 15:05.36 | brlcad | that's something I used to run into a lot with VC6 |
| 15:06.06 | brlcad | would often have to unnest them to get VC6 to work with them at all if it was a complex structure |
| 15:06.41 | d_rossberg | (another issue is that MSVC allowes temporary objets as non-const reference parameter) |
| 15:06.53 | brlcad | oh yeah, that's a big one |
| 15:07.30 | brlcad | our windows devs for bzflag are *constantly* passing in temp objects that have to be fixed :) |
| 15:07.51 | brlcad | rather frustrating as it's convenient for them, but invalid per standard |
| 15:08.02 | brlcad | fortunately the fix is easy |
| 15:08.31 | brlcad | just sometimes rather hard to identify as the errors messages are rather obscure sometimes |
| 15:11.39 | d_rossberg | yes, it was a "multiple choice" error message (i.e. something like "do you mean method A or B") |
| 15:13.02 | brlcad | on the Mac, it would actually compile just fine but result in a run-time error -- memory corruption accessing non-existant temporary memory in the called function |
| 15:13.17 | brlcad | usually std template types |
| 15:14.09 | pacman87 | hi d_rossberg, brlcad |
| 15:14.14 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 15:14.25 | brlcad | how goes the progress? |
| 15:14.30 | d_rossberg | moin moin pacman87 |
| 15:14.38 | pacman87 | fixing up import/exprort for the hyp now |
| 15:14.51 | brlcad | pacman87: I'm about to move some files on you, restructuring librt |
| 15:15.01 | brlcad | specifically the primitives |
| 15:15.07 | pacman87 | how so? |
| 15:15.15 | brlcad | they're moving into a subdir |
| 15:15.35 | brlcad | shouldn't be a problem, just let me know if you run into any problems with your changes |
| 15:15.44 | pacman87 | ok, thanks for the heads up |
| 15:16.20 | brlcad | if you commit frequently, the impact may even be nil |
| 15:17.57 | brlcad | the work is a precursor for the new brep() callbacks for each primitive that poolio is working on, given the guts to those callbacks are C++ they need to be separated out |
| 15:18.22 | brlcad | aside from just being useful organization for librt |
| 15:18.36 | poolio | mornin' brlcad et al |
| 15:18.44 | pacman87 | morning, poolio |
| 15:19.47 | poolio | pacman87: how's the summer of code going? Has it officially started yet? |
| 15:19.54 | pacman87 | yeah, last week |
| 15:20.29 | pacman87 | my dev log, and some pretty pictures, are at http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Pacman87 |
| 15:21.51 | poolio | brlcad: is the rt raytracing going to give me a place to put the brep code? |
| 15:22.01 | poolio | brlcad: I can't read. Woopsy :) |
| 15:25.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31258 10/brlcad/trunk/ (80 files in 5 dirs): |
| 15:25.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: beginning of librt restructuring that places all primitives into a 'primitives' |
| 15:25.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: subdirectory. keeping it non-recursive make for performance reasons and further |
| 15:25.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: breakouts and restructuring is on the way in support of a new brep() callback |
| 15:25.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: for all primitives. still have to move nurbs and nmg sources. |
| 15:36.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31259 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): make bot.h a public header for now since at least one tool (bot_shell-vtk) requires the header for the bot_specific data type as well as related functions |
| 15:37.19 | pacman87 | two brlcad commits later and i'm still compiling :( |
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| 15:49.11 | brlcad | pacman87: and I'm not anywhere near done |
| 15:51.30 | louipc | whoa |
| 15:51.47 | brlcad | doing it piecewise just to show the progression, make sure each step works piecewise, and *then* get to the actual break-up |
| 15:52.44 | brlcad | seriously need to disable dependency tracking .. it's getting annoying to have to depclean each time |
| 16:00.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31260 10/brlcad/trunk/ (51 files in 4 dirs): |
| 16:00.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: move the nurbs/bspline surfaces into src/librt/primitives/nurb using 'nurb' as |
| 16:00.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: the dir instead of 'bspline' for now even though the table.c shorthand for the |
| 16:00.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: primitive's name is bspline. table.c's label name seems to be the |
| 16:00.34 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: inconsistency. |
| 16:09.13 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31261 10/brlcad/trunk/ (51 files in 4 dirs): follow suit and move all of the nmg sources into src/librt/primitives/nmg |
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| 17:20.51 | starseeker | crosses his fingers and does a svn update... |
| 17:40.13 | poolio | brlcad: so are you done destroying everything yet? ;) |
| 17:40.26 | ``Erik | he never is |
| 17:40.36 | poolio | ``Erik: ouch. |
| 17:40.40 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:41.05 | ``Erik | watches the compiles keep chugging |
| 17:43.26 | pacman87 | apparently my hyp always returns 0 from shot() |
| 17:45.22 | poolio | It's invisible! |
| 17:45.41 | pacman87 | negative index of refraction? |
| 17:46.24 | ``Erik | there are real materials with that property now O.o |
| 17:47.18 | pacman87 | what's the easiest way to print to console in the middle of a rt? |
| 17:47.55 | ``Erik | how do you mean? like inside of the shot function or something? |
| 17:48.00 | pacman87 | yes |
| 17:48.05 | ``Erik | bu_log() should do it |
| 17:48.41 | ``Erik | printf or fprintf should work, too... 'nirt' might be worth messing with to debug a shot routine |
| 17:49.53 | pacman87 | ok, thanks |
| 17:57.17 | pacman87 | i dont' think my shot() is even getting called... |
| 17:58.09 | brlcad | yup, never done |
| 17:58.33 | ``Erik | fire up gdb and put a breakpoint on your function? |
| 17:59.03 | pacman87 | yeah, that's what i'm trying now |
| 17:59.04 | brlcad | pacman87: prep has to define the bounding cube or it will be an early-exit miss |
| 17:59.25 | brlcad | make sure prep is right (compare to others) |
| 18:00.16 | pacman87 | i stored the bounding rpp in stp->st_min/max[X/Y/Z] |
| 18:00.38 | ``Erik | needs both the aabb and bounding sphere, I think |
| 18:00.52 | poolio | brlcad: so, is there going to be a brep/ folder? |
| 18:01.03 | poolio | or would it be in primitives? |
| 18:01.18 | brlcad | there are two things .. |
| 18:01.31 | brlcad | a brep primitive will live in a primitives/brep/ folder |
| 18:01.49 | brlcad | there will eventually be one folder for each primitive with the routines for that primitive |
| 18:02.24 | brlcad | you're adding an additional brep() routine to each of those folders |
| 18:02.37 | brlcad | it'll be more clear, I'm working on arb now |
| 18:02.49 | poolio | ah ok. So I don't need to write any of the arb schtuff? |
| 18:07.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31262 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 5 dirs): |
| 18:07.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: recant, make the subdir match the table primitive type so s/nurb/bspline/ for |
| 18:07.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: the directory name. keep the files named as nurb_. it's a minor point, but the |
| 18:07.58 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: short name can't be easily renamed so go with the table label. |
| 18:07.59 | brlcad | you're going to be adding a file for *each* primitive, including arb |
| 18:08.25 | brlcad | that's the main point, to have a new hook function |
| 18:08.58 | pacman87 | gdb shows neither rt_hyp_prep() nor rt_hyp_shot() are being called |
| 18:09.47 | pacman87 | i set a breakpoint for rt_hyp_plot() too, to make sure i was using gdb properly, and it caught that one |
| 18:16.14 | ``Erik | do your bounding box and sphere make sense? is the ray actually intersecting both? |
| 18:19.09 | brlcad | pacman87: set ft_use_rpp to 0 in table.c, see if prep is called |
| 18:21.04 | pacman87 | brlcad: cant' find ft_use_rpp in src/librt/table.c |
| 18:21.06 | brlcad | you can single step a ray easily with nirt or rt -Q |
| 18:21.27 | brlcad | pacman87: that's because you just use the value there |
| 18:21.40 | brlcad | look at the rt_functab structure |
| 18:22.05 | brlcad | your primitive is hooked into an rt_functab table with a slew of settings and callbacks |
| 18:24.50 | pacman87 | where is rt_functab defined? |
| 18:25.04 | brlcad | raytrace.h |
| 18:28.49 | starseeker | begins to see how it's very nice to have cmake generate cross-platform build logic... |
| 19:00.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31263 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Added bu_copy_argv, bu_copyinsert_argv and bu_free_argv. |
| 19:01.49 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@74.86.45.130) | |
| 19:05.18 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31264 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: Modified f_nirt() to pass along the use_air setting. |
| 19:10.08 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-237-118.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 19:19.06 | brlcad | hrms and looks at bob's argvage |
| 19:21.10 | pacman87 | after changing it to 0, prep() still isnt' called |
| 19:25.06 | brlcad | hum hum hum.. that implies you have something else wrong of course -- like the primitive ID doesn't match the table entry or something |
| 19:26.23 | pacman87 | do i need it in idmap[]? |
| 19:26.37 | pacman87 | there's a lot of ID_NULLs in there |
| 19:35.12 | brlcad | shouldn't need to |
| 19:35.26 | brlcad | that's a v4 to v5 conversion table |
| 19:38.41 | pacman87 | how do i check in g_hyp.c now? i'm getting a 'svn: file not found' |
| 19:39.17 | pacman87 | will an update move my files to the right place? |
| 19:48.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31265 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: implemented import5() and export5(); corrected the bounding radius in prep() |
| 19:50.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31266 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/g_hyp.c: try 2: implemented import5(), export5(), and describe(); corrected the bounding radius in prep() |
| 19:50.41 | pacman87 | there we go |
| 19:50.59 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-235.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:51.05 | pacman87 | hi clock_ |
| 19:52.15 | clock_ | hi |
| 19:54.06 | pacman87 | make[2]: *** No rule to make target `g_arb.c', needed by `g_arb.lo'. Stop. |
| 19:55.33 | pacman87 | i'll try "make clean && ./autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all && make" |
| 19:55.46 | pacman87 | i'll check back in 30 min |
| 19:57.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31267 10/brlcad/trunk/ (25 files in 3 dirs): Mods to use "struct ged" instead of "struct rt_wdb" |
| 20:14.09 | brlcad | pacman87: that's dependency tracking, you make have to "make distclean" and rerun from autogen.sh |
| 20:14.32 | pacman87 | make clean isnt' enough? |
| 20:14.43 | brlcad | not usually |
| 20:15.04 | pacman87 | you couldn't tell me this 15 minutes ago :) |
| 20:16.20 | brlcad | is not sure he likes breaking up the g_ files |
| 20:18.50 | louipc | how are you breaking them up? |
| 20:18.51 | brlcad | about a half-hour of tedius refactoring, increases the compile time by more than an order, and the benefit seems wibbly on the surface for just the C funcs |
| 20:19.08 | brlcad | basically putting each callback into it's own file |
| 20:19.58 | louipc | hm |
| 20:20.00 | brlcad | e.g. http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/md128a9b |
| 20:20.51 | brlcad | so I think it works really well for objects like nurbs, nmgs that have dozens of files |
| 20:21.34 | brlcad | kinda torn now, need separation for the C++ code |
| 20:22.35 | louipc | oh yea |
| 20:22.59 | brlcad | will have to think about this some more |
| 20:27.27 | poolio | brlcad: Keep me posted :) |
| 20:28.24 | poolio | mkdir src/librt/brep_cpp_crap |
| 20:30.42 | louipc | darn nurbs |
| 20:54.20 | pacman87 | 36m12.754s to recompile everything |
| 20:55.34 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31268 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Add reference to argv.c |
| 21:01.15 | pacman87 | /home/timothy/brlcad/brlcad/src/mged/rtif.c:1788: undefined reference to `bu_copyinsert_argv' |
| 21:01.15 | pacman87 | /home/timothy/brlcad/brlcad/src/mged/rtif.c:1791: undefined reference to `bu_free_argv' |
| 21:01.28 | starseeker | fixed by bob in that last commit |
| 21:01.48 | pacman87 | thanks, starseeker |
| 21:01.59 | starseeker | np - building myself at the moment :-) |
| 21:02.37 | pacman87 | how long does it take you to build all, and on what hardware? |
| 21:05.13 | louipc | takes me like 1.5 hr on 866MHz pIII |
| 21:26.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31269 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: no argument supplied to bu_log string variable - command strings are printed below so assuming this should be just a label. Fixes crash with bus error for nirt -X 2 debug case. |
| 22:14.46 | brlcad | the machines I compile on range from about 3 minutes to 3 hours to compile with --enable-all |
| 22:15.02 | brlcad | of course tends to prefer the 3 minute system |
| 22:15.28 | brlcad | curious to retry ccache or distcc now that "make fast" is in place |
| 22:18.35 | brlcad | okay, I think I have a workable compromise wrt to the primitive breakouts |
| 22:26.06 | pacman87 | brlcad: what hardware is the 3 minute on? |
| 22:33.22 | ``Erik | thinks a 12 core altix with something like 16g ram and a big 15krpm scsi raid |
| 22:33.27 | ``Erik | mebbe 32g |
| 22:33.49 | ``Erik | it's a beastly machine, if it weren't for sgi's twisted version of suse, it'd be nice :) |
| 22:34.56 | ``Erik | I think I'm running ~4 minutes on a quad core opteron running fbsd8 with sata disks, but I'm not building png, tcl or tk with that |
| 22:36.49 | pacman87 | on another note, i'm really confused about rt |
| 22:37.01 | pacman87 | i added breaks for rt_ehy_prep |
| 22:37.27 | pacman87 | and rt_ehy_shot; and did rt on a simple ehy, and neither on caught |
| 22:37.44 | pacman87 | s/neither on/neither one/ |
| 22:38.48 | ``Erik | hrm, did the breaks take? |
| 22:39.02 | pacman87 | yeah, gdb said they were resolved |
| 22:39.17 | pacman87 | and adding a break on rt_xxx_plot works fine |
| 22:39.19 | ``Erik | usually I have to break main, start rt, then add library breaks and continue, since stuff in librt does not exist before rt is executed |
| 22:39.26 | ``Erik | hrm, weird |
| 22:40.00 | pacman87 | and if i try a ctrl-c and 'where' in the middle, i just get into tcl stuff |
| 22:40.05 | ``Erik | try making geometry with both a sphere and and an ehy, break both preps and run it to see if both are being caught? |
| 22:43.15 | pacman87 | neither prep is caught |
| 22:44.51 | ``Erik | does it render them ok? |
| 22:44.54 | pacman87 | yes |
| 22:45.55 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m4340ef3c |
| 22:46.29 | pacman87 | that's my gdb run, i did ctrl+c in the middle of rt |
| 23:02.51 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.172.171) | |
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| 02:25.05 | pacman87 | anyone else have an idea as to why rt fails on hyp? |
| 02:32.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31270 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt): tweak formatting in csv output |
| 03:38.51 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:02.52 | brlcad | pacman87: are you running rt from inside mged? |
| 04:03.44 | brlcad | (heh) .. dont' do that :) |
| 04:04.01 | brlcad | run rt directly on the unix command line, or via gdb, but not via mged |
| 04:04.39 | brlcad | mged kicks off the rt binary, so none of your ray-trace symbols can get caught by gdb because it's in mged not rt |
| 04:07.26 | brlcad | gdb lets you set the break points simply because mged is also reliant upon librt, but it doesn't use it for ray-tracing, it uses it for geometry services (I/O, editing, etc) |
| 04:11.30 | brlcad | andrecastelo: woot, thx for the update :) |
| 04:12.13 | andrecastelo | brlcad: sorry for taking so long |
| 04:12.59 | brlcad | no problem, it's progress :) |
| 04:18.37 | brlcad | don't be shy about those "week #1" questions for the first phase |
| 04:18.59 | brlcad | that's all pretty staple brl-cad services work |
| 04:44.30 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:57.44 | poolio | brlcad: so did you figure out what to do with librt yet? :) |
| 06:24.25 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-197.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 06:58.58 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:10.41 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 08:48.56 | clock_ | Sorry for offtopic |
| 08:49.01 | clock_ | Anyone been in San Francisco? |
| 11:43.10 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875D1E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 11:43.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31271 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: enable asc2g for hyp (elliptical hyperboloid of one sheet) |
| 11:44.53 | d_rossberg | pacman87: you have to initialize hyp in rt_hyp_prep (it has to point to some valid memory) |
| 11:45.38 | d_rossberg | clock_: 10 years ago |
| 11:58.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31272 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: Corrected calculation of obliquities |
| 12:19.59 | clock_ | d_rossberg: is it like a crowded city? |
| 12:29.59 | d_rossberg | no, it's a very nice city, more european (e.g. in opposite to Los Angeles) |
| 12:32.04 | clock_ | What do you mean with more european? |
| 12:35.09 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-039-242.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 12:35.55 | d_rossberg | it has a centre, some historic buildings, i.e. somebody from europe should feel comfortable there |
| 12:37.52 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.198.97) | |
| 12:38.50 | clock_ | Los Angeles has no centre and buildings are modern? |
| 12:43.33 | d_rossberg | no centre in "european" meaning: in the centre district you will find some high buldings (e.g. the round one from "Independence Day") but this is a place for business and not a tourists |
| 12:45.42 | d_rossberg | the touristic centres are spreaded over a large area, e.g. Hollywood boulevard, Disnayland, UniversalStudios, museums, etc. |
| 12:46.19 | d_rossberg | the area of Los Angeles (and its satalite cities) is gigantic |
| 12:47.24 | d_rossberg | (sorry, "sattelite") |
| 12:51.48 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 12:57.12 | clock_ | Is it true that Los Angeles has high air pollution? |
| 12:59.17 | brlcad | yep, you can see it from a distance quite clearly |
| 12:59.41 | brlcad | LA really is *huge* in comparison to most cities .. it's very much spread out |
| 12:59.44 | clock_ | And San Francisco? |
| 12:59.50 | brlcad | completely different |
| 13:00.03 | clock_ | Does LA reach to the shore? Like Santa Monica etc.? Is it already part of the LA? |
| 13:00.06 | brlcad | only thing they have in common is they're both in the same state |
| 13:00.12 | ``Erik | even sf doesn't have the same center construction as most european cities, afaik |
| 13:00.32 | ``Erik | very few US cities have the notion :( |
| 13:00.48 | ``Erik | it's all "new", built more for cars than anything else |
| 13:00.55 | ``Erik | as far as I can tell :) |
| 13:01.06 | ``Erik | being able to walk to anything I wanted to go to in japan was weird |
| 13:01.16 | clock_ | brlcad: query |
| 13:03.29 | ``Erik | *buildbuildbuild* |
| 13:03.47 | ``Erik | I don't like how asc2g and g2asc have all primitive logic in them, they should delegate that to librt imho :/ |
| 13:04.12 | ``Erik | unless asc is deprecated (it seems very tied to v4) |
| 13:17.15 | starseeker | ``Erik: I think asc is how we store models in svn |
| 13:17.32 | starseeker | ``Erik: That does sound weird that there is primitive logic in them |
| 13:17.45 | ``Erik | it is |
| 13:18.09 | starseeker | uses g2asc and then asc2g to remove size creepage |
| 13:18.15 | ``Erik | but unlike cvs, svn stores xdelta info for binaries, ... just seems like something that needs to be addressed |
| 13:18.45 | ``Erik | heh, do we need an fsck_g to fix/compress? :D |
| 13:19.08 | starseeker | I asked brlcad about that a while back - can't remember what the answer was... |
| 13:19.24 | ``Erik | was probably "sure, go do that!" or something of that nature :) |
| 13:19.28 | brlcad | there already is a command to compress not that it's coming to me at the moment |
| 13:19.30 | starseeker | I think it was when I was doing my earth model - it was waaaaay bigger than a few spheres and arbs needed |
| 13:19.44 | brlcad | there are three or four places in the code that have per-primitive logic |
| 13:19.50 | brlcad | that would be good to merge back up into librt |
| 13:20.01 | brlcad | just hasn't happened |
| 13:20.03 | brlcad | refactor ftw |
| 13:20.18 | starseeker | ``Erik: "go do it" ;-) |
| 13:20.24 | ``Erik | heh, that word still sends chills down my spine :/ |
| 13:20.50 | ``Erik | "refactor"... watching a group attempt to replace things like thinking, planning, design, etc with "refactor it"... *shudder* |
| 13:21.52 | brlcad | asc conversion, mirror, typein, soledit to name a few |
| 13:22.32 | starseeker | makes note to find the compress command |
| 13:25.49 | brlcad | i think it's garbage_collect |
| 13:25.52 | brlcad | or something like that |
| 13:26.13 | brlcad | it's a dev command, not a user command |
| 13:44.05 | *** join/#brlcad karlprof-cgiirc (n=d5a61112@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:46.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31273 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob modified mged nirt command to include air in results (now passes the -u 1 option to nirt) |
| 13:46.55 | brlcad | hello karlprof-cgiirc |
| 13:47.41 | karlprof-cgiirc | hello, I am afraid I am abusing your fantastic cgiirc service because my pc is being odd |
| 13:49.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31274 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/argv.c: fix the header, this isn't vls.c |
| 13:49.29 | brlcad | karlprof-cgiirc: no problem, though I can't see how you'd "abuse" it :) |
| 13:49.58 | brlcad | it doesn't allow connections to anywhere but channels relevant to our needs |
| 13:50.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31275 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/argv.c: unnecessary headers |
| 13:51.04 | karlprof-cgiirc | I need to send some queries out to helpful people :) relating to aforementioned oddness |
| 13:51.35 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 13:51.38 | karlprof-cgiirc | Apologies for any inconvinience or unnessessary strain on your web server |
| 13:51.47 | brlcad | heh, it's no strain |
| 13:52.05 | brlcad | it could probably support hundreds of users beofre being an issue |
| 13:57.36 | ``Erik | heh, yeah, all the strain is coming from other services, and once brlcad gets off his duff and migrates, the machine will be overpowered anyways :) |
| 14:03.09 | karlprof-cgiirc | Cheers for the connection, all done |
| 14:03.11 | *** part/#brlcad karlprof-cgiirc (n=d5a61112@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:04.00 | brlcad | wonders why a staffer would need our cgi:irc |
| 14:06.42 | ``Erik | pheer incoming r00tage? |
| 14:28.21 | brlcad | coffee break! |
| 14:28.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31276 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (5 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 14:28.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: sample of new primitive organization where each primitive will be housed in a |
| 14:28.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: subdir named by it's table label. the intent will be to keep all of the table |
| 14:28.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: hook functions together in a main xxx.c file with structures and interface |
| 14:28.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: properties separated into an interface header, then allowing whatever other |
| 14:28.33 | ``Erik | <-- hands brlcad his mug :D |
| 14:28.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: source files, documentation, and supporting materials to live in that directory |
| 14:28.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: with the primitive. this new organization should better support the addition of |
| 14:29.05 | brlcad | not quite as good as the 2005 solid modeling, but still pretty good/useful .. some interesting papers |
| 14:29.26 | brlcad | slaps self for knowing better re it's |
| 14:32.17 | ``Erik | named by it is table label |
| 14:32.31 | ``Erik | I'm gonna sick crazy daisy on you to learn you up some apostrophes |
| 14:32.38 | ``Erik | apostrophe's :> *smirk* |
| 14:33.51 | prasad_ | howdy |
| 14:34.03 | ``Erik | http://www.angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif |
| 15:29.21 | brlcad | howdy prasad_ |
| 15:30.12 | brlcad | woot, there's the money |
| 15:30.43 | brlcad | great paper on computing volume and surface areas using ray sampling that minimizes sampling errors |
| 15:47.31 | pacman87 | brlcad: thanks for the info re: mged/rt; i'm tracking down the problem |
| 16:17.17 | brlcad | pacman87: np |
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| 17:22.45 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-83-197.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:57.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31277 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Added code to copy nirt sfiles. Modified code that copies g_xxx.c. |
| 18:18.51 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31278 10/brlcad/trunk/ (103 files in 37 dirs): mass (initial) restructuring to place each primitive into their own subdirectory. the g_ files are stripped of their prefix, using a directory and 'main' interface file name that matches the table.c label. |
| 18:21.39 | poolio | wowza. |
| 18:25.37 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31279 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: g_bot_include.c is in the bot dir |
| 18:35.02 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.68.244) | |
| 18:35.43 | andrecastelo | good afternoon people :D |
| 18:35.49 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 18:35.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31280 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi: Several minor mods to get things working again. |
| 18:35.57 | andrecastelo | hey pacman87 |
| 18:36.24 | poolio | howdy andrecastelo, pacman87 |
| 18:36.28 | poolio | Wasn't there a 3rd gsocer? |
| 18:36.33 | andrecastelo | howdy poolio |
| 18:36.41 | pacman87 | poolio: there's 4 of us |
| 18:36.49 | andrecastelo | there is mafm |
| 18:36.58 | poolio | Ah yes. Who's the fourth? |
| 18:36.59 | andrecastelo | and the fourth one i don't know the nickanem |
| 18:37.04 | pacman87 | homovulgaris? |
| 18:37.07 | andrecastelo | nickname* |
| 18:37.10 | poolio | If he's not in IRC he must not exist ;) |
| 18:37.41 | pacman87 | that was the old one, switched recently and i don't remember the new one |
| 18:37.54 | andrecastelo | iirc, brlcad talked about someone who communicated exclusively through the mailing list, don't know if he/she got accepted |
| 18:38.55 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: yeah, that was the libpg proposal |
| 18:38.59 | pacman87 | and it was accepted |
| 18:39.23 | andrecastelo | is checking wiki |
| 18:39.25 | pacman87 | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
| 18:40.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31281 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/tclsh/library/: add missing library dir for distcheck |
| 18:40.06 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 18:40.11 | brlcad | how goes it? |
| 18:40.12 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 18:40.48 | brlcad | dawn's other/better nick is madant ;) |
| 18:41.15 | pacman87 | brlcad: i'd recognize it if i saw it, but not off the top of my head |
| 18:41.17 | brlcad | he's since been in a couple times, but yes tends to prefer e-mail |
| 18:41.27 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm fine, you ? :D |
| 18:41.42 | brlcad | dawn == homovulgaris == madant |
| 18:42.13 | brlcad | andrecastelo: doing great! .. I love going to conferences, and I'm at solid modeling all this week |
| 18:42.27 | brlcad | great for getting work done, networking, and inspiring new ideas |
| 18:42.33 | andrecastelo | brlcad: oh, so i've heard :D |
| 18:42.38 | andrecastelo | and how's ny? |
| 18:43.58 | brlcad | mildly warm outside today, but nice .. SUNY Stony Brook is way up long island .. other than the roads, it's far up into the woods and pretty quiet |
| 18:45.27 | andrecastelo | pretty nice, though i always liked the cold, i'm actually starting to miss the warm days |
| 18:56.33 | ``Erik | <-- scratches his head at the new src/librt ugliness O.o :) |
| 19:04.58 | brlcad | still not complete |
| 19:05.15 | brlcad | have to break out the interface |
| 19:05.28 | brlcad | and then start migrating the various table files |
| 19:07.17 | poolio | Heh, my dad teaches at SUNY |
| 19:07.31 | poolio | (not that one...he teaches at the upstate medical one in Syracuse) |
| 19:08.51 | pacman87 | maybe it's just me, but i have a feeling my raytracing is wrong: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt.png |
| 19:10.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31282 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/Makefile.am librt/Makefile.am): add private headers xxx.h and ged_private.h missing from dist |
| 19:11.34 | poolio | pacman87: looks perfect to me ;) |
| 19:11.49 | poolio | pacman87: what WM is that? |
| 19:11.55 | pacman87 | kde |
| 19:12.59 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt1.png |
| 19:13.07 | pacman87 | there's another one, different angle |
| 19:16.50 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt2.png |
| 19:19.20 | brlcad | hehe |
| 19:19.27 | pacman87 | ...yeah |
| 19:19.29 | brlcad | doesn't think those are "quite" right :) |
| 19:19.41 | pacman87 | but it's not crashing on my anymore ;) |
| 19:19.46 | brlcad | progress! |
| 19:19.57 | brlcad | and it ray-traces something |
| 19:20.14 | brlcad | you could be one +/- character away from completion ;) |
| 19:20.17 | pacman87 | i find it odd that all three have that ellipse in the exact same spot |
| 19:21.11 | brlcad | yeah, that is interesting |
| 19:21.29 | brlcad | the caps should be fairly easy |
| 19:21.36 | brlcad | at least compared to solving the roots for the sheet |
| 19:21.54 | pacman87 | first one was -a 0, second was -a 90, and last was -a 45 |
| 19:22.09 | brlcad | easier said than done, of course, though the code should be nearly identical to that for the epa and tgc |
| 20:13.47 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31283 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: It looks like torus/torus.c changed to tor/tor.c |
| 20:15.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31284 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Temporarily remove rtmlt from solution until it builds. |
| 20:30.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31285 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/view.c: Updated the usage string to include -U. |
| 20:49.07 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31286 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ (34 files in 33 dirs): update the headers for the new file names, use something better than g_ for the doxygen group |
| 20:49.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31287 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/doxygen_structure: rename g_ group to primitives |
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| 23:31.37 | andrecastelo | brlcad: does this answers a few of the "week #1" questions? http://brlcad.org/wiki/Example_Application |
| 00:23.50 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 00:24.06 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 00:24.15 | yukonbob | what's happening, pacman87? |
| 00:24.24 | pacman87 | um, not my raytracing |
| 00:24.36 | yukonbob | feh... |
| 00:24.44 | yukonbob | try solidworks ;) |
| 00:24.59 | pacman87 | i mean my primitive's raytracing |
| 00:25.06 | yukonbob | knows -- is joking |
| 00:25.14 | pacman87 | i dont thing solidworks does hyperboloids, anyway |
| 00:25.26 | yukonbob | hits google |
| 00:26.06 | yukonbob | my Net connection is working about as well as your raytracing :P |
| 00:29.05 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:29.50 | yukonbob | sees something about developing hyperboloid drill bits in solidworks in summaries... |
| 00:46.39 | pacman87 | progress: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt3.png |
| 00:46.51 | pacman87 | still not sure why the bottom plate is showing, though |
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| 01:36.16 | brlcad | pacman87: woot, nice progress! |
| 01:36.29 | brlcad | my guess would be sort order |
| 01:36.45 | brlcad | the in-out segment points you add to the result should be sorted |
| 01:37.40 | brlcad | if you have the segment inverted so you present the back-facing bottom plate exit point before the side-wall entry point, you could see that kind of effect |
| 01:38.33 | brlcad | course could be something wrong with the middle surface.. those normals are whack |
| 01:46.54 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad .. the rt applications consist of view[app].c + worker.c + do.c + opt.c + main.c, right? what functions are specific to the view file, in this case viewmlt.c? i've reorganized the declarations and the mlt project file to be compliant with this system |
| 01:50.18 | brlcad | andrecastelo: there's about a dozen view*.c example rt apps that show the various call-backs you have to hook |
| 01:51.27 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, I'll look for them, thanks :) |
| 01:53.57 | brlcad | I believe a lot of it is covered in http://brlcad.org/w/images/3/3d/Application_Development.pdf too |
| 02:10.02 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yeah but it kind of confused me, because it has main() and etc. But i already solved the problem :D |
| 02:13.43 | brlcad | yeah, the part that is relevant is the "RTUIF" that it refers to , the view callbacks it refers to |
| 02:13.56 | brlcad | those are what are in your viewmlt.c file |
| 02:14.44 | brlcad | the tutorial starts from one level deeper, and also describes how to implement the rt front-end in addition to view interface |
| 02:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31288 10/brlcad/trunk/ (misc/win32-msvc9/rtmlt/rtmlt.vcproj src/rt/viewmlt.c): |
| 02:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Merged definitions from mlt_defs.h into viewmlt.c. Added functions to make |
| 02:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: viewmlt.c a rt compatible application. Added missing files (worker.c, do.c, |
| 02:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: main.c and opt.c) to win32-msvc9/rtmlt/rtmlt.vcproj. It should build correctly |
| 02:18.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: now. |
| 02:19.11 | andrecastelo | mlt_defs.h is useless now :S |
| 02:20.38 | brlcad | so remove it? |
| 02:20.51 | brlcad | nothing wrong with adding/removing as needed as it evolves :) |
| 02:20.58 | brlcad | don't forget the Makefile.am if you remove it ;) |
| 02:21.06 | andrecastelo | okay ;} |
| 02:23.21 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31289 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (Makefile.am mlt_def.h): |
| 02:23.30 | andrecastelo | :S |
| 02:24.18 | andrecastelo | brlcad: sorry, can i revert that to add a decent commit message? |
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| 03:15.35 | brlcad | andrecastelo: heh, nope -- you can never go back! |
| 03:15.48 | andrecastelo | :O |
| 03:16.40 | brlcad | if you really really want to leave a note, make a ws commit and annotate in the commit message that it is for r31289, etc |
| 03:16.41 | andrecastelo | ws commit? |
| 03:16.46 | brlcad | ~ws |
| 03:16.49 | ibot | ws is probably short for workstation. White Space, or the country code for Western Samoa |
| 03:18.10 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll do a western samoa commit ;) |
| 03:20.18 | brlcad | :) |
| 03:22.01 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31290 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: WS Commit. In the last commit (r31289), removed mlt_defs.h and edited src/rt/Makefile.am accordingly. Definitions in mlt_defs.h are now in viewmlt.c. |
| 03:30.26 | poolio | brlcad: so is src/librt restructured as you wanted now or is there still more? |
| 03:42.32 | pacman87 | so i fixed my bottom plate, but the normals are definately off |
| 03:48.15 | louipc | ~pacman |
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| 03:48.54 | pacman87 | louipc: ?? |
| 03:50.15 | louipc | just wondering what ibot had for that |
| 03:50.29 | louipc | pacman is my package manager :D |
| 03:50.43 | pacman87 | ~pacman87 |
| 03:51.19 | louipc | besides most being most popularly known as a video game |
| 03:51.30 | pacman87 | ~pacman87 |
| 03:51.30 | ibot | well, pacman87 is not a package manager |
| 03:51.38 | louipc | errr - a most |
| 03:52.09 | louipc | nope |
| 03:55.09 | brlcad | poolio: pretty much |
| 03:55.45 | brlcad | not that any restructuring should hold anyone back from coding... :) |
| 03:56.09 | IriX64 | code blue, code blue :) |
| 03:56.24 | brlcad | the idea for the brep routine, though, will be to add a cxx file to each primitive for a brep routine (similar to the nurb routine) |
| 03:56.30 | brlcad | hello IriX64 |
| 03:56.36 | IriX64 | regards |
| 03:56.40 | louipc | obama wins |
| 03:56.55 | brlcad | did you ever talk to your friend about licensing on his bolt program? |
| 03:56.58 | poolio | brlcad: jah. I just wanted to commit either the sph or cyl brep stuff, just to get an idea of where things would be going :) |
| 03:57.17 | IriX64 | is it still there? |
| 03:57.19 | brlcad | getting the subdir was the main point |
| 03:57.27 | IriX64 | haven't looked at that site lately |
| 03:57.32 | brlcad | so maybe something like xxx_brep.cpp for each |
| 03:57.40 | brlcad | IriX64: has nothing to do with the site |
| 03:57.52 | poolio | Ok. and you just want the brep() routine? |
| 03:57.54 | brlcad | you showed me a bolt creation program that he made |
| 03:58.15 | IriX64 | i *thought i got the code from clock, can't find him now |
| 03:58.22 | brlcad | no, it wasn't clock |
| 03:58.31 | IriX64 | yes it was |
| 03:59.11 | IriX64 | mmm maybe another clock? |
| 03:59.59 | brlcad | why would you insist it was? |
| 04:00.09 | brlcad | you don't even seem to remember what I'm talking about |
| 04:00.23 | IriX64 | remeber some guy going by that nick sending it to me |
| 04:00.40 | brlcad | well, clock's name isn't Jamie |
| 04:00.44 | IriX64 | pastebined it |
| 04:01.03 | IriX64 | now im confused |
| 04:01.32 | brlcad | forget it, you apparently didn't care enough to follow up |
| 04:01.34 | brlcad | i'll just delete it |
| 04:01.41 | IriX64 | sorry man |
| 04:02.25 | IriX64 | gotta test my client, want it to msg nickserv when i start up |
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| 05:28.26 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31291 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: add a tcl+itcl sanity check given how we can't build our version of incrTcl with a system 8.4 .. it's both or neither. |
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| 05:30.52 | brlcad | evenin prasad1 |
| 05:34.08 | pacman87 | success! https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt6.png |
| 05:47.09 | pacman87 | and here's a shell: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt7.png |
| 05:55.34 | pacman87 | unfortunately, i had to pull all of the generalized code, so now it only works if your main axis is aligned with Z :( |
| 05:56.01 | pacman87 | but at least it works |
| 05:56.13 | pacman87 | goodnight all |
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| 10:15.52 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:21.59 | mafm | allo |
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| 12:35.31 | brlcad | pacman87: awesome! |
| 12:36.06 | brlcad | new primitives are always exciting :) |
| 12:36.56 | brlcad | howdy mafm, how goes it? |
| 12:40.19 | mafm | tired, but other than that OK :) |
| 12:53.08 | mafm | do you support "make distclean"? |
| 12:53.26 | mafm | it's starting to configure things before removing them |
| 13:05.27 | brlcad | yes, of course |
| 13:06.09 | brlcad | whether it has to configure before cleaning depends on the dependency tracking and edit states of files (timestamps) |
| 13:06.39 | brlcad | if you did an svn update, it would have to regenerate and rerun configure before it could perform the clean |
| 13:07.33 | brlcad | automake design, not our doing |
| 13:07.38 | alex_joni | that "bites" sometimes.. it's always best to do an distclean before updating |
| 13:08.22 | alex_joni | (if there was a long period of time since the last update.. and lots of infrastructure changes) |
| 13:09.25 | brlcad | the faster more general rule I usually suggest is if you see configure.ac or any Makefile.am get updated, run: sh autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all && make clean && make |
| 13:09.55 | brlcad | that'll generally complete more quickly and reliably than trying to force a distclean, and should give the same result |
| 13:10.19 | brlcad | since distclean can actually fail under some update/edit situations |
| 13:15.48 | brlcad | once you get more familiar with what the Makefile's are doing and how the timestamp updates work, you can get away with the localized depcomp rebuilds and automatic reconfigurate |
| 13:16.06 | brlcad | but few get to the level of understanding ;) |
| 13:16.32 | mafm | not very likely, yep :D |
| 13:16.41 | mafm | was cmake considered? |
| 13:16.45 | brlcad | sure |
| 13:16.55 | brlcad | it's used for some of the windows build |
| 13:17.13 | brlcad | to redo the entire build system with it though is a pretty big effort |
| 13:18.06 | ``Erik | cmake adds a new end user dependancy, no? |
| 13:18.14 | brlcad | with pretty minimal payoff -- what we have works and works rather well, robust, familiar, etc, just painful to the autotool newbies (which tend to be in the minority) |
| 13:18.32 | brlcad | yeah, it's not nearly as prevalent |
| 13:19.04 | mafm | I meant mostly as it seems to reduce compilation times, not sure if that is an issue for devels |
| 13:19.10 | ``Erik | yeah, I think we have two "guru" grade automake weenies (if I'm allowed to claim that for myself, heh) who'll fix the newbs mistakes if they're hacking |
| 13:19.24 | brlcad | nah, that's a petty benefit frankly |
| 13:19.31 | ``Erik | good structuring of an automake system will be pretty damn quick |
| 13:19.33 | brlcad | compilation time is dominated by the machine |
| 13:19.52 | ``Erik | I'm tempted to flatten the src/adrt directory for the half second speed boost O>o |
| 13:19.53 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 13:20.26 | ``Erik | (also; we have "make fast" which speeds things up a fair amount... gmake -sj13 fast) |
| 13:21.20 | mafm | well dunno, but it takes something like 5 minutes to run "configure" on my system |
| 13:21.37 | ``Erik | what is your system? the only thing I've seen close to that slow is windows O.o |
| 13:21.38 | brlcad | we'd have to do those same checks with cmake |
| 13:21.43 | brlcad | that problem doesn't go away |
| 13:21.55 | mafm | amd64, 1gb ram, 2 years old |
| 13:21.57 | brlcad | it's just not called a "configure" script |
| 13:22.29 | ``Erik | OS is a bigger impact, I think |
| 13:22.59 | ``Erik | windows is ass slow, fbsd is smoking fast, linux is almost as fast as fbsd, mac is somewhere between bsd/linux and windows |
| 13:23.04 | mafm | Debian GNU/Linux, random :P version |
| 13:23.38 | brlcad | it's I/O intense, if you have slow OS or slow disks, it'll be teh suck |
| 13:23.39 | ``Erik | weird, does it have any obvious stall points? or are you feeding it funny options? mebbe if you "export CFLAGS=-pipe" ? |
| 13:24.47 | brlcad | suspects a bit of exaggeration too, probably closer to 3 minutes on that system |
| 13:25.18 | brlcad | it reports the time, how long exactly? |
| 13:25.21 | ``Erik | "time sh configure" :) |
| 13:25.29 | brlcad | it's in the summary |
| 13:25.41 | ``Erik | how's the conf, burly? just one big win paper so far? |
| 13:26.32 | ``Erik | hrm, hendrix (manic depressive) into old soundgarden (jesus christ pose)... my computer wants me to be active today O.o |
| 13:30.42 | brlcad | there have been several really good papers and posters |
| 13:31.39 | mafm | I'm not doing anything special... it might not even be 5 minutes but instead 2, dunno |
| 13:32.26 | mafm | some of the projects where I worked recommended a full clean build every morning, and things like these are time-consuming, but that's not the case for all projects of course ;) |
| 13:32.29 | brlcad | there was another good one yesterday that dealt with extracting an implicit model from CT scan data for capturing blood vessels, neural connectivity, and other "tube networks" from a friend down at Texas A&M |
| 13:33.01 | ``Erik | <-- tries to avoid touching configure.ac or primary headers as much as possible to avoid that step |
| 13:33.08 | brlcad | mafm: those instructions are recommended only to those that don't learn how the tools work but just use them as tools |
| 13:33.17 | ``Erik | that's why I tend to be conservative about changing or adding directories :) |
| 13:33.24 | brlcad | you can get away with much much faster rebuild times if/when you know when you really need to do what |
| 13:34.33 | ``Erik | (also; 3/(24*60) isn't that big) |
| 13:35.13 | mafm | Elapsed configuration time ...........: 1 minute, 4 seconds <- plus unknown time generating makefiles |
| 13:35.18 | brlcad | heh |
| 13:35.37 | brlcad | that includes makefile generation time |
| 13:35.58 | mafm | hmm? it starts to generate them after that |
| 13:36.19 | ``Erik | then try "time sh configure" ? |
| 13:36.56 | mafm | http://rafb.net/p/xYG7fn39.html |
| 13:37.07 | mafm | ok there I go ``Erik |
| 13:37.41 | ``Erik | <-- thinks it's a non-issue *shrug* |
| 13:38.11 | ``Erik | better integration with system tcl/tk/[incr]/etc would be a more useful build "optimization" |
| 13:45.24 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874E03.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:46.45 | brlcad | or realizaing it's less than 1% of a given workday and instead optimizing something that is more likely going to make a more significant impact ;) |
| 13:47.02 | ``Erik | neat http://media.threadless.com//product/282/zoom.gif |
| 13:47.28 | brlcad | you probably spend more time going to the bathroom, you'd save more time "holding it" ;) |
| 13:47.44 | ``Erik | uhm, 0.06944% :) |
| 13:47.58 | ``Erik | of a 24 hour period, anyways |
| 13:48.46 | brlcad | ~3.0/(8*60) |
| 13:48.46 | ibot | 0.00625 |
| 13:48.56 | brlcad | even for an 8 hour |
| 13:49.30 | ``Erik | wonders if he can concoct a horrible command to embed a simple lisp interpreter in ibot O.o :> |
| 13:49.42 | brlcad | this discussion was enough time to run configure more than 20 times over :) |
| 13:49.59 | ``Erik | that'd be a hell of a hack, and I imagine I have things to do that other people consider far more important O:-) |
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| 13:50.52 | brlcad | multitasks listening to a guy talk about extracting the hippocampus automatically from brain scan data |
| 13:51.36 | ``Erik | wants to keep his hippopatumus in his brain for the time being O.o not ready for mgmt training (matter removal) |
| 13:52.37 | ``Erik | laptops can be dangerous at conferences, I got bored at vis/vast and wrote a trivial raytracer... I got bored at javaone and, uh, read lots of webcomics I think |
| 13:53.49 | archivist | hmm brain removal is that CAZ computer aided zombies |
| 13:53.58 | clock_ | lol |
| 13:54.10 | clock_ | And Jay Adams is DAZ. Drug Aided Zombies. |
| 13:54.25 | ``Erik | heh, amusingly, I saw "shaun of the dead" last weekend :D must just be a zombie week |
| 13:55.10 | ``Erik | so it looks like clinton isn't going to make it to the primaries |
| 13:55.38 | clock_ | ``Erik: how can the mankind appreciate a trivial raytracer when the Military-Industrial Complex has brought us the ultimate non-trivial raytracer, BRL-CAD? |
| 13:55.45 | clock_ | I hope Obama makes it |
| 13:56.00 | clock_ | He's attractive and he's a minority. |
| 13:56.31 | ``Erik | uhm, I can appreciate generating images from a model file after an hour of coding from scratch? |
| 13:56.44 | louipc | I hears something about hilary wanting to be VP |
| 13:57.02 | clock_ | Who has better chances Obama or McCain? |
| 13:57.03 | ``Erik | I wrote a pong game (in one day), too, is that completely useless because other people have written better ones? |
| 13:57.05 | ``Erik | :) |
| 13:57.26 | louipc | that might be a smart move if what they say about people dropping Hilary for McCain is true |
| 13:57.34 | louipc | or dropping Obama |
| 13:57.50 | clock_ | they shouldn't drop Obama Obama has nice thick lips |
| 13:57.52 | louipc | ``Erik: fun exercise? |
| 13:58.00 | clock_ | Sorry for being superficial but aren't the US voters as well? |
| 13:58.10 | louipc | dunno |
| 13:58.38 | clock_ | We need to destroy the terror with all available force |
| 13:59.07 | clock_ | Who's not with us is against us (oh yeah isn't the guy in the TV right?) |
| 13:59.09 | ``Erik | with the choice between a woman and a black man on the democratic ticket, a lot of bigots are going to cement their vote on the white guy :/ (but it seems to me that the bigots tent to vote republican, anyways, so mebbe it won't be a big factor) |
| 13:59.33 | ``Erik | s/tent/tend/ |
| 13:59.39 | clock_ | what does bigot mean? I know bigotry is something bad, but not sure what it actually is |
| 14:00.17 | clock_ | Obama's trousers should accidentally drop in some TV show |
| 14:00.23 | clock_ | Then he would get the women |
| 14:00.29 | clock_ | the women's votes |
| 14:00.48 | louipc | haha |
| 14:00.50 | ``Erik | the US is far too repressive and anti-sex for that |
| 14:01.06 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:01.06 | clock_ | McCain would then try as well but he would lose all the women |
| 14:01.17 | louipc | wardrobe malfunction eh? |
| 14:01.35 | ``Erik | well, no matter what, it'll be a step up... how can you go DOWN from bush? :> |
| 14:01.37 | ``Erik | *duck* |
| 14:01.41 | mafm | times: http://rafb.net/p/Re3Sxc27.html |
| 14:01.58 | louipc | we could dig up stalin |
| 14:02.27 | clock_ | They say Obama spent his childhood and adolescence in Honolulu |
| 14:02.31 | clock_ | I wonder if he can surf |
| 14:02.32 | ``Erik | heh, sibera, guantanamo, whatever :) |
| 14:02.56 | clock_ | I hope if he's a president he requests the CIA torture manuals |
| 14:03.09 | louipc | mafm: how about the make? |
| 14:03.10 | clock_ | and changes "waterboarding" to "wakeboarding" |
| 14:03.45 | ``Erik | mafm: I don't think you're taking the cache abilities into consideration with your timing... also; you've spent way more time worrying about it than a month of just doing it in regular dev mode :) |
| 14:07.05 | ``Erik | http://rafb.net/p/Re3Sxc27.html |
| 14:07.11 | ``Erik | bleh, mouse puke |
| 14:07.25 | ``Erik | http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/funny-pictures-anteater-debugged-laptop.jpg |
| 14:07.27 | ``Erik | there we go :) |
| 14:10.16 | mafm | louipc: make is in the making |
| 14:10.47 | louipc | holy anteater |
| 14:13.11 | ``Erik | organic debugger :) |
| 14:13.31 | mafm | ``Erik: I'm not worrying about that... I just asked if you had though about cmake or something similar alternative, for me it has a lot of advantages but that's not the point :) |
| 14:13.42 | mafm | and I'm running the time tests just because you asked |
| 14:15.25 | ``Erik | we've talked about cmake, a couple other "new" build systems, if you check out an older version, it uses one called "cake", but automake was picked up because it was better than cake for handling diverse platforms with minimal developer concern, ubiquitous and "standard", and we had solid knowledge of it *shrug* BRL-CAD only went auto* 4.5 years ago, converting it was my second task :) |
| 14:20.10 | mafm | I see |
| 14:27.48 | mafm | same old error :S http://rafb.net/p/8K7VU536.html |
| 14:28.56 | ``Erik | sh configure --enable-all --enable-optimized --prefix=/place/it/goes |
| 14:29.43 | brlcad | the refree error is not fixed without --enable-all yet |
| 14:29.53 | ``Erik | afaik, the issue is with funky cpp paths, it's picking up $(top_srcdir)/src/other/tcl/generic/regex.h when it SHOULD be getting /usr/include/regex.h |
| 14:40.57 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, I'd agree that it has several advantages, just performances is a minor one in the big scheme of things .. the biggest is a unified build environment that spans to windows |
| 14:41.47 | brlcad | i wouldn't mind cmake if someone actually fully duplicated our current build system in it .. but I just don't see that happening anytime soon, it'd be weeks of full-time effort if not more |
| 14:42.14 | mafm | same error, maybe I should make clean before reconfiguring with --enable-all? |
| 14:42.26 | brlcad | yeah, have to make clean |
| 14:42.50 | brlcad | Tcl_ReFree is an unresolved symbol.. meaning you have a .o object file somewhere with references to it |
| 14:43.09 | brlcad | so just running make again doesn't invalidate that .o |
| 14:43.14 | ``Erik | (if you know which files, you can just remove the specific .o and .lo files, but it's easier to just make clean) |
| 14:43.35 | brlcad | from make's perspective, there's nothing to do |
| 14:45.33 | mafm | it's librt, but after removing it complained about the file not being present, so I just issued the make clean |
| 14:46.14 | brlcad | that all boils down to learning what the tools are doing :) |
| 14:46.25 | brlcad | there actually is deterministic behavior, but it takes a while to learn the tools |
| 15:29.31 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31292 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/adrt.h: bump (c) info |
| 15:31.25 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31293 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (load.c load.h slave.c): use a struct instead of indexing a void* |
| 15:34.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31294 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/adrt_struct.h: use a struct instead of indexing a void* |
| 15:34.06 | ``Erik | yeah, helps if I commit the struct I'm using, too |
| 15:55.21 | pacman87 | getting there: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt8.png |
| 15:55.35 | pacman87 | time to go fix my normals again |
| 15:57.01 | starseeker | nice! |
| 15:57.36 | starseeker | should finish up mucking with nirt and do something cool like a new primitive... |
| 16:07.49 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt9.png |
| 16:09.00 | pacman87 | now i have to figure out the new primitive file structure so i can commit |
| 16:09.08 | starseeker | Cooooool :-) |
| 16:10.07 | pacman87 | i had to pull all of the speed enhancements and start over, so prep() is pretty useless atm |
| 16:21.59 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 16:22.01 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.54.154) | |
| 16:23.10 | brlcad | pacman87: how about elliptical caps? |
| 16:24.09 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo_ |
| 16:29.01 | brlcad | pacman87: there was a pretty decent paper on sweeps about an hour ago, I'll see if I can get it to you :) |
| 16:40.16 | PrezKennedy | howdy brlcad |
| 16:48.01 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 16:58.02 | mafm | I guess that I should put my code in a different directory... any suggestion? |
| 17:14.19 | pacman87 | brlcad: elliptical caps: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt10.png |
| 17:18.49 | pacman87 | one question: how are tangent hits counted? is the same point used for seg_in and seg_out? |
| 17:22.23 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.54.154) | |
| 17:30.36 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad, what's up? |
| 17:32.09 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 17:32.14 | andrecastelo | howdy ``Erik :) |
| 17:38.37 | brlcad | mafm: yours is probably the most "distinct" given the external dependencies it's going to require |
| 17:38.59 | brlcad | pacman87: hah, you're on a roll :) |
| 17:39.14 | brlcad | that's pretty f'n sweet |
| 17:39.49 | pacman87 | only at that view though, other angles are giving me flipped normals |
| 17:41.33 | mafm | so... src/weirdo then? :) |
| 17:44.31 | brlcad | so... maybe not in the same module, gimme a min to rummage |
| 17:45.54 | starseeker | spots what might be another nirt bug and gets out his sledgehammer... |
| 17:49.00 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31295 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/adrt.h: screw the 'version year'? how about just say what adrt means |
| 18:00.15 | starseeker | looks at direct_output, decides it is raising too many questions , and decides to add it to the bug list... |
| 18:01.59 | brlcad | nirt cmd line example against one of the db g's would be useful |
| 18:03.59 | starseeker | of the bug? |
| 18:04.01 | starseeker | can do... |
| 18:05.41 | brlcad | finally! .. found a way to reproduce the _TclReFree error from here for non-enable-all |
| 18:06.46 | mafm | w00t |
| 18:09.22 | starseeker | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d64313679 |
| 18:09.36 | starseeker | that's the first issue... |
| 18:09.48 | starseeker | the second didn't reproduce, so maybe it's not an issue after all... |
| 18:10.06 | brlcad | you mean the "file test.cs is" ? |
| 18:10.12 | starseeker | yep |
| 18:10.20 | starseeker | it ate the last charater |
| 18:10.20 | brlcad | off-by-one somewhere |
| 18:10.28 | starseeker | oh, it gets better |
| 18:10.32 | ``Erik | <-- pats his belly |
| 18:10.34 | brlcad | probably strcpy |
| 18:10.41 | starseeker | if you type dest default (no space) you get back stdout |
| 18:10.44 | brlcad | er strlcpy |
| 18:11.12 | starseeker | if you do it WITH the space, you get a file called default |
| 18:11.54 | brlcad | same problem |
| 18:11.56 | starseeker | could it be the original authors intended that you would have to have a space after a name? |
| 18:12.17 | starseeker | thought dest default without space would create a file called defaul |
| 18:12.28 | brlcad | default == defaul vs "default " == default |
| 18:12.43 | brlcad | yeah, so it's probably a copy happening between those two checks |
| 18:12.43 | starseeker | but default doesn't == defaul |
| 18:12.48 | starseeker | it equals stdout |
| 18:13.06 | brlcad | so it does the strcmp before it gets trimmed |
| 18:13.13 | starseeker | ah |
| 18:13.31 | starseeker | digs a bit... |
| 18:13.36 | brlcad | otherwise, no .. no way needing a space was intended |
| 18:13.59 | brlcad | in face the command interpreter should trim all whitespace |
| 18:14.07 | brlcad | (should but probably doesn't) |
| 18:15.05 | prasad1 | brlcad, where are u? |
| 18:15.13 | brlcad | new york |
| 18:15.26 | brlcad | long island |
| 18:16.03 | prasad1 | sig conference? |
| 18:22.57 | brlcad | acm solid and physical modeling (spm) just ended, now starts ieee international conference on shape modeling (smi) |
| 18:23.13 | brlcad | joint conference |
| 18:24.27 | brlcad | spm was pretty cool .. the second best paper was a fast implementation of nurbs surface-on-surface evaluation as well as fast xyz to uv mapping |
| 18:24.43 | brlcad | (which is what I'm currently working on) |
| 18:24.55 | starseeker | sweeet |
| 18:25.57 | brlcad | will need a few days to get through just the top half-dozen most interesting/useful papers |
| 18:28.42 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31296 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/ (tie_define.h tie_kdtree.c): Move some macros around, eliminate some others... |
| 18:30.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31297 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: nirt's dest command was chopping off the last character in the filename string |
| 18:30.13 | starseeker | got it |
| 18:30.33 | starseeker | looks like it isn't trimming whitespace at the end, just at the beginning... should probably fix that |
| 18:32.14 | brlcad | yep |
| 18:32.45 | brlcad | if you have a vls, there is a bu_vls_trimwhitespace |
| 18:32.55 | brlcad | er, bu_vls_trimspace() |
| 18:33.10 | starseeker | wishes he had vls... |
| 18:33.22 | starseeker | nirt didn't seem to like vls much |
| 18:33.34 | starseeker | I suppose it didn't exist when it was written or some such? |
| 18:34.03 | brlcad | possible, they're both pretty old |
| 18:34.22 | brlcad | sometimes just devs that don't know about the available facilities |
| 18:34.30 | starseeker | could be |
| 18:34.48 | brlcad | it is a big package after all, you only know what you encounter unless you go looking for something specific |
| 18:35.29 | brlcad | and most resist at first because it's a simple operation to "just do it" yourself |
| 18:35.40 | brlcad | only recent that some of the facilities were even documented in HACKING |
| 18:35.50 | brlcad | just knowledge one acquires |
| 18:35.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31298 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: fix mlt_hit prototype |
| 18:36.28 | starseeker | yep. It hurts most in the file-reading side of things - this I can probably throw in a quick hack for now and vls-ify later |
| 18:38.05 | starseeker | checking for whitespace isn't too hard, fortunately... |
| 18:41.08 | brlcad | yeah, something like while(isspace(*cp)) cp++; while(isspace(cp[strlen(cp)-1])) cp[strlen(cp)-1] = '\0'; |
| 18:41.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31299 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Add code to prevent raytrace control panel being destroyed by user. Decactive panel instead of destroy. |
| 18:42.04 | starseeker | ah nice |
| 18:42.26 | starseeker | oh yeah - heh |
| 18:42.35 | starseeker | managed to hard crash his mac yesterday with archer |
| 18:42.46 | brlcad | neat |
| 18:44.02 | starseeker | really likes archer as compared to mged - maybe libged will help bring it closer to feature parity with mged... |
| 18:47.27 | starseeker | crud - what's the opposite of Ctrl-s on the command line |
| 18:47.57 | starseeker | At, nevermind - Ctrl-Q |
| 18:48.11 | starseeker | Ctrl-q ratjer |
| 18:48.13 | starseeker | rather |
| 18:50.26 | brlcad | interesting conference .. every single attendee has a laptop at the moment |
| 18:51.11 | pacman87 | brlcad: take a picture |
| 18:55.05 | brlcad | heh, alas no camera for the lighting or good view to capture everyone |
| 19:00.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31300 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: Add quick fix to avoid whitespace at the end of a name - this whole function (OK, most of nirt) should be reworked to use vls at some point. |
| 19:07.46 | starseeker | notes the problem with documenting tools is that you keep having to fix the tool to do what it is supposed to do... |
| 19:10.18 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.196.26) | |
| 19:10.35 | starseeker | good for the tool though... |
| 19:13.15 | mafm | going home now, see you tomorrow |
| 19:22.23 | brlcad | yep, maintenance burden .. that's (part of) why there is a lot of consideration when adopting a new external dependency |
| 19:22.36 | brlcad | those are things you can't easily fix or maintain |
| 19:23.11 | brlcad | and the importance of refactoring the bigger the project gets (for BRL-CAD it's huge never-ending requirement) |
| 19:29.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31301 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: If parentClass is not set, set it to Toplevel regardless of platform. |
| 19:39.08 | starseeker | decides to see if the archer changes avoid the hard crash... |
| 19:39.45 | brlcad | starseeker: is it user-visible? |
| 19:40.14 | starseeker | you mean the dest fix? I suppose so in the sense that if someone tries it they'll get the correct filename now... |
| 19:40.27 | brlcad | i.e. did a release go out with that bug in the last release |
| 19:40.38 | starseeker | almost certainly |
| 19:40.51 | brlcad | the it "almost certainly" .. |
| 19:41.02 | starseeker | the it? |
| 19:41.10 | starseeker | parse error ;-) |
| 19:41.23 | brlcad | then it "almost certainly" .. deserves a note |
| 19:41.28 | starseeker | gotcha |
| 19:41.50 | brlcad | would be good quick sanity check to be certain |
| 19:42.22 | starseeker | k. I've been needing to build a release tarball for comparision purposes anyway... |
| 19:53.07 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54874E03.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 19:53.44 | brlcad | or find a machine with a /usr/brlcad installed |
| 19:54.26 | brlcad | probably did make the release, the string clamping changes happened recently, but before the last release |
| 19:56.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31302 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bio.h: account for badness in the Tcl regex header. for this to work, bio.h has to come after the include for regex.h of course, but then regex.h is a system header so it should be before bio.h regardless. |
| 19:57.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31303 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/regionfix.c: regex.h is a system header, include it before bio.h |
| 20:01.30 | brlcad | there, that should fix the tcl_refree error |
| 20:01.41 | starseeker | does happy dance |
| 20:03.26 | starseeker | Yep, it's in 7.12.4 |
| 20:03.46 | starseeker | updates news file, then gets back to attempting to crash the mac... |
| 20:07.03 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31304 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Fixed nirt's dest command to use the full supplied filename string instead of chopping off the last character - whitespace is also handled after the string as well as before. |
| 20:08.53 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 20:08.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31305 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: check for strcasecmp so BLT has it properly defined, avoid duplicate symbols at link time |
| 21:16.21 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 21:39.50 | pacman87 | another pretty picture: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt12.png |
| 21:46.45 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-94-220.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:46.51 | pacman87 | hi clock_ |
| 21:48.46 | clock_ | gu] |
| 21:48.48 | clock_ | hi |
| 21:52.50 | andrecastelo | pacman87: looking really good! nearly finished with the hyperboloid? |
| 21:53.03 | pacman87 | well, rt from within mged still fails |
| 21:53.12 | pacman87 | and i still need tess() and curve() |
| 21:53.19 | pacman87 | but it's getting there :) |
| 21:54.56 | andrecastelo | in this pace you will finish the whole gsoc project before the end of june! :D |
| 21:55.47 | pacman87 | it's been a week and a half, and the revolve/sweep will be a lot more math-heavy |
| 22:03.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31306 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: prep(), shot(), and norm() updated: moved most of the calculations from prep() to shot() in order to insure correctness, and updated norm() to account for the changed private data stored in the hitpoint |
| 22:03.42 | pacman87 | now everyone can play with it! |
| 22:15.58 | pacman87 | rt is wrong in the very specific case when you're viewing from 45 degrees off of the main axis in the direction of of the major axis of the ellipse |
| 22:18.07 | andrecastelo | (typo at line 22?) |
| 22:28.22 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 22:29.58 | andrecastelo | howdy ``Erik |
| 22:30.25 | ``Erik | how's it going, andre? |
| 22:30.53 | andrecastelo | i'm happy viewmlt.c is now working together with main.c and the other rtuif files :) |
| 22:31.51 | ``Erik | yeah, gotta get a grid set up and start doing your bidirectional work now :) |
| 22:32.05 | andrecastelo | yup |
| 22:32.46 | ``Erik | uhm, for saving files, I added nifty capabilities in libbu (image.c), but the only rt to use it right now is uhm, viewedge.c... or you can dump straight pix and it'll get cleaned up later |
| 22:35.52 | andrecastelo | hmm i see.. interesting.. it will be nice if i can test the bidirectional work as i go, instead of going blindly, right? |
| 22:36.14 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: good catch on the typo, thanks. |
| 22:36.49 | andrecastelo | pacman87: np, didn't want to mess with the file you're working on |
| 22:37.12 | andrecastelo | (that's why i didn't committed immediately etc) |
| 22:37.15 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31307 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: change group to primitives and file to hyp.c |
| 22:37.23 | pacman87 | the group needed changing too |
| 22:37.55 | pacman87 | wait, i still didnt fix the typo :( |
| 22:38.34 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: the grid you're talking about, is the final image matrix? |
| 22:38.47 | ``Erik | yeah, it IS nice to have immediate feedback |
| 22:38.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31308 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: typo fix, thanks andrecastelo |
| 22:39.31 | ``Erik | every pixel in the output image has at least one primary ray shot from it, ya gotta set up the initial ray information (with appropriate matrix-fu) |
| 22:43.51 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i see.. the ray information will be set in the application structure, depending on the run, something like that? taking turns between a pixel and a light source? |
| 22:44.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31309 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewedge.c: Fixed typo in a comment section (algorythm -> algorithm). |
| 23:02.05 | ``Erik | that's up to you, andre |
| 23:02.46 | ``Erik | heh, I just updated and did a double-take at viewedge.c being updated before looking at irc :D rtedge needs some major reworking |
| 23:05.58 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hm, what about something like an adapted view_pixel()? it would do something like this - pick the first pixel, set the origin of the ray to the camera, shoot the ray, record the points; set the origin of the ray to the light source, shoot a ray and record hit points; then test if this is an acceptable path |
| 23:06.35 | andrecastelo | (like not going through a wall or not connecting properly, still need to put a little more thought in this) |
| 23:07.32 | andrecastelo | then, if it is a good path, save the path, and mutate the pixels, adding the contribution of this path to the image |
| 23:07.48 | andrecastelo | (iterating through all the pixels) |
| 23:08.14 | andrecastelo | after that, mutate a point in the path.. then calculate the contribution of this path to all pixels |
| 23:08.23 | andrecastelo | what do you think? |
| 23:09.33 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:13.02 | andrecastelo | brb |
| 23:23.41 | ``Erik | oi, twingy |
| 23:24.43 | ``Erik | andre, I actually don't know the algorithm well enough to comment on that... I can look it up tomorrow, but what I'm primarily providing for you is knowledge of BRL-CAD, C and general project management :) |
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| 00:15.22 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31310 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: uncomment code in shot() to fix problem when raytracing from 45 degrees off of the height vector towards the major axis of the ellipse |
| 00:16.26 | pacman87 | raytracing from command line should be perfect now |
| 00:17.38 | pacman87 | but i have no clue why rt from within mged fails |
| 00:46.56 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: sorry for the delay, had to take care of some things :S |
| 00:49.24 | andrecastelo | i've been taking a look at main.c and the file parsing will be done there, i'll study how the info about the file should be passed from main.c to viewmlt.c |
| 01:10.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31311 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/do.c: Fixed a typo in a comment section, at line 720, automaticly -> automatically. |
| 01:23.50 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i have a doubt - here in do.c (line 768), view_2init receives 2 parameters, but in viewdummy.c and in the application development pdf, view_2init has only one parameter - struct application.. so, why is it different in do.c ? |
| 01:59.29 | starseeker | raises eyebrows at via's openbook CAD files for a laptop case |
| 02:02.20 | starseeker | Ah, foo - they're proe |
| 02:08.29 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:11.25 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 02:26.40 | andrecastelo | wb ``Erik :D |
| 04:10.44 | brlcad | andrecastelo: technically, the callback has two parameters, but most of the rtuif apps don't use the second one (framename) |
| 04:12.12 | brlcad | so if you want to be correct, you can/should add the second parameter .. could add it to all of them -- only three of the dozen or so have it |
| 04:12.51 | brlcad | even more interesting would be to put it to use in all of them in some useful way |
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| 04:18.18 | brlcad | pacman87: does rt from various -a -e work? other than invoking the installed rt, all that's different from within mged is that it passes the active view |
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| 08:49.27 | d_rossberg | ``Erik: your change on rt_functab makes the brlcad.dll interface incompatible to previous versions, i.e. it won't work with my viewer any more |
| 09:26.32 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:27.03 | mafm | hai |
| 09:27.22 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i see.. what about the grid setup - i've been taking a look and it seems it is done in do.c and worker.c, how does/should it link to viewmlt.c ? |
| 09:27.30 | andrecastelo | oh hai, mafm! |
| 09:29.05 | mafm | méquié! |
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| 12:11.56 | brlcad | d_rossberg: ahh, I wondered about that |
| 12:18.21 | brlcad | i'll undo it, but it'll have to change for the other callbacks that get added at some point too -- maybe for 7.14 |
| 12:22.01 | d_rossberg | brlcad: my viewer isn't BRL-CAD's main application but what about your customers? they have to recompile their applications too |
| 12:22.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31312 10/brlcad/trunk/ (TODO doc/deprecation.txt include/raytrace.h): |
| 12:22.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: undo the size change to rt_functab's ft_label element in order to preserve |
| 12:22.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: binary compatibility with previous release, but leave deprecation notices in |
| 12:22.45 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: place so it can be changed eventually since it will need to. fortunately |
| 12:22.46 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: ft_label didn't need to grow, but there will need to be new callbacks soon. |
| 12:24.46 | brlcad | d_rossberg: it's a valid important point -- it's more just a matter of how and when the changes occur |
| 12:26.44 | brlcad | our "main customer" performs synchronized releases with us, so for them it's not an issue -- it's more a problem for all the rest of our customers, though, so good to keep track of (and avoid if we can) |
| 12:27.25 | brlcad | for rt_functab, I've actually wanted to remove that table altogether, at least it's exposure as a public callback container |
| 12:27.44 | d_rossberg | i got the problem with the RT_HIT_NORMAL macro |
| 12:28.05 | d_rossberg | it uses the ft_normal callback |
| 12:28.49 | brlcad | nods |
| 12:28.57 | d_rossberg | BTW: i was able to display a hyp in my viewer :) |
| 12:30.18 | d_rossberg | it isn't perfect yet, but it's well on the way |
| 12:32.27 | brlcad | heh, cool :) |
| 12:32.49 | brlcad | he is making great progress, I'm excited |
| 12:33.38 | brlcad | there was a good paper at this conference I'm at about performing sweeps that (after he finishes hyp) I'll see if I can get to him |
| 12:34.50 | brlcad | it was an interesting application trying to form smooth sweep paths for hearing aid devices that have a tiny pressure canal that gets swept through |
| 12:38.33 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31313 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: the echos were unintentional debug, removed |
| 12:39.34 | d_rossberg | can this paper be included in the documentation on the brlcad web site? |
| 12:41.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31314 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: primitives are one level deep in their own dir now |
| 12:44.01 | mafm | brlcad: did you think about the place for my code yet? |
| 12:45.25 | brlcad | d_rossberg: portions of it probably could, would have to contact the author for the whole thing |
| 12:45.42 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, remind me in a bit :) |
| 12:46.43 | mafm | ok |
| 13:02.44 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.200.136) | |
| 13:20.11 | ``Erik | heh,brlcad beat me to the fix :) |
| 13:20.31 | ``Erik | wonders if changing those to bu_vls would be overkill |
| 13:34.53 | starseeker | ``Erik: you mean nirt? well, maybe - it seems cleaner though |
| 13:54.53 | ``Erik | I meant the raytrace.h issue, actually |
| 13:55.01 | ``Erik | the strings in the functab |
| 13:56.45 | ``Erik | /t BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling - Do Not Fold, Spindle, or Mutilate. |
| 13:56.48 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 14:07.22 | ``Erik | how do you bury an old programmer? |
| 14:07.34 | ``Erik | face down, nine edge first |
| 14:10.10 | pacman87 | brlcad: ae works from command line. "./src/rt/rt -a 45 -e 30 ~/brlcad/test/hyp-test.g grp.g" gives http://brlcad.org/wiki/Image:Rt_hyp.png |
| 14:11.37 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: what "isn't perfect" about hyp in your viewer? tess() and curve() are still stubs, if that makes a difference |
| 14:11.42 | ``Erik | neat |
| 14:12.32 | ``Erik | are your hyperbaloids solid? like, do you have a plate thickness on them or are they naturally solid and you're doing subtractions? |
| 14:12.42 | pacman87 | the flat elliptical endplates were boring, so i made shells from subtraction |
| 14:12.55 | ``Erik | ok, cool :) |
| 14:13.25 | ``Erik | now for the scary part; can they be modified in mged with the "sed" command? :D |
| 14:13.40 | pacman87 | hmm, haven't tried |
| 14:13.49 | ``Erik | that was the hardest part when I added metaballs, edsol.c is... interesting. |
| 14:14.16 | pacman87 | i havent' changed edsol.c, so your answer is probably no |
| 14:15.55 | pacman87 | mged> sed h.s |
| 14:15.55 | pacman87 | mged> rt_nul_xform unimplemented |
| 14:15.55 | pacman87 | transform_editing_solid failed to apply a matrix transform, aborting |
| 14:16.11 | pacman87 | so, not yet :) |
| 14:16.18 | ``Erik | src/mged/edsol.c is where most of that is |
| 14:16.48 | ``Erik | at least your primitive doesn't have a dynamic amount of information like pipes and metaballs do :) |
| 14:17.42 | d_rossberg | pacman87: the hyps aren't solid: they look ok from the side but not from the top |
| 14:19.19 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: could you post a screenshot? |
| 14:19.55 | d_rossberg | let me see ... |
| 14:20.00 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt13.png |
| 14:20.06 | pacman87 | that's what mine looks like |
| 14:27.04 | d_rossberg | http://ftp.brlcad.org/hyp_1.png |
| 14:28.05 | pacman87 | that's a 404 |
| 14:29.22 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/~rossberg/hyp_1.png |
| 14:29.32 | d_rossberg | sorry: http://ftp.brlcad.org/~rossberg/hyp_1.png |
| 14:29.58 | brlcad | notes that the ftp. is no longer needed now that the site is migrated |
| 14:30.37 | d_rossberg | checks ... ... ... ok |
| 14:31.07 | d_rossberg | from top: http://ftp.brlcad.org/~rossberg/hyp_2.png |
| 14:34.21 | d_rossberg | from the side: http://brlcad.org/~rossberg/hyp_3.png |
| 14:34.44 | d_rossberg | and a rearly nice one: http://brlcad.org/~rossberg/hyp_4.png |
| 14:40.36 | andrecastelo | morning everyone |
| 14:41.15 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 14:41.24 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad :D |
| 14:44.09 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@208.43.126.194) | |
| 14:44.58 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 14:45.14 | ``Erik | it's migrated already? |
| 14:45.27 | prasad_ | u guys lose power up there? |
| 14:45.34 | prasad_ | yesterday |
| 14:45.46 | brlcad | it migrated a couple months ago when the new website went live |
| 14:46.02 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31315 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/librt/librt.vcproj: torus/torus.c is now tor/tor.c, updated librt.vcproj. |
| 14:46.04 | ``Erik | no, had a good bit of rain briefly, but power both at work and home stayed up |
| 14:48.42 | ``Erik | zomfgwtff |
| 14:53.45 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@h-72-245-122-226.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 15:06.35 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31316 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libutil/Makefile.am: move camera.[ch] to EXTRA_DIST since it's an empty file |
| 15:09.05 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31317 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (10 files in 5 dirs): remove (unused/inconsistent) "magic endian" support, will move to standard endian handling down the road. |
| 15:11.28 | brlcad | mafm: what is your build environment? (OS, compiler, etc) |
| 15:13.43 | ``Erik | ponders migrating his personal CVS stuff to subversion |
| 15:17.12 | ``Erik | ponders getting the blanket out of his car and taking a nap under his desk O.o :D |
| 15:18.53 | clock_ | brlcad: aren't you a relative to a singer from the Doors? |
| 15:21.05 | mafm | brlcad: Debian, GCC 4.2/3 |
| 15:23.11 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31318 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (COPYING Doxyfile NEWS): These go away now. |
| 15:23.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31319 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/Makefile.am: take removed files out of EXTRA_DIST |
| 15:25.12 | mafm | brlcad: why? |
| 15:27.41 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 15:27.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31320 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: logic fix in shot() to avoid an incorrect third hitpoint, fixes the endcap problem d_rossburg found |
| 15:31.40 | mafm | (be back in 1h or so...) |
| 16:40.13 | pacman87 | anyone have any ideas as to why rt fails on hyp from within mged? |
| 16:40.41 | pacman87 | or a way to get a more verbose error message than 'raytrace failed'? |
| 16:45.07 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 17:09.49 | mafm | brlcad: any resolution yet? |
| 17:15.50 | ``Erik | pacman: how are you trying to execute it? using the 'rt' command in the mged console, or the 'raytrace' dialog box? |
| 17:16.00 | pacman87 | rt from mged console |
| 17:16.02 | ``Erik | also; did you try rendering something like a torus or sphere the same way? |
| 17:16.09 | pacman87 | yes, only the hyp failed |
| 17:16.13 | ``Erik | weird |
| 17:16.23 | pacman87 | i'm runnign mged -c |
| 17:16.45 | ``Erik | the, uhm, rt tcl command executes the dgo_ wrapper which merely does a fork/exec of the rt binary |
| 17:16.56 | ``Erik | hum, did you try it in tk mode, too? |
| 17:17.02 | pacman87 | tk? |
| 17:17.07 | ``Erik | the gui mged |
| 17:17.17 | ``Erik | non-classic |
| 17:17.27 | pacman87 | not yet, trying now |
| 17:18.18 | ``Erik | classic mode isn't high on the priority list for testing when things get changed, so there may've been an odd bug that crept in? *shrug* :) |
| 17:18.58 | mafm | ``Erik: you're committing spam! |
| 17:19.02 | pacman87 | hmm, non classic works |
| 17:19.09 | mafm | (according to gmail, that is...) |
| 17:19.59 | ``Erik | weird :) probably too high a ratio of UPPER ZOMGBUYVIAGRA CASE |
| 17:21.32 | pacman87 | hmm, it's working now |
| 17:21.36 | pacman87 | even -c |
| 17:21.46 | mafm | maybe the one removing the GPL |
| 17:21.57 | mafm | either that or the other to adrt |
| 17:22.44 | ``Erik | <-- flips google off |
| 17:22.46 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:24.44 | ``Erik | "Happy Birthday! X86 Turns 29.991803 Years Old." |
| 17:25.29 | pacman87 | floating point error? |
| 17:26.20 | ``Erik | was a response to "The story is a few days early. I think you may have a rounding bug somewhere." on /. |
| 17:27.21 | pacman87 | it's probably preparation for the dupe on the right day :) |
| 17:27.39 | ``Erik | hehehe, yeah |
| 17:27.48 | ``Erik | but now that has to be dup'd before the real dup, which will be dup'd |
| 17:30.54 | mafm | probably related to this: |
| 17:30.57 | mafm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug |
| 17:31.16 | ``Erik | ayup |
| 17:31.36 | ``Erik | back with the p75's and stuff, there was a nifty "10 reasons not to buy intel" list floating around |
| 17:32.00 | mafm | cue the jokes http://www.netjeff.com/humor/item.cgi?file=PentiumJokes |
| 17:32.04 | ``Erik | and every one was numbered with a funny long number, like 10.000142 8.999232 8.001412223 |
| 17:32.20 | mafm | (it's inside there, I think) |
| 17:40.13 | pacman87 | how do you do texture mapping for a raytrace? |
| 17:43.30 | starseeker | Well, we have the VIA open book case and the openmoko case now... anybody know of any more such releases? |
| 17:52.12 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-043-056.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 17:53.41 | starseeker | Oh, and of course the NASA space probe stuff... |
| 18:07.42 | brlcad | pacman87: that's where the _uv function matters, you define the uv mapping for the primitive and that in turn describes how a texture is mapped |
| 18:09.19 | pacman87 | brlcad: right, i want to test my uv function, but i dont know how to tell it to use a texture |
| 18:10.35 | brlcad | ah, create a region with your primitive in it, use the texture shader on it (or stack shader with texture and plastic) |
| 18:11.09 | brlcad | wonders where there is a good texture example |
| 18:12.21 | starseeker | The earth model might do OK, but a tutorial would be better... |
| 18:12.23 | brlcad | mm.. in the regress/ directory, run make regress .. it'll run its tests and then one of those tests is a shaders test -- there will be a .g (several) that has an object with a texture applied, and there's a shell script that shows how it was made (shaders.sh iirc) |
| 18:14.56 | brlcad | five step process: it amounts to 1) make primitive (in or make cmd) 2) make combination/region (r cmd) 3) create/convert texture (.pix format, png-pix tool) 4) import pix as object (dbbinary cmd) 5) set shader on region (mater cmd) |
| 18:15.24 | brlcad | 4 is technically optional, but it's best for transport |
| 18:15.48 | pacman87 | is there an ideal texture image size? |
| 18:15.56 | brlcad | not really |
| 18:16.07 | pacman87 | how does it do scaling/tiling? |
| 18:16.08 | brlcad | start with default 512x512 |
| 18:16.42 | brlcad | those are controlled when you set the shader, it has parameters for how it scales/tiles |
| 18:16.51 | pacman87 | ok |
| 18:17.16 | brlcad | it's a little more obvious via the tcl mged shader gui, but the regress/shaders.sh script will show the base commands |
| 18:17.56 | pacman87 | btw, the non-classic mode seems to work for me now |
| 18:18.03 | brlcad | wierd |
| 18:30.37 | starseeker | brlcad: z-clipping is now off by default, correct? |
| 18:32.45 | starseeker | sees it is in latest svn, thinks he remembers this being done a while back |
| 18:33.26 | starseeker | Ah, nevermind - in the NEWS file |
| 18:34.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31321 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: remove z-clipping from TODO list - done in last release |
| 18:37.54 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31322 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: gap reporting is in there now as well |
| 18:39.47 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31323 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (Makefile.am entryexit.nrt): Add nirt formatting option to report exit points rather than LOS. |
| 18:44.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31324 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO): |
| 18:44.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Add several additional built-in formatting options for nirt, specifiable using |
| 18:44.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: the -f option and stored in brlcad's global data directory. nirt -L option |
| 18:44.52 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: lists available formats, will check directory at runtime instead of compile time |
| 18:44.53 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: thanks to new uce-dirent functionality. One of the new formats addresses the |
| 18:44.55 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: TODO request for reporting exit points instead of LOS. |
| 18:45.00 | ``Erik | http://bash.org/?866133 heh |
| 19:07.01 | starseeker | sees bug report on nirt generating messages in triplicate if the shot routines miss - anybody know of a test case for this? |
| 19:17.57 | brlcad | woot for reduction of TODO |
| 19:18.04 | starseeker | :-) |
| 19:18.41 | starseeker | I hope I understood that request for exit points correctly - if I did it bordered on trivial |
| 19:18.51 | brlcad | I've seen the nirt multiple report bug several times -- it seems to be tied to environments |
| 19:19.02 | starseeker | hmm. |
| 19:19.15 | starseeker | not mac, apparently - i've never seen it here |
| 19:19.22 | starseeker | flips to linux box... |
| 19:20.10 | starseeker | how goes conferernce #2? |
| 19:20.21 | starseeker | s/conerernce/conference |
| 19:20.27 | brlcad | pretty good |
| 19:20.46 | brlcad | smi's never as good as spm, different focus, but there have been a few good papers/posters |
| 19:20.55 | starseeker | cool |
| 19:21.21 | brlcad | a really good paper on searching/comparing geometry using wavelets |
| 19:21.29 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, do you know of any docs (good or otherwise) describing the Pro/E file format? |
| 19:21.35 | starseeker | sweet |
| 19:21.47 | brlcad | for translation and orientation invariant comparison mappings |
| 19:22.02 | brlcad | the "Pro/E file format"? |
| 19:22.13 | starseeker | or formats i suppose |
| 19:22.29 | brlcad | they're proprietary formats |
| 19:22.43 | starseeker | right - has no one done any work to figure them out? |
| 19:22.53 | brlcad | nothing of value, no |
| 19:22.57 | starseeker | bah |
| 19:23.07 | brlcad | and there are several formats, several versions of formats |
| 19:25.01 | starseeker | well, that explains why google didn't tell me anything |
| 19:25.08 | brlcad | the 'main' format of their granite engine is actually also a ".g" file format .. but it's not used very much afaik |
| 19:25.46 | brlcad | most common are .prt/.asm files -- that's Pro/E's "native" file format |
| 19:26.09 | starseeker | is guessing it's probably pretty nasty... sigh |
| 19:26.57 | brlcad | yeah, and a moving target |
| 19:27.32 | brlcad | better would be to focus on one of the formats their engine supports natively that crosses over with other major engines (acis or parasolid) |
| 19:28.04 | brlcad | like .sat, .iges, .step, .x_t |
| 19:29.05 | starseeker | how much is lost going from Pro/E to one of those formats? |
| 19:31.59 | starseeker | reflects it doesn't matter too much anyway, in the end... |
| 19:33.24 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31325 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Blinn blob method is implemented, but weird shelling issue was discovered in metaballs, so update to fix queue |
| 19:35.18 | starseeker | is confused by the BRLCAD_ROOT segfault bug report - on his machines echo $BRLCAD_ROOT doesn't show anything, and yet rt is working fine... |
| 19:36.06 | mafm | where should I discuss about the GUI to use, here or in mail with {Robert,Mailing List,...}? |
| 19:39.16 | starseeker | brlcad: where did you see the multiple report bug - do you happen to remember? (linux box didn't show it either) |
| 19:39.33 | starseeker | also, is it MGED or command line? |
| 19:44.53 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177725958.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:46.37 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/irssi.exe <---- self extracting archive, containg cygwin build of Irssi 0.8.12 and supporting cygwin dll's :) |
| 19:48.53 | mafm | hmmm, but does it have icons of nude women? [ http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20080605 ] |
| 19:49.06 | IriX64 | i'm running it now, do a version of me if you like |
| 19:49.35 | IriX64 | user friendly women there's an idea |
| 19:50.18 | mafm | it looks like a contradiction to me |
| 19:50.20 | mafm | :) |
| 19:50.24 | IriX64 | heh |
| 19:50.32 | IriX64 | telawoman :) |
| 19:50.48 | IriX64 | as good as television and telkephone :) |
| 19:50.56 | IriX64 | err telephone |
| 19:55.03 | IriX64 | 04:08 IriX64 [n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177725958.dsl.bell.ca] requested CTCP VERSION from IriX64: |
| 19:55.09 | IriX64 | 04:08 CTCP VERSION reply from IriX64: irssi v0.8.12 - running on CYGWIN_NT-6.0-WOW64 i686 |
| 19:56.07 | IriX64 | sorry for the paste |
| 19:57.02 | mafm | :) |
| 19:57.08 | IriX64 | :) |
| 19:58.56 | mafm | [mainly] for GSoC mentors: http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Mafm#Log |
| 19:59.08 | mafm | I'll continue checking RBGui tomorrow and trying to fix it |
| 19:59.58 | mafm | I don't know if somebody wants to discuss the GUI to use or leave that decision only to me |
| 20:00.13 | mafm | if anybody wants, please chime in |
| 20:00.19 | mafm | heading home now, see you tomorrow :) |
| 20:00.27 | pacman87 | i'll give feedback, if that's what your' lookign for |
| 20:00.53 | mafm | thanks pacman87 |
| 20:01.22 | pacman87 | though i only really have experience with the solidworks way of doing things |
| 20:01.26 | mafm | the bad thing is that there's no many choices... it's probably RBGui or the ugly-but-familiar CEGUI... |
| 20:01.48 | mafm | there're* even |
| 20:02.33 | mafm | k so... see you tomorrow |
| 20:02.45 | pacman87 | yeah, i dont know too much about actually coding gui's |
| 20:03.15 | pacman87 | but if your lookign for UI design type feedback, i'd be more helpful there |
| 20:03.43 | poolio | I hate almost all GUIs, so I could potentially be helpful critiquing :) |
| 20:07.03 | brlcad | starseeker: "it depends" for every one of those file formats, there is no golden egg format, importer, or exporter generally speaking .. it's a nasty matrix of tradeoffs |
| 20:07.37 | brlcad | that's why you avoid it at all costs, or at least do it as infrequently as possible and use formats that preserve the fundamental underlying data format representation |
| 20:07.51 | brlcad | e.g. if it's a brep spline surface, keep it as that |
| 20:08.32 | brlcad | even then, you can still lose data like the assembly hierarchy, material properties, the construction history |
| 20:10.36 | brlcad | starseeker: I don't recall where, it seems to come and go -- in mged only -- probably a bu_log bug with mged's logging hook and stdout/stderr settings |
| 20:11.04 | brlcad | i wouldn't close it out without testing on an analysts machine on windows and mac |
| 20:11.17 | brlcad | nice ufie.. :) |
| 20:12.44 | brlcad | cegui is only "ugly" if you use the default theme (which we definitely would not) .. it's as ugly as your theme |
| 20:13.30 | brlcad | poolio: I think all the options suck too .. that doesn't actually usualy help pick one though :) |
| 20:13.47 | poolio | brlcad: true true |
| 20:16.42 | poolio | brlcad: ah hey, I just noticed the brep/ folder :) |
| 20:21.18 | poolio | brlcad: so would the function call be rt_xxx_brep? or just xxx_brep? And it would take the implicit form and convert to an ON_Brep? |
| 20:31.14 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p54875F85.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:33.03 | pacman87 | i gave up on texturing; i |
| 20:33.16 | pacman87 | ... i'm just using checker |
| 20:39.16 | pacman87 | why does mged treat del the same as backspace? |
| 21:05.34 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 21:05.59 | *** join/#brlcad dli (n=dli@400exp219.anlgh.org) | |
| 21:08.10 | dli | Initializing and backgrounding, please wait...Can't find a usable tk.tcl in the following directories: |
| 21:08.27 | dli | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:09.31 | dli | /usr/brlcad/lib/tk8.5/tk.tcl: no event type or button # or keysym |
| 21:10.12 | pacman87 | dli: did you do ./configure --enable-all? |
| 21:13.36 | dli | pacman87, let me find out |
| 21:16.38 | andrecastelo | good evening everyone |
| 21:16.59 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 21:17.07 | andrecastelo | howdy pacman87 |
| 21:18.42 | pacman87 | i'm working on fixing my UV coords so the textures aren't stretched oddly for the elliptical cross section |
| 21:19.14 | dli | pacman87, http://pastebin.com/m35787fa7 |
| 21:19.23 | dli | pacman87, my configure line |
| 21:21.16 | pacman87 | dli: i'm not really all that familiar with brlcad's compile flags, sorry |
| 21:21.44 | pacman87 | i just know --enable-all fixed my problems with tcl/tk |
| 21:22.59 | dli | pacman87, I will try the opposite, disable tcl/tk by brlcad, try system tcl/tk |
| 21:23.05 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.56.224) | |
| 21:23.26 | dli | pacman87, kind of dangerous though, upgrading system tcl/tk to 8.5 |
| 21:24.06 | louipc | brlcad needs 8.5 |
| 21:24.40 | dli | louipc, yes, I have 8.4 packages installed now, that's why I mentioned I have to upgrade them |
| 21:25.10 | dli | louipc, upgrading might cause massive damage to tcl/tk based packages, I imagine |
| 21:25.27 | louipc | yea |
| 21:26.32 | dli | louipc, any idea why tcl/tk from brlcad breaks down? |
| 21:27.05 | louipc | no idea |
| 21:27.20 | louipc | I've always used system |
| 21:27.55 | dli | louipc, sounds good, I will take the risk and upgrade then |
| 21:28.21 | louipc | I don't have any system critical apps that depend on tcl |
| 21:28.31 | starseeker | brlcad: What does the windows version of BRL-CAD do with XStoreColor? |
| 21:28.41 | starseeker | libdm seems to need it... |
| 21:28.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31326 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: convert (back) to using make variables instead of automake encoded subst variables for all values. |
| 21:28.50 | louipc | the only things I have are git-gui, some program to write guitar tabulatures |
| 21:28.54 | dli | louipc, one more question, "--disable-tcl-build --disable-tk-build" would try system tcl/tk, right? |
| 21:28.56 | louipc | and brlcad |
| 21:28.57 | louipc | :D |
| 21:29.53 | louipc | dli: yeah that'd be the only option :D |
| 21:29.55 | brlcad | pacman87: portable bindings on del vs bs is a pita -- if you want to tweak that logic, go for it .. I'll even point you at the files but you'll need to put in a bit of cross-platform testing love to make sure it does sane things |
| 21:30.32 | louipc | dli: but brlcad will try to use your system tcl/tk automatically if it's suitable |
| 21:31.14 | dli | louipc, so, I don't have to rebuild brlcad indeed, just upgrade system tcl/tk |
| 21:31.18 | brlcad | dli: it doesn't exactly break down, that's a search path failure |
| 21:31.56 | louipc | hmm there might be an issue with the tcl extensions though |
| 21:32.01 | louipc | I'm not sure |
| 21:32.07 | brlcad | which is a mess the way tcl deals with searching .. there are lots of variables and places for things to go wrong for embedded interpreter apps (which mged is) |
| 21:32.37 | brlcad | what was your configure summary? |
| 21:32.49 | brlcad | that's more informative than the configure line for what it's actually going to do |
| 21:33.13 | dli | brlcad, which ENV to direct it? |
| 21:33.14 | brlcad | it's near the end of your config.log (not the very end, go back a few pages) if you don't still have it in a scrollback buffer |
| 21:34.04 | brlcad | starseeker: windows shouldn't be using anything X11 |
| 21:34.32 | starseeker | color.c in libdm includes X11/X11.h without any conditionals |
| 21:34.47 | starseeker | and dm_copy_cmap makes direct use of XStoreColors |
| 21:35.53 | starseeker | Is color.c needed only for X systems? |
| 21:36.35 | brlcad | you're asking me instead of looking at the build files because... ? :) |
| 21:37.26 | starseeker | hadn't tried reading the windows build files on a mac, but he should have... |
| 21:37.30 | brlcad | that's something I'd seriously hope nobody wasted neurons on remembering ;) |
| 21:37.56 | brlcad | but my guess would be that windows doesn't need it |
| 21:38.52 | brlcad | even without knowing the build files, just trace the functions in that file and what other files call those functions .. if it doesn't have a path to dm-wgl, then it shouldn't get hit |
| 21:39.04 | starseeker | ah |
| 21:40.56 | pacman87 | i realized why rt failed inside mged before: i skipped the 'make install' step and was running from the build location |
| 21:45.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 21:45.14 | brlcad | that'll do it |
| 21:46.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31327 10/rt^3/trunk/ (40 files in 18 dirs): |
| 21:46.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: mass update of the sources and build system so that this module can be used as a |
| 21:46.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: stomping ground for C++ gui developments. there's still a fair bit of useless |
| 21:46.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: and non-existent code, but the overall structure is more or less a sound |
| 21:46.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: starting point. sync license and version approach with main module. |
| 21:47.14 | brlcad | mafm has a home |
| 21:47.28 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 21:47.37 | starseeker | ogre fun? |
| 21:47.43 | brlcad | yep |
| 21:47.56 | louipc | ogre! |
| 21:47.56 | brlcad | goes to dinner |
| 21:48.15 | starseeker | louipc: you know of it? |
| 21:48.19 | louipc | that's another package that will give me pain |
| 21:48.27 | starseeker | how come? |
| 21:48.28 | louipc | yeah |
| 21:48.51 | louipc | I don't know. i tried building a game with it |
| 21:49.12 | louipc | and it's not in my distros repos :( |
| 21:49.38 | starseeker | ah |
| 21:49.51 | louipc | seems cool though |
| 21:50.23 | starseeker | has heard lots of good things about it |
| 22:07.49 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31328 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: upgrade uv(): change top/bottom mapping from circular to elliptical to match the shape, and change latitude lines to be more evenly spaced around the ellipse |
| 22:21.17 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt14.png |
| 22:25.35 | pacman87 | how do you do a shaded checkerboard? |
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| 00:56.33 | starseeker | pacman87: funky |
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| 01:07.02 | pacman87 | starseeker: i was testing my uv mapping |
| 02:03.17 | starseeker | Hmm - considering this is a completely mechanical translation to html, it's not bad: http://brlcad.org/oed/ |
| 02:42.20 | brlcad | pacman87: stack shader, you apply checker and plastic |
| 02:42.28 | brlcad | nice uv mapping |
| 02:45.16 | poolio | brlcad: Was just wondering where you wanted he brep() routine? In primitives/xxx/xxx_brep.cpp ? And would the routine just be xxx_brep(implicit shape) or something? |
| 02:47.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31329 10/brlcad/trunk/COPYING: fix typo, remove trademark section |
| 02:48.16 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31330 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: ws |
| 02:48.37 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, something like that |
| 02:49.11 | brlcad | spot on for the file and function name, there are more function arguments |
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| 03:12.21 | poolio | brlcad: ah alright, I'll go ahead and commit sph and cyl |
| 03:12.29 | poolio | And just to confirm, no rt prefix? |
| 03:12.35 | brlcad | something like rt_xxx_brep(ON_Brep **b, const struct rt_db_internal *ip, const struct bn_tol *tol) |
| 03:13.02 | brlcad | no no, should match the style of the other callbacks, with the prefix |
| 03:13.31 | brlcad | exact params depends on what it ends up needing, but I suspect at least those three -- maybe a model instead of an ip, but same gist |
| 03:14.51 | poolio | Alright, thanks. I'll give it a shot |
| 03:16.14 | starseeker | takes a gander at the firebird docbook manual... |
| 03:16.46 | brlcad | woo hoo |
| 03:19.42 | brlcad | poolio: the idea will be (particularly for testing) to have it generate a valid solid ON_Brep that could be passed to mk_brep |
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| 03:21.24 | brlcad | howdy andre! |
| 03:23.43 | starseeker | raises eyebrows - they're using what appears to be a script based build rather than teaching autotools to do it |
| 03:25.14 | brlcad | you can always make autoconf run a script ;) |
| 03:25.32 | starseeker | true :-) |
| 03:25.40 | brlcad | regardless, autoconf probably would just check for tool availability |
| 03:26.01 | starseeker | right. they have instructions for downloading tools from their website if problems arise |
| 03:27.10 | brlcad | somethin like a make doc target (have it run a script) |
| 03:33.02 | poolio | brlcad: How would I handle the bn_tol? Isn't that just for raytracing? |
| 03:33.39 | starseeker | brlcad: any idea on that html oed why there are capital As next to the navigation links? |
| 03:33.50 | starseeker | I don't get them when I view the page locally |
| 03:34.26 | brlcad | poolio: nope |
| 03:34.50 | brlcad | it's for anything that requires numerical tolerancing, which you will undoubtedly run into for some of the primitives |
| 03:36.58 | poolio | Well, in terms of creating the brep from the implicit form, why would you need to deal with the tolerancing? Like, wouldn't you just create a brep that ignored it and creating a very precise representation? |
| 03:47.07 | brlcad | poolio: sure, ideally .. some of the primitives will still require some computations |
| 03:47.28 | brlcad | e.g. arbs |
| 03:49.54 | poolio | brlcad: I don't really get it :) Could you give an example where you'd need to look at tolerances? |
| 03:50.05 | brlcad | you'll know it when you get to it :) |
| 03:50.10 | brlcad | don't worry about it till then :) |
| 03:50.46 | starseeker | brlcad: Early thoughts - xmlto uses xsltproc for the "dirty work", which is in turn part of libxslt and uses libxml. Would it be worth considering adding libxslt, libxml and the necessary style files to the src/other directory? |
| 03:51.12 | starseeker | the licenses on those two libs are MIT, and they claim to be written in basic C code |
| 03:51.13 | brlcad | eep, I'd sure hope not |
| 03:51.33 | brlcad | that'd only be if we were including and redistributing xmlto |
| 03:51.53 | starseeker | xmlto is just a script that invokes xsltproc, apparently |
| 03:52.01 | starseeker | we could probably go direct to xsltproc |
| 03:52.06 | brlcad | okay, including and redistributing xsltproc |
| 03:52.09 | brlcad | same thing |
| 03:53.13 | brlcad | I see it more like autoconf, libtool, automake, m4, perl, make .. all things we require devs have, but we don't provide them (because they are dev-only) |
| 03:53.48 | brlcad | and devs != any user that might compile brl-cad |
| 03:53.54 | brlcad | devs is our guys here |
| 03:54.23 | starseeker | OK. |
| 03:54.26 | poolio | brlcad: ok ok. So basically you shouldn't create say, multiple points if they are all within the tolerance? I was just thinking I'd go ahead and create those points, and that it wouldn't matter :) |
| 03:54.48 | starseeker | was thinking they might be in the same class as libpng, libregex, libz... |
| 03:54.57 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, something like that .. you'll end up with rather invalid surfaces and geometry |
| 03:55.24 | brlcad | that will just cascade failures (and completely invalid geometry due to floating point error alone) |
| 03:55.48 | poolio | Well, will is it really 'invalid' ? Is floating point that bad? |
| 03:55.51 | poolio | Ah, ok :) |
| 03:55.59 | brlcad | yes, it really is |
| 03:56.09 | brlcad | when it comes to validity checking on brep geometry |
| 03:56.13 | brlcad | it's a pretty major problem |
| 03:57.20 | poolio | So is implicit gemoetry not checked against tolerances? Cause wouldn't converting from valid geometry lead to valid results...maybe I should just wait til I get there |
| 03:57.22 | brlcad | you'll end up with things that are inside out, twisted, with singularities, cracks, overlaps, and other degeneracies |
| 03:57.58 | brlcad | the implicits are checked, sure .. the mere conversion to brep form, though, can (and will) introduce those errors |
| 03:58.40 | brlcad | aside from primitives that inherintly tolerancing for type detection (arbs) |
| 03:59.57 | poolio | brlcad: So should all shapes take a tolerance or only the ones that need them? I'm thinking it's easier to just use a standard...although with C++ we could overload/set a default param |
| 04:00.57 | brlcad | the api has to be the same for all of them |
| 04:01.21 | brlcad | it's a callback |
| 04:02.09 | poolio | ah, k |
| 04:02.43 | brlcad | it'll go in a table by name, and called genericly |
| 04:02.58 | brlcad | like all the other rt_xxx_* callbacks |
| 04:05.29 | pacman87 | how much time is it worth spending on moving the code back into prep() from shot/norm/uv? |
| 04:05.53 | pacman87 | and is there a standardized way to test performance improvements? |
| 04:06.10 | brlcad | pacman87: highly valuable |
| 04:06.32 | brlcad | optimizing the hell out of primitives is always a good thing |
| 04:06.51 | brlcad | that cascades performance benefits |
| 04:07.25 | pacman87 | so, keep moving code until i cant find any more code to move. |
| 04:07.30 | brlcad | standardized way .. use a good performance profiler ;) |
| 04:07.35 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:08.03 | brlcad | and then for the code that's remaining, make sure it's efficient, non-redundant, cache coherent, etc |
| 04:08.13 | pacman87 | i've never done performance profiling before |
| 04:08.40 | brlcad | ahh, fun stuff |
| 04:08.45 | brlcad | well, want to? :) |
| 04:08.57 | pacman87 | yeah, i just want to know how |
| 04:09.01 | brlcad | how easy and good it is depends entirely on your platform |
| 04:09.10 | pacman87 | slackware 12 |
| 04:09.38 | brlcad | so your basic staple of profiling on linux would be gprof |
| 04:12.04 | brlcad | it's really simple to use -- you'll recompile with configure --enable-profiling --disable-optimized .. compile .. install .. run rt on a hyp .. then run gprof |
| 04:12.04 | pacman87 | is there a compile flag for profiling? |
| 04:12.19 | pacman87 | read my mind :) |
| 04:12.52 | brlcad | when you run rt with profiling enabled, it'll generate a gmon.out file in that directory, gprof uses that along with the binary to sort out where time was spent |
| 04:13.28 | brlcad | it'll generate a fairly detailed report with lots of options and stats.. you then review that report and see if where the time is being spent makes sense |
| 04:14.29 | pacman87 | uv is skipped unless there's a texture, and i'm guessing norm is skipped if there's no shading |
| 04:14.41 | pacman87 | when is curve called? |
| 04:15.17 | brlcad | look for the rt_functab entry callers |
| 04:15.26 | brlcad | don't recall specifically |
| 04:15.42 | pacman87 | curve and tess are the last functions i have to write |
| 04:15.51 | brlcad | tess will be fun.. |
| 04:16.10 | pacman87 | yeah, i've kind of been avoiding it |
| 04:17.57 | brlcad | ehy and tgc kinda give you the formula though |
| 04:18.05 | brlcad | might be nearly identical to tgc |
| 04:19.03 | brlcad | oh yeah -- can the hyp caps have two different radii? .. and separate orientation? :) |
| 04:20.01 | brlcad | separate radii at least could be really useful for attaching pipes together |
| 04:20.01 | pacman87 | right now the endplates are identical |
| 04:20.23 | pacman87 | if you want a different radius, you could cut it off sooner |
| 04:21.10 | pacman87 | the cross sections are all similar ellipses, a/b = const |
| 04:32.48 | brlcad | except it'd be a curvature discontinuity |
| 04:35.02 | brlcad | i see these being used to smoothly tie together tgc/rcc objects, pinched cables, flow control valves, etc, connecting ends with a specific height and specific sized/shaped ends |
| 04:35.42 | pacman87 | that could be done, using a circle for the cross section at the neck |
| 04:37.37 | pacman87 | in that case, you'd need the height axis, top/bottom heights, major axis vectors for the two ends, major/minor axis lengths for both ends, and the radius of the circle in the middle |
| 04:38.11 | brlcad | major/minor for the ellipse in the middle ;) |
| 04:38.17 | pacman87 | in that case, it's not really an elliptical hyperboloid anymore |
| 04:38.29 | pacman87 | yeah, sure ;) |
| 04:38.36 | pacman87 | and the major vector for that too |
| 04:39.23 | pacman87 | but i don't see a way to handle an arbitrary elliptical neck |
| 04:40.31 | brlcad | alright, just a thought :) |
| 04:41.31 | pacman87 | if you want a shape like that, i could do it |
| 04:41.46 | brlcad | nah, doesn't have to be that way .. more just probing thought |
| 04:42.20 | pacman87 | but it'd probably take another week or so |
| 04:42.37 | pacman87 | and i'd rather go on to the revolve after hyp is done |
| 04:44.31 | brlcad | yeah, don't worry about it .. straight up elliptic hyperboloid of one sheet sounds like the plan to stick to |
| 04:45.18 | brlcad | especially since we could do the shape I'm thinking of with a generalized sweep anyways :) |
| 04:52.27 | poolio | brlcad: So apparently I break parsing of input if I manage to sneak in a '\' before it outputs the next line of parameter reading. Is this expected? |
| 05:04.36 | brlcad | doesn't ring a bell, but would have to read the source |
| 05:08.37 | pacman87 | i'm off to bed; i'll work on tess() in the morning |
| 05:18.29 | brlcad | cheers |
| 05:19.04 | starseeker | likes the ability to include multiple sub-files in a top level document - that needs more study |
| 05:31.47 | brlcad | xpath is good stuff |
| 05:31.59 | brlcad | and/or usual docbook hierarchyness |
| 05:32.57 | starseeker | breaking VolII into parts should be a good test |
| 06:35.11 | brlcad | pacman87: in hyp hyp 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 1 .5 |
| 06:35.26 | brlcad | ae 35 25 |
| 06:36.38 | brlcad | actually from any ae it seems |
| 06:37.50 | brlcad | scale is off too |
| 06:39.57 | brlcad | and all sorts of interesting results if I twitch that .5 anywhere from .1 to 10 .. :) |
| 06:41.20 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31331 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: don't allow system tcl to be mixed with non-system itcl under any circumstance regardless of version |
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| 09:23.43 | mafm | hello |
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| 11:47.16 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 11:47.47 | brlcad | your code now has a home! |
| 11:50.14 | brlcad | the rt^3 module, you can add to that as needed probably starting with a new subdir in src, and another for src/other for the external deps |
| 12:15.37 | clock_ | There's a Swiss guy mentioned in the new who retargetted his Opel Kadett for driving on wood |
| 12:15.53 | clock_ | Has a gasifier attached to the rear of the vehicle |
| 12:16.12 | clock_ | I wonder if a gasifier large enough could feed a resonance ramjet and one could build a cruise misile running on wood |
| 12:16.42 | clock_ | Or fly to the moon on wood ;-) |
| 12:19.57 | mafm | brlcad: I guessed so by the movement in the -commit list... but is the ^ a good character for filenames? wouldn't that give problems on some systems? |
| 12:22.54 | mafm | my bet is on vivoleum: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/6/14/214445/536 |
| 12:23.05 | mafm | (for clock_ :) ) |
| 12:25.06 | clock_ | I wonder what happens if you put plastic into gassifier |
| 12:25.18 | clock_ | could cars run on the plastic part of household waste? |
| 12:25.30 | clock_ | Terry, eat the youghurts faster, Dad needs to drive to the work! |
| 12:26.45 | mafm | many of those contain nasty chemicals or things that cause breathing problems for humans or other nasty side effects... kind of the problem with biofuels |
| 12:27.53 | clock_ | I once put the oil from canned fish into a jar and added a makeshift wick |
| 12:27.56 | clock_ | It burned hell long! |
| 12:39.52 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-237-118.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 12:40.53 | mafm | :D |
| 12:52.38 | clock_ | I just invented how to make a transmission from slow to fast without cogs, only with levers! |
| 12:52.47 | clock_ | without cogwheels |
| 13:07.41 | brlcad | mafm: you'd think, but I've actually been surprised how many shells/OS/filesystems support it without a problem |
| 13:07.58 | brlcad | that said, the name isn't finalized, think of it as an internal dev name |
| 13:08.20 | mafm | fine |
| 13:09.05 | mafm | did you read the log about RBGui? it seems that the development effort has declined since when it was considered |
| 13:09.17 | brlcad | yep |
| 13:13.11 | brlcad | mafm: for the module, you have a fairly large amount of flexibility, nothing there is set in stone -- it'll likely be a stomping ground for the new OO API layer in order to keep a defined separation with librt/libbn/libbu, but how that is organized on the filesystem isn't set |
| 13:14.06 | brlcad | one thing that would be nice would be a conversion of rt^3 to cmake, you're welcome to |
| 13:14.20 | brlcad | especially if you're not experienced with the autotools, then it'd probably be a great idea |
| 13:18.26 | mafm | I'm not experience in cmake either :D |
| 13:18.28 | brlcad | mafm: as for rbgui, whenever you want to talk about that vs other other options, I'm game |
| 13:18.55 | mafm | well, you know about the other *option*: CEGUI |
| 13:21.03 | brlcad | sure, that is an option |
| 13:21.44 | brlcad | their activity wouldn't necessarily need to be the deciding factor, especially if you're talking about a mere couple months that have passed to declare them "inactive" |
| 13:22.01 | mafm | since March, is 3 |
| 13:22.29 | brlcad | sure, call it 6 .. that's not very long in the big scheme of things :) |
| 13:22.30 | mafm | the thing is that they patched OGRE for a new function that they {need,think is more convenient}? |
| 13:22.38 | brlcad | plenty of projects release once a year or less |
| 13:22.43 | mafm | and they removed that option from newer stable versions of OGRE |
| 13:22.44 | brlcad | yet are still quite "active" |
| 13:23.02 | mafm | and they haven't adapted their code since then |
| 13:23.12 | brlcad | the bigger issue is how readable/maintainable is their code bose |
| 13:23.31 | mafm | so well, a few months is not big hassle.. but they have a very short story |
| 13:23.42 | brlcad | so if we have to do the updates and ports ourselves, is that worth the effort (compared to the downsides of using something else) |
| 13:23.48 | mafm | so in the scale of their lifetime, it's significant, I think |
| 13:24.04 | brlcad | i'm just saying that it's not a deciding factor |
| 13:24.14 | brlcad | they could drop dead/disappear today |
| 13:24.29 | brlcad | it could still be a viable code to use, even if it doesn't work out of the box |
| 13:24.33 | brlcad | just depends on other factors |
| 13:24.50 | brlcad | i.e. the actual quality of the code and features provided |
| 13:25.20 | brlcad | build system integration issues are usually very very minor .. the actual features the various toolkits provide are where the time is spent |
| 13:25.59 | brlcad | "usually" of course, there are some outlier nasties for rapidly changing codes, but ogre isn't in that camp |
| 13:26.13 | mafm | well... yes, but in example if CEGUI dies, for sure somebody will maintain it in one way or another... but if they die almost certainly the job would be for BRL-CAD team, no other way |
| 13:27.18 | mafm | and code quality, at first glance, might be easy to analyze; but for features probably you don't know until you're deeply buried in the mud :D |
| 13:27.42 | brlcad | possibly, but I'd just treat it as if nobody is or will maintain either -- that makes evaluation a lot more simple and less influenced by popularity perception |
| 13:28.10 | brlcad | the code itself and features really should drive the decision |
| 13:28.51 | brlcad | any external code is a burden especially given we fully manage all external dependencies |
| 13:30.01 | mafm | I see |
| 13:30.35 | mafm | well, the code looks clean and pretty well commented, with lots of "const" guards and so on -- so they seem to have put good care on it |
| 13:31.07 | brlcad | are their features significantly better/worse than cegui? |
| 13:31.48 | brlcad | a minor note, you mentioned yeesterday about cegui's appearance -- you are aware that we would absolutely not use the default theme, yes? :) |
| 13:31.50 | mafm | as for the features, having seeing the video in the links of the discussion, I think that they are not behind CEGUI, but that might be just because of the default theme (as somebody suggest in OGRE forum threads) |
| 13:32.15 | brlcad | that'd probably be the first thing that'd have to change if you go the cegui route, something much simpler, lightweight, clean |
| 13:33.16 | brlcad | how big are the actual code for each? |
| 13:33.22 | brlcad | have you looked at line counts? |
| 13:33.42 | ``Erik | notes that BRL-CAD has gone more than 3 months without release before, yet is quite active... has seen programs go YEARS without releases or visible activity, yet are still active *shrug* |
| 13:34.23 | mafm | Totals grouped by language (dominant language first): |
| 13:34.23 | mafm | cpp: 11215 (95.82%) |
| 13:34.23 | mafm | ansic: 489 (4.18%) |
| 13:34.29 | mafm | and for Mocha... |
| 13:34.43 | ``Erik | (why rt^3 instead of a new top-level?) |
| 13:35.25 | mafm | Totals grouped by language (dominant language first): |
| 13:35.26 | mafm | ansic: 12426 (65.59%) |
| 13:35.26 | mafm | cpp: 6519 (34.41%) |
| 13:35.38 | mafm | (most of "ansic" being actually Lua scripts) |
| 13:35.43 | brlcad | ``Erik: because it has some basic structure in place, a build system set up, C++ files that establish/demonstrate style, documented structure, etc .. less to fix down the road |
| 13:35.53 | mafm | (mocha is a kind of helper library needed by RBGui) |
| 13:35.54 | brlcad | the module can always be renamed |
| 13:36.43 | brlcad | same mocha as seen here: http://greghoustondesign.com/demos/mocha/ ? |
| 13:37.15 | mafm | ``Erik: yes but there are also thousands of projects which make a first release and abandon very early |
| 13:37.55 | brlcad | notes that style is curiously *really* close to the style seen in the IOE demo |
| 13:38.10 | mafm | nope, that one of yours is javascript |
| 13:39.55 | brlcad | well I know that, but the logic under the hood could have been the same library |
| 13:40.05 | brlcad | especially if they were doing any server-side ajaxisms |
| 13:42.37 | mafm | http://www.rightbraingames.com/tech.php -> description of RBGui and mocha |
| 13:43.02 | brlcad | so about 30k lines for rbgui |
| 13:43.06 | mafm | it's a kind of utility library |
| 13:43.16 | mafm | the GUI itself is in RBGui |
| 13:43.29 | mafm | so I think that it doesn't have anything to do with the javascript thingy |
| 13:45.02 | brlcad | yeah, k |
| 13:45.40 | brlcad | so how much code in cegui? |
| 13:46.17 | mafm | http://feature.mmosite.com/antilia/ |
| 13:46.36 | mafm | they're creating this game, but the website has empty pages and the screenshots have no GUI :( |
| 13:46.47 | brlcad | 30k is pretty significant, but not insurmountable to maintain on our own .. anywhere from a couple months to a year of effort |
| 13:48.31 | mafm | (downloading CEGUI, I don't have it around) |
| 13:50.54 | mafm | SLOC Directory SLOC-by-Language (Sorted) |
| 13:50.54 | mafm | 26494 src cpp=26494 |
| 13:50.54 | mafm | 12503 include cpp=12149,ansic=354 |
| 13:51.21 | mafm | with image modules, renderer modules, xml and the like... about 10k more |
| 13:51.59 | brlcad | that sloc is for which? |
| 13:52.21 | mafm | cegui |
| 13:52.52 | brlcad | ah, so pretty closely on par with each other |
| 13:53.19 | brlcad | + any external deps for cegui |
| 13:54.07 | mafm | from rbgui svn: |
| 13:54.11 | mafm | r1 | brian | 2007-10-24 04:01:11 +0100 (Wed, 24 Oct 2007) | 1 line |
| 13:54.30 | mafm | r16 | brian | 2007-11-20 04:01:28 +0000 (Tue, 20 Nov 2007) | 1 line |
| 13:54.42 | mafm | that's the last one appearing in that repository |
| 13:56.02 | brlcad | nods |
| 13:57.49 | mafm | the dates of the RBGui 0.1.3 release are also from 2007, I don't know where I got the thing about march... maybe the date of the thread of OGRE forums announcing it, or the RPM package or something |
| 13:58.16 | mafm | I have to go for a meeting now, be back in about 1 hour |
| 13:58.21 | brlcad | you're still stuck on that point :) |
| 13:58.22 | mafm | or probably less |
| 13:58.25 | brlcad | treat them both as dead |
| 13:58.28 | brlcad | and compare from there |
| 13:58.55 | brlcad | have fun! |
| 13:58.56 | brlcad | :) |
| 13:59.07 | mafm | well, yes, but it turns that it's more dead than I thought :D |
| 13:59.17 | mafm | later |
| 14:00.14 | brlcad | or they're just "finished" because it was so damn good and/or they didn't need it to do anything else |
| 14:00.58 | brlcad | all the more reason to just look at what it is and does |
| 14:02.17 | brlcad | cegui may be the better choice, I'm fine with trying either -- but they should be compared on factors that matter the most to us |
| 14:03.17 | brlcad | from what I've seen, cegui is certainly more popular and better documented/supported .. but more complex to learn and integrate I bet, and will require a complete overhaul of the defaults |
| 14:04.26 | brlcad | rbgui is of course more unknown and not well documented/supported .. but more simple to integrate (less ext. deps), has a gui editor, and the defaults are "fine" for now |
| 14:04.38 | brlcad | so kinda a wash barring new information |
| 14:07.39 | brlcad | poolio: I'm listening to a presentation right now that is basically what you did last summer, but only in 2D using circles and non-overlapping unions |
| 14:08.02 | brlcad | no more, no less .. and it's a formally published IEEE paper :) |
| 14:39.24 | mafm | back |
| 14:40.20 | clock_ | brlcad: I have also an IEEE paper with ISBN! |
| 14:40.30 | clock_ | bursts with self-pride |
| 14:44.55 | clock_ | poolio: what did you do? |
| 14:54.01 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31332 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/ (BrlcadCore.def CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): |
| 14:54.02 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: BrlcadCore.dll now exports some functions which brlcad.dll does not |
| 14:54.02 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: at least some of these functions are rather BRL-CAD private and shouldn't be used in other applications |
| 14:54.04 | mafm | no replies in #ogre3d channel :) |
| 14:54.31 | brlcad | their guys are rarely on freenode |
| 14:54.37 | brlcad | they're mainly forum driven |
| 14:55.06 | brlcad | steve says he gets nothing done when he's on irc :) |
| 14:56.47 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31333 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): added asc2g and g2asc to the CMake |
| 15:01.28 | mafm | I was mostly trying to find ppl who used it for their projects -- I guess that OGRE devels don't have much time to test other stuff |
| 15:06.42 | starseeker | just out of curosity, is cegui's close relationship with OGRE of any help as compared to RBgui? |
| 15:06.58 | starseeker | can't spell today... |
| 15:07.22 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31334 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: fix scale error found by brlcad |
| 15:09.30 | d_rossberg | pacman87: the endcaps now look good |
| 15:10.08 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: only curve() and tess() left now :) |
| 15:11.17 | brlcad | hm |
| 15:11.18 | d_rossberg | and revolve and sweep ;) |
| 15:11.29 | brlcad | was getting all sorts of endcap errors |
| 15:11.32 | brlcad | updates |
| 15:12.29 | starseeker | Ah, nevermind... (found the wiki discussion of OpenGL gui frameworks) |
| 15:12.32 | starseeker | reads... |
| 15:13.37 | brlcad | clock_: he implemented a GA that performed shape matching using ray-tracing, implicits, and CSG: http://brlcad.org/Beset_Overview.pdf |
| 15:14.59 | mafm | starseeker: both them are, they were originally designed for OGRE afaik |
| 15:16.13 | clock_ | brlcad: what's a GA? |
| 15:16.31 | clock_ | and what's shape matching? |
| 15:16.37 | brlcad | you didn't look at the link apparently |
| 15:19.48 | clock_ | Preliminary results approximates a cone from spheres |
| 15:20.06 | clock_ | That's sounds a bit impractical and more theoretical |
| 15:20.13 | clock_ | Is it in some practical stage already? |
| 15:20.41 | brlcad | of course not, it was specifically theoretical research |
| 15:21.35 | brlcad | it's not been done before, and the results actually show that it's probably quite feasible for real-world results with more focus on the fitness function and convergence criteria |
| 15:22.05 | clock_ | isn't it just going to make everything from spheres? |
| 15:22.12 | brlcad | No... |
| 15:22.16 | clock_ | give it a cube and it approximates it from spheres? |
| 15:22.20 | brlcad | you're not getting it |
| 15:22.39 | clock_ | but why didn't it just produce one cone and produce tons of spheres instead? |
| 15:22.54 | brlcad | the point is to match an unknown shape with candidate shape(s) and CSG operations |
| 15:23.16 | brlcad | because that would converge nearly instantly, it's a nonsensical result |
| 15:24.05 | brlcad | that task of matching an input shape where the input shape is in you candidate shape set was matched very early on, that's pretty much trivial |
| 15:24.33 | brlcad | the (much) harder problem is when your candidate shapes don't match the input |
| 15:25.05 | clock_ | I would take a biggest sphere that would fit in |
| 15:25.08 | brlcad | so instead of cylinder, maybe it's the mounting bracket to your ronja device |
| 15:25.15 | clock_ | subtract it and recursively call the algorithm on the rest ;-) |
| 15:25.50 | clock_ | or convert the shape into an octree and then build the octree from cubes ;-) |
| 15:25.57 | brlcad | you don't know what would fit, or even where |
| 15:26.05 | brlcad | it determines that implicitly through the GA process |
| 15:26.13 | clock_ | wow |
| 15:26.14 | brlcad | it knows *nothing* about the input |
| 15:26.24 | clock_ | not even it's shape? |
| 15:26.32 | brlcad | it can sample the shape is all |
| 15:26.32 | clock_ | polishes his crystal ball |
| 15:26.41 | brlcad | single ray queries |
| 15:26.49 | mafm | (I appear to know more of GUIs than people of the channel, so no much help in that camp :) ) |
| 15:26.53 | brlcad | that tell you where material exists or does not exist |
| 15:27.19 | brlcad | mafm: what were you expecting to get from them? :) |
| 15:27.26 | clock_ | I wonder how it reacts if you give it a sponge like for washing dishes |
| 15:27.33 | brlcad | highly likely iff you got feedback, it'd be biased to the more well-known popular result |
| 15:27.38 | clock_ | then the results will depend on precise sampling point |
| 15:28.16 | brlcad | the GA itself tries to converge to match the same space occupancy |
| 15:28.34 | brlcad | mostly useful for high-dimensional search spaces as a semi-brute force search method |
| 15:29.37 | poolio | brlcad: I might try to further pursue beset off the clock :) I've got some more ideas I want to try out |
| 15:30.02 | brlcad | was inspired to code up some of the remaining ideas he had as well ;) |
| 15:30.18 | poolio | ah well, I concede. |
| 15:30.38 | brlcad | especially with more operators and primitives to choose from, and simulated annealing to increase convergence |
| 15:31.00 | brlcad | no no.. don't let me hold you up from doing anything |
| 15:31.18 | brlcad | those aren't exclusive-or decisions :) |
| 15:31.19 | poolio | Well, are you working off of the code I had implemented or starting anew? |
| 15:31.41 | clock_ | brlcad: if you give it a mounting bracket do you think it figures out the primitives from which the bracket was made? |
| 15:31.44 | brlcad | eh, why would I start new? |
| 15:31.51 | clock_ | 3 rpps and 2 cyls? |
| 15:32.00 | poolio | brlcad: no clue, just wondering :) You should keep beset up to date so we could potentially collaborate :) |
| 15:32.13 | poolio | clock_: Maybe, but it's pretty far from that currently. |
| 15:32.27 | brlcad | clock_: theoretically if the same primitives and operators were available in the sample set, that would be one of the possible solutions it could arrive at (along with billions of other less fit solutions) |
| 15:33.12 | brlcad | poolio: I rarely ever have uncommitted code, commit frequently ftw |
| 15:33.34 | poolio | commit early, commit often, commit every time you save ;) |
| 15:33.42 | clock_ | Hehe genetic algorithms on WP: "Commonly, the algorithm terminates when either a maximum number of generations has been produced, or a satisfactory fitness level has been reached for the population. |
| 15:33.47 | clock_ | " |
| 15:34.19 | clock_ | or "until intelligence capable of producing nuclear weapons evolves" |
| 15:34.39 | clock_ | what's the termination criterion for the genetic evolution of the nature? |
| 15:35.12 | poolio | It never terminates. |
| 15:35.21 | brlcad | made a GA that drove little tanks around that learned how to combat each other in teams effectively whilest in college |
| 15:35.33 | poolio | It terminates if you can solve the halting problem :) |
| 15:35.48 | poolio | brlcad: hehe, I did something like that but with little animals collecting food |
| 15:35.54 | brlcad | easy .. if (rand() == 0) abort(); :) |
| 15:36.01 | poolio | brlcad: I see you started early with the army |
| 15:36.27 | poolio | Bah, it's not even random. pseudo-random ftl. |
| 15:37.52 | brlcad | the first really impressive result I saw was another group in that same class that used a GA that learned how to play tetris .. it learned *exceptionally* well and after a couple days evolving could then easily beat any human players (and could play at 100x real-time speed) |
| 15:38.08 | brlcad | all through a GA that evolved an FSM of gameplay logic |
| 15:38.47 | poolio | That's quite impressive...but couldn't they have just brute forced something like that? |
| 15:39.09 | clock_ | I once played with a program for genetically generated art |
| 15:39.40 | brlcad | the second impressive result was terzolopolous' work where he had an articulated model of a fish and it completely and naturally learned how to swim .. that was fscking impressive |
| 15:39.44 | clock_ | or evolve tetris that is as easy as possible |
| 15:39.48 | clock_ | with only 1x1 blocks |
| 15:40.03 | poolio | brlcad: oh heh, was it just a simulation? I think I've seen that research before |
| 15:40.21 | poolio | There was also someone in #ai a while ago that used Q-learning + NNs to evolve a gait for a quadruped |
| 15:40.25 | clock_ | brlcad: I tried that with human body, biological computer and skateboarding and it also worked impressively |
| 15:40.40 | clock_ | poolio: they do it on the university of zurich in their robotic lab |
| 15:40.50 | brlcad | poolio: actually the combinatorial explosion in tetris can get pretty bad -- especially as the stragey actually needed to optimize and respond differently at different levels -- it was multi-player tetris (netris) |
| 15:41.23 | poolio | ah, I love netris :). I just did some quick figures and got 7(2^200)...I guess that's a little bit large :) |
| 15:43.13 | clock_ | Could you use GA to evolve an .mp3 that would get #1 in the world charts? |
| 15:43.29 | starseeker | <snort> that would explain a lot of current music... |
| 15:43.59 | clock_ | I wrote a program where I fed Bible and Koran and it produced a religious text on the halfway |
| 15:44.06 | clock_ | Allah and God walking hand in hand in one sentence |
| 15:44.16 | clock_ | Should solve the eternal collision between religions |
| 15:44.27 | brlcad | clock_: there's some people that have actually worked on that .. |
| 15:44.42 | clock_ | I also put in gay sex stories |
| 15:44.48 | brlcad | (the music bit, not the religious one) |
| 15:44.50 | clock_ | to make the religion less homophobic |
| 15:44.58 | clock_ | brlcad: evolved music? |
| 15:45.05 | brlcad | yep |
| 15:45.30 | brlcad | it's all in the fitness function |
| 15:45.44 | clock_ | I took like 8 bit game monsters put them into one picture and ran through the program |
| 15:46.11 | clock_ | and it created new monsters like birds and dwarfs and birds sitting on a tree branch and multi-headed monsters etc. |
| 15:46.30 | clock_ | Apparently, the extremely primitive algorithm somehow understood how a monster should look like |
| 15:46.41 | clock_ | wouldn't it be possible for shapes? |
| 15:47.13 | clock_ | You give it a complicated model and it ideates and phantasizes based on that? |
| 15:47.45 | starseeker | can hear the marketing slogans for GA music software "Record studios - when you can't afford or identify musical quality and talent, evolve it with Hit-Gen 3.0!" |
| 15:49.31 | clock_ | or like "Throw away all discrimination and prejudice - hitmaking for the deaf, painting for the blind!" |
| 15:50.29 | poolio | I think it'd be more interesting to have some program train on all the top hits ever and mash them together |
| 15:50.32 | clock_ | Well I solved the problem how deaf people can accompany music |
| 15:50.59 | clock_ | I wrote an analyzer that shows coloured graphs of the semitones being played and you put coloured stickers on a piano and press the same color you see is coming |
| 15:51.03 | clock_ | And it mostly sounds good. |
| 15:51.32 | clock_ | DJ Elvis and MC Jimi Hendrix |
| 15:51.37 | starseeker | poolio: agree it would be an interesting experiment to run, but I'm not sure we need any more ways to kill off human culture generation... |
| 15:52.42 | brlcad | pacman87: looking better, next bug: in hyp hyp 100 100 100 0 0 1 .5 0 0 .5 .5 ; left ; zoom 4 ; rt |
| 15:52.43 | starseeker | more interesting would be to see if such a program could identify what decade a song was most popular in based on some baseline of popular songs from the last six decades or so |
| 15:53.05 | clock_ | starseeker: it would be necessary to discriminate structure in music |
| 15:53.05 | starseeker | Perhaps you could identify core "sounds of an era" |
| 15:53.34 | clock_ | you need just one human brain in a vat |
| 15:53.39 | clock_ | with a happiness indicator |
| 15:53.49 | clock_ | feed the music in and find such music that produces the best happiness signal |
| 15:54.06 | clock_ | but would have ethical issues |
| 15:54.46 | clock_ | I hope humans will be replaced by immortal computers before I die |
| 15:55.18 | clock_ | then I will upload my mind into a compact flash chip and be killed from a falling brick animated in BRL-CAD |
| 15:55.20 | starseeker | Uh - unless you are an immortal computer I doubt that |
| 15:55.36 | clock_ | from -> by |
| 16:01.01 | pacman87 | brlcad: what problem did you see? |
| 16:10.40 | brlcad | a line right through the middle, flipped normals |
| 16:11.10 | pacman87 | screenshot plz? |
| 16:11.45 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/hypnorm.png |
| 16:12.34 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/hypnorm2.png |
| 16:12.40 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt15.png |
| 16:13.07 | brlcad | it's some near-zero tolerancing problem |
| 16:14.14 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 16:15.35 | brlcad | probably floating point fuzz, that's exactly on the midline |
| 16:15.52 | mafm | brlcad: "what were you expecting to get from them? :)" experience on using it |
| 16:16.13 | brlcad | fair nuff :) |
| 16:16.39 | brlcad | I think you just need to "pick one" and run with making it work, for better or worse |
| 16:17.14 | brlcad | I'll pick one if you want, but they do seem fairly even to be rather bikeshed issue barring any other information about the code quality and APIs |
| 16:17.49 | brlcad | how easy / hard does it seem to be to themee rbgui ? |
| 16:18.02 | mafm | I think that peole gathering in those channels are usually people like me, using OGRE for their projects, along with some core devels, sometimes of the difefferent addons themselves |
| 16:18.16 | mafm | (though I would not expect to fin rbgui devels here :) ) |
| 16:18.17 | brlcad | and does the ui scale non-raster |
| 16:18.42 | mafm | so I'm going to patch OGRE to make it work with RBGUI |
| 16:19.59 | brlcad | patch ogre, not patch rbgui? :) |
| 16:32.22 | mafm | yep... it's calling a non-existing method in some ogre class |
| 16:33.19 | mafm | http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=239174&sid=ce193664e1d3d7c4af509e6f4e2718c6 |
| 16:33.44 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31335 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: fix normals near z=0 |
| 16:33.49 | pacman87 | brlcad: try that |
| 16:41.11 | brlcad | mafm: ah, another interesting patch for rbgui+mocha here: http://www.ogre3d.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=32929&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=650 |
| 16:41.32 | brlcad | finds that method of exchanging patches utterly appalling |
| 16:42.09 | pacman87 | brlcad: i just realized i can get rid of the z=0 check by multiplying the normal vector through by z |
| 16:42.21 | brlcad | ok |
| 16:42.22 | pacman87 | and it also takes care of the z>0 conditional |
| 16:42.38 | pacman87 | so 10 lines of code -> 1 line :) |
| 16:42.44 | brlcad | excellent |
| 16:42.58 | pacman87 | testing it now |
| 16:43.49 | mafm | you mean for me to include the sources+patches of all this in our brl-cad branch? |
| 16:44.39 | mafm | oh, that function exists in OGRE-bleeding-edge-trunk at least, gonna try that first |
| 16:51.56 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@208.43.126.194) | |
| 16:54.19 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31336 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: new and improved normals\! |
| 16:55.32 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-86-41.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:59.14 | brlcad | starseeker: those circumflex A's are undoubtedly unicode conversion problems -- try changing the doctype in the html header source, maybe from utf-8 to one of the iso types |
| 16:59.24 | brlcad | or just regex replace them .. |
| 16:59.29 | brlcad | mafm: yup |
| 16:59.36 | brlcad | fully managed dependencies |
| 17:00.04 | brlcad | if we can't build it for ourselves, it's kinda silly to expect our users to be able to |
| 17:03.13 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-237-118.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 17:05.11 | brlcad | we may later pull ogre out given it's size, but for now it'll really help to consistently become familiar with their sources, build layout, etc |
| 17:06.39 | brlcad | traditionally, though, anything that is need to compile (other than the compilation environment itself) is provided with the sources and optionally/only used if a suitable system version isn't installed |
| 17:06.39 | mafm | uh, that's a huge one :) |
| 17:06.39 | brlcad | no bigger than tcl/tk iirc |
| 17:06.44 | brlcad | and you wouldn't include some of their binary goo that we don't need |
| 17:06.58 | louipc | what now? brl-cad's going to include ogre? |
| 17:07.12 | brlcad | louipc: no |
| 17:07.22 | mafm | dunno about TK, but TCL was supposed to be a tiny interpreter :) |
| 17:07.23 | brlcad | this is experimental development |
| 17:07.38 | brlcad | if it works out well, certainly |
| 17:07.57 | mafm | go for a coffee while compiling trunk |
| 17:07.59 | brlcad | separate module, though, not the brlcad module |
| 17:08.01 | mafm | brb |
| 17:08.06 | louipc | ah |
| 17:08.45 | brlcad | this can be thought of as an app that uses brl-cad's libraries/tools, a unified environment |
| 17:14.10 | brlcad | pacman87: that seems to have done the trick! |
| 17:16.55 | louipc | mafm: well it's pretty small compared to others. |
| 17:21.43 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 17:36.06 | brlcad | pacman87: the primitive is nicely robust down to computation tolerance sizes... very nice! |
| 17:36.22 | brlcad | e.g. a hyp that is only 0.0005 mm tall |
| 17:50.01 | pacman87 | how exactly is the tesselation stored in the nmgregion? |
| 18:29.15 | brlcad | faces, loops, edges, vertices |
| 18:29.27 | brlcad | they stitch together a solid surface |
| 18:33.03 | pacman87 | what is tess() used for; ie, how can i test it? |
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| 18:40.19 | pacman87 | what's the best way to handle the case where the ellipse's major axis vector isnt' perpendicular to the height? |
| 18:41.33 | pacman87 | give an error and refuse to work, or just take the component of the vector that is perpendicular? |
| 18:42.43 | pacman87 | in test hyp 0 0 0 0 0 4 0 1 1 1 1 |
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| 18:45.11 | mafm | OGRE crashing my X... no good >:[ |
| 18:46.21 | louipc | heheh |
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| 18:55.21 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/shot2.png :) |
| 19:00.25 | louipc | what is it? :P |
| 19:00.41 | IriX64 | computer burped and that came out :) |
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| 19:03.59 | andrecastelo | good afternoon guys |
| 19:05.29 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 19:05.46 | andrecastelo | hey pacman87, how are u ? |
| 19:12.32 | pacman87 | pretty good, still trying to wrap my mind around tess() |
| 19:12.38 | pacman87 | how are you? |
| 19:12.38 | ibot | pacman87: mas o menos |
| 19:15.54 | andrecastelo | pretty good too, got some free time, trying to work my way into stting up a grid |
| 19:15.59 | andrecastelo | s/stting/setting |
| 19:27.16 | brlcad | pacman87: tess is used by most of the converters -- you can test it with the E and/or ev commands inside mged |
| 19:54.17 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: mlt's view_setup() will be pretty similar to rt's view_setup() ? perhaps expanding it a little to handle mlt specific stuff?? |
| 20:08.07 | mafm | be back tomorrow or sunday to recover a bit of the time and speed up things |
| 20:08.34 | mafm | and fix this OGRE thing broking my X-Windows :P |
| 20:08.40 | mafm | cya |
| 20:46.20 | pacman87 | hmm, the ehy will accept a major axis vector that's not perpendicular to the height vector, but ehy's export5() gives a scary error message. Would it be better to check this in typein.c instead of export5()? |
| 21:23.23 | ``Erik | 2/det |
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| 23:30.56 | brlcad | pacman87: you should check in both places .. there are other ways to directly create primitives that side-step typein |
| 23:31.35 | brlcad | export is ultimately where it's "actually" created on disk, so that makes sense too |
| 23:35.42 | brlcad | otherwise you could handle it in a variety of ways, but probably not worth the effort |
| 23:38.56 | brlcad | andrecastelo: likely very similar or even empty |
| 23:39.20 | brlcad | view_init is rarely used .. it's what you can do after you know your view grid but before you've prep'd geometry .. which isn't very much |
| 23:40.48 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i see.. i have a night class now but i'll be back in an hour, an hour and a half.. will you be online then? |
| 23:42.17 | andrecastelo | hehe, i'm kinda late, so cya later |
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| 01:41.14 | kolnstyle_ | about how much time it would take to rotate by 45 degrees and scale by a factor of 2 a 500x500px image while using biquintic interpolation? |
| 01:41.21 | kolnstyle_ | a rough estimate is fine |
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| 02:02.49 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad - is it ok to use bu_bomb() in the center point calculations, in the case of an empty list? |
| 02:04.11 | yukonbob | afternoon, cadheads |
| 02:19.11 | starseeker | 's eyebrows go up as he reads the RBGui readme file - so far they only have windows build logic?? ugh |
| 02:22.56 | andrecastelo | good evening yukonbob |
| 02:24.37 | starseeker | is beginning to understand properly why brlcad thought there weren't any really great options... |
| 02:37.53 | andrecastelo | how can i initialize a bu_list will null? head->l = BU_LIST_NULL; ??? |
| 02:56.44 | brlcad | andrecastelo: center point calculations? |
| 02:57.21 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yep, i'm BUnitizing the rtarea patch |
| 02:57.39 | brlcad | bu_bomb should be used for exceptional failures -- usually either code that really should *never* be reached, or situations where continuing very well may put users data at risk (e.g. detected corruption) |
| 02:58.11 | andrecastelo | hm ok then.. the function returns zero if any trouble arises |
| 02:58.32 | andrecastelo | but my problem right now is initializing the point lits |
| 02:58.36 | andrecastelo | s/lits/lists |
| 02:58.45 | brlcad | if there's no way to reasonably continue the application, but it's not critical, you could call bu_exit |
| 02:59.07 | brlcad | bu_bomb would be cases where you might actually want a stack trace to know just how the f*ck you got to that point in the code |
| 02:59.54 | andrecastelo | you're right, that won't be needed here.. and i think even in the mlt stuff it won't be that serious |
| 03:00.58 | andrecastelo | i'll paste you my problem, just a sec |
| 03:02.46 | andrecastelo | here - http://rafb.net/p/Nmgo0C33.html |
| 03:03.13 | andrecastelo | my doubt is - how do i set up a bu_list? |
| 03:04.21 | andrecastelo | i've made the appropriate changes in other sections, where the list is iterated through and stuff and also used vector macros to handle points (is that ok?) |
| 03:06.42 | brlcad | of course, using existing libraries is always a good thing |
| 03:08.26 | brlcad | andrecastelo: did you read the header block for bu_list in include/bu.h ? |
| 03:09.05 | andrecastelo | yes, i even implemented a bu_list type in a separate program, just to test and become familiar with the list |
| 03:10.35 | brlcad | that's good |
| 03:11.47 | andrecastelo | what am i missing? |
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| 03:25.57 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31337 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: include a simple example of one way to use a bu_list |
| 03:27.16 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that line is a problem because you're trying to set a structure type to an integer scalar type |
| 03:28.16 | andrecastelo | yeah, i know, i was trying to find a way to initialize the lists involving BU_LIST_NULL (because later on i use BU_LIST_UNINITIALIZED to check if it's ready) |
| 03:28.17 | brlcad | you wouldn't try to do this for example: struct area foo = 0; ... you'd only do that with a pointer, struct area *foo = 0; |
| 03:28.56 | brlcad | see the example I just added to bu.h, see if that helps |
| 03:30.12 | andrecastelo | hm ok, will do |
| 03:30.26 | andrecastelo | is the point list structure correct? |
| 03:30.28 | brlcad | to use BU_LIST_NULL, you'd actually normally do something like set your hit_points = BU_LIST_NULL |
| 03:30.39 | brlcad | until you allocate it of course |
| 03:31.04 | brlcad | sure, looks fine |
| 03:34.36 | andrecastelo | thanks, will check |
| 03:35.42 | starseeker | Hmm - http://ogre4j.sourceforge.net/ |
| 03:35.49 | starseeker | That could be useful |
| 03:36.24 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:36.40 | starseeker | if a certain project ever reaches such a stage... |
| 03:38.19 | brlcad | possibly |
| 03:38.29 | brlcad | so you doing anything more with oed/ |
| 03:38.45 | brlcad | the html dump that is |
| 03:38.52 | brlcad | or just playing around |
| 03:38.59 | starseeker | Just playing around, so far |
| 03:39.03 | brlcad | k |
| 03:39.05 | starseeker | testing the xhtml output |
| 03:39.43 | starseeker | indicently, how do I spot the friggin unicode character if it only shows up when served from bz? |
| 03:39.47 | brlcad | who was it that was trying to import the infobox wikipedia template ? |
| 03:40.15 | brlcad | would be good if someone figured out what needs to happen for that to work, would be really useful for documentation |
| 03:43.16 | starseeker | googles infobox... |
| 03:43.22 | brlcad | you can see the unicode character in emacs |
| 03:43.34 | brlcad | (as ?? in text mode or c2a0 in hexl-mode) |
| 03:43.45 | brlcad | it's a no-break space character |
| 03:45.57 | starseeker | should actually figure out how to get xsltproc not to generate it... |
| 03:47.02 | brlcad | some insight, http://ask.metafilter.com/71246/What-the-Ã |
| 03:47.57 | brlcad | but yeah, better at the xsltproc phase probably, if there's a setting to output ISO 8859-1 instead of UTF-8 |
| 03:48.23 | pacman87 | brlcad: the infobox wiki template was me |
| 03:50.57 | andrecastelo | brlcad: here, http://rafb.net/p/hWwqDq60.html (i'll delete the comments i added, though) |
| 03:51.42 | brlcad | andrecastelo: does it work? :) |
| 03:52.34 | andrecastelo | yep, it does, but only for the presented areas |
| 03:56.06 | starseeker | brlcad: Looks like the way to do it is to correct the XSL stylesheet and use a custom one... |
| 03:57.21 | andrecastelo | also, can i take struct point_list to an include/ header?? i'll need it in viewmlt.c.. though it's not that big deal |
| 03:57.22 | starseeker | or perhaps I can fake it out with a fragment... |
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| 04:00.30 | brlcad | andrecastelo: possibly |
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| 04:11.59 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31338 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: commentify cleanup the bu_list section |
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| 04:23.03 | starseeker | brlcad: Is bz somehow forcing things to be ISO 8859-1? I'm really confused that if I load the file locally in firefox it works and the same page on bz doesn't... |
| 04:27.41 | starseeker | growls at xsl and realizes setting this up isn't so simple... |
| 04:27.50 | starseeker | ok, bedtime... |
| 04:28.43 | brlcad | andrecastelo: it looks like there's already a linked list point structure, but it may be obsolete/unused |
| 04:29.15 | brlcad | er, never mind .. not unused |
| 04:37.48 | brlcad | andrecastelo: there's an rt_pt_node structure that's a simple forward linked list of point_t |
| 04:38.43 | brlcad | so it'd be interested to update that structure to use bu_list instead of it's custom implementation and see what kind of impact it'd make if any on performance |
| 04:38.55 | brlcad | s/interested/interesting/ |
| 04:39.56 | brlcad | otherwise .. both mlrt and rtarea are in the same location so your structure could be in a private header instead of something in include/ |
| 04:42.52 | andrecastelo | i see, i see.. the structure is in a header in include/ ? |
| 04:43.05 | brlcad | yeah |
| 04:43.23 | brlcad | it looks like it's basically a light-weight linked list for primitive construction |
| 04:43.48 | brlcad | from the look of the primitives, it might even predate the structure |
| 04:49.01 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll take a look in a while :D |
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| 09:19.38 | LeRuCh | 05 Afternoon people! |
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| 13:19.52 | brlcad | finds a handful of remaining hyp issues to resolve |
| 13:34.08 | brlcad | pacman87: woo hoo, looking great ... http://brlcad.org/tmp/hyp.png |
| 13:34.34 | brlcad | a few things I've noticed though .. it's really hard to line up the parameters with that c parameter |
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| 13:35.30 | brlcad | I'd really like to define the height and base ellipse and have those stick .. then the c parameter just be how much to pinch |
| 13:35.59 | brlcad | since the common case is likely going to be attaching it to rcc and tgc |
| 13:36.22 | brlcad | I had to do my own newtonian iterative search to find the right c to get this to line up: http://brlcad.org/tmp/hyp_pinch.png |
| 13:37.23 | brlcad | and I don't know how feasible it is, but it'd be really cool if it could be done without the discontinuity |
| 13:38.22 | brlcad | the other two things I noticed are that the center point should be the center of the base for consistency (see the tgc as an example), not the center of the primitve (l command should list top center point too (see tgc)) |
| 13:38.52 | brlcad | also, the uv mapping seems off on the scaling -- you can see here: http://brlcad.org/tmp/hyp_pinch_checker.png |
| 13:40.23 | brlcad | tgc has the right number of vertical sections for that scaling (10), hyp also seems to be starting from a different angle |
| 13:41.34 | brlcad | after that, that just leaves the make, mirror, and gui additions and I think it'll be done! .. very cool work :-) |
| 13:41.45 | brlcad | prepares an announcement |
| 13:41.53 | brlcad | also packs for his flight |
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| 16:42.11 | andrecastelo_ | good morning all |
| 16:42.18 | andrecastelo_ | have a good flight, brlcad :) |
| 16:43.27 | dtidrow | brlcad: where are you headed? |
| 17:43.43 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've found rt_pt_node and the files that use it, so I will update everything to handle rt_pt_node with bu_lists |
| 17:49.18 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 17:49.50 | andrecastelo | hey hi yukonbob |
| 17:59.41 | andrecastelo | http://rafb.net/p/vif2oc76.html |
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| 19:00.55 | brlcad | andrecastelo: still in route |
| 19:01.14 | brlcad | dtidrow: was up in NY, now heading back to baltimore |
| 19:01.40 | brlcad | andrecastelo: when you do that -- set up some profile tests so you can compare before and after |
| 19:01.52 | brlcad | I don't suspect it'sll be any worse, but it's worth a simple sanity check |
| 19:02.25 | andrecastelo | i see.. i'm correcting a little bug here in rtarea and will commit it, is that a problem? |
| 19:03.16 | andrecastelo | the rt_pt_node update to bu_list will affect rpc.c, ehy.c, epa.c, eto.c and rhc.c, so i need to change those as well |
| 19:03.46 | andrecastelo | are those primitives? |
| 19:05.09 | brlcad | andrecastelo: fixing bugs is *never* a problem ;) |
| 19:05.21 | brlcad | those are all primitives you listed |
| 19:05.39 | andrecastelo | heheh, i mean commiting with the struct point_list, instead of rt_pt_node |
| 19:05.43 | pacman87 | brlcad: is it possible to have two (or more) ways to give parameters to a primitive? |
| 19:05.56 | pacman87 | ie, give the user the option of what data to input? |
| 19:05.58 | brlcad | right parabolic cylinder, elliptical hyperboloid, elliptical paraboloid, etc |
| 19:06.37 | brlcad | pacman87: not via the 'in' command |
| 19:07.17 | brlcad | it's pretty linear in letting the user specify parameters in one way consistently |
| 19:07.24 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: the *.c files you mentioned are |
| 19:08.14 | brlcad | the "make" command provides a different way to input data in a way, creates a default that fills the current view |
| 19:08.20 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've taken a look at those files and the sections that use the structure, and made a few alterations, just a sec and i'll paste |
| 19:08.33 | brlcad | then you can provide whatever editing options on the edit menu |
| 19:09.11 | brlcad | that's the most common you'll find if there are other edit parameters (like increasing a length when length wasn't a creation parameter |
| 19:11.01 | brlcad | andrecastelo: if you test them to work, go ahead and commit the changes -- I can (and do) just as easily review the commit e-mails |
| 19:11.22 | andrecastelo | ok ok, i'll commit rtarea, it's ready |
| 19:11.24 | brlcad | if there's a problem, I'd ask you to revert .. that's where small commits helps for reviewing |
| 19:11.44 | brlcad | rtarea amounts to trying some test cases |
| 19:11.48 | pacman87 | here's the changes i think you want, correct me if i missed anything: |
| 19:11.48 | pacman87 | move vertex to center of bottom; change height to measure base to base; ellipse axes specify base dimensions; scale factor determines pinch |
| 19:11.50 | brlcad | boards his flight, waves |
| 19:12.13 | poolio | brlcad: have a good flight :) |
| 19:12.20 | poolio | it's super hot here, don't die :( |
| 19:13.47 | andrecastelo | hehe |
| 19:13.54 | andrecastelo | have a good flight, cya later |
| 19:15.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31339 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: |
| 19:15.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: Added calculation of the presented area center. Added structure point_list, a |
| 19:15.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: bu_list that holds points, and struct area got two lists - exp_points and |
| 19:15.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: hit_points. The calculation of the center point is the same for both, but the |
| 19:15.38 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: gathering of the points is different and this commit takes care of the |
| 19:15.41 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: hit_points assembling. |
| 19:17.29 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31340 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: Added more comments in the area_center() function, as it was a bit unclear as what the for() was doing. |
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| 22:09.34 | yukonbob | . |
| 23:35.27 | yukonbob | build error for interested people: http://www.pastebin.ca/1041645 |
| 23:35.51 | yukonbob | ^--- bu_bomb issues w/ latest svn |
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| 02:29.41 | brlcad | arrives home with a quaint sigh of relaxation |
| 02:29.53 | pacman87 | wb, brlcad |
| 02:30.11 | brlcad | thanks poolio .. though it was pretty much the same temp up in NY today as here, 90-something before I left |
| 02:30.16 | brlcad | thanks pacman87 |
| 02:30.30 | pacman87 | a question on the uv mapping |
| 02:30.52 | brlcad | k |
| 02:30.58 | pacman87 | is each (u,v) point supposed to be unique? |
| 02:31.05 | brlcad | unique? |
| 02:31.28 | pacman87 | ie, if i know the (u,v) coordinate, there's exactly one (x,y,z) coordinate on the shape |
| 02:32.57 | pacman87 | because i have my base use 0<v<.25; the body uses .25<v<.75; and the top uses .75<v<1 |
| 02:34.04 | pacman87 | so if you use "s 10" on the checker, there's 5 squares on the sides |
| 02:34.05 | brlcad | an unique in the sense of there being a 1-to-1 mapping, yes that's ideal (but not strictly necessary for many modeling systems) |
| 02:35.03 | pacman87 | the rec's you used in your example have 10 checker squares on the body, and 10 on each endplate |
| 02:35.10 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:36.05 | pacman87 | so it looks like the v coord ranges (0,1) three times; once for each face |
| 02:38.01 | brlcad | iirc, the intent is to treat the uv mapping as a volumetric mapping since these are applied as part of more complex CSG recipes |
| 02:39.16 | pacman87 | hmm? |
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| 03:01.32 | brlcad | pacman87: i just meant that there's a variety of possible default uv mappings |
| 03:01.51 | brlcad | if we did this a lot, there'd be easier ways for users to define their own uv mappings |
| 03:01.56 | pacman87 | http://brlcad.org/tmp/hyp_pinch_checker.png |
| 03:02.08 | brlcad | as it stands, though, it's taken to be like a volumetric mapping |
| 03:02.16 | brlcad | so you get the mapping effectivley from the inside out |
| 03:02.32 | pacman87 | i switched the rotation since then, so lines up now |
| 03:02.47 | brlcad | which amounts to having the uv mapping per *surface* instead of per primitive |
| 03:03.13 | brlcad | cool |
| 03:03.16 | pacman87 | if that's the standard way of doing it, i can fix that too |
| 03:03.19 | brlcad | what was the offset? |
| 03:03.38 | pacman87 | i had x and y swithed in atan() |
| 03:03.51 | brlcad | ah, nifty |
| 03:04.05 | brlcad | i actually figured it was something intentional going on in tgc that was different |
| 03:04.16 | pacman87 | so should i switch to per-surface for UV? |
| 03:04.28 | brlcad | yeah, just so it's consistent |
| 03:04.35 | brlcad | that's how all the other primitives behave |
| 03:04.40 | poolio | brlcad: welcome home :) |
| 03:04.43 | brlcad | there is a good reason to do as you suggest |
| 03:05.08 | pacman87 | ok. the problem i though of with that is for texture mapping, if you want to specify a different top/bottom texture |
| 03:05.51 | brlcad | to have a primitive-based uv mapping that is holistic instead of per-surface, but that'd really beg changing all the primitives and that'd definitely not be backwards compatible even if it is render-only |
| 03:07.02 | brlcad | pacman87: there are other ways, you can always composite the textures or specify that a given texture map with a v range of 1/3 etc |
| 03:07.36 | brlcad | given you specify one texture per object, you'd have to composite them anyways to get perface to work |
| 03:08.11 | brlcad | poolio: danka |
| 03:08.26 | pacman87 | from what i understand, the uv coords tell which pixel to grab from the texture image |
| 03:09.04 | pacman87 | so if the same uv pair shows up on the top and the body, the same pixel will go there, right? |
| 03:09.20 | brlcad | with a 0 to 1 uv domain, yes |
| 03:09.45 | pacman87 | dont' all the primitives follow that? |
| 03:10.03 | brlcad | you specify he uv domain when you add textures, so you could set the domain to be less or more as needed |
| 03:10.11 | poolio | brlcad: so I've got sphere and right cylinder working...they don't raytrace right but I'm pretty sure they are correct. I was going to commit them but I think I'll wait til I get ell and a generalized algorithm for cylinders and just use that instead of having a whole mess of different code |
| 03:10.35 | brlcad | poolio: so then why aren't you committing anything?? |
| 03:10.48 | brlcad | there's no need to wait for committing things |
| 03:11.41 | poolio | ok...good point. commit working code and fix later :) |
| 03:11.43 | brlcad | almost never, really, even if it's incomplete or even non-functional -- so long as the state is documented and it doesn't leave the compilation in a busted state |
| 03:12.05 | brlcad | commit early, commit often |
| 03:12.13 | brlcad | for new committers, you really can't commit too frequently |
| 03:12.27 | poolio | oy vey. i need to stamp that on my forehead |
| 03:12.28 | brlcad | seriously, if it compiles and is forward progress, commit |
| 03:12.48 | brlcad | commit -m ftw |
| 03:13.37 | brlcad | svn commit -m "yay, initial brep support for spheres isn't working yet" primitives/sph/sph_brep.cpp etc |
| 03:14.38 | brlcad | then it just sort of becomes a documented "save" step in your development progress and it tells a story |
| 03:15.41 | brlcad | really likies http://brlcad.org/tmp/hyp.png ... I think that might have to go up on the wiki somewhere |
| 03:16.41 | starseeker | can upload it to the renders gallery |
| 03:16.41 | pacman87 | you couldnt' get one where the checker dont' hit the middle of the edge? |
| 03:16.52 | pacman87 | *checkers *don't |
| 03:17.18 | pacman87 | my apostrophes never end up in the right place |
| 03:17.51 | brlcad | could have, but I actually kind of like it that way |
| 03:17.57 | pacman87 | ah |
| 03:18.11 | pacman87 | well, once i fix the uv mapping, it'll be impossible ;) |
| 03:18.15 | brlcad | :) |
| 03:18.21 | poolio | brlcad: is there no longer rt_sph_internal? just rt_ell_internal? |
| 03:18.42 | pacman87 | in sph.s shp is stored as ell |
| 03:19.28 | brlcad | pacmac87, only in depth .. it should still wrap there |
| 03:19.48 | brlcad | i.e. white to white, black to black (at least for uv scale of 10) |
| 03:20.34 | starseeker | brlcad: which is preferable - gallery or wiki? |
| 03:20.39 | pacman87 | not if the top ellipse goes 0->1 and the side starts over again at 0 |
| 03:21.00 | brlcad | starseeker: depends on the purpose :) |
| 03:21.25 | brlcad | i think wiki myself, unless someone is going to make snazzy pictures of all of the primitives :) |
| 03:21.46 | brlcad | a better version of my primitives overview |
| 03:21.49 | starseeker | heh - we could make an album and stick it in with the metaballs primitive |
| 03:22.01 | starseeker | already a render of that up |
| 03:24.23 | brlcad | oh cool, I hadn't seen the GSI images were up |
| 03:25.46 | starseeker | yes, Rain did a good job with those |
| 03:27.27 | brlcad | oh, I got a database of almost 2000 polygonal models while I was up at the conference |
| 03:27.34 | brlcad | lots of fun to be had |
| 03:28.03 | starseeker | <jaw drops> |
| 03:28.14 | starseeker | what licensing terms? |
| 03:29.36 | starseeker | smacks head to get the idea of writing a docbook overview of all the primitives out of it... |
| 03:30.52 | starseeker | arrgh... |
| 03:36.33 | starseeker | ding nab it, why does that sound like fun??? |
| 03:37.51 | brlcad | it was fun to make it the first time |
| 03:38.05 | brlcad | chance to fix some things too |
| 03:38.07 | starseeker | ah - well, it's not just me at least :-) |
| 03:38.48 | starseeker | would probably go whole-hog though - equations describing primitives, key parameter descriptions and illustrations... maybe I'd better do it on my own time... |
| 03:41.47 | brlcad | welp, since he will be working on some more, if you want to add a primitives album .. that is probably better than nothing, go for it |
| 03:42.16 | starseeker | k - it'll do for a start anwyay |
| 03:42.42 | starseeker | in diagrams or renders? |
| 03:43.36 | starseeker | will stick it in renderings for now |
| 03:45.56 | brlcad | renderings |
| 03:46.27 | brlcad | the others are only in diagrams because they have labels .. diagramming what they are |
| 03:46.55 | brlcad | attempts to move the m1a1 pic so that it preserves the hit count |
| 03:47.32 | poolio | brlcad: so you'll be worrying about coding all the plotting and raytracing of the BREP shapes? :D |
| 03:48.00 | brlcad | they already plot in a simplistic form |
| 03:48.11 | brlcad | ray-tracing is what I'm working on |
| 03:48.34 | poolio | brlcad: The sphere I have plots half of an arc...that's it |
| 03:48.35 | brlcad | at least what I'm trying to work on |
| 03:48.44 | brlcad | that sounds right |
| 03:48.46 | poolio | :) |
| 03:48.54 | brlcad | really it does :) |
| 03:49.05 | poolio | The raytracing looks decent...it's been gooing for aorund 5 minutes |
| 03:49.06 | brlcad | it plots the edges of the surface(s) |
| 03:49.19 | brlcad | a sphere has just one surface |
| 03:49.19 | poolio | You have a lot of purty debugging |
| 03:49.26 | poolio | ah, makes sense |
| 03:49.56 | brlcad | the left and right u parameters meet, the top and bottom collapse to a point |
| 03:50.02 | brlcad | so you're left with one arc |
| 03:50.20 | brlcad | and a surface that sweeps out a sphere |
| 03:51.25 | poolio | Hehe, I'm still trying to fully understand the brep representation...I'm still resting on the crutches of the openNURBS fancy schmancy helper functions |
| 03:52.01 | brlcad | yeah, that might be good thing to go over on a thursday sometime |
| 03:52.16 | brlcad | ed loves to talk about that |
| 03:53.11 | poolio | yeah that'd be great :) |
| 03:53.49 | poolio | I think I also just need to read throgh some intro CAD / 3d graphics stuff. I managed to get through all of last summer knowing zip about it |
| 03:55.26 | poolio | brlcad: Is there a reason that the .cpp footers use C99 // comments? Woldn't it make more sense to keep it the same as the .c files? |
| 03:55.30 | poolio | (the headers are the same) |
| 04:03.29 | starseeker | metaballs had its rating survive when I moved it, once I enabled ratings in the target location |
| 04:03.38 | starseeker | should sleep now... |
| 04:04.53 | brlcad | ugh, gallery is such an inefficient pig of a web app |
| 04:06.16 | brlcad | poolio: no huge reason other than it being a few characters less and it distinguishes them as c++ |
| 04:06.36 | brlcad | unlike c, // has been part of c++ since before it was ratified |
| 04:06.53 | poolio | Ah ok. I was just thinking it'd be nice to keep a standard look even between C/C++ |
| 04:06.59 | brlcad | so they're not "C99" comments in that file's context as it's never compiled by a c99 compiler |
| 04:08.01 | brlcad | I don't think it needs to be enforced as one way vs the other, rather insignificant |
| 04:08.03 | poolio | brlcad: True, but coming from coding C forever, they are always C99 comments, no matter where I put them ;) |
| 04:08.05 | brlcad | if it's bothering you, go for it ;) |
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| 04:08.17 | poolio | Eh it's fine, I was just like //woah! |
| 04:08.41 | brlcad | fair game in the c++ files ;) |
| 04:09.20 | brlcad | I actually like the "wrapped blocks" more regardless of it being c/c++ for that footer |
| 04:09.39 | brlcad | but like I said, it just didn't matter and another project requested that footer.sh use // |
| 04:09.54 | brlcad | (template.sh uses header.sh and footer.sh) |
| 04:10.06 | brlcad | (for creating new files) |
| 04:13.41 | starseeker | Hmm... http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/hyp_odd.png |
| 04:14.01 | starseeker | in test.s hyp 0 0 0 1 1 1 1 0 0 .4 .8 |
| 04:18.29 | brlcad | there have been 53k views of the gallery |
| 04:18.58 | brlcad | looks like an imae for pacman87 :) |
| 04:19.22 | brlcad | notes the my. is not needed |
| 04:21.11 | thing0 | hey brlcad |
| 04:21.17 | thing0 | how's things? |
| 04:28.19 | brlcad | howdy thing0 |
| 04:28.26 | brlcad | going great |
| 04:28.38 | brlcad | how are things down under? |
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| 04:36.17 | brlcad | that good, eh? |
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| 06:09.18 | LeRuCh | 05 Hello! |
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| 13:35.32 | pacman87 | starseeker: i noticed that too. it's because your major axis isn't perpendicular to the height vector, and i haven't done any sanity checking to prevent that. |
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| 14:54.59 | mafm | allo |
| 15:44.01 | poolio | brlcad: so I don't think I have commit access...? |
| 15:49.10 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31341 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sph/sph_brep.cpp: initial brep support for spheres, nonfunctional |
| 15:49.13 | poolio | ah neverminddd :) |
| 16:27.15 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:27.22 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
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| 18:09.02 | mafm | do all the code conventions apply for the rt^3 module? |
| 18:09.56 | mafm | or are they something left from old codebases? |
| 18:25.24 | poolio | mafm: as in the C code conventions in HACKING? |
| 18:26.39 | mafm | yep |
| 18:26.48 | poolio | I don't see why they wouldn't apply :) |
| 18:27.36 | brlcad | mafm: what in particular -- for the most part yes as the intent is still to be consistent across the project |
| 18:27.53 | brlcad | and most of the conventions for C still apply to C++ |
| 18:29.01 | mafm | dunno... being a new module "cleanly" gives the opportunity to change something, without mixing conventions |
| 18:29.31 | poolio | brlcad: Is it fine if I don't bother to update Makefiles and what not for now |
| 18:30.13 | brlcad | mafm: heh, there's nothing legacy about the choice of conventions .. |
| 18:30.47 | brlcad | poolio: if you're adding new files, they should at least be added to EXTRA_DIST even if they're not added to the build |
| 18:30.53 | brlcad | so that they are included in source distribution |
| 18:30.58 | mafm | i.e. I think that people lately tends to use tabs for indentation, so it can be configured the size of a tab in different IDEs |
| 18:31.37 | brlcad | eh, I figured that was where you were probably going with that |
| 18:31.40 | brlcad | and it's just not true |
| 18:32.07 | brlcad | there are plenty of ws conventions and zealotry of preferences raging throughout projects for different styles |
| 18:32.20 | brlcad | there are at least a half dozen "exceptionally popular" styles |
| 18:32.37 | brlcad | and just about every IDE lets you configure it to suit any of them |
| 18:34.13 | brlcad | the real need in that case is to just be consistent, and to enforce that consistency |
| 18:35.15 | mafm | oki :) |
| 18:38.01 | brlcad | it's mostly just familiarity .. the more code you write in different styles, the more I think you'll find that it just really doesn't matter |
| 18:38.03 | mafm | should I modify the RtApplication and the rest of placeholder classes directly? |
| 18:38.06 | brlcad | there are tradeoffs to each |
| 18:38.53 | brlcad | I was thinking that you'd add your own directory |
| 18:38.59 | brlcad | not the rt^3 dir |
| 18:39.38 | brlcad | you can use the structure as a template or not |
| 18:39.56 | brlcad | the existing source isn't so important, it can totally change if needed |
| 18:40.53 | mafm | 3dge? :) |
| 18:41.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:41.20 | brlcad | if that's what you want to call it, go for it :) |
| 18:41.32 | brlcad | clever |
| 18:42.41 | mafm | just made it up now... hadn't thought of it |
| 18:43.51 | brlcad | I have had a name in mind for several years now but it's not time to start using that yet :) |
| 18:44.01 | brlcad | need the geometry engine and plugin architecture first |
| 18:44.32 | pacman87 | brlcad: what tolerance should i put on the check to see if two vectors a perpendicular? |
| 18:44.47 | pacman87 | NEAR_ZERO( VDOT( rip->hyp_H, rip->hyp_Au ), SMALL_FASTF )? |
| 18:47.28 | brlcad | RT_DOT_TOL |
| 18:48.48 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31342 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: change uv() to conform to standard practice; (u,v) coords are unique per face, not per primitive |
| 18:51.22 | pacman87 | brlcad: is there a valid reason for allowing the major axis vector to be non-perpendicular to the height? |
| 18:53.59 | brlcad | you mean the major axis of the ellipse? |
| 18:54.02 | pacman87 | yes |
| 18:54.21 | pacman87 | re: starseeker's picture |
| 18:54.58 | brlcad | unless it's actually going to act like a tgc and allow end caps be at angles, I don't see a need |
| 18:55.39 | pacman87 | ok, then my fix to starseeker's problem is to say "that's not allowed" |
| 18:55.59 | brlcad | well, if it's not allowed, it shouldn't allow one to be made |
| 18:56.11 | brlcad | with checks during in and export |
| 18:56.14 | pacman87 | right, that's my next commit :) |
| 18:56.39 | pacman87 | i haven't done any sanity checking for inputs yet |
| 18:57.22 | brlcad | now I do think that there's no need to limit the A/B ellipse vectors |
| 18:58.09 | brlcad | i.e. instead of taking input for major and then saying minor must be <= .. just take a vector and the perpendicular distance, then have the in command figure out which then is major/minor |
| 18:58.15 | brlcad | minor usability nit |
| 18:58.31 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 18:58.45 | brlcad | since you can obviously swap them and it'll be fine |
| 18:59.00 | pacman87 | and calculate the new major axis vector |
| 18:59.06 | brlcad | yeah |
| 19:00.43 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31343 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: add check to ensure ellipse's major axis is perpendicular to the height vector when creating a hyp or ehy using 'in' |
| 19:01.15 | mafm | hmmm, what happens when you include a header when in your include path there are several with the same name? only one is inserted? |
| 19:05.19 | brlcad | first one the preprocessor encounters |
| 19:05.39 | brlcad | which is based on the -I cpp_flags/paths |
| 19:15.36 | brlcad | starseeker: is oedtmp still needed? |
| 19:15.48 | brlcad | removed the A's |
| 19:17.30 | starseeker | brlcad: opps - nope, sorry |
| 19:18.08 | starseeker | strictly speaking, oed isn't either until I figure out the xsl fun |
| 19:18.26 | starseeker | my initial attempt didn't do squat |
| 19:19.27 | starseeker | cleaned up |
| 19:19.40 | brlcad | eep |
| 19:19.45 | brlcad | was playing in oed/ |
| 19:20.00 | brlcad | oh well :) |
| 19:20.24 | mafm | what's oed? |
| 19:20.46 | brlcad | a tutorial he wrote on the oed command |
| 19:20.49 | brlcad | object editing |
| 19:20.49 | pacman87 | how do i add an '!' to my commit message? |
| 19:21.10 | brlcad | pacman87: use single quotes or the editor |
| 19:21.36 | pacman87 | single quotes around the -m message, or around the !? |
| 19:21.36 | brlcad | there's a way to escape it in a double-quoted message, but I forget exactly |
| 19:21.44 | brlcad | around the -m |
| 19:22.03 | pacman87 | ok, i tried \! earlier, and it printed both characters |
| 19:22.50 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31344 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: hyp now accepts a minor axis length larger than the given major axis, and recalculates the direction of the major axis. Also includes logic fix for previous commit NEAR_ZERO -> !NEAR_ZERO |
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| 19:49.57 | mafm | heh, RBGui feels snappy |
| 19:55.08 | mafm | brlcad: LGPL v2.1 or v3? |
| 19:55.14 | brlcad | 2.1 |
| 19:55.47 | brlcad | should be using the same headers as for the reset of the brlcad sources |
| 19:57.34 | brlcad | if you've got things working .. there should be some commits coming soon then? :) |
| 19:59.32 | mafm | I thought that I saw the LGPLv3 flying around in the new module... it must be because of the 3 in Rt^3 :D |
| 20:00.27 | mafm | The commits yep, but I hope that you accept half-working stuff, it needs a lot of infrastructure (data files, etc) |
| 20:01.35 | mafm | do you think that "3dge" could give any problem? when compiling it was complaining because 3DGE_WHATEVER_H was not a valid name, so I changed it to __NAME__ (as it's in other files of rtgeom and the like) |
| 20:02.07 | mafm | but that made me thought if it could bring some problems in other parts as well, starting the name with a number |
| 20:02.14 | mafm | number->digit |
| 20:07.24 | pacman87 | mafm: you could try edg3 |
| 20:08.06 | brlcad | mafm: yep, half-working something is better than fully-working nothing ;) |
| 20:08.32 | pacman87 | brlcad: i've got your new and improved hyp input method coming right up :) |
| 20:08.49 | pacman87 | though it seems my uv mapping fix didn't fix everything |
| 20:08.53 | brlcad | yeah, symbols (vars, functions, etc) can't start with a number |
| 20:09.18 | brlcad | having a dir named that shouldn't be a problem |
| 20:09.24 | brlcad | nor bin target |
| 20:09.32 | brlcad | pacman87: cool :) |
| 20:09.52 | pacman87 | i just changed hyp_in(), all the internal data is still stored the same |
| 20:10.55 | mafm | maybe ge3d? geometry editor 3d? but the pun was to change the m in mged ;) |
| 20:12.04 | brlcad | heh, g3d would be interesting |
| 20:12.18 | brlcad | as mged's original name was "ged" |
| 20:12.31 | mafm | I know that dirs etc is not a problem [in modern systems], but who knows... maybe it gives problems in target names for MSVC or things like that |
| 20:12.50 | mafm | ok, so g3d be it |
| 20:13.26 | brlcad | ah, see I took it to be clever because it was 3dge -> edge -> new interface uses an explicit polygonal representation for visualization, i.e. an "edge-based" representation |
| 20:13.43 | brlcad | but the mged angle (pun intended) is clever too |
| 20:14.02 | brlcad | g3d is nice and succinct, though |
| 20:14.27 | brlcad | though there is .. http://g3d-cpp.sourceforge.net/ |
| 20:15.38 | mafm | yep, but well... that would be the g3d tool in brl-cad similar to the other gazillion ones, not a full product name I guess? |
| 20:16.08 | mafm | nowadays anything with 3d in the name is probably taken anyway :D |
| 20:16.58 | brlcad | yeah, it shouldn't matter so much just yet as it can be basically considered the internal dev name |
| 20:18.22 | mafm | well, you know how it works... in the end nobody renames just for the pain of renaming files and so on |
| 20:18.36 | brlcad | sometimes |
| 20:19.19 | mafm | and about the commits, I meant half-working because in brlcad-trunk you require people not broking things, checking performances and so on |
| 20:19.20 | brlcad | except in this case, if everything works out as planned, this is going to be the foundation for the "next-generation" editing interface that eventually replaces mged |
| 20:19.58 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, though even on trunk there is ways to do that for a project such as yours incrementally without breaking things |
| 20:20.18 | brlcad | it's a new code, so it's expected that it'll be a work in progress |
| 20:20.42 | brlcad | the breaking things applies mostly to existing code and interfaces, and not leaving the compilation in a broken state |
| 20:21.05 | brlcad | it's easy to not leave the compilation in a broken state on new files, don't compile those files :) |
| 20:27.17 | mafm | yup |
| 20:28.05 | mafm | well, I should be going home, and I only have the main.cxx in state to commit (clean, proper doxygen, etc) |
| 20:28.21 | mafm | should I commit it or wait for the test Application tomorrow? |
| 20:29.06 | pacman87 | mafm: i'm pretty sure the answer to that question is almost always 'commit now' |
| 20:29.30 | starseeker | brlcad: whoooops! sorry! |
| 20:29.58 | starseeker | brlcad: I can put it back... |
| 20:31.07 | mafm | pacman87: well, it's 3 lines worth of code...! |
| 20:31.36 | pacman87 | i've committed changes of less than three lines |
| 20:32.24 | pacman87 | and it's a good habit to get into |
| 20:33.04 | mafm | OK, I'll do |
| 20:33.31 | mafm | but this is different than regular changes... it's main() and calls a non-existing class in the repository :D |
| 20:34.57 | pacman87 | like brlcad said, don't add it to the makefile then |
| 20:35.24 | pacman87 | but hey, it's your call |
| 20:38.14 | brlcad | starseeker: too late and no matter :) |
| 20:38.47 | brlcad | mafm: it doesn't matter |
| 20:38.52 | brlcad | you sould still commit everything you have |
| 20:40.25 | brlcad | it's a hard practice for some to get used to but you will eventually appreciate it, particularly the more you get used to making incremental functional commits |
| 20:40.26 | mafm | can't commit everything, part is still application example of RBgui |
| 20:40.28 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 20:40.57 | brlcad | so? |
| 20:41.12 | mafm | copyright! |
| 20:41.34 | brlcad | you're not claiming copyright on their code |
| 20:43.30 | brlcad | at least commit the code that you've written and been working on |
| 20:43.36 | mafm | well, if you don't mind not following coding conventions, no doxygen etc, it's OK for me |
| 20:43.49 | brlcad | that's part of the "compile works, time to commit" habit |
| 20:43.59 | brlcad | heh, it's not like you're going to be done with it |
| 20:44.19 | brlcad | it's not an excuse to not do those things, you're just checkpointing |
| 20:44.48 | brlcad | so if you got, you know, hit by a bus tonight .. we'd have the last state of your efforts to continue on from :) |
| 20:45.18 | pacman87 | or if your next door neighbor sets off an EMP... |
| 20:45.37 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt16.png |
| 20:45.45 | mafm | yes, I get the point, and I always submit several times a day... but usually not in the case that I'm using testing applications |
| 20:46.01 | brlcad | tragic exaggeration of course, but it's all part of getting you to learn to code in "complete" steps |
| 20:46.23 | brlcad | mafm: okay, fair enough .. if you have test apps, you can leave them out |
| 20:46.38 | mafm | too late, I already made the patches :P |
| 20:46.51 | brlcad | but so far there hasn't been any commits, so it smells more of uneasy first-time commiter |
| 20:46.59 | mafm | btw, I had to diff against /dev/null |
| 20:47.05 | brlcad | huh? |
| 20:47.17 | mafm | changed the name by hand, hope that there's no problem |
| 20:47.36 | mafm | well, svn diff doesn't work, I guess that it's because of being in a new directory |
| 20:47.52 | brlcad | you have to svn add the new directory and new files first |
| 20:47.58 | mafm | (not present upstream) |
| 20:48.02 | brlcad | then they'll be in a diff |
| 20:48.42 | mafm | hmm, can I add dirs as anonymous? |
| 20:48.42 | brlcad | sure, at least I'm pretty sure |
| 20:48.42 | brlcad | that's a local operation |
| 20:48.49 | mafm | ah ok |
| 20:49.07 | brlcad | (unlike cvs where cvs adding a new dir made a commit) |
| 20:49.32 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31345 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: change hyp input routine: vertex is now center of base; major/minor axes define the base size; height measures from bottom to top plate; c is now the squeeze factor for the neck, as a fraction of the base size |
| 20:50.02 | brlcad | woot! |
| 20:50.24 | brlcad | goes giddily to play with a hyp |
| 20:50.27 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31346 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: modify hyp's uv() to match with rec to produce a continuous checker pattern |
| 20:50.36 | pacman87 | now you can go have fun :) |
| 20:56.45 | mafm | sent first patches, goes to hide his head in shame :P |
| 20:57.02 | mafm | not really, going home to get some food & sleep :) |
| 20:57.13 | mafm | see you tomorrow! |
| 20:57.28 | brlcad | heh, okay! cya :) |
| 21:00.13 | brlcad | thinks it's time for a new poll |
| 22:08.30 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 22:50.57 | ``Erik | thinks it's time for this "code monkeys" show O.o |
| 22:53.32 | poolio | brlcad: the older poll is quite interesting...shows that a good website good lead to a lot more users IMO :) |
| 22:59.25 | brlcad | ooh, code monkeys! |
| 23:00.31 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, it is about what I expected (that 90% of our visitors are first-time visitors, along with a few first-time users) |
| 23:03.42 | ``Erik | time to impress jodi foster O.o |
| 23:08.30 | brlcad | um, hello? breasts? |
| 23:10.11 | brlcad | chock full of good quotes :) |
| 23:10.20 | ``Erik | <-- fights the urge to implement some of these games :D |
| 23:11.22 | ``Erik | the bars at te top and bottom are hilarious |
| 23:24.40 | brlcad | makes himself more comfortable |
| 23:53.55 | pacman87 | brlcad et al: how's the new hyp creation working? |
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| 00:19.19 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad, ``Erik and pacman87 |
| 00:20.03 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 00:20.09 | poolio | I resent that andrecastelo ;) |
| 00:20.26 | andrecastelo | howdy poolio ! heheh :D |
| 00:55.42 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 01:20.55 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 01:41.31 | yukonbob | hey pacman87 -- how're things? |
| 02:05.19 | PrezKennedy | howdy brlcad! |
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| 04:37.34 | brlcad | ahh |
| 04:38.52 | starseeker | notices the science overlay has an ebuild for salome |
| 04:41.59 | brlcad | starseeker: are you on the news mailing list? |
| 04:43.04 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 04:43.04 | brlcad | or better yet, has anyone received a message today from the brlcad-news mailing list? |
| 04:43.05 | starseeker | checks... |
| 04:43.13 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 04:43.19 | starseeker | no, just the devel list |
| 04:43.20 | brlcad | pacman87: welcome back :) |
| 04:43.23 | starseeker | moves to correct this... |
| 04:43.25 | brlcad | hrmph |
| 04:43.34 | brlcad | oh, you're only on devel, got it |
| 04:45.05 | starseeker | is subscribed now, but doubts that helps with the immediate problem... |
| 04:46.17 | starseeker | chuckles as gentoo pulls opencascade from freebsd.org |
| 04:47.40 | starseeker | brlcad: IIRC the opencascade license is somewhat odd? |
| 04:48.05 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 04:50.33 | brlcad | yeah, rather horribly worded license |
| 04:51.00 | brlcad | somewhat sketchy terms |
| 04:51.32 | starseeker | wonders if they ever publicly justified the reasons for the one-off license? |
| 04:55.16 | starseeker | gets "welcome to brlcad-news" email, if that helps any... |
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| 04:57.15 | homovulgaris | hi Sean, u there ? |
| 04:57.22 | brlcad | nope |
| 04:57.37 | homovulgaris | huh :O |
| 04:57.52 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 04:57.53 | ibot | hmm... ask is Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 04:58.09 | starseeker | he must have been killed and replaced by the AI bot he was working on... |
| 04:58.19 | starseeker | :-P |
| 04:58.24 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 04:58.37 | homovulgaris | anyways.. i have been living without internet for around 5 days now.. |
| 04:58.40 | homovulgaris | it is a disaster |
| 04:58.58 | starseeker | ow |
| 05:00.12 | brlcad | apparently so |
| 05:00.33 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=cb6ef51f@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 05:01.14 | brlcad | well sorry to hear that.. glad to see you were able to find the intarwebs eventually ;) |
| 05:01.39 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i will commit tomorrow hopefully when the network comes up :( |
| 05:02.10 | homovulgaris | literally worst five days i have had in a long time .. maybe i am a net addict :O --> self-realization |
| 05:02.36 | homovulgaris | i dont have all the data i have been working with but i think i can still discuss it if you are free |
| 05:03.24 | homovulgaris | basically i started a new directory libpc which contains most of the code, a new pc.h header containing the structures in include |
| 05:03.54 | homovulgaris | inside librt i started a new file pc_constraint.c which implement pc_constraint_export and pc_constraint_import |
| 05:04.03 | homovulgaris | the import part i havent written |
| 05:04.42 | homovulgaris | then i have made a simple mk_constraint function for now inside libpc |
| 05:05.43 | brlcad | now libpc instead of libpg? |
| 05:05.49 | homovulgaris | Inside libpc i have also defined generate_parameters function , the idea of which basically is.. if you pass a directory pointer to it , it generates a parameter set of all possible handles |
| 05:06.26 | homovulgaris | yeah i thought parametrics and constraints are significant .. i mean Parametrics & Constraints rather than parametric geometry |
| 05:07.30 | homovulgaris | and a write_parameter_set function which basically writes the parameter set as an (attribute value) array to the db using update_attributes |
| 05:07.46 | homovulgaris | i hope i am not messing up any of the function names from memory :P |
| 05:07.59 | brlcad | it all sounds good and well without seeing the code structure itself ;) |
| 05:08.10 | homovulgaris | :) i know |
| 05:08.55 | homovulgaris | hey sean, regarding librt integration.. the way i have implemented it presently is , so that we still use the librt functions to write stuff to db |
| 05:08.59 | brlcad | the exact function names aren't significant at this point other than consistently prefixing the calls with the library prefix |
| 05:09.25 | brlcad | that's good |
| 05:09.36 | brlcad | librt should be the gatekeeper for all db io |
| 05:09.59 | homovulgaris | i am finding using the attribute system for storing parameters a little bit too verbose |
| 05:11.03 | brlcad | the question we'd talked about earlier was whether to create a new non-geometric db object or using attributes |
| 05:11.10 | homovulgaris | but i am not able to think of a better way to handle it without extending the database system to a new version or defining a new object type just to hold the "handles" or parameters of the existing geometry object |
| 05:11.21 | brlcad | no doubt that using attributes is more verbose |
| 05:12.00 | brlcad | i thought we'd settled on using a new db object actually after the last discussion |
| 05:12.11 | homovulgaris | for storing the equations or constraints we do need a non-geometric object which i have defined. |
| 05:12.25 | brlcad | okay, then what are you using attributes for then? |
| 05:12.55 | homovulgaris | for each geometric type there are a certain list of variables or parameters u can change right.. for denoting them |
| 05:14.20 | homovulgaris | like for example in the case of a sphere ( radius,center-x,center-y,center-z) whether they are parametric or explicit, is there some domain restriction ( 0<radius < fastf_t_MAX ) |
| 05:15.26 | homovulgaris | adding a new object for each and every variable of a geometric object seems overkill |
| 05:16.24 | brlcad | there are implicitly a list of vars/params.. it'll take a bit of effort to make that list explicit through a generic interface |
| 05:16.36 | homovulgaris | so i was thinking we could use the attribute system for storing that data.. since in a sense it is the attribute of the sphere after all. but the verbosity is making me think about shifting that infomration as well to an object type somehow |
| 05:17.04 | brlcad | that list of variables/parameters is in the library itself, not persisted to the db |
| 05:17.41 | homovulgaris | didnt get it |
| 05:18.33 | brlcad | so say you want to make a sphere .. it has radius and position values that are stored already |
| 05:18.41 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 05:18.42 | brlcad | that much doesn't need to change |
| 05:18.50 | homovulgaris | right |
| 05:19.10 | brlcad | but say now we want to add a constraint that the radius must be > 100mm |
| 05:19.24 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 05:19.55 | brlcad | that requires knowledge that "radius" is something that can be constrained on a sphere, which is something the sphere primitive itself needs to declare |
| 05:20.28 | brlcad | as part of librt, i.e. src/librt/primitives/sph would have some logic that says that radius and position are two things that can be parameterized |
| 05:20.53 | brlcad | now we need to create the actual constraint |
| 05:21.07 | homovulgaris | yeah that is the ideal way to do it :) so we should change the geometry description u men |
| 05:21.10 | brlcad | for that, there's a new db constraint object |
| 05:21.54 | brlcad | that db constraint object will refer to something like sph.radius or some other defined nomenclature for saying it applies to a given sphere's radius |
| 05:22.00 | homovulgaris | if the sphere is able to declare the fact that it has two variables for example , then things should be simple |
| 05:22.14 | homovulgaris | the question is, how do we represent which of the parameters are variable or parametric and which are constant |
| 05:22.22 | brlcad | I think it needs to |
| 05:22.41 | homovulgaris | like in this case we need to say that only radius is the only variable and position is not |
| 05:22.57 | homovulgaris | that data needs to be stored in db right |
| 05:23.43 | brlcad | saying that radius is variable and position is sound like two constraints to me |
| 05:23.58 | brlcad | s/constraints/parameters/ |
| 05:25.11 | brlcad | so by default, all parameters defined by the primitive could be changed like they can now -- you'd create a constraint object to restrict that further (e.g. radius > 100 && position == immutable) |
| 05:25.22 | homovulgaris | ok so we put two constraints ( position fixed) and (radius >100) ? |
| 05:25.30 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:25.44 | homovulgaris | hmm |
| 05:25.58 | homovulgaris | this way we wont need generate_parameters and similar functions |
| 05:26.27 | brlcad | hasn't seen the code, so agrees :) |
| 05:26.55 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 05:27.14 | brlcad | now what isn't clear, maybe you've sorted out already, is how to create generic equations that can be applied |
| 05:27.54 | brlcad | and stored/referenced in the db as distinct generic function objects |
| 05:28.06 | brlcad | or if it's even worth dealing with that right now |
| 05:28.14 | homovulgaris | to store the equations i was thinking of using a stack with postfix or prefix which refers to these parameters. |
| 05:28.46 | homovulgaris | basically for the whole solution part i was planning on using c++ |
| 05:29.37 | brlcad | that should be fine, you'll just have to have a well-defined abstraction into librt so you don't infect it type-wise :) |
| 05:29.54 | homovulgaris | hopefully :) |
| 05:30.10 | brlcad | necessarily |
| 05:30.20 | homovulgaris | obviously :) |
| 05:30.46 | homovulgaris | regarding storage |
| 05:31.09 | homovulgaris | what if i just store the stack as a string in the .g file ? |
| 05:31.40 | homovulgaris | and when you import it, it generates the constraint_network graph |
| 05:31.49 | brlcad | that should be fine |
| 05:32.04 | brlcad | especially since the objects are referred to by string references necessarily anyways |
| 05:32.06 | homovulgaris | the edges in the graph are these equations ( like sph.1_r>1000) |
| 05:32.28 | brlcad | there may be value, though, in storing the operators and values in binary |
| 05:32.34 | brlcad | especially the values |
| 05:32.45 | brlcad | for precision |
| 05:33.08 | homovulgaris | hmm.. so names i store as string and values and operators i convert to binary |
| 05:33.51 | brlcad | yeah, probably ideal |
| 05:35.24 | brlcad | maybe something like STR sph.1_r INT 1000 OP > |
| 05:35.33 | brlcad | where str, int, and op are some binary code |
| 05:36.11 | brlcad | so you push values onto a ministack when importing, and perform operations as needed for each equation |
| 05:36.49 | brlcad | I don't mean that exact string, only "sph.1_r" would be a chars in that example, the rest would be network encoded |
| 05:36.50 | homovulgaris | for representing the solution of any individual parameter i was thinking of struct parameter_soln { int n_domains; struct domains * d[] } ; where struct domain { double min; double max} |
| 05:37.13 | homovulgaris | makes sense :) |
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| 05:38.36 | homovulgaris | hi pacman87 |
| 05:38.55 | brlcad | a fixed array of domains? |
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| 05:40.53 | homovulgaris | well a dynamic array of domains |
| 05:41.01 | brlcad | you could use a simple bu_list of domains |
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| 05:41.33 | homovulgaris | bu_list is a linked list right ? |
| 05:41.38 | brlcad | they're a pretty simple container |
| 05:41.43 | brlcad | yeah, doubly linked lists |
| 05:41.48 | homovulgaris | ok. |
| 05:42.02 | homovulgaris | i still have to figure out how to solve equations like r<1000 |
| 05:42.05 | brlcad | you create your own data type (i.e. struct domain), and just add bu_list as the first element |
| 05:42.25 | brlcad | that automatically makes it a linkable structure |
| 05:42.33 | homovulgaris | kewl :) |
| 05:42.48 | brlcad | there's an example in bu.h |
| 05:43.40 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 05:43.58 | brlcad | you're basically implementing a simple lamba calculus for evaluating the expressions |
| 05:44.21 | brlcad | the same evaluation that lets you do a == b should work for c > d, etc |
| 05:44.39 | brlcad | giving truth values for each result that tell if the parameters hold |
| 05:45.15 | brlcad | at least that handles all constraints, evaluating equations is a bit different of course |
| 05:46.09 | homovulgaris | hmm.. ( need to do more reading :)) |
| 05:47.55 | homovulgaris | pacman87: sorry, but my svn is 6 days old :) did u rename the tentry in table.c to lesser than 8 characters. i was getting a compiler warning, initializer string too long.. you are the one wokring on hyperboloid right ? |
| 05:48.28 | brlcad | homovulgaris: it's since changed, it's less |
| 05:49.01 | homovulgaris | and then again there is the case of generic equations which can themselves be complex |
| 05:49.06 | brlcad | it was increased, breaking binary compatibility, then reverted/renamed to something less than 8 chars to avoid that (and it wasn't necessary) |
| 05:49.12 | brlcad | it's a 'hyp' primitive now |
| 05:49.28 | homovulgaris | like 2nd degree polynomials in 2 variables and so on. |
| 05:49.36 | homovulgaris | oh.. i realy need to update :) |
| 05:50.40 | homovulgaris | pacman87: the uv mapping looks ultra cool :) |
| 05:52.38 | homovulgaris | i will go think about how to make geometry declare their variables to the world :) |
| 05:52.45 | brlcad | very cool: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/primitives/hyp.png.html :) |
| 05:53.47 | homovulgaris | see you tonight again hopefully on my computer hopefully :) |
| 05:54.59 | brlcad | i think each primitive's list of their variables is close to the class of entity types you listed |
| 05:55.38 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. true |
| 05:56.59 | brlcad | points, lines, planes, axes, corners, circles, curves |
| 05:58.30 | brlcad | e.g. sphere probably only has a point and an axis, whereas an arb8 would have 8 points, 6 planes, 12 lines, and an axis |
| 06:00.45 | brlcad | was talking with a professor from IIT Kanpur just last week at a conference |
| 06:01.09 | homovulgaris | hehe.. was he a nice guy ? |
| 06:01.20 | brlcad | oh sure |
| 06:01.29 | brlcad | it's a small highly technical conference |
| 06:01.47 | homovulgaris | on cad ? |
| 06:01.51 | brlcad | we talked for quite a while about open source |
| 06:01.53 | brlcad | and gsoc |
| 06:02.02 | homovulgaris | :) nice |
| 06:02.04 | brlcad | on solid and physical modeling |
| 06:02.44 | homovulgaris | what is his name ? |
| 06:03.08 | brlcad | i actually don't remember atm, I'd have to look up his paper |
| 06:03.39 | homovulgaris | :) lots of good professors in india at IITs |
| 06:03.50 | homovulgaris | lots of not so good ones also .. but still :D |
| 06:05.01 | brlcad | mm.. would be really interesting to have the primitives also define their constraints, and then use the library to ensure they're held |
| 06:05.20 | brlcad | that might even make a good first step before trying to sort out the db io |
| 06:05.44 | brlcad | since all primitives had implicit constraints |
| 06:05.45 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. define their constraints in the sense the self constraints right ? |
| 06:05.50 | brlcad | right |
| 06:06.03 | homovulgaris | like for the sphere ? the implicit restrictions on radius ? |
| 06:06.05 | brlcad | a sphere can't have a negative or infinite radius, for example |
| 06:06.46 | brlcad | and more specifically, since the parameters for a sphere are technically the same as that of an ellipsoid, there's an A and B vector for parameters |
| 06:07.07 | homovulgaris | basically this declaration would involve adding new functions to each geometry type right |
| 06:07.08 | brlcad | and the constraint is that |A| == |B| for it to be a sphere |
| 06:07.40 | homovulgaris | i meant the declaration of constraints and parameters to the world |
| 06:07.58 | homovulgaris | like new functions in g_ell or g_arb8 |
| 06:08.02 | brlcad | one callback function that returns a table should suffice |
| 06:08.17 | homovulgaris | yeah new function sorry :) |
| 06:09.56 | homovulgaris | and where would the code which calls the library to ensre the constraint holding be located ? |
| 06:35.04 | CIA-21 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31347 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: add some basic sanity checks on the uv range, mapping is still slightly off with a rotation offset on the u values and incorrect count |
| 07:31.30 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:38.23 | brlcad | hmms and thinks thinks he just needs to keep going |
| 09:01.13 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.155) | |
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| 09:34.48 | brlcad | quad charts suck |
| 09:35.02 | clock_ | brlcad: what's a quad chart? |
| 09:35.36 | brlcad | an imposed format that tries to categorize information into 4 specific bins |
| 09:35.43 | clock_ | lol |
| 09:35.51 | clock_ | some kind of mind mapping tool? |
| 09:36.07 | brlcad | nah, just business junk |
| 09:36.08 | clock_ | categorizes information into one specific dustbin |
| 09:36.18 | clock_ | brlcad: :) |
| 09:40.01 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-034-129.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 09:47.15 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:47.40 | mafm | hello |
| 09:52.12 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 09:52.20 | brlcad | buenos dias! |
| 10:00.27 | mafm | hi |
| 10:00.32 | mafm | you have strange sleep habits, don't you? :D |
| 10:00.41 | poolio | mornin' |
| 10:00.41 | clock_ | brlcad: you can speak spanish? |
| 10:00.49 | poolio | brlcad: way to ... sleep |
| 10:01.56 | clock_ | A friend is designing his own beds, lamps etc. and using some commercial software I don't remember the name |
| 10:02.12 | clock_ | Should I suggest BRL-CAD? Does it run under Windows good enough for an end user as well? |
| 10:03.29 | brlcad | mafm: heh, you could say that .. |
| 10:04.12 | brlcad | doesn't generally like sleeping |
| 10:05.10 | clock_ | finds falling asleep boring |
| 10:05.14 | mafm | I don't either, but I have to |
| 10:06.21 | brlcad | nonsense! just have to train your body to expect less :) |
| 10:07.00 | brlcad | body is exceptionally resiliant and adaptive if you force it |
| 10:07.32 | brlcad | clock_: it runs just fine under windows -- if they're as smart and adaptive as you are, then sure |
| 10:07.46 | clock_ | they are smart but not sure if they are adaptive :) |
| 10:07.53 | brlcad | in general though, you are a bit exceptional as for a modeler getting up to speed quickly and adapting to your needs |
| 10:08.14 | clock_ | they use windows and they paid for commercial program maybe they will want to find psychological reasons to not admit their bad financial decision :) |
| 10:08.51 | clock_ | brlcad: you mean I am exceptional in adapting to BRL-CAD? Ordinary user would advance slower? |
| 10:33.50 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin (i=cbc85f82@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-fca99bf11cf4a3d0) | |
| 10:33.59 | hippieindamakin | hey guys |
| 10:34.12 | clock_ | hippieindamakin: hey |
| 10:34.33 | hippieindamakin | may i have the link to the svn of brlcad java trunk ? |
| 10:36.21 | clock_ | hippieindamakin: BRLCAD in java? |
| 10:36.54 | hippieindamakin | yeah there are some programs written in java man |
| 10:37.33 | hippieindamakin | wanted to get a reference and for some reason sourceforge doesnt openup |
| 10:39.21 | hippieindamakin | nevermind i reached there.. |
| 10:41.29 | hippieindamakin | clock_: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/jbrlcad/ this is wat i meant |
| 10:41.53 | mafm | brlcad: I've already had problems for not getting enough sleep |
| 10:41.59 | brlcad | clock_: something like that, you're pretty much the ideal/intended user type that dives in, isn't afraid to script tools, can tie things together, etc |
| 10:42.26 | brlcad | hippieindamakin: just like the main repo, but jbrlcad instead of brlcad |
| 10:42.28 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 10:42.31 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 10:42.48 | brlcad | so this: https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/jbrlcad/trunk jbrlcad |
| 10:42.53 | hippieindamakin | hey mafm and brlcad |
| 10:44.00 | mafm | hi hippieindamakin |
| 11:08.10 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 11:13.08 | starseeker | has finally encountered something worse than BRL-CAD for gentoo ebuild creation... |
| 11:13.19 | starseeker | stares in awe at the SALOME gentoo bug history... |
| 12:03.48 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.245.43) | |
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| 12:44.16 | clock_ | The dating all boils down to the looks, and the looks boil down to the gym ;-) |
| 12:44.28 | clock_ | brlcad: was it you who attends gym or was it ``Erik? |
| 12:57.55 | mafm | uh |
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| 13:47.57 | ``Erik | brlcad is the gym monkey, my idea of exercise is the 12oz curl :D |
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| 15:04.19 | pacman87 | morning, all |
| 15:04.28 | mafm | morning |
| 15:35.18 | ``Erik | neato, bzflag has shadows, tracks, and textures now O.o |
| 15:35.38 | pacman87 | ``Erik: um... what was the last version you tried? |
| 15:35.59 | ``Erik | d'no, about 5 years ago |
| 15:36.09 | pacman87 | that explains it ;) |
| 15:36.53 | ``Erik | dodging is difficult with no 'strafe' type motion |
| 15:37.26 | pacman87 | what server are you on? |
| 15:37.36 | ``Erik | and being able to aim seperate from trvel would be neat (like keys for movement and mouse for turret) |
| 15:37.47 | ``Erik | uh, some 'BRL.something' one? |
| 15:37.59 | ``Erik | desert something-or-rather |
| 15:38.44 | ``Erik | i was dicking with macports, noticed it in the games dir, so *shrug* threw it on and jumped on one... couldn't find the name of one on brlcad's machine |
| 15:50.29 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
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| 16:35.34 | mafm | brlcad: when I submit next patches, should be the whole file or related with the patches yesterday? |
| 18:04.18 | mafm | ping! |
| 18:15.26 | mafm | omfg I killed the channel!!!!111!!! |
| 18:17.47 | louipc | pong |
| 18:19.26 | mafm | :) |
| 18:52.06 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@208.43.126.194) | |
| 18:59.43 | pacman87 | do the triangular faces for tess() need to be (counter)clockwise, or does the direction not matter? |
| 19:27.30 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-91-99.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:33.16 | mafm | @brlcad and maybe other gsoc mentors: I'm waiting on what to do with my patches to either create new patches based on them, or submit new ones with the full content of the files, etc |
| 20:33.21 | mafm | in the meantime: http://wainu.ii.uned.es/~mafm/brlcad/brlcad_rbgui_20080609-1.png |
| 20:33.57 | mafm | heading home now, see you tomorrow |
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| 22:24.16 | poolio | ``Erik: where were you today? :) |
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| 02:39.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31348 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Check for situations where a pre-existing file conflicts with the name to be used for the .g file, and refuse to overwrite if a file is found. |
| 02:40.52 | starseeker | has heard speculation that the way Mathematica was created was they wrote the documentation, and then made the software do what they had documented. |
| 02:41.00 | starseeker | is starting to believe it |
| 02:50.00 | poolio | starseeker: it's great software :) One of my professor's was working on a bunch of extensions for it. |
| 03:02.36 | starseeker | prefers Maxima and Axiom, but must agree Mathematica is good stuff |
| 03:04.17 | starseeker | reflects that the change in tire behavior is user visible and realizes he should have updated the NEWS file... darn it... |
| 03:08.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31349 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 03:08.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Changed default behavior of tire command to avoid silently overwriting |
| 03:08.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: pre-existing files if the user supplies their names or has a pre-existing tire.g |
| 03:08.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: file in the same directory - it now exits and prints an error message. |
| 03:09.33 | starseeker | alright, that should be everything... sleep time :-) |
| 03:34.58 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 03:55.51 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 06:43.46 | brlcad | starseeker: bu_file_exists() |
| 07:24.18 | brlcad | so there's a new cad on the open source block, hopefully he'll keep it up |
| 07:31.09 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:57.57 | archivist | noo cad? a name? |
| 08:37.32 | brlcad | shame he's got a nibm attitude, but well see what comes of it |
| 08:53.16 | brlcad | poolio: sph_brep.cpp .. file header is bunk for several reasons |
| 08:54.03 | brlcad | if you delete the header and run sh/header.sh lgpl src/librt/primitives/shp/sph_brep.cpp it'll create what should be there |
| 09:41.38 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.15.124) | |
| 09:41.48 | andrecastelo | good morning folks |
| 09:54.53 | andrecastelo | reads logs |
| 09:59.41 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:00.06 | mafm | hey |
| 10:17.19 | brlcad | howdy guys |
| 10:24.17 | mafm | not bad |
| 10:24.38 | mafm | holidays in Portugal, so full day to work with BRL-CAD! \o/ |
| 10:30.12 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad.. i had internet problems sunday and yesterday i had to be at the university the whole day |
| 10:31.27 | andrecastelo | i'll have to go there now, will be back in 4 hours tops, but probably will have the rest of the day to work on BRL-CAD |
| 10:31.35 | andrecastelo | cya later |
| 10:35.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31350 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (. main.cxx): Initial patch for the 3D Geometry Editor, the entry point of the application. |
| 10:37.19 | mafm | svn is making strange things with the files >:[ |
| 10:40.00 | mafm | rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Application.h : svn:mime-type is not set |
| 10:40.29 | mafm | this happened with .cxx too... but I fixed it by hand, knowing that maybe .cxx is not a very popular extension |
| 10:40.40 | mafm | but .h ...?!?!!!? :) |
| 10:41.01 | brlcad | woo hoo! congratulations on commit :) |
| 10:41.31 | brlcad | svn doesn't know about any file types by default |
| 10:42.03 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Developer_Documents#I.27m_trying_to_add_a_new_file_to_the_repository_and_I_get_an_error_on_commit_about_mime_types.__What_should_I_do.3F |
| 10:44.18 | mafm | it's the 1st time that happens to me |
| 10:44.47 | brlcad | it's the first time you've committed :) |
| 10:45.00 | brlcad | (to our repository at least) |
| 10:45.22 | mafm | yes, but not from this computer with SVN |
| 10:45.34 | brlcad | there are commit hooks that validate the mime types |
| 10:45.34 | mafm | and not with any previous computer either |
| 10:45.52 | mafm | the hooks are specifically for BRL-CAD? |
| 10:46.02 | brlcad | so you've only worked with repositories that don't have their mime types enforced |
| 10:46.23 | brlcad | hooks are always repository specific |
| 10:46.35 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 10:46.38 | mafm | ah, I see |
| 10:46.39 | brlcad | moin d_rossberg |
| 10:46.55 | mafm | now, I set by hand mime-type:text/x-cpp for .cxx |
| 10:46.59 | d_rossberg | guten morgen! |
| 10:47.11 | mafm | should I revert it and put as in your .svn/config? |
| 10:47.14 | mafm | hi d_rossberg |
| 10:49.15 | brlcad | mafm: it shouldn't matter |
| 10:50.06 | brlcad | I don't, however, see text/x-cpp as an officially designated IANA mime type |
| 10:50.40 | brlcad | where's text/plain is |
| 10:51.28 | mafm | I copied it from here, my fault: http://www.noah.org/wiki/SVN_auto-props |
| 10:51.32 | brlcad | probably just happens to work out okay because probably most application handlers just key off the entire text/ subset |
| 10:51.49 | brlcad | mafm: I figured |
| 10:51.57 | brlcad | that doesn't mean they didn't make up their own mime types |
| 10:52.21 | brlcad | lots of folks make up mime types without realizing that there's actually an official registration process |
| 10:52.34 | brlcad | http://www.iana.org/assignments/media-types/ |
| 10:53.08 | brlcad | there may be some caveat about x- extensions in the rfc, but it's still an unregistered type |
| 10:55.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31351 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/main.cxx: Set proper svn:mime-type instead of forged one (copied incorrectly from some web page) |
| 10:56.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31352 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Patch for the Application class of 3D Geometry Editor, mostly the RBGui example for OGRE. |
| 10:57.52 | mafm | google suggestion: Did you mean: text/x-php |
| 10:57.53 | mafm | :) |
| 11:00.47 | brlcad | the main point is for proper web-server delivery and web-browser viewing, for with almost all text types are perfectly suited with just text/plain |
| 11:01.09 | brlcad | it's the binary types that need subtyping for specific handlers |
| 11:01.27 | starseeker | brlcad: ah, figures |
| 11:02.41 | mafm | and specially to tag the virus, similar to the "evil bit" :P |
| 11:06.07 | starseeker | brlcad: I'll switch it to bu_file_exists when I get a chance. |
| 11:10.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31353 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h main.cxx): |
| 11:10.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Revision of the code (WIP) to set it up to BRL-CAD standards: naming |
| 11:10.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: conventions, doxygen documentation, ... Also a couple of new functionalities: to |
| 11:10.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: not waste CPU when the window is not visible (it seems that my contribution to |
| 11:10.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: OGRE a few years ago comes back to me), and making the mouse cursor visible (at |
| 11:10.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: least it was not visible in my platform) |
| 11:31.28 | mafm | what's that jbrlcad thing? a testing implementation in Java? only some portions of the libraries? |
| 11:32.47 | brlcad | mafm: a testing implementation of a small portion of librt in java |
| 11:34.27 | mafm | oh, I see |
| 11:38.09 | brlcad | it includes most of the basic .g file i/o parsing, object and scene management, prep, and raytracing for a few of the primitives |
| 11:44.25 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 11:44.29 | mafm | is it mature, or testing-but-mostly-dead? :D |
| 11:55.36 | mafm | I'm wondering if we can submit this to the repositories (default font that RBGui is using): Version 1.00 - Trebuchet MS version 1.00 was added to our collection of 'Core fonts for the Web' on 11 October 1996. Version 1.00 was also included in the Internet Explorer supplemental font pack. |
| 11:56.05 | mafm | it's available from here: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=34153 |
| 11:56.40 | mafm | and Corefonts project is licensed under GPL |
| 11:58.54 | mafm | from RPM spec: License: Spec file is GPL, binary rpm is gratis but non-distributable |
| 11:59.30 | mafm | %description |
| 11:59.30 | mafm | The TrueType core fonts for the web that was once available from |
| 11:59.30 | mafm | http://www.microsoft.com/typography/fontpack/. The src rpm is cleverly |
| 11:59.30 | mafm | constructed so that the actual fonts are downloaded from Sourceforge's site |
| 11:59.30 | mafm | at build time. Therefore this package technically does not 'redistribute' |
| 11:59.31 | mafm | the fonts, it just makes it easy to install them on a linux system. |
| 12:01.14 | mafm | (I go to lunch, be back in a bit) |
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| 12:19.43 | brlcad | mafm: neither .. it works, has been tested and works well as a design, but was mostly just an experiment |
| 12:20.17 | brlcad | the OO organization is actually a very nice model for how to go about designing our new C++ API |
| 12:20.33 | brlcad | and will likely be joining your work in the rt^3 module soon |
| 12:22.10 | brlcad | mafm: no, gpl is a no-no .. go with the bitstream vera fonts |
| 12:22.53 | brlcad | there are others, but that one isn't very desirable |
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| 13:21.21 | mafm | oki |
| 13:21.50 | mafm | where should they go, misc/gd3/ ? |
| 14:16.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31354 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: add note about needed fix for rtweight |
| 14:20.34 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.15.124) | |
| 14:20.48 | andrecastelo | hey |
| 14:22.16 | mafm | wb andrecastelo |
| 14:22.22 | andrecastelo | hi mafm |
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| 14:32.29 | mafm | andrecastelo_: you're infringing andrecastelo's copyright |
| 14:32.44 | andrecastelo_ | mafm: hahaha |
| 15:05.26 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 15:34.58 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik.. i'm thinking about the implementation of the rayhit function right now |
| 15:35.10 | andrecastelo | the idea is to record each hit point in a point_list |
| 15:35.16 | andrecastelo | then apply the mutation algorithm and so on |
| 15:36.49 | andrecastelo | but rayhit will call rt_shootray() again, and how can i pass a point_list to be used without using global variables?? since rayhit()'s parameters are predetermined? |
| 16:08.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31355 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sph/sph_brep.cpp: fixed header. removed opennurbs_circle.h include |
| 16:11.41 | poolio | brlcad: isn't this naming scheme a bit redundant? :) |
| 16:15.25 | mafm | <brlcad> no. no. |
| 16:22.23 | brlcad | poolio: what naming scheme? |
| 16:27.31 | mafm | some classes that I'm using need to access other classes, which are in principle known to have only one instance |
| 16:28.13 | mafm | I'm wondering if you prefer me to use Singletons, or to pass pointers when creating those classes, or don't care about that and it's up to me? |
| 16:31.33 | poolio | brlcad: the primitives/xxx/[xxx.c,xxx_brep.cpp] |
| 17:39.23 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 17:56.22 | poolio | brlcad: for arbn, does it make sense to duplicate a lot of the code in tess? In terms of solving for vertices, edges, faces, etc... |
| 18:07.13 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 18:08.14 | homovulgaris | back finally :D |
| 18:09.09 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 18:09.22 | homovulgaris | yikes No rule to make target nurb_basis.c |
| 18:20.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31356 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Added information about which files use struct rt_pt_node. |
| 18:23.35 | brlcad | mafm: basically it's a judgement call -- it shouldn't be whether you *need* only one but whether you think you absolute *have to* limit it to only ever one instance |
| 18:24.04 | brlcad | like a network socket manager is usually a good case for a singleton |
| 18:25.31 | brlcad | poolio: is usually doesn't make sense to duplicate code .. could abstract up into src/librt/primitives it if you need the same functionality in two places |
| 18:26.10 | brlcad | but given the data types are different, they're not necessarily duplicated beyond the algorithm for tess() so your call |
| 18:26.16 | brlcad | wb homovulgaris |
| 18:30.02 | poolio | brlcad: I mean it's a similar algorithm, but the structures used and what not are different. I could probably call tess(), get the structures, and work with them, but the prototype for brep() doesn't have everything that the current tess() implementation requires. So I think I will go ahead and rip it out |
| 18:31.32 | brlcad | poolio: if the tolerances aren't used, you could still call tess |
| 18:32.36 | brlcad | if they are used, you could define your own tolerance values and/or get at the global ones through other means (like adding them to the param list or they may be reachable through deeply through one of the other args) |
| 18:42.58 | poolio | brlcad: alright, I'll have to think about it a bit more |
| 18:44.00 | mafm | does anybody know if there is a quick way to produce a static build with .la files? |
| 19:07.23 | mafm | nevermind, it seems that I need the .a's anyway |
| 19:08.48 | prasad_ | heh justin's site is still up |
| 19:23.06 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31357 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Application.cxx: Setting a new theme, adding a cursor, instantiating the console |
| 19:24.07 | poolio | mafm: so you're using .cxx for C++ files? |
| 19:28.38 | mafm | it's in the HACKING guide |
| 19:28.53 | mafm | it's the first time that I use it, I always used .cpp before |
| 19:37.50 | poolio | mafm: I don't see it in HACKING...I normally use .cpp and there's only one .cxx file in trunk and many .cpp files |
| 19:38.43 | mafm | erm... then it's the files already existing in the module |
| 19:38.50 | mafm | all of them are with .cxx |
| 19:39.14 | poolio | Oh, you raen't working out of brlcad trunk....nevermind |
| 19:39.40 | mafm | it's in HACKING though: |
| 19:39.42 | mafm | [20:39] <mafm@lnsys17> ~/soc2008-brlcad/rt^3-trunk $ grep cxx HACKING |
| 19:39.42 | mafm | C files use the .c extension. C++ files use the .cxx extension. |
| 19:40.09 | mafm | (I don't know if HACKING is the same in both modules, though) |
| 19:40.28 | pacman87 | timothy@HAL9000:~/brlcad/brlcad$ cat HACKING | grep cpp |
| 19:40.28 | pacman87 | files use the .cpp extension. PHP files use the .php extension. |
| 19:41.30 | mafm | erm |
| 19:41.36 | mafm | it's brlcad's fault |
| 19:41.42 | mafm | hides behind the table |
| 19:46.14 | poolio | pacman87: I used to do that all the time ... try grep cpp HACKING :) |
| 19:47.13 | pacman87 | timothy@HAL9000:~/brlcad/brlcad$ grep cpp -A 2 -B 1 HACKING |
| 19:47.13 | pacman87 | C files use the .c extension. Header files use the .h extension. C++ |
| 19:47.13 | pacman87 | files use the .cpp extension. PHP files use the .php extension. |
| 19:47.13 | pacman87 | Tcl/Tk files use the .tcl/.tk extensions. POSIX Bourne-style shell |
| 19:47.13 | pacman87 | scripts use the .sh extension. |
| 19:47.33 | poolio | I would guess that using .cpp is more desirable but I'd wait for word from brlcad. I'm guessing they originally had the same HACKING and then rt^3 was pulled out and the HACKING file neglected |
| 19:48.13 | pacman87 | check the svn log to see which one changed, and when? |
| 19:49.56 | mafm | well, with SVN is trivial to change them (and not losing history, etc), so no problem |
| 19:52.13 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-243.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:52.36 | pacman87 | hi clock_ |
| 19:54.42 | clock_ | hi |
| 19:57.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31358 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: Change file checking in tire procdb to use bu_file_exists |
| 20:05.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31359 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx GuiConsole.h): Commiting work done so far in the class creating and managing the Console window. It works with some glitches (probably fault of the input system) but it's still lacking functionality. |
| 20:06.48 | mafm | see you tomorrow, people! |
| 20:10.31 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: should ap->one_hit be set? so the ray shooting stops on the first hit? is there anything else regarding ap->one_hit? |
| 20:11.12 | andrecastelo | nevermind, it's already set |
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| 22:26.16 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that's a design consideration you could take into account in your algorithm |
| 22:26.28 | brlcad | it would actually be an interesting extension of mlt global illumination |
| 22:26.56 | brlcad | and a nifty performance boost as we can do full-shotline ray-tracing at only a fraction the overhead of one hit |
| 22:27.18 | brlcad | that said, you should probably get it working with one hit before thinking about that :) |
| 22:28.32 | andrecastelo | yeah, thought the same thing.. i'm taking a look at the callback functions in view.c, to understand the code that is common to both view and viewmlt |
| 22:28.57 | andrecastelo | the idea is to store each hitpoint in a point list, what do you think? |
| 22:29.42 | andrecastelo | also, how can i pass the point list address to the rayhit() function, without using global variables? |
| 22:30.42 | andrecastelo | i thought of adding a pointer to a mlt app structure, inside the application structure, what do you think? |
| 22:30.44 | brlcad | sounds like a plan |
| 22:31.06 | brlcad | the application struct has a couple points you can use |
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| 22:31.25 | brlcad | s/points you can use/user-provided pointers you can set/ |
| 22:31.37 | brlcad | userptr or something |
| 22:31.54 | brlcad | you can make that an addrss to your struct, and then you'll have access to it in the callback |
| 22:33.39 | andrecastelo | nifty! |
| 22:33.48 | andrecastelo | a gen_ptr, right ? |
| 22:34.52 | andrecastelo | thanks, brlcad |
| 22:46.36 | brlcad | sounds about right |
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| 23:36.01 | ``Erik | uhm, one_hit is set for all optical rendering, I think, uhmmmmm, you might look at the glass shader to see how the secondary rays for reflection/refraction, maybe? (brlcad is gonna poopoo that idea, I bet) |
| 23:37.36 | ``Erik | src/optical/refract.c ? |
| 00:39.24 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:41.05 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hm, yes, i'll take a look.. but does one_hit impact that much on reflections and refractions?? Because the ray will reflect based on the material it hits, it can reflect "inside" the material, refracting.. what do you think? |
| 01:33.04 | ``Erik | those require changing the ray direction/origin, so one_hit is still ok |
| 01:33.08 | ``Erik | evening, twiggly |
| 02:47.17 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, I think there are too many structures in viewmlt (mlt_app, path_list and point_list). Perhaps path_list can be eliminated? I'm thinking about connecting the mlt_app directly to a point_list |
| 02:49.18 | andrecastelo | the application sequence could be something like: shoot ray in a random direction, build path (each point added to mlt_app->point_list), verify if path is valid, mutate path and store information about it in the image (repeat this n times, perhaps a user supplied parameter?), then shoot another random ray.. repeat proccess |
| 02:49.24 | andrecastelo | what do you think?? |
| 02:50.19 | andrecastelo | is it possible to do this? |
| 02:50.35 | ``Erik | shoot, it's late and hot, lemme read that a few times and think about it |
| 02:51.16 | andrecastelo | hm ok ok |
| 02:51.52 | ``Erik | it's like 26c here in my house, and I'm a wussy seattle boy, so anything above like 21c is hot to me |
| 02:53.02 | andrecastelo | heheh, i'm something like that, inverted.. anything lower than 21c is too cold :b |
| 02:53.52 | ``Erik | heh, I can run around in snow barefoot wearing just pants and a tshirt without being concerned, and I have plenty of warm clothes :) |
| 02:54.09 | ``Erik | uhm, lets see, application has a generic user pointer you could use as your top level |
| 02:54.49 | andrecastelo | yup, that solved building the path list |
| 02:56.46 | ``Erik | hrmmmm, not seeing a generic pointer in ray_data |
| 02:58.20 | andrecastelo | hmm, i'll commit, so you can see what i have done, ok? |
| 02:58.37 | ``Erik | commit to which? |
| 02:58.43 | ``Erik | viewmlt.c ? |
| 02:59.02 | ``Erik | the less impact on brlcad/include/*.h the better |
| 02:59.19 | brlcad | woo hoo, finished the priorities/passions document rewrite |
| 02:59.47 | brlcad | yukonbob: you'll have to let me know how the update looks, lot of your comments taken into account (wrt layout/emphasis) |
| 03:01.02 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: yup, commit to viewmlt.c |
| 03:06.08 | brlcad | for anyone interested: http://brlcad.org/~sean/BRL-CAD%20Priorities.pdf |
| 03:07.12 | brlcad | acrobat seems to render it as teh suck on Mac |
| 03:08.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31360 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: |
| 03:08.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Changed mlt_hit() and mlt_miss() to rayhit() and raymiss(), respectively. Added |
| 03:08.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: a link between struct mlt_app and struct application, using a generic pointer |
| 03:08.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (ap->a_uptr). Added comments to rayhit() regarding what it will do and how it |
| 03:08.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: will do it. |
| 03:09.30 | brlcad | it should look like: http://brlcad.org/~sean/BRL-CAD%20Priorities.png |
| 03:10.37 | brlcad | will have to catch up with log later |
| 03:11.20 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i did add a few comments to struct rt_pt_node, in raytrace.h, about the files that use it. Bad idea? |
| 03:15.37 | brlcad | comments aren't usually a problem unless they're a heavy maintenance burden (for whatever reason) |
| 03:16.57 | brlcad | except for bad comments of course that say something wrong or confusing; or comments that change a deprecation status |
| 03:17.16 | brlcad | wanders on home |
| 03:17.23 | andrecastelo | hm ok, i think it is going to be useful, to look for rt_pt_node instances and butify them |
| 03:20.50 | ``Erik | hrmmm |
| 03:21.26 | ``Erik | are you going to have support for both ortho and perspective view, and setting of fov? |
| 03:23.52 | ``Erik | hrmmm, 'register' is pretty pointless these days, I think |
| 03:24.21 | ``Erik | x86 simply doesn't have sane registers and compilers are pretty solid at painting |
| 03:25.09 | ``Erik | thinks he might actually need to read up on mlt :D |
| 03:25.18 | andrecastelo | hm ok ok |
| 03:25.52 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i'm writing my idea in a step by step form, going to update the blog in a while |
| 03:27.01 | andrecastelo | is the support for different views really complex? what do you think about setting a "domain" of valid initial directions to shoot from?? (i think this would be perspective) |
| 03:28.10 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: http://andrecastelo.wordpress.com/ |
| 03:29.11 | ``Erik | nah, the view thing is just a different way to set up your initial set of rays, i think most of the rt's do it procedurally on the fly, each "struct resource" grabbing the next scanline |
| 03:29.36 | ``Erik | and it's just a matter of either picking a direction and mutating the origin or picking an origin and mutating the direction |
| 03:33.00 | yukonbob | brlcad: /me checks the new pdf |
| 03:40.56 | yukonbob | brlcad: looks nice -- one grammar point (I'm not sure that I'm correct on this) is "emplaced" -- perhaps "forever firmly placed as open source..." |
| 03:44.53 | ``Erik | "in order to catch a fairy, I'll have to think like a fairy" -Stewie |
| 03:45.33 | ``Erik | emplace is archaic, but correct... O.o |
| 03:48.41 | andrecastelo | hey guys, i'm off :) |
| 03:48.48 | andrecastelo | cya guys tomorrow |
| 03:49.03 | brlcad | likes archaic |
| 03:49.09 | yukonbob | :) |
| 03:49.17 | brlcad | cya andre|away |
| 03:49.18 | yukonbob | hey brlcad... what's happening? |
| 03:49.50 | brlcad | oh, just got home .. big inbox, ton of irc channels lit up, kinda hungry, should probably sleep |
| 03:49.57 | yukonbob | feh |
| 03:57.10 | brlcad | andre|away: this is a really nice overview presentation if you haven't seen it: http://www.cs.ucf.edu/~colbert/presentations/mlt.pdf |
| 03:59.52 | brlcad | ``Erik: maybe of interest to you too, I ran into that a couple months ago while reading up on it again |
| 04:00.01 | brlcad | really like the 2D example |
| 04:00.28 | brlcad | kinda tempted to implement it though there wouldn't be much point :) |
| 04:01.46 | ``Erik | heh, I was hoping it was stephen colbert :D |
| 04:02.48 | yukonbob | emmy please. |
| 04:03.51 | ``Erik | heheeh lena :) |
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| 05:04.59 | brlcad | cool, mafm's changes look good |
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| 09:56.18 | mafm | hi there, folks |
| 10:17.35 | brlcad | howdy! |
| 10:17.58 | brlcad | "cool, mafm's changes look good" -- from a while ago |
| 10:23.08 | mafm | who dared!? |
| 10:26.16 | mafm | I'm trying to find out with big bot-rher :) |
| 10:26.28 | mafm | btw, the bot doesn't log /me's |
| 10:27.47 | mafm | (no clues from the bot logs, demmit) |
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| 13:09.43 | ``Erik | takes up the habit of speaking in all ctcp actions to avoid surveillance O.o :D |
| 13:11.15 | mafm | :D |
| 13:11.23 | archivist | logs actions |
| 13:12.28 | ``Erik | goes all gitmo and waterlogs archivist ;D |
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| 13:24.16 | ``Erik | when life gives you limes, make a gin and tonic |
| 13:29.49 | mafm | when life gives you microsoft, go pencil and paper? |
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| 14:20.39 | mafm | hmm |
| 14:21.56 | mafm | the MGED command window should stay in the GUI too, with more or less the same capabilities, right? |
| 14:24.18 | mafm | or if not, can anybody point to examples or requirements of what should be implemented? |
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| 15:39.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31361 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx GuiConsole.h): Perfecting the implementation of the console, mainly history handling |
| 15:39.56 | mafm | "Logging in to SourceForge.net is currently disabled." |
| 15:40.14 | mafm | holy cows! |
| 16:28.02 | andre|away | mafm: not watching the soccer match ? :b |
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| 17:16.13 | ``Erik | http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v674/moonlight80/DodgeTrucks.jpg |
| 17:51.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31362 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiConsole.cxx: Small modifications removing redundancy |
| 18:09.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31363 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiConsole.cxx: Header cleanup, to not include full OGRE and OIS headers and other unneeded ones |
| 18:14.16 | brlcad | mafm: yes per examples/requirements .. in a bit, gotta munch some first :) |
| 18:15.10 | mafm | oki |
| 18:15.43 | mafm | I'll have to run in a moment though, it's my last opportunity to watch Blade Runner, director's cut in the cinema :) |
| 18:25.35 | mafm | http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Mafm#Log -- update, with screenie included |
| 18:25.44 | mafm | not very impressive really :P |
| 18:27.30 | mafm | I go now, take care |
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| 20:13.04 | pacman87 | well, i'm finally making progress on tess() |
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| 21:02.53 | ``Erik | http://www.theonion.com/content/video/warcraft_sequel_lets_gamers_play |
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| 22:59.19 | ``Erik | home at last |
| 23:43.08 | ``Erik | carter, hand me my thinking grenades |
| 23:49.08 | brlcad | hehe |
| 00:22.59 | ``Erik | fucking goddamnit |
| 00:23.13 | ``Erik | I can deal with the heat, but I need to get the a/c fixed, some redneck is blasting lynyrd skynyrd |
| 00:23.30 | ``Erik | it's ok in small doses, but not a whole album when I'm not in the mood for it |
| 00:23.56 | ``Erik | at least the song going now is a good one... simple man... *sigh* |
| 00:26.04 | pacman87 | ``Erik: http://xkcd.com/368/ |
| 00:27.05 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:28.05 | ``Erik | <-- has thought about using a collander as a near parabolic director, a spark plug at roughly the focal point, and a nice assload of high capacity fast capacitors... |
| 00:28.20 | ``Erik | uhm, not a collander, a metal uh, like, grease sieve thing |
| 00:28.41 | ``Erik | the metal screen thing :) EM cannon style, yo |
| 00:29.32 | ``Erik | (unfortunately, cars seem to be their own faraday cages to protect the target electronics) |
| 00:34.50 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:34.52 | ``Erik | http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1855/01721azf4.jpg |
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| 03:52.50 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 04:23.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31364 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: |
| 04:23.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Removed struct path_list, mlt_app now has a direct access to a struct |
| 04:23.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: point_list. Added a point list of light sources. Added initialization of mlt_app |
| 04:23.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: lists (lightsources and path). Added hit point calculation and hit point storage |
| 04:23.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: in mlt_app->path, in the rayhit() function. |
| 04:30.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31365 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Fixed structure handling bugs (ap->a_ray->r_pt ---> ap->a_ray.r_pt, for example). |
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| 10:06.39 | mafm | howdy folks |
| 10:28.25 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-032-104.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 10:58.49 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 11:25.40 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.197.15) | |
| 11:51.09 | brlcad | howdy |
| 12:19.45 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.49.194) | |
| 12:21.14 | andrecastelo | good morning guys |
| 12:22.40 | *** join/#brlcad clock__ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 12:36.10 | mafm | andrecastelo: I wasn't watching the football match, no |
| 12:37.37 | mafm | the guys at the lab set up the conference room with the projector to watch them together, though |
| 12:42.06 | mafm | brlcad: so what about the console design? |
| 13:10.19 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31366 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: irrelevant formating changes |
| 13:19.15 | mafm | hmm |
| 13:19.34 | mafm | do you guys think that listeners should go in separate classes |
| 13:19.46 | mafm | or maybe add that capability to a bigger class too? |
| 13:28.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31367 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx GuiConsole.h): Implemented properly the GuiConsole window auto-resizing when OGRE RenderWindow (i.e. the window that appears in your desktop) is resized, and cleaned up some of the other listeners/callbacks. |
| 13:37.02 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.196.163) | |
| 13:39.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31368 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiConsole.cxx: Commenting out debugging cout's. |
| 14:06.25 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-72-245-122-226.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 14:28.29 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 14:55.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31369 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx GuiConsole.cxx): Setting the console text zone to wrap lines instead of cutting them, and setting OIS to not disable keyboard auto-repeat for all the applications in the same DISPLAY -- that's *very* annoying. |
| 15:44.12 | poolio | brlcad: how might I go about calling rt_xxx_tess from a C++ file? I don't see any header with that defined...just the rt table. Should I go through there? |
| 16:09.29 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 16:52.12 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
| 16:52.32 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i was writing definitions for constraintnetwork which is basically a graph |
| 16:52.40 | homovulgaris | can we use the boost library ? |
| 16:53.00 | homovulgaris | i think their headers are pretty rigorous and generic |
| 16:53.24 | homovulgaris | 2 hours to first commit hopefully :) |
| 16:54.21 | homovulgaris | can't we split up the existing doxygen librt page. Am i the only one facing difficulty in loading that page |
| 17:01.55 | mafm | never used that page |
| 17:02.11 | homovulgaris | :) it is a pretty "huge" page |
| 17:02.48 | homovulgaris | mafm: gui images look nice |
| 17:05.28 | mafm | that's default theme's fault :) |
| 17:15.12 | homovulgaris | :D indeed |
| 17:15.32 | homovulgaris | i have never used ogre :) |
| 17:16.54 | mafm | actually it's not OGRE, it's a bit more complex than that |
| 17:17.16 | mafm | OGRE folks wanted to specialyze in the 3D part only, and being so portable as to be usable in consoles |
| 17:17.28 | mafm | then they "externalized" support for other things like input and GUI |
| 17:17.37 | homovulgaris | oh :) |
| 17:17.46 | mafm | so actually you have to use several different libraries to get to this point |
| 17:18.24 | mafm | in this case it's the new RBGui, instead of the most widely known CEGUI... but it feels much better when using it, I think |
| 17:19.02 | mafm | I guess that I should try to focus soon in getting the rest of the infrastructure usable so everybody can test :) |
| 17:19.26 | homovulgaris | i tried rt^3 trunk |
| 17:20.02 | homovulgaris | but didnt seem to do anything :) |
| 17:20.17 | homovulgaris | g3d presently doesnt install ? |
| 17:20.32 | mafm | nope |
| 17:20.45 | mafm | otherwise I think that rt^3 is mostly empty |
| 17:20.53 | homovulgaris | any idea how magic.h entries are created :) |
| 17:21.28 | mafm | the problem is that, for compiling g3d, you need all these different libraries working, and some of them need patches |
| 17:21.43 | homovulgaris | yeah it produces a few binaries rt^3 rt^3d etc. which just prints timer started stopped etc. |
| 17:22.04 | mafm | no idea, let me check... |
| 17:24.36 | mafm | magic.c is in SVN, so I guess that it's not autogenerated -- so I guess that the entries are added by hand, if that's what you mean |
| 17:26.01 | homovulgaris | yeah magic.c just has an identify_magic which returns the name corresponding to magic value |
| 17:26.49 | homovulgaris | but there must be some system of generating the hexadecimal magic number right :) right now i just wrote a number i liked .. but not at all a good way i suppose :) |
| 17:28.47 | mafm | oh I see |
| 17:29.05 | mafm | well, you might want to wait for the gurus to come by ;) |
| 17:29.16 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 17:29.28 | homovulgaris | u are from portugal ? |
| 17:29.45 | mafm | usually nobody is around while I'm coding, except for a couple of hours or so |
| 17:29.48 | mafm | yep |
| 17:30.31 | mafm | you must be from America or Canada I guess :P |
| 17:33.02 | homovulgaris | India :P |
| 17:33.49 | mafm | hmm |
| 17:33.57 | mafm | so what time of the day is it, at the moment? |
| 17:34.27 | homovulgaris | 11:11 pm |
| 17:34.42 | homovulgaris | what time at portugal 5:30 6 ? |
| 17:35.11 | mafm | oh, at night.. I though that you were joining because you just got up in the morning or something :D |
| 17:35.19 | mafm | here it's 18h35 |
| 17:35.28 | homovulgaris | i just got up though :) |
| 17:36.06 | mafm | :D |
| 17:53.45 | homovulgaris | did u see pacman's hyperboloid ? awesome right :) ? |
| 17:56.05 | mafm | only in pictures that he posted here |
| 17:56.12 | mafm | but it's nice yep |
| 18:00.37 | mafm | what's yout development platform? |
| 18:05.25 | homovulgaris | u mean language ? C for integration with librt and other existing libraries.. constraint solving etc. in C++ |
| 18:05.54 | homovulgaris | saw this one ? http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/primitives/hyp.png.html |
| 18:06.15 | mafm | I mean also the OS |
| 18:06.40 | homovulgaris | debian unstable :) amd64 2.6.24-1 |
| 18:06.47 | mafm | heh, nice |
| 18:06.56 | mafm | oh, another Debianite? |
| 18:07.10 | homovulgaris | :) et tu ? |
| 18:07.13 | mafm | int random { return 4; } :P |
| 18:07.17 | mafm | me too |
| 18:07.26 | mafm | they make a lot of fun of me around here :PPP |
| 18:16.10 | mafm | (not in BRL-CAD, I mean in Portugal some of my friends -- it's not a very popular distro here) |
| 18:18.54 | homovulgaris | :) BRL-CAD is a very "secular" organization i am sure :) |
| 18:20.21 | louipc | mafm: whats popular? |
| 18:20.46 | homovulgaris | I cant imagine debian not being popular anywhere :) |
| 18:20.50 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: all my hyp images are here: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/ |
| 18:21.15 | mafm | louipc: mostly fedora |
| 18:21.27 | homovulgaris | pacman87: makes me want to write a primitive myself :) |
| 18:21.36 | louipc | ah |
| 18:21.37 | mafm | and now Ubuntu of course |
| 18:21.56 | louipc | yeah I would have guessed ubuntu |
| 18:22.07 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: most of it was pretty easy, but i'm still fighting to get tess() to do what i want |
| 18:22.16 | homovulgaris | how is the sweep thing going to be implemented ? |
| 18:22.31 | homovulgaris | i mean how does hyp help revolve and sweep ? |
| 18:22.55 | pacman87 | i started it as my gsoc app patch requirement |
| 18:23.14 | pacman87 | and it helps me figure out what all a primitive needs |
| 18:23.20 | homovulgaris | method of creating new geometry primitives is pretty well strucutred as i understood from the comments in librt.. but yeah i think the raytracing part must be pretty involved |
| 18:24.07 | pacman87 | there's a fairly standard method for finding intersections of conic-type shapes |
| 18:25.02 | brlcad | poolio: why would you be calling rt_xxx_tess()? .. it doesn't do anything |
| 18:25.59 | pacman87 | brlcad: i think he wanted to call each primitive's tess(), not rt_xxx_tess() specifically |
| 18:26.01 | brlcad | if instead of xxx you mean some given primitive, then you can either call the function directly (just declare the function) or go through rt_functab |
| 18:27.06 | brlcad | homovulgaris: you're welcome to break up librt into doxygen groups -- I'm not sure who all uses it, that's a work in progress |
| 18:27.08 | homovulgaris | sweep would basically involve a profile right ? and for the profile u would be using sketch ? |
| 18:27.23 | homovulgaris | ok.. and magic number generation ? |
| 18:27.36 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: that's the current plan |
| 18:27.43 | ``Erik | hey, burley... should g2asc/asc2g per-primitive functionality be moved out of conv/ and into src/librt/whatver/g_*.c ? |
| 18:28.34 | poolio | brlcad: I meant rt_arbn_tess, declaring it did the trick :) |
| 18:28.36 | ``Erik | (if I have to use linux, debian is the one I like to go with) |
| 18:29.03 | starseeker | would have thought Gentoo for ``Erik |
| 18:29.11 | brlcad | as for boost, it really depends on which parts of boost -- the portions that are going to be part of c++0x are probably fair game, the others on case-by-case |
| 18:29.29 | ``Erik | uhm, I gave up on linux before gentoo came along, I believe |
| 18:29.50 | homovulgaris | :o gave up on linux :) |
| 18:30.22 | ``Erik | (also; gentoo is for ricers) |
| 18:30.38 | starseeker | Oddly enough, I don't performance tune my system much |
| 18:30.46 | pacman87 | uses slackware |
| 18:31.05 | brlcad | homovulgaris: the magic numbers are defined by the maker of the structure that needed them -- they're usually the ascii encoding of some related text string (see magic.h) |
| 18:31.15 | mafm | slackware r:-) |
| 18:31.35 | ``Erik | in the old days, I tuned some, I don't anymore... |
| 18:31.41 | ``Erik | heh |
| 18:31.51 | ``Erik | I still have floppies with slackware disk set files on them |
| 18:32.01 | homovulgaris | basically i wanted to define PC_CONSTRAINT_MAGIC_INTERNAL so i just selected a hex number and added it to magic.h and magic.c .. should it be ok / |
| 18:32.05 | pacman87 | ``Erik: 5.25" or 3.5"? |
| 18:32.13 | ``Erik | 3.5's |
| 18:32.18 | pacman87 | awww :( |
| 18:32.21 | ``Erik | I moved from 5.25's to 3.5's with my commodore |
| 18:32.28 | brlcad | mafm: hadn't had a chance to say it, that is great progress on the gui -- want to walk through a build (maybe tomorrow) to get things up and running myself |
| 18:32.36 | ``Erik | I used to have 4 track data tapes O.o |
| 18:32.53 | pacman87 | i've got carmen sandiego on a 5.25" |
| 18:33.00 | ``Erik | heh, I used to |
| 18:33.27 | ``Erik | I had BUCK ROGERS on cassette tape :D and used to buy the 120 minute ones because you could cram more bytes on 'em and they usually worked :D |
| 18:33.36 | brlcad | bets he still has carmen discs somewhere |
| 18:34.10 | brlcad | pacman87: cool! https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt16.png .. so is that recent that you got it aligned? |
| 18:34.37 | pacman87 | brlcad: yeah, it should work now |
| 18:34.41 | brlcad | awesome |
| 18:35.28 | pacman87 | i was off before because the rec uses y and -x as maj/min axis, and i use x and y |
| 18:35.29 | mafm | brlcad: nice. maybe I should sort out the building process so everybody could do it... it's a bit complicate though, and I already contacted RBGui guys to fix some of the issues instead of rolling private patches |
| 18:36.06 | ``Erik | brlcad: two cylinders and a hyp in the middle? |
| 18:36.28 | mafm | other than that, I have still the problem of not knowing exactly what to build in the console, etc; and what about the logging -- if I have to use the one in libbu or what |
| 18:36.33 | ``Erik | or pacman, rather? heh :D |
| 18:36.34 | brlcad | ``Erik: yup, anywhere there is per-primitive tables .. that belongs in the new dirs |
| 18:36.57 | brlcad | (asc2g, g2asc, in, mirror, soledit, *thinks* .. ) |
| 18:37.07 | pacman87 | ``Erik: yes, the hyp creation specifies the base dimensions, and neck ratio, so it's easier to match up to cyls |
| 18:37.29 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, especially for bob :) |
| 18:37.43 | ``Erik | g2asc.c has per primitive operations in it... for everything... asc2g.c, too :( |
| 18:41.05 | mafm | if you want something quickly though, I could pack the libraries (already with patches), the media (still not sure about the license) and the simple Makefile+ogre.cfgs |
| 18:43.13 | ``Erik | hehehe --fenable-racing-stripes |
| 18:43.26 | ``Erik | --fuck-upstream |
| 18:43.32 | ``Erik | I love reading about gentoo, it's funny stuff :D |
| 18:46.29 | ``Erik | ahhh, it's moved |
| 18:46.31 | ``Erik | http://www.funroll-loops.info/ |
| 18:47.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31370 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx GuiConsole.h): Adding pointer to listener to be able to delete it, and thus not leak memory (even if it should be only disabled when closing the application...) |
| 18:47.59 | mafm | mmm |
| 18:48.26 | mafm | sf.net won't accept my new ssh key anymore, and asks me for password all the time -- any idea of the reason? |
| 18:48.35 | mafm | maybe another special brl-cad hook? |
| 18:59.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31371 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Some cleanups and small code reorganizations, and adding Doxygen documentation in some parts. |
| 19:00.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31372 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/tie_kdtree.c: If bu_realloc() could possibly have a 0 size, test and call bu_free() instead. PR 1989853. |
| 19:09.44 | mafm | brlcad: so about my question before about logs and the console functionalities? |
| 19:12.02 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, that's actually our regular modus operandi to include deps (with our srcs) |
| 19:12.34 | brlcad | I'd say commit their sources, them make commit(s) for any/all patches needed |
| 19:12.46 | brlcad | that way we can reapply the patches if/when we need to update the sources |
| 19:13.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31373 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Restoring missing character when closing comment, it was causing havok when compiling :) |
| 19:13.36 | mafm | do you mean update their sources to our repository? |
| 19:13.37 | brlcad | mafm: and no regarding ssh keys -- that's entirely outside of the commit/hook infrastructure |
| 19:13.58 | brlcad | you should be able to log into an interactive node and manually verify your ~/.ssh files |
| 19:14.07 | mafm | all RBGui (which needs Mocha as util library), OGRE and OIS? |
| 19:14.26 | *** join/#brlcad WARLOCK (n=Paychris@wsip-24-120-246-34.lv.lv.cox.net) | |
| 19:14.27 | brlcad | if you *just* uploaded new keys, I'd give it a day -- sometimes takes a while to sync them to all the svn hosts |
| 19:14.49 | brlcad | mafm: yep, the whole shebang -- how big is their stuff? |
| 19:14.51 | mafm | I can successfully submit to other repositories (gna), but not this |
| 19:14.51 | WARLOCK | anyone know a good place to discuss autocad & get help |
| 19:15.12 | mafm | maybe it's because of pulling SVN from https instead of svn+ssh? |
| 19:15.13 | brlcad | WARLOCK: sure, try an autocad support forum :) |
| 19:15.27 | brlcad | (which this is not) |
| 19:15.28 | WARLOCK | well, i was curious if there was an irc chat room |
| 19:15.31 | WARLOCK | for cad users |
| 19:15.36 | WARLOCK | it would be nice |
| 19:15.36 | brlcad | not that I'm aware of |
| 19:15.50 | WARLOCK | we should have one! |
| 19:15.53 | brlcad | there is #cad with like one dude |
| 19:16.15 | brlcad | "we" ? that wouldn't benefit us given we're developing a different cad system |
| 19:17.03 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 19:17.21 | WARLOCK | really |
| 19:17.27 | WARLOCK | let me navigate |
| 19:17.28 | WARLOCK | to shi site |
| 19:17.34 | WARLOCK | to this site* |
| 19:17.35 | ``Erik | joins #gentoo to talk about the latest vista service patch and the issues he's having |
| 19:17.40 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:18.20 | *** part/#brlcad WARLOCK (n=Paychris@wsip-24-120-246-34.lv.lv.cox.net) | |
| 19:18.43 | homovulgaris | brlcad: is our pkgconfig system working properly ? |
| 19:18.55 | mafm | brlcad: took a while to run: http://rafb.net/p/6UGAlD81.html |
| 19:19.10 | homovulgaris | i mean in the .pc files shouldnt the datarootdir declaration be one line above ? |
| 19:20.53 | mafm | I'd say that 300k sloc from OGRE is a bit... too much |
| 19:21.52 | mafm | as for patches and so on, for me OGRE and OIS stand pretty much by themselves and are quite easy to install (regular build systems, etc) |
| 19:22.15 | mafm | but RBGui and Mocha don't even compile out of the box, even if the patches required are pretty small |
| 19:27.47 | mafm | well, have to run now |
| 19:28.28 | mafm | hopefully I'll come back tomorrow -- tonight is the day of patron of the city, big party \o/ |
| 19:28.36 | mafm | take care folks :) |
| 20:01.51 | homovulgaris | hey erik, shouldnt line 918 of tie_kdtree.c be ((tie_geom_t *)(tie->kdtree->data))->tri_list rather than ((tie->kdtree->data))->tri_list |
| 20:02.00 | homovulgaris | i was getting a compile error |
| 20:04.12 | ``Erik | hrm, yeah, probably |
| 20:05.25 | ``Erik | thanks for catching that |
| 20:05.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31374 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/tie_kdtree.c: pheer my pointy hat (fix a void* deref). |
| 20:06.47 | homovulgaris | :) i have honestly no idea what libtie does :) |
| 20:07.06 | ``Erik | uhm, really really fast triangle raytracing, used by adrt |
| 20:07.08 | homovulgaris | :should check out more parts of the source.. 1.5 mil lines is too much :) |
| 20:07.19 | ``Erik | some day, I'll rip out bot stuff in librt and shove tie in there |
| 20:07.24 | ``Erik | 'triangle intersection engine' |
| 20:07.37 | pacman87 | not 'twin ion engine'? |
| 20:07.44 | homovulgaris | oh ok :) bag of triangles never made much sense to me either :P |
| 20:08.20 | ``Erik | a long time ago, in a galaxy far away, the notion of modeling or rendering something just using triangles seemed stupid :) |
| 20:08.44 | ``Erik | I mean, how are you going to get a reasonable model to fit in the massive 4kb of memory your big high powered supercomputer has? |
| 20:09.02 | ``Erik | :D |
| 20:09.05 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 20:10.12 | ``Erik | wonders if his patch actually works |
| 20:15.52 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-78-196.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:17.04 | ``Erik | brilliant :D http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=35890 |
| 20:42.12 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 20:42.44 | homovulgaris | no wonder u like #gentoo |
| 20:43.13 | louipc | lol |
| 20:48.27 | homovulgaris | :) btw why do we still attribute copyright to US army ? |
| 20:50.26 | andrecastelo | good evening guys |
| 20:51.36 | ``Erik | <-- personally thinks that donated work should remain under content creators content, the license protects the US gov't, as well as all other consumers O.o but *shrug* not my call |
| 20:51.46 | ``Erik | howdy, andré |
| 20:52.24 | andrecastelo | howdy ``Erik |
| 20:52.43 | andrecastelo | how's the weather ? :D |
| 20:52.55 | ``Erik | day-star too bright *grunt* |
| 20:59.09 | homovulgaris | :( no mged -- ogl_open: couldn't create glXContext. |
| 20:59.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31375 10/brlcad/trunk/ (60 files in 43 dirs): |
| 20:59.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Added basic structure of new Parametrics and constraints library in src/libbpc, |
| 20:59.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: pc_constraint.c file in librt for constraint object import export functionality, |
| 20:59.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: modification of primitives and table.c to provide rt_primitive_params |
| 20:59.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: functionality via functab structure, minor change to doxygen_structure |
| 21:18.02 | ``Erik | sobs at the every increasing instance count of "#ifdef __linux__ /* EXTRA special */" in this file |
| 21:18.13 | ``Erik | s,y,, |
| 21:28.51 | pacman87 | ``Erik: which file? |
| 21:33.20 | ``Erik | different project |
| 21:33.43 | pacman87 | briefly contemplates rewriting hyp's tess() to take advantage of the fact that a hyberboloid is a doubly-ruled surface |
| 21:34.07 | ``Erik | compiler chunk that outputs at&t style x86 assembly, there's the linux way and the rest of the known universe way :) |
| 21:35.48 | ``Erik | oh poo, mal isn't here to raz on :D |
| 21:48.14 | pacman87 | success! |
| 21:49.42 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/hyp_rt_tess.png |
| 21:50.26 | pacman87 | still not all that efficient, but at least it finally works |
| 21:57.47 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.111.4) | |
| 22:06.49 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 22:20.43 | andrecastelo | so ``Erik, what do you think about the implementation idea at http://andrecastelo.wordpress.com/ ? |
| 22:58.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31376 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ (hyp/hyp.c rhc/rhc.c): tess() should finally work, but still needs effeciency optimizations |
| 23:01.10 | ``Erik | hrmmm, you are intending on doing a full sample set for each pixel, not building a light map, correct? |
| 23:05.48 | andrecastelo | yup, but i'm open to suggestions |
| 23:07.39 | ``Erik | no, that works for me |
| 23:08.04 | ``Erik | it seems to me that you should shoot a primary ray and begin your pass at the first hitpoint? |
| 23:08.16 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 23:08.24 | ``Erik | opposed to shooting a random direction from the viewpoint as your list indicates? |
| 23:08.50 | andrecastelo | that's what i meant |
| 23:09.00 | ``Erik | okie |
| 23:09.16 | ``Erik | storing the path in mlt_app might be trickier than you might think |
| 23:09.25 | andrecastelo | why ? |
| 23:09.33 | ``Erik | we're going to have N workers going |
| 23:09.48 | ``Erik | you probably have 1 by default, I have 8 by default and will be testing at 128+ |
| 23:10.07 | andrecastelo | i see, if i restrict it to one point list, it will slow down considerably |
| 23:10.20 | ``Erik | in fact, we're getting a new sun t2 machine with 128 ALU's, I'm excited to see this piece of hw :) |
| 23:10.28 | ``Erik | and I have machines with, uh, 4096 cpu's at my disposal |
| 23:10.41 | andrecastelo | O.O |
| 23:10.51 | andrecastelo | holy.. |
| 23:10.53 | ``Erik | well, if you have one point list, the usual occurance is for data to be over-written or confused |
| 23:11.19 | pacman87 | is jealous |
| 23:12.05 | ``Erik | I probably won't use the big one, it requires queuing a batch job and people doing "important" things need time on it |
| 23:12.24 | ``Erik | but I will pretty much be operating solely in a fairly threaded and parallel mode |
| 23:12.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31377 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Added memory freeing block for mlt_app->path. (Subject to change to mlt_app->path_list) |
| 23:12.37 | andrecastelo | i see |
| 23:13.05 | andrecastelo | also, should i give more priority to view_pixel() over rayhit() ? |
| 23:13.09 | ``Erik | most of the rt's operating by having each worker responsible for an entire scanline |
| 23:13.21 | ``Erik | priority? how do you mean? |
| 23:13.48 | ``Erik | they do different things, last I looked O.o |
| 23:14.29 | andrecastelo | i know, i meant if i should work first on view_pixel() |
| 23:14.40 | ``Erik | um |
| 23:14.56 | ``Erik | well, if you do view_pixel first, you can stub like a flat shader to see if you're casting right |
| 23:15.08 | andrecastelo | yup, that's what i thought |
| 23:15.10 | ``Erik | I think that would give you a more visual result sooner |
| 23:15.33 | ``Erik | which is always good, not only can you course correct sooner, but it's awesome seeing it and gets ya all enthusiastic :D |
| 23:15.55 | andrecastelo | yep, i've been thinking that should i do view_pixel() later, i could need to rewrite some stuff |
| 23:16.16 | andrecastelo | yup, i'm kind of jealous of pacman87 and his nifty images |
| 23:16.23 | ``Erik | *nod* |
| 23:16.35 | pacman87 | :D |
| 23:16.50 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 23:17.15 | ``Erik | I sure got a huge thrill out of my metaball image |
| 23:17.19 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/primitives/niceballs.png.html |
| 23:17.33 | ``Erik | ask brlcad, I was running around the office yelling "check out my balls! look at my balls!" |
| 23:18.21 | andrecastelo | rofl! |
| 23:19.23 | andrecastelo | rtmlt's view_pixel() would be something like rt's view_pixel(), right? |
| 23:19.34 | ``Erik | I think so |
| 23:19.54 | ``Erik | generate the primary cast, "go do it", pack the result |
| 23:21.33 | andrecastelo | primary cast is the primary rays? |
| 23:21.38 | ``Erik | yes |
| 23:22.04 | ``Erik | ray caster vs ray tracer... :) |
| 23:23.47 | andrecastelo | ah ok ok :D |
| 23:23.47 | ``Erik | hrmmmmmm, gpl or bsd *think* |
| 23:24.40 | ``Erik | leans towards the 'new' bsd license (two clause, not 3) |
| 23:24.53 | ``Erik | side project, unrelated to BRL-CAD or graphics :D |
| 23:25.04 | andrecastelo | was just going to ask that :D |
| 23:25.20 | andrecastelo | what's so bad about gpl? (or what's so good about bsd) |
| 23:27.16 | ``Erik | bsd allows use in closed source projects (with attribution) |
| 23:28.08 | ``Erik | I've released some stuff under the bsd license that is use in, uh, shoutcast and stuff |
| 23:28.08 | ``Erik | so my name gets in their readme or whatever :) |
| 23:28.35 | andrecastelo | is impressed how open source ``Erik is |
| 23:28.43 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 23:29.06 | ``Erik | *shrug8 |
| 23:29.18 | ``Erik | in the late 80's, I was releasing code on BBS's under pretty much public domain |
| 23:29.59 | andrecastelo | must be awesome to have someone use your code, isn't it ? |
| 23:30.07 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 23:30.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31378 10/brlcad/trunk/ (27 files in 15 dirs): changes in comments to conform to doxygen, update of misc/Doxyfile |
| 23:30.16 | ``Erik | http://www.brianlee.org/digital-picture-frame/ <-- especially neat stuff like that |
| 23:30.59 | andrecastelo | opens site |
| 23:34.03 | ``Erik | neat, my name is on http://www.centova.com/pages/icescc too |
| 23:35.23 | andrecastelo | awesome, ``Erik.. that digital picture frame looks really nice |
| 23:36.01 | ``Erik | I thought so, I got an email from brian with a couple questions and we got to talking, he did some really awesome stuff, I'm glad he chose my software :D |
| 23:36.52 | andrecastelo | neat, neat, i can imagine the feeling :D |
| 23:37.41 | andrecastelo | ices-cc is the shoutcast thing you talked about? or did you work on more related stuff ? |
| 23:38.02 | ``Erik | uhm, it's a fork of the thing my stuff was used for, I think |
| 23:38.18 | ``Erik | I didn't work on it, I just had some open source software out there under a bsd license, and people used it |
| 23:38.36 | ``Erik | sometimes I get lucky and they tell me what they're using my stuff for :) |
| 23:40.14 | ``Erik | xiph icecast is the one I was thinking |
| 23:41.30 | andrecastelo | wants to write good code too :b |
| 23:41.47 | ``Erik | oh, whoa, wait up there, I never claimed I wrote GOOD code ;) |
| 23:43.14 | andrecastelo | hehehe, true, but i assume that if people want to use it, it must be somewhat good |
| 23:43.38 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: that just means it's useful ;) |
| 23:44.05 | andrecastelo | still, i think that both concepts overlap :) |
| 23:44.41 | ``Erik | hum, some neat renderings from gsi O.o |
| 23:52.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31379 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Fixed some issues in view_end(): structure freed changed from mlt_app to point_list; moved declarations to the beginning of the block. |
| 23:55.45 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik : can you give me some tips on understanding view_pixel() ?? what is the core of the function?? (i'm thinking it must be one of the switch cases) |
| 00:14.06 | ``Erik | in... rt? |
| 00:16.28 | ``Erik | *look* |
| 00:17.31 | ``Erik | "BUFMODE_SCANLINE" is the one you'd be used to seeing, I believe |
| 00:24.07 | ``Erik | andre, this is reduced to the "normal" code path for you: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d79ae3ecc |
| 00:24.19 | ``Erik | brlcad: zomfg, teh spamz0rz! |
| 00:27.57 | ``Erik | wants to completely remove the 'restart' capability, so "perfect black" is no longer a magic semantic notion :/ |
| 00:28.46 | ``Erik | I'll wait until MLT is fully implemented, if it takes a week to render a nice scene, restart might be worth keeping |
| 00:30.11 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: thanks erik, i'll take a look. I've also changed the mlt_app back, with path_lists and point_lists |
| 00:30.31 | andrecastelo | I was doing the required changes to rayhit() and view_init() |
| 00:33.27 | ``Erik | <-- has never written an rt, has only really dorked around with fixing a race condition in viewedge.c in that dir... :) so I may be wrong or otherwise confused :) |
| 00:35.46 | andrecastelo | thanks though, changing view_end to free multiple path lists and point lists |
| 00:35.54 | homovulgaris | who was the adrt architect :) ? |
| 00:37.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31380 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Changed mlt_app to use path_lists that use point_lists. Updated rayhit(), view_init() and view_end(). |
| 00:40.06 | andrecastelo | reads pastebin |
| 00:41.58 | ``Erik | adrt was done by twingy |
| 00:42.53 | ``Erik | I've been doing a lot of crud in that directory, but I still treat parts as black boxes, so right now, no one really knows it... he knows part, i know part... :) |
| 00:44.03 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 00:44.37 | ``Erik | whyfor? |
| 00:45.58 | homovulgaris | Tryker ICV looks really cool :) |
| 00:46.03 | homovulgaris | *Stryker |
| 00:46.19 | ``Erik | that is the RISE path tracer |
| 00:46.42 | homovulgaris | what exactly was the grass in that model .. geometrically ? |
| 00:46.47 | ``Erik | theoretically, the MLT should output an extremely similar picture in less time, given the resource |
| 00:46.48 | ``Erik | triangles |
| 00:47.31 | ``Erik | twingy used a blender plugin to generate a gazillion triangles of grass, then exported it to the adrt format and glued the stryker on it |
| 00:47.35 | ``Erik | iirc |
| 00:47.42 | ``Erik | each blade is several triangles |
| 00:48.05 | homovulgaris | :O 11542,992 triangles |
| 00:48.13 | homovulgaris | and 5 days of rendering :) |
| 00:48.30 | homovulgaris | i think it's time for MLT indeed :) |
| 00:48.33 | ``Erik | yes, a few years ago |
| 00:48.49 | ``Erik | across a large number of machines, ADRT is a distributed system |
| 00:49.01 | homovulgaris | yeah i was just checking out the directory |
| 00:49.02 | ``Erik | so there was something like two dozen computers, many of them dual core |
| 00:49.19 | andrecastelo | still, mlt IS a brute force solution.. so how much less time it is expected to output such images? |
| 00:49.25 | ``Erik | but it's hypersampled and has depth shtuff |
| 00:49.39 | ``Erik | uhm, you know the semi-genetic algorithm to favor 'important' rays? |
| 00:49.51 | ``Erik | RISE is full on random in path selection |
| 00:50.04 | homovulgaris | :D "full on random" |
| 00:50.08 | ``Erik | every time. Never tries to do any kind of importance selection, just drand48() style |
| 00:50.40 | homovulgaris | how does tie improve it ? |
| 00:50.53 | ``Erik | tie is a very fast raytracer that only does triangles |
| 00:51.07 | ``Erik | not quite as fast as rayfarce or manta, but far faster than librt |
| 00:51.26 | ``Erik | were it done with librt bots, that'd be 5 months, not 5 days :D |
| 00:51.42 | ``Erik | note; 8 TRILLION rays |
| 00:52.05 | homovulgaris | :) hmmm |
| 00:53.30 | ``Erik | feel free to figure out how many rays per second that is |
| 00:53.45 | ``Erik | in 2004 |
| 00:56.13 | ``Erik | comes up with 2.3 million rays per second on 2004 hardware |
| 00:56.51 | ``Erik | starts wondering if that 8 trillion is short O.o like a rollover bug or something |
| 00:57.14 | homovulgaris | :) what is the status now ? i mean how many rays per sceond on 2007 |
| 00:57.19 | homovulgaris | *in |
| 00:57.21 | ``Erik | dunno |
| 00:57.23 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:57.25 | ``Erik | rise doesn't work anymore |
| 00:57.29 | ``Erik | and isst doesn't do it that way |
| 00:57.33 | ``Erik | speak of the devil |
| 00:58.30 | ``Erik | twingy: dawn is drooling over the icv image and the general awesomeness of adrt/rise |
| 00:58.38 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 00:59.01 | homovulgaris | maybe we can have another drool when mlt is finished |
| 00:59.44 | ``Erik | would like to ram tie (or rayforce) into librt to replace bots some day |
| 01:00.13 | ``Erik | and mebbe replace remrt with the adrt stuff O.o |
| 01:01.16 | homovulgaris | only raytracing i did in architecture school was using maxwell and kerkythea .. ok maybe a bit of rhino |
| 01:03.15 | Twingy | who is dawn? |
| 01:03.33 | homovulgaris | i am dawn :) |
| 01:03.39 | ``Erik | gsoc student |
| 01:03.39 | Twingy | hi dawn |
| 01:04.15 | homovulgaris | dawn is mostly a female name in us right :P I am a guy |
| 01:04.43 | homovulgaris | hi Twingy , adrt is awesome :) |
| 01:05.00 | homovulgaris | 6.41 am here.. better go eat something |
| 01:05.21 | Twingy | I'm flattered, but you should work with ray force as it's a more intelligent way of handling ray tracing |
| 01:05.55 | ``Erik | rayforce is not open source. |
| 01:06.17 | Twingy | what do I know... |
| 01:06.37 | homovulgaris | hmm.. :) oh if somebody is commiting change me and mafm out of the Special Thanks section in AUTHORS to Contributors or something :) |
| 01:06.59 | homovulgaris | I dislike small commits :) |
| 01:07.25 | ``Erik | everyone else dislikes big commits :D |
| 01:08.16 | andrecastelo | i prefer small commits :B |
| 01:08.21 | andrecastelo | easier to fix if anything goes wrong |
| 01:08.37 | ``Erik | *nod* and easier to perform code archeology on |
| 01:24.39 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 01:26.08 | brlcad | woof, what a backlog :) |
| 01:26.14 | brlcad | *read*read*read* |
| 01:26.29 | ``Erik | heh |
| 01:27.19 | brlcad | homovulgaris: no idea re: pkgconfig working -- I set up the files originally and they should be dynamic to the actual build settings needed/used, but I had no quick means or need to test whether it actually worked |
| 01:27.25 | Twingy | I worked with a gsoc student on nurbana once |
| 01:27.32 | ``Erik | cool |
| 01:27.33 | brlcad | I figured I'd leave that to the first person to complain/need it :) |
| 01:28.17 | brlcad | homovulgaris: if you think they need a fix, go ahead and fix them |
| 01:28.17 | ``Erik | has a couple 'third party' apps that use librt (rtcmp and that "fast" vl thing), can test the .pc if needed |
| 01:34.44 | brlcad | notes that tcl/tk is more than 500+k sloc compared to ogre's mere 300k |
| 01:35.38 | ``Erik | notes that tcl/tk is a pile *cough* O:-) |
| 01:35.59 | brlcad | homovulgaris: if you run sh/enumerate.sh .. it's a little less than 1.5mil lines :) .. about 1mil of actual brl-cad source |
| 01:36.16 | ``Erik | I like wheelers "sloccount" suite |
| 01:36.27 | ``Erik | if you want to extract meaningless metrics |
| 01:37.50 | ``Erik | thedailywtf.com has a few stories about how coders destroy idiotic mgmt plans involving loc or commit metrics :) |
| 01:38.37 | ``Erik | http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/The-Defect-Black-Market.aspx |
| 01:42.39 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 01:46.02 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 01:46.29 | brlcad | pacman87: hah, that's awesome (tess) .. |
| 01:46.57 | brlcad | homovulgaris and andrecastelo: really nice progress updates :) |
| 01:47.13 | brlcad | jeez, leave for dinner and come back to a ton of cool stuff :) |
| 01:47.40 | ``Erik | the answer, obviously, is to quit eating. |
| 01:47.51 | ``Erik | I mean, you gave up sleep, giving up eating should be easy O.o |
| 01:49.02 | ``Erik | munches his nuked dinner O.o |
| 01:49.55 | ``Erik | "if you don't like it, you can just pass the blunt to the n***er on your left" --Jimmy, southpark |
| 01:50.03 | ``Erik | what a show :D |
| 01:51.14 | homovulgaris | hey Erik could you check if pkgconfig is working |
| 01:51.25 | brlcad | andrecastelo: he really was .. kinda disturbing to have a grown guy asking folks to look at his balls :) |
| 01:51.39 | homovulgaris | mine gives Variable 'datarootdir' not defined in '/usr/brlcad/lib/pkgconfig/rt.pc' |
| 01:51.57 | homovulgaris | where as it is defined.. just a line below where it is used i guess :) |
| 01:52.05 | ``Erik | it was completely innocent! I can't help if you PERVERTS twisted it into something disturbing! |
| 01:52.30 | homovulgaris | i am sure it would have been equally disturbing even if it was a non-grown guy :D |
| 01:53.34 | ``Erik | and, uh, WHO suggested changing "goo" to "sweat" in the primitive? |
| 01:53.49 | ``Erik | btw; I had to :%s/sweat/goo/g really fast when I was showing pjt the code |
| 01:53.54 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i ran sloccount it says we have 0.26 mil of shell script :O |
| 01:54.03 | homovulgaris | and 1 mil of ansic ofcourse |
| 01:54.14 | ``Erik | most of that .26 is probably generated or copied autoconf stuff |
| 01:54.57 | homovulgaris | yeah.. :) 3323 of asm ;) in src/other and libfb :) |
| 01:56.31 | homovulgaris | hmm libz |
| 01:57.38 | ``Erik | eyeballs src/libfb/sgiselect.s |
| 01:57.45 | brlcad | yay, caught up |
| 01:57.53 | homovulgaris | libz has ada too ? |
| 01:58.19 | brlcad | yeah, sloccount is nifty, last ran it like seven years ago though |
| 01:58.20 | ``Erik | o.O |
| 01:59.15 | brlcad | ``Erik: if I had not gone to dinner, I wouldn't have found out some cool news |
| 01:59.24 | brlcad | mamie's is getting a liquor's license :) |
| 01:59.33 | ``Erik | nice |
| 01:59.40 | ``Erik | are they going to carry anything worth ordering? :D |
| 01:59.43 | brlcad | and because of that's they are already byob now |
| 01:59.59 | brlcad | some folks were in tonight with a bottle of wine |
| 02:00.14 | ``Erik | unfortunately, I can't throw a beer in the fridge at work in anticipation |
| 02:00.27 | brlcad | and Ed stuff ourselves like mad |
| 02:00.30 | ``Erik | shows up to mamies with a six pack and a bottle of vodka O.o :> |
| 02:00.46 | ``Erik | ed was in the area? shoot, I may've done the 30 minute drive for that |
| 02:00.56 | brlcad | we left late |
| 02:01.14 | ``Erik | ahhh |
| 02:01.25 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, but remember the place next door :) |
| 02:01.34 | ``Erik | hrm? radio shack? |
| 02:01.39 | ``Erik | or the asian market? |
| 02:01.40 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 02:01.45 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:02.02 | homovulgaris | at sgiselect.s i like intel syntax better, argh windows memories |
| 02:02.10 | brlcad | before asian is my blessed scotch shop |
| 02:02.21 | ``Erik | I doubt I can buy a single bottle of a drinkable beer at a liquor store... aint' no way I'm gonna drink something that comes as a "fourty" |
| 02:02.32 | ``Erik | eck, intel syntax is teh ugliez, give me at&t style |
| 02:02.46 | brlcad | they have a decent selection, surprising for the appearance outside |
| 02:02.55 | homovulgaris | binutils also now supports intel syntax :) |
| 02:03.16 | ``Erik | <-- has two nice stores around the corner from his house |
| 02:03.57 | homovulgaris | It is just 7.40am , I want to have lunch and sleep |
| 02:04.16 | brlcad | homovulgaris: that 0.26 mil of shell script is biased because of the regression scripts in regress/ |
| 02:04.21 | ``Erik | wow, almost sounds like you keep programmers hours :) |
| 02:04.33 | brlcad | they have binary images encoded in ascii that are compared for regression testing |
| 02:04.52 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (n=Pandora@c-69-243-244-154.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 02:04.56 | brlcad | you'd have to exempt regress/ |
| 02:05.11 | brlcad | howdy punkrockgirl (nice nick) |
| 02:05.16 | homovulgaris | yeah regress is around .23 mil :D |
| 02:05.22 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 02:05.24 | punkrockgirl | thanks |
| 02:05.39 | ``Erik | punker is my bitch, btw, so put it away, boy |
| 02:05.40 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 02:05.44 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 02:05.58 | punkrockgirl | wait a second... bitch? ;P |
| 02:06.23 | ``Erik | eck, shaders.sh is ginormous |
| 02:06.25 | brlcad | homovulgaris: otherwise, the bulk is in sh/ and bench/ .. which is about 9k |
| 02:06.35 | ``Erik | hah |
| 02:06.42 | ``Erik | shell script generate of the eagle logo. Ow. |
| 02:06.50 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: i'll refrain from calling you that, but pleasure to (sorta) finally meet you |
| 02:07.06 | punkrockgirl | thanks, and you too :) |
| 02:07.25 | ``Erik | wonders if the image can be shoved in as a pix and have a script use that to generate what it needs |
| 02:07.45 | ``Erik | or, uh, since it generates a pix, just... have... a pix? |
| 02:07.51 | brlcad | these days probably, especially with svn |
| 02:08.00 | poolio | hmm, where do I get a struct model from? |
| 02:08.32 | brlcad | poolio: sounds like you're following tess() |
| 02:08.35 | brlcad | for brep() |
| 02:08.37 | poolio | Aye. |
| 02:09.09 | brlcad | to get that model struct, you'll have to follow the rt_functab caller that invokes tess() (which I sadly don't remember off-hand) |
| 02:09.30 | ``Erik | doh, extra_DIST != EXTRA_DIST |
| 02:09.50 | ``Erik | brlcad, you put in an order for my hocket helmet and water wings, right? |
| 02:10.00 | brlcad | heh, yep |
| 02:10.14 | brlcad | is going to do that just to see what W says |
| 02:10.29 | ``Erik | "I'm not fat, I just have a sweet hockey body" |
| 02:10.33 | ``Erik | -Cartman |
| 02:10.34 | brlcad | heh |
| 02:11.23 | ``Erik | <-- prepping his brainfuck suite for release |
| 02:11.42 | homovulgaris | running enumerate made me realise i did not have dc :) |
| 02:13.23 | ``Erik | enumerate? is this an attempt to re-implement jot? |
| 02:13.57 | homovulgaris | :O enumerate.sh i meant :) |
| 02:14.00 | homovulgaris | whats jot ? |
| 02:14.00 | ``Erik | hates finding himself on linux when he needs something as fundamentally UNIX as jot... wtf doens't linux have that? :( |
| 02:14.02 | ``Erik | oh, heh |
| 02:14.03 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 02:14.36 | ``Erik | jot prints a series of numbers... if you say "jot 10", it'll count from 1 to 10... it has the notion of stride and start, as well |
| 02:14.49 | ``Erik | so "jot 10 10" will print 10, then 20, then 30, ... to 100 |
| 02:15.13 | homovulgaris | something like seq |
| 02:15.22 | brlcad | homovulgaris: no dc? the horrors! |
| 02:15.26 | ``Erik | er, no, "jot 10 10 100" will print that |
| 02:15.42 | ``Erik | seq? I d'no that one... jot goe sback to the early 70's I believe |
| 02:16.23 | brlcad | ``Erik: wow, I don't think I knew about jot ... |
| 02:16.28 | ``Erik | sorry, early 80's |
| 02:16.43 | ``Erik | 42BSD |
| 02:16.51 | brlcad | we effectively have our own implementation of it in brl-cad because there wasn't a prevalent means |
| 02:17.14 | ``Erik | jot doesn't exist on linux |
| 02:17.32 | homovulgaris | seq does and does the same work .. except for jot -r i guess |
| 02:17.32 | ``Erik | I wrote something kinda similar when I was at fedex because we were stuck fielding redhat boxes :/ |
| 02:17.49 | ``Erik | 'enum.c |
| 02:17.55 | ``Erik | i have it somewhere on some hard drive, I think |
| 02:18.04 | brlcad | /usr/brlcad/bin/loop |
| 02:18.17 | brlcad | loop 10 100 10 |
| 02:18.28 | ``Erik | hah |
| 02:18.37 | ``Erik | sounds like someone knew about jot and missed it :d |
| 02:18.38 | ``Erik | :D |
| 02:18.50 | brlcad | probably |
| 02:19.02 | brlcad | thinks loop is a much better name though :) |
| 02:19.39 | brlcad | uses loop in a handful of the scripts |
| 02:20.29 | ``Erik | *shrug* jot hails from '82 and is on every OS I seem to give a rats ass about :D |
| 02:20.46 | ``Erik | the ability to jot out characters is nice, too |
| 02:21.33 | ``Erik | "jot -c 128 0" is an example in the mac manpage |
| 02:24.40 | brlcad | mebbie, but loop -c 128 0 would work just as well |
| 02:24.46 | brlcad | loop -c a z |
| 02:25.48 | pacman87 | brlcad: don't get too excited about tess() yet, the code is still ugly |
| 02:26.20 | homovulgaris | brlcad: hmm .. loop -c a z goes on printing zeros... |
| 02:29.17 | ``Erik | heh :D |
| 02:31.41 | ``Erik | hrm, '86 by mike |
| 02:32.02 | brlcad | homovulgaris: hehe, you found a bug :) |
| 02:32.27 | brlcad | probably reading -c as a negative number and getting stuck in an inf loop |
| 02:32.51 | brlcad | course it's invalid per the usage, loop doesn't do -c presently |
| 02:33.14 | homovulgaris | hmm.. present src/util/loop.c has no functionality for -c |
| 02:33.18 | brlcad | pacman87: nfw, it's awesome .. I actually thought you'd get stuck on it for a while :) |
| 02:33.37 | pacman87 | brlcad: i was stuck since monday |
| 02:33.55 | brlcad | well longer :) |
| 02:34.01 | brlcad | and you fixed uv's in the meantime |
| 02:34.08 | brlcad | which reminds me |
| 02:34.09 | pacman87 | i ended up having to read almost all of the other primitive's tess() functions |
| 02:34.10 | brlcad | updates |
| 02:34.26 | pacman87 | well, the uv fixes were just to fit to conventions |
| 02:34.50 | pacman87 | uv took 15-20 characters changed |
| 02:37.36 | brlcad | yay, kernel panic |
| 02:37.52 | pacman87 | what from? |
| 02:38.08 | homovulgaris | kernel update :) ? |
| 02:38.30 | brlcad | pacman87: it's rarely ever number of lines or chars that matter when it comes to implementing new primitives |
| 02:38.47 | brlcad | I've been stuck for two weeks on three characters |
| 02:39.14 | pacman87 | it's knowing what characters to change that's the hard part |
| 02:39.40 | pacman87 | second half is starting, back later |
| 02:39.48 | pacman87 | (go lakers) |
| 02:40.19 | brlcad | shakes fist at jeff hanes |
| 02:40.49 | brlcad | speaking of jeff hanes .. homovulgaris, hope to get some quality regression testing in on your root solver changes soon |
| 02:41.05 | brlcad | it's not being ignored, just needs some more effort before it can be applied |
| 02:41.18 | brlcad | also why it wasn't just assigned to you |
| 02:46.22 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 02:47.36 | brlcad | andrecastelo: yours however .. was assigned to you so you can determine if/when to close it out :) |
| 02:48.06 | homovulgaris | thinks what regression testing would involve |
| 02:50.36 | brlcad | applying the changes, checking all instances of all callers, determining what public APIs were changed if any (and making appropriate deprecation statements or refactoring wrappers), running our regression test suite, creating a series of test polynomials that test edge cases, etc |
| 02:51.12 | poolio | Users do the best testing :) |
| 02:51.33 | brlcad | validing that indeed nothing has changed computationally and/or seeing how to integrate it in a way that doesn't screw users that might rely on it |
| 02:52.00 | brlcad | poolio: not when your user might die as a result of it not working |
| 02:52.08 | homovulgaris | hmm.. yeah convention change is such a long process :) |
| 02:52.35 | brlcad | and for this code, invalid computation could have some pretty serious impacts if it has a subtle bug |
| 02:52.35 | homovulgaris | has a grumbling stomach.. :| |
| 02:52.47 | poolio | brlcad: err... |
| 02:53.10 | brlcad | otherwise, I'd agree :) |
| 02:53.34 | homovulgaris | i am pretty sure there must be a bug lurking around ..:) |
| 02:54.01 | brlcad | what makes you think that? |
| 03:07.01 | brlcad | *crickets* |
| 03:09.44 | homovulgaris | well even after testing, i just felt like it happened too fast :P |
| 03:09.56 | brlcad | k |
| 03:11.35 | homovulgaris | brlcad: could you check the wiki page. small changes and a few questions i think.. i am going out for a big brunch.. and sleep.. will check after that.. lots of work for the next 3 days |
| 03:13.09 | brlcad | john already answered at least one question |
| 03:14.37 | brlcad | at least a good comment to one of the points |
| 03:19.00 | brlcad | homovulgaris: shift to pc.h earlier rather than later would be good (and raytrace.h would/could include pc.h if it needs it) |
| 03:21.03 | brlcad | i will be quite impressed if you can actually implement what you suggest in your solution class |
| 03:21.43 | brlcad | resolving to ranges of possible solutions, potentially ordered solution sets with preferred solutions |
| 03:25.26 | brlcad | also, not sure if it's useful in your situation, but your solver might benefit from an interval arithmetic library (boost has one, it was recommended for C++0x inclusion but don't know if it made it) |
| 03:25.40 | brlcad | for managing numeric ranges |
| 03:29.43 | brlcad | http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_35_0/libs/numeric/interval/doc/interval.htm |
| 03:29.46 | brlcad | http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg21/docs/papers/2006/n2067.pdf |
| 03:29.48 | brlcad | for reference |
| 03:30.34 | brlcad | pretty cool stuff, I wanted to implement a volumetric path tracer using interval arithmetic at one point .. |
| 03:31.12 | brlcad | mpfi is a lean n mean C implementation that'd be trivial to embed in your domain class |
| 03:31.47 | poolio | brlcad: are the raytracing issues of brep objects regarding the floating point errors on edges outside of the tolerance range? Couldn't you just test all points against the tolerance in order to correct for the errors or is it _that bad_ ? |
| 03:32.30 | brlcad | depends which tolerance you're talking about |
| 03:33.15 | poolio | Well, I was thinking about some distance in bn_tol |
| 03:33.20 | brlcad | regardless, even if you do -- simply testing all points against a tolerance doesn't solve it by itself |
| 03:34.51 | brlcad | so you determine you hit a curve or several curves within some tolerance .. you 1) can't easily compute that with any efficiency (like order of magnitude problems) and 2) even if you do, you still don't know if it was grazing exit or grazing entry without additional information |
| 04:15.35 | andrecastelo | is back |
| 04:15.40 | andrecastelo | wow, lots of logs |
| 04:15.44 | andrecastelo | reads |
| 04:16.41 | pacman87 | wb andrecastelo |
| 04:16.49 | poolio | brlcad: well don't you have that problem regardless of how you try to solve? Don't you always not know whether it's entering or exiting if you're going through an edge? |
| 04:17.34 | andrecastelo | sup pacman87 |
| 04:17.44 | andrecastelo | brlcad: mine what? the patch? |
| 04:19.14 | poolio | pacman87: purty pictures :) |
| 04:19.36 | pacman87 | poolio: thanks ;) purty, but slow atm |
| 04:19.56 | pacman87 | have you tried it? |
| 04:20.40 | poolio | pacman87: nope, how do I make it run? |
| 04:20.55 | poolio | I should really read through the mged docs and learn how to actually use the software I code for :) |
| 04:21.03 | pacman87 | start mged |
| 04:21.28 | poolio | I'm looking at a plotted hyp, how do I tesselate? |
| 04:21.34 | pacman87 | "ev name" |
| 04:22.08 | poolio | ah |
| 04:22.20 | poolio | schweet :) |
| 04:22.31 | pacman87 | no bugs yet? |
| 04:24.42 | poolio | pacman87: yes siree: nmg_booltree_leaf_tess(hyp2.s): tessellation failure |
| 04:24.42 | poolio | db_walk_subtree() FAIL on '/hyp2.s' |
| 04:24.42 | poolio | /hyp2.s: |
| 04:24.58 | pacman87 | do "l hyp2.s" |
| 04:25.21 | poolio | do you want all that rather then the in command? |
| 04:25.28 | pacman87 | in works too |
| 04:25.34 | pacman87 | if you still have it |
| 04:26.08 | poolio | in hyp4.s hyp 0 0 0 1 0 1 0 0 2 1 90 |
| 04:26.13 | poolio | I think it's due to my crazy parameters :) |
| 04:29.31 | pacman87 | hmmm, i'm getting bad pointer errors... |
| 04:38.49 | pacman87 | Making all in libpc |
| 04:38.50 | pacman87 | make[2]: Entering directory `/home/timothy/brlcad/brlcad/src/libpc' |
| 04:38.50 | pacman87 | make[2]: *** No rule to make target `pc\_solver.lo', needed by `libpc_nil.la'. Stop. |
| 04:39.01 | andrecastelo | hm, cya guys, i'm out to sleep |
| 04:39.10 | pacman87 | bye andre|away |
| 04:41.32 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: did libpc compile for you? |
| 04:42.20 | brlcad | that should be a simple Makefile.am fix |
| 04:44.10 | pacman87 | brlcad: except that i don't really know my way around makefiles... |
| 04:44.57 | brlcad | well, but you shouldn't need to :) |
| 04:45.11 | brlcad | look at that line in the file that mentions solver |
| 04:45.19 | brlcad | something should look very wrong about it to you |
| 04:45.20 | pacman87 | extra \ |
| 04:45.23 | brlcad | even in the error messgae |
| 04:45.25 | homovulgaris | hi :) |
| 04:45.50 | brlcad | bingo |
| 04:45.51 | homovulgaris | yeah the \_ i had put in because there was some problem on my make system in recognizing underscore character |
| 04:46.09 | homovulgaris | you can remove the \ :) |
| 04:46.21 | pacman87 | should i go ahead and commit it? |
| 04:46.26 | brlcad | why not? |
| 04:46.30 | poolio | One day I'm going to learn about all these autoconf tools and what not and not wait hours for brlcad to finish cleaning and recompiling |
| 04:46.44 | homovulgaris | :) brl-cad has a pretty nice build system :) |
| 04:47.10 | homovulgaris | i especially like the way posix shell scripts are generated instead of binaries :P |
| 04:47.28 | pacman87 | make install takes 6 times longer than make for me, after a simple change to hyp.c |
| 04:47.49 | brlcad | pacman87: cd src/librt && make install |
| 04:47.55 | brlcad | you shouldn't need to reinstall everything |
| 04:48.15 | pacman87 | brlcad: yeah, i though of that 2 secs after i hit enter |
| 04:48.48 | brlcad | homovulgaris: only one does that really |
| 04:49.00 | poolio | What really bugs me is how to 'make clean' it will sometimes have to reconfigure |
| 04:49.04 | brlcad | one out of 400 |
| 04:49.08 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i will check out boost's interval arithmetic thingy |
| 04:49.58 | homovulgaris | and any idea why i have to put \_ to get things working with my make :) maybe a debian issue |
| 04:50.15 | poolio | homovulgaris: I run debian (sid) and haven't seen that issue |
| 04:50.16 | brlcad | and/or mpfr .. been thinking of using that for another task, gmp and its deps could be made fair game if they work |
| 04:51.00 | homovulgaris | like yesterday i was having trouble compiling primitives/bspline/nurb_* |
| 04:51.17 | homovulgaris | worked when i put them as bspline/nurb\_* |
| 04:51.59 | homovulgaris | and then they worked even when i removed them(\) .. even after clean ofcourse.. |
| 04:52.35 | pacman87 | chocolate milk... the midnight snack of champions :) |
| 04:54.03 | homovulgaris | poolio: i am on sid too . weird |
| 04:55.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31381 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: if libpc is dependent upon libwdb, it needs to be listed here instead of the Makefile.am |
| 04:55.40 | homovulgaris | brlcad: the whole include thing is a general mess, i need to really clean that part up |
| 04:56.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31382 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/Makefile.am: remove the gnu-specific linker and compiler flags, configure controls those (and/or they can be specified at make time with make CXXFLAGS=-Wall for example). remove erroneous backslash |
| 04:59.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31383 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/Makefile.am: include fast compilation rules for fast dependency-free distributed linkage |
| 05:01.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31384 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libbu/Makefile.am librt/Makefile.am): hum, missing some fast entries |
| 05:03.15 | pacman87 | poolio: that hyp isn't valid |
| 05:04.28 | poolio | pacman87: figures :) But shouldn't you be catching that? |
| 05:04.38 | pacman87 | my version does... |
| 05:04.44 | poolio | ah hmm. let me update again |
| 05:04.55 | poolio | ah yah know, I built but I didn't install :) Sorry. |
| 05:05.09 | pacman87 | you can run from src/mged/mged |
| 05:07.47 | poolio | pacman87: works now. Sorry I wasted your time mate |
| 05:08.06 | pacman87 | np, poolio |
| 05:10.18 | brlcad | homovulgaris: fyi: table.c:1007: warning: initialization from incompatible pointer type |
| 05:10.21 | brlcad | table.c:1008: warning: initialization from incompatible pointer type |
| 05:11.16 | homovulgaris | well got to do with the function declarations of constraint export import etc. will check it |
| 05:11.22 | homovulgaris | i thought i had fixed that |
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| 05:15.44 | pacman87 | bedtime for me, if anyone breaks hyp, i'll be back in the morning to put it back together :) |
| 05:21.52 | homovulgaris | gn pacman |
| 05:22.19 | homovulgaris | is unable to sleep thinking about constraint solver architecture |
| 05:45.39 | homovulgaris | is going to dream about solver now :) |
| 05:47.37 | poolio | nite homovulgaris |
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| 08:21.47 | poolio | Argh. I was 3 characters short from working code... "C" ... darn C++. |
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| 11:06.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31385 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/Makefile.am: the private headers must be declared so they will be included in the source dist, else distcheck failure |
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| 14:00.40 | mafm | holy excrement |
| 14:00.49 | mafm | I must have eaten a cow or two :P |
| 14:03.37 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:05.33 | mafm | I think that the gsoc rules should forbid about going to brazilian restaurants before coding |
| 14:05.42 | mafm | (that would be bad for andrecastelo, though...) |
| 14:07.42 | brlcad | hehe |
| 14:07.54 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E08C.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 14:07.56 | brlcad | mmm.. I haven't been to brazillian in a long while.. |
| 14:10.07 | mafm | I go very often, there are lots of them here |
| 14:10.55 | mafm | I wanted to eat [shell]fish today, because it's a very hot day and I'm tired, but I tried several restaurants and they're closed today |
| 14:11.04 | mafm | so... no escape |
| 14:21.37 | mafm | brlcad: so about the logging & console guidelines? |
| 14:24.09 | brlcad | mmm... |
| 14:24.41 | brlcad | logging is an age-old pet project of mine |
| 14:25.19 | brlcad | I'd just start with something really simple, maybe just a Logger singleton that sends via cout for now |
| 14:25.46 | brlcad | no levels or categories, just straight up simple logging |
| 14:26.01 | brlcad | as long as the hooks are in the right place, the rest can be added alter |
| 14:26.06 | brlcad | s/alter/later/ |
| 14:27.35 | mafm | I see |
| 14:27.45 | brlcad | sound reasonable? |
| 14:27.47 | mafm | I was wondering if you wanted me to use libbu for that |
| 14:28.08 | brlcad | at this point it doesn't matter quite yet |
| 14:28.14 | brlcad | you could use bu_log |
| 14:28.26 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 14:28.26 | mafm | OK, singleton would be |
| 14:28.39 | brlcad | i mean the logger singleton would/could call bu_log |
| 14:28.57 | mafm | and about the console? |
| 14:28.59 | brlcad | or cerr/cout, etc -- so long as it's encapsulated, it doesn't matter |
| 14:30.58 | brlcad | so the console is going to be a bit tricky |
| 14:31.08 | brlcad | as you're working on something the rest of the core devs are also working on |
| 14:31.18 | brlcad | there's a big effort going on now on the development of a new geometry service |
| 14:32.25 | brlcad | that geometry service entails refactoring most of mged into libged for basic geometry editing command functionality, the development of an OO API layer on top for geometry management, and a network service layer for accessing a geometry database (which is what you'd ultimately connect to) |
| 14:33.21 | brlcad | alas those are very much bleeding edge developments, so you're working in tandem, and the console needs to pretend that there's this service that it'll be talking to even though it doesn't yet functionally exist |
| 14:34.29 | mafm | I see |
| 14:34.56 | brlcad | it should be ready in a couple weeks, but for now I think the best plan will be for you to stub in some functionality into rt^3dbd so that it basically does what brlcad/src/gtools/gtransfer does |
| 14:35.12 | brlcad | then have your gui attach to rt^3dbd and get its list of commands |
| 14:35.41 | mafm | and I should try to copy MGED layouts and functionalities but with stubs, or do you guys have another plans for that? |
| 14:35.58 | brlcad | yeah, other plans |
| 14:37.48 | brlcad | you can hook the dbd into libged if you like, there is some functionality already in there that can be leveraged, but I think the basic goal will be to be able to run just a handful of commands on the console that amount to "get list of available geometry, load/draw geometry" |
| 14:38.26 | brlcad | at that point, you'll have a display list that you can then work out the rest of the gui interface for input and trackball support |
| 14:39.12 | brlcad | if you want to forego the dbd layer for starters, you could, but it should ideally end up being protocol-driven |
| 14:40.05 | brlcad | I'd suggest taking a look at what g_transfer is doing and see if you can get dbd and your gui talking to each other the same way |
| 14:40.56 | brlcad | make sense? |
| 14:43.44 | mafm | yep, OK, I'll look into it |
| 14:43.55 | mafm | I was looking for info in the wiki too |
| 14:43.59 | brlcad | otherwise, the other tasker is to make it trivial for others to compile :) |
| 14:44.34 | mafm | rbgui guys didn't tell anything yet |
| 14:44.41 | brlcad | there's a fair bit about the geometry service at http://brlcad.org/wiki/Geometry_Service |
| 14:44.48 | brlcad | linked from the Developer_Documents page |
| 14:45.11 | mafm | based in the size of OGRE & friends as I pasted yesterday, should I still integrate OGRE? |
| 14:45.24 | brlcad | the dev that uploaded that stuff is a little uml-happy, so have to weed through a bit to get to the guts |
| 14:45.37 | brlcad | ah, you missed my reply :) |
| 14:46.05 | mafm | yup, I disconnected shortly thereafter, there were people waiting for me for the party :D |
| 14:46.13 | brlcad | we have nearly 1M of external code in the main brl-cad module.. :) .. tcl/tk alone is about 500k sloc |
| 14:46.47 | brlcad | the point isn't so much the size as providing a one-stop delivery for folks that *don't* have those deps already installed |
| 14:46.49 | mafm | hmm, that's biggish |
| 14:46.55 | brlcad | as disk space is pretty damn cheap |
| 14:47.27 | brlcad | course with the brl-cad module, we still have more brl-cad code than external code and with this new project, ogre would certainly dwarf it |
| 14:47.47 | mafm | yet I think OGRE is a bit different though, since in example I'm using now trunk (~1.7) instead of latest stable (1.4.8), because RBGui depending on some functionalities |
| 14:47.49 | brlcad | the idea, though, is to usually sort out the build system so that it *only* ever builds it if the user doesn't have it installed |
| 14:48.08 | brlcad | so you basically just save them a download and make compilation/integration easy |
| 14:48.49 | mafm | but OK, I'll do what you want :) |
| 14:48.52 | brlcad | that sort of requirement for a special ogre is actually exactly one of the sort of reasons why we do often embed |
| 14:49.09 | brlcad | you don't have to for ogre, at least not yet |
| 14:49.22 | brlcad | but then the installation instructions need to be specific |
| 14:49.29 | brlcad | and the patch sets need to be handy |
| 14:49.39 | brlcad | (in the repository) |
| 14:50.26 | mafm | at the moment only RBGui/Mocha need, with Ogre it would be either to have the patch, or using trunk |
| 14:50.44 | brlcad | so what do you think about rbgui? |
| 14:51.07 | brlcad | worth sticking with? |
| 14:51.09 | mafm | maybe (wild guess) even they make a new release with that included in the next few weeks |
| 14:51.18 | mafm | I like it better than CEGUI at the moment |
| 14:51.30 | brlcad | yeah, I don't really care about the build integration issues, we can deal with that :) |
| 14:51.41 | brlcad | it's more features, usability, ease of use, etc |
| 14:52.07 | brlcad | how easy is it to skin? I saw you added a brlcad.skin |
| 14:52.15 | mafm | feature-wise I think that they're about the same, but RBGui doesn't use XML (I'm not big fan of it, in example for speed considerations), and feels more responsive etc |
| 14:52.41 | mafm | that skin was only for the new font |
| 14:52.50 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 14:53.07 | mafm | and I don't know about automatic tools (I think that both of them have, but I never used) |
| 14:53.11 | brlcad | how hard would it be to do a non-overlapping layout? |
| 14:53.24 | mafm | but not having XML is a bit more manageable to edit by hand |
| 14:53.44 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:54.01 | mafm | and it's based in PNG images, so in that sense both of them are also similar (no SVG or the like) |
| 14:54.41 | brlcad | that's a shame :/ |
| 14:54.52 | brlcad | but okay |
| 14:54.54 | mafm | about overlapping, I still don't have an idea of the GUI elements that need to be present at a given time, so I can't tell |
| 14:56.28 | brlcad | minimally the elements -- a console, a 3D view, an informational pane |
| 14:57.13 | mafm | I guess that you saw the screenshots -- at the moment I put a little console in the bottom (30% or so) of the page |
| 14:57.29 | mafm | but MGED console is different, is a separate window |
| 14:57.30 | brlcad | other elements include a command overlay, some sense of progress/status (maybe a status bar or status corner), "maybe" a menu bar or menu corner |
| 14:57.34 | mafm | OGRE can do that, too |
| 14:57.45 | brlcad | forget mged's gui for now |
| 14:58.07 | brlcad | if we wanted to keep mged, you wouldn't have a gsoc project :) |
| 14:58.25 | brlcad | s/mged/mged's appearance and usability/ |
| 14:58.26 | mafm | and that MGED console had a lot of menus to do things... so that's why I was wondering what were your plans about that |
| 14:59.15 | brlcad | you did see the IOE prototype? |
| 14:59.35 | mafm | what's that, the video that you sent me a few weeks ago? |
| 14:59.45 | brlcad | yes |
| 15:01.02 | brlcad | take another look at that if you need, http://brlcad.org/design/gui/ioe_proto_final.mov |
| 15:01.10 | mafm | I did but I already forgot :D |
| 15:01.19 | mafm | yup, already downloading it |
| 15:01.36 | brlcad | try to use that as a guide for the gui, see how close you can get (both in look and interaction) |
| 15:02.15 | brlcad | because if you can, that captures most of the basic layout/interaction requirements |
| 15:03.05 | brlcad | menus, pages, buttons, menubars, drag n drop, non-overlapping panels, overlay input, etc |
| 15:03.12 | mafm | OK, watching it from stream |
| 15:03.52 | brlcad | doesn't have to necessarily include the task manager or the same tasks of course, yours are somewhat different |
| 15:04.02 | mafm | ah, another question that I remembered now -- how about the target systems? As many as possible, only Unices, only Win+Mac+Lin? |
| 15:04.07 | brlcad | but the *gui* aspects are still about the same |
| 15:04.55 | brlcad | in general, as many as possible, though focusing on the latter win/mac/lin |
| 15:05.40 | brlcad | if rbgui really needs a fair bit of work to work on mac/linux then I'd leave that to someone else (unless it's got some fundamental limitation) |
| 15:05.48 | brlcad | so you can make progress on the gui |
| 15:08.52 | brlcad | in fact, I only mentioned rt^3dbd so that you can add the right hooks to get geometry for the 3D display -- you could just as easily fake it |
| 15:10.43 | mafm | heh, the video is very good |
| 15:11.39 | mafm | (lin including bsds, we don't want Erik to get mad at us!) |
| 15:12.37 | mafm | RBGui needs only some small pieces from the OS |
| 15:13.14 | brlcad | including mac almost implicitly gives you *bsd |
| 15:13.16 | mafm | they have it abstracted in a platform manager, where you can fill it the way to get a directory listing, keyboard autorepeat, and things like that -- but they're 10 or less |
| 15:14.04 | brlcad | cool, some of that we cover in libbu |
| 15:14.24 | brlcad | starseeker actually just added a routine for getting a directory listing from nix platforms |
| 15:15.07 | mafm | yep, and in fact they're manageable enough so I think that I could take responsibility for that for RBGui |
| 15:15.38 | mafm | that would boost a bit probably the community interest in it, and thus it would be a benefit for both projects :) |
| 15:23.09 | brlcad | yep |
| 15:31.35 | mafm | what's that ioe thing? |
| 15:32.08 | mafm | Institute of Education University of London? |
| 15:58.23 | ``Erik | but but but what about solaris? and aix? and hpux? and irix? and uh, beos? uhhh, amigaos? what about my commodore 64? :D haiku? uh, awos? hrmmm, lispos? |
| 15:58.29 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:00.28 | ``Erik | "talk is cheap. supply exceeds demand" |
| 16:00.59 | mafm | I think that we should target DOS users too |
| 16:01.16 | mafm | and make the GUI ascii-art worthy |
| 16:01.20 | mafm | :) |
| 16:01.51 | mafm | I think that the #defines used by RBGui are exactly POSIX, WIN32 and OSX |
| 16:03.18 | mafm | anything with usual file-accesing interfaces and X11 should work |
| 16:04.53 | mafm | http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Please-Pay-000.aspx |
| 16:05.07 | mafm | "A system call that should never failed has fail" |
| 16:05.44 | mafm | It seems that There Might Be Dragons with our Win32 port too :) |
| 16:06.03 | mafm | fail* has failed* even |
| 16:16.12 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 16:18.05 | brlcad | mafm: he says what it is in the introduction |
| 16:19.17 | mafm | oh |
| 16:19.53 | mafm | it took a while until I put the headphones on, so I had missed those first seconds |
| 16:20.25 | mafm | anyway I knew it, the ideal operation environment is command-line-driven! :P |
| 16:30.06 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away_ (n=chatzill@189.71.10.209) | |
| 16:33.34 | mafm | buff, I'd better go out for a walk, I can't concentrate today |
| 16:34.36 | mafm | see you, folks |
| 16:43.11 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:43.28 | brlcad | driven != always accessible |
| 17:29.04 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-83-30.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:07.25 | pacman87 | hmmm, it looks like ehy's curve() is useless |
| 18:07.59 | pacman87 | does a nice job calculating, then overwrites the values at the end... |
| 18:51.19 | brlcad | hehe |
| 18:51.25 | brlcad | fix it! :) |
| 18:53.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31386 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Temporarily commenting out the dump command. |
| 18:58.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31387 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.c setup.c): Temporarily commenting out the dump command. |
| 18:58.43 | pacman87 | when is curve() used? |
| 19:00.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31388 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ehy/ehy.c: fix curve() so the calculated values are actually used |
| 19:01.28 | brlcad | I believe the curvature lighting model uses it |
| 19:01.35 | brlcad | rt's -l option |
| 19:01.40 | brlcad | (i think) |
| 19:01.56 | pacman87 | i'm just wondering why ehy's curve was never caught |
| 19:02.03 | pacman87 | it's been wrong since at least 2004 |
| 19:02.26 | brlcad | that lighting model isn't used very often |
| 19:03.01 | pacman87 | is there a way to color the shape depending on the curvature at that point? |
| 19:03.02 | brlcad | and ehy is a "specialized" shape not found too frequently in practice |
| 19:03.17 | brlcad | that's what I'm saying, rt's lighting model |
| 19:03.24 | brlcad | one of them is based on curvature |
| 19:20.18 | pacman87 | rt -l isnt' right |
| 19:30.34 | poolio | is having the worst friday the 13th ever |
| 19:30.44 | pacman87 | poolio: why's that? |
| 19:31.04 | poolio | Well...I was flying to Madison, WI through detroit. Made it to detroit, second leg was cancelled, the flight isn't until 5pm. |
| 19:31.05 | ``Erik | you've only gotten 3 people with your chainsaw and it's already 3:30? |
| 19:31.24 | poolio | I also spent the better part of today in a hospital in detroit so ... yeah. very unlucky day |
| 19:54.02 | prasad_ | tim russert dead |
| 19:55.29 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-214-111.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 20:18.56 | poolio | prasad_: that too :( |
| 20:39.55 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@203-59-26-22.perm.iinet.net.au) | |
| 21:11.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31389 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/archer/Archer.tcl: Minor mod. |
| 21:11.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31390 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/ (Display.tcl Dm.tcl): Minor mods. |
| 21:16.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31391 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Moved wdb_log, wdb_result, wdb_result_str and wdb_result_flags to struct ged. |
| 21:17.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31392 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Mods related to libged. |
| 21:18.40 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177871429.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:19.17 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31393 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/argv.c: Before freeing argv[i], make sure it's not NULL |
| 21:44.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31394 10/brlcad/trunk/ (24 files in 4 dirs): Checking in for safety. These are mods related to fleshing out libged. |
| 21:50.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31395 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/draw.c: Drawing routines from dg_obj |
| 21:50.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31396 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Added draw.c |
| 22:45.10 | *** part/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-72-245-122-226.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 00:15.25 | ``Erik | so, uh |
| 00:15.28 | ``Erik | this one time, at band camp |
| 00:43.14 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:35.42 | ``Erik | ponders the notion of each eye having a blue/red favor |
| 01:37.15 | ``Erik | dr who... regular is a very red/yellow visual, lighening is a very blue one... my brain sees that as a horizontal shift |
| 02:21.34 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 02:49.07 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-214-111.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 07:47.34 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-59.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:57.22 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F5DB.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 10:01.48 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@77.237.104.91) | |
| 11:54.46 | brlcad | heh, nice: http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=583059&cid=23780095 |
| 12:10.59 | ``Erik | sounds about right |
| 12:18.48 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 12:36.52 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-214-111.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 13:24.49 | ``Erik | I find it annoying that svn uses hard coded 'shortcuts' instead of a parse trie |
| 13:39.39 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 13:40.16 | ``Erik | blargh, apple has a special way of handling bss segments |
| 13:40.28 | ``Erik | "special", like, hockey helmet and water wings, yo |
| 13:42.23 | mafm | hi cuties :P |
| 13:43.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 13:43.12 | ``Erik | eeks *flee* |
| 13:43.50 | ``Erik | y'know, I'm watching history channel here |
| 13:44.14 | ``Erik | about the amistace and surrender of the empire of germany in ww1 |
| 13:44.20 | ``Erik | canada really fucked a lot of people over |
| 13:45.11 | ``Erik | german delegation was trying to move quickly under a deadline with a white flag up, and kept getting pinned down by canadian fire (german fire once, but mostly canadian) |
| 13:45.40 | ``Erik | shakes fist at canada, yet again |
| 13:45.49 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:45.54 | brlcad | blames canada too |
| 13:46.10 | ``Erik | "history international" channel |
| 13:46.13 | ``Erik | if interested |
| 13:46.34 | brlcad | thinks dr who and bsg might win |
| 13:46.44 | ``Erik | watched 'em last night :D |
| 13:46.46 | ``Erik | no tivo |
| 13:46.55 | brlcad | tsk tsk :) |
| 13:47.05 | ``Erik | dr who was good.. bsg has... changed |
| 13:47.08 | ``Erik | lost their way, yo |
| 13:47.22 | brlcad | hook up some mythtv yo |
| 13:47.29 | ``Erik | been thinking about it |
| 13:47.40 | ``Erik | I |
| 13:48.05 | ``Erik | I'd like the ability to save 2-3 channels in 'decent' quality (dont' need perfect) to an NFS share |
| 13:48.44 | ``Erik | lack the hw right now, but if I had it, I'd throw my codin' time on that like a mofo |
| 13:49.11 | ``Erik | flipping who the bitch is in the tv equation would be nice :) |
| 13:50.46 | ``Erik | both fbsd and linux offer a bss glop ability... ".local heap\n.comm heap,30000,32" style |
| 13:51.00 | ``Erik | the apple approach seems to be ... uh, sbrk style |
| 13:51.09 | ``Erik | who the FUCK uses sbrk style memory management these days??? |
| 13:51.36 | brlcad | heh |
| 13:51.50 | brlcad | about 1 in 10 apparently |
| 13:51.51 | ``Erik | leal -30012(%ebp), %eax |
| 13:51.53 | ``Erik | uh? :D |
| 13:52.18 | ``Erik | is dorking with his compiler, trying to make the asm output as generic as possible... |
| 13:53.31 | ``Erik | outside of the opcode set, it seems that there is the "classic sensibility" (called "unix" style by all the sites), linux violates... many of those (function call convention), and mac violates teh very few that linux adhered to |
| 13:53.37 | ``Erik | (says the bsd zealot) |
| 13:55.29 | ``Erik | hrm, this seems cheap to me... modern video, sepia toned.. obviously not original footage... why sepia it? |
| 13:57.17 | brlcad | artistic license? |
| 13:58.42 | ``Erik | perhaps, but it's history cahnnel, they're showing re-enactments in full color, modern quality... and then there's this scene that is modern video... sepia toend |
| 13:59.00 | ``Erik | my typing is guud |
| 13:59.16 | ``Erik | I IS GEORGE DUBYA TYPINATOR! |
| 14:32.15 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 14:36.51 | mafm | hi homovulgaris |
| 14:52.49 | ``Erik | "Americans live to work. Spanish work to live." painfully true O.o |
| 14:53.05 | ``Erik | (history channel commercial) |
| 14:54.18 | mafm | Spanish or Spaniards? |
| 14:56.21 | mafm | that's about to change anyway |
| 14:57.28 | mafm | European Commision passed a law, or something to that effect, so that workers will be able to "freely agree" with the employer how much time to work up to 65 hours/week |
| 14:58.03 | mafm | that's 13 hours/day if you work 5 days, 11 if you work 6 days, 9 if you work all days of the week |
| 14:58.11 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-046-072.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 15:00.12 | ``Erik | I'm quoting a commercial |
| 15:00.40 | ``Erik | I thought 34 a week was 'normal' for most of europe |
| 15:00.47 | ``Erik | opposed to the 40+ of us |
| 15:01.16 | mafm | in general it's 40 for the most lucky ones -- e.g. people in supermarkets and bars usually work more |
| 15:01.26 | ``Erik | hum |
| 15:01.47 | ``Erik | when I was doing 'part time' work, it was hard to get up to 40 (more than 40 means overtime pay, extra expense) |
| 15:02.15 | ``Erik | when I was doing "professional" work, it was hard to get under 60 |
| 15:02.18 | mafm | 37.5 or 35 is only for some special cases like government workers, or some law that tried to pass france 10 years ago or something (but now France was pushing that EU thing) |
| 15:02.25 | ``Erik | now I'm doing gov't work... it's 40, damnit. |
| 15:02.41 | mafm | and government workers usually work 20 hours a day, nevermind what their contract say :D |
| 15:02.51 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:03.05 | ``Erik | brlcad does 20 hour days, but he'll do two of them and enjoy the rest of his week relaxing :D |
| 15:03.24 | ``Erik | and by relaxing, i mean coding brlcad and bzflag, but what HE cares about, not his paycheck signer |
| 15:03.33 | mafm | lol |
| 15:03.45 | mafm | this reminds me of a co-worker who is a voluntary fireman |
| 15:03.55 | ``Erik | I do a little "above and beyond", but I find it hard anymore :/ |
| 15:04.32 | mafm | but the professional firemen are forced (not by choice of relaxing, like brlcad) to spend some nights as "volunteers" |
| 15:04.43 | ``Erik | yeah, but that's a signup thing |
| 15:04.52 | ``Erik | I have friends who do that here |
| 15:05.07 | ``Erik | and, heh, lost a gf to one of those, cuz 'firemen are sexy'... |
| 15:05.34 | ``Erik | even with that, I still respect volunteer firefighters, emt, etc |
| 15:06.28 | ``Erik | hrm, I threw on this "man made marvels in asia" hoping to see historic awesomeness, it's about an upcoming high speed rail in south korea |
| 15:07.34 | mafm | lol... women love them because of the phallic image of the "pipe" (whatever the proper name) :D |
| 15:07.50 | ``Erik | hose |
| 15:07.57 | ``Erik | probably |
| 15:07.59 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:08.22 | ``Erik | "I fucked him because he loaned me his cellphone"... I seem to have made some mistakes :D I sure hope punker ain't one O.o |
| 15:09.16 | ``Erik | how's the ogre thingie coming? |
| 15:09.39 | ``Erik | I've been ignoring it, it's c++ and in another dir, so.. *shrug* not my big thing, but ... any visual results? |
| 15:09.39 | mafm | :D |
| 15:10.02 | mafm | not bad I think |
| 15:10.14 | ``Erik | is rbgui off the table? |
| 15:10.16 | mafm | http://wainu.ii.uned.es/~mafm/brlcad/brlcad_rbgui_20080612-1.png |
| 15:10.23 | mafm | last screenie |
| 15:11.08 | mafm | I'm trying to implement the supporting bits now, like logging |
| 15:11.10 | ``Erik | hrmmm, fairly reasonable toolkit, visually |
| 15:11.41 | ``Erik | logging like printing to a file trivial style, or "just use syslog" style? |
| 15:12.52 | mafm | well, I'm implementing it in a class where they'll call a single function to do the final printing, so it can be changed easily |
| 15:13.14 | mafm | a.t.m. brlcad recommended to focus only in the abstraction |
| 15:13.26 | ``Erik | *nod* |
| 15:13.31 | mafm | then maybe use libbu for that |
| 15:14.09 | ``Erik | now I'm gonna raise up the opposing concern, I've seen good projects turned to crap when a 'tard gets in the mix and worships abstraction and 'refactoring' to absurdum |
| 15:15.42 | mafm | well, this is only something like: Logger.logERROR(message); |
| 15:15.43 | ``Erik | if you think it'd be more time to abstract than it'd be to "just do it" and "just do it again" when ya realize you did it wrong, that might be the point to "just do it"... but brlcad is the lead here *shrug* allz I can say is my experiences |
| 15:16.07 | ``Erik | <-- is talking... um, abstracted, instead of just doing it ;) |
| 15:16.22 | mafm | which calls Logger.log("ERROR", "message"); or something to that effect, which will format the line and print it with cerr at the moment |
| 15:16.33 | ``Erik | that looks like a good abstraction |
| 15:17.15 | mafm | I just meant abstraction in the sense that it won't call "cerr" directly in the rest of the classes, and so it'll have a central point to change the file destination, message format and so on |
| 15:17.24 | ``Erik | yes |
| 15:17.42 | mafm | and so use libbu, syslog or whatever is easy to implemtn |
| 15:17.52 | mafm | :) |
| 15:18.36 | ``Erik | I've seen collosal failures, i'm scared that someone might see their way into that turf... I mean, java programs where an interface is defined... and then a class is defined to "implement" that, but it's a completely abstract class (no content).. and then antoher class extends THAT, but has no guts... and then ANOTHER class extends that, and zomfg, the first content, 4 abstractions down! |
| 15:19.03 | ``Erik | so I have a paranoia against anything pointing in that direction :) |
| 15:19.34 | ``Erik | I'll sit in the corner and say 'why not just do it?', feel free to ignore me ;) |
| 15:20.14 | mafm | in general I also hate complex hierarchies and relations |
| 15:20.18 | ``Erik | personally tends to implement, then "refactor" and abstract when it becomes obvious that it should be abstracted, probably a bad approach |
| 15:20.50 | ``Erik | and when I do hit that point, I do it... I like C macros for that in BRL-CAD... |
| 15:21.08 | ``Erik | src/libbu/image.c is what happens when I go there :D |
| 15:21.24 | ``Erik | so I'm sure others appreciate when I don't get that hair (hare?) up my arse |
| 15:23.01 | mafm | :D |
| 15:23.34 | mafm | I'm no big fan of magnificent previous designs either |
| 15:23.59 | mafm | in this case it's easy for me because I used similar classes several times |
| 15:24.19 | mafm | Logging is something that you have to do everywhere :D |
| 15:25.41 | mafm | and it's pretty standard stuff: different classes of messages with increasing priority, filter by priority, and just call methods to log the messages |
| 15:25.41 | ``Erik | *nod* |
| 15:26.21 | ``Erik | syslog "solved" that long ago in my mind, but tends to require superuser knowledge/privelege |
| 15:28.51 | mafm | does it? I think that in debian, processes running as non-root users can also use it |
| 15:30.04 | mafm | anyway, Windows systems don't have the same thing and I think that there are small nuisances with the Unices too |
| 15:30.09 | ``Erik | yeah, non-root can trasmit, but setting things up requires rootage |
| 15:30.34 | ``Erik | transmitting log messages to a remote machine is damn sexy |
| 15:30.55 | ``Erik | log4j is a feeble attempt to imitate |
| 15:31.12 | ``Erik | imho :D |
| 15:31.48 | ``Erik | hears an owl O.o at 11:30 am, on a hot summer day |
| 15:33.08 | mafm | setting things up? file destinations and so on? |
| 15:33.12 | ``Erik | yeah, the config files |
| 15:34.24 | mafm | in this case, it would be the user who could set the log level, reading from a config file or something to that effect |
| 15:34.47 | mafm | then the destination could go anyware |
| 15:35.07 | mafm | so if syslog lets you, it'll get logged there |
| 15:36.41 | mafm | hmm, with the preprocessor, you can in example ##DEBUG to get the string "DEBUG", right? |
| 15:39.16 | ``Erik | uhmmm, i'd have to look that up |
| 15:39.19 | ``Erik | sounds about right |
| 15:39.37 | ``Erik | is it a#b for concatenation and ##a for 'string, not symbol'? |
| 15:39.50 | ``Erik | or the other way around? i always have to look that up |
| 15:40.36 | ``Erik | I have a gut feeling that a##b is concat and #a is 'as string' |
| 15:40.44 | mafm | hmm |
| 15:41.46 | mafm | I think that I'll just do it by hand, they're few and it's more flexible this way :D |
| 15:42.03 | ``Erik | sadly, my answer it to look up http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=933411&group_id=28255&atid=392815 |
| 15:42.04 | ``Erik | :( |
| 15:43.04 | ``Erik | a#b, ##a. |
| 15:43.18 | ``Erik | awz wrong |
| 15:43.20 | ``Erik | I admit it |
| 15:43.31 | mafm | :D |
| 15:43.34 | mafm | thank you |
| 15:44.06 | mafm | but in the end I think that setting it by hand it's a bit better in this case |
| 15:44.11 | ``Erik | C "macros" are horrible to start with, look at lithp and thcheme for the real deal |
| 15:44.12 | ``Erik | ok |
| 15:45.10 | ``Erik | wait, what? a video game based on, uh, what, larry the cable guy, as a military unit? O.O |
| 15:49.10 | mafm | it was not a macro per se... it's only to translate the log levels to string, when composing the message |
| 15:51.03 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away__ (n=chatzill@189.71.10.209) | |
| 15:52.21 | ``Erik | moin, andre |
| 15:53.06 | mafm | hi andre|away |
| 15:53.23 | mafm | hmm, is using va_list and the like fair game? |
| 15:58.19 | ``Erik | we have several apps that do |
| 15:58.41 | ``Erik | grep it up, yo |
| 16:18.28 | mafm | do you think that it's ok to put a char buffer[] as file-global variable? it doesn't look very elegant to me |
| 16:20.54 | ``Erik | um, "it depends" |
| 16:21.15 | ``Erik | are you questioning an exiting piece of software, or contemplating your next move? |
| 16:21.25 | mafm | next |
| 16:21.28 | mafm | let me explain |
| 16:22.13 | mafm | basically, instead of making folks to format their messages, and having to write "Logger.log(Logger::FATAL, msgString);" |
| 16:22.27 | mafm | preformatting the string with sstream, or vprintf or the like |
| 16:22.56 | mafm | I think that it's more convenient to do: Logger.logFATAL("regular printf %s", "syntax"); |
| 16:22.58 | ``Erik | hrm, c++ allows, um, a default in a, uh, what do they call it, uh, member? |
| 16:23.10 | ``Erik | that can be overridden? |
| 16:23.26 | mafm | yes |
| 16:23.44 | ``Erik | new Logger(fmt="%s is busted, yo"); or something? |
| 16:24.15 | ``Erik | so instead of a global, have a default in your logger object? |
| 16:24.22 | mafm | the thing is that, I do the vprintf parsing in those functions, and then I hand the fixed message string to log(), to do the rest of the process (adding timestamp, print to stderr/syslog/whatever) |
| 16:24.25 | ``Erik | is that going to be a singleton "pattern"? |
| 16:24.51 | mafm | same concept, but I eliminated the singleton for verbosity :D |
| 16:25.19 | ``Erik | "eliminated the singleton for verbosity"... I don't understand |
| 16:25.27 | mafm | hmm, I don't know if it's better to be elegant or succint in something used like this |
| 16:25.30 | ``Erik | you have multiple logger instances writing to the same file? |
| 16:25.55 | mafm | singleton would be: Logger::instance().log(Logger::DEBUG, "message"); |
| 16:26.11 | mafm | this one is only one instance, because methods are static |
| 16:26.16 | ``Erik | well, a singleton CAn be l = new Logger(); |
| 16:26.45 | ``Erik | and the constructor figures out to reference a static existing thingie and just return it, or create new shizzlenitz, iirc |
| 16:27.13 | ``Erik | hasn't done c++ in quite a while, and views the notion of a "design pattern" as a failure in the language |
| 16:28.25 | mafm | hmm, well.. that's another possibility, but it's more or less the same, and you have to create the object before using it :D |
| 16:29.13 | mafm | so in the way that I'm creating it, it's just the most similar way to a printf -- which is good when you have to type it a lot of times, I think |
| 16:29.48 | mafm | hmm, it's already working, maybe I should post it so you can see it, istead of explaining it |
| 16:33.05 | ``Erik | the typical singleton pattern has an object created once, and a method that says "does it exist? yes? pass it, otherwise, create and pass" |
| 16:33.21 | ``Erik | so the second consumer gets a reference to the original instance |
| 16:37.37 | ``Erik | has always wanted a pilot license |
| 16:40.14 | mafm | I'm about to post it |
| 16:40.20 | mafm | post/commit :) |
| 16:42.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31397 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Adding @author keywork for Doxygen documentation, so anybody can easily find out who is to blame. |
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| 16:42.59 | ``Erik | hm, in zomfg brlcad/, we've moved all authors out of files and into /AUTHORS, depending on the commit record for blame |
| 16:44.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31398 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Logger.cxx Logger.h): Adding Logging facilities |
| 16:45.48 | mafm | there it is |
| 16:47.02 | mafm | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Logger.cxx?view=markup&pathrev=31398 |
| 16:47.08 | mafm | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Logger.h?view=markup&pathrev=31398 |
| 16:50.22 | mafm | so what do you think, ``Erik? |
| 16:52.35 | ``Erik | hrm |
| 16:52.39 | ``Erik | strftime is expensive |
| 16:53.24 | ``Erik | static char in log() is not reentrant, so you could get "odd results" in parallel ops |
| 16:53.50 | mafm | example msg: 20080614_17:52:50 :: INFO :: Application starting |
| 16:53.51 | ``Erik | I d'no how efficient String += is |
| 16:54.02 | ``Erik | snprintf might be cheaper/easier |
| 16:55.10 | mafm | is there an alternative to strftime? |
| 16:55.25 | ``Erik | no |
| 16:55.40 | ``Erik | either don't mkae it static (so it uses pre-threat memory), or wrap it in a semaphore or something |
| 16:56.02 | ``Erik | per-thread, even |
| 16:56.03 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:56.44 | mafm | yeah, non-static is fine |
| 16:56.55 | mafm | allocating in stack is cheap, anyway |
| 16:58.12 | mafm | hmm... maybe I should take advantage of strftime to format the full log message |
| 17:00.22 | mafm | no way, only time-related markup allowed |
| 17:11.17 | mafm | ``Erik: but you think that it's better in this way, or with the Singleton? |
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| 18:43.14 | brlcad | mafm: either static or singleton should be fine (for this, for now) |
| 18:43.40 | brlcad | the point yesterday was actually to keep it intentionally/exceptionally "thin" for the time being since the requirements are utterly minimal |
| 18:44.22 | mafm | well, did you see the code? good enough? |
| 18:44.27 | brlcad | so you don't spend even a couple hours working on logging when there are some unified longer-term plans in that area ;) |
| 18:44.34 | brlcad | yeah, it looks good enough |
| 18:44.47 | brlcad | there are a few problem areas, but they can be tackled later |
| 18:44.54 | brlcad | the class should be moved to the utility library |
| 18:45.06 | mafm | I already fixed the non-reentrant area |
| 18:45.11 | mafm | uh |
| 18:45.21 | brlcad | anything generic like that should be in Utility |
| 18:45.45 | mafm | well, I'm putting everything in the same place at the moment, I still didn't grasp the whole rt^3 masterplan :) |
| 18:46.16 | brlcad | that much was evident, hence why I mention it :) |
| 18:46.46 | brlcad | from your perspective, it's just a matter of putting the generic functionality into a different dir |
| 18:46.52 | mafm | where should I put the data, btw? |
| 18:47.05 | brlcad | like resource files? |
| 18:47.10 | mafm | yep |
| 18:47.14 | mafm | misc/g3d/data? |
| 18:47.42 | brlcad | make a new top-level dir, data/g3d |
| 18:48.18 | mafm | oki |
| 18:48.20 | brlcad | misc is a kitchen sink for script utilities and helper tools |
| 18:48.22 | mafm | hmm |
| 18:48.27 | brlcad | snippets |
| 18:49.12 | mafm | I think that I'm accumulating things in my dir, but that's to keep the makefile simple... maybe it's time to prepare it to build before going farther |
| 18:52.08 | brlcad | yeah, getting to more easily buildable state would be a good thing |
| 18:53.29 | brlcad | the longer that languishes, the more of a pain it'll be .. same as with organizaing into bundles of functionality into the lib dirs |
| 18:54.48 | brlcad | it's not so much as to follow any semblance of a masterplan for what's already there as the intent is to keep things organized from the start into reusable classes to prevent application logic from leaking into what should otherwise be generalized functionality |
| 18:55.25 | brlcad | mafm: how have you been building so far? a custom makefile? |
| 18:55.42 | mafm | yep |
| 18:55.50 | mafm | there are 3 classes... :D |
| 18:56.52 | brlcad | and you pre-compiled/installed the three dependencies independently? |
| 18:57.07 | brlcad | so you're just using -logre -lrbgui etc? |
| 18:57.29 | brlcad | plus a few other include/linker flags |
| 18:59.16 | mafm | more or less, yes (but with pkg-config) |
| 18:59.44 | brlcad | ok, cool |
| 19:00.45 | mafm | I think that cmake has direct support for it |
| 19:02.25 | brlcad | pacman87: you should add a NEWS entry for your ehy bug fix |
| 19:03.03 | brlcad | mafm: have you ever used cmake before? |
| 19:03.33 | brlcad | since this is starting from scratch for the most part, cmake could very well be used |
| 19:04.15 | mafm | only for very basic things, but yes... it could be an experiment |
| 19:04.24 | mafm | Aqsis used it, in example |
| 19:05.22 | brlcad | I know of tons of projects that use it, it'd be perfectly viable for this if you want to set it up |
| 19:06.16 | brlcad | the only reason we don't use it (yet) for the main brl-cad code is because we have a rather large and complex build system, it'd take months to fully replace the functionality we have at very minimal benefit |
| 19:06.36 | brlcad | for something new though, a lot more sense |
| 19:06.54 | mafm | fine :) |
| 19:06.55 | brlcad | i'm fine with autotools too, that easily the more well known approach |
| 19:07.21 | brlcad | so whatever suits you, but it should be early on if you do want to do that, not later |
| 19:07.54 | brlcad | and it should parallel the options configure provides |
| 19:11.34 | mafm | I'll try to look into it either tomorrow or monday |
| 19:11.48 | mafm | before going on with other ideas |
| 19:11.59 | brlcad | okay, then I won't spend half the weekend working on dependency integration :) |
| 19:34.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31399 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Logger.cxx Logger.h): |
| 19:34.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Adding GCC __attribute__ when available, to check for ill-formed string formats, |
| 19:34.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: missing arguments and the like -- avoids one class of segfaults, and in general |
| 19:34.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: helps a lot. Also improved a bit the way to generate the final string. |
| 19:36.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31400 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx GuiConsole.cxx): Make use of the new logging facilities in a couple of places, mainly for testing it. |
| 19:37.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31401 10/rt^3/trunk/src/data/ (. g3d/): Adding new directory for data files of applications, in particular g3d |
| 19:41.43 | mafm | well folks, see you tomorrow or on monday -- maybe tomorrow I'll get a rest :) |
| 19:41.47 | mafm | see you |
| 19:41.55 | brlcad | see ya! |
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| 22:49.17 | ``Erik | also; an automake approach requires no special crud for a packager or end user (who compiles) to think about, cmake DOES |
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| 01:08.47 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 01:23.50 | pacman87 | punkrockgirl: hi |
| 01:25.20 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 01:25.28 | punkrockgirl | i'm dj'ing if you guys wanna hear |
| 01:25.42 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 01:28.49 | pacman87 | your 'listener forums' link is broken |
| 01:30.20 | punkrockgirl | yeah, its not mine ;) |
| 01:30.30 | punkrockgirl | i just dj, this other dude runs it |
| 01:30.44 | punkrockgirl | but i'll tell him :) |
| 01:31.00 | punkrockgirl | are you listening? :) |
| 01:31.27 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 01:31.52 | punkrockgirl | cool |
| 01:32.10 | punkrockgirl | if you wanna hear something let me know, most my music is on my playlist thing on there |
| 01:32.20 | punkrockgirl | i need to update though |
| 01:37.53 | punkrockgirl | ok i asked him he said that he is working on the forums |
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| 05:38.11 | brlcad | tunes in |
| 05:43.10 | brlcad | could go for some Gravity Kills |
| 05:43.32 | brlcad | ( punkrockgirl ) |
| 07:24.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31402 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/: ignore generated goo |
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| 12:00.35 | tjyang | anyone online ? |
| 12:26.26 | clock_ | is online |
| 12:36.31 | tjyang | Thanks, for the response. I fount the answer of my own (brlcad beginner) question. |
| 12:37.38 | tjyang | just a comment. why not make a "demo" button, in either mged or archer to show off what brlcad can do. |
| 12:38.00 | tjyang | it took me a while by RTFM ;-< |
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| 13:35.47 | brlcad | tjyang: that's a good suggestion, you're quite welcome to work on that if you're a developer :) |
| 13:36.03 | brlcad | i'd be glad to point you in the right directions and help out |
| 13:37.20 | tjyang | how will started with baby step by putting a simple procedure on brlcad wiki site. |
| 13:37.49 | tjyang | who will -> I will |
| 13:38.07 | brlcad | great! |
| 13:43.59 | tjyang | http://brlcad.org/wiki/FAQ#How_do_I_getting_started_with_Windows_version_of_BRL-CAD |
| 13:44.59 | brlcad | Hm, that'll only get you so far -- Archer is a nice interface, but only a prototype |
| 13:45.09 | brlcad | the real functionality is in MGED |
| 13:45.30 | tjyang | understood, "Getting started" is the keyword ;) |
| 13:45.31 | brlcad | Archer only does about 25% of what MGED can do |
| 13:45.50 | tjyang | that is enough for beginner like me ;) |
| 13:46.12 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 13:46.46 | brlcad | then you should maybe make a page dedicated with screenshots and a walkthrough (e.g. where are the example files) |
| 13:46.48 | tjyang | BTW, who decide the direction of using docbook for future brl-cad |
| 13:46.54 | ``Erik | isn't sure how much of what you learn in archer will actually transfer to mged |
| 13:47.03 | tjyang | brl-cad doc format. |
| 13:47.15 | brlcad | tjyang: in what regard? |
| 13:47.43 | ``Erik | throws monty python on the tv and looks at some code |
| 13:47.45 | tjyang | I used framemaker,msword,docbook and latex before |
| 13:47.55 | tjyang | I think docbook is not as good as latex. |
| 13:48.05 | brlcad | same as most project decisions, the folks doing the work (i.e. usually the devs) decide |
| 13:48.09 | tjyang | I switch from docbook to latex. |
| 13:48.13 | ``Erik | docbook has slightly different goals (and can generate TeX) |
| 13:48.32 | ``Erik | you're not gonna touch latex for printed materials, but the web materials come out... rough |
| 13:49.14 | brlcad | and can't even really *think* about integrating latex into applications, whereas with docbook it's pretty straightforward |
| 13:49.18 | tjyang | not really , I will provide an example later, multitasking right now. |
| 13:49.39 | ``Erik | <-- big LaTeX fan, but has seen 'nuff from the FreeBSD docbook/jade to accept it :) |
| 13:51.40 | brlcad | tjyang: just about every major documentation project has moved to docbook and with good reason, it's simply easier to work with as a hub format |
| 13:52.08 | brlcad | not as ideal as some of the formats that are specifically suited to certain tasks (e.g. latex->print) but overall it's a win |
| 13:52.44 | ``Erik | heh, 488 record hits, 153 url hits, 2 subscribers... not too terrible for what it is I suppose |
| 13:53.34 | ``Erik | ponders coding something useful |
| 13:53.38 | tjyang | brlcad: I switched for the reason you mentioned and in the end I decided to switch to latex. |
| 13:54.40 | brlcad | tjyang: understood, but that doesn't really say much about whether that was a good decision or not :) |
| 13:54.54 | brlcad | and what your considerations/needs were |
| 13:55.20 | brlcad | and what problems you actually ran into |
| 13:55.31 | ``Erik | *shrug* both are simple text formats that can be trivially parsed, so it doesn't look like there's a "problem" here... it's not like the docs are in ms word or quark format |
| 13:55.41 | ``Erik | codes O.o |
| 13:55.52 | brlcad | woot, code ftw |
| 13:56.10 | ``Erik | yes, the world needs better faster stronger brainfuck compilers. |
| 13:56.52 | brlcad | heh |
| 13:59.19 | tjyang | sorry, I am still on the phone with my mom. |
| 13:59.22 | tjyang | later |
| 14:05.46 | ``Erik | 10:05AM up 178 days, 22 mins, 5 users, load averages: 0.72, 0.18, 0.07 |
| 14:06.10 | ``Erik | it may be telling that I'm accepting "bad syscall" errors from a 'hot' upgrade to keep service up |
| 14:06.12 | ``Erik | :/ |
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| 14:15.43 | ``Bman | 10:15AM up 154 days, 15 mins, 11 users, load averages: 2.22, 2.18, 2.19 |
| 14:16.14 | ``Erik | oh yeah, pheer my den p2's uptime, stomps the almighty bz uptime :D *duck* |
| 14:18.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31403 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/draw.c: make function declarations match definition wrt being static and constness. fixes build failure reported by tjyang (thanks). |
| 14:19.10 | ``Erik | maybe I need to update more often. Every time I update, there is a commit during my compile. If it update more often, does that mean we'll get commits more often? |
| 14:19.58 | ``Erik | my compile made it to libbu when that message came out, at least |
| 14:20.39 | tjyang | http://brlcad.org/wiki/FAQ#How_do_I_getting_started_with_Windows_version_of_BRL-CAD_.3F |
| 14:20.52 | brlcad | mebbie |
| 14:20.54 | tjyang | this was the FAQ, I was hoping to see. |
| 14:22.05 | ``Erik | if you don't like the existing tutorial pdf's, feel free to start a tutorial wiki chain |
| 14:23.15 | ``Erik | would call archer an experimental avenue, would NOT point new users there yet... *shrug* personal opinion |
| 14:23.25 | tjyang | no, I do like it. I think there should be some material for total beginner like me. |
| 14:24.06 | ``Erik | feel free to create new wiki pages *shrug* |
| 14:24.07 | brlcad | tjyang: that's the point -- you're a total beginner even with regards to what you like about it |
| 14:24.11 | brlcad | you can't actually do much with it |
| 14:24.21 | brlcad | which you'll quickly find out |
| 14:24.29 | brlcad | there's a reason we don't point anyone to it just yet |
| 14:24.38 | brlcad | it's there to encourage developer interest |
| 14:24.39 | tjyang | I do have a plan to use it. |
| 14:24.54 | brlcad | and you'll find that you can't actually "do" much with it regardless of your plans :) |
| 14:25.05 | ``Erik | if you look at the recent commit history, the entire libged effort has been kinda part of bobs plan to turn archer from being a useless but pretty toy into something useful |
| 14:25.05 | brlcad | unless that doing involves coding |
| 14:25.41 | tjyang | I need a opensource 3D modeling software for my opensource scooter project ;) |
| 14:25.48 | brlcad | tjyang: the other faq item you mentioned is being worked on, maybe this helps answer your question: http://brlcad.org/~sean/BRL-CAD_Priorities.png |
| 14:26.36 | brlcad | still under development is why that's not on the wiki too |
| 14:27.03 | ``Erik | hey, burley, check me; we completely lack anything of the notion of, say, lightwaves scener? static models being moved along bezier splines for animation? |
| 14:27.39 | brlcad | notes that havoc or m35 would be a much more interesting intro than "axis" |
| 14:28.06 | tjyang | saw the png file, thanks brlcad. |
| 14:28.06 | brlcad | ``Erik: no, we actually have that |
| 14:28.18 | ``Erik | and I imagine if I were to do a 'pulling the points apart' metaball animation, I'd probably be best generating the 120 or so seperate primitives to play in succession? |
| 14:28.21 | brlcad | it's crusty as all hell.. stuff chris johnson worked on way back when |
| 14:28.23 | ``Erik | uhm, the track thing? |
| 14:28.26 | brlcad | the anim_* tools |
| 14:28.40 | brlcad | and some of the joint tools |
| 14:29.05 | ``Erik | hum, back in, uhm, '96 or '97(?) that was one of the few things I felt good with in lightwave |
| 14:29.29 | tjyang | how far is brlcad converted to docbook already ? |
| 14:29.29 | ``Erik | lightwave 4? I took other peoples models, gave 'em paths, and pushed the button to render :D made me feel good |
| 14:29.55 | brlcad | what we have works but is a total hack, not at all robust .. but a slew of movies were made with the tools that way (what rain and others are working on converting) |
| 14:30.35 | brlcad | ours involves a lot of tables a few anim commands and even a bit of sed/awk scripting :) |
| 14:30.57 | ``Erik | ohyeah, that reminds me |
| 14:31.05 | ``Erik | dude, wtf, the knights and shit? wtf? hahahaha |
| 14:31.30 | ``Erik | and the koosh ball with the eyeball, we TOTALLY need that koosh in our distro :D |
| 14:31.46 | ``Erik | it was freaking rain out :D |
| 14:32.10 | tjyang | brlcad = sean ? |
| 14:32.23 | brlcad | tjyang: depends what you count .. we have a hell of a lot of docs in various formats, but the bulk of what we're counting is probably halfway there |
| 14:32.32 | brlcad | tjyang: yeah |
| 14:32.41 | brlcad | a get assigned that value sometimes |
| 14:32.50 | tjyang | http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=2082285&forum_id=362511, thank you for this answer. |
| 14:33.18 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, I haven't seen the nights bit in like 10 years, don't really remember it |
| 14:33.29 | brlcad | and totally don't remember seeing a koosh ball |
| 14:33.47 | brlcad | i've not seen all the videos myself, just a handful |
| 14:33.53 | ``Erik | starseeker and rain pulled me across the hall to see it |
| 14:33.57 | brlcad | i'm looking forward to seeing what's in all of them |
| 14:34.08 | ``Erik | rain was REALLY freaking out on the koosh ball... |
| 14:34.18 | brlcad | she freaks out easily |
| 14:34.23 | brlcad | noob |
| 14:34.26 | ``Erik | "what is that thing??? it keeps showing up!" |
| 14:34.58 | tjyang | brlcad: if doc->docbook is 50% done then I rest my case of doc->latex. |
| 14:35.14 | brlcad | tjyang: eh how so? |
| 14:35.41 | brlcad | that's after just a couple days of actual effort, and we're talking about *hundreds* of pages of existing documentation |
| 14:35.52 | tjyang | brlcad: looks like decision has been to adopt docbook which is my 2nd perference. |
| 14:35.53 | ``Erik | tjyang: LaTeX has been in the discussion all along... many of us STILL insist on sending our pubs down the pipe as LaTeX and fighting the "it's not word" back-push |
| 14:36.01 | brlcad | it would take just as long to convert these docs to latex |
| 14:36.10 | ``Erik | trust me, it's not like we just don't know about LaTeX |
| 14:36.42 | brlcad | yeah, some of our docs are (still) in latex |
| 14:36.43 | tjyang | great to know. |
| 14:37.16 | brlcad | we probably have well over a thousand pages of actual/useful documentation material |
| 14:37.34 | ``Erik | heh, and millions of useless ones? ;D |
| 14:38.12 | brlcad | in various formats from word to latex to docbook to only-available-in-printed-form-now that have accumulated over the years |
| 14:38.18 | tjyang | mercurial book is a good example of using latex. |
| 14:38.24 | brlcad | ah, and good ol troff |
| 14:38.43 | ``Erik | yes, I've been tossed some very classic roff files for review :/ |
| 14:39.06 | ``Erik | rich s is good at what he does, but he is sure stuck in his own time O.o |
| 14:39.38 | tjyang | I like to join brl-cad latex doc group, if there is a such group. |
| 14:40.25 | tjyang | docbook is unecessary diversion effort of tex/latex. |
| 14:41.19 | ``Erik | the color, serifs, images and layout of the priorities image make it feel very archaic, like, 1900's era stuff |
| 14:41.52 | tjyang | google.com is down ? |
| 14:42.09 | ``Erik | and it took a while for me to realize that the summary was in the middle and channeled to the details, mebbe I'm just special |
| 14:42.29 | brlcad | tjyang: you still haven't quantified what's actually technically "wrong" about docbook other than you don't like it and/or find it unnecessary |
| 14:43.03 | brlcad | you're welcome to work on latex docs, maybe through sheer volume of contributions you can make something happen there |
| 14:43.25 | brlcad | but as for a project direction on the docs, I'm still going to keep going down the docbook path for many reasons |
| 14:43.44 | tjyang | ok, what is your pro reason for docbook ? |
| 14:43.45 | brlcad | you'd have to do some serious convincing and contributing to derail that |
| 14:44.15 | brlcad | no no, you're not going to bait on points you can nit pick when you still haven't pointed out what you find negative about it |
| 14:44.42 | ``Erik | notes that docbook and latex are awefully close to eachother than the progress right now towards docbook is 98% towards latex... |
| 14:44.52 | brlcad | or even more, what makes latex better for *all* of the necessary requirements |
| 14:45.12 | brlcad | yeah, it's not like we're moving away from docbook |
| 14:45.17 | brlcad | s/docbook/latex/ |
| 14:45.18 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:45.32 | ``Erik | we're off in middle of the ocean and we have two lighthouses close to each other... we on the docbook one right now *shrug* :) |
| 14:46.01 | ``Erik | knowwhatImean,verne? |
| 14:46.14 | brlcad | yeah, you mean we're aimed at the docbook one, but they're right next door to each other |
| 14:46.25 | brlcad | we just happen to be in the middle of the ocean a couple miles away at this point :) |
| 14:46.26 | tjyang | http://brlcad.org/wiki/FAQ#Why_BRL-CAD_chose_docbook_over_latex_.3F |
| 14:46.44 | tjyang | lets put down some pros/cons of each solutions. |
| 14:47.02 | ``Erik | *sigh* |
| 14:47.08 | brlcad | tjyang: that's not the appropriate place ot have a pro/con debate/discussion |
| 14:47.21 | brlcad | and it'd seriously be a waste of time frankly |
| 14:48.21 | ``Erik | if docbook has failings that LaTeX addresses, why not put your effort into improving the docbook->LaTeX converter? |
| 14:49.46 | brlcad | if you want to work on latex docs, go for it, not going to stop you -- just not going to stop other efforts happening for docbook |
| 14:49.56 | tjyang | I think the bottom line is the doers go to pick the tool. |
| 14:50.50 | ``Erik | yes |
| 14:50.53 | ``Erik | that is the bottom line |
| 14:50.57 | ``Erik | the doers picked docbook |
| 14:50.57 | ``Erik | sorry |
| 14:50.58 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:51.01 | tjyang | agree ;) |
| 14:51.36 | tjyang | np, remember docobok is 2nd perference. if you pick msword then I will scream ;) |
| 14:52.20 | brlcad | tjyang: what (if anything) are you actually asking? :) |
| 14:52.33 | ``Erik | oh, you're talking to a fistful of unix geeks here, I mean, we buy macs cuz it's unix that "can do" office, but we still use keynote instead of powerpoint for slides, ... |
| 14:53.20 | brlcad | why do you think it took nearly 5 years to get the second release of brl-cad for windows out ... |
| 14:53.35 | brlcad | hm, three years I suppose |
| 14:53.39 | tjyang | keynote is not a common tool. |
| 14:54.27 | brlcad | you're missing the point |
| 14:54.28 | brlcad | twas an example dude |
| 14:54.28 | tjyang | use beam in latex ;) |
| 14:54.28 | tjyang | beams |
| 14:54.28 | ``Erik | hopes that with a couple open source windows developers, windows releases will happen more often |
| 14:54.28 | ``Erik | I think I've used beams before |
| 14:54.32 | tjyang | commens about beams ? |
| 14:54.34 | tjyang | comments |
| 14:54.47 | ``Erik | I've also written a portable javascript thingymajigger so I could use html for my display info and push the space bar for 'next slide', with the right and left arrow doing what's right |
| 14:55.10 | ``Erik | anyways, we avoid microsoftian proprietary lockin like the plague. |
| 14:55.51 | tjyang | ok, I am going to stop time wasting chat(wasting your time). |
| 14:56.02 | louipc | haha I did html slides too |
| 14:56.14 | tjyang | osx 10.5.3 is building ;) |
| 14:56.25 | tjyang | thanks for the quick fix, sean. |
| 14:56.28 | ``Erik | discussion is good, submitting patches is better :) |
| 14:56.50 | brlcad | please, if beam is what I remember, it totally sucked on many levels :) |
| 14:57.12 | tjyang | stand correct, I sould be more serious about brl-cad. |
| 14:57.20 | tjyang | stand corrected. |
| 14:58.10 | brlcad | code > doc > chat ;) |
| 14:58.22 | ``Erik | nods solemnly |
| 14:58.43 | ``Erik | unless it's my code, I produce some... special... code... :D |
| 15:02.28 | tjyang | imac:brlcad tj_yang$ find . -type f -name *.tex |
| 15:02.28 | tjyang | ./doc/html/manuals/mged/ged.tex |
| 15:02.28 | tjyang | imac:brlcad tj_yang$ |
| 15:02.41 | tjyang | only one tex file found in source tree. |
| 15:03.05 | ``Erik | very little documentation is in the tree |
| 15:03.15 | ``Erik | that's part of the docbook effort, to move more into it |
| 15:03.23 | tjyang | what are docbook extension used in source tree. |
| 15:03.39 | tjyang | docbook extension file name. docbook ? |
| 15:03.59 | ``Erik | I'd assume something like xml? starseeker would be the big doer on that, I think |
| 15:04.17 | tjyang | yeap, thanks, it is .xml |
| 15:04.20 | ``Erik | writes .c, not .xml |
| 15:05.00 | tjyang | BRL-CAD Release 7.12.5, Build 20080615 |
| 15:05.00 | tjyang | Elapsed compilation time: |
| 15:05.00 | tjyang | 20 minutes, 57 seconds |
| 15:05.00 | tjyang | Elapsed time since configuration: |
| 15:05.00 | tjyang | 22 minutes, 20 seconds |
| 15:05.21 | tjyang | thanks for the fix. |
| 15:06.11 | ``Erik | no need to paste, brlcad wants to have BRL-CAD's babies, he'll do what's necessary when necessary :) |
| 15:06.58 | ``Erik | I think it's a good thing to have, so I push portability and internal correctness, and I don't mind the paycheck :D |
| 15:07.11 | ``Erik | I'm ALMOST good enough to model a box :D |
| 15:07.48 | tjyang | how do I find out if my grapich card is used by win32 brl-cad ? |
| 15:08.16 | ``Erik | thinks it would be awesome to model his house and be able to place furniture and render, or model his truck and see where the big drag points are |
| 15:08.17 | tjyang | my son upgrade the card to play game. |
| 15:08.44 | ``Erik | uhm, do you mean the 3d components of your graphics card? cuz, uh, if it comes up on the screen, your graphics card was involved in some way or another |
| 15:09.18 | ``Erik | we have an opengl mode, but it's all GL_LINE stuff, so using opengl will actually slow you down vs X or win32 |
| 15:09.43 | ``Erik | it's in the big todo list to get 'shaded displays' up, that'd be where a 3d card becomes useful |
| 15:10.29 | tjyang | I don't feel the rendering is fast in brl-cad vs my Son's game. |
| 15:10.58 | ``Erik | no, the purpose is very different. BRL-CAD is looking to be accurate and deep. The game is looking to be fast and pretty. |
| 15:11.50 | tjyang | (Erik) speaking of paycheck, how is brl-cad.com doing ? is everybody there got fed properly ? |
| 15:11.53 | ``Erik | in BRL-CAD, we care about sub-millimeter accuracy and deep ray penetration at several KM out... it's scientific software, not "pretty" :) |
| 15:12.12 | tjyang | ok, no problem. |
| 15:12.24 | tjyang | this is what I am looking for. |
| 15:12.47 | ``Erik | uhm, I get my paycheck from http://www.arl.army.mil/slad, brlcad gets his (indirectly) from the same place, dunno what a brl-cad.com is O.o |
| 15:13.02 | tjyang | I did have educations both C.S. and building ship. |
| 15:13.03 | ``Erik | ohhhh, a cname for survice |
| 15:13.38 | louipc | opengl is faster than X for me |
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| 15:14.26 | ``Erik | ok, BRL-CAD was designed and implemented more for physics simulation and multispectral analysis than fast pretty pictures |
| 15:14.28 | tjyang | I am thinking of using using brl-cad as the modeling tool a opensource scooter project. |
| 15:14.56 | ``Erik | that'd be awesome, clock used BRL-CAD quite a bit in his 'ronja' project, which is effin' awesome |
| 15:14.59 | tjyang | physics simulation ? that sounds cool. |
| 15:15.06 | ``Erik | http://ronja.twibright.com/ |
| 15:15.33 | ``Erik | well, it seems that we have big metal boxes, and some people want to make holes in them... and other folk have big metal boxes that WE want to mkae holes in... |
| 15:16.24 | ``Erik | I get paid because some people want to use BRL-CAD to figure out what happens when people try to make holes in metal boxes *shrug* |
| 15:17.06 | ``Erik | ronja is definitely a project that'll let a feller sleep better at night |
| 15:17.07 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:18.00 | ``Erik | (we're more CAE than CAD) |
| 15:18.10 | tjyang | I want to use brlcad to build a three wheel scooter like BugE. http://www.bugev.net/ |
| 15:18.47 | tjyang | am I picking the right tool ? |
| 15:18.47 | brlcad | cocks his head at the image of having BRL-CAD's babies |
| 15:18.55 | brlcad | ow |
| 15:18.57 | ``Erik | that'd be neat, how exactly will BRL-CAD aid you in that? |
| 15:19.08 | louipc | tjyang: that's sweet |
| 15:19.13 | tjyang | like m35 |
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| 15:19.34 | ``Erik | the current NURBS work would really benefit that kinda project, I think |
| 15:19.47 | tjyang | it brlcad can model m35 truck then it can model a bugE alike |
| 15:19.50 | ``Erik | but, um, we don't do blueprints |
| 15:19.58 | ``Erik | yt |
| 15:19.59 | ``Erik | yet |
| 15:20.08 | tjyang | I can wait |
| 15:20.27 | tjyang | it is hobby project . |
| 15:20.32 | ``Erik | it may take more than waiting, you might have to do :) |
| 15:21.00 | brlcad | brlcad.com (i.e. SURVICE's support service) does their own thing, gets some attention |
| 15:21.05 | ``Erik | the people paying for BRL-CAD development are analysis, not design... blueprints are irrelevant to them, so *shrug* |
| 15:21.06 | brlcad | i'm sure not as much as they'd like |
| 15:22.30 | tjyang | Erik, so I am picking the wrong tool ? |
| 15:22.39 | brlcad | tjyang: I'd really suggest going through the Vol II tutorials in order to get a feel for how you model |
| 15:22.40 | ``Erik | now if you lay down code to do blueprints, you'd be a hero to many... most of the developers have someone saying to pay attention to other stuff and holding the paycheck |
| 15:22.48 | ``Erik | it depends on what exactly you want out of it |
| 15:23.39 | ``Erik | if you want to verify assembly, visualize subassemblies, computer actual weights and stuff... BRL-CAD is great... if you want to hit a button and get a blueprint to take to the machine shop? no. :( |
| 15:24.11 | tjyang | I see, that whaty pro/E is doing, correct ? |
| 15:24.18 | brlcad | as far as open source CAD goes, we're (imho) as good as it gets but still with a long ways to go |
| 15:24.40 | ``Erik | pro/E and unigraphics are very into CAM stuff |
| 15:24.46 | ``Erik | we're more CAE |
| 15:24.50 | brlcad | pro/e, unigraphics/nx, catia, solidworks, .. |
| 15:25.08 | brlcad | autocad is king of blueprints |
| 15:25.26 | tjyang | I really don't have a big wallet to spend on those CAE/CAM commerical tool |
| 15:25.30 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/w/images/4/44/Industry_Diagram.pdf |
| 15:25.49 | ``Erik | that pdf has a *LOT* of information in it, brlcad spent a lot of effort getting it just right |
| 15:25.52 | tjyang | yeah, I saw that pdf file. |
| 15:26.15 | ``Erik | might take a little look at http://gcam.js.cx/index.php/Main_Page if CAM is what you're looking for |
| 15:26.16 | tjyang | very nice pdf file. |
| 15:26.21 | brlcad | tjyang: the amount of manpower effort that has to go into a functionally useful CAD system is truely massive and they know it and they charge accordingly |
| 15:26.34 | brlcad | about a 6 billion dollar commercial market last year |
| 15:27.09 | louipc | tjyang: looks like you won't be able to see anything on the road ahead if you're behind other cars :P |
| 15:27.22 | brlcad | we've got almost 25 years of non-stop development, nearly 500 man-years of effort, and we still mostly focus on CAE aspects and could easily double that and still not be at the commercial systems level in some regards |
| 15:27.59 | ``Erik | was it uni that you talked to with 100 dedicated developers? |
| 15:28.21 | tjyang | louipc: that is oppertunity that BugE 2/3 can fix ;) |
| 15:28.48 | brlcad | yeah, uni |
| 15:29.01 | brlcad | talked to catia dev at solid modeling ... |
| 15:29.10 | brlcad | they have about 1000 *devs* :) |
| 15:29.14 | louipc | ouch |
| 15:30.00 | tjyang | it is not I don't appreicate the value of commerical cad/cam tool, it is the problem I can't afford it. unless I ask my kids stop there college education. |
| 15:30.02 | brlcad | distributed all over the place, lots of competeting projects |
| 15:31.14 | ``Erik | heh, ain't nothin' worth disadvantaging your kids, dude |
| 15:31.20 | brlcad | tjyang: i'm not promoting them or saying go with them -- my answer is help make brl-cad better, help make it do what it needs to do to be the absolute best ;) |
| 15:31.44 | ``Erik | we're open source and solid, if you run into a serious stumbling block, we're here to talk to... if you can fix it, we love patches |
| 15:31.54 | brlcad | yeah, because you'd not only have to take away they're college, you'd have to start pimping them out for the annual maintenance and upgrade costs ;) |
| 15:32.32 | ``Erik | even taking away college, seems to me that once you have a kid, your focus changes from doing for yourself to making their life better *shrug* |
| 15:32.39 | ``Erik | or SHOULD |
| 15:33.28 | tjyang | I still want to allocate some resources for my personal hobbies ;) |
| 15:33.31 | brlcad | meh, they can fend for themselves, good learning experiences ;) |
| 15:33.56 | ``Erik | heh, it's a balance :D but if push comes to shove, I think the kids take precidence |
| 15:34.23 | tjyang | be back, let me test the mac version of brlcad. |
| 15:34.24 | brlcad | stopped being a negative time/money sink as soon as he could be put to work (early teens) |
| 15:34.53 | ``Erik | my parents gave up a lot for me, but I wasn't spoiled. i support 'em when they need it, ... I'm boggled at how the bitch spoils her brats at times *shrug* |
| 15:36.11 | ``Erik | (of course, I grew up in a single income family with my dad being enlisted in the navy, not exactly wealthy... buying a 'puter was a huge hobby expense that came hard to my dad, but I got my fingers on a keyboard in '83, which affected where I am now *shrug*) |
| 15:37.32 | ``Erik | pancake tends to buy her kids video games and dolls... last xmas, I bought her boy an electronic experimentor kit and her daughter a projection lamp tracing table thing O.o |
| 15:38.15 | louipc | drafting table ;) |
| 15:38.30 | ``Erik | almost, but cheap plastic and with disney images to project :D |
| 15:38.49 | ``Erik | rachel is "artsy"... I don't grok it, my arts are either aural or mathematical |
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| 15:40.08 | brlcad | I think I got joshua one of those for xmas |
| 15:40.10 | ``Erik | http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000Q947SG?smid=A1OLFXZISZ8WL8&tag=nextag-toys-20&linkCode=asn |
| 15:40.14 | brlcad | pretty nifty |
| 15:40.52 | brlcad | heh, yeah .. cept the 'boy' version of that apparently, "Cars" theme instead of princess |
| 15:40.59 | ``Erik | heh, you HAVE to buy josh cool shit, you're his godfather :D I'm just off in left field, not even invited to hang out :D |
| 15:41.20 | ``Erik | met up with jason and nettie a week or two ago for lunch, josh is getting big! |
| 15:41.54 | ``Erik | and was the first time I'd seen their daughter |
| 15:42.23 | brlcad | aspires to be that affluent godfather that joshua knows he can go to for toys whenever he wants (or whenever mom n dad are being stubborn) |
| 15:42.32 | ``Erik | hah |
| 15:42.48 | ``Erik | the faux grandfather roll? :> |
| 15:43.05 | brlcad | like when they were trying to ween him off candy |
| 15:43.13 | brlcad | I show up with chocolate bars |
| 15:43.13 | ``Erik | bwahahahaha |
| 15:43.33 | ``Erik | I have to say, josh seems awfully well behaved, it's boggling |
| 15:43.58 | ``Erik | he got fitty with the crayons, jason told him to settle downa nd be nice and ... he... did... *boggle* |
| 15:44.10 | brlcad | :) |
| 15:44.50 | ``Erik | and the girl (I forgot her name) seems to be the polar opposite |
| 15:45.08 | ``Erik | she just stays quiet and happy |
| 15:45.12 | ``Erik | no fits |
| 15:45.56 | ``Erik | makes me jealous :) they have something awesome going on |
| 15:47.06 | ``Erik | (and nettie has an awesome ability to bounce back, zomfg, jason is all sorts of lucky there *cough* *duck*) |
| 15:47.11 | ``Erik | so, code time :D |
| 15:49.51 | ``Erik | is happy that it is cool today, can actually run "make" without fear :/ |
| 16:00.58 | punkrockgirl | :/ |
| 16:05.01 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: g'morning :) |
| 16:06.24 | brlcad | ``Erik: mira, yeah.. impressively "calm" |
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| 16:23.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31404 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/draw.c: reorder the functions so that forward declarations are not needed for any except the (recursive) callbacks |
| 16:24.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31405 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (8 files): ws |
| 16:27.53 | ``Erik | yeah, that sounds right, was boggling at lunch (grumpies) |
| 16:28.42 | ``Erik | punker says good morning, she's lazy and laying back in bed |
| 16:51.40 | brlcad | mm.. food |
| 17:25.14 | andrecastelo | sorry guys for being away for so much time |
| 17:53.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31406 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: |
| 17:53.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Regarding the center point algorithm - fixed a bug that prevented the head of a |
| 17:53.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: point list from receiving data and a crude hack was being used to prevent loss |
| 17:53.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: of precision. area_center() had a for statement that didn't start with the head, |
| 17:53.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: now it has been improved and now uses BU_LIST_FOR(). |
| 18:00.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31407 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: Moved mafm and homovulgaris (Manuel Fernandez and Dawn Thomas, respectively) from the Special Thanks section to the Code Contribution section, as requested by Dawn Thomas. |
| 18:21.03 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo ! |
| 18:21.09 | brlcad | happy weekend to you |
| 18:21.38 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 18:21.51 | brlcad | andrecastelo: normally requests to get "moved up" by themselves aren't a valid reason :) |
| 18:22.07 | brlcad | though in this case all four of you should be moved up by this point |
| 18:22.55 | andrecastelo | sorry about it S: |
| 18:23.03 | andrecastelo | i thought it was ok to edit it |
| 18:23.21 | brlcad | no, it's completely fine |
| 18:23.31 | brlcad | i'm just saying the commit "reason" isn't the reason |
| 18:23.39 | brlcad | at least that shouldn't be the reason |
| 18:24.15 | brlcad | the reason is that you guys are committing code :) |
| 18:25.21 | andrecastelo | ah ok ok :) |
| 18:25.49 | andrecastelo | i've added a few files that weren't added to the msvc 9 build |
| 18:25.58 | andrecastelo | just building now to see if i didn't forget anything |
| 18:25.59 | brlcad | and by the end of summer, should be at dev status, particularly if you all keep it up |
| 18:26.21 | andrecastelo | awesome :D |
| 18:26.26 | andrecastelo | hehehe |
| 18:26.37 | brlcad | as dev status is more an indicator of "time" (though there is a magnitude of effort factor too) |
| 18:28.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31408 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: denote all four gsocers as such |
| 20:10.34 | starseeker | chuckles to see the docbook debate flare up again |
| 20:11.30 | starseeker | I'm using .xml for the moment, but that's not set in stone |
| 20:12.35 | starseeker | is still a LaTeX fan, but appreciates docbook more now that he can get pdf files out of it and appreciates the magnitude of LaTeX conversion for essentially nil gain |
| 20:13.20 | brlcad | he left :) |
| 20:13.27 | starseeker | bah |
| 20:13.33 | starseeker | that's no fun ;-) |
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| 23:29.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31409 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/ (brlcad/brlcad.sln libged/libged.vcproj): Updated the MSVC 9 build configuration. Added files from libged that weren't added before. Added rtmlt back into the configuration. |
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| 02:39.30 | brlcad | wee |
| 03:14.55 | andrecastelo | weeee |
| 03:14.57 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 03:15.19 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad , what should i do about functions used both in view.c and viewmlt.c ? |
| 03:15.55 | andrecastelo | for example, i'm going to use scanlines, so free_scanlines() is a nice function to have.. external header? |
| 03:27.47 | brlcad | what do you mean used in both? viewmlt is a separate version of view |
| 03:28.06 | brlcad | utility funcs that view happens to use? |
| 03:28.12 | brlcad | or actual callbacks? |
| 03:28.52 | andrecastelo | utility functions that will be useful in viewmlt, as the view_pixel function will be pretty similar |
| 03:30.23 | brlcad | okay, well for that particular example .. I'd move the scanline struct and the free_scanlines into their own scanline.h/scanline.c files, and reuse |
| 03:30.51 | brlcad | and make a pairing alloc_scanlines() to match the free (presently is inline in view_init2 i think) |
| 03:31.11 | brlcad | other funcs, depends what they do :) |
| 04:23.15 | starseeker | raises eyebrows at Intel's demo of raytraced quake... |
| 04:41.25 | andrecastelo | ok, i'm going to add scanline.c and .h |
| 04:41.46 | andrecastelo | but here in the makefile, there is a line 'EXTRA_PROGRAMS = rtmlt' |
| 04:41.56 | andrecastelo | rtmlt isn't included in the build ? |
| 04:43.55 | andrecastelo | ok, checked the log |
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| 05:23.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31410 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): |
| 05:23.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Added files scanline.c and scanline.h, to contain functions and definitions of |
| 05:23.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: scanline, that are shared by view.c and viewmlt.c. Updated msvc9 build files and |
| 05:23.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the Makefile.am. Moved and modified free_scanlines() function to work with |
| 05:23.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: parameters (int height and struct scanline* scanline). Updated view_pixel() |
| 05:23.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: function in viewmlt.c and made some other minor changes in the file. |
| 05:36.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31411 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (scanline.c scanline.h view.c viewmlt.c): Added alloc_scanlines(int, struct scanline*) function and made appropriate changes in view.c and viewmlt.c. |
| 05:38.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31412 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/view.c: Removed commented code (that is now alloc_scanlines() ). |
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| 09:17.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31413 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/Makefile.am: libremrt needs stuff moved to scanline. Remove the EXTRA_PROGRAMS thing |
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| 10:35.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31414 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/CMakeLists.txt: |
| 10:35.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: include new constraint object import export functionality in CMake build |
| 10:35.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: we need to include libpc too if any function from this library will be used here |
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| 11:00.22 | mafm | hai |
| 11:04.53 | andrecastelo | hai mafm |
| 11:06.04 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:17.44 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik good morning :D |
| 11:21.31 | brlcad | howdy folks |
| 11:23.47 | ``Erik | well, it's A morning, that's for sure :) |
| 11:24.30 | mafm | A morning? |
| 11:24.34 | ``Erik | andre: you might have to tweak the msvc proj file to include scanline.c in libremrt (in src/rt) |
| 11:24.57 | ``Erik | I ran into missing symbol issues in src/remrt |
| 11:26.06 | ``Erik | half wonders if some of those functions might be better held in librt |
| 11:28.57 | brlcad | andrecastelo: changes look good, one thing though -- you can use "make distcheck" to do a sanity check when adding new files (needs header) |
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| 11:30.18 | ``Erik | heh, doh, I missed that, too :) |
| 11:30.27 | andrecastelo | hmm ok ok |
| 11:32.11 | andrecastelo | libremrt ? |
| 11:32.40 | andrecastelo | or librt ? |
| 11:35.00 | ``Erik | libremrt in src/rt/ |
| 11:35.10 | ``Erik | used by src/remrt/ |
| 11:36.30 | ``Erik | patched it earlier (couple hours ago) |
| 11:37.21 | andrecastelo | ah so it's a new lib? |
| 11:37.59 | andrecastelo | o.O |
| 11:38.01 | ``Erik | uhm, not... new... it's been in src/rt/ as a noinst for quite a while, src/remrt uses it for a lot of rt guts... |
| 11:38.40 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll setup a new project in msvc |
| 11:38.53 | ``Erik | basically rt as a library, so remrt can re-use that code (stuff that might be better in librt *cough*) |
| 11:39.04 | ``Erik | you don't build src/remrt/ in msvc? |
| 11:39.23 | andrecastelo | let me see |
| 11:50.37 | andrecastelo | apparently not o.O |
| 11:54.12 | andrecastelo | this is weird |
| 11:54.34 | ``Erik | ? |
| 11:55.18 | ``Erik | huzzah for bad system calls in ld |
| 12:00.34 | andrecastelo | remrt is described in src/rt/makefile.am, right ? |
| 12:00.39 | andrecastelo | looks |
| 12:01.12 | ``Erik | libremrt is in src/rt/Makefile.am, remrt is in src/remrt/Makefile.am |
| 12:01.33 | ``Erik | remrt uses libremrt to crib rt functionality |
| 12:04.25 | ``Erik | straps some shoes on and drives to "that place", bbiab |
| 12:08.16 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: here's a screenshot of brlcad/brlcadinstall/lib http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/2202/librertnotherewe6.jpg |
| 12:44.36 | brlcad | mafm: you received my memo? |
| 12:46.43 | brlcad | it was basically "check out wmii", there may even be code that you could use (it's certainly small enough) and it has many of the same usability traits as IOE |
| 12:57.16 | mafm | memo? |
| 12:57.21 | mafm | ah, IRC one |
| 13:02.04 | mafm | lol |
| 13:02.04 | mafm | the p9 window manager |
| 13:12.29 | ``Erik | andré, libremrt is a compile time convenience library, it is not intended to be installed. |
| 13:14.19 | mafm | brlcad: did you use wmii? |
| 13:17.00 | brlcad | mafm: i've used it before (long time ago) |
| 13:18.21 | brlcad | I'm just not at a linux desktop frequently these days it seems, one of the other devs uses it fairly regularly |
| 13:18.32 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i'm having trouble setting it up |
| 13:18.40 | brlcad | (the ioe guy) |
| 13:19.02 | andrecastelo | i've created a new project for libremrt, exports a .dll.. but it's having some problem compiling |
| 13:19.29 | brlcad | you shouldn't need a libremrt |
| 13:19.41 | brlcad | that's just the easy way to put it together in automake |
| 13:19.50 | mafm | which is the interesting part in our perspective? the general layout? the taskbar at the bottom? the tiling of windows? |
| 13:20.20 | brlcad | mafm: "yes" |
| 13:20.26 | andrecastelo | the thing is that remrt isn't there as a vcproj file either |
| 13:20.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31415 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/librt/librt.vcproj: Added pc_constraint.c to build. |
| 13:21.33 | brlcad | it has many of the same usability conventions, tiled windows, tabbed contexts, quasi-shaded windows, full keyboard navigation, task/info bar, etc |
| 13:22.22 | ``Erik | um, if remrt is put in, it should have, uhm, all the sources used by libremrt included... like, uh, ...\src\rt\view.c ...\src\rt\shotline.c ... etc |
| 13:22.39 | andrecastelo | hm ok |
| 13:22.49 | ``Erik | looks at the mail list |
| 13:23.14 | ``Erik | tjyang is the one who was arguing for LaTeX instead of docbook? |
| 13:24.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31416 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/librt/librt.vcproj: Added pc_constraint.c to librt. |
| 13:24.19 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: yup |
| 13:24.37 | mafm | I see |
| 13:24.44 | ``Erik | thinks someone is looking for a large helping of "patches accepted" |
| 13:24.52 | mafm | I'll try to check it out, but I'm fighting with cmake at the moment :) |
| 13:24.55 | ``Erik | or, welcome, rather |
| 13:26.46 | mafm | latex? he must be a mad physicist |
| 13:31.28 | ``Erik | "Can god code something so unusable even he can't use it? No, but I can and so can you: http://www.microsoft.com/careers" |
| 13:32.32 | andrecastelo | lol |
| 13:33.12 | andrecastelo | "We offer opportunities around the world to make an impact with the next generation of technology we're building today." |
| 13:33.16 | andrecastelo | s/building/copying |
| 13:37.19 | mafm | s/copying/borking |
| 13:42.15 | starseeker | LaTeX does offer easier customization on the output side, but that's probably not worth the tradeoff |
| 13:42.42 | starseeker | is still early on the Docbook learning curve, in some respects |
| 13:42.55 | ``Erik | <3 LaTeX for print, and it's web thing isn't too terrible, but has seen docbook work damn well, too *shrug* |
| 13:43.18 | starseeker | is rather surprised by the apparent lack of "here's how to write a docbook file and get a pdf" step by step |
| 13:45.38 | mafm | well, certainly docbook is more writer-friendly :D |
| 13:45.44 | ``Erik | has seen jade->pdf shtuff |
| 13:45.51 | mafm | for non-english texts especially |
| 13:46.58 | starseeker | ``Erik: Occasionally, but not like I would expect - Docbook's "get up and go" threshold is fairly high as compared to LaTeX's |
| 13:47.24 | starseeker | reflects that it does help that ALL of the TeX tools are usually crammed into one huge installation |
| 13:47.54 | ``Erik | pheer the teTeX |
| 13:48.05 | ``Erik | which I guess is deprecated now? heh |
| 13:48.11 | starseeker | :-) |
| 13:48.19 | starseeker | pheer the TeXlive |
| 13:48.41 | ``Erik | lets his package management system worry about all that for him, is old and lazy |
| 13:49.09 | starseeker | I think to do DocLive you would have to bundle java, xml tools, fop, the stylesheets, and lord knows what else |
| 13:49.14 | starseeker | does too |
| 13:49.44 | starseeker | To date, the only successfully running toolchain for docbook that I have working is on my Gentoo box (yay portage!) |
| 13:51.01 | starseeker | meh - firebird seems to be using ant |
| 13:53.40 | starseeker | doesn't want to use ant - I'll concede java as a necessity for fop, but arrgh... |
| 13:53.57 | starseeker | alright, what are they up to here... |
| 13:54.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31417 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/rt/rt.vcproj: Added scanline.c to build. |
| 14:03.03 | mafm | about the rt^3 module... should I consider g3d a separate project? |
| 14:03.32 | mafm | I mean so that you can build g3d but not other utilities/whatever inside there |
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| 14:37.35 | starseeker | brlcad: do we want to keep all docbook documentation build results (html, pdf, etc.) in the share directory or should we make a /usr/local/doc/brlcad/7.12.4 type layout? |
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| 15:56.19 | louipc | starseeker: I'd say leave them in the same place as the .xml after make, then put them into brlcad/doc or brlcad/share/doc on `make install` |
| 15:58.45 | louipc | starseeker: err I wasn't paying attention. Yeah keep them under the brlcad root please :D |
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| 16:44.25 | homovulgaris | hi all :) |
| 16:44.47 | louipc | hi |
| 16:44.55 | pacman87 | hello |
| 16:45.33 | homovulgaris | hi pacman how is it going ? :) |
| 16:45.54 | homovulgaris | hi louipc |
| 16:46.05 | louipc | what's up yo |
| 16:46.15 | pacman87 | pretty good. putting the finishing touches on hyp, then optimizing everything |
| 16:46.33 | homovulgaris | have been studying gecode structure for sometime.. they are a generic constraint solver |
| 16:46.54 | homovulgaris | but their architecture is good.. was thinking could use something for geometric constraint solver.. |
| 16:47.44 | homovulgaris | Ideally though i think in effect any constraint solver is in the end generic.. all csps- constraint satisfaction problems can be translated from one "language" to the other |
| 16:48.07 | homovulgaris | pacman87: how are the plans on sweep going ? |
| 16:48.35 | pacman87 | i've kinda put them on hold while finishing hyp |
| 16:48.43 | pacman87 | you have any ideas/suggestions? |
| 16:48.48 | homovulgaris | how exactly would u be storing the dependence between the existing geometry and the new one ( sweep ) ? |
| 16:49.23 | pacman87 | i'm planning on using the sketch to store the outline, and i need to find a way to store the path |
| 16:49.35 | homovulgaris | i mean in the .g .. would it be like a name reference to the sketch object , inside the sweep object repersentation.. |
| 16:49.56 | pacman87 | i need to see how 'extrude' does it |
| 16:50.14 | pacman87 | becasue that's just a sweep in a straight line |
| 16:50.24 | homovulgaris | indeed :) |
| 16:50.46 | louipc | you can extrude a sketch? |
| 16:51.14 | pacman87 | louipc: what else would you do with a sketch? |
| 16:52.45 | louipc | sketch in 2d I suppose |
| 16:52.53 | pacman87 | louipc: yes |
| 16:53.37 | louipc | but that's cool |
| 16:54.01 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i checked out boost interval library.. not very confident it is useful in csp solving .. though still keeping it as an option now..basically the type of intervals i need are for example if x belong to (3,4) and (4,5) the effective domain should be shown as (3,5) or in a sense (3,4) + (4,5) = (3,5) set union basically .. whereas interval arithmetic is basically (3,4) + (4,5) =(7,9) basically the domain of x+y if x and y belong to the respect |
| 16:54.01 | homovulgaris | ive ranges |
| 16:54.10 | homovulgaris | oops :) |
| 16:54.38 | homovulgaris | pacman87: what are sketches themselves made of ? |
| 16:55.01 | homovulgaris | hmm i should read mk_sketch |
| 16:55.08 | homovulgaris | is there one ? |
| 16:55.13 | pacman87 | not sure |
| 16:55.26 | pacman87 | src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c |
| 17:02.14 | homovulgaris | hmm.. splines |
| 17:02.14 | homovulgaris | gecode.org for the constraints thingy i mentioned |
| 17:03.06 | homovulgaris | brlcad: so basically i am writing the interval class myself whose list<> makes the domain |
| 17:05.42 | homovulgaris | pacman: sketches dont have to be closed right? |
| 17:06.02 | homovulgaris | pacman87: and u intend the sweep path to be a 3d curve right ? |
| 17:06.23 | pacman87 | i dont think you can sweep an open sketch |
| 17:06.31 | pacman87 | and sweep path will be 3d |
| 17:06.57 | louipc | I guess it depends on how you sweep it eh? |
| 17:07.18 | homovulgaris | i mean we can sweep an open sketch right ? |
| 17:07.41 | pacman87 | how would you get a 3d solid from sweeping an open sketch? |
| 17:07.46 | louipc | if you're just sweeping along one axis it could be open |
| 17:07.55 | homovulgaris | and regarding 3d i mean ofcourse minimally it would be a 2d curve and maximally 3d :) |
| 17:07.59 | louipc | like turning on a lathe |
| 17:08.07 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. |
| 17:08.30 | homovulgaris | thats revolve right ? |
| 17:09.01 | pacman87 | if you sweep an open sketch, you end up with a surface, not a solid, right? |
| 17:09.13 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 17:10.43 | pacman87 | a closed sketch is already a surface, so sweeping that gives you the soldi |
| 17:10.46 | pacman87 | solid |
| 17:12.03 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: http://rafb.net/p/G6YzD486.html :O |
| 17:13.58 | homovulgaris | yikes.. this iterator thingy is getting on my nerves i better get back to kicking some c++ butt |
| 17:13.58 | homovulgaris | defining ur own containers is so much like writing a manual :( |
| 17:14.02 | homovulgaris | true |
| 17:14.14 | homovulgaris | pacman87: have u seen this page ? http://www.opencascade.org/showroom/shapefactory/# |
| 17:15.49 | homovulgaris | andrecastelo: huh :O no time.h ??? 0.o |
| 17:16.19 | andrecastelo | apparently no! hehehe |
| 17:16.23 | ``Erik | neato |
| 17:16.35 | ``Erik | netdb.h may be handled by winsock.h on windows, I d'no |
| 17:18.45 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: its weird though, that a module such as remrt wasn't present in the solution file |
| 17:18.50 | andrecastelo | msvc 9 solution file* |
| 17:27.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31418 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: implement curve() for hyp, hyp is now fully functional |
| 17:27.44 | pacman87 | optimizations, here i come! |
| 17:29.09 | ``Erik | *shrug* the msvc8 stuff was not ALL of BRL-CAD, bob's still working on making more build on win32 |
| 17:29.26 | ``Erik | and remrt/rtsrv should probably be modified to use libpkg instead of direct sockets |
| 17:47.34 | andrecastelo | ah ok ok |
| 17:47.50 | andrecastelo | should i commit the changes? |
| 17:54.31 | brlcad | starseeker: I believe docs are covered by the --data-dir setting, so somewhere under there |
| 17:54.55 | brlcad | (which is what the Makefile.am's in doc/ already do iirc |
| 18:07.26 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I realize that it wasn't exactly what you needed, but you can get that different range through different operators .. but more a thought of what structures you could leverage |
| 18:07.38 | brlcad | instead of growing everything from scratch, which will be tough |
| 18:07.46 | brlcad | (but also viable solution) |
| 18:10.39 | brlcad | pacman87: I believe extrudes just use a vector, you'l probably want to use spline paths for sweeping (maybe struct curve's) |
| 18:11.50 | pacman87 | brlcad: i was referring more to how the sketch is stored for the extrude |
| 18:12.13 | brlcad | it's "not" |
| 18:12.22 | brlcad | sketches are independent objects |
| 18:12.27 | brlcad | extrudes refer to them by name |
| 18:13.04 | pacman87 | right, that's what i'm planning for rev/sweep, too |
| 18:13.18 | brlcad | sounds like a good plan |
| 18:13.55 | pacman87 | is there a standard set of benchmarks to test my primitive's performance? |
| 18:14.50 | brlcad | andrecastelo: are you creating a new project for remrt? |
| 18:15.18 | brlcad | pacman87: not per-primitive |
| 18:15.34 | brlcad | there are benchmarks that quantify performance for regression purposes |
| 18:15.43 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yes, created and added the sources of libremrt |
| 18:15.44 | brlcad | and testing/optimization, etc |
| 18:16.31 | brlcad | andrecastelo: ah, okay -- those header woes are build system issues -- the sys/time.h header should be wrapped in HAVE_SYS_TIME_H, the netdb.h is probably a missing preprocessor search path |
| 18:17.33 | brlcad | sweeping a non-closed sketch would be invalid -- we don't deal with zero-thickness surfaces |
| 18:30.45 | louipc | ah right you might want a hollow object |
| 18:34.18 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i have a class right now, i'll work on it when i get back :D |
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| 18:43.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31419 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (qray.c setup.c): Temporarily disable qray while transitioning to libged. |
| 19:10.20 | brlcad | pacman87: there are a few remaining polish points for hyp to be "done", if you're interested |
| 19:10.30 | pacman87 | brlcad: sure |
| 19:10.56 | brlcad | nothing critical, you're more than welcome to "move on" too, I can certainly implement them |
| 19:11.43 | pacman87 | well, i ran into a bug somewhere trying to ev a combination |
| 19:13.58 | pacman87 | nmg_region_v_unique(): 2 verts are the same, within tolerance |
| 19:17.50 | brlcad | the ones I noticed are the 'make' comamnd (libged/make.c), 'mirror' (librt/mirror.c), solid edit menu options (mged/edsol.c), and the 'ted' command (mged/tedit.c) |
| 19:18.05 | brlcad | all are pretty easy |
| 19:18.50 | brlcad | interesting about unique vertices .. |
| 19:27.14 | pacman87 | and i'm getting a segfault when raytracing at view.c:1474 |
| 19:27.28 | pacman87 | for all rt's, not just hyp |
| 19:38.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31420 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CMakeLists.txt cmake/ cmake/UsePkgConfig.cmake): Preliminary support for CMake, not working yet |
| 19:53.03 | andrecastelo | so the professor couldn't go today :S |
| 19:59.56 | mafm | I feel your sorrow andrecastelo |
| 20:02.58 | mafm | w00t |
| 20:02.59 | mafm | cmake is starting to work :) |
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| 20:08.17 | prasad_ | applied for graduation :o |
| 20:08.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31421 10/brlcad/trunk/src/remrt/rtsrv.c: Wrapped sys/time.h with HAVE_SYS_TIME_H macro. |
| 20:12.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31422 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/ (Makefile.am brlcad/brlcad.sln remrt/ remrt/remrt.vcproj): Created remrt project file, with files in src/remrt and the files that belong to libremrt, in src/rt/, and added the .vcproj to the MSVC 9 build. |
| 20:15.59 | mafm | I go now, bye |
| 20:16.07 | brlcad | cya mafm |
| 20:16.11 | brlcad | any progress? :) |
| 20:16.19 | mafm | it compiles in cmake |
| 20:16.27 | brlcad | cool |
| 20:16.36 | brlcad | building just the g3d dir sources? |
| 20:16.39 | mafm | yes |
| 20:16.47 | brlcad | okay |
| 20:16.48 | mafm | I asked about that before, let me find |
| 20:17.10 | brlcad | should you consider it a separate project? no |
| 20:17.20 | mafm | <mafm> about the rt^3 module... should I consider g3d a separate project? |
| 20:17.25 | mafm | <mafm> I mean so that you can build g3d but not other utilities/whatever inside there |
| 20:17.27 | brlcad | it *is* the project |
| 20:17.46 | brlcad | the other dirs/folders are very closely related |
| 20:17.59 | brlcad | the "rt^3" name is just misleading |
| 20:18.02 | mafm | so basically all the rt^3 "module" is for g3d? |
| 20:21.53 | mafm | well, be back tomorrow anyway :) |
| 20:21.56 | mafm | cheers |
| 20:52.00 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 21:06.48 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: i think your changes to view.c broke rt |
| 21:07.44 | andrecastelo | pacman87: hmm, what's happening? it isn't compiling ? |
| 21:07.59 | pacman87 | no, it compiles |
| 21:08.03 | pacman87 | but rt fails |
| 21:08.31 | andrecastelo | seg fault? |
| 21:08.34 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 21:12.12 | andrecastelo | hm, did you try reverting ? |
| 21:12.44 | pacman87 | yeah, it works for rev 31409 |
| 21:15.01 | andrecastelo | ok, i'll take a look |
| 21:31.35 | andrecastelo | ok, fixed |
| 21:31.44 | andrecastelo | just reviewing and will commit |
| 21:33.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31423 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (scanline.c scanline.h view.c): Fixed a bug in rt that had to do with scanlines. The memory allocation function now returns a pointer. Checks to see if scanline already exists were added. |
| 21:36.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31424 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Fixed scanline functions and added checks in memory allocation. Did some irrelevant formatting and added a bit more to view_pixel(). |
| 21:37.40 | pacman87 | viewmlt.c: In function 'view_pixel': |
| 21:37.40 | pacman87 | viewmlt.c:184: error: 'width' undeclared (first use in this function) |
| 21:39.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31425 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Fixed a minor bug - int width not declared. |
| 21:39.52 | andrecastelo | my bad :S |
| 21:39.56 | andrecastelo | did you try rt ? |
| 21:40.06 | pacman87 | that's why i generally compile before committing |
| 21:40.34 | andrecastelo | yeah, i do that too, just missed this time |
| 21:41.24 | andrecastelo | anyways, i'll have to leave now |
| 21:41.28 | andrecastelo | will be back later |
| 21:41.30 | andrecastelo | cya |
| 21:41.32 | pacman87 | bye |
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| 22:24.20 | ``Erik | thinks you should compile and try running stuff you may've impacted before compiling |
| 22:24.59 | ``Erik | like view/viewmlt/scanline shoulda seen test runs of rt, rtmlt and remrt/rtsrv :) |
| 22:26.00 | ``Erik | er |
| 22:26.03 | ``Erik | before committing |
| 22:33.02 | ``Erik | "what good is mining nose-gold if I can't share it with the towns-people???" |
| 22:34.32 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: yeah Erik, i usually compile stuff and try a few runs (viewarea for example), but totally forgot this time o.O |
| 22:35.00 | ``Erik | *shrug* eventually, it should become pretty much automatic, muscle-memory |
| 22:35.14 | andrecastelo | i'll work on it ;) |
| 22:35.17 | ``Erik | but I've committed without even doing the "does it compile" test just recently, so'z *shrug* :) it happens |
| 22:38.13 | ``Erik | nice, a bf2c compiler written in bf |
| 22:38.19 | ``Erik | http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/dbf2c.b |
| 22:48.04 | poolio | howdy all |
| 22:49.15 | ``Erik | greetings, ben |
| 22:51.02 | poolio | ah it is quite bizarre reading my real name on IRC, hi ``Erik. How's the office? |
| 22:53.48 | ``Erik | the office is 20 miles over that way *point* so I'm happy :D |
| 23:20.25 | brlcad | yay for problems getting fixed before I get to compile |
| 23:35.40 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_ (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 00:06.22 | ``Erik | destroys every rj45 jack in brlcads possession to make it so all the issues get fixed before he can compile :D |
| 00:06.55 | pacman87 | ``Erik: don't forget to warp his wireless antenna in a faraday cage |
| 00:08.04 | ``Erik | I'm fairly certain his intarweb uplink requirs an rj45 :D though he might be low enough to try to steal a neighbors 802.11[bg] |
| 00:08.47 | ``Erik | someone in the same apt complex as him was whining because they couldn't steal wifi access, so I d'no if he has that opportunity without going "above and beyond" the casual bandwidth thiefs ability... |
| 00:09.22 | ``Erik | mah finners hurt |
| 00:10.04 | ``Erik | jamming out cream, hendrix, metallica, ac/dc, pantera, and some random thrash/speedmetal... rough on ya if you haven't kept your callouses up |
| 00:10.33 | ``Erik | I think I'm running 10's on that gitfiddle, to boot |
| 00:16.29 | brlcad | yup, there are like 15 competing wireless nets |
| 00:17.02 | brlcad | last I checked, two were wide open, I use them from time to time just for kicks (when I have .. "stuff" .. to download) |
| 00:30.02 | ``Erik | deletes the last two lines |
| 00:31.36 | ``Erik | my face hurts from pissing off punker on webcam O.o |
| 00:31.56 | ``Erik | she's freaking out about my face fuzz, so I keep pulling it out to exaggerate it |
| 00:32.27 | ``Erik | (it's not like I have that much, sheesh) |
| 00:33.10 | ``Erik | invests in moustache wax |
| 00:56.16 | brlcad | heh |
| 00:57.07 | brlcad | kinda misses when the goatee could be gripped entirely in hand and still have a bit more to go |
| 01:14.47 | ``Erik | heh |
| 01:15.33 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 01:16.01 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:17.09 | brlcad | howdy madant |
| 01:17.44 | brlcad | great name, btw |
| 01:19.49 | brlcad | pacman87: nice update :) |
| 01:19.57 | brlcad | loves getting feed updates |
| 01:21.10 | pacman87 | brlcad: yeah, i kind of forgot about it last week; too busy wrestling with tess() :) |
| 01:26.25 | brlcad | pacman87: actually coding and commiting is a perfect excuse and alternative for updating the log :) |
| 02:24.34 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:30.02 | PrezKennedy | howdy brlcad |
| 02:52.34 | brlcad | howdy howdy |
| 04:00.40 | punkrockgirl | um, erik has more than face fuzz |
| 04:00.45 | punkrockgirl | fyi :) |
| 04:01.08 | punkrockgirl | he has more hair on his face than on his head |
| 04:01.20 | punkrockgirl | and its not neatly kept |
| 04:01.42 | punkrockgirl | :P |
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| 08:10.20 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 09:02.53 | d_rossberg | i don't like the idea of using a reference to a sketch in other primitives |
| 09:03.07 | d_rossberg | even the extrude isn't suitable for an example of this |
| 09:03.46 | d_rossberg | correct me if i'm wrong but i think this primitive will crash after removing the sketch |
| 09:04.13 | d_rossberg | furthermore the implementation of nurb curves is missing |
| 09:04.43 | d_rossberg | and the method for bezier works for straight line paths only |
| 09:05.49 | d_rossberg | therefore i'm not convinced that this would be the right start point for revolves and sweeps |
| 09:24.55 | brlcad | using the existing nurb curve struct was just a thought |
| 09:24.59 | brlcad | or some similar structure |
| 09:25.16 | brlcad | there are just about five different 3d spline path structures throughout the code |
| 09:25.31 | brlcad | because every keeps implementing their own for their little bit |
| 09:25.41 | brlcad | instead of refactoring that into something proper in librt |
| 09:26.35 | brlcad | the intent is just to either find something existing that will work perfect or make it something proper in librt (and perhaps get the others using it) |
| 09:28.06 | brlcad | as for the named reference, it certainly shouldn't crash -- it's no different than how combinations and regions work, or textures, or dsp height fields, or bump maps, or extrudes, etc |
| 09:31.34 | brlcad | to change from named references would certainly be a pretty big shift from convention |
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| 10:06.34 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14FA2E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 10:22.20 | d_rossberg | it's only on the disk a named reference |
| 10:22.57 | d_rossberg | the internal structure of an extrusion refers to the internal structure of the sketch |
| 10:32.43 | d_rossberg | as for the convention: there is a big difference between the extrusion and your other examples |
| 10:33.46 | d_rossberg | you can't create an extrusion from an arbitrary sketch |
| 10:34.03 | brlcad | it's actually only the on-disk structure that I was referring to |
| 10:34.22 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_ (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 10:34.31 | brlcad | it can do whatever it needs to for the internal structure (what is used by prep) |
| 10:35.01 | brlcad | I took what you said of not using a reference to mean that the on-disk shouldn't use a named reference |
| 10:35.44 | brlcad | the extrusion still isn't so different, I can't create combinations from arbitrary database objects either |
| 10:36.22 | d_rossberg | but it's limited my their types only? |
| 10:36.51 | brlcad | they need to be solid 3D primitives or other combinations |
| 10:37.08 | d_rossberg | or sketches |
| 10:37.09 | brlcad | so not even any primitive |
| 10:37.46 | brlcad | hm? |
| 10:38.09 | d_rossberg | only a question: can a combination contain a sketch? |
| 10:38.58 | brlcad | it could by name, but it would not be a valid combination |
| 10:39.09 | brlcad | e.g. if you 'e' it up, it's going to complain |
| 10:39.42 | d_rossberg | my statement wasn't "every primitive" but "if it can refer an arb (e.g.) then any arb" |
| 10:41.03 | d_rossberg | with this you can test at creation time for correctness |
| 10:41.26 | brlcad | i'm still not sure what you're trying to say overall :) |
| 10:42.24 | d_rossberg | ok, i see some potential preblems there: |
| 10:42.26 | brlcad | my original notes were merely to 1) decrease entropy when picking a spline path and 2) have on-disk be a named reference .. no more, no less :) |
| 10:42.56 | brlcad | if you're not talking about on-disk, then I don't see a problem |
| 10:43.44 | d_rossberg | 1) the test for the referenced sketch is done on creation only |
| 10:43.46 | brlcad | as for usability, there are all sorts of things that can be done to test for correctness at time of creation or db import loading or ray-trace prep |
| 10:44.52 | d_rossberg | i.e. if you create an extrusion and remove the sketch the program will crash next time it accesses the extrusion primitive |
| 10:45.59 | d_rossberg | 2) the extrusion primitive has some special requirements to the sketch |
| 10:46.02 | brlcad | it "shouldn't" crash no matter what is done, *any* crash is a hard bug imho that can be prevented :) |
| 10:47.18 | d_rossberg | because there is no explicit conversion these requirements are hidden |
| 10:47.35 | d_rossberg | and changing the sketch can destroy the extrusion |
| 10:48.06 | d_rossberg | (that's the "not arbitrary" point) |
| 10:49.41 | brlcad | apologies, but I'm still not clear on what you're trying to say -- are your 1)/2) points potential problems or things that we should do or not do? |
| 10:50.35 | brlcad | and similarly, are you talking about what it should do, shouldn't do, or currently does |
| 10:51.01 | brlcad | as even extrude does a few things currently that it really shouldn't (wrt robustness) |
| 10:52.46 | brlcad | otherwise I quite agree that if you screw up or remove a sketch, you implicitly invalidate the extrude .. and that fact should be evident the next time the extrude is used (because it's invalid) |
| 10:55.37 | d_rossberg | only invalid wouldn't be a problem for me, e.g. if you have a reference to a texture bitmap and somebody removed this bitmap you won't see it |
| 10:56.53 | d_rossberg | but if you are using a pointer to an internal structure and you use this pointer without test if the refered object still exits you have a problem |
| 10:58.18 | d_rossberg | therefore the point is: if you are working with references you have to care for them |
| 10:59.16 | brlcad | quite true |
| 10:59.43 | d_rossberg | sometimes it is woth doing this: combinations, textures, etc. |
| 11:00.00 | brlcad | right, you might remove something merely to update it with something new |
| 11:01.10 | brlcad | I've done something similar with extrudes in the past, removing/updating a sketch to test different extrude shapes -- and it wasn't robust, had bugs that had to be fixed |
| 11:02.04 | brlcad | it used to crash if you created an empty sketch, for example, which is a "valid" sketch, but invalid for extrusion purposes just as if I'd given a curve instead of a closed path contour |
| 11:02.17 | d_rossberg | in the case of an extrusion it would be worth doin it, if there would be a real reference relationship |
| 11:02.19 | brlcad | no longer crashes, that was a bug |
| 11:04.23 | brlcad | i don't see sweep and revolve as being different, they're just different types of sweep paths with extrude being a simple linear and rotationally invariant sweep |
| 11:04.29 | d_rossberg | but in fact the extrusion primitive has its own type of "sketch" which can be memorized in the BRL-CAD sketch primitive |
| 11:05.09 | brlcad | you mean the fact that it has to form a non-empty closed loop? |
| 11:05.19 | brlcad | that being the type? |
| 11:05.32 | d_rossberg | yest, and the nurb thing |
| 11:05.59 | d_rossberg | (i mean "yes") |
| 11:06.43 | d_rossberg | logically it's an other type |
| 11:06.49 | brlcad | yeah, I think that's the same type that sweep needs, but not necessarily the type that revolve needs (since it needs to only be closed on a given axis) |
| 11:07.34 | d_rossberg | and the sweep type would have problems with the Beziers |
| 11:08.49 | d_rossberg | the common thing is that all these primitives could use rt_sketch_internal |
| 11:09.07 | brlcad | yeah, they should |
| 11:09.13 | brlcad | they just need to validate differently |
| 11:09.21 | brlcad | what's the problem with the bezier curves? |
| 11:09.21 | d_rossberg | but does this mean the same as having a reference to aan arbitrary sketch? |
| 11:09.43 | d_rossberg | Bezier: finding the roots |
| 11:11.42 | brlcad | which roots? roots are used in plotting the curve as well as during ray-tracing (in the case of extrude) to evaluate where the surface is |
| 11:12.53 | d_rossberg | e.g. during the ray-trace |
| 11:15.58 | d_rossberg | to be clear: these are problems which should be solved before the implementation starts |
| 11:16.10 | d_rossberg | the solution could be to use a reference to a sketch and make tests during the ray-trace |
| 11:16.21 | d_rossberg | or to use an internal structure for the sketch and e.g. use the BRL-CAD sketch for creation (and make the tests there) |
| 11:19.41 | d_rossberg | maybe pacman87 should think about it and give us a well-founded proposal |
| 11:20.09 | brlcad | iirc, the way extrude deals with it is that it loads the sketch during import (stores it in rt_extrude_internal) and then during ray-trace, it converts the sketch into extrude-specific information (i.e. struct extrude_specific, no longer using rt_sketch_internal) by projecting the sketch onto a plane creating a connected set of curves (struct curve) and vertices (point_t's) |
| 11:21.31 | brlcad | yeah, I think pacman87 should think about and document what it needs to do :) |
| 11:23.42 | d_rossberg | i've looked into extrude.c: in the prep function there is a test if the pointer to the sketch is still valid (RT_SKETCH_CK_MAGIC) |
| 11:24.06 | d_rossberg | this probable solves some problems |
| 11:24.14 | d_rossberg | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:25.18 | brlcad | nods |
| 12:37.35 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
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| 12:50.15 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 12:50.44 | mafm | heyo |
| 13:49.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31426 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CMakeLists.txt cmake/UsePkgConfig.cmake): CMake now compiles the binary; but more work is needed to get to install the package in the system, and furthermore -- doing it properly. |
| 14:09.51 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 14:13.18 | mafm | hey |
| 14:13.23 | starseeker | puts on his football gear and takes another headlong rush at the firebird manual setup |
| 14:13.56 | mafm | so continuing with yesterday's conversation, is the rt³ module only for the new GUI? |
| 14:14.58 | mafm | this CMake thing is pretty funny! |
| 14:17.26 | brlcad | hah |
| 14:17.41 | brlcad | likes the appropos use of unicode |
| 14:18.25 | mafm | Unicode? |
| 14:18.35 | mafm | it's regular ascii I think |
| 14:18.36 | brlcad | rt³ |
| 14:18.39 | brlcad | is it? |
| 14:18.43 | brlcad | neat |
| 14:18.58 | mafm | well, when you press caret ^ plus 2 or 3, it adds that character |
| 14:19.13 | mafm | I did it unintentionally, trying to write rt^3 :) |
| 14:19.39 | mafm | the key strokes are: r t shift+caret space 3 |
| 14:19.50 | brlcad | rt^ 3 |
| 14:19.52 | mafm | if you don't press the space, caret is applied as an accent |
| 14:19.52 | brlcad | :) |
| 14:20.14 | mafm | as for â é |
| 14:20.29 | brlcad | which OS? |
| 14:21.03 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 14:21.38 | mafm | Debian Linuz |
| 14:22.32 | mafm | (0)¹ n² c³ ... r^4 doesn't work |
| 14:23.19 | mafm | probably your keyboard is not set up to have carect acting as an accent, so you can't do it like this |
| 14:23.45 | brlcad | doesn't see superscript in the ascii table |
| 14:24.23 | mafm | http://www.pemberley.com/janeinfo/latin1.html |
| 14:24.26 | mafm | this one has |
| 14:24.33 | mafm | not ascii though :D |
| 14:25.04 | brlcad | ah, yeah |
| 14:25.19 | brlcad | 8859-1 != ascii ;) |
| 14:26.33 | brlcad | nice, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_page_850 shows the overlap |
| 14:28.22 | brlcad |  |
| 14:28.48 | mafm | I see a "blank space" (with rectangle around) |
| 14:29.04 | mafm | that CP is for windows |
| 14:29.21 | brlcad | figured, it's a mac-specific charcode |
| 14:29.26 | mafm | equivalent of latin1 I think |
| 14:30.18 | brlcad | i know that's what the table is for, but it still shows where ascii and latin1 coincide |
| 14:30.35 | brlcad | and (more interestingly) where they don't |
| 14:33.20 | brlcad | ââ¦ây ⥠â BRL-CAD â» |
| 14:33.30 | brlcad | woo, irssi didn't like that :) |
| 14:33.53 | brlcad | course I'm set to utf-8 atm |
| 14:34.20 | mafm | you look like a orkut teenager :P |
| 14:37.48 | brlcad | meh, if I could feel like one too, I'd be a great shape ;) |
| 14:38.25 | mafm | heh :) |
| 14:39.10 | mafm | so well... the module is mainly for g3d or not? would I create a general CMakefile instead? |
| 14:39.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31427 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CMakeLists.txt cmake/UsePkgConfig.cmake): Sanitizing the helper pkg-config module for CMake |
| 14:45.01 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, is my brother on a windoze machine? |
| 14:46.24 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: nope |
| 14:46.51 | PrezKennedy | any machine at all? i know its the Fed... it took em two weeks to get me connected |
| 14:47.08 | brlcad | mafm: mainly, yes -- that's where it's all going to come together for the geometry service, the OO engine API, and the new gui (i.e. g3d) |
| 14:48.55 | PrezKennedy | first day at FGS i had to set up my own computer :P |
| 14:50.05 | mafm | oki |
| 14:54.18 | brlcad | and they all need to work together :) |
| 14:55.15 | brlcad | which includes organizationally putting things together than can be reused, but also keeping an eye on the library functionality in our existing core libraries (libbu, libbn, librt, libged) |
| 14:55.46 | brlcad | bob said last night that libged is almost ready for you to use for testing |
| 14:56.41 | mafm | good |
| 14:56.50 | brlcad | there's only two pieces of functionality that should be needed, opendb and draw |
| 14:57.02 | brlcad | that gives you a display list for rendering 3d wireframes |
| 14:57.42 | brlcad | the focus should still be more on the gui itself, though, getting the major portions worked on (like non-overlapping windows, command overlay, etc) |
| 14:58.44 | mafm | yep |
| 14:59.10 | mafm | and I think that I'll need all this week for getting all this building thing complete, with the external libraries and so on |
| 14:59.42 | brlcad | oh, what's the complicated part? |
| 15:00.45 | mafm | the external libs, devise an automatic system to compile all that, applying patches and so on |
| 15:05.39 | brlcad | ok, sounds good |
| 15:05.47 | brlcad | let bob know :) |
| 15:05.52 | brlcad | and/or wiki note |
| 15:09.04 | mafm | should I write bob especially? he never comments anything |
| 15:13.11 | brlcad | updating the wiki should be fine |
| 15:13.15 | brlcad | he reads it |
| 15:13.29 | brlcad | he's just a guy of (very) few words |
| 15:13.57 | brlcad | he cares more about end-result and/or if you directly ask him a specific technical question |
| 15:16.14 | starseeker | begins to like XInclude |
| 15:26.12 | ``Erik | brlcad: on site today? lunch? |
| 15:26.25 | brlcad | dunno |
| 15:27.33 | brlcad | lemme know where you decide to go |
| 15:27.36 | mafm | oki |
| 15:29.00 | brlcad | likes how the CMake universal deals with relocatable Mac installs |
| 15:39.29 | mafm | brlcad: can you please put this in a CMakeLists.txt and give me the SYSTEM output? |
| 15:39.29 | mafm | include(CMakePrintSystemInformation) |
| 15:47.31 | brlcad | http://paste.bzflag.bz/m1f49d99d |
| 15:53.39 | mafm | holy cow |
| 15:53.46 | mafm | the system name is Darwin? |
| 15:54.30 | mafm | I thought that it would be MacOSX or so |
| 15:54.57 | mafm | if creationists discover this internal name for Mac, they might set Stevie on fire |
| 16:08.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31428 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx CMakeLists.txt): Auto-detecting system when building, intead of hardcoding POSIX, and some other misc enhancements |
| 16:10.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31429 10/rt^3/trunk/ (data/ src/data/): Moving data out of src/, for some reason I had created it in there... |
| 16:21.02 | brlcad | mafm: the kernel and underlying BSD OS has always been called Darwin |
| 16:21.34 | brlcad | "Mac OS X" is a suite of applications and frameworks that sit on top of Darwin |
| 16:22.25 | brlcad | just like with the autotools, though, you really shouldn't be associating functionality with the system type, it should be tied to features |
| 16:24.29 | mafm | testing for features separately? |
| 16:24.30 | brlcad | at least if/when you can at all avoid it, just not a good approach for long-term maintainability |
| 16:25.03 | brlcad | absolutely |
| 16:25.23 | brlcad | if you need to know if X is available, you don't assume POSIX means there's X, you test for X |
| 16:25.30 | brlcad | that sort of thing |
| 16:26.38 | brlcad | or better example, say you had a bit of code that needed to use posix threads .. you wouldn't test for POSIX, you'd test for posix threads specifically as that could be available on APPLE, WIN32, etc, |
| 16:29.57 | mafm | I see |
| 16:33.11 | brlcad | it's a little more work, but it's the maintainable approach |
| 16:33.31 | brlcad | actually ends up making the logic somewhat simpler overall |
| 16:33.55 | brlcad | otherwise you end up needing to add version checks per platform that quickly can get messy |
| 16:35.13 | brlcad | good catch on the src/data move .. I swear I'd checked to make sure it wasn't in src when you originally committed :) |
| 16:35.22 | mafm | but I guess that it can be cascated with the libraries? |
| 16:35.40 | brlcad | ~dict cascate |
| 16:35.48 | mafm | cascade* |
| 16:35.56 | mafm | i.e. my program doesn't include any X file at all |
| 16:36.08 | brlcad | that's a good thing! :) |
| 16:36.17 | brlcad | hopefully never will |
| 16:37.55 | brlcad | not sure what you mean by cascaded though, data resources are generally not tied to libraries |
| 16:39.02 | mafm | that I don't need to test for X in specifically in my program, that's up to OGRE |
| 16:39.33 | mafm | if OGRE builds fine or there's OGRE installed in the system, I don't have to care |
| 16:42.50 | brlcad | oh |
| 16:42.58 | brlcad | eh, that was just an example, like the posix threads |
| 16:43.08 | brlcad | it could be any bit of functionality |
| 16:43.48 | brlcad | the point being to test for the functionality at configure time, not some concept of a system that is supposed to have that functionality |
| 16:45.33 | brlcad | so in the case of ogre creating platform-specific windows, the "feature" is the windowing system they're requiring |
| 16:51.54 | mafm | well, but I mean that OGRE does that by itself |
| 16:52.10 | mafm | so I don't have to do it again for the program, I hope? |
| 16:59.46 | brlcad | if ogre does it by itself, then you don't need to do any checks at all theoretically |
| 17:00.18 | brlcad | I'm saying in the code *you* write and the checks you find you need to perform, there shouldn't be system tests |
| 17:06.16 | mafm | but in example for RBGui they want in general the platform |
| 17:06.47 | mafm | so they abstract some operations (directory listing, mouse cursos, etc) all together |
| 17:07.21 | mafm | so in principle that has to be treated as a whole |
| 17:08.35 | ``Erik | (bowling alley, ya didn't miss much) |
| 17:09.48 | ``Erik | one of the big benefits from moving to cake to autotools was the ability to reference feature instead of OS, suddenly a lot of '#ifdef IRIX_6" went away and suddenly a bunch of new platforms could be built on O.o |
| 17:13.18 | brlcad | mafm: understood and expected, lots of projects still perform platform assumptions -- we don't |
| 17:13.32 | brlcad | unless absolutely necessary, or some other really good justification |
| 17:13.48 | brlcad | I guess I'd have to see an example where you think it's needed |
| 17:13.59 | clock_ | unless relatively necessary? |
| 17:14.17 | brlcad | as it almost never really is, even when you're using 3rd party libs that make the assumptions |
| 17:14.24 | clock_ | I just found one thing in my code which doesn't work properly because it wasn't implemented |
| 17:14.33 | clock_ | Things seem to work somewhat better when they are implemented |
| 17:14.33 | mafm | well, the one that I explained is |
| 17:14.43 | mafm | RBGui does those assumptions |
| 17:14.54 | clock_ | brlcad: do you know Spanish? |
| 17:15.30 | mafm | clock_: it depends on the programmer, though |
| 17:15.37 | clock_ | brlcad: I have to finish the BRL-CAD film, not because I should, but because it gives me a nice famililar feeling, unlike say, going wakeboarding |
| 17:18.20 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 17:23.23 | brlcad | mafm: yes, I understand that rbgui makes those assumptions but that has nothing to do with your use and an actual problem encountered codewise |
| 17:23.41 | brlcad | clock_: si |
| 17:24.09 | clock_ | brlcad: is spanish complicate language to learn? |
| 17:24.29 | brlcad | not really, very nicely structured language, not too many irregular rules |
| 17:24.40 | clock_ | brlcad: does it have flexion like german? |
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| 17:25.34 | mafm | well, the only thing that I need at the moment about platforms is that |
| 17:25.41 | andrecastelo | hi guys |
| 17:25.45 | mafm | the rest of my code doesn't need anything special |
| 17:25.47 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 17:26.22 | brlcad | mafm: then let me be more specific, because we're not getting to the point it seems |
| 17:26.30 | brlcad | what makes you say you need it? |
| 17:26.33 | brlcad | specifically |
| 17:28.13 | mafm | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/1EsPdG86.html -- this piece of code |
| 17:30.17 | brlcad | okay, that's more concrete, so rbgui has broken out some level of interface by platform (and cursor (input?) control) into headers and those in turn imply some set of functionality7 |
| 17:30.45 | brlcad | what does posix actually mean to them? |
| 17:31.16 | brlcad | as macs are posix compliant as are some portions of windows even with the right settings |
| 17:31.25 | mafm | the cursor bit is to disable the regular cursor when you're inside the GL window |
| 17:31.44 | brlcad | okay, why does only WIN32 do that? |
| 17:32.47 | mafm | I'm not sure of the details yet |
| 17:32.53 | brlcad | k |
| 17:32.59 | brlcad | so back to the example |
| 17:33.02 | mafm | in example the POSIX thing is mostly empty |
| 17:33.19 | mafm | that's why the auto-repeat with keyboard wasn't working, in example |
| 17:33.55 | brlcad | in that particular case with those headers, the usual way would be to break out the interface per platform per file, so you can push the platform type up into the build system |
| 17:34.13 | clock_ | erbbut cygwin isn't posix compliant even in places where they claim to |
| 17:34.15 | brlcad | so on windows, you build the windows sources |
| 17:34.36 | brlcad | and the file would be limited to exactly just what is needed to encapsulate rbgui's concept of a platform |
| 17:34.58 | brlcad | otherwise it's going to cascade a need for platform types throughout the app |
| 17:37.50 | brlcad | if that snippet is from a file that is supposed to be that encapsulating wrapper and the intent is to keep it simple with just one or two files, it should still be tied to what a platform means to rbgui -- which is likely some ui featureset that could be captured with platform-centric ui tests |
| 17:38.44 | brlcad | e.g. instead of testing sytem==apple, you'd test for the IOKit framework or some other Mac framework that they require |
| 17:39.17 | brlcad | as that implicitly is tied to the platform, but is a test for the feature rbgui is assuming as part of the platform |
| 17:39.50 | mafm | sheesh |
| 17:40.22 | mafm | can I defer this for a bit later? :) |
| 17:41.43 | brlcad | except later will never come, I'd bet on it :) |
| 17:42.04 | brlcad | this is the kind of feature creep that becomes a maintenance nightmare in five to ten years |
| 17:42.49 | mafm | well yes, but RBGui looks fine and all that, but I'd like to test it more because it still can have some hard edges that prevent us from using it |
| 17:42.54 | brlcad | in the process of undoing years of that sort of propagation on the main codebase, very time-consuming and costly now -- moreso than it would have been to do it right up front |
| 17:43.31 | mafm | apart from that I want to get this running soon so everybody can test |
| 17:43.36 | brlcad | that's fair enough, though it should be decided by the midpoint if it's to be used |
| 17:43.56 | brlcad | then make a TODO entry with that at the top |
| 17:44.08 | brlcad | it needs to be done (during gsoc) if rbgui is going to stay |
| 17:47.04 | mafm | oki |
| 17:59.20 | mafm | can I pass some variable (data directory) when compiling? kind of g++ -DDATA_DIR=path... |
| 17:59.49 | mafm | or only the symbol can be defined (DATA_DIR) but no content, as is usually the case with DEBUG and the like? |
| 18:00.02 | mafm | I can't get examples with google :S |
| 18:14.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31430 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/oed/oed.xml: Add some tweaks suggested by Paul tanenbaum, add acknowledgements. |
| 18:21.08 | brlcad | mafm: use bu_brlcad_data("data", 0); |
| 18:22.01 | brlcad | that'll give you a configure-time, compile-time, and run-time hook that can be overridden for finding resources |
| 18:22.47 | brlcad | by default, it'll find data in the current directory, if you want compile-time path, you'd define BRLCAD_DATA to your install path |
| 18:24.09 | brlcad | and to do that, it's just what you showed, a CPPFLAG of -DVAR to just "set" it and -DVAR="VALUE" to set it to a specific value |
| 18:24.58 | brlcad | e.g. -DBRLCAD_DATA=/usr/local/share/rt^3/data |
| 18:41.45 | mafm | sigh |
| 18:41.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31431 10/brlcad/trunk/ (23 files in 5 dirs): Shift oed to tutorials subdirectory |
| 18:41.58 | mafm | OGRE is segfaulting now and I don't know why |
| 18:52.00 | mafm | yay, now it works \o/ |
| 19:00.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31432 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (book/ book/README book/book.xml catalog.xml): Add test book file which demonstrates method of combining documents to make a new document - technique testing ONLY at this point |
| 19:01.27 | brlcad | woot! |
| 19:09.15 | mafm | brlcad: what's the mime type for ttf? they don't have an own type |
| 19:09.27 | mafm | application/x-font is for others |
| 19:09.35 | mafm | application/x-font pfa pfb gsf pcf pcf.Z |
| 19:13.09 | brlcad | mm, checking |
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| 19:15.37 | brlcad | looks like it's just application/octet-stream |
| 19:15.49 | brlcad | there is nothing official registered from what I can see |
| 19:17.46 | mafm | yep |
| 19:18.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31433 10/rt^3/trunk/data/g3d/RBGui/ (59 files in 7 dirs): Submitting data for RBGui (fonts, decorations, shaders...) |
| 19:18.05 | brlcad | adds .ttf to the sample |
| 19:20.39 | mafm | good |
| 19:21.14 | brlcad | andrecastelo: finally testing rtarea, nice work on the surface :) |
| 19:21.22 | brlcad | now to just figure out why it doesn't actually work :) |
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| 19:27.26 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/jZlpIy41.html |
| 19:27.43 | IriX64 | cheers :) |
| 19:27.46 | *** part/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177871429.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:30.55 | brlcad | one of only a handful of people that really make me wish there was a way I could reach through their monitors to slap them |
| 19:32.17 | starseeker | heh |
| 19:37.10 | starseeker | wonders why subversion doesn't check mime types BEFORE uploading all the file data (and then throwing it out when it doesn't like something) |
| 19:41.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31434 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx CMakeLists.txt): Making it work with CMake in a relatively clean fashion. |
| 19:48.35 | mafm | brlcad: do you happen to have the rest of the libraries working (OGRE, RBGui...)? |
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| 20:01.35 | brlcad | starseeker: put in a feature request :) |
| 20:02.04 | brlcad | course the answer is probably because it's a post-commit-hook instead of a pre-commit-hook |
| 20:02.12 | brlcad | and we have no (easy) control over that |
| 20:02.30 | brlcad | mafm: nope |
| 20:02.40 | mafm | I see |
| 20:02.43 | brlcad | was waiting for you to give the thumbs up :) |
| 20:02.50 | brlcad | when it's integrated cleanly |
| 20:03.22 | mafm | cleanly it is -- but you have to have them installed :D |
| 20:03.23 | brlcad | I'm itching to try it |
| 20:20.01 | starseeker | whips out his Quake railgun and starts blasting away at mime types |
| 20:22.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31435 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/ (37 files in 4 dirs): Add docbook dtd files |
| 20:29.54 | mafm | I go now |
| 20:29.57 | mafm | bye |
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| 20:54.07 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.51.90) | |
| 20:54.28 | andrecastelo | hi again |
| 20:54.55 | andrecastelo | brlcad: sorry, had to leave earlier.. rtarea is outputting wrong info ? |
| 20:57.17 | brlcad | al zeros |
| 20:57.58 | brlcad | should also probably be a separate section for formatting compatibility |
| 20:58.20 | brlcad | rtarea could use some formatting love like starseeker added to nirt |
| 21:02.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31436 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (. VERSION): Add xsl directory - do this piecemeal so it actually works. |
| 21:04.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31437 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (13 files): Add rest of top level xsl files |
| 21:05.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31438 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (101 files in 3 dirs): Add rest common, docsrc, eclipse |
| 21:13.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31439 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (425 files in 20 dirs): Add epub, extensions, fo |
| 21:16.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31440 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (76 files in 3 dirs): Add highlighting, html, htmlhelp |
| 21:17.38 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31441 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (126 files in 5 dirs): Add images javahelp lib manpages |
| 21:23.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31442 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (784 files in 16 dirs): Add params profiling roundtrip slides |
| 21:26.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31443 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/ (140 files in 5 dirs): add template tests website xhtml xhtml-1_1 |
| 22:14.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31444 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Added more headers and removed some extern declarations. Added file writing in view_pixel(), based on rt's view_pixel() as suggested by ``Erik. |
| 22:15.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31445 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: general efficiency improvements; remove unnecessary debug logging code |
| 22:16.57 | pacman87 | rt is ~6% faster now |
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| 00:47.34 | brlcad | pacman87: neat |
| 01:37.10 | brlcad | if anyone wants to get on the .de server and already has a .bz account, just lemme know |
| 01:42.50 | yukonbob | lots of committing to docbook... |
| 01:42.56 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:43.57 | brlcad | yeah, that's a about 1000 files more than I thought it was going to be :) |
| 01:44.37 | brlcad | starseeker: you should run distcheck if you haven't |
| 01:47.06 | yukonbob | reads scrollback, for .de server desc, and whatever else crops up... |
| 01:49.29 | yukonbob | heh -- IriX64 was here and I missed him |
| 01:55.01 | yukonbob | brlcad: what is this .de server about? |
| 02:58.13 | brlcad | yukonbob: ah, I have another dedicated host over in germany |
| 02:58.35 | brlcad | it doesn't have a fqdn yet, so I just call it the .de server |
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| 03:27.34 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i want one! |
| 03:27.48 | PrezKennedy | logs in every once in awhile to brush up on his unix commands |
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| 04:11.22 | starseeker | svn updates and runs distcheck to see what he busted this time... |
| 04:20.50 | starseeker | brlcad: Let me know if that's too much |
| 04:20.56 | starseeker | in docbook I mean |
| 04:23.02 | brlcad | might want to reduce the binary, maybe nix examples |
| 04:23.25 | brlcad | and the testing framework if it doesn't get us anything |
| 04:24.29 | starseeker | no problem - I was a bit rushed there at the end of the day |
| 04:24.49 | starseeker | is definitely in favor of trimming to the minimum, once he figures out what said minimum is |
| 04:25.46 | brlcad | k |
| 04:25.55 | brlcad | no rush to trim |
| 04:27.42 | starseeker | keeps eye on distcheck build, misses super-powered machines at work |
| 04:35.17 | starseeker | brlcad: What would you recommend as a good example of a journal-style CSG modeling paper? Are there any particularly good examples to learn from in terms of styling, information to present, etc? |
| 04:45.39 | poolio | rt^ 3 |
| 04:45.47 | poolio | I had to test that...and I failed :( |
| 04:45.54 | poolio | Also, alloo all. |
| 04:47.28 | starseeker | distcheck failed, but not where I was thinking it would: |
| 04:47.32 | starseeker | ../../../src/rt/scanline.c:26:22: error: scanline.h: No such file or directory |
| 04:56.07 | starseeker | tweaks... |
| 04:59.15 | brlcad | poolio: heh |
| 04:59.46 | brlcad | starseeker: that'd be a file missing from the Makefile.am, header missing from noinst_HEADERS in that case |
| 05:00.52 | brlcad | starseeker: I finally read some of paul's note -- he is right about the subtraction -- once you subtraced the sphere from the cylinder on the lollipop, that included the core and the stick |
| 05:01.02 | brlcad | a nitpick overlooked detail, but valid |
| 05:01.42 | brlcad | they're needed for the first part, just not the seond |
| 05:04.27 | brlcad | his reason for the pull command is semi bogus .. a pull command would be awesome, just mildly more complicated to implement properly |
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| 05:16.33 | poolio | heh, .de seems faster than .bz |
| 05:22.06 | brlcad | it is |
| 05:22.25 | brlcad | faster everything (net pipe, disks, cpu, ..) |
| 05:22.45 | brlcad | and cheaper! ze crazy germans |
| 05:24.51 | poolio | sweet :) |
| 05:27.05 | brlcad | should totally make that a freenode node or mirror for something when it's configured |
| 05:28.43 | PrezKennedy | it also doesnt have anything on it... |
| 05:28.47 | PrezKennedy | probably helps a bit |
| 05:28.47 | PrezKennedy | :P |
| 05:40.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31446 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx History.h): break out the History class into its own file, plus some comment cleanup |
| 05:41.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31447 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiConsole.h: comment/header cleanup |
| 05:41.08 | brlcad | that too |
| 05:46.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31448 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Logger.cxx: ws |
| 05:48.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31449 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx History.h): get rid of using namespace std -- conventionally/intentionally use std:: scope on all stl types to make the code universally unambiguous. also fix ws indentation. |
| 05:50.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31450 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/main.cxx: ws + header |
| 06:38.23 | brlcad | starseeker: at a quick glance, it looks like the epub subtree could probably go (ebook format) .. it's about 25 MB of "stuff" that wouldn't be high on the priority list anytime soon |
| 06:40.36 | brlcad | that was all I noticed at a glance |
| 06:46.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31451 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pc_solver.cpp: ws and header cleanup, intentionally do not use 'using namespace std;' in order to make the usages of stl classes unambiguous |
| 06:46.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31452 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pc_solver.h: ws and header cleanup, intentionally do not use 'using namespace std;' in order to make the usages of stl classes unambiguous |
| 06:49.50 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31453 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): ws |
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| 08:52.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31454 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): Class definitions for constraint solver: Interval, Domain, and Variable in pc_solver.h; Code beautification/indentation to be done |
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| 10:53.27 | mafm | hey |
| 11:11.36 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 11:17.02 | mafm | sigh |
| 11:17.14 | mafm | I could do better, but not very bad |
| 11:19.53 | mafm | have to go out for a bit |
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| 12:43.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31455 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/standard/xsl/epub/: Remove epub xsl files - not high priority output target, large amount of stuff (per Sean's suggestion) |
| 13:01.12 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.51.90) | |
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| 13:01.51 | andrecastelo | morning all |
| 13:05.41 | mafm | morning andrecastelo |
| 13:19.00 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.183) | |
| 14:02.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31456 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Since MUVES3 was not using the asynchronous capabilities, simplified this library to eliminate pthreads, queues, and most of the locking. These changes were also suggested by Ron and Erik. |
| 14:03.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31457 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/loop.c: added -c argument to loop.c so as to support characters |
| 16:03.45 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 16:04.43 | homovulgaris | hi all |
| 16:04.46 | homovulgaris | pacman87: how is it going ;) |
| 16:06.06 | homovulgaris | mafm: how do i see g3d :) i did a make in rt^3 trunk.. but i guess i need to do much more ? |
| 16:08.23 | homovulgaris | loves the tropics and the monsoon : enjoying the rain for the last 36 hours ( non-stop) |
| 17:09.48 | poolio | brlcad: So I'm a bit confused about working with nmgs...to retrieve say, all the vertices, do I just repeatedly call the macros and that will properly manipulate the indices? Or is it that each vertex is an element in a linked list that I can iterate over? |
| 17:36.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31458 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/tutorials/oed/oed.xml: Fix to lollipop model suggested by Paul Tanenbaum |
| 17:52.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31459 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/tutorials/oed/ (README oed.xml): Point dtd reference to new location, add note on xsltproc conversion |
| 17:56.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31460 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/Makefile.am: Add scanline.h to noinst_HEADERS, per Sean |
| 18:13.02 | pacman87 | is there documentation somewhere on how to use sketch/extrude? |
| 18:13.34 | mafm | homovulgaris: I need to upload OGRE and the rest of libraries |
| 18:17.04 | mafm | brlcad: what's "ws" of your commit comments? |
| 18:17.11 | pacman87 | whitespace |
| 18:20.03 | mafm | I see |
| 18:21.18 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 18:21.41 | homovulgaris | mafm: didnt svn diff show that ? |
| 18:22.04 | mafm | there are more changes than that |
| 18:26.42 | homovulgaris | what changes i see only corresponding line addition and removals ( svn diff -r 31453:31452 right ? ) , code style standardization of my files :) |
| 18:29.03 | mafm | there are 5 commits or so |
| 18:30.38 | homovulgaris | oh ok u meant all the commits together.. :) hows the ogre hacking going btw ;) |
| 18:31.28 | mafm | there are the comment "ws" in 2 or 3 of them, and in some it's not only that |
| 18:32.07 | mafm | the hacking of OGRE is not an issue, the hacking of the GUI libraries (RBGui) is |
| 18:32.28 | mafm | I offered to the guys to maintain that in their server, a week or more ago, but no reply |
| 18:32.30 | mafm | :( |
| 18:32.50 | mafm | it's much better to do it that way than having to maintain private patches |
| 18:33.16 | mafm | apart from the obvious "useful for everyone, not just us" because it simplifies the process of building it from our side |
| 18:39.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31461 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added GED_INIT |
| 18:41.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31462 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/setup.c: Temporarily comment out the E command. |
| 18:51.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31463 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (chgmodel.c chgtree.c cmd.c): Use GED_INIT initialize ged. |
| 18:52.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31464 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Use GED_INIT to initialize ged. |
| 18:55.48 | homovulgaris | mafm: hmm .. why dont they have a irc channel :P |
| 19:02.11 | mafm | they don't even have proper website |
| 19:04.26 | mafm | http://www.rightbraingames.com/ |
| 19:04.39 | mafm | you have to go to http://www.rightbraingames.com/tech/ to actually see something |
| 19:11.05 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-81-222.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:13.38 | homovulgaris | RBG stands for Right Brain Games :O :) ? |
| 19:14.06 | prasad1 | the new brlcad gui is built using rbgui? |
| 19:17.05 | homovulgaris | afaik yes :) mafm: so ogre provides the rendering functionality which u would be accessing via rbgui ? i mean rbgui basically provides ui elements and management right ? or does it act as a layer above ogre for everything ? |
| 19:18.26 | homovulgaris | prasad1: u are from india :) ? |
| 19:18.42 | prasad1 | close, sri lanka |
| 19:19.21 | homovulgaris | closer ;) . my home is in kerala :) i am right now more near Bangladesh though |
| 19:19.40 | prasad1 | ah cool |
| 19:19.45 | homovulgaris | would love to visit Sri Lanka sometime |
| 19:20.10 | prasad1 | most of us have origins in kerala |
| 19:20.11 | prasad1 | :) |
| 19:22.53 | homovulgaris | wow :) I thought it was more tamil-esque :) |
| 19:23.07 | prasad1 | who? SL? |
| 19:23.14 | prasad1 | 70% majority is sinhalese |
| 19:23.37 | homovulgaris | k |
| 19:23.49 | prasad1 | it's not well known but most anthropologists say the sinhalese ppl are from kerala |
| 19:23.58 | prasad1 | 20% tamils from tamil nadu |
| 19:24.32 | homovulgaris | interesting :) I know pretty little about my neighbour i realise |
| 19:25.47 | homovulgaris | hmm.. i should be back in Kerala soon.. end of the month .. home after 2 years :) |
| 19:25.57 | prasad1 | then again most ppl believe a story about a prince and crew from a mythical kingdom in northern india |
| 19:26.04 | prasad1 | cool |
| 19:26.11 | mafm | homovulgaris: yes, RBG stands for that... would be funny BDGui though |
| 19:26.13 | mafm | :P |
| 19:26.14 | prasad1 | my mother in law is from kerala |
| 19:26.29 | homovulgaris | pacman87: did u find anything on sketch and extrude ? |
| 19:26.43 | homovulgaris | prasad1: nice :) |
| 19:26.47 | mafm | RBgui only provides windows and widgets |
| 19:26.58 | mafm | you have to inject the input from ogre (keyboard, mouse, whatever) |
| 19:27.13 | mafm | for displaying geometries and all that, OGRE will be used directly |
| 19:27.21 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. |
| 19:28.09 | prasad1 | we might visit kerala next year |
| 19:28.24 | homovulgaris | I have only used libcairo before for output.. 0 knowledge about openGL, ogre et al :) rendering stuff must be fun :) |
| 19:28.51 | prasad1 | heh not really |
| 19:29.00 | homovulgaris | prasad1: If you come near cochin let me know maybe we could meet up :) |
| 19:30.12 | prasad1 | heh cool |
| 19:30.31 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: no, unfortunately |
| 19:31.29 | pacman87 | http://www.nabble.com/-brlcad---Developers--QCAD-integration-inside-BRL-CAD--td5495294.html |
| 19:31.40 | pacman87 | did anything ever come from that? |
| 19:36.51 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. |
| 19:53.23 | homovulgaris | pacman87: i cant locate the code for sketch type in mged/typein |
| 19:53.23 | homovulgaris | how are we supposed to add sketches anyways :O |
| 19:53.42 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: that's what i was wondering, too |
| 19:54.42 | pacman87 | read primitives/sketch/sketch.c import/export functions, and write your own binary file to conform to that standard? |
| 19:54.45 | pacman87 | :) |
| 20:22.42 | mafm | going home now, take care guys :) |
| 20:25.23 | homovulgaris | pacman87: I guess there must be some system of inserting sketch if not via mged |
| 20:25.41 | pacman87 | i dl'd and complied qcad |
| 20:25.46 | homovulgaris | otherwise how would they have tested during development of extrude |
| 20:26.29 | pacman87 | make a simple sketch, saved as .dxf |
| 20:26.43 | pacman87 | now i'm trying to figure how to import that to brl-cad |
| 20:26.50 | homovulgaris | dxf-g now :) ? |
| 20:28.26 | homovulgaris | conv/dxf-g should do that work shouldnt it ? |
| 20:28.31 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 20:28.49 | pacman87 | /usr/brlcad/bin/dxg-g input.dxf output.g |
| 20:28.55 | pacman87 | *dxf-g |
| 20:29.09 | homovulgaris | yep :) |
| 20:30.14 | pacman87 | although the conversion switches everything to line segments |
| 20:36.18 | homovulgaris | hmm supporting splines would be a functional addition to dxf-g.. but if dxf import is the only method of adding a sketch, we should concentrate on providing make sketch functionality within mged / brlcad |
| 20:36.35 | homovulgaris | though i guess specifying bsplines using commandline would be pretty tedious |
| 20:37.50 | pacman87 | yeah, the sketch primitive has line segments, circular arcs, bezier splines and nurb |
| 21:06.22 | starseeker | woot - make distcheck succeeded |
| 21:07.25 | homovulgaris | is taking a nap |
| 21:07.58 | starseeker | and the tarball didn't suck up the dtd and xsl dirs |
| 21:08.03 | starseeker | breaths a sigh of relief |
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| 22:11.43 | brlcad | pacman87: nope, absolutely nothing came of it -- erosenst had a few questions, but never got to trying afaik |
| 22:12.14 | pacman87 | brlcad: how are sketches made in brlcadA? |
| 22:12.25 | brlcad | through the sketch editor |
| 22:12.56 | brlcad | Create -> sketch |
| 22:13.19 | pacman87 | yeah, i'm still using classic mode ;) |
| 22:13.32 | brlcad | ahh, then somewhat tough :) |
| 22:13.48 | brlcad | you can create an empty one with "make sketch sketch" |
| 22:13.54 | brlcad | but that's certainly not useful |
| 22:14.03 | pacman87 | i tried that, but it crashed |
| 22:14.10 | brlcad | oh? |
| 22:14.16 | brlcad | sounds like a bug that needs fixing |
| 22:14.17 | brlcad | oooh |
| 22:14.19 | brlcad | right |
| 22:14.44 | brlcad | there was a bit that bob committed just yesterday (or day before) that broke the 'make' command and a slew of other mged commands |
| 22:14.51 | brlcad | he's working on it now |
| 22:14.57 | pacman87 | ok |
| 22:15.14 | brlcad | if you revert libged and mged dirs to friday, it should work |
| 22:15.27 | pacman87 | i got the import workign from qcad .dxf, so i have a sample sketch to play with |
| 22:15.27 | brlcad | or you can add the one-liner that makes it not crash |
| 22:15.37 | brlcad | ah, even better |
| 22:15.39 | pacman87 | unfortunately, the import is just line segments |
| 22:16.53 | brlcad | do they enclose an area? |
| 22:17.11 | pacman87 | yes |
| 22:17.29 | pacman87 | my original sketch had two lines and an arc |
| 22:17.38 | pacman87 | the arc was approximated using line segments on import |
| 22:17.43 | brlcad | ahh |
| 22:32.28 | brlcad | pacman87: I'll make a sample sketch for you |
| 22:32.32 | brlcad | gimmie a sec |
| 22:33.20 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/sketch.g |
| 22:34.20 | brlcad | that's a sketch that has all of the basic entities (circle, arc, line, and two bezier curves) |
| 22:34.35 | brlcad | with an extrude that shows it |
| 22:34.42 | pacman87 | ok, thanks |
| 22:34.48 | brlcad | which for some reason is god-aweful slow here |
| 22:35.04 | brlcad | some semaphore contention .. lemme know if it's slow for you |
| 22:35.30 | pacman87 | what part is slow? |
| 22:36.13 | brlcad | the ray-trace |
| 22:36.19 | brlcad | I think it's because of the two beziers |
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| 22:36.50 | brlcad | they invoke malloc/free a few dozen/hundred times per ray as part of their evaluation... |
| 22:36.53 | brlcad | utterly horrible |
| 22:37.00 | brlcad | was never optimized |
| 22:37.07 | pacman87 | can't that be moved to prep()? |
| 22:37.09 | brlcad | should never alloc during a shotline |
| 22:37.16 | brlcad | of course! :) |
| 22:37.19 | brlcad | or not done at all |
| 22:37.28 | brlcad | in this case, it could probably go away entirely |
| 22:38.21 | brlcad | fyi, if you run g2asc, you can see the basic structure and could use that to make your own sketches with a text edtior |
| 22:38.53 | brlcad | there's a VL vertex list followed by a SL segment list that defines the thing |
| 22:39.04 | brlcad | very simple |
| 22:39.36 | brlcad | the dxf-g should just preserve the entities instead of turning them all into line segments |
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| 02:21.19 | yukonbob | hello, cadhead |
| 02:21.21 | yukonbob | *s |
| 02:21.32 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 02:21.41 | yukonbob | hey pacman87, how're tricks? |
| 02:21.51 | pacman87 | tricks? |
| 02:22.19 | yukonbob | *How're things going? |
| 02:23.04 | pacman87 | pretty good, hyp is just about finished, and i'm starting to research for rev/sweep |
| 02:23.16 | pacman87 | you? |
| 02:24.07 | yukonbob | oh... I'm tuckered out. Long hours... no time to geek out w/ BRL-CAD, unfortunately... and I _need_ to so I can get the latest revs building/running nicely... |
| 02:24.20 | yukonbob | but I'm alive, so that's good. |
| 02:24.31 | yukonbob | (some might disagree) |
| 02:30.42 | dtidrow | heh |
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| 06:58.46 | homovulgaris | wakes up after 9 hours of sleep |
| 06:58.56 | homovulgaris | that was a long nap :P |
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| 07:03.26 | brlcad | heh |
| 07:15.04 | homovulgaris | hi sean, didnt see rossberg |
| 07:15.21 | brlcad | ~seen rossberg |
| 07:15.24 | ibot | rossberg <n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 448d 16h 32m 32s ago, saying: 'brlcad: sorry, "fmax" is missing on ftp.brlcad.org'. |
| 07:15.29 | brlcad | ~seen drossberg |
| 07:15.30 | ibot | brlcad: i haven't seen 'drossberg' |
| 07:15.33 | brlcad | gr |
| 07:15.40 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 07:15.48 | brlcad | ah |
| 07:15.52 | brlcad | ~seen d_rossberg |
| 07:15.53 | ibot | d_rossberg <n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 1d 19h 51m 39s ago, saying: ' (but not all ;-)'. |
| 07:16.28 | brlcad | homovulgaris: it was more when you get the chance to ask him |
| 07:17.14 | homovulgaris | :) btw, i was planning on using this for the graph representation : http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_35_0/libs/graph/doc/adjacency_list.html |
| 07:17.31 | homovulgaris | but i have to check about defining graph traversal system |
| 07:18.55 | homovulgaris | i hope to be able to make a simple constraint solution search system in the next few days: brute force with simple backtracking |
| 07:19.26 | brlcad | hm, you'd think we'd have a graph structure already |
| 07:19.38 | brlcad | given the CSG hierarchy is a directed acylcic graph |
| 07:20.42 | homovulgaris | hmm.. should check that out then .. would the structure definition be in bu ? |
| 07:20.42 | brlcad | you just might be "in luck" though, I'm not seeing or remembering a specific structure that would help other than our red-black trees (and that's a stretch) |
| 07:21.09 | brlcad | bu, bn, or rt |
| 07:21.15 | brlcad | maybe to a quick search |
| 07:21.22 | brlcad | but I'm not remembering |
| 07:21.28 | brlcad | good question for daytona if you see him |
| 07:21.45 | brlcad | though I think the answer is still no |
| 07:21.53 | homovulgaris | k. i'll mail him , update wiki |
| 07:22.15 | brlcad | good idea, copy the devel list |
| 07:22.24 | brlcad | (if you mail him) |
| 07:22.43 | homovulgaris | and the idea of rt_params was to just get the set of parameters.. constraint return would be via pc_constraint_import |
| 07:23.21 | brlcad | I meant implicit constraints that all primitives have |
| 07:23.36 | brlcad | like how a sphere has implicit constraints that a==b==c |
| 07:23.39 | homovulgaris | to set the parameters i was thinking of adding another function.. but that seems unnecessary.. i should integrate it to params itself ? |
| 07:23.43 | brlcad | where a,b,c are the params |
| 07:23.49 | homovulgaris | yeah implicit constraints ofcourse |
| 07:24.06 | brlcad | hm? |
| 07:24.07 | homovulgaris | i mean implicit constraints would be returned by rt_*_params |
| 07:24.13 | brlcad | ah, okay |
| 07:24.21 | brlcad | so some way to delineate between the two |
| 07:25.33 | homovulgaris | two ? u mean set / return ? |
| 07:25.49 | brlcad | yeah, the set being returned |
| 07:26.24 | homovulgaris | hey sean, what is the convention .. right now i have all the method definitions for the classes inside .h files .. should i shift them to .cpps ? |
| 07:26.30 | homovulgaris | with one file for each class ? |
| 07:26.35 | brlcad | i mean you're either making two functions, one for parameters and one for the primitive constraints, or one func that returns both with a means to distinguish which is a parameter and which is a constraint |
| 07:27.43 | homovulgaris | the idea of params() right now is to return both parameters and constraints while distinguishing between both.. |
| 07:27.44 | brlcad | homovulgaris: that's not so much a matter of convention as it is intent -- if you don't intend them to be inlined, they should probably go into a cpp |
| 07:28.04 | brlcad | and the .h then just describes and documents the class/methds |
| 07:28.18 | brlcad | okay, that's what I though |
| 07:28.19 | homovulgaris | k |
| 07:28.31 | brlcad | params() might not be the best name, but I don't have another suggestion :) |
| 07:28.55 | homovulgaris | that can always be changed :) i suck at naming.. even pc sounds crappy ;) |
| 07:29.14 | brlcad | you should try to keep it to one class per file, unless they're a bunch of really small related classes |
| 07:29.43 | brlcad | pc works surprisingly well |
| 07:30.02 | homovulgaris | hmm. right now that .h is around 350 lines without comments.. so i was thinking split it into 2 |
| 07:30.05 | brlcad | and the namespace conflicts on libpc are similarly conveniently very minimal |
| 07:30.22 | brlcad | "that .h"? |
| 07:30.29 | homovulgaris | pc_solver.h |
| 07:31.18 | homovulgaris | will be back after lunch :) |
| 07:31.22 | brlcad | I'd imagine it would necessarily break up |
| 07:31.35 | brlcad | e.g. the generic interval class kinda belongs by itself |
| 07:31.48 | homovulgaris | yeah.. that was my plan |
| 07:31.58 | brlcad | same for domain, etc |
| 07:32.05 | brlcad | you've got a lot of classes in there |
| 07:32.11 | homovulgaris | probably Interval in one.. and Domain and variable together or 3 separate.. |
| 07:32.23 | homovulgaris | some of them have to be removed / upgraded :D |
| 07:32.29 | homovulgaris | i mean the empty ones :) |
| 07:32.42 | brlcad | try to keep it to one unless they really are so tightly coupled to each other that they don't make sense without the other |
| 07:32.59 | brlcad | or if one is effectively just a private class that another class uses |
| 07:33.14 | brlcad | (akin to a static struct) |
| 07:33.31 | homovulgaris | hmm not exactly i think in the near future we will have inheritances from Interval for example |
| 07:34.01 | brlcad | the inherited classes become domain-specific |
| 07:34.03 | homovulgaris | for discrete intervals or something like that or from Variable for different types |
| 07:34.08 | brlcad | that alone is a good reason to separate |
| 07:34.16 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 07:34.19 | brlcad | if these were broken into sub-libs, Interval is a generic concept |
| 07:34.51 | brlcad | it'd be in some base common library because it's application/domain agnostic |
| 07:34.59 | homovulgaris | I was thinking of adding some more functionality into interval later.. it is a pretty useful concept.. |
| 07:35.01 | brlcad | you only have one lib, so it just gets its own file |
| 07:35.11 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 07:35.39 | homovulgaris | after the minimal implementation of constraint solution search i will work on the stack system for handling constraint representation |
| 07:35.59 | brlcad | if you want to extend something like a BoundingBoxInterval class or something, he'd get his own implementation/header files |
| 07:36.28 | homovulgaris | and when i am stuck with C++ i can add stuff to each of the params/ expand the pc_import etc. |
| 07:36.42 | homovulgaris | ok. |
| 07:37.24 | homovulgaris | and sean, regarding the regression testing on the roots change .. i was confused.. am i supposed to do the testing :) ? |
| 07:37.25 | brlcad | yeah, hooking into a given primitive to use params() and your solver in import or prep would be a really good test of the system |
| 07:38.05 | brlcad | homovulgaris: no, don't worry about that -- focus on libpc |
| 07:38.23 | brlcad | i was going to do the testing |
| 07:38.27 | homovulgaris | i just want to make sure that the whole architecture works for the simple case and then add on features |
| 07:38.36 | homovulgaris | that was about lipbc |
| 07:38.43 | brlcad | you're wouldn't necessarily know exactly what to look for anyways |
| 07:39.01 | brlcad | since it's the portions that relate to ray-trace behaviors that are of concern |
| 07:39.21 | homovulgaris | yeah.. i was thinking about it.. i mean i have 0 knowledge about regression testing.. :) will definitely need to check it out over the year though |
| 07:42.36 | homovulgaris | also presently the Interval class doesnt have sorting depending on optimal nature.. It just sorts according to < operator definition. So if i need to change it in a derived class i can redefine the < operator or write a sort function. |
| 07:43.53 | homovulgaris | which i we will need when we do the solution search selectively over more preferred intervals or to represent preferred solutions |
| 07:44.09 | brlcad | nods |
| 07:44.13 | brlcad | sounds reasonable |
| 07:44.48 | homovulgaris | ok... i'd be back after lunch |
| 07:44.57 | brlcad | happy chowda |
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| 07:50.44 | shazbot | Hi, just heard about the google summer of code.. good luck. Can anyone tell me what the lgpl-ed parts of BRL-cad are? |
| 07:54.34 | brlcad | shazbot: almost the entire source code is lgpl |
| 07:55.11 | brlcad | COPYING has the details |
| 07:55.57 | brlcad | source code is lgpl unless it's not ours to license; build system, documentation, and data files are mostly bsd licensed |
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| 08:36.59 | homovulgaris | is back :) |
| 08:37.17 | homovulgaris | loves chicken |
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| 09:24.05 | mafm | allo |
| 09:38.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31465 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: |
| 09:38.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Added default lights and scanline initializations in view_2init(). Added |
| 09:38.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: scanline freeing in view_end(). Added view_cleanup() function. These functions |
| 09:38.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: are pretty similar to rt's, the big differences will come in rayhit() and in |
| 09:38.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: view_pixel(). |
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| 13:17.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31466 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Add more commands. |
| 13:24.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31467 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (11 files): Initial check-in. |
| 13:27.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31468 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (erase.c erase_all.c illum.c): Initial check-in. |
| 13:34.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31469 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/globals.c: Added FreeSolid. |
| 14:03.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31470 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/bigE.c: Converted to use struct ged. |
| 14:04.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31471 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged_private.h: Added more function declarations and a few struct definitions. |
| 14:10.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31472 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/draw.c: Added ged_draw_guts() and ged_ev(). |
| 14:11.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31473 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/dg_obj.c: Temporarily disable the E command. |
| 14:14.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31474 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declarations for several functions. |
| 14:15.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31475 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added several source files. |
| 14:18.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31476 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: update how to make the ChangeLog |
| 14:19.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31477 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged_private.h: Added include for time.h |
| 14:21.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31478 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged_private.h: common before system header consistency |
| 14:24.04 | pacman87 | morning, all |
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| 14:43.23 | starseeker | go bob go! |
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| 15:43.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31479 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (5 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 15:43.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Proof of concept - the new mged_commands.xml contains a little of the extensive |
| 15:43.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: command appendix in Volume II as a valid stand-alone article, and the |
| 15:43.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: VolumeII.xml here references inside that file to grab the content for inclusion |
| 15:43.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: in its own appendix using XInclude and xpointer. If this technique scales, it |
| 15:43.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: will be possible to break down the volumes into individual valid files that can |
| 15:43.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: be assembled by VolumeII.xml to reproduce (more or less) the original VolumeII |
| 15:53.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31480 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/argv.c): Added bu_argv_from_path. bu_copy_argv and bu_copyinsert_argv changed to bu_dup_argv and bu_dupinsert_argv, respectively. |
| 15:54.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31481 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: bu_copyinsert_argv changed to bu_dupinsert_argv |
| 15:54.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31482 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl: Changed help for dgo_E. |
| 16:42.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31483 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/mged/mged_commands.xml: 2 command explanations and examples added, using glossary docbook markup |
| 16:59.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31484 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/mged/mged_commands.xml: More prep work for glossary, another example |
| 17:06.40 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 17:10.32 | poolio | brlcad: Does it make sense that arb8s are rt_arb and not arb8? |
| 17:34.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31485 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/History.h: Adding header with copyright and so on; and added missing #endif preventing the program from compiling successfully. |
| 17:42.14 | brlcad | poolio: probably not |
| 17:42.55 | brlcad | arb8 used to be g_arb.c -- but for consistency they were all made to match their functab name |
| 17:43.20 | brlcad | for which arb8 actually handles arb8, arb7, arb6, arb5, and arb4 |
| 17:49.33 | poolio | ah oh well. I've decided to work on arb8 instead of arbn :) |
| 17:49.57 | poolio | You've already done most the arb8 work...just need to adjust for equivalent vertices |
| 17:55.15 | brlcad | yeah, the arb8 nmg routine is already in brep form |
| 17:55.28 | brlcad | notes a distinct lack of commits if progress is being made :) |
| 17:56.50 | poolio | brlcad: so calling rt_arb_tess() is probably a good idea here? |
| 17:57.13 | brlcad | up to you :) |
| 17:57.26 | poolio | Also, there are a few places where primites are mentioned as say, "g_arb.c" ... should those be changed to arb8.c? |
| 17:57.26 | brlcad | if you just end up with nearly the same logic, probably |
| 17:57.35 | brlcad | sure |
| 17:58.00 | poolio | Ah k, I will commit when it compiles :) |
| 17:58.31 | brlcad | even better would be to have one "structure" routine for brep/nurb/tess if they're basically the same |
| 17:59.37 | poolio | as in something that went from NMG -> brep? |
| 18:00.47 | poolio | Ah, the one big question I still haven't resolved is how to properly iterate over elements of the NMG. It looks like repeatedly calling the GET routines does it? |
| 18:01.29 | brlcad | something like that -- basically just so there's not two or three copies of logic that do effectively the same thing |
| 18:01.56 | brlcad | mm, I forget how to deal with nmgs |
| 18:02.04 | brlcad | it involves loops |
| 18:02.08 | brlcad | lots of loops |
| 18:02.44 | poolio | ah hmm, I couldn't find anywhere in the code where they repeatedly called GET, but I didn't see any other way to really access them |
| 18:03.31 | brlcad | almost all the converters iterate over nmgs, could check their code out in src/conv |
| 18:03.37 | poolio | ah, thanks |
| 18:04.06 | brlcad | the E and ev commands too |
| 18:04.45 | poolio | Ah hey, I see...it's all fun linked list goodness :) |
| 18:06.00 | brlcad | yep |
| 18:11.31 | mafm | brlcad: so should I commit all the code of my libraries to src/other of my module, right? |
| 18:12.00 | brlcad | mafm: you mean the three dependencies? |
| 18:12.09 | mafm | 4 |
| 18:12.19 | brlcad | oh? who's number 4? |
| 18:12.19 | mafm | ogre, ois, mocha, rbgui |
| 18:12.28 | brlcad | ah, ois isn't part of ogre? |
| 18:12.49 | brlcad | but yeah, to answer your question |
| 18:12.49 | mafm | they decided to remove input support from OGRE about 2 years ago |
| 18:13.10 | brlcad | the first commit should be a clean upstream |
| 18:13.15 | brlcad | i.e. no patches/mods |
| 18:13.19 | brlcad | then commit the mods |
| 18:13.35 | brlcad | so it'll be easier to extract/reapply later if needed as well as to see what changes there are |
| 18:14.08 | mafm | I got a tarball for OIS, but for OGRE has to be some specific revision of the trunk that happened to work a while ago -- today's isn't even compiling :D |
| 18:17.20 | brlcad | awesome |
| 18:17.32 | brlcad | any upstream revision, even from svn/cvs/git/whatever is fine |
| 18:17.55 | brlcad | just annotate their revision in the commit message (e.g. from upstream ogre svn repository, r12345) |
| 18:28.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31486 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ (. Makefile): Commiting other/ subdir and the Makefile |
| 18:29.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31487 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 18:29.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: next release is still a fair bit away given the libged instability, but go ahead |
| 18:29.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: and annotate some of the most pressing issues for the next release as testing |
| 18:29.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: mged, verifying fast4-g for ajem, and fixing the bug tom browder just reported |
| 18:29.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: about the windows installer |
| 18:32.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31488 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: note that dawn added a -c option to the loop command so you can now iterate over characters as well as numbers. makes loop even more similar to the old bsd 'jot' command, but with a better name. |
| 18:36.47 | brlcad | homovulgaris: fyi, your r31454 commit blew away my changes |
| 18:37.12 | mafm | sigh, propsets... |
| 18:37.26 | brlcad | mafm: sup? |
| 18:42.59 | mafm | it's missing like 30 propsets only in ois/ :) |
| 18:46.02 | mafm | hmm, scripts are text/plain, right? xml have to be text/xml or can be text/plain too? |
| 18:46.52 | starseeker | feels mafm's pain |
| 18:47.02 | starseeker | xml should probably be text/xml |
| 18:48.09 | mafm | in my case they don't even name the file .xml |
| 18:48.26 | mafm | it's some random msvc/mac stuff :P |
| 18:55.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:55.45 | brlcad | text/plain or test/xml is fine for their stuff |
| 18:55.51 | brlcad | they don't matter as much as our stuff |
| 18:56.41 | mafm | hmmm, and OGRE now doesn't want to build with the old version either, great >:| |
| 18:57.30 | mafm | svn propset svn:eol-style native ois/src/linux/LinuxKeyboard.cpp |
| 18:57.30 | mafm | svn: File 'ois/src/linux/LinuxKeyboard.cpp' has inconsistent newlines |
| 18:57.30 | mafm | svn: Inconsistent line ending style |
| 18:57.56 | alex_joni | run dos2unix on it |
| 18:58.25 | mafm | it seems so, now works :) |
| 19:03.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31489 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ois/ (155 files in 29 dirs): Commiting OIS (Object-Oriented Input System) from tarball v1.2.0, no patches needed |
| 19:03.27 | mafm | yay, at last |
| 19:19.48 | mafm | now for OGRE it'll need a few iterations and many minutes of transmissions, I go to watch the football match to the public square |
| 19:19.52 | mafm | :D |
| 19:20.25 | mafm | maybe I won't come back if it's too late, so see you tomorrow then |
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| 19:25.23 | poolio | brlcad: Is there a way to get a list of all vertices in an NMG model? The only way I can think of doing it is going through all the vertexuses |
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| 19:26.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31490 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (ged.c how.c set_transparency.c tree.c): Initial check-in. |
| 19:28.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31491 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libged/qray.c): Changed signature of ged_init_qray(). Added declaration of ged_free_qray. |
| 19:29.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31492 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nirt.c: Mods related to signature change of ged_qray_data_to_vlist. |
| 19:31.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31493 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/ (mged.sh mged.tr): renamed to .sh since it's a shell script archive |
| 19:31.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31494 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nirt.c: Oops! Forgot to change the usage :-). |
| 19:47.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31495 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged.c: Fix miscellaneous descrepancies. Note - this has still not been tested. |
| 19:51.25 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 19:53.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31496 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nirt.c qray.c): After actually compiling and noticing the need for ged_wdbp->dbip the ged_qray_data_to_vlist function has been changed back to using a struct ged. |
| 19:55.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31497 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/Makefile.am: mged.tr was renamed to mged.sh |
| 20:18.38 | brlcad | madant: fyi, your r31454 commit blew away my changes .. (if you missed the earlier note) |
| 20:22.48 | PrezKennedy | why arent you partying?? |
| 20:23.49 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 20:23.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31498 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): added wdb_init() |
| 20:27.31 | homovulgaris | brlcad: sorry.. u mean the ones in solver_test.c ? |
| 20:28.22 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 20:29.06 | homovulgaris | the code indentation right ? hmm.. wait or was it pc_test.. yikes sorry there was a conflict i guess i resolved it wrongly |
| 20:29.55 | homovulgaris | but i didnt commit that in 31454 .. argh.. am confused .. |
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| 00:38.31 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, are you there? |
| 00:38.50 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 00:54.41 | andrecastelo | brlcad: are you there? |
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| 01:31.47 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad I'll need to be out of town for the next 10 or so days, I'll be back by 29th june |
| 01:46.36 | PrezKennedy | we got ourselves a runaway!! |
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| 02:16.44 | brlcad | yowsa! |
| 02:17.06 | brlcad | that's not much of a short notice unless I'm forgetting him mentioning it earlier, hopefully he told erik |
| 02:18.41 | brlcad | homovulgaris: it was a variety of changes including ws, header fixes, and removal of using |
| 02:18.53 | brlcad | you can reapply my changes using svn merge |
| 02:19.26 | brlcad | merge the revisions I applied (fortunatly they were all together so you can just give the range) |
| 02:24.03 | poolio | brlcad: any way to get all vertices in an NMG? I'm about to write a nasty hack to mark which vertices i've already added to the brep but was hoping there was an easier way |
| 02:27.46 | brlcad | poolio: nmg_visit(), set the vis_vertex callback |
| 02:28.31 | brlcad | (iirc) |
| 02:40.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31499 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: annotate that Timothy Van Ruitenbeek fixed a bug in the ehy primitive where it's curve() callback was inexplicably clobbering the computed curvature value. he clobbered the clobbering. |
| 02:40.31 | pacman87 | :) |
| 02:50.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31500 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: for format compatibility, rtarea needs to have the cpa values in their own section otherwise it's going to break some other tools that parse the output. (the cpa values are also coincidentally wrong atm) |
| 04:08.01 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 04:08.40 | pacman87 | howdy, yukonbob |
| 04:08.47 | poolio | ahoy yukonbob, pacman87 |
| 04:08.57 | yukonbob | hey, it's a party |
| 04:23.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31501 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: |
| 04:23.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: prompted by sf bug report 1998145 by tom browder, document a standardized naming |
| 04:23.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: scheme for source and binary releases so that our filenames can be more |
| 04:23.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: consistent. Basically, still use brlcad-version.extension for source |
| 04:23.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: distributions, but consistently using |
| 04:23.38 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: BRL-CAD_version[_optional_other_stuff].extension for binary releases. |
| 04:23.48 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 04:24.22 | yukonbob | hey brlcad -- how's it going? |
| 04:26.26 | brlcad | pretty good |
| 04:26.39 | brlcad | really looking forward to a nice long weekend of coding |
| 04:27.15 | brlcad | has been distracted away from attending to his code gardens |
| 04:27.32 | yukonbob | tries to decipher that last sentence. |
| 04:32.06 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 04:37.34 | yukonbob | has a few projects that need attention too... |
| 04:38.14 | yukonbob | gets ready to hit hay -- this week has been too busy :P |
| 04:41.08 | brlcad | cya through the ethermorning |
| 04:45.11 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 04:45.24 | pacman87 | so apparently my gfx card doesn't like being underclocked |
| 04:48.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31502 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): |
| 04:48.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: make the binary build targets conform to the newly documented filename |
| 04:48.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: convention of using BRL-CAD_ for the prefix instead of BRL-CAD- which lets us |
| 04:48.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: drop the .bin extension convention. (source dists use lower, binaries use upper) |
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| 07:58.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31503 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added who.c |
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| 09:53.49 | mafm | 'lo |
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| 10:43.32 | mafm | brlcad: I keep having problems with the mime types :( |
| 11:07.05 | d_rossberg | mafm: what kind of problems? |
| 11:08.19 | mafm | I have to commit whole OGRE source, and it gives many failures, and the roundtrip is quite high |
| 11:08.45 | mafm | and then sometimes it gives strange errors like .sh not being accepted as application/x-sh |
| 11:09.29 | mafm | because of some binary properties, I can't recall the exact error now |
| 11:10.41 | d_rossberg | i would recommend text/x-sh as mime type for the shell scripts |
| 11:11.23 | d_rossberg | the is what brlcad did in the brlcad trunk |
| 11:11.28 | mafm | well, that's what I tried, but it gives an error... I'll show you after this rountrip finishes |
| 11:12.25 | d_rossberg | you probable need the svn:eol-style native too |
| 11:16.05 | mafm | svn: File 'ogre/SDK/Win32/prepsdkbuild.sh' has binary mime type property |
| 11:18.18 | d_rossberg | ... maybe i have to check out this to see ... |
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| 11:21.40 | mafm | I think that it's that I have to *remove* the eol-style property, not being a text/* |
| 11:22.55 | d_rossberg | i don't think so, a shell script isn't binary, so could you remove the binary property? |
| 11:23.15 | mafm | well, probably being application/* considers it a binary file |
| 11:23.35 | d_rossberg | BTW: the ogre isn't in the brlcad repository yet (?) |
| 11:23.43 | mafm | images and the rest of applications don't have end-of-line |
| 11:24.25 | mafm | and mime-types are a bit inconsistent anyway: it's application/x-sh, but text/x-python... |
| 11:24.28 | mafm | nope it's not |
| 11:25.00 | d_rossberg | the shell scripts in brlcad's main trunk are all text/x-sh |
| 11:25.13 | mafm | text? hmm |
| 11:25.16 | d_rossberg | therefore this should work (and be ok too) |
| 11:25.33 | d_rossberg | yes: text/x-sh |
| 11:25.51 | d_rossberg | with svn:eol-style: native |
| 11:26.21 | brlcad | yeah, shouldn't use application/ for anything |
| 11:26.26 | brlcad | binary types won't diff |
| 11:26.37 | mafm | application/x-sh sh |
| 11:26.44 | mafm | application/x-shellscript |
| 11:26.51 | brlcad | if you can read it with a text editor, it should be text/something |
| 11:26.51 | mafm | text/x-sh sh |
| 11:27.07 | mafm | right, I was using the 1st one |
| 11:27.11 | brlcad | mafm: to svn application/* means handle the fine as binary |
| 11:27.19 | brlcad | s/fine/file/ |
| 11:27.39 | mafm | I see |
| 11:28.51 | brlcad | should really only be using mime types text/* unless it's known image/video data |
| 11:29.33 | mafm | there are lots of crap in here really |
| 11:30.48 | mafm | rtf, in example |
| 11:32.47 | mafm | suo, which no idea of what means |
| 11:33.04 | d_rossberg | what's the problem with rtf? this is a simple text file too |
| 11:36.20 | mafm | text or application? it has both again |
| 11:36.37 | brlcad | 07:26 <@brlcad> if you can read it with a text editor, it should be text/something |
| 11:36.46 | brlcad | text/plain if you don't know |
| 11:36.54 | brlcad | or as a reasonable default |
| 11:37.25 | mafm | never read a RTF since I was in windows, I think :) |
| 11:37.51 | mafm | what about DDS? is there a default image binary type, like octect-stream for applications? |
| 11:41.25 | brlcad | yeah, just use application/octet-stream |
| 11:42.57 | mafm | .xcf (GIMP native format) is application/x-xcf? I have that one in my mime-types, but I think that it should be image/ |
| 11:43.21 | mafm | and in google I can find image/xcf |
| 11:43.56 | brlcad | all of the x- types are basically made up |
| 11:44.09 | brlcad | no different than just using application/octet-stream |
| 11:44.10 | clock_ | application/x-another-obscure-x-type |
| 11:44.52 | clock_ | or application/x-put-the-name-of-your-favourite-proprietary-windows-program-here |
| 11:45.54 | mafm | meh |
| 11:46.51 | brlcad | mafm: basically/especially for all of the src/other codes, if you don't know it or see it, just stick to text/plain and application/octet-stream (preferring text/plain unless you can't read it with a text editor) |
| 12:04.23 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-045-101.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 12:39.26 | starseeker | mafm: I would suggest commiting it in pieces to reduce the roundtrip time, if you're still working on mime issues (unless brlcad wants OGRE uploaded as a unit) |
| 12:53.36 | starseeker | wow - the tex mged manual is over 250 pages |
| 12:53.37 | brlcad | mostly just important to have a clear revision before patches are applied |
| 12:54.17 | starseeker | makes pdf and txt versions so he can use it at work... |
| 12:59.39 | starseeker | flinches at the size of the png images for volII |
| 13:00.23 | starseeker | brlcad: Maybe it would be a better idea to have the docbook live in its own tree rather than inside the brlcad tree? |
| 13:06.39 | mafm | I think that it would be better to commit in one chunk |
| 13:07.27 | mafm | and there are no clear ways to separate the files anyway |
| 13:07.27 | mafm | they're spead evenly through the code |
| 13:09.42 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 13:23.12 | brlcad | thinks mafm might like to learn how to use 'find' |
| 13:24.52 | brlcad | example: find . -name \*.rtf -exec svn propset svn:mime-type text/plain {} \; |
| 13:25.11 | brlcad | or: find . -name \*.rtf -exec svn propset svn:mime-type text/plain {} \; -exec svn propset svn:eol-style native {} \; to set both at the same time |
| 13:25.33 | brlcad | i.e. that finds rtf files in the current subdir recursively applying the mime-types |
| 13:26.10 | brlcad | other variations, find . -name whatever -not -regex '.*svn.*' ... to ignore the svn dir contents |
| 13:30.39 | mafm | yes, I know, I already do that |
| 13:35.39 | mafm | the thing is that there are dozens of different extensions, many of them completely custom or unknown to me at the very least |
| 13:35.48 | mafm | 800+ files to go now :) |
| 13:39.20 | mafm | application/x-msdos-program com exe bat dll |
| 13:39.29 | mafm | bat should be text/plain or this? |
| 13:40.20 | mafm | I know of the viewable-in-your-editor, but it's the only entry which applies |
| 13:50.24 | prasad1 | arrrr |
| 14:15.59 | brlcad | text/plain |
| 14:16.39 | brlcad | mafm: eh, you're not using the sample subversion config file? |
| 14:17.05 | brlcad | that has bat, com, exe, dll, ... |
| 14:18.03 | mafm | I copied many entries, but I think that I commented most of them because it was causing me some problem |
| 14:18.23 | brlcad | oookay.. |
| 14:18.26 | mafm | you know... things like CEGUI have totally made up filename extensions |
| 14:18.35 | mafm | .font, .config, .scheme.... |
| 14:18.41 | mafm | .layout |
| 14:18.46 | mafm | all of them being XML files |
| 14:19.39 | mafm | and Ogre includes dozens of things like that: .def, .fontdef, nsh, nsi, .program, .material, ms, .... |
| 14:20.02 | mafm | some of them being text, other xml, other binary, sometimes with proper extension :) |
| 14:21.07 | brlcad | nsi also in the list :) |
| 14:21.29 | mafm | but my favourites are: ogre/Docs/src/MaterialScriptCopy.inc |
| 14:21.38 | mafm | ogre/Docs/src/sm-redesign/sm-redesign/cpp_includes |
| 14:21.48 | mafm | ogre/Docs/src/umldocs/128095 |
| 14:22.01 | brlcad | nods, not unheard of |
| 14:22.10 | mafm | ogre/Mac/Samples/plist/CelShading-Info.plist |
| 14:22.14 | brlcad | i prefer to keep them as .c for includes myself |
| 14:22.32 | brlcad | plist is a standard file format |
| 14:23.32 | mafm | I guess that for Mac only? |
| 14:24.38 | brlcad | yeah, Mac OS X specific |
| 14:30.57 | mafm | you have it defined without eol-style |
| 14:31.13 | mafm | and as text/plain |
| 14:36.02 | brlcad | I think that was because it depended on what the project intent was |
| 14:36.42 | brlcad | should be native for most |
| 14:47.41 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-187-199.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 14:52.47 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 14:55.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31504 10/brlcad/trunk/ (AUTHORS src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_light.h): |
| 14:55.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: apply tom browder's sf patch 1998134 (Eliminate Warnings from g++ for |
| 14:55.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: opennurbs_light.h) even though we usually leave src/other alone. it's his first |
| 14:55.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: patch. thank him in authorship anyways as he's had several other interactions |
| 14:55.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: filing bug reports and feature requests. |
| 15:01.46 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 ! |
| 15:01.54 | pacman87 | hi brlcad |
| 15:02.09 | brlcad | does a happy weekend dance |
| 15:03.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31505 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: tom's full name |
| 15:07.23 | mafm | does a sleepy after-lunch danczzzzzzz zzz zzzzzzzz |
| 15:12.30 | mafm | yay, 30 files to go |
| 15:33.43 | brlcad | yay |
| 15:39.36 | brlcad | notes that today is day 26 of 85 for GSoC .. this weekend will be 1/3rd through |
| 15:40.50 | prasad1 | dicaprio starring in atari movie as nolan bushnell |
| 15:41.47 | poolio | brlcad: it's not the weekend yet :P |
| 15:48.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31506 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ogre/ (3176 files in 492 dirs): Commiting OGRE from upstream trunk r7565, no patches needed |
| 15:49.25 | brlcad | woot |
| 15:49.28 | brlcad | ~mafm++ |
| 15:59.37 | mafm | lol |
| 16:04.33 | mafm | 39 minutes to commit |
| 16:04.34 | mafm | not bad |
| 16:04.54 | brlcad | heh, nice |
| 16:05.25 | brlcad | updates |
| 16:16.40 | mafm | With mocha, only two patches (that I got from a RPM file) are needed |
| 16:17.04 | mafm | including a header and forward declarating templates or something like that |
| 16:17.23 | mafm | and then I wrote a pkg-config file that I put directly into the destination |
| 16:18.51 | mafm | now, what occurs to me is that I could add the patches, my file; and add a script to apply the patches before compiling it, and copying the file directly after that |
| 16:18.59 | mafm | does it sound ok? |
| 16:19.12 | mafm | (with RBGui the situation is more or less the same) |
| 16:20.35 | brlcad | hm |
| 16:21.00 | brlcad | well, that'd certainly be one way |
| 16:21.11 | brlcad | if that's what you want to do, go for it |
| 16:21.29 | brlcad | I'd probably just apply the changes myself, but it's no more or less effort I think |
| 16:21.55 | brlcad | rather less immedate, but you have to re-find the patch later and reapply if there's an update, so it evens out |
| 16:22.07 | brlcad | vs making a script that continues to work through updates |
| 16:23.11 | mafm | I see |
| 16:23.28 | mafm | I thought that you wanted to have the patches separated |
| 16:23.50 | mafm | indeed applying directly is less cumbersome for maintenance |
| 16:25.28 | brlcad | nope |
| 16:25.35 | brlcad | separate commits |
| 16:25.37 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:25.50 | brlcad | but doesn't need to be preserved as a separate file |
| 16:26.33 | brlcad | we can regenerate the patch if we can find the revisions in the svn log for before/after |
| 16:26.52 | brlcad | that was the reasons to commit pristine, then commit the patch that makes it work |
| 16:26.59 | brlcad | that can be easily recovered |
| 16:27.25 | mafm | I see |
| 16:27.46 | mafm | however, I don't know what's the proper way to create the .pc file -- do you have experience with that? |
| 16:28.17 | mafm | (you as in plural :) ) |
| 16:29.55 | brlcad | you mean like these: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/misc/pkgconfig/ |
| 16:30.59 | brlcad | you'd usually tie them to the build system, the brlcad module's are tied to autoconf |
| 16:32.00 | mafm | hmm |
| 16:32.13 | mafm | so you maintain it independently from the source of the package? |
| 16:32.45 | brlcad | que? |
| 16:33.35 | brlcad | could put the files anywhere really, but for the brlcad module, all build-related files are in misc |
| 16:33.49 | mafm | I mean that it's not "inside" the dir of each library, but instead in a common place |
| 16:33.53 | mafm | what about the external packages, src/other, you don't create .pc files for them? |
| 16:34.08 | brlcad | they could have been in the dir, same difference |
| 16:34.55 | brlcad | just organizationally, most "extra" files are put in misc so that source really is just the sources and whatever is exactly needed to compile them |
| 16:35.12 | brlcad | (i.e. the CMakeLists.txt and/or Makefile.am files) |
| 16:40.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31507 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/mocha/ (126 files in 7 dirs): Importing Mocha (helper library for RBGui, from the same authors), v0.1.3 |
| 16:42.47 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31508 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (10 files in 2 dirs): code reorganization in libpc : division of previous pc_solver.h into pcInterval.h and pcVariable.h; ws, license cleaning, and comment modification |
| 16:44.30 | mafm | ~homovulgaris++ \o/ |
| 16:48.16 | mafm | what does that syntax mean btw, is it something for the bot? |
| 16:48.33 | brlcad | ~karma mafm |
| 16:48.33 | ibot | mafm has karma of 2 |
| 16:48.58 | brlcad | it's a simple "karma" system where you can show that you like/dislike something/someone |
| 16:49.35 | mafm | lol |
| 16:49.36 | brlcad | pretty much pointless as a "system", but it's useful for saying "yay" and fun to watch the numbers accummulate |
| 16:49.44 | mafm | ~karma brlcad |
| 16:49.44 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 16:49.50 | brlcad | mine is hard-coded :) |
| 16:50.08 | mafm | :D |
| 16:50.10 | mafm | why? |
| 16:50.10 | brlcad | ~karma learner |
| 16:50.10 | ibot | learner has karma of 98 |
| 16:50.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31509 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Start breaking Volume II out into individual lessons, begin adding graphics back in. |
| 16:50.24 | brlcad | oh, just Tim having some fun |
| 16:50.28 | brlcad | (ibot's maintainer) |
| 16:50.38 | starseeker | ~karma starseeker |
| 16:50.38 | ibot | starseeker has neutral karma |
| 16:50.43 | starseeker | heh |
| 16:50.48 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 16:51.33 | poolio | ~karma ibot |
| 16:51.33 | ibot | ibot has karma of 24 |
| 16:52.11 | starseeker | notes that breaking up VolII makes checking the markup more managable |
| 16:56.21 | starseeker | heh - brlcad, once unicode support becomes more universal you should hack your ibot karma to return an infinity symbol |
| 16:56.52 | brlcad | ~unicode |
| 16:56.53 | ibot | from memory, unicode is http://qpe.sourceforge.net/packages/ipaq/qpf-cyberbit-120-50-t10_2.3.0-3_arm.ipk or http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/bedic/unifont_160_50_t10.qpf?download, or something ibot doesn't get |
| 16:56.56 | brlcad | aw |
| 16:57.24 | brlcad | ~color |
| 16:57.24 | ibot | 13C12O5L8O9R6! |
| 16:59.14 | archivist | I have seeded karma in my bot and a self karma test for one user! |
| 17:02.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31510 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/mocha/Include/Mocha/ (Compressor.h Stream.h): Patches needed to compile Mocha on GCC 4.x in GNU/Linux systems, at least -- grabbed from RPM by Matt Williams <matt@milliams.com> |
| 17:03.38 | brlcad | woot |
| 17:03.40 | mafm | can you please tell me what's the url you're using with svn info? |
| 17:03.49 | brlcad | tis a day of good progress :) |
| 17:04.21 | brlcad | same as the repository url |
| 17:04.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31511 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/creating_primitive_shapes.xml: tweak output formatting to better match book |
| 17:04.43 | brlcad | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net |
| 17:05.19 | mafm | mmm |
| 17:05.37 | mafm | I switched to https, for security |
| 17:06.03 | mafm | but I'm wondering if it's asking for my password for being with http instead of svn+ssh, as other repositories that I have |
| 17:08.22 | brlcad | oh, you actually meant "svn info"? |
| 17:09.00 | brlcad | I meant that http just for web browsing for info |
| 17:09.16 | brlcad | usual checkout would be |
| 17:09.19 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 17:09.19 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 17:09.51 | brlcad | so for your module, https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/rt^3/trunk rt^3 |
| 17:10.37 | brlcad | sourceforge has pretty extensive docs on the setup and protocols you can use |
| 17:12.11 | prasad1 | when's the next siggraph sean |
| 17:13.18 | brlcad | this year :P |
| 17:13.50 | mafm | yep, but if you are also using https and you can use ssh-keys, then it's not a problem of me alone using this protocol |
| 17:14.04 | prasad1 | i wonder if we'll have a booth |
| 17:14.21 | prasad1 | trying to weasel my way into that trip; if it happens |
| 17:14.25 | prasad1 | :D |
| 17:21.17 | ``Erik | ~karma ``Erik |
| 17:21.17 | ibot | ``erik has karma of 3 |
| 17:21.23 | ``Erik | ~karma dogma |
| 17:21.23 | ibot | dogma has neutral karma |
| 17:22.20 | ``Erik | andre sent me a message earlier in the week that he would be away, I was afk so was unable to respond at the time |
| 17:23.10 | ``Erik | shakes fist at build error in src/libpg/ (something is messed up on my end, it's looking for .c files when the SOURCES list .cpp files) |
| 17:23.14 | brlcad | k, that's good to know |
| 17:23.26 | brlcad | ``Erik: that's an automake stupidity |
| 17:23.45 | brlcad | it was .c and changed to cpp I believe, and the .deps dir still has the old dependency |
| 17:24.06 | ``Erik | heh, nice. |
| 17:24.26 | brlcad | you can edit the .deps/ Plo file or reconfigure with dependency tracking disabled, or distclean |
| 17:24.32 | ``Erik | just did |
| 17:24.35 | ``Erik | works now |
| 17:25.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31512 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/rbgui/ (234 files in 28 dirs): Importing RBGui (GUI library for OpenGL), v0.1.3 |
| 17:25.52 | ``Erik | reads about MAGI a little O.o |
| 17:28.31 | mafm | oh the irony -- $ dos2unix linux.diff |
| 17:29.07 | ``Erik | all your line endings are belong to me |
| 17:33.43 | mafm | the patch wouldn't apply just because of the line endings :) |
| 17:37.17 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31513 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/rbgui/Gui/ (18 files in 11 dirs): Patches needed to compile RBGui on GCC 4.x in GNU/Linux systems, at least -- grabbed from RPM by Matt Williams <matt@milliams.com> |
| 17:52.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31514 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/rbgui/Gui/Source/PosixPlatformManager.cpp: |
| 17:52.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: My patch (might I say quick and DIRTY hack instead?) to get keyboard autorepeat |
| 17:52.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: working inside RBGui. I tried to contact RBGui guys so it's done properly |
| 17:52.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: upstream, along with the other patches needed (I offered myself as maintainer, |
| 17:52.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: so to speak), but proper implementation for this kind of things would be |
| 17:52.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: probably after GSoC period -- the project is demanding enough. |
| 17:57.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31515 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: annotate tom's ManTech SRS Technologies, Inc. affiliation too since that relates to the ajem-centric contributions |
| 18:00.02 | mafm | brlcad: you might want to try this thing |
| 18:00.08 | mafm | it'll probably give some error :) |
| 18:03.05 | brlcad | I most certainly do :) |
| 18:03.14 | brlcad | are the deps hooked into the build somehow? |
| 18:03.41 | brlcad | or should I jump into each and try to get them to build? |
| 18:03.53 | brlcad | i saw you had a writeup somewhere |
| 18:03.57 | mafm | not properly hooked, they're just preliminary instructions |
| 18:04.19 | brlcad | k |
| 18:04.39 | ``Erik | hum, now opennurbs fails to build for me :D |
| 18:05.10 | mafm | commiting the instructions, it was missing |
| 18:06.06 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31516 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ (Makefile Mocha.pc RBGui.pc): Preliminary support for building external libraries, not working yet (it gives instructions on how to do it, but probably people will get some errors) |
| 18:06.06 | mafm | basically: you go to src/other |
| 18:06.42 | mafm | eeeeek, my Makefile is not working >_< |
| 18:08.11 | mafm | shouldn't this be calling the dependencies in place? all: ogre ois mocha rbgui |
| 18:13.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31517 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/ (22 files in 2 dirs): Add lesson #2 - learning viewing options |
| 18:13.31 | brlcad | updates |
| 18:13.47 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31518 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series/VolumeII.xml: And add the new lesson 2 to the book using xinclude |
| 18:14.41 | brlcad | eww, binary dlls |
| 18:14.55 | starseeker | where, rt^3? |
| 18:15.07 | brlcad | apparently in the ogre repo |
| 18:15.13 | starseeker | ewww |
| 18:15.18 | brlcad | mafm: you have to declare them as PHONY targets |
| 18:15.28 | brlcad | otherwise it sees the dir and thinks the target is fulfilled |
| 18:16.09 | brlcad | make is entity-driven not rule-driven |
| 18:18.49 | mafm | I see |
| 18:19.10 | mafm | wrote some Makefiles sometimes, but they were very straightforward |
| 18:19.40 | mafm | prefers Jam or now CMake, autotools irritates me |
| 18:22.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31519 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/Makefile: Fix Makefile so it actually works as intended -- even if it's only printing how to build libraries at the moment |
| 18:24.07 | mafm | brlcad: so did you get the instructions right? |
| 18:24.14 | mafm | cd to src/other; type make |
| 18:24.37 | mafm | type make "library" to make each one of them -- but instead of making, at the moment just tells you the chain of commands |
| 18:25.21 | mafm | as you'll see, Mocha and RBGui are cluncky in that sense (probably they were "extirped" from a bigger repository, and just put some building system quickly) |
| 18:26.54 | mafm | and then, after having the libraries installed, go to some new build dir (inside src/g3d for example) and type something like |
| 18:26.58 | mafm | $ cmake .. && make -s && su -c "make -s install" |
| 18:29.42 | mafm | anyway brlcad, I have to go now because I have friends who came to visit me |
| 18:29.53 | mafm | and thus I probably won't be around during weekend |
| 18:30.22 | mafm | but I'd like you to write me an email with the problems (or use the wiki, etc) if you run into problems |
| 18:30.32 | mafm | so you don't forget about them by monday :) |
| 18:31.07 | mafm | I have to go now, take care folks :) |
| 18:34.05 | brlcad | waves |
| 18:55.44 | PrezKennedy | waves at brlcad |
| 18:56.01 | PrezKennedy | keepin my brother busy? |
| 19:02.34 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-81-206.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:05.29 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: he's been learning the modeler, making some cool stuff |
| 19:05.33 | brlcad | just getting started though |
| 19:12.35 | ``Erik | heh, woops |
| 19:15.05 | ``Erik | 'make -j' in src/other/openNURBS makes a bit of a mess if you don't have many free fds and pids handy |
| 19:19.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31520 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_light.h: match declaration prototype to definition, fixes build errors on mac and fbsd |
| 19:29.01 | brlcad | oops |
| 19:29.06 | brlcad | didn't test the build |
| 19:41.38 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-187-199.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 20:01.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31521 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 20:02.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: need to investigate why solids.sh sometimes fails on 64-bit platforms on three |
| 20:02.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: tgc-related pixels. it's floating point fuzz, but where the inconsistency |
| 20:02.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: happens isn't clear. iirc using ieee float or non-optimized builds fixes the |
| 20:02.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: failure. |
| 20:59.43 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 21:07.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31522 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Oh yeah, add the glossary component too. |
| 21:07.37 | starseeker | jeez the default xhtml output formatting is boring |
| 21:10.04 | ``Erik | uh, good? |
| 21:49.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31523 10/brlcad/trunk/ (TODO misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi): |
| 21:49.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: prompted by sf bug report 1998145 (Windows Installation Version Confusion) by |
| 21:49.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: tom browder, try to make our Windows installer more version-aware. this is |
| 21:49.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: rather untested but the jist is that it will install to |
| 21:49.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: programfiles/BRL-CAD/VERSION now and the uninstall registry keys become |
| 21:49.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: version-specific. we also ensure that the installer filename being created |
| 21:49.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: conforms to the newly established convention. |
| 22:07.49 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E605.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:19.57 | brlcad | there's be something fun to model and make a tutorial of: http://www.keveney.com/Ross.html |
| 22:20.50 | brlcad | basically a bunch of cylinders |
| 22:21.06 | brlcad | would be a good test of the constraint solver later on |
| 22:33.36 | archivist | nice animation, Ive modelled James Watt's parallel motion in solidworks (within a few thou) |
| 22:42.11 | brlcad | oh, cool, he has others: http://www.keveney.com/Engines.html |
| 22:47.42 | archivist | I should rewrite the one I did, was in turbo pascal, it was to simulate the steam pressure in an engine with a strange method of governing |
| 22:48.49 | archivist | the indicator diagrams showed possible problems, but the simulation proved it is a design error |
| 23:30.17 | brlcad | archivist: the simulation was or you did an animation/rendering in pascal? |
| 23:30.35 | archivist | did animation as well |
| 23:32.28 | archivist | I think last time I could run it was win 95 |
| 23:55.10 | *** join/#brlcad Tempy]_ (n=chatzill@adsl-146-133-74.clt.bellsouth.net) | |
| 23:56.41 | Tempy]_ | I noticed a survey about help on the website and I have an idea if you want a help system where users can reach the creators but there's less danger of the creators being bothered by users who don't try for a solution. |
| 00:00.26 | pacman87 | Tempy]_: what's the idea? |
| 00:01.46 | pacman87 | personally, i think a forum-type system would be best, because it'd be easier to search for questions that have already been answered |
| 00:04.28 | Tempy]_ | Well, you could add an ajax-based IRC chat system to the website that brings people here. Then (in the unlikely event people aren't able to get the help they need) the bot spits out a key every 15 minutes, use an ajax based chat system to connect with the developers by typing in 3 keys. It gives people a route to the developers, guarantee's it won't be used in haste, and forces them to try IRC before they bother the developers. The |
| 00:05.40 | Tempy]_ | Not to mention the forums I have about 9 usernames on because I join with some junk e-mail address, give the answer, and leave forgetting my login information. |
| 00:05.42 | pacman87 | the developer are already in the irc channel |
| 00:05.56 | pacman87 | devs |
| 00:06.23 | Tempy]_ | Yeah... I didn't say it was very useful... if you have a very active developer you don't have to worry about it. |
| 00:06.43 | pacman87 | and from what i can see, you're trying to solve a problem that doesnt' exist |
| 00:07.05 | pacman87 | ie, not too many people rush in here asking foolish questions |
| 00:07.12 | ``Erik | nah, the developers are inactive, and we'd never want anything like http://irc.brlcad.org/ *cough* O:-) |
| 00:07.32 | pacman87 | ``Erik: yeah, that too |
| 00:07.35 | Tempy]_ | It was a survey question on the BRL-cad forum... about how you would rather get help. I'm saying... anything can be made available from the website... IM, IRC, anything. |
| 00:07.45 | Tempy]_ | Sorry... BRL-cad website |
| 00:07.51 | pacman87 | IRC already is available |
| 00:08.35 | pacman87 | and your idea assumes theres a 'dev' channel and a 'users' channel |
| 00:08.51 | Tempy]_ | Ah... you beat me to the punch... by over 2 years it looks like. |
| 00:09.11 | Tempy]_ | Well... then I think I'll ask an actual question about the source of BRL-cad. |
| 00:09.55 | ``Erik | I think the irc page has been up for mroe than 2 years, the CGI was last updated on that date, I think |
| 00:12.01 | Tempy]_ | Cool... CGI... hmm. The question is... hypothetically... how complicated would it be to pull out the CSG system of BRL-cad... it's... the only open source CSG system I could find. And... is it even possible? (I intend to make a level editor for a game engine... well... actually... I intend to fail miserably... but go out giving it everything I have and maybe learn a lot). |
| 00:13.01 | ``Erik | it's mostly contained in include and src/libt, might not be too difficult to extract |
| 00:13.31 | pacman87 | librt? |
| 00:13.36 | ``Erik | however; it does not generate new geometry by itself, it modifies the way evaluation... so it might not do what you want it to |
| 00:13.56 | ``Erik | yeah, like comb.c for the boolweave |
| 00:14.08 | Tempy]_ | *Hallelujah, angels sing... FINALLY!* .... Um... hmm... what do you mean? |
| 00:14.12 | ``Erik | er, bool.c |
| 00:15.23 | ``Erik | csg evaluation only happens in resolving a ray into a partition list. After all the primitives along the ray are evaluated. ray-trace time only. |
| 00:15.48 | ``Erik | one of the future projects is NURBS on NURBS evaluation to resolve a new geometry, but that's future work |
| 00:16.41 | Tempy]_ | Actually, I'm waiting for swept surfaces from google summer of code. |
| 00:16.58 | pacman87 | Tempy]_: that'd be my project :) |
| 00:17.18 | ``Erik | we can do final evaluation via the nmg stuff when you convert CSG geometry into triangles (like in the g-stl or g-adrt convertes) |
| 00:17.45 | Tempy]_ | GO PACMAN!!!! I'm rootin for ya! |
| 00:17.50 | ``Erik | but the nmg stuff needs... help :) buggy and not so very well maintained |
| 00:18.16 | pacman87 | what are you plannign on doing with sweeps? |
| 00:18.25 | Tempy]_ | I wish I could help but I can't even figure out how to do collision detection of swept surfaces unless they're circles in parallel... |
| 00:19.06 | Tempy]_ | Oh... mostly learn... and CSG... swept surfaces allow for pipes, roots, and other complex structures. |
| 00:19.30 | ``Erik | if you're thinking about using it in game stuff, you probably want to reduce it to triangles for opengl or direct3d, and cd against triangles is well known? :) |
| 00:20.52 | pacman87 | right now i'm planning on a single 2d cross section swept along a 3d spline path |
| 00:21.55 | Tempy]_ | Well... I'm planning on leaving the CSG layer in the engine for collision detection in the environment. Collision detection for triangles is well known... but HELL... convex hulls are used to narrow down the areas for collision detection... but detecting if a convex hull hits another one... or if one circle hits a square is a lot simpler... from there it's boolean logic. |
| 00:23.03 | Tempy]_ | Aigea Physx can't actually do triangle mesh to triangle mesh collision detection!!!!!!! |
| 00:23.13 | Tempy]_ | AT... ALL!!!! |
| 00:28.18 | Tempy]_ | Hmm... though it's only really quick and effective for points... which is why it works very well to collide the triangle mesh of the player with the CSG object. |
| 00:29.28 | ``Erik | flips over to "code monkeys" |
| 01:15.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31524 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/book/ (Makefile.am VolumeII.xml): VolII in docbook is already in better shape - remove this one |
| 02:32.45 | punkrockgirl | i'm djing if anyone cares to listen |
| 02:32.49 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 02:33.13 | punkrockgirl | i am having some mic issues though so i cant talk... which sucks... but i can take requests, and i have a lot of stuff that isnt on that playlist too |
| 02:33.53 | punkrockgirl | and brlcad: i can play that request of yours from last week, i was done by the time you asked for it last week, so let me know if youre listening |
| 03:13.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31525 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (3 files in 2 dirs): ids need to be unique for pdf book generation. Default formatting is bad but this does generate a pdf now. |
| 03:14.59 | starseeker | is going to have to resize all the volII images - fop doesn't seem to be using the scaling info. |
| 04:03.51 | yukonbob | punkrockgirl: how long are you on for? |
| 04:04.37 | yukonbob | (and is the music punk?) |
| 04:04.46 | yukonbob | (or opera?) |
| 04:05.00 | yukonbob | hello, cadheadas |
| 04:05.04 | yukonbob | *cadheads |
| 04:05.41 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 04:05.47 | punkrockgirl | more punk, less opera |
| 04:05.51 | punkrockgirl | another hour |
| 04:06.07 | punkrockgirl | actually more rock than anything |
| 04:07.32 | punkrockgirl | i have a half correct playlist on the site |
| 04:07.35 | yukonbob | tries to tune in... |
| 04:08.20 | punkrockgirl | sweet :) |
| 04:08.49 | yukonbob | ah -- /me adjusts firewall |
| 04:09.07 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 04:09.17 | punkrockgirl | youre missing alice in chains |
| 04:10.36 | yukonbob | you can't shake me 'round now... |
| 04:10.43 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 04:11.18 | yukonbob | so -- what's the setup that you DJ with? |
| 04:11.26 | punkrockgirl | well, winamp |
| 04:11.27 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 04:11.42 | punkrockgirl | and a crappy headset that seems to not want to work tonight so i have no mic |
| 04:12.05 | yukonbob | hrmm... and you just stream once to a server to stage it and serve it? |
| 04:12.16 | punkrockgirl | pretty much |
| 04:12.21 | yukonbob | nods |
| 04:13.09 | punkrockgirl | weird it skipped a song |
| 04:13.13 | punkrockgirl | winamp hates me |
| 04:13.21 | yukonbob | Windows hates everybody |
| 04:13.25 | punkrockgirl | i know |
| 04:13.32 | punkrockgirl | erik keeps telling me that |
| 04:13.50 | yukonbob | you need to code your own OS by hand, in assembler, like everybody in #brlcad has... |
| 04:13.57 | punkrockgirl | hahaha |
| 04:13.58 | punkrockgirl | yeah |
| 04:14.06 | punkrockgirl | i'll get on that |
| 04:14.22 | punkrockgirl | i'm just here to stalk erik :) |
| 04:14.39 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 04:14.40 | yukonbob | well... don't let me hold you up... |
| 04:15.16 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 04:15.50 | yukonbob | this reminds me of Sublime... is it? |
| 04:15.54 | punkrockgirl | actually im here to give you guys good music :) |
| 04:15.56 | punkrockgirl | its phish |
| 04:16.04 | punkrockgirl | this song is sublime-ish |
| 04:16.11 | yukonbob | mmm -- i'm not a phishhead, but when I hear it, I like it. |
| 04:16.16 | punkrockgirl | i could play some sublime |
| 04:16.25 | yukonbob | put on some old punky REM |
| 04:16.32 | punkrockgirl | i wish my mic worked *sigh* |
| 04:16.35 | yukonbob | something from Reckoning |
| 04:16.42 | punkrockgirl | oh, i'll try |
| 04:16.55 | yukonbob | this is no try. only do, or do not. |
| 04:16.57 | punkrockgirl | most my rem is on tapes and when i try to find it it doesnt work |
| 04:17.01 | punkrockgirl | lol, ok :) |
| 04:17.19 | yukonbob | or something from Document. |
| 04:18.39 | punkrockgirl | damn it wont play my weezer |
| 04:23.19 | punkrockgirl | not having much rem luck :/ |
| 04:23.27 | punkrockgirl | i have a playlist on that site |
| 04:26.53 | yukonbob | checks playlist |
| 04:26.57 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 04:31.47 | yukonbob | hey -- does that Clutch cowboy bebop have anything to do w/ the Cowboy Bebop cartoon? |
| 04:34.14 | punkrockgirl | i believe its from the soundtrack |
| 04:34.40 | punkrockgirl | or not |
| 04:34.42 | punkrockgirl | im not sure |
| 04:34.47 | punkrockgirl | im scared to check lol |
| 04:36.28 | yukonbob | Clutch reminds me of Friday night Arts and Crafts; one town where I used to live, on Fridays we'd go over to a friends house, make dinner, drink beer, listen to Clutch and do arts and crafts. |
| 04:37.42 | punkrockgirl | hehehe |
| 04:37.59 | punkrockgirl | sounds awesome |
| 04:38.00 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 04:38.22 | punkrockgirl | reminds me i need a beer :D brb |
| 04:41.42 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 04:42.47 | punkrockgirl | this isnt very punk |
| 04:42.48 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 04:44.45 | yukonbob | hey -you've got REM Pretty Persuasion on your list |
| 04:45.13 | punkrockgirl | oh |
| 04:45.17 | punkrockgirl | :P ok its next :) |
| 04:47.37 | yukonbob | STP Interstate Love Song or Sour Girl get votes from me too (STP are great, but their "slow" songs are super-great, imo) |
| 04:48.04 | yukonbob | whatever -- it's your show... /me needs a beer too |
| 04:48.23 | yukonbob | heh |
| 04:48.50 | punkrockgirl | i agree, stp was the first band i saw live |
| 04:48.58 | punkrockgirl | well, the first good band... ;P |
| 04:49.22 | yukonbob | doesn't remember who his first band was... |
| 04:49.30 | yukonbob | but saw REM for Monster |
| 04:50.08 | yukonbob | Alice in Chains at one of the Lollapalooza tours (and Ministry, Ice-T, etc., etc.) |
| 04:50.14 | punkrockgirl | nice |
| 04:50.18 | yukonbob | big tours like that are the way to see music |
| 04:50.25 | punkrockgirl | i never got to see rem or alice in chains |
| 04:50.29 | punkrockgirl | i saw ministry |
| 04:50.51 | punkrockgirl | my stp show was a long time ago, they opened for butthole surfers |
| 04:50.58 | yukonbob | remembers Jesus and Mary Chain were at that Lollapalooza too, and were *SO* loud. |
| 04:51.02 | punkrockgirl | lol, nice |
| 04:51.14 | yukonbob | wow stp + bhs -- good show. |
| 04:51.22 | punkrockgirl | yeah it was cool :) |
| 04:51.30 | yukonbob | "Ministry Stole my Hotrod" |
| 04:52.40 | punkrockgirl | ;D |
| 04:55.41 | yukonbob | is Tori Amos' Choirgirl Hotel a good album? |
| 04:57.05 | punkrockgirl | all tori amos is good |
| 04:57.21 | punkrockgirl | althoug i personally like the older ones better |
| 04:57.37 | punkrockgirl | but thats because i dont get a chance to enjoy it as much as i used to i suppose |
| 04:58.30 | yukonbob | got into her w/ Little Earthquakes and Under the Pink, and for UtP is a highmark |
| 04:58.48 | yukonbob | *and for me, UtP... |
| 04:59.15 | punkrockgirl | yeah |
| 04:59.26 | yukonbob | lol |
| 04:59.32 | punkrockgirl | i saw her in concert a bunch |
| 04:59.46 | yukonbob | ticky tick tick of a gun. |
| 04:59.52 | punkrockgirl | back when i went to concerts |
| 04:59.56 | yukonbob | has never seen Tori, but imagines it would be good. |
| 05:00.02 | punkrockgirl | yeah, she was awesome |
| 05:00.13 | yukonbob | lives in the Big City again, so should try to take time to see music |
| 05:04.45 | punkrockgirl | good idea :) |
| 05:05.00 | punkrockgirl | lol, there is this guy in my wow guild freaking out from that ministry song |
| 05:05.06 | punkrockgirl | so i'm trying to make him explode |
| 05:06.01 | punkrockgirl | he must like kenny g |
| 05:09.02 | punkrockgirl | its some poor 17year old kid |
| 05:09.09 | punkrockgirl | who has never listened to music apparently |
| 05:15.31 | yukonbob | this really reminds me of buckethead |
| 05:17.06 | punkrockgirl | oh |
| 05:17.19 | punkrockgirl | yeah |
| 05:17.24 | punkrockgirl | they did stuff together |
| 05:17.33 | yukonbob | ah -- no wonder, then. |
| 05:17.37 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 05:59.33 | *** join/#brlcad aten (n=sashko@74-131-161-181.dhcp.insightbb.com) | |
| 06:01.18 | aten | hello, I'm trying t build brl-cas under fedora8. make complains about "undefined reference to `TclReFree" |
| 06:01.29 | aten | am I missing some package? |
| 06:01.42 | aten | err brl-cad |
| 06:06.29 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 06:18.04 | yukonbob | aten: sounds like error linking in tcl libs |
| 06:18.31 | yukonbob | ReFree makes me think regexp, but I doubt it matters about the particulars, Tcl is the issue... |
| 06:19.03 | yukonbob | you need to make sure you can link against a pre-installed version of Tcl, or that you use the distributed version and link against it... |
| 06:26.32 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-210.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:40.10 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-210.dclient.hispeed.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
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| 11:37.03 | aten | yukonbob, uhm... link against it? |
| 11:44.23 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@brmn-4db2e8c3.pool.einsundeins.de) | |
| 12:04.15 | ``Erik | actually, that's an issue of /usr/include not coming before $(top_srcdir)/src/other/tcl/generic/ in the include path, do a "make clean" and reconfigure with --enable-build-tcl --enable-build-tk |
| 12:04.38 | ``Erik | on fedora 8 even, I've only seen that issue on osX so far :/ |
| 12:05.11 | ``Erik | grouses some more about tcl shadowing a system header name |
| 12:15.06 | aten | ``Erik, thanks, trying |
| 12:23.01 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 12:34.32 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: sorry I missed the offer, was a busy offline night |
| 13:08.57 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-187-199.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 13:27.12 | brlcad | aten: that problem is fixed in the latest svn sources, there's a change you can manually apply, or you can add --enable-all to configure |
| 14:01.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31526 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: photonmap.h required for struct shadework (in light.h) |
| 14:02.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31527 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libbu/argv.c libged/erase.c librtserver/rtserver.c): add missing headers |
| 15:41.33 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.247) | |
| 17:02.46 | punkrockgirl | brlcad: its ok, i think i'm on again from 7-9 cst tonight, although i'm still having mic issues |
| 17:03.30 | brlcad | aw, no mic :/ |
| 17:37.24 | punkrockgirl | i know, its lame |
| 17:37.40 | punkrockgirl | i need to mess with it, it was working when i played wow but not when i dj'd so im assuming its a winamp issue |
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| 18:37.56 | ``Erik | heh, mute button? :> |
| 18:38.51 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-110-111.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:45.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r31528 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD: Don't strip debugging symbols and keep documentation in Arch Linux package. |
| 19:27.28 | brlcad | looks like sf.net e-mail is finally unstuck.. flowing in like gravy |
| 19:27.46 | alex_joni | nice and slow? |
| 19:28.12 | brlcad | constant stream, steady n slow |
| 19:28.22 | brlcad | basically everything on friday |
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| 20:56.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31529 10/brlcad/trunk/include/magic.h: change the magic number to PC_CONSTRAINT_INTERNAL_MAGIC to something readable/useful, 'pcim' |
| 20:58.43 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 21:08.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31530 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: ws |
| 21:15.33 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 21:17.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31531 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ell/ell.c: use the same parameter names that mged uses (in fact we probably want to refactor edsol to use this) |
| 21:51.00 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 21:51.22 | homovulgaris | hi all :0 |
| 21:51.25 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 21:51.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31532 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob added a -C color option to the big E command |
| 21:51.41 | homovulgaris | ok my 0 key has problems :P |
| 21:53.04 | homovulgaris | brlcad: check this out ;) maybe u have seen it already http://student.agh.edu.pl/~kawulak/constrained_value/ |
| 21:53.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31533 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl: help consistency, the options are independently optional |
| 21:54.14 | homovulgaris | I have been toying with boost graph .. but what i am really looking forward to is a hypergraph system which they don't have.. their ideas in terms of bgl interface is good. but i guess it would probably be better to write a Hypergraph structure similar to their bgl interface |
| 21:54.25 | brlcad | nope! haven't seen that |
| 21:54.50 | brlcad | looks like a useful library though |
| 21:55.10 | homovulgaris | indeed.. maybe not in our constraint thing.. but kinda cool.. |
| 21:55.11 | brlcad | likes |
| 21:55.38 | homovulgaris | boost had a hypergraph proposal.. didnt proceed i guess..http://www.crystalclearsoftware.com/cgi-bin/boost_wiki/wiki.pl?Google_Summer_Of_Code_2006#hypergraph |
| 21:56.59 | homovulgaris | i am trying to see how their constrained values ideas could fit in my constraint definition system :) |
| 21:57.41 | homovulgaris | the way in which they generically represent constraints using predicate is neat |
| 21:58.11 | brlcad | I like the callback overrides, similar to other stl containers |
| 21:58.23 | homovulgaris | it just came up for formal review yesterday though.. the boost constrained value library |
| 21:58.44 | brlcad | that looks like it really could be useful actually |
| 21:58.57 | brlcad | not just for constraints, but especially for them |
| 21:59.50 | homovulgaris | indeed... :) |
| 22:01.17 | brlcad | your pc_c_set could return/store/encapsulate a set of constrained<> objects |
| 22:01.50 | homovulgaris | yeah .. implicit constraints should be easy to implement using constrained<> type |
| 22:02.00 | homovulgaris | i am still thinking about the explicit ones |
| 22:02.06 | brlcad | constraining parameters with given things |
| 22:02.49 | brlcad | there'd presumably be some set of common constraints needed (like vector > 0) |
| 22:03.59 | homovulgaris | as i see most of the implicit constraints are either domain restricitions like a<vector<b or equality ( vector 1 = vector 2 ) |
| 22:04.06 | brlcad | or pc_c_sets would still be generic, and get converted to those during processing |
| 22:04.56 | homovulgaris | i was thinking conversion during processing since that would keep c/c++ a little bit segregated |
| 22:05.49 | brlcad | equality, perpendicularity, |length|, yeah, there's probably just a handful |
| 22:06.15 | brlcad | yeah, I was thinking the same, not exposing C++ through the C api |
| 22:07.47 | homovulgaris | btw .. how would we be incorporating the boost headers in our code structure ? |
| 22:08.05 | homovulgaris | just add the necessary hpps to a folder ? |
| 22:08.29 | brlcad | src/other/boost |
| 22:08.56 | brlcad | then defining cppflags in configure.ac |
| 22:09.46 | brlcad | libregex is similar, can follow that logic as an example (REGEX_CPPFLAGS in particular, but a few other checks relate) |
| 22:10.03 | homovulgaris | hmm.. and we wont be adding the whole boost library right.. for example if we are using bgl ( boost graph library) do we include only bgl or those bgl hpps which we want ? |
| 22:10.04 | brlcad | I can help with that bit if you get stuck |
| 22:10.14 | homovulgaris | k.. |
| 22:11.04 | brlcad | right, boost on the whole is huge, just the portions that are needed (but do include all the portions needed directly or indirectly) |
| 22:11.38 | homovulgaris | yeah basically i was planning to add everything connected via includes |
| 22:11.39 | brlcad | anything in the c++0x subset is easily fair game to include |
| 22:11.58 | brlcad | do you know if that includes the graphs? |
| 22:13.22 | homovulgaris | i dont think bgl is in c++0x |
| 22:13.40 | homovulgaris | eventhough it is quite stable for sometime now |
| 22:13.55 | brlcad | ../../../src/libpc/pcVariable.h:36:21: error: pcBasic.h: No such file or directory |
| 22:14.05 | brlcad | probably missing from Makefile.am |
| 22:14.05 | homovulgaris | and the constrained value has just started undergoing formal review |
| 22:14.11 | homovulgaris | yikes.. |
| 22:14.42 | homovulgaris | yeah.. but i added it i thought |
| 22:15.07 | brlcad | well it's not committed :) |
| 22:15.59 | brlcad | the other updates that were clobbered by r31454 are still missing too ;) |
| 22:16.45 | homovulgaris | oh.. there were some conflicts.. i manually edited with hand all the files which i changed in r31454.. hmm will check again |
| 22:17.24 | homovulgaris | basically 31451-31453 right ? |
| 22:17.28 | brlcad | easiest is probably to svn diff the revisions that preceeded in that dir that day |
| 22:17.36 | brlcad | probably, something like that |
| 22:17.52 | brlcad | an svn merge should do the trick |
| 22:18.12 | homovulgaris | yeah thats what i did svn diff -r 31454:31451 etc. |
| 22:18.40 | brlcad | reversed range |
| 22:19.03 | brlcad | something like 31450:31453 |
| 22:19.20 | brlcad | if 51 was the first and 54 the last |
| 22:19.24 | brlcad | er, 53 |
| 22:19.33 | homovulgaris | oh .. ok :) |
| 22:19.37 | brlcad | 54 was yours |
| 22:19.58 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 22:20.51 | homovulgaris | hey sean , i will be taveling home on 27th .. 2200 km train journey :P 36 hours will be out of touch during that time :) leave in advance :) |
| 22:21.06 | brlcad | cool, thanks for letting me know |
| 22:22.06 | homovulgaris | k.. i'll make the Makefile edits + restore 31450-3 and commit and then start adding a bit of boost |
| 22:22.07 | brlcad | travelled about double that distance across the US a couple years ago just for fun |
| 22:22.18 | brlcad | (by train) |
| 22:22.27 | homovulgaris | hehe.. :) |
| 22:22.36 | brlcad | absolutely beautiful |
| 22:22.45 | homovulgaris | i traveled around 6k km when i was 18 ;) |
| 22:23.02 | brlcad | those can be separate commits, btw :) |
| 22:23.09 | brlcad | remember, succint more frequent commits |
| 22:23.15 | homovulgaris | ok :) |
| 22:23.31 | brlcad | you probably have a dozen queued up if I had to quess |
| 22:23.36 | brlcad | s/quess/guess/ |
| 22:25.00 | homovulgaris | yeah.. i was reading about the commits on windows build system and realised i have no idea whatsoever about how it works :) |
| 22:26.00 | brlcad | there are two types of windows builds in the repository, cmake and msvc (8 and 9) |
| 22:26.14 | brlcad | msvc files are all in misc |
| 22:26.23 | brlcad | cmake files are distributed, set of CMakeLists.txt |
| 22:26.26 | homovulgaris | hmm.. cmake mafm was also planning to use right ? for g3d ? |
| 22:26.30 | brlcad | yeah |
| 22:26.37 | brlcad | he's got it working |
| 22:27.00 | homovulgaris | oh i will update and check |
| 22:27.09 | brlcad | cmake would potentially be interesting for the whole repository, but it'd be several weeks/months of work to replicate what we have |
| 22:27.32 | brlcad | the dependencies don't build automatic yet, they take some more effort |
| 22:28.21 | homovulgaris | and sean regarding the posix shell script .. while we do the make arent all of them made to be shell scripts |
| 22:29.17 | brlcad | que? |
| 22:29.31 | brlcad | all of them, who? what? |
| 22:29.35 | homovulgaris | for example when i was doing solver_test or roots_new_test for example.. make was generating shell scripts.. for debuggin i had to manually do the compilation on commandline |
| 22:29.48 | brlcad | ah |
| 22:29.55 | brlcad | libtool tutorialage needed |
| 22:30.19 | brlcad | libtool generates wrapper scripts prior to install that ensures the binary running uses the right libraries |
| 22:30.38 | brlcad | they are just "preinstall" objects |
| 22:30.53 | homovulgaris | thought so.. :) |
| 22:31.03 | brlcad | to debug you can either run make install or run through libtool |
| 22:31.57 | brlcad | e.g. to debug: ./libtool --mode=execute gdb --args src/libpc/solver_test --your --stuff |
| 22:32.22 | homovulgaris | hmm.. :) libtool tutorialage needed indeed :) |
| 22:32.23 | brlcad | or ../../libtool --mode=execute gdb ./solver_test etc |
| 22:32.40 | brlcad | otherwise, just install and debug as normal |
| 22:33.39 | homovulgaris | but solver_test etc. are under no_inst right.. |
| 22:33.58 | brlcad | the scripts basically guarantee in a cross-platform manner that when you run solver_test (or rt or mged, etc) that it's using the uninstalled libraries that are in the source tree, and not some other installed or LD_LIBRARY_PATH library that could otherwise override |
| 22:34.06 | homovulgaris | *noinst |
| 22:35.05 | brlcad | ah, then you can't install obviously ;) |
| 22:35.12 | brlcad | the same library problem holds though |
| 22:35.21 | homovulgaris | yeah i noticed as much.. i mean for example when i was making changes to rt for example make would make the roots_test to use the proper libraries within the make system and not the ones "installed" |
| 22:35.23 | brlcad | you'd have to make them static to get rid of the wrapper without installing |
| 22:35.45 | brlcad | (-static LDFLAG) |
| 22:37.35 | homovulgaris | hmm.. * note to self.. add -O2 or -O3 in the Makefile for optimizing boost |
| 22:37.53 | homovulgaris | k.. i'll get back to my vim :) |
| 22:37.54 | brlcad | optimization settings are set in configure.ac |
| 22:38.01 | homovulgaris | oh.. |
| 22:38.11 | brlcad | --enable-optimized will turn them on (and destroy your ability to debug) |
| 22:38.17 | brlcad | at least effectively |
| 22:38.38 | homovulgaris | hmm.. i will check libregex setup |
| 22:39.04 | brlcad | yeah, don't worry about compiler flags.. that should all be golden ;) you just need a few cpp flags |
| 22:39.04 | homovulgaris | and i still have tcl issues :) |
| 22:39.18 | brlcad | really? that was fixed |
| 22:39.28 | brlcad | have you ran make clean since? |
| 22:39.43 | brlcad | the symbols would still be there |
| 22:39.54 | homovulgaris | lots of times.. :) |
| 22:40.14 | homovulgaris | it is not a make error.. just version compatibility issue |
| 22:40.38 | brlcad | ah, not the tclrefree error |
| 22:40.49 | homovulgaris | nopes :) |
| 22:40.50 | brlcad | mged failure |
| 22:40.59 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 22:41.18 | brlcad | k, *that* is a different issue --enable-all ;) |
| 22:41.53 | homovulgaris | yeah i know.. then i get an ogl_ error.. unable to open .. something.. i will get back ;) |
| 22:42.02 | brlcad | --without-opengl |
| 22:42.48 | brlcad | that'd be a good one to fix and/or get more info on, it can't readily be debugged without sitting at a box that has the problem |
| 22:43.09 | homovulgaris | hmmm.. :) |
| 22:43.10 | brlcad | should add the info to BUGS |
| 22:43.26 | brlcad | (not the tcl one, the ogl run-time error) |
| 22:44.02 | homovulgaris | hmm. k |
| 22:44.34 | homovulgaris | procedural geometry is awesome :) |
| 22:44.46 | brlcad | indeed |
| 22:44.53 | homovulgaris | who works on it ? |
| 22:45.01 | brlcad | what part? |
| 22:45.21 | brlcad | the src/proc-db examples? |
| 22:45.27 | brlcad | or libwdb? |
| 22:45.27 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 22:45.33 | homovulgaris | proc-db |
| 22:46.20 | brlcad | proc-db is usually something students get to work on after getting through the modeling tutorials, various authors |
| 22:46.28 | brlcad | or devs testing out new bits of functionality |
| 22:46.36 | brlcad | (like new primitives) |
| 22:46.41 | homovulgaris | k |
| 22:46.57 | homovulgaris | plans to read more on libtool |
| 22:47.00 | brlcad | basically just a bunch of random stuff, some way more cool than others |
| 22:47.26 | brlcad | the new tire procedure that starseeker worked on is pretty snazzy |
| 22:47.37 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 22:47.53 | homovulgaris | thats how i noticed :) |
| 22:48.43 | brlcad | vegitation can be fun if you seed it the right parameters |
| 22:49.38 | homovulgaris | the one in stryker ICV is from vegitation ? |
| 22:49.38 | brlcad | oh, by the way, did I send you this link? http://www.langbein.org/research/TAConstraints/ |
| 22:50.54 | homovulgaris | Erik and twingy were talking about adrt and RISE |
| 22:51.32 | homovulgaris | nope.. checking it out |
| 22:52.23 | brlcad | no, stryker vegitation is from a nearly identical blender script |
| 22:53.13 | homovulgaris | the presentation is nice: notes on geometric constraint systems |
| 22:53.14 | brlcad | at least in function |
| 22:54.06 | homovulgaris | i hear..with mlt we will have such renders at much less time :) |
| 23:04.43 | brlcad | mm, not sure about "much less time" unless you include the time it takes to tessellate a model (which can be substantial) |
| 23:05.05 | brlcad | it should certainly make it a heck of a lot easier |
| 23:23.01 | aten | brlcad, tell me about the change please, because ``Erik's advise did not help |
| 23:25.06 | brlcad | aten: edit src/librt/regionfix.c and add "#undef regfree" after all the #include lines |
| 23:26.32 | aten | brlcad, Done, trying to build. Thanks |
| 23:27.10 | aten | brlcad, do I have to ise that --enable-all still? |
| 23:27.11 | brlcad | you may need to rm src/librt/regionfix.lo if it still comes up |
| 23:27.51 | aten | ther is no src/librt/regionfix.lo, I did make clean |
| 23:27.57 | brlcad | i'd recommend it at least until you have a full build -- whether it'll work without it depends on what system libraries you have installed (and versions of them) |
| 23:42.45 | brlcad | totally awesome, on-line ordering to a couple dozen restaurants in about a 30 mile radius |
| 23:43.07 | brlcad | gets giddy for indian |
| 23:55.19 | aten | brlcad, sweet! It compiled. installing now. Do you guys ever had a spec file for rpm or something? |
| 23:57.02 | brlcad | oh, there was one the last time we made actual rpms.. about 4 years ago for release 6 |
| 23:57.36 | brlcad | we have a spec file in misc/brlcad.spec .. but the script to build the rpm isn't there |
| 23:57.39 | brlcad | and it's untested |
| 23:57.44 | brlcad | feel free to fix that problem ;) |
| 00:07.39 | aten | ok, thanks |
| 00:37.10 | brlcad | np |
| 00:49.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31534 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libged/libged.vcproj: sync with vc8 project files, add a slew missing |
| 00:52.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31535 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libged/libged.vcproj: contemplated renaming bigE.c to E.c, but reverted (all but this) |
| 00:54.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31536 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 2 dirs): consistency update, make all libged's argv parameters be declared as arrays of pointers instead of pointers to pointers even if they're used the same |
| 03:08.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31537 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Add start of lesson 3 |
| 03:26.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31538 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add start of lesson 4 |
| 04:13.30 | starseeker | Humm - http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/06/21/203240 |
| 06:19.20 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-92-233.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:27.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31539 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): ws, reverting changes from 31450-31453 |
| 07:28.20 | brlcad | woot |
| 07:36.24 | brlcad | hum, that doesn't look like everything |
| 07:36.38 | brlcad | that's just a bit of ws |
| 07:42.08 | homovulgaris | huh.. yikes..i double checked it this time.. what were the other modifiications ? |
| 09:23.35 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-73-95.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 10:45.24 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-040-234.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 11:03.52 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 11:04.59 | *** part/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-73-95.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
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| 11:49.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31540 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (7 files): take two, sanother round of ws and style conformancy changes. try not to wipe these out. ;-) |
| 11:51.27 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.247) | |
| 11:53.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31541 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (pc.h raytrace.h): commend cleanup |
| 12:03.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31542 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 12:03.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: I made all platform installers use consistent naming conventions, outlined in |
| 12:03.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the HACKING file. In particular, the Windows installer is now more |
| 12:03.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: version-aware, installing into a versioned subdir by default (similar to how we |
| 12:03.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: distribute for other platforms) and allowing per-version uninstalls. |
| 12:17.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31543 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/ (opennurbs_light.cpp opennurbs_light.h): |
| 12:17.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (re)apply the intent of the changes prompted by tom browder in sf patch 1998134 |
| 12:17.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (Eliminate Warnings from g++ for opennurbs_light.h) but also making the extra |
| 12:17.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: changes to the cpp file to match. declaring a bool return value as const is |
| 12:17.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: meaningless |
| 12:24.36 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@123-194-167-3.dynamic.kbronet.com.tw) | |
| 12:24.55 | Mouette | i had entered |
| 12:27.15 | brlcad | hello Mouette |
| 12:27.23 | Mouette | hihi |
| 12:28.04 | brlcad | I see you were able to upload to anon ftp |
| 12:28.18 | Mouette | Mmm |
| 12:28.22 | brlcad | or at least are in the process of doing so |
| 12:28.51 | brlcad | 25MB and counting .. how big is it? |
| 12:29.03 | Mouette | 180MB |
| 12:29.09 | brlcad | heh |
| 12:29.16 | brlcad | that's one slow upload :) |
| 12:29.51 | brlcad | and a huge dist .. is that compressed? |
| 12:30.01 | Mouette | C'est pas grave,we can wait |
| 12:30.27 | Mouette | i forget compressed it |
| 12:30.30 | Mouette | ...... |
| 12:31.19 | brlcad | it doesn't need to be, I can make it a .pkg.gz .pkg.bz2 |
| 12:31.37 | Mouette | ok,thanks |
| 12:31.50 | Mouette | and i need you test it |
| 12:32.11 | brlcad | where does it install to? |
| 12:32.20 | Mouette | because it not be compiled in a pure system |
| 12:32.35 | brlcad | what were the configure options? |
| 12:32.43 | Mouette | /opt/Brl-CAD |
| 12:32.50 | brlcad | eep |
| 12:33.05 | brlcad | lower/upper mixed case is a no-no |
| 12:33.31 | brlcad | should be either 'brlcad' or 'BRL-CAD', not other variations |
| 12:33.51 | Mouette | ok |
| 12:34.39 | Mouette | need i remake a pkg file? |
| 12:34.43 | brlcad | please :) |
| 12:35.01 | Mouette | ok,i stop it |
| 12:35.02 | brlcad | what were all of your configure options? |
| 12:35.09 | Mouette | and re-upload |
| 12:35.13 | brlcad | k |
| 12:35.51 | brlcad | running as root .. tsk tsk |
| 12:44.25 | Mouette | wait me,compressing |
| 12:47.01 | brlcad | what were all of your configure options? |
| 12:48.21 | Mouette | i don't know your mean. you means the result of "./configure" from source? |
| 12:49.14 | brlcad | Did you just run "./configure" with no options following it? |
| 12:49.32 | brlcad | you had to have used at least --prefix=/opt/brlcad to change it from /usr/brlcad |
| 12:49.50 | Mouette | no |
| 12:50.18 | brlcad | then.. what did you do? :) |
| 12:51.44 | Mouette | --enable-tcl-build --enable-tk-build --enable-itcl-build |
| 12:52.23 | brlcad | hence why I ask, you should use --enable-all --enable-optimized for a platform distribution :) |
| 12:53.17 | brlcad | it's not necessary to redo everything, but something to keep in mind for next time |
| 12:53.29 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.199.234) | |
| 12:53.43 | brlcad | optimized will give about a 2x performance increase |
| 12:53.59 | brlcad | enable-all helps ensure that there are no external system dependencies in the binaries |
| 12:54.04 | *** join/#brlcad root_ (n=root@123-194-167-3.dynamic.kbronet.com.tw) | |
| 12:55.11 | brlcad | at least none other than major ones like X11 and OpenGL |
| 12:57.22 | root_ | need you look config.cache? |
| 12:57.34 | brlcad | not really |
| 13:01.16 | root_ | i don't understand your means. how about X11 and OpenGL? |
| 13:03.02 | root_ | after i do ./configure, then make and get some erreurs. |
| 13:03.19 | root_ | then i modify some code |
| 13:03.27 | brlcad | did you not see my preceeding comments? |
| 13:05.26 | brlcad | http://paste.bzflag.bz/m3002fc62 |
| 13:05.37 | root_ | no. |
| 13:08.05 | root_ | and then?? |
| 13:10.06 | root_ | need you my source dir after compiling? |
| 13:10.37 | *** join/#brlcad piotrnikiel (n=piotrnik@cy243.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) | |
| 13:10.52 | root_ | sorry,my english is bad, sometimes i don't understand your means |
| 13:10.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31544 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/helplib.tcl: |
| 13:10.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: increase the column spacing to 25 characters, making a max of 100 wide instead |
| 13:10.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: of 80 .. this is a real shame but stems from the problem that the command names |
| 13:10.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: are way too long on dgo_set_plOutputMode, dgo_set_transparency, |
| 13:10.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: dgo_set_outputHandler, and a few others. increasing the width makes it so you |
| 13:11.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: can iterate over the commands (while messing with default width wrapping) |
| 13:12.14 | brlcad | root_: and then nothing, just pointing out that next time you should use --enable-all --enable-optimized instead of the -build options you were using |
| 13:13.44 | root_ | can't "--enable-all", part of source get erreurs |
| 13:13.57 | root_ | sorry i am Mouette |
| 13:14.00 | brlcad | ah, that's what you meant |
| 13:14.08 | brlcad | heh, I know |
| 13:14.20 | brlcad | what errors? |
| 13:16.24 | root_ | let me recompile, because some Makefile context i delete some that compile get erreurs |
| 13:16.26 | piotrnikiel | hello, are there any Mac OSX BRL-CAD users? |
| 13:16.40 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: lots |
| 13:18.20 | piotrnikiel | Well, I've got a problem with BRL-CAD, which you probably seen before |
| 13:18.29 | piotrnikiel | .X Error of failed request: BadRequest (invalid request code or no such operation) |
| 13:18.30 | piotrnikiel | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:18.30 | piotrnikiel | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:18.37 | root_ | wait me |
| 13:24.10 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: yes, bugs in the new X11 update |
| 13:24.22 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: did you compile yourself or install binary? |
| 13:25.11 | root_ | upload finish,and wait me recompile...... |
| 13:25.58 | piotrnikiel | I installed binary and that's what i got |
| 13:26.02 | piotrnikiel | but i also compiled by myself |
| 13:26.09 | piotrnikiel | and |
| 13:26.39 | brlcad | root_: what are you recompiling? |
| 13:27.15 | piotrnikiel | when i configure with --enable-optimized it compiles well, but when starting mged, it says that i have tcl8.4 (apple's) and it needs tcl8.5 |
| 13:27.18 | root_ | rm -rf brlcad dir and restart download source |
| 13:28.00 | piotrnikiel | so i installed tcl8.5 from macports, and then it fails to compile |
| 13:28.05 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: unfortunately, there's not a whole lot that can be done about the 10.5 error at the moment .. it'll be a couple months before a fix is expected |
| 13:28.11 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: add --enable-all to the build |
| 13:28.19 | piotrnikiel | well, i ve got 10.4 ;) |
| 13:28.25 | brlcad | really? |
| 13:28.35 | brlcad | now that's odd |
| 13:29.10 | piotrnikiel | so i am today trying various combinations of configure, with aquatk, and with tcl&tk from ports, or from apple, and so on |
| 13:29.11 | brlcad | ppc or intel? |
| 13:29.13 | piotrnikiel | intel |
| 13:29.49 | brlcad | aquatk is for devs-only, it's not going to work for you |
| 13:30.08 | piotrnikiel | ok... i didn't know that |
| 13:30.10 | brlcad | neither will using system-installed tcl/tk because you don't have itcl/itk |
| 13:30.34 | brlcad | and even iff you did, it's not a frequently tested configuration on mac |
| 13:31.03 | brlcad | usually mac is tested with enable-all |
| 13:31.42 | piotrnikiel | ok. i'm now compiling it, and if it fails, I'll try enable-all |
| 13:31.50 | piotrnikiel | since i haven't tried it yet |
| 13:32.17 | brlcad | oh interesting, 129 is direct rendering |
| 13:32.49 | brlcad | you don't have direct render opengl support for some reason |
| 13:33.00 | piotrnikiel | well FYI if i start your binary with: mged -c |
| 13:33.02 | piotrnikiel | and choose X |
| 13:33.05 | brlcad | (you can add --without-opengl to get past that) |
| 13:33.11 | piotrnikiel | then i have the old X-server mged |
| 13:33.28 | brlcad | yeah, that's the main problem |
| 13:33.43 | brlcad | the ogl driver isn't failing gracefully |
| 13:33.57 | piotrnikiel | but if i start mged -c and run it with ogl, then the "129" error happens |
| 13:34.00 | brlcad | it should automatically fall back to indirect rendering, but decides to abort |
| 13:34.38 | piotrnikiel | my mac is pretty standard Macbook |
| 13:34.45 | piotrnikiel | and i never got any problems with opengl |
| 13:35.00 | piotrnikiel | but let my check the --enable-all |
| 13:35.12 | piotrnikiel | if it fails then I'll tell you |
| 13:35.17 | root_ | this is my config result ( ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized): |
| 13:35.31 | brlcad | what we mean by opengl is not the same as what you probably think it means |
| 13:35.32 | root_ | Java Developer Kit support ...........: no |
| 13:35.47 | root_ | Build 64-bit release .................: no (32-bit) |
| 13:35.48 | brlcad | it's just a low-level rendering mode for us, no different/additional functionality |
| 13:35.59 | root_ | Print verbose compilation warnings ...: no |
| 13:36.09 | root_ | Print verbose compilation progress ...: no |
| 13:36.10 | brlcad | root_: those are fine |
| 13:36.15 | piotrnikiel | I thought you mean just the system libraries |
| 13:37.17 | brlcad | it's related, but it's more what we do when that display manager driver is turned on/off |
| 13:37.54 | brlcad | and in this case, there's an additional complexity of going through X11 and through the X OpenGL layer |
| 13:38.54 | brlcad | we ask the X server for a direct rendering context, normally it either says here you go or sorry can't but here use this indirect one |
| 13:39.05 | brlcad | instead it's saying just "sorry, goodbye" |
| 13:39.13 | piotrnikiel | ;) |
| 13:39.39 | brlcad | either way, the simplest thing to do is just turn the ogl layer off |
| 13:39.49 | brlcad | you don't miss anything |
| 13:59.18 | root_ | ok,i look the first erreues,and i modify |
| 14:00.51 | root_ | in src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_point.cpp |
| 14:01.36 | brlcad | what version are you compiling? |
| 14:01.50 | root_ | i delete #ifdef HAVE_IEEEFP_H and #else, # include <math.h>, #endif 4lines |
| 14:02.07 | root_ | 7.12.14 |
| 14:02.29 | root_ | and continuing |
| 14:03.23 | brlcad | okay |
| 14:03.45 | brlcad | root_: I suspect they don't get many solaris folks compiling openNURBS |
| 14:10.42 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-166-120.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 14:13.26 | brlcad | yay, automatic mged command test |
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| 14:31.51 | root_ | the second erreurs,i checking |
| 14:34.55 | root_ | in src/libtermio/termio.c 428,439, let me think how i deal with the problem in that time |
| 14:39.46 | root_ | add #include <fcntl.h>,#include <sys/types.h> 2 line,ad delete some ifndef....... |
| 14:39.57 | root_ | and continuing |
| 14:42.01 | root_ | the third erreur appear. |
| 14:43.03 | piotrnikiel | got it, got it ;) |
| 14:43.08 | piotrnikiel | thank you sean |
| 14:43.19 | brlcad | piotrnikiel: glad to hear it! |
| 14:43.20 | piotrnikiel | enable-all really sorted everything out well |
| 14:43.44 | root_ | in src/adrt/master/,i haven't ability to deal with it, so i modify the Makefile in src/adrt |
| 14:44.34 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 14:45.52 | root_ | i delete the context "master" in Makefile,Makefile.in,and Makefile.am in src/adrt |
| 14:46.01 | root_ | and continuing |
| 14:46.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31545 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtermio/termio.c: include fcntl.h for solaris, thx Mouette |
| 14:46.55 | brlcad | root_: adrt isn't important |
| 15:03.06 | root_ | compile finish |
| 15:03.23 | root_ | installing and testing it |
| 15:05.25 | root_ | in installing,a tcl erreurs,i am dealing with it |
| 15:06.42 | root_ | in src/other/tcl/unix/Makefile |
| 15:08.10 | root_ | in the Makefile, SHELL=/bin/sh become /usr/bin/bash |
| 15:09.35 | root_ | and src/other/tk/unix/Makefile is also |
| 15:10.21 | brlcad | we try not to modify anything in src/other |
| 15:10.34 | brlcad | unless it's something that causes a hard failur |
| 15:20.26 | root_ | install finish and test it, it look like ok in my machine. |
| 15:20.58 | root_ | my process is finish |
| 15:21.27 | brlcad | root_: if you run "cd /tmp && /opt/bin/benchmark" |
| 15:21.48 | brlcad | what does it report at the end? |
| 15:21.53 | brlcad | should be a number |
| 15:21.55 | brlcad | in a box |
| 15:22.16 | brlcad | (takes about 9 minues to run) |
| 15:22.53 | root_ | RT reports the following version information: |
| 15:22.53 | root_ | BRL-CAD Release 7.12.4 The BRL-CAD Raytracer RT |
| 15:22.53 | root_ | BRL-CAD Release 7.12.4 The BRL-CAD Ray-Tracing Library |
| 15:22.53 | root_ | BRL-CAD Release 7.12.4 The BRL-CAD Numerical Computation Library |
| 15:22.53 | root_ | BRL-CAD Release 7.12.4 The BRL-CAD Utility Library |
| 15:22.54 | root_ | Minimum run time is 3 minutes, 12 seconds |
| 15:22.56 | root_ | Maximum run time is 30 minutes |
| 15:22.58 | root_ | Estimated time is 9 minutes, 36 seconds |
| 15:23.04 | root_ | Running the BRL-CAD Benchmark tests... please wait ... |
| 15:23.06 | root_ | +++++ moss |
| 15:23.08 | root_ | Frame 0: 357882 rays in 1.40 sec = 255252.77 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 15:23.10 | root_ | Frame 1: 715764 rays in 2.69 sec = 266573.31 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 15:23.12 | root_ | Frame 4: 5726112 rays in 20.19 sec = 283580.98 rays/sec (RTFM) |
| 15:23.18 | brlcad | eek |
| 15:23.21 | brlcad | not the whole thing :) |
| 15:23.34 | brlcad | way too much for irc |
| 15:23.47 | brlcad | wait until it finishes |
| 15:24.01 | root_ | ok |
| 15:24.11 | root_ | and then? |
| 15:25.00 | brlcad | there will be a #*#*#* box, print the two lines inside |
| 15:25.01 | root_ | look the end part? |
| 15:25.14 | root_ | ook |
| 15:25.36 | brlcad | or "cat summary" |
| 15:30.12 | root_ | Output was saved to run-3187-benchmark.log from /tmp |
| 15:30.12 | root_ | Benchmark testing complete. |
| 15:30.24 | root_ | Benchmark results indicate an approximate VGR performance metric of 1626 |
| 15:30.25 | root_ | Logarithmic VGR metric is 3.21 (natural logarithm is 7.39) |
| 15:30.35 | root_ | is this? |
| 15:31.49 | root_ | is this fine? |
| 15:37.03 | brlcad | that's it, thanks |
| 15:54.08 | root_ | ? |
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| 16:42.38 | ``Erik | w00t, got my experiment box up |
| 16:43.33 | brlcad | which is that? |
| 17:03.49 | ``Erik | the wally world special that I souped up, running fbsd-current |
| 17:04.11 | ``Erik | one of the drives was shot which was preventing the entire machine from booting :/ |
| 17:04.24 | ``Erik | like, not even trying to post |
| 17:07.28 | brlcad | finally updates ze fresh meat |
| 17:45.21 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-040-234.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 17:50.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31546 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: add an automatic options usage statement to the help and don't ignore invalid options. clean up the usage printing a little bit too. |
| 17:56.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31547 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/ (Makefile.am mged.sh): |
| 17:56.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: add a new regression test for mged. it makes sure mged will run, can create a |
| 17:56.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: geometry database, and then evalutes the commands available. for every command |
| 17:56.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: available, it makes sure that it exits, runs successfully without reporting an |
| 17:56.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: error, and has a help/usage statement. this has already unvelieved a few issues |
| 17:56.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: that should get fixed (edcolor kicking off an editor, rt-tools crashing with a |
| 17:56.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: bu_log write error, few commands missing (recent libged changes)). |
| 17:57.04 | ``Erik | does some more updating on the old machine named 'the new bz' |
| 17:57.12 | brlcad | cool |
| 17:57.27 | brlcad | almost did that this weekend |
| 17:57.29 | brlcad | *almost* |
| 17:57.39 | brlcad | instead wanted to get some coding done |
| 17:58.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31548 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/mged.sh: oops, numeric test |
| 17:59.22 | ``Erik | I'm just running cvsup, mebbe building world and then doing a portupgrade... no migration tuff |
| 17:59.25 | ``Erik | tuff |
| 17:59.26 | ``Erik | stuff |
| 17:59.41 | ``Erik | sssssssssssssssssstuff. damn s key |
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| 18:47.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31549 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: fixed typo |
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| 20:16.54 | brlcad | ``Erik: you might like this: http://www.pawfal.org/Software/fluxus/ |
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| 00:30.55 | ``Erik | interesting |
| 00:31.22 | ``Erik | "and sometimes osx" |
| 02:57.05 | brlcad | downloaded the osx binary, no go (must be intel me thinks, at a ppc atm) |
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| 09:49.23 | mafm | hallo |
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| 12:14.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31550 10/brlcad/trunk/ (1124 files in 80 dirs): Boost (header only include library) initial import, using bcp |
| 12:32.59 | brlcad | heh, wow, that's big for header only :) |
| 12:33.14 | brlcad | initial import of what? |
| 12:42.27 | mafm | brlcad: did you have the chance to test the branch |
| 12:42.28 | mafm | ? |
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| 13:21.07 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 13:27.52 | pacman87 | morning, all |
| 13:31.28 | mafm | 'allo pacman87 :) |
| 13:36.24 | d_rossberg | morning pacman97 |
| 13:37.54 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: i've looked into the sketch primitive, and there's 4 types of segments to deal with: line segment, circular arc, bezier spline, and nurbs |
| 13:40.04 | pacman87 | for now, i'm thinking it would be best to limit the order of the splines to be able to solve intersetions analytically |
| 13:40.20 | d_rossberg | right, and in the extrude the nurb isn't implemented, probable because it isn't trivial |
| 13:41.20 | pacman87 | so my overall plan is to start with just line segments, and get them working, before moving on the the more complex ones |
| 13:41.23 | d_rossberg | i would say you have to multiply the degree of the sketch with the one of the spline to get the order of the surface |
| 13:41.48 | pacman87 | 'degree of the sketch'? |
| 13:42.28 | d_rossberg | i mean the degree of the segments (line is 1, arc is 2 etc.) |
| 13:43.09 | pacman87 | and the spline is for sweeping |
| 13:43.20 | pacman87 | sorry, i'm still just thinking revolve at the moment |
| 13:44.17 | d_rossberg | it depends on where your priorities are, i would start with a degree 2 sketch and degree 2 spline (or revolve) |
| 13:44.31 | d_rossberg | i.e. both build from 3 point beziers |
| 13:45.02 | pacman87 | so do you think revolve should only be a subset of sweep? |
| 13:45.35 | pacman87 | like how sph is really an ell? |
| 13:45.50 | d_rossberg | you can reach a revolve effect from a sweep on a circle |
| 13:46.13 | d_rossberg | however, i like the idea to have a distinct revolve primitive |
| 13:46.38 | pacman87 | right, because then i can make revolve-specific performance enhancements |
| 13:46.47 | pacman87 | that dont' necessarliy apply to all sweeps |
| 13:48.38 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31551 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/rbgui/Gui/Source/PosixPlatformManager.cpp: Fix for lame error preventing the fix for autorepeat behaviour to work -- the huge amounts of unimportant warnings were masking this. |
| 13:50.19 | d_rossberg | if you once got the revolve you could perhaps develop the sweep from it like: "revolves" along a spline |
| 13:50.28 | pacman87 | one problem i see is determine which segments to test for intersection, or to test all of them |
| 13:51.12 | d_rossberg | in a first attempt: all segments |
| 13:52.00 | pacman87 | my general plan is to essentially take the 'reverse' of the sweep path, and apply that transformation to the ray, and project the ray onto the 2d sketch surface |
| 13:52.45 | pacman87 | ie, if you 'unbend' a revolve, the ray becomes a hyperbola |
| 13:53.56 | d_rossberg | your plan sounds still good :) |
| 13:54.02 | pacman87 | and looking toward sweep, is there already a way to store a 3d spline, or will i have to creat something for that specifically? |
| 13:57.09 | pacman87 | should the 3d path spline be created/edited seperately, or inside the sweep only? |
| 13:58.26 | d_rossberg | store the spline: hard to say, it depends on the spline, there is the bu_list but this may be not optimal |
| 13:58.51 | pacman87 | could that be its own primitive, like sketch? |
| 13:59.55 | pacman87 | so if you want two parallel sweeps, you specify the same sketch and path, and change the vertex |
| 14:00.30 | d_rossberg | it could be an own primitive but this also means that it is its own live in some sense |
| 14:00.50 | d_rossberg | (3D sketch) |
| 14:01.32 | d_rossberg | you could get two parallel sweeps by copying the primitive ... |
| 14:02.54 | pacman87 | if you copy, and have to edit the path, will those changes affect both? |
| 14:03.13 | d_rossberg | no |
| 14:04.09 | pacman87 | and if you wanted that behavior, you could copy the path |
| 14:04.13 | d_rossberg | but you could add a primitive twice to the geometry with different matrices |
| 14:06.37 | pacman87 | what problems do you see with storing the path seperately? |
| 14:07.06 | d_rossberg | but you have a point there: i would be a nice feature to be able to sweep different shapes along a sweep line |
| 14:07.41 | d_rossberg | with the sweep path the problem might not be so big: |
| 14:08.24 | d_rossberg | because you define it, you may define it in a way you won't get any problems with your sweep primitive |
| 14:09.08 | d_rossberg | i.e. "a 3D sketch has at most degree 2 spline segments" |
| 14:09.58 | pacman87 | would there be a practical use for a 3d sketch besides the sweep? |
| 14:11.18 | d_rossberg | i would expect it to have a practical use because the large CAD packages have this |
| 14:12.22 | pacman87 | the only thing i remember using 3d sketches for is for sweeps/lofts |
| 14:13.33 | pacman87 | but if there are other uses, i'd be better to not restrict the path, and just have a flag for isSweepable |
| 14:14.27 | d_rossberg | the sketches in BRL-CAD have a "comment" role, but i can't see why these "comments" should be 2D only |
| 14:14.57 | pacman87 | wasnt' that on the list of improvements? |
| 14:17.25 | d_rossberg | i don't like the idea with the flag, this would make it possible to destroy the sweeps inadvertently |
| 14:18.22 | pacman87 | while editing the path? |
| 14:19.03 | d_rossberg | i'm not sure but could the parametrics/constraint help? |
| 14:19.58 | pacman87 | i think the p/c stuff is about physical relationships, and the problem here is with the math behind it all |
| 14:21.02 | pacman87 | it's also possible to set the isSweepable flag when you create the path, and require the user to explicitly change it |
| 14:21.10 | pacman87 | so if it's set, it doesnt allow changes to break it |
| 14:21.33 | pacman87 | but then that becomes close to a whole different primitive |
| 14:21.45 | pacman87 | ie, path vs 3dsketch |
| 14:22.32 | d_rossberg | the is-a relationship works only in one direction |
| 14:23.02 | pacman87 | path is a sketch3d |
| 14:23.13 | d_rossberg | right |
| 14:23.16 | pacman87 | with additional restrictions |
| 14:25.24 | d_rossberg | an other solution would be to have default replacements for "unknown" segments (e.g. build a spline of line segments from a nurb curve) |
| 14:26.42 | pacman87 | using a bezier curve would require fewer segments |
| 14:26.54 | pacman87 | and keep the surface curvature better |
| 14:27.35 | pacman87 | since i'll have to check each segment in the sketch |
| 14:27.45 | d_rossberg | only if you have an algorithm for converting a nurb into a bezier spline |
| 14:27.56 | pacman87 | true :) |
| 14:29.33 | pacman87 | the other issue with is-a is that C doesnt really do inheritance |
| 14:30.22 | pacman87 | i suppose it'd be done using the functab |
| 14:31.06 | d_rossberg | you may get the beziers if you attach the border conditions to the line segments |
| 14:32.06 | d_rossberg | functab: this is more an replacement for a switch ... case |
| 14:33.05 | d_rossberg | i.e. switch (object_type) ... case hyp: ... |
| 14:34.14 | pacman87 | well, if path just references the sketch3d functions when it doesnt' need to change them, and references its own functions when there are changes |
| 14:38.38 | d_rossberg | this would only mean you are reusing code but actual you have two diferent primitives |
| 14:39.47 | pacman87 | is that a problem? |
| 14:41.45 | d_rossberg | reusing code isn't a problem but it looks like you should care for the path and if there is a 3dsketch it might reuse your code |
| 14:42.51 | d_rossberg | we would need something like a validator connected to the primitives |
| 14:43.14 | clock_ | win 12 |
| 14:45.14 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 14:45.57 | pacman87 | so just get the path working now, and worry about sketch3d later |
| 14:46.07 | d_rossberg | this validator could be implemented as a new functab method (if this don't go to far away) |
| 14:46.21 | d_rossberg | path vs. sketch3d: yes |
| 14:46.25 | pacman87 | what would be validated? |
| 14:46.34 | d_rossberg | the primitive |
| 14:46.37 | pacman87 | order of sketch and path? |
| 14:47.09 | d_rossberg | a validator is a funktion which returns for a primitive true or false |
| 14:47.25 | d_rossberg | true if it's ok, false if not |
| 14:47.31 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 14:48.12 | d_rossberg | i.e. an editor has to call the validator to test the changed primitive |
| 14:48.24 | pacman87 | like how primitives do basic checking before prep() and others |
| 14:48.40 | pacman87 | but moved to it's own function |
| 14:48.43 | pacman87 | make sense |
| 14:48.46 | pacman87 | makes* |
| 14:50.56 | d_rossberg | but in practice it's not so easy e.g. there should be a hint to the user if the validator fails |
| 14:57.59 | pacman87 | right |
| 14:58.43 | pacman87 | i think i've answered your email question, is there anything else i missed? |
| 14:59.51 | pacman87 | i'll update the wiki for revolve, and create a page for sweep to outline everything |
| 15:06.12 | d_rossberg | this is what i wanted to ask you for: document your plans for revolve and sweep on the brlcad.org wiki |
| 15:07.09 | d_rossberg | i'm full of hope :) |
| 15:15.45 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 16:15.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31552 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Adding window which will act as taskbar. Only the skeleton, at the moment. |
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| 16:22.38 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31553 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiTaskbar.h: Fixing doxygen comments. |
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| 17:39.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31554 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Removing debugging messages |
| 17:40.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31555 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (17 files in 4 dirs): Add includes and graphics through Lesson 5 |
| 17:41.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31556 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/learning_boolean_expressions.xml: Whoopsie, add the xml file as well as the images |
| 17:48.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31557 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (8 files): |
| 17:48.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Introducing Window Base class, so the rest of the windows are derived from it. |
| 17:48.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: This allows to have some operations factored out, and to have lists of windows |
| 17:48.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: present and so on (which is immediately useful for the taskbar, in example). |
| 18:05.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31558 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Delegating more functionality in the windows base class. |
| 18:08.34 | mafm | brlcad, are you back? |
| 18:15.19 | pacman87 | what's the best (ie, user friendly) way to specify the start/end planes of the revolve? |
| 18:17.46 | starseeker | Are your start/end planes constrained relative to each other? |
| 18:18.18 | pacman87 | i know i need the revolve axis (point + vector) |
| 18:18.37 | pacman87 | and a way to specify which plane passing though that axis is the start plane |
| 18:20.08 | pacman87 | they could be constrained relativly by giving the first plane, and an agnle |
| 18:20.09 | pacman87 | angle |
| 18:20.26 | starseeker | Hmm - I'd guess for full generality you'd need to specify another vector perpendicular to the revolve axis, but that's just off the cuff |
| 18:20.36 | pacman87 | that's what i was thinking too |
| 18:20.46 | starseeker | yes, once the start plane is identified the end plane could be identified by an angle |
| 18:21.03 | pacman87 | would you perfer an angle, or a second vector to define the end plane? |
| 18:21.08 | starseeker | angle |
| 18:21.09 | pacman87 | ok |
| 18:21.38 | starseeker | you might optionally take a second vector, if there is a way to work it |
| 18:22.11 | pacman87 | i dont' think you can overload 'in' |
| 18:22.53 | pacman87 | though i suppose once the p/c is fully integrated with the primitives, you could jsut use that |
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| 18:23.40 | starseeker | well, you could do like ell1 and ell2 |
| 18:24.05 | starseeker | er ell and ell1 rather |
| 18:24.16 | starseeker | have a sweep and sweep1 primitive |
| 18:24.33 | pacman87 | what should i name the revolve? |
| 18:24.35 | pacman87 | rev? |
| 18:24.54 | starseeker | iirc, ell and ell1 exist because they take different parameters for the same geometric shape |
| 18:25.33 | starseeker | hmm. rev is less typing, but extrude uses the full name... |
| 18:25.49 | pacman87 | but ext is a filesystem |
| 18:25.59 | starseeker | and rev is revision :-) |
| 18:26.03 | pacman87 | right |
| 18:26.17 | pacman87 | rvl |
| 18:26.35 | starseeker | It's a brlcad question, but my sense would be to go ahead and use revolve to keep it consistent with extrude |
| 18:26.49 | pacman87 | and sweep instead of swp |
| 18:26.57 | pacman87 | swp looks like swap |
| 18:27.18 | starseeker | right - extrude needs a sketch, and so will revolve/sweep yes? |
| 18:27.23 | pacman87 | yes |
| 18:28.25 | pacman87 | i'll have to specify the point/axis in both the 3D side, and the 2D sketch side |
| 18:28.30 | starseeker | I think pipe is the only non-sketch based primitive with a full name... |
| 18:28.42 | starseeker | yeah, check with brlcad |
| 18:28.44 | pacman87 | sketch is too |
| 18:29.06 | starseeker | heh - is sketch sketch based? :-P |
| 18:29.41 | starseeker | probably not, strictly speaking |
| 18:29.49 | pacman87 | no, it doesnt' reference a sketch |
| 18:30.07 | starseeker | My instinct is to go with full names as being more descriptive, now that we have tab completion |
| 18:30.26 | starseeker | although I don't know if that works for primitive type, come to think of it |
| 18:32.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31559 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiConsole.cxx GuiConsole.h): Properly center console vertically |
| 18:57.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31560 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiTaskbar.cxx GuiTaskbar.h): Implementing the buttons in the task bar (not complete) |
| 18:57.19 | mafm | I have to go now, see you guys |
| 18:58.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31561 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (10 files in 3 dirs): Add lesson 6 |
| 19:04.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31562 10/brlcad/trunk/ (12 files in 5 dirs): Remove tcl.c from libged. Added ged_obj.c to libtclcad. Call Ged_Init from Tclcad_Init. Added struct ged_obj to tclcad.h. |
| 19:19.06 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31563 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Added ged.c to Makefile.am. Added erase.c and erase_all.c to CMakeLists.txt |
| 19:21.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31564 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Add Lessson 7 |
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| 20:04.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31565 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (9 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 8 |
| 20:33.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31566 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (9 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 9 |
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| 20:34.24 | starseeker | attempts to uncross eyeballs |
| 20:51.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31567 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 10 |
| 20:55.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31568 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Split out the ls command from wdb_obj. Added the ls command to ged_obj. |
| 21:06.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31569 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 11 |
| 22:05.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31570 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (8 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 12 |
| 22:37.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31571 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (12 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 13 |
| 23:09.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31572 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (11 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 14 |
| 23:30.32 | pacman87 | so there's a 2d point, but no 2d vector? |
| 23:46.46 | pacman87 | make[2]: *** No rule to make target `solver_test.c', needed by `solver_test.o'. Stop. |
| 23:49.21 | poolio | pacman87: distclean :) I had that same issue |
| 23:49.36 | pacman87 | poolio: thanks |
| 23:53.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31573 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (15 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 15 |
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| 00:25.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31574 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (11 files in 3 dirs): Add Lesson 16 |
| 00:25.46 | starseeker | Wooooo-hooooooo! |
| 00:26.54 | houdin8888 | Hi all. I'm new to this BRL-CAD. Just wanted to say hello. |
| 00:27.08 | starseeker | peels eyeballs off monitor |
| 00:27.13 | pacman87 | houdin8888: hi |
| 00:27.19 | starseeker | howdy and welcome |
| 00:27.30 | houdin8888 | thank you. thank you |
| 00:28.24 | houdin8888 | just trying to get me teeth into some CAD experience. thought i'd go the open-source route. glad there's so much out there. |
| 00:29.46 | houdin8888 | would anyone suggest an easy tutorial for someone (myself) wishing to start using BRL-CAD on MS Vista? |
| 00:32.32 | houdin8888 | i wanted to try the "benchmark" images using script run.sh, but couldn't find the "bench" directory. |
| 00:34.31 | houdin8888 | hmm. did i say something wrong? |
| 00:35.58 | houdin8888 | ?lib |
| 00:39.41 | starseeker | heh - no |
| 00:39.44 | starseeker | we're in and out |
| 00:40.37 | houdin8888 | ic, its ok. i know i have a very high learning curve to climb. |
| 00:40.55 | starseeker | For tutorials the standard starting point is here: http://brlcad.org/w/images/c/cf/Introduction_to_MGED.pdf |
| 00:41.30 | houdin8888 | ahh.. yes,. I have that one. thanks. |
| 00:42.19 | houdin8888 | i read the first pdf in the series... haven't yet digested this 2nd pdf |
| 00:42.53 | starseeker | The second one is the "real" introductory documentation |
| 00:43.07 | starseeker | in the sense that it is the volume that gets you working with CAD geometry |
| 00:43.09 | houdin8888 | i'm beginning to see that. |
| 00:43.47 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 00:43.55 | starseeker | Hey yukonbob |
| 00:43.59 | houdin8888 | Hello! |
| 00:44.02 | yukonbob | hey starseeker |
| 00:44.30 | starseeker | is now MUCH closer to having a reasonable Volume II docbook conversion |
| 00:44.34 | yukonbob | houdin8888: expect a _steep_, steep learning curve, and once you stop and look around, find it's all been worth it ;) |
| 00:44.52 | houdin8888 | i am very hopeful |
| 00:45.18 | yukonbob | <yoda>There is no hope; only do, or do not</yoda> |
| 00:45.38 | pacman87 | there is no try |
| 00:45.38 | houdin8888 | hehe |
| 00:45.40 | starseeker | houdin8888: Do you have any experience in other CAD systems? |
| 00:45.41 | yukonbob | ^--- bastardization, but wth... |
| 00:45.52 | houdin8888 | googlesketch |
| 00:46.07 | yukonbob | houdin8888: CSG (ie: POVRay)? |
| 00:46.39 | houdin8888 | i must admit near total ignorance.. but, been a long time wannabe |
| 00:46.52 | starseeker | OK. I could go Yoda and say "you must unlearn what you have learned" but it would be more accurate to say that prior experience is not terribly applicable to BRL-CAD |
| 00:47.17 | starseeker | It's a very DIFFERENT way of modeling for most folks |
| 00:47.35 | houdin8888 | i like the idea that BRL-CAD was used to predict ballistic effectiveness |
| 00:47.43 | starseeker | s/was/is |
| 00:47.46 | starseeker | still in active use |
| 00:48.01 | starseeker | although BRL-CAD itself doesn't do the military predictions |
| 00:48.01 | yukonbob | houdin8888: you're getting into the advanced stuff; long path to balistic modelling ;) |
| 00:48.12 | starseeker | it is used by other software that does |
| 00:48.16 | houdin8888 | true... but, i like pyrotechnics |
| 00:48.29 | starseeker | heh - sorry, no explosions |
| 00:48.37 | yukonbob | predicts somebody is going to be disappointed... |
| 00:49.00 | starseeker | If you want to animate stuff being blown up, Blender is probably a better bet ;-) |
| 00:49.15 | houdin8888 | no disappointment.. I'm committed to learning this computer graphics modeling program |
| 00:49.21 | yukonbob | prefers the easy route and goes to a movie |
| 00:49.24 | starseeker | can't understand why their second movie project didn't get more notice... |
| 00:49.37 | starseeker | Big Buck Bunny or something like that |
| 00:49.46 | yukonbob | hrmm... first I've heard of it... |
| 00:49.55 | starseeker | one sec... |
| 00:49.57 | yukonbob | hits alta vista |
| 00:50.15 | starseeker | www.bigbuckbunny.org |
| 00:51.13 | starseeker | Not only did they do it with Blender, but all the content files are available under creative commons licenses |
| 00:51.21 | yukonbob | neat |
| 00:51.40 | starseeker | figures someone will be doing a bunny vs. penguin faceoff at some point... |
| 00:51.47 | yukonbob | we're undergoing a mini rennaisance with media and licensing... |
| 00:51.50 | starseeker | It's near Pixar level animation |
| 00:53.25 | starseeker | is still annoyed at slashdot for not giving them a front page article |
| 00:53.46 | houdin8888 | nice find (bigbuckbunny) |
| 00:54.30 | starseeker | It's the successor project to Elephant's Dream, which was the Blender project's first such move. Well done, very artsy, very weird viewing experience |
| 00:54.55 | starseeker | Big Buck Bunny was intended to appeal to a wider audience |
| 00:55.20 | starseeker | Ah, well |
| 00:56.01 | starseeker | They may have tried to avoid the slashdot effect, given how large the movie files are |
| 00:56.41 | starseeker | either everyone's watching it or I chased everyone away ;-) |
| 00:56.59 | houdin8888 | i'm watchin the movie trailer |
| 00:57.04 | starseeker | heh |
| 00:58.08 | starseeker | must get out of here, back on later |
| 00:58.20 | houdin8888 | nice to meet ya |
| 01:12.32 | *** join/#brlcad Byron1 (n=byron@pool-96-229-127-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 01:12.56 | Byron1 | how can I create an empty box with no top |
| 01:13.50 | brlcad | Byron1: depends what sort of box, thickness of walls, etc |
| 01:14.35 | Byron1 | I would like to create a box similiar to a battery |
| 01:14.44 | brlcad | one of the easiest ways is to just create an arb8 (a box), then subtract a slightly smaller arb8 from it that is shifed up |
| 01:15.26 | brlcad | the 'inside' command will create an inner arb8 easily, then you can just extrude the top face to make it "open" |
| 01:15.37 | Byron1 | Could the box then not have a top? |
| 01:15.58 | Byron1 | How can you extrude the top |
| 01:17.09 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 01:17.13 | brlcad | nice doc progress! |
| 01:17.54 | brlcad | Byron1: yes, the same arb8 that makes the exterior can be made to remove the top |
| 01:18.24 | brlcad | when you're editing an arb8, one of the (many) editing options is moving faces |
| 01:19.18 | Byron1 | If you move a face can it be removed from the box? |
| 01:19.20 | brlcad | pacman87: yeah, 'revolve' and 'sweep' probably best -- the old short names were from ancient days where every keystroke was precious and cryptic names were the standard convention |
| 01:20.11 | brlcad | Byron1: "yes and no" .. you cannot have an arb8 with a side missing, that's topologically not solid geometry |
| 01:20.24 | brlcad | but you can certainly make a box with a hole in the top |
| 01:20.35 | brlcad | two primitives, bam |
| 01:22.00 | brlcad | the geometry must always preserve a solidity constraint, hence solid primitives -- even with brep, it wouldn't be allowed |
| 01:22.36 | brlcad | Byron1: have you gone through the basic mged tutorials? .. that might help explain things a bit |
| 01:23.18 | Byron1 | Yes I have gone through the tutorials. And they have helped out a lot. |
| 01:24.29 | Byron1 | I thought that I could make a glass box with a steal plate inside and be able to see the plate |
| 01:25.17 | brlcad | pacman87: there is and is not a 3D spline structure you can use.. openNURBS provides it (as do several of our older tools internally like 'track', the anim tools, and joint solving) |
| 01:25.19 | Byron1 | Also I figured I could do a thin arb8 to make the bottom non transparent |
| 01:25.37 | brlcad | sounds reasonable |
| 01:26.50 | Byron1 | if the top was transparent I figured that that would give the impression to the top not there |
| 01:33.17 | brlcad | it would if it was fully transparent |
| 01:33.52 | brlcad | the thing is those are region properties, you'd have to create a separate object for each side of the box and make just the top fully transparent .. which would be silly |
| 01:35.14 | brlcad | makes a quick example |
| 01:42.30 | brlcad | Byron1: http://brlcad.org/tmp/box.png |
| 01:42.57 | brlcad | that's four primitives, two that make the glass box (that has no top), one for the bottom checkered plate, and the sphere |
| 01:44.02 | brlcad | Byron1: and the geometry for that is here: http://brlcad.org/tmp/box.g |
| 01:50.06 | brlcad | starseeker: you'll see a lot of "very weird viewing experiences" at siggraph, even more so than elephant's dream |
| 01:50.48 | brlcad | lots of really interesting (and huge) artistic influence.. they tend to be the fun side of siggraph :) |
| 02:08.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31575 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: add a 2d point type to finish out the set, plus some minor ws consistency updates |
| 02:15.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31576 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: busted, define the right names so it'll compile |
| 02:16.40 | pacman87 | brlcad: there was a 2d point, the 2d vector was missing |
| 02:18.43 | brlcad | just a bad comment |
| 02:18.59 | pacman87 | just checking ;) |
| 02:19.03 | brlcad | nods |
| 02:20.56 | brlcad | also, wouldn't worry about aligning the sketch (does extrude try to?) |
| 02:21.57 | brlcad | pacman87: also, just background info, it was missing simply because nobody had needed them yet (at least from a vmath perspective) |
| 02:23.19 | brlcad | try to only add things exactly when they're needed, otherwise maintenance grows faster than is useful if you develop speculatively |
| 02:23.37 | brlcad | rather, the cost of that maintenance is high |
| 02:24.01 | brlcad | that goes for most of the code in brl-cad, though some parts less than others (i.e. they need refactoring) |
| 02:24.38 | pacman87 | aligning the sketch with what? |
| 02:25.24 | brlcad | you'd asked assuming the y-axis |
| 02:25.37 | brlcad | or using point/vector |
| 02:26.10 | pacman87 | right |
| 02:26.35 | pacman87 | so you're saying just to use the y axis? |
| 02:29.08 | brlcad | I think that's a safe assumption |
| 02:29.27 | brlcad | just because, as example, I don't recall extrude accounting for sketch rotation in any way |
| 02:29.32 | brlcad | not much different |
| 02:30.17 | brlcad | the only thing I can think of is that it might require some changes to the sketch editor to get something that perfectly clamps to that y-axis |
| 02:30.42 | pacman87 | for extrude, you give the height vector, and one of the axes (i forget which), and it aligns the sketch with that |
| 02:30.46 | brlcad | I believe it dynamically scales the domain when the bounds are reached |
| 02:31.33 | pacman87 | if it helps, i could just ignore everything in the -x side of the sketch |
| 02:31.57 | pacman87 | so the lines just have to cross the y-axis instead of stopping |
| 02:33.45 | brlcad | i'm thinking you might just have to auto-adjust the x-domain |
| 02:34.10 | brlcad | i.e. shift it to the right so it meets the first point/curve |
| 02:34.22 | brlcad | it == y-axis |
| 02:34.49 | pacman87 | so treat the y-axis as though it passes through the first point? |
| 02:36.20 | brlcad | ideally first piece of the sketch (which might not be a point), but sure point would be a decent second best |
| 02:36.38 | brlcad | first left-most point |
| 02:37.02 | poolio | brlcad: sorry I've been so inactive the past week...hopefully I'll get more done this one :) |
| 02:37.19 | pacman87 | i haven't actually used the sketch editor, so i dont' really know what im talking about |
| 02:37.25 | brlcad | poolio: hope so :) |
| 02:37.41 | brlcad | pacman87: you're not missing much :) |
| 02:38.09 | brlcad | it was a *very* rudimentary interface to have some means to tweak sketches that were being imported from other CAD systems |
| 02:38.17 | pacman87 | my parents and little bro are gone (college visiting), so i'm free to eat, sleep, and code for the next two days :) |
| 02:38.37 | brlcad | not intended for day-to-day use really .. with sweeps and revolves using them, having a new sketch editor becomes a much higher priority ;) |
| 02:38.45 | brlcad | maybe next gsoc follow-up ;) |
| 02:42.56 | brlcad | pacman87: awesome (regarding intense coding) woot :) |
| 02:43.34 | brlcad | pacman87: I hope you don't mind, but I sent out an announcement to our news mailing list about your progress on hyp |
| 02:44.17 | pacman87 | that reminds me, i still need to finish those last few things |
| 02:44.28 | pacman87 | revolve took over my brain too soon :) |
| 02:48.09 | pacman87 | when's the june release going out? |
| 02:50.32 | brlcad | don't worry about those few things, keep up on revolve |
| 02:50.40 | brlcad | someone else can wrap up those other pieces |
| 02:50.56 | pacman87 | someone else (tm) |
| 02:51.01 | brlcad | document them into the TODO file |
| 02:51.16 | pacman87 | ok, i wrote down the list |
| 02:51.55 | pacman87 | it's a great feeling when i can find a mathematical proof for my intuition |
| 02:52.05 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:58.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31577 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/asc2g.c: good gravy, there were three different ws/indent styles going on in here. make it more consistent. |
| 03:12.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31578 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/asc2g.c: more cleanup. turn the comment blocks into doxygen blocks, reorder functions so forward declarations are not necessary. |
| 03:14.58 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 03:22.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31579 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 5 dirs): deprecate HPT_LEN, HVECT_LEN, and ELEMENTS_PER_PT so that the defines are consistently ELEMENTS_PER_[type sans _t] across the board where they match the type they refer to. |
| 03:27.37 | poolio | brlcad: do you think the nmg structure -> brep will be useful in the long wrong? For arb8 it seems simpler to just duplicate the tess() code |
| 03:28.42 | brlcad | heh, subliminal slip? the long wrong sounds fun |
| 03:29.56 | poolio | haha. long run. uh oh :) |
| 03:30.15 | brlcad | no entiendo lo que dices |
| 03:30.17 | brlcad | explain |
| 03:31.10 | poolio | So, I'm working on just going from the struct model, the NMG model of the arb8 generated by tess and converting that to b-rep |
| 03:31.50 | poolio | But it is going to be a pain in terms of keeping track of objects/etc... and it seems easier to just hard code values (similar to breplicator and such) and duplicate a lot of the code from tess() |
| 03:32.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31580 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: woot, 3-fer-won .. the windows installer is better now, nsis goodness should be version aware now. |
| 03:32.51 | brlcad | breplicator is a *horrible* example to follow for *anything* .. other than simply understanding how the ON_Brep type works |
| 03:33.05 | brlcad | just so you know :) |
| 03:33.09 | pacman87 | nice name ;) |
| 03:33.31 | brlcad | there is/was no intention of keeping the tool around, it is a testing tool |
| 03:33.50 | brlcad | same with the two brep_ examples |
| 03:34.07 | brlcad | what objects do you have to keep track of? |
| 03:34.16 | brlcad | for an arb, there's just one shell |
| 03:34.36 | poolio | I understand that, I was just referencing the fact that to connect proper elements and such you need to keep track of them, and doing so with NMG seems more difficult than just doing it from a tess()-like method |
| 03:35.11 | brlcad | quite possibly true |
| 03:35.12 | poolio | Well, the vertices, edges, all the various elements |
| 03:35.24 | brlcad | i'd see how many other tess() routines will be directly useful |
| 03:35.27 | poolio | Although I suppose being able to work with the NMG may be useful in the future |
| 03:35.52 | brlcad | say you wrote some completely generic struct model -> ON_Brep routine (which you're going to have to write anyways |
| 03:36.05 | poolio | A lot of what I'm doing is kind of reverting the tess() work...it calculates what I need, puts it in NMG, and then I need to extract it. It'd be much easier to just work with the calculated values |
| 03:36.17 | brlcad | e.g. to support NMG primitives.. :) |
| 03:36.22 | poolio | fun fun :) |
| 03:36.31 | brlcad | s/primitives/primitive/ |
| 03:36.59 | brlcad | not a huge deal, /me thinks -- your call |
| 03:37.11 | brlcad | but I do think you'll end up needing that routine eventually |
| 03:37.16 | poolio | does NMG support non-linear curves? |
| 03:37.31 | brlcad | so if you have to tackle the hard problem, might as well avoid wasting the time redoing all the little easier problems |
| 03:37.44 | poolio | Yeah, makes sense...if I write it properly than I'm done the NMG primitive work...maybe I should just start there and not work specifically on arb8 |
| 03:38.02 | brlcad | yeah, sorta -- the bspline primitive is built on top of nmg |
| 03:38.27 | brlcad | (i.e. the old nurbs implementation) |
| 03:38.47 | poolio | ah k. but NMG is just lines? |
| 03:38.52 | brlcad | arbitrary bspline brep surfaces |
| 03:39.13 | poolio | The paper I borrowed talks about future work to support more types of curves in NMG |
| 03:39.20 | brlcad | nmg is technically just the structure (the 'uses') .. so it could be either |
| 03:39.33 | brlcad | in practice, they're all linear segments afair |
| 03:40.03 | brlcad | yeah, the entire bspline system is built on top of and/or into nmg |
| 03:40.22 | brlcad | you have all the uses references, but the things they're using are geometry (which can be anything) |
| 03:41.17 | brlcad | that's where opennurbs decided to pick a different set of terminology where historic used the 'uses' concept to distinguish topological structure from underlying geometry |
| 03:42.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31581 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: I wrote a script that checks for missing files in a dist some time ago |
| 03:43.32 | *** part/#brlcad Byron1 (n=byron@pool-96-229-127-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 03:43.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31582 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: promote testing the root solver patch |
| 03:44.03 | brlcad | last Byron1 |
| 03:44.12 | brlcad | er, cya |
| 03:51.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31583 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 03:51.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: more cleanup, promote integrating last summer's opennurbs update and reviewing |
| 03:51.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the root solver. raytrace progress can be obtained by sending a signal |
| 03:51.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (SIGUSR1), adrt was updated/decoupled, and environ doesn't seem as interesting |
| 03:51.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: as it used to. |
| 04:00.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31584 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 04:00.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: nice.. it's been hella long since I've apparently reviewed everything.. more |
| 04:00.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: completed. indentation was run, eclectic was (briefly) reviewed, autogen.sh is |
| 04:00.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: recursive, configure doesn't test stuff it doesn't need to, center of presented |
| 04:00.13 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: areas are implemented, we have mirror around arbitrary vectors, and there's a |
| 04:00.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: script to parse sf.net trackers |
| 04:26.43 | starseeker | gets vmplayer working and is impressed by Haiku |
| 04:26.47 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31585 10/brlcad/trunk/ (27 files in 2 dirs): apparently pkg-config wants the files to have the same name as the internal name, who woulda thunkd it. |
| 04:29.19 | starseeker | wonders how he's supposed to download stuff without a browser in the image... |
| 04:29.51 | starseeker | ah ha - wget |
| 04:29.56 | starseeker | of course |
| 04:30.38 | brlcad | or curl |
| 04:30.53 | brlcad | curl is slightly more prevalent than wget |
| 04:31.20 | starseeker | huh. wonder how I stumbled into wget first |
| 04:31.29 | starseeker | checks for curl... |
| 04:32.41 | brlcad | i believe wget might be older and it's good for copying sites (recursively) .. curl is a generalized URL tool |
| 04:32.50 | starseeker | ah |
| 04:32.50 | brlcad | curl -O http://brlcad.org/index.html |
| 04:33.13 | brlcad | curl http://brlcad.org/tmp/box.g > /tmp/box.g |
| 04:33.51 | starseeker | ah, I'll bet that was it - recursive site copying |
| 04:33.58 | brlcad | should find either on most linux distros |
| 04:34.02 | starseeker | remembers attempting that with a few websites |
| 04:34.09 | brlcad | bsd depends on what was installed |
| 04:34.19 | brlcad | mac has curl by default, but no wget |
| 04:34.36 | brlcad | windows has neither by default |
| 04:34.51 | brlcad | forget what solaris did |
| 04:35.51 | starseeker | is continually amazed by how little Windows has by default |
| 04:38.53 | starseeker | you're mowing through stuff brlcad - nice work yourself ;-) |
| 04:39.04 | starseeker | is reading scrollback... |
| 04:39.28 | brlcad | not what I wanted to get to |
| 04:39.59 | starseeker | What were you hoping for? |
| 04:45.20 | brlcad | oh, didn't get to rtarea rewrite, libged/mged refactor bit, and new gui tested |
| 04:48.31 | starseeker | ah |
| 04:49.11 | starseeker | well, for what it's worth, nice image in the release news item :-) rtwizard I'm guessing? |
| 04:49.27 | brlcad | hm? |
| 04:49.36 | brlcad | nah, I just whipped that up on the fly |
| 04:49.41 | starseeker | really |
| 04:49.46 | starseeker | nice |
| 04:49.55 | starseeker | 'course, I'm biased |
| 04:50.46 | brlcad | :) |
| 04:55.57 | brlcad | oo, there's a thought .. starseeker, have you tried tessellating a tire yet? with/without tread? |
| 04:59.13 | pacman87 | hmmm, my numpad took over my mouse, and i'd don't know why (or how to turn it off) |
| 04:59.21 | pacman87 | numlock doesnt' matter |
| 05:02.46 | starseeker | nope |
| 05:03.01 | starseeker | tried tessellating the mustang tire and it blew up |
| 05:03.09 | starseeker | tries... |
| 05:03.58 | pacman87 | starseeker's developing a new weapon |
| 05:04.08 | starseeker | pheer the tire |
| 05:04.19 | pacman87 | exploding tires |
| 05:04.47 | starseeker | sees he has done one too many system updates since last recompiling BRL-CAD... |
| 05:12.47 | starseeker | oo, nope - might have caught the libged transformation at a bad point... ok, gcc, do your stuff |
| 05:20.31 | starseeker | wonders how long before 8 core supercomputers cost less than $300... |
| 05:25.42 | PrezKennedy | you can get 4 core computers for not too bad |
| 05:28.18 | starseeker | supposes he should just be more regular about recompiling... |
| 05:31.19 | starseeker | let's try this... |
| 05:31.58 | starseeker | facetize ftire tire |
| 05:32.07 | starseeker | and the cpu goes nuts... |
| 05:34.50 | brlcad | would expect it to take a long while |
| 05:35.12 | brlcad | and .. um .. yeah, like at least daily :) |
| 05:35.30 | starseeker | heh - I'll get going on the machine at work and forget to update my home machine |
| 05:35.37 | starseeker | should set up a cron job... |
| 05:35.54 | brlcad | I used to have it compile continuously via cron |
| 05:36.14 | starseeker | wonders what brlcad's power bills were linke |
| 05:36.18 | starseeker | er like |
| 05:36.24 | brlcad | shrugs |
| 05:36.30 | brlcad | i never turn my machines off |
| 05:38.14 | starseeker | BRL-CAD - it's not just for modeling, it's also a space heating application! |
| 05:39.31 | starseeker | well, considering this is the model WITHOUT tread, I'd say lord help anyone who has to do this |
| 05:41.03 | starseeker | will let it run 'til morning |
| 05:41.21 | brlcad | tries one with tread |
| 05:41.51 | starseeker | can hear the machines flinching from here |
| 05:44.37 | brlcad | wonders why OIS is trying to compile Linux interface files on Mac OS X |
| 05:46.19 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@fw1.phys.sinica.edu.tw) | |
| 05:47.23 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-95-212.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 05:47.38 | brlcad | howdy Mouette |
| 05:47.59 | brlcad | which I could stay longer, gotta run though .. hopefully the e-mails were enough info |
| 05:50.16 | Mouette | ? |
| 06:11.18 | starseeker | bemusedly wonders if ReactOS could run the windows BRL-CAD binary |
| 07:04.30 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 07:19.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31586 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: duplicate entries removed |
| 10:04.32 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@fw1.phys.sinica.edu.tw) | |
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| 11:05.38 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:09.50 | mafm | hallo |
| 11:14.54 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
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| 11:36.46 | brlcad | Mouette: I see why you were confused .. my messages hadn't sent, some bug in my e-mail client had them just sitting in my outbox |
| 11:36.54 | brlcad | howdy mafm! |
| 11:39.06 | mafm | hi brlcad |
| 11:39.14 | mafm | did you see my messages in the log? |
| 11:39.31 | brlcad | yep |
| 11:39.57 | mafm | so did you try to build it? if so, any problems/comments? |
| 11:40.20 | brlcad | I did, making progress, but it's quite far from seamless :) |
| 11:40.38 | brlcad | not through getting the dependencies to build |
| 11:41.34 | mafm | you mean the dependencies of OGRE? |
| 11:41.41 | brlcad | no problems as yet, just annoyance of dependencies and each one having different build settings .. a couple are just crap build configurations on mac |
| 11:41.45 | mafm | I think that the others don't have almost dependencies |
| 11:42.10 | mafm | I see |
| 11:42.27 | brlcad | rather linux-specific atm |
| 11:43.33 | mafm | apart from that, I'd like to talk a bit about which functionalities create, how they should appear, etc |
| 11:43.53 | mafm | in example, the taskbar of the video doesn't have "minimize" |
| 11:44.14 | mafm | and I don't know if you'd like it or not, |
| 11:44.57 | mafm | also I think that it would be good to have some window controls when clicking in the buttons of the taskbar (close, whatever) |
| 11:45.32 | mafm | and having buttons in the taskbar somewhere for tiling/fullscreen, and things like that |
| 11:49.58 | mafm | I have to go to lunch though, be back in a bit :) |
| 11:49.58 | brlcad | minimization is an application modality |
| 11:50.09 | brlcad | it handles it by providing new sheets |
| 11:52.25 | brlcad | each tabbed sheet is effectively a new context, they're already effectively fullscreen unless there's a current 'task' in progress that might have caused a split or two |
| 11:52.31 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 11:53.02 | brlcad | from the *users* perspective, they shouldn't look or act like 'windows' |
| 11:55.34 | brlcad | part of the point of non-overlapping contexts, and one of the big usability impacts is window management, not letting the user waste time with window layout/organization, overlaps, and active states (source of many modality errors) |
| 11:56.24 | brlcad | that's talked about a fair bit throughout the IOE prototype |
| 11:56.48 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E41A.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 12:47.06 | starseeker | hrm. facetizing tire returned message: nmg_radial_build_list() min and max angle not adjacent in list (or list not monotone increasing) |
| 12:47.24 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 12:49.07 | starseeker | here's the full message: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m49a83cdf |
| 12:50.03 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_ (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 12:57.00 | Mouette | credit can be writen: Albatross Yang |
| 12:57.40 | Mouette | you can rename it as BRL-CAD_7.12.4_solaris_x86.pkg |
| 12:59.31 | Mouette | or other |
| 13:00.23 | Mouette | but have keeped the version number and platform name. |
| 13:09.42 | ``Erik | *snrkt* http://home.clara.net/lesmcdm/images/virgin.jpg (work safe) |
| 13:10.01 | ``Erik | ish, anyways |
| 13:13.04 | brlcad | that's *old* old :) |
| 13:13.16 | brlcad | sees someone is making there way through /. comments |
| 13:13.51 | brlcad | Mouette: can the two numbers that are inside the .pkg be manually edited safely? |
| 13:14.12 | brlcad | the version numbers that are listed as 7.2.14 .. if they can, I'll just make the direct edits |
| 13:16.19 | Mouette | you mean my version display 7.2.14 in my package? |
| 13:16.27 | brlcad | yes |
| 13:16.37 | Mouette | ok,i modify |
| 13:16.45 | brlcad | er, maybe 7.4.12 .. one of the two |
| 13:17.02 | brlcad | either way, it seemed .. not right :) |
| 13:17.38 | brlcad | starseeker: interesting tessellation .. fails on the tread, but gets the inner tube and hub just fine |
| 13:32.11 | Mouette | reuploading |
| 13:44.52 | PrezKennedy | flexspending blows |
| 13:45.11 | *** join/#brlcad piotrnikiel (n=piotrnik@cy243.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) | |
| 13:55.49 | mafm | brlcad: the problem is that I was imagining modeling as something similar to using GIMP |
| 13:56.11 | mafm | with many windows around to perform different operations on geometries |
| 13:56.47 | ``Erik | (bsd has 'fetch' standard, curl and wget are "linux weenie tools") |
| 13:58.06 | ``Erik | <-- *slow* slow, so it all works out |
| 13:58.11 | ``Erik | and I'm caught up! w00t |
| 13:58.52 | Mouette | i have done |
| 14:01.29 | brlcad | Mouette: got it, looking it over |
| 14:01.48 | brlcad | mafm: yes, that is a "problem" :) |
| 14:02.00 | ``Erik | "margarita? I thought that was a slushy!" |
| 14:02.44 | brlcad | mafm: that can be an option later (to allow broken out, overlapping window management), but isn't at all what we need first |
| 14:03.00 | mafm | so I don't know which kind of contexts are necessary to create |
| 14:03.52 | ``Erik | brlcad: do we have fastgen geometry stashed somewhere? there's some email noise about a fast4-g truncation error (ajem scr) |
| 14:04.04 | ``Erik | (or is it fixed?) |
| 14:04.15 | brlcad | two things to focus on, 1 - having one application window that can toggle between window and fullscreen and 2 - context/'window' management inside the application for the basic UI elements (taskbar, command overlay, graphics context, etc) |
| 14:04.26 | brlcad | brlcad: see TODO |
| 14:04.31 | brlcad | er ``Erik heh |
| 14:04.40 | ``Erik | ah, heh |
| 14:04.50 | ``Erik | doesn't answer my question, though, just the context statement |
| 14:05.07 | ``Erik | well, answers my second question, but... :D |
| 14:05.50 | brlcad | i have some somewhere, cad might on an unmounted disk |
| 14:06.16 | ``Erik | heh, and no g-fast4.c :D |
| 14:06.21 | brlcad | hence the todo, finding something to test was part of checking it out |
| 14:06.31 | brlcad | yep, somewhat intentionally .. |
| 14:06.54 | brlcad | there's not much point going from our format to theirs (from our perspective) |
| 14:08.11 | mafm | brlcad: the application window is OGRE I guess, that it already works in that way (can be resized, and the gui windows that I create adapt to that) |
| 14:08.40 | brlcad | i know it's ogre .. but can it go fullscreen? :) |
| 14:08.42 | mafm | brlcad: then the command overlay it's already there, but without autocompletion or things like that |
| 14:08.55 | brlcad | big window != fullscreen |
| 14:09.13 | mafm | then the graphicx context would be the top panel I guess |
| 14:09.17 | prasad1 | brlcad going fullscreen eh |
| 14:09.23 | mafm | sure, it's a toggle :) |
| 14:09.28 | brlcad | damn straight |
| 14:09.47 | mafm | you can even start in fullscreen |
| 14:09.59 | mafm | I just have to create a shortcut or something |
| 14:10.24 | prasad1 | got a screenshot of current progress? |
| 14:10.27 | brlcad | it'll probably eventually be a default |
| 14:12.33 | mafm | the first time that you start, as usual OGRE apps, ask you for display configuration, and you can set it |
| 14:12.50 | mafm | prasad1: http://wainu.ii.uned.es/~mafm/brlcad/brlcad_rbgui_20080623-1.png |
| 14:14.51 | brlcad | mafm: you say you have the translucent command overlay working? |
| 14:15.48 | mafm | not exactly... my initial idea of the console was a bit different, similar to IRC |
| 14:15.54 | brlcad | when I mean IOE is a prototype, it's not just in basic functionality but in appearance too :) |
| 14:16.01 | brlcad | we *also* need a console like you have |
| 14:16.10 | mafm | hmmm |
| 14:16.44 | mafm | so command overlay is the IOE-like one, and console IRC-like one, right? |
| 14:16.52 | brlcad | right |
| 14:16.58 | mafm | neat |
| 14:17.27 | brlcad | so the console would be something that you could toggle on/off that would fit to a given side (e.g. to the bottom) |
| 14:17.32 | mafm | the console one is also a full context? |
| 14:17.50 | mafm | ah, good |
| 14:18.12 | mafm | it's already working like that, only that I centered it thinking of the overlay |
| 14:18.34 | brlcad | it's a panel similar to when in the IOE he does a search and it creates a results panel on the right |
| 14:19.09 | mafm | so I think that I have enough work for a while, maybe then you or somebody else can test it and give more ideas |
| 14:20.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31587 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiTaskbar.cxx GuiTaskbar.h): Making buttons of the taskbar to react when clicked |
| 14:30.41 | mafm | brlcad: about shortcuts to enable different windows, fullscreen etc... are there guidelines, should I try to mimic something or should I invent them? |
| 14:38.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31588 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): Added the l, listeval and paths commands to libtclcad. Split out the code for the l and paths commands (from wdb_obj.c) into separate files in libged and modified to use struct ged. |
| 14:42.40 | brlcad | mafm: hook display of windows into the command window, some way to query what is available and enable/disable them |
| 14:43.07 | brlcad | otherwise, mimic'ing IOE as close as possible in appearance and function should be more than enough work to keep you busy for a couple weeks |
| 14:43.44 | brlcad | the only context missing is a graphics context, which is another packable widget type |
| 14:43.54 | brlcad | i.e. something to display some 3D geometry in |
| 14:44.01 | prasad1 | do these panels dock? |
| 14:44.27 | brlcad | prasad1: eventually, they should be auto-docked by default |
| 14:44.31 | prasad1 | i found the daz studio (free) interface pretty easy to use |
| 14:44.35 | prasad1 | it's based on qt |
| 14:44.36 | brlcad | prasad1: do you remember IOE? |
| 14:44.51 | prasad1 | what does ioe mean |
| 14:44.55 | brlcad | or had he not finished that by the time you left |
| 14:45.07 | brlcad | it was an interaction prototype that jason worked on |
| 14:45.25 | prasad1 | oh, prolly didnt start b4 i left |
| 14:45.33 | brlcad | oh, he'd started |
| 14:45.45 | brlcad | he'd started thinking about IOE before we left college :) |
| 14:45.54 | prasad1 | oh heh |
| 14:46.02 | brlcad | he just finally got to finishing a prototype for a class |
| 14:46.28 | prasad1 | know which class? |
| 14:46.28 | brlcad | it's pretty slick, lots of nice concepts |
| 14:46.46 | brlcad | it was a usability analysis class iirc |
| 14:47.01 | prasad1 | wait is this the thing he did for m3? |
| 14:47.07 | brlcad | nope |
| 14:47.08 | prasad1 | that got scratched |
| 14:47.17 | prasad1 | *shrug* |
| 14:47.40 | brlcad | it touches on some of the same concepts that m3 has/had, but really ends up being different |
| 14:50.38 | brlcad | there's a video if you wanna watch |
| 14:50.54 | prasad1 | utube? |
| 14:51.00 | brlcad | uporn |
| 14:51.08 | prasad1 | kinky |
| 14:51.23 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/design/gui/ioe_proto_final.mov |
| 14:51.50 | brlcad | forget the task center and exact example he's going over, it's the ways you interact and core concepts that are the meat |
| 14:52.01 | brlcad | takes about 10-15 min |
| 14:54.06 | prasad1 | interesting |
| 14:54.10 | prasad1 | something like quicksilver |
| 14:54.12 | brlcad | mafm: so for starters, go for full-window tabs that you can toggle with the console being one and a graphics context being another .. with top task bar and bottom tabs |
| 14:54.18 | brlcad | very much so |
| 14:55.59 | brlcad | it's a cross between quicksilver and something like http://www.suckless.org/wiki/wmii and aqua usability concepts |
| 14:58.50 | mafm | what do you mean bottom tabs -- the bottom tabs of MDI windows? |
| 15:03.27 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:04.52 | prasad1 | ioe is too much change for one political season |
| 15:04.53 | prasad1 | ;) |
| 15:05.46 | brlcad | mafm: no... the bottom tabs in ioe |
| 15:05.50 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31589 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Creating Command Overlay and changing a bit the settings for the other windows |
| 15:06.04 | mafm | mmm... the bottom tabs is what I call the taskbar |
| 15:06.08 | brlcad | mdi tabs suck |
| 15:06.21 | mafm | maybe you call the taskbar the upper panel? :D |
| 15:07.16 | brlcad | there's the bar on top and tabbed selector on the bottom .. call them what you want |
| 15:07.36 | brlcad | the one on the bottom should act like tabs, not buttons and not minimized windows |
| 15:08.00 | brlcad | more like tabs in a browser |
| 15:08.40 | brlcad | visually, that'st he one bit I didn't like -- it should be seamless to the context it activates (instead of appearing like a button) |
| 15:09.10 | mafm | so, not restoring the appearance as a button, but having one highlighted at a given time |
| 15:09.24 | brlcad | right |
| 15:09.37 | brlcad | or rather, dehilighting the others, and having one just be "normal" |
| 15:10.15 | mafm | I see |
| 15:10.36 | mafm | I guess that I have to do it that way (or create the Tab myself, because they don't seem to have that in the library) |
| 15:12.10 | brlcad | something sort of like this for the bottom: http://brlcad.org/tmp/tabs.png |
| 15:12.26 | brlcad | where it blends up but demphasizes the others |
| 15:14.18 | mafm | I see |
| 15:14.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31590 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series/VolumeII.xml: Fix docbook for authors so that it outputs cleanly |
| 15:17.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31591 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (list.c pathsum.c): include missing header, cast to fix type warning (const issue) |
| 15:19.25 | mafm | I guess that I should create some kind of "window manager" class to register the windows, the specialized unique windows (taskbar, etc) |
| 15:19.56 | mafm | and to take high-level layout decisions, such as tiling windows |
| 15:24.57 | brlcad | absolutely, that was part of the reason why I pointed you at wmii .. to see if maybe there was even some layout code that could be pulled from it |
| 15:25.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31592 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/pkgconfig/Makefile.am: libwdb typo |
| 15:26.10 | brlcad | they have two basic layout options, one being tabbed, the other being 'stacked'/shaded |
| 15:28.01 | mafm | I wonder if I can use wmii with KDE :D |
| 15:37.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31593 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (18 files in 2 dirs): Point all the lessons and the book itself to a single authors file in the tutorial series directory, since they're all pulled from the book |
| 15:40.28 | mafm | huh |
| 15:40.40 | mafm | not with KDE, but it's working now :D |
| 15:41.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31594 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/pathsum.c: Changed TCL_ERROR to GED_ERROR in a few places. |
| 16:17.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31595 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Changed a handfull of function name prefixes from bu_ bu_tcl_. |
| 16:29.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31596 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Stage 1/4 towards a simple binary constraint solver: Addition of simple Network and Solution class |
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| 16:42.48 | pacman87 | hmmm, so i have an arbitrary number of hitpoints to store and sort in shot(), but using a linked list requires memory allocation during shot. extrude just assumes there will be no more that 64 hitpoints |
| 17:06.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31597 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (11 files): |
| 17:06.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Introducing Window Manager class, which will perform high-level operations. One |
| 17:06.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: example of the future functionality is that it took over the window resized |
| 17:06.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: events: instead of registering all individual windows for render window resized |
| 17:06.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: events, only the window manager gets notified and then it delivers the event to |
| 17:06.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: some of the windows. |
| 17:30.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31598 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): |
| 17:30.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Removing Taskbar as separate window, and reintroduce it instead as a 'frame' |
| 17:30.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: window, part of the WindowManager class. This makes sense since WindowManager |
| 17:30.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: is already going to have the list of available windows, it should subtract the |
| 17:30.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: size of the taskbar when passing the available screen size to the rest of the |
| 17:30.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: windows, etc. |
| 17:34.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31599 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): beginning of revolve primitive, with shot() algorithm for straigh line sketches (untested) |
| 17:48.15 | mafm | uh |
| 17:48.24 | mafm | fullscreen works, but not very smoothly for me :D |
| 17:50.02 | mafm | well, when adding more resolution it works much better really |
| 17:53.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31600 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Adding fullscreen support |
| 17:59.57 | starseeker | Here's the html conversion as it currently stands: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/vol2/book/tutorial_series/ |
| 18:00.12 | starseeker | that stupid unicode character is at is again... |
| 18:00.28 | starseeker | why doesn't that happen on the local copy???? |
| 18:32.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31601 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (10 files): |
| 18:32.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Adding a bar in the top of the screen, that will be used for context actions, |
| 18:32.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: set fullscreen and similar tasks. Application class was made a Singleton so it |
| 18:32.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: can be accessed from elsewhere, in example to toggle fullscreen mode from the |
| 18:32.54 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: recently created top bar. |
| 18:48.32 | starseeker | Ah hah, getting closer - http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/vol2/book/tutorial_series/ |
| 18:50.31 | mafm | ~starseeker++ |
| 19:21.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31602 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/README: Add toplevel docbook readme with a few notes |
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| 19:56.41 | mafm | have to go now, take care guys |
| 19:56.45 | pacman87 | bye mafm |
| 19:57.27 | mafm | http://wainu.ii.uned.es/~mafm/brlcad/brlcad_rbgui_20080624-1.png |
| 19:57.28 | mafm | :) |
| 20:45.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31603 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added the attr command to libtclcad. Split out the code for the attr command (from wdb_obj.c) into a separate file in libged and modified it to use struct ged. |
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| 22:13.50 | brlcad | pacman87: you could preallocate a pool of memory during prep, put that into the specific structure, then only allocate if you run out |
| 22:14.13 | pacman87 | best of both worlds strategy? |
| 22:14.19 | brlcad | can use bu_vls or bu_vlb as automatic pools |
| 22:14.28 | brlcad | (probably vlb) |
| 22:14.47 | brlcad | yeah, it's a decent practical balance |
| 22:18.35 | brlcad | starseeker: I had them reversed, the server declaration does indeed override the meta declaration so the .htaccess and/or a section in httpd.conf that declares specific subtrees as utf-8 would be needed |
| 22:20.43 | brlcad | default setting for all sites is ISO-8859-1, so that makes more sense now |
| 22:21.25 | brlcad | could possibly change the whole server to utf-8, but would need a weekend to verify it doesn't break any sites |
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| 23:34.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31604 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: implement make, ted, edsol, mirror, and analyze for hyp primitive |
| 23:35.02 | brlcad | pacman87: does that magic number mean anything or did you pick random chars? |
| 23:35.17 | pacman87 | i think it's 'hype' |
| 23:35.27 | pacman87 | might be caps |
| 23:35.38 | brlcad | should document it in the header :) |
| 23:35.45 | brlcad | same for revolve |
| 23:39.08 | pacman87 | in magic.h? |
| 23:40.26 | brlcad | yep |
| 23:40.39 | pacman87 | ok |
| 23:58.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31605 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcNetwork.h solver_test.cpp): start class name in caps |
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| 00:36.45 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
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| 01:26.14 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 03:03.37 | geocalc | ./.libs/librt.so: undefined reference to `TclReFree' |
| 03:04.58 | pacman87 | geocalc: did you do ./configure --enable-all? |
| 03:05.14 | geocalc | no |
| 03:08.35 | geocalc | same error pacman87 |
| 03:09.27 | pacman87 | what version is your system tcl/tk? |
| 03:10.07 | pacman87 | are you using svn current? |
| 03:11.06 | geocalc | 8.5.2 pacman87 no svn |
| 03:11.37 | pacman87 | what OS? |
| 03:12.09 | geocalc | paldo linux 64 bits |
| 03:13.44 | pacman87 | geocalc: i guess you'll have to stick around until someone who knows what they're doing shows up |
| 03:13.58 | pacman87 | ./configure --enable-all fixed for me |
| 03:14.35 | geocalc | hah ok thanks pacman87 |
| 03:28.44 | brlcad | geocalc: you have to make clean after the enable-all |
| 03:28.54 | brlcad | else there are still object files with the bad reference |
| 03:29.31 | brlcad | the other quick fix to that problem is to edit src/librt/regionfix.c and add "#undef regfree" after the #include's |
| 03:29.42 | geocalc | i see thanks |
| 03:33.17 | brlcad | tcl screws up a header |
| 04:09.18 | brlcad | pacman87: fyi, traced down at least one of the existing spline curve structures: struct edge_g_cnurb in nmg.h |
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| 04:14.36 | brlcad | that would be a viable C approach, for C++ openNURBS provides a variety like ON_BezierCurve and ON_NurbsCurve |
| 04:14.50 | pacman87 | did i miss something? |
| 04:15.01 | brlcad | mebbie |
| 04:15.09 | brlcad | 00:09 <@brlcad> pacman87: fyi, traced down at least one of the existing spline curve structures: struct edge_g_cnurb in nmg.h |
| 04:19.44 | brlcad | anim and tracker were useless curves |
| 04:22.37 | brlcad | so that basically leaves you those c or c++ structures, either would be good for sweep .. probably making the curve be part of sweep (instead of sweep referring to one object for the sketch and another nmg or brep object for the curve |
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| 04:23.37 | pacman87 | ok, that was a question i had for sweep |
| 04:23.43 | pacman87 | whether the path would be seperate |
| 04:27.49 | brlcad | I think it can be down either way, but I see that more as being the values of the sweep |
| 04:28.17 | brlcad | it's not like we're going to sweep over anything else (although that does give rise to some interesting ideas) |
| 04:29.00 | pacman87 | well, if it's seperate, you could edit the path, or have 'parallel' sweeps using the same path and different start points |
| 04:29.14 | pacman87 | *edit the path seperately |
| 04:30.04 | brlcad | you could still conceivably edit it separately, I'm just not sure what that buys you |
| 04:30.22 | brlcad | given we *don't* presently allow editing of any non-solid geometry in 3D |
| 04:30.48 | brlcad | closest is the sketch, but that kicks off a separate 2D editor |
| 04:31.01 | pacman87 | what i meant was if you change the path, the both of your 'parallel |
| 04:31.08 | pacman87 | ' sweeps would change |
| 04:31.15 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:32.41 | brlcad | you can do it that way, I wouldn't object, but I'm just not convinced that flexibility is worth the complexity myself |
| 04:33.44 | brlcad | as you'd have to decide whether you're going to use bspline or brep objects (probably the latter if you go the object-route), and validate that it's just one curve (or maybe set of curves) |
| 04:33.57 | brlcad | if it's internal, it is what it is |
| 04:34.10 | brlcad | no chance for it to be invalid |
| 04:34.26 | pacman87 | checked on creation instead of import? |
| 04:34.41 | brlcad | que? |
| 04:35.23 | pacman87 | you're saying i could use the structure internally |
| 04:35.59 | pacman87 | if i have to limit the path to degree 2, then the internal structure could concievably be bad |
| 04:36.13 | geocalc | This probably means that tk wasn't installed properly. brlcad ? |
| 04:36.15 | brlcad | the options are a) sweep uses sketch and bspline, b) sweep uses sketch and brep, c) sweep uses sketch and internal spline |
| 04:37.02 | brlcad | geocalc: no it doesn't mean that .. it's just a bug in one of their headers, a really obscure one that only affects folks that seach them as a header search path |
| 04:37.29 | brlcad | the "problem" is that a) and b) can have a hell of a lot more in them than splines .. they're general brep containers |
| 04:37.48 | brlcad | not that the spline itself may be invalid if you have some constraints that have to be imposed |
| 04:38.03 | brlcad | the spline itself could be conceivably bad with a, b, or c |
| 04:38.09 | brlcad | that much is constant |
| 04:39.12 | brlcad | c) just gets rid of the generalized container, so you don't have to "validate" the bspline/brep |
| 04:39.48 | brlcad | it's not a huge deal, I think any of the three are perfectly viable |
| 04:40.52 | brlcad | my own inclination would probably be b) or c) leaning slightly to c) but using the nmg struct in a) internally during prep |
| 05:01.59 | geocalc | so brlcad to use mged i must recompile ? |
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| 10:41.22 | mafm | hi |
| 10:43.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31606 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Making the top panel visible, although not very elegantly. Cleanup of unused functions. |
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| 12:02.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31607 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: every file has to be mentioned here: added revolve.h |
| 12:04.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31608 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/CMakeLists.txt: beginning of revolve primitive: added revolve.c |
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| 12:06.06 | brlcad | geocalc: yep |
| 12:32.16 | mafm | meh |
| 12:32.23 | mafm | silly ogre :P |
| 12:32.44 | mafm | g3d: ../../OgreMain/include/OgreSingleton.h:66: Ogre::Singleton<T>::Singleton() [with T = Ogre::Root]: Assertion `!ms_Singleton' failed. |
| 12:40.50 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah, now I remember why I was so baffled by the gdb backtrace on iges-g: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m6e1dc5ed |
| 12:46.48 | brlcad | starseeker: that's an optimized build, you need/want a debug build (probably not a /usr/brlcad install unless you install there yourself) |
| 12:47.47 | brlcad | mafm: looks like someone deleted a singleton |
| 12:49.08 | ``Erik | flatulates with vigor |
| 12:52.42 | mafm | apparently you can get that kind of errors also because of linking issues |
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| 13:03.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31609 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/bu_tcl.c src/libbu/parse.c): bu_tcl_structparse_argv has been modified to use the new bu_structparse_argv (No Tcl here. It write log messages to a vls.) |
| 13:04.51 | starseeker | odd, I didn't enable optimization |
| 13:06.04 | starseeker | explicitly enables debug |
| 13:11.37 | brlcad | starseeker: hm, then that may just be stack stompage |
| 13:11.47 | brlcad | put a break on something like bu_log |
| 13:11.51 | brlcad | then to a bt |
| 13:11.54 | brlcad | see if you see symbols |
| 13:12.12 | starseeker | is rebuilding with explicit debug support too |
| 13:12.20 | brlcad | do you install into /usr/brlcad ? |
| 13:12.24 | starseeker | yes |
| 13:12.54 | brlcad | radmind wipes that out every night if you're not exempted (and the one it puts in place is optimized) |
| 13:13.10 | starseeker | I'm on my home box right now |
| 13:13.15 | brlcad | ah, k :) |
| 13:13.27 | starseeker | If radmind is wiping THIS box, I'm scared ;-) |
| 13:13.28 | brlcad | then .. *maybe* that's not the problem *smirk* |
| 13:13.41 | brlcad | try the bt |
| 13:14.14 | brlcad | if you see a valid backtrace, then you're good and you can just try to pinpoint the crash-point |
| 13:14.47 | brlcad | e.g. put a break on the file:line that is printing "Converting NURB entities" and step from there |
| 13:15.22 | starseeker | does some quick checking and gdb 101 review... |
| 13:18.01 | brlcad | break {functionname|file:line} |
| 13:18.04 | brlcad | run |
| 13:18.13 | brlcad | bt |
| 13:18.38 | starseeker | erm. It's saying no source file named convsurv.c - does it need the full path? |
| 13:19.20 | brlcad | surv? |
| 13:19.32 | starseeker | That's the iges conversion source file with the NURB message |
| 13:19.44 | starseeker | when I try to set the break |
| 13:19.51 | starseeker | feels like such a noob... |
| 13:20.02 | brlcad | surV? |
| 13:20.28 | starseeker | ah |
| 13:20.29 | starseeker | sorry |
| 13:20.35 | starseeker | smacks self |
| 13:20.56 | brlcad | all your surv are belong to surfers |
| 13:20.59 | ``Erik | poo, src/libpc/ fails to compile |
| 13:21.26 | brlcad | yeah, I was going to smack dawn |
| 13:21.49 | brlcad | it needs CPPFLAG love in configure.ac |
| 13:22.11 | brlcad | to add src/other if it needs non-system boost |
| 13:23.00 | ``Erik | heh, removing libpc from the build dirs in Makefile works fine for my needs |
| 13:24.37 | ``Erik | hehehe "s/global warming/heated orb terror syndrom/g" |
| 13:25.19 | starseeker | ah hah - it's failing on mk_bspline |
| 13:26.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31610 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/Makefile.am: unbreak the build, it needs src/other as an include path .. temp hack that someone(tm) needs to fix. |
| 13:27.27 | starseeker | is now into libwdb's nurb.c |
| 13:32.43 | starseeker | fails at line 64 - returning the export |
| 13:50.33 | starseeker | ok, down to line 318 in wdb_put_internal... |
| 13:55.28 | mafm | hmm |
| 13:55.39 | mafm | I have an strange problem here, maybe somebody can help |
| 13:56.11 | mafm | I instantiate Ogre::Root (the mother of all the lambs), and this class has a singleton |
| 13:57.03 | mafm | when I try to get a pointer to the renderwindow, it works if I call the singleton, but not if I do it indirectly through the pointer of the created root |
| 13:57.12 | mafm | does this make any sense for you? |
| 13:57.41 | mafm | I don't know why they make a singleton when you can create the object separately, for a start... |
| 14:01.18 | starseeker | down to rt_nurb_free_snurb... |
| 14:09.28 | brlcad | mafm: it seems weird (wrong?) that you'd ever want or need to direction instantiate a base class |
| 14:09.34 | brlcad | s/direction/directly/ |
| 14:10.14 | brlcad | they could/should prevent that if it wasn't desirable, but there may have been some reason to allow it .. still seems pretty odd |
| 14:10.39 | mafm | well, OGRE allows it (i.e. the constructor is not protedted or private), and it seems to be required as the only way to pass configuration parameters |
| 14:11.11 | mafm | http://www.ogre3d.org/docs/api/html/classOgre_1_1Root.html#Ogre_1_1Roota0 |
| 14:12.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31611 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/tracker.sh: dunno why the minuses were being escaped |
| 14:12.52 | mafm | I need that because we ship a configuration file with the plugins we need |
| 14:13.14 | mafm | so it's a system-wide file installed in /usr/local |
| 14:13.25 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, here's as far as I've been able to drill: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m81591bf |
| 14:14.08 | brlcad | mafm: *nod*, doesn't make it any less odd ;) |
| 14:14.57 | mafm | but you mean that it's odd what I'm doing or what they're doing? |
| 14:15.08 | brlcad | yes :) |
| 14:15.22 | mafm | that's not a yes-no question :P |
| 14:15.41 | starseeker | tables the problem temporarily to head in... |
| 14:15.50 | brlcad | i don't doubt that you need to, them making you need to is odd, them making an api that requires instantiating a base class is .. weird |
| 14:16.12 | mafm | I think that they make it too complex with their template and inheritance trickery is causing the problem |
| 14:16.34 | mafm | and I don't know what's the way out of the pit |
| 14:17.06 | starseeker | so I have it, here's the path from main down to the wipeout: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m5429c1a8 |
| 14:17.11 | brlcad | starseeker: mm, rt_nurb_free_snurb() being called with a null resource structure could be a problem |
| 14:17.14 | mafm | unless I start accessing directly Ogre::Root:getSingleton() in all the GUI windows/classes |
| 14:17.39 | starseeker | will try it on the mac and see if things look difference once I'm in |
| 14:18.38 | brlcad | starseeker: ever used valgrind? |
| 14:18.48 | starseeker | no, unfortunately :-( |
| 14:18.55 | brlcad | that might pinpoint the problem, it's great at finding memory issues |
| 14:19.06 | starseeker | checks to see if he has valgrind |
| 14:19.24 | brlcad | and this seems to be one, the fact that it crashes after free() just probably means it was asked to free something that it shouldn't have |
| 14:19.38 | brlcad | or that something went wrong earlier |
| 14:20.05 | brlcad | valgrind is predominantly best on x86 linux, so should be easy to get |
| 14:20.09 | brlcad | it's really easy to use |
| 14:20.14 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 14:20.24 | brlcad | mafm: any hint from the ogre devs? |
| 14:20.27 | starseeker | is installing ebuild now |
| 14:20.36 | brlcad | it's been a long while since I played with the samples |
| 14:20.41 | mafm | nobody replies me in the IRC |
| 14:20.54 | brlcad | their devs mostly work off their forums |
| 14:21.04 | mafm | I guess that I could write them, but it'll take days |
| 14:21.07 | brlcad | steve doesn't like irc :) |
| 14:21.21 | brlcad | they're actually pretty responsive every time I've interacted |
| 14:21.36 | mafm | and they point to the linking issues in the FAQs, so I guess that they'll stick to that explanation |
| 14:21.36 | brlcad | forums are a lot different when all your core guys predominantly use it |
| 14:21.50 | mafm | http://www.ogre3d.org/wiki/index.php/CommonMistakes#Exceptions_and_Asserts |
| 14:22.53 | starseeker | considers using this experience to write up an example based "debugging for dummies" |
| 14:23.45 | brlcad | mafm: that faq entry leads me to believe that there's a plugin instantiating the root as well |
| 14:23.47 | starseeker | has valgrind now |
| 14:24.05 | mafm | http://www.ogre3d.org/docs/api/html/OgreSingleton_8h-source.html |
| 14:24.21 | mafm | starseeker: just "valgrind binary-of-the-program" |
| 14:25.03 | mafm | scared of the pointer trickey :) |
| 14:25.45 | mafm | and the compiler pragmas as well |
| 14:26.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31612 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/news2tracker.sh: maybe a \t got stripped at some point, just leaving the slash. either way, clean up. |
| 14:27.31 | brlcad | mafm: that's a pretty basic singleton |
| 14:27.53 | brlcad | it's quite flawed for many purposes, but decent enough |
| 14:29.13 | brlcad | much better: http://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/bzflag/trunk/bzflag/include/Singleton.h?revision=16429&view=markup |
| 14:30.11 | brlcad | automatic cleanup, prevents accidental instantiation, simple initialization .. and with just a couple extra params you can extend it to multithreading or other allocation mechanisms |
| 14:31.46 | brlcad | i wrote that several years ago, one of the most reused pieces of code I've ever written |
| 14:34.23 | starseeker | hmm - valgrind internal error |
| 14:34.36 | mafm | no good :) |
| 14:35.41 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:35.41 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:36.08 | mafm | things strange with singletons, they do :) |
| 14:36.48 | brlcad | yeah, looks like they're of the explicit creation/destruction camp |
| 14:37.11 | brlcad | silly for many reasons |
| 14:37.19 | brlcad | c'est la vie |
| 14:47.44 | starseeker | Here's what valgrind did with it: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m78e64646 |
| 14:48.01 | starseeker | REALLY needs to get going... |
| 14:51.40 | mafm | starseeker: you might try to see what the last lines before the warnings are doing |
| 14:51.46 | mafm | in example: spline (spline.c:120) |
| 14:52.02 | mafm | at that position of that file, something seems to be going wrong |
| 14:52.26 | mafm | writing to a non-allocated place of memory, or something like that |
| 14:54.48 | brlcad | yeah, there's lots of goodies/nasties in that report |
| 15:04.20 | starseeker | 's first guess based on this would be checking the various data structures and the memory allocation for said structures? |
| 15:08.14 | mafm | starseeker: http://rafb.net/p/B8SFmg93.html |
| 15:08.50 | mafm | in the first case of printf trying to read an dangling pointer, you get this: |
| 15:08.56 | mafm | Use of uninitialised value of size 8 |
| 15:09.22 | mafm | then I try to assign it a value, writing to that position: |
| 15:09.24 | mafm | Invalid write of size 4 |
| 15:10.04 | mafm | so in the lines of spline.c, you should try to see which variable you're accessing, and if was properly created (and not deleted in the meantime) |
| 15:10.08 | starseeker | Right - so in the case of valgrind it diesn't like (*b_patch)->v.knots[i] -= min_knot; |
| 15:10.19 | mafm | sometimes you get chained problems, when some memory overwrites other |
| 15:11.16 | mafm | for a simple debugging procedure, you might try to access different parts of that line, to see where's the problem |
| 15:11.19 | starseeker | looks for the structural definition of face_g_snurb |
| 15:11.50 | mafm | maybe it's that i runs too far away in the vector (trying to access beyond the created elements) |
| 15:16.25 | starseeker | is thinking this looks like pointer fun... |
| 15:21.46 | starseeker | OK, knot vector is using fastf_t for its array type and min_knot is a fastf_t, so that's OK... |
| 15:25.23 | starseeker | OK, this is interesting - the FIRST call to rt_nurb_free_snurb succeeds |
| 15:25.32 | starseeker | it's only the second that fails |
| 15:25.38 | starseeker | I wonder what the difference is... |
| 15:26.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31613 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h GuiWindowManager.cxx): Miscellaneous reorganization of code and cleanup. |
| 15:29.24 | mafm | well, it's not always straightforward |
| 15:29.43 | mafm | sometimes you even get completely mad errors due to stack overruns and things like that |
| 15:37.26 | clock_ | or shooting into the memory |
| 15:37.46 | starseeker | scowls at the C programming language... |
| 15:37.50 | clock_ | running out of an array overwrites some global variables and a complex behaviour can result. |
| 15:38.10 | clock_ | starseeker: I suggest to scowl at wrongly programmed programs |
| 15:38.28 | clock_ | make sure your algorithm is correct and your program is written correctly and typed in correctly |
| 15:38.33 | clock_ | and then you won't encounter any bugs |
| 15:38.47 | starseeker | That too, but mucking at such a low level except when no alternative exists is just annoying |
| 15:39.00 | clock_ | once a colleague decreased some constant which was hard assumed to be 2 in the kernel |
| 15:39.02 | starseeker | didn't write this one anyway |
| 15:39.10 | clock_ | and a behavour resulted that emulated a faulty pipeline in the CPU |
| 15:39.24 | clock_ | since the CPU has already one instruction faulty I was investigating that |
| 15:39.34 | starseeker | nice |
| 15:39.36 | clock_ | and after a month or two of false track I managed to find the source of the problem |
| 15:40.02 | clock_ | starseeker: you can check if it's correct. The universe will collapse 3 times in between, but it's possible :) |
| 15:40.26 | starseeker | decides to eat lunch first... |
| 15:40.30 | starseeker | back later |
| 15:41.11 | clock_ | the morale of this story: do not write bad programs |
| 15:41.17 | clock_ | always make only correct ones |
| 16:43.44 | pacman87 | rt_gettree_leaf(rev): prep failure |
| 16:43.44 | pacman87 | db_walk_subtree() FAIL on '/rev' |
| 16:55.31 | ``Erik | heh, that sounds about as useful as my statemeny, clock... "don't put the bugs in the code in the first place, then you won't have to debug" ... :D |
| 16:55.50 | ``Erik | and don't scowl at C, it's a fantastic language for what it was designed for... writing kernels and drivers. |
| 16:57.03 | poolio | wanders off to implement BREP support in Matlab |
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| 17:12.14 | poolio | Gee, that was fun ;) |
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| 17:26.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31614 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Connecting CommandOverlay with history, so both it and the console have the same effect. Also made the History a Singleton to keep this consistency. |
| 18:33.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31615 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/extrude/extrude.c: ws |
| 18:34.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31616 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): more work on revolve |
| 18:34.59 | pacman87 | probably should've used a better commit message |
| 18:38.05 | mafm | maybe :D |
| 18:43.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31617 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Adding listeners to History events, so in example commands entered in CommandOverlay get logged in the panel of the console. |
| 18:46.14 | mafm | I go now, take care |
| 18:46.18 | pacman87 | bye |
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| 20:17.13 | starseeker | Phooey. The iges-g bug does not appear on the Mac |
| 20:17.41 | starseeker | Amusingly, however, it does cause an attempted raytrace in mged to die with an abort trap error |
| 21:07.56 | ``Erik | keeps laughing at http://www.explosm.net/comics/1324/ for some reason |
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| 21:17.33 | jgay | Hey, anybody want to be attached to a really interesting discussion thread happening about the creation of a "mozilla foundation for government contractors" |
| 21:17.40 | jgay | brlcad: ^^? |
| 22:50.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31618 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): Stage 2/4 towards binary constraint solver: Constraint class definition, refinement of certain Variable and Network members and methods |
| 23:05.59 | pacman87 | how do you set the background color for a raytrace? |
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| 00:49.12 | Byron | If I added a region in a comb can I remove it later? |
| 00:49.30 | Byron | and if so how? |
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| 02:00.17 | geocalc | Can't find a usable tk.tcl in the following directories: /usr/brlcad/lib/tk8.5 |
| 02:01.01 | geocalc | but it is here |
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| 02:59.12 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:09.07 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 03:13.42 | yukonbob | eats chocolate, listens to Frank Sinatra, and sips on his Aranciata |
| 03:13.53 | yukonbob | mmmm... |
| 03:14.55 | yukonbob | Fry Me to the Moon.. |
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| 03:27.20 | Byron1 | Is there a way t remove a region from a comp in mged |
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| 04:05.48 | starseeker | wonders who replaced his brain with an overcooked meat loaf... |
| 04:06.31 | brlcad | moans quietly in exhausted pain |
| 04:08.19 | starseeker | concedes brlcad has more right to it than he does |
| 04:09.07 | brlcad | nah |
| 04:09.14 | starseeker | is at least current with his email... |
| 04:09.20 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 04:09.28 | brlcad | i just got back from the gym, half my body is throbbing in pain .. |
| 04:09.38 | brlcad | the other half was already sore from tues and wed |
| 04:09.45 | starseeker | training? |
| 04:10.04 | starseeker | tries to remember which extreme sport is in season right now... |
| 04:10.23 | brlcad | just trying to get back into my workout routine |
| 04:12.34 | starseeker | heh - close enough |
| 04:12.56 | starseeker | keeps having fits and starts on both gym and diet - grr |
| 04:17.17 | brlcad | our team's perpetual lunch habits don't help :) |
| 04:17.55 | brlcad | the last time I started getting ripped, went to gym instead of lunch for about 8 months .. man those were good times |
| 04:18.44 | brlcad | if Byron comes back .. "d" command |
| 04:19.11 | brlcad | pacman87: -C option to rt |
| 04:19.22 | brlcad | (man rt, rt -C 255/0/0 |
| 04:22.56 | starseeker | will consider that - gym instead of lunch. Good idea. |
| 04:23.18 | starseeker | (or could just lug that Betamax up and down the stairs a few more times) |
| 04:24.14 | brlcad | have to leave *before* 11:20 though .. the temptation of yummy korean or mamie's pizza vs a gruelling hour in the gym is harsh on the mind and willpower |
| 04:24.31 | geocalc | Can't find a usable tk.tcl in the following directories: /usr/brlcad/lib/tk8.5 but it is here brlcad |
| 04:24.39 | brlcad | hello geocalc |
| 04:24.48 | geocalc | hi |
| 04:24.53 | brlcad | geocalc: you compiled yourself? |
| 04:25.01 | geocalc | yes |
| 04:25.11 | brlcad | what was your configure line? |
| 04:25.59 | brlcad | (it's at the top of your config.log) |
| 04:26.55 | geocalc | oh |
| 04:27.06 | geocalc | */configure --prefix=/usr/brlcad --disable-static --enable-all |
| 04:27.21 | brlcad | huh, that's curious indeed |
| 04:27.39 | brlcad | what platform ? |
| 04:27.57 | geocalc | linux 64 |
| 04:28.13 | brlcad | which distro? |
| 04:28.34 | geocalc | Linux xyz 2.6.25.7-paldo1-x86_64 #1 SMP PREEMPT Tue Jun 17 11:30:40 CEST 2008 x86_64 GNU/Linux |
| 04:29.04 | brlcad | so no distro, hand-setup? |
| 04:29.20 | brlcad | or just custom-compiled kernel |
| 04:29.46 | geocalc | no it is a distro |
| 04:32.28 | brlcad | and that would be? |
| 04:32.42 | brlcad | suse? am I missing it in the uname there? |
| 04:33.26 | geocalc | http://paldo.org/index-section-news.html |
| 04:33.44 | brlcad | ah, paldo |
| 04:34.31 | brlcad | so, maybe some of the fundamentals.. |
| 04:34.43 | brlcad | I hope TCL_LIBRARY and TK_LIBRARY are unset? |
| 04:34.48 | brlcad | (env vars) |
| 04:34.50 | geocalc | hmm |
| 04:34.56 | brlcad | they shouldn't be |
| 04:35.13 | brlcad | and if you ldd /usr/brlcad/bin/mged, what do you get |
| 04:37.22 | geocalc | libitk.so.0 => /usr/brlcad/lib/libitk.so.0 (0x00007ffc2110a000) |
| 04:37.22 | geocalc | libitcl.so.0 => /usr/brlcad/lib/libitcl.so.0 (0x00007ffc20eeb000) |
| 04:37.22 | geocalc | libtclcad.so.19 => /usr/brlcad/lib/libtclcad.so.19 (0x00007ffc20ce5000) |
| 04:38.55 | brlcad | does /usr/brlcad/bin/btclsh run? |
| 04:39.18 | brlcad | also, did the compile and install both complete fully and successfull? |
| 04:41.37 | geocalc | btclsh seems to work |
| 04:42.27 | geocalc | compil and didn't quit and no erro |
| 04:42.46 | geocalc | install* |
| 04:43.40 | brlcad | pastebin the result of this: ls -la /usr/brlcad/lib/tk8.5 |
| 04:44.08 | brlcad | ~bzpastebin |
| 04:44.08 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, bzpastebin is http://pastebin.bzflag.bz or a place to put large chunks of text so as not to flood a channel |
| 04:44.31 | geocalc | i can't past my isp block |
| 04:45.07 | brlcad | blocks http? |
| 04:45.13 | brlcad | o.O |
| 04:46.05 | geocalc | i'l try |
| 04:46.07 | brlcad | also those ldd results cannot have been complete |
| 04:46.15 | brlcad | there should have been about 20 libs |
| 04:47.52 | geocalc | ldd /usr/brlcad/bin/mged | wc |
| 04:47.52 | geocalc | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:48.04 | brlcad | okay, a few more than 20 :) |
| 04:48.08 | brlcad | another pastebin |
| 04:53.22 | geocalc | brlcad=<< i can't past loading and loading as always it never end |
| 04:53.45 | brlcad | que? |
| 04:57.42 | brlcad | loading and loading of what? pastebin? mged? |
| 04:59.32 | geocalc | pastebin |
| 05:00.00 | geocalc | why -la ? |
| 05:01.59 | geocalc | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:01.59 | geocalc | bgerror.tcl button.tcl choosedir.tcl clrpick.tcl comdlg.tcl console.tcl demos dialog.tcl entry.tcl focus.tcl images listbox.tcl menu.tcl mkpsenc.tcl msgbox.tcl msgs obsolete.tcl optMenu.tcl palette.tcl panedwindow.tcl pkgIndex.tcl prolog.ps safetk.tcl scale.tcl scrlbar.tcl spinbox.tcl tclIndex tearoff.tcl text.tcl tkAppInit.c tkfbox.tcl tk.tcl ttk unsupported.tcl xmfbox.tcl |
| 05:02.27 | brlcad | geocalc: to see permissions |
| 05:03.09 | geocalc | rw-r--r-- |
| 05:04.13 | brlcad | ls -la /usr/brlcad/lib/libtk* |
| 05:05.50 | geocalc | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:05.51 | geocalc | -r-xr-xr-x 1 root root 1649048 jun 26 02:49 /usr/brlcad/lib/libtk8.5.so |
| 05:05.51 | geocalc | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 1649048 jun 26 02:49 /usr/brlcad/lib/libtk.so |
| 05:05.51 | geocalc | -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 2942 jun 26 02:49 /usr/brlcad/lib/libtkstub8.5.a |
| 05:05.51 | geocalc | -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 2942 jun 26 02:49 /usr/brlcad/lib/libtkstub.a |
| 05:06.48 | geocalc | look ok |
| 05:06.54 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:07.08 | brlcad | can you run mged -c ? |
| 05:07.22 | brlcad | using 'nu' display device or X |
| 05:08.58 | geocalc | X nu work |
| 05:10.03 | geocalc | ogl too |
| 05:11.32 | geocalc | strange |
| 05:11.36 | brlcad | then in any of those, run "gui" |
| 05:13.08 | geocalc | ogl |
| 05:13.08 | geocalc | Starting an ogl display manager |
| 05:13.08 | geocalc | mged> gui |
| 05:13.08 | geocalc | invalid command name "dm_bestXType" |
| 05:13.24 | brlcad | OOooh |
| 05:13.32 | brlcad | you running off lastest svn sources? |
| 05:13.47 | brlcad | a lot of the commands are moving around due to a restructuring |
| 05:14.03 | geocalc | no |
| 05:14.19 | brlcad | which version? |
| 05:14.31 | geocalc | release last |
| 05:15.00 | geocalc | 7.12.4 |
| 05:16.05 | brlcad | nm /usr/brlcad/lib/libdm.so |grep dm_best |
| 05:17.15 | geocalc | GUI IN NU GIVE THE TCL ERROR |
| 05:17.31 | brlcad | k |
| 05:18.28 | geocalc | nm /usr/brlcad/lib/libdm.so |grep dm_best => no symbol |
| 05:20.21 | geocalc | yo want a no strip build ? |
| 05:22.19 | geocalc | the packages manager strip all but i can install byhands if you need brlcad |
| 05:23.04 | brlcad | it'd be useful to verify that it's there or not |
| 05:23.07 | brlcad | it should be |
| 05:23.44 | brlcad | your build doensn't happen to set other CFLAGS or CPPFLAGS during make or some other build step? |
| 05:24.33 | geocalc | i don't think |
| 05:26.11 | geocalc | gone eat i'll rebuild after |
| 05:27.09 | brlcad | k |
| 05:27.21 | brlcad | wanders for a bit to poke at pipe performance |
| 05:48.37 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-213.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:17.36 | geocalc | nm /usr/local/lib/libdm.so |grep dm_best |
| 06:17.36 | geocalc | 000000000002e7d0 T dm_bestXType |
| 06:17.36 | geocalc | 000000000002eb24 T dm_bestXType_tcl |
| 06:17.36 | geocalc | i saw some warnings about relinking *.la brlcad |
| 06:33.39 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@dyn-91-171-218-91.ppp.tiscali.fr) | |
| 06:34.15 | geocalc | Linux xyz 2.6.25.8-paldo1-x86_64 #1 SMP PREEMPT Sun Jun 22 14:51:58 CEST 2008 x86_64 GNU/Linux |
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| 07:55.34 | geocalc | [geocalc@xyz:~]$ mged -c |
| 07:55.34 | geocalc | mged: error while loading shared libraries: libtermio.so.19: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 07:55.34 | geocalc | <PROTECTED> |
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| 09:48.18 | mafm | hi |
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| 10:37.54 | mafm | hi ``Erik |
| 10:52.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31619 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/History.cxx: Fixing small glitch when navigating History (bad offset of index sometimes |
| 11:01.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31620 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h main.cxx): Cleanup and doxygen documentation |
| 11:15.33 | mafm | hmm |
| 11:15.43 | mafm | bot missing my last commit? |
| 11:15.59 | mafm | sign of the armageddon, I guess :) |
| 11:28.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31621 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx History.cxx): Indentation/whitespace |
| 11:52.05 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 12:30.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31622 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWindowManager.cxx GuiWindowManager.h): Adding Quit button to the top bar |
| 12:34.25 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@fw1.phys.sinica.edu.tw) | |
| 12:35.01 | Mouette | when you will release 7.12.5? |
| 12:56.03 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.204.207) | |
| 13:14.20 | brlcad | Mouette: probably not till next month (as 7.12.6) |
| 13:22.48 | mafm | brlcad: Darwin is basically same as regular Xorg, right? |
| 13:35.18 | ``Erik | "smells like karl rove's burnt asshairs" *shudder* |
| 13:37.08 | ``Erik | sometimes the bot is a little laggy, mafm |
| 13:37.15 | ``Erik | and darwin is the name for the macosX kernel |
| 13:38.10 | mafm | kernel? |
| 13:38.42 | ``Erik | jiggles his mini buddha gut and decides that lunch is far moar awesomer than gym |
| 13:39.24 | ``Erik | what's the context you're seeing darwin in, mafm? |
| 13:40.34 | mafm | basically I need to know whether the same options that I use for keyboard for Xorg are applicable to MacOS |
| 13:40.39 | brlcad | mafm: if you're asking if Mac OS X uses Xorg, it has it but the gui you're working on shouldn't use it (at all) .. it should be going through the Carbon/Cocoa graphics layers |
| 13:41.12 | brlcad | probably not, e.g. you shouldn't be using libXi |
| 13:41.22 | ``Erik | yeah, BRL-CAD currently uses X11.app (a fork of X11R6 that sits ontop of quartz, I believe), but we want to get rid of thte X11.app dependancy on osX some day |
| 13:42.19 | mafm | I see |
| 13:42.23 | ``Erik | what does OGRE use for input and context/window attach? (wgl/win32)/(glx/Xlib) ? |
| 13:42.45 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 13:43.30 | ``Erik | (note that X11.app is NOT installed by default on osX, you have to install it off the developer disc or download it...) |
| 13:44.41 | ``Erik | re-re-reads the Veach/Guibas MLT paper O.o |
| 13:51.33 | mafm | ``Erik: a mix of everything :) |
| 13:52.02 | mafm | furthermore, it's another library called OIS, forked project or something like that |
| 13:56.54 | brlcad | mafm, it looks like OIS has both Mac-specific facilities as well as an SDL interface |
| 13:57.21 | brlcad | either of those should work (preferably not the sdl interface if we can avoid it) |
| 13:59.57 | Mouette | Mmm, when my brlcad-7.12.4 solaris x86 can annonce? |
| 14:00.01 | mafm | yes, but I was wondering the parameters that I should pass |
| 14:00.11 | mafm | if they were the same as for Xorg or not :) |
| 14:01.50 | brlcad | Mouette: you're in a hurry? :) it's still being validated |
| 14:02.26 | brlcad | mafm: depends if OIS abstracts that or not |
| 14:02.49 | brlcad | ideally it should be entirely abstracted so at the app level you don't worry about that at all |
| 14:02.59 | brlcad | otherwise, there's not really much point to OIS |
| 14:03.03 | mafm | you instantiate the class with some "parameterlist", with system-dependent k-v pairs |
| 14:03.19 | brlcad | hell, we have abstracted input for bzflag |
| 14:03.38 | brlcad | that's not abstracted if the *app* has to provide system-dependent anything |
| 14:03.42 | mafm | kind of, to disable/enable autorepeat, or mouse grabbing |
| 14:03.56 | Mouette | can't you compile like my result then release your solaris x86 package? |
| 14:04.23 | mafm | it's OGRE... *shrugs* :) |
| 14:05.17 | brlcad | I don't recall there being system-specific input the last time I made an ogre app a couple years ago.. |
| 14:06.04 | mafm | well, you don't have to, but you can |
| 14:06.06 | brlcad | Mouette: sure, it just takes time and effort to make a solaris package .. along with the dozen other platforms we actively support |
| 14:06.29 | mafm | I hate having to switch back to my terminal and kill the app by hand |
| 14:06.41 | brlcad | Mouette: more ideal is to find individual platform maintainers that prepare the releases for a given platform |
| 14:06.55 | mafm | because the program is in infinite loop or crashed in gdb, and keeps all my input grabbed |
| 14:07.03 | brlcad | thought I saw that you added a quit button? :) |
| 14:07.05 | mafm | or when disables autorepeat for all X |
| 14:07.07 | ``Erik | brlcad: your faq sheet has been substantially modified and is ready for you, she sent you an email and asked if you were in today |
| 14:07.24 | brlcad | ``Erik: k |
| 14:07.27 | brlcad | will be in a few |
| 14:07.46 | mafm | well, sometimes it doesn't paint the buttons, so you just can't do anything but do Ctrl+Alt+F1 so the app doesn't get that input |
| 14:09.30 | Mouette | Maybe i can be brlcad for the solaris x86 platform maintainer |
| 14:10.11 | brlcad | Mouette: maybe .. :) |
| 14:10.28 | brlcad | it still means though that as a new contributor, your package has to be reviewed |
| 14:10.41 | brlcad | at least with some level of scrutiny to make sure it's "ok" |
| 14:11.38 | Mouette | mmm |
| 14:13.34 | ``Erik | of course, merely having someone building on slowaris x86 and providing patches if things don't "Just Work" would be tremendously appreciated :D |
| 14:15.18 | mafm | do you know a simple way to check where's an infinite loop, different from cachegrind? |
| 14:16.04 | mafm | valgrind-like if possible, not having to recompile with profiling options or things like that |
| 14:16.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31623 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/History.h: Commenting out to avoid compiler warnings |
| 14:18.11 | brlcad | I think oprofile has similar facilities |
| 14:18.29 | brlcad | it's a performance profiler that also uses the cpu register timers |
| 14:18.30 | ``Erik | um, compile with -O0 -ggdb, wait a while, break it and see where it is? and if you're not convinced based on program state/stack, put some printfs around it? |
| 14:19.53 | mafm | ah, just statistical interruption? :D |
| 14:20.03 | mafm | good one |
| 14:20.13 | ``Erik | that'd be my quick&easy dirty hack approach, yeah :D *shrug* |
| 14:21.05 | brlcad | then you can see that it's spending x% of time in a given body of code, and if it's an infinite loop, that'll be blatently obvious |
| 14:22.25 | ``Erik | hrm, oprofile isn't in fbsd ports |
| 14:22.33 | mafm | ``Erik: exactly what I was looking for... I tried it sometimes but don't remember |
| 14:22.33 | ``Erik | ah, leenewx only |
| 14:22.38 | mafm | didn't* |
| 14:24.51 | brlcad | yeah, uses some kernel modules to get to the timers |
| 14:25.05 | brlcad | was kinda like valgrind, but hasn't been ported yet |
| 14:25.42 | ``Erik | should spend some time poking at the dtrace port in fbsd base |
| 14:27.10 | ``Erik | (only -current right now, I think... since april) |
| 14:30.42 | mafm | it seems that doesn't like to have empty windows or things like that :S |
| 14:31.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31624 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Application.cxx: Disabling Keyboard and Mouse grabbing at least for Xorg, so it doesn't cause problems with application crashes, infinite loops and the like |
| 14:35.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31625 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Flag to mark whether the window should be present in Taskbar or not (i.e. CommandOverlay should not) |
| 14:59.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31626 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiCommandOverlay.cxx: Setting CommandOverlay to Modal (dialog, cannot interact with the rest of the interface while opened), initially hidden, hidden every time Return is pressed. |
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| 15:29.39 | clock_ | do you know big bucks bunny? |
| 15:31.29 | clock_ | the open source blender film? |
| 15:39.54 | mafm | nup |
| 15:40.03 | mafm | I saw elephant's dream though |
| 15:41.09 | clock_ | they have a list of individual pngs |
| 15:41.22 | clock_ | do you have a unix on the backbone? |
| 15:41.30 | clock_ | I would like to encode it for them with Luminaplex |
| 15:41.40 | clock_ | Standard Y'CbCr is incredibly shitty in regarding to colour detail |
| 15:42.30 | clock_ | then it looks like cinema and not like a video :) |
| 15:44.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31627 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): |
| 15:44.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Adding event handlers so the prompt is focused whenever the windows becomes |
| 15:44.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: focused; showing close button for CommandOverlay but acting as 'hide'; and |
| 15:44.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: fixing a bug where entries in the console text panel were added twice. |
| 15:45.15 | mafm | yes, I have unix -- but I don't understand why is that related with bucks bunny :) |
| 15:45.30 | clock_ | not bucks bunny big bucks bunny |
| 15:45.35 | clock_ | the open source movie |
| 15:45.56 | mafm | yes |
| 15:46.02 | mafm | so what's the relation? |
| 15:46.10 | clock_ | between what and what? |
| 15:47.26 | mafm | big bucks bunny and my unix backbone that you were asking for |
| 15:47.33 | mafm | (for/about) |
| 15:47.48 | clock_ | I want to download the pngs automated unpack them run through luminaplex and Theora encoder |
| 15:47.53 | clock_ | and then send them the resulting video |
| 15:47.58 | clock_ | because standard encoded videos are shit |
| 15:48.11 | clock_ | invented the luminaplex algorithm |
| 15:49.26 | mafm | and do you want to render it in my computer? :D |
| 15:49.37 | clock_ | I didn't say anything about rendering |
| 15:49.40 | clock_ | the film is already rendered |
| 15:51.17 | mafm | adding colour or whatever |
| 15:51.39 | mafm | out for a coffee |
| 16:24.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31628 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWindowManager.cxx GuiWindowManager.h): Adding toggle buttons for CommandOverlay and Console visibility, and setting it to focused window when visible. |
| 16:26.58 | mafm | brlcad: you don't want typical application menus, do you? |
| 17:25.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31629 10/brlcad/trunk/ (32 files in 21 dirs): |
| 17:25.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Added bu_structparse_get_terse_form() to libbu/parse.c. Added |
| 17:25.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: wdb_import_from_path to librt/wdb.c. Modified the adjust, get and form members |
| 17:25.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: of struct rt_functab (i.e. signature). Added four new commands to libged: |
| 17:25.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: adjust, form, get and put. |
| 17:35.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31630 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: Added extern to the declaration of brlcad_interp. |
| 17:43.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31631 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Unimportant renamings, for consistency between classes |
| 18:19.29 | mafm | cya folks |
| 18:19.41 | pacman87 | bye |
| 18:25.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31632 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/tcl.c: Modified rt_comb_adjust to handle no and yes (i.e. the same way that rt_comb_tcladjust previously did when using Tcl_GetBoolean. |
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| 19:48.17 | brlcad | no "typical" menus, bleh |
| 19:49.12 | pacman87 | revolve with straight line sketches is looking promising |
| 19:51.32 | brlcad | how's that work? |
| 19:51.53 | pacman87 | i just use a sketch with straigh lines |
| 19:51.55 | brlcad | you not requiring that the scetch for a closed area with a given vector? |
| 19:52.00 | brlcad | ahhhh |
| 19:52.03 | brlcad | multiple lines |
| 19:52.06 | brlcad | got it |
| 19:52.19 | pacman87 | i'm not doing any sketch testing yet |
| 19:52.20 | brlcad | I was thinking a sketch with a single line segment :) |
| 19:52.43 | pacman87 | but if i rt it alone, the hit distances are off |
| 19:52.50 | pacman87 | if i add another shape to the rt, it works |
| 19:52.51 | brlcad | revolving that would imply a conic sheet of course, but not closed/solid |
| 19:53.09 | brlcad | sounds like the bounding box calc is wrong |
| 19:53.18 | brlcad | or maybe bounding sphere is wrong |
| 19:53.30 | pacman87 | you mean too small? |
| 19:53.43 | pacman87 | right now i'm cheating, set at 100 ;) |
| 19:53.58 | pacman87 | and my sketch is inside that |
| 20:00.25 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt01.png vs https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt02.png |
| 20:01.11 | brlcad | neat :) |
| 20:13.29 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt02.png |
| 20:13.49 | pacman87 | two rev's and a hyp between ;) |
| 20:18.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31633 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: more work on shot() and norm() for sketches with only line segments |
| 20:52.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31634 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Added binary, bot_decimate and bot_face_sort to libged. These were split out of wdb_obj.c and modified to NOT require Tcl. Added references to these commands in ged_obj.c |
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| 22:07.40 | pacman87 | this is very perplexing |
| 22:35.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31635 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: more work on revolve's norm() |
| 22:36.24 | brlcad | perplexing and flexing? |
| 22:38.20 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14D704.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:40.14 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt06.png |
| 22:40.19 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt05.png |
| 22:41.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 22:42.11 | pacman87 | only difference is the sphere |
| 22:42.22 | pacman87 | the revs didnt change at all |
| 22:42.38 | pacman87 | same view, same everything |
| 22:43.56 | pacman87 | 03 is the prettiest |
| 22:46.51 | brlcad | that is pretty odd .. hmm |
| 22:47.52 | brlcad | introducing the sphere changes the space partitioning, so you're going to have ray's being evaluated from different positions on the bounding view |
| 22:49.03 | brlcad | somehow those (different) rays are getting transformed differently during prep or shot (probably the latter) |
| 22:50.15 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@76-10-146-181.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 00:14.28 | *** join/#brlcad Byron1 (n=byron@pool-96-229-127-10.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 00:15.24 | Byron1 | from the command line is there a way to edit one point on for example an arb8 |
| 00:38.51 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 00:39.15 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i broke the build :( ? |
| 00:40.20 | homovulgaris | boost is header only files .. why would we have build errors. |
| 01:02.00 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:15.14 | brlcad | homovulgaris: because you added the code that used the headers, but didn't update the build system to tell it where they are ;) |
| 01:15.31 | brlcad | doesn't magically know to look in src/other |
| 01:15.48 | brlcad | and welcome back, haven't seen you in a few days :) |
| 01:16.04 | homovulgaris | yeha |
| 01:16.08 | homovulgaris | changing it :P |
| 01:16.24 | brlcad | that was the hint about looking at what configure does for libregex |
| 01:16.26 | homovulgaris | actually i edited the configure.ac adding src/other/boost |
| 01:16.31 | homovulgaris | but it shoud have been src/other |
| 01:16.32 | brlcad | ah |
| 01:17.02 | brlcad | missed the configure edit .. must have been buried in a commit :) |
| 01:17.16 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 01:17.25 | brlcad | they're getting better/smaller, but would still be better to have them smaller still and more frequent |
| 01:18.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31636 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac src/libpc/Makefile.am): correcting BOOST_CPPFLAGS to src/other rather than src/other/boost: temporary fix till AX_BOOST_BASE |
| 01:18.38 | brlcad | either way, nice progress so far, coming together well me thinks |
| 01:18.46 | homovulgaris | i am hoping for at least 3-4 per day when i get home :) |
| 01:18.57 | brlcad | ah, on the road? |
| 01:19.19 | homovulgaris | yeah sort of on the road :) |
| 01:19.47 | brlcad | Iiinteresting.. Rhino is available for Mac OS X |
| 01:19.59 | homovulgaris | It is fun though .. coding while on the run :) |
| 01:20.03 | brlcad | makes a mental note |
| 01:20.11 | brlcad | yeah, I love coding on the road |
| 01:20.19 | brlcad | I get some of my better work done during conferences |
| 01:20.30 | brlcad | at least, I enjoy it more :) |
| 01:21.23 | brlcad | ah, so the original 'bug' was that the makefile.am wasn't updated to use BOOST_CPPFLAGS |
| 01:21.37 | brlcad | though even if it had, it wouldn't have worked because of the path |
| 01:22.56 | homovulgaris | both.. It was pointing to the wrong location and it was not being included for the .h files in libpc |
| 01:23.24 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 01:23.54 | homovulgaris | didnt even notice as apparently it was using my installed libraries.. :| grrr.. |
| 01:24.44 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i was unable to build mocha |
| 01:25.36 | brlcad | yeah, I figured as much (re using sys headers) |
| 01:26.31 | brlcad | homovulgaris: let mafm know (or wait for better build system integration) |
| 01:26.53 | brlcad | they're certainly not in the state I'd want them to stay in |
| 01:27.07 | homovulgaris | mafm: check it when you come online http://rafb.net/p/vnRg5b73.html |
| 01:27.10 | brlcad | it's dependency hell at the moment, and there's only four of them |
| 01:27.34 | brlcad | oh, that's just a missing header |
| 01:27.36 | homovulgaris | :) ogre and ois is still peaceful i guess.. I think rbgui is the major issue |
| 01:27.48 | brlcad | include <string.h> |
| 01:27.54 | homovulgaris | :P |
| 01:28.18 | brlcad | they build, but it's not seamless |
| 01:28.30 | brlcad | I like things to 'just work' as much as possible |
| 01:29.23 | homovulgaris | :) yeah i remember this ad.. in which there are all these motor parts working or dancing in symphony.. toyota ? and the guy says.. "isn't it great when things just.. work" :) |
| 01:29.41 | brlcad | none of this download these tools, run cmake, scons, autotools, compile a pray .. watch it assume a Makefile means your on Linux (wtf), etc |
| 01:29.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31637 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/boost/ (460 files in 59 dirs): additional boost library files: graphviz write |
| 01:29.56 | brlcad | oh, I have that video |
| 01:29.59 | brlcad | one of my favorite |
| 01:30.11 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 01:30.20 | homovulgaris | It was pretty well made :) |
| 01:30.50 | brlcad | yeah |
| 01:30.57 | homovulgaris | grr.. workrave keeps telling me "daily limit: get off your computer" |
| 01:32.48 | brlcad | fts |
| 01:33.52 | brlcad | has dealt with rsi for years, a program telling me to stop doing what I love would quickly find itself shredded |
| 01:34.54 | brlcad | i switched using the mouse from my right hand to my left and what made a *massive* difference |
| 01:36.16 | homovulgaris | hmm :) |
| 01:57.24 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/honda.mov |
| 02:00.02 | poolio | Ah man...my code seg faults in mk_brep() |
| 02:03.37 | homovulgaris | ah yes.. it was honda :) |
| 02:10.39 | brlcad | poolio: peanut butter debug time? |
| 02:10.53 | brlcad | where it at, where it at |
| 02:11.03 | brlcad | peanut butter debug with a baseball bat! |
| 02:13.25 | poolio | errr |
| 02:16.01 | poolio | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/xbgAy241.html |
| 02:18.47 | brlcad | what's your code look like |
| 02:19.07 | brlcad | it's *highly* unlikely that it's a bug in opennurbs |
| 02:23.15 | poolio | I'm 100% my code is flawed, I just wish it wouldn't segfault inside their stuff |
| 02:25.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31638 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/nmg/nmg_brep.cpp: initial nmg support. not anywhere near functional... |
| 02:25.54 | poolio | err, initial brep support for nmgs...but ah well. |
| 02:26.04 | poolio | I have a feeling it has to do with my mixing and matching of C/C++ instantiations |
| 02:28.10 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:28.10 | brlcad | makeFunnyFaces |
| 02:47.28 | starseeker | brlcad: That's a nice high quality copy of that commercial |
| 02:47.46 | starseeker | loves that almost all of it is real and not computer generated |
| 02:48.29 | starseeker | always wondered if it would be worth it to try and get the DVD - shoulda remembered and made it a condition of my buying the civic |
| 02:50.18 | brlcad | iirc, the only part that wasn't real was the muffler where they spliced the two sequences together |
| 02:50.39 | poolio | what about the tires going up the ramp? |
| 02:50.40 | brlcad | and that was mostly because the studio wasn't actually long enough to set the whole thing up in one go |
| 02:50.51 | brlcad | poolio: heh, that part is real |
| 02:50.54 | brlcad | tis a neat trick |
| 02:51.21 | brlcad | there are heavy weights inside the tires on the top-right |
| 02:51.49 | brlcad | they talk about it in the original writeup, how many hundred takes it took, etc |
| 02:52.16 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:53.53 | poolio | brlcad: so I get segfaults if I add an edge. I can upload the simple example that it's dying on if you'd like to have a look...I have no clue why it's segfaulting |
| 02:54.20 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:59.45 | poolio | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/4QYpfu48.html |
| 03:09.44 | brlcad | it'll take a while for me to clean out my build on this box fr testing, let you know if I find anything though |
| 03:12.00 | poolio | thanks. breplicator runs fine so I'm thinking it may be the way I'm building it |
| 03:13.25 | brlcad | in the meantime, try calling IsValid on the brep before calling mk_brep |
| 03:14.01 | brlcad | see if it is, if it's not .. there may be ill-defined behavior on the copy construtor (mk_brep utilizes a copy) |
| 03:20.11 | poolio | Well, I know it's not valid...I was hoping that mk_brep() would dump the brep before it segfaulted (or even write out an invalid brep) |
| 03:22.00 | poolio | Ah well, dump and IsValid() work fine so I guess there's no reason to worry about it...maybe modify mk_brep() to test the validity of the brep before copying and writing it? |
| 03:40.00 | brlcad | i didn't say that was the problem, just a possibility |
| 03:40.45 | brlcad | would have to test that theory, and even if that's the cause .. doesn't explain why |
| 03:41.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31639 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): Still stage 2/4 of Binary Constraint Solver Implementation : Graphviz done . postscript of graphs can be generated using dot |
| 03:42.10 | homovulgaris | http://parametrics.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/x.png |
| 03:45.55 | poolio | brlcad: It is definitely segfaulting during the copy constructor |
| 03:52.03 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
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| 07:27.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31640 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: Added four new commands to libged: adjust, form, get and put. |
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| 10:07.19 | brlcad | hum |
| 10:32.18 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-040-234.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 10:39.09 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:40.36 | mafm | hi |
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| 11:19.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31641 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiCommandOverlay.cxx GuiConsole.cxx): Small cleanup of unneeded intermediate variables |
| 12:26.01 | brlcad | hi mafm |
| 12:40.18 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:05.22 | mafm | brlcad: do you think that you'll have time to test the app during the weekend? |
| 13:05.31 | mafm | I'm eager to receive feedback :) |
| 13:15.56 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@dslb-088-071-040-234.pools.arcor-ip.net) | |
| 13:22.19 | ``Erik | This is awesome! We're gonna be like pow-pow-pow, and they're gonna be like ... *AAAHHHH!* *PSSSHHHHH* ... and then we'll have pancakes to celebrate and I'll be like...gronhmgronhmgornhmì |
| 13:23.03 | mafm | are you going to a strip-tease? |
| 13:23.33 | ``Erik | (futurama quote) |
| 13:26.08 | mafm | are they going to a strip-tease? if Bender is involved at all, it must be |
| 13:26.10 | mafm | :) |
| 13:26.23 | mafm | in fact forget the moon... |
| 13:28.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31642 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Added most of the drawing related commands to ged_obj.c |
| 13:29.05 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 13:29.07 | ``Erik | bender rocks |
| 13:29.36 | starseeker | now here's a question - has anyone done a Bender version of a chat bot? |
| 13:29.57 | ``Erik | no, but I'm suddenly tempted to make bender .po files. |
| 13:30.24 | starseeker | Is Eliza still the lead in chat bot stupidity, or has someone made a better one? |
| 13:30.30 | ``Erik | has made beavis&butthead and redneck ones before |
| 13:30.52 | mafm | starseeker: nop, but they did a real Bender to brew beer: http://www.asciimation.co.nz/bender/ |
| 13:30.55 | ``Erik | um, eliza is probably the best, the brlcad bot takes forever to respond :/ |
| 13:30.56 | clock_ | Isn't G. W. Bush currently the leading authority on stupidity? |
| 13:31.14 | ``Erik | leading practicer of, not leading authority on |
| 13:31.18 | ``Erik | I mean, uh, O:-) |
| 13:31.35 | ``Erik | pheer http://www.dubyaspeak.com/ |
| 13:32.13 | starseeker | works on tire manual to prepare for The Process... |
| 13:32.20 | clock_ | "is a Korean Peninsula" |
| 13:32.36 | ``Erik | peninshula heh |
| 13:33.06 | clock_ | ballistic missile programs |
| 13:33.15 | clock_ | north korea must have multiple ballistic missile programs |
| 13:33.43 | ``Erik | ? |
| 13:35.04 | clock_ | And so I'm -- it's been a -- multilateral diplomacy is difficult at times. |
| 13:35.18 | clock_ | Looks like Bush is in the initial stage of small child's mental development |
| 13:35.25 | ``Erik | pretty much, yeah |
| 13:35.29 | clock_ | where it's still difficult to distinguish himself from the world around. |
| 13:35.52 | clock_ | And so I'm -- it's been a ... |
| 13:36.09 | ``Erik | though one of the "repeat offender" things that the site rags on him for, I've talked to a guy from texas and he says that's how its' said in texas (so texas is special, not just bush... the "mothers and dads" phrase) |
| 13:36.11 | clock_ | The message to the North Korean people is, is that we don't want you ... |
| 13:36.41 | clock_ | And so my point is this, is that -- we'll see. |
| 13:36.49 | clock_ | We'll see, that's a truly deep point. |
| 13:36.52 | clock_ | I think Bush has a point. |
| 13:37.50 | clock_ | "I remember meeting a mother of a child who was abducted by the North Koreans right here in the Oval Office. |
| 13:37.53 | clock_ | " |
| 13:38.05 | clock_ | North Koreans abduct children directly from the Oval Office. |
| 13:38.19 | clock_ | I think they must be really evil when they abduct children directly from the Oval Office. |
| 13:38.56 | ``Erik | "The Iraqis are fully staffed, and and they've got their team in there, but we don't. And so, what Gen. Petraeus is saying some early signs, still dangerous, but give me give my chance a plan to work." |
| 13:39.30 | ``Erik | "I'll be long gone before some smart person ever figures out what happened inside this Oval Office." |
| 13:39.39 | clock_ | ``Erik: my program for automated generation of nonsensical English sequences works better than Bush's brain |
| 13:39.40 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:39.56 | clock_ | I think Bush needs to upgrade his statistical model of English language. |
| 13:40.15 | ``Erik | jan '09, woooo |
| 13:40.22 | archivist | he just needs killing off |
| 13:40.26 | clock_ | He should figure out for example, that if the text ends with "give me", following with " give" is highly improbable |
| 13:40.52 | clock_ | Sounds like the person who programmed the singlechip in his head was not a very competent programmer. |
| 13:41.03 | ``Erik | "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: |
| 13:41.03 | ``Erik | soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." |
| 13:41.04 | ``Erik | -Ed Howdershelt |
| 13:41.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31643 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/report.c: Initial check-in. |
| 13:41.11 | clock_ | Give me an example of sentence that contains the string "give me give" |
| 13:41.24 | ``Erik | we're in the ballot/jury phase right now (I think we should be well in the jury one, but *shrug*) |
| 13:41.27 | ``Erik | :) |
| 13:42.02 | clock_ | Bush needs some texan rednecks with shotguns to be sent on him :) |
| 13:42.22 | clock_ | ``Erik: what is the soap box good for? |
| 13:42.49 | ``Erik | um, american phrase, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soapbox |
| 13:43.01 | ``Erik | or, english, rather |
| 13:46.54 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31644 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (CMakeLists.txt Makefile.am): Added references to how.c report.c, set_transparency.c and tree.c |
| 13:47.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31645 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/tree.c: Added include for errno.h |
| 13:47.27 | clock_ | ``Erik: I see |
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| 14:00.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31646 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Writing configuration files to a temporary dir, and removing it when finishing -- instead of writing them in the directory with the sources. |
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| 14:38.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31647 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: add DEPENDS |
| 14:39.06 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31648 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (attr.c ls.c): missing header |
| 14:39.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31649 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/wdb.c: missing header |
| 14:40.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31650 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: missing header and type fix for bu_strdup |
| 14:40.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31651 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Writing configuration files to the build dir instead, so we don't have to create temp dirs and cleanup and still don't clutter the source dir. |
| 14:45.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31652 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Setting explicitly the cfg file names, to avoid installing unintended files as it just happened to me. |
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| 15:10.50 | prasad_ | hmm looks like we'll have a booth at siggraph |
| 15:10.54 | prasad_ | :) |
| 15:13.30 | mafm | \o/ |
| 15:13.42 | mafm | I only need to get a sponsor to pay me the travel |
| 15:17.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31653 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (13 files): Miscellaneous cleanup: renaming some variables, enhancing a bit doxygen documentation and comments, reducing the visibility of some methods when they don't need to be public... |
| 15:41.19 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31654 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): Migrated a few more commands (i.e. ae, center and size). Removed the local2base and base2local members of struct ged_view. |
| 15:42.09 | ``Erik | heads off to lunch O.o |
| 15:47.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31655 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (aet.c center.c size.c): Initial check-in. |
| 15:56.16 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 16:04.14 | mafm | hi homovulgaris |
| 16:04.30 | homovulgaris | hey mafm :) |
| 16:04.39 | homovulgaris | my system is not able to find Mocha .. grr :( |
| 16:06.44 | mafm | mocha is in src/other |
| 16:06.52 | mafm | are you using unix? |
| 16:08.57 | homovulgaris | debian unstable |
| 16:09.13 | homovulgaris | i mean i installed mocha.. when i try to cmake rbgui it complains that it is unable to find MOcha |
| 16:12.11 | mafm | I see |
| 16:12.31 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 16:12.46 | mafm | but that after compiling mocha, right? |
| 16:12.56 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 16:12.57 | mafm | the sequence is (mocha, rbgui) |
| 16:13.04 | mafm | the other is independent |
| 16:14.22 | mafm | $ make mocha |
| 16:14.22 | mafm | Type: cd mocha; scons && cp libmocha.{a,so} /usr/local/lib && ldconfig && cp ../Mocha.pc /usr/local/lib/pkgconfig; cd .. |
| 16:14.31 | mafm | do you execute that like exactly? |
| 16:14.55 | mafm | notice the manual copy :) |
| 16:15.11 | mafm | and that it'll fail if you don't have scons |
| 16:15.15 | mafm | (be back in a minute) |
| 16:16.25 | homovulgaris | naah.. i mean i had scons and i did the manual copy |
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| 16:17.42 | mafm | so, I'll check it in a minute :D |
| 16:18.37 | homovulgaris | hehe .. no probs.. maybe some issue with my pkg config..i will try figuring it out |
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| 16:27.35 | homovulgaris | mafm: It was because the Include files were not being copied to /usr/local/Include :) |
| 16:28.37 | homovulgaris | shouldnt u add that to the Makefile in other ? |
| 16:32.03 | homovulgaris | grr.. http://rafb.net/p/9eCcu948.html but it has only two stars in the file :O |
| 16:39.04 | homovulgaris | hmm.. shouldnt it be char* argv[] ? |
| 16:52.11 | mafm | homovulgaris: char* arg[] and char** is the same |
| 16:52.39 | homovulgaris | yeah they are but in the file it is char** arg[] |
| 16:52.39 | mafm | I don't have the error, so I guess that it's not compiling the samples |
| 16:52.51 | homovulgaris | which is char *** argv |
| 16:53.11 | homovulgaris | anyways mocha and rbgui done ;) |
| 16:53.16 | mafm | char*** is one indirection too far away |
| 16:53.39 | homovulgaris | i changed it to char * argv[] that is :) which is char ** argv :) |
| 16:53.46 | mafm | yep |
| 16:53.54 | mafm | and about mocha you're right, I forgot it |
| 16:54.52 | homovulgaris | i am getting this now though in g3d :) http://rafb.net/p/2rrvzH92.html |
| 16:55.19 | mafm | what you did is "cp -r mocha/Include/Mocha/ /usr/local/include/" I suppose? |
| 16:55.39 | homovulgaris | and in rbgui too i think you should put the manual copy ../RBGui.pc /usr/local/lib/pkgconfig |
| 16:55.51 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 16:56.25 | homovulgaris | i use -R though :P |
| 16:56.39 | mafm | somebody made the rpm for RBGui and they created a CMake file for it, so I think that it installs fine |
| 16:58.55 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 16:58.57 | mafm | hmm, I cannot see why you're getting the error with g3d |
| 17:00.26 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 17:00.54 | mafm | maybe you should "svn up" ? :) |
| 17:01.46 | homovulgaris | yeah i did :) |
| 17:02.31 | mafm | oh, one thing, I recomment to create another dir, like src/g3d/build (it can be anywhere really) |
| 17:03.01 | homovulgaris | http://rafb.net/p/A7pCyy86.html |
| 17:03.12 | mafm | and to compile g3d: cmake .. [to be changed depending on the build dir] && make -s && su -c "make -s install" && g3d |
| 17:03.35 | homovulgaris | oh.. ok :) |
| 17:03.46 | mafm | mmm |
| 17:03.53 | mafm | what's your g++? |
| 17:06.14 | homovulgaris | 4.3.1 |
| 17:06.19 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:06.26 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:06.38 | mafm | the problem are these two lines |
| 17:08.15 | homovulgaris | hmmm |
| 17:21.00 | mafm | I cannot find the problem really |
| 17:21.16 | mafm | 4.3 is more picky in general, but I don't know a proper workaround |
| 17:22.19 | mafm | for a start you might hardcode the path: "/usr/local/share/g3d/" |
| 17:22.40 | mafm | so the lines would be: _root = new Ogre::Root("/usr/local/share/g3d/ogreplugins.cfg"); |
| 17:22.57 | mafm | config.load("/usr/local/share/g3d/resources.cfg"); |
| 17:23.22 | mafm | homovulgaris: but maybe 4.3 continues to be picky and refuses to compile other portions of the code :) |
| 17:24.47 | homovulgaris | ok.. will check that out |
| 17:25.18 | homovulgaris | mafm: i was doing some svn:ignore propsets on rt3 mainly the src/other directory.. |
| 17:25.28 | homovulgaris | dunno if i have commit access to that trunk though. |
| 17:27.29 | mafm | what do you mean with that, that maybe you won't be able to commit fixes? |
| 17:28.07 | mafm | you can maintain them locally and then I'll fix them properly |
| 17:28.59 | homovulgaris | naah.. not code modifications or anything.. just that when i do svn status for example i have to see through the whole list of Makefiles and Makefile.ins and other autogenerated stuff in the list |
| 17:29.30 | mafm | I see |
| 17:30.02 | mafm | homovulgaris: well, so does it compile now? |
| 17:31.51 | homovulgaris | was doing the propedits.. will do the compile after that |
| 17:31.54 | homovulgaris | 5 mins :) |
| 17:33.46 | homovulgaris | ogre/OgreMain/include/config.h.in is autogenerated .. right ? so we can svn:ignore it ? |
| 17:34.12 | mafm | I think that is not autogenerated |
| 17:34.21 | mafm | that it's the template to generate config.h |
| 17:39.13 | homovulgaris | it is not on svn presently right.. :) so it must be generated ;0 |
| 17:39.14 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 17:40.01 | homovulgaris | and hey mafm: i had to add #include <string.h> to mocha/Source/MemoryStream.cpp |
| 17:40.36 | mafm | well, with 4.3 probably it's not the only one that you have to change |
| 17:40.59 | mafm | they reorganized the included headers so now many compilations fail for simple things like that |
| 17:41.41 | homovulgaris | ok i am commiting the propset changes to ogre and ois |
| 17:41.59 | homovulgaris | will check out the compilation thing .. |
| 17:42.07 | homovulgaris | i would love to see the new gui on my monitor :) |
| 17:42.31 | mafm | well, I have to go that I'm already late and can't wait more, you'll tell me :) |
| 17:42.41 | mafm | 'evening! |
| 17:43.12 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 17:48.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31656 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ (521 files in 521 dirs): set svn:ignore |
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| 17:53.22 | homovulgaris | brlcad: cmake_minimum_required(VERSION 2.6) asks me to add this to the top of CMakeLists.txt .. shouldnt I :) ? |
| 17:58.53 | homovulgaris | oops i mean cmake asks me to add that to the top of CMakeList ;) |
| 18:29.36 | brlcad | homovulgaris: yes, you should add that (or some prior version) |
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| 18:36.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31657 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/mocha/ (3 files in 2 dirs): <string.h> include to build mocha |
| 18:42.59 | homovulgaris | yeehaw.. g3d running :) |
| 18:45.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31658 10/rt^3/trunk/src/ (g3d/CMakeLists.txt other/rbgui/Gui/CMakeLists.txt): cmake_minimum_required(2.2) added to the CmakeLists |
| 18:49.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31659 10/rt^3/trunk/ (28 files in 28 dirs): svn:ignore and char*** to char** in OgreSample application |
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| 18:56.22 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
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| 20:46.02 | brlcad | hello quentusrex |
| 20:47.49 | pacman87 | well, starting plot() for the wireframe fixed the earlier raytrace problem |
| 20:48.56 | brlcad | cool, what was it? |
| 20:49.13 | pacman87 | what was what? |
| 20:49.17 | brlcad | the problem :) |
| 20:49.22 | brlcad | when you added the sphere, the results changed |
| 20:49.23 | pacman87 | i still don't know |
| 20:49.26 | brlcad | hah |
| 20:49.31 | pacman87 | i dont need the sphere now |
| 20:49.31 | brlcad | gotta love it |
| 20:49.52 | brlcad | prepares to go see wallE |
| 20:50.15 | pacman87 | theory is when it should work, but doesn't. practice is when it works, but no one know why/ |
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| 21:37.19 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 21:53.47 | pacman87 | wireframe: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf01.png |
| 21:53.59 | pacman87 | and raytrace: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt07.png |
| 21:56.44 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:06.38 | pacman87 | should i use 8 or 16 sketch slices in the wireframe? |
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| 22:24.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31660 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: rt_revolve_plot() now works for sketches consisting of straight line segments |
| 23:47.35 | starseeker | pacman87: neat! |
| 23:47.53 | pacman87 | straigh lines only, atm |
| 23:48.05 | starseeker | still cool :-) |
| 23:48.11 | pacman87 | yeah :) |
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| 16:30.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31661 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.h pcNetwork.h pcVariable.h solver_test.cpp): Stage 3/4 : Basic constraint solver implemented by solve() funtion in BinaryNetwork class- No backtracking ; Modifications to Variable Class structure and Constraint Class methods |
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| 16:38.22 | starseeker | wanders over to the cmake site... |
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| 16:43.28 | homovulgaris | pacman87: hi :) how are things going :) |
| 16:50.12 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: pretty good, have you seen my screenshots? |
| 16:50.26 | homovulgaris | nope |
| 16:50.34 | homovulgaris | the line segments are working good ? |
| 16:50.36 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/ |
| 16:50.47 | pacman87 | look at the rev_rtXX.png |
| 16:50.58 | pacman87 | and rev_wf01.png is the wireframe |
| 16:53.47 | homovulgaris | looks neat ;) |
| 16:54.03 | pacman87 | i put rt_nul_params into table.c instead of rt_revolve_params |
| 16:54.06 | homovulgaris | how are the sketches made finally :) ? |
| 16:54.21 | pacman87 | that one i imported |
| 16:54.42 | homovulgaris | ok.. :) |
| 16:55.28 | homovulgaris | about rt_revolve_params .. hmm yeah well since revolve is like a derived object, the way parameters are specified would be different .. :) |
| 16:55.40 | pacman87 | probably similar to extrude |
| 16:55.59 | homovulgaris | yeah.. very similar to extrude..i havent worked on the C files and primitives parts for sometime.. |
| 16:56.21 | homovulgaris | have been working mostly on modeling the constraint solver and graph generation |
| 16:56.22 | pacman87 | yeah, i checked the hyp_params() to see what was going on |
| 16:56.38 | pacman87 | it's just return 0; |
| 16:56.40 | homovulgaris | presently none of the params() do anything :D |
| 16:58.50 | pacman87 | gets food |
| 16:59.19 | homovulgaris | just had around 500 grams of chicken |
| 16:59.58 | homovulgaris | did u see mafm's gui :) ? |
| 17:00.14 | homovulgaris | i finally was able to get it running yesterday ;) |
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| 17:43.57 | Byron1 | using oed, if you have a set of metal plates within a box can you move the set of plates as a whole in the box |
| 18:02.25 | starseeker | Byron1: If the plates are in a combination or region, yes |
| 18:26.25 | Byron1 | starseeker thanks I was able to make it work. |
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| 10:59.56 | ghostknife | Where can I find archer? |
| 11:00.55 | ghostknife | or wait I have it in tclscripts |
| 11:00.59 | ghostknife | but it's not finding it |
| 11:01.54 | ghostknife | Error in startup script: can't find package Archer 1.0 |
| 11:04.01 | ghostknife | dammit, this thing is bugyg |
| 11:05.30 | ghostknife | I create a new database in mged, create metaball, crash because it runs free() on the same pointer twice |
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| 12:03.27 | Mouette | have you the OpenGL libraries in your solaris platform? |
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| 12:31.21 | brlcad | ghostknife: backtrace? |
| 12:32.26 | brlcad | Mouette: maybe, probably |
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| 17:24.02 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 17:54.14 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 18:00.53 | ghostknife | brlcad: are you the creator? |
| 18:07.52 | brlcad | ghostknife: BRL-CAD was started by Mike Muuss |
| 18:08.29 | ghostknife | Yeah I know. The PING god |
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| 18:23.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31662 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: ws |
| 18:32.45 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 18:45.36 | homovulgaris | is thinking about functors for specific constraint evaluation :| |
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| 19:24.18 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31663 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.h solver_test.cpp): variadic function based constructor for Constraint to support easy addition of variable number of variables |
| 19:26.03 | ``Erik | puts the 'puters away and prepares for flight |
| 19:27.18 | homovulgaris | :) flying by urself ? |
| 19:28.06 | homovulgaris | and Erik did u check if pkg-config was working . I mean i saw that sean edited the names to represent internal names . but on my system it still complains of datarootdir not declared |
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| 20:03.19 | smurfette | yes, he is flying by himself :) |
| 20:03.36 | smurfette | to come and visit me :D |
| 20:10.32 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 20:11.01 | homovulgaris | I love pancakes :D |
| 20:17.24 | homovulgaris | brlcad: :( sourceforge not accepting my mail to devel-list |
| 20:19.41 | homovulgaris | they say : that the other server returned was: 550 550 This message matches a blacklisted regular expression (pharma ban) (state 18) |
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| 00:45.35 | brlcad | smurfette: enjoy :) |
| 00:45.52 | brlcad | sells all his wordly possessions while he's away |
| 00:46.17 | brlcad | i suppose he's there by now, or will be soon |
| 00:46.48 | brlcad | homovulgaris: hmm, can you forward me the rejection? |
| 00:47.07 | brlcad | you've sent to it before... |
| 00:48.48 | homovulgaris | yeah i have .. dunno why it is rejecting this time |
| 00:48.59 | brlcad | and if you need functors (which i sorta assumed you would.. for representing a given 'compiled' constraint), that boost constraint library becomes even more interesting :) |
| 00:50.52 | homovulgaris | yeah.. basically i am very much keen on using functors ;) major on my TODO list |
| 00:51.45 | brlcad | is_tangent, is_parallel, etc |
| 00:52.08 | homovulgaris | basically binary constraints are nothing compared to the actual generic constraint problems.. so writing a generic solver is gonna be pretty tough.. |
| 00:52.21 | homovulgaris | :) nice challenge i mean ;) |
| 00:52.39 | brlcad | hm, you should document your TODO list actually in the TODO |
| 00:53.26 | homovulgaris | brlcad: have a look at this, decently simple introduction to basic concepts of constraint solution http://kti.mff.cuni.cz/~bartak/constraints/index.html |
| 00:53.38 | brlcad | it's supposed to be a basic scratch-pad file for those sorts of thoughts/plans, not rigid format nor formalized, just notes |
| 00:53.56 | homovulgaris | hmm.. the main TODO.. do i add a new section called libpc and add bullets ? |
| 00:54.38 | homovulgaris | ok.. sent the mail btw. both the original message and the rejection :) |
| 00:56.19 | brlcad | homovulgaris: mm, yeah, you could add a new section, or create either a TODO or README in src/libpc |
| 00:56.56 | brlcad | if they're "definitely going to happen" notes, then they probably belong at the top-level |
| 00:56.59 | homovulgaris | hey sean, in the TODO what do we mean by integration of BRL-CAD Overview and Industry diagrams. I was pretty impressed by the Industry diagram :) neat spanning representation |
| 00:57.20 | brlcad | integrating them into svn somehow |
| 00:57.32 | homovulgaris | hmm.. I think i will create a TODO in the libpc and refine things from there to the main :) |
| 00:57.44 | brlcad | they're not revision controllable/controlled at the moment, they were drafted up with proprietary tools |
| 00:58.04 | homovulgaris | ok.. |
| 00:58.05 | brlcad | try not to be too isolationist.. :) |
| 00:58.28 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 00:58.30 | brlcad | reduction of "stuff" to maintain is a good thing |
| 00:58.49 | homovulgaris | finally i had to return to my college due to the rains :) going home on 2nd july now.. |
| 00:59.34 | homovulgaris | and the 2200 train journey is shifted to a crappy flight |
| 00:59.38 | homovulgaris | loves trains |
| 00:59.57 | homovulgaris | sean, we don't have a problem with variadic functions right ? |
| 01:00.13 | brlcad | seriously, I smile .. but it's a natural tendancy of new devs in particular, low maintenance and integrated is key regardless of the mechanisms |
| 01:00.40 | homovulgaris | i mean we dont have to think about compilers which don't support them. I mean i dont know of any |
| 01:01.07 | brlcad | nah, varargs are fine when used appropriately |
| 01:01.14 | brlcad | typechecking them can be a bitch |
| 01:01.16 | homovulgaris | hmm.. ok.. will try to keep it as integrated as possible.. :) I don't want to end up writing code which becomes useless in a short time :D |
| 01:01.24 | brlcad | and having the right signatures if they're publicly exposed |
| 01:01.50 | homovulgaris | just for the constructor of constraint class right now |
| 01:02.34 | brlcad | that's also why a great first step is getting the primitives using the library for their simple validation needs -- if that much is easily understood and simple enough, using and extending the library for modeling purposes can more readily follow |
| 01:03.43 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I also haven't reviewed whether you're using any stl types in libpc's public API .. that's usually taboo/problematic |
| 01:04.20 | homovulgaris | hmm.. so i think i should write my own list and vector ? |
| 01:04.33 | brlcad | hells no, not if you can avoid it |
| 01:04.51 | brlcad | depends just where in the api it is |
| 01:05.20 | brlcad | i love the stl containers, they're just hell for windows binary compatibility |
| 01:05.24 | homovulgaris | hmm.. ok right now lots of transfer between objects takes place using lists |
| 01:05.58 | homovulgaris | that should be removed i guess ? i mean if it is not exposed it is not an issue ? |
| 01:06.20 | brlcad | hell => not generally portable to anything but the OS and version it was compiled for |
| 01:06.52 | brlcad | i guess it really depends how the windows build is set up |
| 01:07.13 | homovulgaris | hmm... :) grr.. so i need to do some figuring out in that direction |
| 01:07.27 | brlcad | if libpc is set up as a static lib and resolves everything in librt et al, then it won't matter (but that's a bigger pita) |
| 01:07.42 | brlcad | I wouldn't worry about it too much at this point |
| 01:08.01 | homovulgaris | hmm.. static.. k.. lets see |
| 01:08.16 | brlcad | both std lists and vectors can be easily turned into bu_lists if we need to |
| 01:08.57 | homovulgaris | bu_list is kewl.. that example was pretty explanatory |
| 01:08.58 | brlcad | make the public api call a bu-wrapper that turns them into stl on the backend |
| 01:10.47 | homovulgaris | hmm.. as i mentioned in the mail, i think i need to do the work i left of at the C part of things bridging the interface between all these C++ classes and the C structs |
| 01:10.51 | brlcad | if you want to worry about that now, great, if not we can look into it before anything is exposed to external developers |
| 01:12.05 | homovulgaris | I think mid july would be a good time. |
| 01:12.15 | homovulgaris | adding to TODO |
| 01:14.14 | homovulgaris | sean, another thing i was thinking about was, when we actually implement constraints, for supporting generic constraint evaluation, is it worth considering runtime code generation |
| 01:15.18 | homovulgaris | one way of evaluation is basically a stack parser which is relatively easy to code |
| 01:15.18 | brlcad | example? |
| 01:16.02 | brlcad | bah, sf.net lists aren't responding at the moment, I'll have to check on it later |
| 01:17.00 | homovulgaris | like any constraint involving a set of parameters and operations on them ( X^5 + YZ^3 -f(P&Q) ) or some complex expression of the sort |
| 01:17.20 | brlcad | presumably you mean some parser for tokenizing and evaluating the expression(s) |
| 01:17.39 | homovulgaris | yeah that is one solution. |
| 01:18.12 | homovulgaris | by runntime code generation, I mean actually coding and compiling the function so that we save computational time |
| 01:18.54 | homovulgaris | because that same expression will have to be evaluated for a large number of possible value sets of (X,Y,P ,Q) |
| 01:19.29 | smurfette | brlcad: no he isnt here yet, he took some obnoxiously long flight that has a 1.5 hour layover in minnesota :P |
| 01:19.49 | smurfette | minnesota isnt exactly between here and there, its WAY out of the way :( |
| 01:19.57 | brlcad | smurfette: ah |
| 01:20.26 | smurfette | so i have to pick him up at 11 cst |
| 01:20.39 | brlcad | you going to be waiting in a white summer dress in high heels with a white hat? |
| 01:20.45 | brlcad | painted in blue? |
| 01:21.04 | smurfette | haha, of course! |
| 01:21.51 | smurfette | i need to dye my hair yellow too |
| 01:22.24 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I get what it is and what it's for, but not how your actual question relates to what you were planning on doing |
| 01:23.35 | homovulgaris | hmm.. :D I am pretty fuzzy on that too .. just started thinking about it |
| 01:24.32 | brlcad | if you have expression trees/graphs, then each node is a potential function |
| 01:25.06 | brlcad | the mere nature of parsing the expression into an in-memory graph structure that is evaluated should be reasonable for most purposes |
| 01:25.43 | brlcad | turning the whole expression into some new dynamic function is probably overkill (or at least not a project for *this* summer given everything else that is needed) |
| 01:26.02 | homovulgaris | hmm.. k i was thinking that probably the graph traversal would eat up time :D and yeah :) overkill |
| 01:26.23 | brlcad | since if you *really* needed the performance for some given expression, then that would really sound like some missing pre-existing function |
| 01:26.59 | homovulgaris | and eitherways i think i should first implement the parser rather than worrying about optimization |
| 01:27.14 | brlcad | i sort of seem to think we'll end up with a set of available "precompiled" functions, similar to the excel macros if you will, that basically let you write expressions that use some syntax like TANGENT(this_sphere, that_plane), etc |
| 01:27.38 | brlcad | which amounts in code to a is_tangent() callback or somesuch |
| 01:27.55 | brlcad | just like is_odd(), is_perpendicular(), is_nonnegative, etc |
| 01:28.28 | homovulgaris | hmm.. i was thinking of macros |
| 01:29.42 | brlcad | if you're going to need an *actual* parser, I would recommend sticking to either a) lex/yacc, b) using a standard interpreter, c) using the spirit portion of boost |
| 01:30.35 | brlcad | goes to let the dog out |
| 01:31.16 | homovulgaris | grr.. workrave message .. k.. i will check out the parser options |
| 01:44.04 | brlcad | we do a) and b) in other places in brl-cad already -- and by b) I mean something like using the tcl interpreter that we already integrate with (from the C side) |
| 01:44.27 | brlcad | c) becomes an option simply because you're already using boost and it's cross-platform |
| 01:44.47 | brlcad | having a BNF for the expressions would be ideal |
| 01:45.32 | brlcad | and intentionally not some custom hand-rolled parser even if it seems more simple at the start, less maintainable |
| 01:46.40 | homovulgaris | hmm.. TODO: BNF |
| 01:48.57 | homovulgaris | let me see what boost has to offer .. i have never used tcl.. Basically the parsing would happen on the objects passed from the C side of things generating functions which would be used by the C++ solvers/ constraint evaluation .. So we can have either tcl based systems or C++ based parsers |
| 01:50.18 | homovulgaris | brlcad: john replied to the message i sent , did it come on the group ? |
| 01:53.33 | homovulgaris | and the revision controllable image would mean something xml based like svg or uml like from dia ? |
| 01:54.01 | brlcad | I haven't received anything yet |
| 01:54.31 | brlcad | homovulgaris: something like that perhaps |
| 01:58.32 | homovulgaris | hmm.. k i am off to a short nap now..hopefully backtracking would be done in 2 hours after i wake up . |
| 01:59.11 | brlcad | cheers |
| 02:02.14 | homovulgaris | maybe i will do some doxygen editing ( rt division) and wiki additions and indendation/beautification after that. one day break from coding |
| 02:03.12 | brlcad | sounds like a plan :) |
| 02:03.44 | homovulgaris | should stop sleeping at 7.40 am and follow a more regular schedule |
| 02:03.58 | homovulgaris | bye all :) |
| 02:04.34 | brlcad | it works out conveniently ;) |
| 02:45.56 | brlcad | homovulgaris: fyi, I submitted a support request for the e-mail rejection |
| 02:46.20 | brlcad | I get the same rejection -- it happens at the mail server itself before it even gets to our mailing list |
| 02:46.49 | brlcad | so your message content apparently just looks too much like pharmacological spam |
| 02:47.18 | brlcad | maybe the malformed url you embedded |
| 02:50.27 | brlcad | apparently not, just tried with it cleaned up |
| 02:53.04 | brlcad | not the url at all, tried without |
| 02:53.32 | brlcad | has to just be the code, which makes the filter even more absurd.. awaiting support request results |
| 02:58.52 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:58.59 | brlcad | howdy |
| 02:59.20 | brlcad | sushi time! |
| 03:03.07 | yukonbob | Mmmm sushi |
| 03:04.01 | yukonbob | orders 2 toro, 2 unagi, a tomago and a rainbow roll |
| 03:59.28 | starseeker | is going to have to crack and see Wall-E, if the reviews are right... |
| 03:59.54 | yukonbob | feh -- disney |
| 04:00.10 | yukonbob | boycots that evil empire |
| 04:04.16 | starseeker | brlcad: If svg is OK I can look a making versions of the diagrams... |
| 04:34.26 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=homovulg@202.63.233.61) | |
| 05:38.03 | starseeker | brlcad: Well, I have a start at least: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/test.png |
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| 07:34.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31664 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: |
| 07:34.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: rt_revolve_plot: moved variable declarations on top of the (function-)block |
| 07:34.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: rt_revolve_prep: added missing return statement |
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| 10:23.13 | mafm | hi |
| 11:54.40 | brlcad | howdy mafm, how was the weekend? |
| 11:56.21 | brlcad | starseeker: not too shabby for that quick |
| 11:57.18 | brlcad | shame we can't use the same font, picky about that |
| 11:59.03 | starseeker | Yeah, that'll be tough |
| 11:59.17 | starseeker | used Bitstream Vera, IIRC |
| 11:59.55 | brlcad | open source font options are really weak |
| 12:00.14 | starseeker | loads update with more decorative bits on the brlcad outline |
| 12:01.06 | starseeker | Is that a worthwhile starting point? If so I can upload the svg somewhere |
| 12:01.12 | starseeker | or stick it in svn |
| 12:01.44 | brlcad | mm, hold off for now |
| 12:01.49 | starseeker | k |
| 12:03.48 | starseeker | is unlikely to get too much closer to the exact colors without a lot of fiddling |
| 12:04.37 | starseeker | If you could recover rgb, alpha settings and ordering of the ellipses from the original program that can be set up here I think... |
| 12:05.33 | starseeker | anyway, enough of that for now |
| 12:05.50 | starseeker | gets ready to rumble... |
| 12:27.22 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.201.7) | |
| 12:39.38 | mafm | brlcad: hot and sunny :9 |
| 12:39.39 | mafm | :) |
| 12:43.16 | mafm | so did you have the chance to test the program yet? |
| 12:43.27 | mafm | I had to leave when homovulgaris was at it |
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| 13:59.22 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
| 14:01.04 | mafm | agrees |
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| 15:16.19 | PrezKennnedy | brlcad, you keeping my bro busy? |
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| 16:05.15 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
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| 17:37.17 | mafm | bye |
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| 18:08.43 | brlcad | PrezKennnedy: he says yes |
| 18:10.54 | PrezKennnedy | you all upstairs in that open room? |
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| 18:37.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31666 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CommandInterpreter.cxx CommandInterpreter.h): Several bugfixes and improvements, still WIP |
| 18:37.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31667 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiCommandOverlay.cxx GuiConsole.cxx): Linking Console and CommandOverlay to CommandInterpreter |
| 18:38.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31668 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Logger.h: Method to translate the log levels to strings set to public -- it's not harmful and other code can take advantage of it. |
| 19:07.21 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.10.110) | |
| 19:07.28 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 19:11.46 | poolio | andrecastelo: how was vacation? |
| 19:13.12 | andrecastelo | poolio: not so good, too cold.. and i couldn't code at all |
| 19:13.52 | poolio | ah, sorry. where'd you go? |
| 19:14.27 | andrecastelo | Rio de Janeiro |
| 19:22.08 | poolio | Sounds cool :) |
| 20:55.12 | brlcad | andrecastelo: welcome back! |
| 20:56.29 | andrecastelo | brlcad: thanks! |
| 21:10.13 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-22 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 21:31.20 | poolio | brlcad: I think U-V mapping just clicked in my head :D |
| 21:31.35 | poolio | The whole directional trim is in relation to the coordinates defines as control points, right? |
| 21:40.30 | brlcad | sentance does not parse :) |
| 21:40.51 | brlcad | trimmings are on surfaces |
| 21:41.55 | brlcad | surfaces are defined in terms of a UV mapping, so yeah.. the trim curves are in relation to the 3d control points used for the surface |
| 21:57.35 | poolio | yeah...the "what is the u-v direction in relation to in 3-space" was my main confusion |
| 21:57.58 | poolio | I think I've got it right in my head...let me try to implement :) |
| 21:58.43 | poolio | And in terms of defining 3d control points, is it pretty arbitrary? Like, does it have to be [0,1]? The example cubes use (0,0) (0,1) (1,0) (1,1) |
| 23:05.46 | brlcad | zero-to-one UV mappings are usually just pretty damn convenient |
| 23:06.54 | brlcad | pretty common |
| 23:32.38 | PrezKennnedy | hey brlcad! |
| 00:43.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31669 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/fast4-g.c: massive style cleanup, ws changes |
| 00:55.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31670 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: quell warning, give the union in pc_p_set a name so it can be referenced |
| 01:01.47 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31671 10/brlcad/trunk/include/common.h: quell strict ansi compilation warnings about the 'inline' keywords now in use in bu.h by turning them off if __STRICT_ANSI__ is defined |
| 01:07.09 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:08.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31672 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/fast4-g.c: comment out a surprising amount of logic not being used. the post-processing in particular looks useful, but will need some testing to validate behavior (or make it optional). |
| 01:11.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31673 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: steven k. found out that the bump shader doesn't seem to be working. |
| 01:13.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31674 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: pipe primitive has a BU_GETSTRUCT malloc getting called during raytracing. kills performance by more than an order of magnitude. thx stephen k. for provoking the bug. |
| 01:16.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31675 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS TODO): verified that fast4-g no longer vomits warning messages. did discover, though, that it'll annoyingly skip every other input line if you're processing a DOS file on UNIX... |
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| 06:13.59 | ilya004857363 | Hi, I'm at first in brlcad and in fact I haven't compiled it yet. |
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| 09:49.00 | mafm | hi |
| 11:03.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31676 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Logger.cxx: Logging the event of setting the log level, and checking that it's a proper level (and not some forged/casted value) |
| 11:05.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31677 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CommandInterpreter.cxx CommandInterpreter.h): Enhancing the command display (help), and the flexibility to show information about commands themselves |
| 11:05.54 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31678 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Adding a couple of commands (quit, set log level) |
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| 12:56.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31679 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Commands.h Logger.cxx Logger.h): Adding Singleton and Listener patterns |
| 14:15.02 | starseeker | does text and image extraction from Volume III... |
| 14:16.52 | starseeker | turns read as he checks the xml conversion and notices the "role" keyword for emphasis tags |
| 14:24.09 | starseeker | hmm - vol3 images are stubborn |
| 14:26.59 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_ (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 14:27.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31680 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Observer.cxx Observer.h): Adding classes to implement Observer pattern |
| 14:31.37 | starseeker | grrr |
| 14:33.32 | mafm | what happens starseeker? |
| 14:33.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31681 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (8 files): Substituted private Listener implementations for the more general Observer pattern, so we'll [hopefully] have less hassles when adding/modifying code in the future. |
| 14:34.08 | starseeker | I'm trying to get the 3rd volume of the tutorial series in shape to convert to Docbook, but that means image extraction |
| 14:34.26 | starseeker | so far none of the tools I've tried are having much luck |
| 14:34.31 | mafm | image extraction from which format? |
| 14:35.33 | starseeker | word |
| 14:36.36 | mafm | uh :D |
| 14:36.49 | mafm | I was going to suggest imagemagick in the case that you didn't know, but... |
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| 14:56.32 | ``Erik | hum, tcl 8.6a1 is out |
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| 15:00.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31682 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (7 files): Make some general enhancements: making public-accesable attributes read-only (const), decoupling a bit more functionality of the console from the widgets implementing it, etc. |
| 15:42.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31683 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Moving basic window creation, operations and settings to base class, so we abstract and protect a bit more the code from the GUI libraries that we're using underneath. |
| 15:47.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31684 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiConsole.cxx: Adding content to the console panel only when the line is not empty -- otherwise we produce a spurious new-line. |
| 16:05.31 | ``Erik | hum, breakage in libt |
| 16:05.32 | ``Erik | librt |
| 16:05.34 | ``Erik | primitives/ell/ell.c:1659: error: 'struct pc_p_set' has no member named 'pointp' |
| 16:05.34 | ``Erik | primitives/ell/ell.c:1663: error: 'struct pc_p_set' has no member named 'vectorp' |
| 16:06.34 | *** join/#brlcad b0ef (n=b0ef@062016141231.customer.alfanett.no) | |
| 16:16.32 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:16.41 | ``Erik | cinelerra, clock? O.o |
| 17:10.55 | starseeker | Ah - HAH |
| 17:11.03 | starseeker | bad image file in document |
| 17:11.12 | starseeker | even Word itself couldn't export it |
| 17:13.57 | starseeker | still weird though... |
| 17:14.06 | starseeker | low image quality, despite 300dpi request |
| 17:14.18 | starseeker | ah, well - enough to start anyway |
| 17:17.46 | poolio | ``Erik: doesn't the union need to be tagged? |
| 17:23.10 | poolio | neverminddd. I forget my C :( |
| 17:25.18 | mafm | lol |
| 17:25.29 | mafm | maybe you can apply to be a manager then, poolio |
| 17:25.49 | poolio | I think I have to do something to warrant promotion first |
| 17:26.11 | mafm | I had a job interview and the guy kep talking about C and Java, when I was told that it was C++ and Java |
| 17:26.26 | mafm | when I asked he said that it was C++ really, but that he liked to call it C |
| 17:26.30 | mafm | (...) |
| 17:27.23 | poolio | well, most your C code will compile with g++ :) |
| 17:28.44 | mafm | but in that case it was the contrary.. maybe their C++ code compiles with gcc |
| 17:28.52 | mafm | that would be a bit worrysome, I guess |
| 18:47.37 | mafm | humm |
| 18:47.47 | mafm | dunno what happens today, internet life seems dead |
| 18:48.06 | mafm | maybe the start of the holidays? :) |
| 18:48.13 | pacman87 | well, my partial revolves are taking a lot longer that expected |
| 18:50.08 | mafm | :D |
| 18:50.28 | mafm | I mean also because brlcad [the man] is missing in action |
| 18:50.37 | mafm | but not only in this channel |
| 18:51.02 | mafm | are you happy with your project, pacman87? |
| 18:51.17 | pacman87 | so far, yes |
| 18:51.19 | pacman87 | you? |
| 18:53.21 | pacman87 | i'm getting 4 hitpoints when i should be getting 2 |
| 18:53.55 | pacman87 | so instead of a hit segment from (A,B), i get two segments (A,A) and (B,B) |
| 18:54.47 | mafm | it's quite funny and I'm learning quite a lot |
| 18:54.55 | mafm | so yes, pretty much so :) |
| 19:00.11 | brlcad | ``Erik: jra is cool keywise |
| 19:00.51 | brlcad | ah, that error in ell.c is probably due to my fix last night, didn't do a full recompile |
| 19:01.01 | brlcad | homovulgaris had a bad union |
| 19:02.14 | pacman87 | hmmm, i think my sketch has duplicate segments |
| 19:03.12 | pacman87 | sketch |
| 19:03.50 | pacman87 | sketch's curve.seg_count is 10, and there should be 5 |
| 19:04.42 | brlcad | sketch you made? |
| 19:04.56 | pacman87 | the one i imported |
| 19:04.57 | pacman87 | yes |
| 19:05.15 | brlcad | if you 'l' it, does it show 10? |
| 19:05.34 | pacman87 | says 8 verticies |
| 19:06.20 | pacman87 | of the 8, there are three sets of repeats |
| 19:06.48 | brlcad | indeed sounds wrong |
| 19:06.51 | pacman87 | and the curve lists 10 line segments |
| 19:07.39 | pacman87 | and i've been banging my head against a wall trying to get my code working using incorrect assumptions about my sketch... |
| 19:08.13 | pacman87 | what did you say was the best way to edit a sketch by hand? |
| 19:08.19 | pacman87 | ie, human readable format? |
| 19:08.32 | brlcad | heh, i'm not sure *any* assumptions are good when it comes to geometry |
| 19:08.53 | brlcad | ah, convert the file to ascii format |
| 19:08.55 | brlcad | g2asc |
| 19:09.00 | brlcad | edit, then asc2g |
| 19:09.06 | pacman87 | the whole .g file? |
| 19:09.11 | brlcad | up to you |
| 19:09.22 | brlcad | if you want just the sketch, use the "keep" command |
| 19:13.01 | mafm | hey brlcad |
| 19:13.05 | mafm | so you're alive after all |
| 19:13.56 | pacman87 | hmmm, g2asc is giving me: ERROR: bad pointer x8066e08: s/b bu_vls(x89333bbb), was Unknown_Magic(x8066f20), file vls.c, line 407 |
| 19:18.06 | pacman87 | lunchtime |
| 19:18.33 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, just a 'tad' bit overloaded .. :) |
| 19:19.14 | brlcad | I still don't have the gui up, but not for lack of effort .. just still haven't got all the deps building yet |
| 19:20.07 | mafm | really? I though that it wouldn't be complicated |
| 19:20.24 | mafm | debian has most of the dependencies |
| 19:20.47 | brlcad | who said I was on debian? |
| 19:21.25 | brlcad | it's not been complicated, just annoying and time consuming |
| 19:22.18 | mafm | I mean that it's surprising for me, since for me it was virtually no effort for the deps |
| 19:22.19 | brlcad | haven't run into a single real problem yet, just the time involved to configure the build, compile (really slow machine), test, install, etc |
| 19:23.14 | brlcad | virtually no effort when you have even a couple hours to work on it is an entirely different situation :) |
| 19:23.14 | mafm | good :) |
| 19:23.21 | brlcad | virtually no effort != no effort |
| 19:23.44 | brlcad | i'm actually used to the latter, part of the emphasis on clean build system integration so it just works regardless of the platform |
| 19:23.51 | mafm | not that -- it's that I didn't have to compile anything :D |
| 19:24.32 | brlcad | well sure, package management systems are great for that when they're default available and when they work |
| 19:24.43 | brlcad | certainly not cross-platform, though |
| 19:28.36 | mafm | good enough, no rush :) |
| 19:30.04 | brlcad | should work on improving/finishing that build system integration some more too ;) |
| 19:31.23 | brlcad | saving users the need to hunt/download is only a small piece of the reason for including the deps, it should build them if it doesn't find a suitable system version |
| 19:31.59 | brlcad | also, your cmake files presently assume pkg-config, that shouldn't be assumed |
| 19:32.09 | brlcad | (nor required) |
| 19:34.33 | mafm | I'm no expert in building systems, but that could take weeks :S |
| 19:35.35 | mafm | "but" is alias to "but I think" and "because of that" at the same time :) |
| 19:35.41 | brlcad | I don't think anyone here would call themselves a cmake expert :) |
| 19:36.59 | brlcad | it is something that needs to happen earlier rather than later given this tool is intended to become pretty fundamental eventually |
| 19:37.33 | brlcad | minimally document the need somewhere (TODO), but poke on it when you can |
| 19:37.51 | mafm | but I could spend much time with it and miss the milestones with gsoc |
| 19:39.10 | brlcad | i understand, that doesn't change the pressing need for it .. |
| 19:39.19 | brlcad | the longer it's ignored, the harder it will be for whomever does try it |
| 19:39.52 | brlcad | it's part of coding complete |
| 19:40.18 | brlcad | if the build doesn't work cleanly, it's not really usable yet to most of our devs |
| 19:40.41 | mafm | I see |
| 19:41.43 | brlcad | e.g. I can't imagine bob readily being willing to futz with three different build systems plus pkg-config, cmake, and scons |
| 19:42.25 | brlcad | we're used to *zero* effort unless you want to change away from defaults |
| 19:43.45 | brlcad | it's not top-priority in front of the milestone tasks, but it's probably #2 or #3 to have a default-functioning build system regardless of system deps |
| 19:44.18 | mafm | that's fine, but I don't think that it's in the scope of the project to rework whatever building system the dependencies decide to use |
| 19:44.34 | brlcad | so at least document it is what I'm saying, maybe work on it if you take a break from coding |
| 19:44.37 | mafm | especially being an experimental project |
| 19:45.34 | brlcad | fyi, I don't see this as an experiement -- a prototype, sure .. but one with an exceptionally high probability of becoming the foundation for a new GUI |
| 19:46.22 | brlcad | you'd have to mess up in several big ways for it to be wasted effort :) |
| 19:47.32 | mafm | it seems to me that you're relaying on somebody with a weak knowledge of building for such a foundation :P |
| 19:48.10 | brlcad | not relying, just don't want you to blow it off entirely as not your problem |
| 19:49.54 | starseeker | prods CIA |
| 19:49.58 | brlcad | wasn't saying drop what you're doing to work on it, just keep it in mind and poke on it when you can .. and document where things are at |
| 19:51.15 | brlcad | kicks CIA-22 |
| 19:51.15 | CIA-22 | ow |
| 19:53.41 | starseeker | hmm - must commit more, evidently |
| 19:53.45 | starseeker | can do... |
| 20:03.20 | mafm | CIA missed half of today's commits or so |
| 20:06.41 | mafm | ~CIA-22-- |
| 20:06.42 | mafm | :) |
| 20:06.45 | mafm | heading home now |
| 20:07.20 | mafm | night |
| 20:32.29 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-235.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:16.13 | brlcad | yeah, I think our bot is hosored |
| 21:48.14 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1128564908.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 22:11.30 | brlcad | rather, the bot is fine but it's not getting any notifications from the main bot_server process (they're not showing up in #commits even) |
| 22:11.37 | brlcad | so it's something busted with the rpc relay |
| 23:18.52 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 00:31.54 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 02:53.26 | brlcad | heh, and steadily he chugs along! |
| 02:53.35 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 03:00.18 | starseeker | takes break from docbook to do first kernel upgrade in quite a while - when coreutils starts needing functionality not in your current kernel it's probably time to upgrade... |
| 03:28.42 | starseeker | hates upgrading the kernel |
| 03:42.01 | starseeker | crosses fingers and prepares to take the dive... |
| 03:54.15 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
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| 10:23.39 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:26.48 | mafm | hi |
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| 12:37.54 | starseeker | kernel upgrade (apparently) successful |
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| 13:47.39 | mafm | bad CIA-22, bad |
| 13:56.38 | starseeker | no kidding |
| 13:57.11 | starseeker | grits his teeth and grinds through the last of the volIII images... |
| 14:00.33 | mafm | go starseeker go |
| 14:00.59 | mafm | think of them as the guys who stole Christmas's spirit :P |
| 14:03.28 | brlcad | resets the rpc backend to CIA, which seems to have shut down |
| 14:06.57 | brlcad | reloading |
| 14:16.53 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-22 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 14:17.44 | brlcad | hugs CIA-22 |
| 14:17.44 | CIA-22 | hugs brlcad |
| 14:20.12 | brlcad | welp, that didn't do the trick |
| 14:25.18 | *** join/#brlcad cad24 (n=410d42ec@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:25.28 | *** part/#brlcad cad24 (n=410d42ec@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:51.54 | ``Erik | brlcad: wrt jra, thanks much |
| 15:24.15 | brlcad | hugs CIA-22 |
| 15:24.16 | CIA-22 | hugs brlcad |
| 15:38.48 | brlcad | gives up kicking CIA-22 for now .. either massive backlog or I'm just not hitting the right notes |
| 16:41.28 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
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| 18:34.52 | mafm | bye all |
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| 21:04.39 | brlcad | starseeker: great question for you on the help forum :) |
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| 01:05.41 | pacman87 | woohoo, partial revolves are working now! |
| 01:09.05 | pacman87 | raytrace; https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt08.png |
| 01:09.15 | pacman87 | wireframe: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf02.png |
| 01:10.20 | pacman87 | now i need to clean up all the commented out, failed code |
| 01:14.58 | pacman87 | i had to edit my sketch using a hex editor, though |
| 01:15.10 | pacman87 | i never got g2asc working |
| 01:23.13 | pacman87 | kicks CIA-22 |
| 01:23.14 | CIA-22 | ow |
| 02:05.17 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:47.15 | brlcad | pacman87: hah, awesome! |
| 02:47.44 | brlcad | never got g2asc working?? |
| 02:48.14 | brlcad | as in it didn't work or you didn't see how to edit the sketch or something else? |
| 02:49.14 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.com/m6efef113 |
| 02:49.54 | pacman87 | revolve angles > 180 still have a bug |
| 02:52.53 | brlcad | can you pastebin the unknown-3488-bomb.log file? |
| 02:53.48 | pacman87 | http://pastebin.com/m157c4fdd |
| 03:05.47 | brlcad | hrm, looks like it's corrupted somewhere before that point |
| 03:05.55 | brlcad | can you post the .g somewhere? |
| 03:06.11 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 03:07.43 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/sk.g |
| 03:15.42 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 03:25.40 | brlcad | thanks |
| 03:27.07 | brlcad | pacman87: huh, that succeeds for me without a hitch .. do you have a modified sketch.c ? |
| 03:27.42 | pacman87 | no |
| 03:30.36 | brlcad | tries a linux host |
| 03:39.47 | brlcad | hm, clean on ubuntu |
| 03:52.55 | pacman87 | fixed my bug |
| 03:54.06 | pacman87 | CIA-22 is still dead... |
| 03:54.56 | brlcad | the bot is alive, but yeah notifications are still down |
| 03:55.10 | brlcad | I worked on it for a few hours this morning |
| 03:55.35 | pacman87 | more pretty pictures: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt09.png |
| 03:55.45 | pacman87 | and wireframe: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf03.png |
| 03:55.58 | brlcad | either the problem is on sf.net's end or I totally missed where things are amiss on cia.vc |
| 03:56.55 | brlcad | neat :) |
| 03:58.16 | brlcad | btw, if you'd like a book to help you with revolve or sweep, lemme know |
| 03:58.38 | pacman87 | do you have a book that'd be useful? |
| 03:58.50 | brlcad | nope :) |
| 03:59.13 | pacman87 | revolve is shaping up nicely |
| 03:59.20 | brlcad | i think i've already sent you the few research papers that I've read that relate to it |
| 04:00.00 | pacman87 | and it's good i'm doing revolve first, rather than jumping head-first into sweep |
| 04:00.10 | brlcad | hm, your sketch.c line numbers don't match up with head source |
| 04:01.25 | pacman87 | yeah, i just did a svn up and it said it was updated |
| 04:01.32 | pacman87 | so i'm recompiling |
| 04:06.07 | brlcad | update again (just now) |
| 04:06.16 | brlcad | added a sanity check |
| 04:06.41 | pacman87 | i think i'm still on ./configure... |
| 04:07.00 | brlcad | heh, configure? you updated a Makefile.am? |
| 04:07.11 | pacman87 | no, i started over jsut in case |
| 04:07.15 | brlcad | ah |
| 04:07.34 | pacman87 | make clean; autogen.sh; configure --enable-all; make; make install; |
| 04:10.12 | pacman87 | i think i'm just going to go to bed |
| 04:11.14 | brlcad | early :) |
| 04:11.40 | brlcad | cya tomorrow |
| 04:11.54 | pacman87 | yeah, my parents go to bed early |
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| 04:45.06 | starseeker | brlcad: Cool, thanks for the heads up :-) |
| 04:45.09 | starseeker | answers |
| 04:47.01 | starseeker | Nuts, IIRC this was covered in the draft NIRT writeup... |
| 04:52.24 | brlcad | good answer |
| 04:52.31 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 04:52.44 | starseeker | the iges-g item below it looks like the same crash I got |
| 04:53.58 | starseeker | That luck sonofagun got the backtrace easy - I had to manually walk through it |
| 04:54.03 | starseeker | s/luck/lucky |
| 04:54.35 | starseeker | Looks like the same steps though |
| 04:55.17 | starseeker | brlcad: If that's the case, the openmoko files with the -n option DO trigger this on Linux, but not on the Mac |
| 04:55.50 | starseeker | the openmoko conversion ran to conclusion on the Mac for the openmoko as well (didn't display, but it did finish converting) |
| 04:56.15 | brlcad | sounds like it needs some debugger and/or valgrind love |
| 04:57.21 | starseeker | The valgrind report complained about something all right, but it wasn't immediately helpful to me |
| 04:57.29 | starseeker | wants to take another run at it |
| 04:57.53 | starseeker | iirc, valgrind spat out an error and then ran screaming (metaphorically) |
| 04:59.01 | starseeker | otoh, I am just finishing up with a massive system upgrade so I'll see if that did anything - iirc there was a valgrind update in there |
| 04:59.35 | starseeker | should make a bug report and reference the duplication in this post... |
| 05:10.41 | starseeker | does |
| 05:27.39 | pacman87 | brlcad: g2asc works now |
| 05:27.47 | pacman87 | really goes to bed now |
| 05:45.36 | brlcad | odd, maybe just libraries out of sync .. I don't know of any actual code changes that would have affected/caused/fixed that crash in the least |
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| 08:56.03 | wuxia | the wireframe model for brlcad -- it's opengl based? |
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| 10:36.45 | mafm | hi |
| 10:37.13 | poolio | mornin mafm |
| 10:45.19 | mafm | 'sup |
| 11:32.14 | brlcad | (for the now gone wuxia) the wireframe can be drawn using a variety of (equivalent) backends |
| 11:32.21 | brlcad | mornin' gents |
| 11:44.07 | starseeker | morning |
| 11:47.50 | archivist | hmm coverity is looking at the source http://scan.coverity.com/rung1.html |
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| 13:17.10 | brlcad | archivist: it's been at that status for over a year .. it's stuck |
| 13:17.24 | brlcad | we have far more than 178k lines of code :) |
| 13:17.58 | archivist | ew |
| 13:18.03 | brlcad | David Maxwell is overloaded trying to get an automated system in place right now |
| 13:19.06 | brlcad | we would be the #4 or #5 largest code in there otherwise, somewhere between 1M and 3M depending on what they count |
| 13:21.05 | archivist | I shall watch with interest (trying to get my C head back on at the moment) |
| 13:22.33 | brlcad | it's like watching paint dry .. |
| 13:23.28 | mafm | brlcad: did you get to compile Ogre at least? I'm stuck since, for some reason, I can't get it to compile now |
| 13:23.31 | brlcad | from what he was saying, running coverity on BRL-CAD broke their scanner at frist |
| 13:24.04 | brlcad | it also didn't have a means to ignore 3rd party sources and/or he didn't set it up |
| 13:24.48 | brlcad | mafm: yes -- I didn't have trouble compiling the deps other than the time factor itself |
| 13:24.56 | archivist | heh fun for him |
| 13:25.21 | mafm | macs have a pentium4, don't they? |
| 13:25.31 | brlcad | mafm: that's probably enough 'poking' for now, I did say just occasionally poke on it :) |
| 13:26.03 | brlcad | macs can have x86 or ppc cpus |
| 13:26.11 | brlcad | 32bit and 64bit |
| 13:26.54 | mafm | I mean yours |
| 13:27.02 | brlcad | i have several i use |
| 13:27.22 | brlcad | i'm actually on a ppc right this second |
| 13:28.09 | brlcad | any particular reason? |
| 13:28.30 | mafm | because it's failing for me in an optimized version for SSE instructions |
| 13:29.39 | mafm | so with PPC you don't have the problem, but I do |
| 13:30.19 | brlcad | I can give it a go later today on an Intel, but not too surprising with a random point of their svn trunk |
| 13:30.51 | brlcad | I'd say don't worry about it since you have another path that works |
| 13:31.17 | brlcad | you definitely shouldn't be fixing 3rd party sources this early |
| 13:31.41 | brlcad | even integrated we avoid that like the plague |
| 13:32.33 | mafm | well, yes, but I had it working before and I barely changed my system in the last months, so it's strange |
| 13:32.55 | mafm | and apart from that, I don't know if automatic compilation && installation works |
| 13:34.49 | brlcad | nods |
| 13:35.39 | brlcad | well I can certainly test and work on the latter from here |
| 13:36.02 | brlcad | you've got some more pieces plugged in |
| 13:36.35 | brlcad | investigating what's changed since your last test, well .. :) |
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| 13:38.16 | brlcad | nifty, http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~maverick/VimColorSchemeTest/index-pl.html |
| 13:44.44 | mafm | neat |
| 13:44.52 | mafm | now ogre works |
| 13:46.01 | mafm | I think that they should substitute clean&distclean for mrproper like the linux kernel :P |
| 13:56.47 | mafm | if I maintain ogre & the like as PHONY, then it repeats the configuration && compilation steps when I do make install |
| 13:56.54 | mafm | is there an easy way to fix this? |
| 14:13.32 | brlcad | if you make them phony, you have a build rule for them? |
| 14:13.41 | brlcad | in there you'd have to do your own timestamping |
| 14:13.46 | brlcad | at least with plain makefiles |
| 14:14.18 | brlcad | the better integration route will be to hook it into a cmake configuration step so it doesn't even traverse those paths (but leave that for later since cmake isn't a forte) |
| 14:14.25 | brlcad | s/later/someone else/ |
| 14:17.48 | mafm | I have "all" and "install", and then a function for each one |
| 14:18.06 | mafm | so all,ogre,ois...,install,install-ogre... |
| 14:18.11 | mafm | and install-ogre depending on ogre |
| 14:18.22 | mafm | and PHONY ogre, ois |
| 14:18.43 | mafm | so unless you call "make install" initially, it's repeated twice |
| 14:20.15 | mafm | so people having cmake && pkg-config; and some dependencies of OGRE (I think that only DevIL is needed), can get it up and running by just: |
| 14:20.29 | mafm | cd src/other; su -c "make install" |
| 14:20.56 | mafm | and then compile g3d with cmake && make as usual |
| 14:21.06 | brlcad | k, that's much better than it was ;) |
| 14:21.10 | mafm | no SCons needed now or other manual commands |
| 14:21.20 | mafm | to copy libraries |
| 14:21.35 | mafm | since I made pkg-config files for Mocha & RBGui in the Cmake-files themselves |
| 14:21.59 | brlcad | there's almost guaranteed to be cross-platform build issues still, but none that have to be addressed now |
| 14:22.11 | mafm | maybe I should explain this in the mailing list so ppl start testing it before the midterm evaluation? |
| 14:22.42 | brlcad | sure! |
| 14:22.45 | mafm | oh yes btw -- about paths and so on, I'm assuming Unixes only |
| 14:23.15 | mafm | and I guess that even Macs won't accept all paths and things like that |
| 14:23.19 | brlcad | oh, I mean issues in their code, other build system assumptions |
| 14:24.12 | mafm | OGRE and OIS should be multi-platform, but Mocha and RBGui's Cmake-files were made by the guy who created the RPM and me, so... |
| 14:24.16 | brlcad | e.g. one of them was already using cmake iirc, but they made assumptions that if you ran "make" after cmake that you were on linux, and started compiling linux-specific files |
| 14:24.41 | brlcad | you had to go to the generated xcode project instead and manually install the files after compile |
| 14:24.53 | brlcad | a lame busted assumption on their part |
| 14:25.14 | brlcad | not cmake's fault, they made it behave that way (perhaps by accident/ignorance) |
| 14:25.45 | brlcad | anyways, not important for now.. :) |
| 14:26.22 | mafm | I guess that you meant RBGui |
| 14:26.34 | brlcad | i forget which it was |
| 14:26.42 | mafm | the problem with RBGui is that they published the SVN site in Ogre forums, but just that |
| 14:27.02 | mafm | (it was RBGui because OIS and OGRE don't have it, and for Mocha I created it yesterday) |
| 14:27.23 | mafm | so that's why RBGui and Mocha need external patches to even compile in Linux/GCC |
| 14:27.28 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:27.40 | brlcad | classic corporate toss-over-the-wall |
| 14:27.51 | mafm | and one of RBGui's patches was the CMake-files themselves, so... |
| 14:27.52 | brlcad | runs off to a meeting |
| 14:28.03 | mafm | ok, so I'll write to the mailing list :) |
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| 17:59.53 | mafm | bye |
| 18:13.45 | starseeker | brlcad: Would it be useful to add stresstest.c to the repository, or should it just live in the bug report? |
| 18:14.02 | starseeker | only asks because he is afraid of accidently committing the makefile logic he has to build it |
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| 19:08.02 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 19:08.59 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 19:52.57 | brlcad | starseeker: stresstest.c ? |
| 19:53.09 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 20:18.34 | poolio | howdy brlcad, get my note? |
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| 20:28.41 | brlcad | poolio: yup, welcome home |
| 20:29.15 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/nmg_brep2.cpp |
| 20:33.50 | brlcad | interesting, updated quarterly stats on OS distributions: 71% Windows XP, 16% Windows Vista, 8% Mac OS X, 2% Windows 2000, 1% Linux (and leaving about 2% unknown) |
| 20:34.50 | brlcad | s/unknown/iphone, playstation, etc/ |
| 20:36.48 | poolio | brlcad: danke |
| 20:39.40 | prasad1 | so i visited firaxis yesterday |
| 20:39.52 | prasad1 | finally got to do it |
| 20:39.53 | prasad1 | heh |
| 20:40.46 | prasad1 | 2 pool tables, a ping pong table, 3 console centers, a cpl of arcade machines... |
| 20:40.48 | prasad1 | yup.. |
| 20:52.07 | poolio | prasad1: isn't that near baltimore? |
| 20:52.19 | prasad1 | hunt valley |
| 20:52.43 | starseeker | ponders stress test proc-db which is also useful and remembers the spring idea |
| 20:53.02 | starseeker | looks up spring characterization... |
| 20:56.39 | starseeker | figures this one will have to be on his own time - large scale spring generation and usage is unlikely... |
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| 10:40.09 | mafm | hi |
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| 12:21.51 | clock_ | clock@duke:~$ png_info tbl_300dpi.png |
| 12:21.51 | clock_ | color type: RGB with alpha channel (bit depth=8) |
| 12:21.51 | clock_ | Image size: 3417 X 4961 |
| 12:21.51 | clock_ | not interlaced |
| 12:21.51 | clock_ | Segmentation fault |
| 12:23.36 | clock_ | how do I determine the version of BRL-CAD? |
| 12:28.45 | clock_ | Oh it's the ..4 |
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| 14:01.51 | ``Erik | happy independance day for the dirty americans in the room O.o |
| 14:08.40 | mafm | o_O |
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| 14:46.10 | ``Erik | quatro de explodo |
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| 16:45.09 | poolio | brlcad: so I'm at the point in b-rep code where everything looks fine but it's not valid and I can't understand the cryptic errors :( |
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| 18:02.40 | ewilhelm | brlcad, you going to siggraph this year? |
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| 19:13.23 | pacman87 | hard at work: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/work.jpg |
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| 21:58.19 | Darknesss | is this still a channel for libirc? |
| 21:58.47 | Darknesss | if it ever was |
| 22:03.00 | Darknesss | anyone alive? |
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| 23:39.20 | dic003585498 | I have compiled brlcad from source with option -enable-all, but it offers a [nu] version only, with no graphics!! What is wrong? |
| 23:50.30 | pacman87 | dic003585498: are you running mged? |
| 23:50.40 | pacman87 | and what OS are you on? |
| 00:00.39 | dic003585498 | Ubuntu 8.04, /usr/brlcad/mged -n new.g |
| 00:01.12 | dic003585498 | yes, see my www.ansysED.narod.ru |
| 00:02.03 | pacman87 | try -c |
| 00:03.44 | dic003585498 | ok |
| 00:05.09 | dic003585498 | he says, attach (nu)[nu]? |
| 00:05.58 | dic003585498 | while I want to 'attach' X, ogl, or opengl |
| 00:06.14 | pacman87 | mine says "attach (nu|X|ogl)[nu]?" |
| 00:06.36 | dic003585498 | yours is better than mine... |
| 00:07.18 | pacman87 | i don't really know what else to tell you |
| 00:07.29 | pacman87 | you could try on monday when more ppl are around |
| 00:07.54 | pacman87 | today is independance day in the US |
| 00:09.58 | dic003585498 | ok, today I do not know "what a day today", I sit behind my new laptop... b there were a problem with Xlib.h whilst 'make' command... I will have tried something while my internet session is cheap |
| 00:13.33 | pacman87 | i'm out, good luck |
| 00:13.46 | dic003585498 | I think you had probably played in that game, called PacMan in '87... |
| 00:13.50 | dic003585498 | ok |
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| 06:59.48 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 07:02.28 | pacman87 | howdy, yukonbob |
| 07:03.42 | yukonbob | hey pacman87 |
| 07:03.49 | yukonbob | what are you doing up at this hour? |
| 07:04.14 | pacman87 | talking to a girl on aim |
| 07:04.30 | pacman87 | and sorting out my fireworks pictures |
| 07:04.31 | yukonbob | heh. nice |
| 07:04.40 | pacman87 | forgot a tripod |
| 07:04.45 | yukonbob | feh |
| 07:04.53 | yukonbob | lots of blurry coloured lines? |
| 07:05.00 | pacman87 | had to use a lawn chair instead |
| 07:05.07 | pacman87 | so instead of random wiggles |
| 07:05.13 | pacman87 | it's all up and down wiggles |
| 07:05.18 | yukonbob | nods |
| 07:05.29 | pacman87 | some came out alright |
| 07:05.35 | pacman87 | a lot were overexposed |
| 07:05.56 | yukonbob | digital or to film? |
| 07:06.03 | pacman87 | and there were some annoying parkign lot lights in the way |
| 07:06.08 | pacman87 | digital |
| 07:06.38 | pacman87 | if you're interested: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/fireworks/ |
| 07:06.55 | yukonbob | fires up X11 |
| 07:07.18 | pacman87 | isnt' there some jpg to ascii convertor? |
| 07:08.36 | yukonbob | heh -- something like libcaca, or aalib (I believe) -- I only know them for mpgs (and bet that's the only place they're really useful) |
| 07:09.02 | pacman87 | i think i saw the original star wars in ascii somewhere |
| 07:09.54 | yukonbob | are there ravers with their glow-sticks parading around too? ;) |
| 07:10.34 | pacman87 | little kids, lightsabers |
| 07:10.56 | pacman87 | i thought it looked kinda neat with the long exposure |
| 07:12.19 | yukonbob | 3299 looks like it's embossed |
| 07:15.26 | pacman87 | the second two were of a plane flying by |
| 07:15.30 | pacman87 | if you were wondering |
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| 15:29.19 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
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| 16:05.54 | Jo1 | hey =) |
| 16:32.43 | ``Erik | salut |
| 16:41.21 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 17:00.52 | jooivind | finnaly brlcad working ;) |
| 17:01.32 | jooivind | how does brl-cad compare to autocad ? |
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| 18:50.04 | ``Erik | 'sup, andre? how's the mlt going? |
| 18:50.36 | ``Erik | BRL-CAD is mostly designed for solid modelling with high resolution for physics simulation type shtuff |
| 18:50.50 | ``Erik | autocad is designed more as a drafting package for making blueprints |
| 18:52.02 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/w/images/4/44/Industry_Diagram.pdf will help you see the difference :) |
| 19:13.34 | jooivind | thank you kind sir |
| 19:13.35 | jooivind | ;) |
| 19:13.46 | jooivind | i feel autocad is kind of bloated |
| 19:14.19 | jooivind | but (imo) very intuitive, just the system requrements is kind of high |
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| 23:54.29 | wuxia | anyone have good papers for : (1) implementing constructive solid geometry on water tight meshes and (2) converting things like spheres, cylinders, etc .. intol meshes |
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| 14:26.04 | ilya0044566 | tommorov, there will be a lot of people in here... |
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| 15:53.23 | Axman6 | sure |
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| 06:14.41 | yukonbob | hello , cadheds |
| 06:14.47 | yukonbob | *cadheads |
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| 06:15.59 | yukonbob | uhhhhhhh |
| 06:16.29 | yukonbob | there are andrecastelo's popping up like mushrooms in here.. |
| 06:16.37 | yukonbob | set out the traps... |
| 06:52.29 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
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| 10:10.02 | mafm | hello |
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| 13:11.59 | pacman87 | morning, all |
| 13:14.09 | mafm | morning |
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| 14:42.22 | pacman87 | d_rossberg & brlcad: the revolve axis is currently set as the sketch's y-axis. it would be fairly easy to allow the user to specify a different x coordinate to revolve about -- would this be useful, or would it be better assume that the sketch is setup properly? |
| 14:43.24 | pacman87 | if the sketch editor could be extended to handle transformations (translation, rotation, scale) |
| 14:43.58 | pacman87 | that would probably work better |
| 14:44.31 | pacman87 | allow more flexablilty with sketches, and avoid the extra computation doing the translation each time in revolve |
| 14:45.50 | brlcad | ewilhelm: yes |
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| 14:59.45 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:05.09 | brlcad | pacman87: "no comment" .. i.e. I defer to you and d_rossberg on that one |
| 15:05.47 | pacman87 | i'm assuming the curent sketch editor doesnt already do that... |
| 15:08.26 | brlcad | present sketch editor is crappy |
| 15:09.11 | ``Erik | hum, now tcl and tk have 8.5.3 out |
| 15:09.13 | brlcad | it'll let you translate, but only edge/curve at a time |
| 15:09.35 | brlcad | presently no scaling or rotation, though they would be trivial to add |
| 15:10.02 | brlcad | you just have this absolute 2D coordinate space that you work in, create your sketch |
| 15:11.13 | pacman87 | should i start a 'wish list' for the editor? |
| 15:13.06 | brlcad | sure |
| 15:14.11 | brlcad | could add a section to the TODO specifically for it or a new file somewhere in doc or in src/primitives/sketch etc |
| 15:14.52 | ``Erik | it might be better to add it to the orange page or make something similar to that, then migrate those to the TODO in svn when people agree? |
| 15:15.46 | d_rossberg | pacman87: to use the y-axis as the revolve axis is ok for now |
| 15:16.35 | pacman87 | how much sketch checking should i do? |
| 15:17.00 | pacman87 | ie, make sure it's a closed loop? |
| 15:17.07 | d_rossberg | what kind of checks do you need |
| 15:17.52 | d_rossberg | you could also have some kind of default behavior if it's not closed |
| 15:18.02 | pacman87 | closed loop, everything on the + side of the y-axis |
| 15:18.49 | d_rossberg | why not on the - side? |
| 15:19.26 | pacman87 | my algorithm for partial revolves assumes + only |
| 15:20.25 | pacman87 | is there an application for partial revolves on the - side too? |
| 15:22.49 | d_rossberg | i don't know (at the moment) but you can have a sketch with the rotation axis moving through (but this can be done by two rotatons too) |
| 15:23.14 | d_rossberg | pacman97: BTW the sketch_name in rt_revolve_internal has a problem |
| 15:23.53 | d_rossberg | in asc2g there will be no memory allocated for it, and in ifree not freed |
| 15:24.13 | pacman87 | i noticed the asc2g problem |
| 15:24.18 | d_rossberg | maybe you should use bu_vls there |
| 15:25.02 | d_rossberg | (%S format in bu_structparse) |
| 15:25.21 | d_rossberg | see the dsp primitive for reference |
| 15:25.41 | pacman87 | ok, i was basing it more on the extrude |
| 15:27.00 | d_rossberg | the extrude has it's own adjust function |
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| 17:00.34 | brlcad | ``Erik: possibly, though the TODO doesn't cover "big picture"/project goals like the orange page, they tend to be much smaller tasks |
| 17:00.52 | brlcad | a section on the website/wiki would be good for that though, for sure |
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| 18:08.05 | ilya0044566 | after the installation, brlcad 7.10 has not offered mr graphical mode in ubuntu 8.04, and i have problems with some libraries for X as Xlib.h. What librarie(s) shall I use? |
| 18:09.47 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 18:10.47 | ilya0044566 | in linux [ubuntu] - what libraries for X Window system shall I use? do i need something 'huge' as OpenGL? |
| 18:12.28 | ilya0044566 | People leave the room, than they enter the room. It's kind of-a life, it is kind of-a "this's the way life is, yeah..." |
| 18:23.14 | d_rossberg | ilya0044566: you should use the head version from the subversion repository for Ubuntu 8.04 |
| 18:25.00 | mafm | I go now, bye |
| 18:25.06 | ilya0044566 | head version of which librarie - I have non-cheap internet traffic - this is a problem... |
| 18:26.12 | d_rossberg | and for the xlib you need some X development package (xserver-xorg-dev?) |
| 18:28.17 | ilya0044566 | so, after the installation into new system it has offered me only [nu] at the startup... Is it something well-known, or I just 2 greedy 2 install libraries? I'lltry xorg-dev and others... |
| 18:30.11 | d_rossberg | ~brlsvn |
| 18:30.40 | pacman87 | ~svncad |
| 18:30.47 | pacman87 | ~cadsvn |
| 18:30.47 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 18:30.49 | ilya0044566 | ~brlsvn - what is it? |
| 18:30.51 | ibot | ilya0044566: okay |
| 18:31.39 | ilya0044566 | "okay" - what is it? |
| 18:31.56 | d_rossberg | ilya0044566: ~cadsvn shown the url uf brl-cad's subversion repository |
| 18:32.23 | ilya0044566 | okay |
| 18:32.28 | d_rossberg | use your subversion client wih this url to check out the latest version of brlcad |
| 18:33.03 | d_rossberg | (~brlsvn was mistyped) |
| 18:34.04 | ilya0044566 | ok, but i'm 2 greedy 2 spend 20 mb of traffic, i'm www.ansysED.narod.ru and i'm new 2 open source... |
| 18:36.21 | d_rossberg | that's probable a problem, brl-cad version 7.12.4 (and probable the versions before) has a problem with Ubuntu 8.04 |
| 18:37.12 | d_rossberg | however, you could try to get the X window working |
| 18:37.27 | ilya0044566 | yes, and ubuntu, probably, might have a lot more libraries at the "plain" installation... |
| 18:38.19 | d_rossberg | by instaling did you install the xserver-xorg-dev package of Ubuntu? |
| 18:39.57 | d_rossberg | or the xorg-dev package? |
| 18:40.08 | ilya0044566 | ther were no any options... it's a cd image... only onr cd, but kubuntu's dvd I had was 'empty' too - I compare it with versions of ASPLinux on 4 cd's... |
| 18:41.13 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: the other thing for checking sketches is the order of the spline curves |
| 18:42.10 | ilya0044566 | i don't really know... "essentials libraries for X window system" - this make a sence... I just can't spend traffic for a while... but i surely will have a brlcad installed! |
| 18:42.25 | d_rossberg | ilya0044566: do you update or upgrade your system via internet? |
| 18:43.13 | ilya0044566 | no, 1mb equals 0.1 US $ |
| 18:44.01 | d_rossberg | ilya0044566: you probaly have to install the development packeges via internet (because they are not essential for using the other software) |
| 18:44.19 | ilya0044566 | ok, ...corporations still 'milking' good guys :( |
| 18:45.27 | ilya0044566 | ok. i need 2 quit now... My frien says his program Pro-Engeneer can point the dimensions to the model, and to prepare views... Without autocad, i want to mix BRLCAD with QCAD... Am I right, or there are another ways? |
| 18:46.42 | ilya0044566 | 'other ways' - to be correct... |
| 18:47.58 | d_rossberg | pacman87: sure, they have to have a low degree (2 or so), will it be done in the prep function? |
| 18:48.11 | ilya0044566 | ok, i quit for about 1.5 days |
| 18:48.27 | *** part/#brlcad ilya0044566 (n=q@217.118.79.36) | |
| 18:48.47 | pacman87 | i was thinking about adding a function to sketch.c |
| 18:48.58 | pacman87 | and calling it from rt_revolve_prep() |
| 18:49.07 | pacman87 | since the sweep will need that check too |
| 18:50.25 | d_rossberg | will sweep work with the same degree of spline (i.e. sketch) curves as the revolve? |
| 18:51.09 | pacman87 | yes, that's the plan |
| 18:51.16 | d_rossberg | ... maybe yes if we think of a sweep as a series of revolves (?) |
| 18:53.26 | pacman87 | essentially, yes |
| 18:53.51 | pacman87 | for revolve, i'm mappign the ray into 2d, then finding intersections |
| 18:55.08 | d_rossberg | pacman87: therefore you plan to implement a function which checks the maximum degree of a sketch in sketch.c and call it from revolve.c and sweep.c, that sounds good for me |
| 18:55.49 | pacman87 | what should i name it? |
| 18:56.11 | d_rossberg | as for the closed loop: you can require a closed loop or close it with a default method |
| 18:57.25 | d_rossberg | are there any similar functions to guess the name? |
| 18:57.26 | pacman87 | if it's not closed, the only thing that makes sense is if the two endpoints are on the y-axis |
| 18:58.27 | pacman87 | there's an rt_check_curve() |
| 18:59.11 | d_rossberg | for example, closing the sketch automatically would make the primitive more robust |
| 18:59.27 | pacman87 | ideally, i'd return the degree of the sketch, so if someone else needs it, it's there |
| 18:59.50 | d_rossberg | rt_check_sketch_degree() |
| 18:59.51 | pacman87 | close by line segment from end to start? |
| 19:02.57 | d_rossberg | closing the sketch: from the y-axis to the first point by a straight line, from the last point of one segment to the first point of the next segment by a straight line, from the last point to the y-axis by a straight line (for all: if it is not already closed) |
| 19:04.38 | d_rossberg | the result of automatic closing may be not what the user want but he sees what he did |
| 19:05.15 | d_rossberg | this is better than seeing nothing but the error message |
| 19:05.16 | pacman87 | yeah, depends on how 'smart' i make the algorithm |
| 19:05.31 | pacman87 | since there could be several disjointed segments |
| 19:06.04 | pacman87 | or unconnected sets of segments |
| 19:06.54 | d_rossberg | yes, the sketch can be very ugly, even if it is closed |
| 19:07.11 | pacman87 | self intersecting |
| 19:07.27 | d_rossberg | exactly |
| 19:07.37 | pacman87 | which i don't think will be a problem, other than looking ugly |
| 19:08.35 | d_rossberg | it could be intended to get holes in the solid |
| 19:09.11 | pacman87 | if you have two seperate, independantly closed loops |
| 19:10.14 | pacman87 | the other way to handle open loops is to duplicate all the segments |
| 19:10.18 | pacman87 | forming a shell |
| 19:10.27 | pacman87 | since the hitpoints would be duplicated |
| 19:10.38 | pacman87 | (i ran into this problem with an ill-formed sketch earlier) |
| 19:11.56 | d_rossberg | yes, a double line in the sketch means nothing (no hit) |
| 19:12.29 | pacman87 | i though it was a hit with a zero-length hit segment |
| 19:12.48 | pacman87 | ie, identical in and out points |
| 19:13.47 | d_rossberg | double lines are a common trick to conect two regions in one border line |
| 19:14.33 | d_rossberg | they should be trated as "not there" |
| 19:15.06 | pacman87 | hmmm |
| 19:16.19 | pacman87 | is trying to think of the best way to detect this |
| 19:16.33 | d_rossberg | with double lines you may cut holes in plates if you have to deskribe the plate by one closed borderline |
| 19:17.45 | pacman87 | i'm not seeing it |
| 19:18.37 | pacman87 | say you have three points: (0,0); (0,2); and (1,1) |
| 19:18.51 | pacman87 | and the sketch just has line segments |
| 19:18.54 | pacman87 | so it's a triangle |
| 19:19.04 | d_rossberg | e.g. a wall with a window in it |
| 19:19.51 | d_rossberg | how would you describe this with a single closed border? |
| 19:20.16 | pacman87 | oh, so the sketch outline traces along the middle of the wall, around the window, and back to the edge of teh wall on the same path |
| 19:20.25 | pacman87 | and the overlapping segments cancel |
| 19:20.35 | pacman87 | leaving a window in a wall |
| 19:20.52 | d_rossberg | yep |
| 19:21.22 | pacman87 | where does the 'single' part of the 'single closed border' requirement come from? |
| 19:22.26 | d_rossberg | the structure is much simpler than having a list of closed non overlapping borders |
| 19:24.08 | d_rossberg | a surface has a border and a border is a list of points |
| 19:24.28 | d_rossberg | this is much simpler than "list of list of points" |
| 19:25.23 | d_rossberg | if you need the second you have to compute it from the first one |
| 19:27.21 | pacman87 | i though the sketch primitive could handle multiple closed loops |
| 19:28.30 | pacman87 | and if those loops overlap, then that'd be the same as a self-intersecting closed loop |
| 19:29.46 | d_rossberg | the sketch primitive has no problem with it |
| 19:30.30 | d_rossberg | but you have to decide if two intersection points are identical or not |
| 19:32.22 | pacman87 | so i'd have to check for zero length segments, and for zero distance between the end/start of adjacent segments |
| 19:35.13 | d_rossberg | i would say yes |
| 19:39.44 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-95-134.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:30.17 | brlcad | ~brlsvn is <reply>try ~cadsvn instead |
| 20:30.18 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 20:33.07 | brlcad | pacman87: feel free to refactor code needed by multiple primitives into files in src/librt/primitives ;) |
| 20:33.27 | brlcad | nice working pic too :) |
| 20:40.30 | brlcad | pacman87: also adding to the previous discussion, being a solid shotline ray-tracer, no primitives should return zero-thickness ray segments as hits -- they shoule have a non-zero thickness or it's a miss |
| 20:54.37 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@117.196.130.46) | |
| 20:56.05 | pacman87 | so do a NEAR_ZERO( dist1-dist2, SMALL_FASTF)? |
| 21:31.20 | brlcad | that'd be one way |
| 21:32.10 | brlcad | isolates which of his memory chips is bad after about a dozen reboots and tests |
| 21:32.26 | pacman87 | mmmm, memory chips :) |
| 21:38.39 | brlcad | excessively obscure file corruption errors .. that took a while to pin down |
| 21:40.14 | pacman87 | brlcad: what's your opinion on how to handle non-closed sketches? |
| 21:44.21 | brlcad | pacman87: if they're implicitly 'closed' wrt the rotation axis, I think it should behave accordingly -- e.g. points/edges 0,0 -> 1,1 -> 0,1 would be 'implicitly' closed even though there is no 0,1 -> 0,0 closure |
| 21:45.02 | brlcad | where accordingly means that it'd revolve and ray-trace successfully (as an upside-down cone in that example) |
| 21:45.36 | brlcad | if someone defined 0,0 -> 0,1 -> 1,1 though .. hm, dunno |
| 21:46.52 | brlcad | you could close it automatically by implicitly forming an edge to the 0,y value or throw an error (not so useful but not unreasonable) |
| 21:47.46 | brlcad | i suppose you could also auto-close to the original point if they don't form a closed loop (e.g. to 0,0 in that second example instead of to 0,y) .. but that'd be .. wierd |
| 21:48.55 | pacman87 | most 'auto-closing' ends up rather complicated; ie for multiple open sections |
| 21:51.00 | brlcad | determining what it means might get complicated, but the closure itself could be fairly simple |
| 21:52.25 | brlcad | something like "if a segment/curve endpoint has no connected endpoints, connect it to a line segment that goes from the unconnected x,y point to the corresponding 0,y point |
| 21:53.41 | brlcad | you would probably want to throw an error if you close it for the user since I'd still probably consider that an "invalid" ill-defined revolve sketch, but it'd probably be closer to what was expected |
| 21:54.43 | brlcad | so if someone models a simple open 0,0 -> 1,1 straight segment as the curve, it'd make the cone |
| 21:55.11 | brlcad | 1,0 -> 1,1 would make a cylinder, etc |
| 21:55.26 | pacman87 | ok, will do |
| 21:56.45 | brlcad | as if they'd modeled those as 0,0 -> 1,1 -> 0,1 -> 0,0 for the cone and 1,0 -> 1,1 -> 0,1 -> 0,0 -> 1,0 respectively for the cylinder |
| 21:57.51 | brlcad | probably need to test each edge/curve against the y-axis as a bisector, so you can insert the corresponding points/edges |
| 21:58.55 | pacman87 | so we're still ignoring everything on the (-) side of y? |
| 22:00.31 | pacman87 | one other question: should i modify the actual sketch (add the extra points/segments) or leave it alone? |
| 22:00.48 | pacman87 | modifying the sketch would be easier for me |
| 22:00.51 | brlcad | hm? not really ignoring it |
| 22:02.14 | brlcad | 0,0 -> -1,0 -> 1,1 -> 0,1 would be perfectly valid I would think (two cones that touch tip to tip) |
| 22:02.35 | pacman87 | that's the -x side |
| 22:02.41 | pacman87 | i was referring to the -y side |
| 22:02.45 | brlcad | ah ah |
| 22:03.23 | brlcad | how's -y any different? |
| 22:03.35 | pacman87 | wait, i just confused myself |
| 22:03.41 | brlcad | translate all the values down and it works just fine |
| 22:04.05 | pacman87 | invalid | valid |
| 22:04.08 | pacman87 | axis ^ |
| 22:04.32 | brlcad | in fact, to make your processing simple, you may want to do exactly that -- translate all values into positive xy 'normalized' coordinates |
| 22:05.41 | brlcad | you'd have to translate the ray by the same amount, but it should remove sign problems when evaluating |
| 22:06.11 | pacman87 | let me ask as an open question: what should happen when a circle centered at 0,0 is revolved through 90 degrees? |
| 22:07.29 | brlcad | two quarter-sphere wedges |
| 22:08.08 | pacman87 | ok, that gets a bit more difficult |
| 22:10.03 | brlcad | hm, I take it back about translating to positive first-quadrant coordinates .. that might cause more problems than it solves |
| 22:10.34 | pacman87 | yeah, it's working perfectly when everything has a positive x coord |
| 22:10.57 | pacman87 | s/perfectly/perfectly for straight lines ;) |
| 22:11.57 | brlcad | what about automatically trimming the curves like I suggested -- bisect all curves against the x and y axis so you can evaluate all curves for each of the four quadrants consistently? |
| 22:12.45 | brlcad | since if you got it working for +x, should be a few flips of sign to get the other quadrants |
| 22:12.48 | pacman87 | the y coordinate doesn't working |
| 22:12.55 | pacman87 | doesn't matter* |
| 22:13.25 | brlcad | so only bisect with the x-axis |
| 22:13.37 | brlcad | er, y-axis |
| 22:14.12 | pacman87 | what should result from a triangle at -1,0 1,0 1,2? |
| 22:14.21 | brlcad | then all your x coordinate signs are flipped and only solid for angles 90->270 |
| 22:15.40 | pacman87 | i could pick up the hits with -x coords by using both sides of my projected hyperbola |
| 22:15.44 | brlcad | I'd think a cylinder, no different than 0,0 -> 1,0 -> 1,2 -> 1,0 |
| 22:16.28 | brlcad | testing hits, you'd get solids on both the left and right, but the segments would overlap so you'd combine them (and get the cynlinder since the +x side encompasses) |
| 22:16.54 | pacman87 | so i'd have to keep the hit lists seperate |
| 22:17.43 | brlcad | yeah, you wouldn't have your answer until you evaluate both sides |
| 22:18.14 | pacman87 | which doesnt' really have any computational advantages over just using two revolves |
| 22:18.18 | brlcad | pretty simple book-keeping though, some of the other primitives have to do that |
| 22:18.35 | pacman87 | which primitives? |
| 22:19.10 | brlcad | yeah, don't think there are any computational advantages other than they overlap as *one* primitive so you would only ever get one segment back |
| 22:19.44 | brlcad | whereas if I actually made two revolve primitives, that would be an overlap -- I'd have to union them at a sub-region level |
| 22:21.17 | pacman87 | is that really a problem? |
| 22:22.53 | brlcad | not really -- they are able to do that regardless |
| 22:23.25 | brlcad | the question is more what should a single primitive do -- your -1,0 1,0 1,2 should work I think |
| 22:24.03 | pacman87 | it would do the same by ignoring the -x hits (only for full revolve, though) |
| 22:24.25 | brlcad | in that case it would |
| 22:24.39 | pacman87 | if it was flipped, it'd be different |
| 22:24.44 | brlcad | for other cases, it wouldn't (like your sphere rotated by 90) |
| 22:25.13 | brlcad | s/sphere/circle/ |
| 22:25.46 | brlcad | or even -1,-1 -> 1,1 (two cones) |
| 22:27.17 | pacman87 | yeah, partial revolves are a major difference |
| 22:30.02 | brlcad | if you a) break up prep()/shot() into a left/right case for +-x and b) close all open edges to the y-axis .. should give you a consistent means to test intersection |
| 22:31.24 | brlcad | kicks CIA-22 |
| 22:31.25 | CIA-22 | ow |
| 22:32.15 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
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| 00:13.48 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.27.163) | |
| 00:13.59 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 00:15.21 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 00:16.39 | brlcad | andrecastelo: how's your tracer coming along? |
| 00:21.24 | andrecastelo | Not upt to my expectations. I've written about it at the blog. Some functions are pretty similar to RT, probably need to be tweaked to support MLT better; rayhit is also akin to color_view(). Also, I'm not able to dedicate as I wanted to, due to school and laboratory responsibilities. |
| 00:21.53 | brlcad | yeah, I read your update, several comments and responses if you're interested |
| 00:22.28 | andrecastelo | those are really welcome |
| 00:23.07 | brlcad | hope you don't fall too far behind, there's a fair bit to go and afaikt you don't have it generating (any) images yet.. :) |
| 00:24.03 | brlcad | well the answer to a lot of your questions was "don't worry about that yet" .. your first step really needs to be a simple flat-shaded bitmap image |
| 00:24.19 | brlcad | if you hit it, color the pixel on or color it the color of what you hit, etc |
| 00:24.37 | brlcad | before you get to the more complex summations needed for mlt |
| 00:24.50 | brlcad | you need that before you can sample hemispheres regardless |
| 00:25.21 | brlcad | and even getting that far will be a heck of a lot of motivation since you get to finally see something |
| 00:28.09 | andrecastelo | thanks, I will do my best to keep up |
| 00:28.15 | andrecastelo | did you comment on the blog itself? |
| 00:28.26 | brlcad | after you get that far, then we can start thinking about how to deal with reflections/refractions, forward path discovery, reverse path discovery, metropolis sampling, path jitter, depth of field, etc |
| 00:29.05 | andrecastelo | so, the idea is to build a simple tracer first? |
| 00:29.23 | brlcad | more specific to the code, even for bitmapping, you'll either color in ray-hit, or store the hit during rayhit and write to the image probably during viewend |
| 00:29.37 | brlcad | yes, a *very* simple tracer, bitmap on/off even |
| 00:30.11 | brlcad | no secondary rays |
| 00:30.19 | andrecastelo | hmm |
| 00:30.27 | andrecastelo | i really didn't think about that |
| 00:30.45 | brlcad | if you don't have that much working, the rest is moot :) |
| 00:31.20 | brlcad | it's certainly not wasted code, you need it regardless .. |
| 00:42.09 | andrecastelo | thanks for the help, brlcad :D really appreciate it |
| 01:08.35 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:13.19 | brlcad | howdy |
| 01:47.50 | brlcad | fyi, there's a support request in to sf.net to fix CIA |
| 01:47.52 | brlcad | the problem seems to be on their end |
| 01:47.56 | brlcad | it was instantly marked high-priority so hopefully it should get resolved soon |
| 02:22.47 | yukonbob | updates his copy of the svn repo... |
| 02:57.29 | *** join/#brlcad Miesco (n=shawn@bas2-toronto12-1167860846.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 02:57.41 | Miesco | Hi, how do I center an object |
| 02:57.47 | Miesco | I lost it |
| 03:01.29 | Miesco | I found it, I just did: center 0 0 0 |
| 03:10.52 | Miesco | Hey how come in the MGED text is so big, like File, Edit, its way bigger then any other apps |
| 03:14.42 | andrecastelo | brlcad: so, i think my view_pixel is broken :S |
| 03:36.44 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 03:37.37 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 03:55.53 | brlcad | Miesco: the 'center' command centers the view |
| 03:56.08 | brlcad | doesn't change the object you're looking at, just the view |
| 03:56.57 | brlcad | default text is so big because that was a common size requested by users -- it's configurable, though -- you can make it whatever size suits you |
| 04:15.57 | brlcad | andrecastelo: might help to step back and relook at something more simple like rtarea -- you should be able to follow what is going on there but instead of tabulating the hits and printing a summary, you fill in a pixel array and write the buffer out to a file |
| 04:17.06 | brlcad | you should have the same basic callbacks going on in your code, except for a binary array it's even more simple than rtarea -- you only need first hit and only hit/miss |
| 04:59.16 | yukonbob | lots of autocad chatter on #tcl, so I pointed the nerds to http://www.brlcad.org... |
| 05:03.04 | brlcad | :) |
| 05:03.25 | brlcad | tell them the modeler is a huge tcl/tk code base? |
| 05:03.52 | brlcad | some portions predate 8.0 days.. might scare some ;) |
| 05:10.12 | yukonbob | of course mentioned the Tcl... |
| 05:10.13 | yukonbob | ;) |
| 05:10.33 | yukonbob | Tcl is was brought _me_ to BRL-CAD ;) |
| 05:10.54 | brlcad | :) |
| 05:11.17 | yukonbob | now I stay because BRL-CAD is 1) awesome 2) Has a great community (and awesome leader (Sean)) 3) Still has Tcl ;) |
| 05:12.03 | yukonbob | heh "stay" -- I haven't touched anything for months :P |
| 05:14.05 | brlcad | 1) yes it is! 2) heh (pffft) 3) and probably always will in some central capacity even if the interface itself becomes less intertwined |
| 05:15.02 | brlcad | pfft to myself, not the community .. the community is great ;) |
| 05:16.08 | yukonbob | :) -- well, like the attention or not, I think you do a wicked job here... but enough of that. How're things going? |
| 05:17.45 | brlcad | going a'ight |
| 05:18.16 | brlcad | working on some finishing touches for a geometry service visualization plan at the moment |
| 05:19.07 | brlcad | central to the new modeler architecture among other things |
| 05:19.20 | yukonbob | gsv -- a central geom server? |
| 05:19.34 | yukonbob | is only guessing, by the name... |
| 05:19.56 | brlcad | sort of, only part of it (a small part of what you could conceivably do with it) |
| 05:20.10 | yukonbob | interrogation ,etc. ,etc? |
| 05:22.13 | brlcad | sort of turning libbu, libbn, libwdb, librt, and mged into a unified API, allowing versioned object management on top of that as part of a new geometry kernel, and then providing means for storing/retrieving geometry, visual representations, and change notifications |
| 05:23.32 | yukonbob | ever considered sqlite for version management? |
| 05:23.40 | brlcad | part of a grand master plan to modernize our services for application codes to use |
| 05:23.44 | yukonbob | has had this on his head for a while... |
| 05:23.53 | brlcad | yep, it's on the docket for some things already |
| 05:24.06 | yukonbob | nods... |
| 05:24.17 | brlcad | though for actual geometry management, the plan is presently a different (hybrid) approach |
| 05:24.54 | brlcad | using sql for metadata directory services, using more traditional revision control for geometry itself |
| 05:25.30 | brlcad | I'll see if I can post up this plan when I'm done, might help see things better (there are pretty pictures) |
| 05:25.37 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 05:26.02 | yukonbob | when you say more traditional revision control, are you thinking a lightweight svn? |
| 05:26.09 | yukonbob | (for example) |
| 05:26.39 | brlcad | well I'm referring at a programmatic level, but yeah sorta |
| 05:27.07 | brlcad | at a c/c++ coding level, managing revision controlled geometry |
| 05:27.09 | yukonbob | brlcad: are you familiar w/ another drh project, fossil (http://www.fossil-scm.org)? |
| 05:27.25 | brlcad | yep, you mentioned them a week or two ago :) |
| 05:27.47 | yukonbob | Oops -- I one of _those_ people :P |
| 05:27.48 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:28.05 | yukonbob | UNfortunately, it's currently licensed gpl... |
| 05:28.25 | yukonbob | but his (drh) coding style is very cool... built for integration... |
| 05:29.00 | brlcad | gpl is a non-starter, but there are other requirements too |
| 05:29.35 | yukonbob | lgpl is the "worst" for consideration, no? |
| 05:29.51 | yukonbob | ie: BSD is better... or other such permissive license? |
| 05:30.08 | brlcad | e.g. something like mercurial would be interesting, but there's no low-level bindings; git has low-level api facilities but is a mess and isn't really cross-platform at all, etc |
| 05:30.22 | yukonbob | ugh -- git |
| 05:30.23 | brlcad | lgpl or bsd/mit are fine |
| 05:30.38 | yukonbob | 8000 binaries to do your job |
| 05:31.03 | brlcad | again, that's the high-level .. which we're not involved with :) |
| 05:31.56 | yukonbob | ya, true... but still. /me quit working with git when he discovered mercurial, then quit w/ mercurial when discovered fossil... |
| 05:32.19 | brlcad | looking at the reliability/portability/momentum landscape, the svn C libraries are actually pretty darn solid (just presently sans distributed capabilities, which we don't exactly want/need at this point) |
| 05:33.15 | brlcad | and since we're at a compile-time layer, we could add those capabilities ourselves if that requirement happens (though not likely) |
| 05:34.13 | brlcad | that's all just gravy-talk, the main effort is much more direct -- unify our services (which requires a *massive* rewrite at three separate levels) |
| 05:34.54 | brlcad | hence all the work lately on libged, upcoming C++ OO layer, and a network service layer |
| 05:35.12 | brlcad | that's more than enough to keep us busy for a year or three |
| 05:36.01 | yukonbob | kewl, kewl, kewl |
| 05:40.53 | yukonbob | hits hay -- tomorrow's another day (or so I'm told) -- chat later, brlcad |
| 05:41.13 | brlcad | cya! |
| 05:41.24 | brlcad | suspects this might be an all-nighter |
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| 08:37.09 | brlcad | suspected correctly |
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| 10:02.08 | mafm | hi |
| 10:47.30 | brlcad | howdy! |
| 10:47.52 | brlcad | gets dressed |
| 10:49.19 | mafm | won't look at brlcad |
| 12:02.23 | brlcad | heh |
| 12:03.10 | alex_joni | mafm: smart move |
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| 12:26.43 | mafm | I'm all for not looking at naked guys |
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| 13:33.13 | brlcad | mafm: more eye candy if you're not seen this already: http://slinky.imukuppi.org/zenburnpage/ (or the former http://slinky.imukuppi.org/zenburn/ ) |
| 13:34.10 | brlcad | would be very cool to be able to use either vim files or one of the other "ports and derivatives" directly as a theming format for the gui's text |
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| 13:53.19 | HTT-Bird | hey all, just installed BRL-CAD from the Windows binary yesterday to leverage its file-format conversion capabilities, but I only got the IGES and STL importers/exporters + the fast4 importer |
| 13:53.32 | HTT-Bird | what do I have to do to get the other importers and exporters? |
| 13:53.46 | brlcad | HTT-Bird: the Windows port isn't as comprehensive as (all) other platforms |
| 13:54.04 | HTT-Bird | :( will I have to build the rest of the exporters from source? |
| 13:54.41 | brlcad | you have to either compile them directly yourself (setting up a studio project for some of them), try compiling under cygwin, use a non-Windows OS, or .. "wait" |
| 13:55.01 | HTT-Bird | okiedokie, thank goodness I know how to compile stuff :D |
| 13:55.09 | brlcad | which compile were you looking to use? |
| 13:55.15 | brlcad | s/compile/converter/ |
| 13:55.39 | HTT-Bird | the VRML exporter |
| 13:58.01 | HTT-Bird | oh lol, turns out that the version linked to off the mainpage is OLD! |
| 13:58.01 | HTT-Bird | (7.8.0 as opposed to 7.12.x) |
| 14:01.18 | HTT-Bird | also, can the IGES importer read STEP too? the documentation alludes to STEP being an IGES refinement... |
| 14:07.49 | HTT-Bird | alright, upgrading to 7.12.2 got me my importers and exporters |
| 14:08.50 | brlcad | ah, heh |
| 14:09.00 | brlcad | no IGES cannot read STEP |
| 14:09.05 | brlcad | entirely different standards |
| 14:09.55 | HTT-Bird | ah... |
| 14:10.22 | HTT-Bird | crosses his fingers and hopes that the IGES importer works then |
| 14:11.22 | HTT-Bird | gah, I guess not |
| 14:12.14 | brlcad | STEP replaces IGES from an industry standardization perspective, but isn't a refinement |
| 14:12.25 | HTT-Bird | ok...ty for clearing that up |
| 14:12.39 | brlcad | the iges importer is rather .. "complex" .. there are various import modes possible |
| 14:12.53 | brlcad | you have to pick the right modes and even then it will only pay attention to solid geometry |
| 14:13.14 | HTT-Bird | well, I'm trying to import an assembly of 3 solid parts so I can send it right back out the door as VRML |
| 14:13.36 | brlcad | and you only have it in iges format? |
| 14:14.21 | brlcad | converting from iges to brl-cad's nmg or bot formats is your best bet for getting to vrml |
| 14:14.57 | HTT-Bird | I have the original source of the model (as AIP2k8) |
| 14:14.57 | brlcad | just if you have spline nurbs surface solids in your iges file, that's the one case that might give you problems |
| 14:14.57 | HTT-Bird | ah... |
| 14:14.57 | HTT-Bird | tries a re-export |
| 14:15.04 | brlcad | "might", depends on a lot of factors |
| 14:15.13 | brlcad | iges export has tons of options usually |
| 14:15.33 | brlcad | there are like three that should work perfectly, and about one or two dozen that will fail |
| 14:16.24 | HTT-Bird | tried exporting Analytic instead of NURBS surfaces, and no dice :( |
| 14:17.53 | HTT-Bird | ok, Surface export seems to work using the importer's -n flag |
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| 14:22.08 | HTT-Bird | well...almost there :( I can't seem to get Mged to draw the object in the file |
| 14:28.55 | mafm | brlcad: what do you mean, having a code translating theme.vim to RBGui.theme? |
| 14:30.21 | mafm | also, the text has format highlighting, which the RBGui's text widgets have no support for |
| 14:31.51 | brlcad | it's the format highlighting that make it useful ;) |
| 14:32.17 | brlcad | HTT-Bird: what does "tops" say in mged? 'e' that name |
| 14:32.28 | HTT-Bird | brlcad: already tried that :( |
| 14:32.34 | brlcad | what'd it say? |
| 14:32.43 | HTT-Bird | 'all' |
| 14:32.58 | HTT-Bird | but nothing happens in the console and no objects show up when I do 'e all' |
| 14:33.09 | brlcad | "l all" |
| 14:33.41 | HTT-Bird | yeah, there's an object there, alright |
| 14:35.10 | brlcad | perhaps the graphics display simply isn't updating? try moving the graphics window after e all |
| 14:35.58 | mafm | do you want me to implement syntax highlighting for text widgets? |
| 14:36.11 | HTT-Bird | brlcad: no, still just a black graphics window with the axes in it |
| 14:38.15 | brlcad | mafm: nah, layout and interaction is more important than styling for now |
| 14:38.37 | brlcad | HTT-Bird: if you run "rt", do you just get a black window? |
| 14:39.07 | HTT-Bird | rt doesn't even get that far! |
| 14:39.17 | HTT-Bird | rt_dirbuild(all) failure! |
| 14:39.29 | HTT-Bird | ok, that was my bad |
| 14:39.45 | mafm | I don't know if more windows than the console would be heavily based in text |
| 14:40.00 | HTT-Bird | well, rt gives me an object, just the wrong object |
| 14:40.14 | brlcad | HTT-Bird: what color is it? black? |
| 14:40.36 | HTT-Bird | brlcad: the object's there and nice and gray, it just is badly distorted from the original |
| 14:43.01 | poolio | waves |
| 14:45.04 | HTT-Bird | lol, I just triggered a rather spectacular crash in iges-g |
| 14:47.31 | clock_ | `iseg-f |
| 14:48.33 | brlcad | HTT-Bird: badly distorted as in polygonal soup, too low tessellation? |
| 14:48.40 | brlcad | that should be export settings controllable |
| 14:48.40 | HTT-Bird | brlcad: the tesselation is fine |
| 14:48.52 | brlcad | pic? |
| 14:49.06 | HTT-Bird | it's just that the object itself is distorted (a hemispherical shell became a sphere, for instance) |
| 14:50.51 | HTT-Bird | well, I guess I'll go to a totally different solution |
| 14:51.33 | HTT-Bird | oh wait...some signs of life from the graphics window! |
| 14:52.29 | HTT-Bird | yeah, it's IGES object soup that's my problem |
| 14:52.41 | HTT-Bird | so...now I know why IGES is bad. |
| 14:53.05 | HTT-Bird | thx for the help brlcad |
| 14:53.54 | brlcad | np |
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| 15:33.56 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31752 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: cia test |
| 15:36.05 | mafm | go CIA go! |
| 15:36.13 | pacman87 | woohoo! |
| 15:36.42 | mafm | Let CIA spy shamelessly on us and report to the rest |
| 15:37.05 | mafm | One Oprah Show In Every Channel :P |
| 15:38.29 | brlcad | laments that we couldn't actually find the problem |
| 15:39.13 | brlcad | burley blames cia isp, but all indications still seem to point to an sf problem |
| 15:39.31 | brlcad | it's working because we switched it over from using xmlrpc to using e-mails |
| 15:41.36 | mafm | good old technology :) |
| 15:56.39 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31753 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/Makefile: Attempt to make the building of src/other to stop on the first failure, as suggested by Dawn Thomas |
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| 16:50.20 | mafm | re |
| 16:50.53 | mafm | too bad... I wasn't here to post the "frist commtit" comment :( |
| 17:16.38 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31754 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Adding command to set different polygon modes for the renderer (wireframe, solid, points), and another one to create and show simple geometries (only the command in place, still missing the geometry itself) |
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| 20:04.09 | brlcad | mafm: hehe |
| 20:04.12 | brlcad | commit early, commit often |
| 20:04.34 | brlcad | I could certainly break cia again .. :) |
| 20:13.00 | mafm | I can't commit more today |
| 20:13.08 | mafm | geometries refuse to work |
| 20:13.20 | pacman87 | they |
| 20:13.26 | pacman87 | they're going on strike? |
| 20:14.44 | mafm | they're complaining because of the gas price or something |
| 20:14.55 | mafm | need a lot of power to run... |
| 20:15.22 | mafm | well, I have to get going, I'm already late :) |
| 20:15.33 | mafm | hopefully I'll got it working by tomorrow! |
| 20:15.34 | pacman87 | bye, and good luck |
| 20:15.36 | mafm | see you |
| 20:15.43 | mafm | same for you :) |
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| 01:31.49 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 03:51.55 | poolio | brlcad: for planar faces of an NMG, is there a way to somehow get an area that encloses the face? I've got a bounding box and a surface normal...can I intersect those to find what I want? (I'm trying to create a rectangular surface that I know is large enough to fit the face, then cut it out using the trimming loops) |
| 04:30.36 | brlcad | poolio: hm |
| 04:30.47 | brlcad | I don't think you have enough information with that approach |
| 04:31.28 | brlcad | not sure why you'd want to make them all rectangular with trimming loops to make the actual surface though |
| 04:32.14 | brlcad | why not make it match it identically and make the trims simply match the edges (i.e. trim nothing like in twisted cube example) |
| 04:36.43 | poolio | Well, the main issue is I'm not sure how to create a surface that way :) |
| 04:38.11 | poolio | Do you just define more control values and it works? I think the issue might be I'm still shaky on the U-V mapping |
| 04:39.13 | brlcad | less src/other/openNURBS/example_brep/example_brep.cpp |
| 04:39.22 | poolio | Heh, I've read through that many times :) |
| 04:40.06 | brlcad | mm, there's a simpler one then too |
| 04:47.33 | brlcad | there it is, example_write/example_write.cpp |
| 04:47.56 | brlcad | that one actually helped me initially understand how uv trimmings worked |
| 04:48.33 | brlcad | that example writes out about a dozen different objects |
| 04:48.43 | brlcad | there are two or three that should be interesting to you |
| 04:48.57 | brlcad | write_trimmed_surface_example() in particular |
| 04:49.28 | brlcad | they create a simple single triangle |
| 04:50.05 | brlcad | with real xyz values so you can see how that would correspond to a given nmg face |
| 04:51.07 | poolio | ah cool, thanks. I'm off to bed but I'll read through it first thing tomorrow |
| 04:51.14 | poolio | was hoping to finish NMG schtuff by the end of thursday |
| 04:51.46 | brlcad | awesome |
| 04:55.39 | brlcad | what I don't know is whether an ON_Mesh would be sufficient since none of the nmgs we have actually need trimmings, write_mesh_example() is much simpler |
| 04:56.46 | brlcad | whether the ON_Mesh it creates will validate as IsSolid() is the question .. I suspect it won't |
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| 10:14.34 | brlcad | mafm: saw your note, but I'll reply via e-mail ;) |
| 10:14.35 | mafm | hi |
| 10:14.49 | brlcad | g'morning |
| 10:14.59 | mafm | are you going to make comments? grrr :P |
| 10:15.11 | mafm | that was a rhetoric artifact... |
| 10:19.59 | brlcad | for what it's worth, you have nothing to worry about for the midterm eval |
| 10:20.59 | mafm | heh, that's good :) |
| 10:21.45 | mafm | I only intended to make an auto-evaluation in advance, specially since I barely interacted with Robert |
| 10:21.52 | brlcad | all four of you have been making steady progress for the most part, good stuff |
| 10:21.59 | brlcad | heh, he goes by "Bob" |
| 10:22.16 | mafm | Silent Bob? :P |
| 10:22.27 | brlcad | think's he'll call him Robert all day today just for fun |
| 10:22.33 | brlcad | yep, bob is pretty silent |
| 10:22.45 | brlcad | he's been working pretty hard on libged |
| 10:22.58 | brlcad | that requires refactoring about 100k lines of code |
| 10:23.07 | brlcad | lots of lots of issues |
| 10:23.08 | mafm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_and_Silent_Bob |
| 10:23.11 | mafm | no offence :D |
| 10:23.44 | brlcad | none taken |
| 10:24.03 | mafm | I mean for him, if he happens to read the logs or something |
| 10:24.36 | brlcad | i've heard of those movies, not one of my favorite directors |
| 10:24.39 | mafm | it's just that the fact of you calling him Bob and the silent thingy, sparked in my mind :D |
| 10:24.58 | mafm | I don't like them either, although most of my friends do |
| 10:25.46 | brlcad | highly doubts bob will know the reference (or read the log, prove me wrong bob ;) |
| 10:25.59 | mafm | so do you work with Bob everyday? are you in ARL buildings? |
| 10:26.14 | brlcad | he's a pretty traditional guy, irc's a bit much for him |
| 10:26.27 | mafm | well, IRC is pretty traditional |
| 10:26.57 | mafm | myspace kiddies don't even know what it means :D |
| 10:26.59 | brlcad | heh, from one perspective I suppose |
| 10:27.56 | mafm | and many ppl (being IM users of gmail, msn etc) gets confused when I tell that I know A or B from IRC |
| 10:28.02 | brlcad | traditional "dev" in the sense he doesn't coordinate/communicate over irc for his dev needs -- he's a face-to-face guy, "maybe" e-mail if you can find an account he's using |
| 10:28.27 | mafm | teh ninja programmer! |
| 10:28.45 | brlcad | hehe |
| 10:29.33 | mafm | if he managed to refactor 100K LoCs mostly in silence, he surely must be... |
| 10:37.29 | brlcad | neat, looks like he just recently passed up john |
| 10:37.38 | brlcad | #3 all-time contributor now |
| 10:38.13 | mafm | where's that? |
| 10:38.33 | brlcad | according to ohloh, he's changed 882k lines of code in brl-cad |
| 10:38.38 | brlcad | ohloh stats site |
| 10:38.52 | brlcad | http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3996/contributors?page=1 |
| 10:39.53 | mafm | oh, them |
| 10:40.16 | mafm | them punks don't have mi contributions |
| 10:40.42 | brlcad | you're on page 3 |
| 10:41.07 | brlcad | moving up through the ranks.. |
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| 10:41.46 | mafm | hum, so it works now? it didn't before |
| 10:41.50 | mafm | hi d_rossberg |
| 10:41.51 | brlcad | interesting that andre commits more frequently than you apparently, even though he's more behind on his progress |
| 10:42.00 | mafm | they had problems with caret in rt^3 |
| 10:42.33 | mafm | I think that I made much more than 25 commits, I have more than 10 some day... |
| 10:42.39 | d_rossberg | hi mafm, brlcad |
| 10:42.39 | brlcad | mafm: er, it's been indexing rt^3 for about a year |
| 10:42.48 | brlcad | howdy d_rossberg |
| 10:42.56 | mafm | well, they confirmed that as a bug |
| 10:43.15 | mafm | and there was only the main brlcad/ in enlistments |
| 10:43.59 | brlcad | huh, wonder if someone removed it |
| 10:44.10 | brlcad | because I'd added it a long while ago |
| 10:44.45 | mafm | probably you did, but it was removed because of problems indexing |
| 10:44.47 | brlcad | where was the chatter about the caret? |
| 10:47.04 | mafm | http://www.ohloh.net/forums/10/topics/1706 |
| 10:48.41 | brlcad | thx |
| 10:49.42 | mafm | $ svn log | egrep "^r.* \| mafm \|" | wc -l |
| 10:49.42 | mafm | 74 |
| 10:50.11 | mafm | $ svn log | egrep "^r.* \| mafm \|" | wc -l |
| 10:50.11 | mafm | 75 |
| 10:50.26 | mafm | (before svn update, that it affects for the logs) |
| 10:51.13 | brlcad | yeah |
| 10:51.38 | mafm | so it seems rt/3, not rt^3 :PPPP |
| 10:51.53 | brlcad | fwiw, ohloh also collapses commits if the log messages are identical within a given time window |
| 10:52.07 | brlcad | but yeah, I'd bet it's missing some commits |
| 10:52.21 | brlcad | with so few, should be able to figure out which and could let robin know |
| 10:52.32 | brlcad | he's pretty good at chasing down those problems |
| 10:53.02 | brlcad | we had a handful of issues to sort out when ohloh first went on-line a couple years ago |
| 10:53.43 | brlcad | they'd never indexed a cvs project with a history as extensive as ours, they had a few bugs in their cvs backend |
| 10:53.46 | mafm | http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3996/commits?commit=Update&page=3&query=mafm |
| 10:53.55 | mafm | it seems that it's only my commits since 30th june |
| 10:54.32 | brlcad | well, you haven't committed 50 times since 30th, so it's still missing something :) |
| 10:55.01 | mafm | hmm? |
| 10:55.18 | mafm | I mean that it's only counting the ones after 30th, which must be the 25 |
| 10:55.27 | mafm | being another ~50 before that |
| 10:55.36 | brlcad | ah |
| 10:56.00 | brlcad | could try readding the enlistment |
| 10:56.45 | brlcad | or even just telling robin that much |
| 10:57.31 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31755 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/BrlcadCore.def: some additional exported functions in BrlcadCore |
| 10:58.00 | brlcad | wonders how long before d_rossberg just ends up exporting everything :) |
| 10:58.47 | mafm | http://www.ohloh.net/topics/1706?page=1#post_6265 |
| 10:59.45 | d_rossberg | :) my initial point was to not export everything |
| 10:59.57 | mafm | wantz to pwn commits |
| 11:00.17 | brlcad | hears "Robert" |
| 11:02.18 | mafm | it would be important for me, but the interviewers don't even know what GSoC is, not what Grid is (they always think of map grids, or UI layouts...) |
| 11:02.36 | mafm | so half the interview goes to explain what I'm really doing |
| 11:02.57 | mafm | so they would clearly won't look at my ohloh stats... :) |
| 11:04.42 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31756 10/brlcad/trunk/ (misc/win32-msvc/CMakeLists.txt src/conv/patch/CMakeLists.txt): added the patch converters to the CMake build |
| 11:12.07 | mafm | lunch time! |
| 12:06.52 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31757 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/ (Makefile.am ax_boost_base.m4): Adding boost checking macro, configure.ac unchanged (WIP) |
| 12:07.23 | brlcad | neat |
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| 13:19.57 | mafm | hi again |
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| 14:00.09 | brlcad | good lunch? |
| 14:01.01 | mafm | pretty good |
| 14:01.53 | mafm | but now I have these network outages... they're switching (pun intended?) the router |
| 14:08.05 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31758 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 3 dirs): Added shift-grip functionality to libtclcad's ged object. |
| 14:32.06 | mafm | brlcad: could you briefly describe how to imagine a session where you would model a simples totem of cubes/balls/whatever, composed by ~3 pieces? |
| 14:34.51 | clock_ | in a rpp 0 1 0 1 0 1 ... |
| 14:34.52 | clock_ | then rt |
| 14:36.31 | clock_ | would have to try it actually out and record everything he types |
| 14:37.07 | clock_ | tries to avoid the Graphical Unusable Interface |
| 14:38.11 | brlcad | mafm: I'd start by thinking of it from a read-only perspective, locking down the synchronization of the gui with the command-line (so they are in-fact one in the same), and getting all of the visualization manipulations working |
| 14:38.20 | brlcad | *then* thinking about creating stuff ;) |
| 14:39.05 | brlcad | that is all going to tie into the geometry service framework that is being developed |
| 14:39.28 | brlcad | that will actually manage the actual commands possible (like 'in' and others you find in mged) |
| 14:40.05 | clock_ | can't get it to stay on the display more than split second |
| 14:40.23 | clock_ | mafm: do you also want to see what you've created? Then I am of no help, I can't do that even myself :) |
| 14:42.46 | mafm | clock_: it's for my new project, not mged |
| 14:42.48 | brlcad | otherwise, how I'd forsee that happening is similar to the IOE example where you'd have a content panel on the left or right that would have your primitives, you'd drag them into the view to create them in a stack or use an on-demand command to create them with the keyboard |
| 14:44.31 | mafm | with locking down sync you mean to only update the GUI (and OGRE?) on keystrokes, instead of the usual renderloop of 3D apps? That would make sense for an app like this without animations, I guess |
| 14:45.19 | brlcad | mafm: if you're to the point where you want to start seeing geometry, you should probably hook in libged -- it's already good to go for wireframe and polygonal display |
| 14:46.17 | mafm | the wireframe stuff is already sorted out -- it's just to switch a flag in the renderwindow or camera, already created a command for that |
| 14:46.46 | mafm | and I'm starting to create a geometry, tried with a tetraedron, but no luck showing it |
| 14:48.29 | mafm | so basically, the app would inquiry libged about available primitives, commands |
| 14:48.54 | mafm | then create a panel with the primitives and zone as "sheet" |
| 14:49.18 | mafm | and then allow to apply commands on the objects in the sheet, or via keyboard |
| 15:04.26 | brlcad | mafm: it's not fully sorted out ;) .. I saw the commits |
| 15:08.23 | brlcad | there's various complications given we're dealing with unevaluated CSG |
| 15:08.55 | brlcad | toggling from wire to poly to shaded only works if you already have an evaluated boundary representation (e.g. polygonal) |
| 15:09.07 | brlcad | which we don't always have |
| 15:09.35 | brlcad | so *all* you might have would be a wireframe representation represented as a raw display list of points and segments |
| 15:10.01 | brlcad | needs to be able to manage that in addition to polygonal forms that can be more easily toggled |
| 15:11.57 | brlcad | but yeah, you have it spot on for the rest! |
| 15:12.23 | brlcad | query what's available and display/respond accordingly |
| 15:12.57 | mafm | Oh, I see |
| 15:13.16 | mafm | I'm not sure if opengl can work with non-triangles really |
| 15:13.21 | mafm | or rather, OGRE |
| 15:16.08 | brlcad | it can, it all boils down to display lists in the scene |
| 15:16.34 | brlcad | and even if it couldn't, you could fake it if you absolutely had to |
| 15:20.24 | mafm | yep, I suppose |
| 15:20.31 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31759 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (Makefile.am mrot.c rot.c slew.c vrot.c zoom.c): Added more view related commands. |
| 15:20.34 | mafm | but a.t.m I can't even show the tetraedron :D |
| 15:26.59 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-72-245-122-226.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 15:32.40 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 15:32.57 | pacman87 | my computer doesnt like me anymore |
| 15:35.43 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31760 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/pc.h src/libpc/pc_main.c src/libpc/pc_test.c): removal of outdated functions:pc_write_parameters, pc_generate_parameters etc. |
| 15:36.06 | brlcad | quick scan, looks like http://www.ogre3d.org/docs/api/html/classOgre_1_1SceneManager.html#Ogre_1_1SceneManagera114 has what you'd need probably |
| 15:37.12 | brlcad | calling Ogre::SceneManager::manualRender() or Ogre::SceneManager::renderObjects() or Ogre::SceneManager::renderSingleObject() |
| 15:37.30 | brlcad | and passing the right container that would just represent a wireframe |
| 15:37.46 | brlcad | otherwise you could turn the wires into pipes and spheres |
| 15:41.19 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31761 10/brlcad/trunk/ (33 files in 33 dirs): pc_param_set deprecated, replacing with pc_pc_set (WIP) |
| 15:42.30 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 15:48.40 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31762 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Increase av size to account for the optionial argument. |
| 15:50.19 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31763 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): #include cleanup . boost specific includes already in pcNetwork.h not repeated |
| 15:51.30 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31764 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declaration for ged_vrot. |
| 16:01.53 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31765 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/tra.c: Added more view related commands. |
| 16:13.54 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31766 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declarations for ged_mrot and ged_rot. |
| 16:23.24 | mafm | mm, I guess that the conversion is more feasible |
| 16:24.42 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31767 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added files to windows build. |
| 16:31.22 | *** join/#brlcad cad09 (n=51d053f9@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:38.59 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31768 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/boost/ (53 files in 22 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 16:39.02 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: boost::spirit import and other boost updates. Spirit is an object-oriented |
| 16:39.04 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: recursive-descent parser generator framework implemented using template |
| 16:39.06 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: meta-programming techniques. Expression templates allow us to approximate the |
| 16:39.10 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: syntax of Extended Backus-Normal Form (EBNF) completely in C++. Spirit would be |
| 16:39.12 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: particularly helpful in writing the parser for generating constraints from |
| 16:39.17 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: expressions for libpc with its object oriented methodology and particularly |
| 17:11.19 | brlcad | yay for finding spirit++ |
| 17:11.31 | brlcad | was going to suggest that to him |
| 17:11.43 | brlcad | that or good ol' lex/yacc |
| 17:14.25 | prasad_ | good ol' lex yacc |
| 17:14.41 | prasad_ | ply has the best implementation of it |
| 17:14.56 | prasad_ | or should i say most intuitive |
| 17:15.08 | prasad_ | representation |
| 17:21.39 | mafm | w00t |
| 17:21.55 | mafm | I can se my tetraedron \o/ |
| 17:22.11 | pacman87 | congrats |
| 17:23.06 | mafm | first step for creating pr0n programatically :P |
| 17:51.03 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 17:51.28 | mafm | brr |
| 17:51.30 | mafm | damn router |
| 18:02.58 | mafm | well, nuff for today, no commits |
| 18:04.58 | mafm | see you! |
| 18:05.04 | pacman87 | farewell |
| 18:05.21 | mafm | same |
| 18:05.26 | mafm | keep up the good work :) |
| 18:17.31 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.13.241.80) | |
| 18:17.58 | poolio | brlcad: for the trimmed circle they aren't specifying the iso (the direction that it trims). When I tried to add in another point and make it trim for a square it's telling me I need to define it...is there a reason for that? (why you don't need to specy for a triangle but do for shapes with more points) |
| 18:18.29 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 18:23.32 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've reworked some stuff, commented a lot of code, set the same color for both hits and misses.. and now it draws two vertical lines |
| 18:44.36 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.199.43) | |
| 18:49.44 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 19:00.37 | andrecastelo | are you there ``Erik ? |
| 19:13.42 | andrecastelo | pokes CIA-60 |
| 19:13.52 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31769 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Commented some parts of code and simplified view_pixel. It shows the silhouette of the image now. |
| 19:14.03 | andrecastelo | thanks CIA-60 |
| 19:31.36 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 19:40.06 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.200.162) | |
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| 19:48.43 | pacman87 | wishes there was an option for 'focus follows eyes' instead of 'focus follows mouse' |
| 19:50.39 | poolio | pacman87: that's what tiled WMs are for :) |
| 19:52.31 | pacman87 | i have two code windows side by side, both with tabs. one is for reference, the other one i code in, and too many times i start typing in my 'reference' side instead of the 'code' side |
| 19:53.39 | alex_joni | pacman87: I think there was some experimental "follows eyes" thingie |
| 19:56.08 | pacman87 | alex_joni: i'd still have problems because all my code is in the same window (kdevelop) |
| 20:09.05 | brlcad | poolio: hm, that's interesting about the trimming loop .. dunno other than there may be special code in there for handling triangles where it simply defaults to clockwise or CC orientation |
| 20:09.27 | brlcad | yet in the more generalized case, there is no such default for that class |
| 20:09.42 | brlcad | just a guess, would have to dig through the code |
| 20:14.45 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hey, brlcad, it works now! |
| 20:14.56 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 20:15.39 | poolio | brlcad: It looks like special triangle code...it also fails when the edge is along an edge of the surface... |
| 20:16.06 | poolio | I found some code in Dump() that looks like it calculates the proper trimming direction somehow so I'm using that |
| 20:17.51 | poolio | This is what I've been stuck on (both in the nmg_brep() code and modifying the write_trimmed to write a rectangle): Distance from end of ON_Brep.m_T[2] to 3d edge is 1. (edge tol = 0, trim tol ~ 0). |
| 21:03.20 | poolio | wow. I just spent around 2 hours trying to get the rectangle trim to work and the issue was that I had a 2 instead of a 3. rawr. |
| 21:04.49 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-164-28.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 21:34.53 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31770 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 2 dirs): doxygen edit: division of libpc into modules |
| 21:37.51 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31771 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am pcParser.h solver_test.cpp): Skeleton Structure for libpc Parser: pcexpression_grammar, Parser class and functor interface defined |
| 21:46.28 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31772 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Fixed bug in get_new_name() that caused an infinite loop when using the dbconcat command with NO_AFFIX. |
| 21:55.39 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31773 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: |
| 21:55.41 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: View_pixel() now receives the color from ap->color; Commented the creation and |
| 21:55.43 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: insertion of point_lists and path_lists. It is always creating the path list, |
| 21:55.45 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: but it isn't accessible in view_end(), thus creating memory leaks. |
| 22:17.01 | brlcad | andrecastelo: cool! |
| 22:17.06 | brlcad | ... what works? :) |
| 22:17.31 | andrecastelo | brlcad: not much, but it shows the silhouette |
| 22:17.33 | andrecastelo | http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/1521/silhouettezu3.jpg |
| 22:17.49 | brlcad | woo hoo! |
| 22:18.15 | andrecastelo | i was having problems freeing the loads of structures that i added |
| 22:18.22 | andrecastelo | i mean, i still am |
| 22:18.55 | andrecastelo | i've added the structs allocation and insertion in the rayhit function |
| 22:19.42 | pacman87 | brlcad: allowing the sketch to be on both sides of the revolve axis complicates things immensely |
| 22:19.53 | brlcad | poolio: if distance from trim coordinate to an end coordinate can mean that you have a uv-3d coordinate mismatch |
| 22:20.23 | andrecastelo | it goes like this - a point_t is in struct point_list, that is inside a struct path_list, which is inside the struct mlt_app |
| 22:20.51 | brlcad | andrecastelo: sounds reasonable |
| 22:21.43 | andrecastelo | yep, but i allocate memory for the path list inside rayhit, if it doesn't exist already.. but despite the checks, it always allocates memory for it |
| 22:21.50 | andrecastelo | there was this huge memory leak |
| 22:26.25 | brlcad | sounds like you need to initialize it to zero/null |
| 22:27.16 | brlcad | andrecastelo: the next step is to probably get flat shading working |
| 22:30.09 | brlcad | for that, you look at each hit, get the surface normal and compare deviation from your light source(s) |
| 22:30.19 | brlcad | use that to color the intensity |
| 22:31.31 | brlcad | pretty trivial step, but that'll give you some shape definition |
| 22:33.19 | brlcad | then maybe add in some basic logic for optional distance falloff just to give you some testable definition |
| 22:34.07 | brlcad | then add shadows so you have to account for secondary rays |
| 22:34.25 | brlcad | at that point you should be just about ready to jump to forward path tracing |
| 22:43.48 | andrecastelo | hm, ok, ok |
| 22:44.06 | andrecastelo | is the shadework system needed? |
| 22:44.32 | andrecastelo | (i mean, struct shadework and viewshade() function) |
| 22:48.33 | starseeker | Grr... where are the irc logs again? |
| 22:48.45 | pacman87 | starseeker: in the topic |
| 22:48.56 | pacman87 | http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ |
| 22:49.09 | starseeker | Ah, right - thanks |
| 22:49.38 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there any way we can provide a searchable interface to the IRC logs? |
| 22:53.04 | brlcad | andrecastelo: for you to figure out ;) |
| 22:53.22 | andrecastelo | hm ok ;} |
| 22:53.37 | pacman87 | starseeker: i wrote a script to download the logs, so i can search locally |
| 22:53.44 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, i've got a placeholder for the logs in my "site map" (on paper) |
| 22:53.54 | brlcad | would love to pretty-print/colorize them |
| 22:54.04 | brlcad | riker's logs are crap for many reasons |
| 22:54.35 | starseeker | Actually, the formatting could be worse - but gzipping them by default and no searchable interface... |
| 22:54.38 | starseeker | arrgh |
| 22:55.14 | starseeker | The best irc log system I've ever seen is ircbrowse.com for #lisp, but it's SLLLOOOOWWWW these days (to the point of un-usability) and it's search has been busted for years now :-( |
| 22:55.15 | brlcad | I could allow that irc logging group that made /. headlines last year in here, they've been asking if we want to be indexed |
| 22:55.28 | brlcad | they provide automatic logging, very nice interface .. mildly intrusive |
| 22:55.38 | starseeker | what group is that? |
| 22:55.52 | brlcad | mm.. i'll have to hunt |
| 22:56.25 | brlcad | they made headlines because they were quitely logging thousands of channels for months before going live without anyone's permission |
| 22:56.33 | starseeker | ouch |
| 22:56.52 | brlcad | they responded to the outcry and removed everyone and made it opt-in instead of opt-out after than happened though |
| 22:57.27 | archivist | irseekbot |
| 22:58.32 | brlcad | yeah, that's them |
| 22:58.48 | archivist | we have one in #mysql atm |
| 22:59.11 | archivist | they dont seem to stay up properly |
| 23:00.22 | starseeker | tries to figure out the irseek search |
| 23:00.35 | brlcad | example: http://www.irseek.com/result.php?keywords=%22BRL-CAD%22 |
| 23:01.01 | starseeker | what if I only want to search within one channel |
| 23:02.42 | brlcad | don't think it has that option directly, maybe add #channel but I suspect that just adds 'channel' as a keyword |
| 23:02.54 | starseeker | yep |
| 23:02.56 | starseeker | meh |
| 23:03.16 | brlcad | ah, I see what you're wanting to do |
| 23:03.42 | starseeker | the ircbrowse search used to allow me to search #lisp for keywords, and specify how many minutes of conversation around the keyword hit to display |
| 23:04.01 | starseeker | has yet to find any system to match it |
| 23:04.33 | brlcad | nods |
| 23:04.54 | starseeker | must be one SOMEWHERE though - if I can find it, would it be an option for us? |
| 23:05.24 | brlcad | mm.. i bet there's a drupal module somewhere.. |
| 23:05.28 | archivist | easy enough to add to a database type logger |
| 23:05.50 | archivist | I should add one to the #mysql bot |
| 23:08.29 | brlcad | hm, looks like there's a bot and cgi:irc as a drupal module, but no irc log pretty-printer |
| 23:08.43 | brlcad | could mod the bot I suppose |
| 23:12.04 | starseeker | This is interesting, although I don't know how mature it is: www.irc-collective.org |
| 23:14.14 | brlcad | woo.. the bot does log |
| 23:14.15 | brlcad | http://drupal.org/project/bot |
| 23:15.44 | brlcad | horrible theme, but an example: http://www.disobey.com/bot/log/drupal-themes |
| 23:16.08 | starseeker | Are the logs searchable? |
| 23:17.29 | brlcad | to store content as a drupal module, it 'should' be searchable like all of the site content |
| 23:17.43 | brlcad | would have to install it and test |
| 23:20.45 | starseeker | really a shame that the irc collective project is inactive |
| 23:21.43 | starseeker | can't help thinking how awesome it would be to have a link to display all the images linked to in the last X hours (obvious problems with nasty links though...) |
| 23:22.27 | starseeker | unbelievable - I don't see ANY apps that mention the type of searching ircbrowse had. I must be looking in the wrong place |
| 23:41.55 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 23:54.59 | poolio | woot! an NMG cube works :D |
| 23:55.28 | poolio | One line of code changed and voila. I recall thinking about t his bug while coding but I guess I never fixed / documented it. |
| 00:02.29 | pacman87 | sketch: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf05.png |
| 00:02.29 | pacman87 | wireframe: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf04.png |
| 00:02.42 | pacman87 | raytrace: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt10.png |
| 00:05.02 | louipc | swept around Z? |
| 00:05.21 | pacman87 | yes |
| 00:05.48 | pacman87 | the sketch is revolved about its y-axis, which i told revolve to line up with the 3d Z-axis |
| 00:06.22 | louipc | cool |
| 00:06.53 | pacman87 | showing the 'auto-close' for open sketches |
| 00:07.16 | louipc | yeah I was wondering heheh |
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| 00:42.54 | brlcad | poolio: yahoo! .. pics?! :) |
| 00:46.23 | brlcad | pacman87: interesting closure on the base -- does it stay open if the base of those two segments line up perfectly? do they line up now? |
| 00:47.41 | brlcad | if they do line up, that's the one case I might have expected it to stop at the inner segment |
| 00:50.56 | poolio | brlcad: err...it looks exactly the same as brep_cube/breplicator/etc... |
| 00:52.03 | poolio | I'm working on generalizing to not just 4-sided things now. Is there a way to define surfaces shaped like say, triangles? I know there is...I'm just not quite sure how :) The approach I was going to do was creating a rectangle that encloses the area and cutting out of that. |
| 00:52.06 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 00:53.19 | brlcad | that example file I pointed you at made a triangle.. |
| 00:54.36 | poolio | Yes, but it did so by creating a rectangular suface and trimming a triangle |
| 00:55.04 | brlcad | pacman87: oh, I see what you did now .. never mind :) |
| 00:55.16 | brlcad | the rt is "upside down" from what I thought I was looking at |
| 00:58.11 | pacman87 | brlcad: yeah, they stop because on the inside, it's a zero length hit segment, so i ignore it |
| 01:04.49 | brlcad | oh.. heh, I was thinking that if you draw lines from the endpoints to the y axis, the wider base ends up connecting the two edges on the outside leaving the base open yet the narrow top has a clear path the the y axis for both segment endpoints so you end up with a thick top |
| 01:09.24 | brlcad | from a 'top' view, render rt -k 0,0,1,0 .. what does that look like? |
| 01:10.01 | pacman87 | lookign down along Z? |
| 01:11.31 | pacman87 | two circles |
| 01:11.39 | pacman87 | bright white center, grey outside that |
| 01:12.08 | pacman87 | *two concentric circles |
| 01:15.20 | brlcad | erm |
| 01:15.35 | brlcad | you said https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf05.png is rotating around the +Y axis? |
| 01:15.54 | pacman87 | that is the sketch |
| 01:16.00 | brlcad | cutting +z should cut it in half (a "C") |
| 01:16.22 | pacman87 | it rotates about the sketch's y axis |
| 01:16.32 | pacman87 | the 3d axis is 0,0,1 |
| 01:16.38 | brlcad | ahhh |
| 01:16.53 | brlcad | so left view with 0,1,0,0 |
| 01:21.56 | pacman87 | rt -F/dev/X -C 128/192/255 |
| 01:24.03 | pacman87 | oops |
| 01:24.09 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt11.png |
| 01:43.40 | brlcad | cool! |
| 01:43.47 | brlcad | wierd black line... |
| 01:44.03 | brlcad | if that's straight-on, it's probably a bug |
| 01:44.42 | brlcad | normal going the wrong way on grazing or something |
| 02:16.09 | pacman87 | no, it's a little above |
| 02:16.19 | pacman87 | straight-on is buggy |
| 02:16.39 | pacman87 | so is looking along the revolve axis |
| 02:16.54 | pacman87 | those i'll have to handle as special cases |
| 02:26.05 | pacman87 | s/above/below |
| 02:30.21 | brlcad | cool |
| 02:30.49 | pacman87 | is there a way to choose 'X' from commandline after -c? |
| 02:47.12 | poolio | brlcad: hmm...so code works with rectangular faces...triangles make it blow up for some reason :\ |
| 03:14.07 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 03:15.27 | brlcad | pacman87: ' |
| 03:15.33 | brlcad | 'X' ? |
| 03:15.48 | brlcad | poolio: ahh :) |
| 03:16.05 | pacman87 | attach (nu|X|ogl)[nu]? |
| 03:17.34 | brlcad | ooh, *mged* -c .. was thinking rt -c :) |
| 03:22.05 | brlcad | yes, either answer X at the attach prompt or run "attach X" afterwards |
| 03:23.00 | pacman87 | i was hoping for a one-line way to start mged so i could skip the prompt |
| 03:23.22 | pacman87 | /usr/brlcad/bin/mged -c ~/brlcad/test/open.g |
| 03:23.50 | brlcad | ahh, interesting |
| 03:23.51 | pacman87 | if it's possible to have -c take an argument |
| 03:24.00 | brlcad | don't think anyone has ever asked that :) |
| 03:24.02 | pacman87 | /usr/brlcad/bin/mged -c X ~/brlcad/test/open.g |
| 03:24.16 | pacman87 | well, i restart mged every time i compile |
| 03:24.34 | brlcad | no, at least not optionally and still be able to tell the diff with a filename arg that optionally follows |
| 03:25.08 | pacman87 | what about just -X instead of -c |
| 03:25.29 | brlcad | i do too, but mged -c file.g[enter][enter] does the trick for me ;) |
| 03:26.08 | pacman87 | it defaults to nu, right/ |
| 03:26.09 | poolio | brlcad: So I failed a bit on some basic geometry stuff. I'm trying to enclose a face in a rectangular surface. I want to compute 2 points on the plane that will be the lower left/upper right of the rectangle. Is there an easy way of doing this? |
| 03:26.09 | pacman87 | ? |
| 03:26.48 | brlcad | -x and -X are taken, they are debug options for almost every one of brl-cad's apps |
| 03:26.58 | pacman87 | -cX? |
| 03:27.07 | brlcad | librt and libbu respectively |
| 03:27.58 | brlcad | -cX is no different than -c -X |
| 03:28.08 | pacman87 | --cX? |
| 03:28.15 | brlcad | (think tar -xvf == tar -x -v -f |
| 03:28.23 | pacman87 | yeah, i forgot about that |
| 03:29.45 | brlcad | could maybe add "-a display_manager", e.g. -a X |
| 03:30.02 | brlcad | or take over the deprecated -n |
| 03:30.38 | pacman87 | would that imply -c? |
| 03:30.58 | pacman87 | ie, would specifying the display manager make sense for non-classic mode? |
| 03:37.21 | starseeker | brlcad: Random mostly off topic question - what's the leading finite element library with a license compatible with BRL-CAD? |
| 03:42.40 | brlcad | right now -c == -n and both are optionless |
| 03:43.37 | brlcad | but yeah, a -a would imply -c |
| 03:44.23 | brlcad | starseeker: why our own libfem of course! |
| 03:44.49 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:44.52 | brlcad | depends, you wanting meshing, analysis, or both? |
| 03:45.05 | brlcad | open soure fea/fem sucks |
| 03:45.49 | starseeker | was thinking anything we don't have that we would need to do in-BRL-CAD analysis... |
| 03:46.12 | starseeker | notes that the first hit on google for libfem is the mailing list for Liberty and Feminism |
| 03:46.55 | brlcad | gmesh is probably one of the better fem tools, i've heard of impact for fea but not looked into it |
| 03:47.26 | brlcad | they're about as far away from high-end commercial fea codes as we are from full-blown catia |
| 03:48.34 | starseeker | ow |
| 03:48.57 | brlcad | pacman87: not pertinent to what you're needing, but if you didn't know -- you can add a command after the .g file and mged will run it |
| 03:49.02 | starseeker | Is openFEM worth anything? |
| 03:49.03 | brlcad | and then quit.. |
| 03:49.25 | brlcad | could add a mod to make certain commands keep mged running |
| 03:49.39 | brlcad | ones (like attach) that make no sense as single-action commands |
| 03:49.47 | brlcad | so this would work: mged -c brlcad/db/moss.g attach X |
| 03:50.37 | pacman87 | can you do multiple commands? |
| 03:51.49 | brlcad | mged -c brlcad/db/moss.g "attach X ; puts hello" |
| 03:52.41 | brlcad | alternatively, it'll take stdin too so you can batch commands together |
| 03:53.03 | brlcad | e.g. mged -c blah.g <<EOF |
| 03:53.04 | brlcad | tops |
| 03:53.06 | brlcad | whatever |
| 03:53.08 | brlcad | EOF |
| 03:53.43 | brlcad | or put that in some mged_script and "mged -c blah.g source mged_script" instead |
| 03:54.03 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, they're pretty good |
| 03:54.16 | brlcad | not so much a tool but set of routines |
| 03:54.31 | starseeker | Ah |
| 03:55.30 | starseeker | guesses this sounds like a situation where maybe we will end up creating a libfem :-) |
| 03:55.34 | brlcad | inria's pretty intense in their research |
| 03:55.50 | brlcad | they're a research powerhouse |
| 03:55.55 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:57.48 | starseeker | groans as he updates his gentoo profile and starts one more round of re-compiles... |
| 03:58.46 | starseeker | 'course, Mike is already working on some FEM stuff, IIRC... |
| 04:01.14 | brlcad | inria is the source of gems like OCaml and SmartEiffel |
| 04:01.29 | brlcad | oh, and you probably know of coq and scilab |
| 04:01.31 | starseeker | Ah, yes - Scilab too, IIRC |
| 04:01.35 | starseeker | heh - yep |
| 04:01.53 | starseeker | coq is amazingggggggggg |
| 04:02.20 | brlcad | yeah, mike hooked an importer into sandia's cubit |
| 04:02.42 | brlcad | cubit is pretty snazzy, they have one of the *best* mesher libs |
| 04:03.19 | brlcad | and one of the best low-budget fem tools (alas not fully open source nor free) |
| 04:03.27 | brlcad | though their geometry lib is lgplg |
| 04:03.50 | brlcad | there mesh lib is the bread n' butter, though, and they're not letting go |
| 04:04.08 | starseeker | hmm - is there any chance at all they can be made to see reason? |
| 04:04.35 | brlcad | only if someone(tm) hooked brl-cad into their backend as the geometry format and geometry engine |
| 04:05.02 | brlcad | they have to charge "something" for cubit as they use the ACIS engine |
| 04:05.12 | starseeker | oh |
| 04:05.18 | brlcad | licensing issues |
| 04:05.21 | starseeker | googles ACIS |
| 04:06.56 | starseeker | hmm. Would they be supportive of a port or fight the idea? |
| 04:07.11 | brlcad | hook all of our converters, librt, libged, libwdb, libbu, and libbn together into one clean unified object-oriented API, and we overlap about 75%-90% of what ACIS does, they're the big dog of CAD kernels |
| 04:08.04 | starseeker | ouch |
| 04:08.04 | brlcad | oh everyone would be supportive, sandia said they'd love it (if it worked as well/better) |
| 04:08.22 | brlcad | just a lot of work for somewhat minimal payoff and no manpower to dedicate |
| 04:08.39 | brlcad | really begs for BREP support being fully in place first as well as our OO geometry engine |
| 04:08.54 | brlcad | (next year's priority) |
| 04:09.00 | starseeker | Ah |
| 04:09.57 | starseeker | looks for his API scrubbing gear... |
| 04:11.32 | starseeker | So it makes the most sense to do BREP and the OO engine (needed anyway) and then use the new functionality + cleanup to get cubit off of the ACIS gravy train |
| 04:11.44 | starseeker | and thus take advantage of some really good code |
| 04:12.19 | brlcad | we would increase (developer) interest in BRL-CAD by more than an order of magnitude if we had an ACIS-compatible geometry kernel API |
| 04:12.44 | starseeker | Does ACIS publish the specs for their API? |
| 04:12.53 | brlcad | e.g. something that'd convert an acis call into our geometry engine, like wine |
| 04:13.10 | starseeker | nods |
| 04:13.44 | brlcad | don't think so, you'd have to (legally try to) reverse engineer it |
| 04:13.53 | starseeker | ow ow ow |
| 04:14.30 | brlcad | just guessing, I haven't searched too hard given our other priorities |
| 04:14.38 | starseeker | right |
| 04:16.02 | brlcad | really need BREP/NURBS representation working, CSG eval of NURBS working, tessellation of NURBS, LIBGED completed, and our object-oriented geometry engine working before working on that becomes a tractable semi-even-thinkable/practical task |
| 04:16.23 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.73.81) | |
| 04:16.28 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo_ |
| 04:16.36 | brlcad | ~andrecastelo_++ |
| 04:17.10 | brlcad | excitedly anticipates a flat-shaded image |
| 04:17.30 | louipc | ö |
| 04:19.17 | yukonbob | like 'toon-shading? |
| 04:19.37 | starseeker | Hmm - http://doc.spatial.com/r18/index.php/InterOp:Connect/ACIS |
| 04:20.04 | brlcad | yukonbob: no, that'd be cell-shading |
| 04:20.21 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shading |
| 04:20.32 | yukonbob | s/cell/cel/ |
| 04:20.49 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:21.05 | brlcad | more like the two distance falloff images on the wikipedia page |
| 04:21.28 | brlcad | (more specifically the left first, then next get the right working) |
| 04:22.07 | starseeker | Looks like at least some of ACIS has public docs, although they have some "coming soon" links to what is probably the core ACIS docs |
| 04:23.50 | brlcad | starseeker: this makes me think it's entirely closed even if you do find bits n pieces: http://www.caddigest.com/subjects/adsk_inventor/select/grabowksi_shapemanager.htm |
| 04:24.24 | brlcad | otherwise one of the other 4 billion dollar per year cad giants would have done it already |
| 04:25.27 | starseeker | hmm |
| 04:26.38 | starseeker | Depends on what he means by "expose the API" - that sounds as if they have a full version of the ACIS sources and plan to keep working based on those |
| 04:26.54 | starseeker | unless I'm reading the article wrong |
| 04:28.08 | brlcad | but that they're forced to shimmy a layer between their kernel and the acis api (so they cannot possibly be a drop-in replacement) |
| 04:29.07 | starseeker | Right, but I'm reading that as hiding the ACIS API because their license to the source doesn't let them just take it and expose it - they'd be exposing ACIS's api using ACIS's own source code behind it |
| 04:29.23 | starseeker | So they're keeping the ACIS source, but using a different API |
| 04:29.30 | starseeker | easier than a new kernel, I'd guess |
| 04:31.48 | starseeker | is hoping there is a difference between "exposing" and "implementing from scratch" the API |
| 04:33.27 | starseeker | kinda unclear though |
| 04:35.05 | starseeker | Yeah, thought so - Autodesk proposed to continue based on the ACIS code: http://www.caddigest.com/subjects/adsk_inventor/select/grabowski_buzzkross.htm |
| 04:37.06 | brlcad | yeah, i know the article was referring to multiple things |
| 04:37.35 | brlcad | regardless of them 'extending' acis or not -- the fact that they had to make their own api layer |
| 04:37.45 | starseeker | yep |
| 04:37.46 | brlcad | api == headers == some source |
| 04:38.35 | brlcad | there are acis headers for cubit, but have to specifically ask for them (and hey have clauses in them saying no redistribution) |
| 04:38.42 | brlcad | no authorized, that is |
| 04:38.53 | brlcad | er, unauthorized |
| 04:39.37 | brlcad | or even better -- just do what acis does but do it even better |
| 04:39.53 | starseeker | Right |
| 04:40.25 | brlcad | hence libged and new geometry service which begs a middle oo geometry engine |
| 04:41.16 | brlcad | yay for it finally being prioritied (started that particular crusade as a student when I started, that brl-cad needed an OO api) |
| 04:41.50 | starseeker | :-) |
| 04:42.17 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: any luck on figuring out why the contact page won't prompt a captcha? :-) |
| 04:42.51 | brlcad | new spammer started two weeks ago, I've gone from about 2-5 a day to 20-50 a day |
| 04:43.29 | starseeker | knows FEM analysis is long term at best, but had a random interest pop up |
| 04:43.36 | starseeker | probably needs sleep... |
| 04:46.57 | louipc | that captcha was tough. It took me three tries to get it right |
| 04:48.22 | brlcad | woot, mafm's up to the second contributor's page now that rt^3 ohloh stats are fixed |
| 04:48.46 | brlcad | puts him in the gsoccer lead |
| 04:49.16 | starseeker | now if only I could build it... |
| 04:49.17 | brlcad | starseeker: you're a mere 50 away from front-page ;) |
| 04:50.19 | starseeker | 50? |
| 04:50.25 | brlcad | commits |
| 04:50.29 | starseeker | heh |
| 04:50.31 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 04:50.32 | brlcad | http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3996/contributors |
| 04:50.50 | brlcad | louipc: which one? |
| 04:51.06 | brlcad | (there are three) |
| 04:51.15 | louipc | oh when I registered for the wiki |
| 04:51.31 | brlcad | ah, that should have been recaptcha |
| 04:51.38 | brlcad | it's good stuff |
| 04:52.02 | brlcad | that's what I *want* on the contacts page, but can't figure out how to enable it |
| 04:52.24 | starseeker | blegh - primary language XML |
| 04:52.33 | starseeker | hangs head in shame |
| 04:52.46 | brlcad | hehe |
| 04:53.11 | starseeker | will write his spring tool just for the hell of it... |
| 04:53.33 | brlcad | spring? |
| 04:53.43 | brlcad | ooh |
| 04:53.51 | brlcad | right |
| 04:54.07 | starseeker | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_(device) |
| 04:54.16 | starseeker | no one will care, but it will be fun |
| 04:54.21 | brlcad | could try to implement a helical sweep |
| 04:55.49 | starseeker | heh :-) |
| 04:57.27 | starseeker | that might be a good way to do advanced shapes like springs with elliptical wires |
| 04:59.17 | starseeker | or the spring in the lower right corner here: http://www.spring-makers-resource.net/images/compressionspringgroup.gif |
| 05:01.25 | starseeker | inserting pipes with libwdb looks to be fairly complicated all by itself |
| 05:04.16 | pacman87 | starseeker: would you be modelling the spring behavior, or jsut the position? |
| 05:04.43 | louipc | yes do the helical sweep please |
| 05:05.29 | starseeker | pcman87: Initially just the position |
| 05:05.44 | starseeker | pacman87: Behavior modeling would probably require FEM |
| 05:06.05 | starseeker | or one heck of a mathematical model |
| 05:06.16 | louipc | behaviour depends on the type of material too |
| 05:06.23 | pacman87 | i was thinking more in terms of F = -kx |
| 05:06.25 | starseeker | exactly |
| 05:06.51 | starseeker | pacman87: What would you do with F=-kx? |
| 05:07.01 | pacman87 | um... |
| 05:07.31 | starseeker | animate it? |
| 05:07.44 | pacman87 | pass it off to libphy created in next year's gsoc? |
| 05:08.01 | starseeker | Well, you could assign a behavioral equation as an attribute |
| 05:09.23 | starseeker | has always had the knack for making the most seemingly simple little problems complex and challenging... sigh |
| 05:10.11 | pacman87 | dealing with the behavior side of it in BRL-CAD is over my head |
| 05:17.50 | brlcad | reminds starseeker of http://www.wingimp.org/tutorial/3d_maze/3dmaze.jpg |
| 05:23.08 | brlcad | starseeker: doc/IDEAS .. could implement a Kaleido primitive or a Kaleido proc-db :) |
| 05:24.13 | brlcad | not that it's any more practical, but pretty cool |
| 05:24.18 | brlcad | http://www.math.technion.ac.il/~rl/kaleido/ |
| 05:35.21 | starseeker | So either hook the kaleido code to a primitive or tie it to a proc-db? Hmm :-) |
| 05:35.29 | brlcad | removes revolve from his ideas.html page given latest progress! |
| 05:36.24 | starseeker | sleeps now... |
| 05:36.49 | brlcad | mm.. pull command |
| 05:39.05 | brlcad | strikes out the docbook tasks too! |
| 05:41.59 | brlcad | for those motivated or bored: http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 05:48.36 | brlcad | figures he should probably nap a bit too |
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| 10:06.46 | mafm | hi |
| 11:30.21 | mafm | CIA-60: register my commit, at once! >:| |
| 11:30.36 | brlcad | it's slower notifications no |
| 11:30.38 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31774 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Adding methods for basic camera manipulation, and to add a sample geometry to the scene |
| 11:30.38 | brlcad | now |
| 11:30.42 | mafm | :) |
| 11:30.47 | mafm | goody |
| 11:30.58 | mafm | time for a cookie for mafm (lunch), bbiab |
| 11:31.12 | brlcad | ~cookies mafm |
| 11:31.15 | ibot | ACTION hands mafm a nice, steaming chocolate chip cookie, hot from the oven |
| 12:06.46 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31775 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: A better fix for the dbconcat infinite loop bug. |
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| 12:19.18 | mafm | cookies, yay \o/ |
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| 12:23.45 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31776 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Commands.h GeometryConversion.cxx GeometryConversion.h): Adding GeometryConversion, and modifying the command so we can create at least sample tetraedrons |
| 13:37.58 | mafm | brlcad: would an orbital camera be enough, or it would be better another/different modes? |
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| 14:01.43 | lleroy | ? |
| 14:02.30 | mafm | ! |
| 14:02.46 | lleroy | help |
| 14:03.47 | lleroy | commands |
| 14:04.53 | lleroy | hi... can anyone help me with a problem in 7.12.4 ? |
| 14:05.09 | lleroy | db_lookup(-n) failed: -n does not exist |
| 14:05.12 | mafm | probably not me, but if you shoot somebody could eventually help |
| 14:05.25 | lleroy | while executing |
| 14:05.27 | lleroy | "_mged_ill -n -i $ri $spath" |
| 14:05.28 | lleroy | (procedure "solid_illum" line 14) |
| 14:05.30 | lleroy | invoked from within |
| 14:05.31 | lleroy | "solid_illum $item" |
| 14:05.33 | lleroy | (procedure "lbdcHack" line 35) |
| 14:05.34 | lleroy | invoked from within |
| 14:05.36 | lleroy | "lbdcHack .emid_0.listbox 43 10 99876703 id_0 s1 junkpath" |
| 14:05.37 | lleroy | (command bound to event) |
| 14:05.47 | lleroy | hmm... I never used irc, so I'm not sure how this works |
| 14:06.10 | mafm | lol, that's why you were writing "help, commands"? :D |
| 14:06.21 | mafm | basically you write, and everybody can see it |
| 14:06.36 | mafm | if you stick for a bit somebody will hopefully tell you something :) |
| 14:06.49 | lleroy | yeah... |
| 14:07.05 | lleroy | how can you see who is around ? |
| 14:07.45 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31777 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/tra.c libged/vutil.c libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Mods to add more shift-grip functionality. Added more bindings to the new_view command. |
| 14:08.13 | lleroy | I posted a question on http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=2105803&forum_id=362510 a week ago, but I got no reply |
| 14:11.37 | clock_ | lleroy: once I posted a bugreport on Samba and they fixed it after a year |
| 14:12.39 | lleroy | i see... I had feedback one issue I reported 4 years ago in mozilla recently:-) |
| 14:13.48 | lleroy | thing is, it seems so basic (like it's the first entry on one of the top level menu's and it's not working in a major release) so I hoped to get feedback somewhat quicker than a year |
| 14:14.01 | clock_ | which one of the hundreds of thousands bugs they have was it? :) |
| 14:14.52 | clock_ | lleroy: what did they say? That the version for which you reported is already discontinued so it's your fault? |
| 14:15.28 | lleroy | nah, iirc they moved it to a future milestone or so :-; |
| 14:15.34 | lleroy | ;-) |
| 14:16.24 | clock_ | with software like this I think the term "trashheap" is more suitable than "milestone". |
| 14:17.42 | mafm | lleroy: depending on the client, you can see a list on some side of the window/tab/whatever showing you who's there |
| 14:17.52 | mafm | otherwise maybe "/whois #brlcad" |
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| 14:31.55 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 14:33.46 | andrecastelo | oh hi mafm |
| 14:34.18 | andrecastelo | my internet is not that stable and chatzilla reconnects after every disconnection |
| 14:34.37 | andrecastelo | so i usually have a few minions of my own in the channel (andrecastelo_ ) |
| 14:35.14 | mafm | I only have one minion, he's called brlcad |
| 14:35.22 | mafm | but he has life of his own :P |
| 14:35.31 | andrecastelo | mafm: hahaha |
| 14:36.46 | mafm | damn artificial intelligence! |
| 14:46.17 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31778 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h Commands.h): |
| 14:46.25 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: More tweaks to the camera. I'm waiting for confirmation from other devels, but |
| 14:46.29 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: I think that the proper thing to do is to create one or several camera modes |
| 14:46.33 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: with better and more complete functionality, encapsulated in a proper way. |
| 14:49.24 | lleroy | andrecastelo: you still there? |
| 14:49.51 | andrecastelo | yes, why? |
| 14:49.54 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31779 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/ (revolve.c revolve.h): revolve prep() and shot(): automatically close open sketches - still bugs with partial revolves |
| 14:50.13 | pacman87 | i had that commit typed in last night, and apparently never hit enter... |
| 14:50.18 | lleroy | I posted a bug on the forum: http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=2105803&forum_id=362510 |
| 14:50.40 | lleroy | and I wonder if this is a "yeah, we know about it" bug or a "that should normally work" bug |
| 14:50.47 | mafm | pacman87: sounds like lazy evaluation... |
| 14:51.01 | lleroy | db_lookup(-n) failed: -n does not exist |
| 14:51.36 | pacman87 | mafm: i got distracted by more coding, and went to bed without looking back at that console tab |
| 14:52.20 | mafm | lleroy: what do you mean with "and I wonder if _this_ is a...", I cannot see any comment to that bug |
| 14:53.01 | lleroy | I mean... does this work in the released version, or is this broken ? |
| 14:53.03 | mafm | pacman87: so you only "evaluated" it just when you needed it commited, I guess ;) |
| 14:53.20 | lleroy | just to know if it's broken due to my compiling it or if it's in the release |
| 14:53.45 | pacman87 | i need a better process scheduler - shouldnt' have to wait all night to get processor time ;) |
| 14:53.56 | mafm | lleroy: well, the three guys that are babling actively in the channel (except for clock_) are newcomers to the project, afaik |
| 14:54.18 | mafm | and I only fired mged a couple of times, so I can't really confirm or deny.. |
| 14:54.46 | mafm | you'll probably have to wait around until some experienced devel appears |
| 14:55.37 | mafm | pacman87: you're thinking about overclocking yourself with coke, or what?! :) |
| 14:55.38 | lleroy | mafm: ok thanks. It worked on 7.10.2 for windows... so I want to know if I did something wrong during compiling on slackware... |
| 14:56.04 | pacman87 | no, i just need to renice 'sleep' to a lower priority |
| 14:56.22 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=madant@117.196.141.49) | |
| 14:56.29 | mafm | lleroy: did you have some special compilation warnings? |
| 14:56.33 | mafm | homovulgaris o/ |
| 14:56.53 | homovulgaris | hi all .. phew.. long time.. |
| 14:57.14 | homovulgaris | mafm: did u see my 200 minute build screenshot :( |
| 14:57.20 | mafm | pacman87: well, Linus sleeps 9+ hours per day, apparently; brlcad about 4 or less... your mileage may vary :D |
| 14:57.29 | lleroy | mafm: it didn't exactly check each warning during compilation, to be honest... |
| 14:58.52 | mafm | lleroy: if you have the source around, maybe you can try to compile with "make -s", so it leaves only prominent warnings and not the whole compiler command line |
| 14:59.02 | homovulgaris | pacman87: seems like revolve is making good progress :) hows the sketch editor wishlist going :) ? |
| 14:59.03 | mafm | so errors and warnings are easier to spot |
| 14:59.21 | mafm | homovulgaris: you mean the mail about g3d? I did, yes |
| 14:59.35 | lleroy | mafm: ok, will try tomorrow. unfortunately i cannot be around on irc when the developers are on |
| 15:00.06 | homovulgaris | mafm: naah not the rt^3 build. brlcad build on my p3 took 197 minutes :P |
| 15:00.15 | mafm | lleroy: also you can try to write to brlcad-devel mailing list, it's probably the best place for things like this |
| 15:00.37 | homovulgaris | http://parametrics.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/screenshot-deos-wrk-brlcad.png |
| 15:00.43 | mafm | homovulgaris: building brlcad on arm, eh? :P |
| 15:01.00 | *** part/#brlcad lleroy (n=chatzill@axsguard.bepco.com) | |
| 15:01.54 | homovulgaris | mafm: i'd experiment with rt^3 when i get my laptop hard disk fixed or when my desktop crosses the flood somehow :P |
| 15:02.45 | mafm | why is it so slow? |
| 15:02.47 | homovulgaris | mafm: I had a few ideas about constraint representation in the new gui.. but that is pretty far away.. I need to finish a minimal system first :P |
| 15:03.38 | mafm | yes, I have quite a few things to do myself... :) |
| 15:05.39 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: for closing an open sketch, right now i just have all open endpoints connecting directly to the y axis, instead of trying to string multiple open segments together. i think this will be more consistant, as all of the added lines can be clearly differentiated from the original sketch. |
| 15:06.07 | homovulgaris | check out Spirit sometime .. EBNF parser generator library.. almost even looks like BNF grammar :) http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_35_0/libs/spirit/doc/introduction.html |
| 15:07.50 | mafm | homovulgaris: why is the compilation so slow? |
| 15:10.33 | homovulgaris | 7 year old computer and processor with 128 MB ram :| |
| 15:11.00 | mafm | seesh |
| 15:11.34 | mafm | might the access to a remote machine help you? |
| 15:12.08 | homovulgaris | :) with brlcad on it ? |
| 15:12.38 | mafm | I don't know if you can perform your work remotely |
| 15:12.54 | mafm | and if the lag would be a problem |
| 15:12.59 | pacman87 | distcc? |
| 15:13.25 | homovulgaris | naah.. i mean it is not that bad.. just the whole system build takes a long time.. as long as i have to do a make clean things are ok i guess |
| 15:13.53 | mafm | but probably someone around (even me if there's nobody else with better chances) can offer you access to a better machine than that one |
| 15:14.16 | homovulgaris | grrr.. I love my first computer :D |
| 15:15.02 | mafm | what's the problem with the floods anyway? |
| 15:15.16 | d_rossberg | pacman87: that's ok, automatically closing the loop will probable produce a result the user doesn't want |
| 15:15.19 | mafm | did you have to move because of them or something? |
| 15:15.39 | homovulgaris | desktop in college stuck with the courier service :D |
| 15:15.39 | d_rossberg | therefore it isn't important how it looks like as long as it is consistant |
| 15:15.54 | pacman87 | ok, that's what i thought; just making sure |
| 15:16.17 | d_rossberg | the result should help the user finding the errors |
| 15:16.37 | homovulgaris | hmm.. k .. me going back to writing grammar and finishing the parser :) |
| 15:16.50 | mafm | I see |
| 15:18.53 | d_rossberg | pacman87: your method can produce intersection in the closed loop you have to handle |
| 15:19.37 | pacman87 | hmm? |
| 15:23.47 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: intersections how? |
| 15:25.27 | homovulgaris | brlcad: when passing information from C to C++ : specifically rt_*_params to pcParser.h objects, one method is to pass them as data structures : the existing unions, pointers and so on ( example pval.vectorp ) . Since I am writing a parser for constraint expressions anyways, should i consider transfering variable/parameter information to pcParser.h via pc_pc_set as parseable text ? |
| 15:27.22 | homovulgaris | brlcad: for example, something like "@Radius#2.3#4.2#2.8" .. which is better precision wise .. conversion and passing as string or passing on a fastf_t/double as such ? and which one whould i use ? |
| 15:28.26 | d_rossberg | pacman87: look at the example i send you by mail, if you connect the end point of the first line with the y-axis this connection line will intersect the second line of the sketch |
| 15:31.28 | pacman87 | then the area to the left of the line (1,1.5); (1.5,2) will be open |
| 15:31.44 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31780 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series/VolumeIII.xml: Markup through half of Table 8 |
| 15:33.39 | d_rossberg | if you see the intersection and handle it it's ok |
| 15:33.55 | homovulgaris | starseeker: did u think about making the industry and overview diagrams maintainable via xml ? |
| 15:34.15 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: why does it need to be handled seperately? |
| 15:34.46 | pacman87 | are you saying the hollow area is bad? |
| 15:35.08 | d_rossberg | not seperately, but you have an implicite line on the y-axis which connects the two closing lines |
| 15:46.59 | pacman87 | http://xkcd.com/371/ |
| 16:20.13 | mafm | :D |
| 16:57.53 | homovulgaris | pacman87: distcc is nice :) |
| 17:00.51 | mafm | have to go now, take care |
| 17:03.52 | *** join/#brlcad smurfette (n=Pandora@c-69-243-244-154.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 17:15.44 | MinuteElectron | mmh |
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| 17:29.26 | brlcad | wowsa, lots of backlog to respond to .. but I gots another couple hours of meeting to go still |
| 17:30.05 | brlcad | i'll be back, but yeah .. shouldn't need to rebuild everything every time, that's for sure |
| 17:39.57 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@dyn-91-171-218-234.ppp.tiscali.fr) | |
| 17:42.07 | homovulgaris | brlcad: 403 Forbidden error while editing wiki |
| 17:43.35 | MinuteElectron | What page? |
| 17:52.15 | homovulgaris | http://brlcad.org/w/index.php?title=Libpg_:_A_parametrics/constraint_library |
| 17:52.59 | MinuteElectron | Do you get this every time you try to edit that page, or just once? |
| 17:53.40 | homovulgaris | i edited it last yesterday i guess.. today when i am trying to restructure a bit .. 403 |
| 17:53.50 | homovulgaris | tried a couple of times.. |
| 17:54.13 | MinuteElectron | I don't get an error, strange. |
| 17:54.21 | geocalc | what is the good svn to dl ? |
| 17:54.36 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: Still looking into the CAPTCHA thing. |
| 17:54.38 | homovulgaris | geocalc: u mean svn client ? |
| 17:55.06 | geocalc | no svn of brlcad |
| 17:55.42 | homovulgaris | oh.. i thought we had only the repository at sourceforge |
| 17:56.01 | homovulgaris | ~cadsvn |
| 17:56.01 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 17:56.24 | geocalc | thanks |
| 17:56.35 | homovulgaris | np |
| 17:56.57 | homovulgaris | MinuteElectron: you are able to edit the pages ? as in submit the changes ? |
| 17:57.00 | MinuteElectron | yes |
| 17:57.17 | homovulgaris | i get the error message when i make the changes and press either preview or show changes or submit changes |
| 17:57.29 | homovulgaris | hmm.. weird.. |
| 17:57.31 | MinuteElectron | I don't, which is odd. |
| 17:57.33 | MinuteElectron | yes |
| 17:57.54 | homovulgaris | k.. let me try anonymous editing |
| 17:58.55 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: I'm stuck on this one, it seams very strange that the CAPTCHA point isn't being registered and no one in the drupal support knows either. The only other thing I can think of is the upgrade to Druapl 6. |
| 18:00.29 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-88-66.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:02.03 | homovulgaris | the present CAPTCHA looks pretty nice . Are we having trouble with that ? |
| 18:02.18 | MinuteElectron | It doesn't show up on the contact page. |
| 18:02.39 | homovulgaris | brlcad: error message is You don't have permission to access /w/index.php on this server. |
| 18:04.43 | homovulgaris | same error from multiple browsers.. maybe my ip is in some banned range or something ? |
| 18:12.45 | homovulgaris | geocalc: also check out http://brlcad.org/wiki/Building_from_SVN |
| 18:12.45 | geocalc | ok thanks homovulgaris |
| 18:12.45 | homovulgaris | np :) .. just ping this channel if u have any build trouble |
| 18:15.49 | geocalc | ;) |
| 18:16.17 | andrecastelo | brlcad: my irc client reconnects on disconnection, so sometimes when I join the channel it's the client reconnecting |
| 18:16.38 | andrecastelo | but yes, i'm trying to tame RT_HIT_NORMAL, checking how it is used |
| 18:17.03 | andrecastelo | to find the normal vector |
| 18:18.07 | andrecastelo | but it is seg faulting.. I'm probably doing something wrong (i think it has something to do with soltab) |
| 18:19.34 | andrecastelo | here's the rayhit function, http://rafb.net/p/nwXIeQ98.html |
| 18:29.31 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31781 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/tutorials/tire/ (19 files): Add docbook and images - user documentation for the tire procedure. |
| 18:31.16 | starseeker | homovulgaris: That's a difficult thing to attempt - svg is probably the best bet |
| 18:33.14 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:33.49 | starseeker | thinks his inkscape file was/is a good start, but brlcad will probably need to look into it - there was a lot of very careful design put into things like font choices, colors, etc. |
| 18:41.52 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:44.09 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:45.00 | homovulgaris | starseeker: I was thinking of something in dia with svg output.. but that wouldnt look very nice.. and inkscape is seriously kewl stuff.. |
| 18:45.45 | homovulgaris | somebody should build up a software project based on this : revision controllable generated diagrams and images :) |
| 19:06.13 | homovulgaris | going to watch some dumb hbo to get my brain fresh :) |
| 19:09.01 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31782 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series/VolumeIII.xml: Add other half of Table 8 |
| 19:56.38 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31783 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series/VolumeIII.xml: Markup through chapter 7, stub for references. Remainder will be included from articles. |
| 19:57.38 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31784 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Added ae2dir and dir2ae commands to libtclcad's ged object. |
| 20:04.23 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31785 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/dir2ae.c: Added ae2dir and dir2ae commands to libtclcad's ged object. |
| 20:06.34 | *** join/#brlcad lleroy (n=51a4212d@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:10.33 | lleroy | Has anyone had this problem : "db_lookup(-n) failed: -n does not exist" in "Primitive Selection"? |
| 20:11.20 | lleroy | I posted a problem on the sourceforge forum http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=2105803&forum_id=362510 some time ago but got no reaction... |
| 20:16.20 | *** join/#brlcad lleroy (n=51a4212d@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
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| 20:46.46 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31786 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: Use MAX_FASTF instead of 1.0/0.0 |
| 21:08.30 | pacman87 | awww, i liked dividing by zero ;) |
| 21:11.49 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.8.201) | |
| 22:21.21 | pacman87 | i think i just killed a bug |
| 22:53.41 | poolio | pacman87: code or real life?? |
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| 23:34.28 | *** join/#brlcad ibot_ (i=ibot@rikers.org) | |
| 23:34.28 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 00:04.35 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, the leader of project wilderness says he misses work |
| 00:36.01 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
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| 01:54.14 | andrecastelo | brlcad & ``Erik : flat shaded http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/5120/rtmltfscastleas2.jpg :D:D |
| 01:54.34 | pacman87 | oooh, pretty! |
| 02:06.43 | andrecastelo | pacman87: thank you! :D hehehe |
| 02:06.56 | pacman87 | where'd the model come from |
| 02:06.59 | pacman87 | ? |
| 02:08.27 | andrecastelo | hmm.. brlcad/brlcadInstall/share/brlcad/7.12.1/db/ |
| 02:11.20 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31788 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libged/libged.vcproj: Added ae2dir.c and dir2ae.c. |
| 02:28.31 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31789 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Expanded rayhit() to output a flat shaded image. |
| 03:23.13 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.8.201) | |
| 03:36.03 | starseeker | observes his computer works much better when he has the correct IDE driver in the kernel... |
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| 05:18.14 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.8.201) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 05:28.26 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 05:29.08 | Ralith | Does there exist a more user-friendly modelling interface than mged? |
| 05:30.24 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow_ (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 06:17.42 | homovulgaris | Raltih: not presently , mafm is working on one. http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Mafm |
| 06:21.40 | Ralith | homovulgaris: that's good to hear. |
| 06:23.02 | homovulgaris | mged is a "little" tough to get used to .. but it is pretty functional once u start using it |
| 06:23.46 | homovulgaris | u can do things quite rapidly with the keyboard u know :) |
| 06:23.49 | Ralith | I'm sure it is; however, I'm interested in leveraging brl-cad for an audience who are wary of anything not laden in widgets. |
| 06:24.04 | homovulgaris | oh.. |
| 06:24.06 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 06:24.16 | Ralith | Personally, I prefer the keyboard; I use emacs for my generic text editor/IDE, for example. |
| 06:24.25 | Ralith | and in that respect I'm quite interested in learning mged in and of itself. |
| 06:25.19 | Ralith | however, I'm *more* interested to see if brl-cad as a whole is going to become itself accessible to people less interested in spending time learning an arcane interface than just messing around with a mouse to get some basics thrown together quickly and easily |
| 06:25.50 | Ralith | As you may be aware, other than brl-cad, there really isn't any respectable open source CAD system out there. |
| 06:26.16 | homovulgaris | yeah, i know :) |
| 06:26.21 | Ralith | the website cites a *very* impressive resume, which would seem to imply that brl-cad has finally broken that trend, but without a friendly interface, that's not very useful for my purposes. |
| 06:26.49 | Ralith | which would be a real shame, given that the user interface is probably the simplest portion of a professional-quality CAD system |
| 06:26.59 | homovulgaris | once mafm's work is done, things should be pretty smooth |
| 06:27.50 | Ralith | that's really exciting :) |
| 06:27.55 | Ralith | grabs the video |
| 06:28.13 | homovulgaris | the lack of open source CAD systems is really spooky.. I personally majored in architecture last year and had to work entirely on proprietary software tools for instance |
| 06:28.42 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:29.20 | Ralith | especially since CAD is one of the things which would benefit most from the principles of open source |
| 06:29.20 | homovulgaris | and most of them have such high licensing fees. especially the ones with advanced features like CATIA for instance |
| 06:29.45 | Ralith | e.g. wouldn't it suck if your flagship product's designs were inaccessible because the software developer dropped support? |
| 06:30.16 | Ralith | of course, this generally moot as many CAD formats are well documented and supported. |
| 06:30.40 | Ralith | speaking as someone largely unfamiliar with CAD systems, how does brl-cad compare to something like, say, solidworks? |
| 06:30.40 | homovulgaris | :) u work in CADD sector Ralith ? |
| 06:30.43 | Ralith | nah |
| 06:30.50 | Ralith | I'm a hobbyist |
| 06:31.03 | Ralith | hoping to expand into CAD/CAM/CNC |
| 06:31.30 | Ralith | specifically, using brl-cad with home-built rapid prototyping equipment |
| 06:31.37 | homovulgaris | brl-cad has an impressive array of features. It is more useful for precision modeling and raytracing for physics simulations :) |
| 06:32.01 | homovulgaris | Ralith: rapid prototyping is really kewl. |
| 06:32.20 | Ralith | the eventual goal being the capacity to manufacture precision custom parts with few restrictions and at very low cost |
| 06:32.26 | homovulgaris | Ralith: I myself am quite interested in STL and CNC |
| 06:32.46 | Ralith | the approach I'm looking at is FDM |
| 06:32.52 | Ralith | have you heard of the reprap project? |
| 06:33.39 | homovulgaris | brl-cad has a larger array of tools around 400 and libraries.. but as u said , user friendliness is to be worked out a bit :) |
| 06:33.40 | Ralith | (FDM is neat because it proves to be pretty easy to build a rapid prototyper based on it) |
| 06:33.44 | Ralith | hehe |
| 06:33.45 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:34.04 | Ralith | but the same goes for the rest of the reprap project, so I figure by the time it becomes userfriendly to build, perhaps brl-cad will be userfriendly to use. |
| 06:34.20 | homovulgaris | btw ;) I am just a gsoc student :D don't take these as official statements :P |
| 06:34.23 | Ralith | the project is seriously suffering from lack of powerful host software |
| 06:34.37 | Ralith | the rapid prototyper itself is moving along nicely, though |
| 06:34.45 | homovulgaris | hmm.. will check out reprap |
| 06:34.49 | Ralith | it's really cool |
| 06:35.08 | homovulgaris | what are the requirements from the host software ? |
| 06:35.17 | Ralith | long-term goal is to produce a rapid prototyper that can manufacture itself; short term goal (already achieved) is to produce one that can manufacture the only hard-to-find and thus expensive parts |
| 06:35.22 | Ralith | well, there's a few different bits |
| 06:35.25 | Ralith | first is the CAD system |
| 06:35.34 | Ralith | which I hope brl-cad will be able to provide |
| 06:35.45 | Ralith | right now a tool called Art of Illusion or something like that is being used |
| 06:35.53 | Ralith | it's some shitty java modeller that almost nobody likes :P |
| 06:36.14 | homovulgaris | :) i hope so too.. rapid prototyper building rapid prototyper sounds like an awesome project :) |
| 06:36.20 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:36.36 | Ralith | you can build the current model for under $1000, and it's quite useful already |
| 06:36.41 | Ralith | far more than a proof of concept |
| 06:36.44 | homovulgaris | ur work is hosted on the net somewhere ? |
| 06:36.49 | Ralith | it's not my work; I'm just a fan |
| 06:36.52 | Ralith | http://reprap.org/ |
| 06:37.05 | homovulgaris | :) was just seeing reprap |
| 06:37.40 | Ralith | one of the more challenging host-side software requirements is the process of converting models to tool paths for the rapid prototyper |
| 06:37.58 | Ralith | I don't suppose you know of any existing work in that area that would be applicable to a FDM system? |
| 06:38.54 | Ralith | currently, a home-grown java system is being used (I don't get the projects' obsession with java. Perhaps it's the only language the original developers knew.) |
| 06:38.59 | Ralith | it's slow and has problems. |
| 06:39.13 | homovulgaris | nope :) I had just a 1 year span to work on my thesis. so i worked mostly with conventional proprietary stuff :) |
| 06:39.19 | Ralith | It used to (I don't know about the current state) take longer to calculate toolpaths for an object than it took to actually build it |
| 06:39.50 | homovulgaris | hm.. i am no big fan of java :| |
| 06:39.54 | Ralith | I agree. |
| 06:40.26 | Ralith | luckily, the important bit (the rapid prototyper itself and the hardware that drives it) is all done in a much more professional manner. |
| 06:40.26 | homovulgaris | i mean i understand what they say about portability etc. etc. but i always feel unnecessary overhead |
| 06:40.34 | Ralith | the funny thing is, java isn't very portable |
| 06:40.45 | homovulgaris | ;) |
| 06:40.50 | Ralith | C(++) code written using the right libraries beats it any day. |
| 06:41.18 | Ralith | for example, I doubt there's a java VM for netbsd on an ARM processor. |
| 06:42.28 | homovulgaris | hmm.. there should be i guess |
| 06:42.59 | Ralith | and the overhead itself prevents it from being used properly on an embedded platform |
| 06:43.14 | Ralith | hell, it prevents it from being used on plenty of full-on desktop computers :P |
| 06:43.21 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31790 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be consistent with Makefile.am |
| 06:43.47 | homovulgaris | I better go grab some food :) Ralith, i will check out reprap further .. see u on this channel sometime, u should talk with brlcad (Sean) for better info regarding brl-cad btw ;) |
| 06:43.56 | Ralith | cool |
| 06:43.59 | Ralith | seeya |
| 06:44.23 | homovulgaris | will run reprap today |
| 07:04.21 | brlcad | mehhowdy gents |
| 07:04.28 | brlcad | :) |
| 07:13.40 | *** join/#brlcad lleroy (n=chatzill@axsguard.bepco.com) | |
| 07:18.07 | Ralith | hullo |
| 07:18.20 | Ralith | I'd hang around and ask questions, but it's past midnight over here and I need some rest |
| 07:35.58 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31791 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS TODO): fix the primitive selection bug in mged, reported on the forums by lleroy. details in the todo file. |
| 07:40.42 | brlcad | lleroy: I replied -- the bug made it into release |
| 07:41.31 | lleroy | ok, thanks... I wondered if this was a bug or if this was due to my compilation. |
| 07:41.35 | brlcad | lleroy: there are a few trivial mods you can make that will work or you can use the command-line way as a work-around until it gets fixed -- thanks for the report, didn't know about it |
| 07:41.56 | lleroy | btw, what's in brlcad for collision detection? |
| 07:42.20 | lleroy | I mean to look into CAM toolpath generation... |
| 07:42.25 | brlcad | homovulgaris: 200 minutes is certainly not the worst I've seen for a compile :-) |
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| 07:51.44 | brlcad | homovulgaris: (reading and responding to scrollback chatter) .. probably needs to support both binary and some scriptable form -- I can imagine some full-constrained parametric object (a full vehicle) will be horribly inefficient to have it evaluate everything as strings, but that's probably what the user will input in creating them |
| 07:54.04 | brlcad | pacman87: d_rossberg's comments about self-intersecting your sketch when connecting to the y-axis is the same that I was referring to -- probably want to connect and stop when that happens instead of going all the way to the y-axis so you don't end up with open edges and infinitely thin walls |
| 07:56.01 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: cool, and thanks :-) |
| 07:59.15 | brlcad | pacman87: fyi, dividing by zero will cause a run-time abort exception for many environments |
| 08:00.28 | brlcad | getting inf/nan results from a floating point unit is compilation and hardware dependent (relies on ieee conformance, which is a bad assumption) -- should always be using tolerance tests and other logic in order to get consistent reliable behavior |
| 08:01.20 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: heh, and the wilderness misses him too! |
| 08:04.39 | brlcad | andrecastelo: hah! awesome ... nice work, send that to erik if he doesn't see it here :) |
| 08:07.33 | brlcad | homovulgaris: how dare you say you're "just a gsoc student" .. :-) |
| 08:09.22 | brlcad | aww |
| 08:09.27 | brlcad | catches up |
| 08:12.29 | lleroy | brlcad: what support is available in brlcad for generating CAM toolpaths? |
| 08:17.04 | brlcad | lleroy: none directly -- your best bet is probably looking at your CAM hardware to see if it'll autogenerate for a given input format (like stl, which we can export) |
| 08:17.28 | lleroy | brlcad: I mean, if I were to implement CAM inside BRLCAD? |
| 08:18.30 | lleroy | brlcad: I remember reading on a forum something along the lines of "there is already support stuff implemented for CAM but...???" |
| 08:18.31 | brlcad | ah, well in that regard there is a fair bit available and quite a few things that are possible |
| 08:19.21 | brlcad | shotlining can actually give you some surprisingly accurate (sampled) collision detection, high-performance, and robust |
| 08:20.33 | brlcad | if you wanted to generate toolpaths for a layered dual-axis cnc for example, i could see setting something up where you raytrace each layer of your model and infer solidity/paths from the result |
| 08:21.14 | brlcad | similar to what rtedge is doing for 2D images, but on a slice-by-slice approach up through a model |
| 08:24.10 | brlcad | from a ray-tracing perspective, overlaps == collisions, so you could conceivably write a tool that would read in some geometry, provide tooling options (gui, cmd line, or otherwise), and then use either parametric projections or sampled slicing or some volumetric approach for generating tool paths (sort of a g-gcode converter in the end) |
| 08:26.32 | lleroy | is there something for region-querying (i.e. give me all objects that intersect an object) |
| 08:26.58 | lleroy | or where their bounding box/sphere intersects this box/sphere |
| 08:28.40 | brlcad | performing the latter would be really trivial if there's not a routine already for that |
| 08:29.11 | brlcad | there's not something to query existing overlaps that intersect, though that certainly depends on current object/viewing states |
| 08:29.19 | lleroy | yes, but doing so efficient using something along the lines of kdtree? |
| 08:29.42 | brlcad | yeah, that's what I was trying to think if there is something |
| 08:30.05 | brlcad | nothing that comes to mind that uses the spatial partitioning, but I'd have to rummage around librt a bit to be sure |
| 08:30.07 | lleroy | is there a partitioning scheme in use in librt |
| 08:31.12 | brlcad | yeah, definitely -- this question comes up a fair bit, I should really document it somewhere.. :-) |
| 08:32.30 | brlcad | it actually supports a variety of space partitioning mechanisms |
| 08:34.20 | brlcad | there's a BSP implementation and a hybrid grid-based partitioning scheme in place presently |
| 08:35.48 | brlcad | (which isn't so much like traditional gridding, it dynamicly sizes, attempts to balance objects per grid cell, etc) |
| 08:37.15 | brlcad | default though is a non-uniform binary space paritioning tree |
| 08:41.15 | brlcad | that's also, though, why I was referring to using the shot-liner since a) that uses space partitioning and is fast/robust, and b) is how you evaluate that an overlap actually exists regardless (since there is potentially unevaluated CSG and other geometry) |
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| 08:52.09 | lleroy | brlcad: something completely different: I was trying to understand the mged_ill problem, and I wonder where the code jumps to when _mged_ill is called... (i suppose it jumps from tcl to C, but I failed to find the entry point into the C code) |
| 09:38.30 | *** part/#brlcad lleroy (n=chatzill@axsguard.bepco.com) | |
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| 10:16.20 | alex_joni | brlcad: seen http://code.google.com/p/wildcat-cad/ ? |
| 10:25.10 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 10:27.15 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:28.38 | mafm | hi |
| 10:30.54 | mafm | brlcad: did you see the question about the camera yesterday? |
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| 11:04.29 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=homovulg@117.196.143.199) | |
| 11:05.17 | homovulgaris | brlcad: :O more than 200 ? |
| 11:05.24 | homovulgaris | what was it on :) |
| 11:08.17 | homovulgaris | btw, i wanted to use the ax_boost_base.m4 macro i added using something like this addition to the configure.ac http://rafb.net/p/v3tpKU36.html |
| 11:08.42 | homovulgaris | but it gives some trouble while configuring in tcl saying LDFLAGS was not set during the last run |
| 11:09.07 | homovulgaris | is there something additional i have to do other than adding the macro to m4 dir and the code to configure.ac |
| 11:09.45 | homovulgaris | and also , did u see my question about passing data about variables to C++ by strings ? |
| 11:10.15 | homovulgaris | sorry if u already replied.. is there any way to check up logs .. the ones at ibot.rikers is always one day old right ? |
| 11:15.19 | alex_joni | 10:38 <@brlcad> homovulgaris: (reading and responding to scrollback chatter) .. |
| 11:15.19 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:15.19 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:15.19 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:15.19 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
| 11:15.21 | alex_joni | <PROTECTED> |
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| 12:27.51 | *** join/#brlcad sam (i=sam@poulet.zoy.org) | |
| 12:32.07 | sam | howdy |
| 12:34.06 | mafm | hi |
| 12:40.08 | *** part/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 12:47.31 | sam | brlcad: I have two patches to suggest; one prevents "configure" from being removed upon "make distclean", and the other sets CONFIG_TS in the proper format |
| 12:47.32 | sam | http://zoy.org/~sam/patches/patch-brlcad-preserve-configure.diff |
| 12:47.32 | sam | http://zoy.org/~sam/patches/patch-brlcad-debian-friendly-date.diff |
| 12:51.50 | sam | more generally, "make distclean" renders the source tree unusable unless you run autogen again |
| 12:52.35 | sam | (which it shouldn't do) |
| 12:52.48 | sam | I suggest creating a "make maintainerclean" rule instead |
| 13:15.50 | brlcad | alex_joni: yes, I commented on the work a couple weeks ago -- and some chatter on grabowski's mailing list where it was announced |
| 13:16.53 | *** join/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 13:17.25 | brlcad | mafm: I saw the comments in the commits and your wiki update |
| 13:17.47 | brlcad | but not a specific question |
| 13:17.57 | brlcad | several camera modes would be good to have |
| 13:18.27 | mafm | examples? |
| 13:18.27 | brlcad | howdy sam! :) |
| 13:19.08 | mafm | for kbd control is not much of an issue, but I don't know for making a window to control the camera |
| 13:20.48 | brlcad | sam: for the first, understandable though it was intentional to make distclean restore the sources to a *checkout* state |
| 13:21.13 | sam | yeah, I understand the idea |
| 13:21.20 | brlcad | we could of course get that with another rule, but were intentionally avoiding having a plethora of clean rules when one goes "all the way" |
| 13:21.23 | sam | maybe it's just misc/debian which needs a makeover |
| 13:21.53 | sam | it's the first project I see where "make distclean" doesn't allow you to reconfigure though |
| 13:22.33 | brlcad | it's very bikesheddish to me -- not a big deal either way -- but there are undoubtedly other mods that would be needed to make it clean up to a dist state |
| 13:22.48 | brlcad | though I might have already started |
| 13:22.56 | brlcad | e.g. the Makefile.in files |
| 13:23.26 | brlcad | sure, I understand the tradeoff -- just saying it was indeed intentional, we distclean and run autogen.sh |
| 13:23.52 | brlcad | distclean is run prior to making a dist, so our devs have to go through the full release prep |
| 13:24.40 | brlcad | sam: curious about the second patch -- it should already be setting that with the LC_ALL=C that preceeds |
| 13:26.08 | sam | brlcad: my bad, I missed the LC_ALL=C |
| 13:26.16 | sam | but the important part is the -R flag |
| 13:26.29 | sam | debian/changelog needs to be in a very specific format |
| 13:26.46 | brlcad | i'm on a bsd atm, what does -R do? |
| 13:27.55 | sam | RFC822 format |
| 13:27.56 | brlcad | misc/debian is/was user-contributed by someone that was trying to set it up in apt, you're welcome to take it over if you like |
| 13:28.06 | brlcad | they've not continued their efforts |
| 13:28.30 | sam | I'm afraid I would make a sloppy maintainer for such a big piece of software |
| 13:28.50 | brlcad | nods |
| 13:28.59 | brlcad | and there are still integration issues to sort out |
| 13:29.35 | sam | I can provide patches during my quest to a working brlcad package though :) |
| 13:29.57 | brlcad | sure ;) |
| 13:30.10 | brlcad | want commit access to work on that or prefer patches? |
| 13:33.37 | sam | as you wish |
| 13:39.36 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31792 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: apply CONFIG_TS patch from sam hocevar to make the date stamp return in RFC822 format. breaks compilation timing, so might need to make sh/elapsed.sh handle 'one more' format |
| 13:40.42 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31793 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: we already removed the Makefile.in clobbering for distclean, so go the extra mile and keep configure too; patch from sam (thanks) |
| 13:50.33 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31794 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: special thanks to sam hocevar for his build system tweaks and debian integration testing |
| 13:52.02 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31795 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: sammy is another (commit) nick |
| 13:52.46 | sam | wow, that was fast :) |
| 13:54.07 | brlcad | you have commit now, you're a fairly known quantity and all changes are pretty closely scrutinized for this project regardless |
| 13:54.47 | brlcad | but either way, thanks for the mods .. it will be really cool to finally get into apt cleanly some day |
| 13:55.24 | brlcad | trunk is unstable if you're running/testing things, there's a separate stable branch for release integration testing |
| 13:55.28 | homovulgaris | i look forward to apt-get install brlcad :) |
| 13:55.42 | brlcad | yeah, that request comes up like once a month it seems |
| 13:55.47 | sam | I was surprised brlcad wasn't in Debian |
| 13:55.58 | sam | I found packages but they're only i386 and I run amd64 |
| 13:56.24 | brlcad | that was the last time it was seriously worked on, outside of build fixes done for ubuntu |
| 13:57.39 | sam | the task is huge: unfortunately Debian still has tcl8.5 and itcl3.1 |
| 13:57.41 | brlcad | the biggest problem for integration is that brl-cad is big and with an extensive heritage .. developed since early 80's, it's more like X11 than it is like, say, gimp or even blender |
| 13:58.32 | brlcad | so it was developed to install (like many proprietary apps or X11) into an isolated root given the conflict reality |
| 13:58.38 | sam | yeah, I could see that... commit messages from 1983 :) |
| 13:59.09 | brlcad | we've got most of that fixed now, but there are still a few critical issues remaining (one being proper system incrTcl detection) |
| 13:59.30 | brlcad | and our high-conflict potential libs: librt, libbn, libbu |
| 14:00.13 | sam | are the contribs linked statically into brlcad, or installed in a separate suffix? |
| 14:00.15 | brlcad | they're our core libs and predate those we conflict, but librt is still pretty prevalent (albeit deprecated) |
| 14:00.54 | brlcad | ideally they're linked dynamic for package managers |
| 14:01.04 | brlcad | they're only compiled and linked if not detected |
| 14:01.48 | brlcad | whether we build static or dynamic is a build setting, defaults to dynamic/shared libs |
| 14:01.59 | brlcad | our install becomes several GB in side if it's static |
| 14:02.07 | brlcad | s/side/size/ |
| 14:04.07 | brlcad | so to avoid the conflicts, I think the ultimate goal is to just set up the build system so that a /usr prefix will default to /usr/lib/brlcad/VERSION etc for the libs |
| 14:04.18 | brlcad | i think i've resolved all of our bin conflicts |
| 14:17.54 | brlcad | mafm: heh |
| 14:18.02 | brlcad | (and hi) :) |
| 14:18.23 | mafm | hiya |
| 14:18.34 | brlcad | I didn't respond because it seemed more a comment than a question :) |
| 14:18.49 | mafm | I see |
| 14:19.05 | mafm | well, it's because I don't know the level of sofistication desired |
| 14:19.25 | mafm | in geometry editors you don't need "follow player" modes and things like that |
| 14:19.30 | brlcad | for clarity, you're talking about how the view responds to mouse events, yes? |
| 14:19.38 | mafm | so I figured that orbital mode (with zoom) could be enough |
| 14:20.11 | mafm | more to kbd events, but could be mouse too |
| 14:20.13 | brlcad | you need a "follow player" mode if you have animation/timeline support where there's a camera being tracked |
| 14:20.56 | mafm | are animations supported by brl-cad? |
| 14:21.10 | brlcad | crude, but yes |
| 14:21.14 | mafm | hmm |
| 14:21.30 | brlcad | I wouldn't worry so much about that right now though |
| 14:21.54 | brlcad | I see two immediate styles that are needed, one being classic "trackball" view support |
| 14:21.59 | mafm | well, the orbital idea can follow a given point, only that it follows it always from the same "orbital-stationary" position |
| 14:22.14 | brlcad | the other being our classic shift-grips |
| 14:22.41 | mafm | with "follow player" I also meant to smooth curves when following the players and so on... that's mostly needed for games with 3rd person view |
| 14:23.29 | mafm | well, I was about to create a somewhat complex and useful camera mode, with accompanying window, so I think that it would be helpful to know |
| 14:23.32 | brlcad | ah, we might be talking about two slightly different things -- I could see having an orbital mode with trackball or with shift-grips |
| 14:24.09 | mafm | ok, I describe |
| 14:24.12 | brlcad | orbital would definitely be useful to have early on, though -- imagine browsing through a geometry database, pulling up a piece of geoemtry, and your preview spins around like in a game preview panel |
| 14:24.43 | mafm | for me orbital is having a central point, and zoom in and out |
| 14:24.58 | mafm | and being able to rotate up-down and left-right |
| 14:25.26 | mafm | so the camera is always in a point of the sphere, looking to the center |
| 14:25.33 | brlcad | sure, that's basically an immobile trackball |
| 14:25.34 | mafm | being the diameter of the sphere variable |
| 14:25.51 | mafm | (and following the center, if it happens to be mobile) |
| 14:26.40 | mafm | another mode is 1st person as in doom, where basically the controls to move the kbd control the camera too, and have some additional keys to look up&down and so on |
| 14:27.10 | mafm | follwing-player is 3rd person, and would be tracking the player from a few meters behind |
| 14:27.28 | mafm | so you're in a kind of chariot, being the player the horses |
| 14:27.44 | mafm | of course lots of small variations are possible in all the modes :) |
| 14:27.52 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:28.49 | brlcad | do you intent to tie a viewing mode to input behavior, or is it merely a degrees of freedeom matter that's separately considered from input? |
| 14:28.50 | mafm | so how's trackball and shift-grips related with this? I'm not familiar with it |
| 14:29.36 | brlcad | basically, those are input control styles |
| 14:30.18 | brlcad | trackball navigation is what most modelers use by default |
| 14:30.23 | sam | by the way, I'd like to explain why I wanted to try brlcad |
| 14:30.28 | sam | maybe it isn't the right tool |
| 14:30.29 | mafm | the viewing mode would be in general tied to input behaviour I think -- keys to go left/right, up/down, zoom in/out... |
| 14:30.54 | sam | I'd like to create solids whose colour values are f(x,y,z) |
| 14:30.57 | brlcad | sam: if it gets you contributing code/patches/fixes/enhancements, then of COURSE it's the right tool ;) |
| 14:31.03 | mafm | also imagine a window: it could have 4 arrows pointing to cardinal points, and one +/- for zoom, etc |
| 14:31.05 | sam | then perform CSG operations on them |
| 14:31.54 | sam | in order to visualise what colours remain |
| 14:32.33 | brlcad | mafm: okay, if you're going to tie them together, that works -- but probably have to clarify/learn what at least is meant by shift-grips and trackball modes then -- both use the view's eye point as the manipulation point |
| 14:36.03 | mafm | is "trackball navigation" something specific about navigating with trackballs, or just an axis-based mouse? |
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| 14:36.37 | mafm | or just to only have as input a trackball, instead of mouse and keyboard? |
| 14:40.09 | mafm | imagine that you have 1st person view... you can go forward, backward and turn with arrow keys; look up&down with page up&down; etc |
| 14:40.21 | mafm | but you can also assign similar actions to mouse |
| 14:41.02 | mafm | moving the mouse is looking to a particular direction, clicking some button is run, etc |
| 14:42.08 | mafm | when I speak about a camera mode is basically to have a class encompassing everything, and then you can assign kbd/mouse/trackball events to controll it, with commands similar to zoomIn, turnLeft, goToHomePosition.... |
| 14:42.49 | mafm | but you can also have several camera modes, so each time that you switch the camera mode, your buttons act also differently in the way that you move the view |
| 14:43.55 | mafm | so I'd like a bit of input in what's desired to have input on what's needed/desired if possible, so I implement something sufficiently complex to accomodate to the needs, but not overengineer it |
| 14:44.00 | brlcad | mafm: it has nothing to do with an actual trackball |
| 14:44.47 | brlcad | it's probably what you're most used to actually, started from old old code from sgi back in the 80's, and a trackball.c that most have continued to use over the years |
| 14:45.09 | brlcad | spinning around a simple model in opengl, you have basic trackball control |
| 14:46.10 | brlcad | I know entirely what you mean by the various other modes (remember that I do also code for bzflag, we have most of those modes :) |
| 14:46.51 | mafm | yes, that's what I was guessing :D |
| 14:47.07 | brlcad | you've run mged, yes? |
| 14:47.11 | mafm | yes |
| 14:47.35 | brlcad | notice how it doesn't rotate the view around if you click-drag in the graphics window? |
| 14:47.40 | brlcad | it zooms |
| 14:48.42 | mafm | yes |
| 14:49.33 | brlcad | it's a "shift-grips" interface, where you get zoom in/out with buttons and no move event actions by default, shift+clicking+dragging, though, does one set of operations (e.g. panning), control+click+dragging does another (e.g. trackball rotation), etc |
| 14:49.56 | brlcad | that's one input style that we'll definitely want to have available |
| 14:50.23 | brlcad | taking it away would probably result in me being lynched |
| 14:50.48 | brlcad | but doesn't mean it has to be default, just available ;) |
| 14:50.48 | mafm | lol |
| 14:50.56 | brlcad | there's a doc on the website that details all the bindings |
| 14:51.27 | mafm | Shift Grips Quick Reference Guide ? |
| 14:51.30 | brlcad | we only need a follower mode if/when there is an animation track to follow -- we don't have that yet so I wouldn't focus on that one now |
| 14:51.33 | brlcad | yes |
| 14:51.37 | brlcad | it's just a simple table |
| 14:52.04 | brlcad | a fly-through mode would definitely be useful/interesting |
| 14:52.22 | brlcad | and then having a trackball mode probably by default |
| 14:52.26 | mafm | ok, let me read and think about it and explain you my idea about implementing it |
| 14:52.50 | brlcad | sam: hmmm |
| 14:53.11 | brlcad | sam: that entirely depends what you expect to happen when you perform the CSG operations |
| 14:54.00 | brlcad | you can do what you suggest now, but it sounds like maybe you're wanting addition/subtraction of colors (for union/subtration ops) .. and 'something' for intersection |
| 14:56.42 | mafm | brlcad: trackball up&down&left&right just moves the center of the window, or moves the perspective looking at the same 3D point (I guess that it's the 1st, with another to zoom in&out)? |
| 14:57.35 | sam | brlcad: I just need substraction, so no colour "merging" would be involved |
| 14:59.06 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31796 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/resources/README: Add basic readme explaining why the resources directory exists - this should be fleshed out later. |
| 14:59.07 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/colors.png |
| 14:59.16 | brlcad | something like that? |
| 15:01.35 | sam | yes, exactly |
| 15:02.07 | sam | but I also want the solids to have variable colour values (using a parametric function maybe?) |
| 15:02.16 | brlcad | oof |
| 15:02.34 | brlcad | that'd be a shader |
| 15:02.57 | brlcad | certainly doable and not hard, but you'd have to write some code to support it |
| 15:03.12 | sam | and I'd need my GLX driver to understand shaders I guess |
| 15:03.18 | brlcad | no no |
| 15:03.31 | brlcad | ray-trace shader, rather different |
| 15:03.39 | sam | ah, ok. |
| 15:03.46 | brlcad | more like what pixar's renderman does for the movies |
| 15:04.45 | brlcad | when generating an image via ray-tracing, the ray hits a surface and calls upon a 'shader' to determine a color value there (for the intent of coloring a pixel image ultimately) |
| 15:05.21 | sam | would I be able to navigate in near realtime around the scene with a ~1500 vgr machine? |
| 15:05.47 | brlcad | so in that image, you're actually looking at two shaders -- one is a classic "phong" shader that shows surface curvature, specular highlights, etc .. the other is a very very simple "flat" shader that just returns the color set to the object |
| 15:05.48 | sam | the scene would have fewer than 10 cubes |
| 15:06.41 | brlcad | you could certainly navigate the wireframe in realtime.. :) |
| 15:06.45 | sam | lol |
| 15:07.01 | brlcad | those images are renderings, ray-traced |
| 15:07.55 | brlcad | ray-tracing 10 cubes in 'real-time' is certainly doable but it'd be through a different interface that doesn't use shaders |
| 15:08.19 | sam | mmmh, maybe I just need a CSG library and my own OpenGL renderer |
| 15:09.23 | brlcad | then it would be an opengl shader |
| 15:13.35 | *** part/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-164-28.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 15:17.18 | mafm | brlcad: trackball up&down&left&right just moves the center of the window, or moves the perspective looking at the same 3D point (I guess that it's the 1st, with another to zoom in&out)? |
| 15:18.10 | brlcad | the latter if I understand you correctly |
| 15:19.10 | brlcad | imagine a large bounding sphere in your 3D view, click-dragging from the center to the left rotates that sphere (and the scene it hypothetically encompasses) |
| 15:19.17 | mafm | the latter continues the object (rotates around given center), the former moves the window in a fixed Z plane |
| 15:19.42 | mafm | the latter orbits* |
| 15:20.33 | brlcad | yes |
| 15:25.44 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03sammy * r31797 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/URToolkit/tools/rlehdr.c: * rlehdr.c: fix a potential crash in the RLE header display function. |
| 15:27.00 | mafm | I see |
| 15:27.07 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 15:27.19 | mafm | well, then I think that I'll build a bit of infrastructure for supporting different modes |
| 15:28.02 | brlcad | yeah, I figured you'd need to support at least two styles |
| 15:28.58 | mafm | nicey nicey |
| 15:29.09 | mafm | I have work for most of next week, I guess |
| 15:29.27 | brlcad | mafm: here's an example of a basic (immobile) trackball: http://www.opengl.org/resources/code/samples/glut_examples/examples/dinoshade.c |
| 15:29.46 | brlcad | simple lil glut example, gcc dinoshade.c -lglut |
| 15:30.54 | dtidrow | cls |
| 15:31.09 | dtidrow | ugh, wrong window |
| 15:31.16 | brlcad | -bash: cls: command not found |
| 15:31.32 | dtidrow | unless it's aliased ;-) |
| 15:31.43 | dtidrow | really old habits die hard |
| 15:32.06 | brlcad | shame on you for aliasing dos commands :) |
| 15:32.22 | dtidrow | see previous remark ;-) |
| 15:32.22 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31798 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 3 dirs): Added arot, eye and eye_pos functions. |
| 15:32.24 | brlcad | they die even harder when you let them keep working |
| 15:32.44 | dtidrow | fewer keystrokes too |
| 15:45.10 | mafm | I cannot compile that thing |
| 15:49.57 | brlcad | mafm: really? |
| 15:50.03 | brlcad | what's your error? |
| 15:51.27 | brlcad | all of the glut_examples are pretty simple to compile, just have to have glut installed (headers/libs) and tell gcc where |
| 15:51.41 | brlcad | maybe gcc dinoshade.c -lglut -lgl |
| 15:53.08 | mafm | the glut I already figured out |
| 15:53.23 | mafm | but there's a function from glext.h causing problems |
| 15:53.55 | mafm | dinoshade.c:(.text+0x1c25): undefined reference to `glPolygonOffsetEXT' |
| 15:59.26 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31799 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added ae2dir, arot, dir2ae, eye and eye_pos source files. |
| 16:02.07 | brlcad | mafm: try adding the snippet suggested here: http://www2.cemr.wvu.edu/~ejb/Instructions/node10.html |
| 16:03.54 | brlcad | i.e. add the wrapper or simply remove the EXT |
| 16:03.59 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31800 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Add appendix A of VolIII as pipes tutorial, with corresponding changes for VolIII |
| 16:04.00 | mafm | freeglut (./a.out): WARNING - Display string token not recognized: stencil>=2 |
| 16:04.00 | mafm | dinoshade: Sorry, I need at least 2 bits of stencil. |
| 16:04.02 | mafm | :D |
| 16:04.13 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo___ (n=chatzill@189.71.25.125) | |
| 16:04.40 | brlcad | hrm, i'll dig up a simpler example later then |
| 16:04.46 | brlcad | lunch! |
| 16:04.49 | mafm | oki |
| 16:05.00 | mafm | np anyway, I'm quite busy |
| 16:05.02 | mafm | good lunch! |
| 16:15.19 | starseeker | phooy - Apache FOP is known to have an issue (or more likely unimplemented feature) about not shrinking images to fit on a page |
| 16:15.56 | starseeker | makes note to get ahold of the FOP devs for an eta on that feature... |
| 16:20.28 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.140.127) | |
| 16:24.56 | mafm | hi homovulgaris |
| 16:45.28 | poolio | Aha. My bug had to do with the fact that I fail at basic geometry. Wonderful. |
| 17:01.39 | pacman87 | brlcad: self intersecting example: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt13.png |
| 17:01.54 | pacman87 | 2 lines: ((1, 1); (2, 2)) and ((1, 1.5); (2, 2.5)) |
| 17:26.02 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@dyn-91-171-218-234.ppp.tiscali.fr) | |
| 17:28.17 | brlcad | starseeker: or grab their sources and try to implement it ;) |
| 17:36.43 | pacman87 | brlcad: i don't see how "open edges and infinitely thin walls" are created, unless you mean along the circle traced by the point of intersection |
| 17:37.12 | pacman87 | and that's not really different than a user-supplied self-intersecting sketch |
| 17:39.24 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: thanks? |
| 17:51.07 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 17:52.06 | starseeker | brlcad: :-P yeah, I'll just take a couple minutes here... |
| 17:52.58 | starseeker | brlcad: Thanks to the joys of binary svn diffs, I should be able to size down for now and then revert to the original size if/when fop supports it again |
| 17:54.45 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 18:29.07 | brlcad | pacman87: akin to having two segments 1,0 -> 1,1; and 2,0 -> 2,1; .. you can either make four segments that clamp the four "open" endpoints to x,0 .. or you can detect that the 2,0->2,1 segment will connect up with the other leaving you with two new segments at 2,0 -> 1,0 and 2,1 -> 1,1; |
| 18:29.47 | brlcad | MinuteElectron: for looking into the problem |
| 18:30.22 | brlcad | i was going to do the upgrade to 6 but the modules we're using weren't upgraded yet |
| 18:31.01 | mafm | I go now, have a good weekend in the case that I don't join :) |
| 18:32.52 | MinuteElectron | brlcad: really, I wonder if they still haven't been... |
| 18:33.02 | MinuteElectron | I think theres a change to the skin system too =/ |
| 18:46.16 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31801 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add projection shader tutorial |
| 19:07.04 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 19:09.12 | brlcad | starseeker: reminder on https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1990961&group_id=105292&atid=640803 |
| 19:09.35 | brlcad | he's not responded, so it might just need to move to bugs, but it's one that'd be good to fix |
| 19:13.44 | starseeker | OK, thanks - i'll take a look |
| 19:14.06 | brlcad | you should be able to reproduce on your 30" |
| 19:14.11 | starseeker | :-) |
| 19:14.23 | starseeker | let me commit ebm quick |
| 19:14.34 | brlcad | doesn't have to be now/today, just a reminder |
| 19:15.06 | brlcad | like to keep support requests and patches processed with fairly high priority (contrary to bugs and feature requests that might linger for years) |
| 19:15.19 | starseeker | right |
| 19:15.27 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31802 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add extruded bitmap overview. |
| 19:18.20 | Ralith | brlcad: hey, you're still around! |
| 19:18.34 | Ralith | so I was told you're The Person to come to with brlcaddy questions |
| 19:19.00 | starseeker | does rtwizard not have a man page??? |
| 19:19.40 | brlcad | howdy Ralith |
| 19:19.52 | Ralith | so I've got a fairly fundemental question: is BRL-CAD an appropriate tool for designing new parts in? |
| 19:20.00 | brlcad | starseeker: niet, though it does have a fair bit of in-interface help |
| 19:20.10 | brlcad | it's meant to be a "wizard" after all, walking you through |
| 19:20.23 | brlcad | Ralith: it depends for what purpose |
| 19:20.25 | starseeker | When he's saying running it from the command line, does that mean starting it from the command line then? |
| 19:20.33 | brlcad | yes |
| 19:21.21 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm not sure how to answer that question. What I had in mind was for use as source data (which would then be converted into toolpaths) for a rapid prototyper. |
| 19:21.41 | brlcad | Ralith: conceptual design of parts is not a strong point, you tend to need a wide range of feature-based editing operations and ability to perform unknown free-form edits |
| 19:22.03 | brlcad | if it's a part that already exists, and you're just modeling it -- sure |
| 19:22.26 | brlcad | even if it's something you have drawings for already, sure |
| 19:22.52 | brlcad | if you have absolutely nothing, though, and you're trying to design the worlds latest and greatest new toaster, not good for concept design |
| 19:23.01 | Ralith | it seems like that would be the case for most serious cases; at least, when I'm designing something I usually have it all worked out on paper before I even touch a computer. |
| 19:23.15 | brlcad | then you should be golden |
| 19:23.19 | Ralith | awesome. |
| 19:24.18 | Ralith | also, on a semi-related note, I don't suppose you're aware of any freely available tools that might be adapted to create toolpaths for a fused deposition modelling rapid prototyping system? |
| 19:24.49 | Ralith | it seems like the sort of problem that should have been solved a long time ago, but is obscure enough not to have been. |
| 19:26.36 | brlcad | Ralith: here's an example of such a modeling example where someone had drafted up the dimensions and angles for an extrator part to a pistol/gun -- it was modeled up in a matter of minutes to specification |
| 19:27.27 | brlcad | the only free tool that comes to mind is one justin worked on a for a while, gcam |
| 19:27.30 | brlcad | http://gcam.js.cx/ |
| 19:27.48 | brlcad | dumps out g-code |
| 19:28.14 | starseeker | brlcad: I'm not triggering it, even at 2048x2048. Is there something special I need to be sure I do? |
| 19:28.36 | brlcad | starseeker: it'll happen right when you run the app, try starting with a .g perhaps |
| 19:28.41 | brlcad | rtwizard path/to/file.g |
| 19:28.46 | starseeker | did |
| 19:28.51 | starseeker | hmm... |
| 19:29.13 | brlcad | hm, then maybe try chaning your screen res or try making other displays the primary (under display preferences) |
| 19:29.59 | brlcad | it's certainly not been fixed, so it must just depend on some other factor(s) |
| 19:30.40 | brlcad | Ralith: oh, oops -- the example link, heh .. http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/screenshots/extractor.png.html |
| 19:31.28 | starseeker | Any chance it's 10.5 specific? |
| 19:32.29 | Ralith | brlcad: that sounds very encouraging. I hope the friendly GUI in progress will be similarily efficient; while I'm personally quite happy with steep learning curves, I'm hoping BRL-CAD might be adopted by a community which, on the whole, is not. |
| 19:32.59 | starseeker | hmm - changing resolution doesn't do it, nor does opening on another monitor |
| 19:38.51 | starseeker | tries to find out what "screen distance" means in Tk |
| 19:45.19 | starseeker | brlcad: When you wiped out rtwizard on large displays, was it an identical error message? If I'm not mistaken, the complaint is that itk is passing tk a value that is not a valid distance in pixels |
| 19:46.17 | Ralith | Does mged (and, I suppose, the BRL-CAD file format) have a way to instantiate a single object such that changes to any instance are applied to all instances? |
| 19:48.58 | prasad_ | is that shaded view in an interactive ogl context? |
| 19:49.12 | prasad_ | or is that the ray traced img |
| 20:20.05 | *** join/#brlcad cad63 (n=4f00e60e@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:38.38 | starseeker | Ralith: In a sense - if you create a primitive and then use that primitive in multiple combinations, changes to the original primitive will manifest in the combinations |
| 20:41.49 | Ralith | starseeker: that's cool and related, but I was wondering more if you can define one primitive or set of combined primitives, then define several instances of it which all share the same data, so that a change to one applies to all. |
| 20:41.58 | Ralith | perhaps I misunderstand something? |
| 20:42.33 | Ralith | the PDF on good modelling technique implies that brl-cad can do this; that is, it doesn't say how to (that I saw), but it does say that use of such a feature is a good way to do certain things. |
| 20:43.59 | starseeker | Well, not for primitives as such - what you want (I think) is to create one combination (comb1.c) with one or more primitives/combinations "inside" it |
| 20:44.08 | starseeker | then copy comb1.c to comb2.c |
| 20:44.17 | starseeker | cp comb1.c comb2.c, IIRC |
| 20:44.33 | starseeker | if you do a tree on comb1.c and comb2.c, you will notice they have the same contents |
| 20:45.32 | starseeker | so if you move a primitive (notice there is a difference between moving a primitive and moving the instance of the primitive inside comb1.c - see the OED tutoral for a discussion of this) |
| 20:45.48 | starseeker | let's get more concrete |
| 20:45.57 | starseeker | make sph1.s sph |
| 20:46.07 | starseeker | comb comb1.c u sph1.s |
| 20:46.13 | starseeker | cp comb1.c comb2.c |
| 20:47.37 | starseeker | tree comb1.c comb2.c |
| 20:47.53 | starseeker | You should see that both comb1.c and comb2.c have sph1.s in them. |
| 20:48.35 | starseeker | Now, type B sph1.s |
| 20:48.53 | starseeker | then do the following: |
| 20:48.58 | starseeker | sed sph1.s |
| 20:49.05 | starseeker | tra 0 0 -100 |
| 20:49.26 | starseeker | better make that -500 |
| 20:49.41 | starseeker | then type accept |
| 20:50.18 | starseeker | If you do B comb1.c and comb2.c, you should see no display change. This is because both comb1.c and comb2.c picked up the change to sph1.s we just made |
| 20:50.28 | starseeker | er B comb1.c comb2.c |
| 20:50.32 | starseeker | no and |
| 20:51.08 | starseeker | Now, B comb1.c |
| 20:51.38 | starseeker | no scratch that - let's leave comb2.c up |
| 20:52.03 | starseeker | Now use the oed command to work at the combination level: oed / comb1.c/sph1.s |
| 20:52.29 | starseeker | tra 0 0 500 |
| 20:52.31 | starseeker | accept |
| 20:52.42 | starseeker | you should see two spheres now |
| 20:53.03 | starseeker | because you operated at the combination level and not the primitive level, the translation was NOT shared between comb1.c and comb2.c |
| 20:53.20 | starseeker | that make any sense? |
| 20:54.01 | starseeker | Ralith: ping |
| 20:55.00 | Ralith | starseeker: I follow; this is exactly what I was hoping for. Thanks! |
| 20:56.04 | starseeker | If you now want comb1 and comb2 to each have their own primitives with the new location information, that's what xpush is all about |
| 20:57.00 | starseeker | Have you read the oed tutorial? |
| 20:59.19 | Ralith | not yet, no. |
| 20:59.41 | Ralith | I'm just getting started with all this stuff, while simultaneously trying to work out if brl-cad is entirely appropriate. So far it looks perfect. |
| 20:59.43 | starseeker | It should be at least related to this |
| 21:01.04 | starseeker | http://brlcad.org/w/images/3/36/Object_Editing_-_the_oed_Command.pdf |
| 21:05.06 | Ralith | starseeker: my installation seems to be missing an oed binary. |
| 21:05.16 | Ralith | is it a function of mged? |
| 21:06.16 | starseeker | yes, it's an mged command |
| 21:06.31 | Ralith | kk |
| 21:06.44 | Ralith | thanks! |
| 21:23.11 | brlcad | starseeker: it wasn't identical values, but the same error iirc |
| 21:23.24 | starseeker | sent a response asking for more info |
| 21:47.35 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 21:50.38 | Ralith | I have to say, I'm *very* impressed with the thoroughness of the documentation. |
| 21:51.03 | Ralith | is the source material for the pdfs available, so that it might be converted into e.g. a webpage? |
| 21:58.59 | Ralith | Also, where would I find documentation about the structure of database files? |
| 22:04.36 | Ralith | the Users group presentations wiki page seems to have docs for v5, but isn't that completely outdated? |
| 22:50.26 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:30.38 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo___ (n=chatzill@189.71.73.20) | |
| 23:32.40 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 23:46.03 | andrecastelo___ | andrecastelo: get out!! |
| 23:47.35 | andrecastelo___ | thank you |
| 23:48.06 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad, have you seen ``Erik around? |
| 00:11.49 | yukonbob | Ralith: re: source -- yes. It's in DocBook format, suitable for html if you like. |
| 00:12.06 | yukonbob | grab the distro from svn and checkout /doc |
| 00:12.16 | yukonbob | s/checkout/look in/ |
| 00:12.20 | yukonbob | ~svn |
| 00:12.20 | ibot | Subversion (aka SVN) is version control software that aims to be a better CVS than CVS. See http://subversion.tigris.org/. |
| 00:12.55 | yukonbob | ~distribution |
| 00:12.55 | ibot | distribution is probably a collection of goodies built around a kernel, also a whole lot of infrastructure and people. |
| 00:13.00 | yukonbob | gah |
| 00:13.19 | pacman87 | ~cadsvn |
| 00:13.20 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 00:13.39 | yukonbob | ya, what he said. |
| 00:13.43 | yukonbob | :P |
| 00:13.48 | yukonbob | pacman87: hi :) |
| 00:13.53 | pacman87 | yukonbob: howdy |
| 00:14.02 | yukonbob | happy friday |
| 00:14.25 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31803 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libged/libged.vcproj: Added files to libged.vcproj. |
| 00:17.49 | Ralith | yukonbob: cool, tanks. Guess you wouldn't know where to find technical docs on the file format? |
| 00:22.45 | yukonbob | well, there's the source, for one -- otherwise, I don't think I've personally come across a technical paper describing it, no... |
| 00:22.58 | pacman87 | g2asc? |
| 00:25.58 | Ralith | what about it? |
| 00:25.59 | Ralith | also, brb |
| 00:26.16 | Ralith | yukonbob: so long as the relevant code's well commented that's not too bad. |
| 00:36.24 | brlcad | Ralith: no, v5 is the current .g file format revision |
| 00:36.36 | brlcad | the database format is versioned separately from the rest of brl-cad |
| 00:37.01 | brlcad | v4 and v5 are all that you'd ever encounter |
| 00:37.26 | brlcad | it's been v5 since about release 5.0 (just coincidence they match) |
| 00:37.41 | brlcad | andrecastelo: he's on vacation, gets back tomorrow |
| 00:38.34 | brlcad | Ralith: and docs for the .g format are on the website, under documentation iirc |
| 00:38.46 | brlcad | best reference are the headers and sources, though |
| 00:39.00 | brlcad | there are a few minor items out of sync |
| 01:22.32 | Ralith | Ah, I thought the versioning thing might be the case. |
| 01:30.18 | andrecastelo | brlcad: hm ok ok :D |
| 01:30.36 | andrecastelo | I was kind of worried since the mid term evaluations end monday |
| 01:57.00 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-59-111-122.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 02:00.48 | brlcad | starseeker: other huge payoff I forgot to mention, decoupling from X11 on Mac -- having a "BRL-CAD Shell" and MGED that work identical and natively on Mac and Windows |
| 02:01.15 | brlcad | andrecastelo: no worries on your part, the admins back the mentors up if needed |
| 02:01.41 | Ralith | that reminds me |
| 02:02.06 | Ralith | why does brl-cad have its own command window thing instead of just opening the shell in the terminal it was launched from? |
| 02:02.30 | pacman87 | Ralith: that's classic mode |
| 02:02.33 | pacman87 | mged -c |
| 02:02.52 | Ralith | oh, cool. |
| 02:03.42 | brlcad | you can run both simultaneously too |
| 02:03.57 | brlcad | mged -c, select nu or X, then run "gui" |
| 02:04.50 | brlcad | another fun way, mged -c, select nu or X, then run "attach X" for as many window views as you want |
| 02:07.31 | Ralith | fun! |
| 02:09.08 | Ralith | how hard would it be to get the command equivalent of arbitrary GUI actions automatically? |
| 02:15.28 | brlcad | depends which gui actions, what actions they're taking |
| 02:15.48 | brlcad | some of the tcl logic is actually processed in tcl for the tcl/tk interface |
| 02:15.54 | brlcad | most of it isn't though |
| 02:16.21 | Ralith | was imagining that it might be educational to have that sort of thing dumped to stdout or somewhere every time an action was performed |
| 02:16.26 | brlcad | for editing, you can get most of the options on the faceplate with the 'press' command |
| 02:16.40 | brlcad | the geometry browser does exactly that |
| 02:17.03 | brlcad | it'll output every command that corresponds to what it's showing |
| 02:17.24 | brlcad | the main menu actions, though, are a hybrid mix |
| 02:17.30 | Ralith | neat |
| 02:17.35 | Ralith | kk |
| 02:17.57 | brlcad | "press help" to get a list of built-in actions press supports |
| 02:18.56 | brlcad | if you "sed some_primitive" .. it goes into edit mode, with the faceplate gui enabled, you get a menu in the graphics context. you can run: press "Menu Option" to press most of the edit operations and run the "p" command or mouse edit from there |
| 02:19.46 | Ralith | sounds useful |
| 02:19.50 | Ralith | especially if I ever have to script something |
| 02:25.22 | brlcad | yep |
| 02:25.51 | brlcad | the mged quick reference card is a good starting point for learning what commands are available, and their categorization |
| 02:25.56 | brlcad | (tis on the website) |
| 02:26.38 | brlcad | ~botmail for mafm: http://www.ogre3d.org/docs/api/html/classOgre_1_1ManualObject.html .. looks like what we'd need for rendering wireframes/points manually |
| 02:27.50 | Ralith | Hm. In following the tutorials in the introduction to mged, it's apparent that the raytracer makes visible objects which are arguably hidden, such as the intersection between a two objects rendered along with the difference between two objects taken in both directions. |
| 02:27.54 | Ralith | Is this intentional? |
| 02:31.11 | brlcad | hm? |
| 02:32.37 | brlcad | what section/page? |
| 02:32.51 | Ralith | when you create a rcc, then a sph with a centerpoint on the center of the top of the rcc and a radius equal to that of the rcc, then render sph + rcc (an inverted dome) and sph - rcc (an upright dome) and rcc - sph (a cylinder with an inverted dome cutout) you can see a sliver of the sph + rcc. |
| 02:32.58 | Ralith | sec |
| 02:33.17 | brlcad | or screenshot |
| 02:33.17 | Ralith | pdf page 57 == real page 45 |
| 02:33.28 | Ralith | said sliver is visible both in the image in the pdf and in the actual rendering |
| 02:38.30 | brlcad | ah! I see what you're getting at |
| 02:39.27 | brlcad | they're not hidden, for that particular intersection it just numerically happens to work out that there is overlap on the tangency (which naturally extends all the way to the surface) |
| 02:40.12 | Ralith | tangency? |
| 02:40.46 | brlcad | where the cynlinder meets the sphere, it's perfectly tangent to the sphere's surface |
| 02:41.21 | brlcad | so there is a thin sliver of material there where they both exist on the exterior |
| 02:41.34 | Ralith | isn't that infinitely thin, though? |
| 02:41.40 | Ralith | and therefore invisible? |
| 02:41.51 | Ralith | or does the raytracer make approximations necessary for performance reasons? |
| 02:42.37 | brlcad | sure, that sliver's thickness numerically approaches being infinitely thin with inifinite precision arithmetic |
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| 02:43.15 | brlcad | but yes, performing infininte precision or even fixed precision is two-to-three orders of magnitude slower than floating point |
| 02:43.16 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 02:43.36 | Ralith | so it's proportional to the actual way the math is being performed. |
| 02:43.37 | Ralith | neat! |
| 02:43.50 | Ralith | thanks for the in-depth answer |
| 02:44.23 | brlcad | and for the sake of being a *solid* modeling engine and a solid model ray-tracer, you want all sements and objects have some real non-infinite thickness when sampled for analytic purposes |
| 02:44.34 | Ralith | I had no idea that that was the sort of place floating point imprecision became visible, but I guess if it's reasonable anywhere it's places like that. |
| 02:45.16 | Ralith | yeah, I thought it might actually be intentional for those reasons, but sacrificing accuracy because of that alone seemed strange. |
| 02:45.39 | brlcad | oh yeah, floating point precision can wreak absolute hell if it's not managed consistently and robust -- our librt library goes through extensive hoops to validate and do its best to stabilize the numerics |
| 02:57.29 | Ralith | the primitive selection menu appears to be broken in the latest release. |
| 02:57.44 | Ralith | when I click an item, the console gives this error: |
| 02:57.45 | Ralith | db_lookup(-n) failed: -n does not exist |
| 02:57.45 | Ralith | bgerror failed to handle background error. |
| 02:57.45 | Ralith | Original error: |
| 02:57.45 | Ralith | Error in bgerror: window name "_secErrorDialog" already exists in parent |
| 03:25.29 | Ralith | brlcad: any ideas? |
| 04:20.53 | Ralith | I can't work out how to do this on the command line, so it's blocking my use of brl-cad just as I was learning enough to do cool things :/ |
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| 18:47.46 | Ralith | anybody about? |
| 18:49.24 | Ralith | I'm getting progress-halting errors when progressing through the goblet tutorial |
| 18:52.06 | Ralith | Specifically, when I try to use the GUI primitive selection tool, I get the following errors (one is printed each time I click on a primitive in the list): http://codepad.org/YHA1WcK4 |
| 19:08.21 | Ralith | ah, *there's* the command line version. The gui bug is still annoying, though. |
| 19:15.46 | Ralith | also, occasionally the command window opens at a very small size. |
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| 20:32.57 | ``Erik | O.o |
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| 20:57.18 | brlcad | Ralith: howdy |
| 20:58.53 | brlcad | yeah, that's a known bug that happened in the latest release, you can either revert to a previous binary or .. |
| 20:59.03 | brlcad | follow the suggestion I mention here: http://sourceforge.net/forum/message.php?msg_id=5088783 |
| 21:16.04 | Ralith | cool, thank |
| 21:16.04 | Ralith | s |
| 21:44.42 | brlcad | dives into obscene quantities of sushi he picked up on the way home |
| 21:52.21 | ``Erik | heh |
| 21:52.26 | ``Erik | that tofi place? |
| 22:27.04 | Ralith | mm, sushi |
| 22:45.49 | brlcad | yeah, pretty decent |
| 22:46.06 | brlcad | huge thick pieces of sashimi |
| 22:46.48 | Ralith | I need to get more good sushi |
| 22:46.56 | Ralith | standard store stuff sucks |
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| 11:33.11 | GTrax | ?? |
| 11:36.11 | GTrax | Ah well - it's Sunday. Maybe not too many are indoors :) |
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| 12:33.41 | homovulgaris | brlcad: just read the irc logs :P "just a gsoc student" ;) |
| 12:40.40 | homovulgaris | libged breaking the build on gcc |
| 12:43.04 | homovulgaris | ged_private.h some static - nostatic trouble with ged_persp_mat function |
| 12:43.23 | homovulgaris | and Sean, did u see the boost_base doubt i had asked ? |
| 12:45.08 | homovulgaris | one more build doubt, I am including certain C headers in solver_test.cpp , it seems i have to manually specify -I../other/tcl/generic to (CPPFLAGS) for the tcl.h location |
| 12:45.25 | homovulgaris | whats the right method rather than this blind include ? |
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| 14:48.56 | ``Erik | um, that may be out of sync with the, uh, actual tcl being used. There should be something like $(TCL_CPPFLAGS) in your CFLAGS or CPPFLAGS in Makefile.am |
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| 15:00.51 | homovulgaris | TCL_CPPFLAGS is there in AM_CPPFLAGS but maybe i should add it to the individual binary as well ( in this case solver_test_CPPFLAGS ) .. hmm |
| 15:02.59 | homovulgaris | Erik, have u seen the bu_list example in bu.h . shouldn't there be a bu_free(my_entry) bu_free(new_entry) etc ? or does freeing the main list using bu_free free all the allocated memory ? |
| 15:06.33 | ``Erik | remove your .o file, try making it again, and look at the build line? |
| 15:07.00 | ``Erik | uhmmmm, I'd have to dig into that :/ |
| 15:08.04 | ``Erik | look at line ~510 of bu.h |
| 15:08.18 | ``Erik | does that help? |
| 15:11.14 | starseeker_ | forgot how ungodly long it takes to build VTK... |
| 15:14.24 | homovulgaris | Erik, adding TCL_CPPFLAGS to the binary_CPPFLAGS worked :) i dont like tcl |
| 15:16.08 | ``Erik | :D |
| 15:16.41 | ``Erik | tcl has some good and bad aspects to it... personally, i'd favor embedding lithp or thcheme, perhaps ruby or python these days |
| 15:22.00 | homovulgaris | lots of projects happening in python these days.. :) i still like C and C++ mostly :) |
| 15:22.15 | homovulgaris | there is something allergic about java |
| 15:25.58 | ``Erik | once java finishes going open source, it may be semi-acceptable |
| 15:26.40 | ``Erik | python and ruby seem to be the big flashy new ones, though |
| 15:27.01 | homovulgaris | bbut over the past 5 or 6 years there has been so much code base in java.. I mean lots of application software being written in it.. |
| 15:27.04 | ``Erik | seems like python is a favorite of the linux world and ruby is a favorite of the bsd world heh |
| 15:27.21 | homovulgaris | ruby rox :) |
| 15:27.33 | homovulgaris | and i am from the linux world :P |
| 15:27.37 | ``Erik | yeah, businesses like it, but it's a royal pain to install on, say, fbsd.... not wroth the hassle |
| 15:27.44 | ``Erik | worth |
| 15:27.52 | ``Erik | due to licensing issues |
| 15:27.56 | ``Erik | (java, that is) |
| 15:28.37 | homovulgaris | even in sectors like bioinformatics.. i mean gene analysis etc. is done mostly using perl but so much of their visulization and other code is in Java .. |
| 15:29.00 | homovulgaris | at least in academia and science they should stick to open source completely as a policy decision |
| 15:30.05 | ``Erik | schools here in the US used to push c++, and moved to java as I was leaving (mostly due to marketting, I believe) |
| 15:30.14 | ``Erik | a lot of the c++ was msvc and windows based, though |
| 15:30.52 | ``Erik | the notion of teaching scheme, or using a fbsd.. a lot of the wuss students thought it was stupid and irrelevant (they were looking for a vocational "programming" approach, not computer science) |
| 15:31.34 | ``Erik | and schools feel pressure to put out what the industry wants, and the industry feels pressured to move towards what the schools are pushing out, so suns JZOMFGJAVA! blitz campaigning was... highly effective :) |
| 15:31.39 | homovulgaris | In india the universities push c++, but lots of training institutes , polytechnics and so on pushing java, since it fetches jobs :) |
| 15:31.55 | homovulgaris | huge outsourcing industry in India providing technology support in Java i guess :P |
| 15:32.36 | ``Erik | yeah... *glare* :D |
| 15:32.57 | homovulgaris | at that time i guess they pushed the PORTABILITY thing so much .. and i guess in the end it is not that portable anyways :) bsd for instance |
| 15:33.43 | ``Erik | no, java is not portable at all, it runs binaries made for the java ABI, the "portable" aspect is that there are emulators for that machine available for a few OS/arch platforms |
| 15:34.11 | ``Erik | and even those tend to be fractured (even suns reference versions), so the popular snipe is "write once, debug everywhere" |
| 15:34.26 | homovulgaris | i always find the VM idea a roundabout approach to getting things done.. :P |
| 15:35.13 | homovulgaris | Sun has an ambassador in our university , trying to get students to use solaris more :) |
| 15:50.58 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31804 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/vutil.c: static mismatch |
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| 16:28.13 | Axman6 | homovulgaris: there's a small group at ours who put on the occasional talk. i get free solaris DVD's, so i'm happy |
| 16:40.30 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31805 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ell/ell.c: commenting out code obsolete due to pc_pc_set modification |
| 16:41.09 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31806 10/brlcad/trunk/include/pc.h: Macros for pc_pc_set initialization, push, and free |
| 16:43.01 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31807 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: modification of pc_pc_set : using bu_list in pc_param and pc_constrnt structures |
| 16:45.50 | homovulgaris | Axman6: ;) Yeah pretty much the same deal here.. ocassional talks, demonstrations etc.. :) |
| 16:50.03 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31808 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcParser.h: addition of pcVariable and pcConstraint grammar structs and Parser class definition |
| 16:55.56 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31809 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am solver_test.cpp): Testing pc_pc_set modifications and Parser::parse() |
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| 17:30.45 | jonored | Hello. I've a question: is there something in BRL-CAD that would be the equivalent of a macro in Lisp? What I mean is, is there some way of, rather than programmatically generating a shape by building an external program, writing the result to a database file, loading it in, etc. and redoing that process if something changes, of just embedding a (small) script into a model, and having the information that script is run with kept in the |
| 17:31.39 | jonored | So, for instance, I could write a macro that generates an involute gear, and would be able change the number of teeth on a gear by just modifying its definition? |
| 17:32.42 | jonored | I know that there are some features like that, but they seem like they lose information such that either the model is no longer the preferred form for editing of the design, or you have to redo work every time a definition changes. |
| 17:33.06 | archivist | shape and body of a gear is not as constant as tooth shape |
| 17:34.24 | archivist | and low number gears have differently shaped teeth |
| 17:34.59 | jonored | I'm mostly saying a gear as an example. |
| 17:36.41 | jonored | Although I'd be surprised if it weren't possible to encode the variations over a useful range - what I want would be more than a simple pattern. |
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| 17:54.07 | jonored_ | ...and the router goes away and I don't notice. did I miss replies? |
| 17:54.42 | archivist | no |
| 17:55.51 | jonored_ | ...okay. Does wanting something like that make sense, at least (even if it'd be challenging to do for that example)? |
| 17:56.31 | archivist | it does (i do it in SolodWorks) |
| 17:57.24 | archivist | parametric parts (driven by an axcel table) |
| 17:57.29 | archivist | excel |
| 17:58.15 | jonored_ | Okay. The other two questions associated with that are then whether it's there in BRL-CAD, and whether it'd be a reasonable addition (for me to work on, I mean.) |
| 18:03.22 | homovulgaris | parametric parts :) well once libpc works out well we shouldnt need solidworks |
| 18:03.38 | homovulgaris | but it is still at baby steps |
| 18:03.51 | archivist | waiting to jump ship :)) |
| 18:04.47 | jonored_ | libpc? |
| 18:05.01 | homovulgaris | parametrics and constraints library.. |
| 18:05.22 | jonored_ | facepalms. |
| 18:05.47 | jonored_ | Not in the tarball for users yet? |
| 18:05.51 | archivist | homovulgaris, will it have rotations on axis eg gearing |
| 18:06.26 | homovulgaris | jonored_: it is in the svn. but far from the actual requirements of parametric parts. |
| 18:06.54 | homovulgaris | archivist: what exactly would rotations on an axis involve ? positioning dependent on an axis ? |
| 18:07.37 | archivist | I rotate gear a and all related gears(and assemlies) rotate |
| 18:07.48 | homovulgaris | first phase of constraints would be implementations such as is_tangent or is_perpendicular and so on.. |
| 18:08.23 | homovulgaris | well i think the rotation of interconnected gears could be specified as a set of constraints |
| 18:08.37 | jonored_ | I'll check it out and take a look anyways; perhaps I can find a way to be helpful. |
| 18:08.51 | archivist | its really nice to put a mouse pointer on a gear push it and the mechanism moves as it should |
| 18:09.18 | homovulgaris | archivist: almost like physics simulation ;) |
| 18:09.24 | archivist | yesum |
| 18:09.26 | homovulgaris | and yep in the end that is pretty much the idea |
| 18:10.24 | homovulgaris | rotation of gears is basically a sort of relation between a controlling rotation of one gear and change in the orientation of the rest according to change in the orientation of the control gear right. |
| 18:10.45 | homovulgaris | It just needs to be parametrized in terms of teeth number and so on. |
| 18:11.16 | archivist | yes except some reversal and if one is fixed then the housing moves |
| 18:11.48 | archivist | but all should work out as you get the idea |
| 18:12.33 | homovulgaris | jonored_: right now i have just started writing the parser for parsing constraint expressions.. and by constraints i mean stuff like "radius<3" A "tangent to" B and so on "position of sph.centre is on the cube" and so on |
| 18:12.43 | archivist | my last job here was a sun and planet gear assembly |
| 18:13.52 | homovulgaris | archivist: hmm.. in terms of libpc , the question really would be how do we extract those relationships, i mean i cannot expect the user to specify mathematical relationship between orientation ( rotation angles) |
| 18:14.37 | homovulgaris | I will have to derive them using some simple point/teeth contact constraint between the gear parts |
| 18:15.03 | jonored_ | I seem to remember doing almost that kind of specification with Pro-E, just with selecting specific sorts of relationships. |
| 18:15.32 | archivist | that depend how the user is prompted, I add a gear mate betweent two gears ans specify the numbers and direction if the program guesses incorrectly |
| 18:16.00 | homovulgaris | and jonored_ the gear teeth number change, well theoretically , that sort of thing should be possible using libpc and sketch system |
| 18:16.36 | archivist | the mate is on the axis not the teeth in solidworks |
| 18:16.44 | homovulgaris | basically teeth angle radius etc. being interrelated |
| 18:16.53 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 18:17.11 | archivist | could be pulleys and belts |
| 18:17.31 | archivist | or chain wheels |
| 18:17.51 | homovulgaris | yeah get the idea, oh.. so u set relationships between axes, |
| 18:17.59 | homovulgaris | specify rotation ratio |
| 18:18.07 | archivist | yes |
| 18:18.29 | homovulgaris | well that could be implemented .. no need for comlex derivations from teeth contact blah blah :) |
| 18:18.30 | jonored_ | *nod*. Although I'd still like a way for things like at least the invocation part of things like the wall generator/plant generator/tire generator to be kept in the model file. |
| 18:19.27 | archivist | contact type is also useful for special types of mechanical motion |
| 18:19.53 | homovulgaris | currently and as per plan, libpc will be storing the constraints in the .g file only.. u would be able to invoke it using "yet to be implemented" constraint editing commands.. |
| 18:20.06 | homovulgaris | well in this case parameter editing commands.. pretty much the same.. |
| 18:21.01 | jonored_ | Is there a programming language embedded? |
| 18:21.07 | homovulgaris | contact type would be a bit tough, computationally i mean , if you are dealing with two ranges of points.. |
| 18:21.35 | homovulgaris | jonored_: programming language ? in libpc ? |
| 18:21.55 | homovulgaris | if u mean a method of expressing relations, i am implementing a grammar using boost::spirit |
| 18:22.33 | jonored_ | Would I be able to specify an arbitrary computable shape (provided that it is definable with the primitives that BRL-CAD has) from a set of paramaters? |
| 18:24.09 | homovulgaris | with primitives that BRL-CAD has and representation of how the parameters are related to primitives and each other yes.. |
| 18:25.01 | jonored_ | ...Then I do believe that there is a programming language there in some form or another. Cool :) |
| 18:26.42 | homovulgaris | but ur idea of adding scripts to the objects is nice.. |
| 18:27.10 | homovulgaris | maybe brlcad (Sean) would have more to say about this :) |
| 18:28.22 | archivist | with a part on screen I select properties and select one of my preset configurations and the gear redraws to the new shape and no of teeth |
| 18:32.00 | homovulgaris | implementation-wise it would be an addition to the property object i guess , or if they already have something like construct_from_parameters just a call to it ? |
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| 18:32.34 | homovulgaris | s/property object/object property :P |
| 18:33.19 | jonored_ | It's essentially the same thing - just an imperative language to the declarative one you're writing. |
| 18:33.54 | homovulgaris | jonored_: the present database system does not have any method of including code, it only has mostly geometric and a few non-geometric object types |
| 18:38.17 | jonored_ | i'd be surprised if there'd be much difference between adding constraints and adding imperative code, though. |
| 18:48.36 | homovulgaris | hmm.. i am still unable to visualize the workflow (implementation wise) for the imperative case |
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| 18:52.39 | homovulgaris | Ralith: I checked out reprap.. awesome stuff .. hoping to make my rapid prototyper soon.. maybe september :) |
| 18:52.44 | jonored_ | For defining macros it basically dumps the user straight to the assumption of being a script programmer; I don't know any way of getting as much power as you get that way without that. For the user of a script, it'd probably look a bit like using a primitive - tell it that the definition is by this macro, and that here are the parameters to the macro, and there's a shape there. I'd want to have it so that the macro can take geometry a |
| 18:54.22 | homovulgaris | yeah scripting support is provided in most applications right.. like catvba for catia , rhinoscript and so on.. ;) i worked on catvba for around 6 months last year |
| 18:54.28 | homovulgaris | i am not sure but probably we already have a tcl interface.. |
| 18:54.47 | homovulgaris | dunno what all features it supports |
| 18:57.04 | homovulgaris | jonored_: and these macros would be stored as a separate file ? |
| 18:57.46 | homovulgaris | like in catia for example , it is stored as a separate .catvba file |
| 18:58.49 | jonored_ | There are reasons to do both; on the one hand, if you send someone a model, you want it to be possible to edit the definitions of stuff in the model, on the other hand, you want it to be easy to get them from a library, because more people would be using them than writing them. |
| 19:00.56 | jonored_ | The main thing (to me) is that they'd get run when their inputs are changed, without needing the user to invoke them explicitly and redo work in the model. |
| 19:02.27 | brlcad | tunes in |
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| 19:03.02 | homovulgaris | hmm.. so ideally they should support both insertion into file as well as independent existence.. and indeed without generated geometry life would be tough in any cad application :) |
| 19:03.11 | homovulgaris | brlcad is the man :) |
| 19:03.13 | brlcad | reads backlog |
| 19:03.36 | poolio | errr |
| 19:03.40 | SlickT10 | asdf |
| 19:03.50 | poolio | brlcad: Could you help me think through some basic dumb geometry math when you get a chance? |
| 19:04.31 | poolio | Trying to think of the best way to compute a rectangle that encloses the face given the points and the plane equation |
| 19:07.34 | jonored_ | Fills the same sort of role as the parameterization, I think, just as explicit steps rather than implicit constraints. The differences are mostly to do with speed of the code (because the constraint version needs to run a solver - which might be better or worse than what a person might write in terms of getting it done), and expressiveness - some things are easier to think of as constraints, some as steps. |
| 19:09.35 | homovulgaris | hmm.. true.. I am planning on spending quite some time optimizing the solver once i finish the basic framework that is.. and expressing step wise generation of geometry would be a bit twisted in terms of constraints.. |
| 19:09.37 | brlcad | howdy jonored_ |
| 19:10.28 | jonored_ | hullo |
| 19:10.35 | brlcad | libpc will ultimately be central to any long-term implementation of fully parametric geometry, but it's also worth noting that a fair bit of that is already possible too |
| 19:11.05 | homovulgaris | but would the macro interface look much different from using mk_* () ? like mk_sph mk_ell and so on.. basically macros could add a layer on top of them to do some additional calculation to generate their arguments from the parameters |
| 19:11.17 | brlcad | via libwdb, you can write procedural database generators (in C) that are, of course, hard-coded but entirely parametric from an input perspective |
| 19:12.01 | brlcad | this has also been done in Tcl directly in mged before, where there were tcl objects defined for a given .g such that the modeler could store the routine in the .g and invoke it as needed to create geometry |
| 19:12.37 | brlcad | what you're suggesting is also very much closely related to the last primitives idea at http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 19:13.10 | brlcad | where it becomes a full-fledged new primitive with inboard or outboard script storage that gets evaluated at run-time (per constraints or whatever) |
| 19:14.11 | brlcad | poolio: possibly in a bit :) |
| 19:14.20 | Ralith | homovulgaris: cool, me too |
| 19:15.02 | brlcad | Ralith: how goes the tutorializing? |
| 19:15.21 | Ralith | brlcad: great; I'm onto #15 today |
| 19:16.13 | Ralith | libpc is that SoC project? |
| 19:16.30 | poolio | brlcad: ping me when you've got time :) |
| 19:17.05 | jonored_ | brlcad: That does sound like /exactly/ what I'm talking about. The generators in C are what I was aware of, but inconvenient - especially to a lisp programmer. |
| 19:17.34 | Ralith | jonored_: I bet you could wrap the C api in lisp |
| 19:18.47 | jonored_ | Ralith: It occurs to me that that statement has two possible meanings - I was meaning that it's inconvenient to someone who is accustomed to extending their language's compiler as he sees fit while writing his program, not as a wish to write generators in Lisp. |
| 19:18.53 | brlcad | Ralith: yeah, one of our four projects: http://brlcad.org/d/node/23 |
| 19:19.58 | Ralith | jonored_: I'm not quite sure I follow. Doesn't lisp, like most languages, have some mechanism for accessing C libraries, which can then be wrapped to make the interface more clean and lispy? |
| 19:20.33 | brlcad | jonored_: now one side effect of mged's built-in scriptability is that you can use pretty much ANY language to write "mged scripts" .. doesn't get you parameterized geometry nor a high-level api nor state management, but it does let you do just about anything you can do in mged from a given arbitrary language -- there's an example on the website .. (digs) |
| 19:21.01 | jonored_ | Ralith: Oh, easily - but I was meaning that I wanted an idea from lisp in brl-cad, not that I wanted to use lisp for brl-cad. |
| 19:21.11 | Ralith | oh, ok |
| 19:21.13 | brlcad | here's an example of mged scripted with about 3 different I/O approaches using simple posix shell scripting: http://brlcad.org/wiki/SGI_Cube |
| 19:21.25 | jonored_ | because it's essentially /the/ idea that makes lisp really powerful. |
| 19:21.39 | brlcad | generates some geometry and renders it |
| 19:22.19 | brlcad | once our new libged library is complete (which is at the heart of ALL mged commands), the plan is to swigify the whole thing so that you can access a consistent command layer from any language |
| 19:22.27 | homovulgaris | Ralith: yep libpc is a SoC project.. :) |
| 19:22.28 | brlcad | (directly, instead of indirectly) |
| 19:22.43 | Ralith | homovulgaris: yeah, brlcad provided the link |
| 19:23.04 | Ralith | (you must have a database of handy descriptive links on hand or something) |
| 19:23.06 | homovulgaris | just saw :) |
| 19:27.15 | brlcad | Ralith: not really |
| 19:27.36 | brlcad | just know where the stuff is on the website |
| 19:27.46 | brlcad | there's a heck of a lot more ;) |
| 19:27.53 | Ralith | yeah, I've been browsing |
| 19:31.12 | brlcad | and a ton of stuff not even uploaded yet |
| 19:44.12 | homovulgaris | brlcad: :) my boost_base doubt :D |
| 19:51.20 | brlcad | homovulgaris: que? |
| 19:51.35 | brlcad | oh, a question you had? |
| 19:56.55 | brlcad | homovulgaris: hmm.. you totally should not have needed to wrap the includes in extern "C" .. if there are decls in our headers that need wrapping, they should get fixed instead of adding a work-around |
| 20:02.31 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 21:32.12 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.40.80) | |
| 21:34.39 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 21:35.32 | Ralith | hullo |
| 21:36.26 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 21:36.42 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 21:36.49 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 21:47.00 | brlcad | starseeker_: iqtest.dk is the site I was talking about, fun stuff ;) |
| 22:05.29 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31810 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/ (9 files): regression test typo, refer to the variable instead of some invalid var expansion so that hopefully mged will find tcl/tk if we're regression testing |
| 22:20.10 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31811 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: ignore dsp's with no data source a little more gracefully instead of bombing |
| 22:21.08 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31812 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Fixed point lists and path lists allocation and deallocation. Each point hit is now stored in a path list. This will be useful for path tracing. |
| 22:23.45 | homovulgaris | brlcad: checked without extern "C" .. works fine :) |
| 22:28.07 | homovulgaris | and the boost_base doubt.. |
| 22:28.11 | homovulgaris | 11:08.17homovulgarisbtw, i wanted to use the ax_boost_base.m4 macro i added using something like this addition to the configure.ac http://rafb.net/p/v3tpKU36.html |
| 22:28.11 | homovulgaris | 11:08.42homovulgarisbut it gives some trouble while configuring in tcl saying LDFLAGS was not set during the last run |
| 22:28.11 | homovulgaris | 11:09.07homovulgarisis there something additional i have to do other than adding the macro to m4 dir and the code to configure.ac |
| 22:28.22 | alex_joni | brlcad: that was quite fun (the iqtest.dk site..) |
| 22:28.47 | homovulgaris | i think i will have to modify the macro probably ? |
| 22:29.38 | poolio | alex_joni: I just took it too :P how'd you do? |
| 22:30.06 | alex_joni | 133.. but I didn't have nerve to really answer the last couple of questions |
| 22:30.34 | alex_joni | still had about 20 minutes left :) .. but it's 1am here |
| 22:30.40 | alex_joni | so I'm off to bed ;) |
| 22:31.55 | alex_joni | poolio: u? |
| 22:32.28 | poolio | alex_joni: 126, I got frustrated and didnt do the last few as well. I didn't see the pattern and went "arghhhhhhh" |
| 22:33.25 | alex_joni | haha :) |
| 22:33.28 | alex_joni | maybe one day :P |
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| 23:14.55 | homovulgaris | 4.44 am :) time to sleep |
| 23:15.27 | homovulgaris | will write a good grammar tomorrow |
| 23:33.21 | brlcad | homovulgaris: there's nothing additional you have to do other than blowing away the automake/autoconf caches assuming there are no problems with the m4 itself |
| 23:38.46 | brlcad | andrecastelo: something to keep in mind, at some point you'll want to optimize it so that there are no malloc/free (e.g. bu_calloc, BU_GETSTRUCT, etc) calls occurring during ray-trace (prep is fine, viewstart/viewend is fine) |
| 23:39.31 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that will generally result in a substantial performance hit .. and given you're writing a path-tracer, you'll want to keep an eye on performance very early on |
| 23:40.25 | brlcad | since you'll ultimately be shooting billions of rays (or more) per image |
| 23:45.41 | andrecastelo | hmm, i understand.. but how can I do that?? something like how scanline is treated? |
| 23:46.23 | andrecastelo | allocate a big array in the beginning.. ?? |
| 00:17.25 | brlcad | yeah, can use a pre-allocated memory pool, reuse allocations no longer needed, etc |
| 00:17.25 | brlcad | can allow allocations, but do them in huge chunks at a time to minimize the system calls to just a handful (e.g. 64MB at a time as needed) |
| 00:20.41 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31813 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: clean up the warning messages |
| 00:24.41 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) | |
| 01:14.48 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31814 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (11 files): include cleanup -- common.h should come before _all_ system headers in order to ensure portability (and type wrapping and macro behavior) when compiling |
| 01:49.35 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31815 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (8 files): (log message trimmed) |
| 01:49.37 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: style and formatting are only issues when they are completely disregarded.. |
| 01:49.39 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: please be more careful/consistent with the style guide. much of these changes |
| 01:49.41 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: aren't even self-consistent within a single function. use space after commas |
| 01:49.43 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: and intrinsic keywords (if, while, for) but not after functions or within |
| 01:49.45 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: parens; prefer spaces around operators (especially for streams). whitespace and |
| 01:49.51 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: indents also seem to be horribly inconsistent (run sh/ws.sh and sh/indent.sh if |
| 01:51.18 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31816 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: align the followup info |
| 01:53.34 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 03:06.34 | starseeker_ | figures either his computer has gotten slower or software has gotten harder to compile since the last time he rebuilt everything |
| 03:06.41 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 03:14.10 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:14.49 | yukonbob | disables his covert daemons running on starseeker's puter. |
| 03:17.12 | starseeker_ | yukonbob: heh - in reality, I can't fault my machine |
| 03:17.33 | starseeker_ | the world rebuild totaled over 1000 packages, including things like VTK, Paraview, KDE, and Blender |
| 03:18.40 | Ralith | blender isn't a big build |
| 03:19.00 | Ralith | I'd be more worried about firefox |
| 03:19.09 | jonored | starseeker_: gentoo? |
| 03:19.16 | starseeker_ | Yep, gentoo |
| 03:19.38 | starseeker_ | hadn't done a kernel upgrade in a couple years, was finally noticing potential issues |
| 03:19.55 | starseeker_ | so did the big jump - world upgrade |
| 03:20.02 | jonored | Same. PII toughbook - full rebuilds take a something like a week or two... :) |
| 03:20.09 | starseeker_ | ow |
| 03:20.18 | starseeker_ | is better off than that, at least... |
| 03:20.29 | starseeker_ | I wimped out on openoffice though |
| 03:20.46 | starseeker_ | that's a full day just to build it, assuming it works |
| 03:21.02 | starseeker_ | considering I just need it for the odd office doc anyway... |
| 03:21.09 | jonored | Ick. Glad I avoid office-like software... wvHtml for me :) |
| 03:21.38 | poolio | Debian ftw ;) |
| 03:21.43 | starseeker_ | heh. Once in a while you can't avoid the .doc format - some businesses speak only .doc |
| 03:22.16 | starseeker_ | never quit got the hand of doing development on Debian - I'm sure there was some "always install the friggin dev packages" option but I didn't find it |
| 03:22.45 | jonored | probably will need to use it at some point after school, but for the moment I'm just reading them - so converting them out of .doc works reasonably well. |
| 03:22.52 | poolio | starseeker_: hmm, I've never had an issue other than the broken libtool stuff |
| 03:22.57 | starseeker_ | as a result, compiling anything was always a game of "ok, which dev package do I still need..." |
| 03:23.10 | starseeker_ | poolio: It's been years, so I would have to revisit it |
| 03:23.41 | starseeker_ | Gentoo has always been good even for weird scientific stuff and lisp implementations |
| 03:23.48 | poolio | starseeker_: heh, there's still a little bit of that if you're compiling stuff, but it's not that difficult...and the time it takes to sort out the dependencies is far less than the time it would take for gentoo to compile them |
| 03:24.43 | starseeker_ | poolio: Oh, sure :-). But at least on gentoo it's automated - I can let the build go overnight. So far I've not met a Debian install that's smart enough to go find the dev packages |
| 03:24.47 | jonored | polio: I would suggest that that does depend on machine, and on whether you're doing development on a package you've already installed once. |
| 03:25.02 | starseeker_ | is always compiling weird stuff... |
| 03:26.13 | starseeker_ | It's driving me nuts. I want to recompile BRL-CAD and start a proc-db, but I don't dare until I'm sure my system is done putting itself back together |
| 03:26.48 | starseeker_ | It'll be interesting to see if the iges-g crash still behaves the same... |
| 03:27.48 | starseeker_ | still wants to try a Fourth -> Lisp bootstrap someday, unless it turns out going straight to Lisp is easier/just as hard... |
| 03:28.45 | starseeker_ | alright, sleep |
| 03:29.07 | jonored | ...Fourth->Lisp? a simple Scheme wouldn't take that much to build up and would be quite sufficient for building any lisp you'd want... |
| 03:29.27 | jonored | g'night :) |
| 03:29.57 | Ralith | starseeker_: proc-db? |
| 03:30.02 | Ralith | jonored: also, toughbook? awesome! |
| 03:30.37 | jonored | Ralith: CF-27, with some modifications and a strap to carry it nestled on my back with. |
| 03:30.52 | Ralith | I want a toughbook. |
| 03:30.59 | Ralith | Sadly, I want up to date hardware more. |
| 03:31.04 | Ralith | (also, some money left over) |
| 03:31.42 | jonored | *Nod*. There's the occasional newish ones that are not terribly much - my girlfriend got a CF-19 for $1000 off of craigslist... |
| 03:32.20 | Ralith | wow. |
| 03:32.27 | Ralith | didn't think stuff worth anything ever showed up there |
| 03:33.09 | jonored | which is just a bit absurd. A fully rugged tablet PC with a modern (albeit crazy-low-power) processor is kinda impressive. |
| 03:35.02 | Ralith | yeah |
| 03:35.09 | yukonbob | starseeker_: how do you like paraview? |
| 03:35.44 | Ralith | what *is* paraview |
| 03:38.01 | yukonbob | data visualization -- used in FEM, medical, others... |
| 03:38.28 | yukonbob | cmake is the build system that spawned from that project... |
| 03:41.22 | Ralith | oo |
| 03:41.38 | starseeker_ | proc-db - a tool in BRL-CAD for generating models |
| 03:41.51 | starseeker_ | brlcad's fence routine is a good example |
| 03:42.04 | jonored | Ralith: So you know, we ran into two similar systems in our area <=$1100. It would seem that it's surprisingly effective to get the beasties - Perhaps it's time for me to upgrade. |
| 03:42.13 | starseeker_ | yukonbob: Can't say I've used paraview much, actually |
| 03:42.18 | starseeker_ | not yet anyway |
| 03:42.50 | starseeker_ | jonored: It's an interesting question. Forth has the property of being easy (relatively speaking) to bootstrap on cool hardware |
| 03:43.04 | starseeker_ | jonored: I don't know how scheme would do in such circumstances |
| 03:43.25 | starseeker_ | er cold hardware - nothing but machine/assembly language available |
| 03:44.33 | starseeker_ | For the sake of verifiability all the way through the software stack, being able to do a true "cold", from the metal bootstrap is actually important. |
| 03:45.01 | starseeker_ | Even though no one does that anymore, and probably haven't for 40 years except as a hobby... |
| 03:45.28 | starseeker_ | has a knack for nutty ideas... |
| 03:46.11 | jonored | starseeker_: Scheme has impressively few primitives - something like seven or eight fundamental ones and you really want to implement some of the other stuff like arithmetic. I've looked at setting up one for a microcontroller.. much of the complexity comes from the extensible compiler. |
| 03:47.16 | jonored | but then, some of it doesn't mesh well with some hardware - like the not having a standard stack thing. |
| 03:47.26 | starseeker_ | Hmm. How much machine/assembly code would you estimate it would take? |
| 03:49.09 | jonored | That I'm not sure of; wanting to do it was associated with my major qualifying project, and it didn't seem a good idea to pursue concurrant with trying to make a UAV fly. |
| 03:49.43 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 03:49.46 | starseeker_ | point |
| 04:33.13 | Ralith | jonored: I'd ask you to grab me one if I had the money lying around. |
| 04:34.44 | Ralith | also, what kind of UAV? |
| 05:22.19 | jonored | One quadrotor design (four fixed-blades in a square), the other a more normal-looking miniature helicopter. Never got very far - Prof said I wasn't allowed to do the controls side, and the aerospace people who were the rest of the team took so long to do it I couldn't get the programming done before the project ended. |
| 05:22.59 | jonored | (er, fixed-pitch blades.) |
| 05:37.48 | Ralith | that's a shame. |
| 05:38.26 | Ralith | but, uh, what's abnormal about a four-bladed heli? |
| 05:39.38 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-158.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 05:43.05 | jonored | Rather than having one motor and controlling attitude and thrust primarily by varying the angle of the blades, it has four motors with solid props on them out on booms and controls itself by varying the speed at which each prop is spinning. |
| 05:45.20 | Ralith | ooh |
| 05:45.21 | Ralith | neat |
| 05:45.34 | Ralith | sounds mechanically simpler, too |
| 05:46.18 | Ralith | now I want to build one :/ |
| 05:47.18 | jonored | And control-wise more of a headache. To go sideways you have to turn up one side and turn the other down, and then reverse that torque before the thing flips over, and do the reverse to stop it going sideways... |
| 05:47.44 | jonored | but much of that is actually common to both. |
| 05:49.32 | Ralith | it's easier to handle things in software than in hardware |
| 05:50.33 | Ralith | and I'd imagine you could keep yourself mostly safe by setting up a software governor that'd ensure no matter what any other bits told it to do, it always remained mostly upright |
| 05:50.53 | Ralith | of course, that would preculde really cool maneuvers, but those are generally beyond the scope of a UAV anyway. |
| 05:51.01 | Ralith | how were you planning on powering it? |
| 05:51.21 | jonored | Sometimes. Sometimes not. It's a lot easier to do precise positioning with a set of linear axes than with a roomba. That's basically what the control scheme we were aiming for did - use nested saturation functions to keep what it's doing sane. |
| 05:52.32 | Ralith | hm, I bet you could simplify the control issue by physically angling all of the rotors so the pointed inwards something under 45 degrees from vertical |
| 05:52.51 | Ralith | that way it'd strafe in the direction of any prop putting displacing less air |
| 05:53.00 | Ralith | s/putting// |
| 05:53.43 | Ralith | you'd sacrifice some energy for that conveniences, of course |
| 05:54.00 | jonored | Power was from a fairly gigantic lithium ion polymer battery. I want to say it was rated for something like 40A, with a 4 amp-hour capacity... and four little brushless motors that spin the props such that you're convinced they'd take a finger off if you let them. Scary to have the thing spin up. |
| 05:54.25 | Ralith | that must have been pretty powerful if it could lift a heavy battery like that |
| 05:54.27 | jonored | eleven volts coming off the battery. |
| 05:54.29 | Ralith | I *really* want one of these |
| 05:54.42 | Ralith | how long could it stay in the air? |
| 05:54.46 | jonored | lipoly batteries are crazy light, though. |
| 05:54.49 | Ralith | also, altitude ceiling? |
| 05:55.36 | jonored | Don't know - project ended too soon after they got me their control stuff, and awkwardness with not having sufficient computing power to run the control scheme they wanted on the microcontroller. |
| 05:56.03 | Ralith | surely swapping in a more powerful controller wasn't that big a deal |
| 05:56.11 | Ralith | I mean, a project like that would need a big budget already |
| 05:56.43 | jonored | We went over. it's something like $300 per person for those projects. |
| 05:56.56 | Ralith | how large a team? |
| 05:57.30 | jonored | Six and six, I think. I was sorta in the middle and the only one who could write code. |
| 05:57.44 | Ralith | that must've sucked |
| 05:57.47 | jonored | (Two projects.) |
| 05:58.56 | Ralith | I have to build myself one of these things; it sounds remarkably affordable. |
| 05:59.22 | Ralith | was this a univ course project, something professional, or what? |
| 05:59.42 | jonored | Yeah, rather did. Didn't help arguing with the aerospace engineers that any accelerometers we could get weren't going to magically differentiate between gravity and acceleration... |
| 06:00.07 | jonored | University, ours has something like a thesis for undergraduates. |
| 06:01.31 | Ralith | I wish there was some entity out there that would happily give out a few thousand dollars to people just for the sake of building cool stuff |
| 06:02.55 | Ralith | I'd think with an aircraft like that you'd be able to do some neat hacks |
| 06:03.32 | Ralith | it's going to be mostly upright most of the time, so if you assume relatively still air, you could mount a laser rangefinder aimed straight down |
| 06:03.46 | Ralith | it'd get easily confused at higher altitudes, though |
| 06:04.18 | jonored | There are people doing that sort of thing. It's surprisingly awkward getting one to know where it is if you can't just stick a GPS module on it. A sonar module also is an option; we were trying for an indoor device, so that seemed reasonable. |
| 06:05.12 | Ralith | sound-based rangefinding would be iffy |
| 06:05.19 | Ralith | who knows what sort of surface it would end up above |
| 06:05.40 | jonored | For us, floor, mostly. But other things yes. |
| 06:06.12 | Ralith | yeah, but floor can be all sorts of things |
| 06:06.18 | Ralith | from concrete to shag carpet |
| 06:06.25 | Ralith | which can't be good for sonar. |
| 06:07.04 | jonored | True. |
| 06:07.05 | Ralith | if you want to get more creative here's an idea |
| 06:07.14 | Ralith | this one only works outside, but eh |
| 06:07.17 | Ralith | take a laser rangefinder |
| 06:07.37 | Ralith | aim it horizontally at a spinning 45 degree mirror with an encoder so you know where the mirror's pointed |
| 06:07.52 | Ralith | then estimate the location of the horizons on both side based on when the range given goes to infinity |
| 06:08.04 | Ralith | this should give you pretty accurate orientation information in anything but heavy fog |
| 06:09.56 | jonored | Would be reasonable, yes. Outside is, surprisingly enough, easier to deal with than inside. Among other things, you can get a location and velocity in a fixed coordinate frame to within a few meters with a small, easy device... |
| 06:10.05 | Ralith | heheh |
| 06:10.24 | Ralith | inside you could do a similar thing, except aim the assembly downwards |
| 06:10.42 | Ralith | it wouldn't be so useful for orientation, admittedly |
| 06:11.05 | Ralith | but it'd be pretty awesome in terms of other tasks you'd have to do to have a realtime map of surroundings at the current altitude |
| 06:11.22 | Ralith | of course, it'd crash into mirrors all the time. |
| 06:11.24 | jonored | Much nicer than trying to integrate from accelerometers and gyroscopes for all of it and get it to be stable for the few minutes to test the control system.. |
| 06:12.52 | Ralith | I'm not sure what problems you'd have with accelerometers |
| 06:13.23 | Ralith | zero it while it's sitting on a table, then just have everything try to keep them at zero |
| 06:13.48 | Ralith | put one at the extreme of each prop boom and you've got lots of info |
| 06:14.23 | Ralith | I can see the problem with keeping track of what upright is, though :/ |
| 06:14.34 | jonored | Accumulation of errors. Double integration mixed with noise is not a happy prospect. Could certianly try to just keep them at zero - on the other hand, for a quadrotor, what you get back is that you are accelerating upwards at 9.8 m/s^2 if you're thrusting as you would to counter gravity. |
| 06:15.10 | Ralith | treat that as zero :P |
| 06:15.20 | jonored | What you get putting them out on the ends of the boom is that you've built a gyro out of accelerometers. |
| 06:15.36 | Ralith | this is useful and probably cheaper than a real gyro. |
| 06:15.57 | Ralith | but yeah, with error accumulation you'd lose track of which way's up |
| 06:15.59 | Ralith | hm. |
| 06:16.12 | Ralith | well, wait |
| 06:16.19 | Ralith | this thing isn't stable in anything but vertical |
| 06:16.21 | jonored | The problem with treating that as zero is that accelerating straight towards the ground at 18.6 m/s^2 looks awful similar... |
| 06:16.31 | Ralith | so couldn't you examine the specifics of its current instability and correct? |
| 06:16.56 | Ralith | I'd hope your accelerometers can tell the difference between negative and positive :P |
| 06:17.15 | Ralith | uhh |
| 06:17.16 | jonored | it is positive. The accelerometer is oriented the same direction as the props. |
| 06:17.20 | Ralith | and just hope you don't get flipped upside down. |
| 06:17.27 | Ralith | cuz if that happens you're pretty much fucked. |
| 06:17.58 | Ralith | I don't see that being even remotely recoverable when you've got so little room to maneuver, even if you're omniescient |
| 06:18.01 | jonored | You can get the information that needs from gyros/equivalent devices. That's even just a single integration. |
| 06:18.55 | jonored | the problem is that if you think about it, the raw accelerometers should always be reading zero in the 'horizontal' axes in the body frame, and 9.8 in the 'vertical' axis. |
| 06:19.24 | Ralith | I'm still not sure where the problem lies |
| 06:19.30 | Ralith | you could even give a brute force approach, if properly tweaked |
| 06:20.00 | jonored | it's not impossible to fly something like this on that kind of system. |
| 06:20.14 | Ralith | when you're tilting one way, crank up the motor on that side; wouldn't it stabilize at vertical? |
| 06:20.40 | jonored | Yes. the problem is telling you're tilting one way. |
| 06:21.05 | Ralith | it would be rotationally accelerating, wouldn't it? |
| 06:21.09 | jonored | You can get the derivative of the thing you want to control from a gyro, but it's not easily done to get the actual number you care about. |
| 06:21.17 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:21.46 | jonored | Just rotating is detectable. the problem then is that you care about the angle. That said, you can get good enough sensors that this works for a good while. |
| 06:21.59 | jonored | but I need sleep... |
| 06:22.04 | Ralith | alright |
| 06:22.07 | Ralith | good discussion |
| 06:22.15 | jonored | g'night |
| 06:39.41 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 07:01.31 | *** join/#brlcad kylec (n=1812caa9@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:02.28 | kylec | hey, anyone out there? |
| 07:23.05 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:54.18 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
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| 08:10.24 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31817 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be consistent with Makefile.am |
| 08:17.11 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31818 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: fixed crash because of a corrupted function stack |
| 08:36.41 | *** join/#brlcad esben_ (n=esben@0x573ff382.boanqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) | |
| 08:46.54 | homovulgaris | brlcad: hmm.. was planning on style cleanup later.. not coding complete .. true |
| 08:49.55 | homovulgaris | should write self consistent code. |
| 09:00.49 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-92-144.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 09:12.59 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 10:14.32 | *** join/#brlcad davidg (n=david@84-45-236-142.no-dns-yet.enta.net) | |
| 10:20.05 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@zux221-122-143.adsl.green.ch) | |
| 10:26.29 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:27.37 | mafm | hi |
| 10:27.50 | homovulgaris | howdy mafm :) |
| 10:30.23 | mafm | sigh |
| 10:30.27 | mafm | too much work |
| 10:30.34 | mafm | but that's a common illness, I guess :) |
| 10:40.58 | brlcad | sleep less ;) |
| 10:42.42 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 10:58.32 | mafm | I can't |
| 10:58.45 | mafm | I can sleep less for a few days or so, but then I have to recover |
| 10:59.50 | mafm | hmm, ibot_ is actively ignoring me :| |
| 11:00.45 | archivist | the saturday lie in, zzzz, /me didnt get up till about 3pm this last weekend |
| 11:01.24 | mafm | oh, now I read it -- brlcad: I'm already using Ogre::ManualObject to build and render the sample shapes |
| 11:02.49 | homovulgaris | :D sleeping less is always a good solution ;) |
| 11:03.11 | homovulgaris | plenty of time to sleep later :) |
| 11:05.07 | mafm | that's only fun when you haven't had serious sleeping problems in the past :P |
| 11:06.56 | homovulgaris | :) i had some trouble with 30 hour sleep per week ;) |
| 11:07.25 | homovulgaris | i mean not trouble per se :P class bunks |
| 11:14.38 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.40.80) | |
| 11:17.29 | mafm | I mean health problems :) |
| 11:17.32 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 11:17.44 | andrecastelo | hi mafm |
| 11:18.47 | homovulgaris | hey castelo ;) nice castle |
| 11:36.10 | brlcad | breifly documents, http://brlcad.org/wiki/Sketch |
| 11:40.54 | andrecastelo | thanks homovulgaris :D |
| 11:41.05 | andrecastelo | (i didn't model it though) |
| 12:02.02 | mafm | castelo's castle... you have to patent it |
| 12:21.53 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.47.136) | |
| 12:52.19 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.47.136) | |
| 13:52.12 | yukonbob | browses sketch docs, suggests a pictures are worth thousands of words... |
| 13:52.22 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 13:56.25 | starseeker | tests whether the X updated that busted tk on gentoo also busts BRL-CAD's internal tk |
| 13:56.37 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 13:56.52 | ``Erik | pets fbsd :) |
| 13:57.37 | starseeker | It looks like it's a change at the Xorg level |
| 13:57.55 | starseeker | reads bug report... |
| 13:58.16 | starseeker | Possibly a hardcoded Tk assumption is being violated by new xproto behavior... |
| 13:58.53 | starseeker | They seem to think ALL tk versions are impacted |
| 13:58.59 | starseeker | ouch |
| 13:59.08 | starseeker | here's hoping BRL-CAD doesn't trigger the behavior |
| 14:05.26 | starseeker | So far so good... |
| 14:14.49 | starseeker | crap crap crap crap |
| 14:15.48 | yukonbob | heads to work... |
| 14:15.56 | yukonbob | starseeker: good luck |
| 14:16.24 | yukonbob | (see also #tcl, if you think it might help... lots of Tcl Core Team hangs out there...) |
| 14:17.25 | starseeker | Oh, I know why it's failing (or at least someone does) |
| 14:17.52 | starseeker | Alright, here's the failure and the links to info - to discuss with brlcad: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m2bc3454c |
| 14:18.25 | starseeker | figures apply the patch to our tree and move on with life, but it doesn't look like the tk devs have their final solution as yet... |
| 14:18.46 | starseeker | heads out... |
| 14:19.16 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.193.128) | |
| 14:32.58 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away_ (n=chatzill@189.71.10.147) | |
| 15:07.55 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 15:10.15 | brlcad | heh, "This has been a valid assumption (from 1991 up until very recently)" |
| 15:10.49 | brlcad | pats Xorg on the back for breathing some new life into X11 |
| 15:14.07 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, probably should just apply john's patch for now |
| 15:14.22 | brlcad | er, joe i mean |
| 15:30.37 | *** join/#brlcad esben_ (n=esben@0x573ff382.boanqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) | |
| 15:31.03 | brlcad | gets peckish |
| 15:35.11 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:35.44 | prasad_ | peck peck |
| 15:37.35 | ``Erik | quit being a pecker, prasad ;D |
| 15:41.44 | ``Erik | wonders if brlcad is in the office today |
| 15:52.22 | brlcad | nope |
| 15:52.43 | brlcad | ironically have too much work to do |
| 15:54.11 | ``Erik | heh, yet anther fine framework, I hear |
| 15:54.37 | brlcad | starts after tomorrow |
| 15:56.55 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away__ (n=chatzill@189.71.18.137) | |
| 16:10.09 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 16:30.54 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-93-183.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:39.37 | brlcad | hugs CIA-60 |
| 16:39.37 | CIA-60 | hugs brlcad |
| 16:42.05 | Axman6 | oh, i can see i came back whole you were having a moment... |
| 16:42.08 | Axman6 | while* |
| 16:59.23 | brlcad | yeah, it's apparently back-logged.. |
| 16:59.38 | brlcad | just now springing back to life |
| 17:02.07 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 17:04.44 | starseeker | so a peckish brlcad is either hungry, easily annoyed, or both? |
| 17:10.50 | brlcad | annoyingly hungry |
| 17:11.02 | starseeker | heh :-) |
| 17:11.38 | ``Erik | <-- pats his belly full of expired chef boy r dee ravioli |
| 17:12.24 | ``Erik | I know you're jealous, you can admit it |
| 17:12.25 | brlcad | ponders pizza |
| 17:12.31 | brlcad | heh |
| 17:12.44 | brlcad | I think I have a can of that crap .. not going there today |
| 17:12.58 | starseeker | around starseeker pizza seldom lasts long enough to ponder |
| 17:13.11 | brlcad | i get a craving for it like two times a year, it's there "just in case" |
| 17:13.22 | poolio | I just had way too much free pizza for lunch :D |
| 17:13.31 | ``Erik | remembers to taze starseeker when the pizza's arrive for any pizza party |
| 17:14.21 | starseeker | makes note to drain the charge on ``Erik's tazer |
| 17:16.45 | starseeker | although given ``Erik's approach to toys, he's probably got a mini-nuclear reactor in there... |
| 17:16.51 | brlcad | wow, just a couple weeks since I last used that on-line ordering dude's new site and he's already got a dozen new restaurants |
| 17:17.00 | starseeker | cool |
| 17:19.42 | ``Erik | nah |
| 17:20.01 | ``Erik | just enough capacitors to flash vaporize a 1" diameter steel rod :D |
| 17:22.30 | starseeker | ``Erik: Ah, of course - the gigaFarad capacitor :-). After all, what good are the large scale SI unit prefixes if you don't make use of them? :-) |
| 17:23.03 | starseeker | I guess it would probably be gigafarad, actually... |
| 17:23.55 | starseeker | remembers someone once comparing measuring capacitance in Farads to measuring egos in Stallmans - uselessly large units... |
| 17:24.02 | ``Erik | mine are gibifarads |
| 17:24.20 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 17:24.36 | starseeker | digital farads? |
| 17:25.00 | ``Erik | only fools count in decimal, you have to count in binary to be cool |
| 17:25.07 | ``Erik | and I'm the coolest! or something |
| 17:25.21 | starseeker | well, you're certainly the somethingist |
| 17:26.25 | ``Erik | lithp people are... thpecial. |
| 17:26.47 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31819 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/elapsed.sh: |
| 17:26.48 | starseeker | They're metapeople ;-) |
| 17:26.51 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: add support for RFC 2822 dates in addition to UNIX dates, this should fix a |
| 17:26.59 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: couple of timing issues that have been noticed. also make the argument |
| 17:27.03 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: processing more robust including detection of the date format. add support for |
| 17:27.12 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: env variable overrides and --debug|DEBUG in addition to --seconds|ONLY_SECONDS |
| 17:27.16 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: support. woot. |
| 17:27.51 | ``Erik | apparently all 3 public branches of ucw are dead(ish), the various developers have their own private repos, and the 'proper' way to get it at the moment is to download something called paragent and extract it from that |
| 17:29.00 | ``Erik | neat, huh? :D |
| 17:29.28 | starseeker | restrains an impulse to knock ucw dev's heads together and read them the git user maual |
| 17:29.33 | starseeker | manual even |
| 17:29.41 | ``Erik | they like darcs |
| 17:30.05 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 17:30.10 | starseeker | howdy |
| 17:30.18 | CIA-60 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31820 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Changed initialization sequence |
| 17:30.18 | ``Erik | though I have to admit, I did get a minor urge to use git... while I was flying |
| 17:30.20 | andrecastelo | hey starseeker |
| 17:30.28 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik :D |
| 17:30.48 | ``Erik | the 5 hours of airport/aircraft non-access made git almost look attractive... but *shrug* then the 5 hours was up and I could resume not being a git :D |
| 17:30.54 | ``Erik | afternoon, andre |
| 17:31.01 | starseeker | git is good for situations like that where everyone has a branch - it's precisely what tends to happen with the Linux kernel |
| 17:31.11 | ``Erik | nice screenies, started the bidirectional stuff yet? |
| 17:31.40 | andrecastelo | i was trying to do much detailed things |
| 17:31.41 | ``Erik | yes, I did a little linux kernel hacking in the 90's, a bunch of gits sounds about right :D |
| 17:31.43 | starseeker | pokes CIA-60 |
| 17:31.58 | andrecastelo | brlcad told me to keep it simple, try to make it work as a simple raytracer |
| 17:32.12 | ``Erik | fbsd is preparing to move to svn O.o |
| 17:32.22 | andrecastelo | it saves the hit points now, will be useful when path tracing |
| 17:32.29 | ``Erik | <-- thought he suggested that to andre long ago... :D |
| 17:33.05 | andrecastelo | my bad, then :S |
| 17:33.06 | starseeker | Well, for the record - the tk patch is added. It didn't break the Mac, but I'll have to wait til I get back home to confirm it fixed the new Xorg issue |
| 17:33.11 | ``Erik | I believe twingy rendered the castle using rise/adrt at one time, d'no if I have the images from that anymore |
| 17:33.19 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 17:33.23 | ``Erik | ssh -X ? |
| 17:33.58 | starseeker | has never set up remote access to his box - too much trouble between modem, ISP, and securing box |
| 17:35.02 | starseeker | hopes one day to be in a place where he can get a direct fiber hookup... |
| 17:35.09 | ``Erik | sweden? |
| 17:35.24 | starseeker | heh |
| 17:35.49 | starseeker | do I detect a slight mistrust of the USA's ability to roll out broadband? |
| 17:36.30 | ``Erik | um, ability, or desire? |
| 17:37.00 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 17:37.00 | starseeker | desire I never doubt, unless it's the MPAA/RIAA |
| 17:37.21 | ``Erik | the companies don't particularly want to do it, they're cr^Happing all over the intartoobs, and most people don't particularly care as long as their por^Wmail gets to them fast enough |
| 17:37.39 | ``Erik | supposedly a large number of people use dialup and don't want to switch to "broadband" |
| 17:38.04 | ``Erik | and we tend to be a pretty spread out country compared to some :) |
| 17:38.05 | starseeker | has run into a few and always has to resist the urge to scream... |
| 17:38.15 | starseeker | true |
| 17:38.47 | starseeker | (which is why we need faster trains, doggone it - what will we do when flying gets too expensive?) |
| 17:39.52 | ``Erik | my round trip flight was about $200 after the fees and taxes, train woulda been more expensive and time consuming :/ a sleeper ride probably woulda been $2k and taken 2-3 days |
| 17:40.19 | prasad_ | dc to chicago is 17 hrs :o |
| 17:40.28 | starseeker | <snort> - all that means is Amtrak should be beet read |
| 17:40.30 | prasad_ | for the same price as a plane ticket |
| 17:40.30 | starseeker | red |
| 17:40.37 | ``Erik | and the notion of 2-3 days in cattle is unpleasant |
| 17:40.37 | prasad_ | which is 2 hrs |
| 17:40.59 | starseeker | right. We need bullet maglev trains for 1/4 the cost of air travel |
| 17:41.17 | starseeker | what's wrong with learning from the rest of the world? |
| 17:41.19 | ``Erik | rode a train from seattle to oakland in '85, and one from some mudhole to osan (south korea) around '87 |
| 17:41.35 | ``Erik | other than subways, haven't ridden any others :/ |
| 17:42.23 | starseeker | road Amtrack two or three times - one time he got sick, one time he was stuck near the smoking lounge and one time he was 17 hours late |
| 17:43.00 | ``Erik | but we run into the issue of things being spread out so much, combined with the inability to accept darwinism so the tracks must be caged to prevent r-tards from getting pasted... huge cost :D |
| 17:43.01 | clock_ | starseeker: sick from dry air? |
| 17:43.22 | starseeker | clock_: Dunno. More likely being couped up with other sick people |
| 17:43.35 | clock_ | 17 hours late lol |
| 17:43.41 | clock_ | how long did the journey normally take? |
| 17:43.49 | starseeker | ``Erik: Nah, just build elevated maglev tails |
| 17:44.05 | ``Erik | again; expensive :) |
| 17:44.09 | starseeker | clock_: Little over a day or two |
| 17:44.20 | clock_ | here in switzerland there is a fence around |
| 17:44.23 | starseeker | ``Erik: Up front, yes, but it's a fixed cost |
| 17:44.27 | clock_ | i climbed it once and wont do it anymore |
| 17:44.40 | starseeker | airplane fuel looks to be open ended |
| 17:44.45 | ``Erik | building a 50 mile city loop might be fine, building a single 5000 mile run... |
| 17:44.55 | clock_ | I saw like for half kilometer crossed carefully and suddenly a silent doubledecker train going like 120km/h was whistling at me |
| 17:45.13 | clock_ | my brother said he saw it there was huge clearance no danger but i wont do it anyway |
| 17:45.14 | starseeker | hey, they probably said the same thing about a continuous railroad across the US |
| 17:45.30 | clock_ | its not czech republic where the trains go 60km/h you hear them few kilometers and people normally cross the tracks safely |
| 17:45.57 | starseeker | agrees with ``Erik that any opportunity for stupidity in the US will be taken advantage of by someone |
| 17:46.00 | ``Erik | yeah, but we can't pay chinese people 2 cents a week and let them die without concern anymore... O.o it was an achievement with some insanely horrible prices attached |
| 17:46.36 | starseeker | <snort> we've learned a few things technologically since then |
| 17:47.16 | ``Erik | I was thinking more about the social abuses of dehumanizing a large work force |
| 17:47.31 | starseeker | as opposed to (say) IT support call centers? |
| 17:48.11 | starseeker | I'm guessing proper maglev installation isn't going to be about dehumanizing people so much as it is making the install foolproof |
| 17:48.21 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 17:48.27 | starseeker | the labor requirements are different |
| 17:48.27 | clock_ | I think a wire fence like in CH suffices |
| 17:48.29 | ``Erik | I don't see it happening in the near future |
| 17:48.35 | clock_ | with ocassional sign do not cross life danger |
| 17:48.40 | starseeker | I agree, it won't be near term |
| 17:48.47 | ``Erik | rednecks won't go for tax hikes when they never leave their trailer park |
| 17:48.49 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:49.12 | starseeker | has seen Japan's train system, and is still green with envy |
| 17:49.28 | starseeker | you can get almost anywhere you want to go without a car, between the rail systems and busses |
| 17:49.52 | ``Erik | yeah, but remember; japan is a small country with a high population density and a culture that pushes more for common good than personal wealth |
| 17:50.02 | starseeker | Sure. |
| 17:50.28 | ``Erik | <-- was dumbstruck at the cultural difference at first |
| 17:50.37 | starseeker | But unless you seriously think our population will stop going up, shouldn't we be planning for the long term here as well? |
| 17:51.02 | ``Erik | of course I think we SHOULD |
| 17:51.08 | starseeker | figures we elect officials to watch out for the common good, after all... |
| 17:51.08 | ``Erik | ... |
| 17:51.12 | starseeker | heh |
| 17:51.36 | starseeker | keep voting, I guess... |
| 17:51.37 | ``Erik | elected officials tend to only worry about the future to a term length |
| 17:51.52 | starseeker | very true |
| 17:51.52 | ``Erik | just like companies end to only worry out to a quarter away |
| 17:51.56 | ``Erik | tend |
| 17:52.05 | ``Erik | and most of the US only worries about a paycheck away |
| 17:53.05 | starseeker | that's natural (frustrating, but natural) |
| 17:54.33 | ``Erik | thinks the highway system mostly exists because a large part of the population was in awe at the german system they used first hand, as well as a huge economy rebuilding push by the gov't |
| 17:55.02 | ``Erik | if it weren't pimped so well to a choire of an audience, I doubt we'd have it :) |
| 17:55.55 | ``Erik | computer geeks discussing socioeconomic philosophies, that just ain't right |
| 17:56.00 | ``Erik | pokes at computer stuff :D |
| 17:56.23 | starseeker | is back to xml conversion - getting close to the end of volIII |
| 17:56.33 | starseeker | lotta appendices |
| 17:58.25 | ``Erik | vestigial organs in our documentation? ohs noes! |
| 17:59.05 | starseeker | wishes the Build Pattern doc qualified... |
| 18:00.39 | ``Erik | O.o as in 'builder design pattern'? |
| 18:08.01 | brlcad | loves riding by train, with or without delays |
| 18:08.22 | brlcad | one of the few means of travel where you can actually do something almost the *entire* trip, very productive |
| 18:09.10 | brlcad | pull out the laptop, plug it in, prop up your feet, code code type type all day, get up and go get a beer from the bar, back to coding, enjoy the scenery |
| 18:12.38 | ``Erik | give me a teleportation booth any day |
| 18:15.06 | ``Erik | detaches brlcad's screen and doesn't give it back until he's done coding O.o :D |
| 18:15.26 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:15.46 | brlcad | this isn't so much coding, it's writing, and it doesn't start until tomorrow |
| 18:16.50 | ``Erik | detaches brlcad's screen and doesn't give it back until bz is migrated :D *duck* |
| 18:17.00 | ``Erik | <-- running updates on it yet again |
| 18:21.06 | ``Erik | curses up a storm at yet another lithper thpecialnethth |
| 18:32.14 | ``Erik | hey, neat, a tarball with emacs ~ files, a .DS_Store file, a 23 meg core file, ... a mixture of CVS, .svn and _darcs directories... |
| 18:40.17 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 18:40.17 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 18:42.37 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:51.09 | andrecastelo | finishing blog report and then off to class |
| 18:57.58 | ``Erik | looks at andres checklist... the +'s are done and -'s are not? |
| 18:58.24 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-22 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149.simpli.biz) | |
| 19:00.12 | pacman87 | i think i found a bug in kde |
| 19:00.25 | pacman87 | either that, or i'm doing it wrong |
| 19:00.40 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: yup |
| 19:00.48 | brlcad | avoids the lewd joke |
| 19:01.14 | andrecastelo | but that is not up to date |
| 19:01.15 | pacman87 | every so often, i end up with a whole bunch of kdesktop_lock and kblankscrn.kss processes running when i come back |
| 19:02.40 | ``Erik | but lewd jokes are the best kind! |
| 19:08.40 | ``Erik | hum |
| 19:11.49 | ``Erik | a horrible bug in andres code! it assumes a single worker thread doing lines in order instead of saving scanlines where they belong |
| 19:14.47 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: in view_pixel() ? |
| 19:16.32 | ``Erik | I didn't look that close, but when I run it on a 4 core machine, I get what looks like a few random grey strips with a lot of black background, but when I give it -P1, it looks ok |
| 19:19.57 | ``Erik | hm, and no save image ability |
| 19:20.25 | ``Erik | try um, running it with like -P4 or -P512 or something |
| 19:21.29 | andrecastelo | yeah, the view_pixel() assumes BUFMODE_SCANLINE |
| 19:21.37 | andrecastelo | that'll be changed |
| 19:22.05 | andrecastelo | also, i temporarily cut the save image ability from it, when i was trying to make it work with a frame buffer |
| 19:22.14 | ``Erik | okie, I mostly use 4 and 8 core boxes, so I was wondering what was broken until I tried explicitely giving -P1 |
| 19:22.17 | andrecastelo | (plus it created a 128mb file o.O) |
| 19:29.59 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 19:37.57 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 19:40.10 | mafm | have to go home before the night falls: strange creatures roam Lisbon city during the night :P |
| 19:45.42 | mafm | nighty night |
| 19:47.22 | *** join/#brlcad esben_ (n=esben@0x573ff382.boanqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) | |
| 19:51.36 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 20:05.07 | andrecastelo | pokes C |
| 20:05.12 | andrecastelo | pokes CIA-22 |
| 20:05.50 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: updated viewmlt.c, it outputs an image file now |
| 20:06.18 | andrecastelo | i'm still downloading a program to visualize .pix files, though :S |
| 20:12.17 | ``Erik | heh, um, there's a program to dump a pix to an fb :) or cnvert fb to png |
| 20:13.29 | ``Erik | is nervous about hacking on it lest he modify thing that'll be deleted/replaced O.o |
| 20:18.23 | andrecastelo | i'm off to class now |
| 20:18.27 | andrecastelo | cya later |
| 20:18.55 | ``Erik | hasta |
| 20:35.12 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 20:41.58 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-22 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149.simpli.biz) | |
| 21:07.38 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-22 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149.simpli.biz) | |
| 21:24.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31826 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Reworked things a bit to make it easier to add commands in the GED object. |
| 21:33.24 | pacman87 | is there a problem with me adding this to vmath.h? |
| 21:33.24 | pacman87 | #define MAX(a, b)( (a) > (b) )?(a):(b) |
| 21:33.24 | pacman87 | #define MIN(a, b)( (a) < (b) )?(a):(b) |
| 21:33.35 | pacman87 | or is there a better place? |
| 21:33.38 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:00.05 | ``Erik | has thought about doing that himself O.o |
| 22:00.30 | pacman87 | need to wrap another () around it, though |
| 22:02.13 | ``Erik | hrmmm, I forget if anything takes precedence over the ternary |
| 22:02.31 | pacman87 | MAX( 5, 3 ) + 1; |
| 22:02.49 | pacman87 | won't the +1 be included with :(b) + 1; |
| 22:03.45 | ``Erik | ah, yeah |
| 22:04.12 | pacman87 | the carc_seg struct isn't very friendly |
| 22:04.47 | ``Erik | (((a)>(b)?(a):(b)) /* and people think lithp has lotth of parenthethith */ |
| 22:04.49 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 22:05.25 | pacman87 | (((a)>(b))?(a):(b)) |
| 22:05.25 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:05.47 | ``Erik | yeh |
| 22:06.04 | ``Erik | I just got home, my brain needs a few minutes to acclimate, it's frikkin' 80f in my house :( |
| 22:06.14 | pacman87 | nice and toasty |
| 22:06.51 | ``Erik | some day, I'll get my a/c fixed |
| 22:06.53 | ``Erik | honest |
| 22:07.01 | ``Erik | or wait until it's cold outside and sell my house *cough* O:-) |
| 22:07.51 | pacman87 | my ac broke last summer in austin |
| 22:08.16 | pacman87 | twasn't fun |
| 22:11.20 | ``Erik | hrmmm, can V_MAX() be twisted to your needs? |
| 22:16.31 | pacman87 | i want to compare a and b and store in c |
| 22:16.43 | pacman87 | not necessarily store back in a |
| 22:17.22 | ``Erik | yeah, I think it's a silly construct, just looking for ways to avoid adding there |
| 22:17.45 | pacman87 | which is silly? |
| 22:17.54 | ``Erik | and { int c = a; V_MAX(c,b); blah(c); } is ugly |
| 22:18.12 | ``Erik | the store instead of return approach |
| 22:19.17 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31827 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add build pattern tutorial |
| 22:20.10 | ``Erik | sees MAX defined in /usr/include (in a few places) |
| 22:20.23 | starseeker | hugs CIA-22 |
| 22:20.24 | CIA-22 | hugs starseeker |
| 22:21.00 | ``Erik | HEY! keep it family friendly, freaks! |
| 22:21.25 | starseeker | CIA forgave me - I was being ignored for the longest time |
| 22:21.32 | ``Erik | c.h php/main/snprintf.h php/Zend/zend.h sys/param.h X11/extensions/xtrapddmi.h |
| 22:21.58 | ``Erik | (this is on a mac, btw) |
| 22:22.08 | pacman87 | yeah, i probably need a new name |
| 22:22.54 | ``Erik | (defun in (x) (asdf-install:install x)) |
| 22:23.32 | starseeker | heh - making lisp user friendly, one abbreviation at a time |
| 22:23.42 | ``Erik | :D |
| 22:24.37 | ``Erik | I'd rather type (in 'thlime) than (asdf-install:install 'thlime) if I'm doing a gazillion of 'em |
| 22:25.31 | ``Erik | huh, how does lithp do variable arity? in thcheme, it's (define (func arg1 ... argn) form) |
| 22:26.04 | ``Erik | or, uh, one ., sorry |
| 22:26.07 | ``Erik | C macros on the brain |
| 22:26.20 | ``Erik | (define (println . args) (for-each display args) (newline)) ; for example |
| 22:26.53 | starseeker | the #lisp channel is actually good for stuff like that :-) |
| 22:27.05 | starseeker | if the right folks are on |
| 22:27.26 | ``Erik | the personal lithp yoda named cliff is good for that, too, now turn green and start spouting wisdom or I'll whack you with my lispsaber |
| 22:27.34 | ``Erik | :D |
| 22:27.48 | starseeker | pulls his brain out of docbook and looks... |
| 22:28.30 | starseeker | what's variable arity? |
| 22:28.34 | ``Erik | google is being mean to me |
| 22:28.35 | ``Erik | varargs |
| 22:28.52 | starseeker | you want to define how many arguments you will pass to a command? |
| 22:29.06 | starseeker | er function |
| 22:29.19 | ``Erik | I want to define a function that takes a variable number of args |
| 22:29.24 | ``Erik | like format |
| 22:29.51 | starseeker | just pass it a list? |
| 22:29.57 | starseeker | stuff the args in the list? |
| 22:30.09 | starseeker | is out of shape lisp wise |
| 22:30.36 | ``Erik | well, that's what it boils down to in scheme, but the syntatic sugar is nice |
| 22:30.59 | ``Erik | (myfunc 'a 'b 'c) instead of (myfunc '(a b c)) ... :) |
| 22:31.44 | ``Erik | is not finding satisfaction via google :( |
| 22:32.06 | starseeker | try #lisp if you can take the heat - they have helped me in the past |
| 22:33.20 | starseeker | does this help? http://gigamonkeys.com/book/functions.html |
| 22:33.40 | starseeker | check the &optional symbol |
| 22:34.49 | ``Erik | ah, &rest |
| 22:34.57 | pacman87 | decides to take a shotgun approach to carc bounds, instead of using a rifle |
| 22:36.46 | pacman87 | ... at least for now, anyway |
| 22:45.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31828 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add build_region appendix |
| 22:54.07 | starseeker | woot! http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/vol3/book/tutorial_series/volume_III.xhtml |
| 22:56.03 | starseeker | lots of holes to fill in, but progress! |
| 23:00.10 | brlcad | yeah, nifty -- what's different? :) |
| 23:00.51 | brlcad | starseeker: and what's up with the images.. some are way too big (oversampled), some way too small (super low res).. |
| 23:03.14 | brlcad | ``Erik: huh, nervous about hacking on what? his code is fair game, he probably needs to learn how to correctly resolve conflicts anyways |
| 23:05.26 | ``Erik | yeah, but if he's gonna gut&replace, *shrug* i'm trying to be lazy :D |
| 23:05.32 | ``Erik | uh, anyone using firefox 3? |
| 23:06.15 | brlcad | pacman87: posix provides fmax(), fmin() |
| 23:06.45 | brlcad | we use that throughout the code, that's why there's nothing defined already |
| 23:08.47 | ``Erik | downgrades firefox due to inexcusable brokeness :( |
| 23:12.09 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 23:19.48 | ``Erik | and now the old one is broken the same way. *sigh* |
| 23:20.15 | PrezKennedy | UE!! |
| 23:24.25 | ``Erik | starts wondering if his pref file hacking is coming back to haunt him |
| 23:34.49 | Ralith | ``Erik: I use FF3 |
| 23:35.18 | PrezKennedy | I use IE! |
| 23:35.22 | Ralith | D: |
| 23:35.25 | PrezKennedy | gets struck by lightning |
| 23:37.13 | ``Erik | when I upgraded from ff2 to ff3, it quit showing tabs and would get stuck on pages, when I downgraded back to ff2, the tabs were still gone :( annoying crap |
| 23:39.26 | Ralith | sounds like mangled prefs |
| 23:39.30 | Ralith | kill your profile |
| 23:41.58 | ``Erik | yeah, trying to do that in a way that keeps my bookmarks |
| 23:42.39 | Ralith | copy the bookmarks over after you have a new profile |
| 23:42.42 | Ralith | should work fine |
| 23:42.46 | Ralith | they're in they're own file iirc |
| 23:42.48 | ``Erik | tried that, they're not sticking |
| 23:42.57 | ``Erik | grepped through the directory to make sure, even |
| 23:43.10 | Ralith | complain on their IRC channel |
| 23:44.21 | Ralith | I'm curious -- the docs and website use all these really neat looking detailed military vehicles for example pics |
| 23:44.25 | Ralith | are those available anywhere? |
| 23:44.29 | Ralith | (the models, that is) |
| 23:44.47 | brlcad | nope |
| 23:44.51 | Ralith | aw. |
| 23:45.04 | brlcad | the only one that is available is havoc |
| 23:45.10 | Ralith | ? |
| 23:45.12 | Ralith | got a link? |
| 23:45.19 | ``Erik | um, mi28 iirc |
| 23:45.26 | ``Erik | the helicoptor |
| 23:45.41 | Ralith | to the file, I meant |
| 23:45.53 | ``Erik | russian, never fielded, it's in the distribution |
| 23:46.02 | ``Erik | as is the US m-35 2.5 ton truck |
| 23:46.15 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/havoc_rtedge.png.html installed as havoc.g |
| 23:46.41 | ``Erik | wouldn't mind getting the t62 in public release status :) |
| 23:47.00 | Ralith | <3 detailed and accurate military models |
| 23:47.07 | brlcad | i think that one's doable if it's just pressed (at the right time to the right people) |
| 23:47.19 | Ralith | in the distribution? |
| 23:47.22 | Ralith | you sure? |
| 23:47.25 | Ralith | % find ./ -iname '*.g' |
| 23:47.26 | Ralith | ./doc/html/manuals/mged/cup.g |
| 23:47.41 | ``Erik | should be in share/brlcad/7.12.4/db/havoc.g |
| 23:47.59 | Ralith | weird. |
| 23:48.06 | ``Erik | how did you install? |
| 23:48.07 | Ralith | that's not in the source tarball |
| 23:48.10 | Ralith | but it's in my install |
| 23:48.18 | ``Erik | it's in the source as havoc.asc |
| 23:48.21 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 23:48.23 | brlcad | in the source dist it's db/havoc.asc |
| 23:48.30 | Ralith | why store it that way? |
| 23:48.33 | brlcad | that's converted to .g during compilation and installed |
| 23:48.37 | ``Erik | we have an ascii mode format of the .g file and "compile" it to binary |
| 23:48.38 | Ralith | better versioning system handling? |
| 23:48.56 | brlcad | yes, human readable |
| 23:49.08 | ``Erik | um, v4 db wasn't smart about endian and width, CVS is bitchy about binary files, etc |
| 23:49.14 | Ralith | cool, thanks |
| 23:49.19 | ``Erik | human readable is nice, but I think a lot of it is historic |
| 23:49.23 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 23:49.30 | ``Erik | would like asc updated to v5 |
| 23:49.33 | ``Erik | :) |
| 23:50.05 | Ralith | also, my GUI's console occasionally opens as a tiny vertical rectangle (you can't even see anything besides the wm decorations) |
| 23:50.15 | Ralith | can't find a way to reliably reproduce it, but it happens often |
| 23:50.22 | ``Erik | asc2g generates v5's I believe, but the info in asc is still v4, I think |
| 23:52.00 | Ralith | what's the license on these? |
| 23:54.25 | brlcad | see COPYING |
| 23:54.52 | brlcad | (bsd) |
| 23:56.43 | ``Erik | should db/ be explicitely called out around line 46 of COPYING? |
| 23:57.33 | ``Erik | ponders adding comments to asc to hold that info there O.o |
| 23:57.35 | ``Erik | :D |
| 00:00.56 | ``Erik | that'd probably be a good "jr hacker" task |
| 00:10.22 | ``Erik | holy crap, that thing is pigging the corners bad |
| 00:10.28 | ``Erik | c55 amg on top gear |
| 00:10.56 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:11.04 | ``Erik | it lost a cornering drive to a 'vette |
| 00:12.49 | ``Erik | way behind bmw, porsche, lotus, even mitsubishi :D |
| 00:22.16 | Ralith | is it possible to get antialiasing out of the brlcad renderers? |
| 00:23.01 | brlcad | it's performed at a ray-cast level, jittering, so probably not what you'd expect for antialiasing |
| 00:23.19 | brlcad | even though it is an antialiasing approach and will eliminate aliasing artifaces |
| 00:23.44 | brlcad | usually you'll want to render at 2x-4x and scale down, though, for clean image-space anti-aliasing |
| 00:24.10 | Ralith | I guess that's one way to do it. |
| 00:27.57 | brlcad | the results will usually be better in a super-sampled image space than what you can do in a sub-sampled ray-space |
| 00:29.01 | brlcad | Ralith: if you find a way to reproduce the vertical rect, lemme know .. never seen that |
| 00:29.19 | Ralith | I'll see what I can do |
| 00:29.24 | Ralith | it's pretty unpredictable, though |
| 00:34.00 | ``Erik | much more info would be needed for that |
| 00:34.37 | ``Erik | rt's antialiasing involves the -h (hypersample) and -J (jitter) flags being used in conjunction, basically shoot a bunch of rays per pixel with random minor mutations and the results averaged |
| 00:35.25 | ``Erik | -J3 is both cell and frame jitter, and -h takes the # of rays to fire, I haven't noticed any appreciable difference between ~7 and "more" |
| 00:35.39 | ``Erik | though sometimes I do a lot more to do profiling :) |
| 00:36.07 | ``Erik | hasn't really messed with shooting a big one and downscaling |
| 00:36.38 | Ralith | ``Erik: -h 5 -J3 gets me a white silhouette |
| 00:37.02 | ``Erik | woops |
| 00:37.03 | ``Erik | -H |
| 00:37.33 | ``Erik | -h is distance attenuation shtuff |
| 00:37.41 | ``Erik | like, uh, opengl style 'fog' |
| 00:37.47 | pacman87 | i think i forgot something: |
| 00:37.47 | pacman87 | warning: incompatible implicit declaration of built-in function 'fmin' |
| 00:37.50 | Ralith | hm. slows down things a lot and mostly just fuzzes the edges |
| 00:38.06 | Ralith | are standard antialiasing techniques inapplicable? |
| 00:38.12 | ``Erik | pacman: math.h ? |
| 00:38.23 | pacman87 | it's there |
| 00:38.27 | ``Erik | which "standard" antialiasing techniques? |
| 00:39.07 | ``Erik | opengl and d3d use a "magic set" approach published in a paper I believe out of nvidia for edge hits |
| 00:41.22 | Ralith | that works. |
| 00:41.31 | Ralith | is it inapplicable? |
| 00:41.49 | ``Erik | I imagine not, but it's highly recent compared to the existing approach |
| 00:41.53 | ``Erik | feel free to implement it :D |
| 00:42.00 | Ralith | hehe |
| 00:42.05 | Ralith | if I were a graphics programmer :P |
| 00:42.29 | ``Erik | I imagine being a graphics programmer is irrelevant, it'd be a hard coded pattern opposed to a random set of tweaks |
| 00:43.14 | Ralith | yeah, but I don't have enough background to even know where to begin. |
| 00:43.18 | ``Erik | whoever did the paper basically went through a series of possibly layouts until they came across the one that seemed the "best" for the least number of rasterizations |
| 00:43.23 | Ralith | let alone how to adapt something from opengl to brl-cad. |
| 00:43.59 | ``Erik | well, the paper, iirc, basically boils down to 7 points in a square |
| 00:44.16 | ``Erik | so instead of doing N random pertubations to rays, just assume those 7... |
| 00:44.19 | ``Erik | or 5 or whatever |
| 00:45.13 | ``Erik | finding the paper with the magic #'s would be the harder aspect, I'd imagine |
| 00:45.30 | ``Erik | but don't listen to me, I've been looking at lisp code, so I've been getting liquored up ;) |
| 00:45.35 | Ralith | heh |
| 00:45.47 | pacman87 | testing the balmer peak? |
| 00:45.49 | Ralith | raytracing isn't how opengl/d3d do things at all, though |
| 00:45.52 | Ralith | it's that directly mappable? |
| 00:46.08 | ``Erik | no, ogl and d3d are rasterized approaches |
| 00:46.13 | ``Erik | but I think the notion is mappable |
| 00:46.33 | Ralith | isn't even sure how a rasterized renderer differes from a raytracer |
| 00:46.40 | ``Erik | I haven't jumped around screaming "developers" over and over, nor have I launched chairs or sworn to "fucking kill" anyone |
| 00:46.41 | Ralith | other than that the latter seems to be very slow. |
| 00:46.46 | ``Erik | so, no, not on the ballmer track |
| 00:46.49 | Ralith | ``Erik: it's an xkcd reference |
| 00:46.58 | ``Erik | ohhhh |
| 00:47.02 | ``Erik | balmer, not ballmer |
| 00:47.02 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:47.05 | pacman87 | http://xkcd.com/323/ |
| 00:47.09 | ``Erik | I think I'm beyond the productivity spike |
| 00:47.21 | ``Erik | sorry, I'm disadvantaged. :) |
| 00:47.41 | ``Erik | once ralith said xkcd, it clicked... :D |
| 00:47.57 | ``Erik | I do like how foxtrot included xkcd in their latest quip |
| 00:48.11 | pacman87 | yeah, i saw that |
| 00:48.28 | ``Erik | http://euler.missouristate.edu/~erik/comics/comic.php <-- web app he wrote to deal with those damn webcomics |
| 00:48.59 | ``Erik | and since I like high resolutions and big fonts, clicking an image zooms it, pheer javascript O.o |
| 01:07.38 | starseeker | brlcad: difference is that volume three was generated from docbook sources - like the earlier volume II example |
| 01:08.11 | starseeker | brlcad: As for the images, I had originally captured them at the highest resolution I could, simply to ensure I preserved the detail present in the originals |
| 01:08.30 | starseeker | If you're referring to the second tank image, I believe the pixelation there is present in the original |
| 01:09.43 | starseeker | I need to downsize the images anyway for pdf, so thinks will look better - I was simply ensuring that at least the svn history had the full image data |
| 01:12.09 | brlcad | if -j + -H simply averaged the cell results, it would look a hell of a lot better |
| 01:12.44 | brlcad | that's a viewend() post-processing hook that wouldn't be too hard to code up |
| 01:13.40 | brlcad | starseeker: the big ones aren't nearly as much of a concern as the under-res ones :) |
| 01:13.51 | brlcad | you can down-sample, upsampling sucks |
| 01:28.04 | pacman87 | primitives/revolve/revolve.c:176: warning: incompatible implicit declaration of built-in function 'fmax' |
| 01:28.29 | pacman87 | what am i missing? |
| 01:34.39 | ``Erik | perhaps a -lm ? |
| 01:34.58 | ``Erik | well, that error says it's not seeing the prototype in the header, though |
| 01:35.10 | ``Erik | "man fmax" and include the correct header O.o |
| 01:35.49 | pacman87 | says math.h |
| 01:36.10 | pacman87 | is fastf_t considered a float? |
| 01:36.28 | brlcad | not usually, but could be |
| 01:36.33 | ``Erik | um, I think it's usually a double |
| 01:36.47 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:36.47 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:36.47 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:37.09 | brlcad | is that from the manpage or the header? |
| 01:37.15 | pacman87 | manpage |
| 01:37.23 | brlcad | see what your header has |
| 01:37.36 | brlcad | maybe it's in some #ifdef'd block |
| 01:40.33 | pacman87 | my /usr/include/math.h doesnt' have any of them |
| 01:41.18 | brlcad | eh, you didn't just grep I hope? :) |
| 01:41.28 | brlcad | usually it's just a front-end to /usr/include/somethingelse |
| 01:42.03 | brlcad | also, I presume you're using <math.h> and not "math.h", yes? |
| 01:42.23 | pacman87 | when grep failed, i opened it |
| 01:42.30 | pacman87 | and it's not linked anywhere |
| 01:42.41 | pacman87 | and yes to <math.h> |
| 01:43.15 | brlcad | can you upload your math.h somewhere? |
| 01:43.20 | pacman87 | sure |
| 01:43.49 | brlcad | not the first time i've seen them missing, but it's certainly been a while.. |
| 01:45.18 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/math.h |
| 01:47.30 | brlcad | what did you mean by "it's not linked anywhere"? |
| 01:48.12 | brlcad | that header includes about four or five others that might have fmax, try: grep -r -i fmax /usr/include |
| 01:48.16 | pacman87 | (08:42:17 PM) brlcad: usually it's just a front-end to /usr/include/somethingelse |
| 01:48.47 | brlcad | yeah, your math.h is a front end to /usr/include/bits |
| 01:48.53 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 01:48.56 | brlcad | for at least many decls |
| 01:50.32 | brlcad | I vaguely recall fighting fmax declarations on other platforms a while back |
| 01:50.51 | brlcad | gave up on nirt apparently, #define FMAX(a,b) ((((double)(a))>((double)(b)))?((double)(a)):((double)(b))) |
| 01:51.00 | pacman87 | yeah, i saw that one |
| 01:52.13 | brlcad | if it comes to it, go ahead and add an FMAX and FMIN to vmath.h |
| 01:52.17 | pacman87 | /usr/include/bits/mathcalls.h:__MATHCALL (fmax,, (_Mdouble_ __x, _Mdouble_ __y)); |
| 01:52.25 | brlcad | that's it |
| 01:53.40 | pacman87 | /usr/include/tgmath.h:#define fmax(Val1, Val2) __TGMATH_BINARY_REAL_ONLY (Val1, Val2, fmax) |
| 01:54.34 | brlcad | so either that __MATHCALL macro requires math.h coming after some other header, or mathcalls.h isn't getting included due to some #if inclusion logic, or similar situation |
| 01:56.14 | pacman87 | mathcalls.h is included |
| 01:56.20 | pacman87 | no #if wrapper |
| 01:57.34 | pacman87 | except #ifndef_MATH_H |
| 01:58.37 | brlcad | hmm.. but it is included before __MATHCALL is defined |
| 01:59.16 | pacman87 | __MATHCALL is defined on line 54 |
| 01:59.26 | pacman87 | #include <bits/mathcalls.h> is line 71 |
| 02:00.34 | brlcad | oh, I was looking at mathdef.h |
| 02:01.22 | brlcad | ah, it is wrapped |
| 02:01.51 | brlcad | add this before #include <math.h> .. #define __USE_MISC 1 |
| 02:02.05 | brlcad | might be SoL |
| 02:02.23 | brlcad | as it's a c99 macro, and it's not providing it unless in c99 mode |
| 02:04.09 | brlcad | so you can either cheat and just declare them yourself, extern double fmax(double, double); or do the FMAX/FMIN thing for now |
| 02:04.39 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:04.47 | brlcad | since it's c99, configure would need to test for it and conditionally use it or provide it (which would still warrant a FMIN/FMAX) |
| 02:04.57 | brlcad | yeah, it probably unsets it |
| 02:05.34 | pacman87 | so add FMAX/FMIN to vmath.h, or somewhere else? |
| 02:05.49 | brlcad | didn't follow through all the logic, it's going to be one of the extension defines |
| 02:06.03 | brlcad | or adding -std=c99 as a cflag, etc |
| 02:06.09 | brlcad | which we can't do just yet |
| 02:06.34 | pacman87 | well, running the code doesn't blow up anything |
| 02:06.40 | brlcad | well, we could and it should work, but c89 strict hasn't been 100% tested (we're almost done) |
| 02:07.38 | brlcad | it's still resolved by the -lm symbol or the built-in |
| 02:08.04 | brlcad | no different than not including stdlib for exit(), just calls to exit will still work |
| 02:09.18 | brlcad | actually, add it to common.h -- it's not specific to vector or matrix math |
| 02:09.28 | brlcad | nor specific to libbn |
| 02:11.56 | pacman87 | #define FMAX(a, b)(((a)>(b))?(a):(b)); |
| 02:11.56 | pacman87 | #define FMIN(a, b)(((a)<(b))?(a):(b)); |
| 02:12.13 | pacman87 | or without the ; |
| 02:12.34 | pacman87 | s/or/err, |
| 02:16.39 | pacman87 | i'm looking at moving my open sketch detection to sketch from revolve's prep |
| 02:16.52 | pacman87 | since i'll need it for revolve's plot() too |
| 02:17.10 | pacman87 | so plot() shows the lines needed to close the sketch |
| 02:22.32 | brlcad | without the ; |
| 02:22.52 | pacman87 | brlcad: yeah, i fixed it |
| 02:24.00 | brlcad | consider adding a file to src/librt/primitives/here.c since it's shared so there isn't cross-primitive referencing |
| 02:24.35 | brlcad | not a huge deal, but part of the refactoring cleanup that would be good to work towards for some of the "combo" primitives |
| 02:26.04 | pacman87 | was wondering why it should be called 'here.c' |
| 02:26.22 | pacman87 | then i realized it was the location |
| 02:28.31 | brlcad | heh |
| 02:37.11 | ``Erik | y'know, uh, ... listening to some of the originals that metallica covered in their early years... metallica waren't nothin' special... they kinda sucked, really |
| 02:37.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31829 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ (revolve/revolve.c sketch/sketch.c): add rt_sketch_bounds() to sketch.c; fix rt_revolve_prep() to use rt_sketch_bounds() in calculating bounding volume |
| 02:38.28 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31830 10/brlcad/trunk/include/common.h: add FMAX() and FMIN() |
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| 02:55.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Agreed about the low res image(s), but I'm not sure what we can do about it at this late date :-/ |
| 03:07.39 | brlcad | where'd they come from? |
| 03:09.20 | brlcad | ``Erik: you see the note about the summit? |
| 03:10.05 | brlcad | leslie shared the date, 25th/26th |
| 03:10.15 | brlcad | pretty cool that it's two days this year |
| 03:11.05 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 03:12.20 | brlcad | awesome! .. new handbrake works much much better now |
| 03:20.03 | starseeker | brlcad: dunno where they came from |
| 03:20.28 | brlcad | er, you mean the images in the .doc are that small? |
| 03:20.37 | starseeker | yep |
| 03:20.38 | brlcad | they wouldn't have printed well at that resolution |
| 03:20.51 | brlcad | hunts for vol III |
| 03:20.54 | starseeker | well, maybe my extraction routine made a hash of them... |
| 03:25.11 | Ralith | starseeker: at least a few of them can be regenerated from scratch, can't they? |
| 03:25.44 | starseeker | The simple ones like diagrams, sure. The tank raytraces are something else again |
| 03:31.03 | brlcad | yeah, it's dropping it from 300dpi to 100dpi or something on extraction from the looks of it |
| 03:31.10 | starseeker | grr |
| 03:31.24 | brlcad | not that it'd look any better, just minor aliasing artifacts |
| 03:31.42 | brlcad | just not suitable for print |
| 03:32.14 | starseeker | hmm. can they be regenerated at higher res? |
| 03:32.29 | starseeker | thought maybe they were deliberately low res for release |
| 03:33.08 | brlcad | those probably could or manually extracted from the doc or scripted capture |
| 03:33.58 | brlcad | the doc compilation would probably run an image 'compile' to generate the right resolution depending on the target |
| 03:36.05 | starseeker | only if the models are to hand during the doc build... |
| 03:39.10 | brlcad | yeah, most of those could be generated with a simple script |
| 03:39.28 | brlcad | would make for a nice testing suite too |
| 03:39.37 | starseeker | what about the text overlays? |
| 03:39.40 | brlcad | something for later maybe |
| 03:39.45 | brlcad | sure, that's doable |
| 03:39.49 | brlcad | that's just mged plotting |
| 03:39.59 | brlcad | you can extract the mged overlay now |
| 03:40.50 | brlcad | they just entered edit mode so it displays the label, then captured a screenshot |
| 03:41.16 | starseeker | are we both looking at the tank raytracings at the beginning of Volume III? |
| 03:41.30 | brlcad | could just as easily extract that data as ps/plot data and run pl-fb to get the image |
| 03:41.40 | brlcad | no, i'm talking about the wireframes |
| 03:42.08 | brlcad | the tank images can't be regenerated of course, we don't have the models |
| 03:42.28 | brlcad | would just keep a high-res copy of the image and it'd downsample as needed |
| 03:42.59 | brlcad | er, "could" regenerate it, just not on the fly |
| 03:44.17 | starseeker | Ah, ok wireframes |
| 04:16.44 | poolio | I think I thought of the fix to the NMG brep code while watching Hancock :D |
| 04:18.28 | poolio | Time to see if it'll work :) |
| 04:23.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31831 10/brlcad/trunk/ (Makefile.am include/conf/Makefile.am): make the reported compilation time reset every time 'make' is invoked so that the numbers are a little more meaningful for users pulling a dist and for partial recompiles. |
| 04:24.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31832 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: minor cleanup in rt_revolve_prep(); remember to save your final changes before comitting |
| 04:55.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31833 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/db5.h src/librt/db_match.c): |
| 04:55.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: add reference counting support for revolve primitives since they reference other |
| 04:55.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: objects (sketches), used by tops, xpush, and possibly a couple other mged |
| 04:55.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: commands. requires providing DB5_MINORTYPEs for revolve and a slew of other new |
| 04:55.03 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: objects that have since been added. stupid to maintain two listings like this. |
| 05:03.29 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
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| 06:22.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31834 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: |
| 06:22.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: fixed a bug detected by the solids regression test where dsp primitives were |
| 06:22.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: failing due to the change made in r31629 that made the converted the dsp's |
| 06:22.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: former rt_parsetab_tclget() (now rt_dsp_get()) routine from |
| 06:22.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Tcl_DStringAppendElement to bu_vls_printf calls which are not equivalent. The |
| 06:22.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Tcl_DStringAppendElement() calls automatically pad spaces, so have to manually |
| 06:23.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: pad the bu_vls_printf() call. |
| 06:46.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31835 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parse.c: |
| 06:46.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: and we come full circle. perform a strcat instead of a strcpy so it doesn't |
| 06:46.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: clobber what's already written to log. that said, it's still BUSTED bad. not |
| 06:46.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: only does it only log instead of setting the var, it also still ends up smashed |
| 06:46.59 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: against the next logged item (see solids.sh regression test for db put dsp.s, |
| 06:47.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: broken) |
| 06:48.33 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 06:56.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31836 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: d_rossberg's suspicion was spot on, need to unbreak mged get/put commands and structparsing with %S formatters. it's been busted since r31629 and r31609 in particular from a couple weeks ago. |
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| 08:34.00 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31837 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parse.c: reactivated the %S format (string copy to struct bu_vls) in bu_structparse_argv |
| 08:38.24 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31838 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): changed the sketch_name in rt_revolve_internal to struct bu_vls to handle strings correctly |
| 08:50.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31839 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: changed the sketch_name type in rt_revolve_internal |
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| 10:33.27 | mafm | hiya |
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| 11:32.54 | mafm | brlcad: trackball and shift-grips should be active at the same time? (be the same "camera mode") |
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| 13:46.56 | brlcad | mafm: no, those are two separate manners of interaction |
| 13:48.29 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 13:48.49 | pacman87 | morning, all |
| 13:50.03 | ``Erik | salut |
| 13:53.14 | brlcad | hola |
| 14:00.06 | poolio | mornin' |
| 14:07.06 | d_rossberg | moin moin pacman87 |
| 14:07.07 | mafm | goody, so two different camera modes :D |
| 14:07.31 | mafm | inventing a new way of development... refartoring before even commiting :P |
| 14:07.36 | *** join/#brlcad cad00 (n=cec31333@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:07.41 | mafm | hi pacman87 |
| 14:09.21 | mafm | refart lol... refact*oring |
| 14:12.08 | brlcad | haha |
| 14:15.15 | mafm | now I can't complain if somebody tells me that my code is shit :| |
| 14:17.04 | ``Erik | because you re-farted it? |
| 14:23.58 | mafm | yep |
| 14:24.06 | mafm | is like when something talks by burping :) |
| 14:24.28 | ``Erik | lifts a cheek and lets some code out :D |
| 14:27.06 | mafm | lol |
| 14:27.18 | mafm | would avoid to go to any brl-cad hackaton |
| 14:27.53 | ``Erik | yeah, people would be confused at all the candles in the room O.o |
| 14:31.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31840 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: implemented rt_sketch_degree() |
| 14:35.21 | mafm | candles? |
| 14:35.44 | ``Erik | sure, some code might be flammable :D and that'd be cool |
| 14:36.27 | mafm | lol |
| 14:37.07 | mafm | BRL CAD's Flaming Circus |
| 14:38.01 | ``Erik | the trick is getting everyone to code in sync to cut off 'liberty bell' |
| 14:41.59 | mafm | :D |
| 14:48.23 | d_rossberg | pacman87: you should compute the hit_point member of struct hit in rt_revolve_norm as your comment on this function says (maybe other members are missing too) |
| 14:51.36 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: VJOIN1( hitp->hit_point, rp->r_pt, hitp->hit_dist, rp->r_dir ); |
| 14:52.04 | pacman87 | does adding that line to norm() fix it? |
| 14:52.44 | clock_ | And then get all the primitives sing "This is the CAD we live in!" |
| 14:52.57 | pacman87 | ...? |
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| 14:53.27 | d_rossberg | pacman87: something like this, yes |
| 14:54.51 | d_rossberg | it looks like the rt command doesn't need this, but my application does |
| 14:55.41 | pacman87 | i'm allocating memory using bu_calloc in prep(), and storing it in revolve_specific - when should it be free'd? |
| 14:56.13 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 14:56.46 | pacman87 | just free the revolve_specific pointer before assigning the new data? |
| 14:59.58 | brlcad | burst, g_lint, lgt, nirt, and a few others need the hit_point too |
| 15:02.15 | d_rossberg | rt_revolve_free ? |
| 15:02.37 | pacman87 | does that always get called after prep? |
| 15:05.51 | d_rossberg | as far as i can see: yes |
| 15:34.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31841 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Commands.h GeometryConversion.cxx GeometryConversion.h): Fixing typo in name -- missing 'h' |
| 15:46.49 | mafm | does anybody know if there is a document like this for trackball mode? |
| 15:47.08 | mafm | http://brlcad.org/w/images/8/8c/Shift_Grips_Quick_Reference_Guide.pdf |
| 15:53.08 | brlcad | mafm: download AoI or Blender, their defaults are trackball-style |
| 15:55.55 | brlcad | trackball is merely a "rotate viewpoint" default |
| 15:57.38 | brlcad | AoI -> http://www.artofillusion.org/downloads |
| 15:59.02 | brlcad | similar to control-click with shift-grips |
| 15:59.31 | mafm | but I mean also with keys |
| 16:00.13 | mafm | would be arrow keys only? |
| 16:00.27 | brlcad | *confused* |
| 16:01.08 | brlcad | your question doesn't make any sense to me |
| 16:01.16 | brlcad | i also mean with keys too |
| 16:01.53 | brlcad | shift-grips .. is centered around key-bindings, and even without mouse arrow-keys still modify the view (they rotate iirc) |
| 16:03.31 | brlcad | in the end, all we're talking about is 1) key bindings and 2) view modifications ... sets of 1+2 => an interaction style |
| 16:04.12 | brlcad | shift-grips is one interaction style, the one used by mged with all the binding-to-view modifications spelled out in that guide (the key-only bindings are listed, but they're trivial) |
| 16:06.06 | brlcad | think of the view modifications as a 'tool' you might select (ala photoshop/gimp): e.g., zoom in/out, rotate freely, translate freely, rotate vertical, rotate horizontal, translate left/right, translate up/down, etc |
| 16:06.21 | brlcad | those map to input events |
| 16:10.50 | mafm | bleh |
| 16:10.57 | mafm | I'm dragging into all this :S |
| 16:55.05 | mafm | yay! |
| 16:55.10 | mafm | got something working at last :) |
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| 17:12.27 | esben__ | Hi, I'm using version 7.12.5 and when I try to raytrace something and try to underlay the framebuffer the wireframe version still gets hidden behind the frame buffer. Is this the intended behaviour or should I post a bug report ? |
| 17:15.11 | esben__ | I also posted this question on the user mailing list as I am living in Denmark and therefore is not available because of the time difference when you guys from the U.S. are on this channel |
| 17:29.44 | starseeker | stokes his courage with caffine and takes a look at firebirds title page xsl... |
| 17:35.34 | brlcad | esben__: I've seen the mailing list question, just haven't had a chance to look into it or reply |
| 17:36.26 | ``Erik | some people here are in non-us timezones, some people keep odd hours, and some of us read backlog and reply (eventually) |
| 17:37.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31842 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Commiting more flexible Camera system, having camera with different camera modes. Still WIP, but it's already working better than my previous attemps to control the view. |
| 17:43.55 | esben__ | Thanks Sean. I'll just wait for the reply then. About reading backlog I do that too, when I have time... |
| 17:45.17 | poolio | errr wut: cannot convert âface_g_plane*â to âfage_g_plane*â in assignment |
| 17:45.29 | poolio | Those two look the same to me. |
| 17:49.32 | ``Erik | face fage? |
| 17:49.51 | poolio | D'OH. |
| 17:50.00 | poolio | I should get my eyes checked |
| 17:50.24 | ``Erik | pop 'em out and mail 'em to a service center |
| 18:04.07 | brlcad | esben__: basically 7.12.5 implies you're using trunk sources .. which is somewhat unstable right now -- I just tried 7.12.2 and can't reproduce what you're saying |
| 18:04.22 | brlcad | maybe someone else can try trunk (don't have a compile handy atm) |
| 18:04.54 | brlcad | esben__: otherwise, no that's not expected behavior -- underlay should show the wireframe (unless the wireframe is the same color as the framebuffer of course) |
| 18:05.25 | brlcad | hehe, nice one poolio |
| 18:06.01 | brlcad | mafm: the site with your screenshots seems down, is it just from here or really down down? |
| 18:08.00 | poolio | brlcad: =( |
| 18:08.43 | brlcad | :) |
| 18:18.43 | mafm | brlcad: it's apache2 that sometimes dies... restarted |
| 18:19.01 | poolio | brlcad: so I'm trying to compute a rectangular bounding box for a given set of points on a plane. To do this, I'm letting the first point we look at be the "origin," the second point defines the direction of the x-axis/u, and then I project onto the x/y axis to find the min/max points |
| 18:19.09 | poolio | Does that seem reasonable or am I making this way too complicated? |
| 18:26.58 | starseeker | brlcad: I take it clone is also going to need some libged lov'in at some point? |
| 18:29.41 | mafm | brlcad: one of the things that I wanted to ask before is if there's a set of keys predetermined for trackball mode -- if it's the arrows keys, or other... |
| 18:33.43 | mafm | (demand overflow :P) |
| 18:38.46 | ``Erik | heh, "teach yourself programming in 10 years" |
| 18:40.33 | mafm | me with old voice: say 10 years, you punk? Ain't learn Cobol in less than 50, all those verbose sentences... |
| 18:41.10 | mafm | :P |
| 18:41.10 | mafm | missing / :) |
| 18:41.10 | ``Erik | http://www.norvig.com/21-days.html |
| 18:43.27 | brlcad | mafm: you're welcome to have an account on brlcad.org, if you're interested |
| 18:43.41 | mafm | yup, I read it like 10 days ago ``Erik :) |
| 18:43.51 | brlcad | would give you a brlcad.org/~mafm as well as the ability to put stuff under brlcad.org itself |
| 18:44.00 | ``Erik | heh, really? nutty :) |
| 18:44.12 | ``Erik | only $50/mo ? :D *duck* |
| 18:45.11 | mafm | well, if you think that it's worth having it... I would only use it for the screenies atm (I don't know even if I can upload them to the wiki) |
| 18:46.32 | brlcad | you can upload them into the wiki too, that's open -- but yeah I think it's worth having myself ;) |
| 18:46.36 | ``Erik | the dep chain for darcs is brutal O.o |
| 18:46.59 | mafm | ok then |
| 18:47.47 | mafm | I hope that I don't have to send my police file to us army or anything :PPP |
| 18:47.57 | brlcad | mafm: for the account, go to http://bzflag.bz/ hit the link in the bottom right, and go from there (has you do something) |
| 18:48.07 | brlcad | it's not a govt server |
| 18:48.38 | brlcad | it's just one I provide for cad, bz, and a couple dozen other purposes |
| 18:49.50 | mafm | lol, a hidden pixel in the website! |
| 18:50.00 | mafm | I don't hear from that since 1997 or so |
| 18:50.27 | brlcad | it's not hidden, but yeah a lil historic fun ;) |
| 18:51.01 | ``Erik | such a lame movie, though :) |
| 18:51.12 | ``Erik | had several tiny pi's on pages back in the day O.o |
| 18:51.30 | brlcad | yeah, it was very cheesy |
| 18:51.36 | brlcad | but memorable :) |
| 18:52.01 | ``Erik | um, I just remember the pi symbol and that sandra bullock is lame |
| 18:52.02 | ``Erik | :D |
| 18:52.14 | brlcad | if I could get voice authentication working over javascript, you'd have to say "my voice is my passport, verify me .. please" |
| 18:52.50 | ``Erik | scoots his office away from brlcad's |
| 18:53.55 | brlcad | hacks the gibson to send ``Erik streaming porn backed with disney music |
| 18:54.27 | mafm | have to rush to the supermarket for bread before they close, bbiab :D |
| 18:54.50 | ``Erik | heh |
| 18:54.52 | brlcad | poolio: x-axis/u ? |
| 18:54.59 | ``Erik | don't get dizzy from flying around all those cubes |
| 18:55.11 | ``Erik | excuse me while I go make out with angelina's jolies |
| 18:55.13 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 18:55.19 | starseeker | starts pondering very basic naming functions as a way to think about an increment providing library |
| 18:55.26 | ``Erik | would you like to play a game? |
| 18:55.32 | brlcad | poolio: if you just want a projected 2d bounding box, just look at their x,y values and min/max them all |
| 18:56.23 | brlcad | global thermonuclear war |
| 18:56.42 | pacman87 | i finally saw that last year |
| 18:56.56 | pacman87 | didn't realize how many quotes from there i'd already heard |
| 18:57.00 | ``Erik | heh |
| 18:57.22 | ``Erik | or jurassic park, "I recognize this.. it's UNIX!" |
| 18:57.26 | ``Erik | with an old indy |
| 18:57.48 | brlcad | "ah ah ah ... [wags finger] ... ah ah ah" |
| 18:58.07 | ``Erik | after I saw sphere, I ran and wrote a little random print/sleep loop in C to emulate what was going on their terminals heh |
| 18:58.36 | ``Erik | and, uh, brlcad, YOU have to blow the computer. |
| 18:58.46 | poolio | brlcad: that only works if the plane lies in the z-axis though |
| 18:59.02 | poolio | I want to look at their "x,y" values on the plane and min/max them all |
| 18:59.23 | pacman87 | poolio: so you're projecting 3d points onto an arbitrary plane? |
| 18:59.40 | poolio | well, those 3d points are all on the plane |
| 18:59.56 | ``Erik | grar, still getting errors on my mac |
| 19:00.30 | brlcad | poolio: what is it that you're actually trying to do from a higher level? |
| 19:01.50 | poolio | Create a planar surface for the brep |
| 19:02.30 | poolio | So have the rectangular plane, then cut out the surface inside of that plane |
| 19:02.43 | poolio | well, rectangular surface, and cut out the proper shape of the surface inside of it |
| 19:03.12 | poolio | So for example, if I have a triangle, I want to first create a rectangle that surrounds the triangle, and then cut the triangle out of that rectangle (using trimming curves) |
| 19:04.22 | pacman87 | so the triangle verticies are your 3d points, and you need to know what size rectangle you need to contain them? |
| 19:05.43 | poolio | yes |
| 19:06.51 | pacman87 | could you use the 3d bounding box for the 3d points, and transfer that to the 2d plane? |
| 19:09.29 | poolio | hmm, that's probably a much easier way to do it, but I'd have to intersect the plane with the bounding box |
| 19:10.01 | pacman87 | it depends on how many 3d points you have |
| 19:10.52 | pacman87 | if it's only a few, it might be faster to project them all to the plane first |
| 19:11.55 | poolio | It's highly variable |
| 19:12.06 | poolio | I'm thinking that intersecting with the BB is probalby a better way to do it though |
| 19:12.06 | pacman87 | what's the average case? |
| 19:12.33 | poolio | not really sure...it's used to convert any NMG to brep |
| 19:13.13 | poolio | A fairly typical case may be 8 points when used for an arb8, but I'm guessing that there are models with a very large number of points |
| 19:15.39 | poolio | So intersecting with the BB works, but it's not the prettiest in terms of the geometry of the brep. If you have say, a rectangular surface, that is not axis-aligned, then you have to trim the surface at odd angles |
| 19:15.46 | pacman87 | if you know the plane's normal vector, dot it with each of the three axes (x,y,z), and see which is closest to zero. then you can project into that plane by ignoring that coordinate, get your 2d box, and transform it back to the real 2d plane |
| 19:16.35 | pacman87 | poolio: you could try getting a rect bounding box for the intersection... |
| 19:16.53 | poolio | well, it'd be rectangular but the issue is that it's not aligned with the face geometry |
| 19:17.40 | pacman87 | if alignment is worth starting with a larger box, you can just make an aligned box around the first bo |
| 19:17.41 | pacman87 | x |
| 19:18.10 | poolio | ah hmm |
| 19:18.30 | poolio | I'm going to see if my hacked up method works, if not, then yours sounds ... better :) |
| 19:19.03 | ``Erik | laughs evilly as he commits |
| 19:19.06 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31843 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: change to output using bu_image routines instead of straight pix |
| 19:19.08 | pacman87 | is your hacked up the "first point is origin, second is direction of x?" |
| 19:20.15 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 19:20.18 | pacman87 | poolio: and if your worried about aligning your bounding box, wouldnt that determine your x/y directions? |
| 19:20.41 | poolio | Wouldn't what? |
| 19:20.52 | poolio | pacman87: yes |
| 19:21.11 | pacman87 | poolio: yes to which: hacked up, or directions? |
| 19:21.23 | poolio | hacked up |
| 19:22.13 | pacman87 | if you need your bounding box to be aligned, you should use those axes you want to be aligned to, instead of an arbitrary set |
| 19:22.15 | poolio | That determines x/y directions. So I could just take the bounding box, create a new bounding box that's properly aligned and encloses the previous box. Then intersect the aligned box |
| 19:22.55 | poolio | pacman87: When I say aligned, I mean aligned with the geometry, not aligned with the x/y/z axis |
| 19:23.08 | poolio | I think I'm confusing both you and myself :( |
| 19:25.33 | pacman87 | so the aligned box has its own axes (u,v)? |
| 19:26.01 | poolio | yes |
| 19:26.23 | pacman87 | do you know what those axes are before you create the first bounding box? |
| 19:28.16 | poolio | well, the first bounding box is automatically created and axis aligned |
| 19:28.25 | poolio | (the standard min_pt, max_pt) |
| 19:28.46 | poolio | So, no. |
| 19:31.47 | esben__ | brlcad: Thanks. Do you need more info ? I go to bed now so lets continue over mail if you need more info. I the mean time I discovered another strange thing which I will report on the user list tomorrow Good night when you get that far. |
| 19:32.03 | mafm | back |
| 19:34.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31844 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Removing previous (and now unneeded) hacks related with camera positioning |
| 19:36.37 | pacman87 | poolio: ah, i was thinking if you already knew the u,v axes you wanted for the aligned bounding box, you could use those axes directly in determining max/min bounds for your points, and skip the "aligned bounding box around the x/y/z bounding box" |
| 19:37.57 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.196.59) | |
| 19:38.18 | pacman87 | though i'm not quite sure what you mean by 'automatically created'; i though you were the one making the bounding box |
| 19:39.57 | poolio | Well, the NMG primitive has a min_pt and max_pt for a face |
| 19:46.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31845 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: fix revolve's norm(), broken by trying to be too clever; incremental improvements to plot() for handling partial revolves of open sketches - draw lines to close sketches |
| 19:50.32 | starseeker | Anybody know the "right" way in C to ask for the number of characters in an integer? |
| 19:50.52 | ``Erik | erm, snprintf and strlen it? |
| 19:51.05 | ``Erik | or do a reduction loop? |
| 19:51.07 | starseeker | right - that's the right way? |
| 19:51.18 | starseeker | was hoping for charlength(number) or something cute |
| 19:51.28 | ``Erik | not that I know of |
| 19:51.32 | starseeker | phooey |
| 19:51.34 | starseeker | ok |
| 19:51.35 | starseeker | thanks |
| 19:52.22 | ``Erik | { int i = 1, x = val; while( x>10 ) { ++i; x /= 10; } printf("%d\n", i); } |
| 19:52.44 | pacman87 | don't forget about the negative |
| 19:53.17 | ``Erik | ok, abs(x)>10, ptbtbbt |
| 19:53.30 | pacman87 | and add a char for the ' |
| 19:53.32 | pacman87 | -' |
| 19:53.35 | ``Erik | (plus, I suppose, the -) |
| 19:54.22 | starseeker | bu_log("%d\n",snprintf(NULL, 0, "%d",i)); seems to do what I need |
| 19:54.24 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 19:55.26 | ``Erik | heh, string length of a number, silly lithper :D |
| 19:55.30 | ``Erik | "Mom? Whats 6 x 8?" "Oh sweetie, those are two completely different numbers!" |
| 19:57.49 | ``Erik | doesn't know that he'd trust writing 0 bytes to a NULL ptr to return the real length instead of 0 or -1 |
| 20:01.03 | starseeker | OK, now question two. How to make printf use a number in a variable, e.g. printf("%numofspacesd",integer); |
| 20:01.13 | mafm | I go now, take care folks :) |
| 20:01.19 | ``Erik | "% 4d" |
| 20:01.28 | ``Erik | ? |
| 20:01.30 | starseeker | yes, but 4 is in a variable |
| 20:01.35 | ``Erik | oh |
| 20:02.10 | ``Erik | char fmt[BUFSIZ]; snprintf(fmt, "%%%dd", x); printf(fmt, i); |
| 20:02.38 | ``Erik | minus the bugs/typos |
| 20:02.56 | starseeker | Does vls have anything? |
| 20:03.22 | ``Erik | Iuhho |
| 20:04.02 | Ralith | %%%dd looks more like your repeat rate is set too high than a valid format string |
| 20:05.17 | starseeker | hunts |
| 20:05.18 | ``Erik | printf("%%%dd\n", 4); will print "%4d" |
| 20:05.30 | Ralith | I know |
| 20:05.37 | Ralith | it's just kinda funny :P |
| 20:05.43 | ``Erik | :D could be worse |
| 20:05.46 | Ralith | true |
| 20:05.50 | ``Erik | take a look at lisps format notation |
| 20:05.52 | Ralith | this is C, after all |
| 20:06.07 | ``Erik | so many weird ~ commands that you'll get seasick from the waves :D |
| 20:06.12 | Ralith | hehe |
| 20:06.40 | pacman87 | http://xkcd.com/234/ |
| 20:07.54 | ``Erik | http://xkcd.com/224 :) |
| 20:08.04 | ``Erik | is in a very lisp state of mind at the moment |
| 20:08.19 | ``Erik | time to swap brains with cliff for a bit O.o |
| 20:08.49 | starseeker | I wouldn't do that if I were you :-) |
| 20:09.44 | ``Erik | doesn't grok how to address a thread in sbcl |
| 20:10.46 | ``Erik | like, I see one from (sb-thread:list-all-threads) I want defined as #<SB-THREAD "some name" {432135}> and I want to (sb-thread:terminate-thread 'it) |
| 20:11.29 | ``Erik | do (car (sb-thread:list-all-threads)) to get the legit pointer to the object? |
| 20:11.40 | ``Erik | tries |
| 20:12.51 | ``Erik | yuh oh, now sbcl isn't seeing the packages I installed with asdf |
| 20:13.03 | starseeker | has actually never delt with sbcl threads |
| 20:13.34 | ``Erik | bah, fat lot of good you are :D *duck* |
| 20:15.33 | ``Erik | ah, the car approach works |
| 20:31.02 | starseeker | ``Erik: Thanks - it looks strange but it does work |
| 20:31.48 | ``Erik | huh? what looks strange? O.o |
| 20:32.07 | ``Erik | oh, generating the format string at runtime? |
| 20:32.16 | starseeker | The format string for sprintf - %%s%%s%%0%dd%%s%%s... |
| 20:32.28 | starseeker | it's getting close to Perl readibility |
| 20:32.41 | ``Erik | heh |
| 20:32.58 | ``Erik | that's why C programmers comment ugly things like that O:-) |
| 21:37.26 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (n=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 22:26.01 | pacman87 | poolio: how'd your bounding work out? |
| 22:35.24 | poolio | pacman87: welllllll. I think it's working right...but there's still a bug somewhere |
| 22:35.33 | poolio | pacman87: Ask me again in about an hour :) |
| 22:37.36 | pacman87 | good luck |
| 22:42.58 | poolio | Make that ... a few more hours...going to see hellboy ii :) |
| 22:53.36 | ``Erik | heh |
| 00:03.34 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 00:48.48 | Ralith | I don't suppose the SoC rules allow third parties to aid development? |
| 00:48.55 | Ralith | (not counting the mentor) |
| 00:58.36 | Ralith | Can one even get ahold of the code from the current SoC projects? |
| 01:00.38 | Ralith | Also, just how much of a task might a realtime shaded view be? |
| 01:12.28 | brlcad | Ralith: sure they do |
| 01:12.52 | brlcad | collaboration and integration is actually highly encouraged |
| 01:13.23 | brlcad | the student just can't use that as a crutch to not do work and the collaboration can't negatively impact their ability to do work |
| 01:15.24 | Ralith | oo! |
| 01:15.34 | Ralith | in that case, where can I get at the new GUI code? |
| 01:16.06 | brlcad | the main point of gsoc is actually to (hopefully) make them new (long-term) developers, build up our dev team .. not just for them to work on a project |
| 01:16.32 | brlcad | the new gui code is sitting in the rt^3 branch |
| 01:16.35 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 01:16.36 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 01:17.15 | Ralith | woo |
| 01:17.17 | Ralith | thanks |
| 01:17.18 | brlcad | replace brlcad/brlcad with brlcad/rt^3 (and brlcad with rt^3 |
| 01:17.33 | Ralith | is there summary of the branches anywhere? |
| 01:17.53 | brlcad | yeah, it's asking one of the devs in here or on the mailing list ;) |
| 01:18.01 | Ralith | consider yourself asked |
| 01:19.13 | brlcad | there are 5 top level "modules" that came over from our cvs repo, seen at http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/ |
| 01:19.49 | brlcad | brlcad is the main codebase, core libraries, the big hot dog kahuna mamma million lines of cadness |
| 01:20.26 | Ralith | oh, so it's not actual code branches, just organization? |
| 01:20.41 | brlcad | jbrlcad is/was a test project by one of the core devs that implemented a (very very small) portion of our "librt" raytrace library in pure java |
| 01:20.51 | Ralith | heh |
| 01:21.19 | brlcad | there are also branches, potentially, for each of these modules -- though afaik, 'brlcad' is the only one that has branches and STABLE is the only one of interest atm |
| 01:21.21 | Ralith | a raytracing library in java; you don't hear about that every day |
| 01:21.44 | brlcad | it was actually a rather enlightening exercise |
| 01:21.48 | Ralith | oh? |
| 01:22.34 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-154-132.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 01:22.41 | brlcad | not so much the java part but how we can go about restructuring our huge librt library into an object-oriented framework (hint: it surprisingly converts over very neatly) |
| 01:23.11 | brlcad | librt is at brl-cad's core, it provides the geometric representation, data i/o, primitives, boolean operations, ray-trace evaluation, etc |
| 01:23.42 | Ralith | is there much to be gained from such a restructure, though? |
| 01:24.36 | brlcad | rtcmp is another pet project for comparing librt ray-trace results against our libtie high-performance "triangle intersection" library (as well as another closed source lib) |
| 01:26.16 | brlcad | my bad, misspoke we wouldn't want to replace librt with such a restructuring -- s/restructuring our huge librt/structuring a new object-oriented API on top of our librt/ |
| 01:27.13 | brlcad | there is a pretty strong request to also have an oo c++ api in addition to and/or on top of our c libs |
| 01:27.32 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 01:27.50 | brlcad | continuing, the 'web' module is a stubbed (mostly empty) placeholder for revision controlling the website |
| 01:27.52 | Ralith | Isn't that a pretty simple (if lengthy) task? |
| 01:28.11 | brlcad | very lengthy |
| 01:28.23 | brlcad | mostly simple, there are some complex things to sort out |
| 01:28.41 | brlcad | especially how to best leverage our c libs, don't want to rewrite |
| 01:30.41 | brlcad | that leaves the last 'rt^3' module whose original purpose isn't so important, but has become a place to put the new gui and oo geometry engine infrastructure |
| 01:30.44 | brlcad | (don't want to mix C++ in with the brl-cad's C sources any more than we need to) |
| 01:31.30 | brlcad | plus we (directly) manage all external dependencies and the front-end gui has a hell of a lot of dependencies that have nothing to do with the rest of brl-cad |
| 01:31.42 | Ralith | yeah, I noticed that |
| 01:32.10 | Ralith | it seems kind of strange; one doesn't need all that much for such a purpose-specific app. |
| 01:33.03 | Ralith | Is there an existing wiki page buried somewhere that would be good for this info, or shall I start a new one? |
| 01:43.36 | brlcad | there are some pages on the wiki that relate to it |
| 01:44.30 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/OpenGL_GUI_Framework and http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:mafm for starters |
| 01:45.04 | brlcad | otherwise there's not a lot up yet |
| 01:46.23 | Ralith | I was referring to the SVN branch info, actually |
| 01:55.47 | brlcad | oooh |
| 01:55.52 | brlcad | sure, go for it if you like |
| 01:56.36 | brlcad | hugs the wiki and hugs MinuteElectron |
| 02:00.42 | starseeker | Ralith: Actually, you'd be surprised how much a full featured GUI needs |
| 02:01.26 | brlcad | starseeker: that's pretty freaky relying on snprintf(null, 0) like that .. :) might want to pass a valid non-zero-length buffer just in case |
| 02:01.27 | starseeker | at least for something like CAD |
| 02:02.11 | starseeker | brlcad: sure, no problem - is that actually the "right way" to do it? |
| 02:02.25 | starseeker | the snprintf trick works, but eeek |
| 02:02.30 | brlcad | it's certainly "a" way |
| 02:02.38 | brlcad | and at least one supported by c99, dunno about c89 |
| 02:02.46 | starseeker | hmm. |
| 02:03.10 | starseeker | was looking for a "right" way, but will take working... |
| 02:03.45 | brlcad | curious, what doyou need dynamic size for? |
| 02:04.10 | brlcad | usually taboo and potential security issue to have non-const format specifiers |
| 02:05.06 | starseeker | strings with different numbers of digits - prim-0001.s up to prim-1000.s, prim-01.s to prim-10.s, etc |
| 02:05.35 | starseeker | %04d works for the first, %02d for the second |
| 02:06.16 | brlcad | hmm |
| 02:06.17 | starseeker | but if I don't specify the number of zeros needed up front, I get stuff like prim-1.s to prim-10.s |
| 02:06.22 | starseeker | bad |
| 02:06.29 | starseeker | doesn't list nicely |
| 02:06.34 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:07.05 | starseeker | I have a little test routine working using the snprintf trick, which could eventually get put into the get_name logic we discussed |
| 02:07.34 | brlcad | and ideally preserves the original padding, or automatically pads up to the 'n' specified (for cloning) that fits whatever increment |
| 02:07.35 | starseeker | I figured non-const was OK since it's defined in the routine itself based on the input params... |
| 02:07.44 | starseeker | exactly |
| 02:07.51 | brlcad | except the input params are user-provided |
| 02:07.58 | starseeker | right |
| 02:08.06 | starseeker | whoops, gotta run - biab |
| 02:08.08 | brlcad | means it's exactly the sort of case that would need to be extra-checked ;) |
| 02:09.08 | Ralith | starseeker: well, I've seen all sorts of GL-using programs do it *without* ogre |
| 02:09.22 | Ralith | and I have the strong (perhaps incorrect?) perception that ogre is about as heavy as they come |
| 02:09.54 | pacman87 | starseeker: i just remembered you could also use log|x| to find the number of digits |
| 02:09.58 | brlcad | i'd say that's not entirely correct .. ogre's one of the smallest "engines" out there |
| 02:10.17 | brlcad | especially given they only focus on the rendering |
| 02:10.46 | brlcad | iirc, osg was a fair bit bigger, cs is definitely bigger |
| 02:11.26 | Ralith | aren't these all designed for use with things like games? |
| 02:11.36 | brlcad | not at all |
| 02:11.44 | Ralith | I thought the requirements here were far simpler than what those libraries support. |
| 02:12.00 | brlcad | "graphics" applications for those three |
| 02:13.14 | Ralith | well, so long as it works, I suppose. |
| 02:13.23 | Ralith | nothing wrong with a nice, abstract interface |
| 02:13.27 | brlcad | the main reasons for ogre (or any engine) have been to provide proper scenegraph management, automatic LoD, automatic rendering styles, and cross-platform acceleration support |
| 02:13.50 | Ralith | rendering styles? |
| 02:14.29 | pacman87 | digits = floor( log10(number) ) + 1; |
| 02:14.47 | brlcad | home-grown usually has "no" scenegraph management beyond a simple "here display all this stuff" on/off, which is hell for exceptionally large models |
| 02:15.08 | Ralith | that makes sense, given the complexity of things done with brl-acd |
| 02:15.10 | Ralith | cad* |
| 02:15.21 | Ralith | pacman87: neat |
| 02:15.41 | brlcad | rendering styles like non-hidden wireframe, fully-shaded displays, cell-shaded, flat-shaded, hidden wireframe, etc |
| 02:16.22 | pacman87 | Ralith: thanks, my older brother told me about that trick a while ago |
| 02:16.23 | Ralith | so the new GUI's going to include a proper shaded display? :D |
| 02:17.29 | poolio | WOOHOO. NMG -> brep works for all arbs :D |
| 02:17.30 | brlcad | Ralith: yes, that is one of the primary goals |
| 02:17.40 | brlcad | poolio: woot! |
| 02:17.54 | pacman87 | poolio: congrats |
| 02:17.54 | poolio | pacman87: so yes, algorithm did work but it's awfully inefficient |
| 02:18.01 | pacman87 | which one? |
| 02:18.04 | poolio | I probably have ~2 hours worth of code cleanup/etc though |
| 02:18.14 | Ralith | brlcad: awesome! |
| 02:18.37 | brlcad | Ralith: though the main reason mged doesn't do shaded displays has much more to do with geometric representation -- unevaluated implicit surfaces with boolean operations have no intrinsic polygonal representation to send to opengl, it has to be evaluated |
| 02:19.36 | brlcad | to do proper shaded displays of arbitrary geometry requires what poolio is working on right now (unevaluated implicit primitives -> spline surface or polygonal boundary representation primitives) |
| 02:20.06 | brlcad | then CSG evaluation of brep on brep surfaces, then tessellation of breps |
| 02:20.16 | brlcad | *then* we have fully shaded displays of ANY geometry |
| 02:20.20 | poolio | pacman87: The project onto the arbitrary axes, calculate min u/v on that plane -> 3-space |
| 02:21.04 | poolio | It's also nice in that if you have a rotate arb with a rectangular face the surface w/out trimming curves matches up....although that's just nice for staring at /debugging brep output |
| 02:21.14 | brlcad | poolio: that's where coming in to talk with Ed would certainly help, he's great at finding ways to optimize/simplify an algorithm |
| 02:22.14 | brlcad | though I forgot to mention last week that there was something cool you could have gone to today .. :/ |
| 02:22.43 | brlcad | drinks a mt dew for dinner |
| 02:22.44 | poolio | aww man :( was it the tour? |
| 02:23.36 | poolio | brlcad: So do you think it's more important to continue and fully support all types of NMGs (multi-shell/region, inner wire loops, etc...) or supporting other primitives? |
| 02:26.52 | brlcad | poolio: yeah :( |
| 02:27.03 | brlcad | ordnance museum |
| 02:31.05 | brlcad | poolio: if you want to try out other primitives, go for it -- maybe add a section to the top-level TODO or to a doc in src/librt/primitives with details on where you left off at, what's working, and/or what's remaining |
| 02:44.54 | starseeker | brlcad: In this case, I think the check would be that the number of user supplied clones is between 1 and INT_MAX or some such |
| 02:45.11 | starseeker | brlcad: The string size follows directly and internally from that |
| 02:51.34 | brlcad | that's not quite what I mean |
| 02:53.22 | brlcad | if the user can provide the input string (which they are in this case), there's the potential to inject print specifiers of their own -- often in ways that can creatively overrun a buffer and jump to code of their own (security hole) |
| 02:55.08 | brlcad | it'd even be safer to count the number of digits in the pattern and do a for loop that iterates over printing "%c" to print each digit one at a time, or a case table that supports a set of sizes .. but all of them still using a constant format specifier |
| 03:02.25 | starseeker | I don't quite see - the user isn't providing the string, except to specify they want an incrementer in position x |
| 03:03.24 | starseeker | according to what you outlined this evening, they aren't supplying any strings at all except for an already valid primitive name |
| 03:05.08 | starseeker | Or are you thinking some operation that doesn't use an existing primitive? |
| 03:06.15 | starseeker | is just trying to envision an attack vector |
| 03:12.34 | brlcad | more around the idea that you're implementing a general librt routine for naming objects and don't really know where the input string comes from |
| 03:13.48 | brlcad | could come up with a variety of example, but say specific to clone's case, the modeler says "clone my_object_0000.c -n 100" .. |
| 03:14.47 | brlcad | that my_object_0000.c would be the pattern you'd want to fit to and probably even start from (at least dwayne has said as much, and I believe clone already tries to preserve such existing numerations) |
| 03:16.05 | brlcad | especially if the pattern in that case was something like {prefix}{num}{suffix}, so it matches 0000 and you'd expect to end up with my_object_0100.c and so on |
| 03:17.08 | starseeker | OK, that's a good argument for digit counting, if there are any, and comparing it to what is needed by the arg to -n |
| 03:18.15 | starseeker | but I still don't see how it presents an attack vector - in the end it's just a count of digits and reading them in as an int |
| 03:19.24 | starseeker | I suppose you could do an append operation to add chars as numbers one at a time, but ouch... |
| 03:24.03 | brlcad | could do lots of twisted things with something like: clone my_%n_0000.c |
| 03:24.27 | brlcad | and various variations thereof |
| 03:26.34 | poolio | oo. Never had "]]))" appear in my C code before :P |
| 03:26.48 | brlcad | the point wasn't so much to come up with a specific failure case, there are plenty of links throughout the web for tricks you can play ;) |
| 03:29.31 | brlcad | the point was more "try to structure the processing so you don't need dynamic format specifiers" -- just about any dynamic format specifier can be turned into a loop, then you just need to do some basic sanity checking |
| 03:35.55 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:36.36 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 03:37.08 | yukonbob | what's happening, my friend? |
| 03:39.51 | starseeker | brlcad: OK... I'll have to run it by you once I've got something written. (Maybe we could just disallow % in primitive names? ;-) |
| 03:40.24 | starseeker | hates having to deal with individual characters when there are more powerful tools available |
| 03:43.10 | starseeker | Oh, well... I guess that's life |
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| 04:27.22 | brlcad | starseeker: like I said, you're making a new public api call -- that's where the checking needs to occur to be 'secure' regardless of whatever validation/limitations that mged or other apps impose on their end |
| 04:27.52 | poolio | brlcad: I think I'm getting some weird C/C++ header confusion. I'm including vmath.h but it's not picking up the constant definitions, like 'X', and 'Y' |
| 04:28.19 | poolio | If I also include 'dm.h' I get the X,Y, and Z but not W/H |
| 04:28.26 | brlcad | poolio: hum, perhaps some subsequent header is undefining them |
| 04:28.54 | brlcad | try adding it last to test |
| 04:28.58 | poolio | It's the last one included... but maybe one of the previous header includes it as well |
| 04:29.59 | poolio | ah hmm: |
| 04:30.09 | poolio | brep.h:#undef X |
| 04:31.05 | brlcad | yeah, I forget exactly what that was needed |
| 04:31.34 | brlcad | those are such general symbols, iirc there was some borkage deep in the c++ template headers |
| 04:31.42 | brlcad | or it was something in the openNURBS headers |
| 04:32.12 | poolio | Yeah...has a XXX ack, a hack comment. I can't force it because rtgeom.h includes vmath.h and then brep.h |
| 04:32.31 | poolio | The only thing to do seems to be to just add a definition myself |
| 04:32.58 | brlcad | you can change our header logic to accommodate |
| 04:33.17 | brlcad | conditionally def/undef or redef after undef, etc |
| 04:38.17 | poolio | brlcad: do you remember what it broke? |
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| 05:16.23 | Ralith | hm, Ogre seems to depend on CEGUI. I wonder if that can be cut out. |
| 05:45.47 | brlcad | Ralith: it doesn't/shouldn't depend on it, though some of their code samples may |
| 05:45.54 | brlcad | poolio: compilation ;) |
| 05:46.24 | Ralith | smacks ports |
| 05:46.29 | Ralith | I disabled code samples >:| |
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| 06:05.20 | brlcad | Ralith: bsder? |
| 06:05.34 | Ralith | yep |
| 06:05.35 | Ralith | freebsd |
| 06:05.42 | brlcad | awesome |
| 06:05.50 | Ralith | o/ |
| 06:05.55 | Ralith | wrestling with porting Mocha right now |
| 06:06.14 | Ralith | mafm come on here ever? |
| 06:06.20 | brlcad | you did hopefully see that the sources are in the rt^3 module I hope? :) |
| 06:06.28 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:06.32 | brlcad | they require some minor patches and latest sources |
| 06:06.32 | Ralith | I'm worrying about deps |
| 06:06.42 | Ralith | oh, they're already made portable? |
| 06:06.42 | Ralith | cool |
| 06:06.51 | Ralith | oh! |
| 06:06.54 | Ralith | I see what you meant |
| 06:07.00 | brlcad | they're in src/other |
| 06:07.04 | Ralith | kk |
| 06:07.24 | brlcad | he included some makefile logic to build them |
| 06:07.51 | brlcad | but forewarning that it's not been tested by more than just a couple people so far, so not compilation-robust |
| 06:08.10 | Ralith | that's what I'm here for |
| 06:08.24 | Ralith | if I wasn't happy to be testing and making patches, I wouldn't have checked out SVN code. |
| 06:08.32 | brlcad | \o/ |
| 06:09.58 | Ralith | glad to see he's got the build problem largely addressed, though |
| 06:10.18 | Ralith | was worried when I saw the rbgui page stating non-windows was unsupported |
| 06:10.45 | brlcad | yeah, I rattled his cage for quite a while to try to make it more seamless and automatic to build |
| 06:11.09 | Ralith | argh |
| 06:11.20 | Ralith | why does NOTHING put /usr/local/include in the default search path >:| |
| 06:11.45 | brlcad | automatic dep management is a pretty big deal (and pet peeve) for the project in general, fully portably managing deps, not depending on anything being installed, not requiring the user go get stuff |
| 06:12.16 | brlcad | our main module does :) |
| 06:12.32 | Ralith | kudos |
| 06:13.43 | Ralith | oh this looks bad |
| 06:14.13 | Ralith | :D |
| 06:14.19 | Ralith | there's already freebsd patches for ois |
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| 06:15.43 | Ralith | hm, I wonder if these break non-freebsd |
| 06:16.05 | yukonbob | Ralith: add to brlcad's description the tension of being able to use a system's pre-installed libraries, etc. and it's "fun" with a capital "F". |
| 06:16.48 | Ralith | yukonbob: I don't entirely follow |
| 06:16.56 | Ralith | that's not tension so much as a useful feature |
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| 06:17.24 | brlcad | yeah, tries to detect system libs and prefer them by default unless overridden, otherwise compiling the dep cleanly as if it were bundled |
| 06:17.34 | Ralith | nice. |
| 06:18.21 | brlcad | the hard part there is the plethora of versions, e.g. having a tcl/tk 8.4 but no itcl installed, yet our itcl requires 8.5, and a variety of combinations thereof |
| 06:18.38 | yukonbob | :) |
| 06:18.46 | yukonbob | Capital "F", I tell ya... |
| 06:19.42 | yukonbob | would you say I have a plethora of gifts? |
| 06:20.38 | brlcad | a plethora of .. something ;) |
| 06:20.42 | yukonbob | heh -- |
| 06:20.47 | Ralith | hehe |
| 06:20.52 | yukonbob | is channeling The Three Amigos |
| 06:21.05 | Ralith | brlcad: I don't suppose there's a makefile equivalent of #ifdef __FreeBSD__ ? |
| 06:22.43 | Ralith | well, I can always wrap the entire file in that |
| 06:22.47 | Ralith | but that's hacky |
| 06:22.48 | brlcad | those makefile(s) in src/other can change |
| 06:22.58 | brlcad | they're not going to stay that way |
| 06:23.11 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:23.20 | Ralith | my idea was to be an agent of that change :P |
| 06:23.59 | brlcad | his project is also a mild experiment in cmake's flexibility, but he isn't very familiar with it (and doesn't really have time during gsoc to figure it out more than absolutely necessary) |
| 06:24.34 | brlcad | so the idea would be to eventually end up with something similar to our gnu build system infrastructure on the main trunk in cmake for rt^3 |
| 06:24.52 | brlcad | or just gut it for gbs if it turns out to be too much hassle |
| 06:25.11 | Ralith | well, this will still make it work on freebsd without breaking other stuff for the short term. |
| 06:25.17 | brlcad | having it be seemlessly cross-compilable to Windows would be a big win, though, which cmake offers |
| 06:26.49 | yukonbob | Ralith: I'm not entirely sure what you're working on, but you might consider patching as part of the build in ports, too, w/o touching the BRL-CAD tree... |
| 06:27.04 | Ralith | yukonbob: I'm taking the patches from ports, actually |
| 06:27.07 | yukonbob | s/entirely sure/sure at all/ |
| 06:27.11 | Ralith | except applying them nondestructively |
| 06:27.17 | Ralith | or should I not even bother, and just grab from there? |
| 06:28.22 | yukonbob | are you trying to get some FreeBSD-specific building happening that's not already addressed in the patches? |
| 06:28.46 | Ralith | I'm trying to apply what's in the patches nondestructively to the stuff in svn |
| 06:29.08 | yukonbob | ?"nondestructively" |
| 06:29.24 | Ralith | the existing patches kill a variety of things for the sake of making it work on FreeBSD, which doesn't actually support them in the first place |
| 06:29.40 | Ralith | gtg now, actually |
| 06:29.44 | Ralith | guess I'll leave the ois stuff alone for now |
| 06:29.51 | yukonbob | chat later :) |
| 06:30.11 | brlcad | cya later Ralith |
| 06:30.12 | Ralith | I'll probably be forced to make it up as I go along for other bits that aren't in ports, anyway |
| 06:30.30 | Ralith | seeya |
| 06:30.32 | brlcad | looks forward to seeing patches ;) |
| 06:30.44 | yukonbob | looks forward to hitting hay... |
| 06:30.50 | brlcad | yukonbob: crazy talk |
| 06:30.52 | brlcad | yawns |
| 06:31.42 | yukonbob | knows that brlcad seems to get by on .5h sleep/day, and an occasional sushi platter, but I'm not brlcad... so I sleep. |
| 06:32.15 | yukonbob | on that note... ciao for now, geeks. |
| 06:32.32 | brlcad | heh, cya |
| 06:32.46 | brlcad | wonders what timezone he's in |
| 06:33.20 | yukonbob | == pacific... 11:30 now -- 5am approaching too soon... |
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| 08:36.58 | lleroy | starseeker: printf("%*d", 4, i) |
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| 08:42.09 | mafm | hey |
| 08:45.50 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31846 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModes.cxx CameraModes.h): Separating declaration and implementation of camera modes, since the code in these files is going to grow |
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| 09:00.57 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 09:02.37 | mafm | o/ |
| 09:02.48 | brlcad | mafm, you had a fan checking out your project earlier, he started poking at the code .. he'll undoubtedly be back in a while |
| 09:03.32 | mafm | huh? |
| 09:03.41 | mafm | sombody from brl-cad? |
| 09:03.50 | brlcad | someone new |
| 09:04.18 | brlcad | (a coder) |
| 09:09.58 | mafm | huh |
| 09:10.09 | mafm | why does he know about the code? trade secret! |
| 09:10.51 | mafm | can we silence him before he spreads the word? |
| 09:11.28 | brlcad | he wants to help work on it |
| 09:12.19 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31847 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraManager.cxx CameraManager.h): Changing private Observer/Listener pattern implementation by the one already existing in the project |
| 09:12.49 | mafm | I see |
| 09:13.00 | mafm | do you remember his nickname? |
| 09:13.39 | brlcad | Ralith |
| 09:14.48 | mafm | fine, I'll speak with him when I see him :) |
| 09:15.42 | mafm | but I don't know if it's advisable for other people to start developing it this early? I don't know if that would mess gsoc plans |
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| 09:36.12 | brlcad | working integrated with others is part of gsoc, you've been "lucky" so far ;) .. but not to worry, nothing that would significantly derail your schedule/progress |
| 09:38.40 | brlcad | as I mentioned to him, collaboration and integration is actually highly encouraged for most projects/students |
| 09:38.46 | brlcad | the student just can't use that as a crutch to not do work and the collaboration can't negatively impact their ability to do work |
| 09:39.18 | mafm | yes, I mean if he wants to work in things like the communication with libged... |
| 09:39.47 | brlcad | the main point of gsoc is actually to (hopefully) make you a new (long-term) developer, build up our dev team .. not just for folks to work on a project ;) |
| 09:41.17 | brlcad | yeah, would try to find something productive of course |
| 09:41.31 | brlcad | at this point, he's just compiling -- was going to look into cleaning up the build system |
| 09:43.14 | mafm | goody |
| 09:43.59 | mafm | btw, I think that maybe shortly after gsoc we have to start to worry about the GUI toolkit at least |
| 09:46.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31848 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraModes.cxx: Setting limits to orbital camera mode, so it doesn't cause strange artifacts when verticalRotation is greater than PI/2 (or smaller than -PI/2). Maybe it should continue to rotate but seamlessly, I don't know... |
| 09:47.01 | mafm | they're like missing in action, and apart from the private patches there are small glitches here and there, even if I didn't start to create very complex things |
| 09:47.43 | brlcad | i don't care so much that they're missing in action, but the glitches are cause for concern |
| 09:47.55 | brlcad | have you been able to get a feel for how well it's suited to customization yet? |
| 09:48.39 | brlcad | input binding customization, theming the appearance, developing custom layout managers |
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| 09:52.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31849 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx CameraManager.cxx CameraModes.h Commands.h): Minor changes in comments/indentation, adding missing #ifdefs around Commands.h |
| 09:52.55 | mafm | not much of that yet, but in example the Text widget for the console doesn't seem to have scrolling working |
| 09:56.07 | mafm | about theming I changed fonts and minor things only, and you can define many things (corners, borders, etc) but it looks like it needs minucious/detailed work, or a good editor |
| 09:56.31 | mafm | that is, I think that it's not difficult to get a theme that you work, but probably it needs time |
| 10:10.23 | mafm | http://graphjam.com/2008/07/15/song-chart-memes-breakdown-of-government-funding-in-england/ -- Silly Brittish :) |
| 10:20.58 | mafm | brlcad: http://www.clutter-project.org/ | http://moblin.org/playground/?q=node/76 |
| 10:21.48 | mafm | brlcad: it seems that they're going to experiment with that with 3.0, still I don't know if it's advisable to try that path, it's the 1st time that I hear from that project |
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| 12:30.32 | brlcad | mafm: I've heard of them, they've come a long ways |
| 12:32.00 | brlcad | mafm: I wouldn't try that path unless you were set on *not* using rbgui for sure |
| 12:33.18 | brlcad | clutter has decent portability on paper, but also a few additional dependencies too so they'd have to be reviewed .. plus their actual widget/interactions is fairly minimal -- you'd have to implement things like tabbed contexts, input text areas, etc |
| 12:35.00 | brlcad | otherwise, I love their overall approach, there are lots of features in the moblin interface that show how some reasonably powerful widgets and interactions can be made to work |
| 12:35.19 | brlcad | integrating that with the 3D render engine could be interesting.. |
| 12:44.19 | mafm | oki, I'll keep it in mind for after gsoc |
| 12:45.09 | mafm | in the meantime, I have a question about trackballs -- what input events they generate? the computer sees it as a regular mouse? |
| 12:45.52 | brlcad | "trackball mode" has nothing to do with a physical trackball ... :) |
| 12:46.12 | brlcad | but yah, they're usually regular mice |
| 12:46.37 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 12:46.42 | brlcad | turn a mouse with a ball upside down, make the ball a lot bigger |
| 12:47.28 | mafm | yes, I know that, but I mean if the computer/OS feeds that as a mouse, in x-windows |
| 12:48.07 | brlcad | yep |
| 12:48.19 | mafm | goody |
| 12:48.19 | brlcad | it really is just an upside down mouse |
| 12:48.38 | mafm | and the rotations are discrete, as in blender? |
| 12:48.59 | brlcad | discrete in what way? |
| 12:49.20 | mafm | in that with each key stroke means 15 degrees or whatever |
| 12:49.24 | brlcad | the rotations are whatever you make the bindings do :) |
| 12:49.35 | mafm | currently my orbital mode acts almost in the same way, just that it's continuous |
| 12:49.48 | mafm | and has the vertical glitch |
| 12:50.08 | brlcad | key stroke? i don't have any keys on my trackball |
| 12:50.16 | brlcad | lots of buttons, but no kesy |
| 12:50.31 | mafm | I'm now talking about trackball, the mode :D |
| 12:51.08 | mafm | is the one that implements blender, IIRC from your conversation yesterday |
| 12:51.17 | mafm | and to move the camera, you use the numpad |
| 12:54.30 | mafm | so the difference between blender an mine is: |
| 12:55.28 | mafm | in blender) each keypressed event acts as a trigger, and makes 30 degrees of rotation or so; if you maintain it pressed it for longer time it rotates for that while, but in discrete steps of same 30 degrees |
| 12:56.22 | brlcad | mged behaves that way too, discrete vertical/horizontal view rotations |
| 12:56.31 | brlcad | though I think we're about 5 degrees |
| 12:56.36 | mafm | in mine) keypressed and released act as on a switch, and the rotation is "continuous" (from when you press until when you release); the camera position is updated every loop of the renderer |
| 12:58.10 | mafm | 360 / ~24 steps for full revolution = 15 degrees |
| 12:58.11 | brlcad | press x/y/z/X/Y/Z/0 in mged graphics window, you get that |
| 12:58.40 | brlcad | that'd be the shift-grips/mged binding style of course |
| 13:00.35 | mafm | shift-grips? we were talking about trackball |
| 13:00.45 | brlcad | be sure to peek at blender's View -> View Navigation menu |
| 13:01.11 | brlcad | sure, just commenting that they're there |
| 13:01.21 | brlcad | so you can test it out |
| 13:02.15 | mafm | erm... so the mged and blender are very different |
| 13:03.33 | brlcad | oh sure |
| 13:03.49 | brlcad | blender is a heck of a lot different than most modeling guis, much less a cad gui |
| 13:04.13 | mafm | so my orbital mode is different than both |
| 13:04.24 | mafm | do you want me to mimic brlcad's, I guesS? |
| 13:04.34 | mafm | brl-cad's, I mean :) |
| 13:05.04 | mafm | or rather, mged's |
| 13:06.08 | brlcad | if you set it up right, the only different between shift-grips, blenders, and your orbital mode is default bindings -- the same operations are pretty much available to all of them (just via different bindings or unspecified) |
| 13:06.42 | brlcad | so you really just have to focus on the events/actions that can be bound, and managing sets of bindings as an input style set |
| 13:08.03 | mafm | yes, eventually I'd create the generic operations in the base class |
| 13:08.45 | mafm | but the question is: do you want me to create Trackball and Shif-grips with exactly the same keys and behaviours than mged? |
| 13:11.55 | brlcad | hm, actions that come to mind... pan up/down, pan left/right, pan freely, rotate horizontally left/right, rotate vertically up/down, rotate freely, fly navigation, zoom in, zoom out -- and all as continuous/quasi-modal or discrete events |
| 13:13.10 | brlcad | well, at least mimic'ing shift-grips .. beyond that whatever else you like |
| 13:13.40 | mafm | well, that shift-grips is quite... complete :D |
| 13:13.58 | brlcad | I would recommend blender's default bindings as another predefined, but up to you |
| 13:14.11 | brlcad | shift-grips should cover most any interaction except a fly mode |
| 13:14.42 | mafm | the bindings for the different modes are switchable, or all of them are present at the same time? |
| 13:14.55 | brlcad | forget about "trackball" as a mode -- what was mostly meant by that was a mode where left-mouse+drag bound to "rotate view" |
| 13:15.06 | mafm | switchable as "only one active at a given time" |
| 13:15.18 | brlcad | blender's is pretty close to that, they use middle mouse for rotate view |
| 13:16.09 | brlcad | only one active at a given time |
| 13:16.20 | brlcad | they can't be active simultaneously, the bindings are entirely different |
| 13:16.41 | mafm | I find your trackball mode -or whatever you call to the x/y/z/0- very funny :D |
| 13:17.43 | brlcad | middle-mouse+drag is what I was referring to as a "trackball" view manipulation, btw .. and a pretty good implementation |
| 13:18.16 | brlcad | (in blender) |
| 13:19.44 | mafm | So... to make things clear, what should I implement for my trackball? Blender middle-mouse+drag and x/z/y/0 for axial rotation? |
| 13:23.42 | brlcad | control+(any)-mouse+drag in mged == middle-mouse+drag in blender == 'view rotation' == 'trackball view rotation' |
| 13:24.53 | brlcad | make a 'mafm' style, have it do whatever you want :) |
| 13:24.57 | mafm | OK, but I mean exactly which keys do you want :) |
| 13:25.18 | mafm | I already have my style, it's the orbital one -- which is very similar in essence |
| 13:25.19 | brlcad | have an 'mged' style that is effectively shift-grips as close as you can get it |
| 13:26.21 | brlcad | then maybe add a 'blender' style that is as close to blender as possible (not hybridized with 'mged' bindings, that just makes it confusing and error-prone) |
| 13:27.54 | brlcad | if you have those three with a relatively straightforward way to define new styles, any one of those three styles would be more than enough |
| 13:28.45 | mafm | okish, thanks :) |
| 13:31.15 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:37.17 | mafm | hi d_rossberg |
| 13:42.12 | *** join/#brlcad esben (n=esben@0x573ff382.boanqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) | |
| 13:43.26 | d_rossberg | moin mafm |
| 14:52.31 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.36.28) | |
| 14:52.33 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 14:52.41 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 14:52.49 | andrecastelo | hi pacman87 |
| 14:53.09 | mafm | hi |
| 14:56.08 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 15:01.36 | mafm | heyo |
| 15:01.59 | mafm | too hot cold there in Brazil? :P |
| 15:12.24 | andrecastelo | it's raining now :S |
| 15:14.20 | mafm | at Lisbon it's 30+ degrees |
| 15:14.29 | mafm | and it's a cold summer, fortunately :D |
| 15:21.14 | d_rossberg | moin pacman87, now the revolve ray-trace works for me too :) |
| 15:22.30 | d_rossberg | (if not along a coordinate axis) |
| 15:26.57 | mafm | svn: Server sent unexpected return value (403 Forbidden) in response to MKACTIVITY request for '/svnroot/brlcad/!svn/act/683d9f64-d642-4309-846b-f929d2cad1b5' |
| 15:26.59 | mafm | ? |
| 15:27.31 | mafm | fascist pigs, they forbid me to commit!!!111! :P |
| 15:29.55 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.201.183) | |
| 15:30.41 | prasad_ | brlcad: so i started working out again |
| 15:30.57 | prasad_ | after a ~1 yr hiatus |
| 15:31.02 | prasad_ | :) |
| 16:00.12 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-95-207.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:01.40 | mafm | hi clock_ |
| 16:01.48 | mafm | is anybody else having problems with commiting? |
| 16:05.14 | mafm | even google accounts are failing |
| 16:05.39 | mafm | it might be a sign of the Apocalypsis or something... |
| 16:11.32 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 17:05.42 | mafm | brlcad: is there a way for you to check svn logs? |
| 17:07.33 | mafm | oh, it seems that it's an scheduled downtime |
| 17:13.16 | poolio | mafm: so svn on sf.net is down? |
| 17:15.01 | mafm | read-only, they are migrating to a new datacenter, it seems |
| 17:19.55 | mafm | poolio: http://sourceforge.net/community/forum/topic.php?id=2874&page |
| 17:51.17 | brlcad | wb andrecastelo |
| 17:51.50 | brlcad | andrecastelo: any new progress, working on depth-based lighting or shadows next? |
| 17:52.08 | brlcad | mafm: sourceforge svn is down for the next 6 hours or so |
| 17:52.23 | brlcad | sourceforge is moving svn to their new datacenter in chicago today |
| 17:52.26 | andrecastelo | i was thinking about starting some kind of prototype path tracing system, what do you think? |
| 17:52.32 | mafm | >:[ |
| 17:52.47 | mafm | so no more commits today, now that I have lots and lots of new things |
| 17:53.13 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, I didn't realize it was today or I would have sent out a note |
| 17:58.14 | andrecastelo | do you think i should improve the shading or start the path building?? |
| 17:58.52 | brlcad | I think you should do at least shadows just so you see how to shoot secondary rays |
| 18:10.20 | andrecastelo | hm ok, ok |
| 18:10.28 | mafm | I received some random crap from sf.net yesterday but I didn't even bother to read it |
| 18:10.37 | mafm | too much mail :| |
| 18:10.48 | andrecastelo | have classes now |
| 18:10.52 | andrecastelo | later guys |
| 18:11.15 | pacman87 | mafm: that's why i switched the gsoc mail to 'digest' |
| 18:11.35 | mafm | the gsoc I read in less than 30 seconds |
| 18:12.26 | mafm | basically I click next next next and read the subject in the split second :) |
| 18:12.54 | pacman87 | it'd be nice if i could flag the mail from LH and other official google people |
| 18:13.01 | pacman87 | to make sure i dont' miss anything important |
| 18:13.18 | mafm | it's no so easy with other mails that I have to reply... but yes, gsoc lists are annoying :D |
| 18:14.19 | pacman87 | i treat it as a forum instead of a mailing list |
| 18:18.47 | mafm | I basically don't read anything |
| 18:19.01 | mafm | just the initial mail of the thread if it's from LH |
| 18:19.18 | mafm | and then only some specific if it interests me |
| 18:32.38 | ``Erik | %*d? when did that happen? O.o |
| 18:33.02 | pacman87 | ``Erik: hmmm? |
| 18:34.44 | ``Erik | printf("%*d", x, y); |
| 18:44.50 | mafm | neat-o |
| 18:55.45 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 18:56.15 | mafm | hi Ralith |
| 19:06.23 | Ralith | oh hey! |
| 19:06.36 | Ralith | needs to make his irssi highlight better. |
| 19:08.11 | Ralith | mafm: I, along with at least part of the reprap community, am quite interested in your GUI work; myself to the extent of a desire to contribute. |
| 19:09.34 | mafm | yep, brlcad told me a bit about it |
| 19:09.55 | Ralith | cool |
| 19:10.24 | mafm | that's the reprap of http://reprap.org/bin/view/Main/WebHome ? |
| 19:10.27 | Ralith | yeah |
| 19:12.01 | mafm | that's an interface for a 3D printer? |
| 19:12.58 | Ralith | it *is* a 3D printer. |
| 19:13.44 | mafm | :D |
| 19:14.05 | mafm | neat |
| 19:14.14 | mafm | and what does my project have to do with that? |
| 19:15.24 | mafm | are you already using BRL-CAD to design it or something? |
| 19:15.27 | Ralith | well, I'll give a bit of background |
| 19:15.59 | mafm | please :) |
| 19:16.01 | Ralith | reprap is supposed to be completely open source |
| 19:16.17 | Ralith | so we can't standardize on professional CAD packages |
| 19:16.29 | Ralith | (there's very good reasons for this which aren't entirely relevant; we can get into that later) |
| 19:16.59 | Ralith | currently, we're standardized on this kinda shitty java mesh modeler called Art of Illusion that afaik nobody likes much. |
| 19:17.36 | Ralith | however, there's no argument that that's really a good tool for CAD/CAM |
| 19:18.00 | Ralith | it's just something like the first oss modeler that the founders ran into |
| 19:18.20 | Ralith | now lately, people have been hitting its limitations and starting to search for alternatives |
| 19:18.54 | Ralith | but, as you may or may not be aware, there really aren't any open source CAD tools worth mentioning; let alone professional quality ones. |
| 19:19.00 | Ralith | Except for BRL-CAD. |
| 19:19.20 | mafm | not even k-3d? |
| 19:19.50 | Ralith | k-3d states from the start that it's meant for animation :P |
| 19:20.21 | Ralith | BRL-CAD has the additional advantage of its purist CSG approach, which is great because of the level of precision it maintains. |
| 19:21.04 | Ralith | to put this in perspective, AoI is so inappropriate that the founders actually modeled some of the current reprap design using professional CAD tools isntead, and just exported to an open format. |
| 19:21.14 | Ralith | STL |
| 19:21.28 | Ralith | which is another bad choice, because conversion to trimeshes loses precision. |
| 19:21.49 | mafm | I thought that they had added (or wanted to, maybe it was some gsoc project) to get into other modelling, but I know mostly zero about that so I shut up :D |
| 19:22.11 | Ralith | well, we want something as professional quality as we can get |
| 19:22.31 | Ralith | and BRL-CAD seems to be nothing if not professional. |
| 19:22.43 | Ralith | however, its interface is very tangibly from the 1980s. |
| 19:23.03 | Ralith | one of reprap's goals is to be widely and easily accessible. |
| 19:23.33 | Ralith | Standardization on a CAD suite with such an arcane modeling interface would conflict with that. |
| 19:23.43 | Ralith | as attractive as the technology behind the interface may be. |
| 19:24.27 | Ralith | So, your SoC project seems to be the solution to all our worries. |
| 19:25.03 | mafm | goody :D |
| 19:25.21 | Ralith | especially since, imo, a tried and true back-end with a newly developed interface is much more suitable than a tried-and-true interface with newly developed CAD support. |
| 19:25.24 | mafm | I'm very glad to hear that it can be helpful for you |
| 19:25.30 | Ralith | besides, you don't get much more tried-and-true than BRL-CAD. |
| 19:25.41 | Ralith | far more than us, I'm sure |
| 19:26.10 | Ralith | there's a *lot* of people out there who would benefit from professional and accessible open source CAD. |
| 19:26.15 | mafm | did you already try it? it's in very initial state... |
| 19:26.26 | Ralith | I haven't built it yet |
| 19:26.31 | Ralith | but I've reviewed your log |
| 19:27.25 | mafm | :D |
| 19:27.57 | mafm | well, if you have some sort of GNU/Linux (or even BSD) variant, should be quick easy to get it running |
| 19:27.57 | Ralith | I'm quite eager to lend whatever aid I can. |
| 19:28.02 | *** join/#brlcad philipix (n=c91adbe1@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:28.02 | Ralith | I'm on FreeBSD |
| 19:28.21 | Ralith | luckily, the larger of your deps are in ports |
| 19:28.53 | mafm | I think that you mostly need some image library like DevIL |
| 19:29.00 | Ralith | that'll be in ports too. |
| 19:29.05 | Ralith | I was talking about ois and ogre |
| 19:29.24 | Ralith | I'll be submitting a patch for ois freebsd compatibility despite this |
| 19:29.58 | mafm | $ aptitude show libogre-dev |
| 19:29.59 | mafm | ... |
| 19:30.07 | Ralith | ? |
| 19:30.08 | mafm | Depends: libfreeimage-dev | libdevil-dev, libfreetype6-dev, libogremain-1.4.6 (>= 1.4.6.dfsg1-1), libopenexr-dev, |
| 19:30.08 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:30.34 | Ralith | deps are not an issue :P |
| 19:30.37 | mafm | I think that these are the only dependencies needed, apart from std C++ things |
| 19:30.38 | Ralith | at least, I don't think so |
| 19:30.47 | brlcad | Ralith: interesting background interest |
| 19:31.01 | Ralith | I haven't tried building your versions of rbgui or mocha yet |
| 19:31.04 | Ralith | brlcad: I think so. |
| 19:31.10 | mafm | and apart from that, the rest of the things that you need is just contained in src/other :D |
| 19:32.26 | brlcad | Ralith: if you're interested in our long-term project goals, I wrote up an overly wordy document that you might find interesting .. it's being completely restructured and reworded, but it captures a fair bit even with the layout/temp state that it's in |
| 19:32.39 | Ralith | brlcad: I would be interested in that. |
| 19:33.01 | mafm | I think that RBGui and Mocha don't depend on anything but standard C++ libraries |
| 19:33.33 | Ralith | yeah, but you never know |
| 19:33.43 | Ralith | besides, what you think is standard is often moved around in FreeBSD |
| 19:33.57 | mafm | oh, you need pkg-config too |
| 19:34.03 | mafm | is fan of pkg-config :P |
| 19:34.03 | Ralith | who doesn't have pkg-config? |
| 19:34.07 | brlcad | Ralith: http://brlcad.org/~sean/BRL-CAD_Priorities.png (there's a .pdf too, but many renderers do a horrible job on the fonts it's using) |
| 19:34.23 | mafm | well, I had an argument with postgresql guys a while ago, they're not so fans of it :D |
| 19:34.45 | Ralith | oo, neat layout |
| 19:34.52 | brlcad | again, not really intended for public consumption as it's going to change a fair bit, but it's the high-high-level project overview of what I'm trying to focus on |
| 19:35.22 | Ralith | by the way, I've been curious: you're the maintainer, right? Just how did you end up as such? |
| 19:36.33 | brlcad | dedication, years of keeping the flame alive |
| 19:36.54 | brlcad | I really do love working on BRL-CAD -- it has so much potential and so much existing powerful functionality |
| 19:37.35 | brlcad | just not-so-great usability for the newcomer, hence the focus on gui enhancements, brep (for visualization), and open source |
| 19:39.33 | mafm | and weeks of wasting time talking with prospective gsocers |
| 19:39.40 | mafm | :P |
| 19:39.42 | Ralith | hehe |
| 19:40.10 | Ralith | did you have anything to do with it when it was still proprietary? |
| 19:40.48 | mafm | warns: if SourceForge doesn't reenable commits now, you're all going to miss my wonderful new Blender mode... SF, we're watching you |
| 19:41.03 | Ralith | Blender mode? |
| 19:41.10 | Ralith | camera control? |
| 19:41.13 | mafm | yep |
| 19:41.15 | Ralith | oo, fun |
| 19:41.19 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:41.19 | mafm | 1046 |
| 19:41.20 | Ralith | blender has good camera control |
| 19:41.41 | Ralith | learned mesh modeling in blender |
| 19:41.55 | mafm | just that I'm making it "continuous" |
| 19:42.13 | Ralith | I'm not sure what that means |
| 19:42.27 | mafm | unless somebody has something against, I think that it's more practical and easier to implement :D |
| 19:42.48 | mafm | that instead of jumping 30 degrees when you click the numpad keys, it does so in a continuous way |
| 19:43.04 | mafm | turning slowly while you maintain the key pressed |
| 19:43.15 | Ralith | hm |
| 19:43.25 | Ralith | well, first, an interface design thought |
| 19:43.45 | Ralith | for all inputs that produce continuous movement, make it be *accelerated*, not constant rate of change. |
| 19:43.52 | Ralith | this is extremely useful since scale can vary so much |
| 19:44.11 | Ralith | makes it easy to quickly achieve the state that is desired, no matter how numerically distant it is from the current one |
| 19:44.43 | Ralith | for example, I recently implemented a spinner widget for a GUI project I'm on that does this in all cases; imo it's just that useful. |
| 19:44.59 | Ralith | I can't think of a case where it *wouldn't* be helpful. |
| 19:45.31 | Ralith | of course, one must be careful to keep the acceleration from being too sharp, else there's not enough control. |
| 19:45.31 | mafm | the zoom already works like this |
| 19:45.35 | Ralith | great! |
| 19:45.39 | mafm | it has an increment ratio |
| 19:45.47 | Ralith | oh yeah, promise me you'll rip off blender's grid system |
| 19:45.53 | Ralith | I *love* blender's grids |
| 19:46.40 | Ralith | (except don't bother implementing blender's upper and lower limits to grid size; I can't imagine why you'd want those) |
| 19:46.43 | mafm | and I hate the linear spinners too :D |
| 19:46.47 | Ralith | :D |
| 19:47.04 | Ralith | and now a more direct response |
| 19:47.13 | Ralith | blender uses fixed increments for a good reason imo |
| 19:47.21 | Ralith | it allows one to easily go to a specific perspective |
| 19:47.22 | mafm | well, I don't have almost any experience modeling, so I don't know what would be useful and what not |
| 19:47.36 | mafm | I largely follow orders/ideas/suggestions :D |
| 19:47.48 | Ralith | I've got moderate experience; I'm not a real modeler, but I've done a lot of experimentation and produced some not entirely boring works. |
| 19:48.08 | Ralith | I've got enough experience to know that blender does a lot of things right. |
| 19:48.46 | mafm | :) |
| 19:49.05 | Ralith | so if you're using that as a template for some parts, that's a good sign, imo |
| 19:49.19 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/explode.avi |
| 19:49.20 | mafm | this part is only the camera mode, which with some keys it orbits the object, with mouse drag rotates around freely |
| 19:49.31 | mafm | probably you'll have more requests in the near future :) |
| 19:49.37 | Ralith | mafm: define 'the object' |
| 19:49.43 | Ralith | sure you don't mean the origin? |
| 19:50.06 | mafm | at the moment it is, but eventually it'll pan :D |
| 19:50.23 | Ralith | I suggest a blender-style 'center camera at point' command |
| 19:50.44 | Ralith | also, 'center camera at selected object(s)'s origin' |
| 19:50.59 | mafm | I still only with camera modes this week, or the last day of the past one :) |
| 19:51.11 | Ralith | that plus orbit-style movement plus optional drawing of objects would probably cover most use cases already |
| 19:52.08 | Ralith | anyway, if you want to go for continuous camera movement, that's cool, but maybe you should include a toggle button or a keyboard bind for incremental movements of various fractions of 90 degrees? |
| 19:52.18 | mafm | the center on object is just a matter of setting the object as focused |
| 19:52.35 | mafm | I initially thought of that but it was half implemented, so I removed the little code |
| 19:52.48 | mafm | but it's easy to read when I know exactly what we want to do |
| 19:52.57 | Ralith | ll |
| 19:52.58 | Ralith | kk |
| 19:53.34 | mafm | maybe I'll just keep orbital mode as blender-like but continous, and blender as exactly blender |
| 19:53.43 | Ralith | also, my OIS patch is ready -- where's the best place for it? |
| 19:53.49 | pacman87 | anyone here used davfs2? |
| 19:54.18 | mafm | I'm just implementing functionality at this moment, defining bindings it's mostly a detail when infrastructure is in place :) |
| 19:54.29 | mafm | pacman87: no |
| 19:54.35 | Ralith | mafm: ooh, here's a neat idea for non-priority implementation that'll make continuous (and imprecise) movement useful: allow save/restore of multiple camera positions |
| 19:54.58 | Ralith | enjoys coming up with features |
| 19:55.05 | Ralith | put up with me long and your TODO list will double :> |
| 19:55.25 | mafm | Ralith: the patch maybe you could send to OIS guys themselves... IIRC the main devel lurks around in #ogre3d and the nickname starts with p :) |
| 19:55.40 | mafm | and we would have to apply it for it to work in src/other, too |
| 19:55.51 | Ralith | mafm: it's an inelegant patch that references your build system |
| 19:56.15 | Ralith | appropriate for making things work, but not so much for upstream application |
| 19:56.25 | Ralith | I've #ifdef'd out three whole files :P |
| 19:56.46 | Ralith | (only has any effect on FreeBSD, of course) |
| 19:56.53 | mafm | http://rafb.net/paste, please? |
| 19:56.56 | Ralith | sure |
| 19:57.10 | mafm | what's the error in BSD (and the compiler?) |
| 19:57.33 | Ralith | it's just the removal of linux-specific stuff |
| 19:58.09 | Ralith | http://rafb.net/p/Jz5kv519.html |
| 19:58.45 | Ralith | oh, and some X input handling stuff I'm not sure I follow, but which was used in the ports version. |
| 19:59.33 | mafm | huh... I think you need those linux files, because AFAIK they call linux to whatever using X.org |
| 19:59.42 | Ralith | huh? |
| 20:00.00 | Ralith | these files are cut straight out of the build process by the ports version |
| 20:00.03 | Ralith | they're not critical at all. |
| 20:00.34 | Ralith | note that only the first three effected files are completely #ifdef'd out |
| 20:01.31 | *** join/#brlcad esben (n=esben@0x573ff382.boanqu1.static.dsl.tele.dk) | |
| 20:02.19 | mafm | well, I'm not sure, whatever works for you :) |
| 20:02.49 | Ralith | the patch has no effect on non-FreeBSD anyway |
| 20:02.58 | mafm | but I guess that you could try to refine it and send it upstream, and then we can upload whatever new version to OIS -- new versions of OIS shouldn't break anything |
| 20:03.57 | Ralith | hm. I don't suppose you're familiar with pthreads? |
| 20:05.02 | mafm | not much, only generically with threads, but also not very very deeply :D |
| 20:05.14 | Ralith | hm. |
| 20:05.14 | mafm | svn: Server sent unexpected return value (403 Forbidden) in response to MKACTIVITY request for '/svnroot/brlcad/!svn/act/6f51664b-be0d-4203-96a0-6a780e9db359' -- OK, so no more work today :) |
| 20:05.25 | Ralith | aw. |
| 20:06.02 | mafm | I have to go home anyway, it's already night here :) |
| 20:07.29 | Ralith | alright, seeya |
| 20:07.39 | mafm | I'll commit in ~14 hours or so, I guess :) |
| 20:07.46 | ``Erik | known issue, they're migrating their server from cali to chicago |
| 20:07.54 | ``Erik | so read only |
| 20:07.57 | Ralith | brlcad: I don't think you answered -- did you have anything to do with it when it was still proprietary? |
| 20:08.03 | Ralith | (brlcad) |
| 20:08.07 | Ralith | (er, BRL-CAD) |
| 20:08.39 | mafm | Ralith: I look forward to get it working, you'll be the second after other gsocer homovulgaris :) |
| 20:08.40 | ``Erik | brlcad has been working on BRL-CAD for almost a decade I think? long before it went out to the public |
| 20:08.42 | mafm | see you |
| 20:08.51 | Ralith | oo, neat |
| 20:09.00 | Ralith | seeya |
| 20:09.11 | Ralith | fixing up mocha now |
| 20:09.20 | ``Erik | (you could kinda argue it was always open source, you had to fax in a license agreement, then got an encrypted tarball of the source sent to you... wasn't redistributable back then, though) |
| 20:09.22 | ``Erik | :D |
| 20:09.27 | Ralith | this one *will* be upstream-worthy |
| 20:09.57 | Ralith | ``Erik: any idea how much brl-cad is used professionally these days, if at all? |
| 20:10.05 | Ralith | also, any idea what brought about the opensourcing? |
| 20:12.05 | ``Erik | um, several people at ARL and survice are paid to use BRL-CAD, I think beoing uses it some, air force uses it a bit, probably many others |
| 20:12.17 | brlcad | Ralith: yes, I've worked on BRL-CAD for about 10 years now, long before it was open source |
| 20:12.38 | ``Erik | and we're a bunch of open source geeks who got enough gumption to push it through the beaurocracy to get it 'public release' status |
| 20:12.46 | ``Erik | rather, brlcad and butler pushed it... :) |
| 20:12.46 | Ralith | cool! |
| 20:12.56 | Ralith | many kudos to them, then |
| 20:13.00 | brlcad | I worked persistently for about 5 years to get BRL-CAD released as open source, it was one of two goals I had from the start |
| 20:13.13 | Ralith | that must have taken a lot of pushing |
| 20:13.40 | Ralith | are you being employed as brl-cad's maintainer, or is it something you do on your own? |
| 20:16.40 | brlcad | Ralith: best place for patch is our sf.net patches tracker (reading backlog) |
| 20:16.50 | Ralith | kk |
| 20:28.26 | Ralith | uploaded |
| 20:57.53 | Ralith | augh |
| 20:57.55 | Ralith | so close |
| 20:58.13 | Ralith | rbgui refers to some ogre func that's missing in the more recent version I have installed |
| 21:05.19 | Ralith | temp-workarounds by building the rt^3 version of ogre |
| 21:05.46 | Ralith | ...which fails. >:| |
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| 21:52.26 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt15.png & https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf06.png |
| 21:52.43 | pacman87 | wireframe upgrades for open sketches |
| 21:53.05 | pacman87 | now includes the lines that i added to close the sketch |
| 21:54.59 | Ralith | oo |
| 21:55.03 | Ralith | now just make that work for all primitives :> |
| 21:55.34 | pacman87 | Ralith: hmm? |
| 21:55.43 | Ralith | or wait |
| 21:55.47 | Ralith | wrong person |
| 21:55.47 | pacman87 | revolve takes in an arbitrary sketch |
| 21:55.51 | Ralith | all you p named people >:| |
| 21:56.10 | Ralith | anyway, looking nice! |
| 21:56.15 | pacman87 | ty |
| 21:56.25 | Ralith | can you define smooth curves in the sketch? |
| 21:56.30 | Ralith | or is it point-line only? |
| 21:56.48 | pacman87 | yes, lines, carc, bezier, and nurbs |
| 21:56.59 | pacman87 | though lines are the only ones working now |
| 21:57.20 | Ralith | so long as it's coming |
| 21:59.43 | poolio | Ralith: *achem* |
| 22:00.06 | starseeker | yay! |
| 22:00.18 | starseeker | can now parse core-001a.s into pieces |
| 22:00.45 | Ralith | poolio: sup |
| 22:00.47 | Ralith | :] |
| 22:27.22 | brlcad | Ralith: sorry, disappeared at 16:16 -- to answer your question -- it's something I predominantly do on my own, though I am (also) employed to work on BRL-CAD |
| 22:27.43 | Ralith | kk |
| 22:27.50 | Ralith | sounds pretty nice |
| 22:29.03 | brlcad | starseeker: nifty, using % parsing? |
| 22:31.43 | starseeker | not really (yet) - just a string with 4 key characters |
| 22:31.47 | brlcad | pacman87: interesting .. I think that's the first primitive that has a "self-intersecting" wireframe other than an invalid nmg/bot |
| 22:32.10 | starseeker | not sure if there is a reason to allow anything other than those 4, and if so % is not needed |
| 22:33.25 | pacman87 | i'd probably look better with a circular arc at the sketch's self-intersection point, but i'm not sure if that's worth the extra computation to find the intersection points |
| 22:33.25 | brlcad | "those four" being? |
| 22:34.09 | brlcad | for polyline/ployline, computing self-intersections is trivial :) |
| 22:34.32 | brlcad | nurbs-nurbs is probably the hardest |
| 22:35.03 | starseeker | n is for name substrings, i is for incremented regions, s is for separators, and e is for extension |
| 22:35.20 | starseeker | so core-001a.s would be nsinse |
| 22:38.24 | brlcad | how do you control how much padding? |
| 22:38.41 | starseeker | you mean 001 vs 01? |
| 22:39.17 | brlcad | sure |
| 22:40.07 | starseeker | That has to be a function of how many are ultimately needed to pad out to the maximum requested by the calling command - the larger of the supplied default (3 if in the core example you only wanted 10) or the minimum required by the maximum case (say, 5 if you wanted 10000) |
| 22:41.12 | starseeker | is currently trying to figure out how to use itoa to coax a string length out of a supplied integer |
| 22:41.31 | brlcad | withholds comments until he's let the brain enfeed some dinner |
| 22:51.38 | ``Erik | /nick p``Erik |
| 22:57.14 | PrezKennedy | golden corral! |
| 22:58.32 | pacman87 | brlcad: i wouldn't really expect too many sketches to be self-intersecting, anyway |
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| 23:09.34 | ``Erik | heh, old people food? :D |
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| 23:57.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31850 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: |
| 23:57.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Upload (very) early stage work for functions intended to provide consistent |
| 23:57.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: automatic naming for tools that need it. Currently working on parsing a |
| 23:57.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: supplied primitive name into components based on a format string - routines will |
| 23:57.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: probably need to become more general. |
| 00:11.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31851 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: upgrade revolve's wireframe to show lines added to close open sketches |
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| 00:54.31 | jonored | So, I've been trying for a while and not managing to work out how to invoke an external editor on a temporary file and read the revised file back with tcl in mged... I seem to have it either manage reading the file back, or invoking vim, not both. It seems like nothing after the external command gets run. Am I misunderstanding exec / is there a wait command I should be using? |
| 00:57.38 | pacman87 | ...bash doesnt do so well parsing mged commands :( |
| 00:59.26 | jonored | ...? I'm using open, puts, etc. to write to a file in /tmp, then "exec xterm -e vim <tempfile>", then trying to read it back in the same way I wrote it... |
| 01:00.15 | pacman87 | jonored: can you use g2asc and asc2g instead? |
| 01:02.01 | jonored | I'm trying to write myself a command similar to ted for attributes. |
| 01:06.20 | pacman87 | wireframes look good for (-) sided sketches, (-1,-1) to (1,1) : https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf07.png |
| 01:06.44 | pacman87 | shot() still needs logic work |
| 01:21.14 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31852 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: rearrange plot() to avoid a second calloc(), and remember to free allocated memory |
| 01:27.53 | pacman87 | wishes his first programming class wasn't in java - bad memory management habits |
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| 02:58.54 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31853 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Moved declarations to the beginning of the parse_obj_name() function. |
| 03:00.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31854 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/librt/librt.vcproj: Added librt/namegen.c to the MSVC 9 build. |
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| 03:58.20 | starseeker_ | scowls at comcast |
| 03:59.32 | poolio | starseeker_: I was out for ~6hours today |
| 03:59.50 | starseeker_ | It doesn't like my ssh connection to bz |
| 04:00.12 | starseeker_ | slow, and keeps getting reset - wonder if they're doing some *ahem* traffic management |
| 04:01.12 | Axman6 | didn't the FCC just get pissed at comcast for doing that? |
| 04:01.27 | Ralith | yep |
| 04:01.31 | Ralith | starseeker_: they do that for me, too :/ |
| 04:02.23 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 04:04.46 | starseeker_ | wants verizon fios... |
| 04:05.24 | poolio | Hmm, I might have to hack mged's WM_NAME |
| 04:05.26 | poolio | It's making my WM unhappy |
| 04:07.16 | poolio | Ah there we go....Toplevel worked. |
| 04:07.30 | poolio | starseeker_: Isn't FIOS similarly priced to comcast? |
| 04:08.35 | Ralith | poolio: not available most places |
| 04:10.19 | starseeker_ | dunno. Doubt this particular apartment would support it - it was hard enough to get cable here |
| 04:38.55 | andre|away_ | hey starseeker_, i added librt/namegen.c to the msvc9 build, is there a problem? |
| 04:39.37 | starseeker_ | uh, that's not ready |
| 04:39.43 | starseeker_ | or functional |
| 04:40.24 | starseeker_ | I'd recommend ignoring it until something actually uses it |
| 04:41.00 | andre|away_ | hm sounds better |
| 05:07.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31855 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/librt/librt.vcproj: Removed namegen.c from librt.vcproj until it's used by something. |
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| 09:13.21 | mafm | hi |
| 09:58.26 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 10:00.33 | mafm | happier than usual |
| 10:00.40 | mafm | now I must devote to my fans \o/ |
| 10:01.20 | brlcad | hehe |
| 10:01.41 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 10:03.23 | mafm | sending a patch of 1043 lines... |
| 10:03.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31856 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (7 files): |
| 10:03.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Many pending commits due to SourceForge downtime, cannot be separated now: |
| 10:03.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Important increase in functionality of CameraMode base class to allow for the |
| 10:03.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: now more complex derived camera modes, including managing their own input |
| 10:03.39 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: bindings; implemented Blender camera mode including mouse drag mode for free |
| 10:03.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: camera rotations; fixed parts of input handling which were still immature |
| 10:03.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (traping events when they shouldn't, etc). |
| 10:04.12 | mafm | done. |
| 10:04.25 | brlcad | bets some separation could have occurred, but good enough |
| 10:04.43 | mafm | btw, what happened with the feedback of middle term evaluation? |
| 10:05.16 | brlcad | i'm going down the list, some have happened, some still to go |
| 10:05.49 | mafm | hmm, it's because it was intermixed: the application main input handlers inject cameramanager with input, then it feed the active camera mode; which has also the new camera modes; etc |
| 10:12.30 | mafm | and mostly I didn't bother because probably the code is to be changed massively anyway :D |
| 10:19.30 | brlcad | hence the good enough |
| 10:20.09 | brlcad | there's almost always some way to break things up, it's one of the things I do rather frequently/well ;) |
| 10:20.48 | brlcad | the message is still informative and concise |
| 10:21.01 | brlcad | so nbd |
| 10:21.38 | mafm | about the acount in brlcad? |
| 10:22.14 | mafm | what was the missing part, state explicitly to accept the conditions |
| 10:23.36 | brlcad | yep |
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| 11:20.26 | Axman6 | http://yaws.hyber.org/contact.yaws |
| 11:20.29 | Axman6 | whoops |
| 11:42.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31857 10/brlcad/trunk/ (29 files in 4 dirs): |
| 11:42.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Added the following commands to libged: isize, keypoint, lookat, m2v_point, |
| 11:42.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: model2view, orient, perspective, pmat, pmodel2view, pov, rmat, rot_point, |
| 11:42.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: rotate_about, scale, setview, v2m_point, view2model, viewdir, c, cat, color and |
| 11:42.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: prcolor. |
| 11:58.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31858 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (perspective.c rmat.c): Initial check-in. |
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| 12:06.25 | starseeker_ | scolds the European Union politicians for more silly copyright ideas |
| 12:06.38 | starseeker_ | (not that ours don't have plenty...) |
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| 13:12.00 | mafm | hi again |
| 13:12.11 | mafm | network outages down here :S |
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| 13:51.31 | thing1 | *ywan* |
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| 14:46.47 | mafm | brlcad: internal classes a no-no? |
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| 15:28.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31859 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/raytrace.h src/libpc/pc_test.c): Modification to pc_param and pc_constrnt structs in particular removal of character arrays and usage of bu_vls for supporting expression of the form "radius=3.24" for parameters and "radius*centre.x=4.0" for constraints |
| 15:30.10 | ``Erik | brlcad: your team leader is taking abuse for your slides, save him! :D also; I has me a couple shiney new sun machines |
| 15:39.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31860 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/pc.h src/libpc/pc_main.c): |
| 15:39.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: modification of macros to initiate the bu_vls struct added to pc_param and |
| 15:39.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: pc_constrnt; definition of pc_free_pcset, pc_pushparameter and pc_pushconstraint |
| 15:39.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: functions for adding parameters and constraints to pc_pc_set using a simple |
| 15:39.02 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: string expression |
| 15:49.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31861 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModes.cxx CameraModes.h): Basically completing Blender camera mode, and factoring out more functionality in the base class (now basically the different modes act only on input, defining the bindings) |
| 16:06.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31862 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/solver_test.cpp: quasi-detailed definition of constraint and variable expression grammars, and testing the usage of bu_vls for passing information to the Parser object |
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| 16:14.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31863 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcParser.h: quasi-detailed definition of constraint and variable expression grammars, and testing the usage of bu_vls for passing information to the Parser object. sorry about 31862 accidental -m |
| 16:21.22 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31864 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am pc_constraint.h pc_solver.cpp): Removal of obsolete/empty files |
| 16:37.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31865 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModes.cxx CameraModes.h): Adjustments to the implementation for better compliance and maintainability, and copying better Blender mode. |
| 16:42.42 | brlcad | mafm: why do you ask? |
| 16:58.21 | mafm | I created one Vector3 :P |
| 17:01.10 | ``Erik | heh, starseeker, http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/28-(Around-Going).aspx |
| 17:02.27 | starseeker | Heh |
| 17:03.27 | jonored | Oif. |
| 17:03.34 | brlcad | mafm: ah, well in general I would have said it's fine -- for that one, for vector/matrix structures, it should probably use what is already provided |
| 17:04.14 | mafm | I just want to hold together 3 floats, no operations |
| 17:04.33 | brlcad | you hadn't had the need yet so I hadn't said much, but you should utilize the mainline brl-cad libs when they have functionality you need (libbu, libbn, librt in particular) |
| 17:04.47 | mafm | http://rafb.net/p/Zm93t624.html |
| 17:05.50 | ``Erik | hum, how is that, uh, different than, say, the vector in vmath.h ? :D |
| 17:05.53 | mafm | I was considering using Ogre::Vector3 because it's going to be assigned as such, eventually |
| 17:06.11 | mafm | what's vmath.h? |
| 17:06.23 | ``Erik | file in brlcad's include dir |
| 17:06.39 | brlcad | don't really want to expose ogre's data types, encapsulated at best, avoided if possible |
| 17:07.23 | ``Erik | (is BRL-CAD not a requirement for the new rt^3 shtuff?) |
| 17:07.23 | brlcad | vmath.h is part of libbn, vect_t is basically the same as your Vector3 |
| 17:07.53 | mafm | ``Erik: it would be eventually, but not yet |
| 17:08.28 | brlcad | why "not yet" .. sounds like you have a need now ;) |
| 17:09.30 | mafm | well, after I finish with cameras the main thing left is to use the remote library, so it would be needed soon enough |
| 17:10.26 | brlcad | remember that the (only) reason you're off in a different directly is for language/api separation, that doesn't mean it shouldn't utilize what it would have available if it were in brlcad/src/g3d |
| 17:10.27 | mafm | and by "no yet" I just mean that I don't use it |
| 17:11.03 | mafm | well, but apart from PI_NUMBER, it's the first thing that I feel need for |
| 17:11.18 | mafm | not that I don't want to use anything from BRL-CAD, is that I didn't need it yet :D |
| 17:14.52 | Ralith | other than vect_t. |
| 17:15.54 | mafm | that emerged just now, it doesn't count :P |
| 17:17.56 | brlcad | mafm: sure, and it's not a huge deal for a tiny Vector3 class .. but even that lil snippet becomes dead/wrong code that has to get fixed eventually -- less cost if dealt with early |
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| 17:26.43 | mafm | I already put a doxygen \todo, but anyway after I make the shift-grips mode (and I guess that it would take about 1 day) I'll start to look into using the geometry service |
| 17:27.17 | mafm | btw I don't know if tomorrow I'm going to be available because they need to exchange router and many things in the network |
| 17:27.26 | brlcad | libged at this point, not via the service |
| 17:27.36 | brlcad | but cool either way |
| 17:27.38 | Ralith | mafm: I'm pretty sure you don't even need to link with anything in this case. |
| 17:27.43 | mafm | but if not, it would be by the beginning of next week |
| 17:28.16 | mafm | doesn't libged incoporate the remote service? |
| 17:28.34 | brlcad | the service sits on top of libged |
| 17:29.00 | mafm | and libged doesn't include network abstractions yet? |
| 17:29.23 | brlcad | but the service isn't ready for use just yet (the dev is still documenting and sorting out protocol issues) |
| 17:30.04 | brlcad | libged won't have any network abstractions, you or me or someone would have to work on that now if you wanted to make it entirely abstracted from the start |
| 17:30.35 | brlcad | libged is basic geometry management, editing, querying .. at a command level ala mged's command line |
| 17:30.52 | brlcad | where commands like ged_e() give you wireframe data for a given object, for example |
| 17:31.41 | brlcad | that is supposed to sit underneath the geometry engine, which frankly doesn't exist yet (at least not in C++) |
| 17:32.02 | brlcad | and the geometry service makes the engine available through a port protocol interface (ala mysqld for example) |
| 17:33.38 | brlcad | there has been a dev working for several months on that layer as well as several working on the libged layer, so it's all starting to come together |
| 17:34.22 | mafm | "the geometry engine, which frankly doesn't exist yet (at least not in C++)" -- if it communicates via sockets, why does the language matters? |
| 17:35.58 | Ralith | mafm: because, at least ideally, the project includes production of a straightforward client lib so you don't have to manage the network bits yourself. |
| 17:36.22 | brlcad | the geometry engine is just an API, the geometry service provides the communication layer |
| 17:36.55 | brlcad | difference between libmysql and mysqld |
| 17:37.44 | mafm | but unless the library is written in tcl, C++ can use the C libraries directly... :) |
| 17:39.09 | brlcad | which is why I said you could start by simply hooking into libged for now (just so you have commands that you could issue on the command line and access to display list data for geometry) |
| 17:39.18 | ``Erik | rewrites the library in bf |
| 17:40.26 | brlcad | the engine itself is specifically a project in providing an OO C++ geometry processing layer similar to the ACIS or Granite engines, wrapping up our geometry processing facilities in libbu, libbn, libwdb, librt, and libged |
| 17:41.30 | mafm | so there's no "library geometry service" yet, not even in C... I though that libged would include support for this |
| 17:42.02 | mafm | anyway, I'll use that |
| 17:42.44 | brlcad | no, libged's job is very simply "perform this geometry command" |
| 17:43.00 | brlcad | massive refactoring of most of mged's command functionality into a library |
| 17:44.07 | brlcad | which amounts to moving and reworking about 100k lines of code |
| 17:45.00 | brlcad | bob's about 40% done from the looks of it (after about two months of effort) so it won't be fully complete for at least two or three more |
| 17:45.13 | brlcad | not that he needs to be complete for it to be functional, it should be usable now |
| 17:46.10 | brlcad | going on in parallel are the engine bits and the service bits |
| 17:47.35 | brlcad | Ralith: did someone review/apply your patch yet? |
| 17:47.51 | Ralith | uh, lemme check |
| 17:48.13 | brlcad | also, was it posted to the patches tracker or just in here? |
| 17:48.28 | Ralith | appears to not have been reviewed |
| 17:48.30 | Ralith | http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2019951&group_id=105292&atid=640804 |
| 17:48.53 | Ralith | also needs to upload his mocha patch |
| 17:49.09 | brlcad | k |
| 17:51.11 | mafm | did you submit it to OIS guys as well? |
| 17:52.51 | Ralith | like I said, I'm not sure it's entirely appropriate for upstream use; it's the sort of thing that really should be done in the build system, but I really have no idea how to do target-conditional config in autotools. |
| 17:53.04 | Ralith | the mocha patch, however, I have sent upstream |
| 17:53.42 | Ralith | the most that can be said for the ois patch is it's clean and it works. |
| 17:55.08 | mafm | well, OIS guys should be able to test if it's safe in other linux systems |
| 17:55.28 | mafm | btw, how did you contact mocha/rbgui guys? I couldn't contact them |
| 17:56.01 | Ralith | I would be very, very surprised if this broke other systems. |
| 17:56.06 | Ralith | Their website has a contact form :P |
| 17:56.28 | mafm | huh |
| 17:58.20 | mafm | where's that? I can't see it |
| 17:58.26 | Ralith | http://rightbraingames.com/contact.php |
| 17:58.44 | mafm | :S |
| 17:59.10 | mafm | how did you get there? their main website is a fedora apache welcome site |
| 17:59.22 | Ralith | |
| 17:59.33 | mafm | you can enter via /tech/ but I cannot see that form from there |
| 18:00.04 | Ralith | heh, that's a completely different website |
| 18:00.09 | mafm | Forbidden |
| 18:00.10 | mafm | You don't have permission to access /contact.php |
| 18:00.28 | brlcad | Ralith: not that I like their approach, but did you see: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1835815&group_id=149835&atid=775955 |
| 18:02.01 | brlcad | found after the reference in this thread: http://www.wreckedgames.com/forum/index.php/topic,115.0.html |
| 18:02.10 | mafm | you also can see more info from them in this site, but their forums look like quite dead :) http://www.rightbraingames.com/tech/node/40 |
| 18:03.59 | Ralith | brlcad: hm, SDL is a pretty big dep, and I don't see anything in this patch about removing the linux-specific code that was the problem in the first place |
| 18:04.43 | Ralith | there is some mention about what may be a drop-in replacement from SDL, though |
| 18:04.44 | brlcad | Ralith: yeah, that's why I didn't like it .. don't really want (or see a need for) the sdl dep just for input |
| 18:04.53 | Ralith | the only difference is joystick support |
| 18:05.09 | Ralith | SDL *may* provide it, whereas my patch will not. |
| 18:05.16 | brlcad | especially given they've already taken care of windows, linux, and are working on mac |
| 18:05.23 | brlcad | sdl does provide joystick support |
| 18:05.27 | Ralith | on FreeBSD? |
| 18:05.30 | Ralith | I'm not sure that's even possible. |
| 18:05.43 | ``Erik | I think it does, though the fbsd joystick interface changed a few years ago |
| 18:05.43 | Ralith | linux seems to have had to go out of its way to. |
| 18:06.01 | brlcad | erm, haven't tested it, but it certainly compiles our sdl joystick interface for bzflag |
| 18:06.24 | ``Erik | couldn't get his usb joystick to work with fbsd when he tried it, thinks it was due to a gimpy usb card |
| 18:06.28 | mafm | hmm, but is it also the mouse, apart from the joystick? |
| 18:06.45 | Ralith | mafm: the mouse is handled completely differently. |
| 18:06.54 | Ralith | I'm sure my patch leaves that intact. |
| 18:06.55 | brlcad | no, they provide separate events and require different processing styles |
| 18:07.24 | mafm | doesn't X.org abstract that part? |
| 18:07.38 | Ralith | X doesn't touch joysticks afaik |
| 18:07.52 | mafm | I mean the mouse part |
| 18:07.57 | Ralith | what mous epart |
| 18:08.18 | mafm | you modify LinuxMouse too |
| 18:08.21 | ``Erik | heh http://lgdc.sunsite.dk/articles/19.html :D |
| 18:08.29 | Ralith | yeah |
| 18:08.58 | Ralith | that's taken from the patch in ports |
| 18:09.17 | Ralith | it looks like it should work fine on any platform |
| 18:09.31 | Ralith | though if someone could test it out on linux that would be good |
| 18:10.03 | Ralith | ``Erik: linux 2.0. and 2.2.? :P |
| 18:10.09 | ``Erik | yeah, from 2000, dude |
| 18:10.25 | mafm | don't they have a description about why is the patch necessary at all? |
| 18:10.45 | Ralith | ``Erik: hm, I guess FreeBSD does support it. |
| 18:11.05 | Ralith | does it matter enough that I should put together a nice clean patch w/ proper joystick support? |
| 18:11.09 | Ralith | (which may be nontrivial) |
| 18:12.41 | mafm | I'd say that, whatever you might do, it's preferable to have it uptream when possible |
| 18:12.55 | Ralith | well, it's not going upstream without real support |
| 18:13.03 | Ralith | I'm not even going to try to pitch a quick fix like this :P |
| 18:13.21 | mafm | I was talking mostly about the mouse one of netbsd |
| 18:13.57 | mafm | it doesn't seem like that it's for API issues or something, but because they want to process things in different orders |
| 18:14.16 | Ralith | I'm not even sure that's necessary; it would require testing that's beyond my current means. |
| 18:14.33 | Ralith | I'd have to cobble together some sort of OIS app |
| 18:15.15 | mafm | did you try to use OIS without the changes to the mouse file? |
| 18:15.38 | mafm | or does it everything come in the same patch in freebsd, or what? |
| 18:15.42 | Ralith | like I said, I have no way to 'try' OIS. |
| 18:15.54 | Ralith | and the freebsd version of OIS uses that patch, yes. |
| 18:17.11 | mafm | http://www.wreckedgames.com/forum/index.php?action=printpage;topic=115.0 |
| 18:17.31 | mafm | "Probably would be best to create a seperate BSDInputManager than trying to hack it into the LinuxInputManager, can share the Keyboard and Mouse classes just need to make the JoyStick classes." |
| 18:17.53 | mafm | I think that it's the best solution |
| 18:18.00 | Ralith | I'm sure it is |
| 18:18.13 | mafm | without creating the joysticks at the moment |
| 18:18.14 | Ralith | my patch, however, should give us a working OIS in the meantime |
| 18:19.40 | mafm | well, that's fine... but I want you to understand me... I don't even like the idea of having libraries in src/other :P |
| 18:19.54 | mafm | much less to start maintaining private patches for them |
| 18:20.04 | Ralith | brlcad's goal of a simple, unified, build system that *just works* is laudable. |
| 18:20.11 | Ralith | such a system inevitably requires local hacks. |
| 18:20.57 | mafm | probably we'll have to do that for mocha and rbgui inevitably, and I'm even thinking about forking them and maintaining them separately... |
| 18:21.21 | Ralith | that reminds me |
| 18:21.24 | Ralith | just why did you pick rbgui? |
| 18:21.41 | mafm | because I don't like CEGUI |
| 18:21.47 | Ralith | you may not like it |
| 18:21.50 | Ralith | but CEGUI has a community |
| 18:21.57 | Ralith | you can rely on CEGUI not dissapearing and dying. |
| 18:22.11 | Ralith | rbgui, on the other hand, we can't even tell if it's maintained right now, let alone in the future. |
| 18:23.04 | mafm | according to brlcad's metric, they both would be about the same pain in the ass to maintain separately, if needed at all |
| 18:23.12 | mafm | so the choice didn't matter much :) |
| 18:23.45 | Ralith | we don't want to maintain them separately. |
| 18:23.54 | Ralith | we just want to make the build process simple. |
| 18:24.03 | Ralith | this is *easier* if somebody else is actually maintaining upstream |
| 18:25.22 | Ralith | using libs where you can't get in contact with the authors or even confirm their continued existence is a bad idea, imo. |
| 18:26.09 | mafm | yep, but I have a plan to follow, and that happened relatively late :D |
| 18:26.22 | Ralith | that doesn't justify it :P |
| 18:26.48 | Ralith | would it be helpful if I ported your existing work to CEGUI? |
| 18:27.10 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 18:27.14 | mafm | maybe not for you, but for me it's most important until gsoc finished |
| 18:27.23 | Ralith | uh |
| 18:27.26 | Ralith | was that a yes? |
| 18:27.30 | Ralith | because I'm happily offering my time here |
| 18:27.52 | Ralith | I'm just interested in seeing this poject succeed |
| 18:28.03 | brlcad | ``Erik: you might enjoy this read: http://www.gladwell.com/2004/2004_01_12_a_suv.html |
| 18:28.07 | mafm | it was a reply to "that doesn't justify it", not the second one :D |
| 18:28.11 | Ralith | using questionable software is not a good start. |
| 18:28.23 | Ralith | ah, heh |
| 18:28.30 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 18:28.33 | Ralith | well, I'm offering a solution |
| 18:28.42 | Ralith | it won't mess up your schedule any if it's my problem :P |
| 18:28.43 | mafm | and I would mind you to switch to CEGUI before gsoc finishes, yess :P |
| 18:29.00 | Ralith | you're saying that would be a problem? |
| 18:29.31 | mafm | yes, I would have to make windows in CEGUI and so on, and it's a PITA |
| 18:29.58 | mafm | I don't think that CEGUI is better than RBGui anyway :D |
| 18:30.05 | Ralith | that's not really debatable |
| 18:30.22 | mafm | be right back |
| 18:30.30 | Ralith | CEGUI is obviously and actively maintained by multiple developers who are easy to get ahold of |
| 18:31.11 | Ralith | RBGui is pretty obscure, hosted on a hard-to-access website by developer(s) who might not even be around anymore, and has no community to speak of. |
| 18:33.33 | brlcad | wonders how much effort it would take to abstract the gui portion into just one or few classes such that the backend can be rbgui, cegui or whatever |
| 18:33.44 | brlcad | without replicating everything in that library of course |
| 18:34.42 | Ralith | I think that would be more work to no particular gain; abstract we may, but in the end we'll just use a single one, and probably depend on unique features of it, even. |
| 18:34.48 | mafm | Ralith: what if you notice that CEGUI is severely limited and they don't want to add your changes? :) |
| 18:35.00 | brlcad | Ralith: in all fairness, looking at the various gui toolkits, most of them are so far away from providing the sorts of interaction styles I've had in mind that it *almost* doesn't matter which toolkit we go with -- it's going to be a fair bit of work on our part |
| 18:35.01 | Ralith | mafm: what changes? |
| 18:35.31 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm not even looking at quality of library here; my issue with rbgui is simply that it's not visibly maintained. |
| 18:35.52 | brlcad | mafm: well in that case, if we really needed some change -- it's no different than rbgui -- we'd fork and move on |
| 18:36.26 | Ralith | I suppose brlcad is of sufficient scope that doing that sort of thing really isn't out of the question. |
| 18:36.32 | mafm | brlcad: I'd say that only Gui files have code which would depend on one or the other, except from some initial instantiation |
| 18:36.42 | Ralith | in which case rbgui may well be justifiable, if the way it does things is that much more convenient. |
| 18:37.16 | mafm | brlcad: re:changes, it was speculation... but I feel the same as you do, any of is severely lacking |
| 18:37.23 | brlcad | Ralith: understood, that part really sucks about it -- I know of about 3 or 4 commercial guis that are nearly *exactly* what I'd want for our gui, but then that's not helpful.. ;) |
| 18:37.32 | Ralith | hehe |
| 18:38.16 | mafm | and the point of using RBGui was mostly to play with it, since the alternative CEGUI is well known |
| 18:38.25 | mafm | at least rbgui feels more slick |
| 18:38.41 | mafm | and it has no external dependencies I think, so that also helps |
| 18:38.52 | Ralith | well, there is mocha |
| 18:38.58 | brlcad | what I'm not going to be too compromising on is the features and interactions we need for a clean gui -- that's fairly custom as it is meaning we just need a framework that is functional enough to work in |
| 18:39.04 | Ralith | which seems like your token inhouse util lib |
| 18:39.25 | Ralith | if we're all but resigned to forking in the first place it's pretty moot. |
| 18:39.27 | brlcad | mafm: was it you that sent the link a day or two ago about the pango-based interface? |
| 18:39.58 | brlcad | Ralith: yeah, i'm sure it was *exactly* that -- a simple little lib that was developed for their game's world editor or something and they've moved on |
| 18:40.28 | brlcad | i mean, not just mocha, but rbgui itself too |
| 18:40.35 | Ralith | but if it's a good, usable, extensible lib, that's probably sufficient. |
| 18:41.02 | Ralith | I mean, we should face it; we're going to have some pretty arcane GUI requirements in this editor sooner or later, and we'll have to implement those widgets or w/e ourselves anyway. |
| 18:41.30 | Ralith | the question is if we want to add that much more software to maintain |
| 18:42.01 | brlcad | i certainly don't want to fork and don't think it's a resolved issue .. but I don't think it's one that has to be resolved today either |
| 18:42.01 | mafm | brlcad: yes |
| 18:42.08 | mafm | (wrt pango interface) |
| 18:44.14 | mafm | other than that, did you get things working, Ralith? |
| 18:44.14 | Ralith | not really |
| 18:44.15 | Ralith | rbgui depends on a function inside ogre which is no longer there in the latest version. |
| 18:44.17 | brlcad | the open source custom gui toolkit scene has been (and still is) teh suck .. it really is a shame that none of them are realy 'good' |
| 18:44.43 | Ralith | friend of mine actually has a *really* cool GUI toolkit put together, but it's in D. |
| 18:44.51 | mafm | Ralith: 1.4? you have to use either the one in src/other or trunk (but maybe it has their own problems) |
| 18:44.58 | mafm | its* |
| 18:44.59 | Ralith | mafm: 1.4.9 |
| 18:45.01 | brlcad | Ralith: I can say the one fairly fundamental problem I've had with cegui is their lack of vector support and scalable guis |
| 18:45.10 | mafm | trunk as in... 1.7.something |
| 18:45.23 | Ralith | mafm: oh, we've backported stuff from their dev code? |
| 18:45.33 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm sure it has plenty of problems, but it's active. |
| 18:45.46 | mafm | not backported: using trunk directly :D |
| 18:45.49 | brlcad | I talked to the cegui devs a while back about it and they had it on their todo but said it was a huge task given how they currently do things, and not likely to happen anytime soon |
| 18:46.24 | Ralith | mafm: what's in src/other doesn't look like trunk, it looks like 1.4.8 |
| 18:46.28 | mafm | <brlcad> the open source custom gui toolkit scene has been (and still is) teh suck .. it really is a shame that none of them are realy 'good' -- and do you say that even if there's not even a decent network library? ;) |
| 18:46.46 | brlcad | Ralith: i know, preaching to the choir .. just noting that upstream support is only one piece to consider (and not necessarily the biggest one) |
| 18:46.56 | mafm | it's trunk, really |
| 18:47.10 | mafm | and it has to be, not only me but homovulgaris got it working |
| 18:47.11 | Ralith | must be very old trunk. |
| 18:47.20 | brlcad | mafm: decent network library? there are several decent network libraries |
| 18:47.39 | Ralith | brlcad: I don't suppose we've considered using a more mainstream GUI lib like qt or gtk? |
| 18:47.49 | Ralith | I imagine there's some reason those are inappropriate? |
| 18:47.51 | brlcad | Ralith: yes |
| 18:48.00 | brlcad | they were the first things considered |
| 18:48.07 | brlcad | wrought with lots of issues |
| 18:48.11 | mafm | brlcad: s/decent/standard :D |
| 18:48.40 | mafm | Ralith: not very old, it's from may or so |
| 18:49.04 | Ralith | huh. |
| 18:49.12 | brlcad | mafm: the great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from -- i'm not sure what standardization would get you (for this sort of project) |
| 18:49.16 | Ralith | well, I'll see about making *it* bsd happy then. |
| 18:49.41 | brlcad | we have our own net lib in brlcad that should generally be used unless there is some functional reason not to |
| 18:52.08 | mafm | brlcad: not for this project, I mean in general |
| 18:52.15 | mafm | and I wanted them in std:: :P |
| 18:52.53 | Ralith | there are networking thingies in std::. |
| 18:53.10 | brlcad | Ralith: not to get too far into it but the biggest negatives for the two big camps aside from community/dev polarization are that gtk is cross-platform dependency hell and qt is under an unfortunate license |
| 18:54.25 | Ralith | dependency hell? |
| 18:54.34 | brlcad | otherwise, qt is fairly high on the list from a features perspective |
| 18:54.46 | Ralith | actually, that's a thought |
| 18:54.46 | brlcad | yes |
| 18:55.03 | Ralith | qt has a *ton* of stuff that we wouldn't need. |
| 18:55.05 | brlcad | gtk is about as bad as it gets if you manage all dependencies |
| 18:55.13 | Ralith | that sucks. |
| 18:55.18 | Ralith | ah well, if rbgui works, then great. |
| 18:56.11 | brlcad | like I said, I don't think the gui problem is solved .. it'll more amount to how easily can a given toolkit be customized |
| 18:57.07 | ``Erik | when I was your age, we built gnome without package managers! and we liked it! |
| 18:57.07 | ``Erik | ;D |
| 18:57.18 | Ralith | hehe |
| 18:57.27 | pacman87 | ``Erik: yeah i tried that with kde4 a few weeks ago... |
| 18:58.23 | mafm | ``Erik: then the came the gentoo guys and blew you all away... :P |
| 18:59.45 | ``Erik | nah, debian got gtk into apt, freebsd added it to ports, gentoo wasn't around, ... |
| 19:00.39 | Ralith | back to an earlier note, that wreckedgames link someone pasted seems to imply that they've already got somebody solving the OIS problem cleanly |
| 19:01.19 | Ralith | so the quick fix I set up should do to hold us over for now. |
| 19:02.44 | mafm | solved it in which release? we're using 1.2.0 IIRC |
| 19:03.08 | Ralith | nobody's solved it |
| 19:03.12 | Ralith | read what I said :P |
| 19:06.17 | mafm | ah, the guy is still *solving* it? |
| 19:08.45 | Ralith | so he says. |
| 19:13.01 | mafm | do you remember the name of the guy? I can't see the one that I know in IRC at the moment |
| 19:15.05 | Ralith | Post by: AMDmi3 on June 17, 2008, 04:13:33 PM |
| 19:17.59 | mafm | the one that I know it's similar to pacman87, but now his nick is clobbering the other one :D |
| 19:18.58 | pacman87 | mafm: do you log chats? |
| 19:20.11 | mafm | nope |
| 19:20.26 | mafm | pjcast, that's it |
| 19:20.31 | mafm | not very similar after all :D |
| 19:21.15 | brlcad | three letters match :) |
| 19:22.51 | mafm | I recalled 1st letter and approximate length, just that :D |
| 19:32.10 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-84-80.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:35.07 | brlcad | "And the old pro said to him that people who succeed in the business are not those that are the most talented, and theyâre not the people that know the most people, but they are the people who are able to endure." |
| 19:35.15 | brlcad | that's such a good quote |
| 19:37.13 | ``Erik | I thought you were working, not reading slashdot :> |
| 19:38.33 | ``Erik | looks around for his emacs crib sheet |
| 19:39.09 | mafm | lol |
| 19:42.12 | mafm | Ralith: are you going to try with ogre trunk? |
| 19:42.28 | mafm | there was a simple patch adding a function for get it working with older versions |
| 19:42.28 | Ralith | mafm: yeah, on the wrong system right now |
| 19:42.39 | Ralith | I saw it |
| 19:42.53 | mafm | good |
| 19:43.12 | mafm | maybe I won't be able to join tomorrow and I'll probably be out the rest of the weekend |
| 19:43.36 | mafm | but you can send me a mail with your progress or doubts, if you want :) |
| 19:44.52 | Ralith | kk |
| 19:44.55 | Ralith | your email's on your userpage? |
| 19:44.57 | brlcad | dev mailing list ftw ;) |
| 19:45.04 | Ralith | should get on that |
| 19:45.27 | mafm | that too |
| 19:45.36 | brlcad | it's low traffic, but a good alternative to irc for the non-screen+irssi or simply non-irc folks |
| 19:45.53 | brlcad | at least until there's a decent forum |
| 19:46.12 | mafm | woot, I think that I got a complete Blender implementation for the basic functions |
| 19:47.01 | ``Erik | rocket racing league heh |
| 19:47.24 | Ralith | mafm: nice! sounds like you're making fast progress. |
| 19:48.18 | brlcad | mafm: cool, that should be really useful in the long run |
| 19:49.51 | mafm | it has: zoom in & out, zoom reset, orbit up/down/left/right, pan 4 dirs, full reset |
| 19:50.00 | mafm | and mouse drag with free rotation |
| 19:50.35 | mafm | (and keyboard with 15 degree steps, as in blender too) |
| 19:51.12 | Ralith | is there any sort of test-object so you can actually tell it's rotating? |
| 19:52.44 | mafm | yes, the boring tetrahedron-like |
| 19:55.14 | pacman87 | tetrahedrons aren't boring, you just have to get to know them first |
| 19:55.39 | mafm | well, it doesn't even have texture and it's all grey |
| 19:55.51 | mafm | it's like a tetrahedron from Roswell |
| 19:56.07 | mafm | you can't get acquainted with them easily |
| 20:03.22 | pacman87 | make a wireframe-type version: 4 spheres, 6 cylinders |
| 20:06.32 | mafm | the problem is that it's still not shaded or anything |
| 20:07.27 | brlcad | pacman87: hehe |
| 20:09.21 | mafm | btw, making spheres and cylinders requires more manual programming :D |
| 20:10.16 | pacman87 | surely i'm not the only one who anthropomorphizes the platonic solids? |
| 20:10.31 | Ralith | I didn't |
| 20:10.33 | Ralith | but I will now |
| 20:10.40 | Ralith | because that is an AWESOME idea. |
| 20:10.58 | Ralith | now I have someone to blame when a model doesn't work out :> |
| 20:11.45 | pacman87 | Ralith: if you get mad at them, they'll never work for you |
| 20:11.52 | pacman87 | you have to be friendly |
| 20:12.00 | Ralith | I never said I'd be cruel |
| 20:12.10 | Ralith | I just might take away their material privledges for a little while |
| 20:12.42 | Ralith | make them spend some time in a region all alone |
| 20:13.31 | pacman87 | woohoo, i just fixed a bug by adding 4 characters in two places :) |
| 20:14.25 | brlcad | hehe, you guys are nuts |
| 20:14.53 | brlcad | like a torus |
| 20:17.57 | starseeker | I know I can check the region flag on a combination to see if it IS a region - is there any logic to let me ask a combination if it CONTAINS any regions? (i.e., is it an assembly?) |
| 20:20.33 | mafm | Could not read status line: Secure connection truncated (https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net) |
| 20:20.33 | brlcad | not that come to mind, but you should be able to find out pretty easily with db_walk_tree or one of the other traversal funcs |
| 20:20.34 | mafm | :| |
| 20:20.49 | starseeker | cool. |
| 20:21.24 | starseeker | checks how db_apply_state_from_comb works... |
| 20:21.39 | pacman87 | wireframe: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_wf09.png |
| 20:21.39 | pacman87 | raytrace: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt16.png |
| 20:22.03 | pacman87 | the sketch is just four line segments |
| 20:22.17 | pacman87 | autoclosed |
| 20:22.19 | mafm | so I can't commit the rest of the code today... |
| 20:22.51 | mafm | heading home, take care folks :) |
| 20:23.09 | pacman87 | later |
| 20:25.21 | pacman87 | i can't commit either |
| 20:27.11 | brlcad | me either |
| 20:29.19 | brlcad | pacman87: hah, that is wicked cool -- i take it that is at least 4 line segments? |
| 20:29.35 | pacman87 | the sketch is only the 4 segments |
| 20:29.42 | pacman87 | all others were auto-added |
| 20:30.02 | brlcad | right |
| 20:30.10 | brlcad | looks great |
| 20:30.15 | pacman87 | thanks |
| 20:30.39 | pacman87 | i think i'll write a rt_sketch_contains( point2d pt ) function |
| 20:36.40 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@c-69-255-182-248.hsd1.va.comcast.net) | |
| 20:38.09 | starseeker | note to self - looks like logic needed is somewhere in db_tree |
| 20:42.02 | brlcad | starseeker: there are about five walkers |
| 20:42.13 | brlcad | make sure it's not something already available in one of the other walkers |
| 20:42.21 | starseeker | right :-) |
| 20:42.24 | pacman87 | brlcad: file is here: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/wireframe.g |
| 20:42.39 | pacman87 | won't look right for you yet, since i can't commit |
| 20:42.51 | starseeker | knows the region creator warns of there is a region below it - a variation on that is all I need |
| 20:43.25 | brlcad | e.g. db_find_tree maintains a db_tree_state with the matrices applied, but none of the others do, etc |
| 20:43.47 | brlcad | er db_walk_tree |
| 20:44.02 | brlcad | db_walk_tree stops at regions, it's probably using that |
| 20:46.12 | brlcad | there we go, db_recurse would probably do the trick, feed it a db_tree_state that has a region callback set |
| 20:46.18 | starseeker | Hmm - db_count_subtree_regions |
| 20:46.27 | brlcad | ooh, even better :) |
| 20:46.50 | brlcad | one of the great and bad things about librt .. it's big |
| 20:46.58 | starseeker | assumes the name is descriptive... |
| 20:47.02 | brlcad | but if you need it, highly likely someone else needed it too |
| 20:47.04 | starseeker | read read read |
| 20:47.32 | starseeker | for naming, a LACK of an extension is only OK (sometimes) if its an assembly |
| 20:47.45 | starseeker | e.g. if there's one or more regions in there |
| 20:47.58 | starseeker | so I have to check |
| 20:55.42 | brlcad | woot |
| 20:55.49 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31866 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac include/common.h include/config_win.h): since we're always defining it, push USE_PROTOTYPES up into common.h so our headers are closer to working without needing a config.h |
| 20:56.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31867 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: make the wireframe handling more robust - don't automatically draw a line from an open endpoint to the axis if there is another open endpoint with the same Y value |
| 21:01.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31868 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Make it a bit easier to throw test strings at the parsing routine, tweak some behavior, a few notes on things to figure out. Still a long way from usable. |
| 21:04.28 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i got my learner's permit! |
| 21:09.39 | brlcad | woo hoo! |
| 21:09.52 | brlcad | now you just need one of those four-wheeled thingies |
| 21:12.09 | pacman87 | brlcad: a car? |
| 21:12.46 | brlcad | pacman87: ;) |
| 21:12.57 | pacman87 | i need one too |
| 21:13.16 | Ralith | get me one while you're at it |
| 21:13.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31869 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 7 dirs): if we're going to always define USE_FBSERV then why does it even exist? push it out of configure up into dm.h, make it non-conditional for libtclcad but keep libdm's just in case. |
| 21:23.34 | brlcad | Ralith: curious, back on the rbgui point, did you see the video? |
| 21:23.43 | brlcad | (just wondering) |
| 21:44.27 | Ralith | brlcad: the 'ideal UI' thing? |
| 21:45.05 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:45.07 | pacman87 | lol |
| 22:15.17 | poolio | brlcad: howdy :) |
| 22:15.42 | pacman87 | poolio: apparently we Ps are taking over IRC |
| 22:15.55 | poolio | pacman87: according to? Ralith? |
| 22:16.41 | brlcad | Ralith: no, the rbgui demo video |
| 22:16.54 | pacman87 | (02:14:16 PM) mafm: do you remember the name of the guy? I can't see the one that I know in IRC at the moment |
| 22:16.54 | pacman87 | (02:19:14 PM) mafm: the one that I know it's similar to pacman87, but now his nick is clobbering the other one :D |
| 22:17.38 | poolio | aawww, hi mafm |
| 22:17.50 | Ralith | brlcad: nope |
| 22:18.05 | Ralith | didn't know there were any |
| 22:18.18 | poolio | pacman87: I think the issue is just that we have the same first character...I think that everyone else is unique in that respect |
| 22:21.16 | pacman87 | there are currently 32 people in this channel, and only 26 letters. therefore, there must be other sets of nicks that start with the same first letter. |
| 22:27.04 | poolio | oh how I love the pigeonhole principle |
| 22:27.34 | Ralith | what about non-alphabetical nicks? |
| 22:27.37 | Ralith | IRC allows that |
| 22:28.05 | *** join/#brlcad hml (n=x@unaffiliated/hml) | |
| 22:28.20 | hml | how do i efficiently take the intersection of two water tight meshes? |
| 22:30.52 | brlcad | hml: combine them together in a combination with an intersection operation .. (?) |
| 22:31.09 | hml | no sorry; i meant how to implement this operatioln |
| 22:31.21 | hml | if i have an array of vertices, an array of edges, and an array of faces |
| 22:31.26 | hml | as the structure for a mesh; |
| 22:31.40 | hml | giveh two of these water tight meshes, how I can calculate their intersection |
| 22:31.45 | hml | this seems like a rather complicated operation |
| 22:31.49 | brlcad | heh, explaining that is somewhat more complicated |
| 22:32.00 | brlcad | "read the source" ;) |
| 22:32.14 | brlcad | we have an implementation of that in brl-cad |
| 22:32.23 | brlcad | it amounts to .. a lot of code |
| 22:33.11 | hml | hmm; is the csg library easy to factor out? |
| 22:33.32 | brlcad | it's fairly modular as it is |
| 22:34.10 | brlcad | but yeah, you could probably extract those portions that relate to this fairly easily |
| 22:34.50 | brlcad | it all happens in src/librt (with most in src/librt/primitives/nmg) |
| 22:35.15 | hml | can you give me a few pointers on which dirs to start with? |
| 22:35.27 | brlcad | otherwise, we published a research paper on the technique we use about a decade ago |
| 22:36.23 | brlcad | what are you doing? |
| 22:36.44 | hml | i see src/librt, but not primitives/nmg |
| 22:36.59 | brlcad | starseeker, pacman87, etc .. if you use rss, sf.net has a feed for site status now: feed://sourceforge.net/community/forum/rss.php?forum=11 |
| 22:37.56 | brlcad | he talks about the recent svn outage earlier today as just being part of working on the new svn infrastructure in chicago, sorting out performance problems |
| 22:38.11 | brlcad | that shouldn't be longer than a half-hour else they'll update the site status |
| 22:42.01 | hml | why is thisalled librt |
| 22:42.18 | hml | (why is csg in ray tracing) |
| 22:43.18 | hml | actually, where's the pape ryou write 10 years again |
| 22:43.32 | hml | maybe i can read it and implement a crapppppy version of it for my own needs |
| 22:44.20 | pacman87 | hml: is that like a Ppppppowerbook? |
| 22:44.20 | hml | no; it's an ultra sensistivbe keyboard |
| 22:44.20 | hml | it's xrate 150 100 |
| 22:44.38 | brlcad | csg ray tracing is at the heart of what we do and why we do it, they are very closely tied to one another |
| 22:44.50 | pacman87 | http://www.zug.com/pranks/powerbook/ |
| 22:44.56 | brlcad | csg of polygonal surfaces is entirely secondary |
| 22:45.35 | brlcad | we can evaluate csg on any geometry format whether it be implicit, explicit polygonal, explicit spline surface, etc |
| 22:45.43 | brlcad | by doing it at the ray-trace level |
| 22:46.05 | hml | so you do csg via ray traceing? |
| 22:46.19 | brlcad | yes |
| 22:46.44 | brlcad | not for the polygonal surface on polygonal surface calculation I referred to |
| 22:46.50 | hml | hmm |
| 22:47.02 | hml | where's the paper ? :-) |
| 22:47.11 | brlcad | though if you just put the two meshes into one combination and ray-trace it, it'll evaluate the csg at ray-trace time |
| 22:47.24 | hml | i need to get the csg into a mesh to load ito opengl |
| 22:48.14 | brlcad | specifically for meshes, you can also evaluate the result by facetizing .. which if you have two meshes and a boolean will be the resultant mesh of that boolean |
| 22:48.40 | brlcad | i don't have a cite link on hand for the paper, you'll have to search for it -- pretty sure it's reachable via google |
| 22:49.01 | brlcad | try brl-cad, nmg, n-manifold geometry, muuss, terms should help |
| 22:49.28 | brlcad | otherwise, I'd be glad to help you modularize our code for your need |
| 22:52.11 | hml | okay; I'm going to tkae you up on this offer; right after I eat |
| 22:54.23 | brlcad | as in help you work with us, provide pointers in the code, maybe work towards commit access |
| 22:54.26 | brlcad | not do it for you in any sense of the offer ;) |
| 22:54.52 | brlcad | collaboration is key, I have more than enough on my plate to do it for you ;) |
| 22:54.58 | hml | of course |
| 22:55.12 | hml | you job will solely be as a wiki; i'll write every line of code :-) |
| 22:55.40 | brlcad | you really shouldn't need to write code other than to optimize (this chunk of code is entirely not optimized) |
| 22:56.07 | brlcad | mostly moving stuff around, maybe moving all the nmg code into its own library |
| 22:56.22 | brlcad | since that's what it sounds like you need |
| 22:56.43 | brlcad | still, what is this for and who are you? :) |
| 22:57.37 | hml | research ... nameless grad student |
| 22:58.22 | brlcad | k |
| 22:59.04 | brlcad | then I shall be mentor ... nameless brl-cad dev |
| 22:59.28 | Ralith | what's with the nick anyway |
| 22:59.36 | Ralith | I thought you were a bot when I joined |
| 23:00.33 | poolio | it was that or 'sean-cad' |
| 23:00.58 | hml | brlcad: when are you normally on irc / what time zone? |
| 23:01.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31870 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 23:01.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the topic has come up before, but raised again by someone possibly interested in |
| 23:01.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: working on the task (hml, via irc). refactor all of the nmg processing code |
| 23:01.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: (back) into its own library. would let external users manage their mesh |
| 23:01.08 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: geometry without needing to pull in everything else in librt. |
| 23:01.11 | brlcad | hml: I'm always on irc, even when I'm not |
| 23:01.37 | brlcad | if you linger, i'll read and answer anything in my backlog |
| 23:02.05 | brlcad | Ralith: I was using the 'brlcad' nick long before brl-cad was open source |
| 23:02.23 | Ralith | huh. |
| 23:02.23 | brlcad | just a handle because I love working on it |
| 23:02.23 | Ralith | hehe |
| 23:02.47 | Ralith | great to know you're that dedicated |
| 23:03.25 | poolio | brlcad: is src/other/openNURBS meant to be vanilla? |
| 23:03.37 | brlcad | poolio: theoretically |
| 23:03.42 | brlcad | it's not atm |
| 23:04.02 | brlcad | i (or someone(tm)) have to undo some of the mods made so we can upgrade to the latest releast |
| 23:05.02 | poolio | Hmmm, it's probably to just create a new file for what I'm thinking about doing...I was talking with ed about how to get ellipsoids, and it looks like you can just take the sphere and stretch it |
| 23:05.25 | brlcad | jason had to implement some of the evaluation routines that they ripped out in order to get ray-tracing working and it was easier at the time to just mod them instead of hacking around it some other way |
| 23:05.31 | poolio | Also, I have no clue how to do tgc :\ |
| 23:05.51 | brlcad | i can help you with the caps ;) |
| 23:06.02 | brlcad | chuckles |
| 23:06.03 | poolio | Heh, but raytracing doesn't work, does it? :P |
| 23:06.14 | brlcad | it does |
| 23:06.17 | brlcad | somewhat |
| 23:06.26 | brlcad | lots of failure cases, very raw |
| 23:06.33 | poolio | It failed pretty miserable on my torus |
| 23:07.41 | brlcad | you'll get a mix of utter failure (crashes) to working beautifully to working with nasty results to almost working with acne |
| 23:07.50 | poolio | My English is pretty terrible today |
| 23:08.04 | poolio | brlcad: good luck fixing that :) |
| 23:08.35 | brlcad | we have a matrix of a slew of things exported from Rhino3D .. about a third worked flawless, about a third with some problem, and about a third failing hard |
| 23:08.50 | poolio | yeah I saw, you sent it to me |
| 23:08.56 | brlcad | right |
| 23:09.00 | brlcad | that thing |
| 23:12.40 | poolio | After ell/tgc/arbs, what would you say is the next most important? |
| 23:14.08 | brlcad | tor |
| 23:14.30 | poolio | done tor :) |
| 23:14.47 | poolio | I guess I should say openNURBS did tor... |
| 23:15.19 | brlcad | for tgc, you could start with the subset cases |
| 23:15.30 | brlcad | rcc, rec, trc, tec, etc |
| 23:16.09 | brlcad | otherwise, pipe is probably the next one (which is sort of just stitching rcc's and tor's together) |
| 23:16.22 | brlcad | followed by arbn (different from arb#) |
| 23:17.05 | poolio | Do you think it's worth doing the subsets of tgc? |
| 23:20.14 | brlcad | dunno, might help figure out tgc if you figure out rcc first |
| 23:20.52 | poolio | Well rcc is just a surface of revolution...all the primitives like that are easy |
| 23:21.04 | poolio | The issue is when they aren't a surface of revolution...have to take a totally different approoach |
| 23:21.21 | poolio | Although, if the scaling thing ed told me about works, then that may be grossly simplified |
| 23:24.06 | brlcad | ah, true |
| 23:24.15 | brlcad | i was thinking of defining that surface directly |
| 23:24.23 | brlcad | but a revolution would be easier |
| 23:25.08 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (n=Pandora@c-69-243-244-154.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 23:25.35 | brlcad | poolio: er, hold up .. isn't tgc one of the few that were actually already done? |
| 23:25.55 | brlcad | i.e. it has a tnurb callback |
| 23:26.05 | brlcad | just need to convert that to opennurbs lingo |
| 23:26.08 | poolio | brlcad: oh yeah? lemme go look :) |
| 23:26.15 | brlcad | yeah it does |
| 23:26.48 | poolio | brlcad: yes! schweet :) |
| 23:27.06 | poolio | ell does too. I forgot about these |
| 23:27.41 | *** join/#brlcad saltan (n=lieven@d51530284.access.telenet.be) | |
| 23:27.52 | brlcad | so do a few others from the looks of it |
| 23:27.56 | brlcad | howdy punkrockgirl |
| 23:28.49 | brlcad | poolio: yet even a third option is that we have an okay to utilize the code in BOOLE |
| 23:29.45 | *** part/#brlcad saltan (n=lieven@d51530284.access.telenet.be) | |
| 23:29.56 | brlcad | boole implements a lot of this too (it's a sytem for ray-tracing csg nurbs surfaces, specifically built from brl-cad geometry) |
| 23:29.58 | poolio | So is there any reason not to use BOOLE? |
| 23:30.31 | brlcad | yeah, it was an academic effort that has a hell of a lot of failure cases |
| 23:30.39 | brlcad | but that's at the CSG eval level |
| 23:30.50 | brlcad | the underlying pieces might be helpful reference code |
| 23:30.52 | poolio | yeah...if the conversion to brep works... |
| 23:31.31 | brlcad | they have a website with a tarball up |
| 23:32.08 | poolio | I'm browsing the source right now |
| 23:34.33 | brlcad | their "ascii" format is actually our old v4 file format, so I can show you how to get that if you need it |
| 00:08.21 | hml | haha |
| 00:08.29 | hml | spinlocksolutions ... interesting company name |
| 00:08.37 | hml | reminds me of this proof |
| 00:08.39 | hml | where if you're in the os |
| 00:08.47 | hml | and you're decidine g between spinlocking and sleeping |
| 00:08.55 | hml | you shoudl spinlock for the expected time to get the lock |
| 00:08.57 | hml | then sleep |
| 00:09.03 | hml | guarnateed to be within a factor of 2 of optimal |
| 00:11.34 | starseeker_ | does double-take seeing rhino in his world upgrade file, before noticing it is a java thing |
| 01:27.18 | *** join/#brlcad Miesco (n=shawn@bas2-toronto12-1088943115.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 01:27.24 | Miesco | Hey, how do i select an object |
| 01:27.26 | Miesco | So its white |
| 01:29.04 | brlcad | Miesco: want the gui answer or the command-line answer? |
| 01:29.27 | Miesco | brlcad: both please |
| 01:29.30 | brlcad | and have you read the mged tutorial -- it covers the gui answer |
| 01:29.41 | Miesco | brlcad: I am reading it |
| 01:29.50 | Miesco | brlcad: the one for beginners |
| 01:30.27 | brlcad | #2 at http://brlcad.org/wiki/Documentation |
| 01:30.29 | Miesco | Im doing the project where you create a globe in a frame |
| 01:30.34 | brlcad | okay |
| 01:30.41 | brlcad | that's one of its lessons |
| 01:32.02 | Miesco | I dont think that it told me |
| 01:32.08 | Miesco | How do you? |
| 01:32.17 | Miesco | I looked through the whole refrence |
| 01:32.22 | Miesco | both of them |
| 01:33.31 | brlcad | it definitely tells you :) |
| 01:33.36 | Miesco | aw man, what page |
| 01:33.44 | Miesco | Whats the command line way to do it |
| 01:33.48 | brlcad | page 73 |
| 01:34.10 | brlcad | if it's a primitive, you can use Primitive Selection on the Edit menu |
| 01:34.25 | brlcad | if it's a combination/region/group, you use the Matrix Selection on the Edit Menu |
| 01:35.04 | Miesco | thanks |
| 01:35.34 | Miesco | primitive is what you get from make right? |
| 01:35.41 | brlcad | yes |
| 01:36.46 | brlcad | if you turn on misc->faceplate and misc->faceplaye gui then you can also use the 's' keybinding in the graphics window, then move your mouse up/down to select objects for editing |
| 01:37.12 | brlcad | the command line way is either using the 'sed' command or the 'oed' command for primitives and combinations respectively |
| 01:37.50 | brlcad | there's a nice detailed tutorial on the oed command on the website, #5 |
| 01:38.10 | brlcad | the mged quick referecne card (#2.1) lists both of them under editing |
| 02:45.06 | PrezKennedy | changes nickname to mged for good laughs |
| 02:46.44 | pacman87 | i call 'rt' |
| 02:48.30 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: you happen to be at home? |
| 03:05.08 | poolio | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:06.10 | starseeker_ | Hmm - brlcad, is oed supposed to work if you just give it a primitive? Or should that be sed only? |
| 03:06.30 | brlcad | it's not presently supposed to work |
| 03:06.46 | brlcad | but it certainly could be made to work |
| 03:09.41 | brlcad | something like: oed {lhs rhs | object} and if object is a primitive, it just does the same as sed; if it's a combination, it uses the center of bb and applies as "/ object" |
| 03:10.27 | brlcad | oo, even better: oed [lhs] {path} |
| 03:11.43 | brlcad | where if lhs is missing, it defaults to / and path can be just an object name (prim or comb) which causes it to use center of the BB of the rightmost path element (which is the BB of that element if you do just "oed obj") |
| 03:20.54 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, im in La Plata |
| 03:41.40 | *** join/#brlcad Rabbitbunny (n=Bunny@unaffiliated/rabbitbunny) | |
| 03:42.24 | Rabbitbunny | You guy only know about brlcad or do you happen to know how to get things to quit flipping inside out in SolidWorks. |
| 03:42.34 | Rabbitbunny | Also, Why aren't you all in #cad? |
| 03:48.55 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 03:58.33 | pacman87 | 'flipping inside out'? |
| 03:59.39 | Rabbitbunny | As in, instead of the control arms being outside the ladder frame, they are suddenly inside it. |
| 04:00.22 | pacman87 | are you talking about mates in an assembly? |
| 04:01.35 | brlcad | Rabbitbunny: why would be be in #cad? |
| 04:01.36 | Rabbitbunny | Well, It's related to mates... But yes it's an assembly of tubing which creates a double wishbone suspension. |
| 04:02.04 | Rabbitbunny | brlcad: Because brlcad is pretty related. |
| 04:02.30 | brlcad | and more importantly, why would we want to provide support for a non-commercial package that someone supposedly paid a high penny for while what we do is for free ;) |
| 04:02.59 | brlcad | Rabbitbunny: so is #c and a couple dozen channels, but that's not a reason to hang out there ;) |
| 04:03.20 | Rabbitbunny | Because not everyone has 3d rendering on their linux box. |
| 04:03.54 | brlcad | eh? |
| 04:04.26 | brlcad | s/non-// too, of course .. heh |
| 04:05.01 | brlcad | not trying to be antagonistic, but it's just really out of place |
| 04:05.23 | yukonbob | hello, BRL-CADheads |
| 04:06.10 | pacman87 | howdy yukonbob |
| 04:06.13 | brlcad | if we received the money that was sent to dassault for that license, I might be more receptive ;) |
| 04:06.20 | Rabbitbunny | Well, obviously, But truth be told I never considered an oss cad system. |
| 04:06.38 | yukonbob | Rabbitbunny: you've come to the right place to start considering :) |
| 04:06.52 | brlcad | you're paying them to support you, make them support you :) |
| 04:07.21 | Rabbitbunny | It's 11pm, I think they're sleeping on my money right this moment. |
| 04:07.45 | yukonbob | or snorting cocaine off of strippers |
| 04:07.59 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:08.03 | Rabbitbunny | Well yeah, But I figure they're too old for that. |
| 04:08.10 | Rabbitbunny | Maybe the marketing guys are. |
| 04:08.33 | brlcad | oh, i know a couple of the dassault guys .. they'd be up for at least half that statement ;) |
| 04:10.37 | Rabbitbunny | heh 'Solid Modelling for a strong defense' |
| 04:10.48 | Rabbitbunny | I think the project history may be fun to read. |
| 04:12.10 | brlcad | if you have any questions about brl-cad, be more than happy to answer them :) |
| 04:12.45 | brlcad | the industry diagram might be a useful starting point for you (under Documentation) as well as the introduction |
| 04:13.55 | brlcad | we don't have nearly the manpower, resources, or development investment than the major commercial CAD packages have, but we do get the job done if you are willing to climb the learning curve (we are definitely rather different) |
| 04:14.29 | brlcad | usability isn't a strong point, but support, customization, and development momentum are |
| 04:15.00 | yukonbob | suggests s/usability/easy introduction/ |
| 04:15.28 | yukonbob | like people say about Unix -- it's user friendly, but just picky about who it's friend are... |
| 04:17.49 | brlcad | yeah, that's probably a better way to put it -- especially given our best modelers are just as efficient in brl-cad as they are in commercial cad systems (they tell us) |
| 04:22.27 | Rabbitbunny | It can't be too bad, I didn't even do the SolidWorks course. |
| 04:23.23 | yukonbob | Rabbitbunny: with BRL-CAD, expect a steep learning curve. Think of something steep. Double it. Double it again. But once you're over that, pure joy. |
| 04:24.42 | *** join/#brlcad hml (n=x@unaffiliated/hml) | |
| 04:25.17 | yukonbob | howdy hml |
| 04:25.33 | hml | reading laidlaw's 1986 csg paper |
| 04:25.38 | hml | you read it before? |
| 04:25.46 | jonored | notes that this sort of learning curve is exactly why he's unlikely to bother much with anything else - not everyone is afriad of the steep curve. |
| 04:28.34 | Rabbitbunny | Well, there are two types of curves. Concepts and Memorization. SolidWorks forced me to learn a lot of concepts. Hopefully brlcad isn't all about memorization. |
| 04:28.54 | Rabbitbunny | I see references to vi and emacs, somewhat forboding. |
| 04:29.41 | yukonbob | Embrace the fear. Come. Join the Free Side. |
| 04:30.54 | jonored | Ah, but you get so much power from a proper editor like one of those... |
| 04:34.34 | Ralith | in my opinion, steep learning curves are the best kind |
| 04:34.44 | Ralith | lots of work, but a very rewarding height once you're up there |
| 04:34.53 | Ralith | also |
| 04:34.56 | Ralith | [21:03]<Rabbitbunny>Because not everyone has 3d rendering on their linux box. |
| 04:35.14 | Ralith | I'm pretty sure BRL-CAD is usable if you don't even have an X server. |
| 04:35.18 | Ralith | although compiling it might be hard. |
| 04:35.54 | Ralith | the only realtime rendering currently done in the bits I'm aware of is very simple wireframes :P |
| 04:36.04 | Ralith | which can probably even be done at usable speed in software. |
| 04:36.24 | jonored | There's also, you know, rt... but that's a raytracer, which isn't generally done with hardware. |
| 04:36.32 | jonored | (or rather, specialized hardware.) |
| 04:36.41 | Rabbitbunny | Oh, I have X. It just doesn't do 3d. It's a p2-733 with 320Mb ram and an Intel i810. Xfce is pushing it. |
| 04:37.14 | pacman87 | Rabbitbunny: is that what you're running solidworks on? |
| 04:37.34 | Rabbitbunny | No, I run SolidWorks on the Windows box. |
| 04:37.48 | Ralith | Rabbitbunny: if you look at the gallery, there's a photo of BRL-CAD in use on a PDP-11. |
| 04:37.50 | pacman87 | *sigh of relief* |
| 04:37.53 | jonored | I'm running BRL-CAD quite comfortably on a similar system, but I think substantially lower clock. |
| 04:37.57 | Ralith | I'm pretty sure those don't have 3d accel either. |
| 04:38.23 | pacman87 | i've got a pIII 800 mhz w/ 192 mb ram ( i think |
| 04:38.37 | pacman87 | sitting behind me |
| 04:38.55 | Ralith | I've got a bunch of those |
| 04:39.02 | jonored | CF-27. PII, 300MHz, 128mb ram, what I'm typing this on :) |
| 04:39.04 | Ralith | been thinking about networking them up and trying out distributed raytracing on them |
| 04:39.26 | jonored | my primary machine. |
| 04:39.40 | Rabbitbunny | My server is a p2-450 with 128mb and no X. Slowest box I've ever owned. |
| 04:42.51 | Rabbitbunny | Yes, I'm young. |
| 04:43.42 | pacman87 | i think my dad had a 286 and a 386 |
| 04:43.51 | jonored | It's nice having a machine you can drop from a yard up, take out in the rain/dust/freezing, and replace for $50. Snappy, too, with lightweight software on it. |
| 04:43.53 | pacman87 | probably sitll up in the attic somehwere |
| 04:44.30 | Ralith | jonored: although I <3 my core 2 duo laptop w/ a high end video card, too ^^ |
| 04:45.26 | pacman87 | first os i remember was ms dos shell |
| 04:45.47 | brlcad | hml: yeah, that's not far off what we do |
| 04:46.52 | Rabbitbunny | Lucky, My dad into Apple, I still have the ][e. Haven't made the fishtank yet. |
| 04:47.00 | Rabbitbunny | s/into/was into/ |
| 04:48.20 | jonored | Ralith: Might up to one of the CF-19s sometime. 4lb, ultra-low-power core duo, good graphics, and a tablet, all on the same durability spec as my beast. |
| 04:48.28 | hml | brlcad: cool, I think i'm going to start out trying to implement that paer (and learn from it -- not trying to reinvent the wheel here -- and port the brlcad code if I fail) |
| 04:49.15 | jonored | (girlfriend has one of those, it's impressive.) |
| 04:50.39 | brlcad | Ralith: compiling brl-cad for non-X11 use is pretty simple actually, just set a flag and you have non-gui-only |
| 04:51.09 | pacman87 | use rt -F/dev/brainlink |
| 04:51.52 | Ralith | brlcad: ooo, cool |
| 04:51.54 | brlcad | but yeah, even for full functionality we don't require opengl |
| 04:51.57 | Ralith | i didn't think that was actually supported |
| 04:52.28 | Ralith | jonored: I like being able to game ^^ |
| 04:52.56 | brlcad | Rabbitbunny: brl-cad actually should run on a IIe if you had the right tools and environment to compile :) |
| 04:53.40 | Rabbitbunny | It has a ~9" screen. |
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| 06:13.46 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31871 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: ah, this file got skipped by the commit. remove USE_FBSERV protections, it's always on anyways. |
| 06:14.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31872 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: EXTERN_STDOUT does not seem to be used anywhere |
| 06:43.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31873 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be consistent with Makefile.am |
| 06:44.37 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31874 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/BrlcadCore.def: some additional exported functions in BrlcadCore |
| 06:45.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31875 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/CMakeLists.txt: added the proe-g converter to the CMake build |
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| 08:31.45 | saltan | \whois saltan |
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| 10:27.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31876 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModes.cxx CameraModes.h): Tweaks so Blender camera mode works closer to the original |
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| 10:42.55 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:00.08 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 13:16.04 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31877 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcParser.h: header is not included |
| 13:32.50 | pacman87 | morning, all |
| 13:36.22 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
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| 14:08.53 | prasad1 | heyo |
| 14:15.34 | brlcad | howdy prasad1 |
| 14:17.37 | brlcad | poolio: it's in your home dir |
| 14:21.51 | ``Erik | has opened his mouth in #lisp and is... boggled at how undickish and helpful and laid back they are O.o |
| 14:21.54 | ``Erik | what went wrong? :D |
| 14:33.09 | poolio | brlcad: thanks. whatcha doin in there ;) |
| 14:33.32 | brlcad | hm, in where? |
| 14:33.52 | poolio | ~poolio |
| 14:34.07 | poolio | I'm just giving you a hard time :) |
| 14:47.13 | brlcad | wasn't, just blindly sudo cp'd :) |
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| 15:12.48 | starseeker | ``Erik: told you |
| 15:13.18 | starseeker | in my experience, it's usally idiots and flamers who get burnt to a crisp - you know enough to ask reasonable questions |
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| 16:20.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31878 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): |
| 16:20.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Variable generation from expressions ( of the form "Var123=325.3" with |
| 16:20.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: whitespace skipping complete. Result stored in a PCSet class which would be used |
| 16:20.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: by Generator( Simple wrappers over Network constructor ) for generation of the |
| 16:20.33 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: constraint network |
| 16:22.54 | *** join/#brlcad hippieindamakin8 (n=hippiein@59.92.167.43) | |
| 16:40.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r31879 10/brlcad/trunk/ (68 files in 12 dirs): |
| 16:40.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Stub in the following commands: copyeval cp dbip dump dup expand facetize find g |
| 16:40.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: get_type hide i keep kill killall killtree lt make_bb match move_arb_edge |
| 16:40.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: move_arb_face mv mvall nmg_collapse nmg_simplify open pathlist push r rm rmap |
| 16:40.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: rotate_arb_face rt_gettrees shells showmats bot_smooth summary title tol unhide |
| 16:40.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: units version whatid whichair whichid xpush |
| 16:42.44 | prasad1 | http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-509718/Try-making-splash-worlds-largest-swimming-pool--1-000-yards-long.html |
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| 21:03.43 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31880 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_tree.c: ws |
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| 21:47.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31881 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: |
| 21:47.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: more work on name parsing - test database reading, beginnings of region |
| 21:47.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: counting logic - need to use db_functree in db_walk.c and supply a comb function |
| 21:47.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: to check if the comb is a region and increment a counter. Current method bombs |
| 21:47.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: out if no region is present due to use of db_recurse. |
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| 21:55.28 | brlcad | ahah |
| 21:55.35 | brlcad | starseeker: I forgot to load the directory |
| 22:48.16 | brlcad | starseeker: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Example_db_walk_tree |
| 22:48.50 | brlcad | shakes fist at db_dirbuild() .. then shamefully realizes it was entirely user error |
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| 01:28.47 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Cool example - thanks! |
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| 02:12.50 | starseeker_ | bemusedly predicts that the Mummy III movie will start prompting jokes about the franchise itself joining the ranks of the undead... |
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| 06:34.24 | brlcad | yawns |
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| 14:04.00 | ``Erik | apparently pauly short desease is transmittable, brenden frasier caught it when he was doing encino man O.o |
| 14:04.20 | ``Erik | shore, even |
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| 15:10.45 | ``Erik | it's really handy that emacs binds help to ^H, I mean, it's not like that could mean anything else, like delete |
| 15:26.31 | brlcad | (global-set-key "\C-h" 'delete-backward-char) |
| 15:29.43 | brlcad | having a tailored .emacs is handy, here's what I usuaully use: http://brlcad.org/~sean/dotemacs |
| 15:31.32 | jonored | I'll take :help any day, even when writing Lisp. |
| 15:42.15 | ``Erik | slime is damn sexy. limp is not quite there yet, and tic is busy with his masters thesis. :( |
| 15:42.55 | ``Erik | jonored++ for lithp :D |
| 15:44.28 | ``Erik | if vim could provide me the swank bridge, something like ^c^c for form eval, and sane tab completion... that'd be it, I'd put emacs back in the bit bucket :) |
| 15:45.15 | ``Erik | (by "sane" tab completion, I mean interrogating the environment on the other side of the swank bridge for candidates) |
| 15:54.01 | starseeker_ | 's pet annoyance is that on the Aquamacs the end key goes to the end of file rather than the end of line |
| 15:55.01 | starseeker_ | looks over brlcad's dotemacs to see if he solved that... |
| 15:57.43 | brlcad | starseeker_: erm, should learn the standard bindings for that .. |
| 15:57.52 | brlcad | ctrl-a ctrl-e for begin/end of line |
| 15:58.08 | starseeker_ | Ah |
| 15:58.19 | brlcad | that's portable to most command lines, and goes back to the dawn of time |
| 15:58.30 | starseeker_ | very good |
| 15:58.49 | starseeker_ | keeps using the end key by reflex, then has to find his way back... |
| 15:59.12 | jonored | Both scripts I found to do that quickly use some perl glue, but not terribly much. vim doesn't do terribly well with talking to continuously-running processes. I'm only finding the form eval part, but the tab completion part is derivable from that... |
| 16:34.25 | brlcad | starseeker_: added the bindings for home/end |
| 16:34.30 | brlcad | (refresh) |
| 16:35.34 | starseeker_ | cool - thanks!! |
| 16:35.38 | brlcad | but seriously .. should learn the standard navigation keys .. |
| 16:35.46 | starseeker_ | Oh, I'll try :-) |
| 16:36.08 | starseeker_ | the problem was it takes only one split second mistake and you're off to lala land... |
| 16:36.14 | brlcad | ctrl-a,e,b,f,p,n |
| 16:36.50 | starseeker_ | is learning both Emacs and vim intelligent editing |
| 16:36.55 | brlcad | erm, whenever in doubt ctrl-g ctrl-g |
| 16:37.09 | brlcad | that'll break out of just about anything |
| 16:38.01 | brlcad | think of it as your "uh oh, i better start over" binding (ctrl-gg) |
| 16:41.25 | starseeker_ | Or the "oh, crap!" binding :-P |
| 16:41.34 | brlcad | sure :) |
| 16:42.01 | brlcad | akin to esc esc in vim |
| 16:42.55 | starseeker_ | wishes vim had nxml |
| 16:43.03 | brlcad | (including the detail that one is usually enough, but two will get you out of most anything) |
| 16:44.07 | starseeker_ | is planning to post the VIM cheat sheets up on the wall of his work area |
| 16:44.12 | brlcad | have you been using the docbook major mode? |
| 16:44.27 | starseeker_ | for vim you mean? |
| 16:44.32 | brlcad | for emacs |
| 16:44.36 | starseeker_ | just nxml |
| 16:44.51 | starseeker_ | looks up docbook major mode |
| 16:45.26 | brlcad | http://sourceforge.net/projects/docbookxml/ |
| 16:46.54 | brlcad | dunno if it's actually any better, was more asking if you'd compared :) |
| 16:47.06 | brlcad | nxml could very well be better |
| 16:47.33 | starseeker_ | hadn't heard of docbookxml |
| 16:47.45 | starseeker_ | nxml dominated most of the searches I did, IIRC |
| 16:48.04 | starseeker_ | REALLY likes nxml's ability to check validity in real time |
| 16:48.30 | starseeker_ | even with the xinclude stuff messing it up, it still underlines the errors usefully - a very impressive piece of work |
| 16:49.01 | brlcad | cool |
| 16:49.28 | starseeker_ | It knows what tags should and shouldn't be in environments, as well - kept me from making a few errors |
| 16:53.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31882 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/: ignore TS |
| 17:28.01 | poolio | brlcad: I recently read a fairly old paper on 'geons' and how we recognize things based on their structure. Makes me want to keep going on beset :) |
| 17:28.42 | poolio | Also, looks like the DoD is interested: http://www.dodtechmatch.com/DOD/Opportunities/SBIRView.aspx?id=A08-059 :P |
| 17:39.22 | brlcad | poolio: nobody stopped you in the first place ;) |
| 17:50.46 | poolio | brlcad: true true. but i can work on the brep code and get paid :) need money for chinese carry out all next year. |
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| 23:09.44 | starseeker_ | must say he is impressed with the open games being developed off the quake engine |
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| 04:39.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31883 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_4d.c: w |
| 04:40.35 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31884 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/ (html/manuals/Install.html pkg.tr): remove references to the non-existent rfbd service, it was renamed to fbserv |
| 06:20.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31885 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/Makefile.am: need -fexceptions for libs that link against C++ sources (that throw exceptions) |
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| 00:19.45 | jonored | hmm... what does "loop transits plane of shell/face" mean from g-stl? it keeps bailing with that message, and I didn't think my geometry was that odd... |
| 00:38.49 | brlcad | jonored: it's part of the solidity constraint checking as it evaluates geometry, going from one representation format to another (solid polygonal) |
| 00:39.39 | brlcad | more specifically, the topological 'loop' that defines a given face is non-planar (which shouldn't regularly be happening) |
| 00:40.33 | brlcad | it'll complain and even "bu_bomb" reporting errors -- that doesn't necessarily mean that it succeeded or failed though -- have to inspect the result |
| 00:40.51 | jonored | Any idea why it'd do that? I've got a trc with a bunch of other trcs and spheres subtracted out, and intersected with an rpp... it's saying that it didn't write any triangles. |
| 00:44.40 | jonored | which is to say, what should I be looking for to figure out what's wrong? |
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| 01:00.58 | jonored | Found it. Using a sphere as an endcap to smooth between two cones, and having them all have the same radius was breaking things, even though they're unioned together. Wasn't expecting that. |
| 02:06.12 | ``Erik | pheers code monkeys |
| 02:58.29 | poolio | brlcad: Do you know what's up with the incomplete brep code in conv/iges? |
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| 05:08.32 | brlcad | poolio: that was started as a means to test the new brep primitive |
| 05:09.03 | brlcad | a separate iges importer, started from scratch |
| 05:11.57 | poolio | ah k. It's incomplete, no? It looked like an almost already done snurb/cnurb -> brep aside from a few missing (crucial) functions |
| 05:12.36 | brlcad | yeah, incomplete |
| 05:13.55 | poolio | The reliance of a cnurb on the associated snurb really messes up the structure of my NMG -> brep code :\ |
| 05:14.29 | poolio | Is there a way (outside of openNURBS) to evaluate a snurb at a given (u,v) point? |
| 05:15.16 | poolio | Ah d'oh. Found it in nurb_eval.c |
| 05:15.45 | brlcad | oooh, you mean the old snurb/cnurb code |
| 05:16.09 | brlcad | src/conv/iges has two iges converters, one using new 'brep' and one using old 'nurb' |
| 05:16.59 | brlcad | the new brep stuff is looked at as mostly a full replacement for the old nurb code (when it's all working) |
| 05:17.46 | brlcad | the old iges converter was the one place old nurb was actually put to use (and mostly works actually) .. just that it doesn't do a few things, e.g. doesn't do trimmed nurbs |
| 05:17.47 | poolio | So, I was going to more fully implement nmg -> brep to supportthe old nurb code, this way I could use the existing tnurb callbacks |
| 05:18.10 | poolio | Is that a bad idea? (are we trying to phase out all the old nurbs code?) |
| 05:19.12 | brlcad | if brep fully works, the old nurb code will be deleted |
| 05:19.53 | brlcad | don't worry about old spline surface nmg's (i.e. nurb primitives) |
| 05:20.18 | brlcad | if you need it's code, you should probably convert it over as brep routines |
| 05:20.48 | poolio | Ok. The thing was it looked easier to implement the NMG conversion then rewriting the tnurb callbacks to create a brep |
| 05:21.33 | poolio | But it's not that bad to just rewrite the callbacks to create a brep instead... |
| 05:23.33 | brlcad | but what do you need the old tnurb callbacks for (what callbacks?) |
| 05:25.07 | poolio | So for example, in tgc.c, there is a rt_tgc_tnurb which creates an NMG to represent the tgc. |
| 05:25.17 | brlcad | ah |
| 05:25.47 | brlcad | creates a 'nurb' nmg .. specific subset |
| 05:26.05 | poolio | I was going to take the NMB that rt_tgc_tnurb created and convert from that NMG -> brep as I already have working NMG code for planar faces, and I'd just need to add support for cnurb/snurb in the NMG -> brep code and then all these rt_xxx_tnurb callbacks would work fine |
| 05:26.16 | brlcad | yeah, I wouldn't rely on that implentation, it needs to be converted to create an ON_Brep instead |
| 05:26.35 | poolio | Alrighty, I'll take that path :) |
| 05:27.07 | brlcad | might even end up being line for line identical with just different data structures |
| 05:27.13 | poolio | So just to confirm: reliance on rt_xxx_tess is OK? I'm guessing that's going to be around for ... a hell of a long time :) |
| 05:27.40 | brlcad | yeah, it's just the _nurb() routines that are getting replaced with _brep() routines |
| 05:27.52 | brlcad | tess is fair game |
| 05:35.03 | PrezKennedy | "<darkcrab> question: one of the screws came out of my laptop and one of the sides of my laptop is coming open, what should I do?" |
| 05:35.06 | PrezKennedy | priceless |
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| 09:12.42 | mafm | hi |
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| 10:24.42 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31886 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be consistent with Makefile.am |
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| 11:09.39 | mafm | brlcad: any news from Ralith? |
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| 12:00.13 | brlcad | mafm, not that i'm aware of |
| 12:00.50 | mafm | I haven't received mails or anything, I wonder if he ever got to compile the project |
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| 12:55.45 | mafm | hi homovulgaris |
| 12:56.14 | mafm | mater tua mala burra est :P |
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| 13:20.04 | starseeker_ | hmm - for some reason trying to compile the other directory RBgui can't find OGRE |
| 13:21.01 | mafm | are you also checking it out starseeker_? :) |
| 13:21.38 | mafm | what's the exact error? (rafb.net/paste or similar, please) |
| 13:21.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31887 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModes.cxx CameraModes.h): Minor rearrangements to prepare for next changes, and to avoid warnings |
| 13:22.00 | starseeker_ | one sec - let me run ldconfig |
| 13:23.41 | starseeker_ | btw - is there a required version of gcc? I'm using a pretty new one and OGRE is throwing out warnings left and right |
| 13:24.03 | mafm | yes, but that's ogre's fault |
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| 13:24.23 | mafm | I mean, it's normal, no especial version of gcc required |
| 13:24.29 | mafm | I'm using 4.3.1 I think |
| 13:25.01 | starseeker_ | http://paste.bzflag.bz/m34eb8859 |
| 13:26.29 | starseeker_ | I can try a clean checkout - I may have old incorrect stuff somewhere - but that'll take a while |
| 13:32.55 | mafm | hmm |
| 13:33.06 | mafm | do you build ogre and ois before? |
| 13:33.20 | mafm | or call explicitly to build only mocha and rbgui? |
| 13:35.33 | mafm | starseeker_: and also, do you have pkg-config installed? |
| 13:36.14 | starseeker_ | built them before |
| 13:36.19 | starseeker_ | let me see if I have pkg-config |
| 13:37.03 | starseeker_ | yes, I have it |
| 13:38.01 | mafm | is Ogre installed, rather than only compiled? |
| 13:38.45 | mafm | you can find out if it's properly installed: pkg-config --cflags OGRE |
| 13:39.18 | mafm | it should spit some compiling flags |
| 13:40.08 | starseeker_ | let's see... |
| 13:40.18 | starseeker_ | hmm, not found |
| 13:40.23 | starseeker_ | let me re-check ogre |
| 13:43.09 | starseeker_ | Oh, needed to manually point it to the src/other/ogre directory where `OGRE.pc' is located |
| 13:43.27 | starseeker_ | let's see if that does anything... |
| 13:46.20 | mafm | huh |
| 13:46.43 | mafm | it should install it in /usr/local/lib/pkgconfig or similar |
| 13:47.01 | starseeker_ | /usr/qt/3/lib/pkgconfig is what it had by default |
| 13:50.07 | starseeker_ | If I manually point the PKG_CONFIG_PATH to the directories where the *.pc files are found, it seems to be doing OK. |
| 13:53.22 | starseeker_ | mafm: Arrgh, I set the video settings wrong |
| 13:53.27 | starseeker_ | where's the config file? |
| 13:55.00 | starseeker_ | oh, nevermind - ogre.cfg |
| 13:55.26 | starseeker_ | yick - doesn't like my fonts or something |
| 13:57.10 | starseeker_ | Ah, well - got it working :-) |
| 13:57.12 | starseeker_ | sort of |
| 13:57.16 | starseeker_ | thanks mafm! |
| 13:57.44 | starseeker_ | heads in |
| 14:01.04 | mafm | hmm |
| 14:01.39 | mafm | well, default in unix systems should be /usr/lib/pkgconfig or with local, in the same spirits as includes and so on |
| 14:01.54 | mafm | I don't know why would you *only* had the one of qt |
| 14:01.59 | mafm | but well, it's OK :) |
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| 15:30.06 | starseeker | mafm: might want to add a note in the INSTALL file about that and how to handle it |
| 15:30.46 | mafm | I'm think about adding some kind of pre-flight test with the makefile itself |
| 15:31.06 | mafm | checking whether pkg-config is available, and yelling when not available |
| 15:31.41 | mafm | (it might be good to have workarounds when not having pkg-config, but I don't have time to fix it atm) |
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| 15:47.25 | homovulgaris | howdy mafm :) whats with the latin :P ? |
| 15:47.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31888 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (10 files): Separating camera modes (classes) in different files, as suggested by Sean. |
| 15:48.17 | mafm | homovulgaris: I tried to said something that I recalled from high school |
| 15:48.29 | homovulgaris | :D |
| 15:48.31 | mafm | because your name is in latin |
| 15:48.50 | mafm | tempus fugit! |
| 15:48.55 | homovulgaris | :P just means common man :) but yeah latin is kind of a fun language i guess. |
| 15:49.12 | homovulgaris | personally i feel sanskrit is much more well structured .. |
| 15:49.36 | mafm | I speak several degenerate-latin languages, so... :) |
| 15:50.20 | homovulgaris | latin is pretty neat foundation for learning all the romance languages i guess.. especially if you already have one as a mother tongue ;) |
| 15:50.38 | mafm | and I my case I have two :D |
| 15:50.47 | homovulgaris | I finally got my computer back :D 4.0 GHz dual core ;) |
| 15:50.50 | mafm | but I don't remember almost anything from latin classes |
| 15:50.54 | homovulgaris | overclocked ofcourse :) |
| 15:50.56 | mafm | it's the age I guess :) |
| 15:51.03 | mafm | congrats! |
| 15:52.13 | homovulgaris | well compilation takes just around 12 minutes.. and planning to use distcc too :P |
| 15:52.24 | homovulgaris | huge improvement from 200 minutes :) |
| 15:53.06 | mafm | compilation from whole brlcad? |
| 15:53.16 | homovulgaris | yeah :) |
| 15:53.20 | mafm | not bad |
| 15:53.36 | mafm | hopefully I don't have to compile it often :P |
| 15:54.10 | homovulgaris | g3d looks neat ;) |
| 15:54.18 | homovulgaris | what all stuff can i do in it now ? |
| 15:55.45 | mafm | you can... compile it under 15s, I guess (OGRE aside :P) |
| 15:56.06 | mafm | I've been working in camera modes lately |
| 15:56.17 | mafm | I'm trying to create MGED mode today |
| 15:57.01 | mafm | and next to it, start working in the last major part left: displaying geometry and operations, using the new libged |
| 15:57.22 | homovulgaris | yeah i already have the window up and running.. :) |
| 15:57.31 | homovulgaris | whats the triangle in the middle ? test draw ? |
| 15:58.48 | mafm | it's a kind of tetrahedron |
| 15:58.58 | mafm | so you somehow can see the camera mode movements :D |
| 15:59.44 | mafm | you can manipulate the default camera mode with: +,-,8-4-6-2,5 in the numpad |
| 16:00.16 | mafm | it would help to see it better if the tetrahedron would have texture and proper shading |
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| 16:01.42 | homovulgaris | tried it nice.. :) even drawing the edges would make it clearer |
| 16:02.22 | mafm | (btw, the fist phrase in latin that I told before means "your mother eats red|mature apples", but for portuguese and italian and spanish and probably other it sounds as "your mother is a worthless donkey") |
| 16:02.30 | mafm | you mean to set it in wireframe mode? |
| 16:03.21 | homovulgaris | :P yeah that sentence is known to be pretty ambiguous :P wordplay or something :P : as per google :P |
| 16:03.45 | homovulgaris | wireframe+shade. i mean show the edges as well as the faces |
| 16:05.12 | mafm | well, I didn't implement any of that, it would be done when displaying the rest of geometries |
| 16:05.53 | mafm | probably I'll have to write code to translate brl-cad primitives as vertices and lists |
| 16:06.17 | mafm | you can set wireframe mode in the meanwhile with "polygonmode wireframe" |
| 16:06.19 | mafm | in the console |
| 16:07.35 | mafm | oh, and you can also click with middle mouse button and move around dragging the camera -- it's free rotation |
| 16:09.41 | homovulgaris | hmm.. is adding mouse support tought ? i mean like this view rotation for example.. |
| 16:10.58 | mafm | you have to inject input, the camera mode sets parameters depending on the position of the pointer (vertical or horizontal rotations, translations, etc) |
| 16:11.28 | mafm | then when painting the next frame, the camera uses these data to position itself, seeing the scene from different angles |
| 16:11.55 | mafm | but getting to this "dettached" approarch took a few days and refinements :D |
| 16:12.19 | mafm | hopes to not have to do big acommodations again for implementing MGED |
| 16:14.15 | mafm | the key parts are only a few dozens lines of code, but it takes a lot to get it right |
| 16:14.27 | mafm | well |
| 16:14.42 | mafm | and what about your project? progressing steadily? |
| 16:14.52 | homovulgaris | :) can imagine.. beautiful code is a nice read |
| 16:18.32 | brlcad | mafm: one of the libged routines is effectively "give me a display list of vertices and edges" |
| 16:19.28 | brlcad | should be ged_e or ged_draw -- ged_E or ged_ev should give you evaluated polygonal (slow to call on complex objects) |
| 16:19.52 | mafm | you mean that that part is translated directly? |
| 16:19.57 | homovulgaris | free rotation with the mouse works smooth and nice .. :) zoom with scroll coming up ;) ? |
| 16:20.33 | mafm | directly by libged I mean, so I don't have to do that myself :D |
| 16:20.48 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, libged handles that |
| 16:21.03 | mafm | homovulgaris: mmm, it tried to copy Blender mode, not sure if they have that |
| 16:21.11 | brlcad | with libged you really should be able to do just about everything that mged can presetntly do |
| 16:21.33 | mafm | homovulgaris: >:| you found a bug |
| 16:21.37 | brlcad | and if there's something you can't do with it, bob's probably just not gotten to it yet or it's something that needs refactoring still |
| 16:21.54 | brlcad | but basic geometry loading and wireframe is there now |
| 16:22.07 | homovulgaris | thinks irssi is awesome |
| 16:22.11 | mafm | and the vertices list also takes into account "faces" of the triangle? |
| 16:22.17 | brlcad | screen+irssi ftw |
| 16:23.25 | starseeker | brlcad: Where does that example code of yours link from? the wiki home page doesn't seem to have a path to it |
| 16:23.30 | brlcad | mafm: there are different render modes -- for e/draw you don't have faces, you just have unevaluated wireframe so you'll just display what they give you |
| 16:23.36 | homovulgaris | brlcad: terminator+irssi .. i like screen.. but maybe will need more getting used to :) |
| 16:23.59 | brlcad | mafm: for commands like ev/E, you get a polygonal display list -- plenty to do shaded displays and more |
| 16:24.36 | brlcad | homovulgaris: what is terminator? |
| 16:25.02 | brlcad | starseeker: mm, probably from nothing |
| 16:25.11 | starseeker | digs it up... |
| 16:25.13 | starseeker | confirmed |
| 16:25.14 | brlcad | try special pages, unreferenced |
| 16:25.36 | brlcad | link it under the dev docs/tutorials |
| 16:25.48 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31889 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Enhancing PolygonMode command so less typing is needed |
| 16:26.08 | brlcad | could use expanding too, explaining each section, didn't get to that |
| 16:26.12 | homovulgaris | brlcad: multiview terminal https://launchpad.net/terminator/ |
| 16:26.38 | homovulgaris | not as useful as screen .. |
| 16:26.40 | starseeker | brlcad: will do |
| 16:26.43 | brlcad | homovulgaris: oh, heh .. that's not a screen replacement :) |
| 16:27.18 | homovulgaris | yeah not at all a screen replacement :) |
| 16:27.27 | brlcad | screen is useful when run from a remote server so you can log in and keep (the same) sessions running |
| 16:27.45 | brlcad | like keeping irssi running so you never detach from irc ;) |
| 16:27.46 | jonored | would rather have screen for when he remotes in/kills X because of occasionally glitchy wm. |
| 16:28.31 | jonored | gets the tiling from the tiling window manager :) |
| 16:28.45 | homovulgaris | rethinks why he runs X when most of the time all he has on are bash windows |
| 16:29.10 | brlcad | ooh, terminator is a non-overlapper |
| 16:29.23 | brlcad | nudges mafm :) |
| 16:32.42 | brlcad | ala wmii/dwm/ion/awesome etc |
| 16:32.46 | mafm | brlcad: what? |
| 16:32.54 | starseeker | anybody else getting foobarred fonts in the ogre gui? |
| 16:33.11 | mafm | starseeker: never ran into that problem |
| 16:33.13 | brlcad | mafm just that homovulgaris' terminal program is .. related ;) |
| 16:33.33 | brlcad | tiling |
| 16:33.43 | starseeker | meh, just my luck |
| 16:33.58 | starseeker | will post a screenshot when he gets home |
| 16:34.14 | mafm | oh, the tiling thing... sorry but I was only reading my part of conversation |
| 16:34.16 | starseeker | probably not worth worrying about if I'm the only one |
| 16:34.31 | homovulgaris | what does foobarred look like :P |
| 16:35.01 | mafm | I had an epyphany because I'm tired and I don't feel like having to type too much today, and "polygonmode wireframe" is way too long... |
| 16:35.13 | mafm | so I'm trying to substitute it for "p<tab> w" |
| 16:35.13 | mafm | :D |
| 16:35.47 | starseeker | homovulgaris: unintelligble blurred mess |
| 16:41.03 | ``Erik | pets screen |
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| 17:16.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31890 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Thanks to Sean's example, switching over to using db_functree - identification is now working. |
| 17:24.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31891 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: break out object type detection into its own routine |
| 18:36.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31892 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Adding auto-completion functionality for the console and command overlay |
| 18:57.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31893 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Adding missing functionality to Blender camera mode: zoom in/out with mouse scroll (discovered by Dawn Thomas <homovulgaris>) |
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| 19:08.34 | mafm | hi Ralith |
| 19:08.45 | mafm | unfortunately I have to go now to go to hypermarket |
| 19:08.52 | Ralith | hey |
| 19:08.57 | Ralith | kk |
| 19:09.04 | mafm | but I'd like to know about your progress, so if you can send me a brief or something, I would appreciate |
| 19:09.09 | mafm | (or to the mailing list also) |
| 19:09.52 | Ralith | will be submitting my mocha patch to sourceforge |
| 19:10.12 | mafm | oki |
| 19:10.14 | mafm | bye |
| 19:16.50 | poolio | brlcad: do you know how the ctl_points in the old nurbs system translates into (u,v), it's just a 1-d array and doesnt seem to be in any order |
| 19:17.43 | Ralith | kk, patch uploaded |
| 20:19.44 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31894 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: More reworking - database opening and closing is no longer in the parsing routine, matching real world behavior. |
| 20:24.01 | *** join/#brlcad homovulg1ris (n=d@117.196.128.26) | |
| 20:26.02 | Ralith | submits Yet Another patch, this time improving the rt^3 src/other makefile |
| 20:34.02 | Ralith | hm |
| 20:34.03 | Ralith | so close :| |
| 21:53.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31895 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Starting to explore generating the strings. Some data structure evolution needed - this doesn't build right now, simply saving work - do NOT add to any build system yet. |
| 00:06.28 | *** join/#brlcad ewilhelm (n=ewilhelm@pool-71-111-83-56.ptldor.dsl-w.verizon.net) | |
| 00:37.42 | yukonbob_ | hello, cadheads |
| 00:45.54 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:42.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31896 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: need a new tool to automatically model inside air |
| 02:45.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31897 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: related to the text overlay support is the ability to have some toolt that will apply text data onto a given raster/rt image for things like adding a title, units, az/el, objects, etc. |
| 03:22.35 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@c-76-19-120-77.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) | |
| 03:34.24 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos__ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 06:04.32 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-111-193.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:18.12 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:20.23 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@61-69-25-250.netspeed.com.au) | |
| 08:37.54 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.130.31) | |
| 09:01.03 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:03.43 | mafm | hallo |
| 09:31.07 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.142.103) | |
| 10:04.38 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 10:26.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31898 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (5 files): Adding button to show and cycle camera mode in the topbar, and adding a command too to cycle mode. |
| 10:32.45 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 10:43.57 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E0E6.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 10:51.01 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 10:53.34 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.192.57) | |
| 11:15.57 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:16.16 | mafm | hi again |
| 11:52.24 | brlcad | howdy gents and gentettes |
| 11:56.39 | mafm | howdy ho |
| 12:08.13 | starseeker_ | howdy |
| 12:08.30 | geocalc | gentettes is a word ? |
| 12:08.49 | jonored | apparently? |
| 12:12.08 | brlcad | it's a perfectly cromulent word |
| 12:17.08 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.198.171) | |
| 12:17.08 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.217.127) | |
| 12:40.05 | starseeker_ | geocalc: he's just engaging in the time honoured practice of adding features to the English language ;-) |
| 12:49.31 | geocalc | ;) |
| 13:05.45 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 13:05.47 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 13:37.04 | Axman6 | brlcad: what do crumpets have to do with it? |
| 13:40.25 | clock_ | brlcad: do you remember how we talked about the bug where parts of the Ronja holder were missing and parts enlarged, caused by some problems with arbn plane normalization? |
| 13:42.18 | geocalc | strange i have to put a shortcut to /usr/lib/tk.tcl in /usr/local/lib to run brlcad also have to comment : uplevel \#0 [list source $::ttk::library/ttk.tcl] and : namespace eval :: [list source [file join $::tk_library $file.tcl]] |
| 13:43.12 | geocalc | Package: brlcad |
| 13:43.12 | geocalc | Version: svn.31898-1 |
| 13:43.12 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.23 | clock_ | Relais brisé lol :) |
| 13:43.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.39 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:43.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.39 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:44.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.09 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:45.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.09 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:46.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.52 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:47.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.38 | docelic | CONGRATULATIONS GEOCALC |
| 13:48.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:48.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.08 | clock_ | E X C E S S F L O O D |
| 13:49.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.39 | clock_ | E X C E S S F L O O D |
| 13:49.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:49.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.10 | clock_ | -----E--X--C--E--S--S-------------------------F--L--O--O--D-------- :) |
| 13:50.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:50.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:51.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.49 | alex_joni | wheee |
| 13:52.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:52.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:53.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:54.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.11 | jonored | Meep. |
| 13:55.11 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.41 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:55.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.33 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.39 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:56.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.03 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:57.59 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.09 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.21 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.23 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.29 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.49 | alex_joni | geocalc: it should be enough now.. we get the point |
| 13:58.51 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:58.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.01 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.05 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.07 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.13 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.15 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.17 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.19 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.25 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.27 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.31 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.35 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.37 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.39 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.43 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.45 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.47 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.49 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.53 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.55 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 13:59.57 | geocalc | /usr/bin/upkg-show: line 36: echo: write error: Relais brisé (pipe) |
| 14:00.29 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-218-234.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 14:02.13 | geocalc | sorry again |
| 14:09.56 | elite01 | whoa, nice one |
| 14:09.59 | elite01 | shakes his head |
| 14:12.17 | Axman6 | how did he even manage that :| |
| 14:12.23 | alex_joni | good client? |
| 14:13.39 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-218-234.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 14:15.13 | Axman6 | i know irssi whinges when i paste more than 4 lines of text |
| 14:15.55 | geocalc | i wanted only two |
| 14:17.02 | geocalc | the pipe here is broken now i don''t know why |
| 14:19.00 | geocalc | it send so much error messages and i didn't realise it was continuing to send it :( |
| 14:39.43 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.217.127) | |
| 14:40.36 | PrezKennedy | geocalc, so how many lines did that run for? that totally filled up my buffer :P |
| 14:40.41 | PrezKennedy | i have it set for like 500 lines |
| 15:53.41 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31899 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Add another test case, activate type based extension logic in parser, comment out busted code so it at least builds again. Need to work on argc+argv. |
| 15:59.21 | geocalc | PrezKennedy=<< i don't know sorry |
| 16:00.49 | geocalc | how i change color of cammand line tool ? |
| 16:03.20 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.141.32) | |
| 16:33.54 | louipc | geocalc: hah! what client do you use? |
| 16:59.37 | poolio | louipc: xchat :P |
| 16:59.50 | poolio | That's quite a lot of errors..heh |
| 17:06.40 | mafm | huh, shift-grips input mode from MGED is pretty hairy :D |
| 17:23.09 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.130.224) | |
| 17:32.20 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31900 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: add rt_sketch_contains() to find whether a 2D point is inside or outside a closed sketch (or an open sketch automatically closed by revolve); currently only working for line segments only. |
| 17:40.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31901 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModeBlender.cxx CameraModeBlender.h): Fixing some missing things when finishing functions, or badly typed ones, etc |
| 17:40.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31902 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/ (revolve.c revolve.h): update rt_revolve_shot() to use rt_sketch_contains(); revolve now works for sketches on both sides of the revolve axis |
| 17:51.23 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 17:55.56 | mafm | seesh |
| 17:56.02 | mafm | I feel the need to use a goto! |
| 17:56.50 | pacman87 | dont' do it! http://xkcd.com/292/ |
| 17:59.19 | poolio | Heh, there's a few gotos scattered throughout BRL-CAD |
| 17:59.32 | archivist | or http://www.fortran.com/come_from.html |
| 18:00.47 | mafm | pacman87: lol, I love xkcd |
| 18:02.07 | mafm | lol |
| 18:02.17 | mafm | I'm doing it with a common function instead |
| 18:02.32 | mafm | but I think that it's less meaningful than with the goto |
| 18:05.33 | pacman87 | archivist: so if you have two COME FROM statments from the same place, is that how you create a new execution thread? |
| 18:06.06 | archivist | or see http://www.cse.unsw.edu.au/~malcolmr/intercal/threaded.html |
| 18:09.24 | pacman87 | pretty pictures: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt17.png |
| 18:09.29 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt18.png |
| 18:09.33 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt19.png |
| 18:10.53 | louipc | funkey |
| 18:26.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31903 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: warn now if objects have a valid extension that doesn't match type of object, and replace extenstion if it isn't an extension for ANY type. Insert increment string if none is found in the correct place. |
| 18:28.02 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-82-106.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:05.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31904 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/blt/Makefile.am: add build dependancy information |
| 19:05.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31905 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/Makefile.am: update dependancy information |
| 19:31.58 | *** join/#brlcad cerrayo (n=cerrayo@c-67-160-127-173.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) | |
| 19:39.56 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31906 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.h: Modifications to Variable constructor : initalization list instead of assignment and specialization for type double : default domain/interval addition using numeric_limits |
| 20:42.36 | ``Erik | yeah, there are a couple gotos in BRL-CAD, and those poor coders suffered the dinosaur attacks for it :( |
| 21:09.36 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31907 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Add basic functionality to re-assemble names from parsed data. (Thanks Bob Parker for looking over the code and spotting my BU_LIST mistake.) Now that the functionality is in place, need to explore use of argc and argv. |
| 21:11.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31908 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (8 files): |
| 21:11.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Interface reorganization: functors communicate directly to the PCSet output |
| 21:11.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: object of the Parser class. Functor code location changed to new pcGenerator.* |
| 21:11.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: files. pcVariable.cpp necessitated due to the specialization in r31906 |
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| 02:36.17 | brlcad | returns home semi-exhausted |
| 02:39.27 | brlcad | andrecastelo: so there are several ways to shoot secondary rays |
| 02:40.09 | brlcad | and yes, rt shoots secondary rays -- though it does so as part of the phong calculations (and some of it is done by liboptical |
| 02:40.49 | brlcad | rt_shootray is ultimately what fires a ray so looking for that call is a very strong indicator and good place to start for finding whom all is shooting rays (and why) |
| 02:51.13 | brlcad | you can trace down how rt does it by following rt's hit callback (colorview) which leads you to liboptical (via viewshade) which leads you to ... more stuff, but that direction won't readily help you understand |
| 03:05.36 | brlcad | andrecastelo: I'd say just first write your own ray-trace test app where you fire your own ray using rt_shootray (or undersand rtexample.c and/or rt_simple.c) |
| 03:17.08 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 03:21.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31909 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/rtexample.c: start merging in the additional comments from rt_simple.c into rtexample.c -- there only needs to be one 'simple' example. |
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| 03:52.39 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:52.45 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 03:52.55 | yukonbob | how're things, pacman87? |
| 03:53.32 | pacman87 | pretty good; finally tracked down a bug caused by one character (2 instead of 1) |
| 03:54.16 | Ralith | another? |
| 03:54.25 | pacman87 | right now i'm wondering why my kde panel stops 83% of the way across the screen |
| 03:54.37 | pacman87 | Ralith: the last bug was 4 characters |
| 03:54.40 | pacman87 | j++; |
| 03:57.48 | louipc | I'm wondering why brl-cad doesn't like tcl 8.5.3 :/ |
| 03:57.57 | yukonbob | louipc: interesting... |
| 03:58.20 | Ralith | pacman87: bah. |
| 03:58.34 | yukonbob | is re-attacking 8.5.3 on his machine, which happens to be NetBSD -current, just to make things even more difficult... |
| 04:05.08 | brlcad | louipc: define "doesn't like" |
| 04:05.36 | Ralith | mafm: ping? |
| 04:06.57 | brlcad | Ralith: your patches are high in my to-be-reviewed queue just so you know |
| 04:07.25 | Ralith | cool :D |
| 04:07.28 | Ralith | thanks |
| 04:07.47 | Ralith | they're all very straightforward, except for that X11 mouse handling bit which might not even be necessary |
| 04:07.56 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:08.07 | Ralith | once I can get g3d building, I can test that |
| 04:08.14 | Ralith | ogre's proving to be very finnicky though |
| 04:08.37 | Ralith | have to touch ogre.cfg in ./ before it'll even init, and now it wants some png that I don't have |
| 04:18.08 | pacman87 | for some reason, kde thinks my monitor is 1400x1050 instead of 1680x1050 when maximizing windows |
| 04:18.38 | pacman87 | but the desktop background is lined up and centered properly |
| 04:20.19 | Ralith | O.o |
| 04:20.29 | Ralith | lightweight and simple DEs ftw |
| 04:21.09 | poolio | Ralith: what do you run? :P |
| 04:21.15 | poolio | pacman87: restart X? |
| 04:21.38 | Ralith | poolio: xfce at the moment, but if I was less lazy I'd have transitioned over to something even lighter like fluxbox |
| 04:23.19 | poolio | Cool cool. I went KDE -> xfce -> fluxbox -> ratpoision -> xmonad |
| 04:24.04 | yukonbob | next stop is running everything in text mode on a wrist watch and imagining what it would look like if graphical... |
| 04:24.17 | Ralith | I don't even use any part of xfce but the WM and the keybindings |
| 04:24.17 | brlcad | wow, what a nasty thunderstorm |
| 04:24.34 | Ralith | yukonbob: no, you always need X for web browsing if nothing else |
| 04:24.47 | yukonbob | Ralith: links, w3m... |
| 04:25.00 | yukonbob | vesafb |
| 04:25.18 | brlcad | yay for having all computers and networking equipment on ups' |
| 04:25.41 | Ralith | yukonbob: all kind of suck. |
| 04:25.52 | brlcad | (as the power drops in an out about two dozens times over the past two minutes alone) |
| 04:25.53 | Ralith | and are suitable for emergency fallbacks. |
| 04:26.08 | poolio | brlcad: That bit missed north of me...but I fear the next part |
| 04:26.19 | yukonbob | uses elinks, and firefox as an emergency backup these days... :P |
| 04:26.24 | poolio | brlcad: I have nothing on UPS...uh oh |
| 04:26.30 | brlcad | heh, eep |
| 04:28.20 | brlcad | wow .. so much lightning..... |
| 04:28.35 | brlcad | power is fluctuating mad .. hadn't seen this bad in years |
| 04:28.58 | brlcad | bets he'll lose power hard eventually |
| 04:29.07 | poolio | brlcad: You must be in that bright red area :P |
| 04:29.56 | louipc | brlcad: oh it decides to build the bundled 8.5.1 |
| 04:30.43 | brlcad | louipc: config.log should say why it's thinking it fails |
| 04:32.16 | brlcad | ahh.. so that's what they mean by "severe thunderstorm warning" for this area |
| 04:33.05 | poolio | Hasn't it passed you by now? |
| 04:33.19 | brlcad | hail, wind gusts to 60mph |
| 04:33.27 | brlcad | nope, it's roaring outside right now |
| 04:33.40 | poolio | brlcad: unrelated: if I'm interested in continuing work on beset and working with some CMU people, is that all kosher? There's no conflict with CMU and ARL? |
| 04:33.45 | louipc | brlcad: yeah I peeked at it but I can't really make sense of it |
| 04:33.49 | louipc | http://louipc.yi.org/brlcad/config.log |
| 04:34.18 | louipc | looks like it wants 8.6 or something? |
| 04:34.20 | louipc | shrugs |
| 04:35.13 | brlcad | louipc: no, keep reading -- it tries versions in order |
| 04:35.41 | brlcad | so 8.6 failed (naturally), but checking for Tcl_Main in -ltcl8.5 actually succeeds, so the lib check passed |
| 04:36.17 | brlcad | the other two potential checks are header checks (which tcl doesn't directly check for) and a functionality/sanity check (which is what is probably is failing) |
| 04:37.36 | brlcad | ah, tcl does have a header check, my bad -- but it passed |
| 04:38.34 | brlcad | er... |
| 04:38.35 | brlcad | configure:42641: checking whether to build Tcl |
| 04:38.35 | brlcad | configure:42662: result: no |
| 04:39.35 | brlcad | aha.. |
| 04:39.36 | brlcad | configure:43388: WARNING: Unable to find a system incrTcl compatible with the available system Tcl |
| 04:39.39 | brlcad | configure:43390: WARNING: Enabling compilation of both Tcl and incrTcl |
| 04:40.00 | brlcad | that should have been visible in your basic configure output too |
| 04:41.00 | brlcad | poolio: of course it's kosher, it's encouraged |
| 04:41.02 | louipc | ah, thanks |
| 04:41.35 | brlcad | louipc .. now whether the itcl test should have failed, that's another story |
| 04:43.10 | brlcad | louipc: ah, looks like you didn't have a system incrTcl according to the tests, so the failure is correct/intentional |
| 04:43.42 | brlcad | though using our incrtcl against a system 8.5 should be fine -- right now it just tries an all-or-nothing in order to support the macs |
| 04:44.55 | louipc | ah. It used to be cool with system tcl + bundled itcl |
| 04:45.13 | brlcad | it is/was/still is |
| 04:45.20 | brlcad | just so long as the versions match up |
| 04:46.01 | brlcad | macs have 8.4 installed and it was finding it .. but no itcl installed, and 8.4 doesn't work with our incrtcl sources (they require 8.5) |
| 05:03.17 | louipc | hmm! |
| 05:07.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31910 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: |
| 05:07.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: per louipc's discoverage, make the warning about mixing non-system incrtcl with |
| 05:07.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: system tcl a lot more in-thy-face obvious during output. for his case, though, |
| 05:07.32 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: he was trying the one version that should work (8.5) so try to make that work. |
| 05:09.08 | brlcad | give that a go |
| 05:14.09 | brlcad | poolio: what you're suggesting strongly relates to this topic: http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Project_Ideas#CSG_ray-trace_optimizations |
| 05:14.25 | brlcad | particularly the last two sentances ;) |
| 05:16.08 | poolio | brlcad: ah yes. |
| 05:29.17 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31911 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/rtexample.c: merge in the rest of rt_simple.c's comments including a plethora of new ones by yours truely. |
| 05:31.32 | Ralith | poolio: CMU? |
| 05:32.31 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31912 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/ (Makefile.am rt_simple.c): ding dong, rt_simple.c is no longer with us. it overlapped with rtexample.c too much so the two were merged into one. |
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| 05:33.41 | louipc | Carnegie Mellon University? |
| 05:35.31 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:36.28 | poolio | aye. |
| 05:50.02 | Ralith | ah. |
| 05:50.53 | Ralith | might apply there |
| 05:53.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r31913 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: Fix problem with quotes. |
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| 07:22.18 | brlcad | reyawns |
| 07:26.31 | Ralith | deyawns |
| 07:32.26 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31914 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: there is no rt_simple, but could use one for rtexample if it's going to be installed |
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| 08:53.53 | mafm | Ralith: are you there? |
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| 09:02.04 | Ralith | mafm: sorry, heading off now |
| 09:02.08 | Ralith | check your email though |
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| 13:20.16 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31915 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraMode.cxx CameraMode.h): Adding Axis enumerator useful for some of the modes (Shift-grips at least), and renaming of variables to be more correct. |
| 14:03.29 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31916 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraManager.cxx CameraModeMGED.cxx CameraModeMGED.h): Initial commit for my work on MGED mode. At the moment only scaling works, and not very well... |
| 14:07.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31917 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParser.cpp pcParser.h): remove deprecated warning by using boost::spirit::classic instead of boost::spirit |
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| 14:35.14 | mafm | yahhoooooo |
| 14:41.54 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31918 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraMode.cxx CameraMode.h): More renamings, forgot about these before... |
| 14:46.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31919 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModeMGED.cxx CameraModeMGED.h): I think that at last I got the scale commands right, and in a simpler way than I was expecting... |
| 15:04.37 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 15:04.56 | mafm | aloha pacman87 |
| 15:06.31 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@c-76-19-120-77.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) | |
| 15:15.46 | pacman87 | hi mafm |
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| 15:34.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31920 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraModeMGED.cxx CameraModeMGED.h): Variable renaming, for consistency |
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| 16:53.30 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31921 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Implementing basic translation for Shift-grips mode, although not working very well at the moment... |
| 17:21.26 | mafm | gotta go, laters |
| 17:33.09 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31922 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: add first cut at argc+argv mechanism |
| 17:47.50 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31923 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Succeeding with multiple tests. |
| 18:28.25 | homovulgaris | longs for heterogeneous STL containers |
| 18:43.58 | ``Erik | um, yeah, that's one reason I keep going back to scheme/lisp |
| 18:53.28 | homovulgaris | :) scheme is awesome.. <- tautology |
| 19:18.49 | jonored | still has the impulse to start writing reader macros and the like to load other languages into lisp... |
| 19:43.44 | pacman87 | can i tell 'attach X' to attach to a different X session? |
| 19:45.22 | louipc | how about if if you set DISPLAY? |
| 19:45.58 | pacman87 | how? |
| 19:46.45 | poolio | DISPLAY=:0.1 mged -c ... |
| 19:47.18 | ``Erik | (if in bash, csh is a little... different) |
| 19:47.35 | poolio | true true :) I've been using exclusively bsah for ... ever |
| 19:47.46 | louipc | me too |
| 19:48.03 | pacman87 | Starting an X display manager |
| 19:48.03 | pacman87 | X Error of failed request: BadMatch (invalid parameter attributes) |
| 19:48.22 | poolio | pacman87: It may not be :0.1, it might be :1 or something |
| 19:48.49 | pacman87 | :0.0 is the current session |
| 19:49.25 | poolio | Try it with :1.0 or just :1 |
| 19:49.26 | ``Erik | host:server.workspace |
| 19:49.41 | poolio | yeah that :) |
| 19:49.49 | ``Erik | :0 is equivelant to localhost:0.0 and server 0 means port 6000 |
| 19:49.55 | ``Erik | :1 is 6001, ... |
| 19:52.17 | pacman87 | 'DISPLAY=:0.1 kedit' works as expected |
| 19:52.38 | pacman87 | but 'DISPLAY=:0.1 mged' fails |
| 19:57.02 | ``Erik | neat, what about 'wish' or 'bwish'? |
| 19:57.21 | ``Erik | TK might have some "extra special" relationship to this task O.o :) |
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| 20:42.34 | pacman87 | i'm getting 'interesting' raytraces from overlapping geometry |
| 20:43.13 | pacman87 | ie, rectangle from -1,-1 to 2,1 |
| 20:43.27 | pacman87 | revolved more than 180 degrees |
| 20:47.51 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt20.png |
| 20:50.02 | pacman87 | ^^ that's from (-4,-1) to (8,1) revolved 270deg |
| 20:52.51 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31924 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Misc tweaks, add note about switching parser to use regex |
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| 22:13.05 | ``Erik | heh, this was too good, on the drive home, annoying little honda civic 'si' with the fart cannon and everything, license plate said "baka" |
| 22:13.14 | ``Erik | (japanese for "stupid", for those who don't know) |
| 22:13.41 | pacman87 | you should've taken a pic |
| 22:14.18 | ``Erik | I wish I had a camera |
| 22:20.08 | PrezKennedy | ive always got one with me now |
| 22:22.25 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 22:22.47 | ``Erik | <-- can't carry one when he goes to work |
| 22:23.03 | pacman87 | i couldn't either, last summer |
| 22:23.24 | pacman87 | had a bit of trouble finding a cell phone without one |
| 22:25.15 | louipc | yeah it's ridiculous |
| 22:25.31 | louipc | you can't buy just a phone anymore |
| 22:27.08 | pacman87 | i ended up getting a motorola L6 and swapping for my mom's L2 |
| 22:39.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31925 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (8 files): De-templating the Constraint object since it should not have been based on a template in the first place. need to sort out a preexisting segfault in the solver |
| 22:41.53 | homovulg1ris | gave up cellphones 6 months ago :) |
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| 01:35.20 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:35.55 | starseeker_ | howdy |
| 01:35.59 | starseeker_ | read read read... |
| 01:39.34 | starseeker_ | pacman87: Heh - when I see L6 I always think of Howard Clark's L6 katana blades: http://swordforum.com/summer99/howardclark.html |
| 01:39.38 | yukonbob | is "read read read..." what you're doing, or what I should do? |
| 01:39.44 | starseeker_ | what I'm doing |
| 01:41.24 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 01:41.30 | brlcad | hasn't started the read read yet |
| 01:46.17 | yukonbob | howdy brlcad :) |
| 01:47.53 | brlcad | pacman87: awesome new pics .. got negative quadrants working now it seems |
| 01:48.11 | brlcad | at least first and third |
| 01:49.28 | pacman87 | brlcad: they're all working, of a sort |
| 01:49.40 | pacman87 | the problem is with overlapping geometry |
| 01:50.07 | pacman87 | if you have + and - sides of a sketch, you're fine unless you try to go more than 180 degrees |
| 01:50.20 | pacman87 | then it ends up as an XOR-type thing |
| 01:50.36 | brlcad | treat it like a union |
| 01:51.23 | brlcad | so if you have 1,1->1,-1 and -1,.5->-1,-.5 .. you get a cylinder |
| 01:51.40 | brlcad | I see them as sweeping solid space |
| 01:52.04 | brlcad | that smaller left side shouldn't both create material and carve out the right me thinks |
| 01:52.44 | pacman87 | ok, that will require more condition handling for sketches over 180 degrees |
| 01:54.28 | brlcad | seemed like it should simplify things |
| 01:54.53 | pacman87 | no, because i'll have to determine which surfaces to ignore |
| 01:55.08 | brlcad | since that's the same as treating the -x as the same as a +x curve, just only for half |
| 01:55.32 | brlcad | do left and right independently, then you can merge your segment lists for the result |
| 01:56.09 | brlcad | just have to trim all curves that cross from + to - x |
| 01:56.43 | brlcad | at least it's a thought, it's the thought that counts right? :) |
| 01:57.22 | pacman87 | i'm already finding the angle for each hitpoint to determine whether it's valid |
| 01:58.04 | brlcad | just seems to me like it should make things simpler .. at least over xor'ing |
| 01:58.13 | pacman87 | i'm not doing anythign special to XOR |
| 01:58.18 | pacman87 | it just happens naturally |
| 01:58.51 | brlcad | unless you go over 180 |
| 01:59.04 | pacman87 | no, only if you go over 180 |
| 01:59.16 | brlcad | then what's the problem? :) |
| 01:59.22 | pacman87 | if it's under 180 the + and - sides dont' interfere |
| 02:00.42 | pacman87 | in this image: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt20.png |
| 02:00.58 | pacman87 | the holes are caused because the top and bottom surface are traced twice |
| 02:01.12 | pacman87 | once for +, once for - |
| 02:01.27 | brlcad | g'dammit .. that utexas.edu server sends the wrong mime type every so often |
| 02:01.40 | pacman87 | um... sorry? |
| 02:01.42 | brlcad | really wierd/craptastic |
| 02:01.53 | brlcad | it spews the png data as binary into the browser |
| 02:01.58 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:01.59 | pacman87 | fun |
| 02:02.07 | brlcad | till something resets, and it's fine |
| 02:02.08 | pacman87 | that's the lynx compatibality mode |
| 02:02.12 | pacman87 | ;) |
| 02:02.49 | pacman87 | anyway, the curved hole surfaces are from valid hits on the - side |
| 02:02.53 | brlcad | so what am I looking at in 20? what's the sketch? |
| 02:03.01 | pacman87 | two vertical lines |
| 02:03.08 | pacman87 | one at -4, the other at +8 |
| 02:03.14 | pacman87 | from -1 to 1 in y |
| 02:03.25 | pacman87 | it's 270 degrees |
| 02:04.24 | brlcad | huh? i'm missing a coordinate or a reference frame |
| 02:04.31 | brlcad | "at -4" .. |
| 02:04.45 | brlcad | and what way is the image oriented |
| 02:04.57 | pacman87 | ae -135 60 |
| 02:05.14 | pacman87 | so +z is up through the center |
| 02:05.18 | *** join/#brlcad cerrayo (n=cerrayo@c-67-160-127-173.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) | |
| 02:05.25 | pacman87 | +x is upper right |
| 02:05.32 | pacman87 | going away |
| 02:06.21 | pacman87 | you want the .g to play with? |
| 02:07.51 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/neg3.g |
| 02:09.05 | brlcad | arg, I don't have a recent compile .. this might take a bit |
| 02:10.11 | brlcad | does a g2asc and sees the values anyways |
| 02:10.59 | brlcad | {-4 -1} {-4 1} {8 -1} {8 1} helps ;) |
| 02:12.57 | poolio | brlcad: Holy cow it is pouring :P |
| 02:13.07 | brlcad | nay a drop here :) |
| 02:13.40 | poolio | Heh, it was the same way when you had rain and I didn't last night. I just got home and the roads were crazy...a lot of lights were out and a few roads were flooded out |
| 02:15.47 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt20b.png |
| 02:16.13 | pacman87 | added coord axes: z=black; x=red; y=green; |
| 02:16.37 | brlcad | heh, did you manually draw that? :) |
| 02:16.41 | pacman87 | yeah :) |
| 02:16.47 | brlcad | thanks, I figured that much |
| 02:18.09 | brlcad | what bothers me about that is the first 90 on the -x side (third quadrant |
| 02:18.40 | pacman87 | the bottom hole? |
| 02:18.48 | brlcad | since if you just had -4,-1->-4,1 that would be filled in .. |
| 02:18.51 | brlcad | yes |
| 02:19.22 | pacman87 | but the +x side from 180 to 270 overlaps that |
| 02:19.30 | pacman87 | giving zero-length hit segments |
| 02:19.34 | pacman87 | which are ignored |
| 02:19.36 | brlcad | likewise, the fact that 2nd quadrant is filled, I'd expect that to be open |
| 02:20.14 | pacman87 | quad II is only swept once |
| 02:20.32 | pacman87 | by the + side only |
| 02:20.45 | pacman87 | quad IV is only swept by the - side |
| 02:20.47 | brlcad | ah, right right |
| 02:22.14 | pacman87 | i'm assuming you still want it fixed (ie, holes filled in) |
| 02:23.14 | brlcad | i could be convinced either way really since it's sort of an "exceptional use" I think |
| 02:24.15 | brlcad | just seems to ask for issues .. e.g. what does 1,1->-1,-1 and -1,1->1,-1 give you (i.e. an X) |
| 02:24.30 | brlcad | nothing? two cylinders? |
| 02:24.40 | pacman87 | if it's symmetric, you get nothing from a 360 revolve |
| 02:25.52 | pacman87 | for a 180 degree, you'd get two cones |
| 02:26.29 | pacman87 | a 270 would look the same as a -90 |
| 02:38.07 | brlcad | trying to think of a case where that's actually useful |
| 02:39.35 | brlcad | (where either union or xor is more desired) |
| 02:40.02 | pacman87 | xor is faster, as it requires no additional tests/code |
| 02:40.14 | pacman87 | at least the way i have it coded now |
| 02:43.09 | brlcad | hm, there is one benefit of xor |
| 02:43.28 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 02:45.14 | brlcad | with the union approach, you can obviously get the same result (with a 360) by using |x| for your curve or by unioning two separate revolves with |x| and ofsetting one 180 |
| 02:46.01 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.12.88) | |
| 02:46.06 | brlcad | with xor, there are some shapes that you cannot get |
| 02:46.22 | brlcad | at least not without subtractions and only performing partial rotations, etc |
| 02:46.41 | brlcad | a bit more complicated |
| 02:47.09 | Ralith | union seems a lot more intuitive |
| 02:51.13 | poolio | brlcad: will I be seeing you tomorrow? :) |
| 02:51.44 | brlcad | Ralith: can you think of a shape where you'd intentionally model the revolve curve over into -x though and expect/need that unioned result |
| 02:51.57 | brlcad | poolio: heh |
| 03:02.03 | Ralith | brlcad: well, say you wanted a disk with a ridge extending out for 270 degrees, but absent for the rest |
| 03:02.42 | Ralith | you could rotate a rectangle with a ridge on one end around its center 270 degrees, and if it unioned you'd get that |
| 03:03.27 | Ralith | of course, there are all sorts of other ways to do that |
| 03:03.53 | pacman87 | Ralith: give me 5 min to make that sketch |
| 03:04.16 | Ralith | 5 min? It's a painfully simple sketch :P |
| 03:04.36 | pacman87 | i'm writing the sketch by hand, and doing the math in my head |
| 03:04.39 | pacman87 | i was estimating |
| 03:05.01 | Ralith | say, 1,1 -> 1,-1 -> -1,-1 -> -2,0 -> -1,1 -> 1,1 |
| 03:05.23 | Ralith | math? |
| 03:07.54 | pacman87 | Ralith: that won't work |
| 03:08.59 | pacman87 | ...at least not with xor |
| 03:09.34 | Ralith | huh? |
| 03:09.38 | Ralith | that was a union example |
| 03:09.42 | pacman87 | oh |
| 03:09.52 | Ralith | I can't think of a case where you'd want an xor |
| 03:14.16 | pacman87 | if you need a union, split the rev into two parts less than 180 and combine them |
| 03:14.41 | *** join/#brlcad stting (n=stting@c-67-160-127-173.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) | |
| 03:14.43 | pacman87 | if you want an XOR, you can't get it if it defaults to a union |
| 03:15.03 | brlcad | you can, it just takes a few more operations |
| 03:15.23 | pacman87 | (A-B) U (B-A) |
| 03:16.55 | *** join/#brlcad stting (n=stting@c-67-160-127-173.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) | |
| 03:22.37 | pacman87 | just found a new bug :( |
| 03:23.31 | pacman87 | note to self: when testing shapes, don't always put the center at the origin, and line the vectors up with the axes... |
| 03:26.07 | brlcad | pacman87: another argument against xor approach.. any +x curve rotated beyond 360 would wipe itself out |
| 03:26.36 | brlcad | instead of what I'd intuitively expect where anything >360 == 360 |
| 03:27.41 | pacman87 | no, seperate code path for > 360 |
| 03:30.26 | brlcad | well then that sort of breaks the behavior consistency |
| 03:31.38 | brlcad | i mean that the same reasoning that might result in xor being okay from 180->360 is similar to a +x-only curve for 360->720 |
| 03:34.01 | pacman87 | brlcad: it's still an xor |
| 03:34.19 | pacman87 | but it treats everythign over 360 as 360 exactly |
| 03:35.16 | brlcad | that's my point |
| 03:35.43 | pacman87 | sorry, i'm not seeing what you're trying to say |
| 03:36.08 | brlcad | that "but" case is the only reason it doesn't subtract away, where behaviorally I would expect it to |
| 03:36.54 | brlcad | that is, i would expect it to iff it's using xor behavior |
| 03:37.09 | pacman87 | (10:27:00 PM) brlcad: instead of what I'd intuitively expect where anything >360 == 360 |
| 03:37.17 | brlcad | with xor behavior, 360 != 361 |
| 03:37.43 | brlcad | right, intuitive modeling intent behavior, I would expect >360==360 |
| 03:37.50 | brlcad | but not if it's xor'ing |
| 03:38.13 | pacman87 | it xor's the + and - half of the revolve |
| 03:38.19 | brlcad | i'd expect it to oscillate on/off depending on the angle |
| 03:39.10 | pacman87 | the way to handle >360 would be to rework the start vector and angle behind the scenes |
| 03:39.24 | pacman87 | if you want it to keep xoring |
| 03:40.33 | brlcad | wasn't saying it couldn't be dealt with, just that I would expect it to behave that way if it's going to xor for 180-to-360 angles for -x curves |
| 03:41.25 | brlcad | that said, i'm not seeing the benefit vs. expected behavior still for why you'd specifically want an xor'd result -- some specific meaningful shape |
| 03:41.26 | pacman87 | so you want consistancy |
| 03:41.48 | pacman87 | it doesnt' really matter to me much either way |
| 03:41.58 | pacman87 | i'm just throwing out the options |
| 03:42.10 | pacman87 | so "what i code" == "what you want" |
| 03:42.15 | brlcad | i mean, it could be an option when you create the revolve, could ask which way to behave .. but then that's more work and probably not necessary :) |
| 03:42.23 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:42.49 | brlcad | "what I want" == "everything"! |
| 03:43.37 | pacman87 | does than mean i have to go back and set the universal constanst so that the universe evolves to contain a hard disk with your 'everything'? |
| 03:44.23 | brlcad | yes please |
| 03:45.03 | brlcad | the universe with hookers and blackjack |
| 03:45.09 | brlcad | in fact, forget the universe |
| 03:47.15 | pacman87 | so, final decision = union? |
| 03:47.20 | brlcad | pacman87: see what daniel says about the revolve, but my inclination would probably still by my original assertion that a union behavior is more what I would expect (and overall simpler to account for consistently) |
| 03:48.04 | pacman87 | ok |
| 03:48.55 | brlcad | not to mention a hell of a lot easier to document and explain |
| 03:49.13 | brlcad | if some twisted soul wants xor behavior, he can do the subtractions and union ops himself |
| 03:49.33 | pacman87 | awww, i kinda liked catering to the twisted soul |
| 03:50.05 | brlcad | mm.. sounds like the name of a rock band |
| 03:50.20 | pacman87 | 'catering to the twisted soul'? |
| 03:50.40 | brlcad | yeah or even just 'twisted soul' |
| 03:50.56 | brlcad | longer could be their cover song |
| 03:51.12 | pacman87 | right |
| 03:51.13 | brlcad | waits for punkrockgirl to write and sing it |
| 03:51.27 | pacman87 | i managed a segfault with 'l revolve' |
| 03:51.42 | pacman87 | now i've got 3 bugs to fix |
| 03:53.19 | brlcad | l revolve should be an easy one |
| 03:53.26 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 03:53.36 | pacman87 | i'm pretty sure i know how to fix them all |
| 03:55.39 | pacman87 | i still havent' managed to convince KDE that my monitor is 1680 px wide |
| 03:56.14 | brlcad | still? |
| 03:56.22 | brlcad | that something new? what changed? |
| 03:56.45 | pacman87 | i turned off twinview |
| 03:57.04 | pacman87 | it was giving me trouble playing bzflag :D |
| 03:57.14 | pacman87 | so now i have three seperate X sessoins |
| 03:57.54 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:57.58 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 03:58.03 | pacman87 | hi andrecastelo |
| 03:58.04 | brlcad | hello andrecastelo |
| 03:58.12 | andrecastelo | hey pacman87, hey brlcad |
| 03:58.17 | brlcad | andrecastelo: how are the secondary rays coming? |
| 03:59.01 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 03:59.09 | brlcad | don't linger too long on those -- you really need to get into the depths of path tracing soon (which requires secondary rays) |
| 03:59.19 | pacman87 | we should schedule a mentors vs gsocers bzflag match ;) |
| 03:59.23 | andrecastelo | i've been taking a look into rtexample.c and rt_simple.c and the idea is to set a new direction and a new point and fire again, right ? |
| 03:59.37 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 03:59.40 | andrecastelo | and perhaps write another function to handle those secondary rays |
| 03:59.56 | brlcad | look at the new rtexample.c -- i merged the two |
| 04:00.06 | andrecastelo | ok, will svn |
| 04:00.16 | brlcad | same code, just more comments |
| 04:00.26 | andrecastelo | okay |
| 04:00.54 | andrecastelo | rtexample uses a main(), so there's the place to set the new points and directions |
| 04:01.48 | andrecastelo | but which function works like that in a callback way (as is viewmlt.c ) ? i need to look into to which function it goes after it shoots the rays |
| 04:03.25 | brlcad | at least one of the functions in viewmlt.c is basically a callback to rt_shootray() already -- just one that is being called for you by the code that shoots the original primary rays in a grid |
| 04:03.48 | brlcad | inside that callback, you set up a struct application ap for each secondary ray |
| 04:04.03 | brlcad | and call rt_shootray() yourself with your own callback(s) |
| 04:04.49 | andrecastelo | hm, setting up a flag, perhaps, in mlt_app, to ensure no recursion madness (so the secondary rays dont call secondary rays)? |
| 04:05.39 | brlcad | depending on what you need to do, recursion may be desirable |
| 04:05.46 | brlcad | now for shadows, you don't need recursion |
| 04:05.53 | brlcad | but for path-tracing... |
| 04:06.05 | brlcad | that's sort of exactly how basic path tracing works |
| 04:06.50 | brlcad | otherwise, though, you'll only end up with a recursive-potential-infinite-loop if you make your hit/miss callback also call that same hit/miss callback |
| 04:07.11 | brlcad | you wouldn't call the same view callback though for the secondary rays |
| 04:07.27 | andrecastelo | got it, i was misunderstanding |
| 04:07.37 | brlcad | you'd call your own |
| 04:10.35 | Ralith | smacks ogre around a bit with a large abort |
| 04:12.33 | pacman87 | how do i append a bu_vls to another bu_vls? |
| 04:16.20 | brlcad | bu_vls_vlscat() |
| 04:16.37 | pacman87 | where are those? |
| 04:16.52 | brlcad | bu_vls_vlscatzap() if you're done with the one being added |
| 04:17.14 | pacman87 | this is for describe() |
| 04:17.16 | brlcad | they're all in include/bu.h -- but easier to read the documentation in src/libbu/vls.c |
| 04:17.47 | brlcad | it's on my todo to move all docs into the headers, but that's a hell of a lot of work.. :) |
| 04:22.07 | brlcad | wow, the website is getting about 32k hits/day |
| 04:22.20 | pacman87 | which site? |
| 04:22.24 | brlcad | brlcad.org |
| 04:22.27 | pacman87 | impressive |
| 04:22.37 | pacman87 | unique? |
| 04:22.50 | brlcad | no, indiv. requests |
| 04:23.18 | pacman87 | turns on opera auto-reload every 2 seconds |
| 04:23.44 | brlcad | looks like at least in the last 24 hours, 1081 unique IPs |
| 04:24.06 | pacman87 | 32 pages per user average |
| 04:24.29 | brlcad | s/pages/requests/ |
| 04:24.55 | pacman87 | hits != pages ? |
| 04:25.07 | brlcad | first page is about 7 requests |
| 04:25.22 | pacman87 | so, 4.5 pages |
| 04:26.05 | pacman87 | bugcount--; |
| 04:26.13 | pacman87 | fixed the segfault |
| 04:26.13 | brlcad | looks like it |
| 04:26.26 | brlcad | fairly small sample, but interesting nonetheless |
| 04:26.37 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 04:27.33 | pacman87 | describe was still treating the sketch name as a *char instead of a vls |
| 04:27.56 | pacman87 | ~karma |
| 04:27.56 | ibot | pacman87 has karma of 4 |
| 04:28.06 | pacman87 | thought it was 2... |
| 04:28.38 | pacman87 | not complaining |
| 04:30.06 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 04:30.34 | brlcad | you know you can get a char* from a vls too, yes? |
| 04:30.39 | brlcad | bu_vls_addr() ftw |
| 04:31.24 | pacman87 | i assumed vls->vls would be better |
| 04:31.32 | pacman87 | rather than vls->char*->vls |
| 04:31.45 | pacman87 | bugcount--; |
| 04:31.55 | pacman87 | now there's one left |
| 04:32.00 | pacman87 | that i know of |
| 04:35.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31926 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: two bugfixes: segfault in describe() due to change from char* to bu_vls; and ignore the start/end planes for full revolves (>360) |
| 04:35.37 | brlcad | 120,224 bytes in 6 files to be exact (on the main page) |
| 04:35.53 | brlcad | oh sure, much better |
| 04:36.07 | pacman87 | hmm? |
| 04:36.12 | brlcad | i just meant in general |
| 04:36.23 | brlcad | using bu_vls_addr() if you need a char* |
| 04:36.31 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 04:36.32 | brlcad | if you can stick to vls use, even better |
| 04:37.17 | pacman87 | sorry, my bugfixing took over my local context |
| 04:37.33 | pacman87 | needs a bigger L2 cache |
| 04:37.57 | pacman87 | but going to bed would probably work too |
| 04:38.11 | pacman87 | since i need to be up early enough to catch d_rossburg |
| 04:39.10 | brlcad | you can always hit him up on the mailing list too |
| 04:40.02 | pacman87 | if i dont catch him tomorrow morning, i'll do that |
| 04:40.08 | pacman87 | good night |
| 04:40.13 | brlcad | cya1 |
| 04:43.25 | PrezKennedy | ~karma |
| 04:43.25 | ibot | prezkennedy has karma of 3 |
| 04:47.28 | Ralith | who's bot is ibot? |
| 04:49.04 | Ralith | also: cool about the high traffic |
| 04:49.07 | Ralith | wonder what's generating interest |
| 04:49.11 | Ralith | any common referrers? |
| 04:49.23 | yukonbob | ~karma |
| 04:49.23 | ibot | yukonbob has karma of 2 |
| 04:49.41 | yukonbob | passes hat for karma |
| 04:49.55 | Ralith | ~karma |
| 04:49.55 | ibot | ralith has neutral karma |
| 04:49.58 | Ralith | aw :[ |
| 04:50.10 | yukonbob | you're the switzerland of karma |
| 04:50.17 | Ralith | that's not so bad |
| 04:50.33 | Ralith | I have a full on citizen militia |
| 04:57.39 | brlcad | Ralith: I didn't dig into the stats much further -- I'll do something more comprehensive and automated later, maybe at the anniversary |
| 04:58.29 | brlcad | the bot is run by tim on one of his systems |
| 04:58.57 | brlcad | on a couple hundred channels at last check |
| 04:59.08 | brlcad | and probably the largest factoid database for an irc bot |
| 04:59.23 | yukonbob | ~brlcad |
| 04:59.23 | ibot | somebody said brlcad was like a learner wrapped in tofu best served chilled |
| 04:59.39 | brlcad | ~stats |
| 04:59.39 | ibot | Since Mon Jul 14 18:39:43 2008, there have been 143 modifications, 1468 questions, 0 dunnos, 0 morons and 1061 commands. I have been awake for 9d 10h 19m 56s this session, and currently reference 115036 factoids. I'm using about 21096 kB of memory. With 0 active forks. Process time user/system 23166.69/1095.29 child 0.01/0.02 |
| 05:08.06 | yukonbob | installs |
| 05:08.14 | yukonbob | tcl 8.5, listening: |
| 05:08.18 | yukonbob | Boards of Canada |
| 05:08.22 | yukonbob | ^- a haiku |
| 05:09.25 | PrezKennedy | ~prezkennedy |
| 05:09.33 | yukonbob | (read "8.5" "Eight Five") |
| 05:09.34 | PrezKennedy | aww :( |
| 05:21.53 | louipc | catering to the twisted soul eh? |
| 05:22.40 | louipc | with human flesh. Death Metal! |
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| 09:21.38 | mafm | hi |
| 09:33.27 | alex_joni | hi |
| 10:34.32 | louipc | hi |
| 10:40.23 | homovulg2ris | hi :D |
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| 13:03.56 | andrecastelo | brlcad: got it to shoot secondary rays and to use another function for the secondary hits.. the algorithm in the secondary rays hit function is a stub (it shades again), i need to work on that now |
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| 13:58.00 | pacman87 | ~seen d_rossberg |
| 13:58.01 | ibot | d_rossberg <n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 7d 22h 35m 31s ago, saying: '(if not along a coordinate axis)'. |
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| 14:26.26 | mafm | network network network |
| 14:26.45 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31927 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Added secondary rays support. rayhit() calls secondary_hit(). The algorithm in secondary_hit() needs to be changed, though. |
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| 15:55.16 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 16:01.40 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31928 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): making VariableAbstract more than an empty class by shifting data from Variable<T> templates |
| 16:58.57 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31929 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: add carc support to rt_sketch_contains() |
| 17:46.25 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31930 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h solver_test.cpp): adding intersectInterval() function to Domain object , which among many other things would be helpful in implementing implicit constraints which result only in domain reduction |
| 18:09.53 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:09.53 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:12.07 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31931 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcBasic.h: scheduled removal/cleanup |
| 18:39.49 | louipc | yeh I got that too |
| 18:40.06 | louipc | mged seemed to work ok |
| 18:40.36 | pacman87 | i just went back to autogen.sh and configure |
| 18:43.53 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31932 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: add V2ADD3() to vmath.h |
| 18:44.33 | louipc | woo |
| 18:47.30 | louipc | do your floats conform to IEEE 754? |
| 18:47.39 | louipc | configure:38682: checking whether floats conform to IEEE 754 |
| 18:47.43 | pacman87 | i think i got that warning too |
| 18:49.48 | pacman87 | configure:38993: WARNING: The floating point implementation does not seem to be IEEE 754 |
| 18:49.49 | pacman87 | configure:38995: WARNING: compliant. The behavior or htond and htonf may be incorrect. |
| 18:50.40 | pacman87 | s/or/of? |
| 18:52.58 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31933 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: fix minor typo in warning, spotted by pacman87 |
| 18:53.01 | ``Erik | looks right to me |
| 18:54.39 | pacman87 | hmm, autogen.sh and configure didn't fix the "WARNING: Too many of the pkgIndex.tcl and tclIndex files are empty." |
| 18:55.12 | ``Erik | I get that, too... not sure why, haven't dug into it (what I do seems to work, so I haven't been concerned) |
| 18:55.24 | ``Erik | the annoying thing is that I have to svn revert -R src/tclscripts once in a while |
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| 19:33.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31934 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: Eliminated call to exit() and added memory clean-up to shutdown method |
| 20:09.50 | pacman87 | is it possible to alias commands within mged |
| 20:28.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31935 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/tire.c: |
| 20:28.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: Fix problem with nicks being removed from tread - turned out to be a problem |
| 20:28.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: with the trimming of the tread ellipse, which was trimming material from inside |
| 20:28.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the tread as well as outside. Switched to using two trimming cyls getting only |
| 20:28.55 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: the necessary outer parts - tread now renders without visual defect. |
| 20:31.11 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31936 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: note fix to tire tool in NEWS file. |
| 20:39.19 | brlcad | poolio: in your home dir again |
| 20:40.29 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i was doing some header include cleanup .. to use std::string we don't need to have any #includes ? |
| 20:40.52 | brlcad | pacman87: sure, you can create a proc that calls any number of other procs, even overriding commands already provided |
| 20:41.32 | brlcad | homovulgaris: what do you mean? should include <string> I'd think, no? |
| 20:41.52 | homovulgaris | yeah that was what i was thinking.. but it compiles fine :P |
| 20:42.19 | brlcad | if you use it, include it |
| 20:42.22 | homovulgaris | anyways.. good coding practice is to #include <string> :) |
| 20:42.26 | homovulgaris | i guess |
| 20:42.53 | brlcad | just means somewhere earlier in the header dependency chain, someone else needed it and is including it |
| 20:43.00 | brlcad | but that's not a guarantee |
| 20:43.37 | brlcad | so you should alwways include what a given file uses -- either its interface header (which includes what its implementation needs) and/or including the necessary implementation headers |
| 20:44.20 | homovulgaris | hmm.. :) |
| 20:44.36 | brlcad | is rather pedantic on headers |
| 20:44.44 | brlcad | s/pedantic/picky/ |
| 20:45.31 | homovulgaris | on another note i was almost about to delve into RTTI ..I think i should search for a better solution.. basically the issue is I want to support constraints which support multiple Variable types |
| 20:45.55 | brlcad | yeah, I think you need a really good reason to start using rtti |
| 20:46.05 | brlcad | that causes a handful of portability problems |
| 20:46.23 | brlcad | if your project wasn't so important, I would have said "absolutely no" :) |
| 20:46.51 | brlcad | but as a last resort, he can try to make the headaches work if needed |
| 20:47.05 | homovulgaris | I don't want to use it either.. I just need to write a heterogeneous container |
| 20:47.06 | brlcad | still, if you can find a better solution, it would probably be preferred |
| 20:48.06 | pacman87 | i'm pretty sure a bug is in revolve.c lines 302-344, so if someone wants to lend a fresh set of eyes to it, i'd appreciate it |
| 20:48.19 | brlcad | ah, yeah, there are better ways to get to that end (change the problem, use multiple containers, use a base class, type identifiers, even void* marshalling) |
| 20:49.03 | pacman87 | the problem is determining which side is + and which is - for a hitpoint on the start/end planes |
| 20:49.11 | homovulgaris | basically implementationwise how would the constraint evaluation function know the type of variables in the expression it evaluates.. I tried a bit with Variable Inheritance .. but function pointers still cause trouble due to signature difference.. I am experimenting a bit with boos::function and boost::lambda .. but it's proving to be tricky |
| 20:49.25 | brlcad | looks like someone checked in a bunch of tclIndex files |
| 20:50.38 | brlcad | wags his finger at bob |
| 20:53.18 | ``Erik | casting pointers with a magic check is pretty common in BRL-CAD |
| 20:54.35 | pacman87 | ``Erik: that's how extrude determines which segment type to use |
| 20:56.03 | brlcad | homovulgaris: I was actually going to talk to you about that bit .. what are your thoughts on using something a little more "less custom" for parsing the expressions |
| 20:56.03 | ``Erik | heh, that's core to just about everything librt does, pacman... :D |
| 20:57.24 | starseeker | brlcad: heh - another regex recruit? |
| 20:57.44 | homovulgaris | brlcad: u mean not using spirit ? and using flex/yacc instead ? |
| 20:59.38 | homovulgaris | I think spirit along with phoenix would be able to put in a lot of functional programming techniques into constraint generation.. performance wise though i think spirit is a bit of an issue.. |
| 21:01.34 | homovulgaris | about phoenix : http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_35_0/libs/spirit/phoenix/doc/preface.html |
| 21:02.34 | homovulgaris | basically i want the precompiled constraint functors to be as generic as possible.. |
| 21:04.50 | homovulgaris | hmm.. magic check.. |
| 21:15.07 | pacman87 | bugcount--; |
| 21:16.17 | brlcad | pacman87: so what exactly is the bug in that section? |
| 21:16.23 | brlcad | or is that the bugcount--? |
| 21:16.27 | pacman87 | i fixed it |
| 21:16.31 | brlcad | ah, bah :) |
| 21:16.34 | brlcad | what was the problem |
| 21:16.38 | brlcad | and the fix :) |
| 21:16.46 | pacman87 | i wanted the untransformed hit, and was using the transformed hit point |
| 21:17.03 | pacman87 | i was taking the dot product of the start vector and the point |
| 21:18.06 | pacman87 | so i switched to use the translated point and the original ray's direction |
| 21:18.12 | brlcad | this is part of turning that chunk into a union instead of subtraction/xor based? |
| 21:18.16 | pacman87 | no |
| 21:18.22 | brlcad | ah, just some other issue? |
| 21:18.24 | pacman87 | yeah |
| 21:18.29 | pacman87 | the last one i found last night |
| 21:18.33 | brlcad | what was the issue? |
| 21:18.41 | brlcad | i.e. the end result |
| 21:19.01 | brlcad | wrong hit points I presume? |
| 21:19.08 | pacman87 | it was confusing +/- for the x coordinates to pass to rt_sketch_conatains() |
| 21:19.15 | homovulgaris | :| i will have to burn a lot of midnight oil for clearing my solver segfault :( |
| 21:20.13 | pacman87 | but i didnt' see it before since my testing had all been aligned with the coordinate axes |
| 21:20.32 | brlcad | homovulgaris: i'll have to read up on phoenix later tonight, but it does sound like there's a need for some direction discussions here rsn :) |
| 21:20.33 | pacman87 | so the transformed was the same as the untransformed |
| 21:21.08 | homovulgaris | brlcad: amen :) |
| 21:22.12 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r31937 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: fix bug that caused flipping the start/end plane's x-axis for certain revolve start vectors |
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| 21:41.47 | poolio | brlcad: thanks |
| 21:58.36 | brlcad | pacman87: makes complete sense, thanks :) |
| 22:32.10 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31938 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (8 files): Include cleanup |
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| 23:15.47 | brlcad | wonders if he got stuck |
| 23:38.49 | pacman87 | who got stuck? |
| 23:39.30 | brlcad | starseeker |
| 23:39.33 | brlcad | but he didn't |
| 23:39.50 | starseeker | I'm back :-) |
| 23:40.14 | starseeker | may get stuck in another sense, as he attempts to tame regex to his will... |
| 23:40.30 | brlcad | starseeker: contains offsets to the start and end, not copies |
| 23:40.39 | starseeker | right |
| 23:40.41 | brlcad | so you just allow as many entries as you'll have matches |
| 23:41.06 | starseeker | how do I tell which substring was matched by which pattern? |
| 23:41.13 | brlcad | which yeah, could be strlen and/or something big |
| 23:41.33 | brlcad | they're ordered |
| 23:42.07 | starseeker | k |
| 23:42.16 | starseeker | starts working on a test case |
| 00:04.25 | poolio | returns from his bike ride :) |
| 00:06.38 | starseeker | brlcad: How do I print a substring to a vls, knowing the starting and ending offsets? |
| 00:08.47 | starseeker | nevermind, got it |
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| 00:34.53 | starseeker | um. pastebin is saying forbidden |
| 00:36.14 | brlcad | it's a one-liner .. here :) |
| 00:36.27 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31939 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/ (9 files in 8 dirs): revert the inadvertent index mods. someone(tm) should make it so this doesn't keep happening. |
| 00:36.45 | starseeker | ret=regcomp(&compiled_regex, "([co]*)([re]*)", 0); |
| 00:36.46 | brlcad | otherwise works for me here |
| 00:37.08 | brlcad | k, that seems alright I think |
| 00:37.33 | starseeker | Then I must be doing the array wrong |
| 00:37.48 | starseeker | regmatch_t result_locations[10]; |
| 00:37.58 | starseeker | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:38.28 | starseeker | When I look in gdb, I have nonsense for positions |
| 00:38.29 | brlcad | ah, I think it's your 0 |
| 00:38.42 | starseeker | checks docs... |
| 00:39.57 | brlcad | regcomp() |
| 00:40.11 | starseeker | It's just cflags |
| 00:40.46 | brlcad | try REG_EXTENDED | REG_ICASE |
| 00:42.14 | brlcad | REG_EXTENDED is what you want regardless as those are POSIX expressions |
| 00:42.19 | starseeker | OK, that runs at least... |
| 00:43.00 | starseeker | Ah, cool |
| 00:43.10 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks |
| 00:43.56 | brlcad | icase is case-insensitive, if it wasn't obvious |
| 00:44.10 | starseeker | :-) |
| 00:46.00 | brlcad | not to imply that you need or want it, maybe - maybe not |
| 00:47.54 | starseeker | hard to tell, just yet |
| 00:48.18 | starseeker | I don't see a way to tell how many substrings were actually matched, short of checking the array |
| 01:14.04 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:17.23 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
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| 02:10.01 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31940 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: Preliminary test work to use regex matching for breaking up names. Two patterns defined which break up two test names successfully - much more work and testing to do but the essentials are here. |
| 03:43.34 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31941 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ell/ell_brep.cpp: Working ellipsoid to brep conversion. |
| 03:45.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31942 10/brlcad/trunk/include/brep.h: redefine X,Y,Z,W,H after including the opennurbs headers. removed author |
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| 04:42.21 | brlcad | starseeker: "note fix to tire tool in NEWS file." .. not very informative :) |
| 04:43.23 | brlcad | should say what fix to what problem ideally since it's the commit message that is useful down the road |
| 04:43.39 | brlcad | to the news file is a given.. :) |
| 04:47.55 | brlcad | poolio: woo hoo! |
| 04:48.02 | brlcad | just read the diff |
| 04:52.17 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31943 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: strcat has less overhead than printf if you're not actually going to use a print specifier |
| 04:57.21 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31944 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: ws, add missing footer, M-q paragraphs, and don't put semicolons after functions (only after structs/classes). |
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| 09:13.04 | mafm | ho ho ho |
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| 10:07.54 | brlcad | green giant |
| 10:09.30 | mafm | green giant? |
| 10:38.07 | brlcad | ho ho ho |
| 10:38.21 | brlcad | old 80's commercial, never mind :) |
| 10:39.50 | mafm | I was pretending to be Santa |
| 10:39.58 | mafm | it's raining in Lisbon |
| 10:42.30 | mafm | I think that St. James (Galiza's patron, my home) is blinking an eye to me |
| 10:44.25 | brlcad | mafm: naturally, that's part of the .. joke :) |
| 10:44.35 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ho_ho_ho |
| 10:44.57 | brlcad | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxW1AZ_klVQ |
| 10:45.15 | brlcad | ho ho ho, green giant! |
| 10:46.21 | mafm | while the idiots managing the network at the lab continue to disconnect me every few minutes :P |
| 10:46.30 | mafm | oh, the giant of the vegetables |
| 10:46.36 | brlcad | hehe |
| 10:51.43 | mafm | 1 week of migration |
| 10:52.12 | mafm | router, switches, 80 new workner nodes and around 20 storage machines and misc crap |
| 10:52.20 | brlcad | fun |
| 10:52.23 | mafm | and they migrate everything at once without making tests |
| 10:52.50 | mafm | so they discovered bugs on the firmware and things like that after the migration |
| 10:53.30 | mafm | and half of the people (many of them are on holidays) have to spend the afternoon walking in the nearby parks |
| 10:53.50 | mafm | for a whole week (and maybe the next one too, who knows) |
| 10:54.13 | mafm | the thing of the parks is not bad, except when you have deadlines to meet :P |
| 10:58.53 | mafm | brlcad: so about the evaluations, anything new? |
| 11:47.00 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Oops, sorry |
| 11:47.09 | starseeker_ | brlcad: any way to fix it? |
| 11:47.39 | starseeker_ | should have committed the NEWS file fix at the same time, but didn't think about it being (potentially) user visible until too late |
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| 12:29.40 | starseeker_ | makes note to self: set up cindent properly |
| 12:39.37 | poolio | pokes CIA-22 |
| 12:50.46 | andrecastelo | brlcad: can i use the phong model implementation to get a new vector direction ? |
| 12:57.19 | poolio | I think CIA-22 is dead. |
| 12:59.09 | clock_ | CAPTCHA 22 |
| 13:00.19 | poolio | Heh, one of my professors last semester invented CAPTCHAs :) |
| 13:01.57 | mafm | for the tests? |
| 13:18.13 | poolio | mafm: No, he's the guy who came up with the idea of CAPTCHAs |
| 13:18.46 | mafm | kidding ;) |
| 13:19.17 | mafm | where are you studying at? |
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| 13:40.02 | poolio | mafm: CMU |
| 13:40.06 | poolio | in pittsburgh, PA, USA |
| 13:40.29 | mafm | heh, nice :D |
| 13:42.05 | poolio | mafm: thanks I guess :P Where are you studying? |
| 13:46.08 | mafm | some random spanish univ |
| 13:46.44 | mafm | one of my teachers and formers boss was making the doctorate at CMU |
| 13:51.08 | mafm | did you also have classes with Randy Pausch (sp?) ? |
| 13:54.39 | poolio | Nope, I did see "The Last Lecture" though. |
| 13:56.58 | mafm | :D |
| 13:57.19 | PrezKennedy | the next step for captchas should be identifying the object in the picture |
| 13:57.35 | mafm | very emotive video, yep |
| 13:57.53 | poolio | PrezKennedy: I really like what he's doing with reCAPTCHA...putting all those human hours to good use |
| 13:58.29 | poolio | mafm: heh yeah. in person it was really crazy. Everyone in the audience was almost in tears by the end |
| 13:58.51 | mafm | it's the same of recaptcha? very good, yep |
| 13:59.06 | mafm | although I read some criticism to the idea |
| 14:00.17 | poolio | Well, computer vision has gotten much better, so it's being broken all the time. But you can always make it a little bit harder, etc... recaptcha is basically working to digitize an immense number of books |
| 14:00.18 | louipc | I'm not a fan of captchas really |
| 14:00.44 | louipc | at least the type where they take some random string and distort it so it's hard to read |
| 14:01.47 | poolio | In the case of recaptcha it's a random word, and that word is from a book they're trying to digitize where OCR has failed. |
| 14:04.22 | louipc | heh I can't even read it 60% of the time http://louipc.yi.org/images/image.jpeg |
| 14:05.24 | louipc | maybe they should put some context and underline the words they want, and not distort them at all |
| 14:05.26 | homovulgaris | same with me.. most times images are pretty tough to be "even" human-readable |
| 14:06.09 | poolio | louipc: true true. they're working on it :) |
| 14:06.22 | homovulgaris | but i have to agree recaptcha is kind of cool human computing idea |
| 14:06.56 | clock_ | at Loton |
| 14:07.44 | poolio | mafm: Holy cow. I just got an e-mail from the CMU President. Randy Pausch died today :( |
| 14:08.16 | homovulgaris | hmm.. well he had a blast at least. |
| 14:09.43 | clock_ | louipc: http://louipc.yi.org/images/venice_beach-small.jpg |
| 14:09.48 | clock_ | louipc: have you been to Venice Beach? |
| 14:09.52 | louipc | yea |
| 14:10.10 | clock_ | louipc: you live close? |
| 14:10.28 | clock_ | Venice, that's Dogtown and Z-Boys! |
| 14:10.48 | poolio | clock_: That's 'small' heh |
| 14:11.00 | clock_ | poolio: :) |
| 14:11.05 | louipc | santa monica/venice yea |
| 14:11.13 | clock_ | louipc: you live there? |
| 14:11.20 | louipc | no |
| 14:11.50 | louipc | I spent a week in Los Angeles area |
| 14:11.58 | clock_ | oh |
| 14:12.12 | clock_ | louipc: is there a lot of skaters? |
| 14:12.25 | louipc | not that I saw |
| 14:20.31 | mafm | oh, died today? I thought that it might be already dead... his illness is quick and I saw the video about 6 months ago |
| 14:23.33 | clock_ | what does it mean to have a blast? |
| 14:25.23 | louipc | It's like having a banging good time :D |
| 14:27.25 | mafm | huh, does anybody here models with MGED actually? |
| 14:27.40 | clock_ | oh randy pausch has an extensive article on wikipedia |
| 14:27.44 | clock_ | mafm: me |
| 14:27.52 | clock_ | mafm: http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/ |
| 14:28.27 | mafm | do you use shift-grips mode? |
| 14:28.39 | clock_ | no |
| 14:28.44 | mafm | trackball? |
| 14:29.20 | clock_ | shift-mouse |
| 14:29.23 | clock_ | is that shift-grip? |
| 14:29.31 | mafm | yes |
| 14:29.41 | clock_ | oh that i use it and dont know it |
| 14:29.50 | louipc | shift/ctrl/etc |
| 14:30.03 | mafm | is the current way to perform rotation important, or it can as well be random rotation? |
| 14:31.37 | louipc | well it's better than random :P |
| 14:32.00 | mafm | sorry, I meant free rotation, similar to blender |
| 14:32.25 | louipc | blender is probably better |
| 14:32.34 | louipc | I remember I could use the keypad too :D |
| 14:33.05 | mafm | I'm creating two camera modes: blender and shift-grips |
| 14:33.17 | mafm | I think that the blender one is superior, and much simpler anyway |
| 14:33.45 | brlcad | starseeker_: you can run sh/indent.sh and sh/ws.sh to help with style -- the way to 'fix' it is to re-edit the line and commit it again with a new message |
| 14:34.34 | brlcad | andrecastelo: what do you mean about using the phong model -- using what's already implemented, or using that algorithmic technique? |
| 14:35.42 | andrecastelo | brlcad: using what's already implemented, in liboptical, right? |
| 14:56.50 | brlcad | andrecastelo: right |
| 14:57.27 | starseeker | poolio: Jeez, that's sad - of all the guys to get terminal cancer... |
| 14:57.28 | brlcad | you could use it, but the goal isn't to understand/implement phong so much as it is to learn how to shoot your own secondary rays properly (since that's what you need to build up a path) |
| 14:58.08 | brlcad | mafm: familiarity makes one much more superior to the other |
| 14:58.55 | brlcad | for the folks that have been using shift-grips for over a decade, mged's style is far more effective |
| 14:59.33 | mafm | but it doesn't event rotate completely? or I can't seem to get to do it |
| 15:01.50 | brlcad | not sure what you mean? can get any orientation I want with just a few motions |
| 15:02.00 | andrecastelo | i managed to shoot the secondary rays, setting up an application and the ray direction and origin |
| 15:02.11 | brlcad | andrecastelo: i saw the commits |
| 15:02.20 | brlcad | they didn't seem right for the purpose of shadows :) |
| 15:02.27 | brlcad | does it actually work for shadows? :) |
| 15:03.04 | mafm | that with control+mouse drag you can't orbit freely, some angles are missing |
| 15:03.44 | andrecastelo | that's what i thought, perhaps the shadows can be achieved with the secondary callback function? (also, we're talking about some kind of gouraud shading right?) |
| 15:05.02 | andrecastelo | i asked about the phong model because that could be used to determine the direction of the secondary rays, instead of using (0,0,-1) |
| 15:06.52 | brlcad | mafm: I'm not sure what you mean, works for me -- it's basically a free rotation mode |
| 15:07.32 | mafm | dunno, in my case is not complete |
| 15:07.50 | mafm | i.e., if viewing the earth I would be missing zenithal view of poles |
| 15:07.51 | brlcad | you can get angled rotations by going CC or CCW around the center too for alignment |
| 15:08.32 | brlcad | you mean in mged, or the rotation mode you've implemented thusfar for "mged style"? |
| 15:08.43 | mafm | mged |
| 15:09.17 | mafm | but anyway, what I've just implemented is a free rotation |
| 15:09.30 | mafm | my original question is if it has to be exactly the same |
| 15:09.35 | brlcad | sounds like you're doing something wrong |
| 15:10.01 | brlcad | it really should be, but then that depends on what is meant by "exact" too |
| 15:10.32 | brlcad | doesn't have to be numerically identical such that X drag events correspond to exactly Y rotation degrees for example, just the overall behavior should match |
| 15:11.02 | brlcad | andrecastelo: that 0,0,-1 is what was "wrong" |
| 15:11.21 | mafm | yes, I meant more like the second :) |
| 15:11.56 | mafm | shift grips/pans, control rotates freely, ctl+alt+shift scales... |
| 15:12.03 | mafm | are also the constrained modes important? |
| 15:12.13 | brlcad | andrecastelo: the original goal that you're aiming for was implementing secondary rays to render a shadow yes? |
| 15:12.42 | starseeker | prods CIA-22 |
| 15:12.54 | brlcad | yes, the constrained are very important |
| 15:13.15 | brlcad | they've been crying that they're not provided on one of our ported platforms (mac) for quite some time |
| 15:13.36 | brlcad | shift+ctrl freely zooms |
| 15:13.59 | andrecastelo | brlcad: yes, i was thinking something like shading.. |
| 15:14.14 | brlcad | meta/alt translates to fixed point |
| 15:14.17 | andrecastelo | perhaps that can be achieved later, with the path tracing and all? |
| 15:14.28 | brlcad | andrecastelo: shading != shadows |
| 15:14.51 | andrecastelo | brlcad: drop shadows? |
| 15:14.57 | brlcad | you have a simplistic flat shading implemented now |
| 15:15.25 | brlcad | based on surface orientation from the view plane |
| 15:15.56 | brlcad | drop shadows? this aint photoshop :) |
| 15:17.31 | andrecastelo | brlcad: sorry, i was r cast shadows |
| 15:17.38 | andrecastelo | s/r/thinking of |
| 15:17.40 | andrecastelo | :S |
| 15:19.06 | brlcad | yes, things that cast a shadow -- and if you think about what it means to have a shadow, it's based on visibility of a given surface point your light source(s) .. think about that for a bit and what you need secondary rays to do should become obvious |
| 15:21.07 | pacman87 | for shadows, shouldn;t the secondary ray point towards the light source? |
| 15:32.03 | brlcad | pacman87: ;) |
| 15:32.17 | brlcad | that would be a far better direction than 0,0,-1 ;) |
| 15:32.36 | pacman87 | that research i did during the application period pays off |
| 15:40.18 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i'm trying the origin point being the first hit point and the new direction being the same direction as the first direction.. and then, on the secondary function, set ap->a_color to a dark value.. in theory it should work.. or not? |
| 15:42.22 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.132.132) | |
| 15:43.12 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: i'd think that'd be more for semitransparent shapes |
| 15:43.53 | pacman87 | once you have the hitpoint from the primary ray, you shoot a secondary ray from that point to your light source |
| 15:44.23 | pacman87 | if the secondary ray doesn't intersect anything else before it gets to the source, you dont have a shadow |
| 15:44.35 | pacman87 | if the secondary ray does hit something, you have a shadow |
| 15:47.05 | andrecastelo | hmm, it would need a third ray then, to generate the shadows |
| 15:47.19 | pacman87 | what's your first secondary ray doing? |
| 15:47.59 | andrecastelo | i think i'll set up the secondary ray as you said |
| 15:48.48 | andrecastelo | currently it is shot from the first hit point, in the same direction, and when it intersects, it paints it black |
| 15:49.37 | pacman87 | your primary ray is from your eye to the environment, right? |
| 15:49.58 | pacman87 | once that ray hits something, why do you care what's behind it? |
| 15:52.00 | andrecastelo | good point, let me try something |
| 15:56.39 | mafm | heh, my panning for shift-grips is most funny |
| 15:57.08 | mafm | starseeker: homovulgaris: did you test the camera modes lately? |
| 15:58.24 | pacman87 | to my understanding, there's three main classes of secondary rays: shadow (directed toward light sources); reflections (reflect primary using hitpoint normal); and transmitted (passing through the object, used for transparency). |
| 16:00.34 | pacman87 | reflected rays would be somewhat offset depending on the surface characteristics |
| 16:00.56 | pacman87 | as would transmitted rays depending on the material characteristics |
| 16:01.21 | pacman87 | and offset using snell's law for differing indices of refraction |
| 16:15.35 | mafm | brlcad: the one of "constrained scale" that you mentioned before was only an example but all of them are important, or is it only important for scaling? |
| 16:17.35 | homovulgaris | mafm: Link error :( Undefined reference to CameraModeMGED::CameraModeMGED() .. do i need to copy stuff to /usr/lib ? |
| 16:19.32 | andrecastelo | what i tried didn't work.. |
| 16:19.35 | andrecastelo | brb, lunch |
| 16:19.52 | homovulgaris | ok .. works now .. my bad i think :P |
| 16:19.58 | mafm | homovulgaris: maybe you should do a clean rebuild or something? |
| 16:20.00 | mafm | ah ok |
| 16:20.57 | homovulgaris | oh it is more like mged now .. i liked the way it was earlier :) |
| 16:21.34 | homovulgaris | cameramode: blender is freer :) |
| 16:21.44 | mafm | homovulgaris: click on the top button about camera... |
| 16:21.51 | homovulgaris | there should be a word free-er :P |
| 16:22.18 | mafm | (and can issue the command "p<tab> w" for prettier view) |
| 16:22.48 | homovulgaris | is there a no hidden-lines command ? |
| 16:23.41 | mafm | no hidden lines? which lines? |
| 16:23.59 | homovulgaris | mafm: g3d working smooth on my end working smooth |
| 16:24.05 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03poolio * r31945 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/tor/tor_brep.cpp: working torus to brep conversion. needs more error checking, but should work for valid tori. |
| 16:24.10 | homovulgaris | i mean for example wireframe view |
| 16:24.59 | mafm | that's what "polygonmode w" should do |
| 16:25.17 | mafm | can type "help" in the console, w is short for "wireframe" |
| 16:25.29 | mafm | and it works on my end, what it doesn't seem to work is "point" |
| 16:28.31 | mafm | homovulgaris: so can you view in wireframe or not? |
| 16:29.15 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31947 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): More work (in progress) in panning and rotation for MGED shift-grips mode -- rotation works pretty well but panning does funny things |
| 16:31.04 | brlcad | almost any new user is guaranteed to probably prefer and expect 'blender-style" since that's what a lot of 3D apps do now |
| 16:31.33 | brlcad | shift-grips really is primarily to support our existing users that have their fingers and mice hard-wired to shift grips |
| 16:32.01 | brlcad | kinda like trying to make a vi user suddenly start using emacs |
| 16:32.19 | brlcad | doesn't matter how much better it is, it's painful to unlearn and relearn ;) |
| 16:33.34 | homovulgaris | brlcad: true :) |
| 16:33.54 | homovulgaris | mafm: in polygon mode the lines are hidden by faces if they are behind them right |
| 16:34.17 | mafm | yes |
| 16:34.26 | homovulgaris | i meant is there a mode which shows only the edges .. :) this polygonmode is neat too :) |
| 16:35.46 | homovulgaris | mafm: so we can support as many cameramodes as we want ? i mean later if some rhino ppl ask for their mode ;) |
| 16:36.56 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i am also sure lots of ppl will continue using mged.. :) i like vim more than gvim ;) |
| 16:37.38 | brlcad | didn't recall mentioning "constrained scale", no entiendo |
| 16:39.11 | brlcad | homovulgaris: yeah, there are still mged users that prefer 'ged' .. our old classic mode that doesn't have the tcl/tk gui |
| 16:40.36 | brlcad | when I first learned mged, I preferred classic mode -- some things are just more efficient than via the new interface, there's just a lot more functionality in the new interface overall that you end up wanting to convert |
| 16:40.48 | brlcad | then just turning on the faceplate gui so you get the best of both worlds |
| 16:43.28 | mafm | homovulgaris: many camera modes yes, in fact there are already 3 |
| 16:44.12 | mafm | homovulgaris: the polygon modes are direct translations of opengl inner workings, I just used those at the moment |
| 16:46.14 | mafm | <brlcad> they've been crying that they're not provided on one of our ported platforms (mac) for quite some time | shift+ctrl freely zooms | meta/alt translates to fixed point |
| 16:46.44 | mafm | I already implemented that for scale, and I see no point in non-constrained scaling -- it's hellish to control with a mouse :D |
| 16:47.48 | louipc | why not make the controls fully configurable and shift-grips, etc could be handy presets? |
| 16:47.53 | mafm | but I mea if it's also important for translation/panning (I think so) and rotation (I don't find it very useful here, specially after you're not in the initial position, because you don't know where are you rotating from :D) |
| 16:47.57 | brlcad | what do you mean by non-constrained scaling? |
| 16:48.18 | mafm | non-constrained to three-axes together |
| 16:48.22 | brlcad | to me that sounds like scaling the view in the horizontal or something (affecting perspective) .. which I don't see a need for |
| 16:48.57 | brlcad | view scaling == zooming in/out |
| 16:49.01 | mafm | I understood that in mac, shift+control scales freely, so in any direction independently (not fixing) |
| 16:49.15 | brlcad | oh, no |
| 16:49.24 | brlcad | those were three separate statements :) |
| 16:50.03 | brlcad | if you mean edit deformations, that's a different story |
| 16:50.53 | mafm | at the moment with shift-grips, I have scaling, freely rotating (not constraining to axes, i.e. meta/alt doesn't act) |
| 16:51.03 | mafm | and funny panning with shift |
| 16:51.07 | brlcad | what I meant with the mac is that there's a couple bindings missing (due to the keyboard differences) that let you constrain to just one axis while translating (or while scaling when editing) |
| 16:51.08 | mafm | (rotating is control) |
| 16:52.10 | brlcad | funny panning? |
| 16:53.04 | brlcad | it's pretty standard/simple panning |
| 16:53.13 | mafm | yes, it rotates at the same time :D |
| 16:53.19 | brlcad | it shouldn't |
| 16:53.28 | mafm | I know |
| 16:53.54 | brlcad | i.e. it doesn't (in mged) :) |
| 16:55.11 | brlcad | mafm: oh, another thing that might help you -> when comparing to mged, turn on Misc->Faceplate .. that will show you the view values as they change |
| 16:56.57 | mafm | btw, for voyeurs :P -- http://brlcad.org/~mafm/g3d-screenshots/brlcad_rbgui_20080725-1.png |
| 16:57.42 | andrecastelo | mafm: looking good! |
| 16:57.52 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31946 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Fix problem in tire with nicks being removed from tread due to the trimming method used for the inside cut of the tread shape. |
| 16:58.13 | brlcad | since some behaviors might not do what you think they do (e.g. you can implement zooming as changing the view size (i.e. moving the eye point) or by changing perspective (yuck)) |
| 16:58.19 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 16:58.54 | brlcad | woo hoo, that's looking much better :) |
| 16:58.56 | brlcad | ~mafm++ |
| 16:59.07 | mafm | much better than what? |
| 16:59.28 | mafm | it's similar to the last ones |
| 17:00.08 | brlcad | similar but not the same |
| 17:00.20 | brlcad | the first screenshot that shows it's actually a 3d context ;) |
| 17:01.12 | mafm | oh |
| 17:01.23 | mafm | that's because I think that I haven't made since I started with camera controls |
| 17:04.13 | mafm | btw I think that copied pretty well Blender mode |
| 17:04.46 | mafm | hopefully it won't need many changes to be production re |
| 17:04.48 | mafm | ready |
| 17:05.16 | mafm | (only one rotation glitch, and maybe missing keys that are for advanced users) |
| 17:05.57 | brlcad | sounds good |
| 17:08.14 | mafm | and my Orbital mode, of course, but maybe we should remove it because it's doesn't give you much more than Blender's... |
| 17:36.57 | louipc | is there a more generic term than 'blender' hehe |
| 17:44.18 | brlcad | 'kitchen appliance'? :) |
| 17:44.37 | homovulgaris | yikes :P |
| 17:44.45 | brlcad | "liquidizer mode" |
| 17:44.50 | louipc | HA HA |
| 17:47.17 | louipc | http://louipc.yi.org/images/haha.jpeg |
| 17:47.21 | mafm | well, it's blender because it tries to mimic blender |
| 17:47.33 | mafm | rotations with keyboard step in 15 degrees, etc |
| 17:47.51 | mafm | every program implementing similar ones would have different details |
| 17:49.36 | mafm | if you find a good name, I don't mind to use it :) |
| 18:02.25 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik, how do I find the light source point? I've tried a few suggestions made by brlcad and pacman87, regarding shooting 2ndary rays from the hit points to the light source, but I think I made a few wrong assumptions about rt |
| 18:02.30 | andrecastelo | also I think I'm doing something wrong - the secondary rays are shot from the first hit point and if I set ap->a_color based on whether these rays hit or not, it doesn't show any difference |
| 18:05.15 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: i think the light source is a user-defined point |
| 18:06.39 | andrecastelo | pacman87: what about when you run rt (or rtmlt, i think they are similar in this point) with just the database file and the objects as arguments, what is assumed to be the light source? |
| 18:07.23 | brlcad | rt makes specific default lights for you if none are specified |
| 18:07.55 | mafm | I hate panning, let's ban this from the program |
| 18:08.04 | mafm | panning is for pussies! :P |
| 18:08.07 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:09.27 | pacman87 | for your color setting, are you doing grayscale, or black/white, or full color? |
| 18:09.42 | mafm | theres a slight rotation in any step, and I don't know why -- maybe it's natural when changing the perspective? |
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| 18:12.09 | mafm | say, if you're looking a cube directly ahead you don't see the sides, but if you pan 5m and look in straight ahead, you should now see one side, right? |
| 18:12.23 | mafm | I think that MGED doesn't work like that |
| 18:14.37 | andrecastelo | pacman87: currently just grayscale |
| 18:21.13 | mafm | so I go home |
| 18:21.17 | mafm | see you guys |
| 18:21.52 | homovulgaris | ciao mafm |
| 18:22.05 | mafm | (and girls? :PPPPP) |
| 18:22.10 | mafm | bye :) |
| 18:24.03 | pacman87 | if ( !shadow ) brightness = (light source direction) DOT ( reflected primary ray direction from surface normal) |
| 18:24.21 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: somethign like that ^^ |
| 18:24.24 | pacman87 | ? |
| 18:25.50 | brlcad | eh, no you shouldn't be able to see one side .. yeesh |
| 18:26.01 | brlcad | at least not with an orthogonal view, that's probably what's screwing him up |
| 18:26.57 | andrecastelo | pacman87: hm, i see what you mean, something like 'only shade if not in the shadow' ? |
| 18:28.31 | pacman87 | strictly speaking, if there's only one light source, then you wouldnt be able to see the shadow side |
| 18:28.49 | pacman87 | like you cant' see the dark side of a cresent moon |
| 18:31.15 | pacman87 | i don't know the specifics of mlt or how it differs from standard raytracing |
| 18:32.05 | pacman87 | you might add a dim light at the eye source by default, so you can see the whole shape |
| 18:32.41 | andrecastelo | pacman87: i'd be happy if half the truck were in the shadow, :D |
| 18:32.56 | andrecastelo | and currently it's basically a raytracer |
| 18:37.47 | andrecastelo | i've added something like what you suggested |
| 18:38.22 | andrecastelo | but i think the problem lies in the secondary ray shooting, it just doesn't intersect anything |
| 18:38.57 | andrecastelo | (the secondary rays direction isn't good) |
| 18:39.24 | pacman87 | you need to specify the light source point |
| 18:39.57 | pacman87 | vector subtraction between hitpoint and light source, and unitize for your new direction |
| 18:40.28 | pacman87 | check if the closest hit on secondary ray is in front or behind the light source |
| 18:55.07 | ``Erik | iirc, there are two ways to specify lights in BRL-CAD; either a point light (like automatically generated by rt of no lights exist), or by applying a light shader (which photon mapping requires) |
| 18:55.25 | ``Erik | the point light is dimensionless, so you'll never intersect it with a shot |
| 18:55.28 | ``Erik | iirc |
| 18:56.11 | pacman87 | ``Erik: right, for the shadow secondary ray, you care about whether the first intersection is closer than the light source |
| 18:56.55 | andrecastelo | so, in view2init, the default lightmaker creates one coming from (1, 0, 1) |
| 18:57.13 | ``Erik | for point lights, pacman, yes |
| 18:58.58 | andrecastelo | when i set the direction of the secondary rays to that direction, everything is shadowed (i set a constant color for the cast shadow) |
| 18:59.17 | ``Erik | you fire a ray from your intersect point towards the light source, then compare the first hit against the distance to the light source? |
| 19:01.58 | andrecastelo | nope. I've tried something simple like what pacman87 suggested |
| 19:02.22 | andrecastelo | if (!shadow) shade; else paint it black |
| 19:02.29 | pacman87 | if your shadow ray is into the shape (shadow ray)DOT(normal) < 0, then it's shadowed |
| 19:02.36 | andrecastelo | hm |
| 19:03.04 | andrecastelo | let me try that |
| 19:03.05 | pacman87 | andrecastelo: so currently, everything is in shadow? |
| 19:03.06 | ``Erik | that's shading, not a cast shadow |
| 19:03.32 | pacman87 | ``Erik: it's in its own shadow |
| 19:03.41 | pacman87 | but yeah, i see your point |
| 19:03.56 | ``Erik | if your initial fire point is ON the surface, it probably won't hit itself trying to go to the light |
| 19:04.02 | ``Erik | or it'll always hit itself |
| 19:04.42 | ``Erik | so usually it's punted by shading on the surface and firing shadow rays to see if something else is casting a shadow on it |
| 19:05.27 | pacman87 | makes sense |
| 19:05.51 | andrecastelo | but when i shoot it, from the surface, to other directions, it doesn't intersect |
| 19:07.59 | pacman87 | have you tried simple tests |
| 19:08.28 | pacman87 | ie, two different sized spheres, with the light source on the line connecting the centers |
| 19:08.30 | pacman87 | ? |
| 19:09.18 | ``Erik | or an arb8 with a cylinder sticking out of it and a light source off to one side? |
| 19:09.22 | ``Erik | (post in the earth style?) |
| 19:10.54 | andrecastelo | no, haven't tried those.. I pretty much got some .g files and test on them :S |
| 19:20.13 | andrecastelo | i told it to output the distance from the second ray starting point and the first intersection, and it flooded me with the same number :S |
| 19:20.44 | pacman87 | should that be zero? |
| 19:21.01 | pacman87 | er, first intersection of secondary ray. right. |
| 19:21.07 | pacman87 | ignore me |
| 19:21.58 | andrecastelo | got something around 1954 o.O |
| 19:22.17 | pacman87 | you built a time machine? |
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| 19:30.17 | andrecastelo | heheh |
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| 19:53.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31952 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: |
| 19:53.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: test more names, add regex logic for build_region style endings. need to think |
| 19:53.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: abou thow to handle potential incrementors - apparently regex can't tell me how |
| 19:53.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: many numbers are tucked in the string. I can check and generate a regex string |
| 19:53.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: based on that, always use the first number before a period as the iterator |
| 19:53.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: (probably a bad idea), or...? |
| 20:14.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31953 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: |
| 20:14.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: check components that aren't numbers to see if they contain numbers - if they |
| 20:14.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: do, flag them in the array. Will need to create a secondary regex substring |
| 20:14.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: routine to handle up to some large number of numbers in such a string, and then |
| 20:14.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: when identifying which number to use for an iterator branch out to subarrays if |
| 20:14.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: a value of 2 is found. |
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| 23:13.25 | brlcad | ~seen ralith |
| 23:13.28 | ibot | ralith <n=ralith@216.162.199.202> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 1d 18h 22m 55s ago, saying: 'I have a full on citizen militia'. |
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| 04:15.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31954 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/mat.c: revive bn_vtoh_move() after it was (apparently inadvertently) commented out in r23481 (part of the ansi conversion) |
| 04:16.14 | starseeker_ | humph. |
| 04:16.32 | starseeker_ | can't test 7.12.4 on his box - Xorg is too new |
| 04:16.41 | starseeker_ | at least, can't test mged |
| 04:16.53 | starseeker_ | make test and make benchmark are proceeding... |
| 04:19.10 | louipc | xorg is too new eh? |
| 04:21.10 | starseeker_ | upgraded to unstable gentoo |
| 04:21.41 | starseeker_ | I stuffed the patch into trunk, but it's not in 7.12.4 |
| 04:21.44 | starseeker_ | phooie |
| 04:23.11 | starseeker_ | well, make test and make benchmark succeeded |
| 04:23.58 | starseeker_ | goes ahead and attempts the STABLE update, making note to hammer on his newly built copy at work on Monday |
| 04:25.02 | louipc | hmm |
| 04:25.57 | starseeker_ | 7.12.2 has that blasted TclReFree/regex issue |
| 04:44.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31955 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/mat.c: ws, style, and commentification consistency |
| 04:46.25 | louipc | bwahaha I hacked tor.c so it doesn't crash |
| 04:46.50 | louipc | it's crappy though :( |
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| 04:56.25 | brlcad | louipc: any insight on the bug? |
| 04:56.42 | brlcad | haven't gotten a chance to look into that one yet |
| 04:57.36 | louipc | seems like a divide-by-zero |
| 04:58.20 | louipc | I don't know how the values turn out to be zero though! |
| 04:59.11 | louipc | and even if they do it should get past the " if ( half_theta <= SMALL ) { |
| 04:59.40 | louipc | err shouldn't |
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| 08:42.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31956 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/view_obj.c: simplify, anything less than SMALL_FASTF is bad |
| 08:43.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31957 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbn/mat.c: optimize, near_zero test should be slightly faster than fabs() |
| 08:55.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31958 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/view_obj.c: |
| 08:55.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: comment on how vo_update() needs to validate the model2view matrix (or the |
| 08:55.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: corresponding rotation and center matrices) before attempting to invert it. |
| 08:55.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: investigating a bug report showed that this particular bn_mat_inv() was crashing |
| 08:55.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: due to that very reason. |
| 09:19.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31959 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/tor/tor.c: comment consistency cleanup |
| 09:28.20 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31960 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/tor/tor.c: style cleanup |
| 09:47.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31961 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/tor/tor.c: attempt to prevent an illegal instruction floating point exception (divide by zero in rt_num_circular_segments) reported by louipcin sf bug 1959202 (mged crashes when inserting a torus) |
| 09:47.46 | brlcad | louipc: give that a try |
| 09:57.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31962 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/view_obj.c: missing curlie |
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| 14:07.20 | ``Erik | morning, andre |
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| 14:13.42 | ``Erik | damn dave for having astroempires.com on his screen O.o |
| 14:29.35 | brlcad | oooh |
| 14:48.22 | brlcad | creates an account and gets to work |
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| 14:59.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31963 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: one char off bug in CONFIG_TS |
| 15:16.32 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:16.49 | ``Erik | we're in e37 if it matters :) |
| 15:19.34 | brlcad | B44:47:01:22 |
| 15:19.43 | ``Erik | oh, that's a seperate server |
| 15:20.55 | ``Erik | we're in epsilon (the alpha/beta/ceti... are the 5 seperate servers they have, each isolated) |
| 15:48.33 | brlcad | nods |
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| 16:28.59 | brlcad | tis addictive, I thought about writing something similar for the iphone |
| 16:29.45 | ``Erik | needs to go phone shopping :/ |
| 16:29.55 | ``Erik | I got the l2 mostly working, but the earbud doesn't |
| 16:30.02 | ``Erik | damn washing machines O.o |
| 16:30.40 | brlcad | you need an eyefown! |
| 16:32.29 | brlcad | wishes the timeframes were slightly longer, so you could queue up actions for an entire day in one go |
| 16:33.36 | ``Erik | you can later on |
| 16:34.09 | ``Erik | <-- just starting and has stuff with over 3 hours build time |
| 16:34.29 | brlcad | yeah, I saw that I could kick off goods and they take 5 hours |
| 16:34.37 | ``Erik | structures, even |
| 16:35.20 | ``Erik | like my spaceports and shipyards would take 3 hours and 4 minutes on my capital planet, and I've been gearing up to build economy quickly, not field a fleet or set up defenses |
| 16:35.44 | brlcad | seems that tutorial is primarily aimed at gaming the 7 day "newbie" timeframe so you don't have to pay |
| 16:36.04 | ``Erik | (you get 7 days safety, then the vultures descend O.o) |
| 16:36.48 | brlcad | yeah, but still with the seemingly primary intent of having as many planets as possible |
| 16:36.59 | brlcad | since you have to pay the upgrade fee to expand after that |
| 16:37.17 | ``Erik | I'll probably pay for an account, but getting enough economy going to put up a decent defence and fleet is a good side effect of that thing |
| 16:37.25 | ``Erik | yeah *shrug* |
| 16:37.32 | ``Erik | defense |
| 16:37.35 | ``Erik | even, I ain't no brit |
| 16:37.50 | brlcad | what day are you on? |
| 16:38.00 | ``Erik | uhm, like 3.5 |
| 16:38.04 | ``Erik | I started in the afternoon |
| 16:38.31 | ``Erik | I lose my carte blanche invulnerability on wednesday |
| 16:39.23 | ``Erik | and I'm surrounded by a bunch of people in a guild, so I assume they'll immediately attack me when that becomes an option |
| 16:39.59 | ``Erik | especially since my home defense fleet (one fighter to prevent piracy right now) is called "FluffyBunnies" :D |
| 16:41.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:44.24 | PrezKennedy | kill them all FluffyBunnies! |
| 16:55.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31964 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/Makefile.am: only generate the files once, is all-am needed given they're all BUILT_SOURCES? |
| 16:55.53 | ``Erik | amusingly enough, it seems like vim highlights lisp better than emacs O.o |
| 16:56.15 | brlcad | probably just better defaults |
| 17:14.52 | PrezKennedy | vim ftw! |
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| 19:59.15 | thing0 | test |
| 19:59.20 | thing0 | yes |
| 19:59.22 | thing0 | it worked |
| 19:59.36 | ``Erik | damn |
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| 21:35.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31965 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: daniel unbroke mged get/put commands when he fixed the %S structparsing |
| 21:42.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31966 10/brlcad/trunk/ (BUGS NEWS TODO): Bob fixed the solid_illum bug that was popping up in mged's gui and making primitive selection fail. |
| 21:46.04 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
| 21:46.04 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 21:48.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31967 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS README include/conf/MINOR include/conf/PATCH): |
| 21:48.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: bump revision to an unstable minor 7.13.0 to reflect the massive libged changes |
| 21:48.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: -- this will be released as 7.14.0 when the migration is complete. in the |
| 21:48.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: meantime, the STABLE branch will have the efforts that lead to a 7.12.6 release |
| 21:48.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: before then. |
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| 01:15.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31968 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: since it's happened twice now, add a basic sanity check for an infinite loop when trying to find a new object name during dbconcat |
| 02:05.09 | brlcad | starseeker_: you can implement contains_number() much more simply with a while loop and is_digit() -- it'll be considerably faster too |
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| 03:49.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31971 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: Improved memory cleanup on shutdown. limitations of rt_clean_resource() prevent complete cleanup. |
| 03:49.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31970 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/prep.c: rt_init_resource(): was failing when rtip was NULL, added some checks |
| 03:49.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31969 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/shoot.c: rt_clean_resource(): moved call of bu_ptbl_free() for re_pieces_pending earlier (it wasa not being called if pieces had not benn used). |
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| 05:50.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31972 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (14 files): ws style |
| 06:19.44 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Good idea, thanks! :-) |
| 06:25.44 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I think I'm getting a sense of how to break things up now - had forgotten about build_region's little twist on things and it wasn't mentioned originally... |
| 06:26.18 | starseeker_ | as near as I can tell the most build_region uses is #operator#, so that's not too bad |
| 06:26.38 | starseeker_ | will check the tcl code on monday to be sure |
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| 18:53.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31973 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Parker fixed mged 'dbconcat' hang when not specifying an affix. this was reported in sf bug 2015038 (dbconcat fails) by butler where mged would hang. cause was an infinite loop when searching for a new object name. |
| 19:01.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31974 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: just remove the else case since we cannot rely on ieee floating point which means not using ==, !=, inf, and nan with floating point types. other approaches prevail (case-specific). |
| 19:07.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31975 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: take a few liberties and cull out the dead code after a nice refactoring (rt_sketch_contains()) .. hopefully not anything pacman needs |
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| 02:27.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31976 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/prep.c: |
| 02:27.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Refactored rt_clean_resource(). Now calls rt_clean_resource_basic(), then calls rt_resource_init(). |
| 02:27.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: rt_clean_resource_basic() contains most of what was in rt_clean_resource(), but without the |
| 02:27.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: re-init. New method rt_clean_resource_complete() calls rt_clean_resource_basic(), frees the |
| 02:27.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: directory blocks, and does not call re-init - frees ALL the resource memory. |
| 02:29.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r31977 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: Now calls the new rt_clean_resource_complete() method to free all used memory |
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| 03:23.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r31978 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): solver segfault solved.. just a missing increment :( almost a 3 character bug |
| 03:30.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r31979 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: |
| 03:30.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Added setup of new direction according to light sources list - but just for the |
| 03:30.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: first element. Still need to be tweaked for the default value or the position of |
| 03:30.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the default light is added to the list? Added some comments. |
| 03:42.20 | andrecastelo | BRL-CAD is approaching 2 mil lines of code ;O |
| 04:02.17 | Ralith | is this good or bad |
| 06:19.32 | brlcad | andrecastelo: run sh/enumerate.sh |
| 06:23.36 | brlcad | it's not 2M -- that'd only be if you also count the sources in src/other that aren't ours -- we're closer to 1M |
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| 06:39.03 | brlcad | looks like it's presently 1.2M atm, which is .2M docs and 1M actual sources .. as well as .1M blank lines (not counted) and 1M external sources |
| 06:43.32 | Ralith | altogether, quite a lot. |
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| 07:34.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31980 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/cmakecheck.sh: add a simple helper script that compares the CMakeLists.txt build files against the Makefile.am files and lists any files that are missing. this should help keep them in sync, at least for the time being. |
| 07:49.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31981 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/cmakecheck.sh: bah, the dos carriage returns are causing sed to match the first entry. rework it so this doesn't happen -- new version simplifies the sed side but at a small run-time cost. |
| 07:50.30 | Ralith | can't you make svn convert everything into unix line endings on commit? |
| 07:54.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31982 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/CMakeLists.txt: add htester to the cmake build so the sources being compiled are in sync |
| 07:55.07 | brlcad | Ralith: yep, just atm those files don't have svn:eol-style set |
| 07:56.17 | brlcad | most do, just not the ones I'm trying to sync (they're older) |
| 08:00.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31983 10/brlcad/trunk/ (15 files in 15 dirs): add proper svn:eol-style and svn:mime-type settings to all of the CMakeLists.txt files that got added before setting proper properties became enforced. native and text/plain respectively. |
| 08:00.38 | brlcad | still wanted the script to work for the devs on cygwin anyways so it was a good fix |
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| 08:26.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31984 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libsysv/CMakeLists.txt: add the missing files to the build (even though they're configured off) so they are syncd with the Makefile.am |
| 08:30.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r31985 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pipe/pipe.c: a goto skipped the initialization of variables, moved the initialization of the variables (which are important after the goto) up |
| 08:35.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31986 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/cmakecheck.sh: account for {} vars too |
| 08:37.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31987 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/CMakeLists.txt: ignore a few files and add timer42.c since it's needed for nix builds |
| 08:41.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31988 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: add the new cmakecheck.sh to the distcheck to hopefully prevent making a release with the build files out of sync. use the SH var consistently too. |
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| 09:25.46 | mafm | hi |
| 09:38.04 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 09:38.08 | brlcad | did you see my note? |
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| 09:40.02 | mafm | the email? yep |
| 09:46.01 | mafm | I don't know if it reached the mailing list though, I only received one copy |
| 09:47.29 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31989 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraMode.cxx: Shutting up debug messages |
| 09:58.53 | brlcad | it made it, mailman is smart enough to notice you already received it |
| 09:59.47 | mafm | lol |
| 10:00.02 | mafm | I don't like that kind of smartness, it's like google's |
| 10:00.27 | mafm | and then I need to spend not-smart-but-dumb time finding posts :) |
| 10:00.38 | mafm | anyway, default should be orthogonal? |
| 10:01.21 | brlcad | yeah |
| 10:01.35 | brlcad | that's how most cad packages deal with it |
| 10:01.41 | brlcad | gives you precision alignment |
| 10:02.00 | brlcad | it should be toggle-able, though -- and completely independent of the inputs |
| 10:02.47 | brlcad | it's a view setting |
| 10:08.55 | mafm | hmm, so the state shouldn't be saved in the input/camera modes, but higher levels? |
| 10:26.13 | mafm | meh, it's not that simple to set up :) |
| 10:33.00 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31990 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Adding support for different projections: orthogonal(orthographic)/perspective |
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| 14:24.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r31991 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: don't assume that SH ends in whitespace |
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| 14:34.12 | mafm | you've got to love your network admins ¬_¬ |
| 14:35.39 | ``Erik | "or else" |
| 14:40.52 | mafm | the bad part is that they disconnected to about ~100 people, not just me for behaving badly :) |
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| 14:49.37 | starseeker | takes another run at STABLE... |
| 15:02.22 | mafm | orthogonal/orthographic modes, by default, have any issue with zooms? |
| 15:05.19 | mafm | I guess that it's something specific from OGRE, but everything is working but zooming |
| 15:05.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r31992 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (6 files): Moving the control of Perspective/Orthogonal projection types to the CameraManager, so it's independent of the Camera/Input Modes (MGED, Blender, etc). |
| 15:20.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31993 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/proc-db/tire.c): Fix sketch in tire tool to avoid jagged stepping artifacts on inner tread wall. |
| 16:01.26 | brlcad | mafm: I suppose it could be at a camera level -- but it does have nothing to do with input |
| 16:01.47 | brlcad | since a camera is how you're representing your view |
| 16:05.12 | brlcad | mafm: what angle are you using for perspective mode? |
| 16:07.08 | brlcad | ah, I see you already moved it up (view control) |
| 17:10.47 | mafm | brlcad: yes, I moved it up, but OGRE has a problem with zooming in that situation |
| 17:13.00 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 17:26.21 | starseeker | brlcad: There we go - as close as I'm likely to get to a "proper" dimensional match for the pre-existing tires in m35: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/m35newtires.png |
| 17:30.27 | brlcad | starseeker: cool, so you know how to update the m35.asc file? |
| 17:32.29 | brlcad | the only detail there is to make sure it's writing out a v4 asc instead of a v5 .. which it should do by default iirc since the original is v4 asc so it should effectively go v4asc->v4g->v4asc |
| 17:34.07 | brlcad | starseeker: you know what else comes to mind in your m35 picture.. you should install your fancy headlights on that 'higher' res version too |
| 17:34.24 | brlcad | that'd be a good place to put that work to good use |
| 17:34.33 | starseeker | sure :-) |
| 17:34.54 | starseeker | let me do my pre and post screenshots for the tire talk, and I'll pop the headlights in |
| 17:37.33 | brlcad | note where the lights actually are, two sets -- http://www.fsmm.org/collection_images/buttons/trucks1.jpg |
| 17:57.44 | mafm | I have to go now, take care guys :) |
| 18:23.37 | starseeker | brlcad: doesn't look like the default is to preserve v4 - the ascii export is almost half the size of the original |
| 18:28.51 | ``Erik | yeah, asc2g and g2asc suck like that, they're hardcoded to format and haven't really been updated since v4 |
| 18:29.08 | starseeker | so how DO I output a v4 asc? |
| 18:29.29 | ``Erik | um, g2asc should generate v4 style O.o |
| 18:30.10 | ``Erik | misread |
| 18:30.45 | starseeker | sure doesn't seem to |
| 18:30.46 | brlcad | starseeker: run dbversion in mged -- does it report 4 or 5? |
| 18:30.56 | starseeker | 5 |
| 18:30.58 | brlcad | it'll preserve |
| 18:31.05 | brlcad | ah, so asc2g upgraded it |
| 18:31.18 | brlcad | so you'll need to downgrade it |
| 18:31.23 | starseeker | ok... |
| 18:31.35 | ``Erik | *look* asc2g has notes about v4 stuff being replaced |
| 18:31.44 | brlcad | using a super-special undocumented flag (because we don't want non-developers using this) |
| 18:53.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31994 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: remove the unused MGEDCopyRight_Notice |
| 19:07.36 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-90-86.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:16.08 | ``Erik | stupid effin' subversion |
| 19:16.43 | ``Erik | made the mistake of updating his nfs shared copy of brlcad from a machine that has 1.5 installed when his usual machine has 1.4 :/ |
| 19:28.02 | starseeker | confound it |
| 19:28.33 | starseeker | the version I'm getting on the conversion seems to be VERY different from the one in the repository |
| 19:33.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31995 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/TODO: Update TODO file to 7-12-4 - testing commit ability to STABLE branch |
| 19:33.18 | starseeker | well, at least something is working |
| 19:50.28 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo___ (n=chatzill@201008219046.user.veloxzone.com.br) | |
| 19:50.44 | brlcad | starseeker: that needs some debugging, something is wrong with g2asc |
| 19:51.06 | brlcad | it's at least writing out the wrong comgeom types, looks like record parsing is off somewhere |
| 19:51.45 | brlcad | do you have a previous version you can test? (like a 7.10 or a 7.8) |
| 19:52.31 | brlcad | so wants to rip out all v4 support at some point |
| 19:52.31 | starseeker | not right now - I can try building one |
| 19:52.54 | starseeker | can we rip it out and still maintain the benchmark testing? |
| 19:53.09 | brlcad | oh sure, that's not the problem |
| 19:53.19 | brlcad | the problem is the slew of v4 geometry databases out there |
| 19:53.50 | starseeker | mm. Can we push for a comprehensive update effort? |
| 19:54.07 | brlcad | we have, several times |
| 19:54.21 | starseeker | humph |
| 19:54.25 | brlcad | it's not like they're all sitting pretty in one place waiting to be upgraded |
| 19:54.53 | starseeker | thinks they should be, darn it all... |
| 19:55.02 | brlcad | not just at arl too, there are other repos |
| 19:55.32 | brlcad | even in-house we can't really do it until the geometry service comes on-line |
| 19:55.44 | starseeker | true... |
| 19:55.59 | brlcad | a v6 8.0 branch would be good to start at some point though |
| 19:56.19 | starseeker | :-) |
| 20:03.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31996 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: g2asc of a v4 is apparently writing out the wrong s_cgtypes and otherwise parsing v4 .g files incorrectly. perhaps an off-by-one buffer problem crept into 7.10/7.12? |
| 20:34.01 | *** join/#brlcad mas3773 (n=mas3773@75-13-4-215.lightspeed.kscyks.sbcglobal.net) | |
| 20:35.09 | ``Erik | what about just collecting all v4 load ability into, say, dbupgrade (make it as ugly as g2asc/asc2g)? |
| 20:35.55 | ``Erik | "v4 database detected, would you like to upgrade it to v5? [Y/n]" :D |
| 20:37.14 | mas3773 | quick question: what's the command to fire up the brlcad terminal in a headless mode? |
| 20:37.36 | brlcad | mged -c |
| 20:38.04 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, I think even if all code was ripped out we'd still have to do that |
| 20:38.46 | mas3773 | aiy, thanks much, I was thinking it was a separate command vs a flag |
| 20:39.09 | ``Erik | eliminate it from the librt stuff and move the loaders into src/conv/dbupgrade.c :D then a little tcl/tk hackery |
| 21:07.56 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 21:18.07 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 21:35.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r31997 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (chgview.c dodraw.c dozoom.c mged.c mged.h mged_solid.h): remove the seemingly unused/dead HeadSolid list and distinguish the FreeSolid list from the same-named libged global (bleh) |
| 21:50.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31998 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (8 files): Begin update of STABLE to rel-7-12-4 tag from trunk. |
| 21:52.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r31999 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/doc/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Update STABLE doc dir to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:02.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32000 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/doc/docbook/ (20 files in 2 dirs): Finish updating docs in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:03.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32001 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/include/ (30 files in 2 dirs): Update include in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:25.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32002 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/ (26 files): Update misc in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:26.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32003 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/archlinux/ (. . Makefile.am PKGBUILD brlcad.install brlcad.sh): Update misc/archlinux in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:27.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32004 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/debian/ (13 files): Update misc/debian in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:27.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32005 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/enigma/ (12 files): Update misc/enigma in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:28.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32006 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/macosx/ (19 files in 4 dirs): Update misc/macosx in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:28.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32007 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/nsis/ (8 files): Update misc/nsis in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:29.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32008 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/pkgconfig/ (14 files): Update misc/pkgconfig in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:33.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32009 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/ (355 files in 199 dirs): Update misc/win32-msvc* in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:37.00 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:39.38 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, youd be so proud, i invested in a cheap linux server |
| 22:40.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32010 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/regress/ (Makefile.am flawfinder.sh gqa.sh repository.sh solids.sh): Update regress in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:41.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32011 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/sh/ (linkroot.sh make_dmg.sh make_pkg.sh): Update sh in STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 22:48.42 | starseeker | grr - why's it accepting it in small chunks but not as one big gulp??? |
| 22:49.33 | starseeker | settles in for a long, grinding night... |
| 23:01.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32012 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcBasic.h pcConstraint.cpp pcConstraint.h): Cleanup: code reorganization and transfer between .cpp and .hpp making way for the Heterogeneous container as an argument |
| 23:22.22 | poolio | gah, I broke my glibc |
| 00:07.02 | Ralith | that's no fun |
| 00:51.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32013 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/src/ (456 files in 67 dirs): Update src of STABLE to rel-7-12-4 |
| 00:59.12 | *** join/#brlcad Byron1 (n=byron@pool-96-251-1-116.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 00:59.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32014 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Remove from STABLE misc files that aren't in rel-7-12-4 |
| 00:59.49 | Byron1 | Is there a tutorial on how to use the matrix selection option in mged? |
| 01:01.26 | starseeker | the graphical one or the command line? |
| 01:02.21 | Byron1 | The graphical one I have the command line |
| 01:02.35 | starseeker | 'fraid not |
| 01:02.47 | starseeker | at least, that I've found so far |
| 01:04.49 | Ralith | trail-and-error it, then write one :D |
| 01:05.45 | starseeker | does small happy dance - that should bring STABLE up to 7.12.4 |
| 01:07.15 | starseeker | now to pull in whatever can be easily swiped from trunk and get ready for the actual 7.12.6 testing... |
| 01:25.31 | starseeker | brlcad: How do you want me to handle the snarfing of changes from trunk for 7.12.6? Should I do it all outside svn and then do one big commit, or add them as I go? |
| 01:26.15 | *** join/#brlcad yukonbob (i=1000@s142-179-54-198.bc.hsia.telus.net) | |
| 01:27.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32015 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/HACKING: Add r31220 from trunk - brlcad's better release tagging example. |
| 01:44.27 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 01:46.40 | brlcad | Byron1: if you read the OED tutorial, it is perfectly applicable to the matrix selection gui |
| 01:47.23 | brlcad | the gui has you pick a right-hand-side then a left-hand-side just like oed requires |
| 01:47.36 | brlcad | from there, the edits are the same |
| 01:50.47 | starseeker | should add a note to the oed tutorial about how to move assemblies/groups that are referenced in multiple locations |
| 01:50.57 | starseeker | that threw me early on |
| 01:52.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32016 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (33 files): remove the now empty mged_solid.h header |
| 01:53.08 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: wow, really? put one together yourself or bought something? |
| 01:53.59 | brlcad | starseeker: if they're fully tested, can add them as you go |
| 01:54.24 | brlcad | in general STABLE is supposed to be a branch where it'll always checkout, build, and run and be something we've fully tested |
| 01:54.43 | starseeker | crud |
| 01:54.56 | brlcad | i.e. much higher validity overhead that it not only compiles by default everywhere but also passes all our known tests |
| 01:55.12 | starseeker | had better wait then - this will take long enough without per-commit building |
| 01:55.48 | brlcad | you could create a branch, commit your changes there |
| 01:56.02 | starseeker | That's a thought |
| 01:56.05 | brlcad | then when it's all working, merge that over to stable |
| 01:56.30 | starseeker | had better do that - this will get too hard to keep track of otherwise |
| 01:56.34 | brlcad | that's probably the best route given it's an adhoc set of changes that need to be integrated |
| 01:59.17 | *** join/#brlcad stustev (n=stustev@ip72-205-246-167.ks.ks.cox.net) | |
| 02:00.01 | stustev | hello |
| 02:03.27 | brlcad | hello starseeker |
| 02:03.28 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:03.33 | brlcad | oops, hello stustev |
| 02:04.00 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, renting a cheapo one |
| 02:05.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32017 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/: Create working branch in which to prepare 7.12.6. |
| 02:06.55 | starseeker | brlcad: maybe we should tell CIA to ignore this branch? the STABLE update was noisy enough |
| 02:08.16 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: ah |
| 02:08.28 | starseeker | has no wish to spam |
| 02:08.34 | brlcad | nah, it's fine |
| 02:09.04 | brlcad | shows the live activity, tis a good thing :) |
| 02:09.14 | starseeker | :-) |
| 02:09.24 | starseeker | rather like slashdot reruns though... |
| 02:09.37 | brlcad | anyone that doesn't like the irc chatter can add an /ignore |
| 02:09.43 | starseeker | Ah |
| 02:10.06 | stustev | I am new to BRLCAD |
| 02:10.22 | starseeker | should go home soon but is hitting his stride now... |
| 02:10.32 | stustev | I want to know if I can use variables for the arguments |
| 02:10.43 | stustev | I haven't found that in the documentation |
| 02:10.44 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, the only thing in the house that runs Linux is the router |
| 02:11.00 | stustev | is it an undocumented feature? |
| 02:11.54 | Ralith | stustev: arguments in mged commands? |
| 02:11.58 | stustev | brlcad: are you the one that answered my bug report - if you are thanks a lot - I did an svn update and it compiled and runs good |
| 02:12.18 | Ralith | starseeker: imo CIA activity is always fun to see, even if it's a repeat; as brlcad says, it shows active development which is very satisfying. |
| 02:12.18 | stustev | yes - I want to build model with parameters |
| 02:12.57 | Ralith | stustev: iirc, the mged command line interface is actually a modified TCL interpreter; you can write code directly into it, so yes, veriables can be used as arguments. |
| 02:13.00 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32018 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (include/rtserver.h src/librtserver/rtserver.c): Add trunk r31226 by johnranderson for 32-bit vs 64-bit architectures |
| 02:13.19 | Ralith | the mged tutorial has an somewhat fairly early on of using a loop to modify the properties of 8 spheres |
| 02:14.13 | stustev | I will look for the 8 spheres. It will probably be just what I want. Thanks |
| 02:14.27 | starseeker | Ralith: Does that example still work? |
| 02:14.52 | Ralith | starseeker: uh, I don't recall hitting any problems when I did it |
| 02:14.57 | Ralith | starseeker: it's part of the candle tutorials |
| 02:14.58 | Ralith | er |
| 02:15.02 | Ralith | stustev: it's part of the candle tutorials |
| 02:15.35 | stustev | off to the candle tutorial - thanks again - bbl |
| 02:16.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32019 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Add trunk revisions 31229-31231 - various fixes |
| 02:17.43 | Ralith | stustev: you can even pass commands to mged from other sources, meaning you can easily script modelling in just about anything |
| 02:18.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32020 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/nirt/nirt.c: Add trunk revision 31239 - switch nirt's listforms to bu_vls. |
| 02:18.26 | Ralith | and if you really want to get fancy you can forego mged entirely and work with the libraries it's based on to build models using any language that supports C linkage |
| 02:20.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32021 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: time to level up. upgrade cliff yapp's entry from code contributor to developer. has had many months of sustained effort, hundreds of commits and counting. awesomeness. |
| 02:20.47 | brlcad | stustev: probably, I answer a lot of reports .. but welcome(!) regardless |
| 02:21.29 | starseeker | brlcad: thank you! :-) |
| 02:21.43 | brlcad | stustev: there are a lot of ways to model parametrically too, depending on what your actual goal is |
| 02:21.47 | starseeker | is humbled and honored |
| 02:22.03 | brlcad | using tcl in mged, using C, using scripting outside mged, etc |
| 02:23.09 | brlcad | starseeker: you probably passed up chris today :) |
| 02:25.02 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, while I'm thinking of it - do you want the hyp primitive in 7.12.6 or does it need more work first? |
| 02:25.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32022 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: ws |
| 02:25.17 | brlcad | i.e., into the top-ten committers |
| 02:25.22 | brlcad | it needs more work |
| 02:25.31 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 02:25.37 | brlcad | there are todo items for it |
| 02:25.49 | starseeker | well, doing a stable branch update is cheating a bit, but cool! :-) |
| 02:26.15 | brlcad | ah, actually good point -- those don't affect your stats :) |
| 02:26.28 | brlcad | so maybe not yet, but pretty close |
| 02:26.44 | starseeker | :-) |
| 02:27.51 | brlcad | mm, there's one more that deserves mention too |
| 02:28.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32023 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/mged/ (adc.c chgview.c): Add trunk revisions 31245-31246 - brlcad tweaks for M_SQRT@_DIV2 and using vmath.h for defines. |
| 02:29.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32024 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/vmath.h): Add trunk revisions 31246-31248 - more math tweaks, depreciate M_SQRT2_DIV2. |
| 02:30.09 | brlcad | starseeker: next step .. break into that list of "core devs" .. seems to be a big jump to cross the 1000 count mark :) |
| 02:30.40 | starseeker | Hehe :-) |
| 02:30.47 | starseeker | "I have not yet begun to code" |
| 02:31.04 | brlcad | misses mike .. |
| 02:31.18 | brlcad | between him, bob, and I .. *damn* |
| 02:31.45 | brlcad | he'd probably be between 15-20k commits now |
| 02:32.00 | starseeker | can believe it |
| 02:33.31 | stustev | brlcad: my goal is learning brlcad and modeling a replacement part for a machine of mine. I want to maintain an edge margin on a round plate for a bolt hole pattern. I would like to insert the diameter of the plate and the edge margin parametrically and then when I change the plate diameter the hole pattern diameter changes along with it. |
| 02:33.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32025 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Add trunk revisions 31262-31264 - Bob's fixes for graphical nirt. |
| 02:35.19 | PrezKennedy | i miss mike too |
| 02:35.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32026 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Add trunk revisions 31268-31270 - more nirt fixes. |
| 02:36.09 | stustev | I can see the substitution should work. It is all over the command line parameter. I am sure BRLCAD will do it. Does it use a # sign before the variable to tell the interpreter this is a variable? |
| 02:37.25 | brlcad | # are comments |
| 02:39.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32027 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (libbu/argv.c librtserver/rtserver.c): Add trunk revisions 31272, 31274, 31275 - john's obliquities calculation fix and brlcad's header fixes |
| 02:39.07 | starseeker | wonders just how bad this will blow up on him when he tries to build it... |
| 02:40.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32028 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Add trunk revisions 31277 - Bob's fix for copying nirt sfiles and mods to code that copies g_xxx.c - the latter may be an issue in this branch, TOCHECK |
| 02:42.25 | jonored | stustev: it's $ to tell the interpreter this is a variable. If you're doing math than stuff like [expr {(1+2)/3}] (square brackets substitute return values, expr does math) is probably also helpful. The usual math functions are there in expr, too. |
| 02:43.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32029 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/adrt/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Add trunk revisions 31292-31296 - adrt tweaks. |
| 02:44.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32030 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: Add trunk revision 31297 - fix to nirt's dest command. |
| 02:46.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32031 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/tclscripts/archer/ArcherCore.tcl: Add trunk revision 31299 - Archer raytrace control panel fix. |
| 02:46.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32032 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: Add trunk revision 31300 - nirt whitespace fix. |
| 02:48.14 | starseeker | 31300, that's a nice round number on which to call it a night |
| 02:48.29 | starseeker | only 700 odd more to consider... |
| 02:49.36 | brlcad | it's also worth noting -- though I'm sure the tutorial series covers it somewhere -- is that the mged tcl interpreter has "globbing" enabled by default so things like "draw [abc]*.r" works which otherwise wouldn't -- have to "set glob_compat_mode 0" if you want a pure tcl interpreter |
| 02:49.54 | brlcad | starseeker: hehe |
| 02:50.05 | brlcad | are you going through every committed revision? |
| 02:50.29 | starseeker | essentially - scanning the svn log looking for things not related to libged, the summer projects, etc |
| 02:50.39 | brlcad | nods |
| 02:50.55 | brlcad | check NEWS to, to see at least from a high-level what you might want to include |
| 02:51.02 | brlcad | s/to,/too,/ |
| 02:51.16 | starseeker | I'll undoubtedly suck in some build config changes unintentially, but that'll have to be fixed at the end once I know the final layouts |
| 02:51.19 | starseeker | nots |
| 02:51.21 | starseeker | er nods |
| 02:51.31 | brlcad | most bug fixes are good to have |
| 02:51.45 | brlcad | anything metaball related of course |
| 02:52.12 | starseeker | expects to have to take a closer look at that, since metaball work may have come after the primitives directory restructuring |
| 02:52.23 | starseeker | did you want to include that, btw? |
| 02:52.36 | brlcad | the restructuring itself doesn't matter |
| 02:52.50 | starseeker | Ah - might be easier to include it, if it doesn't tie in too heavily with libged |
| 02:53.01 | brlcad | it doesn't tie in at all |
| 02:53.08 | starseeker | oh, good :-) |
| 02:53.11 | brlcad | it should be pretty safe |
| 02:53.20 | starseeker | that'll make life much easier |
| 02:53.27 | brlcad | src/libged mostly interacts with src/mged |
| 02:53.35 | starseeker | didn't realize how many nirt fixes hadn't made it into a tarball release yet - ouch |
| 02:53.39 | brlcad | and src/libtclcad to a lesser extent |
| 02:54.01 | brlcad | yeah, sucks not being able to make a release, so this will be really good |
| 02:54.12 | brlcad | hopefully we can post it before siggraph |
| 02:54.36 | starseeker | will of course avoid most of the docbook for this purpose, but will probably stuff the tire doc in there since the latest/greatest tire should be in this release |
| 02:55.02 | starseeker | will try - he is gradually getting the hang of svn and getting the big 7.12.2 -> 7.12.4 jump behind him helped |
| 02:57.26 | starseeker | Oh - can I go ahead and include that tk fix for the newest Xorg releases? |
| 02:57.51 | starseeker | <selfish> can't run without that on his home machine </selfish> |
| 03:00.18 | brlcad | go for it |
| 03:01.31 | stustev | jonored: thanks - I will look for the examples and try them. I very much appreciate the info and help! |
| 03:05.09 | jonored | stustev: It's worth looking up some tutorial stuff on tcl if you can't find all of what you want in the brlcad docs - some of that came from reading up on tcl for me. |
| 03:05.32 | brlcad | stustev: any time, we're always here ;) |
| 03:06.47 | brlcad | new devs and power users (i.e. folks that leverage scripting) get my attention pretty quick, it's what we need more of most :) |
| 03:12.05 | Ralith | who was mike? |
| 03:12.21 | brlcad | Mike Muuss |
| 03:12.34 | Ralith | also, the new release will have metaballs? Neat! I wasn't aware those were even CAD-relevant. |
| 03:12.44 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Muuss |
| 03:13.36 | Ralith | oh. |
| 03:13.49 | brlcad | a truly brilliant guy to work with, exceptionally charismatic |
| 03:15.08 | Ralith | I can imagine, with a history like that. |
| 03:15.46 | brlcad | the wiki page doesn't really do him justice to say the least, but still informative |
| 03:15.51 | Ralith | opens up his /usr/src/sbin/ping/ping.c |
| 03:15.53 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:15.53 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:15.57 | Ralith | awesome. |
| 03:16.50 | brlcad | brl-cad is sort of like ping a thousand times over |
| 03:17.17 | Ralith | in what respect? |
| 03:18.10 | brlcad | in that the characteristics that have made ping useful and a great tool for so many environments for so long |
| 03:18.22 | Ralith | ah. |
| 03:18.48 | brlcad | ping was the result of a late afternoon of focused intent, brl-cad the same focus over more than a decade |
| 03:19.01 | Ralith | I'd thought that brl-cad's internals seemed amazingly well designed. |
| 03:19.10 | Ralith | seems I was justified :) |
| 03:19.19 | brlcad | yeah, they really are |
| 03:19.30 | brlcad | i mean every code, every api has room for improvement |
| 03:19.38 | Ralith | well, of course |
| 03:19.51 | brlcad | but as far as long-lived codes go, pretty darn nice |
| 03:19.57 | Ralith | but it's rare to find a package that hasn't been ruined by deadlines or ill-thought-out decisions |
| 03:20.29 | Ralith | hell, it's rare to find any code at all that's survived more than five years outside of things like unix system internals |
| 03:21.14 | Ralith | said quality is one of the things that engages me most about brl-cad, really |
| 03:21.21 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32033 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: yet another level up. long overdue credit to dev daniel for his sustained and varied contributions to the project. |
| 03:21.52 | brlcad | Ralith: that reminds me.. |
| 03:22.24 | Ralith | without that I'd have lost interest long ago. |
| 03:23.50 | brlcad | you now have commit access so you can apply your patches yourself |
| 03:24.00 | Ralith | wow |
| 03:24.02 | Ralith | thanks! |
| 03:24.08 | brlcad | I reviewed them and it was a mix of good and not so good for applying the changes to the rt^3 sources |
| 03:24.24 | brlcad | think of it as probationary, don't break anything ;) |
| 03:24.26 | Ralith | hehe |
| 03:24.30 | brlcad | and be sure to read HACKING if you haven't yet |
| 03:24.37 | Ralith | will do. |
| 03:24.42 | pacman87 | Ralith: congrats |
| 03:24.54 | brlcad | the biggest issue with the patches is that they were all bandaids instead of fixes |
| 03:25.10 | brlcad | which is fine for src/other code -- those should always be the utter minimum to maintain portability |
| 03:25.16 | Ralith | to be fair, that was my goal |
| 03:25.42 | Ralith | most of them are likely to be outdated by changes to the build system or upstream improvements |
| 03:25.43 | brlcad | nods |
| 03:25.58 | brlcad | and changes that will likely be lost the next time we sync with upstream |
| 03:27.14 | brlcad | in addition to not breaking anything, be sure to talk to mafm if you're working on that module |
| 03:27.24 | Ralith | of course. |
| 03:28.54 | brlcad | fyi, the Makefile he set up is entirely temporary .. if he or I or whomever can't get CMakeLists.txt to behave easily enough, I'll end up gutting the whole thing for GBS like the main brlcad module |
| 03:29.46 | Ralith | yeah, that's what I was referring to with respect to my patchs' temporary nature |
| 03:30.26 | stustev | wow - are all the tcl capabilities available in brlcad? |
| 03:33.43 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:34.08 | brlcad | most of tk's too |
| 03:55.13 | Ralith | Is it desired behavior that mged does not exit when all GUI elements have been closed, and it's providing no command line interface (as when launched with no options)? |
| 03:57.09 | Ralith | also, both reference links are broken :/ |
| 03:57.14 | Ralith | (in HACKING) |
| 03:58.01 | Ralith | (in rt^3) |
| 04:02.02 | brlcad | that's a bug, it should shut down |
| 04:02.45 | brlcad | it used to shut down if the graphics menu was closed (only) but even that was undesirable since you might still want the command line and vice versa |
| 04:03.08 | brlcad | rt^3's HACKING is a bit out-dated -- sorry for not mentioning that |
| 04:03.27 | brlcad | see the one in the brlcad module |
| 04:03.43 | brlcad | most of the same principles apply, just that it doesn't address some of the c++isms |
| 04:05.33 | Ralith | kk |
| 04:05.44 | Ralith | I noticed the main one seemed very different |
| 04:07.02 | brlcad | rt^3 was originally for a different purpose but with a lot of overlapping intent with a more recent development, so it's become the place to define a separation between the new OO api and new gui from the rest of brl-cad |
| 04:07.34 | brlcad | a way to encourage separation of responsibilities and not pollute the api in particular |
| 04:27.48 | starseeker | reaches home base |
| 04:28.20 | starseeker | Mike lent me his Mastering CMake book, so once I can find time to read it I'll take a more serious look at cmake |
| 04:28.48 | starseeker | REALLY likes the idea of "change config once, build everywhere" |
| 04:29.33 | brlcad | getting cmake to that point without a slew of platform-specific checks is going to be tough (instead of feature-specific) |
| 04:30.10 | starseeker | true, but it at least provides a unified framework for the logic |
| 04:30.17 | brlcad | right now, optional sub-configured cmakes is the bigger issue |
| 04:31.56 | brlcad | hm, even GBS provides a unified framework for the logic |
| 04:32.29 | brlcad | the difference is just that it'll generate various target types instead of just Makefiles |
| 04:33.01 | brlcad | otherwise they're both single cross-platform solutions to the extent that make (and having a shell) is cross-platform |
| 04:34.10 | starseeker | was under the impression that generating Microsoft specific build files was a considerable advantage |
| 04:34.13 | brlcad | most of the work for either is the feature tests -- how do I "know" that this platform needs DM_OGL defined for example so that our opengl framebuffer compiles |
| 04:34.41 | starseeker | ah |
| 04:35.13 | brlcad | gbs's solution was scripted feature, compilation, and runtime tests that you can write (in a m4+shell script language) |
| 04:35.37 | brlcad | how cmake deals with that portably to various environments is much more limited, making those tests a bit harder |
| 04:35.50 | brlcad | s/bit/LOT/ |
| 04:36.25 | starseeker | wait - GBS? |
| 04:36.42 | brlcad | begging projects to just fall back to "if I'm on windows, do this" style checks which are expensive to maintain over a long-term |
| 04:36.45 | brlcad | ~gbs |
| 04:36.46 | ibot | gbs is probably the GNU Build System, aka the Autotools, aka the suite of tools frequently used on UNIX and UNIX-like platforms that utilize the GNU Autoconf, Automake, and Libtool build tools. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_build_system for more details. |
| 04:36.49 | starseeker | ah |
| 04:37.15 | starseeker | could the issue be raised with the cmake devs? |
| 04:41.47 | starseeker | really should sleep now... |
| 04:47.21 | *** part/#brlcad Byron1 (n=byron@pool-96-251-1-116.lsanca.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 04:50.11 | brlcad | stustev: it's really a fundamental implementation issue -- side effect of supporting various output formats |
| 04:50.30 | brlcad | cmake has support for it -- it's just not *as* flexible as gbs |
| 04:50.37 | brlcad | in the end, it could very well be good enough |
| 04:50.54 | brlcad | most of the feature tests have a specific pattern anyways |
| 04:51.01 | starseeker | one of those "we only find out by putting in an absurd amount of effort" questions? |
| 04:51.35 | starseeker | scowls as his svn checkout and wonders if Comcast is up to their tricks again... |
| 04:52.12 | Ralith | I know comcast does all sorts of nasty things, but messing with svn? |
| 04:52.31 | starseeker | if it's tunneling through ssh, they might treat it like one more ssh connection |
| 04:52.45 | starseeker | and they sure haven't liked my screen remote sessions through ssh in the past |
| 04:52.51 | Ralith | they treat my ssh connections ok, so long as I don't leave them idle for long periods |
| 04:53.10 | Ralith | otherwise they drop them |
| 04:53.28 | starseeker | they do seem to be a bit better lately |
| 04:53.33 | starseeker | ok, sleep |
| 04:53.36 | Ralith | night |
| 04:53.38 | starseeker | later all :-) |
| 04:56.17 | brlcad | starseeker: pretty much |
| 04:56.34 | brlcad | have to put a solid two weeks into it at least |
| 04:57.02 | brlcad | fortunately, rt^3 is tiny so it's not so bad but it should provoke many of the same test types |
| 04:58.03 | brlcad | Ralith: that sucks .. I don't tend to see that unless they're perfectly idle (e.g. on a screen window with no activity, but fine on an irc session) |
| 04:59.27 | Ralith | brlcad: that's what I was referring to; I've never had an active session dropped, only things that I wasn't using/had forgotten about anyway. |
| 05:02.02 | Ralith | it was only annoying insofar as that it tended to invalidate the master sockets that freebsd's ssh generates by default, meaning I'd have to manually delete them before opening a new session. |
| 05:05.49 | brlcad | o.O |
| 05:06.35 | brlcad | i've not seen that be an issue to .bz (brlcad.org) which I'm always on via screen, use for irssi -- that's an old 5.2 box |
| 05:12.41 | Ralith | on completely idle connections? |
| 05:20.47 | brlcad | probably not |
| 05:21.08 | brlcad | but idle enough to get me disconnected if I'm on a quiet screen context |
| 05:43.50 | Ralith | well, I only ever have to deal with comcast when I'm using someone else's wifi anyway. |
| 05:44.27 | Ralith | normally (and currently) I'm on a neat local ISP which accidentally made my consumer-level link symmetric a year or two ago. |
| 05:49.34 | brlcad | nice! |
| 05:50.34 | brlcad | doubts it was accidental though .. probably just cheaper (e.g. some tech in the isp office saying "oh noes, we ran out of adsl ports .. gotta use the sdsl ones now" |
| 05:51.40 | Ralith | hehe |
| 05:51.46 | Ralith | well, I'm not about to call them up and ask what's going on. |
| 05:53.20 | brlcad | iinteresting .. http://www.sdbestpractices.com/ |
| 05:53.35 | brlcad | wonder how technical it actually gets, some interesting tracks |
| 05:53.40 | brlcad | spensive as hell though |
| 05:56.17 | brlcad | wonders if anyone he knows has ever gone |
| 05:58.31 | Ralith | not that great a website for a group that's all about software development. |
| 06:14.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 06:19.07 | Ralith | so what's a use case for metaballs in CAD? |
| 06:19.41 | brlcad | analysis purposes |
| 06:20.17 | brlcad | say you want to represent field strengths surrounding a given object |
| 06:20.39 | brlcad | and determine when two fields are interacting, or when you are within a given field |
| 06:21.22 | brlcad | metaballs serve that purpose very well to implicitly represent envelopes that have variable power associations between points in the field |
| 06:23.09 | brlcad | useful for representing proximity as well -- if you want to roughly know when you are within a meter of a given object for example -- define a metaball structure for the primary boundary points on the given object, automatic solid envelope results |
| 06:24.42 | brlcad | more of a CAE capability, but closely related |
| 06:25.59 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 06:28.18 | Ralith | it makes a lot more sense in that context. |
| 06:28.58 | brlcad | yeah, wouldn't necessarily use it to represent actual geometry |
| 06:29.11 | brlcad | unless you're in the business of making blobby things |
| 06:29.41 | brlcad | could be used to represent certain fluids (inefficiently) |
| 06:30.58 | Ralith | I can't imagine a CAD suite, especially a CSG one, would be the tool of choice for someone in the business of making blobby things. |
| 06:31.23 | Ralith | still, it would be pretty fun to have full support for boolean operations on metaballs |
| 06:32.01 | brlcad | nods |
| 07:09.48 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:19.17 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 08:21.06 | mafm | heya |
| 08:40.38 | *** part/#brlcad vedge (n=vedge@205-237-251-204.ilesdelamadeleine.ca) | |
| 08:45.44 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 09:17.11 | mafm | w00t |
| 09:17.37 | mafm | I'm getting orthographic modes working, and I think that I indirectly fixed another issue :) |
| 09:24.17 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 09:44.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32034 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraMode.cxx CameraMode.h): |
| 09:44.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Fixing the problems with zooming in orthographic mode with minimum hassle, using |
| 09:44.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: some of the capabilities of OGRE (instead of previous trials modifying view |
| 09:44.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: matrices and so on). It works as expected with all current camera/input modes. |
| 10:06.25 | brlcad | awesome! |
| 10:07.30 | mafm | still have problems with panning though :D |
| 10:07.48 | brlcad | heh |
| 10:08.37 | mafm | there are two problems |
| 10:09.07 | mafm | 1) with keyboard, I want to get panning to work the same independent of zoom |
| 10:10.44 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14DB05.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 10:11.20 | mafm | 2) with mouse, I cannot get the model to follow exactly the mouse |
| 10:23.25 | brlcad | sounds like you have a fair bit of work ahead of you then :) |
| 10:25.28 | brlcad | by panning independent of zoom, do you mean so that one key event corresponds to some amount of absolute translation or translation that is relative to the view (so a object will move N pixels left regardless of zoom/size) |
| 10:25.48 | mafm | the latter |
| 10:25.53 | brlcad | k |
| 10:26.06 | mafm | well, whatever is desired |
| 10:26.12 | clock_ | -/win 12 |
| 10:26.14 | brlcad | that works |
| 10:26.30 | mafm | but at the moment I only get absolute translations |
| 10:29.18 | brlcad | ~botmail for homovulgaris 29 jul - pcConstraint.h:39:20: error: pcHSet.h: No such file or directory |
| 10:37.48 | mafm | one thing... |
| 10:38.12 | mafm | in orthogonal mode, I see the same width in front of me than in the infinitum, right? |
| 10:38.53 | mafm | say, if my camera is a box of 10m, I only see objects at max of that size either if they're in the foreground or in the background, right? |
| 10:39.17 | mafm | (or otherwise they're cropped and I only see a chunk of the whole object) |
| 10:44.29 | brlcad | right |
| 10:45.52 | brlcad | you might have depth-clipping, but things are otherwise parallel such that a 2mx2mx2m box looks the same as a 2mx2mx200m box (presuming you're looking down the z axis) |
| 10:46.08 | brlcad | oh, and if it wasn't mentioned! .. jeez |
| 10:46.16 | brlcad | I sure hope you used right-hand rule |
| 10:46.21 | brlcad | +Z is up |
| 10:46.55 | brlcad | should have made sure I said that earlier, much earlier |
| 10:49.25 | brlcad | if you want to add support for left-handed or other orientations (e.g. +y is up), go for it -- but default for all modes should be +Z is up, right hand rule, and if you're looking down the -X axis with +Z going up, +Y goes to the right .. +x is the "front", +y is the "left", +z is the "top", etc |
| 10:49.57 | brlcad | example diagram is on the mged quick reference |
| 10:50.26 | brlcad | pretty standard for most CAD systems, but not for some graphics systems |
| 10:50.40 | mafm | yahooooo, I got it (for blender mode) |
| 10:51.12 | brlcad | ~mafm++ |
| 10:51.19 | mafm | +Z is up? |
| 10:51.23 | mafm | ~mafm-- :P |
| 10:54.27 | brlcad | +Z is most definitely "up" |
| 10:54.47 | brlcad | we were going to make shirts for that for last year's gsoc party :) |
| 10:56.23 | mafm | I have +X right, +Y up, +Z backwards |
| 10:56.28 | brlcad | some games also chose differently, mostly due to directx pollution |
| 10:56.41 | brlcad | yeah, that's bad |
| 10:57.07 | brlcad | that's view-centric coordinates instead of 3D environment-centric |
| 10:57.56 | brlcad | basing it on an XY plane to match your display (usually for rendering purposes), but when you move to 3D environments, that is the ground-plane and z goes up |
| 10:58.28 | brlcad | that'll definitely need to change |
| 10:59.19 | mafm | uh |
| 10:59.58 | mafm | that'll hurt |
| 11:00.24 | mafm | I was just using OGRE defaults, didn't know that there were different habits for CAD systems |
| 11:01.06 | brlcad | yeah, the alternative is entirely counter-intuitive to CAD |
| 11:01.34 | brlcad | ogre has a setting for which orientation iirc |
| 11:01.50 | brlcad | one of its perks |
| 11:02.06 | mafm | for "which orientation"? |
| 11:02.18 | brlcad | for setting the orientation |
| 11:02.20 | brlcad | right/left hand |
| 11:02.29 | brlcad | z up, y up iirc |
| 11:02.57 | brlcad | otherwise z-up/y-up should be easy to fix, it's one rotation |
| 11:03.21 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 11:03.53 | brlcad | what you described is a left-handed coordinate system |
| 11:04.13 | brlcad | that's wrong on two-counts ;) |
| 11:04.37 | mafm | really? Z is backwards, pointing towards you |
| 11:04.56 | brlcad | ah, okay |
| 11:04.58 | mafm | I think that it's only a rotation away (along X axes) |
| 11:05.49 | brlcad | I read +z backwards as +z going away from you |
| 11:06.50 | mafm | why is that important? for creating things programatically? |
| 11:07.28 | brlcad | it cascades across various issues |
| 11:08.34 | mafm | saving/loading files too |
| 11:08.45 | brlcad | you're constantly dealing with proper orientation and alignments, tools and commands that rely on knowing which way up is |
| 11:09.54 | brlcad | import/export of data for sure, though many importers will give you an option to realign since there are still a small minority that use a different handedness or a different orientation |
| 11:09.56 | mafm | oh goody |
| 11:13.28 | brlcad | most real-world systems (flight control, simulators, cartography) use the convention of living in the X/Y plane (what should be natural/intuitive) |
| 11:13.44 | brlcad | CAD systems reflect that |
| 11:13.55 | brlcad | (as they should) |
| 11:15.12 | mafm | that's a religious thing I guess, for me it's more natural the OGRE way :D |
| 11:15.53 | mafm | Ogre::RenderSystem::_setViewMatrix || Ogre::RenderSystem::_setWorldMatrix |
| 11:16.11 | mafm | one of these would do, wouldn't it? |
| 11:16.31 | brlcad | it's not just religion -- if I asked you to draw a top-down view of your house on a sheet of paper and asked you to draw a coordinate grid over it -- you'd most likely label them x and y |
| 11:17.24 | brlcad | one of those should do the trick I believe yes |
| 11:17.52 | mafm | hopefully that won't thrash the GUI! |
| 11:19.02 | brlcad | the *only* reason the other convention came to pass was because of display system programmers that started with a 2D context, which was naturally labeled x/y, was extended to 3D where they just went "into" the display |
| 11:19.07 | mafm | the X/Y it depends on the situation, if you're used to draw coordinates of a projectile (classical high school physics problems) you'd do Y up :) |
| 11:19.28 | brlcad | it's focusing on what is doing the looking instead of what you're looking at, the world being represented and how that correlates with the one we live in |
| 11:19.50 | mafm | I guess that I'm biased because of the displays too :D |
| 11:19.52 | brlcad | you do X/Y when you only have two to work with no matter what view |
| 11:22.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32035 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Fixing the problems with panning when controlled by keyboard (currently for Blender Camera mode only). |
| 11:23.56 | brlcad | like I said, it's mostly whether you emphasize the viewer (viewing system) or the environment being viewed .. I even learned +Y is up for graphics and thought similarly until I had to model stuff that mattered and became familiar with both |
| 11:24.34 | mafm | scared |
| 11:25.11 | mafm | ok ok +Z is up, but don't make me learn it by modeling with MGED! :P |
| 11:25.12 | mafm | ;) |
| 11:25.53 | mafm | have to go to lunch, hopefully I'll get inspiration for fixing the panning with mouse for MGED mode |
| 11:25.55 | mafm | bbiab |
| 11:26.06 | brlcad | heh, cya |
| 11:49.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32036 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (archer/archer.bat mged/mged.bat util/rtwizard.bat): Update version to 7.13.0 |
| 11:53.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32037 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcConstraint.h: unbreaking the build. accidental premature code insertion |
| 11:55.34 | mafm | "accidental premature code insertion"... so that's how they call it now |
| 12:02.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32038 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (dir.c setup.c): |
| 12:02.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Added the killrefs command that kills/removes all references of the specified |
| 12:02.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: objects by combinations. The objects themselves are not killed. Also added the |
| 12:02.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: -a option to killtree that arranges for "all" references to also be removed. |
| 12:08.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32039 10/brlcad/trunk/ (63 files in 8 dirs): Fleshing out a few libged commands that were previously stubbed in. |
| 12:15.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32040 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Add revisions 31301-31305 to pre-7-12-6; misc. fixes to Tcl, nirt, config.ac |
| 12:25.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32041 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (Makefile.am wdb_track.c): Temporarily adding wdb_track. |
| 12:30.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32042 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (Makefile.am killrefs.c): Adding killrefs. |
| 12:43.25 | mafm | yay! got it |
| 12:43.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32043 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/open.c: Cut-n-paste fix. |
| 12:44.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32044 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Removed ged_rt_gettrees. |
| 12:45.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32045 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraManager.cxx CameraModeMGED.cxx): |
| 12:45.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Fixing the problems with panning when controlled by mouse (currently for |
| 12:45.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: MGED/Shift-grips Camera mode only). In the end it was very simple, but only |
| 12:45.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: once we got the relative dimensions of the camera and we're working in |
| 12:45.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: orthogonal projection mode. |
| 12:51.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32046 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (362 files in 41 dirs): Start merging the primitives reorg into pre-7-12-6 |
| 12:52.44 | mafm | brlcad: the constrained modes work according to the initial coordinates, not with the screen coordinates... are there any document explaining this? |
| 12:55.04 | mafm | any other person knowing the information is welcome to reply, of course |
| 13:00.53 | mafm | when using unconstrained mode, it works in "screen mode", you move the object according to the camera plane |
| 13:01.15 | mafm | or rather, move the camera up/down/left/right |
| 13:01.55 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@58.171.212.200) | |
| 13:02.40 | mafm | but when using constrained mode, this works constraining to "X" axis in world coordinates or something like that, so you hardly can control where to move the view to |
| 13:03.24 | mafm | at least I'd expect that constrained modes would constrain it to only up/down or left/right in "camera space" |
| 13:06.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32047 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librt/primitives/ (68 files in 33 dirs): more primitive directory restructuring |
| 13:14.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32048 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (59 files in 49 dirs): Merge trunk r 31311-31319 - tweaks, adrt updates |
| 13:30.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32049 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/dup.c: make prototype match declaration for ged_dir_check (missing static) |
| 13:30.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32050 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Saving the state of camera rotations before dragging, so they continue to rotate from the current position instead of starting from scratch (for both Blender and MGED modes). |
| 13:30.54 | mafm | what happens today with brl-cad, developers on asteroids? :) |
| 13:31.12 | mafm | amazing, being that it's the peak of the summer :) |
| 14:03.01 | PrezKennedy | programmers are allergic to the sun ;) |
| 14:03.31 | d_rossberg | brlcad: did you get my e-mail from friday? |
| 14:56.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32051 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (4 files): Cleanup of #includes |
| 14:57.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32052 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiWindowManager.h: Renaming to remove inconsistencies |
| 14:59.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32053 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraManager.cxx CameraManager.h GuiWindowManager.cxx): Adding event for when we update the camera every frame |
| 15:05.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32054 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Temporarily adding wdb_importFg4Section. |
| 15:06.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32055 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged_private.h: Declare ged_open_dbip(). |
| 15:20.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32056 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged.c: The declaration of ged_open_dbip has moved to ged_private.h |
| 15:21.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32057 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: sort source files |
| 15:25.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32058 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/importFg4Section.c libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Added the importFg4Section command to libged. |
| 15:31.29 | poolio | ooo, when's the new release supposed to be out? |
| 15:41.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32059 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: do not call rt_resource_clean_complete() for rt_uniresource |
| 15:42.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32060 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserverTest.c: Mods to work with changes in rtserver |
| 16:11.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32061 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/prep.c: rt_clean_resource_basic() now sets the conditions that are checked by rt_init_resource(), allowing resource structures to be cleaned and initialized again. |
| 16:14.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32062 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: Now that the init-clean-init cycle is possible, restore the call to rt_clean_resource_complete() for rt_uniresource. Librtserver is once again free of memory leaks. |
| 16:24.51 | starseeker | poolio: It'll be a bit yet - I'm still collecting updates while trying to avoid accidently pulling libged changes |
| 16:27.20 | starseeker | then there's all the testing, plus this being my first time putting a release together :-) |
| 16:35.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32063 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 2 dirs): Add r31321-31326 from trunk - TODO updates and nirt features. |
| 16:37.08 | poolio | starseeker: good luck :) |
| 16:38.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32064 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (COPYING configure.ac): Add r31329-31331 from trunk - typo fixes, don't mix sysystem tcl with non-system itcl. |
| 16:42.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32065 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Add r31333 from trunk - add asc2g and g2asc to cmake lists. |
| 16:43.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32066 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/include/bu.h: Add r31337-31338 from trunk - new bu_list example. |
| 16:48.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32067 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (BUGS NEWS src/proc-db/tire.c): Add r31348,31349,31354,31358 - tire fixes. |
| 16:51.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32068 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/adrt/libtie/tie_kdtree.c: Add r31366-74 - adrt tweaks. |
| 16:55.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32069 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/rt/viewarea.c: Add r31406 - viewarea fix. |
| 17:16.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32070 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiBaseWindow.cxx: Cleanup of #includes |
| 17:20.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32071 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/doc/docbook/oed/oed.xml: Add r31430 - Add oed tweaks suggested by Paul Tanenbaum, add acknowledgements. |
| 17:34.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32072 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/doc/docbook/oed/oed.xml: Fix to lollipop model suggested by Paul Tanenbaum (r31458) |
| 17:36.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32073 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Upload r31456 and 31457 - rtserver simplification and loop -c feature |
| 17:37.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32074 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/HACKING: Update how to make ChangeLog |
| 17:42.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32075 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (TODO include/bu.h src/libbu/argv.c src/mged/rtif.c): Upload r31480,81, and 87 - libbu updates and TODO update |
| 17:42.51 | brlcad | aaah, the mged quick ref is finally getting out of date .. hrmph |
| 17:43.03 | brlcad | beams at all the activity |
| 17:45.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32076 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (NEWS doc/Makefile.am doc/mged.sh doc/mged.tr): News updates, rename mged.tr to mged.sh |
| 17:48.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32077 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (9 files in 3 dirs): Naming convention build target updates. |
| 17:51.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32078 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (TODO misc/nsis/brlcad.nsi): Upload r31523 NSIS updates for version aware Windows installation |
| 17:53.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32079 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/misc/archlinux/PKGBUILD: archlinux PKGBUILD update - don't strip debugging, keep docs |
| 17:54.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32080 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 17:54.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: per modeler request, bob added a new killrefs command that removes all |
| 17:54.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: references to a given object (without killing the object itself) as well as a |
| 17:54.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: new -a option to killtree so it removes all references in addition to killing |
| 17:54.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the object and it's hierarchy. these be very very dangerous commands. |
| 18:01.14 | starseeker | next step, kill tree except for objects referenced in another tree ;-) |
| 18:04.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32081 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (6 files in 5 dirs): Commit r31542, 31544-51549 - new mged regression test, tire cleanup by Sean, column width change in helplib.tcl, other tweaks |
| 18:06.28 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 18:16.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32082 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (35 files in 7 dirs): Uploaded r31575 - 31585 - cleanup by Sean |
| 18:17.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32083 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/sh/ (news2tracker.sh tracker.sh): Update news2tracker.sh and tracker.sh, r31611-12 |
| 18:18.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32084 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/asc2g/asc2g.vcproj: Update version to 7.13.0 |
| 18:28.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32085 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Uploaded r31669 - 31675 - cleanup by Sean, fast4-g checks, note pipe primitive issue |
| 18:34.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32086 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Upload trunk r31695:31699 Updates and fixes to sketch and extrude |
| 18:36.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32087 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (include/raytrace.h src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c): Upload trunk r31701 - more sketch updates |
| 18:38.44 | mafm | I go now, take care folks |
| 18:39.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32088 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/conv/g2asc.c: Upload trunk r31703 - g2asc tweak |
| 18:41.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32089 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (include/bu.h src/conv/CMakeLists.txt): r31721 comment, BU_BITV_ZEROALL requires #include <string.h> |
| 18:44.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32090 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: r31729 - sketch sanity checks |
| 18:46.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32091 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/proc-db/tire.c: r31736 - remove tire debugging printout |
| 18:51.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32092 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (BUGS src/librt/primitives/pipe/pipe.c): r31743-44 - fix pipe performance issue by eliminating BU_GETSTRUCT for hits, note about failure of toy jeep to triangulate |
| 18:55.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32093 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: r31772,31775 - fix for infinite loop when dbconcat was called with NO_AFFIX |
| 19:35.56 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo___ (n=chatzill@189.71.12.203) | |
| 20:02.15 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 20:07.39 | poolio | brlcad: Do you know if there is a way, given a 3d curve, to get the 2d trimming curve when projecting that 3d curve onto the surface? I'm thinking of just manually evaluating the control points, but was wondering if you knew of any opennurbs functionality like that? |
| 20:16.20 | brlcad | poolio: src/librt/opennurbs_ext.cpp |
| 20:16.35 | brlcad | pullback_curve() in particular |
| 20:17.16 | brlcad | very much green code |
| 20:17.21 | brlcad | but does exactly that |
| 20:17.45 | poolio | brlcad: ah, thanks |
| 20:17.59 | Ralith | >.< |
| 20:18.08 | Ralith | so my g++ has decided not to support exceptions for some reason. |
| 20:18.28 | brlcad | Ralith: odd |
| 20:18.53 | brlcad | gcc needs -fexceptions, but it should be enabled by default for g++ |
| 20:19.10 | Ralith | passing -fexceptions manually changes nothing |
| 20:19.25 | brlcad | then sounds like you might have some other problem.. |
| 20:20.27 | Ralith | serious one, too |
| 20:20.43 | Ralith | I can't properly test any of my changes until ogre works, and ogre depends on exceptions being catchable |
| 20:20.45 | poolio | brlcad: hmm, so that routine looks very imprecise. If I find the (u,v) for each of the 3d control points, will that work? |
| 20:21.05 | brlcad | poolio: imprecise how? |
| 20:21.23 | brlcad | make it more precise ;) |
| 20:21.33 | poolio | well, it's sampling and interpolating between points |
| 20:21.44 | poolio | By definition, isn't that inaccurate? |
| 20:22.22 | brlcad | of course it is, but what alternative approach did you have in mind? |
| 20:22.50 | brlcad | for two joined surfaces, there's definitely something better that can be done |
| 20:22.59 | brlcad | but for a single curve, single surface.. |
| 20:23.13 | poolio | Well, I have all the control points for the 3d curve, I just want to have a 2d curve that traces that 3d curve on a planar surface (note that the 3d curve is on the 3d plane) |
| 20:25.39 | brlcad | and.. how do you go about tracing that curve |
| 20:26.16 | poolio | So my real question is whether a curve defined by the same knots, but control points in a different dimension will match the 3d curve when the 2d control points are the (u,v) on the surface that corresponde to the (x,y,z) of the control points of the 3d curve |
| 20:26.33 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-83-99.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:30.00 | brlcad | hm |
| 20:32.32 | brlcad | if the surfaces have the same order and are planar, probably (at least that's the intuitive assumption) |
| 20:33.02 | brlcad | not sure about curved surfaces though |
| 20:33.18 | brlcad | actually don't think so for curved |
| 20:33.34 | poolio | wait, surfaces plural? I'm just doing one 3d curve on one surface |
| 20:33.52 | brlcad | just one surface |
| 20:34.12 | poolio | yeah, for planar I thought it would work. Maybe I'll just try it and see :) |
| 20:34.24 | Ralith | ahah! fixed my gcc. |
| 20:34.36 | brlcad | Ralith: congrat |
| 20:36.13 | Ralith | aaand g3d loads! :D |
| 20:36.20 | brlcad | woot |
| 20:40.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32094 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (BUGS TODO): r31791 - note primitive selection bug in mged |
| 20:41.30 | brlcad | starseeker: be sure to revert the cpa changes to src/rt/rtarea.c for release |
| 20:41.31 | Ralith | aaand latest svn doesn't build :/ |
| 20:42.22 | starseeker | brlcad: So we no longer want those to go in before the next release per the TODO? |
| 20:42.28 | Ralith | fixd. |
| 20:43.25 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, the center of presented area changes (from andre) modify the output format and hasn't been fully tested yet |
| 20:43.44 | starseeker | Ah, ok |
| 20:43.46 | brlcad | it needs to be a separate section in the file and coordianted with the s2 folks |
| 20:43.47 | starseeker | sorry |
| 20:43.51 | brlcad | since they rely on it |
| 20:43.54 | brlcad | you didn't know |
| 20:44.37 | starseeker | has probably bitten off way more than he can chew, but oh well - after all the chatter in IRC I have to make it work now :-) |
| 20:44.39 | brlcad | so since that's not done yet, just easier to revert it for now until it can be fixed |
| 20:45.00 | brlcad | Ralith: I see no commits to fix anything.. :) |
| 20:45.25 | Ralith | brlcad: that's because I'm polishing and killing unnecessary stuff still. |
| 20:45.52 | Ralith | e.g. OIS seems to work fine without the mouse tweaks |
| 20:46.00 | brlcad | ah, k |
| 20:47.01 | starseeker | me blinks - trunk doesn't have rtarea.c |
| 20:47.07 | starseeker | at least not in src/rt |
| 20:47.22 | starseeker | confound it, I missed that somehow |
| 20:48.20 | brlcad | no you didn't |
| 20:48.27 | brlcad | i said the wrong file |
| 20:48.34 | brlcad | all the rt's are view*.c |
| 20:48.38 | starseeker | ah |
| 20:48.39 | brlcad | viewarea.c |
| 20:49.03 | brlcad | they use the same front-end and back-end, just using different view files for behavior |
| 20:49.41 | poolio | brlcad: well it looks like there is no way in opennurbs to go from (x,y,z) -> (u,v) for a given surface :\ |
| 20:51.29 | brlcad | poolio: nope |
| 20:51.35 | brlcad | they don't have any evaluation routines |
| 20:51.47 | brlcad | seriously, that's what pullback does |
| 20:52.04 | brlcad | you could modify the algorithm to detect pullback onto a planar surface |
| 20:52.33 | brlcad | but that's the action of (x,y,z) -> (u,v) .. you pull back a 3D point into 2D uv space |
| 20:52.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32095 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (10 files in 2 dirs): revert r31046 from trunk, per advice from Sean - needs more testing |
| 20:53.16 | brlcad | there are other evaluation routines in opennurbs_ext.cpp .. built up from functionality (intentionally) missing from openNURBS |
| 20:53.57 | brlcad | they removed all evaluation routines specifically because they don't want the library to be used exactly the way we're using it -- at least they're not going to help |
| 20:54.26 | brlcad | they sell a product (Rhino SDK) that implements all the needed algorithms (via some of the best approaches) |
| 20:54.33 | poolio | Hmm, alright. It just seems like it shouldn't be this difficult...I have a 3d edge and I just want a face with the area it encloses |
| 20:58.49 | starseeker | poolio: <grin> There's the moon right there doggone it - I just want to go stand on it ;-) |
| 20:59.19 | poolio | starseeker: ... silly rabbit |
| 21:00.13 | poolio | brlcad: Do you know how the old nurbs code did it? The way they define the surfaces for the top and bottom of the tgc is by defining the rectangular surface and then defining a 3d curve. That's it |
| 21:00.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32096 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/Makefile: Improvements to portability and removal of explicit build from install targets |
| 21:00.32 | Ralith | :] |
| 21:00.50 | poolio | oh hey, Ralith's first commit? |
| 21:00.54 | Ralith | yep |
| 21:00.57 | poolio | ~Ralith++ |
| 21:01.02 | Ralith | :D |
| 21:02.47 | brlcad | starseeker: oh, and I need to revert an mged command too -- remind me when it's starts stabilizing |
| 21:02.56 | brlcad | ~ralith++ |
| 21:03.24 | starseeker | brlcad: Will do |
| 21:03.39 | brlcad | poolio: ah, and you need the 2D uv to define that surface |
| 21:03.52 | starseeker | is taking the naive approach of grabbing everything that looks like it might be appropriate, and then figuring out what broke |
| 21:04.02 | brlcad | poolio: that means there is a nurb_* pullback routine somewhere too |
| 21:04.23 | poolio | ah k. I'll mess around with pullback then |
| 21:04.29 | brlcad | though that's odd -- paul stay didn't finish trims |
| 21:04.40 | brlcad | odd that he'd use a trimmed surface |
| 21:05.22 | brlcad | poolio: and there should be a third implementation of pullback in boole too ;) |
| 21:06.20 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32097 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: Commit r31810 and r31811 (31810 got sucked into the previous commit) - regression test typo fix and ignore dsps with no data more gracefully. |
| 21:08.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32098 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: r31813 - clean up dsp warning messages |
| 21:10.32 | pacman87 | woohoo |
| 21:10.45 | pacman87 | finally got the union working |
| 21:10.55 | pacman87 | still needs more thorough testing |
| 21:11.08 | Ralith | hm. Anyone know the freenode channel for autotools? |
| 21:14.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32099 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 4 dirs): r31816, r31819-22 - cleanup, RFC822 format support |
| 21:15.30 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 21:16.21 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32100 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/other/tk/generic/tk.h: r31823 - fix to Tk for newer Xorg installations. |
| 21:18.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32101 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (Makefile.am include/conf/Makefile.am): r31831 - reset compilation time every time make is invoked |
| 21:19.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32102 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: r31834 - fix bug in dsp caught by solids regression test |
| 21:19.50 | brlcad | Ralith: #gnu iirc |
| 21:20.00 | brlcad | did you have a specific question, though? |
| 21:20.05 | brlcad | pretty strong expertise in here |
| 21:21.27 | Ralith | oh, I suppose there would be |
| 21:22.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32103 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libbu/parse.c: r31835 - use strcad instead of strcpy |
| 21:22.42 | Ralith | I could make my OIS fix a lot more elegant if I knew how to set a boolean, and include/exclude certain files from the build as well as define/leave undefined a preprocessor macro |
| 21:22.54 | Ralith | according to the state of that boolean |
| 21:24.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32104 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libbu/parse.c: r31837 - reactivate %S format in bu_structparse_argv |
| 21:24.50 | Ralith | that way I could define something along the lines of USE_JOYSTICK to false on all non-windows/linux platforms, exclude certain files from the build entirely (removing the messy entire file #ifdef hack my patch used) and use a feature-specific rather than platform-specific #define in config.h for the files that need to be only partially modified |
| 21:26.16 | Ralith | I could hack up something to provide the preprocessor macro via cflags from a ./configure check for the linux joystick headers, but that's still pretty inelegant |
| 21:26.27 | Ralith | and would probably break windows joysticks |
| 21:29.51 | Ralith | I think all I need to do is make conditional the contents of libOIS_la_SOURCES from src/Makefile.am and the value of a new config.h #define |
| 21:30.37 | Ralith | preferably through the same mechanism, such that no situation could produce a case in which the files were added but the macro was defined false |
| 21:30.42 | Ralith | or vis versa |
| 21:30.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32105 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (8 files in 5 dirs): push USE_PROTOTYPES up into common.h, push USE_FBSERV into dm.h |
| 21:31.52 | brlcad | catchs up and reads |
| 21:37.20 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14DB05.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:42.29 | brlcad | Ralith: is it OIS that's using GBS? |
| 21:42.55 | brlcad | the src/other/Makefile is temporary until someone(tm) can hook up proper build system integration |
| 21:43.10 | brlcad | that gets at the cmake comments I made yesterday |
| 21:52.03 | Ralith | it's OIS, yes |
| 21:52.41 | Ralith | I didn't worry about elegance when fixing up the generic makefile for exactly that reason |
| 22:02.00 | brlcad | nods |
| 22:02.12 | brlcad | yeah, I wouldn't worry about the clean fix for their build system |
| 22:02.47 | brlcad | absolute minimum effort to make them work (which sometimes is "replace their build system") |
| 22:05.43 | brlcad | in that specific case, what will be interesting is how cmake can be configured to optionally compile a sub-project that is gbs-based |
| 22:06.44 | brlcad | ois is pretty small at least, so worse case is write a cmake build for them (presuming we stick with cmake instead of gbs ourselves) |
| 22:13.56 | Ralith | kk |
| 22:14.00 | Ralith | dirty hack it is |
| 22:15.56 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@pool-72-74-102-223.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 22:20.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32106 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/ois/src/linux/ (4 files): Dirty hacks to make OIS build on FreeBSD until upstream ports joystick support properly |
| 22:30.15 | Ralith | Anybody familiar with cmake? |
| 22:32.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32107 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/mocha/ (6 files in 3 dirs): FreeBSD support for Mocha |
| 22:41.30 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.12.203) | |
| 22:46.31 | *** join/#brlcad jonored_ (n=jonored@pool-72-74-102-223.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 22:48.14 | stustev | good evening gentlemen - I have a good handle on the variables - I am able to write a script using variables and create geometry. I have a question about patterns this evening. The example in the documentation stops as if some pages are left out. I am talking about the cylindrical pattern example. The other patterns are not very clear about the implementation but the cylinder pattern seems to stop short. Can anyone point me to a completed |
| 22:53.57 | *** part/#brlcad stustev (n=stustev@ip72-205-246-167.ks.ks.cox.net) | |
| 22:56.42 | *** join/#brlcad jonored__ (n=jonored@pool-72-74-102-223.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 23:08.06 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 23:08.54 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@pool-72-74-102-223.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 23:42.25 | starseeker | stustev: I would suggest looking at clone for patterning geometry |
| 23:42.32 | brlcad | he left |
| 23:42.40 | starseeker | ah |
| 23:42.55 | starseeker | notes scrollback after the fact |
| 23:43.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32108 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 4 dirs): r31882-85 misc tweaks, doc updates |
| 23:45.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32109 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (libtclcad/Makefile.am other/blt/Makefile.am): r31904-5 - update blt dependancy information |
| 23:47.29 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32110 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 2 dirs): r31909-13 - merge rt_simple into rtexample, configure.ac tweak |
| 23:49.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32111 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (configure.ac include/vmath.h src/librtserver/rtserver.c): r31932-34 add V2ADD3 to vmath.h, typo fix, rtserver cleanup |
| 23:55.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32112 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (NEWS src/proc-db/tire.c): r31935,36,46,93 - fix accidental tread clipping and jagged edge. |
| 23:57.21 | *** join/#brlcad stustev (n=stustev@ip72-205-246-167.ks.ks.cox.net) | |
| 00:05.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32113 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (7 files in 5 dirs): r31957-66 misc updates by brlcad |
| 00:18.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32114 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): r31968-77 selective merging of updates to librt and librtserver |
| 00:20.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32115 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/sh/cmakecheck.sh: Add cmakecheck.sh (r31980-81) |
| 00:24.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32116 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (11 files in 11 dirs): r31983 - add svn properties for CMake lists |
| 00:26.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32117 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 4 dirs): r31985-91 various updates - pipe primitive and make logic |
| 00:28.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32118 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/librtserver/ (rtserver.c rtserverTest.c): r32059-60 rtserver updates |
| 00:29.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32119 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (librt/prep.c librtserver/rtserver.c): r32061-62 more rtserver updates |
| 00:30.56 | brlcad | 19:42 < starseeker> stustev: I would suggest looking at clone for patterning geometry |
| 00:31.36 | brlcad | it's invariably more easily scriptable for procedure development than the gui pattern tool |
| 00:32.49 | starseeker | reaches the end of the svn trunk log (give or take the new kill stuff) and stops to see how bad the damages are |
| 00:32.50 | brlcad | almost has mged working so it'll invoke as an icon/shortcut for linux/mac without thinking it's in non-interactive mode |
| 00:33.03 | starseeker | cool! |
| 00:33.11 | starseeker | may have spoken too soon... |
| 00:36.37 | stustev | brlcad: thanks - I will look at it |
| 00:39.00 | stustev | I would still like to learn the pattern commands though. |
| 00:39.52 | starseeker | is more likely at this point to write a new pattern tool and document that - the interface on the old one is non-intuitive even by MGED standards |
| 00:45.00 | stustev | that sounds like a marvelous idea |
| 00:46.51 | starseeker | it's a lot of work though, and brlcad has me doing more useful stuff at the moment... |
| 00:51.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32120 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/configure.ac: First tweaks to configure to let it know about the docbook libpc dirs - start looking at what havoc all the merges did. |
| 00:52.07 | *** join/#brlcad iday (n=jlowens@c-68-55-215-195.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 01:16.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32121 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/include/bu.h: |
| 01:16.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Grab the renaming of bu_structparse_get_terse_form, etc. in bu.h from r31595 - |
| 01:16.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: have this in libbu via one of the updates. If it doesn't harm anything else |
| 01:16.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: it's a logical renaming based on the use of Tcl_Interp in the functions, |
| 01:16.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: otherwise need to revert both this and the corresponding libbu changes. |
| 01:35.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32122 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (6 files in 5 dirs): Merge in changes r31595 and 31609 - libbu compiles now. |
| 01:45.06 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:16.02 | pacman87 | old: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt20.png |
| 02:16.03 | pacman87 | new: https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt21.png |
| 02:27.51 | Ralith | how's new work? |
| 02:28.05 | Ralith | union? |
| 02:28.12 | pacman87 | yes |
| 02:28.47 | Ralith | that's where you have something like [===|=] where | is x=0? |
| 02:28.54 | Ralith | and rotate it >180 degrees? |
| 02:29.03 | pacman87 | yes |
| 02:29.09 | pacman87 | 270 there |
| 02:29.11 | Ralith | cool |
| 02:37.11 | starseeker | ooooohhh crap |
| 02:41.32 | Ralith | ? |
| 02:46.40 | starseeker | has more of the libged stuff mixed in than he intended |
| 02:50.41 | starseeker | well, I can do it the hard way I suppose - start from the 7.12.4 release and check each change for breakage |
| 03:38.37 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 03:44.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32123 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/current_successful_compile_rev.txt: Add file to record last revision verified to have built - will go away later, just for convenience now. |
| 03:45.37 | starseeker | alright, I'm outta here |
| 03:51.34 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 03:51.57 | brlcad | teh awesome |
| 03:52.16 | brlcad | almost time for another showcase :) |
| 03:52.51 | pacman87 | showcase? |
| 04:10.13 | brlcad | to share some of the results with users |
| 04:10.26 | brlcad | (nothing for you to do) |
| 04:10.30 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 04:10.47 | pacman87 | just fyi, revolve is still limited to straight line sketches |
| 04:11.11 | pacman87 | i wanted to get that all ironed out before it gets too complicated |
| 04:11.26 | brlcad | yep, got that |
| 04:11.39 | brlcad | tis a great approach |
| 04:11.54 | pacman87 | and i'm having some odd 'flipped normals detected' |
| 04:12.14 | pacman87 | i can't quite figure out exactly what's causing them |
| 04:12.18 | brlcad | that usually means that the hit points being returned from shot() aren't sorted |
| 04:13.20 | brlcad | an exit before an entry for the given shotline .. or a problem actually in norm() |
| 04:13.34 | pacman87 | i think it's in norm() |
| 04:13.58 | pacman87 | does it ever ask for the normal for a hit other than the first one? |
| 04:14.13 | brlcad | rt doesn't |
| 04:14.25 | brlcad | but the "first one" might be wrong if they're not sorted right from shot() |
| 04:14.41 | pacman87 | ok, i'll look at that again |
| 04:15.15 | pacman87 | for a revolve about Z, i use x/y coords, plus the slope of the line at the hitpoint |
| 04:16.17 | pacman87 | but that doesnt tell me which way is out from the surface |
| 04:17.46 | pacman87 | so i end up doing my own dot test between normal direction and ray direction to see if i should flip |
| 04:17.58 | pacman87 | which assumes only the first hit's normal is used |
| 04:19.21 | brlcad | noteworthy: "Subversion service will be offline on 2008-07-30 from 17:00 Pacific for not more than 12 hours to permit a rebuild of the storage used by the service, followed by further performance tuning." |
| 04:20.20 | pacman87 | is there a way to check whether a hitpoint is an 'in' or an 'out'? |
| 04:20.24 | brlcad | that should be a fair assumption |
| 04:21.18 | brlcad | obviously shouldn't be going away from the ray direction, should be coming back towards it |
| 04:21.29 | pacman87 | right, that's what i'm doing |
| 04:22.35 | brlcad | there's not really a fixed solution to check, primitive-specific -- usually, though, the logic goes into shot() and it just makes sure there is the right parity and ordering |
| 04:22.45 | brlcad | so norm can just pop off the first hit and return the normal |
| 04:22.53 | brlcad | there is an rt flag to debug normals |
| 04:26.17 | brlcad | various ways to do it using either nirt or rt, the trick being to just fire a single ray so you're not drowned in data and use the -x option |
| 04:26.33 | brlcad | various debug flags listed in include/raytrace.h, -x2 being useful for this |
| 04:26.50 | brlcad | it'll tell you the in/out segments |
| 04:27.39 | pacman87 | the thing is, the normal direction is right, so it's shaded properly; it's just reversed |
| 04:28.06 | brlcad | nirt -x2 something.g your_object .. then there are a slew of interactive commands for shooting from az/el's of interest for example |
| 04:28.37 | brlcad | rt trys to compensate when it gets a flipped normal by flipping it for you |
| 04:28.45 | brlcad | it does the same dot check |
| 04:39.06 | Ralith | hm, something's wrong with nirt's manpage |
| 04:39.45 | Ralith | <standard input>:785: cannot use character `1' as a starting delimiter |
| 04:42.49 | pacman87 | ah, i think i found it |
| 04:43.09 | pacman87 | paying attention to the surfno in the flipped normals error is helpful |
| 04:43.39 | pacman87 | my initial assumption that the sketch was always +x is coming back to bite me |
| 04:57.45 | brlcad | ah |
| 04:57.59 | brlcad | Ralith: there are only so many 1's in there, maybe you can pinpoint it? :) |
| 04:58.46 | brlcad | ah, I found it |
| 04:59.12 | brlcad | knows not what h does |
| 04:59.17 | Ralith | I was going to |
| 04:59.19 | Ralith | but then you found it |
| 04:59.30 | Ralith | commitstealer. >_> |
| 04:59.47 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:07.32 | pacman87 | success! |
| 05:07.50 | brlcad | ~pacman87++ |
| 05:07.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32124 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.1: fix the manpage so it doesn't have a \h 1 delimiter error. snarf a .FN macro to list the files |
| 05:08.39 | starseeker | returns to home base |
| 05:11.11 | brlcad | starseeker: wow, long day :) |
| 05:11.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32125 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fbed/fbed.1: apply the .FN macro |
| 05:11.25 | brlcad | was thinking about maybe heading in soon |
| 05:11.27 | starseeker | is ready to admit he probably went about the release prep the wrong way |
| 05:11.35 | starseeker | heh - figures |
| 05:11.40 | brlcad | my shedule is about 12 hours off sync now |
| 05:11.53 | pacman87 | brlcad: move to new zealand |
| 05:11.59 | starseeker | at this rate, I'll show up about when you leave ;-) |
| 05:12.04 | brlcad | pacman87: heh |
| 05:12.15 | brlcad | usually operates on west coast US time |
| 05:12.45 | starseeker | is agast that subversion will be down - bad timing! |
| 05:13.19 | starseeker | just when I'm going back and checking incrementally |
| 05:13.20 | pacman87 | set up your own svn on brlcad's server? |
| 05:13.34 | starseeker | could grab a git repo |
| 05:13.38 | starseeker | or make one rather |
| 05:14.21 | starseeker | brlcad: At least make fun of my release prep so I don't feel so newbish |
| 05:15.33 | brlcad | or just build up into a bigger commit since you're on a branch, it's probably not worth the effort to do anything else but wait |
| 05:16.02 | brlcad | starseeker: make fun of it? heh |
| 05:16.10 | brlcad | it is rather .. methodical :) |
| 05:16.36 | brlcad | but good experience reviewing/merging changes too |
| 05:16.51 | starseeker | idiotic - I should have checked incrementally. I sucked in some libged stuff without intending to, and now it's well and truly foobared |
| 05:17.21 | brlcad | you can undo individual ranges if you know the revision numbers |
| 05:17.38 | starseeker | nods |
| 05:17.44 | brlcad | svn merge -rstart:end |
| 05:18.14 | starseeker | once I find the first breakage commit, that's probably what I'll do |
| 05:18.15 | brlcad | where start would be the newest and end the pre-commit state -- that reverts the change |
| 05:19.04 | starseeker | cool |
| 05:19.16 | starseeker | did that a couple times when he grabbed the wrong range |
| 05:20.15 | starseeker | I'm guessing I started to go off base when I merged in the primitive reorg - hyp and friends probably snuck in |
| 05:20.47 | pacman87 | aww, poor hyp didn't want to be left out of the fun ;) |
| 05:20.55 | starseeker | heh :-) |
| 05:21.23 | starseeker | it's not quite ready for stable - that's most of the challenge for this release, and the reason it requires a branch |
| 05:21.34 | starseeker | trunk has a lot of stuff in flux right now |
| 05:21.34 | pacman87 | i understand |
| 05:22.52 | pacman87 | if i have spare time during the 'finalize week', i'll look into finishing the todo for hyp |
| 05:22.59 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 05:23.10 | pacman87 | when's the release date? |
| 05:23.40 | starseeker | whenever I get the branch straightened out and tested - probably sometime next week at this rate |
| 05:24.01 | starseeker | doesn't even want to think about the Windows build... |
| 05:24.38 | starseeker | brlcad: If you do go in soon, watch out for the deer - I must have seen four or five on the way out |
| 05:24.38 | pacman87 | just use (wine)^-1 |
| 05:24.51 | starseeker | heh |
| 05:25.03 | pacman87 | translate from linux to windows calls |
| 05:25.24 | Ralith | that's called mingw |
| 05:25.56 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, it's always that way after about 10pm |
| 05:26.56 | pacman87 | "Students can begin submitting required code samples to Google" - from gsoc timeline |
| 05:26.58 | brlcad | i don't know that i've ever not seen one traveling between 10pm and 4am |
| 05:27.12 | pacman87 | what's that mean? |
| 05:27.28 | brlcad | pacman87: you upload code you've worked on |
| 05:28.02 | brlcad | that's technically your actual legal responsibility per the arrangement in place, that's what they pay you for |
| 05:28.17 | pacman87 | hmm, don't remmeber reading that part |
| 05:28.25 | pacman87 | and i though i read through the whole think |
| 05:28.27 | pacman87 | thing* |
| 05:28.29 | brlcad | which can be anything really, usually a tarball of files you've worked on, or svn diffs |
| 05:28.37 | starseeker | thinks dark thoughts about venison burgers and realizes he probably needs sleep |
| 05:30.52 | brlcad | crazy talk |
| 05:31.21 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32126 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (7 files in 5 dirs): apply the same FN macro changes consistently to the (surprisingly few) manual pages that have a FILES section. |
| 05:31.36 | starseeker | my grandfather used to hunt - venison meat is actually pretty darn tasty when prepared right |
| 05:32.19 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:33.15 | brlcad | one of the guys (that you haven't met yet) that used to work next to where you're sitting would bring in deer sticks and deer steaks from time to time, delicious |
| 05:33.42 | starseeker | :-) |
| 05:34.26 | starseeker | wants to read the slashdot LaTeX article but remembers he needs to be present at a presentation tomorrow... |
| 05:34.40 | starseeker | brlcad: Incidently, thanks for reviewing that for her |
| 05:34.43 | pacman87 | present and alert, or just present? |
| 05:35.05 | starseeker | snores, so at a minimum I need to be awake |
| 05:35.12 | brlcad | grrrr... |
| 05:35.12 | brlcad | data is pending on stdin |
| 05:35.12 | brlcad | DATA is: [] |
| 05:35.26 | starseeker | that's... odd |
| 05:35.48 | pacman87 | wonders how he lived for so long without knowing shitf+left/right arrow to change konsole tabs |
| 05:48.49 | Ralith | I don't understand the complaints some people have about LaTeX |
| 05:49.41 | Ralith | for me at least, it had very little learning curve (largely thanks to google) and behaved wonderfully for everything short of long URLs, which it can't seem to work out when to break. |
| 05:54.19 | pacman87 | brlcad: i'd rather keep " [ (x*x) / aa^2 ] - [ (y-h)^2 / bb^2 ] = 1 " in a comment in revolve, so i can remember where my variables are used in the formula for a hyperbola |
| 06:01.42 | pacman87 | ctrl+z just saved my life |
| 06:03.39 | brlcad | pacman87: ok .. am I supposed to object to useful comments? :) |
| 06:04.00 | pacman87 | you deleted it with the rest of the old code |
| 06:04.11 | brlcad | many of them spell out their equations, it's a good thing |
| 06:04.15 | brlcad | ooh, that wasn't intentional |
| 06:04.23 | brlcad | it was more the code |
| 06:04.31 | brlcad | sorry about that |
| 06:07.27 | pacman87 | np, but i'm pretty sure that line isnt' valid C when uncommented ;) |
| 06:07.59 | brlcad | depends on what cpp macros are defines ;) |
| 06:08.29 | brlcad | s/defines/defined/ |
| 06:08.56 | pacman87 | ok, maybe. but even if that was valid, it'd be horrible coding practice |
| 06:09.55 | brlcad | indeed |
| 06:10.01 | brlcad | obfuscated fun |
| 06:10.11 | brlcad | ugh, the is horrible .. select says there is data waiting on stdin .. but there's nothing to read |
| 06:10.29 | brlcad | that's seriously screwing with detecting whether we're interactive or not |
| 06:10.56 | pacman87 | how hard would it be to add mged history between sessions? |
| 06:12.02 | brlcad | not too hard, could probably keep a .mged_history file with a few variables to control it |
| 06:12.31 | pacman87 | i find myself exiting to do make && make install |
| 06:12.34 | pacman87 | then restarting |
| 06:12.42 | pacman87 | and wanting to run the same commands again |
| 06:13.05 | pacman87 | i've been using ; to seperate commands on a line |
| 06:13.08 | brlcad | yeah, that's be pretty useful |
| 06:13.10 | pacman87 | and shift+insert |
| 06:22.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r32127 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/ (revolve/revolve.c sketch/sketch.c): |
| 06:22.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: change revolve to use a union instead of an xor when the -X and +X sides of a |
| 06:22.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: revolve overlap (ie, angle > 180). also, modify norm() to give the proper |
| 06:22.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: vector direction when the start/end surface is hit on a point with a -X |
| 06:22.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: coordinate. |
| 06:22.12 | pacman87 | that took way longer than it should've |
| 06:22.31 | pacman87 | i need more practice merging |
| 06:23.09 | pacman87 | almost completely wiped out my changes, then wiped out the other updates, and had to merge by hand |
| 06:23.30 | pacman87 | and being past 1am probably had something to do with it |
| 06:23.38 | pacman87 | anyway, goodnight |
| 06:23.42 | brlcad | or could work on a direct checkout too ;) |
| 06:23.53 | brlcad | avoid the hassle altogether |
| 06:24.16 | pacman87 | i usually do |
| 06:24.32 | brlcad | so why not? |
| 06:24.52 | pacman87 | well, if i'm working and you commit changes, i'll have to merge, right |
| 06:24.53 | pacman87 | ? |
| 06:25.25 | brlcad | ah, you mean actually just dealing with svn update merging, conflicts, etc? |
| 06:25.30 | pacman87 | yes |
| 06:25.34 | brlcad | ah, misunderstood |
| 06:25.41 | brlcad | though you were merging from a separate copy |
| 06:25.51 | pacman87 | since i'm usually the only one working on my files, i rarely have to deal with it |
| 06:26.00 | pacman87 | i think maybe three times so far |
| 06:26.04 | brlcad | ah |
| 06:26.11 | pacman87 | and most of those were oneliners |
| 06:26.12 | brlcad | shame that you can actually count the times |
| 06:26.32 | brlcad | what's really cool is seeing a half dozen guys all hit the same file simultaneously trying to get something done fast |
| 06:26.41 | pacman87 | sounds scary |
| 06:26.56 | brlcad | you end up wanting to svn up faster than you save |
| 06:27.18 | brlcad | really cool watching the file grow, though |
| 06:27.37 | pacman87 | so long as everyone know what part they're doing |
| 06:27.47 | brlcad | just wish it could be done live -- like with shared emacs editing sessions very cool to watch code just grow live in front of you |
| 06:27.58 | brlcad | two people editing the same line simultaneously |
| 06:28.00 | pacman87 | that would be cool |
| 06:28.10 | brlcad | it works, it's just a pita to set up |
| 06:28.28 | pacman87 | use comments to discuss code |
| 06:28.34 | brlcad | subethaedit folks also have it working, but for lan-only |
| 06:28.53 | brlcad | yeah, like google docs, but for code |
| 06:29.51 | pacman87 | really should be asleep, have fun playing with/trying to break revolve |
| 06:29.56 | brlcad | now if someone made a module to eclipse for that, I'd seriously revisit a switch .. something that keeps you continuously up to date with live code updates (line by line) |
| 06:30.01 | brlcad | hehe, k |
| 06:30.17 | pacman87 | too bad i can't distcc sleep |
| 06:30.35 | pacman87 | everyone else in the house is asleep, i'd be perfect |
| 06:30.48 | brlcad | :) |
| 06:31.07 | brlcad | the answer to that is to wake everyone else up, then go to bed |
| 06:31.37 | brlcad | yay, progress |
| 06:31.55 | brlcad | stdin has an exception pending in addition to select saying it's ready for reading |
| 06:32.07 | brlcad | even though feof and ferror are clear |
| 06:34.20 | brlcad | and NOW I run across a DDD snippet that does exactly what I just implemented |
| 06:37.30 | brlcad | consults the stevens bible |
| 07:12.38 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 07:13.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32128 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: restore the other portion of the comment that I accidentally blew away |
| 07:21.36 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:26.43 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:52.42 | d_rossberg | pacman87: i would recommend to initialize "angle" in rt_revolve_shot before using it |
| 08:00.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32129 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: some modifications to be consistent with Makefile.am |
| 08:04.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32130 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: presumably which.c, not which |
| 08:06.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32131 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: (log message trimmed) |
| 08:06.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: significant change to mged's initialization. instead of using the (flawed) |
| 08:06.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: approach of using isatty() to determine if we're interactive, make interactive |
| 08:06.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the default mode and find a reason to not be interactive. this is done by |
| 08:06.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: checking for command-mode args or redirected standard input. the latter one in |
| 08:06.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: particular was tricky given some means to invoke the application might leave the |
| 08:06.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: stdin read fd set even though there may be no data. this was specifically |
| 08:09.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32132 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 08:09.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: make it possible to have mged invoked without needing a controlling terminal |
| 08:09.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: (e.g. as an icon or menu item). this specifically supports sf bug report |
| 08:09.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 2019280 (mged incorrectly deduces interactivity) from lode_leroy where he tried |
| 08:09.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: to create a linux mged.desktop icon. was previously using a flawed approach |
| 08:09.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: that assumed being invoked from a controlling terminal. |
| 08:24.24 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:24.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32133 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 08:24.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: bu_log() and friends use %S for bu_vls structures. this was |
| 08:24.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: implemented long before libc decided to use it as an alias for %ls to |
| 08:24.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: support wchar_t strings. we should migrate to something else unused |
| 08:24.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: (like %V). somewhat non-trivial effort to deprecate and update even |
| 08:24.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: our own uses safely. |
| 08:26.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32134 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: minor cleanup. quell warnings, add some headers. |
| 08:43.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32135 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/CMakeLists.txt: |
| 08:43.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: stab in the dark. add the entire include directory to the run-time library |
| 08:43.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: package so that folks can compile against the libraries. this was requested by |
| 08:43.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: tom browder (ajem) in sf feature request 2019346 (Run-time Library Packaging). |
| 08:51.22 | d_rossberg | if it would be so easy i would have already done it |
| 08:51.28 | d_rossberg | ;) |
| 08:52.04 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:02.38 | mafm | hey |
| 09:06.37 | Ralith | hey mafm |
| 09:06.41 | Ralith | got g3d working :] |
| 09:07.00 | Ralith | had fun rotating your occluded wireframe |
| 09:07.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32136 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): deprecate the duplicitous '-n' (not-new) option to mged. use -c console/classic/command option instead. |
| 09:07.17 | mafm | yup, I saw it |
| 09:07.21 | mafm | congrats :) |
| 09:07.41 | Ralith | although either your 'zoom' actually moves the camera around or your near clipping plane is set unreasonably |
| 09:07.49 | Ralith | cuz the example object dissapears after very little zooming in |
| 09:08.33 | mafm | I don't set the near clipping plane, so it must be ogre defaults |
| 09:08.42 | Ralith | (also, random though -- perhaps you could optionally render places where the near clipping plane intersects with an object as a specially colored surface?) |
| 09:08.47 | mafm | but the zoom actually moves the camera, yes |
| 09:09.12 | Ralith | mightn't literally zooming in be preferable? |
| 09:09.32 | Ralith | alternatively, consider logarythmic progression of zoom towards/away from the point on which the camera is centered. |
| 09:11.25 | mafm | I only discovered the zooming (by modifying size of window camera) yesterday, so the rest is implemented with distances |
| 09:11.44 | Ralith | but what're your thoughts on the Correct Way? |
| 09:11.57 | Ralith | btw, I'm happy to try implementing this myself, if you like |
| 09:13.30 | mafm | dunno what's the correct way, I'm still fighting to implement some of the MGED's functionalities |
| 09:14.27 | mafm | and trying to mimic them (Blender and MGED), althought the numeric approaches -zoom increments and so on- might not be always the more adequate |
| 09:14.50 | mafm | so maybe things like log() are more adequate, who knows |
| 09:14.55 | Ralith | I think both zoom and camera movement should probably be supported |
| 09:15.07 | Ralith | though I'm not sure how to do so elegantly |
| 09:15.44 | Ralith | for orthographic views it doesn't matter much, but once we start mapping g3d camera -> render config, this might become important |
| 09:16.37 | Ralith | I've got to go for the night -- if you've got any thoughts, including things that I could work on now that I've got commit access, I'd be interested to hear them in email. |
| 09:17.33 | mafm | ok |
| 09:17.51 | mafm | the thing is that I'm still fighting my way to finish some of the milestones for gsoc |
| 09:18.12 | mafm | I don't know if your work in some of the areas would be considered interfering or not |
| 09:18.24 | mafm | probably not from brlcad's (the person) point of view |
| 09:18.32 | Ralith | sean mentioned that collaboration was encouraged by gsoc |
| 09:18.42 | Ralith | I'm not sure of the specifics |
| 09:19.06 | mafm | you have my plans in the wiki page |
| 09:19.11 | Ralith | but I'm eager to work on whatever I can there. |
| 09:19.27 | Ralith | specifics insofar as the difference between collaboration and interference. |
| 09:19.27 | mafm | I'm now trying to make a widget from rbgui, mged mode needs to be finished |
| 09:19.50 | Ralith | I'm hesitant to pick work items off your TODO list for that reason |
| 09:19.58 | mafm | also Sean wants me to make a binary release |
| 09:20.09 | Ralith | tweaks and elaborations on what's already there are another matter |
| 09:20.18 | Ralith | anyway |
| 09:20.19 | mafm | and another thing that I can't remember at the moment |
| 09:20.22 | Ralith | we can discuss this more later |
| 09:20.24 | Ralith | gtg |
| 09:20.27 | Ralith | good luck |
| 09:20.31 | mafm | okay, g'night! |
| 09:20.33 | mafm | :) |
| 09:34.19 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_ub (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 09:44.57 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F60E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
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| 12:58.15 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 12:59.55 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 13:00.14 | brlcad | ponders taking a nap or heading in |
| 13:01.44 | yukonbob | gets ready to head to work... |
| 13:03.48 | yukonbob | ...and heads out. |
| 13:04.10 | yukonbob | bbl. Hope everybody has a good day... |
| 13:07.35 | brlcad | likewise! |
| 13:11.07 | brlcad | mafm: absolutely, you should put him to work given he's interested (and capable) |
| 13:11.44 | brlcad | it's all about grooming new devs, not reaching some end-of-summer project goal |
| 13:13.23 | brlcad | there's nothing he could do that will negatively reflect on you no matter how much you collaborate (nor what he screws up) |
| 13:14.16 | brlcad | ideally if this wasn't such a busy summer, all the devs would have been heavily coordinating with other devs on their projects throughout |
| 13:34.59 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.126.249) | |
| 13:52.55 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there any way to run filemerge on OSX from the command line, supplying the two files as arguments? |
| 13:53.51 | brlcad | dunno |
| 13:53.52 | brlcad | probably |
| 13:54.00 | brlcad | run the binary directly |
| 13:54.54 | brlcad | tries |
| 13:55.39 | brlcad | doesn't look like it |
| 13:55.57 | brlcad | would have to script it via applescript |
| 13:58.23 | starseeker | ick |
| 13:58.33 | starseeker | likes xxdiff |
| 14:00.20 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 14:01.32 | starseeker | brlcad: ah - does opendiff work? |
| 14:02.08 | starseeker | reads man page on web and is hopeful |
| 14:02.23 | starseeker | that would increase the utility of FileMerge considerably |
| 14:02.32 | starseeker | OK, time to get in there |
| 14:13.49 | starseeker | note to self - check this out: http://ssel.vub.ac.be/ssel/internal:fmdiff |
| 14:24.58 | brlcad | ah yeah, opendiff does it |
| 14:25.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32137 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/CMakeLists.txt: undo previous change, it breaks the CMake build (add_subdirectory has to point to a directory containing a CMakeLists.txt file) and has no effect on the *_devel package |
| 14:26.26 | brlcad | oopses |
| 14:26.36 | brlcad | blind stab ftl |
| 14:29.18 | d_rossberg | commented your commit here in the irc |
| 14:30.01 | d_rossberg | i've created a package which includes the header files |
| 14:32.21 | brlcad | yeah, I read it .. but didn't imply that it was a totally failed attempt :) |
| 14:32.52 | brlcad | took it as "incomplete", was just busy processing to comment at the time |
| 15:02.45 | andrecastelo | good morning all |
| 15:03.15 | pacman87 | morning, andrecastelo |
| 15:03.50 | andrecastelo | i've been looking at the light sources creation, using light_maker(), in sh_light.c and it doesn't set a specific position for the light |
| 15:04.15 | andrecastelo | makes sense, since default light rays give the impression of being parallel.. |
| 15:04.30 | andrecastelo | it does, however, set up the direction of the light |
| 15:04.56 | andrecastelo | is it safe to make the secondary rays point in the opposite direction? |
| 15:06.21 | andrecastelo | when the light list is not empty, I get the first element position though |
| 15:11.52 | pacman87 | secondary rays for shadows? |
| 15:15.54 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 15:16.04 | andrecastelo | the ones that i shoot after the first hit |
| 15:20.23 | pacman87 | then yes, the secondary rays would point opposite to the light direction |
| 15:20.35 | pacman87 | the question now is 'how far away is the light source'? |
| 15:24.25 | andrecastelo | why? i think that at the moment it doesn't matter |
| 15:25.29 | pacman87 | i guess you could assume the light source is infinately far away |
| 15:26.23 | pacman87 | you need distance to the light in order to determine whether the first intersection of your secondary ray is before or after you get to the light source |
| 15:30.09 | andrecastelo | hmm.. true |
| 15:30.55 | pacman87 | though for default illumination, putting it at infinity is probably fine |
| 15:48.52 | mafm | brlcad: so he can chime in and work on *anything*? |
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| 16:04.37 | pacman87 | primitives/arb8/arb8.c:1771: error: conflicting types for 'rt_arb_calc_planes' |
| 16:41.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32138 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: Minor mods to get things compiling. :-) |
| 16:58.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32139 10/brlcad/trunk/ (19 files in 4 dirs): Convert more dg_obj commands for use by libged (i.e. rtcheck, rtabort, importFg4Section and vdraw. |
| 17:58.56 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.192.19) | |
| 18:31.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32140 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/: |
| 18:35.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32141 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/: |
| 18:36.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32142 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/: |
| 18:37.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32143 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/: |
| 18:37.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32144 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/title.c: Fixed typo. |
| 18:38.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32145 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractThread/: |
| 18:42.29 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32146 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/stractNet/: |
| 18:58.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32147 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/tol.c: Mods to allow getting individual tolerance settings. |
| 19:00.48 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 19:05.31 | mafm | hi Ralith |
| 19:05.51 | mafm | I was about to write you, but basically: you can work on anything you want |
| 19:07.54 | *** join/#brlcad paroneayea (n=user@fsf/member/paroneayea) | |
| 19:08.11 | mafm | Ralith: preferably if it's not something in what I'm working on without agreement ;) you have the list of what I do in the wiki |
| 19:09.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32148 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/summary.c: Minor alteration of the error message. |
| 19:09.55 | Ralith | mafm: so leave the stuff on the wiki alone? |
| 19:10.43 | mafm | You can work in things like platform/compilation support, if that pleases you |
| 19:11.00 | mafm | including to make releases, is one of the things that Sean wanted to see |
| 19:11.47 | mafm | if you want to work with cameras as you suggested before, I can also delegate, but it's something that I was working on actively and some things are not finished yet (e.g. some MGED constrained modes) |
| 19:12.30 | mafm | so I think that either you or me do it, but not both at the same time (because I think that involves some possible heavy refactoring/redesign) |
| 19:12.59 | mafm | now I'm trying to create a window to control the camera, using some custom widgets |
| 19:13.15 | mafm | and the last remaining part is to start showing real geometry, using libged |
| 19:14.33 | mafm | Ralith: http://brlcad.org/wiki/User:Mafm#To_finish_GSoC (and the log, in the bottom, might be also interesting for you) |
| 19:14.38 | mafm | I have to go now, see you! :) |
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| 19:53.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32149 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/showmats.c: Flesh out the showmats command. |
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| 19:54.17 | poolio | stabs a tgc |
| 20:08.50 | *** join/#brlcad Rigolo (n=rigolo@cc14973-d.zwoll1.ov.home.nl) | |
| 20:08.57 | Rigolo | good evening ... |
| 20:15.29 | *** join/#brlcad saltan (n=lievensa@d51530284.access.telenet.be) | |
| 20:15.45 | Rigolo | good evening ... |
| 20:16.00 | saltan | evening all |
| 20:16.13 | Rigolo | well .. all ... |
| 20:16.29 | Rigolo | has been her now for a few minutes .. and nobody talks :-) |
| 20:16.36 | saltan | evening some |
| 20:16.36 | Rigolo | untill you joined |
| 20:16.57 | Rigolo | saltan: can I ask you a BRL-CAD conversion question? |
| 20:17.11 | saltan | please do but not an expert |
| 20:17.32 | Rigolo | knows noting about BRL-CAD ... so everybody in my is the expert |
| 20:17.45 | Rigolo | have you ever heard about the openmoko project? |
| 20:18.05 | jonored | grins and covets. |
| 20:18.22 | saltan | No, can't say that I have |
| 20:18.26 | starseeker | Rigolo: If you're asking about converting their cad files to BRL-CAD, we can convert the IGES files - sort of |
| 20:18.42 | Rigolo | starseeker: that was indeed my question .. :-) |
| 20:19.15 | Rigolo | on their wiki they are looking for other formats than what they currently have ... so i thought .. let's ask here |
| 20:19.27 | saltan | is off to find openmoko on the net |
| 20:19.54 | Rigolo | saltan: openmoko.org ... they are building a complete "free" mobile phone |
| 20:20.27 | Rigolo | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_case_schematics that is where the CAD drawings for their phone can be found |
| 20:20.29 | starseeker | http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/screenshots/iges-openmoko-conversion.png.html |
| 20:20.49 | Rigolo | see .. I should have googled some more :-) |
| 20:21.28 | jonored | covets because he wants a phone that'll actually let him compile and use SSH and gpsd, and can be casemodded to survive being strapped to the outside of a kayak... |
| 20:21.56 | Rigolo | jonored: well .. then openmoko is your friend :-) |
| 20:22.06 | Rigolo | ssh and gpsd are standard on the new freerunner |
| 20:22.56 | Rigolo | although still under development .... you can make and receive calls, connect via sub to your desktop .. and then ssh into your phone |
| 20:23.01 | starseeker | iges-g is the convertor used - I forget the options |
| 20:23.13 | starseeker | so far i can only get the wireframe though |
| 20:23.20 | Rigolo | it contains a agps device ... |
| 20:23.48 | Rigolo | starseeker: and the other formats .. like those Pro/E files? |
| 20:24.40 | starseeker | Pro/E - not on its own, no |
| 20:25.11 | starseeker | needs other (commercial) libraries |
| 20:25.34 | jonored | I'd expect them to be - unfortunately, family plan with sister where only verizon has coverage for two years. And I've been curious whether it's actually got more computing power than my current laptop (CF-27, 300mhz PII..) - and ssh and phone (X perhaps) are all I need anyways :) |
| 20:25.36 | starseeker | Pro/E formats aren't documented anywhere that I'm aware of, so importing them directly is a tough problem |
| 20:25.42 | Rigolo | starseeker: okee ..because the wikipedia says it can import them ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_CAD_software |
| 20:26.21 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F60E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:26.27 | starseeker | Rigolo: You might ask brlcad about that, when he shows up |
| 20:27.21 | Rigolo | jonored: X is also on there .. it has a VGA touchscreen display (640x480 2.8") |
| 20:27.27 | jonored | Rigolo: I think the restriction is something loosely on the order of requiring a copy of Pro-E to do conversions with it's format. |
| 20:28.22 | Rigolo | jonored: okee ... so if the people that made these drawings (apparently using Pro/E) install BRL-CAD .. they could do it them selfs? |
| 20:28.28 | jonored | is aware. He's aware of the device, just stuck not having a service he can run it on for a couple years, and so hasn't ordered one already. |
| 20:28.56 | Rigolo | has one right here .. to the left ... GSM is eveywhere here in .nl |
| 20:29.13 | Rigolo | well ... you could start with the gps bits :-) |
| 20:29.21 | Rigolo | and start using the phone later :-) |
| 20:29.46 | jonored | Rigolo: For that I'm not sure - I was more justifying the listing of being able to convert, as it's as possible as it's reasonable to make it. |
| 20:30.58 | Rigolo | jonored: okee ... well ... I might update the openmoko wiki page and point to BRL-CAD as at least an opensource free software applicaiton that can do something with the CAD files |
| 20:31.50 | Ralith | Rigolo: does the latest model support 3G? |
| 20:32.01 | Ralith | starseeker: 'sort of' import IGES? |
| 20:32.03 | Rigolo | jonored: and ... within 2 years you must be able to design a nice casing for the freerunner |
| 20:32.10 | jonored | There's also the part where it's on the list after college expenses and a reprap :) - and GSM is, unfortunately, not available in the north end of Vermont - hence the sister needing verizon. |
| 20:32.20 | Rigolo | Ralith: no, only GSM with GPRS at the moment |
| 20:32.33 | Rigolo | but is has wifi |
| 20:32.35 | Ralith | Rigolo: call me when they've got 3G, then I want one. |
| 20:32.38 | Ralith | wifi drains battery life like no other. |
| 20:32.39 | starseeker | Ralith: It doesn't quite get you what you're probably expecting - it's not something (so far) that I can raytrace, for example |
| 20:32.53 | Ralith | starseeker: that doesn't sound like a very useful import |
| 20:33.21 | Ralith | it seems silly for me to ask you this, but did you try creating regions of the parts manually? |
| 20:33.39 | Rigolo | Ralith: no idea when that happens ... it is hard to get a "open" 3G chipset at the moment ... and that is not to expensive |
| 20:33.45 | starseeker | no, I was just testing the direct conversion |
| 20:34.02 | Ralith | Rigolo: unless the openmoko becomes incredibly cheap, I don't really care about the 'why' |
| 20:34.14 | starseeker | I rather expect we'll need robust BREP support before we can really handle openmoko importing "properly" |
| 20:34.17 | Ralith | I mean, it sounds like the perfect phone in all other respect |
| 20:34.18 | Ralith | s |
| 20:34.24 | starseeker | again, brlcad is the real expert here |
| 20:34.33 | Ralith | but I might as well wait for a proper commercial android phone |
| 20:35.02 | Rigolo | Ralith: even on androids you can not get to the real low level .. like with the openmoko phones |
| 20:35.18 | Ralith | Rigolo: they're linux. What's stopping me? |
| 20:35.56 | Ralith | jonored: by the way, did you start out here and go to reprap or vis versa? I can't work out where you originated >:| |
| 20:36.08 | jonored | Ralith: Possibly no root, binary kernel modules with tight lockdowns... |
| 20:36.11 | Rigolo | Ralith: start reading about android .... as far as I can tell .. they use a linux framework, but you can not "escape" from the android enviroment .. but I might be wrong |
| 20:36.36 | Ralith | jonored: that sounds kinda ghey |
| 20:36.48 | Ralith | Rigolo: you can escape from any environment when you own the hardware |
| 20:37.35 | Rigolo | Ralith: well, but if you can do anything with it .. that is an other question |
| 20:38.44 | jonored | Ralith: I've been watching the reprap since it was meccano and hot glue guns (and trying a little to get going doing useful things), and looking at BRL-CAD (and playing with it a little) since it hit slashdot... and just started using IRC, so hit the channels :) |
| 20:38.47 | Ralith | it'd be ludicrous if they didn't give you root |
| 20:38.50 | Ralith | even the iphone gives you root |
| 20:38.58 | Ralith | jonored: oh, neat! |
| 20:39.01 | Ralith | a kindred spirit :> |
| 20:39.08 | Rigolo | Ralith: .... software installed by end-users must be written in Java, and will not have access to lower level device APIs ... |
| 20:39.17 | Ralith | Rigolo: that sounds like BS to me |
| 20:39.18 | Rigolo | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Android#Criticism |
| 20:39.35 | Ralith | wikipedia is not my idea of a reliable source :P |
| 20:39.54 | Rigolo | Ralith: and the iphone does not give you real root .... you can not run anything on the iPhone when it is not signed by apple |
| 20:40.56 | Rigolo | http://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/why-free-software-and-apples-iphone-dont-mix .. read this then :-) |
| 20:41.45 | Ralith | Rigolo: people do it all the time; it's called hacking it :P |
| 20:41.50 | Rigolo | but ... this channel is about BRL-CAD .. not iphones and the pro and cons of free software :-) |
| 20:42.04 | Ralith | in practice I don't care if something's locked down if it's a straightforward hack |
| 20:42.04 | Rigolo | Ralith: well .. .the iPhone linux guys are still strugling ... |
| 20:42.15 | Ralith | iphones are already unixy enough for me |
| 20:42.26 | Rigolo | Ralith: okee |
| 20:43.02 | jonored | The openmoko thing is a bit like the differene between having a tivo that's built on linux and hacking into it and having a gentoo box running a media app... |
| 20:43.02 | Ralith | I'm more interested in just where you got the idea that andriod would only support java for third party stuff |
| 20:43.38 | Ralith | jonored: to me, that says "openmoko probably won't work, but at least it'll take all week to set up." |
| 20:43.52 | Rigolo | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/02/02/google_android_developers_view/ |
| 20:44.19 | Rigolo | and openmoko at the moment works for basic things like calls and sms .. |
| 20:44.29 | starseeker | uses and likes Gentoo |
| 20:45.03 | Rigolo | openmoko is build using the openembedded framework ... |
| 20:45.31 | Ralith | Rigolo: that says quite clearly that *all* apps run on a VM, not that java is used |
| 20:45.46 | jonored | is quite pleased with his Gentoo machine; it's the one that lives on his back in the CF-27. |
| 20:45.58 | Rigolo | and just like with any linux device .. there are multiple "distributions" already .. so you can choose what you like .. but don't expect the iphone user experiance just yet |
| 20:46.36 | Ralith | Rigolo: I don't mind a unpolished GUI. Ever used windows mobile? |
| 20:46.47 | Ralith | You wouldn't believe how horrible their GUI is. |
| 20:46.48 | Rigolo | Ralith: http://www.betaversion.org/~stefano/linotype/news/110/ |
| 20:47.03 | Rigolo | Ralith: that is why I never user WinMob |
| 20:47.32 | Ralith | What I want is mobile high speed internets in a pocketable form, and with a sufficiently unixy system that I can do fun things like set it up as a wifi access point |
| 20:48.16 | Rigolo | Ralith: well .. that last bit kills the moko for your completly .. their wifi chips do not allow AP functionality .. only client |
| 20:48.33 | Ralith | that can be prevented in hardware? |
| 20:48.38 | Rigolo | but don't expect an android phone to do that either |
| 20:48.41 | Ralith | that sucks |
| 20:48.43 | Ralith | but it was only an example |
| 20:48.46 | Rigolo | Ralith: yes |
| 20:48.50 | Rigolo | Ralith: oke :-) |
| 20:49.02 | Ralith | Rigolo: that agains says that java is not used, and the former article implies that the VM is language independent |
| 20:49.08 | Ralith | really |
| 20:49.17 | Ralith | so long as I can make the thing route traffic from outside sources |
| 20:49.20 | Ralith | I don't mind having to wire it up |
| 20:49.37 | starseeker | Ah, no wonder they hyp primitive got sucked into the reorg - it was there in 7.12.4 |
| 20:49.38 | Rigolo | Ralith: android apps are writen in java .. and then compiles to a google owned VM enviroment |
| 20:49.38 | Ralith | Rigolo: can it do USB host? |
| 20:50.03 | Ralith | starseeker: despite being considered incomplete? |
| 20:50.05 | Rigolo | Ralith: openmoko can do both ... but usb 1.1 on this version |
| 20:50.21 | Ralith | so long as it can be a host |
| 20:50.24 | jonored | Ralith: Being an AP requires capabilities that aren't required for being a client - it's not really surprising that they wouldn't neccessarily include it in a chipset. |
| 20:50.36 | Ralith | jonored: I wasn't sure how much is done in hardware. |
| 20:50.48 | starseeker | Ralith: it happens sometimes - 7-12-4 was a tag, it might have been removed from the tarball |
| 20:51.11 | Ralith | if openmoko can be a USB host, that probably means I could wire up a USB wifi stick that *does* have AP support |
| 20:51.19 | Ralith | even if it's unpowered host, it's not too hard to stick a battery inline |
| 20:51.41 | jonored | Ralith: Depends on the chipset, I think. |
| 20:51.43 | Ralith | then, instant mobile wireless internet for anyone in my vicinity :> |
| 20:51.46 | Ralith | jonored: huh? |
| 20:51.52 | Rigolo | Ralith: yes ... that should work ... |
| 20:52.05 | Ralith | awesomeness. |
| 20:52.15 | Ralith | still needs to have 3G before I spend >$100 on one though |
| 20:52.16 | Rigolo | Ralith: but I already did that with a 50 Euro ASUS wifi router and a UMTS usb card .. |
| 20:52.37 | Ralith | can you make/receive phone calls with that router? :P |
| 20:52.50 | Rigolo | connected a complete computer retails shop like that for over 30 days |
| 20:52.51 | Ralith | one cellular subscription is enough, ty |
| 20:53.03 | Ralith | although |
| 20:53.12 | Ralith | do you know where I could get a USB HSDPA card for not-hugely-expensive? |
| 20:53.25 | Ralith | with north american frequency support |
| 20:53.50 | Rigolo | not straight away .... got mine via my provider .. with a 2 year unlimited data only plan ... |
| 20:54.15 | Rigolo | and cancelled that after 30 days .. (and got money back ..minus one month subscription fee) |
| 20:54.56 | Ralith | US cell phone providers are nowhere near as kind |
| 20:55.05 | Ralith | $200+ cancellation fees |
| 20:55.13 | Ralith | shitty hardware-with-contract deals |
| 20:55.17 | Rigolo | well .. it helped that we had 200 other subscriptions with them :-) |
| 20:55.24 | Ralith | heh |
| 20:55.50 | Rigolo | and .. they were also our DSL provider that scrwed up with installing DSL at a new shop :-) |
| 20:55.55 | Ralith | has a PCMCIA HSDPA card, but his new laptop only has an express card slot >:| |
| 20:56.24 | Rigolo | Ralith: there must be express cards with HSDPA out there .. or not? |
| 20:57.53 | jonored | Ralith: If there are USB ones, then there should be express card ones - same design, just a different connector - USB is one of the lines going to that slot. |
| 20:59.29 | Ralith | there are plenty, they're just all very expensive |
| 20:59.46 | Ralith | $200+ for what I've seen |
| 20:59.57 | Ralith | cellular tech is very price-raped :( |
| 21:00.06 | jonored | Ah, okay. |
| 21:00.38 | Ralith | whereas my PCMCIA card was about $70 on ebay |
| 21:02.49 | saltan | is off now and thanks for fascinating banter |
| 21:04.16 | Rigolo | and Rigolo is also going .. thanks for the update on BRL-CAD and openmoko CAD files :-) |
| 21:08.15 | *** part/#brlcad Rigolo (n=rigolo@cc14973-d.zwoll1.ov.home.nl) | |
| 21:09.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32150 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (9 files): detemplating the PCSet class. Using a list of VariableAbstract* rather than Variable<T> to hold the set of Variables. noticing valgrind memory leak of 160 bytes : due to pc_pc_set macros/functions |
| 21:12.19 | Ralith | so poolio's working on the code to generate an accurate set of surfaces from an arbitrary region is poolio's WIP, right? Anyone feel able to quantify the state of that project? |
| 21:37.33 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F60E.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:55.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32151 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/current_successful_compile_rev.txt: builds ok to this point with the one exception noted. |
| 22:12.21 | *** join/#brlcad poolio (n=poolio@bz.bzflag.bz) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
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| 22:46.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32152 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h): forward declaration of Constraint Class and definition of getVariableID function so as to support usage of PCSet methods by the constraint object |
| 22:49.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32153 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.cpp pcConstraint.h solver_test.cpp): specifying PCSet reference in the constraint object and corresponding modification in the constructors |
| 23:05.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32154 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libged/libged.vcproj: Added several missing files to the msvc9 build. |
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| 00:26.51 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 00:34.02 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 00:34.49 | yukonbob | how'd your day turn out? |
| 00:40.12 | starseeker | goes into convulsions as sourceforge svn goes offline... |
| 00:43.43 | starseeker | decides to do some Gentoo upgrading... |
| 00:45.06 | brlcad | yukonbob: alright, sort of a day of exhausted relaxation before the storm |
| 00:50.33 | starseeker | proposes a study of brlcad to learn how to make a human body function without sleep |
| 01:03.14 | *** join/#brlcad iday (n=iday@c-68-55-215-195.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 01:04.42 | brlcad | practice makes perfect! |
| 01:13.08 | starseeker | sees slashdot article on virtualbox and checks it out |
| 01:27.50 | stustev | good evening - is anyone up for another question? Here goes. Is there a way to run a script and have the script history in the command window? |
| 01:29.55 | brlcad | howdy stustev .. hmm |
| 01:30.09 | stustev | good evening |
| 01:30.10 | brlcad | I think the short answer is no |
| 01:30.18 | stustev | that's too short |
| 01:31.33 | stustev | that would be very nice for me. Write a script, load the script without running it and step through it to make it work |
| 01:32.32 | brlcad | I can see the utility in that, but it'd probably require a new command or an option to an existing command |
| 01:33.04 | brlcad | actually, could probably write a little tcl script that does exactly that for you |
| 01:33.31 | stustev | just give me an idea how to do it and I will try to do it |
| 01:33.42 | brlcad | does fopen on specified file, loops over lines in the file, runs each line interactively asking if it's okay or to skip |
| 01:34.15 | brlcad | proc hello {args} { |
| 01:34.23 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:34.24 | brlcad | } |
| 01:34.30 | brlcad | hello |
| 01:34.52 | stustev | I am here - just talking to my daughter |
| 01:35.02 | brlcad | from there, just find a tutorial on-line for reading the lines from a file |
| 01:35.21 | brlcad | (using Tcl) |
| 01:35.35 | brlcad | should be all of about 20 lines of code probably |
| 01:35.57 | stustev | I will look at it - thanks |
| 01:36.18 | brlcad | if you get stuck, let me know |
| 01:42.11 | stustev | I am already stuck - but I want to try anyway - It will take more time to help me do it than if you did it yourself but then I would learn anything. :) |
| 01:43.16 | stustev | I have been scripting models today. It is a LOT like APT programming. I am an APT programmer. |
| 01:44.42 | ``Erik | my condolances |
| 01:44.56 | stustev | :) |
| 01:47.15 | stustev | here is not a way to read the whole script into the command window and then be able to move forward and back in the file using the keyboard? Just like what you would have if you typed the script into the command window? |
| 01:47.21 | stustev | there |
| 01:53.19 | stustev | Can I put a command in the script to over write the existing database with the created database when the script runs? Even better would be a question when I load the script "Do you want to erase the existing database: Y/N". |
| 01:57.35 | brlcad | almost made it off post, only to turn right back around |
| 01:57.51 | stustev | welcome back |
| 02:01.20 | *** join/#brlcad ibot_ (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 02:01.20 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 02:01.23 | brlcad | a litl bit of tcl scripting |
| 02:02.32 | stustev | The command to load the file? Is it possible to load the entire file instead of one line at a time. Your suggestion seemed to me to load one line at a time. |
| 02:05.34 | brlcad | it's a full language, you can make it do whatever you want |
| 02:05.46 | brlcad | read the whole file if you like, ask line by line |
| 02:06.08 | stustev | Maybe I am thinking the command history is a file but it isn't. Is it the command history like the 'history' command in a terminal window. |
| 02:07.15 | brlcad | there are various command histories in mged -- the one you see when you up/down arrow are always actions that have *happened* .. so if you want a command to show up there, it has to have run |
| 02:07.31 | brlcad | but that doesn't prevent you from stepping through a transcript for the user |
| 02:07.47 | stustev | that is what I am just understanding |
| 02:10.48 | stustev | In APT we have what we call a source file. It is all the APT commands to create geometry if we need to and then move the cutter around the geometry. We load the whole file and then run through the file how we need to (sometimes - one line at a time). It doesn't sound as if brlcad is structured the same. |
| 02:11.43 | brlcad | sounds more like an interactive debugger |
| 02:12.11 | brlcad | different tool, different purposes |
| 02:12.11 | stustev | exactly - that is how it functions |
| 02:12.18 | brlcad | your point? :) |
| 02:13.11 | stustev | It seems more intuitive and functional to me. That is probably because that is what I am used to. |
| 02:15.36 | brlcad | that's a pretty grandiose statement to make on one simple interaction data point (regardless of it being true or false) |
| 02:16.07 | brlcad | there are plenty of ways mged can be improved, working on usability is one of our top (long-term) priorities |
| 02:16.38 | jonored | stustev: It doesn't seem like it's even impractical to do things that way in brlcad... I've mostly been editing files and running them. Haven't written up a line-by-line execute command, but that should only be a few lines to write... |
| 02:17.03 | stustev | my process now - write the script, run the script, look at the error messages to decipher why it didn't work, edit the script, erase the database, repeat until I get no errors, check the model to see if it looks like what I expected, edit the script , erase the database, repeat until the model looks like what I want. :) |
| 02:17.40 | stustev | not too bad just different than what I am used to |
| 02:18.11 | brlcad | stustev: i.e., you'd like an interactive script debugger |
| 02:18.44 | jonored | I find myself wondering if this is actually a procedural-stuff-stored-in-database thing... |
| 02:18.49 | brlcad | it's not ground-shaking insightful, it's just not a feature we presently provide even if it would just take a few lines of code to implement |
| 02:19.00 | stustev | I had never thought of the APT process as debugging before but that is exactly what it is |
| 02:19.02 | brlcad | in fact you're the first person to (ever) suggest such a feature |
| 02:19.27 | brlcad | (for mged) |
| 02:20.03 | brlcad | it really would amount to just one routine, probably less than 50 lines tops including interactivity unless you slap a gui in there too |
| 02:28.44 | Ralith | what would be really neat would be a way to step forward and back (via a not-yet-present undo system) through a script to see what each line does (good for learning *and* debugging!) in an integrated editor, next to a nice pretty shaded view of the model |
| 02:28.45 | yukonbob | stustev: [source] is your friend... and if you're using [X]Emacs as your editor, inferior-tcl-mode is also your friend. |
| 02:28.52 | Ralith | of course, this has nothing to do with mged |
| 02:29.14 | Ralith | other than using mged commands |
| 02:30.01 | stustev | Ralith: now you are talking |
| 02:30.18 | Ralith | I don't think it would be very hard to do |
| 02:30.20 | jonored | Ralith: Defining a variant on 'in' that kills the solid first seems like it'd get closer to that... |
| 02:30.22 | Ralith | even as a completely unique system |
| 02:30.33 | Ralith | jonored: I don't follow |
| 02:30.53 | jonored | Unless I'm mistaken, that makes those commands repeat by themselves... |
| 02:31.33 | Ralith | still lost |
| 02:31.43 | jonored | or I might just be being a noob... checking. |
| 02:33.25 | jonored | ...no, it doesn't seem like it. Make it so that if you go up in the history/external program and rerun the command it essentially updates the object. Or is it not based on name in the db? |
| 02:34.00 | Ralith | I really have no idea what you're suggesing |
| 02:34.11 | Ralith | other than that it sounds like some kind of undo system to implement what I described |
| 02:35.21 | stustev | jonored: yes that would be the ticket - move up to rerun the command - the model is updated to the just run command - using the same entity name as before |
| 02:35.37 | Ralith | that's exactly what I said :P |
| 02:35.44 | jonored | I've been finding myself (as I play with scripting) putting a "kill" statement immediately before every statement that creates something. Although that doesn't work for combinations easily, nevermind - they need to not get killed sometimes and killed other times. |
| 02:36.32 | brlcad | jonored: there's the more dangerous killtree for combinations |
| 02:36.35 | stustev | Ralith: not exactly - the undo system I have seen will erase the entities when the undo command is issued |
| 02:36.46 | Ralith | jonored: there are all sorts of things that can't be undone with a kill, though |
| 02:36.56 | Ralith | stustev: what |
| 02:37.03 | Ralith | that sounds more like a delete button than an undo system |
| 02:37.30 | stustev | isn't undo - the same as delete? |
| 02:37.59 | Ralith | uh no? |
| 02:38.03 | Ralith | not remotely |
| 02:38.09 | Ralith | where did you get that idea |
| 02:38.10 | jonored | It's close. It's more like a "Rerun and replace" button for this... or "edit definition". |
| 02:38.20 | Ralith | what if you want to undo moving something |
| 02:38.24 | Ralith | or undo changing its color |
| 02:38.24 | jonored | (to a delete) |
| 02:39.02 | stustev | if you undo the last command (whatever it is) isn't that like deleting the last command - not just entities |
| 02:39.26 | Ralith | hell, what if you want to undo deleting an object? |
| 02:39.45 | Ralith | databases don't store commands >.< |
| 02:39.46 | stustev | I see - you are thinking ahead of me |
| 02:39.55 | stustev | :) |
| 02:39.55 | Ralith | they store primitives and their relationships |
| 02:40.07 | Ralith | deleting a command from your text editor has no bearing on anything |
| 02:41.18 | jonored | I think this is really getting to the part where some people just really, really want to have procedurally-generated stuff that they can edit the definition for, rather than manually rerun the generating program... |
| 02:41.35 | brlcad | there are plenty of commands that are not reversible or have no corresponding reverse action -- from a data storage perspective, 'undo' merely restores previous revisions (and that's all it needs to do really) |
| 02:41.54 | Ralith | thank you :] |
| 02:41.56 | brlcad | regardless of what reverse action it might correspond to |
| 02:42.01 | brlcad | it doesn't need to know really |
| 02:42.18 | Ralith | so at the barest level |
| 02:42.21 | brlcad | if complete construction history is preserved (infinite undo) |
| 02:42.27 | Ralith | all we need is a binary diff of the db state every time an action is made, right? |
| 02:42.32 | brlcad | basically |
| 02:42.39 | Ralith | that sounds very simple to implement |
| 02:42.43 | brlcad | tis |
| 02:42.49 | brlcad | there is even a lib that already does it |
| 02:42.56 | Ralith | *blinkblink* |
| 02:42.59 | brlcad | part of the geometry service design |
| 02:43.00 | Ralith | then why isn't mged hooked up? |
| 02:43.35 | brlcad | because that's active development, pretty big collaborative development effort with lots of simultaneous development threads |
| 02:43.58 | Ralith | ...so the API's likely to change under your feet? |
| 02:44.09 | brlcad | the new features like that one will probably only go into the new gui, especially complete versioning |
| 02:44.32 | jonored | But would that let you change something ten steps back without having to redo everything in between? |
| 02:44.33 | Ralith | unless mged is being completely abandoned, I'd think it would benefit from it |
| 02:44.38 | brlcad | the API is still being *written*, just getting started actually -- just one piece of a bigger effort |
| 02:44.56 | Ralith | jonored: that might require a bit more than a binary diff :/ |
| 02:44.58 | brlcad | there's the libged refactoring effort, that alone is moving and restructuring nearly 100k lines of code |
| 02:45.14 | Ralith | you'd have to have the logic to modify the future actions to acomodiate for any effect missing the past action would have |
| 02:45.36 | Ralith | ah, so there's only a lib that does it in the sense of their being a project. |
| 02:45.58 | brlcad | no, there are libs that already do the diffing |
| 02:46.22 | Ralith | you know what |
| 02:46.28 | Ralith | I have no doubt that you're doing things the Right Way |
| 02:46.32 | Ralith | so I'm going to go get breakfast/lunch/dinner |
| 02:47.02 | Ralith | (my schedule is that messed up. I am accordingly hungry.) |
| 02:47.51 | brlcad | like I said, there are several pieces to this puzzle -- the new geometry service is a fairly big effort that involves the new gui, a new OO geometry engine, a major mged/libged code refactoring, hooking into revisioning libraries, development of a service protocol, and binding that all together in phases |
| 02:48.31 | Ralith | oh, the undo bits depend on the geometry service as a whole which is itself incomplete? |
| 02:48.35 | Ralith | (or something like that) |
| 02:48.37 | jonored | Ralith: or store "how to get this shape" on the level of abstraction that the user types as well as on the level of straight CSG trees and matrices, and let it be edited and rerun easily. |
| 02:49.24 | Ralith | jonored: that would be pretty awesome, but it sounds pretty challenging to keep those in sync |
| 02:50.39 | Ralith | anyway. |
| 02:50.40 | Ralith | HUNGRY. |
| 02:50.43 | Ralith | -> food |
| 02:50.43 | stustev | jonored: I do not want just another point and click CAD program. If I wanted that I would go with Solidworks or some such like. I like brlcad because it can be so flexible. If I need to work in the brlcad manner I can learn that. I started this by suggesting a few things I thought I would like to see. I have CADKEY, Solidworks, Catia, Unigraphics, ProE and VX. I know how to use VX and I don't want to learn any of the others. They are very |
| 02:51.00 | brlcad | the "undo" functionality (which doesn't exist because the geometry service itself is far from complete) leverages a revision control layer (that already exists completed, but is a generic data versioning system) |
| 02:51.16 | Ralith | neat. |
| 02:51.23 | Ralith | shame it's not edible. |
| 02:53.24 | *** join/#brlcad iday (n=jlowens@c-68-55-215-195.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 02:53.40 | brlcad | the whole project is estimated around 6 staff years of effort in whole to achieve base production quality (not including new gui work), with around that many people presently contributing from 20% to 100% of their time |
| 02:54.29 | brlcad | stustev: irc has message limits, you were cut off ;) |
| 02:54.41 | brlcad | try breaking at the sentance level ;) |
| 02:54.49 | jonored | stustev: I'm not trying to say that the way brlcad works now is bad - but I was in here a few days ago asking about what I think is the same thing, and it's done somewhat, but isn't quite comfortable to me. I've been prodding at a line-by-line batch while we're talking because I'd use it too. |
| 02:55.16 | stustev | will do |
| 02:55.31 | brlcad | seriously, line-by-line command parsing is really pretty simple to implement |
| 02:56.05 | jonored | and I've been (distractedly; i have classes) prodding at stashing the TCL definitions of things in attributes and having a command to open it in an editor and rerun it when done... or just vim integration... stuff like that. |
| 02:56.06 | brlcad | wham, bam, could be done in less than an hour if you knew the scripting syntax |
| 02:56.23 | brlcad | jonored: neat |
| 02:56.30 | stustev | the whole thing shows up on my screen - where were you cut off? |
| 02:56.52 | brlcad | They are very |
| 02:57.44 | stustev | expensive and continue to get more expensive. The continue to box you into the capability programmed into the point and click interface. |
| 02:58.06 | jonored | is trying to find either stdin or a get-line-from-user in tcl.. five lines, I think, to go through it line-by-line, but with no backwards. |
| 02:58.49 | jonored | is wrong, that breaks for multi-line commands. |
| 02:59.48 | jonored | misses (read). |
| 03:00.33 | brlcad | thinks he set a record this week for too many hours.. |
| 03:00.48 | stustev | it is only Wednesday |
| 03:01.19 | brlcad | but end of month |
| 03:01.59 | stustev | it is that |
| 03:03.57 | stustev | bbl |
| 03:04.26 | brlcad | puts "next? [y/n]" |
| 03:04.38 | brlcad | catch {gets stdin answer} |
| 03:05.14 | brlcad | if {$answer == "y"} { ..process line.. rinse and repeat |
| 03:05.42 | jonored | Out of curiosity, how much of the graphical display stuff will libged be able to do? Would I be able to tell it to use a window like mged does now, or does the program using it need to do that? |
| 03:05.58 | brlcad | maybe write a "prompt user" command (I sent an example to one of the mailing lists many months back) |
| 03:06.26 | brlcad | "tell it to use a window like mged does now"? no entiendo |
| 03:06.45 | brlcad | libged has nothing to do with gui -- it's a geometry editing library |
| 03:07.28 | brlcad | it's moving a ton of editing, querying, analysis, and other command functionality (i.e. pretty much *all* commands in mged) into a library so that it can be reused |
| 03:07.41 | brlcad | and cleaned up at the same time |
| 03:07.54 | brlcad | refactoring is giving us the chance to remove some of the cobwebs |
| 03:08.23 | brlcad | performs his "take 2" homeward bounding |
| 03:11.21 | yukonbob | finishes reading scrollbck |
| 03:11.23 | yukonbob | *back |
| 03:15.48 | jonored | *Nod*. I'm asking if libdm is in libged, aren't I. I should look at these things before asking and confusing people... |
| 03:32.09 | starseeker | wishes he knew enough to contribute something useful to the Geometry Engine email... his only suggestion might be that a brief summary of the potential pros/cons of the various approaches available might be educational, although orthogonal to the purpose of the email... |
| 03:39.17 | brlcad | starseeker: you are contributing something *vital* |
| 03:40.00 | brlcad | feature requests, bug fixes, releases .. those *have* to keep happening, so if you're not doing them then that just falls back on others (me!) |
| 03:40.13 | brlcad | jonored: libdm is definitely not in libged |
| 03:40.56 | brlcad | libged does provide generic display lists though .. which libdm uses .. which opengl can use .. and others because they're .. generic ;) |
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| 08:44.30 | brlcad | hrm |
| 08:44.35 | brlcad | decides to call it a day |
| 08:48.44 | d_rossberg | brlcad: who is davidloman? |
| 09:15.59 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:20.24 | mafm | hi |
| 09:41.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32155 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): Adding type information to Variable classes so as to avoid RTTI during construction/destrcution |
| 09:43.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32156 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h): addVariable() and addConstraint() functions for the operation of PCSet object: argument list to be changed to non pointer type |
| 10:51.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32157 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Added light and zclip commands to ged_obj. |
| 10:54.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32158 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: some modifications to be consistent with Makefile.am |
| 11:07.44 | d_rossberg | mafm: is rt^3 for gui development only or is it a more general C++ developmend sandbox? |
| 11:12.09 | mafm | d_rossberg: I don't know, it was created before me |
| 11:12.25 | mafm | Sean suggested me to put my new interface there |
| 11:12.51 | mafm | AFAIK it was not really used, the rest of code around are placeholders/sketches |
| 11:13.28 | mafm | and it was devised as a place to put things like 3D interfaces, thus the name rt^3 |
| 11:16.53 | d_rossberg | same to me: Sean suggested me to put my C++ interface there |
| 11:17.29 | d_rossberg | so don't be surprised |
| 11:17.55 | mafm | all right |
| 11:18.07 | mafm | it was you who was creating directories yesterday? |
| 11:18.34 | d_rossberg | no, it was David Loman |
| 11:19.27 | d_rossberg | he works probable at the ARL, but i don't know his intention in creating these directories |
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| 11:28.04 | mafm | OK |
| 11:28.20 | mafm | so well, at the moment I've only put stuff in src/other, src/g3d and data/g3d |
| 11:28.52 | mafm | I don't know much about the rest |
| 11:29.48 | mafm | if we're going to use same code, like patterns and so on, we could move our code to libUtility or similar dirs |
| 11:36.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32159 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Removed a bit of temporary/test code. |
| 11:39.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32160 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/intaval/ (Makefile.am tgf2g.dsp): |
| 11:39.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: removed MSVS 6.0 project file |
| 11:39.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: BRL-CAD doesn't support this VS version any more |
| 11:45.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32161 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/intaval/ (8 files): made the copyright and license notice compatible with the rest of BRL-CAD |
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| 13:23.48 | starseeker | brlcad: Thank you :-). I was referring more to the issues you had asked for comment on in the email "BRL-CAD C++ Geometry Engine" - things like run-time typing and single object hierarchies are a bit beyond my expertice level as yet ;-) |
| 13:25.03 | brlcad | nods |
| 13:25.50 | brlcad | ah, missed daniel |
| 13:30.01 | poolio | brlcad: I'm leaving now :) |
| 13:53.34 | starseeker | there we go, much better: http://brlcad.org/wiki/ARL_Technical_Reports |
| 13:54.00 | starseeker | needs to docbook those suckers once 7.12.6 is out... |
| 13:54.44 | brlcad | the OLD subdir should get merged in |
| 13:55.08 | brlcad | it was just a place to put the previous site mirror |
| 14:03.03 | starseeker | I know |
| 14:03.12 | starseeker | but at least there is SOME active link now |
| 14:03.30 | starseeker | merging it in will take longer, especially if we docbook/wikify it |
| 14:04.11 | starseeker | I could pull it out and make a "reports" directory to hold them in the main site, if that's preferable |
| 14:05.51 | starseeker | just let me know - if you don't want any link until they're ready I can revert it, too |
| 14:07.13 | brlcad | nah, it's better |
| 14:07.26 | brlcad | just saing it's not where it should be |
| 14:11.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32162 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWidgetRotation.cxx GuiWidgetRotation.h): Adding custom Widget based in RBGui::Widget intending to represent and control rotations |
| 14:15.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32163 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiCamera.cxx GuiCamera.h): Adding window to control camera and display different properties |
| 14:37.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32164 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiBaseWindow.cxx GuiWindowManager.cxx): Whitespace and debug logging messages |
| 14:38.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32165 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Application.h): Adding new window and widget, and commenting out test code |
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| 15:00.06 | brlcad | mafm: it is a general c++ development sandbox if the question comes up again ;) |
| 15:01.42 | mafm | :| |
| 15:01.55 | mafm | so people can deposit cat droppings in there... not good! |
| 15:15.03 | mafm | nice, I try to draw lines and I got back characters being rendered |
| 15:16.25 | brlcad | cool |
| 15:16.34 | brlcad | so maybe you should draw characters, see if you get lines |
| 15:25.45 | mafm | text leads to text |
| 15:32.19 | mafm | huh, that's strange |
| 15:32.55 | mafm | it seems that the font manager decodes something in every widget and thus the characters get rendered |
| 16:34.53 | brlcad | mafm: how are you rendering fonts? (what font manager? one in ogre?) |
| 16:35.32 | brlcad | notes he also works with ftgl .. so would be highly inclined to use that where we need ofnt rendering -- it's good stuff |
| 16:42.11 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 16:44.47 | mafm | brlcad: freetype, I think |
| 16:46.50 | brlcad | eh, that might be what's under the hood, sure |
| 16:46.57 | brlcad | but what are you interfacing through? |
| 16:47.03 | brlcad | something ogre provides? |
| 16:48.18 | mafm | RBGui |
| 16:48.42 | mafm | I don't know if in turn in uses some OGRE thing -- might be |
| 16:50.58 | mafm | #include <ft2build.h> |
| 16:50.59 | mafm | #include FT_FREETYPE_H |
| 16:51.09 | mafm | (in RBGui::FontManager.cpp) |
| 16:51.15 | mafm | so they use that directly, I guess |
| 16:59.00 | starseeker | brlcad: Know anything about Growl for Mac OSX? |
| 16:59.10 | starseeker | http://growl.info |
| 17:00.11 | mafm | I have to go now |
| 17:00.13 | mafm | take care :) |
| 17:02.49 | brlcad | starseeker: I do now |
| 17:10.31 | starseeker | heh - those scripts that get subversion to use FileMerge seem to want to use it |
| 17:11.05 | starseeker | Growls in frustration |
| 17:15.46 | brlcad | really? that's odd |
| 17:15.52 | brlcad | change the scripts |
| 17:21.17 | starseeker | they'll work without it, but there seems to be some feature it provides that they benefit from |
| 17:21.37 | starseeker | maybe you don't have to manually quit FileMerge if you have it around |
| 17:23.39 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 18:16.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r32166 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: don't need to check the angle for hits on start/end planes, replaced with a check for rev->ang > M_PI |
| 18:40.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32167 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/current_successful_compile_rev.txt: upload notes on progressive compile issues identified so far |
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| 20:18.32 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 20:33.00 | Ralith | What sort of OS do most devs here run on? |
| 20:33.14 | pacman87 | i run slackware |
| 20:33.35 | Ralith | linuxes, then? |
| 20:33.36 | pacman87 | occasionally boot winXP on weekends |
| 20:33.42 | pacman87 | but not for dev work |
| 20:49.48 | PrezKennedy | vista! |
| 20:50.09 | PrezKennedy | except im not a dev... just an innocent bystander |
| 20:50.23 | pacman87 | if you run vista, you're not innocent... |
| 20:52.46 | PrezKennedy | at least im not fingering people and mounting drives like you sickos :P |
| 20:53.23 | pacman87 | hey, i never said we were innocent either |
| 20:53.37 | Ralith | at least we're experienced :> |
| 20:55.20 | PrezKennedy | "hey baby, i know how to mount a drive" ;) |
| 20:58.20 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-159-211.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 21:05.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32168 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.cpp pcConstraint.h): forward declaration of PCSet for usage of PCSet methods |
| 21:07.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32169 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.cpp: correcting inherited protected variable access name |
| 21:07.51 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14DFE6.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:11.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32170 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h solver_test.cpp): Variable addition methods for the PCSet object |
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| 22:45.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32171 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (69 files in 35 dirs): OK, take a step back. Reverting to 32083. |
| 22:54.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32172 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/rt/rt_simple.c: Opps, add rt_simple back in to get to 32083 state. |
| 23:02.27 | brlcad | Ralith: Mac, BSD, and Linux for most of the devs |
| 23:03.16 | starseeker | keeps waiting for someone to port BRL-CAD to HaikuOS ;-) |
| 23:03.37 | brlcad | that would be fun |
| 23:03.43 | Ralith | so an acceptable form of binary release for g3d would be a binary tarball for extraction into an installation root? |
| 23:04.34 | brlcad | ah, for g3d, sure -- it can be pretty much anything |
| 23:05.04 | brlcad | it's more just getting it into some dev users hands for easy testing, getting a feedback loop started |
| 23:05.22 | brlcad | there the OS doesn't matter, could pretty much pick anything |
| 23:05.25 | starseeker | needs to check if it's still doing the screwed up font thing on his Gentoo box... |
| 23:06.34 | Ralith | finds the idea of a binary release for devs to be somewhat odd |
| 23:08.01 | brlcad | it's not just for devs -- its for anyone really |
| 23:08.28 | starseeker | Does it still need all the libs installed as root? |
| 23:08.37 | starseeker | or did it ever, for that matter? |
| 23:09.00 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32173 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/TODO: list of minor tasks/ plan in libpc |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32174 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 3 dirs): |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Merge in changes to get the tree back into a working state, circa 32083 as far |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: as merging in of trunk changes. Testing indicates there be dragons in the 32085 |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: and 32086 changes, so prepare working base and re-attempt the subsequent merges |
| 23:17.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: from trunk from there. |
| 23:18.11 | brlcad | if he's making a binary release, he has the opportunity to sort that out |
| 23:18.20 | starseeker | ah. |
| 23:19.14 | starseeker | goes to get dinner before attempting to get over the next merge barrior |
| 23:23.53 | Ralith | I don't know many libs that do need to be installed as root |
| 23:30.15 | brlcad | think he meant that need to be installed beforehand/separately |
| 23:32.06 | brlcad | in which case the installer for the dependency (e.g. on Mac) might be set up to require perms to go where the installer wants to put it |
| 23:33.02 | brlcad | there's never been a release of it yet, so it's a mostly moot point though -- he could make the whole thing one big stand-alone static binary if he wanted |
| 23:40.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32175 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParser.cpp pcVariable.cpp): cleanup / debug removal |
| 23:40.42 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 23:42.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32176 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.h: intersectInterval modified to take into account empty Domain; display function modified to show Variable type |
| 23:45.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32177 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h solver_test.cpp): modification to addVariable() and pushVar() functions of PCSet. small *hack* in pushVar() since default specialized constructors are not being used |
| 00:19.43 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 00:22.07 | Ralith | hello, tundrahead |
| 00:24.14 | yukonbob | :) |
| 00:40.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32178 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (5 files in 3 dirs): re-merge r31669 - fast4-g cleanup |
| 00:40.48 | starseeker | arrgh - |
| 00:43.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32179 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (COPYING INSTALL misc/enigma/COPYING misc/enigma/INSTALL): ack, how'd that happen? put trunk's COPYING and INSTALL files back |
| 00:51.27 | starseeker | can't figure out how those COPY and INSTALL files got switched |
| 00:51.31 | starseeker | grrrr |
| 00:55.15 | starseeker | is a bit freaked out |
| 01:02.34 | poolio | brlcad: tgc almost works, it's flipped about the z-axis... |
| 01:35.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32180 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (9 files in 6 dirs): re-merge up to r31701, previously in this branch 32087 |
| 01:38.00 | starseeker | thinks he may be finally getting the hang of this merge thing |
| 01:38.05 | starseeker | ++FileMerge~ |
| 01:43.43 | ``Erik | effin' fate bitch pizz0wned one of my astros and it'll take 3 hours to get a liberation fleet there *sigh* |
| 01:44.30 | starseeker | isn't sure if ``Erik is playing a game or learning a new language |
| 01:50.10 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@pool-72-74-102-223.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 01:59.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32181 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (3 files in 3 dirs): re-merge up to r31744 where the changes weren't related to new work, including extensive changes to pipe.c , previously in this branch 32092 |
| 02:00.36 | brlcad | starseeker: that can happen during an automatic regeneration during make |
| 02:01.11 | brlcad | if you update/merge configure.ac and Makefile.am updates, and don't run autogen.sh -- it will try automatically |
| 02:01.45 | brlcad | and depending on the exact ordering of things, it can end up blowing away what you have and sticking defaults |
| 02:02.05 | brlcad | I'd bitched about it (informally) to the gnu guys in the past but they didn't seem to really care |
| 02:02.35 | brlcad | since it's obscure and it's the content they think should be in every one's copy of those files anyways |
| 02:02.41 | starseeker | ah |
| 02:02.56 | brlcad | poolio: awesome! |
| 02:03.04 | starseeker | grumbles in the direction of the GNU guys, who sure won't listen to him if they don't listen to brlcad |
| 02:03.17 | brlcad | starseeker: go for it |
| 02:03.37 | brlcad | it was several years ago, I'm sure it's just a matter of catching the right guy(s) at the right time |
| 02:03.54 | brlcad | one of them was zealotry trolling |
| 02:03.55 | stustev | good evening gentlemen |
| 02:04.02 | brlcad | with which I sometimes have very little patience |
| 02:04.11 | brlcad | howdy starseeker |
| 02:04.14 | stustev | question - how do I use TRA? |
| 02:04.53 | starseeker | heh - howdy stustev |
| 02:05.11 | starseeker | hands brlcad some coffee |
| 02:05.14 | stustev | I can't seem to get it to affect anything |
| 02:07.10 | stustev | do I describe geometry after I issue tra xxx yyy zzz? I am trying to mirror and move an object |
| 02:09.21 | brlcad | stustev: you have to be in an edit mode first |
| 02:09.44 | brlcad | either solid/primitive edit or object/matrix edit mode |
| 02:09.45 | stustev | I can't issue this in the command window? |
| 02:10.04 | brlcad | sure, sed primitive ; tra 100 0 0 |
| 02:10.11 | brlcad | accept |
| 02:10.13 | brlcad | reject |
| 02:10.19 | stustev | this is for editing one object at a time? |
| 02:10.29 | brlcad | what are you trying to do? |
| 02:10.41 | brlcad | that would apply an edit to a specific primitive |
| 02:10.42 | stustev | I have a region. |
| 02:10.55 | brlcad | sed == solid edit mode == for editing primitives individually |
| 02:10.58 | stustev | I want to mirror the region and translate it. |
| 02:11.06 | brlcad | oed is for editing groups |
| 02:11.39 | stustev | trying |
| 02:11.41 | brlcad | so mirror; oed; tra |
| 02:12.26 | brlcad | mirror old new ; oed / new/path/to/primitive ; tra x y z ; accept |
| 02:12.59 | brlcad | there is a great tutorial on oed specifically on the website under documentation |
| 02:15.23 | stustev | I will try to tutorial - thanks |
| 02:15.30 | stustev | s/to/the |
| 02:18.31 | brlcad | stustev: starseeker wrote it so if you have any questions -- he's the man |
| 02:18.55 | brlcad | it describes the command pretty well and in detail, including its limitations |
| 02:19.07 | brlcad | as well as it's power/flexibility |
| 02:19.16 | starseeker | feedback welcome :-) |
| 02:20.03 | starseeker | does need to add a section in there about moving objects used multiple times in a combination by blasting in just that component and working on it alone... |
| 02:23.25 | brlcad | more useful would be implementing "oed all.g" ;) |
| 02:23.37 | starseeker | hehe |
| 02:23.52 | starseeker | should add that to the TODO |
| 02:24.05 | brlcad | or even 'ed object' |
| 02:24.21 | starseeker | with type identification that could work |
| 02:24.44 | brlcad | there's no useful reason for there to be two |
| 02:24.50 | brlcad | it was just a technical artifact |
| 02:24.53 | starseeker | absolutely :-) |
| 02:24.56 | brlcad | just like rhs |
| 02:25.36 | starseeker | would very much like to do that, but then he'd have to redo all the docs for it again :-P |
| 02:25.41 | brlcad | and I really hate to say it, but 'e' should probably enter edit mode |
| 02:26.11 | starseeker | wouldn't that cause a lot of trouble with our old timers? |
| 02:26.13 | brlcad | the one-letter commands all need reviewed |
| 02:26.18 | brlcad | yeah it would |
| 02:26.22 | brlcad | so not likely going to happen |
| 02:26.28 | brlcad | but it should" |
| 02:26.40 | brlcad | e means edit, but you don't actually get to edit |
| 02:27.03 | brlcad | s/means/meant/ |
| 02:27.25 | brlcad | rather "display for editing" .. but that's often also just viewing |
| 02:27.31 | starseeker | maybe we can have "command profiles" the way g3d has blender and MGED modes? |
| 02:27.35 | brlcad | hence draw == e |
| 02:27.48 | brlcad | yeah, command sets |
| 02:28.08 | brlcad | and "standard aliases" |
| 02:28.24 | brlcad | i.e. treat it like a full shell |
| 02:28.29 | brlcad | make it BE a full shell |
| 02:28.46 | starseeker | that would rock |
| 02:28.53 | brlcad | then e would just be an alias to the draw command in the mged-compatibility command profile |
| 02:29.50 | starseeker | hehe - e, ed, sed and oed would all end up leading to the same command by default |
| 02:30.58 | starseeker | maybe have the sed and oed versions check to make sure what they're editing, to preserve behavior |
| 02:31.10 | starseeker | or the sed one anyway |
| 02:32.35 | brlcad | possibly, though the modal edit modes need to go eventually too |
| 02:33.34 | brlcad | or combine it into a new non-modal command space |
| 02:33.56 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos__ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 02:34.06 | brlcad | so things like "tra object 100 0 0" would work, or "object tra 100 0 0" |
| 02:34.56 | starseeker | would like to have the option to go modal or non-modal - modality can be tremendously productive if you want to take the time to learn it (vim) |
| 02:35.12 | starseeker | but the default should be non-modal |
| 02:36.31 | brlcad | in our case, though -- there are still N lines of commands |
| 02:36.50 | brlcad | so the modality really just introduces errors |
| 02:37.43 | brlcad | all it saves you us is typing object names per command as there is a modal "loaded" set (e'd objects) |
| 02:39.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32182 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (18 files in 7 dirs): re-merge up to r31822, previously in this branch 32099 |
| 02:45.38 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 02:49.24 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.78.186) | |
| 02:52.57 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 03:40.45 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 03:49.06 | starseeker | brlcad: sorry, connection decided to quit |
| 03:49.31 | starseeker | true, modality does mainly save typing names |
| 03:50.36 | brlcad | could get a similar effect with named edit sets, akin to registers |
| 03:51.14 | brlcad | register 1 obj1 obj2 obj3 |
| 03:51.18 | brlcad | tra 1 100 0 0 |
| 03:51.47 | starseeker | hmm - essentially create temporary groups for the purposes of command application |
| 03:51.49 | brlcad | for what might otherwise be three tra lines for each obj |
| 03:51.54 | starseeker | not bad |
| 03:51.55 | *** part/#brlcad stustev (n=stustev@ip72-205-246-167.ks.ks.cox.net) | |
| 03:52.35 | starseeker | sees potential for confusion though - "does registering objects create combinations? how is a combination different from a register?" |
| 03:52.54 | brlcad | even with just one object, it eliminates the modality and minimizes it to two characters (for at least 0-9 sets) |
| 03:53.04 | brlcad | so regsiter is a bad word |
| 03:53.23 | brlcad | sort of like a named 'e' set |
| 03:53.35 | starseeker | "edit sets" |
| 03:54.17 | starseeker | editset obj1.s obj2.r obj3.c |
| 03:54.24 | starseeker | editset obj1.s obj2.r obj3.c obj1 |
| 03:54.43 | starseeker | maybe enforce that an edit set name does not map to any database object name |
| 03:54.57 | brlcad | something, but the power would be in using "registers", i.e. some simple int id |
| 03:55.04 | starseeker | right |
| 03:55.25 | brlcad | otherwise if you allow arbitrary names, it is confusing/overlapping with groups |
| 03:55.30 | starseeker | true |
| 03:56.09 | brlcad | though .. I can see a case, maybe it's just a matter of defaults |
| 03:56.27 | starseeker | would that be the command line equalivent to graphically selecting several objects and then doing something with them? |
| 03:56.42 | brlcad | exactly |
| 03:56.46 | starseeker | cool |
| 03:57.05 | starseeker | could tie into the exact same functionality we will eventually use to do that graphically |
| 03:57.20 | brlcad | yep, that'd be the intent too I'd hope |
| 03:57.47 | brlcad | I'd like *all* gui actions to actually go through the scripting layer unless there's some unresolvable performance problem |
| 03:58.05 | brlcad | at least, end state actions |
| 03:58.37 | starseeker | maybe we could have a default of a "hidden" name if none is supplied, and then then commands without arguments supplied could default to that |
| 03:58.48 | starseeker | eg editset obj1.s obj2.s obj3.s |
| 03:58.52 | starseeker | tra 100 0 0 |
| 03:59.01 | starseeker | unselect |
| 03:59.03 | starseeker | or some such |
| 03:59.36 | brlcad | so, for example, rotating an object around and dragging it up/down might be thousands of gui events, but they'd amount to one command-line transaction of "apply this matrix" when you go to a different tool/action |
| 03:59.55 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 04:00.19 | brlcad | "select" |
| 04:00.27 | brlcad | select obj1 obj2 obj3 |
| 04:00.39 | brlcad | returns an int id for that set |
| 04:01.46 | brlcad | so you could "tra [select obj1 obj2] 0 0 100" or "select -id 5 obj1 obj2" .. "tra 5 0 0 100" or something similar |
| 04:04.19 | starseeker | cool |
| 04:04.21 | brlcad | or ftw, the posix shell interface: tra `select obj1 obj2` 0 0 100 |
| 04:05.23 | starseeker | should we optionally avoid an explicit int return, to conceptually match the GUI case? I.e. "just do this on what I just selected, I don't want to care what # it is" |
| 04:05.48 | starseeker | specify an int return if we want the selection to persist beyond the next select command |
| 04:06.42 | brlcad | it still matches the gui with an int -- the gui is just hiding data keeping track of the int for you, akin to setting it to a var |
| 04:06.57 | brlcad | set id [select obj1 obj2] ; tra $id 0 0 100 |
| 04:07.37 | brlcad | the idea being that the gui would actually do exactly that or some similar technique |
| 04:07.43 | brlcad | so you could replicate what the gui is doing exactly |
| 04:07.52 | starseeker | sure |
| 04:07.54 | brlcad | and have a transaction list regardless of which you use |
| 04:08.35 | brlcad | would love to hit the "play" button on a full vehicle being constructed .. with full revision history as it was put together |
| 04:08.40 | starseeker | just wants to hide the selection of the int unless explicitly specified - under the hood all would do the same thing |
| 04:08.48 | starseeker | that would ROCK :-) |
| 04:09.19 | brlcad | rockage on so many levels |
| 04:09.31 | Ralith | then export it to a physics engine and testdrive it :> |
| 04:09.34 | brlcad | that'd probably be worth a paper somewhere |
| 04:13.46 | starseeker | doesn't want any of his revision histories played back just yet |
| 04:13.56 | starseeker | :-P |
| 04:14.50 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:15.31 | starseeker | steady cam it ain't |
| 04:22.25 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 04:25.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32183 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (50 files in 30 dirs): re-merge up to r32062, r32120 previously - this should incorporate most of the relevant trunk changes up until that point, and seems to have completed a build on OSX - need a clean checkout to be certain. |
| 04:25.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Can I grab the new mged initialization for 7.12.6? |
| 04:51.57 | starseeker | and the new kill stuff? |
| 04:52.11 | brlcad | initilzation? |
| 04:52.34 | brlcad | I don't think you can merge killrefs without libged |
| 04:52.40 | starseeker | mrf |
| 04:52.52 | brlcad | ooh, new mged init -- yeah, that should merge easy |
| 04:52.54 | starseeker | your new mged mods that let mged start through menus/icons |
| 04:52.57 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 04:53.16 | starseeker | that'll be a nice feature to have in the stable release |
| 04:54.10 | starseeker | looks at killrefs quick... |
| 04:56.30 | starseeker | is sorely tempted to try, but it looks like you're probably right |
| 04:56.54 | brlcad | there's always next month |
| 04:57.10 | starseeker | will libged be ready by then? |
| 04:57.19 | starseeker | WOOOOO HOOOOOOOO |
| 04:57.23 | brlcad | gotta draw the line somewhere else it can drag on indefintiely |
| 04:57.34 | brlcad | iff bob keeps up his pace, possibly |
| 04:57.44 | starseeker | gets mged to start up built from the HEAD of pre-7-12-6 |
| 04:58.01 | brlcad | maybe two months -- but it should be stabilizable within a couple weeks regardless of libged being finished |
| 04:58.20 | brlcad | if anything, can just start throwing the bugs at bob as they're found until he's done, or help him debug |
| 04:58.57 | starseeker | true |
| 04:59.17 | starseeker | does happy dance that he can now build and install with almost all the changes merged in |
| 04:59.45 | Ralith | yay! |
| 05:00.01 | starseeker | That was a big first step on the road to a release |
| 05:00.14 | Ralith | if it needs testing on other platforms, I'm happy to give it a build on FreeBSD |
| 05:00.36 | starseeker | please - check out branches/pre-7-12-6 to give it a whirl |
| 05:02.06 | starseeker | would appreciate |
| 05:03.05 | Ralith | uh |
| 05:03.13 | Ralith | I can't seem to work out how that translates to a svn checkout url :/ |
| 05:03.18 | starseeker | one sec... |
| 05:03.46 | starseeker | svn co https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6 |
| 05:03.59 | Ralith | ahh, double brlcad. |
| 05:04.42 | brlcad | starseeker: ran make benchmark and make test ? |
| 05:05.09 | brlcad | have to scan the test output, it'll keep going even if it fails |
| 05:05.26 | brlcad | also be sure to do a make distcheck .. that will really show where things are pooched |
| 05:06.50 | starseeker | not yet |
| 05:07.04 | starseeker | just got done getting basics working :-) |
| 05:08.29 | brlcad | then checking both default build and --enable-all builds ;) |
| 05:09.07 | starseeker | :-) |
| 05:09.25 | starseeker | saw the release section in the HACKING file - he'll step through it |
| 05:09.39 | brlcad | then doing all those same steps for all platforms ;) |
| 05:09.48 | starseeker | this is just the first time I've had any hope at all of working ;-) |
| 05:10.01 | starseeker | will make Bob do the Windows binary :-P |
| 05:10.44 | Ralith | yawns and watchs svn scroll |
| 05:10.57 | starseeker | dreads the drive home |
| 05:11.08 | brlcad | just sent a long e-mail to the sf.net vice pres. after today's irc meeting |
| 05:11.20 | brlcad | talking about performance .. albeit web performance |
| 05:11.38 | starseeker | subversion you mean? |
| 05:11.49 | brlcad | nope, project sites |
| 05:11.56 | starseeker | ah |
| 05:11.57 | brlcad | subversion is just migration pains |
| 05:13.19 | brlcad | crap, I think I broke mged regressibility on trunk |
| 05:13.30 | starseeker | how so? |
| 05:13.55 | brlcad | the mged init changes I think, doing something odd with the scripts |
| 05:14.31 | starseeker | will hold off for the moment then (nuts) |
| 05:14.34 | brlcad | some complete, some are failing |
| 05:14.55 | starseeker | s ees it too |
| 05:15.30 | brlcad | not good, really gotta stabilize trunk |
| 05:15.37 | brlcad | this is the most instable it's been in years |
| 05:15.46 | brlcad | er, unstable |
| 05:15.52 | brlcad | uncredible |
| 05:16.10 | Ralith | web performance? |
| 05:16.17 | Ralith | it's that bad? |
| 05:16.43 | brlcad | Ralith: yes, the fact that if you go to http://sourceforge.net/projects/brlcad/ |
| 05:16.55 | brlcad | uncached, that results in approx 72 requests |
| 05:17.07 | brlcad | 23 of which are for advertisement data |
| 05:17.29 | brlcad | those 23 dominate more than 50% of the data |
| 05:18.02 | Ralith | that is a bit annoying, but is it actually a problem? |
| 05:18.17 | starseeker | adblock plus ftw |
| 05:18.58 | brlcad | about 230KB to load the page from scratch for starters .. of which abou 130KB is ad, 100KB for *everything* else |
| 05:19.15 | starseeker | yeesh |
| 05:19.15 | Ralith | 22:18:17 < starseeker> adblock plus ftw |
| 05:19.17 | Ralith | qft |
| 05:19.24 | starseeker | qft? |
| 05:19.27 | Ralith | quoted for truth |
| 05:19.33 | starseeker | heh |
| 05:19.51 | brlcad | prefers /etc/hosts |
| 05:20.04 | Ralith | /etc/hosts doesn't auto-update |
| 05:20.06 | brlcad | easier to manage, less overhead, browser agnostic |
| 05:20.24 | Ralith | adblock these days has other people blocking stuff for you |
| 05:20.28 | Ralith | which works great in practice |
| 05:20.46 | Ralith | don't remember the last time I saw an obtrusive ad |
| 05:21.15 | starseeker | isn't too picky about sf adds given how useful they are, but that's just him |
| 05:21.23 | brlcad | I don't mind some ads that are actually on-topic, low overhead, easy to ignore if I want to, etc |
| 05:21.33 | starseeker | ah |
| 05:21.46 | starseeker | edcolor is an expected unable to test in the mged regress? |
| 05:21.46 | brlcad | e.g. /.'s ads are often just fine |
| 05:22.02 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah for now |
| 05:22.06 | starseeker | k |
| 05:22.07 | Ralith | I like how /. serves microsoft ads, though |
| 05:22.12 | starseeker | make test marchs on |
| 05:22.13 | Ralith | it's funny when you see one on a ms-bashing article |
| 05:22.22 | brlcad | yep |
| 05:22.40 | Ralith | back to the point, though, sf.net has never been what I'd call terribly slow |
| 05:23.03 | Ralith | and they're providing a lot of service for a lot of people for no direct profit |
| 05:23.09 | starseeker | depends on the internet connection |
| 05:23.20 | Ralith | oh hey, my checkout finished! |
| 05:23.24 | starseeker | :-) |
| 05:23.47 | Ralith | (kind of ironic, in the context of my argument that sf has decent speeds) |
| 05:24.04 | starseeker | brlcad: 0 off by many is expected? |
| 05:24.17 | starseeker | solids.rt.pix 0 off by many |
| 05:24.51 | starseeker | if so, make test succeeded |
| 05:25.06 | starseeker | makes a note to look at the regression system's reporting |
| 05:25.27 | starseeker | wants a wtf just happened summary like the configure end of things has |
| 05:27.30 | starseeker | what a great slashdot headline: The War Against Virtual Beer Pong |
| 05:28.37 | starseeker | was sure he was losing it |
| 05:28.53 | Ralith | sets the compile going |
| 05:29.15 | brlcad | Ralith: don't get me wrong, I'm a huge sf.net supporter -- using them for nearly a decade in some fashion now |
| 05:29.37 | brlcad | that's why they even care to hear my complaint |
| 05:29.46 | brlcad | i think they do a lot of great even with the ads |
| 05:30.14 | brlcad | it's just excessive that there is actually more ad data than real content (and that a page would take 72 requests, 72 potential latency points) to load |
| 05:30.18 | Ralith | starseeker: hehe |
| 05:30.31 | starseeker | confesses to wondering if ping started the war against pong |
| 05:30.46 | Ralith | it is very frustrating when an ad site is down or something and that ruins a page's load time |
| 05:30.52 | brlcad | starseeker: yes, 0 off is good |
| 05:30.58 | starseeker | sweet |
| 05:31.04 | starseeker | is running the benchmark now |
| 05:31.10 | Ralith | but it's hard to serve ads on a site like sf.net without having lots of data-wise disproportionality |
| 05:31.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32184 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.cpp pcConstraint.h): Adding a display() method to the constraint object, modification of constructor to expect va_list * instead of (...) |
| 05:31.22 | Ralith | most project relevent data is text, while the ads are generally images or even flash |
| 05:31.28 | Ralith | (dunno if sf.net does flash ads) |
| 05:31.29 | brlcad | and shaders is known to fail with 3 off by 1 on one of the 64bit platforms so you know .. but shouldn't any where else |
| 05:31.43 | brlcad | er, 3 off by many |
| 05:31.45 | Ralith | what's that a measurement off? |
| 05:31.47 | Ralith | er |
| 05:31.48 | Ralith | of? |
| 05:31.53 | starseeker | how does sf.net look in text mode links? |
| 05:32.04 | Ralith | testing in w3m |
| 05:32.15 | Ralith | a few layout issues, but generally pretty clean |
| 05:32.52 | brlcad | if you want to speed up benchmarking for testing (since it really only needs to run each frame once for testing purposes, set the TIMEOUT environment variable to 1 |
| 05:33.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32185 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h solver_test.cpp): addConstraint method of PCSet elaborated , modifications to the PCSet::display() method |
| 05:33.14 | brlcad | er, sorry, TIMEFRAME! |
| 05:33.28 | starseeker | :-) |
| 05:33.42 | starseeker | will let it run, it's probably about halfway already |
| 05:33.51 | brlcad | e.g. TIMEFRAME=0 make benchmark |
| 05:34.00 | brlcad | or export TIMEFRAME=0, etc |
| 05:34.11 | starseeker | holy cow, NASA's Phoenix probe found water in a sample on Mars |
| 05:34.12 | brlcad | otherwise it'll take 10 minutes every time |
| 05:35.05 | brlcad | Ralith: it's a high-level integration test of the ray tracer |
| 05:35.33 | brlcad | which in turn ends up testing nearly everything in several libraries |
| 05:36.04 | starseeker | brlcad: cool, thanks! :-) that will help quite a lot |
| 05:36.27 | brlcad | it compares the ray-trace result against a known good result, if any pixel value in the resulting image is ever different -- it will detect and report |
| 05:36.48 | Ralith | starseeker: actually confirmed, not just "oh hey that looks shiny and waterlike"? |
| 05:36.58 | starseeker | Ralith: apparently |
| 05:37.06 | brlcad | "off by 1" errors and "off by many" errors indicate the RGB for a given pixel is slightly (or not so slightly) different |
| 05:37.15 | Ralith | sounds pretty rigorous. |
| 05:37.45 | starseeker | pixcmp pixels: 262070 matching, 74 off by 1, 0 off by many |
| 05:37.47 | brlcad | it is, it'll detect subtle floating point unit issues, compiler optimization bugs, etc |
| 05:37.58 | brlcad | starseeker: for benchmarking, off by 1's are fine |
| 05:38.21 | starseeker | k |
| 05:38.24 | brlcad | those are floating point differences within tolerance |
| 05:38.45 | starseeker | now why isn't there a sphflake.pix file for comparison?? |
| 05:38.46 | brlcad | 234 54 63 vs 233 54 63 |
| 05:38.56 | brlcad | there is |
| 05:39.39 | brlcad | crew:~/brlcad sean$ ls -la pix/sphflake.pix |
| 05:39.40 | brlcad | -rw-r--r-- 1 sean sean 786432 May 10 10:36 pix/sphflake.pix |
| 05:39.44 | starseeker | I must have lost it somehow... |
| 05:40.24 | brlcad | that's not good .. it's in svn .. or should be |
| 05:42.49 | brlcad | now that we have a proper image gallery in place, should get rid of the unnecessary pix files from svn |
| 05:43.01 | brlcad | move them into the gallery at some point |
| 05:43.09 | brlcad | especially .. toilet.pix |
| 05:43.29 | starseeker | is afraid to ask |
| 05:43.40 | brlcad | check it out.. |
| 05:44.18 | Ralith | build went fine |
| 05:44.21 | Ralith | running test suite |
| 05:45.17 | starseeker | thinks a student got bored... |
| 05:45.24 | brlcad | starseeker: pix-fb -h pix/toilet.pix |
| 05:45.33 | starseeker | oh, me has it up :-) |
| 05:45.40 | brlcad | that was chris johnson |
| 05:45.43 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 05:46.02 | Ralith | ugh |
| 05:46.19 | Ralith | make test popped up the mged gui while I was watching a movie fullscreen |
| 05:46.25 | Ralith | which made X freak out and die |
| 05:46.28 | brlcad | i mean neat n all, nice rounded edges, but .. heh |
| 05:46.31 | starseeker | uh oh |
| 05:46.42 | Ralith | >:| |
| 05:46.43 | brlcad | yikes |
| 05:47.03 | brlcad | starseeker: is that with the mged init code? |
| 05:48.00 | starseeker | no, it's the new mged regress test |
| 05:48.09 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 05:48.11 | starseeker | I saw an mged window flash by on my screen too |
| 05:48.16 | Ralith | ok |
| 05:48.25 | Ralith | looks like we have a problem. |
| 05:48.38 | starseeker | what's that? |
| 05:48.40 | Ralith | mplayer had nothing to do with that crash; it just happened again :| |
| 05:48.47 | starseeker | uh... |
| 05:48.58 | Ralith | might that have to do with an erroneously set BRLCAD_ROOT? |
| 05:49.13 | Ralith | no, wait, I unset that the first time around |
| 05:49.21 | Ralith | so yeah, mged seems to be killing my X on startup |
| 05:49.33 | starseeker | that's not good |
| 05:49.36 | Ralith | Xorg log: |
| 05:49.37 | Ralith | Fatal server error: |
| 05:49.37 | Ralith | Caught signal 11. Server aborting |
| 05:49.37 | starseeker | how did you build? |
| 05:49.49 | Ralith | no options to configure other than --prefix |
| 05:49.51 | starseeker | wait, you mean it's STILL not starting up |
| 05:49.53 | brlcad | starseeker: ah, one of the commands is basically "open the gui" so that seems right |
| 05:50.01 | Ralith | no, X starts up again fine :P |
| 05:50.04 | brlcad | and it intentially tests all commands (except edcolor) |
| 05:50.13 | Ralith | that's the log from when it died |
| 05:50.25 | brlcad | Ralith: sounds like an X11 bug even if we're provoking it |
| 05:50.31 | Ralith | kk |
| 05:50.35 | brlcad | i suspect it's the opengl driver killing X |
| 05:50.37 | Ralith | will test running mged by hand |
| 05:50.42 | Ralith | I'm using nvidia's proprietary driver |
| 05:50.43 | starseeker | are you getting a system Tcl/Tk? |
| 05:50.44 | Ralith | so that could be at fault |
| 05:50.49 | brlcad | and mged using opengl making it go wah |
| 05:50.50 | Ralith | no, it's using built in tcl/tk |
| 05:50.58 | starseeker | hmm |
| 05:51.02 | brlcad | you built it yourself? |
| 05:51.07 | pacman87 | i'm running nvidia prop too |
| 05:51.11 | Ralith | built which? |
| 05:51.23 | brlcad | that version of mged |
| 05:51.26 | Ralith | pacman87: yeah, but weird driver issues are likely to be hard to reproduce |
| 05:51.28 | pacman87 | i had some trouble with mged taking 100% cpu |
| 05:51.32 | Ralith | brlcad: yeah, I just built starseeker's pre |
| 05:51.33 | brlcad | i suppose if you're running make test, then yes you are.. |
| 05:51.52 | Ralith | testing mged now |
| 05:51.58 | Ralith | ... |
| 05:52.01 | brlcad | test with ./configure --enable-all --without-opengl |
| 05:52.19 | Ralith | sec |
| 05:52.21 | brlcad | mged by itself should fail similarly |
| 05:52.33 | brlcad | could try mged -c |
| 05:52.34 | Ralith | we'll find out as soon as install finishes |
| 05:52.55 | brlcad | then select X or ogl for the dm |
| 05:53.06 | Ralith | my instinct is that the failure won't happen on a standard startup |
| 05:53.10 | brlcad | X should work, ogl should fail I bet |
| 05:53.24 | Ralith | hm |
| 05:53.29 | Ralith | is there a way to run a nested X session? |
| 05:53.53 | Ralith | ah well, here goes nothing. |
| 05:54.03 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:54.10 | pacman87 | i guess that didnt work |
| 05:54.14 | starseeker | ow |
| 05:54.18 | starseeker | feels bad |
| 05:54.19 | brlcad | looks like it worked to me! |
| 05:54.35 | *** join/#brlcad saltan (n=lievensa@d51530284.access.telenet.be) | |
| 05:54.39 | pacman87 | for which defination of 'work'? |
| 05:54.40 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 05:54.43 | brlcad | hehe |
| 05:54.45 | Ralith | well |
| 05:54.49 | Ralith | you don't need me to tell you how that went |
| 05:54.59 | Ralith | how do I launch it with ogl disabled? |
| 05:55.00 | starseeker | what about rtwizard? |
| 05:55.08 | pacman87 | was that mged or mged -c? |
| 05:55.09 | brlcad | Ralith: mged -c |
| 05:55.32 | Ralith | er, wasn't there some way to set the renderer to something non-opengl? |
| 05:55.34 | brlcad | select X or nu |
| 05:55.40 | Ralith | oh |
| 05:55.42 | Ralith | right |
| 05:55.50 | Ralith | X works fine |
| 05:55.55 | Ralith | nu too |
| 05:56.00 | Ralith | testing rtwizard |
| 05:56.08 | brlcad | in nu, try "attach ogl" |
| 05:56.30 | brlcad | or just try ogl |
| 05:56.37 | brlcad | from the prompt |
| 05:56.39 | Ralith | % bin/rtwizard |
| 05:56.40 | Ralith | Itcl_Init ERROR: |
| 05:56.40 | Ralith | already installed: [incr Tcl] |
| 05:56.40 | Ralith | ERROR: Application initialization failed |
| 05:56.41 | Ralith | Error in startup script: couldn't load file "./lib/itk3.4/libitk3.4.a": Cannot open "./lib/itk3.4/libitk3.4.a" |
| 05:56.46 | Ralith | when launching rtwizard |
| 05:56.53 | Ralith | note that I've installed in a nonstandard location |
| 05:57.04 | Ralith | the app does open, but with a featureless square window |
| 05:57.08 | Ralith | ~square |
| 05:57.15 | brlcad | that's a different issue, rtwizard is a pita |
| 05:57.18 | Ralith | kk |
| 05:57.31 | Ralith | testing 'ogl' on mged -c prompt |
| 05:57.45 | Ralith | invalid command name "ogl" |
| 05:57.46 | Ralith | :P |
| 05:57.53 | Ralith | attaching instead. |
| 05:57.53 | brlcad | "attach ogl" |
| 05:57.59 | starseeker | ow |
| 05:58.00 | brlcad | or ogl during the Attach prompt |
| 05:58.10 | starseeker | thinks he figured it out |
| 05:58.34 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 05:58.36 | brlcad | I think he's just yanking our chain |
| 05:58.41 | brlcad | there's nothing wrong with it |
| 05:58.43 | Ralith | :P |
| 05:58.55 | starseeker | wonders if that happens with 7.12.4 and/or trunk |
| 05:59.07 | brlcad | starseeker: it does, known issue |
| 05:59.09 | brlcad | in the bugs file |
| 05:59.10 | Ralith | I'm running 7.12.4 as built by freebsd ports |
| 05:59.21 | Ralith | er |
| 05:59.21 | starseeker | and that does work? |
| 05:59.23 | Ralith | that is |
| 05:59.31 | Ralith | 7.12.4 as built by freebsd ports works great |
| 05:59.32 | brlcad | it is a driver bug, different versions are less catastrophic |
| 05:59.36 | Ralith | haven't tested trunk |
| 05:59.44 | starseeker | ah |
| 05:59.49 | Ralith | shall I try trunk? Is this solvable? |
| 06:00.07 | brlcad | it's based on whether we ask/get a direct opengl rendering context from glx |
| 06:00.28 | Ralith | surely there's a way to fail more elgantly than killing X? |
| 06:00.33 | brlcad | it's actually a one-character flag in one source file that usually will take it from all going to hell and not |
| 06:01.23 | Ralith | so... fixable? |
| 06:01.23 | brlcad | Ralith: iirc, it dies the first time it tries to draw on the context |
| 06:01.29 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:01.32 | Ralith | no way to safely validate the context? |
| 06:01.39 | brlcad | before that, everything checks out |
| 06:01.49 | starseeker | evil |
| 06:02.09 | starseeker | will have to ask ``Erik what the freebsd ports version does |
| 06:02.13 | pacman87 | trunk still goes 100% cpu on me without -c |
| 06:02.18 | brlcad | it avoids causing the crash by asking for a software rendering context |
| 06:02.28 | brlcad | which absolutely sucks for performance |
| 06:02.29 | Ralith | starseeker: I can see right off that the freebsd version doesn't patch anything |
| 06:02.37 | Ralith | that would suck. |
| 06:02.45 | Ralith | but I run glx things on here all the time |
| 06:02.58 | brlcad | hence the suggestion to use --without-opengl during configure |
| 06:02.58 | Ralith | what's brl-cad doing that they aren't? |
| 06:02.58 | brlcad | same functionality,but avois the crash |
| 06:03.09 | Ralith | wait, --without-opengl still allows acceleration? |
| 06:03.14 | brlcad | Ralith: feel free to debug it ;) |
| 06:03.19 | Ralith | no thanks :P |
| 06:03.27 | Ralith | has reset enough for one night |
| 06:03.43 | brlcad | sure, it often actually outperforms as the X calls have less overhead |
| 06:03.50 | Ralith | heh |
| 06:04.04 | Ralith | so long as the new gui doesn't have the issue. |
| 06:04.14 | Ralith | (it doesn't. Yet, anyway.) |
| 06:04.31 | brlcad | there's no loss in functionaltiy remember, this is pretty low level "what language am I talking to for this unknown generic display device thing" |
| 06:04.50 | Ralith | doesn't it lose hardware accel? |
| 06:04.51 | brlcad | new gui is entirely different architecture/design |
| 06:05.01 | starseeker | should we just trigger the without-opengl flag on BSD for now? |
| 06:05.04 | brlcad | only if X isn't accelerated |
| 06:05.12 | Ralith | ...huh. |
| 06:05.17 | brlcad | and if X isn't, you're not getting accelerated anything |
| 06:05.19 | Ralith | so why bother with GL at all when X is available? |
| 06:05.46 | brlcad | all the new stuff started happening in the X layer, it's more generalized |
| 06:05.53 | brlcad | er, s/X/ogl/ |
| 06:06.11 | brlcad | so for example, there's an experimental "shaded mode" |
| 06:06.15 | brlcad | that only works with ogl |
| 06:06.19 | Ralith | there is? O.O |
| 06:06.24 | Ralith | wants to play with that :( |
| 06:06.26 | brlcad | but it's so experimental that it's not used |
| 06:06.47 | Ralith | I wasn't aware we had the infastructure to support a shaded mode yet. |
| 06:06.54 | brlcad | there aren't any production-ready features in ogl that X doesn't do |
| 06:07.01 | Ralith | kk |
| 06:07.02 | brlcad | we do and we don't |
| 06:07.25 | brlcad | there has been a way in there for nearly a decade |
| 06:07.25 | starseeker | I gotta run guys - I've still got a 35 minute drive home |
| 06:07.25 | brlcad | it's just really expensive to evaluate .. and not robust |
| 06:07.33 | brlcad | starseeker: yowsa! |
| 06:07.44 | starseeker | yeah, I'm still at work :-/ |
| 06:07.45 | brlcad | cya |
| 06:07.46 | Ralith | what's it do, shoot a bunch of rays to test for depth and assemble a mesh? |
| 06:08.16 | brlcad | no, that could be done more robustly probably |
| 06:08.23 | brlcad | though it's still be relatively slow |
| 06:08.29 | starseeker | it was worth it though - now I have a firm foundation on which to shake out any release bugs :-) |
| 06:08.40 | Ralith | if it's not terribly hard to explain, how does it work? |
| 06:09.00 | brlcad | sure, so you have a geometry hierarchy |
| 06:09.04 | brlcad | starseeker: excellent! |
| 06:09.27 | brlcad | that hierarchy consists of nodes with boolean operations and leaf nodes that are primitives |
| 06:10.12 | brlcad | basically, it tessellates each primitive, then pairwise combines their mesh per the boolean operation all the way up the hierarchy |
| 06:10.18 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:10.40 | Ralith | and the mesh boolean ops have a tendency to fail? |
| 06:10.50 | Ralith | (limited accuracy aside) |
| 06:11.21 | brlcad | even the primitive tessellations can fail, though I'd characterise those more as tolerance bugs that can be fixed |
| 06:11.30 | brlcad | but yeah, the mesh boolean ops can fail |
| 06:12.01 | Ralith | That strikes me as weird, despite being an issue present in every mesh boolean tool I've seen |
| 06:12.23 | brlcad | it's an np-complete problem at that point, lots of issues come into play -- floating point tolerance, numerical drift, several O(n^3) algorithms, and more |
| 06:12.30 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:12.33 | Ralith | that's no fun at all. |
| 06:12.48 | brlcad | conceptually, it's very simple |
| 06:12.53 | brlcad | in practice, it's hell |
| 06:13.05 | Ralith | so poolio's project is basically a rehash of that done the Right Way, with no tesselation involved? |
| 06:13.21 | brlcad | especially if you try and guarantee that you end up with the same topological structure and that it's a closed solid volume (which a lot of meshers ignore) |
| 06:13.40 | brlcad | there is still tessellation, but *after* the boolean is evaluated, not before |
| 06:14.07 | brlcad | evaluating the spline surfaces against each other first, deriving evaluated spline surface results |
| 06:14.38 | brlcad | then just walking each surface and asking for a tessellation .. much more stable (and efficient) approach |
| 06:14.51 | Ralith | is it possible for a library user to get ahold of the spline data, so that one could e.g. generate a set of nice smooth vector slices appropriate for being fed into a rapid prototyper? |
| 06:14.52 | brlcad | just a bit harder to implement |
| 06:15.27 | Ralith | basically, get in before the tesselation induces imprecision? |
| 06:15.59 | brlcad | sure, conceivably with this new multirepresentation format, you can evaluate any evaluated brep object with a plane and derive a vector representation of that slice |
| 06:16.06 | Ralith | :D |
| 06:16.09 | brlcad | use that for images, for g-code generation |
| 06:16.12 | Ralith | awesome! |
| 06:16.16 | brlcad | truely |
| 06:16.48 | brlcad | for rapid prototyping, though, you can do that now discretely with ray-tracing |
| 06:17.02 | Ralith | that's good to know |
| 06:17.05 | brlcad | far far simpler to implement, should be more than sufficient to a given tolerance |
| 06:17.14 | jonored | Getting the surfaces to trace doesn't seem as straightforward with the raytracing. |
| 06:17.15 | Ralith | but for some purposes, bar extremely smart g-code generators |
| 06:17.25 | Ralith | it's much more useful to have the vectors |
| 06:17.26 | brlcad | jonored: how so? |
| 06:17.45 | Ralith | jonored: if all else fails, just boolean subtract away all but a thin slice of the object, render orthographically, rinse, repeat |
| 06:17.56 | brlcad | intersect your object (CSG intersection operation) for each layer, raytrace each layer orthogonally |
| 06:18.06 | Ralith | right, intersect. that would be easier. |
| 06:18.28 | brlcad | actually subtraction would be more efficient :) |
| 06:18.34 | Ralith | hehe |
| 06:18.44 | brlcad | but yeah, same result |
| 06:18.57 | brlcad | assuming you're on the right side ;) |
| 06:18.57 | Ralith | the great thing about the vector version, though, is machines like the reprap can accept g-code for smooth curves |
| 06:19.00 | jonored | Well, infill seems simple, but I wasn't quite seeing how to pull the outline as a curve from just raytracing. I may be being dense. |
| 06:19.17 | Ralith | which can then be printed perfectly smooth, and even at higher speed than a manyline approximation |
| 06:19.31 | Ralith | jonored: we can't, but it's no worse than what we already do. |
| 06:19.45 | brlcad | Ralith: raytrace it to a high-enough tolerance and then you can do edge reconstruction, interpolate a matching spline |
| 06:19.51 | Ralith | edge reconstruction is no fun. |
| 06:20.01 | Ralith | jonored: there's even a discussion on the reprap forums about doing a similar thing with povray. |
| 06:20.11 | brlcad | it's not, but you can sample as much as you like to find boundaries |
| 06:20.36 | Ralith | besides, there's something very satisfying about having *perfect* precision throughout the whole process |
| 06:20.39 | Ralith | barring hardware fp errors |
| 06:20.40 | jonored | ...which is why I wasn't hacking around with tcl already to get a slicer built on brl-cad. |
| 06:20.42 | brlcad | true |
| 06:21.22 | Ralith | jonored: I don't know if that would be worthwhile; brl-cad probably won't attract any serious use from the reprap guys very easily until the new gui is usable, and at that point poolio's work might be usable, too. |
| 06:21.53 | brlcad | there are several really good papers that have sprung up this year on how to efficiently evaluate surface-surface intersections, so I'm pretty hopeful/convinced we can get something working out of this |
| 06:21.54 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm the sort of guy who cares about the difference between a .01mm _| and a .01mm / |
| 06:22.06 | Ralith | great :) |
| 06:22.28 | jonored | There's a difference between using it as a modeler and using it because it has a bunch of converters in the context of writing a program. |
| 06:22.31 | Ralith | at least, in the context of application for rapidprototyping |
| 06:23.03 | Ralith | jonored: true, but you lose most of the awesomeness if you're importing non-csg data anyway. |
| 06:23.21 | brlcad | Ralith: it's actually our #1 priority project right now |
| 06:23.24 | Ralith | I'm not sure non-csg data can be very usefully imported for nonvisual purposes, anyway. |
| 06:23.31 | brlcad | followed closely behind by STEP conversion support |
| 06:23.39 | Ralith | that's really good to hear |
| 06:23.45 | brlcad | followed by new geometry engine and geometry service |
| 06:23.50 | brlcad | followed by new gui work |
| 06:23.55 | jonored | Ralith: If you use Adrian's csg-of-half-spaces interpretation for STL stuff, it seems like it imports reasonably well... |
| 06:24.11 | brlcad | they all tie in to each other though .. BREP/NURBS support is pretty foundational though |
| 06:24.16 | brlcad | hence it being top-priority |
| 06:24.35 | Ralith | jonored: csg-of-half-spaces? I'm not familiar with that. |
| 06:24.36 | brlcad | can't do good gui or conversion support without it |
| 06:25.21 | Ralith | heh |
| 06:25.23 | Ralith | here's a thought |
| 06:25.52 | brlcad | Ralith: we can import non-csg data .. ray-trace, analyze and manipulate it like any other geometry .. combine non-csg brep with csg primitives, etc |
| 06:26.10 | Ralith | I wonder if you could convert meshes to CSG fairly easily by simply generating an extruded triangule at every face, then extruding them back until they intersect another face, then unioning them all. |
| 06:26.12 | brlcad | you just have a heck of a time editing polygonal models |
| 06:26.17 | jonored | Ralith: Going and looking up the thing - if you think about it a bit, an object whose surface is made up of planar facets and one that's a CSG combination of half-spaces seem to be the same set. |
| 06:26.25 | brlcad | and there's pretty much no suport to edit spline surface models yet |
| 06:26.43 | Ralith | brlcad: I wasn't aware there was good support for boolean operations on non-csg data. that's good to hear, too. |
| 06:27.19 | brlcad | the ray trace engine will evaluate just about anything and any combination thereof |
| 06:27.29 | Ralith | neat. |
| 06:27.49 | Ralith | jonored: forgive my infamiliarity with terminology -- half spaces? |
| 06:28.16 | brlcad | it's one of the strenths of our engine, part why brl-cad exists |
| 06:28.44 | Ralith | I hope poolio's work will be as flexible. |
| 06:29.12 | jonored | Ralith: The surface is a plane, and everything on one side is in the solid, and everything on the other isn't. |
| 06:29.13 | brlcad | jonored: not sure if you're indirectly referring to it, but we have a specific primitive that is exactly that |
| 06:29.40 | brlcad | arbn .. collection of n half-spaces that form an arbitrary convex polyhedral solid |
| 06:30.11 | Ralith | no potential for nonconvex things? |
| 06:30.21 | brlcad | not using half-spaces :) |
| 06:30.28 | jonored | Ralith: Union of two of them? |
| 06:30.53 | brlcad | oh sure, you can always perform additional booleans with others |
| 06:30.56 | Ralith | jonored: I'm pretty sure they can be a bitch to cut apart computationally for that |
| 06:31.48 | brlcad | unioning two arbn's though is not the same as taking the union of all the half-spaces that those two are comprised of |
| 06:32.47 | brlcad | i.e. they're not associative |
| 06:33.47 | Ralith | arbn is an arbitrary convex solid describable by a mesh? |
| 06:34.56 | jonored | Ralith: The stuff I'm ranting about is there (admittedly without detail as to algorithm) at the bottom of http://www.reprap.org/bin/view/Main/MultipleMaterialsFiles |
| 06:35.57 | Ralith | jonored: we should add brlcad databases to the article. |
| 06:38.13 | jonored | ...You know, they do rather have all of the characteristics that we could want, don't they. Including the multiple material part. We should get a slice routine put together. That said, I am being dragged off to bed; it's 2:30 here. |
| 06:41.07 | Ralith | yeah, I've been thinking about storing material properties in region metadata for a while |
| 06:41.10 | Ralith | g'night |
| 07:05.25 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:16.08 | Ralith | brlcad: do you ever sleep? |
| 07:51.53 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:44.30 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
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| 09:10.04 | brlcad | Ralith: why bother? |
| 09:10.47 | brlcad | and yes, arbn 'can' be fairly easily described by a mesh |
| 09:11.43 | brlcad | presuming it's a convex mesh |
| 09:11.44 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E667.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 09:19.41 | brlcad | unless you do what you indicated and piecewise deconstruct a concave structure into unions of convex |
| 09:20.20 | brlcad | wanders back to code |
| 09:37.23 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:46.10 | mafm | hallo |
| 09:49.18 | Ralith | hay |
| 10:13.12 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-162-93.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 10:27.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32186 10/rt^3/trunk/data/g3d/RBGui/themes/ (9 files): Adding new icons for windows |
| 10:27.46 | Ralith | oo, icons! |
| 10:28.05 | Ralith | mafm: by the way, I think I can generate freebsd binary tarballs pretty easily |
| 10:29.32 | mafm | goody |
| 10:30.04 | mafm | I think that brlcad wanted binary tarballs for every platform, not "native formats" (deb, rpm, whatever) |
| 10:30.26 | mafm | I don't know if cmake has some support for it? |
| 10:31.05 | Ralith | it's moot |
| 10:31.13 | Ralith | you can make one by having cmake install to an empty dir |
| 10:31.14 | Ralith | then tarring up the dir |
| 10:31.46 | mafm | yep, that too :) |
| 10:34.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32187 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWindowManager.cxx GuiWindowManager.h): Adding new method for getting the default theme being used (and thus be able to ask for resources like images easily) |
| 10:34.53 | Ralith | I really need to get to sleep, anyway |
| 10:34.54 | Ralith | good luck |
| 10:35.12 | Ralith | if you come up with anything you'd like to delegate to me, just let me know |
| 10:36.10 | mafm | Ralith: I think that we need to talk more deeply soon |
| 10:36.25 | Ralith | alright |
| 10:36.32 | mafm | but this weekend I'm going to a festival and wouldn't return until tuesday or so :D |
| 10:36.36 | Ralith | :| |
| 10:36.47 | mafm | I really need a break |
| 10:36.51 | Ralith | kk |
| 10:36.53 | mafm | ;) |
| 10:36.57 | Ralith | you can always just write up something and email me |
| 10:37.05 | Ralith | I'm happy to work on whatever |
| 10:37.13 | mafm | yep, maybe I even join from my parent's home too :) |
| 10:37.21 | Ralith | kk |
| 10:37.28 | mafm | as for areas ready to work in, packaging is a good candidate |
| 10:37.32 | mafm | if you like that |
| 10:37.41 | Ralith | well |
| 10:37.44 | Ralith | not much I can do for that |
| 10:37.48 | Ralith | don't have linux boxes handy |
| 10:37.56 | Ralith | and screw setting up a win32 dev environment |
| 10:38.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32188 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiCamera.cxx: Showing the new icons |
| 10:38.18 | mafm | do you prefer programming? |
| 10:38.19 | Ralith | I'm pretty sure I can already throw together a BSD tarball on short notice |
| 10:38.29 | Ralith | of course I prefer programming :P |
| 10:38.46 | mafm | maybe you would like to take care of the camera system? |
| 10:39.10 | Ralith | that's fairly large, and I have no past experience with ogre or rbgui, but I'd love to give it a try |
| 10:39.26 | Ralith | what you have right now *should* be plenty to learn-by-example from |
| 10:39.30 | Ralith | thanks! |
| 10:39.34 | mafm | RBGui is not involved, except for the focusing maybe that you said :) |
| 10:39.49 | Ralith | well, and there are some settings I'd like to have exposed in a guifical way |
| 10:40.06 | mafm | like zooming in and rotating? |
| 10:40.18 | Ralith | actually not coming to mind at the moment |
| 10:40.36 | mafm | the current window that I'm creating is for that |
| 10:40.37 | Ralith | probably because it's 3:40 AM where I am |
| 10:40.38 | mafm | camera control :) |
| 10:40.46 | mafm | ok, so we'll talk in another moment |
| 10:40.49 | mafm | good night! :) |
| 10:40.49 | Ralith | yeah, that sounded relevant |
| 10:41.04 | Ralith | and things like precision position display/entry seem appropriate for the console |
| 10:41.21 | Ralith | maybe a small overlay text could show current az/el/etc? |
| 10:41.53 | Ralith | discussions to be had later I suppose. |
| 10:41.54 | Ralith | g'night! |
| 10:42.06 | mafm | I guess ;) |
| 10:57.16 | mafm | brlcad: getting more minions for the WDMP |
| 11:34.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32189 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/src/ (68 files in 15 dirs): |
| 11:37.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32190 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/ (.classpath .project): |
| 11:41.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32191 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/src/stractNet/SNRoot.java: Testing commit from windows |
| 11:46.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32192 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/ (5 files): |
| 12:26.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32193 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractThread/ (15 files in 4 dirs): |
| 12:27.17 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-162-93.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 12:28.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32194 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractThread/docs/: |
| 12:29.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32195 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 13:03.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32196 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/src/stractNet/messaging/ (MessageDispatcher.java MessagingSystem.java): |
| 13:13.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32197 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/stractNet.eap: |
| 13:30.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32198 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (7 files): Enhancing camera modes by adding bindings for actions in the camera control window |
| 13:31.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32199 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiCamera.cxx GuiCamera.h): Bind actions in camera control window with camera modes |
| 13:39.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32200 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/ (stractNet.eap stractNet.ldb): |
| 13:56.31 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-85-94.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 14:13.15 | mafm | I go for the weekend, to my homeland |
| 14:13.28 | mafm | to a festival, to visit my parents, friends, etc |
| 14:13.58 | mafm | so I think that I won't be back until tuesday, in the case that somebody wonders why I won't be here |
| 14:50.01 | *** join/#brlcad clock__ (n=clock@77-56-85-94.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 15:01.53 | starseeker | regains consciousness |
| 16:12.31 | starseeker | brlcad: Hmm - has the mged regression test ever been run in an out-of-tree build situation before? |
| 16:14.56 | starseeker | mged appears to have built and installed successfully, but the regress script couldn't find |
| 16:15.00 | starseeker | it |
| 16:17.00 | brlcad | ~wdmp |
| 16:17.35 | *** join/#brlcad elite01_ (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:17.37 | brlcad | starseeker: I don't think so |
| 16:18.11 | starseeker | wdmp? |
| 16:18.14 | brlcad | rather, "maybe" but it's not really critical .. it just needs to work for 'some' configuration |
| 16:18.22 | brlcad | 06:57 < mafm> brlcad: getting more minions for the WDMP |
| 16:18.30 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 16:19.32 | brlcad | has no idea what that means :) |
| 16:44.11 | poolio | web development marketing and promotion? |
| 16:45.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32201 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/proc-db/tire.1 src/proc-db/tire.c): |
| 16:45.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Add w option to tire to allow modelers to avoid wheel/rim generation (also |
| 16:45.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: changes how air region is built accordingly) - eventually this option will also |
| 16:45.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: be used to specify different wheel types but right now the only options are on |
| 16:45.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: and off. |
| 16:45.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32202 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/proc-db/ (tire.1 tire.c): Add tire updates from trunk r32201 |
| 17:12.39 | starseeker | grr |
| 17:12.40 | starseeker | make[2]: Entering directory `/home/cyapp/cadtoplevel/brlcad/release-build/misc/pkgconfig' |
| 17:12.44 | starseeker | make[2]: *** No rule to make target `liwdb.pc.in', needed by `distdir'. Stop. |
| 17:13.07 | brlcad | sup? |
| 17:13.14 | starseeker | make distcheck failed |
| 17:13.19 | starseeker | on the above problem |
| 17:13.21 | brlcad | you want to know the fix? |
| 17:13.21 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 17:13.26 | starseeker | twood be nice |
| 17:13.30 | brlcad | tis a one-character typo |
| 17:13.35 | brlcad | libwdb |
| 17:13.53 | starseeker | turns mildly red |
| 17:14.01 | brlcad | so there's a liwdb.pc probably listed in configure.ac |
| 17:14.07 | poolio | starseeker: :) |
| 17:14.19 | brlcad | either there or in misc/pkgconfig/Makefile.am |
| 17:14.22 | poolio | brlcad: are you at your office? |
| 17:14.51 | brlcad | poolio: no, I'm not - sup? |
| 17:15.14 | poolio | was just wondering if you could send me some schtuff. maybe the next time your in, it's on the desktop as a .zip again |
| 17:15.31 | brlcad | ah, hold on |
| 17:15.48 | poolio | *you're. My grammar is terrible on IRC :\ |
| 17:15.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32203 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/misc/pkgconfig/Makefile.am: Oops, thanks Sean - typo in pkgconfig Makefile.am |
| 17:15.59 | starseeker | needs to get into the office, now that his brain has booted |
| 17:16.30 | starseeker | must have introduced that himself when he removed libpc |
| 17:16.31 | starseeker | gah |
| 17:17.21 | starseeker | Oh well, at least I won't have to hear complaints about how hard it is to remove rims from a tire generated wheel :-) |
| 17:17.22 | brlcad | poolio: yeah, I gather it's off the net .. I should have it later today |
| 17:17.48 | brlcad | starseeker: nah, I think that was there and later fixed |
| 17:17.53 | poolio | alrighty. no rush, I just wanted to get some work in this weekend before I head off |
| 17:17.57 | brlcad | so you're just a couple revisions shy |
| 17:18.13 | starseeker | <snort> and after all that rev by rev updating too... |
| 17:20.39 | starseeker | /bin/sh ../pre-7-12-6/sh/cmakecheck.sh |
| 17:20.39 | starseeker | ERROR: cannot find src/libbn/CMakeLists.txt |
| 17:20.51 | starseeker | oh, cmakecheck.sh |
| 17:20.55 | starseeker | I hadn't tested it |
| 17:21.01 | starseeker | certainly not out of source |
| 17:22.07 | brlcad | yeah, it assumes pwd is a specific place |
| 17:22.23 | starseeker | notices - so make distcheck should be run only in-tree? |
| 17:22.37 | starseeker | gah, my CMakeLists are way out of sync |
| 17:26.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32204 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Update cmake lists to avoid MISSING errors in cmakecheck.sh, should check that they really do match source trees |
| 17:26.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32205 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: make the cmake distcheck check work out of dir (untested) |
| 17:26.57 | starseeker | :-) |
| 17:27.11 | starseeker | can you do the mged regress script to? :-) :-) |
| 17:29.13 | brlcad | it's not the only one, most of them aren't set up for it |
| 17:29.37 | starseeker | OK, nevermind - I'll reconfigure |
| 17:31.00 | brlcad | what's the actual error? |
| 17:31.12 | brlcad | if you run "make mged" in the regress dir? |
| 17:32.21 | starseeker | I think it couldn't find mged, i'll run it as sone as autoconf shuts up... |
| 17:32.49 | starseeker | Unable to find mged, aborting |
| 17:32.49 | starseeker | make: [mged] Error 1 (ignored) |
| 17:40.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32206 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/ (8 files): go an extra mile to find mged and set up paths properly regardless of the compile being in or out of dir -- untested and there are undoubtedly other commands, but it's one step |
| 17:44.09 | starseeker | brlcad: that dir command doesn't work in Makefile.am - tries to change to directory "ir" |
| 17:44.40 | starseeker | I think you want something like currdir="`pwd`" ; cd $(top_srcdir) && ${SH} $(top_srcdir)/sh/cmakecheck.sh ; cd $(currdir) |
| 17:45.25 | starseeker | aaah, crud |
| 17:45.41 | starseeker | messes up his out of source build by configuring for an in-source one |
| 17:46.02 | starseeker | OK, I've got to get in there - this is looking good though :-) |
| 17:46.32 | starseeker | brlcad: Didn't mean to pull you off your other stuff, I know this is supposed to by my baby right now :-/ |
| 17:52.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32207 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: oops, it's a shell var |
| 17:52.44 | brlcad | you have to escape the $ since it's a shell var, not a makefile var |
| 18:12.29 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-162-93.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 19:15.26 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 20:02.44 | *** join/#brlcad cad75 (n=584adef1@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:26.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32208 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (TODO pcNetwork.h pcPCSet.h solver_test.cpp): code rearrangement, addition of BinaryNetwork(PCSet &) constructor skeleton. seems like BinaryNetwork needs to be de-templated as well |
| 20:31.14 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 20:31.14 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || BRL-CAD is participating in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || Release 7.12.4 is posted (source-only release) | |
| 20:51.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32209 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (TODO pcNetwork.h solver_test.cpp): BinaryNetwork generation from PCSet complete.. implicit assumption that all the variables are of the same type dut to BinaryNetwork<T> |
| 21:09.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32210 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (TODO pcConstraint.cpp pcConstraint.h pcNetwork.h): renaming evaluating functor of a constraint to eval from funct, making the Variable list of constraint object private for encapsulation |
| 22:09.50 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.12.47) | |
| 22:26.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32211 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Update r32205, r32206 - steps towards out-of-tree regression testing. |
| 22:38.59 | starseeker | well, out-of-tree still doesn't seem mged but in-tree make distcheck seems to be succeeding. |
| 22:40.52 | Ralith | was a workaround going to be implemented for the driver issues I hit, or are we going to rely on ports to disable opengl at the configure stage? |
| 22:47.06 | starseeker | Probably the latter at the moment :-( |
| 22:47.49 | Ralith | nothing new as far as ports is concerned |
| 22:48.05 | Ralith | who's "erik@smluc.org"? |
| 22:48.11 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14E667.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:48.26 | Ralith | (he's listed as the port maintainer) |
| 22:49.30 | Ralith | if this problem is common on nvidia/freebsd it would be bad to make a release without the workaround |
| 22:55.32 | starseeker | I believe it's ``Erik here |
| 22:55.43 | starseeker | the workaround may take weeks |
| 22:55.52 | starseeker | I have no idea how hard it would be |
| 22:56.39 | starseeker | someone with more knowledge of that part of the system might be able to track it down faster, but I don't have the expert knowledge yet :-/ |
| 22:57.03 | starseeker | would have a lot of learning to do just to get started :-( |
| 22:57.37 | Ralith | starseeker: uh, the workaround is disabling opengl :P |
| 22:57.51 | Ralith | you're thinking of the fix. |
| 22:57.55 | starseeker | Oh, gotcha |
| 22:58.05 | Ralith | ``Erik: you around? |
| 22:58.21 | starseeker | the fix is to get BSD's drivers fixed ;-) |
| 22:59.37 | Ralith | yeah, good luck convincing nvidia to do something about that. |
| 22:59.48 | starseeker | indeed :/ |
| 23:00.02 | starseeker | YAY make distcheck succeeded |
| 23:02.28 | Ralith | :D |
| 23:02.30 | starseeker | ``Erik may pop in later |
| 23:05.07 | Ralith | so long as later is before he puts up the port. |
| 23:08.35 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:33.59 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.23.224) | |
| 00:37.21 | brlcad | yawns |
| 01:06.17 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 01:58.26 | starseeker | brlcad: I don't seem to have svn2cl on my box - where's the right place to get it from? |
| 01:58.55 | starseeker | is awed brlcad is still awake, and wonders if there will be an east coast coffee shortage soon |
| 01:59.44 | starseeker | http://ch.tudelft.nl/~arthur/svn2cl/ ? |
| 02:01.38 | starseeker | yay, portage has it |
| 02:01.43 | starseeker | emerge ftw |
| 02:02.34 | brlcad | haven't gotten to caffeination yet |
| 02:02.37 | brlcad | maybe tonight |
| 02:03.00 | brlcad | yeah, there's only one svn2cl .. though various versions |
| 02:03.28 | starseeker | tries 0.9 |
| 02:03.32 | brlcad | some older ones don't have the --break-before-message option |
| 02:03.40 | brlcad | if not, just leave it off, not important |
| 02:03.43 | starseeker | k |
| 02:03.49 | brlcad | other versions are buggy and won't work without --stdout and a redirect |
| 02:04.03 | starseeker | will just be sucking in the branch history anyway, which is mildly embarassing |
| 02:04.25 | brlcad | it is what it is |
| 02:04.48 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:04.49 | brlcad | cranks up the music since nobody is around |
| 02:04.56 | starseeker | you're into work? |
| 02:05.19 | brlcad | yeah, needed a change of scenery |
| 02:05.30 | starseeker | wow |
| 02:05.32 | brlcad | and the friday night sci-fi rotation is too tempting |
| 02:05.36 | starseeker | :-) |
| 02:08.08 | starseeker | hates to have to ask this, but... is there a special way a "portable" Linux binary is built? |
| 02:08.16 | starseeker | ditto for Mac |
| 02:12.01 | brlcad | in what sense? |
| 02:12.22 | brlcad | making one binary that works any/everywhere? |
| 02:21.53 | brlcad | not possible, at least not for all values of any/every |
| 02:34.50 | brlcad | what you can usually get, though, is portable to a given version of libc |
| 02:35.06 | brlcad | still architecture specific |
| 02:35.52 | Ralith | starseeker: compile all the libs in and make sure it knows where to look for config data? |
| 02:36.02 | Ralith | relative paths everwhar, etc |
| 02:36.10 | brlcad | mac goes a lot farther and there's ways to make a 'universal' binary, but we're not fully set up for that (requires dynamic runtime endian checks) |
| 02:36.33 | brlcad | Ralith: that's not practical for a brl-cad release |
| 02:36.47 | brlcad | compiling in all the libs will result in a binary install that is a couple GB in size |
| 02:37.30 | Ralith | O.o |
| 02:37.31 | brlcad | we are already relocatable, that bit was done a while back |
| 02:37.59 | Ralith | yay |
| 03:10.04 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 03:24.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32212 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): Making constraint check (Constraint::check() ) be argumentless by passing PCSet reference and Varialbe id list to the eval functor: stage 1/2 - all the changes outside the functor implementation |
| 03:27.43 | starseeker | just needs to know how to do the binary builds for the release |
| 03:30.41 | brlcad | damn, houdini event is already full |
| 03:31.49 | brlcad | starseeker: i can answer the questions, but a bit of it is platform-specific so I'd ask as the questions come up |
| 03:32.01 | starseeker | ok |
| 03:32.10 | brlcad | the general process is after testing is complete, take these steps |
| 03:33.24 | brlcad | ensure /usr/brlcad exists but without any /usr/brlcad/rel-* directories (you can move them out and back if needed) |
| 03:34.36 | brlcad | for config, you'll want to use on all(?) platforms: ./configure --enable-all --enable-optimized --without-opengl --prefix=/usr/brlcad/rel-7.12.6 |
| 03:35.01 | brlcad | make sure it compiles, passes tests, run /usr/brlcad/bin/mged and do some quick sanity checking |
| 03:36.06 | brlcad | then make sure there are symbolic links in /usr/brlcad for bin, include, lib, man, and share that point to stable/same .. and then a stable link that points to rel-7.12.6 |
| 03:37.08 | brlcad | so you end up with something like: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m6897f220 |
| 03:37.51 | brlcad | then two steps remain, make the tarballs and uploads to sf.net |
| 03:38.52 | brlcad | tarball can be made with: sh/make_tar.sh BRL-CAD 7.12.6 /usr/brlcad |
| 03:39.47 | starseeker | excellent - thank you! |
| 03:39.49 | brlcad | make a copy of that and encrypt in bz2, gz, and zip format using: sh/make_bz2.sh BRL-CAD |
| 03:40.03 | starseeker | encrypt... - you mean compress? |
| 03:40.07 | brlcad | er, yeah |
| 03:40.21 | brlcad | wow, what a slip back to pre open source days |
| 03:40.22 | starseeker | didn't know we signed release tarballs |
| 03:40.37 | brlcad | there used to be an encrypt step :) |
| 03:40.39 | starseeker | heh - password alphabeta? |
| 03:40.43 | brlcad | not signed, actually encrypted |
| 03:41.59 | brlcad | each platform in turn has a specific naming convention it should use, documented in HACKING |
| 03:42.42 | brlcad | NAMING A SOURCE RELEASE and NAMING A BINARY RELEASE sections |
| 03:43.09 | brlcad | source tarball is lowercase, binaries are upper |
| 03:43.20 | brlcad | thinks "what else" |
| 03:44.35 | brlcad | ah yes, uploading to sourceforge -- there are instructions on sf site for using the file release system (FRS), basically entails using sftp, adding a version entry for each platform, setting the news and release notes, then selecting that binary |
| 03:45.15 | brlcad | I can walk you through that part when you get to it, it's one of the few where you really don't want to make a mistake because there are several actions that are absolutely unrecoverable through the FRS |
| 03:45.25 | starseeker | OK |
| 03:45.40 | brlcad | (never delete anything! .. unless you are 100% sure what you're doing is okay) |
| 03:45.45 | starseeker | :-) |
| 03:46.09 | brlcad | once you hit the "notify users", there is no going back too |
| 03:46.30 | starseeker | OK |
| 03:46.43 | brlcad | and no removal of a bad tarball after the first day even if there is a problem -- have to upload a new rev |
| 03:46.52 | brlcad | i.e. it's forward-only |
| 03:47.04 | brlcad | thinks that about covers it |
| 03:47.14 | starseeker | make distcheck succeeded on the Mac, along with the other tests, but I still need to check Linux and think figure out what to do about a Windows build |
| 03:47.42 | starseeker | Not to mention invent some release notes for the NEWS file... |
| 03:47.56 | brlcad | then there is a slew of announcements that go out, but I'd hold off on those |
| 03:48.02 | starseeker | sure |
| 03:48.13 | starseeker | will let brlcad decide when/if to notify anyone |
| 03:48.43 | brlcad | minor releases don't *have* to have additional release notes -- depends on what is worth emphasizing |
| 03:49.22 | brlcad | all the various announcement outlets have their own format requirements anyways, you never get to just write it once and use it everywhere |
| 03:50.10 | starseeker | Oh, sure - I'm just trying to decide about the NEWS file in the distro |
| 03:50.18 | starseeker | maybe the pipe improvements? |
| 03:50.19 | brlcad | the linux-cad mailing list needs to be linux-centric, freshmeat wants a human-readable short paragraph only, our news list is all events since the last posting, main website is that release, sf site has additional footer info, ... :) |
| 03:50.40 | starseeker | blegh ;-) |
| 03:50.42 | brlcad | usually spends an entire day formulating the appropriate notifications if it's a big release |
| 03:51.59 | brlcad | reads the list |
| 03:52.17 | brlcad | ah, hell -- the nirt changes are definitely worth calling out |
| 03:54.04 | brlcad | as well as the mged (various) changes |
| 03:54.11 | brlcad | and the tire changes |
| 03:54.16 | brlcad | that's two or three paras |
| 03:55.49 | brlcad | then all it needs.. |
| 03:55.53 | brlcad | ~cowbell starseeker |
| 03:55.54 | ibot | starseeker, try it with a little more cowbell ... really explore the object space this time |
| 03:56.24 | starseeker | isn't familiar with the reference |
| 03:56.31 | brlcad | heh, really? |
| 03:56.34 | brlcad | ~cowbell |
| 03:56.34 | ibot | they're gonna want more cowbell in your program |
| 03:56.45 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 03:57.18 | starseeker | can try writing notes, but knows how particular brlcad is about such things - should it wait until you have time? |
| 03:57.19 | brlcad | http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1721265933126353939 |
| 03:57.39 | starseeker | suspects he will be testing for a day or two yet, particularly with windows thrown in |
| 04:05.37 | starseeker | needs to check and make sure which of the MGED improvements made it in |
| 04:07.46 | Ralith | imagines a cwbl primitive |
| 04:08.05 | starseeker | that'd be some funky primitive math ;-) |
| 04:08.18 | starseeker | Ralith: btw, thanks for testing the build on FreeBSD |
| 04:08.21 | Ralith | no problem |
| 04:08.33 | Ralith | I don't think I ever ran all the way through 'make test' though |
| 04:08.33 | starseeker | was rather sleep deprived at that point, can't remember if he said that |
| 04:08.38 | Ralith | I'll update and rebuild and do that again |
| 04:08.44 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 04:09.04 | Ralith | happy to contribute |
| 04:09.15 | starseeker | I'll make sure to check with ``Erik about the port and keeping the opengl disabled |
| 04:09.24 | Ralith | thanks |
| 04:14.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32213 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (7 files in 6 dirs): Update all the version numbers I can spot, start tweaking the NEWS file. |
| 04:14.25 | starseeker | grr - comcast, quit messing with my ssh connection |
| 04:15.49 | Ralith | <3 grep |
| 04:17.39 | starseeker | grepped, but sometimes the pieces are scattered |
| 04:19.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32214 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ChangeLog: Release ChangeLog, per HACKING. Since this release is a true branch and not a tagging of trunk, ChangeLog is from pre-7-12-6 branch - the release building effort. |
| 04:20.00 | Ralith | testing |
| 04:20.03 | Ralith | prays it won't eat X |
| 04:20.13 | starseeker | without opengl, it shouldn't |
| 04:20.22 | Ralith | yeah |
| 04:20.24 | Ralith | but you know X. |
| 04:20.28 | starseeker | heh |
| 04:20.32 | Ralith | it's so very... edible. |
| 04:20.41 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:20.43 | starseeker | mmm, crunchy |
| 04:20.53 | starseeker | that's not good |
| 04:21.31 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 04:21.35 | starseeker | ow |
| 04:21.36 | Ralith | --disable-opengl, huh? |
| 04:21.48 | starseeker | suggests grabbing the config flags used by the port |
| 04:21.50 | Ralith | that doesn't seem to have disabled anything. |
| 04:21.57 | Ralith | I didn't use the port |
| 04:22.01 | starseeker | I know |
| 04:22.02 | Ralith | I configured it manually :P |
| 04:22.07 | Ralith | orite |
| 04:22.20 | Ralith | but didn't we isolate this to the GL stuffs already? |
| 04:22.33 | Ralith | why doesn't --disable-opengl stop it from using opengl in mged? |
| 04:22.39 | starseeker | did you do a make clean |
| 04:22.51 | Ralith | ...wups |
| 04:22.56 | Ralith | I thought GBS was smarter than that |
| 04:23.15 | Ralith | rebuilding from scratch. |
| 04:23.19 | starseeker | not sure - given you got death by gl, my first response is to scrub |
| 04:24.11 | Ralith | reasonable |
| 04:24.26 | Ralith | iirc I didn't make test last night cuz the mged binary was inexplicably dated to before my reconfigured rebuild |
| 04:24.33 | starseeker | did you do make install or are you running from the build tree? |
| 04:24.39 | Ralith | build tree |
| 04:24.46 | starseeker | hmm |
| 04:24.54 | starseeker | yeah, clean out that sucker |
| 04:25.00 | Ralith | did, building again |
| 04:25.03 | starseeker | cool |
| 04:25.09 | Ralith | would be angry if he didn't have a dual core |
| 04:25.34 | starseeker | didn't realize he had gotten a dual core until he installed it |
| 04:25.48 | starseeker | <3 dual core |
| 04:26.10 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:26.20 | Ralith | seriously; I never imagined it'd be this helpful. |
| 04:26.51 | starseeker | me either - all of a sudden I could do two things at once without straining the system :-) |
| 04:27.12 | Ralith | compiling and watching a movie go well together |
| 04:27.30 | starseeker | 'cept for when I forget to compile in the kernel's disk IO drivers - no helping performance then |
| 04:28.26 | Ralith | blinks |
| 04:28.37 | Ralith | uh, without disk I/O drivers, how is your system operable? |
| 04:29.39 | brlcad | neat, there will be an advanced screening of the clone wars |
| 04:30.05 | Ralith | the clone wars? |
| 04:30.15 | Ralith | did we hop back several years or something? |
| 04:30.21 | PrezKennedy | Star Wars 2.5 "The Clone wars have raged for years, and now we take an inside look because George Lucas has decided he needs more cash." |
| 04:30.25 | brlcad | the new one coming out in a couple weeks |
| 04:30.28 | Ralith | oh. |
| 04:30.29 | Ralith | that. |
| 04:30.45 | Ralith | you know it's bad when they start releasing minor versions |
| 04:30.57 | brlcad | yeah, maybe meh, but the animations look like it might be interesting |
| 04:31.15 | brlcad | and can't beat a free screening (assuming it doesn't conflict with something) |
| 04:32.24 | brlcad | not --disable-opengl .. it's --without-opengl |
| 04:32.29 | PrezKennedy | They should do Star Wars: Episode 4 -- The Animated Movie |
| 04:32.34 | Ralith | :| |
| 04:32.37 | brlcad | enable/disable is internal, with/without is external |
| 04:32.55 | starseeker | whoops |
| 04:33.01 | starseeker | should have spotted that |
| 04:33.31 | brlcad | INSTALL file details ftw |
| 04:34.06 | Ralith | restarts the build again. |
| 04:35.01 | brlcad | how the pixar night on tuesday .. that should be great |
| 04:37.37 | brlcad | i totally shouldn't have looked at the siggraph site.. so .. distracted .. and .. excited |
| 04:37.43 | Ralith | wut? |
| 04:37.56 | brlcad | Ralith: ever been to siggraph? |
| 04:37.59 | Ralith | nah |
| 04:38.03 | Ralith | sounds interesting though |
| 04:38.07 | brlcad | ah, explains it ;) |
| 04:38.14 | Ralith | lots of projects I follow/have followed are represented there |
| 04:38.19 | brlcad | it's "the" event for anyone and everyone in computer graphics |
| 04:38.24 | Ralith | yeah, I know a bit about it |
| 04:38.37 | Ralith | does BRL-CAD offer a presence? |
| 04:38.39 | brlcad | I turn into a giddy school girl every year right about this time |
| 04:38.42 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:39.05 | brlcad | yeah, we've held BoF's in the past, technical papers, collaborations |
| 04:39.17 | Ralith | fun! |
| 04:39.24 | brlcad | we'll have several guys attending this year |
| 04:40.13 | brlcad | if you feel the urge to drive the distance, glad to treat you to drinks on me! :-) |
| 04:40.27 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:40.35 | brlcad | not sure a couple hundred bucks in gas are work a couple dozen in drinks though :) |
| 04:40.36 | Ralith | I'd love to, but it's infeasible |
| 04:41.01 | starseeker | hasn't been before either, so he is clueless - just wants to make sure he gets to the most useful things for him |
| 04:41.10 | brlcad | starseeker: any ideas of something we can render? |
| 04:41.10 | Ralith | you're going? |
| 04:41.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32215 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): much needed cleaning up of pcNetwork.h and separation of code into pcNetwork.cpp, removal of obsolete functions |
| 04:41.35 | starseeker | Ralith: yep |
| 04:41.40 | brlcad | starseeker: only if you leave the center early or just aren't paying attention will you not find "too much" useful |
| 04:41.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Heh |
| 04:42.00 | brlcad | you're barraged by information, ideas, people, research, graphics, ... |
| 04:42.05 | starseeker | brlcad: render for... |
| 04:42.10 | brlcad | for a poster! |
| 04:42.13 | starseeker | Ah |
| 04:42.21 | starseeker | ... a moose? ;-) |
| 04:42.31 | brlcad | there is usually a guerilla studio where you can get just about anything printed up in large-scale format |
| 04:42.34 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:43.27 | brlcad | was thinking more along the lines of maybe a super-high detailed tire with tread, texturing, .. the works |
| 04:43.34 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 04:43.37 | starseeker | that would be cool |
| 04:43.44 | brlcad | or even one of the old gsi images .. shiny tank |
| 04:44.12 | starseeker | didn't want to seem like he was tooting his own horn |
| 04:44.13 | Ralith | that's certainly very iconic of brlcad. |
| 04:44.14 | brlcad | or I could get the source visualization working again .. that would be cool |
| 04:44.22 | Ralith | source visualization? |
| 04:44.47 | starseeker | brlcad: Any models better than m35 I could put nice tires on? |
| 04:45.03 | Ralith | imagines a tank with a spare tire on the back |
| 04:45.04 | brlcad | Ralith: I worked on a tool a couple siggraphs ago for fun that lets you visualize an entire codebase (in source code / text form) as one mega image |
| 04:45.16 | Ralith | got any screenshots? |
| 04:45.26 | brlcad | with syntax hilighting, merge blend with another image |
| 04:45.33 | brlcad | mm, not on hand |
| 04:45.36 | Ralith | aw. |
| 04:46.10 | starseeker | sounds like that project some years back that made a map of the linux kernel as a huge postscript file |
| 04:46.34 | starseeker | can never remember the name of the project |
| 04:46.56 | starseeker | Ah - Free Code Graphing Project |
| 04:47.02 | Ralith | myself I was always impressed by the translucent renderings of the fully modeled bradleys and such |
| 04:47.03 | brlcad | this is more like catting every file together (sans src/other of course) in the tiniest font that remains legible |
| 04:47.07 | starseeker | http://fcgp.sourceforge.net/ |
| 04:47.11 | starseeker | hehe |
| 04:47.19 | Ralith | although those don't really show off any new features |
| 04:47.22 | brlcad | then you have something that actually prints at about 600 dpi in (huge!) poster size |
| 04:47.23 | Ralith | they look *very* cool |
| 04:47.38 | Ralith | brlcad: hm, it would be more interesting to visualize it abstractly |
| 04:47.45 | starseeker | likes the way his earth model came out, but it's waaaay too simple for a BRL-CAD poster |
| 04:48.03 | Ralith | huge amounts of code are cool and all |
| 04:48.06 | brlcad | starseeker: could try running that (fcgp) on brl-cad sources, see how it looks |
| 04:48.08 | Ralith | but, I mean, it's a literal wall of text. |
| 04:48.27 | starseeker | dunno if it would work - I think it takes a lot of customization |
| 04:48.30 | Ralith | brlcad has more interesting things to show off than how many lines of code it has. |
| 04:48.52 | brlcad | Ralith: there's an idea (old talk with transparency), but they take a lot of time to get approval on |
| 04:48.56 | starseeker | would be an awesome thing if it did work though |
| 04:49.13 | brlcad | if would have to be something already done .. and even then even more effort to dig up the .g |
| 04:49.29 | Ralith | don't you still have high resolution copies of those ones in the gallery? |
| 04:49.43 | brlcad | some of them |
| 04:49.50 | brlcad | the gsi ones, yes |
| 04:49.51 | Ralith | I mean, just a small grid of nice big printouts of the more clean images from the gallery would be very cool. |
| 04:49.58 | Ralith | the gsi ones were what I had in mind |
| 04:50.05 | Ralith | and there's always sphflake. |
| 04:50.18 | brlcad | well, we're not making marketing materials -- we can do that any time |
| 04:50.35 | starseeker | idly wonders what would be a good tire texture... |
| 04:50.49 | brlcad | we get maybe one or two free printouts at siggraph, so it's usually fun to do something new |
| 04:50.53 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 04:51.07 | brlcad | printouts that commercially are normally 50-100 a pop |
| 04:51.18 | brlcad | bring it back, frame it, etc |
| 04:51.19 | Ralith | yeah, I was thinking about how expensive poster size at 600dpi would be |
| 04:51.36 | starseeker | would live to take a ruler and go find an old m35 somewhere - could REALLY improve the model |
| 04:52.12 | starseeker | wonders what the m35 would look like in surface normal rendering... |
| 04:52.21 | brlcad | large format printings, variable size, but common is 2'x4' (yes feet) though you can go bigger if they like what you're printing |
| 04:52.29 | Ralith | I don't suppose the new lighting system from the SoC has anything to show yet? |
| 04:52.45 | Ralith | I want a printer like that |
| 04:52.46 | brlcad | nah, he won't be done in time |
| 04:52.50 | Ralith | aw. |
| 04:52.54 | Ralith | not even a pretty WIP? |
| 04:53.14 | brlcad | would be faster to try to get rise working on a tessellation |
| 04:53.21 | Ralith | rise? |
| 04:53.42 | brlcad | the realistic image synthesis engine, part of ADRT .. the stryker image is a rise image |
| 04:54.03 | Ralith | oo, that one |
| 04:54.14 | Ralith | adrt isn't part of brlcad? |
| 04:54.18 | brlcad | it is |
| 04:54.32 | brlcad | but there's a fair bit of prep .. it's cumbersome |
| 04:54.49 | Ralith | review the image to see render time 5 days |
| 04:54.50 | Ralith | ...wow. |
| 04:54.53 | brlcad | great results, but not user friendly :) |
| 04:55.14 | brlcad | that was before some optimizations -- that same image would take about a day with current resources |
| 04:55.20 | Ralith | on 48 xeons. |
| 04:55.25 | Ralith | still... |
| 04:55.33 | Ralith | well, I guess raytracing all that grass would be a huge drain |
| 04:55.36 | brlcad | yeah, there is a lot of devil in the detail there too |
| 04:55.55 | Ralith | is still amazed by the detail of models like that one. |
| 04:55.58 | brlcad | every blade of grass, every leaf, every nut bolt and wire inside the vehicle |
| 04:56.03 | Ralith | shame they're so hard to get released |
| 04:56.16 | brlcad | performing a full global illumination simultion (via forward path tracing) |
| 04:57.02 | starseeker | has idea - the earth model with the caption "Welcome to the world of open source CAD" ;-) |
| 04:57.10 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:57.13 | Ralith | got a pic of the earth model? |
| 04:57.26 | brlcad | in the gallery |
| 04:57.37 | Ralith | oh, thought it was new |
| 04:58.20 | starseeker | we could stuff in the imported Cassini probe model orbiting it |
| 04:58.50 | Ralith | doesn't really show off anything new, though, does it? |
| 04:59.01 | starseeker | new features, you mean? |
| 04:59.04 | Ralith | yeah |
| 04:59.17 | starseeker | brlcad: What new features would we like to show off this year? |
| 04:59.26 | Ralith | hey, here's a tangental idea |
| 04:59.59 | Ralith | every year, render in high quality and print at poster size something really elegant that demos all the Big New Features that can be easily shown visually |
| 05:00.06 | Ralith | line them up on a wall |
| 05:00.27 | Ralith | would be pretty interesting to walk down the line years later |
| 05:03.37 | brlcad | interesting idea |
| 05:04.39 | Ralith | you'd need a long hallway to take over or something, for futureproofing |
| 05:04.52 | brlcad | would be fun to host an open source model competition each year, use the winner |
| 05:05.12 | Ralith | that would be pretty cool, but do we have sufficient userbase? |
| 05:05.28 | Ralith | I suppose it'd be straightforward to require the prominent display of at least one major new feature |
| 05:05.32 | brlcad | if there's money involved? the users will show up :) |
| 05:05.36 | Ralith | hehe |
| 05:05.47 | starseeker | hmm - evidently, I did NOT successfully import bob's dbconcat fix |
| 05:05.49 | Ralith | where'd the money come from, though? |
| 05:06.10 | brlcad | is still willing to pay someone to make him a light-cycle with pure csg like the original |
| 05:06.17 | Ralith | light-cycle? |
| 05:06.20 | Ralith | as in tron? |
| 05:06.38 | brlcad | indeed |
| 05:06.54 | brlcad | tron was almost entirely done with csg when it was made |
| 05:06.58 | Ralith | 'the original' as in the props from the movie? |
| 05:07.06 | Ralith | s/props/models/ then |
| 05:07.12 | brlcad | yeah |
| 05:07.21 | Ralith | that would be an interesting project... |
| 05:07.22 | brlcad | reverse engineer the shapes |
| 05:07.45 | brlcad | there are several clips in the film that show what the primitives were |
| 05:09.07 | brlcad | just have to reconstruct the locations and sizes as close as possible, that's the hard part |
| 05:09.10 | Ralith | those models don't look terribly complicated |
| 05:09.25 | brlcad | there are a few surprises in it |
| 05:09.30 | brlcad | a few really tricky blends |
| 05:09.42 | brlcad | iirc, it was a couple hundred primitives per bike |
| 05:09.46 | brlcad | they have internals too |
| 05:10.14 | brlcad | that are only visible for a few frames in the entire film as the bikes are constructed |
| 05:10.45 | Ralith | kudos to the modelers |
| 05:11.40 | Ralith | I wonder if anyone still has the original full quality renders |
| 05:11.44 | brlcad | something that showcased all of the primitives available would be interesting .. something better than my info sheet |
| 05:13.26 | Ralith | the info sheet is incomplete? |
| 05:14.22 | Ralith | likes the idea of a competition, if there really are enough skilled modelers to make it worthwhile, but can't imagine where funding would come from |
| 05:14.36 | Ralith | short of some corporation spontaneously adopting brl-cad internally and donating large sums to the development |
| 05:15.26 | brlcad | at the prize monies we're talking about, finding funding isn't too hard |
| 05:15.35 | Ralith | hm? |
| 05:16.00 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32216 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcNetwork.cpp pcNetwork.h): Further pcNetwork.h cleanup |
| 05:16.27 | brlcad | I would gladly sponsor it myself -- it's more the time/effort of running the first few to get a sustainable event, getting the right announcements out, etc |
| 05:16.47 | brlcad | otherwise, we might participate in GHOP next year, it's geared for exactly this |
| 05:16.52 | Ralith | GHOP? |
| 05:16.53 | Ralith | googles |
| 05:17.42 | Ralith | ooh |
| 05:17.55 | Ralith | that does sound applicable. |
| 05:18.09 | brlcad | it is, there was just a pilot test last year |
| 05:18.16 | brlcad | but it was a success so it will likely be expanded |
| 05:18.26 | Ralith | although I think they'd want it to be less "make us a pretty model" and more "do something useful" |
| 05:19.05 | brlcad | we dictate what is useful, what the tasks are |
| 05:21.10 | brlcad | alright, I think "shiny gsi tank" wins unless I can get srcviz up and running again |
| 05:21.52 | Ralith | as cool as shiny gsi tanks are, it's something brl-cad has been capable of for several years :/ |
| 05:21.57 | Ralith | oh that reminds me |
| 05:21.59 | Ralith | completely unrelated |
| 05:22.11 | Ralith | at what bounce depth is sphflake in the gallery rendered? |
| 05:22.15 | brlcad | of course, that image is more than 10 years old now |
| 05:22.50 | Ralith | heh |
| 05:22.52 | Ralith | now there's a thought |
| 05:23.10 | Ralith | "BRL-CAD: We could do this 10 years ago. Come see what we can do now." |
| 05:25.41 | Ralith | remembers to start the test again |
| 05:25.43 | brlcad | bounce depth for phong reflectivity is 5 |
| 05:25.59 | starseeker | scowls at dbconcat |
| 05:26.22 | brlcad | presume you mean this one: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/brlcad_in_a_box.png.html ? |
| 05:26.24 | Ralith | XXX: Unable to test edcolor |
| 05:26.24 | Ralith | It probably shouldn't kick off an editor without an argument |
| 05:26.38 | brlcad | yep, I added that |
| 05:26.53 | brlcad | so it'll annoy the hell out of me and others till someone changes it |
| 05:26.53 | Ralith | so that's normal? |
| 05:26.57 | Ralith | hehe |
| 05:27.13 | Ralith | ...rtcheck |
| 05:27.13 | Ralith | bu_log: write error |
| 05:27.32 | brlcad | that's expected .. the ray-trace terminates before it has a chance to log |
| 05:27.44 | brlcad | async race |
| 05:27.57 | starseeker | growls at dbconcat, then looks at the clock and decides sanity must temporarily prevail |
| 05:28.05 | Ralith | bunch of 0 off by many, which sounds great |
| 05:28.21 | Ralith | seems to have completed without error |
| 05:28.30 | brlcad | excellent |
| 05:30.43 | starseeker | nice |
| 05:30.53 | Ralith | anything else to be done? |
| 05:31.30 | starseeker | does mged open and run? |
| 05:32.03 | starseeker | if so, generate an example model with tire -p 1, then open it with mged tire.g and try a raytrace |
| 05:32.49 | Ralith | kk |
| 05:33.04 | starseeker | (tire runs from the command line) |
| 05:33.12 | Ralith | yeah, got that |
| 05:33.39 | starseeker | Oh, e tire will draw the tire |
| 05:34.54 | Ralith | e? |
| 05:35.39 | Ralith | odd abbreviation for draw |
| 05:35.50 | starseeker | or draw tire :-) |
| 05:35.58 | Ralith | also if X is accelerated |
| 05:36.02 | Ralith | why is this rotating so laggily :| |
| 05:36.10 | starseeker | the wireframe? |
| 05:36.12 | Ralith | yeah |
| 05:36.21 | Ralith | raytrace works and looks nice |
| 05:36.26 | starseeker | tries rotating |
| 05:36.47 | Ralith | well |
| 05:36.51 | starseeker | rotates OK for me... weird |
| 05:36.52 | Ralith | the ports installed opengl-y version is a bit laggy too |
| 05:36.53 | Ralith | so w/e |
| 05:37.02 | Ralith | guess it's just very complicated :P |
| 05:37.07 | starseeker | it is complex |
| 05:37.21 | starseeker | you can try fence for another cool example |
| 05:37.22 | Ralith | can only guess |
| 05:37.25 | Ralith | fence? |
| 05:37.42 | starseeker | fence will genrate a chain link fence using pipes |
| 05:37.54 | starseeker | since pipes got an update, it's a good one to try |
| 05:38.02 | starseeker | shouldn't need any options |
| 05:38.08 | starseeker | will give you fence.g |
| 05:38.54 | Ralith | works, looks nice too |
| 05:39.03 | Ralith | I just realized something |
| 05:39.16 | starseeker | That was brlcad who created that tool :-) |
| 05:39.21 | Ralith | I've never done the classic zoom-in-tons-and-ogle-how-smooth-everything-is renders in mged |
| 05:39.43 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 05:39.55 | starseeker | beware a close zoom on tire - it will test your CPU |
| 05:40.13 | Ralith | hm, fence looks a little less elegant from an angle |
| 05:40.21 | Ralith | most real chain link fences dont' use 90 degree twists :P |
| 05:40.36 | brlcad | you can still saturate the rendering with too many line segments, as it shovels data through the display manager |
| 05:40.49 | starseeker | there are lots of options to fence if you want to play around |
| 05:41.01 | Ralith | kk |
| 05:41.11 | brlcad | starseeker: it doesn't use pipes.. :) |
| 05:41.18 | brlcad | pipes weren't done |
| 05:41.36 | starseeker | Oh, really???? |
| 05:41.46 | brlcad | they are connected rcc's with sph joints |
| 05:41.47 | starseeker | well, darn then |
| 05:41.51 | starseeker | Ah |
| 05:42.00 | Ralith | well, it certainly works fine. |
| 05:42.10 | starseeker | well, probably faster in the end anyway |
| 05:42.25 | brlcad | dunno, would be an interesting comparison |
| 05:42.35 | Ralith | is not at all used to being able to render in really close and not see *any* mesh artifacts |
| 05:42.58 | brlcad | although the biggest gains would still be to make it instead be procedurally generated during ray-trace time -- similar to the grass shader but for geometry |
| 05:52.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32217 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: doggone it dbconcat is crashing - revert and take another look at the changes to try and figure out why. |
| 05:54.53 | jonored | is amused. He was spoilt by povray... |
| 05:55.13 | Ralith | ? |
| 05:55.45 | jonored | hasn't ever seen mesh artifacts on stuff he's done. |
| 05:55.50 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker_ (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 05:55.53 | starseeker_ | OK, fine I give up |
| 05:56.22 | starseeker_ | hopes someday to have an ISP not hostile to ssh connections... |
| 05:57.25 | jonored | starseeker: speakeasy isn't, at least... |
| 05:58.15 | brlcad | starseeker: connect through .bz -- should stay persistent |
| 05:58.27 | starseeker_ | did |
| 05:58.33 | brlcad | huh |
| 05:58.46 | starseeker_ | why I'm thinking it's the ISP - I keep having the connection die |
| 05:58.49 | brlcad | oh, maybe a late night reset |
| 05:59.03 | brlcad | they do that around 2-4am sometimes if they're doing maintenance |
| 05:59.13 | brlcad | usually comes back to life after a minute or two |
| 05:59.16 | starseeker_ | hehe - I should get the NASA deep field and use it as a background: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/spacefun.png |
| 05:59.48 | starseeker_ | probe scaled by 50000000 |
| 06:00.17 | Ralith | jonored: povray doesn't have mesh artifacts? |
| 06:00.32 | brlcad | should be able to do at scale if you turn on perspective |
| 06:00.49 | brlcad | might need a wide angle |
| 06:01.09 | starseeker_ | :-) |
| 06:01.35 | starseeker_ | has to sleep or hit his head on the keyboard - Ralith, thanks again for your testing efforts! |
| 06:01.39 | brlcad | Ralith: only if you're rendering meshes (for most primitives) |
| 06:01.52 | Ralith | oh, I thought povray was a mesh-only renderer :P |
| 06:01.53 | brlcad | povray also does implicits |
| 06:01.57 | Ralith | implicits? |
| 06:02.02 | brlcad | implicit geometry |
| 06:02.07 | Ralith | not familiar with the term |
| 06:02.10 | brlcad | non-boundary representation |
| 06:02.19 | Ralith | starseeker_: and again, very happy to help. |
| 06:02.31 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm not very up on terminology in this field yet :/ |
| 06:02.50 | Ralith | I can guess at meanings |
| 06:02.56 | Ralith | but that's about it |
| 06:02.57 | brlcad | normally what you probably think of as "CSG" is "CSG operations on primitives defined via implicit mathematical equations" |
| 06:03.07 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:03.14 | Ralith | so, our kind of solids. |
| 06:03.37 | brlcad | yeah .. "solids" in our case generally refers to implicit geometry |
| 06:03.42 | Ralith | kk |
| 06:04.06 | Ralith | implicit meaning, all the data says for, say, a sphere, is "it's over there and about -so- big" |
| 06:04.10 | Ralith | ? |
| 06:04.19 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@124-169-204-192.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 06:04.22 | brlcad | though strictly speaking, solid just means that it (hopefully with a strict guarantee) topologically represents a closed volume |
| 06:04.24 | jonored | Precisely. Also a few i don't remember seeing here - they can do a solid based on where an expression in three variables is less than a threshold... |
| 06:04.44 | brlcad | sort of |
| 06:05.03 | brlcad | the fact that you define *and* evaluate a sphere using just it's point and radius |
| 06:05.10 | brlcad | there is no surface mesh being evaluated |
| 06:05.17 | brlcad | no boundary |
| 06:05.36 | brlcad | there is an implicit boundary where it's solid and not solid |
| 06:05.59 | pacman87 | implicit: x^2 + y^2 + z^2 = r^2 |
| 06:05.59 | pacman87 | explicit: x = f(u,v); y = g(u,v); z = h(u,v); |
| 06:06.06 | brlcad | mathematically, that's an implicit equation where you define all values > 1 as outside, < 1 as inside, and == 1 as "on the surface" for example |
| 06:06.41 | brlcad | where 1 can really be any value, but is conventionally 1 or 0 usually |
| 06:06.54 | brlcad | yeah, exactly what pacman87 shows ;) |
| 06:08.15 | brlcad | the two approaches generally have pretty profound differences in terms of implementation, evaluation, ray-tracing, solidity guarantees, compactness of representation, performance, etc |
| 06:10.11 | brlcad | that representation is at the heart of why brl-cad shows you a wireframe instead of a polygonal view -- there is no surface to visualize, you have to find/evaluate it |
| 06:11.54 | Ralith | I'm looking forward to playing with a polygonal view. |
| 06:12.12 | pacman87 | ev? |
| 06:12.27 | Ralith | ? |
| 06:12.47 | brlcad | that's where BREP comes into play -- it's making all primitives describe themselves in both implicit and boundary representation form .. so they can be directly evaluated and visualized, without incomplete knowledge |
| 06:12.50 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:13.11 | brlcad | Ralith: he means, try the "ev" command in mged |
| 06:13.14 | brlcad | or "E" |
| 06:13.40 | brlcad | that does/attempts the (painful) conversion |
| 06:13.59 | Ralith | probably shouldn't be testing this on the tire. |
| 06:14.04 | pacman87 | i'm afraid of writing that for revolve |
| 06:14.21 | pacman87 | since last time was mostly a chop job on ehy's function |
| 06:14.25 | Ralith | kills mged |
| 06:14.25 | brlcad | oh hell, yeah .. tire isn't one I'd start with :) |
| 06:15.03 | Ralith | brlcad: is it likely that poolio's work will be appropriate for realtime use (e.g. mouse-dragging a subtracted primitive around the edges of another to see how it looks), or would it be more something you'd grab a new mesh from every time you applied a change? |
| 06:16.05 | Ralith | E worked on the 'cube' demo pretty well |
| 06:16.13 | Ralith | except it's still a wireframe -- just now a wireframe of the mesh :P |
| 06:16.27 | brlcad | Ralith: because you're using X instead of ogl :) |
| 06:16.33 | Ralith | aw. |
| 06:16.37 | brlcad | that's the one feature that ogl provides, shades it |
| 06:16.39 | Ralith | wait |
| 06:16.40 | Ralith | no I'm not |
| 06:16.45 | Ralith | this is the ports-supplied version |
| 06:16.46 | Ralith | that uses GL |
| 06:16.48 | Ralith | and works |
| 06:16.59 | brlcad | o.O |
| 06:17.05 | Ralith | also, there's a srs Z ordering issue |
| 06:17.15 | Ralith | all the spheres are drawn on top of all the bars |
| 06:17.33 | Ralith | it's very confusing when I'm not rotating it. |
| 06:18.25 | Ralith | this does not appear to be an issue in the normal wireframe, although it's harder to tell due to lower line densities |
| 06:18.55 | brlcad | do you have Z clipping, lighting, and z buffer turned on? |
| 06:19.00 | brlcad | (on the Misc menu) |
| 06:19.02 | Ralith | I have absolutely no idea. |
| 06:19.13 | Ralith | oh, that helps |
| 06:19.45 | Ralith | there's no lighting/z buffer |
| 06:19.49 | Ralith | will verify ogl |
| 06:19.57 | Ralith | hm. |
| 06:20.06 | Ralith | oh, maybe I amusing the wrong mged after all |
| 06:20.07 | brlcad | type "dm set" |
| 06:20.09 | Ralith | how did that get into my path O.o |
| 06:20.24 | brlcad | it should say if it's dm_ogl or dm_X |
| 06:20.37 | Ralith | I'm confused now |
| 06:20.39 | Ralith | it's X |
| 06:20.45 | Ralith | maybe the port did disable gl |
| 06:20.52 | Ralith | I didn't see it in the config options :/ |
| 06:21.21 | pacman87 | 'attach ogl'? |
| 06:21.53 | brlcad | Ralith: some older versions auto-disabled opengl support (because of the driver problems) |
| 06:22.03 | Ralith | this is 7.12.4; not exactly old. |
| 06:22.05 | Ralith | ah well |
| 06:22.06 | brlcad | and some others were hard-wired to off |
| 06:22.09 | Ralith | guess this means we don't have to bug ``Erik |
| 06:22.15 | brlcad | ah, hm |
| 06:22.21 | brlcad | then it should have been a flag |
| 06:22.26 | Ralith | to configure? |
| 06:23.05 | Ralith | looking at the CONFIGURE_ARGS line in the root Makefile now |
| 06:23.10 | Ralith | could be set by more convoluted means I suppose |
| 06:24.09 | Ralith | only line containing 'gl' is USE_GL= gl |
| 06:24.20 | Ralith | which I'm pretty sure just means it needs gl |
| 06:24.29 | Ralith | (despite not using it, funnily enough) |
| 06:30.52 | brlcad | yeah, I don't see what it's doing to turn it off |
| 06:31.08 | brlcad | good question for ``Erik |
| 06:31.31 | brlcad | otherwise, your compile may simply have determined that opengl wasn't fully available (e.g. now dev headers) |
| 06:31.37 | brlcad | s/now/no/ |
| 06:36.28 | Ralith | that wouldn't make sense |
| 06:36.37 | Ralith | this is freebsd with all packages installed from ports; everything have dev headers |
| 06:36.52 | Ralith | and the prerelease build enabeled opengl by default, too |
| 06:39.21 | brlcad | drools as he scrolls through the journal of graphics tools |
| 06:39.47 | brlcad | Ralith: I understand that -- but doesn't mean it failed the test ;) |
| 06:39.55 | brlcad | just means that it "shouldn't" have failed the test |
| 06:40.25 | brlcad | heck, could have been a typo in the configure.ac file |
| 06:40.30 | brlcad | are there any patches that get applied? |
| 06:41.02 | brlcad | or can you find the config.log from your compile? |
| 06:41.17 | brlcad | it'll have a summary near the end that will say exactly what it intends to do |
| 06:41.39 | Ralith | for which? |
| 06:42.02 | brlcad | hm? |
| 06:42.10 | brlcad | for the brlcad port |
| 06:50.00 | Ralith | kk, building it |
| 06:50.06 | Ralith | normally cleans out the work dir |
| 06:50.59 | Ralith | from configure: |
| 06:50.59 | Ralith | OpenGL support .......................: yes |
| 06:56.07 | brlcad | then something is indeed amiss |
| 06:56.16 | brlcad | perhaps your test build installed overtop the ports one |
| 06:56.22 | brlcad | default is /usr/brlcad |
| 06:56.49 | brlcad | and I don't see a --prefix in the ports file |
| 06:57.28 | Ralith | ports go to /usr/local |
| 06:57.36 | Ralith | and I certainly didn't make install as root |
| 06:57.39 | Ralith | so an overwrite is impossible |
| 06:57.50 | Ralith | plus, I've been using the ports version safely since forever |
| 06:58.05 | Ralith | when it finishes building we'll see if mged offers opengl |
| 07:01.17 | brlcad | simple check, which mged ? |
| 07:01.24 | brlcad | ls -la /usr/brlcad |
| 07:02.09 | brlcad | the 'binfo' command in bin will indicate the compilation date |
| 07:03.01 | yukonbob | ! |
| 07:03.05 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 07:03.29 | brlcad | reading the Makefile more carefully, looks like it's configured to install into /usr/local/brlcad |
| 07:03.38 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 07:05.47 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:05.59 | Ralith | yeah, that can't have been the prerelease build |
| 07:27.04 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-109-37.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:25.20 | Ralith | brlcad: looking at the camera code mafm's delegated to me now -- which lib was it that provides our vector? |
| 08:28.02 | Ralith | libbn, lookslike |
| 08:30.17 | Ralith | weird -- my ports install seems to lack vmath.h |
| 08:31.16 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14D918.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 08:31.21 | Ralith | and even bn.h |
| 08:36.58 | Ralith | hm, g3d isn't set up to build with vmath.h visible |
| 08:41.21 | Ralith | not sure what to do here, what with rt^3 being outside the normal source tree |
| 08:41.24 | Ralith | brlcad: any tips? |
| 09:10.06 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 09:11.09 | brlcad | Ralith: hm, not sure I understand |
| 09:11.28 | brlcad | the header isn't in /usr/local/brlcad/include or /usr/local/brlcad/include/brlcad ? |
| 09:11.48 | brlcad | suspects the latter |
| 09:14.19 | brlcad | if that's not the case, then ports install is busted and that should get fixed next or should install manually so you know you have everything in the "usual" place (/usr/brlcad) |
| 09:14.38 | Ralith | oh, it's the latter |
| 09:14.42 | Ralith | was not expecting redundant nesting |
| 09:14.48 | brlcad | nods |
| 09:15.09 | brlcad | the ones in /usr/local/brlcad/include are 3rd party headers |
| 09:15.15 | brlcad | makes more sense when prefix is /usr |
| 09:15.15 | Ralith | that makes sense. |
| 09:15.37 | brlcad | or even /usr/local |
| 09:15.42 | Ralith | yeah |
| 09:16.10 | Ralith | but I still don't know what to do about g3d's include paths and such |
| 09:16.40 | Ralith | right now, #include "brlcad/vmath.h" can't find its .h |
| 09:16.45 | Ralith | which is not surprising |
| 09:16.51 | brlcad | at some point somewhere in g3d's build, it has to say where brl-cad is installed |
| 09:17.08 | Ralith | does it currently? |
| 09:18.42 | brlcad | historically, we install to a given BRLCAD_ROOT which is akin to --prefix with no other --whatever-dir flags that reorganize piecewise; and with that assumption g3d should just be adding cppflags of BRLCAD_ROOT/include BRLCAD_ROOT/include/brlcad (along with ldflags) |
| 09:19.01 | brlcad | don't remember what it presently does |
| 09:19.08 | brlcad | you tell me :) |
| 09:19.21 | Ralith | so BRLCAD_ROOT is expected to be correctly set at g3d's build time? |
| 09:19.43 | Ralith | or wait |
| 09:19.48 | Ralith | cmake just needs to know the prefix somehow |
| 09:19.49 | brlcad | well, *somewhere* the build needs to know |
| 09:19.53 | Ralith | yeah, got it now |
| 09:20.08 | Ralith | keeping in mind I've never hacked cmake before... |
| 09:20.13 | brlcad | whether it's a cmake flag or an env var or hard-coded into a build file, etc |
| 09:20.36 | brlcad | understands |
| 09:21.03 | brlcad | it's actually my first steps into cmake as well beyond web readings on the design intent, use cases, etc |
| 09:21.13 | brlcad | intimately familiar with the gbs |
| 09:21.23 | brlcad | it's a fall-back if we run into hard problems |
| 09:23.33 | brlcad | cmake does have several really enticing feature points though for consistent cross-platform maintenance that thses new C++ modules became a good test case (after a moderately successful go on the main brlcad module building libs and a few binaries with cmake) |
| 09:23.59 | Ralith | its pretty colors and % progress indicator are pretty neat too :] |
| 09:25.21 | Ralith | does brlcad define a pkgconfig thingy? |
| 09:25.37 | brlcad | fairly untested, but yes -- there are pkgconfig files for all of the libs |
| 09:25.47 | Ralith | or does the root need to be determined manually via flag/search/env |
| 09:25.53 | Ralith | cool |
| 09:26.13 | Ralith | is it acceptable to depend on that, or should I be moving this build system away from it? |
| 09:26.26 | brlcad | if it does the trick, why not? |
| 09:26.39 | Ralith | kk, great |
| 09:26.43 | brlcad | especially since we can control whether it exists or not |
| 09:26.47 | Ralith | thought I recalled you saying something to the contrary earlier |
| 09:26.52 | brlcad | unlike some of our external deps |
| 09:26.57 | Ralith | well, we can't control whether pkg-config itself exists |
| 09:27.09 | Ralith | but it's pretty damn common. |
| 09:27.15 | brlcad | ah ah, true .. forgetting |
| 09:27.21 | brlcad | macs and windows |
| 09:27.31 | Ralith | hm |
| 09:27.31 | Ralith | good point |
| 09:27.32 | brlcad | gets lost in bsd thoughts |
| 09:27.37 | Ralith | hey! |
| 09:27.46 | Ralith | this is the first time I've ever actually forgotten that mac/windows exist! |
| 09:27.47 | Ralith | :D |
| 09:27.56 | brlcad | hehe |
| 09:28.34 | Ralith | . geekpoints++ |
| 09:29.08 | Ralith | I'll refer to BRLCAD_ROOT for now |
| 09:29.19 | brlcad | so I dont' know what the usual cmake approach is for testing for a dependency, but I could imagine some conditional test logic that uses pkg-config if it finds it else has options to specify where things are at |
| 09:29.35 | Ralith | wait a sec |
| 09:29.47 | Ralith | is BRLCAD_ROOT set to --prefix in the build environment? |
| 09:29.51 | Ralith | because that would be handy |
| 09:29.55 | Ralith | and make this reliable |
| 09:30.05 | brlcad | que? |
| 09:30.18 | Ralith | in configure |
| 09:30.38 | Ralith | export BRLCAD_ROOT=whatever_the_install_prefix_is |
| 09:30.50 | Ralith | that way subordinate build scripts can just refer to that var |
| 09:31.26 | brlcad | it is set during the configure for the brlcad module as an AC_SUBST but I'm not sure how that helps you |
| 09:31.52 | Ralith | that doesn't mean anything to me :/ |
| 09:32.05 | Ralith | wait |
| 09:32.14 | Ralith | AC_SUBST exports autoconf vars to the environment right? |
| 09:32.20 | brlcad | no |
| 09:32.23 | Ralith | damnit! |
| 09:32.33 | brlcad | nothing in auto* ever exports anything to the env |
| 09:33.08 | Ralith | ...starting over then. |
| 09:33.10 | brlcad | even if you had a manual export VAR=blah in configure.ac, that'd be lost when the subshell terminates |
| 09:33.18 | Ralith | hm :/ |
| 09:33.43 | brlcad | now in addition to the pkg_config files .. there is also a 'brlcad-config' script |
| 09:33.51 | Ralith | wait, existing subordinate builds just refer to the internal headers and libs and such, right? |
| 09:33.53 | brlcad | that has the prefix saved |
| 09:34.11 | Ralith | scratch what I just said |
| 09:34.18 | Ralith | g3d will in all cases be built after brlcad is installed? |
| 09:34.31 | brlcad | I think that's a safe assumption |
| 09:34.39 | Ralith | then brlcad-config is perfect. |
| 09:34.40 | Ralith | thanks. |
| 09:34.49 | brlcad | perfect for everyone except windows ;) |
| 09:34.52 | Ralith | wait |
| 09:34.55 | Ralith | it doesn't exist on windows? |
| 09:34.56 | Ralith | O.o |
| 09:34.59 | brlcad | course to find brlcad-config .. you have to know the prefix |
| 09:35.05 | brlcad | it exists.. but it's a script |
| 09:35.05 | Ralith | ...damnit. |
| 09:35.16 | Ralith | shell script. |
| 09:35.19 | Ralith | sigh. |
| 09:35.28 | brlcad | i mean, it could be a binary, but you still have the other problem |
| 09:35.46 | brlcad | cmake really just needs an option that says "the brl-cad root is HERE" |
| 09:35.51 | brlcad | and then go from there |
| 09:36.00 | Ralith | can cmake even take options? |
| 09:36.01 | brlcad | otherwise stick to the env VAR for now, that works everywhere |
| 09:36.04 | brlcad | sure |
| 09:36.52 | Ralith | makes a guess at how to do the env var bit |
| 09:38.07 | Ralith | hrm. |
| 09:38.55 | brlcad | http://www.cmake.org/HTML/cmake-2.6.html |
| 09:39.18 | Ralith | yeah, I need that |
| 09:39.18 | Ralith | thanks |
| 09:40.44 | brlcad | ah, looks like they control everything through vars |
| 09:40.52 | brlcad | this may be a lot more informative: http://www-flc.desy.de/ldcoptimization/documents/talks/CMake_Tutorial.pdf |
| 09:41.53 | brlcad | particularly the example that hints at something like this working, cmake -DBRLCAD_ROOT=/path/to/root |
| 09:43.09 | Ralith | all I really need is the ability to pull data from environment variables :| |
| 09:44.19 | brlcad | well, what I just said -- that should do the trick |
| 09:44.46 | Ralith | less effort with an env var I already leave set |
| 09:44.48 | Ralith | but I suppose |
| 09:44.55 | Ralith | grabs |
| 09:45.00 | brlcad | then in the cmakelists.txt file somewhere you'd have INCLUDE_DIRECTORIES("${BRLCAD_ROOT}/include ${BRLCAD_ROOT}/include/brlcad") |
| 09:45.26 | brlcad | using a var is just a temp measure |
| 09:45.48 | brlcad | from just a quick view through that tutorial, there are external PKG facilities that you can apparently set up |
| 09:46.06 | brlcad | so it could do things like have defaults, check env vars, check command-line overrides, etc |
| 09:46.17 | Ralith | oo |
| 09:46.28 | Ralith | worth my while to go through and do this elegantly at this stage? |
| 09:50.12 | brlcad | up to you! |
| 09:50.34 | Ralith | kk |
| 09:50.50 | brlcad | tis always a work in progress, even g3d's sources aren't where they probably belong, e.g. his general functionality that belongs in a utility lib |
| 09:51.06 | Ralith | had noticed that. |
| 09:52.05 | brlcad | feel free to fix it :) |
| 09:53.26 | Ralith | hehe |
| 09:53.33 | Ralith | some of this stuff I wouldn't even have abstracted out in the first place |
| 09:54.16 | brlcad | hrm, I don't see vmath.h being used anywhere |
| 09:54.19 | Ralith | ok, including vmath.h or even bu.h is raping this |
| 09:54.23 | brlcad | where did you run into that? |
| 09:54.28 | Ralith | I'm trying to add it |
| 09:54.33 | brlcad | ooh, got it |
| 09:54.48 | brlcad | was going to ask how he dealt with i |
| 09:54.50 | brlcad | *it |
| 09:55.41 | Ralith | /usr/local/brlcad/include/brlcad/bu.h:170:58: error: tcl.h: No such file or directory |
| 09:55.44 | Ralith | O.o |
| 09:55.44 | Ralith | what's going on here |
| 09:55.50 | brlcad | it needs both |
| 09:56.01 | brlcad | /usr/local/brlcad/include and /usr/local/brlcad/include/brlcad |
| 09:56.04 | Ralith | it has both |
| 09:56.14 | brlcad | er, then |
| 09:56.16 | brlcad | what's going on there? |
| 09:56.20 | brlcad | :) |
| 09:56.22 | Ralith | :P |
| 09:56.47 | brlcad | oh, perhaps your install used an auto-detected tcl.h ? |
| 09:56.55 | Ralith | yes |
| 09:56.58 | brlcad | ah |
| 09:57.04 | Ralith | tcl8.h |
| 09:57.08 | Ralith | instead of tcl.h |
| 09:57.16 | brlcad | gdffs |
| 09:57.19 | Ralith | just how did everything else build without encountering this issue |
| 09:57.32 | Ralith | er wait wait |
| 09:57.33 | Ralith | my bad |
| 09:57.44 | Ralith | tcl8.4/tcl.h |
| 09:57.51 | brlcad | there it be |
| 09:58.35 | brlcad | brlcad configure loads up the tclConfig.sh among many other optional things to locate resources and optionally toggle on/off |
| 09:58.56 | brlcad | sounds like another VAR |
| 09:59.05 | Ralith | I suspect that reconstructing all that is going to be a nightmare |
| 09:59.13 | brlcad | at least until we finish unwiring tcl from libbu |
| 09:59.23 | Ralith | that will be nice :] |
| 09:59.48 | brlcad | that's *after* libged is done .. because it's another huge chunk of code to refactor |
| 10:00.24 | brlcad | some of it has started, but it's hella lot |
| 10:00.48 | brlcad | you could forget vmath.h for now and just do what he's been doing |
| 10:01.19 | Ralith | I'd rather not -- this will have to be done at some point |
| 10:01.47 | brlcad | looks like he's using a mix of Ogre::Vector3, SimpleVector3 (CameraMode.h), and Mocha::Vector2 depending on what's being tweaked wrt the 3D graphics, the view, and the gui respectively |
| 10:01.57 | Ralith | yeah, that's pretty bad already :/ |
| 10:02.20 | Ralith | also, is there a C++ wrapper for vmath.h? If not, should there be? If so, where? |
| 10:02.26 | brlcad | I see the need ffor the first and third since they're what those respective APIs need |
| 10:02.34 | brlcad | just doesn't need the SimpleVector3 class |
| 10:03.00 | Ralith | well, so long as they're not used gratuitously |
| 10:03.04 | brlcad | the new geometry engine will address having a c++ wrapper on vmath |
| 10:03.10 | Ralith | kk |
| 10:03.24 | Ralith | will make do with C for now then |
| 10:04.00 | brlcad | without some really extensive testing/optimization, the vmath macros are exceptionally hard to beat performance-wise |
| 10:05.23 | Ralith | awesome |
| 10:06.25 | Ralith | argh |
| 10:07.04 | Ralith | what I like least about working in C++ is how the errors are almost never anything directly to do with what you're doing wrong >:| |
| 10:11.02 | Ralith | including vmath.h should be harmless assuming it can find all its needed headers and is wrapped in extern "C" |
| 10:13.02 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-154-7.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 10:16.22 | Ralith | OH! name conflict. |
| 10:20.09 | Ralith | oh no. |
| 10:20.26 | Ralith | or, hm. |
| 10:21.25 | Ralith | brlcad: vmath.h line 105 conflicts with OgreMath.h line 552 in a way which does not have an immediately apparent resolution. |
| 10:22.38 | brlcad | hm, I bet it's both of us using X, Y, Z |
| 10:22.44 | Ralith | actually, it's both of us using PI |
| 10:22.51 | brlcad | ah |
| 10:22.56 | brlcad | that's deprecated in our case |
| 10:23.26 | Ralith | time to follow through on that deprecation, perhaps? |
| 10:23.36 | brlcad | we have a deprecation process |
| 10:23.38 | Ralith | aw. |
| 10:23.46 | brlcad | it's in the pipeline |
| 10:24.01 | Ralith | wonders if this might not be resolvable via reordering includes somewhere as HACKING recommends |
| 10:24.25 | brlcad | ah, true |
| 10:24.32 | Ralith | ah, there's the culprit. |
| 10:24.37 | Ralith | smacks mafm |
| 10:24.37 | brlcad | vmath.h should come later |
| 10:25.06 | Ralith | yep |
| 10:25.14 | brlcad | common.h, system headers, external deps, our public headers, our private headers |
| 10:25.23 | Ralith | nods |
| 10:25.44 | Ralith | this was done exactly backwards -_- |
| 10:25.57 | Ralith | suspects in more than one file, too |
| 10:26.08 | brlcad | probably |
| 10:26.23 | brlcad | thinks Ralith should be committing as he finds these things.. :P |
| 10:26.34 | Ralith | oh right |
| 10:26.40 | Ralith | still isn't in the habit of good atomic commits |
| 10:26.58 | Ralith | I think to myself "I'm going to implement proper vectors" and then I forget to commit anything until that's done |
| 10:27.07 | Ralith | even if I pause and go do ten other fixes halfway through |
| 10:28.03 | brlcad | and then the commit for "implemented proper vectors" ends up containing a dozen other changes that have little to nothing to do with implementing proper vectors, right? :) |
| 10:28.11 | Ralith | exactly. |
| 10:29.16 | brlcad | committing frequently in succint little packets was one of the first traits I learned (and appreciated) when I started getting seriously into oss development |
| 10:29.23 | brlcad | (many many moons ago) |
| 10:30.03 | Ralith | thanks for the reminder |
| 10:30.17 | brlcad | it's a different pattern of thinking and development, one that is exceptionally "better" imnsho for most types of collaborative development where constant 1-to-many communication is critical |
| 10:30.30 | brlcad | just anecdote, not a comment on you in the least :) |
| 10:31.08 | Ralith | nods |
| 10:31.09 | Ralith | I quite agree |
| 10:31.20 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32218 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Proper include/link paths for BRL-CAD libraries (required, manually specified) and TCL (optional, manually specified) |
| 10:31.48 | Ralith | also makes for much more interesting changelogs |
| 10:32.12 | brlcad | and useful |
| 10:32.20 | brlcad | I actually read them now |
| 10:32.23 | brlcad | :) |
| 10:33.50 | Ralith | do interface headers go before or after local headers? |
| 10:34.06 | Ralith | (that is, interfaces for the implementation in the file in question) |
| 10:35.16 | Ralith | is systematically fixing header ordering in every single file; good thing g3d isn't too big yet, |
| 10:36.40 | Ralith | oh, good, that's in hacking |
| 10:36.44 | Ralith | didn't remember that |
| 10:36.57 | brlcad | ah, that list I gave was for C-style, for C++ the terms just change a little |
| 10:37.15 | Ralith | the list in hacking might cause problems |
| 10:38.01 | Ralith | the interface headers include brlcad headers |
| 10:38.24 | Ralith | and then the implementation might include the ogre headers |
| 10:38.29 | Ralith | which creates a conflict |
| 10:38.49 | Ralith | the solution is to treat interface headers like generic public headers |
| 10:38.52 | Ralith | this acceptable? |
| 10:39.56 | Ralith | (it could also be placed absolute last, for clarity, I suppose. Can't think of any reason its relative position would matter much)) |
| 10:42.16 | brlcad | erm, the interface header is a public header |
| 10:42.24 | Ralith | yes |
| 10:42.25 | brlcad | are you reading the brlcad module's HACKING file? |
| 10:42.27 | Ralith | yes |
| 10:42.40 | Ralith | it places interface headers absolute first |
| 10:42.44 | brlcad | ah, that single "interface" header is really for C code |
| 10:42.54 | Ralith | thought as much |
| 10:43.09 | Ralith | so what's the preferred position for the C++ version? |
| 10:43.26 | Ralith | so far I've stick it immediately before public headers |
| 10:43.56 | brlcad | sounds like that'll do for now |
| 10:44.00 | Ralith | kk |
| 10:44.04 | brlcad | it really shouldn't be position dependent of course |
| 10:44.33 | Ralith | well, beyond after the system headers, it doesn't matter; it's just good to have a One Place imo |
| 10:44.41 | brlcad | solution being to wrap the header with an #undef of whatever conflicts, for example |
| 10:44.57 | brlcad | checks on that deprecation status |
| 10:47.47 | Ralith | putting the #undef in the gui code seems like a hack to me |
| 10:47.51 | Ralith | it belongs in Ogre's code |
| 10:49.45 | brlcad | yeah, ogre should be checking like we do |
| 10:51.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32219 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: PI was left out of the 7.12 vmath deprecation list |
| 10:52.00 | Ralith | tests to ensure his reordering didn't bork anything |
| 10:52.01 | brlcad | looks like it can formally go away in the 7.14 release |
| 10:52.22 | brlcad | it passes our "minimally impacting" criteria |
| 10:52.34 | Ralith | yay! |
| 10:54.12 | Ralith | also, a thought |
| 10:55.03 | Ralith | wrapping C headers in a preprocessor-conditional extern "C" seems to be common, but we don't do that |
| 10:55.12 | Ralith | necessitating use of it in C++ that includes it |
| 10:55.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32220 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (20 files): Reordered #includes as recommended by HACKING |
| 10:56.47 | Ralith | any reason for that? |
| 10:58.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32221 10/brlcad/trunk/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/vmath.h): |
| 10:58.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the deprecated M_SQRT_DIV2 and PI defines fit the criteria for minimally |
| 10:58.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: impacting given their deprecation spans a minor release and they have fully |
| 10:58.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: equivalent replacements (M_SQRT1_2 and M_PI respectively). make them now |
| 10:58.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: obsolete. |
| 10:59.01 | brlcad | yeah, just that the headers hadn't been cleaned up for C++ yet -- the C headers should be fixed, not hacked around on the C++ side |
| 10:59.08 | brlcad | some have, some havent' |
| 10:59.19 | Ralith | got it |
| 10:59.42 | brlcad | if you see one missing its wrapper or some other logic in the brlcad module, go for it |
| 10:59.49 | Ralith | yay |
| 10:59.59 | brlcad | I clean them up as I run into them |
| 11:02.05 | brlcad | gets the munchies, and wanders off to forage for a bit |
| 11:05.01 | Ralith | appreciates the help |
| 11:05.39 | brlcad | no problemo |
| 11:05.53 | brlcad | and no! thank you.. :) |
| 11:06.14 | brlcad | you have it building at the moment? |
| 11:07.08 | brlcad | have something to compile-test, but can't test it proper here atm |
| 11:07.19 | Ralith | 'it'? |
| 11:07.29 | Ralith | something's still triggering the conflict in g3d |
| 11:07.34 | Ralith | but brlcad as a whole works |
| 11:07.46 | brlcad | I mean g3d |
| 11:08.04 | Ralith | no luck yet; this one's thrown me |
| 11:08.22 | Ralith | reordering fixed the first instance of the error, but the exact one recurred when cmake moved on to the next file |
| 11:09.04 | Ralith | oh wait. |
| 11:09.07 | Ralith | wups >_> |
| 11:09.55 | Ralith | probably unrelated, but still wups. |
| 11:10.04 | Ralith | oh hey! |
| 11:10.07 | Ralith | 32222 get |
| 11:10.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32222 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Fixed mangled if statement |
| 11:10.48 | Ralith | well what do you know, that did it |
| 11:10.52 | Ralith | ...for a while |
| 11:10.58 | brlcad | cool |
| 11:10.59 | Ralith | nevermind |
| 11:11.04 | brlcad | heh |
| 11:11.12 | Ralith | was misled by the build time being nonzero after a clean |
| 11:11.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32223 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Application.cxx Logger.cxx): |
| 11:11.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: this is untested and might break the build temporarily, but re-remove the |
| 11:11.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: blasted using namespace std lines. namespaces should be explicit unless it's on |
| 11:11.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: an implementation only but still never with std in order to avoid a handful of |
| 11:11.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: portability and maintenance issues. |
| 11:11.23 | Ralith | palindromic commits! |
| 11:11.49 | brlcad | well if you get it working, that might have just broken it, but shouldn't be anything difficult to fix .. just a missing std:: here and there |
| 11:11.50 | Ralith | noticed those but didn't touch them as it wasn't a header |
| 11:11.54 | Ralith | yeah |
| 11:13.05 | brlcad | i've removed them from those exact same files before |
| 11:13.15 | Ralith | :| |
| 11:13.29 | brlcad | i think he just forgets |
| 11:13.49 | Ralith | probably |
| 11:13.59 | brlcad | just need to get him to have to deal with 20 other coders on a couple more platforms in order to break that habit.. |
| 11:14.05 | Ralith | hehe |
| 11:14.49 | brlcad | aiight, foodage needs me |
| 11:14.53 | Ralith | seeya |
| 11:14.54 | brlcad | cheers |
| 11:26.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r32224 10/rt^3/trunk/src/other/mocha/Include/Mocha/Platform.h: Disabled MSVC-specific warning removal #pragmas on non-MSVC |
| 11:26.29 | Ralith | gives up on fixing this tonight, considering the hour |
| 11:26.32 | Ralith | -> sleep |
| 11:29.21 | brlcad | eww :) |
| 11:29.38 | brlcad | fun |
| 11:33.14 | Ralith | at least I assumed they're MSVC |
| 11:33.19 | Ralith | because gcc has nfc what to do with them |
| 11:33.28 | Ralith | and I doubt anything else has errors that dumb |
| 13:03.28 | starseeker_ | For the g3d people, here's what's happening with fonts when I build and run: http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/g3d_font_oddness.png |
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| 15:34.14 | jonored | [ajaa |
| 15:35.44 | jonored | ...oops; sorry. Failure to press modkey followed by accidental enter... |
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| 16:10.07 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I'm getting a crash on dbconcat when I apply your infinite loop check - it looks like the first comparison it's doing is to an empty prev_name and it doesn't like that somewhere along the line. |
| 16:17.13 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@217-162-108-34.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:25.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32225 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: |
| 16:25.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: OK, restore the previous wdb_obj changes (checking for infinite looping in |
| 16:25.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: naming) while initializing prev-name to a space char - this way the initial |
| 16:25.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: comparison doesn't trigger a crash and a single space character is an unlikely |
| 16:25.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: name choice for any object. |
| 16:27.43 | starseeker_ | isn't sure if the problem appears in trunk or whether this is the "right" fix, but it does make dbconcat work again here |
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| 16:32.03 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.23.224) | |
| 16:32.20 | andrecastelo | morning guys |
| 16:50.41 | starseeker_ | morning |
| 16:50.59 | starseeker_ | can't figure out how to make a good texture or bumpmap to use on a tire... |
| 16:58.58 | starseeker_ | heh - http://my.bzflag.bz/~starseeker/candytire.png |
| 18:34.24 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14D918.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:38.04 | brlcad | starseeker_: okay, i'll check -- more than likely head is busted too then |
| 19:09.14 | poolio | brlcad: did you ever get a chance to upload that zip? |
| 19:09.27 | poolio | brlcad: my head is literally busted :P |
| 19:14.11 | brlcad | poolio: yes! it's in /tmp |
| 19:14.56 | brlcad | starseeker_: i'm betting bumpmap wants a bw and you're giving it a pix or vice versa |
| 19:15.25 | brlcad | g'morning andrecastelo |
| 19:22.21 | poolio | brlcad: ah, thanks. I was planning on working a lot this weekend but I've suffered a bit of head trauma, so I'm not sure how competent my coding will be :) |
| 19:22.58 | brlcad | o.O |
| 19:23.05 | brlcad | dare I ask? |
| 19:23.07 | poolio | I stood up into a fan :( |
| 19:23.10 | brlcad | hehe |
| 19:23.23 | poolio | Had to get 5 stitches...wasn't a very fun experience. |
| 19:24.19 | brlcad | and no youtube video? misfortunes like that spread like wildfire ;) |
| 19:25.14 | poolio | heh, I wish. I was totally fine, no concussion, totally lucid. Just bleeding profusely. |
| 19:25.28 | poolio | I think a youtube video would be hilarious. I'm gonna go do it again, brb. |
| 19:25.35 | brlcad | :) |
| 19:25.43 | brlcad | hilarious for everyone *else* :) |
| 19:28.01 | brlcad | starseeker_: woah, wtf .. initializing to non-empty was the problem? |
| 19:28.21 | poolio | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(season_2)#Ceiling_Fan_Decapitation -- "Normal household fans do not have the power even to inflict serious injury while spinning at top speedâthey are more likely to break first. " LIES. |
| 19:28.51 | poolio | Hmm, well that paste got messed up. I'm going to try to unbreak the tgc code now :) |
| 19:28.55 | brlcad | by serious, they probably meant lethal |
| 19:29.13 | poolio | True true. It |
| 19:29.13 | brlcad | iirc during the show, they said it probably would mess you up pretty bad |
| 19:29.15 | poolio | 's also wikipedia |
| 19:29.18 | brlcad | just wouldn't cut your head off |
| 19:29.31 | poolio | Well, didn't they have it on a lawn mower engine with sharpened blades? |
| 19:29.33 | brlcad | and "probably" wouldn't kill you |
| 19:29.39 | brlcad | yeah |
| 19:29.47 | poolio | I remember they reused it for the cutting a sword with another sword myth |
| 19:29.57 | brlcad | never liked that one |
| 19:30.21 | brlcad | so much slop in the experiment |
| 19:30.33 | poolio | Yeah...they really butcher the scientific method sometimes. Damn popular media. |
| 19:55.27 | poolio | brlcad: just FYI, tornado warning for you :) |
| 19:55.41 | poolio | I think that's the first time I've seen the emergency response system in use |
| 19:57.02 | brlcad | poolio: ah, is that what all that rumbling is about :) |
| 19:58.35 | poolio | brlcad: aye. I'd be careful, they did the typical get in your basement/closet/etc.. thing. I've never seen that before, even for that awful storm a few weeks ago |
| 20:00.19 | poolio | brlcad: They say high probability of tornado in next 45 minutes |
| 20:00.30 | poolio | brlcad: good luck :) |
| 20:01.33 | brlcad | it was really nasty last night for about ten minutes with huge lightening events and the momentary monsoon, car window was partially open |
| 20:01.47 | poolio | ah yes, I drove through that storm to the hospital :) |
| 20:01.59 | poolio | s/I drove/someone drove me |
| 20:02.02 | brlcad | at which point I though ... why the f* is there a big metal tip on the end of my umbrella |
| 20:02.04 | poolio | The lightning was absolutely gorgeous |
| 20:02.59 | brlcad | stripped off his shirt instead and ran out amidst the booming happening all around within less than a mile |
| 20:04.47 | poolio | haha, i'd like to see that on youtube as well |
| 20:09.39 | brlcad | I was actually thinking something along those lines last night |
| 20:10.46 | brlcad | along with "someone is going to find me dead on monday with nothing but shorts on outside work" |
| 20:12.25 | brlcad | at which point I comically locked myself out of the building when the door shut .. fortunately I'd (accidentally) left my keys in my pocket |
| 20:16.45 | ``Erik | reminds me of when I was beating on twingies door wearing jeans and a tshirt (no shoes) in snow |
| 20:20.32 | Ralith | ``Erik: just a heads up before the next release (for the FreeBSD port); I'm not sure how common this issue is in the real world, but I'm getting a fatal X crash launching mged when opengl is used, relating to my nvidia drivers. It might be a good idea to disable that for this build, at least if the user has the nvidia drivers installed. |
| 20:29.33 | Ralith | starseeker_: your font rendering issues remind me a lot of how my inkscape GUI looked after I upgraded some libs it depended on |
| 20:29.48 | Ralith | maybe you've got something like that going on? |
| 20:35.06 | Ralith | hm, just rebuilt my inkscape and its gui still displays similar behavior |
| 20:35.31 | Ralith | so it's probably not a lib incompatiblity issue |
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| 21:11.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32226 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/vls.c: |
| 21:11.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: starseeker pinned down an insideous little crash where bu_vls_strcmp() was |
| 21:11.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: crashing if the bu_vls was empty. this was due to a bug in the bu call where it |
| 21:11.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: wasn't accounting for how bu_vls represents emptry strings (they're null strings |
| 21:11.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: with no allocation at first). this makes sure they are at least a valid (empty) |
| 21:11.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: string when someone asks for a comparison. also clean up and document the magic |
| 21:11.29 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: constants. |
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| 23:54.04 | yukonbob | loves reading commit reports... |
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| 00:07.39 | Ralith | argh |
| 00:07.50 | Ralith | why the hell does ogre use Y as a template parameter |
| 00:27.19 | Ralith | god I wish C had namespaces |
| 00:32.52 | Ralith | gives up and undefs some stuff |
| 00:34.09 | Ralith | brlcad: don't suppose you know why mafm appears to have limited camera rotation around the horizontal axes to 180 degrees around the front? |
| 00:34.41 | Ralith | thought that was a bug when he encountered it in the GUI. |
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| 03:22.39 | brlcad | Ralith: not in the least |
| 03:24.14 | Ralith | hehe |
| 03:25.07 | brlcad | Ralith: one fix for the X, Y, Z, H, etc problems might be to not provide those symbols in vmath if we're compiling c++ |
| 03:25.09 | Ralith | well, thanks to some #undefs I'm not far from swapping out the vector |
| 03:25.17 | brlcad | wouldn't solve all of the problems, but it might help some |
| 03:25.18 | Ralith | that seems hacky :/ |
| 03:25.25 | Ralith | imo we shouldn't be using such generic names in the first place |
| 03:25.41 | Ralith | prefix BU_ on all global thingies, or something |
| 03:25.53 | Ralith | or wait |
| 03:25.55 | Ralith | this is BN_ |
| 03:26.00 | Ralith | same idea |
| 03:26.05 | brlcad | probably, though we've gotten by this long with them (and it wasn't any easier a decade or two ago - similar defines in X) |
| 03:26.23 | brlcad | yeah, I've thought about it, but then it really sort of kills the point of the define |
| 03:26.35 | Ralith | actually |
| 03:26.41 | Ralith | I know what the *right* solution is |
| 03:26.42 | brlcad | could make it a const |
| 03:26.47 | Ralith | a const would work |
| 03:27.02 | brlcad | that would at least prevent turning params into invalid code |
| 03:27.05 | Ralith | in fact, a const would solve it perfectly |
| 03:27.14 | Ralith | because all ogre's stuff is in its own namespace |
| 03:27.19 | Ralith | so no naming conflict if it's not a #define |
| 03:28.17 | brlcad | the problem then just becomes the fact that there's (presently) no compilation unit to provide them in order to avoid symbol duplication |
| 03:28.57 | brlcad | (which is of course just a minor problem) |
| 03:30.04 | brlcad | woah, hey hippieindamakin8 .. ltns |
| 03:31.42 | Ralith | uh, I don't follow |
| 03:46.54 | Ralith | brlcad: what do you mean? |
| 03:47.30 | Ralith | (also, what I was about to say before: a C++ wrapper to libbn would nicely resolve this problem, too |
| 03:47.33 | Ralith | ) |
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| 17:20.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32227 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): |
| 17:20.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: code cleanup, chaning the Constraint Network graph vertices and edges to |
| 17:20.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: associate with pointers to Variables and Constraints rather than than objects |
| 17:20.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: themselves, faciliating in simpler constraint functors as well as preventing |
| 17:20.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: unnecessary data replication. Solver code modification to assimilate the same in |
| 17:20.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: progress : GTSolve working, BTSolve not working. Also stage 1.5/2 :| of the |
| 17:20.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: evaluation functor changes mentioned in 32212 |
| 18:22.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32228 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): Backtracking solver functional again |
| 18:56.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32229 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): changing argument list of Solver functions so as to support arbitrary Network input and arbitrary solution output by not using references internally |
| 20:06.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32230 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (38 files in 38 dirs): Import proper fix for dbconcat crash from trunk and revert previous workaround - dbconcat now functional. |
| 20:16.23 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 21:00.44 | starseeker_ | make test, make benchmark and make distcheck all pass on my gentoo box |
| 21:17.33 | starseeker_ | doggone it |
| 21:17.56 | starseeker_ | I'm getting an error db_lookup(-n) failed: -n does not exist when I try to do primitive selectin |
| 21:27.26 | brlcad | mm, sounds like a fix is missing |
| 21:27.33 | brlcad | bob fixed that a couple weeks ago |
| 21:27.51 | brlcad | don't remember which files though.. |
| 21:28.55 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 21:29.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32231 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bu_tcl.c: vmath is libbn, don't use libbn facilities in libbu |
| 21:31.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32232 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/color.c: yet another good reason to move the image processing functionality out of libbu and into libbn. rewrite file to not rely on vmath.h by replicating the handful it uses directly. cleanup the style while we're at it. |
| 21:32.39 | starseeker_ | will try to find it in the logs, but must do laundry now |
| 21:33.36 | Ralith | brlcad: where are the code docs stored? |
| 21:35.11 | brlcad | starseeker_: should revert 32230 on include/vmath.h for 7.12.6 -- shouldn't be obsolete until minor |
| 21:35.19 | brlcad | Ralith: code cods for what? |
| 21:35.26 | brlcad | heh, docs |
| 21:36.23 | Ralith | I'd generally assume they're all in the same place |
| 21:36.28 | Ralith | but in particular, the vector stuffs |
| 21:43.17 | brlcad | dev docs, api docs are all over the place |
| 21:43.44 | brlcad | in general, the source is the documentation, with comments tied to the functionality and files they pertain to |
| 21:43.59 | Ralith | kk |
| 21:44.03 | brlcad | some of that is on the web, big migration to doxygenify the entire api |
| 21:44.19 | brlcad | as well as moving the doxygen comments out of compilation units and into the public headers |
| 21:44.39 | Ralith | thanks |
| 21:44.43 | brlcad | but that's all on-going as someone gets an itch or has a need |
| 21:45.13 | brlcad | welcome to help make it better ;) |
| 21:47.12 | Ralith | heh |
| 22:02.57 | brlcad | starseeker_: wow ... should get rain to fix this next week: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/GSI_Images/M110.png.html?g2_imageViewsIndex=0 |
| 22:04.45 | brlcad | two major oops' in that image |
| 22:06.48 | brlcad | glad that was caught before making a poster.. |
| 22:07.22 | Ralith | wonders what the errors are |
| 22:11.23 | brlcad | look closely .. one is fearsomely easy to overlook but really glaring |
| 22:11.43 | brlcad | the other is more subtle unless you know the model |
| 22:11.50 | poolio | the bizarre cut through the center? |
| 22:14.28 | Ralith | the weird panel extending from its right hand headlight shield? |
| 22:14.39 | Ralith | (its right, not the camera's right) |
| 22:14.46 | brlcad | poolio: yep |
| 22:15.22 | brlcad | looks like a sliced portion of the image in a layer was accidentally left |
| 22:15.50 | brlcad | base of the barrel |
| 22:16.46 | poolio | is there something wrong with the reflections underneath it? |
| 22:17.05 | Ralith | oh, I see tht |
| 22:17.06 | Ralith | that* |
| 22:17.36 | brlcad | poolio: nah, the reflections are fine .. just the fact that the small rect was left there |
| 22:17.51 | brlcad | smack in the middle |
| 22:18.33 | brlcad | intern was learning photoshop in order to remove the massive/ugly GSI logo that was plastered across the images |
| 22:18.45 | brlcad | the other error is more small |
| 22:18.48 | brlcad | M110 isn't a tank |
| 22:19.00 | brlcad | it's a howitzer |
| 22:19.40 | yukonbob | pimp my tank |
| 22:19.47 | brlcad | don't know how many times I've looked at that image and missed both of those.. |
| 22:23.05 | Ralith | wonders how long it would take to rerender |
| 22:23.19 | Ralith | also, is that panel I noticed deliberate? |
| 22:23.30 | Ralith | the reflections on it look funky |
| 22:25.08 | yukonbob | so many reflections, it's easy to miss the rectangle block... :P |
| 22:45.07 | brlcad | which panel? |
| 22:46.42 | brlcad | bets that same image wound render in just a minute or so on a good workstation |
| 22:48.52 | brlcad | the reflections should be spot-on |
| 23:04.57 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:04.57 | Ralith | 15:14:28 < Ralith> the weird panel extending from its right hand headlight |
| 23:04.58 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:35.22 | *** join/#brlcad poolio (n=poolio@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 23:36.47 | poolio | What happened to MBO? |
| 23:47.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32233 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libbu/libbu.vcproj: Added missing files to the msvc 9 libbu project file. |
| 23:50.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32234 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libtclcad/libtclcad.vcproj: Added Added missing files to the msvc 9 libtclcad project file. |
| 23:56.16 | Ralith | remains unanswered |
| 00:26.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32235 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (doc/deprecation.txt include/vmath.h): Revert depreciation in vmath.h per request from Sean - not due until next release. |
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| 01:01.06 | brlcad | wth, I go to eat dinner and *poof* |
| 01:01.20 | brlcad | investigates |
| 02:00.04 | starseeker_ | *poof*? |
| 02:05.52 | brlcad | bz rebooted |
| 02:05.58 | brlcad | isp lost power |
| 02:06.06 | brlcad | backups apparently didn't hold out long enough |
| 02:18.06 | starseeker_ | ouch |
| 02:18.24 | starseeker_ | goes hunting for bob's fix |
| 02:19.30 | brlcad | he didn't document it directly because he didn't exactly know that he was fixing that bug at the time |
| 02:19.40 | brlcad | not that his comments are so hot to start with sometimes :) |
| 02:19.53 | brlcad | but I believe it had to do with argv processing on the C side in mged |
| 02:20.12 | brlcad | or the argv processing in libb/librt/libged |
| 02:20.27 | brlcad | it was one of his commits though, so should narrow it some |
| 02:26.45 | starseeker_ | not so much, unfortunately - he's had a lot of them in libged :-( |
| 02:28.38 | starseeker_ | it wasn't you with r31536? |
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| 02:47.15 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Do we know if it was fixed after the dbconcat infinite loop bug? |
| 02:49.11 | jonored_ | hellcattrav: Any reason not to just use scp or sshfs? |
| 02:51.52 | jonored_ | suggests sshfs if you'd like a gui - it makes a directory on the local machine point to a directory on the remote one for real, rather than some odd gui thing, so everything works right with it... |
| 02:52.12 | jonored_ | gui or not. |
| 02:52.49 | jonored_ | ...crap. Wrong channel. |
| 03:00.09 | starseeker_ | wonders dismally if it would be faster to make bob fix it on Monday... |
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| 03:15.53 | starseeker_ | where the heck is mged_ill defined? |
| 03:18.54 | Ralith | brlcad: is there a reason vect_t is an array rather than a struct? |
| 03:22.03 | poolio | Ralith: much easier to use that way |
| 03:23.42 | Ralith | easier how? |
| 03:24.32 | Ralith | .x is one less character than [X], and produces no weird namespace conflicts :P |
| 03:26.28 | brlcad | that's going back a really long ways but iirc it was/is part simplicity and part performance |
| 03:28.34 | brlcad | differences in the optimizer being able to efficiently prefetch based on data access, guaranteed alignment, easy stride through arrays of points/vectors/etc |
| 03:28.41 | poolio | Ralith: I've always found the code is cleaner that way, and it's easier to iterate over |
| 03:29.41 | brlcad | the namespace conflicts can be dealt with, they have been dealt with successfully for decades without it being a big problem |
| 03:29.58 | Ralith | ah, performance. |
| 03:30.00 | Ralith | :| |
| 03:30.14 | brlcad | i'm testing the XYZ constness patch now, but it'll take a few days to run through all the regression tests to make sure even that doesn't mess with performance |
| 03:30.19 | Ralith | alright |
| 03:30.20 | Ralith | thanks |
| 03:30.30 | Ralith | in the meantime I'll use workaround |
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| 03:32.57 | starseeker | much better |
| 03:33.22 | starseeker_ | universal backscroll helps |
| 03:35.46 | starseeker_ | resolves to ask bob tomorrow morning - this computer compiles too slow to set up for proper trial and error testing in reasonable time |
| 03:35.57 | starseeker_ | hopes it's not tied deeply to libged changes |
| 03:39.33 | brlcad | it wasn't, but you'll probably have to apply the fix by hand |
| 03:39.48 | starseeker_ | sure |
| 03:40.13 | starseeker_ | will be happy to once he finds the fix |
| 03:40.40 | starseeker_ | how DOES one debug something like this? The tcl error message is all but useless and the error never gets to the gdb level |
| 03:41.11 | starseeker_ | mged_ill must parse somewhere into something else - grep can't find it except being called in tclscripts |
| 03:47.25 | brlcad | it's a pita, you sort of have to follow the code from start to finish to understand how things parse |
| 03:47.54 | brlcad | mged_ill is an auto-generated command, that's why you can't find it |
| 03:48.25 | brlcad | all of the "mged_" commands are the same as the non-prefixed -- but the tcl code calls the mged_ one |
| 03:48.35 | brlcad | i.e. ill == mged_ill |
| 03:49.26 | brlcad | the difference being that users can override the non-prefixed command if they wanted to get some behavior |
| 03:49.54 | brlcad | for example, say you wanted to make e always do the e and go into solid edit mode |
| 03:50.30 | brlcad | instead of defining a new command, you could override it and still get e's behavior by having your 'e' call mged_e (then call mged_sed) |
| 03:51.40 | brlcad | for debugging, you basically just have to find the callback for the ill command with is one way if called in classic mode and another if called in tclgui mode |
| 03:53.56 | brlcad | namely src/mged/setup.c or src/libged|librt/wdb_obj.c |
| 04:35.23 | andrecastelo | hey brlcad |
| 04:35.49 | andrecastelo | i'm cleaning the msvc9 build, adding missing files and missing dependencies and found a problem |
| 04:36.00 | andrecastelo | libtclcad does not build |
| 04:36.27 | andrecastelo | there's a problem with ged_obj.c or with win32 definitions |
| 04:36.34 | andrecastelo | here's the paste |
| 04:36.36 | andrecastelo | http://pastebin.com/m1b97fdf0 |
| 04:41.37 | brlcad | andrecastelo: I can't get to pastebin.com from here, can you try paste.bzflag.bz instead? |
| 04:41.45 | andrecastelo | sure |
| 04:42.53 | andrecastelo | here it is: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m61eb44ca |
| 04:44.22 | brlcad | andrecastelo: sounds like you're missing a define in your build |
| 04:44.52 | brlcad | IF_WGL |
| 04:45.39 | brlcad | looks like vc8 uses: PreprocessorDefinitions="WIN32;NDEBUG;_WINDOWS;_USRDLL;TCLCAD_EXPORT_DLL;DM_WGL;TCL_THREADS=1;__win32;BRLCAD_DLL;HAVE_CONFIG_H;BRLCADBUILD;IF_WGL;IF_REMOTE;_CRT_SECURE_ |
| 04:45.43 | brlcad | NO_WARNINGS;inline=__inline" |
| 04:45.49 | andrecastelo | hm ok, let me see |
| 04:46.06 | brlcad | not having DM_WGL and IF_WGL are what are causing that error |
| 04:51.14 | andrecastelo | yep, that fixed it |
| 04:53.38 | andrecastelo | thanks, just rebuilding it, see if nothing's wrong |
| 04:53.42 | andrecastelo | then committing |
| 04:55.13 | brlcad | cool |
| 04:58.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32236 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/libtclcad/libtclcad.vcproj: Added missing preprocessor definitions on libtclcad.vcproj, as pointed by brlcad. |
| 05:02.18 | starseeker_ | OK, it's somewhere between 31535 and 31772 |
| 05:07.55 | starseeker_ | looks at logs |
| 05:11.19 | andrecastelo | is remrt needed in the windows builds? |
| 05:14.31 | brlcad | starseeker_: hehe, only 200 commits? .. time for binary search? :) |
| 05:14.40 | brlcad | or just wait a few hours |
| 05:14.51 | brlcad | andrecastelo: depends for what values of need |
| 05:15.36 | andrecastelo | hm some files aren't there |
| 05:15.37 | starseeker_ | yeah, I'm thinking the latter, but this thing is thumbing its nose at me - it's the only show-stopper issue I know of stopping a release |
| 05:15.40 | brlcad | ideally and eventually everything is needed from the perspective of simply wanting the release functionality to be consistent across all platforms |
| 05:15.59 | andrecastelo | and remrt isn't present in the msvc8 build |
| 05:16.01 | brlcad | will anyone cry a tear on windows without remrt right now, probably not |
| 05:16.25 | starseeker_ | If it's in 31629 I'm dead either way - that's a huge commit |
| 05:16.54 | andrecastelo | hm, i'll edit brlcad.sln then |
| 05:17.00 | brlcad | his commit message for it had the snippet "arg" in it if that helps.. might grep the changelog |
| 05:20.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32237 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Removed remrt from the msvc9 build. |
| 05:21.37 | starseeker_ | 31188? |
| 05:22.07 | starseeker_ | no, too old |
| 05:22.09 | starseeker_ | hmm |
| 05:29.42 | andrecastelo | good night fellows |
| 05:29.45 | andrecastelo | cya tomorrow |
| 05:46.59 | brlcad | cya andrecastelo |
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| 08:33.26 | brlcad | sighs at all the e-mail |
| 08:37.46 | Ralith | heh |
| 08:47.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32238 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g-dxf.c: include godbey's comments on what is going on in main for g-dxf (not verified) |
| 08:47.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32239 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf-g.c: header comment |
| 08:54.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32240 10/brlcad/trunk/ (26 files in 5 dirs): |
| 08:54.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Crowd wave time! Bring the new INTAVAL converter (tgf-g) into the default fold |
| 08:54.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: for compilation/installation since the legalities and copyright issues have been |
| 08:54.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: sorted out. need to update our docs to reflect the granted rights (i.e. that |
| 08:54.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: they are in no way giving up any rights on their ability to hold copyright or |
| 08:54.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: make changes to the code on their end) but since it conforms, we can add it to |
| 08:54.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the default compile now. excellentness. |
| 08:56.43 | Ralith | what's this INTAVAL thing that's so cool? |
| 08:57.55 | brlcad | what's most cool about it is that it was developed by our V/L modeling developer counterparts over in Germany and the Netherlands |
| 08:58.20 | Ralith | V/L? |
| 08:58.45 | brlcad | one of the reasons we went open source, encourage exactly this sort of collaboration and contributions .. and that's a substantial one |
| 08:58.55 | brlcad | Vulnerability/Lethality |
| 08:59.03 | brlcad | gov't parlance |
| 08:59.08 | brlcad | ~spell parlance |
| 08:59.47 | Ralith | nice! |
| 08:59.48 | brlcad | i.e. devs over in those countries that do nearly the same thing .. perfect case for new devs that can work on brl-cad |
| 09:00.16 | brlcad | the contribution itself is a new geometry converter |
| 09:00.45 | brlcad | intaval is a geometry file format by her royal majesty's government (england) |
| 09:02.47 | Ralith | seems these days BRL-CAD's impressive in its conversion abilities alone |
| 09:06.27 | brlcad | nods |
| 09:06.49 | brlcad | making all the converters into a general library would be a great project for someone |
| 09:07.04 | brlcad | about as close as it gets for making an open source universal geometry converter |
| 09:07.20 | brlcad | ala image magik's 'convert' but for geometry |
| 09:15.49 | Ralith | which is quite something. |
| 09:16.42 | Ralith | it's interesting that we're getting contributions from other governments |
| 09:17.18 | Ralith | though I suppose if you could get open sourcing all of BRL-CAD ok'd here, that doesn't really compare. |
| 09:18.42 | Ralith | I wonder if such contributions might eventually elevate BRL-CAD to industry standard for what it does best. |
| 10:57.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32241 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/geometryService/: Framework for the Java Prototype |
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| 11:16.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32242 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/geometryService/src/ (5 files in 5 dirs): |
| 11:24.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32243 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/geometryService/ (.classpath .project): |
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| 12:53.26 | starseeker_ | "Increase av size to account for the optionial argument." maybe that's it? |
| 12:55.58 | brlcad | don't think so but mebbie |
| 12:56.13 | brlcad | i talked to him about it |
| 12:56.23 | brlcad | he'll see if he can dig up the change |
| 12:59.01 | starseeker_ | thanks :-) |
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| 14:34.18 | jonored_ | ...oh. No tab completion in classic mode? |
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| 15:25.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32244 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/mged/chgview.c: Add in fix for illumination bug when doing primitive editing - r31737 |
| 15:58.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32245 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Port tire to windows. |
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| 16:05.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32246 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Port tire to windows. |
| 16:08.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32247 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/ (stractNet.eap stractNet2.eap): |
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| 16:12.29 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32248 10/brlcad/trunk/ (12 files in 4 dirs): Added fracture, prefix, quat, regdef, view and ypr to libged. |
| 16:13.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32249 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added fracture, prefix, quat, regdef, view and ypr to libged. |
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| 17:16.47 | starseeker | jeez sourceforge is slow today |
| 17:17.28 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32250 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Merge Bob's changes from trunk to add tire to the Windows build. |
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| 18:22.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32251 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 3 dirs): Enable E, nirt and qray |
| 18:45.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32252 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/stractNet.eap: |
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| 19:35.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32253 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Added project for the tire command. |
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| 04:12.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32254 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ChangeLog: Update Changelog again |
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| 07:08.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32255 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be consistent with Makefile.am |
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| 10:50.23 | mafm | hey there |
| 11:02.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32256 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): removing using namespace boost |
| 11:30.05 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 11:59.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32257 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcPCSet.cpp pcPCSet.h pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): Adding a generic PCSolver to take care of non-binary constraints as well taking data directly from the PCSet without using the graph structures |
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| 12:08.26 | mafm | brlcad: what's the logic behind including headers' order, from the HACKING file? |
| 12:13.57 | mafm | if you include system headers before your code's headers, your headers are not autocontained |
| 12:14.41 | mafm | say, if you need std::vector in a header, you might not put it but still works in your code |
| 12:15.09 | mafm | but then brokes when somebody wants to include the header in a new implementation file, and forgets to include what the header needs |
| 12:24.41 | brlcad | mafm: portability/overridability |
| 12:24.55 | brlcad | "you might not put it" would be an error in that header |
| 12:24.59 | brlcad | s/header/source/ |
| 12:25.08 | brlcad | each file should include what it needs |
| 12:26.02 | brlcad | the ordering ensure consistent inclusion across platforms and allows you to globally (and consistently) override or account for system peculiarities |
| 12:34.15 | brlcad | it also helps identify/fix cyclic header dependencies because it's really hard to keep them in the prescribed order if the interfaces form a cycle (which is generally a bad design) |
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| 13:18.21 | mac- | HI THERE |
| 13:18.25 | mac- | sorry for caps :) |
| 13:18.50 | mac- | i wish to install BRL-CAD on my slackware Linux |
| 13:19.00 | mac- | there is sense to compile it ? |
| 13:21.03 | starseeker | sure, that should work fine |
| 13:21.55 | mac- | but i`m looking now on download page from sourceforge |
| 13:21.56 | starseeker | The binary should be OK if you just want to try it out, but the compile is pretty straightforward if you want to build it yourself |
| 13:22.17 | mac- | and there is only 64 bit version precompiled |
| 13:22.24 | mac- | when I`m working on IA32 |
| 13:22.25 | mac- | :/ |
| 13:22.43 | starseeker | Ah, yes - for the most recent one that's true |
| 13:22.52 | starseeker | 7.10.4 has 32 bit versions |
| 13:23.40 | mac- | I`m working on AMD Athlon 750 MHz with 768 MB ECC RAM and SCSI 10k disks it is enough ? |
| 13:23.53 | starseeker | sure |
| 13:24.01 | starseeker | plenty ;-) |
| 13:24.20 | starseeker | BRL-CAD has historically run on just about everything, from a VAX on up to a supercomputer |
| 13:24.37 | mac- | i wish to draw robot`s effector |
| 13:24.43 | mac- | :> |
| 13:25.09 | starseeker | effector? |
| 13:25.12 | mac- | there is module for motion simulation like on Deassault Systemes Catia ? |
| 13:25.26 | starseeker | our motion tools are pretty limited at the moment |
| 13:25.50 | mac- | effector is an robot working tool at the and of robot arm |
| 13:25.51 | mac- | :> |
| 13:26.15 | mac- | but there is tool for motion simulation ? |
| 13:26.51 | mac- | i know that Catia is very experienced software on this area |
| 13:26.55 | starseeker | I guess you could start here: http://brlcad.org/OLD/reports/tr-313/index.html |
| 13:27.17 | starseeker | I've never used them myself, so I'm not really qualified to comment |
| 13:27.34 | mafm | brlcad: what I told there it was only a simple problems, but there are more complex scenarios; like including RBGui header (external non-system header) which includes things that make that some .c/xx files have to include system headers before other local headers, or not |
| 13:28.09 | mafm | brlcad: but well, it was just for curiosity seeing what Ralith has done, it's about the same for me -- just that I was "fixing" them in the other direction recently |
| 13:28.47 | mac- | i`m student of mechanical engeenerig |
| 13:28.52 | mac- | engeneering |
| 13:29.11 | mac- | then i wish to define trajectories of elements motions |
| 13:29.59 | mac- | it will be very syntetic but should work proper for my requirements |
| 13:30.01 | mac- | :) |
| 13:34.57 | mac- | hmm, 24 MB of bz2 sources file, and it is complete BRL-CAD with all features ? |
| 13:34.58 | brlcad | mafm: that's a failure of encapsulation in the rbgui header then, which can be accounted for by having an rbgui wrapper private header that includes common, system-that-rbgui-needs, rbgui header |
| 13:35.16 | brlcad | or fixing rbgui's files |
| 13:36.37 | brlcad | the problem is there regardless |
| 13:37.18 | brlcad | mac-: what else would you expect? |
| 13:38.31 | brlcad | catia has more than 1k developers and a 5-figure per-seat license fee (USD/EUR) so keep that in mind :P |
| 13:39.00 | mac- | and is written in VisualBasic :P |
| 13:40.49 | mafm | oh, that explains why it's so expensive |
| 13:40.58 | mac- | :> |
| 13:41.16 | mac- | do you worked on Catia ? |
| 13:41.27 | mac- | did you work on Catia?* |
| 13:47.57 | mafm | (not me) |
| 13:50.20 | mac- | catia is very 'heavy' software |
| 13:51.09 | mac- | I`ve installed it on my slackware unser wine, and moreover it started but can`t work :P |
| 13:51.37 | pacman87 | mac-: i run slackware too, and i compiled from source |
| 13:52.11 | mafm | pacman87: he's talking about a software called Catia, not BRL-CAD :D |
| 13:52.40 | pacman87 | i was responding more to the scrollback than the latest comment |
| 13:56.34 | mac- | uhm, on which hardware and how long it taken ? |
| 13:57.01 | pacman87 | p4, 2.8ghz, 30-40 minutes |
| 13:57.14 | mac- | and how big binaries are ? |
| 13:59.04 | mac- | it will take about 3hrs to compile :) |
| 13:59.10 | mac- | on my machine |
| 13:59.11 | pacman87 | /usr/brlcad is 317MB |
| 13:59.24 | mac- | it`s quite big after compile :) |
| 13:59.37 | pacman87 | my svn checkout directory is 997MB |
| 14:07.21 | PrezKennedy | i should try compiling it on my wimpy centos box |
| 14:11.47 | mac- | :) |
| 14:11.53 | mac- | You are engeeners ? |
| 14:12.20 | pacman87 | i'm a ME major/EE minor at UT, class of '09 |
| 14:13.17 | mac- | what kond of constructions You are drwaing on BRL ? |
| 14:13.30 | PrezKennedy | im an IT major, class of someday :) |
| 14:14.01 | brlcad | mac-: why would I work on catia? did they make it open source recently? :) |
| 14:14.14 | mac- | heh |
| 14:14.17 | brlcad | I just know a couple of their devs |
| 14:14.36 | brlcad | s/know/have met/ .. not like we chum out every week |
| 14:15.34 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, you going to siggraph? |
| 14:15.35 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: you should do something about that 'someday' :) |
| 14:15.39 | brlcad | absolutely |
| 14:18.07 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i will, work is going to pay for it |
| 14:18.40 | brlcad | paying for it isn't the hardest part .. it's doing the work and finsihing :) |
| 14:19.39 | PrezKennedy | yeah there is that too |
| 14:24.52 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, ive got the motivation and i know where i want to go with it now... didnt have that before :) |
| 14:25.06 | mac- | oh, there is any rewuirement i.e. OpenGL graphic adapter or something ? |
| 14:25.21 | mac- | I have Matrox MGA G200 |
| 14:29.22 | brlcad | mac-: nope |
| 14:31.00 | mac- | gr8 :) |
| 14:45.11 | Axman6 | wow, been a long time since i've seen anyone use that |
| 14:50.40 | mac- | what ? |
| 14:50.42 | mac- | G200 ? |
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| 16:10.06 | starseeker | mac-: You should be fine to compile and run it |
| 16:10.06 | starseeker | just remember that it's not intuitive for beginners - you will NEED to read the docs |
| 16:10.09 | brlcad | wee, fun |
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| 16:50.14 | brlcad | initial testing of using constant integers for X, Y, Z, etc seems to give about a 40% decrease in performance (at least on unoptimized) .. testing at least one other platform and optimized |
| 16:51.12 | brlcad | supposes that is more intended for Ralith who is not here |
| 16:51.47 | prasad_ | i wont be able to make it to siggraph :( |
| 16:53.51 | brlcad | prasad_: ahh, shame |
| 16:54.29 | brlcad | I'm sure the girls will cry when I tell them you couldn't be there |
| 16:57.04 | mafm | brlcad: why Ralith? I can't see traces of those changes in the diffs |
| 16:57.24 | brlcad | mafm: it was a discussion we were having a few days ago |
| 16:58.31 | brlcad | the changes weren't committed |
| 16:58.37 | brlcad | (*gasp* -- changes to the core ray-trace or numerics library that might affect performance shouldn't be committed without testing) |
| 16:59.28 | mafm | ah OK |
| 16:59.37 | brlcad | it's come up before, so it was worth testing out to see what the impact would be like .. alas it looks like what we do is for a very good reason (and should probably be documented as such) |
| 17:00.06 | brlcad | it's the kind of thing you don't remember 10 years later, no matter how intuitive it seems 'today' |
| 17:04.37 | brlcad | needs faster computers |
| 17:05.52 | prasad_ | indeed :( |
| 17:06.14 | prasad_ | but we'll prolly unveil gfx on iphone/mobile there |
| 17:06.17 | mafm | what do you use instead of const int? macros/straight numbers? |
| 17:06.55 | brlcad | yes |
| 17:07.34 | brlcad | I'm expecting optimized to do much better, but how much better is the question |
| 17:14.09 | starseeker | brlcad: What was the name of that FB variable again? |
| 17:17.38 | mafm | hmm |
| 17:17.52 | mafm | I thought that the compiler would treat const int as a macro |
| 17:18.04 | brlcad | starseeker: FB_FILE ? |
| 17:18.35 | starseeker | Is that the remote display one? |
| 17:18.38 | starseeker | that wasn't working? |
| 17:18.47 | brlcad | well yes and no |
| 17:19.02 | brlcad | FB_FILE is simply an alternative to using the -F option with all the tools |
| 17:19.23 | brlcad | it's having an FB_FILE or a -F using the remote interface that seems bused |
| 17:20.12 | brlcad | rt -Flocalhost:0 or rt -Fbzflag.bz:/dev/X:0, etc |
| 17:20.21 | brlcad | fbhelp |
| 17:23.38 | starseeker | hmm - confirmed, it didn't like the remote addy |
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| 17:25.49 | starseeker | interesting - the pkg_open printing shows the name of the target host minus one character |
| 17:26.33 | starseeker | e.g. pkg_open(machin,remotefb): unknown service instead of pkg_open(machine,remotefb): unknown service |
| 17:32.48 | starseeker | prods CIA |
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| 18:26.08 | mafm | brlcad: did you talk anything with Ralith about modifying the CMakeFile to include BRL-CAD root? |
| 18:26.38 | mafm | or the TCL includes? |
| 18:27.08 | mafm | I wouldn't think of any reason why TCL/TK would be necessary for this project |
| 18:31.04 | homovulgaris | howdy mafm :) |
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| 18:35.46 | mafm | hi homovulgaris, everything all right? |
| 18:36.40 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 18:39.07 | homovulgaris | pretty much |
| 18:39.39 | homovulgaris | my broadband has now a maximum limit of 512 kbps.. what is broad about that :| |
| 18:40.55 | mafm | I could live with less than that, if bills were smaller :) |
| 18:44.03 | starseeker | or if there were less free software to upgrade regularly ;-) |
| 18:44.34 | mafm | nope, I rarely update |
| 18:45.25 | homovulgaris | looking at an apt-get dist-upgrade size of 1289 MB right now |
| 18:45.50 | starseeker | heh - easier when you don't use Gentoo |
| 18:46.03 | starseeker | 's distro downloads the sources for everything and compiles - somewhat bigger |
| 18:46.41 | mafm | oh, sure |
| 18:46.45 | mafm | Debian ftw :P |
| 18:47.04 | starseeker | Nah, I like knowing everything is self consistent ;-) |
| 18:47.15 | mafm | I use unstable but don't update unless it's necessary feature-wise, or I'm bored and not in the middle of important projects |
| 18:49.51 | starseeker | If I were to use a binary distro though, it would be Debian or Ubuntu |
| 18:51.17 | mafm | and Debian is pretty consistent |
| 18:51.33 | mafm | int random { return 4; } |
| 18:51.35 | mafm | :) |
| 18:51.48 | mafm | random()* even |
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| 18:58.14 | homovulgaris | ibot says i have a message awaiting from brlcad .. how do i read ? :| irc noob |
| 19:02.42 | mafm | read 1, maybe |
| 19:03.45 | mafm | have to go now, see you later folks |
| 19:03.48 | homovulgaris | :) nope |
| 19:03.55 | homovulgaris | and :P |
| 19:03.58 | homovulgaris | ~read |
| 19:03.59 | ibot | ACTION reads Lord of the rings |
| 19:04.22 | homovulgaris | ciao mafm |
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| 19:57.15 | pacman87 | ~botmail |
| 19:57.41 | pacman87 | ~botmail read |
| 19:57.53 | pacman87 | homovulgaris: ^^ |
| 19:58.47 | homovulgaris | :) grr.. |
| 19:58.54 | homovulgaris | ~botmail read |
| 19:59.28 | homovulgaris | hmm.. that was 7d 9hours ago |
| 20:02.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32263 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add note about possibility of level of detail based wireframe drawing. |
| 20:02.50 | starseeker | hugs CIA-23 |
| 20:03.16 | homovulgaris | why is cia.vc having so much trouble these days |
| 20:03.36 | starseeker | not sure. It is a complex chain to keep up |
| 20:03.37 | CIA-23 | hugs starseeker |
| 22:03.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32264 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (15 files): renaming PCSet to VCSet for Variable-Constraint set since it is precisely what VCSet is, also necessary for adding a Parameter abstraction over the Variables . A vector is a collection of 3 variables for instance |
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| 23:03.17 | brlcad | starseeker: ah, then you might have found the bug -- an off-by-one on the string processing |
| 23:08.22 | brlcad | starseeker: yep |
| 23:08.43 | brlcad | they're good as-is if the docs are all updated/committed |
| 23:08.57 | brlcad | don't forget to tag it at that point |
| 23:09.12 | starseeker_ | Right - tag it in the branch? |
| 23:09.41 | brlcad | svn's idea of a tag is just a dir-to-dir cp |
| 23:09.58 | brlcad | but yeah, cp/tagging off the branch dir to the tags dir |
| 23:10.06 | starseeker_ | got it |
| 23:15.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32265 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/librender/Makefile.am: uses vmath.h so link libbn |
| 23:16.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32266 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/Makefile.am: uses vmath.h so link libbn |
| 23:17.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32267 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/convert.c: doesn't need/use vmath.h |
| 23:18.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32268 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: uses vmath.h so link libbn |
| 23:53.57 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Did you want to back something out of mged before I tag? |
| 23:54.08 | brlcad | ah, yes |
| 00:08.44 | brlcad | looks like the optimizer does do much better, but there is still about a 5% slowdown to use vars |
| 00:09.58 | brlcad | 4.1% to be more precise on this particular configuration (linux, ia64, gcc4.1.2) |
| 00:10.29 | brlcad | consistent enough to be significant, so it looks like that change is a no-go |
| 00:13.47 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:14.03 | brlcad | starseeker_: the changelog is moderately useless as-is .. how about just including all changes since r30789 |
| 00:19.34 | starseeker_ | ok |
| 00:20.03 | brlcad | maybe up to where you branched, then your branch commits |
| 00:20.35 | starseeker_ | sure, not a problem |
| 00:21.02 | brlcad | better to have too much than too little for it to be useful |
| 00:21.09 | starseeker_ | :-) |
| 00:21.45 | brlcad | i know some projects just include their entire project changelog .. that'd be hilarious |
| 00:22.17 | starseeker_ | hehe - we'd probably noticeably increase the file size of the tarball |
| 00:22.37 | brlcad | also, don't know if there is an option -- see if it can be in reverse chrono order |
| 00:22.47 | starseeker_ | mans svn2cl |
| 00:23.33 | brlcad | so newest is on top |
| 00:23.44 | brlcad | if not, no biggie |
| 00:23.46 | starseeker_ | Hmm, maybe reverse the r args? |
| 00:23.51 | starseeker_ | tries |
| 00:24.08 | brlcad | good idea :) |
| 00:32.37 | starseeker_ | bingo |
| 00:32.45 | starseeker_ | now the other half... |
| 00:37.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32269 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ChangeLog: Add more informative version of Changelog |
| 00:37.13 | starseeker_ | brlcad: OK, give that a look-see |
| 00:39.59 | starseeker_ | wonders if parse_file in if_remote.c could use a little regex love |
| 00:47.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32270 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: implement mged globbing so that it matches tcl's globbing interface (so glob_compat_mode can die). there's already all the pieces in place that would need this, though they don't presently behave. |
| 00:47.56 | brlcad | starseeker_: more than likely, it's a bu_ call that is off-by-one |
| 00:48.02 | starseeker_ | brlcad: my money is on it getting broken in r30030 |
| 00:50.09 | starseeker_ | looking at the history, it was changed from strcpy -> strncpy -> bu_strcpy |
| 00:50.35 | brlcad | it's almost guaranteed related to that change |
| 00:50.46 | starseeker_ | should it have been bu_strncpy? |
| 00:51.16 | starseeker_ | er bu_strlcpy |
| 00:51.21 | starseeker_ | was was was used |
| 00:51.37 | starseeker_ | not bu_strcpy |
| 00:51.59 | starseeker_ | can't test any changes to that locally, but at least it's a place to look |
| 00:52.07 | starseeker_ | should we try to get that fix into 7.12.6? |
| 00:52.34 | brlcad | sure |
| 00:53.11 | starseeker_ | <grin> OK, what's one more? ;-) I'll take a stab at it tomorrow. |
| 00:53.57 | brlcad | if you can't find it, then forget it |
| 00:54.12 | starseeker_ | k |
| 00:54.20 | starseeker_ | would be kind of a nice turnaround though :-) |
| 00:54.50 | starseeker_ | is thinking a few judicious bu_log outputs should tell the tale |
| 00:55.06 | starseeker_ | Is there a strncpy analog in libbu? |
| 00:55.33 | brlcad | bu_strlcpy |
| 00:55.39 | starseeker_ | heh |
| 00:55.55 | starseeker_ | OK. |
| 00:56.15 | brlcad | reading it now -- it's probably in this: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_remote.c?r1=30030&r2=30029&pathrev=30030 |
| 00:56.35 | starseeker_ | though so too |
| 00:56.59 | starseeker_ | line 208 looks most relevant |
| 00:57.22 | starseeker_ | or possibly 217 |
| 01:00.20 | starseeker_ | Wait - after 217, the prefix[colon-rest] = '\0'; was removed - was that intentional? |
| 01:00.47 | starseeker_ | bu_strlcpy takes care of the \0? |
| 01:01.59 | brlcad | strlcpy guarantees a null-termination |
| 01:02.12 | brlcad | that was part of why that change was made across the board |
| 01:02.19 | brlcad | hundreds of calls |
| 01:08.55 | starseeker_ | How come line 208 didn't have one before the change? |
| 01:10.52 | starseeker_ | itches to replace this with regex ;-) |
| 01:19.17 | brlcad | that's just part of the nature of using strcpy, strcat, strncpy, strncat |
| 01:19.43 | brlcad | some code would null-terminate, some wouldn't (relying on the null in the string being copied) |
| 01:19.56 | brlcad | other issues happen if you hit the end of a buffer |
| 01:20.15 | brlcad | it's a common way to have a security flaw |
| 01:20.43 | brlcad | the semantics on strlcpy() are much better, hence the change |
| 01:21.08 | brlcad | but it's behavior isn't 100% identical of course (otherwise what would be the point), so you have to review every use case by case |
| 01:21.52 | brlcad | which was done.. took several painstaking days of reviewing, but some slipped through |
| 01:26.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32271 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/if_remote.c: pointer arithmetic string length fun. strlcpy copy size includes the null terminator, so have to +1 |
| 01:26.22 | brlcad | that should be it, give it a test |
| 01:26.33 | starseeker_ | will do - thanks! |
| 01:26.43 | starseeker_ | is impressed :-) |
| 01:27.03 | brlcad | missed it because the arith operator was smashed in .. was reading it as a var |
| 01:27.15 | starseeker_ | Ah |
| 01:29.36 | starseeker_ | would have been mucking around with bu_log for half an hour ;-) |
| 01:30.19 | brlcad | nods |
| 01:30.25 | brlcad | you'll have plenty of other opportunities ;) |
| 01:30.35 | starseeker_ | <grin> |
| 01:32.38 | brlcad | fwiw, what's going on there is that it splits the string based on ':' using strchr() -- strctr returns a char* to the place in the string where the : is at, so if you subtrace the colon string from the input string, you get the length of the input up to the : since it's linear memory |
| 01:34.04 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 01:34.39 | brlcad | so e.g. input is "hello:tommy" at address 0x00000001, strchr will return char* to address 0x00000006 (":tommy") .. subtract the two pointers and you get 5 .. |
| 01:34.53 | brlcad | which is wrong for strlcpy since it will copy n-1 characters and then null-terminate the result |
| 01:34.59 | brlcad | so it copies 4 and null terminates |
| 01:35.07 | brlcad | hell |
| 01:35.23 | starseeker_ | ? |
| 01:35.28 | brlcad | "hell" :) |
| 01:35.35 | starseeker_ | Ah :-) |
| 01:35.46 | starseeker_ | thought brlcad was cussing out a report or a bug |
| 01:36.01 | brlcad | returns you to your regularly scheduled release programming |
| 01:36.26 | starseeker_ | and as a result, all remote connections fail (and even ones where localhost:0 is supplied, which should be a test case) |
| 01:36.55 | starseeker_ | returns brlcad to his regularly scheduled stressful stuff |
| 01:36.57 | brlcad | i should review that mega-diff yet one more time to see if there are any more smashed-variables that I glossed over as a var |
| 01:37.10 | starseeker_ | <wince> |
| 01:39.09 | starseeker_ | heh - I guess I have been CIA spamming of late. Well, that should be pretty much done now |
| 01:39.24 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads :) |
| 01:39.33 | starseeker_ | heya yukonbob |
| 01:39.38 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 01:39.56 | yukonbob | what's shaking, friendly neighbourhood h4x0rs? |
| 01:40.10 | starseeker_ | on the brink of release :-) :-) |
| 01:40.23 | yukonbob | mmmm... release |
| 01:40.44 | yukonbob | needs to get his completely "unstable" system stable-ish -- I've been away too long |
| 01:40.58 | yukonbob | *sniff* :~( |
| 01:41.01 | brlcad | yukonbob: and not coding for too long ;) |
| 01:41.17 | brlcad | code code type type |
| 01:41.53 | starseeker_ | dem bugs they need afixin |
| 01:41.58 | yukonbob | gah -- you know it -- I think I've contributed less than 20lines total (of code, not docs), but I'd sure love to really get into it... |
| 01:42.26 | yukonbob | oh |
| 01:42.29 | yukonbob | speaking of which |
| 01:42.34 | brlcad | starseeker_: so the last change is the 'binary' command |
| 01:42.44 | brlcad | i need to rename it once again |
| 01:42.47 | yukonbob | have either of you (or any other listeners) heard of the "reprap" machine |
| 01:42.47 | yukonbob | ? |
| 01:42.52 | starseeker_ | binary command... |
| 01:42.55 | starseeker_ | greps logs |
| 01:43.03 | starseeker_ | oh, a new change? |
| 01:43.04 | brlcad | yukonbob: absolutely |
| 01:43.10 | yukonbob | ...nice |
| 01:43.11 | brlcad | a few of their guys are/were in here from time to time |
| 01:43.25 | yukonbob | wants to build one, and set it up w/ brlcad |
| 01:43.32 | brlcad | you should! |
| 01:43.44 | brlcad | wants an m35 |
| 01:43.58 | brlcad | starseeker_: it was 'dbbinary' |
| 01:44.03 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 01:44.04 | yukonbob | our .stl support is good? |
| 01:44.05 | brlcad | related to the _DENSITIES |
| 01:44.19 | starseeker_ | brlcad: It needs to be dbbinary again? |
| 01:44.20 | brlcad | yukonbob: pretty good |
| 01:44.20 | yukonbob | believes it takes .stl |
| 01:44.24 | brlcad | it's an utterly horrible format |
| 01:44.36 | brlcad | starseeker_: I hate 'dbbinary' as a name |
| 01:44.55 | brlcad | it's so ambiguous |
| 01:44.55 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 01:45.05 | brlcad | and misleading |
| 01:45.25 | brlcad | is it supposed to make my .g binary? I thought it was already binary |
| 01:45.34 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 01:45.39 | jonored | grins, and needs to get started on his machine. |
| 01:46.16 | brlcad | and what does it have to do with dbconcat? if dbconcat concatenates a db, then surely dbbinary binarifies a db |
| 01:46.50 | starseeker_ | makes sense. What's the proposed replacement? |
| 01:47.06 | brlcad | 'binary' was merely a compromise, it was familiar with the old and removed the db confusion |
| 01:47.11 | brlcad | but that conflicts with tcl |
| 01:47.30 | starseeker_ | mmm |
| 01:47.44 | jonored | yukonbob: I've actually been doing a bit towards just going from a .g to g-code for a reprap... |
| 01:48.34 | brlcad | so i'm thinking of changing it either back to dbbinary (ugh) or to either a generalized 'import' or 'data' command |
| 01:48.51 | brlcad | jonored: that would be awesome |
| 01:49.00 | brlcad | a g-gcode converter |
| 01:49.48 | jonored | not nearly enough to be ready, and currently messing around with perl because I've been having trouble getting stuff to compile cleanly, but trying. |
| 01:50.16 | brlcad | jonored: try the STABLE branch instead of head -- that should compile fine |
| 01:50.42 | brlcad | or post the compilation problems -- they should be fixed |
| 01:50.47 | yukonbob | jonored: nice -- are you strictly playing w/ software, or do you have the hardware, too? |
| 01:50.47 | brlcad | s/be/get/ |
| 01:51.55 | brlcad | starseeker_: thoughts? |
| 01:51.58 | brlcad | (or others) |
| 01:52.28 | starseeker_ | importdata ? |
| 01:52.38 | jonored | brlcad: I'm not convinced that any of them weren't from grabbing an ebuild from gentoo's scientific overlay, and messing with it a bit to try to get it to build a newer version... |
| 01:52.40 | yukonbob | brlcad -- what is the function of this to-be-named command? |
| 01:52.42 | starseeker_ | I agree dbbinary isn't so hot |
| 01:53.19 | jonored | Especially because the weird thing with configure eating my processor for an hour or two didn't happen when I did it manually... |
| 01:53.21 | brlcad | yukonbob: it's a command that is presently used to marshall files into and out of your .g |
| 01:53.36 | brlcad | e.g. you can use it to shove an msword .doc into the .g |
| 01:53.47 | starseeker_ | <wince> |
| 01:53.49 | brlcad | or more usefully, use it to import terrain data or texture files as objects |
| 01:54.02 | brlcad | that can then be used without needing the external files |
| 01:54.02 | yukonbob | that's one place to shove a .doc |
| 01:54.34 | brlcad | and in the case of the g_qa command, it is used to import a material properties table (text file) |
| 01:54.46 | starseeker_ | wonders when someone will stuff a pdf documenting the model into the model, then request a command to open it |
| 01:55.02 | jonored | yukonbob: I haven't quite gotten to the point of getting the hardware on an undergraduate's budget yet ;) |
| 01:55.12 | brlcad | why not? :) |
| 01:55.36 | yukonbob | give up beer for a month... |
| 01:56.51 | jonored | bah, I don't drink much, certainly not beer... |
| 01:57.01 | starseeker_ | hmm - well, the name is right now |
| 01:57.10 | yukonbob | is tossing around command-names like "jam" "slurp" |
| 01:57.25 | starseeker_ | anything special needed to make fbhelp -F localhost:/dev/X work? |
| 01:58.17 | yukonbob | "stow"? |
| 01:59.53 | starseeker_ | pkg_open(localhost,remotefb): unknown service |
| 01:59.53 | starseeker_ | pkg_open: client connect: errno=111 |
| 01:59.53 | starseeker_ | rem_open: can't connect to remotefb server on host "localhost". |
| 01:59.53 | starseeker_ | fb_open: can't open device "localhost:/dev/X", ret=-4. |
| 01:59.53 | starseeker_ | fbhelp: Can't open frame buffer |
| 01:59.56 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 02:00.25 | yukonbob | jonored: get a friend to give up beer for a month and give you the money? :) |
| 02:00.53 | yukonbob | tell them you'll craft them a custom bong... |
| 02:01.37 | yukonbob | is taking uni stereotypes too far... |
| 02:02.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32272 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/src/libfb/if_remote.c: Adjust libfb string copying - may be related to problem with remote FB display. |
| 02:02.10 | jonored | yukonbob: I'm more likely to go for finding cheap motors somehow and getting the friend with the laser cutter in his apartment to cut parts out on it... |
| 02:02.31 | starseeker_ | wonders what those power bills are like... |
| 02:03.14 | jonored | He's not gotten it all the way set up yet. Probably smaller power bills than buying laser cutter time, though... |
| 02:03.34 | starseeker_ | can the apartment building handle it? |
| 02:04.49 | yukonbob | "hitch"? |
| 02:04.59 | brlcad | starseeker_: yeah, there has to be an /etc/services entry for remotefb |
| 02:05.09 | starseeker_ | ah |
| 02:06.01 | brlcad | remotefb 5558/tcp # BRL-CAD remote frame buffer |
| 02:06.21 | jonored | Hopefully. It's not a hugely powerful one, won't do even thin metal... He says he's expecting it to be able to do up to about a half-inch of acrylic. |
| 02:06.42 | brlcad | and then /etc/inetd.conf needs: remotefb stream tcp nowait nobody /usr/brlcad/bin/fbserv fbserv |
| 02:06.44 | jonored | goes and sees if he can find a power rating for the beastie somewhere. |
| 02:07.44 | starseeker_ | hmm - gentoo doesn't have /etc/inetd.conf |
| 02:08.17 | jonored | starseeker: I'd expect that to depend on which inetd you use... |
| 02:09.36 | starseeker_ | hmm xinetd has some stuff here... |
| 02:10.24 | starseeker_ | will try at work tomorrow - a rebuild will be needed after brlcad picks the new name for dbbinary anyway |
| 02:10.46 | jonored | ...dbblob? |
| 02:10.48 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I'll vote for something other than *binary - do you have a hard preference there? |
| 02:11.14 | jonored | sees "blob" used to refer to that sort of chuck-a-binary-thing-in a lot... |
| 02:11.17 | brlcad | starseeker_: some newer linux use xinetd, so an /etc/xinet.d/fbserv file |
| 02:14.59 | yukonbob | also has "alien" in mind, referencing putting an "alien" file into the .g... |
| 02:15.42 | brlcad | could live with an sqlishy 'blob' command |
| 02:16.18 | starseeker_ | adddata? |
| 02:16.27 | yukonbob | heh |
| 02:16.31 | yukonbob | lol |
| 02:16.44 | yukonbob | what a mouthful... just a funny word.. not laughing at the suggestion. |
| 02:16.49 | brlcad | nnno? :) |
| 02:16.55 | yukonbob | sounds like gattaca |
| 02:17.20 | starseeker_ | would prefer something slightly more descriptive than "blob"... |
| 02:17.20 | yukonbob | is still laughing... |
| 02:17.25 | brlcad | presently, it is used to both import and export |
| 02:17.36 | brlcad | so if the name implies just one, there has to be a matching for export |
| 02:17.46 | starseeker_ | would that be bad? |
| 02:17.57 | brlcad | no |
| 02:18.11 | starseeker_ | would intuitively expect that, come to think of it |
| 02:18.37 | brlcad | that's actually why I was leaning towards import/export .. could make it a generalized command to import/export anything |
| 02:19.10 | starseeker_ | likes that |
| 02:19.16 | starseeker_ | far more intuitive |
| 02:19.32 | yukonbob | ...though an OO-type command with sub-commands is kinda nice, too -- esp. if the noun + verb are the same... |
| 02:19.49 | brlcad | e.g., import/export another .g file (maybe replaces dbconcat/keep) |
| 02:20.10 | starseeker_ | base it on the file type? |
| 02:20.12 | yukonbob | saves looking for the "un" "de" "anti" etc version of one command |
| 02:20.49 | starseeker_ | heh - is "io" taken? |
| 02:22.14 | brlcad | blob import file.doc mydoc or blob -i uc file.doc mydoc, etc |
| 02:22.39 | starseeker_ | blob just sounds so... undignified |
| 02:22.52 | starseeker_ | ah, well - I must admit I have also seen it in this context |
| 02:23.05 | brlcad | data import mydoc file.doc |
| 02:23.13 | starseeker_ | :-) |
| 02:23.58 | jonored | Isn't it something along the lines of "binary large object"? |
| 02:24.00 | starseeker_ | yes, I like that - but if it's going to also replace dbconcat, shouldn't it wait til after the release? |
| 02:24.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32273 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 02:24.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: fixed a bug that caused remote framebuffers (specified via -F or FB_FILE) to |
| 02:24.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: fail. this bug was reported (in person) by r.lai and v.cericole after |
| 02:24.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: encountered during ray-trace tests. fortunately, you could work around the |
| 02:24.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: problem by using DISPLAY, but this should fix it. |
| 02:24.50 | brlcad | yes, I'm just thinking where to go for the right fix |
| 02:25.09 | brlcad | for release, might just revert to dbbinary :( |
| 02:25.15 | starseeker_ | fair enough |
| 02:25.30 | starseeker_ | like the generic "data" command |
| 02:25.33 | brlcad | right now it's: binary -i u c _DENSITIES filename |
| 02:25.43 | starseeker_ | ick |
| 02:25.51 | yukonbob | "data" has no "personality" |
| 02:26.08 | yukonbob | could be anything... |
| 02:26.18 | starseeker_ | what about having g_qa and rtweight and whoever else needs it ask for a filename if _DENSITIES isn't found? |
| 02:26.41 | yukonbob | like "blob" -- besides, the objects don't need to be blobs, do they? |
| 02:27.22 | brlcad | starseeker_: those commands have no support for (or expectation of) user-provided interactive input |
| 02:27.42 | brlcad | and it's not deterministic behavior |
| 02:27.51 | brlcad | it does check for the file now, it could bitch better |
| 02:28.32 | brlcad | yukonbob: right now, they all get imported into the .g file as a "binary object" |
| 02:29.03 | yukonbob | mmm. But that's an implementation detail to the user of the command... |
| 02:29.17 | brlcad | all it knows is the type of data -- e.g. it's an array of unsigned characters or an array of short integers or an array of floating point integers, etc |
| 02:29.23 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:29.31 | jonored | hellcattrav: you want ">"... "ipconfig > ip_address.txt" |
| 02:29.39 | jonored | ...wrong channel. |
| 02:29.57 | brlcad | ~nickometer hellcattrav |
| 02:30.05 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I suppose - I like the idea of using the context of the command to avoid needing to specify something like _DENSITIES manually, but it could be a problem if interactive behavior is a no-no" |
| 02:30.10 | yukonbob | ..and you want /etc/passwd, not ip_address.txt |
| 02:30.25 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:30.27 | starseeker_ | lol |
| 02:30.48 | jonored | hides in shame. |
| 02:31.02 | starseeker_ | could have the "blob" or "data" command look in the file for a optional target object name? |
| 02:31.16 | brlcad | starseeker_: I could see mged or a gui prompting after checking for the file, the command-line commands are (all?) non-interactive though |
| 02:31.26 | starseeker_ | OK. |
| 02:32.02 | brlcad | and I agree, _DENSITIES needs to die |
| 02:32.30 | brlcad | more to the point, it should be better integrated, a hidden detail at best if it's an object, but not a binary_obj |
| 02:32.39 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 02:32.55 | brlcad | maybe make it official attributes on _GLOBAL if we have to |
| 02:33.00 | yukonbob | matryoshka <-- russian stacking doll |
| 02:33.29 | starseeker_ | I can see multiple density objects, and specifying an rtweight calculation with different ones to compare density tables, but that's more a debugging feature than anything - theoretically most densities have a "right" answer |
| 02:33.40 | yukonbob | "borg", for assimilation... |
| 02:33.49 | starseeker_ | hehe |
| 02:33.50 | yukonbob | borg in myfile.txt myfile |
| 02:33.59 | yukonbob | borg out myfile myfile.txt |
| 02:34.11 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 02:34.28 | yukonbob | "Hey -- borg that .doc into the db and let's ship!" |
| 02:34.38 | starseeker_ | likes it better as the univeral *->g converter - "resistance is futile, your CAD file will be assimilated" |
| 02:35.37 | starseeker_ | should get chores done and sleep... |
| 02:38.02 | brlcad | actually "bo in myfile.txt myfile" or "bo -i u c myfile.txt myfile" was one of the ideas I've been considering |
| 02:38.39 | brlcad | makes a mental note to do laundry before leaving so he actualy has clothes to wear |
| 02:39.24 | yukonbob | stephen colbert last night: "Hey America, I wear the pants in this relationship. [glances down] Most of the time." |
| 02:42.06 | yukonbob | is feeling that his colourful names are getting traction ;) |
| 02:42.57 | starseeker_ | doesn't want to have to answer the question "so why did you call this command "blob" again?" |
| 02:43.45 | brlcad | yeah, I'd lean away from blob -- though for different reasons |
| 02:44.00 | yukonbob | thinks blob is too generic; sees starseeker_'s POV re: attrativeness, but mostly doesn't like it because it could apply to so many diff't aspects of BRL-CAD |
| 02:44.23 | brlcad | with sql, blob types are "untyped" data that you don't know much about |
| 02:44.31 | brlcad | with us, we know what they are |
| 02:44.35 | brlcad | to some extent |
| 02:45.08 | brlcad | and if we get to adding mime-types and handlers, we could deal with them -- bring in a pdf, display it, etc |
| 02:45.36 | yukonbob | still likes "alien" or similar... |
| 02:45.51 | yukonbob | "visitor" -- anybody remember that TV show "V"? |
| 02:45.58 | brlcad | data is generic enough that it's borderline on too generic, but still would do the trick as would import/export |
| 02:46.01 | yukonbob | wasn't allowed to watch it :P |
| 02:46.13 | brlcad | bo is quirky brief like most of our commands and directly pertains to what it is/does |
| 02:46.31 | brlcad | yukonbob: yeah.. vaguely :) |
| 02:46.32 | yukonbob | kinda likes 'bo' for it's Unix-yness |
| 02:46.33 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 02:46.59 | yukonbob | assumes it's for _B_inary _O_bject |
| 02:47.04 | brlcad | yep |
| 02:47.06 | jonored | suggests that blobs usually are mostly unknown only to the database software, not the app using it, but likes bo better. |
| 02:47.59 | brlcad | mm.. so perhaps bo ftw for now |
| 02:48.07 | brlcad | dissenters?! |
| 02:48.14 | yukonbob | beau |
| 02:48.27 | brlcad | (burn them!) |
| 02:48.35 | yukonbob | :) |
| 02:48.42 | yukonbob | raises glass of OJ to "bo" |
| 02:48.43 | jonored | ...bob? |
| 02:48.55 | yukonbob | heh |
| 02:48.58 | brlcad | mged so needs a 'bob' command |
| 02:48.58 | jonored | ducks. |
| 02:49.14 | brlcad | i'm just not sure what it'd do :) |
| 02:49.22 | yukonbob | duck and weave. |
| 02:50.08 | brlcad | could make it randomly pick a command and alias it to some other random command |
| 02:50.24 | yukonbob | awesome... |
| 02:50.39 | brlcad | notes that the name of the dev that has written most of mged is named 'bob' |
| 02:50.47 | yukonbob | "and from around the lab, one would occasionally hear 'fscking bob!'" |
| 02:51.00 | brlcad | has heard that :) |
| 02:51.13 | brlcad | (in good fun usually) |
| 02:51.26 | yukonbob | "usually" |
| 02:51.27 | yukonbob | :) |
| 02:51.36 | brlcad | bob rocks |
| 02:52.19 | yukonbob | is this the bob that I still see commit msgs from in here? |
| 02:52.23 | yukonbob | *Bob |
| 02:52.25 | brlcad | oooh, 'bob' could increase the font size +1 each time you run it |
| 02:52.41 | yukonbob | on that note, we need better font handling in mged. |
| 02:52.44 | brlcad | he likes big fonts |
| 02:52.55 | brlcad | yeah, same bob |
| 02:53.12 | yukonbob | had a script that he'd source/run to fix the fonts when he was more regularly running BRL-CAD |
| 02:53.39 | brlcad | you know you could set the fonts, then run "update/create .mgedrc" on the File menu, no? ;) |
| 02:54.04 | brlcad | that should say "Save Preferences" |
| 02:54.25 | yukonbob | never thinks of the menu :P -- I'll keep in mind, though :) |
| 02:54.39 | brlcad | there's a font panel on the menu |
| 02:54.44 | brlcad | how were you changing the fonts? :) |
| 02:55.06 | yukonbob | introspection, creating a default tag, adjusting tag :P |
| 02:55.22 | yukonbob | "tag" is wrong word, but I don't have a manual handy, nor script. |
| 02:56.44 | yukonbob | something like font create foo "*-*-*-helvetica-10-l-whatever", and then adjusting appropriate items to use this font... then can update the "foo" and everything that was using it would be automagically updated. |
| 03:04.31 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:06.08 | brlcad | looks like using const int's for the indicese on ia32 is a 4-8% hit for both optimized and unoptimized |
| 03:06.27 | brlcad | deletes the patch and associated changes |
| 03:06.40 | yukonbob | expensive |
| 03:17.09 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Do you want me to implement the binary -> bo change tomorrow? |
| 03:19.49 | brlcad | starseeker_: I'm almost done |
| 03:19.56 | starseeker_ | ah :- |
| 03:20.02 | starseeker_ | ) |
| 03:21.07 | starseeker_ | starts - cat jumped on back of chair |
| 03:21.16 | starseeker_ | she's never done that before, at least not with my chair |
| 03:21.27 | starseeker_ | we must be feeding her wheaties |
| 03:22.16 | brlcad | ever put a piece of tape on her back? |
| 03:22.26 | starseeker_ | no |
| 03:22.46 | starseeker_ | it'd be a tossup as to whether the cat or the boss would kill me first |
| 03:23.09 | brlcad | :) |
| 03:23.31 | yukonbob | tape sounds like fun... |
| 03:23.38 | starseeker_ | she has however (of her own accord) jumped into the washer/dryer when it was warm after clothes were removed |
| 03:23.41 | yukonbob | is "cat sitting" two cats atm. |
| 03:23.45 | starseeker_ | needs to get a picture of that... |
| 03:24.21 | starseeker_ | is actually allergic to cats, but after a few months with an initial anti-allergy assist tolerance seems to be building |
| 03:24.53 | brlcad | thinks the news section could use some wordsmithing .. it doesn't say much different than the bullets |
| 03:25.01 | starseeker_ | yukonbob: TWO cats? |
| 03:25.03 | brlcad | yeah, i'm somewhat allergic myself |
| 03:25.04 | starseeker_ | how do they get along? |
| 03:25.12 | yukonbob | nods |
| 03:25.21 | yukonbob | <- not a cat fan. |
| 03:25.31 | starseeker_ | brlcad: please! I didn't know quite what to do with that part |
| 03:25.39 | brlcad | it was the first thing I discovered I was ever allergic to (at the age of 20 or so) |
| 03:25.44 | starseeker_ | ! |
| 03:25.57 | brlcad | aside from poison ivy that is.. :) |
| 03:25.58 | starseeker_ | found out he didn't get along with various pollens early on... |
| 03:26.02 | starseeker_ | hehe |
| 03:27.09 | brlcad | stayed with a buddy down in georgia.. the small apartment had this viscious cat that controlled the domain and whose smell, fur, and dander permeated every inch of the place |
| 03:27.22 | starseeker_ | ick |
| 03:27.35 | brlcad | it would like under a chair and take swipes at anyone passing by (drawing blood) |
| 03:27.48 | starseeker_ | oh, lovely |
| 03:28.01 | starseeker_ | never ran into one quite that bad |
| 03:28.13 | brlcad | I mean it was a normal 'cat place' .. but first I'd slept/lived in extensively with a cat that couldn't go outdoors |
| 03:29.12 | starseeker_ | looks at previous NEWS entries and tries again... |
| 03:29.12 | brlcad | took me several weeks to realize why I woke up every morning feeling utterly miserable, thought it was a cold, but then I'd get better after I left the house going to the gym, to work, dinner, etc |
| 03:29.37 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 03:29.46 | starseeker_ | that's nasty |
| 03:31.20 | brlcad | starseeker_: think of it like you're explaining what all those bullets mean to someone who maybe knows very little about BRL-CAD specifically, or that doesn't want to follow all the bullet items and wants the big picture |
| 03:31.37 | brlcad | plus it's a good place to put the "why" and "what does this mean" |
| 03:41.49 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Were you actually able to test the fbhelp option? I didn't get it working here yet |
| 03:46.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32274 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/NEWS: First try at tweaking NEWS wording |
| 03:47.30 | brlcad | of course not :) |
| 03:47.38 | starseeker_ | heh |
| 03:47.52 | brlcad | rather, I'm "able" .. but I didn't |
| 04:14.13 | PrezKennedy | never had too much doubt when im allergic to something |
| 04:15.29 | PrezKennedy | a day at a place with a cat and id probably need to be hospitalized |
| 04:15.31 | PrezKennedy | :P |
| 04:34.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32275 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 8 dirs): |
| 04:34.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: after some discussions on the channel, rename the 'binary' command in mge to the |
| 04:34.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 'bo' command (for binary object). this was done due to the fact that Tcl |
| 04:34.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: already has a 'binary' command and ours ends up masking it - a cnflict that |
| 04:34.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: mysteriously didn't surface during early 8.5 testing but is still there. this |
| 04:34.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: relates to tom browders sf bug 1532699 that prompted th initial change. other |
| 04:34.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: options considered: import/export, data, blob, borg, dbblob, adddata, ... |
| 04:53.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32276 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/bottest.c: put semicolons so it indents correctly |
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| 05:14.24 | starseeker_ | growls at the merge tools for Linux |
| 05:14.39 | starseeker_ | 'course, perhaps I shouldn't be at subversion 1.5 just yet... |
| 05:15.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32277 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (10 files in 8 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 05:15.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: sync with r32275 changes on trunk. after some discussions on the channel, |
| 05:15.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: rename the 'binary' command in mge to the 'bo' command (for binary object). |
| 05:15.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: this was done due to the fact that Tcl already has a 'binary' command and ours |
| 05:15.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: ends up masking it - a cnflict that mysteriously didn't surface during early 8.5 |
| 05:15.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: testing but is still there. this relates to tom browders sf bug 1532699 that |
| 05:15.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: prompted th initial change. other options considered: import/export, data, blob, |
| 05:16.10 | starseeker_ | heh - thanks :-) |
| 05:16.32 | starseeker_ | decides to see what subcommander is like... |
| 05:17.16 | brlcad | untested :) |
| 05:17.35 | starseeker_ | brlcad: No worries - I'll put it through one more cycle tomorrow |
| 05:17.45 | starseeker_ | and test bo |
| 05:17.59 | brlcad | make test will test bo |
| 05:18.07 | starseeker_ | cool |
| 05:18.23 | brlcad | make sure the mged create menu works though |
| 05:18.35 | starseeker_ | k |
| 06:04.43 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 06:15.53 | brlcad | howdy Ralith |
| 06:16.22 | brlcad | i finished testing the const int replacement, it was definitely a no-go .. |
| 06:16.37 | brlcad | anywhere from 4 to 40% performance hit, even on optimized |
| 06:16.56 | brlcad | but I think I have something that should be a suitable fix in the works now |
| 06:17.17 | Ralith | :/ |
| 06:17.22 | Ralith | alright; what're you thinking? |
| 06:17.56 | brlcad | basically adding a switch that turns them off (rather, hides them) |
| 06:18.25 | Ralith | there's always const _X_ = X; #undef X \n const X = _X; |
| 06:18.38 | brlcad | that you define, akin to _POSIX_C_SOURCE and similar defines |
| 06:18.40 | Ralith | a switch where? |
| 06:18.46 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:19.15 | Ralith | that's not necessarily helpful |
| 06:19.19 | Ralith | all the vmath macros depend on them |
| 06:19.34 | Ralith | so I'm left doing very ugly and space-consuming operations everywhere |
| 06:19.53 | brlcad | huh? |
| 06:20.02 | Ralith | e.g. VSETALL |
| 06:20.12 | Ralith | doesn't work without X, Y, Z defined or set somehow |
| 06:20.33 | brlcad | i'm talking about a switch that changes that... |
| 06:20.38 | Ralith | ooh! |
| 06:20.46 | brlcad | what did you think I meant?? |
| 06:20.58 | Ralith | a switch that just disabled the definition of X, Y, and Z |
| 06:21.11 | brlcad | no, the macros obviously still have to work |
| 06:21.19 | brlcad | otherwise it's a broken header |
| 06:22.40 | Ralith | yeah. |
| 06:23.26 | Ralith | that'll do well enough, although the usage still seems pretty inelegant compared to your standard C++ fare. |
| 06:25.21 | brlcad | i'll take efficiency over elegancy in this situation :) |
| 06:26.17 | Ralith | still wonders if there's no way to hack a struct on top of the array data |
| 06:26.49 | Ralith | using a C++ class would induce overhead, wouldn't it? |
| 06:27.15 | brlcad | yep |
| 06:27.19 | brlcad | quite a lot actually |
| 06:27.25 | Ralith | suspected that. |
| 06:27.26 | Ralith | >:| |
| 06:27.38 | Ralith | stupid performance sensitivity. |
| 06:28.09 | brlcad | subtle too, doens't show up easily on a profile (e.g. gprof) since it's distributed unless you observe overall time or use a sampling profiler (maybe) |
| 06:28.40 | Ralith | if you've got the time to explain, how does it induce the overhead? |
| 06:28.46 | brlcad | it's hard to get much faster than directly accessing memory in order marching through memory |
| 06:30.12 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:30.25 | Ralith | so not so much a case of extra overhead as a case of comparison to absolutely no overhead. |
| 06:30.31 | brlcad | a struct is an interesting one -- a really good compiler optimization "should/could" make that a fairly minimal approach except that there are memory alignment issues based on how an array of structs can be packed into memory, how individual elements are positioned, alignment paddings, compilation settings |
| 06:30.53 | Ralith | depending on compiler features is silly, anyway. |
| 06:31.43 | brlcad | there are egregious overheads you can have with OO vector math classes that often go unnoticed, like implicit data copying, vtable dereferencing, pointer dereferencing, etc (for various naive implementations) |
| 06:32.46 | Ralith | a real shame, given all the wonderful syntax that OO impls allow. |
| 06:32.48 | brlcad | it's actually somewhat non-trivial to make a c++ vector/matrix class that is optimal |
| 06:33.35 | brlcad | doesn't mean we can't use it or make one, just means have to be pretty careful about it and that still doesn't mean the C code shouldn't be as tight as possible :) |
| 06:33.42 | Ralith | yeah |
| 06:34.27 | Ralith | still, even a simple naive implementation that wraps and can convert to the C one might be really nice to keep performance-insensitive code like the new GUI clean and elegant. |
| 06:36.20 | mac- | re |
| 06:36.56 | mac- | starseeker_: i suppose that, in the past i`ve compiled several programs and i`m familiar with problems during this |
| 07:05.48 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:26.43 | brlcad | gets back to his task at hand |
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| 08:08.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32278 10/brlcad/branches/pre-7-12-6/ (11 files in 10 dirs): revive the CMake build (brlcad.dll) |
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| 09:19.54 | brlcad | arf |
| 09:20.05 | Ralith | arf indeed! |
| 09:21.07 | brlcad | Ralith: what timezone are you in? |
| 09:21.54 | Ralith | pacific |
| 09:21.59 | brlcad | heh, nice |
| 09:22.07 | brlcad | woots on the night owl |
| 09:22.58 | Ralith | o/ |
| 09:23.02 | Ralith | coding isn't coding if it's not done after midnight |
| 09:23.47 | brlcad | =) |
| 10:48.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32279 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/stractNet.eap: |
| 10:54.44 | archivist_ub | fresh svn checkout on ubuntu what have I missed or what dependency is missing from configure http://pastebin.ca/1093661 |
| 11:00.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32280 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/geometryService/src/geometryService/subsystems/GED.java: |
| 11:04.00 | *** join/#brlcad mac`u (i=mac@linux.slackware.in) | |
| 11:04.03 | mac`u | re :) |
| 11:18.05 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:19.05 | mafm | hi |
| 11:19.36 | Ralith | hey |
| 11:20.32 | mafm | what's up Ralith? |
| 11:20.56 | Ralith | idling around |
| 11:21.18 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 11:21.18 | Ralith | g3d switch to libbn vectors is almost ready, pending some updates from brlcad |
| 11:21.26 | Ralith | also |
| 11:21.31 | Ralith | I've been meaning to ask you, mafm |
| 11:21.44 | Ralith | why do you limit vertical camera rotation? |
| 11:22.38 | mafm | when you switch from almost-top to top-post (and same with bottom), the camera makes a strange turn |
| 11:23.10 | brlcad | sounds like a bug :) |
| 11:23.13 | Ralith | so force roll to a more reasonable value? |
| 11:23.24 | mafm | not really, it's because of the mathematical ecuations |
| 11:23.32 | mafm | afaik |
| 11:23.35 | Ralith | strange turns can be overriddent |
| 11:23.39 | Ralith | overridden* |
| 11:23.45 | Ralith | I'll see if I can do so |
| 11:23.55 | mafm | yes, they should, I just did a quick fix |
| 11:24.15 | mafm | probably you only have to change the sign of the vertical rotation or something like that |
| 11:24.37 | Ralith | kk |
| 11:24.49 | Ralith | was hesitant to play with it cuz I thought it might have been a conscious UI decision |
| 11:24.52 | Ralith | I'm no UI designer |
| 11:25.20 | mafm | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spherical_coordinates#Definition |
| 11:25.38 | mafm | 0 ? ? ? ? |
| 11:25.46 | mafm | 0 ? ? < 2? |
| 11:25.57 | Ralith | spherical coords are used? O.o |
| 11:26.03 | Ralith | that's very strange. |
| 11:26.54 | mafm | it's the easier way that it ocurred to me :) |
| 11:27.27 | Ralith | never thought I'd hear spherical coords referred to as easy. |
| 11:28.27 | mafm | well, I started implementing orbital mode |
| 11:28.36 | mafm | which is continuous, not in discrete steps |
| 11:29.10 | mafm | so while you maintain a key pressed, the amount of rotation goes up of down, in horizontal or vertical |
| 11:29.18 | Ralith | yeah, I played with that |
| 11:29.19 | Ralith | was neat |
| 11:29.30 | mafm | and zoom changes the ratio |
| 11:29.42 | Ralith | ratio of what? |
| 11:29.49 | mafm | radius* |
| 11:29.53 | Ralith | ah. |
| 11:29.56 | mafm | so the camera is basically in a point of the sphere looking to the center |
| 11:30.12 | Ralith | kk |
| 11:30.23 | Ralith | I've *really* gotta get some sleep now |
| 11:30.27 | Ralith | thanks for the explanations |
| 11:30.30 | mafm | soo... that's why I thought that it would be the more natural way to implement it :) |
| 11:30.35 | mafm | oki, see you around ;) |
| 11:30.55 | Ralith | conceptually simple, but doesn't strike me as mathematically straightforward. |
| 11:30.58 | Ralith | seeya. |
| 11:31.21 | brlcad | cya Ralith |
| 11:31.27 | Ralith | 'nite |
| 11:34.22 | mafm | feels a math nerd for the 1st time :D |
| 11:35.07 | archivist_ub | thats one thing I shall never be |
| 11:36.49 | mafm | I usually failed tests in math, although I like them in general |
| 11:39.30 | archivist_ub | I can program and use maths, but useless at generating the equations |
| 11:43.55 | mafm | heh |
| 11:44.05 | mafm | well, I think that I never did that either |
| 12:15.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32281 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/stractNet/ (106 files in 2 dirs): Phase 1 of code conversion effort. |
| 12:47.29 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
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| 13:17.09 | mafm | all hail network admins! |
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| 13:54.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32282 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am TODO pcParameter.cpp pcParameter.h): Adding skeleton files for Parameter classa abstraction over the Variables |
| 14:01.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32283 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/ (11 files): |
| 14:08.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32284 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/wiki/ (. index.html): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 14:12.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32285 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/ (13 files in 3 dirs): |
| 14:14.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32286 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/release/ (6 files): |
| 14:14.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32287 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Mods for automatically setting the version for asc2g.vcproj and brlcad.nsi |
| 14:17.25 | mafm | brlcad: do you conceive any possible use of Tcl/Tk in g3d? |
| 14:18.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32288 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/win32-msvc8/: This was mistakenly added with other mods. |
| 14:18.42 | brlcad | mafm: yes |
| 14:18.53 | brlcad | not for the near-term though |
| 14:19.10 | brlcad | other than as a requirement to link against the geometry engine libs |
| 14:19.36 | brlcad | but eventually, the ability to plug in and switch between scripting engines (ala script-fu) is in the plan |
| 14:20.03 | mafm | I just mean because ralith included some new things in the CMakeFile |
| 14:20.24 | brlcad | so as a scripter, you could use any of the common interactive shells as your scripting interface (posix sh, tclsh, maybe others) |
| 14:20.25 | mafm | and I don't know if the TCL/TK part should be there or not |
| 14:21.01 | brlcad | I believe that was to be able to link/use the brl-cad geometry libs |
| 14:21.24 | brlcad | they have bits of tcl integrated, so the dep gets carried forward |
| 14:21.33 | brlcad | tk shouldn't be needed |
| 14:21.35 | brlcad | just tcl |
| 14:22.58 | mafm | I see |
| 14:23.06 | mafm | I'll leave them then |
| 14:27.32 | mafm | another thing... I am creating the widget but I'm having a few problems, and I don't think that I'm doing very complicate things compared to what we're going to do |
| 14:36.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32289 10/rt^3/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): IsRegion() is const throw() |
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| 14:47.48 | brlcad | "the widget"? |
| 14:47.51 | brlcad | what widget? :) |
| 14:48.24 | brlcad | presume you mean something customized in the gui? .. it's more proof of concept to evaluate rbgui |
| 14:48.35 | brlcad | if it's really hard, that's a huge negative on the toolkit |
| 14:48.58 | brlcad | since we do have some rather complicated things that we'll want to be able to do |
| 14:49.48 | mafm | I can get things painted, but not all of them |
| 14:49.57 | mafm | some rectangles work, some others don't |
| 14:50.10 | mafm | lines don't seem to work |
| 14:50.58 | mafm | and the text has that problem sometimes of drawing also all glyphs |
| 14:51.16 | mafm | I guess that the library is a bit undertested |
| 15:00.23 | mafm | sooo I'm now trying to compose a radial control via drawing rectangles of 1 pixel :) |
| 15:00.48 | mafm | it would be easy to manage if the widget would use 10 textures depending on the progress, though |
| 15:32.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32290 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/ (11 files in 2 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:33.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32291 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/xsl_reports/xsl/ (39 files in 5 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:34.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32292 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/xsl_reports/utils/ (14 files): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:36.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32293 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/xsl_reports/test/ (10 files): |
| 15:37.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32294 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/test/ (43 files in 12 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:39.47 | *** join/#brlcad mas3773 (n=mas3773@75-13-4-215.lightspeed.kscyks.sbcglobal.net) | |
| 15:41.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32295 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/regression/ (31 files in 5 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:45.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32296 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/boost/ (178 files in 25 dirs): boost update and additional files for using shared_ptr and indirect_iterator |
| 15:47.10 | mas3773 | before I put in a bug report, I wanted to make sure it's not something on my end... Anyone want to check it out? |
| 15:49.54 | mas3773 | I put up a copy of the terminal at http://dirtykdx.is-a-geek.net/files/brlcad_bug.txt this is from the command line only interface [mged -c choosing the null output] |
| 15:50.19 | mas3773 | basically a tra gives a mged_players error |
| 15:50.27 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14C460.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:53.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32297 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/quickbook/ (36 files in 7 dirs): |
| 15:58.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32298 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/quickbook/ (80 files in 13 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 16:08.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32299 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/ (25 files in 3 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 16:10.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32300 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/jam/ (24 files in 3 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 16:16.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32301 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/jam/src/ (96 files): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 16:45.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32302 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/tools/jam/src/ (202 files in 9 dirs): |
| 16:59.26 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:02.31 | starseeker | there we go |
| 17:08.16 | *** join/#brlcad starseek1r (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:29.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32303 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/rtcheck.c: Fixed argument to bu_vls_printf. |
| 17:53.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32304 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am NOTES pcMathVM.h solver_test.cpp): beginning work on Math Virtual Machine for evaluation of arbitrary expressions, would be useful only in the case of explicit constraints |
| 18:03.23 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.30.223) | |
| 18:05.27 | starseeker | exit |
| 18:05.29 | starseeker | quit |
| 18:06.36 | starseeker | heh opps |
| 18:15.22 | mafm | brlcad: would be a slider enough? :) |
| 18:31.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32305 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ypr.c: Fixed typo. |
| 18:37.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32306 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/inside.c: Mods reflecting a signature change of rt_arb_calc_planes |
| 18:45.16 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32307 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: wdb_binary_cmd has changed to wdb_bo_cmd |
| 18:57.13 | archivist_ub | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:12.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32308 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraMode.cxx CameraMode.h): Adding methods to retrieve the relative rotations, so (in example) they can be shown in windows |
| 19:19.28 | *** join/#brlcad cad79 (n=caaf8794@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:20.03 | *** join/#brlcad brls (n=caaf8794@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:21.08 | brls | hi there anyone can consult on mater command? |
| 19:26.12 | brls | mater command enyone? |
| 19:26.50 | archivist_ub | basicly in IRC just ask the real question |
| 19:28.33 | brls | hi there anyone can consult on mater command for BRL-CAD? |
| 19:29.31 | brls | using mater to specify plastic as a material, how I can specify wood for e.g or metal etc and render to see the sructure ? |
| 19:30.29 | mafm | have to go, bye |
| 19:32.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32309 10/rt^3/trunk/data/g3d/RBGui/themes/brlcad_camera_rotation.png: Change icon appearance |
| 19:44.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32310 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/docs/stractNet.eap: EA Update. |
| 19:51.00 | brls | so much for the tech discussion ..see you all |
| 19:52.01 | archivist_ub | irc is not instant! |
| 19:56.08 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14C460.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:06.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32311 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): Added edcodes, rcodes, wcodes and which_shader to libged. |
| 20:45.12 | brlcad | archivist_ub: you expect anything more from cgi:irc? :) |
| 20:45.51 | archivist_ub | who me was a comment about brls |
| 20:46.22 | archivist_ub | but you could look a few lines above :) |
| 20:46.33 | archivist_ub | then you see my question |
| 20:50.23 | brlcad | i'm referring to brls |
| 20:50.45 | brlcad | he was on a cgi:irc connection |
| 20:51.39 | brlcad | tend to be the worst offenders of impatience, bad irc netiquette, not ~ask'ing, and overall just being annoying |
| 20:51.48 | archivist_ub | heh |
| 20:52.06 | archivist_ub | I see a few in #mysql |
| 20:52.55 | brlcad | and just about when I'm ready to take the web interface down, someone shows up who is a normal joe and the cgi:irc helped get them into the channel to figure out their next step |
| 20:54.19 | archivist_ub | actually had a face to face IRC moment on sunday, volunteer steam engine driving and someone aske was I a volunteer, yes, he then berated me for a single word reply! |
| 20:54.30 | archivist_ub | asked |
| 20:54.55 | brlcad | then you say.. |
| 20:55.00 | brlcad | ok, how about "no" then |
| 20:55.08 | archivist_ub | hehe |
| 20:58.53 | archivist_ub | anyway what rule builds libitk.la |
| 21:03.48 | brlcad | brlcad/src/other/incrTcl/Makefile.am |
| 21:05.12 | archivist_ub | I assume there's a missing dependency so its not built yet |
| 21:07.28 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 21:08.51 | archivist_ub | hmm its there |
| 21:18.48 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-72-245-122-226.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 21:34.09 | archivist_ub | it wasnt there and Makefile.am depends on WITH_X11 being set and this has XORG so some digging , will have to wait as its home time |
| 22:19.18 | brlcad | archivist_ub: check the summary block near the bottom of config.log and see if a) x11 support is enabled and b) whether itcl and itk are enabled and c) whether tcl and tk are enabled or off -- it could be some problem mixing some system tcl-stuff with some built tcl-stuff |
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| 01:42.44 | starseeker | growls in frustration at STABLE - might just nuke and reload again |
| 01:42.49 | brlcad | :) |
| 01:45.01 | starseeker | "why are you SKIPPING files I just told you to MERGE?? whadaya mean PROPFIND failed???" |
| 01:55.18 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:05.37 | starseeker | whoa - did sourceforge just change their site? |
| 02:07.58 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 02:08.01 | brlcad | starseeker: howso? |
| 02:08.06 | brlcad | it changed a couple days ago |
| 02:08.14 | starseeker | orange theme, different look |
| 02:08.27 | starseeker | huh, guess I didn't notice |
| 02:08.28 | starseeker | ick |
| 02:08.51 | brlcad | i never go to the main page |
| 02:09.01 | brlcad | but yeah, that was announced a couple days ago |
| 02:09.06 | brlcad | 1-2 days |
| 02:09.12 | starseeker | ah |
| 02:10.30 | brlcad | heh, looks like it's set up for iphone use |
| 02:10.41 | brlcad | kinda silly on a big browser window |
| 02:10.47 | starseeker | no kidding |
| 02:11.15 | starseeker | deems this change for the sake of change |
| 02:15.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32312 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-12-6/: Tag 7.12.6 release |
| 02:16.00 | starseeker | Well at least that worked |
| 02:16.08 | starseeker | glares at STABLE |
| 02:17.09 | starseeker | fudge, missed the bo command update in the Changelog |
| 03:24.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32313 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/: Updating STABLE isn't going well - wipe it out in prep to move in new copy |
| 03:25.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32314 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/: Copy 7.12.6 release to become new STABLE branch |
| 03:26.06 | starseeker | the svn nuclear option |
| 04:04.21 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 04:06.35 | pacman87 | su |
| 04:06.53 | Ralith | su: Permission denied |
| 04:07.17 | pacman87 | no, you're supposed to do a /nick Password, and then say ' ' |
| 04:08.53 | pacman87 | anyway, i lost power a while back, and when i rebooted, my gfx card fan was really noisy, so i pulled it out to try to fix it. when i put it back in, it didn't work. i finally got it working again, but it's still quite loud |
| 04:09.19 | pacman87 | and now my intel gfx died on me so i have to reboot again... |
| 04:21.17 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.138.171) | |
| 04:23.39 | homovulgaris | brlcad: i see that boost 1.35 is being added as a part of geometry service into rt3. Should we be keeping two copies. I mean the src/other/boost is not the complete package ofcourse. But if it is better either of us can remove the 'unnecessary?' double storage ? |
| 04:27.48 | brlcad | homovulgaris: howdy, haven't sync'd up with you in a while! |
| 04:29.03 | homovulgaris | :) |
| 04:29.12 | brlcad | sure, makes sense regarding eliminating the double storage -- how would you propose going about that? |
| 04:29.13 | homovulgaris | lots of action in the group lately.. :) |
| 04:29.26 | brlcad | oh yeah |
| 04:29.27 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 04:29.30 | brlcad | my mailbox floweth over |
| 04:29.40 | brlcad | tis good stuff |
| 04:29.42 | homovulgaris | I mean if Geometry Service needs boost they can use the one in src/other |
| 04:29.58 | brlcad | yeah, I think that at least is the plan |
| 04:30.32 | brlcad | just maybe a little premature since it's just now finally getting off of one guy's own repository/machine and finally getting syncd |
| 04:30.33 | homovulgaris | I won't be able to use the rt3/.. one right . |
| 04:30.39 | brlcad | right |
| 04:30.41 | homovulgaris | ok. |
| 04:30.47 | brlcad | that direction doesn't make sense |
| 04:30.56 | brlcad | rt^3 can use brlcad though |
| 04:31.06 | brlcad | just a matter of how to sort that out exactly wrt the build system |
| 04:31.20 | homovulgaris | I am going ahead with passing data structures for implicit constraints rather than expressions as per ur comments |
| 04:31.42 | brlcad | Ralith started cleaning some of that up, moving towards being able to specify where the BRLCAD_ROOT is at |
| 04:31.58 | brlcad | which then in theory should either have boost or have a means to point to where boost is at |
| 04:32.27 | brlcad | i saw your updated comments, did what I wrote make sense? |
| 04:32.29 | homovulgaris | yeah i had some trouble when i compiled rt3 2 days back.. regarding BRLCAD_ROOT |
| 04:33.48 | homovulgaris | it made a lot of sense. I wasnt planning on using expressions for implicit constraints. But for explicit ones I guess expression parsing is inevitable. I started a bit of work on a Math VM for evaluating expressions. |
| 04:34.30 | homovulgaris | http://www.lyx.org/~leeming/yac/ I mostly want to do something like this |
| 04:34.42 | brlcad | when you say "using expressions" do you mean "using string expressions"? |
| 04:34.51 | *** join/#brlcad pacman88 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 04:34.52 | homovulgaris | It supports almost the entire gnuplot syntax |
| 04:35.15 | brlcad | what's the license? |
| 04:35.18 | homovulgaris | boost |
| 04:35.24 | brlcad | k |
| 04:35.33 | homovulgaris | but it is an application i want to convert it into a library |
| 04:35.35 | brlcad | is it part of boost? |
| 04:37.11 | brlcad | looks like no (which is fine, just curious) |
| 04:37.17 | brlcad | interesting project at a glance |
| 04:37.35 | brlcad | so that one is more interesting than the other project you mentioned ? |
| 04:37.36 | homovulgaris | lots of interesting concepts in the code.. |
| 04:38.22 | homovulgaris | yac is just one application of the spirit parsing capabilities . It even supports expressions of the form factorial(x) = (x < 0.1) ? 1 : x * factorial(x - 1) |
| 04:38.46 | homovulgaris | and all the usual trigonometric and other mathematical functions |
| 04:38.53 | brlcad | support closures? |
| 04:39.11 | homovulgaris | closures as in ? |
| 04:40.27 | homovulgaris | spirit suppors closures of course http://spirit.sourceforge.net/distrib/spirit_1_8_3/libs/spirit/doc/closures.html |
| 04:40.38 | brlcad | yeah, I saw that in spirit a while back |
| 04:41.04 | brlcad | background info, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closure_(computer_science) |
| 04:41.37 | brlcad | basically from a lame pragmatic non-rigorous standpoint, the ability to define functions as objects in themselves, functions within functions |
| 04:41.59 | brlcad | that refer to their containing function |
| 04:42.34 | brlcad | pseudo dynamic programming, rather powerful construct |
| 04:43.59 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 04:45.18 | brlcad | so how does yac relate to phoenix? |
| 04:45.32 | brlcad | is it in leu of phoenix? in conjunction with it? |
| 04:45.59 | brlcad | did phoenix burn up and if so, when will it be reborn? :) |
| 04:45.59 | homovulgaris | yac uses phoenix and spirit |
| 04:46.14 | brlcad | oh, really? didn't see that |
| 04:49.02 | homovulgaris | Geometry Service sounds like a cool idea. didn't have much time to think about it though |
| 04:49.51 | brlcad | the information is only just getting started, it's a pretty big effort with lots of payoff |
| 04:50.03 | brlcad | several design docs still to be uploaded |
| 04:50.22 | brlcad | hmm, the skip grammar in yac is kinda sucky |
| 04:50.55 | homovulgaris | we won't hve to support it since we don't expect any piped input |
| 04:51.43 | homovulgaris | or even interactive mode so to speak. Since we would only be dealing with std::strings or char * skip grammar can be much simplified |
| 04:51.51 | brlcad | oh, actually I just missed it -- the comment is misleading |
| 04:52.00 | brlcad | it also supports ; terminations |
| 04:52.33 | brlcad | i'm thinking of a constraint that is really multiple constraints |
| 04:52.50 | brlcad | like in the example you put on the wiki |
| 04:53.14 | brlcad | some of them are multiple grouped evaluations (e.g. 0 > x > 1) |
| 04:53.58 | homovulgaris | effectively they will be implemented as constraint ( x>0 && x<1) |
| 04:54.05 | brlcad | nods |
| 04:54.14 | homovulgaris | so constraints depend on constraints and hypergraphs come in |
| 04:55.05 | homovulgaris | which is why I will have to modify the existing constraint class to have a std::list<Constraint *> as well to support similar logic operations once we support such constaints |
| 04:56.13 | brlcad | ranged(a) = a > 0 && a < 1; ranged(x) && mod(x * 10, 2)==0; |
| 04:56.18 | brlcad | or somesuch |
| 04:56.48 | homovulgaris | boost/adjacency_list.hpp is just 600 lines.. :) but I am pretty sure I have a lot to cover up before thinking about hypergraphs.. my 100 hour expectation not going very smoothly. |
| 04:57.40 | homovulgaris | Sean, regarding passing the constraint/evaluators as data strcutres what do u suggest ? actual function pointers ? or some sort of lookup table |
| 04:59.34 | brlcad | you mean like a global lookup table? |
| 04:59.43 | brlcad | or some context-specific lookup table? |
| 04:59.44 | homovulgaris | yeah |
| 05:00.13 | homovulgaris | global lookup table of possible constraint types. But I think passing pointers is better |
| 05:00.31 | brlcad | well the main benefit of having some global table would be the ability to refer to multiple evaluators by name/type/id/whatever |
| 05:00.49 | brlcad | if you only need one callback, then a function pointer seems to make more sense, it's simpler |
| 05:01.47 | homovulgaris | I guess each constraint will have only one evaluation method . So i guess fp would suffice. |
| 05:02.03 | homovulgaris | what exactly was the RTTI comment in Geometry Service |
| 05:02.34 | brlcad | i'll be responding to those comments later, probably friday |
| 05:02.50 | homovulgaris | k |
| 05:03.11 | brlcad | but basically as a pervasive adopted use encouraged throughout the project contrasted with the maintenance aspects it entails |
| 05:03.41 | brlcad | not so much the benefits/downsides from a technical perspective -- there's good and bad things about it that you could argue about indefinitely |
| 05:04.05 | homovulgaris | Sean, the arb implicit constraint you were refering to , checking the faces, where would the code be located, I did a brief lookaround.. couldnt locate it i think |
| 05:05.36 | brlcad | refresh my memory, that's only vaguely ringing a bell |
| 05:06.33 | homovulgaris | quote : conditionally requiring that each face on an arb be planar, connected, and enclose a volume |
| 05:08.20 | brlcad | homovulgaris: to the rtti point, the other main issue is how using rtti pertains to container management -- since cases where rtti is used as a way to put N objects into one container can often be more effectively achieved using separate containers for each type or by using a data-driven approach where some id (data) in the object indicates the type |
| 05:08.55 | brlcad | those are three pretty substantial differences in approach that are non-trivial to unwire/change down the road with various tradeoffs |
| 05:09.32 | brlcad | aside from several compilers only allowing you to link against other "rtti-compatible/using" libs if you use them |
| 05:10.29 | homovulgaris | hmm.. I am facing something similar .. the container issue that is when thinking about the variable<T> objects.. |
| 05:11.26 | homovulgaris | template specilaizations don't work with most compilers i guess .. So i have to change the id setting according to type somewhere |
| 05:12.11 | brlcad | from a technical perspective, this is a fairly succint classic read that hints at some of the technical reasons for/against it |
| 05:12.17 | brlcad | http://www.artima.com/intv/const2.html |
| 05:13.31 | brlcad | otherwise, though -- like I said, my point wasn't so much the technical as the pragmatic and maintainability/integratability aspects since it can be made to work with or without |
| 05:13.58 | brlcad | and yes.. template specializations can be a royal pita :) |
| 05:14.28 | brlcad | whic as always .. "it depends" on the situation |
| 05:14.41 | homovulgaris | :| step by step i am detemplating almost everything i templated :P |
| 05:15.44 | brlcad | hehe |
| 05:16.58 | homovulgaris | I'll go eat some junk food |
| 05:17.31 | homovulgaris | wants Math Virtual Machine to be awesome |
| 05:18.12 | brlcad | too |
| 05:18.21 | brlcad | looks like you're heading that way, bit by bit :) |
| 05:18.38 | brlcad | i like yac, looks like a good choice |
| 05:20.11 | brlcad | as good as it's likely going to get without going through an existing language parser like tcl or lisp |
| 05:22.16 | homovulgaris | yeah, I think it would be nice to have an inhouse math expression parser/evaluator. |
| 05:22.22 | homovulgaris | always comes in handy |
| 05:23.45 | homovulgaris | considering "generality" of application should i put mathvm and associated files somewhere outside libpc folder ? |
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| 05:54.43 | brlcad | ~botmail send homovulgaris mathvm does probably belong outside of libpc -- libbn is the usual place for our numerics facilities but if the implementation is C++ then of course it'd probably be either a backend lib (with a C interface in libbn) or something similar |
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| 08:22.44 | archivist_ub | brlcad, re ran the autogen.sh and configure script, that got it! |
| 08:25.46 | mac`u | re |
| 08:25.47 | mac`u | :) |
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| 09:38.20 | archivist_ub | i want mooore VGR performance metric of 1298 |
| 09:39.24 | archivist_ub | dual core opteron 2.2ghz and 2 gig ram but a few things going on in the background |
| 09:56.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32315 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): adding spirit::symbols for MathVM |
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| 10:59.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32316 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/status/ (4 files): |
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| 11:01.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32317 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/regression/: Library addition for GeometryService. |
| 11:03.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32318 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/ (.cproject .project): |
| 11:04.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32319 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/people/ (. people.htm): Library addition for GeometryService. |
| 11:05.02 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:10.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32320 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/more/ (47 files in 5 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService. |
| 11:21.14 | mafm | hihi |
| 12:12.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32321 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h vm_test.cpp): adding some flesh to MathVM skeletons, copy constructor for the stack; addition of vm_test for MathVM tests |
| 12:19.07 | *** join/#brlcad mac`u_ (i=mac@linux.slackware.in) | |
| 12:55.35 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32322 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWindowManager.cxx GuiWindowManager.h): Fixing some of the problems of the taskbar, and some other uninmportant changes |
| 12:58.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32323 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/: |
| 13:01.20 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32324 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): MathFunction object definition |
| 13:02.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32325 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/: Library addition for GeometryService |
| 13:04.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32326 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/: Library addition for GeometryService. |
| 13:06.55 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 13:18.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32327 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/ (397 files in 57 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService. |
| 13:31.18 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 13:31.27 | mafm | silent, busy programmers :) |
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| 13:45.15 | brlcad | mafm: heh, yep :) |
| 13:50.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32328 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/ (714 files in 45 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService. |
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| 14:10.22 | *** join/#brlcad pacman_87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 14:12.01 | pacman_87 | exit |
| 14:12.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32329 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiBaseWindow.cxx GuiBaseWindow.h): Adding method to retrieve base windows (necessary to attach buttons in taskbars to these ones) |
| 14:27.07 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:29.18 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 14:54.41 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32330 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h vm_test.cpp): MathF1 or unary mathematical function class added, display() function added to MathVM for debugging purposes, testing addition of Unary Math functions to the MathVM symbol table |
| 15:21.41 | d_rossberg | pacman87: how is you progress with the revolve? what do you think you can reach this summer? |
| 15:48.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32331 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/date_time/ (196 files in 17 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 15:50.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32332 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWindowManager.cxx GuiWindowManager.h): Perfecting the taskbar, now it works much more closely to the Ideal Operation Environment (IOE, see my wiki page for the video) that we take as ideal interaction model |
| 15:53.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32333 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/ (23 files in 4 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 16:22.21 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32334 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/ (789 files in 99 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 17:01.37 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:08.19 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32335 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiWidgetRotation.cxx: Enhancing the custom widget |
| 18:10.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32336 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: denote utf-8 encoding for emacs |
| 18:12.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32337 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/BRL-CAD.bib: add ARL-TR-2396 to the todo |
| 19:01.21 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32338 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiWidgetRotation.cxx GuiWidgetRotation.h): Enhancing custom widget with a label and the numerical progress (useful at least when testing) |
| 19:14.59 | mafm | have to go, laterz folkz |
| 19:15.01 | mafm | :) |
| 19:30.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32339 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/gil/ (770 files in 5 dirs): Library addition for GeometryService |
| 19:41.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32340 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: FB_FILE and -F option for specifying a remote framebuffer was fixed. twas and off-by-one strlcpy in src/libfb |
| 20:31.44 | *** join/#brlcad jonored (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
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| 22:42.33 | brlcad | mmm.. the final stretch |
| 22:42.47 | brlcad | go go gadget gsoc |
| 22:45.56 | pacman87 | being in #brlcad and #bzflag means brlcad comes through in stereo :) |
| 22:47.27 | jonored | seems to be having issues to do with tcl... possibly mostly building with the one packaged with brlcad and for the bit that's glitching trying to link against the system's library. |
| 22:49.39 | Ralith | pacman87: #bzflag has something to do with brlcad? |
| 22:49.42 | Ralith | oh wait |
| 22:49.45 | Ralith | brlcad himself |
| 22:49.46 | Ralith | lol |
| 22:50.01 | Ralith | wait, he's not there :| |
| 22:50.05 | Ralith | <- confused. |
| 22:50.58 | Ralith | or he is. whois failed me. |
| 22:51.02 | pacman87 | brlcad (the person) said the same two statements in #brlcad (the channel) and #bzflag (the channel) |
| 22:51.26 | Ralith | you know, I'm just glad there's nobody named 'bzflag' too. |
| 22:54.48 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 22:54.58 | pacman87 | howdy andrecastelo |
| 23:24.24 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 23:53.27 | brlcad | pacman87: hehe |
| 23:54.08 | brlcad | Ralith: there is, he just rarely uses that nick |
| 23:54.13 | brlcad | (bzflag) |
| 23:54.35 | Ralith | D: |
| 00:32.20 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r32341 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: changed some variable names to be (slightly) more descriptive, and properly handle raytracing when the elevation is 0 or +-90 degrees. in that case, the transformed ray is a line, not a hyberbola. |
| 00:32.46 | pacman87 | that took a lot longer than i was expecting |
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| 01:36.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32342 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h vm_test.cpp): MathF2 or binary function added, testing evaluation of F1 and F2 types using the symbol table |
| 02:21.25 | *** join/#brlcad charltr (n=411f36d9@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 02:21.53 | charltr | hello? |
| 02:23.06 | charltr | I am looking for ehlp building blrcad in windows. Can anyone help? |
| 02:26.34 | charltr | I guess no one is here. I will check back later |
| 02:35.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32343 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): commenting, adding size(), empty(), push_back() and clear() methods to the Stack |
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| 03:02.30 | *** join/#brlcad stustev (n=stustev@ip72-205-246-167.ks.ks.cox.net) | |
| 03:02.42 | stustev | good evening |
| 03:02.55 | stustev | anybody home? |
| 03:03.23 | stustev | imagine this - I have another question |
| 03:03.34 | stustev | how do I extrude a sketch? |
| 03:07.49 | Ralith | that's not covered in the mged tutorials? |
| 03:10.29 | stustev | I haven't been able to find it - maybe I am not looking good enough - if you think it is I will look again |
| 03:12.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32344 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (. pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): Specialized node implementation : Definition and methods for ConstantNode and VariableNode to hold constant real numbers and variables (double) |
| 03:13.26 | Ralith | stustev: I don't know, but I don't know the answer either, and that's where I'd look. |
| 03:15.32 | *** join/#brlcad jonored_ (n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net) | |
| 03:17.54 | stustev | I have been looking all day - I figured out the sketching but now I have no clue about the extrusion |
| 03:21.26 | pacman87 | stustev: 'in extrude' |
| 03:22.03 | pacman87 | er, 'in <name> extrude' |
| 03:31.47 | stustev | I have the sketch named s0 - the autoname feature - would the command be 'in s0 extrude'? |
| 03:33.02 | pacman87 | no, the name is the name of the extrude |
| 03:33.08 | pacman87 | it will prompt you for the sketch name |
| 03:33.50 | pacman87 | mged> in ext extrude |
| 03:33.50 | pacman87 | Enter X, Y, Z of vertex: 0 0 0 |
| 03:33.50 | pacman87 | Enter X, Y, Z of H: 0 0 1 |
| 03:33.50 | pacman87 | Enter X, Y, Z of A: 1 0 0 |
| 03:33.50 | pacman87 | Enter X, Y, Z of B: 0 1 0 |
| 03:33.51 | pacman87 | Enter name of sketch: sk |
| 03:34.07 | stustev | trying |
| 03:37.01 | stustev | it says enter K - what is K? |
| 03:37.35 | pacman87 | i'm not sure, i'll try to find it |
| 03:37.53 | stustev | I will try a number - maybe I can figure it out |
| 03:38.03 | pacman87 | 1 should work |
| 03:41.57 | stustev | I entered 100 - 'B s0' draws the sketch but only the 2D - 'B ext' draws a line - at least there is some positive progress |
| 03:42.00 | stustev | thanks |
| 03:42.10 | pacman87 | it's the 'keypoint' |
| 03:42.18 | pacman87 | it = K |
| 03:42.35 | stustev | is that a geometry label? |
| 03:43.03 | stustev | the keypoint is the placement anchor? |
| 03:43.33 | pacman87 | i think it has something to do with which point in your sketch you're using as the 'center' |
| 03:43.43 | pacman87 | i'm looking throught the source code to find it |
| 03:44.02 | stustev | thanks |
| 03:44.52 | stustev | I have brlcad at work and at home - they behave differently - the work machine is a 32bit running the brlcad binary load - the home machine is 64bit svn |
| 03:45.04 | stustev | I have found two differences |
| 03:46.13 | stustev | the mirror on the svn is 'mirror -z entityname entityname' - the binary mirror is 'mirror entityname entityname z' |
| 03:46.53 | stustev | the svn clone gives a different name to the cloned entities than the binary load |
| 03:48.06 | stustev | if I clone hole1.s on the svn load I get hole11 - on the binary load I get hole11.s - not a big problem but I have a lot of cloned entities for hole patterns |
| 03:48.55 | stustev | I think I will just use hole1 as the name for the entity to clone - I think this will work |
| 03:49.15 | pacman87 | stustev: i'd wait for one of the major devs to swing by, they know more than i do |
| 03:50.09 | stustev | I have a lot of time - I will leave this on - if they answer I will be able to see it tomorrow - thanks - if they don't see it I will ask again |
| 03:50.24 | stustev | thanks again for the help on the extrude |
| 03:50.26 | stustev | goodnight |
| 03:50.31 | pacman87 | goodnight |
| 04:19.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32345 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): UserFunction implementation: Constructors and arity() |
| 06:03.54 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-95-226.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:25.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32346 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): initial updateStack() method for updation of Stack nodes, asUserFunction() method for getting a pointer to UserFunction |
| 06:36.58 | brlcad | begins packing |
| 07:09.35 | Ralith | brlcad: where you going? |
| 07:09.45 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:10.28 | brlcad | Ralith: siggraph |
| 07:10.42 | brlcad | (los angeles) |
| 07:11.37 | Ralith | cool! |
| 07:13.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32347 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): Stack iterator methods: begin, end, erase, insert |
| 07:20.48 | brlcad | stustev / pacman87: I believe ... that 'K' is an unimplemented feature that has never been removed/completed .. don't think it does anything |
| 07:21.14 | brlcad | it's a single value so not exactly a "keypoint" in classic mged sense either |
| 07:26.41 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
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| 08:08.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32348 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): updateStack() completed |
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| 09:12.19 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32349 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
| 09:22.33 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1128565078.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 09:23.47 | IriX64 | try www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/operators.png :) |
| 09:27.04 | Ralith | neat |
| 09:27.10 | IriX64 | heh |
| 09:27.43 | IriX64 | their examples are wonderful, wish i could model :) |
| 09:33.32 | Ralith | IriX64: go through the mged tutorial |
| 09:33.36 | Ralith | the basics aren't very hard at all |
| 09:34.05 | IriX64 | i could'nt even get the mug right... and i tried :) |
| 09:34.27 | Ralith | ...it gives you a step by step O.o |
| 09:35.10 | IriX64 | i know but... thats being told what to do not how to do it |
| 09:36.34 | Ralith | IriX64: did you go through the pdf from the very start without skipping anything? |
| 09:58.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32350 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (56 files in 24 dirs): using boost::prior for iterator addition, subtraction ; also updating to 1.36 |
| 10:10.09 | IriX64 | pdf? i was using the html docs |
| 10:27.55 | Ralith | download the full tutorial pdf |
| 10:46.24 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:51.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32351 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraMode.cxx CameraMode.h): Correcting values, it was using an unexpected scale |
| 11:07.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32352 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiCamera.cxx: Adapting code to changes in other classes, making it work better overall (custom widget now displays a label, rotation progress corrections, etc) |
| 11:07.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32353 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcMathVM.cpp pcMathVM.h): MathVM evaluate() : supports functions and numbers |
| 11:10.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32354 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/vm_test.cpp: testing the evaluator with sqrt(100 + sqrt(2)) and sin( pi * (2 + sqrt(4*4)) * 12) |
| 12:26.25 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 13:06.23 | pacman87 | d_rossberg: ping |
| 13:09.08 | d_rossberg | my profiler tells me that the most expensive function during a ray-trace is |
| 13:09.55 | d_rossberg | bu_bitv_shift, a function which returns a "constant" (MS Windows) |
| 13:10.51 | d_rossberg | (40% of rt_shootray) |
| 13:11.05 | d_rossberg | pacman87: pong |
| 13:11.30 | pacman87 | re: what i expect to finish for gsoc |
| 13:12.27 | pacman87 | straight line sketches should raytrace fine now, i finally finished the cases of looking along(parallel to) and perpendicular to the revolve axis |
| 13:13.21 | d_rossberg | yes, i tested the actual version, and it was ok |
| 13:14.06 | pacman87 | my plan was to work on tess() now, unless you think my time could be spent better elsewhere |
| 13:14.27 | pacman87 | tess() for hyp took me about 1 week |
| 13:14.51 | d_rossberg | is there any chance to do something with the degree 2 curves (arcs)? |
| 13:16.06 | pacman87 | i have carcs supported in rt_sketch_contains(), but not in rt_revolve_shot() |
| 13:17.33 | d_rossberg | about tess(): you should do this first because a clean implementation of the revolve is more important than supporting additional scetch elements |
| 13:17.41 | jonored_ | ...Frustration. Illegal instruction when I display rpcs still... isn't compiling cleanly. |
| 13:18.53 | jonored_ | At least it's building rather than glitching out (since I updated tcl - it was /mostly/ compiling the brlcad copy of tcl, but then asking for stuff from the system copy, and glitching out... |
| 13:19.44 | d_rossberg | pacman87: do you have any ideas or sourcecode to support arcs in revolves? |
| 13:22.50 | pacman87 | i did some research earlier, but couldn't find what i was looking for. last night i realized the carc seg revolves would be very similar to a toroid, so i'm looking at that code now |
| 13:25.25 | d_rossberg | remember: a clean implementation is more important than additional shapes |
| 13:25.53 | d_rossberg | therefore you should look for implementing all methods/interfaces for lines |
| 13:26.16 | d_rossberg | then make a cut and send your code to google |
| 13:26.45 | d_rossberg | however, we would be glad if you could support us in the future too |
| 13:27.34 | pacman87 | i'm taking 17 hours in the fall, so i probably won't have much time. |
| 13:27.54 | d_rossberg | maybe by sending me/us some ideas codefragments or contributing code to make the revolve work with arcs |
| 13:28.57 | pacman87 | right now, it looks like tess(), uv(), and curve() are the only ones still needing work |
| 13:30.14 | pacman87 | extrude's uv() is empty, so it's not much help for finding an algorithm |
| 13:31.24 | d_rossberg | look at the cone, your revolves are very similar to cones |
| 13:33.24 | pacman87 | even though lines are the only ones working now, i'm still trying to write my other functions to require minimal modificaitons to add to |
| 13:34.26 | pacman87 | should each line segment in the sketch have it's own uv space? |
| 13:39.38 | d_rossberg | i think they have to have each it's own uv space because otherwise there would be a problem with the horizontal lines (right?) |
| 13:41.50 | pacman87 | ok, and the start/end planes for partials, i can just scale the 2d hitpoint to get uv coords |
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| 13:44.44 | d_rossberg | this should work |
| 13:49.23 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@203-206-79-125.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 13:50.56 | d_rossberg | btw the cone method should work for every shape in a sketch, therefore the method would be general |
| 14:01.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32355 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiWidgetRotation.cxx: Formating the numerical progress a bit more gently |
| 14:05.02 | ``Erik | *peer* |
| 14:08.01 | mafm | *goto jail* |
| 14:09.06 | ``Erik | label 'jail' not found |
| 14:14.44 | mafm | RIAA will catch the exception :) |
| 14:15.17 | ``Erik | yeah, I'd expect riaa would be halfassed about handling a continuation |
| 14:16.02 | mafm | a continuation? :D |
| 14:16.21 | mafm | you mean that *peer* was a kind of "back here"? |
| 14:16.43 | ``Erik | yeah, old programming concept that most languages don't support, some attempt to fake little parts with things like setjmp/longjmp and exceptions |
| 14:16.51 | ``Erik | hehe, the *peer* was meant as looking around |
| 14:17.03 | ``Erik | verb, not noun |
| 14:18.03 | mafm | ah ok |
| 14:18.21 | archivist_ub | hmm peer should be in INTERCAL |
| 14:18.32 | ``Erik | pokes andre with a cattleprod |
| 14:18.57 | archivist_ub | peer at subroutine |
| 14:19.25 | ``Erik | heh |
| 14:19.35 | ``Erik | not as awesome as "jump from", though |
| 14:27.14 | archivist_ub | I like the footnotes on this page http://www.muppetlabs.com/~breadbox/intercal-man/ |
| 14:29.46 | mafm | jump from in disguise: "** This footnote intentionally unreferenced." |
| 15:00.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32356 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraMode.cxx: Swapping axes |
| 15:23.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32357 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/vm_test.cpp: division in vm_test was not working due to a misplaced ; corrected |
| 15:25.43 | prasad1 | ``Erik: attending siggraph? |
| 15:46.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32358 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraMode.h: Fixing typo |
| 15:58.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32359 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraModeBlender.cxx: Removing \todo comment, no longer applied |
| 17:31.48 | ``Erik | not this year |
| 17:32.06 | ``Erik | by the time the paperwork went through on my side, the hotels were all booked up way beyond per diem |
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| 02:21.17 | starseeker | testing |
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| 03:24.39 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 04:32.54 | pacman87 | will be GRE'ing tomorrow afternoon, wish me luck |
| 04:37.13 | starseeker | wishes pacman87 luck |
| 05:08.36 | yukonbob | wonders at a GRE is |
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| 10:26.01 | Hybris71 | I have trouble obtaining BRL-CAD. Sourceforge just blows up big and ugly in my face, claiming "Group cannot be created" |
| 10:29.12 | *** join/#brlcad Hybris_71 (n=53f383a1@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 10:30.07 | Hybris_71 | Sorry. Using the web client. Dropped out. Can anyone help with the sourceforge issue? |
| 10:33.56 | Hybris_71 | OK. I see. Dead CAD. I'll just learn Cademia instead. Bye. |
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| 11:26.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32360 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): modifying pcset structure to pass parameter by expression/string as well as by datastructure, also memory leak correction mentioned in TODO, was occuring due to not clearing bu_vls while dequeing |
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| 18:25.39 | *** topic/#brlcad by siggraph -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Only a few days left in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || ACM SIGGRAPH 2008 is under way! | |
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| 20:11.58 | mac`u_ | re |
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| 23:57.21 | pacman87 | according to the GRE, i still know how to do math ;) |
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| 02:45.30 | ``Erik | ssshhhhhhh |
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| 04:11.54 | starseeker | ``Erik: heh |
| 07:34.23 | CIA-22 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32363 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): continuing with supporting both data and expression based passing of parameter information , testing with point, vector and fastf types |
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| 20:15.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32371 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 20:15.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Making rt depend on pc rather than the other way around |
| 20:15.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: M include/pc.h transfer of structure definitions from raytrace.h/ remove raytrace.h include / remove mk_constraint export |
| 20:15.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: M include/raytrace.h transfer of tructures to pc.h / add pc.h include |
| 20:15.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: M src/libpc/pc_test.c temporarily commenting out test code |
| 20:15.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: M src/libpc/pc_main.c remove pc_mk_constraint to be reinseted correctly post the dependency change, remove wdb.h, raytrace.h includes |
| 20:15.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: M src/libpc/TODO Minor work update |
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| 21:07.30 | Derevko | Hi, I've an issue with brlcad build, it doesn't compile on debian sid... here the full log (3,7M) http://paste.debian.net/14478/plain/14478 |
| 21:07.42 | Derevko | someone can help me? |
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| 01:57.53 | siggraph | Derevko: howdy |
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| 02:14.42 | siggraph | Derevko: if you're working on an updated .deb for Debian, I have several suggestions/comments relavent to your build |
| 02:22.28 | siggraph | Derevko: namely 1) for a package-management system, you want --disable-all instead of all the --disable-*-build options you're using; 2) there is no reason for you to use --enable-warnings or --enable-progress (those are dev-team options); 3) you don't need or want java as a dependency, let it autodetect or force it off using --without-java (unnecessary but explicit); 4) there is a BIG ALERT warning about installing with --prefix=/usr .. there |
| 02:22.35 | siggraph | lemme know if that cut off :) |
| 02:27.25 | siggraph | 6) use --without-opengl for now as well (buggy nvidia drivers will crash X hard on some configurations); 7) .. the crash log is interesting, looking into it |
| 02:35.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32372 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/librender/Makefile.am: contrary to libtool tweakage, debian is apparently bitching about LIBADD symbol dependencies in adrt's librender. |
| 02:36.17 | siggraph | Derevko: 8) that last commit should kick start the build for you, or you can manually remove the 'adrt \' line from src/Makefile.am |
| 02:53.52 | *** join/#brlcad homovulgaris (n=d@117.196.131.215) | |
| 02:55.32 | homovulgaris | brlcad: can you have a look at r32371. I changed made libpc a dependency of librt. I am not very sure about my configure.ac modifications.. especially where i added LIBSTDCXX |
| 03:22.04 | siggraph | homovulgaris: I did |
| 03:23.29 | homovulgaris | ok |
| 03:24.03 | siggraph | homovulgaris: they looked alright -- whether LIBSTDCXX needs to go there or with $PC instead depends on a few other things |
| 03:24.20 | siggraph | which won't really know without building across a few other platforms |
| 03:24.54 | siggraph | the header removal of raytrace.h was right, rt uses pc -- not the other way around |
| 03:24.58 | siggraph | so that was good |
| 03:25.06 | homovulgaris | ok. |
| 03:25.22 | homovulgaris | also right now constraint.c in librt depends on wdb .. |
| 03:25.45 | homovulgaris | should i remove that dependency ? I mean should i be using wdb from rt ? |
| 03:26.48 | siggraph | in general .. "no" -- libwdb sits on top of librt |
| 03:26.56 | homovulgaris | sorry, it is just a blank header include i guess, not using any wdb stuff |
| 03:27.15 | siggraph | but it's not fully consistent at the moment either, so it's understandable |
| 03:27.44 | homovulgaris | so basically, i can shift my mk_constraint code with modifications into libwdb |
| 03:28.01 | siggraph | you had an mk_constraint in libwdb already didn't you? |
| 03:28.04 | siggraph | that you removed |
| 03:28.14 | homovulgaris | well it was in libpc |
| 03:28.20 | siggraph | oh |
| 03:28.24 | siggraph | blinks |
| 03:28.24 | homovulgaris | i should have shifted it to WDB long back |
| 03:28.34 | siggraph | yeah |
| 03:29.27 | siggraph | it either belongs in librt as an rt_constraint or some similar librt "creator" |
| 03:29.58 | siggraph | but primarily in libwdb as mk_constraint (which could call this hypothetical rt_constraint or not) |
| 03:30.34 | homovulgaris | sean, now tests will depend on both pc,wdb and rt when i do actual constraint writing geometry updation etc, so the pc_test files should be shifted somewhere so that it gets built after librt and libwdb is built |
| 03:30.54 | siggraph | misspoke, s/rt_constraint/wdb_export/ .. which would call the librt export routine for a constraint object |
| 03:31.22 | siggraph | okay, sounds reasonable |
| 03:31.36 | homovulgaris | yeah, the export functionality is in rt/constraint.c |
| 03:33.58 | siggraph | so libwdb should probably just call that, but still provide the mk_ interface |
| 03:34.34 | siggraph | mk_ is the easy 'public interface' for creation, default constructor of sorts |
| 03:35.07 | homovulgaris | yeah, sort of hardcoded parametrics ;) |
| 03:35.32 | homovulgaris | ok, i will get back to finishing up the read-solve-update-write cycle |
| 03:35.39 | siggraph | how's that goin? :) |
| 03:35.48 | siggraph | oh question |
| 03:36.32 | homovulgaris | well parameter passing is done, I need to work with constraint passing now. |
| 03:37.17 | homovulgaris | The problem with passing just a function pointer is that I have to pass the signature type information in some way as well |
| 03:37.55 | siggraph | noticed in pc_main that it nicely sorts out the data types, but then pcVCSet uses different structures on the type |
| 03:38.10 | siggraph | e.g. PC_DB_VECTOR_T being a vect_t and a Vector class |
| 03:38.26 | homovulgaris | like istangent() expects two arrays/2 vectps , ispositive() expects 1 array/vectp and so on |
| 03:38.39 | siggraph | right |
| 03:39.05 | siggraph | could do something like what opengl does with the format encoded in the name |
| 03:39.54 | siggraph | e.g. isPositive3f() |
| 03:40.12 | siggraph | not really elegant, but a thought |
| 03:40.23 | homovulgaris | hmm.. I was thinking of something like that in MathVM, add##2 for add expecting two inputs... but that was just for double check. |
| 03:40.30 | homovulgaris | hmm.. |
| 03:40.40 | siggraph | or could make the signature simply be a vararg ..., and let the function typecheck itself (yikes) |
| 03:41.02 | homovulgaris | i only like varargs when all the types are the same :D |
| 03:41.34 | siggraph | you mean like printf? :) |
| 03:41.42 | homovulgaris | hmm.. i think i could do something similar to what i am doing for passing parameter by structure.. pass a void * and a type variable |
| 03:41.43 | siggraph | if the types are the same, there's not much point to using varargs :) |
| 03:41.55 | siggraph | could just use an array :) |
| 03:42.07 | homovulgaris | :P yeah. |
| 03:42.10 | homovulgaris | exactly :D |
| 03:42.54 | siggraph | yeah, data-driven is pretty straightforward |
| 03:43.21 | siggraph | though there are some problems with that with strict c99 |
| 03:43.53 | siggraph | I forget the rules off the top of my head at the moment, but there's some issue there iirc |
| 03:44.02 | homovulgaris | oh |
| 03:44.27 | siggraph | something to do with void*'s and casting to function pointers not being allowed |
| 03:44.37 | siggraph | I'd have to dig, it's come up before |
| 03:45.21 | homovulgaris | ok.. i'll check too |
| 03:45.47 | siggraph | might be C++ or c99, might be confusing my languages, but it'd still be relevant |
| 03:46.25 | siggraph | so think you're going to make implicit constraint checking by next week? :) |
| 03:47.32 | homovulgaris | confident :) |
| 03:47.47 | homovulgaris | { hopefully :) } |
| 03:48.16 | siggraph | heh, { great :) } |
| 03:48.50 | homovulgaris | because once this constraint passing is done, the actual implementation of constraints , most cases being simple, is really not time-consuming |
| 03:48.57 | pacman87 | are you two proposing an extension to lolcode, where semicolons are replaced by ':)'? |
| 03:49.37 | homovulgaris | uses {} as equivalent of clouds in cartoons |
| 03:49.59 | homovulgaris | howdy pacman |
| 03:50.24 | pacman87 | hi homovulgaris |
| 03:51.25 | homovulgaris | :D i should change that nick, i like madant much more anyways :) |
| 03:51.40 | homovulgaris | something vulgar about latin |
| 03:52.31 | homovulgaris | sean, on a scale of 1 to 10 how much trouble would one face when trying to make a .deb package for brlcad ? |
| 03:55.01 | siggraph | likes "madant" more too .. fewer vulgar connotations ;) |
| 03:55.23 | siggraph | homovulgaris: "it depends" .. on a lot of things |
| 03:56.06 | siggraph | their familiarity with making deb's being the biggest, followed by autotool build familiarity, followed by knowledge of what our options mean |
| 03:58.23 | siggraph | otherwise, if you know all three of those then it's like a 2 .. if you don't then it's like an 8 |
| 04:01.26 | siggraph | howdy andrecastelo |
| 04:01.34 | siggraph | how goes the hemispheres? |
| 04:02.06 | andrecastelo | howdy siggraph |
| 04:02.37 | andrecastelo | i see you are excited about the event :) |
| 04:03.46 | siggraph | of course! |
| 04:06.21 | siggraph | alrighty, about time to /away ... blasted interweb lackage |
| 04:07.38 | andrecastelo | when is your flight? |
| 04:08.09 | siggraph | i'm already there |
| 04:08.22 | siggraph | twas two/three days ago |
| 04:10.24 | andrecastelo | oh, my bad :) |
| 04:10.31 | andrecastelo | how's the weather? :P |
| 04:11.03 | siggraph | already slightly sunburnt |
| 04:11.17 | siggraph | that daystar is viscious when you don't see it very often |
| 04:11.19 | starseeker | <snort> from lunch, probably |
| 04:11.46 | siggraph | misses the golden tan he used to keep |
| 04:11.48 | starseeker | still wants to know who's bright idea (no pun intended) the white tablecloth was |
| 04:12.12 | siggraph | sunglasses ftw |
| 04:12.29 | siggraph | really detaches now |
| 04:12.45 | andrecastelo | good night, cya tomorrow :D |
| 04:13.16 | starseeker | signs off too, sleep ftw |
| 04:14.13 | andrecastelo | 'night starseeker |
| 04:28.33 | yukonbob | waves in -- hello cadheads |
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| 07:07.38 | Derevko | siggraph: thanks a lot. Just a question, why should I force java off? |
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| 10:09.27 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32373 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (6 files in 2 dirs): shifting test to outside libpc since it depends on pc,rt,wdb |
| 10:15.52 | mafm | siggraph: are you brlcad? :D |
| 11:09.11 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32374 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/graph/ (. LICENSE index.html): |
| 11:15.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32375 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/graph/test/ (65 files): Library addition for GeometryService |
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| 12:34.25 | mafm | anybody with linux amd64 around? |
| 12:34.40 | mafm | I'd like somebody to test my package |
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| 12:53.01 | archivist_ub | starts an svn checkout |
| 13:13.07 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32376 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/graph/test/planar_input_graphs/ (30 files): Library addition for GeometryService |
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| 13:41.44 | ``Erik | EVERYBODY DANCE! |
| 13:42.18 | archivist_ub | ugh, dancing is too much like hard work |
| 13:42.38 | ``Erik | I dance incredibly white, so it's pretty easy for me *shrug* :) |
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| 14:12.00 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32379 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pc_test.c: include headers, uncomment code, test compilation & execution |
| 14:23.53 | stustev1 | hello world |
| 14:28.21 | ``Erik | return 0; |
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| 15:07.45 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
| 15:18.57 | pacman87 | /* User has no tolerance for this kind of drink */ |
| 15:19.13 | pacman87 | (tor.c, 1043) |
| 15:19.19 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32380 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/libs/ (26 files in 26 dirs): Major svn connection issues, reworking the Boost library |
| 15:30.54 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 15:46.57 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.37.142) | |
| 15:47.09 | ``Erik | oi, andre, how goeth the mlt? |
| 15:47.25 | andrecastelo | hey ``Erik |
| 15:47.54 | andrecastelo | had exams last week plus one wednesday and one monday |
| 15:48.17 | andrecastelo | didn't have much time to put in mlt |
| 15:49.18 | andrecastelo | i'm still stuck.. when the secondary rays hit anything, *everything* shades |
| 15:49.32 | ``Erik | 'everything'? |
| 15:49.42 | andrecastelo | yes |
| 15:50.00 | andrecastelo | currently, if it's supposed to be shadowed, it paints a dark blue |
| 15:50.12 | andrecastelo | if not, gray |
| 15:50.17 | ``Erik | hrm, dark blue like 0,0,1 ? |
| 15:50.25 | ``Erik | do you have a screenie of this? |
| 15:50.45 | andrecastelo | yes i can set recreate it |
| 15:51.11 | andrecastelo | it paints a specified color, in ray hit, just to note what's supposed to look like |
| 15:52.04 | ``Erik | ok, so still flat shading |
| 15:57.48 | ``Erik | looks at the calendar O.o |
| 16:00.09 | andrecastelo | screens taken, uploading |
| 16:02.20 | andrecastelo | rtmlt cornell.g floor.r right_wall.r -> http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/916/withoutbluexv2.jpg |
| 16:02.40 | andrecastelo | rtmlt cornell.g floor.r right_wall.r short_box.r -> http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/1246/withbluevd8.jpg |
| 16:06.52 | *** join/#brlcad kcorbitt (i=d12559a6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c36774134f51b03a) | |
| 16:07.10 | kcorbitt | ping |
| 16:08.08 | kcorbitt | anyone there? |
| 16:08.58 | ``Erik | nope |
| 16:08.59 | ``Erik | 'sup? |
| 16:09.22 | ``Erik | interesting, andre, um, material information isn't being grabbed correctly... are you fully committed right now? |
| 16:09.26 | stustev1 | hello |
| 16:09.43 | kcorbitt | I read about the GSoC projects on the wiki |
| 16:09.53 | kcorbitt | is there anywhere where the progress on those is being tracked? |
| 16:10.01 | kcorbitt | they look like super useful improvements |
| 16:10.05 | ``Erik | their individual blogs |
| 16:10.32 | ``Erik | each project should be linking to the appropriate place for status if not on the wiki... :) |
| 16:10.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32381 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/ (more/ people/ regression/ status/ tools/): Major svn connection issues, reworking the Boost library |
| 16:10.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32382 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/boost_1_35_0/wiki/: Major svn connection issues, reworking the Boost library |
| 16:10.58 | stustev1 | I have brlcad on two machines. One at home and one at work. The home machine is svn. The work machine is a binary download. They behave differently. |
| 16:11.53 | ``Erik | howso? (the latest source release has significant differences from svn trunk, and binaries are all quite a bit older...) |
| 16:12.24 | stustev1 | so I should load the svn on my work box. thanks |
| 16:12.49 | stustev1 | I will do so |
| 16:13.37 | stustev1 | the clone works different and the mirror. This tells me what I need to do to make the systems the same. |
| 16:14.17 | stustev1 | I am unable to use the extrude command. It asks for a K value. nothing seems to work for the K value. |
| 16:14.53 | pacman87 | the K value isn't used |
| 16:15.11 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i'll have to leave in about 20 minutes, have classes this afternoon |
| 16:15.51 | andrecastelo | and won't be back for another 8 hours o.O |
| 16:15.54 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32388 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/ (107 files in 3 dirs): svn:mime-type & svn:eol-style fixes |
| 16:15.58 | andrecastelo | what you have in mind? |
| 16:16.10 | stustev1 | i understood that from a previous answer but the prompt asks for one and no answer works. leaving it blank doesn't seem to work either. |
| 16:16.50 | pacman87 | i just use 1 |
| 16:17.02 | stustev1 | I will try that - thanks |
| 16:18.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32389 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Minor updates. |
| 16:22.18 | ``Erik | clone changes have been merged into the latest stable, so the source tarball on the webpage should work for you. svn trunk can be hit or miss, there's a big code migration happening right now |
| 16:22.35 | ``Erik | andre, I'll take a peek and see if there's anything blatant *shrug* |
| 16:22.41 | ``Erik | have fun at class O.o |
| 16:23.57 | stustev1 | I will download the tarball and see what happens - thanks |
| 16:30.31 | kcorbitt | I read the project log for mafm's GUI project |
| 16:30.47 | kcorbitt | looks like there's still a lot of coding going on |
| 16:31.10 | kcorbitt | I assume that won't be ready for use for a while yet then? |
| 16:38.37 | andrecastelo | cya ``Erik |
| 16:38.51 | andrecastelo | if you need me, andrecastelo@gmail.com |
| 16:51.45 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14FE9A.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:55.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32390 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: Fixed a typo. |
| 17:13.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32391 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/Makefile.am: librender relies upon libutil so build it later. patch from Giuseppe Iuculano (derevko) via sf bug report 640802. |
| 17:14.45 | siggraph | mafm: yep |
| 17:16.49 | mafm | kcorbitt: for real use, it needs a while, yep :) |
| 17:23.15 | siggraph | stustev1: clone and mirror have been under active development/improvements lately, so it's to be expected that they'd be different for you |
| 17:24.01 | siggraph | ah yeah, what erik said |
| 17:25.20 | stustev1 | very good - I am configuring a tarball download now - thanks |
| 17:25.57 | kcorbitt | mafm: thanks. this is a GSoC project, but is anyone out there planning on actively continuing dev work after summer ends? |
| 17:26.13 | siggraph | kcorbitt: hopefully he is ;) |
| 17:26.41 | siggraph | but even if he's not, it's one of our top-priorities .. most paths of development relate to it in some way |
| 17:26.49 | ``Erik | how was the irt thing, brlcad? |
| 17:26.58 | siggraph | it was pretty good |
| 17:27.18 | siggraph | not as immediately useful as solid modeling was, but still pretty good |
| 17:27.22 | ``Erik | <-- hopes to thumb through materials when ya'll get back |
| 17:27.49 | siggraph | ``Erik: if you can get ahold of the low man .. he just set a hell of a lot of files with the wrong mime types |
| 17:28.09 | ``Erik | eh? who? whu? |
| 17:28.11 | siggraph | yeah, they should actually have all the presentations on-line too |
| 17:28.18 | ``Erik | oh |
| 17:28.18 | ``Erik | dave |
| 17:28.24 | siggraph | yeppers |
| 17:28.37 | siggraph | test/plain isn't exactly .. right |
| 17:29.13 | siggraph | they were text/plain .. oddly changed them to test/plain saying he was fixing them |
| 17:29.21 | siggraph | .. fix'd em real good ;) |
| 17:29.36 | ``Erik | he seems... confused, but is looking now |
| 17:29.53 | ``Erik | "oops, hehehehe" |
| 17:30.00 | ``Erik | thanks for the heads up |
| 17:30.02 | siggraph | specifically r32388 |
| 17:30.10 | siggraph | but the one(s) preceeding too |
| 17:31.51 | ``Erik | he says it's all fixed now |
| 17:31.56 | siggraph | also should set the svn:eol-style |
| 17:32.16 | siggraph | on the text files |
| 17:32.26 | ``Erik | he says he did, it won't let him commit if he doesn't set that |
| 17:32.58 | siggraph | if only halts on mime-types, and then "suggests" eol-style |
| 17:33.01 | siggraph | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Mime-types |
| 17:33.09 | siggraph | he might want the sample config file |
| 17:35.52 | ``Erik | ok, got him on that page |
| 17:38.12 | siggraph | danka sir |
| 17:38.27 | siggraph | how's the land of mary doing? |
| 17:39.08 | ``Erik | still seems to be here *shrug* looking like I might need to bring my lunch this week, or go hungry and eat bigger dinners :D |
| 17:39.47 | ``Erik | oh, btw, I'm pillaging desks of people who're at siggraph |
| 17:39.49 | ``Erik | mwahahaha |
| 17:39.52 | siggraph | :) |
| 17:39.59 | ``Erik | RAPE THE VILLAGE AND PLUNDER THE WOMEN! |
| 17:40.22 | siggraph | leave my stash of porn and booze alone! |
| 17:40.26 | ``Erik | (nah, I left my kbd at home, so I'm borrowing starseekers for today) |
| 17:40.45 | ``Erik | um, what booze? *burp* and I think nick beat me to the pr0n |
| 17:41.21 | siggraph | speaking of nick, he may need some svn skooling |
| 17:41.37 | siggraph | supposed to be committing his stuff soon, pointed him in your general direction |
| 17:41.45 | ``Erik | yuh oh |
| 17:42.14 | siggraph | and he's never used svn or any other vcs before |
| 17:42.32 | siggraph | sent him instructions via e-mail, but he might need some poking |
| 17:43.02 | ``Erik | aight, if he wanders my way, I'll show him out to irreperable thrash the repo |
| 17:43.11 | siggraph | heh |
| 17:45.13 | siggraph | wonders what "stract" means .. dave picked an odd name there.. |
| 17:45.25 | mafm | kcorbitt: "but is anyone out there planning on actively continuing dev work after summer ends?" -- ,e |
| 17:45.27 | mafm | me* |
| 17:45.45 | siggraph | ab-stract, dis-stract, .. ex-stract |
| 17:45.46 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 17:46.01 | siggraph | ~mafm++ |
| 17:46.04 | mafm | there's some other people interested and who started commiting some changes |
| 17:46.17 | mafm | kcorbitt: maybe you want to work in that too? :D |
| 17:46.34 | siggraph | yeah, that mess needs to all come together at some point :) |
| 17:46.34 | ``Erik | abstract |
| 17:46.59 | mafm | (sorry for the delay, but it seems that notifications don't work properly with this IRC client, or this channel) |
| 17:47.19 | kcorbitt | cool, that's good to hear |
| 17:47.23 | siggraph | channel doesn't have anything to do with highlights :) |
| 17:47.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32392 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/ (149 files in 7 dirs): svn:mime-type & svn:eol-style fixes |
| 17:47.45 | siggraph | unless you told your client to do something per channel of course |
| 17:47.48 | kcorbitt | found out about brl-cad some months ago and have been wanting to teach myself it |
| 17:48.20 | kcorbitt | but haven't found the time to really spend a day going over the mged tutorials |
| 17:48.46 | kcorbitt | that's why I found mafm's project and got very excited! |
| 17:49.03 | mafm | :D |
| 17:49.09 | mafm | what's your platform kcorbitt? |
| 17:49.34 | kcorbitt | I use vista or ubuntu at home and CentOS at work |
| 17:50.06 | mafm | siggraph: I think that it doesn't highlight or show smalls windows when I leave this channel as the active one, and it happens often since it's the more active amongst the ones I join :) |
| 17:50.24 | mafm | kcorbitt: 32/64 bits? |
| 17:50.32 | kcorbitt | actually main reason I use vista still is because there's no decent CAD package for linux |
| 17:50.36 | kcorbitt | 32 |
| 17:50.51 | kcorbitt | but hoping brl-cad will change that |
| 17:50.57 | ``Erik | erm, pro/E and unisys were available for linux last I heard |
| 17:51.21 | mafm | meh, I just prepared a package for amd64 and wanted to find some vict^H^H^H^Hbrave volunteers to test it |
| 17:51.22 | kcorbitt | oh, I hadn't heard |
| 17:51.25 | ``Erik | I'm under the impression that they're considered "decent", just expensive |
| 17:51.35 | kcorbitt | yeah they're good |
| 17:51.35 | siggraph | kcorbitt: even with an easier to use interface, there's no production CAD system that doesn't require some level of training to be useful :) |
| 17:51.40 | jonored | That doesn't mean that an organization keeps the license, though... so might be expensive for a person to get the linux version. |
| 17:51.48 | kcorbitt | yeah |
| 17:51.56 | kcorbitt | I'm no professional engineer, just a student/hobbyist |
| 17:52.22 | kcorbitt | managed to get an edu license of Autodesk Inventor which I've used a lot |
| 17:52.43 | kcorbitt | but this project is very intriguing |
| 17:53.10 | jonored | Happily, my school does... worth checking. Won't do anything on my machine, but it's there. |
| 17:54.33 | kcorbitt | I write C code for my day job though |
| 17:54.47 | siggraph | woot |
| 17:54.51 | ``Erik | neat |
| 17:54.59 | siggraph | kcorbitt: we need devs more than we need users at this point ;) |
| 17:55.04 | ``Erik | I attend meetings, read email, and attend more meetings for my day job |
| 17:55.08 | siggraph | though users are always welcom ;) |
| 17:55.26 | kcorbitt | and I want to look into doing some dev work if it won't suck away my life |
| 17:55.37 | kcorbitt | like some other open source projects I've involved myself in in the past ;) |
| 17:56.00 | kcorbitt | admittedly, that is my own fault |
| 17:56.10 | kcorbitt | this sort of thing is so darn cool! |
| 17:57.15 | siggraph | indeed! |
| 17:57.24 | siggraph | lots of stuffs to be done |
| 17:57.27 | mafm | abstracting away from society? sure, it is :) |
| 17:58.07 | siggraph | sociewho?what? :) |
| 17:58.14 | kcorbitt | lol |
| 17:58.37 | kcorbitt | out of curiousity, any kind of estimate for the current userbase of brl-cad? |
| 17:59.49 | kcorbitt | (if any?) |
| 17:59.58 | siggraph | not anything reliable |
| 18:00.12 | siggraph | we used to have 2k registered site licenses before we were open source |
| 18:00.42 | siggraph | but now we're seeing about 10k downloads per month, so it's really hard to say |
| 18:01.05 | kcorbitt | good stuff |
| 18:01.13 | siggraph | i'm sure a lot of folks checking things out and learning/using brl-cad that never interact, other users that try it once and never again, etc |
| 18:01.20 | ``Erik | even if you sum all that up, some people just download it, look, and throw it away... others redistribute it |
| 18:01.21 | kcorbitt | sure |
| 18:01.49 | siggraph | can say that our rate has been increasing year over year, so if anything .. more people are noticing |
| 18:02.01 | kcorbitt | (I was one of the download-once-and-never-actually-use-it crowd for the month of July ;)) |
| 18:02.38 | kcorbitt | is there a centralized list of feature requests/bugs? |
| 18:02.48 | mafm | siggraph: I PM'ed you, I don't know if it's a convenient time for you :) |
| 18:04.01 | mafm | kcorbitt: http://sourceforge.net/projects/brlcad/?abmode=1#item3rd-3 |
| 18:04.28 | mafm | (I just noticed new SF interface, not very convenient for direct links it seems :) |
| 18:04.41 | mafm | tab "Public" |
| 18:05.43 | kcorbitt | thanks |
| 18:06.38 | kcorbitt | for history, why was it decided to go open source? |
| 18:06.46 | kcorbitt | if anyone is still around from when that happened |
| 18:09.54 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.204.86) | |
| 18:11.24 | siggraph | kcorbitt: for brl-cad, it was more why *not* go open source? |
| 18:11.57 | siggraph | brl-cad has always been developed in a relatively open manner, as open as the team could get away with at the time |
| 18:12.56 | siggraph | there are many benefits and potential benefits that were obtained when we were allowed to go open source |
| 18:13.32 | siggraph | note "allowed" != "decided" .. wanted to a long time ago, but it took over a half-decade to get it approved |
| 18:13.44 | kcorbitt | I see |
| 18:14.17 | kcorbitt | sounds like you've been a developer for quite some time |
| 18:14.41 | kcorbitt | does the project have paid/full time devs, or is it solely volunteer? |
| 18:15.13 | siggraph | it just makes sense .. the gov isn't into the business of making money on brl-cad (and they shouldn't be imho) .. and it's not in the public's interest for such an extensive code to NOT be in the public's hands |
| 18:15.18 | kcorbitt | from reading the history page it sounds like it was first designed by the military, so I assume there were paid developers at some point at least |
| 18:15.38 | siggraph | both, some paid/full some not, some via ARL, some other orgs |
| 18:16.27 | kcorbitt | neat |
| 18:16.57 | siggraph | ARL still funds, develops, and monitors/reviews brl-cad development, though the project is a 'complete' open source project with its own community around it where those that participate are the ones that direct development |
| 18:17.09 | kcorbitt | that's reassuring - projects with even a few full-time developers seem to be much healthier in general than volunteer only ones |
| 18:17.18 | mafm | siggraph: so about the private message? |
| 18:17.23 | siggraph | i.e. a development meritocracy with just some basic peer review to make sure we have a consistent vision |
| 18:17.38 | siggraph | mafm: sorry, on a roll :) |
| 18:18.01 | kcorbitt | heh, sorry for taking your time |
| 18:18.12 | kcorbitt | just trying to get a better handle on the structure |
| 18:19.14 | siggraph | some of that is covered in the HACKING file in our distribution |
| 18:19.23 | siggraph | some in the README |
| 18:26.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32393 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (buttons.c dodraw.c muves.c qray.c rtif.c setup.c): Getting rid of a few warning. |
| 18:27.39 | mafm | so I'll repeat myself now that the channel is a bit more active... |
| 18:28.10 | mafm | <mafm> anybody with linux amd64 around? |
| 18:28.15 | mafm | <mafm> I'd like somebody to test my package |
| 18:30.25 | siggraph | mm.. have an amd64 back at the office somewhere, but I'm of course nowhere near that right now :) |
| 18:39.16 | mafm | I think that I should compile for i386, it's more popular :D |
| 18:40.57 | siggraph | is there a reason you need amd64? |
| 18:42.23 | siggraph | if it's for the gsoc 'goal' of making a dev/test binary -- anything should suffice really |
| 18:44.15 | mafm | yes, it is -- both computers are with amd64 |
| 18:44.30 | mafm | and I would like somebody to test :D |
| 18:44.44 | mafm | if it's not to be tested, what's the point of making it? :) |
| 18:50.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32394 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added the following commands to libged and libtclcad: idents, regions, solids, loadview, saveview and solids_on_ray. |
| 18:51.41 | siggraph | ah, you mean both of yours are amd64 |
| 18:51.52 | siggraph | yeah, just compile for i386 to hit a wider audience |
| 18:52.15 | siggraph | the point is exposure/availability, otherwise you're right -- it'd be a waste of time |
| 18:54.08 | mafm | yep |
| 18:54.33 | mafm | my next laptop would be i386 I guess, I didn't like being an early adopter :D |
| 18:55.15 | mafm | (not that early, it had been commercialized for years, but there are still some things missing at this point) |
| 18:55.43 | mafm | but I think that it would be a Dell and would only arrive by the end of august, at the very least |
| 18:56.23 | siggraph | you can compile for i386 on amd64 no? |
| 18:56.50 | mafm | I think so, but I never did for big projects |
| 18:57.06 | mafm | and Debian has only native distros, not mixed ones like fedora |
| 18:57.39 | mafm | g3d and the libraries are not much of a problem, but I think that OGRE is |
| 18:58.05 | siggraph | you'll probably just have one file, one staticly compiled binary file -- probably easiest to make and get into hands for testing |
| 18:58.30 | siggraph | looks for food |
| 19:03.29 | mafm | hmm, I'm doing it with dynamic libs |
| 19:10.19 | mafm | ok, I leave this cross-compiling ... going home now |
| 19:10.37 | mafm | kcorbitt: hopefully tomorrow I'll have a binary package for you :) |
| 19:12.10 | kcorbitt | nice! |
| 19:38.21 | *** join/#brlcad andre|away_ (n=chatzill@189.71.27.15) | |
| 19:39.11 | ``Erik | brlcad: low-man says thanks for the config |
| 20:30.24 | prasad_ | sean, did the expo start? |
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| 23:03.53 | siggraph | prasad_: not yet |
| 23:03.59 | siggraph | ``Erik: okies dokies |
| 23:04.05 | siggraph | thanks for relaying |
| 23:04.46 | siggraph | sips his cognac whilest listening to the advances in real-time rendering session |
| 23:05.15 | siggraph | praises this glorious new "Geek Bar" |
| 23:14.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32396 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob and andre have added procedural geometry tools to the Windows build |
| 23:48.50 | siggraph | hopes starseeker is watching the data structures for computer graphics class |
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| 00:31.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32397 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 00:31.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: reword -- made all platform installers use consistent naming conventions, |
| 00:31.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: outlined in the HACKING file. In particular, the Windows installer is now more |
| 00:31.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: version-aware, installing into a versioned subdir by default (similar to how we |
| 00:31.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: distribute for other platforms) and allowing per-version uninstalls. bob also |
| 00:31.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: fixed my windows hackage, so props to the man. |
| 00:33.28 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 00:37.51 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.71.17.207) | |
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| 01:18.19 | andrecastelo_ | hey ``Erik, did you have the time to take a look at the code? |
| 01:18.34 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:18.44 | yukonbob | reads scrollback |
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| 06:01.16 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/adchavoc.png :) |
| 06:25.39 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/mixhavoc.png :) with an x server other than cygwinX |
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| 07:00.15 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32398 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
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| 08:05.17 | *** join/#brlcad pawleeq (n=pawleeq@pc112.iabrno.cz) | |
| 08:06.44 | pawleeq | Hi, I have problem when compiling 7.12.4 on Ubuntu 8.04 |
| 08:07.34 | archivist_ub | error? |
| 08:07.37 | pawleeq | ./configure goes well, but make ends with error: "can't read /brlcad-7.12.4/src/other/libz/libz.la: No such file or directory" and |
| 08:08.13 | pawleeq | "brlcad-7.12.4/src/other/libz/libz.la' is not a valid libtool archive" |
| 08:08.24 | pawleeq | the file itself is in the right place |
| 08:08.53 | pawleeq | make[4]: *** [tkimg.la] Error 1 |
| 08:13.27 | pawleeq | the configure script follows: ./configure --with-tcl=/usr/share/tcltk/tcl8.5/tclConfig.sh --with-tk=/usr/share/tcltk/tk8.5/tkConfig.sh |
| 08:18.36 | archivist_ub | hmm I used svn and it used tcl that came with brlcad, hang about someone should know the answer eventually |
| 08:18.39 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:23.58 | pawleeq | or i can try svn:) |
| 08:53.18 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.204.86) | |
| 09:09.48 | d_rossberg | pawleec: 7.12.4 doesn't work with Ubuntu (there is a thread about it in the brlcad-users mailing list) |
| 09:10.02 | d_rossberg | the svn checkout should work |
| 09:11.19 | pawleeq | well, it does not :/ |
| 09:11.32 | pawleeq | here goes the error message: |
| 09:11.36 | pawleeq | /home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XFreeDeviceList' |
| 09:11.36 | pawleeq | /home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XOpenDevice' |
| 09:11.36 | pawleeq | /home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XSelectExtensionEvent' |
| 09:11.36 | pawleeq | /home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src/libdm/.libs/libdm.so: undefined reference to `XListInputDevices' |
| 09:11.37 | pawleeq | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 09:11.37 | pawleeq | make[2]: *** [btclsh] Error 1 |
| 09:11.39 | pawleeq | make[2]: Leaving directory `/home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src/bwish' |
| 09:11.41 | pawleeq | make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 |
| 09:11.43 | pawleeq | make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/pawleeq/src/brlcad/brlcad/src' |
| 09:11.45 | pawleeq | make: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 |
| 09:15.54 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:17.41 | archivist_ub | check config.log for missing , eg xorg dev stuff by the look of it |
| 09:21.27 | mafm | hi |
| 09:21.49 | mafm | Ralith: do you have 32 or 64 bit system? |
| 10:06.03 | Ralith | mafm: 32, why? |
| 10:07.36 | Ralith | actually, I've gtg |
| 10:11.17 | d_rossberg | mafm: i've a 64 bit Ubuntu 7.10 here |
| 10:25.23 | mafm | d_rossberg: maybe you can test a g3d package that I made? |
| 10:25.36 | mafm | Ralith: for that :) |
| 10:29.13 | d_rossberg | mafm: maybe :) |
| 10:35.49 | d_rossberg | where can i find your package? |
| 10:36.27 | mafm | I'm compressing it and then upload it |
| 10:40.56 | mafm | d_rossberg: http://brlcad.org/~mafm/g3d-packages/ |
| 10:43.14 | d_rossberg | ok, i'm trying the .gz ... |
| 11:54.34 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 11:54.34 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Only a few days left in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || ACM SIGGRAPH 2008 is under way! | |
| 12:18.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32399 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Shifting mk_constraint to libwdb |
| 13:03.32 | ``Erik | no, andre, not yet :( I pulled it up in vim and other crap came up |
| 13:12.01 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
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| 13:13.56 | d_rossberg | mafm: i could install libzzip with the package manager, but now the libCg.so is missing |
| 13:14.09 | d_rossberg | where does it belongs to? |
| 13:18.37 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32400 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/iges/brlcad_brep.cpp: renamed PI to its current name M_PI |
| 13:23.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32401 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/iges/ (n_iges.cpp n_iges.hpp): |
| 13:23.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: - replaced a C99 construct by std::string (which is the real nature of this variable) |
| 13:23.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: - adjusted the function type of IGES::readBreps |
| 13:31.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32402 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 10 dirs): added some additional geometry conversion tools to the CMake build |
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| 14:34.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32403 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 14:34.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: adding pass by struct and pass by struct functionality analogous to pc_param: |
| 14:34.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: modification of pc_constrnt struct, adding pc_pushconstraint_expr() and |
| 14:34.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: pc_pushconstraint_struct(), associated modifications to other pc functions |
| 14:44.22 | mafm | d_rossberg: we can't ship things like libCg afaik, that's a proprietary library by nVidia |
| 14:45.17 | mafm | http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/virtual/libcg |
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| 14:51.21 | d_rossberg | mafm: but i have gutsy,it looks like this package isn't available there |
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| 14:54.20 | mafm | d_rossberg: http://developer.nvidia.com/object/cg_toolkit.html |
| 14:56.46 | d_rossberg | maybe, but why do i have to use it? |
| 15:05.17 | mafm | OGRE requires it |
| 15:06.40 | mafm | or rather doesn't require, but strongly recommends |
| 15:07.38 | d_rossberg | bad luck |
| 15:08.57 | mafm | when you start to use complex libraries like OGRE, you start to have lots of dependencies :( |
| 15:11.45 | d_rossberg | btw: it looks like you may redistribute Cg (they have binary packages for this on their web page) |
| 15:12.05 | d_rossberg | the one you showed me |
| 15:13.08 | mafm | but I think that you can re-distristribute in the legal sense |
| 15:13.25 | mafm | that's why Debian or Ubuntu have "installers", but not the libraries directly |
| 15:13.54 | mafm | (kind of like with macromedia flash plugins) |
| 15:14.27 | mafm | so if they don't have them in the repositories, I doubt that we can |
| 15:16.35 | d_rossberg | i think we can because Nvidia has redistributable packages on its web page |
| 15:16.55 | d_rossberg | btw: what is "libfreeimage"? |
| 15:17.56 | mafm | ii libfreeimage3 3.10.0-1 Support library for graphics image formats (library) |
| 15:18.06 | d_rossberg | (I use now libCg from Nvidia's redistribution package) |
| 15:18.57 | d_rossberg | my package manager doesn't know about it :( |
| 15:19.25 | d_rossberg | i.e. libfreeimage |
| 15:21.40 | mafm | http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=libfreeimage&searchon=names&suite=all§ion=all |
| 15:21.52 | d_rossberg | ... sorry - wrong search parameters - i claim the opposite - got libfreeimage ... |
| 15:21.55 | mafm | it seems that it's available for gutsy? |
| 15:22.12 | mafm | ah ok :) |
| 15:24.26 | d_rossberg | mafm: i could see a window but it couldn't find the plugins |
| 15:24.44 | d_rossberg | but this is ok because i installed it in a different path |
| 15:25.54 | d_rossberg | i'll have a look at it tomorrow |
| 15:27.44 | mafm | so it aborts, then? |
| 15:28.41 | d_rossberg | yes, i'll try it with the /usr/local path tomorrow |
| 15:29.19 | mafm | ah, well, if you install in another dir you have to change the paths in the .cfg files |
| 15:29.31 | mafm | it's only a few of them :) |
| 15:29.57 | mafm | thanks for your patience anyway! |
| 15:30.07 | mafm | (I've got to run to the second interview now) |
| 15:30.19 | d_rossberg | is says: /usr/local/share/g3d/ogreplugins.cfg not found |
| 15:30.33 | mafm | uh, I hope that it's not hardcoded! |
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| 17:24.12 | mafm | hi kcorbitt |
| 17:26.52 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: you mean other problems appeared? |
| 17:26.57 | andrecastelo | with the code |
| 17:27.02 | kcorbitt | hi |
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| 18:13.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32406 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Documentation Change |
| 18:22.55 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32407 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): testing a simple case of implicit constraint : isperpendicular which calculates the dot product |
| 18:48.15 | mafm | going home now, take care folks |
| 18:58.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32408 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/doxygen_structure: doxygen: vlb / Variable length buffer added to libbu as a group |
| 19:17.42 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32409 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/parse.c: doxygen: @param corrected |
| 19:32.08 | ``Erik | stuff unrelated to mlt, andre |
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| 21:54.09 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: hm, ok. You think it does not have anything with do with the hit callback functions? |
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| 22:44.49 | starseeker | siggraph: where does the wireframe drawing code live? |
| 22:45.27 | pacman87 | starseeker: rt_*_plot() ? |
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| 23:58.38 | siggraph | yep, plot does the magic |
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| 01:36.28 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 03:53.52 | starseeker | <snort> If you've got a bazillion siggraph geeks at your hotel, you might want to beef up the internet... |
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| 08:27.25 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32410 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/CMakeLists.txt: added constraint.c to be in sync with Makefile.am |
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| 10:22.34 | mafm | hi |
| 10:55.06 | d_rossberg | mafm: after putting the program in /usr/local i could start it |
| 10:55.29 | d_rossberg | but i couldn't find out what it is good for |
| 10:56.11 | mafm | lol, no documentation |
| 10:56.29 | mafm | it has basic infrastructure for commands ("help" in the console) |
| 10:56.50 | d_rossberg | i typed help but it wasn't helpful |
| 10:57.09 | mafm | you can set different polygon modes, camera modes, etc |
| 10:57.34 | mafm | the other part that it's pretty complete it is the camera |
| 10:57.45 | d_rossberg | i thought it is a gui for brlcad |
| 10:58.52 | mafm | in progress :D |
| 10:59.00 | mafm | it's missing the connection to libged |
| 10:59.36 | mafm | to translate operations and geometries back and forth |
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| 16:23.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32411 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcParser.cpp: shifting bu_vls free so as to free only if vls exists |
| 16:25.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32412 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcGenerator.cpp pcGenerator.h): framework and code for a constraint2V object which takes 2 vectors as arguments calling the appropriate function (via pointer) expecting double ** |
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| 19:03.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32413 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/install.doc: Added info about installing the resource files. |
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| 19:34.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32416 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/proe-brl.c: Replace fprintf statements in proe_brl() with calls to ProMessageDisplay(). |
| 20:02.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32417 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (5 files): |
| 20:02.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: adding Point and FastF objects analogous to the Vector object, sorry about |
| 20:02.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: r32415 message. It included modifications to Constraint object to support |
| 20:02.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: addition by data structure / pointer to evaluator as well as addConstraint |
| 20:02.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: functionality to VCSet to suport analogous constraints |
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| 21:09.14 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32418 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): adding functionality to pass information about arguments of a particular constraint; also removed the memory leak by typecasting constraint pointers before delete |
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| 23:11.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32419 10/brlcad/trunk/include/pc.h: make the prototypes match, build is still borken though because some structure addition(s) are missing. |
| 23:19.35 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=d@117.196.137.142) | |
| 23:19.55 | madant | brlcad: is the build still broken due to pc ? |
| 23:46.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32420 10/brlcad/trunk/include/pc.h: unbreaking build. the struct member addition |
| 23:47.06 | madant | ok done. i didnt even realise i had modified pc.h . I thought i was working in libpc directory only. usually i always commit from the root folder.. grr.. my bad :D |
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| 00:12.43 | siggraph | madant: I know, it happens |
| 00:12.56 | siggraph | it works now |
| 00:13.58 | siggraph | fyi, that could probably also be a bu_vls -- there are routines to get a vls from an argv and an argv from a vls |
| 00:14.10 | siggraph | to avoid having to manage memory based on nargv |
| 00:14.32 | siggraph | or even needing to know/keep nargv potentially |
| 00:31.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32421 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (TODO pcParser.cpp pc_main.c): removal of memory leak by adding bu_free and correcting a copy error |
| 00:33.45 | siggraph | and issues like that :) |
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| 01:16.14 | geocalc_ | nick geocalc |
| 01:16.25 | geocalc_ | ooo |
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| 01:56.59 | yukonbob | waves in; "Hello, cadheads" |
| 01:58.50 | andrecastelo | so ``Erik, any clues? |
| 05:01.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32422 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParameter.cpp pcParameter.h): adding iterators to the Parameter class, code transfer from hpp to cpp, commenting |
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| 07:40.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32424 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParameter.cpp pcParameter.h pcParser.cpp): testing Variable reference addition to the Constraint Object using Parameter and VCSet methods, adding display() method to Parameter object |
| 07:40.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32423 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVCSet.cpp pcVCSet.h): adding Parameter related methods to VCSet : gtetParameter() getParaVariables(), modification to display() method, modifying return type of addVariable() functions from void to VariableAbstract * |
| 07:52.33 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32425 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/pc.h src/libpc/pcParser.cpp src/libpc/pc_main.c): simplify pc_param struct by using a void * ptr rather than a union of different pointers |
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| 09:43.19 | mafm | hallo |
| 09:59.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32426 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcGenerator.h: correcting assignment, interchanging lhs and rhs |
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| 10:21.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32427 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParameter.cpp pcVariable.h): changing intersection of intervals to assign the stepsize of the intersect and reducing the default size of double variables for testing |
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| 15:09.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32428 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParameter.cpp pcSolver.h pc_main.c solver_test.cpp): actual test of a constraint solution by using the implicit constraint methodology. approaching complete implicit constraint cycle |
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| 16:37.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32429 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/win32-msvc8/ (3 files in 2 dirs): proe-brl.vcproj has been renamed to proe-brl-4.0.vcproj |
| 16:42.26 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32430 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/win32-msvc8/ (4 files in 3 dirs): renamed proe-brl to proe-brl-4.0 |
| 16:59.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32431 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/win32-msvc8/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Added proe-brl-3.0 |
| 17:32.56 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32432 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/Makefile.am: s/BU/BU_LIBS/ |
| 18:17.54 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: do you think rtmlt shadow issue has something to do with materials? why? |
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| 18:42.16 | divide_by_zero | hello, folks... how do I _run_ brl-cad??... :] |
| 18:49.30 | divide_by_zero | oh, it's installed on /usr/brlcad... |
| 19:20.25 | louipc | mged |
| 19:30.13 | divide_by_zero | louips thanks, I found the tutorial and I am rendering already! =) |
| 19:48.35 | divide_by_zero | I am trying to open a file from a website... what s the "step" format, can I convert it?... |
| 19:49.28 | divide_by_zero | http://www.micromo.com/servlet/com.itmr.waw.servlet.Anzeige?fremdaufruf=ja&kdid=40929&sprachid=1&htdigurl=/n112053/i404618.html |
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| 19:55.01 | louipc | I don't think there's a step converter yet |
| 19:56.12 | louipc | you can do iges though |
| 19:57.48 | divide_by_zero | I am trying iges, it seems some objects appear, but the main cylindrical body of the motor, for example, is missing... :/ |
| 19:58.05 | louipc | hehe |
| 19:59.10 | divide_by_zero | I think I'll need to hack into these files... let's see |
| 20:09.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32433 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (libtienet/Makefile.am master/Makefile.am): lib fixes |
| 21:16.01 | divide_by_zero | If anyone manage to convert this file to BRL-CAD, I would be extremely thankful... I can't make it show the motor cylinder, just the top and bottom planes!... :/ http://www.lti.pcs.usp.br/~nwerneck/almoxarifado/1524_SR.igs |
| 21:35.40 | siggraph | divide_by_zero: for starting, http://brlcad.org/wiki/FAQ <-- second question ;) |
| 21:37.52 | divide_by_zero | thanks, siggraph . I already started the tutorial... my problem was finding where it was installed... :] |
| 21:42.45 | prasad1 | sean: drop by the booth? |
| 21:43.00 | siggraph | prasad1: yeah |
| 21:43.13 | siggraph | talked to ... jason something |
| 21:43.25 | siggraph | said he'd heard of you but he was fairly new himself |
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| 00:11.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32434 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Started moving path building specific code to a third function, that will act as a recursive callback (as ap->a_hit). Still has to be decided where will this function be called from. |
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| 02:38.27 | siggraph | ~andrecastelo++ |
| 02:38.40 | siggraph | prasad_: presume you saw my response :P |
| 02:38.43 | siggraph | wanders off to the reception |
| 02:50.13 | andrecastelo | siggraph: :D |
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| 02:53.14 | andrecastelo | siggraph: going home now? |
| 02:53.35 | andrecastelo | divide_by_zero: olá :D |
| 02:53.46 | divide_by_zero | hello, I am trying to convert a IGES file to BRL-CAD. It doesn't seem to be working, and I was wondering if this is a common problem, hopefuly with a solution. The object is a cylindrical motor, I can get some planes with curves over them, but no solids... any hope for me? |
| 02:53.55 | divide_by_zero | andrecastelo olá... :] |
| 02:54.50 | andrecastelo | divide_by_zero: i'm not very good with modelling, so I can't help :( |
| 03:02.45 | divide_by_zero | perhaps I am getting that what it calls a "trimmed surface"?... |
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| 03:17.36 | divide_by_zero | here is how it looks like converting with -t. perhaps I just need to process the file with some program?.... http://www.lti.pcs.usp.br/~nwerneck/almoxarifado/motor.png |
| 03:27.58 | divide_by_zero | OK, what about this one? I am trying to run this nmg_collapse function, and I get ERROR: bad pointer x9dbd408: s/b face_g_plane(x726b6e65), was face_g_snurb(x736e7262), file nmg_tri.c, line 444 |
| 04:01.57 | divide_by_zero | ouch, even the older version from the debian package gives that, I guess it's just my file that is wrong then... :( |
| 05:48.14 | divide_by_zero | can someone please try to run nmg_simplify in this file, so I can know wheter is it the file that is wrong, or my system that has a problem? http://www.lti.pcs.usp.br/~nwerneck/almoxarifado/motor.g |
| 05:49.43 | divide_by_zero | I tried 3 versions and had similar errors... perhaps is a library I have?... :/ |
| 05:51.32 | Ralith | sure |
| 05:51.43 | Ralith | that's some very slow hosting you've got there |
| 05:52.39 | Ralith | divide_by_zero: ERROR: bad pointer xbc26f00: s/b face_g_plane(x726b6e65), was face_g_snurb(x736e7262), file nmg_mod.c, line 134 |
| 05:52.46 | Ralith | (ran nmg_simplify foobar all) |
| 06:05.34 | divide_by_zero | Thanks!... At least now I know I'm not crazy. :) |
| 06:13.57 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32435 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcGenerator.cpp pcGenerator.h): first go at a dimension independent constraint interface similar to constraint2V |
| 06:16.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32436 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): adding constantness property and associated methods to the VariableAbstract class |
| 06:25.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32437 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcSolver.h: trying to use isConst() for ignoring fixed variables in generic constraint solver |
| 06:32.34 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32438 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/pc.h src/libpc/pc_main.c): trying a wrapper function interface around pc_isperpendicular |
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| 10:23.20 | mafm | hi cadheads |
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| 11:21.18 | mafm | siggraph: so you're going to change your nick or siggraph conf is still going on? :) |
| 11:22.44 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32439 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CMakeLists.txt: Commenting out unneeded part (at the moment) |
| 11:28.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32440 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CameraModeMGED.cxx: |
| 11:28.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Removing \todo which is not applicable anymore. Rotations were not accumulated, |
| 11:28.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: instead they depended on the initial point of the screen where the mouse was at |
| 11:28.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the moment of starting, so it caused an strange jump just when starting to drag |
| 11:28.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: the mouse around. There might be other glitches, of course, but the behaviour |
| 11:28.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: described here is not present anymore so I remove this \todo. |
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| 13:25.52 | diogo | hey have a question never used brlcad before... is brlcad a good program for CAAD (PS: CAAD is not CAD) |
| 13:25.53 | diogo | ? |
| 13:27.00 | diogo | CAAD = computer aided archteture design |
| 13:40.25 | ``Erik | it'd be dandy if you intend to push the design through structural analysis sims (fems and such), but it isn't going to give you blueprints |
| 13:41.25 | diogo | I know... just evaluating my alternatives for linux 64 bit |
| 13:41.27 | ``Erik | (the historic focus is engineering analysis of pre-existing things, not creating new things) |
| 13:41.36 | diogo | k |
| 13:41.42 | diogo | thx |
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| 14:03.34 | donny_baker | brlcad on vacation? |
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| 14:09.02 | ubuntu | hi, i will study brlcad soon... I see it is impossible to create orthogonal views with dimensions, extracted from 3D... What can I use instead of QCad to create complete drawings with dimensions? |
| 14:10.03 | ubuntu | My ubuntu 8.04 was needed in xorg-dev and probably m4 to cbe able to compile be ar el cad. only 6 mb to download |
| 14:15.07 | ``Erik | we can do ortho views pretty easy, and we have 'rtedge' to sorta kinda do line drawings, but dimension info would have to be added either to the rendered image or using a 'sketch' primitive in BRL-CAD :/ |
| 14:20.48 | ubuntu | I will've learned it |
| 14:22.16 | ubuntu | I consider it is easy to run brlcad even on old machines... Rendering could be slow, but it is faster than AutoCAD for Windows... |
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| 14:42.23 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 14:46.42 | ``Erik | howdy |
| 14:48.02 | ``Erik | um, I'm thinking material properties because things like color are stored as materials. My gut feeling is that you're getting one material property hit and setting it, then it just "sticks" instead of being updated for every hit, but I'm not sure how all that actually works. |
| 14:48.21 | ``Erik | um, ok |
| 14:51.22 | mafm | communication breakdown. |
| 14:52.48 | ``Erik | <-- grabs his guitar and jams out some led zepp |
| 14:53.03 | mafm | :) |
| 14:53.43 | mafm | could you give me some ideas about which functions in libged to implement for g3d? |
| 14:54.03 | clock_ | an electric spark led to a zeppelin fire |
| 14:56.34 | mafm | :) |
| 14:59.01 | ``Erik | supposedly the issue with that wasn't the hydrogen providing buoyancy, but the dope they sealed it with :/ conductive and highly flammable, good choice for a huge airship |
| 15:04.20 | mafm | they were clearly doped, then :) |
| 15:04.58 | ``Erik | <-- just uses monokote, way easier to slap it on and hit it with an iron and gun than the cloth&dope approach :D |
| 15:05.04 | mafm | ``Erik: the question above about libged functions were mostly for you, the only active gsoc mentor atm |
| 15:05.21 | ``Erik | uhm, I've no idea? :D |
| 15:05.50 | ``Erik | I haven't even really been following the libged thing, I've been swamped in unfun crap :/ |
| 15:06.35 | mafm | I see |
| 15:06.36 | ``Erik | the big point of g3d is just visualization at this point, right? so the query type functionality would be best? |
| 15:07.11 | mafm | query type fucntionality? I don't understand very well this expression |
| 15:08.52 | ``Erik | view_obj, ae2dir, ged_bot_smooth, mebbe ged_decimate, perhaps ged_summary |
| 15:09.33 | ``Erik | ged_which, ged_who |
| 15:10.04 | ``Erik | stuff like that? |
| 15:10.43 | mafm | maybe |
| 15:11.29 | mafm | the principle of operation is that you tell libged to do things, then saves data internally, and you can query about what's in there (ged_who, which...)? |
| 15:11.39 | ``Erik | the point of the gsoc effort is to make a geometry interrogator that can later become the next generation editor, right? |
| 15:12.30 | mafm | it could jump that step and try to be directly a ng editor :D |
| 15:12.39 | ``Erik | libged has a fistful of functions that just return info and don't edit anything, so being able to say "show me geometry with region id 42" seems like a logical capability, or "show me all regions made of titanium" |
| 15:13.56 | mafm | hmm |
| 15:13.57 | ``Erik | I know a lot of work around here is 'push the button to convert the Pro/E geometry, then go through and changed r31534 to "steeringwheel.r" |
| 15:14.16 | mafm | but for testing that they are working I would need to create something too |
| 15:14.30 | ``Erik | but this is a special weird environment, not the real world :D |
| 15:15.16 | ``Erik | um, to test query functions? you can't load up ktank and pick an arbitrary material or region id to use? :) or the m35 if you want to have a more interesting target? |
| 15:18.30 | mafm | mmm |
| 15:18.45 | mafm | probably yes, but I don't know how to do it |
| 15:18.49 | mafm | firing up mged |
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| 15:19.03 | ``Erik | wb, andre |
| 15:19.19 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 15:19.21 | ``Erik | <``Erik> um, I'm thinking material properties because things like color are stored as materials. My gut feeling is that you're getting one material property hit and setting it, then it just "sticks" instead of being updated for every hit, but I'm not sure how all that actually works. |
| 15:20.15 | andrecastelo | i do get a lot of mlibs warnings on rendering |
| 15:20.56 | mafm | ``Erik: I load the tank/m35 .g files but it won't show anything |
| 15:21.28 | ``Erik | hrm, I have trivial rt I wrote that pays attention to material, but I can't give you the source :/ lemme look to see if I can snip a line or what I did or something heh |
| 15:21.38 | ``Erik | e all.g, mafm |
| 15:21.54 | ``Erik | the ktank.g is um, "tank g17 computer engine" |
| 15:22.11 | ``Erik | the m35 has a nice all.g which includes a light and half in addition to the truck |
| 15:22.17 | ``Erik | two lights, rather |
| 15:23.36 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ok, see if you can :D |
| 15:23.44 | andrecastelo | that would be great |
| 15:25.01 | mafm | huh, neat |
| 15:26.46 | prasad_ | siggraph: actually i didn't. got a bsod b4 i saw the response |
| 15:27.22 | prasad_ | oh |
| 15:27.40 | prasad_ | u talked to a guy who doesn't even work at hq |
| 15:27.41 | prasad_ | hehe |
| 15:30.10 | mafm | ``Erik: when I open a db in libged, it loads it internally or what? |
| 15:36.07 | mafm | huh, ged.h is not in very good state it seems |
| 15:49.08 | ``Erik | opening a db just gets a file descriptor. loading an object creates the internal representation and prep generates more internal representation (for raytracing mostly) |
| 15:51.33 | mafm | that's the loadview command? |
| 15:51.43 | mafm | it's the only "load*" in ged.h |
| 15:52.19 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32441 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Command.cxx Command.h CommandInterpreter.cxx Commands.h): Movind Command base class to a separate file, adding a new command to start to use libged |
| 15:52.21 | ``Erik | <-- doesn't know, has mostly done librt stuff and hasn't touched mged since before the libged effort :( |
| 15:54.00 | mafm | hmm, libged should have the same commands (more or less) as the mged's command line mode? |
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| 15:55.33 | andrecastelo_ | i love my connection |
| 15:56.21 | mafm | \o/ |
| 15:58.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32442 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GuiCommandOverlay.cxx GuiConsole.cxx): Including newly added file for Command base class |
| 15:59.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32443 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GuiCamera.cxx: Silencing debugging message |
| 16:01.08 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32444 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/CommandInterpreter.h: Movind Command base class to a separate file, adding a new command to start to use libged (forgot to add this file in previous commit) |
| 16:19.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32445 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/cmake/UsePkgConfig.cmake: Fix: clearing unexistent variable, go weakly-typed languages go :) |
| 16:47.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32446 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CMakeLists.txt cmake/UseBrlcadConfig.cmake): Better support for BRL-CAD library with CMake |
| 16:50.22 | mafm | ``Erik: help!!!! |
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| 16:52.47 | ``Erik | f1? |
| 16:52.54 | mafm | :) |
| 16:53.13 | mafm | what do I have to do to use libged in my program? |
| 16:53.20 | mafm | brlcad-config --libs ged and so on? |
| 16:53.29 | ``Erik | um, should just be a matter of linking it and calling the functions |
| 16:53.34 | mafm | the thing is that "ged" seems to be missing |
| 16:53.54 | mafm | bu, bn, pkg etc, but no "ged" there |
| 16:56.44 | ``Erik | what're you talking about, I see it in there |
| 16:56.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32447 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/brlcad-config.in: add ged |
| 16:56.51 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:57.17 | mafm | erm |
| 16:57.23 | mafm | so I have to recompile brlcad? |
| 16:57.41 | ``Erik | um, go into brlcad/misc/ and do 'make install', that should be enough |
| 17:01.45 | mafm | done |
| 17:01.50 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 17:04.30 | mafm | w00t |
| 17:04.39 | mafm | my first segfault with libged \o/ |
| 17:08.42 | andrecastelo_ | cya later guys, off to class |
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| 18:18.54 | mafm | siggraph is dead, long live siggraph :P |
| 18:18.57 | mafm | wb brlcad ;) |
| 18:19.02 | brlcad | heh |
| 18:19.19 | brlcad | not quite over yet, but had an irssi reset |
| 18:19.28 | brlcad | s/irssi/isp/ |
| 18:19.33 | mafm | I see |
| 18:20.36 | pacman87 | brlcad: i think donny_baker is looking for you |
| 18:20.53 | brlcad | okies |
| 18:21.14 | mafm | I go now cadheads, take care :) |
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| 21:23.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03n_reed * r32449 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): added foundation for new point primitive; no functionality yet |
| 21:23.27 | prasad_ | so did u see the tech? |
| 21:53.32 | smurfette | awww where did erik go :( |
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| 22:18.24 | brlcad | prasad_: yep |
| 22:18.48 | brlcad | though nothing new that's not on the site .. except for maybe the iphone interface which was fun to play with |
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| 23:43.22 | ``Erik | *yawn* |
| 23:43.28 | ``Erik | brlcad, the new machine rebooted earlier, I didn't do it |
| 23:43.59 | ``Erik | the log reads like someone with priv issued a reboot |
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| 00:27.17 | SportChick | brlcad: ping |
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| 01:46.15 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/classic.png :) a little something :) |
| 01:47.04 | IriX64 | Classic |
| 01:47.10 | IriX64 | sorry bout that |
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| 03:20.53 | poolio | howdy |
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| 13:18.36 | mafm | hi |
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| 14:20.14 | mafm | brlcad: did you play with libged? |
| 14:41.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32451 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcConstraint.cpp pcSolver.h pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): |
| 14:41.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: adding constrained_ and isConstrained() methods so as to generate only |
| 14:41.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: variations of constrained variables while using generate-test method. |
| 14:41.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Significant reduction of sample space in constraints involving higher number of |
| 14:41.47 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: variables |
| 15:08.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32452 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CameraManager.cxx CommandInterpreter.cxx Commands.h): |
| 15:08.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Adding new commands using libged for getting version, title of a database and |
| 15:08.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: summary of objects in the database; but marking them as WIP -- they don't work |
| 15:08.53 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: well but I don't know if it's my fault, libged's, or what's the problem. |
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| 15:54.27 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 15:54.51 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32453 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (7 files): testing construction of Constraint object in C++ directly from pc_constrnt data structure in C. constraint2V to be replaced with dimension/arity independent constraintInterface |
| 16:00.07 | andrecastelo | hi mafm |
| 16:34.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32454 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (4 files): shifting ConstraintInterface code |
| 16:54.09 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32455 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/pc.h src/libpc/pc_main.c): simplifying constraint memory allocation by dividing pc_getconstraint into pc_getconstraint_expr and pc_getconstraint_struct |
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| 18:37.00 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: it does seem to be a material problem, lots of error messages coming from mlib. |
| 18:41.52 | andrecastelo | i did include the material setting in viewmlt.c as is in view.c, though, don't know where's the problem |
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| 19:52.43 | mafm | have to go now, see you |
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| 21:09.56 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/upick.png :) (the aim here is to get it running this way completly with a minimal set of sygwin stuff) |
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| 21:52.07 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik |
| 21:52.22 | andrecastelo | <andrecastelo>âErik: it does seem to be a material problem, lots of error messages coming from mlib. |
| 21:52.33 | andrecastelo | <andrecastelo>i did include the material setting in viewmlt.c as is in view.c, though, don't know where's the problem |
| 23:24.16 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 20:32.31 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 20:32.31 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || Only a few days left in the 2008 Google Summer of Code! || ACM SIGGRAPH 2008 is under way! | |
| 20:32.58 | csanyipal | sean: and again, the color of the wireframe is light green, and the object color in the framebuffer is light green too. |
| 20:34.43 | csanyipal | sean: The color of the Geometry Default in Active Pane is red. |
| 20:37.43 | brlcad | csanyipal: in the screenshot you showed, I don't see a wireframe -- if that was underlay, that's probably a bug |
| 20:38.11 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 20:38.18 | andrecastelo | hi brlcad , hi ``Erik |
| 20:38.22 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 20:38.28 | brlcad | how goes things? |
| 20:39.03 | csanyipal | sean: it is underlay, because you can see the dot in the center that marks the center of the view. |
| 20:39.31 | csanyipal | sean: so that's probably a bug. |
| 20:39.45 | andrecastelo | brlcad: pretty good :D |
| 20:40.55 | brlcad | csanyipal: yes, probably -- do you know if that is an ogl or x11 display? |
| 20:41.23 | csanyipal | sean: I don't know how to determine that.. |
| 20:41.35 | brlcad | run "fbhelp" outside of mged |
| 20:41.43 | csanyipal | sean: OK |
| 20:41.45 | brlcad | does it list /dev/X or /dev/ogl |
| 20:41.48 | brlcad | first |
| 20:43.01 | csanyipal | sean: Description: Silicon Graphics OpenGL Device: /dev/ogl |
| 20:44.20 | brlcad | on linux? |
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| 20:44.36 | csanyipal | sean: Debian GNU/Linux Etch an a Half. :D |
| 20:45.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32465 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 20:45.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: csanyipal reports that the wireframe is failing to draw when the framebuffer is |
| 20:45.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: displayed in mged (regardless of selecting underlay/overlay) when using the ogl |
| 20:45.23 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: display manager. problem seen on linux (debian), unknown if it occurs using the |
| 20:45.24 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: x11 dm. |
| 20:45.43 | brlcad | since you compiled it, you could try recompiling using --without-opengl on configure and see if that fixes it |
| 20:45.59 | brlcad | that would help narrow down the problem |
| 20:45.59 | csanyipal | sean: OK |
| 20:46.20 | pacman87 | how do i use a checker pattern to test my uv()? |
| 20:46.28 | pacman87 | i've forgotten since the last time i used it |
| 20:50.00 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ``Erik thinks that the no-shadow problem with rtmlt is due to bad material setting |
| 20:50.32 | andrecastelo | but i've done the same as in rt, even used the same function |
| 20:51.02 | andrecastelo | another clue is that rtmlt outputs lots of 'shader not found' errors, while rt doesn't |
| 20:51.19 | andrecastelo | do you have any suggestion? |
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| 21:14.14 | csanyipal | sean: I have compiled now using --without-opengl. |
| 21:15.14 | csanyipal | sean: I noticed that that when I run the command: B shapes2.r then the wireframes changed the clor from red to light green. |
| 21:16.11 | csanyipal | sean: but, now is everything OK!! I can see the wireframe in underlay mode!! :) |
| 21:20.24 | csanyipal | sean: You can see it here: http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=kepernyoaa7.png |
| 21:20.55 | csanyipal | sean: Thank you for help! By for now!! |
| 21:22.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32466 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: wireframe bug is specific to the ogl dm, x11 is fine |
| 21:24.24 | brlcad | pacman87: you just set a material property of checker |
| 21:24.43 | brlcad | or if you want it to look nice shaded, use stack with checker and plastic |
| 21:25.11 | brlcad | which is on the edit menu, edit combination, select shader button |
| 21:25.41 | brlcad | another way to debug the uv mapping is to use rt's 6th lighting model ( rt -l 6 ) |
| 21:26.19 | brlcad | that'll show you the uv coordinates as a blue/red palette |
| 21:29.14 | Ralith | that's odd -- I've been getting the tiny console on open bug almost every time I start mged lately |
| 21:30.07 | brlcad | hm? "tiny console on open"? |
| 21:30.18 | brlcad | never heard/seen that |
| 21:30.34 | pacman87 | brlcad: thanks |
| 21:30.39 | Ralith | brlcad: I described it to you a while back |
| 21:30.45 | Ralith | can't seem to work out what makes it happen |
| 21:31.03 | Ralith | when I run mged for the first time since reboot it *seems* to happen every time though |
| 21:31.09 | brlcad | do you have an .mgedrc file? |
| 21:31.19 | Ralith | nope |
| 21:31.37 | brlcad | that's odd |
| 21:31.52 | brlcad | so it's a really small command window, but graphics window seems fine? |
| 21:31.58 | Ralith | it happens at other times too |
| 21:32.00 | Ralith | yeah |
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| 21:32.05 | Ralith | graphics window shopes up normal size every time |
| 21:32.29 | Ralith | command window sometimes shows up with 0 width and only about 2cm height on my 1680x1050 15" display |
| 21:32.45 | Ralith | (I can still resize it thanks to wm decorations) |
| 21:33.33 | brlcad | i'd be completely guessing as to a cause without being able to reproduce it, :/ |
| 21:33.48 | Ralith | I know :/ |
| 21:34.28 | Ralith | it seems to be happening more often than not today |
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| 21:34.59 | brlcad | Ralith: just to annotate -- which os, which dm? |
| 21:35.13 | Ralith | FreeBSD, XFCE |
| 21:35.36 | Ralith | 7.0-STABLE |
| 21:35.48 | brlcad | does it happen with other wm's? |
| 21:36.13 | Ralith | haven't tested yet |
| 21:36.36 | Ralith | wm at use here is actually metacity |
| 21:36.38 | brlcad | that's the only anamoly I can think of that would affect window dimensions |
| 21:39.04 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32467 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: Ralith notes that the mged command window is showing up as an empty 0x0 dimensioned window under some unknown conditions. |
| 21:39.17 | Ralith | not 0x0 -- it has height |
| 21:39.32 | Ralith | thought he was clear about that |
| 21:40.25 | brlcad | content height or wm height? |
| 21:40.35 | brlcad | I took that to mean wm height |
| 21:40.45 | brlcad | since the wm will always draw something |
| 21:40.53 | brlcad | sounded like an empty context |
| 21:41.46 | Ralith | it looked a bit tall for that for me |
| 21:41.55 | Ralith | it's stopped doing this in a different dir opening a different file O.o |
| 21:42.18 | Ralith | and in the original case, now, too |
| 21:43.12 | Ralith | anyway, brlcad, it was much taller than I think the wm would make it by default, although I can't speak with certainty |
| 21:43.29 | Ralith | four or five times the height of the titlebar alone |
| 21:49.48 | Ralith | brlcad: also, is brl-cad supposed to not support $EDITOR being set to a value incl. arguments (e.g. "pico -w")? |
| 21:50.07 | Ralith | 'cuz the way it's calling it certainly doesn't |
| 21:50.51 | Ralith | (when using 'ted') |
| 21:52.14 | brlcad | ah, more than titlebar height you say? |
| 21:53.37 | brlcad | not supporting editor args isn't intentional, though that's the way the shell behaves too -- just try vipw or something similar |
| 21:56.01 | Ralith | vipw launches vi, oddly enough. |
| 22:12.57 | brlcad | not if you set EDITOR to something else :) |
| 22:13.38 | brlcad | if you're running sudo vipw or somesuch, root's config might be setting it back |
| 22:13.54 | brlcad | but you can see it if you go root, set EDITOR, and run vipw |
| 22:21.56 | Ralith | vipw: pw_edit(): No such file or directory |
| 22:22.03 | Ralith | O.o |
| 22:26.19 | brlcad | case in point |
| 22:26.34 | brlcad | just tries to exec whatever EDITOR is set to |
| 22:28.07 | Ralith | kay |
| 22:28.10 | Ralith | guess it's reasonable then |
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| 22:31.20 | brlcad | I wouldn't be opposed to supporting it if you want to patch it, just not sure about the benefit |
| 22:32.23 | Ralith | if it's the way the shell does it there's not really any point |
| 22:32.59 | Ralith | odd that I hadn't noticed that my $EDITOR was broken for this long though O.o |
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| 00:08.17 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32468 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/ (compiler.m4 epsilon.m4 stage.m4): list the required BC dependencies |
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| 01:03.54 | pacman87 | success! |
| 01:05.11 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/rev_rt22.png |
| 01:05.25 | pacman87 | uv mapping |
| 01:08.13 | Ralith | yay! |
| 01:08.27 | Ralith | wait, how do you uvmap a non-mesh object? O.o |
| 01:10.47 | pacman87 | each face has its own uv-space |
| 01:12.13 | Ralith | so faces are tesselated? |
| 01:12.46 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r32469 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: rt_revolve_uv() now works, several changes made to how data from the hit is stored in order to calculate (u,v) |
| 01:13.39 | pacman87 | well, for the start/end faces, the u/v coords are just the 2d hitpoint scaled by the bounds of the sketch |
| 01:14.25 | Ralith | I suppose it doesn't help that I'm not really familiar with UV |
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| 01:17.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03pacman87 * r32470 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: vect_t v is no longer needed by revolve, remove it from rt_revolve_internal |
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| 01:36.57 | brlcad | howdy punkrockgirl |
| 01:37.13 | brlcad | pacman87: awesome :-) |
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| 02:04.01 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 02:04.26 | brlcad | howdies |
| 02:04.45 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 02:04.53 | andrecastelo | how are things? |
| 02:05.35 | brlcad | still decompressing |
| 02:05.46 | andrecastelo | decompressing? |
| 02:05.55 | brlcad | decompressing after siggraph |
| 02:06.31 | brlcad | letting my brain relax all of the ideas that have built up |
| 02:07.06 | andrecastelo | wishes to go next year |
| 02:08.06 | brlcad | tis good stuff |
| 02:08.45 | brlcad | make your path tracer kick arse, get a paper accepted on it -- then it's much cheaper ;) |
| 02:09.30 | andrecastelo | is it possible to write a paper about mlt? |
| 02:09.54 | andrecastelo | i mean, the algorithm is already done and stuff |
| 02:10.22 | brlcad | there's always ways to improve upon algorithms |
| 02:10.28 | brlcad | make it faster, better |
| 02:11.47 | andrecastelo | ponders |
| 02:27.39 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 02:27.43 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:29.52 | Ralith | don't forget prettier |
| 02:36.18 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32471 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/prefix.m4: break the BRLCAD_ROOT and BRLCAD_DATA checks into BC macros so configure.ac can be trimmed down some more. add a pausing statement in order to emphasize the warnings. |
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| 02:37.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32472 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: use the new BC_BRLCAD_ROOT and BC_BRLCAD_DATA macros so we can trim down configure.ac closer to 4k. devs will have to run autogen.sh in order to pick up the update. |
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| 03:28.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32473 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (NOTES pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): adding iterator methods to Domain using boost indirect iterator, :) 1st post-gsoc commit |
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| 03:57.24 | csanyipal | Hi |
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| 05:24.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32474 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/epsilon.m4: BC_TRY_RUN_OUTPUT wasn't set up to take no arguments. fix that so it works with AC_REQUIRE. |
| 05:38.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32475 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/ (tcl.h tclInt.decls tclInt.h tclIntDecls.h tclIntPlatDecls.h): argh, quell the fracking warnings even if they will be clobbered. |
| 06:18.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32476 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/IDEAS: |
| 06:18.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: make it a little more practical. make it a general 'how to get started' guide |
| 06:18.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: for new contributors instead of a smattering of development ideas. the ideas it |
| 06:18.38 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: used to have were all already included in on http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 06:18.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: anyways |
| 06:20.23 | Ralith | brlcad: so did you get that vmath switch into svn? |
| 06:25.03 | brlcad | Ralith: ah! that was pushed back into the recesses of my mind during siggraph |
| 06:25.24 | brlcad | ran into a regression test failure before leaving so I couldn't just commit it |
| 06:26.14 | brlcad | I'll have to see where I left off |
| 06:27.26 | Ralith | aw. |
| 06:29.21 | brlcad | shouldn't take long |
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| 10:26.25 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:26.36 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:11.42 | mafm | :P |
| 13:11.51 | mafm | my lab is hiring new network admins |
| 13:12.05 | tofu | is that a good thing? |
| 13:12.16 | mafm | :D |
| 13:12.33 | mafm | just complaining about them |
| 13:12.41 | mafm | I think that I won't spend much more time here anyway |
| 13:13.03 | brlcad | :( |
| 13:13.31 | mafm | why the sad face? |
| 13:13.33 | brlcad | you were just getting started, doing so well! |
| 13:13.43 | mafm | oh |
| 13:13.48 | mafm | I mean working for the lab |
| 13:13.53 | brlcad | ah |
| 13:13.58 | brlcad | then :) |
| 13:14.18 | mafm | I got a new tempting job offer that probably I'll accept |
| 13:15.05 | brlcad | doing what? |
| 13:15.27 | mafm | programming communication modules of Galileo satellites |
| 13:15.50 | mafm | outsourcing :( |
| 13:16.19 | brlcad | could be fun |
| 13:16.42 | brlcad | could be tedious as hell and not fun too |
| 13:16.58 | mafm | it might be a start as developer, nobody takes me seriously with my foss experience |
| 13:17.13 | mafm | and I'm tired of grid/sysadmin things |
| 13:19.03 | mafm | (go out for a bit) |
| 13:20.24 | brlcad | I highly doubt it's so much your "foss experience" as it is just your experience to date |
| 13:20.39 | brlcad | you're just getting started in many respects |
| 13:21.35 | brlcad | there's plenty of people I know that I'd hire in an instant even though they *only* have foss experience |
| 13:31.26 | andrecastelo | good morning everyone |
| 13:31.28 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 13:31.46 | brlcad | morning andrecastelo |
| 13:31.51 | andrecastelo | brlcad: that's good to know, very good hehe |
| 13:32.06 | andrecastelo | (about hiring) |
| 13:32.12 | andrecastelo | morning brlcad |
| 13:32.23 | andrecastelo | how goes things? |
| 13:32.42 | brlcad | about ready to get back into the swing of things |
| 13:32.57 | andrecastelo | morning (although in your timezone it's more like afternoon) mafm :D |
| 13:34.04 | andrecastelo | sounds good brlcad :D |
| 13:34.51 | PrezKennedy | hey brlcad |
| 13:34.58 | PrezKennedy | how was siggraph? |
| 13:34.59 | brlcad | howdy PrezKennedy |
| 13:35.08 | brlcad | was pretty good |
| 13:35.21 | brlcad | lots of good stuff to be implemented |
| 14:01.32 | mafm | andrecastelo: full afternoon, 15h :) |
| 14:02.31 | mafm | brlcad: ohloh lists more than 2 years for me, and it's missing some important parts |
| 14:02.42 | mafm | and they don't even like me for junior positions |
| 14:03.48 | mafm | or well, getting only crappy Java/C# financial things, or webservices |
| 14:05.26 | mafm | (new network outage announced...) |
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| 15:51.27 | brlcad | mafm: like I said, just getting started ;) |
| 15:52.27 | brlcad | not that ohloh stats are any useful basis to hire or put on a resume |
| 15:53.12 | brlcad | I just mean overall quality/quantity of work -- major contributions in oss are just as recognized as having some big-name company on your resume |
| 15:53.25 | brlcad | presuming you put the effort into it and make it shine |
| 15:53.36 | brlcad | the new gui has that potential for impact and then some |
| 15:53.54 | mafm | well, ohloh is just an example, and not just about statistics |
| 15:54.11 | mafm | it also has links for things that you've coded |
| 15:54.41 | mafm | which in general is a better idea to look at than making random idiotic tests/questions about pieces of code or what-if questions, I think |
| 15:56.11 | brlcad | sometimes |
| 16:05.07 | mafm | anyway |
| 16:05.46 | mafm | for initialiting GED_INIT, you have to pass a valid rt_wdb? I'm getting error strings when passing zero |
| 16:06.14 | brlcad | I would expect so |
| 16:07.13 | mafm | wdb_init? |
| 16:07.27 | brlcad | remember what I said earlier, the ged struct is a container for your application state which includes things like pointers to an open geometry file, loaded geometry, etc |
| 16:08.07 | brlcad | so you're basically getting into the librt and libwdb apis now since you're trying to manage that state directly |
| 16:11.36 | mafm | I see |
| 16:13.04 | brlcad | you'll have to do what mged does in some respects, which for read/write geometry will probably amount to something like wdb_dbopen() |
| 16:13.27 | brlcad | which takes a database instance (a db_i) obtained after db_open |
| 16:15.52 | mafm | does mged already use libged? |
| 16:16.03 | brlcad | yes |
| 16:16.22 | brlcad | about 80% migrated |
| 16:16.24 | mafm | oh, I thought that it was independent at this point |
| 16:16.37 | brlcad | nope, it's been hooked into mged from the start |
| 16:16.49 | brlcad | hence all the instability on trunk lately |
| 16:17.40 | brlcad | bob's been refactoring and cleaning up functionality in mged while he performs the migration, decoupling the implementation from tcl, keeping it hooked into mged using the new ged routines, etc |
| 16:29.27 | mafm | I see |
| 16:29.45 | mafm | a bit intricated process, but I'll manage :) |
| 16:30.48 | brlcad | yeah, the geometry engine and geometry service are meant to clean up that interface to make it much more simple, but you're ahead of the curve |
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| 16:34.56 | mafm | sooo BRL-CAD always puts the data on disk? |
| 16:35.00 | brlcad | no, you can create an in-memory db |
| 16:36.03 | brlcad | mged manages in-memory db access when you're in an edit state, gtransfer maintains an in-memory db for ray-tracing objects received over the network |
| 16:37.17 | brlcad | db_open_inmem() instead of db_open() |
| 16:38.19 | brlcad | see src/gtools/g_transfer.c for sample code |
| 16:50.31 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32477 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/g_transfer.c: Typos |
| 16:52.55 | mafm | so brlcad, I have to use brl-cad specific stuff in the base classes, right? |
| 16:53.12 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 16:53.30 | brlcad | which base classes |
| 16:53.42 | mafm | like storing database references in the main classes, Application, or something to that effect |
| 16:53.58 | mafm | base as in main, basic |
| 16:55.22 | brlcad | it'll obviously have to be stored somewhere -- if you want to do it "right", you could help develop the GE OO layer |
| 16:55.46 | brlcad | otherwise yeah, I'd think you'd have to store them somewhere |
| 16:56.01 | brlcad | either in a base class or a simple wrapper/container that you write |
| 16:56.11 | brlcad | s/base/main data/ |
| 16:56.17 | mafm | just checking that we're in the same page, obviously in this aspect the thin client has to be a bit dependent :) |
| 16:58.09 | mafm | maybe I should use a class to store GED-related data? it could be a start for GE OO layer (I don't have idea on how to contribute to that at this point, before grasping the details of how it works) |
| 16:58.48 | brlcad | yeah, that's probably a good idea |
| 17:03.49 | mafm | should I program the communication protocol myself? |
| 17:12.58 | brlcad | no, there's a guy working on the protocol already -- that would be almost entirely wasted effort |
| 17:13.25 | mafm | where's that? |
| 17:13.39 | brlcad | it's already in the rt^3 module |
| 17:13.48 | brlcad | dave's working on that part |
| 17:14.59 | mafm | stractNet ? |
| 17:15.55 | brlcad | yes |
| 17:16.24 | mafm | so I shouldn't use libpkg directly? |
| 17:16.59 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32478 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/g_transfer.c: ttcp wasn't a typo ;) |
| 17:17.53 | brlcad | mafm: you should and eventually will -- just a question of whether you want to do it sooner or later, and what you're trying to accomplish :) |
| 17:18.01 | mafm | it was referring to the command ttcp? |
| 17:18.56 | mafm | well, I don't have a clear view of the whole picture |
| 17:19.07 | brlcad | stractNet (which shall be renamed, I swear) can be thought of as the communication portion of the GS .. which has to be hooked into the GE as it comes into existence .. which hooks into libged |
| 17:19.33 | mafm | when you tell me that the protocol is stractNet, I understand that it's an upper layer above libpkg, so I shouldn't use it directly |
| 17:21.09 | brlcad | you shouldn't need to use it directly -- the client only indirectly will be interfaced with it through the Geometry Service |
| 17:22.19 | brlcad | but the point is that those portions aren't yet ready, there's a lot of functionality still be written -- how the front-end actually talks with the back-end, how the GS uses the GE, how GE uses libged, migration of libged from mged itself ... |
| 17:22.44 | mafm | seesh :) |
| 17:22.52 | brlcad | so if you want geometry to visualize, your best bet for the near time (i.e. sometime this month) is to use libged directly since that's where it starts |
| 17:23.13 | mafm | so I probably should do that, yep |
| 17:23.15 | brlcad | you're working on a task that has several manyears of effort associated with it |
| 17:23.30 | brlcad | all part of making a powerful new gui |
| 17:23.40 | brlcad | in a scalable fashion |
| 17:24.02 | mafm | FTW-GUI :) |
| 17:24.31 | mafm | well, so I prefer to be conservative at this point |
| 17:24.41 | prasad_ | so the marketing guy dropped by the office |
| 17:24.44 | brlcad | and yes, ttcp refers to the old unix ttcp command used for raw tcp transfers or for "testing tcp" |
| 17:24.50 | prasad_ | said a hulk of a man dropped by and mentioned me |
| 17:24.51 | prasad_ | ;) |
| 17:24.57 | brlcad | prasad_: heh |
| 17:25.24 | brlcad | feel puny in the muscles atm |
| 17:25.38 | brlcad | haven't been to the gym in a long while |
| 17:34.46 | mafm | btw, is there going to be some people working on g3d from this point onwards? |
| 17:34.56 | mafm | I mean, "officially" |
| 17:35.25 | brlcad | all those pieces I talked about directly relate to the editor |
| 17:35.39 | brlcad | just working on it from the bottom up instead of top down |
| 17:36.19 | brlcad | so as those pieces get finished (later this year is expected for some of them), then the attention is towards the editor |
| 17:36.20 | mafm | I'm talking in the g3d/ dir |
| 17:37.07 | brlcad | it's highly likely that folks will be rummaging around the g3d dir, yes :) |
| 17:37.15 | brlcad | myself for one :) |
| 17:37.17 | starseeker | just can't get into this new sourceforge interface |
| 17:37.27 | brlcad | funky, eh? |
| 17:37.35 | starseeker | wants to figure out why he doesn't have fonts in g3d... |
| 17:37.55 | brlcad | starseeker: if you have some feedback, I'd be glad to send it forward -- they're asking me how I feel about it |
| 17:38.01 | starseeker | I keep looking at the "at a glance" window sf puts up by default and wanting to shout "I have more screen space, USE IT" |
| 17:38.26 | mafm | never experienced much of sf's new look yet |
| 17:38.54 | brlcad | which reminds me that I have a half dozen e-mails from sf staffers that I *really* should respond to soon |
| 17:39.15 | mafm | so brlcad, is there a need for organized efforts/communication, or just ml/irc channel as usual? |
| 17:39.33 | starseeker | stretches fingers and gets ready to put up some source tarballs |
| 17:40.01 | brlcad | mafm: there is a strong need for that, but that'd still be over ml/irc no? |
| 17:40.41 | brlcad | some of it is getting some of the big-picture documents up on the site, details into the wiki, a running list of what needs to be worked on |
| 17:40.55 | mafm | starseeker: about fonts, maybe you could try to compile Ogre (from trunk) yourself |
| 17:41.05 | mafm | and see whether it works better |
| 17:41.48 | starseeker | mafm: That's a thought. I can compile the one in the rt^3 trunk, although I'm getting a complaint about missing bio.h when I try building g3d |
| 17:43.00 | mafm | I think that it's a missing include in ged.h, I defined a var to 0 to not include Windows things |
| 17:44.45 | mafm | brlcad: well, my life for the following weeks is more or less like this: |
| 17:44.50 | mafm | - laptop dying at home |
| 17:45.20 | brlcad | heh, ouch |
| 17:45.21 | mafm | I can use it only for 1h30 or so |
| 17:45.42 | mafm | I ordered a new one, but it's going to get to my parent's home by the beginning of september |
| 17:47.42 | mafm | in the meantime I have to find a new flat to live, preferably before the end of the month, and probably it won't have internet |
| 17:47.49 | brlcad | a new laptop or a new battery? |
| 17:48.08 | mafm | I think that the problem is the circuit charging the battery, because it won't boot without it |
| 17:48.35 | mafm | and the led for charging battery is intermitent (without regularity) |
| 17:50.04 | mafm | if I start a new job during next week, I don't know if I'm going to be able to connect from there (so at least I can participate a bit in IRC) |
| 17:50.27 | brlcad | there is the web irc interface if you're blocked ;) |
| 17:50.35 | brlcad | and the mailing list of course |
| 17:51.18 | mafm | and I still hope to visit turkey with the lab in a conference in mid-end september |
| 17:51.36 | brlcad | it's odd that the laptop itself would have a problem charging -- do you have another battery to test? |
| 17:51.42 | brlcad | or is that what you're sending to your parents? |
| 17:52.12 | mafm | so I wanted to tell you about this in the case that you want to start participating actively in g3d/ :) |
| 17:52.42 | mafm | nope I don't have batteries, and they cost 100 euros or so in Portugal :S |
| 17:52.52 | mafm | I ordered a new laptop from Dell |
| 17:53.02 | mafm | does not recommend to buy Asus laptops :PPP |
| 17:53.46 | mafm | I send it over to there because it's free shipping and I'll be visiting them shortly after shipping it |
| 17:53.54 | brlcad | i'd never buy an asus laptop regardless :) |
| 17:53.59 | mafm | send it -> asked them to send it there :) |
| 17:54.46 | brlcad | 100 eu isn't so bad if the laptop isn't too old |
| 17:55.25 | mafm | 2+ years old, half the memory (512 module went away a couple of months ago) :D |
| 17:55.35 | mafm | and I'm not even sure if it's the battery or what |
| 17:55.48 | mafm | theoretically it should work with the battery removed |
| 17:55.58 | brlcad | yeah, it should, doesn't? |
| 17:56.06 | mafm | and when it's only on battery it works for 1h30, a bit short but "normal" |
| 17:56.13 | mafm | nope, it doesn't |
| 17:56.20 | brlcad | yikes, that's f'd up |
| 17:56.27 | mafm | yep, it's very strange |
| 17:57.06 | mafm | so when I have it connected (with battery + ac), it runs on battery and recharges, but only at 1/5th the speed of discharging |
| 17:57.14 | brlcad | debates .. hours in gym or hours writing e-mails |
| 17:57.21 | mafm | then spends all night and next day to recharge to 100% :) |
| 17:58.22 | mafm | I'd say gym if there's some nice girl around :P |
| 17:59.32 | brlcad | there are always nice girls at one of the gyms I go to :) |
| 17:59.48 | PrezKennedy | signs up for brlcad's gym |
| 18:00.01 | brlcad | not that I go there for that reason, but eye candy is always a plus |
| 18:02.32 | mafm | would only go to the gym for the eye candy :P |
| 18:10.50 | brlcad | thinks e-mail may win today |
| 18:20.28 | mafm | :S |
| 18:20.47 | mafm | I think that I got which is the error with ged.h and my libs |
| 18:23.44 | mafm | /* Element names in homogeneous vector (4-tuple) */ |
| 18:23.46 | mafm | #define X 0 |
| 18:23.47 | mafm | ... |
| 18:24.22 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32479 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.cpp pcVariable.h): storeValue() and restoreValue()methods added to Variable, adding methods to check the position of the present variable value in the domain |
| 18:24.27 | mafm | (in vmath.h) |
| 18:24.36 | mafm | is there a possible way that these can go away? |
| 18:26.50 | mafm | or well, to be undefined by the end of the file? :) |
| 18:45.32 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32480 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVariable.h): code for atUpperBoundary, atCriticalAbove and similar functions, modifying the PCSolver to use these methods for the constraint solution |
| 18:48.42 | brlcad | starseeker: looks good to me |
| 18:48.51 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 18:49.00 | starseeker | does happy dance - 1st release! |
| 18:51.02 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! *sniff* -- Congratulations deserved all around to our students for their efforts || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 | |
| 18:54.40 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32481 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.h: correction to last revision, getStep() defined for Variable |
| 18:55.12 | brlcad | mafm: I was talking about those with ralith just a week ago |
| 18:55.16 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 18:55.24 | brlcad | I have a possible fix, but it's still being tested |
| 18:55.49 | brlcad | it's usually been easy enough to work around the problem or undef in the places that cause problems |
| 18:59.14 | *** part/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 18:59.39 | brlcad | there's not much point in having them if they're undefined as they're meant to be convenience indices so that the code is more readable |
| 18:59.50 | brlcad | still, looking into a possible fix, tbd |
| 19:00.55 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 19:01.04 | csanyipal | Hi, |
| 19:34.23 | mafm | brlcad: I cannot use more libged until it's removed, conflicts with OIS and other Ogre things |
| 19:34.27 | mafm | hi csanyipal |
| 19:36.30 | brlcad | mafm: que? |
| 19:36.35 | brlcad | just undef them and you're fine |
| 19:36.54 | brlcad | howdy csanyipal |
| 19:36.59 | mafm | in the .cxx? |
| 19:37.04 | brlcad | after the #include |
| 19:37.11 | brlcad | before including the other headers |
| 19:37.17 | mafm | also: /usr/brlcad/include/brlcad/ged.h:36:17: error: bio.h: No such file or directory |
| 19:37.43 | mafm | #define GED_USE_RUN_RT 1 |
| 19:37.45 | mafm | #if GED_USE_RUN_RT |
| 19:37.46 | mafm | /* Seems to be needed on windows if using ged_run_rt */ |
| 19:37.48 | mafm | #include "bio.h" |
| 19:37.49 | mafm | #endif |
| 19:37.51 | brlcad | ah, bio.h isn't installed |
| 19:37.57 | brlcad | ged.h shouldn't be using it |
| 19:38.17 | mafm | that's the error that starseeker was talking about, a while ago |
| 19:38.18 | brlcad | that's a hack bob put in apparently to make windows work |
| 19:39.11 | brlcad | will have to ask him what the actual error was, could be as simple as a missing io.h |
| 19:40.08 | brlcad | yeah, that was just a hack so he could move on |
| 19:40.30 | brlcad | he has 300 commands, over 100k lines of code to rework so he doesn't stop to figure out every little issue |
| 19:40.40 | brlcad | which ends up leaving turds like that one |
| 19:40.52 | mafm | :) |
| 19:42.30 | PrezKennedy | advantage of arriving early: leaving early! woooo! |
| 19:42.37 | PrezKennedy | runs home to slack off |
| 19:53.29 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 19:56.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32482 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 19:56.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: make GED_USE_RUN_RT go away. bio.h is a private header and is not installed so |
| 19:56.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: it can't be used in ged.h (which is a public header that is installed). the |
| 19:56.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: ged.h header simply needs to declare and include the headers it uses like any |
| 19:56.58 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: other interface which includes the ged_run_rt struct if it's a public struct |
| 19:57.01 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: (and does seem out of place). remove all the associated conditionals that |
| 19:57.03 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: relate to GED_USE_RUN_RT while we're at it. |
| 20:05.10 | brlcad | mafm: that should do the trick, albeit untested on windows |
| 20:07.55 | starseeker | brlcad: What was the name of that book publisher you liked? |
| 20:08.23 | mafm | starseeker: so one error less for you, I guess |
| 20:08.37 | starseeker | mafm :-) |
| 20:08.48 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32483 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/rt.c: merge the two ged_rt_output_handler functions into just one since the _WIN32 sections are relatively small. |
| 20:08.54 | brlcad | starseeker: blurb and lulu depending on the type of book |
| 20:09.42 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah, blurb - that was it |
| 20:10.17 | starseeker | wonders if the owners will start up a company named "blob" as well, just for the heck of it :-P |
| 20:10.56 | brlcad | neat quote |
| 20:10.59 | brlcad | "Good engineering accommodates the errors and omissions of users. Bad engineering relies on laws and conventions to overcome inherent systemic flaws. Laws and conventions are, therefore, indicative of bad engineering." |
| 20:11.32 | starseeker | interesting, but true only when the laws apply to engineering |
| 20:12.06 | starseeker | can see anarchists wanting no laws at all |
| 20:13.03 | starseeker | humans just need to be engineered better :-P |
| 20:13.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32484 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GedData.cxx GedData.h): Adding class to store libged-related data |
| 20:14.35 | brlcad | starseeker: 13! |
| 20:14.56 | starseeker | ? |
| 20:15.05 | starseeker | is missing context |
| 20:15.11 | brlcad | commits :) |
| 20:15.51 | brlcad | mafm and dawn are quickly rising up through the ranks too |
| 20:16.01 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 20:16.02 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32485 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (GeometryConversion.cxx GeometryConversion.h): Fixing doxygen/plain comments |
| 20:16.15 | starseeker | mafm: heh, good timing |
| 20:16.27 | mafm | meh, I just want to get home :) |
| 20:16.30 | mafm | 21h16 here |
| 20:16.50 | starseeker | drools at blurb printing quality |
| 20:16.53 | brlcad | mafm is exactly 100 commits away from entering the top ten :) |
| 20:17.31 | brlcad | their new large-format book is awesome |
| 20:17.51 | brlcad | starseeker: keep "catalog" in mind for sometime next year ;) |
| 20:18.12 | starseeker | catalog format? |
| 20:18.21 | brlcad | I really want to show them how it should be done |
| 20:18.44 | brlcad | the arl tdc |
| 20:18.51 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 20:18.52 | mafm | top ten of brl-cad contributors? |
| 20:19.03 | brlcad | mafm: yes |
| 20:19.33 | starseeker | brlcad: The tdc is less fun though - not public |
| 20:19.35 | brlcad | getting into the top ten isn't so hard, though it gets (almost exponentially) harder to break into each position after that |
| 20:19.41 | brlcad | starseeker: yes it is |
| 20:19.54 | starseeker | does double take |
| 20:19.58 | brlcad | at least we can make one that is |
| 20:20.04 | starseeker | ah |
| 20:20.25 | starseeker | Heh - Large format Landscape tdc with high quality rendering... drool |
| 20:20.37 | brlcad | yes, I LOVE that new book format |
| 20:20.49 | brlcad | it came out a couple months after I published mine |
| 20:21.14 | starseeker | would probably end up replacing the tires on everything for the new book ;-) |
| 20:21.23 | *** join/#brlcad prasad1 (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 20:21.40 | brlcad | would work on getting path tracing working for a new book |
| 20:22.02 | starseeker | boy would that turn some heads |
| 20:22.07 | brlcad | global illumination, soft shadows, ambient occlusion, edge overlay |
| 20:22.27 | brlcad | two page spread per vehicle |
| 20:22.36 | brlcad | so you can show rendered and hidden-line |
| 20:22.53 | starseeker | we'd have to juice up rtedge too |
| 20:23.00 | starseeker | rummages for SIGGRAPH dvd |
| 20:23.42 | brlcad | it's a good 90% solution as it is -- there's a few things it could do better but for vehicle size, it'll catch most of the detail needed |
| 20:23.43 | mafm | brlcad: but I guess that only a small portion of the developers get accounted? |
| 20:24.23 | brlcad | mafm: no, that accounts for most |
| 20:24.39 | mafm | for all BRL-CAD's history? |
| 20:24.48 | brlcad | doesn't account for branch development and older contributors that committed via proxy, but that's otherwise nearly everyone |
| 20:25.11 | brlcad | search the commits, they go all the way back to 1983 |
| 20:25.20 | mafm | huh |
| 20:25.39 | brlcad | http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3996/commits?page=3112 |
| 20:25.48 | brlcad | not enough for you? :) |
| 20:26.17 | mafm | but if devels don't get registered and claim their account, they are listed as contributors anyway? |
| 20:26.48 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F076.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:27.31 | mafm | oh, it seems so |
| 20:28.28 | mafm | #17 atm :) |
| 20:28.49 | mafm | I would have think that the team was much bigger |
| 20:28.52 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32486 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: credit nicholas reed for his summer coding efforts developing a new point primitive. |
| 20:29.18 | brlcad | nope, the team has been about 5-10 guys for most of its history |
| 20:29.28 | brlcad | there are 52 or so contributors |
| 20:29.36 | poolio | brlcad: was that point primitive stuff ever committed? |
| 20:29.44 | brlcad | lots of those are folks that work for a year really hard but then are off on other projects |
| 20:29.50 | brlcad | poolio: yes |
| 20:30.03 | poolio | does it work? |
| 20:30.13 | brlcad | it's incomplete and untested (peer-wise), but it's there and at least worked in demo :) |
| 20:30.28 | brlcad | I believe it actually does work |
| 20:30.32 | poolio | oh cool cool. so the summer students presented? |
| 20:30.33 | brlcad | he was pretty methodical |
| 20:30.52 | brlcad | I've not been back in yet since my trip |
| 20:30.55 | starseeker | brlcad: Does Blurb accept pdfs or do you have to use their software? |
| 20:31.19 | brlcad | starseeker: you have to use their software, though if you have a pdf it's really easy |
| 20:31.26 | brlcad | that's what I started with for mine |
| 20:31.32 | starseeker | meh. Sucks for Linux then |
| 20:31.41 | brlcad | why? |
| 20:32.02 | starseeker | Hard to submit it when they don't have a Linux version of the software |
| 20:32.11 | brlcad | it's pretty well-designed java software iirc (and suprisingly good/stable esp. for java software) |
| 20:32.20 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 20:33.09 | brlcad | it's not like you don't have access to other operating system(s) if needed :) |
| 20:33.40 | starseeker | He |
| 20:33.42 | starseeker | h |
| 20:33.47 | starseeker | true |
| 20:34.39 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32487 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Using program-wide data structures instead of testing on-demand ones |
| 20:35.27 | brlcad | 99! ;) |
| 20:36.16 | mafm | it's a moving target anyway :D |
| 20:36.35 | brlcad | only if starseeker gets there first |
| 20:36.46 | brlcad | cjohnson isn't likely to increase his count anytime soon |
| 20:37.01 | brlcad | ~seen cjohnson |
| 20:37.02 | ibot | cjohnson <n=cjohnson@71.5.32.3.ptr.us.xo.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #maemo, 25d 2h 49m 8s ago, saying: 'Is it possible to link the n800 up with a phone, via bluetooth or other, and send text messages?'. |
| 20:37.09 | brlcad | hm, that's not him |
| 20:38.29 | brlcad | oh well, it's been over a year |
| 20:39.17 | mafm | :) |
| 20:40.29 | brlcad | d_rossberg is the other one that might make it there first |
| 20:42.21 | brlcad | if pacman87 would make more succint commits, he'd be nearing the top ten too :) |
| 20:43.14 | mafm | brlcad: how to print bu_vls? vls_str[vls_offset] ? |
| 20:44.37 | mafm | or esoteric calls like init, bu_vls_addr(&vls), etc? |
| 20:49.26 | brlcad | you shouldn't access their internal structure |
| 20:49.47 | brlcad | if you want to print one, there are a variety of bu_vls_*() functions related |
| 20:50.13 | brlcad | that match usual string manipulation and stream printing |
| 20:51.04 | mafm | mmm |
| 20:51.18 | brlcad | bu_vls_addr() will give you a char* suitable for most uses if you need to pass it to something expecting a C string |
| 20:51.40 | brlcad | if you just want to print it, though, you can use bu_log() and the %S will print a bu_vls |
| 20:52.03 | brlcad | what are you trying to do with it? |
| 20:52.41 | mafm | bu_vls_addr() to print it in "%s"? |
| 20:52.48 | brlcad | yep |
| 20:52.51 | mafm | (ok, I just read what you said) |
| 20:54.42 | brlcad | if it's a string op, there is almost guaranteed a more suitable/optimized bu_vls_*() routine (e.g. better than calling strlen or strcmp, etc) |
| 20:55.59 | mafm | it's to append it to the output |
| 20:56.10 | mafm | e.g. to print the version string, from ged_version() |
| 20:56.19 | brlcad | output as in stdout? |
| 20:56.24 | brlcad | or some other stream? |
| 20:57.39 | mafm | some other stream -- to print in console |
| 20:57.47 | mafm | (gui console) |
| 20:59.24 | mafm | anyway, the main problem is taht I'm getting either no results (empty strings) or segfaults :) |
| 20:59.46 | mafm | it's 22h here, I guess that I'll have to leave the quest for top 10 for tomorrow :) |
| 20:59.53 | brlcad | heh |
| 21:00.56 | mafm | anyway, this looks about right, isn't it? |
| 21:00.59 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:01.01 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:01.02 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:01.35 | brlcad | no |
| 21:01.48 | brlcad | bu_vls_addr is guaranteed to not return null |
| 21:01.58 | brlcad | presuming it has been initialized (which is required) |
| 21:02.30 | mafm | I see |
| 21:02.33 | brlcad | which ged_result_str has iirc |
| 21:02.35 | mafm | and the other part? |
| 21:02.37 | brlcad | so you can just use it |
| 21:03.34 | mafm | I mean, it's in there where the output of ged_version is put? |
| 21:04.25 | brlcad | yes |
| 21:04.46 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@123.208.124.191) | |
| 21:04.47 | brlcad | though you do realize that ged_version() is related to the version of a given .g file (e.g. '4' or '5') |
| 21:04.54 | brlcad | not the version of the library |
| 21:05.13 | brlcad | akin to typing 'version' inside mged |
| 21:05.44 | brlcad | so the gedp that you pass ged_version() needs to have a valid/opened geometry database |
| 21:06.28 | mafm | oh sheet :) |
| 21:07.22 | brlcad | hm, that is an unfortunate point of confusion |
| 21:07.33 | brlcad | the other libs do have a lib_version() routine that identifies them |
| 21:07.47 | mafm | I'm just trying to get simple commands, to know whether basic things work |
| 21:08.15 | brlcad | version is a good basic thing |
| 21:08.28 | brlcad | title and units are also good |
| 21:09.25 | mafm | I have also title, and it doesn't segfault but doesn't show anything |
| 21:10.31 | brlcad | did you open something with a title? :) |
| 21:10.39 | brlcad | mged -c db/moss.g title |
| 21:10.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32488 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: reword dbversion comment |
| 21:11.27 | mafm | haven't open anything, but I think that when you provide a parameter it should set it as title |
| 21:12.14 | mafm | http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brlcadtestkw5.png |
| 21:13.14 | brlcad | yes it should/does if you provide a title |
| 21:13.26 | brlcad | but not if you don't have a db open |
| 21:13.31 | brlcad | it should bitch at you |
| 21:13.42 | brlcad | no messages on your console? |
| 21:13.51 | brlcad | er, onto stdout |
| 21:14.00 | mafm | nope, and I print ged_log |
| 21:14.26 | mafm | (just after trying to print the title) |
| 21:14.37 | brlcad | yeah, it's calling GED_CHECK_DATABASE_OPEN |
| 21:14.40 | mafm | and no results either |
| 21:14.56 | mafm | and I open a inmem DB, not one on disk |
| 21:15.16 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:15.18 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:15.19 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:15.21 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:15.26 | brlcad | what happens if you just bu_log("testing\n"); |
| 21:15.49 | brlcad | sounds like it's just going into a void if stderr is gone |
| 21:16.17 | brlcad | ah, so you do that first .. that'll pass the test |
| 21:16.31 | brlcad | that's a valid (albeit empty) database |
| 21:17.37 | mafm | pre-testing |
| 21:17.38 | mafm | post-testing |
| 21:17.40 | mafm | :) |
| 21:17.44 | mafm | what prints in stdout |
| 21:17.57 | brlcad | bu_log will go to stderr |
| 21:18.02 | mafm | (which respectively wrap around the result and ged_log calls) |
| 21:18.20 | mafm | well, stderr -- I mean the xterm |
| 21:18.31 | brlcad | okay, so bu_logging is working |
| 21:20.03 | brlcad | bu_log("result: [%s]\n", bu_vls_addr(&g->ged_result_str)); |
| 21:20.54 | brlcad | after your three ged_title calls |
| 21:21.01 | mafm | http://img49.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brlcadtest2hy2.png -- for reference |
| 21:24.07 | mafm | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/YKSlS986.html |
| 21:24.42 | mafm | so it should print that in the gui console, I'd say |
| 21:25.03 | mafm | anyway, almost 22h30 here, I really have to go now |
| 21:25.03 | brlcad | AH! |
| 21:25.09 | brlcad | you're not reading *which* result |
| 21:25.16 | mafm | hmm? |
| 21:25.16 | brlcad | there are non-valid result codes |
| 21:25.24 | brlcad | g->ged_result |
| 21:25.35 | mafm | isn't a kind of bool? |
| 21:25.51 | brlcad | no |
| 21:25.55 | brlcad | it's a bitmask |
| 21:25.55 | mafm | grr |
| 21:26.04 | mafm | joins C-haters |
| 21:26.06 | mafm | :P |
| 21:26.24 | brlcad | heh, it would be the same in C++ |
| 21:26.49 | brlcad | er, misspoke |
| 21:27.01 | brlcad | ged_result is a result object |
| 21:27.17 | brlcad | that just means that there is some response returned |
| 21:27.42 | brlcad | ged_result_flags tells you what to do |
| 21:27.46 | mafm | well, you can do that in C++, but you usually have better encapsulation to avoid some errors |
| 21:28.15 | mafm | so I have to apply GED_CHECK_* every time? |
| 21:29.03 | brlcad | for now, can probably just check if !ged_result_flags instead of if !ged_result |
| 21:29.15 | brlcad | no flags is expected result |
| 21:30.21 | brlcad | my bad (yet again) |
| 21:30.29 | brlcad | just check the return code! |
| 21:31.19 | brlcad | result = ged_title(..); .. if (result == BRLCAD_OK) .. |
| 21:32.02 | mafm | what about outputting logs? |
| 21:32.26 | mafm | they're only produced when !BRLCAD_OK, or under other conditions? |
| 21:32.49 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 21:32.52 | brlcad | like the READ_ONLY? |
| 21:32.58 | brlcad | that's a BRLCAD_ERROR return |
| 21:33.55 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:33.56 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:33.57 | brlcad | also, remember that you're working on "pre-alpha interface", an interface that can change |
| 21:33.58 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:33.59 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:34.01 | mafm | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:34.02 | mafm | so like this? |
| 21:35.02 | mafm | hmm, it looks like it uses &g->ged_result_str anyway, not &g->ged_log) |
| 21:35.19 | brlcad | yeah, ged_log doesn't make any sense to me |
| 21:35.24 | brlcad | don't think it's really needed |
| 21:35.32 | brlcad | should probably go away |
| 21:35.51 | brlcad | it's a log hook needed by the 'log' command so it can capture logging |
| 21:35.51 | mafm | and what about accumulating error strings? |
| 21:36.03 | mafm | result: [Sorry, this database is READ-ONLYSorry, this database is READ-ONLYSorry, this database is READ-ONLY] |
| 21:36.52 | brlcad | that's a bug in title, it should bu_vls_trunc(&gedp->ged_result_str, 0); |
| 21:37.03 | brlcad | i'm sure there are a LOT of those |
| 21:37.23 | brlcad | don't presently see it because the caller (i.e. mged) always truncs it itself presently |
| 21:37.59 | mafm | I see |
| 21:38.07 | mafm | well so, it's a start :) |
| 21:38.37 | brlcad | yeah, if you set the right mode on wdb_dbopen, it should work |
| 21:40.21 | brlcad | should be calling db_open_inmem(); |
| 21:40.31 | brlcad | ah, you are, never mind |
| 21:40.38 | mafm | yay, ged_version at least doesn't segfault! |
| 21:41.03 | mafm | but it's not very robust, ged_version() in libged doesn't check for missing argument (argv == 0) |
| 21:42.34 | mafm | w00t |
| 21:42.38 | mafm | and summary also works |
| 21:44.41 | mafm | keey, so almost 23h, enough is enough ;) |
| 21:44.43 | mafm | see you |
| 21:44.43 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32489 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Fixing libged commands, now they at least give some result and mostly work |
| 21:45.07 | brlcad | see ya! |
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| 02:24.27 | starseeker | brlcad: If the raytracing in BRL-CAD were sped up, would that mess with the benchmarking? |
| 02:49.40 | *** join/#brlcad jack-- (i=jack@unaffiliated/jack) | |
| 02:50.03 | jack-- | evening |
| 02:50.30 | jack-- | i'm gonna package brlcad for fink/mac os x now, if you don't mind :) |
| 02:51.04 | jack-- | seems to have evolved quite a bit, since i tried the last time (7.8.something) |
| 02:52.06 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32490 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVariable.h solver_test.cpp): adding insert() method to Solution object so as to simplify the insertion process, code cleanup of Solution and VarDomain in general, both seem to be asking for being de-templated |
| 02:52.32 | jack-- | configuration time is like half of what it needed back then, and you even fixed some of the problems yourself (Found -all_load in libtool script, removing) |
| 02:52.41 | brlcad | starseeker: it would certainly change the results, yes |
| 02:52.42 | jack-- | very nice. |
| 02:53.33 | jack-- | is there a way to see how exactly you compiled your macosx version? configure options, cppflags etc etc? |
| 02:53.35 | brlcad | starseeker: though it wouldn't change the fundamental meaning of the number -- the baseline is still a constant baseline |
| 02:53.43 | brlcad | jack--: nice, glad to hear it |
| 02:53.47 | brlcad | wondered how long it'd take ;) |
| 02:54.14 | jack-- | it's an ancient ppc, 350mhz ;) configuring took about 14 mins now |
| 02:54.43 | brlcad | one of my test boxes is an old dual 500, takes a couple hours to compile ;) |
| 02:54.53 | jack-- | hehe |
| 02:55.00 | brlcad | so I can imagine your pain |
| 02:55.12 | brlcad | probably looking at 3 hours |
| 02:55.53 | jack-- | i'm gonna stash all the binaries into %p/lib/brlcad, and include a brlcad-init.sh to set up $users PATH |
| 02:56.01 | jack-- | should be the best way, i guess |
| 02:56.08 | brlcad | a standard set of release options for binary mac release is a little tricky to explain given how it packs up the pkg for the dmg |
| 02:56.37 | brlcad | given fink is already isolated, you may be able to get away with fink's /sw deafult |
| 02:56.48 | jack-- | no need for dmg...fink does all the packaging by itself, resulting in a .deb |
| 02:57.01 | brlcad | i know, i'm just saying the configuration options are different |
| 02:57.07 | jack-- | ok |
| 02:57.29 | brlcad | do you have a /sw/lib/librt* ? |
| 02:57.50 | brlcad | or a libbu or a libbn ? |
| 02:58.01 | jack-- | not yet, none of them |
| 02:58.02 | brlcad | those are common conflict libs |
| 02:58.12 | jack-- | brlcad will build all that stuff by itself |
| 02:58.28 | brlcad | hm? |
| 02:58.49 | jack-- | it found+will use our libz, tcl+tk at least |
| 02:59.12 | jack-- | but librt, libbu and libbn aren't in fink yet at all |
| 02:59.19 | brlcad | you misunderstand |
| 02:59.55 | brlcad | those three are three of our core libs .. but there are other projects that use same-named libraries, i.e. a *conflict* |
| 03:00.09 | jack-- | none in fink, yet |
| 03:00.23 | jack-- | so i don't see any possible conflicts to arise :) |
| 03:00.41 | brlcad | it's one of the reasons why we're still not in apt and portage yet -- librt in particular is an old linux lib |
| 03:00.50 | brlcad | alright, well that's good :) |
| 03:00.59 | jack-- | macosx != linux ;) |
| 03:01.04 | brlcad | what happens if there were a libbu installed by some other fink package? |
| 03:01.15 | jack-- | and fink is not debian, even if it uses dpkg+apt |
| 03:01.36 | jack-- | that would make me stuff the brlcad libs into a private path |
| 03:01.41 | brlcad | yes.. that was all background info :) |
| 03:01.46 | jack-- | but apparently i don't have to |
| 03:01.54 | brlcad | right |
| 03:02.14 | brlcad | and why I brought it up, if there's no conflict then you might get away with the usual /sw default |
| 03:02.57 | brlcad | for a package management system, though, I would recommend disabling the autodetection |
| 03:03.21 | brlcad | and enabling/disabling along with specified dependencies, so you get deterministic builds |
| 03:04.16 | jack-- | yeah |
| 03:04.29 | jack-- | check http://paste.lisp.org/display/65559 |
| 03:04.57 | brlcad | something like --prefix=/sw --enable-optimized --without-opengl --disable-all |
| 03:05.05 | jack-- | autodetection is fine, as long as it recognizes everything that's there |
| 03:05.06 | brlcad | then --enable-* for any that aren't in fink |
| 03:05.51 | jack-- | should i enable endgame framework and proe? might be totally useless on macosx |
| 03:06.51 | brlcad | --enable-verbose and --enable-progress aren't going to buy you anything for non-developers |
| 03:07.01 | brlcad | you can't enable those two |
| 03:07.07 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:07.22 | brlcad | you'd need third-party binary libs to link them, they're plugins to commercial systems |
| 03:07.42 | jack-- | those 2 enables are just for me, for exactly seeing what's going on in this first-time-build ;) |
| 03:07.51 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:09.03 | brlcad | then --enable-progress should be enough, --enable-verbose is a meta flag for --enable-progress and --enable-warnings .. --enable-warnings is pointless unless you plan on fixing isoteric/additional compilation warnings |
| 03:09.18 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:09.21 | jack-- | why --without-opengl? are there known problems with macosx-opengl? |
| 03:09.31 | brlcad | the flag doesn't mean what you think it means |
| 03:09.52 | brlcad | we have our own display manager and framebuffer interfaces that are implemented using various backend libraries |
| 03:10.19 | brlcad | one of them is an 'ogl' layer, which is supplanted by other interfaces |
| 03:10.29 | jack-- | i see |
| 03:10.36 | jack-- | so it should be using only x11 on macosx? |
| 03:10.39 | brlcad | the ogl one is more likely going to cause problems as it's out of sync |
| 03:10.53 | brlcad | yes |
| 03:11.00 | jack-- | all right |
| 03:11.46 | jack-- | did you get rid of SDL completely meanwhile? |
| 03:11.50 | brlcad | it just defines how it 'talks' protocol-wise, doesn't change any end-user functionality nor decouples us from X11 just yet |
| 03:12.02 | jack-- | i remember adrt and something else using that, long ago |
| 03:12.14 | brlcad | that was for one tiny portion, a bit of experimental code |
| 03:12.20 | jack-- | i see |
| 03:12.26 | brlcad | that and java were/are returning causes of confusion |
| 03:12.31 | brlcad | neither are requirements |
| 03:12.39 | brlcad | neither should be listed as dependencies |
| 03:12.39 | jack-- | :) |
| 03:12.57 | jack-- | sounds like brlcad grew pretty mature in the meantime |
| 03:13.02 | jack-- | which is good :) |
| 03:13.24 | brlcad | put a lot of effort in trying to make the build more flexible for the package management systems |
| 03:13.33 | jack-- | :D |
| 03:13.51 | brlcad | there is still at least one issue with incrtcl |
| 03:14.22 | brlcad | it won't behave if it finds a system incrTcl that mismatches with tcl/tk |
| 03:14.33 | jack-- | did any other package management system pick it up already? like ubuntu or so? |
| 03:14.54 | jack-- | they have zillions of packagers and buildfarms |
| 03:14.56 | brlcad | ports was first to integrate, couple years ago |
| 03:15.05 | brlcad | (freebsd) |
| 03:15.12 | jack-- | yeah |
| 03:15.20 | brlcad | portage was first to try :) |
| 03:15.43 | jack-- | wonder why macports didn't yet ;) considering how close to fbsd-ports they are |
| 03:16.00 | brlcad | but there a lot more adament about how it integrates with not a strong science/cad core to follow up on it |
| 03:17.00 | brlcad | our portage integration record is several years old, huge discussion log |
| 03:17.19 | jack-- | fink should reach enough science folks to generate quite some feedback, i hope |
| 03:17.40 | jack-- | i made a couple guys pretty happy when i packaged the current ghemical, for example |
| 03:17.43 | jack-- | we'll see |
| 03:18.00 | brlcad | anyways, some tips on integration -- INSTALL actually does itemize the options and attempts to describe them in detail |
| 03:18.11 | brlcad | as well as says how to test/validate |
| 03:18.16 | jack-- | ok, cool :) |
| 03:18.35 | jack-- | that's more than 99% of the other open source INSTALLs do |
| 03:19.51 | brlcad | why I mention it, most get used to ignoring them :) |
| 03:20.04 | jack-- | exactly ;) |
| 03:20.27 | jack-- | some packages even have 0byte INSTALL/AUTHORS etc files |
| 03:20.44 | jack-- | only COPYING and README are used most of the time |
| 03:21.57 | brlcad | oh, fyi a universal build won't work in case you try due to some compile-time settings that haven't been weeded out yet |
| 03:22.23 | jack-- | fink doesn't do any universal builds anyway |
| 03:22.27 | brlcad | k |
| 03:22.28 | jack-- | i386 or ppc |
| 03:24.24 | jack-- | hmm...need to make it use fink's libpng, i guess |
| 03:25.18 | brlcad | bigger question would be why did it fail to detect |
| 03:25.27 | jack-- | yeah |
| 03:25.41 | brlcad | (presuming you have it installed) |
| 03:26.05 | jack-- | of course ;) libpng is used by a damn lot of other packages |
| 03:26.43 | jack-- | i'll patch out all traces of /usr/local, just to avoid random clashes with user-installed stuff |
| 03:28.10 | brlcad | the BC_SEARCH_DIRECTORY line should be the only one that matters |
| 03:28.26 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:28.56 | jack-- | i just don't want -L/usr/local/lib to appear anywhere |
| 03:30.12 | jack-- | does it properly honor --bindir/--libdir for the stuff it installs? |
| 03:30.39 | jack-- | or should i give configure a --prefix=privatedir? |
| 03:30.55 | brlcad | it should and has worked fine in the past, but those frankly aren't common configurations that are regularly tested |
| 03:31.11 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:32.19 | brlcad | mged might have some problems initializing as the binaries need to find various resources during run-time, but it'll be pretty obvious if it fails |
| 03:32.42 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:33.18 | jack-- | that's why i'd prefer --prefix=$finkstandardprefix |
| 03:33.40 | brlcad | I would suggest just trying a default --prefix=/sw if you don't care about potential conflicts or maybe /sw/whatever/brlcad-7.12.6 or something similar to make a version-specific single-root |
| 03:34.26 | jack-- | testbuilding with --prefix=/sw now :) conflicts will be dealt with later |
| 03:35.16 | brlcad | might try installing openssl, I think they maybe have/had a libbn at one point |
| 03:35.35 | jack-- | not anymore :) |
| 03:35.44 | brlcad | librt is ancient-linux-specific so should be good there |
| 03:36.01 | jack-- | how did the google SoC thing work out for you? |
| 03:36.41 | brlcad | still working! ;) |
| 03:36.44 | brlcad | worked out great |
| 03:36.49 | jack-- | cool |
| 03:36.57 | brlcad | all of our students did a great job |
| 03:39.35 | brlcad | and similarly, our mentors did a great job -- think we can probably take on another student next year too |
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| 03:44.11 | jack-- | re...damn splits |
| 03:44.12 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:44.12 | starseeker | mumbles under his breath about gentoo portage and BRL-CAD... |
| 03:44.12 | brlcad | starseeker: fix the incrtcl detection and it should be done ;) |
| 03:44.12 | starseeker | nods |
| 03:44.12 | starseeker | I really need to try that |
| 03:44.43 | starseeker | is currently slamming through NIRT paper edits |
| 03:44.43 | starseeker | Janine is great at this - far better at nit picking than I am :-) |
| 03:44.43 | jack-- | again..concerning libxft - should i try to make it use our pango1-freetype219-xft instead? |
| 03:45.24 | starseeker | brlcad: Were there any high level "this should change" thoughts you had on the NIRT paper? |
| 03:45.45 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32491 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: emphasize that the second batch are all optional and try to emphasize how specialized the java portion is (so it should never be listed as a required dependency) |
| 03:45.45 | starseeker | would like to bounce it past Paul and Natalie and try for form1 |
| 03:47.22 | brlcad | jack--: that only matters if tk compiles -- it's a tk dependency that we have to follow through on if tk is configured to use ft (which it is by default) |
| 03:47.35 | jack-- | ok |
| 03:48.03 | brlcad | starseeker: that context has been switched out since siggraph |
| 03:49.59 | starseeker | :-) figured |
| 03:52.06 | starseeker | just working to get it off my desk and back onto someone elses ;-) |
| 03:56.15 | brlcad | well, once you finish up janine's edits .. good point to get an update from you ;) |
| 03:57.05 | starseeker | got most of them tonight :-P |
| 03:57.28 | starseeker | 's eyeballs need a rest from red now... |
| 04:17.48 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 04:17.51 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 04:18.16 | yukonbob | just finished watching Olympic BMX (never thought I'd hear of that event) -- awesome. |
| 04:18.25 | jack-- | cool |
| 04:18.35 | jack-- | = fritz the cad, for tonight |
| 04:19.05 | yukonbob | howdy, fritz |
| 04:19.13 | jack-- | ^^ |
| 04:19.24 | yukonbob | anybody here see Iron Man ( <-- is that a stupid question?) |
| 04:19.34 | jack-- | not yet |
| 04:19.41 | jack-- | rumoured to be quite ok |
| 04:19.47 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 04:19.49 | yukonbob | better than ok |
| 04:19.52 | yukonbob | hey brlcad :) |
| 04:20.05 | yukonbob | have you downloaded your brain after another sigraph? |
| 04:20.10 | brlcad | yukonbob: heh, yeah, I saw it .. pretty good movie |
| 04:20.21 | brlcad | just about |
| 04:20.28 | yukonbob | jack, brlcad: how 'bout THEIR cad :) |
| 04:20.56 | yukonbob | those Iron Man "suit" wireframes were very cool. |
| 04:21.19 | brlcad | heh |
| 04:21.43 | yukonbob | jack--: I'd say go see Iron Man, and see it in the theatre if you can -- the lab/VR scenes are worth the big screen. |
| 04:22.00 | jack-- | ok :) |
| 04:22.21 | yukonbob | brlcad: what was the highlight of sigraph for you this year? |
| 04:22.21 | brlcad | it was well worth a theater venture for me |
| 04:22.34 | brlcad | yukonbob: oof, that's a tough one :) |
| 04:22.51 | yukonbob | !!that's a nice feeling to have |
| 04:23.10 | brlcad | probably a paper on watertight nurbs |
| 04:23.16 | yukonbob | brlcad: you probably know, but tcl/tk 8.5.4 are out now, too |
| 04:23.25 | yukonbob | hrmm... |
| 04:23.50 | yukonbob | thought nurbs were pretty muck "leaky" in practice -- lots of math fu? |
| 04:23.55 | brlcad | followed closely by a follow-up effort to a paper last year on generating cad diagrams |
| 04:24.45 | brlcad | lots of math-fu, yes, and generally require a heck of a lot of effort to make implementing them robust to numerical errors due to floating point |
| 04:25.16 | jack-- | opennurbs_plane.cpp:627: warning: comparing floating point with == or != is unsafe |
| 04:25.18 | brlcad | the paper gave an interesting approach that algorithmically deals with at least a lot of the robustness problems |
| 04:25.19 | jack-- | ;p |
| 04:25.40 | brlcad | jack--: heh, yep -- and that's from some of the folks that do nurbs best ;) |
| 04:26.04 | jack-- | np, as long as it works :) |
| 04:26.50 | brlcad | mm, about 167k lines of code in librt |
| 04:28.00 | yukonbob | brlcad: somebody must have tried BCD to handle this... you have insight into implementations like that? |
| 04:28.17 | brlcad | ~bcd |
| 04:28.25 | brlcad | what is bcd? |
| 04:28.29 | yukonbob | binary coded decimal -- |
| 04:28.39 | brlcad | ah, there are fixed precision implementations |
| 04:28.43 | yukonbob | used in financial apps to get rid of floating-point errors. |
| 04:29.07 | brlcad | there's even an implementation that uses brl-cad geometry |
| 04:29.14 | brlcad | research effort from several years ago |
| 04:29.21 | jack-- | the 6502/6510 even had a D flag for that shit ;) 8bit, but it had bcd |
| 04:29.33 | jack-- | almost never used, though |
| 04:29.36 | yukonbob | C=64 ftw!!!!! |
| 04:29.45 | jack-- | exactly :p |
| 04:29.57 | yukonbob | my first (and only) machine language. |
| 04:30.03 | jack-- | same here ;) |
| 04:30.13 | jack-- | i was a demo/intro coder in the 80s |
| 04:30.14 | brlcad | unc basically implemented exactly what we're implementing now -- just was entirely non-robust and buggy as hell (academic-quality) -- boole |
| 04:30.20 | yukonbob | (yes, machine -- I kept a table of mneumonics, and POKEd programs in :P) |
| 04:30.46 | brlcad | then unc did the same thing again but used fixed precision (esolid) .. and it worked .. but it was more than two *orders* slower on average |
| 04:31.04 | yukonbob | jack--: nice... did you do the first digital recording I heard of Madonna on the C=64? |
| 04:31.13 | jack-- | nope |
| 04:31.18 | yukonbob | heh |
| 04:31.22 | yukonbob | :) |
| 04:31.33 | jack-- | the first one to use "samples" was martin galway, back then |
| 04:31.42 | jack-- | sounded like crap, but still |
| 04:31.50 | yukonbob | can't remember much of the C=64 demo scene -- probably more of the Amiga scene, and not much of that, either. |
| 04:32.19 | jack-- | martin galway did sounds/music for games, back then |
| 04:32.35 | jack-- | "arkanoid" was the very first thing to use 4bit samples |
| 04:32.46 | yukonbob | remembers that name... |
| 04:32.53 | yukonbob | "arkanoid", that is. |
| 04:34.03 | jack-- | best breakout clone ever ;) |
| 04:34.22 | jack-- | and the only reason to buy a "paddle" from commodore for many people |
| 04:34.38 | yukonbob | brlcad: hrm... and did anything ever come of it, or is this another case of "First speed, then correctness>" |
| 04:35.09 | yukonbob | is really happy to have been a kid in the Commodore era... |
| 04:35.19 | yukonbob | had a 4-pen plotter for his Vic-20 |
| 04:35.44 | yukonbob | got into multimedia with the Vic 20 |
| 04:36.12 | yukonbob | BASIC on the Vic20, machine language on the C=64, BBS on the Amiga |
| 04:37.22 | yukonbob | bitmapped graphics and animation on the C=64 (sprites ftw!) |
| 04:38.10 | yukonbob | after the magic of that era, nearly everything since is just "meh". |
| 04:52.29 | brlcad | yukonbob: heh, "did anything ever come of it"? |
| 04:52.35 | brlcad | it's our top development priority right now |
| 04:52.41 | brlcad | so .. yeah, kinda |
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| 04:58.05 | yukonbob | brlcad: where "it" == watertight NURBs? |
| 04:59.11 | yukonbob | starts X |
| 05:04.41 | yukonbob | sees BRL Moose... |
| 05:04.50 | brlcad | :-) |
| 05:05.17 | yukonbob | yours? |
| 05:08.32 | brlcad | nope |
| 05:08.37 | brlcad | summer student |
| 05:10.03 | yukonbob | heh |
| 05:10.26 | yukonbob | so, "top dev priority" == water tight nurbs? |
| 05:10.32 | brlcad | he came up to speed impressively quickly |
| 05:10.51 | brlcad | water tight is a requirement of any solid modeling system |
| 05:11.04 | brlcad | a firm one, to not be water tight is a bug for a solid modeler |
| 05:11.34 | yukonbob | but generally, non-CSG modellers are using 'lazy' nurbs though, correct? |
| 05:12.01 | brlcad | no, has little to do with CSG |
| 05:12.28 | brlcad | has to do with solid modeling, which is one specific part of the overall CAD and modeling industries |
| 05:12.53 | yukonbob | is missing something -- did you you say that NURBs are typically not "water tight"? |
| 05:13.20 | brlcad | whether a CAD system (which often are also solid modeling systems) is water-tight depends on the system |
| 05:13.38 | brlcad | most content modeling systems generally aren't, or at least don't have to be a |
| 05:14.03 | brlcad | as content modelers have generally no engineering basis |
| 05:14.34 | brlcad | (examples of content modelers - maya, lightwave, blender) |
| 05:14.41 | yukonbob | right -- but this paper on water-tight NURBs must be pretty impressive to get a spot at sigraph -- so what about NURBs and this paper deserved that attention? |
| 05:15.15 | brlcad | NURBS are *really* hard to make water tight -- particularly trimmed nurbs |
| 05:15.29 | yukonbob | re: maya, blender -- understood; they're for eyeballs, not correctness -- and only "skin" deep (by definition of their design and the models' construction" |
| 05:15.36 | brlcad | many commercial systems are water tight, but it's not like they want or need to publish how they did it ... ;) |
| 05:15.37 | yukonbob | s/"/)/ |
| 05:16.16 | brlcad | others become water-tight by taking a lot of effort being consistently robust in the implementation |
| 05:16.37 | brlcad | or by imposing various editing limitations (e.g. can't have a nurbs surface with an order greater than some degree) |
| 05:17.27 | brlcad | this paper proposed a solution that involved transforming a trimmed nurbs surface into a different representation type that doesn't have the stitching problem you usually have |
| 05:17.54 | yukonbob | nods -- and so my initial comment "did anything become of it" was re: the system that had 2 orders-of-magnitude performance hit... is that the way that BRL-CAD is currently implementing it's NURBs? |
| 05:19.08 | yukonbob | "correctness" at the cost of "finishing" slower than say Maya. |
| 05:20.05 | brlcad | no, it's not how we do it -- the hit really is impractical for any production use |
| 05:20.20 | brlcad | it'd take days to render an image |
| 05:21.01 | brlcad | hours to evaluate a surface for interactive rendering (we need real-time) |
| 05:22.05 | yukonbob | so that N.Carolina implementation probably has _NOT_ been re-implmented, but stands as an example of how not to do it... |
| 05:22.23 | andrecastelo | reads the email about the C++ geometry engine.. |
| 05:22.39 | brlcad | btw, "NURBS" isn't plural, the S stands for Spline ;) |
| 05:23.16 | brlcad | non-uniform rational basis spline (nurbs) surfaces |
| 05:23.22 | jack-- | NURBSes sounds crappy though ;) |
| 05:23.22 | yukonbob | heh -- well, you can tell I'm out of my depth here ;) |
| 05:23.41 | yukonbob | NURBS Flurbs -- show me pictures of robots, dammit!!!1 |
| 05:24.02 | yukonbob | <-- keen to learn, though :) |
| 05:24.27 | yukonbob | NURBI |
| 05:25.48 | brlcad | the russian pole vaulter is *hot* |
| 05:25.59 | yukonbob | turns on TV |
| 05:26.18 | jack-- | bubka still holds his world record :) |
| 05:26.22 | brlcad | watching dvr, recorded from a couple days ago |
| 05:26.25 | jack-- | after more than 10 years |
| 05:31.28 | brlcad | that is impressive |
| 05:32.44 | jack-- | yup |
| 05:33.01 | jack-- | that guy was so much better than everyone else |
| 05:33.07 | jack-- | probably without any doping |
| 06:23.23 | brlcad | gets through two e-mails out of 20 |
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| 07:03.03 | Mouette | is the file bu.h define bu_exit()? |
| 07:04.59 | Mouette | is libbu important? |
| 07:21.20 | d_rossberg | Mouette: libbu is essential for librt (and other libraries) |
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| 07:32.07 | Mouette | where is defined "htond()"? |
| 07:37.59 | d_rossberg | bu.h, lines 2005 to 2008 |
| 07:43.14 | Mouette | /bin/bash ../../libtool --silent --mode=link gcc -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -L/usr/local/lib -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -o htester htester.o libbu.la -L../../src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -ldl -lm -lpng -lm -lmalloc -lthread |
| 07:43.15 | Mouette | Undefined first referenced |
| 07:43.15 | Mouette | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:43.15 | Mouette | htond htester.o |
| 07:43.15 | Mouette | ntohd htester.o |
| 07:43.17 | Mouette | ld: fatal: Symbol referencing errors. No output written to .libs/htester |
| 07:43.19 | Mouette | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 07:44.43 | brlcad | htond is in libbu |
| 07:44.57 | brlcad | the libbu.la file should have had it |
| 07:45.47 | Mouette | i can't find the problem |
| 07:46.10 | brlcad | run that line without the "--silent" |
| 07:46.17 | brlcad | see what the actual compile line looks like |
| 07:47.20 | brlcad | I suspect maybe someone is dorking with the libtool configuration (again) .. debian devs have it broken by default |
| 07:50.57 | Mouette | /bin/bash ../../libtool --mode=link gcc -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -L/usr/local/lib -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -o htester htester.o libbu.la -L../../src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -ldl -lm -lpng -lm -lmalloc -lthread |
| 07:50.57 | Mouette | gcc -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -o .libs/htester htester.o -L/usr/local/lib ./.libs/libbu.so -L/UNIX-LAB/brlcad-7.12.6/src/other/tcl/unix -ltcl8.5 -ldl -lpng -lm -lmalloc -lthread -R/usr/local/BRL-CAD_7.12.6/lib |
| 07:50.57 | Mouette | Undefined first referenced |
| 07:50.58 | Mouette | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:51.00 | Mouette | htond htester.o |
| 07:51.02 | Mouette | ntohd htester.o |
| 07:51.04 | Mouette | ld: fatal: Symbol referencing errors. No output written to .libs/htester |
| 07:51.06 | Mouette | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 07:51.17 | Mouette | the problem is still exist |
| 07:51.26 | brlcad | that wasn't to fix the problem |
| 07:51.30 | brlcad | that was to help diagnose |
| 07:52.13 | brlcad | do you have another libbu on your system? |
| 07:52.49 | Mouette | no |
| 07:53.42 | brlcad | how did you check? |
| 07:54.06 | Mouette | what happen if i delete these line with "htond" in htester.c? |
| 07:54.14 | Mouette | ? |
| 07:54.53 | Mouette | i don't understand your mean "check"? |
| 07:55.22 | brlcad | how did you verify you don't have a libbu installed somewhere? |
| 07:56.04 | Mouette | ls /usr/lib/libbu* |
| 07:56.37 | brlcad | there are usually other system search paths -- do you have 'locate'? |
| 07:57.10 | Mouette | yes,i have |
| 07:57.19 | brlcad | htester isn't important, you could skip its entire compilation -- but you'll probably just run into the same problem shortly thereafter |
| 07:57.56 | brlcad | edit src/libbu/Makefile.am and change noinst_PROGRAMS to EXTRA_PROGRAMS |
| 07:58.39 | brlcad | still, something else is wrong for that to be happening |
| 07:59.09 | brlcad | if you didn't start your compile by running autogen.sh, try that (./autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all --prefix=...) |
| 08:00.36 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32492 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: emphasize some of the configure args that are less important/optional so they show up in the --help |
| 08:01.13 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32493 10/brlcad/trunk/m4/args.m4: use square brackets around the defaults to be consistent with what autoconf does by default and to differentiate from the (optional) parentheticals |
| 08:10.10 | brlcad | wanders off |
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| 09:05.22 | Mouette | too many errors, i have compiled failed. |
| 09:26.39 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:46.00 | mafm | hello |
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| 09:59.53 | mafm | hi ``Erik |
| 09:59.57 | mafm | brlcad: are you there? |
| 10:03.38 | jack-- | it's early morning in america. |
| 10:03.50 | mafm | :) |
| 10:04.11 | jack-- | 10:10:00 * brlcad wanders off |
| 10:04.15 | jack-- | 2 hours ago |
| 10:04.24 | mafm | ok, thanks |
| 10:04.49 | mafm | anyway, brlcad is known for his aversion to sleep :D |
| 10:04.57 | jack-- | hehe |
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| 12:22.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32494 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (67 files): |
| 12:22.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: Bug fixing: not using argv[0] when argc<1, it tends to be crashy ;) (it happened |
| 12:22.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: to me when trying to use the library). I did some minor normalization in other |
| 12:22.49 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: commands, initializing the result and so on, hopefully I didn't introduce new |
| 12:22.50 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: bugs due to poor understanding of the way it works. |
| 12:31.50 | jack-- | mafm: linux sucks ;) |
| 13:46.57 | mafm | jack--: huh? |
| 13:47.32 | jack-- | not using argv[0] when argc<1, it tends to be crashy ;) |
| 13:47.40 | jack-- | happens only on linux, i bet |
| 13:47.57 | mafm | nope, it's the command interface for internal libged (mged) commands |
| 13:48.18 | jack-- | oh ok |
| 13:48.26 | mafm | so it's rather C-ish thing, not properly Unix-ish :D |
| 13:48.30 | jack-- | yeah |
| 13:52.10 | jack-- | <PROTECTED> |
| 13:52.12 | jack-- | hrm |
| 13:52.34 | jack-- | wonder why it builds without fink, but not when fink does the job.. |
| 13:52.56 | jack-- | maybe i need to tell configure --with-tcl and --with-tk |
| 13:53.43 | mafm | maybe, or with --enable-all |
| 13:55.05 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32495 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: Comment typo |
| 13:56.57 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@fw1.phys.sinica.edu.tw) | |
| 13:57.50 | Mouette | since 7..12.4 to 7.12.6, is libbu changed? |
| 13:59.47 | mafm | doesn't know |
| 14:00.01 | starseeker | I think a few minor changes got pulled in - are you seeing a problem? |
| 14:03.47 | Mouette | in 7.12.4, libbu can be compiled passed in libbu, but 7.12.6 can't. htester.c code is same. |
| 14:04.43 | Mouette | i have check md5sum, both are same,but: |
| 14:04.59 | Mouette | /bin/bash ../../libtool --silent --mode=link gcc -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -L/usr/local/lib -pipe -fno-strict-aliasing -fno-common -fexceptions -g -O3 -o htester htester.o libbu.la -ltcl8.5 -lpng -lz -lm -lmalloc -lthread |
| 14:04.59 | Mouette | Undefined first referenced |
| 14:04.59 | Mouette | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:04.59 | Mouette | htond htester.o |
| 14:05.00 | Mouette | ntohd htester.o |
| 14:05.02 | Mouette | bu_exit htester.o |
| 14:05.04 | Mouette | ld: fatal: Symbol referencing errors. No output written to .libs/htester |
| 14:05.06 | Mouette | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
| 14:05.08 | Mouette | make: *** [htester] Error 1 |
| 14:05.25 | starseeker | what platform are you on? |
| 14:06.31 | Mouette | i compile 7.12.6, appear error |
| 14:06.44 | starseeker | Windows, Linux, Mac? |
| 14:06.56 | Mouette | Solaris |
| 14:07.04 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 14:07.32 | starseeker | I'm not sure I have a Solaris environment handy |
| 14:08.32 | Mouette | in the part libbu, in 7.12.4 i succed to compile but 7.12.6 failed |
| 14:10.18 | starseeker | hmm - are the Makefile.am s different between the two releases? let me check... |
| 14:10.46 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (n=MinuteEl@silentflame/member/pdpc.base.minuteelectron) | |
| 14:11.55 | Mouette | si, they are different |
| 14:16.40 | starseeker | hmm - try swapping in the latest libbu Makefile.am http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/Makefile.am |
| 14:17.29 | jack-- | ok, seems like i solved the tcltk shit at least |
| 14:17.38 | jack-- | hope the build will finish now |
| 14:19.21 | starseeker | Mouette: IIRC that type of error means it's not including something it should be including |
| 14:20.35 | starseeker | not sure why it would be Solaris specific... |
| 14:21.24 | Mouette | ? |
| 14:21.45 | starseeker | I've been doing build testing on OSX for a while now, and it seems to complete OK |
| 14:22.02 | starseeker | I haven't built solaris, so the first thought is there's a solaris specific gotcha somewhere |
| 14:23.40 | jack-- | starseeker: mind giving me your os x configure params? |
| 14:23.49 | jack-- | i'm just packaging brlcad for fink |
| 14:24.02 | starseeker | ./configure --enable-all |
| 14:24.15 | starseeker | nothing fancy :-/ |
| 14:24.22 | jack-- | nothing else? ;) |
| 14:24.41 | starseeker | nah - just a prefix parameter if I want it somewhere other than /usr/brlcad |
| 14:24.43 | jack-- | it doesn't even find tcl+tk if i don't specify --with-bla |
| 14:24.45 | jack-- | ok |
| 14:24.53 | starseeker | with-bla? |
| 14:24.59 | jack-- | tcl and tk |
| 14:25.03 | starseeker | ah |
| 14:25.09 | jack-- | =%p/lib in fink's case |
| 14:25.12 | starseeker | enable-all pulls in tcl an dtk |
| 14:25.14 | starseeker | er tk |
| 14:25.48 | jack-- | are you using fink, macports or none of those? |
| 14:25.55 | starseeker | none |
| 14:26.01 | jack-- | ok |
| 14:32.10 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32496 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Remove '#if GED_USE_RUN_RT', Sean did the same yesterday in libged but not here, so now it won't compile. |
| 14:36.28 | brlcad | oops |
| 14:36.44 | mafm | sean-- :P :D |
| 14:41.23 | mafm | brlcad: you might want to check my commit about command args, I'm not sure whether it'll work for all of them |
| 14:41.49 | brlcad | I saw it |
| 14:42.19 | mafm | and after doing all this by hand, I think that some kind of common infrastructure for the commands would be nice to have :) |
| 14:42.37 | brlcad | something tells me that needing to add the same five lines in hundreds of places isn't the solution |
| 14:42.51 | brlcad | there is some common infrastructure already |
| 14:43.13 | mafm | well, it has same lines for initialiting the result, and for similar feature of showing help when there's only one argument |
| 14:43.21 | brlcad | there are the GED macros that validate, which would reduce that to a one-liner |
| 14:43.41 | brlcad | there's a wrapper function that's in mged that does exactly that |
| 14:43.57 | brlcad | it's not been migrated since all the commands aren't there yet |
| 14:44.27 | mafm | oh, nice, so when moved from mged to libged all this will go away |
| 14:44.45 | brlcad | that is, so that there's be a generic ged_command() or something that would do the callback automatically based on the argv name |
| 14:50.20 | jack-- | brlcad: i'm stuck with a weird issue atm |
| 14:51.11 | jack-- | when i try to build it through fink, it wants to build its own tk even after i told configure --with-tcl=%p/lib and --with-tk=%p/lib |
| 14:51.19 | jack-- | no clue how to get out of that mess |
| 14:51.55 | brlcad | the config.log should say why it's failing |
| 14:52.16 | brlcad | can you post it up somewhere? |
| 14:52.36 | *** join/#brlcad jack--_ (i=jack@e180018009.adsl.alicedsl.de) | |
| 14:57.08 | brlcad | the config.log should say why it's failing |
| 14:57.10 | brlcad | can you post it up somewhere? |
| 14:58.48 | Mouette | i try to copy 7.12.4's libbu to 7.12.6, still failed ......... :( |
| 14:59.08 | brlcad | Mouette: that's a horrible 'fix' regardless :) |
| 14:59.28 | brlcad | it's the bury-your-head-in-sand approach |
| 14:59.58 | brlcad | Mouette: you never answered what I asked last night |
| 15:00.36 | Mouette | locate? |
| 15:00.39 | brlcad | no |
| 15:00.50 | brlcad | 04:01 < brlcad> htester isn't important, you could skip its entire compilation -- but you'll probably just run into the same problem shortly thereafter |
| 15:00.53 | brlcad | 04:01 < brlcad> edit src/libbu/Makefile.am and change noinst_PROGRAMS to EXTRA_PROGRAMS |
| 15:00.56 | brlcad | 04:02 < brlcad> still, something else is wrong for that to be happening |
| 15:01.02 | brlcad | 04:02 < brlcad> if you didn't start your compile by running autogen.sh, try that (./autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all --prefix=...) |
| 15:01.11 | brlcad | did you try running ./autogen.sh ? |
| 15:01.21 | Mouette | yes |
| 15:01.33 | brlcad | and then make clean? |
| 15:02.05 | brlcad | you have to clean the symbols out or you're just stuck on the same linkage problem |
| 15:02.12 | Mouette | but m4 version is less, but i don't update my system m4 version |
| 15:02.33 | brlcad | what do you mean your "m4 version is less"? |
| 15:02.35 | brlcad | less than what? |
| 15:03.01 | brlcad | and did you run make clean? |
| 15:03.29 | Mouette | Preparing build ... autom4te: need GNU m4 1.4 or later: /usr/sfw/bin/gm4 |
| 15:03.29 | Mouette | ERROR: autoconf failed |
| 15:03.46 | brlcad | so you *didn't* successfully run autogen.sh .. |
| 15:03.53 | Mouette | yes |
| 15:04.00 | brlcad | see, that's very important to know |
| 15:04.30 | Mouette | so i need try to update the m4? |
| 15:04.34 | brlcad | help me help you .. really have to know things like that |
| 15:04.53 | brlcad | you downloaded a source tarball I presume, yes? |
| 15:05.14 | brlcad | the libtool script it generates may simply be incomplete/buggy for solaris if it was generated on an older automake |
| 15:05.53 | brlcad | so you really should rerun autogen.sh before proceeding, otherwise you could be chasing a libtool/automake bug that was fixed two years ago |
| 15:06.30 | brlcad | so yes, try to update m4 and anything else until autogen.sh succeeds |
| 15:06.44 | brlcad | start from a fresh untar too |
| 15:09.41 | jack-- | configure: WARNING: Unable to find a system incrTcl compatible with the available system Tcl |
| 15:09.41 | jack-- | configure: WARNING: Enabling compilation of both Tcl and incrTcl |
| 15:09.47 | jack-- | problem found |
| 15:10.03 | jack-- | but we don't have any "incrTcl" ;< |
| 15:10.18 | brlcad | do you have 8.5 tcl? |
| 15:10.27 | jack-- | no, only 8.4 so far |
| 15:10.37 | brlcad | ah, then it's completely valid :) |
| 15:10.45 | jack-- | will be a couple weeks until 8.5 is packaged |
| 15:10.54 | jack-- | what should i do? sit and wait? |
| 15:10.55 | brlcad | since there isn't a system incrtcl, it has to use ours |
| 15:10.59 | brlcad | ours is 8.5-specific |
| 15:11.30 | brlcad | not our doing, but we have to live with it |
| 15:11.55 | brlcad | I can't imagine that you actually don't have incrTcl -- maybe it's called something else? |
| 15:12.03 | brlcad | itcl? itk? |
| 15:12.19 | jack-- | no clue, i rarely dealt with tcl/tk yet at all |
| 15:12.19 | Mouette | Automatically preparing build ... done |
| 15:12.19 | Mouette | The BRL-CAD build system is now prepared. To build here, run: |
| 15:12.19 | Mouette | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:12.19 | Mouette | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:12.23 | jack-- | but let me check |
| 15:12.28 | brlcad | even mac os x ships it |
| 15:12.55 | brlcad | albeit in a mildly broken manner (they don't provide the damn headers!) |
| 15:13.15 | brlcad | Mouette: excellent, that is on a clean untar yes? |
| 15:13.49 | jack-- | ok, found /usr/lib/itclConfig.sh |
| 15:13.57 | jack-- | how do i tell configure to use that? |
| 15:14.04 | Mouette | no, now i restart |
| 15:16.11 | brlcad | jack--: alas, that's my point -- it has everything needed to run itcl scripts .. but not compile itcl apps (because of the missing headers) |
| 15:16.26 | jack-- | :( |
| 15:16.28 | brlcad | so the itclConfig.sh is useless |
| 15:16.33 | jack-- | yeah |
| 15:16.45 | jack-- | but why does the build succeed without fink... |
| 15:16.48 | brlcad | should submit a bug report for that |
| 15:16.51 | jack-- | totally confused |
| 15:17.18 | starseeker | because it's using its own internal TCL/TK |
| 15:17.26 | starseeker | it detects the problem and defaults to its own copy |
| 15:17.29 | brlcad | the build should succeed regardless.. it should just enable compilation of tcl/tk and itcl/itk and move on, unless they're forced off |
| 15:18.01 | brlcad | if they're forced off, it 'should' halt configure since it can't do what it was told |
| 15:18.20 | jack-- | ok |
| 15:18.39 | jack-- | so i need to make sure it builds its own |
| 15:18.55 | brlcad | yeah, add --enable-tcl --enable-tk after --disable-all if you're using that |
| 15:19.04 | Mouette | done |
| 15:19.07 | brlcad | along with itcl and itk too |
| 15:20.03 | Mouette | and then? |
| 15:21.53 | brlcad | Mouette: and then what? after ./autogen.sh you need to run ./configure (try ./configure --enable-all for starters) then make clean && make |
| 15:22.12 | brlcad | then sudo make install |
| 15:23.33 | Mouette | this is nocompiled tarball , and it still need make clean? |
| 15:24.02 | brlcad | if you haven't run make yet, then no the make clean is not necessary |
| 15:24.11 | brlcad | it just wasn't clear from what you've (not) said |
| 15:26.10 | Mouette | need "--enable-optimized"? |
| 15:29.06 | starseeker | brlcad: Poking at this, I'm not at all sure what the tgc primitive is mathematically |
| 15:29.30 | brlcad | Mouette: not to get things working |
| 15:29.54 | brlcad | Mouette: you will want it for your 'final compile' as it will increase performance by about 2x |
| 15:30.03 | brlcad | starseeker: poking at what? |
| 15:30.22 | starseeker | understanding mathematically what the various primitives are |
| 15:30.40 | starseeker | tgc is a tricky one |
| 15:30.56 | brlcad | it's a generalized cylinder |
| 15:30.58 | brlcad | truncated ;) |
| 15:31.15 | pacman87 | thought it was truncated generalized cone |
| 15:31.45 | starseeker | is looking at the Mathworld description of a generalized cylinder and we seem to be even more general than that |
| 15:32.35 | brlcad | yep, they solved the equations for elliptical bases back in the day |
| 15:32.55 | starseeker | yeek |
| 15:33.14 | starseeker | so this puppy is some specific instance of a bounded quadratic surface |
| 15:34.04 | brlcad | http://planetmath.org/encyclopedia/Frusta.html relates at a glance |
| 15:35.41 | starseeker | yep - that's for a cone - that's our trc and tec, as far as I can tell |
| 15:36.16 | starseeker | and uses of tgc up to truncated general cone :-) |
| 15:36.58 | starseeker | it's the using two ellipses and having them defining a surface with non-constant derivative in two dimensions that's throwing me |
| 15:37.00 | brlcad | ah yes, here's the mathworld, http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ConicalFrustum.html |
| 15:37.59 | brlcad | non-constant derivative? you sure 'bout that? |
| 15:38.23 | brlcad | each edge connecting top to base is a straight line |
| 15:38.52 | starseeker | not completely, but look at http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/diagrams/primitives.png.html |
| 15:39.04 | starseeker | the image of the tgc in the lower left |
| 15:39.11 | starseeker | I'm having a hard time getting a cone out of that |
| 15:39.17 | starseeker | or a cylinder either |
| 15:42.02 | starseeker | maybe the right way to say it is derivatives on the surface in the direction of the major height vector that are different from the slope of the height vector? |
| 15:42.05 | brlcad | canonical paper: http://ftp.arl.army.mil/~mike/papers/86scotland/out.ps |
| 15:43.16 | pacman87 | isnt' tgc a singly-ruled surface? |
| 15:44.06 | brlcad | starseeker: those are still flat edges all the way around the tgc |
| 15:45.07 | starseeker | True. |
| 15:45.08 | brlcad | you just end up seeing portions in front of the others because they can extend in/out due to opposing radius ratios |
| 15:45.27 | brlcad | which is also why you can actually get 4 intersections through a tgc |
| 15:45.37 | starseeker | OK, I'll quit worrying :-) |
| 15:45.43 | prasad1 | my raytracer only supports spheres :p |
| 15:45.59 | jack-- | imagines a moebius cone |
| 15:46.09 | jack-- | maybe i should take lsd more often |
| 15:47.12 | brlcad | and yes, as pacman87 notes -- it's a singly ruled surface (each edge connecting top to base is a straight line) |
| 15:49.10 | starseeker | Looks like it's breaking down fairly nicely into Polyhedra, Frustrums, Closed Generalized Cylindars, Ellipsoids, Tori, and Quadratic Surface Bounded Volumes |
| 15:49.52 | starseeker | Then the composite primitives like pipe, extrude, dsp, part... |
| 15:51.19 | starseeker | Which corresponds pretty closely to the colors used to group them in the image :-) |
| 15:51.25 | brlcad | ~seen jonored |
| 15:51.28 | ibot | jonored <n=jonored@dsl092-076-134.bos1.dsl.speakeasy.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 8d 21h 58m 18s ago, saying: 'Happily, my school does... worth checking. Won't do anything on my machine, but it's there.'. |
| 15:53.35 | starseeker | was hoping it could be done somehow using derivatives, edges and whatnot but looks like there's no such animal - at least not without more trouble than it's worth |
| 15:53.50 | starseeker | 's head is mildly spinning from the discussion of Algebraic Varieties |
| 16:10.22 | PrezKennedy | ~seen PrezKennedy |
| 16:10.24 | ibot | prezkennedy is currently on #bzflag #brlcad. Has said a total of 4 messages. Is idling for 2s, last said: '~seen PrezKennedy'. |
| 16:10.32 | PrezKennedy | :D |
| 16:10.56 | jack-- | what a verbose guy you are. ;p |
| 16:12.09 | starseeker | keeps reading and between Sean's idea page and Mathworld is starting to see Polyhedra, Closed Generalized Cylindars, Quadratic Surface Bounded Volumes and Quartic Surface Bounded Volumes |
| 16:18.01 | starseeker | Ah - ha - Flat Surfaces. There we go |
| 16:18.15 | starseeker | likes that "click" feeling |
| 16:20.00 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) | |
| 16:20.29 | starseeker | now I can look into appendix C of VolII |
| 16:22.12 | brlcad | heh, fun |
| 16:22.38 | brlcad | starseeker: remember (if you haven't noticed) that most/many of the primitives spell out their implicit forms in the source code |
| 16:22.45 | brlcad | some of them spell out their parametric as well |
| 16:23.34 | starseeker | nods |
| 16:24.06 | starseeker | I was planning to add that - but I wanted to have some kind of mathematically backed way to group them first :-) |
| 16:26.19 | Mouette | libbu is passed |
| 16:28.19 | Mouette | i still want to know why? the difference between use "autogen then configure"and directly run configure. |
| 16:28.32 | starseeker | Hmm - so an extruded sketch is always a ruled surface, if I'm understanding this right |
| 16:30.08 | brlcad | starseeker: *nod* I'd suggest going a step further than the high-level surface/equation based approach too and think of it more as categories or tags |
| 16:31.30 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32497 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Fixing the commands using libged, they seem to work properly now |
| 16:31.32 | brlcad | Mouette: autogen.sh prepares the build system generating Makefile templates, configure, and the libtool compilation script -- it's a rather complicated symphony that all works together |
| 16:32.16 | brlcad | Mouette: in particular -- you can run autogen.sh on *any* system usually speaking .. unless there is a bug in autoconf/automake/libtool on the platform you run it on |
| 16:32.37 | starseeker | I can certainly tag each primitive (would be helpful to know it "fits" into a specific category) but I was figuring to use Polyhedra, Ruled Surfaces, Quadratic Surfaces, and Quartic Surfaces as logical sections in docbook |
| 16:33.01 | brlcad | libtool and the resulting Makefiles have all the logic for how to compile and link the libraries and programs -- it's different for every platform with lots of possible variations |
| 16:33.12 | starseeker | within that, each primitive gets its "I am this, this, and this mathematically" tags |
| 16:33.17 | brlcad | for whatever reason, it was flawed when generated on platform (whatever) and then used on Solaris |
| 16:34.43 | brlcad | starseeker: only if those top-categories are all-encompassing |
| 16:35.13 | starseeker | brlcad: How so? |
| 16:35.33 | brlcad | they won't get other tags that might be relevant, e.g. whether a primitive can be ray-traced or whether it's finite for example |
| 16:36.29 | brlcad | it's also organizing things mathematically instead of "logically" .. close but not necessarily the same |
| 16:37.07 | brlcad | instead of reading about a torus and finding out it's a fourth order -- i have to read about fourth orders and find out the torus is one of them |
| 16:37.35 | brlcad | rather backwards potentially depending on their background and expectation |
| 16:37.42 | starseeker | Well, if each primitive has its own sub-section the magic of docbook lets us prepare multiple top level groupings using the same content :-) |
| 16:38.22 | starseeker | Maybe we could have page one be images of all the primitives with a section/page number... |
| 16:38.28 | brlcad | hell, many cad packages refer to the primitives as 'box', 'cone', and 'donut' shapes given the target audience generally doesn't know or care about the math behind them |
| 16:39.28 | starseeker | nods - I like the mathematical categorization though as it should scale well - arranging things by "user expectation" has sort of an ad-hoc feel to it unless there is some metric by which they can be sorted? |
| 16:39.32 | brlcad | i can see having a section on quadratic surfaces, ruled surfaces, etc .. but that wouldn't be most intuitive primary grouping that I'd expect |
| 16:39.49 | brlcad | i'm sure you do -- you're a math guy with a strong math background :) |
| 16:40.06 | starseeker | it also tells me which primitives are likely to be harder to work with |
| 16:40.26 | brlcad | again, that's your math bias creeping in :) |
| 16:40.50 | jack-- | gonna package itcl myself now. |
| 16:40.50 | starseeker | :-P |
| 16:40.55 | jack-- | damn apple folks. |
| 16:40.57 | brlcad | for a modeler, it mostly boils down to these types of shapes with those limitations, 2D and 3D |
| 16:41.00 | brlcad | jack--: heh |
| 16:41.24 | jack-- | it's ok, macports has that crap already |
| 16:41.37 | jack-- | so i only need to distill a finkinfo from their portfile |
| 16:41.54 | jack-- | pirating opensource stuff rocks. so legal. :P |
| 16:42.43 | starseeker | brlcad: I can preserve the order in Appendix C for the default "book" - or perhaps the best thing to do is ask the modelers? |
| 16:42.47 | brlcad | starseeker: my point with the tags is that you can get the various groupings if they are employed as tags instead of belonging to groups |
| 16:42.56 | Mouette | compile finish |
| 16:43.00 | brlcad | the tags form groups -- subtle inverse relationship |
| 16:43.52 | starseeker | yes, but there still has to be some docbook document(s) that sort things, unless you're aware of some auto-generation based on tags ability I haven't come across yet |
| 16:44.31 | brlcad | starseeker: layout isn't exactly a modeler's domain any more than gui design is -- once you have something, though, they can certainly give feedback on what they like and don't like about it |
| 16:44.53 | starseeker | nods |
| 16:45.28 | starseeker | I guess I can give it a shot, and if I do it right each primitive will be an "atomic" module that can be re-used easily in any case |
| 16:46.38 | brlcad | well, by tags I more meant that you'd have a 'page' for each primitive, then a container 'tag' page that lists those primitives |
| 16:47.01 | brlcad | which in turn lets you have hierarchical groupings and really arbitrary tags |
| 16:48.21 | brlcad | "implemented_by_anderson", "3d", "quartic", "bounded", etc |
| 16:48.21 | starseeker | I think we're on the same page :-) |
| 16:50.14 | SportChick | pouts at brlcad |
| 16:50.15 | *** part/#brlcad SportChick (i=essy@freenode/staff/sportchick) | |
| 16:50.15 | brlcad | the resulting final document really probably shouldn't present them pre-grouped any more than it does now though |
| 16:50.23 | brlcad | *sniff* |
| 16:51.06 | brlcad | so the current order is probably good for now, especially if all the primitives are included |
| 16:51.20 | starseeker | :-( |
| 16:51.22 | starseeker | Ok, will do |
| 16:51.42 | brlcad | you'll noticed an entire category of primitives missing from the book, they're ones that would otherwise be tagged "unstable" or "incomplete" |
| 16:51.51 | starseeker | nods |
| 16:52.03 | brlcad | i'm just talking about the (current) "appendix" |
| 16:52.12 | brlcad | that is useful in itself |
| 16:52.51 | brlcad | having another section/chapter/whatever that describes each primitive, groups them into subchapters by mathematical surface, etc would be fine too |
| 16:53.04 | starseeker | Hmm... |
| 16:53.09 | starseeker | ponders... |
| 16:53.10 | brlcad | but secondary value to just seeing all the primitives at once |
| 16:53.34 | brlcad | i mean even when I learned mged, I was constantly going back to that appendix (before it was an appendix) |
| 16:53.44 | brlcad | to find a shape that matched something I was trying to model |
| 16:53.55 | starseeker | right. I was figuring to do a primitives "article" and then xinclude it like the lessons |
| 16:54.05 | starseeker | or sections of it anyway |
| 16:54.08 | brlcad | I had no concept of what those shapes were or what they implied -- i was purely visually searching for a rough match |
| 16:54.48 | starseeker | was using your quick reference card for that :-) |
| 16:54.50 | brlcad | finishes getting dressed, pops some painkillers, and heads in |
| 16:55.05 | starseeker | heads for lunch |
| 16:55.18 | starseeker | gah - how'd it get to be one! |
| 16:55.27 | starseeker | doggone interesting topics... |
| 16:55.27 | brlcad | exactly |
| 16:55.46 | brlcad | thinks he'll pit stop at pit beef |
| 16:56.31 | PrezKennedy | i want one!! |
| 16:56.50 | PrezKennedy | we dont have anything good like that place here :( |
| 17:03.57 | Mouette | libtool: install: error: cannot install `tkimg.la' to a directory not ending in /usr/brlcad/lib |
| 17:04.20 | brlcad | Mouette: where are you installing to and what was your --prefix ? |
| 17:04.33 | brlcad | sounds like an unclean build |
| 17:04.41 | Mouette | /usr/local/BRL-CAD |
| 17:05.06 | brlcad | so you ran configure once with one prefix and then again with another it sounds |
| 17:05.12 | brlcad | you have to make clean if you do that |
| 17:05.30 | brlcad | that first tkimg.la was built with the default prefix |
| 17:08.07 | Mouette | when i first run "./configure --enable-all" , then compile looks like succed, so i run "./configure --enable-all --optimized --prefix=/usr/local/BRL-CAD" |
| 17:08.35 | Mouette | ok, i know the problem |
| 17:08.57 | Mouette | tomorrow, i will restart |
| 17:09.39 | Mouette | i will sleep,good night |
| 17:40.52 | mafm | see you tomorrow, I go to the terrific task of visiting flats :) |
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| 20:41.01 | starseeker | note to self - may need to switch all the sect* tags to <section> - working with xinclude I suspect the explicit identification of depth is going to be too cumbersome. |
| 20:43.36 | starseeker | check on the formatting consequences of this |
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| 20:52.18 | andrecastelo | ~seen ``Erik |
| 20:52.21 | ibot | ``erik is currently on #brlcad (9h 24m 34s), last said: 'the log reads like someone with priv issued a reboot'. |
| 20:59.12 | CIA-23 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32498 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add steps Sean mentioned earlier concerning speeding up raytracing |
| 20:59.48 | starseeker | w |
| 20:59.52 | starseeker | whoops |
| 21:28.41 | punkrockgirl | andre: are you looking for erik? i know he has been having internet issues, i'll let him know to come find you though :) |
| 21:33.47 | andrecastelo | punkrockgirl: thank you, that would be great :D |
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| 01:42.53 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:58.01 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@rikers.org) | |
| 01:58.01 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! *sniff* -- Congratulations deserved all around to our students for their efforts || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 | |
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| 04:41.09 | Mouette | is benchmark used check the efficient? |
| 04:55.22 | starseeker | It tests how fast your system runs BRL-CAD in comparison to other systems. |
| 04:59.05 | Mouette | i see |
| 05:06.58 | Mouette | BRL-CAD 7.12.6 for solaris x86 is uploading |
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| 08:12.34 | brlcad | Mouette: excellent! |
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| 09:36.59 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:42.53 | mafm | hi |
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| 10:17.14 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 10:17.29 | mafm | hallo :) |
| 10:17.38 | Mouette | My package is bad in running my another test system Solaris 10 u2, i will restart |
| 10:18.18 | Mouette | i have deleted it in the ftp |
| 10:24.52 | brlcad | noticed |
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| 11:46.33 | Mouette | Package maybe no problem, the problem is from my system, i am verifying |
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| 12:55.29 | Mouette | this pkg look like ok |
| 13:23.31 | brlcad | great |
| 14:10.24 | brlcad | Mouette: so it's ready? |
| 14:17.51 | Mouette | yes |
| 14:18.51 | Mouette | and waiting for your validate |
| 14:20.17 | brlcad | k |
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| 16:53.00 | andrecastelo | hey guys |
| 17:01.48 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
| 17:03.27 | ``Erik | howdy |
| 17:37.02 | mafm | wandering off, see you folkz :) |
| 17:46.04 | andrecastelo | howdy ``Erik |
| 19:51.35 | pacman87 | will be moving back to austin tomorrow, so i'm packing up now. bye all |
| 19:51.37 | *** part/#brlcad pacman87 (n=timothy@71.170.63.120) | |
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| 02:06.15 | brlcad | starseeker: I uploaded the solaris dist, so forget about it |
| 02:08.55 | starseeker | Ah - thanks! |
| 02:10.15 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32499 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: ws |
| 02:12.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32500 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: doxygenify the macros |
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| 03:48.43 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.43.146) | |
| 04:25.51 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32501 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: add a GED_CHECK_ARGC_GT_0 macro to make sure argc is > 0 on all commands. this really belongs in a wrapper function for categories of commands, but it'll do fo r now and is better than having the replication throughout. |
| 04:27.12 | brlcad | ~botmail send mafm curious that you only added the argc < 1 check to some commands but not others -- was that intentional? |
| 04:28.06 | brlcad | ~botmail for mafm: curious that you only added the argc < 1 check to some commands but not others -- was that intentional? |
| 04:28.11 | brlcad | there we go |
| 04:28.19 | brlcad | stupid syntax |
| 04:30.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32502 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (chgmodel.c chgtree.c cmd.c muves.c utility2.c): quell constness warnings |
| 04:30.44 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32503 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/setup.c: fix/update the function sig |
| 04:31.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32504 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (154 files): use the new GED_CHECK_ARGC_GT_0 macro throughout to elimiate the 'invalid command name' block. really belongs in a wrapper, but good enough until there are command categories. |
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| 08:38.30 | brlcad | yawns and wanders on home |
| 09:08.35 | brlcad | yawns and arrives home, ponders foodage |
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| 09:57.10 | Axman6 | hands brlcad some corn chips |
| 10:00.23 | brlcad | :) |
| 10:00.30 | brlcad | munches happily |
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| 10:07.52 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:08.50 | mafm | hi cadheaddies :P |
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| 13:36.17 | starseeker | brlcad: Am I correct that the issue with the libpng/dyld confusion on OSX 10.5 is something that will require a fix from Apple? |
| 13:52.20 | starseeker | glares at nmgs and iges-g |
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| 14:01.42 | brlcad | starseeker: nah, I think there's a way to work around it |
| 14:01.58 | brlcad | but I haven't had my hands on a 10.5 to even try |
| 14:05.33 | starseeker | mmm. So the bug stays open then. |
| 14:05.35 | starseeker | k |
| 14:07.48 | starseeker | heads in |
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| 14:39.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32505 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/autoview.c: "small" is already defined in MS Windows SDK, renamed it to sqrt_small |
| 14:59.39 | prasad1 | usain bolt is the man |
| 14:59.41 | prasad1 | lol |
| 14:59.46 | prasad1 | Bolt tears down the track after Powell and actually finishes in front of the Netherlands. |
| 15:00.31 | clock_ | tightens the kingpin bolt on his skateboard and inserts brand new Powell bearings |
| 15:00.56 | clock_ | USA in bolt |
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| 17:44.31 | mafm | bye bye |
| 17:50.27 | brlcad | looks like he finished the apt packaing: http://groups.google.com/group/linux.debian.bugs.dist/browse_thread/thread/983e8306acd1c080?hl=en |
| 18:27.06 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 18:27.11 | brlcad | andrecastelo: it'd be good to have a couple nice high-quality renderings of where your ray-tracer currently sits for a write-up |
| 18:27.16 | brlcad | ooh, there he be |
| 18:27.20 | brlcad | same for you pacman87 :) |
| 18:27.30 | pacman87 | hmmm? |
| 18:27.43 | brlcad | did you happen to see the guy's comment on the mailing list? |
| 18:28.00 | pacman87 | i've been out of it for the past 24ish hours |
| 18:28.07 | brlcad | it was a few days ago |
| 18:28.17 | pacman87 | checks |
| 18:28.45 | brlcad | it might have been on the forums |
| 18:28.49 | pacman87 | i need to pack to leave in half an hour |
| 18:28.53 | pacman87 | grandmother's funeral |
| 18:28.56 | pacman87 | back sunday |
| 18:29.02 | brlcad | aww, sorry to hear that |
| 18:29.18 | brlcad | forget about it then |
| 18:29.22 | pacman87 | when do i need to finish the final gsoc survey by? |
| 18:29.35 | brlcad | looks |
| 18:30.12 | brlcad | pacman87: looks like the end of the monthh |
| 18:30.26 | brlcad | sept 1st being the eval deadline |
| 18:30.37 | pacman87 | ok, it can wait til i get back |
| 18:32.29 | brlcad | yeah, and what I mentioned isn't for the eval -- it's for a report I'm putting together |
| 18:32.35 | brlcad | for our community and for other gsocers |
| 18:32.51 | pacman87 | ah, ok |
| 18:59.16 | andrecastelo | brlcad: ok, will do! |
| 19:01.45 | brlcad | thx |
| 19:15.21 | andrecastelo | truck rendering: http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/169/truckks2.jpg |
| 19:16.28 | andrecastelo | and this is what happens when shadow was supposed to occur: http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/3701/greycornellra2.jpg and http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bluecornelllp7.jpg (blue was set as the 'shadow') |
| 19:16.36 | brlcad | was more thinking something at 2048x2048, lot more detailed :) |
| 19:17.07 | andrecastelo | and the mlib errors: http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/2043/mliberrorseh9.jpg |
| 19:17.09 | andrecastelo | hm i see |
| 19:18.20 | brlcad | mm, looks like you're going through liboptical now? |
| 19:19.33 | andrecastelo | ``Erik thinks it sets one material for every one |
| 19:20.16 | andrecastelo | i mean, the same material for every region |
| 19:20.35 | brlcad | materials only matter to liboptical, so I take that's a yes? :) |
| 19:21.16 | brlcad | render onto a white background too, that'll print better |
| 19:22.23 | andrecastelo | still, the material set up is similar to rt o.O |
| 19:23.04 | brlcad | yeah, something clearly is amiss there |
| 19:28.41 | ``Erik | more important, it spews mlib errors about missing material with several 'should be there' mats, so yeah, something missing with liboptical interface |
| 19:30.03 | ``Erik | notes that the "parallel issue" is still there and may possibly be a contributing factor? |
| 19:32.31 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: could be, I'll try expanding it |
| 19:37.53 | andrecastelo | notices issues with the file output in rtmlt |
| 19:41.14 | andrecastelo | it may also have something to do with the parallel issue |
| 19:50.42 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: what is that parameter to use more threads? |
| 19:57.27 | ``Erik | -P |
| 19:57.46 | ``Erik | -P8 for example |
| 20:09.14 | brlcad | man rt or brlman rt will list a slew of options that you're getting for free by being an rtui app |
| 20:09.34 | starseeker | brlcad: well, it looks like the region_id bug wasn't a bug after all |
| 20:09.50 | brlcad | what was it? |
| 20:10.30 | starseeker | they had a model that did a nasty subtraction of an entire assembly (tree with multiple regions below the top level) and also included the tree they subtracted - using reid on that tree cause multiple renamings of regions |
| 20:11.02 | starseeker | Dwayne was getting second hand info, apparently - once I got a direct look at it it made sense |
| 20:11.33 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: can you do rtmlt -P4 truck.g g4 and tell me what happens? I've added the bufmode options, and it's drawing nicely with -PX |
| 20:11.49 | starseeker | the correct thing to do would be to fix the model, but since that's unlikely running reid on the individual subtrees should work just fine |
| 20:12.35 | starseeker | if we wanted to we could make reid smart about not changing the region_id of a region more than once in an assignment, but that may or may not satisfy expectations |
| 20:13.30 | brlcad | mm, interesting |
| 20:13.47 | starseeker | they REALLY need to fix their subtractions |
| 20:13.48 | brlcad | reid does just do a simple recursive walk |
| 20:14.07 | starseeker | nods |
| 20:14.19 | brlcad | iirc it builds up a region list before applying changes |
| 20:14.49 | starseeker | hmm. Did its behavior change since 7.10.4? |
| 20:15.02 | starseeker | (they've got an old version linked to stable for some reason) |
| 20:15.20 | brlcad | nope |
| 20:15.24 | starseeker | huh. |
| 20:16.03 | brlcad | yeah, looks like it builds up a final list of regions for all specified tree(s) and then incrementally sets each |
| 20:16.14 | brlcad | in order encountered |
| 20:16.20 | starseeker | does it check for duplicate entries? |
| 20:16.22 | brlcad | so hm, if listed multiple times.. |
| 20:16.36 | starseeker | is 99% sure that's where the trouble is |
| 20:16.52 | starseeker | it did just fine until multiple references crept in |
| 20:17.08 | brlcad | no, it definitely does not |
| 20:17.10 | brlcad | runs a test |
| 20:17.46 | starseeker | Do we want to? it might slow things down on big models |
| 20:20.13 | brlcad | hm, that still doesn't fully explain the 32k limit |
| 20:20.25 | starseeker | I didn't see the 32k limit |
| 20:20.35 | starseeker | I think we were getting confused reporting |
| 20:20.41 | brlcad | so then what was the actual problem? |
| 20:20.47 | brlcad | id's that were larger than they expected? |
| 20:21.08 | brlcad | because my tests are working and are doing what I'd expect -- they just get incremented multiple times |
| 20:21.14 | starseeker | right - or when they looked at a tree and expected 301, 302, 303... and didn't always get it |
| 20:21.37 | starseeker | They might get 301, 302, 311, 304, 322, ... |
| 20:21.38 | brlcad | they'd get 301, 305, 306, 309 etc |
| 20:21.42 | brlcad | sure |
| 20:21.53 | starseeker | I think that's what was doing it |
| 20:22.08 | starseeker | I successfully assigned numbers WAY over 32k |
| 20:22.21 | brlcad | *shrug*, that's not supposed to be a big deal .. the 32k was what sounded like a problem |
| 20:22.36 | starseeker | agreed |
| 20:22.41 | brlcad | there was a 32k limit in one of the fastgen tools, maybe that's what they were getting confused with |
| 20:23.12 | starseeker | could be. When I went over the behavior they presented me with as a problem was as described above |
| 20:24.21 | starseeker | I think up until now they've always had well behaved (or at least xpushed) models that did increment in order |
| 20:26.32 | brlcad | negatives above the region level are usually evil |
| 20:26.55 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: i'll commit, apparently it works. Didn't fix shadow or file output issues |
| 20:27.04 | brlcad | but pretty prevalent unfortunately |
| 20:27.27 | starseeker | was tempted to call the orca guys and offer to fix the model to make the problem go away... |
| 20:30.59 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32506 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewmlt.c: Added BUFMODE support to rtmlt: modified view_pixel() and view_2init(). Added reproject_worker() and reproject_splat(). |
| 20:33.45 | starseeker | closes bug... yay! |
| 20:38.03 | andrecastelo | brlcad: output to file is a little weird. The bigger the image, the bigger the artifacts and problems (more like, the longer the scanlines are shifted to the right) |
| 20:39.05 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 20:39.07 | andrecastelo | s/scanlines/lines of pixels |
| 20:39.44 | brlcad | andrecastelo: sounds like you either have a multithreading I/O bug or you're writing the wrong number of pixels per scanline |
| 20:51.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32507 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/mged/mged_commands.xml: Add note about correction to VOLII example - error is in pdf so will need to be caught/changed when that command is eventually docbooked. |
| 20:53.10 | starseeker | closes VolumeII arced bug |
| 21:19.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32508 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/tclscripts/mged/reid.tcl): (log message trimmed) |
| 21:19.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: add support to get_regions to ignore duplicate regions in the hierarchy so that |
| 21:19.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: get_regions only lists all regions once. this makes it so that reid will |
| 21:19.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: similarly only set the regionID on a region once instead of incrementing it |
| 21:19.12 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: multiple times (if it was, say, subtracted at an assembly level as well as used |
| 21:19.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: elsewhere as a positive region). this fixes an unexpected behavior reported by |
| 21:19.16 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: dwayne et al. also made get_regions work on single regions where the only |
| 21:19.51 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks! |
| 21:28.57 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32509 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/remat.tcl: refactor remat to use get_regions so that it gets the same benefits of only setting the materialID once per region (even if it doesn't change anything). simplifies the implementation a bit anyways. |
| 21:35.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32510 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/remat.tcl: sort the commands by order of use and add db |
| 21:37.18 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32511 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (Makefile.am get_regions.tcl): separate out get_regions into its own file since even though it's an under-the-hood devish command, it's useful stand-alone |
| 21:38.06 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32512 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/reid.tcl: remove get_regions from here since it's used in other places now, remove authorship, list all deps |
| 21:44.43 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32513 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (help.tcl helpdevel.tcl): move get_regions from being a user command to being a developer command. minor rewordings |
| 21:45.52 | brlcad | gets bored poking on Tcl, looks for some C code to play with |
| 21:46.10 | starseeker | heh |
| 21:46.42 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32514 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/help.tcl: oops, save the file first |
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| 22:21.02 | starseeker | brlcad: Looking at the report about attr set region not resulting in attr show printing a region type identification, I think it's because the dp->d_flags type is not changed when attr sets the region attribute. Should attr be automatically spotting the setting of region and changing the flag to DIR_REGION as well? |
| 22:22.08 | starseeker | from what I can tell, it almost looks like MGED is creating a new region combination to replace the old combination when the flag is toggled there, but I'm not sure yet |
| 22:22.34 | starseeker | looks at clock and decides he'd better get a move on |
| 22:54.03 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32515 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.h: stopping the usage of VarDomain class so as to begin support for non-unique solutions |
| 23:06.25 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32516 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVariable.h): removal of VarDomain code, testing addSolution method : only Var pointers transfered between solver and solution |
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| 23:35.17 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32517 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcParameter.cpp pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): passing multiple messages to solution class by modification of the solver, adding numSolutions() method to PCSolver to return the number of solutions found, coding style edits |
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| 09:55.51 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32518 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: merge in the 7.12.6 release notes from the stable branch. alas this will mean some manual fiddling to get useful news2tracker data but it is what it is. |
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| 13:09.54 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32519 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcSolver.h: removing unnecessary for loop resulting in multiple addition of the same solution, generator() changed to include certain boundary cases which were being ignored earlier |
| 13:11.27 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32520 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcVariable.h: addSolution() code, Solution::display() modified, operator== for Domain defined |
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| 14:58.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32521 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcSolver.h: adding a base Solver class which other solvers inherit, Solver has all the common Solver code; Modifying GT and BT Solvers to use addSolution |
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| 16:00.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32522 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVariable.h): adding minimize() and maximize() function to Variable; modifying BTSolver and GTSolver to be more analogous to PCSolver |
| 16:01.24 | brlcad | go go gadget solver |
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| 19:23.07 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32523 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcSolver.h: adding a generic BackTracking solver : independent of BGL |
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| 02:58.57 | starseeker | grins as he sees meld has the nice diff graphics (or at least close enough) that show "flow" from one file to another |
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| 12:51.44 | Axman6 | hmm, sorry for the join spamming :\ |
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| 13:31.41 | mafm | hi folks |
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| 15:26.19 | *** join/#brlcad Mouette (n=root@fw1.phys.sinica.edu.tw) | |
| 15:26.56 | Mouette | i notice this:http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=2177261&forum_id=362510 |
| 15:28.12 | Mouette | Maybe my build method is not good |
| 15:34.14 | Mouette | you tell him: mv /opt/BRL-CAD to /usr/local/ |
| 15:36.12 | Mouette | This is my error method that build package: first compile and install to /usr/local and then make package by using /usr/local to /opt |
| 15:38.01 | mafm | huh, what are you trying to do? |
| 15:39.06 | Mouette | you means? |
| 15:41.02 | mafm | I'm no expert, but I think that you cannot move the installed files from one place to another |
| 15:41.35 | mafm | there might be hardcoded paths in some places and so on, so if you move the installed files elsewhere, those hardcoded paths won't work |
| 15:43.15 | mafm | think of the paths that brlcad-config returns, in example |
| 15:43.31 | Mouette | But when the package install my test system, it is normal |
| 15:43.57 | Mouette | my test system is a pure system |
| 15:44.34 | Mouette | so remove those package in sourceforge |
| 15:45.02 | Mouette | then i repackge |
| 15:45.17 | mafm | I think that brlcad has to do that, I don't think that I have permission to remove packages |
| 15:49.15 | mafm | "You cannot perform file release operations on this project." |
| 15:49.44 | mafm | (nor I should, since I never took care of that and know the policies about releases :) ) |
| 16:04.42 | brlcad | Mouette: we didn't tell him to move anything -- they said they moved it |
| 16:05.45 | brlcad | you can relocate the install like they suggest, but it will mean that some things won't work like you'd expect |
| 16:06.03 | brlcad | and you'll have to define to env vars to get some things to work in the relocated place |
| 16:06.59 | brlcad | Mouette: what it sounded like is that you did the same thing again where you compiled once with a prefix of one thing and then you compiled/installed again using a different prefix -- so it was messed up |
| 16:07.20 | brlcad | they fixed it by making a symlink, but you gotta stop doing that :) |
| 16:08.37 | mafm | brlcad: It's sunday, don't come to work :P |
| 16:08.46 | brlcad | and we don't remove releases, it is what it is |
| 16:09.20 | brlcad | mafm: why not? not that I planned on it :) |
| 16:10.45 | mafm | it's holy day, you shouldn't work on lord's day :P |
| 16:11.45 | brlcad | doesn't work, he plays |
| 16:11.55 | mafm | :D |
| 16:12.05 | brlcad | is it still work if you really do enjoy it so much :) |
| 16:12.07 | mafm | chatting from lab's 'pooter too... |
| 16:13.21 | brlcad | that said, I do need to be packing .. this is going to be one heck of a busy week |
| 16:15.40 | mafm | :D |
| 16:15.44 | mafm | me too |
| 16:15.53 | mafm | it seems that I'm staying in the lab in the end |
| 16:16.11 | mafm | but I wanted to find a new apartment and move in these following 5 days :) |
| 16:16.39 | mafm | (me continuing in the lab is positive for BRL-CAD, I guess) |
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| 16:18.24 | brlcad | ah, so moving at the same time :) |
| 16:18.52 | mafm | are you moving too? |
| 16:18.54 | brlcad | yep |
| 16:19.12 | mafm | I already did most of the packing, I don't have much anyway |
| 16:19.16 | Mouette | i have modify the pkginfo and let it install to the same place with build binary: /usr/local, Maybe this is the simplest method, now i have reuploading 7.12.6 |
| 16:19.23 | brlcad | cops are getting too close, gotta keep them searching |
| 16:19.34 | Mouette | now i modify 7.12.4's |
| 16:19.54 | brlcad | Mouette: 7.12.6 is posted .. wait for 7.12.8/7.14.0 :) |
| 16:19.56 | mafm | lol |
| 16:20.40 | brlcad | we don't replace binaries that have already gone out (ever), that's just asking for release maintenance problems |
| 16:20.49 | mafm | not a problem of the cops, but I don't have TV or almost anything beyond the (now fscked up) laptop, and a few pieces of furniture |
| 16:21.01 | brlcad | unless there is some serious security issue |
| 16:21.16 | brlcad | even then it's just marked hidden or incremented on a sub-patch |
| 16:21.51 | brlcad | mafm: that's nice .. I have way too much stuff for my comfort (and I'm a pack rat) |
| 16:22.52 | brlcad | my tv is actually my biggest problem atm .. it's way too big for one person to move |
| 16:23.00 | mafm | :D |
| 16:23.04 | mafm | I don't even have TV :) |
| 16:23.07 | brlcad | s/big/heavy/ |
| 16:23.37 | brlcad | I can carry a 14" couch on my back, but that tv is a beast |
| 16:23.38 | mafm | well, I was in a permanent state of indecision for the last couple of years, I'm trying to get to some place that I can call home |
| 16:23.42 | brlcad | and I do hate asking for help |
| 16:23.46 | mafm | that's also why I don't have many things :) |
| 16:24.18 | mafm | TV from Hell! |
| 16:24.32 | brlcad | I've not staying in one place for more than three years for more than a decade |
| 16:24.59 | mafm | so you have experience in packing, yep :P |
| 16:25.25 | brlcad | closer to two decades i suppose... |
| 16:25.33 | mafm | this was my first residence (apart from weeks outside etc) out of parent's home though |
| 16:28.26 | mafm | "8. How much time have you spent working on your SoC project since the midterm evaluation, on average? |
| 16:28.27 | mafm | 0 - 5 hours per week / 6 - 10 hours per week / 10 - 15 hours per week / More than 15 hours per week" |
| 16:28.29 | mafm | :D |
| 16:28.41 | mafm | I would have though that they put somewhat higher values |
| 16:28.45 | mafm | like x3 :) |
| 16:30.57 | brlcad | yeah, but think of it more like an optional choice quiz: all options except one are wrong |
| 16:31.11 | brlcad | so if you answer one of the others, you get reviewed more closely to see what's wrong |
| 16:31.51 | mafm | who submits the final evaluation, Bob? |
| 16:31.57 | brlcad | yep |
| 16:32.01 | mafm | nobody started yet |
| 16:32.01 | brlcad | or me |
| 16:32.11 | brlcad | we've not started yet |
| 16:32.23 | brlcad | 7 days for that too |
| 16:32.36 | mafm | I see |
| 16:32.43 | brlcad | should be done/started by Wed |
| 16:32.57 | brlcad | have some discussions and deliberations |
| 16:33.09 | mafm | I want to finish this ASAP to focus on the apartment for the rest of the week |
| 16:40.10 | mafm | do you still have to discuss about the evaluations? |
| 16:46.17 | brlcad | of course |
| 16:46.50 | brlcad | what else? |
| 16:46.54 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:49.31 | mafm | am I going to get my t-shirt? |
| 16:49.44 | mafm | or not known yet? |
| 16:50.02 | mafm | the t-shirt is much nicer this year than the previous year |
| 16:50.05 | mafm | :P |
| 16:59.43 | mafm | (submited and revised) |
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| 19:32.57 | brlcad | mafm: nice summary |
| 19:33.18 | mafm | brlcad: thanks :) |
| 19:49.47 | pacman87 | is finally back, needs to unwind |
| 19:54.03 | mafm | welcome back, pacman87 |
| 20:48.18 | mafm | I go home, take care pplz :) |
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| 21:42.43 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32524 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/librt/librt.vcproj: Added pnts.c to the build. |
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| 00:13.01 | brlcad | tires of packing |
| 00:34.15 | Ralith | where you off to this time? |
| 00:39.33 | brlcad | dunno that yet :) |
| 00:39.43 | brlcad | closer to the city |
| 00:40.09 | Ralith | you're already packing but you don't know where to? O.o |
| 00:53.45 | brlcad | yup |
| 00:54.22 | brlcad | figure i'll shove some stuff in storage, keep some essentials with me, and stay in a hotel until I find something better |
| 00:56.30 | Ralith | why the move? Tired of commuting, or something? |
| 01:10.59 | pacman87 | brlcad: sounds a lot like moving into a dorm room |
| 01:24.16 | brlcad | Ralith: nah, just getting back to my roots in a way (I grew up in big cities) |
| 01:24.31 | Ralith | ah. |
| 01:24.42 | brlcad | i've been in suburbia ever since college and been rather dissatisfied with where I've been |
| 01:24.58 | brlcad | current place is actually *really* close to work, just a few miles |
| 01:25.25 | brlcad | that's why I came here, was just for a year or two (now three, so I'm fed up) |
| 01:25.40 | brlcad | pacman87: I loved dorm life :) |
| 01:26.34 | brlcad | not that i'm moving back into that crappy or small place though :) |
| 01:26.59 | brlcad | just something closer to baltimore, maybe on the water if I can find something nice not too far off |
| 01:27.37 | brlcad | found a really nice house on the water but it's like an hour from work, so that'd suck |
| 01:30.59 | pacman87 | brlcad: just dress up a dummy in your seat, and SSH in for everything :) |
| 01:32.14 | brlcad | i do that already ;) |
| 01:32.29 | pacman87 | is still getting used to having 37.5% of his former screen real estate |
| 01:46.09 | Ralith | wonders just how much screen real estate pacman87 used to have |
| 01:50.26 | pacman87 | 4480x1050 |
| 01:50.37 | Ralith | O.O |
| 01:50.39 | pacman87 | now just 1680x1050 |
| 01:50.44 | pacman87 | before was three monitors |
| 01:51.10 | Ralith | epic workstation much? |
| 01:51.21 | pacman87 | https://webspace.utexas.edu/trv82/www/work.jpg |
| 02:06.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03n_reed * r32525 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/make.c librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c mged/typein.c): added mged make/in support for point primitive: [make|in] <name> pnts |
| 02:10.39 | Ralith | nice |
| 05:27.20 | brlcad | way to go simon clubley! |
| 05:27.25 | brlcad | that's some good debugging |
| 05:30.50 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32526 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: use the SSE var so it can be overridden |
| 05:41.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32527 10/brlcad/trunk/ (AUTHORS NEWS configure.ac): (log message trimmed) |
| 05:41.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: simon clubly on the brlcad-users mailing list reported and isolated a rather |
| 05:41.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: nasty bug that was causing an 'Illegal instruction' from rt during ray-tracing. |
| 05:41.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: the cause was pin-pointed down to sse instructions getting executed on non-sse |
| 05:41.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: hardware, with gcc generating the code due to the -msse and -msse2 flags |
| 05:41.42 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: regardless of the local system's capacity to run that code (e.g. for |
| 05:41.44 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: cross-compiling). commenting out those flags for now (as it's not required) and |
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| 11:42.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32528 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/dbip.c: Mods to fix a compile time error: duplicate case value |
| 11:45.41 | mafm | hi ppl |
| 12:13.29 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:38.13 | mafm | about to go Robin-Hood with apartment owners :P |
| 13:34.59 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32529 10/brlcad/trunk/ (16 files in 5 dirs): Added plot, put_comb, putmat, qvrot, red, rfarb, savekey and get_comb functions to libged. Also modified libtclcad/ged_obj to use them. |
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| 14:14.44 | brlcad | mafm: happy trails |
| 14:19.15 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32530 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (8 files): Added call to GED_CHECK_ARGC_GT_0. |
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| 14:19.46 | andrecastelo | morning guys |
| 14:19.52 | mafm | hi andrecastelo |
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| 14:20.23 | andrecastelo | good afternoon, mafm :D |
| 14:22.45 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo |
| 14:23.00 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 14:23.21 | ``Erik | ohayo gozaimasu |
| 14:23.33 | ``Erik | o'genki desu ka? |
| 14:24.54 | ``Erik | nippongo o hanasemasen ka? |
| 14:25.00 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:25.17 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: genki desu |
| 14:25.19 | andrecastelo | domo arigato |
| 14:26.39 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: ç§ã¯æ¥æ¬èªã話ã |
| 14:26.46 | mafm | ? |
| 14:27.01 | mafm | go wash your mouth, you sinners! |
| 14:27.02 | brlcad | they've both just been sipping the happy juice |
| 14:27.18 | andrecastelo | hahaha |
| 14:27.54 | andrecastelo | brlcad: i've been able to output images only up to 1280x1024, that's why using pix-fb -s 2048 resulted in errors o.O |
| 14:28.45 | brlcad | mlrt -s2048 -o somefile.pix isn't doing its job? |
| 14:29.02 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32531 10/rt^3/trunk/src/coreInterface/ConstDatabase.cpp: handle possible exceptions and return values coming from the callback objects |
| 14:29.33 | andrecastelo | let me get a paste |
| 14:32.28 | andrecastelo | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/wZalek33.html |
| 14:32.48 | andrecastelo | i forgot the address of BRL-CAD's exclusive paste bin :S |
| 14:35.28 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/ |
| 14:35.54 | ``Erik | thinks there should be copious cnames like pastebin.brlcad.org paste.brlcad.org etc :D |
| 14:36.10 | ``Erik | pasties.brlcad.org O.o *duck* |
| 14:36.42 | brlcad | there are, just apache isn't configured to do anything atm |
| 14:36.57 | ``Erik | ah, waiting on migration for that? |
| 14:37.05 | andrecastelo | there you go http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d2d99158c |
| 14:37.09 | brlcad | rather, not a cname, but points to the ip already |
| 14:38.03 | brlcad | andrecastelo: what's that showing other than a somewhat slow rtfm :) |
| 14:38.26 | brlcad | i see the output file, but that's useless without the command line |
| 14:39.01 | andrecastelo | sorry, i used 'rtmlt -s 2048 -o test.pix truck.g g4' |
| 14:40.31 | brlcad | hm, then yeah .. that looks like a bug that you should find/fix ;) |
| 14:40.54 | brlcad | i think that's come up before with other rtuif apps, but don't recall the problem or the fix |
| 14:41.50 | andrecastelo | ah ok, thought it was something wrong with the rtuif common files |
| 14:43.02 | brlcad | it may be |
| 14:43.22 | brlcad | there's no info as to where/what it is at this point |
| 14:59.49 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32532 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/red.c: only need to check argc>0 once |
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| 19:15.24 | mafm | I'm going home, take care |
| 19:17.23 | *** part/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-46-48.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
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| 20:07.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32533 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: |
| 20:07.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Check attributes as well as d_flags when determing if object is a region in |
| 20:07.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: wdb_attr_cmd's show option - should be handled at a lower level in some fashion |
| 20:07.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: since the file shows correct info without this when mged is restarted, but for |
| 20:07.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: now this fixes the labeling issue. |
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| 21:39.01 | kylecorbitt | hello |
| 21:39.27 | kylecorbitt | looking at mafm's wiki page he says he sent out a summary email with what he's done/future potential to the dev list |
| 21:39.46 | kylecorbitt | I'm very interested in his project - is there any way for me to get a copy of that? |
| 21:40.19 | kylecorbitt | (better yet would be to put it on the wiki, I think there would be other people interested in that too) |
| 21:44.50 | brlcad | starseeker: tis user-visible |
| 21:45.09 | starseeker | brlcad: I know, but I'm trying to do it better |
| 21:45.17 | starseeker | brlcad: tops and t are still busted |
| 21:46.17 | brlcad | kylecorbitt: the mailing list archives will have it soon if not already |
| 21:46.23 | brlcad | and the list is mirrored on gmane as well |
| 21:47.00 | kylecorbitt | brlcad: where is the list archive? |
| 21:48.54 | kylecorbitt | nvm, found it |
| 21:48.55 | kylecorbitt | thanks |
| 21:50.03 | starseeker | brlcad: what's the right way to do dp->d_flags = DIR_REGION & ~(RT_DIR_INMEM); |
| 21:50.17 | starseeker | If I try that I get a bu_assert_long failure |
| 21:53.38 | starseeker | whoops, hang on... |
| 22:01.22 | starseeker | grrrr |
| 22:29.55 | starseeker | brlcad: I'm at something of a loss - setting the dp->d_flags directly is what the db_diradd command does, but when I do it on an already existing object it behaves strangely. |
| 22:48.01 | starseeker | Ah - HA! |
| 22:53.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32534 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: |
| 22:53.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Revert previous d_flags related check - instead, explicitly set the flags for |
| 22:53.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: the current object when the region flag is either added with argument R or |
| 22:53.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: removed. This is so far robust for the attr show, tops and t -r commands |
| 22:55.13 | starseeker | does happy dance |
| 22:58.24 | starseeker | now the NEWS file can be updated |
| 23:04.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32535 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 23:04.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Addressed bug 1918098 reported by David Loman identifying conflicting reports |
| 23:04.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: about object type when the region attribute was set with the attr command - code |
| 23:04.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: in BRL-CAD using the dp->d_flags mechanism to identify type without being aware |
| 23:04.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: of the region attribute would report the object as a combination. attr now sets |
| 23:04.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: the proper flags when the region attribute is either added or removed. |
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| 01:32.41 | brlcad | starseeker: not sure that fully will do it, don't want to unset flags that might already be set |
| 01:32.48 | brlcad | just want to make sure those two flags are set |
| 01:33.04 | brlcad | so probably should be an |= |
| 01:33.31 | brlcad | |= (DIR_REGION | DIR_COMB) or whatever it is |
| 01:33.42 | starseeker | OK, I'll give that a test |
| 01:33.43 | brlcad | er |
| 01:34.12 | brlcad | |= (DIR_REGION & DIR_COMB) .. might want to make sure the bit-logic is right ;) |
| 01:34.28 | starseeker | doesn't quite understand the bit logic... |
| 01:34.31 | brlcad | er, I had that right the first time, jeez |
| 01:34.36 | starseeker | thought so |
| 01:34.50 | starseeker | let me check in something quick, and I'll test that out |
| 01:35.57 | brlcad | the only thing that comes to mind presently would be an inmem object, which I don't know how you'd get at one via attr |
| 01:36.27 | brlcad | but that's the sort of detail that becomes a *really* obscure nasty hard bug to find several years later when someone does make it possible |
| 01:36.27 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32536 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Add -nonstd and -shader options to attr command to list all objects with nonstandard attributes and all objects with shaders. |
| 01:37.52 | brlcad | blech, those aren't really generalized |
| 01:39.01 | brlcad | seriously need a 'find' command |
| 01:39.25 | starseeker | I can roll it back if you want - I was just looking at Dwayne's feature request in the tracker |
| 01:40.41 | brlcad | I know, it's been requested for years .. it's just a small can of worms |
| 01:42.49 | starseeker | The |= looks OK for adding the region attribute, but doesn't hack it for deleting |
| 01:43.20 | starseeker | Is there a "remove DIR_REGION" operation? |
| 01:44.26 | brlcad | it'll be something like & ~(DIR_REGION) |
| 01:44.36 | brlcad | you and the negation |
| 01:44.50 | brlcad | that unsets just that bit |
| 01:45.22 | brlcad | which is what you saw earlier: dp->d_flags = DIR_REGION & ~(RT_DIR_INMEM); |
| 01:45.30 | starseeker | Ah |
| 01:45.37 | brlcad | setting region and unsetting the inmem bit if it was set |
| 01:46.00 | brlcad | actually not quite in that case since it's just = |
| 01:46.18 | brlcad | same across the DIR_REGION value though |
| 01:47.14 | brlcad | that dp->d_flags = DIR_REGION & ~(RT_DIR_INMEM) line is mildly suspicious actually |
| 01:47.34 | brlcad | stops thinking about it |
| 01:47.53 | starseeker | So you're thinking dp->d_flags |= DIR_COMB & ~(DIR_REGION); |
| 01:50.29 | starseeker | whoops, that doesn't do it... |
| 01:54.38 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32537 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: fine tuning the setting of the d_flags for attr |
| 01:55.32 | brlcad | more like dp->d_flags = dp->d_flags & ~(DIR_REGION) |
| 01:55.48 | starseeker | brlcad: should I revert the nonstd and shaders options? |
| 01:56.03 | brlcad | I think you should write a find command |
| 01:56.29 | brlcad | would be the greatest new command addition, deprecating out a dozen or so others |
| 01:56.57 | brlcad | then having those sorts of customized searches fits in pattern-wize |
| 01:57.08 | starseeker | nods. |
| 01:57.22 | starseeker | OK, let me untangle the patch quick... |
| 01:57.25 | brlcad | i now, it's more work an dyou were looking for th equick fix |
| 01:57.40 | brlcad | jeez, i must be tired |
| 01:57.54 | starseeker | blinks |
| 01:58.03 | starseeker | come again? |
| 01:58.20 | brlcad | i mean.. i know, it's more work and you were looking for a quick fix |
| 01:58.24 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 01:59.05 | starseeker | looked simple and I thought it would look good to kill such a long standing request, but I shoulda know there was a reason ;-) |
| 01:59.13 | brlcad | if it's any incentive, though, the need comes up several times every year |
| 02:02.06 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32538 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: Remove -nonstd & -shader options for attr per Sean - need a more general find command as a solution. |
| 02:02.13 | starseeker | I think that pulls it out |
| 02:02.50 | starseeker | will look into a find command tomorrow |
| 02:02.55 | brlcad | find / -region no |
| 02:03.25 | brlcad | find / -not -stdattr |
| 02:06.34 | brlcad | find /path/to/assembly -not -regex '.*\.r' -name '*_left" -delete |
| 02:06.46 | brlcad | such a powerful command :) |
| 02:07.15 | starseeker | gets the feeling this is more than a one day command |
| 02:07.55 | brlcad | in this case, it's be worth a month if you ended up with the command |
| 02:08.12 | starseeker | ok :-) |
| 02:09.16 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32539 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: a few more wdb_attr_cmd cleanups |
| 02:09.45 | starseeker | OK, I think that gets us to "just what's needed to fix the attr show & t -r & tops behavior" |
| 02:10.07 | starseeker | should read the find manual in depth now... |
| 02:10.27 | starseeker | sorry to rush in headlong on the attr options brlcad |
| 02:10.44 | brlcad | could put a todo (in src or TODO if it's worth it) for whatever the next step is |
| 02:11.17 | brlcad | no need to be sorry |
| 02:11.34 | starseeker | k. I'm also going to make a note on Dwayne's bug so someone else doesn't fall into the same trap |
| 02:11.36 | brlcad | i never actually said pull it .. it just really is a can of worms :) |
| 02:11.44 | brlcad | i just would complain a lot |
| 02:11.53 | starseeker | heh - I noticed ;-) |
| 02:12.26 | starseeker | but it would be user visible, which means I'd have to admit it's there, which means it would become a barnicle to be scraped off once find is written ;-) |
| 02:12.39 | starseeker | so the solution is to write find quickly |
| 02:12.43 | brlcad | a new find command is actually pretty exciting |
| 02:14.55 | starseeker | once libregex and searching the database are in hand it should be mainly a question of lots of syntax support, correct? |
| 02:15.16 | starseeker | i.e., those options were in essense (very) small pieces of what will ultimately be needed? |
| 02:15.19 | brlcad | if I could only have one unix-command and I had a filesystem full of data to manage, find would probably be it |
| 02:16.08 | starseeker | that's a pretty compelling argument |
| 02:16.17 | brlcad | first off, though -- do you know how to use find yourself already? |
| 02:16.34 | starseeker | not well - that's why my first stop will be the find man page for an in-depth read |
| 02:16.36 | brlcad | if not, you should probably take a couple days and learn it first |
| 02:17.13 | starseeker | senses a docbook doc at the end of this... my sympathies to brlcad in advance ;-) |
| 02:18.27 | starseeker | Ah, well - at least one bug was closed. |
| 02:19.36 | brlcad | find / -name \*\.r -exec cp {} {}.bak \; -exec facetize {}.bot {} \; |
| 02:19.46 | brlcad | whoosh! .. damn will that be powerful |
| 02:20.40 | brlcad | and you can probably even find a bsd implementation that you could start from |
| 02:20.55 | starseeker | that will help :-) |
| 02:21.26 | brlcad | but yeah, to your earlier question -- you basically end up needing to write a pretty flexible argument parser for the syntax/options and then little snippets of logic for each rule |
| 02:22.18 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32540 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add TODO item for BRL-CAD find command |
| 02:22.21 | brlcad | the arguments just become a filter/stream/stack/whatever on objects and then there are optional actions (with the default being "print it") |
| 02:22.35 | brlcad | wasn't already in there? |
| 02:22.46 | starseeker | didn't see it |
| 02:22.49 | starseeker | looks agin |
| 02:22.51 | brlcad | huh, k |
| 02:23.12 | starseeker | just grepped for "find" |
| 02:23.33 | starseeker | brain fried ;-) |
| 02:23.56 | starseeker | was actually quite pleased to get even the limited searches working, so find should be Fun :-) |
| 02:24.46 | starseeker | idly wonders if it's possible to have a find syntax for "all objects inside box" |
| 02:25.18 | brlcad | probably even worthy of a dev doc on the wiki to sort out just which options to find you intend to implement first |
| 02:25.34 | starseeker | nods - sounds good |
| 02:25.44 | brlcad | since there are too many to implement all of them, some that can't be implemented, and a few brl-cad specific ones that would be needed |
| 02:27.11 | starseeker | has evil thought - have a "find_box" object in MGED, movable like any arb8, and then have a find option to list all objects inside that box, wherever the box is a the time the find command is run |
| 02:29.14 | brlcad | yeah, that'd probably fall into the third category |
| 02:29.18 | brlcad | geometry-specific options |
| 02:29.44 | brlcad | find / -bbox x1,y1,z1,x2,y2,z2 |
| 02:29.57 | starseeker | :-) |
| 02:30.38 | starseeker | that could help when pruning meshes - "execute a kill on all meshes inside this box" |
| 02:30.49 | starseeker | or mesh points rather |
| 02:31.29 | brlcad | find / -bbox x1,y1,z1,x2,y2,z2 -type bot -exec kill {} \; |
| 02:32.10 | starseeker | has a feeling Dwayne would be doing scary scary stuff with that kind of power ;-) |
| 02:32.33 | brlcad | it's uber powerful scripting without all the scripting |
| 02:34.38 | brlcad | the remat command could have been a simple find one-liner, find assembly -type region -exec attr set {} material_id 10 \; |
| 02:35.37 | brlcad | course the really frequently used commands still have brevity and simplicity on their side, as remat does in that case: remat assembly 10 |
| 02:35.58 | starseeker | create colored object lines through a model: find / nirt -b -e dir 10 10 10 -type region -exec mater shader rgb 255/255/255 {} \; or some such :-) |
| 02:36.02 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:36.23 | brlcad | but it's *very* specific to that action only, if I want even the slightest variant (maybe set the los), I can't |
| 02:36.47 | starseeker | heck, some of those commands could become wrappers around the find command |
| 02:37.05 | starseeker | might simplify the code a bit |
| 02:38.19 | brlcad | yep |
| 02:39.16 | starseeker | OK, I'm sold - and there's a feature request so I'm technically doing a help desk support task :-) |
| 02:42.28 | starseeker | alright, time to go home and get some sleep :-) |
| 02:42.46 | starseeker | later all! (and thanks brlcad, particularly with the "|=" syntax) |
| 02:47.09 | brlcad | cheers |
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| 04:13.30 | yukonbob | peeks in |
| 04:21.07 | brlcad | pees in |
| 04:27.07 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32541 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/nirt.c: ws and comma style cleanup |
| 04:28.22 | yukonbob | heh |
| 04:28.32 | yukonbob | how's it going my friend? |
| 04:28.45 | yukonbob | ~lart puddles |
| 04:28.45 | ibot | puts on a hockey mask and jumps out at puddles |
| 04:29.29 | brlcad | tired |
| 04:30.02 | brlcad | all reading and no coding make jack tired |
| 04:31.43 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32542 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/sfiles/ (csv-gap.nrt csv.nrt default.nrt gap1.nrt gap2.nrt): poor man alignment .. probably should just have the alignment and use the file name or another line in the file for the name. then the alignment could be automatic.. |
| 04:43.39 | PrezKennedy | waves to yukonbob and brlcad |
| 04:46.09 | yukonbob | hello, PrezKennedy |
| 04:46.17 | PrezKennedy | howdy |
| 04:49.53 | brlcad | waves back to PrezKennedy |
| 04:51.17 | brlcad | awesome, barely any grammar/punct changes this time .. janine must have caught them beforehand or he's wising up to their placement.. |
| 05:50.07 | brlcad | finishes reviewing yonder minibook about nirt |
| 05:50.23 | brlcad | nicely done starseeker .. lots of comments |
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| 07:50.34 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32543 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
| 07:55.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32544 10/rt^3/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): we don't need an extra pointer to the database's title |
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| 11:13.09 | starseeker | brlcad: Thanks :-) |
| 11:13.18 | starseeker | brlcad: Janine caught them |
| 11:15.36 | starseeker | has a ways to go in that department, unfortunately... |
| 11:36.49 | mafm | hi pplz |
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| 12:05.54 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32545 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/edit_solid_int.tcl: This fixes bug 2040395 "tra in console mode produces error" |
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| 12:18.06 | andrecastelo | morning guys |
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| 14:21.47 | ``Erik | morning, andre :) |
| 14:38.05 | starseeker | <PROTECTED> |
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| 15:13.10 | andrecastelo | hi |
| 15:13.39 | andrecastelo | hi ``Erik.. did you test the rtmlt parallel stuff? |
| 15:15.02 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 15:19.18 | ``Erik | not yet, updating stuff right now, I can give it a quick whirl |
| 15:20.45 | ``Erik | still fruity |
| 15:20.47 | ``Erik | http://brlcad.org/~erik/mlt.png |
| 15:22.05 | ``Erik | that was with: rtmlt -F/dev/Xl -o mlt.png /usr/brlcad/share/db/moss.g all.g |
| 15:22.26 | ``Erik | with -P1, I get http://brlcad.org/~erik/mltP1.png |
| 15:27.33 | andrecastelo | ``Erik: aww :/ |
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| 16:46.01 | mafm | go network admins, go |
| 17:09.15 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32546 10/brlcad/trunk/ (17 files in 4 dirs): Added the following new functions to libged: ged_3ptarb, ged_analyze, ged_arb, ged_bev, ged_bot_condense, ged_bot_face_fuse, ged_bot_merge, ged_bot_split and ged_bot_vertex_fuse |
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| 23:49.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32547 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (8 files): add a slew of additional mged_players protections throughout where it was being used without checking if it existed |
| 23:53.08 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32548 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 23:53.08 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: bob fixed sf bug 2040395 'tra in console mode produces error' where mged was |
| 23:53.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: trying to update the display manager if you went into edit mode on an object |
| 23:53.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: without checking if mged is being run in graphical mode (i.e. whether there are |
| 23:53.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: any mged_players to talk to). |
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| 10:41.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32549 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
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| 16:32.00 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32550 10/brlcad/trunk/src/nirt/parse_fmt.c: Add check to avoid overwriting pre-existing files in NIRT's dest command. |
| 16:35.35 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32551 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: nirt's dest command no longer overwrites files - it uses bu_file_exists to check if the file already exists. |
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| 17:46.47 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 17:49.36 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32552 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: consistency, use lowercase on all commands except mged. nirt's dest command no longer overwrites files - it uses bu_file_exists to check if the file already exists. (by cliff) |
| 17:57.25 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32553 10/brlcad/trunk/ (15 files in 5 dirs): Added the following functions to libged: ged_copymat, ged_cpi, ged_decompose, ged_delay, ged_eac, ged_edcolor and ged_glob. |
| 18:11.42 | brlcad | mm, so a waiting list for more than 2 mentor attendees |
| 18:11.47 | brlcad | (at the gsoc summit) |
| 18:22.07 | mafm | humm? |
| 18:27.30 | brlcad | details about the mentor summit came out today |
| 18:28.01 | mafm | you lucky mentors :P |
| 18:28.13 | brlcad | tis great fun :) |
| 18:30.06 | brlcad | project leads and devs from most of the top open source projects and organizations all getting together |
| 18:30.15 | brlcad | to talk about open source, gsoc, our students, ... |
| 18:30.38 | brlcad | pretty much bigger than oscon by the simple nature that google pays to bring everyone together |
| 18:31.55 | mafm | project leads? |
| 18:32.13 | mafm | I don't know if for the most prominent projects the leads are involved.. :D |
| 18:36.22 | poolio | howdy all |
| 18:37.38 | brlcad | mafm: not for all projects of course |
| 18:37.44 | brlcad | but for a heck of a lot of them |
| 18:37.52 | brlcad | core devs for most of them regardless |
| 18:38.48 | brlcad | and last year it was three per org so there was a pretty good chance representation for most orgs |
| 18:39.07 | mafm | >:| |
| 18:39.18 | mafm | you lucky b... :D |
| 18:40.17 | brlcad | aside from getting new developers that actually *stay* with the project and remain involved, the mentor summit is probably the secondary highlight of the entire program |
| 18:40.23 | brlcad | for mentors/orgs at least |
| 18:42.30 | brlcad | I can talk directly with the blender devs (the ones I don't see at siggraph), talk with the netbsd lead that works on our coverity scan face-to-face, have a drink with the Haiku devs and figure out how close they are for porting brl-cad/bzflag, meet up with ogre lead yet again to see what he's up to |
| 18:43.22 | brlcad | it's an excellent networking festival and lots of commonality -- almost everyone there is just like everyone else, highly passionate about open source |
| 18:44.21 | mafm | >>>:|||| |
| 18:44.29 | mafm | don't tell any more! |
| 18:46.46 | brlcad | I recommended having some sort of showcase/ranking/summit for students last year |
| 18:47.20 | brlcad | but leslie really didn't want to get the students into a competitive mindset |
| 18:47.45 | brlcad | and there's no way they could afford to send/reward all of them (more than they do already with shirts/swag) |
| 18:49.45 | mafm | yep, it's not bad at all, but I love traveling :) |
| 18:49.57 | brlcad | yeah, me too |
| 18:49.59 | mafm | hopes to go to Turkey on Sept 22 |
| 18:50.28 | brlcad | If I could travel all the time (at least more than just the handful times a year I do now).. hot damn would I be a happy camper |
| 18:52.56 | mafm | handful times... sigh |
| 18:53.03 | mafm | I travel once every few years :P |
| 18:53.30 | mafm | anyway, going home now, have to pack some things and go to the cinema |
| 18:53.34 | mafm | see you :) |
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| 20:28.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32554 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/README: some minor dev notes |
| 21:14.57 | ``Erik | wtf did they do to my poor machine |
| 00:12.13 | ``Erik | howdy, andre |
| 00:21.35 | ``Erik | jabs starseeker with something sharp until he notices |
| 00:42.33 | andrecastelo | howdy ``Erik |
| 00:42.35 | andrecastelo | :D |
| 00:47.30 | starseeker | what am I supposed to notice? |
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| 02:09.00 | ``Erik | um, map vs mapcar, |
| 02:09.16 | ``Erik | map has a stupid 'output' type, where mapcar does what you'd expect map to? |
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| 06:56.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32555 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
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| 10:38.01 | mafm | hi |
| 10:38.05 | brlcad | howdy! |
| 10:38.46 | brlcad | debates whether to present at the tcl/tk conference |
| 10:39.01 | mafm | to present what? |
| 10:39.19 | brlcad | something :) |
| 10:39.33 | brlcad | anything, whether to do it at all |
| 10:39.40 | brlcad | would have to write up the abstract today |
| 10:39.50 | mafm | suggests something about COBOL bindings for Tcl/Tk |
| 10:40.13 | brlcad | heh, it'd be about brl-cad use of tcl/tk |
| 10:40.24 | brlcad | just don't know which aspect specifically atm |
| 10:40.47 | mafm | :) |
| 10:41.04 | mafm | you only do that because of traveling :P |
| 10:41.18 | brlcad | heh |
| 10:41.27 | Ralith | I'll bet some conferences have pretty good food, too, though. |
| 10:41.35 | brlcad | is that not a good reason in itself? :) |
| 10:41.52 | brlcad | Ralith: and parties, can't forget the parties |
| 10:42.08 | Ralith | parties are simply a higher level construct atop the base necessity of food. |
| 10:42.17 | brlcad | but actually, the tcl/tk conf. is only about 100mi away, just outside DC |
| 10:42.47 | brlcad | Ralith: sometimes the 'food' at parties is purely in a liquid form though ;) |
| 10:43.06 | clock_ | Ralith: aren't parties the base necessity of socialization? |
| 10:43.48 | Ralith | clock_: so long as the socialization produces food ^^ |
| 10:46.33 | mafm | hi Ralith, howdy |
| 10:47.06 | mafm | loves liquid food |
| 10:47.59 | Ralith | hullo |
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| 15:42.15 | brlcad | argles |
| 15:47.09 | mafm | brlcad: is there anything else left to close the gsoc project other than submitting the code? |
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| 17:41.24 | mafm | see you folks :) |
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| 18:13.36 | ``Erik | "programming is like sex. make one mistake and support it for the rest of your life." *snicker* |
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| 19:19.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32559 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Add note about long term goal of having a plugin system for BRL-CAD. |
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| 19:45.37 | ``Erik | kicks emacs |
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| 10:29.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32560 10/rt^3/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): the core of ray trace |
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| 12:57.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32561 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged.c: |
| 12:57.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Making sure ged_log and ged_result_string will initially contain an empty string |
| 12:57.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: instead of a null pointer (I wrongly assumed that bu_vls_init did this :-( ). |
| 12:57.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: This way, any callers of libged functions can harvest ged_log or ged_result_str |
| 12:57.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: without the need to check whether or not it contains a null pointer (i.e. it |
| 12:57.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: should always contain atleast an empty string assuming the application doesn't |
| 12:57.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: free the vls). |
| 12:58.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32562 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (ged_private.h qray.h): Include missing header |
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| 14:08.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32563 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Add code to draw view axes (temporarily hardwired to always be on and drawn in center of view) |
| 14:59.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32564 10/rt^3/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): a little bit more output from the ray trace |
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| 16:00.49 | ``Erik | heh, remember how I was bitching about them screwing up my machine and having stuff crash? even vim is crashing, so I have a hard time just blaming ms... :D |
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| 16:17.54 | prasad_ | too many metaballs |
| 16:21.21 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:21.33 | ``Erik | my balls are awesome, WORSHIP MY BALLS! *duck* |
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| 17:43.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32565 10/brlcad/trunk/ (186 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 17:43.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Removed ged_result_flags from struct ged and added another return type (i.e. |
| 17:43.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: BRLCAD_HELP). This should make libged easier to use. Before, you would have |
| 17:43.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: checked the return value and the result_flags to determine if the function was |
| 17:43.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: returning a help message or results of the function call. Now you check only the |
| 17:43.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: return value. BTW, the reason an application may need to distinguish the |
| 17:43.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: difference between BRLCAD_OK and BRLCAD_HELP may be to refresh a display if the |
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| 19:11.00 | starseeker | brlcad: Hmm, I wasn't aware of it, but there does seem to be some sort of find command already in libged. Would the new find command replace it? |
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| 20:42.02 | brlcad | starseeker: that's the 'dbfind' command .. some commands were renamed in archer, that being one of them |
| 20:42.52 | brlcad | what you're doing would replace that |
| 20:44.12 | brlcad | there is also a tcl 'find' command unfortunately, so there is still a name conflict that will have to get sorted out later |
| 20:44.53 | brlcad | what I had in mind was to encapsulate all of our commands in a ged:: namespace that is auto-loaded in mged, so it can still be just 'find' |
| 20:45.16 | brlcad | and you'd just call ::find or ged::find to get tcl's or ged one respectively |
| 20:45.21 | brlcad | or at least something like that |
| 20:51.13 | brlcad | actually even better in this case, find is already namspace scoped for itcl so you can just use 'find' |
| 21:16.24 | ``Erik | hehehe, that guy just lost 26k of fleet on my base, I lost 220 and got a nice fat 11k derb pile :D awesome |
| 21:16.42 | ``Erik | 2200, rather |
| 21:17.20 | starseeker | So do you go attack him now? |
| 21:18.27 | brlcad | ``Erik: random luck of the draw or something else? |
| 21:18.29 | ``Erik | theoretically... but I probably wouldn't profit from it, so I won't |
| 21:18.43 | ``Erik | idiot at the wheel, he got upset at my potshots and decided to "teach me a leson" |
| 21:18.45 | ``Erik | lesson |
| 21:19.12 | brlcad | upgraded his beta account for a month so it can continue through the weekend unattended whilest packing |
| 21:19.19 | ``Erik | I'll message you the transcript when I get home so you can get a chuckle and learn how not to do it :) |
| 21:22.23 | starseeker | looks at stack of libged and find code for "light" weekend reading and hopes he has enough time to get through it. |
| 21:23.39 | starseeker | :q |
| 21:23.42 | starseeker | whoops |
| 21:23.43 | brlcad | the find.c in libged is probably code you'll end up needing |
| 21:23.48 | brlcad | it's basic traversal |
| 21:23.54 | starseeker | nods |
| 21:24.03 | brlcad | or at least some variation on it in a more general form |
| 21:24.22 | brlcad | it's one of the dozen or so 'findish' commands for walking the hierarchy looking for things |
| 21:24.31 | starseeker | Yes, I printed it to get the "how to read a tree from libged" perspective |
| 21:26.32 | starseeker | It doesn't seem to actually use db_functree though - db_tree_funcleaf maybe |
| 21:27.00 | starseeker | I take it the dp = gedp->ged_wdbp->dbip->dbi_Head[i]; dp != DIR_NULL; dp = dp->d_forw logic gets all top level objects? |
| 21:28.10 | brlcad | I don't remember for sure, but I don't believe so |
| 21:28.23 | brlcad | I believe that is the hash entry for all db objects |
| 21:28.33 | starseeker | checks other code... |
| 21:28.36 | brlcad | it's just the "Head" of the db linked list |
| 21:28.41 | starseeker | Oh, right |
| 21:28.44 | brlcad | so you can iterate over all objects in a db using that |
| 21:28.55 | brlcad | if the directory has been loaded, that is |
| 21:29.20 | starseeker | so that's not what you want to do if you're searching within a particular subtree then |
| 21:29.40 | starseeker | hmm. |
| 21:29.48 | brlcad | that's very low level .. kinda like putting all objects in one dir on the filesystem and running ls |
| 21:30.01 | brlcad | no hierarchy, but you can get at everything |
| 21:30.42 | brlcad | so iff you knew you were doing a top-level search with path / then you could use that, but I don't see why you'd want to |
| 21:31.00 | starseeker | nods |
| 21:31.04 | starseeker | any performance gains? |
| 21:31.47 | starseeker | looks for a db_functree use in libged |
| 21:32.06 | brlcad | not really |
| 21:32.20 | starseeker | ah, of course - killtree and xpush |
| 21:32.29 | starseeker | plus a few in wdb_obj |
| 21:33.45 | starseeker | wants a kill command that kills only the object in a tree not referenced by any other tree |
| 21:40.06 | brlcad | chuckles at "the website is down" |
| 22:03.29 | starseeker | notes McCain's VP pick and listens to hear the pop of wacko far right voter brains unable to cope with the two major presidential tickets :-) |
| 22:04.04 | starseeker | whatever else it may be, this has gotta be one of the more interesting run-ups to an election in recent history |
| 22:52.17 | ``Erik | http://www.kontraband.com/pics/13365/Proof-Evolution-Is-Phoney/ |
| 23:07.28 | ``Erik | wow O.o http://www.kontraband.com/pics/13277/Trailer-Parking-Catastrophy/ |
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| 23:18.01 | tulth | hey guys. Anyone know how to get brl-cad operating with gnu emacs instead of jove? |
| 23:29.49 | tulth | or at least, run mged from a shell prompt |
| 23:30.58 | brlcad | tulth: if you set your editor, it'll use it |
| 23:31.27 | brlcad | and what do you mean by run mged from a shell prompt? |
| 23:31.47 | brlcad | if you mean non-gui, you can run mged -c |
| 23:31.54 | brlcad | that's classic console mode |
| 23:32.01 | tulth | ahh that may be exactly what i want |
| 23:32.13 | tulth | sorry, i'm just starting with it |
| 23:33.17 | brlcad | np |
| 23:33.28 | tulth | with the console mode, how can i bring up the graphics window |
| 23:33.37 | brlcad | if you want the gui from there, you can run "gui" or the attach command |
| 23:33.52 | brlcad | it'll prompt you on startup to attach something |
| 23:34.04 | tulth | ah cool |
| 23:34.04 | brlcad | nu is nothing, X will give you the classic X console |
| 23:34.14 | brlcad | ogl might crash ;) |
| 23:34.51 | tulth | interesting, it brought up the command window too, which echoes my console i/o |
| 23:35.01 | brlcad | yep, 'gui' does that |
| 23:35.09 | brlcad | kicks off the tcl gui -- which is both windows |
| 23:35.26 | brlcad | attach is just the graphics window, but without a menu |
| 23:35.57 | tulth | that might work for me as well |
| 23:36.29 | brlcad | fyi, if you're not using the tcl/gui interface -- much of the mged tutorial will be rather different |
| 23:36.53 | tulth | you are a mindreader; i'm working through it now |
| 23:37.11 | tulth | i'll leave the gui up for now, still typing in my emacs eshell though for my commaand |
| 23:37.13 | brlcad | everything in the tutorials you can do via the gui can be done via the console or via classic mode regardless, though - you'll just have a little trouble figuring out just exactly what |
| 23:37.31 | brlcad | the mged quick reference sheet should help some |
| 23:37.56 | brlcad | wow, running mged via eshell.. |
| 23:38.02 | brlcad | lemme know how that works out ;) |
| 23:38.08 | tulth | yea, its great so far |
| 23:38.36 | brlcad | does mged's tab-completion work there? |
| 23:38.47 | tulth | hrm probably not |
| 23:38.58 | tulth | no, just tabs haha |
| 23:38.59 | brlcad | (try: make sph sph ; e s[tab] |
| 23:41.11 | tulth | yea, it just tabs |
| 23:41.16 | brlcad | k |
| 23:41.58 | brlcad | wants a brl-cad major mode |
| 23:42.05 | brlcad | that behaves like tar mode |
| 23:42.23 | tulth | yea, that would be fantastic |
| 23:42.39 | tulth | though, i haven't used tar mode |
| 23:42.55 | tulth | lots of others are nice, like gdb mode |
| 23:42.55 | brlcad | traverse the hierarchy, see the object details, edit values directly, have a few cmds to create new objects |
| 23:43.00 | tulth | org mode is cool too |
| 23:43.20 | tulth | yea, like maybe browse it with dired? |
| 23:43.21 | brlcad | an "mged mode" would be more like gdb mode |
| 23:43.29 | brlcad | right, dired is similar |
| 23:43.39 | brlcad | tar mode emulates dired on a tar file |
| 23:44.12 | brlcad | g mode would emulate direct on a g file |
| 23:44.17 | brlcad | s/direct/dired/ |
| 23:44.21 | tulth | hrm maybe even something like norton commander |
| 00:01.25 | ``Erik | *read* wow, emacs users really are masochists O.o :D |
| 00:06.53 | brlcad | heh |
| 00:06.56 | brlcad | funny battle ``Erik |
| 00:07.21 | brlcad | took me a sec to realize that was you |
| 00:13.17 | ``Erik | yeah, was hilarious :D cliff wandered in wondering why I was laughing my ass off |
| 00:14.00 | ``Erik | there were a lot of minor battles before that at various places, kill single scouts, corvettes, etc... freeing guildies who merlin had occ'd |
| 00:14.07 | ``Erik | I guess he just snapped |
| 00:14.21 | tulth | what game? |
| 00:14.25 | ``Erik | astroempires.com |
| 00:15.56 | tulth | ah =) |
| 00:20.49 | brlcad | looks like he sent every little fleet, every little bit he could to try to make the profit |
| 00:21.03 | brlcad | since they got smaller and smaller really quick :) |
| 00:25.54 | ``Erik | no, he sent everything he had. period. |
| 00:26.16 | ``Erik | each fcv can carry 400 fighters, he sent 633 fighters with 6 fcv's... and used the fcv's in the attack |
| 00:26.21 | ``Erik | that was a desperation move |
| 00:27.27 | ``Erik | I'm not vindictive, I won't attack his bases unless there's profit to be had... it's nice that he basically gave me 10k credit through his little tantrum, though :) |
| 01:03.34 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos (n=Me@emc/developer/SWPadnos) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 01:03.34 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 01:03.34 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 01:22.27 | punkrockgirl | hi guys im djing |
| 01:22.35 | punkrockgirl | if you wanna hear :D |
| 01:22.38 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 01:23.03 | brlcad | howdy punkrockgirl |
| 01:23.10 | punkrockgirl | hi! :D |
| 01:23.32 | punkrockgirl | so do you play that astroempires thing too? |
| 01:23.37 | punkrockgirl | i need to do that, erik keeps talking about it |
| 01:23.54 | brlcad | avoid it! tis evil |
| 01:24.09 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 01:24.15 | punkrockgirl | more evil than wow? |
| 01:24.20 | brlcad | I got suckered in on a whim when I was killing some time two weeks ago |
| 01:24.25 | brlcad | probably not |
| 01:24.33 | punkrockgirl | oh, i have no time to kill, wow sucks it out of me |
| 01:25.02 | brlcad | i was procrastinating, had something exceptionally more important that I needed to be doing |
| 01:25.06 | brlcad | now i'm paying for it |
| 01:25.22 | brlcad | heh, "punkrockgirl and the smurfettes" |
| 01:27.44 | brlcad | woot! |
| 01:27.50 | brlcad | hears her voice for the first time |
| 01:28.09 | brlcad | go for it |
| 01:28.22 | brlcad | :) |
| 01:28.22 | ``Erik | if you're curious, she's at least as retarded as she sounds ;) *duck* *run* |
| 01:28.55 | brlcad | dude |
| 01:29.04 | brlcad | she's gonna beat yo ass |
| 01:29.19 | ``Erik | :D |
| 01:29.33 | brlcad | gives punkrockgirl some dayquil |
| 01:29.54 | brlcad | mixes pretty well with alcohol ;) |
| 01:30.16 | ``Erik | blegh, queues are full, I'm still gonna be broke tomorrow *sigh* |
| 01:30.32 | ``Erik | I need $'s for research, damnit |
| 01:31.59 | brlcad | i think i might just have to upgrade epsilon too, at least for a month so I can go over the 5 limit on terraform, get two more astros established, then let it run for a couple months |
| 01:32.30 | brlcad | is happy he sold his couches |
| 01:32.40 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-117-250.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 01:33.06 | brlcad | totally needs to be drinking a scotch right now |
| 01:33.15 | ``Erik | <-- vodka&beer |
| 01:33.34 | brlcad | is offloading a bunch of beer tomorrow |
| 01:33.34 | ``Erik | the game is fun and cheap, *shrug* I'll probably keep paying until I get bored |
| 01:34.12 | brlcad | ``Erik: I think she's giving you a hint |
| 01:34.33 | ``Erik | o.O |
| 01:35.07 | brlcad | it is cheap, but I did find out the damn upgrades are per-server |
| 01:35.22 | ``Erik | thinks he liked jill sobules "I kissed a girl" from the mid 90's more than this one |
| 01:35.25 | brlcad | i suspected, but confirmed |
| 01:35.42 | ``Erik | makes ya wonder if you should be writing web games instead, huh? ;) |
| 01:35.51 | brlcad | no kidding |
| 01:36.22 | brlcad | it's all probably running off this dude's 486 too |
| 01:37.03 | ``Erik | I d'no, I surspect they got quite a few hits an hour |
| 01:37.10 | ``Erik | and bz is kinda straining |
| 01:37.25 | brlcad | bz? |
| 01:38.05 | brlcad | ah, sql .. yeah, maybe but I'd be surprised if the load was a whole lot more |
| 01:38.38 | ``Erik | the two big consumers on bz seems to be mysql and irssi O.o |
| 01:39.26 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: yeah, and this isn't one of them! :P |
| 01:39.58 | brlcad | hehe |
| 01:40.20 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 01:40.50 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: can you tell how many are streaming? |
| 01:41.09 | brlcad | (and individually kick them off? that'd be awesome) |
| 01:41.58 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: how about my request from a couple months ago? :) |
| 01:46.41 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 01:47.03 | punkrockgirl | ok and no i cant figure out who's streaming, i think the guy who runs it can i cant remember how to check :P |
| 01:47.09 | punkrockgirl | its at least like 16 |
| 01:49.34 | ``Erik | 'mundo' is world? |
| 01:49.40 | punkrockgirl | i must be drunk i cant remember what the request was |
| 01:49.41 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 01:49.46 | punkrockgirl | i do um, but i dont |
| 01:49.47 | ``Erik | 'meu mundo' is my world? |
| 01:51.07 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: maybe next time :) |
| 01:51.23 | punkrockgirl | nah i remember i just cant remember who sings it cuz im drunk |
| 01:51.31 | brlcad | gravity kills |
| 01:51.36 | punkrockgirl | thats right thanks :D |
| 01:51.40 | punkrockgirl | up next :] |
| 01:51.45 | brlcad | woo hoo |
| 01:51.50 | brlcad | ~punkrockgirl++ |
| 01:51.56 | ``Erik | heh |
| 01:52.06 | punkrockgirl | ;D |
| 01:52.21 | punkrockgirl | sorry, the beer is evil |
| 01:52.31 | brlcad | cranks up his sound system for (maybe) one last time before departing this place |
| 01:52.40 | brlcad | (to the annoyance of his neighbors) |
| 01:53.19 | ``Erik | quit pissing richard off! :D |
| 01:53.37 | brlcad | i'd need my other speakers to do that |
| 01:53.50 | brlcad | the big uns and amp are already in storage |
| 01:53.57 | ``Erik | careful, he might come 'mike' at you |
| 01:54.08 | brlcad | nah, he's a pansy |
| 01:54.35 | ``Erik | somehow, mike didn't consider a composite bow to be a weapon. he had it in his car at work |
| 01:54.41 | ``Erik | boy has issues |
| 01:55.44 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: you rock |
| 01:55.57 | punkrockgirl | thanks :D |
| 01:59.14 | brlcad | designed an entire game around that song |
| 02:01.54 | punkrockgirl | cool |
| 02:01.58 | punkrockgirl | what game |
| 02:02.23 | *** join/#brlcad thing1 (n=ric@124-169-117-250.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 02:02.27 | brlcad | it wasn't published/finished |
| 02:02.36 | brlcad | just nearly fully designed |
| 02:06.48 | ``Erik | busts out his huge request list o.O :D *duck* |
| 02:07.49 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 02:09.15 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: a pleasure to finally hear you, have to get ``Erik to host a party and get you over this way :) |
| 02:14.36 | ``Erik | heh |
| 02:14.42 | ``Erik | that was damn weird |
| 02:15.01 | brlcad | hm? |
| 02:15.10 | ``Erik | on my way home, I threw that flyleaf cd in my cars changer, kept saying 'no cd', so i moved it from 1 to 6 and threw a bunch of other cd's in, suddenly it all works |
| 02:15.30 | brlcad | huh |
| 02:16.02 | ``Erik | so now my car has santana, green day, metallica, the spawn and crow soundtracks, ... heh |
| 02:18.11 | ``Erik | (good green day... kerplunk.. not dookie&later crap... shut up) |
| 02:20.23 | ``Erik | ohhhhhh, that's why the radio was suddenly good, it lost connection and went to my play list |
| 02:20.34 | ``Erik | was wondering why I was getting stuff like garbage and filter :D |
| 02:20.52 | punkrockgirl | haha, yes brlcad, everytime i go there we dont do anything but sit around |
| 02:20.59 | punkrockgirl | when he comes here i throw parties... |
| 02:21.10 | punkrockgirl | guess he doesnt want me to meet his friends |
| 02:21.18 | brlcad | haha, THAT's why the music changed... |
| 02:21.26 | punkrockgirl | oh, im done djing |
| 02:21.28 | brlcad | thanks ``Erik .. was wondering the exact same thing |
| 02:21.41 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: figured that out.. didn't think the stream would end though :) |
| 02:21.47 | punkrockgirl | but um, some chicks on after me |
| 02:21.59 | brlcad | oh |
| 02:21.59 | punkrockgirl | she didnt connect right so it broke |
| 02:22.04 | brlcad | tunes in |
| 02:22.10 | ``Erik | playing some retarded def lepard remix so I turned it off |
| 02:23.01 | punkrockgirl | shes cooler than cat |
| 02:23.06 | punkrockgirl | keeps playing nirvana |
| 02:23.08 | punkrockgirl | i like her |
| 02:24.01 | ``Erik | heh, "not a scary chick humping kev"? O.o *duck* |
| 02:24.56 | punkrockgirl | nope |
| 02:25.09 | punkrockgirl | miss seems pretty cool |
| 02:25.17 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:25.28 | ``Erik | morning, yukon |
| 02:25.28 | punkrockgirl | she isnt insane liek teh others |
| 02:25.29 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 02:25.30 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 02:25.49 | brlcad | woot, the liquid floweth freely |
| 02:26.05 | ``Erik | which scotch tonight? |
| 02:26.19 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: you're not missing much |
| 02:26.27 | brlcad | I wouldn't want to meet his friends either |
| 02:26.33 | ``Erik | hah |
| 02:26.59 | ``Erik | is surprised punker isn't fed up with htis friends... zyx alone is more than most can handle |
| 02:27.01 | ``Erik | :D |
| 02:27.37 | brlcad | bunch a geeks that talk tech most of the time |
| 02:28.36 | brlcad | tonight is a night for the good stuff, the 21 year portwood balvenie is calling me |
| 02:28.53 | brlcad | makes it easier to pack and throw stuff away |
| 02:29.02 | ``Erik | on the rocks? |
| 02:29.12 | brlcad | of course |
| 02:30.00 | ``Erik | every time I get the urge to do that, I end up saying "fuqqit" and running a neat with a chase |
| 02:30.17 | punkrockgirl | i hate zyx |
| 02:30.18 | ``Erik | shot to the liver, bullseye |
| 02:31.36 | punkrockgirl | ok so is it bad that when this startedi thought it was vanilla ice and not david bowie? |
| 02:31.53 | punkrockgirl | i realized it after like 30 secs... but still... |
| 02:32.11 | ``Erik | 89 rc's, should only take 12 hours |
| 02:32.28 | ``Erik | yeah, you suck, punker... I mean, vanilla ice? seriously? |
| 02:32.39 | ``Erik | rice rice gravy |
| 02:33.28 | ``Erik | batshit insane ripping up the mtv set with an aluminum baseball bat his name really is mud rob? O.o |
| 02:35.31 | punkrockgirl | eat me... |
| 02:35.40 | ``Erik | jabs punker with a fork |
| 02:35.59 | punkrockgirl | ouchies |
| 02:36.07 | punkrockgirl | dude, where did my snotrag go? |
| 02:36.09 | punkrockgirl | did you steal it? |
| 02:36.13 | punkrockgirl | did you hide it? |
| 02:36.27 | brlcad | sips his scotch as deep satisfaction sets in |
| 02:36.43 | punkrockgirl | i want some scotch |
| 02:36.51 | punkrockgirl | i have beer and vodka and amaretto |
| 02:36.55 | ``Erik | ... *burp* |
| 02:37.00 | brlcad | saw vanilla ice (in person) just two weeks ago |
| 02:37.04 | punkrockgirl | excuse you |
| 02:37.05 | brlcad | weirdness |
| 02:37.15 | punkrockgirl | interesting |
| 02:37.16 | punkrockgirl | where? |
| 02:37.18 | ``Erik | at siggraph? |
| 02:37.21 | brlcad | in L.A. |
| 02:37.22 | yukonbob | hehe |
| 02:37.23 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:37.32 | brlcad | there was a softimage party |
| 02:37.35 | ``Erik | dangit, I shoulda went |
| 02:37.37 | punkrockgirl | cool |
| 02:37.39 | ``Erik | I coulda gotten to kick his ass |
| 02:37.43 | punkrockgirl | he's kinda a loose cannon |
| 02:37.52 | ``Erik | that'd be a good resume line |
| 02:37.52 | punkrockgirl | LOL that would be funny to watch |
| 02:38.02 | brlcad | they were releasing a new product called 'ICE' .. with a special (unknown) guest presenter |
| 02:38.04 | punkrockgirl | but um baby, he is kinda buff last i checked... |
| 02:38.09 | ``Erik | "expert in C, lisp, shell scripting, assembly, and kicking vanilla ices crazy ass" |
| 02:38.20 | brlcad | modern vanilla ice, though he did do a few variations on the oldies |
| 02:38.24 | brlcad | kickin' party |
| 02:38.39 | punkrockgirl | you see how he went off on that porn king guy, um whats his name? |
| 02:38.43 | punkrockgirl | i cant remember things |
| 02:38.46 | ``Erik | ron jeremy? |
| 02:38.49 | punkrockgirl | yes]' |
| 02:38.56 | brlcad | girls literally hanging and dancing from cloth sheets 20 feet up in the air |
| 02:38.56 | punkrockgirl | throwing shit at him |
| 02:39.02 | brlcad | yeah, hehe, ron was there too |
| 02:39.06 | punkrockgirl | lolll |
| 02:39.08 | punkrockgirl | really? |
| 02:39.09 | ``Erik | and I'm not scared of rob 'vanilla lice'... now carrot top, shit, I'll steer clear of that nut |
| 02:39.20 | punkrockgirl | ummm |
| 02:39.22 | brlcad | yep, they're apparently good friends |
| 02:39.28 | punkrockgirl | yeah they were |
| 02:39.34 | punkrockgirl | they got in a HUGE fight |
| 02:39.39 | punkrockgirl | im glad they are friends again |
| 02:39.40 | ``Erik | of course they're good friends, they have something in common... both of them suck ron's dick |
| 02:39.40 | brlcad | he was up in the rafters with some ladies |
| 02:39.41 | ``Erik | *cough* |
| 02:39.50 | punkrockgirl | i watch vh1 too much... |
| 02:40.01 | punkrockgirl | no, they were on surreal life together |
| 02:40.08 | punkrockgirl | and lived together |
| 02:40.15 | brlcad | ah, right |
| 02:40.15 | punkrockgirl | for a couple months |
| 02:40.30 | ``Erik | doesn't negate or preclude my statment... :D |
| 02:40.46 | ``Erik | s/tm/tem/ |
| 02:41.02 | punkrockgirl | and rob FrEAKED out about something and was breaking the vh1 set and throwing a drum set at ron and it was just funny as hell |
| 02:41.21 | brlcad | http://www.softimage.com/events/sig08/NiceIce/ |
| 02:41.28 | brlcad | video totally doesn't do the venue justice |
| 02:43.40 | brlcad | shakes fist at the volume changing so much from voice to tune on troubleradio |
| 02:45.18 | punkrockgirl | yeah, thats her... i dont do that |
| 02:45.23 | ``Erik | yeah ya do |
| 02:45.26 | punkrockgirl | i do not! |
| 02:45.30 | punkrockgirl | stfu |
| 02:45.31 | ``Erik | gotta watch the vu meters |
| 02:45.36 | punkrockgirl | eat me |
| 02:45.43 | ``Erik | and normalize it every time ya move hte mic, it sucks |
| 02:45.43 | punkrockgirl | that looks fun |
| 02:45.48 | punkrockgirl | so whats softimage? |
| 02:45.56 | ``Erik | graphic software company |
| 02:46.07 | punkrockgirl | huh... so thats um, work? |
| 02:46.10 | brlcad | it's like the main software that's used for making commercials and tv edits |
| 02:46.18 | brlcad | some movie work too |
| 02:46.42 | punkrockgirl | hm |
| 02:46.43 | ``Erik | xsi, I think? |
| 02:46.45 | brlcad | gets a quick buzz realizing that he's not had a damn thing to eat today |
| 02:46.53 | punkrockgirl | why is it my work sucks so bad |
| 02:47.00 | punkrockgirl | and other people like what they do |
| 02:47.15 | punkrockgirl | and how do i fix that |
| 02:47.20 | brlcad | loves what he does, contrary to ``Erik's happiness :) |
| 02:47.27 | punkrockgirl | :) |
| 02:47.38 | ``Erik | huh, they were involved with the new hulk move |
| 02:47.43 | punkrockgirl | i think he does love what he does |
| 02:48.00 | brlcad | he just wants to be left alone |
| 02:48.02 | punkrockgirl | i, however, scream all day and then my throat hurts and then i cry cuz im so stressed |
| 02:48.07 | brlcad | and they keep gettin' all up in his bidness |
| 02:48.27 | brlcad | scream o.O |
| 02:48.32 | punkrockgirl | yes, that would be like another issue with my job, but not nearly as annoying as the screaming |
| 02:48.33 | ``Erik | today was nice, I only got interrupted 5 or 6 times |
| 02:48.42 | punkrockgirl | lmao 5 or 6 times? |
| 02:48.45 | punkrockgirl | are you kidding me? |
| 02:48.53 | brlcad | that's a good day |
| 02:49.05 | ``Erik | yeah, tha tmeans I got, what, almost an hour of productive work done |
| 02:49.19 | brlcad | at least double office-space guy |
| 02:49.25 | punkrockgirl | im in the middle of something... a hand goes up... "what time is it" i ignore it... 3 seconds later another hand "yes?" "i gotta USE it" |
| 02:49.42 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: teacher? |
| 02:49.45 | punkrockgirl | i ignore it... 10 secs later "what page are we on?" |
| 02:49.47 | punkrockgirl | yes |
| 02:49.52 | ``Erik | yeah, but you don't have a full hour of mental cooldown/windup for each and every interruption |
| 02:49.52 | brlcad | raises his hand |
| 02:50.16 | brlcad | raises his hand and starts flailing |
| 02:50.45 | punkrockgirl | i have 1 second of a "omfg if this kid doesnt stop beating on the goddamn desk i will throw this stapler at his face... now i must calm down.. ok so a factor is ..." |
| 02:50.51 | punkrockgirl | yes brlcad? :D |
| 02:50.55 | brlcad | hehe |
| 02:51.01 | ``Erik | he had to pee |
| 02:51.03 | brlcad | I gotta go |
| 02:51.04 | ``Erik | but he wasn't excused |
| 02:51.05 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:51.07 | ``Erik | so he did it anyways |
| 02:51.13 | punkrockgirl | (this is where you say "you waited to long... i forgot..." |
| 02:51.20 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 02:51.39 | punkrockgirl | i have no hour of mental cooldown... wtff is that? |
| 02:51.56 | brlcad | once again, the brl-cad mentors rock out over the bzflag mentors |
| 02:52.11 | brlcad | all survey's completed early .. bz only has 1 of 6 done |
| 02:52.24 | punkrockgirl | i had a kid today who came in late... takes 2 steps forward... one step back... 2 steps forward... 1 step back... wont move out of my doorway... 2 steps forward.... OMFG i was gonna push him |
| 02:52.26 | ``Erik | coders function in a semi-hypnotic state... knock us out of it and we're dazed and it takes us a while to figure out what's going on... getting back into is is another good chunk of time |
| 02:52.33 | punkrockgirl | it took everything in me not to |
| 02:52.50 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: that's where I'd probably get sued |
| 02:52.55 | punkrockgirl | me too |
| 02:52.59 | brlcad | i'd just pick the kid up and move em |
| 02:53.01 | punkrockgirl | im so suprised i didnt |
| 02:53.07 | punkrockgirl | he's adhd/sped too |
| 02:53.16 | punkrockgirl | but im like GET OUT OF MY WAY |
| 02:53.24 | ``Erik | I d'no, when I was subbing, I could fluff up and intimidate them pretty easily |
| 02:53.30 | punkrockgirl | ask erik, im very impatient |
| 02:53.42 | ``Erik | yes, punker is a spaz |
| 02:53.46 | punkrockgirl | very |
| 02:53.46 | brlcad | kick the bottom of their shoe when they start to step forward |
| 02:53.50 | brlcad | that'll get their attention |
| 02:53.54 | punkrockgirl | my coworkers call me the bad kid |
| 02:54.07 | punkrockgirl | i am always late for everything and freak out over everything |
| 02:54.15 | punkrockgirl | hehehe |
| 02:54.16 | brlcad | woot, late ftw |
| 02:54.33 | ``Erik | not for certain things |
| 02:54.34 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 02:54.45 | ``Erik | "late? what? *runs for hills*" |
| 02:54.46 | ``Erik | :D |
| 02:54.46 | punkrockgirl | i assume that they cant fire me |
| 02:54.50 | brlcad | notes he will be homeless in 49 hours :) |
| 02:54.50 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
| 02:55.01 | punkrockgirl | eck, thats lame |
| 02:55.06 | punkrockgirl | why |
| 02:55.13 | ``Erik | oh, uh, dude, labor day weekend |
| 02:55.17 | brlcad | i'm moving |
| 02:55.23 | ``Erik | might not be wise to wait until friday evening to call around |
| 02:55.25 | brlcad | it's on purpose :) |
| 02:55.29 | punkrockgirl | to a home? |
| 02:55.47 | brlcad | i'm not looking for a new place yet |
| 02:55.51 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 02:55.56 | punkrockgirl | might wanna do that |
| 02:56.02 | brlcad | i'll figure that out next month probably |
| 02:56.06 | punkrockgirl | cuz um, places arent open past noon tomorrow |
| 02:56.23 | ``Erik | wait, it is friday evening, huh |
| 02:56.25 | ``Erik | heh |
| 02:56.27 | brlcad | tomorrow I'm packing and moving the rest of my stuff into storage |
| 02:56.28 | punkrockgirl | past that |
| 02:56.33 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
| 02:56.35 | ``Erik | why was I thinking it was wednesday? |
| 02:56.42 | punkrockgirl | cuz youre an idiot? |
| 02:56.47 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 02:56.48 | brlcad | because you WANT to go to work tomorrow |
| 02:56.51 | ``Erik | ... |
| 02:56.57 | punkrockgirl | *snuggle* :) |
| 02:57.11 | ``Erik | you know it! I wasn't supposed to go to work today, but there I was, bright eyed and bushy somethinged |
| 02:57.33 | punkrockgirl | nerdling |
| 02:57.44 | punkrockgirl | dude why cant i breathe |
| 02:57.49 | punkrockgirl | its so irritating |
| 02:57.52 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: actually I figure I will actually make out quite well at a hotel for a few weeks (or however long) while I search |
| 02:57.57 | punkrockgirl | wtf is this chick playing |
| 02:58.03 | brlcad | it works out not much different than rent frankly |
| 02:58.10 | brlcad | and someone cleans my place every day! |
| 02:58.11 | punkrockgirl | oh |
| 02:58.13 | punkrockgirl | hahaha |
| 02:58.22 | ``Erik | heh, not jaylo's couch? :D |
| 02:58.29 | brlcad | nah |
| 02:58.29 | punkrockgirl | well thats not entirely homeless then |
| 02:58.35 | punkrockgirl | ive been homeless, thats not so fun |
| 02:58.36 | brlcad | true |
| 02:58.45 | brlcad | home is where my head is, always has been |
| 02:58.46 | punkrockgirl | its interesting though |
| 02:58.53 | punkrockgirl | you meet people |
| 02:58.56 | ``Erik | how're you supposed to buy the new elise if you spend money on hotels? |
| 02:58.56 | brlcad | is a bit different at times |
| 02:59.14 | brlcad | yeah, I've actually met folks that live in hotels in my travels |
| 02:59.31 | brlcad | very well-to-do folks, not what you'd think |
| 02:59.34 | punkrockgirl | i went through a phase a long time ago that i couch surfed |
| 02:59.39 | brlcad | it's mostly mobile convenience |
| 02:59.43 | punkrockgirl | and slept behind a grocery store |
| 03:00.04 | brlcad | ``Erik: because it's not really different than rent .. the elise is still easily within reach |
| 03:00.31 | punkrockgirl | well, actually, i bet its not bad, cuz you dont have electricity and crap |
| 03:00.39 | ``Erik | I d'no, man, seems worth it to buy one.. and if you go mobile and can't sell it, rent it out |
| 03:00.39 | punkrockgirl | bills are killing me |
| 03:00.46 | punkrockgirl | my electric bill is 300 a month |
| 03:00.48 | brlcad | especially if I try to curtail eating $40 meals a dozen times a month |
| 03:01.00 | brlcad | and $150 bottles of scotch .. though I can't make promises |
| 03:01.06 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 03:01.17 | brlcad | has his limits |
| 03:01.38 | ``Erik | it's all good until you break 1k for a fifth |
| 03:01.47 | brlcad | ``Erik: heh, hell, my MOM was telling me the craziest stuff just two days ago.. |
| 03:02.11 | ``Erik | hey man, I don't wanna hear about her key parties and shit, tmi, dude |
| 03:02.14 | brlcad | telling me to empty out my retirement, buy whatever car I want, live it up |
| 03:02.44 | punkrockgirl | why? |
| 03:02.51 | brlcad | heh, my parents are like your traditional apple pie folks, it was so wierd |
| 03:03.08 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: because she thinks I need a really hot car |
| 03:03.25 | ``Erik | the elise is only like 50 or 60k |
| 03:03.26 | brlcad | it sorta suits me if you meet me, freespirit and such |
| 03:03.28 | punkrockgirl | i sometimes feel like i dont need to worry about retirement cuz my parents will leave me enough some day |
| 03:03.40 | ``Erik | not like an amg slk or anything |
| 03:03.42 | brlcad | ``Erik: i'd get the exige if I did that |
| 03:03.54 | brlcad | or actually, a viper |
| 03:04.01 | punkrockgirl | oh i want a viper! |
| 03:04.04 | ``Erik | I've never been thrilled with vipers |
| 03:04.07 | punkrockgirl | erik buy me one |
| 03:04.14 | ``Erik | brutal quarter mile car... crap for anything else |
| 03:04.14 | brlcad | that's always been my 'car' to get |
| 03:04.23 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 03:04.25 | brlcad | sexy as hell |
| 03:04.26 | punkrockgirl | they are cool |
| 03:04.39 | brlcad | ponders that statement |
| 03:04.43 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
| 03:04.51 | ``Erik | and a shoddy lsd with no decent mgmt computer |
| 03:04.58 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: you totally rock out over the current chick .. she's kinda weird |
| 03:05.04 | punkrockgirl | lol, thanks |
| 03:05.10 | ``Erik | I keep hearing stories about people throwing the tail out and going in circles or crashing |
| 03:05.10 | punkrockgirl | she's way more hyper |
| 03:05.12 | brlcad | i mean serious |
| 03:05.16 | brlcad | seriously |
| 03:05.18 | punkrockgirl | LOL |
| 03:05.32 | punkrockgirl | im like "heres the music... love it... hate it.. .whatever..." |
| 03:05.35 | ``Erik | TEH INTARWEBZ IS SRS BZNS!~#~! |
| 03:05.37 | ``Erik | YARLY! |
| 03:05.54 | punkrockgirl | she's like "omfg! this song rocks! lol! listen! lol! its so neat-o! lol!" |
| 03:06.08 | brlcad | aaaand.... the song sucks |
| 03:06.15 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 03:06.19 | punkrockgirl | precisely |
| 03:07.00 | punkrockgirl | omg i wish i wasnt sick |
| 03:07.02 | ``Erik | ... can we get back to car talk now? :D |
| 03:07.03 | brlcad | will take stuffy and drunk dj over that any day :) |
| 03:07.17 | punkrockgirl | this music is like, stuff i heard when i was 10 at the skating rink lol |
| 03:07.32 | punkrockgirl | thanks |
| 03:07.46 | punkrockgirl | and um, erik... you like talking about cars more than talking about me? |
| 03:07.48 | punkrockgirl | meanie |
| 03:08.03 | brlcad | ``Erik: so car will probably be next on my radar after I'm fully moved back in someplace |
| 03:08.14 | punkrockgirl | dude, why are all these beers empty |
| 03:08.38 | brlcad | just hopefully will be a place I can park curbside without too much risk ;) |
| 03:08.59 | brlcad | most of canton is shweet, but dunno if I'll find a place there |
| 03:09.24 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: you're not nearly drunk, your sentances still form complete thoughts |
| 03:09.25 | ``Erik | punker: I've ridden you, I haven't ridden in an elise, or 911, or c6, or ... |
| 03:09.27 | ``Erik | :> *duck* *run* |
| 03:09.43 | punkrockgirl | so i'm old news??? |
| 03:09.45 | brlcad | 911 is actually a backup .. looked a few |
| 03:09.47 | punkrockgirl | *cry* |
| 03:10.00 | punkrockgirl | and i'm boring???? |
| 03:10.02 | punkrockgirl | *sob* |
| 03:10.12 | ``Erik | there was a nice one down at the german lot by jones junction when I was replacing my old m3 |
| 03:10.15 | ``Erik | bites punker |
| 03:10.20 | brlcad | nah, just melodramatic ;) |
| 03:10.24 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 03:10.29 | brlcad | hides |
| 03:10.57 | ``Erik | the 911 lacks a back seat, and having something that could carry more than 2 people seemed important to me at hte time |
| 03:10.58 | brlcad | ``Erik: it's a far backup choice, though .. not too fond of the ass on the new models |
| 03:11.13 | ``Erik | they changed it? |
| 03:11.24 | brlcad | doesn't care about 2 people, just get another car for that if it's really needed ;) |
| 03:11.34 | punkrockgirl | carrying more than 2 people is important |
| 03:11.42 | punkrockgirl | OMFG my friend has this car... um |
| 03:11.45 | punkrockgirl | an audi? |
| 03:11.50 | punkrockgirl | so i sat in the back |
| 03:11.57 | ``Erik | http://images.myride.com/images/vehicle/2008/Porsche/911/oem/08_Porsche_911_Turbo_03_(768x576).jpg |
| 03:11.58 | brlcad | which audi? |
| 03:12.01 | punkrockgirl | and im VERY short btw, like 5'2" on a good day |
| 03:12.02 | ``Erik | looks ... pedestrian |
| 03:12.13 | brlcad | heh, good day |
| 03:12.17 | punkrockgirl | andi could not fit without hitting my head and smashing my legs |
| 03:12.26 | punkrockgirl | it was SO lamesauce |
| 03:12.34 | ``Erik | hrm, lee's a4 isnt too bad |
| 03:12.37 | ``Erik | probably a tt |
| 03:12.46 | punkrockgirl | i'm not sure what it was |
| 03:12.47 | ``Erik | is it round and a 2 seater? |
| 03:12.51 | punkrockgirl | no... |
| 03:12.57 | punkrockgirl | i said i wasi n the backseat |
| 03:13.02 | punkrockgirl | 4 seats |
| 03:13.10 | punkrockgirl | TINY |
| 03:13.24 | brlcad | ``Erik: the boxter's rear |
| 03:13.31 | punkrockgirl | i couldnt BELIEVE it was a 4 seater, i always thought it was a 2 seater |
| 03:13.34 | brlcad | 911's good, but they're not so easy to find |
| 03:13.47 | ``Erik | huh? porsche boxster is a 2 seater with a mid engine |
| 03:13.58 | ``Erik | petey had one back in memphis, he ended up selling it and getting an m3 |
| 03:14.05 | punkrockgirl | this music is ghey |
| 03:14.28 | punkrockgirl | do i need more beer |
| 03:14.39 | ``Erik | oh, visual shit |
| 03:14.51 | ``Erik | sorry, it's late, vodka in me, not firing 100% :) |
| 03:15.15 | ``Erik | http://allworldcars.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/2008-limited-edition-porsche-boxster-2.jpg |
| 03:15.29 | ``Erik | it grew rice fins |
| 03:15.37 | brlcad | ``Erik: http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/911/ |
| 03:15.50 | brlcad | the ones that I have no problem with are outside my budget ;) |
| 03:15.55 | brlcad | (the gt's) |
| 03:16.01 | ``Erik | http://www.thewho.info/wfc/images/03Box6.jpg far cuter |
| 03:16.21 | brlcad | yeah, I don't like that model |
| 03:16.46 | brlcad | big ass rear |
| 03:17.13 | ``Erik | gotta house the engine... :D pancake 6, right around 3 liter |
| 03:17.36 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: yes you do |
| 03:17.54 | ``Erik | um, the uh, vulva s60r was high on my list, that's a nice little machine |
| 03:18.12 | brlcad | heh's that's such a horrible name for a car |
| 03:19.11 | brlcad | it had to be the TT |
| 03:19.37 | brlcad | the r8 is cramped too, but that's pretty money |
| 03:19.42 | ``Erik | 300 bhp, 6spd, tightened suspension, .... s60r is a beast in sheeps clothing |
| 03:19.59 | punkrockgirl | pancake 6 what |
| 03:20.09 | brlcad | 6 pancakes? |
| 03:20.09 | ``Erik | the audis never really thrilled me, the s8 is neat, but ... |
| 03:20.23 | punkrockgirl | i want 6 pancakes |
| 03:20.31 | ``Erik | pancake engine... like a boxer engine... |
| 03:20.39 | punkrockgirl | im a boxer? |
| 03:20.48 | ``Erik | a bit boxy, yeah |
| 03:20.49 | ``Erik | :D |
| 03:20.56 | punkrockgirl | what/?!$?@!#% |
| 03:21.01 | punkrockgirl | hows that |
| 03:21.03 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 03:21.05 | brlcad | i love the s8, but that's like loving the ford gt |
| 03:21.08 | ``Erik | http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1139668 |
| 03:21.22 | ``Erik | heh, kermit keeps talking about his buddy with a ford gt |
| 03:21.25 | punkrockgirl | when i think of boxes i think of flat |
| 03:21.29 | punkrockgirl | am i flat? |
| 03:21.43 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 03:21.44 | ``Erik | no, punker, just a square |
| 03:21.49 | punkrockgirl | ha |
| 03:21.57 | punkrockgirl | yeah? |
| 03:21.58 | punkrockgirl | well |
| 03:22.07 | punkrockgirl | youre so square that youre a cube |
| 03:22.10 | ``Erik | s8 is under the 100k mark, right? it's like 80? |
| 03:22.11 | brlcad | okay, I think the radio is about to loose a listener |
| 03:22.18 | punkrockgirl | already lost me |
| 03:22.20 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 03:22.23 | punkrockgirl | its ok |
| 03:22.31 | punkrockgirl | i left about 10 mins ago |
| 03:23.07 | brlcad | she just said hi to you |
| 03:23.17 | ``Erik | heh |
| 03:23.23 | punkrockgirl | oh |
| 03:23.25 | punkrockgirl | thanks :D |
| 03:23.41 | ``Erik | ya renting a truck, brlcad? |
| 03:24.14 | ``Erik | I believe I am promised to do somehting on wow tomorrow, otherwise I think I can help ya, y'know, drink your beer and not lift anything heavy |
| 03:24.37 | brlcad | "punkrockgirl likes vaseline too" |
| 03:24.41 | punkrockgirl | hahaha |
| 03:24.53 | punkrockgirl | yes, um, but i prefer other things to vaseline |
| 03:25.24 | ``Erik | I was about to flip that I'd been buying expensive shit when vaseline woulda worked heh :D |
| 03:25.33 | punkrockgirl | hahaha |
| 03:25.34 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, picking it up tomorrow morning till i'm done |
| 03:25.45 | brlcad | thanks for the offer, I'll let you know if I hit a crunch |
| 03:25.51 | ``Erik | got anyone hleping you with the heavy stuff? |
| 03:26.12 | ``Erik | jaylo, twinky, ? mebbe richard since he lives right there? |
| 03:26.25 | brlcad | i only have one thing I can't deal with solo |
| 03:26.26 | ``Erik | or, rather, bulky stuff |
| 03:26.31 | brlcad | ze huge tv |
| 03:26.34 | punkrockgirl | you know... when i put my playlist on shuffle it does better than i do when i pick stuff |
| 03:26.49 | brlcad | so jlo is coming by for that |
| 03:26.55 | ``Erik | ok, cool |
| 03:27.12 | brlcad | funny, I can move a 16ft couch by myself, but not that tv |
| 03:27.17 | ``Erik | not bringing nettie and the children? they could get underfoot if they show up |
| 03:27.47 | brlcad | too big to wrap arms around it, unwieldy .. might try something with a dolly |
| 03:27.58 | brlcad | nah |
| 03:28.02 | ``Erik | well, if you drop the couch, big whup, pick it up.. if you drop the tv... :D |
| 03:28.10 | punkrockgirl | ok i ate a burrito with super hot sauce and i can kinda breathe a bit |
| 03:28.16 | punkrockgirl | i need to eat more hot shit |
| 03:28.21 | brlcad | actually I'm selling the couches |
| 03:28.40 | brlcad | someone coming by to get them tomorrow, craigslist ftw |
| 03:28.46 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 03:28.56 | ``Erik | posts one truck, needs some minor work *cough* :D |
| 03:28.58 | brlcad | they're getting a sweet deal :) |
| 03:29.22 | ``Erik | "never farted in" heh |
| 03:29.24 | brlcad | i was just going to put them up for free, but figured I'd see if anyone responded if I put a cheap pricetag |
| 03:29.31 | brlcad | makes no promises |
| 03:29.41 | brlcad | and sure enough, they came in droves |
| 03:30.04 | brlcad | twas 3k new, so for $100 it's a steal even if they do need reupholstered now |
| 03:30.27 | ``Erik | dares not ask |
| 03:30.38 | ``Erik | http://www.tensionnot.com/Automobiles453.html |
| 03:30.38 | brlcad | :) |
| 03:31.00 | brlcad | hehe |
| 03:31.34 | ``Erik | there was a classified ad for a mercedes that said "never been farted in", I can't find it |
| 03:34.53 | punkrockgirl | ok i totally cant breathe, about to give up and go to bed |
| 03:34.57 | punkrockgirl | its so frustrating |
| 03:36.02 | brlcad | :( |
| 03:38.09 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 03:38.14 | punkrockgirl | it sucks |
| 03:38.27 | punkrockgirl | i should take some medicine but i have drank a lot |
| 03:39.05 | brlcad | doesn't see the problem |
| 03:40.34 | brlcad | wants to try to compile brl-cad using tcc |
| 03:42.46 | ``Erik | could be interesting... tendra might be a gentler first step... and here I was contemplating an __attribute__ tag |
| 04:13.32 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:35.41 | starseeker | ``Erik: don't blame you being scared of carrot top, but if anyone ever needed a good smackdown... |
| 04:36.36 | starseeker | //www.kontraband.com/pics/13365/Proof-Evolution-Is-Phoney/ |
| 04:38.04 | starseeker | that's both funny and very sad... |
| 04:41.12 | starseeker | brlcad: So... what do you do when you need to put an address on government paperwork? |
| 05:26.40 | brlcad | starseeker: I put the address :) |
| 05:27.32 | brlcad | there is both a physical and logical variant of the address |
| 05:28.48 | brlcad | can show you on wed |
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| 16:33.41 | brlcad | silly noob, attacked my weakest planet and still came out at a net deficit of 10k |
| 16:36.06 | elite01 | what game? |
| 16:36.41 | ``Erik | astroempires.com |
| 16:37.21 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F2E9.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:37.41 | elite01 | looks cool, played something similar a while ago |
| 16:38.17 | brlcad | ``Erik: is there an easier way to find folks other than clicking on each damn system for every quadrant where there is a fleet presence? |
| 16:39.00 | brlcad | elite01: basic space trader game, usual lots of variables to balance, mmo |
| 16:39.50 | elite01 | yeah |
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| 11:00.12 | ``Erik | brlcad: no :( some people keep spreadsheets to track folk |
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| 11:02.04 | docelic | you guys noticed brlcad.org is unaccessible? ("The MySQL error was: Too many connections.") |
| 11:05.58 | ``Erik | hum, /usr is full *look* |
| 11:29.23 | ``Erik | hrm, looks like /usr/var/log is the big consumer... I don't feel comfortable killing shit there, brlcad needs to wake up and address this :/ |
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| 14:02.29 | brlcad | wakes up |
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| 19:28.37 | yukonbob | ``Erik: has this full volume been addressed yet? |
| 20:53.15 | brlcad | yes |
| 22:56.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32566 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): modifications to generic Backtracksolver trying to make it work |
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| 01:54.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32567 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h solver_test.cpp): Generic backtracker functional |
| 01:55.11 | brlcad | woot |
| 02:06.12 | ``Erik | "cock goblin" hah |
| 02:19.03 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32568 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVCSet.cpp): debug strings: removal and modification |
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| 07:01.00 | blitz | quick question, can brl-cad export gcode? |
| 07:01.27 | blitz | I need to see if I can run it with my mill |
| 07:02.26 | blitz | my mill is running emc2 |
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| 13:46.01 | ``Erik | no, not yet |
| 13:46.24 | ``Erik | http://gcam.js.cx might be interesting for ya, though |
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| 15:38.38 | archivist_ub | bleh typical quitter, I was about to point him at the emc cam links page |
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| 15:48.19 | blitz | I have a box named "stock" and a rcc named "hole1". How do I combine these so that "hole1" is cut through "stock" ? |
| 15:49.33 | archivist_ub | blitz from your earlier question http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Cam, hang around in irc answers are often slow |
| 15:52.18 | blitz | thanks for the link, thats where I first got the idea of using brl-cad for my mill. I had used it before but didn't really do much except do the tutorial. I think I can get gcam working with brl-cad if I convert .g to .dxf |
| 16:06.02 | blitz | after a raytrace, how do I clear the screen? |
| 16:11.37 | blitz | I can clear the current wireframe stuff with "Z" but I cant get rid of the raytrace |
| 16:14.35 | blitz | nevermind, I just turned framebuffer off. :-) |
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| 18:45.13 | blitz | how do I save a raytrace? |
| 18:53.48 | blitz | and how can I have the graphics window show the xyz axis? |
| 19:17.33 | blitz | ok, I guess it's the "V" key... |
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| 10:50.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32569 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (ged_private.h rmap.c which.c): Flesh out libged's rmap function. |
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| 14:38.42 | andrecastelo | howdy :D |
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| 17:04.19 | brlcad | howdy andrecastelo ! |
| 17:04.21 | brlcad | how goes it? |
| 17:04.35 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad |
| 17:04.48 | andrecastelo | school period is ending |
| 17:05.21 | andrecastelo | final exams and such |
| 17:05.48 | andrecastelo | that's why i've been away for a while |
| 17:09.05 | brlcad | i figured as much |
| 17:09.12 | brlcad | good luck with the exams |
| 17:19.13 | andrecastelo | thank you :D |
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| 22:09.49 | starseeker | Tcl/tk sucks |
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| 22:15.15 | andrecastelo | howdy! |
| 22:22.30 | starseeker | brlcad: correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks like ALL the working commands are piped through wdb_obj.c at the moment? |
| 23:18.58 | starseeker | arrrgh |
| 23:19.05 | starseeker | KERN_INVALID_ADDRESS? |
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| 23:22.53 | mafm | ho ho ho |
| 23:22.59 | mafm | dances the new laptop dance |
| 23:24.18 | mafm | and congrats brlcad, bzflag just entered in debian archives :) |
| 23:27.37 | andrecastelo | oh hi mafm |
| 23:27.56 | andrecastelo | it's unusual to see you online so late :b |
| 23:28.10 | andrecastelo | congratulations on the new laptop :D |
| 23:35.17 | mafm | thanks |
| 23:35.38 | mafm | let's see if it's better than the previous one :P |
| 23:36.28 | mafm | and yep, it's quite late, I'm at my parent's place with a brief holidays/unimportant exams :) |
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| 00:07.47 | mafm | well, I'd better go |
| 00:07.49 | mafm | good night! |
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| 03:26.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32570 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): (log message trimmed) |
| 03:26.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Beginnings of work on the new find command - intention is to have (insofar as it |
| 03:26.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: makes sense) the full power of the standard Unix style find command available in |
| 03:26.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: BRL-CAD. Eventually this will replace the existing find.c file, but as it is |
| 03:26.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: nowhere near ready for primetime keep it elsewhere for now. DO NOT ADD to |
| 03:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: makefiles. At this stage the effort is to get very basic functionality working, |
| 03:27.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: then build from there. If substituted in correctly this version can see objects |
| 03:27.34 | starseeker | decides that's as good a stopping point as any and heads home for the evening... |
| 03:41.19 | louipc | yar glad to have BRL-CAD working again |
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| 11:12.48 | ``Erik | starseeker: tcl sucks, but if you look at it the right way, it's almost like a shitty lisp with horrible syntax... it has a fair number of the simple concepts |
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| 11:55.41 | andrecastelo | good morning :D |
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| 14:36.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32571 10/brlcad/trunk/ (20 files in 6 dirs): Added ADC (angle distance cursor) functions to libged. Added ADC drawing to libdm. Added ADC command to libtclcad. |
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| 19:07.05 | starseeker | woot! Go Malamud! |
| 19:11.13 | ``Erik | malawhat? |
| 19:13.17 | starseeker | Carl Malamud - putting all kinds of public law and code online for free |
| 19:13.28 | starseeker | sometimes in defiance of claimed copyright by states |
| 19:13.48 | ``Erik | ah, that project, yeah, sounds cool |
| 19:13.57 | starseeker | it's awesome |
| 19:14.12 | ``Erik | that fucktards are trying to exert IP crap over public law is bull |
| 19:14.17 | starseeker | can't wait until someone gets public law organized into a subversion or git repository :-) |
| 19:14.35 | ``Erik | heh, cvs diff ftw? |
| 19:14.42 | starseeker | exactly :-) |
| 19:14.52 | starseeker | finally make sense out of US law :-) |
| 19:15.07 | archivist_ub | not possible |
| 19:15.15 | starseeker | submit diffs to your congresscritter ;-) |
| 19:15.30 | ``Erik | cvs ann, acquire pitchfork and torch |
| 19:15.33 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:15.34 | archivist_ub | compile a lawyer |
| 19:16.21 | starseeker | Now that hard disks have caught up, there really is no excuse for not having all public law in the united states available as a download |
| 19:16.30 | starseeker | heck, all public works |
| 19:16.52 | ``Erik | I think the capacities were there a decade ago |
| 19:17.07 | starseeker | <snort> not sure about that, ever seen a law library? |
| 19:17.23 | ``Erik | um, had one in my posession about ten years ago :D |
| 19:17.42 | starseeker | with case history and everything? |
| 19:18.18 | ``Erik | law firm sold their old server to upgrade, had a stack of scsi cdroms and 3.5" floppy with netware on it, with a single nic |
| 19:18.26 | starseeker | lol! |
| 19:18.40 | ``Erik | we think the company didn't realize the $10 'puter we bought still had their $10k of cd's in it |
| 19:19.16 | ``Erik | the neat thing was the floppy was mounted in the lower hard drive things, facing inside, so you had to disassemble the machine to eject the disk :D |
| 19:19.40 | ``Erik | we slapped a drive in and installed I think suse at a luc |
| 19:20.00 | starseeker | did they ever ask for the disks back? |
| 19:20.10 | ``Erik | d'no, I wasn't there at the purchase |
| 19:20.10 | starseeker | saw systems like that in libraries, come to think of it... |
| 19:20.28 | ``Erik | they drug it to the luc meeting and we tore into it |
| 19:20.52 | starseeker | heh |
| 19:22.58 | starseeker | always found law very boring, but access to the whole of it and applying analysis tools to make sense of it is something else again |
| 19:24.13 | archivist_ub | I bought an Altos386 for work and it had case details still on it |
| 19:28.18 | starseeker | eek |
| 19:30.03 | archivist_ub | it was at a time in the UK when lawyers were miss selling mortgages and were being struck off, they didnt get time to clear the disk |
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| 21:28.54 | mafm | hello |
| 21:54.36 | mafm | congrats to all gsoc students, I think that we all passed the evaluations :) |
| 22:06.32 | louipc | nice |
| 22:07.53 | mafm | now time for the mentors to go to the parties ¬_¬ |
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| 23:41.05 | andrecastelo | hello folks |
| 23:41.09 | andrecastelo | congratulations to everyone :D |
| 23:41.27 | andrecastelo | and a very big thank you to brlcad and ``Erik :D |
| 23:46.58 | mafm | hi andrecastelo :) |
| 23:47.02 | andrecastelo | hey mafm |
| 23:47.06 | andrecastelo | >) |
| 23:47.11 | andrecastelo | :)* |
| 23:47.45 | mafm | well, I better go to finish some things and sleep |
| 23:47.50 | mafm | see you :) |
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| 04:26.00 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 19:31.31 | andrecastelo | howdy all |
| 19:33.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32572 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 6 dirs): Added grid and snap-to-grid functionality. |
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| 20:57.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32573 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Now able to print the full path string for a returned match. Requires db_fullpath_traverse tree walker, so adding that in this commit as well. |
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| 01:08.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32574 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/analyze.c mged/anal.c): make findang() static |
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| 04:02.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32575 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Update the find routines to use arguments to work on the plans, and return integers to allow error mechanisms to do their thing. MGED doesn't crash any more when an unescaped * is expanded by TCL. |
| 04:34.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32576 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nfind.c: Activate other parsing options, fix a few more problems. |
| 05:05.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32577 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 05:05.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Fix a crash caused by too few args, add to normal MGED environment as nfind for |
| 05:05.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: easier testing. Although this is technically user visible I'm not quite sure |
| 05:05.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: it's NEWS file ready, so holding off - more work to do both in features and |
| 05:05.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: testing. |
| 05:10.34 | starseeker | Here's an illustration of pretty much all it can do right now, using m35.g as the test db: http://paste.bzflag.bz/m505c5334 |
| 05:10.41 | starseeker | all it's got is name, but it's a start |
| 05:10.59 | starseeker | is going home now... |
| 05:16.16 | Ralith | nice |
| 05:18.04 | starseeker | is mildly proud of himself for rewiring the plan handling, error handling, and a new tree walker on his own, although he's sure brlcad will quickly thrash it to compost when he gets a chance ;-) |
| 05:20.04 | starseeker | logs out and hits the road |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32578 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Fix icon and redirected invocation after much pain and suffering. |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: This 'should' properly refix sf bug 2019280 (mged incorrectly deduces |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: interactivity). |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Wasn't able to find out exactly why select() is returning exceptfds |
| 08:08.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: set. There is no MSG_OOB pending afaikt and recv() reports it as not |
| 08:08.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: a valid socket making it difficult to distinguish between a here doc |
| 08:14.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32579 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nfind.c: include nfind.h |
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| 16:57.39 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
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| 19:56.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32580 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (get_regions.tcl reid.tcl remat.tcl): use 'get' instead of 'db' as a dependency since db doesn't exist until after opendb. |
| 19:57.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32581 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/tclIndex: update the index for get_regions.tcl |
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| 21:40.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32582 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Add the ability to use nfind with attributes, e.g. nfind -attr rgb=255/255/255 -attr oshader=glass to find all the objects with colorless glass as a shader. |
| 21:41.17 | starseeker | technically I guess that's white glass - oh well |
| 21:43.48 | starseeker | need to add something specific for "nonstandard" attributes - e.g. find an attribute not in the supplied list. Maybe add support for -attr !(region, region_id, ...,) or some such... |
| 21:45.24 | starseeker | maybe find has that tucked away somewhere, or something similar... |
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| 01:44.48 | deeeffache | is there any more detailed installation documentation other then README and INSTALL?? I downloaded 7.10.4. Theres no configure file though. I downloaded autogen.sh, libtools, autoconf and automake.. I put autogen.sh in the same dir with INSTALL and README and ran it.. the resulting configure file runs, but make fails. was that the right place to put it? |
| 01:55.18 | starseeker | You might want to download the 7.12.6 tarball and try that |
| 01:55.40 | starseeker | ./configure --enable-all && make |
| 01:55.49 | starseeker | unless you want to use some system libs |
| 01:56.04 | starseeker | then ./configure && make |
| 01:58.09 | louipc | yeah the tarball should have pretty much everything you need |
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| 02:37.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32583 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nfind.c: Whoopsie - fix order of args to fnmatch, so I actually get pattern matching |
| 03:17.28 | louipc | âµ |
| 03:46.15 | starseeker | then ./configure && make |
| 03:46.18 | starseeker | whoops |
| 03:46.20 | starseeker | sorry |
| 03:49.21 | louipc | hey starseeker |
| 03:50.49 | louipc | do you know how to disable follow mouse window focus in mged? |
| 04:32.05 | deeeffache | ok, i downloaded 7.12.2.. still no configure scripts or anything |
| 04:39.11 | deeeffache | and you guys said 7.12.6.. and i was downloading ht elinux package not the source.. um, i think i should be alright now, thanks for making me notice |
| 04:51.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32584 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): add nattr option - a simple reversal of the attr option, but useful for (say) finding all objects with attributes that do NOT have the region attr set: nfind -nattr region -attr \* |
| 05:41.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32585 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (6 files): need to make sure the commands we're looking for are loaded if they're available otherwise info commands may still fail. |
| 05:45.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32586 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/wdb_obj.c mged/cmd.c mged/cmd.h mged/setup.c): add a stub interface for commands (like 'db') that don't exist until after other commands are run (e.g. opendb). this lets us get help on commands even if they don't exactly exist |
| 06:13.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32587 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): |
| 06:13.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Add stdattr option which takes 0 or 1 and sorts based on whether attributes are |
| 06:13.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: standard - 1 returns objects with one or more standard attributes and no |
| 06:13.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: non-standard, 0 returns objects with one or more non-standard. Between the zero |
| 06:13.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: setting for this option and the attr option it should now be possible to achieve |
| 06:13.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the effects desired in feature request 1177374. |
| 06:29.22 | deeeffache | is there a list of what libraries are required for compile anywhere?? |
| 06:57.58 | Ralith | deeeffache, configure will tell you what, if anything, is missing. You'll find brl-cad to be pretty self-contained, though. |
| 07:01.31 | deeeffache | i have an error during make libtool: link: cannot find the library `../../src/other/incrTcl/libitk.la' |
| 07:02.34 | deeeffache | any recommendation? |
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| 18:31.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32588 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Tweak behavior of stdattr option - add -1 option that will print a table of ALL nonstandard attr,value pairs at the expense of ignoring other find options. |
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| 18:32.39 | bjorkBSD | how's good-ole brl these days? |
| 18:32.48 | starseeker | busy :-) |
| 18:34.57 | bjorkBSD | hmm. i need to revive my brl-cad-iness. |
| 18:35.03 | bjorkBSD | it's still use tcl/tk right? |
| 18:35.09 | starseeker | yep |
| 18:35.28 | starseeker | work going on exploring other options, but for the moment it's still tcl/tk |
| 18:40.11 | bjorkBSD | hmmm. |
| 18:41.08 | starseeker | The libged work Bob is doing will help make the functionality MGED independent |
| 19:16.34 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 19:17.01 | yukonbob | starseeker: re: options BLASPHEMY!!! |
| 20:20.06 | brlcad | settles in and breathes a sigh of relief |
| 20:21.41 | brlcad | starseeker: find has (or at least you should add it) built-in negation support, so if you have a -stdattr option, finding non-standard options becomes simply -not -stdattr |
| 20:22.22 | brlcad | -not -or -and with parens gives you complete boolean recipes for just about any action |
| 20:27.06 | brlcad | that might/should make the arg to -stdattr just go away |
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| 21:17.06 | brlcad | deeeffache: did you figure out your compile problems? |
| 21:17.30 | brlcad | the libitk.la problem sounds like a stale libtool, need to re-run autogen.sh and make noprod |
| 21:47.43 | deeeffache | brlcad: Many thanks. got past that error.. theres a new one now, but i can take care of this one. |
| 22:32.30 | deeeffache | omg it works. Thanks to everyone who helped out in the past day. |
| 22:47.50 | brlcad | deeeffache: be sure to check out the tutorials on the website |
| 22:48.04 | brlcad | there's a lot to learn before things start to click and make sense |
| 22:49.09 | yukonbob | heh -- _now_ the hard part begins ;) |
| 23:15.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32589 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: still need to make mged behave better detecting whether it's being run interactively or not. |
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| 23:56.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32590 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_path.c: comment ws |
| 23:58.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32591 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: ws |
| 23:58.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32592 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: have GED_INIT() call ged_init() since it does almost everything we need |
| 00:03.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32593 10/brlcad/trunk/ (13 files in 7 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 00:03.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: absorb the old mged 'edcolor' command into the 'color' command as a -e option. |
| 00:03.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: this reduces the entropy by removing a lot of duplication shared between the two |
| 00:03.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: commands. they still could use some refactoring to make _ged_edcolor go away, |
| 00:03.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: but it's a start. this ALSO makes it so there is no mged command that doesn't |
| 00:03.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: have non-blocking behavior when run without arguments (edcolor blocks until |
| 00:03.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: editor terminates). there are still some edcolor hooks that need to be removed |
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| 00:29.03 | deeeffache | Im going through all the docs now and tutorials.. Is there a comprehensive list of keyboard shortcuts anywhere? And, what does Shift+z do and how do i stop it?? |
| 00:32.29 | brlcad | press 0 |
| 00:33.01 | brlcad | xyzXYZ all rotate the view along that axis forward and reverse (in caps) |
| 00:33.10 | brlcad | 0 stops the rotation |
| 00:33.18 | brlcad | emulates a knob device |
| 00:34.03 | brlcad | there isn't a comprehensive list of shortcuts for mged's display manager -- there is, however, a command quick reference sheet and a shift-grips guide (for manipulating the view with your mouse) |
| 00:34.19 | brlcad | the menus will show you what the shortcuts are if there is a key bound |
| 00:40.00 | deeeffache | thanks, the 1000 fps of a rotating wireframe sphere was causing my pc to overheat a lil bit, i do have those to reference sheets you mentioned.. moving on |
| 00:44.16 | starseeker | brlcad: The difficulty with finding non-standard options is if I not something that finds standard attributes, it also returns things that have NO attributes |
| 00:44.45 | starseeker | brlcad: I'll think about it some more - I was a tad tired working on it earlier |
| 00:45.26 | starseeker | I need to make sure it doesn't return just things that have ONLY non-standard attributes |
| 00:47.29 | starseeker | also Dwayne wants a table printout of objects and attributes, which isn't what find does. |
| 00:47.32 | brlcad | starseeker: sounds like you need another option |
| 00:47.39 | brlcad | what do you have now? |
| 00:48.34 | brlcad | find is considerably more powerful and useful than table processing |
| 00:48.35 | starseeker | just the stdattr option - 1 returns all objects with only standard attributes, 0 returns all objects with 1 or more nonstandard attributes, and -1 is Dwayne's table |
| 00:48.40 | brlcad | tis a valid request, but different problem |
| 00:48.45 | starseeker | nods |
| 00:48.57 | starseeker | the attr table should probably just be a new command |
| 00:49.13 | brlcad | gut says find really shouldn't dump multiple formats at this point |
| 00:49.22 | starseeker | thought so too |
| 00:49.43 | starseeker | just wanted to use find to kill that feature request - in retrospect that doesn't make much sense though |
| 00:51.18 | starseeker | can I just make a nonstdattr command that takes a list of "standard" attributes and does what Dwayne wants? |
| 00:51.28 | starseeker | didn't like hardcoding what "standard" was either |
| 00:52.13 | brlcad | for find, I expected you'd have something like -attr akin to -name, -aregex akin to -regex but for attributes, and -stdattr basically being a shorthand for a long list of ( -attr regionID -or -attr color -or ... ) |
| 00:52.37 | brlcad | maybe even exactly doing that expansion in the plan preparation |
| 00:53.21 | starseeker | would prefer to take the "stdattr" question out of find - you think it has merit? |
| 00:53.33 | brlcad | so if you wanted all objects with non-standard attributes set, find / -attr * -not -stdattr |
| 00:53.49 | brlcad | i could go either way |
| 00:54.15 | brlcad | seems out of place, but there is a lot of value in knowing what's off the norm in a db |
| 00:54.29 | brlcad | no sure what the corrollary in that case is with fs find |
| 00:54.44 | brlcad | also, if you want a 'find' that doesn't conflict namespace-wise, you could just call it 'search' |
| 00:55.08 | brlcad | makes it unambiguous and doesn't conflict with system or tcl |
| 00:55.15 | brlcad | even if use is the same |
| 00:57.43 | starseeker | brlcad: find / -attr * -not -stdattr was what I was trying to figure out |
| 00:57.59 | starseeker | I knew this would go faster with you around ;-) |
| 00:58.56 | brlcad | also, if you're going to return full-path matches, you'll probably need some way to deal with the duality nature of the searches (sometimes as tree, sometimes as flat dir) |
| 00:59.14 | brlcad | maybe make "/" and "." imply one or the other |
| 00:59.34 | starseeker | Hmm - there is some kind of "path" option - maybe that will work. |
| 00:59.42 | starseeker | bbl, gotta get supper |
| 00:59.48 | brlcad | e.g. find / -name whatever vs find . -name whatever |
| 01:00.08 | brlcad | with the prior returning /path/to/whatever and the later returning just whatever pathless |
| 01:00.41 | brlcad | so if you do find . -type region, you get a list of all regions in the db |
| 01:01.06 | brlcad | but if you find / -type region, you get a list of all uses of a region in an assembly in the db (unless there are top-level regions) |
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| 02:54.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32594 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Revert nattr and stdattr commands - the former should be handled with not and the latter needs a bit of rethinking. |
| 02:56.00 | brlcad | starseeker: another option is to just use -attr but provide some keyword/group |
| 02:58.25 | brlcad | e.g. something like -group for permissions, like "--attrgroup default" |
| 02:58.37 | starseeker | that's an idea |
| 02:59.18 | brlcad | the "better" fix I think would be to introduce namespaces and all the defaults would just be in a default namespace |
| 02:59.25 | brlcad | then you'd just use -attr |
| 02:59.43 | starseeker | namespaces? |
| 02:59.59 | brlcad | find . -attr ::std::* |
| 03:00.12 | starseeker | ah |
| 03:00.16 | brlcad | instead of regionID, it'd be something like ::std::regionID |
| 03:00.33 | brlcad | but that entails a fair bit of changes to support it |
| 03:00.39 | starseeker | indeed |
| 03:00.43 | brlcad | since the point is to have a namespace that is only optionally specified |
| 03:01.32 | starseeker | re: name - do you want me to change it to "search"? |
| 03:01.41 | brlcad | another option could be to make the defaults all UPPERCASE |
| 03:02.23 | brlcad | then you don't even need namespaces, you'd just find . -regattr '[A-Z]+' |
| 03:02.47 | brlcad | or some similar naming convention |
| 03:02.53 | starseeker | I actually kind of like the "attrgroup" notion, particularly if we let the user make their own |
| 03:03.33 | brlcad | heh, if you do that .. they have to be stored :) |
| 03:03.35 | starseeker | have an attrgroup attribute that lists which attributes are "groups", and then have attr_standard, attr_analysis1, etc. |
| 03:04.01 | brlcad | could set the attribute groups as attributes on _GLOBAL |
| 03:04.38 | brlcad | could hook it into the attr command |
| 03:05.19 | starseeker | nice |
| 03:05.25 | brlcad | hm, have to think on that some .. it is a bit error-prone/fugly |
| 03:05.49 | starseeker | sure |
| 03:06.09 | brlcad | it's certainly more work too (compared to a naming/namespacing convention) |
| 03:06.28 | brlcad | wanders home |
| 03:06.33 | starseeker | isn't too sure he wants to change the naming convention at this point for the standard attributes... |
| 03:06.37 | starseeker | where's home now? |
| 03:06.44 | brlcad | hotel :) |
| 03:06.50 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 03:06.59 | starseeker | will you be in Monday? |
| 03:06.59 | brlcad | finally healed |
| 03:07.04 | starseeker | ?? |
| 03:07.04 | brlcad | yeah |
| 03:07.16 | starseeker | what happened? |
| 03:07.18 | brlcad | was in quite a bit of pain, lots of injuries from the move |
| 03:07.29 | starseeker | owowow |
| 03:07.33 | starseeker | not good |
| 03:08.06 | starseeker | ok, take care - glad to see you back! |
| 03:08.16 | brlcad | yeah, on the last day after I'd been up about 40 hours hauling stuff around and on my feet the whole time was probably the worst |
| 03:08.28 | starseeker | jeez |
| 03:08.40 | brlcad | i've not been in that much pain in years, probably not since I had hypothermia .. very very painful |
| 03:09.20 | starseeker | you shoulda asked for help - we could have pitched in |
| 03:09.39 | brlcad | I know, lots of offers to help I turned down :) |
| 03:09.45 | brlcad | appreciated though |
| 03:09.58 | brlcad | it was just something I had to do this go-round |
| 03:10.20 | brlcad | maybe get help when I move in someplace next month |
| 03:10.30 | brlcad | for now, though, it's really nice being mobile |
| 03:10.35 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:10.48 | starseeker | can see you getting to like it... |
| 03:10.49 | brlcad | but I now have a mountain of e-mails and past-due deadlines to respond to, hence the weekend |
| 03:10.54 | brlcad | I am already! |
| 03:11.07 | brlcad | it's very addictive.. I could just pack up and go anywhere |
| 03:11.08 | brlcad | tonight |
| 03:11.11 | brlcad | pretty cool :) |
| 03:11.21 | starseeker | ah, yes - I take it you got the messages from all sides about presenting next week? |
| 03:11.31 | brlcad | late thursday :) |
| 03:11.45 | starseeker | you good there? Anything I can do to help? |
| 03:12.01 | brlcad | apparently I was signed up to present while out at siggraph (of which I've still not gotten to those e-mails yet) |
| 03:12.10 | brlcad | unless I missed something even older |
| 03:12.17 | starseeker | eeek |
| 03:12.20 | brlcad | no matter, it shouldn't be anything difficult |
| 03:12.33 | starseeker | OK. Let me know if you change your mind |
| 03:12.34 | brlcad | just needed to have a dry run on tuesday and I took leave the whole week |
| 03:13.05 | brlcad | at least there's no way I could have done that on tuesday .. physically could not have made it in at that point |
| 03:13.29 | starseeker | jeez |
| 03:13.50 | brlcad | still have to find my phone though |
| 03:14.07 | brlcad | it's dead somewhere |
| 03:15.24 | brlcad | the only thing I really miss is my data archive ... which I annoyingly and inadvertently put into a crate at the very back of my storage |
| 03:15.32 | starseeker | ouch |
| 03:15.38 | brlcad | oh, and my scotch glass |
| 03:15.41 | starseeker | lol |
| 03:15.47 | starseeker | sounds like you needed that |
| 03:15.57 | brlcad | has the scotch, just not his glass |
| 03:16.27 | starseeker | sounds like an excuse for a scotch glass upgrade |
| 03:16.36 | brlcad | I should at least have internet now .. didn't at first while still between spots |
| 03:16.42 | starseeker | figured |
| 03:17.12 | starseeker | kinda unnerving working on find on my own though :-) |
| 03:17.12 | brlcad | really wanders back now |
| 03:17.15 | starseeker | k |
| 03:17.22 | starseeker | have a good night! |
| 03:17.27 | brlcad | yeah, I haven't gotten to that bin of mail yet :) |
| 03:17.38 | brlcad | I have like 300 message that have piled up |
| 03:17.44 | brlcad | 200 are for gsoc though |
| 03:17.46 | starseeker | tries to fix all the bugs before brlcad sees them... |
| 03:18.09 | brlcad | the only thing I saw at a glance that was questionable |
| 03:18.12 | brlcad | was the new walker |
| 03:18.13 | starseeker | oh, when you get a chance, can you set me up with admin so I can do a 7.12.6 news post on the website? |
| 03:18.23 | brlcad | trying to have *fewer* walkers, more generalized :) |
| 03:18.30 | starseeker | brlcad: Yeah, I figured you would be leary of that... |
| 03:18.32 | brlcad | not more specialized :) |
| 03:19.16 | starseeker | I wanted full paths, walking the tree not the pointers, and function calls for every comb and leaf |
| 03:19.29 | starseeker | couldn't figure out how to get that out of any of the existing options |
| 03:19.34 | brlcad | there are plenty of walkers that will give you every comb and leaf |
| 03:19.53 | brlcad | not sure what you mean by "walking the tree not the pointers" though |
| 03:20.08 | starseeker | db_functree uses the next pointer to get all objects |
| 03:20.21 | starseeker | I wanted the db_walk_tree style "follow the children" approach |
| 03:20.53 | brlcad | still don't "get" what you mean, but I don't need to just yet :) |
| 03:20.57 | starseeker | I'll run it by you when you get a chance - that's one of the reasons it's not announced yet |
| 03:21.05 | brlcad | it's also under the hood |
| 03:21.16 | brlcad | save for the raytrace.h publishing |
| 03:21.23 | brlcad | should add a comment saying don't use it for now |
| 03:21.30 | starseeker | right |
| 03:21.32 | brlcad | so it doesn't have to be deprecated |
| 03:21.41 | brlcad | or don't even put it there |
| 03:21.59 | starseeker | can I call it from libged without it? |
| 03:22.08 | brlcad | sure |
| 03:22.12 | brlcad | it's just a declaration |
| 03:22.20 | brlcad | you just declare it where you use it |
| 03:22.41 | brlcad | sans all the BU RT wrapping that the public headers need |
| 03:23.08 | brlcad | really wanders off now |
| 03:23.19 | starseeker | OK - I'll slap a comment in tonight and look at it on Monday |
| 03:23.20 | starseeker | night! |
| 03:23.20 | brlcad | i'll be back on-line in a few min |
| 03:23.26 | brlcad | cya |
| 03:23.28 | starseeker | Oh, OK :-) |
| 03:25.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32595 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: Add comment to not use db_fullpath_traverse as it is experimental - may take it out of public altogether. |
| 04:15.06 | brlcad | munches on a most excellen gyro |
| 04:24.36 | starseeker | brlcad is eating gyroscopes? |
| 04:24.59 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:25.02 | brlcad | spins |
| 04:25.37 | starseeker | "food that will give you balance in life" |
| 04:27.07 | brlcad | :) |
| 04:27.59 | starseeker | brlcad: I hope find is worth a month 'cause it's looking like it could take that :-P |
| 04:29.19 | starseeker | should learn how to write tcl scripts for real fun inside MGED... |
| 04:29.22 | brlcad | it's probably worth more frankly |
| 04:29.38 | brlcad | it really is one of those uber-powerful commands |
| 04:29.43 | starseeker | phew :-) |
| 04:29.47 | brlcad | especially if done well |
| 04:30.01 | starseeker | will try to do it well - he sure doesn't want to do it poorly |
| 04:30.54 | starseeker | did get through some of the grunt stuff like rewiring the error handling last Thurs, but at the expense of a 2am night |
| 04:31.04 | starseeker | got me in a bit of trouble ;-) |
| 04:34.33 | starseeker | updates his gentoo box, just to keep things lively |
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| 14:34.57 | ``Erik | wow, brlcad isn't dead, nor living out of his car anymore! |
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| 14:54.41 | brlcad | heh |
| 16:51.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32596 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/plot.c: use the appropriate root instead of relying on a PATH search |
| 17:08.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32597 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 5 dirs): |
| 17:08.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: mged no longer requires that the PATH be set in order to run various commands |
| 17:08.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: that get externally invoked under the hood (e.g. fbclear). this has come up |
| 17:08.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: before, but was reminded by a forum post from Murray Blakeman (mblakeman). The |
| 17:08.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fix is to simply call bu_brlcad_root with the bin/command so that it does the |
| 17:08.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: proper lookup. |
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| 19:27.36 | starseeker | note to self: investigate possibility of a -printattr option for new find command |
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| 00:32.41 | brlcad | starseeker: that'd be better left to -exec |
| 00:33.04 | brlcad | find . -attr regionID -exec attr get regionID {} \; |
| 00:33.21 | brlcad | something like that |
| 00:34.22 | brlcad | find searches for objects in the db that have some characteristic, itemizing those objects -- doing anything with them beyond printing them is probably best left to other commands |
| 00:35.52 | starseeker | ok |
| 00:36.05 | starseeker | should start working on exec |
| 00:37.12 | brlcad | exec is going to require some libged changes |
| 00:37.14 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo____ (n=chatzill@189.71.72.40) | |
| 00:37.17 | starseeker | ick |
| 00:37.22 | brlcad | as find needs to know what commands are available |
| 00:37.26 | brlcad | no no, tis a good thing |
| 00:37.32 | brlcad | it's geometry engine work |
| 00:37.36 | brlcad | needs to happen regardless |
| 00:37.52 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 00:37.56 | brlcad | it should have been done for mged already, just not done yet |
| 00:38.22 | starseeker | should probably first get the . vs / path reporting set up... that shouldn't be too hard |
| 00:40.25 | starseeker | once I do, I take it exec is by far the most critical part to get up and running? |
| 00:42.22 | brlcad | not strictly necessary for the original task, but it is where most of the power is |
| 00:54.26 | starseeker | brlcad: Um - by "original task" do you mean Dwayne's feature request? |
| 00:55.19 | brlcad | yeah, sorta |
| 00:55.35 | starseeker | well, we've got the shader part covered |
| 00:55.38 | brlcad | finding objects with various attribute qualities |
| 00:56.22 | starseeker | the "non-standard attribute" bit still needs some work before it can be closed :-( |
| 01:16.05 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 01:16.05 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 02:47.35 | *** join/#brlcad grfrblshntz (n=smee@68-191-176-167.dhcp.stpt.wi.charter.com) | |
| 02:51.51 | grfrblshntz | Hello, I'm pretty new to using brlcad, and I'm trying to model a subtractive union, I used comb test u a - b, and it seems to be correct, showing a fully, and b has a dashed outline, which I'm assuming means it's the negative element. I want to see it drawn merely with the positive element without the subtracted portion, I can't seem to find how to do this, anyone? |
| 02:52.03 | brlcad | would like to buy a vowel for grfrblshntz |
| 02:52.16 | grfrblshntz | a's are going to $1000 |
| 02:52.57 | brlcad | for the wireframe rendering, there's not (presently) a way to not show the wireframes for all primitives involved |
| 02:53.17 | brlcad | there are ways to view an evaluated wireframe, though |
| 02:53.33 | brlcad | and you can always ray-trace the object -- which is usually the recommended method |
| 02:53.37 | grfrblshntz | evaluated, is like the ... yes. |
| 02:53.40 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:53.47 | brlcad | type "rt" into the command window |
| 02:53.52 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:54.03 | brlcad | or use the raytrace control panel under the file menu |
| 02:54.35 | brlcad | that'll use an embedded framebuffer that uses the same graphics window to render the raster image into it |
| 02:54.54 | grfrblshntz | I tried the raytrace from the file manu, already, and the subtracted part still showed up, I must have done something wrong |
| 02:55.02 | brlcad | ray-traced images are, however, raster images -- fully shaded evaluated displays are something we're working on |
| 02:55.05 | brlcad | type "who" |
| 02:55.24 | brlcad | you may still be displaying the primitives and the combination |
| 02:55.33 | brlcad | d a b |
| 02:55.36 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:55.53 | grfrblshntz | I did try "hide a" |
| 02:55.58 | grfrblshntz | does that not remove it |
| 02:56.14 | brlcad | dunno :) |
| 02:56.18 | brlcad | probably |
| 02:56.36 | brlcad | draw/hide are the 'new' commands, I'm used to the old cryptic short versions |
| 02:56.39 | grfrblshntz | (I may have made a mistake I tried various combinations of "hide a" "B -A", and then just "draw"ing the parts I needed |
| 02:56.43 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:56.52 | brlcad | d to delete from the display, e to display them for editing |
| 02:56.55 | grfrblshntz | d a b is the cryptic version? |
| 02:56.57 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:57.20 | grfrblshntz | any recommendations on how to learn all those commands? |
| 02:57.25 | brlcad | B == Z and e |
| 02:57.31 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 02:57.52 | brlcad | yeah, there's an mged quick reference sheet on the website -- that groups them by actions |
| 02:58.22 | brlcad | there's also the mged tutorial series, which goes through most of the core commands in depth over many many tutorials |
| 02:59.07 | grfrblshntz | Ok, I looked at and downloaded the quick reference, it seemed like the command list showed more than what was on it, but I didn't do a rigorous study |
| 03:00.00 | grfrblshntz | I just started looking at the tutorials today, but there style is very foreign to me. |
| 03:00.06 | grfrblshntz | Thanks for you help |
| 03:02.20 | brlcad | the command list? |
| 03:02.22 | brlcad | which list? |
| 03:03.35 | brlcad | the tutorials all build upon each other, with each lesson teaching a new concept -- more like lessons you'd get if you took a training class for a few days |
| 03:03.48 | brlcad | you wouldn't just jump into the fifth lesson, for example |
| 03:04.32 | brlcad | they are pretty comprehensive of the basics, though .. and can usually be done in under a day if you are intent on reading and learning |
| 03:04.59 | grfrblshntz | oh, sorry, I went away a bit. |
| 03:05.05 | grfrblshntz | It's.. in the help menu... |
| 03:05.14 | grfrblshntz | help commands |
| 03:05.15 | brlcad | the quick reference covers 99% of the most important commands |
| 03:05.18 | grfrblshntz | help > commands |
| 03:05.20 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 03:05.54 | brlcad | the ones its missing are mostly for advanced modeling practices, experimental or custom commands, or redudandant commands mostly |
| 03:06.06 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 03:06.20 | grfrblshntz | lots of terse names |
| 03:06.47 | brlcad | yep, the mged command line was developed very similarly to the unix command line (and around the same timeframe) |
| 03:07.43 | grfrblshntz | Oh, yes, I love apropos |
| 03:07.53 | grfrblshntz | I was thrilled that that was in there |
| 03:08.09 | grfrblshntz | It's how I've gotten most of what I've done so far done |
| 03:08.17 | brlcad | it's not a very good apropos implementation, needs to be expanded |
| 03:08.24 | brlcad | along with full manpages for all commands :) |
| 03:08.54 | brlcad | there are about 300 mged commands and about 400 external command-line commands |
| 03:08.54 | grfrblshntz | well, I just appreciate the attempt |
| 03:09.23 | grfrblshntz | I just found out about "tire", anything else like that thats fun to use? |
| 03:09.25 | brlcad | about 300 of the external ones are documented, most of the mged ones are documented in the help and (more comprehensively) on the wiki |
| 03:09.53 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 03:09.55 | brlcad | tire is one of the 400, probably ;) |
| 03:10.36 | brlcad | there is a fence generator, a vegitation generator, a "sphere flake" generator, tools for making nuts and bolts, several sample geometry databases |
| 03:10.48 | grfrblshntz | Ummm... you are "brlcad"? Are you involved with developing somehow? or just a big enough fan to make it you login name? |
| 03:10.56 | brlcad | just scratching the surface of course |
| 03:11.19 | brlcad | you could say i'm a bit of a fan :) |
| 03:11.30 | grfrblshntz | well, I can see why, lots of good stuf |
| 03:11.32 | grfrblshntz | stuff |
| 03:11.43 | brlcad | is also the project lead |
| 03:12.00 | grfrblshntz | The last time I tried it, I got intimidated, and gave up, this time, for some reason, I'm having better results |
| 03:12.33 | grfrblshntz | I've been searching for a good open source CAD program for a while, so far I've found brlcad and freecad |
| 03:12.47 | grfrblshntz | I'm not sure about freecad, but I'm not giving up on it ye |
| 03:12.49 | grfrblshntz | yet |
| 03:13.18 | brlcad | we're by far the most extensively developed and the only actually in production use that I know of |
| 03:13.23 | brlcad | but we still have a LONG ways to go |
| 03:13.37 | brlcad | especially compared to the featuresets of most of the commercial CAD systems |
| 03:14.23 | grfrblshntz | I'm a long way off from being able to write any code for a CAD program, but something like BRLCAD means I can start reading code |
| 03:14.24 | brlcad | our focus over the years has been very different and our resources considerably constrained -- you're more than welcome to join the team to help make things better ;) |
| 03:15.01 | grfrblshntz | Well, I'll start reading the code, and see if I can find something I might be able to help with, I'd love to, eventually |
| 03:15.06 | brlcad | this is kind of where we currently sit: http://brlcad.org/Industry_Diagram.png |
| 03:15.17 | grfrblshntz | Joining projects is one of my next goals |
| 03:17.09 | brlcad | relating that to other packages, CADD is sort of the AutoCAD domain, CATIA sort of fits in the CAID/CAD domain, GibbsCAM is square in the MCAD domain, etc |
| 03:17.09 | grfrblshntz | That's a nice diagram, what was the program that made it? |
| 03:17.09 | brlcad | indesign or illustrator, I forget .. think it was indesign |
| 03:17.10 | grfrblshntz | ok |
| 03:17.10 | grfrblshntz | I guess it doesn't look that hard to make with a normal editor, I guess I just don't do much of that stuff |
| 03:17.14 | brlcad | looking to replicate it with free tools, and starseeker has a really nice conversion, but still figuring out what to do with the fonts |
| 03:17.30 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@12.162.247.10) | |
| 03:17.39 | brlcad | it uses the adobe garamond pro font iirc, which there's nothing free that comes anywhere close to its polish |
| 03:18.58 | brlcad | a lot of effort went into the exact kernings, layouts, how the dashed lines wrap around corners, the exact overlaps of the industries, the transparency/colors used, etc |
| 03:19.30 | dtidrow | I'm back ;-) |
| 03:19.42 | dtidrow | what did I miss? |
| 03:20.04 | grfrblshntz | While I've got your ear, and you seem to know quite a bit, I'm currently just designing some woodworking projects, you know, lots of simple arb8's, and I was wondering if there is anything that I could use to convert one arb8 into several smaller pieces. I was thinking of taking an arb8, and converting the edges to arb8's representing 2X4's, and the faces into plywood, etc. |
| 03:20.06 | grfrblshntz | ? |
| 03:20.17 | brlcad | howdy dtidrow |
| 03:20.29 | brlcad | dtidrow: noticed you missed another siggraph.. :/ |
| 03:20.36 | dtidrow | yeah ;-( |
| 03:20.55 | dtidrow | jumping jobs tends to do that... |
| 03:21.13 | dtidrow | not to mention relocating... |
| 03:21.54 | brlcad | grfrblshntz: hmm |
| 03:23.21 | grfrblshntz | Ok, it took a bit, but I just finally got to the point where I raytraced test/{a,b}, after "d a b", and it worked just like you said it should, I must not have deleted last time |
| 03:23.23 | brlcad | grfrblshntz: not sure exactly what you mean, but you can use the "inside" command in mged |
| 03:23.57 | brlcad | that will hollow out an arb8 by creating an inner arb8 the uses thicknesses specified for each of the 6 faces |
| 03:24.12 | grfrblshntz | ok, that's closer, I guess |
| 03:24.16 | brlcad | otherwise, you can cp the arb, and move the faces as needed for expecific cases |
| 03:24.27 | grfrblshntz | that's what I've been doing, so ar |
| 03:24.28 | grfrblshntz | far |
| 03:24.32 | grfrblshntz | dangit |
| 03:26.15 | grfrblshntz | is there a command to, for instance, translate point 1 of shape x to the coordinates of point 1 of shape y? for moving by easy reference? |
| 03:26.38 | grfrblshntz | so x is selected, with focal point 1, and something like "translate y.1"? |
| 03:27.49 | brlcad | yep |
| 03:28.10 | brlcad | see 'keypoint' and 'permute' for starters |
| 03:29.08 | grfrblshntz | Ok, well, I should probably just get to working on stuff for a while, I could probably come up with questions all night, but you've helped me enough, thanks, I'm sure I'll bug you again. |
| 03:30.03 | brlcad | belatedly notes 3ptarb, arb, and rfarb probably are of use to him as well |
| 03:50.39 | dtidrow | brlcad: so how did SIGGRAPH go? |
| 03:52.50 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177878636.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 03:53.44 | IriX64 | why do i get 7.11.0 out of sourceforge cvs checkout if you guys are up to 7.12.6? |
| 04:00.32 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/7.12.6.png <---- 7.12.6 in action :) |
| 04:01.42 | deeeffache | nice copter |
| 04:01.53 | deeeffache | the start menu reminds me of work though... |
| 04:02.20 | IriX64 | just plays :) |
| 04:07.19 | IriX64 | ciao |
| 04:25.12 | starseeker | wonders why the open design "Gray-Hoverman Antenna" has such poor handdrawn diagrams - surely some sucker has redone them in Dia, Inkscape or XFig... |
| 04:30.18 | starseeker | or BRL-CAD, for that matter - then as a bonus teach the NEC analysis systems to work on BRL-CAD models :-) |
| 04:30.56 | starseeker | wonders why it is that so much stuff that is interesting is also completely useless... |
| 04:32.31 | brlcad | dtidrow: pretty good, several really interesting papers |
| 04:33.35 | brlcad | having vanilla ice sing at the softimage party was pretty funny |
| 04:34.09 | brlcad | a really good paper on brep/nurbs, have to see if it can be implemented without violating a patent though |
| 04:35.22 | brlcad | and a great extension paper on breaking out models for diagrams that was an excellent follow-on to their paper last year |
| 04:36.30 | brlcad | the geek bar was pretty awesome to have this year, seeing eight rooms at once with a beverage bar nearby |
| 04:36.58 | brlcad | otherwise overall it was alright, not as good as last year in san diego but still pretty darn good |
| 04:39.04 | brlcad | the keynote was one of the best I've enjoyed to date, one of the founders of pixar spoke to lots of issues dear to my heart *sniff* |
| 05:01.14 | Ralith | <PROTECTED> |
| 05:01.50 | brlcad | Ralith: dunno |
| 05:02.11 | brlcad | can certainly get electrons for it easily enough as an acm member |
| 05:03.06 | brlcad | so if, for example, you were going to do something with it for brl-cad, probably wouldn't be a problem |
| 05:03.19 | Ralith | electrons for it? O.o |
| 05:03.27 | brlcad | a digital copy |
| 05:03.34 | Ralith | ah. |
| 05:03.52 | Ralith | would love to, but can't commit to a major project like that atm :/ |
| 05:06.13 | brlcad | nothing too major, the basics could probably be implemented in a few weeks, the whole thing minus interactivity would probably be a great gsoc-level project |
| 05:07.13 | Ralith | I think that might be hindered a bit by my lack of experience with handling this kind of data |
| 05:07.33 | Ralith | that said, I'm quite interested in going for gsoc next year |
| 05:08.13 | brlcad | ah great, looks like at least last year's work is on-line already: http://grail.cs.washington.edu/projects/cutaways/ |
| 05:08.40 | Ralith | oh, that kind of diagram. |
| 05:09.04 | Ralith | can't that be done easily enough with some clever subtractions? |
| 05:09.11 | brlcad | yep |
| 05:09.25 | brlcad | the whole work is how to do those clever subtractions |
| 05:09.31 | Ralith | I was imagining something more along the lines of engineering blueprints |
| 05:10.02 | brlcad | the follow-up work was how to perform completely automatic separation of components for visualization purposes without using any cutaways |
| 05:10.23 | Ralith | oo |
| 05:10.27 | Ralith | that sounds relevant. |
| 05:10.59 | brlcad | both approaches are highly relevant and useful |
| 05:11.17 | brlcad | and really really easy with our CSG system |
| 05:11.27 | Ralith | I have to say |
| 05:11.29 | Ralith | I <3 CSG |
| 05:11.35 | brlcad | probably easier than what they had to do in their system |
| 05:12.12 | Ralith | what sort of UI would you want to provide? A list of parts to be exposed? |
| 05:12.14 | brlcad | though they do have great interactive visualization software for theirs given their brep structure |
| 05:12.29 | Ralith | Anything more specific than that seems like just about as much work to use as a manual cutaway. |
| 05:13.01 | brlcad | for those diagrams on that site, the *only* thing specified was the object(s) listed in red |
| 05:13.31 | Ralith | hm. |
| 05:14.01 | Ralith | in that case, the extensive cutaway and other labels seem a bit excessive; or is all that configurable? |
| 05:14.05 | Ralith | maybe I should just read the paper :P |
| 05:14.08 | brlcad | everything else is automatic including the text layout, what to separate and label that was obstructing, how to cut (cylindrical, linear, patchwise, ..), how much to cut, how to best orient the diagram |
| 05:14.22 | Ralith | nice. |
| 05:14.31 | brlcad | it only labels the things that were in the way |
| 05:14.42 | Ralith | oh, cool! |
| 05:14.53 | Ralith | (that's a bit less than obvious with the human anatomy stuff) |
| 05:14.53 | brlcad | and/or whatever you asked for (in red) |
| 05:15.18 | brlcad | check out the video link |
| 05:15.28 | brlcad | they show it in action |
| 05:15.46 | Ralith | grabs |
| 05:16.57 | brlcad | mm, yeah .. 100MB |
| 05:16.59 | brlcad | but worth it |
| 05:17.10 | Ralith | it's not like I'm doing anything realtime with my bw |
| 05:25.30 | Ralith | I really love academia sometimes |
| 05:25.45 | Ralith | a big group of people who just pump out neat ideas for other people to implement |
| 05:44.21 | *** join/#brlcad alex_jon1 (n=juve@81.196.65.201) | |
| 05:49.15 | Ralith | brlcad, that was really neat :D |
| 05:49.34 | Ralith | seems more straightforward than I had imagined |
| 05:49.58 | Ralith | I bet a lot of those classifications could be determined automatically with some accuracy, too |
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| 10:30.17 | brlcad | yeah, totally |
| 12:09.58 | *** join/#brlcad pippoo (n=a0dc9730@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 12:10.23 | pippoo | ciaoo a tutti |
| 13:30.36 | ``Erik | heh "extreme deceleration syndrome" |
| 13:36.32 | Axman6 | ``Erik: commonly known as crashing? or impact? |
| 13:37.10 | Axman6 | btw, 2^2^2^2^2^2^2 takes a long time to compute -_- |
| 13:37.19 | Axman6 | in haskell at least |
| 13:43.13 | Axman6 | i need a better solution to this problem -_- |
| 13:43.43 | Axman6 | i think the fact i needed to write my own power function was a bad sign |
| 14:00.36 | ``Erik | 7 dimensions? O.o |
| 14:01.07 | Axman6 | hyperexponentiation |
| 14:02.08 | ``Erik | 340282366920938463463374607431768211456 |
| 14:02.10 | ``Erik | all pheer lithp |
| 14:02.46 | ``Erik | ith fatht :D |
| 14:04.16 | ``Erik | in '99 or '00, I was writing some numerical solvers, usually wrote in haskell, let it run... got bored, reimplemented it in scheme, ran it in the slowest scheme known to man (guile) and got the final results before the haskell version was done with the first or second... but that was using hugs, which I understand to be insanely slow (yet another gnu project) |
| 14:04.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32598 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 6 dirs): Added rubber band rectangle functionality. |
| 14:04.48 | Axman6 | yeah, ghc's the only way to go |
| 14:04.58 | ``Erik | is that 'glaskow'? |
| 14:05.13 | Axman6 | glasgow? |
| 14:05.22 | ``Erik | er, yeah |
| 14:05.48 | ``Erik | ah, yes it is, I've heard that was the shizzle forizzle, hadn't messed with hit |
| 14:06.26 | ``Erik | the pattern match function definition style is shweet, but monads can be annoying when you just want a quick&dirty program |
| 14:06.46 | Axman6 | they're working on some stuff atm what has the possibility of making it faster than C for parallel work, which is pretty cool |
| 14:07.49 | Axman6 | yeah, monads are a bitch at times. i still don't have a cleat picture in my mind of what they really are |
| 14:08.16 | Axman6 | infinite integers is pretty cool though |
| 14:08.34 | Axman6 | well, handling infinite things in general is pretty cool |
| 14:08.48 | ``Erik | like map/apply type dealies? I've been wanting to experiment with tweaking a scheme compiler to mark referential transperancy, do some minor re-arranging of the syntax tree, and automagically multi-thread and distribute work as it deems fit |
| 14:09.46 | ``Erik | (map f '(a b c)) executes (f a) (f b) and (f c) in parallel and collects the results for return, that kinda shtuff |
| 14:11.02 | Axman6 | yeah, sort of. more working with parallel arrays, which they're using some very simple ideas to get something very powerful |
| 14:11.26 | Axman6 | http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/2269 |
| 14:11.31 | Axman6 | worth watching |
| 14:12.50 | Axman6 | and the way they're doing it means that programming to use GPU's for parallel computation could become _really_ easy |
| 14:13.32 | Axman6 | literally just as easy as writing your code as if you weren't using a GPU. just use parallel types, and let the compuler and runtime handle the rest |
| 14:13.52 | ``Erik | that's a good website, um, the lemon one is also good |
| 14:14.20 | ``Erik | http://lemonodor.com/ |
| 14:17.48 | Axman6 | also, i'm pretty sure your answer to 2^2^2^2^2^2^2 was wrong. it should be many thousands of digits (since 2^2^2^2 is a few hundred digits) |
| 14:18.03 | ``Erik | o.O hrm, mebbe I input it wrong |
| 14:18.25 | Axman6 | supposed to be 2 to the power of 2 to the power of 2 to the... |
| 14:18.32 | ``Erik | ooh, got order of ops backwards |
| 14:20.34 | ``Erik | ohyeah, there's the explosion |
| 14:20.55 | Axman6 | hehe |
| 14:21.07 | ``Erik | 4 just filled my terminal |
| 14:21.16 | Axman6 | i'm so used to powers being really easy for computers |
| 14:21.28 | Axman6 | did it take a while to compute? |
| 14:21.42 | ``Erik | no, was instant |
| 14:22.06 | Axman6 | so 2^2^2.. 6 times? |
| 14:22.26 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:22.46 | Axman6 | 2ââ6 is one notation used |
| 14:23.10 | Axman6 | yeah, need another 2 expt's in there to get the kind of answer i'm looking for ;) |
| 14:24.12 | ``Erik | isn't sure he wants to know what the point is :D |
| 14:24.33 | Axman6 | pwoject euler :P |
| 14:24.37 | Axman6 | problem 188 |
| 14:25.03 | Axman6 | need to find the last 8 digits of 1777ââ1855 |
| 14:26.10 | Axman6 | anyway, sleep time. g'night |
| 14:28.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32599 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Remove edcolor.c from build. |
| 14:45.41 | ``Erik | later, dude |
| 15:09.28 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 15:09.28 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
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| 17:30.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32600 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Move db_fullpath_traverse directly into nfind, change command name to search. |
| 17:57.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32601 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/nfind.c: Correct some more error handling, have the usage message print now only for argc < 2 since the error cases of such commands have been handled. |
| 18:44.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32602 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Add ability to use '.' to do a 'flat' search of objects, as opposed to following the tree. In essence, this finds object rather than uses of objects - s.s instead of c1.c/s.s and c2.c/s.s |
| 18:48.54 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-192.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 18:56.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32603 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): |
| 18:56.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Add stdattr back in. This time it takes no options and tests that an object has |
| 18:56.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: only standard attributes. A ! on this option will return objects without |
| 18:56.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: standard attributes (including no attributes) - adding an -attr \* to the |
| 18:56.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: equation results in all objects with one or more nonstandard attributes. |
| 18:57.24 | prasad_ | hmm has anyone used libpcre? |
| 19:12.28 | brlcad | prasad_: erm, you really shouldn't need to :P |
| 19:13.03 | brlcad | libregex will get you posix, perl extensions are just petty syntactic sugar |
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| 20:22.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32604 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (nfind.c nfind.h): Add -type option to search by primitive type, and also comb and region. |
| 20:25.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32605 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (Makefile.am nfind.c nfind.h search.c search.h): move nfind.c and nfind.h to search.c and search.h |
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| 21:13.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32606 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 21:13.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Adding new search command based off of OpenBSD's find - uses combination of !, |
| 21:13.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: -o and () to form complex logical search structures. Currently implemented |
| 21:13.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: options include -name, -attr, -stdattr, and -type. -attr has the ability to |
| 21:13.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: search for either attributes or attribute,value pairs - e.g. -attr region_id vs. |
| 21:13.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: -attr region_id=100. stdattr will return a match if an object uses only |
| 21:14.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: standard attributes and uses more than one such attribute. name is the objects |
| 21:14.36 | brlcad | what about the rest of the boolean args? (-and -or -not) |
| 21:14.46 | starseeker | they're there |
| 21:14.50 | starseeker | ! is there for not |
| 21:15.01 | starseeker | -o for or |
| 21:15.06 | starseeker | and is the default |
| 21:15.08 | brlcad | the actual arg, not something equiv |
| 21:15.11 | starseeker | parenthesis work too |
| 21:15.18 | brlcad | default find, both work |
| 21:15.33 | starseeker | huh. OK, they can be added |
| 21:15.41 | starseeker | must have used code that didn't alias them |
| 21:16.10 | brlcad | the non-cryptic versions would be preferred over the cryptic ones if we had to pick, but there's no need to limit at least for the booleans |
| 21:17.12 | brlcad | hmm, freebsd's find has all three -- you sure openbsd didn't have them all too? |
| 21:17.28 | starseeker | might have - I hacked and slashed a lot early on |
| 21:18.25 | brlcad | hmm, freebsd doesn't even have -o |
| 21:18.56 | starseeker | yeah, it's got a lot more |
| 21:19.04 | starseeker | just a sec, I'll put 'em back |
| 21:19.34 | brlcad | ah, yeah it does .. just not in the manpage |
| 21:34.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32607 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Add back in other names for not, and and or options |
| 21:34.45 | starseeker | there ya go :-) |
| 21:39.11 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 22:08.32 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@c-71-197-213-172.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 22:57.31 | ``Erik | o.O it has -or in the manpage |
| 22:57.42 | ``Erik | in the 'operators' section |
| 00:52.21 | starseeker | ``Erik - there are a couple different options that lead to the same behavior - I missed that in my first cut |
| 00:53.47 | Ralith | oo |
| 00:53.52 | Ralith | AVRs are neat. |
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| 02:24.38 | brlcad | ``Erik: it has -or but it doesn't list -o (yet supports it) |
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| 12:21.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32608 10/brlcad/trunk/ (182 files in 3 dirs): Removed ged_result from struct ged. |
| 12:38.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32609 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcVariable.h solver_test.cpp): adding a compact display method (cdisplay()) to Solution object to display ranges of multiple solutions (mostly for debugging) |
| 12:43.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32610 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h include/tclcad.h src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Added the following members to ged_view: gv_adc, gv_grid and gv_rect. |
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| 13:07.58 | ``Erik | always viewed -o as short for -or (and not safe for portable scripts) |
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| 17:21.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32611 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Added ged_adc() to libged's command functions. Declared ged_init in ged.h (needed because of earlier redefinition of GED_INIT. |
| 17:57.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32612 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/adc.c: Remove adc draw toggle. |
| 18:55.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32613 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/load.c: improved error checking. Match ISST request protocol. |
| 18:56.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32614 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtienet/tienet_slave.c: C style comments |
| 20:07.06 | brlcad | starseeker: iff you did get the itch to play with a table view, http://tktable.sourceforge.net/ |
| 20:07.32 | brlcad | actually looks pretty complete (no screenshots though) |
| 20:08.01 | starseeker | cool - thanks! |
| 20:08.15 | starseeker | is there a good reverence detailing how to do an fnmatch in regex somewhere? |
| 20:09.14 | brlcad | try searching for converting glob to regex |
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| 22:10.30 | starseeker | scowls at regex |
| 22:47.47 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 22:53.00 | starseeker | looks at FreeBSD's find, after digging up the CVS browse link |
| 23:33.02 | Axman6 | starseeker: what's the problem? |
| 23:38.50 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:13.02 | starseeker | Axman6: just working on getting the -regex option for find (search in BRL-CAD) working |
| 00:29.59 | ``Erik | bwahahhaa |
| 00:30.12 | ``Erik | "barak obama, the son of a black man from kenya and a white man from kansas" wow |
| 00:30.20 | ``Erik | daily show ftw |
| 01:04.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32615 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (6 files in 2 dirs): two more C-style comments and a lotta cuddle bracing |
| 01:36.07 | Ralith | cuddle bracing? |
| 01:36.07 | Ralith | heh |
| 01:36.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32616 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: looks like the DSP needs some tess() loving.. apparently never implemented |
| 01:40.18 | starseeker | so I can find this tomorrow: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/usr.bin/find/ |
| 01:44.10 | ``Erik | it's the only cuddling a lot of coders get o.O |
| 01:44.43 | ``Erik | where's the linux one? in fileutils? |
| 02:24.28 | brlcad | ~botmail for Mouette see https://sourceforge.net/forum/message.php?msg_id=5221211 about the solaris inst still not working right |
| 03:15.42 | starseeker | ``Erik: Yeah. That one is GPL so it's a no-no for this |
| 03:15.52 | starseeker | don't think it will be needed though |
| 03:16.25 | starseeker | will spend a little quality time with gdb tomorrow and figure out what he did wrong |
| 03:17.14 | starseeker | on a side note, why the heck didn't my college programming courses spend about two weeks teaching gdb in the second semester???? |
| 03:28.00 | Ralith | I've been getting an increasing appreciation for the annoyingness of the GPL's viral nature lately. |
| 03:31.40 | brlcad | starseeker: gdb (or any debugger) wasn't taught in any of my courses either .. heck most of them didn't even teach the languages they required |
| 03:32.03 | brlcad | you were expected to pick it up in a week or two, all part of background research expected of everyone |
| 03:54.21 | starseeker | brlcad: That works find for those with enough computer background to do it - at the time my big computer experiences were Netscape on Macs and DOS editor in high school |
| 03:54.32 | starseeker | Plus a little Offic |
| 03:54.33 | starseeker | e |
| 03:55.41 | starseeker | Ah, well. Fair enough I guess, but at the time prior computer experience for freshman was NOT a given |
| 03:56.00 | brlcad | neither for my program |
| 03:56.21 | brlcad | they just didn't teach it, a lot of unis are like that |
| 03:56.44 | starseeker | I suppose. It would really have helped though |
| 03:58.46 | starseeker | I can see it being too much of a "trade school" approach |
| 03:59.19 | brlcad | yeah, I think that's basically what it amounts to |
| 03:59.28 | starseeker | remembers he DID get one programming experience in high school - Pascal :-) |
| 04:00.03 | starseeker | the last year before they started in with (IIRC) C++ |
| 04:00.12 | starseeker | was a bit annoyed |
| 04:00.14 | brlcad | akin to learning landscaping but never having someone teach you how to use a weed whacker |
| 04:00.24 | starseeker | nods |
| 04:03.02 | starseeker | the "trade school" argument would have held up better if they didn't put us through that semester of "Office 101" |
| 04:03.38 | starseeker | still cringes at the memory of wasting time doing trivial office tasks when he could have been learning More Powerfull Tools |
| 04:06.06 | Ralith | you were put through that in college? O.o |
| 04:07.32 | starseeker | nods |
| 04:07.49 | starseeker | kind of a "computer 101" course to make sure people could do what was needed |
| 04:08.01 | starseeker | the scariest thing is a LOT of them actually seemed to need it |
| 04:09.35 | starseeker | to be fair, 1998 was only 3 years after Win95 so desktop penetration wasn't as high |
| 04:10.16 | starseeker | No matter. Ancient history now |
| 04:10.16 | Ralith | yeah, but it's not the college's job to stop people from applying to high-level courses they don't have the background for |
| 04:10.27 | Ralith | and I don't think office is exactly necessary CS background. |
| 04:10.35 | starseeker | No, no - this wasn't for CS |
| 04:10.39 | Ralith | oh, ok. |
| 04:10.42 | starseeker | it was for the general college population |
| 04:11.07 | starseeker | Now LaTeX, that I could have gotten into :-) |
| 04:11.22 | Ralith | LaTeX is awesome. |
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| 14:57.51 | prasad_1 | netsplitz |
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| 15:17.06 | ``Erik | heh, starseeker, I had a couple classes where pretty much every assignment was in a different language, the primer to each language was "you can download it from X or log into the cs server and it's this command" |
| 15:18.17 | ``Erik | AI and theory of computation o.O theory devolved into just using scheme for everything, though |
| 15:18.28 | ``Erik | though markov chains were in c++ |
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| 15:32.02 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.31.249) | |
| 15:32.08 | andrecastelo | morning everyone :D |
| 16:08.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32617 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Add support for -regex and -iregex to search. Using REG_EXTENDED at the moment - if there is a need support can be added later for other options. |
| 17:10.40 | *** join/#brlcad prokoudine (n=avp@beacon.altlinux.ru) | |
| 17:10.47 | prokoudine | hi |
| 17:10.57 | prokoudine | i'm writing a small report on gsoc this year |
| 17:11.11 | prokoudine | are all of your projects completed successfully? |
| 17:13.04 | ``Erik | I believe all were decided to be adequately successful |
| 17:33.11 | prokoudine | adequately? :) |
| 17:34.51 | prokoudine | anyway, thanks :) |
| 17:43.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32618 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/java/stractNet/src/stractNet/messaging/tests/MSTest02.java: Modified Test for efficiency. |
| 18:02.28 | brlcad | howdy prokoudine |
| 18:02.55 | brlcad | lemme know if you have any specific questions |
| 18:03.17 | brlcad | i'm writing a report specific to our students as well, but itll be a week or two |
| 18:50.01 | brlcad | ``Erik: probably will be another week or two before sorting things out, but I signed you up on the summit wiki already |
| 18:51.11 | brlcad | flights are about 350 right now, so it should be pretty easy -- probably arriving on the 24th (fri)) and returning the 27th (mon), paying for an extra day stay for the room (which we have to share, if you didn't know..) |
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| 19:01.06 | brlcad | starseeker: you're leaking memory |
| 19:01.18 | brlcad | gotta free after a regcomp (run valgrind) |
| 19:04.44 | starseeker | whoops sorry |
| 19:10.35 | starseeker | was getting too used to passing pointers to everything ;-) |
| 19:19.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32619 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Oops - need to regfree after regcomp (thanks Sean) |
| 19:25.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32620 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: even though it was implemented after separately, the regex options shouldn't be a separate line item since the proceeding line covers it. the emphasis on the effort belongs in a summary paragraph for that one |
| 19:25.25 | starseeker | k |
| 19:25.48 | brlcad | if (rv != 0) { <-- doesn't look right |
| 19:26.17 | starseeker | That's from NetBSD |
| 19:26.50 | brlcad | rather, it looks alright, but then the else case is fishy |
| 19:27.58 | starseeker | else case? |
| 19:27.59 | brlcad | namely, I don't recall but do you have to regfree if regcomp fails |
| 19:28.07 | starseeker | oh |
| 19:28.19 | starseeker | um |
| 19:28.32 | starseeker | NetBSD calls regerror |
| 19:28.33 | brlcad | quick read looks like it might be okay, but should verify |
| 19:28.45 | starseeker | looks to see if regerror frees |
| 19:30.08 | brlcad | i think it just prints an error message based on the code |
| 19:30.27 | starseeker | agreed |
| 19:30.55 | starseeker | weird |
| 19:31.14 | starseeker | so regcomp must not assign anything until it succeeds internally? |
| 19:31.27 | brlcad | i don't know |
| 19:31.29 | brlcad | i was asking :) |
| 19:31.38 | starseeker | is looking at regcomp now ;-) |
| 19:31.55 | brlcad | just don't want it to crash if the regcomp fails |
| 19:33.26 | starseeker | Oh, here it is - if p->error != 0 it does regfree |
| 19:33.29 | starseeker | cool |
| 19:33.46 | starseeker | removes regfree from the error case... |
| 19:35.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32621 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Don't need regfree in error case - libregex is polite and frees the memory itself in an error situation. |
| 19:35.42 | starseeker | there we go :-) |
| 19:36.34 | starseeker | brlcad: Bob and I were plotting to include fnmatch in libbu and make it work on Windows - is that OK? |
| 19:36.58 | starseeker | or rather, bu_fnmatch :-) |
| 19:46.37 | starseeker | will commit so Bob can test on Windows quick before he's outta here - I'll make it all one commit so it's an easy revert if you don't like it brlcad |
| 19:48.24 | brlcad | so windows doesn't have fnmatch? |
| 19:48.32 | starseeker | nope |
| 19:48.38 | starseeker | Bob already tried |
| 19:49.32 | starseeker | can't remember how to set karma or he'd ding Windows another one |
| 19:49.42 | louipc | windows-- |
| 19:50.08 | brlcad | I don't have a problem with a bu_fnmatch though I might suggest a different name to be consistent with other bu routines |
| 19:50.23 | starseeker | OK :-) |
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| 19:50.53 | starseeker | let me get Bob compiling quick... brb |
| 19:51.26 | brlcad | bu_path_match() maybe or a simple bu_glob() |
| 19:52.28 | louipc | ibot: karma windows |
| 19:52.28 | ibot | windows has karma of -2 |
| 19:52.30 | brlcad | bu_pattern_match |
| 19:52.58 | brlcad | with just a pattern and string argument (unless the flags are *really* *really* needed for some reason |
| 19:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32622 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Add fnmatch to libbu as a first step towards supporting the find based search code in Windows. |
| 20:01.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32623 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: reorder so that declarations are not necessary |
| 20:02.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32624 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: We don't really need stdbool.h here, and Windows doesn't like it. |
| 20:05.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32625 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: header/footer/indent cleanup, always need common.h before any system headers. |
| 20:06.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32626 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: document the new argv functions testing out the migration of API documentation from source files to the public header files. |
| 20:12.43 | prasad_1 | http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26641652/ |
| 20:15.13 | brlcad | looks forward to them actually smashing things together at 100% power, not just flipping on the power switch |
| 20:17.37 | ``Erik | wiggles his toes |
| 20:20.31 | prasad_1 | first contact or half life |
| 20:20.37 | prasad_1 | i hope for the former |
| 20:23.11 | brlcad | i mean damn, if you're gonna get killed, a supercollider singularity would be one of the best ways |
| 20:24.02 | brlcad | every atom accelerating away at the speed of light. no thought, no pain, you would just instantly cease to exist |
| 20:27.01 | Ralith | good call |
| 20:28.59 | archivist_ub | whos going to write up the Darwin award |
| 20:33.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32627 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): Changed include order for windows. Fixed a few typos. |
| 20:35.11 | ``Erik | I d'no, the masses sound far too tiny to do anything like that |
| 20:35.52 | ``Erik | even tidal effects would diminish awfully quickly if it were to go supermassive, and it wouldn't have the mass to sustain it o.O |
| 20:36.39 | ``Erik | what was it that article a few days ago said, the energy of an aircraft carrier moving at 60kph? |
| 20:37.48 | prasad_1 | funnelled through the area of your fingernail |
| 20:37.53 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 20:37.59 | prasad_1 | er the size of your fingernail |
| 20:38.02 | prasad_1 | ;) |
| 20:42.04 | ``Erik | hrm, 7 trillion electron volts, 1.1215*10^-6 joules... o.O I must be missing something here |
| 20:44.38 | ``Erik | ah, each particle is at 7teV, it's the entire beam that accounts for all that energy |
| 21:24.02 | ``Erik | rolls up a magazine and beats starseeker for a bit |
| 21:24.13 | starseeker | just for kicks? |
| 21:24.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32628 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/Makefile.am: add missing backslash, was producing broken makefile |
| 21:24.36 | starseeker | Ah |
| 21:28.19 | ``Erik | wow, my arm is sore... closest to a magazine I could find was a siggraph transaction book, those are heavy |
| 21:28.32 | ``Erik | I should go kick his ass some more for making my arm sore |
| 21:29.38 | starseeker | Heh - you'll need more mass, you're not much more than a rounding error relatively speaking ;-) |
| 21:48.54 | ``Erik | heh, I used to spar with a dude who was close to 300 pounds of muscle back in 'the day', picked him up and bounce dhim off his ass one day... and I was a lot smaller back then :D don't misunderestimate (bushism!) the little wirey guy |
| 22:04.43 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo (n=chatzill@189.71.31.249) | |
| 22:57.31 | ``Erik | <-- tries to figure out why italian would have a single word that translates to "to suck to me" |
| 22:59.47 | Ralith | lol |
| 23:02.06 | ``Erik | http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/succhiarmi teh awesomez |
| 23:44.16 | Ralith | nice |
| 00:47.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32629 10/brlcad/trunk/ (35 files in 17 dirs): |
| 00:47.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: deprecate the use of %S as a struct bu_vls format specifier, now using %V |
| 00:47.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: instead. update all instances from the old to the new and document the |
| 00:47.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: functions that parsed them (structparse and logging). run-time and regression |
| 00:47.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: tested successfully, but there are nasty verbose warnings that should get |
| 00:47.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: printed if any were missed. the reason this change was made was because libc |
| 00:47.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: now uses %S for wchar_t strings as an alias for %ls. |
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| 01:44.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32630 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (bu_tcl.c parse.c): jeez, surprisingly still passed all testing, but there were several cases missed for the %S -> %V conversion |
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| 14:05.51 | ciaooo | ciaooo |
| 14:05.58 | ciaooo | eiii ce nessunooo? |
| 14:06.07 | ciaooo | prontooo |
| 14:06.11 | ciaooo | eiiii |
| 14:17.58 | prasad_1 | ciaoo |
| 14:31.51 | Axman6 | strange guy |
| 14:33.00 | brlcad | cgi:irc .. I wouldn't expect any less ;) |
| 14:33.13 | brlcad | s/less/more/ :) |
| 14:45.00 | prokoudine | brlcad: thank you |
| 14:45.06 | prokoudine | brlcad: I'll let you know :) |
| 14:45.08 | brlcad | prokoudine: hm? |
| 14:45.27 | prokoudine | -brlcad- howdy prokoudine |
| 14:45.27 | prokoudine | >brlcad< lemme know if you have any specific questions |
| 14:45.27 | prokoudine | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:45.33 | brlcad | ahh, right |
| 14:46.45 | brlcad | prokoudine: who are you with? |
| 14:46.49 | brlcad | inkscape? |
| 14:47.35 | brlcad | notes that I'm planning on using the tango icons for our new GUI |
| 14:49.15 | prokoudine | brlcad: in gsoc - with hugin/panotools and audacity |
| 14:49.34 | prokoudine | brlcad: but outside gsoc I'm with just everybody :) |
| 14:50.07 | prokoudine | was backup admin for scribus last year too |
| 15:16.29 | ``Erik | *burp* |
| 15:18.54 | brlcad | prokoudine: ah, alrighty then -- good to know |
| 15:19.27 | brlcad | so you're writing up a report of all projects? lots of projects? just a small handful? where do the brl-cad students come into play? |
| 15:35.39 | prasad_1 | has anyone used any other alternatives to the printf formatting syntax (e.g: %d, etc.) ? .NET? |
| 15:36.25 | brlcad | you mean like C++ stream formatting? |
| 15:42.21 | prasad_1 | no |
| 15:42.34 | prasad_1 | token replacement syntax |
| 15:42.52 | prasad_1 | .NET has an alternative syntax |
| 15:43.02 | prasad_1 | wondering what other schemes are out there |
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| 17:13.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32634 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added search.c |
| 17:13.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32633 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libbu/libbu.vcproj: Added fnmatch.c |
| 17:15.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32635 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/adc.c: Replaced atof with sscanf |
| 17:15.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32636 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Reworked the grid and rect functionality into ged_grid and ged_rect. |
| 17:15.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32632 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: Needs bu.h |
| 17:32.07 | *** join/#brlcad Nikty (n=nicholas@89.163.117.94) | |
| 17:32.24 | Nikty | hi guys!!!!!!!! |
| 17:32.58 | Nikty | i installed brlcad from ports (freebsd) but /usr/local/brlcad/bin/mged doesn't start!!!!!!! |
| 17:33.02 | Nikty | help :) |
| 17:33.05 | Nikty | pls |
| 17:35.30 | *** join/#brlcad Nikty (n=nicholas@89.163.117.94) | |
| 17:36.55 | Nikty | help with starting mges pls :) |
| 17:36.59 | Nikty | (mged |
| 17:37.01 | Nikty | *mged |
| 17:41.45 | starseeker | what's the error? |
| 17:41.49 | Nikty | no error |
| 17:42.08 | starseeker | ``Erik is our BSD guy |
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| 17:42.24 | starseeker | ``Erik, know if the port is in workign order atm? |
| 17:42.43 | Nikty | ``Erik: hi, /usr/local/brlcad/bin/mged doesn't start |
| 18:29.44 | ``Erik | um, is that out of ports? |
| 18:29.50 | ``Erik | (what does it do?) |
| 18:30.02 | ``Erik | the port SHOULD be working on everything but -current |
| 18:40.01 | starseeker | Nikty: Try mged -c and see what happens |
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| 19:25.58 | prasad_ | has anyone used code::blocks? |
| 19:40.17 | ``Erik | not I, computers are against my religion |
| 20:42.15 | starseeker | prods CiA |
| 20:42.24 | starseeker | prods CIA rather |
| 20:42.43 | alex_joni | kicks CIA-4 |
| 20:42.58 | alex_joni | doesn't work.. |
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| 21:53.01 | brlcad | prasad_: not I, graphical IDEs are against my religion |
| 21:56.13 | prasad_ | years of vs2005 + visual assist x + incredibuild + perforce |
| 21:56.16 | prasad_ | can't go back |
| 21:58.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32639 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): ws, indent, header fixes |
| 21:59.15 | brlcad | "go back" .. you never went there |
| 22:00.06 | louipc | I used to be a fan of the windows and the guis and stuff but I saw the way and was transformed |
| 22:00.41 | louipc | that's why I think mged -c should be the standard :D |
| 22:00.49 | brlcad | emacs is all ye know and all ye need to know, my son |
| 22:06.56 | louipc | emacs-ged? |
| 22:08.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32638 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tcl/generic/tclIO.c: Added check for exceeding max int. |
| 22:13.08 | brlcad | louipc: an mged major mode would be awesome :) |
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| 22:50.05 | ``Erik | yeh, in the mid 90's, I thought the big weakness of leenewx was that it lacked ide's like msvc and borland |
| 22:50.10 | ``Erik | I learned better |
| 22:52.21 | prasad_ | go back to pico :o |
| 22:53.18 | ``Erik | heh, I did pico briefly... then joe... then vim... :D |
| 22:53.26 | ``Erik | ultraedit32 on windows for a bit |
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| 01:18.29 | PrezKennedy | i use vim/jedit |
| 01:25.40 | ``Erik | .de, jlo? |
| 01:26.08 | ``Erik | is have her dur grace linked up to a deleware cx? |
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| 03:40.53 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 08:47.54 | brlcad | ``Erik: he's at the beach |
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| 11:59.47 | starseeker | is starting to get the hang of glibc's fnmatch code a bit better |
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| 14:07.35 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 14:07.52 | mafm | hallo |
| 14:09.08 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-23-145.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 14:09.42 | ``Erik | oi |
| 14:10.53 | brlcad | ugh, 130 hour build time.. |
| 14:11.00 | mafm | brlcad: re:argc for commands: maybe I missed some of them |
| 14:11.14 | mafm | I think that one that starseeker commited recently had the same problem |
| 14:11.34 | brlcad | mafm: you missed a bunch of them iirc :) |
| 14:11.54 | brlcad | starseeker's not using the ged interface just yet contrary to the function name |
| 14:11.59 | mafm | uhm, then maybe was a regex too restrictive |
| 14:12.02 | brlcad | using the wdb interface |
| 14:16.29 | mafm | hmm |
| 14:16.34 | mafm | so do you want me to fix the rest? |
| 14:24.04 | brlcad | i already did |
| 14:24.15 | brlcad | that same day, iirc even |
| 14:24.39 | brlcad | ahh, cia is down... dagnabit |
| 14:25.33 | mafm | oh |
| 14:30.04 | mafm | I saw a bit of activity in the mail lately |
| 14:35.28 | yukonbob_ | brlcad: I'd change that hard-coded value to something like sizeof(int) |
| 14:35.34 | yukonbob_ | it's not portable. |
| 14:35.43 | yukonbob_ | ^--in Tcl patch |
| 14:41.01 | mafm | so, any news lately? I took a little break with a friend for the last week, I still have a lot of mail to read |
| 14:41.37 | brlcad | yukonbob_: i know .. it's not really a proper fix (wasn't intended to be really) .. just hopefully enough to provoke them to fix it properly |
| 14:42.29 | brlcad | the bigger issue is really prevalent throughout the API .. there are unqualified ints used everywhere that can overflow in many/most of the functions that aren't being checked |
| 14:42.30 | yukonbob_ | is also a bit surprised Tcl is using malloc, and not some tcl_malloc(), where a test for this type of thing could be inserted once, and fix all cases... |
| 14:42.51 | brlcad | tcl does have their own wrapper, but it doesn't check |
| 14:43.08 | yukonbob_ | that's where the fix should be, by my one-minute evaluation... |
| 14:43.47 | yukonbob_ | tct will probably come to same conclusion themselves, though, unless I'm just wrong. |
| 14:43.58 | brlcad | we'd still be stuck at it failing on commands that exceed 1073741823 |
| 14:44.21 | brlcad | the patch pushes it all the way up to 2147483647 before it'll fail |
| 14:44.44 | brlcad | there's a length = offset * 2 that'll overflow it half-way |
| 14:44.53 | yukonbob_ | would have to look harder to completely understand; trusts brlcad |
| 14:45.17 | yukonbob_ | would the "test for completeness of command" help wrt parsing the db? |
| 14:45.52 | yukonbob_ | is also working to getting itcl up/running with his -current OS, and Tcl 8.5.4, then back on the brl-cad wagon ;) |
| 14:46.08 | brlcad | also, by the time it's to tcl's wrapper, it's an unsigned int (like ours in libbu) .. so you lose the fact that it overflowed |
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| 15:01.50 | yukonbob_ | [info complete $x] is what I was thinking of, perhaps allowing one to parse the db in smaller chunks. |
| 15:01.55 | yukonbob_ | brlcad: --^ |
| 15:04.58 | yukonbob_ | heads to work. |
| 15:24.00 | brlcad | yukonbob_: brlcad/src/conv/asc2g.c if you want to look at improving the converter further :-) |
| 15:24.20 | brlcad | not sure what info complete would translate to on Tcl's C API |
| 15:24.34 | brlcad | right now, we just call Tcl_EvalFile iirc |
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| 15:43.18 | mafm | great, my machine at work is borked |
| 15:43.19 | mafm | :) |
| 15:44.55 | brlcad | excellent |
| 15:45.18 | mafm | I love when things run smoothly :P |
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| 17:08.41 | ``Erik | http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html |
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| 17:18.57 | mafm | heh |
| 17:19.23 | mafm | LHC news are having a big impact |
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| 18:45.37 | starseeker | brlcad: It looks like including the collate features of GNU's fnmatch will mean including some locale code too - is it worth it? |
| 19:13.42 | starseeker | growls in annoyance and starts re-thinking plan B, adding a few features to the BSD version |
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| 22:39.47 | brlcad | starseeker: nope |
| 22:40.03 | brlcad | just rip that part out? |
| 22:40.09 | starseeker | It' |
| 22:40.12 | ``Erik | o.O |
| 22:40.16 | starseeker | s a bit tricky |
| 22:40.21 | starseeker | hang on, take a look: |
| 22:41.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32641 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: Start of an implementation of character classes. |
| 22:42.06 | starseeker | I've got a little more debugging to do, but I think I'm getting close. |
| 22:47.01 | starseeker | "and an ominous silence descended over IRC" ;-) |
| 22:53.27 | starseeker | decides to head home before he gets in any more trouble :-{ |
| 22:53.36 | brlcad | heh |
| 22:53.39 | starseeker | how'd it get to be 7 already?? |
| 22:53.47 | brlcad | yeah.. |
| 22:54.47 | starseeker | brlcad: if we opt out of the collate feature, I don't think it's too much difference between adding to the working one and stripping out the unneeded stuff from the other one |
| 22:54.55 | brlcad | what is the collate feature? |
| 22:55.23 | starseeker | As near as I can tell, it's some kind of ordering awareness based on locale information |
| 22:55.51 | brlcad | there is no geoemtry locale, so that doesn't seem to be anything of use regardless |
| 22:55.56 | brlcad | you'd just rip that out if you did use it |
| 22:56.11 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:56.20 | brlcad | sort of like -atime |
| 22:56.30 | starseeker | It might be things like "a comes before z" though - that's what I'm not sure of yet |
| 22:56.57 | brlcad | either way, sounds like a gnu extension |
| 22:57.06 | starseeker | I'm pretty close to getting the character classes working, which I remember you missing |
| 22:57.33 | brlcad | the point isn't to get all features, it's to get whatever makes most sense for geometry processing |
| 22:57.53 | brlcad | which is going to be all ascii-based |
| 22:58.00 | brlcad | standard posix globbing |
| 22:58.26 | starseeker | Here's where it pops up on opengroup: http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/000095399/basedefs/xbd_chap09.html#tag_09_03_05 |
| 23:00.28 | starseeker | I got a simple test case of [[:digit:]] to work, so now it's just a question of making sure I understand how its used and making sure what I've got in there has the correct behaviors |
| 23:02.16 | starseeker | I guess it's a sign of coding immaturity but I found it much more straightforward to add to the BSD code than ripping stuff out of the GNU code :-/ |
| 23:02.29 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:02.40 | brlcad | never used collating |
| 23:03.08 | brlcad | not sure equivalence classes are useful to us, unless it's easy to implement |
| 23:03.33 | starseeker | Unless I'm very much mistaken, it's quite hard to implement - I think it depends on locale support in some fashion. |
| 23:04.00 | brlcad | collating actually sounds rather useful, but I don't see anyone getting that advanced |
| 23:04.10 | starseeker | nods |
| 23:04.12 | brlcad | it's a way to match substrings |
| 23:04.32 | starseeker | I was thinking if anyone got that advanced regex could step in |
| 23:05.49 | brlcad | looks like bsd doesn't support/implement it |
| 23:05.55 | starseeker | nope |
| 23:06.12 | brlcad | yeah, forget about it |
| 23:06.38 | starseeker | ok. If someone specifically requests we can do an estimate of the cost/benefit ratio, but I'm thinking it's pretty high |
| 23:07.03 | starseeker | would probably mean including locale to do it portably |
| 23:07.05 | brlcad | yeah, i don't see the need |
| 23:07.11 | brlcad | you could just use a regex, even easier |
| 23:07.18 | starseeker | nods |
| 23:08.14 | starseeker | Now I just need to hunt up some advanced glob test cases using :digit: and friends, but after I get home :-) |
| 23:08.21 | starseeker | really leaves, bbl |
| 23:09.04 | brlcad | and ranges |
| 23:09.13 | brlcad | find . -name [0-9]* |
| 23:09.29 | starseeker | actually, that should work |
| 23:09.55 | brlcad | find . -name [x-z]* |
| 23:10.27 | starseeker | will test, but I think it does have at least basic ranges already |
| 23:10.31 | brlcad | find . -name [a-zA-Z_][a-zA-Z0-9_-]* |
| 23:10.48 | starseeker | dunno about that one ;-) |
| 23:10.53 | starseeker | ok, later all! |
| 23:11.12 | brlcad | cya |
| 00:29.38 | ``Erik | wrt find |
| 00:29.53 | ``Erik | how do the classes effect the tcl interpreter |
| 00:30.19 | ``Erik | tcl's eval is [blah], right? o.O do the classes have to be quoted or escaped? |
| 00:30.36 | ``Erik | or should find override the tcl interpreter? |
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| 00:36.15 | starseeker | ``Erik: The eventual idea is to move the globbing below the command line and let the individual commands decide how to handle it |
| 00:36.55 | starseeker | most will just call glob straight away, but those who plan to work with it themselves (a.l.a. search/find) will handle it themselves without the interpreter being "smart" for them. |
| 00:37.15 | starseeker | that's a bit of a job, but now with the libged stuff is the logical time to do it |
| 00:37.42 | starseeker | sees some rather long and mundane coding coming at him... |
| 00:49.41 | brlcad | gets hungry |
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| 01:15.56 | ``Erik | that seems.. irregular |
| 01:16.21 | ``Erik | if tcl expressions are viable, I'd expect them to be viable on any command... what if I want to generate the regex using tcl? |
| 01:25.44 | starseeker | ``Erik: It's a case of conflicting expectations - I expect the find/search command to take a regex string without tcl bothering it |
| 01:30.25 | ``Erik | well, I love playing devils advocate :D |
| 01:30.42 | ``Erik | my mindset is that of a linguist, so regularity is king |
| 01:31.12 | ``Erik | rocks out to mc 900' jesus, punker's on a roll o.O |
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| 03:34.00 | yukonbob_ | is "Punker's on a Roll" the name of the album? /me can recommend MC 900' Jesus' "One Step Ahead of the Spider" as an awesome album |
| 03:48.27 | yukonbob_ | ~svn |
| 03:48.28 | ibot | Subversion (aka SVN) is version control software that aims to be a better CVS than CVS. See http://subversion.tigris.org/. |
| 03:48.46 | yukonbob_ | ~co |
| 03:48.47 | ibot | well, co is Colombia |
| 03:48.58 | yukonbob_ | ~lart stupid answers |
| 03:48.58 | ibot | beats stupid answers severely about the head and shoulders with a rubber chicken |
| 03:49.22 | yukonbob_ | ~checkout |
| 04:02.09 | starseeker | cannot fathom how mortals are supposed to set up snort on Gentoo... |
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| 05:13.35 | yukonbob | hello, starseeker |
| 08:07.00 | brlcad | ~cadsvn |
| 08:07.01 | ibot | To obtain BRL-CAD from Subversion: svn checkout https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk brlcad |
| 08:10.42 | brlcad | ~botmail for mafm ... please don't forget to upload your code |
| 10:12.44 | ``Erik | yukon: punker is punkrockgirl, my wench... she was dj'ing last night |
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| 10:45.00 | Nikty1 | hi =) |
| 10:45.08 | Nikty1 | so, bsd needs help) |
| 10:46.10 | Nikty1 | <PROTECTED> |
| 10:46.12 | Nikty1 | :( |
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| 10:59.32 | ``Erik | yeah, what does it do? O.o |
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| 15:55.53 | starseeker | yukonbob: howdy :-) |
| 15:57.47 | Axman6 | heh, i love the lag in this channel |
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| 16:01.37 | starseeker | unlike brlcad, I need to sleep on occasion ;-) |
| 16:09.55 | Axman6 | yeah, that man has epic uptime |
| 16:10.06 | alex_joni | sleep is overrated |
| 16:10.41 | archivist_ub | gets in the way of play |
| 16:12.04 | Axman6 | yeah, it's only mildly essential |
| 16:15.06 | alex_joni | you only die after 10 days without sleep |
| 16:22.17 | Axman6 | i was going to ask how you knew that... then remembered where BRL-CAD comes from |
| 16:23.52 | alex_joni | well.. I have very little connection to BRL-CAL |
| 16:23.59 | alex_joni | but I do watch House M.D. a lot :P |
| 17:18.38 | yukonbob | Axman6: What lag are you talking about? |
| 18:38.15 | brlcad | the 10 days "rumor" about dying from lack of sleep has been propagating for years, it was an isolated single sample study |
| 18:38.45 | brlcad | the guy in the study suffered liver and kidney failure iirc |
| 18:39.04 | brlcad | others have gone farther, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep#Longest_period_without_sleep |
| 18:41.26 | alex_joni | whee. fun, think of all the coding one could do in 33 years without sleep :D |
| 18:41.35 | brlcad | I know! |
| 18:41.42 | brlcad | wishes.. |
| 18:48.43 | brlcad | Axman6: for what it's worth, military training doctrine says you only need about 4 hours a day |
| 18:49.10 | brlcad | and that's supposedly to be indefinitely sustainable, per studies done through the decades |
| 23:38.16 | brlcad | opens his last ABA |
| 23:38.41 | brlcad | ~ww |
| 23:38.42 | ibot | Thanks for wasting our time yet again by telling us "ww" |
| 23:44.05 | yukonbob | brlcad: have there been issues w/ tcl85 and blt in the BRL-CAD builds? |
| 23:44.15 | yukonbob | guesses "no", but hasn't been following closely |
| 23:44.20 | brlcad | nope |
| 23:55.24 | yukonbob | nods |
| 23:55.53 | yukonbob | <-- working (in a way) to get NetBSD -current and Tcl 8.5.x (and bits) ready for BRL-CAD |
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| 01:04.14 | brlcad | yukonbob: awesome |
| 01:04.27 | brlcad | let me know when it's all in, that'll be news-worthy |
| 01:15.27 | Axman6 | brlcad: is the 4 hours sleep supposed to make you really really cranky, so you want to kill people more? |
| 01:15.44 | Axman6 | because, i know i'd want to kill a lot of people if i only got 4 hours sleep a night |
| 01:16.59 | Ralith | myself, I'd just want to get some more sleep. |
| 01:18.04 | brlcad | Axman6: heh, mebbie .. though I don't think I get too cranky |
| 01:20.57 | Axman6 | i'm oretty sure if it was me, people would be dying all the time. |
| 01:21.07 | Axman6 | i need my sleep pretty bad. but i am a uni student.. |
| 01:21.13 | Axman6 | pretty even |
| 01:22.47 | brlcad | finally goes to see darkknight |
| 01:23.05 | Ralith | enjoy |
| 01:23.14 | Axman6 | like right now, i've had like 7 hours, and i could easily eat someone's face for talking too loud |
| 01:42.23 | louipc | huh |
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| 05:14.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32643 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: Much closer to a working character class, but still needs more testing so leave in debug bu_log for now. |
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| 19:10.17 | mafm | hi |
| 19:17.29 | mafm | brlcad: thanks about the code, I came for that reason (among others) but not sure if I'll be able to do it before this computer at the lab dies :) |
| 19:48.20 | mafm | ok, copied... let's see if I get to do this from home :) |
| 19:48.23 | mafm | see you |
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| 22:46.15 | mafm | hi |
| 23:38.56 | mafm | slowy svn, several hours to get the diff done :) |
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| 02:19.43 | mafm | code submitted! |
| 02:19.46 | mafm | night |
| 03:52.22 | starseeker_ | pokes around for standards on technical drawing layouts... |
| 03:52.58 | Ralith | wonders what starseeker_ is working on |
| 03:53.51 | starseeker_ | nothing, as yet |
| 03:54.07 | starseeker_ | Ah, here we go... http://www.iso.org/iso/iso_catalogue/catalogue_tc/catalogue_tc_browse.htm?commid=46022 |
| 03:54.14 | Ralith | wonders what starseeker_ is thinking about |
| 03:54.53 | starseeker_ | If there's any standard for blueprint layouts |
| 03:55.18 | starseeker_ | likes pretty pictures |
| 03:55.24 | Ralith | agrees |
| 03:55.47 | starseeker_ | That's one boatload of documentation on the subject though :-( |
| 03:56.12 | Ralith | there's a lot of situations to cover |
| 03:57.00 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 03:57.23 | starseeker_ | In reality I need to keep working on find/search, so no pretty pictures for a while |
| 03:58.44 | Ralith | it would be pretty cool for brl-cad to be able to produce drawings |
| 03:59.05 | starseeker_ | many have thought so, no one has put forth the effort ;-) |
| 03:59.49 | Ralith | probably something to do with how there's a lot of situations to cover. |
| 04:00.06 | starseeker_ | partially that, partially a matter of other priorities |
| 04:00.26 | Ralith | well, yeah |
| 04:00.42 | Ralith | but the easier it is, the more likely some random person shows up to do it for SoC, or something |
| 04:00.51 | starseeker_ | and partially how the heck to get ahold of all the friggin docs... |
| 04:00.58 | starseeker_ | true |
| 04:01.58 | Ralith | yeah, having to actually buy the docs doesn't help, I imagine |
| 04:02.16 | starseeker_ | you imagine correctly |
| 04:14.40 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 04:33.38 | louipc | starseeker_: what kind of standards are you looking for? |
| 04:33.58 | starseeker_ | layout, required information, formatting, etc. |
| 04:34.48 | louipc | like third-angle projection vs first-angle projection, ... |
| 04:36.28 | louipc | I wouldn't say you need iso specs to start off though hehe |
| 04:37.52 | louipc | lots of info on the net and/or library about drafting 'standards' |
| 04:45.46 | Ralith | louipc: when it comes to writing a software implementation for a CAD suite, I think it's pretty important to strictly follow the formal standards. |
| 04:47.47 | louipc | well it should be flexible |
| 04:48.05 | Ralith | ? |
| 04:48.14 | Ralith | what does that mean |
| 04:48.24 | louipc | there's more than one standard |
| 04:50.13 | Ralith | I think the ISO standards are probably appropriate. |
| 04:52.27 | louipc | ANSI ;) |
| 04:53.32 | Ralith | I > A |
| 04:53.52 | louipc | are you european or something? :P |
| 04:54.34 | dtidrow | M$ proved that standards can be bought |
| 04:54.41 | louipc | haha |
| 04:54.56 | louipc | software is best when it's flexible anyways |
| 04:55.16 | dtidrow | see the ooxml debacle |
| 04:59.30 | Ralith | dtidrow: but nobody has a reason to buy these ones :P |
| 08:37.43 | b0ef | really sad iso has lost all integrity |
| 08:38.04 | b0ef | and credibility |
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| 12:31.35 | mafm | hello |
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| 15:03.25 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, all of your test cases seem to work, although I'm a little fuzzy on the last one - I'll have to check what the "_" is supposed to do |
| 15:07.00 | starseeker | Also, something like search -name [0-9][a-z] without the "*" on the end fails unless I set glob_compat_mode to 0 - it seems like tcl is expanding that for some reason. Even then, with glob_compat_mode at 0 I have to escape the square brackets. Ugh. |
| 15:07.54 | starseeker | is more motivated than ever to keep TCL out of command pre-processing unless the command asks for it |
| 15:13.58 | starseeker | Hmm, looks like search . -name [[:upper:]][[:digit:]]* doesn't work... |
| 15:14.47 | starseeker | wonders if it should |
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| 16:51.50 | starseeker | hrm. Does on Mac's find |
| 16:52.06 | starseeker | grumbles and wanders back into the fnmatch source code... |
| 16:58.03 | starseeker | wait, it does work |
| 16:58.07 | starseeker | blinks |
| 16:58.57 | starseeker | friggin tcl shell... |
| 17:10.19 | mafm | hi starseeker |
| 17:10.20 | mafm | :) |
| 17:10.26 | mafm | this channel is pretty quiet lately |
| 17:11.43 | starseeker | mafm: Howdy :-) |
| 17:11.48 | starseeker | yes, quiet indeed |
| 17:20.22 | mafm | I need more holidays, but not bad :) |
| 18:17.19 | starseeker | Yay, maxdepth and mindepth work :-) |
| 18:49.59 | starseeker | kicks CIA |
| 19:37.12 | starseeker | empty works |
| 19:39.04 | starseeker | brlcad: Do you want an "ls" option for BRL-CAD's search or is that better handled with the -exec option? |
| 19:56.51 | starseeker | and now iname works :-) |
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| 22:46.35 | starseeker | And a path command |
| 22:46.38 | starseeker | er path option |
| 22:46.54 | starseeker | brlcad: regarding prune, can't that be handled by a combination of -not and -path? |
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| 22:59.51 | brlcad | catches up |
| 23:00.30 | brlcad | starseeker: [] are special to tcl, they are like backticks |
| 23:01.38 | brlcad | drat, mafm left |
| 23:02.09 | brlcad | starseeker: ls is definitely better handled via exec |
| 23:02.25 | brlcad | and hm, -path seems out of place |
| 23:03.11 | brlcad | i mean i see the point, but especially for -not -path, that's not really different than -not -name |
| 23:04.19 | brlcad | I use that all the time to prune subtrees on a find search since it won't recurse into something that matches |
| 00:08.50 | brlcad | ~seen calito |
| 00:08.59 | ibot | brlcad: i haven't seen 'calito' |
| 00:10.51 | starseeker | brlcad: I've got name just looking at the object name, and path looking at the whole path string |
| 00:11.10 | brlcad | yes, and? :) |
| 00:11.27 | starseeker | doesn't that mean path isn't out of place? |
| 00:11.29 | brlcad | like I said, I see the point .. but it's somewhat redundant |
| 00:11.48 | starseeker | -not -name and -not -path will do different things... |
| 00:11.56 | starseeker | well, it's easy enough to nuke |
| 00:13.00 | starseeker | Unless you know of any other features needed, it may be time to turn the focus to -exec |
| 00:15.01 | brlcad | something about -empty isn't sitting well with me |
| 00:15.05 | brlcad | it's not really very general |
| 00:15.30 | brlcad | but I can't think of why the general case would be needed atm or what exactly is so bothersome |
| 00:15.41 | starseeker | nods |
| 00:15.54 | starseeker | I think it actually addresses a bug request previously met with a tcl script |
| 00:16.26 | brlcad | it's fine, I mean find has it too |
| 00:16.33 | brlcad | it's just how it relates to primitives I think |
| 00:16.39 | brlcad | what is an empty primitive |
| 00:16.44 | starseeker | :-) |
| 00:17.10 | starseeker | got me |
| 00:17.16 | brlcad | actually somewhat well-defined for sketch, extrude, ebm, and dsp |
| 00:17.29 | brlcad | kinda |
| 00:17.51 | starseeker | you mean find sketch without data, or extrude without sketch, etc.? |
| 00:17.55 | brlcad | right |
| 00:17.59 | brlcad | maybe just always returns false |
| 00:18.13 | starseeker | I think that's what i do now |
| 00:18.21 | brlcad | really? |
| 00:18.28 | brlcad | i thought you just checked if tree == null |
| 00:18.35 | starseeker | yeah |
| 00:18.44 | brlcad | then it'd always return true ;) |
| 00:18.52 | starseeker | oh, you mean return false regardless of the -not option? |
| 00:19.01 | brlcad | hm? no |
| 00:19.21 | starseeker | right now, I check if the DIR_COMB flag is set before even trying to look for a tree |
| 00:19.26 | starseeker | so primitives always get ignored |
| 00:19.53 | brlcad | what does that mean wrt true/false? |
| 00:20.03 | starseeker | if primitive, false |
| 00:20.12 | starseeker | if combination with tree, false |
| 00:20.14 | brlcad | hm, oki |
| 00:20.18 | starseeker | if combination without tree, true |
| 00:20.43 | starseeker | so a -not -empty spews back a lot of primitives too - you need to add a -type comb to filter them out |
| 00:21.05 | brlcad | sure |
| 00:21.31 | starseeker | That's what tutorials are good for :-) |
| 00:21.48 | brlcad | what types did you end up implementing? |
| 00:21.53 | starseeker | not that you need one, but for the rest of us mortals out here :-) |
| 00:21.53 | brlcad | for -type |
| 00:22.16 | starseeker | erm... - all the primitive types, plus combination and region |
| 00:22.42 | brlcad | -type region ? |
| 00:23.02 | brlcad | and -type combination or something else? |
| 00:23.03 | starseeker | yes -type r or -type region get you the same thing |
| 00:23.07 | starseeker | yep |
| 00:23.10 | brlcad | k |
| 00:23.18 | starseeker | -type comb and -type combination |
| 00:23.25 | brlcad | -type c ? |
| 00:23.27 | brlcad | :) |
| 00:23.30 | starseeker | probably should |
| 00:23.49 | starseeker | saves on typing |
| 00:23.55 | starseeker | fires up vim... |
| 00:25.39 | brlcad | there needs to be a way to get a list of objects at all four levels |
| 00:25.55 | brlcad | you've got at least two (region, primitives) |
| 00:26.06 | brlcad | how can the user get the other two? |
| 00:26.12 | starseeker | combination and assembly? |
| 00:26.33 | brlcad | combination == !primitive |
| 00:26.44 | starseeker | right |
| 00:26.54 | brlcad | which would be another useful one to have |
| 00:27.10 | starseeker | -type comb doesn't do it? |
| 00:27.11 | brlcad | -type primitive|prim|p |
| 00:27.30 | starseeker | oh, a general primitive type match? |
| 00:27.36 | brlcad | -type comb gets everything that's not a primitive, that's too much |
| 00:27.43 | brlcad | that's three levels |
| 00:28.06 | starseeker | actually, comb doesn't get regions |
| 00:28.14 | starseeker | at least not the way I've got it set up |
| 00:28.24 | brlcad | hm, that's no good :) |
| 00:28.33 | brlcad | regions are combinations |
| 00:29.16 | starseeker | right, but I was assuming at the user level if they want the set of all combinations they can do -type comb -and -type reg |
| 00:29.37 | brlcad | i mean you could add -type assembly|a|group|g to get the topmost level |
| 00:29.58 | brlcad | yeah, no .. don't do that |
| 00:30.05 | brlcad | it starts screwing with the terminology |
| 00:31.11 | brlcad | all the other commands and docs at least try to keep it clear that regions are combinations, |
| 00:31.20 | brlcad | I would entirely expect a -type option to return them |
| 00:31.31 | starseeker | ok |
| 00:32.00 | brlcad | unless you named them nrc's or something, but then it's still ambiguous as to what you do about the third level (combinations below the region level) |
| 00:32.18 | starseeker | I'll switch it - it's easy enough to do -type comb -not -type reg |
| 00:32.58 | starseeker | awareness of where combinations are relative to regions is something else again |
| 00:33.00 | brlcad | hm, won't that get levels 1 and 3 |
| 00:33.09 | brlcad | or just 1? |
| 00:33.17 | brlcad | there's a good case for either |
| 00:33.38 | starseeker | would get you 1 and 3 |
| 00:34.05 | starseeker | anything else requires awareness of position in tree depth relative to a region, and right now I don't have that |
| 00:34.29 | brlcad | k |
| 00:34.57 | brlcad | actually if you add a -type assembly|a option, you probably don't need the latter for level 3 |
| 00:35.26 | brlcad | since you can get level three with a double search once you have exec |
| 00:35.40 | starseeker | right - combinations that are not assemblies would have to be the other group |
| 00:36.00 | brlcad | oh, right .. just use the boolean |
| 00:36.09 | brlcad | dont' even need a double search |
| 00:36.39 | starseeker | -type comb -not -type region -not -type assembly |
| 00:36.42 | brlcad | i was thinking something like: search . -type r -exec search {} -not -type p |
| 00:36.58 | starseeker | that would work too, once exec is running |
| 00:37.27 | starseeker | checking for assembly will take a bit of logic, but I think I've got it in namegen somewhere |
| 00:37.56 | starseeker | let me fix combinations to report regions. |
| 00:38.44 | brlcad | also should work, -not -type a -not -type r -not -type p |
| 00:40.49 | starseeker | brlcad: Know what happened to CIA? |
| 00:43.46 | starseeker | OK. So we can get all primitives with search -not -type comb |
| 00:43.48 | brlcad | kicks CIA-4 |
| 00:43.48 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 00:44.05 | starseeker | don't tell me my commit didn't go through... |
| 00:44.10 | brlcad | it did |
| 00:44.17 | brlcad | you're not on the commits list? |
| 00:44.34 | starseeker | Get all regions with search -type reg |
| 00:45.04 | starseeker | Get all combinations above and below the region level with search -type comb ! -type reg |
| 00:45.13 | starseeker | Yep, assembly will do it |
| 00:45.19 | starseeker | hunts up namegen... |
| 00:47.13 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 00:47.34 | starseeker | brlcad: will db_functree give me everything below the tree if I supply it a dp, or do I need to walk the tree? |
| 00:48.37 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 00:49.05 | brlcad | it will call the comb or prim callback |
| 00:51.22 | starseeker | right, but for an assembly check I need to know if any of the combinations below the target combination are regions |
| 00:53.05 | brlcad | hm, i've implemented that before somewhere ..... |
| 00:53.38 | brlcad | ouch.. lap top hot |
| 00:53.57 | brlcad | importing half a million points into the point primitive is taking .. a while |
| 00:55.06 | starseeker | ow |
| 00:55.20 | starseeker | IO limited, or just lack of optimization? |
| 00:55.53 | brlcad | not i/o |
| 00:56.31 | brlcad | probably a non-linear cost in there somewhere |
| 00:59.27 | brlcad | mm, actually, looks like it's maybe just horribly inefficient command-line processing |
| 01:04.09 | brlcad | heh, glob_compat_mode expansion |
| 01:06.30 | starseeker | ~lart glob_compat_mode expasion |
| 01:06.30 | ibot | strangles glob_compat_mode expasion with a 9-pole serial cable |
| 01:07.21 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo_ (n=chatzill@189.13.246.92) | |
| 01:08.08 | brlcad | ahh, and that'd be the N^2 |
| 01:08.30 | brlcad | my input point data set is one point per line |
| 01:09.18 | brlcad | it's using the "i need more" mode in mged for the 'in' command |
| 01:09.39 | brlcad | so then for every point, it scans the entire previous resulting input thusfar for possible expansion |
| 01:09.54 | brlcad | instead of just the portion being added |
| 01:10.01 | brlcad | because of where that check actually occurs |
| 01:11.08 | brlcad | so after about a half-hour, it's not even halfway done |
| 01:12.42 | brlcad | tries without globbing and without incremental command input |
| 01:13.03 | starseeker | owowow |
| 01:26.28 | brlcad | 298 registered mged commands and only 239 listed through the help system |
| 01:26.49 | brlcad | that sucks |
| 01:27.01 | brlcad | 59 with absolutely no documentation |
| 01:27.56 | brlcad | wants to get mged's total command count down to less than 200 |
| 01:28.45 | brlcad | eventually getting to less than 100 |
| 01:29.32 | starseeker | well, search may help a bit there |
| 01:30.20 | brlcad | a little bit |
| 01:31.15 | brlcad | wow, some commands have help, exist, and are *not* registered |
| 01:31.30 | Ralith | O.o |
| 01:31.31 | brlcad | gets the total "real" command count |
| 01:33.40 | brlcad | 324 commands total |
| 01:34.49 | starseeker | THINKS he has an assembly type check |
| 01:34.51 | brlcad | so 85 are undocumented |
| 01:37.06 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 01:37.42 | starseeker | commits |
| 01:38.58 | starseeker | That was suspiciously easy |
| 01:39.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Ok, modulo bugs, check |
| 01:42.59 | starseeker | brlcad: Does the command count reduction mean I get to merge the sed and oed commands? :-) |
| 01:44.01 | starseeker | needs to head home now |
| 01:44.51 | brlcad | they're a prime candidate |
| 01:53.51 | brlcad | Aaaaaannnnd.. kerrash |
| 01:53.58 | brlcad | pnts_in failure |
| 01:57.13 | starseeker | ow |
| 02:03.58 | starseeker | you're laptop is going to go on strike ;-) |
| 02:04.01 | starseeker | er your |
| 02:04.08 | starseeker | slaps self awake |
| 02:23.02 | brlcad | ponders a workout now that he knows he's not got to wake up so early |
| 02:24.53 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 03:21.48 | prasad_ | ahh still at work |
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| 10:53.41 | mafm | hi |
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| 16:09.02 | brlcad | pokes CIA-4 |
| 16:09.09 | brlcad | hey mafm |
| 16:09.14 | brlcad | get my messages? |
| 16:12.31 | mafm | brlcad: which one, the one of the code? |
| 16:12.39 | brlcad | about uploading your code |
| 16:12.49 | mafm | yup, I already did |
| 16:12.52 | brlcad | ah, great |
| 16:13.37 | mafm | there are no more requirements for google, I think |
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| 16:18.00 | *** part/#brlcad Nikty (n=nicholas@89.163.117.94) | |
| 16:32.00 | mafm | brlcad: did you test g3d yet? |
| 16:53.37 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-4 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 18:11.32 | brlcad | mafm: yep! |
| 18:11.37 | brlcad | looking great |
| 18:11.46 | brlcad | took a little finagling, it was a long while back |
| 18:12.48 | mafm | :) |
| 18:12.59 | mafm | glad that you like it |
| 18:13.26 | mafm | so we should talk some day about how to continue |
| 18:32.16 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.21.96) | |
| 18:39.37 | brlcad | absolutely |
| 18:40.03 | brlcad | i mean, I think the next step is to do full libged integration -- it'll be this week probably that the command wrapper is finished |
| 18:40.15 | brlcad | letting you run pretty much any mged command |
| 18:41.17 | brlcad | the next step would then be more gui work to make it look nice, fix some of the usability patterns |
| 18:50.25 | mafm | I see |
| 18:50.38 | mafm | is anybody going to start working on it immediately? |
| 18:51.29 | brlcad | what is "it"? |
| 18:51.32 | brlcad | this task, yes |
| 18:51.47 | mafm | on g3d |
| 18:51.49 | mafm | who? |
| 18:52.07 | brlcad | me, bob, and now starseeker have been working on libged quite a bit |
| 18:52.14 | brlcad | not g3d directly |
| 18:52.26 | brlcad | it needs libged, so the efforts been there first |
| 18:54.01 | mafm | is there any plan at all to have other ppl working on g3d in the next few weeks? |
| 18:55.20 | mafm | I have to travel to Turkey for about a week, and then I was planning to have a bit of holidays if everything goes Ok |
| 18:56.02 | brlcad | I doubt it, honestly there is about two months of concerted effort remaining on libged to complete it |
| 18:56.27 | mafm | right |
| 18:56.40 | mafm | otherwise I could start talking with the people to coordinate a bit |
| 18:57.34 | mafm | btw, Ralith isn't coding AFAIK, I guess that he needs some motivation, time, or something |
| 19:26.03 | brlcad | yeah, ebb and flow |
| 19:26.18 | brlcad | been a really busy summer in many respects |
| 19:32.29 | mafm | :) |
| 19:32.34 | mafm | ok, so I go for today |
| 19:32.37 | mafm | g'night |
| 19:33.20 | brlcad | cya! |
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| 03:16.20 | starseeker | CIA-4: helllllooooo |
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| 04:06.13 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 11:39.38 | mafm | hi |
| 11:41.22 | mafm | brlcad: lol, I had another message from you in the offical memoserv |
| 13:43.08 | brlcad | yeah, was a couple days trying to find you :) |
| 13:44.12 | mafm | I was lost in translation |
| 14:01.43 | brlcad | ~seen jack-- |
| 14:01.50 | ibot | jack-- <i=jack@unaffiliated/jack> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 27d 21h 19m 56s ago, saying: 'pirating opensource stuff rocks. so legal. :P'. |
| 14:04.12 | mafm | I will receive the payment and the t-shirt later because of that |
| 14:07.48 | starseeker | brlcad: Do you know if cawf was considered back when brlman was put together? |
| 14:11.40 | starseeker | is becoming increasingly annoyed at brlman's limitations |
| 14:26.07 | ``Erik | o.O |
| 14:31.36 | brlcad | starseeker: eh, I highly doubt cawf existed back then |
| 14:32.01 | brlcad | brlman is really provided "just in case" the users doesn't have man |
| 14:32.17 | brlcad | otherwise, feel free to rip it a new one |
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| 18:03.51 | louipc | canadian arm wrestling federation? |
| 18:29.11 | starseeker | heh - a C version of awf, Henry Spencer's Amazingly Workable (text) Formatter |
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| 18:47.11 | starseeker | we use awf right now for the basic last-ditch brlman manual reader |
| 18:48.18 | starseeker | I'm hoping the C code in cawf can provide an alternative that gives us greater flexibility for things like supplying text to non-terminal outputs, although looking at this code I think there's a bit of a challenge ahead |
| 18:52.59 | prasad_1 | starseeker: where can i find this awf/cawf |
| 18:59.29 | prasad_1 | ah awk |
| 19:29.22 | louipc | I just use man :P |
| 19:29.35 | louipc | but I guess it could be helpful for windows people? |
| 19:35.17 | mafm | going home, see you |
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| 20:26.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32654 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (primitives/dsp/dsp.c table.c): Implemented rt_dsp_tess() |
| 20:27.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32655 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (Makefile.am search.1): Add man page for search command, even though it is (currently) an MGED only command. Need to work on displaying it inside of MGED. |
| 20:31.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32656 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/dsp/dsp.c: |
| 20:31.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: it is important to preserve the order of includes |
| 20:31.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: common.h/<system header files>/bio.h/<other BRL-CAD header files> |
| 20:36.33 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F892.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:39.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32657 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/RtServerImpl.h src/librtserver/rtserver.c): Mods to account for changed package names in MUVES3 |
| 20:39.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32658 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.1: Fix non-assembly non-region combination search so it actually works |
| 20:39.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32659 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Add option to type to spot nested regions (assemblies with the region flag set, or regions containing regions depending on how you look at it.) |
| 20:39.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32660 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.1: Update man page to include tables of standard attributes, types recognized, and other tweaks. |
| 20:39.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32661 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 20:39.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: bob improved the Pro/E exporter so that it now iterates over different tolerance |
| 20:39.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: settings, adaptively refining the tessellation tolerance to a more refined mesh |
| 20:39.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: if a coarser tolerance fails. allows controlling the chord length and angle. |
| 20:39.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: he also added more control over logging allowing only outputting success, |
| 20:39.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: failures, success+failures, or all debug output. |
| 20:39.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32662 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 20:39.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: add another line specifically for the pro/e logging options since it's a fairly |
| 20:39.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: feature in itself. both the tolerancing and logging changes fulfill sf request |
| 20:40.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: #2105927 (Refinemets of Pro/E to BRLCAD converter) from lee butler. |
| 20:40.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32663 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 20:40.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: john awesomely added tessellation support to the DSP primitive. the fact that |
| 20:40.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: dsp's lacked tess support was brought to attention on the brlcad-devel mailing |
| 20:40.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: list by Bengt Wennehorst who discovered g-stl failing on a dsp. naturally, |
| 20:40.03 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: adding tess support to the dsp primitive makes it possible to export them |
| 20:40.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: through any of the polygonal exporters. |
| 20:42.45 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F892.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:43.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32664 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Add the release data for 7.12.6 |
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| 20:48.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32665 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.1: Formatting tweaks. |
| 20:52.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32645 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): Add maxdepth and mindepth options to search |
| 21:01.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32651 10/brlcad/trunk/src/external/ProEngineer/ (proe-brl.c proe_brl.res): Modified to iterate over ranges of tolerances (i.e. one for chord length and one for angle). Also added more control over logging. |
| 21:06.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32646 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): Enable -empty option in search - will return combinations with no subtree. |
| 21:07.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32647 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Get iname working (along with changes to libbu to allow search to know about BU_CASEFOLD |
| 21:11.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32648 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): Add path option to search |
| 21:13.22 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32649 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Regions are combinations - report them if type is combination |
| 21:14.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32650 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Add assembly type check to search. |
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| 23:16.18 | brlcad | looks like samba folks are to blame about CIA going down recently |
| 23:16.34 | brlcad | they did some git push that queued up 78k commits |
| 23:18.01 | Ralith | impressive |
| 23:19.22 | brlcad | it's almost unbelievable actually, I'm thinking the wiped and remerged their entire history or somesuch |
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| 00:46.34 | ``Erik | damn |
| 01:45.38 | starseeker_ | hmm - http://es.fbk.eu/events/fmcad08/index.html |
| 01:50.33 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:55.12 | starseeker_ | wonders how much background training would be needed to actually understand a Formal Method CAD paper |
| 01:55.31 | starseeker_ | eeep http://www.cs.ubc.ca/~jbingham/fmcad08-extended.pdf |
| 02:04.52 | louipc | hah technicians aren't necessarily good writers |
| 02:44.36 | starseeker_ | brlcad: this looks relevant: http://doc-book.sourceforge.net/homepage/ |
| 02:44.48 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Perhaps this as well: http://drupal.org/project/export_docbook |
| 03:14.42 | starseeker_ | http://moinmo.in/HelpOnXmlPages |
| 03:33.14 | starseeker_ | brlcad: I take it doclifter was the tool you were referring to for manpage->docbook? The results are fairly impressive. |
| 03:36.31 | starseeker_ | Here's the rt man page converted to docbook and then from docbook to html with no manual editing on my part: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/rt.html |
| 03:43.54 | starseeker_ | Hmm - well, there's certainly this for html in tcl/tk and the license appears to be BSD - http://tkhtml.tcl.tk/index.html |
| 03:44.09 | starseeker_ | claims to be alpha code though |
| 03:48.53 | starseeker_ | GPL license on this one - nuts http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/ |
| 03:53.21 | starseeker_ | well, nuts http://midc.miem.edu.ru/HelpSystem/ us GPL too |
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| 06:55.20 | yukonbob | starseeker_: what are you looking for, with this html libraries? |
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| 12:23.24 | starseeker_ | yukonbob: A way to display html in MGED rather than relying on starting up a browser |
| 12:27.40 | starseeker_ | makes note to compare docbook2X to whatever the "standard" option is for xsltproc when translating back from docbook to man page... |
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| 13:06.23 | mafm | hallo |
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| 13:56.56 | mafm_ | sigh |
| 13:57.07 | mafm_ | hail my network admins |
| 13:57.24 | mafm_ | is looking for a new jobs btw, please employers apply |
| 16:22.34 | prasad_1 | where are u mafm_ |
| 16:25.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32669 10/brlcad/trunk/ (misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln src/conv/Makefile.am): Added a bot-stl converter that converts bots to stl without evaluation. |
| 16:26.55 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14F089.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:54.27 | mafm_ | prasad_1: Portugal |
| 17:01.42 | prasad_1 | tough :( |
| 17:07.35 | mafm | yup |
| 17:33.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32670 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot-stl.c: Added a bot-stl converter that converts bots to stl without evaluation. |
| 17:39.58 | prasad_1 | if u were in the us we have a cpl of spots open |
| 17:40.32 | mafm | where do you work at? |
| 17:50.33 | prasad_1 | www.scaleform.com |
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| 18:57.16 | mafm | prasad_1: heh, not bad |
| 18:59.10 | *** join/#brlcad b0ef (n=b0ef@062016141231.customer.alfanett.no) | |
| 19:13.26 | mafm | going home, take care |
| 19:13.28 | mafm | :) |
| 21:37.12 | starseeker | Hmm - CIA apparently doesn't like me |
| 21:38.22 | PrezKennedy | black vans following you around? |
| 22:03.05 | Ralith | hm? |
| 22:51.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32672 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: |
| 22:51.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Fix a couple bugs in the -below option - now seems to be working better, results |
| 22:51.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: on m35.g match those of -type nr search. Also do better path argument |
| 22:51.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: validation - multiple object full path values are valid, so can't just do |
| 22:51.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: db_lookup on argv. |
| 22:53.41 | starseeker | ah, crud |
| 22:59.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32673 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Doggone it - do path validation right this time. |
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| 01:35.08 | starseeker_ | PrezKennedy: heh, no not yet |
| 01:35.37 | starseeker_ | doubts IRC bots have gotten good enough with AI to take over cars, but you never know... |
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| 03:00.34 | brlcad | starseeker_: doc-book wiki is a project I've been involved with loosely for years -- tis a great project, but unfortunately not a great wiki |
| 03:01.18 | brlcad | the mediawiki and drupal docbook integrations are more interesting since they can hook into what we already have better |
| 03:01.41 | brlcad | and yes, doclifter is the one |
| 03:04.52 | brlcad | starseeker_: and Tkhtml3 should be more than enough to display our stuff, you really shouldn't need a complicated comprehensive html support package |
| 03:05.11 | brlcad | in fact the smaller/simpler the better/easier it will be to maintain and integrate |
| 03:16.19 | brlcad | starseeker_: also, Tkhtml at http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/ is not GPL, it's LGPL |
| 03:51.52 | starseeker_ | brlcad: They seem to have both GPL and LGPL statements in their tarball: http://www.hwaci.com/sw/tkhtml/tkhtml.tar.gz |
| 03:51.59 | starseeker_ | brlcad: and the README is saying GPL |
| 03:52.03 | starseeker_ | is confused |
| 03:52.22 | brlcad | well, sources say lgpl, and those are all we'd need |
| 03:52.40 | starseeker_ | which is the better one to look at do you think? |
| 03:53.18 | brlcad | well, it's certainly a lot simpler than tkthml3 |
| 03:53.53 | starseeker_ | nods. |
| 03:54.01 | brlcad | I'd give tkhtml3 a try, see if it's simple to integrate |
| 03:54.11 | brlcad | if not, fall back to the one that you know should be simple |
| 03:54.16 | starseeker_ | Right |
| 03:55.05 | starseeker_ | Don't know if you've had a chance to look - I got above and below working, but at the cost of yet another tree walking routine. |
| 03:55.33 | brlcad | saw the commit |
| 03:56.05 | starseeker_ | is thinking when the tree walker rework comes he'll rip all that out, but leave it for now? |
| 03:56.41 | brlcad | that's the idea for all the walkers eventually |
| 03:56.48 | brlcad | at least most of them |
| 03:59.43 | starseeker_ | nods |
| 04:00.06 | starseeker_ | was actually a good experience - taught me something about how general a really good tree walker will need to be |
| 04:00.30 | starseeker_ | should I rip out the nested_region type? |
| 04:04.21 | brlcad | does the added value outweigh the added complexity and maintenance burden? |
| 04:04.30 | brlcad | if it does, keep it; if not, rip it |
| 04:05.16 | starseeker_ | Added complexity is virtually ziltch for that type. |
| 04:05.34 | starseeker_ | at least, given the need to detect assembly types too ;-) |
| 04:06.15 | starseeker_ | Actually was able to show Mike that option to help him get at a model problem today |
| 04:06.22 | starseeker_ | he seemed to like it |
| 04:06.34 | starseeker_ | even though that wasn't his actual problem ;-) |
| 04:06.55 | brlcad | remember everything that's involved, not just code |
| 04:07.34 | brlcad | documentation over a lifetime, etc |
| 04:08.17 | starseeker_ | nods. I'd say that it's actually much simpler to document that option than it is to explain search -below -type region -type region |
| 04:08.43 | starseeker_ | so in that sense (docs included) it's probably a net savings |
| 04:09.10 | brlcad | and the fact that it breaks the consistency (it's not a type like the others, it's sort of a metatype) |
| 04:09.17 | starseeker_ | so is assembly |
| 04:09.25 | brlcad | yep |
| 04:09.44 | brlcad | that's not reason to keep it, that's reason to do something about both of them ;) |
| 04:10.18 | brlcad | that said, if you think it's really worth it -- then i'll go with that |
| 04:11.09 | starseeker_ | I'm willing to concede that anyone likely to appreciate (or care about) nested regions and assemblies can probably understand examples explaining how to detect them |
| 04:12.01 | starseeker_ | Tell you what - if I do a tutorial-style doc for the search command that includes subsections on spotting assemblies and nested regions, I'll support yanking them as types. |
| 04:12.19 | starseeker_ | 's main concern is to make sure usability is there |
| 04:13.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32674 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: make sure creating points with the in command will not result in empty point sets. also make sure they match the number specified at the beginning, not the number provided (which could be larger) |
| 04:13.24 | starseeker_ | reflects on the deafening irony of that concern given MGED's usability status, but still... |
| 04:13.39 | starseeker_ | cheers the point primitive |
| 04:17.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32675 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: missing declaration of wdb_stub_cmd for windows (it's used by mged) |
| 04:24.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32676 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/libbu/vls.c): |
| 04:24.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fix a bug in bu_vls_gets where a fixed buffer size of BUFSIZE*10 was incorrectly |
| 04:24.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: returning truncated/short lines. this caused nulls to get inserted during reads |
| 04:24.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: that in turn caused commands like mged's 'in' command to fail. encountered this |
| 04:24.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: problem when creating a new pnts object (though it conceivably affects *any* |
| 04:24.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: mged command. |
| 04:29.22 | brlcad | is impressed to find out that you can actually display half a million points interactively |
| 04:29.38 | starseeker_ | wow |
| 04:29.49 | starseeker_ | that is pretty impressive |
| 04:29.54 | brlcad | at least half a million, haven't seen how high it'll go |
| 04:30.02 | starseeker_ | heh |
| 04:30.14 | starseeker_ | feels pity for brlcad's poor computer |
| 04:34.41 | starseeker_ | brlcad: You might find some interesting stuff here: http://www.mpa-garching.mpg.de/Virgo/data_download.html |
| 04:35.53 | starseeker_ | This sucker is 280 megs, not sure how many points that equates to: http://www.vis.uni-stuttgart.de/eng/research/fields/current/pointclouds/virgo.pcld.gz |
| 04:39.10 | brlcad | even displaying them as spheres works relatively reasonably implying that it should be fine to display upwards of about 10M points "interactively" |
| 04:39.42 | starseeker_ | jeez |
| 04:40.00 | starseeker_ | how many points are we looking at for a full vehicle scan? |
| 04:40.19 | brlcad | nobody has ever done one |
| 04:40.39 | starseeker_ | heh - well, that's one point ;-) |
| 04:40.52 | brlcad | it's not even clear (to me) that it's still anywhere close to being a viable/efficient modeling approach (scanning) |
| 04:41.12 | brlcad | but it is useful for visualization and as reference points for "real modeling" |
| 04:41.28 | starseeker_ | That's my thought |
| 04:41.46 | starseeker_ | Dwayne can follow a point cloud around making primitives for the surface |
| 04:43.58 | starseeker_ | I really don't see how a point cloud can serve as anything but (maybe) a basis for a single mesh |
| 04:44.15 | brlcad | now the cool trick would be to leverage what we did with the vulcan scanner |
| 04:45.24 | brlcad | click a button, select a couple points from the scan, and it'd automatically make primitives for you |
| 04:46.15 | starseeker_ | Hmm. Maybe have it prompt for a user selected list of points to "fit" a user selected primitive type to? |
| 04:46.57 | starseeker_ | or a version of in where it's a option to use the mouse to sample the point cloud and have it print the xyz coords to the in command? |
| 04:49.10 | brlcad | that's sort of what lee and I did |
| 04:49.23 | brlcad | the first one at least |
| 04:49.45 | starseeker_ | first one is probably more useful :-) |
| 04:49.49 | brlcad | the vulcan is a point-sample cmm device, gives you individual points in 3space |
| 04:50.26 | brlcad | so we came up with a system where you could create primitives using a set of conventions |
| 04:51.24 | brlcad | so like for an N-sided "plate", for example, you'd click a point on each corner of the top, and then one point for the depth |
| 04:51.35 | brlcad | and it'd automatically make the corresponding solid |
| 04:51.56 | brlcad | (which in that exaple best fit a sketch and an extrude) |
| 04:52.35 | starseeker_ | nice |
| 04:52.35 | brlcad | if you had a cylindrical object, you could select three points on one of the ends and a fourth point for the length, and it'd make the tgc/rcc |
| 04:53.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32677 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.1 search.c): |
| 04:53.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Now that above and below are working, there is no need for special case logic to |
| 04:53.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: handle assemblies and nested regions in the type section. Since those are |
| 04:53.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: likely to be common search cases, include examples of how to use below to find |
| 04:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: nested regions and assemblies have been added to the man page. |
| 04:54.27 | brlcad | there was a dozen or so defined, mged has it now as (the undocumented, as it's pre-alpha) parse_points command |
| 04:54.44 | starseeker_ | sweet |
| 04:54.46 | brlcad | expecting labels and points from a file |
| 04:55.14 | brlcad | which is what src/mged/points is |
| 04:55.32 | starseeker_ | should those live in libged eventually? |
| 05:00.05 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Well, this mortal must seek sleep - thanks for talking me into the type handling change. That does seem cleaner. |
| 05:01.04 | brlcad | i wasn't trying to talk you into one way or the other, just to think about all the tradeoffs |
| 05:01.18 | starseeker_ | either way, good thoughts :-) |
| 05:01.58 | starseeker_ | also realized that with .mgedrc you could simply alias a findnestedregions command to a specific search |
| 05:02.39 | starseeker_ | same for a wide variety of common searches - worth mentioning as a labour saving technique in the main docs. |
| 05:06.16 | starseeker_ | shutdown -h brain |
| 05:13.38 | brlcad | hrm |
| 05:13.57 | brlcad | kicks CIA-4 |
| 05:13.57 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 05:19.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32681 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/namegen.c: beware of c99isms, ws. add to dist. |
| 05:20.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32682 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/Makefile.am: beware of c99isms, ws. add to dist. |
| 05:29.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32683 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: don't call it isblank, don't rely on it being a define either. just roll own. |
| 05:45.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32684 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (edsol.c mged.h): dead code cleanup |
| 06:18.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32685 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: ws |
| 06:24.37 | Ralith | ws? |
| 06:24.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32686 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: quell warnings and fix a bug with case-insensitive matching (it was always matching case-insensitive). |
| 06:30.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32687 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: (log message trimmed) |
| 06:30.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: bob finished implementing a preliminary bot-stl exporter that dumps out bots as |
| 06:30.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: stl data but without evaluating the csg booleans, solidity, normals, etc. this |
| 06:30.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: is to help make export go much faster when the modeler doesn't care about the |
| 06:30.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: geometric representation. this is *really* exceptionally bad for analysis |
| 06:30.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: purposes unless you know exactly what you're doing and the implications; it's |
| 06:30.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fine for rendering/visualization purposes though. this addresses sf bug 2106032 |
| 06:49.08 | brlcad | ~ws |
| 06:49.11 | ibot | methinks ws is short for workstation. White Space, or the country code for Western Samoa |
| 07:00.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32691 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.h: bogus declaration. maybe that has something to do with the bizzare crash reported to the sf bug tracker [ 2043925 ] ERROR: NULL bn_tol pointer. |
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| 11:24.11 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:25.53 | mafm | hello |
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| 13:10.45 | starseeker_ | brlcad: Whoops. Sorry you had to mess with the ccblank/isblank stuff |
| 13:42.19 | starseeker_ | is really liking doclifter :-) |
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| 14:14.30 | starseeker_ | scowls at xchat |
| 14:36.50 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker_ (n=CY@c-68-33-217-173.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 14:36.52 | starseeker_ | grr |
| 15:27.29 | brlcad | catches th' outgoing tide, arrr! |
| 15:27.50 | brlcad | mornin' mafm |
| 15:29.33 | mafm | hello brlcad |
| 16:30.33 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:36.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32692 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: emphasize some of the more significant warnings by sleeping longer |
| 16:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32693 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: |
| 16:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: automatically search /usr/X11 for X11 components since AC_PATH_XTRA on Mac OS X |
| 16:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 10.5 (where R7 is now used) isn't set up to search there yet. this should fix |
| 16:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the 10.5 mac build that was previously failing in Tk because X11 was getting |
| 16:42.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: disabled when it couldn't find libXi. |
| 16:53.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32694 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Added declarations for wdb_search_cmd and wdb_stub_cmd. |
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| 19:22.11 | mafm | well, I'm going home |
| 19:22.39 | mafm | I'm gonna be mostly unreachable for a week, going to a congress in Turkey |
| 19:22.45 | mafm | be happy! |
| 19:27.53 | brlcad | cya mafm, have a great weekend! |
| 19:28.52 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 20:20.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32695 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 20:20.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: trying to make the solver start looking at the current values and start |
| 20:20.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: iteration rather than from the minimum value possible, so as to facilitate |
| 20:20.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: implicit constraint checks during rt_prep for instance which might be satisfying |
| 20:20.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the constraints already (nonfunctional), code cleanup |
| 20:29.16 | ``Erik | shiver me timbers o.O |
| 20:34.20 | prasad_1 | arrrrrrrrr |
| 21:19.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32696 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/adrt.h: add load format defs |
| 21:20.22 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32697 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/load.c: stub out the various load formats |
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| 03:46.24 | starseeker | ``Erik: Is an extension of ".1.xml" enough to mess up the .html.xml: build rule? |
| 03:46.41 | starseeker | resists urge to pull hair out... |
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| 14:51.17 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
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| 22:19.40 | starseeker | Woooooot |
| 22:20.09 | starseeker | gets close to a successful build of all BRL-CAD man1 man pages with docbook |
| 22:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32698 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/picket_fence.1: make sure man page uses the spelling picket instead of pickett (command is picket_fence) |
| 22:56.27 | starseeker | src/other/URToolkit/man/template.1 is a bit of a nusiance |
| 22:59.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32699 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/URToolkit/man/rleinterp.1: make rleinterp man page use rleinterp instead of rleintrp. |
| 23:03.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32700 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cad_boundp.1 cad_parea.1): tweak headers of man pages for cad_boundp and cad_parea |
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| 02:31.47 | starseeker | brlcad: How do we want to handle man1 man pages that come from src/other? I presume those shouldn't be docbooked? |
| 03:11.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32701 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/alias-pix.1: formatting tweaks |
| 03:14.12 | starseeker | brlcad: chan_mult looks like it should really be two man files - it's got multiple name lines, which doclifter doesn't care for |
| 03:16.03 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32702 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf-g.1: Doesn't look as if there should be a period before ATTRIB |
| 03:17.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32703 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fb/fbframe.1: Add space between RB and [ |
| 03:26.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32705 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mk/mk_bolt.1: Looks like a stray .g at beginning of line was resulting in conversion error in doclifter and an undisplayed line in man. |
| 03:32.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32706 10/brlcad/trunk/src/fb/pixautosize.1: looks like .fr was supposed to be .ft based on similar example further down page. |
| 03:34.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32707 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pixcut.1: pp should be PP - up-case command |
| 03:37.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32708 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pixdsplit.1: .\% giving uninterpreted command error and doesn't seem to impact rendering in man - removing. |
| 03:41.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32709 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/pix-sun.1: formatting tweaks |
| 03:43.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32711 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/rtscale.1: filename isn't a command - needs a command before it |
| 03:48.10 | brlcad | starseeker: yep, minimal or no effort in src/other |
| 03:48.47 | brlcad | take any liberties necessary (chan_mult, etc), the docs are fair game for overhaulage |
| 03:49.15 | starseeker | righto, thanks :-) |
| 03:49.58 | starseeker | Looks like I'm down to five that can't be autolifted |
| 03:50.51 | starseeker | brlcad: How do you want to approach this - should it be an "all at once" swoop or can I make "most" of them install from docbook and pick up the rest? |
| 03:51.46 | brlcad | commit early |
| 03:51.48 | brlcad | commit often |
| 03:51.50 | brlcad | code complete |
| 03:53.51 | starseeker | code complete? |
| 03:54.27 | brlcad | i.e. work piecewise but don't leave it half-done |
| 03:54.46 | starseeker | right |
| 03:54.56 | brlcad | coding complete is the practice of working on a task and leaving things in a functional state after every step |
| 03:55.06 | brlcad | even if it results in (seemingly) more work |
| 03:55.10 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 03:55.22 | starseeker | fortunately, in this case it isn't more work :-) |
| 03:55.55 | brlcad | it rarely ever is *actually* more work over the lifetime of the effort to all developers that have a vested interest |
| 03:57.49 | brlcad | starseeker: there's more info about coding complete on the wiki in the gsoc pages |
| 03:58.03 | brlcad | as it was one of their "acceptance criteria" |
| 03:58.08 | brlcad | digs |
| 03:58.55 | starseeker | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Acceptance#Write_complete_code |
| 03:58.56 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/Acceptance |
| 03:59.25 | brlcad | the last three are particularly relevant to any developer |
| 04:00.54 | starseeker | nods - well written |
| 04:14.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32712 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: mged seems to be behaving much better now. still needs more work, but better is better. |
| 04:16.06 | *** join/#brlcad thing0 (n=ric@124-169-182-238.dyn.iinet.net.au) | |
| 04:16.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32713 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: there's no need to revert the nmg processing back out of librt into a generic library, at least not before the next release. push it down. |
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| 04:31.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32714 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: Adding initial support for enabling/disabling docbook building - doesn't impact anything yet but the logic should be in place. |
| 04:43.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32715 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: remove duplicate |
| 05:49.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32716 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): |
| 05:49.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Initial framework for docbook based building and installation of man pages. |
| 05:49.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Currently builds both html and man page; for the moment it installs the html |
| 05:49.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: version in the data directory, subdirectory html/man1 Only two test files are |
| 05:49.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: present at the moment, and their original man page ancestors are not yet removed |
| 05:49.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: - this will come once testing of new arrangement is complete. |
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| 16:01.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32718 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/ (alias-pix.xml all_sf.xml): rework autoconverted man page docbook, add copyright statement in comments. |
| 16:08.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32719 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/ (alias-pix.xml all_sf.xml): tweaks |
| 17:54.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32720 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/fast4-g.c: oops, not from stdin. read from fpin. |
| 18:45.14 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.207.60) | |
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| 19:35.18 | iraytrace | Anyone built a 64bit version on Leopard? |
| 20:08.18 | brlcad | iraytrace: i helped parker get a build on friday |
| 20:09.01 | iraytrace | Any trick to it? |
| 20:09.18 | brlcad | it fails finding tk because it doesn't build tk; it doesn't build tk because it can't find libXi (or more exactly all of X11); it fails to find X11 because it's no longer /usr/X11R6 |
| 20:09.20 | iraytrace | I just did a checkout and configure still can't doi it. |
| 20:09.23 | brlcad | so you have to tell configure where X is |
| 20:10.05 | brlcad | try --with-x=/usr/X11 |
| 20:10.22 | brlcad | otherwise have to add /usr/X11/lib and /usr/X11/include to the paths |
| 20:10.38 | brlcad | --with-x should do that for you (untested) |
| 20:10.57 | iraytrace | Hmm. I have a /usr/X11R6 on my machine (installed the Apple X first) |
| 20:11.09 | iraytrace | I got a comfigure, but not a compile. |
| 20:11.13 | brlcad | it's not complete |
| 20:11.21 | iraytrace | ./configure CFLAGS=-m64 CXXFLAGS=-m64 --enable-everything --enable-64bit-build |
| 20:11.24 | brlcad | there's just a few libs that are there for compatibility |
| 20:11.44 | brlcad | 10.5 bumped it up to X11R7 |
| 20:11.54 | brlcad | so it's now just /usr/X11 |
| 20:13.09 | iraytrace | I also installed Xquartz |
| 20:13.30 | iraytrace | Seems to be a different problem that we saw on friday. |
| 20:13.42 | brlcad | what's the problem? |
| 20:14.11 | iraytrace | first, --enable-64bit-build doesn't set -m64 |
| 20:14.22 | brlcad | custom-installed X11 is uncharted territory, little chance that would work with default configure options to say the least |
| 20:14.38 | iraytrace | define "custom" |
| 20:14.45 | brlcad | yeah, that's a known issue -- even when it does set it, you still have to set the FLAGS |
| 20:15.11 | brlcad | because of how the libtool script gets generated before configure completes |
| 20:15.37 | brlcad | it'll end up compiling 32-bit and there's not a good way to force it (that I've found so far) without setting the flags directly |
| 20:15.44 | brlcad | at least not for all platforms |
| 20:15.46 | iraytrace | I haven't seen any X11R7 dir. All the systems I've seen (install Leopard, install Xquartz) have X11R6 |
| 20:15.59 | brlcad | it's not an R7 dir, it's just /usr/X11 |
| 20:16.17 | iraytrace | X11R6 is a sym-link to X11 |
| 20:16.56 | brlcad | ah, right |
| 20:17.45 | iraytrace | When I build I get down to "pngtcl" and get an error: ld: in /usr/local/lib/libfreetype.6.dylib, missing required architecture x86_64 in file |
| 20:17.57 | iraytrace | Odd, since I didn't know we were using freetype |
| 20:18.02 | brlcad | tk uses it |
| 20:18.07 | brlcad | optionally |
| 20:18.11 | iraytrace | at least not the system one during --enable-everything |
| 20:18.44 | brlcad | quick fix is to turn that off, sounds like it's finding a freetype you installed |
| 20:19.01 | brlcad | a non-64-bit install |
| 20:20.20 | brlcad | try adding --disable-xft to configure |
| 20:20.39 | brlcad | make sure it gets passed to tk's sub-configure |
| 20:21.48 | iraytrace | I renamed freetype.dylib and am making progress now. |
| 20:51.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32721 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/ (Makefile.am fastgen.sh fastgen_dos.fast4): |
| 20:51.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: add a new test script to exercise the fast4-g converter. the test writes out a |
| 20:51.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: simple box in fastgen format with unix line termination and with dos line |
| 20:51.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: termination, makes sure both can be converted to a .g, and that the two .g's |
| 20:51.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: have no differences via a g_diff test. |
| 21:42.07 | iraytrace | brlcad: thanks. I've got it running now in 64bit mode. |
| 23:23.11 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:34.28 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 23:34.28 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 23:45.14 | *** join/#brlcad elmom_ (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 23:59.42 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.193.45) | |
| 00:00.09 | docelic | hey folks, I'm looking at the tire tutorial, and it uses "1 tire" in mged, but I get invalid command name "1".. what's the catch? |
| 00:02.00 | docelic | actually I see that's "l", but still it looks like I have to load the .g file first? |
| 00:43.34 | starseeker | yes |
| 00:43.47 | starseeker | you must load the .g - it's the database with the tire in it |
| 00:44.33 | starseeker | If you're new to BRL-CAD you might want to spend some time with the VolII book before hitting the tire tool - it makes some assumptions about knowledge of BRL-CAD |
| 00:55.50 | brlcad | notes that docelic left.. |
| 00:56.18 | brlcad | he's not new to the channel, but undoubtedly a newbie to mged |
| 00:56.38 | starseeker | ah, shoot |
| 00:56.46 | starseeker | needs to check people leaving... |
| 00:57.46 | starseeker | brlcad: Does the docbook->man stuff look reasonable to proceed with? |
| 00:59.00 | brlcad | starseeker: the stuff I've seen to date looks good |
| 00:59.09 | brlcad | lots of repairs, I noticed |
| 00:59.32 | brlcad | looks like about 2-4% had a problem |
| 00:59.50 | starseeker | Heh |
| 01:00.02 | starseeker | Little tweaks for the most part, nothing spectacular |
| 01:00.33 | starseeker | The docbook will need to be hand fixed in most cases, and that means things like multiple command names can also be delt with |
| 01:00.47 | brlcad | how does it look if you take it back to man? |
| 01:00.54 | starseeker | pretty good |
| 01:01.14 | starseeker | i.e. - about the same |
| 01:01.25 | starseeker | headers are a bit different - more "standard" I suppose |
| 01:01.37 | starseeker | include things like date created |
| 01:03.33 | starseeker | also, xsltproc fusses if it doesn't have an author entry, so for the ones without it I'm just putting "BRL-CAD Team" |
| 01:06.46 | starseeker | will break out the license comment section into its own file to avoid duplication |
| 01:07.10 | brlcad | yeah, that's actually where it would be good to start collecting real authorship information for programs |
| 01:07.31 | brlcad | listing everyone that has worked on the various programs, sort out a mechanism for level of contributions |
| 01:07.39 | brlcad | similar to the authors file, but per application |
| 01:08.09 | starseeker | nods. Yes, that's a good idea |
| 01:08.35 | starseeker | better to wait until after the technical side is up and running though - that's a potential mine field |
| 01:09.11 | brlcad | it's a lot of svn searching |
| 01:11.14 | starseeker | True |
| 01:12.01 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:14.56 | starseeker | hmm, actually makes very little sense to xinclude a commented section. |
| 02:32.25 | yukonbob | o.O |
| 02:32.36 | yukonbob | spies "xinclude"... |
| 02:34.00 | louipc | aww I can create a truncated right cone but not a true full right cone |
| 02:54.59 | starseeker | yukonbob: Yes, we're using it in the Docbook work |
| 03:20.22 | yukonbob | starseeker: I was trying to use it in some work, and it was choking -- I _think_ I traced the problem via google, but I don't even remember off top of head what the issue was... It looked like it required some extra work outside of the .xml file itself, though... |
| 03:20.40 | yukonbob | starseeker: is the work commited (ie: if I update my checkout, I'll see it?) |
| 03:20.46 | starseeker | hmm. I've had pretty good success with it so far. |
| 03:20.59 | starseeker | yep - look in doc/docbook |
| 03:21.16 | starseeker | it's not integrated into the build system just yet except for a couple test files |
| 03:21.38 | yukonbob | starseeker: so are you just manually running a toolchain? |
| 03:21.56 | starseeker | I have been up til now |
| 03:22.10 | yukonbob | has been using xsltproc (DocBook -> html) |
| 03:22.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32722 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Put docbook version of search command in, and remove old man page version. Already formats much better, and is serving as a good test case for template development. |
| 03:22.30 | yukonbob | updates his copy of tree... |
| 03:22.38 | starseeker | If you have xsltproc, you should be able to make the examples in doc/docbook/system/mnan1 now |
| 03:22.42 | starseeker | er man1 rather |
| 03:22.59 | yukonbob | is xsltproc what you've been using too? |
| 03:23.04 | starseeker | yep |
| 03:24.14 | starseeker | The man pages generated by this process are almost certainly too much for awf, but in this day and age the only platform that doesn't have man on it that anybody uses is Windows, and even awf doesn't help there |
| 03:25.01 | starseeker | This process will get us html and (eventually) pdf versions of everything for free, and will even allow the same sources to be integrated both into Volume II's appendix and the man page process |
| 03:25.19 | yukonbob | indeed |
| 03:25.36 | starseeker | is tense - afahk no one else has yet tried this |
| 03:30.26 | yukonbob | wouldn't be worried -- docbook is built to be maleable that way. |
| 03:34.24 | starseeker | I mean building it |
| 03:34.41 | starseeker | is a tad new to autoconf hackery |
| 03:38.52 | yukonbob | starseeker: perhaps tap into the cmake work that's going on... |
| 03:38.54 | yukonbob | ? |
| 03:40.00 | yukonbob | is _NOT_ a cmake expert (or even a novice), but has the book, and intends to learn it. I it's promise is very interesting |
| 03:40.08 | yukonbob | *I think it's ... |
| 03:41.17 | starseeker | is supposed to be able to work with BRL-CAD as it stands ;-) |
| 03:42.11 | yukonbob | well "as it stands" seems to me to be a moving target ;) |
| 03:42.30 | yukonbob | ...but you're the implementor and more "in the loop", if there's in fact a loop to be in ;) |
| 03:42.40 | yukonbob | heads out on Quest for Food |
| 03:45.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32723 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/search.xml: Add dashes to primitives. Also include author section so xsltproc will be quiet. |
| 03:55.16 | starseeker | grins evilly |
| 03:55.20 | starseeker | http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/search.html |
| 03:55.36 | starseeker | and http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/search_man.png |
| 04:03.28 | yukonbob | nice tables in that man page |
| 04:09.59 | starseeker | :-) |
| 04:10.05 | starseeker | thanks |
| 04:10.43 | starseeker | looks like I need to add some html specific table logic to get them to look better there |
| 04:10.51 | starseeker | will do that tomorrow... |
| 04:11.07 | starseeker | were you able to build them? |
| 04:30.53 | yukonbob | didn't try yet... |
| 04:31.33 | yukonbob | heads to doc/docbook/system/man1 |
| 04:35.00 | yukonbob | may see what his issue was... |
| 04:53.02 | brlcad | louipc: what do you mean? what is a "true full" one? |
| 04:56.12 | brlcad | starseeker: that man page looks outstanding, nice |
| 05:01.42 | starseeker | yukonbob: If you want to look at xinclude stuff, try the VolumeII.xml file in doc/docbook/book/tutorial_series - I'm not using it in the man pages as yet |
| 05:01.47 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks! |
| 05:07.22 | yukonbob | waves to brlcad, gets ready to sign-off for evening... |
| 05:13.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32724 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 05:13.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: unable to reproduce the text flood hang when running rtarea on 'slow' machines. |
| 05:13.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: probably just a case of not trying a machine that's actually slow enough, but we |
| 05:13.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: did try several configurations and enough has changed so it was maybe |
| 05:13.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: inadvertently fixed anyways. |
| 09:00.40 | louipc | brlcad: ending with a point instead of ending with a circle. I made the second radius .00001 heh |
| 09:04.45 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 09:05.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32725 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/BrlcadCore.def: added bu_vls_gets |
| 09:05.40 | Ralith | so, not a point, just a very very small circle. |
| 12:15.43 | starseeker | Of course, in the real physical world you never have an infinitely sharp point |
| 12:16.07 | starseeker | even an atomicly pointed cone isn't the same as a true mathematical non-truncated cone ;-) |
| 12:59.44 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:01.47 | brlcad | louipc: that's actually intentional since physically there is no "infinitely thin" tipped point |
| 13:11.07 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14C9E5.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:24.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32727 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: the c++ engine is in the rt^3 module and john implemented tess for the dsp |
| 13:24.49 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32726 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: vararg.h was eliminated along with the old cray code |
| 13:25.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32728 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: cliff fixed the 'Create Solid' reference in volII already as part of the docbook conversion |
| 13:25.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32729 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: cliff implemented a find command for mged (woot) |
| 14:44.13 | brlcad | debates finally hitting up rtarea once again |
| 14:45.21 | yukonbob | waves in: Hello, cadheads |
| 14:45.30 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 14:45.45 | yukonbob | what's shaking, brlcad? |
| 14:47.23 | brlcad | my belly |
| 14:47.31 | brlcad | not enough gym time lately :( |
| 14:48.23 | prasad_1 | <nelson>ha ha</nelson> |
| 14:48.24 | prasad_1 | ;) |
| 14:49.50 | brlcad | yeah, it's pretty bad .. eating way too much, rotator cuff is inflamed something aweful, cardio capacity is *way* down |
| 14:51.06 | prasad_1 | i went last night |
| 14:51.10 | prasad_1 | after 6 mos |
| 14:51.11 | prasad_1 | :o |
| 14:51.14 | prasad_1 | hurtin |
| 14:51.19 | yukonbob | :P |
| 14:51.46 | yukonbob | went for big run/hike for first time in long time other week too... actually felt really good (at the end) |
| 14:52.22 | yukonbob | will hopefully get into habbit of hitting bicycle again.... |
| 14:53.39 | *** part/#brlcad prasad_1 (n=psilva@static-70-108-244-218.res.east.verizon.net) | |
| 15:00.21 | brlcad | begins the rtarea rewrite |
| 15:01.51 | yukonbob | brlcad: good luck! |
| 15:02.15 | brlcad | this will make the third or fourth rewrite |
| 15:02.30 | brlcad | it's so frequently used, though, deserves some attention/improvements |
| 15:02.36 | *** join/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@h-67-103-183-185.mclnva23.covad.net) | |
| 15:29.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32730 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/mirror.c: remove dead mirror code |
| 15:33.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32731 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/mirror.c: remove authorship |
| 22:54.41 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 22:54.41 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 23:16.11 | brlcad | hugs ibot |
| 23:40.21 | ``Erik | take it to a private channel, perv O.o |
| 23:46.11 | PrezKennedy | heh 15 years ago i was 9 |
| 23:46.31 | PrezKennedy | darn old folks and their funny words |
| 23:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32743 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS src/tclscripts/mged/text.tcl): |
| 23:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: with bob's help, we fixed several issues with mged's hacked gets wrapper. this |
| 23:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: is in response to lee's sf bug 2123488 ( Tcl I/O broken on Windows and Leopard ) |
| 23:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: where running mged in tcl gui mode resulted in gets always returning the string |
| 23:53.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: length instead of the input string read (with stdin input). there were then |
| 23:53.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: also a couple related bugs for when the channel == stdin that required similar |
| 23:53.57 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fixage. |
| 23:54.36 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: heh, careful there .. you're getting 'old' pretty quick :) |
| 23:56.02 | brlcad | that makes you about 16 when we first met and that wasn't very long ago :P |
| 00:01.35 | PrezKennedy | hm... long time ago |
| 00:02.17 | louipc | wowzas |
| 00:15.46 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.195.14) | |
| 00:18.07 | docelic_ | hey folks I'm following mged tutorial.. When I run "in spkr.s tor 16 16 16 1 0 0 12 1", mged crashes with "Illegal instruction".. It's a 7.12.4 release compiled on Debian.. have any ideas? Btw, mged crashes but object is in the db, I see it with ls.. If I try to draw it, it also crashes... (But other objects like rpp, rec, etc. work correctly). |
| 00:21.32 | brlcad | docelic_: yeah |
| 00:21.58 | brlcad | there was a thread on the mailing list where an ingenious fellow traced down that problem |
| 00:22.37 | brlcad | quite obscure and insideous, amounts to a compilation/configuration problem with SSE instructions |
| 00:23.36 | brlcad | you apparently have hardware that doesn't support sse instructions, yet a compiler happy to generate binaries with sse instructiongs |
| 00:24.12 | brlcad | the fix it to either obtain the latest from svn or edit configure.ac and disable our SSE tests |
| 00:24.21 | docelic_ | well, the system is Amd Athlon, and cat /proc/cpuinfo lists sse under flags |
| 00:24.31 | brlcad | could be sse2 |
| 00:24.50 | docelic_ | that could be, yes. |
| 00:25.16 | brlcad | edit configure.ac, look for a section that says BC_COMPILER_AND_LINKER_RECOGNIZES([-msse2], [msse2], [nokeep]) |
| 00:25.41 | brlcad | comment out that entire block and then run "sh autogen.sh" to regenerate a new configure script |
| 00:25.56 | brlcad | from there you should be able to rebuild as before |
| 00:26.59 | docelic_ | sure... ok thanks, it'll be recompiling while I continue without speaker element.. |
| 00:27.08 | brlcad | sorry you had to run into that, we're trying to get another release out so it doesn't bite others |
| 00:27.53 | brlcad | but we're also in the middle a big restructuring so it'll still be a week or two |
| 00:28.59 | docelic_ | no probs,.. I'll get onto the ML later too |
| 00:30.19 | docelic_ | btw, is TAB supposed to autocomplete or not in mged's tk window? I get bgerror failed to handle background error. |
| 00:30.19 | docelic_ | , Original error: bad text index "--" |
| 00:30.19 | docelic_ | , Error in bgerror: invalid command name "::swidgets::togglearrow" |
| 00:31.04 | brlcad | it should autocomplete, works like a charm here |
| 00:31.20 | brlcad | blinks in confusion at that error |
| 00:31.47 | docelic_ | another error from TAB is: |
| 00:31.52 | docelic_ | Error in bgerror: window name "_secErrorDialog" already exists in parent |
| 00:31.55 | brlcad | mged doesn't even use swidgets |
| 00:32.46 | brlcad | you're using mged and not archer, yes? |
| 00:33.14 | docelic_ | yes, I run mged from cmdline and in the window title it says MGED 7.4.12 command window id_0 |
| 00:33.38 | brlcad | hrm, never heard of that happening before |
| 00:33.51 | brlcad | so you just hit tab and it pops up a dialog with that error? |
| 00:33.57 | brlcad | or it displays in the command window? |
| 00:33.57 | docelic_ | yes |
| 00:34.31 | docelic_ | (hit tab and it inserts that in cmdwindow) |
| 00:34.39 | brlcad | do you have tab bound to something/anything in your window manager? |
| 00:34.52 | docelic_ | nope, works normally in i.e. xterm |
| 00:35.12 | brlcad | can you upload that .g somewhere? |
| 00:35.42 | brlcad | actually first, does it happen with any/all .g files? |
| 00:35.49 | brlcad | or just the one you're working on |
| 00:35.58 | docelic_ | yes, I was about to say -- it happens on empty .g too |
| 00:36.46 | docelic_ | first time it pops up it says about ::swidgets::togglearrow like I pasted above, then on all futher TABs it prints about _secErrorDialog ... |
| 00:36.58 | docelic_ | s/pops up/displays/ |
| 00:37.29 | brlcad | try running: mged -c |
| 00:37.38 | brlcad | press enter (for nu) |
| 00:37.51 | docelic_ | works there |
| 00:37.54 | brlcad | then etab] |
| 00:38.12 | brlcad | sry, e[tab] |
| 00:38.28 | brlcad | should display something like: e e_muves eac echo edcodes edcolor edcomb edgedir edmater em eqn erase erase_all ev exit expand extrude eye_pt |
| 00:38.39 | docelic_ | yes, it works there |
| 00:38.51 | brlcad | so try again without the -c |
| 00:38.56 | brlcad | and no database open |
| 00:39.36 | docelic_ | doesn't work (same 2 errors -- swidgets and _secErrorDialog) |
| 00:40.31 | docelic_ | does it depend on what libs mged links to during compile? |
| 00:40.54 | docelic_ | btw, is there a 'draw all' command? |
| 00:41.00 | brlcad | it "shouldn't", at least nothing that I can think of that would cause that problem |
| 00:41.12 | brlcad | only if there is an 'all' object in the database |
| 00:41.22 | brlcad | the 'tops' command will list the top-level objects |
| 00:41.31 | brlcad | you usually want to draw one of those |
| 00:41.31 | docelic_ | no I mean something that would draw all objects at once |
| 00:41.39 | docelic_ | ah, :) |
| 00:41.42 | docelic_ | got it draw * |
| 00:41.50 | brlcad | draw * is very evil... :) |
| 00:42.09 | starseeker | check in from c++ land |
| 00:42.10 | docelic_ | sure but not for a radio that's missing a tor element :) |
| 00:42.12 | brlcad | that's drawing every primitive, every combination that uses those primitives, every assembly of every combination, etc |
| 00:42.29 | brlcad | i.e. drawing everything many many times over |
| 00:42.43 | brlcad | hardly ever what you really want |
| 00:43.19 | brlcad | there's a geometry browser on the tools menu for pointy-clickedness |
| 00:44.30 | brlcad | otherwise the usual command-line way is like on the unix cmd line with 'tops' and 'l' letting you traverse a hierarchy listing |
| 00:44.45 | brlcad | the tree command often helps too |
| 00:44.55 | brlcad | there's an mged quick reference sheet that spells a lot of this out |
| 00:45.05 | brlcad | howdy starseeker |
| 00:45.10 | brlcad | how's it been so far? |
| 00:46.19 | starseeker | nice |
| 00:46.26 | starseeker | fairly basic, but already some good stuff |
| 00:46.48 | starseeker | commute is murder |
| 00:49.43 | starseeker | brlcad: From an html documentation standpoint - what's your take on the table column width? Is it ok to leave it free floating? |
| 00:49.43 | yukonbob | thought "meat is murder" |
| 00:49.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32744 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 00:49.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: docelic reported that mged (on debian) displays an swidgets error when tab is |
| 00:49.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: pressed. The problem was noticed on 7.12.4 and happens regardless of there |
| 00:49.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: being a db opened or not. The problem does not occur in classic mode. |
| 00:50.46 | brlcad | starseeker: in general, I abhore fixed width layouts that don't utilize available space |
| 00:50.58 | brlcad | so free floating sounds fine with me |
| 00:51.05 | brlcad | unless I misunderstand you of course |
| 00:51.22 | starseeker | Possibly. Did you take a look at the html version of search.html on bz? |
| 00:51.35 | brlcad | yep |
| 00:51.50 | starseeker | If you look at the tables, you'll notice the column widths aren't uniform |
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| 00:51.59 | starseeker | they match the widest text in each row |
| 00:52.02 | starseeker | er column |
| 00:52.06 | brlcad | ah, that kind of alignment |
| 00:52.29 | starseeker | Oddly enough, I think the fo->pdf conversion does handle it |
| 00:52.31 | brlcad | ambivalent for that kind of plain conversion |
| 00:52.51 | brlcad | that could be set up with a single css file |
| 00:52.56 | starseeker | it apparently needs an xslt processor with support for some kind of extension |
| 00:53.01 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 00:53.05 | starseeker | hadn't considered that |
| 00:53.08 | brlcad | nah, I bet they just leave it to css |
| 00:53.33 | brlcad | you're just seeing a default html4 table style |
| 00:53.41 | starseeker | nods |
| 00:54.10 | starseeker | docbook supports a colspec attribute for tables which is somewhat annoying but can be used to set the relative (or absolute) width of the columns |
| 00:54.24 | brlcad | yeah, looking at the sources, it's fully span/divified, just no css to format anything |
| 00:54.31 | starseeker | apparently saxon and xalan can translate that into html table output, although I've yet to test it |
| 00:55.03 | starseeker | nods. I hadn't considered the css route - that might make more sense if it can be slipped into the template |
| 00:55.41 | starseeker | is afraid he's picking up brlcad's taste for perfectionism in quality ;-) |
| 00:56.12 | brlcad | tis a painful disease |
| 00:57.42 | docelic_ | you can specify html.stylesheet parameter for auto-including a reference to css.. |
| 00:57.54 | docelic_ | (works with xml only, sgml requires manual hack to put that in) |
| 00:58.10 | brlcad | ah right, docelic_ you're a regular on #docbook aren't you |
| 00:58.46 | starseeker | docelic_: That's a good idea. I know I'm eventually going to have to start making custom xsl overlays (the nirt docs ALREADY require it) but I've yet to sort out the mechanisms of doing that with basic xsltproc |
| 00:58.48 | docelic_ | ay ay |
| 00:58.54 | brlcad | thought your name was familiar, more than just being a lurker in here :) |
| 01:00.22 | starseeker | sighs in relief - that leaves fop/pdf support as the only other thing needing configure support, and that should be quite simple now that I understand the basics |
| 01:00.51 | starseeker | <evil grin> maybe I can even start building pdf vol II and vol III tonight yet :-) |
| 01:01.54 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh - is it ok to build html and man by default without providing a user option to turn off one or the other? I wouldn't worry except the time factor is significant and then some |
| 01:02.16 | starseeker | build time |
| 01:02.34 | brlcad | starseeker: that would be awesomeness |
| 01:03.57 | brlcad | (that is, being able to build them tonight) :) |
| 01:04.05 | starseeker | :-) |
| 01:04.42 | brlcad | as for building them by default, it has to be all smooth and auto-detecting to be on by default, regardless of having a switch |
| 01:05.45 | starseeker | Oh, that part's OK (I think) already - the trick is there isn't really a way to detect that the user only wants html or man format ;-) |
| 01:06.03 | brlcad | i'd like to do a release with default off first, unless it really is cross-platform tested everywhere |
| 01:06.08 | brlcad | oh you mean together |
| 01:06.11 | starseeker | right |
| 01:06.14 | brlcad | hell, sure -- |
| 01:06.36 | brlcad | I don't think there needs to be anything more than --enable-docs and --disable-docs |
| 01:06.44 | starseeker | OK :-) |
| 01:06.53 | brlcad | if they want more granular than than, they can rm the files they don't want |
| 01:07.04 | brlcad | s/than than/than that/ |
| 01:07.27 | starseeker | nods. I just figured saving ~20 mintes of build time (for the full set) of an unwanted format might be appreciated |
| 01:07.43 | brlcad | nah, they asked for docs |
| 01:07.45 | brlcad | they get docs |
| 01:08.52 | starseeker | lol |
| 01:09.08 | brlcad | I'd like txt, man, html-single, html-multi, and pdf by default myself |
| 01:10.18 | starseeker | <grin> I'll see what I can do |
| 01:11.23 | docelic_ | 30 |
| 01:11.35 | starseeker | 30? |
| 01:11.56 | docelic_ | that should've been an input for mged |
| 01:12.09 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 01:21.09 | brlcad | 31! |
| 01:28.54 | brlcad | starseeker: heh, you can see an example of what happens if I just drop in that crazy orange css template I use on the ideas page |
| 01:28.58 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/search/ |
| 01:29.19 | starseeker | eeeeeep |
| 01:29.33 | starseeker | It's the Halloween man page |
| 01:29.58 | brlcad | neat, the links actually work |
| 01:30.23 | brlcad | though the a.hover is a bit annoying :) |
| 01:30.36 | starseeker | heh |
| 01:31.18 | brlcad | heads out |
| 01:31.27 | starseeker | can automake handle nested ifs? |
| 01:31.35 | starseeker | oh, sorry - nevermind |
| 01:31.38 | brlcad | it's not pretty |
| 01:32.01 | brlcad | see src/Makefile.am for an example |
| 01:32.26 | brlcad | it's very duplicative and can be confusing given we support 1.6 |
| 01:33.02 | starseeker | what about something like if BUILD_DOCBOOK && !BUILD_DOCBOOK_PDF ? |
| 01:34.41 | CIA-4 | libirc: 03JeffM2501 * r372 10/trunk/libirc/ (6 files in 2 dirs): add invite event |
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| 02:27.02 | starseeker | ``Erik: What was the trick again about using something like .fop.pdf: .xml.fo to get an automatic calling of dependency in a Makefile.am? |
| 02:27.10 | starseeker | I can't even get fop to RUN |
| 03:24.05 | starseeker | grrrrrr |
| 03:51.07 | starseeker | ``Erik: Help. Apparently the previous success at building html was a fluke, since I can't duplicate it for html + pdf. The current Makefile.am I'm trying is here: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/Makefile.am and the ONLY thing it builds right now are the man pages. What am I doing wrong? |
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| 04:18.30 | brlcad | starseeker: nope, only supports simple single-symbol syntax |
| 04:25.27 | brlcad | starseeker: looks like there's several things wrong with that Makefile.am |
| 04:26.22 | brlcad | including some basic typos (e.g., mac1DOCBOOK) |
| 04:34.48 | brlcad | you should test each of your build rules one at a time, individually |
| 04:59.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32745 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: improved DSP tessellation now also honors cut type and handles zero values |
| 05:01.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32746 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: Mouse cursor turns into a huge yellow-translucent arrow when running MGED through remote X11 |
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| 09:10.40 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 10:45.26 | starseeker | turns bright red |
| 10:45.46 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks - that mac1DOCBOOK was most of the problem, evidently |
| 11:08.18 | starseeker | brlcad: That yellow-translucent arrow happens on Netscape too, IIRC. I looked that up - it has something to do with X11 on MacOSX, if I remember right - I don't think it's MGED's fault specifically |
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| 11:13.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32747 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac doc/docbook/system/man1/Makefile.am): Add support for building pdf versions of Docbook files via Apache FOP |
| 11:15.13 | starseeker | note to self - do not attempt makefile logic when too tired to keep eyes open |
| 11:18.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32748 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/Makefile.am: Use proper variables instead of hardcoding the extensions. |
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| 11:55.34 | brlcad | starseeker: it's not, but there's a simple fix for mged that works around the problem |
| 11:55.57 | brlcad | it ends up sending the cursor over with the wrong byte encoding, making it look fugly |
| 11:56.21 | brlcad | so if you set it to something, the local X server you're connecting through gets to display it (correctly) |
| 11:56.32 | brlcad | jim hunt somehow figured that out for mged |
| 12:03.03 | clock_ | what's going on with these 700 billion dollars in the US? |
| 12:05.45 | brlcad | clock_: the gov't is buying everyone new ipods |
| 12:06.36 | clock_ | I was like surfing for 3 weeks so it went past me |
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| 12:35.01 | docelic | hey folks is brlterm still an active thing or it's been removed in recent versions? |
| 12:36.29 | brlcad | brlterm? |
| 12:37.59 | docelic | ah I see.. that thing exists but it's not related to brlcad... |
| 12:38.57 | docelic | in any case, someone made debian package for brlcad, and it installs those hundreds of executables into /usr/bin.. I was thinking if a shell wrapper could be made which adds a non-system bin path to your PATH when you enter it |
| 12:39.15 | docelic | similar to how grass does it.. when you run it, you have tools from /usr/lib/grass/.../scripts/ in your path |
| 12:39.59 | brlcad | ah, the debian wrapper thing.. |
| 12:40.29 | brlcad | yeah, that would be great actually |
| 12:40.40 | brlcad | having a brl-cad terminal is actually on our todo list |
| 12:41.41 | brlcad | the idea being an actual double-clickable terminal app that would provide the same posix environment cross-platform (so I can get a goddamn decent console on Windows g'dammit) |
| 12:42.34 | brlcad | and it'd set up the PATH, MANPATH, LD_LIBRARY_PATH and whatever else is needed to allow for relocation (if it's a system like Mac OS X where that becomes trivial) |
| 12:43.18 | docelic | right.. are there some notes written about it? (besides just todo item) |
| 12:46.22 | brlcad | mm, somewhere |
| 12:46.33 | brlcad | you interested in working on it? |
| 12:47.18 | brlcad | it's not terribly complicated, the hardest part is how to get a tty on systems that don't have one :) |
| 12:47.18 | docelic | sure |
| 12:48.42 | brlcad | i'll see if I can get some notes up into the wiki later today (in about 4-6 hours) |
| 12:49.02 | docelic | cool |
| 12:49.17 | brlcad | it is pretty simple, though (intentionally), and could easily be done without any notes ;) |
| 12:49.54 | brlcad | it'd sort of be a way to provide a command-line and a graphical launcher all in one "app" |
| 12:50.40 | brlcad | could even call the thing "BRL-CAD" and it'd be the one double-clickable application that gets installed (maybe one of two) |
| 12:51.16 | brlcad | with a means to launch mged or start issuing command-line commands right there in the console |
| 12:53.30 | docelic | yes.. well as I see it, what could be done is just find a shell that compiles on all platforms supported by brlcad.. compile it together with brlcad and provide a default shell config file which sets all the things needed.. |
| 12:54.11 | docelic | and ideally the shell would be just a tar.gz from upstream which can be replaced by user with newer/older version before compile, and the build system wouldn't care |
| 12:54.52 | docelic | or even better, |
| 12:55.51 | docelic | for platforms that do have good shells on their own, just create config files, and user or install procedure can make a shortcut brlcad -> this_shell -config brlcad.cfg |
| 12:55.58 | brlcad | docelic: have you tried looking for such a shell? :) |
| 12:56.44 | brlcad | harder than you'd think, at least without pulling in a massive dependency chain like kde or cygwin |
| 12:57.17 | docelic | you wouldn't like cygwin for windows? what if a person could download binary build of the cygwin-based shell? |
| 12:57.31 | docelic | (unrelated to brlcad) |
| 12:57.50 | brlcad | it's alright if you're going to do everything through them |
| 12:58.22 | brlcad | i wouldn't mix msvc compilation in along with a cygwin-built terminal though |
| 12:58.51 | brlcad | and most windows devs I know aren't too fond of having anything to do with cygwin |
| 12:59.05 | brlcad | unless they're unix devs just using windows because they have to :) |
| 12:59.08 | docelic | I believe that :) |
| 12:59.15 | docelic | k bb later |
| 12:59.20 | brlcad | cya |
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| 15:33.35 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
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| 15:36.51 | docelic | oi yb |
| 15:57.25 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 15:57.35 | brlcad | gut en tag |
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| 16:02.41 | i | What if i want to revolve a line, which represents a shaft's half-symmetry? I think i have two choices: 1 sketch mode and 2 solid modeling. Am I right? |
| 16:03.46 | i | !brlcad |
| 16:04.18 | brlcad | hi i |
| 16:04.29 | i | hi |
| 16:04.57 | i | Am i right that solid modelling shall be used in this case, in BRLCAD? |
| 16:05.12 | brlcad | i: solid modeling approach is used throughout brl-cad |
| 16:05.46 | brlcad | i: hold on a sec (on phone) |
| 16:06.22 | i | and i can not e.g. revolve relatively precise lines around an axis as in e.g. AutoCAD? Well, i do't really need it... |
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| 16:27.35 | iandaletter | brlcad do not support export into different file formats as e.g. iges... I need to build it with Open Cascade support. Is it much to download? Is it a separate source tarball? |
| 16:35.29 | docelic | how are binary builds for sourceforge.net downloads done? is there a makefile command that comes up with the ready-made tarball or? |
| 16:36.44 | prasad_1 | http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2008/09/request-for-urg.html |
| 16:38.38 | iandaletter | is it hard to build brlcad with open.cascade support? Is there much to download? or only few megabytes? |
| 16:39.32 | docelic | http://www.j-walk.com/other/conf/ |
| 16:41.48 | iandaletter | docelic: tarball, ./configure, make, make install, ubuntu needs m4, bison, flex and xorg-dev with its dependencies. |
| 16:42.13 | iandaletter | and more or less... e.g. open cascade to support iges... |
| 16:42.45 | docelic | iandaletter, no, I'm asking how are the tarballs are made, not how to compile source from them |
| 16:45.01 | iandaletter | .tar, which is bzipped, extract it in home directory, cd into it, in terminal, write './configure', then 'make', then 'sudo make install' |
| 16:45.22 | iandaletter | www.ansysed.narod.ru/linux.htm |
| 16:46.06 | docelic | iandaletter, and then what? bzip the resulting installation from /usr/local? |
| 16:49.51 | iandaletter | no, it installs by default into /usr/brlcad after 'sudo make install' - and all u need is to edit .bashrc into your home folder, as 'cd', then 'gedit .bashrc', addinto the end of the file: 'export PATH=$PATH:/usr/brlcad/bin', and then e.g. reboot to let system to read that changed .bashrc and tipe in terminal 'mged' |
| 16:50.15 | docelic | dude, iandaletter , you completely do not understand what I am asking |
| 16:51.48 | iandaletter | oh! yeah! wait... |
| 16:52.43 | iandaletter | well... i'd just downloaded some old 32-bits source tarball... |
| 16:56.49 | iandaletter | though, i'm able to add the path /usr/brlcad/bin contains over 400 programs, where oone is mged - it is a multidesktop graphical editing |
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| 17:15.25 | docelic | in brlcad 7.10 for irix , how do I get the geometry window to show up? I can add solids and call draw, but there's no window in which it draws |
| 17:20.27 | iandaletter | when you start mged, you can "put a database to disk" thru 'mged -n new01.g' - why do you need it? it would ask you to chose between nu | X | gl, where e.g. X is an x window system's "private Rayan" Well, this operation shows you wheter you're able to chose between "nu" option (which means no graphics at all) and at least anything else... |
| 17:22.39 | docelic | aha, ok.. well then must be that this thing is compiled with 'nu' option only, cause that's the only option I get. |
| 17:24.29 | iandaletter | i bet, e.g. Ubuntu needs xorg-dev with its dependencies, totally about 5 mb to download... Probably, GL in ubuntu needs flgrx |
| 17:24.33 | iandaletter | !flgrx |
| 17:24.59 | docelic | i'm about sure you spelled it wrong |
| 17:25.00 | iandaletter | uh... don't know anything about both irix and GL |
| 17:25.54 | iandaletter | yes, ask 'ubuntu' at irc.freenode.net - he's a bot, he answers qestions |
| 17:41.40 | iandaletter | i meant ubottu |
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| 18:22.45 | brlcad | wows at the previous chatter |
| 18:49.52 | louipc | fglrx |
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| 21:47.54 | jjsimon | Hello, I was wondering if anyone could point me to documentation on writing a plugin for BRL-CAD? I'm working with a group of students on a sound modelling addon/program to/using BRL-CAD. Any advice is appreciated. |
| 21:49.45 | jjsimon | I guess I should ask if writing a plugin is even viable...I see a plugins option in Archer, but not in MGED |
| 22:06.59 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:29.19 | brlcad | jjsimon: howdy |
| 22:30.24 | brlcad | jjsimon: mged plugins are more straightforward for mged, though it depends on what sort of extension you want to write (compiled vs scripted vs hybrid) |
| 22:33.59 | brlcad | jjsimon: the basic first-level "plugin"/extension for mged is just a tcl script -- you can see an example of one such extension in mged under the Tools -> Geometry Browser menu item |
| 22:35.24 | brlcad | compiled extensions are a little more involved but either amount to making new commands or run-time loadable extensions via a pkg binding interface (which are also tcl-loadable modules) |
| 22:36.25 | brlcad | for your sound modeling project, I would expect that to involve a bit of a hybrid approach where you'd have an external program that does some work and a tcl interface in mged to present the results |
| 22:42.13 | *** join/#brlcad jjsimon-mtu (n=18ecbe80@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 22:42.21 | jjsimon-mtu | sorry, got DC'd |
| 22:42.36 | jjsimon-mtu | also lost the reply :-/ |
| 22:42.47 | jjsimon-mtu | if you could copy/paste it, I'd appreciate it |
| 22:43.06 | brlcad | 18:34 <@brlcad> jjsimon: mged plugins are more straightforward for mged, though it depends on what sort of extension you want to write (compiled vs scripted vs hybrid) |
| 22:43.09 | brlcad | 18:37 <@brlcad> jjsimon: the basic first-level "plugin"/extension for mged is just a tcl script -- you can see an example of one such extension in mged under the Tools -> Geometry Browser menu item |
| 22:43.13 | brlcad | 18:39 <@brlcad> compiled extensions are a little more involved but either amount to making new commands or run-time loadable extensions via a pkg binding interface (which are also tcl-loadable modules) |
| 22:43.17 | brlcad | 18:40 <@brlcad> for your sound modeling project, I would expect that to involve a bit of a hybrid approach where you'd have an external program that does some work and a tcl interface in mged to present the results |
| 22:44.10 | jjsimon-mtu | hm...well, we're starting out simple. The idea is to model a simple room with multiple sound sources...use ray tracing to model the reflections and analyze the interference |
| 22:44.30 | brlcad | nods |
| 22:45.23 | brlcad | examples of codes that do similar tasks are in src/rt (the various view*.c files are all separate programs) as well as src/rttherm |
| 22:45.38 | jjsimon-mtu | excellent |
| 22:45.45 | jjsimon-mtu | thanks a lot |
| 22:45.47 | jjsimon-mtu | one more question |
| 22:45.49 | brlcad | src/rt/rtexample.c is a simple starting point for writing a ray-trace application |
| 22:46.07 | jjsimon-mtu | I saw jbrlcad in the SVN, how stable/usable is that? |
| 22:46.17 | jjsimon-mtu | assuming it's a Java port) |
| 22:46.18 | brlcad | the src/rt/view*.c programs utilize the "RT" application interface |
| 22:46.40 | brlcad | yeah, it's the start of a java port of the core ray-trace library |
| 22:46.49 | brlcad | it was more a proof of concept |
| 22:47.49 | brlcad | it just implements a couple primitives, nothing complex, and uses a much simpler boolean evaluation method that is a couple orders of magnitude slower than what librt does |
| 22:48.01 | jjsimon-mtu | ah ok, so stick to the C version...I noticed, on the wiki, mention C++ wrapper for the core libs, is that under development or actually usable? If usable, where can I find more info about it? |
| 22:48.14 | jjsimon-mtu | *mention of a |
| 22:48.14 | brlcad | there is a JNI interface to some of librt |
| 22:48.43 | brlcad | see src/java |
| 22:49.18 | brlcad | but yeah, I would recommend sticking to c/c++ |
| 22:49.36 | louipc | oh wow I thought jbrlcad was just java bindings |
| 22:49.37 | brlcad | the c++ wrapper is bleeding-edge active development so I wouldn't recommend trying it |
| 22:50.12 | jjsimon-mtu | Alright, thanks a ton, I'll poke around the wiki for more info |
| 22:50.30 | brlcad | otherwise, the C++ interface does already exist and is being used by a couple 3rd party projects |
| 22:50.44 | brlcad | if you do want to give it a go, it's in the rt^3 module |
| 22:51.16 | brlcad | which also has two other development activities (new modeler interface and geometry service interface), so consider yourself forewarned :) |
| 22:51.47 | jjsimon-mtu | :) thanks, I'm sure I'll be around here quite a bit over the next few months |
| 22:51.50 | brlcad | jjsimon-mtu: sure, I'm usually here as are several others than can answer the coding questions |
| 22:51.55 | brlcad | cool |
| 22:52.26 | brlcad | louipc: yeah, it's a complete transposition by one of the core devs from C into Java |
| 22:53.04 | ``Erik | no, jbrlcad doesn't touch brlcad at all, the only link is the toplevel repo and some overlap in file format and role O.o |
| 22:53.15 | brlcad | our C api is already very naturally designed into categories of data processing routines which translates very well into an object-oriented layout with encapsulation |
| 22:54.27 | brlcad | he implemented most of our low-level database I/O and proceeded on to ray-tracing and started implementing primitives, translating the code into Java along the way |
| 22:54.38 | brlcad | iirc, he stopped when he got to the torus.. |
| 22:54.56 | ``Erik | jim's dorked with it some since, but nothing of serious consequence |
| 22:55.39 | brlcad | the torus is one of the first primitives that requires a polynomial root solver for evaluating the ray intersection, that was another 10k chunk of code in its own right so he stopped :) |
| 22:55.50 | ``Erik | as far as plugins, that's not a special category since our core isn't closed source, code is code :) where it comes from isn't particularly relevant |
| 22:56.59 | ``Erik | (though I do plan on making plugins in the adrt shtuff so C stuff can be added and removed from a running instance) |
| 23:00.21 | brlcad | how's the rippage going? |
| 23:08.50 | ``Erik | ripwhathuh? |
| 23:11.43 | brlcad | on adrt |
| 23:11.49 | brlcad | derippage? |
| 23:11.55 | brlcad | reparage? |
| 23:16.52 | ``Erik | ah, I had a brain off day today, the current state is what's in the repo |
| 23:17.29 | ``Erik | all forks are re-merged, split and shot don't work yet |
| 23:17.44 | ``Erik | (I think it's protocol mismatch) |
| 00:40.21 | starseeker | checks in |
| 00:42.33 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 00:42.40 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 00:43.32 | yukonbob | prepares to have to log off in couple minutes... |
| 00:43.39 | yukonbob | (damn battery...) |
| 01:12.33 | brlcad | ponders a deeply obscure db_dump bug |
| 01:20.28 | ``Erik | that sounds like an awesome thing to add, brlcad |
| 01:21.12 | brlcad | hm? |
| 01:21.23 | brlcad | it already exists |
| 01:21.34 | ``Erik | then why're you pondering one? :D *duck* |
| 01:21.44 | brlcad | ah, heh |
| 01:21.59 | ``Erik | ponders genericising tree walkers and making the existing ones wrappers |
| 01:22.00 | brlcad | it's screwy as hell, it's daniel's bug that he posted to the mailing list |
| 01:22.12 | brlcad | do it! |
| 01:22.19 | brlcad | that is so sorely needed |
| 01:22.32 | brlcad | db_recurse was sort of the start of that |
| 01:22.38 | brlcad | but never finished |
| 01:22.46 | ``Erik | I was talking to dave and mike about it, threw out a basic plan |
| 01:22.54 | ``Erik | mike said it sounded good, so I told him to go do it... he refused |
| 01:23.15 | brlcad | yeah, no way he's getting out of his armchair to actually do something |
| 01:23.34 | ``Erik | not true! |
| 01:23.40 | ``Erik | he'll move like you wouldn't believe to talk to people |
| 01:27.47 | ``Erik | beer, popcorn and stargate continuum, awww yeah |
| 01:29.02 | brlcad | did almost exactly that when it came out |
| 01:29.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32749 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: make sure we don't try to dump a v4 database into a v5 database since it's not implemented. |
| 01:29.07 | brlcad | cept s/beer/scotch/ |
| 01:29.14 | brlcad | yum |
| 01:32.01 | ``Erik | aight, then, bring my some scotch! :D beeyotch |
| 01:33.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32750 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: ws |
| 01:54.36 | brlcad | woo hoo! .. think i found it |
| 01:54.42 | brlcad | damn damn obscure |
| 01:54.43 | *** join/#brlcad The_Schmidt (n=chatzill@74.196.207.174) | |
| 01:55.00 | brlcad | who woulda thunk that there is something wrong with this: |
| 01:55.00 | brlcad | dp->d_flags = (dp->d_flags & ~7) | flags; |
| 01:56.00 | The_Schmidt | whatsit? |
| 01:56.18 | brlcad | | flags is wrong |
| 01:56.28 | brlcad | it overrides the set d_flags |
| 01:57.08 | brlcad | the whole line is pretty much wrong it seems, have to figure out where it came from |
| 01:57.32 | The_Schmidt | u inthe code for this project? |
| 01:57.51 | brlcad | yep |
| 01:58.02 | The_Schmidt | crazy go nuts |
| 01:58.16 | The_Schmidt | need a distraction? |
| 01:58.25 | The_Schmidt | get your mind outta that code for a bit |
| 01:59.09 | The_Schmidt | i need advice on where to start |
| 01:59.20 | louipc | mged |
| 02:00.13 | The_Schmidt | i was wondering if this app would be a suitable for the designing of cardboard boxes |
| 02:01.43 | brlcad | i'm not exactly an expert on what all is required to design cardboard boxes |
| 02:01.47 | The_Schmidt | i design boxes that use a spec diagram to fold and take certain dimensions to fold based on their thickness |
| 02:02.32 | The_Schmidt | does this have folding features that could accomodate? |
| 02:03.05 | brlcad | hmm |
| 02:03.13 | louipc | hah that constraints stuff could be handy |
| 02:03.20 | brlcad | folding as a feature edit operation? |
| 02:03.52 | brlcad | you can certainly rotate something that would represent an edge, or write a script that would apply a boolean with a rotation |
| 02:04.03 | brlcad | but not as a direct edit operation |
| 02:04.11 | brlcad | louipc: yeah, no kidding |
| 02:04.41 | The_Schmidt | can u use it to do a simple 2d drawing? |
| 02:05.02 | The_Schmidt | or are you confined to 3d space? |
| 02:05.17 | brlcad | heh, sort of a contradiction there :) |
| 02:05.39 | The_Schmidt | would that be like trying to use blender to draw 2d vectors? |
| 02:06.01 | brlcad | you can do simple 2d drawing via our sketch editor, but it frankly sucks imnsho |
| 02:06.15 | brlcad | if you want to model with a 2D approach, there are better tools |
| 02:06.24 | brlcad | like qcad |
| 02:06.27 | brlcad | it's 2d-only |
| 02:07.28 | The_Schmidt | any free/open source recommends? |
| 02:07.37 | brlcad | i just did |
| 02:07.43 | yukonbob | http://www.langorigami.com/science/treemaker/treemaker5.php4 |
| 02:08.49 | The_Schmidt | hmm |
| 02:09.04 | louipc | holy moly! |
| 02:09.20 | brlcad | that would make for an interesting mged extension :) |
| 02:09.29 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:09.29 | louipc | hahaha |
| 02:09.37 | brlcad | take an nmg/bot and unfold it |
| 02:10.35 | yukonbob | hits road; will hit libtool this evening (pick whatever definition of 'hit' you please ;) |
| 02:14.40 | brlcad | ouch, this is apparently an 8 year old bug |
| 02:16.55 | Twingy | not mine |
| 02:19.29 | *** part/#brlcad The_Schmidt (n=chatzill@74.196.207.174) | |
| 02:26.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32751 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: need to prefix all the DIR defines with RT |
| 02:35.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32752 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (db5_alloc.c db5_io.c db_alloc.c db_io.c): use RT_DIR_PHONY_ADDR instead of -1L on d_addr |
| 02:56.46 | brlcad | *whew* |
| 02:57.10 | starseeker | whew? |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32753 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/ (db_open.c wdb.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fix the problem that daniel ran into with the db_dump snippet he sent to the |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: brlcad-users list. his program opened an inmem and dumped it to disk, but was |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: crashing during the dump. there were several problems I found (after 10 |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: freaking hours of debugging and testing...), one being a bug in |
| 02:57.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: wdb_export_external() that was 8 years old. the routine erroneously allowed a |
| 02:57.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: disk dp to be marked as an inmem dp. that caused a crash since the (union |
| 02:57.14 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 02:57.31 | starseeker | ~brlcad++ |
| 02:58.36 | louipc | ibot: karma brlcad |
| 02:58.36 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 02:58.43 | starseeker | blinks |
| 02:58.43 | louipc | ibot: karma ~brlcad |
| 02:58.44 | ibot | ~brlcad has neutral karma |
| 02:58.56 | louipc | brlcad++ |
| 02:59.01 | starseeker | whoops |
| 02:59.03 | louipc | ~brlcad++ |
| 02:59.06 | louipc | ibot: karma ~brlcad |
| 02:59.06 | ibot | ~brlcad has neutral karma |
| 02:59.13 | louipc | ibot: karma brlcad |
| 02:59.13 | ibot | brlcad has karma of 1 |
| 02:59.18 | louipc | shrugs |
| 02:59.25 | starseeker | we tried :-) |
| 02:59.31 | louipc | buggy bot. sorry for the spam |
| 02:59.33 | starseeker | forgot about that cute little quirk |
| 02:59.57 | starseeker | I think that's actually a deliberate joke on the part of the bot author |
| 02:59.58 | brlcad | louipc: isn't not a bug, ibot's maintainer made the response to my karma be fixed at 1 :) |
| 03:00.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32754 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: |
| 03:00.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: add some extra protection to the db_dump problem, it shouldn't be trying to a |
| 03:00.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: disk-based wdbp with inmem export flags set. this isn't strictly necessary now |
| 03:00.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: since wdb_export_external catches the error, but it doesn't hurt either. |
| 03:00.17 | louipc | ah haha |
| 03:01.21 | brlcad | thinks those fixes are enough for now, my noodle is baked |
| 03:01.52 | starseeker | is impressed |
| 03:02.00 | brlcad | i'm not |
| 03:02.07 | brlcad | shoulda found that damn bug hours ago |
| 03:02.18 | starseeker | <snort> That's how it always goes |
| 03:02.35 | starseeker | at least you aren't typing macDOCBOOK1 into automake files |
| 03:02.51 | brlcad | went up and down the stack, up and down the stack, poking variables and *seeing* it was wrong and understanding why it crashed, but not how it got to that state |
| 03:03.32 | brlcad | chaulk it up to daniel to provoke an 8-year old bug |
| 03:03.54 | starseeker | Kinda scary some of our features haven't been prodded in that long :-( |
| 03:11.53 | brlcad | there is only one place that routine is used, mged's "dump" command |
| 03:12.06 | brlcad | which is never used to dump an in-memory database |
| 03:12.22 | brlcad | basically it was just a situation that was (apparently) never tested |
| 03:12.29 | starseeker | fun |
| 03:12.35 | brlcad | as in-memory support is something sorta new |
| 03:13.44 | brlcad | inmem's were totally busted for ray-tracing -- i went through similar debugging a couple years ago when I wrote g_transfer to get that working too |
| 03:14.04 | starseeker | ick |
| 03:24.54 | louipc | haha sounds like what I was doing when I got the illegal instruction drawing the torus |
| 03:27.04 | brlcad | that's why I said it was impressive when clubley found that bug so quickly |
| 03:27.11 | brlcad | that was quite obscure too |
| 03:29.05 | starseeker | sigh - why doesn't gentoo have IEE 754 floats I wonder |
| 03:30.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32755 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: provide non-deprecated RT_DIR defines |
| 03:32.21 | brlcad | starseeker: there's not 100% confidence that the tests won't produce false positives, but I've yet to see it fail if you pass -mieee-fp (and be sure -ffast-math is off along with the other ieee-killer compilation flags) |
| 03:33.19 | brlcad | the tests are in m4 |
| 03:34.22 | starseeker | nods. I'll have to check into that - it may be running the unstable gentoo has gotten me something funky enabled without me being aware of it |
| 03:49.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Well, I can build pdf and single page html of the volumes now |
| 03:50.21 | starseeker | chunked output and little things like installing the images correctly for html pages remain to be figured out, but it's progress |
| 03:51.00 | starseeker | 'course, considering how messed up the images are right now anyway... |
| 03:52.20 | starseeker | must sleep for the drive tomorrow... |
| 03:54.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32756 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/ (16 files): Update lessons xml files for pending directory rename. |
| 03:56.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32757 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/mged/: remove old mged commands directory - this is going to be replaced by including full man pages for mged commands in system/man1 |
| 03:57.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32758 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (Makefile.am book/): remove old book directory in preparation for rename. |
| 03:59.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32759 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/tutorials/: delete tutorials - will rename to articles |
| 04:16.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32760 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (131 files in 18 dirs): Add books and articles to docbook |
| 04:18.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32761 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: Oh, yeah - configure.ac probably wants to know where the make files are... |
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| 13:45.50 | ``Erik | waves at claymore O.o |
| 13:46.41 | claymore | hai |
| 13:49.49 | ``Erik | 'sarah palin sez "terminators go away please" 2008' <-- some odd crap in webcomics these days |
| 13:50.38 | pechos_muchos | ``Erik: how big are they? |
| 13:54.57 | ``Erik | huh? how big are what? O.o |
| 13:55.22 | pechos_muchos | the waves at claymore |
| 13:55.31 | claymore | Well thats rather personal :) |
| 13:55.45 | pechos_muchos | and what kind of break is at claymore? |
| 13:55.49 | ``Erik | oh, those, think bowling balls, but bigger |
| 13:55.51 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:56.26 | pechos_muchos | that needs a longboard |
| 13:56.49 | ``Erik | (it's really not that cool, I mean, custom chairs for everything, custom pants, have to waddle like a cowboy...) |
| 13:56.58 | ``Erik | ah, it's karel :D |
| 13:57.43 | ``Erik | crap, m eeting time |
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| 15:00.21 | claymore | 'To sum up why mankind will never achieve its full potential, in one word: Meetings" - Dave Barry |
| 15:11.25 | PrezKennedy | wants to call a meeting of all the world's politicans and lawyers -- on the moon, then blow it up |
| 15:21.56 | claymore | but then, that's no moon... |
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| 15:48.54 | claymore | yawns. |
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| 16:37.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32764 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Fixed vertex indices in face records. Vertex indices start with 1 and are global in file scope (i.e. they aren't local to the group). |
| 16:57.13 | brlcad | woot, claymore joins the insanity |
| 17:10.25 | claymore | brought my white 'love myself' jacket too. |
| 17:35.31 | ``Erik | O.o whoa whoa, tmi there |
| 17:36.24 | claymore | denial ain't just thre river in Egypt :D |
| 17:37.09 | ``Erik | that's gotta be a phrase very ingrained in the queers on military boats, my dad used to say that all the time |
| 17:38.39 | claymore | They teach it in Boot during the Don't ask Don't Tell training. Its right after the 'Good game' asspat practice. ;) |
| 17:39.08 | ``Erik | reminds me of my 'football is gay' joke rant O.o |
| 17:39.41 | ``Erik | a bunch of men in spandex, groping a misshapen ball, laying ontop of eachother and slapping eachothers asses, then taking a big communal shower... ggggaaaayyyyy :D *duck* |
| 17:40.32 | claymore | ...and making WAY more money than we could ever hope to make... all for playing a game. |
| 17:40.43 | ``Erik | yeah... that' sgay. |
| 17:40.46 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:41.47 | ``Erik | damnit, I broke smurfette of using the word gay like that, and there I go doing it *sigh* :D |
| 17:42.24 | claymore | ...so, hypocrite is applicable here then? |
| 17:42.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32765 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: daniel fixed a memory leak in all of the database processing tools that create geometry as there was an avs not getting released. |
| 17:42.42 | ``Erik | the crite-iest |
| 17:42.56 | ``Erik | I, uh, did it for the comedy! |
| 17:43.47 | ``Erik | so, wait, is 33 called off? |
| 17:45.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32766 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_inmem.c: remove dead code |
| 17:48.56 | ``Erik | is boggled that he came back to lunch broke, must've had the queues clicking just right |
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| 18:17.54 | iandaletter | Have someone built it with Open Cascade support? |
| 18:27.01 | iandaletter | ``Erik: I have brl-cad working, but I've not found a way to export geometry as e.g. IGES. Do I need e.g. to build BRL-CAD with Open Cascade support? |
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| 18:36.19 | ``Erik | there are a number of g-* files in the bin/ directory, that is how we 'export' |
| 18:36.35 | ``Erik | not all formats are supported (I think iges is 'import only') |
| 18:36.53 | brlcad | iandaletter: building brl-cad "with open cascade support" makes no sense -- we have absolutely nothing to do with open cascade |
| 18:37.12 | brlcad | we have our own iges importer and exporter |
| 18:44.09 | iandaletter | ok, I just try to export it into gmsh www.geuz.org/gmsh/ |
| 18:44.31 | iandaletter | i will see thru the directories, thanks! |
| 18:46.10 | brlcad | iandaletter: what is it you're trying to do? |
| 18:57.32 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 18:57.32 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 18:58.19 | iandaletter | Well, I used ANSYS, but now I spent some time to www.impact.sourceforge.net - and soon I will download www.code-aster.org I create geometry as e.g. spindle, then well... "to better endure pulse loads" |
| 18:59.31 | ``Erik | really doesn't wanna hear about anyone pulsing their spindle for a load O.o *duck* |
| 19:05.25 | iandaletter | ok |
| 19:35.07 | *** join/#brlcad cad17 (n=45867556@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:42.02 | *** part/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.8.236.141) | |
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| 21:05.44 | *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.8.236.141) | |
| 21:06.11 | iandaletter | ...but i can import 2D-IGES and revolve it? |
| 21:06.38 | brlcad | iandaletter: you'll need the very latest sources |
| 21:06.46 | brlcad | and it depends |
| 21:06.59 | brlcad | revolves only work with sketch objects |
| 21:07.12 | brlcad | I don't recall if a 2D IGES will import as a sketch |
| 21:07.26 | brlcad | I think it may just ignore non-solid IGES entities |
| 21:07.48 | brlcad | ah, no -- it does bring them in |
| 21:08.03 | brlcad | but don't know if it'll bring them in as an nmg (which can't be revolved) or as a sketch |
| 21:08.06 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-68-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:08.14 | brlcad | dxf-g will import as a sketch |
| 21:09.07 | brlcad | then you can create a revolve object using that sketch (which presently only works for arcs/curves and line entities, not splines) |
| 21:09.44 | brlcad | does the unthinkable ..... |
| 21:12.10 | iandaletter | ok ... We, "constructors" has no doubts: just a solution can be different. Nevermind. What if I have 7.10 version for 32-bit i386? is it old? It seems, never versions are 64-bits ones? |
| 21:12.42 | iandaletter | and why don't you sleep? Or it's only an evening? |
| 21:12.46 | brlcad | that's pretty old |
| 21:13.05 | brlcad | I'd suggest a 7.12, but it should be fine depending on what you're doing |
| 21:13.10 | brlcad | there are no revolves in 7.10 |
| 21:13.19 | brlcad | they're brand new in .12 |
| 21:13.30 | brlcad | and sleeping sucks |
| 21:14.36 | brlcad | there's plenty of time to sleep when you're dead |
| 21:14.46 | iandaletter | ok... well... I know revolves only from AutoCAD... How can I "extrude" an orthogonal view into dxf to be able to edit it in e.g. QCAD? |
| 21:15.34 | iandaletter | It seems, ProEngineer has a feature to draw allthe dimensions... I will wait for such a feature in brl-cad... |
| 21:16.25 | iandaletter | i meant autamatically draw it... |
| 21:18.12 | brlcad | i don't know if it's only dxf, I said I don't know how 2D iges import |
| 21:18.20 | brlcad | it'd be a quick test for you to figure that out |
| 21:19.33 | iandaletter | no, i mean - what if i have 3D model - and i need a drawing? can i create orthogonal view? And edit this view in other programs (add dimensions and so on)? |
| 21:28.34 | iandaletter | BRL-CAD cold have a features for meshing - splitting geometry down to finite elements. The only problems are mesh is needed to be refined at e.g. certain borders as a holes and e.g. outer edges. well... free mesher www.geuz.org/gmsh/ 'weights' whole 20 mb - and it is primarily a mesher. |
| 21:35.22 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=127@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 21:45.50 | louipc | brl-cad has no drafting features |
| 21:48.32 | iandaletter | well... i need no an fotorealistic images... it seems, 2D Qcad can import 3D dxf - if it is an orthigonal view - it is almost a drawing... uh... |
| 21:49.04 | brlcad | louipc: not strictly true, they're just really weak from an editing stand-point |
| 21:49.28 | brlcad | the sketch primitive supports many/most of the basic representation requirements for drafting purposes |
| 21:49.58 | brlcad | the rtedge renderer produces drafting-style hidden-line drawings, just without annotation/dimension details |
| 21:50.05 | louipc | yeah but you'd have to do it all manually |
| 21:50.11 | louipc | hahh |
| 21:50.38 | brlcad | iandaletter: are you a coder? |
| 21:50.50 | brlcad | if you are, you're welcome to help make things better ;) |
| 21:50.59 | brlcad | even if you're not, you're welcome to help make things better! |
| 21:51.00 | iandaletter | my www.pastime-one.livejournal.com |
| 21:51.07 | louipc | hehe |
| 21:51.25 | brlcad | iandaletter: that's a 404 |
| 21:51.26 | louipc | iandaletter: page not found |
| 21:51.33 | brlcad | iandaletter: you in .ru ? |
| 21:51.51 | brlcad | tries to infer/decipher the language disconnect |
| 21:52.15 | brlcad | ahh, louipc just remove the www. |
| 21:52.40 | iandaletter | brlcad: I must say I discuss brlcad when I do not know even whole commands... It's at firs time with me... I'm even a bit too responsible... |
| 21:53.01 | brlcad | understandable |
| 21:53.44 | iandaletter | http://pastime-one.livejournal.com/ graduate mech equipm designer |
| 21:54.10 | brlcad | iandaletter: wth is "q-smth" :) |
| 21:54.45 | iandaletter | probably, q-iges ? I don't know ;) |
| 21:54.50 | louipc | maybe he meant g-*? |
| 21:54.51 | brlcad | I think you maybe meant g-iges but I have no idea how you got that from q-smth is wierd :) |
| 21:55.02 | brlcad | yeah, g-* are the various exporters |
| 21:55.18 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 21:56.05 | brlcad | g-acad g-dxf g-euclid1 g-jack g-nmg g-off g-stl g-var g-x3d g-adrt g-euclid g-iges g-nff g-obj g-shell.rect g-tankill g-vrml |
| 21:56.23 | brlcad | howdy Ralith |
| 21:56.47 | Ralith | hey |
| 21:56.57 | Ralith | that is a lot of conversions. |
| 21:57.21 | brlcad | not enough though |
| 21:57.39 | Ralith | how many is enough? |
| 21:58.23 | brlcad | 64k should be more than plenty |
| 21:58.40 | Ralith | lol |
| 21:58.43 | louipc | ha ha |
| 21:59.06 | louipc | g-solid_metal |
| 22:00.23 | Ralith | so I got an atmega644p the other day |
| 22:00.31 | Ralith | it's setting next to me blinking an LED in complicated ways. |
| 22:00.38 | Ralith | good fun. |
| 22:01.22 | louipc | maybe it's trying to communicate |
| 22:01.38 | Ralith | it is communicating "your program works" |
| 22:05.32 | clock_ | porting BRL-CAD to atmega644p? |
| 22:06.02 | clock_ | with LED as a 1x1 resolution graphical monochrome display? |
| 22:06.23 | Ralith | that sounds feasible. |
| 22:06.37 | clock_ | multipane supported *) |
| 22:06.50 | clock_ | * only as long as all 4 panes show the same picture |
| 22:10.50 | iandaletter | brlcad: what if i would use brl-cad on those tiny laptops as ones 250$$ cost? 800x480 pixels... uh? |
| 22:11.14 | brlcad | what if you do? |
| 22:11.27 | Ralith | iandaletter: that would be fine, I'm sure. |
| 22:11.31 | Ralith | raytracing would be slow. |
| 22:11.34 | iandaletter | yes, what if i would buy such a laptop? |
| 22:11.45 | Ralith | what's your question? |
| 22:12.01 | Ralith | if you bought such a laptop then you would have such a laptop. |
| 22:12.02 | clock_ | one laptop per child? |
| 22:12.32 | iandaletter | ok... but my words can be used on e.g. slow machine with relatively small screen resoulution as e.g. 1024x768 were right, yeah? |
| 22:13.08 | Ralith | your words? |
| 22:13.30 | Ralith | mged is not very resource intensive afaik, assuming you're not loading hugely complex models. |
| 22:13.35 | louipc | don't use that as your build machine |
| 22:13.41 | Ralith | yeah, compiling would suck too |
| 22:13.46 | iandaletter | well, yes, not mine ones... Those english words then :) |
| 22:14.29 | Ralith | you're not a native speaker; that explains a lot. |
| 22:14.34 | iandaletter | louipc: "build machine" - what do you mean? You mean complicated drawings? |
| 22:16.55 | iandaletter | ok... but old versions are available, right? and there are fullsupport in newer versions for*.g files, right? So... old machine can be used for e.g. old version of BRL-CAD, isn't it? |
| 22:17.37 | Ralith | new versions work fine on old machines |
| 22:18.14 | iandaletter | then it's ok |
| 22:19.05 | brlcad | iandaletter: brl-cad will run on *very* minimal hardware (you don't even need a display) |
| 22:19.22 | brlcad | it's just the more minimal it is, the smaller the database you'll be able to load |
| 22:19.34 | iandaletter | ok |
| 22:20.03 | brlcad | I think ever since tcl was integrated, that pushed our minimum memory footprint up to 20MB or something |
| 22:20.16 | iandaletter | i'm about rather single details, not about something huge as e.g. "a whole department" |
| 22:21.10 | Ralith | brlcad: aw, I guess I won't be able to port to the atmega after all :( |
| 22:26.30 | brlcad | Ralith: nah, it's possible |
| 22:26.37 | brlcad | entirely depends how it's compiled/linked |
| 22:26.44 | Ralith | hehe |
| 22:26.55 | Ralith | dreams of a microcontroller cluster |
| 22:28.32 | brlcad | dreams of himself standing in sort of sun-god robes on a pyramid with a thousand naked women screaming and throwing little pickles at him |
| 22:29.09 | iandaletter | wuhh... pickles in him... |
| 22:29.43 | Ralith | thinks brlcad might be hitting the caffine pretty hard |
| 22:30.57 | brlcad | chuckles at the reference to one of the best geek cult movies of all time |
| 22:31.25 | ``Erik | depends on how old of a machine, I don't think a vax11/780 with 4k ram cuts it anymore :( |
| 22:31.44 | ``Erik | er, 4m? *forgot* |
| 22:31.45 | brlcad | rt might run, but no mged |
| 22:32.15 | ``Erik | heh, justin and I used to joke about 'numa-pic' (PIC 16f88 style microcontrollers) |
| 22:32.37 | ``Erik | but then the naked women showed up *sigh* there went that plan |
| 22:39.11 | iandaletter | naked women usually love sporty guys with good hobbies as e.g me |
| 22:41.12 | brlcad | iandaletter: and money, can't forget money and power ;) |
| 22:42.50 | brlcad | runs and hides after doing something evil... |
| 22:42.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32768 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 22:42.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: [playing taps] yes, the time has finally come.. to deprecate jove. it's become |
| 22:42.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: a maintenance burden with a bug that actually corrupts (large) input files so |
| 22:42.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: it's time to encourage/require users to finally use a different editor, or at |
| 22:42.57 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: least let them know that we're not maintaining it any more. i've included a |
| 22:42.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: jove.emacs sample '.emacs' file that (supposedly, untested) provides jove |
| 22:43.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: bindings within emacs that should help folks migrate. old habits die hard, but |
| 22:43.32 | iandaletter | axissymmetry or axisymmetry? |
| 22:43.58 | brlcad | axis of symmetry? |
| 22:44.14 | brlcad | wow, what an appropriate revision ID for that commit |
| 22:44.51 | iandaletter | yes, as "axisymmetry analysis" |
| 22:45.23 | iandaletter | the word, its spelling - tell me, please... |
| 22:45.38 | brlcad | ~spell axisymmetry |
| 22:45.46 | brlcad | bah |
| 22:45.48 | brlcad | axisymmetry is right |
| 22:46.04 | brlcad | otherwise it's two words |
| 22:46.14 | iandaletter | ok |
| 22:46.35 | iandaletter | ~spell arquebus |
| 22:47.14 | iandaletter | ~spell harquebus |
| 22:47.29 | iandaletter | sorry |
| 22:47.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32769 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: add a method so we can toggle debugging on and off on the geometry browser |
| 22:48.03 | brlcad | arquebus |
| 22:48.22 | brlcad | i think ibot only knows m-w recognized words or something |
| 23:01.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32770 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: tighten the update hook to 3/6 seconds |
| 23:06.02 | iandaletter | ~spell tensometer |
| 23:31.44 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32771 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/geometree/GeometryBrowser.tcl: quote the debug |
| 23:36.25 | iandaletter | ~spell automatization |
| 23:42.02 | Ralith | iandaletter: automation |
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| 23:56.55 | iandaletter | thanks, and what is a word for that "shafts" in blooming, which (shaft) crushes the metal? |
| 23:59.51 | iandaletter | cylinder... so trivial... |
| 00:01.57 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:04.55 | brlcad | :) |
| 00:24.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32772 10/brlcad/trunk/COPYING: license specification |
| 00:51.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32773 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (pixcut.c pixpaste.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 00:51.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: these files are missing the standard copyright header for all contributions. |
| 00:51.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: per the original brl-cad license agreement, all rights of use were granted to |
| 00:51.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the gov't when the code was provided so the sources are covered like everything |
| 00:51.01 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: else in the package. (copyright was claimed and subsequently granted/assigned |
| 00:51.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: to the gov't after a massive change to the collective work). this inconsistency |
| 00:51.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: tweak is in response to the sf.net bug posting 2128053 (Copyright issue) by |
| 00:53.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32774 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (pixcut.c pixpaste.c): adjust copyright claim to start from 2004 |
| 01:08.29 | yukonbob | afternoon, cadheads |
| 01:08.35 | brlcad | howdy bob |
| 01:08.43 | yukonbob | nods |
| 01:08.50 | yukonbob | good day today, brlcad / |
| 01:08.56 | yukonbob | s/\//?/ |
| 01:09.43 | brlcad | yeah, pretty good |
| 01:09.54 | yukonbob | nice to hear |
| 02:00.37 | starseeker | checks in - power finally came back on in apartment |
| 02:39.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32776 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/ (6 files in 6 dirs): re-target image links |
| 04:04.03 | brlcad | starseeker: eep |
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| 05:24.26 | starseeker | brlcad: what's wrong? |
| 05:34.47 | brlcad | starseeker: you losing power? |
| 05:37.48 | brlcad | that's all |
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| 05:58.26 | yukonbob | just watched "King of Kong: A Fistful of Quarters" -- fun. |
| 05:59.08 | yukonbob | hey pacman87 :) |
| 06:06.12 | pacman87 | howdy yukonbob |
| 06:06.44 | pacman87 | is learning javadoc style comments |
| 06:07.21 | pacman87 | required for a lab i wrote two weeks ago (uncommented) that's due tomorrow |
| 06:22.00 | yukonbob | hehe |
| 06:22.10 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 06:25.37 | brlcad | yukonbob: hum, I heard that was pretty good actually |
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| 07:01.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32777 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_scan.c: hum, yeah... that looks like a bug that daniel found in db_update_ident. that dbi_read_only check does not belong there (the check happens later during write). this should make it work for inmem db instances. |
| 07:13.26 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:16.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32778 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_inmem.c: make dbi_read_only default to false for inmem objects for now until all of the routines that utilize it can rely on it behaving correctly (it should only prevent writing to disk (which inmems never do). |
| 07:19.59 | d_rossberg | brlcad: are you really sure about the dbi_read_only flag? |
| 07:20.21 | d_rossberg | the documentation says "read only file" |
| 07:21.28 | d_rossberg | therefore all database functions refuse to change such a database |
| 07:23.24 | d_rossberg | i.e. version r32778 should be the solution because it is not a "read only file" and r32777 should be reverted |
| 07:26.21 | d_rossberg | btw: it looks like the saved database title is wrong if you have a v5 database without a _GLOBAL object (see my example from the mailing list) |
| 07:26.38 | brlcad | 32777 was a completely unnecessary check that was happening very prematurely -- it doesn't look right regardless of the default being 0 or 1 |
| 07:27.49 | brlcad | the key being "file" .. inmem's have no file so the intent at least was that it's non-existent file cannot be written to |
| 07:27.55 | d_rossberg | this check is contained in every database changing function |
| 07:27.57 | brlcad | since everything happens through the db_write layer |
| 07:28.19 | brlcad | 12 functions |
| 07:28.43 | brlcad | there are a lot more database-changing ones than that ;) |
| 07:28.57 | brlcad | at least indirectly |
| 07:29.22 | d_rossberg | there are only a few low level ones (?) |
| 07:30.00 | brlcad | only looks like there are 8 instances of db_write, so there should be at least 8 uses of dbi_read_only |
| 07:30.08 | brlcad | that leaves 4 suspicious checks |
| 07:30.59 | brlcad | that more than likely just crept in over the years or have never been exercised since inmems are only used in a really specific way by mged right now |
| 07:33.37 | d_rossberg | nevertheless you should test it with a real read-only file |
| 07:33.53 | d_rossberg | i'll do some checks with the inmem |
| 07:34.30 | d_rossberg | and publish my results in the C++ interface draft |
| 07:34.43 | brlcad | okay, excellent |
| 07:34.55 | brlcad | feel free to fix librt if/when you find issues like that though |
| 07:35.28 | brlcad | there's no sense in having a higher-level api or external code work around an issue when it can/should be fixed regardless |
| 07:40.10 | d_rossberg | :) first i have to understand the intention of inmem, thats why my question was "What's wrong with this code?" |
| 07:40.51 | d_rossberg | if the answer is "Nothing." i know there is a problem with librt etc. ;-) |
| 07:41.23 | brlcad | *nod* |
| 07:41.57 | brlcad | so next time I'll just say "nothing" and let you hunt for the bug for 9 hours ;) |
| 07:47.58 | yukonbob | brlcad: re: KoK -- ya -- entertaining, for what it is... |
| 07:48.05 | d_rossberg | i'm grateful to you for your work on BRL-CAD but is wasn't my intention to put pressure on you |
| 07:49.13 | brlcad | d_rossberg: heh, no pressure! .. it was somewhat of a challenge |
| 07:49.19 | yukonbob | has now finished "Slacker Uprising" and heads to sleep... |
| 07:49.42 | brlcad | it shouldn't have taken me that long to figure out what the hell was going on .. I just wasn't seeing it (or concentrating very well apparently) |
| 08:04.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32779 10/rt^3/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): demonstration of an idea of how an application could work with BRL-CAD database files via an in-memory database |
| 08:04.49 | brlcad | d_rossberg: fyi, I replied to your message, but I've yet to receive the reply myself .. mail server might be stuck or something |
| 08:20.32 | clock_ | brlcad: better than having to receive the original message yet, that would indicate serious problems with causality. |
| 08:28.25 | Ralith | "I've replied to your message, but I don't seem to have recieved it yet. Give the space-time continuum a minute to stabilize." |
| 08:29.46 | clock_ | slaps his LCD and gives it a second to stabilize |
| 08:57.05 | brlcad | yep, but it's still not received and been a couple hours now |
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| 11:15.51 | brlcad | ponders yawning |
| 11:23.01 | Axman6 | brlcad: you should consider the consequences first |
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| 11:35.06 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah. :-) |
| 11:35.11 | starseeker | was afraid he borked the build. |
| 11:35.26 | starseeker | Yeah, apparently someone didn't mark the lines correctly and a power line got chopped |
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| 11:47.12 | brlcad | fun |
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| 15:05.23 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
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| 15:35.50 | prasad_2 | kicks nickserv |
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| 20:25.39 | claymore | burps. |
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| 22:32.40 | starseeker | scowls at configure.ac - now it's giving me a false positive on finding fop |
| 22:32.43 | starseeker | grrrrrr |
| 01:26.51 | ``Erik | yeah, your fop check crap is crap |
| 01:27.06 | ``Erik | I mean, "is has it true? bc_lame_check=true" ... uh? |
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| 03:28.02 | brlcad | lines up a couple dozen houses to check out tomorrow |
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| 16:05.16 | iandaletter | brlcad: hi! |
| 16:09.38 | starseeker | ``Erik: I'll rethink it when I have time (day or two) unless you feel like fixing it |
| 16:10.11 | iandaletter | ``Erik: r u here right now? |
| 16:10.37 | starseeker | I'm responding to an earlier remark - I'm outta here about 10 minutes ago :-( |
| 16:10.47 | iandaletter | ok |
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| 16:22.57 | brlcad | starseeker, next time you see him, ask him about translating the commands |
| 16:23.16 | brlcad | he wants to help translate to french |
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| 16:24.56 | brlcad | never mind, telling him now :) |
| 20:39.58 | Twingy | brlcad: I'm working on libnurbana right now, how far did jason get with nurbs? |
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| 04:36.37 | yukonbob | wow -- hope everybody is having a good weekend ;) |
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| 10:23.48 | claymore | stretches. |
| 10:24.04 | claymore | Great weekend. The Amazing Race finally started. |
| 10:25.55 | louipc | Great weekend. Had a wild party with a bunch of smoking hot women. |
| 10:26.23 | claymore | Always a plus. Personally though, women who smoke turn me off majorly... ;) |
| 10:26.43 | louipc | hahah |
| 10:27.12 | claymore | hows that Forum addage go.... "Pics or it didn't happen?" yeah, thats it! |
| 10:29.10 | louipc | aw shucks I never carry a camera with me |
| 10:32.01 | claymore | Well its just a saying. As long as YOU remember what happened! Thats the problem with the really GOOD parties, not many people remember what happened.... |
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| 12:45.27 | starseeker | yawns and heads in |
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| 14:04.58 | mafm | hello |
| 14:13.15 | clock_ | claymore: they can videotape it |
| 14:32.10 | claymore | True, but those vids are a dime a dozen on youtube :/ |
| 14:43.02 | clock_ | how many $ is a dime? |
| 14:43.07 | clock_ | and a nickel? |
| 14:43.21 | claymore | Dime = $0.10 |
| 14:43.28 | claymore | Nickel = $0.05 |
| 14:46.22 | clock_ | do other coins have special names like these? |
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| 14:51.46 | claymore | Penny = $0.01, quarter = $0.25 |
| 14:54.00 | clock_ | is there a 0.02 and 0.50 coin? |
| 14:54.27 | claymore | No and yes, but the $0.50 is pretty rare and not very used. |
| 15:00.40 | clock_ | so if you want to pay 0.04, you have to use 4 0.01 coins? |
| 15:01.05 | claymore | yes. But nothing costs 4 pennies. Not even 1 peice of bubblegum. |
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| 15:05.10 | clock_ | 1.04 then? |
| 15:06.23 | claymore | sure. |
| 15:44.06 | ``Erik | heh |
| 15:46.09 | ``Erik | made his gf stop smoking, :/ |
| 15:46.56 | brlcad | so you think |
| 15:52.49 | ``Erik | no, she actually did, I don't hear the end of it. |
| 15:53.37 | ``Erik | http://librivox.org fear |
| 15:53.57 | claymore | She is probably getting the best of both worlds... still smoking AND being able to give you shit. |
| 15:54.06 | claymore | ..thinkabout it ;) |
| 15:54.19 | ``Erik | sorry, my nose works... :D |
| 15:54.38 | ``Erik | aint' exactly something that can be hidden |
| 15:54.59 | claymore | ah, I thunked you two had a few miles distance between yas. |
| 15:55.53 | ``Erik | a few, yes, but the two week visit vacations, hiding something like that would require siginificant downtime before and is just... not... doable... :D |
| 15:56.15 | claymore | thnx for the librivox link. good stuff. |
| 15:56.32 | claymore | I just started re'reading' the Dragonriders of Pern series again. |
| 15:56.37 | ``Erik | caught it off of the vlog of a webcomic artist, the chick who does 'devils panties' |
| 15:57.08 | ``Erik | jennie beeden or something |
| 15:57.23 | ``Erik | breeden |
| 15:58.03 | ``Erik | my dad was a huge dragonriders of pern fan, he even bought the board game |
| 15:58.24 | ``Erik | I never got into it |
| 15:58.35 | claymore | found a dir of comics, many of which you would probably like: http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/ |
| 15:59.03 | claymore | My favorite is the first book (chronologically) of the series: Dragons Dawn. |
| 15:59.05 | ``Erik | heh, xkcd has been on my regular read list for years |
| 15:59.20 | claymore | its about the inital colonization of the planet. |
| 15:59.36 | ``Erik | I did some php hackery many many years ago, it currently lives at http://brlcad.org/~erik/comics/comic.php |
| 15:59.58 | ``Erik | which is its third or fourth home O.o |
| 16:00.11 | claymore | I remember the name, you mentioned it one time, but this is the entire archive... (I thinks) |
| 16:00.14 | ``Erik | hosts come and go, but revision controlled code is forever |
| 16:00.45 | claymore | I swear I heard a violin leading some epic music as you said that. |
| 16:01.01 | ``Erik | yeh, usually, uh, when a comic makes it to that php script, it means I've gone back and read the ENTIRE archive |
| 16:01.20 | ``Erik | I'm anal like that |
| 16:01.44 | ``Erik | one does not just CLICK into mordor!!! |
| 16:01.54 | claymore | So does Sean always lurk or did i forget my deoderant today? |
| 16:02.14 | claymore | lol |
| 16:02.18 | ``Erik | both, I'd imagine |
| 16:02.32 | claymore | 'Ba-doom ching!' |
| 16:03.23 | ``Erik | naw, deep irc geek culture involves reading a lot of backlog, having a semi-mystical ability to skip large chunks if it doesn't seem relevant, and conversations where responses might come a week after |
| 16:03.42 | ``Erik | and a dozen simulanious conversations all being handled appropriately, if slowly |
| 16:04.11 | claymore | newbie question: Is there a way for me to filter all the 'joined room' and 'left room' screen vomit? |
| 16:04.24 | ``Erik | uhhhh, depends on the client? I d'no irssi myself |
| 16:05.02 | ``Erik | BX recently added collapsing that, so if a netsplit happens, I see "17 people have left" instead of 17 lines of people leaving, or "netjoin, 34 people back" instead of 34 join lines |
| 16:05.50 | claymore | BX = ? |
| 16:05.56 | ``Erik | BitchX |
| 16:06.06 | ``Erik | ircII descendant, like EPIC |
| 16:06.35 | claymore | kk danke |
| 16:06.51 | ``Erik | back in "the day", the two serious clients were BX or ircII/T|X |
| 16:07.02 | ``Erik | and then there were the fucktards using winirc or mirc |
| 16:07.28 | claymore | you sound bitter |
| 16:07.39 | ``Erik | tx was written by shaman, but he had a very classic ircII approach |
| 16:07.40 | claymore | were you a fucktard? |
| 16:07.49 | ``Erik | the epic/BX approach was... niftier |
| 16:08.07 | ``Erik | yes :D I used winirc first, then later moved to mirc... then bitchx, tried ircII, irssi, etc... |
| 16:08.29 | ``Erik | bx is still a solid win for me, I'm the old guy it the rocking chair shakin' my cane from the porch |
| 16:08.34 | claymore | NIFTI = Naval Infrared Firefighting Thermal Imager |
| 16:09.16 | ``Erik | I made a bad hit in ae. now I'm looking at edge targets and getting all pussified out. |
| 16:09.18 | ``Erik | :( |
| 16:09.43 | claymore | </topic> You should read some of the threads in the AE-Artwork forum.... omg. id10ts, all of em. Well except maybe one or two. |
| 16:09.52 | claymore | make more fleet. |
| 16:09.59 | claymore | thats all I had time for this weekend. |
| 16:10.12 | ``Erik | I'm building, the queues stay full, but, dude, it takes a week to ship 'em to the hot spot |
| 16:10.15 | claymore | Cooked up another 200k, fresh from the oven. |
| 16:10.33 | claymore | There will always be more targets.... |
| 16:10.47 | ``Erik | I'm tempted to just kamikaze crap to burn off my fleet in 32 so I can be excused |
| 16:11.21 | claymore | I AM pretty upset about sitting my fleet in33 for 2 weeks awaiting this EPIC mission we are going on.... only to be told its a farming run of hte 30's |
| 16:11.29 | ``Erik | I still wear the student moniker, so I imagine I'm permitted a fair bit of leeway |
| 16:11.32 | claymore | lol you too? hahaha |
| 16:12.14 | ``Erik | compared to the guys who've been dropped, I've been highly active and seem to be on the curve well enough |
| 16:12.16 | claymore | I am planning on just hitting a bunch of targets, making it as profitable as possible. But just keep going and going until I have nothing left in the lower 30s |
| 16:12.21 | ``Erik | they dont' think I need a mentor |
| 16:12.39 | claymore | Hey, that b3n_k1ng fool has ALL of his bases in 37. |
| 16:12.45 | claymore | shitty defences too. |
| 16:12.50 | ``Erik | yeah, I'm at the point where I don't even care about profit, really... it'd be nice, but *shrug* |
| 16:13.10 | ``Erik | I won't hit a former guildie. |
| 16:13.40 | claymore | Thats my normal motto... but man... this guy... logs on once every 5-6 days and only builds JGs and tech.... |
| 16:13.44 | ``Erik | it's a low blow, having someone expose their tech and locations, then booting and romping them, it just ain't cool |
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| 16:13.57 | ``Erik | I'll give him a week or two |
| 16:14.10 | claymore | Well, I knew where he was for a long time before he posted all his locs. |
| 16:14.21 | ``Erik | the savage boot&farm approach is uncool with me |
| 16:14.40 | claymore | we 'grew up' togther. *snif* now I have to destroy his ass :) |
| 16:14.46 | claymore | Agreed. |
| 16:14.57 | ``Erik | if EM comes back, I'll go there in a heartbeat, for a more civil nicer approach |
| 16:14.57 | claymore | Yoda seems to be quite eager to do it though. |
| 16:15.22 | ``Erik | yeah, fates culture is one of bullying and smashing everything around |
| 16:15.26 | claymore | Oh yeah, forgot about the EM Redeux idea. Hear anythign form hellbent on that? |
| 16:15.31 | ``Erik | nope |
| 16:15.34 | claymore | bah. |
| 16:15.55 | claymore | Whats worse is that the game mechanics lend itself to Fate's play style. |
| 16:16.11 | claymore | Something to keep in mind as I build my own game....;) |
| 16:16.26 | claymore | Anyone play 'Sins of a Solar Empire' ? |
| 16:16.30 | ``Erik | yeah... I still hold myself to classic EM rules... if I romp a base, once I get the derbz, I leave a single fighter and don't mind them freeing themselves |
| 16:16.51 | ``Erik | and I'm slow to hit tr's (though I've been ruthless on night) |
| 16:17.44 | claymore | whats up with the TR pillage rampage? I lost 7 over the weekend. |
| 16:17.52 | ``Erik | from who? |
| 16:18.36 | ``Erik | I've been moving a single recycler to a base and doing the tr's with that for these night targets... they hold no fleet over their bases, so *shrug* why not? |
| 16:18.54 | ``Erik | seriously, dude, I am plundering rt's with single recyclers. :D how awesome is that? |
| 16:18.59 | ``Erik | tr's |
| 16:21.19 | claymore | lol Garbage Men Strike Back. |
| 16:21.20 | claymore | Nice. |
| 16:21.37 | claymore | This down in 33/32? |
| 16:21.54 | ``Erik | I've been engaging in 32 |
| 16:22.57 | claymore | kewl. I moved my fleet in 32 once, then logged right off. Had a hutch to build. |
| 16:23.15 | claymore | I'll admit, the playability of AE is begining to wear thin. |
| 16:23.34 | claymore | I am only lvl 35 and I am close enough to Endgame that its borderline boring. |
| 16:24.08 | ``Erik | yeah, see, here I've found 5 more of this madhatter dudes astros |
| 16:24.15 | ``Erik | no fleet. |
| 16:24.27 | ``Erik | I'm gonna go scout tap piracy on his ass |
| 16:25.48 | claymore | are there level restrictions on TR piracy? |
| 16:26.54 | ``Erik | I'm sure |
| 16:27.36 | ``Erik | at this point, I'm just looking to insult, though :D |
| 16:27.58 | claymore | what reg are you in? |
| 16:28.14 | ``Erik | mostly 32:4 |
| 16:28.16 | ``Erik | 46 |
| 16:28.33 | claymore | ah, you went west.. i went east. |
| 16:28.36 | claymore | 48 sucks. |
| 16:28.50 | ``Erik | I sent scouts out to 4 regions |
| 16:29.00 | ``Erik | this one seemed the juiciest, so I've been ignoring the others |
| 16:29.38 | claymore | sassy. |
| 16:29.56 | claymore | so how was yoru weekend? |
| 16:30.12 | ``Erik | seems to me that the weak players will try to collet at the center of a galaxy, to hav e'friends' close |
| 16:30.35 | ``Erik | meh, was a weekend... friday morning, I woke up, sat at the lappy in the kitchen, vomited in the coffee mug and called in. |
| 16:30.55 | ``Erik | still doing weekend, since it's my rdo |
| 16:31.29 | ``Erik | far too much paperwork to do when I get in tomorrow :( |
| 16:31.39 | claymore | Well I figured. Sucks about the decaf vomit though... |
| 16:31.48 | claymore | Hardcopy? Ewww? Why? |
| 16:31.55 | ``Erik | uhm, eval shit |
| 16:32.06 | claymore | oh yeah, that. |
| 16:32.07 | ``Erik | I havne't worked that since the darth wendy departure |
| 16:32.12 | claymore | lol |
| 16:32.48 | claymore | She got a job with the Emperor down at the Death Star... nice. |
| 16:32.48 | ``Erik | it's really sad, she doesn't mean ill will, she is just not wired to deal with the CS type folk |
| 16:33.16 | claymore | Well then, who is she wired to deal with... and would you want to meet those people? |
| 16:34.11 | ``Erik | I have no interest in those folk, but I believe she does have a viable role as an xo in a fomulaic setting. |
| 16:35.26 | ``Erik | were I running a ship and needed someone to go rabid dog on details where versatility and imagination were a bad thing, someone like wendy would be a solid choice |
| 16:36.52 | claymore | So team lead for the Morale Supression Team eh? |
| 16:37.05 | claymore | 'The beatings will continue until Morale improves' |
| 16:37.11 | ``Erik | depends on the teams goal |
| 16:37.50 | ``Erik | somethere where creative thought is involved and rules are an obstacle, ... she is not appropriate. :) |
| 16:38.00 | claymore | lol. |
| 16:38.25 | claymore | the Eng on my last ship would have hated her. lol. |
| 16:38.37 | ``Erik | I think there are environments where free thinking may be a hinderance, and she may be appropriate |
| 16:39.18 | ``Erik | I thought she was completely inappropriate as a bc over a SE team, don't get me wrong |
| 16:39.50 | ``Erik | but I don't think she was intentionally evil, I don't think she is without utility... was just the wrong place to stick her |
| 16:40.08 | claymore | He came into Maneuvering to order the Reactor and ER shutdown for port call in Port Canveral FL: "Ensign, the bars open in 45 minutes. A procedural Shutdown takes 2 hours. You have senior watchstanders on watch and I need a drink. Do you understand me?" |
| 16:40.46 | claymore | We went from the Reactor Critical and steaming to shutdown/cold iron in 27 minutes. :) |
| 16:41.07 | ``Erik | never fuck with a captains drinkin' schedule. |
| 16:41.09 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:41.53 | claymore | well it was the Eng... the CO would have pooped golden bricks if he knew what we did. I swear the ER looked like we just ruptured a Steam Line. Visibility was at 1m at best. :) |
| 16:42.40 | claymore | Me, being rather new at the time, was scare shitless but was told to "sit back and watch" by the senior Electricians. |
| 16:43.45 | claymore | Fun stuff watching a cloud steam blow into maneuvering all the while hearing shouts of laughter from the Engineroom |
| 16:43.48 | ``Erik | I d'no, I grew up on navy bases, did njrotc for a while, have worked under a significant range of bosses... a lot of 'em suck, most don't mean to suck, maybe I'm too forgiving in my old age |
| 16:44.40 | claymore | Perhaps. There are some genuine idiots out there, they just don't know it. |
| 16:45.03 | ``Erik | I think lisa grok'd that she was outclassed and tried to do right, I think wendy was too concerned with looking good and fucked shit up for that, I think steph just wants shit done and doesn't understand what people are telling her |
| 16:45.15 | brlcad | claymore: xkcd is a staple of comic geekdom, I'm a little surprised you've just run across it :) |
| 16:45.33 | ``Erik | I think drew is too damn scared about being blamed, I've called them the kindergarden crowd to bobs face |
| 16:45.38 | brlcad | next you'll be saying you've never head of user friendly |
| 16:45.52 | ``Erik | I think paul is too damn scared of being beaten on to do anything |
| 16:46.04 | claymore | brlcad: Whats your nick all about? |
| 16:46.06 | brlcad | always lurks |
| 16:46.38 | claymore | lol.... kindergarden crowd. |
| 16:46.53 | ``Erik | I think when mike hiked up to deleware for school, he made a damn brilliant choice |
| 16:47.19 | claymore | brlcad: never really was into comics outside of the Far Side, so online comics are only about 3 years old to me. |
| 16:47.30 | ``Erik | I think when justin jumped to drews team and started the georgia tech thing, he blundered into a brilliant decision |
| 16:47.44 | claymore | and yes I have heard of User Friendly. There is one glued to the door of the mens bathroom at work. |
| 16:47.56 | brlcad | catches up |
| 16:48.17 | brlcad | claymore: which nick? |
| 16:48.33 | claymore | bad attempt at sarcasm on my part. nm. |
| 16:49.02 | claymore | I thought Justin was out on the island working with robotics/embeded stuff? |
| 16:49.12 | brlcad | he is |
| 16:49.44 | ``Erik | yeah, uh, drew W was doing robotics under wmrd and moved to vtd, taking his team with him |
| 16:49.53 | claymore | on THAT Drew. |
| 16:50.03 | claymore | I thought you ment F-ing Drew F |
| 16:50.04 | ``Erik | justin doing aviotion and jason doing ground |
| 16:50.07 | ``Erik | no |
| 16:50.20 | ``Erik | not drew f, tha'ts lee's burden, justin is with drew w |
| 16:50.29 | claymore | *confusing* |
| 16:50.35 | claymore | I hate even pseudo politics |
| 16:50.57 | ``Erik | amusingly, I met drew w well before justin moved over, in a social context |
| 16:51.02 | claymore | oh yeah, Heroes is on tonight... don't miss it this time S ;) |
| 16:51.04 | ``Erik | he fly's at sandy hook |
| 16:51.38 | claymore | Sandy's my wife's name. What the hell is he doing with her hook. |
| 16:51.43 | ``Erik | I was watching him do inverted helicoptor tricks before I cut my finger off |
| 16:51.46 | brlcad | claymore: yeah, I know |
| 16:51.49 | ``Erik | well |
| 16:51.51 | ``Erik | dave |
| 16:51.54 | claymore | :) |
| 16:51.55 | ``Erik | we like your wifes hook |
| 16:51.57 | ``Erik | a lot |
| 16:51.59 | ``Erik | ... |
| 16:52.11 | claymore | it IS rather nice .... |
| 16:52.13 | brlcad | claymore: hit ctrl-n a couple times |
| 16:53.02 | claymore | oh, so thats what that means. lol |
| 16:53.14 | claymore | My life's on the net anyways, so I 'm not scared. |
| 16:53.18 | brlcad | private messages and other channels |
| 16:53.45 | brlcad | those are your "windows" |
| 16:54.01 | claymore | Yes, when it comes to the l33t things you guys do, i am still driving my Big Wheel. So be patient. |
| 16:54.14 | ``Erik | oh my, this madhatter boy seems to want a fight |
| 16:54.45 | claymore | lol what did he do now? |
| 16:55.06 | ``Erik | he raped my cyclers |
| 16:55.17 | claymore | looks like vice versa actually |
| 16:55.38 | claymore | his vettes got trashed by your cyclers lol |
| 16:55.49 | ``Erik | no, I hit his 2 credit tr's... that's all I did to him |
| 16:55.57 | claymore | ...so... is that 'trashcan rape' ?? |
| 16:56.08 | ``Erik | he went up on my cyclers, now he gets to feel it |
| 16:57.29 | claymore | New definition of funny: Watching an ide freakout because you accidentally forgot to switch windows back to the IRC channel...lol |
| 17:00.32 | claymore | Good pool from the forums: What Scifi uni has the best ships? BSG, Stargate, bab5, starcraft, starwars, startrek, EvE, Homeworld.... |
| 17:00.52 | claymore | pool = poll for illiterate clods like me. |
| 17:02.19 | claymore | So how are things up in E59? |
| 17:37.40 | brlcad | somewhere between stargate and startrek me thinks .. starwars units are mostly unshielded or easily unshielded, the death star would be shredded by an asgard or ori beam |
| 17:38.37 | claymore | The death star has always stuck me as a 'compensation ship' much like those oversized F-350's with 35" tires and a 40" lift kit. |
| 17:38.38 | brlcad | now a borg ship would be an intersting fight |
| 17:39.20 | claymore | The poll was actually quite intersting... most people based their choice on looks, but a few on functionality.. thus a decent arguement broke out. |
| 17:39.23 | brlcad | bsg ships are just weak |
| 17:39.33 | mafm | Firefly has the best ships |
| 17:39.50 | mafm | one of them as a intergalactic companion ship, with hookers |
| 17:39.56 | brlcad | ff's were fun but also "weak" ;) |
| 17:40.00 | claymore | I was pretty dissapointed wiht the New BSG... they used Missles and Projectile rounds... thats borderline lame! |
| 17:40.33 | claymore | I like the design of FF ships... they feel real and look functional. |
| 17:40.42 | brlcad | sg is the one that takes it way over the top in terms of power and realism, making for some impressively powerful toys |
| 17:40.49 | mafm | brlcad: that's a superficial look on the matter, I look at the content of the ships |
| 17:41.12 | claymore | I also like the way *some* of the BSG ships looked. Viper = stupid, but the Raptor... that looks like something us humans just might build... |
| 17:41.46 | brlcad | mafm: depends what was meant by "best" in that poll -- I took it to mean best at kicking the other ship option's asses ;) |
| 17:41.51 | brlcad | not best resort |
| 17:42.03 | mafm | otoh I haven-t seen any of those, except for Star Trek and Wars (and played Starcraft, but I'm not aware of movies yet) |
| 17:42.14 | claymore | The problem with SG(and the cool thing too) is that its soooo far abstracted from believable that its just plain fun. |
| 17:43.15 | brlcad | liked farscape's moya |
| 17:44.35 | claymore | neat link: www.merzo.net/ |
| 17:47.39 | claymore | brlcad: don't forget to level the playing field Asgard ship Vs Cylon ship is apples and oranges. If there were someway measure and compare the universes... |
| 17:49.27 | brlcad | level the playing field? |
| 17:49.55 | brlcad | isn't that the point of the comparison? :-) given the physics and powers involved, if you mixed them all together .. asgards would kick cylon ass :) |
| 17:50.24 | brlcad | Hm, T????s???ss?? |
| 17:50.32 | brlcad | bahh, no unicode |
| 17:50.42 | claymore | Well, Humans vs cylons in the BSG uni compared to Humans vs Asgard in the SG uni... different 'humans', or level of tech. |
| 17:51.04 | claymore | Perhaps, 'Normalize the Human variable' is a good way to put it. |
| 17:51.28 | mafm | Ünìcõdê FTW |
| 17:55.44 | claymore | I don't speak unicode... what was that again? |
| 17:55.45 | mafm | Stargate is the one with egypcian themes? |
| 17:55.50 | brlcad | sometimes |
| 17:56.10 | mafm | claymore: mine is Unicode with different accents |
| 17:56.20 | brlcad | started with that, they started diverging from the egyptian theme after about 7 years when they ran out of material :) |
| 17:56.35 | mafm | claymore: just to annoy brlcad ;) |
| 17:56.46 | claymore | nice. |
| 17:56.55 | mafm | I think that I only saw the movie(s), not the series |
| 17:57.01 | mafm | I don't have time for series :) |
| 17:57.09 | claymore | Stargate got caughtup in the 'Need a bigger/badder advisary spiral' |
| 17:57.10 | mafm | last was Firefly btw |
| 17:57.26 | claymore | Good series :) |
| 17:58.53 | mafm | well, if you don't count Flying Circus |
| 17:58.53 | claymore | I honestly hate it when a good series goes town the tubes because they run thin on material. |
| 17:59.01 | claymore | Spam? |
| 17:59.11 | mafm | the whole series |
| 17:59.20 | mafm | 40 chapters or so |
| 17:59.33 | claymore | lordy. Got time on your hands or something? |
| 17:59.36 | mafm | but yep, Spam is in there |
| 17:59.56 | starseeker | likes Dahak - needs to become a movie |
| 18:00.10 | brlcad | claymore: hum, I thought SG actually got much better as they ran out of egyptian material |
| 18:00.23 | mafm | well, I don't have TV since 2 years ago, and don't watch it regularly since 5 or so -- and last time I got some time in the evenings, yep |
| 18:00.26 | brlcad | that latter 5 years have been much better than the first 5 imho |
| 18:00.42 | brlcad | the new atlantis one is still under .. evaluation |
| 18:01.01 | brlcad | some good/great, some needing work |
| 18:01.28 | claymore | Well SG did get better when the diversified out from the Egyptian themes, but, imo, they kept introducing new Bigger/Badder races to offset the last Big/Bad race they introduced... |
| 18:01.50 | claymore | Atlantis is *braces* my current fav (Save FF ofcourse). |
| 18:02.37 | starseeker | ``Erik: If you're around, some autoconf advice would be much appreciated |
| 18:02.39 | claymore | Atlantis has very solid characters and a good plot line. Addmittedly, the plot is wavering a little in seasons 3-4 |
| 18:03.02 | claymore | its always a bad sign when they start killing off major characters... |
| 18:03.22 | claymore | just like its a bad sign when they keep introducing new bigger badder races :) |
| 18:05.07 | brlcad | yeah, but that's also some of the best shows too :) |
| 18:05.22 | brlcad | like the latest power beasts from last friday... good stuff :) |
| 18:05.58 | claymore | Are you talking Atlantis? I am 1 season behind current on that one. I wait for the Dvds :) |
| 18:06.03 | brlcad | gotta get yer butt kicked with nearly zero-effort from time to time |
| 18:06.11 | brlcad | ooooh |
| 18:06.25 | brlcad | heh, then I shall try to say no more (no promises) |
| 18:06.32 | brlcad | pretty cool though (so far) |
| 18:07.06 | claymore | lol. thats my favorite formula for a plot line: HUman race getting whooped up on. Matrix, Terminator, S:AB... many many movies/series fit that bill. |
| 18:07.28 | claymore | Best part about Atlantis: They have Kaylee :) |
| 18:09.12 | brlcad | tayla's more my taste :) |
| 18:09.19 | claymore | Oh, does anyone have any news on the FireFly MMO? |
| 18:09.40 | claymore | Agreed, but Inara >> all. She just didn't make it to Atlantis... :( |
| 18:10.08 | brlcad | at least not yet |
| 18:10.29 | brlcad | they left the option open for her to do anything after she ascended |
| 18:10.49 | claymore | her = teyla? |
| 18:12.08 | brlcad | her = inara |
| 18:12.47 | brlcad | Adria |
| 18:13.21 | claymore | lol, i totaly forgot she's in the SG uni also. lol. My life is now complete. |
| 18:24.20 | claymore | Preference Question: What do you prefer, FPS or RTS games? |
| 18:25.49 | brlcad | adventure |
| 18:26.10 | claymore | Cite example... |
| 18:26.59 | mafm | nethack? |
| 18:27.47 | brlcad | Quest for Glory, Space Quest, King's Quest, old infocom games, The Longest Journey, Kyrandia, etc ... |
| 18:28.08 | claymore | Not many modern games do it for you then eh? |
| 18:28.22 | brlcad | "it depends" |
| 18:28.38 | brlcad | but yeah, most of the modern FPS don't do it for me at all |
| 18:28.50 | brlcad | The Longest Journey is modern |
| 18:29.16 | brlcad | there are a couple other modern adventures.. there are usually one or two exceptional ones every other year or so |
| 18:29.35 | claymore | ...perchance a Final Fantasy fan? |
| 18:33.37 | brlcad | never really played it |
| 18:34.07 | claymore | ;) they are a series of games...12 or 13 now I think lol. |
| 18:34.39 | brlcad | yeah, I know -- I used to follow the game, just never played it |
| 18:34.47 | brlcad | more of an RPG ala Ultima |
| 18:34.50 | claymore | The longest Journey... that sounds familiar. Is it puzzle based? |
| 18:35.08 | brlcad | puzzle-based? mmm.. not exactly |
| 18:35.22 | brlcad | it's an adventure, so there are naturally puzzles and mysteries in the game |
| 18:35.29 | brlcad | but I wouldn't say it's "puzzle based" |
| 18:36.09 | claymore | Screenies look cool. Good 100% puzzle based gmaes like the Myst series piss me off after a while. especially after I waste hours on something that turns out to be obvious. grrrr. |
| 18:38.38 | brlcad | the artwork is gorgeous |
| 18:38.52 | brlcad | screenshots on their site don't do it full justice either |
| 18:39.17 | claymore | It looks like a 2D/3D hybrid... |
| 18:39.37 | brlcad | most adventures are |
| 18:43.09 | claymore | ..Bummer, the Bailout bill was reject by the House. Dow is down by 700 points.... not good. not good. |
| 18:47.56 | brlcad | which makes me buying a place right now either really really good or potentially really bad :) |
| 18:48.40 | claymore | Just wait for the housing market to crash a bit more, then buy in nice and cheap. |
| 18:48.59 | claymore | So have you decided on whether you plan on renting or buying? |
| 18:49.02 | brlcad | it could keep crashing for another year |
| 18:49.07 | brlcad | housing-wise |
| 18:49.41 | claymore | Sure could, but its just like any other investment.. buy low, but no one knows when the negative peak will be. |
| 18:49.56 | brlcad | it's been tanking for about 9 months now |
| 18:50.33 | brlcad | true, so I might not optimize the return, but it would/should still be a good deal unless it tanks for like 2-3 years |
| 18:50.40 | brlcad | then i'm just joining in on the fun |
| 18:51.35 | claymore | Well, unless this is the Big Crash that is goung to take down our country, the economy will heal and, given time, will turn any real-estate investment profitable. |
| 18:52.13 | claymore | As long as someone doesnt buy low and sell lower, it shouldn't really affect them. |
| 18:52.28 | brlcad | yeah, I just don't necessarily want to *have* to wait 10 years for a healing :) |
| 18:53.19 | claymore | Well with BRAC happening, certain areas will be Residential Real-Estate investment heaven. |
| 18:54.17 | brlcad | yeah, and I think of the areas being worked .. the places I'm looking at are likely to recover quickly (they've barely dropped as it is compared to some places) |
| 18:54.33 | brlcad | i'm still keeping my options open though, have to find the "right place" |
| 18:54.59 | claymore | Bah, find a fixer and flip it when the market turns :) |
| 18:57.34 | claymore | I hear Dundalk is nice this time of year. *snicker* |
| 18:57.40 | brlcad | neat, autodesk is sueing solidworks |
| 18:59.59 | claymore | Can't find the article. Linkage? |
| 19:00.15 | brlcad | buys a glacial against all the advice to the contrary |
| 19:01.17 | brlcad | http://www.autodesk.com/us/solidworks/Document.pdf |
| 19:01.44 | brlcad | it's the same deal as autodesk suing the open alliance |
| 19:01.52 | brlcad | usage/representation of "DWG" |
| 19:02.02 | brlcad | and a few more things for solidworks |
| 19:03.23 | claymore | This reads like someone stamping their feet and pouting... |
| 19:05.19 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, help. Where's a good configure.ac example of nested enabling? (e.g. if docs enabled, if pdf tool found, enable pdf tool style logic) |
| 19:05.28 | brlcad | starseeker: heh |
| 19:05.35 | brlcad | i'm already working on that |
| 19:05.48 | brlcad | build failures necessitated some hackage |
| 19:05.54 | starseeker | thought this would be so easy... |
| 19:06.18 | brlcad | you had a handful of things 'quirky', couple things wrong |
| 19:06.28 | starseeker | sorry :-( |
| 19:07.00 | claymore | Ease up on himbrlcad, geez! |
| 19:07.00 | brlcad | why is pdf generation separate |
| 19:07.08 | claymore | ;) |
| 19:07.15 | starseeker | deserves it |
| 19:07.25 | brlcad | that's not being hard on him .. :) |
| 19:07.47 | claymore | thinks sarcasm is harder to relay in irc.... |
| 19:08.07 | starseeker | should have had this figured out in an evening |
| 19:08.16 | claymore | If you deserved it, lightening from upon high would have already visited you :) |
| 19:08.27 | claymore | can't spel. |
| 19:08.39 | brlcad | starseeker: what's the pdf generation separated out? |
| 19:08.48 | starseeker | why you mean? |
| 19:08.49 | brlcad | does it make it take hours longer or something? |
| 19:08.57 | brlcad | why is there a docs and a pdf docs option |
| 19:09.00 | starseeker | it might with the full doc build |
| 19:09.05 | brlcad | instead of just a doc option |
| 19:09.13 | starseeker | it's at least 2x longer than html or man |
| 19:10.02 | starseeker | we can go for a docs on/off option if you prefer - I was just trying to be polite if someone wanted docs but not a prolonged pdf build |
| 19:10.12 | brlcad | I could easily see saying that that is just how long it takes to generate the output formats |
| 19:10.35 | starseeker | <grin> That might make the docbook option look less attractive in some eyes ;-). |
| 19:11.47 | starseeker | But regardless, I'd like it to at least give me man/html if fop isn't present |
| 19:11.47 | brlcad | i mean even if it saves them an hour building pdf docs .. that means the configure, compile, and install probably is going to take them more than an hour regardless .. so the savings is really minimal |
| 19:11.47 | starseeker | True |
| 19:11.51 | brlcad | sure, you can still make it autodetect and behave accordingly for a minimal set of docs or something |
| 19:12.55 | brlcad | I just think from an outside user's perspective, we should be giving them all of our docs in all the formats we want to provide |
| 19:13.54 | brlcad | dunno, maybe I just need to feel the pain for a while like you have been doing |
| 19:14.22 | brlcad | but I would start simple regardless before trying to sort out the logic for both |
| 19:15.58 | starseeker | OK, I'll see if I can simplify |
| 19:17.05 | starseeker | If an AC_PATH_PROG doesn't find anything (say, for XSLTPROC) can I spot that in a Makefile.am with an "if !XSLTPROC" |
| 19:17.22 | brlcad | which is sort of where my commit was going to take it |
| 19:17.45 | brlcad | if you can give me a couple min, it might at least push things down the path |
| 19:18.12 | starseeker | k, thanks :-) |
| 19:23.42 | claymore | are you done talking about that work stuff yet? |
| 19:30.01 | brlcad | wasn't talking about work |
| 19:30.03 | brlcad | tis my hobby |
| 19:30.57 | ``Erik | holy fucking shit, you guys talk way too much |
| 19:31.12 | mafm | lol |
| 19:31.17 | brlcad | and you drink too much, it all balances out |
| 19:31.25 | claymore | lol |
| 19:33.55 | ``Erik | stargate started off immensly awesome when the gould were posed as a terrifying race. it quickly lost that, though :( |
| 19:35.26 | ``Erik | <-- flips brlcad off |
| 19:38.18 | claymore | thats not very nice. |
| 19:38.58 | claymore | takes an ACME anvil and drops it off a 105 story building, hitting ``erik on the head.. Meep Meep. |
| 19:39.22 | ``Erik | I, uh, honestly can't recall ever claiming I was nice... :D |
| 19:39.51 | ``Erik | in fact, I believe, I've claimed otherwise on several occasions |
| 19:39.53 | claymore | Well, how much DO you actually recall? |
| 19:40.10 | ``Erik | alrighty then |
| 19:40.14 | ``Erik | flips claymore off, too |
| 19:40.17 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:40.19 | claymore | lol |
| 19:40.27 | claymore | feels accepted |
| 19:40.39 | ``Erik | I'm literally laughing my ass off here |
| 19:41.24 | brlcad | alcoholic mood swings will do that |
| 19:41.26 | claymore | take pictures. I have never seen someone's ass fall off. |
| 19:41.48 | brlcad | doesn't want to see pictures of erik's ass even if it is falling off |
| 19:42.01 | ``Erik | for some reason, I can't get tegan and sara out of my head |
| 19:42.09 | ``Erik | and, uh, burly, fuck off :D |
| 19:43.33 | claymore | tegan & sara? Who Dat? |
| 19:44.08 | brlcad | mhmm, striving to be a sailor today? |
| 19:44.22 | ``Erik | band outta cankcia |
| 19:44.37 | ``Erik | hit youtube and listen, uh |
| 19:44.45 | ``Erik | "walking with a ghost" was one of their bigger ones |
| 19:46.22 | claymore | eh, mute'n'watch video.... perhaps I will try another. |
| 19:46.45 | brlcad | you can pull a stream on last.fm |
| 19:47.46 | claymore | eh, from what I have seen so far, I think I might pass on that. |
| 19:48.12 | ``Erik | they aint' pretty, but they have a fun groove |
| 19:48.44 | claymore | I am getting a serious 'cranberries' vibe form them.... I don't know how i feel about that... |
| 19:49.09 | ``Erik | hrm, I d'no, I never got into cranberries, but I enjoy these kids |
| 19:49.34 | ``Erik | not sure if I can make a statement of correlation and difference |
| 19:49.50 | claymore | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyp5we2ySDo |
| 19:49.55 | claymore | cranberries. |
| 19:50.27 | ``Erik | yeh, I rememeber that song |
| 19:50.38 | ``Erik | not the same |
| 19:50.59 | claymore | music, no. Voices are close imo. |
| 19:51.23 | ``Erik | I'd disagree, and the focus is radically different |
| 19:51.47 | ``Erik | cranberries are very political in a u2 sorta way, tegan and sara is more.. kinda goofy fun punk |
| 19:52.23 | claymore | there was a nother song (that I can't remember the name of) that the canberries did. That 'walking wiht a ghost' song sounded so much like them that I thought they were a tribute band. Need to look i tup. |
| 19:53.03 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 19:53.39 | claymore | either way, i can take about 3-4 mins of those kinda voices before it gets to me :) |
| 19:54.34 | ``Erik | yeh, I agree, neither band has the hours on end listenabilty of AiC or those |
| 19:54.46 | claymore | AiC = ? |
| 19:54.55 | ``Erik | alice in chains |
| 19:55.02 | claymore | ah, agreed then. |
| 19:55.26 | ``Erik | layne has a zomfg vocal ability that I think has never been equaled |
| 19:55.28 | claymore | I have been spining Ride the Lighting recently... forgot ho wmuch lik like the earlier albums |
| 19:55.30 | ``Erik | had |
| 19:55.57 | ``Erik | meh, metallica was decent in the day, it really felt like cliff was the carrying factor, though |
| 19:56.03 | mafm | heading home |
| 19:56.41 | claymore | True, he was a major loss. As retarded as he is in real life, kirk is a damn good guitarist. |
| 19:56.47 | ``Erik | I mean, the first 3 albums... awesome as shit... cliff died, 'and justice for all' was, well, weak, and the stuff after was shit |
| 19:56.53 | claymore | The same could be said for lars. |
| 19:57.00 | starseeker | I died? |
| 19:57.15 | claymore | Didn you get that memo? |
| 19:57.17 | ``Erik | no, dude, the awesome cliff, not you |
| 19:57.21 | ``Erik | :D |
| 19:57.34 | claymore | You failed to turn in your TPS reports and were thus killed. |
| 19:57.48 | starseeker | TPS? |
| 19:57.56 | ``Erik | cliff burton |
| 19:58.13 | claymore | has never been in a workplace so devoid of Office Space knowledge... |
| 19:58.30 | ``Erik | uh,yeah, . .. uh... |
| 19:58.47 | ``Erik | we might need to fire starseeker |
| 19:59.00 | claymore | Well, I am out. Gotta meeting with the Bob's. Cya |
| 19:59.05 | ``Erik | m3 did tps reports for a couple years |
| 19:59.09 | *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 20:03.26 | starseeker | ``Erik: Sorry, distracted - was having a conversation with Mike |
| 20:07.53 | ``Erik | heh |
| 20:58.09 | iandaletter | where can i see examples of docbook? |
| 20:59.38 | PrezKennedy | im thinking about buying stock in apple |
| 21:00.16 | iandaletter | doc/docbook in source tree - can not find source tree, |
| 21:06.03 | iandaletter | PrezKennedy: i'm about to marry your doughter... that younger one... |
| 21:06.33 | PrezKennedy | jokes on you if she told you shes related to me |
| 21:06.36 | PrezKennedy | i have no kids |
| 21:08.09 | iandaletter | no, you have! |
| 21:08.20 | iandaletter | from Monica! |
| 21:09.19 | iandaletter | PrezKennedy: do you know english quite well? |
| 21:09.43 | PrezKennedy | Nein ich sprechen sie Deutsch. |
| 21:09.52 | PrezKennedy | :) |
| 21:09.58 | iandaletter | What is right to say: "I was" or "Iwere"? |
| 21:10.01 | iandaletter | i were |
| 21:10.17 | PrezKennedy | i was |
| 21:10.17 | iandaletter | he/she/it V-s |
| 21:10.29 | iandaletter | and i/we V? |
| 21:10.42 | iandaletter | why? |
| 21:10.43 | PrezKennedy | I was/We were |
| 21:11.25 | iandaletter | i was... no. "we were" and "i were", too |
| 21:12.18 | PrezKennedy | I were is not correct |
| 21:12.25 | iandaletter | ok... |
| 21:12.29 | iandaletter | thanks |
| 21:12.41 | PrezKennedy | were is for plural |
| 21:13.32 | iandaletter | yes, but "he goes" and "I go"... I + V. not I + V-s, right? |
| 21:14.22 | iandaletter | PrezKennedy: can you change the grammar laws? at least until this year? |
| 21:15.04 | PrezKennedy | it would be even better to say "He is going" and "I am going" |
| 21:15.58 | iandaletter | ok, but not when we say about regular events |
| 21:16.05 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 21:16.28 | iandaletter | ok, i just have some white or black spots in my grammar book |
| 21:16.44 | iandaletter | ...in my grammar. |
| 21:16.58 | PrezKennedy | grammar isnt fun... im terrible with german grammar |
| 21:17.46 | iandaletter | but it is considered to be relatively easy... I want to know it, too - but have no time for this... |
| 21:18.34 | iandaletter | there's a link at second entry to German grammar at my http://pastime-one.livejournal.com/ |
| 22:23.23 | starseeker | brlcad: Did you decide on a good configure setup? |
| 22:32.32 | iandaletter | starseeker: so, DocBook is an .xml... |
| 22:34.24 | iandaletter | how about that samples... fr, de, it, pe, sp are bad though... incorrect words... but teasing for those knowing these languages |
| 22:34.58 | starseeker | iandaletter: Haven't had a chance to look yet - slamming through some paperwork right now :-( |
| 22:35.08 | starseeker | iandaletter: Yes, docbook is xml based |
| 22:35.31 | starseeker | doc/docbook is a subdirectory in the current subversion repository for BRL-CAD |
| 22:35.46 | iandaletter | and what about e.g. the biggest section, mged's commands? |
| 22:36.03 | iandaletter | ok, gimmme a alink |
| 22:36.19 | starseeker | There's a reworking of the documentation for MGED's commands in the works - one docbook man page per command |
| 22:36.25 | starseeker | hang on, getting link |
| 22:37.28 | iandaletter | ok, and what can you say about the translation I've supplied to my letter? |
| 22:37.39 | starseeker | http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ |
| 22:41.15 | starseeker | I don't think we want to have all languages present in one document. For the case of MGED commands, it may be possible to have a language variable that points the help commands to a specific subdirectory |
| 22:41.44 | starseeker | brlcad and I were discussing how to set things up for translations a while back - I don't think we had reached a definite decision as yet |
| 22:43.52 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:44.43 | starseeker | brlcad: What's our position on automatic translations? I'm thinking we probably need human verification of correctness at a minimum before they're accepted into the tree |
| 22:48.47 | iandaletter | the main point of translation: |
| 22:49.20 | iandaletter | 1. English is the main since program is English |
| 22:51.04 | iandaletter | 2. English words are quite easy to understand, so translations are... just partial, a main explanation - just as I've done. Rather a way to... well, i don't know... |
| 22:51.27 | starseeker | we're very much in favor of translations |
| 22:51.43 | starseeker | the question is how to structure their storage in the svn repository, and how to handle quality assurance |
| 22:51.46 | iandaletter | ok, but it can be included - since it is an open source (point 1) |
| 22:51.53 | iandaletter | and (point 2): |
| 22:52.17 | iandaletter | someone can easily edit it, since it is already formatted into the book |
| 22:52.50 | iandaletter | starseeker: e.g. old mged_cmd_index.html |
| 22:54.14 | iandaletter | command, then wide description on each language - then options, described on english - since interface and everything is English, and it is relatively easy to know English words worldwide |
| 22:56.10 | starseeker | iandaletter: Are you talking about where to store the translations? |
| 22:57.49 | iandaletter | yes, and at the same time - how to offer to someone, e.g. french, to vise the automatic translation - whilst he study commands |
| 22:58.04 | iandaletter | yes, where to store? |
| 22:58.21 | starseeker | We're planning to make all the docbook documentation editable through a wiki-style interface in Drupal (our user website) |
| 22:58.39 | iandaletter | i would do it as "addition" to english description |
| 22:59.47 | starseeker | I would prefer not to mix languages in individual files. For one thing, the file timestamps are an excellent way of keeping track of what has recently changed and which translations are not up to date. For another, it makes processing the docs into one-language files for output more difficult |
| 22:59.53 | starseeker | I have another idea, however |
| 23:00.03 | starseeker | There is an ability in DocBook called XInclude |
| 23:00.58 | starseeker | It allows Docbook files to include parts of other files automatically. For translation files, we can "include" the main (English) version of the file in the translation |
| 23:00.59 | iandaletter | well, don't know what drupal is, but as long as we edit it - why don't offer a bit funny automatic translation? Shall be included... It's not hard. |
| 23:01.32 | starseeker | There may be licensing restrictions on the automatic output of a translation program - what does the license say? |
| 23:02.08 | starseeker | For translated files, once the translation of the original file becomes complete the original included English version can be removed. |
| 23:02.33 | iandaletter | I don't really know much in coding pages, though. Ok, then e,g, /.../mged/3ptarb8.xml on english, and "additions" to it on fr, de, and so on? |
| 23:03.29 | iandaletter | EasyTranslatorDelux 4 for windows (through wine under linux Ubuntu 8.04) |
| 23:03.35 | iandaletter | wait... |
| 23:04.35 | starseeker | I was thinking docbook/en/mged/3ptarb8.xml and docbook/ru/mged/3ptarb8.xml with the russion version XIncluding the english version until complete. |
| 23:04.45 | starseeker | but that's what I need to discuss with brlcad |
| 23:05.45 | iandaletter | ok, looks good - but! you shall know |
| 23:06.11 | iandaletter | people do not like to see tricky translations... |
| 23:06.26 | starseeker | tricky in what sense? |
| 23:06.42 | iandaletter | en, then the variaNT ON another language - that's the way |
| 23:06.55 | iandaletter | when someone download it |
| 23:07.10 | iandaletter | e.g. en variant - it is only english, |
| 23:07.34 | starseeker | Oh, you mean not making it clear en is the main language? |
| 23:08.04 | iandaletter | when someone downloads e.g. russian variant - it is english + partially russian variant, where "russian" is e.g. a wide description, whil |
| 23:08.33 | iandaletter | ...while e.g. options are wrote still on english |
| 23:09.10 | starseeker | The goal would be to gradually have the ru docs become fully Russian |
| 23:10.21 | iandaletter | well, just.. ""100% english + 60% russian"" - as a recipe of russian version, or any another language... it is hard to translate... interface of the program remains english, since program was developed as english - and this is a main point |
| 23:10.41 | iandaletter | ok, can i send you file? |
| 23:10.45 | iandaletter | example? |
| 23:11.10 | starseeker | Sure |
| 23:11.28 | starseeker | However, the ability to have the interface of the program itself translated would also be of interest |
| 23:12.11 | iandaletter | no, your last comment is potentially wrong! |
| 23:12.52 | iandaletter | mistakes and hard-spelling - this is what it is. My friends hate translated interfaces |
| 23:13.21 | iandaletter | some words have no place to be fit into the menu... |
| 23:15.15 | iandaletter | "translated" means usually "cumbersome" - while people able and really know ebglish quite well, even at school |
| 23:15.52 | starseeker | Well, I suppose that depends on the quality of the translation - I wouldn't expect that I could sit down with an English-*Language* dictionary and make a good interface translation |
| 23:17.29 | iandaletter | ok, i send you: first command represent version 1 of translation |
| 23:18.17 | iandaletter | and second command 3ptarb - version 2 of translation |
| 23:19.23 | iandaletter | if we will have translated both options in manual and command promt in the program, it would be probably right - and we can do it |
| 23:19.41 | louipc | wow lots of chit chat |
| 23:20.36 | iandaletter | louipc: what do you think? |
| 23:21.40 | iandaletter | starseeker: i'm sending at the rocket speed of 1.5 kbps |
| 23:22.22 | starseeker | heh |
| 23:22.25 | starseeker | ouch |
| 23:22.27 | louipc | I don't know. I didn't read the chit chat. |
| 23:22.28 | louipc | smiles |
| 23:22.36 | starseeker | read the chit chat! |
| 23:22.49 | starseeker | :-P |
| 23:22.57 | iandaletter | starseeker: i think we can save a feature to see all available languages - as a feature (point 1), and... |
| 23:23.12 | louipc | It's way too much. no way! |
| 23:23.33 | louipc | you're making russian docs is that it? |
| 23:23.49 | louipc | I think I heard something about french docs too? |
| 23:24.00 | iandaletter | ...how can we ranslate command promt? if "help" is on ru, and promt is english - it can be a bit cumbersome |
| 23:24.01 | louipc | heard/read |
| 23:24.30 | louipc | which command prompt? |
| 23:24.33 | iandaletter | louipc: fr, de, it, pr, sp, ru |
| 23:24.52 | starseeker | iandaletter: Not sure what the best approach is there - need to take some time and think about it. |
| 23:24.54 | louipc | there are some translators lined up eh? |
| 23:25.07 | louipc | gettext wouldn't it be? |
| 23:25.11 | iandaletter | command promt of mged - can be translated, too - but not just at once |
| 23:25.21 | iandaletter | ok |
| 23:25.30 | iandaletter | just: |
| 23:25.44 | louipc | you mean "mged>" ? |
| 23:25.45 | louipc | :P |
| 23:25.51 | iandaletter | command promt of mged remains on english - right? |
| 23:26.00 | iandaletter | louipc: yes |
| 23:26.22 | louipc | no need to translate that one :P |
| 23:26.45 | louipc | "attach (nu|X|ogl)[nu]?" could use translating sure |
| 23:27.01 | starseeker | to English? ;-) |
| 23:27.27 | starseeker | louipc: Is gettext the standard solution for translation? |
| 23:27.33 | starseeker | isn't up on this stuff yet |
| 23:27.34 | iandaletter | then translated variant contains same e.g. 40% of english language, and everybody knows english quite good to unerstand simple worlds - kids or grannies :) |
| 23:27.35 | louipc | yes |
| 23:28.31 | iandaletter | starseeker: you need to rethink another thing, i gues... |
| 23:28.46 | iandaletter | "..guess..." |
| 23:29.05 | iandaletter | it can be not a simple docbook... |
| 23:29.06 | louipc | attach, attacher, juntar |
| 23:29.25 | starseeker | iandaletter: how come? |
| 23:30.00 | iandaletter | this manual can unite people who know en, sp and ru - and they will unerstand they're all the same, and we will've created a peace in the world |
| 23:30.02 | louipc | it can if the tools are there |
| 23:30.03 | iandaletter | starseeker: ? |
| 23:30.12 | louipc | if the tools aren't there then make them :D |
| 23:30.18 | starseeker | why can't it be Docbook? |
| 23:30.31 | louipc | because xml sucks |
| 23:30.36 | louipc | jokes |
| 23:30.41 | starseeker | Heh. |
| 23:31.12 | iandaletter | Then Docbook with features |
| 23:31.27 | iandaletter | starseeker: how about a command promt after "mged>"? |
| 23:31.32 | louipc | one fellow was adamant on arguing for TeX |
| 23:31.34 | iandaletter | it is on english... |
| 23:31.51 | iandaletter | starseeker: ? |
| 23:31.55 | louipc | iandaletter: yeah like try 'in' |
| 23:32.26 | iandaletter | well, i just say about the "policy" of translation... |
| 23:32.35 | iandaletter | it can be different... |
| 23:32.43 | louipc | yeah that can't be in docbook |
| 23:32.57 | louipc | the program interaction/output |
| 23:33.05 | iandaletter | "full" translation is always... non-creative... |
| 23:33.25 | louipc | well, perhaps it could somehow but I don't think it would make any sense |
| 23:34.05 | iandaletter | louipc: what sense? |
| 23:34.24 | louipc | forget I said that |
| 23:34.36 | starseeker | iandaletter: Ah, you're talking about the command prompt commands themselves. Yes, initially they would be English, since they are the literal representation of what is typed in. However, I would expect ru/ documentation to be in Russian except where expressing the actual command |
| 23:34.46 | louipc | gettext is how you translate stuff |
| 23:35.20 | louipc | what could be translated is stuff like: Enter name of solid:, Enter solid type:, Enter X, Y, Z of vertex: |
| 23:35.58 | iandaletter | starseeker: as in files i've sent you? Just edit them, and send to me - i will do it as you wish... I want to know mged's comands - and I need it, well, soon |
| 23:36.47 | iandaletter | louipc: but e.g. I know this english words from the age of 10 - no one really needs it! |
| 23:37.20 | starseeker | Iandaletter: Heh - just got it |
| 23:37.23 | starseeker | reads |
| 23:37.26 | Ralith | iandaletter: plenty of people are far more comfortable in their native language than english, assuming they even know english. |
| 23:37.36 | louipc | iandaletter: oh I thought that's what you wanted when you were talking about command prompts |
| 23:38.19 | starseeker | iandaletter: I was thinking more along the lines of 3ptarb (the 2nd command) |
| 23:38.34 | iandaletter | Everyone know english... I will work in www.code-aster.org soon - it is fully-french... - then i will have studied a couple of hundred foreign words + additional theory on eng 'n'such |
| 23:38.46 | starseeker | iandaletter: Again though - I need to discuss with brlcad |
| 23:38.51 | starseeker | he is the project leader |
| 23:39.03 | louipc | ok so what are we talking about translation then? |
| 23:39.09 | louipc | is confused |
| 23:39.10 | starseeker | yes |
| 23:39.17 | starseeker | translating the docs to multiple languages |
| 23:39.55 | starseeker | iandaletter sent me an example translation of two of the MGED command docs |
| 23:40.10 | iandaletter | Ralith: no, it is easy to translate it... words as "Enter", location - even too interesting, but it can be translated, anyway |
| 23:40.21 | louipc | cool |
| 23:40.42 | louipc | oh you're debating whether it should be in the repo or not? |
| 23:41.01 | starseeker | The difficulty with any translation is how to store the translations in a coherent way - which is compounded in this case by the docs already being put through a major reorg |
| 23:41.10 | louipc | hmm |
| 23:41.29 | iandaletter | starseeker: i have one 300 kb mged_cmd_index.html - and i've sent you an example of first 6- or nine commands... in n, fr, de and hand-edited russian |
| 23:41.29 | Ralith | translated docs, you always have an issue keeping them up to date |
| 23:41.30 | louipc | doc/en, doc/ru? :P |
| 23:41.37 | louipc | yea |
| 23:41.47 | starseeker | Ralith: Docs, period |
| 23:41.53 | louipc | yea |
| 23:41.53 | Ralith | makes me wonder if perhaps no translations should be done when there is not someone who can be relied upon to keep it updated |
| 23:42.10 | starseeker | our ENGLISH stuff isn't even up to date |
| 23:42.39 | starseeker | but it's a problem that needs solving, and the community can be a big help (both with english docs and with translation) |
| 23:42.50 | starseeker | what's needed is a framework within which that work can take place |
| 23:42.58 | starseeker | that's what I'm trying to work out now |
| 23:42.59 | louipc | yeah |
| 23:43.01 | iandaletter | Ralith: there was a talk about wiki engine, it's not a big question - the answer is "Someone, who study brl-cad right now" |
| 23:44.06 | louipc | tutorials would be handy |
| 23:44.08 | iandaletter | starseeker: what if other language will be "a short addition" to original 'english' page? |
| 23:44.23 | louipc | tutorials on how to make accurate solid models of real things |
| 23:44.47 | Ralith | louipc: do you really need a tutorial for that after going through the mged tut? |
| 23:44.50 | starseeker | iandaletter: That might be an OK way to start, but I'd really rather not mix languages except for the "English command" part of things |
| 23:44.51 | Ralith | I only made it about 1 |
| 23:44.52 | louipc | not contorted unrealistic radio/candlestick thingies |
| 23:44.52 | Ralith | er |
| 23:45.01 | Ralith | I only made it about 1/3 through and I have a pretty solid idea how to model real stuff |
| 23:45.09 | Ralith | (hehe, solid idea) |
| 23:45.17 | iandaletter | it is just better, believe me... everything can be edited - not even somehow "properly" - but into DIFFERENT VARIANTS - AND IT WILL BE COOL, ANYWAY! |
| 23:45.17 | starseeker | louipc: Heh - I'm hoping to get down to the National Archives one of these days and poke around |
| 23:45.22 | louipc | I'm trying to make something right now and it's not intuitive from a machinist's perspective |
| 23:45.39 | louipc | well not that it needs to be intuitive |
| 23:46.14 | starseeker | iandaletter: I will discuss with brlcad tomorrow, if he is in tomorrow. Deciding how to set this up is not something I can do by myself - he is lead developer |
| 23:46.23 | louipc | well once I figure it out I might document the process |
| 23:46.38 | iandaletter | starseeker: ok, i'll send you e.g. first 10 commands of mged-cmd-index as separate files in directories /en and /ru |
| 23:46.42 | louipc | or at least I will, in a very simple fashion |
| 23:46.53 | starseeker | iandaletter: Excellent! Thank you! |
| 23:46.57 | louipc | starseeker: nice |
| 23:47.08 | iandaletter | ok, then i'll have supplied you with files today! |
| 23:47.22 | starseeker | hopes they have enough engineering plans for U.S.S. Monitor to make a detailed model |
| 23:47.42 | iandaletter | starseeker: i can save each command as docbook from openoffice, will it be right? |
| 23:47.55 | starseeker | iandaletter: That will be fine |
| 23:48.05 | iandaletter | ok |
| 23:48.43 | iandaletter | then... later... I'm still ending up cam expert |
| 23:49.01 | iandaletter | ok, i quit... morning...is here |
| 23:49.02 | louipc | Ralith: I'm curious what's your occupational/technical background? |
| 23:49.13 | *** part/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 23:49.43 | Ralith | louipc: hobbyist/student |
| 23:50.18 | Ralith | largely selftaught with respect to the interesting stuff, but I generally know what I'm talking about |
| 23:54.10 | louipc | well one thing I find is that I need a calculator when modelling with brl-cad, where I don't seem to really need it with autocad or solidworks. |
| 23:56.31 | Ralith | this is probably because autocad and solidworks don't need exact numerical values for everything right off |
| 23:56.36 | Ralith | and let you do things like snap |
| 23:56.52 | Ralith | rather than a fancy tutorial, I suggest more effort be put into the new gui |
| 23:57.08 | louipc | no I enter all dimensions in autocad |
| 23:57.33 | louipc | but one example: I have to specify radius instead of diametre |
| 23:57.46 | louipc | so I need to half it in the calculator then enter it |
| 23:58.47 | Ralith | radius is a much more useful measurement. |
| 23:59.36 | louipc | not when I'm dealing with diametres of a shaft turned off a lathe, etc |
| 00:00.41 | Ralith | anyway, it's still a GUI issue |
| 00:01.02 | louipc | nah it could work in the command line |
| 00:01.08 | Ralith | fine |
| 00:01.11 | louipc | and it should |
| 00:01.11 | Ralith | it's still a UI issue |
| 00:01.24 | Ralith | I dunno |
| 00:01.32 | Ralith | it'd be awkward to support both |
| 00:01.37 | Ralith | and radius is preferable to diameter |
| 00:01.40 | louipc | not necessarily |
| 00:02.25 | louipc | yeah it is ui though. I don't propose primitives store the diametre |
| 00:02.29 | louipc | rather than radius |
| 00:03.02 | louipc | but if you have any experience working with mechanical drawings and making real parts out of metal and such, you'll know what I mean |
| 00:03.14 | louipc | or should... |
| 00:39.14 | brlcad | `` , and whomever else I missed -- be sure to update mailing address on the dashboard per message that came out today (no '.' or ',' or non-ascii chars) |
| 00:39.28 | brlcad | er |
| 00:39.37 | starseeker | blinks |
| 00:39.44 | brlcad | ``Erik, yukonbob that was for you |
| 00:51.36 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 00:53.23 | starseeker | 's brain has had it - done in by paperwork |
| 01:16.41 | poolio | err i wasnt? |
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| 02:46.46 | yukonbob | reads scrollback, |
| 02:49.42 | yukonbob | er... Hello, cadheads :) |
| 02:58.15 | yukonbob | doesn't recall to which "dashboard" above message refers. |
| 02:58.42 | yukonbob | ?sourceforget |
| 04:23.19 | pacman87 | yukonbob: gsoc dashboard |
| 05:03.26 | PrezKennedy | conspiracy! |
| 05:04.02 | PrezKennedy | dont mind me... its late |
| 05:45.02 | yukonbob | pacman87: oh......... |
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| 07:37.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32781 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 07:37.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: simplify the compilation/configuration options for generating the documentation. |
| 07:37.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: provide just one configure option that turns the docs all on or all off for now, |
| 07:37.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: support 'auto' by default so it's on if it finds what it needs, and simplify the |
| 07:37.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: makefile logic as well. push the logic up into the docbook dir so we don't even |
| 07:37.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: traverse if it's off. this lets you manually traverse into the dir to create |
| 07:37.57 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the docs even if they were configured off. this is all fairly untested but |
| 07:51.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32782 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (libtie/Makefile.am libtienet/Makefile.am): |
| 07:51.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: debian build failures still seem to rear their head in src/adrt due to linkage |
| 07:51.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: failures on libbu. add BU as a LIBADD dependency. more than likely, this is |
| 07:51.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: related to link_all_deplibs in libtool but unable to test the configuration from |
| 07:51.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: sf bug report 2131397 (Latest svn revision failed to build on Debian sid) |
| 08:04.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32783 10/brlcad/trunk/ (11 files in 6 dirs): variety of manual page fixes by Giuseppe Iuculano ( derevko ) via sf patch 2133680 (Minor fixes to manual pages) |
| 08:11.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32784 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: credit Giuseppe Iuculano with special thanks for his efforts integrating brl-cad into debian apt, for compilation testing, and few minor patches to manual page files. |
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| 08:57.29 | claymore | up all night brlcad? |
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| 09:37.51 | brlcad | claymore: nah |
| 09:38.16 | brlcad | just weird sleeping habits |
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| 10:39.42 | claymore | Newb question: Whats a Netsplit'? |
| 10:40.20 | archivist_ub | irc servers losing their interconnection |
| 10:41.54 | claymore | ah i c. Thanks! |
| 10:42.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32785 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/stractNet/ (8 files): Continuing Geometry Service Java -> Cpp Conversion. |
| 13:16.31 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 13:16.31 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 13:23.48 | *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 13:38.33 | starseeker | brlcad: Thanks for the help on the configure stuff! |
| 13:43.21 | clock_ | brlcad: did you ever use vector terminals with brl-cad? |
| 13:43.54 | clock_ | would it be possible to modify brl-cad to produce sound card output such that when viewev od XY oscilloscope, it would represent the scene wireframe? |
| 13:46.20 | archivist_ub | daft idea clock_ have you ever seen the flicker from that type of display |
| 13:46.33 | clock_ | no |
| 13:46.46 | clock_ | I have seen the Youscope demo on the 30 MHz analog scope I bought today |
| 13:46.57 | clock_ | Although the letters are legible, the picture is pretty shit. |
| 13:47.49 | archivist_ub | modern graphics cards are so much better |
| 13:48.43 | brlcad | clock_: yep |
| 13:48.53 | archivist_ub | its very hard to drive the xy plates at the speed needed for equivalent display |
| 13:49.24 | brlcad | not me personally, I arrived around the time when there were still b&w's worth testing on but no vectors by the 90's |
| 13:49.51 | clock_ | brlcad: what's a b&w in this context? a vector or a raster CRT? |
| 13:50.02 | brlcad | raster |
| 13:50.26 | brlcad | one of the very first displays of brl-cad that you can see in the historic images is of the Vector General |
| 13:50.37 | archivist_ub | I have a scap vector in the garden |
| 13:51.00 | clock_ | brlcad: URL on that image? |
| 13:51.11 | brlcad | it's in the gallery |
| 13:51.18 | clock_ | that's very vintage. Oldschool. Dusty and smelly |
| 13:51.24 | clock_ | brlcad: the one with Muus drawing the tank? |
| 13:51.28 | brlcad | yep |
| 13:51.36 | brlcad | that's a vector display |
| 13:51.51 | clock_ | is into oldschool, he likes analog scopes, rides an oldschool skateboard,... |
| 13:52.26 | archivist_ub | one of my book collection shows those displays |
| 13:52.33 | clock_ | This one? http://brlcad.com/screenshots/mikemuuss.jpg |
| 13:52.56 | brlcad | yes |
| 13:53.27 | clock_ | and the cabinets behind the seriously scientifically posing man in sand coloured jacket, are they laundry machines? |
| 13:53.29 | brlcad | fwiw, you shouldn't be going to the .com -- that's for commercial support |
| 13:53.36 | clock_ | Where you can put your jeans and pull them clean out? |
| 13:53.48 | clock_ | brlcad: I found it through google images |
| 13:54.07 | brlcad | dude, brlcad.org/gallery |
| 13:55.35 | clock_ | brlcad: does brlcad has some tool like "rt" which instead of producing a raster would export wireframe in a "line x1 y1 x2 y2" format? |
| 13:59.01 | brlcad | sort of |
| 13:59.20 | brlcad | you can either get a raster hidden wireframe image via rtedge |
| 13:59.39 | brlcad | or you can save the wireframe in mged to a 2d or 3d plot file (or postscript file) |
| 13:59.51 | clock_ | postscript file even nicer |
| 14:00.40 | brlcad | look at the File menu in mged, look at the Render View menu |
| 14:01.04 | clock_ | brlcad: nice |
| 14:01.24 | clock_ | brlcad: but hidden edge vector file is not available I guess? |
| 14:01.41 | brlcad | not presently |
| 14:01.45 | brlcad | maybe after BREP is completed |
| 14:01.52 | clock_ | what is brep? |
| 14:02.16 | clock_ | hidden edge vector file would be nice for publication, providing clean lines |
| 14:02.21 | clock_ | But hey, even now it looks nice |
| 14:02.32 | clock_ | wonders if BREP works like rtedge | autotrace inside ;-) |
| 14:02.35 | brlcad | ~brep |
| 14:05.13 | brlcad | ~brep is a Boundary REPresentation of a solid CAD model where shapes are represented using a collection of connected surface elements, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boundary_representation for details |
| 14:05.13 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 14:06.19 | clock_ | brlcad: does it work for spheres too? Or aren't we getting from CSG to some kind of surface modelling? |
| 14:06.28 | clock_ | BRL-CAD is SOLID modelling |
| 14:07.26 | brlcad | you can represent most all shapes with brep that you can combining primitives together with csg |
| 14:07.35 | brlcad | brep is also (usually) solid modeling |
| 14:07.44 | clock_ | even curved boundaries like sphere? |
| 14:07.45 | brlcad | just a different implementation mechanism |
| 14:08.04 | brlcad | sure, spline surface boundary representations can give you most curved surfaces |
| 14:08.22 | clock_ | can it represent sphere precisely or only approximation? |
| 14:08.24 | brlcad | and with a higher degree of editing freedom (since you can freely deform any surface patch) |
| 14:09.12 | clock_ | hopes there will be some kind of children lock to prevent him from mis-clicking and warping his model |
| 14:09.43 | brlcad | http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/iel4/5937/15808/00732121.pdf?arnumber=732121 |
| 14:10.46 | clock_ | brlcad: that's heavy stuff |
| 14:10.55 | clock_ | doesn't know even the Bresenham for NURBS |
| 14:11.50 | clock_ | I think if I tried to write an algorithm for intersection of a NURBS with a ray, my head would explode. |
| 14:12.11 | clock_ | you must be tough guys at BRL-CAD |
| 14:13.26 | brlcad | they're a pita to implement and really hard to make numerically robust |
| 14:13.47 | brlcad | but they're what you need for interactive shaded displays that most folks expect |
| 14:14.00 | claymore | heads explode here once every 3.7 minutes. |
| 14:16.12 | clock_ | claymore: :) |
| 14:16.44 | clock_ | doesn't want interactive shaded display, I want cubes and cylinders intersecting in a wireframe, and then the object magically appearing during raytracing |
| 14:17.14 | brlcad | well you have that now :) |
| 14:17.24 | brlcad | just trying to please more folks ;) |
| 14:21.10 | claymore | likes wireframe also. |
| 14:21.49 | claymore | doesn't like training wheels on his CAD packages. ;) |
| 14:38.46 | brlcad | starseeker: did all the configure and makefile changes make sense to you? |
| 14:39.31 | brlcad | there is more that should probably happen inside the configure.ac, e.g. if you have xsltproc but don't have Xinclude available |
| 14:39.39 | brlcad | some functionality testing to make sure it'll actually work |
| 14:40.46 | iandaletter | starseeker: you can check your email |
| 15:07.34 | Axman6 | is clock_'s quit message supposed to be a list of depressing languages and pieces of software? |
| 15:14.28 | yukonbob | waves-in: "Morning, cadheads" |
| 15:15.25 | yukonbob | Axman6: heh |
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| 15:25.11 | iandaletter | its his resume |
| 15:25.53 | iandaletter | or his sworn-like wish |
| 15:34.19 | mafm | hi |
| 15:34.30 | claymore | hi |
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| 16:20.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32786 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/stractNet/ (12 files): Continuing Geometry Service Java -> Cpp Conversion. |
| 16:24.59 | starseeker | iandaletter: Looking at it now |
| 16:37.32 | starseeker | scowls at linuxdoc - they appear to have separate websites and storage systems for each language |
| 16:38.29 | starseeker | fortunately, firebird is more interesting... |
| 17:45.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32787 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (. bot_decimate.c nmg_collapse.c nmg_simplify.c wdb_obj.c): nmg_collapse and nmg_simplify now check that their input NMG has only planar faces. This sort of fixes bug #2052656 (mged crashes on nmg_simplify and nmg_collapse) |
| 17:46.19 | brlcad | louipc: the input calculations are something that can/should be improved, allowing the user to either switch sets/styles of input if there are conventions and always allowing them to override and get at more advanced topions |
| 17:46.27 | brlcad | (referring to discussion last night) |
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| 17:51.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32788 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Building on Sean's Makefile cleanups, make pdf building conditional on presence of fop without stopping html generation. Add lessons directory. |
| 17:58.25 | brlcad | starseeker: summary printing is prime real estate in shortage, I wouldn't include pdf there |
| 17:58.35 | starseeker | ok |
| 17:59.09 | brlcad | you can put that detail in the summary |
| 17:59.11 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-71-103.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:59.24 | brlcad | just format the response accordingly |
| 17:59.51 | starseeker | you mean fit it on one line? |
| 18:01.40 | brlcad | yeah, something like.. Install extra documentation: yes (html, pdf) | yes (html only) | yes (without pdf), etc |
| 18:02.44 | brlcad | i'd also try to word it from the end-user's perspective, not what goes on behind the scene |
| 18:03.27 | brlcad | basically what (from their view) results, not how |
| 18:03.37 | starseeker | that's why you're calling it "extra"? |
| 18:03.51 | brlcad | yeah |
| 18:04.39 | brlcad | there are probably a few other ways to say the same thing that would work |
| 18:05.19 | starseeker | extra is fine for now - I just hope to reach the point where it's incorrect to call it extra :-) |
| 18:06.16 | brlcad | yeah, certainly -- but even then at that point, "extra" might then mean "generate pdfs too" |
| 18:09.01 | starseeker | now regrets taking a fresh checkout - giddyup already |
| 18:11.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32789 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: john addressed sf bug 2052656 (crashing whis nmg_collapse and nmg_simplify) from Nicolau Werneck (nwerneck) where iges-g -t was crashing. the problem was non-planar surfaces causing the nmg processing routines to abort. |
| 18:13.22 | brlcad | the only stickler on the doc integration is that the default build on any system should always compile *something* flawlessly with default configure options and with --enable-all |
| 18:14.06 | brlcad | even if that means turning off all documentation down the road once it's fully integrated into mged unless a way can be found to make the build self-contained |
| 18:14.24 | starseeker | nods |
| 18:14.36 | brlcad | libxml2 could easily be imported, but don't know how big xsltproc actually is |
| 18:14.46 | starseeker | checks |
| 18:15.03 | brlcad | not important for now :) |
| 18:15.09 | starseeker | heh |
| 18:15.11 | brlcad | more improtant to get it working first :) |
| 18:19.47 | starseeker | well, just for reference, the combined tarballs of libxslt and libxml2 are just shy of 8MB |
| 18:20.09 | starseeker | winces |
| 18:20.20 | brlcad | would have to see how much of that is actual source data |
| 18:20.47 | brlcad | it undoubtedly includes test cases, probably some binary files, maybe some specs |
| 18:21.47 | starseeker | yep |
| 18:46.13 | mafm | heading home, waves bye bye :P |
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| 19:35.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32790 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: Reduce 'extra' documentation linest one. |
| 19:47.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r32791 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/stractNet/ (MsgFrag.cpp MsgFrag.h MsgStop.cpp MsgStop.h): Continuing Geometry Service Java -> Cpp Conversion. |
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| 20:07.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32792 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: remove the duplication of functionality, bot_dump ftw |
| 20:16.46 | b0ef | much of the manuals are rewritten in docbook; are these online somewheree? |
| 20:17.00 | b0ef | s/somewheree/somewhere/ |
| 20:17.00 | starseeker | not yet - working on that |
| 20:17.11 | b0ef | aiight, thanks |
| 20:17.20 | starseeker | the original pdfs look better, for now |
| 20:17.43 | b0ef | is there any way to extrude a set of lines? |
| 20:17.47 | b0ef | to form walls.. |
| 20:18.19 | starseeker | Um - you could create a sketch of the wall outlines and then extrude that, but our sketch editor isn't so hot |
| 20:18.36 | b0ef | I know; I've imported a dxf and it's a set of lines in 2d; I want to extrude them up in 3d to form the walls |
| 20:18.56 | starseeker | Ah, that's a bit different |
| 20:19.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32793 10/brlcad/trunk/ (32 files in 4 dirs): Integrate oed docs better into the build system |
| 20:19.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Can a dxf import be extruded like that? |
| 20:23.05 | brlcad | yep, they should import as a sketch |
| 20:23.33 | b0ef | is that something different than using dxf-g? |
| 20:23.35 | brlcad | you still cannot, though, have paper thin walls, it'll use a parity test to determine solidity |
| 20:23.51 | brlcad | dxf-g will import them as a sketch |
| 20:24.18 | b0ef | well, the lines form walls in a closed loop; that is, it's a line going around the wall section, making them 10 cm thick |
| 20:24.40 | b0ef | the lines outline the wall |
| 20:25.43 | b0ef | is that good enough? |
| 20:25.51 | brlcad | what makes them 10cm thick? |
| 20:26.24 | b0ef | well, it's like seeing a wall section from above, then tracing around it |
| 20:26.56 | brlcad | so there are lines for the inside wall surface and the outside wall surface |
| 20:27.04 | brlcad | if that's the case, it should be fine |
| 20:27.06 | b0ef | yeah, a wall is like a box |
| 20:27.31 | brlcad | if it's just one line (e.g. just a rectangle), that will result in a solid box when it's extruded |
| 20:27.43 | b0ef | that's ok, for now;) |
| 20:28.13 | b0ef | can I extrude a whole group? |
| 20:28.28 | b0ef | when I do ls, I get intwall.c.6 among others |
| 20:28.46 | b0ef | can I extrude all in intwall.c.6? |
| 20:29.45 | brlcad | no, you can only extrude a sketch |
| 20:30.05 | brlcad | they can be oriented individually in any direction/depth/skew |
| 20:30.43 | b0ef | ah, I also see them as sketch when I do ls |
| 20:31.19 | b0ef | right, so this is sketch.6 |
| 20:33.03 | brlcad | "l intwall.c.6" will show the contents |
| 20:33.27 | b0ef | right |
| 20:33.28 | brlcad | turns off anonymous comments and anonymous contact on the website |
| 20:33.57 | b0ef | then we miss out on the drive by commenters |
| 20:34.49 | b0ef | usage: extrude #### distance |
| 20:35.23 | b0ef | on the wiki, it said it would extrude faces, but these are lines |
| 20:35.30 | brlcad | so far, there has been *one* drive by comment of value |
| 20:35.36 | brlcad | since the site went up |
| 20:35.48 | brlcad | there have been about 400 spam comments |
| 20:36.01 | brlcad | yeah, 'extrude' is for arbs |
| 20:36.08 | brlcad | use the 'in' command |
| 20:36.25 | brlcad | in object extrude sketch.6 |
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| 20:53.04 | b0ef | right, but why does it ask me where to place it? |
| 20:55.27 | b0ef | how do I look up documentation for "in object extrude sketch"?;) |
| 20:56.02 | brlcad | we were just talking about that last week |
| 20:56.13 | brlcad | apparently there is documentation on the sketch/extrude, but I've never seen it myself |
| 20:56.21 | brlcad | trying to hunt it down, but it'll probably be a while |
| 20:56.40 | brlcad | it's asking you where to place it because it's a 3d system? :) |
| 20:57.04 | brlcad | you can place it anywhere and/or extrude in various ways based on those parameters |
| 20:57.06 | b0ef | right, but I don't know where it is; I just want it to extrude from where the object is;) |
| 20:57.22 | brlcad | just try some default 0 0 0 for position and 1 0 0 / 0 1 0 for the uv |
| 20:59.25 | b0ef | yeah, I tried a few but it asks me 10 questions and I don't know what it's asking for;) |
| 20:59.54 | b0ef | X,Y,XYZ,X,Y,XYZ,X,Y |
| 20:59.54 | b0ef | hehe |
| 22:04.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32794 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/ (13 files in 13 dirs): Tie in articles to build system |
| 22:04.31 | starseeker | why is sourceforge so slow? |
| 22:07.08 | archivist_ub | has never known it to be fast |
| 22:09.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32795 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/ (16 files in 16 dirs): Tie in lessons to build system |
| 22:09.43 | starseeker | cripes |
| 22:12.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32796 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): |
| 22:12.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Sweep up the rest of the changes. Volume II and III should now be able to see |
| 22:12.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: all images that are available - single page generation only, at the moment, but |
| 22:12.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: much closer. Still lots of work to get images downsized/replaced with modern |
| 22:12.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: versions, some missing figures, etc. |
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| 23:56.18 | starseeker | tests pdf building on home box... |
| 00:08.18 | starseeker | YEEEESSSSS!!!! |
| 00:12.29 | starseeker | which is not to say that it doesn't need a lot of work, but the basic machinery is now functional. Thanks brlcad! |
| 00:12.29 | ``Erik | holy crap, I got a title and team in ae, crap, now they'll expect me to do something |
| 00:12.38 | starseeker | heh |
| 00:12.49 | ``Erik | oh, uh, hey cliff, uh, still need automake help? :D |
| 00:12.52 | claymore | loves his wife. She bought Ironman and SHE wants to watch it. *love* |
| 00:13.06 | claymore | who the hell put you in charge?!?!?!? |
| 00:13.36 | starseeker | ``Erik: Actually, yes :-). How do I teach automake to identify and install all the output files from a chunked html docbook translation? |
| 00:13.46 | ``Erik | I was thinking "R0x like Br0X" for the title, but they gave me "R0x your S0X Br0X" or something |
| 00:14.00 | ``Erik | chunked how? |
| 00:14.03 | ``Erik | lemme upgrade... |
| 00:14.36 | claymore | Thats got a dr seuss ring to it Erik... |
| 00:14.37 | starseeker | docbook supports two basic modes of producing html documents - "all in one" and "one file per chapter/section/etc." the latter is known as chunked |
| 00:15.04 | ``Erik | ok, I've done sectioned things using the latex2html system |
| 00:15.24 | starseeker | basically I feed it a different stylesheet - that part's OK - but the filenames are random |
| 00:15.26 | Ralith | mm, LaTeX |
| 00:15.39 | claymore | Ralith: lol, beat me to it. |
| 00:15.39 | ``Erik | random? |
| 00:15.40 | starseeker | well, as far as automake knows anyhow |
| 00:15.59 | ``Erik | is there a common file that you know will exist and be able to do path name globbing? |
| 00:16.00 | starseeker | based on the chapter/section names probably |
| 00:16.11 | starseeker | output file? |
| 00:16.18 | starseeker | or input file? |
| 00:16.23 | ``Erik | output |
| 00:16.25 | ``Erik | like |
| 00:16.32 | ``Erik | index.html: crap.xml |
| 00:16.34 | starseeker | not to my knowledge, except maybe index.html |
| 00:16.51 | starseeker | hang on, let me do some down and dirty testing... |
| 00:16.57 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:17.22 | ``Erik | you might have to abuse the uninstall hook to clean up properly, though |
| 00:19.37 | ``Erik | "(RSQ) R0X ur S0X Br0X" heh |
| 00:19.40 | starseeker | er - are you thinking take index.html and follow all its links to install? |
| 00:20.29 | ``Erik | I'm thinking that your xml will generate index.html, which should be sufficient to generate support files, and you can do fugly globbing to handle all the incidentals |
| 00:20.49 | starseeker | I take it there's no "non-fugly" way? |
| 00:20.51 | ``Erik | but it won't be "right" unless you can explicitely name all the generated ones |
| 00:21.01 | starseeker | like "watch all the output from running this operation and install it?" |
| 00:21.10 | ``Erik | uh, no, :( |
| 00:21.19 | starseeker | darn it |
| 00:21.26 | starseeker | why not? ;-) |
| 00:22.07 | starseeker | probably CAN collect all the chunked names, given enough braincells lost to boredom |
| 00:22.11 | ``Erik | well, how the hell do you know what random program xyz outputs when it's non-uniform? |
| 00:22.31 | ``Erik | now if you felt like being horribly gauche, you could collect output and regenerate the makeful with that information |
| 00:22.42 | starseeker | simple - save a list of all files in the directory, then do a diff after the command is run. Anything new is output |
| 00:22.57 | ``Erik | otherwise, you need to simply know the output and sync your .am |
| 00:23.06 | starseeker | nods |
| 00:23.10 | starseeker | was afraid of that |
| 00:23.31 | ``Erik | it's a non-recursive evaluation, think of it as a single pass operation |
| 00:24.03 | starseeker | bah - need a lisp build system. This would be child's play |
| 00:24.21 | ``Erik | yes, this is not lispy, this is simple shell scripts |
| 00:24.58 | ``Erik | lisp has the zomfg awesome of freakin' recursively evaluated macros, C doesn't do that, and this is even further off in the wrong direction :D |
| 00:25.01 | starseeker | wonders how the rest of the world solves this problem |
| 00:25.27 | ``Erik | uh, fugly hacks or knowing all the generated files and maintaining a solid am file? |
| 00:25.35 | starseeker | blegh |
| 00:25.35 | ``Erik | 99% of the world would say "uh, don't do that" |
| 00:25.36 | ``Erik | :) |
| 00:25.55 | starseeker | generate chunks in the first place you mean? |
| 00:26.23 | ``Erik | I honestly can't see this stuff being nondeterministic |
| 00:26.51 | ``Erik | I think you're just expecting too much automagic, if you change a section name, update the am file to reflect that... no? |
| 00:26.59 | starseeker | Oh, I'm quite sure it's deterministic. It's just the idea of a big laundry list doesn't appeal |
| 00:27.20 | ``Erik | <-- points to several places where we have big laundry lists in BRL-CAD's autofu |
| 00:27.54 | starseeker | objects to doing things computers can (or at least should) be able to do. |
| 00:29.07 | ``Erik | ok. You must know the output of every program in existance, ever. Without getting to look at docs or try running them. |
| 00:29.27 | ``Erik | due to the pipelined trivial nature of the auto* approach, that is the issue :) |
| 00:29.49 | ``Erik | given any possible data set as input. |
| 00:29.57 | ``Erik | :D |
| 00:46.32 | starseeker | Heh. Before and after diffs on the directory are fine unless you get side cruft generated, but nevermind |
| 01:06.05 | ``Erik | many programs generate side cruft |
| 01:17.00 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 01:17.00 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 05:51.41 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-93-101.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:01.37 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:02.00 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 08:34.58 | claymore | me yawns. |
| 08:35.01 | claymore | Mornin all. |
| 08:49.05 | ``Erik | you wake up far too early. |
| 08:51.49 | ``Erik | tegan and sarah.. they're not pretty,but they make good music |
| 08:52.54 | *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.40) | |
| 09:31.11 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 10:31.17 | claymore | Well it appears you wake up too early also :) |
| 10:31.32 | iandaletter | me? |
| 10:31.50 | iandaletter | it is rather evening... |
| 10:32.11 | claymore | well i was talking at Erik, but hi! |
| 10:32.24 | iandaletter | hi |
| 10:34.47 | claymore | Erik as for their music... its okay. That song 'back in your head' drives me insane... too squeak of a voice. 'Speak slow' is rock enough that I actually like it. |
| 10:35.14 | claymore | And the looks, eh, I believe the category they fall into is 'bag & tag' ;) |
| 10:36.53 | claymore | iandaletter: Whereabouts are you located? |
| 10:37.09 | iandaletter | пÑе +7 |
| 10:37.14 | iandaletter | gmt +7 |
| 10:37.46 | iandaletter | ending up translating QCAD's manual |
| 10:38.15 | clock_ | iandaletter: QCAD the 2D editor from Switzerland? |
| 10:38.19 | claymore | what for? |
| 10:38.21 | iandaletter | claymore: are you a student? |
| 10:38.54 | iandaletter | clock_: yes, and it seems it loads 3D dxf as orthogonal view - but i'm not sure |
| 10:39.08 | clock_ | orthogonal view? |
| 10:39.13 | iandaletter | claymore: i'm graduated student... |
| 10:40.05 | iandaletter | clock_: probably it fully support dxf, but it's a 2D editor - XY plane can be saved, but i'm not sure |
| 10:40.46 | claymore | ianda:negative ghost rider, I am a oldguy. Done did gradjiated and have to work the rest of my life now :) |
| 10:41.45 | iandaletter | claymore: clay more - you probably love off-road or it's a name of a city? |
| 10:42.27 | claymore | gmt +7 = China, mongolia, russia ...? |
| 10:42.37 | iandaletter | russia |
| 10:42.47 | iandaletter | www.sibsiu.ru |
| 10:42.54 | iandaletter | my university |
| 10:43.07 | claymore | Actually, 'Claymore' is just an internet handle I have had since I was a weee lad. Base on the Scottish Two Handed Sword. |
| 10:43.54 | iandaletter | claymore: i thought it means "Waha!.. more clay after the rain (under my wheels)!.." |
| 10:44.45 | claymore | ianda: Very well could mean that :) I just never heard that. I DO own a jeep and like to go off road evern now and then... |
| 10:45.24 | clock_ | claymore: some people go off road without a jeep - in a sharp curve in a rain, after a lot of drinking... |
| 10:46.13 | claymore | lol, not I. I don't drink and never will. Lost 2 good friends in High School to drugs & alcohol... |
| 10:46.29 | iandaletter | i own a motorbike, heavy one.. like to ride it to e.g. scrambler thru muddy road after rains and so on... When on asphalt tires - it's fun... www.rockrawler.com |
| 10:46.35 | claymore | I go offroad on purpose and in a rather controlled manner ;) |
| 10:46.55 | iandaletter | lol... sharp curve |
| 10:47.19 | clock_ | claymore: did they die from drugs and alcohol? |
| 10:47.41 | claymore | yes they did. |
| 10:47.48 | clock_ | heroin? |
| 10:48.41 | iandaletter | claymore: why developers of brl-cad have not included some new features, as e.g. automatic dimensioning? |
| 10:49.39 | iandaletter | clock_: "hero in" - and it's usually not so... it is "you + drugs" Why don't they call heroin as "youdrugs"? |
| 10:49.47 | claymore | Father came home drunk and high on something, i don't know if they ever found out what, but had a shotgun and was looking to kill his wife. Mistook his daughter for his wife. |
| 10:50.51 | clock_ | claymore: oops |
| 10:51.30 | clock_ | claymore: what happened afterwards with the father? |
| 10:51.51 | claymore | iandaletter: When it comes to features added into brlcad, well, its a matter of person-hours... there just isn't enough coders to go around ;) |
| 10:52.14 | iandaletter | claymore: it's bad a bad opportunity to get fire weapons easily. In Russia, lots of people vote "no" for it. But "our capitalists" still want it, though |
| 10:52.21 | claymore | clock: Prison, haven't heard from him since. Don't care to either. |
| 10:52.38 | clock_ | claymore: and mother? |
| 10:52.40 | iandaletter | claymore: ok, i thought it |
| 10:53.11 | iandaletter | clock_: don't sure mother is happy |
| 10:53.26 | claymore | clock_: She committed suicide shortly thereafter. |
| 10:53.32 | clock_ | no wonder |
| 10:54.19 | clock_ | so effectively the family disappeared from the surface of earth? |
| 10:54.58 | claymore | pretty much. |
| 10:55.39 | claymore | its a said story, sure, but that was many years ago now. Just the reason why i have never and will never partake. *shurgs* |
| 10:55.56 | clock_ | how many years do you get in the US for shotgunning down your own daughter? |
| 10:56.09 | clock_ | claymore: partake == got to parties? |
| 10:56.25 | iandaletter | Drugs 'fresh' up their mind, but they don't pleasure in life. Instead, they try to resolve old problems. Or sit and wait for drug intake - when the problems actually begins - in relations or smth. |
| 10:56.51 | claymore | Murder no longer commands the death sentence, so he will be out in about another 10 years. I think he did 25 total. |
| 10:57.10 | clock_ | So then he can find another woman and the story can repeat |
| 10:57.32 | clock_ | If the wife added one homicide to the suicide, she could have prevented this. |
| 10:57.36 | claymore | partake == go to parties, but not drink. I usually end up being the designated driver... which is lots of fun by itself :) |
| 10:57.54 | claymore | If he makes it out alive... the prisons are not nice to child killers. |
| 10:58.20 | clock_ | she was a child at that time? |
| 10:58.31 | iandaletter | clock_: "partake" = to take a part of |
| 10:58.34 | claymore | Grief makes people do very irrational things. |
| 10:59.17 | claymore | Yes, she was 12 or 13 at the time. We had known eachother since we were babies. |
| 11:00.42 | clock_ | why did the father want to kill the mother? |
| 11:01.06 | clock_ | that's not how a harmonic family works, I'd guess |
| 11:01.50 | claymore | Who knows. He was drunk and high on some drug. He probably didn't even know, just seemed like good idea probably. The mother and daugther were wonderful people. The mother just picked a bad apple when it came to husbands. |
| 11:02.25 | iandaletter | clock_: he has something to say, and he'd chosen inappropriate way to do it - after drugs "Drugs 'fresh' up their mind, but they don't pleasure in life. Instead, they try to resolve old problems. Or sit and wait for drug intake - when the problems actually begins - in relations or smth." |
| 11:03.31 | iandaletter | "husbands" - "house band" |
| 11:04.17 | claymore | husbands = married man. e.g. Husband and Wife. |
| 11:04.25 | clock_ | An advantage of a single mother. There is no husband to shotgun her down |
| 11:05.10 | claymore | ...well thats an intersting angle to look at it from Clock_ ...huh, never thought if that way. |
| 11:06.20 | iandaletter | clock_: and a choice of partners, and a need for being a cute lady... |
| 11:06.46 | claymore | $5 USD says that Erik comes back on the channel and says "zomg you guys talk too much!" |
| 11:08.29 | claymore | so, what do you all do for a living? if you don't mind me askin of course |
| 11:08.50 | clock_ | is a software engineer, which is a posh name for programmer |
| 11:09.31 | iandaletter | i'm mechanical engineer, and sometimes a translator |
| 11:09.42 | claymore | posh? might you be in the uk somewhere clock? |
| 11:09.53 | clock_ | no Switzerland |
| 11:10.02 | iandaletter | Probably, i will be a super-duper e.g. sportsman later |
| 11:10.11 | claymore | only missed by a few hundred miles :) |
| 11:10.56 | clock_ | I program in C. |
| 11:11.00 | claymore | cool, a MechEng. I was a ElecEng in the US Navy for a while. What area of the industry do you work in iandaletter? |
| 11:11.14 | clock_ | mechanical engineer is good |
| 11:11.24 | iandaletter | i want to drive thru europe someday... but the main distance will be my own country - nice views as mountains and plains |
| 11:11.27 | claymore | lol, join the crowd. There are some serious C zealots here where I Work. |
| 11:11.49 | iandaletter | heavy machinery of metallurgical plants |
| 11:11.52 | claymore | I am the 'new guy' and the 'oo guy' :) |
| 11:12.15 | clock_ | object oriented |
| 11:12.30 | clock_ | is object oriented, where the object is attractive gay guys |
| 11:12.47 | claymore | ianda: Awesome, so I understand: The machines at the plants where the alloy mixing occurs, or more like the mines where the metals are extracted? |
| 11:13.29 | clock_ | how to produce heavy machinery: take ordinary machinery and add a lod of lead weights |
| 11:13.35 | iandaletter | big coefficient of reliability - the only difference from other machines... same ratio weight / reliability |
| 11:13.49 | clock_ | iandaletter: so everything i sbasically thicker? |
| 11:14.06 | claymore | clock: lol, I am not sure if you are calling OO guys gay, or just saying that you like gay guys.... |
| 11:14.29 | clock_ | claymore: I am not calling oo guys gays, I am just stating I am gay in a oo-paraphrase manner |
| 11:14.39 | iandaletter | clock_: come on! you can not live wit no womans.. as russian com |
| 11:15.07 | claymore | clock_: i figured it was one of the two :) |
| 11:15.22 | clock_ | claymore: hope I didn't offend you |
| 11:15.48 | clock_ | is listening to a tune recorded on a dot matrix printer |
| 11:15.57 | iandaletter | ComedyClub says: "No, no... I'm same yours, still a clothes' esigner, and don't believe them all - i'm still a gay..." |
| 11:16.14 | claymore | ianda: so what industry do your machines primarily function in? |
| 11:17.18 | claymore | clock: nah, no offense. You can be as gay or straight as you want. No matter to me. I like my 5'8" brown eyed wife though, so its TnA all the way for me :) |
| 11:17.20 | clock_ | claymore: I understood in metal forges :) |
| 11:18.05 | iandaletter | clock_: due to large geometrical dimensions, e.g. casted metal could have cavities, that's why e.g. coefficient of reliability reaches 5-6 ration. not e.g. 1.5-2 as in cars - the only difference. "thicker" - right word |
| 11:18.30 | clock_ | iandaletter: you don't test the metal with x-rays? |
| 11:18.42 | claymore | Cool. I worked with a guy in the navy who got a job making equipment that performs checks on the machines that perform checks on the machines that make pharmacutical products. He loves describing his job just to confuse people :) |
| 11:18.59 | clock_ | sounds like multiple levels o recursion |
| 11:19.36 | clock_ | My father worked in the atomic clock department. |
| 11:19.42 | claymore | he gets paid very well. I am rather jealous. |
| 11:19.57 | clock_ | They had like a 20m well into the ground and an atomic clock on the bottom. To ensure maximum possible environmental stability. |
| 11:20.36 | clock_ | And they had a lot of oscilloscopes counters phase locked loops and signal comparators and made the national time standard for the whole country. |
| 11:20.54 | clock_ | Even the horizontal retrace of all television channels were synchronized to this so you could get atomic time from you TV set. |
| 11:21.11 | iandaletter | clock_: no, usually... it is not really needed - most of equipment has been designed long ago... ain proportions and so on. Now it's fea and "longevity / pit stops" |
| 11:22.58 | iandaletter | "main proportions" |
| 11:23.12 | clock_ | iandaletter: do you use BRL-CAD to design your monstrous machines? |
| 11:25.18 | iandaletter | no, it is usually AutoCAD - but now, when internet access is well ...possible for everyone - we can not use pyrate software in firms... People at home can use it still. I'm about BRL-cad, QCAD, blender, and www.code-aster.org soon |
| 11:25.50 | claymore | is learning blender. |
| 11:26.11 | clock_ | what is code-aster? It's in French I don't understand |
| 11:26.31 | clock_ | iandaletter: I use BRL-CAD and qcad on my DIY garage made optical wireless data link 10Mbps full duplex 1.4km |
| 11:26.39 | iandaletter | Do you know Finite Element Method? FEA or FEM - this and continual modifications to get good "longevity/ pit stops" ratio - all what we do |
| 11:27.00 | clock_ | FEM yes you divide into small pieces and then calculate the mechanical parameters |
| 11:27.47 | iandaletter | clock_: i can not even download it... it's in french, but i will use it and other free programs instead of non-cheao ANSYS.com |
| 11:28.45 | claymore | |
| 11:29.11 | iandaletter | impact.sourceforge.net - for crush tests, written on java, it works with shells and geuz.org/gmsh/ mesher |
| 11:30.47 | iandaletter | clock_: "DIY"? |
| 11:30.54 | clock_ | iandaletter: Do It Yourself |
| 11:31.08 | iandaletter | ah! |
| 11:31.59 | iandaletter | my old PC was "RIY" with couple coolers'n'such in store |
| 11:32.32 | claymore | okay, my turn... RIY == ?? |
| 11:33.09 | iandaletter | Repair it yourself |
| 11:33.36 | clock_ | I bought factory new skateboard trucks and they were RIY |
| 11:33.41 | clock_ | Repair The Faulty Design Yourself |
| 11:33.42 | iandaletter | and now it's a laptop, and by now i hate computers |
| 11:33.59 | claymore | ah, lol. |
| 11:34.06 | clock_ | They left unmachined casted surface in a place where the ball bearings required precisely prependicular surface |
| 11:34.27 | claymore | I am getting ready to make the switch from laptop back to desktop as my primary machine. |
| 11:34.33 | clock_ | I had to file 4 these surfaces and 4 nuts (also crooked) down to prevent the bearings from being destroyed |
| 11:35.03 | clock_ | claymore: I did the same |
| 11:35.15 | iandaletter | uh... I have bought K2 sk8board for 50$ instead of 150$ - promo model - someone'd groung tails a bit... |
| 11:35.37 | clock_ | claymore: Especially at home I have a dual CPU high performance desktop since I render BRL-CAD videos for my hobby project. |
| 11:35.57 | iandaletter | clock_: claymore: I hate computers by now... |
| 11:36.03 | clock_ | iandaletter: I have a G&S Stacy Peralta Warp Tail 2 reissue |
| 11:36.50 | claymore | wow, you use brlcad for videos? got any samples to see? |
| 11:37.00 | iandaletter | don;t know brands... i used to biking, but this thing has no brakes! |
| 11:38.50 | iandaletter | we have no much asphalt... for a while... |
| 11:39.42 | clock_ | claymore: http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/all.ogg |
| 11:40.17 | iandaletter | clock_: I have ABEC 5 and people say it is a bit fast for freestyle - and soon it will be even faster. I'm from http://pastime-one.livejournal.com/ |
| 11:40.20 | clock_ | claymore: sorry, the video is empty. I have to fix it. |
| 11:40.30 | clock_ | iandaletter: I have Bones Swiss. |
| 11:40.57 | claymore | clock: no problem, but can you put it in either mpeg or avi? I am at work and don't have the ability to view ogg. |
| 11:40.58 | clock_ | you regulate speed by crappiness of the bearings? |
| 11:41.10 | clock_ | I thought the job of bearings is to reduce friction as close to 0 as possible. |
| 11:41.25 | clock_ | claymore: no. I tried mpeg but the mpeg encoder shifted sound and video. |
| 11:42.13 | clock_ | If I stop maintaining Ronja for a month always some things screw up |
| 11:42.34 | clock_ | This time it was the fucking video. |
| 11:42.39 | iandaletter | well, i don't really know... Only know opinions - while i'm just skating. I like flatland as Rodney Mullen - and "rally" to somewhere thru every bit of asphalt |
| 11:42.47 | clock_ | I fix my skateboard and my BRL-CAD video breaks. |
| 11:42.53 | clock_ | Life is like the 15 game. |
| 11:43.16 | clock_ | is nowhere as far in skateboarding as Rodney Mullen |
| 11:44.56 | iandaletter | clock_: you mean you can less... I'm too - for a while... I like to spend time this way. Earlier, i liked e.g. brooks + mountain bicycle |
| 11:45.16 | clock_ | iandaletter: I can less |
| 11:45.27 | clock_ | All I can do is some kind of almost-bert like Jay Adams |
| 11:45.51 | clock_ | http://www.purplemoon.ch/upics/124/u_875810.jpg |
| 11:45.56 | clock_ | http://www.purplemoon.ch/upics/160/u_875808.jpg |
| 11:46.32 | iandaletter | i don't know jay Adams, but sk8 - it is a way to spend time as kids do. No, i can not handle pics with my current internet access |
| 11:47.03 | iandaletter | later, save as bookmarks |
| 11:47.20 | clock_ | iandaletter: build a Ronja and you'll be able to stream DVD video realtime! |
| 11:47.42 | clock_ | but only if the next hop has as strong connection as well ;-) |
| 11:48.05 | clock_ | iandaletter: Jay Adams is one of the best skaters ever |
| 11:48.14 | iandaletter | i'm on GPRS it is digital-thru-GMS on mobile cell phone |
| 11:49.28 | iandaletter | i don;t have cheap internet to have a good pastime in the internet... I saw videos only in licensed games of Tony Hawk's Pro Skater |
| 11:51.45 | claymore | how much do you pay for your internet service ianda? |
| 11:52.19 | iandaletter | us $ for 10 mb at night or 5 mb at day |
| 12:08.11 | *** join/#brlcad iandalette1 (n=asus@217.118.79.37) | |
| 12:20.10 | iandalette1 | connection check |
| 12:20.18 | claymore | connection check sat. |
| 12:21.30 | iandalette1 | roger |
| 12:45.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32797 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Added code to dump sat files. |
| 12:57.41 | ``Erik | fights the urge to pull up his bank account and apples store site in windows next to eachother O.o |
| 12:58.25 | claymore | have it both ways: Give in to the urge to buy something, but then give it to someone... like me! |
| 12:58.28 | claymore | muwahaha |
| 12:58.30 | ``Erik | and, claymore, you're doing it wrong, when someone says SYN, you say ACK, then they say ACK back |
| 12:58.40 | claymore | attempts a Jedi Mind Trick. |
| 12:59.14 | claymore | lol. Rule #1: Never tell a Sub Electrician how to do phone comms ;) |
| 12:59.25 | ``Erik | <-- looks at modem |
| 12:59.31 | ``Erik | dis ain't sat comm, boy |
| 12:59.44 | claymore | no one said it is. |
| 12:59.50 | archivist_ub | sets rts |
| 13:00.12 | claymore | oh no, someone set the channel to RealTime Strategy! |
| 13:00.13 | ``Erik | rule #0xff14: never tell intarweb nerd details of ip |
| 13:00.56 | claymore | lulz. ip == ?? in this case? |
| 13:01.32 | ``Erik | I've tuned 300 baud modems to crank about 900 bps, I've decided things like psnuke were inferior and rewrote them to be more brutal |
| 13:01.37 | ``Erik | internet protocol |
| 13:01.53 | ``Erik | ip/tcp is probably the inferior format you've seen |
| 13:02.03 | *** join/#brlcad claymore_ (n=claymore@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:02.14 | claymore_ | well that was strange. |
| 13:02.21 | ``Erik | apparently claymore fails IP rules |
| 13:02.22 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:02.25 | archivist_ub | rtty on the PET was entertaining |
| 13:02.50 | ``Erik | zmodem, ymodem, kermit... I think I mostly used y |
| 13:02.54 | ``Erik | it was a LONG time ago |
| 13:03.04 | claymore_ | who'd thought dropping a bottle of Mt Dew on a keyboard would have such an effect.... |
| 13:03.18 | ``Erik | the z80 cp/m box was amusing, but I really grooved on the c64 |
| 13:03.52 | claymore_ | did you have a tape drive or two? |
| 13:04.05 | ``Erik | had hayes 300 and 1200 rs232 modems, I was badass :D |
| 13:04.22 | ``Erik | no, even in '83, with the coleco adam, my dad bought a disk drive.... |
| 13:04.54 | ``Erik | the disk drive on the coleco never worked. Period. So we used 4track there, but the commie disks worked like a charm |
| 13:04.55 | claymore_ | lol. I think my first modem was a hayes 1200. Can't really remember. Only used it to play games :) |
| 13:04.58 | clock_ | is watching Iggy Pop: Passenger on an 30 MHz analog oscilloscope |
| 13:05.17 | claymore_ | thinks clock needs to get out more ;) |
| 13:05.18 | ``Erik | a couple 1541's, a couple 1571's, a precious 1581 |
| 13:05.43 | ``Erik | I was a bbs sysop in the late 80's |
| 13:05.56 | claymore_ | wow you must be OLD. |
| 13:06.00 | claymore_ | :) |
| 13:06.19 | ``Erik | we were a scary group. A bunch of adult males who couldn't get laid. it was a scary time. |
| 13:06.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32799 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: ws, indent |
| 13:06.44 | clock_ | claymore: get out like outside or into society? |
| 13:06.49 | ``Erik | and I'm only a year older than you, claymore |
| 13:06.56 | claymore_ | lets see... what was I doing in the late 80's... oh thats right, middle school :) |
| 13:07.22 | ``Erik | '76 representin', yo! |
| 13:07.26 | ``Erik | *sob* |
| 13:07.29 | claymore_ | clock: just away from the o-scope :) |
| 13:07.35 | archivist_ub | ``Erik, is a youngster |
| 13:07.48 | claymore_ | erik: 77 was better: First apple, first Starwars movie..... you missed it by a year imo :P |
| 13:08.12 | ``Erik | I was at the very first screening of starwars, tyvm |
| 13:08.36 | ``Erik | and, uh, bicentenial, yo? or is the nation inferior to a pathetic 8b micro? |
| 13:08.37 | claymore_ | wonders why Erik just admitted to that... |
| 13:09.00 | archivist_ub | went to see 2001 |
| 13:09.02 | ``Erik | NERDCORE! |
| 13:09.09 | claymore_ | I am aspiring to see the tricentennial. |
| 13:09.29 | ``Erik | at this point, I'd be impressed if there was one :( |
| 13:09.29 | claymore_ | wow. 2001, thats one acid trip of a movie. :) |
| 13:10.00 | ``Erik | I like the middle of it.. monkey land was .. kinda lame, and space baby was... wtf |
| 13:10.15 | claymore_ | I might have to celebrate it while hiding from the lynch mobs or in a bomb shelter, but i am still planning on being there :) |
| 13:10.56 | claymore_ | my opinion was that good old Stanley K had a good script going but dropped a few tabs of acid 3 pages from the end. |
| 13:11.00 | ``Erik | the travesty, though, was AI |
| 13:11.17 | ``Erik | kubrick wrote a fucking goddamn brillian dysoptic story |
| 13:11.29 | claymore_ | erik: the new movie with that 6th sense kid? |
| 13:11.42 | ``Erik | '01 |
| 13:11.54 | ``Erik | speilberg directed the original screenplay disturbingly well |
| 13:11.59 | ``Erik | but then the story ends... |
| 13:12.09 | ``Erik | and... then... speilburgs writing shows up... and... it sucked |
| 13:12.21 | claymore_ | ah. yeah. I didnt get 2001 until i watched 2001 and 2010 back to back, like 7 times in a row. Then the whole Genesis idea kicked in and I got it. lol |
| 13:12.28 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 13:13.33 | ``Erik | seriously, if you watch ai, when the brat is at the bottom and it does the slow fade to black, turn it off! that is seriously the end of the movie. the shit after that is just gratouitous cg wankery to make a disney ending out of a zomfg awesome story |
| 13:13.38 | claymore_ | and thats strange because Shpeilburg's made some really good movies... |
| 13:14.02 | mafm | hello |
| 13:14.13 | claymore_ | I will have to remember that if I ever bring myself to watch it... |
| 13:14.19 | claymore_ | mafm: hai! |
| 13:14.22 | ``Erik | eh, they were awesome when I was 10 |
| 13:14.23 | ``Erik | ... |
| 13:14.50 | claymore_ | Schindler's list still haunts me to this day. Watched it once. Dunno if i can watch it again. |
| 13:14.59 | ``Erik | that was a good movie |
| 13:15.08 | mafm | ``Erik: which is the status of the debian package? |
| 13:15.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32800 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (8 files in 3 dirs): ws |
| 13:15.21 | ``Erik | when I was in highschool, they bussed everyone to the theater to see it |
| 13:16.16 | claymore_ | Saving Private Ryan, although somewhat weak on plot, was a visual punch in the face. My gramps, who was at ohmaha beach, had to leave the room. |
| 13:16.40 | ``Erik | mafm, the debian machine I had access to has been port blocked for months. all my freshmeat entries have been deleted. They say it's because of some 'hacker' software, and I hav ea gut feelign that they're seeing the self policing crap instituted after the box was hacked, years ago |
| 13:17.29 | ``Erik | that was an interesting flick, the big issue with that seemed to be everyone arguing about the first half hour, calling it gratuitous violence... I think it was a clever way to set the brutal ugly mood of the era |
| 13:18.03 | ``Erik | y'know, war ain't pretty, ladies, it's a lot of ugly followed up by more ugly |
| 13:18.49 | claymore_ | oh dear god... imdb says there is a Jurassic Park 4 in the works..... *slams head on desk* |
| 13:19.29 | ``Erik | now, help me remember, both shindlers list and saving private ryan were zomfg real stories, right? |
| 13:19.51 | mafm | ``Erik: is it just a matter of using your scripts and building, or do you think that more substantial work is needed? |
| 13:19.56 | ``Erik | so there was no actual crative writing in those? just emulation? |
| 13:20.04 | claymore_ | erik: Pretty sure, yeah. I know they were based on real stories, but I don't know how accurate they are. |
| 13:20.25 | ``Erik | the debian package stuff I wrote was sufficient at the time I wrote it, I can't imagine things changing that much |
| 13:21.10 | ``Erik | well, dave, when AI fades to black at the end then goes into the alien thing, it gets... really fucking lame |
| 13:21.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32801 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: add support for color and vectors to pnts so it can be announced |
| 13:21.56 | ``Erik | it was genious up to that point, then got retarded... so retarded, I had to look it up... and, uh, that shift point was where kubrick stopped writing and speilburg picked itup |
| 13:22.31 | ``Erik | they said that kubricks manuscript was incomplete, I think it actually was complete, it was a good morbid end |
| 13:22.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32802 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: need to wrap up revolve too |
| 13:23.19 | claymore_ | probably right. EVERYONE wants a Disney ending nowadays. |
| 13:23.46 | claymore_ | One thing i liked about the Terminator series: 3 movies thus far and they still can't stop the world from being destroyed, lol. |
| 13:23.59 | ``Erik | I think it's a movie worth watching, it really is terrific... but if I were in the room, I'd walk out or hit hte stop button with 20 minutes left, cuz that's where the story ends |
| 13:24.21 | ``Erik | erm, if they do, then the events of the first never occur... :D |
| 13:24.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32803 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: cliff now has the docs autogenerating, at least a good first stab at it |
| 13:24.58 | mafm | ``Erik: I could try to build them for ia32 and amd64 if you help me :) |
| 13:25.09 | claymore_ | Ill put in on my list. The wife picked up Ironman yesterday. not as impressed as the hype had me antcipating it. |
| 13:25.26 | ``Erik | all I can do is offer advice, mafm, with that box gone, I'm all bsd and mac |
| 13:25.47 | ``Erik | I was surprised with how amusing 'tropic thunder' was |
| 13:26.18 | mafm | ``Erik: he |
| 13:26.30 | mafm | ``Erik: yep, that's mostly what I need :) |
| 13:26.35 | ``Erik | robert downey jr was in it, he's the dude who played iron man, right? |
| 13:26.50 | claymore_ | erik: right. |
| 13:27.08 | claymore_ | CG was good... okay, CG was awesome, but the plot wasn't well balanced. |
| 13:27.22 | ``Erik | I was saddened by the transformers movie |
| 13:27.27 | claymore_ | they spent a bulk o fht emovie developing characters and the last 30 minutes telling the story. |
| 13:27.40 | ``Erik | there was no plot, and they boned the legacy |
| 13:27.44 | claymore_ | Really? Did you actually expect anything other than eye candy? |
| 13:27.50 | claymore_ | I sure didn't |
| 13:28.07 | ``Erik | well, I kinda didn't expect my childhood to be bent over and rammed without lube |
| 13:28.38 | claymore_ | I didn't really pay attention to the plot. I was focused on the CG and Megan Fox... with Michael Bay at the helm, I knew the movie was going to have a weak ass plot. |
| 13:28.44 | ``Erik | but, yeah, michael bay movie... |
| 13:28.53 | ``Erik | what I'm really amused by, though |
| 13:29.09 | ``Erik | is my gf is a huge dbz fan, and mike bay is doing a dbz live action movie |
| 13:29.26 | claymore_ | serious? Sounds like you got a keep then. |
| 13:29.27 | ``Erik | so I'm all over that, y'knwo BWAAAAAHAHHAHHA YOU'RE GONNA GET THE BAY TREATMENT! |
| 13:29.57 | claymore_ | and... i will have to look that up. But dbz's fate is pretty much sealed. |
| 13:30.25 | ``Erik | well, y'know, you get mebbe 70 minutes of grunting and powering up to super saiyan |
| 13:30.28 | ``Erik | then, uh |
| 13:30.32 | ``Erik | some explosion or something |
| 13:30.34 | ``Erik | movies over |
| 13:30.58 | claymore_ | lol |
| 13:31.00 | ``Erik | isn't that how the animated series worked? |
| 13:31.40 | claymore_ | according to imdb, Bay is working on remakes of: Friday the 13th, The Birds, and a nightmare on Elm Street... |
| 13:31.41 | ``Erik | sorry, if you're talking anime, give me y'know, ghostin the shell or cowboy bebop |
| 13:32.14 | claymore_ | ah... I have limited exposure to anime, but GitS and Vampire Hunter D are my current favs. |
| 13:32.32 | claymore_ | Well, the animatrix also, if you can count that. |
| 13:32.35 | ``Erik | odddd, there was an anouncement that he was doing dbz, and a LOT of public outcry |
| 13:32.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32804 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: braces |
| 13:34.12 | claymore_ | well, thats not all he's doing, but just 3 of the interesting ones. didn't see dbz on there, but then again imdb is 100% accurate all the time. |
| 13:35.09 | ``Erik | special effects are lovely and all, but I want a story... bay just doesn't do that |
| 13:35.50 | claymore_ | true. |
| 13:35.53 | ``Erik | I mean, loaded in my dvd player right now... kung fu |
| 13:36.11 | ``Erik | the story and backdrop are immense |
| 13:36.30 | ``Erik | but it's, y'know, a cheesy 70's western tv show as far as effects go |
| 13:36.38 | claymore_ | I can forego plan if there is enough awesome cg, fight scenes and hot women ...;) |
| 13:36.50 | claymore_ | so you're at home today> |
| 13:36.57 | ``Erik | I used to, I can't anymore |
| 13:37.06 | ``Erik | yeah, I called in sick, was feeling shoddy when I got up |
| 13:37.41 | claymore_ | based on all the commits, i think Sean won't be in today either ;) |
| 13:38.08 | ``Erik | he does what he does, no one knows when he'll be in |
| 13:38.37 | ``Erik | if they say "hey! you're presenting at a ttm!" he seems to show up, but *shrug* |
| 13:38.50 | claymore_ | truth be told, I am fighting a killer headache. Haivng trouble focusing. Perhaps thats just because i forgot my meds.... |
| 13:39.28 | ``Erik | ok, dude, it's not meds if it involves a mirror, razer and straw. |
| 13:39.33 | ``Erik | :D *duck* |
| 13:39.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32805 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: refactor and simplify, write the number of triangles inside write_bot_stl_binary instead of reseeking afterwards |
| 13:39.50 | starseeker | will be heading in in a few minutes, once his headache is under control |
| 13:40.01 | claymore_ | shhhhhh damnit erik! |
| 13:40.43 | claymore_ | its getting to the point where we will need to rename the channel #sickbay |
| 13:41.31 | ``Erik | "why is there a postit with sickbay written on it on the aft starboard airlock?" |
| 13:41.33 | claymore_ | ponders on ways to get Cliff addicted to AE as well... |
| 13:41.43 | claymore_ | lol |
| 13:42.00 | iandaletter | starseeker: you need to get a fruit smoothie |
| 13:42.15 | starseeker | winces |
| 13:42.35 | ``Erik | bites his tongue on the obscene perverted comment fighting to escape |
| 13:42.42 | iandaletter | oh, starseeker, don't wince |
| 13:42.52 | iandaletter | we're with you! |
| 13:42.59 | claymore_ | ... |
| 13:43.13 | claymore_ | speak for yourself :) |
| 13:43.29 | claymore_ | I am withholdin help until i find out why he is wincing. |
| 13:43.38 | starseeker | iandaletter: I did take a look at your translation stuff - thank you for sending it. |
| 13:43.48 | starseeker | is wincing at the idea of a smoothie with a headache |
| 13:44.10 | starseeker | iandaletter: I'm preparing a docbook template to use for commands, which should work regardless of language |
| 13:44.15 | claymore_ | just heat it up in a microwave. |
| 13:44.53 | ``Erik | I, uh, have to walk away before I type something that'll make i leave the channel again :D bbiab |
| 13:45.28 | starseeker | iandaletter: The structure will be one file per command, and we'll set up directories for the various languages ala firebird |
| 13:45.51 | claymore_ | ah.... eye candy: http://www.scifi-meshes.com/gallery/showfull.php?photo=2327 |
| 13:45.53 | starseeker | this lets us generate man pages, html, and pdf from a single source file |
| 13:46.26 | iandaletter | starseeker: have you checked an email? |
| 13:46.34 | starseeker | Yesterday or today? |
| 13:46.40 | iandaletter | then "main" variant |
| 13:46.48 | starseeker | yes, main variant |
| 13:46.54 | iandaletter | well, "my today" |
| 13:46.57 | starseeker | heh |
| 13:47.21 | iandaletter | don't know... when just, the last one |
| 13:47.46 | iandaletter | and a bit more plain formatting than in old mged cmd index, right? |
| 13:48.32 | starseeker | It will be similar to the search example in doc/docbook/system/man1 |
| 13:49.08 | starseeker | I'll put up a template later today |
| 13:50.04 | iandaletter | ok, i'm on it... just finishing another translation, 2nd of 2 |
| 13:50.12 | starseeker | :-) |
| 13:51.11 | starseeker | gears up for the drive in |
| 13:51.41 | iandaletter | i'll se a template - and offer few first commands in it... but can not download files for using docbook file format under openoffice. It will be html with proper formatting at the start... Then i will save it as docbook. |
| 13:53.07 | brlcad | heya mafm |
| 13:53.15 | brlcad | and iandaletter, how goes it? |
| 13:54.40 | ``Erik | nice pic, claymore, what series/movie? 'ikula' is a russian sub designation, foxhound is overloaded :/ |
| 13:55.14 | brlcad | iandaletter: does OO read docbook? |
| 13:55.16 | ``Erik | akula, rather |
| 13:55.44 | iandaletter | brlcad: i've sent an example to starseeker. Next evening i'll have checked the way it must be formatted. Then the main work will have been started. My floss -translation are finished as 190% of whole 200% |
| 13:55.46 | claymore_ | its an original work from a guy named Coolhand who frequents that site. I think he is either russian or has a love of russian military assets since ALL of his projects have Russian designations to them. |
| 13:56.02 | iandaletter | brlcad: don't know yet, will see |
| 13:56.05 | ``Erik | ah, damn impressive |
| 13:56.49 | claymore_ | his designs are my current fav. check out his profile/gallery. lots more where that come from. The detail on those ships.... must have taken months to do. |
| 13:56.52 | ``Erik | I'll have to talk to the dude about cover art when I decide I'm destined to be a great scifi author :D |
| 13:57.59 | claymore_ | lol |
| 13:58.07 | claymore_ | have you made any short stories yet? |
| 13:58.09 | iandaletter | but i like to produce something "in hands"... don't really love computers... only a help to support documentation, and to design something |
| 13:58.16 | ``Erik | hell no, I hate writing |
| 13:58.18 | brlcad | iandaletter: okay, cool -- lemme know because if it can, that'd be pretty useful to set up some default style templates for easy editing |
| 13:58.29 | ``Erik | I haven't even done my accomplishments yet |
| 13:58.29 | iandaletter | ok |
| 13:58.36 | brlcad | iandaletter: working on docs is a huge help, thanks :) |
| 13:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32806 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 4 dirs): |
| 13:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: bot-raw is killed now that bot_dump pretty much replaces its functionality. |
| 13:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: there is some potentially significant differences, though, that should be |
| 13:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: reconciled (bob?) in the output format (like why bot-raw was outputting the |
| 13:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: vertex count but bot_dump does not) |
| 13:58.50 | iandaletter | ok |
| 13:59.21 | claymore_ | lol |
| 14:00.34 | iandaletter | claymore: comics911 at wordpress.com - my doubtful stuff |
| 14:01.09 | ``Erik | I have the kernel of a book on my drive, but it's not really a fiction, it's kinda a physics book from a fictive view... "physics for the interplanetary traveler", goes into newtonian and kepler style physics with a semi-pragmatic mindset |
| 14:01.35 | ``Erik | tongue in cheek comedy style |
| 14:01.37 | claymore_ | So a compendium for Hitchhikers Guide? :) |
| 14:01.48 | ``Erik | yeah, actually, exactly |
| 14:01.54 | claymore_ | nice. |
| 14:02.17 | ``Erik | but I stopped about five years ago |
| 14:02.33 | iandaletter | ``Erik: you write a book... well, i thought about it, too |
| 14:02.33 | claymore_ | Eddie, the flamboyany ships computer.... that had me nearly pissing myself.... lol |
| 14:03.06 | ``Erik | the recent movie that came out really didn't do justice to the books |
| 14:03.26 | iandaletter | about my book... but always remind Zigmund Freid's psychological sublimation... |
| 14:03.48 | claymore_ | haven't seen it yet, kinda don't want to... |
| 14:03.51 | ``Erik | in, uh, 2002, I actually got pulled out of line because I had the hhgg paperback with me, the foil on the cover set off the metal detecter |
| 14:04.10 | iandaletter | ``Erik: can a date of publishing to be some kind of a copyright? |
| 14:04.29 | ``Erik | so I put my held belongings down on a seat and they wanded me for a while, before figuring out it was my book |
| 14:05.01 | ``Erik | amusingly, my dad had a book with him and was using a carbon fiber knife as a bookmark, forgot to take it out... he went through no problem |
| 14:06.04 | ``Erik | iandaletter: us copyright law states that copywrite is implicit, with date of publishing being the official date for the length |
| 14:06.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32807 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: it looks like bot-bldxf outputs a much better dxf than bot_dump, the two should be merged |
| 14:06.31 | ``Erik | was changed to implicit in the 70's I think |
| 14:06.49 | brlcad | ``Erik: was (fix metaball "shelling" issue) fixed? what is that? |
| 14:06.54 | iandaletter | i mean publishing on e.g. livejournal dot com |
| 14:07.22 | brlcad | and "extend metaball control info beyond simple points" (?) |
| 14:07.25 | ``Erik | no, never fixed, um, the primitive inverted weirdly |
| 14:07.39 | ``Erik | nope, I put in teh stubs to do lines, but not the intersect code |
| 14:08.11 | ``Erik | the shelling issue is that ellipsoid where I cut a cube out of it and it looked hollow inside |
| 14:08.49 | ``Erik | I was instructed to ignore it and work on other things :/ |
| 14:08.52 | brlcad | how's that inverted? |
| 14:09.06 | ``Erik | uhhhh, are you in the office? |
| 14:09.15 | brlcad | not yet |
| 14:09.28 | brlcad | after lunch |
| 14:09.36 | ``Erik | ok, on the, uh, web server, in my home dir is a metaballs dir, one of those pics shows the issue |
| 14:09.56 | ``Erik | if I knew what it did what it did, it'd be fixed |
| 14:10.15 | brlcad | I get what you mean by it looking hollow, just not how that equates to inverted |
| 14:10.28 | ``Erik | but the shell thickness is an artifact of the 'step past' value |
| 14:11.21 | ``Erik | probably my ugly stepping algorithm being not quite right, it makes the first intersection, then imagines everything else to be below threshold or something |
| 14:12.06 | iandaletter | i.ve decide to go to sleep |
| 14:12.09 | *** part/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.37) | |
| 14:12.21 | ``Erik | I assumed the water ball test meant it was all keen, I think I made a mistake there |
| 14:13.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32808 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: expand the metaball items a little so I hopefully knows what they be later |
| 14:14.26 | ``Erik | bah, I know what they mean, and no one else cares :D |
| 14:14.42 | ``Erik | I thought I put verbose notes, uh, somewhere |
| 14:16.25 | brlcad | you knowing what they mean doesn't help me (and I care:P) |
| 14:16.52 | ``Erik | well, with the shelling, if you subtract on it, it's not solid inside, it looks like a shell... |
| 14:17.42 | ``Erik | and I was hoping to make lines and triangles valid control surfaces instead of simple points, so like a line could be run down a rotor blade or something |
| 14:18.23 | ``Erik | I think I added an expandable last term to the struct with a second point as an example |
| 14:19.23 | ``Erik | just didn't add the distance logic in the code |
| 14:20.06 | ``Erik | in theory, being able to call any arbitrary geometry a control surface would be gnarly |
| 14:20.43 | ``Erik | but the point strength function would need the ability to compute the distance to the nearest point on that surface |
| 14:20.46 | claymore_ | did you just say 'gnarly' ? |
| 14:20.58 | ``Erik | yes... yes I did... SHUT UP |
| 14:22.07 | claymore_ | hahahaha |
| 14:22.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32811 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/oed/oed.xml: Oops - put the image links for oed back where they should be. This leaves only tire to fix up. |
| 14:22.33 | brlcad | mm, blobify a bot could be an interesting way to heal mesh geometry, close up thin gaps via medial-axis remeshing |
| 14:24.27 | ``Erik | be damn slow without excessive cleverness |
| 14:24.49 | brlcad | healing geometry is a one-stop job usually |
| 14:25.18 | ``Erik | also; the pain of communicating that the right way to use that primitive to s2 is NOT to think of rays was... brutal |
| 14:25.55 | ``Erik | I had to give her the zomfg drop in code twice |
| 14:28.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32813 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: already covered a brief mged intro doc in the docs section below |
| 14:28.31 | ``Erik | I'm out of funding for pushing adrt, but I think I need to keep doing it :/ |
| 14:30.18 | brlcad | so do it |
| 14:30.37 | brlcad | that's like the biggest payoff tool around atm |
| 14:31.25 | brlcad | if it "just worked", it'd be really useful even at slow refresh rates |
| 14:32.24 | ``Erik | yeah, but I get yelled at for working on unfunded shit |
| 14:32.59 | ``Erik | and I need to prove that I did awesome things for it, like, today, actually |
| 14:34.00 | brlcad | making it runnable would be a great way to do that ;) |
| 14:34.07 | ``Erik | heh, it does run |
| 14:34.12 | ``Erik | most of it, anyways O.o |
| 14:34.14 | brlcad | it does? |
| 14:34.20 | ``Erik | has for six months |
| 14:34.24 | ``Erik | I demo'd it to pjt |
| 14:34.37 | ``Erik | without a fbsd cluster, even :D |
| 14:35.06 | brlcad | how do you run it? |
| 14:36.14 | ``Erik | um, you luck out by having a mysql database with the appropriate data, you run adrt_master, then 'adrt_slave localhost', and isst, tell isst all the right info |
| 14:36.32 | ``Erik | cross your fingers, sacrifice a chicken, and mebbe you see a t62 or stryker |
| 14:37.01 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:37.57 | ``Erik | cut view and shotline don't work yet, my next push is to let it grab a .g file and eliminate the mysql thing, then I might tie the rendering engine straight into the isst binary, so the entire network architecture becomes superfluous |
| 14:38.46 | ``Erik | a single 8 core mac pro runs like a fucking champ with insane geometry, I'm thinking the tide has turned against distributed once again |
| 14:39.08 | brlcad | mm, no isst binary |
| 14:39.21 | brlcad | though adrt_* do seem to run without puking |
| 14:39.35 | brlcad | what's it doing if I don't have a db?? |
| 14:39.40 | ``Erik | it's not in the sf repo, some of the names are inappropriate |
| 14:39.59 | ``Erik | adrt_master and adrt_slave will fire up, but once isst sends the load geometry command, it'll vomit |
| 14:40.09 | ``Erik | isst is in svn on the, uh, internal web server |
| 14:40.45 | ``Erik | the only reason I haven't renamed things and made a .po file to unrename is because it uses gtk+ |
| 14:40.46 | brlcad | working on that sounds so much more interesting than ef |
| 14:40.57 | brlcad | needs to stop procrastinating |
| 14:41.12 | ``Erik | is a gtk+ app permissable in the BRL-CAD repo? |
| 14:41.28 | brlcad | god, no |
| 14:41.39 | ``Erik | then there ya go, that's why you don't have isst |
| 14:41.45 | brlcad | i mean separate module, sure |
| 14:41.56 | ``Erik | hrm, *ponder* |
| 14:42.13 | ``Erik | I imagine moving it to libfb/tk would be nice |
| 14:42.28 | brlcad | could even make it use ogre |
| 14:42.30 | ``Erik | lee has argued that it cannot work since tk doesn't update fast enough, but I think he's blowing smoke |
| 14:42.35 | brlcad | that'd probably be just as easy |
| 14:42.46 | brlcad | yeah, that sounds like hogwash |
| 14:43.12 | ``Erik | well, he's in brady mode, jumping up and down going "manta manta manta!" |
| 14:43.21 | brlcad | now I'd believe libfb having some bottleneck in there depending on the buffering mode you go into |
| 14:43.44 | ``Erik | tk's update frequence was the specific thing he zeroed in on |
| 14:44.14 | ``Erik | and if it matters, libfb can be fixed |
| 14:45.06 | brlcad | if they can get this working, tk's not the problem: http://www.eso.org/~archeso/skycat/rtd/rtd.4.html |
| 14:45.27 | ``Erik | when you get in the office, make sure to hack src/adrt/slave/Makefile to have the mysql cflags, libs, and -DHAVE_MYSQL=1 |
| 14:45.41 | brlcad | yeah, the performance in libfb is just silly memcpy'ing and inefficiencies that haven't ever mattered before |
| 14:45.49 | ``Erik | and compile the isst binary with, uh, I think it's -DHAX=1 |
| 14:45.54 | brlcad | doesn't want mysql |
| 14:46.09 | ``Erik | that's the only way the slave nodes can acquire the data at the moment |
| 14:46.25 | ``Erik | twinky gutted the file approach and went all mysql |
| 14:46.26 | brlcad | hell, it'd probably be easier (for me at least) to hook in .g parsing than set up the mysql backend |
| 14:46.43 | ``Erik | it's there, the db is on the amd64 fbsd box |
| 14:46.50 | ``Erik | just hack the makefile and go |
| 14:46.56 | brlcad | oh wow, xslt actually built the docs for me |
| 14:47.35 | ``Erik | making it grok specially prepped .g files is my next big move, though |
| 14:48.26 | ``Erik | with the insane overhead of the tree generation, I'm half wondering if I need to add a 'last modified' field to all nodes :/ |
| 14:49.25 | ``Erik | so I can store the kdtree info in the .g itself, and only regenerate it on change |
| 14:49.54 | brlcad | holdy crapoldy, the doc html generation actually worked too |
| 14:49.57 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 14:50.07 | brlcad | prepped .g files? |
| 14:50.13 | ``Erik | wait, what? cliff did something right? O.o |
| 14:50.15 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:50.39 | ``Erik | yeah, all bot, with a special command to generate the kdtree cache |
| 14:50.44 | claymore_ | be nice! |
| 14:51.16 | brlcad | adding a timestamp attribute to the database would be interesting to test .. our slick low-overhead I/O on .g's might get screwed a little, would need some testing |
| 14:51.48 | brlcad | otherwise, could simply just create some binary hash object that had the prepped kdtree and the hashes for the geometry they correspond to |
| 14:51.50 | ``Erik | hey, cliff went from the land of hovercars that you tell your destination and sit back to the odd world of cranking the engine by hand to get it started... i'm surprised he's adapting to the primitive world so well |
| 14:51.57 | brlcad | then you wouldn't need to change the geometry format |
| 14:52.35 | ``Erik | my fear is that I make an 'all.g |
| 14:53.21 | brlcad | i fear you doing that too |
| 14:53.24 | ``Erik | in ktank, hit the funky buttons to make it all bots, get an all.f or whatever, generate th kdtree cache, move something and regenerate teh kdtree |
| 14:53.52 | brlcad | all.f ? |
| 14:54.14 | ``Erik | but if I don't think to regenerate the kdtree, it's irrelevant and suddenly I'm missing crap that should exist |
| 14:54.18 | ``Erik | yeah, facets |
| 14:54.23 | brlcad | ah |
| 14:54.33 | ``Erik | I've taken to the behavior of calling facetized objects .f |
| 14:54.38 | brlcad | usually does *.bot |
| 14:55.06 | brlcad | looks like a fortran object *shudder* |
| 14:55.28 | ``Erik | just wait until I start commiting geometry with .CBL objects |
| 14:55.55 | brlcad | mm.. combinatorial ballisic lethalities |
| 14:56.07 | ``Erik | sure, if you wanna call cobol that |
| 14:56.08 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:57.44 | brlcad | still, worrying about the kdtree time seems less-than-prioritous before .g's are first working |
| 14:57.56 | ``Erik | uh |
| 14:57.58 | brlcad | let 'em wait |
| 14:58.04 | brlcad | they'll get it |
| 14:58.08 | ``Erik | we're talkin' overnight issues here |
| 14:58.15 | brlcad | he had a fast one too |
| 14:58.19 | ``Erik | like, click the button on a friday, mayb e it's done by monday |
| 14:58.26 | brlcad | his overnight was a pig |
| 14:58.40 | brlcad | and only gave a couple % iirc |
| 14:58.49 | ``Erik | ok, I just remember the stories of the full weekend grind |
| 14:59.15 | brlcad | yeah, he was proud (or amused) at how piggish he'd made it :) |
| 14:59.24 | ``Erik | ktank should be trivial, so my intent is to make it 'just work' with a facet representation |
| 14:59.28 | ``Erik | then move on to the saved cache |
| 15:00.15 | ``Erik | the timestamp idea is just to say when that saved cache is outdated |
| 15:01.00 | brlcad | still wants to hook libtie behind rt_bot_*() and then hook rt_shootray into adrt |
| 15:01.17 | ``Erik | yeah, that'd be a nice end state |
| 15:01.30 | ``Erik | I've talked about doing both those things to various pointy hairs |
| 15:03.04 | ``Erik | my working notion has been that the tree generation would become a net loss if libtie were shoved into rt_bot without either serious isoliation (to eliminate it's utility) or significant modification to the tree generation |
| 15:04.14 | ``Erik | but I've argued long hard and uselessly that things like "time to market is more important than that last 1% of efficiency" |
| 15:06.03 | ``Erik | twingy, sir, you bitch, why didn't ya document this better? not the i++; // increment i crap, but "this is how th enetwork protocol works" :D |
| 15:09.36 | ``Erik | I cannot get this tegan and sarah song out of my head |
| 15:10.52 | claymore_ | put your head through a window or wall... that might help! |
| 15:11.15 | ``Erik | ... ok, *erik smash* hi sandy! :> |
| 15:11.28 | claymore_ | lol jerk! |
| 15:11.34 | ``Erik | yoh, not YOUR window? |
| 15:13.09 | claymore_ | Thats fine, as long as you pay for it. |
| 15:13.51 | ``Erik | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4THv5SYfBo&feature=related |
| 15:19.53 | ``Erik | also; how awesome is this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbJnwk3GBiM |
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| 16:56.07 | claymore_ | lol she is a on person 'Stomp' |
| 16:56.20 | claymore_ | wussed out on the headache... |
| 16:59.22 | PrezKennedy | tegan and sarah? like doctor who? |
| 16:59.43 | PrezKennedy | pokes ``Erik |
| 17:29.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32814 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Modify coedge output. |
| 18:30.15 | mafm | night |
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| 18:54.03 | brlcad | howdy Ralith, andrecastelo |
| 18:54.14 | andrecastelo | howdy brlcad :D |
| 18:54.26 | brlcad | typed any good code lately? :) |
| 18:54.40 | brlcad | code code type type |
| 18:55.09 | brlcad | waits for an export to finish |
| 19:03.46 | claymore_ | whatcha exporting? |
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| 19:10.40 | brlcad | verifying the size of the current repo |
| 19:10.46 | Ralith | hullo brlcad |
| 19:11.20 | starseeker | is probably to blame for most of the size increase... |
| 19:13.11 | brlcad | actually, i'm just on a slow wireless connection at the moment, that's partly to blame |
| 19:13.22 | brlcad | hasn't even gotten to doc yet :) |
| 19:13.30 | starseeker | ew |
| 19:13.38 | starseeker | doesn't care for slow wireless |
| 19:14.00 | Ralith | concurs |
| 19:14.02 | brlcad | it's not anywhere near saturated, so I suspect it may be on sf's end |
| 19:14.08 | Ralith | still, better slow than unstable |
| 19:14.12 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, are the CCB scripts around here somewhere? Ed wants me to learn "the process" |
| 19:14.25 | starseeker | brlcad: sf has been VERY slow of late |
| 19:14.28 | brlcad | sh/tracker.sh |
| 19:14.52 | brlcad | and sh/news2tracker.sh |
| 19:15.05 | brlcad | start with those |
| 19:15.19 | brlcad | since sf unveiled a new design, they may require tweaking |
| 19:15.49 | brlcad | they invariably require little tweaks every few months, it's far from an automated process |
| 19:15.55 | brlcad | but a lot of it is automatic |
| 19:16.43 | brlcad | none of the formatting is automatic at this point (usually takes about a half-hour to format) |
| 19:17.04 | starseeker | ok |
| 19:17.40 | starseeker | winces at how long this will take with sf in its current state |
| 19:18.07 | brlcad | oh, it takes about 10 minutes to run regardless |
| 19:18.15 | brlcad | just due to how it works |
| 19:18.31 | brlcad | it's the only way to get at the actual public data, though |
| 19:18.37 | starseeker | ok |
| 19:18.43 | brlcad | read the headers/docs in those files |
| 19:18.53 | starseeker | wonders if sf could make this easier... |
| 19:19.04 | brlcad | you don't want "everything" usually -- you find the number of days since the last time it was pulled and use that |
| 19:19.18 | brlcad | sf tried, but what they put in place wasn't as good |
| 19:21.04 | starseeker | uh - when was the last time we did a CCB? |
| 19:21.08 | brlcad | fyi, those scripts are entirely "not important" so you shouldn't put any more time into them other than to get them to work with a balance of manual repairs where needed -- they get attention as often as we do the review, no more .. otherwise, it's lost time |
| 19:21.17 | starseeker | hunts through email |
| 19:21.20 | starseeker | k |
| 19:21.59 | brlcad | they're infrastructure scripts, any way hacked forward is a good way, improving as much as is warranted |
| 19:22.16 | starseeker | won't get sucked into them |
| 19:22.23 | brlcad | this next go-round, I was going to fix the html entities |
| 19:22.52 | brlcad | it'll bring in & and other &; entities that are a couple quick regex/sed/perl replaces |
| 19:23.09 | brlcad | you'll see what I mean when you open the report |
| 19:24.05 | brlcad | prepares to caffinate for the long haul tonight |
| 19:24.05 | starseeker | Eeep |
| 19:24.09 | starseeker | june |
| 19:24.22 | brlcad | ~spell caffeinate |
| 19:25.26 | brlcad | there's only been one arl distribution since then so it's reasonable |
| 19:26.02 | starseeker | thinks this script should be accompanied by a giant sucking sound... |
| 19:26.15 | brlcad | which one are you running? |
| 19:26.33 | brlcad | news2tracker is decently quick |
| 19:26.44 | starseeker | the other one |
| 19:26.49 | brlcad | tracker is the gaping hole .. but fun to run in verbose mode |
| 19:26.58 | starseeker | grins :-) |
| 19:27.35 | starseeker | Dunno if you've seen email, Ed sent out an Oct. 9 date |
| 19:28.04 | starseeker | will try and do grunt prep work so brlcad can do more important stuff |
| 19:28.34 | brlcad | it's on my cal |
| 19:32.22 | brlcad | yay, export completed |
| 19:32.45 | brlcad | about 38 minutes, just under 200MB |
| 19:33.02 | brlcad | doc is about 42MB |
| 19:33.13 | starseeker | ow |
| 19:33.28 | brlcad | src is 120, regress is 10, pix 10, db 9 |
| 19:33.40 | brlcad | so not too bad |
| 19:34.03 | starseeker | heh - can't wait til OGRE gets into the main tree :-) |
| 19:34.21 | brlcad | still would be nice to generate all those images, though .. as part of the "compilation" process |
| 19:34.32 | starseeker | nods |
| 19:34.57 | starseeker | some of the Vol II images would probably be pretty tough |
| 19:35.15 | brlcad | ogre probably won't meet up the the 'brlcad' module any time soon -- intentionally keeping a clean separation between the OO layer and the procedural API |
| 19:36.00 | Ralith | starseeker: what for? |
| 19:36.11 | Ralith | (OGRE, that is) |
| 19:36.13 | brlcad | nah, I can't think of any image that can't be generated (at least with a suitable replacement) |
| 19:36.26 | starseeker | Ralith: new GUI work (eventually) |
| 19:36.37 | brlcad | e.g. the truck, use m35 -- the axes, import that axes model |
| 19:36.57 | Ralith | starseeker: so iow you can't wait 'till the new GUI becomes usable? |
| 19:36.57 | starseeker | brlcad: I was thinking more about viewing angles and zoom |
| 19:37.21 | brlcad | the mged screenshots might be tricky, but there may be a way to get tk to dump the drawing context |
| 19:37.29 | starseeker | Ralith: I'm just saying it's a big sucker - we don't NEED to import it for a while |
| 19:38.10 | brlcad | the views don't have to be exact for most of them, tedious sure but doable and not too tricky |
| 19:42.48 | starseeker | brlcad: Um - what criteria is tracker.sh using to pull in items? There are lots of open items here - don't we want only closed ones? |
| 19:45.42 | ``Erik | didn't we do one in spring? |
| 19:45.57 | starseeker | last one was June |
| 19:46.09 | ``Erik | oh, summer I guess |
| 19:46.53 | ``Erik | usually brlcad goes over the closed ones and if we aren't all dead from boredom, starts on the open ones |
| 19:48.05 | ``Erik | darth boss loved the excessive minutae, I think most would prefer just a big hit grind for like 10 minutes, then a real dialogue for the rest |
| 19:49.29 | ``Erik | I imagine claymore would have valuable insight as he's now sat in both rolls :) |
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| 21:33.11 | starseeker | prods CIA-4 |
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| 23:55.30 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03andrecastelo * r32816 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc9/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Removed bot2raw from the project build. |
| 01:02.44 | starseeker | brlcad: what were you worried about with the merging of the NEWS file from the 7.12.6 branch? |
| 01:06.43 | starseeker | nevermind, I see |
| 01:17.46 | Twingy | heh |
| 01:47.01 | brlcad | pokes in |
| 01:47.23 | brlcad | starseeker: there are options to pull only open, only closed, only closed with N days (that's what I usually use) |
| 01:47.33 | brlcad | er, open and closed within N days |
| 01:48.23 | starseeker | OK, so anything that's appeared since the last CCB, and anything that's been closed since then as well? |
| 01:48.24 | brlcad | and yeah, ``Erik is spot on about detail -- they wanted even more than what that report generates (e.g. needs to include the entire discussion log) |
| 01:48.49 | brlcad | anything open (since it's still a prioritization issue) and anything closed since last ccb |
| 01:49.03 | starseeker | ick. OK, anything open |
| 01:49.16 | starseeker | I can pull the discussion logs - it'll take time though |
| 01:49.19 | brlcad | but he's also right in that there's usually nowhere near enough time to go over everything .. it'd take all day to do more than skim |
| 01:49.38 | brlcad | I wouldn't worry about it, I've yet to include them |
| 01:49.50 | brlcad | unless you want to |
| 01:50.13 | starseeker | will see how his patience holds out |
| 01:50.25 | brlcad | it would be a nice touch for someone that cared, but that will take probably an hour to do manually and probably a couple hours to properly script it |
| 01:50.27 | starseeker | What's the color code for formatting |
| 01:50.42 | starseeker | would just pull the highlight discussions |
| 01:50.43 | brlcad | oh, hell, do you have the last one? |
| 01:50.49 | starseeker | somewhere |
| 01:51.02 | brlcad | could use that as a guide -- that was done manually |
| 01:51.16 | starseeker | may not have survived the move - let me see |
| 01:51.34 | starseeker | can make something up, what with new head honcho and all... |
| 01:52.00 | brlcad | i usually highlight the high-priority ones, sort based on artifact type followed by status (closed/open) followed by priority .. or something like that |
| 01:52.20 | brlcad | usually alternating sections formatted so it's easy to read, etc |
| 01:52.29 | brlcad | fitted to A4 |
| 01:52.34 | starseeker | A4? |
| 01:52.42 | brlcad | the big paper |
| 01:52.50 | starseeker | I know - where do we print it around here? |
| 01:52.58 | brlcad | printer has it |
| 01:53.03 | starseeker | huh. OK |
| 01:53.07 | brlcad | photocopier too |
| 01:53.48 | starseeker | brlcad: I doubt I'll get through it tonight, but I'll try to have something ready for you to check by Mon. or Tues. next week |
| 01:54.24 | starseeker | what about the mailing list, if they want discussions? |
| 01:55.05 | brlcad | just as a guide, I've usually spent no more than a couple hours improving the scripts each time and a half hour formatting |
| 01:55.25 | starseeker | scripts actually worked :-) |
| 01:55.31 | brlcad | kinda disgusting to spend more time preparing for the meeting than the meeting itself lasts, so no worries keeping it minimal |
| 01:55.34 | brlcad | great |
| 01:55.47 | brlcad | you see the html entities that need to be replaced? |
| 01:55.54 | starseeker | yeah, I think I got em |
| 01:55.57 | brlcad | they're in the comments |
| 01:55.59 | brlcad | ah, ki |
| 01:56.10 | starseeker | vim global search and replace ftw |
| 01:56.26 | brlcad | don't include the mailing lists (or any of the discussion channels) |
| 01:56.33 | starseeker | right |
| 01:56.38 | brlcad | that's not the ccb's business |
| 01:57.18 | starseeker | is bemused at the thought of the ccb going over an IRC discussion of ``Erik toasting people in forum based space wars |
| 01:58.21 | brlcad | the primary point of the meeting is to simply review what has happened since the last review to 1) see what they might impact users (analysts, modelers, developers), 2) disseminate/share our changes so folks know about them, and 3) give our users a forum to provide feedback/questions/concerns |
| 01:58.57 | brlcad | basically performing a peer review in a semi-open forum |
| 01:59.14 | starseeker | brlcad: heh. OK. I made the mistake of reading that CCB document Ed has defining the purpose of the CCB |
| 01:59.47 | brlcad | there has been argument over that in the past, it's not actually right |
| 02:00.05 | brlcad | it started modeled after a different code that has an entirely different process |
| 02:00.23 | brlcad | orca's document is actually closer |
| 02:00.33 | brlcad | we need to formally publish an updated version that is correct |
| 02:01.04 | brlcad | which basically amounts to the HACKING file with details about how things pertain to ARL |
| 02:01.52 | brlcad | the controlling authority and "change approval" as presently worded is bogus |
| 02:01.59 | starseeker | I think Ed would feel better if we had a new one :-) |
| 02:05.00 | brlcad | the biggest issue is that it's all overhead (a negative time sink) that could literally take months of time away from development if not careful |
| 02:05.08 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:05.10 | brlcad | it's like the scripts -- they could easily turn into a nice/fancy tool |
| 02:05.24 | brlcad | but ultimately, they're a negative on development .. even from a communication perspective |
| 02:05.43 | starseeker | I'll be very interested to see how the new boss works at the CCB - it should be instructive |
| 02:06.38 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 02:06.55 | brlcad | she'll want to emphasize how to better get the word out |
| 02:07.13 | brlcad | since arl users often don't pay attention to what we say, don't know what we do |
| 02:07.32 | starseeker | I think there'll be questions about how we set our priorities too |
| 02:07.37 | brlcad | it's a mild chicken n' egg problem |
| 02:08.25 | starseeker | favors hauling them into the library's meeting hall and showing off :-P |
| 02:09.04 | brlcad | I did that one year |
| 02:09.09 | yukonbob | waves in: "Hello, cadheads" |
| 02:09.18 | starseeker | waste of time? |
| 02:09.20 | brlcad | a couple dozen showed up, somewhat waste of time |
| 02:09.22 | starseeker | waves back |
| 02:09.27 | starseeker | nuts |
| 02:09.54 | brlcad | and took a fair bit of time to prepare, negative time sink |
| 02:10.12 | brlcad | the real goal from our perspective is like most open source projects -- the demand is WAY higher than capacity |
| 02:10.25 | brlcad | it's all vaporware and talk until a product is actually *released* |
| 02:11.01 | starseeker | nods. I would place a $10 bet that some open source education will be needed |
| 02:11.14 | brlcad | so that really is our best communication means -- getting the features out there sooner, fast/faster frequent iterations, make noise accordingly |
| 02:11.44 | brlcad | not getting everyone's buy-in on what we're going to do beforehand, not micromanaging how we do what we do |
| 02:12.03 | starseeker | Dwayne came by just today and mentioned some guys at LLNL (I think it was LLNL) were interested in building models with BRL-CAD |
| 02:12.21 | brlcad | we talk plenty (here, on forums, on mailing list, in person) -- it's more about actually "getting things done" |
| 02:12.39 | starseeker | absolutely |
| 02:12.57 | starseeker | he was gonna send them tire.exe :-) |
| 02:13.05 | brlcad | cool |
| 02:13.20 | starseeker | forgot we don't have an exe on sourceforge that has tire |
| 02:13.38 | brlcad | is it hooked into the windows build? |
| 02:13.56 | starseeker | It is now - that's actually a news item somewhere |
| 02:14.06 | starseeker | Bob hooked in all the proc-db stuff, IIRC |
| 02:14.18 | brlcad | ah, right |
| 02:28.52 | starseeker | brlcad: How do you sort this sucker? By date of closure, then date opened for still open ones? keep the NEWS items in the front for a quick overview? |
| 02:29.57 | brlcad | points up |
| 02:30.28 | brlcad | 21:55 <@brlcad> i usually highlight the high-priority ones, sort based on artifact type followed by status (closed/open) followed by priority .. or something like that |
| 02:30.31 | brlcad | 21:56 <@brlcad> usually alternating sections formatted so it's easy to read, etc |
| 02:30.37 | starseeker | what's "artifact type" mean? |
| 02:30.53 | brlcad | the type of line it is |
| 02:30.53 | starseeker | slaps self with wet noodle for not reading log |
| 02:31.09 | brlcad | NEWS, bug, feature request, patch, etc |
| 02:31.15 | starseeker | Gotcha |
| 02:31.19 | brlcad | there's a couple tricks to get it sorted neatly |
| 02:31.28 | brlcad | want news first |
| 02:31.36 | starseeker | sub-section column based sorting? |
| 02:31.52 | brlcad | i think descending on that column actually conveniently works out iirc |
| 02:32.04 | starseeker | Cool. |
| 02:32.07 | brlcad | no, the sorts work out globally |
| 02:32.23 | brlcad | you apply one rule-based filter set with two or three sort rules |
| 02:32.51 | brlcad | might have used "category, priority, status" last time |
| 02:33.18 | brlcad | careful to use the tracker ID number -- it shows up initially as a string |
| 02:33.37 | brlcad | I usually select the columns and set their data type where it matters |
| 02:33.55 | brlcad | so the dates are dates and not strings, so they sort properly |
| 02:33.59 | starseeker | Ah. |
| 02:34.12 | brlcad | (if you wanted to sort by date, of course) |
| 02:34.25 | brlcad | I forget exactly which sorting works out best |
| 02:34.48 | starseeker | will figure it out |
| 02:35.13 | starseeker | wonders if we can get Ed to "run the show"... |
| 02:35.20 | brlcad | the point, though it to put the stuff done most recent first, and then go back in time .. emphasizing news then patches then closed bugs/feature requests/support, then everything else |
| 02:35.47 | brlcad | nah, I'll probably still do it |
| 02:36.07 | brlcad | ed doesn't know what the items are, needs to be a dev that can talk to most of the items |
| 02:36.15 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:36.33 | starseeker | is sorry he can't spare brlcad having so much time eaten up... |
| 02:36.36 | brlcad | the information is incomplete, hard enough to remember what some of them are in the moment |
| 02:36.56 | brlcad | it's a fixed point cost so long as we don't promise to do more than absolutely necessary |
| 02:37.00 | brlcad | couple times a year is fine |
| 02:37.19 | starseeker | erm - should I take out the patches to rt^3 stuff? |
| 02:37.22 | brlcad | it's if we get signed up for it to be an even bigger negative time sync |
| 02:37.37 | brlcad | were they tracker items? |
| 02:37.44 | starseeker | yeah |
| 02:37.46 | brlcad | sure |
| 02:38.05 | brlcad | it's a talking point showing open source contributions |
| 02:38.15 | starseeker | so leave em in? |
| 02:38.23 | brlcad | yeah |
| 02:38.28 | starseeker | cool |
| 02:39.08 | brlcad | in the past, I've actually gone over each item and labelled whether they are an "open source contribution" or not .. but that does usually take another hour or so |
| 02:39.24 | brlcad | I'd only do that if we run into a problem |
| 02:40.39 | brlcad | requires a bit of pontificating on the news items as to whether the change was done "on the clock" or off it for those of us that dip into the open source hobby time |
| 02:40.50 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:41.06 | starseeker | rather not dig into that one, personally - gets too confusing :-) |
| 02:41.32 | *** join/#brlcad zolcos (n=zolcos@aeheathe.resnet.mtu.edu) | |
| 02:43.05 | brlcad | yeah, it's only if the bean counters need (or strongly want) the beans .. and it'll actually pay off and not just be a counting exercise |
| 02:43.25 | brlcad | with W, it actually helped get the point across and the numbers still help to this day |
| 02:43.36 | brlcad | I just pulled stats for her last week, though the entire past year |
| 02:43.39 | brlcad | very interesting |
| 02:43.49 | starseeker | heh |
| 02:44.00 | starseeker | you mean your personal on/off clock? |
| 02:44.04 | brlcad | going to send a news announcement out, but basically about 6 staff years of contributed time this past year |
| 02:44.11 | starseeker | wow |
| 02:44.23 | brlcad | level of open source contributions is the meter usually, as well as overall activity |
| 02:45.04 | brlcad | 70 distinct "features" contributed as open source |
| 02:45.13 | brlcad | (out of about 175 total) |
| 02:45.26 | brlcad | 280 mailing lists posts :) |
| 02:45.39 | brlcad | (not including brlcad-commits or brlcad-tracker) |
| 02:45.46 | starseeker | surprised W is still tracking the numbers |
| 02:46.18 | brlcad | about 220,000 measured downloads, which is an increase of 20% over last y ear |
| 02:46.27 | starseeker | eeep |
| 02:47.20 | brlcad | the one negative mark, though .. our average age of a tracker item increased from 484 days to 517 days by the end of the year (turn-around time) |
| 02:47.34 | brlcad | which means there are still more support requests coming in than are being handled |
| 02:48.03 | starseeker | must work faster |
| 02:48.08 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:48.15 | brlcad | cracks a whip on richard |
| 02:49.25 | brlcad | interestingly, 110 new tracker items (bugs, patches, support, feature requests) came in and 128 were closed |
| 02:50.23 | brlcad | 28/18 for open/closed on feature requests; 7/9 for support; 28/26 for patches; and 46/75 for bugs |
| 02:50.36 | brlcad | the first is bad, the last is great |
| 02:51.05 | starseeker | to be fair, some of those feature requests are virtually meta-feature requests |
| 02:52.27 | brlcad | that contributed manpower estimate is the most impressive -- it's not far from being on par with arl funding capacity, probably will exceed it as the community continues to grow |
| 02:53.23 | starseeker | that's a pretty compelling stat |
| 02:53.28 | brlcad | gives it two years .. right about the time that the new interface is ready for production use to replace mged |
| 02:56.05 | brlcad | thinks the portage ebuild needs a kick |
| 02:56.22 | starseeker | needs a friggin sledgehammer |
| 02:56.44 | brlcad | someone just posted an mged failure to find tk .. probably just a build setting |
| 02:58.34 | starseeker | is sure he'll probably have to manually insert a few items into this thing before the CCB - but it's nice to have it more or less "ready to go" ahead of time |
| 02:59.07 | starseeker | is still convinced the only way to get a proper BRL-CAD ebuild into portage is to become a gentoo dev |
| 02:59.39 | brlcad | the important one to review are the comments/description on the news items since that's where the time is focused |
| 03:00.09 | brlcad | usually have to add a few commments, say how it relates to arl if it specifically impacts |
| 03:00.35 | starseeker | nods |
| 03:02.22 | zolcos | Hello. I'm with the acoustic project, I have a question-- |
| 03:02.43 | zolcos | the team has discovered how to fire rays, calculate distances, attenuation, and so on, but when we go to add the first usable feature (that is, point query), what interface options do we have? |
| 03:02.51 | brlcad | howdy zolcos |
| 03:03.22 | brlcad | zolcos: you mean for displaying results of a calculation? |
| 03:03.49 | zolcos | Yes, and for initiating a calculation. |
| 03:03.52 | brlcad | what sort of data/interface are you wanting to present? |
| 03:04.37 | zolcos | The point query would just take in a x,y,z and output a single decibel level |
| 03:04.43 | starseeker | yick - 28 pages |
| 03:04.48 | brlcad | initiating a calculation sounds like just a command, button, or menu item |
| 03:07.35 | zolcos | That sounds right. How can I add new commands? |
| 03:07.52 | Ralith | zolcos: acoustic project? |
| 03:07.54 | brlcad | zolcos: if you want the user to interact with a 3D interface, you can hook into mged pretty easily -- our "nirt" command does almost exactly what it sounds like you're doing where (in mged) the user can either type "nirt" on the command line to get a queried result based on the view center, or they can click in the 3D view and get an interactive query along that ray |
| 03:09.14 | brlcad | zolcos: you can either hook in at compile-time (via C, which could let you embed practically any other scripting layer) or at run-time (via tcl, just a text file that is loaded) |
| 03:09.28 | brlcad | the simplest/fastest is going to be the latter |
| 03:09.37 | brlcad | the prior has a lot more power and integration options |
| 03:10.02 | Ralith | brlcad: might not be the simplest/fastest if they're not familiar with tcl and/or have to hook it into some existing codebase |
| 03:10.35 | brlcad | well yes, tcl knowledge is a prerequisite for the latter, though tcl scripting is pretty trivial -- sorta like php |
| 03:11.03 | brlcad | and you could even write a simple tcl proc that loads a compiled tcl extension (written in compiled language of choice) |
| 03:12.47 | starseeker | brlcad: OK, think I got it |
| 03:13.15 | starseeker | (sans going through news comments) |
| 03:13.27 | brlcad | for what you guys are doing, since you have a C proggie that hooks into the brl-cad libs, I'd think a tcl proc would be the way to go and just have it exec your binary as a command-line command |
| 03:13.50 | starseeker | heads home - I'll probably have to leave sometime around 3pm tomorrow brlcad, just fyi |
| 03:15.00 | zolcos | I'm not sure I follow -- we don't actually have any code written yet, so our options are still completely open |
| 03:16.37 | Ralith | zolcos: brlcad has described options for adding your functionality to the mged interface |
| 03:19.20 | brlcad | zolcos: then what did you mean when you said you figured out how to fire rays, calculate distances, etc? :) |
| 03:20.34 | brlcad | you can actually script brl-cad in pretty much any language by exec'ing nirt or one of the other tracers to query rays |
| 03:21.02 | zolcos | Ah, that. We do have testing code and assorted functionality -- I thought you were saying we had an existing calculation module ready lol |
| 03:21.03 | brlcad | (or write your own tracer that hooks into our librt library) |
| 03:21.22 | brlcad | okay, so you do hook into librt and call rt_shootray() somewhere :) |
| 05:27.45 | *** join/#brlcad dtidrow (n=dtidrow@12.162.247.10) | |
| 05:50.36 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-89-140.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:10.21 | brlcad | awesome: http://www.google.com/search2001/search?hl=en&q=brl-cad&btnG=Google+Search |
| 06:12.03 | brlcad | http://web.archive.org/web/20010903134532/www.ornl.gov/etd/fha/.index.html |
| 06:14.26 | brlcad | http://web.archive.org/web/20010506080305/www.aro.ncren.net/mcsc/redbook/manocha.htm |
| 06:14.49 | brlcad | and the best find of all.. |
| 06:15.20 | brlcad | carl's original AnimMate tutorial .. since lost to the bits of time (thusfar, or at least until now) |
| 06:15.26 | brlcad | snarfs and saves |
| 06:21.30 | brlcad | wow, includes manpages for three mged commands .. starseeker, you didn't write the first one (search) after all! :-) |
| 07:03.42 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:19.14 | Ralith | brlcad: did BOOLE get intergrated? |
| 07:52.09 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:35.47 | claymore_ | yawns & digs in to a bowl of apple jacks. |
| 08:36.31 | claymore_ | Just spent 30 minutes reading everything that happened in irc since I logged for the night. Busy eh? |
| 08:36.41 | claymore_ | brlcad: Still up and working? |
| 08:59.28 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 09:00.17 | mafm | hi |
| 09:37.12 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 09:45.58 | *** join/#brlcad andrecastelo__ (n=chatzill@189.71.52.22) | |
| 10:55.06 | claymore_ | hi mafm! |
| 11:00.35 | *** join/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 11:01.46 | iandaletter | starseeker: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/books/tutorial_series/ ....xml which file? I has somehow forgot it... |
| 11:17.26 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:25.20 | claymore_ | erik: You gonna be in today are you still feeling bum? |
| 14:22.54 | claymore_ | Guess not eh? :) |
| 14:37.27 | *** join/#brlcad clock__ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 15:22.46 | *** join/#brlcad naroth (n=naroth@stoker.csl.mtu.edu) | |
| 15:23.49 | naroth | hi everyone, I'm looking for some reference material for using ray-tracing. Does anyone have some links that would be useful? |
| 15:31.39 | iandaletter | naroth: ray-tracing in general? Could be www.blender.org - their manuals |
| 15:32.22 | iandaletter | ``Erik: create sm |
| 15:33.20 | naroth | well I was referring to using the BRL CAD ray tracing functions. I have the source downloaded but now I'm just looking for something that will give me an idea on how to use the rt library. |
| 15:33.45 | iandaletter | i can not advice something |
| 15:35.11 | iandaletter | ``Erik: create banana smoothie with apples and parsley, totaling in half-a-gallon. Or you will jump as a goat, or you will be a scapegoat at your disease. Your choice. |
| 15:35.54 | iandaletter | ``Erik: http://www.sunfoodpages.com/forum/ultimatebb.php |
| 15:40.30 | starseeker | iandaletter: Do you have a sourceforge account? |
| 15:41.06 | starseeker | Probably the best way to handle translations is to go ahead and commit them to the repository |
| 15:41.19 | iandaletter | starseeker: no, because i pay us $ for 10 mb aday, 5 mb at night. web-serfing is... not really for me |
| 15:41.34 | iandaletter | starseeker: ? |
| 15:42.06 | starseeker | Um. Sourceforge is where BRL-CAD's main repository is stored and we use subversion to make updates to it |
| 15:42.17 | iandaletter | what is a link to that .xml file? /doc/docbook/... ? I has forgot it |
| 15:42.20 | starseeker | you can get a sourceforge account free |
| 15:42.33 | iandaletter | let me send updates to you... at least at start of all |
| 15:43.17 | starseeker | oh, um... - this is a good example xml file: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/search.xml?view=log |
| 15:43.35 | starseeker | iandaletter: Ok, if you'd prefer to send them to me that's great |
| 15:43.36 | iandaletter | i know, but in internet, i'm usually in IRC... Later, when the market will be able to offer it, i will have bought probably 3G-modem... |
| 15:44.13 | iandaletter | ok, i will see the example soon at after my midnight |
| 15:44.59 | starseeker | iandaletter: That file is pretty much the style we're going to use for all commands, one file per command - if you'd prefer to just translate existing pages that's OK too, I can sort it out |
| 15:45.28 | iandaletter | will see... |
| 15:45.29 | starseeker | iandaletter: You don't HAVE to have every section that search has, search is pretty extensive |
| 15:45.53 | starseeker | iandaletter: Thank you for your interest in working on this |
| 15:46.13 | *** part/#brlcad naroth (n=naroth@stoker.csl.mtu.edu) | |
| 15:47.32 | iandaletter | starseeker: i actually wanted a chance to be in "they have somehow helped" section of the book of BRL-CAD - i.e. wanted to show it to my 'employer'. but nevermind |
| 15:48.31 | starseeker | iandaletter: why nevermind? You're definitely going to be contributing |
| 15:49.01 | starseeker | individual docbook files are built up into larger books |
| 15:50.01 | iandaletter | ok, later we will have a time for different "proposals", "benefits", "fame", "girls", dirt money, big money, cars and so on... |
| 15:51.15 | starseeker | brlcad handles the management of the credit sections (like AUTHORS file here http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS?view=log) and he keeps track of who is doing work - he will not miss your efforts |
| 15:51.33 | iandaletter | ok! |
| 15:52.57 | starseeker | once we start getting them integrated into BRL-CAD proper, of course :-) |
| 15:54.06 | starseeker | decides not eating one meal was a mistake, and not eating two would be a worse mistake... |
| 15:55.06 | iandaletter | i don't really know much about it yet, i mean about the world of open source... night builds and so on... Don't have cheap internet connection... But i will probably have it soon... even thru mobile cell phone. |
| 15:55.35 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.202.217) | |
| 15:56.20 | iandaletter | starseeker: eat sauerkraut with steamed potato. And drink cognac, or some beer. but don't become an alcohol-addicted. ;) |
| 15:56.58 | starseeker | actually doesn't drink - his brain malfunctions enough without any help |
| 15:57.08 | starseeker | ok, lunch |
| 15:57.15 | *** join/#brlcad docelic_ (n=docelic@78.134.202.217) | |
| 15:57.39 | iandaletter | ok, almost midnight |
| 15:58.00 | iandaletter | the world and mother earth is wonderful |
| 16:03.47 | docelic | morn' |
| 16:10.40 | brlcad | aw, no ralith |
| 16:11.22 | brlcad | iandaletter: sending folks that come looking for ray-tracing to another ray-tracer when we do ray-tracing doesn't exactly help :) |
| 16:12.08 | iandaletter | ok :-X |
| 16:14.14 | brlcad | working on the docs definitely helps though ;) |
| 16:14.26 | brlcad | howdy docelic |
| 16:26.32 | iandaletter | docelic: at least you, listen to me: you need to be raw vegan, you must like smoothies and nuts and salads and probably milk, but it disagrees with www.peta.org |
| 16:27.42 | docelic | seems youre outta luck today, pal |
| 16:29.02 | iandaletter | no, i'm ok - even advise it sometimes. Fell comfortable and young. don't sweat. do sport. (I do) |
| 16:29.37 | iandaletter | actually, it's too much of typing today - and i feel myself crazy! |
| 17:48.13 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-79-20.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:13.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32817 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Mods to fix output of binary stl. Minor cleanup. |
| 18:17.00 | louipc | we can get fame, girls, and big money from contributing to open source? since when? |
| 18:26.34 | brlcad | 'bout '98 |
| 18:28.40 | iandaletter | battery ends |
| 18:28.43 | *** part/#brlcad iandaletter (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 18:42.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32818 10/brlcad/trunk/ (92 files in 23 dirs): Shift English docs into en subdirectories in preparation for multi-lingual documentation. |
| 18:48.26 | ``Erik | wait, what? I've been doing it for a long time, do you have to fill out a form to get the fame, girls and big money? |
| 19:04.05 | claymore_ | erik: howya feelin? |
| 19:04.10 | ``Erik | surviving :D |
| 19:05.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32820 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Added -u option for units and removed the -i option. |
| 19:08.47 | mafm | goes to try to cure his half-flu to home |
| 19:08.50 | mafm | take care |
| 22:21.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32821 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/README: update notes on docbook |
| 22:38.37 | starseeker | ah, nuts - forgot that pdf generation needs to know where the images are from the xml. OK, need to restructure install paths too and change the image links. (grumble...) |
| 22:39.11 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=Ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
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| 02:05.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32822 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (35 files in 11 dirs): Update image links and html install paths to allow both pdf and html to work again. |
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| 06:22.26 | brlcad | waves |
| 06:27.06 | Ralith | waves |
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| 11:08.02 | claymore_ | So brlcad, did you make it asleep before your second wind kicked in? |
| 12:26.14 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32823 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Modified to accept optional bot objects. If provided, dump only the specified bots. |
| 12:45.32 | brlcad | sorta, woke up after just a couple hours |
| 14:38.57 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 16:12.55 | brlcad | wonders if claymore knows he's running irssi three times |
| 16:28.47 | *** join/#brlcad claymore (n=claymore@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:06.52 | ``Erik | heh, screen is hard :D |
| 17:21.40 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14D92C.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:27.13 | brlcad | interestingly, he's only running screen once, so he must be running it in multiple windows |
| 17:35.18 | starseeker | maybe he's got one screen per channel, rather than using multiple windows in irssi? |
| 17:35.27 | starseeker | er one irssi per channel? |
| 17:35.38 | brlcad | dunno, that'd be odd |
| 17:36.42 | ``Erik | or mebbe he's on 3 different networks |
| 17:37.10 | ``Erik | ae has its own irc server, and his cybermistress is probably on dullnet or something ;) *duck* |
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| 18:12.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32824 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (pcSolver.h pcVariable.h solver_test.cpp): code cleanup; still figuring out why domain space iteration using atCriticalBelow fails if initial value is at the boundary |
| 18:21.43 | brlcad | irssi handles multiple simultaneous networks just fine |
| 18:39.41 | ``Erik | yeah, but he may not be familiar with the mechanisms |
| 18:57.17 | brlcad | woot, madant update |
| 19:09.23 | ``Erik | "madant"? |
| 19:11.17 | brlcad | ~seen madant |
| 19:11.20 | ibot | madant <n=d@117.196.137.142> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 50d 19h 24m 14s ago, saying: 'ok done. i didnt even realise i had modified pc.h . I thought i was working in libpc directory only. usually i always commit from the root folder.. grr.. my bad :D'. |
| 19:11.35 | brlcad | fyi, I just booked a room at the Domain |
| 19:11.42 | brlcad | ~seen homovulgaris |
| 19:11.43 | ibot | homovulgaris <n=d@117.196.131.215> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 53d 15h 19m 12s ago, saying: 'sean, on a scale of 1 to 10 how much trouble would one face when trying to make a .deb package for brlcad ?'. |
| 19:12.05 | ``Erik | coo' |
| 19:12.41 | ``Erik | didn't recall seeing him as madant |
| 19:13.09 | brlcad | would have gotten wild palms, but I ain't spooning and you probably don't want to sleep on a rollout :) |
| 19:14.10 | ``Erik | meh, coulda just dumped you in the bathtub *shrug* |
| 19:17.21 | brlcad | set it up to check in friday, check out monday |
| 19:18.36 | ``Erik | aight, I'll bug ya about that when bc is in office to get my paperwork set up |
| 19:29.55 | brlcad | ``Erik: would you rather arrive a day earlier or stay later or do you not care? |
| 19:30.23 | brlcad | wouldn't mind taking another day off work to relax while out there |
| 19:31.54 | ``Erik | doesn't matter to me, they're only paying for 2 nights, right? what's cost per night? |
| 19:32.18 | brlcad | 109 |
| 19:32.31 | ``Erik | that's not bad for silly valley |
| 19:32.48 | ``Erik | last time I was down there, I think it was three hundred and something |
| 19:36.00 | ``Erik | starseeker, asdf wrapped package, I have a (let inside a function, when I try to use the variable, it complains that package:variable isn't around, is there some magic fu I'm missing? O.o |
| 19:36.26 | brlcad | would be another day to relax, recover from flight, not be at work, get some coding done, etc |
| 19:45.10 | brlcad | ``Erik: aiight, arriving thursday now then too, cool? |
| 19:57.30 | *** join/#brlcad berndj (n=berndj@41.4.231.109) | |
| 20:42.27 | brlcad | hello berndj |
| 20:44.04 | brlcad | howdy poolio |
| 20:44.06 | brlcad | :) |
| 20:46.45 | ``Erik | sure *shrug* |
| 20:55.23 | brlcad | aiight |
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| 21:45.49 | poolio | brlcad: howdy :) |
| 21:45.51 | poolio | brlcad: how goes it? |
| 21:46.09 | *** join/#brlcad ```Erik (n=erik@66-111-42-110.static.sagonet.net) | |
| 21:46.13 | ```Erik | o.O |
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| 01:59.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32825 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/bspline/bspline.c: |
| 01:59.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: rt_nurb_plot() calls rt_nurb_s_refine() with a "refined" knot vector. However, |
| 01:59.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: if the refined knot vector is smaller than the original knot vector, the oslo |
| 01:59.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: calculation will fail. This modification checks for that condition, and does |
| 01:59.09 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: not call rt_nurb_s_refine() in that situation. |
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| 17:48.28 | tony-h | Hello. I'm looking at the Tcl code for mged... how can I add a new command that the command-line will recognize? |
| 18:27.42 | brlcad | tony-h: you can just create a new tcl proc |
| 18:28.28 | brlcad | tony-h: you can register a C function as a tcl command as well for compile-time additions |
| 18:30.01 | brlcad | if you just want something scripted and quick to iterate on as a tcl script, you can just write up a proc, put it in a file, and source that file within mged and it'll be available -- you can get auto-sourcing by adding the source to any of mged's tclscript dirs and rebuilding the tclIndex for that directory |
| 18:30.50 | tony-h | Ah. That sounds like what I was trying to do, but how do I rebuild the tclIndex? |
| 18:31.04 | brlcad | if you're making a proper patch/contribution/enhancement that'll get committed to svn, that'll all happens fairly automatically |
| 18:34.04 | brlcad | the easiest way to rebuild the index if you built/installed brl-cad yourself is to put your file into src/tclscripts/mged, add it to src/tclscripts/mged/Makefile.am, mv tclIndex tclIndex.backup, make, make install |
| 18:34.36 | brlcad | OR .. just edit the tclIndex file directly where brl-cad is installed with a line to source your script |
| 18:35.56 | brlcad | something like "set auto_index(test) [list source [file join / path to your test.tcl]]" .. if you had a proc named 'test' in a /path/to/your/test.tcl directory |
| 18:36.37 | brlcad | make sense? |
| 18:37.12 | brlcad | it's usually much easier to just "source test.tcl" while you're developing the proc, resourcing after each edit |
| 18:40.33 | tony-h | Sounds simple enough. I'm not familiar with what 'source' does though |
| 18:40.54 | brlcad | it just loads the file |
| 18:41.43 | brlcad | tcl is a rather pure command interpreter -- sourcing a file in is no different than if you typed that in on the command prompt |
| 18:41.58 | brlcad | creating a new command in tcl is very trivial, example: |
| 18:42.05 | brlcad | proc howdy {} { |
| 18:42.09 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:42.10 | brlcad | } |
| 18:42.19 | brlcad | now you have a new command |
| 18:44.15 | brlcad | src/tclscripts/mged/get_regions.tcl has a fairly simple example of a "get_regions" command that searches geometry objects of a particular type (regions) by recursively walking the geometry hierarchy |
| 18:44.54 | tony-h | Okay. So if I take the file with my new command in it, and add it to src/tclscripts/mged/Makefile.am and run make again, it will be an available command in mged? |
| 18:46.06 | brlcad | you'll have to move/remove the tclIndex in that directory, make, and make install, butyes |
| 18:46.59 | brlcad | src/tclscripts/mged/remat.tcl is a "remat" command that uses "get_regions" to set a material property on a set of objects (as just another example) |
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| 18:47.17 | brlcad | howdy jjsimon-mtu |
| 18:47.23 | jjsimon-mtu | hello |
| 18:49.35 | tony-h | jjsimon and myself are in the lab right now working on the acoustic project |
| 18:49.49 | brlcad | presumed as much ;) |
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| 19:19.29 | naroth | Hi, I'm looking to include a new .c file into the make process for brlcad. Where in the makefile should I be making changes? |
| 19:21.37 | tony-h | naroth is making the raytrace program that gets called by our tcl script |
| 19:21.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32826 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 19:21.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: john fixed a bug in the bspline/nurbs surface where plot would fail. the |
| 19:21.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: problem as he tracked it down was that the Oslo calculation was failing because |
| 19:21.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: the refinement knot vector was smaller than the original knot vector. this was |
| 19:21.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: a condition not being tested for, causing a crash. now it correctly halts |
| 19:21.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: refinement. |
| 19:25.30 | brlcad | naroth: you would do that by adding it to the mged_SOURCES directive in src/mged/Makefile.am |
| 19:26.13 | naroth | thanks, I'll look around there for a bit then |
| 19:34.38 | naroth | are new files that I create and want to make with the rest of the program supposed to have a main function? |
| 19:39.33 | tony-h | make is giving him an error for multiple definitions of main, but the example rt_example.c has one. |
| 19:44.36 | brlcad | it depends what you're compiling |
| 19:45.09 | jjsimon-mtu | he pretty much copied rtexample.c, changed a few lines, and wants to build it now |
| 19:45.22 | brlcad | if you're wanting to add a new application to the build system, it has to be listed under a PROGRAMS line and have a SOURCES variable for just that application |
| 19:45.49 | brlcad | ah, then you should replicate what rtexample.c has in src/rt/Makefile.am in src/rt |
| 19:47.06 | brlcad | i.e. list your 'yourapp' application under bin_PROGRAMS, then have a yourapp_SOURCES declaration |
| 19:48.50 | jjsimon-mtu | ok, thanks we're trying that now |
| 19:58.06 | jjsimon-mtu | so do we change lines in /src/rt/Makefile.am or /src/mged/Makefile.am? In other words, which file do we add 'yourapp' to the bin_PROGRAMS and yourapp_SOURCES lines? |
| 20:02.16 | brlcad | you can add it whereever you want really |
| 20:02.45 | brlcad | just affects where/when it gets compiled in the build tree |
| 20:04.14 | naroth | looks like make worked, running make install now. Thanks for help |
| 20:05.57 | brlcad | this does a decent job at explaining a standard gnu build system setup: http://www.seul.org/docs/autotut/ |
| 20:06.15 | brlcad | particularly relevant, the 5. Write a Makefile.am section |
| 20:18.07 | *** part/#brlcad naroth (n=naroth@dumbo.csl.mtu.edu) | |
| 20:26.52 | tony-h | I'm looking at the way a tcl script invokes a C binary. I think understand the form -- set result [catch { exec $cmd $x $y } error] -- but when result is inspected, it looks like all that you get back is a return code. How do you get more information from the binary command? Is there a way to grab its standard-out? |
| 20:50.44 | ``Erik | http://www.freakingnews.com/Inverted-Celebrities-Pictures--1754-0.asp o.O |
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| 23:39.23 | brlcad | tony-h: puts $error |
| 23:39.55 | brlcad | when you catch an exec, the output goes to the variable |
| 23:40.41 | brlcad | (stderr and stdout) |
| 23:47.00 | tony-h | Oh! The reference material I was looking at made it sound like catch only collected stderr. I was starting to think I would have to deal with file redirection >_> |
| 23:52.59 | brlcad | fyi, bu_log() outputs to stderr |
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| 03:16.13 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32827 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am objdir.h): removed unused objdir.h header |
| 03:44.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32828 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.h: need dg.h for struct dg_obj |
| 03:45.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32829 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (chgview.c mged_dm.h): get rid of MINVIEW define, use RT_MINVIEWSIZE |
| 03:57.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32830 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.h edsol.c mged.h): get rid of more unnecessary and unused crap. begone MGED_EXTERN too. |
| 03:59.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32831 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: don't need use BU_EXTERN for local decls |
| 04:01.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32832 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (mged.c mged.h): 'identity' matrix is no longer used. the cool kids are all using bn_mat_identity. |
| 04:06.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32833 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.h: more unused begonnage |
| 04:15.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32834 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/utility1.c: stray identity |
| 04:22.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32835 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/utility1.c: quell constness warnings |
| 04:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32836 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am hideline.c mged_dm.h): |
| 04:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: enable compilation of the former 'hideline' functionality and f_hideline |
| 04:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: callback for an 'H' command. it's not clear to me just quite yet what exactly |
| 04:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: this even does as it's untested, but it is at least no longer 'dead' code. |
| 04:26.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: cursory review seems to be that it's shooting rays for all vlist segments |
| 04:26.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: producing some sort of plot file as a result. |
| 04:30.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32837 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/hideline.c: quell warnings |
| 04:34.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32838 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged_dm.h: clean up alignment, remove PI |
| 04:37.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32839 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am editobjGui.h): remove editobjGui.h .. it doesn't seem to be used anywhere |
| 04:39.50 | brlcad | starseeker: hm, in src/mged there is actually already a simple html display setup that was started (but obviously never finished) |
| 04:42.22 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32840 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am icreateGui.h): remove the (apparently) unused icreateGui.h too |
| 04:48.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32841 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am sunicon.h): dm-sun is gone, so sunicon should die too |
| 04:51.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32842 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am vgdev.h): Our hats are off to you General Vector, sir. Thank you for all the fond memories and vectorish goodness. |
| 05:06.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32843 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (Makefile.am cad_boundp.c cad_parea.c vld_std.h): get rid of doug gwyn's rather unnecessary vld_std.h header wrappings for 'standard C programming definitions' |
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| 05:47.54 | pacman87 | brlcad: ping |
| 05:53.42 | brlcad | pacman87: pong |
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| 06:50.22 | yukonbob | . |
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| 15:07.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32847 10/brlcad/trunk/src/vdeck/ (Makefile.am vproc.c): remove the duplicate vproc.c, which seems to be fully replaced by (nearly identical) routines in vdeck.c .. looks like a renamed file that was never removed. |
| 15:19.33 | louipc | holy smokes |
| 16:53.26 | ``Erik | http://viewaskew.com/press/dogma.html hilarious |
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| 01:13.05 | starseeker | brlcad: It looks like the distinguishing feature of tkhtml3 is it's ability to handle css. |
| 01:19.18 | starseeker | notes that the brlcad ebuild has evolved somewhat, but wonders why it's depending on itcl/itk when it can't use system versions right now |
| 01:57.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32848 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tk/generic/tkBind.c: |
| 01:57.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: apply the patch provided via the gentoo ebuild tracker (Comment #124 From |
| 01:57.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Facundo de Guzman 2008-10-05 16:57:24 0000) (attachment id=167322). This patch |
| 01:57.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fixes an issue with the new Xorg-server 1.5 and Tk where it reportedly causes a |
| 01:57.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: runtime event error. |
| 04:43.06 | yukonbob | ?link |
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| 08:30.50 | brlcad | link? |
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| 10:49.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32849 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: ew, rt_binunif_get shouldn't be taking a Tcl_Interp .. all of the rt_*_get routines should take a bu_vls for logging. fortunately, just the decl was wrong. quells compilation warning. |
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| 11:08.32 | brlcad | woot |
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| 11:08.41 | brlcad | got rid of the riff raff |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32850 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: stub in initial functionality for supporting points that optionally have |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: per-point color, scale, and normal data while remaining a memory-compact |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: representation using exactly no more than necessary (allowing datasets only |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: limited by the size of available memory). don't yet implement support for |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: reading in or using the extra data just yet, but the container is there now. |
| 11:09.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: later might also want to add support for allowing binunif as the data source. |
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| 11:16.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32851 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: these are not likely going to happen within two releases |
| 11:27.34 | mafm | hallo |
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| 11:39.57 | claymore | hai! |
| 13:39.34 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 13:39.34 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 18:26.46 | starseeker | starts following the threads of MGED's help system |
| 18:35.56 | ``Erik | stares at the amusing ways brlcad broke libged |
| 19:02.31 | starseeker | wonders if we're planning to move to an OGRE based GUI at some point in the future, whether it might make sense to move the "help" information associated with functionality moving to libged out of MGED and into something that can be called by any interface using libged |
| 19:06.26 | starseeker | Is the doxygen output from BRL-CAD online anywhere? |
| 19:20.53 | starseeker | brlcad: is the intention at some point to add doxygen doc building to the build process the same way docbook doc building has been added? |
| 19:25.40 | ``Erik | at one point, it was buried somewhere on brlcad.org |
| 19:26.23 | starseeker | Oh, here we go: http://brlcad.org/mirror/doxygen |
| 19:26.27 | starseeker | thanks ``Erik |
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| 19:47.24 | poolio | howdy all |
| 19:47.39 | poolio | starseeker: oo, some of the dependency graphs are purty :) |
| 19:48.15 | starseeker | :-). Lot of work to do there - if I'm understanding this correctly, we shouldn't have any .c files with comments that are ending up in that sucker |
| 19:50.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32854 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am rt.xml): Add rt.xml - worked on by Janine Gettier |
| 19:51.13 | starseeker | poolio: The rt_i data structure graph is pretty cool |
| 19:51.46 | ``Erik | hrm, none of the bugs or feature requests look like five minute hacks. :/ bummer |
| 19:52.02 | starseeker | agrees |
| 19:52.24 | comics | starseeker: * ar4545fb /checl/your/mail (Right.now): New mail |
| 19:52.25 | ``Erik | soooo, I'll promptly ignore them all and do something else, instead :D |
| 19:52.49 | starseeker | what mail? |
| 19:52.59 | ``Erik | PO box .. |
| 19:53.03 | comics | mine |
| 19:53.38 | ``Erik | $ less /var/spool/mail/comics |
| 19:54.34 | comics | $ yes /opt/off cause |
| 19:54.48 | starseeker | ``Erik /var/spool/mail doesn't seem to be there |
| 19:55.07 | comics | i will fight with .xml with gedit |
| 19:55.30 | ``Erik | depends on the os you use,, many linux breeds went nonstandard and moved stuff from /var/spool/mail to /var/mail many years ago, starting with debian I believe |
| 19:56.25 | ``Erik | fbsd followed the fruitiness :( |
| 19:57.03 | starseeker | commics: Oh, web mail |
| 19:57.09 | starseeker | comics rather |
| 19:57.19 | starseeker | sounds good |
| 19:57.55 | comics | ok |
| 19:58.23 | starseeker | The mged commands file will get broken up in english too - lots and lots of doc work ahead |
| 19:58.32 | starseeker | and that doesn't even count reviewing it all :-( |
| 19:58.52 | starseeker | needs to get working on Drupal module |
| 19:59.12 | starseeker | once he figures out how the heck to used tkhtml3 inside mged... |
| 20:00.01 | starseeker | (workmode:set 'workmode:go-crazy :tcl-tk) |
| 20:00.17 | comics | mged: about 400 comands i guess, each about 5-8 lines - well, i will see thru search.xml... Will add english and save, then save again |
| 20:00.57 | comics | and new commands... update to version 7.12.* |
| 20:01.24 | ``Erik | (send 'starseeker '(asdf:oos asdf:load-op addlithptomged))) |
| 20:01.24 | starseeker | comics: brlcad was listing all commands a little while back - he might have a list handy |
| 20:01.37 | comics | PrezKennedy: howz your wife, hilarious ? |
| 20:02.04 | starseeker | ``Erik: ERROR - STACK OVERFLOW. Core dump. |
| 20:02.17 | ``Erik | scheme woulda done it :> *duck* |
| 20:02.53 | starseeker | Nah, try sending it to 'Erik instead - there may be more resources available there |
| 20:03.06 | comics | starseeker: ? MGED_cmd_index.html - 7.10 - all what i have. I gues you will add .xml files to real site - and we will have added them all, finally |
| 20:03.12 | PrezKennedy | gently nudges comics as he's walking down the stairs |
| 20:03.18 | PrezKennedy | whoops...! |
| 20:03.26 | ``Erik | BOFH'd! |
| 20:04.29 | ``Erik | and I don't mean the new kindler gentler bofh, I mean classic style, yo :D airtight tape safes, connecting mains to floor plates, etc |
| 20:04.54 | poolio | starseeker: I prefer the nmg edge one :) |
| 20:05.33 | comics | comics: smiles, and his X-man's like smile take him avay up the stair. He kicks the president with his leg with words "As to el Wista". |
| 20:06.10 | PrezKennedy | breaks out Windows Vista CD |
| 20:06.14 | PrezKennedy | stand back or ill use it |
| 20:09.08 | comics | comics: rolls and break the whole building! Everybody are in the heaven, and part of people - are in hell by now. The end of the story |
| 20:16.37 | ``Erik | ah, russian? |
| 20:23.43 | comics | ah? |
| 20:24.32 | comics | same old comics911.wordpress.com, but there's nothing new in there |
| 20:46.53 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 20:53.48 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32855 10/brlcad/trunk/Makefile.am: fix for out of dir build (doxygen) |
| 21:18.01 | *** part/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.8.236.152) | |
| 23:03.19 | ``Erik | wonders where claymore got off to O.o |
| 23:03.39 | ``Erik | I'm imagining brlcad is still passed out |
| 23:12.11 | louipc | starseeker: you're putting docs for each mged command into a separate file? |
| 23:59.06 | claymore | is hanging out at home. Had a surprise visit from some inlaws :/ |
| 00:00.49 | ``Erik | oh yay :) |
| 00:05.01 | ``Erik | learn something new about submariners every day :> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=985373&cid=25264311 |
| 00:05.03 | ``Erik | *duck* *run* |
| 00:08.36 | ``Erik | apparently, research time is dictated by the number of research labs you had at the beginning, adding more during research does NOT change the duration |
| 00:09.58 | ``Erik | on the up side, you can downgrade all the way down to the minimum number for the current level without impacting it as well |
| 00:27.15 | starseeker | louipc: That's the idea |
| 00:31.08 | starseeker | The individual files can be xincluded into a convenient larger document, and the individual ones can generate things like man pages |
| 00:36.51 | starseeker | eventually, there should be very little distinction between "command line" and "mged" commands - the latter can usually be run from the command line if they make sense, and a unified system of documentation simplifies a lot |
| 00:49.58 | starseeker | the new docbook "one per command" files are intended to serve the purpose of man pages, and one of their output formats actually IS man |
| 00:50.22 | starseeker | the nice part is we also get other formats (like html and pdf) for free |
| 00:50.56 | starseeker | html in particular will be handy - I'm currently looking at ways to get MGED to display html pages |
| 00:53.31 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:58.29 | mafm | hi Ralith |
| 00:58.42 | mafm | and good night all, I go to sleep :) |
| 01:18.18 | ``Erik | starseeker is just itching to see the dreaded "filesystem out of inodes" message |
| 01:27.01 | starseeker | ``Erik: suck it up, BSD man ;-) |
| 01:29.52 | ``Erik | heh, all *nix have that issue, dude O.o |
| 01:30.13 | starseeker | I know, but surely the leet BSD hackers will get around it |
| 01:31.04 | ``Erik | sure, we just create fs's with more inodes *shrug* even linux can do that, but it requires a newfs |
| 01:31.15 | ``Erik | uh, mkext2fs for you leenewx weenies :) |
| 01:34.53 | starseeker | will switch to opensolaris and the almighty ZFS |
| 01:35.40 | ``Erik | um, hrm, I d'no if zfs has the ability to tweak inode count on the fly O.o (but fbsd does fully support zfs, and mostly supports dtrace!) |
| 01:35.41 | ``Erik | :D |
| 01:35.43 | starseeker | eyes Tokeneer project with interest |
| 01:36.19 | starseeker | heh - BSD license is nice sometimes |
| 01:37.12 | starseeker | REALLY doesn't understand the appeal of 3D television |
| 01:37.54 | starseeker | can only see 2D without moving around - how can the couch potato adapt to such an environment |
| 01:40.41 | ``Erik | immediately patents a moving barka |
| 01:41.02 | ``Erik | barcalounger |
| 01:41.09 | ``Erik | :D |
| 01:43.26 | starseeker | that would be a patent worth framing |
| 01:44.00 | ``Erik | does scifi count as prior art? O.o |
| 01:44.25 | starseeker | wished it did - probably depends on the circumstances |
| 01:45.02 | starseeker | still wants to contact the dude who has the cat laser pointer patent after it expires and purchase the original document |
| 01:46.55 | Ralith | starseeker: is your depth perception borken? |
| 01:47.09 | starseeker | eh? |
| 01:47.18 | Ralith | starseeker: also, what about DragonflyBSD and it's shiny new HammerFS? |
| 01:47.25 | Ralith | 18:37:53 * starseeker can only see 2D without moving around |
| 01:47.43 | starseeker | depth perception is deduced based on two dimensional information |
| 01:47.54 | Ralith | everyone else can see full 3D while sitting still |
| 01:48.01 | Ralith | why do you think we have two eyes :P |
| 01:48.24 | starseeker | Sure, but the benefits of 3d television are minor unless you move around it |
| 01:48.39 | starseeker | you're losing most of the information due to a limited vantage point |
| 01:49.00 | starseeker | It might make more sense with a holographic sterogram type display |
| 01:49.18 | Ralith | I'm not personally interested in a multi-PoV 3D display |
| 01:49.24 | Ralith | but I would love to have a depth-capable display. |
| 01:49.35 | starseeker | that's different |
| 01:49.36 | Ralith | e.g. stereo glasses |
| 01:49.41 | starseeker | nods |
| 01:49.51 | Ralith | wants a nice high res pair, but it'll be forever before he can afford one :( |
| 01:49.58 | starseeker | amen |
| 01:50.00 | Ralith | at least by the time I buy one, hardware to drive it will be cheap |
| 01:51.14 | starseeker | Ah yes, here it is: http://www.google.com/patents?id=OfwkAAAAEBAJ&dq=5443036 |
| 01:51.20 | Ralith | I have this deep-set desire to custom-build and integrate an enhanced-reality set in a car. |
| 01:51.28 | starseeker | my favorite monument to the flaws of the US patent system |
| 01:51.52 | starseeker | Ralith: Heh - there was this ride at universal studios that was pretty good at that... |
| 01:52.23 | Ralith | oh? |
| 01:52.34 | starseeker | I think it was back to the future relate |
| 01:52.35 | starseeker | d |
| 01:52.58 | starseeker | I may have been too young to really appreciate its flaws though |
| 01:54.05 | Ralith | I'm obsessed with the potential useful||entertaining aspects of something actually built to help you out |
| 01:54.11 | Ralith | lots of fun to think about |
| 01:54.25 | starseeker | :-) |
| 01:54.51 | starseeker | 's particular fun with thought experiments is renewable energy and efficient house design |
| 01:55.13 | Ralith | lacks sufficient technical knowledge to cover that sort of area |
| 01:55.15 | Ralith | also, bbs |
| 01:55.44 | starseeker | didn't say he had sufficient knowledge either ;-) |
| 01:56.16 | Ralith | hehe |
| 02:17.09 | louipc | starseeker: cool. I wonder if it could somehow be integrated into the mged help system |
| 02:17.25 | louipc | that would be sweet |
| 02:20.17 | Ralith | </bbs> |
| 02:20.59 | Ralith | starseeker: what *would* make a multi-PoV display neat is if it was opaque and projected in such a way that you could walk in the middle of it without interrupting anything |
| 02:24.30 | louipc | http://www.ipwatchdog.com/patent/animal-toy/ |
| 02:24.39 | louipc | this one is awesome |
| 02:43.32 | ``Erik | could be worse, starseeker, check out australias awesomeness http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/auspac/07/02/australia.wheel/ |
| 04:18.31 | brlcad | fixes libged |
| 04:23.24 | brlcad | iirc, there are about 300 mged commands, 400 unix command-line commands |
| 04:25.20 | brlcad | there's a couple ways to ask mged for the list of all commands, e.g. info commands |
| 04:36.23 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32856 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/rtgeom.h src/libged/make.c src/mged/typein.c): need to update the pnts in use in libged as well for the make command. prefix all of the pnts types with RT_ since they are (presently) part of the API that you have to go through to use them. |
| 04:40.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32857 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: |
| 04:40.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: add janine gettier to the contributors list for her help with documentation. |
| 04:40.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: she's worked on reviewing some documents in the past but has stepped up |
| 04:40.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: contributions recently with the work on docbook integration with cliff. |
| 04:55.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32858 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 04:55.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: bob improved mesh normals from Pro/E exporter. he said that it seems like |
| 04:55.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: they're exporting with a left-hand orientation, so the bot is now created |
| 04:55.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: accordingly set as lh or unoriented depending on whether there are normals |
| 04:55.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: available during export. |
| 06:30.32 | brlcad | booyah |
| 06:30.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32859 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO bench/Makefile.am bench/benchmark.1 bench/run.sh): |
| 06:30.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: greatly improved the usability of the benchmark suite by providing additional |
| 06:30.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: processing commands including not doing anything by default any more unless the |
| 06:30.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 'run' command is requested. added detailed usage and instruction commands along |
| 06:30.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: with updated manual page to match. the options that control how the benchmark |
| 06:30.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: behaves can now also be specified on the left or right side of the 'benchmark' |
| 06:30.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: command as well on the command-line. |
| 06:33.07 | brlcad | should docify doc/benchmark.tr and bench/benchmark.1 into one (unified) document at some point |
| 07:20.03 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:55.22 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 08:24.47 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EEFA.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 09:15.59 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@130.Red-83-49-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 09:17.46 | mafm | morning |
| 10:07.48 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 10:11.33 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 10:13.32 | mafm | hi brlcad |
| 10:14.01 | mafm | I'm under attack of micro-bugs, as my flatmates calls them :P |
| 10:14.07 | mafm | other than that, pretty well |
| 10:15.04 | brlcad | sick? |
| 10:16.48 | mafm | yup |
| 10:17.54 | mafm | cold/flu |
| 10:18.23 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 10:21.43 | brlcad | fun |
| 10:27.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32860 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: remove stray rt_revolve_prep debug printing |
| 11:13.03 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 11:24.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32861 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 5 dirs): Added bot_dump functionality to libged. |
| 11:48.05 | starseeker | louipc: integrating into (even replacing much of) the current MGED help system is exactly the goal :-) |
| 12:21.18 | brlcad | gives up on the revolve bug hoping pacman87 can make better sense of it |
| 12:56.40 | claymore | never give up, never surrender! |
| 13:03.33 | ``Erik | it's not surrender, it's passing the buck :D |
| 13:04.28 | claymore | Delgation: The greatest power on earth ;) Men can move mountains with it..... |
| 13:04.52 | ``Erik | men can delegate others to move mountains with it, you mean |
| 13:05.04 | ``Erik | will, determination, and an endless supply of slave labor? |
| 13:05.06 | clock_ | claymore: you mean atomic bomb? |
| 13:05.23 | PrezKennedy | newkular bombs |
| 13:07.48 | clock_ | ;-) |
| 13:10.17 | claymore | Erik: Bingo ;) |
| 13:10.40 | claymore | clock: Perhaps, as long as we are discussing the delegation of deploying a nuclear weapon! |
| 13:11.34 | claymore | Erik: What's you impression of Ubuntu? Good/Bad/indifferent? |
| 13:11.41 | claymore | you = your |
| 13:13.31 | ``Erik | it's... linux... |
| 13:14.15 | ``Erik | I haven't used ubuntu, I was doing kernel development in linux and uh, was a bit terrified :D all those nippets of MS and enterprise code that people laugh at... I've seen worse in the kernel |
| 13:14.35 | ``Erik | ubuntu is based off of debian, right? debian was my favorite leenewx back in the day |
| 13:15.04 | claymore | cool. Since you're the OS zealot, i figured I'd ask ;) |
| 13:15.29 | clock_ | ``Erik: you want to say that in the Linux kernel there are even worse pearls than in MS and enterprise code? |
| 13:16.07 | ``Erik | clock: there are some real stinkers. |
| 13:16.20 | clock_ | ``Erik: do you remember some? |
| 13:16.38 | clock_ | A friend found a chain of functions that were doing nothing else just one caling another |
| 13:16.45 | clock_ | So he removed that and sent a patch |
| 13:16.50 | clock_ | Don't know if they accepted it though. |
| 13:17.18 | ``Erik | um, iirc (it's been many years), ioctl is treated as a pass through unguarded pointer remapping instead of a guarded copy that divides top and bottom half |
| 13:17.32 | clock_ | A friend who wrote his own operating system and did a surprising discovery in the filesystem area so maybe he knew what he was doing ;-) |
| 13:17.57 | ``Erik | which certain driver writers demonstrated horrible ways to abuse *coughnvidiacough*, basically permitting arbitrary overflow into kernel space |
| 13:17.58 | clock_ | I don't understand it |
| 13:18.03 | clock_ | I know what a top and bottom half is |
| 13:18.19 | clock_ | that's in interrupt drivers the top half puts some request on a que and the bottom half then does the real work |
| 13:18.30 | clock_ | I know what a pointer is |
| 13:19.13 | clock_ | oh nvidia is shit already just by the name isn't it? |
| 13:19.43 | ``Erik | ok, you call an ioctl, you get the ability to write to kernel protected memory from a user process... on most OS's you actually write to a user buffer, then the kernel copies a kernel defined number of bytes from your user memory into kernel space |
| 13:20.17 | clock_ | with ioctl you pass 2 ints and a variable amount of parameters |
| 13:20.17 | ``Erik | with the linux way, it just maps a pointer to both without a guard (or it used to), so if you were malicious, you could just keep writing into kernel memory to your hearts content (at least for that page) |
| 13:20.24 | clock_ | I don't see any way how to write into kernel memory |
| 13:20.34 | clock_ | Who's writing into the kernel memory is the kernel isn't it? |
| 13:20.55 | clock_ | Or is the ioctl somehow significantly translated by glibc? I am looking into the manpage not into the kernel interface spec |
| 13:21.04 | clock_ | (frankly, I wouldn't expect Linux to have any kind of interface spec) |
| 13:21.09 | ``Erik | it's a syscall |
| 13:21.28 | ``Erik | lemme try to find my minirant |
| 13:21.33 | clock_ | ``Erik: what pointer? It returns an int |
| 13:22.00 | claymore | technically speaking EVERYTHING is a pointer ;) |
| 13:22.33 | clock_ | Linux is crap anyway. For exacmple the whole VT_ACTIVATE virtual terminal switching mechanism is flawed by design, resulting in a serious and irreparable race condition that can crash the video card and thus the whole machine |
| 13:22.34 | ``Erik | https://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?forum_id=89042 |
| 13:22.51 | clock_ | We were debugging Links crashing when switching VT's |
| 13:22.58 | clock_ | Kernel people keep saying it's a bug of svgalib. |
| 13:23.10 | ``Erik | this rant is trying to move the abused linux code into the 'safe' bsd approach |
| 13:23.16 | clock_ | But I found it isn't. And then the kernel people confirmed me that the VT_ACTIVATE mechanism in the linux kernel is buggy by design. |
| 13:23.49 | clock_ | "ioctl address" -> what's an ioctl adddress? |
| 13:23.56 | clock_ | knows just what ioctl is, see ioctl |
| 13:23.59 | clock_ | see man ioctl |
| 13:24.12 | clock_ | is it an address associated with some specific ioctl? |
| 13:24.38 | ``Erik | some ioctl's act like memcpy() |
| 13:25.09 | clock_ | and? |
| 13:25.17 | clock_ | where's the problem? |
| 13:25.20 | ``Erik | um |
| 13:25.42 | clock_ | you instruct the kernel to write somewhere into the kernel space and he doesn't check if you have permission for that? |
| 13:25.52 | ``Erik | or read, and yes |
| 13:25.59 | clock_ | basic eror |
| 13:26.20 | clock_ | same like calling unlink("/etc/shadow") under user privileges |
| 13:26.28 | clock_ | If the kernel doesn't check the permission, youre screwed. |
| 13:26.30 | ``Erik | UNIX: memcpy(dst,src,len); Linux: dst=src; |
| 13:26.40 | clock_ | Why should this be anything different? Why does it need discussion? |
| 13:26.46 | clock_ | Because the linux kernel developers are retarted? |
| 13:27.09 | ``Erik | or too trusting and looking for speed *shrug* this was a while ago, hopefully that gripe has changed |
| 13:27.16 | clock_ | omg |
| 13:27.33 | clock_ | Not only Linux is crap, also the x server |
| 13:27.42 | clock_ | they have a piece of code that is guarded by cli and sti |
| 13:28.11 | ``Erik | really? in X? neat |
| 13:28.11 | clock_ | if a page boundary happens in between and the lower page happens to be paged in and the upper paged out |
| 13:28.13 | clock_ | it throws a page fault the fault handler asks the disk to serve the page and waits for an interrupt. |
| 13:28.21 | ``Erik | guess if you have to run it as root, you're able to be fugly like that |
| 13:28.31 | clock_ | The disk brings the page pulls the interrupt and NOTHING HAPPENS, BECAUSE THE INTERRUPT IS DISABLED. |
| 13:28.42 | clock_ | Now the machine hangs and he user can happily press the RESET button. |
| 13:29.04 | ``Erik | I haven't run across that issue yet |
| 13:29.28 | ``Erik | these days, I sit at a mac, run X11.app and do everything over remote X |
| 13:29.55 | ``Erik | <-- been thinking about buying a linux subnotebook, though |
| 13:33.12 | clock_ | I get all kinds of problems with X |
| 13:33.41 | clock_ | For example 99% times I shut down X in the work with ctrl-alt-backspace, the lower edge of the screen fills with thin vertical coloured stripes and a square is painted on the screen. |
| 13:33.56 | clock_ | Then I have to press alt-sysrq-u-s-b because the system doesn't react to anything else. |
| 13:37.38 | ``Erik | that sounds more like a video driver reinitialization issue than a straight up X issue |
| 13:38.26 | clock_ | Well if there are things like this - and I have verified that myself with the cli and sti in the source code - than I simply don't trust X |
| 13:38.28 | PrezKennedy | windows is pretty good |
| 13:38.38 | clock_ | puts a "broken by design" stamp over X and stops worrying about any crashes |
| 13:39.58 | ``Erik | uh, we're talking performance cars at a drag strip, don't brag about your honda civic with a type R sticker and dragging muffler, boy :D |
| 13:40.26 | clock_ | Trabant car |
| 13:40.43 | archivist_ub | car! cycle |
| 13:41.11 | claymore | Score for egging people on: PrezKennedy: 1, Erik: 0 |
| 13:41.46 | ``Erik | aw, c'mon, that ain't fair, I jump at any excuse for an off the wall analogy :D |
| 13:42.24 | claymore | thinks Erik jumps at any excuse to slam windows. |
| 13:42.53 | ``Erik | speaking of off the wall car analogies, funroll loops has moved O.o it's now http://funroll-loops.info/ |
| 13:46.10 | claymore | newb question: When it comes to load average, should it be 1.0 per cpu? |
| 13:46.26 | ``Erik | um, load is a red herring |
| 13:47.21 | PrezKennedy | load should be whatever is just below locking up the system |
| 13:48.10 | claymore | Understanding that its more of a qualitative measure than a quantitative one, is it 1.0 per cpu? |
| 13:48.50 | PrezKennedy | thats what ive heard people say |
| 13:50.35 | PrezKennedy | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Load_(computing) |
| 13:57.14 | claymore | cool thanks for the link. didn't have a browser open and figured you all would know. |
| 14:06.02 | ``Erik | it's the length of the runnable queue, if you sustain a load of 1.0 per cpu, you're probably in the neighborhood of full utilization and minumum process latency |
| 14:06.08 | ``Erik | (sorry, someone walked in my office) |
| 14:07.39 | ``Erik | linux includes uninterruptible sleeps in its load computation? laaammmeeee |
| 14:14.10 | claymore | hates the sloooowness of a wireless connection. grrr. |
| 14:17.45 | clock_ | claymore: not every wireless connection is slow, you should say the wireless connection! |
| 14:18.05 | clock_ | claymore: there are wireless connection with latency less than an optical fibre, with 10^-9 BER |
| 14:23.59 | claymore | okay Mr Specific: Claymore hates the slooooownes of a 802.11g wireless connection. |
| 14:25.20 | brlcad | if you're being pedantic, that should probably be an 'an' too ;) |
| 14:25.21 | PrezKennedy | hates the slowness of an 802.11a/b connection |
| 14:25.28 | brlcad | yay, an |
| 14:26.05 | claymore | glares at Sean. |
| 14:27.10 | claymore | VMware's virtual networking is kinda strange.... Need to read more. |
| 14:27.58 | PrezKennedy | stares hard at Sean through the monitor |
| 14:28.06 | PrezKennedy | you can't see it... but im staring hard! |
| 14:28.11 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 14:29.52 | ``Erik | so, uh, this one time, at band camp |
| 14:35.08 | claymore | I never knew you played flute Erik.... |
| 14:35.30 | ``Erik | nah, dude, oboe O.o |
| 14:35.40 | claymore | doh, my bad. |
| 14:35.42 | ``Erik | that movie had some very disturbing scenes |
| 14:35.49 | claymore | yes it did.... |
| 14:36.06 | ``Erik | (that was an oboe he violated, right?) |
| 14:36.07 | claymore | i mean, apple pie? Come on, thats a new level of desperate... |
| 14:43.45 | PrezKennedy | yeah i mean c'mon... pumpkin pie is so much better |
| 14:43.47 | PrezKennedy | XD |
| 14:44.37 | ``Erik | backs away |
| 14:44.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32862 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (bot_dump/bot_dump.vcproj brlcad/brlcad.sln): Update bot_dump project. |
| 14:53.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32863 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/brlcad/brlcad.sln: Remove bot2raw project reference. |
| 14:56.36 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 15:15.09 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 15:22.20 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 15:43.39 | *** join/#brlcad Naaatan (n=45461cb2@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 15:48.19 | starseeker | oh, ICK |
| 15:48.37 | starseeker | tkhtml3 is using some kind of parser to extract the c files before compiling |
| 16:01.45 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:02.30 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.199.66) | |
| 16:07.07 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-86-64.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:51.12 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 17:02.24 | mafm | going out, see you |
| 17:06.27 | pacman87 | brlcad: i've got to run now, but i should be back in ~2hrs if you want me to take a stab at the revolve bug |
| 18:02.26 | brlcad | pacman87: ok cool |
| 19:10.20 | pacman87 | is back |
| 19:15.02 | pacman87 | brlcad: ping |
| 19:54.31 | *** join/#brlcad cad95 (n=3f44e4c5@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:00.46 | brlcad | pacman87: pongo |
| 20:00.57 | pacman87 | what's the bug? |
| 20:01.14 | brlcad | did you see the revolve.g that daniel sent to the mailing list? |
| 20:01.58 | brlcad | the hit points on the top/bottom don't seem right (possibly just inverted) |
| 20:02.26 | pacman87 | i don't remember getting that one |
| 20:02.50 | pacman87 | sent to the -devel list? |
| 20:03.05 | brlcad | yeah |
| 20:03.23 | brlcad | ah, not the devel list |
| 20:03.32 | brlcad | posted to the help forum |
| 20:03.43 | brlcad | http://sourceforge.net/forum/message.php?msg_id=5381844 |
| 20:04.12 | brlcad | you're probably not subscribed to the forums |
| 20:09.16 | pacman87 | i'm in winXP atm, and have another class in 20 min |
| 20:09.24 | brlcad | k |
| 20:09.49 | pacman87 | 17 hours of all engr classes (2 labs, plus my senior design project) doesnt leave much spare time |
| 20:10.58 | brlcad | http:/brlcad.org/tmp/revolve.png |
| 20:11.04 | pacman87 | but the bug you're talking about is for revolve faces that are perpendicular to the axis of rotation? |
| 20:11.17 | pacman87 | ah, i see |
| 20:11.52 | pacman87 | if you try that with a different bg color, are those faces still black? |
| 20:12.20 | brlcad | I did see in a simple single ray query that it is getting a in/out hit computed there, but it didn't seem like they were right |
| 20:12.51 | pacman87 | so the hitpoint could be off there |
| 20:12.53 | pacman87 | ? |
| 20:13.33 | brlcad | yeah, or simply inverted points |
| 20:13.55 | brlcad | the panels don't register as background, so even with a bgcolor set, they render black |
| 20:14.24 | brlcad | both the top and the bottom |
| 20:15.07 | brlcad | basically all surfaces that are perfectly perpendicular |
| 20:15.28 | pacman87 | if you add a rpp overlapping with the revolve, do those surfaces intersect properly? |
| 20:15.50 | pacman87 | (to test for proper hit distance) |
| 20:18.24 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/tmp/revolve2.png seems ok |
| 20:19.09 | pacman87 | ok, so the distances are probably correct, and the normals need fixing |
| 20:19.31 | pacman87 | adds it to my todo list |
| 20:19.56 | brlcad | hm, that gives me an idea actually |
| 20:21.33 | brlcad | hm, firing straight down, I get |
| 20:21.43 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:21.44 | brlcad | OUT: ( 1.66, 1.00 ) 2.6224 |
| 20:22.33 | pacman87 | looking along the revolve axis is handled seperately for hitpoints |
| 20:23.55 | pacman87 | i've got class; i'll check back in ~1.5hrs |
| 20:24.27 | brlcad | cya |
| 20:26.12 | brlcad | hm, yeah -- that in/out looks right |
| 20:27.23 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 22:00.09 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:00.53 | pacman87 | is back again |
| 22:16.42 | brlcad | aha, vpriv is ending up with Z == -inf |
| 22:16.54 | brlcad | causing nan's during norm() |
| 22:20.34 | pacman87 | hmm, i though i handled that in norm() |
| 22:21.28 | brlcad | actually, really shouldn't rely on ieee encoding |
| 22:21.43 | brlcad | division by zero on some platforms will result in a floating point exception instead of nans |
| 22:21.51 | brlcad | i.e., the app can crash |
| 22:22.18 | brlcad | best to always protect with NEAR_ZERO tests and do the extra book-keeping and conditionals |
| 22:22.19 | pacman87 | is looking up the code |
| 22:22.42 | brlcad | it's undoubtedly the m = dir[Y] / dir[X] where things start |
| 22:23.23 | pacman87 | what happened to the sourceforge svn browse? |
| 22:26.12 | brlcad | looks like they're in the middle of setting up a new web server |
| 22:26.26 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EEFA.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:26.31 | brlcad | it was fine just yesterday |
| 22:27.10 | brlcad | ah, interesting, it works if you go deep .. just not the top-level places that used to redirect |
| 22:27.13 | brlcad | e.g. http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/ |
| 22:29.51 | brlcad | woot, fixed at least one of the problems |
| 22:29.58 | brlcad | still have a problem if they're dead-on |
| 22:31.33 | pacman87 | dead-on = ? |
| 22:31.36 | pacman87 | along the revolve axis? |
| 22:32.09 | brlcad | top-view |
| 22:32.19 | brlcad | yeah, looking down the revolve axis |
| 22:47.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32864 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: |
| 22:47.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fix at least one problem with the revolve normals where nan's were making their |
| 22:47.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: way into the norm() calc causing badness. this protects the division by zeros |
| 22:47.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: applying some naive fallback logic that probably needs reviewing/improving but |
| 22:47.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: does fix the problem for at least a few orientations. there are still problems |
| 22:47.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: with looking straight up/down the rotation axis. |
| 22:52.53 | brlcad | pacman87: feel free to review/revert that .. |
| 22:53.18 | brlcad | the near-zero cases should probably be handled better than that |
| 22:54.11 | brlcad | I left some XXX debug statements in there for you if you want to poke it |
| 22:54.21 | pacman87 | ok |
| 22:55.29 | pacman87 | don't you need an else in front of line 432? |
| 23:00.25 | pacman87 | and if dir[X] is near zero, then m would be very large, not one |
| 23:01.17 | brlcad | ah, yeah -- there was an else there at one point .. where'd it go |
| 23:03.19 | brlcad | yes, huge, but then they're caught with the subsequent near_zero tests for /m to just make vpriv[z] = 0 |
| 23:04.08 | brlcad | those seem like they should be 1/-1 instead of 0, but I was following/faking intent |
| 23:05.50 | pacman87 | subsequent test == line 455? |
| 23:06.17 | pacman87 | shouldn't that be dir[X] is near zero, instead of m near zero? |
| 23:07.20 | brlcad | heh, copy-paste ftw .. you can see how careful/awake I am :) |
| 23:07.59 | brlcad | actually, hm, 455 you say? |
| 23:08.16 | pacman87 | and if you're worried about inf, then you need a check for dir[Y] == 0, cause then m = 0 and 1/m is inf |
| 23:08.34 | brlcad | 455 looks right to me |
| 23:08.37 | pacman87 | yeah, i'm looking at the diff on sourceforge |
| 23:08.45 | pacman87 | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:08.49 | brlcad | it's protecting the /m |
| 23:09.06 | pacman87 | oh, right |
| 23:09.08 | brlcad | the point being to avoid inf/nan altogether |
| 23:09.51 | pacman87 | so all the problems arise when either dir[X] or dir[Y] are zero, yeah? |
| 23:10.56 | pacman87 | the easiest way to ensure correctness (i'd think) would be to replace m or 1/m with dir[Y]/dir[X] or the opposite, and it'd be easier to check the condition you need |
| 23:11.37 | brlcad | yeah, I think so |
| 23:12.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32866 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/revolve/revolve.c: ws, indent |
| 23:12.43 | brlcad | kicks CIA-4 |
| 23:12.43 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 23:12.45 | pacman87 | another way would be to add another surfno to designate that the face is perpendicular to the revolve axis |
| 23:13.18 | brlcad | is that your HORIZ_SURF ? |
| 23:14.28 | pacman87 | yeah, but in shot(), i think i'm only using it when i have to close the sketch myself |
| 23:14.46 | pacman87 | though the code should be applicable to this problem, too |
| 23:15.25 | pacman87 | so i think that boils down to "if (dir[y] is near zero) surfno = HORIZ_SURF |
| 23:18.17 | pacman87 | dinnertime, back soon |
| 23:18.56 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 23:20.44 | brlcad | cheerio |
| 23:21.03 | ``Erik | cheerios for dinner? *ponder* |
| 23:28.26 | starseeker | never cared for cheerios |
| 23:29.27 | ``Erik | I used to get frosted miniwheats and raisin bran, but I don't eat breakfast anymore :/ |
| 23:29.43 | ``Erik | if I do, I cook up crepes or pancakes or waffles or eggs/hashbrowns/bacon or something |
| 23:30.10 | ``Erik | grabs his pink apron and prances about |
| 23:30.53 | brlcad | yay, threats from someone 35 levels higher than me now that I'm about to pass 30 |
| 23:31.02 | starseeker | tries to scrub that mental image out of his head |
| 23:31.25 | ``Erik | on ceti, I assume? |
| 23:31.44 | ``Erik | I think 50 is the high end of epsilon right now |
| 23:31.46 | brlcad | beta |
| 23:31.54 | ``Erik | oh, beta, my bad |
| 23:31.59 | ``Erik | "the other one" |
| 23:32.24 | ``Erik | my first lithp web app project, I think, is going to be a suite of ae helpers |
| 23:32.57 | ``Erik | extending the notion that created http://brlcad.org/~erik/profit.html |
| 23:32.57 | ``Erik | :) |
| 23:35.00 | brlcad | I find myself getting increasingly apathetic given I only check the status every couple days now |
| 23:35.14 | brlcad | not writing enough code, even if it's only getting 5 minutes of my day |
| 23:36.16 | ``Erik | opposed to tv? :D |
| 23:36.31 | brlcad | yep, that already doesn't really get much/any of my time |
| 23:37.05 | brlcad | especially since I moved, I've gotten weened off of everything |
| 23:37.24 | ``Erik | <-- pads ae in around his down cycles, fun diversion :) |
| 23:37.26 | brlcad | even missing the new season of heroes (though I *will* catch up on that at some point) |
| 23:37.47 | ``Erik | bought a place yet? bob says you have another townhouse in canton that caught your eye? |
| 23:37.50 | brlcad | heh, but you only consist of down cycles?? |
| 23:38.01 | brlcad | yeah, it's a sweet place |
| 23:38.02 | ``Erik | heh, on occasion |
| 23:38.20 | ``Erik | when, say, I svn up, run make and it breaks, yeah, that's a downtime day :D *duck* |
| 23:39.06 | brlcad | you sound like someone else now |
| 23:39.31 | ``Erik | heh |
| 23:39.45 | ``Erik | pizza time :D |
| 23:39.49 | brlcad | someone who shall go unnamed but doesn't even read the error message before "giving up" on even simple typo errors :P |
| 23:41.11 | ``Erik | oh, I saw the message, followed the commit message, looked at the diff, looked at the infracting code |
| 23:41.37 | ``Erik | and figured you must've just forgotten to commit src/libged/make.c |
| 23:41.40 | ``Erik | :) |
| 23:42.12 | brlcad | nope, never even made the edit |
| 23:42.15 | brlcad | but it was trivial :P |
| 23:42.28 | brlcad | i was just compiling per-dir at the time |
| 23:43.09 | ``Erik | I'm thinking you gutted a void* type 'magic' thing to overload it with switching structs using a type enumerator |
| 23:43.25 | ``Erik | but the enumeration was set up like a bit vector in octal for some strange reason |
| 23:43.27 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 23:45.23 | ``Erik | so *shrug* it was paperwork, answering make questions, etc |
| 23:45.43 | brlcad | it's exactly as you read it |
| 23:47.15 | brlcad | even down to the strange reason (exclusive id, just so you could look up the type via bitmask or equivalence) |
| 23:47.19 | ``Erik | the part that really had me step bck and go "uh, wtf?" was using an enumeration with a value set on every name instead of just letting it be a real enumeration or doing #defines |
| 23:47.28 | brlcad | custom structs just being a way to pack them in memory tight |
| 23:47.46 | ``Erik | why not a union in the struct? |
| 23:48.02 | brlcad | thought about it |
| 23:49.02 | ``Erik | unfortunately, I still have loads of non-code things to deal with :/ so something weird like that, Igo do the unfun stuff for a bit :) |
| 23:49.03 | brlcad | but the size of a union is the size of it's largest member iirc |
| 23:49.13 | brlcad | which defeats the whole purpose |
| 23:49.23 | brlcad | otherwise I could just have done what the DSP did |
| 23:50.17 | brlcad | (which was to just shove it all in a struct and access members based on the type) |
| 23:50.58 | ``Erik | yeah, union will always be the biggest member |
| 23:51.06 | brlcad | which makes for one pig of a structure .. I was debugging it a while ago and it looked like it's using 160 bytes per cell(!) .. maybe just a bug but damn |
| 23:52.23 | brlcad | points should now take up just exactly what they need with the only cost being that you have to typecast the container to the right struct |
| 23:52.51 | brlcad | would also make a really trivial extension to add per-point weights/scales now too |
| 23:54.29 | ``Erik | ponder this |
| 23:54.45 | ``Erik | resuming a raytrace is gone, no more, an ex-feature |
| 23:54.51 | ``Erik | <-- beats it on the countertop |
| 23:54.55 | brlcad | the other thing I could have done would have been separate lists for the point data, normal data, color data, etc, just having null lists for the ones that don't have that data .. that would have avoided the void* |
| 23:55.09 | ``Erik | does the 0,0,1 'base' color still make sense? or can we have pure colors? |
| 23:55.18 | brlcad | ahhhmmmmmmmmmm |
| 23:55.33 | brlcad | that wasn't just done for resuming |
| 23:55.45 | ``Erik | <-- has half been thinking about adding an .rpx format that'd journal how much was written |
| 23:56.20 | ``Erik | so my 40000x40000 -H37 -J3 poster render could be picked back up O.o :D |
| 23:56.59 | ``Erik | what else is 'not really black' used for? O.o |
| 23:57.13 | brlcad | i'd completely go for eliminating that magic color if we had proper alphachannel support -- knowing which are "background"/missed pixels is a feature used by quite a few tools |
| 23:58.32 | ``Erik | heh, png is looking better and better :) |
| 23:58.59 | brlcad | hell, I'd go for full 64-bit images, hdr internally ftw |
| 23:59.15 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 23:59.15 | ``Erik | png can do that :D |
| 23:59.42 | brlcad | it does? |
| 23:59.49 | brlcad | thought they only did 16bit |
| 23:59.55 | brlcad | exr does 32-bit |
| 00:00.30 | ``Erik | iirc, png allows you to set the width arbitrarily |
| 00:00.34 | brlcad | we actually have the start/stubs to a floating point raw image format (dpix) that was getting added to everything |
| 00:00.47 | ``Erik | nifty |
| 00:02.19 | ``Erik | hah, john stewart is refering to palin as "the she-bush" |
| 00:03.06 | brlcad | ah, so it does.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portable_Network_Graphics#Color_depth |
| 00:26.47 | dtidrow | howdy, brlcad - finally moved into our new home |
| 00:29.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32867 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bomb.c: erm, think the three fputs calls are stale debug leftovers. kill em |
| 00:29.33 | claymore | good lord.. a 1 TB 7200 spin SATA drive... $89... |
| 00:30.25 | dtidrow | lik please ;-) |
| 00:30.31 | dtidrow | link, that is... |
| 00:31.17 | claymore | bah, 119 with a 30 mail in rebate... never mind |
| 00:31.21 | claymore | http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10005968&eml=100708&email=100708&ref_id=5992&ref_t=Z&originid=82882604 |
| 00:31.51 | dtidrow | still, $120/TB is still a good deal |
| 00:32.36 | claymore | I know, I am just super impatient ;) Mail In Rebates != instant satisfaction.... |
| 00:32.48 | starseeker | prods CIA-4 |
| 00:33.14 | claymore | quadcore AMD socket am2 2.6GHz for $190. Now thats not bad at all... |
| 00:50.12 | starseeker | hopes his hardware holds out for a while |
| 00:57.46 | ``Erik | looks at his 1.2ghz athlon and ponders |
| 01:14.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32869 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/Makefile.am: Oh yeah, might help to actually build tkhtml3 |
| 01:21.25 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) | |
| 01:21.25 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || Channel logs at http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ || The 2008 Google Summer of Code is complete! -- Thanks deserved to all of our students! || (Source) Release 7.12.6 posted 2008-08-19 || Mailing lists are now reply-to-list instead of reply-to-sender by default | |
| 02:01.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r32870 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/iges/spline.c: |
| 02:01.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Corrected the limit on a loop. I believe this corrects bug #2009424 |
| 02:01.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: "iges-g crashes with -n option on Linux". Also improved handling of rational |
| 02:01.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: vs polynomial surfaces (to reduce memory usage of non-rational Bspline surfaces). |
| 02:14.12 | ``Erik | http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1772239 |
| 02:42.54 | brlcad | woo hoo! .. http://brlcad.org/tmp/bombardier.png |
| 02:43.05 | brlcad | halfway there |
| 02:45.50 | PrezKennedy | you should have put in "Having fun" in the place where it asks what you were doing |
| 02:46.02 | starseeker | sweeeet! |
| 02:50.38 | louipc | fancy |
| 02:51.00 | louipc | I thought that was going to be a model of a water bomber or something |
| 02:52.02 | brlcad | :) |
| 02:52.15 | brlcad | it's what I'm calling the crash report tool |
| 02:52.34 | brlcad | dtidrow: congratulations! |
| 02:52.53 | brlcad | dtidrow: so where abouts are you now? |
| 02:54.20 | brlcad | so aquatk is still a bit of a pita to get matching x11 .. and I have to jump through hoops to force it to use the right libs (it's sort of all or nothing) |
| 02:54.29 | brlcad | but it does indeed work at least for that simple example |
| 02:56.33 | starseeker | YES! http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/html_man_MGED.png |
| 02:56.56 | brlcad | hah |
| 02:57.09 | brlcad | I've been trumped, nice work :) |
| 02:57.24 | brlcad | that looks great |
| 02:57.31 | starseeker | nah, not trumped - just didn't want to get too far behind :-P |
| 02:57.32 | starseeker | thanks |
| 02:57.59 | starseeker | rendering isn't absolutely perfect (one of the tables is left justified for some reason) but it should do |
| 02:58.19 | brlcad | nods |
| 02:58.29 | starseeker | right now, only search and rt on that list work |
| 02:58.44 | brlcad | i know it's powerful and can do pretty much any layout, but it always seems a pita to me to get tk layouts to behave |
| 02:59.02 | starseeker | I need to use the dirent functionality to look at whats actually available and build a list from that |
| 02:59.12 | starseeker | agrees |
| 02:59.21 | brlcad | they just seem to go contrary to how I learned layouts or something and I always feel like I'm hacking it (probably due to just not sitting down and spending the time to learn it proper) |
| 03:00.47 | starseeker | brlcad: Right now it's more or less held together with chewing gum and string, but I think it should be fairly safe as far as crashing goes - can I go ahead and commit so I don't lose it? |
| 03:01.13 | starseeker | doesn't think it's brlcad - I've got the frigging intro book in front of me and it feels weird |
| 03:02.18 | brlcad | the only concern is the compilability of tkhtml3 |
| 03:02.30 | brlcad | if that's working cleanly, I don't see why not |
| 03:02.56 | brlcad | maybe test a bsd and mac at least |
| 03:03.11 | brlcad | make sure it builds and installs without a hiccup |
| 03:03.15 | starseeker | Mac's OK (at least this one is) |
| 03:03.19 | starseeker | hunts up linux box |
| 03:06.09 | louipc | builds tkhtml |
| 03:06.13 | louipc | woohoo |
| 03:20.48 | brlcad | what's the usual Linux/X11 key binding to quit an app and/or close a window? |
| 03:21.52 | brlcad | control-q ? |
| 03:24.13 | starseeker | hmm. Ctrl-q sounds good. I'm not sure there really is a standard per say - I usually either quit via the program or kill the sucker |
| 03:26.10 | ``Erik | whatever has been mapped to xkill :D ctl+alt+escape (then click the window) shows up on a google |
| 03:26.32 | ``Erik | if that doesn'twork, ctl+alt+backspace will definitely get it |
| 03:26.37 | ``Erik | *duck* |
| 03:26.47 | brlcad | heh |
| 03:27.04 | starseeker | sounds like an approach Mike would use for quitting an app - "Nuke 'em all!" :-P |
| 03:28.45 | starseeker | will test john's iges-g fix when he gets home - that'll be NEWS worthy if he got it |
| 03:29.12 | ``Erik | many moons ago, back when I used to code,I was having issues with X locking up during opengl development with my 3dfx card and the opengl/glide bridge... ended up writing a joystick polling program that mapped things like killing X to a button, rebooting the machine to a button, etc... :) |
| 03:29.19 | ``Erik | I used to be cool! honest! |
| 03:29.35 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:30.00 | starseeker | was only ever cool in a relative sense |
| 03:32.45 | starseeker | reached the Zen of floppy divination - the true master needs no labels |
| 03:34.03 | ``Erik | http://www.libraryjournal.com/articles/blog/770000077/20080618/cassette02.jpg |
| 03:34.13 | ``Erik | my first programs went on things that looked like those |
| 03:34.14 | ``Erik | :D |
| 03:35.04 | starseeker | eh |
| 03:35.15 | starseeker | at least neither of us was there to suffer through punch cards |
| 03:35.23 | ``Erik | my mom did O.o |
| 03:35.26 | starseeker | ow |
| 03:35.45 | starseeker | might still take punch cards over old style mechanical typewritters though |
| 03:36.03 | ``Erik | she was in college taking programming classes... fortran on punch cards... her guidance councellor told her there was no future in programming or computers |
| 03:36.08 | ``Erik | woops O.o |
| 03:36.14 | starseeker | did she listen? |
| 03:36.20 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 03:36.49 | starseeker | whoops |
| 03:37.48 | Ralith | fortran existed on punch cards? |
| 03:37.49 | Ralith | wow. |
| 03:37.56 | Ralith | I didn't know they were at all high level. |
| 03:39.12 | starseeker | pretty much ignored his undergraduate councellor |
| 03:39.38 | ``Erik | up through fortran 4, the format was "fixed column" to facilitate punchcard programming... |
| 03:47.08 | starseeker | Works on linux |
| 03:47.14 | starseeker | swwweeeet |
| 03:49.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32871 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Early stage attempt at html based manual page display in MGED |
| 03:50.02 | starseeker | decides that's probably enough for one day and heads home. |
| 03:50.36 | starseeker | on the plus side, it doesn't look like my hours will be quite as long as I was afraid they would be |
| 03:55.48 | brlcad | great |
| 04:01.27 | dtidrow | brlcad: we're about 15 miles north of Detroit |
| 04:50.50 | brlcad | dtidrow, oh wow .. dunno if I knew that already, but .. yeah, wow :) |
| 04:51.18 | brlcad | I have family about a mile or two from M59 |
| 04:52.18 | brlcad | kicks CIA-4 |
| 04:52.18 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 04:52.56 | brlcad | given the e-mails are making it out, CIA must be dropping commits now when load is high |
| 04:55.24 | brlcad | more or less final appearance now, http://brlcad.org/tmp/bombardier.png |
| 06:33.21 | starseeker | very nice! |
| 06:33.56 | brlcad | thx, still needs word-smithed |
| 06:34.03 | brlcad | still needs to send the report somewhere |
| 06:34.05 | starseeker | erm |
| 06:34.10 | brlcad | still needs to get hooked into an app |
| 06:34.10 | starseeker | In file included from ../../../brlcad/src/util/bombardier.c:35: |
| 06:34.10 | starseeker | /usr/include/tk.h:23:3: error: #error Tk 8.4 must be compiled with tcl.h from Tcl 8.4 |
| 06:34.25 | brlcad | hm |
| 06:34.38 | brlcad | sounds like might be needing some autogenification love |
| 06:34.48 | brlcad | or cppflags are lacking |
| 06:35.03 | brlcad | ah, yes.. |
| 06:35.08 | brlcad | doesn't bite on mac |
| 06:36.59 | brlcad | hrm, not what I thought it might be |
| 06:37.24 | brlcad | ah, maybe this.. |
| 06:40.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32874 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: try adding the tk and tcl cppflags for bombardier since it needs both |
| 06:41.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32875 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: re-enable the tclcad_auto_path so that we can run cleanly uninstalled (nasty to include all of libtclcad just for that routine, but oh well) |
| 06:45.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32876 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: quell warnings, use fclose instead of close so we don't have to invoke bio.h or unistd.h |
| 06:52.40 | brlcad | give that a go |
| 06:59.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32878 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: and say bye bye to the second fixed buffer too, all hail the new vls overlords |
| 08:13.29 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:14.05 | brlcad | gets back to work |
| 08:39.19 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 09:11.36 | pacman87 | finally finishes ~5 hours of assembly programming and breadboard prototyping |
| 09:11.47 | pacman87 | good night/morning |
| 09:14.40 | brlcad | g'morning claymore |
| 09:15.02 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 09:15.21 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
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| 09:15.33 | pacman87 | waking up for my circuits lab in 4 hours isn't going to be fun |
| 09:15.33 | brlcad | :) |
| 09:15.34 | brlcad | don't go to sleep |
| 09:15.45 | brlcad | then you don't have to face that unpleasantry |
| 09:16.03 | pacman87 | if it's less than 3 or so, i usually just stay up and go running |
| 09:16.25 | pacman87 | anyway, my bed is calling |
| 09:17.17 | clock_ | pacman87: circuits lab? Is it something to do with electronics |
| 09:17.54 | brlcad | circuits usually do |
| 09:18.19 | clock_ | That reminds me how I am trying to teach 2N3904's to ride 10 MHz swell |
| 09:18.54 | clock_ | Using a circuit simulator I found out the emitter capacitance is not 8pF as written in datasheet, but under current, it goes up to 57pF! |
| 09:19.17 | clock_ | No wonder it was deforming the signal so horribly when I designed for 8pF! |
| 09:20.02 | archivist | dont over trust simulators |
| 09:20.13 | clock_ | But it makes sense |
| 09:20.31 | clock_ | Under current the capacity of every junction goes much higher |
| 09:21.22 | clock_ | In reality when built the circuit I got a 500 MHz oscillator. |
| 09:21.45 | clock_ | It couldn't amplify 10MHz properly, but had no problems with oscillating at 500 MHz ;-) |
| 09:21.47 | clock_ | Even when the transistors stop working at 300 MHz |
| 09:22.00 | clock_ | knows how to design circuits for astonishing results |
| 09:22.40 | archivist | the models in circuit simulators can be poor approximations and ive seen some maths effects from poor simulator design |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32880 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/ (Makefile.am bombardier.h): |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: add an icon to bombardier in old-school bitmap format (since that's what tcl |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: wants). it's nice when all the old tools still work. bitmap was custom |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: hand-edited based off a picture of real Bombardier wings, dithered to bitmap, |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: exported as png, converted to bw, rotated/inverted to 4th quadrant with bwrot, |
| 09:23.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: converted to ascii via bw-a, and then to X11 bitmap format using atobmp. so |
| 09:23.04 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: nice when everything works. |
| 09:23.42 | clock_ | archivist: yeah the theory vs. praxis problem |
| 09:24.38 | clock_ | archivist: reminds me surfing. All the surf people told me to train stand up at home. I trained a perfect standup on a floor. But when I got to a real board it didn't work at all, because the board has a different mechanical impedance |
| 09:25.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32881 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: hook in a preliminary query dialog that asks the user if they'd like to report the crash (displaying the nifty bombardier wings as a bitmap icon). good to go now for sending the report on in. |
| 09:41.06 | brlcad | more preview shots: http://brlcad.org/tmp/bombardier_hello.png http://brlcad.org/tmp/bombardier_final.png |
| 09:43.00 | clock_ | Please describe what you were doing when the crash occured: |
| 09:43.13 | clock_ | I was eating a phone order pizza and masturbating under the desk. |
| 09:47.21 | brlcad | and that description will get the attention it deserves |
| 10:07.58 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 10:18.02 | claymore | wants to know what kind of pizza it was... |
| 10:35.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32882 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/ (11 files in 11 dirs): ignore the generated files for a clean svn status |
| 11:03.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32883 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added a file to be in sync with Makefile.am |
| 11:18.22 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:16.21 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 12:30.17 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@130.Red-83-49-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 12:30.35 | mafm | hi |
| 12:48.12 | claymore | hai! |
| 12:57.36 | starseeker | brlcad: Yep, that looks like it builds now - thanks! |
| 12:57.48 | starseeker | (sorry, crashed last night) |
| 12:59.50 | mafm | hai |
| 13:00.09 | starseeker | howdy |
| 13:01.36 | starseeker | brlcad: those screenshots look awesome |
| 13:06.36 | starseeker | wooot - tkhtml3 works on my gentoo box too |
| 13:08.08 | starseeker | is stunned - once I get MGED to generate a "proper" list of available man pages and hook in a command line call, this might actually be ready to roll |
| 13:10.04 | starseeker | should get ready to roll too... |
| 13:10.29 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.200.56) | |
| 14:19.49 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 14:56.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32884 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bwscale.xml): Add bwscale man page docbook conversion from Janine. |
| 15:18.48 | brlcad | starseeker: so is she just going down the list and the first ones started with B ? |
| 15:20.01 | brlcad | er with the b's |
| 15:26.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32885 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: call out the work being put into converting, reviewing, and editing the documentation as it is massaged into Docbook format by cliff and janine. |
| 15:27.05 | starseeker | no, that was just a random short file I gave here as a test |
| 15:27.50 | starseeker | I gave here the full set now, with the list of cmds MGED knows about as the high priorities |
| 15:27.58 | starseeker | er gave her |
| 15:28.17 | starseeker | should think about waking up |
| 15:28.47 | brlcad | "the full set"? |
| 15:28.59 | starseeker | all man1 man pages |
| 15:29.13 | starseeker | she knows to avoid the 3rd party ones |
| 15:29.18 | brlcad | ah, okay -- so they are all command-line commands |
| 15:29.25 | starseeker | nods |
| 15:30.01 | starseeker | is there a good example of starting a dialog from the mged command line anywhere? |
| 15:30.23 | starseeker | needs an id to feed the dialog request |
| 15:33.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32886 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 15:33.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: this one is a little more tricky to word from an external user perspective but |
| 15:33.36 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: it's not critical to get it right since it should have a suymmary paragraph |
| 15:33.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: talking about it anyways come release time. mention the enhanced documentation |
| 15:33.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: processing system in mged that cliff now has integrated and working. |
| 15:33.56 | brlcad | erm, yeah, look at bombardier :) |
| 15:34.04 | brlcad | tk_dialog |
| 15:34.08 | starseeker | turns red |
| 15:34.11 | starseeker | I knew that... |
| 15:36.47 | brlcad | i.e., this line in that file: set response [tk_dialog .supg {Ooops...} $msg bombardier 1 {Close} {Report...}] |
| 15:37.38 | starseeker | wants to set up a "man" command on the MGED command line such that "man search" opens up the html search doc - is it better to do that in tcl or C? |
| 15:49.32 | brlcad | "yes" |
| 15:50.18 | brlcad | given it kicks off a gui, that portion belongs in tcl as tcl |
| 15:50.44 | starseeker | ok |
| 15:51.03 | starseeker | is there an example of that (maybe the sketch editor?) |
| 15:51.17 | brlcad | you could, however conceivably have a 'man' command inside mged that was even available in classive mode, and that wouldn't/shouldn't involve tcl at all |
| 15:51.37 | starseeker | how would it display results? |
| 15:51.38 | brlcad | sketch editor is a pig, but yeah -- it's an example |
| 15:51.42 | starseeker | k |
| 15:51.48 | brlcad | probably a better example would be the geometry browser |
| 15:51.54 | brlcad | it's hooked in as the "geometree" command |
| 15:52.02 | starseeker | cool - thanks! |
| 15:52.04 | brlcad | src/tclscripts/geometree/geometree.tcl |
| 15:52.42 | brlcad | and yes.. I believe it's not documented ;) |
| 15:52.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32887 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/mged.tcl: Only list MGED commands if they actually have an html man page available. |
| 15:53.04 | starseeker | doesn't dare document that - he'll end up rewriting it |
| 15:53.30 | starseeker | Ah dingnabbit, now I've got to update the CCB notes again and this time I did it to myself |
| 15:54.04 | claymore | has extreme sympathy for starseeker. |
| 15:54.33 | starseeker | 's sarcasm detector just had its needle broken off |
| 16:02.04 | claymore | spent nearly 10 years dealing with the QA aspect of running nuclear power plants, so when it comes to paperwork, claymore DOES have sympathy for starseeker ;) |
| 16:02.17 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 16:02.33 | starseeker | yes, I've heard legends about nuclear power plant requirements for documentaiton |
| 16:03.02 | claymore | legends? Nah. More like living mightmares. |
| 16:04.31 | claymore | True story: I had to spend 3 hours one time to replace a set of 25A/450V fuses in a switchboard. 1.4 hrs for the initial paperwork/permissions, .2 hrs to replace the fuses in the live board, 1.4 hrs for the followup paperwork closeout. |
| 16:04.59 | claymore | that was the point at which i knew i was finished with the Nuke Power aspect of my life ;) |
| 16:05.01 | Axman6 | nice |
| 16:05.12 | starseeker | winces |
| 16:05.27 | Axman6 | those sound like large fuses... |
| 16:05.49 | claymore | Nope. 25A fuses are about the size of half a crayon. |
| 16:05.56 | Axman6 | what was it like working there? |
| 16:06.00 | Axman6 | heh, fair enough |
| 16:06.13 | claymore | I think they were for a 450V recepticle actually. |
| 16:06.32 | claymore | Well, it was active duty Navy, so it was like any other active duty really. |
| 16:07.14 | Axman6 | ah yes, right. makes sense why you're here then |
| 16:07.51 | claymore | 'here' ? |
| 16:08.00 | Axman6 | #brlcad |
| 16:08.12 | Axman6 | the whole army thing... nevermind |
| 16:08.18 | claymore | looks out his window for suspicous looking cars... |
| 16:08.40 | Axman6 | *cough* |
| 16:09.04 | claymore | Yeah, i had 10 years in governent service... couldn't just toss that away and I couldn't stand any more deployments... SO, seemed like a natural choice. |
| 16:09.48 | claymore | Plus, I will hit my retirement window at the age of 42 and will probably switch over to contracting at that point. Nothing like the double dip! |
| 16:10.22 | Axman6 | so what are you doing now? |
| 16:11.26 | claymore | I am a newb software dev for the Army Research Labs ;) |
| 16:11.51 | claymore | en you? |
| 16:12.49 | Axman6 | first year uni student in australia. falling heavily in love with haskell... |
| 16:14.23 | Axman6 | i'm not sure why i still hang around here tbh. i haven't used brlcad for most than two years (mostly because X11 is broken on OS X). just has a nice feel i guess |
| 16:15.17 | claymore | isnt the x11 in 10.5 behaving? Like I said, I am just a newb with the brlcad package (from the dev side that is)... so I am unsure. |
| 16:15.32 | Axman6 | i should test it out again. |
| 16:20.12 | Axman6 | fetches the source |
| 16:20.47 | brlcad | starseeker: if all you're going to do is %s formatting, format is pointless |
| 16:21.06 | Axman6 | a while ago brlcad was trying to see if he could get it all working under leopard, and i let him use this lappy via ssh. kind of anoying that it was apple's fault in the end :\ |
| 16:21.08 | brlcad | instead of format "html/man1/en/%s.html" $cmd, just use "html/man1/en/$cmd.html" instead |
| 16:21.17 | starseeker | ah, ok |
| 16:21.25 | starseeker | isn't used to tcl yet |
| 16:23.43 | brlcad | Axman6: that should all be working now -- we had successful 10.5 compiles just a couple weeks ago |
| 16:23.48 | Axman6 | brlcad: how would you feel about solving this, just to show off? http://projecteuler.net/index.php?section=problems&id=202 |
| 16:23.57 | Axman6 | brlcad: excellent :) |
| 16:24.59 | pacman87 | Axman6: i already did that one 2-3 weeks ago :) |
| 16:25.12 | Axman6 | nice :) |
| 16:25.35 | pacman87 | i came up with the algorithm over dinner, written on the back of a napkin |
| 16:25.50 | pacman87 | when one of my friends brought up the problem |
| 16:25.50 | Axman6 | i've become a bit addicted to project euler. i still have a long way to come though :\ |
| 16:25.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32888 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (Makefile.am man.tcl tclIndex): Not quite perfect yet, but this flips up the window if you type 'man search' in the command window. |
| 16:26.04 | Axman6 | heh, very nice |
| 16:26.52 | starseeker | not yet it isn't - I need to figure out how to avoid blocking the command line |
| 16:27.13 | pacman87 | ~25 lines of code |
| 16:28.33 | Axman6 | one of the reasons i really like haskell s that i can write clear, one line solutions, that are very fast. often i don't use one line, because i confuse myself... but many could be |
| 16:33.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32889 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/mged.tcl: Don't need format here (per Sean) |
| 16:39.45 | Axman6 | brlcad: anything more i need to do to get a 64 bit build than --ebable-64bit-build? ./configure's whinging :\ |
| 16:41.13 | brlcad | Axman6: yes, you have to set flags |
| 16:41.35 | brlcad | the configure flag isn't sufficient due to how libtool works |
| 16:42.06 | brlcad | CFLAGS=-m64 LDFLAGS=-m64 |
| 16:43.19 | brlcad | starseeker: tk_dialog is blocking -- if you want non-blocking, you'll want to do something different (create a proper window) |
| 16:46.32 | brlcad | the geometry browser does it by creating a panedwindow (itk widget) inside the GeometryBrowser constructor |
| 16:46.54 | brlcad | there are a couple dozen other ways you can get a similar result |
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| 17:17.05 | *** part/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.8.236.129) | |
| 17:31.53 | mafm | night |
| 18:09.57 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D692.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:16.17 | claymore | how does one turn the terrian off? |
| 18:18.26 | brlcad | claymore: que? |
| 18:21.56 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 18:25.36 | ``Erik | haskell does some damn sexy things in some very limited fields, but it suddenly gets weak when you leave that arena :/ |
| 18:29.04 | ``Erik | like, "find the smallest number evenly divisable by every number between 1 and 20"... foldr1 lcm [1..20] |
| 18:56.56 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 19:00.24 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32890 10/brlcad/trunk/bench/run.sh: fix it so clean/clobber work atain. treat those two commands like help and instructions, processing them before the benchmark 'begins'. |
| 19:08.36 | brlcad | starseeker: toggling .so and .dll isn't portable (and won't be right on mac where it's neither) |
| 19:08.47 | brlcad | try to avoid bob's bad habits :) |
| 19:09.16 | starseeker | brlcad: Yeah, that's were I got it - OK, what's the right way? (how come it is working on Mac, then?) |
| 19:09.47 | brlcad | you should also *never* peek into .libs dirs |
| 19:11.47 | ``Erik | unless you're über |
| 19:12.52 | brlcad | it's working because you told libtool to make a "module" (which is sort of like a fake library instruction) |
| 19:12.58 | brlcad | which makes it build the thing static |
| 19:13.09 | brlcad | so package require doesn't do anything, it just happens to be compiled in |
| 19:13.16 | starseeker | was following what tkimg was doing... |
| 19:13.36 | brlcad | tkimg is a broken way to do it, and part why archer has so many problems |
| 19:13.54 | starseeker | ok, what's the better one? |
| 19:14.11 | brlcad | where'd the build files for tkhtml3 come from? |
| 19:14.17 | brlcad | you write them or did upstream? |
| 19:14.47 | starseeker | wrote them |
| 19:14.59 | starseeker | they had some but they didn't seem to "fit" |
| 19:15.08 | brlcad | what'd they use? |
| 19:15.28 | starseeker | Make, but they were using tclsh to generate c files on the fly |
| 19:15.56 | brlcad | the "right way", which tkimg doesn't do, is to set up the build through the tcl extensions interface, TEA |
| 19:16.31 | brlcad | straight up make or automake or ? |
| 19:16.53 | starseeker | configure.in, Makefile.in, no Makefile.am |
| 19:17.24 | brlcad | this explains TEA a bit (and is a good read to follow regardless), http://www.equi4.com/pub/etc/extuse.html |
| 19:17.32 | brlcad | okay, so autoconf project |
| 19:17.44 | brlcad | they may have been using tea then already |
| 19:17.58 | starseeker | yes, i think they were |
| 19:19.29 | brlcad | http://wiki.tcl.tk/327 too |
| 19:19.51 | starseeker | Are any of the src/other libs handled "the right way" currently? |
| 19:19.51 | brlcad | ah, there it is -- http://www.tcl.tk/doc/tea/ |
| 19:20.05 | brlcad | mm, don't remember |
| 19:20.13 | brlcad | maybe iwidgets |
| 19:20.52 | starseeker | groans - I take it the "right" thing to do is to fix 'em all? |
| 19:20.55 | brlcad | I think maybe incrTcl too possibly, but it's got other complexities |
| 19:21.19 | brlcad | nah, I wouldn't worry about fixing a problem that doesn't exist or has zero-cost at the moment |
| 19:21.26 | brlcad | just don't add to it ;) |
| 19:21.32 | starseeker | heh |
| 19:21.50 | starseeker | checks what iwidgets does |
| 19:21.53 | brlcad | and avoid the bobish if platform copouts :) |
| 19:22.16 | brlcad | they continue to bite us in the ass years later |
| 19:22.19 | starseeker | That seemed rather weird to me at the time, but I was assuming Archer did things the "right way" - guess not... |
| 19:23.21 | brlcad | i've spent weeks discovering/debugging and then rewriting something that amounted to a hack done a decade ago because a problem came up |
| 19:23.24 | brlcad | dozens of them |
| 19:24.04 | brlcad | it saved the original dev 'maybe' a couple days of extra work at the time |
| 19:24.26 | starseeker | nods. I'll attempt to retool the tkhtml3 build to the "correct" behavior |
| 19:24.48 | starseeker | I think we still want to avoid the tclsh generated c files - those are a pain |
| 19:24.57 | brlcad | archer does the tcl side better, but not any of it's dependency management |
| 19:25.15 | brlcad | it's initialization really sucked horribly as well, hard coded filesystem paths everywhere |
| 19:25.19 | brlcad | impossible for it to run anywhere |
| 19:25.34 | brlcad | but i've since rewritten it when I got it working on mac |
| 19:25.54 | starseeker | cool |
| 19:26.24 | brlcad | took over a month to diagnose, learn, and fix .. and probably only saved a week to do the hack |
| 19:26.44 | starseeker | we need to send Bob to boot camp :-P |
| 19:26.46 | brlcad | really has grown to despise the maintenance burden of hacks |
| 19:27.06 | brlcad | oh, I don't mind *bob* so much doing it |
| 19:27.25 | brlcad | but it means he needs a finisher, someone that follows up after him and cleans up while it's all still in context |
| 19:27.58 | brlcad | at least I don't mind "too" much .. sometimes the hacks aren't even worth it if he's really being lazy |
| 19:28.30 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87_ (n=pacman87@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:28.43 | brlcad | howdy pacman87_ |
| 19:28.47 | starseeker | was so happy to have a working tkhtml3, too... |
| 19:29.24 | brlcad | damn commit e-mails ruining your fun ;) |
| 19:29.41 | starseeker | you were supposed to be too shot to read them :-P |
| 19:31.00 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87_ (n=pacman87@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 19:31.21 | starseeker | erm. Does each src/other directory need its own version of tcl.m4? |
| 19:32.19 | brlcad | technically, no, but it's easier to leave upstream as pristine as possible |
| 19:32.28 | brlcad | and to distribute stand-alone.. |
| 19:32.51 | starseeker | Ah... |
| 19:33.12 | brlcad | fyi, not to add to the greivances but make dist is busted in tkhtml3 too ;) |
| 19:34.06 | brlcad | chuckles |
| 19:34.17 | starseeker | OK, OK, I give up - I'll look over the iwidgets setup. |
| 19:34.51 | brlcad | read the TEA docs, act like you're writing an extension .. then see what the others have done |
| 19:34.59 | starseeker | will see about staying closer to the original tkhtml3 build logic, but it doesn't clean up after itself properly |
| 19:35.43 | brlcad | it is possible to hook in their .in files into our configure so that they build as a proper subconfigure |
| 19:36.43 | starseeker | would prefer not to do that - they've got a snarl of several things stuffed in there, some of which may or may not be working... |
| 19:36.50 | brlcad | unless they were doing something horrible, I'd try to leave them as pristine as possible just so we can upgrade with near-zero effort |
| 19:37.32 | starseeker | can submit a patch to them... :-P |
| 19:38.53 | starseeker | mumbles something under his breath about getting Bob for this... |
| 19:43.32 | ``Erik | heh "what about bob?" ? :D |
| 19:44.02 | ``Erik | hopefully with windows, linux and osX all on his desk, he'll avoid those issues :) |
| 20:03.06 | brlcad | you'd think |
| 20:03.56 | brlcad | but he still reverts to #ifdefs all the time, and 90% of the time they're not needed or desirable |
| 20:07.27 | PrezKennedy | need some goto statements |
| 20:11.19 | ``Erik | logs in and 'updates' his cpp :D |
| 20:12.38 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, have you talked to my brother about his classes this semester? |
| 20:14.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32892 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/man.tcl: Would help to be able to scroll. |
| 20:36.29 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: nope |
| 20:37.12 | brlcad | starseeker: scrolling example in bombardier |
| 20:37.34 | brlcad | you basically just tie the text area to the scrollbar |
| 20:42.11 | ``Erik | wiggles his toes |
| 20:44.04 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.200.56) | |
| 21:04.26 | PrezKennedy | i hate when the Internet goes down at work |
| 21:04.29 | PrezKennedy | phones go too |
| 21:04.36 | PrezKennedy | but somehow people still manage to find me |
| 21:18.08 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, I've got a scrollbar hooked up - I was just overriding all mouse events at the window level so when I clicked on the scrollbar to move it the window closed |
| 21:18.40 | starseeker | brlcad: sort of a "you touch it, it vanishes" kind of arrangement |
| 21:42.26 | *** join/#brlcad TunaSushi (n=tunasush@static-70-22-154-184.bstnma.east.verizon.net) | |
| 21:42.38 | TunaSushi | hello, any humans in here? |
| 21:43.48 | starseeker | will aliens do? |
| 21:44.38 | TunaSushi | close enough... i have a newbie question... |
| 21:44.57 | TunaSushi | what's the easiest way to get dimensions and volume from an igs file? |
| 21:45.15 | starseeker | igs? |
| 21:45.28 | starseeker | iges you mean? |
| 21:46.11 | starseeker | You can give the iges-g converter a shot and then examine the components in BRL-CAD |
| 21:46.14 | TunaSushi | oops. typo. yes. plus i'm using windows with a 3-letter file extention. |
| 21:46.35 | starseeker | erm. brlcad, you know if the iges-g convert is in the Windows build? |
| 21:49.13 | TunaSushi | i haven't used brl-cad before. downloading now... i try to use catia for iges, but i have not been able to get simple drafting info for print. |
| 21:49.21 | starseeker | nirt can be used to examine a solid model for dimensions |
| 21:50.01 | starseeker | if the iges-g conversion preserves the right info - not sure about that |
| 21:50.09 | TunaSushi | is nirt a component of brl-cad? |
| 21:50.28 | starseeker | yes |
| 21:51.02 | TunaSushi | ok. |
| 21:52.47 | TunaSushi | are you one of the developers? |
| 21:53.01 | starseeker | not a senior one, but yes |
| 21:53.54 | ``Erik | nub |
| 21:54.04 | starseeker | nurb |
| 21:54.37 | starseeker | oh, shorthand for noob? |
| 21:54.44 | starseeker | fair enough |
| 21:54.59 | ``Erik | like noob, but meaner :D |
| 21:55.19 | TunaSushi | i was crass enough to spell it 'newbie'. |
| 21:55.47 | TunaSushi | what OS do you guys run this on? |
| 21:56.03 | ``Erik | I mostly use FreeBSD and MacOS-X |
| 21:56.21 | starseeker | OSX and gentoo linux |
| 21:56.33 | ``Erik | bbiab, my computer told me to go home |
| 21:57.29 | starseeker | should get supper |
| 21:58.44 | TunaSushi | i'm lost. |
| 21:58.59 | starseeker | what's the problem? |
| 22:00.06 | TunaSushi | i have Archer, MGED, and RTWizard. |
| 22:00.13 | starseeker | The iges-g tool is a command line tool - if it is in the Windows build it will need to be run from the Windows terminal |
| 22:01.06 | starseeker | Look in the BRL-CAD install directories for iges-g.exe |
| 22:01.35 | starseeker | probably in a bin directory |
| 22:01.56 | starseeker | if it's there, open a terminal and CD into that directory. |
| 22:02.38 | starseeker | then it's iges-g -o file.g path_to_iges_file |
| 22:02.51 | starseeker | or iges-g.exe maybe |
| 22:03.00 | starseeker | must run - bbiab |
| 22:09.08 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:34.01 | louipc | haha windows terminal |
| 22:49.52 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1178014793.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 23:53.47 | Axman6 | bleh, bre-cad doesn't want to build 64bit for me -_- |
| 23:54.03 | Axman6 | brl-cad too |
| 00:12.50 | brlcad | starseeker: arf, just missed you I suppose |
| 00:12.56 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 00:12.56 | starseeker | eh? |
| 00:13.02 | brlcad | starseeker: you home? |
| 00:13.09 | starseeker | no, back at work - grabbed supper |
| 00:13.17 | brlcad | OOoooh . . . |
| 00:13.25 | brlcad | forgot his keys |
| 00:13.30 | starseeker | ouch |
| 00:13.37 | starseeker | in your office? |
| 00:13.38 | brlcad | so I couldn't get in :) |
| 00:13.46 | brlcad | I'm over in kermit's |
| 00:13.49 | Axman6 | bah! well the latest brl-cad still fails to build properly on my system 9OS X 10.5.5) the benchmark dies with lt-rt crashing with some error about symbol not found: __cp_png_create_info_struct |
| 00:13.51 | starseeker | well, come on back - I'll be here :-) |
| 00:14.05 | Axman6 | (* |
| 00:14.17 | starseeker | (sounds like there may be some unhappy equipment in your room, come to think of it) |
| 00:14.25 | Ralith | Axman6: on your system 9OS X? O.o |
| 00:14.39 | Axman6 | OS X* |
| 00:14.58 | brlcad | Axman6: hm, the png thing is easily fixed, but I forget what exactly the fix it :) |
| 00:15.20 | Axman6 | yeah i seem to remember that was a fix |
| 00:16.14 | brlcad | reads backlog, and I do believe iges-g is in the windows mix |
| 00:16.28 | brlcad | the 3-letter extension shouldn't be a problem/relevant |
| 00:17.33 | brlcad | TunaSushi: there should be a 'bin' directory, iges-g should be in there .. but yeah, you'll need some terminal lovin' |
| 00:18.04 | starseeker | bparker was talking about sucking the converters into libged - boy would that be nice |
| 00:18.09 | brlcad | Axman6: can you post a full build log including configure up somewhere? (sorry to repeat, but I really just don't remember) |
| 00:18.20 | starseeker | has daydreams of a dialog with dropdowns for CAD filetypes |
| 00:18.33 | brlcad | starseeker: even better .. into their own library |
| 00:18.46 | brlcad | and then just having two ged commands for import/export |
| 00:18.53 | Axman6 | yeah i will. gimme a sec to get my mouse again. this piece of crap macbook pro's keyboard and mouse randomly stop responding |
| 00:18.55 | brlcad | that support any available type |
| 00:19.14 | starseeker | licks his chops at the idea of such a lib |
| 00:21.43 | Axman6 | brlcad: http://pastie.org/288294 |
| 00:22.31 | brlcad | Axman6: cool thanks, give me a bit |
| 00:22.37 | Axman6 | sure :) |
| 00:23.09 | Axman6 | well, the good news is mged works fine so far |
| 00:23.23 | brlcad | oh, so what's the problem then? :) |
| 00:25.17 | ``Erik | I think it's even in to TODO file, starseeker |
| 00:25.29 | ``Erik | I know I started the hackery that is the 2d image equivelant :) |
| 00:25.37 | brlcad | yeah, it's been in TODO and doc/PROJECTS ever since going open source |
| 00:29.17 | Axman6 | brlcad: the benchmark dies, and i guessing raytracing will too |
| 00:29.27 | brlcad | yep |
| 00:29.44 | brlcad | the benchmark calls rt |
| 00:29.58 | Axman6 | hmm, it has been far too long since i've used brl-cad. i can't remember how to do anything |
| 00:32.53 | Axman6 | there isn't an object browser of any kind is there? like a gui where i can browse what objects i have, and display them? |
| 00:33.27 | ``Erik | sorta kinda |
| 00:33.33 | ``Erik | the geometry viewer |
| 00:33.37 | ``Erik | in 'tools' I believe |
| 00:33.50 | Axman6 | yeah, just found it |
| 00:34.02 | Axman6 | i had looked, not very hard obviously |
| 00:36.37 | ``Erik | shakes fist at emacs |
| 00:36.51 | Axman6 | and how do i just look at the raytraced image, without the outline of the objects? |
| 00:39.53 | ``Erik | if you pull up the raytrace panel and choose 'underlay' |
| 00:46.19 | Axman6 | urgh, how do i copy text from the mged commandn window? i'm getting an error i remember for a while ago, and i don't know how or if it can be fixed |
| 00:47.08 | Axman6 | "The process has forked and you cannot use this CoreFoundation functionallity safely. You MUST exec()." |
| 00:52.18 | ``Erik | O.o weird, I don't recall seeing that, the X proto worked for me on osX last I checked |
| 00:52.31 | ``Erik | but I don't run mged often, and I'm more apt to run it -c so *shrug* |
| 00:52.53 | ``Erik | what about running an xclipboard and seeing what happens there? |
| 00:53.23 | ``Erik | I vagually recall needing to use it to bounce things between x11.app and system cut&paste once upon a time, but that seems to have been fixed for me |
| 01:02.51 | Axman6 | i don't know how to copy things :\ |
| 01:59.36 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 02:11.04 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 02:24.52 | brlcad | Axman6: run mged -f |
| 02:25.03 | brlcad | should be default if you're compilng off of head though.. |
| 02:26.03 | brlcad | Axman6: copying text from the mged command window is the same for any other x11 window (which unfortunately is not the same key bindings as aqua by default) .. make your selection then middle mouse click |
| 02:35.51 | poolio | brlcad: howdy |
| 02:38.05 | brlcad | howdy poolio |
| 02:38.09 | brlcad | how's it going |
| 02:49.32 | poolio | brlcad: good good. I've been insanely busy lately. And you? |
| 02:50.06 | Axman6 | brlcad: -f is unrecognised, and i have middle click bound to another action. stupid X11 -_- |
| 02:53.08 | brlcad | poolio: similarly insane |
| 02:53.13 | brlcad | and busy too I suppose ;) |
| 02:54.10 | Axman6 | brlcad: this is with the latest release i think (7.12.6) |
| 02:55.36 | brlcad | hm, that's really bizzare then .. it no longer forks |
| 02:55.44 | brlcad | do you maybe have a previous install somwehere? |
| 02:56.29 | brlcad | does it say "Initializing and backgrounding, please wait..." when you start mged? |
| 02:56.31 | Axman6 | i do... but i did run sudo make install, so it should've installed over it shouldn't it? |
| 02:56.40 | Axman6 | no |
| 02:57.01 | Axman6 | installs again |
| 02:58.22 | Axman6 | bleh, i need to get going |
| 03:06.14 | brlcad | hm, it entirely should have if you used the same build settings, but if one was --enable-all and the other wasn't, that might change matters |
| 03:07.24 | brlcad | Axman6: it could also just be that something has been missed wrt forking, but like I said -- we did have clean compile/installs a week or two ago on 10.5 (though we had some customizations that you probably don't have wrt external dependencies) |
| 03:08.12 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:12.47 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 04:09.11 | yukonbob | man, what a day |
| 04:09.33 | yukonbob | and what a slow interweb... is everybody watching Heroes or something tonight? |
| 04:10.24 | yukonbob | checks to see if it's Heroes night tonight |
| 04:17.11 | starseeker | Well, confirmed that the iges-g crash is fixed |
| 04:17.20 | starseeker | should update NEWS file... |
| 04:17.57 | starseeker | Now the problem is the .g file wiped out my memory when I tried to draw it |
| 04:18.52 | starseeker | brlcad: feel like attempting to crash your Mac? :-P |
| 04:25.37 | starseeker | does a g2asc and is awed to see a single 35MB bspline |
| 04:30.02 | starseeker | hmm - well, nirt is reporting hits and LOS values |
| 04:30.47 | starseeker | rt can't seem to do much with it though |
| 05:15.38 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-178-214.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 05:44.52 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@206-248-178-214.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 06:59.20 | brlcad | goes walkabout to stretch the legs |
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| 09:12.45 | brlcad | shakes his fist at the air in front of him |
| 10:29.18 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@130.Red-83-49-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 10:29.45 | mafm | hi |
| 11:19.47 | *** join/#brlcad mafm_ (n=mafm@130.Red-83-49-86.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 11:32.55 | brlcad | howdy |
| 11:55.31 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:02.57 | claymore | Mernin! |
| 12:04.24 | mafm_ | holy disconnections, batman! |
| 12:04.38 | mafm_ | mourim, claymore |
| 12:10.10 | starseeker | brlcad: What did that air ever do to you? |
| 12:18.43 | brlcad | hm? air? |
| 12:18.47 | brlcad | oooh |
| 12:18.47 | brlcad | heh |
| 12:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32893 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: |
| 12:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: John fixed a bug reported on both Gentoo and Redhad Linux where iges-g was |
| 12:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: crashing when run with the -n option. The cause turned out to be an incorrect |
| 12:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: upper limit on a loop adjusting knot values that caused a failure when the |
| 12:20.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: program attempted to free the knot array. |
| 12:23.12 | starseeker | faces up to the reality of morning rush hour traffic and gets going |
| 12:23.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32894 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: extract the name of the command that crashed from the crash report itself. |
| 12:23.52 | claymore | Starseeker: Just bring a book ;) |
| 12:24.05 | starseeker | <snort> Not a bad idea |
| 12:24.34 | starseeker | thinks they should do "Programming Books on Tape (well, CD nowadays)" |
| 12:25.01 | starseeker | can see listening to Practical Common Lisp as read by the author on his way to work |
| 12:25.04 | claymore | is listening to audio books during is 1.2 hour commute. Working through Anne McCaffery's Pern books.... MUCH better on tape. |
| 12:25.10 | claymore | lol |
| 12:25.22 | starseeker | Heh. I never could get into the Pern series |
| 12:25.41 | starseeker | likes David Weber's stuff so far |
| 12:26.08 | claymore | The very very frist one, Chronologically, is the first I ever read. Got hooked. If you try to start in the middle with the first book that was written... its tough to swallow. |
| 12:26.22 | claymore | Weber has some gems also:) |
| 12:26.22 | starseeker | Ah, that might help |
| 12:26.36 | starseeker | really likes Empire from the Ashes |
| 12:27.06 | claymore | DragonsDawn covers the initial colonization of Pern. so its more Scifi that Fantasy. I have the Audio Book on mp3 if you want it ;) |
| 12:27.22 | starseeker | is tempted |
| 12:28.45 | claymore | just lemme know and I can burnin it to cd or email a tar to ya. |
| 12:28.55 | starseeker | Cool - thanks! |
| 12:29.21 | claymore | lol actually, i just checked. I have a backup copy at work ;) |
| 12:29.26 | starseeker | hehe |
| 12:29.50 | starseeker | sounds good :-) |
| 12:30.18 | starseeker | really stops procrastinating and heads in, particularly since he just gave himself one more item to add to the CCB list |
| 12:30.43 | starseeker | time to watch the rest of the world pretend it knows how to drive - see ya! |
| 12:31.00 | claymore | cyas |
| 12:35.33 | mafm_ | bye |
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| 15:31.33 | *** join/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.8.236.131) | |
| 15:31.48 | comics | starseeker: ? |
| 15:42.08 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc_ (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 15:44.48 | ``Erik | scratches his brain |
| 15:50.42 | *** join/#brlcad claymore (n=claymore@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 15:51.35 | comics | claymore has gone from one server to another. |
| 15:52.22 | comics | or has come from one server to another... has gone or has come uh uh uh.. don't know |
| 15:56.01 | claymore | is an irc newb, please cut him some slack ;) |
| 15:57.46 | comics | ok, i cut some slack toast for claymore |
| 15:58.25 | claymore | is rather hungry.... good idea! |
| 15:58.34 | comics | actually 'Karmakoma' from MassiveAttack - my previous words reminds that video |
| 15:59.06 | ``Erik | karmakoma, jamaica and a rome-uh |
| 15:59.07 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 15:59.55 | comics | yeah... |
| 16:32.40 | comics | ``Erik: I want automatic dimensioning. Not myself, but e.g. separate details |
| 16:33.08 | comics | probably, 2022 fromthe birth of Jesus? |
| 16:57.39 | *** part/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.8.236.131) | |
| 17:13.06 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 17:17.24 | PrezKennedy | <3 IRC |
| 17:20.09 | ``Erik | erm, tmi? :D |
| 17:23.07 | starseeker | comics: sorry, preparing for a meeting right now |
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| 20:24.18 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32896 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/asc2g.c: add a comment token (must be first character of line) |
| 20:24.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32897 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/librender/camera.c: default to phone instead of normal |
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| 23:00.05 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 00:03.26 | ``Erik | hm |
| 00:03.41 | ``Erik | GHAH! NOOOOOOOO |
| 00:04.00 | ``Erik | my brain said "type cvs" and my screen said "$ svn" :~( |
| 00:38.12 | claymore | Well, thats better than the screen saying "$ svn" and you brain saying "Hommmmmmer." ;) |
| 00:38.23 | ``Erik | doooonnuuutttsssss |
| 00:38.59 | ``Erik | who's the catcher for fng right now? I got in fate, sent my fleet to their death, and am waiting on acceptance back into fng :/ |
| 00:39.37 | ``Erik | ten dizzy's and 5 pshield make me an ugly target, but I'd still prefer having a fag tag to further dissuade :/ |
| 00:41.21 | ``Erik | <-- did some self assessment, cannot figure out how to make a profit on his bases, is happy :) |
| 00:41.37 | ``Erik | even with tr rapage |
| 01:04.51 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 01:33.12 | starseeker | gets a subset of tkhtml3 much closer to "as is" in their cvs tree building just tkhtml3, but still needs to figure out such minor items as hooking the configure.in file into BRL-CAD's build system and supplying the correct flags to tell it to use the local tcl/tk instead of the system tcl/tk |
| 01:45.12 | starseeker | 's first guess is that a "configure tkhtml3" step is needed in configure.ac and the TCL_PATH and TK_PATH variables will be involved... |
| 01:45.41 | ``Erik | yes, yes. *shakes fist at needing to re-run autogen.sh for this tkhtml shit) |
| 01:45.54 | starseeker | sorry |
| 01:46.34 | starseeker | invites ``Erik to do it using better way |
| 01:46.38 | starseeker | please... |
| 02:28.44 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 03:31.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32898 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/: Remove customized tkhtml3 |
| 03:37.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32899 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/ (53 files in 4 dirs): Re-add tkhtml3 with setup closer to original. |
| 03:39.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32900 10/brlcad/trunk/ (3 files in 3 dirs): |
| 03:39.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Last steps of the reworking of tkhtml3's inclusion in src/other - keep things |
| 03:39.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: much closer to the existing tkhtml3 build logic, use their configure.in and |
| 03:39.38 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Makefile.in, and install 'correctly' - package require Tkhtml 3.0 now works. |
| 03:39.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Adjusted mged dialog implementations accordingly. |
| 03:39.49 | starseeker | YES |
| 03:44.23 | starseeker | heh, weird - I couldn't draw up the phone conversion in mged, but after several hours of raytracing (cpu = 10214.8 sec, elapsed - 11896.9 sec) rt produced this image: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/phone.png |
| 03:48.47 | starseeker | still needs to test for tkhtml3 in a system tcl/tk and build if not found, but tomorrow for that |
| 03:49.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32901 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: Ooops - add Makefile.in |
| 03:56.02 | starseeker | tests the build one more time... |
| 03:57.02 | starseeker | there we go |
| 03:57.06 | starseeker | swwwwweeeeeet |
| 03:57.30 | starseeker | next up, a (slightly) better help browser |
| 04:05.48 | Axman6 | \o/ |
| 05:10.31 | starseeker | works on linux - good |
| 05:10.34 | starseeker | sleeps |
| 05:10.39 | brlcad | :) |
| 05:12.56 | brlcad | image looks like that because it's got trimming curves on the nurbs surface |
| 05:13.05 | brlcad | old nurbs don't support trimmings |
| 05:13.15 | brlcad | was never fully implemented |
| 05:14.16 | brlcad | starseeker: as for hooking in, look at AC_CONFIG_SUBDIRS |
| 05:14.22 | brlcad | we do that already |
| 07:00.46 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:07.14 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.204.142) | |
| 08:36.37 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 10:17.49 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.202.188) | |
| 10:57.54 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 10:59.15 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 11:38.09 | brlcad | points at his highlights |
| 11:38.19 | brlcad | wanders walkabout |
| 12:38.07 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 13:14.44 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-4 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 14:17.41 | *** join/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.118.79.42) | |
| 14:40.46 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:45.24 | claymore | o.O |
| 14:47.39 | starseeker | regains consciousness (or as close as he ever gets) |
| 14:51.28 | brlcad | :) |
| 14:53.52 | claymore | brlcad: He's back! Coming in today? |
| 14:56.50 | starseeker | is tempted by the Army Technical Manual on ebay but can't help thinking it's a bit pricy... |
| 14:57.04 | starseeker | http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220289588108 |
| 14:57.06 | comics | starseeker: see www.ansysed.narod.ru/3ptarb.html - and check e-mail - and answer to me. |
| 15:00.46 | starseeker | comics: hang on, my machine doesn't seem to have the right fonts for this... |
| 15:01.23 | comics | starseeker: no! unicode utf-8 |
| 15:01.34 | comics | everyone has it |
| 15:02.27 | starseeker | apparently not |
| 15:08.13 | brlcad | comics: I think that page is lacking the proper encoding markers, because it's showing up as garbage |
| 15:09.26 | comics | well, i see it thru linux - juse choose UTF-8 in browser. |
| 15:09.47 | brlcad | you shouldn't have to choose it -- that's why it works for you |
| 15:10.06 | brlcad | the problem isn't the page -- if I save it to file and open it, it'll render correctly |
| 15:10.21 | brlcad | which means the web server is sending the wrong encoding |
| 15:14.26 | *** join/#brlcad theBishop (n=theBisho@67-134-234-189.dia.static.qwest.net) | |
| 15:14.46 | brlcad | howdy theBishop |
| 15:14.57 | theBishop | :) |
| 15:16.08 | starseeker | comics: OK, I see email - I will create a docbook example and send it back to you |
| 15:38.50 | ``Erik | I'm feeling less and less happy about the docbook stuff |
| 15:39.18 | ``Erik | it requires fop, which requires java, ... which is not... common in my little quirkosphere |
| 15:39.29 | starseeker | It only requires fop for pdf |
| 15:39.49 | ``Erik | so man pages still come up on a bare nekkid unix machine? |
| 15:39.56 | starseeker | absolutely |
| 15:40.02 | ``Erik | okie, good |
| 15:40.27 | ``Erik | "bare naked" is not one of those linux monstrosities, btw... :D |
| 15:45.00 | starseeker | As long as you've got a decent man command |
| 15:47.40 | comics | starseeker: what browser do you have? |
| 15:47.55 | comics | "Automatic encoding"? |
| 16:05.57 | *** part/#brlcad comics (n=asus@217.118.79.42) | |
| 16:12.51 | starseeker | firefox |
| 16:13.00 | starseeker | I get same as brlcad - OK if I save the file. |
| 16:13.03 | starseeker | it's the web server |
| 16:13.23 | starseeker | comics: I sent you an example |
| 16:14.06 | starseeker | needs to get going |
| 16:14.17 | starseeker | kicks CIA-4 |
| 16:14.18 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 16:14.23 | starseeker | hmm |
| 17:00.31 | brlcad | cia has been mysteriously dropping (or not receiving) notifications randomly for about a week now |
| 17:00.52 | brlcad | about 30% fail to show up it seems |
| 17:09.57 | claymore | just like the CIA to miss information... sheesh. *ducks* |
| 17:10.09 | claymore | kicks CIA-4 |
| 17:10.10 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 17:10.17 | claymore | lol, thats great. |
| 17:10.26 | claymore | is easily amused. |
| 17:18.24 | PrezKennedy | punches CIA-4 in the nose |
| 17:20.53 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 17:28.13 | claymore | daaaaaaaaaaaamn, he got knocked the **** out! |
| 17:29.10 | brlcad | ~fishslap claymore |
| 17:29.11 | ibot | ACTION slaps claymore up side the head with a wet fish. |
| 17:29.26 | claymore | Salmon? |
| 17:29.45 | claymore | ~suckerpunch brlcad |
| 17:29.54 | claymore | Hrm.... didn't work :P |
| 17:38.47 | brlcad | ~suckerpunch claymore |
| 17:38.47 | ibot | ACTION wanders casually by brlcad and abruptly delivers a stiff upper-cut to brlcad's lower jaw |
| 17:38.54 | brlcad | hah, oops :) |
| 17:39.37 | brlcad | ~suckerpunch claymore |
| 17:39.37 | ibot | ACTION wanders casually by claymore and abruptly delivers a stiff upper-cut to claymore's lower jaw |
| 17:39.43 | brlcad | that's better |
| 17:39.46 | claymore | lol |
| 17:40.32 | brlcad | listkeys sucker |
| 17:40.37 | brlcad | ~listkeys sucker |
| 17:40.48 | brlcad | mm.. |
| 17:40.50 | claymore | just don't add donkeypunch or you will lose a lot of channel members... |
| 17:41.00 | brlcad | ~sucker punch someone |
| 17:41.01 | ibot | ACTION slugs someone in the gut |
| 17:41.42 | brlcad | couldn't lose anymore than whale slapping ;) |
| 17:45.14 | archivist | hmm must add more violence my bot |
| 17:50.47 | claymore | ~suckerpunch brlcad |
| 17:50.48 | ibot | ACTION wanders casually by brlcad and abruptly delivers a stiff upper-cut to brlcad's lower jaw |
| 17:51.40 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:54.30 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:55.37 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:19.26 | *** join/#brlcad Nikty (n=nicholas@89.163.117.94) | |
| 18:19.29 | Nikty | hi |
| 18:19.35 | brlcad | hello |
| 18:19.50 | Nikty | ``Erik: i see freebsd port is marked as broken now) |
| 18:20.09 | Nikty | so, X crashing problem was not only for me ) |
| 18:20.55 | Nikty | btw, can brlcad export ro autocads' .dwg? |
| 18:26.38 | brlcad | Nikty: no, dwg is a closed/proprietary file format |
| 18:26.54 | Nikty | clear |
| 18:26.55 | brlcad | not likely we'd support that format any time soon |
| 18:30.09 | brlcad | ``Erik: you have an airline pref? |
| 18:36.56 | *** join/#brlcad sysed (n=asus@217.118.79.35) | |
| 18:38.16 | sysed | Brenda was in her bedroom when her roommate came home. Her roommate Naima is a very busty blonde who loves to play with Brenda's firm assertions. She slowly walks into Brenda's room and climbs into bed with her. She then pulls down Brenda's panties and gives her tushy a nice kiss. |
| 18:38.51 | sysed | reminds: "another gender, no computers" - The spirit of Nicolopopas |
| 18:41.05 | claymore | ~fishslap sysed |
| 18:41.06 | ibot | ACTION slaps sysed up side the head with a wet fish. |
| 18:41.13 | sysed | Tina and Joni were hanging out together after work. They are both bartenders at one of the most sophisticated computer clubs in the city. After work they decided to take a showers then settle down with each other. After a few minutes of kissing and touching brave new FOSS, Tina bends Joni over the couch and proceeds to give her a very deep anal tongue! |
| 18:41.47 | sysed | reminds: "Another gender, not computers - is our goal" - the spirit of Niclolopas |
| 18:42.19 | sysed | seriously, i will live in such a kind world! |
| 18:42.49 | claymore | ~suckerpunch sysed |
| 18:42.50 | ibot | ACTION wanders casually by sysed and abruptly delivers a stiff upper-cut to sysed's lower jaw |
| 18:43.31 | sysed | come on! Kids don't draw 3D models! Relax! |
| 18:43.45 | brlcad | sysed: please don't |
| 18:43.50 | sysed | ok |
| 18:44.19 | sysed | just've uncovered and unfold something new |
| 18:47.36 | claymore | is not sure he wants to know... |
| 18:48.08 | sysed | just have never seen anything more kind... except free open source software |
| 18:48.24 | sysed | no, choose freedom |
| 18:48.47 | *** part/#brlcad Nikty (n=nicholas@89.163.117.94) | |
| 18:49.35 | claymore | right..... |
| 18:52.43 | sysed | kindness as it is |
| 18:55.20 | starseeker | thank goodness |
| 18:55.32 | starseeker | would have kicked |
| 18:55.35 | brlcad | starseeker: that was comic |
| 18:55.45 | brlcad | er, "comics" |
| 18:55.46 | starseeker | oh, lovely |
| 18:56.07 | starseeker | great - how are we supposed to trust his translations now |
| 18:56.50 | claymore | my first reaction to his first post was: "Pics or it never happened!" But then he got wierd.... |
| 18:58.18 | brlcad | he stopped when asked, so no persisted harm done -- it's only when they ignore the channel nettiquette after learning it that makes someone an assclown |
| 18:59.39 | brlcad | yeah, that was just very "wierd" .. probably bored if I had to guess |
| 19:00.09 | starseeker | he shouldn't be bored - he has a template now for MGED command docbook :-P |
| 19:00.30 | claymore | Based on the scene he was setting, um, the last thing on my mind would be FOSS... |
| 19:00.39 | brlcad | ah, so working on mged docs did that to him .. ;) |
| 19:01.26 | starseeker | The 3ptarb commit that CIA declined to mention should work for most of the existing description/examples pairs found in current MGED documentation |
| 19:02.09 | brlcad | you should commit an empty templated example |
| 19:02.23 | starseeker | nods |
| 19:11.31 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32904 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/ (README mged_cmd_template.xml): Add a template to help when converting existing MGED command documentation in html files to Docbook man pages. |
| 19:13.22 | starseeker | admits to thinking it is cool that all he has to do is add the xml file to system/man1/en and put in the Makefile.am directory. |
| 19:14.03 | starseeker | file, not directory |
| 20:04.46 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:05.52 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14E413.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:06.46 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc_ (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 20:34.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32905 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am nirt.xml): Add nirt.xml to man1. |
| 20:36.37 | starseeker | brlcad: Erm. Should I go ahead and upload the rtarea man page or will your rewrite change things? |
| 20:37.01 | brlcad | don't wait for me |
| 20:37.06 | starseeker | k |
| 20:45.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32906 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/Makefile.am: Add rtarea to man1 |
| 20:46.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32907 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/rtarea.xml: Add rtarea to man1 - add the file this time |
| 20:58.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32908 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am rtcheck.xml): Add rtcheck to man1 |
| 21:10.25 | *** join/#brlcad phreak_ (n=phreak@70-56-28-87.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 22:11.15 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.202.188) | |
| 22:59.12 | ``Erik | nikty: I submitted a patch for the fbsd port |
| 22:59.35 | ``Erik | brlcad: not really, uh, !swa i guess? tell me where to be, I'll do it |
| 23:00.52 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 23:00.54 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 23:00.57 | brlcad | ``Erik: you should have an e-mail |
| 23:01.00 | brlcad | hey punky |
| 23:01.09 | ``Erik | bites punker |
| 23:01.11 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 23:01.27 | punkrockgirl | i thought you were napping :P |
| 23:01.41 | ``Erik | punker is gonna dj in a bit and she's doing two of my 'finds', so ya'll should listen |
| 23:01.43 | punkrockgirl | i came by to invite people to listen to my show in an hour :D |
| 23:01.46 | ``Erik | "elbow" and "the bird and the bee" |
| 23:01.48 | brlcad | work's over, he should be done napping |
| 23:01.56 | ``Erik | no, I had today off |
| 23:02.03 | punkrockgirl | yeah, he's a bum |
| 23:02.15 | ``Erik | monday is holiday and my rdo, so I get today as holiday, took my car to the shop, worked on the yard waste some, etc |
| 23:02.17 | punkrockgirl | 4 day weekend for columbus day? |
| 23:02.23 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 23:02.24 | ``Erik | cleaned the garage for a bit |
| 23:02.26 | punkrockgirl | i dont get off on monday |
| 23:02.31 | punkrockgirl | what is that about? |
| 23:02.43 | ``Erik | ? |
| 23:02.49 | punkrockgirl | ? |
| 23:02.55 | ``Erik | what is what about? O.o |
| 23:02.57 | punkrockgirl | why dont i get off on monday? |
| 23:03.01 | punkrockgirl | and you do |
| 23:03.05 | punkrockgirl | how does that work? |
| 23:03.06 | ``Erik | cuz I rock and yo usuck |
| 23:03.15 | brlcad | what's that url again? |
| 23:03.17 | punkrockgirl | you cannot even type correctly |
| 23:03.22 | ``Erik | troubleradio.net |
| 23:03.23 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 23:05.52 | punkrockgirl | i need to go make a playlist |
| 23:05.56 | brlcad | ~punkrockgirl is a suave chic punk rock chick that sometime DJ's for www.troubleradio.net and is rumored to have some sort of affiliation with ``Erik so check out the station sometime to hear her tunage |
| 23:05.57 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 23:05.59 | ``Erik | ya gonna do both bird and the bee songs? |
| 23:06.01 | punkrockgirl | and my dumb mic better work or i might smash it |
| 23:06.03 | punkrockgirl | sure |
| 23:06.23 | punkrockgirl | haha, some sort of affiliation ;) |
| 23:06.33 | punkrockgirl | and i'm suave |
| 23:06.34 | punkrockgirl | lol |
| 23:06.40 | ``Erik | settle down, rico O.o |
| 23:06.46 | punkrockgirl | my friend used to call me rica suave |
| 23:06.48 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 23:06.53 | ``Erik | so'z I can affiliate you until you can't walk |
| 23:06.54 | ``Erik | *cough* |
| 23:06.57 | punkrockgirl | hehe |
| 23:07.09 | brlcad | now I can find the url ;) |
| 23:07.13 | brlcad | ~punkrockgirl |
| 23:07.14 | ibot | i guess punkrockgirl is a suave chic punk rock chick that sometime DJ's for http://www.troubleradio.net and is rumored to have some sort of affiliation with ``Erik so check out the station sometime to hear her tunage |
| 23:07.19 | ``Erik | soul coughing would be good, too |
| 23:07.31 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 23:07.34 | ``Erik | ~c |
| 23:07.35 | ibot | somebody said c was for maniacs C code. C code run. Run, code, run. Please? |
| 23:07.45 | ``Erik | ~tcl |
| 23:07.46 | ibot | [tcl] at http://www.scriptics.com/ or in feed "http://handhelds.org/feeds/tcl" |
| 23:07.48 | ``Erik | ~lisp |
| 23:07.49 | ibot | i guess lisp is a theory that unexpectedly became a programming language http://paulgraham.com/icad.html |
| 23:07.54 | ``Erik | ~monkeyspank |
| 23:07.55 | brlcad | hah |
| 23:07.58 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
| 23:08.07 | brlcad | ~spank ``Erik |
| 23:08.08 | ibot | ACTION bends ``Erik over his knee and tatoos 'ibot' on ``Erik's pasty white buttocks. |
| 23:08.16 | ``Erik | kinky |
| 23:08.25 | ``Erik | wow, byrds came up on helen |
| 23:08.26 | ``Erik | O.O |
| 23:08.38 | ``Erik | strips and dances funky |
| 23:09.17 | punkrockgirl | hawt |
| 23:14.19 | punkrockgirl | i think bucc is telling helen what to play |
| 23:15.12 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: so are you on now? |
| 23:15.35 | ``Erik | at 8, I reckon O.o |
| 23:15.42 | brlcad | ah,k |
| 23:16.41 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@70-56-28-87.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 23:18.34 | ``Erik | grumbles because his car is not in his garage |
| 23:19.34 | punkrockgirl | yeah not yet, in like 45 mins |
| 23:22.02 | punkrockgirl | what were those bird/bee songs? |
| 23:22.03 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 23:22.26 | ``Erik | heh |
| 23:22.32 | ``Erik | "fucking boyfriend" and "again and again" |
| 23:22.52 | ``Erik | bands name is "the bird and the bee" |
| 23:24.32 | punkrockgirl | yes i know |
| 23:24.45 | punkrockgirl | i just couldnt remember which song |
| 23:26.14 | ``Erik | but all of 'em are good, that band kicks butt |
| 23:30.41 | ``Erik | "paladins can't use the helm of destruction" family guy ftw |
| 23:36.28 | punkrockgirl | i may go in in a min |
| 23:41.05 | ``Erik | heh, lame, a light strike force is 200 cruisers, 800 fighters, and 400 cyclers to pick up the trash... this game gets lame :( |
| 23:43.51 | punkrockgirl | yeah im just aimlessly making shit |
| 23:43.55 | punkrockgirl | im not really sure what im doing :D |
| 23:44.03 | ``Erik | make fighters and cruisers mostly |
| 23:44.05 | punkrockgirl | and no, i didnt read the url you told me to read |
| 23:44.10 | ``Erik | heh |
| 23:44.30 | ``Erik | brlcad managed to pass up my level :( he didn't get stomped on like I did |
| 23:44.52 | ``Erik | I'm thinking after i'm done with this guild excursion, I'm gonna come home and destroy dm. |
| 23:44.55 | ``Erik | like, all of it |
| 23:45.04 | ``Erik | pewpewpew |
| 23:45.23 | ``Erik | I passed on easy targets when you were in that guild, but they booted ya, so, y'know, ... |
| 23:45.27 | ``Erik | pewpewpew :D |
| 23:46.01 | punkrockgirl | ok im on |
| 23:46.03 | punkrockgirl | so go listen |
| 23:46.08 | punkrockgirl | im testing the mic |
| 23:47.02 | ``Erik | all but one of my bases will have pshields tomorrow, so I'm feeling fairly well defended |
| 23:47.10 | ``Erik | and I need monies for pringles |
| 23:48.04 | punkrockgirl | jesus |
| 23:48.08 | punkrockgirl | so no mic i assume? |
| 23:48.09 | ``Erik | nope |
| 23:51.43 | punkrockgirl | im gonna reboot |
| 23:51.43 | punkrockgirl | brb |
| 23:55.42 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-92-23.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 23:56.52 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 23:56.57 | punkrockgirl | ok pray for me |
| 23:57.21 | punkrockgirl | and are you still listening? |
| 23:58.06 | punkrockgirl | im back on |
| 23:59.07 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 23:59.09 | ``Erik | beck |
| 23:59.13 | ``Erik | right? |
| 23:59.19 | ``Erik | yeah, beck - gamma ray |
| 23:59.45 | ``Erik | I moved my tiny assault fleet, got a message saying I was out of range for level |
| 23:59.47 | ``Erik | *pout* |
| 00:00.00 | ``Erik | that means a) I suck and b) target spotted me |
| 00:00.18 | ``Erik | I should head up to 59 to whack that learner boy, mebbe get some monies that way |
| 00:00.39 | punkrockgirl | yes |
| 00:00.44 | punkrockgirl | ok listen |
| 00:01.47 | ``Erik | no voice |
| 00:01.49 | ``Erik | just dead air |
| 00:02.39 | punkrockgirl | christ |
| 00:02.42 | punkrockgirl | why |
| 00:02.44 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 00:03.40 | ``Erik | not a clue, the VUmeter read hot when you did it? |
| 00:03.43 | punkrockgirl | um, what is sprtcmd.exe |
| 00:03.50 | punkrockgirl | yes |
| 00:04.54 | ``Erik | "dell support agent" |
| 00:04.57 | ``Erik | http://www.what-is-exe.com/filenames/sprtcmd-exe.html |
| 00:05.50 | punkrockgirl | well here is your song |
| 00:05.50 | ``Erik | elbow, w00t |
| 00:05.53 | ``Erik | *dance* |
| 00:06.08 | ``Erik | you don't dig it? |
| 00:07.44 | punkrockgirl | sure i do |
| 00:09.20 | punkrockgirl | im so mad at this craphole computer |
| 00:09.21 | ``Erik | dead air again |
| 00:09.39 | ``Erik | got a rebuffering stream window, may've been my end |
| 00:09.58 | ``Erik | heh, wow, you're just chugging my requests one after another here O.o |
| 00:10.15 | punkrockgirl | ;D |
| 00:10.21 | punkrockgirl | its cuz i like you |
| 00:10.29 | ``Erik | sweet, the non-censored version |
| 00:11.28 | ``Erik | yes, that's right. I'm not metrosexual, I'm not gay, I'm APPLE gay. |
| 00:12.14 | ``Erik | bends over and shoves a mac pro up his rectum O.o |
| 00:12.43 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
| 00:12.45 | punkrockgirl | im scared |
| 00:14.04 | ``Erik | mac pro is a scary big machine with big vented surfaces and big fins |
| 00:14.22 | punkrockgirl | and um |
| 00:14.28 | punkrockgirl | you want it up your ass because...? |
| 00:14.28 | ``Erik | awesome footrest |
| 00:14.33 | ``Erik | also; l7 ftw |
| 00:14.43 | ``Erik | cuz I'm apple gay? |
| 00:15.20 | ``Erik | dont' you want a http://switchtoamac.com/images/hardware/macs/macpro/macpro_hero.jpg in your rectum? |
| 00:15.54 | punkrockgirl | omg listen i might have fixed it |
| 00:15.57 | punkrockgirl | and um, no? |
| 00:15.58 | ``Erik | l7 is kinda weird, they're not quite grrl |
| 00:16.04 | ``Erik | but real effin' close |
| 00:16.32 | ``Erik | uh, grrl was a sorta kinda subgenre of the seattle scene in the early 90's |
| 00:16.35 | ``Erik | no voice, dead air |
| 00:17.28 | ``Erik | when I was dj'ing, I usually had a laptop in the living room hooked up to the zomfg audio system and listening to the stream... and the audio output on my laptop I was dj'ing from was turned off |
| 00:17.29 | ``Erik | :) |
| 00:18.20 | punkrockgirl | heh |
| 00:18.23 | punkrockgirl | i know? |
| 00:18.40 | punkrockgirl | although my stereo is downstairs and im not |
| 00:19.31 | ``Erik | just sayin' what I did *shrug* |
| 00:19.58 | ``Erik | you've seen my setup, I had the audio system cranking the toons and sat at my table dj'ing |
| 00:20.44 | ``Erik | brlcad, wake up, I wanna float some thoughts by ya |
| 00:21.35 | ``Erik | I want asc to be important, like, move the in/out into the primitive logic and gut asc2g/g2asc |
| 00:22.21 | ``Erik | dead air again, punker |
| 00:24.40 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:24.57 | ``Erik | i think we need to capture keyframe information for linear interpolation |
| 00:25.02 | ``Erik | minimally |
| 00:26.07 | ``Erik | ponders the meaning of interpolation with complex primitives (pipe, metaball) and changes in tree form O.o skeery) |
| 00:27.02 | clock_ | complex primitives? With an imaginary part? |
| 00:27.04 | ``Erik | your mic kinda works now, very quiet, though |
| 00:27.12 | clock_ | shouldn't work so much with complex impedances |
| 00:27.28 | punkrockgirl | still trying |
| 00:27.38 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: cool nick |
| 00:27.47 | ``Erik | clock, things like bot, pipe and metaball are insane primitives |
| 00:27.50 | punkrockgirl | thanks :D |
| 00:28.04 | ``Erik | I call them "complex", I don't mean +i, I mean nontrivial :) |
| 00:28.06 | clock_ | is a bot, ``Erik is a pipe |
| 00:28.19 | ``Erik | 'sall good, punker likes my pipe |
| 00:28.24 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 00:28.26 | punkrockgirl | :D |
| 00:28.30 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: youre a girl? |
| 00:28.56 | ``Erik | yes, she is |
| 00:29.09 | ``Erik | last I checked, anyways |
| 00:30.30 | ``Erik | annoying, I thought I found a target, but level cap got me |
| 00:30.47 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: and you like punk and/or rock? Iggy Pop? Devo? |
| 00:31.03 | ``Erik | your voice level is WAY below the music level, baby... |
| 00:31.08 | punkrockgirl | i know im working on it |
| 00:31.15 | punkrockgirl | i'm dj'ing right now clock, go listen :D |
| 00:31.22 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 00:31.23 | ``Erik | troubleradio.net |
| 00:31.26 | punkrockgirl | except my dumb mic hates me |
| 00:31.27 | ``Erik | :) |
| 00:32.26 | ``Erik | I'm continually impressed by audioslave, btw... swapping zach for chris... awesomeness ensues |
| 00:32.27 | clock_ | punkrockgirl and the smurfettes |
| 00:32.32 | clock_ | first read surfettes |
| 00:32.45 | punkrockgirl | haha |
| 00:32.53 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: do you have a pic? I am a gay so you don't have to worry that I would pester you |
| 00:33.05 | punkrockgirl | ask erik for one of me :) |
| 00:33.22 | ``Erik | I mean, it's cool that zach has a message, but, wtf, chill out, man |
| 00:33.23 | punkrockgirl | or i suppose i could give you my myspace |
| 00:33.33 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: pity that the radio doesn't transmit in Ogg Vorbis |
| 00:33.50 | ``Erik | heh, even if clock liked the tuna boat, he's in effin' croatia :D |
| 00:35.42 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: you have a nice voice |
| 00:35.44 | ``Erik | it's not an on/off issue, t's a volume issue |
| 00:36.04 | ``Erik | the "what if I do this" got you slightly louder |
| 00:36.20 | ``Erik | tegan and sarah? |
| 00:36.32 | ``Erik | oh, santogold |
| 00:36.35 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: you play only punk rock and so? |
| 00:38.35 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:39.10 | ``Erik | she's up the street from me |
| 00:39.14 | ``Erik | like 1.5 hour drive |
| 00:39.44 | ``Erik | philly, yo |
| 00:39.55 | punkrockgirl | oh yeah? you visit her often? |
| 00:40.03 | ``Erik | you betcha |
| 00:40.06 | punkrockgirl | clock: can you hear me? my dumb mic sucks :( |
| 00:40.10 | ``Erik | hot nasty sex, every night |
| 00:40.28 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 00:40.39 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: I could hear you but it was much less loud than the music. After I adjusted my volume to your voice the music was too loud afterwards |
| 00:40.42 | punkrockgirl | clock: kinda, idk i play like alt stuff |
| 00:40.55 | punkrockgirl | lol yeah im gonna turn the music down i think in a sec |
| 00:40.58 | clock_ | Do you play commercial music or Creative Commons? |
| 00:41.32 | Ralith | ``Erik: aren't hot and nasty mutually exclusive? |
| 00:41.43 | clock_ | suggest Raveonettes: Love In A Trashcan, Iggy Pop: Passenger or Devo: Gut Feeling |
| 00:42.25 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: you should rather turn the voice up. Otherwise the music will not exploit the whole dynamic range. |
| 00:42.35 | punkrockgirl | the mic is maxed out |
| 00:42.35 | ``Erik | ralith: hardly |
| 00:42.38 | punkrockgirl | i cant figure out whats wrong |
| 00:42.53 | ``Erik | ravenettes, I saw 'em live and have their trashcan cd, they're good |
| 00:43.07 | ``Erik | boy drank wine like it was going out of style |
| 00:43.17 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: now the music is modulated exactly properly, utilizing the whole range |
| 00:43.24 | clock_ | checked a streamdump in audacity |
| 00:43.32 | ``Erik | reminded me of terry, who probably plays guitar better :) |
| 00:44.12 | ``Erik | girl only strapped the guitar on for like 2 songs |
| 00:44.16 | ``Erik | was a good show, though |
| 00:44.33 | ``Erik | and I was able to buy guinness on tap, so it was all good |
| 00:44.42 | ``Erik | hah |
| 00:44.50 | punkrockgirl | maybe i'll just play music and not talk then ;D |
| 00:45.41 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: hehe youre playing those raveonettes :) |
| 00:45.50 | clock_ | didnt listen for a moment when he played with stream dumps |
| 00:45.57 | clock_ | thanks to punkrockgirl for the raveonettes |
| 00:46.38 | ``Erik | this is makin' me sad, cuz, uh, this is the band when he saw wehn punker was, uh, doin' things and stuff to some married dude :( |
| 00:46.56 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: what about this Creative Commons CC-BY-SA tune it's kinda faster blues would you fit into your programme? http://ronja.twibright.com/cc-by-sa_music/Red\ Light.ogg |
| 00:47.15 | clock_ | I put it as a soundtrack to my surfing movie |
| 00:47.16 | ``Erik | punker is a winiot, karel |
| 00:47.35 | clock_ | oh has to be mp3? |
| 00:47.56 | clock_ | specific bitrate? |
| 00:48.17 | ``Erik | she uses the, uh, winamp plugin, I believe |
| 00:48.28 | clock_ | winamp should be able to play ogg |
| 00:49.03 | punkrockgirl | idk ogg |
| 00:49.06 | clock_ | but there is an mp3 somehwere |
| 00:49.33 | punkrockgirl | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:49.54 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: here should be mp3 directly from jamendo http://download3.jamendo.com/download/track/73007/mp32/f6f58829c9/Red%20Light.mp3 |
| 00:50.15 | clock_ | Or here is the page if that won't work http://www.jamendo.com/en/album/6439 |
| 00:50.20 | clock_ | It's called Red Light |
| 00:50.39 | clock_ | I also have my own directory of my the-best-of CC-BY-SA from Jamendo |
| 00:50.52 | clock_ | http://ronja.twibright.com/cc-by-sa_music/ |
| 00:50.58 | clock_ | Ogg vorbis 128kbps all unfortunately |
| 00:51.00 | punkrockgirl | im afraid to try to open it cuz my computer will wipe out my playlist |
| 00:51.03 | punkrockgirl | and play that instead ;P |
| 00:51.08 | punkrockgirl | 128 is ok |
| 00:51.15 | punkrockgirl | 96 sucks ;P |
| 00:51.23 | punkrockgirl | some of my songs are unfortunately 128 |
| 00:51.37 | clock_ | 128kbps ogg is like 160 mp3 |
| 00:52.16 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: you need songs with singing? |
| 00:52.18 | ``Erik | 160 vbr mp3 |
| 00:52.27 | ``Erik | vbr is big shit |
| 00:52.40 | clock_ | ``Erik: why? |
| 00:52.59 | punkrockgirl | i prefer songs with singing |
| 00:53.00 | punkrockgirl | ;D |
| 00:53.03 | ``Erik | 168 mp3 vs 168 vbr is insanely different |
| 00:53.09 | punkrockgirl | ok im gonna run kara |
| 00:53.13 | punkrockgirl | i'll be in and out here |
| 00:53.15 | punkrockgirl | ;D |
| 00:53.20 | ``Erik | do they need a tank? |
| 00:53.38 | clock_ | M1A1 Abrams? |
| 00:54.10 | ``Erik | bah, who uses a1 anymore? it's all m1a2 now |
| 00:54.22 | ``Erik | with the packs on |
| 00:56.59 | punkrockgirl | if you would ever log in :P |
| 00:57.08 | punkrockgirl | there is another run i think tonight |
| 00:58.40 | ``Erik | well, I'm waiting for you to tell me hwen to get in a group :( |
| 00:59.19 | ``Erik | i'm your "pocket tank" :( |
| 01:06.08 | *** join/#brlcad a-nice (n=asus@217.118.79.43) | |
| 01:06.44 | *** part/#brlcad a-nice (n=asus@217.118.79.43) | |
| 01:06.45 | *** join/#brlcad a-nice (n=asus@217.118.79.43) | |
| 01:08.26 | starseeker | fights the urge to write a user manual for rt... |
| 01:12.25 | a-nice | starseeker: can you write manuals and docs for telecommunicarion? |
| 01:12.43 | starseeker | what's that? |
| 01:13.03 | a-nice | if you cam, you can cut some money |
| 01:13.07 | a-nice | see IM |
| 01:13.58 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@70-56-28-87.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 01:14.23 | a-nice | see? |
| 01:14.42 | brlcad | ``Erik: heh, with unfulfilled threats from folks 30 levels up that figured out it would be profitable? :) |
| 01:15.13 | starseeker | a-nice: Heh. Not my area of interest though |
| 01:15.25 | starseeker | not much $$ for the effort involved, either |
| 01:15.59 | a-nice | starseeker: but check their offers. could be yours |
| 01:16.12 | starseeker | has full time job :-) |
| 01:16.14 | a-nice | yes, i think same |
| 01:16.29 | a-nice | oh... I thought you're student |
| 01:16.38 | starseeker | nope |
| 01:16.47 | a-nice | a nice... |
| 01:17.01 | a-nice | i thought you do |
| 01:17.10 | brlcad | so gut away, refactoring junk from apps back up into the libs is always good |
| 01:17.28 | starseeker | eh? |
| 01:17.45 | brlcad | and especially any places in the code where there are tables of primitive types.. that junk belongs up with the primitives |
| 01:18.02 | starseeker | Ah - you're thinking like nirt, only more so? :-P |
| 01:18.12 | a-nice | brlcad: can we wait e.g. automatic dimensioning from coders? just someday. as Pro-E? |
| 01:18.42 | starseeker | would end up implementing a zoom option on rt if he dug into it... |
| 01:22.12 | starseeker | heads home... |
| 01:29.19 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 01:33.59 | a-nice | PrezKennedy: i voted for you |
| 01:36.35 | brlcad | starseeker: was referring to ``Erik and something he was mentioning earlier |
| 01:36.46 | brlcad | about refactoring asc2g/g2asc up into src/librt/primitives |
| 01:37.06 | brlcad | a-nice: some day, sure |
| 01:50.58 | *** part/#brlcad a-nice (n=asus@217.118.79.43) | |
| 04:28.50 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah :-) |
| 04:29.13 | starseeker | that makes more sense :-) |
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| 23:31.46 | punkrockgirl | hi people |
| 23:31.52 | punkrockgirl | and bots |
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| 03:50.19 | starseeker | punkrockgirl: howdy |
| 04:16.24 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 07:02.19 | *** part/#brlcad illethal (n=oden@c-71-200-221-159.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) | |
| 07:33.20 | brlcad | pokes in and waves |
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| 08:35.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r32909 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (Makefile.am pcMathGrammar.h): |
| 08:35.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: working towards a Math Grammar for the creation of stack by parsing so that |
| 08:35.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: MathVM can evaluate it. NameGrammar, VariableGrammar, ExpressionGrammar to be |
| 08:35.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: extended. Variable_grammar and Constraint_grammar presently in pcParser to be |
| 08:35.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: modified/removed |
| 10:29.52 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 11:36.43 | louipc | punkrockgirl: check out this band from NJ http://www.myspace.com/darkempireband |
| 12:41.12 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D108.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
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| 14:47.34 | *** join/#brlcad pacman871 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 15:37.58 | brlcad | \o/ homovulgaris added closure to the expression grammar |
| 17:24.06 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-72-7.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 18:55.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32912 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (64 files): lots of style, indendation, and comment consistency cleanups |
| 18:59.29 | punkrockgirl | louic: they sound good with a hint of evil that kinda scares me ;) |
| 18:59.35 | punkrockgirl | starseeker: hi |
| 19:05.46 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: hey |
| 19:06.03 | clock_ | punkrockgirl: wheres the radio URL? |
| 19:21.24 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net but im not on right now |
| 19:21.32 | punkrockgirl | i think the bot is playing |
| 19:32.49 | *** part/#brlcad tony-h (n=aeheathc@dumbo.csl.mtu.edu) | |
| 20:01.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32913 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: ws |
| 20:23.57 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 20:35.29 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 20:37.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32914 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/xdr.c: get rid of dead code, bu_gtimeval bu_ptimeval |
| 20:53.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32915 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/uce-dirent.h: revert style chnages, not our file. |
| 21:02.44 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D108.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
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| 01:56.45 | starseeker | plays around with Docbook 5... |
| 02:25.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32916 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/rb_internals.h: comments tweakage |
| 04:01.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32917 10/brlcad/trunk/src/irprep/ (Makefile.am see2.1 see2.c): remove unused duplication, kill see2. |
| 04:03.42 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32918 10/brlcad/trunk/src/irprep/ (Makefile.am see.1 see.c): remove unused duplication, kill see (replaced by ir-X). |
| 06:23.42 | *** join/#brlcad alex_jon1 (n=juve@81.196.65.201) | |
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| 07:53.37 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32919 10/brlcad/trunk/ (20 files in 9 dirs): move g-dxf, dxf-g, and bot-bldxf into src/conv/dxf so some of the common functionality can be abstracted. |
| 08:01.52 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32920 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/CMakeLists.txt: moved dxf sources to subdir |
| 13:02.53 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 13:02.55 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14F923.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:11.10 | mafm | hello |
| 13:55.56 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:34.11 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 14:38.21 | mafm | back at Lisbon |
| 14:38.42 | mafm | so... lot's of fun and so on :) |
| 14:50.01 | brlcad | cool |
| 14:50.06 | brlcad | vacation traveling? or family? |
| 14:51.53 | mafm | this time vacation + bureaocracies |
| 14:52.08 | mafm | I won't be back there for 2 months or so |
| 14:59.57 | brlcad | curious how you'd travel and disappear |
| 15:00.05 | brlcad | I know when I travel, I stay connected :) |
| 15:00.49 | brlcad | screen is particularly great for that, but even just being offline *shudder* |
| 15:26.46 | ``Erik | vile vehemence. Random acts of unruliness. blah. |
| 15:27.15 | ``Erik | $2400 for a routine workover of my car. *sob* |
| 15:27.44 | ``Erik | with another 5000 waiting for me. |
| 15:57.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32921 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf/ (Makefile.am dxf-g.c dxf.h g-dxf.c): eliminate the duplication. separate the rgb table into a common header file. |
| 16:04.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32922 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf/dxf-g.c: remove about 100 lines of duplication, the text and attrib processing functions were identical |
| 16:10.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32923 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g-x3d.c: ugh, more if-def'd forever code. remove all the dead vrml code that the x3d exporter was derived off of. |
| 16:16.52 | mafm | brlcad: in example for turkey, I didn't bring the laptop with me |
| 16:16.54 | mafm | and this week I was connected sometimes, from my parent's home |
| 16:24.53 | mafm | ``Erik: go green, buy a donkey... the maintainance is cheaper for sure :) |
| 16:46.11 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-79-162.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:58.22 | brlcad | ``Erik: haha |
| 16:58.46 | brlcad | mafm: all the more reason to use screen |
| 17:00.02 | mafm | but then I would have to read 1 week of logs, etc :D |
| 17:01.16 | mafm | I already have thousands of websites posting to read (subscriptions), some hundreds of mails, etc |
| 17:02.08 | brlcad | nah, /last -hilight |
| 17:02.14 | brlcad | just see what matters to you |
| 17:11.37 | mafm | well, there's mail and memos, I'm not much into permanente connectivity really ;) |
| 17:13.01 | mafm | speaking of which, I haven't seen many mails regarding libged in the commits ML |
| 17:13.10 | mafm | is that part already "stable"? |
| 17:17.58 | brlcad | no, it's still being worked -- there were a bunch of offline discussions last week |
| 17:18.29 | brlcad | bob was working on converters for a bit, taking a break, but now he's about ready to finish up libged |
| 17:18.33 | brlcad | i'd say it's about 80% |
| 17:25.14 | mafm | nice |
| 17:25.55 | mafm | how much is that in terms of time? till the end of the year? |
| 17:42.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32924 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf/g-dxf.c: restructure to not require forward function declarations. also pass in a callback structure during db_walk_tree so that do_region_end can be generic and shared among the tessellating exporters. |
| 17:46.24 | brlcad | hard to say, but I would expect another month or two before it's done, another to put a suite of tests in place, integrate into mged, and work out remaining issues |
| 17:47.13 | brlcad | also being added to the refactoring now, it seems, is getting all of the converters exposed into libged as well with the addition of a new geometry converter library |
| 17:47.20 | brlcad | that refactors src/conv |
| 17:47.33 | brlcad | need a good name for it |
| 17:54.33 | mafm | :) |
| 17:55.09 | mafm | we can use a name generator for roleplaying games or something like that, it would be handy with all these names around :) |
| 17:57.16 | mafm | well, going to hunt for food to the grocery store |
| 17:57.19 | mafm | see you! |
| 17:58.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32925 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf/g-dxf.c: overarchitecting. get rid of the anticipatory struct, just pass the function directly since it's all we need in do_region_end. |
| 18:02.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32926 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dxf/dxf-g.c: quell warnings |
| 19:02.00 | brlcad | finds a name and likes it |
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| 20:00.01 | *** join/#brlcad z_ (n=asus@217.118.79.41) | |
| 20:02.00 | z_ | starseeker: have you fulfilled the comand in text editor? Or was it a sophisticated text editor as OpenOffice.org? I've already started to work... |
| 20:11.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32927 10/brlcad/trunk/ (10 files in 6 dirs): |
| 20:11.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: begin LIBGCV, a geometry conversion library. the intent of this library is to |
| 20:11.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: allow conversion to/from a variety of geometry file formats, migrating and |
| 20:11.15 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: generalizing logic from src/conv into a useful library. start with a simple |
| 20:11.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: region callback that is logic shared by many of the mesh-format exporters. |
| 20:16.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32928 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/PROJECTS: it exists .. sorta. just started libgcv as a geometry conversion library. |
| 20:23.05 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32929 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (Makefile.am g-stl.c): make g-stl use the new gcv_region_end callback instead of it's own (identical) copy of do_region_end. |
| 20:23.25 | brlcad | z_: I believe he has been using emacs -- xml mode helping there |
| 20:23.48 | z_ | ok |
| 20:25.34 | *** part/#brlcad z_ (n=asus@217.118.79.41) | |
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| 21:53.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32930 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/brlcad-config.in: add libgcv to the managed libs list for brlcad-config |
| 21:54.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32931 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): add a pkg_config file for libged and libgcv |
| 21:58.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32932 10/brlcad/trunk/src/Makefile.am: |
| 21:58.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: enable generation and installation of a libbrlcad public library for providing |
| 21:58.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: application developers a convenient/simplified collection of the core brl-cad |
| 21:58.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: libraries that relate to geometry processing (and to sort of match what daniels |
| 21:58.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: dll bundle for windows does) |
| 22:14.41 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32933 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/cmakecheck.sh: check new libgcv too |
| 22:25.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32934 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/: ignore generated files |
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| 00:19.43 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32936 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpkg/pkg.c: quell some g++ compilation errors related to exact function prototype matching and needing to declare errno globally |
| 00:21.33 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32937 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpkg/tpkg.c: quell c++ error |
| 00:25.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32938 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bomb.c: quell warnings/errors for c++ compilation mode |
| 00:31.20 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32939 10/brlcad/trunk/include/cmd.h: include the complete function prototype, make the compiler happy |
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| 00:47.12 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32940 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): quell more compilation warnings that c++ compilation mode enjoys throwing a fit over. mostly constness and exact callback matching. |
| 00:50.29 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32941 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/convert.c: cast accordingly |
| 00:50.47 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32942 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/fnmatch.c: don't use 'class' for a variable name since it's a reserved word in c++ |
| 00:53.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32943 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/ (hash.c list.c log.c): more 'new' variables, rename to something less conflicting |
| 00:59.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32944 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/malloc.c: more warning quellage related to c++ mode |
| 01:34.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32945 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 2 dirs): and round-robin we go. fix things back up on the C side since a variety of warnings crept in. mostly related to propagating constness, but it's not clear that bu_key_eq_to_key_val() is correct at the moment. |
| 01:42.50 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32946 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: revert back to an unknown function callback. there are other front-end callers that make up their own arguments for the callback table. |
| 01:53.39 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32947 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (view_obj.c wdb_obj.c wdb_vdraw.c): more quellage spillover |
| 01:54.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32948 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (bu.h cmd.h): revert here too for callback args but because of constness and genptr_t args |
| 02:06.06 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32951 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libdm/dm_obj.c: constness quellage |
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| 06:11.49 | brlcad | yawns |
| 06:14.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32953 10/brlcad/trunk/src/liboptical/sh_prj.c: ws |
| 06:31.49 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32954 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/bombardier.c: emphasize if the appname is not known |
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| 07:35.27 | brlcad | thinks it's time to caffinate |
| 07:43.22 | clock_ | just read about Kerrson Predictor and Norden Bombsight, analog computers used in a war. |
| 07:55.43 | brlcad | avoids the temptation to google |
| 08:03.13 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet2-46-90.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 08:43.20 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 08:43.28 | brlcad | up late, eh? |
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| 10:47.29 | Axman6 | brlcad: ever done any work using Ada? |
| 11:03.48 | brlcad | Axman6: not really |
| 11:04.43 | Axman6 | righto. thought you may have, being in the army 'n all. anyway, you might like this all the same http://bit.csc.lsu.edu/~gb/csc4101/Reading/gigo-1997-04.html |
| 11:04.55 | Axman6 | the real story behind Ada >_> |
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| 12:21.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32955 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 5 dirs): Added support for commands that prompt for input. The first command of this type to be added to libged is "in". Also modified libtclcad's ged_obj to make use of this type of command. |
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| 12:48.47 | mafm | hi |
| 12:59.30 | claymore | hai! |
| 13:15.19 | ``Erik | iie |
| 13:15.20 | ``Erik | ! |
| 13:15.30 | ``Erik | ano wa kuso tarre desu ne |
| 13:15.37 | ``Erik | :D |
| 13:17.22 | claymore | Erik has been drinking again.... |
| 13:18.30 | ``Erik | yes, guzzling down coffee at the moment O.o OOAAAHHH </beavis|thegreatcornholio> |
| 13:32.36 | starseeker | claymore: How can you tell? |
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| 15:00.54 | starseeker | anyone else seeing a buggered build on libgcv/region_end.c? |
| 15:01.24 | starseeker | is building out of source |
| 15:45.15 | brlcad | ciao monsignore mafm |
| 15:45.26 | brlcad | starseeker: did you autogen.sh? |
| 15:45.34 | brlcad | have to kick the tires because of the new dir |
| 15:45.49 | brlcad | i've also not done a linux build yet, so might need some tweaks |
| 15:54.36 | mafm | going to a job interview, see you |
| 15:54.42 | brlcad | cya! |
| 15:54.43 | brlcad | good luck |
| 15:55.31 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 16:14.52 | brlcad | starseeker: hm, actually I just noticed that I get a failure here too -- must have missed something |
| 16:15.16 | brlcad | hah, looks like I didn't commit gcv.h |
| 16:25.45 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32957 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ (Makefile.am gcv.h): dumb me. add the frelling gcv.h interface header and unbreak the build |
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| 17:09.05 | tony-h | I have a question about the database format-- |
| 17:09.46 | tony-h | For the acoustic analysis project, I need a way to specify where the speakers are. I can model them, but how do I attach information like "this is speaker model xxxx and uses the dispersion info #5" |
| 17:17.43 | claymore | you could consider using the attr command: |
| 17:18.31 | claymore | http://brlcad.org/wiki/MGED_CMD_attr |
| 17:18.41 | claymore | that might get you what you need. |
| 17:37.16 | tony-h | Cool, sounds like it will make things easier than expected. But is there a good way to inspect all the regions with a particular attribute without combing the entire database? |
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| 19:08.21 | starseeker | you can find all such regions with the search command, if you're using svn |
| 19:19.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32958 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/man.tcl: upgrade the doc viewer to list available man pages on the side. For now this will only trigger via the man command, but next step is to point the menu to this functionality. |
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| 20:59.41 | brlcad | tony-h: if you already have a process that works within mged (or can figure one out), it's easy enough to convert those steps into C code too |
| 21:00.14 | brlcad | but yeah, attr and search (and ged_attr() and ged_search() respectively) will probably be your friend, else other routines in librt |
| 21:01.11 | naroth | Hi everyone, I'm working on finding a way to get the surface area and volume of a room modeled in BRLCAD. I was told a that these sort of calculations might be best performed if the model was converted to a mesh type of format as opposed to BRLCAD's constructive solid geometry. Any suggestions on how to do this? |
| 21:01.48 | brlcad | naroth: ew |
| 21:02.14 | naroth | hehe |
| 21:02.19 | brlcad | I wouldn't go about it that way only because conversion to polygonal from implicit csg is np complete and non-robust |
| 21:02.37 | brlcad | you can do it, facetize command or any one of the dozen or so exporters that do it |
| 21:02.48 | naroth | hmm ok |
| 21:03.08 | brlcad | but it'd be a lot simpler (and probably faster) to shoot a grid of rays to sample the volume |
| 21:03.31 | brlcad | rtweight already does this for volume/mass computations (src/rt/viewweight.c) |
| 21:04.01 | naroth | ok, any ideas on how to get surface area of the inside of a room? |
| 21:04.02 | brlcad | as does g_qa using a better adaptive refinement method (src/gtools/g_qa.c) |
| 21:05.58 | brlcad | you could subtract the room from an encompassing "air region" (using just one boolean) depending on the shape of the room and it'll automatically take care of everything in the room allowing something like rtweight to compute the volume with ease |
| 21:06.51 | brlcad | if the room is odd-shaped, but still encloses space, you could perform some sort of in/out parity check to find the segments that are "inside" |
| 21:08.02 | naroth | then those segments would represent corners in the room right? |
| 21:08.11 | brlcad | or if you want to get really fancy, you could perform an ant-walker propagation step that starts someone in the known air volume and adaptively fills the space with geometry (testing for overlaps as it goes along) |
| 21:08.39 | brlcad | no, the segments would *be* the inner volume |
| 21:10.15 | naroth | alright |
| 21:11.24 | naroth | I'll see what I can do with these ideas then, thanks a lot |
| 21:11.40 | brlcad | picture shooting a ray through the center of the room where H and X are where it goes through wall and reports the wall segments out ----> wall_enter --> wall_exit ------> wall2_enter --> wall2_exit ----> inf |
| 21:12.21 | brlcad | the distance from wall_exit to wall2_enter would be your "interior" sampled segment .. add that up with all of the other interior segments and you'd have your volume (within some sampled cell size tolerance) |
| 21:13.08 | brlcad | so long as you have at least two walls you go through and can start/end "outside" the room |
| 21:14.09 | brlcad | flood fill would be a little harder and time intensive (due to overlap testing), but probably more robust to implement (parity is a bitch with degenerate geometry) |
| 21:25.51 | *** part/#brlcad naroth (n=naroth@oak.csl.mtu.edu) | |
| 21:36.56 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32959 10/brlcad/trunk/ (8 files in 3 dirs): Both the menu and the command line now call mged/man.tcl. |
| 22:12.20 | louipc | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:24.46 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32960 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/Makefile.am: Ooops - don't need man_dialog in here any more. |
| 22:40.41 | starseeker | stares at the mged man page with some amusement. I'd say rewriting is in order here... |
| 22:41.09 | starseeker | Vector General 3300 probably isn't a selling point feature any more... |
| 22:49.37 | starseeker | heh - neither the Getting Started blurb nor the man page match the mged -h report on available options |
| 00:04.34 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32961 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am mged.xml): Add first stab at an MGED man page that is a tad more current - needs some more work. |
| 00:07.18 | louipc | starseeker: some funky line wrapping you've got there :D |
| 00:07.49 | starseeker | mm? |
| 00:08.00 | starseeker | you mean in the xml? |
| 00:08.04 | louipc | yea |
| 00:08.30 | starseeker | Doesn't look too bad here - what's it look like on your end? |
| 00:09.44 | starseeker | what really counts is how it looks in output :-) |
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| 00:10.44 | louipc | http://louipc.yi.org/images/funky-wrapping.png |
| 00:12.02 | louipc | well my term is at 79 cols is why hah |
| 00:13.20 | starseeker | Ah |
| 00:13.31 | starseeker | yea, I'm being a bit careless about that |
| 00:13.36 | starseeker | feel free to correct it :-) |
| 00:14.30 | louipc | I'd feel so lame doing that since you're actually doing the real work and stuff haha |
| 00:14.40 | louipc | your rules |
| 00:26.14 | starseeker | louipc: Nah, go for it |
| 00:26.44 | starseeker | really shouldn't be doing doc stuff, but his new doc display system doesn't reach full potential until it has lots of material to work with |
| 00:28.38 | starseeker | lots of instant gratification, as it were :-) |
| 00:28.57 | louipc | hey man it's good work |
| 00:29.24 | starseeker | louipc: Does the new tkhtml3 widget work for you? |
| 00:29.31 | louipc | haven't tried it yet |
| 00:29.58 | starseeker | ah. At the moment, if you type "man search" in a recent svn build you should get it |
| 00:30.22 | louipc | that works in classic mode too? |
| 00:30.31 | starseeker | no, needs Tcl/Tk |
| 00:30.52 | louipc | aw |
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| 01:19.41 | brlcad | looks like -h is help and that's not in the man page either .. :) |
| 01:20.20 | brlcad | that's where I'd really like to have the command spreadsheet complete to datamine what the predominant args in use are for various types of commands |
| 01:20.55 | brlcad | would help to know what options would be best to be globally consistent (like -? or -h on any command always giving usage) |
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| 02:42.46 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:26.56 | starseeker | howdy bob |
| 03:29.54 | starseeker | brlcad: Is the other html stuff actually being used anywhere? If so, is it something we can swap out with tkhtml3? |
| 03:36.18 | starseeker | Hmm. Wonder where the right place to store documentationon shift grips is - an article? |
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| 07:55.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r32962 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): |
| 07:55.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: fixed the libgcv integration into the MS Windows Dll build |
| 07:55.28 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: added some libged file for consistency |
| 10:34.01 | brlcad | starseeker: "the other html stuff"? |
| 10:40.51 | brlcad | g'morning d_rossberg |
| 10:41.44 | d_rossberg | moin moin brlcad |
| 10:43.30 | claymore | begins the morning caffination cycle. |
| 10:44.03 | clock_ | CIA-4: ;-) |
| 10:44.07 | clock_ | claymore: ;-) |
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| 12:17.24 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 12:21.02 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32964 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Added the clone command to libged. |
| 12:23.06 | mafm | hallo |
| 12:31.09 | claymore | hai! |
| 12:32.09 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:35.58 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32965 10/brlcad/trunk/src/README: add libgcv |
| 12:57.32 | mafm | hey, my module still compiles fine! |
| 13:04.58 | starseeker | regains consciousness |
| 13:05.18 | starseeker | dingnabbit, I want brlcad's limitless endurance |
| 13:07.55 | mafm | would be OK with half or one quarter of brlcad's endurance |
| 13:08.04 | mafm | infinite/4 is not bad |
| 14:16.58 | brlcad | mafm: heh, graet ;) |
| 14:17.12 | brlcad | starseeker: not limitless, I slept some last night :( |
| 14:30.07 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:39.02 | starseeker | brlcad: are my commit privs messed up somehow at sourceforge? |
| 14:39.28 | starseeker | Server sent unexpected return value (403 Forbidden) in response to MKACTIVITY request |
| 14:39.40 | brlcad | sounds like a server hiccup |
| 14:41.21 | starseeker | growl |
| 14:43.28 | starseeker | dammit, even with a fresh checkout |
| 14:43.31 | starseeker | BAD timing |
| 14:43.36 | starseeker | how do I fix it? |
| 14:44.14 | brlcad | time |
| 14:51.01 | ``Erik | try scaring it or making it drink water |
| 14:51.57 | ``Erik | echo "I'm going to install java on you" | telnet svn.sf.net |
| 14:57.08 | mafm | lol |
| 14:57.36 | starseeker | Can anyone else commit? |
| 14:58.09 | starseeker | needs to go in but would prefer to have his changes committed first |
| 14:58.59 | ``Erik | I cannot |
| 14:59.20 | brlcad | nor I |
| 14:59.39 | starseeker | OK, at least it wasn't just me offending the sourceforge gods |
| 15:00.12 | starseeker | blames this on the cat |
| 15:01.08 | brlcad | a new svn was deployed yesterday, maybe some fallout today that needed addressing |
| 15:01.15 | starseeker | ah |
| 15:01.43 | brlcad | not the only project too, so they know about it: https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?group_id=1&atid=200001 |
| 15:03.55 | brlcad | heh |
| 15:04.05 | starseeker | got in first, but not by much ;-) |
| 15:04.17 | brlcad | wondered what that flash was |
| 15:04.43 | starseeker | predicts this issue will rapidly get a lot more comments |
| 15:04.59 | brlcad | heh, travis saw it |
| 15:05.03 | brlcad | likes the live updates |
| 15:05.09 | starseeker | this is cool |
| 15:05.35 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EE89.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:05.44 | brlcad | nice way to reduce load, no need to refresh |
| 15:06.46 | starseeker | Heh - "Issues of this nature will typically be reviewed again by |
| 15:06.48 | starseeker | the assigned member of the SourceForge.net team within 3 business days" |
| 15:07.28 | brlcad | i think it's more of an "alright already, I see it" :) |
| 15:08.00 | starseeker | Oh, I know - I just like the mental image of what would happen if they did wait that long |
| 15:08.36 | brlcad | I think you were probably one of the first |
| 15:08.58 | brlcad | the earliest postings are all about 10 minutes after you first started having the problem |
| 15:09.15 | starseeker | Tjat |
| 15:09.22 | starseeker | that's what I get for doing a compile test |
| 15:09.53 | brlcad | ah, actually looks like matplotlib beat you by 2 minutes |
| 15:10.35 | starseeker | you mean 20 minutes? |
| 15:11.16 | brlcad | no |
| 15:11.29 | brlcad | they reported at 14:40, you commented here at 14:42 |
| 15:12.27 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 15:12.30 | starseeker | hehe |
| 15:12.56 | starseeker | how come I never have this kind of luck with lottery tickets? |
| 15:14.46 | starseeker | goes to make some food... |
| 15:15.26 | brlcad | what, you want to be two minutes late to buying a winning lottery ticket? |
| 15:15.42 | brlcad | I'd rather not play with that level of frustration :) |
| 15:18.50 | brlcad | sets up a notification |
| 15:19.19 | claymore | erik: you get my email? |
| 15:26.50 | brlcad | off to korean now if you're close |
| 15:39.35 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32966 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: pnts have vectors and colors now, just have to make them work |
| 15:57.51 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32967 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/mged/ (mged.tcl openw.tcl): Trim back the help menu a bit |
| 16:04.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32968 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/ (254 files in 15 dirs): |
| 16:04.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: Take first stab at updating OpenNURBS to 4.0. Have attempted to merge in all |
| 16:04.07 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: BRL-CAD specific changes. Builds on gentoo in this form, although for some |
| 16:04.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: reason I needed to include assert.h in opennurbs_curve.h and make a couple other |
| 16:04.08 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: tweaks. |
| 16:47.42 | brlcad | *burps* |
| 16:47.44 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 16:58.34 | starseeker | brlcad: Does that integration of opennurbs look OK? |
| 17:00.27 | brlcad | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:00.42 | brlcad | if it works, then it looks great ;) |
| 17:01.09 | brlcad | try running breplicator and raytracing the db |
| 17:02.28 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-77-139.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:14.16 | starseeker | erm. Lots of WTF??? output |
| 17:16.24 | starseeker | I'm guessing that's not right |
| 17:16.25 | starseeker | crud |
| 17:16.55 | starseeker | screen xy: 251,348 |
| 17:17.10 | brlcad | maybe maybe not.. it wasn't exactly flawless |
| 17:17.18 | brlcad | lemme make sure it works |
| 17:18.17 | brlcad | hm, yeah .. no .. it should work just fine :) |
| 17:18.29 | brlcad | makes a cube, even renders clean |
| 17:18.32 | starseeker | ding nabbit |
| 17:19.11 | starseeker | let me get in there and I'll try to figure out what's messed up - worst comes to worst I can revert |
| 17:19.52 | starseeker | crap - 5 hours+ potentially down the drain |
| 17:19.54 | brlcad | I ran: ./breplicator && mged -c breplicator.g l brep && rt -F/dev/X breplicator.g brep |
| 17:20.21 | brlcad | should dump a bunch of face info (twice) and render a cube |
| 17:20.37 | brlcad | with no warnings/errors during render |
| 17:21.00 | brlcad | it might not be your fault if they actually changed something, but chances are some patch needed |
| 17:23.55 | starseeker | it dumps info alright, but it raytraced this: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/breplicator_failure.png |
| 17:24.24 | starseeker | Here's the .g file: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/breplicator.g |
| 17:25.45 | brlcad | renders fine so it's not the structure |
| 17:25.55 | brlcad | just the raytrace routines (which are related to the opennurbs mods) |
| 17:26.37 | starseeker | sigh. OK. I'm heading in - I'll start digging once I get there. Confound it... |
| 17:27.02 | starseeker | had hoped to surprise everyone with a working upgrade, but nooooo... |
| 17:32.21 | brlcad | heh |
| 17:32.31 | brlcad | well, it *is* surprising ;) |
| 17:32.53 | starseeker | yeah, but now it's surprise breakage |
| 17:33.30 | starseeker | still, good excuse to figure out debugging cpp/c interactions |
| 17:35.01 | starseeker | is a bit taken aback by just how much code is in opennurbs |
| 17:35.47 | brlcad | hm? |
| 17:35.52 | brlcad | it's a pretty small library |
| 17:36.27 | brlcad | sorta, i mean it's on par with librt line-wise |
| 17:36.36 | brlcad | but it's c++, which is more verbose line-wise |
| 17:37.01 | starseeker | Ah |
| 17:51.56 | mafm | on the other hand, with new "auto" keyword, LoC counts for C++ files will drop down by 40% or so :þ |
| 18:18.44 | brlcad | hehe, probably |
| 18:27.28 | brlcad | starseeker: NEWS updates .. |
| 18:37.43 | mafm | I think that it would be the most appreciated feature of new C++ standard |
| 18:37.49 | mafm | at least mine it would be! |
| 18:54.03 | mafm | heading off, 'night! |
| 19:08.49 | brlcad | yeah, auto will be great |
| 19:12.58 | louipc | uh oh build error with latest SVN and openNURBS http://pastebin.com/mb4f8a7 |
| 19:29.11 | starseeker | louipc: Can you paste it to the bzflag pastebin? I can't get to that one |
| 19:29.59 | starseeker | brlcad: oops, right |
| 19:34.10 | starseeker | louipc: Is it opennurbs_box.h? |
| 19:35.14 | starseeker | must have missed an add |
| 19:40.19 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32969 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/ (opennurbs_box.cpp opennurbs_box.h opennurbs_crashtest.h): Bad developer, need to add files when they're new... |
| 19:46.50 | brlcad | ~bzpaste |
| 19:48.33 | brlcad | !listkeys bzp |
| 19:48.39 | brlcad | er... *slap* |
| 19:48.46 | brlcad | ~listkeys bzp |
| 19:48.54 | brlcad | ~bzpastebin |
| 19:48.55 | ibot | rumour has it, bzpastebin is http://pastebin.bzflag.bz or a place to put large chunks of text so as not to flood a channel |
| 19:49.10 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks :-) |
| 19:49.35 | starseeker | I'm guessing the missing files were the problem - they caused a failure for me too |
| 19:52.07 | starseeker | jeez - who needs roller coasters when you have the stock market? |
| 19:52.57 | brlcad | oh, dip? |
| 19:53.07 | brlcad | looks |
| 19:53.38 | starseeker | just a tad |
| 19:54.21 | brlcad | woot, outstanding |
| 19:54.34 | brlcad | buys |
| 19:55.41 | starseeker | feels like the stock market needs mental help - it's bipolar |
| 19:58.49 | brlcad | hah, this is awesome... |
| 19:58.57 | brlcad | moves more funds into his trading account |
| 20:03.26 | brlcad | taps foot impatiently waiting for account to reflect the change |
| 20:03.34 | brlcad | woot! |
| 20:09.03 | starseeker | alright, how can hits.size get a value of 3?? |
| 20:09.06 | PrezKennedy | who do you use brlcad ? |
| 20:09.50 | PrezKennedy | hahaha and they *thought* the worst was over |
| 20:09.52 | PrezKennedy | morons... |
| 20:10.41 | starseeker | is forced to conclude the majority of market players have no clue what's going on |
| 20:18.46 | louipc | starseeker: yep |
| 20:20.33 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EE89.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:21.14 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: etrade |
| 20:23.19 | louipc | why buy now when you can buy later for pennies! |
| 20:23.26 | louipc | muhahah |
| 20:25.08 | brlcad | :) |
| 20:25.16 | brlcad | will buy all the way down |
| 20:26.00 | brlcad | it'll eventually go back up, especially on a local panic minima like it is now |
| 20:38.17 | starseeker | builds 7.12.6 to have something to compare |
| 20:48.13 | PrezKennedy | i need to buy in |
| 21:01.47 | louipc | I'd say invest in a real business rather than magical numbers in a computer ;) |
| 21:04.14 | PrezKennedy | a real business? like what? |
| 21:04.35 | brlcad | thinks you should invest your money in the Bank of Sean |
| 21:04.59 | PrezKennedy | sounds sketchy |
| 21:05.20 | brlcad | it is, almost guaranteed 0% return on investment |
| 21:05.32 | archivist | can archive your moneyz |
| 21:05.44 | PrezKennedy | im waiting for the next fake announcement that jobs is having a heart attack |
| 21:05.46 | brlcad | but there are perks, potato chips, and nice pat on the back |
| 21:05.47 | PrezKennedy | then ill buy into apple |
| 21:10.26 | louipc | PrezKennedy: like a hot dog stand or something |
| 21:57.53 | PrezKennedy | wow... $50 and i could buyout Ford... |
| 21:59.33 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:01.05 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:44.19 | *** join/#brlcad Elperion (n=Bary@p5B14EBF8.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 23:28.05 | louipc | starseeker: I recall you said something before about sending a patch upstream for tkhtml3. What was that one about? I'm currently looking at the config scripts to disable the build since I already have tkhtml3 |
| 23:29.01 | starseeker | loouipc: Er, don't need to do that |
| 23:29.09 | starseeker | figured out how to use their build |
| 23:29.17 | louipc | ok cool |
| 23:29.30 | starseeker | Do need to make a test for whether tkhtml3 is already present inside an already present tcl/tk |
| 23:29.48 | louipc | hmm |
| 23:30.08 | louipc | ah were you working on a config option? |
| 23:30.11 | starseeker | isn't quite up on autoconf testing procedures yet - probably some sort of routine to look at the results of package require Tkhtml 3.0 |
| 23:30.18 | starseeker | louipc: not right now |
| 23:30.22 | starseeker | go for it if you like |
| 23:30.36 | louipc | yeah I just need to do the test |
| 23:30.52 | starseeker | does happy dance that the openNURBS updates are OK after all |
| 23:33.10 | louipc | http://louipc.yi.org/brlcad/tkhtml-build.patch |
| 23:33.25 | louipc | well that's what I put so far... |
| 23:33.34 | louipc | it won't work because I didn't do the test |
| 23:34.06 | starseeker | I can't get to louipc.yi.org :-( |
| 23:34.11 | louipc | erp |
| 23:34.40 | louipc | http://louipc.dontexist.org/brlcad/tkhtml-build.patch |
| 23:35.44 | starseeker | can't find that one either |
| 23:35.48 | starseeker | weird |
| 23:35.58 | starseeker | ~bzpastebin |
| 23:35.59 | ibot | methinks bzpastebin is http://pastebin.bzflag.bz or a place to put large chunks of text so as not to flood a channel |
| 23:36.04 | starseeker | might try that |
| 23:37.05 | louipc | http://omploader.org/vdHU5/tkhtml-build.patch |
| 23:37.19 | louipc | oh are you restricted to that domain or something? |
| 23:37.49 | starseeker | last one worked |
| 23:38.22 | ``Erik | I AM the shogun of harlem! |
| 23:38.57 | ``Erik | http://palinaspresident.com |
| 23:39.37 | louipc | sweet |
| 23:39.41 | starseeker | louipc: We aren't looking for an la file in this case |
| 23:40.19 | starseeker | There's probably some "standard" way to check for packages at the autoconf level |
| 23:41.27 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32970 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO): Note cleanup on MGED's Help menu and the integration of the latest release of openNURBS (4.0) into the BRL-CAD source tree. No longer a TODO item. |
| 23:41.52 | louipc | the test for TNT is interesting. It seems to compile and run a little program imbedded in the config script |
| 23:45.26 | starseeker | I think that's the "right" way |
| 23:52.22 | ``Erik | sucks that garth marenghi's darkplace is only available as a region 2 dvd :( |
| 23:52.59 | starseeker | ``Erik: I figured you'd have a BSD box set up with mythtv or some such to be able to watch anything |
| 23:53.53 | starseeker | is it wrong to be amused by the wild swinging of the stock market? |
| 23:54.17 | ``Erik | nah, haven't built a mythtv box |
| 23:54.37 | ``Erik | looks like most of the episodes are on googles video site O.o |
| 00:00.08 | starseeker | brlcad: Yep, looks like it does do in-memory: http://www.sqlite.org/cvstrac/wiki?p=InMemoryDatabase |
| 00:02.49 | louipc | I'm amused any chance I get to laugh at the bankers |
| 00:02.57 | louipc | because usually they're laughing at me |
| 00:09.30 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:10.24 | louipc | yeah when they're taking your money |
| 00:14.06 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet2-46-90.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 01:47.41 | brlcad | starseeker: I believe what we already had was 4.0 too .. maybe check for a patch number or use the protocol number (it's in one of the header files) |
| 02:24.22 | ``Erik | crap, my chest is hurting from laughing at this southpark |
| 03:35.36 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 05:37.57 | starseeker | brlcad: hmm. I'll see if I can dig up the protocol number |
| 05:49.11 | starseeker | checks diffs on .h files and so far turns up alot of copyright date updates... |
| 05:51.12 | brlcad | 200707189 |
| 05:51.30 | brlcad | i.e. 4.0.2007.0718 |
| 05:52.22 | brlcad | (opennurbs_version.h) |
| 05:52.51 | starseeker | ah, dingnabbit |
| 05:52.53 | starseeker | thanks |
| 05:53.07 | brlcad | no matter, I had the number wrong anyways |
| 05:53.27 | starseeker | updates news file again... |
| 06:05.51 | starseeker | Well, unless we want a zillion diffs with just /* $Header$ */ in them I'd better trim this diff down a bit |
| 06:18.36 | brlcad | there was an option with cvs to not include cvs vars |
| 06:18.41 | brlcad | er, rcs vars |
| 06:19.46 | starseeker | I think I've got the major ones isolated |
| 06:20.06 | starseeker | couple ws related ones that needed to come out too |
| 06:26.39 | starseeker | prods CIA |
| 06:33.00 | brlcad | puts on a pot |
| 06:50.43 | brlcad | starseeker: that number wasn't right :) |
| 06:50.49 | brlcad | 01:56 <@brlcad> no matter, I had the number wrong anyways |
| 06:57.44 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 07:01.54 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:59.07 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 08:25.12 | brlcad | saws off the extra r on claymorer |
| 08:28.25 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 08:53.49 | claymore | Tired fingers don't type correctly :P |
| 08:53.56 | claymore | yawns. |
| 08:54.19 | claymore | Brlcad: slept since I last saw you? |
| 09:00.08 | brlcad | why bother? |
| 09:01.18 | claymore | Just thought the whole 'body need sleep or you'll die' thing....nevermind, doesn't apply to coding machines eh? ;) |
| 09:03.24 | brlcad | it's a myth |
| 09:04.19 | claymore | Have you been able to break away and check out that 1.6 acre plot during the daylight yet? |
| 09:04.24 | clock_ | well check wikipedia they have an answer to almost anything :) |
| 09:05.29 | claymore | sure, Wikipedia has 'an answer' to everything, but that doesn't make it 'the answer' or anywhere near correct! |
| 09:06.58 | brlcad | nope |
| 09:07.36 | clock_ | I had 8.5 hours of sleep and I had concerns if I amt destroying my body by going to sleep at 23.00 and not 22.00 |
| 09:07.58 | claymore | brlcad: Hitting the road enroute to work. Need somethin drom Dunkin? |
| 09:09.59 | archivist | recommends Dunkin Donuts I haz tasted them |
| 09:11.09 | AFK-claymore | ...nothin? okie. |
| 09:11.15 | AFK-claymore | Cyas |
| 09:36.24 | brlcad | you get up insane early AFK-claymore |
| 11:14.52 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 12:42.27 | claymore | hai mafm! |
| 12:54.00 | mafm | hi |
| 13:04.09 | ``Erik | claymore: brlcad's mantra seems to be "there'll be plenty of time to sleep when you're dead", mebbe he's lookin' to flare out and sleep soon O.o :D |
| 13:04.49 | claymore | I just want to make sure I have minimum safe distance when he does flare out ;) |
| 13:04.54 | ``Erik | candle that burns twice as bright burns half as long? |
| 13:05.02 | claymore | Erik: You get my email? |
| 13:05.12 | ``Erik | uhmmmm, haven't looked yet |
| 13:05.21 | claymore | Work email. |
| 13:05.26 | ``Erik | getting the important stuff done first, y'know, reading irc backlog... |
| 13:05.30 | claymore | lol |
| 13:05.44 | claymore | its just a software approval. |
| 13:06.31 | Donuts | ``Erik: is regular sleep necessary to maintain health? |
| 13:07.30 | ``Erik | I'd always heard so, karel... I've also heard that if you've been awake for 18 hours, you function as if at the legal driving limit for intoxication, and 24 hours is far far worse |
| 13:08.07 | ``Erik | there was a french study that claimed you operated a lot better taking two 3-hour naps in a 24 hour period than single full 8 hour |
| 13:08.15 | ``Erik | in like the 80's I think |
| 13:08.26 | Donuts | lol |
| 13:08.37 | ``Erik | but it was french, so may not apply to humans |
| 13:08.41 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 13:08.44 | Donuts | I never function well no matter what naps I take |
| 13:08.53 | Donuts | I either sleep too little and then I am tired from sleeping too little |
| 13:09.05 | Donuts | Or sleep enough but then my nose blocks and I cannot sleep well anyway |
| 13:09.11 | ``Erik | lay off the opiates and alcohol? :D |
| 13:09.18 | Donuts | I do NOTHING! |
| 13:09.24 | Donuts | No opiates alcohols drugs nothin |
| 13:09.59 | Donuts | how old is brlcad? |
| 13:10.04 | Donuts | Maybe he still can make into the Club 27 |
| 13:10.08 | archivist | I miss nights and just nap if needed, no real problem |
| 13:10.10 | claymore | Yeah, there are PLENTY of things that can help you sleep better ;) |
| 13:10.28 | Donuts | fact is I usually dinner just before falling into the bed |
| 13:10.28 | claymore | Rumor has it BRLCAD is 157 years old.... no one knows for sure though. |
| 13:10.43 | Donuts | which is supposed to make crappy sleep |
| 13:10.52 | Donuts | He could ground the CLub 157 |
| 13:11.07 | Donuts | People who dies 157 years old from too much alcohol drugs |
| 13:12.41 | claymore | Ever seen the Matrix? brlcad makes NEO look like a newb. Little known fact: the Matrix uses BRL-CAD libraries. |
| 13:12.56 | Donuts | claymore: oh really? |
| 13:13.01 | Donuts | What do they use it for? |
| 13:13.18 | Donuts | uses not only BRL-CAD libraries but the whole BRL-CAD, will he get more famous than the Matrix? |
| 13:13.47 | claymore | well see, the problem is that is IS not BRL-CAD..... |
| 13:13.58 | claymore | wow, i crapped that on epretty bad. |
| 13:14.02 | ``Erik | <neo> duuuude! totally excellent! let's totally go, bill... erm, I mean, morpheus! |
| 13:14.17 | claymore | well see, the probem is that there is NO brl-cad. |
| 13:14.51 | Donuts | bil kaulitz? |
| 13:14.54 | claymore | Just once, i wanted Neo to look at Morpheus and say, "Rufus? Is that you?" |
| 13:15.05 | Donuts | Whos Rufus? :) |
| 13:15.14 | Donuts | I think I heard that name. isn't he homeless? |
| 13:15.20 | ``Erik | character from 'bill and ted's excellent adventure' |
| 13:15.27 | ``Erik | played by carlin iirc |
| 13:15.30 | claymore | He drives a telephone booth. |
| 13:15.35 | Donuts | lol |
| 13:15.40 | Donuts | sounds like on hard drugs |
| 13:16.25 | ``Erik | it was the 80's, all of hollywood had the healthy look of freshly powdered noses O.o |
| 13:16.45 | Donuts | powedered from inside? |
| 13:16.55 | claymore | Strange things are afoot at the 7-11. |
| 13:16.57 | Donuts | from THE inside, my f. english |
| 13:17.16 | ``Erik | no, karel, from the lines cut onto the mirror :D |
| 13:19.51 | Donuts | oh its raining like hell here |
| 13:20.59 | claymore | Never been, so I really don't know how bad it rains in hell... |
| 13:21.34 | ``Erik | <-- has been told that it's hot and dry there, convinced it's a synonym for arizona |
| 13:23.57 | ``Erik | sees no email from claymore |
| 13:24.04 | claymore | Some even say that the Rockies and the Sierra Nevada's were once one range... then hell erupted out and split them. Once the hole was resealed, Arizona, Nevada and Utard remained.... |
| 13:24.47 | claymore | erik: Sent wednesday at 0815 |
| 13:25.05 | claymore | ... I think there was a Buffy episode about that ;) |
| 13:25.38 | ``Erik | hum, the last email I got was monday, something musta busted |
| 13:25.48 | claymore | I will resend. |
| 13:26.00 | ``Erik | well, hold up |
| 13:26.18 | ``Erik | let me try reconnecting to the server, I surspect my uplink to that pile just went fruity |
| 13:26.37 | ``Erik | I bet my password there expired or something |
| 13:28.54 | claymore | resent |
| 13:28.58 | claymore | you at work or home? |
| 13:29.25 | ``Erik | yeah, password was expired, and at the office |
| 13:30.22 | claymore | stupid stupid outlook.... |
| 13:30.28 | claymore | shakes head. |
| 13:31.18 | ``Erik | entourage, actually. For some reason, it doesn't bother tell you why it failed to connect, where outlook seems almost useful in popping up the 'please change it' dialog O.o |
| 13:32.25 | claymore | points at the outlook servers. Phear..... |
| 13:33.20 | ``Erik | exchange |
| 13:34.01 | ``Erik | is CIA-4 busted, or just being ... special? |
| 13:34.28 | claymore | Call it what you will, guano is still poop. |
| 14:00.39 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 14:07.41 | PrezKennedy | http://gadgets.boingboing.net/2008/10/14/microsoft-announces-1.html |
| 14:17.12 | claymore | lol, thats good stuff Prez. |
| 14:18.33 | ``Erik | secure edition, nice |
| 14:26.53 | claymore | Gotta atdmit, though, at first glance, i was hoping the secure edition had something to do with the x-files. kinda ruined it for me when I realized it was probably a Mac Fanboi that made the graphic :/ |
| 14:37.19 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14F34D.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 14:41.39 | starseeker | brlcad: erm? It was in opennurbs_version.h: 200707180 |
| 14:45.16 | starseeker | 's brain doesn't seem to be in working order atm anyway... |
| 14:51.17 | ``Erik | neato, breakage in the opennurbs array shtuff now |
| 14:55.41 | starseeker | ``Erik: eh? |
| 14:56.08 | starseeker | as a result of the upgrade? The breplicator example wasn't working in 7.12.6 either |
| 15:14.13 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d5ed5e2df |
| 15:39.10 | starseeker | erm |
| 15:39.21 | starseeker | Is that on BSD? |
| 15:45.35 | starseeker | ``Erik does including #include "opennurbs_array.h" in opennurbs_array_defs.h help any? |
| 15:45.45 | starseeker | looks like previous revision had that |
| 15:47.20 | starseeker | goes to car fixer people... |
| 16:25.34 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:25.58 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 17:57.16 | *** join/#brlcad cad45 (n=8ddb99a9@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:57.46 | cad45 | hello |
| 17:58.11 | claymore | hai! |
| 17:58.31 | cad45 | is this the brlcad developers |
| 17:58.48 | louipc | yep there are a few here |
| 17:59.26 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-78-232.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:59.50 | cad45 | we are looking to find more information on how the models are stored in brlcad |
| 18:00.11 | cad45 | for the purpose of finding surface area and volume of the model |
| 18:01.36 | louipc | hmm I think that was being discussed not long ago, but I couldn't comprehend any of it haha |
| 18:02.28 | claymore | Surface area and volumes can be calculated via Raytrace interrogation of any given target. |
| 18:02.30 | ``Erik | volume can be estimated using rtweight, rtarea can give you "exposed" surface area |
| 18:02.56 | claymore | ah, you are too slow grasshoppa |
| 18:26.36 | mafm | going home, take care |
| 18:33.10 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r32977 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/opennurbs_array_defs.h: fix breakage on *nix/opteron, calling non-msvc compilers lame while not grokking pointer casting ftl. s/unsigned int/size_t/ |
| 18:51.32 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32978 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/all_sf.xml: add tweaks to all_sf man page from Janine. |
| 19:06.03 | ``Erik | Q: What's a 'special variable'? |
| 19:06.03 | ``Erik | A: Some variables have values that must be accessed very quickly. They are stored in memory that is connected to the CPU by a high speed datapath called 'the short bus'. Special variables ride the short bus. |
| 19:16.21 | cad45 | where can I find documentation on rtarea and rtweight? |
| 19:16.31 | ``Erik | they both have man pages |
| 19:16.45 | cad45 | thank you |
| 19:21.40 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32979 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am anim_cascade.xml): add anim_cascade manual - worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:33.39 | claymore | timmmmah! |
| 19:33.53 | starseeker | ? |
| 19:49.04 | ``Erik | CRIPPLE FIGHT! |
| 19:55.59 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32980 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am anim_fly.xml anim_hardtrack.xml): add anim_fly and anim_hardtrack manuals - worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 20:07.16 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32981 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am anim_keyread.xml): add anim_keyread manual - worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 20:45.17 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32982 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am rtedge.xml): add rtedge manual - worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 21:37.10 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 21:37.20 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 21:59.27 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:00.09 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 23:06.42 | louipc | starseeker: brlcad I don't really know enough to do the test for tkhtml3 but I got it to not build tkhtml3 with the --disable-tkhtml3 ... Is that OK to commit? http://omploader.org/vdHo4/tkhtml-build.patch |
| 00:57.18 | ``Erik | needs to extract/expunge/unfuck the gnu-isms of the tkhtml3 build crap :( |
| 01:24.53 | brlcad | louipc: not getting the gist at the moment, so I've got no problems |
| 01:25.00 | brlcad | so either commit or talk it out with starseeker |
| 01:25.04 | brlcad | or ``Erik |
| 01:25.16 | brlcad | or someone else who's not about to pass out :) |
| 01:32.22 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:37.11 | ``Erik | heh, bourbon and lack of sleep, brlcad? |
| 01:38.38 | ``Erik | loui, why do you have both ${TKHTML3DIR} and tkhtml3 in SUBDIRS of src/other/Makefile.am ? |
| 01:40.49 | ``Erik | oh, n/m, removing it |
| 01:41.20 | ``Erik | is there any way to tell configure where tkhtml3 is installed on the system? I don't see anything to do that other than overloading CPPFLAGS and LDFLAGS |
| 01:45.40 | ``Erik | I say commit it, it looks good to me |
| 01:47.09 | ``Erik | grouses about svn's lack of a -y flag on the diff command |
| 02:33.55 | Ralith | what would that do? |
| 02:41.13 | louipc | side by side diff |
| 03:11.00 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03louipc * r32983 10/brlcad/trunk/ (INSTALL configure.ac src/other/Makefile.am): Add --enable-tkhtml3-build configure option. |
| 06:49.54 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 07:12.07 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:12.21 | brlcad | yawns refreshed |
| 08:12.39 | brlcad | ``Erik: scotch, not bourbon |
| 08:46.08 | poolio | brlcad: mornin? |
| 08:56.03 | brlcad | howdy poolio |
| 08:56.10 | brlcad | yep, mornin it be |
| 08:56.37 | brlcad | made it home alive after being up for 80 hours |
| 08:58.59 | poolio | brlcad: geez. go to sleep! |
| 08:59.09 | clock_ | lol |
| 08:59.19 | clock_ | brlcad: you should get a Guinness Book record for that |
| 09:17.40 | brlcad | poolio: I did, hence "refreshed" :) |
| 09:18.57 | brlcad | clock_: nah, the world record was something like 276 hours before they banned it as a category |
| 09:22.43 | poolio | Was that the one done by those students? |
| 09:23.01 | poolio | brlcad: heh, your sleeping schedule is more bizarre than a college student's :P |
| 09:23.06 | brlcad | hm, dunno |
| 09:23.27 | brlcad | "finished" a project .. wasn't going to leave until it was done |
| 09:25.03 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 10:47.18 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D3BF.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:05.44 | *** join/#brlcad cad15 (n=cfd35205@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:39.48 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, you were up for 80 hours? you crazy! |
| 13:40.05 | PrezKennedy | did you take a powernap then start again? |
| 13:50.26 | ``Erik | when he stops coding, we get the box out and put 4KV across his nipples, he pops right back up, says "wow, what a party!" and starts coding again O.o |
| 13:50.41 | ``Erik | he's actually a robot, just needs his batteries recharged once in a while O.o |
| 14:10.45 | clock_ | recharges ``Erik's batteries with his >500V D.C. electric bicycle |
| 14:58.28 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:21.20 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-77-64.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 16:25.26 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: it's good fun, you should try it! |
| 16:25.45 | brlcad | not the driving afterwards part, but the staying up fun part :) |
| 16:27.22 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 16:27.35 | mafm | hi |
| 16:27.55 | mafm | network outages FTW |
| 16:27.56 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 16:27.59 | brlcad | que tal? |
| 16:28.18 | mafm | not bad except for the cold/flu |
| 16:28.20 | mafm | :) |
| 16:28.34 | brlcad | ah, good time to code then :) |
| 16:29.12 | mafm | hmm, bzflag in debian testing |
| 16:29.35 | mafm | do you like to code with fever? :D |
| 16:30.16 | brlcad | I got a fever, and the only prescription ... |
| 16:30.24 | brlcad | IS MORE COWBELL! |
| 16:30.45 | mafm | misses the reference :D |
| 16:31.01 | brlcad | http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xnfyp_cowbell_fun |
| 16:31.26 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32984 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ps.c: Enable clipping. |
| 16:32.23 | mafm | hmm, no flash at the moment :) |
| 16:32.34 | brlcad | ahh |
| 16:32.37 | mafm | one technical question that I thought about yesterday |
| 16:32.40 | brlcad | it's an old SNL skit |
| 16:33.08 | mafm | would be good to destroy the singletons when exiting the program? |
| 16:33.33 | brlcad | I generally prefer controlled/intentional shutdown |
| 16:33.50 | brlcad | but technically it's a wash |
| 16:34.20 | brlcad | if you're using the singleton that was already there, it'll clean up after itself automatically |
| 16:34.35 | brlcad | (but I'd still usually do it manually/intentionally) |
| 16:35.03 | mafm | hmm, well, a singleton wouldn't activate the destructor of the instance |
| 16:35.12 | mafm | unless you somehow tell it to do it |
| 16:35.21 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:35.32 | brlcad | which it does :) |
| 16:35.57 | brlcad | looks at which mafm is using |
| 16:36.50 | brlcad | ah, you manually made it one .. |
| 16:36.53 | brlcad | yeah, that's not going anywhere |
| 16:37.04 | mafm | manually made what? |
| 16:37.10 | brlcad | but that probably won't/shouldn't stay written that way either |
| 16:37.46 | brlcad | include/Utility/Singleton.h |
| 16:37.56 | brlcad | there's a singleton implementation already that takes care of a lot of issues |
| 16:38.10 | brlcad | issues that aren't addressed by just stashing a static |
| 16:38.51 | brlcad | it's a bit beefier than what is used for BZ.. not sure (in hindsight) that it needs to keep the flexibility it has vs simplicity of interface |
| 16:41.23 | mafm | I see |
| 16:41.26 | mafm | hmm |
| 16:41.33 | mafm | so should I use that one? |
| 16:42.03 | brlcad | it reduces code complexity quite a bit if all singletons just inherit from one Singleton template :) |
| 16:43.13 | brlcad | I think that's one of the most reused pieces of code I've ever written |
| 16:44.07 | mafm | ah, so it's already known to work and all that? |
| 16:44.17 | brlcad | great return, the only problem I could never sort out a good solution for was cross-library instantiation |
| 16:44.24 | brlcad | oh yeah, it works great |
| 16:44.43 | brlcad | it's in use in at least a half-dozen projects |
| 16:45.02 | brlcad | outside of brl-cad |
| 16:45.29 | mafm | I thought that it was made as a "template" for that module or something |
| 16:45.48 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i gotta have more cowbell! |
| 16:46.03 | brlcad | baby |
| 16:47.41 | mafm | huh |
| 16:48.08 | mafm | but for that I have to somehow install the code of that module in the system |
| 16:48.11 | mafm | is that part ready? |
| 16:48.19 | brlcad | mafm: the utility library? |
| 16:48.28 | brlcad | yeah, it was already working |
| 16:48.52 | mafm | I mean, the compilation && instalation |
| 16:49.20 | brlcad | well technically, it's a template class |
| 16:49.22 | mafm | gonna test it |
| 16:49.27 | brlcad | so you can just use it without libUtility |
| 16:49.57 | brlcad | you just inherit from Singleton<yourclass>, add a friend (to yourself), and initialize the singleton in a compilation unit |
| 16:50.02 | ``Erik | *readreadread* it depends on what kinda resources the singleton holds.. closing file decriptors (to files, sockets, etc) is fairly important |
| 16:50.10 | brlcad | three lines and you're done |
| 16:50.45 | ``Erik | it USED to be that some os's didn't free all of a programs memory if it exited without cleaning itself up, leading to a slow leak and requiring periodic reboots |
| 16:50.59 | brlcad | ``Erik: the singleton implementation I have will call the destructor so as long as it is written okay, it'll clean up |
| 16:51.17 | ``Erik | still have to have a proper destructor written :) |
| 16:51.21 | brlcad | yep |
| 16:51.56 | brlcad | and even with that, I'd still perfer manual over atexit destruction so it's obvious/controlled/ordered |
| 16:52.36 | mafm | it's not a problem of having files etc (at the moment) |
| 16:52.51 | mafm | but just so in example valgrind doesn't report them as "noise" |
| 16:52.52 | ``Erik | yeh, I prefer a full stack unwind so the final code before _exit() is a return from main |
| 16:53.39 | ``Erik | hehhe "When your hammer is C++, everything begins to look like a thumb. |
| 16:53.41 | ``Erik | " |
| 16:54.07 | ``Erik | "Being really good at C++ is like being really good at using rocks to sharpen sticks." |
| 16:54.10 | mafm | ``Erik: comment from slashdot? |
| 16:54.22 | ``Erik | nah, an old ITS fortune file |
| 16:54.54 | mafm | it appeared in slashdot in an interview to Stroustrup (spelling) |
| 16:55.05 | ``Erik | which one, mafm? |
| 16:55.27 | mafm | brlcad: the compiler whines when including your file |
| 16:55.37 | ``Erik | the hammer/thumb one is attributed to Steve Hoflich, the other is Thant Tessman |
| 16:55.37 | mafm | I think that for using ThreadingModel name |
| 16:55.38 | brlcad | mafm: oh? |
| 16:56.31 | brlcad | alright, simplifying |
| 16:56.35 | mafm | ``Erik: http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=653033&cid=24690821 |
| 16:56.37 | ``Erik | brlcad, ya missed out on gourmet bowling alley food today O.o |
| 16:56.51 | mafm | notices that his notion of recent extends to 2 months ago |
| 16:57.06 | PrezKennedy | mmmm gourmet bowling alley food |
| 16:57.09 | PrezKennedy | which bowling alley? |
| 16:57.20 | brlcad | before long, recent will be a couple years ago |
| 16:57.26 | ``Erik | "In C++ it's harder to shoot yourself in the foot, but when you do, you blow off your whole leg." Bjarne Stroustrup. |
| 16:57.33 | ``Erik | prez: the post one |
| 16:57.43 | PrezKennedy | ah only been there a couple times |
| 16:57.48 | mafm | it's because I had lots of articles to read from slashdot due to lack of time |
| 16:59.41 | mafm | brlcad: Singleton inherits from ThreadingModel, which doesn't exist as class |
| 16:59.58 | brlcad | mafm: i'm replacing it now |
| 17:00.28 | mafm | so it was not working after all :þ |
| 17:00.51 | brlcad | mafm: it is |
| 17:00.57 | brlcad | ThreadingModel is a template parameter |
| 17:01.03 | brlcad | default is SingleThreaded |
| 17:01.08 | brlcad | SingleThreaded is in that file |
| 17:01.14 | brlcad | so the error, if any, is something else |
| 17:01.19 | brlcad | I've used that file |
| 17:01.46 | brlcad | probably some innocuous type warning with gcc4 that hasn't been fixed in the rt^3 version |
| 17:02.57 | mafm | brlcad: http://rafb.net/p/2kJT1T63.html |
| 17:05.16 | brlcad | try that |
| 17:05.55 | mafm | try... what? |
| 17:06.07 | brlcad | taps foot impatiently |
| 17:06.41 | mafm | CIA ? :) |
| 17:06.47 | brlcad | yeah |
| 17:08.05 | brlcad | looks like "lock" may be typedef'd to something via system header on your system given that error |
| 17:08.08 | brlcad | but doesn't matter |
| 17:08.17 | brlcad | the simplified version I just commited gets rid of threading support |
| 17:08.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32985 10/rt^3/trunk/include/Utility/Singleton.h: |
| 17:08.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: revert to a version of the singleton template class that is more often used |
| 17:08.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: elsewhere for its simplicity. this version doesn't have threading support nor |
| 17:08.21 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: support non-new construction, but it does let you make something a singleton |
| 17:08.22 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: with three lines. |
| 17:08.26 | mafm | ah, goody |
| 17:08.26 | brlcad | yay |
| 17:08.58 | *** join/#brlcad elite01_ (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 17:11.06 | brlcad | the new header shows how to use it too |
| 17:11.30 | brlcad | stole it back from bz, woot |
| 17:13.07 | ``Erik | that poor singleton header, being passed around like a drunk freshman at a frat party :( |
| 17:13.48 | mafm | lol |
| 17:14.11 | mafm | hmm, it seems to compile :S |
| 17:14.17 | mafm | most amazing |
| 17:17.39 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 17:23.51 | *** join/#brlcad elmom_ (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 17:27.52 | mafm | hmm |
| 17:27.56 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 17:28.00 | mafm | Ogre headers don't like it very uch |
| 17:28.47 | brlcad | mm, they probablly use the exact same names |
| 17:28.57 | mafm | ah, I think that it was the old problem of ged.h definin X, Y and the like |
| 17:29.06 | mafm | defining* |
| 17:29.11 | brlcad | okay |
| 17:29.32 | mafm | is that still in place or did somebody remove it? |
| 17:29.52 | brlcad | it's still in place |
| 17:30.04 | brlcad | I had a test of a way to work around the problems |
| 17:30.19 | brlcad | but that machine is in storage atm until I settle |
| 17:34.27 | mafm | hmm |
| 17:34.35 | mafm | is it a complicate fix? |
| 17:34.50 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 17:35.13 | brlcad | it's not broken, it's naming conflicts |
| 17:36.50 | mafm | hmm |
| 17:37.38 | mafm | well, but I mean... if it would happen something bad elsewhere for undefining those variables at the end of the same file where they are defined |
| 17:37.41 | brlcad | yeah, that'd break everywhere they're used :) |
| 17:38.24 | mafm | what if I undefine them after including ged.h? |
| 17:38.49 | brlcad | that's the usual work-around |
| 17:39.24 | brlcad | i was looking at a change that would work for both, but don't remember where I left off with that frankly without that machine |
| 17:41.10 | mafm | okish, no problem |
| 17:41.20 | mafm | just don't want to get stuck with this |
| 17:41.26 | brlcad | yeah, it's fugly |
| 17:44.36 | mafm | well, it seems to be working now |
| 17:53.24 | brlcad | cheers for a friday ralley as he makes 15% |
| 17:54.36 | mafm | brlcad: Singleton is not under Utility namespace, is that intended? |
| 17:54.58 | brlcad | it's fine for now |
| 17:55.08 | brlcad | the per-library namespaces is a win-lose |
| 17:55.46 | brlcad | i.e. if you want to change it, go for it -- but not a huge deal at this point |
| 17:56.14 | mafm | I don't mind much, it was just a reminder/warning for you |
| 17:56.18 | mafm | pokes CIA |
| 18:11.03 | ``Erik | CIA won't talk to you, you didn't buy it dinner first |
| 18:15.02 | brlcad | kicks CIA-4 |
| 18:15.02 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 18:15.29 | brlcad | not the bots, elsewhere in the system -- probably overloaded or sf is dropping again |
| 18:17.11 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32987 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Application.cxx: Avoid calling finalize() twice |
| 18:17.18 | brlcad | so it's overloaded |
| 18:17.31 | mafm | it missed the previous one |
| 18:17.42 | brlcad | ah, then sf is still dropping :) |
| 18:19.04 | mafm | hmm |
| 18:19.17 | mafm | ok, so most leaks seem to be either OGRE or RBGui's fault |
| 18:19.38 | brlcad | that from a valgrind profile? |
| 18:20.39 | mafm | yup |
| 18:21.01 | mafm | well, maybe I should delete some of the objects |
| 18:21.10 | mafm | but when I try to do so it gives segfaults :) |
| 18:21.22 | ``Erik | which ones come from BRL-CAD? :D |
| 18:22.02 | mafm | you mean leaks or segfaults? |
| 18:22.06 | brlcad | that's highly likely then that it's a problem of use, not a problem on their side (other than they could add crash protection maybe) |
| 18:22.19 | brlcad | could be deletion order |
| 18:22.23 | ``Erik | leaks, we should be fairly leak free |
| 18:22.51 | mafm | there are some of the leak reports with empty stack, the rest are OGRE/RBGui related, as I said |
| 18:23.46 | mafm | brlcad: posibly, I should look at it more closely :) |
| 18:24.05 | *** join/#brlcad tanderson (n=gentoofa@gentoo/developer/gentoofan23) | |
| 18:25.13 | tanderson | hi |
| 18:25.16 | brlcad | howdy tanderson |
| 18:26.30 | tanderson | I and some others are interested in packaging brlcad for gentoo linux. One problem that comes up is that brlcad packages dependant libraries inside, which is completely against policies for various reasons. Is there any chance brlcad could use the system libraries? |
| 18:27.27 | brlcad | tanderson: have you read the portage integration thread? |
| 18:27.36 | tanderson | no, where is that? |
| 18:27.44 | brlcad | ahh...then you *really* should :) |
| 18:27.49 | brlcad | on the tracker |
| 18:27.56 | brlcad | there's been folks working on integration for a couple years |
| 18:28.18 | tanderson | what tracker? |
| 18:28.22 | brlcad | it's on the gentoo tracker, i'd have to dig up the url |
| 18:28.30 | tanderson | oh, gentoo's bugzilla? |
| 18:28.33 | brlcad | yeah |
| 18:28.38 | tanderson | ok |
| 18:28.49 | brlcad | it's a very old and very long thread |
| 18:29.17 | brlcad | should answer a lot of questions -- and from there I'd be glad to share where things are at *today* when you get up to speed |
| 18:29.17 | tanderson | unfortunately our bugzilla is down at the moment |
| 18:29.28 | brlcad | that's no fun |
| 18:29.30 | tanderson | I'll look at it when it's fixed |
| 18:29.37 | tanderson | yeah |
| 18:29.59 | brlcad | basically, those that are bundled are all just optional -- for platforms that don't use package management systems |
| 18:30.08 | brlcad | saves a download and gives us a guaranteed regression test |
| 18:30.36 | brlcad | but none have to be used (at least not any more -- we used to have heavy mods, hence why the tracker goes back years) |
| 18:31.07 | brlcad | --disable-almost-everything is something a packager should probably be using |
| 18:31.27 | ``Erik | http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:CrKBeNz5VpoJ:bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi%3Fid%3D77197+brlcad+site:bugs.gentoo.org&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=us&client=firefox-a |
| 18:31.29 | ``Erik | izzat it? |
| 18:31.49 | tanderson | yes, I think so |
| 18:31.54 | brlcad | the only issue remaining that I can think of is 1) a bug in the tk sources that make run-time loading fail, and 2) a run-time lookup failure of itcl.tcl if you use a system IncrTcl |
| 18:32.00 | ``Erik | it's got cliffs name all over it, I think that's the big thread about the issue |
| 18:32.15 | brlcad | yeah, he did a lot to try to get it working |
| 18:34.40 | tanderson | that page doesn't really load for me |
| 18:34.57 | tanderson | I'll just wait for our infrastructure to bring it back up |
| 18:35.20 | brlcad | yeah, me either |
| 18:35.36 | brlcad | ah, there it came up |
| 18:35.47 | tanderson | yeah, for me too as soon as I said it |
| 18:36.06 | brlcad | yeah.. since 2005 .. nice. |
| 18:36.56 | tanderson | when I get my faster machine to compile I hope to get it working better |
| 18:38.10 | brlcad | of those two issues I mentioned, 1 has already been fixed upstream so just a matter of if it's status is completed |
| 18:38.55 | brlcad | for 2, nobody has tried it in a couple revisions, but the issue is like a line in a file to fix (just a matter of knowing which file and which line) ;) |
| 18:39.14 | brlcad | s/fix/add/ |
| 18:39.20 | tanderson | heh |
| 18:40.29 | brlcad | wonders why starseeker is manually coping files into the wiki file repo instead of using the web interface :P |
| 18:43.22 | mafm | going home, see you |
| 18:43.38 | brlcad | see ya mafm |
| 18:45.04 | brlcad | ooh, it's just the form1, cool |
| 18:47.16 | tanderson | heh, that bug repot is quite informative about the state of things |
| 18:47.22 | tanderson | *report |
| 18:47.33 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:48.05 | starseeker | brlcad: that's the form1 |
| 18:48.25 | starseeker | normally I do use the web interface :-) |
| 18:48.59 | starseeker | I have to relearn how to do the www copy every time... need to write stuff faster so I do it more frequently :-P |
| 18:49.02 | brlcad | I think I had a long post in there at one point that explains a lot of misgivings |
| 18:49.09 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, i noticed |
| 18:49.29 | starseeker | heh - sorry. I was probably tripping all kinds of warnings |
| 18:49.32 | brlcad | starseeker: or keep a HOWTO in your home directory :) |
| 18:49.39 | starseeker | will do that... |
| 18:49.42 | brlcad | nah, benign |
| 18:50.14 | ``Erik | and every time he stumbles through trying to relearn it, he'll go to add it to his HOWTO, then chew himself out because it was already there :D *duck* |
| 18:50.16 | brlcad | tanderson: please let me know if you have any questions -- getting brl-cad integrated really would be great |
| 18:50.44 | brlcad | it's the three-year race to see whether portage folks or apt folks get a final integration first it seems :) |
| 18:51.33 | starseeker | tanderson: I think some form of brlcad ebuild is in the science overlay |
| 18:51.38 | brlcad | tanderson: also .. our INSTALL, COPYING, and README files actually contain useful/relevant information, contrary to convention ;) |
| 18:51.49 | brlcad | might help with setting things up |
| 18:52.35 | starseeker | I really should tackle the itcl issue - that one was basically a showstopper |
| 18:52.46 | brlcad | and it's so easy |
| 18:52.50 | brlcad | you could probably figure it out now :) |
| 18:53.15 | starseeker | glances suspiciously at brlcad, shrugs, and pulls up configure.ac |
| 18:53.18 | ``Erik | 'cept the itcl/itk is a horrible mash of release 3.3.1 and bits out of their CVS because it broke with tcl85 |
| 18:53.39 | ``Erik | (sorry) |
| 18:53.49 | starseeker | ``Erik: Are you saying you wouldn't expect it to work with a system tcl/tk right now? |
| 18:54.07 | brlcad | ``Erik: yeah, but it works with 8.4+3.2 or 8.5+3.3 .. that can be specified |
| 18:54.19 | starseeker | woot: http://brlcad.org/w/images/f/fe/Interactive_Raytracing_-_The_nirt_Command.pdf |
| 18:54.30 | brlcad | at worst, there'd be a small patch |
| 18:54.40 | brlcad | nice work starseeker |
| 18:55.13 | ``Erik | hrm, bob commited with "Update version.", I wonder what that means |
| 18:55.20 | starseeker | wishes time_to_write/time_paperwork_overhead wasn't so close to 1... |
| 18:55.23 | brlcad | you think you could make it more detailed? it's kinda thin |
| 18:55.36 | starseeker | brlcad: thanks |
| 18:55.38 | brlcad | (just kidding!) |
| 18:55.39 | starseeker | brlcad: heh |
| 18:55.54 | tanderson | starseeker: I'm aware of that ebuild. One of my colleagues in gentoo put it there ;) |
| 18:55.58 | starseeker | I think we've already scared folks enough :-) |
| 18:56.17 | tanderson | brlcad: now that you put it as a challenge I'll be sure to work harder on it :) |
| 18:57.26 | starseeker | doesn't intend to touch nirt again until the time comes to libbu-ify it and make it behave "better" as a BRL-CAD component |
| 18:57.27 | ``Erik | wonders how much of http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/ports/cad/brlcad/ would help O.o |
| 18:57.53 | brlcad | tanderson: I'll be sure to announce you guys as winning over debian folks if it happens first ;) |
| 18:57.57 | starseeker | From what I recall of the ebuild stuff, the itcl issue was THE big remaining one. |
| 18:58.28 | tanderson | starseeker: yeah, definitely |
| 18:58.37 | starseeker | They were absolutely determined that it wouldn't go in unless/until it could build with all system libs, and WHERE to put it was almost as big an issue |
| 18:59.15 | tanderson | the where issue didn't make much sense to me as we already put kde and qt in a non-standard location |
| 18:59.36 | brlcad | and x11 ;) |
| 18:59.58 | brlcad | i don't recall, is gentoo one of the few that no longer has a librt.so from compat? |
| 19:01.39 | tanderson | starseeker: fbsd won't help us much because we are a lot stricter in some areas |
| 19:01.59 | tanderson | brlcad: what do you mean by 'compat'? |
| 19:02.46 | brlcad | librt is a deprecated library last I read |
| 19:03.02 | starseeker | he's talking about where one of the core name conflicts comes from |
| 19:03.14 | ``Erik | old sysV realtime library iirc? |
| 19:03.29 | brlcad | yeah, something like that |
| 19:03.37 | starseeker | HOZED his system when he ignored all warnings and attempted a /usr install |
| 19:03.55 | brlcad | started up in late 80's or early 90's .. lasted about 10 years, then was put on the chopping block |
| 19:04.18 | ``Erik | now there's a new one to play with, uh, a bayesian network library called libbn.so :) |
| 19:04.48 | starseeker | IIRC gentoo's first response was to ask us to rename our libs, which is a no-go |
| 19:05.29 | brlcad | i'm not too worried about them .. anyone with a 404 downloads page ... |
| 19:05.36 | tanderson | librt seems to be provided by glibc |
| 19:05.41 | brlcad | yep |
| 19:05.44 | brlcad | at least on linux |
| 19:05.57 | brlcad | it was part of a variety of libc implementations |
| 19:06.20 | brlcad | some moved the lib to a libc compat library, others kept it but marked as dead/deprecated |
| 19:06.43 | brlcad | it's more a matter of "is it still there" for a default system |
| 19:06.46 | starseeker | The most frustrating aspect of all that was the opendx ebuild (or maybe it was just dx) did similar non-standard things and was already in the main tree |
| 19:10.46 | tanderson | some people have different standards etc. |
| 19:11.02 | starseeker | nods. Apparently we attracted some real sticklers |
| 19:11.48 | starseeker | If the itcl issue is resolved, we MIGHT be able to figure out some kind of location |
| 19:11.57 | brlcad | woot, cha-ching .. my limit order executed |
| 19:12.26 | ``Erik | starseeker: like /usr/brlcad, where all those third party apps assume it'll be? :D |
| 19:12.30 | brlcad | yeah, the location should work now that mged can auto-locate all of its resources |
| 19:12.36 | starseeker | brlcad: Heh, who knew indecision on the part of the market could be so profitable? |
| 19:13.00 | brlcad | is loving it |
| 19:13.19 | starseeker | ``Erik: That would be my preference, but they REALLY wanted it in "standard" locations. That was one very frustrating discussion |
| 19:14.12 | starseeker | <evil chuckle> time to get the nirt stuff into svn, although it will mean dealing with our very first custom XSL logic... |
| 19:14.14 | ``Erik | you're just trying to get me on a rant about linux, aren't ya O.o :D |
| 19:14.44 | starseeker | ``Erik: Of course - it will keep me off a rant about the frustrations of that ebuild process |
| 19:27.25 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32988 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ps.c: Added an option to draw a border around the image. Also added an option for specifying a border color. |
| 19:47.55 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r32989 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Added the png command to libged. For now, this works with wireframe only. |
| 20:00.24 | PrezKennedy | i love the EFF |
| 20:14.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32991 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/nirt/en/nirt.xml: Fix image link in nirt doc. |
| 21:52.18 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:55.49 | brlcad | example, http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap080924.html is public domain |
| 21:56.57 | brlcad | oops |
| 22:59.04 | starseeker | wonders if we can find a sun texture and add it to the Earth model :-) |
| 23:09.21 | ``Erik | well, given that the earth model is geometrically correct, I'd be awfully tempted to throw a sketch in that was "mccan't/failin '08" on it :( and that just wouldn't be very proper |
| 23:10.32 | ``Erik | http://mu.org/~bright/lj/Sarah-Palin-Hunter.jpg |
| 23:11.25 | ``Erik | http://mu.org/~bright/lj/2008-09-01-socksbarney_181.gif |
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| 01:17.39 | ``Erik | http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c365/wraithfodder/motivational%20humor/SGA-rodneyhairmistake.jpg |
| 01:34.02 | starseeker | wonders how professional comedians would survive without politics |
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| 11:58.45 | brlcad | wow ..incrTcl 4 is released |
| 12:14.16 | louipc | wow |
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| 00:32.31 | ``Erik | now that's lovely |
| 00:33.15 | ``Erik | upgrade from mysql 50 to 51, so it wants my to run mysql_upgrade, but it can't because I can't start mysqld, but I can't because I haven't run mysql_upgrade |
| 00:35.56 | archivist | lurks in #mysql and has never heard of that |
| 00:40.21 | ``Erik | I did go from a fairly old 50 to a brand spanking new 51, mebbe I need to do a new 50, then move to 51 |
| 00:41.42 | archivist | dunno 5.1 is still RC status |
| 00:50.02 | ``Erik | heh, *shrug* 60 is in the ports tree, mebbe I shoulda researched :D *downgrade* |
| 00:51.21 | archivist | 60 is somewhat beta |
| 00:51.43 | ``Erik | yeah, "-devel" |
| 00:52.14 | ``Erik | needs to write the postgresql backend for this durn program |
| 00:57.14 | archivist | noo 5.0 whatever should be ok |
| 01:00.05 | ``Erik | nooo, postgresql >> mysql :D *duck* |
| 01:00.44 | archivist | neva! |
| 01:01.12 | archivist | sets the #mysql bot on ``Erik |
| 01:02.25 | ``Erik | hehehe |
| 01:02.38 | ``Erik | I have to say, mysql is getting far less sucky lately |
| 01:03.36 | archivist | I run the #mysql bot on an old PII on the shelf here |
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| 03:00.31 | ``Erik | everyone out of the universe, quick! |
| 03:19.35 | yukonbob | evening, cadheads |
| 03:20.02 | yukonbob | thinks Aeon Flux (live-action) might be on TV tonight... |
| 03:24.56 | punkrockgirl | i'm dj'ing soon |
| 03:25.08 | punkrockgirl | if anyone cares to hear |
| 03:27.50 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 03:35.00 | yukonbob | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:40.59 | yukonbob | what time? |
| 03:44.45 | ``Erik | 17 minutes ago |
| 04:11.59 | punkrockgirl | now |
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| 06:54.29 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: still on or done? |
| 06:54.54 | brlcad | needs a beep or something |
| 07:00.44 | clock_ | beeps |
| 07:00.50 | brlcad | heh |
| 07:16.59 | yukonbob | mawning |
| 07:17.17 | yukonbob | hey clock_, long time no see... |
| 07:17.31 | clock_ | yukonbob: hey mawning |
| 07:18.08 | yukonbob | gets ready to hit hay... |
| 07:27.14 | brlcad | crazy talk |
| 07:30.09 | starseeker | wonders if brlcad would volunteer to get "borged" for the direct nerve level computer access and the eradication of physical distractions like sleep... |
| 07:30.47 | brlcad | oh absolutely if the technology was solid |
| 07:30.49 | clock_ | starseeker: in that case I would volunteer for the intergalactic optical equipment so his brain could be also connected with the aliens |
| 07:30.52 | brlcad | i'm all for cybernetic implants |
| 07:31.13 | clock_ | brlcad: Universal Soldier? :) |
| 07:31.16 | brlcad | just not of the brain until it's about to kick the bucket (then absolutely that too!) |
| 07:31.29 | clock_ | what does the kick the bucket phrase mean? |
| 07:31.34 | starseeker | Hmm, brlcad as an operating system... |
| 07:31.35 | brlcad | die |
| 07:31.45 | clock_ | aha yes :) |
| 07:31.57 | starseeker | those poor cpus would need some serious overclocking |
| 07:32.16 | clock_ | s over |
| 07:33.06 | starseeker | On the other hand, we could hook him to the internet and watch Windows be eradicated from the world's computers :-) |
| 07:33.24 | clock_ | Using M1A2 Abrams tanks? |
| 07:33.57 | starseeker | enjoys that mental image |
| 07:34.06 | brlcad | heh |
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| 08:12.54 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r32992 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/nirt/en/Makefile.am: Point to actual file name for fo_custom.xsl |
| 08:14.41 | brlcad | ~starseeker++ |
| 08:17.33 | starseeker | makes the very unplesant discovery that out-of-dir build for pdf doesn't work, since the image links in the docs don't have a "top_srcdir" prefix |
| 08:18.01 | starseeker | ponders... |
| 08:24.22 | starseeker | ew - that's a real problem |
| 08:40.53 | clock_ | These free software tools are ingenious due to their flexibility |
| 08:41.12 | clock_ | I am simulating a telecommunications amplifier and want to know the time jitter caused by different shifts of 10 and 5 MHz |
| 08:41.36 | clock_ | no simulator will show you time jitter, but in gnuplot I can enter a formula which graphs directly the time jitter from phase angles which the simulators commonly show! |
| 08:42.02 | clock_ | SImilar to BRL-CAD, doing anything is also not difficult there, or hooking it up into custom scripts and website. |
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| 13:45.17 | brlcad | kicks itcl 4 configure in the nads trying to appease the tea flag gods |
| 13:58.33 | louipc | there's tcl/tk 8.5.5 out too :D |
| 14:02.04 | brlcad | yeah, I saw that |
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| 14:59.28 | novakyu | hi |
| 14:59.50 | novakyu | is there a way to generate a blueprint from a brlcad model? |
| 15:00.09 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-88-148.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 15:06.35 | brlcad | novakyu: howdy -- yes and no |
| 15:06.55 | brlcad | you can generate the diagram, but you have to label it with dimensions manually outside of brl-cad |
| 15:07.51 | brlcad | example: http://brlcad.org/gallery/s/renderings/havoc_rtedge.png.html |
| 15:07.53 | novakyu | i see. |
| 15:08.48 | brlcad | would make an excellent addition and is on our todo list |
| 15:09.09 | brlcad | but it's unfortunately not a high-priority item given other priorities and limited manpower |
| 15:11.06 | clock_ | novakyu: you have quite a slavic sounding name |
| 15:11.41 | novakyu | i suppose if one could somehow generate the dimension list though ... |
| 15:11.55 | novakyu | labeling itself may not be too onerous. |
| 15:12.06 | novakyu | clock_: yes, i do. |
| 15:12.59 | brlcad | novakyu: it should be possible to generate the dimension list using the bounding boxes (for orthogonal views) or using 'nirt' for off-axis dimensions |
| 15:12.59 | novakyu | thx for the information. |
| 15:13.16 | novakyu | ah. great. |
| 15:14.04 | brlcad | nirt samples a ray through an object telling you where you enter/exit and the distances in-between -- that's exact dimensioning for that ray path |
| 15:14.54 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 15:15.17 | clock_ | novakyu: sounds Czech |
| 15:15.21 | brlcad | massive doc/tutorial on nirt published to the website just a couple days ago, making bounding boxes and getting their dimensions is pretty simple and scriptable (make_bb, analyze) |
| 15:16.37 | novakyu | that sounds promising. i'll look into it. |
| 15:16.53 | novakyu | clock_: closer to polish |
| 16:23.27 | brlcad | looks like itcl/itk 4 rely on tcl 8.5.5 |
| 16:23.58 | brlcad | I have the upgrade pretty much done, but it requires upgrading all of tcl too .. and I'm not sure I really want to do that |
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| 18:41.50 | starseeker | brlcad: Pretty much guaranteed to break S2, isn't it? |
| 18:47.26 | yukonbob | "S2"? |
| 19:42.31 | ``Erik | third party app |
| 19:42.44 | ``Erik | they bitch every time tcl changes, yeah |
| 19:43.57 | ``Erik | (if it weren't for "s2", brlcad, starseeker, bob and myself wouldn't be getting paid to work on BRL-CAD, it's that important...) |
| 19:58.09 | ``Erik | huh |
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| 20:47.55 | ``Erik | commercials on history channel are stupid. "every wish you had *SONIC* hearing?" ... |
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| 21:24.47 | phreak4257 | Erik: please to be telling me where can I buy this "sonic hearing" of which you speak? |
| 21:39.48 | brlcad | starseeker: not guaranteed, but highly likely -- and if anything, it's not worth the hassle it "might" cause even at that |
| 21:40.43 | brlcad | i already pushed it off into a stashed dir so it can be tried later if needed, not going to do it until we have a pressing need |
| 21:41.22 | brlcad | the recent changes would have probably have helped the integration issues |
| 21:41.40 | brlcad | itcl and itk are finally separated, rewritten to use the new tclOO core |
| 21:42.20 | brlcad | and their build systems are now clean TEA builds |
| 21:49.32 | ``Erik | #file# is emacsese for a file being edited at the moment, right? |
| 22:24.28 | brlcad | yeah |
| 22:24.34 | brlcad | unsaved change |
| 22:25.01 | brlcad | make[5]: *** No rule to make target `Introduction.html', needed by `all'. Stop. |
| 22:25.17 | brlcad | ah, never mind .. that was my bad |
| 22:28.01 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r32994 10/brlcad/trunk/ (configure.ac src/libged/Makefile.am): |
| 22:28.01 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: bob added png as a dependency to libged when he moved the 'png' command over. |
| 22:28.01 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: that functionality should be shoved up into a different place (like an image |
| 22:28.02 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: conversion library that erik sorta started). for now, just spell out the dep |
| 22:28.02 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: and include the flags. |
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| 02:21.12 | louipc | |
| 02:21.16 | louipc | kjk |
| 02:41.33 | *** join/#brlcad ilya (n=asus@87.118.102.154) | |
| 02:42.14 | ilya | starseeker: so what? Is it possible to arrange tags that way? |
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| 07:33.18 | brlcad | yawns |
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| 10:26.48 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 10:27.17 | mafm | hi |
| 10:32.09 | claymore | Mornin all |
| 10:45.25 | alex_joni | is it possible to import a pro-e solid from brlcad? |
| 10:45.41 | alex_joni | is interested in converting it to STEP or IGES |
| 10:46.01 | claymore | From Pro/E to BRLCAD or from BRLCAD to Pro/E ? |
| 10:47.27 | alex_joni | from PRO/E to BRLCAD |
| 10:48.09 | claymore | Yes, there is a Pro/E to BRL-CAD converter that comes with the BRLCAD source.... although you need to have the Pro-Toolkit to be able to compile the converter. |
| 10:48.38 | claymore | Other routes are Pro/E->IGES->BRL-CAD and Pro/E-> DXF -> BRLCAD |
| 10:48.54 | alex_joni | actually Pro/E->IGES would be enough for me |
| 10:49.01 | alex_joni | but I don't have acces to Pro/E atm |
| 10:49.15 | alex_joni | I only have a model I need as IGES or STEP |
| 10:49.44 | claymore | Oh, are you asking if BRLCAD can perform the Pro/E->IGES conversion? Because if you are, then no, we don't do that ;) |
| 10:50.15 | alex_joni | ok, thanks |
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| 11:34.51 | claymore | Mernin Erik! |
| 11:46.32 | brlcad | alex_joni: i just read that and am not sure what exactly you were asking wrt conversion |
| 11:47.02 | brlcad | we're not the pro/e folks so I don't see why you'd be asking about proe->iges .. |
| 11:49.47 | claymore | Well, brlcad, when you need 'spert advice about conversions... gotta go to the 'sperts ;) |
| 11:58.38 | claymore | brlcad: you in today? How goes the 'hunting' ? |
| 12:04.08 | alex_joni | brlcad: I was wondering if there is a pro/w->brlcad->iges way |
| 12:04.26 | alex_joni | and claymore is right about the 'spert advice ;) |
| 12:07.06 | claymore | Darn tootin. |
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| 13:48.31 | brlcad | claymore: cept we have more than enough in our own hands to be providing support to commercial cad packages that folks have *paid* them to answer their questions :-) |
| 13:50.11 | brlcad | harmless in this instance, but don't want it to become a habit in general -- focus is selfishly and shamelessly on our stuff |
| 13:50.51 | brlcad | alex_joni: so yeah, in that instance, there'd be no point with the intermediary, just dump pro/e->iges directly |
| 13:55.38 | *** join/#brlcad mafm_ (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 13:59.55 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32996 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/solver_test.cpp: Avoiding compiler complaint: solver_test.cpp:98: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*' |
| 14:11.50 | mafm_ | brlcad: you around? |
| 14:12.44 | mafm | well, any other experienced developer might chime in |
| 14:13.07 | mafm | the supposed fix of my commit above triggers compiler errors |
| 14:13.41 | mafm | because some statically defined C-string is ending up in some struct with char** |
| 14:14.10 | mafm | so I don't know if the proper fix is to modify the struct, revert the change, or what :) |
| 14:18.37 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=500@resnet-46-165.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 14:25.28 | mafm | hi pacman87 |
| 14:27.47 | pacman87 | howdy |
| 14:31.09 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32997 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libfb/fb_obj.c: Avoiding compiler complaint: fb_obj.c:102: warning: passing argument 4 of 'bu_cmd' from incompatible pointer type |
| 14:46.03 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32998 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (get_obj_bounds.c how.c): Including stdlib.h which declares free(), to avoid warning: incompatible implicit declaration of built-in function 'free' |
| 14:46.15 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r32999 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Avoid warning: passing argument 3 of 'ged_bot_dump' from incompatible pointer type |
| 15:09.41 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 15:10.00 | claymore | hai erik! |
| 15:10.04 | ``Erik | says some impolite things concerning his service provider. |
| 15:10.44 | ``Erik | 'sup, jgkillingvacationboy? |
| 15:12.18 | claymore | not much getyourowndamnjgsfoo, en you? |
| 15:13.05 | ``Erik | I have a few jg's, but I've been building defenses more, being that I can borrow other peoples jg's :D my big jg is gonna be in 65 I think |
| 15:14.24 | claymore | cool. You can have mine when quitting time comes ;) I can prolly hang on another month or so.... |
| 15:15.01 | ``Erik | yeah, I might only last that long, too heh |
| 15:15.37 | ``Erik | I got a DN this weekend and ... well, *shrug* yeah, now I have one, big whup |
| 15:15.45 | ``Erik | game lacks depth :( |
| 15:16.27 | claymore | ah, first dread eh? I am building them up and will do some smashage when I have enough.... takes too long though :/ |
| 15:16.37 | claymore | 580 hours on the next level of photon |
| 15:16.42 | ``Erik | close to my first titan |
| 15:16.42 | claymore | vomits |
| 15:16.49 | claymore | really? NICE |
| 15:16.57 | ``Erik | one more research and a couple structures |
| 15:17.44 | claymore | oh hell. didnt even realize I can make titans now! *slams head on desk* DOH |
| 15:17.48 | ``Erik | and 4 prings in the queue, one already out |
| 15:17.58 | ``Erik | :D it's the 22(3) that's gonna hurt me I think |
| 15:18.05 | claymore | Nice. Prings act as a pretty good deterrant. |
| 15:18.17 | ``Erik | pshields on everything, too, plus 10 dizzies |
| 15:18.20 | claymore | yeah... its PITA. it took soo long I forgot about them. lol |
| 15:18.29 | claymore | hence why I didn't even see them complete lol. |
| 15:19.11 | claymore | Sounds like you have some nice fleet blender planets :) |
| 15:19.23 | ``Erik | <-- not sure how people are spending 4 years with multiple accounts on that game though |
| 15:20.00 | ``Erik | I d'no, how keen would you be to jump http://epsilon.astroempires.com/base.aspx?base=136910 ? :D |
| 15:21.24 | claymore | get those CCs up! otherwise pretty tight :) |
| 15:21.40 | claymore | and no, 4 years on multiple accounts.... can't fathom |
| 15:38.21 | mafm | kicks CIA-24 |
| 15:38.21 | CIA-24 | ow |
| 15:53.44 | mafm | does anybody know if bu_lob / bu_vls_printf support 64 bit pointers? :) |
| 16:55.46 | brlcad | mafm: they should work just fine |
| 16:55.52 | brlcad | we do 64-bit builds |
| 16:57.27 | brlcad | mafm: regarding the static c-string, haven't looked at the patch yet but I would expect a static c-string to be const or well-defined via the api |
| 16:58.25 | mafm | brlcad: does %p work with bu_vls_vprintf? |
| 16:58.52 | brlcad | hm |
| 16:59.03 | brlcad | looks |
| 16:59.31 | mafm | theoretically there's a "case 'p':" but dunno if works with 64 bits |
| 16:59.42 | mafm | that was mostly my question |
| 16:59.44 | brlcad | looks like it should work |
| 17:00.07 | mafm | since some "%x, (unsigned int)pointer" looks like a bad idea for portability |
| 17:00.12 | mafm | and it issues some warnings :) |
| 17:00.21 | mafm | so is it OK if I change them for %p, right? |
| 17:00.24 | brlcad | just sprintf's as an int, which would be 64-bit |
| 17:01.07 | brlcad | every instance of %p and %x that is used I can think of is actually developer/debug statements, nothing incredibly important |
| 17:01.22 | mafm | yes, they're logs |
| 17:01.37 | mafm | in converters |
| 17:01.49 | brlcad | I thought there was some significant portability problem with %p, but I'm not remembering at the moment |
| 17:02.14 | mafm | so do I change them or not? |
| 17:02.40 | brlcad | commit a few and I can run some portability tests |
| 17:03.02 | brlcad | or commit them all as one chunk and I can do the same, either way |
| 17:03.05 | mafm | they're only 4 of them :) |
| 17:04.20 | brlcad | there are more than that -- you probably just found them in one file somewhere :) |
| 17:04.35 | brlcad | there's probably a couple dozen spread throughout where pointer addresses are printed |
| 17:05.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33001 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (dxf/dxf-g.c dxf/g-dxf.c fast4-g.c): Avoiding warning: cast from pointer to integer of different size -- Using format %p for pointers instead of '%x, (unsigned int)pointer', which should work with bu_vls_vprintf() |
| 17:05.11 | mafm | I mean the ones that I'm intending to shut off |
| 17:05.34 | brlcad | what was the warning? |
| 17:06.07 | mafm | it's in the commit message |
| 17:06.13 | mafm | just printed above |
| 17:06.29 | brlcad | ah, gotit |
| 17:06.30 | mafm | cast from pointer to integer of different size |
| 17:06.52 | mafm | so, pointer is 64 bits and (unsigned int) 32 |
| 17:07.05 | brlcad | ooh, that should have been "unsigned long" for the usual trick, printing to an %lx |
| 17:07.27 | brlcad | the dxf convs are old code |
| 17:08.35 | mafm | but if %p is supported, it's better that way, isn't it? |
| 17:09.09 | brlcad | sure, why not |
| 17:39.00 | mafm | brlcad: FMAX(a, b) is redefined in nirt/interact.c, having it in common.h (same code except for not casting it to double) |
| 17:39.32 | mafm | and it's used for a path length, with doesn't need casting to double at all |
| 17:40.25 | mafm | I'm removing it, if there are no objections :) |
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| 17:43.34 | ``Erik | ... |
| 17:44.24 | brlcad | mafm: no objections here.. |
| 17:44.50 | mafm | wb ``Erik |
| 17:46.03 | mafm | good |
| 17:46.58 | mafm | flaming ``Erik: not using fmax() it's because of the BSD hippies anyway :þ |
| 17:47.16 | brlcad | heh |
| 17:47.39 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 17:47.57 | mafm | it's because of a FMAX macro |
| 17:48.18 | mafm | you would see the commit, but SF's SVN servers are down or something |
| 17:48.43 | ``Erik | which file? |
| 17:48.50 | ``Erik | er, wait, you haven't committed yet |
| 17:48.56 | ``Erik | quit confusin' me, boy :D |
| 17:49.03 | mafm | lol |
| 17:49.05 | mafm | sorry :) |
| 17:50.00 | mafm | it's in nirt/interact.c, redifining the macro in common.h, but the comment says that BRL-CAD uses FMAX() even if it's in c99 because BSDs don't implement it |
| 17:51.34 | mafm | kicks CIA-24 again |
| 17:52.05 | mafm | kicks CIA-24 |
| 17:52.05 | CIA-24 | ow |
| 17:52.12 | mafm | now :P |
| 17:53.35 | ``Erik | hrm, it was sucked in at some point, dun remember when |
| 17:55.59 | ``Erik | july of '04 |
| 17:56.42 | mafm | what does that mean, that some BSD folks removed them from their libc? if so, why? |
| 17:57.29 | ``Erik | june, rather |
| 17:57.41 | brlcad | mafm: sf is still dropping them (or there's a problem with the procmailer) |
| 17:57.58 | brlcad | and will probably continue to drop them until me or another guy can investigate |
| 17:58.08 | brlcad | it's only a few projects |
| 17:58.13 | brlcad | we're "lucky" |
| 17:58.37 | ``Erik | um, sunos 5.1 implemented them as a macro, fbsd has been using suns math.h, which predates c99... it's been slowly pulled into spec |
| 17:58.53 | mafm | brlcad: ok, no problem... it works intermittently anyway |
| 17:59.08 | ``Erik | http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/lib/msun/src/math.h.diff?r1=1.36;r2=1.37;f=h |
| 18:00.02 | ``Erik | I d'no about obsd or nbsd |
| 18:00.41 | ``Erik | should only effect fbsd before 5.0 *shrug* |
| 18:01.09 | mafm | well, it's good to have in common.h then |
| 18:01.20 | mafm | just not duplicated for no purpose :) |
| 18:05.51 | ``Erik | ooh, some neato CPP macro fu for that one |
| 18:06.29 | mafm | huh? |
| 18:07.00 | ``Erik | in gcc's source |
| 18:07.14 | mafm | ah |
| 18:07.16 | mafm | :D |
| 18:07.36 | brlcad | starseeker: somewhere in the manpages, you've got Introduction.html listed as a built_source (which causes it to be deleted) |
| 18:07.42 | mafm | you take the "use the Source, Luke" quite seriously |
| 18:07.45 | brlcad | yet it's also svn managed |
| 18:08.14 | starseeker | oopd |
| 18:08.36 | starseeker | that's just a "here's the help browser" page |
| 18:08.52 | ``Erik | mmx_smaxv2sf3 wow, that's a useful name :D heh |
| 18:08.59 | starseeker | wants it installed, but probably did it wrong |
| 18:10.03 | ``Erik | best I can tell, there is an sse/3dnow op that does basically fmax(), and gcc 4.0 and later will attempt to use it if possible. If FMAX() is used in a tight loop, that's a case for trying to use it :) |
| 18:11.45 | mafm | probably |
| 18:12.11 | mafm | doesn't dare to dive into GCC source code |
| 18:12.38 | ``Erik | it's far less horrible than the 2.7.2.3 days |
| 18:12.53 | mafm | so here I have the last-but-one of the compiler complaints, the one that I unsuccessfully tried to shut before |
| 18:13.00 | ``Erik | even the versioning is far less horrible :D |
| 18:13.28 | mafm | homovulgaris used some struct with char** args for his constraints |
| 18:14.01 | ``Erik | yes, "char **" vs "const char **", which seem sto have been fixed in the last hour or so |
| 18:14.03 | mafm | then in some part of the code is doing: char* args[] = { "whatever", "other" } |
| 18:14.46 | mafm | and the compiler warns because those are "static" c-strings |
| 18:15.24 | mafm | so what's the proper way to deal this kind of things? doing nothing, changing the struct, ...? |
| 18:16.27 | ``Erik | args[0] = "whatever"; args[1] = "other"; ? possibly? |
| 18:16.54 | ``Erik | args = (char **)malloc(sizeof(char *) * 2); before those |
| 18:17.17 | ``Erik | "stop building solver_test by default" :D |
| 18:17.18 | brlcad | mafm: declare them as const char* args[] = ... |
| 18:17.54 | mafm | ``Erik: I thought about that too, probably the best thing to do anyway |
| 18:17.56 | ``Erik | noo, it's being automatically coerced, it's when it's passed to the function, it's trying to convert the const char to char |
| 18:18.12 | mafm | brlcad: that was my first attempt, but then gives a compiler error, not just a warning |
| 18:18.21 | mafm | as erik says |
| 18:18.53 | ``Erik | this is src/libpc/sol<tab> line 98 or so |
| 18:18.57 | mafm | I don't know if the test is related with testing the software or waht |
| 18:19.12 | mafm | I mean, the one running with "make tests" |
| 18:19.29 | mafm | in that case probably it shouldn't be disabled |
| 18:19.41 | ``Erik | no, solver_test is not executed at all from the build system |
| 18:21.06 | mafm | so I just disable it in Makefile.am then |
| 18:21.16 | mafm | phone |
| 18:21.56 | ``Erik | personally, I'd add the .cpp file to EXTRA_DIST and provide an explicit rule to compile it correctly, but not put it in noinst_PROGRAMS, but that's just me |
| 18:30.40 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33003 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Introduction.html Introduction.xml Makefile.am): Use docbook for intro page too |
| 18:30.48 | starseeker | brlcad: That should work better |
| 18:30.53 | brlcad | mafm: ah, then it sounds like it's getting passed to a routine declared as non-const |
| 18:31.12 | brlcad | which is probably the "problem" .. the constness probably needs to extend throughout libpc |
| 18:33.23 | ``Erik | drops his pants and runs around the building screaming |
| 18:33.44 | ``Erik | (now if only I were to jog down the hall screaming, that'd freak a couple people out, methinks) |
| 18:35.27 | ``Erik | holy crap, it's been a long time since I've logged into a linux machine, heh |
| 18:37.21 | mafm | lol |
| 18:37.34 | mafm | totally freaked out by ``erik |
| 18:38.03 | ``Erik | sanity is overrated |
| 18:38.39 | mafm | brlcad: the question is if from a desgin point of view, this kind of args should be overridable (?) or not |
| 18:39.00 | mafm | I don't think that there's much point in modifying an argument |
| 18:39.28 | mafm | and if in main() is non const, it's because of a special reason |
| 18:39.39 | ``Erik | we have a lot of code that should probably wear the const attribute O.o |
| 18:39.51 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33004 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: reword cliffs efforts to 'mged help menu is restructured for improved usability' since lowercase mged is used on the one-liners |
| 18:39.56 | ``Erik | you can coerce to const, it's bad to coerce FROM const |
| 18:40.07 | brlcad | mafm: I didn't (at least immediately) see a reason why the API would need to modify that arg |
| 18:40.15 | brlcad | which means const needs to propagate |
| 18:40.38 | brlcad | with that done, it doesn't matter if the caller is const or not |
| 18:41.12 | mafm | good |
| 18:41.28 | mafm | propagates down to the struct or only other function args? |
| 18:42.22 | ``Erik | recursively make the callee const |
| 18:43.39 | ``Erik | int alpha(int x){} int beta(int x){alpha(x);} int gamma(const int x){beta(x);} /* make beta take const int x, then make alpha take const int x */ |
| 18:45.00 | mafm | yup |
| 18:45.20 | mafm | but alpha is using a struct with "char** args" |
| 18:45.50 | mafm | so I guess if I should do that a const, in the struct already -- I think so |
| 18:46.05 | mafm | because of brlcad's explanation about APIs |
| 18:46.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33005 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/openNURBS/Makefile.am: no such file: opennurbs.xcodeproj |
| 18:47.10 | brlcad | doesn't recall explaining much about APIs :) |
| 18:47.31 | mafm | [19:40:07] <brlcad> mafm: I didn't (at least immediately) see a reason why the API would need to modify that arg |
| 18:47.39 | ``Erik | um, but the args field is being addressed immediately, the struct itself is not being passed? it's good to coerce TO const, you should do it every time it makes sense O.o :D |
| 18:47.41 | brlcad | if alpha is using a char **args, yes it would need to be made const |
| 18:48.12 | mafm | args is a member of "pc_constrnt" struct really |
| 18:48.23 | brlcad | mafm: I know, I just wouldn't call that explaining much -- just a statement of perception :) |
| 18:48.26 | mafm | so if args shouldn't need to be modified, it can be const there too |
| 18:48.44 | ``Erik | int alpha(char **x); int beta(char **x); int gamma(struct *poo) { beta(poo->x); } /* still cast to const */ |
| 18:49.17 | mafm | :þ |
| 18:49.19 | brlcad | mafm: whether the struct needs to have it set const is a slightly different matter -- it could go either way |
| 18:49.22 | mafm | you'll see the diff |
| 18:49.29 | ``Erik | int alpha(const char **x); int beta(const char **x){alpha(x);} int gamma(struct *poo) { beta((const char **)poo->x); } |
| 18:49.39 | brlcad | if something uses struct->args and it complains about constness, that's where you would need to cast the const potentially |
| 18:49.52 | brlcad | yeah, like that |
| 18:50.16 | ``Erik | yay, tkhtml3 breaks on make distcheck, no rule to make target `distdir' |
| 18:51.29 | brlcad | hm, it does have a dist rule, so hopefully something simple can be done |
| 18:53.04 | ``Erik | hm, since it's fresh from starseeker, should this be, um, more education for him? :D |
| 18:54.17 | brlcad | sounds like an outstanding idea |
| 18:54.27 | brlcad | though I did just hack a fix |
| 18:54.46 | starseeker | drags himself out of the g_qa source code |
| 18:54.51 | PrezKennedy | continuing to teach the padawan the ways of the Farce? |
| 18:54.52 | PrezKennedy | ;) |
| 18:54.52 | ``Erik | :D |
| 18:55.09 | ``Erik | and here I was, all ready to go around the corner and do a major dramatic finger posing pose |
| 18:55.13 | ``Erik | pointing |
| 18:55.58 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33006 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/Makefile.am: totally hack the tkhtml3 dist inclusion. don't even both with logic. someone(tm) should test or make DIST_SUBDIRS actually work. |
| 18:56.11 | brlcad | didn't madonna do finger posing poses? |
| 18:56.19 | brlcad | i remember a song about that |
| 18:56.51 | ``Erik | thought it was more about finger hiding poses |
| 18:56.53 | ``Erik | vogues |
| 18:58.01 | mafm | lol |
| 18:59.11 | mafm | hmm, I don't know if some code of homovulgaris is leaking |
| 18:59.15 | mafm | I will put a note |
| 19:00.45 | mafm | or wait... free() free memory assigned to ** pointers, no need to say the size or anything? or arrays ala delete[] in C++? |
| 19:01.01 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33007 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/ (win32-msvc8/Makefile.am win32-msvc9/Makefile.am): bot2raw no longer exists, renamed to bot_dump (with no build file) |
| 19:01.18 | brlcad | mafm: no, there's not delete[] semantic |
| 19:01.25 | brlcad | you delete the elements, then you delete the container |
| 19:01.44 | brlcad | depending on the allocation sorts, assuming dynamic allocation |
| 19:02.23 | mafm | thinks that he didn't use C for far too long :/ |
| 19:02.27 | brlcad | so free()'ing a ** pointer is perfectly fine .. but if it's a container, there is potentially more to free |
| 19:03.33 | mafm | it's the args (char*), not another container |
| 19:04.46 | mafm | goody |
| 19:04.57 | mafm | so yet another complaint removed! |
| 19:06.21 | brlcad | that's the fun with constness .. it's like a vine that grows throughout the code.. once you plant a seed, it has to propagate |
| 19:06.51 | mafm | it's odd in C |
| 19:07.14 | mafm | at least for me in C++ is much more natural when you do it for objects and since the beginning |
| 19:07.15 | brlcad | that mess all started last weekend when I was working on getting c++ compilation mode working |
| 19:07.22 | ``Erik | 2damnit |
| 19:07.40 | ``Erik | brlcad beat me to the msvc files, sucks to be me, testing a distcheck before commiting |
| 19:08.25 | brlcad | the rules are really the same for C++ .. it's just the same sort of issues you'd have if you try to retroactively make class functions const that weren't originally |
| 19:08.36 | brlcad | har har :) |
| 19:11.20 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33008 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): const'ifying arguments for constraints (they don't seem to need to be modified), and additionally in this way we avoid yet another compiler warning |
| 19:11.44 | mafm | well, yes, but since you usually take responsibility for each class to manage itself, it's less prone to let anybody access the stuff when it doesn't need it |
| 19:12.03 | mafm | at least it was my major mind-shift when starting to use C++ from C |
| 19:12.14 | brlcad | that can be said of "neat" simple C functions too |
| 19:12.34 | brlcad | it's really just a matter of the guy writing the prototype and remembering to say "oh, this should be const" |
| 19:13.12 | brlcad | which you can forget or do with either -- the language really has nothing to do with it, not even towards encouraging/discouraging you to think about it up front imho |
| 19:13.20 | mafm | yep, but what I'm saying is that in my case, C++ (or OOP in general) makes me to remind that part much more easily |
| 19:13.34 | brlcad | because that's how you learned C++ |
| 19:13.57 | brlcad | I also learned C that way, it's odd for me to not think about it in exactly the same way |
| 19:14.22 | mafm | ``Erik: you can work your automake trickery with solver_test if you want, I'm a bit scared of using that |
| 19:14.44 | brlcad | object encapsulation doesn't change that -- it changes the data, giving me a bunch of "static's" to play with and store things in |
| 19:14.46 | mafm | brlcad: you use const in C all the time? |
| 19:15.04 | brlcad | as much as I remember to do so with C++, sure :) |
| 19:15.20 | brlcad | for new code, it's usually one of a half dozen things I try to ensure |
| 19:16.07 | mafm | :D |
| 19:16.11 | mafm | nice |
| 19:16.19 | brlcad | consistent style, constness, proper scope of functionality, right data types, consistent return values, good readability, etc |
| 19:16.20 | mafm | I've never saw that too much in C code |
| 19:16.37 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33009 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pc_constraints.c: Moving doxygen comment to the proper place |
| 19:20.24 | starseeker | works on puzzling out the requirements of distdir |
| 19:21.30 | brlcad | starseeker: while you're at it, doc/docbook dist building is busted too ;) |
| 19:21.53 | starseeker | ok |
| 19:22.15 | mafm | gtoos/solshoot.c gives another (last!) warning at line 158, when assigning a callback |
| 19:22.30 | mafm | "assignment from incompatible pointer type" |
| 19:23.18 | mafm | there are other places with the same assignation and declaration of functions which doesn't give the warning |
| 19:24.07 | mafm | (something in mged I think, grepping for it right now) |
| 19:24.42 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33010 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/solshoot.c: ws cleanup |
| 19:25.23 | mafm | mged/solids_on_ray.c 225, in example |
| 19:25.50 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33011 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/solshoot.c: remove unused parameter |
| 19:26.08 | brlcad | if they both declare parameter lists, they need to match |
| 19:26.12 | brlcad | in that case, they didn't |
| 19:26.20 | brlcad | but fortunately, the extra arg wasn't even used |
| 19:27.12 | mafm | brlcad: but then the one of mged/solids_on_ray has the same problem |
| 19:28.14 | mafm | gonna compile and test it, but haven't read a warning from it before... |
| 19:28.50 | brlcad | not surprising -- almost everything used to use k&r style declarations |
| 19:29.04 | brlcad | which didn't require argument lists, so the compiler didn't care |
| 19:29.33 | brlcad | the argument lists are continually added over time, causing propagation of warnings where funcs are set and passed around that have to get fixed |
| 19:29.38 | brlcad | kinda like constness propagation |
| 19:29.51 | brlcad | just not as deep |
| 19:30.17 | mafm | hmm |
| 19:30.28 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33012 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/beset/ (beset.c population.c): quell extra compilation warnings |
| 19:31.13 | mafm | but what was the difference between both declarations then? I don't see the one of mged having k&r style |
| 19:31.51 | mafm | oh wait, it's inside ifdef |
| 19:32.10 | mafm | so most certainly it wasn't copiled, that's the difference :D |
| 19:35.05 | mafm | well, going home now |
| 19:35.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33013 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/solids_on_ray.c: Propagating modification to another file (r33011)) using the same code, the extra parameter didn't match the callback declaration |
| 19:35.30 | mafm | take care :) |
| 20:12.11 | starseeker | blinks has his distcheck fails at tk itself |
| 20:42.36 | starseeker | growls at distcheck |
| 20:49.22 | starseeker | uh-oh - It's giving me tar: brlcad-7.13.0/doc/docbook/lessons/mged/assigning_material_properties_and_raytracing_images/commandwindow.png: file name is too long (max 99); not dumped |
| 20:50.55 | starseeker | brlcad: I take it I need to do some r enaming? |
| 21:17.24 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33014 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/ (g_diff.c g_lint.c g_qa.c testfree.c): quell variety of compilation warnings |
| 21:20.54 | brlcad | yeah, looks like posix says 100 is the max |
| 21:21.05 | brlcad | with optional behavior to bump it up to 256 |
| 21:21.15 | brlcad | but portably/practically it drops to 100 |
| 21:21.24 | starseeker | ok |
| 21:21.28 | starseeker | will redo |
| 21:21.47 | brlcad | gnu tar does their own thing to extend it even farther, but even they'll obey the limit if posix mode is set |
| 21:22.30 | brlcad | looks like it's mainly so you don't end up with a tar file that old tar can't open up |
| 21:23.12 | brlcad | aside from "assigning_material_properties_and_raytracing_images" being rediculously long :) |
| 21:26.29 | starseeker | yeah, yeah ;-) |
| 21:26.47 | *** join/#brlcad Gariton (n=kvirc@p54996157.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:27.02 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33015 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/ (Makefile.am testfree.c): get rid of testfree. it's apparently just a trivial test of libbu memory management. really unnecessary. |
| 21:33.58 | brlcad | starseeker: here's a simple fix to g_qa you can make to get ya started into the code |
| 21:34.04 | brlcad | rip out the conversion tables |
| 21:34.08 | brlcad | make it use libbu |
| 21:34.25 | brlcad | that's a hundred lines of waste as it is |
| 21:34.46 | starseeker | unit conversions? |
| 21:35.55 | brlcad | yep |
| 21:36.03 | starseeker | can do |
| 21:36.03 | brlcad | it's all manually hard-coded in there |
| 21:36.13 | brlcad | there are libbu routines to help with that |
| 21:36.18 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33016 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/ (g_diff.c g_lint.c g_qa.c g_transfer.c): style/consistency cleanup |
| 21:36.19 | starseeker | humph. A lot of the tools seem to have that coded in |
| 21:36.46 | starseeker | was it rtweight that had that really bad case that was causing incorrect unit printouts? |
| 21:36.47 | brlcad | he has it handling more than linear units, so you might have to keep the other two smaller tables (or add them to libbu) |
| 21:36.55 | starseeker | nods |
| 21:37.00 | brlcad | yeah, they all really need to be refactored |
| 21:37.34 | brlcad | yeah, rtweight's had a bug -- perfect example why that sort of hard-codedness is bad maintainability |
| 21:37.49 | brlcad | gets fixed in one place, and nobody knows about or fixes the other N places |
| 21:40.17 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33017 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/Makefile.am: Try this for docbook build logic - it seems to allow the make distcheck to proceed (wipes out for other reasons, will fix those next.) |
| 21:40.31 | starseeker | OK, I gotta run right now - will retool the lessons subdirectory tonight. |
| 21:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33018 10/brlcad/trunk/src/gtools/ (Makefile.am solshoot.c): |
| 21:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: remove the also mostly useless solshoot test program. looks like it fires a |
| 21:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: hard-coded ray at specified geometry with debugging getting turned on/off for |
| 21:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: redblack tree testing. either way, doesn't do anything useful and has been a |
| 21:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: maintenance burden. bye. |
| 22:07.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33019 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: don't generate the tkhtml3 documentation every time we run make (nor by default). |
| 22:28.18 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 22:54.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33020 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: |
| 22:54.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: temporarily revert the center of presented area changes to rtarea since they |
| 22:54.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: break the output formatting (and the computations still had yet to be |
| 22:54.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: peer-reviewed by someone for correctness) which would detrimentally affect the |
| 22:54.04 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: S2 folks. |
| 22:57.18 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 22:59.21 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33021 10/brlcad/trunk/src/rt/viewarea.c: emphasize the output formatting deprecation (even if it does risk breaking the S2 tools, it'll prepare folks for the bigger change coming). |
| 23:01.02 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33022 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: rtarea is reverted so the only release issue remaining is to fix the distcheck failures. |
| 23:55.09 | ``Erik | hah, "nailin' paylin", so wrong |
| 00:48.42 | ``Erik | silly 'puters |
| 00:52.10 | Ralith | Any of you have suggestions for a place to go for relatively cheap acrylic lasercutting? |
| 00:52.56 | brlcad | not I |
| 01:04.54 | ``Erik | ghetto gourmet! woohoo |
| 04:06.11 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 04:39.33 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 04:52.13 | yukonbob | what's happening, brlcad? |
| 05:05.30 | brlcad | keeping busy |
| 05:05.37 | brlcad | fortunately back to coding |
| 05:10.14 | starseeker | pulls out a railgun and shoots autotools |
| 05:15.33 | brlcad | heh |
| 05:15.46 | brlcad | it's a rite of passage to learn "the gnu way" |
| 05:18.30 | yukonbob | heh |
| 05:50.15 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-94-165.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 05:53.16 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33023 10/brlcad/trunk/ (170 files in 34 dirs): Take a stab at re-naming the volume II lessons to have somewhat shorter path names |
| 08:20.23 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@cl-213.dus-01.de.sixxs.net) | |
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| 10:33.11 | mafm | hi |
| 10:52.46 | claymore | hai!! |
| 11:04.14 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
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| 12:57.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33024 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: declaration of rt_clean_resource_complete() so that it can be used somewhere |
| 13:05.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33025 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/db_open.c: fixed a memory leak for in memory databases |
| 13:17.18 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33026 10/rt^3/trunk/src/coreInterface/ConstDatabase.cpp: made use of libbu's memory management |
| 13:18.20 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33027 10/rt^3/trunk/src/coreInterface/Database.cpp: memory leak fixed |
| 13:27.01 | ``Erik | heh |
| 13:27.18 | ``Erik | starseeker: there're similarities between the auto* community and the lisp community... :D *duck* |
| 13:32.53 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 13:34.14 | ``Erik | heh http://www.phdcomics.com/comics.php <-- disturbing |
| 13:41.18 | mafm | really disturbing, yep |
| 14:40.06 | claymore | Heh, I woul dlike to see a graph comparing Public and Private School teachers, Active Duty Military and Pro Sports players.... |
| 14:41.39 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33028 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CommandInterpreter.cxx Commands.h): Adding command to dump the database to a file |
| 14:47.59 | ``Erik | active duty vs pro sports wouldn't be interesting unless you used a logarithmic scale O.o |
| 14:49.44 | ``Erik | even sr occifers, I'd imagine |
| 14:50.09 | ``Erik | much less the unwashed enlisted masses |
| 14:57.24 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33029 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: daniel fixed an in-memory geometry db memory leak. looks like the memory wasn't being freed during db_close. |
| 15:09.20 | claymore | unwashed? lol |
| 15:20.34 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33030 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GedData.cxx: ws for clarity |
| 15:21.58 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33031 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CommandInterpreter.cxx Commands.h): Adding command 'Solids on ray' |
| 15:25.52 | starseeker | grr - why isn't tkhtml3 using the local tk? |
| 15:26.04 | ``Erik | brlcad: japan house? |
| 15:33.16 | brlcad | ``Erik: i would, but too far out, won't get there in time |
| 15:48.36 | starseeker | Somehow, ac_cv_c_tkh=${ac_cv_c_tkh=/usr/include} is creeping into the configure result |
| 15:52.00 | claymore | brlcad: are you coding & commiting from you cell phone again? Mad skillz i tell ya.... |
| 15:54.30 | starseeker | anybody on a systerm where they have a toplevel config.cache.* handy? |
| 16:23.32 | starseeker | arrrrrrgh. How can ac_cv_c_tclh be present in the config cache but not have any code that's referring to it in configure |
| 16:29.23 | brlcad | claymore: I can/have, but not at the moment .. do I need to be? :) |
| 16:31.03 | starseeker | help |
| 16:32.59 | starseeker | make distcheck is failing here: In file included from ../../../../src/other/tkhtml3/src/html.h:62, from ../../../../src/other/tkhtml3/src/cssdynamic.c:2: |
| 16:33.03 | starseeker | /usr/include/tk.h:23:3: error: #error Tk 8.4 must be compiled with tcl.h from Tcl 8.4 |
| 16:33.23 | starseeker | Obviously, with enable-all on, it shouldn't be getting /usr/include/tk.h in the first place |
| 16:34.08 | starseeker | The configure options, when examined, show that /usr/include is substituted where the tk/generic include should be |
| 16:34.39 | starseeker | tracing this leads back to the config.cache.* file, which does indeed have ac_cv_c_tkh=/usr/include |
| 16:35.41 | starseeker | But I can't for the life of me figure out why ac_cv_c_tclh is correctly set and ac_cv_c_tkh is not - the ac_cv_c_tkconfig variable is actually set correctly |
| 16:37.27 | starseeker | There is no direct assignment of either of those variables anywhere in the configure logic - I can't figure out how/where they're being generated and stuck in config.cache |
| 16:56.10 | claymore | brlcad: chuck just dropped by and left some donuts for ya. just so you know ;) |
| 17:03.37 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-89-6.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 17:07.09 | ``Erik | obviously, tk.h should not be in /usr/include |
| 17:07.10 | ``Erik | :D |
| 17:08.07 | starseeker | ``Erik: thanks |
| 17:08.21 | starseeker | ``Erik: Do you happen to have a config.cache file handy? |
| 17:09.56 | ``Erik | a few |
| 17:10.08 | starseeker | What does your value for that variable look like? |
| 17:10.36 | ``Erik | which os and which variable? |
| 17:10.51 | ``Erik | ac_cv_c_t{k,cl}h ? |
| 17:11.00 | starseeker | ac_cv_c_tkh |
| 17:11.35 | ``Erik | ac_cv_c_tkh=${ac_cv_c_tkh=/usr/brlcad/HEAD/include} |
| 17:11.49 | starseeker | Is that with an enable-all configure? |
| 17:12.11 | ``Erik | no, it's "configure --enable-optimized --prefix=/usr/brlcad/HEAD" |
| 17:12.25 | starseeker | are you using system tcl/tk? |
| 17:12.49 | ``Erik | nah, it builds |
| 17:13.00 | starseeker | so that variable setting makes no sense at all |
| 17:13.21 | ``Erik | ac_cv_c_tkh=${ac_cv_c_tkh=/usr/brlcad/HEAD-ALL/include} |
| 17:13.33 | ``Erik | that's in the --enable-all build on that fbsd opteron |
| 17:13.39 | ``Erik | the first is from my mac |
| 17:14.01 | starseeker | yeah, it's doing something similar on my machine - $PREFIX/include |
| 17:14.06 | starseeker | that's wrong |
| 17:15.10 | starseeker | it's why distcheck is failing here - tkhtmle is trying to use that include path and (surprise surprise) bombing because it's a different tk.h than it needs |
| 17:16.14 | starseeker | this is beyond my level of autoconf foo - I got as far as knowing why the variable is named the way it is, but I so far can't figure where it's (not) being set |
| 17:16.32 | starseeker | or why tclh is |
| 17:17.36 | starseeker | ``Erik any ideas? |
| 17:20.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33032 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (CommandInterpreter.cxx Commands.h): Adding command 'Zap' |
| 17:24.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33033 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/Commands.h: Sorting 'ged' commands alphabetically, for easier location later |
| 17:26.25 | mafm | who's responsible for cleaning the ged result string between commands? |
| 17:26.45 | mafm | the library with each new message, or the "user" of the library? |
| 17:26.56 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (i=500@resnet-46-165.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 17:29.18 | ``Erik | starseeker: nope, this'd be the point where I start reading the configure script itself :/ |
| 17:41.54 | mafm | brlcad: wake up you lazy boy! |
| 17:50.54 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33034 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/adrt_struct.h: bring into sync with isst |
| 17:52.04 | starseeker | ``Erik: tried that |
| 18:43.02 | starseeker | brlcad: Has this ac_cv_c_tkh variable ever been a problem before? |
| 18:48.57 | starseeker | ``Erik: Does make distcheck work for you on a Mac? |
| 19:00.47 | ``Erik | d'no, haven't tried it |
| 19:07.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33035 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/3dm/3dm-g.cpp: using namespace std is prohibited juju |
| 19:11.15 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33036 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/bottest.c: remove outfp global |
| 19:24.43 | starseeker | OK, I'm beginning to see - tcl.m4 is what's supplying the variable |
| 19:42.48 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33037 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (186 files): Initialize result before the sanity checks, because otherwise the error string keeps appending new errors to the last message |
| 19:43.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33038 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: move brep.h up to the file header so it's not buried deep and sitting within the DECLS block |
| 19:44.01 | mafm | going home, take care folkz :) |
| 19:45.17 | starseeker | Uh, tcl/generic is not the location for tk/generic... |
| 20:16.37 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33039 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/brep/brep.cpp: ws cleanup |
| 20:47.50 | starseeker | this is so stupid - somewhere in this sea of config stuff TK_SRC_DIR must be getting set to the TCL src directory - but how to find it? |
| 21:28.40 | starseeker | anybody know how to "watch" a configure process to spot where variables are being set? |
| 21:31.44 | ``Erik | read the script? :D |
| 21:36.51 | starseeker | dammit, I'm trying to |
| 21:39.18 | ``Erik | read harder! |
| 21:39.49 | ``Erik | when I get into brainbusters, I often put a lot of echo statements ini that script near what I think the fruity bit is, then run configure inside of a script(1) or 2>&1 | tee it |
| 21:40.09 | ``Erik | or if you're masochistic, sh -x configure |
| 21:41.03 | archivist | vi script /variable n n n n |
| 21:42.45 | starseeker | why is ${top_srcdir} empty?? |
| 21:55.10 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=Ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 21:57.06 | starseeker | ``Erik: why is it I can pin it down to TK_SRC_DIR and yet not be able to see any instances of that actually being set? |
| 22:25.50 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 22:53.33 | ``Erik | is it coming from a script somewhere? |
| 22:53.42 | ``Erik | if you have a bsd make, you can inspect make variables with -V |
| 23:04.24 | louipc | #grep ged |
| 23:42.38 | ``Erik | hah "svn is better for windows users. git is better for git users." |
| 23:45.28 | louipc | so what's better for everyone else? |
| 23:47.12 | ``Erik | cvs |
| 23:47.16 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 23:47.31 | louipc | ... |
| 23:47.42 | louipc | unless you start using git I guess. yeah! |
| 23:48.29 | ``Erik | I keep seeing darcs around lately |
| 23:55.10 | ``Erik | but still use cvs for my personal stuff *shrug* |
| 00:00.58 | louipc | I use git. It's way faster and cleaner in my opinion |
| 00:05.43 | ``Erik | cleaner how? (the other argument sounds like a no-starter to me *shrug* personal opinion I suppose) |
| 00:06.24 | louipc | my directories aren't littered with CVS |
| 00:07.10 | ``Erik | heh, true, but subversion makes .svn directories, darcs makes an ugly _darcs directory, both of those have FAR more crap than cvs... what's git use? |
| 00:08.08 | louipc | .git at the top level only |
| 00:08.29 | louipc | all diffs/config/etc is stored there |
| 00:08.43 | ``Erik | so you have to go to the top level directory to do any operation? |
| 00:08.47 | louipc | nope |
| 00:08.54 | louipc | you can be in any subdir |
| 00:09.11 | ``Erik | huh, recursive parent checking? O.o |
| 00:09.18 | louipc | I don't need a separate checkout to look at an branch |
| 00:09.33 | ``Erik | hops on louipc's box and makes ugly stuff in /.git/ :D |
| 00:09.59 | louipc | git is pretty sweet. better than svn or cvs at least |
| 00:10.10 | louipc | I can't speak for the other stuff out there since I never used it |
| 00:10.14 | ``Erik | _darcs is directory top-level, too, and it drives me nuts *shrug* |
| 00:10.34 | louipc | hehe yeah they could have made it a .darcs |
| 00:10.58 | ``Erik | personally, I like cvs more than svn... svn copes with moving files, but that's the only leg up it has on cvs to me *shrug* :) |
| 00:11.23 | ``Erik | even so, "find ." returns about twice what it SHOULD |
| 00:11.32 | louipc | hehe indeed |
| 00:11.43 | ``Erik | and it uses twice as many inodes as it should, and craps all over the directory table, and ... :D |
| 00:11.48 | louipc | yeah git is grep/find friendly |
| 00:12.17 | louipc | all objects have SHA1 hashes and they're stored based on that hash too |
| 00:12.38 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 00:12.40 | louipc | so you get some corruption/tampering warnings if things don't add up |
| 00:31.53 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 03:15.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33040 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/tclconfig/tcl.m4: (log message trimmed) |
| 03:15.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: This fixes a problem that showed up in make distcheck, but will also be |
| 03:15.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: triggered in any situation where there doesn't happen to be a correct tk.h |
| 03:15.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: include file installed - the list variable used by tcl.m4 already had |
| 03:15.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: directories in it when the time came to find the tk.h file to use, and those |
| 03:15.23 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: pre-existing paths caused a build failure on some machines (in my case, it was |
| 03:15.25 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: trying to use /usr/include/tk.h despite the enable-all flag because it 'saw' |
| 03:18.20 | starseeker | can't believe that took him so long :-( |
| 03:20.29 | louipc | nice |
| 03:21.36 | louipc | starseeker: do you think tkhtml3 should be installed in the same place as brlcad? right now it's installing in /usr/lib |
| 03:22.36 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33041 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/Makefile.am libpc/Makefile.am other/Makefile.am): These tweaks get make distcheck up to the documentation build. |
| 03:29.02 | starseeker | louipc: Is it? crud It's supposed to install wherever tcl/tk packages are supposed to go |
| 03:29.49 | louipc | well my system tcl is in /usr but itcl, etc is all in the brlcad dir |
| 03:30.23 | starseeker | weird. On my system it's in /usr/brlcad/lib/Tkhtml3.0 |
| 03:31.05 | louipc | are you using a brlcad build tcl or system tcl? |
| 03:31.12 | starseeker | brlcad build |
| 03:31.46 | starseeker | if you're using a system build (assuming that works, I haven't tried it) it would probably have to go where the system tcl/tk could find it |
| 03:34.07 | starseeker | unlike tkimg (don't know about the rest) we're building a "proper" tcl package that "package require" can find |
| 03:34.57 | louipc | hmm so if it was installed in the brlcad directory you'd just have to add it to the path eh? |
| 03:35.06 | starseeker | not sure |
| 03:35.31 | louipc | or tcl's version of ld.so.conf |
| 03:35.36 | starseeker | in theory bwish could/should be aware of a brlcad specific location for things, I'm just not sure what it does |
| 03:36.30 | starseeker | should tackle the last issue for using system libs on gentoo and get that working so he can test properly |
| 03:37.31 | louipc | :D |
| 03:38.22 | starseeker | right now though, I'm trying to make sure all my new stuff isn't killing make distcheck |
| 03:41.21 | louipc | yeah this build system is kind of difficult to figure out |
| 04:13.32 | yukonbob | hi, cadheads |
| 04:13.44 | starseeker | howdy |
| 04:44.39 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 04:58.42 | starseeker | brlcad: Do I need to manually add the targets for the dvi portions to the Makefile.in in tkhtml3? |
| 05:32.55 | brlcad | dvi portions? |
| 06:25.14 | *** join/#brlcad lol (n=48dbbdd4@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 07:36.59 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 07:45.38 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 10:38.43 | claymore | You guys stay up way tooo late ;) |
| 10:43.05 | starseeker | brlcad: Making dvi in tkhtml3 |
| 10:43.05 | starseeker | make[4]: Entering directory `/home/cyapp/cadtoplevel/brlcad/brlcad/brlcad-7.13.0/_build/src/other/tkhtml3' |
| 10:43.08 | starseeker | make[4]: *** No rule to make target `dvi'. Stop. |
| 10:50.52 | Axman6 | claymore: 9:50pm is late? |
| 10:54.52 | claymore | Axe: No, but 0136 is :) |
| 10:55.55 | claymore | Does anyone have experience with nVidia's CUDA tech? |
| 10:56.04 | clock_ | what is it supposed to be? |
| 10:56.29 | claymore | Just by reading all the online reports/hype, it sounds awesome... but we all know how nVidia likes to toot their own horn. |
| 10:56.51 | claymore | Its an API designed for utilizing nVidia GPUs as computational processors. |
| 10:56.55 | clock_ | I don't like nvidia because of their proprietary approach to drivers. |
| 10:57.37 | clock_ | can it be used in BRL-CAD? |
| 10:58.17 | claymore | There is no reason why it couldn't.... would probably be a pain to impliment though. Although that is just a guess. |
| 10:58.41 | clock_ | are you interested in it in because of BRL-CAD? |
| 10:59.09 | claymore | Partially work related, partially hobby related :) |
| 11:00.18 | claymore | All the benchmarks I have been seeing are comming in at 10-64x faster than a cpu..... |
| 11:00.29 | clock_ | lol |
| 11:00.33 | clock_ | so it can render 64x faster? |
| 11:00.50 | clock_ | I would have use for that, Ronja compiles 1 week and most of it is video rendering time |
| 11:01.00 | clock_ | OpenOffice is peanuts compared to that... |
| 11:01.10 | claymore | a GTX280 nVidia module clocks 64 Gflops while a 2.4GHz Opteron clocks 1.6 Gflops....lol |
| 11:01.26 | clock_ | What is Opteron? |
| 11:01.34 | clock_ | That's the new AMD CPU? |
| 11:01.44 | claymore | AMD's server CPU...not really new |
| 11:02.06 | clock_ | looks like the transistors inside must be substantially faster than the good ole 2N3904 |
| 11:02.30 | clock_ | probably don't have 272pF of base-emitter capacitance either ;-) |
| 11:02.42 | claymore | well yeah, they are like 60nm big :) not much substrait there. |
| 11:02.53 | clock_ | the smaller the better |
| 11:03.08 | clock_ | I hate dinosaur transistors which take half an hour just to charge their mammoth junction |
| 11:03.08 | claymore | sneeze wrong and you could forward bias a 60nm transistor ;) |
| 11:03.15 | clock_ | ;-) |
| 11:03.31 | claymore | lol. |
| 11:04.03 | clock_ | I was designing a 16MHz amplifier and had to resort to 5GHz transistors because the slower ones were so slow... |
| 11:04.20 | claymore | wow.... CUDA can utilize as many GPUs as you have in your system.... *ponders* |
| 11:05.06 | claymore | wonders why clock was designing a 16MHz amp.... |
| 11:05.18 | clock_ | for my optical project |
| 11:05.26 | clock_ | whose casing and holders ar desigend in brlcad |
| 11:05.43 | claymore | personal or professional project? |
| 11:06.00 | clock_ | it has to have 100dB of gain, clip flawlessly and -3dB @16MHz |
| 11:06.03 | clock_ | personal |
| 11:06.15 | clock_ | but the performance is rather professional |
| 11:06.28 | claymore | 'optical project' is pretty vague... |
| 11:06.39 | clock_ | free space optics 10Mbps full duplex 1.4km |
| 11:06.43 | clock_ | 62nm or 875nm |
| 11:06.47 | clock_ | 62 -> 625 |
| 11:07.11 | clock_ | It's like fibre optics except there is no fibre |
| 11:11.27 | claymore | sorry, phone. |
| 11:11.36 | claymore | so free space = out in the open air? |
| 11:11.53 | clock_ | yes like openair just without the music |
| 11:12.10 | claymore | do you have functional prototypes yet? |
| 11:12.24 | clock_ | Far beyond that |
| 11:12.30 | clock_ | there are 153 registered installations worldwide |
| 11:12.42 | clock_ | But at the moment I have no complete functional prototype :) |
| 11:12.53 | claymore | .... confused.... |
| 11:13.10 | clock_ | well it's already in widespread use. |
| 11:13.14 | claymore | if you don't have a prototype... how can there be installations? Or are you reverse engineering an existing tech? |
| 11:13.49 | clock_ | Because I left the prototype in the home of my parents where it was partially disassembled partially left on the roof and disconnected |
| 11:14.08 | clock_ | it's a from-scratch development nothing to do with existing tech |
| 11:14.20 | clock_ | It's built from peanut cans, rusty smoke flues and Chinese magnifying glasses |
| 11:14.29 | claymore | And you have managed to sell this? |
| 11:14.37 | clock_ | And can transmit DVD video realtime with 10_9 bit error rate |
| 11:14.45 | clock_ | claymore: no I didn't even try to sell this |
| 11:15.55 | claymore | sounds pretty cool. is the purpose to create a point to point network bridge? |
| 11:16.06 | clock_ | yes with standard Ethernet interface |
| 11:17.03 | clock_ | thanks |
| 11:18.58 | claymore | and to make sure I get your benchmarks correct, you sustained 10Mbps over a 1.4km distance? |
| 11:19.16 | clock_ | yes and full duplex |
| 11:19.23 | clock_ | with 10^-9 bit error rate |
| 11:20.13 | claymore | impressive. Whats the deltaPerformance over the range of weather types? |
| 11:20.29 | clock_ | deltaPerformance? |
| 11:20.35 | claymore | change in performance |
| 11:20.58 | clock_ | It doesn't work in fog, works in haze rain and snow |
| 11:21.16 | claymore | cool.... no radiation hazard then? |
| 11:21.19 | clock_ | works in -25degC and also when the sun is heating it in the summer so you can't hold hand on it |
| 11:21.31 | clock_ | and also under frost buildup |
| 11:22.13 | clock_ | Also once someone didn't seal the casing and the thing filled half with water so it was like aquarium and all the electronics was underwater but it still ran |
| 11:22.19 | clock_ | But that's not a designed mode of operation |
| 11:22.29 | claymore | haha nice. |
| 11:22.36 | clock_ | I have a video of this aquarium |
| 11:23.04 | clock_ | Here is the frozen one http://images.twibright.com/tns/381.html |
| 11:23.18 | *** join/#brlcad cad30 (n=c8632bfe@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 11:23.29 | claymore | so the power required to bridge 1.4km doesn't require a laser powerful enough to pose a radiation hazard eh? |
| 11:24.42 | clock_ | Here is the aquarium video http://ronja.twibright.com/failure/aquarium.avi |
| 11:25.12 | clock_ | claymore: the power is 17mW, the 625nm is totally eye safe, the 875 you are not supposed to stare into it with binoculars from < 20 meters |
| 11:25.32 | clock_ | According to Czech legislature. The individual national limits may of course vary. |
| 11:25.45 | clock_ | It doesn't use a laser, but an LED |
| 11:26.22 | claymore | laser/led.... radiation is radiation ;) |
| 11:26.50 | clock_ | Here is the warning sign I made in Czech :) http://ronja.twibright.com/drawings/warning.png |
| 11:27.22 | elite01 | whoo, believe it or not, i heard of ronja before :) |
| 11:28.06 | clock_ | elite01: from me boasting here in this channel? |
| 11:28.21 | elite01 | noo quite a while ago |
| 11:28.27 | clock_ | from Slashdot? |
| 11:28.28 | elite01 | no idea how i stumbled upon it |
| 11:28.30 | elite01 | nah |
| 11:28.54 | elite01 | maybe because of links |
| 11:28.59 | clock_ | hack-a-day? O'Reilly blog? |
| 11:30.23 | elite01 | *shrug* i don't visit those sites often |
| 11:51.08 | brlcad | starseeker: ah |
| 11:52.33 | brlcad | i'm not sure what that option actually means, when do you see it getting called? |
| 11:53.06 | brlcad | I mean, I don't see how you would have run into it since we don't have any dvi |
| 11:55.08 | brlcad | ah, I see that the top-level distcheck calls it on the hierarchy |
| 11:57.51 | brlcad | ooor, not on the hierarchy .. how'd you run into it again?? |
| 12:06.44 | brlcad | aaand never mind, I see it's recursive |
| 12:26.34 | *** join/#brlcad elite01_ (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:39.22 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@193.136.2.121) | |
| 13:39.39 | mafm | hallo |
| 13:43.25 | claymore | Hai! |
| 13:47.26 | starseeker | wishes they would hurry up and deliver the firggin filing cabinet already |
| 13:50.13 | brlcad | howdy |
| 13:58.49 | claymore | hands starseeker his Easy Button. |
| 14:01.30 | starseeker | <snort> I was about an inch away from being able to load the thing into my car this weekend |
| 14:01.38 | mafm | brlcad: is my big fat commit of yesterday ok? |
| 14:02.00 | starseeker | but noooo. And this morning I get a call that it's been "shipped from the warehouse" whatever that means |
| 14:03.22 | starseeker | they're supposed to deliver it, but it's not clear if they can leave it at the front desk or I have to sign for it |
| 14:03.22 | starseeker | I'm starting to regret not strapping it to the roof |
| 14:04.04 | mafm | starseeker: lost in tansportation |
| 14:04.26 | starseeker | brlcad: Got another one missing - make check |
| 14:04.32 | starseeker | fakes up another one... |
| 14:12.00 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:12.25 | brlcad | starseeker: if you look at the distcheck: rule in the top-level Makefile, you'll see all the recursive targets that get called |
| 14:12.41 | starseeker | nods - trying that now |
| 14:13.04 | starseeker | should be getting fairly close to a clean distcheck |
| 14:13.20 | starseeker | didn't realize just how badly he had torpedoed it |
| 14:14.11 | brlcad | happens :) |
| 14:14.44 | brlcad | at least most of the problems are actually just simple build system integration tweaking |
| 14:14.52 | starseeker | True |
| 14:15.01 | starseeker | 'cept for that sneaky tcl.m4 problem |
| 14:19.45 | ``Erik | clock, your 'optar' was linked in a +5 slashdot comment a few days ago, didja see that? |
| 14:20.02 | clock_ | ``Erik: no. what does it mean +5? |
| 14:20.11 | clock_ | what was it about? |
| 14:20.30 | clock_ | Recently they posted some research centre was started to develop networking over light |
| 14:20.34 | ``Erik | http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1001009&cid=25438323 |
| 14:20.36 | clock_ | and someone posted a link to my Ronja page |
| 14:22.39 | starseeker | optar looks cool |
| 14:23.22 | starseeker | needs a good printer though, and things like dot based watermarking would tend to be a problem |
| 14:24.08 | ``Erik | probably why the 3x3 pixel cell size, no? :D |
| 14:24.46 | starseeker | yeah, that should get above all but the worst toner noise |
| 14:25.15 | starseeker | is reading |
| 14:26.07 | starseeker | almost wants to take some pages printed out on this system to a notary just to see the reaction |
| 14:28.28 | brlcad | reminds me of work I did many years ago for Hopkins hospital, a DARPA project with unfortunately inept management |
| 14:28.44 | ``Erik | wait, what?? inept mgmt in the DoD? no way! |
| 14:28.51 | clock_ | I have some optar files |
| 14:28.55 | clock_ | I recently wanted to print them |
| 14:29.15 | clock_ | but the printer had bad mood and created huge vertical smudges of missing toner across the whole page |
| 14:29.24 | starseeker | nods |
| 14:29.28 | clock_ | A printer is not enough. Must be a printer which actually works. |
| 14:29.43 | starseeker | used to develop printer components, seen how bad some of the outputs can get |
| 14:29.56 | brlcad | to prove that our xray encryption was working and "secure" (which it was, AES before it was finalized), I took one of the xray films, scanned it, encrypted the data, and reprinted a new xray of the encrypted data |
| 14:30.16 | brlcad | which of course just looks like white noise, but printed up on xray film |
| 14:30.19 | clock_ | starseeker: with output do you mean the actual design that comes out of the development deparment? |
| 14:30.26 | starseeker | brlcad: Cool :-) |
| 14:30.36 | ``Erik | out of curiousity, does optar have the ability to work around, say, a tri-folded letter? |
| 14:30.37 | brlcad | still has those films *somewhere* |
| 14:30.56 | clock_ | ``Erik: I don't know. I tried just a two-folded letter. |
| 14:31.00 | starseeker | clock_: Nah, the test pages from developing physical hardware (my thing was Optical PhotoConductor drums) |
| 14:31.11 | ``Erik | means 3 'panels', two folds |
| 14:31.24 | starseeker | worked on variety of common desktop and small business level printers |
| 14:31.28 | clock_ | I actually tried one vertical and one horizontal fold |
| 14:31.37 | clock_ | put the paper into the pocket of my jeans and took out |
| 14:31.45 | ``Erik | the ink damage from folding didn't adversly effect it? |
| 14:31.52 | clock_ | yes it did |
| 14:31.57 | clock_ | but that's why there are golay codes |
| 14:32.20 | ``Erik | <-- imagines having gutters in the print format for folding would be the best approach on that |
| 14:33.01 | claymore | just heard forests around the world scream in terror. |
| 14:33.08 | clock_ | A friend helped me on Ronja project |
| 14:33.12 | ``Erik | heh |
| 14:33.21 | clock_ | he wa clever he backed up his work on CD for the case the hard disk failed |
| 14:33.21 | starseeker | clock_: Hmm, looks like the view_vc links aren't working |
| 14:33.27 | clock_ | The hard disk actually failed in 2 weeks |
| 14:33.33 | clock_ | So he took the CD and realized he cannot read it |
| 14:34.02 | clock_ | That's why I made optar. I don't fold my prints. I put them into a transparent foil and file them with contracts etc. |
| 14:34.13 | clock_ | starseeker: there is more things not working |
| 14:34.14 | ``Erik | well, claymore, if someone in the US writes crypto with more than 128 bits in the key, it cannot be legally distributed to anyone outside the US electronically. but it CAN be printed and sent |
| 14:34.28 | clock_ | with optar? |
| 14:34.41 | ``Erik | that's why all the cool crypto stuff is coming from like israel and germany and shit |
| 14:35.30 | clock_ | free speech in the C language, that's not implemented in the US? |
| 14:35.34 | ``Erik | (iirc, it was 56, and clin-ton upped it to 128, but anyone who doesn't suck uses at least 1024) |
| 14:35.37 | clock_ | What does the onstitution say? |
| 14:35.48 | clock_ | Bill Cliton? |
| 14:36.18 | claymore | stares at his joke, lying on the floor, beaten to death by Erik, who obviously mistook it for something else..... |
| 14:36.23 | starseeker | clock_: The tarball from the website has two bad links in it - font.h and golay.svg |
| 14:36.37 | clock_ | starseeker: I already have this bugreport in the pipeline |
| 14:36.42 | starseeker | ok |
| 14:36.48 | clock_ | Now I am going to add the one with viewvc |
| 14:36.53 | clock_ | for this I have to send myself an e-mail reminder |
| 14:37.01 | clock_ | for this I have to login into the e-mail system of my provider |
| 14:37.15 | ``Erik | sorry, I don't wake up until 5:30-6 pm |
| 14:37.19 | clock_ | but this e-mail system is running in Java and takes about 10 minutes to react to the "login" button |
| 14:37.22 | clock_ | So patience please |
| 14:37.37 | ``Erik | the vacuum tubes in my humor circuits are still cold :D |
| 14:37.45 | clock_ | If they don't return 501 Internal Server Error, or the login page again, your report might actually get filed. |
| 14:38.00 | clock_ | Oh I broke through already into the write e-mail page |
| 14:38.20 | clock_ | But when I click write e-mail it shows a page "thank you for logging off" |
| 14:38.22 | clock_ | Well - Java. |
| 14:38.53 | starseeker | claymore: We need an open source humor detector bot :-) |
| 14:39.27 | claymore | well the Geekdar just caught on fire, lemme put it out ;) |
| 14:39.50 | clock_ | after trying 3 times finally succeeded to get into the write e-mail page |
| 14:40.21 | clock_ | OK filed successfully |
| 14:40.30 | clock_ | now wait about 10 years and I might actually get to it |
| 14:41.30 | starseeker | the golay.svg file can be gotten from the website, it's the missing font.h that's the problem |
| 14:42.11 | starseeker | likes neat archiving ideas |
| 14:42.12 | clock_ | doesn't remember anything anymore |
| 14:42.44 | ``Erik | 'cept paper for archiving may not be good these days, most paper is acid washed and deteriorates quickly in a decade or two |
| 14:42.54 | clock_ | I am now realizing the best way how to get a surge of popularity is put deadlinks on the website |
| 14:43.05 | starseeker | claymore: I'm surprised it isn't on continual burnout where we work ;-) |
| 14:43.12 | ``Erik | tufte has one of his usual tufte-esque rants on the topic, and pays out the butt to get his books printed on "good" paper |
| 14:43.19 | clock_ | ``Erik: sometimes I get receipts from a cash desk which are completely white after 2 weeks |
| 14:43.40 | clock_ | I wonder if it's legal to give out purchase proofs like these |
| 14:43.55 | ``Erik | ink deterioration is one thing, I have 10 year old papers that are crumbling :/ |
| 14:44.02 | starseeker | ``Erik: Yeah, durable paper is expensive |
| 14:44.25 | clock_ | Well you can at least tell when it's crumbling and re-scan |
| 14:44.32 | starseeker | IBM (I think) has some nifty stuff that is really hard to rip, not sure about it's long term storage |
| 14:44.46 | ``Erik | if you want text to stick around for a while, grab a hammer and chisel and find some marble :D |
| 14:44.49 | clock_ | But can you look at a hard disk and say "shit I see the bits flipping, I should copy it to another one"? |
| 14:45.07 | clock_ | ``Erik: marbles are subject to deswtruction by interplanetary impacts |
| 14:45.27 | starseeker | wait, might have been Xerox |
| 14:45.37 | ``Erik | yeah, and everything is subject to destruction by universe heat death *shrug* |
| 14:45.40 | starseeker | yeah, marble sucks - go granite |
| 14:45.46 | clock_ | ;-) |
| 14:46.04 | starseeker | or those plastic bottles everyone claims will be around for 1 million years |
| 14:46.09 | clock_ | load the granite into a dot matrix printer and print optar 1000 times without the ribbon :) |
| 14:46.12 | ``Erik | marble and even pottery has done a good job for 2-3k years |
| 14:46.44 | ``Erik | the languages die/mutate a lot faster than the medium :) |
| 14:47.06 | clock_ | good to have a medium which lasts 500 years when the civilization will obviously destroy itself in 100 years anyway :() |
| 14:47.25 | ``Erik | which civilization? |
| 14:47.33 | clock_ | well don't store the data itself |
| 14:47.53 | clock_ | assume that in 1000 years the archaelogy will be so advanced they will be able to tell what you've been thinking just from your ashes |
| 14:47.56 | ``Erik | only one of the original 7 still exists, civilizations come and go, and are not a singleton :D |
| 14:49.32 | clock_ | I am sure in 1000 years people will be able to travel in time and extend their lifespan, but they will still not be able to make a reliable electrical connector. |
| 14:50.22 | clock_ | ``Erik: which are the remaining 6 ones? |
| 14:50.38 | claymore | clock: assuming electricity will still be in use then ;) |
| 14:50.56 | starseeker | Ah, there it is - Xerox DuraPaper: http://www.rechargermag.com/articles/37709/ |
| 14:52.52 | starseeker | or I guess now it's DuraDocument paper |
| 14:54.17 | clock_ | What's the point in storing data? |
| 14:54.25 | clock_ | Who is interested in the tons of information? |
| 14:54.35 | starseeker | future historians |
| 14:54.47 | starseeker | we have to make sure they can get to all those youtube videos |
| 14:55.01 | starseeker | it will explain why our civilization collapsed |
| 14:55.18 | clock_ | because all of the earth mass was converted into iPods |
| 14:55.40 | claymore | they will also need to know who Jenna Jameson was ;) |
| 14:55.58 | clock_ | I am gay so I don't know the names of the current female porn stars. |
| 14:56.34 | clock_ | Also the list of patents so they know what all they are not allowed to invent |
| 14:56.45 | starseeker | Once we can put out a new BRL-CAD manual, it'd be fun to have a copy printed on this super paper :-) |
| 14:56.59 | clock_ | in optar format all on one page :) |
| 14:57.13 | brlcad | it's more than 200k :) |
| 14:57.20 | clock_ | BRL-CAD: extermely simple UI: all the manual fits on 1 page :) |
| 14:57.24 | clock_ | brlcad: how many K? |
| 14:57.33 | clock_ | Maybe "The whole manual fits on just 10 pages"? |
| 14:57.52 | brlcad | maybe compressed |
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| 15:00.23 | starseeker | if it's pdf, and we agglomerate everything into one big book... that's a lotta megs, even compressed. Good quality raytraced images are big |
| 15:01.04 | brlcad | the text looks like it's about 1158714 chars in docbook and text format .. images are the big ones |
| 15:02.41 | brlcad | gets on the road |
| 15:02.59 | brlcad | ``Erik: probably not till noon now :/ |
| 15:04.50 | clock_ | In 1000 years we will be able to back up the whole Universe on a USB stick |
| 15:04.59 | clock_ | But this stick will lose all it's data in 10 seconds |
| 15:05.21 | clock_ | And consumer warranty will be only 5 seconds. |
| 15:06.51 | starseeker | heh - the quantum USB stick - you delete what's stored on it by trying to read it |
| 15:08.26 | claymore | how about the precog USB stick: It copies/creates what data you want on it before you do. |
| 15:11.18 | clock_ | quantum USB stick: there is nothing on the stick, random data are created at the time you attempt to read them |
| 15:15.54 | claymore | Matrix USB Stick: There is no USB Stick. |
| 15:16.53 | clock_ | You take the blue pill you read 1 |
| 15:17.00 | clock_ | you take the red one you read zero |
| 15:17.07 | clock_ | You can freely decide what you are going to read |
| 15:17.39 | clock_ | Chinese USB stick: it is a stick, but it's actually not USB. |
| 15:18.03 | clock_ | Q: what's the difference between a wooden stick and Chinese USB stick? |
| 15:18.11 | clock_ | A: the wooden stick is more USB-compliant |
| 15:18.25 | louipc | brlcad: why are there so many darned aliases for the config options? |
| 15:19.19 | claymore | scolds louipc for being on topic. |
| 15:35.33 | ``Erik | crap, I gotta look that up, heh |
| 15:35.36 | ``Erik | and he left |
| 15:48.37 | starseeker | arrrrrrgh - tkhtml3 just does not want to play the distcheck game |
| 16:12.10 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there something about putting directories in EXTRA_DIST that messes with make distcheck? I'm getting errors about their removal |
| 16:47.01 | mafm | I go home, c'ya |
| 16:57.07 | louipc | cya |
| 18:14.42 | brlcad | louipc: because I can never remember (and hate having to remember) whether it's --enable-optimize --enable-optimized and --disable-debug --disable-debugging etc |
| 18:14.58 | brlcad | nobody has to use them, they're only defined for convenience (and don't show up in help) |
| 18:23.29 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-76-112.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 18:36.51 | louipc | ah I figured it would be easier to remember if it was only one or two aliases |
| 18:37.07 | louipc | err one alias rather |
| 18:47.33 | brlcad | the aliases also help catch mistakes .. since configure has no way of reporting "unrecognized option" by default |
| 20:04.59 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D969.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 20:11.22 | ``Erik | thinks he'll leave his windows machine blue-screened until the admins notice it :D |
| 20:45.07 | brlcad | heh |
| 20:45.53 | brlcad | calls a dozen liquor places and is amazed at how many different languages other than english everyone seems to know |
| 20:46.08 | brlcad | at least finally found what I was looking for though |
| 20:46.29 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 20:59.29 | starseeker | out of source build, not doing make distcheck succeeded |
| 21:00.00 | brlcad | where'd it put the tkhtml3 object files? |
| 21:00.07 | brlcad | source dir or build dir |
| 21:00.46 | starseeker | build dir |
| 21:00.57 | starseeker | is rerunning make distcheck now |
| 21:05.38 | starseeker | brlcad: Is this the first time we're hooking in something without any Makefile.am? |
| 21:05.51 | brlcad | nope |
| 21:06.01 | brlcad | well, sorta yes/no |
| 21:06.07 | starseeker | heh |
| 21:06.46 | brlcad | tcl/tk's been hooked in without a makefile.am before and sorta still is (though there is the one wrapper) |
| 21:07.32 | brlcad | they also don't use automake for their build so their subconfigure and the traversal into their dir is similarly non-conformant with automake |
| 21:08.05 | starseeker | ok |
| 21:28.30 | starseeker | ????? With a fresh checkout, now I'm getting the Permission denied errors |
| 21:35.53 | starseeker | http://paste.bzflag.bz/d396b020d |
| 21:37.00 | starseeker | brlcad: stocks dove |
| 21:37.58 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 21:39.36 | ``Erik | nifty |
| 21:54.59 | ``Erik | boos at common lisp some |
| 21:55.05 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:04.55 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=Ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 22:21.44 | louipc | the smallest one? |
| 22:30.46 | brlcad | that looks like english to me |
| 22:55.46 | ``Erik | (format nil "~r" 532144321321) |
| 22:55.46 | ``Erik | "five hundred thirty-two billion one hundred forty-four million three hundred twenty-one thousand three hundred twenty-one" |
| 22:56.13 | ``Erik | neat stuff, but unable to cope with BIG numbers |
| 22:56.32 | brlcad | me too |
| 22:56.52 | ``Erik | huh, it doesn't seem to handle complex numbers, either :( scheme does |
| 22:57.02 | brlcad | patch it up! |
| 22:57.33 | ``Erik | but it's a lot easier to sit around and bitch! :D |
| 23:24.30 | PrezKennnedy | brlcad, i drove for the first time on the highway today |
| 23:24.33 | PrezKennnedy | got it up to 60 |
| 23:24.57 | brlcad | woot |
| 23:25.09 | brlcad | and the 'need for speed' begins.... |
| 23:25.47 | PrezKennnedy | no casualties, no fatalities! |
| 23:29.10 | ``Erik | then ur doin' it rong |
| 23:29.11 | ``Erik | :D |
| 23:29.26 | PrezKennnedy | :D |
| 23:29.45 | PrezKennnedy | told the coworkers that if i go out... im going to do it with style |
| 23:29.58 | PrezKennnedy | somehow land the car on the roof of the building or something |
| 23:30.45 | ``Erik | on the roof? lame, get it to stand up on the nose, ontop of a flagpole |
| 23:30.55 | ``Erik | that'd be worth some points |
| 23:31.15 | ``Erik | "freestyle Xtreme" |
| 23:31.48 | PrezKennnedy | its the tallest building in the area... getting the car on the roof would be pretty amazing since nothing is highe |
| 23:31.51 | PrezKennnedy | *higher |
| 23:33.41 | PrezKennnedy | i had lots of practice in burnout though... |
| 23:33.53 | ``Erik | that's where the freestyle xtreme part comes in, you gotta hit the half-pipe just right and not botch it :D |
| 00:42.16 | starseeker | is scared - ``Erik is giving xtreme driving lessons? |
| 00:52.53 | ``Erik | uh huh :D I've done the upside down thing, it's overrated |
| 01:00.14 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 01:17.02 | ``Erik | "is that your camouflage reflex, or are you just happy to see me?" heh |
| 01:46.23 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:09.44 | starseeker | Hmm, cancer fighting beer. |
| 02:09.55 | starseeker | thinks brlcad will need cancer fighting scotch |
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| 03:12.16 | brlcad | starseeker: heh, it's called milk thistle |
| 03:12.23 | brlcad | (which I do take) ;) |
| 04:23.26 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 04:35.18 | starseeker | brlcad: make distcheck may work now |
| 04:35.27 | starseeker | succeeded on my Gentoo box |
| 05:42.56 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith_ (n=Ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 05:46.48 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-88-19.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 05:59.43 | brlcad | starseeker: cool |
| 05:59.48 | brlcad | will test on the road ;) |
| 07:06.05 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:34.49 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33045 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/books/tutorial_series/Makefile.am: Add book_authors.xml to EXTRA_DIST |
| 07:39.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33046 10/brlcad/trunk/ (187 files in 2 dirs): Cannot safely access the ged_result_str member of "struct ged" without first checking to see if it's null. Added calls to bu_vls_trunc in some of the ged macros. |
| 07:39.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33047 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: Add a few more targets to tkhtml3 to try and be compatible with toplevel make |
| 07:58.44 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33048 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/ (Makefile.am tkhtml3/Makefile.in): Give tkhtml3 a distdir target. This allows brlcad to pass the make distcheck test on Gentoo linux. |
| 08:09.06 | clock_ | Do you check all 500 Linux distributions if brlcad passes the make distcheck on them? |
| 08:25.21 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@cl-213.dus-01.de.sixxs.net) | |
| 10:07.23 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 10:15.59 | brlcad | clock_: nope |
| 10:16.22 | clock_ | how do you select those which you test, then? |
| 10:16.42 | clock_ | hopes brlcad tests on Linux From Scratch |
| 10:19.56 | brlcad | usually based on what is immediately available |
| 10:21.24 | brlcad | it's not like there are drastic differences from flavor to flavor wrt compilation environment, much more important to hit up a variety of OS |
| 10:21.41 | brlcad | then it's much more likely to work in more places automatically |
| 10:22.40 | brlcad | that's the whole point of the gbs, so you don't *have* to check 500 variants manually -- that'd suck in many ways and be incredibly inefficient |
| 10:23.19 | clock_ | what is gbs? |
| 10:23.25 | brlcad | packs it up the lappy and hopes to avoid rush hour traffic |
| 10:23.31 | brlcad | ~gbs |
| 10:23.32 | ibot | i heard gbs is the GNU Build System, aka the Autotools, aka the suite of tools frequently used on UNIX and UNIX-like platforms that utilize the GNU Autoconf, Automake, and Libtool build tools. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_build_system for more details. |
| 10:25.19 | clock_ | Aha GNU Autobreak |
| 10:33.18 | claymore | Morning all.... or is it night for some? ;) |
| 10:39.20 | claymore | Have a safe trip Erik and BRLCAD!! |
| 10:49.15 | brlcad | thanks tanderson |
| 10:49.19 | brlcad | er, AFK-claymore |
| 10:49.33 | brlcad | detaches |
| 11:41.58 | tanderson | *ahem* :) |
| 11:42.10 | tanderson | what'd I help you with now? :) |
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| 14:14.19 | clock_ | 5 |
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| 17:11.07 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33049 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/bot_dump.c: Fixed a typo. |
| 17:21.28 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 17:49.08 | starseeker | make distcheck passes on the Mac |
| 18:20.43 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennnedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 19:05.40 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14C907.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 19:43.32 | louipc | ~wrt |
| 19:43.32 | ibot | somebody said wrt was with respect to, or with regards to, or the Linksys WRT54G on which some people have successfully installed Asterisk. More information at http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk+Linksys+WRT54G |
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| 21:33.37 | thilo_ | anyone using open cascade? or can you recommend a better channel to ask about its installation? |
| 21:33.52 | thilo_ | all help that i find mentions the file OpenCascade_Linux.tgz |
| 21:34.00 | thilo_ | but on the download page i only find OpenCascade_src.tgz |
| 21:34.10 | thilo_ | where do i find OpenCascade_Linux.tgz? |
| 21:35.36 | louipc | no idea |
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| 02:09.27 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 02:09.42 | brlcad | starseeker: it doesn't fully pass but nice work fixing the hard problems :) |
| 02:09.43 | pacman87 | hi |
| 02:10.01 | brlcad | looks like everything related to tkhtml3 is passing now, though, so life is good |
| 02:19.28 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (n=erik@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 02:21.33 | brlcad | waves across the pool |
| 02:21.43 | ``Erik_ | *wave* |
| 02:21.54 | ``Erik_ | knew I closed the blinds for a reason O.o |
| 02:25.22 | ``Erik_ | 1.75l, I pheer |
| 02:31.21 | brlcad | mmmm |
| 02:37.17 | starseeker | brlcad: What's still busted? |
| 02:40.14 | ``Erik_ | all of it, why'd you bust it up, dude? |
| 02:40.24 | brlcad | not busted, just a few loose ends |
| 02:40.39 | ``Erik_ | ponders walking to the front desk to inquire about orange juice |
| 02:40.52 | starseeker | how goes the other side of the country? |
| 02:50.02 | ``Erik_ | a little west |
| 03:03.13 | yukonbob | hello, cadhedas |
| 03:03.16 | yukonbob | *cadheads |
| 03:09.07 | ``Erik_ | huh, orange juice |
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| 03:25.22 | punkrockgirl | stop it, i'm jealous |
| 03:29.42 | ``Erik_ | of cadheads? O.o |
| 03:31.52 | punkrockgirl | of oj |
| 03:31.55 | punkrockgirl | and the stuff in it |
| 03:31.56 | punkrockgirl | :P |
| 03:36.19 | ``Erik_ | probably like $50 worth of crap heh, ~200 people, but most I imagine are shared rooms, so like, uh, ~5k on booze and nuts O.o crazy :D must be nice to have a massive expense account |
| 03:37.03 | ``Erik_ | way more on the hotel rooms, though :) heh |
| 03:37.20 | ``Erik_ | doesn't wana know the final cost of this summit |
| 03:46.10 | punkrockgirl | cool |
| 03:46.15 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith_ (n=Ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 03:46.17 | punkrockgirl | i wanna go do something cool |
| 03:47.42 | ``Erik_ | meh, so go to a honeywell space camp or something |
| 03:47.46 | ``Erik_ | *duck* *run* |
| 03:48.04 | punkrockgirl | oh |
| 03:48.08 | punkrockgirl | heh |
| 03:48.12 | punkrockgirl | good point :( |
| 03:48.21 | punkrockgirl | i suck |
| 04:13.42 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 04:27.10 | ``Erik_ | bleh |
| 04:30.47 | ``Erik_ | Patrick Warburton has a very distinct vocal style |
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| 16:57.16 | starseeker | begins to see why the g_qa units were local - libbu is length only in the unit department |
| 16:59.27 | starseeker | starts working on an expansion... |
| 16:59.42 | starseeker | this simply won't do... |
| 17:11.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33050 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/units.c: |
| 17:11.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Change the internal name of the unit table to reflect that it is length only - |
| 17:11.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: other tables will be added so the 'unspoken assumption' that everything is |
| 17:11.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: length will no longer hold. Can't do this (yet) for externally visible |
| 17:11.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: functions but at least internally it should help avoid confusion. |
| 17:39.11 | starseeker | brlcad: Where are we getting these conversion factors, by the way? They should be cited - correctness of these factors is a big deal because having to change them could invalidate who knows how many results. |
| 17:39.43 | starseeker | brlcad: In particular, I'm wondering about the conversion of grains to grams (although all should be audited) |
| 17:40.25 | starseeker | knows there are standards the officially define these units and NIST has some useful literature as well |
| 17:41.09 | ``Erik_ | hrm, when I got to my hotel room, there was a 1.75l bottle of vodka, a six pack of beer, and a dude showed up with cold orange juice... assuming brlcad received the same ... "gift basket", I'm rather surprised he's not floating face down in the pool right now, but unsurprised he's not responding... :D |
| 17:41.30 | starseeker | creating a proper units and dimensions package for a CAS system actually was what interested me in Axiom instead of Maxima, and is still one of my primary long term goals for CAS, so I'm probably a bit "geeky" on this topic... |
| 17:41.44 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 17:42.02 | ``Erik_ | I know our distance measurement, by default, is mm, and we like kg |
| 17:42.14 | starseeker | yes, but grams is the default in g_qa |
| 17:42.21 | starseeker | kg is actually the SI standard |
| 17:42.21 | ``Erik_ | volumes are usually internally kept as cubic mm |
| 17:42.28 | starseeker | right |
| 17:42.50 | ``Erik_ | the in/mm conversion goes back to the early 80's I believe |
| 17:42.52 | starseeker | the pivot unit isn't so critical - it's the definitions of other units in terms of that pivot unit that become critical |
| 17:43.27 | ``Erik_ | old s2 folk like to think of pixels as 4"x4" projections, new ones like to see 100mmX100mm projections |
| 17:43.33 | starseeker | can't believe his single biggest interest in the CAS world has suddenly become job related |
| 17:44.22 | ``Erik_ | personally, I'd default holding formats to strict SI (despite the frenchness) and use a library (there are plenty) for conversions |
| 17:44.24 | ``Erik_ | *shrug* |
| 17:44.46 | starseeker | erm - libbu has a conversion routine |
| 17:44.59 | starseeker | hadn't considered ripping out the whole thing and replacing with an external lib |
| 17:46.07 | ``Erik_ | what's the java one the m3 guys are using? it had a few aspects where I went "holy crap... that's important", but they threw those away |
| 17:46.31 | ``Erik_ | like it carried translation error with the value, and propogated it correctly through the math |
| 17:46.41 | starseeker | Java Units of measure? |
| 17:46.53 | starseeker | It's LGPL at least |
| 17:46.55 | ``Erik_ | no, it was something stupid |
| 17:47.02 | ``Erik_ | unless something stupid renamed itself to that |
| 17:47.06 | starseeker | grumbles at all the C ones being GPL |
| 17:47.18 | ``Erik_ | carrying error with computation was zomfg holy crap awesome, I thought, but it was thrown away |
| 17:47.25 | starseeker | that is impressive |
| 17:47.28 | ``Erik_ | or, deviance, rather |
| 17:47.45 | ``Erik_ | big performance hit, but *shrug* neglegible compared to other performance issues |
| 17:47.48 | starseeker | correct handling of that issue is very nearly a research topic |
| 17:48.03 | ``Erik_ | pessemistic bounding, not perfect bounding |
| 17:48.15 | ``Erik_ | like jscience or something |
| 17:48.17 | ``Erik_ | this is bugging me |
| 17:48.21 | starseeker | Ooo, a BSD licensed one |
| 17:49.30 | ``Erik_ | are you in the office? |
| 17:49.30 | starseeker | yep |
| 17:49.30 | ``Erik_ | jra knows the grim details of what I'm talking about |
| 17:49.47 | ``Erik_ | I'd like to remember the naem of it, but I can't shell into one of those machines and do not carry a co with me :( |
| 17:52.30 | starseeker | you had it - jscience |
| 17:52.53 | ``Erik_ | aight, it carries ranges of values instead of "a value" |
| 17:53.16 | ``Erik_ | for high energy physics, that seems zomfg critical to me |
| 17:55.06 | starseeker | Hmm - units.sourceforge.net |
| 17:56.54 | starseeker | pity NIST doesn't have their own conversion library |
| 17:57.07 | ``Erik_ | I bet they do, somewhere |
| 17:57.52 | ``Erik_ | I ran across a trivial scheme conversion library that was more flexible than the unix "units" program, neat shizzlenitz |
| 17:58.36 | ``Erik_ | (one thing that drives me up the wall with 'units', I can't convert between C and F, or F and K... temperature measurement is valid, damnit!) |
| 17:59.43 | starseeker | indeed |
| 18:00.31 | starseeker | ``Erik: Do you think it would be worth it to hook in an external units conversion library? |
| 18:00.40 | starseeker | Or, more to the point, would brlcad think so? |
| 18:00.59 | ``Erik_ | I might be a little excessive on that one, though... for mebbe 5 years, I ran a program that scraped temperature data on many zip codes hourly to plot, and I used to convert all measurements to kelvin when I was homebrewing :) |
| 18:01.06 | ``Erik_ | um, depends on the size of it |
| 18:01.30 | ``Erik_ | obviously, it's not something you'd expect in libc, so brlcad will push for inclusion in src/other/ |
| 18:01.50 | ``Erik_ | and I'll push for minimizing size and inode count :D so somewhere will be a balance |
| 18:02.43 | starseeker | Hmm, Mayo Foundation - is that related to the mayo clinic folks I wonder? |
| 18:03.40 | starseeker | Hmm, his email was at one point at the mayo clinic |
| 18:03.43 | starseeker | interesting |
| 18:06.36 | starseeker | huh - darned if it doesn't provide a TCL units interface |
| 18:07.00 | starseeker | ok, ok... |
| 18:07.06 | starseeker | downloads to check out |
| 18:07.15 | starseeker | let's see how big it is |
| 18:10.50 | starseeker | ``Erik: More important even than the size though - this would be a major expansion and even a bit of reworking of how BRL-CAD deals with units. Definitely an improvement, but also definitely a change - does anybody outside of BRL-CAD use our current unit functionality? |
| 18:12.51 | starseeker | ``Erik: size of an uncompressed tar is 510KB |
| 18:14.31 | starseeker | using TEAfor building |
| 18:14.41 | starseeker | er TEA for |
| 18:20.59 | starseeker | hmm, pity - it's tcl doesn't call the c side |
| 18:37.00 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-82-179.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:22.26 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-82-179.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:27.15 | brlcad | starseeker: check the commit log on the file, they may be cited there |
| 20:36.55 | brlcad | conversion lib is fine, though our conversion needs are very trivial at this point so I'd be hesitant for using a dep until there was some feature added |
| 20:37.23 | brlcad | cleaning up g_qa by itself would be pretty marginal (as it wouldn't really change, it'd just get rid of the table) |
| 20:40.12 | *** join/#brlcad cad64 (n=4e5699cd@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:47.30 | brlcad | does not understand starseeker's comment to 1677383 |
| 20:47.54 | starseeker | brlcad: um, sorry. |
| 20:47.56 | starseeker | rereads |
| 20:48.45 | starseeker | Lee implemented dbfindempty as a tcl command |
| 20:48.55 | starseeker | should it be integrated into MGED? |
| 20:50.01 | starseeker | if not, dwayne seems to be satisifed. In addition, the search command can also find totally empty combinations (although it doesn't have the dbfindempty ability to find combs with only 1 or only 2 nodes) |
| 20:50.55 | starseeker | I guess I'm wondering what needs to happen that hasn't already happened to be able to close that request |
| 20:53.08 | starseeker | brlcad: re - unit conversions; No problem with waiting, what I can do for now is move the g_qa tables into libbu, add a couple more general calls to access them (that will also be able to pass requests to a more general library behind the hood if we want to do that in the future) |
| 20:53.29 | starseeker | and then tweak g_qa to use the new libbu calls instead of its internal code |
| 20:58.17 | brlcad | starseeker: the trackers are totally your domain, so you can decide if it's sufficient, rejectable, inadequate, etc |
| 20:58.50 | starseeker | OK. I just didn't know if there was some reason dbfindempty wasn't in MGED - a.k.a Lee not wanting it in |
| 20:58.53 | brlcad | I think search completely superceeds a "dbfindempty" command and would reject that patch |
| 20:59.12 | brlcad | nah, it was probably just level of effort |
| 21:00.32 | brlcad | it technically probably belongs as a patch submission once the attachments were added, but pettty at this point since he's also a dev also acting like a user |
| 21:00.44 | starseeker | Looking at the tcl, there is an option to match if the number of elements in a comb matchs a number - is that useful enough to be worth adding to search? |
| 21:01.41 | starseeker | doesn't think it belongs in an empty option - maybe empty could be replaced by a "number of nodes in comb" and "number of nodes in subtree" sort of system... |
| 21:01.41 | brlcad | that would have been a way to generalize your -empty option |
| 21:02.00 | brlcad | exactly |
| 21:02.41 | starseeker | vim's up the search code and hopes he doesn't need yet another tree walker... |
| 21:03.59 | starseeker | must protest the g_qa code grouping mass and weight - that's dimensionally flat out wrong |
| 21:04.20 | brlcad | fix it! |
| 21:04.34 | starseeker | OK :-) |
| 21:04.40 | ``Erik_ | is it fixed yet? |
| 21:04.45 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33051 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/avs.c: make initializaiton order match declaration order |
| 21:04.51 | starseeker | hopes he isn't breaking someone's analysis code... |
| 21:05.00 | ``Erik_ | crosses his arms and taps his foot |
| 21:05.02 | ``Erik_ | why isn't it fixed yet? |
| 21:05.10 | starseeker | finite typing speed |
| 21:05.38 | ``Erik_ | signs starseeker up for the neural jack surgury |
| 21:06.11 | ``Erik_ | (just remember... never EVER core dump while you're jacked in) |
| 21:07.16 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33052 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: ws |
| 21:08.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33053 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: |
| 21:08.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: fix an initialization bug in RT_INIT_DB_INTERNAL that was causing a crash if you |
| 21:08.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: initialized a rt_db_internal, never use it, but then try to release it. the |
| 21:08.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: idb_meth wasn't being initialized causing the callback to crash on randomly |
| 21:08.56 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: initialized values that were not a valid callback. |
| 21:12.27 | starseeker | How's the GSOC thing going? |
| 21:12.48 | brlcad | doesn't really start until tomorrow, dinner tonight |
| 21:14.25 | ``Erik_ | if it was goin', do ya think we'd be talkin' here? :D |
| 21:16.44 | starseeker | fair enough |
| 21:17.01 | starseeker | brlcad: What's a good "clean" way to get a count on the number of nodes in a combination? |
| 21:18.08 | starseeker | do we have a pre-defined function? |
| 21:18.42 | brlcad | mm, that just counts? doubt it but I think you can just walk over a bu_list and count if you have a COMB |
| 21:21.58 | ``Erik_ | that smells like a loaded question |
| 21:22.07 | ``Erik_ | (similar to a loaded diaper, but scarier) |
| 21:22.26 | ``Erik_ | is a comb the compacted human variant, or the binary internal variant? |
| 21:22.58 | starseeker | what? |
| 21:23.06 | ``Erik_ | last I checked, a simple union comb of 4 primitives is at least 7 nodes |
| 21:23.28 | ``Erik_ | if you include both terminal and nonterminal |
| 21:24.24 | ``Erik_ | include/raytrace.h around line 1073 is the gorey detail bit |
| 21:25.30 | ``Erik_ | count(union(n)) >= n*log_{2}n where n is the number of primitives, or something |
| 21:25.54 | starseeker | Oh, I get was Lee was up to - since it's a binary tree you can only have 0, 1 or 2 children per the data structure |
| 21:26.00 | brlcad | ged_list_children() |
| 21:26.25 | starseeker | would expect something else from a node count on a geometry tree |
| 21:26.30 | brlcad | ah, so there is already: db_tree_nleaves |
| 21:26.36 | brlcad | (librt) |
| 21:26.49 | ``Erik_ | internel representation is a simple binary tree, but it's exposed as an n-ary tree to the user :/ |
| 21:27.02 | brlcad | that's why the docs need to be in the freaking headers so I can find that shtuff easier |
| 21:27.27 | starseeker | brlcad: Thank you for finding it! |
| 21:27.44 | ``Erik_ | so just terminal nodes, then :D |
| 21:27.45 | starseeker | wouuld have felt so dumb writing his own... |
| 21:28.37 | starseeker | erm, this one stops at regions though.. |
| 21:28.41 | starseeker | crud |
| 21:28.43 | ``Erik_ | thinks we have too many already, someone needs to generisize and collapse existing functions and put in minor specialization stubs for compatability :/ |
| 21:29.11 | brlcad | it's actually an acyclic graph that can be munged to binary or non-binary depending on where in the api |
| 21:29.28 | ``Erik_ | we need cl loop equivelant for our trees :D |
| 21:29.45 | ``Erik_ | and yes, my spelling sucks. |
| 21:29.52 | ``Erik_ | equivalent |
| 21:29.55 | starseeker | wonders if the time has come to hit the tree walkers |
| 21:30.31 | ``Erik_ | how is richards procdb coming? |
| 21:30.59 | starseeker | still early days |
| 21:31.08 | ``Erik_ | hm |
| 21:32.12 | ``Erik_ | <-- tried to get him to consider an easier procdb to cut his teeth on, but he's in a 'marching orders' mentality :/ |
| 21:32.34 | starseeker | from whom? me or brlcad? |
| 21:32.36 | brlcad | mm, daniel and jeff are here |
| 21:32.59 | ``Erik_ | 4 hours until the dinner thing |
| 21:33.12 | brlcad | er, isn't it in an hour? |
| 21:33.22 | brlcad | oh craptastic.. I'm looking at edt time |
| 21:33.24 | ``Erik_ | um, no? 1830 pst |
| 21:33.25 | brlcad | sweet |
| 21:33.30 | ``Erik_ | and it's 1433 |
| 21:33.39 | brlcad | yeah, my clock says 1734 |
| 21:33.47 | brlcad | thought it felt damn early :) |
| 21:33.48 | starseeker | heh |
| 21:34.16 | brlcad | starseeker: you hook ed up? |
| 21:34.19 | ``Erik_ | I updated my laptops clock, so'z I have both pst and est on my screen (courtesy BX, a *REAL* irc client, unlike that wussy irssi crap) |
| 21:34.20 | brlcad | (lists) |
| 21:34.27 | starseeker | brlcad: yep |
| 21:34.33 | starseeker | he's on dev and commits |
| 21:34.38 | brlcad | saw |
| 21:34.45 | brlcad | not news? |
| 21:34.48 | starseeker | probably should get him on user and news too |
| 21:34.57 | ``Erik_ | so we can't badmouth him in our commit -m '' messages anymore? :( |
| 21:35.13 | starseeker | ``Erik_:depends on if he reads 'em or not |
| 21:35.55 | brlcad | got 2/3rds of the points primitive update working on the plane.. should .. finish |
| 21:36.18 | ``Erik_ | so much for napping before the dinner? |
| 21:38.27 | ``Erik_ | fer some reason, when ya said that dawn and kurt/kirk/whatever were downstairs, I somehow thought they were bz people :D heh |
| 21:39.26 | brlcad | donna and kirk |
| 21:39.31 | brlcad | they are bz people |
| 21:39.51 | ``Erik_ | I was asking how the bzflag gsoc went when you were showering heh :D </doof> |
| 21:40.08 | ``Erik_ | nice folk, dealing with pretty interesting stuff |
| 21:40.22 | brlcad | ah, yeah -- not gsocers |
| 21:41.04 | brlcad | it's really bad that my brain has shifted context.. i need to study up on what all we did for both so I can actually hold a f'ing conversation about it |
| 21:41.15 | brlcad | since this is sorta requisite or at least really useful this weekend |
| 21:41.45 | ``Erik_ | firing braincells are the critical aspect, other people can remember the history for ya :D you weren't a mentor per se |
| 21:43.37 | starseeker | brlcad: Is OP_REGION a unary operator? |
| 21:44.08 | starseeker | or rather, does its presence indicate a left subtree? |
| 21:45.10 | brlcad | ``Erik_: naw, it's still my job to know what everyone did, just not the details |
| 21:45.15 | ``Erik_ | ah, cliff, I figured out what was confusing me with the macro thing. The example code had a defun with soft quoting that was called from the macro. |
| 21:45.28 | brlcad | at least should be able to say what folks were working on what |
| 21:45.32 | ``Erik_ | we did things. And stuff. And it was good. |
| 21:45.40 | starseeker | ``Erik_: nicely done |
| 21:45.41 | ``Erik_ | then, on the 7th week, we rested. |
| 21:45.42 | brlcad | starseeker: dunno really, use the source luke :) |
| 21:45.51 | starseeker | brlcad: OK :-) |
| 21:45.59 | starseeker | just checking for a shortcut |
| 21:46.33 | ``Erik_ | (would've been the 7th day, but we created slashdot, collegehumor, and icanhascheezburger on the first day. Woops.) |
| 21:46.56 | starseeker | assumed those were the work of "somone else" |
| 21:47.19 | ``Erik_ | geekisis 10:12 |
| 21:47.40 | ``Erik_ | And it was goodish. Ramen. |
| 21:48.00 | starseeker | The ed 1.0 version or the Church of Emacs revival edition? |
| 21:49.14 | ``Erik_ | just random blabbering, now with extra blasphemy |
| 21:49.14 | brlcad | ``Erik_: oh, I found out why he attacked -- said it was just to generate debris for a newb he was trying to help, otherwise that he woulda been nuts to attack a 16 CC without levis |
| 21:49.14 | ``Erik_ | heh, so gank his newb friend :D fighters do an ugly job on cyclers |
| 21:49.46 | ``Erik_ | use astroempiresextras to time your fighter pops to exist at like :28 or :29, jack his cyclers as hard as you can just before the tick |
| 21:50.09 | ``Erik_ | a recycler needs 3 ticks to pay for itself |
| 21:50.39 | brlcad | I thought about it .. his friend only has 25 cyclers :) |
| 21:50.56 | brlcad | lvl 13 |
| 21:50.57 | ``Erik_ | you can't kill the tiger, so try to taste like shit :D |
| 21:51.24 | ``Erik_ | (is that sun tzu? :D ) |
| 21:52.47 | brlcad | starseeker: another way to find stuff .. think of an mged command that does what you're thinking and look what it does |
| 21:55.31 | starseeker | nods |
| 21:56.22 | starseeker | Lee used llength in his tcl command, but I'm being more stubborn - I want to count the way a BRL-CAD user would expect |
| 22:01.06 | ``Erik_ | notes that one must take every commands implementation with a grain of salt... it may be a crude hack instead of "right" |
| 22:11.20 | *** join/#brlcad smurfette (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 22:12.43 | ``Erik_ | dude, that restaurant is not walking distance |
| 22:12.59 | ``Erik_ | it's way up by moffett |
| 22:13.41 | ``Erik_ | 6.1 miles as the google flies |
| 22:16.28 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33054 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/units.c: Add in two of g_qa's unit tables. Need to add a 3rd for weights, which are not the same as mass |
| 22:17.34 | ``Erik_ | if you're gonna be like that, only record mass and then record gravity in the scene to compute weight O.o :> |
| 22:17.56 | ``Erik_ | many tools use mass and weight interchangably (incorrect, but 'close enough' for ground vehicles) |
| 22:17.56 | starseeker | not a bad idea |
| 22:18.11 | ``Erik_ | naturally, you should talk about point gravity, so you can compute tidal force |
| 22:18.12 | ``Erik_ | *cough* |
| 22:18.34 | ``Erik_ | full integral gravity would be a bit excessive, though :D |
| 22:18.36 | starseeker | refuses to use mass and weight interchangably |
| 22:18.43 | starseeker | heh |
| 22:18.56 | ``Erik_ | the customer does it, and we like to get paychecks at the end of the day :( |
| 22:18.57 | brlcad | starseeker: llength is a tcl command .. he's counting the list of something -- you'd have to look at what he used to get the list he was counting |
| 22:19.13 | brlcad | ``Erik_: it is? okay |
| 22:19.15 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:19.48 | starseeker | ``Erik_: where do they do it? |
| 22:19.49 | ``Erik_ | http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&saddr=910+E+Fremont+Ave,+Sunnyvale,+CA+94087+(Wild+Palms+Hotel)&daddr=174+castro+st&hl=en&geocode=CcOzhSoacpGzFfnvOQIdyTi6-CFKCwVYHFXddA%3B&mra=pe&mrcr=0&sll=37.380798,-122.046089&sspn=0.052925,0.105228&ie=UTF8&ll=37.373022,-122.061195&spn=0.105861,0.210457&z=13 |
| 22:20.35 | ``Erik_ | the analysts? just look at rtweight |
| 22:21.43 | ``Erik_ | stuff like http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2004-06/rods-god might change that, though |
| 22:22.27 | smurfette | http://www.aclu.org/privacy/spying/areyoulivinginaconstitutionfreezone.html |
| 22:22.49 | starseeker | hunts around for rtweight |
| 22:23.14 | ``Erik_ | was on slashdot earlier, punker |
| 22:23.39 | starseeker | ``Erik_: Whether they're doing it or not it's wrong - if they don't care it shouldn't be too hard to make it "correct" - just call everything a weight and be done with it |
| 22:23.47 | smurfette | bah, im always late to find out anything |
| 22:24.18 | ``Erik_ | when delta(gravity) matters, it becomes... well, important |
| 22:24.20 | starseeker | ``Erik_: it's a 101 basic unit mistake no one should be making |
| 22:24.48 | starseeker | sure |
| 22:25.01 | starseeker | my point exactly - it's worth doing right |
| 22:25.10 | starseeker | and there is a strong case for that |
| 22:25.37 | ``Erik_ | well, grok: analysts demanded a piece of software to automate a large portion of their job. New analysts learned how to use the software, but not the fundamentals. Recurse a few times. Now we have a batch of analysts completely unequiped to deal with the nitty gritty of the model and a black box of magic software. |
| 22:25.46 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33055 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (search.c search.h): Start on some more generalized functionality related to number of nodes present in combinations and subtrees. Once completed, this will fully replace the functionality in the proposed dbfindempty tcl command |
| 22:26.02 | brlcad | howdy smurfette |
| 22:26.09 | ``Erik_ | since it's just a magic black box that you push the 'go' button on, the quality of the minds operating it has deteriorated to essentially assembly line standards. |
| 22:26.21 | starseeker | ``Erik_: so won't they listen to us when we explain why it needs to be done correctly? |
| 22:26.38 | starseeker | since we're " |
| 22:26.41 | starseeker | mechanics" |
| 22:26.47 | ``Erik_ | I imagine most will listen, and a couple might even understand :) |
| 22:27.22 | starseeker | smurfette: Is that everyone's favorite DJ? |
| 22:27.35 | ``Erik_ | but yes, exactly, we're just greasy mechanics, all they know is which pedal to push to make it go faster and which to make it stop. |
| 22:27.47 | brlcad | starseeker: changing everythign to weight .. or everthing to mass ? |
| 22:27.59 | brlcad | gots no problems with making it "right" |
| 22:28.00 | starseeker | brlcad: Doing it "right" |
| 22:28.15 | starseeker | brlcad: Oh, good :-) |
| 22:28.17 | ``Erik_ | thinks it should all be mass, and rtweight should have a gravity parm |
| 22:28.27 | brlcad | yeah, that's what I was thinking |
| 22:28.33 | ``Erik_ | which defaults to, oh, say, 9.82 m/s^2 or something |
| 22:28.54 | starseeker | ``Erik_: Oh, that's a given. I was worried about customer code |
| 22:29.41 | ``Erik_ | if you're going to monkey with default behavior, you might want to talk to geoff... personally, I'd try to keep russ out of it |
| 22:30.02 | starseeker | is prepared to be fairly stubborn about refusing to do it "wrong" in BRL-CAD just to make someone else's tool happy - they need to fix their tool too |
| 22:30.05 | starseeker | ok |
| 22:30.08 | ``Erik_ | he's a nice guy, but insanely resisant to change |
| 22:30.44 | starseeker | errors like this tend to propagate and cause problems down the road |
| 22:31.19 | ``Erik_ | especially once you bring things like orbital platforms into the picture :D |
| 22:31.47 | starseeker | would be very very red-faced if he were an analyst and didn't have his units straight |
| 22:32.13 | ``Erik_ | and even ground crap has been plagued by quirks like coriolis effects for quite a while |
| 22:32.38 | brlcad | everyone just uses it as mass that I'm aware of |
| 22:32.39 | starseeker | really? cool |
| 22:33.31 | brlcad | ``Erik_: 6:15 lobby to head to thai |
| 22:33.38 | brlcad | if you want to drive with |
| 22:33.44 | brlcad | otherwise see ya there |
| 22:34.22 | starseeker | needs to hit the road... getting very quiet around here |
| 22:34.41 | ``Erik_ | aight |
| 22:35.49 | *** join/#brlcad novakyu (n=novakyu@visitor2.Berkeley.EDU) | |
| 22:36.08 | ``Erik_ | damn, this place is crawling with computer nerds |
| 22:36.35 | Ralith | what a strange thing that is. |
| 22:36.38 | Ralith | ^^ |
| 22:36.42 | brlcad | slow'n down ma' net bastages |
| 22:37.01 | ``Erik_ | I think this entire hotel was booked for this event |
| 22:37.43 | ``Erik_ | what kinda scotch did they gift you, brlcad? should I swing by for a sample? ;) |
| 22:37.59 | brlcad | starseeker:erm, why not just db_count_tree_leaves(tp)? |
| 22:39.07 | brlcad | ``Erik_: aberlour 16yr |
| 22:39.24 | ``Erik_ | ok, I need to swing by for a sample in the next day or two. |
| 22:39.29 | brlcad | yup |
| 22:39.30 | ``Erik_ | stop guzzling it. |
| 22:39.31 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 22:39.35 | brlcad | i'll bring it to the party |
| 22:39.42 | ``Erik_ | which? |
| 22:40.00 | brlcad | the main one, sat |
| 22:40.12 | ``Erik_ | oh, the pizza thing? |
| 22:40.30 | brlcad | yeah |
| 22:40.34 | ``Erik_ | coo |
| 22:40.38 | *** part/#brlcad novakyu (n=novakyu@visitor2.Berkeley.EDU) | |
| 22:41.18 | ``Erik_ | open source software development, where everyone's a drunk! wee! heh |
| 22:41.55 | ``Erik_ | <google> these nerds need all the social lube we can afford |
| 22:41.56 | ``Erik_ | O.O |
| 22:46.59 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33056 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/nirt/en/: ignore nirt.html |
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| 23:31.40 | eriksgirl | um werid |
| 23:47.48 | ``Erik_ | yes, yes you are |
| 23:47.53 | ``Erik_ | you are very werid |
| 01:05.15 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 01:07.48 | starseeker | brlcad: I don't want to return 1 at regions? |
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| 02:59.50 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:05.04 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
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| 04:55.34 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 05:03.13 | yukonbob | :) |
| 05:03.59 | yukonbob | hey -- I just found out the other day that BRL-CAD was the _first_ raytracer to produce real-time raytracing (as demonstrated by Mike Muuss at one of the siggraphs, iirc) |
| 05:09.12 | brlcad | yukonbob: yep |
| 05:10.22 | brlcad | massive distributed parallel rendering of a few frames of animation giving about 2-10fps iirc |
| 05:10.41 | brlcad | s/frames/seconds/ |
| 05:11.06 | yukonbob | brl-cad ftw! |
| 05:11.24 | brlcad | I think we got that rendering actually pulled off of umatic just this past summer, so hopefully can get them up on the website |
| 05:11.26 | yukonbob | history folks! history! you're running history! |
| 05:11.42 | yukonbob | the future folks! the future! you're running the future! |
| 05:11.59 | yukonbob | neat |
| 05:12.20 | yukonbob | brlcad: you following the tcl/tk con? |
| 05:19.59 | brlcad | yukonbob: no, I was going to attend (and present), but it overlapped with the gsoc summit |
| 05:20.09 | yukonbob | :P |
| 05:20.21 | yukonbob | I was hoping to attend, too... obviously didn't. |
| 05:24.06 | brlcad | ah |
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| 06:29.55 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33057 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/memalloc.c: r32845 removed memalloc.c from the build but apparently the file itself was accidentally not removed. now it's gone. |
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| 13:52.58 | brlcad | kicks CIA-24 |
| 13:52.58 | CIA-24 | ow |
| 15:16.39 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=elite01@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 15:38.00 | ``Erik_ | kicks brlcad |
| 17:44.02 | brlcad | wonders why CIA-24 isn't reporting anything |
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| 19:20.19 | starseeker | brlcad: Erm, sorry - misread question |
| 19:49.02 | starseeker | should probably just call db_tree_nleaves |
| 19:51.08 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33066 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.c: Revert inclusion of db_count_tree_leaves - need to do more work/thinking on what is needed. |
| 19:51.32 | starseeker | hmm, CIA got that one |
| 19:51.55 | starseeker | remembers he needs to sign up for the brlcad email lists as well... |
| 20:42.35 | AFK-claymore | kicks CIA-24 |
| 20:42.35 | CIA-24 | ow |
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| 22:40.04 | vulduovlak | hi |
| 22:41.29 | *** part/#brlcad vulduovlak (i=hsmvk@201.58.181.101) | |
| 22:48.58 | ``Erik_ | nah ya don't |
| 00:09.06 | ``Erik_ | practices his evil laughs as the commit grinds |
| 00:09.23 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33068 10/brlcad/trunk/ (87 files in 5 dirs): updated libpng to 1.2.32 |
| 01:54.42 | brlcad | heh |
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| 04:45.17 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33069 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/articles/ (27 files in 27 dirs): Add ignores for docbook articles |
| 04:46.20 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33070 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/: Add ignores for system/man1 |
| 04:46.47 | starseeker | brlcad: I think that's got it - svn status should be useful again |
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| 07:56.25 | brlcad | starseeker: awesome |
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| 16:30.53 | Vegitto | sÄ l |
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| 01:34.24 | ``Erik_ | *yawn* |
| 02:06.15 | brlcad | ``Erik_: we're ordering a bunch of chinese for delivery poolside, if you're interested |
| 02:06.34 | ``Erik_ | sure |
| 02:06.43 | ``Erik_ | should I wander over now to htrow an orderin? |
| 02:07.37 | brlcad | up to you |
| 02:07.46 | ``Erik_ | where ya'll at? |
| 02:07.57 | brlcad | poolside |
| 02:08.08 | ``Erik_ | aight, be down in a minute |
| 03:36.53 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 04:01.06 | brlcad | howdy pacman87! |
| 04:01.13 | pacman87 | howdy |
| 04:01.49 | pacman87 | my gfx card fan has become way too loud, and my hard drive is dying :( |
| 04:02.12 | pacman87 | so i'm back to integrated gfx, and hoping my hd doesn't die completely |
| 04:17.17 | brlcad | ouch |
| 04:17.26 | brlcad | sounds like you need a new puter soon |
| 04:23.26 | yukonbob | watches Ghost in the Shell 2 -- awesome... |
| 04:23.46 | yukonbob | hi pacman87 |
| 04:23.56 | yukonbob | , brlcad |
| 04:24.00 | pacman87 | hi yukonbob |
| 04:24.02 | brlcad | yukonbob: oh, sweet |
| 04:24.05 | pacman87 | brlcad: yes, i do |
| 04:24.07 | brlcad | i've been wanting to see that badly |
| 04:24.14 | pacman87 | this one's getting ~4 yrs old |
| 04:24.25 | brlcad | saw the previews two years ago .. absolutely amazing |
| 04:24.30 | brlcad | pacman87: ouch |
| 04:24.46 | yukonbob | brlcad: yup, _very_ cool, indeed... |
| 04:24.49 | brlcad | pacman87: what kind of machine is it? |
| 04:25.12 | pacman87 | p4, 2.8 ghz, 533 fsb, 1280MB ddr-2700 ram |
| 04:25.16 | yukonbob | saw what I think was the world premier at Toronto Internation Film Fest few years ago on big screen... rewatching for the hell of it... |
| 04:25.36 | yukonbob | *International |
| 04:30.28 | yukonbob | some of the scenes are so incredible, it's just gratuitous awesomeness... |
| 04:33.09 | brlcad | yeah, it looked brilliant |
| 04:33.12 | brlcad | truely spectacular |
| 04:51.04 | ``Erik_ | brlcad, I have your bottle |
| 04:56.04 | brlcad | ``Erik_: mm, okay |
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| 09:08.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33071 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/BrlcadCore.def: added bu_avs_init_empty |
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| 10:49.57 | claymore | stretches. |
| 10:50.00 | claymore | Morning all! |
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| 12:18.24 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 12:18.32 | mafm | hi |
| 12:26.13 | claymore | hai! |
| 12:26.20 | claymore | LOL: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3159/2807838577_83cbed0126_o.jpg?t=1053139 |
| 12:29.09 | mafm | pr0n in the tubes! |
| 12:47.41 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-129-225.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 12:50.01 | claymore | pr0n? Thats not pr0n, thats comedy! |
| 13:29.58 | brlcad | hehe, that's great |
| 13:47.00 | yukonbob | hilarious... |
| 13:51.23 | *** join/#brlcad pacman87 (n=Timothy@resnet-45-219.dorm.utexas.edu) | |
| 14:10.29 | ``Erik_ | in a disturbing fashion, quite |
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| 14:57.15 | ``Erik_ | http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/fail-owned-spankme-building-naming-fail.jpg |
| 15:00.40 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33073 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Added a project file for libgcv. |
| 15:24.27 | ``Erik_ | <-- grumbles at this javascript monstrosity he's trying to rewrite in a sane language, the algorithm is just... horrible |
| 15:31.27 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33074 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am g_qa.xml): Add docbook g_qa man page worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 15:49.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33075 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Command.cxx Command.h Commands.h): Factoring out common code to treat results of libged function invocations |
| 15:51.40 | brlcad | ``Erik_: they're ready at 9 in the lobby for breakfast |
| 15:54.05 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 15:59.33 | claymore | Breakfast at 0900? Sheesh. Must be nice. :P |
| 16:00.43 | ``Erik_ | ok, uh |
| 16:00.58 | ``Erik_ | I'm guessing htat includes checkout? |
| 16:27.40 | starseeker | ah, good - db_tree_nleaves seems to do the right thing |
| 16:29.58 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33076 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am anim_lookat.xml anim_offset.xml): Man pages for anim_lookat and anim_offset in docbook, worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 16:49.22 | brlcad | detaches |
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| 17:26.44 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33077 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (7 files): Creating especialized class for commands replicating/calling libged functions |
| 17:49.46 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33078 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/GedCommand.h: Changing access privileges for a method, private is not quite right in this case |
| 17:51.21 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33079 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): |
| 17:51.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Add a 'number of nodes' option to search called -nnodes. This is a |
| 17:51.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: generalization of the -empty option, which is now removed. With this feature |
| 17:51.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: search should be able to handle everything represented by the code on feature |
| 17:51.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: request 1677383. |
| 17:53.26 | mafm | is OK to put messages to be printed as "static const char"? I guess that it's more efficient than #defines |
| 17:54.00 | mafm | but I don't know if you have recommendations or problems or even BRL-CAD guidelines about that |
| 17:56.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33080 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Command.cxx Command.h Commands.h GedCommands.h): Small corrections to method/variable naming, it's a bit clearer and verbosity is not a hassle in this case |
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| 18:53.57 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03mafm * r33081 10/rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ (Command.cxx Command.h Commands.h GedCommands.h): Using statically defined strings instead of putting messages directly in messages related with command processing (it's supposed to be more efficient and maintanable) |
| 19:06.29 | brlcad | mafm: nah, there's no steadfast rule -- fairly bikeshed difference |
| 19:06.53 | brlcad | if it's useful to have a handle on that data in a debugger, then definitely a static const instead of a define of course |
| 19:11.04 | mafm | it's about the latest of my commits |
| 19:14.41 | ``Erik_ | defines ftw! |
| 19:14.42 | mafm | so I'll leave them like that if it's about the same |
| 19:14.50 | brlcad | mafm: I saw the patches, nice work actually |
| 19:15.04 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 19:15.05 | brlcad | some nitpicks, but nothing worth complaining about that actually matters ;) |
| 19:15.35 | mafm | I'm doing... peripheric work until libged is more finished |
| 19:15.37 | claymore | brlcad/erik: When does your flight leave? |
| 19:15.44 | mafm | also I don't have lots of time |
| 19:16.17 | mafm | in example wed-fri of last week I was in a new datacenter and couldn't code a bit, I still have my project pending, etc |
| 19:16.42 | mafm | I'm trying at the moment to tackle small tasks :) |
| 19:16.54 | mafm | ``Erik_: why? |
| 19:17.55 | mafm | also about the efficientcy, I don't know if all compilers are smart enough to optimize that in all cases (even with -O0 and the like) |
| 19:18.15 | mafm | or when calling same defines from different files |
| 19:18.24 | mafm | maybe they would use one string per .o file or something like that |
| 19:20.21 | ``Erik_ | soon I think, claymore |
| 19:21.31 | brlcad | claymore: like in 5 minutes, already boarding |
| 19:21.35 | brlcad | cya on the flip side |
| 19:22.02 | brlcad | mafm: small tasks are great, better than nothing, and it keeps the energy going (motivates others) |
| 19:22.06 | brlcad | good stuff |
| 19:22.16 | brlcad | time to board now, cheers |
| 19:23.08 | mafm | good flight :) |
| 19:45.20 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33082 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am anim_orient.xml): Man page for anim_orient in docbook, worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:45.42 | mafm | going home, bye... |
| 20:27.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33083 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (B.xml E.xml M.xml Makefile.am Z.xml adc.xml): Man pages for B, E, M, Z and adc in docbook, worked on by Janine and Cliff |
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| 22:14.37 | brlcad | woot |
| 22:31.42 | pacman87 | is contemplating designing/building a passive heatsink for his graphics card |
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| 23:57.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33084 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/units.c: (log message trimmed) |
| 23:57.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: Expand bu_units_conversion to support volume and mass. The order of searching |
| 23:57.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: for matches is length, volume and finally mass. Since unit names are unique |
| 23:57.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: across dimensions, this works for the string->conversion factor direction and no |
| 23:57.34 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: new function call is needed. Unfortunately, it is NOT the case that conversion |
| 23:57.36 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: factors are unique to dimensions and as a consequence a general conversion |
| 23:57.38 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: factor -> string function must know if it is looking for a length, volume or |
| 00:02.40 | starseeker | of course, one way to approach this would be to simply store the names of the units in all cases and just convert when actually doing calculations - unit->string is convenient in some cases but I'm not sure it's truly necessary for what we do |
| 02:28.11 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 02:28.17 | starseeker | howdy :-) |
| 02:28.25 | yukonbob | what's shaking, starseeker? |
| 02:28.34 | starseeker | not a lot - new option to search |
| 02:28.45 | starseeker | monkeying with units |
| 02:28.52 | yukonbob | nods |
| 02:29.04 | yukonbob | unit monkey-er |
| 02:29.38 | yukonbob | chews food, trying to think of bite-size software project he can take on.... |
| 02:30.37 | starseeker | new primitive :-) |
| 02:31.24 | yukonbob | oh, no, I've got a list of stuff already :P -- I just need to make progress... I've got a system that's so unstable right now, I don't even have brl-cad up/running... |
| 02:31.55 | yukonbob | my goal is to stabalize and get brl-cad up/running, then check status of some ancient bugs I've already got on my radar :) |
| 02:32.34 | yukonbob | It's not a question of "to do's" for me, it's a question of time :P Work is taking it all :P |
| 02:34.55 | louipc | yep |
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| 11:59.51 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:00.33 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 13:12.15 | starseeker | drools over color epaper |
| 13:12.59 | starseeker | and resigns himself to the inevitable - commute time! |
| 13:13.05 | brlcad | epaper is awesomeness |
| 13:49.24 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33085 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 4 dirs): Added the rrt function to libged. |
| 13:51.25 | claymore | morning all |
| 13:53.48 | mafm | brlcad: are you going to gsoc mentor summit? |
| 14:00.09 | brlcad | mafm: heh, I just got back from the summit |
| 14:00.31 | brlcad | had fun talking to one of the ogre leads about your project |
| 14:02.54 | brlcad | howdy claymore |
| 14:03.07 | brlcad | glances over his shoulder just to make sure he didn't miss something |
| 14:03.35 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:05.22 | mafm | brlcad: oh, I thought that you were going in the plane yesterday, not going back... |
| 14:05.32 | mafm | brlcad: who's the devel? |
| 14:07.19 | brlcad | left on thursday |
| 14:18.32 | mafm | brlcad: who's the devel? |
| 14:19.18 | brlcad | ah, assaf I think |
| 14:21.58 | brlcad | his name escapes me at the moment, has mid-long curly hair, glasses, skinny, tallish ;) |
| 14:22.51 | brlcad | not my buddy steve streeting though, he wasn't there this year |
| 14:23.17 | mafm | I don't have physical references of any of them :) |
| 14:23.23 | mafm | just nicknames |
| 14:24.07 | brlcad | steve is sinbad |
| 14:24.14 | mafm | yes |
| 14:24.15 | brlcad | don't know assaf's nickname |
| 14:24.23 | mafm | and then another ones like pjcast... |
| 14:25.25 | mafm | About: Assaf joined the team in March 2008, and is the primary Dx10 maintainer. |
| 14:25.33 | mafm | so quite a new fella |
| 14:25.34 | mafm | :) |
| 14:26.17 | mafm | any useful comments, in example about the GUI libs? |
| 14:37.43 | claymore | isn't doing so well this morning. Dizzy, headache, etc. |
| 14:38.15 | claymore | brlcad: moved that release sync meeting to wednesday since you said you prolly wouldnt be in today lol ;) |
| 14:46.43 | claymore | is about to throw his router against the wall... it won't forward any ports to save its life..... |
| 14:46.47 | claymore | screams. |
| 14:47.11 | ``Erik | so foward the starboards instead? HA. HA. HA. okI'llshutupnow |
| 14:47.51 | claymore | now has a new target for his router in lieu of the wall. |
| 14:48.13 | claymore | erik: back @ work? |
| 14:48.47 | ``Erik | ayup *flees his office to avoid high velocity networking equipment* |
| 14:49.43 | claymore | Well if I had a router-pult that could sling a wrt-54g ~45 miles then I would think it would be party time at mi casa. |
| 15:17.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33086 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Added the echo function to libged. |
| 15:23.40 | ``Erik | starseeker: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d7fac673e |
| 15:26.59 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33087 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/g_qa.xml: Tweak g_qa docbook man page. |
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| 16:05.59 | mafm | fuse-sshfs ftw! |
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| 18:48.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33088 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/rtif.c: Remove dead duplicate code. |
| 19:01.14 | ``Erik | Trab pu kcip! Trab pu kcip! |
| 19:49.52 | mafm | night |
| 20:13.20 | *** part/#brlcad ``Erik_ (n=erik@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 20:49.11 | starseeker | reads through how nirt is called from mged |
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| 23:18.44 | cad23 | hello |
| 23:20.20 | cad23 | Does anyone know where I can get more info on rtarea and rtweight |
| 23:20.39 | cad23 | I was told man pages but man rtarea and man rtweight didn't return anything |
| 23:21.04 | ``Erik | you probably have to update your MANPATH (or use 'brlman', which does that for you) |
| 23:23.48 | cad23 | that worked great thank you |
| 23:25.57 | cad23 | Do you know where I can look to find more information on how the models are stored? |
| 23:27.03 | ``Erik | uhm, you mean the format of the .g file? |
| 23:27.40 | cad23 | yes |
| 23:28.07 | cad23 | I think logically it's a tree of operations |
| 23:28.42 | ``Erik | the csg stuff is arranged that way... we have a database format document, but it's out of date :/ the source is the documentation now |
| 23:28.58 | ``Erik | mostly in src/librt (src/libwdb might be worth looking at, or the procdb stuff a little bit) |
| 23:31.28 | cad23 | the rtarea doesn't seem like what I wanted |
| 23:32.01 | ``Erik | yeah, it's the area of a view, not the total exposed surface area :/ |
| 23:32.33 | cad23 | I talked to a proffessor in computer graphics and he said it's impossible to get the total surface area |
| 23:33.47 | ``Erik | not impossible, but complex and expensive (and we don't have an automagic knob to cook cpu for that) |
| 23:34.15 | cad23 | he said the approximation is the best bet |
| 23:34.24 | ``Erik | would imagine a surface walking algorithm could probably do it in a reasonable fashion |
| 23:38.30 | cad23 | rtarea from 3 orthogonal views might be an easy way to approximate surface area |
| 23:40.34 | ``Erik | then you have to correlate all the surfaces between all 3 views :/ |
| 23:45.23 | cad23 | so not very practical |
| 23:51.43 | cad23 | thank you for your time |
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| 01:09.49 | pacman87 | you could probably do it using the normal vector at each hitpoint |
| 01:10.10 | pacman87 | (finding the area) |
| 01:10.17 | pacman87 | or at least an approximation |
| 01:21.30 | pacman87 | area covered by one ray would be (d^2) / (unit_ray DOT unit_norm), where d is the distance between adjacent rays, assuming the rays are shot in a square grid |
| 01:21.53 | pacman87 | then add the areas from each ray |
| 01:22.30 | pacman87 | it won't work if there's a surface tangent to the ray, though |
| 01:23.28 | ``Erik | at that point, grinding it through nmg to get a bot non-csg representation and just summing the area of all the triangles would be good 'nuff, no? :D |
| 01:24.26 | pacman87 | yeah, probably :) |
| 01:24.59 | pacman87 | i thought nmg wasn't fully working yet |
| 01:25.41 | pacman87 | i've got to go teach physics, back in ~2 hrs |
| 01:26.03 | ``Erik | it's slow, ugly, and breaks a lot |
| 02:09.53 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 03:05.28 | yukonbob | Nova (PBS) has a show about animation, if anybody's interested... |
| 03:08.56 | louipc | can I watch via web? |
| 04:14.33 | louipc | aww only the day after |
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| 04:27.05 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 05:00.53 | yukonbob | turned out to be more about fractals and Mandelbrot -- still very good... |
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| 12:00.40 | mafm | hallo |
| 12:41.01 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33089 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/ (6 files in 2 dirs): Continuing the Geometry Service Java -> Cpp conversion. |
| 12:57.11 | mafm | C++ ftw! |
| 12:57.13 | mafm | :þ |
| 13:11.42 | ``Erik | ew |
| 13:12.20 | archivist | C++ --, C ++ |
| 13:12.52 | ``Erik | objc, smalltalk, lithp, ruby, ... crap, even python on some days :) |
| 13:13.17 | Axman6 | Haksell++ |
| 13:13.54 | ``Erik | haskell is good, too, if your problem is more math and less i/o... monads can be a pain at times :) |
| 13:15.14 | Axman6 | thar be dragons that get you through the I, and O makes the holes they get in through! |
| 13:15.30 | archivist | I see a lot of OOP abuse of databases, people serialising objects into fields, they have no idea how to harness the power of an RDBMS |
| 13:15.46 | ``Erik | oh yeah, OM is bad juju |
| 13:15.55 | Axman6 | OM? |
| 13:15.59 | ``Erik | object mapping |
| 13:16.07 | Axman6 | ah |
| 13:16.28 | ``Erik | what crap like 'hibernate' does, "magic" instance<->rdbms persistence |
| 13:17.07 | archivist | verily |
| 13:17.13 | Axman6 | i actually quite like java's serialisation stuff, used it in a game for a comp assignment recently, worked very well |
| 13:17.51 | Axman6 | high score list was just an ArrayList with a serialised class i made for storing the info |
| 13:18.20 | ``Erik | most ORM's (sorry, orm, not om) doesn't serialize like that, they have fields marked 'persistent', and each is stored in a column |
| 13:18.39 | ``Erik | object relational mapper? something, I'm still waking up :) haven't had my first sip of coffee yet |
| 13:20.07 | archivist | we see them in #mysql when they hit a speed problem |
| 13:21.53 | ``Erik | many java weenies don't realize the amount of processings and communication to do an sql query, I've seen ORM persistence to mysql, postgresql and oracle abused in horrible ways when developers cache the results of simple (and completely reproducable) computations... in the backing store... |
| 13:22.19 | ``Erik | load 4 values, compute simple polynomial, save result. |
| 13:22.48 | archivist | cache abuse is another can of worms |
| 13:22.51 | ``Erik | (then, later, load 10 results, compute average, save THAT value) |
| 13:23.28 | Axman6 | ``Erik: you might like this http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/The-Annual-Reboot.aspx |
| 13:24.04 | ``Erik | query, archivist, a while back with mysql, if you had a table with a 'double' row, did an insert, then selected that value out, it was not a bit perfect copy... is there any reason? |
| 13:24.21 | ``Erik | axman6: I've read t he entire backlog of dailywtf and catch up every day :D good site |
| 13:24.30 | Axman6 | heh, nice :) |
| 13:24.45 | archivist | most of the idiots never save the result, they calc every page hit |
| 13:25.05 | ``Erik | freshmeat, slashdot, bsd news, qdb/bash, dailywtf, bofh, lolcats... |
| 13:26.11 | archivist | lolcats rulz |
| 13:26.23 | ``Erik | this was in the guts of a distributed physics simulation, it's like the db was being used as a databus and they decided they needed the ability to continue at pretty much source line fidelity, so 99.999% of their time was in the hibertnate<->mysql chunk :( |
| 13:27.40 | archivist | how far back was that data error? older versions trimmed char/varchar, newer does not |
| 13:28.24 | ``Erik | um, a couple years, but this was numerical 'double' type, not text? |
| 13:29.11 | archivist | ah typical float problem, use decimal |
| 13:29.53 | ``Erik | *shrug* their solution was to print it to a string and save that, then parse the string when they read. my solution was to leave. :) |
| 13:30.01 | archivist | I avoid doubles and floats |
| 13:30.21 | archivist | decimal is an exact type |
| 13:31.45 | ``Erik | ah, neat. I've moved my thinking more to non-sql styles of backing, like journalled images (bknr style) |
| 13:33.30 | archivist | or cheat and use a blob /binary type |
| 13:34.53 | ``Erik | http://bash.org/?835413 |
| 13:36.13 | archivist | so much to idle the days work away.... |
| 13:50.44 | ``Erik | indeed |
| 13:53.41 | claymore | Erik: Do you know if brlcad is planning on being in today? |
| 13:56.10 | ``Erik | not sure, um, he dropped me off just after midnight and went to work... I think he was here from mebbe 1am to noon or so yesterday. he may be recovering |
| 13:56.27 | ``Erik | he was committing to bzflag about 5 hours ago |
| 13:57.51 | claymore | Hrm, well hope he doesn't forget about the 1500 meeting I called :) If so I may have to reschedule... again. |
| 14:48.19 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@193.136.2.123) | |
| 15:00.34 | mafm | archivist: C++-- is supposed to be Java :D |
| 15:05.35 | ``Erik | nah, c++-- is like a rollover condition |
| 15:06.08 | mafm | why don't you like C++? :) |
| 15:06.14 | ``Erik | I did get a kick out of guy steeles comment that java was meant to drag the c++ guys half way to lisp |
| 15:07.02 | mafm | lol |
| 15:07.25 | ``Erik | because I drank the koolaid for a bit in the mid-late 90's, got to understanding what it was doing and some of the limitations (which made me adverse to "object oriented" at all), then got into stuff like ruby and smalltalk and objectiveC, so now I know what c++ is defaming ? :D |
| 15:09.53 | ``Erik | that and being exposed to the unix world with some insanely elegant and short C doing what I've seen mountains of c++ used to do in the windows world *shrug* once in a rare while, I write some c++, but it's just a horribly poor fit for most problems, im(ns)ho |
| 15:10.28 | archivist | I came from the assembler side of the world, quick and easy program writing != fast programs |
| 15:11.24 | ``Erik | well, my history is basic->65xx asm->x86 asm (shudder)->c++->C->(explosion of languages that I cannot recall the order of anymore) |
| 15:11.45 | ``Erik | oh, there was some z80 in there somewhere, and some 68xx, too |
| 15:13.24 | archivist | although I admit to buying a book Object Oriented Assembly Programming |
| 15:15.08 | ``Erik | I wish I would've though to convert my old c64 programs to a data source I could access :( I had a nifty library of code blocks for all sorts of common activities |
| 15:19.22 | starseeker | wishes McCLIM would get a big infusion of effort so we could all do everything in Lisp |
| 15:21.07 | mafm | :) |
| 15:21.26 | mafm | dunno, I see C++ as a more elegant C |
| 15:21.53 | mafm | and I'd prefer things like Ada, but I have to live in the real world |
| 15:21.55 | mafm | :) |
| 15:26.08 | brlcad | AFK-claymore: yes, I'll be there |
| 15:31.32 | ``Erik | that's another amusing thing I came across, starseeker... the assertation that c++ and java are written for mediocre developers (and that's ok, because there are plenty of those developers) where lisp is written for top shelf developers (therefore unsuitable for a large portion of the workforce) |
| 15:31.55 | starseeker | yeah, I've seen similar quotes |
| 15:32.37 | ``Erik | and the responses of "but mit teaches scheme in its intro course" and "but you have your guru writing the macros and your turds writing all the other crap"? |
| 15:33.19 | ``Erik | (and I believe I've made the statement that you simply don't see mediocre developers in MIT's courses) |
| 15:34.25 | starseeker | mmm |
| 15:34.34 | starseeker | ah, here's the quote: |
| 15:34.41 | starseeker | Java was, as Gosling says in the first Java white paper, designed for average programmers. It's a perfectly legitimate goal to design a language for average programmers. (Or for that matter for small children, like Logo.) But it is also a legitimate, and very different, goal to design a language for good programmers. - Paul Graham |
| 15:35.58 | starseeker | Heh: |
| 15:36.40 | starseeker | Dino Dai Zovi |
| 15:36.50 | starseeker | We all know that Lisp is the best language around, but in the hands of most it becomes like that scene in Fantasia when Mickey Mouse gets the wand. |
| 15:39.29 | archivist | luvely java quote /me steals and adds it to #mysql bot |
| 15:44.49 | mafm | other than being easy to interpret, I never found LISP to be remarkable nor very useful :þ |
| 15:45.48 | ``Erik | huh, I've found it to be quite useful once you get the training wheels off and move past hello world |
| 15:45.49 | mafm | I would probably quit programming if McCLIM would get that infusion |
| 15:46.34 | ``Erik | given that travelocity and orbitz use lisp backends, I'd say it can be a useful language :D |
| 15:47.10 | ``Erik | oh, and "ratchet&klank" uses a fair chunk of lithp, thuppothedly, as well as that old 'abuse' game |
| 15:47.11 | mafm | what's special about LISP, using lists as main abstraction or modifying other parts of the code on the run, or..? |
| 15:49.07 | ``Erik | meh, lisp has structs, classes, arrays, vectors, ... a zomfg macro system is useful, being able to express things in short clean functions or methods is nice, working in an 'environment' system has huge benefits (like instead of code, compile, load data and test... you just code and test) |
| 15:50.42 | ``Erik | wrote a (obnoxiously simple) gui ide in under 200 lines of scheme a while back, thinks all his copies were on a hdd that cooked, though :( |
| 15:50.46 | mafm | re: travelocity and orbitz... well, you know that there's a surge in COBOL demand because lots of banks use it, right? I don't think that it says anything positive about COBOL though |
| 15:52.18 | brlcad | don't folks have better things to do than pontificate about and navel-gaze on programming languages for hours on end? :-) |
| 15:52.23 | ``Erik | yeah, but simple report generation on a mainframe is far less challenging than multi-facetted path optimization of a constantly changing data set with a slew of concurrent users expecting an interactive experience :D |
| 15:53.04 | brlcad | with that level of discussion inefficiency, the language so doesn't matter -- you could have had [insert_task_here] done in almost any language |
| 15:53.16 | mafm | lol |
| 15:53.17 | ``Erik | "code, {(compile && test), jabber}; repeat" |
| 15:53.28 | brlcad | returns you to your regularly scheduled navel gazing |
| 15:53.35 | mafm | sorry brlcad by I'm not productive in this noisy environment |
| 15:54.26 | brlcad | mafm: understandably |
| 15:54.42 | brlcad | the "off-topic" gavel needed to be raised a couple hours ago |
| 15:54.52 | ``Erik | but it's fun! |
| 15:54.58 | mafm | not the channel, I mean this alien-dissecting greenhouse that they call datacenter |
| 15:55.06 | mafm | :þ |
| 15:55.13 | brlcad | mafm: ah |
| 15:55.15 | ``Erik | and less than an hour of language jabber |
| 15:55.54 | brlcad | try three hours, just migrating participants |
| 15:56.11 | clock_ | this evening don't walk out |
| 15:56.19 | clock_ | I will test my new amplifier |
| 15:56.54 | clock_ | I assume it's so badly designed it will instantly start to oscillate on all possible frequencies, bringing all the air traffic on the Earth down |
| 15:56.58 | ``Erik | bahhh, yer no fun :D |
| 15:57.10 | ``Erik | clock: Large Datagram Collider? |
| 15:57.20 | clock_ | lol |
| 15:57.43 | clock_ | Actually have you heard of use of potentiometers in radars in the small signal path? |
| 15:58.07 | clock_ | I wonder if a potentiometer can be used as a device in a very low noise system which has only the thermal noise and no additional noise. |
| 16:03.55 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14F9BE.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:06.55 | mafm | Large Hellicopter Crusher, maybe |
| 16:07.58 | AFK-claymore | or.... http://musiclub.web.cern.ch/MusiClub/bands/cernettes/firstband.html |
| 16:09.43 | AFK-claymore | http://blog.alcastle.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/2008-06-26-lhc.png |
| 16:10.39 | ``Erik | everyone's seen http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html right? |
| 16:11.46 | AFK-claymore | anything with *webcams* in it is borderline nsfw.... do I click on that or not....? Hrm... |
| 16:12.00 | ``Erik | heh, this is work safe |
| 16:13.44 | AFK-claymore | getting a dedlink |
| 16:14.09 | ``Erik | huh, working for me :( |
| 16:14.43 | louipc | OH SHITE |
| 16:14.47 | AFK-claymore | well you are using your proxy-fu are you not? |
| 16:14.55 | ``Erik | of course |
| 16:15.01 | louipc | we're all gonna die |
| 16:15.05 | mafm | lol |
| 16:15.22 | mafm | you know, my former flatmate was working in CMS experiment |
| 16:15.34 | AFK-claymore | I would be laughing all the way to the grave if the lhc brought forth the end. |
| 16:16.07 | mafm | well, and my labs designs parts of the CMS detector |
| 16:16.16 | AFK-claymore | Almost as funny as the idea of the Earth getting demolished to make room for an intersellar Bypass |
| 16:16.20 | mafm | my lab will be responsible for the black hole! |
| 16:16.51 | ``Erik | ah, the flakey DNS servers here are the issue :/ |
| 16:16.58 | AFK-claymore | CMS = Content Management System? Never knew Joomla was that evil... |
| 16:17.16 | mafm | nope |
| 16:17.22 | mafm | LHC Compact Muon Solenoid Experiment Webcams -> CMS |
| 16:19.35 | AFK-claymore | watches in horror as yet another joke is beaten to death.... |
| 16:21.05 | claymore | erik: I was actually thinking that the IT 'tards updated the firewalls with "Block *.* EXCEPT *.youtube.com" |
| 16:22.07 | ``Erik | heh, no, I did some scanning, it cannot resolve with the DNS servers we're told to use |
| 16:22.24 | ``Erik | and it uses vhosting, so'z you can't just use the IP :( |
| 16:22.54 | ``Erik | ya get a 404 from "hostgator.com" if ya try |
| 16:25.04 | claymore | Speaking of hosting, www.netfirms.com still has their $10 for a year of decent hosting going on. Its a 'coupon' code that I think they forgot to disable, tee hee. |
| 16:25.28 | mafm | claymore: I was thinking that might be a joke, but no sure |
| 16:26.06 | claymore | mafm: I am extremely sarcastic and rarely am serious. its in my nature. |
| 16:26.36 | mafm | nice to hear! |
| 16:27.09 | ``Erik | 10/myr? I see 10/mo O.o |
| 16:27.35 | claymore | Netfirms Advantage Hosting: 250GB Disk, 2TB/month bandwidth, 2 free domains, blah blah blah. |
| 16:27.55 | claymore | Sign up for 1 year of advantage hosting and put in MAX for the propotion/coupon code ;) |
| 16:28.27 | claymore | works out to "Buy 1 month get 11 free" lol. |
| 16:28.49 | ``Erik | huh, cool |
| 16:28.50 | claymore | the speeds are so-so. Not blazing fast, not painfully slow either. |
| 16:29.44 | claymore | one click installers are nice, but the ssh access is super stripped down. What did you call it Erik... a 'jail' ? |
| 16:30.18 | ``Erik | given that it's linux, it'd be a chroot or a vm image |
| 16:31.11 | claymore | Over all, I would say that 10/mo is overpriced for the service & features... but 10/yr... now your're talkin ;) |
| 16:31.12 | ``Erik | linux guys will often call it a jail, but that makes the bsd guys angsty (ok, angstier), since jails involve duplicating all the writable kernel memory to prevent breaking out |
| 16:31.41 | alex_joni | claymore: check out DH while you're at it.. |
| 16:32.04 | claymore | adds that to the long (and growing ) list of things to read. |
| 16:32.13 | alex_joni | claymore: dreamhost.com |
| 16:32.27 | ``Erik | hm, that's who shiro uses |
| 16:35.31 | mafm | reboot needed (no, no windows here :P) |
| 16:37.06 | claymore | Erik: when you heading over? |
| 16:37.41 | ``Erik | 10 or so minutes |
| 16:37.46 | ``Erik | half wondering if I should just not go |
| 16:38.17 | claymore | Paullette is on the warpath |
| 16:38.29 | claymore | so hide |
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| 16:58.57 | mafm | meh |
| 18:04.19 | mafm | damn broadcom wireless :| |
| 18:52.20 | elite01 | heh, this is ndiswrapper :( |
| 18:52.47 | mafm | mine doesn't seem to work with b43 |
| 18:53.04 | mafm | maybe with ndiswrapper, but I don't have networks around to test |
| 18:53.23 | elite01 | ipw3945 used to work fine, but iwl3945 fails, so ugh |
| 18:53.37 | elite01 | no idea about broadcom stuff |
| 18:55.18 | mafm | I'm just bored in this datacenter and trying to configure it, no problem :) |
| 18:55.41 | elite01 | i'm seriously bored as well |
| 19:38.08 | mafm | going home, bue |
| 19:38.09 | mafm | bye |
| 20:05.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33090 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Architecture Planning. |
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| 20:50.45 | ``Erik | "Moving at the speed of government while spending at the speed of government." hah |
| 20:52.36 | archivist | spending faster than the taxpayers can |
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| 00:29.55 | starseeker | brlcad: Is the Liquid Wiki Engine Project for Drupal any good? http://drupal.org/node/142409 |
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| 01:58.50 | ``Erik | nickcollkill on yourself, impressive |
| 02:00.30 | starseeker | needs to set up Drupal on his home machine so he can experiment without severe risk to the brlcad.or website |
| 02:02.09 | ``Erik | once you install freebsd, just do "portmanager www/drupal6" and it's done :D *duck* |
| 02:04.15 | Ralith | <3 freebsd |
| 02:11.57 | ``Erik | hrm, two hits with just hc's, or do I bring my dreadnaught to single-shot it |
| 02:12.57 | starseeker | jeez, gentoo-wiki.com is well and truly screwed |
| 02:13.23 | ``Erik | naturally, it runs on gentoo... :D *duck* |
| 02:13.31 | starseeker | this is going to be poster child #1 for the importance of off-isp-server backups |
| 02:13.51 | ``Erik | 3 location, yo |
| 02:13.56 | starseeker | their isp got in a billing dispute and no one will help him get his data back |
| 02:14.29 | starseeker | locations wouldn't have done it in this case, he needed multiple company backups |
| 02:15.30 | ``Erik | ah, I've been fighting to get my data from a university for the last couple months, sucks |
| 02:16.32 | starseeker | there's something to be said for having physical tape backups in a few locations under your control... |
| 02:16.51 | ``Erik | depends on how much data you're talking about |
| 02:17.06 | ``Erik | when you start measuring dat9 by terabytes, it gets real expensive real fast |
| 02:17.14 | starseeker | grumbles... gentoo-wiki was EXTREMELY useful and had info on Drupal setup - hope google cache was reasonably current |
| 02:17.20 | starseeker | true :-) |
| 02:17.35 | starseeker | unless you're doing lots of multimedia though, that's pretty unlikely |
| 02:22.08 | starseeker | heads home... |
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| 03:50.36 | brlcad | starseeker: can't say I've ever heard of it before today |
| 03:54.37 | brlcad | but I don't see why we'd bother either -- if wiki is the approach, we have mediawiki; otherwise straight up drupal customization is probably easiest |
| 03:54.51 | brlcad | one thing to look at, though, might be drupal Book Import and Book Export |
| 03:55.19 | brlcad | they use xml format there already -- doing an xml<->xml conversion (or maybe get lucky if it's already docbook) might be really trivial |
| 03:55.49 | starseeker | I was under the impression their book format was a rather specific way of linking individual pages to each other |
| 03:56.05 | starseeker | which isn't really what we're looking for for the man pages |
| 03:56.26 | starseeker | but yeah, I'll definitely be peaking at the code for a basic education :-) |
| 03:56.51 | starseeker | is working on getting a basic LAMP setup going on his home box |
| 03:57.46 | brlcad | if you think of each manual page as a book, it works out just fine -- the only linking is book-to-book and metabooks |
| 03:58.14 | brlcad | or even each manual page as a book section, there are lots of corrollaries |
| 03:58.30 | starseeker | Hmm. OK, I guess some experimentation is in order |
| 03:58.43 | brlcad | might want to check out this guy's work: http://www.puregin.org/node/201 |
| 03:58.54 | starseeker | winces recalling how his last attempt to setup a LAMP environment went... |
| 03:59.39 | brlcad | as well as http://drupal.org/project/book_import_export of coruse .. it might do the trick outright now |
| 03:59.54 | brlcad | though I entirely expect that code will need to be written to make it work |
| 04:00.04 | starseeker | nods. |
| 04:00.05 | brlcad | just might get lucky with someone starting things though |
| 04:00.31 | starseeker | I might do some work on the machine here tomorrow - that way anything truly destructive is confined to this box |
| 04:01.07 | starseeker | needs to just take the damn bull by the horns and make this work |
| 04:02.42 | starseeker | blinks - I didn't realize book import/export was supposed to replace the specific docbook export module |
| 04:05.00 | starseeker | that may help |
| 04:07.38 | starseeker | doggone it... |
| 04:07.49 | starseeker | gets php recompiling and grabs a few winks... |
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| 09:47.09 | mafm | hi pplz |
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| 12:06.00 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:20.46 | mafm | I do cool |
| 12:21.03 | mafm | refrigerated by 3 giant UPSs |
| 12:21.08 | mafm | bringing me a nice flu |
| 12:29.11 | brlcad | heh, fun |
| 12:34.38 | mafm | 700TB of storage and not a single disk for p2p, that's not fair! |
| 12:36.12 | mafm | the internet is for pr0n, after all |
| 12:36.39 | clock_ | pr0n and spam |
| 12:42.33 | brlcad | mafm: that's a decent size data store, so where are you at? :) |
| 12:43.04 | mafm | that's a new datacenter to be used for grid projects |
| 12:43.17 | clock_ | p0rn grid? |
| 12:43.19 | mafm | to calculate the size of the new black hole from LHC and things like that |
| 12:53.16 | mafm | and 112 blade servers with 8 cores each and 24/32 GB of RAM |
| 12:53.31 | mafm | I guess that somebody would make decent animations with that |
| 13:04.54 | clock_ | The nature has so many mysteries |
| 13:05.09 | clock_ | Like the one I want to know is does the BF998 transistor still have 1/f noise at 1 MHz? |
| 13:09.47 | ``Erik | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19s4PCaQ5Mk |
| 13:15.46 | mafm | be back later |
| 13:15.52 | ``Erik | hasta la pasta |
| 13:16.10 | mafm | something like that, yep :) |
| 13:40.21 | starseeker | pfft - the book_import_docbook.module file is empty |
| 13:41.32 | ``Erik | sucks to be you |
| 13:49.48 | brlcad | maybe it's a "Choose Your Own Adventure" module |
| 13:50.00 | starseeker | heh |
| 13:50.30 | starseeker | falls back on the last resort - "when all else fails, read the docs" |
| 13:51.07 | starseeker | brlcad: I take it we're staying with Drupal 5 for a while? |
| 13:51.43 | ``Erik | um, the new machine has 6.6 |
| 13:52.21 | starseeker | blinks - this one has 5.7 according to the changelog |
| 13:52.34 | ``Erik | bz.bzflag.bz is the old one |
| 13:53.37 | ``Erik | brlcad last logged into the new one about a year ago, otherwise I've been the only one touching it :) |
| 14:07.49 | brlcad | starseeker: we could update to 6, but at the time nobody had upgraded the ldap module |
| 14:17.05 | starseeker | OK |
| 14:17.53 | starseeker | is also poking at mediawiki - there's an extension to allow iframes, which might come in handy for throwing up the html output of an xsltproc conversion |
| 14:19.09 | starseeker | yeah, ldap for v6 is still on Aug. 12 alpha2 release |
| 14:21.51 | louipc | down with frames! |
| 14:22.31 | starseeker | louipc: In this case it's a convenient solution - xsltproc will give me a complete html page, which I then need to display as a "view" inside another page |
| 14:22.47 | starseeker | er "preview" rather |
| 14:27.57 | louipc | yeah they make it 10 times easier. damn them! |
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| 14:34.25 | clock_ | 999999/win 11 |
| 14:50.29 | mafm | ? |
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| 16:44.01 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 16:51.04 | mafm | brlcad: do you know of a simple, right way to format strings when you have to print size_t and the like? |
| 16:51.22 | mafm | the compiler emits warnings, depending on your coomputer architecture |
| 17:29.42 | ``Erik | would %p be right for you? |
| 17:30.45 | mafm | nope, it's %zu |
| 17:33.12 | ``Erik | ahhh, new c99 toys |
| 17:53.16 | mafm | :) |
| 17:54.06 | mafm | I don't know why they don't have fixed size data in all platforms since the beginning, even if for size_t was probably not an option |
| 17:54.46 | ``Erik | they did in the beginning |
| 17:54.55 | ``Erik | you could choose a pdp7, pdp8, pdp9, or pdp11 |
| 17:56.41 | mafm | what do you mean? |
| 17:57.52 | mafm | I mean to use "int32_t" instead of having "int", with different sizes in each platform |
| 17:58.50 | ``Erik | C was written as a kernel language for the pdp-7, it wasn't intended for portable applications :) so "in the beginning" was a radically different place |
| 17:59.10 | ``Erik | why use int18_t when all ints are int18_t ? |
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| 18:05.32 | archivist | which reminds me In the beginning there was data. The data was without form and null, |
| 18:05.32 | archivist | > and darkness was upon the face of the console; and the Spirit of IBM |
| 18:05.32 | archivist | > was moving over the face of the market. And DEC said, "Let there be |
| 18:05.32 | archivist | > registers"; and there were registers |
| 18:06.03 | archivist | cant find the full one at the moment |
| 18:07.03 | ``Erik | heh, geekenis 0x01:0x01 ? |
| 18:07.18 | archivist | found it http://www.humournet.com/misc.humour/creation.txt |
| 18:07.33 | mafm | dunno about the beginnings, but now it's really inconvenient |
| 18:08.15 | archivist | get used to it, chips are always changing size |
| 18:12.26 | mafm | :) |
| 18:12.30 | mafm | I go now, take care |
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| 19:36.27 | starseeker | Oh my, a CNC carved pumpkin |
| 19:36.32 | starseeker | that's just wrong |
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| 20:20.53 | brlcad | starseeker: oops, I suspect you ran a grep to find the implementations? |
| 20:21.02 | brlcad | (looking at the table you sent) |
| 20:21.37 | brlcad | alas, a lot of them are empty, so you actually have to look at the implementation to see if they're non-empty |
| 20:21.43 | starseeker | sort of |
| 20:21.44 | starseeker | ah |
| 20:21.53 | starseeker | I caught a few empty ones |
| 20:22.06 | starseeker | I was looking for prim_tess |
| 20:22.19 | brlcad | and nmg isn't the right routine I think |
| 20:22.28 | brlcad | it's the _nurb routine |
| 20:22.31 | brlcad | misspoke |
| 20:22.47 | starseeker | erm |
| 20:22.47 | brlcad | (nurbs are nmgs, just not the other way around) |
| 20:23.23 | starseeker | judging by the svn logs, Ben did three primitives with the new opennurbs logic |
| 20:23.33 | brlcad | thinks a matrix of all the callbacks is in order sometime soon, would make a good todo list |
| 20:23.37 | brlcad | s/list/chart/ |
| 20:23.45 | starseeker | agrees |
| 20:24.20 | starseeker | I was assuming a tesselation routine ment NMG, but that's probably not right? |
| 20:25.57 | starseeker | _nurb matches only in tgc and sketch, aside from bspline and nmg... |
| 20:26.12 | starseeker | oh, ell too |
| 20:27.34 | brlcad | note that may are subtyped -- sph is an ell, rec is a tgc, etc |
| 20:27.46 | starseeker | Ah |
| 20:36.26 | starseeker | will try again |
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| 21:58.08 | brlcad | updates and ponders a release |
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| 03:05.03 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i looked up sgiflight in google and all im getting is an irc log of when you talked about it |
| 03:09.17 | Ralith | lol |
| 03:14.38 | PrezKennedy | "sgi flight" has a couple more, but it sure makes me glad i grabbed a copy of it when it was available |
| 03:47.22 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: yeah, I have a copy somewhere around here |
| 03:48.20 | PrezKennedy | i would think it might work ok in a windows 95 virtual machine |
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| 07:43.57 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33091 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added some files to be in sync with Makefile.am |
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| 10:11.58 | mafm | hi |
| 10:55.14 | claymore | hai! |
| 12:20.14 | mafm | hai! can I haz tubez? |
| 12:21.44 | clock_ | was tuning the Impossibility Drive yesterday |
| 12:21.57 | clock_ | brlcad: do you in the army already have the Improbability Drive/ |
| 12:29.15 | claymore | clock: We probably do. ;) |
| 12:30.12 | clock_ | I need to get some kind of variable resistor that doesn't produce extra noise (1-10 MHz) when varied and doesn't have higher noise than the thermal noise of ordinary resistor |
| 12:30.35 | clock_ | Would it be possible to create a non-electrolytically conductive liquid by suspending soot particles in mineral oil? |
| 12:33.33 | claymore | Possibly, but how would you vary the conducivity accurately & easily? |
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| 14:08.31 | brlcad | clock_: it's probable |
| 14:09.02 | clock_ | clock_: it doesn't have to be accurate, since it will be controlled by a feedback loop |
| 14:09.20 | clock_ | brlcad: XEROX / laser toner is supposed to be soot? |
| 14:09.43 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 14:10.04 | clock_ | I have a desoldering plunger made of conductive plastic, antistatic |
| 14:10.08 | clock_ | Ohmmeter showed 900 ohms |
| 14:10.16 | clock_ | I guess that's plastic filled with soot? |
| 14:10.48 | clock_ | I think when I build it I should show it to some engineers from a commercial optics company |
| 14:11.13 | clock_ | they will get a heart attack when they see what kind of garage contraption can outperform their posh transimpedance amplifiers by orders of magnitude |
| 14:11.32 | clock_ | here comes a chinese lens, here a bit of soot, here smoke pipes |
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| 16:17.44 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33092 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am metaball.c): begin stubbing out a metaball proc-db |
| 16:18.24 | ``Erik_ | ok, I think I'm done for the day :D |
| 16:19.28 | starseeker | heh |
| 16:19.48 | starseeker | aren't you going to quash the fake thickness bug? ;-) |
| 16:20.09 | ``Erik_ | eh? fake thickness bug? |
| 16:20.33 | starseeker | that visual you have of the thin metaball edge that you think is floating point fuzz? |
| 16:20.34 | ``Erik_ | "plate mode" is a bug? or did I miss something? |
| 16:20.38 | ``Erik_ | oh |
| 16:20.42 | ``Erik_ | uh, some day |
| 16:21.34 | ``Erik_ | the proc-db is gonna give me a nice stack of fruity demo images and test cases to figure crap out |
| 16:21.55 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 16:22.04 | ``Erik_ | I wrote a C program to generate mged commands a while ago, but it was too limited |
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| 19:10.37 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33093 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/raytrace.h src/librt/wdb.c): added wdb_fflush(), just cuz |
| 19:16.29 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33094 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/metaball.c: some quick scaffolding and the beginning of one of the modes |
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| 19:20.41 | ``Erik | ffs, yet another security update for libpng, their defensive coding is akin to armor of wet sacks made from recycled paper |
| 19:22.00 | PrezKennedy | how many inches thick? |
| 19:25.53 | ``Erik | a few microfurlongs or so |
| 19:28.30 | archivist | and the bag is only the size of a barn (10 -24 sq metres) |
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| 19:51.32 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33095 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/constraint.c: C files should not have the svn:executable property. |
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| 20:42.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33096 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/metaball/metaball.c: added rt_metaball_add_point. Const propogation. |
| 20:44.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33097 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: added rt_metaball_add_point. Const propogation. |
| 20:45.57 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33098 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/wdb.h src/libwdb/wdb.c): stubbed out wdb mk_metaball |
| 21:02.08 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33099 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (librt/primitives/metaball/metaball.c libwdb/wdb.c): completely untested implementations. Wee. |
| 21:05.43 | Ralith | untested commits ftw? |
| 21:05.52 | ``Erik_ | are there any other kind? |
| 21:08.22 | ``Erik_ | ok, there, tested :D happy? it passed the "does it compile?" test |
| 21:08.26 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33100 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/wdb.c: mebbe I should at least make sure it compiles, first |
| 21:57.21 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 21:57.27 | starseeker | howdy |
| 21:57.32 | yukonbob | hey starseeker |
| 21:57.36 | yukonbob | how's your day going? |
| 21:57.40 | starseeker | not too bad |
| 21:57.46 | starseeker | gym kicked my butt |
| 21:58.27 | yukonbob | has never had butt kicked by gym... |
| 21:58.39 | yukonbob | <-- (rarely goes to gyms ;) ) |
| 21:58.51 | starseeker | heh |
| 22:00.05 | yukonbob | needs to get one of his bicycles on the road though -- went for quite a nice ride other week (on borrowed bike), and _does_ need to improve fitness... |
| 22:00.30 | starseeker | needs to achieve some state from which fitness is distantly visible as a goal... |
| 22:00.48 | yukonbob | heh... |
| 22:01.22 | yukonbob | good luck w/ the gym, then... if you get in the habit, I'm sure you'll come to the space where a distantly visible goal emerges ;) |
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| 00:36.55 | ``Erik_ | base #13 is building up now O.o |
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| 03:08.05 | starseeker | brlcad: Have you ever heard of MCS-libre? http://sourceforge.net/projects/mcs-libre/ |
| 03:13.23 | starseeker | wonders if we could use this - the 2.0 version isn't on the website but the author is responsive to email |
| 03:17.27 | starseeker | he claims to be using Boost in the 2.0 version, which would tie in nicely with the Boost stuff we already sucked in |
| 03:20.16 | starseeker | also says he is interested in supporting the library to meet needs it doesn't currently meet |
| 03:36.10 | brlcad | starseeker: yes, but it's only mildly relevant/useful |
| 03:36.17 | brlcad | it's basically a number generator library |
| 03:36.22 | brlcad | normal distributions |
| 03:36.26 | brlcad | aggregation |
| 03:38.27 | brlcad | starseeker: this is what I was referring to earlier: http://ftp.arl.mil/random/ |
| 03:39.23 | brlcad | the way it's implemented, it's really easy to turn into c if needed, or use straight up as c++ |
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| 16:24.49 | starseeker | brlcad: Is there a license on random? |
| 16:53.16 | brlcad | starseeker: nope, PD |
| 16:55.29 | starseeker | so you're thinking is that we don't need too much more of a framework than the proper random number generation? |
| 16:55.36 | starseeker | er your |
| 16:56.03 | brlcad | mcs-libre doesn't really do much more than that either :) |
| 16:56.14 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 16:56.41 | starseeker | very good |
| 16:56.49 | starseeker | likes the 108 page documentation |
| 16:57.04 | brlcad | yeah, he goes into extensive detail on each of the distribution types |
| 16:57.29 | brlcad | one of those secret little snippets of code that doesn't get the attention it deserves |
| 16:57.56 | starseeker | indeed |
| 16:58.00 | brlcad | it would make a good replacement or addendum to the random number generation in libbn |
| 16:58.22 | brlcad | just would need to be hidden behind a C api |
| 16:58.46 | starseeker | adds to todo list :-) This type of project deserves to be used |
| 16:59.57 | starseeker | that reminds me - I noticed there's a bu_hash in libbu, that doesn't seem to be tied to TCL - am I missing something? |
| 17:12.08 | ``Erik_ | why would it be tied to tcl? |
| 17:12.33 | starseeker | thought someone said our hash system was tied to tcl and needed to be untied - that we were using a tcl hash |
| 17:22.21 | brlcad | bu_hash's aren't used nearly as much as Tcl_Hash's iirc |
| 17:22.39 | brlcad | or more importantly, there are plenty of places that use tcl's hash |
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| 17:37.28 | ``Erik__ | yes. comcastic. |
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| 19:18.25 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33101 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/cmd.c: little less emphasis plus some cleanup |
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| 19:56.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33102 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: ws |
| 21:03.54 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33103 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: more ws, fine tuning |
| 21:06.42 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33104 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: about that time |
| 21:30.52 | ``Erik__ | farscape on fancast.com, good stuff... seems like there're 4.29 billion or so new video streaming sites lately O.o |
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| 16:06.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33105 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/image.c: better error message and readability |
| 16:19.47 | starseeker | brlcad: What point cloud format should I be looking for here? just an xyz file of points? |
| 16:40.08 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah |
| 16:46.54 | starseeker | how do I input this? I'm trying mged test.g in test.s pnts 6 4 < test.pnts but nothing is being created |
| 16:48.43 | starseeker | oh, nevermind - seg fault when I try it interactively |
| 16:52.23 | starseeker | grr |
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| 17:07.40 | starseeker | OK, I crafted a command that seems to function, and I end up with... a single sphere |
| 17:09.45 | brlcad | run l |
| 17:09.50 | brlcad | see what the values are |
| 17:10.10 | starseeker | erm. seg fault |
| 17:10.11 | brlcad | segfault on interactive? stack trace? |
| 17:10.37 | starseeker | hang on, let me try this again in gdb |
| 17:14.28 | starseeker | Here's the input command at least: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d364b1f41 |
| 17:17.27 | starseeker | and the crash on l test.s: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m7bef0bcf |
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| 18:44.23 | brlcad | starseeker: heh, you may very well have blown the bash command buffer |
| 18:44.33 | brlcad | sometimes have a limit of 64k |
| 18:44.51 | brlcad | a better way to test that is a here-now doc |
| 18:45.03 | brlcad | mged -c test.g <<EOF |
| 18:45.09 | brlcad | set glob_compat_mode 0 |
| 18:45.45 | brlcad | in test.s pnts 12495 1 0 `cat datafile` |
| 18:45.47 | brlcad | EOF |
| 18:46.14 | brlcad | there it becomes stdin input instead of argv data |
| 18:47.40 | brlcad | still shouldn't crash of course .. that needs fixing (and looks like a simple null dereferencing) |
| 18:53.01 | starseeker | is the one you've been using for testing available anywhere? |
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| 11:20.42 | mafm | hai pplz |
| 12:00.43 | AFK-claymore | Mornin! |
| 12:09.46 | claymore | has a titan to play with now... MUWAHAHAHAHAHA. |
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| 13:41.32 | claymore | brlcad: You in today? |
| 13:43.41 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33106 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: Print out what's in the result string. |
| 14:47.55 | brlcad | claymore: I take it you see your note |
| 14:48.14 | claymore | From Ed? |
| 14:48.18 | brlcad | yea |
| 14:48.29 | brlcad | or you asking for some other reason? |
| 14:48.35 | claymore | Yea, I was in for a bit on Friday. Took care of all that. |
| 14:49.05 | claymore | General BRLCAD coding questions ;) reading through libged, trying to get a handle on things. |
| 14:49.36 | brlcad | well ask away! :) |
| 14:49.43 | claymore | I have a good class layout for the GS, just need to start getting the specifics worked out now. |
| 14:50.09 | ``Erik_ | the blue pill |
| 14:50.42 | claymore | but, I need to see how deep the rabit hole goes. |
| 14:50.43 | ``Erik_ | if y ou just have the descriptor and want the handle, use fdopen() :D *duck* |
| 14:51.49 | claymore | get his 11 peice set and performs a rimshot... badoom ching. |
| 14:57.10 | ``Erik_ | interesting, http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d6384593 |
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| 15:14.15 | louipc | yeah tkhtml3 isn't installing in the brlcad directory |
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| 16:00.31 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33107 10/brlcad/trunk/ (19 files in 9 dirs): Moved g_qa functionality to libged. Port g_qa to windows. |
| 16:22.58 | clock_ | "you'll have enough sleep in the grave" - brlcad is a tough guy |
| 16:23.08 | clock_ | likes this reckless aggressive creativity |
| 16:28.46 | brlcad | doesn't think it's reckless |
| 16:29.40 | clock_ | Recklessness (psychology), a state of mind in which a persons acts without caring what the consequences may be |
| 16:29.45 | clock_ | Doesn't apply for this case>? |
| 16:35.23 | claymore | brlcad: When it comes to the Geometry Service: What had you invisioned for the in-memory representation of geometry? Using the existing c structs? |
| 16:35.55 | claymore | If so, would the svn store then be full of mini-.g files? |
| 16:35.57 | brlcad | claymore: yes, librt already manages geometry |
| 16:36.43 | brlcad | there's some value wrapping them in objects, but still the actual geometry still being via librt |
| 16:36.47 | claymore | I am trying to find the line between librt and a GeometryManager/CachManager is.... |
| 16:37.06 | claymore | CacheManager even. |
| 16:39.18 | brlcad | yeah, svn store consists of .g files broken out |
| 16:40.00 | claymore | Now, is that also a long term solution? Or would we want a slightly more efficient binary format for the geometry fragments in the svn store? |
| 16:40.58 | brlcad | for now it is, our format is actually really compact and efficient as it is |
| 16:41.30 | brlcad | doesn't get much more streamlined than a straight-up binary serialization of the exact data |
| 16:41.49 | claymore | Right, understood. I was just wondering how much could be gained by slimming down the header/footer for the future bin format... thats all ;) |
| 16:42.28 | brlcad | actually for long-term, there would likely be more benefits by using a more flexible non-binary backend store .. but that's a long ways out and would require a lot of testing |
| 16:42.47 | brlcad | current header/footer is like 100 *bytes* |
| 16:43.14 | claymore | pure wastefulness. tsk tsk. A byte is a byte no matter how small. ;) |
| 16:43.15 | brlcad | add a text attribute on an object and you use up more space than that |
| 16:44.05 | clock_ | PDP had like 9 bit bytes didn't |
| 16:45.23 | claymore | Different question then: Since I am relatively unfamiliar with librt, does librt contain the list/tree of db_internals or is that managed external to librt? |
| 16:47.54 | brlcad | I'm expecting our average "object" size to be around 1k for implicits, 10k for spline breps, and 100k for polygonal breps (includes attribute and revision changeset data) |
| 16:48.38 | brlcad | so the .1k wrapper isn't going to amount to much, less than 99% of the data being stored -- and if it is a problem, it can of course be looked into then |
| 16:54.59 | claymore | Different question then: Since I am relatively unfamiliar with librt, does librt contain the list/tree of db_internals or is that managed external to librt? |
| 16:57.38 | brlcad | no, it provides it -- when you open a .g file, you get back a "database instance" |
| 16:57.44 | claymore | 1k for implicits.... really? Are you talking on average? Seems to me that a sphere would be much smaller than 1k |
| 16:58.14 | brlcad | that dbi gives you a handle on a variety of routines, one being a "directory" that you can lookup |
| 16:58.36 | claymore | thinks. |
| 16:59.16 | claymore | I dunno how well that is going to translate to a the way I am envisioning the 'shared geometry' concepts... |
| 17:00.02 | claymore | .... perhaps the cachemanager will simply be holding an array/list/set of db instances? |
| 17:01.31 | brlcad | hm, it could but I didn't envision the GS talking much to librt directly |
| 17:01.48 | brlcad | almost entirely via libged and (even moreso) the GE |
| 17:02.36 | claymore | My current design is that the GE wraps up all of libged functionality and the GE also contains the GeometryManager |
| 17:03.08 | starseeker | ``Erik: You're specifying your tcl and tk in /usr/local - tkhtml3 is a tcl/tk package, so it's going to try to install in the "correct" place for tcl/tk packages on that system - I'm assuming that's the TEA behavior |
| 17:03.17 | claymore | the GeometryManager is what is doing all the caching and IO of the geomtery, regardless of its source or destination. |
| 17:03.34 | starseeker | as I understand it, that behavior is necessary for package require ... to function correctly |
| 17:03.35 | brlcad | that sounds reasonable |
| 17:04.51 | claymore | brlcad: now, besides the fact that we will be using libged, we will still need a way to store (cache) and correlate the bits of geometry so as to provide multi-user access. So, I am stuck on what data struct the GeometryManager (GeoMan) will be caching... db internals? |
| 17:05.52 | brlcad | Geometry objects -- enter data containers that GE needs to have |
| 17:05.59 | starseeker | growls at his email |
| 17:06.27 | brlcad | those geometry objects utilize db internals |
| 17:07.25 | claymore | starseeker: I think i figured out what was wrong with the way we were doing the email thing. Swing by and I think we can make it work! |
| 17:08.22 | claymore | brlcad: So a GeometryObject will: a) replace everthing a db internal has/can do, or b) have a db internal as an aggregate and just add some extra fields? |
| 17:08.42 | brlcad | some mix of b) and c) |
| 17:08.44 | starseeker | claymore: thanks! on my way |
| 17:09.19 | brlcad | it has a handle on the geometry via librt representation |
| 17:09.41 | brlcad | we might add extra fields, but all I/O should still be going through librt so I'm not sure they'd be extra |
| 17:10.40 | brlcad | two things that are useful to read up on are what's already in rt^3 for the geometry engine that daniel's worked on as well as what is in the jbrlcad module and how it structures object management |
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| 17:11.17 | brlcad | I've not been able to review daniel's latest work in detail, but what I've seen quickly looking has been good |
| 17:11.39 | brlcad | I have read john's jbrlcad layout in detail and *really* like it |
| 17:11.52 | brlcad | it's an outstanding OO organization of librt |
| 17:12.02 | brlcad | just incomplete |
| 17:12.12 | brlcad | and in the wrong language :) |
| 17:18.37 | claymore | brlcad: Okay, I looked at jbrlcad about a year ago, but I need to refresh my memory. I'll look at what daniel has done. |
| 17:19.48 | brlcad | from your perspective, I think the take-home point is just going to be that there's going to be "some" object that represents/links/is geometry and it is that object that you could cache |
| 17:19.58 | claymore | also, we will need a way to keep all the geomitry bits unique, so I was thinking of using a long for the OID... which we would have to piggyback as an attribute for now. |
| 17:20.43 | brlcad | yeah, something like that |
| 17:20.43 | claymore | understood, just trying to find the logical point in which to plan to so I am not re-creating work :/ |
| 17:20.52 | brlcad | though longs aren't probably going to be long enough for a UUID |
| 17:21.26 | brlcad | and UUID's are possibly/probably the way to go -- not that they'd get exposed at the GS level though |
| 17:21.52 | claymore | ... why not at the GS level? |
| 17:22.19 | claymore | oh, when I say long, I am referring to an int64 (sorry) |
| 17:23.55 | claymore | I am thinking that 18,446,744,073,709,551,615 unique peices of geometry should be enough.... don't you? |
| 17:24.32 | brlcad | one of the problems i'm hoping to resolve with the new geometry interfaces is having a unified handle system without having the problems of id->name mappings |
| 17:25.07 | brlcad | the difference between uuid's and urls and what they imply on referencing as a system of content management |
| 17:26.22 | claymore | not sure what you are trying to say besides: each geometry bit needs to be able to be universally and uniquely identified.... |
| 17:26.52 | brlcad | claymore: perhaps, but UUID's are 128-bit -- even less chance for collision and can be used as auto-generated hashes |
| 17:27.16 | brlcad | claymore: yeah, I'm saying that -- but there are ways you can do that |
| 17:27.28 | brlcad | take for example how regions are presently identified |
| 17:27.45 | brlcad | there is an integer that is attached to an object |
| 17:28.14 | claymore | What did you have in mind for the uuid control? Centralized worldwide server? or will the UUID's only be Unique and Universal inside the bounds of the an SVN store? |
| 17:28.16 | brlcad | that integer is then reported by our engine and referenced by the analysis codes to identify objects |
| 17:29.29 | claymore | stares in horror at his use of ingrish. |
| 17:29.31 | brlcad | don't need/want a centralized server for uuid's -- there are plenty of algorithms that allow for distributed ID generation |
| 17:31.31 | brlcad | even if you used purely random generation, the chance for collision is something on the order of 2^122 probability |
| 17:31.39 | claymore | Okay, back to my question of "why wouldn't the uuid be exposed at the GS level?" I don't see how it couldn't be exposed. If we are going to not want any ID<->Name mappings, then aren't we going to use the uuid as the sole means of object Lookup and Identification? |
| 17:31.56 | claymore | those are good odds ;) |
| 17:32.20 | brlcad | pretty damn good odds, and if there is a conflict, you'd probably know about it :) |
| 17:32.26 | brlcad | and you could just ask for another |
| 17:32.54 | brlcad | or you'd be just as likely to never run into the duplicate |
| 17:33.33 | brlcad | right, we'd either have to solely use UUID's as the sole means (when just isn't user friendly) or use the name as the sole means (which I'm much more inclined to sort out) |
| 17:34.27 | brlcad | sorting out a global resource identifier that localizes and can map 1-1 with a UUID on the backend (but only on the backend, e.g. svn-level) |
| 17:34.51 | claymore | Why not have the code use the UUID as the sole means while any User Interactive aspect just calls the MyGeoObject.getName() function and displays the string? |
| 17:35.24 | brlcad | that's entirely possible .. just less than ideal |
| 17:35.35 | brlcad | i mean it's the same problem of region idents now |
| 17:35.40 | brlcad | they were meant to be used that way |
| 17:35.43 | brlcad | but they're not |
| 17:35.59 | claymore | But region id's are not unique.... |
| 17:36.07 | brlcad | they crept into common use through most tools, exposed everywhere through the ui's |
| 17:36.08 | claymore | so, I think thats a different case. |
| 17:36.55 | brlcad | it is a different case, but the fact that there's a non 1-1 mapping is part of the problem |
| 17:37.40 | claymore | In existing BRLCAD databases, the string Name is unique, but the Region ID isn't. I am proposing that each bit of geometry has a UUID as its 'global' identifier and the Name is just an attribute to be accessed whenever needed. |
| 17:37.50 | brlcad | if the 1-1 problem is taken care of, then there's a lot less incentive for ui creeping |
| 17:38.55 | claymore | just to understand: the 1-1 problem is: We can have to things named 'Bolt' but with different UUIDs. |
| 17:39.10 | brlcad | right |
| 17:39.53 | brlcad | and I get what you're suggesting -- that's certainly doable, but it doesn't address the problem and has a lot to be desired for data management |
| 17:40.05 | claymore | Further: From a user perspective, the only way to ditinguish between both 'Bolt's is to look at the UUID... and thats the 'creep' you are speaking of? |
| 17:40.15 | brlcad | all I'm suggesting that'd be different, actually is a name that includes context so that the names are also unique |
| 17:40.41 | brlcad | right, that'd be one way |
| 17:40.48 | brlcad | there are other ways for that uuid to creep in |
| 17:41.28 | brlcad | but then if you can make the "name" actually include context (think URL context or namespace context in code) then you have a 1-1 mapping |
| 17:41.52 | claymore | Hrm, what about this: |
| 17:41.54 | brlcad | and possible don't even need the uuid, but it's a really efficient hash |
| 17:42.53 | claymore | Each and every peice of geometry will exist stand alone, but sorted into categories and subcategories. Think of a large parts wherehouse. |
| 17:44.47 | claymore | THe next werehouse over contains lots of 'parts lists' that refer to the individual parts in the first werehouse |
| 17:45.37 | claymore | so, a 'bolt' isnt a bolt, but rather: '/hardware/faseners/9.16th/3in/aluminum/bolt.g' |
| 17:46.08 | brlcad | that's exactly the url context I was referring to :) |
| 17:46.27 | claymore | well then.... GOOD IDEA ;) |
| 17:46.48 | brlcad | there are still problems to be solved with that, though |
| 17:47.02 | claymore | doesn't like the amount of effort it will take to populate the initial parts werehouse :/ |
| 17:47.02 | brlcad | uniqueness guarantees are a problem, but potentially minimized |
| 17:47.32 | claymore | problems like? |
| 17:50.23 | brlcad | well that works well for stuff that gets organized as such down the road, but for uniqueness you still want to be able to distinguish between my bolt and your bolt |
| 17:51.01 | brlcad | or even at a very basic level -- I make a sphere, you make a sphere -- how can I refer to one vs the other (and potentially still call them both 'sph') |
| 17:52.10 | brlcad | that's where the rest of a URL comes into the picture, there's an implicit username, working host, and port that are part of every url |
| 17:52.16 | claymore | but if each object that is checked into the parts werehouse is issued a UUID, then shouldn't that take care of the 'my /hardware/faseners/9.16th/3in/aluminum/bolt.g' vs 'your /hardware/faseners/9.16th/3in/aluminum/bolt.g' ? |
| 17:53.04 | brlcad | that would, but then it's not 1-1 and you are back to the same problem of having an insufficient context to distinguish objects |
| 17:55.49 | claymore | So, to capture yor thoughts, you are ideally thinking that a GeoObject will have a UUID for speed of lookup AND a UUname for easy human identification? |
| 17:55.51 | brlcad | it's not a huge issue, the problem has been pretty much solved for distributed cms and distributed scm's |
| 17:56.12 | brlcad | yeah, basically |
| 17:57.04 | claymore | Just to re-inforce my understanding.... |
| 17:57.56 | brlcad | even if only a portion of the UUname is displayed most of the time (e.g. "bolt" instead of "cad://loman@fe80::21b:63ff:fe03:3cdf%en1/hardware/faseners/9.16th/3in/aluminum/bolt") |
| 17:59.25 | claymore | Okay, I understand that. But how/where will the svn side look when its all checked in? Where will the username and host be stored? |
| 18:00.25 | claymore | in a /hardware/faseners/9.16th/3in/aluminum/versions.file' ? |
| 18:05.52 | brlcad | that's all TBD, but the UUID could be useful there |
| 18:06.13 | brlcad | e.g. using a non-hierarchical or simple two-level hierarchy instead of having the entire hierarchy on disk as a hierarchy (because it's technically not a hierarchy, it's a graph) |
| 18:07.57 | brlcad | I think that'll be more apparent once we start hooking in the svn libs |
| 18:09.15 | claymore | Hrm, okay. Got time for more Brain picking? |
| 18:10.50 | brlcad | is just coding, been coding non-stop since friday |
| 18:11.16 | brlcad | unfortunately in a non-compile state that entire time, or there would have been dozens of commits .. but just about to start the flow back up :) |
| 18:12.20 | claymore | far be it for me to slow your roll, but I'll keep firing Q's then ;) |
| 18:12.55 | brlcad | sings, "it's a small world" .. http://www.flickr.com/photos/36383814@N00/2989996039/sizes/o/in/pool-930035@N21/ |
| 18:15.37 | claymore | I see two troublemakers.... |
| 18:16.20 | louipc | wow that's trippy |
| 18:16.58 | claymore | actually feels like throwing up now. |
| 18:18.02 | claymore | not enough chicks imo. |
| 18:18.11 | brlcad | indeed |
| 18:18.16 | brlcad | http://www.flickr.com/photos/halostatue/2996087302/sizes/o/in/pool-930035@N21/ |
| 18:18.18 | claymore | wonders when he gets to go to a conference..... |
| 18:18.47 | brlcad | http://www.flickr.com/photos/halostatue/2996023060/sizes/o/in/pool-930035@N21/ |
| 18:20.18 | claymore | well hell, did you all do anything else besides take pictures?! |
| 18:22.01 | claymore | brlcad: where was that held? |
| 18:24.21 | brlcad | at the googleplex |
| 18:24.32 | brlcad | mountain view, CA |
| 18:24.53 | brlcad | there are a bunch of other pictures on flickr from others |
| 18:25.30 | brlcad | http://www.flickr.com/photos/tags/googlesummerofcode/ |
| 18:26.28 | brlcad | there are other better tags, but that's a jumping point |
| 18:28.17 | brlcad | http://www.flickr.com/groups/930035@N21/ |
| 18:29.05 | claymore | Looks like fun. Big of a sausage fest, but still fun :P |
| 18:29.16 | claymore | big = bit. |
| 18:29.35 | brlcad | yeah, huge sausage fest |
| 18:30.39 | brlcad | actually above industry average .. I think it was quoted as around 6% at the summit, but average for OSS is something like 2.5% |
| 18:31.27 | louipc | more guys into open source? |
| 18:31.40 | brlcad | yeah, a lot more |
| 18:31.55 | brlcad | average for CS is in the low teens iirc |
| 18:37.38 | *** join/#brlcad MB3 (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 18:37.42 | claymore | brlcad: Back to the GS: To simplify things, would making the .g file name the same as the object in it be a smart thing to do? aka Bolt.g has /Bolt.s inside it? |
| 18:39.05 | ``Erik_ | *burp* |
| 18:41.37 | brlcad | claymore: hm, why does that matter? :) |
| 18:42.19 | claymore | You're right. If we are going to do it stupid, we're going to do it MY WAY. MUWAHAHAHA. |
| 18:43.03 | claymore | Also, how are we going to represent combinations and regions? Text files? |
| 18:44.01 | brlcad | objects like all others, they way they presently are |
| 18:44.36 | claymore | I ment how in the svn repository? |
| 18:44.44 | brlcad | does too :) |
| 18:45.26 | brlcad | they have most of the same requirements as any other objects |
| 18:45.37 | claymore | so, a region will be its own .g, with no geometry in it? If thats the case, how do we link the Region members to the geometry, via the UUID or the UUName? |
| 18:47.03 | brlcad | it is "geometry", just potentially without an evaluated form (or maybe it does exist) |
| 18:47.56 | brlcad | they way it presently works is via locally scoped (file-scoped) name references -- that would have to change to a UUName |
| 18:48.45 | claymore | Will the current character-rules allow us to use all the characters in the 'url' in an BRL-CAD object name? |
| 18:50.09 | brlcad | oh, there may be some things that need slight changing, but there aren't any at the moment that jump out as being a problem |
| 18:51.30 | claymore | Okay. Now when it comes to the svn 'heirarchy' were you saying that there shouldn't be a heirarchy? I got confused with what you were saying. |
| 18:52.12 | brlcad | they get stored as plan c-strings, so pretty much anything goes at the storage level -- it'd only be places in the processing that might need to be changed |
| 18:52.28 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 18:52.50 | brlcad | there isn't exactly a geoemtry hierarchy, so representing geometry hierarchically in the revision store is problematic |
| 18:53.28 | brlcad | if we required a filestore that supported hard links of directories, that might be possible, or if we stash some form of soft links it might work |
| 18:53.47 | claymore | soft link? |
| 18:53.54 | brlcad | we talk about it as a hierarchy, but it's really an acyclic graph |
| 18:55.21 | claymore | 'what' is a dag? |
| 18:55.26 | brlcad | soft links are probably the way to go, just because it'll be really cool to check out entire subtree categories of geometry .. but it'll be tricky |
| 18:55.47 | brlcad | hm? |
| 18:56.00 | brlcad | directed acyclic graph .. |
| 18:56.09 | claymore | thinking heirarchially (is that a word?): |
| 18:56.23 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directed_acyclic_graph |
| 18:56.32 | claymore | I am seeing two top level groups: /parts and /models |
| 18:56.59 | claymore | inside parts are mere organizational subdirectories... as many as are needed. |
| 18:57.16 | claymore | at the bottom level of the /parts 'tree' are the actual .g files. |
| 18:57.29 | claymore | and all the vairous versions of individual .g files. |
| 18:57.37 | brlcad | the line between parts and models is really context-driven |
| 18:57.44 | claymore | exactly. |
| 18:57.59 | mafm | I go home, take care |
| 18:58.56 | brlcad | for one domain, it's one level, for another it's entirely different -- so I'm really not inclined to say "that line is here" in the geometry or even to prescribe an organization -- that can be up to users to a large extent |
| 18:59.26 | claymore | now inside '/models' are all the subdirectorys to organize however the 'company in question' wants to organize it. |
| 18:59.28 | brlcad | from a geometry management perspective, the issues worth tracking are when something goes from being a shape to representing something solid |
| 18:59.48 | brlcad | and whether the geometry is fully-resolved, fully-constrained, etc |
| 19:01.44 | claymore | the problem is, I see a 'chicken or the egg' scenario here. We can't fully abstract the data store methodolgy. There has to be some standards set down. |
| 19:02.19 | brlcad | "We can't fully abstract the data store methodolgy" .. means what? |
| 19:02.29 | brlcad | we're using a fully abstracted data store for the revision control |
| 19:02.56 | brlcad | so by default that would extend to us, we only constrain it on our end via what we support or don't support |
| 19:03.05 | claymore | is thinking... |
| 19:04.48 | claymore | Okay, Understanding that SVN will do whatever we want... |
| 19:05.24 | claymore | and that we intend to store Combination.g's Region.g's and Solid.g's |
| 19:05.46 | claymore | in what ever heirarchy we want. |
| 19:05.48 | brlcad | don't think of them in that regard -- they're just "objects" |
| 19:05.55 | brlcad | we have geometry objects and non-geometry objects |
| 19:06.30 | brlcad | those objects become files (or maybe directories) in the revision store |
| 19:07.14 | brlcad | but yeah, any hierarchy or non-hierarhy we want -- I mean we could store absolutely everything in one massive .g file, all revisions, all data, and that would actually work |
| 19:07.29 | brlcad | it's just unclean and would be ill-constructed (particularly for revision tracking) |
| 19:07.42 | claymore | BrlcadObj is the abstract then. GeoObj isa BrlcadObj, NonGeoObj isa BrlcadObj, Comb isa GeoObj, etc, etc... |
| 19:08.35 | brlcad | s/Brlcad/Database/ I believe is how it's been referred to thusfar |
| 19:08.54 | brlcad | but yeah, sorta |
| 19:09.12 | brlcad | that's where a lot of that is already sorted out (or at least should be sorted out) on the GE side of things |
| 19:09.13 | claymore | ' s/Brlcad/Database/' = ??? |
| 19:09.31 | brlcad | ah, s/// is a substitution pattern :) |
| 19:09.42 | brlcad | substitute this for that |
| 19:10.03 | claymore | you just lost me. |
| 19:10.07 | brlcad | echo "substitute this for that" | sed 's/this/that/' |
| 19:10.12 | brlcad | substitute that for that |
| 19:10.31 | claymore | got that, just failing to see how it applied :/ |
| 19:10.58 | brlcad | common ircism -- means referring to some previous statement, apply the replacement |
| 19:11.20 | ``Erik_ | vi ftw |
| 19:11.30 | claymore | is fixing the train of thought derailment in is head.... one moment please :) |
| 19:11.33 | brlcad | your statement in that case -- they've been referred to as DatabaseObject's |
| 19:12.00 | claymore | who reffered to them as that? |
| 19:12.01 | brlcad | there's little value in using our name over saying what we think it is |
| 19:12.10 | brlcad | librt refers to them as that |
| 19:12.47 | claymore | ah, okay. |
| 19:12.56 | brlcad | jbrlcad does as well, don't recall whether daniel preserved that |
| 19:13.05 | claymore | where is daniels work? |
| 19:13.56 | brlcad | just saying from a nomenclature perspective, really should avoid pronouns in the name where they describe a more general concept |
| 19:14.42 | brlcad | that's a general point of rule for any system really, they usually end up being turds or opaque objects an external viewer |
| 19:14.47 | ``Erik_ | class Thing :: Stuff { |
| 19:14.54 | brlcad | e.g. our few "MUVES" routines in librt.. very turdish |
| 19:15.21 | brlcad | there is an underlying concept that they represent, that should have been used to name them instead of "the way those guys do it" |
| 19:16.57 | brlcad | thinks he should push a tarball before merging his changes |
| 19:17.08 | claymore | okay, back on track: Pertaining to the svn store, if all the combination and region objects contain references to other UUNames (aka fully qualified paths) then is it still a dag? |
| 19:17.28 | claymore | reword: |
| 19:17.39 | claymore | okay, back on track: Pertaining to the svn store, if all the combination and region objects contain references to other objects via UUNames (aka fully qualified paths) then is it still a dag? |
| 19:18.29 | brlcad | yep, it still represents the same thing |
| 19:19.34 | claymore | recap: Svn lookup should be via the UUName but inmemory referencing should be via the UUID for speed? |
| 19:19.56 | brlcad | CSG construction is (usually) inherintly described by a DAG, when can be restructured or displayed as a tree, even a binary tree -- but they're non-unique nodes |
| 19:21.12 | brlcad | probably, but i don't think that's a decision that has to be made now really |
| 19:21.19 | brlcad | just more designing it such that the user never has to see/know that there's a UUID as a constraint |
| 19:22.02 | brlcad | solving local naming (i.e. UUnames) for the usability aspects |
| 19:22.22 | brlcad | and then using UUIDs where it makes sense (for performance or ease of management, etc) |
| 19:24.18 | claymore | where is Daniels GE work? |
| 19:24.29 | brlcad | he checked it in |
| 19:25.06 | claymore | brlcad, rt^3 ? |
| 19:25.11 | brlcad | yes |
| 19:27.26 | claymore | just not used to the layout of directories yet... difficult to see where one aspect starts and the other stops.... |
| 19:28.21 | brlcad | it's not cleaned up yet, it's rather lacking unification |
| 19:29.53 | brlcad | it's common "nibm"itiz .. everyone that's been committing has been ignoring what everyone else does |
| 19:36.50 | claymore | needs caffine..... |
| 19:40.03 | claymore | In relation to the GS: Could you compare/contrast a single proces, multithreaded approach to a multiprocess approach? |
| 19:41.27 | brlcad | for what we're doing, the difference is pretty insignficant (and if either is done well, it becomes even less important) |
| 19:41.59 | brlcad | multiprocess is easier to stab up on *nix platforms, but interprocess communication is a pita |
| 19:42.54 | brlcad | multithreaded is easier to intercommunicate if needed and better for portability, but can quickly get mired in deadlock and obscure bugs |
| 19:47.00 | brlcad | pervasive multithreaded is usually *very* hard to do well and even harder to maintain, high-level parallelism is usually a lot easier to manage over a long haul |
| 19:49.03 | claymore | if you had a choice, whats yoru pick? |
| 19:55.03 | brlcad | high-level parallelism where it's useful, where you have fairly independent tasks |
| 19:56.04 | brlcad | if it's high-level, it doesn't really matter if you use threads or forked processes |
| 19:56.29 | brlcad | e.g. bu_parallel is meant for such a level of parallelism during ray-tracing |
| 19:57.08 | brlcad | the backend implementation uses both threads and procs, depending on the platform, performance, simplicity, etc |
| 20:07.23 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33108 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: Turn init routines for the older tcl interfaces back on for now. |
| 20:20.58 | claymore | what is the advantage to having both db internal and db external structs? |
| 20:22.37 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33109 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libgcv/: ignore generated files/dirs |
| 20:23.55 | brlcad | external is fully serialized, 1-1 mapping with disk data |
| 20:24.30 | brlcad | internal is uncracked just enough to serve as an object directory so you can see what is on disk |
| 20:25.00 | brlcad | big impact on performance |
| 20:25.00 | claymore | so External is a 'bookmark' of sorts? |
| 20:25.15 | brlcad | mm, doesn't sound right |
| 20:25.28 | brlcad | more of an opaque bag of bytes |
| 20:25.43 | claymore | can a dbExternal write to disk? |
| 20:26.05 | brlcad | i don't know what you're looking at |
| 20:26.25 | brlcad | in general for librt, though, a db_external is (exactly) what is written to disk |
| 20:26.46 | claymore | I am correlating jBrlcad with brlcad |
| 20:27.25 | brlcad | it only correlates with (a small portion) of librt, but okay :) |
| 20:27.53 | claymore | So in an OO setting, a DB_external *could* write itself to disk, but in straight C, something writes the the db_external to disk. |
| 20:28.08 | brlcad | right |
| 20:28.34 | brlcad | librt being procedural and data-driven, there are structures and collections of routines that work on those structures and go to/from other structures |
| 20:28.53 | brlcad | so there are a slew of routines that deal with db_externals .. and another set that deal with db_internals |
| 20:30.39 | claymore | I am just wondering, in an OO setting like jBrlcad, wouldn't it make sense to combine db_internals and db_externals? They are very close to being the same.... |
| 20:33.29 | brlcad | they're just as close to being the same on the procedural side |
| 20:33.38 | brlcad | being OO doesn't change that one bit |
| 20:34.31 | claymore | okay.. regardless, wouldn't it simplifiy things a bit? |
| 20:34.54 | brlcad | removing functionality usually does |
| 20:35.24 | claymore | how would merging the two structs remove functionality? |
| 20:36.31 | brlcad | well, let me ask you -- why do you suppose the effort would have been taken to separate them out in the first place? |
| 20:38.05 | claymore | I don't know, thats why I am asking you. They could have been seperate by design from the begining and have just never been refactored due to time required... |
| 20:39.11 | brlcad | nah, v5 databases are the fifth major refactoring of the geometry I/O layer |
| 20:39.44 | brlcad | the performance impact is really substantial, you only unpack exactly what is needed when you need it |
| 20:40.40 | claymore | So, at any given time, there is a db_internal instance and a db_external instance for every object in the db? |
| 20:40.41 | brlcad | the alternate is usually unpacking everything or storing data unserialized |
| 20:41.26 | brlcad | no, internals only if they're actively being used for something |
| 20:42.04 | claymore | ah, now *that* makes sense. thanks ;) |
| 20:42.19 | brlcad | externals are the pointers to the disk records |
| 20:42.52 | brlcad | and can actually be the exact bytes on disk, you could memory map a file, point some pointers to the data, and they'll be valid externals |
| 20:45.34 | claymore | has thought/learned himself into a headache. Time for home. |
| 20:45.37 | claymore | lata |
| 20:45.42 | brlcad | cya! |
| 20:54.18 | starseeker | brlcad: Are you building a release tarball? |
| 20:54.35 | starseeker | doesn't know if he should commit more man1 pages right now... |
| 21:01.50 | ``Erik_ | three hundred forty undecillion two hundred eighty-two decillion three hundred sixty-six nonillion nine hundred twenty octillion nine hundred thirty-eight septillion four hundred sixty-three sextillion four hundred sixty-three quintillion three hundred seventy-four quadrillion six hundred seven trillion four hundred thirty-one billion seven hundred sixty-eight million two hundred eleven thousand four hundred and fifty-six is sufficient, |
| 21:02.17 | starseeker | sufficient what? hard disk space? |
| 21:02.30 | ``Erik_ | unique pieces of geometry |
| 21:02.36 | starseeker | ah |
| 21:05.44 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-69-135.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:16.23 | brlcad | starseeker: trying to |
| 21:16.27 | brlcad | doing testing now |
| 21:18.31 | starseeker | OK - should I hold commits for a bit? |
| 21:19.59 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33110 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (conv/dxf/ libgcv/): more ignores |
| 21:20.34 | brlcad | starseeker: ideally |
| 21:20.36 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33111 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/: ignore metaball product |
| 21:20.41 | starseeker | ok |
| 21:20.45 | starseeker | will do |
| 21:20.47 | brlcad | unless they're cleanup/fixes |
| 21:20.55 | starseeker | did you suck in bob's g_qa changes? |
| 21:21.11 | brlcad | yeah :/ |
| 21:21.15 | brlcad | had to start all over |
| 21:21.41 | starseeker | that should probably be a NEWS item unless you want to back up to the revision before that |
| 21:21.51 | starseeker | apparently he ported it to Windows |
| 21:22.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33112 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/: ignore Makefile |
| 21:22.57 | brlcad | depends if the tests pass |
| 21:45.17 | brlcad | aaand, fail |
| 21:45.23 | brlcad | gqa crashes |
| 21:45.28 | brlcad | fails basic regression test |
| 22:13.36 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14FC70.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:15.40 | brlcad | sighs |
| 22:43.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33113 10/brlcad/trunk/ (18 files in 9 dirs): revert the g_qa port to windows and addition to g_qa until after this release (revert r33107). it's crashing and infinite looping on at least Mac and Linux (and the regression tests are epic fail). |
| 23:03.54 | ``Erik_ | http://fc47.deviantart.com/fs14/f/2007/005/e/0/The_Simpsonzu_by_spacecoyote.jpg O.o |
| 23:11.44 | ``Erik | do we guarantee acyclicity of the graph? O.o |
| 23:38.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33114 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/wdb.c: wdb_fflush is unnecessary. all db io operations are automatically flushed all the time after every db_write and during db_close. |
| 23:39.34 | ``Erik_ | poo |
| 02:12.16 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 02:12.53 | *** join/#brlcad cad13 (n=7c832c0f@66.111.56.50) | |
| 02:54.39 | brlcad | starseeker: did you do an svn cp last time you sync'd to stable? |
| 03:45.37 | starseeker | I believe so |
| 03:45.50 | starseeker | the tree was too diverged for any sort of sane sync |
| 04:00.55 | yukonbob | hello, cadheds |
| 04:00.57 | yukonbob | *heads |
| 04:25.28 | ``Erik_ | <-- rubs his wallet cheek :( |
| 04:25.32 | ``Erik_ | I ordered a new macbook |
| 04:26.48 | Ralith | ouch |
| 04:28.20 | ``Erik_ | the last hackintop I bought lasted me ~6 years, hopefully this does the same |
| 04:31.27 | yukonbob | oO |
| 04:31.43 | yukonbob | thought ``Erik_ was a core *BSD user... |
| 04:33.33 | ``Erik_ | MacOSX is a fbsd userland glued ontop of a MACH microkenrel |
| 04:33.37 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 04:36.45 | Ralith | except for the completely alien GUI and administrative tools and daemons and configuration system and ... |
| 04:36.46 | Ralith | :D |
| 04:38.57 | ``Erik_ | yeah... yeah... *shrug* |
| 04:39.41 | ``Erik_ | sure beats the alternatives,t hough, I mean, osX is far better than leenewx or *shudder* winderz |
| 04:39.58 | Ralith | <3 freebsd |
| 04:40.10 | Ralith | osx is pretty shiny though, I'll give you that |
| 04:40.21 | starseeker | go gentoo - bsd like package control, and all the pretty poorly written stuff works too :-) |
| 04:40.53 | ``Erik_ | um, sorry, cliff, I involved myself in kernel development at one point... |
| 04:41.02 | ``Erik_ | no matter how much you dress up a linux, it's still a linux :( |
| 04:41.22 | starseeker | heh |
| 04:41.28 | starseeker | still doing kernel stuff? |
| 04:42.14 | ``Erik_ | I think one of the reasons I like the BSD's so much is that they're fairly strict... if you write on BSD, it 'just works' on solaris, linux, hpux, aix, etc... if you write on linux, well, it works on, uh, some versions of linux... that's it... |
| 04:42.49 | ``Erik_ | um, been a couple weeks since I've poked at kernelstuff, but I saw something this evening that makes me want to go back with a vengence |
| 04:42.53 | Ralith | my gripe with gentoo was, aside from the generic linux kernel issues, the package management was a breakage-prone ports-wannabe. |
| 04:43.18 | starseeker | really? I've had pretty good luck with it |
| 04:43.33 | ``Erik_ | see, that's the problem, dude... "good luck" with it... |
| 04:43.43 | ``Erik_ | the bsd poirt system is just fucking there, goddamnit |
| 04:43.49 | starseeker | heh |
| 04:44.05 | ``Erik_ | macports is driving me up the wall being 99.9% ok, it's TOO SHITTY |
| 04:44.22 | yukonbob | [hearts] NetBSD |
| 04:44.27 | ``Erik_ | the notion that anything could fail... ever... drives me buggy |
| 04:45.08 | Ralith | ``Erik_, re: portage, exactly! |
| 04:45.19 | Ralith | ports only breaks things if you ask it to ^^ |
| 04:46.23 | starseeker | <snort> ``Erik, so you really want a working Coyotos? http://www.coyotos.org/ |
| 04:46.36 | yukonbob | finds FreeBSD ports a bit fragile compared to NetBSD pkgsrc, but still likes ports... but I've had great success w/ Debian dpkg too, so... |
| 04:46.54 | Ralith | coyotos is really neat looking |
| 04:47.12 | Ralith | I wish there was some sort of standardized ABI for device drivers so it was practical to use research OSs like that :( |
| 04:48.07 | ``Erik_ | debian tends to be solid, but insanely obsolete... haven't tried netbsd *shrug* |
| 04:48.37 | Ralith | NetBSD was pretty tempting |
| 04:48.53 | starseeker | did an ask slashdot about graphics drivers some time back - apparently the problem is they like sticking low level logic into the kernel driver, because it saves them chip complexity |
| 04:48.55 | Ralith | but FreeBSD's hardware support was moreso. |
| 04:49.00 | yukonbob | NetBSD just branched 5... |
| 04:49.22 | Ralith | I'm on a laptop so I can't muck about with iffy hardware support |
| 04:49.39 | yukonbob | Ralith: what kind of hardware are you worried about? |
| 04:49.54 | starseeker | hunts slashdot archives... |
| 04:50.07 | ``Erik_ | nvidia does that, starseeker, and until about ten years ago, that was an issue for fbsd... |
| 04:50.10 | Ralith | yukonbob, well, laptopness aside, 3D accel is a huge bonus. |
| 04:50.17 | ``Erik_ | then nvidia started pushing out fbsddrivers... heh |
| 04:50.20 | Ralith | and nvidia supports freebsd, so ^^ |
| 04:50.46 | ``Erik_ | I think I've forced nvidias hand a couple times, both as a driver writer for the earlier ones and as a whiney consumer for the later ones |
| 04:50.48 | starseeker | ``Erik: heh |
| 04:51.02 | Ralith | cool! |
| 04:51.17 | starseeker | ah, yes - http://ask.slashdot.org/askslashdot/06/07/30/0013241.shtml |
| 04:51.20 | yukonbob | Ralith: ya -- I think if you're nVidia, you're windows/linux/freebsd/mac os x.... |
| 04:51.34 | Ralith | anyone know if nvidia's planning on following AMD with the whole opening the specs thing? |
| 04:51.39 | yukonbob | net/open/dragonfly, etc are currently out of luck... |
| 04:51.58 | yukonbob | otherwise, even Open has accellerated X these days (for Intel, ATI, etc.) |
| 04:52.01 | starseeker | Ralith: I've heard no sign of it |
| 04:52.11 | Ralith | aw. |
| 04:52.20 | starseeker | and I don't think the really critical ATI stuff is out yet, is it? |
| 04:52.27 | starseeker | may have missed another one... |
| 04:52.33 | Ralith | I'm not sure |
| 04:52.37 | Ralith | but if it isn't, it's coming, right? |
| 04:52.50 | starseeker | theoretically |
| 04:52.56 | Ralith | they released the 2D docs |
| 04:53.04 | starseeker | unless management changes before they get it released... |
| 04:53.09 | Ralith | :/ |
| 04:53.19 | Ralith | it's an awfully big PR deal for it to be pulled back |
| 04:54.49 | starseeker | never undestimates the capacity of corporate american managers for stupidity |
| 04:55.02 | Ralith | oh well. |
| 04:55.18 | yukonbob | s/american// |
| 04:55.23 | Ralith | d'ya think larabee will be portable? |
| 04:55.34 | starseeker | more probable, in this case, is the lawyers putting up N roadblocks |
| 04:55.38 | starseeker | where N is large |
| 04:55.41 | Ralith | yeah |
| 04:55.44 | Ralith | but finite. |
| 04:55.57 | Ralith | is hopeful. |
| 04:56.14 | Ralith | however, if Intel succeeds in changing the game, their history of good support is pretty encouraging |
| 04:56.21 | starseeker | true |
| 04:56.38 | starseeker | would consider an opengraphics card, even if it's not "state of the art" |
| 04:56.56 | Ralith | games, so performance is pretty important |
| 04:57.09 | starseeker | as long as it can do bzflag ;-) |
| 04:57.12 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:57.16 | Ralith | bzflag angers me |
| 04:57.29 | Ralith | the physics are too simple and it's too easy to die |
| 04:58.42 | starseeker | gets killed regardless of the physics |
| 04:59.35 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:59.49 | Ralith | now nethack |
| 04:59.50 | Ralith | there's a good game. |
| 05:00.34 | starseeker | never fell prey to nethack |
| 05:02.20 | yukonbob | isn't there an annual nethack competition underway right now? |
| 05:03.47 | Ralith | starseeker, learn it! |
| 05:03.49 | Ralith | it is amazing. |
| 05:04.09 | Ralith | yukonbob, Iunno, I'm not nearly good enough to compete. |
| 05:04.19 | Ralith | I've never even made it to sokoban. |
| 05:04.42 | Ralith | I've had awesome fun wrecking the gnomish mines though |
| 05:04.56 | Ralith | I've even killed shopkeepers ^^ |
| 05:05.24 | starseeker | doesn't have enough time for the things he wants to do now - nethack would be fatal! ;-) |
| 05:05.47 | Ralith | nethack is turnbased! It is incapable of consuming more time than you grant it. |
| 05:06.07 | yukonbob | yup -- 10th annual International Nethack Tournament at nethack.devnull.net.... |
| 05:09.33 | starseeker | looks forward to presidential election being done with |
| 05:10.18 | starseeker | Ralith: Isn't nethack the program that spawned the famous "Thank you for the newest release of gradewrecker..." comment? |
| 05:10.45 | Ralith | never heard about that |
| 05:11.09 | brlcad | word. |
| 05:11.27 | yukonbob | dude. |
| 05:11.46 | Ralith | looks like it. |
| 05:12.00 | starseeker | Thank you for the latest release of gradewrecker. My GPA just went in the corner and shot itself. |
| 05:12.04 | starseeker | -- USENET posting, author unknown |
| 05:12.13 | starseeker | on nethack.org homepage :-) |
| 05:12.29 | Ralith | but you know what's cooler than nethack |
| 05:12.32 | Ralith | slashem. |
| 05:12.48 | Ralith | it's basically nethack-CURRENT except more experimental ^^ |
| 05:13.02 | Ralith | also harder to beat. |
| 05:13.04 | starseeker | brlcad: Anything I can help with? saw the g_qa revert, did that do it? |
| 05:13.12 | starseeker | Ralith: wow |
| 05:13.22 | starseeker | that's scary |
| 05:13.36 | Ralith | I've been playing as a doppleganger monk |
| 05:13.51 | brlcad | starseeker: I'm working on the merge now |
| 05:14.01 | Ralith | I usually die when I hit level 10, polymorph into a dragon, and overestimate my uberness >_> |
| 05:14.26 | brlcad | starseeker: you can probably help test stable after it's merged |
| 05:14.38 | starseeker | ok |
| 05:34.01 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 07:44.12 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 08:18.09 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:24.22 | brlcad | that took way way too long |
| 08:27.23 | clock_ | brlcad: who are you for, I am for the President from Hawaii :) |
| 08:29.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33115 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (2215 files in 427 dirs): |
| 08:29.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: big ultra mega merge from r32275 to r33114 (HEAD on trunk) in preparation for |
| 08:29.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: the pending 7.14.0 source release. that was absurdly painful to merge, diff, |
| 08:29.13 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: and repair by hand. this is untested (compilation-wise) but it should sync it |
| 08:29.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: with 33114 which has been tested. |
| 08:30.22 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33116 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: today is release day, stamp the news |
| 08:31.16 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33117 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/MINOR: and it shall be 14, so sayeth we all |
| 08:37.57 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33118 10/brlcad/trunk/ChangeLog: update changelog to all changes from 2008-08-19 through today on trunk |
| 08:38.58 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33119 10/brlcad/trunk/HACKING: HEAD revision needs to come first on the svn2cl command so that the entries are in stack order (with latest on top like NEWS file |
| 08:56.46 | brlcad | notes that tkhtml3 presently fails on solaris |
| 08:57.07 | brlcad | er, bsd -- wrong system |
| 08:57.30 | brlcad | just missing headers, insignificant |
| 09:07.53 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33120 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: turn it into a simple .c.o rule without the dependency for bsd make portability |
| 09:14.56 | AFK-claymore | yawns |
| 09:15.10 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33121 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: wow, and it's not even valid. the libraries rule is missing. stub an empty one. |
| 09:15.25 | brlcad | throws a cheeto in AFK-claymore's mouth |
| 09:25.24 | claymore | nom nom nom nom nom's |
| 09:26.08 | claymore | Unfortuneately, cheetos are on my list of fav's. |
| 09:27.39 | claymore | Well, looks like tonights TV is shot :/ |
| 09:30.52 | brlcad | unfortunately? |
| 09:31.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33122 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (5 files in 3 dirs): merge 33114:33121 from trunk, preparing for release |
| 09:31.05 | brlcad | cheetos rock |
| 09:31.54 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 09:33.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33123 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: include libgcv in the dist for release |
| 09:35.42 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33124 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: minimerge |
| 09:35.56 | claymore | brlcad: Hows the congestion? |
| 09:36.33 | brlcad | better |
| 09:37.13 | claymore | good deal. You @work or @home? |
| 09:37.56 | brlcad | home, I'll be in later today .. maybe get a couple hours rest for good measure just to make sure it's gone |
| 09:38.11 | brlcad | as soon as I tag this release at least |
| 09:38.22 | claymore | rock on. Take two cheetos and get some rest. ;) |
| 09:38.36 | claymore | Peace, I out. Gonna get my breakfast on. |
| 09:39.33 | brlcad | spent hours fighting a merge only to realize several hours into it that I was doing it wrong .. which is what caused hundreds of conflicts and errors that I went manually fixing |
| 09:39.37 | brlcad | suckage |
| 09:39.48 | brlcad | my suck |
| 09:40.09 | brlcad | oh well, it's all coming together now at least |
| 09:44.26 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33125 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/sh/cmakecheck.sh: look for libgcv files too |
| 09:45.38 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33126 10/brlcad/trunk/sh/cmakecheck.sh: look for libgcv cmake files too |
| 09:47.23 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33127 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-14-0/: tag release 7.14.0 |
| 09:49.47 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33128 10/brlcad/trunk/ (README include/conf/PATCH): bump to 7.14.1 immediately after tagging, back to dev revision. anticipate next release as 7.14.2 |
| 11:29.47 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 11:31.19 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:31.59 | mafm | hi |
| 11:35.57 | claymore | hai! |
| 11:46.20 | claymore | huh, this looks pretty cool: http://atlantica.ndoorsgames.com/ |
| 12:07.40 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-212-221.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 12:33.53 | claymore | what *is* rt^3 exactly? |
| 12:37.57 | claymore | nm |
| 12:45.14 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D869.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:02.52 | ``Erik_ | heh |
| 13:03.06 | claymore | Mernin Erik. |
| 13:03.09 | ``Erik_ | if anyone is still wondering, it was a trivial raytracer written to explore the 'agile' development method |
| 13:03.31 | claymore | rt^3? |
| 13:03.40 | ``Erik_ | I believe so... top level in the svn repo? |
| 13:03.48 | ``Erik_ | dates should all read, um, '03 |
| 13:04.09 | claymore | yeah. Agile eh? looks more like an unorganized, steaming pile of.... code. |
| 13:04.56 | ``Erik_ | :D well, some folk were saying "this RIVA thing sounds important, waterfall is epic fail, what can we do better? "agile" is buzzy, lets see how it works" |
| 13:06.39 | mafm | claymore: my project is in there |
| 13:06.46 | ``Erik_ | hrm |
| 13:06.56 | ``Erik_ | ohh, that's right, you hijacked that toplevel |
| 13:07.05 | mafm | a viewer with opengl, 3D |
| 13:07.07 | ``Erik_ | forgot about that, sorry :) |
| 13:07.20 | mafm | the ^3 part is supposed to be because of that |
| 13:07.37 | claymore | mafm: right, been looking at your code. Good stuff btw ;) |
| 13:07.39 | mafm | but I don't know the original purpose of that module |
| 13:07.40 | ``Erik_ | unless I'm thinking about another project, which might be possible |
| 13:07.55 | ``Erik_ | I thought it was rt^3, might be lrt or something |
| 13:07.56 | ``Erik_ | :/ |
| 13:08.01 | ``Erik_ | I'm old, my memory is shot :D |
| 13:08.06 | mafm | there's somebody making a geometry server/service in there, davidsomething |
| 13:08.15 | ``Erik_ | david blows-men ? |
| 13:08.20 | ``Erik_ | loman? |
| 13:08.24 | mafm | think so |
| 13:08.29 | ``Erik_ | yeah, he's a prick |
| 13:08.37 | ``Erik_ | you should totally kick his ass, mafm :D |
| 13:08.38 | claymore | I am just trying to figure out a place for my project to rest/start in.... wondering if I should start a new top level or re-organize rt^3... |
| 13:08.42 | mafm | why? :) |
| 13:08.42 | claymore | lol |
| 13:08.47 | ``Erik_ | cuz he's claymore |
| 13:08.49 | ``Erik_ | *point* |
| 13:08.53 | claymore | hides |
| 13:09.02 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 13:09.04 | isnotclaymore | :D |
| 13:09.34 | ``Erik_ | (what's the phrase? "outed"? sorry, dude :) |
| 13:09.58 | mafm | hmm |
| 13:10.02 | claymore | ratted out more likely |
| 13:10.21 | claymore | mafm: Your work is for a protoype GUI for the next gen BRL-CAD, correct? |
| 13:10.30 | mafm | so if claymore is David Loman, he should already know what rt^3 is for, I guess :) |
| 13:10.38 | claymore | kinda. |
| 13:10.48 | ``Erik_ | I think the geometry server effort will radically change the approach to geometry creation, and may be massively significant for geometry translation |
| 13:10.51 | claymore | I know what its being used for NOW, but there seems to be some legacy code in there |
| 13:11.00 | mafm | it's supposed to be a GUI, thin client for using a geometry service, using libged as backend |
| 13:11.15 | ``Erik_ | knowing the history and legacy is radically different than knowing what is going on now |
| 13:11.37 | louipc | geometry server eh? |
| 13:11.51 | claymore | I know, but there is this unsung rule in OS that if you move/delete legacy code, you get vegatables thrown at you. |
| 13:12.00 | ``Erik_ | I think it's important to explore that history, but I've become a nut about history and archeology, so I may be weird |
| 13:12.18 | ``Erik_ | VCS lets you clean without expunging history |
| 13:12.23 | claymore | well you *are* wierd, but that has no bearing on the current topic of discussion :P |
| 13:13.18 | claymore | I am working on a high level UML layout of the 'GeometryService' right now... but I think, after many lengthy discussions with Sean, that its grown past a 'GeometryServer' |
| 13:13.30 | ``Erik_ | it's all revision controlled and if crap that shouldn't be there is lingering, delete it... it's in the repo *shrug* :) my personal take, so'z don't hold me to that |
| 13:13.59 | claymore | writes down "Erik said to..." |
| 13:14.34 | ``Erik_ | do you have plans to move your effort into the brlcad module? |
| 13:14.51 | ``Erik_ | or are you content with the dependancy chain? |
| 13:16.24 | ``Erik_ | ordered a mac last night, feels poor :( |
| 13:16.58 | claymore | Erik: I dunno, thats my problem... its not rt^3, its not brlcad....so where do I put it? |
| 13:17.50 | ``Erik_ | if you think it's appropriate, you can always make a new toplevle |
| 13:17.55 | ``Erik_ | I did with rtcmp |
| 13:18.36 | ``Erik_ | I'll probably put the gui chunk of twingy's ISST in as a top-level, since I don't want to induce a GTK+ dependancy into BRL-CAD |
| 13:18.42 | mafm | I think that rt3 became the shed for all this experimental/new stuff |
| 13:18.53 | ``Erik_ | and move the MySQL stuff out of BRL-CAD and into the ISST bit |
| 13:20.28 | ``Erik_ | I'm feeling like my "zomfg, stop talking to [stop]" statement failed :/ |
| 13:21.06 | claymore | Erik: Whats the specs on your Mac? |
| 13:21.28 | ``Erik_ | base line new macbook, 4g ram, dvi dongle, and carrying case |
| 13:21.41 | claymore | Erik: Swing my my office sometime so I can bounce a few questions off ya>? |
| 13:21.59 | ``Erik_ | thinking down the road, I might be a 750gb drive to slap in, but don't need that yet... the 2.0ghz cpu should be plenty, and the nvidia 9400m should be permissable |
| 13:22.09 | ``Erik_ | 'k, it'll be a bit, I'm still at home |
| 13:22.23 | ``Erik_ | going to swing by the voter thingy, then cruise in and work a late day |
| 13:24.23 | claymore | nice. About the politics thing: I honestly stopped liking either of them a long time ago, I am just very eager to see how this whole thing plays out.... that and i really want those stupid waste-of-my-life commercials to go away... |
| 13:24.41 | claymore | mafm: yeah, I think rt^3 is the sandbox ;) |
| 13:24.43 | ``Erik_ | are you voting after work? |
| 13:25.04 | ``Erik_ | mebbe we'll have a nice big lunch tomorrow and we can mock eachother over choices for a while :D |
| 13:25.10 | claymore | Yeah, there is a place 1/2 mile down the road from my house. |
| 13:25.56 | claymore | I won't remember who I vote for. I am going to choose 'c' for all my answers. Let the best man picked by random choise win! |
| 13:26.03 | claymore | muwahaha. |
| 13:26.47 | ``Erik_ | heh, I have a bunch of 1 party shit on mine :( |
| 13:27.29 | claymore | yeah, a party is a party. BYOB and see if they let you vote. Claim you heard there was gonna be a couple parties here. |
| 13:27.44 | ``Erik_ | "Angela M. Eaves -or- Write in" |
| 13:28.07 | ``Erik_ | Continuance of joseph Murphy Jr: Yes -or- No |
| 13:28.16 | ``Erik_ | many continuance onces |
| 13:28.18 | ``Erik_ | ones |
| 13:28.18 | PrezKennedy | i wrote in my choice for president :) |
| 13:28.49 | PrezKennedy | i lost any hope of McCain or Obama not being jackasses |
| 13:28.49 | ``Erik_ | ... I somehow doubt "darth maul" is a valid candidate, dude |
| 13:28.57 | PrezKennedy | i put ralph wiggum |
| 13:29.23 | claymore | I feel like my vote for jack Bauer is wasted.... |
| 13:29.52 | ``Erik_ | I'm voting for captain mal, he kicks cockbites into spacecraft engines |
| 13:30.00 | claymore | lol |
| 13:31.02 | claymore | Only the *cool* captains maintain a crew that consists of outlaws, trigger-happy dimwits and a whore or two. |
| 13:31.35 | PrezKennedy | watched serenity on halloween :) |
| 13:31.43 | ``Erik_ | gotta admit, whedon did a remarkable job making tragically awesome characters |
| 13:32.03 | claymore | Now if Mal were president, we would have cooler reasons for going to war: "I aim to misbehaive..." |
| 13:32.10 | ``Erik_ | if you read up on the inside scoup of that series, all the fucktarded lame shit was demanded by fox, not part of the original vision |
| 13:32.32 | claymore | Yeah, I remember reading that Fox basically killed the series. |
| 13:33.02 | ``Erik_ | the dudes with the blue gloves were not part of the story... it was fox trying to make it "epic", and of course, showing the series out of order and at incredibly random times... heh |
| 13:33.25 | claymore | Serinity was *ok* but I really don't like Joss's habit of killing off major characters. |
| 13:33.48 | claymore | I mean, we never got to see why Book had all those Alliance connections... |
| 13:34.02 | ``Erik_ | it was upsetting, but I understand what he was doing... he'd given up on reviving the series, he wanted the story to conclude |
| 13:34.15 | claymore | If Book turned out to be a badass Preacher-Ninja... that would have been toooo awesome. |
| 13:34.31 | ``Erik_ | yeah, ron glass is awesome |
| 13:34.53 | ``Erik_ | given that he was raised christian and turned buddist, that was a neat role for him :) |
| 13:35.04 | claymore | Well cast then! |
| 13:35.23 | claymore | Bah. Boss alert. need to keep Architecting :/ |
| 16:12.04 | claymore | brlcad: lemme know when you are awake! |
| 16:24.05 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33129 10/iBME/: Making Directory Structure for iBME (Integrated BrlCad Modeling Environment). Ultimately, the iBME will consist of the new GUI, the Geometry Service and the Geometry Engine. |
| 16:26.31 | brlcad | ``Erik_: rt^3 wasn't the agile project -- that project was never migrated (though I do have the sources somewhere) |
| 16:26.47 | brlcad | it was called something like SimpleRT |
| 16:27.07 | brlcad | my server (in storage) knows all |
| 16:27.52 | claymore | All hail MyServer (in storage). Great and mighty MyServer (in storage). |
| 16:28.22 | brlcad | yeah, lrt .. LittleRT |
| 16:30.05 | claymore | Get any rest? |
| 16:31.39 | brlcad | claymore: cool, that's what I did for my SATs -- c, c, c, c .. :) |
| 16:35.18 | brlcad | claymore: enough |
| 16:35.50 | brlcad | fwiw, rt^3 is *exactly* what you described iBME to be -- "Ultimately, the iBME will consist of the new GUI, the Geometry Service and the Geometry Engine. |
| 16:36.17 | brlcad | just replace iBME with rt^3 and you have the same deal |
| 16:36.50 | claymore | so are there any issues with me starting a new top level? rt^3 seems cluttered and I am not knowledgeable enough to clean it up. |
| 16:39.29 | brlcad | well, the code bases are going to have to get merged and cleaned up at some point, so overall a new module is just making more work for someone later |
| 16:39.54 | claymore | Hrm :/ Okay, if you say so. |
| 16:39.59 | brlcad | there is some clutter -- it's what I was referring to yesterday about people not working together yet :) |
| 16:40.29 | brlcad | which is just my bad not getting things sorted out project-management-wise just yet |
| 16:40.52 | claymore | Well I am gong to take charge and whip it into shape. *Cracks whip* |
| 16:41.54 | PrezKennedy | outsource it to a contractor to manage! |
| 16:42.01 | brlcad | the bigger issue is going to be getting things organized and documented for collaborative growth, and then taking the pains to ensure everyone is up to speed and it's not just being dictated |
| 16:42.03 | PrezKennedy | eyes the room |
| 16:42.16 | claymore | You in at all today? |
| 16:42.24 | brlcad | yeah, on my way soon |
| 16:42.42 | claymore | K, I have been architecting and wanna bounce things off your brain at some point. |
| 16:51.02 | brlcad | nods |
| 16:51.39 | claymore | I think Erik is stirring up a Japan House run. |
| 16:56.43 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 16:58.20 | PrezKennedy | we're going to chinese! |
| 16:58.34 | PrezKennedy | its not quite as good as the chinese restaurant in Aberdeen... but good enough |
| 16:58.42 | brlcad | claymore: takes me over an hour to get there so it won't do me much good |
| 16:58.52 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: mm, that sounds good |
| 16:59.10 | PrezKennedy | its inexpensive too! |
| 16:59.25 | brlcad | hits the road |
| 16:59.55 | claymore | Drive safe! |
| 17:24.07 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-212-221.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 17:42.49 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 19:20.47 | starseeker | brlcad: Looks like the .c.o rule change is breaking the build on Mac |
| 19:29.14 | ``Erik_ | I hate getting accused of being a guru :( |
| 19:33.14 | claymore | well start acting stupid instead of knowledgable... |
| 19:46.24 | ``Erik_ | #!~@! I've been trying! |
| 19:48.02 | claymore | I can help if you want.... stooopid. |
| 19:48.08 | claymore | :D |
| 19:49.05 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 20:00.37 | punkrockgirl | erik acts knowledgable? |
| 20:01.08 | mafm | bye |
| 20:01.35 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-94-72.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:02.05 | claymore | every now and then. |
| 20:02.17 | claymore | Well, at least he puts on a good show. Quite believable. |
| 20:02.27 | claymore | I would imagine you know him better though ;) |
| 20:03.50 | punkrockgirl | ;) |
| 20:08.32 | ``Erik_ | says who? |
| 20:08.33 | ``Erik_ | O.o |
| 20:08.40 | ``Erik_ | *duck* *run* :D |
| 20:08.46 | claymore | An Owl says who. |
| 20:08.52 | claymore | not a *duck* |
| 20:08.57 | starseeker | she probably read all your secret journals ;-) |
| 20:08.58 | claymore | shakes head. |
| 20:08.58 | ``Erik_ | ORLY??? |
| 20:09.38 | starseeker | punkrockgirl: Is he really a closet linux kernel hacker? :-P |
| 20:10.24 | claymore | YA RLY!! |
| 20:12.44 | starseeker | Hmm. head fails on BSD for me, but with an ld: cannot find -lX11 error |
| 20:13.17 | ``Erik_ | yes, the tkhtml3 build is ignoring the CPPFLAGS and LDFLAGS that add /usr/local/{include,lib} |
| 20:13.49 | ``Erik_ | http://img.thedailywtf.com/images/200811/errord/404.jpg what's more amusing, the sign, or the irssi/bx session on the screen? |
| 20:15.25 | starseeker | ``Erik: Hmm. CPPFLAGS and LDFLAGS are in the Makefile.in - I take it that means those variables aren't being used correctly within the build logic? |
| 20:15.35 | claymore | whats more sad: The fact someone had time to do this at work, or the fact someone could Identify applications running on the computer in the picture? |
| 20:17.08 | punkrockgirl | i tend to ignore most of what erik says... mostly because i dont understand it :/ |
| 20:17.35 | punkrockgirl | so i figured he just spoke jibberish |
| 20:17.46 | ``Erik_ | I don' speek no jibba jabba, foo! |
| 20:17.51 | punkrockgirl | see? |
| 20:18.58 | louipc | punkrockgirl: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eisa5AZ20W0 |
| 20:19.11 | ``Erik_ | huh, the fbsd box seems to be not responding :/ |
| 20:19.51 | punkrockgirl | erik = mr t |
| 20:20.03 | ``Erik_ | you didn't know? O.o |
| 20:20.26 | ``Erik_ | I mean, you have to trick me with drugged milk to get me to fly... |
| 20:20.55 | punkrockgirl | i never noticed the resemblance before |
| 20:26.26 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33130 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing architecture planning. |
| 20:29.59 | claymore | brlcad: Hrm, well, guess I will catch up with you ... some other time eh? heh. Lata. |
| 21:18.09 | clock_ | everyone in the voting ques? |
| 21:19.17 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33131 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (12 files): Add latest batch of MGED man pages worked on by Janine and Cliff |
| 00:00.24 | ``Erik_ | like, near all the bird guys |
| 00:00.27 | ``Erik_ | woops |
| 00:15.58 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:28.24 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33132 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: go the stupid route. needs some automake lovin'. |
| 01:51.40 | brlcad | that leaves the only error being failures in doc/ when there aren't tools installed |
| 01:57.22 | starseeker | hmm - I thought we disabled the docbook stuff when there weren't tools? |
| 01:58.42 | brlcad | yeah, there's a handfulof .am's that don't |
| 01:59.07 | brlcad | I put a hack, should be good enough to retag 7.14.0 now |
| 02:00.16 | starseeker | cool |
| 02:00.19 | starseeker | rebuilds |
| 02:07.24 | brlcad | kicks CIA-24 |
| 02:07.24 | CIA-24 | ow |
| 02:08.09 | brlcad | so it's now all tagged up, doing another round of distchecks |
| 02:09.45 | brlcad | the only thing that comes to mind is that STABLE might not be perfectly synchronized since it required massive manual intervention |
| 02:10.01 | brlcad | but if it'll check out and build on at least two plats, I'll post up the tarball |
| 02:11.32 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:11.41 | starseeker | you opted not to go the svn cp route? |
| 02:13.35 | brlcad | nope, it was merged |
| 02:14.24 | brlcad | I was actually using the wrong syntax at first and probably wasted a couple hours before I realized it fixing problems |
| 02:15.05 | brlcad | my hope is that keeping a "fixed" merge in place with the proper revision tag annotated on the branch, that future merges should just work |
| 02:15.20 | brlcad | so long as nobody actually works on STABLE directly and causes a new conflict |
| 02:15.33 | starseeker | nods |
| 02:16.34 | starseeker | takes first stab at mk_hyp |
| 02:17.59 | brlcad | hm, looks like doc still (more quietly) halts the build if xsltproc doesn't exist |
| 02:18.13 | brlcad | not a release stopper, but should get fixed |
| 02:18.19 | starseeker | hmm |
| 02:19.25 | louipc | hmm |
| 02:20.05 | brlcad | ".fo.pdf: .xml.fo" looks like badness |
| 02:20.51 | starseeker | Is it not being disabled? |
| 02:21.00 | starseeker | or just bad make file syntax? |
| 02:22.08 | brlcad | well yeah, the bigger problem is it's not being disabled |
| 02:22.33 | brlcad | but making an implicit rule dependent on another implicit rule is odd too |
| 02:23.17 | brlcad | probably a neater way to do that with vars or even just a different approach |
| 02:25.17 | starseeker | um. thought it was a logical mapping to the actual xml -> fo -> pdf process, but maybe not |
| 02:32.37 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 02:39.38 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33133 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: add dependencies so that parallel compilation will fly. auto-search /usr/lib and /usr/local/lib to work around stupidity in the TEA X11 checks. |
| 02:39.39 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33134 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: make xsltproc and apachefop be a no-op if they don't exist so that the build doesn't fail if they're invoked without checking whether they exist. |
| 02:40.00 | brlcad | must be overloaded |
| 02:40.08 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33135 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (configure.ac src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in): merge 33129:HEAD (33134) from trunk to stable. these are a few build repairs that need to make it into the 7.14.0 release. |
| 02:40.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33136 10/brlcad/tags/rel-7-14-0/ (configure.ac src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in): |
| 02:40.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: fugly post-tag merge to fix critical build system failures (across the board) |
| 02:40.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: due to bad juju in the tkhtml3 dependency build. this should |
| 02:40.11 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: (sufficiently/hopefully) make things 'good enough' for release though leaving |
| 02:40.12 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: much to be desired. |
| 03:07.57 | starseeker | growls at the hyp input parameters |
| 03:08.02 | starseeker | later for them |
| 03:41.48 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33137 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: so, cssprop is kinda important if we need to resolve all symbols in the library (e.g. on mac) |
| 03:43.20 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33138 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: merge from head through 33137 |
| 04:35.30 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-205-31.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 04:41.12 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33139 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (doc/book/VolumeII.xml m4/ax_boost_base.m4): more (manual) syncing with trunk, add missing ax_boost_base.m4 and remove the moved VolumeII.xml |
| 04:48.52 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33140 10/brlcad/trunk/ (206 files in 206 dirs): |
| 04:48.52 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: alrighty, it's been years of fighting merges with rcs variables getting in the |
| 04:48.52 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: way and in all that time I can't think of a time where I found that line |
| 04:48.52 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: actually incredibly useful. time to give it the axe, at least in the makefile |
| 04:48.54 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: templates. |
| 04:50.33 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33141 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 3 dirs): removal of a few more rcs var instances |
| 05:11.30 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33142 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/ (211 files in 206 dirs): hopefully the last merge of all changes on trunk to the branch for the 7.14.0 release. this syncs changes from 33137 to HEAD revision 33141 |
| 06:44.46 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-56-88-110.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 06:58.44 | yukonbob | hi clock_ |
| 07:14.55 | clock_ | yukonbob: hi |
| 07:15.08 | clock_ | congratulations to America! |
| 07:50.07 | brlcad | bah, still failing in doc, different issue |
| 07:59.14 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33143 10/brlcad/trunk/configure.ac: can't set xsltproc and apachefop to : until after we test the configuration functionality. |
| 07:59.34 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33144 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/configure.ac: merge 33143 from trunk, can't set xsltproc and apachefop to : until after we test the configuration functionality. |
| 08:03.58 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33145 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: cssprop.c is generated in the build directory, not the source directory. thx mac build. |
| 08:05.19 | CIA-24 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33146 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: merge 33145 from trunk to get the cssprop.c fix for tkhtml3 |
| 08:06.06 | brlcad | hm, drumroll... |
| 08:14.59 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:16.49 | brlcad | so far looking good |
| 08:16.53 | brlcad | hits the road again |
| 08:20.26 | clock_ | once hit the road so hard he had to go to hospital |
| 10:26.46 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 10:53.16 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 11:07.39 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 12:26.16 | ``Erik_ | looks like obama swept it big time, 270 is the magic number and he's already at 338, the non-reporting states are irrelevent now |
| 12:27.03 | ``Erik_ | man, 338 to 163... that is harsh |
| 12:50.06 | ``Erik_ | CLAYMORE! (or starseeker or brlcad) |
| 13:15.55 | Axman6 | ``Erik_: it was a very nice win indeed :) |
| 13:18.00 | ``Erik_ | not unexpected |
| 13:18.24 | ``Erik_ | but I need brlcad, claymore or starseeker to respond, I called in sick, but I need shit done :( |
| 13:19.08 | Axman6 | :( |
| 13:19.11 | Axman6 | gets shit done |
| 13:19.20 | Axman6 | you better get me a birthday present though |
| 13:19.27 | ``Erik_ | ok |
| 13:19.31 | ``Erik_ | poos in a paper sack |
| 13:19.32 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 13:19.48 | Axman6 | that does not constitute a present |
| 13:19.59 | ``Erik_ | does... not... compute... |
| 13:20.48 | Axman6 | luckily my birthday ended 20 mins ago here, so you didn't ruin it |
| 13:21.07 | ``Erik_ | a google pm is in the neighborhood, I'm going to try to facilitate a visit, but gubmint is as gubmint does, so it could be difficult, I'm hoping to have one of my cohorts alert mgmt of my intent |
| 13:21.11 | ``Erik_ | happy bday, axman |
| 13:21.38 | Axman6 | thanks |
| 13:22.36 | *** topic/#brlcad by ``Erik_ -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSOC 2008 is complete! w00t to all || Happy BDay to Axman6 | |
| 13:23.35 | Axman6 | heh, thanks :) |
| 13:23.53 | Axman6 | i need to play with brl-cad more once exams are over |
| 13:31.45 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 13:39.16 | claymore | Yo Erik. Whats up? |
| 13:40.03 | starseeker | ``Erik: now what? ;-) |
| 13:40.54 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 13:41.50 | claymore | is at home finding / replacing a battery & alternator for a 03 dodge caravan :/ |
| 13:42.26 | starseeker | is getting ready to go in after watching too much election coverage |
| 13:49.09 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 13:50.08 | clock_ | Obama has about 3dB over McCain :) |
| 13:51.50 | louipc | McCain apparently got 47% of the popular vote |
| 13:53.59 | claymore | Bleh, didn't even bother watching the election coverage. The outcome didn't change whether I watched it or not :) |
| 13:59.17 | clock_ | If I should sleep with one of the candidates, I would select Obama. |
| 14:00.28 | louipc | Palin all the way |
| 14:01.40 | clock_ | Now Honolulu becomes the capital of the US instead of Washington D.C.? |
| 14:04.47 | claymore | That wouldn't be soooo bad. Except we have touble getting those on capitol hill to do anything as it is, let along move them all to Hawaii and telling them to work.... |
| 14:05.00 | claymore | along = alone |
| 14:05.45 | clock_ | no it would be Medvedev would come for a visit |
| 14:05.50 | clock_ | the Capitol would be all empty |
| 14:05.56 | clock_ | so he would ask the janitor what's up |
| 14:06.05 | clock_ | and he would reply "The surf's up" |
| 14:17.34 | ``Erik_ | Wsend 'em all to alaska |
| 14:18.00 | ``Erik_ | claymore! are you functional? or do I need to phone bc while out on sick? |
| 14:23.49 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 14:24.16 | mafm | hai |
| 14:28.28 | claymore | erik: Functional, but at home. Mini van is sick, need new battery/alternator. |
| 14:28.36 | ``Erik_ | oh |
| 14:28.38 | ``Erik_ | poop |
| 14:28.49 | ``Erik_ | i need a mouthpiece for bc |
| 14:28.52 | claymore | Nothing like working on electric systems in the rain... though I left that in my past lol. |
| 14:28.53 | ``Erik_ | I'm out sick with a head cold |
| 14:28.58 | claymore | just call Ed. |
| 14:29.12 | ``Erik_ | yeh, he's probably in now |
| 14:29.14 | ``Erik_ | *sigh* |
| 14:29.20 | ``Erik_ | 6300 ? |
| 14:29.30 | claymore | I phone him about an hour ago, so yeah, he's in. and yes, x6300 |
| 14:29.52 | claymore | so that atlantica game.... 2gb download... *sigh* |
| 14:30.29 | claymore | gotta hand it to them asians... they know how to draw pretty gurls, lol. |
| 14:38.55 | ``Erik_ | okie, talked to ed |
| 14:39.01 | ``Erik_ | he's gonna get the shit rolling |
| 14:39.23 | claymore | good man that Ed |
| 14:39.39 | ``Erik_ | uh, claymore, you do understand that if this goes down, your participation in a lunch is not voluntary, right? |
| 14:39.50 | claymore | if what goes down? |
| 14:40.12 | ``Erik_ | the google summer of code project manager is going to be in the neighborhood in a week or two |
| 14:40.24 | ``Erik_ | I'm trying to facilitate a meet&greet |
| 14:40.27 | claymore | Oh hell yeah. |
| 14:40.43 | claymore | I'll bring my campbells chunk soup to the resteraunt. |
| 14:40.50 | ``Erik_ | hhahaha |
| 14:40.53 | claymore | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:41.32 | claymore | SO i just did a dumb shit thing.... tried to check out root of the brlcad svn instead of trunk...lol |
| 14:41.43 | claymore | was wondering why it was taking so long.... lol |
| 14:43.06 | claymore | so whats the GSOC PM's name? |
| 14:43.14 | ``Erik_ | leslie hawthorn |
| 14:43.41 | claymore | Nice. Philly or Baltimore>? |
| 14:44.37 | ``Erik_ | he's a cali, she's hitting boston then dc... so I told her that I'd be willing to pull geeks together for her dc portion if she gets bored, she expressed interest in seeing brlcad's 5 monitor setup |
| 14:45.33 | louipc | wow! I'd like to see that in action |
| 14:45.35 | claymore | Sweet, thinking about arranging an onsite? |
| 14:46.05 | ``Erik_ | I'm trying to get ed to start the process of getting leslie and her aussie friend some visitor passes |
| 14:46.12 | claymore | Once that Mac comes back from glen, I am seriously thinking about attempting to utilize all 6 monitor jacks :) |
| 14:46.27 | ``Erik_ | well, there's an issue |
| 14:46.40 | claymore | He broke it didn't he? |
| 14:46.51 | ``Erik_ | if you want a 30" monitor, that uses one physical socket, but consumes both that cards output |
| 14:47.08 | claymore | what about a 24? |
| 14:47.15 | ``Erik_ | he'll try, *shrug* hopefully I'll feel up to snuff tomorrow and accost bc in the right way |
| 14:47.26 | ``Erik_ | 24 is a single dvi, 30 is a dual dvi |
| 14:47.58 | claymore | are you sure? I am driving a 30 and a 24 off a single nVidia Quatro right now on my RHEL box... |
| 14:48.02 | ``Erik_ | brlcad is totally subsuming his 3 dual-dvi cards, he cannot add another monitor |
| 14:48.17 | ``Erik_ | erm, max rez on a 30 is dual dvi |
| 14:48.38 | claymore | ah, I probably have the rez gimped then. |
| 14:48.45 | ``Erik_ | perhaps |
| 14:49.16 | claymore | Is it a VidCard limitation? Because the 30's power supply only has a single DVI cord. |
| 14:49.52 | ``Erik_ | I d'no |
| 14:49.58 | claymore | is confused now. |
| 14:50.14 | claymore | I'll play with BRLCADs monitors when he isn't looking. |
| 14:50.55 | claymore | checks out TRUNK not ROOT this time.... grumble. |
| 14:51.00 | ``Erik_ | I went and got old, I grok the differences, but I don't careanymore... I'll pay a premium for a little bit of ram...thus my new mcabook (why isn't it here yet) |
| 14:52.58 | claymore | Because Murphey and his laws work at UPS and FedEx ;) |
| 14:54.07 | ``Erik_ | I wanna go race :( |
| 14:55.11 | ``Erik_ | I'm not in the ae mentality, but I'm in the os one... |
| 14:55.25 | claymore | Learn something new every day. In windows' Volume Control window, cntl-s toggles small/large mode.... huh.. |
| 14:55.42 | clock_ | claymore: lol |
| 14:55.46 | claymore | os = opensource? |
| 14:55.59 | ``Erik_ | ja |
| 14:56.04 | clock_ | claymore: if you learn enough tricks like this you get the Microsoft Academy Awards Certificate? |
| 14:56.13 | clock_ | or CCNA? |
| 14:56.25 | claymore | then I will wipe my butt with it and flush it ;) |
| 14:56.53 | ``Erik_ | I WHUPPEd THE GUY AT AHE TNED OF THE INTARNET, I ARE TEH WINN4R!!#!~# |
| 14:56.55 | claymore | erik: so start an OS version of AE just way way way better |
| 14:57.29 | ``Erik_ | vsc url? |
| 14:57.39 | claymore | 's eyes bled a bit reading that.... |
| 14:57.58 | claymore | vsc = ? |
| 14:58.18 | ``Erik_ | vcs |
| 14:58.35 | claymore | vcs = ? |
| 14:58.47 | ``Erik_ | version control system... cvs, svn, darcs, mercurial, git, ... |
| 14:59.35 | claymore | Okay still don't knwo what ur askin then. |
| 14:59.55 | claymore | wonders why it takes so long to get a 'common part' from the werehouse. |
| 15:00.21 | ``Erik_ | where is it? |
| 15:00.32 | ``Erik_ | taht applies to both queries |
| 15:01.14 | louipc | ~vcs |
| 15:01.33 | claymore | werehouse is across the parking lot from the 'dealer' that I called. grrrrr. |
| 15:01.54 | claymore | is tempted to strip the alternator down and refurbish it himself... |
| 15:02.11 | ``Erik_ | my hoa is getting grumpy that my truck hasnt' moved... :( I need to move |
| 15:02.58 | clock_ | hoa that's wife? |
| 15:03.04 | louipc | ~vcs |
| 15:03.04 | ibot | extra, extra, read all about it, vcs is "Version Control System" such as CVS, subversion, git, etc. |
| 15:03.10 | ``Erik_ | homo's association |
| 15:03.14 | claymore | lol |
| 15:03.28 | clock_ | what's a homo's association? |
| 15:03.35 | claymore | ~hoa |
| 15:03.49 | clock_ | is it like a gay partner? |
| 15:03.51 | claymore | is crying in laughter. |
| 15:03.57 | ``Erik_ | it's a contract fagtards sign into |
| 15:04.01 | ``Erik_ | <-- is a fagtard. |
| 15:04.02 | PrezKennedy | theyre jerks who tell you how to paint your house and how to mow the lawn |
| 15:04.03 | ``Erik_ | :( |
| 15:04.10 | clock_ | ``Erik_: youre a gay? |
| 15:04.20 | claymore | is crying in laughter even more. |
| 15:04.51 | ``Erik_ | um, I poke my gf's rump, be she isnt, yknow, packing |
| 15:04.53 | claymore | bangs his fists on the table. hahahahahahahahahaha |
| 15:06.42 | claymore | wonders why both cores on his lappy are pegged at 100%.... |
| 15:07.03 | clock_ | claymore: that's a god sent punishment for laughing at people because they are gay! |
| 15:07.40 | PrezKennedy | my 4 cores arent pegged... and i was laughing too |
| 15:08.02 | clock_ | PrezKennedy: you will be punished by discovering youre gay after you are married with 2 children! |
| 15:08.10 | claymore | not laughing at people because they gay. Just the direction of the conversation. |
| 15:08.25 | PrezKennedy | haha.. clock_ i don't think so |
| 15:08.41 | clock_ | ``Erik_: or maybe God wanted to punish ``Erik_ for saying "fagtard" but missed and hit your computer instead |
| 15:09.19 | clock_ | I mean claymore'S COMPUTER |
| 15:09.29 | clock_ | OMG CAPSLOCK !!!1111 |
| 15:10.42 | claymore | whats wrong with calling oneself a retarded bundle of sticks? |
| 15:11.01 | ``Erik_ | hey, I have no bias towards orientation... |
| 15:11.08 | clock_ | sounded like a defamatory word for gays |
| 15:11.22 | ``Erik_ | shit, i'm trying to get my wench to fing a new chica to bring to bed ; |
| 15:11.29 | clock_ | ``Erik_: so youre izotropic? |
| 15:11.32 | ``Erik_ | *duck* *run* |
| 15:11.56 | ``Erik_ | I don't know that word |
| 15:12.10 | clock_ | means no bias towards anhy orientation |
| 15:12.12 | ``Erik_ | google isn't helping me |
| 15:12.20 | clock_ | maybe should be isotropic? |
| 15:12.58 | ``Erik_ | no, I hold no bias. I like sleeping with women, I frankly don't care who other people like sleeping with |
| 15:13.15 | clock_ | plushy teddy bears |
| 15:13.25 | clock_ | that's a mixture between fetish and zoophilia |
| 15:13.29 | ``Erik_ | if that's what gets your rocks off, go for it |
| 15:13.30 | PrezKennedy | women FTW! |
| 15:13.42 | claymore | agrees. TnA rules |
| 15:13.49 | ``Erik_ | I'll continue humping punker and be quite happy about it |
| 15:14.05 | claymore | so you the punk humper eh? |
| 15:14.12 | ``Erik_ | smething like that, yes |
| 15:15.50 | claymore | Pics or it didn't happen. |
| 15:15.57 | claymore | O.o |
| 15:16.07 | louipc | hahahaha |
| 15:17.18 | ``Erik_ | heh |
| 15:18.07 | ``Erik_ | pix exist, not for distribution O:-) |
| 15:19.23 | clock_ | FOR IMMEDIATE CIRCULATION |
| 15:20.03 | claymore | so punk reads backlogs too eh? LOL. |
| 15:20.14 | claymore | Well, gotta get my lunch on. Peace out g's. |
| 15:52.28 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 16:28.26 | claymore | hrm, looks like I am the life of the party eh? ;) |
| 16:28.40 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 16:34.48 | claymore | parties. |
| 16:50.25 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EDA2.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:55.17 | starseeker | ``Erik_: you figuring to pull in all the BRL-CAD devs for this lunch then? |
| 16:57.43 | starseeker | makes the mistake of reading the back logs and considers starting a betting pool on how long ``Erik_ has to live |
| 17:01.11 | claymore | I dunno, Erik picked Punk over being gay... so thats a compliment! |
| 17:14.26 | louipc | ehhh |
| 17:32.29 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-26 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 18:41.57 | starseeker | feels the need for good primitives documentation as he squints at the hyp code |
| 19:01.48 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@206-248-129-225.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 19:34.49 | mafm | night |
| 19:35.00 | brlcad | ``Erik_: not on the cards we got -- they're dual duals, so you could actually hook up 6 |
| 19:55.08 | claymore | brlcad: with splitters... that makes 12 possible? |
| 19:55.22 | brlcad | not at full rez |
| 19:55.32 | brlcad | the 30"'s will saturdate the dual link |
| 19:55.49 | claymore | settle for 12 24" then ;) |
| 19:55.50 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 19:55.56 | brlcad | howdy Ralith |
| 19:56.12 | Ralith | hullo |
| 19:56.16 | brlcad | how goes it? |
| 20:53.41 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14EDA2.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:10.54 | claymore | Erik: hows the head cold? |
| 21:26.59 | brlcad | woot, looks like 7.14.0 is good (enough) to go |
| 21:27.11 | starseeker | yay!! |
| 21:31.37 | brlcad | rebreaks head |
| 21:35.01 | starseeker | Is stable stable now? |
| 21:35.23 | brlcad | builds across at least three platforms seemed to succeed |
| 21:35.30 | starseeker | cool |
| 21:35.39 | brlcad | altix, linux, and mac -- good enough for a source |
| 21:36.32 | brlcad | bsd seemed to work too |
| 21:36.55 | brlcad | the tkhtml3 build is still rather flimsy, I'm sure that's still probably not right |
| 21:37.08 | starseeker | nods |
| 21:37.40 | starseeker | crosses fingers for S2 |
| 21:40.12 | starseeker | I take it CIA is MIA? |
| 21:53.29 | CIA-26 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33147 10/brlcad/trunk/ (20 files in 9 dirs): unrevert r33113 to restore the g_qa merge into mged and port to windows changes so that bob can apply his fix to the crashies and antiparallelism problems. |
| 21:53.48 | CIA-26 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33148 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/make.c libwdb/wdb.c): Add support for make obj hyp to libged, using new mk_hyp from libwdb |
| 22:25.19 | CIA-26 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33149 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/gqa.c: I'm going to take a quick stab in the dark and guess that the problem is that he didn't initialize the semaphores. |
| 23:05.51 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-205-31.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 23:50.02 | brlcad | woot, new news item |
| 23:50.53 | ``Erik_ | I think lh is annoyed at boston and cruising down to dc, ya gonna be up for chumming at lunch? |
| 23:51.35 | brlcad | when? |
| 23:51.58 | ``Erik_ | um, I think now? |
| 23:52.09 | brlcad | it's not lunchtime now :) |
| 23:52.10 | ``Erik_ | she's estimating a 7hr drive |
| 23:52.28 | brlcad | so you mean tomorrow or friday? |
| 23:52.29 | ``Erik_ | I'm going to try to arrange a visitor pass if possible |
| 23:52.39 | ``Erik_ | tomorrie |
| 23:53.08 | louipc | wow it sure didn't seem like there were 280 mailing list messages |
| 23:53.11 | brlcad | thinks we should go to Tidewater |
| 23:53.35 | ``Erik_ | I d'no, she said she was coming to the area, and then she said she was effin' fed up with boston and coming down *NOW*, so *shruG* |
| 23:53.38 | ``Erik_ | tidewater? |
| 23:53.40 | brlcad | she doesn't eat a lot of things, our usual faire won't be too appetizing |
| 23:53.41 | ``Erik_ | what's that? |
| 23:53.50 | brlcad | it's down in HdG |
| 23:53.59 | brlcad | next to the other place |
| 23:54.08 | brlcad | on the water |
| 23:54.08 | ``Erik_ | hdg? |
| 23:54.44 | ``Erik_ | havre de grace? |
| 23:54.58 | ``Erik_ | I need to buy gas, I'm almost out :/ |
| 23:55.06 | brlcad | ~hdg |
| 23:55.07 | ibot | it has been said that hdg is Havre de Grace, Maryland -- one of the original candidate sites to be the U.S. capital |
| 23:57.02 | ``Erik_ | well, I'm under the impression that she threw her buddy in the car and got on the road, so "real soon now", I'd like to take them to the museum and to our building while they're in town |
| 23:57.47 | ``Erik_ | and they'll be in the area for few days... I d'no anyhting about any dietary constraints |
| 23:58.10 | ``Erik_ | my mom is pissed at me because I couldn't advise for good crab shacks *shrug* I eat cow |
| 00:00.57 | brlcad | gasps, there are several outstanding crab shacks that are "must see" if you like crabs |
| 00:01.26 | brlcad | the msrc and maybe area C would also be interesting to show |
| 00:03.01 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 00:03.28 | ``Erik_ | "luftwaffles" hah |
| 00:41.52 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 01:42.25 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@91-171-205-31.rev.libertysurf.net) | |
| 03:23.14 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 04:13.58 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 04:45.08 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 05:37.00 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 08:18.35 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:20.09 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:21.04 | brlcad | punts the tarball until tomorrow |
| 08:26.19 | CIA-26 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33151 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/CMakeLists.txt: added gqa.c to be in sync with Makefile.am |
| 08:36.03 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 09:43.33 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@193.136.2.121) | |
| 09:43.46 | mafm | hi |
| 10:27.46 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 11:40.27 | claymore | so whats the word on the VIP visit? |
| 12:02.39 | Axman6 | VIP visit? |
| 12:12.47 | claymore | Appearently the GSOC PM will be in our neck of the woods sometime soon. I am guessin perhaps today? |
| 12:13.57 | CIA-26 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33152 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (gtools/g_qa.c libged/gqa.c): Mods to get g_qa working again. |
| 12:22.03 | Axman6 | ``Erik_ was saying yesterday i think... |
| 12:22.07 | Axman6 | i could be wrong |
| 13:38.37 | claymore | Erik, Paulette just came in. Are you sleeping or playing host? |
| 13:38.57 | claymore | I have your cell number and will give ya a call at about 0900 (ish) |
| 14:07.11 | claymore | Paulette & Steph stand informed. Word is, turnaround by Friday Afternoon is near impossible :( |
| 15:00.55 | *** join/#brlcad elmom (n=elmom@hoasnet-ff04dd00-187.dhcp.inet.fi) | |
| 15:15.09 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 16:04.05 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 16:06.59 | mafm | hi |
| 16:08.10 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 16:10.45 | claymore | waves at mafm. |
| 16:11.19 | mafm | waves back :) |
| 16:23.33 | brlcad | mafm: heh, pure evil |
| 16:23.56 | brlcad | if this is your first interaction with them, my condolences |
| 16:25.39 | claymore | with who? |
| 16:38.05 | claymore | Woot 3050 econ |
| 16:38.09 | claymore | dances |
| 16:38.43 | mafm | yes brlcad |
| 16:57.33 | *** join/#brlcad quentusrex_ (n=quentusr@c-71-197-244-228.hsd1.or.comcast.net) | |
| 17:07.18 | mafm | oh sorry claymore |
| 17:07.27 | mafm | I was tempted by the Evil Empire |
| 17:08.32 | *** join/#brlcad Bariton (n=Bary@p5B14D8C5.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:13.44 | claymore | Evil Empire being..... Microsoft? |
| 17:15.32 | mafm | claymore: winner! |
| 17:16.02 | claymore | you didn't go vista, didja? |
| 17:16.17 | mafm | nope, they sent me a recruitment message |
| 17:16.28 | claymore | Oh well hell, go for it. |
| 17:16.58 | claymore | My Brother in law works for them on the Silverlight project.... its an amazing company to work for, regardless of the public opinion of their products :) |
| 17:19.36 | mafm | well, it depends where I would be going to be relocated :D |
| 17:19.45 | mafm | but I'm not very thrilled |
| 17:19.56 | claymore | There is only one place: Washington State ;) |
| 17:19.59 | claymore | why not? |
| 17:20.06 | mafm | I don't want to move there |
| 17:20.22 | claymore | why not? |
| 17:20.22 | mafm | and I don't like working on things that I don't like, in general |
| 17:20.27 | mafm | personal reasons :P |
| 17:20.38 | mafm | including familiar and so on :) |
| 17:21.14 | claymore | Well, 'No good deal goes unpunished' so take the good with the bad and fine that place that fits you just right. |
| 17:21.42 | claymore | Well if I got extended a deal to move back to the west coast, I would be there in an instant. No second thoughts. |
| 17:24.28 | mafm | xD |
| 17:24.42 | mafm | The west coast of US is about 9k km away from home |
| 17:27.50 | claymore | True, but West coast is way better than East coast in my opinion. I am about 4.5k km away from where I grew up and where my family is... :/ its all about choices :) |
| 17:29.37 | mafm | I've never been in the US but I probably won't like it very much |
| 17:29.40 | mafm | :D |
| 17:31.03 | mafm | coffee time! |
| 17:31.44 | claymore | Where do you call home? |
| 17:32.39 | claymore | damn Erik/brlcad! make up your minds, I am getting hungry waiting to see if the Luncheon is on or not..... |
| 17:32.44 | claymore | ;) |
| 17:34.27 | mafm | somewhere between Lisbon and the north of the Iberian peninsula (Spain+Portugal) |
| 17:35.56 | claymore | Cool. And as for not liking the US, well don't knock it till ya try it. Come on over, you can stay at my place ;) The wife and I will clean out the spare bedroom! |
| 17:37.33 | mafm | well, it's not that simple, I have my life here |
| 17:37.38 | mafm | ;) |
| 17:37.43 | mafm | thanks for the offer anyway |
| 17:37.56 | mafm | I hope to go at some point of visiting and so on |
| 17:38.32 | claymore | Might I ask what you do for a living now? |
| 17:38.35 | mafm | now coffee time, be back in a while |
| 17:38.53 | mafm | working at a particle physics lab: www.lip.pt |
| 17:38.57 | claymore | kk lata. |
| 17:39.06 | mafm | the web is ugly, yep |
| 17:39.15 | mafm | go there for the coffee, bbiab |
| 17:45.46 | starseeker | claymore: Any word from either of them? |
| 17:46.27 | claymore | negative. |
| 17:46.47 | starseeker | hrm |
| 17:47.00 | claymore | Prbably laughing over plates of Alfredo right now lol. |
| 17:47.45 | claymore | All I can say is: The Batman Begins OST is f-ing awesome! |
| 17:48.48 | starseeker | OST? |
| 17:49.02 | claymore | Original Soundtrack ;) |
| 17:49.23 | starseeker | wasn't clear if they wanted the GSOC folk to see more than just brlcad and `Erik or not... |
| 17:49.28 | starseeker | ah |
| 17:49.44 | starseeker | scowls at automake |
| 17:50.33 | claymore | ah hell, I forgot to renew one of my domains... its in reconsiliation now *grumbles* |
| 17:53.22 | claymore | Boooo. Bad joke: Penguin computing solutions just came out with a new gen of Blade servers... code named Bladerunners...... |
| 17:53.29 | claymore | hisses and jeers |
| 17:54.08 | starseeker | are they at least good machines? |
| 17:54.24 | louipc | were they trying to be funny or trying to be cool? |
| 17:55.38 | claymore | louipc: I dunno. |
| 17:56.19 | claymore | starseeker: Oh, they are great machines. I think the Bladerunner can get 960 cores into 25U space ( I think i read that right) |
| 17:56.37 | louipc | 25U... |
| 17:56.39 | starseeker | coool :-) |
| 17:56.49 | starseeker | can forgive the bad joke |
| 17:56.57 | claymore | starseeker: some of the newer server we have here are 2U penguin machines... |
| 17:57.44 | claymore | lol 3.84TB of ram...lol |
| 17:58.07 | louipc | that is some amazing power |
| 17:59.01 | claymore | as thinking he could be #1 on the Seti@Home rankings in no time with that machine..... |
| 18:01.38 | claymore | just think about the electrical power requirements of a computeNet like that at 100%.... lol |
| 18:02.01 | claymore | "Hell, we lost power. Fire up all the backup generators, we need to reboot" |
| 18:02.46 | claymore | How to make a power plant cry.... |
| 18:04.19 | mafm | back |
| 18:05.03 | starseeker | heh - what nuclear power plants were invented for |
| 18:06.17 | claymore | I need a nuke plant for my current server. 4 HD's and 7 80mm fans. Loud and power hungry! |
| 18:26.50 | mafm | going home, take care :) |
| 18:26.59 | claymore | later! |
| 19:12.31 | starseeker | regrets not having an office to himself so he can yell at autotools properly |
| 19:13.08 | starseeker | ok, when all else fails, back to square one - the docs |
| 19:24.39 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 20:31.24 | brlcad | starseeker: sup with autotools? |
| 20:55.33 | brlcad | starseeker: I highly suspect I fixed that problem shortly after the nightly tests ran |
| 21:20.51 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-24 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 21:53.22 | *** join/#brlcad punkrockgirl (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 21:53.27 | punkrockgirl | hi |
| 21:57.53 | louipc | hi |
| 21:59.10 | brlcad | 'lo |
| 21:59.43 | starseeker | brlcad: Trying to get a read on how to make automake and TEA play together - I think the time has finally come for me to come to grips with autotools |
| 22:01.26 | brlcad | TEA sets a bunch of flags, those flags/variables are documented in the .m4 file -- you just have to make sure those flags get set to the appropriate FLAGS variables in the .am file |
| 22:01.43 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:02.34 | starseeker | I'm sure it's not difficult, but the fact I can't easily set it up underscores my need to do my homework |
| 22:02.56 | brlcad | e.g. TEA_CONFIG_CFLAGS -- sets a whole bunch of flags, one being LDFLAGS |
| 22:03.35 | starseeker | Would a proper Makefile.am remove the need for tcl.m4 altogether? |
| 22:04.24 | brlcad | in configure, you'd want to capture the current LDFLAGS settings, run TEA_CONFIG_CFLAGS, store LDFLAGS into another variable (like TKHTML_LDFLAGS="$LDFLAGS"), restore the original LDFLAGS, then use TKHTML_LDFLAGS in your .am file(s) as needed |
| 22:04.33 | brlcad | no it wouldn't |
| 22:04.48 | punkrockgirl | has anyone talked to erik? |
| 22:04.55 | brlcad | .am files are just templates, they have no real inherint knowledge |
| 22:04.59 | brlcad | punkrockgirl: probably |
| 22:05.15 | starseeker | punkrockgirl: not me |
| 22:05.33 | brlcad | somebody at some point somewhere has probably talked to him ;) |
| 22:05.48 | punkrockgirl | i havent heard from him, so i'm making sure he is ok, i know he didnt feel good |
| 22:07.51 | brlcad | he last chimed in here at 7pm est yesterday |
| 22:08.15 | brlcad | er, 8pm actually |
| 22:08.46 | punkrockgirl | yeah, i talked to him right before southpark and i called him after and he didnt answer :( |
| 22:08.59 | punkrockgirl | i guess he is busy at work? |
| 22:09.34 | starseeker | is he here? |
| 22:09.35 | starseeker | looks |
| 22:10.46 | punkrockgirl | is he not? :( |
| 22:10.47 | starseeker | nope, door locked |
| 22:10.47 | punkrockgirl | hmm |
| 22:10.47 | punkrockgirl | ok now i'm worried then |
| 22:10.47 | punkrockgirl | he called in sick yesterday |
| 22:10.47 | punkrockgirl | he wouldnt call in twice in a row, he'd need a dr note right? |
| 22:10.54 | brlcad | not really |
| 22:11.06 | brlcad | i'll go ask, hold on |
| 22:11.46 | punkrockgirl | im all worried :( |
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| 22:16.46 | brlcad | don't be worried |
| 22:16.49 | brlcad | has details |
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| 23:02.25 | brlcad | howdy Ralith |
| 23:02.33 | brlcad | happy coding trails |
| 23:03.44 | Ralith | hey |
| 23:03.46 | Ralith | trails? |
| 23:06.39 | brlcad | sings "happy trails are here again" |
| 23:07.04 | brlcad | dah dah daaah dah daah di do daaaah dadaaaa |
| 23:07.09 | Ralith | has never heard taht :< |
| 23:07.10 | Ralith | that* |
| 23:07.24 | brlcad | you probably have and just haven't realized it |
| 23:07.28 | Ralith | probably |
| 23:07.32 | brlcad | it's a jingle on a lot of commercials, old song |
| 23:13.29 | Ralith | o |
| 23:13.54 | Ralith | it will not be long before I have a repstrap to play with :] |
| 23:14.28 | brlcad | ooh, that's a cool project |
| 23:14.47 | Ralith | very. |
| 23:15.29 | Ralith | I'm looking forward to when brl-cad can be made to generate slice vectors for use with it |
| 23:17.12 | brlcad | too |
| 23:18.05 | starseeker | can see the tag line - BRL-CAD, it slices and dices! |
| 23:18.09 | Ralith | hehe |
| 23:18.29 | starseeker | gah, how'd it get to be 6:30 already?? |
| 23:18.35 | starseeker | must head home now... |
| 23:19.37 | starseeker | brlcad: Looks like another stock market slump |
| 23:19.43 | brlcad | oh yeah! |
| 23:19.49 | brlcad | crap.. I was gonna buy after talking to bob |
| 23:22.33 | brlcad | there he be |
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| 04:39.05 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 07:27.50 | brlcad | reads through his stack of financial and legal papers |
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| 11:37.32 | claymore | Mornin! |
| 12:19.57 | claymore | Reading financial papers at 0200? Not a good idea ;) |
| 12:26.42 | claymore | starseeker: I was wrong about that blade runner thing: its 160 cores in a 7U space, or 960 cores per rack (42U) |
| 12:26.47 | claymore | still :) |
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| 13:14.20 | mafm | hi |
| 13:17.23 | claymore | Hai! |
| 13:23.50 | Axman6 | o/ |
| 13:27.04 | clock_ | will have a 100 MHz Russian oscilloscope! |
| 13:27.09 | clock_ | For an amazing price! |
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| 15:12.25 | claymore | Erik: whats the word on the luncheon? |
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| 16:09.23 | brlcad | claymore: perhaps, especially since it took 3 more hours to get through them all |
| 16:09.32 | brlcad | but it's done |
| 16:09.59 | brlcad | decides to take even more leave |
| 16:10.21 | brlcad | I think I might actually burn through it all for once with all the time I've been taking off |
| 16:18.50 | claymore | nice :) |
| 16:19.16 | claymore | Pointless to stockpile it this early in your career! |
| 16:19.30 | claymore | is hungry. What are the lunch plans for everyone? |
| 16:19.32 | brlcad | oh, I don't build it up |
| 16:19.40 | brlcad | mine cashes out every year |
| 16:19.55 | claymore | Niceness then. |
| 16:20.02 | brlcad | it's a tradeoff |
| 16:20.07 | claymore | No wonder you can afford a house :) |
| 16:21.40 | claymore | Whats the word on the 'luncheon' today? |
| 16:21.58 | brlcad | I have even less idea of what's going on for that than you do I think |
| 16:22.11 | brlcad | haven't heard anything from erik |
| 16:22.27 | claymore | All i know is my tummy is empty, and it might riot if I wait too much longer :) |
| 16:22.28 | brlcad | I'm way too far away to participate regardless |
| 16:26.42 | claymore | Got a tenative closing date on the house yet? |
| 16:27.06 | brlcad | oh, that was set a couple weeks ago, it's in two weeks |
| 16:27.21 | claymore | outstanding! |
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| 16:35.23 | brlcad | waves to mafm_ |
| 16:38.10 | mafm_ | hi again |
| 16:55.40 | mafm_ | going to the alien greenhouse again, see you :) |
| 16:56.01 | mafm_ | or greenhouse for dissecting aliens, whatever :P |
| 16:56.07 | mafm_ | (our new datacenter) |
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| 17:18.22 | claymore | Erik: You actually on? |
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| 19:15.58 | claymore | yawns. |
| 19:29.01 | starseeker | seconds the yawn |
| 19:36.19 | claymore | feels ancy and unfocused. Hard to concentraite.... |
| 19:38.39 | starseeker | amen |
| 19:39.15 | claymore | should have brought in his PS-2. I need to satisfy my FF itch :) |
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| 20:23.46 | brlcad | just now finds out that tuesday is a holiday |
| 21:17.44 | starseeker | brlcad: Heh - well, you could work a normal day and have a 16 hour day, I suppose ;-) |
| 21:22.33 | starseeker | or, considering a normal brlcad work day, I suppose it would be 20+... |
| 21:53.44 | starseeker | takes the hint on how quiet the channel has become and proceeds to act like he has a life :-P |
| 22:08.59 | brlcad | heh |
| 22:09.38 | brlcad | the OSS activity has been at a curious low lately -- must publicize, activate, and inspire more! |
| 22:22.31 | brlcad | heads off to look for a digital measure |
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| 14:23.51 | iraytrace | Anyone using BRL-CAD on Leopard? |
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| 17:00.13 | *** topic/#brlcad by brlcad -> BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 21:12.54 | yukonbob | w00t |
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| 22:29.22 | louipc | that new release tarball really ballooned in size! |
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| 01:41.41 | brlcad | yeah, just a little bit |
| 01:42.34 | brlcad | about 20% larger than the previous biggest |
| 01:43.03 | brlcad | that'd be most new docs, boost, and libged |
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| 03:56.01 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 04:48.06 | CIA-25 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33155 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_track.c: aexists does not exist |
| 05:05.28 | CIA-25 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33156 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am lens.c): Needs more work and equation correctness checking, but upload a preliminary proc-db to create optical lenses. Currently does Plano-convex, Plano-concave, biconvex and biconcave. |
| 05:06.57 | starseeker | louipc: It's not likely to get much smaller - expecially if you want to bundle ogre and friends into it :-) |
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| 10:11.31 | clock_ | What was the maximum allowed speed on American highways in 1973? |
| 10:24.48 | Mouette | 7.14.0 compile succed , but it is not still included "adrt" |
| 10:25.28 | Mouette | compile "adrt" still failed |
| 11:08.07 | Mouette | the package 7.14.0 for solaris x86 is uploaded. |
| 11:08.34 | Mouette | waiting for your validate and check |
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| 13:22.24 | mafm | hi |
| 13:22.35 | claymore | hai! |
| 14:28.15 | mafm | huh |
| 14:28.31 | mafm | who dared to put that about the gui project in the topic? :D |
| 14:30.10 | claymore | They much be a witch... BURN THEM! |
| 14:31.01 | mafm | xD |
| 14:31.10 | mafm | I'd like to be scientific about that, nevertheless |
| 14:31.26 | mafm | let's first check whether they weight the same as a duck |
| 14:32.12 | claymore | with some of todays 'good looking women', the duck just might end up being heavier. |
| 14:34.10 | mafm | lol |
| 14:34.37 | mafm | well, burning those too is a win :) |
| 14:35.29 | claymore | Just watched the new remake of Get Smart this weekend. Oddly enough, pretty damn funny. Also, I need to shake Anne Hathaway's mother... grew her daughter right! |
| 14:35.56 | claymore | lol, I ment. I need to shake Anne Hathaway's Mother's hand... |
| 14:37.21 | mafm | hummmm |
| 14:37.28 | mafm | no comments :D |
| 14:38.30 | claymore | None needed. Its Anne Hathaway :) |
| 14:44.52 | mafm | http://www.topnews.in/light/files/anne-hathaway.jpg |
| 14:45.20 | mafm | so well, shaking her mother should be funny... |
| 14:50.50 | claymore | ...nah, not really into that MILF thing. O.o |
| 14:51.57 | mafm | :D |
| 14:52.17 | mafm | who knows, with today's surgery maybe it looks younger than the daughter |
| 14:53.50 | claymore | Surgery can't turn back the clock on all aspects of a person, and looks only matter to a certain point. |
| 14:54.08 | clock_ | turns back |
| 14:54.48 | claymore | clock: Don't you dare starting singing Cher! |
| 14:55.16 | claymore | waves at BRL-CAD! |
| 14:56.56 | mafm | haven't heard of sciencists erasing memory in mice? mind manipulation starts to be scarying too |
| 14:57.18 | mafm | Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind any day at your door |
| 14:57.39 | clock_ | mafm: maybe they erased your memory after you heard about them! |
| 14:58.03 | claymore | Great, just what we need. The threat of a Low Level Format of your head. :/ |
| 14:58.46 | clock_ | please insert a blank head into the MRI device A:/ |
| 14:58.46 | mafm | clock_: sometimes I feel like that, yep :) |
| 14:58.53 | clock_ | mafm: alcohol? |
| 15:00.06 | mafm | also, but it also happens naturally :) |
| 15:18.19 | louipc | waves at claymore |
| 15:39.17 | claymore | waves at louipc |
| 15:40.26 | clock_ | http://drawn.ca/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/november-4-2008.jpg |
| 15:40.28 | clock_ | :D |
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| 16:04.09 | claymore | Yeah, I saw that picture with a caption of "C-C-C-C-Combo Breaker!!!".... I lol'ed |
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| 17:23.46 | claymore | brlcad: You in today? |
| 19:12.14 | brlcad | begins to wonder if claymore is going to ask him every day if he's going to be in :) |
| 19:12.35 | brlcad | not with the holiday.. more productive |
| 19:19.53 | claymore | well, since you have no schedule, it has to be daily :P |
| 19:31.35 | brlcad | it's just more chaotic than usual because of the move |
| 19:32.56 | brlcad | more importantly, though .. |
| 19:32.57 | brlcad | ~ask |
| 19:32.58 | ibot | ask is probably Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic. Don't ask if you can ask a question first. Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them. Better questions more frequently yield better answers. We are all here voluntarily or against our will. |
| 19:32.59 | brlcad | :) |
| 19:35.54 | starseeker | scowls at the overall shape of the Mark IV and starts trying to parse it into primitives |
| 19:36.08 | CIA-25 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33157 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: the mac installer doesn't have the symbolic links |
| 19:45.08 | mafm | hi brlcad |
| 19:45.11 | mafm | going home, bye bye |
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| 20:53.15 | starseeker | is taken back to the days of his physics labs :-) http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/default_lens.png |
| 20:53.40 | starseeker | Now all I need to do is go back to that antiques store and buy that tank scope |
| 21:48.58 | brlcad | starseeker: that's pretty cool |
| 21:49.22 | brlcad | isn't sure the lightening is correct, but probably a limitation of phong |
| 21:50.14 | starseeker | always manages to break things in new and interesting ways that no one else will ever notice :-P |
| 21:50.41 | starseeker | thanks for the steer to the epa primitive, you were right that it could work |
| 21:51.04 | brlcad | isn't sure the lightening is correct, but probably a limitation of phong? |
| 21:51.07 | brlcad | that it could work? what do you mean |
| 21:51.12 | brlcad | oops for up-arrow |
| 21:51.37 | starseeker | The epa primitive, given the correct parameters, described the sub-section of a sphere needed |
| 21:52.13 | starseeker | It's actually pretty cool - the wireframes are EXACTLY on the lens surface :-) |
| 21:53.27 | starseeker | brlcad: IIRC, the conclusion was there are no open source libs we can grab that will do the point cloud -> mesh trick? |
| 21:56.46 | brlcad | oooh, for the lens |
| 21:57.04 | brlcad | I was thinking of what you were doing with the hyp primitive, never mind :) |
| 21:57.30 | brlcad | i'm sure there are some libs that could help with point could to meshes |
| 21:57.38 | brlcad | if anything, i'm sure there are some academic efforts |
| 21:58.06 | brlcad | that's been a hot research topic for as long as I can remember, new approaches each year doing slightly better for different aspects |
| 21:58.26 | brlcad | the naive approach can be coded up in a couple hours |
| 21:59.35 | starseeker | <snort> So far I've stumbled on Triangle, which is very definitely not free for commercial product use |
| 21:59.56 | starseeker | Is Delaunay triangulation the naive way? |
| 22:01.39 | brlcad | one of them, yeah |
| 22:01.58 | starseeker | And of course CGAL had to go and use QPL for their routines... |
| 22:02.22 | brlcad | even just trying nearest neighbor 'can' give reasonable results with the right input data sets -- it's just flimsy as heck |
| 22:02.41 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:03.35 | brlcad | the "libs" that do this aren't likely what would come up on a google search - you'd be better of looking at research papers on getting meshes from point clouds |
| 22:04.14 | brlcad | one I *loved* from around 5 years ago was awesome for performing dulaney triangulation on semi-ordered point cloud inputs using a streaming processing system |
| 22:04.47 | brlcad | emphasis there on being able to operate as a streaming processor .. that was the coolest part |
| 22:05.02 | starseeker | found this one, but there's no license at all even assuming it does what we want: http://www.den.rcast.u-tokyo.ac.jp/~yu-ohtake/software/index.html |
| 22:05.05 | starseeker | cool |
| 22:06.31 | brlcad | if you want to do that, I'd say just read up on the latest research (like last 5 years of papers from siggraphs and jgt) .. and then implement the best/easiest |
| 22:07.19 | starseeker | ok. |
| 22:07.35 | starseeker | supposes it's not essential, but hates relying on only commercial solutions |
| 22:08.33 | brlcad | we don't exactly rely on it -- we don't do anything with it at the moment |
| 22:08.50 | starseeker | heh, ok pont |
| 22:08.52 | starseeker | point |
| 22:09.37 | brlcad | point clouds as a starting point is historically a horrible starting point -- best just as reference points for the modeler |
| 22:09.54 | starseeker | had visions of cute little tricks like subtracting a CSG model from a mesh solid to check how close the CSG model was coming |
| 22:10.03 | brlcad | unless you can really control the quality of the input data (e.g. a point-by-point CMS) |
| 22:13.57 | brlcad | it's a great idea, but to date I've yet to see someone actually save time |
| 22:14.13 | brlcad | you just move the time spent on one task to another |
| 22:14.25 | starseeker | ah |
| 22:14.30 | starseeker | figures |
| 22:14.56 | brlcad | instead of direct modeling, you're not spending more time healing geometry, fixing mesh problems, stitching objects together, removing anamolies, and more |
| 22:15.36 | brlcad | there are some specific cases that do really well (e.g. single/simple meshes), but then you still usually need simplification and healing algorithms/tools in place |
| 22:17.10 | brlcad | now for tools that have really good mesh management tools already in place (which we really don't yet), the time sink can be reduced some, but you can still spend a lot of time working on segmentation and mesh separation |
| 22:17.26 | brlcad | whereas you otherwise could have just modeling it directly much more quickly |
| 22:17.42 | starseeker | So the best case is probably a scan + traditional methods, with the scan providing a get out of jail free card for missed dimensional measurements? |
| 22:19.11 | brlcad | scan data is usually most effective as reference data |
| 22:19.31 | brlcad | problem is people see all that data and invariable end up massaging thinking it'll be faster |
| 22:19.36 | starseeker | so what we would want then is a way to interrogate the point cloud using visual tools? |
| 22:20.46 | brlcad | interrogate, visualize, manipulate |
| 22:21.15 | starseeker | the new pnts primitive gets us visualization, so far? |
| 22:21.39 | brlcad | being able to interactive select sets of points and deleting those points or separating them into their own point sets, splitting points, etc .. that's all useful |
| 22:21.56 | brlcad | yeah, visualization is just about "done" or done well enough for now |
| 22:22.35 | starseeker | isn't sure how to handle visual 3D selection of point subsets |
| 22:22.47 | brlcad | new gui |
| 22:22.57 | starseeker | :-) |
| 22:22.57 | brlcad | meshes have the same issue |
| 22:23.08 | brlcad | there are ways to deal with it now, but they're clumsy |
| 22:23.15 | starseeker | OK. |
| 22:24.24 | starseeker | so extending MGED to manipulate point clouds is definitely not on the list |
| 22:32.59 | brlcad | from a command-perspective ala libged/librt, sure |
| 22:33.14 | brlcad | routines to manipulate points are needed regardless |
| 22:33.40 | brlcad | but making the gui mods .. not something I'd think would be worthwhile |
| 22:34.27 | starseeker | right |
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| 22:59.49 | starseeker | really must try meshlab |
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| 02:28.26 | starseeker | jeez no wonder there isn't an ebuild for meshlab |
| 02:40.45 | Ralith | ? |
| 02:49.02 | starseeker | messed up build procedure |
| 02:58.36 | Ralith | ah. |
| 02:58.38 | Ralith | those're no fun |
| 03:03.53 | starseeker | plus, after all that setup, a build error |
| 03:03.54 | starseeker | grr |
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| 03:35.23 | technovir | hi |
| 03:49.37 | yukonbob | hi cadheads |
| 05:05.27 | starseeker | plays with hugin |
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| 06:01.42 | starseeker | concludes he must have taken his photographs incorrectly |
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| 06:49.25 | starseeker | hmm - taking dimensionally useful photographs may be more of a challenge than I thought |
| 07:10.48 | Ralith | dimensionally useful? |
| 07:11.00 | Ralith | as in, photographs from which you can extract meaningful physical measurements? |
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| 11:19.37 | mafm | hi |
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| 14:49.45 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 14:55.58 | mafm | hi brlcad |
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| 15:42.30 | mafm | so what's up brlcad? spending holiday time in your projects? :) |
| 16:22.33 | brlcad | mafm: trying to |
| 16:22.56 | brlcad | little too much context switching with shopping, but about done |
| 16:31.07 | mafm | :0 |
| 16:31.08 | mafm | :) |
| 16:31.16 | mafm | context switching is annoying |
| 16:34.19 | brlcad | yeah |
| 16:40.13 | starseeker | Ralith: yeah |
| 16:43.00 | starseeker | brlcad: I suppose trying to assemble individual photographs into a whole while still have meaningful physical measurement ability isn't possible? |
| 16:43.05 | starseeker | or is at least really hard? |
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| 17:35.12 | starseeker | starts running mentally through the math... |
| 18:17.50 | brlcad | starseeker: it's possible and not "too" hard, but not trivial either -- depends on the input images and distortion types in the image |
| 18:18.12 | brlcad | you generally can't do anything more than stitch them together without knowing the distortion/lens/camera characteristics |
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| 18:45.03 | mafm | bye, I go home |
| 19:26.56 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 23:13.07 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 02:40.36 | starseeker | gets annoyed and runs MeshLab under wine |
| 02:42.13 | Ralith | heh |
| 03:28.25 | starseeker | filed bug report of crash, although I may have caught their svn trunk in a state of flux |
| 03:29.16 | starseeker | gets more interested the more he sees of Meshlab... |
| 03:29.35 | starseeker | GPL, so can't be tied into BRL-CAD directly, but may be a useful companion program |
| 03:29.42 | starseeker | on the mesh side at least |
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| 03:48.33 | starseeker | erm. ls of the pnts test case is crashing because the rt_functab[id].ft_describe being called at wdb_obj.c 9396 is set to 0 |
| 03:48.38 | starseeker | does clean rebuild |
| 03:48.44 | starseeker | that can't be right |
| 03:48.49 | starseeker | er, l not ls |
| 04:11.57 | starseeker | Ah, HA - http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/meshlab.png |
| 04:12.22 | starseeker | what a difference a few days makes |
| 04:12.27 | starseeker | (in revision history) |
| 04:26.00 | starseeker | really should get back to automake, but is for some reason possessed by a fit of temporary interest in the image and point cloud/mesh aspects of all this... |
| 05:11.28 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r33158 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/pcMathGrammar.h: Different closures for MathVM expressions |
| 06:31.58 | starseeker | OK, clean rebuild of latest trunk on gentoo, running l on the point object causes a seg fault |
| 06:32.33 | starseeker | grr |
| 06:32.38 | starseeker | sleeps on it |
| 07:00.11 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33159 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/wdb_obj.c: prevent primitives that don't have describe() implemented from crashing. this was happening with the new point primitive. the real fix is for all primitives to define all functions, but this shouldn't crash regardless. |
| 07:52.23 | brlcad | stops coding on pnts for a bit |
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| 11:32.52 | claymore | Mornin all. |
| 11:48.00 | claymore | brlcad: So I have been doing lots of thinking about the UUName implimentation. What about using a URI? Nearly the same thing. Well, actually, I cannot find a difference between the two concepts actually :) |
| 11:48.36 | claymore | Erik and I had a decent talk last week and he brought up a good point about potiential file system issues should we attempt to spawn too many small files. |
| 11:49.55 | claymore | So since a brlcad db file is really just another filesystem, but only 'in a can' then why not abstract the URI away from both the Computer's File system AND the brlcad File system? |
| 11:50.11 | claymore | for instance: |
| 11:50.17 | claymore | given the URI of: |
| 11:51.05 | claymore | cad://dloman@sassyhost/hardware/fasteners/bolts.g/9.16th/3inch/aluminum/dwaynesbolt/bolt01.s |
| 11:51.28 | claymore | from the actual storage aspect of it: |
| 11:51.53 | claymore | 'hardware' and 'fasteners' are directories on the computer's Filesystem |
| 11:52.11 | claymore | 'bolts.g' is a file (duh) |
| 11:52.49 | claymore | '9.16th', '3inch' and 'aluminum' are all combinations inside the db file. |
| 11:53.00 | claymore | 'dwaynesbolt' is a region (in the db file) |
| 11:53.14 | claymore | and 'bolt01.s' is a solid (in the db file) |
| 11:53.32 | claymore | BUT, as seen by the user of iBME: |
| 11:54.22 | claymore | 'hardware', 'fasteners', 'bolts.g', '9.16th', '3inch' and 'aluminum' are all combinations. |
| 11:54.30 | claymore | 'dwaynesbolt' is a region. |
| 11:54.44 | claymore | > and 'bolt01.s' is a solid . |
| 11:55.47 | claymore | Note that the 'bolts.g' need not have the .g extention. I just put it there to make it obvious where the switch from OS-FS to BRLCAD-DB occured. |
| 11:56.36 | claymore | This would allow the admin of a given iBME installation to place the 'FS-transition point' anywhere in the heirarchy of storage on their system. |
| 11:57.47 | claymore | this should address the problems of: 1) Too many small files will eat up the inodes too fast. 2) Fewer ginormous files might impact performance and be the source of more SVN conflicts |
| 11:58.03 | claymore | breaths finally. |
| 11:58.28 | claymore | Comments? ;) |
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| 13:12.13 | mafm | hi |
| 13:12.29 | claymore | hai! |
| 13:45.37 | brlcad | claymore: using a URI isn't much different than what I was talking about last week about using a URL (as a URL is a URI) |
| 13:46.05 | claymore | righto. Was thinking of using URI in place or a UUNAME |
| 13:46.11 | claymore | in place of |
| 13:46.18 | brlcad | really don't want to get stuck in the weeds, though as both those issues are optimization issues |
| 13:46.32 | brlcad | and as the saying goes, premature optimization is the root of all evil |
| 13:47.04 | claymore | ...right, but how we look up resources is a foundation.... need to pick *something* |
| 13:47.24 | brlcad | sure, but that doesn't have anything to do with what actually happens on the data store side |
| 13:47.36 | claymore | so I picked a URI, but not necessarily a Unique uri quite yet. |
| 13:47.43 | brlcad | they could be tied together, but they certainly don't need to |
| 13:49.25 | brlcad | the only (hard) problem to be solved with using a URL (I don't see the need to use URNs at this point so we really should already be limited to URLs, URI is the superset) is uniqueness across the DAG |
| 13:50.23 | claymore | thats why I was asking about the whole 'Is a dag still a dag when its laid out like a tree, but just references other branches' |
| 13:50.41 | brlcad | or more perhaps more importantly, non-uniqueness .. how to identify that the same object is used in different contexts but also has its own context |
| 13:51.31 | claymore | I am pretty sure that how I have it laid out will be able to handle using a single object in multiple contexts. |
| 13:52.48 | claymore | thats all brlcad does now in its db is use refernces & matricies..... single object multiple contexts... |
| 13:53.05 | brlcad | referentially, it's representable by a DAG regardless of how it's encoded -- the DAG is only "broken" if you replicate data (e.g. turn it into a binary tree) |
| 13:53.43 | claymore | don't quite understand the 'replicate data' statement. |
| 13:53.45 | brlcad | sure, but the only way we get away with that now is through a file-scoped namespace |
| 13:54.37 | brlcad | we're not going to have a file-scope any more so we're either stuck implementing some scoping mechanism or finding a better uniqueness identification scheme not based on scope |
| 13:54.52 | claymore | Exactly, file scoped namespace can be synonymous to a system using truely Unique URI's....right? |
| 13:56.41 | brlcad | it's not clear what you mean by 'using truely unique URIs' -- before going down that path, do you get the difference between URIs, URLs, and URNs? |
| 13:57.04 | claymore | URI and URL yes... not familiar with URNs |
| 13:57.24 | brlcad | you can't really understand uri's without urn's :) |
| 13:58.00 | claymore | so I see. :) Yes I get the differences. |
| 13:58.02 | brlcad | they're simple -- it's sort of like the difference between your postal address and your name |
| 13:58.29 | brlcad | both urls and urns are uris |
| 13:59.13 | brlcad | uri is just "handle on something", url is "here's a location for this thing", urn is "here is the name of something" |
| 13:59.46 | claymore | Okay, so we can use URNs as what I was calling UUName, and URL's as the mechanism to look up these resources..... |
| 14:00.37 | brlcad | and the line between the two is pretty fuzzy, but for talking point purposes, urn is probably equivalent to some cad://UUID protocol, url would be how objects are located in the object store, uri is just a generic term that refers to finding something |
| 14:02.59 | brlcad | fwiw, UUID is not /path/to/some/object, UUID is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UUID -- that's the thing that I was talking about that if we use them, they shouldn't be exposed anywhere |
| 14:03.19 | claymore | understood the UUID concepts. |
| 14:03.51 | brlcad | hence the discussion lending towards using a URL scheme that manages the scoping issues (but again has little/nothing to do with the implementation) |
| 14:03.57 | claymore | But the more I look over and plan things out, the less I see the need for a UUID since a good URL will give us what we need anyways... |
| 14:04.33 | brlcad | absolutely, that will be a good feature as it'd reduce complexity |
| 14:04.44 | brlcad | and I'm all about keeping things as simple as possible for starters :) |
| 14:05.00 | claymore | Sorry its taking me so long to finally come around to what you have been saying all along lol :) |
| 14:05.23 | brlcad | but I do think (for better or worse) that it probably will eventually be needed to really solve the referencing problems |
| 14:05.43 | claymore | ... what will be needed? "URL's" ? |
| 14:05.44 | brlcad | i'd be happy to be wrong on that point, though :) |
| 14:05.50 | brlcad | uuid's |
| 14:06.30 | claymore | Hrm. Guess i dont see the referencing problem then... |
| 14:08.01 | claymore | if the URL's used are truely Unique, then having any combination refer to another object is as simple as using the URL.... |
| 14:08.08 | claymore | ...and a matrix :) |
| 14:08.27 | brlcad | hm, how to describe |
| 14:08.45 | claymore | lol, slowly appreantly. |
| 14:08.54 | brlcad | you can have two unique URLs that refer to the same object in different contexts or in the same context even |
| 14:09.02 | claymore | tries to make his brain more receptive. |
| 14:10.09 | claymore | Okay, got that part... |
| 14:10.43 | brlcad | it's like how many ways can I describe your address -- there are lots of paths to get there, but for our purposes we need to know that paths /A/B/C and /D/E/C both lead to the same C for the purposes of applying operations and managing the geometry effectively |
| 14:11.12 | brlcad | and "C" is not a unique key, so we can't just use that |
| 14:12.23 | claymore | True. But here's what I thought: |
| 14:12.29 | brlcad | also don't really want to enforce a global namespace on all object names (e.g. I cannot name my sphere "sph" because there is already one 'somewhere' in the system) |
| 14:12.48 | claymore | 'c' is the object, which isn't unique. |
| 14:12.53 | brlcad | objects are initially created context-less too |
| 14:12.57 | brlcad | s/less/free/ |
| 14:13.29 | claymore | a/b/c is the URL, which IS unique and differs from all other things because a/b/c is NOT d/e/c |
| 14:13.54 | starseeker | does happy dance - got cell data converted to a mesh in Meshlab and loaded into mged as a dxf |
| 14:14.12 | claymore | gives starseeker a 'good game' |
| 14:14.19 | claymore | :) |
| 14:14.46 | starseeker | we now return you to your regularly scheduled URL lesson :-P |
| 14:15.19 | brlcad | starseeker: I applied a patch for the l crash, but haven't tested it |
| 14:15.39 | claymore | brlcad: so, having 'c' by itself really doen't mean much, because on can only refer to an object by using its URL. |
| 14:15.51 | starseeker | brlcad: works |
| 14:16.01 | brlcad | "because on can" hm? |
| 14:16.02 | starseeker | cell.s: list support unimplemented |
| 14:16.08 | brlcad | ah, one |
| 14:16.27 | claymore | laughs and points at himself. Bad engrish day... as usual. |
| 14:16.46 | starseeker | cheers engrish |
| 14:17.34 | starseeker | brlcad: unfortunately, for some reason I still don't get anything with e cell.s |
| 14:18.14 | starseeker | yet the .g is over a meg, so there's clearly something in there |
| 14:18.40 | brlcad | starseeker: hrm, you sure they're not just dots the same color as your background or something? |
| 14:19.15 | starseeker | I doubt it - I'm using my custom tanish background color |
| 14:19.22 | starseeker | tweaks just to be sure |
| 14:19.55 | starseeker | nope |
| 14:20.37 | brlcad | try a db get |
| 14:20.41 | starseeker | when I add a weight factor I get one sphere, without it I get one xyz coordinate |
| 14:20.45 | brlcad | try manually creating just two points :) |
| 14:20.58 | starseeker | seg fault |
| 14:21.04 | starseeker | on the dbget |
| 14:21.17 | brlcad | hrm, sounds like another place that needs patching |
| 14:21.21 | brlcad | ah right |
| 14:21.58 | starseeker | creating just two points, I get one sphere |
| 14:21.58 | brlcad | that calls _adjust() which probably isn't implemented |
| 14:22.18 | brlcad | and probably not protected like _describe() .. you should apply a similar fix :) |
| 14:22.31 | starseeker | ok |
| 14:22.36 | starseeker | makes note |
| 14:22.36 | brlcad | they're crashes that should only occur with incomplete primitives, but good to fix regardless |
| 14:23.09 | brlcad | did you create it interactively or as one long in line? |
| 14:23.14 | starseeker | interactively |
| 14:23.26 | brlcad | hrm |
| 14:23.31 | starseeker | claymore: sorry |
| 14:23.36 | brlcad | well no matter, I've rewritten most of that already |
| 14:23.40 | starseeker | :-) |
| 14:23.55 | claymore | no worries:) Brain Neaing Capacity warning light was on anyways. |
| 14:24.01 | starseeker | brlcad: is it OK to post screenshots with that cell data or is that a no-no? |
| 14:24.04 | claymore | Nearing |
| 14:24.32 | louipc | |
| 14:24.41 | brlcad | adding support for normals/vectors, per-point scaling, per-point colors, adds quite a bit of complexity |
| 14:24.53 | starseeker | eeep. |
| 14:24.58 | starseeker | can see how it would |
| 14:25.12 | brlcad | isn't sure what cell data you're referring to |
| 14:25.25 | starseeker | the one you bounced to me a few days ago as a points example |
| 14:25.30 | starseeker | in with the presentations |
| 14:25.51 | brlcad | the engine? |
| 14:26.12 | starseeker | don't think so - it's just a point cloud from a scan of a blackberry or some such |
| 14:26.53 | starseeker | nevermind |
| 14:26.57 | starseeker | not all that exciting |
| 14:27.00 | brlcad | I've not seen that yet, but afaik, there's nothing you have you can't show that crowd |
| 14:28.03 | starseeker | ok |
| 14:28.04 | brlcad | and if it's a phone, especially .. that's probably someone's personal phone |
| 14:28.12 | starseeker | sure |
| 14:29.19 | starseeker | moot point anyway as yet - I doubt they'd care about Meshlab screenshots |
| 14:29.25 | starseeker | needs MGED :-) |
| 14:29.35 | starseeker | I'll try again at work on the Mac |
| 14:30.08 | starseeker | speaking of which... |
| 14:30.12 | brlcad | I don't get why it wouldn't work for you -- the last revision was working before release |
| 14:30.26 | starseeker | For some reason it's never worked on this box |
| 14:30.26 | brlcad | maybe something didn't get committed, or something did that shouldn't have, dunno |
| 14:30.37 | starseeker | hasn't tested at work yet |
| 14:30.49 | brlcad | should just fix it regardless of the cause ;) |
| 14:31.03 | starseeker | probably you already have :-) |
| 14:31.08 | brlcad | implement 'l' so you can at least see the data |
| 14:31.20 | brlcad | i've not implemented l |
| 14:31.30 | starseeker | is guessing whatever walks the pnts data to draw it is just hanging up somehow on the first point |
| 14:31.36 | starseeker | right |
| 14:31.57 | starseeker | l should be easy enough |
| 14:33.21 | starseeker | hits the road and hopes the road won't hit back |
| 14:33.53 | claymore | loves pineapple... yum! |
| 14:34.11 | brlcad | does similar though with probably a lot more pitstops |
| 14:35.05 | claymore | brlcad: lee has been in twice and looked at your desk each time. Just a heads up :) |
| 14:35.50 | brlcad | claymore: okay |
| 14:55.45 | claymore | erik: you alive? |
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| 16:51.21 | ``Erik | at times, yes, 'sup? |
| 17:15.53 | claymore | Just havent heard anything from ya in a bit. |
| 17:43.57 | ``Erik | was down sick :/ fortunately, rdo+holiday covered me on that *sigh* still feeling like crap, but far less bad |
| 17:44.32 | claymore | well glad to hear you're feeling better then. just the standard cold? |
| 17:46.33 | ``Erik | not sure, stuffed sinus, nausea, headache, deep cough, fever, delirium, bad interplay between it all and the alcohol :( |
| 17:47.20 | claymore | hell that sounds horrid. were you well enough to at least get some good mmo time in? |
| 17:47.41 | ``Erik | no, I couldn't even be assed to reset my cable modem or dick with a 'puter |
| 17:47.59 | ``Erik | I got my new macbook monday, it's sitting on my floor halfway through the initial configuration |
| 17:48.18 | claymore | sassy :) |
| 17:49.30 | ``Erik | and someone scrapped my fleet, plundered the tr's and got the derbs while I was down, effin' lame |
| 17:49.49 | claymore | whoa... which planet? |
| 17:50.04 | ``Erik | one in 65, I'll post br when I'm caught up on some stuff |
| 17:50.12 | claymore | kk. |
| 17:50.36 | claymore | there is a serious buildup of 7E in E37:44, so watch out. That 'nick' guy is pulling about about 1.6 mil. |
| 17:50.57 | ``Erik | I'd moved fighters and stuff off to my newest for growth cover intending to cycle them back up quickly, but I stopped focusing on it all :( |
| 17:53.17 | claymore | yeah, I have lost a bit of focus also. Mostly simming now ;) |
| 18:09.05 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33160 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/ (BME.eap GS.eap): Continuing Architecture Work. |
| 20:19.34 | mafm | I go home, see you! |
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| 23:58.33 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33161 10/brlcad/trunk/src/util/Makefile.am: old automake can't deal with per-product CPPFLAGS so make bombardier use CFLAGS instead |
| 00:44.27 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33162 10/jbrlcad/trunk/ (90 files in 13 dirs): Refactored package names (they all start with "org.brlcad" now) |
| 00:56.10 | Ralith | jbrlcad is actually active? |
| 00:57.56 | Ralith | isn't sure whether this is a good thing |
| 01:11.51 | brlcad | Ralith: yeah, there is some light activity |
| 01:12.31 | Ralith | that is amusing |
| 01:12.52 | Ralith | in light of the barriers to tweaking vector syntax due to performance impact |
| 01:16.11 | brlcad | until the geometry service is online, the jbrlcad approach is pretty convenient for them just because it's just barely enough to open a binary .g file without needing a JNI layer |
| 01:17.02 | brlcad | well the project they're using it for has a completely different perspective and set of requirements for performance than we do for modeling purposes |
| 01:17.05 | Ralith | ah. |
| 01:17.33 | brlcad | the vector syntax is at the heart of ray-tracing too .. and jbrlcad is nowhere near being a replacement to actually shoot rays |
| 01:17.43 | Ralith | well, yeah |
| 01:17.44 | brlcad | it'll shoot at a few of the simple primitives |
| 01:17.47 | Ralith | still |
| 01:17.52 | Ralith | it made a nice visceral comparison :P |
| 01:18.08 | Ralith | (bet you didn't expect to see that applied to code!) |
| 01:18.21 | brlcad | what do you mean? |
| 01:18.56 | Ralith | the word visceral |
| 01:26.38 | ``Erik | klingon code does not have parameters. it has arguments. and it always wins them! |
| 01:26.45 | ``Erik | runs autogen.sh on his new macbook |
| 01:28.12 | Ralith | hehe |
| 01:31.58 | brlcad | Ralith: ah, heh, k |
| 01:32.23 | Ralith | worried I'd snuck in a commit while nobody was watching, or something? :P |
| 02:03.52 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33163 10/jbrlcad/trunk/ (build.xml test/test.g): Added build.xml and test.g |
| 02:08.46 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33164 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Removed empty directories |
| 02:32.11 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33165 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/org/brlcad/ (info/ info/RegionInfo.java samples/GetRegionMap.java): Refactored GetRegionMap.java to create a Regionlnfo class |
| 02:51.15 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33166 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/org/brlcad/info/RegionInfo.java: Added map from ident to region path |
| 06:23.50 | starseeker | OK, here's the point cloud -> mesh process via open source only tools |
| 06:24.24 | starseeker | step 1 - take xyz point cloud and stick a v in front of each point, save as a .obj file |
| 06:24.34 | starseeker | step 2 - import into meshlab: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/phone_meshlab_pnts.png |
| 06:27.08 | starseeker | Run Filters->Ball Pivoting Surface Reconstruction to build the mesh (for the screenshot extra colorizing was applied to improve the visual effect): http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/phone_meshlab_mesh.png |
| 06:28.02 | starseeker | Save the result as a .dxf file, import into MGED using dxf-g, and raytrace: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/phone_mged_render.png |
| 06:29.01 | starseeker | there are probably lots of things that could have been done to improve the mesh once generated inside meshlab, but for the purposes of quick illustration of the possibility it's not bad |
| 06:29.14 | starseeker | at least for a completely free toolchain :-) |
| 06:48.51 | Axman6 | starseeker: nice :) |
| 06:49.18 | Axman6 | not sure what you did, but it looks cool |
| 07:28.47 | Ralith | I wonder why the screen has such mangled height information |
| 07:28.52 | Ralith | reflective I guess |
| 07:28.55 | Ralith | or something |
| 07:38.41 | Ralith | I'd be amazed if that algo couldn't be optimized to find flat surface, though |
| 07:38.46 | Ralith | and it did a remarkably bad job on the backdrop |
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| 07:56.00 | louipc | /clear/clear |
| 08:17.28 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33167 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/color.c: implement bu_color_to_rgb_floats and bu_color_of_rgb_floats so the points primitive can use them. untested but they seem trivial enough given they match the internal format of bu_color structures. |
| 08:18.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33168 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bu.h: don't speculate. only declare the interfaces that are actually provided by libbu. commented out a handful of bu_color_* conversion routines that were apparently never implemented. |
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| 11:54.36 | mafm | hi |
| 12:11.28 | AFK-claymore | Mornin all! |
| 12:16.05 | claymore | starseeker: Been doing lots of thinking about your image-stiching-then-measuring idea... I am wondering if there is a way to 'use a flash' on the camera to eliminate shadows... THEN a conversion to greyscale and subsequent heightmap extrusion into a mesh *MIGHT* actually work! |
| 13:03.39 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33169 10/jbrlcad/trunk/src/org/brlcad/ (info/RegionInfo.java samples/GetRegionMap.java): Slight Improvement in the way RegionInfo is constructed |
| 13:08.15 | dloman | go go jBRLCAD |
| 13:54.14 | mafm | NullPointerException |
| 13:54.16 | mafm | :P |
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| 14:29.04 | starseeker | growl |
| 14:29.43 | starseeker | either my camera is wrong about its parameters, I don't have enough vertical and horizontal features to get a good read, or something is buggered |
| 14:31.17 | dloman | what camera do you have? |
| 14:31.24 | starseeker | Canon A540 |
| 14:32.18 | starseeker | Or I could just be so damn close to the thing that parallax is killing me for any dimension more than a foot or so away from camera lens center |
| 14:32.29 | dloman | decent camera. What do you mean by 'vert and horx' features? |
| 14:32.35 | dloman | horx = horz |
| 14:33.13 | starseeker | I'm distorting pictures of a tank to try and get an orthogonal photo of the whole side of it, but trying to do so is not resulting in images that can be cleanly overlapped |
| 14:34.56 | dloman | distorting how? on the edges? |
| 14:35.37 | starseeker | correcting for lens effects and (hopefully) perspective |
| 14:36.07 | dloman | have you tried a wide angle lens if you are so close up? |
| 14:36.21 | starseeker | should, but I only have one camera |
| 14:36.27 | starseeker | and zero budget |
| 14:37.05 | starseeker | http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/overlap_example.png |
| 14:37.10 | starseeker | that's what's happening |
| 14:37.49 | starseeker | notice the center area where everything lines up, and things on the overlayed image sort of radiate displacement from that aligned center |
| 14:38.44 | starseeker | I can manually fiddle a bit, but it will only get but so close |
| 14:39.07 | starseeker | and the whole point was to be able to get automatically an image that can yield dimensional information |
| 14:39.24 | starseeker | clearly not much chance of that here :-( |
| 14:40.16 | starseeker | I might be able to do OK in individual images if I have an on-site measurement to calibrate each one, but if I can't correct to the point where they overlap that's suspect |
| 14:40.30 | starseeker | I guess I need to sit down and actually work through the math |
| 14:41.41 | starseeker | It may be I can only expect a teeny tiny reasonable area from this distance, or perhaps a wide angle lens would help too |
| 14:43.20 | starseeker | I can upload the available image sets if anybody knows how to do this better and is interested |
| 14:44.14 | dloman | sorry, was on phone. |
| 14:44.19 | starseeker | np |
| 14:44.28 | ``Erik | what formula are you using for adjustment as you deviate from the center of the lense? I'm sure it's not a perfectly linear transition |
| 14:44.53 | starseeker | I was trying to use Hugin to get a rectilinear transformation |
| 14:45.24 | ``Erik | doesn't it use regional morphing at the seams? |
| 14:45.33 | starseeker | isn't sure |
| 14:45.46 | dloman | our back up camera is a Canon A650IS, so its very similar to your 540. On the front, around the retractable lense, is a detachable retainer ring. You can pull that ring off, add an extention tube, and fix std size canon lenses/filters on the end. |
| 14:46.29 | dloman | we have the extion tube, a .48x wide angle and a 50-200 tele lense for it that you are more than welcome to borrow. |
| 14:46.59 | ``Erik | pheer my ancient olympus crap box that's been dropped and abused so much that it no longer works right O.o work policies have be being safe and simply not owning one, would hate to accidently leave it in the car and get in trouble |
| 14:47.01 | dloman | also, I can get my rebel xti and brind it to the museum someday if you need it. |
| 14:48.03 | dloman | erik: easy enough to get around. You are allowed to have a camera on base, just not in the secure compound. On the days I bring cameras on base, I just park in the lot in front of 328. |
| 14:48.25 | dloman | besides, I need to walk more anyways. *pats gut* |
| 14:48.46 | ``Erik | I've thought about that |
| 14:48.56 | ``Erik | parking infront of 328 and walking more, not your gut, settle down |
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| 14:49.07 | starseeker | dloman: That could be awesome - thank you! Let me crunch some numbers first though - I think it's time to figure out what the theoretical limits are (also a good way to figure out what the *beep* I'm doing) |
| 14:49.26 | starseeker | ah, good point |
| 14:49.37 | starseeker | needs to park in front of 328 - forgot about that |
| 14:50.31 | dloman | starseeker: based on what I am seeing in the pick you linked, the left to right seams look okay, but you are getting some serious top & bottom parallax. If you stiched 3 pics across, you should stitch 3 up as well to make the 3x3. right now it looks like a 3x1... |
| 14:50.45 | dloman | Oh, standup branch meeting in 10 mins |
| 14:50.48 | dloman | yay |
| 14:50.57 | starseeker | ah, crap |
| 14:51.01 | starseeker | take notes for me |
| 14:51.06 | dloman | will do. |
| 14:51.11 | ``Erik | vagually recalls making a stink about vertical parallax yesterday afternoon :D |
| 14:51.22 | starseeker | yeah yeah |
| 14:51.23 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33170 10/rt^3/trunk/ (8 files in 2 dirs): demonstration of an idea of how BRL-CAD database objects could be addressed from an external application |
| 14:51.25 | starseeker | you were right |
| 14:51.36 | starseeker | I just hoped it'd be a tad less severe |
| 14:52.46 | starseeker | Well, here are the "artsy" shots anyway: p5B14FA20 |
| 14:52.53 | starseeker | er http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/markiv/ |
| 14:52.57 | dloman | tbh, minimizing parallax is easy. Just stand 500 ft away and use a telephoto. |
| 14:53.01 | dloman | :) |
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| 14:53.19 | starseeker | yeah, great - we'll just have them move the tank to the middle of the field |
| 14:53.25 | ``Erik | heh, I vagually recall saying something like that, too, except I think I said 'optical zoom', cuz I'm not really a camera weenie |
| 14:53.32 | starseeker | and watch it fall apart in a cloud of rust dust... |
| 14:53.59 | dloman | is there a reason you picked *this* tank? |
| 14:54.20 | ``Erik | ancient and historic |
| 14:54.30 | starseeker | that's part of it - no one will care about it :-) |
| 14:54.40 | ``Erik | hopes the names on the side are crew signatures and not recent additions :( |
| 14:54.53 | dloman | or could you pick a tank on the edge of the museum where we *can* be 500+ ft away, on a tripod, with a telephoto? |
| 14:55.20 | starseeker | plus there have been some scans done on this one - I'm hoping having more data available as a control will allow "checks" on various techniques |
| 14:55.30 | starseeker | oh, sure |
| 14:55.59 | starseeker | if you don't get taken out by sniper fire for wandering around with a big telephoto on a military base ;-) |
| 14:56.00 | ``Erik | ancient american ones may have historic blueprints or design information available via our library |
| 14:56.23 | ``Erik | no, you'll get 5 trucks show up awfully fast if they got concerned |
| 14:56.30 | starseeker | there aren't any american tanks I'm aware of ancient enough to be out of copyright in the US |
| 14:56.35 | dloman | You drastically over estimate the security here.... :/ |
| 14:56.38 | ``Erik | bad form to shoot tourists in the us |
| 14:56.39 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:56.48 | starseeker | aw |
| 14:57.14 | dloman | meeting time. |
| 14:57.18 | ``Erik | ayup |
| 14:57.19 | starseeker | k |
| 14:57.22 | starseeker | I |
| 14:57.28 | starseeker | m heading in now |
| 14:57.52 | starseeker | sighs - at least Ed will like the math part |
| 15:04.15 | PrezKennedy | maths is hard! |
| 15:25.58 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33171 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: make the magic number be an unsigned long |
| 15:26.39 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33172 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: remove the wdb_fflush declaration since the implementation was removed earlier |
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| 15:36.33 | dloman | Prez: I think that its *awesome* that the statement you uttered is nearly identical to what the very first 'talking Barbie' said :) Imagine that... a disproportioned blonde bombshell stating "Math is hard." LOL |
| 15:39.00 | clock_ | In that case Math is a name of a male. |
| 15:39.12 | clock_ | Maybe abbreviation of Mathew? |
| 15:40.19 | dloman | ewww... bad joke clock :( |
| 15:58.33 | ``Erik | in a class all his own |
| 16:00.00 | dloman | Erik: Hopefully not Special Ed Clas..... ;) |
| 16:00.25 | ``Erik | aw, c'mon now, hockey helmets alone bring things up to a positive number |
| 16:00.34 | ``Erik | O:-) |
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| 16:01.29 | dloman | timmehhh! |
| 16:02.24 | dloman | is begining to question brlcad's existance. |
| 16:02.46 | ``Erik | heh |
| 16:03.20 | ``Erik | well, he's committing, so unless it's an at job or something |
| 16:04.32 | dloman | or.... its the super AI computer he created just prior to his death and that computer has been working on BRLCAD ever since...... O.o |
| 16:04.40 | ``Erik | uhm |
| 16:05.01 | ``Erik | that was 12 years ago, the thing you've seen in the office is animatronic |
| 16:05.17 | ``Erik | (explains a lot, don't it?) |
| 16:05.46 | dloman | speaking of potentially horrid plotlines, has anyone seen that new series 'The Seeker of Truth' or something like that? |
| 16:05.57 | dloman | supposedly based on T Goodkinds books. |
| 16:06.17 | dloman | Missed the first 2 episodes, but wanted to see at least one. Anyone? |
| 16:13.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33173 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c mged/typein.c): (log message trimmed) |
| 16:13.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: okay, so commit this since this is at least back into a compiling state. this |
| 16:13.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: adds support for reading in pnts that optionally have an orientation, per-point |
| 16:13.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: color values, and per-point sizes. the typein interface is slightly different |
| 16:13.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: from others in that it asks a handful of yes/no questions that then determines |
| 16:13.45 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: the variable number of arguments that follow. export support is only done for |
| 16:13.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: two of the eight pnt types and import support is just wrong (it'll crash if you |
| 16:16.18 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33174 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: pnts needs some work. import, export, and file input. |
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| 17:03.20 | mafm | brlcad: what do you use for indentation of source code files? emacs or some command line tool (or emacs command of some sort?) |
| 18:08.23 | brlcad | mafm: emacs does a great job at indentation, there are a variety of commands you can use |
| 18:08.58 | mafm | but it's cumbersome to iterate over all files of a hierarchy by hand :) |
| 18:09.11 | brlcad | there's a script in the brlcad repository to that will automatically indent all files in a directory |
| 18:09.21 | brlcad | that's what find is for ;) |
| 18:09.42 | brlcad | find src/librt -name \*.c -exec sh/indent.sh {} \; |
| 18:11.07 | brlcad | most effective if you ensure that the files all have a local variables footer first so it kicks off the right style |
| 18:11.41 | brlcad | (there's a script for that too, sh/footer.sh) |
| 18:11.50 | mafm | that I already added with find command :) |
| 18:13.55 | brlcad | fwiw, the emacs command is 'indent-region' -- it applies whatever style is currently set for the given mode |
| 18:13.55 | mafm | ok, so I was asking for the contents of indent.sh |
| 18:13.57 | mafm | thanks :) |
| 18:14.37 | mafm | yes, but if you do it by hand you have to open each file, select the beginning, go to de end, and execute the "indent-region" thing |
| 18:14.58 | mafm | which I do for individual files, but not very suitable for a lot of them at once :) |
| 18:15.24 | brlcad | indent.sh basically runs: emacs -batch -f batch-indent-region which is a function I wrote, lives in misc/batch-indent-region.el |
| 18:16.19 | brlcad | that overrides case-label and statement-case-open so that switch/case statements indent properly, marks the whole file as a region, then runs indent-region |
| 18:16.29 | brlcad | and saves the file |
| 18:17.17 | brlcad | emacs -batch -l batch-indent-region.el -f batch-indent-region *.c |
| 18:17.29 | mafm | yup, I was already digging |
| 18:17.32 | mafm | nice |
| 18:17.47 | mafm | so that's why knowing LISP is worth! |
| 18:17.49 | mafm | :P |
| 18:18.02 | brlcad | yup |
| 18:18.43 | mafm | doesn't "indent" or similar tools do the same job? |
| 18:19.13 | brlcad | for C, sure |
| 18:19.58 | brlcad | but I think emacs even handles C a bit better (and a variety of common styles are predefined, not just gnu's) |
| 18:20.03 | mafm | do they understand the local variables thing? |
| 18:20.14 | mafm | ah, so indent is hardcoded somehow |
| 18:20.25 | brlcad | add to that the fact that emacs handles dozens of other languages and you have a winning indentation setup |
| 18:20.54 | brlcad | they == who? |
| 18:21.05 | brlcad | indent doesn't know about local vars, that's an emacs thing |
| 18:21.24 | mafm | they, indent-like tools |
| 18:21.31 | brlcad | run 'indent' on some c++ code and you'll see how it sucks nuts |
| 18:21.41 | mafm | oh :) |
| 18:21.56 | brlcad | gnu indent does a little better |
| 18:22.13 | brlcad | bsd indent is C-only iirc |
| 18:23.24 | brlcad | bcpp would normally be what you'd use instead of indent if you had c++ |
| 18:23.59 | brlcad | but then you have multiple sets of indenters, inconsistent indent rules .. emacs makes it a lot easier to make it all uniform |
| 18:25.28 | ``Erik | bsd indent breaks c++ like ma |
| 18:25.35 | ``Erik | mad |
| 18:25.41 | mafm | it's not very coherent, it seems :D |
| 18:26.00 | mafm | when I open the file again by hand and press tab, it reindents some stuff |
| 18:26.41 | mafm | (in emacs) |
| 18:27.37 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33175 10/brlcad/trunk/include/conf/Makefile.am: since we print the timestamp, that's good enough indication that each invocation of make generates a new timestamp |
| 18:28.30 | ``Erik | both classic (bsd) indent and gindent to mess stuf up a bit, I tend to use the '=' command in vim to fix things up if I can... one of the things that emacs has been annoying me with is how poorly it indents lisp code :( (yeah, wtf) |
| 19:00.29 | brlcad | mafm: tab can be bound to lots of different things -- depending on how you have things set up |
| 19:01.29 | brlcad | ``Erik: that's probably just the default lisp style -- it's fully configurable.. default indent for C code sucks horribly too because it defaults to gnu style (which hardly anybody but gnu projects use) |
| 19:04.43 | ``Erik | meh, vim needed some C tweaking, too, but the lisp formatting came out of the box spot on... (of course, that's CL style, not elisp) :) |
| 19:05.16 | ``Erik | it's easier to bitch than to learn how to fix the defaults in the config file :) |
| 19:05.36 | ``Erik | will continue using both |
| 19:10.01 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33176 10/brlcad/trunk/regress/repository.sh: |
| 19:10.01 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: add a cppflags check to make sure there are not per-product cppflags being set. |
| 19:10.01 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: this came up during the last release and several other releases causing build |
| 19:10.01 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: failures (because they're not supported prior to automake 1.7). ignore the |
| 19:10.01 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: BREP_CPPFLAGS as a false positive since it's only presently set to AM_CPPFLAGS |
| 19:10.04 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: (which works). |
| 19:17.24 | mafm | hmm |
| 19:17.24 | mafm | well, I thought that the main function of tab in this context was indenting |
| 19:19.40 | brlcad | it is, but in interactive non-batch mode, different files initialize |
| 19:19.54 | brlcad | it should be bound to indent-for-tab-command unless you changed it |
| 19:25.49 | mafm | I see |
| 19:26.14 | mafm | well, it's easier than changing everything by hand when there are lots of them anyway, it works very well! |
| 19:26.31 | mafm | g3d is mostly clean so I didn't fix anything :) |
| 19:26.37 | mafm | now I have to go, see you! |
| 19:26.42 | brlcad | see ya |
| 19:26.48 | brlcad | already ran indent at some point :) |
| 19:26.52 | brlcad | (several times) |
| 19:26.54 | mafm | and thanks :) |
| 19:34.40 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33177 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: more path issues, rt doesn't appear to obey the path and gives copious overlaps and displays the wrong object if you e up a /path/to/something in mged and run rt. |
| 19:52.43 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33178 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work. |
| 20:03.54 | ``Erik | is that bugs thing related to what ed and lee were talking about? e /car/suspension/frwheel.r; rt raytraces /car instead of just the frwheel.r ? |
| 20:04.45 | brlcad | yes |
| 20:05.01 | brlcad | should be an easy fix |
| 20:07.02 | ``Erik | that was my thought during lunch |
| 20:17.44 | brlcad | notes that "Continuing Architecture Work" conveys absolutely nothing about what actually changed.. |
| 20:21.09 | ``Erik | eh? |
| 20:21.31 | starseeker | Dave's last commit message |
| 20:22.12 | brlcad | might as well have said "changed some stuff" :) |
| 20:22.28 | ``Erik | ah, gotcha |
| 20:22.51 | ``Erik | svn commit -m 'did things. And... stuff.'' |
| 20:23.31 | ``Erik | wants vim editing of his irc buffer :( |
| 20:35.32 | brlcad | hum, looks like idents needs to be rewritten |
| 20:35.44 | brlcad | lots of reliance on unixisms, tmp files, and system() |
| 20:36.00 | brlcad | it's amazing it even does anything at all on windows |
| 20:39.24 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33179 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: rewrite the tables command to not suck |
| 20:39.28 | ``Erik | um, lee was only able to recall 3/5 of his list, did you get the full thing from him (or ed)? |
| 20:40.17 | brlcad | i'm just looking at the trackers |
| 20:40.51 | brlcad | don't exactly need to go looking for more |
| 20:41.10 | brlcad | unless you're about done fixing all of them already :P |
| 20:41.29 | ``Erik | marks all of them as 'not a problem for me' and moves on :D |
| 20:44.07 | ``Erik | can't find crap on their new page layout heh |
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| 23:47.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33180 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 23:47.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: plans for the next iteration (2 weeks remaining) for me include optimizing bitv |
| 23:47.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: counting, pnts, and incrTcl. add an item to document bot_dump, drop tables |
| 23:47.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: rewrite until later. others devs should document their plans for the upcoming |
| 23:47.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: two weeks too as well as next month. |
| 23:54.51 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33181 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: Let's get the poor hyp primitive tied off |
| 23:56.16 | ``Erik_ | adds "play lots of 'Wrath of the Lich King'" to TODO |
| 23:58.52 | brlcad | wonders if ``Erik will ever be a productive coder again |
| 00:00.36 | ``Erik_ | well, I've poked code here and there, but my gf kinda ruined me :D *duck* |
| 00:01.13 | punkrockgirl | no, you cant play wotlk until you do some other things... |
| 00:01.23 | punkrockgirl | and um, i ruined you? |
| 00:01.28 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 00:01.36 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 00:01.40 | punkrockgirl | :~( |
| 00:06.50 | ``Erik_ | lovely |
| 01:01.49 | brlcad | bah, you're an independently reasoning being -- your actions are your own doing, personal responsibility for ones own actions and all that :) |
| 01:03.10 | brlcad | you could be productive if you wanted to be, it's at least not lack of hours in the day or someone keeping your fingers off the keyboard |
| 01:07.07 | brlcad | needs more hours and more fingers! muahaha |
| 01:26.23 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33182 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work. |
| 01:26.38 | ``Erik_ | more hours, definitely, d'no about more fingers |
| 01:27.10 | ``Erik_ | I think I was able to get about 2 hours of coding done today, the rest was rife with special requests, questions, etc |
| 01:27.35 | ``Erik_ | needs to build himself a secret office |
| 01:30.43 | ``Erik_ | now that's irritating |
| 01:31.00 | ``Erik_ | leopard has lost rosetta? |
| 01:36.54 | ``Erik_ | hrm, probably just weird rsync behavior |
| 02:23.45 | punkrockgirl | a secret office in my basement? ;) |
| 04:31.42 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 11:27.59 | dloman | norning all |
| 11:35.32 | claymore | mafm: Hey, did you just check in some changes to /rt^3/src/coreInterface/ ? |
| 11:39.21 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33183 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work: Core 3 levels of objects defined: Geometry Engine <- Geometry Service <- iBME |
| 11:40.39 | mafm | hi |
| 11:40.45 | mafm | no claymore, no idea about that |
| 11:41.01 | mafm | I never touched anything in rt3 besides src/g3d, AFAICR |
| 11:41.07 | mafm | or data related to g3d |
| 11:43.51 | claymore | is /src/g3d the prototype gui you were working on? |
| 11:50.18 | mafm | yes |
| 11:50.26 | mafm | so in rt3 I didn't touch anything else |
| 11:50.35 | claymore | I still blame you. |
| 11:50.40 | claymore | laughs |
| 11:50.44 | claymore | just kidding. |
| 11:50.50 | mafm | I did some not-completely-successful incursions in trunk, but... :) |
| 11:51.10 | claymore | trying to learn the lay of the land in rt^3 since I am prolly going to be making major changes to the structure. |
| 11:51.15 | mafm | so unless OMG I've been hax0red, no it wasn't me :D |
| 11:52.37 | claymore | since I will be doing some re-org in the near future, I want to feel out who all is actively in rt^3 so I don't step on toes. :/ |
| 11:55.10 | mafm | well, so no problem for me |
| 11:55.24 | mafm | unless you touch g3d, then I would have to kill you :) |
| 11:55.53 | claymore | rolls up his sleeves, ready to come out swinging :) |
| 11:55.54 | mafm | well, you can change that also, if you want |
| 11:56.17 | mafm | I never though much about the location |
| 11:56.45 | mafm | sean suggested in there because it was in line with the ideas in there, and was mainly independent from the rest of the code anyway |
| 11:56.59 | claymore | I will be putting up organization on the brlcad.org/wiki |
| 11:57.36 | claymore | to evoke comments that I will most likely igonre >8-) |
| 12:00.44 | claymore | ...that too was a joke. :P |
| 12:02.53 | mafm | xD |
| 12:03.05 | mafm | ignoring wiki comments in common practice anyway |
| 12:07.03 | claymore | where did you stash the Orge libraries? |
| 12:07.48 | claymore | anyone: haven't looked, but are the boost libraries in the BRLCAD src the FULL library set, or a stripped down set? |
| 12:13.21 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33184 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: (log message trimmed) |
| 12:13.21 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: Continuing Architecture Work (GeometryEngine Namespace): |
| 12:13.21 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 1) Architected GeometryManager: provides a high level interface for retrieving, |
| 12:13.21 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: caching and saving Geometry. Considering a rename to ResourceManager since |
| 12:13.24 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 'Geometry' no longer accurately describes ALL data types handled by |
| 12:13.26 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: GeometryManager. |
| 12:13.28 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 2) Architected AbstractResourceSource: a fully virtual base class that |
| 12:13.33 | brlcad | yay, more detailed comments :) |
| 12:13.44 | brlcad | claymore: they're stripped down |
| 12:13.55 | brlcad | there's a boost tool that will pull the subset in use |
| 12:14.02 | claymore | knows not what you mean. ;) |
| 12:14.21 | claymore | pull it from the boost website? |
| 12:14.28 | brlcad | hm? |
| 12:15.10 | claymore | 'there's a boost tool that will pull the subset in use' I dont understand this statement. There is a tool on their website, in our src, ??? |
| 12:15.14 | brlcad | there is a tool in boost that will look at source code (that uses boost) and determine what headers exactly are needed for that code to compile |
| 12:15.45 | brlcad | and it will extract that portion of the boost headers so you can bundle them |
| 12:16.10 | claymore | This scan & extraction happens at compile time? |
| 12:16.38 | brlcad | no, this happens sometime before manually by a developer looking to figure out what portions of boost they need |
| 12:16.54 | claymore | okay, i understand. |
| 12:17.00 | brlcad | so you don't pull too much, don't include the kitchen sink, etc |
| 12:17.08 | brlcad | boost is too big to include *everything* |
| 12:17.26 | claymore | so.. .back to the original question... anyone know which portions of boost are already in our src tree? |
| 12:17.27 | brlcad | and they have a tool that determines the exact subset you need anyways |
| 12:18.12 | brlcad | erhm, we have exactly what we need -- it's not like it even exactly breaks it out by packages, it's actual header use |
| 12:18.34 | brlcad | so if you add something new that uses boost, have to rerun the tool and/or evaluate the new usage |
| 12:19.04 | brlcad | it was mostly portions of spirit in use by the constraint and parametric equation support |
| 12:19.23 | claymore | this tool: it writes a specific header for us? Or just downloads the headers we need? |
| 12:19.42 | claymore | Okay, that answers my Q. I was wondering if BoostThreads is in there already. |
| 12:19.46 | brlcad | just downloads the headers we use |
| 12:20.03 | brlcad | take a look, src/other/boost |
| 12:20.44 | brlcad | there are threading headers in there now, so maybe/probably at least a subset if not the whole thing |
| 12:21.46 | claymore | alright neat. I was wondering if I was going to need boost libs for iBME but it seems that brlcad already has it. Excellent. |
| 12:22.59 | brlcad | there's a configuration management issue there -- presently compiling rt^3 only requires a binary install (and the boost headers are treated private) |
| 12:23.39 | brlcad | so for you to use them, they either need to be installed or rt^3 build system needs to know where brlcad sources are or they need to include their own copy of (exactly) what is used |
| 12:24.38 | brlcad | my feeling would be for it to *not* rely on having both source sets around, so either installing or having a separate copy |
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| 12:25.58 | claymore | :/ Okay, fair enough. I figured since iBME will need the BRL-CAD source or Libs anyways, getting the boost libs from the brlcad src tree wouldn't be an issue. |
| 12:26.24 | brlcad | it needs the libs and headers |
| 12:26.39 | brlcad | which should all be available during install |
| 12:28.12 | claymore | would having the BRL-CAD libs rely on a different copy of boost than iBME create a maintenance headache later down the road? |
| 12:28.33 | brlcad | that should really help keep the two interfaces independent (so there is no C/C++ crossover) allowing the interfaces to be developed as an interface-using application (which should help shore up the interfaces being provided too) |
| 12:28.57 | brlcad | only if they're incompatibly out of sync at a binary level |
| 12:29.04 | claymore | you use the term 'interface' in what context? |
| 12:29.06 | brlcad | most of boost is compile-time static |
| 12:29.35 | claymore | takes notes about keeping things in sync. |
| 12:30.04 | brlcad | well there are the C libs, libbu, libbn, librt, etc .. that are in use by the GE and new G3D/iBME/SS (this thing is getting a lot of names) :) |
| 12:31.29 | brlcad | the chance of incompatibility is pretty low though, I wouldn't worry about it -- and if you really want to make it a non-issue, we can just have an option to install the headers we used |
| 12:32.01 | brlcad | the issue then will just be when rt^3 sources uses more than brlcad module uses and needs additions |
| 12:32.01 | claymore | As for the names, they will make sence when I get a chance to offload my info on ya. I can try to do that here in irc, but the UML pics i have help wonders. You in at a decent hour today? ;) |
| 12:33.07 | brlcad | I'm only referring to G3D vs iBME vs SS .. they all basically refer to the same thing and are just a label really |
| 12:34.44 | claymore | 'just a label'.... well kinda. I am seeing them more as elements and levels of an architecture. |
| 12:34.54 | brlcad | that's having three people name pretty much the exact same concept, not a surprise that everyone has a different one |
| 12:35.46 | claymore | for instance: GeometryEngine will be the C++ library that incorporates ged, svn, and a few other things to form the core funtionality |
| 12:36.08 | brlcad | and iBME is where it all comes together into a graphical inteface that the user interacts with, yes? :) |
| 12:36.45 | claymore | GeometryService is the runnable bin that uses the GE libs, but adds in the Session Management, Access Controls, Network link, blah blah blah blah.... |
| 12:37.02 | brlcad | no surprises there :) |
| 12:37.58 | claymore | and Integrated BrlCad Modeling Environment (iBME) is a runnable bin that has/uses a GS but adds an abstract GUI element... in this case, the first AbstractGui subclass will be g3d |
| 12:37.58 | brlcad | and I think that's a wonderful! separation of responsibilities btw ;) |
| 12:38.26 | claymore | so yeah, its a lot of names, but that makes it sound neater and thus impresses Bosses more :) |
| 12:38.35 | brlcad | i.e. where it all comes together into a graphical inteface ;) |
| 12:38.58 | claymore | right, you had it type before I did, but i couldn't bring myself to delete all my hard typing :P |
| 12:39.00 | brlcad | i'm just saying that's what g3d means/meant as well as SS too |
| 12:39.13 | claymore | oh, whats SS ? |
| 12:41.08 | brlcad | it hints at the name that I arrived at after having many years to think of a good name that caters to the marketing aspect, documentation, community, competition, connotations, .. |
| 12:41.17 | brlcad | has had a long time to think about all of this over the years |
| 12:41.44 | brlcad | not that I'm stuck on using it, I'm also not willing to unveil it before it's actually needed or can be formally documented |
| 12:42.17 | brlcad | naming something often has the tendancy of making people make (false) assumptions about the project that take years to recover from (RIVA anyone) |
| 12:42.57 | claymore | so we should call this project Fred until a few years from now? |
| 12:43.16 | claymore | thinks SS stands for SuperSexy. Just admit it. |
| 12:43.18 | brlcad | nah, iBME is a great name too, that works |
| 12:43.31 | brlcad | thinks SS is super sexy, but no doesn't stand for that :) |
| 12:44.30 | claymore | i was trying to manhandle the acronym into iBEAM, but it ended up being nearly ebonic, so i just went with iBME and will pronounce it I-Beam. |
| 12:44.46 | brlcad | even if iBME has two strong connotations (for me at least) .. BME is like EE or CE in a university context |
| 12:44.47 | claymore | besides, an Ibeam icon is super easy to do :) |
| 12:45.14 | brlcad | BME is the shorthand for biomedical engineering |
| 12:45.27 | claymore | ah, didn't know that. |
| 12:45.29 | brlcad | so everytime I see it, that is what jumps to mind :) |
| 12:46.08 | claymore | I am not stuck on it either, just you mentioned the 'integrated brlcad modeling enviornment' term once and it made sence to me. |
| 12:46.24 | brlcad | BRL-CAD M.E. sounds kinda kinky albeit kinda microsoftish too :) |
| 12:46.38 | claymore | Project iBME untill a SS-ier name can be found |
| 12:46.38 | brlcad | did I? that's funny |
| 12:46.51 | claymore | yeah, BRLCADme made me cringe. |
| 12:46.52 | brlcad | i do see it as an integrated modeling environment, so it does suit |
| 12:47.35 | brlcad | no matter what we call it, the binary will (finally) probably just be called 'brlcad' when it's worthy to have that name |
| 12:47.49 | brlcad | since that is what 99% of most new users expect |
| 12:48.25 | brlcad | but not before it's ready .. till then it can have code name(s) |
| 12:48.44 | claymore | damn them all, break the mold! Fred is the new BRLCAD so they just need to deal with it. |
| 12:48.50 | brlcad | even ss wasn't meant to be the command line, that's just a different expansion of the full title |
| 12:49.27 | claymore | SS has Nazi Connotations to me ;) |
| 12:49.34 | brlcad | something that really should cater exactly to what we do and the ways geometry is managed |
| 12:49.53 | brlcad | that's why it's not the actual name, just my version of "fred" since I've not said what it is :) |
| 12:50.12 | brlcad | though I would have thought SS had navy connotations to you :) |
| 12:50.44 | claymore | SSN baby! SS = ww2, ssn = nuklar ;) |
| 12:51.05 | brlcad | Happy Sailing on the SS BRL-CAD |
| 12:51.22 | claymore | should we have it crash after a '3 hour tour' ? |
| 12:52.04 | brlcad | and make them reboot |
| 12:52.11 | brlcad | wonders what CVN stands for |
| 12:52.31 | claymore | Carrier Vessel Nuclear |
| 12:52.42 | claymore | ;) |
| 12:52.53 | brlcad | ah |
| 12:53.13 | claymore | aka CVN-65 = USS Enterprize, aka Mobile Cherynobl |
| 12:53.43 | brlcad | notes that you shouldn't need/use html markup on the wiki outside of style decls on tables, you can use " " and/or newlines in place of br's |
| 12:54.44 | brlcad | stops chattering so he *can* make it in at a decent time for once |
| 12:55.10 | claymore | didn't know that a line starting with whitespace could be used as a newline. Defaulted on what I knew:) |
| 12:55.19 | claymore | brlcad's wiki-fu is strong. |
| 12:57.14 | claymore | have a safe trip. |
| 12:57.56 | claymore | oh, and in media wiki, multiple newlines are truncated to just one. :/ |
| 13:05.24 | mafm | damn brlcad |
| 13:05.31 | mafm | you talk too much! |
| 13:05.41 | mafm | now I have to read all the log... :P |
| 13:05.50 | claymore | sneaks out of sight. |
| 13:05.58 | mafm | claymore: OGRE & Co. at src/other |
| 13:06.42 | claymore | excellent, thanks mafm! |
| 13:07.03 | claymore | mafm: Do you have documentation on your gui design? |
| 13:10.05 | mafm | not proper documentation, no |
| 13:10.26 | mafm | it's a kind of prototype |
| 13:11.24 | mafm | in src/other I put: OGRE (3D rendering only), OIS (input libs), Mocha (helper library for RBGui), RBGui |
| 13:11.34 | claymore | did you architect your GUI so that it consists of a single 'root' object? |
| 13:11.51 | brlcad | thinks it's a successful prototype, start at least .. the only part I'm still not convinced is doing us anything useful is rbgui |
| 13:12.15 | brlcad | claymore: find main() go from there ;) |
| 13:12.23 | mafm | RBGui stalled at this point maybe not :| |
| 13:12.42 | mafm | it'll begin to be a maintainance issue |
| 13:12.47 | brlcad | there was a great poster at siggraph for a new gui toolkit |
| 13:12.55 | mafm | but I don't know if there are new alternatives yet |
| 13:13.32 | brlcad | done by the guy that worked on G3D (no, the 'other' G3D) ironically :) |
| 13:13.43 | mafm | claymore: I created a set of managers, so to speak, taking care of camera modes, creating and acessing windows, etc |
| 13:14.17 | mafm | so in example there's the camera manager, and classes for camera/input modes |
| 13:14.33 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33185 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: (log message trimmed) |
| 13:14.33 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: Continuing Architecture Work (GeometryService Namespace): |
| 13:14.33 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 1) Created AccessManager Class stub. Will provide access controls for Sessions. |
| 13:14.33 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 2) Architected SessionManager and Session classes: Will provide persistence information for remote and local connections to the GeometryService. |
| 13:14.34 | mafm | the manager takes care of switching between modes and similar tasks |
| 13:14.36 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 3) Architected CommunicationsManager and AbstractPortal: Provides |
| 13:14.38 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: interconnectivity via multiple means. AbstractPortal is a purely virtual base |
| 13:14.40 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: class that will provide/mandate the essential attributes and operations required |
| 13:16.20 | claymore | mafm: so it sounds like it would be relatively easy to aggregate all those managers in to a single, simple, highlevel G3D object? |
| 13:16.37 | brlcad | also probably worth mentioning that it's presently hooked directly into libged since GS nor GE were ready, but that hooking those in are next step |
| 13:17.28 | brlcad | claymore: your java teachings are starting to show :) |
| 13:17.37 | brlcad | s/teachings/learnings/ |
| 13:17.47 | mafm | claymore: well, there's the Application class, I think that it's a kind of root object, now that I think of it |
| 13:18.15 | claymore | nah, not java teachings :P |
| 13:18.19 | mafm | because it takes care of initializing the graphics, has functions to quit, etc? |
| 13:18.43 | claymore | Basic OO abstraction techniques :( |
| 13:19.49 | claymore | mafm: I ask because in the architecture I am working up, there is a GUI object that is purely virtual, ment to be either a full abstract Base class or an Interface to implement, that all gui's coded for iBME will need to adhere to. |
| 13:20.40 | claymore | mafm: that way, it would be very easy to document the GUI API and thus, make it easy for someone to write their own GUI. |
| 13:21.03 | mafm | I guess that it could be adapted to work that way |
| 13:21.21 | brlcad | the tendency to organize everything into single-rooted hierarchies is often a tendency found with 'pure' OO design (which you find a lot of in Java) -- nothing wrong with it, just slightly different perspective as C++ is rarely implemented pure (for various reasons) |
| 13:22.36 | claymore | mafm: SO if it would be possible to seggregate the GUI aspects from the application aspects of g3d, then it would be easy to abstract the trival stuff (aka application stuff) away from your GUI, thus making everything a bit more clean and streamlined. |
| 13:23.10 | mafm | I think that all Gui-like stuff stays in Gui-named files and classes |
| 13:23.14 | claymore | brlcad: Sure is... BUT thats not what I am doing :P so leave me alone with your Java slander! |
| 13:23.27 | claymore | mafm: Then it already is segregated :) |
| 13:23.31 | brlcad | heh |
| 13:23.45 | mafm | it was done that way, apart from the general idea of separating view and logic, because of the uncertainties of RBGui |
| 13:24.02 | mafm | Also I think that it's not very dependent of OGRE |
| 13:24.15 | claymore | what is not very dependant on ogre? |
| 13:24.20 | mafm | the application |
| 13:24.33 | brlcad | isn't slander, I'm actually quite fond of Java actually .. for a whole variety of uses and applications, it solves a lot of problems you have to fight with other languages |
| 13:24.55 | mafm | that is, doesn't relay on anything of OGRE besides launching it |
| 13:24.55 | claymore | mafm: I need to take a look at your code ;) |
| 13:25.26 | mafm | The way to handle commands, console history and similar functionalities implemented, are independent |
| 13:25.39 | mafm | or mostly, I think |
| 13:25.59 | claymore | brlcad; Just teasing you a bit :) |
| 13:26.10 | claymore | I like Java quite a bit. |
| 13:26.44 | brlcad | knows :) |
| 13:26.50 | claymore | but it has/doesn't have a few things that piss me off. Multiple inheritence being one of them.... |
| 13:27.01 | mafm | I like Java as a language, not java as a running thing :D |
| 13:27.18 | claymore | mafm: Sounds like you dun did it smart. |
| 13:28.34 | claymore | brlcad: So much for 'stopping chattering' eh? :P |
| 13:28.58 | brlcad | not really, I got dressed and shaved and groomed all the while :) |
| 13:29.22 | brlcad | socks...where be those things... |
| 13:29.27 | mafm | :D |
| 13:31.02 | mafm | What Java has that bothers me a lot is integrated stuff in core libs like sockets, GUIs, threads... it's so easy to bootstrap simple applications! |
| 13:31.39 | claymore | why does that bother you? |
| 13:31.49 | claymore | thats a *feature* ;) |
| 13:31.52 | mafm | also, for ( e: coll ) loops are niiiice |
| 13:31.56 | mafm | bothers me in C++ |
| 13:32.09 | mafm | What Java has and not C++ |
| 13:32.38 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33186 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/iBME_14NOV08_0800.png: Graphical View of the current iBME architecture. |
| 13:32.44 | mafm | 's favourite C++0x feature will be "auto" things, most probably |
| 13:33.07 | brlcad | c++ is getting lots of great new additions (threads, java-style loops, automatic typing) soon |
| 13:33.11 | brlcad | yeah |
| 13:33.14 | mafm | no insane syntax for iterators anymore :) |
| 13:33.54 | brlcad | was excited to read through some of the SC22 that was resolved last month |
| 13:33.58 | mafm | well, Boost makes a good job for things like threads, but it's got a bit too late to the party I think |
| 13:34.18 | mafm | and in example the network/socket lib, which was a GSoC project this year |
| 13:34.30 | brlcad | yeah, networking will be sorely missing |
| 13:34.51 | brlcad | they did at least agree on some basic threading intrinsics though.. that was going to get left out |
| 13:34.55 | brlcad | http://www.open-std.org/JTC1/SC22/WG21/ |
| 13:35.29 | brlcad | std::thread ftw |
| 13:36.32 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33187 10/rt^3/trunk/src/coreInterface/ (ConstDatabase.cpp Object.cpp): replaced some deprecated defines |
| 13:36.35 | brlcad | er, s/SC22/SC22 disagreements!/ |
| 13:36.43 | mafm | other than those differences in basic libraries, I tend to program similarly in both languages I think |
| 13:38.14 | mafm | hopefully C++0x will be out in 2009, otherwise the very nickname will be confusing :D |
| 13:38.18 | claymore | mafm: really? interesting. One of the biggest PITA's I ran into in java was the whole 'El Camino' thing of Multiple Inheritence. If you want to use MI in java, then at least ONE of the super classes has to be 100% virtual/abstract.... and thats abnoxious! |
| 13:39.02 | mafm | I don't use MI a lot, but well, my java experience is mostly with smallish projects |
| 13:39.05 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:39.10 | brlcad | claymore: there's a big portion that also needs to get integrated (in a way that they can continue to work on it too, collaboration is a good thing) .. src/coreInterface was pretty much designed as the start of the GE |
| 13:41.04 | brlcad | that's some momentum that really would hate to just loose or ignore and they've got it already working for I/O and some set of operations |
| 13:43.21 | brlcad | by the way, if you guys don't know about it already .. http://stackoverflow.com/ <-- great site for getting answers to coding/design/practice questions or even for passively learning if you don't know about it already |
| 13:43.43 | brlcad | is repeating himself, so he hits the road, so he hits the road |
| 13:43.45 | claymore | brlcad: Thats on the todo list ;) I have seen some emails and had conversations recently that have clued me into the need for some pretty pictures and documentation to show progress ;) |
| 13:45.18 | brlcad | claymore: I'm mostly saying it needs to be a two-way collaboration, not just one-way 'here is how this idea was designed, is better, is different, etc' (not to imply that you were or weren't doing that) |
| 13:46.07 | brlcad | he's done a lot of good work there, it should be integrated in a way they're good with too so they can keep using it and contributing |
| 13:46.40 | claymore | Its one bigass, ginormous learning experience for me :) As I learn exactly what is *in* rt^3/src already, I can add/append/alter etc. |
| 13:46.48 | brlcad | he documented some of it on the wiki already too |
| 13:47.03 | claymore | But I will talk PM stuff with ya when you get here :) |
| 13:47.11 | claymore | on the wiki eh? aye aye. |
| 13:47.12 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Developer_Documents |
| 13:47.40 | brlcad | core C++ interface |
| 13:48.53 | claymore | righto, thanks for the link. |
| 14:03.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33188 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/get_type.c: Fleshed out get_type |
| 14:04.07 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 14:07.12 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:08.49 | claymore | Greetings Daniel! Did you get my SourceForge email? |
| 14:09.20 | ``Erik | heh "mobile chernobyl", hadn't heard that one before |
| 14:09.37 | ``Erik | ss... screenshot? secret service? :D |
| 14:10.04 | claymore | erik: The 'Prize' is an ELT's nightmare (Engineering Lab Tech,aka water chem guys) |
| 14:10.19 | d_rossberg | claymore: that's why i'm here :) |
| 14:10.40 | claymore | erik: hence the 'Prize' and 'Mobile Cherynobl' nicknames :) |
| 14:11.05 | claymore | d: Excellent. I just started reading through your code and wiki entries. |
| 14:11.09 | clock_ | mobile chernobyl? |
| 14:11.24 | clock_ | That recommends me since yesterday evening I have a wonderful russian oscilloscope at home |
| 14:11.30 | d_rossberg | currently i'm working on a C++ inteface "as i need it" |
| 14:11.36 | clock_ | 16.5kg, 150W, 100 MHz |
| 14:12.11 | clock_ | recommends -> reminds |
| 14:12.19 | ``Erik | neat, old crt/analog dealie? |
| 14:12.22 | clock_ | yes |
| 14:12.37 | clock_ | This one http://rw6ase.narod.ru/s/s/s1_99_.jpg |
| 14:12.38 | claymore | d: If i read your docs correctly, you are striving to attain a completely self suffiecient C++ Brlcad library...right? |
| 14:12.44 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33189 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/grid.c: Added code to return help string if no args were specified. |
| 14:13.00 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:13.13 | d_rossberg | claymore: right |
| 14:13.16 | ``Erik | other than the letters being all wrong, looks quite similar to what I used in highschool and college |
| 14:13.32 | mafm | going home earlier today, see you! |
| 14:13.43 | claymore | d: Are you familiar with the work on 'ged' that is being done in brlcad currently? |
| 14:13.45 | ``Erik | (or secondary school and university for those who use that terminology) |
| 14:13.51 | clock_ | ``Erik: it's not theyre wrong it's called CYRILLIC! :) |
| 14:14.01 | ``Erik | :D |
| 14:14.10 | clock_ | Mine has a split screen zoom function! |
| 14:14.14 | d_rossberg | it should be independent from the implementation of the kernel ... |
| 14:14.29 | d_rossberg | i know what ged is for |
| 14:14.37 | ``Erik | I don't care of they're ceramic or silkscreen or marker, they're backwards! it's like a first grader made it! :> *duck* *run* |
| 14:14.46 | claymore | erik : lol |
| 14:14.58 | clock_ | L0lz!!111 |
| 14:15.18 | clock_ | Actually I thought for a long time the scope is called C1-99 |
| 14:15.33 | clock_ | But it's actually called S1-99 because C is S in Russian alphabet |
| 14:15.43 | claymore | d: alright cool. Well, it seems that your initiative and ged go hand in hand, unless I read thngs wrong, since ged is supposed to wrap up ALL of mged's current functionality. |
| 14:15.47 | clock_ | What can S stand for? |
| 14:16.06 | clock_ | Scope? |
| 14:16.17 | clock_ | Superb? |
| 14:16.23 | clock_ | Soviet? |
| 14:16.48 | claymore | d: So, the approach I was looking at was to simply write a C++ class called GED and then just wrap all of GED functionality in function calls. |
| 14:17.07 | clock_ | let's fuse BRL-CAD and gEDA together |
| 14:17.09 | ``Erik | given that russian language has no real historic heritage tracing back to teutonic or romance languages to my knowledge, I wouldn't expect to see that kinda similarity to engrish |
| 14:17.19 | clock_ | make a universal circuit and 3D design tool called mgEDA |
| 14:17.33 | ``Erik | unless they hijacked the german word for scope for that specific purpose *shrug* :) |
| 14:17.43 | claymore | d: Are you taking a different approach? |
| 14:20.04 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:20.42 | d_rossberg | claymore: i don't like ged's parameters |
| 14:21.08 | d_rossberg | this is something for a high level inteface as a gui or shell |
| 14:21.19 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33190 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/metaball.c: stack save the thoughts in progress, have other stuff to do first |
| 14:21.39 | d_rossberg | but i wouldn't use argc/argv on system level |
| 14:22.40 | d_rossberg | i'm looking for something closer to the kernel |
| 14:22.44 | claymore | d: Agreed, I don't particularly like that interface either. |
| 14:23.02 | claymore | d: 'kernel' of what... the OS? |
| 14:23.18 | d_rossberg | no, BRL-CAD's kernel |
| 14:23.25 | d_rossberg | (librt) |
| 14:23.27 | claymore | d: ah, I see now. |
| 14:23.37 | ``Erik | and libged, now |
| 14:23.48 | claymore | ponders. |
| 14:24.37 | d_rossberg | libged is an interface to a shell build on librt (mainly) |
| 14:25.18 | claymore | d: I am wondering if establishing a OO system that sits on top of libged but still coming to a focalpoint of a 'master' GED object would solve both our needs. |
| 14:26.47 | ``Erik | surposedly, librt is supposed to evolve to holding and interrogating (viewing crud as immutable) where libged will be the editing kernel, no? :) given that it's a modeler and not a model viewer, I'd believe that librt/libged construct the kernel |
| 14:26.57 | ``Erik | *shrug* I need more tea, at least this cough is dying down |
| 14:27.20 | claymore | Hrm, I was of the mind that libged was closer to an API that involved ALL of the brlcad libs... |
| 14:27.29 | d_rossberg | i would like to see something in between librt and libged |
| 14:28.03 | d_rossberg | i.e. implementing libged's functionality but with "real" parameters |
| 14:28.26 | d_rossberg | maybe with the help of an OO layer |
| 14:28.52 | ``Erik | #!~@! stupid fop crap, popping java crap off and stealing window focus |
| 14:29.19 | d_rossberg | however, i would recommend to develop the C++ inteface independently from ged at the moment |
| 14:29.35 | claymore | d: righto. I think we are speaking the same thing now. By using the term 'implementing' are you talking about re-writing libged's functionality, or putting an OO layer (with *real* parameters) that utilizes libged's existing code? |
| 14:30.04 | ``Erik | oh wow, it's all argv/argc crap (I hadn't looked at libged before) |
| 14:30.27 | claymore | its not crap, just not the way I would like it :) |
| 14:30.46 | claymore | besides, its the first step towards a more unified codebase :) |
| 14:31.11 | d_rossberg | at the moment i'm working on a layer right on top of librt's functionality |
| 14:31.26 | d_rossberg | i.e. ged's functionality will not be included |
| 14:31.27 | ``Erik | yeh, but I grok herr dannies argument now :) |
| 14:33.51 | claymore | Hrm, I will need to study libged and see just how comprehensive its coverage of the underlying libraries is... |
| 14:34.46 | ``Erik | I think I have an idea of exactly what it is, how it's migrating and why... but if I tried to state it, I'd be wrong, I'm sure :D |
| 14:35.13 | claymore | I dunno if making a different API to the libs will be worth the duplication of effort.... :/ |
| 14:35.55 | claymore | Erik: go for it. if you know you are already wrong then you shouldn't be surprized nor hurt if its pointed out that you are :D |
| 14:36.43 | d_rossberg | libged came from mged, now it's an independent shell-like interface to BRL-CAD |
| 14:37.25 | d_rossberg | this is really nice, but it's not applicable for all applications |
| 14:38.07 | ``Erik | heh, aight, mged has a simple capture widget which cranks things through the tcl engine and has a bunch of wrappers for C things exposed to the interpreter FFI style, so'z the 'export to tcl' stuff is being wholesale lifted and moved, libged is looking like a brlcad/tcl ffi lib at the moment |
| 14:38.39 | ``Erik | if you write in tcl, swank... but in C, you have to build things up to look like the tcl interpreter before using it |
| 14:39.07 | ``Erik | don't quote me, boy, I ain't said nothin' :) |
| 14:39.27 | claymore | takes a screenshot. |
| 14:39.43 | clock_ | claymore: Polroid |
| 14:40.39 | ``Erik | mocks up a display of claymore making socially unacceptable statements and takes a screenshot (or polaroid) :D hardly proof |
| 14:41.47 | clock_ | can you give an example of a socially acceptable statement? :) |
| 14:42.18 | claymore | d: Cool. thanks for the info. I will need to chat with a few people before making the descision to build a new interface directly on top of the libs or building one ontop of libged. I think it will come down to a shortterm longterm tradeoff. |
| 14:42.47 | ``Erik | 60 eco, time for prings on that astro O.o |
| 14:44.02 | claymore | erik Nice :) My las wave of dreads should be finishing soon and I will have completed the removal of ft's from all or my bases... that gives me 53K fts in my mobile... once I get all the FCs to move them all :/ |
| 14:47.00 | d_rossberg | claymore: do you have an idea how an interface on top of libged will look like? (TCL?) |
| 14:47.57 | d_rossberg | on the other side: i try to design the C++ interface really fast, e.g. no unnecessary malloc or new |
| 14:48.41 | d_rossberg | (this is the reason for the odd looking callbacks in the Get methods) |
| 14:49.20 | claymore | d: for the purposes of the iBME/GS, the interface to libged would be completely OO, with as many *real* parameters as would make sence. |
| 14:49.53 | claymore | d: so you are trying to do everything on the stack? |
| 14:50.08 | d_rossberg | as much as possible |
| 14:50.37 | claymore | d: cool. What size data files are you working with? If you don't mind me asking... |
| 14:52.31 | d_rossberg | the files on my computer aren't so big, 20MB max |
| 14:53.03 | claymore | d: no issue loading those completely into stack space? |
| 14:55.21 | d_rossberg | at the the moment: no; however the class can be changed to work with a file or it could be created a new class derived from the existing ones which works with a file |
| 14:55.32 | d_rossberg | it is all in development :) |
| 14:56.04 | d_rossberg | the in-memory database was a test for me too |
| 14:56.13 | d_rossberg | i've never used it before |
| 14:57.51 | claymore | d: sweet. FWIW, i would love to ultimately have a pure 00 layer ontop of the libs, but time contraints may make me impliment an 00 layer ontop of libged initially :/ |
| 14:58.14 | d_rossberg | the point in my applications is the ray-trace: it has to be fast |
| 15:00.21 | claymore | d: understood. Ultimately, in the iBME/GS, it will be a priority also. |
| 15:00.24 | ``Erik | should have a titan in the queue in about a week O.O |
| 15:00.46 | claymore | awesomeness. They take *forever* to build :( |
| 15:01.50 | d_rossberg | i try to build a basis where it is easy to add a new interface to a feature or primitive |
| 15:02.26 | claymore | d: I like your approach thus far and can definetly see the potential for expansion. |
| 15:03.28 | d_rossberg | having this it could be a task in next years GSoC to add some features to this interface (for example) |
| 15:03.53 | claymore | d: I just need to feelout how *firm* some of my deadlines are :) |
| 15:04.26 | claymore | d: so you can currently load a database file without any touble? |
| 15:05.18 | d_rossberg | yes |
| 15:05.51 | d_rossberg | and change the database's title and the object's names |
| 15:06.11 | d_rossberg | + ray-trace etc. |
| 15:09.02 | claymore | Excellent thanks :) |
| 15:09.25 | clock_ | xray-trrace |
| 15:10.49 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 16:27.08 | louipc | brlcad: I got an interesting error when building 7.14.0 |
| 16:27.19 | louipc | brlcad: looks like you left your mark in there :D http://louipc.yi.org/brlcad/brlcad-7.14.0-build-error |
| 16:46.58 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 18:23.13 | ``Erik | garth marenghi's darkplace |
| 18:31.59 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33191 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work: Refactored AbstractResource and Subclasses. |
| 18:56.50 | *** join/#brlcad archivist_emc (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 18:57.03 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 19:19.46 | brlcad | claymore: tab-completion (reading backlog d:'s) is nice for others too so your messages are hilighted to their attention ;) |
| 19:28.02 | brlcad | louipc: not too surprising, I leave dents all over the place ;) |
| 19:28.17 | brlcad | that url correct though? |
| 19:28.27 | brlcad | I get no server there |
| 19:28.46 | brlcad | ah, it's blocked, I got it now |
| 19:29.38 | brlcad | louipc: bah .. yeah, that sucks.. tcl is annoying embedding full paths somewhere -- you have to rerun autogen.sh and configure to clear them out |
| 19:45.10 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33192 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/ (4 files): Image generation to support documentation effort at http://brlcad.org/wiki/IBME_Main |
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| 22:26.43 | smurfette | http://forums.beyond.ca/st/240856/i-do-not-have-any-money-so-am-sending-you-this-drawing-i-did-of-a-spider-instead |
| 22:26.43 | smurfette | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:26.47 | smurfette | oops ;P |
| 22:27.06 | smurfette | http://forums.beyond.ca/st/240856/i-do-not-have-any-money-so-am-sending-you-this-drawing-i-did-of-a-spider-instead-/ |
| 22:27.10 | smurfette | there :P my bad |
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| 02:38.12 | starseeker | ooo, NSA history |
| 02:38.31 | starseeker | loves it when more interesting public domain stuff appears |
| 02:40.12 | starseeker | chuckles evilly at the idea of uploading scanned historical army stuff from National Archives onto bz, assuming he can find it :-) |
| 02:54.05 | ``Erik | heh |
| 02:54.34 | ``Erik | we've been challenged for form-1's on material that was public release before form-1's existed |
| 02:54.58 | ``Erik | and have damaged historical sites to comply with new directives. :( |
| 02:56.29 | ``Erik | like having to remove bldg or rm # if both are in the same area... cuz, y'know, if some arbitrary (but not published) building 403 exists, that's ok, if there's a room 101 somewhere, that's ok... but the fact that there is a bld 403 that has a room 101, woops, then the tarrst win |
| 02:56.53 | ``Erik | excuse the http pun |
| 03:11.28 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:11.51 | starseeker | Drool...: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=4094706&CATLN=6&FullDetails=False |
| 03:12.17 | starseeker | http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=4959163&CATLN=6&Highlight=%2CMARK%2CIV&accessmethod=0 |
| 03:13.37 | starseeker | Now, how to get my grubby little hands on the tank plans... |
| 03:15.31 | ``Erik | talk to our libraries |
| 03:15.34 | ``Erik | librarians |
| 03:15.48 | ``Erik | they can work miracles and are excited when someone notices them |
| 03:16.16 | ``Erik | back door into 330, they'll be sitting on the right and confused that someone walked in |
| 03:16.18 | ``Erik | :D |
| 03:18.22 | starseeker | heh - I might just try it |
| 03:18.34 | starseeker | not chance I can get to the UK to try in person |
| 03:19.08 | starseeker | er no chance |
| 03:20.18 | starseeker | If I ask for the tank stuff it's modeling related :-) |
| 03:22.27 | starseeker | REALLY wishes they would be more specific about what's in the doggone collection - asking for copies of the "plans of British Tanks" part would probably mean requesting a bookshelf full of stuff |
| 03:22.48 | starseeker | and the sad part is it's STILL a lot better than the National Archives |
| 03:22.50 | starseeker | in the US |
| 03:23.47 | archivist | british archives rule :) |
| 03:24.19 | starseeker | I stuck in a search for tanks and actually got immediately to relevant tank related records |
| 03:24.22 | starseeker | about fainted |
| 03:24.34 | archivist | hides his nick in case he gets found out |
| 03:24.37 | starseeker | heh |
| 03:24.47 | starseeker | do you work there? |
| 03:25.04 | archivist | I volunteer in a local archive |
| 03:25.08 | starseeker | Ah |
| 03:25.43 | starseeker | knows exactly why it's hard to find stuff - indexing it all is probably the work of a hundred lifetimes (not factoring shortened lifespans due to boredom) |
| 03:25.45 | archivist | one day all brit archives will be available online |
| 03:26.01 | ``Erik | um, ww1 UK stuff may be obtainable, but that'd get involved with foreign companies and gov'ts, atm |
| 03:26.08 | archivist | yup Im doing the database bit for ours |
| 03:26.10 | ``Erik | and the paperwork gets a wee bit trickier |
| 03:26.33 | starseeker | ``Erik: In other words, bad idea? |
| 03:26.38 | ``Erik | (assuming it's not already open source (in the gov't sense)) |
| 03:26.42 | starseeker | archivist: cool! |
| 03:27.05 | archivist | I want details of the first tank experiments (Major Baguley worked on it) |
| 03:27.05 | ``Erik | um, wouldn't say that, but if you have interest in going there, grok that it bumps the beaurocracy up an order of magnitude or more |
| 03:27.14 | starseeker | ``Erik: If I'm parsing this correctly, the collection is labeled public records and as a result (by now) it should be clear |
| 03:27.37 | ``Erik | heh, "uh uh uh, can't say it's an armored vehicle, uh, lets call it, uh, a water mover! a tank, y'know, for water!" |
| 03:27.48 | starseeker | pretty much :-) |
| 03:28.37 | ``Erik | 'cept once this monstrosity was slowly clanking over trenches with small ship cannons and machineguns blasting, uh, cover was blown... name stuck, though |
| 03:28.42 | starseeker | ``Erik: paperwork as in "involve more people and answer more questions about why the **** I'm wanting design drawings for a nearly hundered year old piece of junk" or just "more pieces of paper to fill out"? |
| 03:28.54 | archivist | first tank tests were at a car company in the local town (Burton) |
| 03:29.08 | starseeker | archivist: Oh, so it's local history for you? |
| 03:29.12 | ``Erik | just more pieces of paper |
| 03:29.13 | archivist | yes |
| 03:29.19 | starseeker | AWESOME :-) |
| 03:29.26 | archivist | I want moooore |
| 03:29.38 | archivist | Im doing a book on the car company |
| 03:29.57 | starseeker | The national archives might have some of that |
| 03:30.27 | ``Erik | now if the uk were to, y'know, just OS that info in the spirit of remembering important history, problem solved... but that takes effort with no 'immediate and obvious' benefit for the idjits |
| 03:30.31 | starseeker | ``Erik: That's OK. I just have visions of trying to explain who's going to care about a CAD model of the museum's Mark IV :-) |
| 03:30.36 | ``Erik | and, uh, sorry, the US isn't the only country with idjits |
| 03:30.36 | archivist | well the army part is at a University that I need to get at |
| 03:31.09 | archivist | I have two pictures so far |
| 03:31.10 | starseeker | archivist: that can be entertaining |
| 03:31.30 | starseeker | ``Erik: You looking at the 30 year FOI turnaround notation? |
| 03:32.15 | ``Erik | can't do that, company confidential is not suspect to FOIA |
| 03:33.05 | starseeker | no, I ment on the website |
| 03:33.26 | starseeker | thinks all this stuff is just public record in UK, no restrictions |
| 03:33.33 | starseeker | just no one bothered to scan it |
| 03:33.41 | archivist | yet |
| 03:33.47 | starseeker | or if they did, they put it in books and made $$ selling them |
| 03:34.00 | starseeker | archivist: :-) |
| 03:34.17 | ``Erik | hrm, does it have to be a british citizen to request information? is there a 'distribution fee'? |
| 03:34.25 | archivist | Bullock Creeping Grip was brought over here |
| 03:34.27 | starseeker | tries to find out |
| 03:35.37 | archivist | we have to identify to get stuff at major archive |
| 03:36.21 | starseeker | wonder how they react to tourists |
| 03:36.25 | archivist | my public records card is out of date now |
| 03:37.07 | ``Erik | "public records card" already makes things sound far more complex :D |
| 03:37.16 | archivist | :) |
| 03:37.32 | ``Erik | once data in the US goes open source, it's out there... I don't know if citizenship is even looked at for a FOIA letter |
| 03:38.01 | archivist | first major scanning effort the PRO has done is census records |
| 03:38.23 | starseeker | ``Erik: The US national archives issue IDs too for people wanting access to certain stuff |
| 03:38.43 | archivist | then the bar stewards charge on the intarwebs for copies |
| 03:39.55 | archivist | cameras are banned in some archives but they dont care in others |
| 03:40.23 | ``Erik | 'k, I d'no about national archives, foia shtuff is supposedly distribution unlimited (unless I misunderstand), but uhm, "reproduction" fees are common |
| 03:40.48 | starseeker | Um - they want ID to prove identify and address - doesn't seem to say if proving an overseas address counts |
| 03:41.53 | ``Erik | (sorry, not glued to the convo, got punker being ... insane) |
| 03:41.54 | archivist | which tank are you after |
| 03:42.09 | ``Erik | british MK-IV from ww1 |
| 03:42.34 | ``Erik | http://www.peachmountain.com/5Star/US_Army_Ordnance_Museum_Mark_IV_tank.aspx |
| 03:43.58 | archivist | I want details of the embarrassing fail pre mark I |
| 03:43.58 | starseeker | Hmm - looks like for anything under Crown Copyright you need permission from the Image Library |
| 03:44.07 | starseeker | Little Whillie or whatever it was? |
| 03:44.38 | starseeker | Oh that's cute - so the records themselves may not be restricted but what you can do with them is per the controllers of the records |
| 03:44.51 | starseeker | or rather, what you can do with copies |
| 03:44.54 | archivist | no, that is known as the first but there was an earlier experimental one |
| 03:45.25 | archivist | more Bullock than tank |
| 03:46.21 | archivist | A few were relieved of their duties over it as far as I can see |
| 03:47.47 | starseeker | jeez - http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/imagelibrary/price.htm |
| 03:48.56 | ``Erik | ayup, reproduction fees |
| 03:49.04 | ``Erik | don't worry, the us gov't does it, too... |
| 03:49.59 | ``Erik | I mean, ya gotta pay for internet access to certain classes of laws |
| 03:50.02 | ``Erik | eh? O.o |
| 03:50.18 | archivist | I need to cough up for the two pics I want to use |
| 03:50.19 | starseeker | This isn't just reproduction fees - it looks to be perminent usage restrictions |
| 03:50.38 | ``Erik | court cases always have reproduction fees, cd's full of court case results cost thousands of dollars with a 'no redistribution' clause |
| 03:50.47 | archivist | I believe one needs to negotiate |
| 03:51.19 | starseeker | ``Erik: Those restrictions are usually due to the commercial company who packages the court cases and the legality of them is questionable |
| 03:51.30 | ``Erik | (they call it a 'reproduction fee', but it's really a license and you're bound by copyright law) |
| 03:51.59 | starseeker | ``Erik: check public.resource.org |
| 03:52.12 | ``Erik | if that were the case, I'm sure alturists would've put them out public... there was a slashdot article about teh dude in cali suing to have legal statue made freely avaialble not long ago |
| 03:52.18 | starseeker | reproduction fee means you pay to copy it and you're done |
| 03:52.34 | ``Erik | and cali claiming that the law is protected under copyright and subject to license and fees |
| 03:52.44 | starseeker | ``Erik: The odds are they're going to lose that one |
| 03:52.49 | starseeker | the state I mean |
| 03:53.04 | ``Erik | yeah, ... that's what it's supposed to mean, but they CALL it reproduction fee, and have all sorts of copyright constraint on it (cuz if they called it license, they'd get in trouble) |
| 03:53.30 | starseeker | or, maybe it's more subtle - state goverments might be able to assert copyright, but the Federal government doesn't except on stuff that's had copyright assigned to it |
| 03:54.50 | starseeker | ``Erik: I think this is it: http://bulk.resource.org/courts.gov/c/F3/293/293.F3d.791.99-40632.html |
| 03:55.06 | starseeker | archivist: Do they negociate for unrestricted use? |
| 03:55.13 | starseeker | rather doubts it |
| 03:55.22 | starseeker | even if they did, it'd probably cost a mint |
| 03:58.59 | starseeker | Then there's probably no point in requesting the docs - the point was to have available source materials available online as part of the documentation of (and opportunity for students to follow along with) the modeling process |
| 03:59.04 | archivist | dunno have not tried yet |
| 03:59.46 | starseeker | Even incorporate them into some hypothetical published "Modeling with BRL-CAD" book or some such |
| 04:01.01 | starseeker | wonders if he can get someone, somehow, to scan the MarkVIII and make a good point cloud... |
| 04:03.39 | starseeker | is saddened by the restritions on the UK archives |
| 04:07.09 | starseeker | archivist: Let us know how it goes when you have to deal with them |
| 04:07.11 | archivist | ah found look here http://www.kcl.ac.uk/lhcma/cats/stern/st30-01.shtml were the mil stuff is |
| 04:08.21 | archivist | ref STERN: 1/3/1 1915 Jun see burton upon trent, the real no one! |
| 04:08.52 | starseeker | awesomeness |
| 04:09.10 | archivist | thats what I have to go and look at and beg |
| 04:09.11 | starseeker | what are the usage restrictions on those records? |
| 04:09.18 | archivist | no idea |
| 04:10.05 | archivist | just know I found a few months ago on a google search, just repeated the search now |
| 04:10.18 | starseeker | that's cool |
| 04:10.55 | archivist | research takes a "while" |
| 04:11.00 | starseeker | nods |
| 04:13.03 | archivist | another guy has written up the company covering only the railway equipment, Im doing the rest and anything else car/motorbike related in Burton |
| 04:17.45 | starseeker | Sweet |
| 04:18.10 | starseeker | is getting REALLY confused now: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/legal/pdf/copyright_full.pdf |
| 04:20.45 | archivist | they may conveniantly ignore the age of the docs, as they are out of copyright |
| 04:21.09 | starseeker | These two parts are getting me: |
| 04:21.12 | starseeker | While no Crown copyright royalty fees will be levied for the use of unpublished Crown copyright material among the records, the custodians of the records remain at liberty to levy supply fees where appropriate (see section 8). |
| 04:21.34 | starseeker | 8.2 TNA Image Library supplies copies for use in publications and for commercial purposes. Permission for their reproduction must be obtained from the Image Library (see 12.2), which may charge a fee. This permission and reproduction fee are distinct from any permission which may be required from a copyright owner, who may also charge a fee. For the use of Crown copyright works see section 6; for other copyright works see section 9. |
| 04:22.04 | starseeker | Is that just for reproductions THEY make? |
| 04:22.20 | starseeker | i.e. if you go in with a camera yourself and make your own copies you're good? |
| 04:24.30 | archivist | yes but you wont get though the door with a camera in that sort of archive after moneyz |
| 04:24.56 | archivist | you go in on their terms :((( |
| 04:25.19 | archivist | nasty trick |
| 04:25.49 | archivist | so they could sue under contract not copyright |
| 04:30.44 | starseeker | ah - I see it now: http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documents/photopolicy.pdf |
| 04:32.22 | starseeker | Boy they make sure to slam all the doors don't they |
| 04:33.09 | archivist | yup Lichfield archive allows that, I go in and a few hundred pics and type up at my leisure |
| 04:35.21 | archivist | I shall give the typed info back later, then they can add it to the online search for the archive |
| 04:36.09 | starseeker | OK, so they really do have the power to negociate access terms - they MIGHT conceivably allow unlimited use terms, although practically speaking they won't |
| 04:36.27 | starseeker | archivist: that's a good way to go |
| 04:36.40 | starseeker | and a powerful argument for letting people do what they want with historical data |
| 04:36.46 | archivist | :) |
| 04:36.59 | starseeker | not that the UK national archives are likely to be impressed |
| 04:37.28 | archivist | national no, but the locals are more helpful |
| 04:43.49 | archivist | escapes home as its 4:45 AM |
| 04:48.29 | Ralith | hehe |
| 04:50.41 | starseeker | ? |
| 04:50.51 | Ralith | [20:43:57] * archivist escapes home as its 4:45 AM |
| 04:50.55 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 04:51.08 | starseeker | scowls at the National Archives UK |
| 05:13.59 | starseeker | needs to get ahold of this: http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=AD0415129 |
| 05:14.13 | starseeker | looks like I'll bug the library on Monday after all |
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| 13:26.21 | archivist | starseeker, when you get models from picture I will get interested :) |
| 14:04.41 | starseeker | sneakily wonders if the US National archives might have copies of some of the earlier british tank info as part of the workup for the Mark VIII program |
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| 14:39.55 | brlcad | yawns |
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| 16:00.17 | starseeker | brlcad: So how was the movie? |
| 16:29.36 | starseeker | Hrm. http://www.landships.freeservers.com/jpegs/newpics_05_2005/mk4_cutout.JPG |
| 16:30.34 | starseeker | Or, actually more useful dimensionally: http://www.landships.freeservers.com/jpegs/mk4_interior_plan.JPG |
| 16:47.27 | archivist | notes we had comfy bench seats long before 50's v8 yank cars :) |
| 16:49.02 | brlcad | starseeker: it was pretty good, a follow-on to the first one though so you have to watch them in order |
| 16:49.28 | brlcad | a few of the action scenes were cut a bit too quickly, but otherwise it was pretty good |
| 16:49.36 | brlcad | not as good as casino, but still goo |
| 16:49.38 | brlcad | good |
| 17:14.24 | starseeker | after a morning of stubborn hammering at the US national archives site, I think I might have found a few starting points |
| 17:14.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Any problem if I put in some extra hours tomorrow and during the week so I can run down to College Park on Friday? |
| 17:15.51 | yukonbob | morning, cadheads |
| 17:15.56 | starseeker | morning |
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| 21:44.10 | starseeker | jots notes on bugs |
| 21:46.24 | ``Erik | wow, you must have a tiny little pen |
| 21:46.48 | starseeker | the doggone suckers wiggle too |
| 21:47.18 | ``Erik | <-- still in awe at the notion of people writing on rice |
| 21:47.24 | starseeker | ``Erik: How hard would it be to get the OK to photograph the Liberty tank? |
| 21:48.05 | ``Erik | liberty tank? the spider/skeleton one, or what? |
| 21:48.18 | starseeker | no, not at the ordinance museum |
| 21:48.22 | starseeker | over behind the gate |
| 21:48.54 | ``Erik | um, anyone with a valid photo pass can take a picture of it using a gov't camera, then it's a normal form-1 |
| 21:50.12 | ``Erik | I think there're a couple people in the office and a camera in one, I'd imagine the difficult part would be finding a viable reason to exactly mark A on the form-a |
| 21:50.14 | ``Erik | form-1 |
| 21:50.25 | ``Erik | for,uh, reasons we can discuss on monday |
| 21:50.26 | ``Erik | :) |
| 21:50.53 | ``Erik | don't bother bringing your personal camera, it cannot be used |
| 21:51.00 | starseeker | I know |
| 21:51.32 | starseeker | ``Erik: does difficult ~= impossible? |
| 21:51.42 | ``Erik | I don't think so |
| 21:52.16 | ``Erik | (assuming you mean 'roughly equal to', not 'congruent' or 'set to the inverse') |
| 21:52.16 | ``Erik | :D |
| 21:52.31 | ``Erik | or a horrible perl monstrosity *shudder* |
| 21:52.46 | ``Erik | $_ ~= s/ohmygodmybrainismelting/; |
| 21:52.53 | starseeker | yes roughly equal to |
| 21:53.29 | starseeker | doesn't want to step into quicksand, but unlike the Mark IV the Liberty does have US documentation that is public domain |
| 21:53.51 | starseeker | that I can get at |
| 21:53.52 | archivist | bleh if out doors just use the google map pics |
| 21:53.55 | ``Erik | the obvious issues are going to be "why" and "how does this benefit us?" |
| 21:54.15 | ``Erik | archivist: our entire compound is insanely blurred in google maps and google earth |
| 21:54.22 | archivist | aw |
| 21:54.35 | ``Erik | the entire post, even, including the parts that are publically available and even have location pics |
| 21:54.47 | starseeker | ``Erik: Isn't that the issue with ANY form1 or are photos special? |
| 21:55.13 | ``Erik | there're 3 irl photos of the museum and the museum is still a big blur |
| 21:55.21 | starseeker | heh |
| 21:55.37 | ``Erik | um, any form-1, but we produce mountains of text, and images are sometimes used to support text... small minds, etc, ... |
| 21:56.12 | alex_joni | this one? http://www.militaryimages.net/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/24478 |
| 21:56.31 | starseeker | ``Erik: If I do what I want to with them, they WILL support text |
| 21:56.53 | ``Erik | ok, then collect the photographs and treat them as fouo for now, it's all good |
| 21:57.00 | starseeker | right |
| 21:57.09 | ``Erik | that does look like a male mark |
| 21:57.49 | ``Erik | if you have someone with a camera pass, grab the one from ed's office and go :) it may be wise to not wear baggy clothing and have your identification obvious on a lanyard |
| 21:57.50 | starseeker | that's actually why that particular tank is interesting - because I have documentation of some of the guts that I know is public domain, I can actually do a model as opposed to just a surface gloss |
| 21:58.09 | starseeker | ``Erik: right |
| 21:58.29 | starseeker | never did quite understand why that particular bad boy wasn't at the museum to begin with... |
| 21:59.13 | starseeker | would really prefer to get a point cloud too and have all three types of info on one source, but that would involve convincing Lee it's worthwhile |
| 21:59.15 | ``Erik | I'd kinda like to see our t62 model pushed for OS, or at least the pickup truck... if someone grabbed a used m35 and updated the demo model with a high def version, that'd be awesome |
| 21:59.31 | starseeker | suspects picking up the tank and moving it might be simpler... |
| 21:59.54 | ``Erik | heh, it'd probably crumble |
| 22:00.35 | ``Erik | amusingly, google image search for liberty tank pulls up a lot of images of blonde girls |
| 22:00.51 | alex_joni | heh |
| 22:00.52 | archivist | Ive seen the ones sunk in the channel (france), a LOT remains, |
| 22:01.11 | ``Erik | artifacts keep MUCH longer underwater than on land |
| 22:01.24 | ``Erik | the oxidation avenue is much slower and less UV and heat abuse |
| 22:01.25 | starseeker | Not the Liberty - that's the Mark VIII |
| 22:01.34 | starseeker | apparently they never went to combat |
| 22:01.54 | ``Erik | there're 7's and 8's listed |
| 22:01.54 | archivist | Im talking the WWII sinkers |
| 22:01.56 | starseeker | wikipedia only knows about the one here and a modified one down at Fort Meade |
| 22:01.59 | starseeker | ah |
| 22:02.26 | starseeker | yeah, lot of hardware got put into play off the french coast |
| 22:02.35 | starseeker | needs to get moving - bbl |
| 22:02.43 | ``Erik | hasta manure |
| 22:02.53 | ``Erik | or manana or something |
| 22:04.17 | archivist | they had a silly idea tanks could float into land with the addition of a skirt, rough sees did not help |
| 22:19.19 | ``Erik | heh, yes, yet amphibious armored vehicles were eventually realized :) |
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| 04:15.03 | starseeker | growls at dgo_build_tops |
| 04:15.33 | starseeker | unless I'm completely mistaken, this part of MGED was set up with the assumption that people wouldn't DO things like e all/box.r |
| 04:16.09 | starseeker | probably considered too much typing - "just" xpush and do e box.r |
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| 16:22.49 | ``Erik | oh me |
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| 19:14.24 | starseeker | is starting to wonder if the way MGED is currently keeping track of what's being drawn is up to this challenge |
| 19:20.15 | starseeker | Or, perhaps, it may be a question of how the sflag is set when the draw command is first run |
| 19:20.31 | ``Erik | you think too much |
| 19:39.28 | Ralith | brlcad: was there a reason the vector X/Y/Z defines couldn't be replaced with an enum? I thought that had the same effect after compilation |
| 19:39.50 | Ralith | and it would significantly reduce the chance of a naming conflict |
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| 20:00.48 | starseeker | ``Erik: Where the heck is the s_flag set when something is drawn? Is it in dozoom.c? If so, then dgo_build_tops might be OK after all |
| 20:01.05 | starseeker | or at least, the proper place to change things is in the draw command |
| 21:13.20 | starseeker | Ah, ha! |
| 21:19.49 | starseeker | no, that just introduces new errors |
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| 21:34.08 | starseeker | ignores ``Erik and continues trying to think |
| 23:11.54 | starseeker | tries to think of a case where you would want to do e all/box.r rather than box.r by itself |
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| 06:33.07 | yukonbob | win 3 |
| 06:33.10 | yukonbob | ww |
| 06:37.15 | brlcad | Ralith: the problem is still there so long as we still use [X], [Y], [Z] in our code and use external codes that have #defines for X, Y, Z |
| 06:37.41 | brlcad | adding them into an enum or enum in a namespace would still result in a failure if they have a #define that screws it up |
| 06:38.15 | brlcad | starseeker: the case where you want that is to see objects positioned in a given context |
| 06:39.51 | brlcad | but not in that context -- e.g., engine.r might be modeled at the origin, but actually positioned in some higher level assembly somewhere along the path like /tank/interior/drive_system/engine.r |
| 06:46.03 | Ralith | brlcad: I'm not suggesting putting it in a namespace, and I don't think a plain enum would break existing code. |
| 06:46.25 | Ralith | It might not make naming conflicts *impossible*, but it makes them far more unlikely |
| 06:46.39 | Ralith | iirc the one I was running into was not in the preprocessor at all. |
| 06:47.08 | brlcad | work up a patch, see how it works |
| 06:47.15 | Ralith | alright |
| 06:47.33 | Ralith | should I see if I can manage a before/after performance test? |
| 06:47.45 | brlcad | not for an enum |
| 06:47.50 | brlcad | they'll be the same |
| 06:47.53 | Ralith | that's what I thought |
| 06:51.41 | Ralith | redundant #defines in brep.h and dm.h |
| 06:51.47 | Ralith | what's that about? |
| 06:52.34 | brlcad | such as? |
| 06:52.49 | Ralith | include/brep.h:49:#define X 0 |
| 06:52.52 | Ralith | include/dm.h:57:#define X0 |
| 06:53.08 | brlcad | did you look at brep.h? :) |
| 06:53.17 | Ralith | ah. |
| 06:53.22 | Ralith | I was getting there >_> |
| 06:53.33 | Ralith | still, that doesn't cover the why. |
| 06:53.38 | brlcad | it's got similar conflict issues because of openNURBS defines |
| 06:53.42 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 06:53.57 | brlcad | that's all fair-game to clean up |
| 06:53.57 | Ralith | adopting openNURBS's numbering scheme is not an acceptable solution? |
| 06:54.46 | Ralith | I suppose it would still be messy, though... |
| 06:55.00 | brlcad | those symbols aren't the same for them |
| 06:55.44 | brlcad | the undef/def hacks should certainly go away |
| 06:56.04 | Ralith | opennurbs is C++? |
| 06:57.37 | brlcad | yes |
| 07:24.17 | Ralith | removing or changing the argument names from lines 60-63 of opennurbs_xform.h seems to take the enum && hack removal past the first failure at no sacrifices to functionality. Not sure how hard it would be to push upstream. Thoughts? |
| 07:31.06 | Ralith | realizes that grep -R on the entirety of brlcad is going to take a while |
| 07:31.34 | Ralith | ...I say as it finishes. |
| 08:00.15 | brlcad | think that it doesn't fix the problem since any header could use X/Y/Z for arg names |
| 08:00.51 | brlcad | it's almost always simple to fix, on our end or the other end .. that's partially why it's still the way it is |
| 08:00.57 | Ralith | you could say the same for any globally scoped symbol, with varying degrees of likeliness |
| 08:01.35 | brlcad | not quite, it's specifically because these are preprocessor symbols that they cause problems |
| 08:01.47 | brlcad | if you made them enums, that should fix the opennurbs issue too I'd think |
| 08:02.58 | brlcad | it just won't fix usages, where it is a variable elsewhere and it might/could get our enum value instead of whatever the variable value was |
| 08:03.06 | Ralith | it doesn't fix the opennurbs issue |
| 08:03.11 | Ralith | that's what I've been testing |
| 08:03.29 | Ralith | actually.. |
| 08:03.31 | Ralith | maybe it does |
| 08:03.44 | Ralith | something else has been defining X and I can't find it |
| 08:03.57 | Ralith | cpp reports my enum as 0 = 0, 1 = 1, etc |
| 08:05.15 | brlcad | i just tested it here with a simple test case and it worked |
| 08:05.48 | brlcad | you still have something defining X to 0 |
| 08:05.54 | Ralith | right, there's still a #define X/Y/Z buried somewhere |
| 08:06.00 | brlcad | so your enum gets busted |
| 08:06.19 | brlcad | just have to weed out the rest |
| 08:06.28 | Ralith | what's egrep syntax for whitespace of 1+ chars? Doesn't seem to be \w+ |
| 08:07.11 | brlcad | basic grep would just be '[[:space:]][[:space:]]*' |
| 08:07.44 | brlcad | or extended as '[[:space:]]+' |
| 08:07.59 | brlcad | \w is a perl extension iirc |
| 08:08.10 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 08:08.12 | Ralith | that explains that. |
| 08:08.49 | brlcad | perl added a slew of \* extensions that save keystrokes |
| 08:08.55 | Ralith | does that cover tabs? |
| 08:09.00 | brlcad | yep |
| 08:10.06 | brlcad | [:something:] are posix character classes, probably documented on the re_format(7) manual page |
| 08:10.31 | Ralith | ahah! |
| 08:10.35 | Ralith | further #defines found! |
| 08:10.42 | Ralith | holy shit there's a lot of redundancy here |
| 08:11.32 | brlcad | not too surprising, the headers haven't had an overhaul cleanup in a long time but they get quick-patched a lot |
| 08:11.44 | brlcad | causes a lot of repeat fixing for trivial things |
| 08:13.55 | Ralith | you can't #define something that's already been #defined, right? |
| 08:13.57 | brlcad | longs to be done moving so he can spend all night and day coding again |
| 08:14.12 | Ralith | hehe |
| 08:14.18 | brlcad | you can, but you'll probably get preprocessor warnings or compilation woes |
| 08:14.34 | brlcad | 'blah' was redefined |
| 08:16.45 | Ralith | kay |
| 08:17.04 | Ralith | so I can rely on that none of these numerous "#define X" instances override eachother? |
| 08:29.13 | brlcad | almost guaranteed that they're all just hacks around the fact that openNURBS was also using them, so whenever there's a snippet of code that was dual-processed as C and C++, it needed the protection |
| 08:41.16 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33193 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: flesh out the rest of the fugly pnts export. seriously needs some refactoring cleanup. functify or macrify fer crissakes, or eliminate the cromulent types. |
| 08:44.09 | Ralith | so far so good... |
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| 12:18.35 | mafm | hi |
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| 14:12.50 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33194 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: gave the pointer a type to do arithmetic |
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| 14:25.35 | brlcad | yawns |
| 14:41.07 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33195 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: reduce some of the redundancy, add a routine to pack doubles into the buffer |
| 14:41.53 | starseeker | brlcad: Is the points primitive ready to suck in data? |
| 14:42.06 | brlcad | nope, I just finished export |
| 14:42.13 | brlcad | now I need to do import |
| 14:42.35 | brlcad | another day |
| 14:43.42 | starseeker | k |
| 14:49.11 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33196 10/brlcad/trunk/include/rtgeom.h: document why there are 8 point data containers |
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| 16:58.04 | starseeker | ponders the tree walking aspects of this problem and contemplates first working on the general tree walker |
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| 18:25.09 | brlcad | starseeker: your diagnosis was closer the first time on the rt path problem |
| 18:25.55 | brlcad | there's also a little nomenclature that you don't know about -- the solids list is right, it's just not what you think it is |
| 18:26.33 | brlcad | the primitives used to be called 'solids' .. i.e., solids == primitives |
| 18:27.15 | brlcad | so the solids list really is just a list of the primitives being drawn (since only primitives have wireframes given they're unevaluated and we don't display evaluated versions) |
| 18:28.28 | brlcad | so when you e up all.g, it adds all the relevant primitives to a solids list that it needs to draw all.g (full path to those primitives as there can be duplicates) |
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| 18:29.58 | brlcad | alas, it has absolutely no distinction then between "e a.r" and "e a.r/b.c/c.s" since "e a.r" will cause an /a.r/b.c/c.s path to get added to the solids list |
| 18:30.22 | brlcad | so mged needs to use different information, who needs to be changed |
| 18:55.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33197 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/metaball/metaball.c: do not display "goo" in listing when not appropriate |
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| 19:44.30 | mafm | bye |
| 20:46.04 | starseeker | well, that was an abrupt powerpoint crash |
| 21:23.03 | ``Erik | opposed to a carefully planned and meticulously executed powerpoint crash? |
| 21:23.46 | starseeker | well, usually I expect it to give out when i do something weird like paste an excel graph into a slide, not when editing a text object |
| 21:25.22 | ``Erik | microsoft is continually looking for ways to improve the user experience, now you don't even need to do anything 'weird' to get that comfortably familiar response! :D |
| 21:26.04 | starseeker | next they'll be bundling the sledgehammer with which to destroy the offending OS |
| 21:27.17 | ``Erik | http://www.tburke.net/fun_stuff/pictures/computers/windows-cement.htm an oldie but a goodie :) |
| 21:54.45 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33198 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: just use a simple fixed value of 1 for sizeless points drawing axes until it can be better tested to work resolution independent |
| 22:40.27 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33199 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: ws |
| 23:02.18 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33200 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/sketch/sketch.c: reduce the for loop depth insanity a few levels |
| 00:01.23 | brlcad | hah, hot damn I'm good sometimes |
| 00:03.01 | ``Erik | and you believe this is one of those? :D *duck* |
| 00:03.51 | brlcad | yup -- coded for several hours on some new tricky logic intertwined with old, then compiled warning-free/error-free and ran cleanly on the very first try |
| 00:03.56 | ``Erik | (yay, gnucash is on my new macbook, now I can do my finances :) |
| 00:04.21 | ``Erik | oh, um, that means you probably introduced some very tricky logical bug, no? :D |
| 00:04.38 | brlcad | probably |
| 00:04.53 | brlcad | but that's why I'm just that good |
| 00:04.59 | brlcad | all part of the plan to take over the world |
| 00:05.02 | brlcad | one bug at a time |
| 00:05.06 | ``Erik | beat me to it |
| 00:33.29 | ``Erik | ohhhhhhhhh, I think I get it |
| 00:34.02 | ``Erik | leopard is very ... black... lots of black all over the place, I bet it's to show off the new LED backlighting which can do a very good black opposed to the older flourescent |
| 00:41.37 | Ralith | I bet it's to show off "we can make even cliche designs look good" |
| 00:48.56 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33201 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/g2asc.c: prevent g2asc from crashing on primitives that don't implement *_get() |
| 00:54.37 | ``Erik | HEY, back off, boy |
| 00:54.47 | ``Erik | puts on his black turtleneck, beret, and little round glasses |
| 00:54.49 | ``Erik | *snap* |
| 00:55.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33202 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/bu.h src/libbu/color.c): using _of_ seems quirky/dumb/odd on use, instead use _from_ to match _to_ |
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| 02:05.42 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33203 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: implement import support for all point types. untested but it no longer seems to quejar destructively. remove the magic number from the export header while we're at it since it petty value even as a sanity check. |
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| 04:13.44 | starseeker | hmm, that's a shame - https://sourceforge.net/projects/filters/ is windows only |
| 04:56.51 | starseeker | is awed by the number of computer vision related efforts out there |
| 04:59.57 | Ralith | Programming Language : C, C#, Delphi/Kylix, Java, Python, Visual Basic .NET |
| 04:59.59 | Ralith | what the FUCK |
| 05:13.54 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 05:18.45 | brlcad | probably just bindings |
| 05:21.00 | Axman6 | brlcad: ever played with anything like haskell? |
| 05:24.36 | brlcad | Axman6: yeah, ML |
| 05:24.48 | brlcad | and a little bit of haskell but just playing around |
| 05:25.25 | Axman6 | righto. haven't tried any ML, the syntax looked too strange compared to haskell, when doing the same stuff. @@ for instance |
| 05:26.06 | brlcad | ocaml makes ml actually kinda usable, but yeah it's a quirky language |
| 05:27.34 | Axman6 | i really like haskell, there's some awesome work going into it, and i love how all the hard stuff is figuring out the theory behind things, instead of the syntax. |
| 05:28.49 | Axman6 | things like STM are quite fun |
| 05:29.19 | Axman6 | and `par` for easy parallelising of algorithms |
| 05:31.48 | brlcad | alas, I see haskell (and most functional languages) as really interesting and useful academic tools more than practical languages |
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| 05:32.19 | brlcad | absolutely beautiful constructs you get but nobody to appreciate it |
| 05:32.55 | Axman6 | i think that's beginning to change a bit, but it would be a long time before such things became most mainstream |
| 05:33.16 | brlcad | nods |
| 05:33.45 | ``Erik_ | O.o |
| 05:33.50 | Axman6 | things like STM make haskell very interesting for concurrent applications |
| 05:34.37 | brlcad | is rather happy coding in any language |
| 05:34.59 | brlcad | at least, most languages, there are afew execptions and contexts |
| 05:35.24 | Axman6 | brainfuck? |
| 05:35.41 | ``Erik_ | heh, pheer my brainfuck compiler :D |
| 05:36.29 | Axman6 | i wrote something in brainfuck once. it was pretty much purely random... but it did end up printing something like the Apple command key clover and S or somethign |
| 05:36.40 | Axman6 | should find it and try it again... |
| 05:37.13 | ``Erik_ | I got a belief in my head that the turing tarpit is a perfect place to explore fundamental optimization approaches |
| 05:37.26 | ``Erik_ | so I cooked up a very simple brainfuck compiler suite as a test bed :) |
| 05:38.35 | Axman6 | how'd it go? |
| 05:38.51 | ``Erik_ | the optimizer seemed to make no difference fro the C output performance, but was orders of mangitude difference for the asm output |
| 05:39.06 | Axman6 | excellent |
| 05:39.19 | ``Erik_ | the bf->c->mc path was the faastest, props to gcc |
| 05:39.31 | Axman6 | mc? |
| 05:39.35 | Axman6 | oh, machine code? |
| 05:39.39 | ``Erik_ | ja |
| 05:40.52 | ``Erik_ | I still believe that zomfg core shit belongs at the tarpit level, but I'm not awesome enough to shatter the world just yet |
| 05:41.14 | Axman6 | aww :) |
| 05:42.34 | ``Erik_ | the host I chose to publish all my crap on decided that someone on that machine was doing something naughty, so locked it down and won't give me my bits back.. sucks |
| 05:43.31 | Axman6 | just threaten them with an IP lawsuit or something |
| 05:44.18 | Axman6 | if you mention you're with the Army, doing research for them... they mist be more inclined to listen |
| 05:45.10 | ``Erik_ | I'd be afraid that they might be stupid enough to resist |
| 05:45.30 | Axman6 | you're in the army right?> |
| 05:45.50 | ``Erik_ | no, I'm a civilian employee of |
| 05:46.03 | Ralith | ``Erik_: tell them you work for a government organization? |
| 05:46.09 | Axman6 | close enough :P know any military lawyers? |
| 05:46.18 | Ralith | I dunno, I think the army's pretty intimidating even if you're only an employee. |
| 05:46.28 | Ralith | really, situations like that tend to respond to any pressure whatsoever |
| 05:46.38 | ``Erik_ | yes, I do, but there's this horribly thing called ethics :D |
| 05:46.40 | Ralith | they're only not giving you your data cuz they're lazy, unless I missed something |
| 05:46.58 | Ralith | just send them a scary email. |
| 05:47.13 | ``Erik_ | they're paranoid little bitches who don't grok the notion of a real security issue |
| 05:47.26 | ``Erik_ | all theater |
| 05:47.48 | Ralith | they're also paranoid of big bitches who could make their boss angry at them |
| 05:47.54 | ``Erik_ | but if I abused my position, tha'td be worse than what tehy do |
| 05:48.11 | Ralith | it's not abuse if you're ultimately just saying "I will be very very angry" |
| 05:48.30 | ``Erik_ | complete segregation, dude |
| 05:48.35 | Ralith | ? |
| 05:49.39 | Axman6 | "As an employee of the Unites States Army, i have the right to request that your internet privileges, leased from the DoD be revoked immediately" |
| 05:49.42 | Axman6 | >_> |
| 05:50.16 | Axman6 | "wut? i thought this shit was free, we're fucked, better giv 'em their shit!" |
| 05:50.19 | ``Erik_ | shakes head |
| 05:50.21 | Axman6 | easy :) |
| 05:50.41 | Ralith | lol |
| 05:50.46 | Ralith | little bit overboard there |
| 05:50.53 | Ralith | ``Erik_: what exactly did you lose? |
| 05:51.08 | Axman6 | OS for a ICBM |
| 05:51.11 | Axman6 | an* |
| 05:51.16 | ``Erik_ | personal website, and lone data assocaited with |
| 05:51.36 | Ralith | aw. |
| 05:51.45 | ``Erik_ | code was all in cvs, but the db stuff was not |
| 05:51.53 | Ralith | if you'd left code up there you could say they were obstructing the fulfillment of your obligations. |
| 05:52.25 | ``Erik_ | and the math geeks running the site have been going out of their wa to help me |
| 05:53.13 | ``Erik_ | (I had root access many years after I left that school) |
| 05:53.29 | brlcad | find someone else with a login account on the server to copy your files out |
| 05:53.47 | ``Erik_ | the machien is port blocked |
| 05:54.37 | ``Erik_ | I have a sinking suspicion that the elicite software they discovered was my eggdrop :( |
| 05:55.25 | Ralith | eggdrops are ilicit? |
| 05:55.33 | Axman6 | what are eggdrops anyway? |
| 05:55.41 | ``Erik_ | they contact 'irc', ohz noes |
| 05:55.49 | ``Erik_ | tcl based irc bot |
| 05:55.55 | Axman6 | ah |
| 05:56.03 | Ralith | classic one at that |
| 05:56.06 | Axman6 | and... wait, elicit what? |
| 05:56.17 | Ralith | Axman6: he meant illicit, I think :P |
| 05:56.22 | ``Erik_ | yes, |
| 05:56.24 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 05:56.28 | ``Erik_ | vodka is teh goodz |
| 05:56.32 | Axman6 | heh, so did i then :P |
| 05:56.38 | Axman6 | anyway, illicit how? |
| 05:56.48 | Axman6 | di they solicit? |
| 05:56.51 | ``Erik_ | no |
| 05:56.53 | Axman6 | >_> |
| 05:56.56 | ``Erik_ | uni paranoia |
| 05:57.21 | ``Erik_ | I can't get a straight answer out of their networking team |
| 05:57.42 | ``Erik_ | which I'm apt to read as "it ain't normal, so it's wrong" :( |
| 05:57.49 | ``Erik_ | and now I must sleep! night, kids |
| 05:58.21 | Axman6 | "listen, i have some very important work on that machine that the Army would like to see. They will not be pleased with me, or you, if they cannot see it" |
| 05:58.26 | Axman6 | night man |
| 06:04.10 | Ralith | IRC is pretty normal |
| 06:04.13 | Ralith | at least for people with servers |
| 08:00.42 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 08:16.08 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
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| 08:48.55 | Axman6 | "n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc" trusteduser? |
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| 09:30.35 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33204 10/brlcad/trunk/include/raytrace.h: MS VC++ can not assign a genptr_t (GENPTR_NULL) to a const rt_functab* variable: added a cast to the assignment |
| 09:34.36 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33205 10/rt^3/trunk/ (5 files in 2 dirs): included rt_db_internal in Object |
| 11:58.29 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:58.41 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:00.03 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:59.37 | starseeker | Humm. This is kind of a neat idea http://home.earthlink.net/~tylerfolsom/Research/Research.htm |
| 14:02.37 | starseeker | results in tutorial aren't that hot though |
| 14:11.31 | ``Erik_ | huh, there's an article that may be up starseekers historic avenue... solving what digital camera was used given just the image |
| 14:11.57 | ``Erik_ | http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20026826.200-digital-images-contain-their-makers-mark.html |
| 14:13.34 | ``Erik_ | the ice on my deck still hasn't melted |
| 14:18.10 | starseeker | nifty |
| 14:18.22 | starseeker | why do you have ice on your desk? did the roof leak? |
| 14:18.32 | ``Erik_ | deck, not desk |
| 14:18.36 | ``Erik_ | I called in today, I'm at home |
| 14:19.50 | ``Erik_ | I have a large second story deck with french doors and all that shit |
| 14:20.15 | ``Erik_ | on the north side of the house, so perptually in shadow |
| 14:20.19 | ``Erik_ | perpetually |
| 14:20.44 | starseeker | ah |
| 14:20.54 | starseeker | apparently still isn't parsing properly |
| 14:21.19 | ``Erik_ | still? do I need to take a photograph? O.o |
| 14:21.35 | ``Erik_ | *duck* |
| 14:21.37 | archivist | and draw a map |
| 14:22.27 | ``Erik_ | google earth "my frozen assed deck" |
| 14:22.28 | ``Erik_ | he |
| 14:22.29 | ``Erik_ | h |
| 14:22.43 | ``Erik_ | dEck, you freaks |
| 14:24.28 | starseeker | Ooo, more promising - BSD licensed stand alone source code, too http://svr-www.eng.cam.ac.uk/~er258/work/fast.html |
| 14:25.08 | starseeker | corner detection doesn't do much for circular features, but would be a nice start |
| 14:26.49 | ``Erik_ | *sigh* you missed the critical part |
| 14:26.57 | ``Erik_ | corners and circles are irrelevent |
| 14:27.18 | starseeker | waits for it... |
| 14:27.20 | ``Erik_ | when you break down matter, you get molecules, atoms, quarks, .. keep breaking, eventually you end up with teapots. |
| 14:27.43 | starseeker | ah, so it's teapots all the way down? |
| 14:27.46 | ``Erik_ | the fundamental unit of matter is a teapot, as described by a 16 point bezier surface. Utah style. |
| 14:27.47 | ``Erik_ | yes |
| 14:28.10 | starseeker | The overturn of the Turtle Theory is at hand |
| 14:28.43 | ``Erik_ | the REAL argument isn't about string theory and crap, i'ts about the actual height of the teapot, apparently, someone may've barfed some math and got a 3/4 scaling on the height |
| 14:29.13 | starseeker | heh |
| 14:29.20 | ``Erik_ | turtles are completely valid, but they're made of teapots. |
| 14:29.22 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 14:30.10 | ``Erik_ | wonders how many people are terribly confused by that convo |
| 14:30.22 | starseeker | Sure just like General Relativity can be approximated by Newtonian physics in most cases, Teapots can be approximated by turtles for large numbers of teapont |
| 14:30.28 | starseeker | teapots |
| 14:30.57 | starseeker | ``Erik: Anyone who isn't should seek help immediately |
| 14:31.31 | starseeker | puts link up for later checking when he gets to work: http://www3.ntu.edu.sg/home5/TSOI0002/publications.html |
| 14:32.14 | ``Erik_ | man, wish I were a contractor, I can't show up 2 hours late or I hae to take time off for it, so I just call in sick instead |
| 14:33.17 | ``Erik_ | for some reason, this rule from the jacket and tie era didn't die when the other idiotic rules did |
| 14:33.18 | ``Erik_ | :( |
| 14:35.01 | starseeker | ``Erik: We just pump more hours in at other times - you're required to have a life ;-) |
| 14:36.15 | starseeker | gets in trouble for working late |
| 14:36.22 | ``Erik_ | if I could rock a crunch, that'd be sweet |
| 14:36.34 | starseeker | what? |
| 14:36.44 | ``Erik_ | 40 hour grind, one session |
| 14:36.48 | starseeker | ah |
| 14:36.53 | ``Erik_ | caffiene and sugar and much code |
| 14:37.10 | ``Erik_ | that hypnotic zomfg guru code spew phase |
| 14:37.56 | starseeker | nods |
| 14:38.00 | ``Erik_ | I think I had two really good ones in my life, once in my teens when I was guzzling soda from 2l bottles and popping candy like mad |
| 14:38.27 | ``Erik_ | the other while I was hopped up on a codeine cocktail after having my wisdom teeth removed (one shattered, they cut my jaw apart, gave me 'the good stuff') |
| 14:38.51 | starseeker | owowowowow |
| 14:38.52 | clock_ | now when I hear you talking about coding fits etc. |
| 14:39.01 | ``Erik_ | when real life ends and all that exists is the machine |
| 14:39.02 | clock_ | I want to ask you do you also have problems with lack of social skills?" |
| 14:39.03 | ``Erik_ | :) |
| 14:39.12 | starseeker | heads in before he thinks about teeth too much |
| 14:39.37 | ``Erik_ | I'm quite antisocial, I make it a point to piss people off. Yet I seem to be in a nice relationship with a lovely young woman, have several friends, ... |
| 14:39.54 | starseeker | type to put image analysis aside for a moment and focus on trees any hyp... |
| 14:40.08 | ``Erik_ | I'm probably more antagonistic than antisocial |
| 14:40.21 | starseeker | ``Erik_: You mean she didn't kill you for disappearing like that? ;-) |
| 14:40.27 | ``Erik_ | not yet |
| 14:40.28 | clock_ | ``Erik_: what does it mean "I make it a point to piss people off"? |
| 14:40.39 | starseeker | thought ``Erik_ had tapped in from the afterlife - how else would he know about the teapots? |
| 14:40.42 | ``Erik_ | I go out of my way to annoy people |
| 14:40.48 | clock_ | aha |
| 14:40.51 | clock_ | I did that before too |
| 14:40.54 | clock_ | But not anymore |
| 14:41.01 | ``Erik_ | yeah, I've backed off soe |
| 14:41.12 | louipc | Axman6: Trusted Users are a group that manage the Arch Linux community repository. Kind of a step below 'developer'. |
| 14:41.13 | clock_ | ``Erik_: but imagine you are say in a busy railway station single and you see a nice woman |
| 14:41.26 | starseeker | ``Erik_: I think there are more folk around at work that speak your dialect now :-P |
| 14:41.27 | clock_ | Would you feel incomfortable approaching her and starting to speak at her? |
| 14:41.36 | ``Erik_ | uh huh? and I definitely appreciate the view, but I stay seated |
| 14:41.39 | clock_ | uncomfortable I mean |
| 14:41.53 | starseeker | Regardless, I'll bet she would |
| 14:41.56 | ``Erik_ | not that railway station means anything in the us, I'll assume you meant airport ;) |
| 14:42.07 | starseeker | "why the heck is this guy heading toward me?" |
| 14:42.13 | clock_ | yes I mean airport |
| 14:42.27 | clock_ | starseeker: exactly... |
| 14:42.38 | ``Erik_ | notes that long hair, earrings, goatee, ... imagines he has some aura of 'fuck off or I'll fucking stab you') |
| 14:42.56 | starseeker | you project that or invoke it? |
| 14:43.05 | clock_ | ``Erik_: you have long hair airrings and goatee? |
| 14:43.20 | ``Erik_ | clock: yes. starseeker: I don't know. |
| 14:43.28 | clock_ | ``Erik_: oh cool :) |
| 14:45.08 | ``Erik_ | I think in general I'm civil and polite to a fault, but I seem to try to perpetuate an aura of 'don't fuck with me' :) |
| 14:45.47 | starseeker | stratigically that does make some sense |
| 14:46.08 | starseeker | ``Erik: See ya tomorrow I guess ;-) |
| 14:46.20 | ``Erik_ | if I make it in, yes... have a safe drive |
| 14:46.31 | starseeker | is it frozen out there still? |
| 14:46.37 | ``Erik_ | I know I was upset and unhappy drivign on 95 last night... rain, traffic... *pheer* |
| 14:46.42 | ``Erik_ | yes |
| 14:46.47 | starseeker | crud |
| 14:46.53 | ``Erik_ | and cloudy |
| 14:46.57 | ``Erik_ | hold up a sec |
| 14:47.30 | ``Erik_ | that is very definitely frozen ice on my deck |
| 14:47.39 | ``Erik_ | be careful driving |
| 14:47.58 | ``Erik_ | but I am up in the hills, 95 and apg are way down |
| 14:48.05 | ``Erik_ | hopefully you don't see ice :) |
| 14:48.10 | starseeker | cool |
| 14:48.17 | starseeker | I'll be careful |
| 14:48.18 | starseeker | later |
| 14:49.02 | clock_ | Wikipedia claims social skills are a learned behaviour do you think it's true? |
| 14:49.32 | ``Erik_ | (for those who don't get why ice and stuff is so damn scary on the road here... it's not your control, it's the idjit soccer mom in the 4000kg suv behind you that thinks 4wd means faster stopping) |
| 14:49.59 | clock_ | 1` |
| 14:50.07 | clock_ | ``Erik_: what is this soccer mom I already heard it |
| 14:50.15 | ``Erik_ | for the most part, clock, I do. I personally believe that core function of primary education is to teach the social skills |
| 14:50.28 | clock_ | lol |
| 14:50.43 | clock_ | I always assumed the core function of primary education is to annoy the pupils to death |
| 14:50.45 | ``Erik_ | um, derogatory term for a woman with some wealth at her disposal but little upstairs |
| 14:51.05 | clock_ | like she doesn't have any toys in the attic? |
| 14:51.31 | clock_ | lol hehe |
| 14:51.41 | clock_ | so her intelligence is just enough to buy a suv? |
| 14:51.42 | ``Erik_ | I'm sure you have the notional stereotype... blond chick who breeds, drives an suv, takes care of the kids when they're not in daycare... that's about it |
| 14:51.59 | clock_ | basically a female and older version of a chav? |
| 14:52.06 | ``Erik_ | chav? |
| 14:52.13 | clock_ | no... chav is on a social support right? She has a SUV she isn't |
| 14:52.51 | ``Erik_ | wikipedia has an entry about it |
| 14:53.03 | clock_ | sure they have an entry on anything |
| 14:53.13 | ``Erik_ | apparently not webcomics |
| 14:53.15 | ``Erik_ | heh |
| 14:53.27 | clock_ | if we should look into wikipedia for everything instead of discussing, the human communication could cease altogether ;-) |
| 14:53.37 | ``Erik_ | perhaps |
| 14:54.07 | ``Erik_ | but I'd rather point you to a url than make myself more a fool than usual |
| 14:54.07 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 14:55.55 | clock_ | it's interesting to talk with you |
| 14:56.26 | ``Erik_ | all I can hope is that I disturb your notion of what an american is |
| 14:56.26 | ``Erik_ | :( |
| 14:56.52 | clock_ | well you have obama now don't you? |
| 14:57.03 | ``Erik_ | in a couple months |
| 14:57.05 | clock_ | So the guantanamo will be disassembled and all the weird stuff gets back to normal doesn't? |
| 14:57.26 | ``Erik_ | I'd like it to be so, but I have little hope |
| 14:57.37 | clock_ | yes I hope he's already preparing the handbrake U-turn he's gonna do when Dubya hands him the wheel over |
| 14:58.00 | ``Erik_ | in the world orientation, both the 'republicans' and 'democrats' are incredibly right wing |
| 14:58.32 | ``Erik_ | they call him a liberal, but don't be fooled, there are no liberals in us politics |
| 14:58.49 | ``Erik_ | and since I'm out sick today, I can say shit like that, so PTBTBBTBT |
| 15:00.29 | clock_ | sonds like a pretty long acronym |
| 15:01.30 | ``Erik_ | I'm bitter cynical and old. I have low expectations. No acronyms. Just... malaise. |
| 15:02.12 | ``Erik_ | I've become a huge history and archeology buff, and I look at the modern world and am just saddened |
| 15:04.58 | clock_ | ``Erik_: how old are you? |
| 15:05.12 | ``Erik_ | oh, too old... in my 30's |
| 15:05.25 | clock_ | that's pretty old youre right |
| 15:05.26 | ``Erik_ | I believe only archivist is older than me here :) |
| 15:05.37 | archivist | hides |
| 15:05.42 | clock_ | have you already thought which coffin finish you would like to have? |
| 15:05.53 | ``Erik_ | no, I can't die |
| 15:06.00 | ``Erik_ | I have too much shit to do first |
| 15:06.16 | clock_ | I am 29 and I already feel old |
| 15:06.24 | archivist | shit do do, cars to crash etc |
| 15:06.39 | ``Erik_ | I think I got the car crashing out of my system |
| 15:06.42 | clock_ | archivist: he can do the crash and dying part at once, saving some time |
| 15:06.52 | ``Erik_ | at least I picked a german machine to do it in, otherwise, I may not've walked away |
| 15:07.01 | clock_ | Mercedes>? |
| 15:07.04 | ``Erik_ | bmw |
| 15:07.08 | ``Erik_ | I rolled an m3 |
| 15:07.23 | clock_ | it's like an SUV isn't it? |
| 15:07.26 | ``Erik_ | something about 4 trees, a hill, a chunk of road a couple times |
| 15:07.27 | ``Erik_ | m3? |
| 15:07.28 | ``Erik_ | ... |
| 15:07.31 | ``Erik_ | no, tha'ts their sports car |
| 15:07.42 | ``Erik_ | x3 is their suv |
| 15:07.54 | clock_ | right |
| 15:07.54 | ``Erik_ | m is the bmw equiv of a merc amg |
| 15:08.28 | clock_ | so after that you had to walk? |
| 15:08.42 | clock_ | I thought Americans don't walk |
| 15:09.02 | ``Erik_ | someone hick in a truck calle dthe cops, I found what remained of my phone and put it togheter enough to call iraytrace |
| 15:09.20 | ``Erik_ | he came and fetched me, otherwise it would've been a 10 km walk |
| 15:09.50 | ``Erik_ | he sat and drank vodka with me and made sure I wasn't too damaged |
| 15:10.02 | ``Erik_ | it's good to have good friends :) |
| 15:10.34 | ``Erik_ | I suspect he was analyzing if he needed to take me to the hospital or not the entire time |
| 15:12.07 | ``Erik_ | (I hope, anyways) |
| 15:19.01 | clock_ | If youre party how do you switch the people to talk to? |
| 15:19.20 | clock_ | Can you just stop talking to one and without any explanation walk away? |
| 15:29.30 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33206 10/rt^3/trunk/ (7 files in 2 dirs): added support for file based database |
| 15:29.55 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:08.34 | PrezKennedy | http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1786497 |
| 16:08.43 | PrezKennedy | seems to be a nasty iphone problem there ;) |
| 16:56.00 | starseeker | ``Erik_: metaballs - where is the last "things are working" commit? |
| 16:56.32 | starseeker | I see one in July I'm assuming is it, but there's two in october and one in Nov. - are they fixes or testing new features? |
| 16:57.48 | brlcad | working a 40 hour stint in two days and then disappearing would be a career killer, that'd be bad in so many ways |
| 17:05.10 | starseeker | poor visibility, health effects? |
| 17:17.46 | brlcad | yeah, that's horrible visibility |
| 17:18.05 | brlcad | health effects you might be able to sustain, but the (anti)social aspects would be a killer |
| 17:19.15 | brlcad | not to mention resentment (who doesn't want a 5-day weekend) and the big potential to not be productive during that time (at least not as productive as you could be if the time were spread out) |
| 17:19.27 | starseeker | right |
| 17:20.01 | brlcad | particularly given everyone has to communicate with others from time to time, if only to communicate those changes and progress |
| 17:21.10 | brlcad | working it all in one go is like committing a patch with 250k lines of changes.. that's horrible at communicating what changed, horrible to review, horrible to test, ... just a "bad idea" no matter how many features are included |
| 17:21.21 | brlcad | alienates |
| 17:21.27 | brlcad | is done :) |
| 17:21.34 | starseeker | heh |
| 17:22.12 | starseeker | can't physically sustain such an effort anyway, even if I wanted to - found that out in college |
| 17:26.48 | starseeker | winces - this is going to mess up the release notes table generation again... |
| 17:28.12 | PrezKennedy | i think after hour #14 id be about ready to say "screw you guys, i'm going home!" :) |
| 17:32.38 | brlcad | even when I work a long 30 hour stint.. you'll still see me a couple other times that week |
| 17:33.13 | brlcad | if I'm working late/long, i'm either having a lot of fun (ideally) or there's something important due |
| 17:33.47 | brlcad | starseeker: what table generation? |
| 17:34.05 | starseeker | for CCB |
| 17:34.07 | brlcad | the spreadsheet? wouldn't worry about that so much |
| 17:34.16 | starseeker | isn't, just grousing ;-) |
| 17:34.31 | starseeker | OK, big STABLE revert underway... |
| 17:34.37 | brlcad | the changes aren't being applied to trunk, the table should be fine |
| 17:35.00 | starseeker | If we do a 7.12.8 though, the NEWS file gets hacked up |
| 17:35.21 | starseeker | no biggie |
| 17:36.10 | brlcad | a section just gets inserted noting why the release was made |
| 17:36.32 | brlcad | the script only notes * lines, and there'd only be one at most for .8 |
| 17:36.40 | starseeker | Ah |
| 17:38.13 | starseeker | looks like the post July changes are related to inserting points and a listing change when printing out information about metaballs |
| 17:39.53 | starseeker | brlcad: What's your preference? Is there a chance te listing changes are related to scripted uses of the primitive? |
| 17:40.43 | brlcad | there's always a chance.. I've not read the commit in detail |
| 17:40.59 | brlcad | probably a small chance |
| 17:41.22 | brlcad | go ahead and apply it too just in case, it's a succint patch |
| 17:41.34 | starseeker | That means a 7.12.8 then |
| 17:42.06 | brlcad | ah, right that was only if .6 didn't have the fix |
| 17:42.28 | starseeker | right. Since I don't know exactly what the complaint is, it's a bit tricky |
| 17:42.49 | brlcad | sounds like a phone call :) |
| 17:42.54 | starseeker | however, if we DON'T need a 7.12.8 it'd be silly to do this to stable :-) |
| 17:43.04 | starseeker | right. Whom do I annoy? |
| 17:44.32 | brlcad | you're not annoying :) |
| 17:45.24 | starseeker | will have to try harder :-P |
| 18:23.15 | ``Erik_ | um, I THINK the first commit after the 7.12.2 release is what'll make dave and geoff and russ happy |
| 18:24.08 | ``Erik_ | brlcad: you have a knack for disappearing and I seem to be the one accosted when you do, so I'm stuck saying things like "sean is as sean does, is there anything I can do to help?" or "sean works in mysterous ways, what can I do?" |
| 18:24.40 | ``Erik_ | "where the hell is sean?" "I d'no, I saw commits this morning, he's holed up doing good things" |
| 18:26.58 | ``Erik_ | I miss the ability to grind, the locked down hour notion makes me feel like a gov't beaurocrat, so I have little desire to step up and be a code monkey and find comfort in comforming to the beaurocrat approach :( it's a soul crushing horrible situation |
| 18:51.12 | brlcad | that's mostly been just the past two months while I've been moved |
| 18:51.19 | brlcad | schedule is shifted a solid 5 hours |
| 18:51.38 | brlcad | and I've used up more leave all at once than ever before in a pretty short timeframe |
| 18:52.08 | brlcad | probably the first year I might actually use up most of my leave time |
| 19:02.57 | ``Erik_ | hrm |
| 19:03.09 | ``Erik_ | dante's use of comcast may've been a significant factor of his writing. |
| 19:09.37 | mafm | brlcad: today in 1h I have an interview with minions on the evil one! :D |
| 19:09.43 | mafm | now I go home, take care |
| 19:09.49 | brlcad | ah |
| 19:09.54 | brlcad | well good luck if that interests you |
| 19:10.08 | mafm | not much, if not to go to visit the bigfoots :D |
| 19:10.22 | brlcad | so you're traveling up to WA? |
| 19:10.26 | mafm | it's an external consultancy or whatever the name |
| 19:10.34 | mafm | not at all, it's only a phone interview |
| 19:10.38 | brlcad | ah |
| 19:11.02 | brlcad | phase 1 |
| 19:11.22 | mafm | but if would be good if I were to cross the atlantic for an interview :D |
| 19:11.30 | brlcad | couple phases before WA, then usually the in-persons on-site |
| 19:11.46 | mafm | I liked to fly over the alps when going to a CERN interview :) |
| 19:11.55 | mafm | so you went to an interview with them too? :D |
| 19:12.01 | brlcad | now CERN sounds like a more interesting job :) |
| 19:12.07 | brlcad | nope |
| 19:12.20 | brlcad | I turned them down early |
| 19:12.26 | mafm | xD |
| 19:12.32 | brlcad | but had a couple friends that went there |
| 19:12.50 | mafm | I also told that I didn't use m$ products often, but that apparently didn't discourage them |
| 19:13.35 | brlcad | not at all, they look for ability to learn, not experience |
| 19:14.12 | mafm | but if you don't use their products it's probably because you have a resistance to learn them, maybe ;) |
| 19:14.39 | brlcad | they know a lot of people hate them, especially in CS .. but they also know that's some of the best people |
| 19:15.03 | brlcad | and they have a proven track record at being able to compromise people's (weak) principles with just a little bit of money/toys |
| 19:15.10 | mafm | heh, that's not my case then (some of the best people) |
| 19:15.17 | mafm | anyway, have to go now before the shop close also |
| 19:15.24 | brlcad | cya |
| 19:15.29 | brlcad | hope you get what you want ;) |
| 19:15.45 | mafm | boob.. erm, sorry :D |
| 19:16.38 | mafm | bye folks! |
| 19:16.58 | brlcad | apparently only want's one :) |
| 19:17.11 | brlcad | would rather have at least two, in multiples of two |
| 19:21.46 | PrezKennedy | 2^x boobs |
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| 21:54.06 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33207 10/brlcad/branches/STABLE/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: the problem WAS fixed.. just not merged successfully. merge the other half of r33137 from trunk that was missing that adds cssprop.o to the linkage. this should fix the mac compilation regression woes. |
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| 13:44.37 | ``Erik_ | heh, one of my good buddies in college (dusty) was a very outspoken anti-ms pro-linux nerd, they took him, twisted him... he was back in town and evangelizing them after a bit |
| 13:45.02 | ``Erik_ | if I were accepted into their research division, I'd go for that... otherwise, I don't think I could stomach it |
| 13:45.18 | ``Erik_ | not even their rogue mac division :( |
| 13:47.12 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedyJR (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 14:14.35 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 14:16.34 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33208 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: |
| 14:16.34 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: this amazingly seems to work without needing a switching table. implement ifree |
| 14:16.34 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: to free the rt_pnts_internal structure including all stashed points. probably |
| 14:16.34 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: regret it slightly if we ever decide to undo type aliasing but for now it's the |
| 14:16.34 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: path of least resistance and one step closer to completion. |
| 14:20.13 | mafm | hi pplz |
| 14:21.07 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33209 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/pnts/pnts.c: ws comment cleanup |
| 14:22.56 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 14:26.50 | mafm | sigh |
| 14:26.58 | brlcad | how did it go? |
| 14:27.00 | mafm | legal fights with the lab, otherwise pretty well :) |
| 14:27.16 | mafm | oh, a very nice technical interview, but they rejected me right away |
| 14:28.23 | brlcad | outstanding |
| 14:28.27 | brlcad | er, I mean .. sorry to hear that |
| 14:29.45 | mafm | outstanding? |
| 14:30.09 | brlcad | would consider that a compliment to be rejected by the rejects |
| 14:30.41 | clock_ | brlcad: I sometimes get rejected because I am too good for that position |
| 14:32.48 | mafm | well, I think that I performed well in the technical aspects |
| 14:33.05 | brlcad | I don't think I'm too good to work for them, I strongly disapprove of many of their business practices that have occurred over the years |
| 14:33.15 | mafm | but didn't show much interest in the questions such as "why do you want to work at microsoft?" |
| 14:33.30 | mafm | "I don't, they approched me and I just sent the CV" |
| 14:33.36 | mafm | :D |
| 14:33.40 | brlcad | nice |
| 14:34.26 | mafm | it was not for m$ itself anyway, but from subsidiaries with offices at Paris or maybe other things in the near future |
| 14:34.40 | mafm | something about music services |
| 14:35.20 | clock_ | microsoft |
| 14:38.32 | mafm | yep, the Evil One |
| 14:38.33 | mafm | :P |
| 14:39.08 | mafm | so no visit to Paris or the woods of the bigfoot or anything :( |
| 14:57.39 | ``Erik_ | redmond is pretty developed |
| 14:57.54 | ``Erik_ | you'd have to drive up into the hills to see bigf... uh, woods |
| 14:59.02 | Axman6 | i thought ballmer still worked for MS? |
| 14:59.09 | Axman6 | ba doom cha |
| 14:59.57 | ``Erik_ | now that just ain't cool, sasquash is a peaceful friendly dude, not a sweat drenched chair throwing madman |
| 15:00.02 | ``Erik_ | only humans could be that fucked up |
| 15:00.03 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 15:00.15 | Axman6 | :P |
| 15:01.17 | ``Erik_ | supposedly, ms has a habit of grabbing young coders and burning them out fast, very not family friendly... 80 hour work weeks, free pizza and soda, etc... |
| 15:01.37 | ``Erik_ | may've changed int he last 15 years, I d'no |
| 15:01.56 | ``Erik_ | but they DID provide 'almost live' with some good skit meat :D that was an awesome show |
| 15:02.04 | Axman6 | they're supposed to have some of the best coders out there too... but management means you end up with shit like vista |
| 15:02.20 | ``Erik_ | everyone has the best coders. |
| 15:02.29 | ``Erik_ | I don't think the people who say that know what that means |
| 15:03.19 | ``Erik_ | "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." |
| 15:03.31 | Axman6 | where's that from? |
| 15:03.35 | ``Erik_ | princess bride |
| 15:04.17 | Axman6 | don't think i've seen that, but it sounds familliar |
| 15:04.24 | ``Erik_ | commonly quoted |
| 15:04.27 | ``Erik_ | it's a good flick |
| 15:04.47 | Axman6 | i must get my girlfriend to make me watch it then :P |
| 15:04.48 | ``Erik_ | mid 80's iirc, should be able to buy the dvd cheap or find it online or something, or rent it for a buck or whatever |
| 15:05.26 | ``Erik_ | yeah, it's a good one to watch with the wench |
| 15:11.32 | archivist | made me glance there ``Erik_ the_wench is my bot name |
| 15:13.53 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14FAAF.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:31.15 | Axman6 | don't call my girlfriend a wench :( she gives me sex |
| 15:31.27 | Axman6 | and i love her deeply |
| 15:32.12 | ``Erik_ | I... uh... wow, so many horribly wrong comments to make, I can't pick one O.O |
| 15:32.21 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 15:32.38 | ``Erik_ | shuts up and pets his pancake |
| 15:33.39 | Axman6 | damn it, i want pancakes! |
| 15:33.46 | ``Erik_ | no, she's mine! |
| 15:33.56 | Axman6 | oh, and heh, i see what you mean |
| 16:49.36 | starseeker | brlcad: What's all the stuff in MGED about TRY_EDIT_NEW_WAY? Is that the "standard" way now and no one removed the conditionals or is there some ongoing work on it? |
| 16:57.08 | starseeker | seems to be a fair bit of code duplication with respect to the rotating behaviors in here... |
| 16:57.19 | starseeker | w |
| 16:57.22 | starseeker | whoops |
| 16:59.10 | brlcad | starseeker: svn annotate |
| 17:02.42 | starseeker | mostly morrison or brlcad on the lines - your work? |
| 17:02.59 | brlcad | read the commit message that goes with that revision |
| 17:03.05 | starseeker | ah |
| 17:04.36 | brlcad | much of the code traces back to me when everything moved from the top-level to a nested restructure, so you have to trace back to where the file used to be (e.g. mged/edsol.c instead of src/mged/edsol.c prior to revision 22798 |
| 17:05.02 | brlcad | whitespace changes will also show up -- always have to check the commit message since it could be innocuous changes |
| 17:05.26 | brlcad | so you annotate, then check the log message, then reannotate with -rrevision, then recheck log, etc |
| 17:05.34 | starseeker | ah |
| 17:05.47 | brlcad | (usually easiest to dump the raw log to a file, and just refer to that as you annotate) |
| 17:06.01 | brlcad | the web interface makes some of that easier too, like getting to where things used to be |
| 17:07.25 | brlcad | e.g., if you find out that a file moved at revision 22798, you can go to http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/ .. enter 22798 in the sticky revision box, then you'll see the old hierarchy |
| 17:07.41 | starseeker | neat! |
| 17:07.52 | starseeker | wasn't aware the web ui was that sophisticated |
| 17:08.53 | brlcad | more to the point of that change: http://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/brlcad/brlcad/trunk/mged/edsol.c?view=diff&pathrev=22798&r1=12921&r2=12922 |
| 17:09.27 | brlcad | and bob's wonderful commenting tradition clearly states exactly what he changed and why he changed it that way in the commit message |
| 17:09.29 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 17:09.53 | starseeker | woulud have bet $$ it was bob with that style of coding |
| 17:10.25 | starseeker | Oh, lordy |
| 17:10.54 | starseeker | so for over 10 years the dead code has been sitting around with that conditional in there |
| 17:12.28 | starseeker | considering it's MGED... do I just replicate the sins of the past and duplicate the logic yet again or is it worth at least a little fixing? |
| 17:13.52 | starseeker | supposes the edsol logic might be usable elsewhere, maybe with some retargeting of menu names and such... |
| 17:18.01 | starseeker | decides on some preliminary cleanup testing to see how much work it would be... |
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| 17:30.25 | starseeker | notes he has just blundered into the largest file in src/mged |
| 17:32.40 | brlcad | starseeker: refactoring is always in order |
| 17:33.04 | brlcad | I usually elimiate dead code like that after a decade or after I understand why it was made conditional in the first place |
| 17:33.36 | brlcad | especially on "recent" conditionals, it's often not desirable to use the more recent one .. but they shouldn't both stay of course |
| 17:33.46 | starseeker | nods |
| 17:33.49 | clock_ | I just wrote down all the psychical problems I have |
| 17:34.03 | clock_ | and burst into laughter. I didn't know one person can have so many problems. |
| 17:34.07 | starseeker | If I'm reading this right, the "TRY_EDIT_NEW_WAY flag has been set for YEARS |
| 17:34.11 | clock_ | It's simply amazing. |
| 17:34.45 | clock_ | I think I should consult a professional ask if everything is all right do you think it's a good idea? |
| 17:34.51 | starseeker | brlcad: Is the logic in edsol something we hope will survive to be used in a new GUI? |
| 17:35.26 | brlcad | starseeker: that's often the case .. there are lots of issues that have been there for two decades |
| 17:35.47 | brlcad | clock_: I think you should if you think you should :P |
| 17:35.56 | starseeker | would hope that major issues would have been noticed by the users within a decade... |
| 17:36.23 | brlcad | exactly, but that's also why it's a case by case |
| 17:36.31 | brlcad | for something that old, it's a trivial decision |
| 17:36.54 | starseeker | limbers up his "d" pressing finger |
| 17:38.44 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33210 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: I think we've tried editing the new way long enough. the old way is out of date. |
| 17:39.42 | brlcad | commit early, commit often ;) |
| 17:40.09 | starseeker | and which 30 key simultaneous press was that edit? :-P |
| 17:41.07 | brlcad | ctrl-s s, ctrl-k, ctrl-s #, ctrl-k k k, repeat |
| 17:42.08 | starseeker | must concede the speed competition to brlcad |
| 17:50.45 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33211 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: More dead code cleanup. |
| 18:18.58 | clock_ | Do you have any idea what "loving life" may mean? |
| 18:26.59 | PrezKennedyJR | theyre high |
| 18:42.45 | clock_ | ;-) |
| 18:58.14 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33212 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (edsol.c sedit.h tedit.c): Starting on hyp editing support in MGED |
| 19:06.36 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33213 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: massive ws, indent, and style cleanup |
| 19:13.25 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33214 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: oops, quick revert of 33213 -- missed some typo |
| 19:19.00 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33215 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: okay, that's better. reapply the ws, style, indent cleanups from 33213 but wrap the vmath macros correctly so the new semicolon doesn't cause a syntax error. |
| 19:20.22 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33216 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (15 files): move the mged_ttol and mged_tol declarations into mged.h so we don't have to declare them everywhere. |
| 19:32.29 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33217 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: quell warnings |
| 19:42.10 | mafm | such a frenziness! :P |
| 19:42.29 | mafm | I go home now, bye |
| 19:43.17 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33218 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/anal.c: get rid of the obsolete major/minor protections |
| 19:48.13 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33219 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (7 files): more dead code removal, removing the DO_NEW_EDIT_MATS and DO_DISPLAY_LISTS else case sections. |
| 19:51.02 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33220 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/dozoom.c: fix indentation, remove more dead code |
| 19:53.41 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33221 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (buttons.c chgtree.c): more dead code removal |
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| 21:02.29 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33222 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/table.c: sed doesn't seem to like rt_nul_xform here for hyp |
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| 22:08.05 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33223 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (13 files): add a slew of crash protections around the rt_functab accessors. this needs to be refactored into a better interface where the callers aren't accessing the functab directly. |
| 23:12.02 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
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| 00:27.41 | starseeker | sighs as he realizes all the hyp.c math will need a rework |
| 00:28.30 | brlcad | sighs as he realizes the g-vrml exporter will need a rework |
| 00:29.29 | ``Erik_ | sighs as he realizes that computers are hard and his brain will need a rework |
| 00:31.07 | starseeker | ``Erik_: I thought you were rewriting your brain in Lisp? |
| 00:36.38 | Ralith | brlcad, g-vrml? Neat! |
| 00:40.54 | brlcad | Ralith: hm? we've had that converter for ages |
| 00:40.55 | starseeker | brlcad: Cool, market below 8000 |
| 00:41.00 | brlcad | yep |
| 00:41.31 | Ralith | brlcad, I'm sure we've had lots of things I don't know about for ages :P |
| 00:41.36 | Ralith | doesn't make it less neat. |
| 00:41.56 | brlcad | :) |
| 00:42.13 | brlcad | finds new things I either didn't know about or had long since forgotten all the time ;) |
| 00:42.52 | brlcad | it seems to be very unhappy with dxf-imported bots for some reason, though .. very annoying |
| 00:43.47 | starseeker | falls over laughing at the big 3 automaker CEOs flying to D.C. in private jets to ask for money |
| 00:44.08 | starseeker | not that it makes any practical difference, but the symbolism is great |
| 01:03.28 | Ralith | yeah |
| 03:30.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33224 10/brlcad/trunk/ (Makefile.am bench/Makefile.am): |
| 03:30.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: hook in make check to make test and make benchmark so that distcheck will also |
| 03:30.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: have to pass those two in order to succeed. still don't want distclean wiping |
| 03:30.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: out the benchmark 'summary' file, so have to add a manual exemption to the |
| 03:30.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: top-level, but we do need to clean up after the various log and pix files. |
| 04:00.20 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33225 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: per a forum discussion thread about g-vrml that has come up before, it'd be useful if g-vrml had an option to output v1 or v2 format. this would make a great easy little project for someone looking to get involved. |
| 04:02.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33226 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 04:02.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: g-vrml seems to ignore bots that are created with dxf-g. a simple workaround |
| 04:02.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: seems to be to pass the imported bot through the stl exporter/importer then |
| 04:02.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: it'll export as vrml (but also ends up doubling the number of faces). |
| 07:50.38 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:02.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33227 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 5 dirs): |
| 08:02.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: Rework the hyp primitive to use input parameters provied by user as primary |
| 08:02.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: storage of dimensions. Compiles and make seems to throw up a hyp - next up is |
| 08:02.09 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: more extensive testing of the change and continuing with the editing support. |
| 08:02.29 | starseeker | woo-hoo! |
| 08:02.39 | starseeker | <crash> zzzzzz..... |
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| 11:47.49 | claymore | Morning all. |
| 12:06.48 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33228 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/cpp/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work: Segregated projects into appropriate namespaces. Begun coding work load divisions. |
| 12:21.54 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33229 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/ (. superceded_GS/): Organizational Changes. Creating directories and moving code snippets and libraries into their appropriate directories. |
| 12:22.02 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33230 10/rt^3/trunk/src/ (geometryService/cpp/docs/ iBME/docs/): Organizational Changes. Creating directories and moving code snippets and libraries into their appropriate directories. |
| 12:24.43 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33231 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/ (cpp/ java/): Organizational Changes. Creating directories and moving code snippets and libraries into their appropriate directories. |
| 12:26.36 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33232 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/superceded_GS/ (cpp/ cpp/docs/ java/): Organizational Changes. Moved first attempt at the Geometry Service into a superceded_ directory under iBME. |
| 12:27.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33233 10/rt^3/trunk/src/geometryService/: Organizational Changes. Deleted empty src/geometryService directory. |
| 12:38.47 | brlcad | mornin' |
| 12:39.46 | claymore | howdy. Just waking or getting ready to crash? |
| 12:40.12 | brlcad | neither, I've been up for a while |
| 12:40.47 | claymore | fun stuff! How you been? Read through the emails at work... looks like someone's memory stick was naughty lol. |
| 12:47.26 | claymore | brlcad: So I am working on getting a 'Roast of the GeometryService' meeting lined up. When are you available? |
| 13:15.16 | brlcad | okay, cool -- but if this is an arl thing, then can discuss it there |
| 13:18.43 | claymore | no discussion needed. Just need to know what days you will be available. ;) |
| 13:29.14 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33234 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/docs/BME.eap: Continuing Architecture Work: Added ResourceManifest class to enhance robustness of Resource transfers. |
| 13:31.01 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:32.41 | brlcad | d_rossberg: moin! |
| 13:39.20 | d_rossberg | hallo brlcad |
| 13:39.50 | claymore | d_rossberg: heya. how goes things? |
| 13:43.00 | d_rossberg | hi claymore, which of the many things on my desktop do you mean? |
| 13:43.23 | claymore | d_rossberg: things in general. |
| 13:45.25 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33235 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/ (86 files in 7 dirs): Continuing Architecture Work: Initial import of class skeleton code. |
| 13:45.52 | d_rossberg | well, the end of the year is near and there are some things which have to be finished ... but i shouldn't complain |
| 13:46.09 | starseeker | boots brain... |
| 13:46.57 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:47.17 | d_rossberg | btw, i had a look at the iBME section in the wiki |
| 13:48.07 | claymore | d_rossberg: Yeah, I got about 5% into my work when I had to take a few days off. But I am back at it. More to come on the documentation. |
| 13:48.16 | clock_ | I got an idea |
| 13:48.22 | claymore | d_rossberg: input always welcome! Questions too. |
| 13:48.28 | clock_ | Since BRL-CAD uses an efficient short format to store 3D databases |
| 13:48.41 | clock_ | I have developed a very dense 2D barcode with error correction |
| 13:48.53 | clock_ | One could make a sticker that would contain a 3D model of an object and stick it on an object |
| 13:49.10 | clock_ | If someone needed to interface that object mechanically he would scan the sticker and would have a model available |
| 13:49.23 | claymore | clock_: neat idea :) |
| 13:49.51 | claymore | clock_: what physical dimensions? what storage capacity? |
| 13:49.52 | clock_ | It fits 200kB per page A4 with a laser printer |
| 13:50.06 | clock_ | A6 then 50kB etc. |
| 13:50.25 | clock_ | But now I see a usual .g file is like 19kB or so maybe it would be too big |
| 13:50.35 | clock_ | maybe compressed |
| 13:51.04 | claymore | heh, um, most of the .g's I have worked with are 50-400MB ;) |
| 13:51.08 | clock_ | lol |
| 13:51.10 | clock_ | no way then :) |
| 13:51.34 | claymore | I got excited when you tossed out the words 'High density' |
| 13:51.36 | clock_ | Or it could be a tiny stamp containing only the URLs with the information |
| 13:52.06 | clock_ | It has higher density than the patented PARC Dataglyph which has allegedly only 50kB per A4 |
| 13:52.09 | claymore | those ginormous files consisted of mostly bots though... |
| 13:53.19 | claymore | well, back to work. |
| 13:53.24 | claymore | :/ |
| 14:03.47 | brlcad | claymore: btw, if it's not been said.. the commit messages are much better :) been able to follow much better |
| 14:04.44 | claymore | brlcad: I have been SOOOO tempted to run them through a Ebonics translator just for fun. But thanks, I'm learning still :) |
| 14:04.44 | brlcad | especially the ones today, that's the 'it tells a story' aspect that is great to have in the revision history |
| 14:05.29 | brlcad | hey, you're talking to other devs, so jokes are sometimes appreciated :) |
| 14:05.30 | claymore | d_rossberg: do you have any immediate feedback from the docs on the wiki? |
| 14:05.49 | starseeker | <snort> particularly insults to Windows |
| 14:06.15 | brlcad | now just wishes there was a better text-diffable format for diagrams |
| 14:06.37 | claymore | starseeker: I got a brother-in-law that works for MS and kicks back nearly ALL the perks to his family... so I need to be somewhat careful :) |
| 14:06.46 | starseeker | ah :-) |
| 14:07.12 | starseeker | is only likely to get a poison dart arrow from MS, considering my history with open source |
| 14:07.24 | claymore | starseeker: Nothing like legit copies of XP Pro for $10 :) |
| 14:07.25 | clock_ | I wonder what an output from Ebonics translator looks like. |
| 14:07.57 | brlcad | claymore: sure there is, copies of BSD or Linux for $0 :) |
| 14:09.21 | claymore | brlcad: Not when you run your own whitebox bidness out of your house and the customer wants Windows. :) |
| 14:09.32 | starseeker | brlcad: there's matplotlib: http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/gallery.html |
| 14:10.40 | starseeker | probably a bit too function/dat plotting specific though |
| 14:10.49 | brlcad | starseeker: someone should build an architexture/project diagram tool on top of that then :) |
| 14:10.57 | brlcad | by itself, though, it's too low-level |
| 14:11.18 | starseeker | nods |
| 14:11.33 | starseeker | plus, introduces python as a requirement |
| 14:11.37 | brlcad | hm, what was the tool that one of the gsoc students used.. |
| 14:11.47 | starseeker | what specific application did you have in mind? |
| 14:12.41 | starseeker | claymore's docs? |
| 14:12.50 | brlcad | something like visio |
| 14:13.04 | starseeker | Ah, yes... |
| 14:13.31 | starseeker | was thinking we could make claymore re-implement his diagrams in graphviz ;-) |
| 14:13.44 | brlcad | not even something code-specific, omnigraffle is probably an even better example |
| 14:14.34 | starseeker | googles omnigraffle |
| 14:15.27 | starseeker | oh, it is graphviz based |
| 14:15.33 | claymore | starseeker: You and what army pal! *protects his diagrams* |
| 14:15.48 | starseeker | uh - the one outside the window? :-P |
| 14:16.02 | claymore | starseeker: Thats your verizon network silly. |
| 14:16.51 | starseeker | brlcad: pity that's commercial |
| 14:16.59 | brlcad | yeah, it is |
| 14:17.16 | brlcad | omni's tools are all outstanding, but mostly non-free |
| 14:17.43 | starseeker | hmm... tcldot + tk widgets + lots of ugly hackery... |
| 14:18.22 | starseeker | + graphviz as a requirement... |
| 14:18.34 | starseeker | ~= trouble probably |
| 14:25.51 | starseeker | humph - looks like the only Tk+graphviz work was done in Perl |
| 14:26.21 | starseeker | must investigate tcldot... potential for evil here :-) |
| 14:27.43 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@193.136.2.121) | |
| 14:27.58 | claymore | |
| 14:29.00 | mafm | hi pplz |
| 14:29.46 | claymore | hai mafm! |
| 14:30.17 | starseeker | alrightie, as the song says "back on the road again" |
| 14:36.35 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33236 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/hyp/hyp.c: style/consistency cleanup. format up comments, remove embedded tabbage. |
| 14:38.57 | claymore | imagines what Starseeker Nelson would look like..... *shiver* |
| 14:39.02 | claymore | :D |
| 14:41.11 | d_rossberg | claymore: now i had a closer look to your docs ... |
| 14:42.16 | d_rossberg | e.g.: BrlcadDbResource::getGeometryByObjectName() can never return a GeoRegion |
| 14:43.53 | claymore | Firstly, the BrlcadDbResource class is under my spotlight right now... there is something not right about how I implemented it. |
| 14:44.37 | claymore | but as for not being able to return a GeoRegion... why not? GeoRegion isa GeoCollection isa AbstractResource.... |
| 14:45.46 | d_rossberg | that's true, but getGeometryByObjectName always returns an AbstractResource (i.e. the base class) |
| 14:48.28 | claymore | what you said is also true. Since a GeoRegion isa AbstractResource, getGeometryByObjectName can return ANY AbstractResource or subclass... |
| 14:48.40 | claymore | .... so I don't see how it can't. |
| 14:53.23 | claymore | not that I couldn't be wrong, but that's how I though OO inheritance worked. |
| 14:53.48 | claymore | though = thought |
| 14:53.58 | d_rossberg | at the end of the execution of getGeometryByObjectName the copy constructor of AbstactResource will be called which can create an AbstractResource only |
| 14:54.42 | claymore | no copies, just references/pointers. |
| 14:55.21 | d_rossberg | there is no & or * |
| 14:56.09 | d_rossberg | returning the value means using the copy constructor |
| 14:56.26 | claymore | righto. Design docs are still a work in progress. Assume ALL object passing is either reference or pointer. Never by value. |
| 14:56.59 | d_rossberg | but then: who owns these objects? how long do they live? |
| 14:58.00 | d_rossberg | will be back in some minutes |
| 14:58.09 | claymore | Many different things can have a handle on AbstractResource objects. Primarily, they will reside in the ResourceCache. |
| 15:00.10 | claymore | As various commands are recieved, the GE will perform UUID lookups first in the ResourceCache, then secondly in the ResourceSvnLink, then in anyother AbstractResourceSources registered with the ResourceManager. |
| 15:01.25 | claymore | Once (if) the AbstractResoruce is located by the ResourceManager, a handle can be passed into the appropriate Function in the GED object and the recieved 'command' is then executed. |
| 15:02.53 | claymore | Their Lifespan is determined by the Caching Methodology that is employed in the ResourceCache. That methodolgy is TDB. |
| 15:02.59 | claymore | lol, TBD even. |
| 15:17.28 | d_rossberg | aha, i didn't recognized the cache object |
| 15:19.01 | claymore | it makes perfect sense in my head... now the REAL project is making it make sense on paper :) |
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| 16:21.16 | ``Erik_ | takes a moment to self detonate |
| 16:21.52 | Kool[a]id | ``Erik_: LOL |
| 16:21.54 | claymore | ``Erik_: How ya feeling? |
| 16:22.01 | ``Erik_ | aplosive |
| 16:22.20 | ``Erik_ | much better, still a deep cough, but I think it's residual |
| 16:22.26 | ``Erik_ | hungry |
| 16:22.27 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 16:22.32 | claymore | lol car just for ``Erik_ : http://icanhascheezburger.com/2007/10/31/leeeeeeeeeroy1/ |
| 16:22.36 | claymore | car = cat |
| 16:22.50 | ``Erik_ | LEEEERRROOOOYYYY jenkins! |
| 16:23.09 | ``Erik_ | that was an effin' hilarious video |
| 16:23.27 | claymore | still nearly pees himself laughing at that vid. |
| 16:26.05 | claymore | brings back some very norrid EverCrack memories...... |
| 16:26.06 | ``Erik_ | I was up at 4 this morning (fell asleep on the couch early last night), logged into that stupid game, but just wasn't feeling it :/ even after spending $70 on the 'collectors edition' update |
| 16:26.33 | claymore | that Frozen Lich King exp pack thingy? |
| 16:26.43 | ``Erik_ | I think I spent more time arguing with strangers than playing... I'm very internet special olympics like that |
| 16:26.44 | ``Erik_ | yes |
| 16:27.30 | ``Erik_ | http://www.ifilmdb.com/Crunchyroll/Pictures/ArguingOnTheInternet-Special%20Olympics.jpg |
| 17:18.30 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33237 10/jbrlcad/trunk/ (.classpath .project): Deleted .classpath and .project since they are IDE/Computer specific files and shouldn't really be in the Repository. |
| 17:28.53 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33238 10/jbrlcad/trunk/: Added .classpath and .project files to the svn:ignore property of the root directory. |
| 17:45.16 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33239 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/ (87 files in 8 dirs): Updated Architecture to reflect object References and Pointers instead of 'pass by value' where applicable. Generated new UML images. |
| 19:01.20 | *** join/#brlcad marko1 (n=mark@cpe-74-72-195-92.nyc.res.rr.com) | |
| 19:01.43 | marko1 | there IS an IRC for BRL CAD! |
| 19:02.51 | marko1 | is anyone there? |
| 19:04.03 | marko1 | is it possible to apply transforms and rotations of a region as a whole? |
| 19:04.28 | marko1 | looks like arced is the command to use |
| 19:04.44 | marko1 | can't get it working |
| 19:11.40 | mafm | there is, but sometimes everybody is... erm... sleeping? :) |
| 19:12.01 | marko1 | it's the oed command |
| 19:12.10 | marko1 | reading the oed tutorial |
| 19:12.11 | marko1 | now |
| 19:22.43 | marko1 | do you HAVE to B before you enter oed? |
| 19:44.50 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@193.136.2.121) | |
| 19:59.50 | marko1 | mafm: so I got the basic oed moves down |
| 19:59.59 | marko1 | now I'm trying to use them from command line |
| 20:00.04 | marko1 | mged -c style |
| 20:00.59 | marko1 | I keep getting |
| 20:00.59 | marko1 | no solids in view |
| 20:00.59 | marko1 | Unable to do <Object Translation> from VIEWING state. |
| 20:01.00 | marko1 | Expecting OBJ EDIT state. |
| 20:01.00 | marko1 | no solids in view |
| 20:01.00 | marko1 | Unable to do <Object Translation> from VIEWING state. |
| 20:01.01 | marko1 | Expecting OBJ EDIT state. |
| 20:04.16 | marko1 | NM |
| 20:04.20 | marko1 | got it |
| 20:14.21 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 20:33.12 | claymore | Sorry! Many of us have been off inmeeting land. |
| 20:33.29 | marko1 | I sorta got it |
| 20:33.52 | marko1 | but now it seems like it's only moving the right hand solid |
| 20:33.57 | claymore | problems with the OED command? |
| 20:33.59 | marko1 | not the whole regoion |
| 20:34.11 | marko1 | yeah |
| 20:34.44 | claymore | check this and see if it helps: http://brlcad.org/w/images/3/36/Object_Editing_-_the_oed_Command.pdf |
| 20:34.49 | marko1 | ha |
| 20:34.54 | marko1 | reading that now |
| 20:35.20 | marko1 | does oed behave differently for combinations vs regions |
| 20:35.43 | claymore | A simple way to think about oed is that there is a path from root to solid for every solid |
| 20:35.51 | claymore | marko1: No it shouldn't... |
| 20:35.56 | marko1 | k |
| 20:36.38 | claymore | if you take that full path and split it in two halves, that split will represent the editing point and everything from that split on down to the solid will be affected (all branches of the tree) |
| 20:36.52 | marko1 | whoa |
| 20:37.03 | marko1 | let me read that 3 more times |
| 20:37.14 | marko1 | ah |
| 20:37.18 | marko1 | I think I see |
| 20:37.21 | marko1 | let me try |
| 20:37.41 | claymore | think of it like your arm: shoulder/upperarm/elbow/lowerarm/wrist/hand.s |
| 20:37.52 | claymore | (pardon the horrid spelling) |
| 20:38.18 | claymore | if you: mged>oed /shoulder/upperarm/ elbow/lowerarm/wrist/hand.s |
| 20:38.58 | claymore | then you are editing the 'elbow' and lowerarm, wrist, and hand.s will all be affected (as will all the fingers, but i didnt want to go to THAT level of complexity) |
| 20:39.04 | marko1 | what if you wanted to move the shoulder |
| 20:39.35 | claymore | try mged>oed / shoulder/upperarm/elbow/lowerarm/wrist/hand.s |
| 20:39.48 | claymore | note the single slash that indicates 'root' or 'toplevel' |
| 20:39.57 | marko1 | bingo! |
| 20:39.59 | marko1 | got it |
| 20:40.09 | claymore | excellent! |
| 20:40.15 | marko1 | claymore: very helpful |
| 20:40.24 | marko1 | subtle thing |
| 20:40.30 | marko1 | hard to get from docs |
| 20:40.47 | claymore | brlcad is wickedly powerful... and wickedly hard to learn :) |
| 20:41.08 | marko1 | I'm using ruby to emit mged commands |
| 20:41.10 | marko1 | it's great |
| 20:41.42 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33240 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/docs/ (BME.eap GeometryEngine_UML.png): Updated Architecture to reflect a new more object References and Pointers instead of 'pass by value' where applicable. Generated new UML images. |
| 20:42.22 | claymore | using mged classic mode? |
| 20:45.55 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33241 10/rt^3/trunk/: IDE specific svn:ignore .project and .cproject |
| 20:46.41 | claymore | great. snow on the way home :/ |
| 20:46.48 | claymore | welp, see yall later. |
| 21:11.25 | marko1 | is there a way to force order of operations? |
| 21:11.30 | marko1 | seems parens don't work |
| 21:11.54 | marko1 | r bobbin_solid u (support_plate u bobbin_torus + bobbin_half) - bobbin_negativ |
| 21:12.53 | *** join/#brlcad cad64 (n=52a9e334@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 21:32.25 | brlcad | marko1: yes there is, but it'll take a sec to explain and I gotta run :) |
| 21:33.39 | marko1 | ok |
| 21:34.04 | marko1 | one word clue? |
| 21:34.10 | marko1 | maybe I can look itup |
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| 22:22.04 | brlcad | marko1: the order of operations is that of a stack of operations so you can apply the operations in iteration |
| 22:22.47 | brlcad | to do what you're implying above, the easiest thing you could do is either put the paren'd section into a comb or distribute the subtraction |
| 22:23.34 | brlcad | c bobbin_pos u support_plate u bobbin_torus + bobbin_half ; r bobbin_solid u bobbin_pos - bobbin_negativ |
| 22:23.57 | marko1 | ok |
| 22:24.04 | marko1 | that's basically what I'm doing |
| 22:24.19 | brlcad | otherwise: r bobbin_solid u support_plate - bobbin_negativ u bobbin_torus - bobbin_negativ + bobbin_half |
| 22:24.25 | marko1 | just want to use parens like a normal boolean |
| 22:25.04 | brlcad | there is a tool that lets you construct the boolean using parens, but it's not been tested/used in a while so I would recommend using it |
| 22:25.05 | marko1 | constantly bumping into order of op issues |
| 22:25.56 | brlcad | they're preorder operators, not infix |
| 22:26.18 | brlcad | your example is a mix of pre and infix |
| 22:27.27 | brlcad | that is to say that the operator applies to the word in following and the previous result to the left |
| 22:28.22 | brlcad | that's why you start with a "u something" .. you union that object with the previous (null) result .. giving you "something" |
| 22:30.15 | marko1 | ok |
| 22:33.23 | brlcad | not the best explanation, but sticking stuff in combinations usually makes things simpler to understand regardless, even if you have to make a few extra combinations :) |
| 22:35.38 | brlcad | marko1: also to answer your earlier question -- no you don't have to B before running oed -- B means "Blast" which means 'erase everything and draw this' |
| 22:40.32 | marko1 | thanks! |
| 22:40.44 | marko1 | I'm getting it bit by bit |
| 22:42.13 | marko1 | I really like how I can scrip it into larger workflows |
| 22:45.09 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) | |
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| 00:09.44 | brlcad | polo1! |
| 00:42.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33242 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 00:42.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: this has come up before but was revived today with a request from marko1 for |
| 00:42.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: infix notation support. need to renew efforts at adding support that was |
| 00:42.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: started with comb_bool_parse which added classical infix with fully |
| 00:42.47 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: parenthetical expression support but was never completed/integrated. |
| 00:47.09 | marko1 | that would be useful |
| 00:47.50 | brlcad | yeah, it's come up many times over the years, but it's just been pretty low-priority |
| 00:48.08 | brlcad | since it only affects new users, and usually only their first couple days |
| 00:48.58 | Ralith | infix notation? |
| 00:49.03 | brlcad | it's been implemented for like 10 years, just not integrated/tested .. the original dev didn't take it to completion and nobody else has stepped up |
| 00:49.33 | brlcad | Ralith: yeah, for the CSG expressions when you create combinations within mged |
| 00:49.40 | Ralith | can you give an example? |
| 00:49.44 | Ralith | isn't familiar with the term |
| 00:49.57 | brlcad | which term? |
| 00:50.00 | brlcad | infix? |
| 00:50.03 | Ralith | yeah |
| 00:50.13 | brlcad | infix is what you learned in school |
| 00:50.18 | Ralith | rings a bell |
| 00:50.31 | brlcad | a + b = c .. '+' is an infix operator |
| 00:50.39 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 00:50.46 | Ralith | as opposed to brl-cad's tree notation. |
| 00:50.50 | brlcad | opposed to doing something like "a b +" .. postfix operator or "+ a b" prefix operator |
| 00:50.58 | brlcad | we use prefix |
| 00:51.06 | brlcad | right |
| 00:51.09 | Ralith | that too :P |
| 00:51.27 | brlcad | because prefix lends itself directly to the tree representation, the geometry hierarchy that results directly correlates |
| 00:52.42 | brlcad | it would be cool to be able to use parens with infix |
| 00:54.21 | Ralith | it would indeed. |
| 00:54.33 | Ralith | I haven't done much parsing before, but wouldn't it be fairly trivial to handle? |
| 00:54.54 | Ralith | I mean, one could probably even simply wrap the existing system |
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| 01:10.25 | brlcad | yeah, but it is actually nearly fully implemented already, including boolean expression optimization/rewriting |
| 01:10.31 | brlcad | just not hooked into anything |
| 01:17.13 | Ralith | heh |
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| 05:04.35 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 06:35.35 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-236-98.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 07:15.56 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
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| 08:05.57 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33243 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/typein.c: |
| 08:05.57 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: merge in all of the latest pnts changes that were made to old/previous |
| 08:05.57 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: implementation but not to the libged migrated/new version. this duality |
| 08:05.57 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: shouldn't survive for much longer hopefully. this hooks in all of the new point |
| 08:05.57 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: functionality for normals, point-specific sizes, and more. only compile-time |
| 08:05.58 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: checked. |
| 08:59.30 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 11:54.44 | AFK-claymore | Morning all. |
| 11:57.11 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:58.28 | claymore | Mornin mafm |
| 11:59.09 | mafm | hi claymore |
| 11:59.10 | mafm | and the rest |
| 12:13.55 | claymore | mafm: How are things on your side of the world? |
| 12:14.30 | mafm | fighting with the lab to get out :( |
| 12:14.53 | claymore | whoa, whats that mean? |
| 12:40.21 | mafm | that I'm trying to know, after 3 weeks, when I can get out |
| 12:40.36 | mafm | I spent this week learning about laws because of that |
| 12:40.52 | claymore | oh, your current job or school? |
| 12:41.06 | mafm | to know how much of holidays I can get from my 60-day leave period |
| 12:41.09 | mafm | current job |
| 12:42.05 | mafm | I just went to talk with the director, and he's going to talk with my boss again... this thing never ends :) |
| 12:42.32 | mafm | brb, lunch |
| 12:43.51 | claymore | wow just to get a holiday.... |
| 12:43.57 | claymore | tell them I said its okay. |
| 12:44.05 | claymore | that should do it :D |
| 12:47.33 | *** join/#brlcad alex_joni (n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni) | |
| 12:49.24 | archivist | being in a smaller company is easier, tell boss! |
| 13:14.35 | mafm | claymore: probably it would be better, yes |
| 13:16.03 | mafm | well, the thing is that they didn't want me to have holidays in the last period |
| 13:16.45 | claymore | mafm: why not? |
| 13:16.51 | *** join/#brlcad marko1 (n=mark@cpe-74-72-195-92.nyc.res.rr.com) | |
| 13:17.53 | claymore | mornin marko1 ! You up in New York City? |
| 13:18.05 | mafm | they're pissed off or something, I don't really know |
| 13:18.45 | marko1 | morning |
| 13:18.58 | claymore | mafm: Hrm, well, if you are entitled to X days off per year, then you *should* be able to take them without repercussions... |
| 13:19.07 | claymore | unless your managers suck. |
| 13:19.36 | archivist | some companies have rules for holidays but you should be told before joining |
| 13:21.34 | mafm | yes, that's the point |
| 13:21.56 | mafm | so I elaborated a document about that, and now nobody wants to read it telling that it's not their responsibility/area |
| 13:22.20 | mafm | not even my boss, who is affected somewhat by the fact that I don't have to work for much longer that he expected |
| 13:22.40 | mafm | and who insisted in me staying until christmas |
| 13:22.56 | mafm | so well, I don't really know if everybody is becoming crazy or what :D |
| 13:23.23 | claymore | so you are leaving the company and they asked you to stay on till Christmas, but now are telling you you can't have time off? |
| 13:23.30 | mafm | (I never had problems before and never thought that I would have to do this kind of thing, but apparently they're really pissed off) |
| 13:23.36 | mafm | yes |
| 13:23.45 | mafm | basically I wouldn't work in all december |
| 13:24.28 | archivist | they should offer moneyz! |
| 13:24.29 | mafm | my initial proposal was to work until 12th or so (friday), but they insisted, so I counted all days and I wouldn't have to work in all december really |
| 13:24.31 | claymore | When you leave the company, do they reimburse your for accrued Timeoff that you didn't take? |
| 13:25.19 | mafm | well, I just want them to tell me something... they just refuse to listen, so they basically don't tell me anything |
| 13:26.07 | mafm | that's why I went to talk with the head of the lab, so he (hopefully) fix things top-to-bottom |
| 13:26.19 | claymore | mafm: i only ask that last question because, if they don't have to reimburse you for unused time off, then its in their best interests to get the most work out of you they can. Its a crappy way to treat employees, but it happens a lot. |
| 13:26.29 | archivist | you have rights!, see your company agreement and your countries employment laws |
| 13:27.33 | mafm | yes, that's what I've been doing in the past few days :) |
| 13:27.34 | claymore | archivist is correct. even if no one at your workplace will listen to your complaints, there is always someone higher that will. The higher you go, the more painful it becomes for your boss ;) |
| 13:27.58 | claymore | marko1: you get all your questions with brlcad sorted out yesterday? |
| 13:28.03 | mafm | and yes, I think that my boss talking to the head of the lab is gonig to prove efective :D |
| 13:28.22 | mafm | or the head of the lab talking to my boss, either way |
| 13:29.16 | mafm | strange thing is that we never had problems before and we had very good relations, so I don't really understand why this happens :( |
| 13:29.21 | claymore | well good, at least someone has their head on straight. |
| 13:29.46 | claymore | mafm: how long have you been working there? |
| 13:29.46 | mafm | 2 years and 3 months |
| 13:29.46 | archivist | boss here needs educating in UK employment law |
| 13:31.27 | mafm | sigh :) |
| 13:31.41 | mafm | well, it should be fixed within weeks anyway |
| 13:32.14 | claymore | That is strange mafm. How did your boss take the news that you were leaving? Anger, resentful, indifferent? |
| 13:32.28 | mafm | then hopefully I can finish my degree project, and then maybe I have time to work again in g3d and all these things \o/ |
| 13:33.19 | mafm | worried, the next day resentful (I will be the only one in the lab not having free days in christmas), now he seems indifferent :D |
| 13:35.53 | claymore | Okay, sounds like you have just been on the good side of a medeocre manager. Managers that let too much emotion into their decision making process are NOT good managers at all, imo. |
| 13:36.55 | claymore | Now that you have committed a personal slight against your manager, aka leaving, then they will react as an immature person might... by making yoru life harder. |
| 13:37.13 | claymore | Sad really. |
| 13:37.44 | mafm | yes, that's more or less what I think that is happening :) |
| 13:38.12 | mafm | he's quite good on the technical side (albeit a bit outdated) but he's an awful manager in general |
| 13:38.46 | claymore | Well, is there any incentive for you if you are give 2 weeks notice and leave when you have said you will? aka, good recommendations to your next job? |
| 13:39.01 | mafm | in the sense that he micromanages when you ask some indication, he doesn't care for months when you don't, and in general he doesn't take profit of each person's abilities, which is the main point of a manager |
| 13:40.01 | mafm | (outdated as in... insisting that my ER diagrams are not ER, and then he repaints an older similar diagram, network relations or something like that, outdated by ER diagrams :D) |
| 13:40.25 | mafm | I had to give 60-days notice |
| 13:41.00 | claymore | right, but whats the drawback if you dont give 60days notice and just leave? |
| 13:41.09 | mafm | and there are no consequences for my next job, but maybe so for future jobs (CERN...) |
| 13:41.33 | mafm | or even similar labs to this one |
| 13:43.17 | mafm | one of them is very close to my hometown, so it might be a problem, yes |
| 13:44.13 | claymore | well, if there are not any drawbacks to just leaving, and your boss still won't give you the time you are due, contact your local government to see what Grievance procedures are available. ;) |
| 13:45.05 | archivist | quality of references for the future can be a concern |
| 13:45.43 | archivist | but poor treatment while there does not bode well for references either |
| 13:46.06 | mafm | yes, that's why I don't want to take "severe" actions or anything |
| 13:47.50 | claymore | Well then, we have different takes on things then. I refuse to let people get away with crappy treatment of me or my immediate co-workers. And yes, it makes waves. But wrong is wrong. |
| 13:47.52 | archivist | I would never go to a previous company for a reference as they treated me poorly |
| 13:48.54 | mafm | yes, well, I'm defending myself, but not in a childish way |
| 13:49.30 | marko1 | mafm: you work in physics? |
| 13:49.39 | claymore | and good onya for it mafm. |
| 13:49.46 | mafm | so I presented the document signed, with legal references and so on, so unless they invoke strange things (like having especial periods of holidays, that we don't really have, etc) they can't do much |
| 13:50.18 | archivist | its a choice, I have been informed here about redundancy. So Im hanging on for best severance terms |
| 13:50.28 | mafm | but, if they don't tell me that I agree, I still can't be sure of expecting when to live, to tell the owner of the house and so on |
| 13:50.33 | mafm | marko1: yes |
| 13:50.57 | mafm | when to live->leave* :) |
| 13:51.17 | marko1 | mafm: cool! I'm starting a physics project |
| 13:51.24 | marko1 | http://prometheusfusionperfection.wordpress.com/ |
| 13:51.46 | marko1 | you can see the BRLCAD output |
| 13:51.54 | mafm | well I'm not a physicist, I just happen to work in a physics lab |
| 13:51.58 | mafm | but in the Grid area |
| 13:52.00 | marko1 | same |
| 13:52.43 | claymore | marko1: You are doing this as a hobby? |
| 13:52.57 | mafm | heh, nice pics |
| 13:53.18 | marko1 | hobby, with aspirations to commercialize this technology |
| 13:53.26 | marko1 | I'm an entrepreneur by trade |
| 13:53.41 | marko1 | tech entrepreneur |
| 13:54.27 | claymore | neat! In my past life, I was a nuclear/electrical engineer with the Navy :) |
| 13:54.41 | clock_ | claymore: you mean NEET? |
| 13:55.22 | marko1 | well clearly BRLCAD is the right tool for the job if you guys are using it |
| 13:55.33 | claymore | so i probably shouldnt need to remind you about power generation/radiation emitting device permits you may need lest you get in big trouble :) |
| 13:56.01 | marko1 | well no radiation at this stage |
| 13:56.04 | marko1 | just magnets |
| 13:56.33 | marko1 | and the polywell is intended to run a radiation free reaction |
| 13:56.38 | claymore | clock_: Are you talking about Naval Electrical Engineering Training manuals? |
| 13:56.53 | marko1 | hydrogen + boron = 3 helium |
| 13:56.59 | mafm | marko1: if you mean "you" as me and my lab, no, we don't... my relation with brlcad is something completely different (TM) |
| 13:57.13 | mafm | but probably is the right tool for you, yes |
| 13:57.32 | marko1 | yeah, I'v had success with it |
| 13:57.40 | marko1 | I needed a command line more than a gui |
| 13:57.46 | marko1 | so I can program my drawings |
| 13:58.39 | claymore | marko1: dont forget that any medium to high energy charged particle IS radiation. e.g. bremsstrahlung |
| 13:59.08 | marko1 | technicality! |
| 13:59.13 | claymore | lol |
| 13:59.49 | clock_ | claymore: yes NEETS :) |
| 13:59.54 | clock_ | claymore: coil winding! I love coil winding! |
| 13:59.55 | ``Erik_ | lifts a cheek and radiates some |
| 14:00.12 | claymore | ``Erik_: pig :P |
| 14:00.22 | archivist | marko1, "working on a computer controlled coil winder" what control are you using |
| 14:00.29 | marko1 | arduino |
| 14:00.31 | clock_ | I I needed a DIY repeatable coil with precise inductance and capacitance |
| 14:00.41 | marko1 | I'll be opensourcing all the tech |
| 14:00.44 | clock_ | And ended up with a form made of 3 plastic bolts tied together with cable straps |
| 14:00.47 | clock_ | Works excellent! |
| 14:00.47 | archivist | marko1, are the hard way |
| 14:00.50 | archivist | ah |
| 14:00.54 | claymore | clock_: the NEETs modules are only training manuals. The good stuff is still all basically Non-disclosure stuff. |
| 14:01.05 | clock_ | 2.73uH and 1.2pF better then commercial coils totally stable parameters no Barkhausen nouise! |
| 14:01.24 | archivist | marko1, I use EMC for cnc control, its open source |
| 14:01.35 | clock_ | do you know Reprap? |
| 14:01.38 | marko1 | archivist: thanks for the tip |
| 14:01.42 | clock_ | It's a self-replicating CNC |
| 14:01.48 | marko1 | I'm working with zach from reprap |
| 14:01.49 | marko1 | actually |
| 14:01.53 | claymore | looks at the irc channel.... My God... its full of Geeks... |
| 14:01.53 | clock_ | lol |
| 14:02.00 | marko1 | I'm hacking a reprap to make the coil winder |
| 14:02.16 | clock_ | can reprap make plastic screws? |
| 14:02.22 | marko1 | so the x axis will be the coil guide |
| 14:02.36 | marko1 | screws are store bought |
| 14:02.37 | clock_ | marko1: don't then need people for reprap development? :) |
| 14:02.38 | archivist | 3 EMC people in here |
| 14:02.55 | archivist | at least |
| 14:03.15 | clock_ | I hope reprap can take brl-cad source and rasterize ;-) |
| 14:03.22 | marko1 | stl files |
| 14:03.37 | clock_ | I don't know even if STL is open source |
| 14:03.48 | claymore | archivist: EMC means Electricians Mate Chief to me... whats it mean to you? :) |
| 14:04.00 | clock_ | ElectroMagnetic Compatibility? ;-) |
| 14:04.05 | archivist | Enhanced Machine Control |
| 14:04.10 | alex_joni | v2 |
| 14:04.20 | archivist | :) |
| 14:04.32 | clock_ | Is this multi-coil polyhedron put into an evacuated space? |
| 14:04.45 | marko1 | needs a vacuum yes |
| 14:04.56 | clock_ | I heard someone made a homemade CRT |
| 14:05.13 | clock_ | By throwing a hose with water from a high window and since the column was >10m he got a vacuum |
| 14:05.21 | clock_ | Maybe you use the same technique |
| 14:05.27 | marko1 | ha! |
| 14:05.30 | marko1 | that's funny |
| 14:05.43 | clock_ | And he used marmelade jar for the actual electron tube |
| 14:05.44 | marko1 | well, a good hack is always welcome |
| 14:06.21 | archivist | that only gets down to the vapour pressure |
| 14:06.29 | clock_ | I would also wonder |
| 14:07.18 | clock_ | I always wondered what happens if you take a CRT put the tip into a bathtub full of water and then break off with pliers |
| 14:07.32 | clock_ | And when the CRT is full of water, turn the TV set on |
| 14:07.40 | clock_ | Maybe insert some fish and water plants... |
| 14:07.53 | alex_joni | clock_: might work with oil |
| 14:08.07 | clock_ | maybe he used oil |
| 14:08.13 | claymore | demineralized oil... |
| 14:08.21 | clock_ | oil is used in vacuum pumps |
| 14:08.35 | claymore | had disturbing visions of fish dying a 13kV death..... |
| 14:08.43 | alex_joni | I saw some oil cooling for PC's once.. |
| 14:08.53 | alex_joni | fully submerged in oil.. no fans or anything |
| 14:08.55 | clock_ | Recently I used a skateboard oil to fix my vice |
| 14:09.00 | marko1 | brb |
| 14:09.12 | alex_joni | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtufuXLvOok |
| 14:10.11 | clock_ | When I mentioned the skateboard |
| 14:10.18 | clock_ | We already had a man walking on the moon |
| 14:10.27 | claymore | alex_joni: Any fluid suffieciently de-ionized to prevent conductivity can be used as a coolant that can be in direct contact with electronics. |
| 14:10.31 | clock_ | But not yet riding a skateboard in a half-pipe. I think that's the next task for NASA |
| 14:11.19 | claymore | had some links for some pretty wild Computer mods here somewhere.... |
| 14:11.34 | clock_ | I made a water cooling with a radiator from car |
| 14:11.47 | clock_ | sometimes the CPU core temperature was less than room temperature |
| 14:12.03 | claymore | well thats dangerous now isn't it clock_ :P |
| 14:12.38 | clock_ | I don't see a reason why a radiator from car should be dangerous |
| 14:13.53 | claymore | dropping the cpu temperature below room temp will make any moisture present start to condense ON the CPU first if the relative humidity reaches a certain point. |
| 14:14.06 | clock_ | if BRL-CAD can calculate weight, can it also calculate inductance? |
| 14:14.37 | clock_ | well it was only few degress. Caused by the fact the radiator was under the window and the window was open. THe colder air was flowing at the radiator. |
| 14:14.38 | claymore | clock_: You'd have to script it, but yeah, it should |
| 14:14.56 | clock_ | I wonder if it need finite element method. |
| 14:16.04 | claymore | clock_: I have a simple design using a two stage water cooled system connected via peltier coolers to 'simulate' a refrigeration cycle in a computer... haven't put it to practice though. |
| 14:16.43 | claymore | Inefficiant as anything, but I bet it would get that cpu pretty damned cold :) |
| 14:16.51 | claymore | is having a horrid spelling day. |
| 14:17.08 | archivist | claymore, look at the Elecrolux cycle |
| 14:17.19 | clock_ | I thought about refrigerating my LED with liquid nirogen |
| 14:17.28 | clock_ | It should increase the light efficiency tremendously. |
| 14:19.32 | alex_joni | for how long? |
| 14:19.41 | claymore | archivist: Right, standard Absorption-cycle refers. There are many of them installed at American University in Washington DC. Spent many a days working on those horrid things... |
| 14:20.52 | claymore | the point of my using peltier coolers was to remove any dangerous gasses from my cooling cycle... r114, amonia, etc. |
| 14:21.10 | clock_ | new fridges have butan gas |
| 14:21.27 | clock_ | it's only flammable |
| 14:21.36 | clock_ | Maybe it's even put into cigarette lighter |
| 14:23.20 | claymore | clock_: having a flammable gas inside of a PC wont sit well with most users :) |
| 14:23.55 | clock_ | overclockers can literally get their CPU on fire |
| 14:24.13 | alex_joni | they did that even before (without gas) |
| 14:24.34 | claymore | only because they couldn't remove the heat fast enough :) |
| 14:24.38 | clock_ | there are youtube videos showing people putting very large gas tanks into fire and then shooting them with a gun |
| 14:24.42 | clock_ | a lot of fun to watch |
| 14:25.12 | archivist | claymore, yup, use power supply waste heat to cool the cpu |
| 14:25.36 | claymore | clock_: thats called Darwinism: http://www.darwinawards.com/ |
| 14:25.39 | clock_ | if i understand it correctly absorption cooler runs off heat |
| 14:25.53 | archivist | clock_, yes |
| 14:26.15 | clock_ | Indeed, once the gas tank went airborne and flew horizntally, rotating wildly and spewing flames |
| 14:26.17 | claymore | and has amonia in it ;) amonia + proximity to electronics = large potential for badness |
| 14:26.26 | alex_joni | claymore: unfortunately, they don't usually qualify for darwin awards :/ |
| 14:28.10 | *** join/#brlcad d_rossberg (n=rossberg@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 14:31.51 | brlcad | marko1: that's pretty awesome, love the use |
| 14:33.44 | brlcad | d_rossberg: I'll reply to the list, but I think you're spot on for the characterization |
| 14:34.51 | brlcad | the service is higher-level, network-centric, command and action focused .. and intentionally built on top of existing facilities |
| 14:35.46 | brlcad | whereas the geometry engine is much lower-level with what you've been working on being an OO layer that sits right on top of the core functionality |
| 14:36.27 | d_rossberg | i think the point is that the Geometry Engine wants to preserve the command line interface (?) |
| 14:36.43 | brlcad | there is presently some design overlap that has to be resolved with regards to the geometry engine itself, but I do see that as a distinct "product" as well as the geometry service being another different "product" |
| 14:36.55 | claymore | d_rossberg: not really. |
| 14:37.37 | claymore | d_rossberg: but, in order to bring functionality online as quickly as possible, we are going to use libged initially since a lot of the work was done there. |
| 14:37.41 | brlcad | it might provide hooks to functionality that's in LIBGED but I don't think that's the goal in the least .. if it does that, it's probably/mostly just because that code for whatever action is only/already available there |
| 14:37.54 | claymore | d_rossberg: Just sent a reply to your email |
| 14:43.20 | d_rossberg | my consideration was: if you have a GUI on top of the Geometry Engine and this GUI has a command line interface it would be a design consideration to use libged via the Geomatry Engine |
| 14:43.58 | brlcad | d_rossberg: are you saying that's a bad thing or a good thing? :) |
| 14:44.27 | d_rossberg | in this case it would be a good thing |
| 14:45.00 | d_rossberg | and what i want to say is: the design depends on the application |
| 14:45.11 | claymore | d_rossberg: GUI developement will be independant of the GS and GE development. GUI will also be abstract and will conform to a Communcations API. |
| 14:45.32 | d_rossberg | if i don't know the application i can not assess the design |
| 14:46.05 | claymore | the GS will also Conform to this Communications API and thus a GUI and a GS will be able to communicate abstract of how the GS internals are doing their work. |
| 14:47.41 | claymore | libged was designed the way it was in order to greatly organize how the current BRL-CAD accesses the libraries. libged development has/had nothing to do with iBME,GS oe GE... we are just going to use it for the time being :) |
| 14:48.21 | brlcad | rather, how *MGED* accesses the libraries, and to make it a lot easier to other/new guis to get at that same editing functionality |
| 14:49.24 | claymore | brlcad: good catch;) Thanks. Bouncing between computers is taking its toll on me lol. |
| 14:49.58 | d_rossberg | claymore: i recommend to develop GE, GS and the GUI together (similar to libged which was developed with mged and TCL as brlcad said) |
| 14:50.14 | brlcad | claymore: actually we're going to have a little bit of crosstalk perhaps but LIBGED does have quite a bit to do with the GE (not so much the design, though, as the intent) .. all of this refactoring is moving us towards a new/better GUI |
| 14:50.47 | brlcad | d_rossberg: what do you mean by develop them together? |
| 14:51.21 | brlcad | I know that I at least have a strong preference for each of those to act as stand-alone products so that the interfaces and responsibilities between them are well-defined |
| 14:51.45 | claymore | brlcad: On board with that. However, if we are going to code an OO layer ontop of libged in order to remove the command line like accessability... wouldn't just making an OO layer that access the underlying libs directly (instead of going through libged) be faster? |
| 14:52.21 | brlcad | the GE really compares to that of the likes of ACIS, Granite, OpenCASCADE, etc as being an OO engine on top of our geometry |
| 14:52.51 | brlcad | the GS sits on top of that providing access controls and acts as a network service |
| 14:53.08 | brlcad | a GUI can be tied directly to GE or to the GS then, with different implications and tradeoffs |
| 14:53.24 | brlcad | claymore: absolutely |
| 14:54.57 | claymore | brlcad and d_rossberg : I will get more pictures and documentation up on the wiki. Sometimes text just doesn't make for easy explainations :) |
| 14:55.05 | brlcad | though the first half of what you said gives me pause -- "in order to remove the command line like accessability" .. the GE could retain a "run this command" api call that passes through to LIBGED even if it were otherwise decoupled from it |
| 14:56.03 | d_rossberg | brlcad: i don't think it is a good idea to develop the interface and see if a gui can be build on this afterwards |
| 14:56.09 | brlcad | sure, though sometimes pictures and documentation just add extra questions and confusion too and discussion will still have to occur ;) |
| 14:56.29 | brlcad | d_rossberg: they're occurring concurrently |
| 14:57.45 | brlcad | and at worse - LIBGED is exactly what MGED presently uses so if the GE uses it, it really shouldn't be any worse off than where MGED presently is yet provides all of the existing functionality |
| 14:57.46 | claymore | brlcad: Okay, I am defining 'command line like' accessability as each function in libged takes the standard 'int argc, const char *argv[]' which would be a major speed hit to do all that string parsing... |
| 14:58.11 | clock_ | what is good on CSG is that it mimics the tooling process |
| 14:58.20 | clock_ | drilling is ubtraction on a cylinder |
| 14:58.28 | clock_ | cylindrical grinding is an AND with a cylinder |
| 14:58.37 | clock_ | flat grinding is an AND with a halfspace or cube |
| 14:58.57 | clock_ | and the basic shapes come from rolled stock foundry |
| 14:59.16 | brlcad | it depends where/how to characterize that it's a major speed hit -- it's what mged does now and it's frankly a non-issue as the time is mostly spent processing geometry, not in strings |
| 14:59.21 | d_rossberg | claymore: you should describe some applications in the wiki, the effort is much to high to write only a GUI |
| 14:59.51 | claymore | and if we write a OO layer ontop of libged then we could easily find ourselves taking a cmdline input into GE, parsing it into an object, applying it to the OO layer on libged, converting backinto a string, passing it to libged which then has to pasrse it again. |
| 15:00.04 | claymore | thats my concern... sorry if I worded it poorly :) |
| 15:00.23 | claymore | d_rossberg: 'some applications'.... of what? |
| 15:00.34 | brlcad | d_rossberg: the first/main application I'd planned all along is a new modeling GUI that can eventually replace mged -- starting out with visualization capabilities for starters, then adding searching capabilities, then adding editing capabilities |
| 15:01.37 | brlcad | claymore: well yeah, that could potentially suck -- but that's just a bad way to go about it regardless |
| 15:01.38 | d_rossberg | claymore: GE and GS |
| 15:02.44 | brlcad | d_rossberg: your viewer is an ideal application use |
| 15:03.00 | claymore | d_rossberg: simply put GE is the library that wraps up all of brlcad's current capability and provides a single interface to all the functionality. |
| 15:03.04 | brlcad | sitting on top of the GE or the GS (but not using any of GED) |
| 15:03.46 | claymore | d_rossberg: GS is an actual executable that incorporates the GE, but adds Session managing, network capabilities, access controls, etc. |
| 15:03.49 | brlcad | (save for maybe as temporary back-end implementation detail in GE for the short-term) |
| 15:04.26 | brlcad | d_rossberg: what would you like to see different? |
| 15:04.37 | brlcad | or is this all not making sense yet :) |
| 15:04.57 | claymore | d_rossberg: and a GUI is a standalone application that accessess a GS and provides a means for user input, visualization, editing, etc. |
| 15:05.53 | brlcad | notes that the overall design of having these "three kings" working together hasn't really changed in the 7 years it's been under planning .. just new names here and there :) |
| 15:06.49 | claymore | voted for Project Hamburgler, but was shot down :( |
| 15:06.58 | brlcad | just has a lot more detail now that bob has kicked off libged, mafm has the start of a prototype, and claymore has dived head first into the gs and documenting the whole thing up :) |
| 15:07.20 | d_rossberg | i don't want to change it, i want to understand it |
| 15:07.44 | brlcad | i want you to understand it too (and love it!) :) |
| 15:07.51 | d_rossberg | e.g.: why is the gui on top of GS and not on top of GE? |
| 15:08.48 | brlcad | a gui can be developed on top of either, but that was my doing a long time ago as a means to strongly decouple the interface from the control |
| 15:09.06 | claymore | d_rossberg: to answer that e.g., the GE doesn't have any network capability, so if someone build a gui ontop of JUST the GE (which they could) then their final application wouldn't automatically have interconnectability to other GS's |
| 15:09.08 | brlcad | specific to the new modeler interface too as the primary customer |
| 15:10.25 | claymore | d_rossberg: The GUI is really ment to be a 'smart terminal' or 'thin client' that communicates with the GS (and thus the GE). The GS and GE are doing all the work and informing the GUI of the results. |
| 15:11.29 | brlcad | having it be network-centric also means that it can be compiled to use local unix sockets and shared memory for high performance communication if needed, but then allows much higher-level collaboration for teams of modelers (or even a single modeler to our own centralized public repository that all public clients will have access to ala wikipedia) |
| 15:11.49 | claymore | d_rossberg: The major difference between other apps and this design is that the communication between GUI and GS is abstracted to a point where the communcation can occur over various mediums. ( I personally see network sockets being the most prevalent) |
| 15:12.43 | claymore | d_rossberg: this allows a GS to be running on a massive multicpu machine off in 'ServerLand' while the gui runs on a standard PC on your desk. |
| 15:12.47 | brlcad | probably network sockets and unix sockets only, I can't see us really using anything else |
| 15:13.16 | claymore | d_rossberg: or they can be running on the same machine if you want. Its flexible that way. |
| 15:13.33 | claymore | brlcad: True, but its nice to have extensibility :) |
| 15:14.21 | brlcad | unless it makes the infrastructure more complicated and is more to maintain :) |
| 15:14.35 | brlcad | tbd |
| 15:15.09 | brlcad | fyi, I reworded a fair bit on the iBME page |
| 15:15.17 | brlcad | s/fair/minor/ |
| 15:15.32 | claymore | brlcad: Pffft. We will provide the two basic portals of UnixSockets and NetSockets. If someone else wants to extend in to other mediums... thats there bag not ours :) |
| 15:15.34 | brlcad | you can subscribe to rss events if you want to see changes of others as they occur too |
| 15:15.48 | claymore | how DARE you touch the public wiki! |
| 15:16.10 | d_rossberg | ok, the intended application is a client-server-infrastructure where the computations are done on a multi CPU server and the users sits in front of his desktop PC with a thin client program |
| 15:16.53 | claymore | d_rossberg: that is true, but the other intent is to have both client and server able to run on the same machine. |
| 15:16.59 | brlcad | d_rossberg: also where the computations are done locally on a multi CPU workstation and the users sits in front of his desktop PC with his thin client talking to his own backend |
| 15:17.04 | archivist | not that thin please /me wants nice pics not wireframes |
| 15:17.19 | brlcad | archivist: nah, there will be shaded displays |
| 15:17.26 | brlcad | that's part of the BREP/NURBS effort |
| 15:19.00 | brlcad | d_rossberg: if you want some high-level vision-speak -- I documented how much of this ties together for the project as a whole at: http://brlcad.org/BRL-CAD_Priorities.png |
| 15:19.17 | claymore | brlcad: Your Engrish-foo is more than mine, plus I am typing really fast... so fixing up my dumb dumb errors is greatly appriciated! |
| 15:19.45 | brlcad | it's all very high-level and hand-wavy, but it hopefully describes the four main areas and their intent |
| 15:20.18 | brlcad | PDF of the same document, though the font renders like crap if you don't have it: http://brlcad.org/BRL-CAD_Priorities.pdf |
| 15:21.06 | claymore | is impressed with brlcad's graphic design! |
| 15:21.08 | brlcad | and you'll just have to "deal" with the layout.. if you can't figure it out, it's reader failure! ;) |
| 15:21.09 | claymore | purty |
| 16:08.57 | brlcad | thinks "Resource" should probably be "Object" or "DatabaseObject" to not introduce new terms |
| 16:09.24 | brlcad | resource also implies limited availability |
| 16:09.27 | brlcad | which they're not |
| 16:10.13 | brlcad | my hard drive is a resource, my CPU is a resource.. |
| 16:10.29 | claymore | I am strongly opposed to 'object' since that would really conuse people during OO design discussions. DBObject is agreeable. |
| 16:10.43 | claymore | conuse == confuse |
| 16:12.01 | claymore | 'resource' came from having to abstract away from the OS Filesystem and a BrlCad DB Filesystem... needed a way to describe combs, regions, solids AND directories and .g files.... |
| 16:12.21 | claymore | now thats fixed, DBObject is probably better ;) |
| 16:12.50 | brlcad | I know it's a bikeshed issue, but I'd also really think we should avoid shortening names for clarity as that's often what makes the API inpenetrable for new developers trying to grok the terminology |
| 16:13.27 | brlcad | we should all be using tab-completion editors anyways where the typing aspect is moot :) |
| 16:13.58 | brlcad | also jives with what daniel has going, http://brlcad.org/wiki/BRL-CAD%27s_core_C%2B%2B_interface |
| 16:14.09 | claymore | heh, Enterprise Architect doesn't have Tab-completion :( |
| 16:14.20 | claymore | good thing I am just about done with it. |
| 16:14.25 | brlcad | you only type it once there :) |
| 16:14.49 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33244 10/brlcad/trunk/: IDE specific svn:ignore .project and .cproject |
| 16:14.50 | brlcad | you think you're done |
| 16:15.00 | brlcad | waterfall design rarely ever works .. :) |
| 16:15.32 | brlcad | things will get renamed a LOT once it's in SVN if it's at all successful and there is more than one deve poking on it |
| 16:15.42 | claymore | oh no... i'm f-ing done with it alright! |
| 16:15.47 | brlcad | hehe |
| 16:15.48 | claymore | tosses it out the window. |
| 16:16.08 | brlcad | prepares to go close on that thing he bought |
| 16:16.21 | claymore | congrats again! |
| 16:16.32 | claymore | whens the move in party? >8-) |
| 16:16.54 | brlcad | moving in tonight :) |
| 16:17.04 | brlcad | housewarming party tbd after furniture is in place |
| 16:17.35 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33245 10/rt^3/trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): copying or assigning an object now means to lose the direct connection to the database because this connection can be invalid when the copy will be used |
| 16:18.13 | brlcad | d_rossberg: interesting -- does that turn it into an in-mem or something? |
| 16:18.20 | claymore | Well, the moving heavy stuff slave labor offer is still in place if you need it. |
| 16:18.28 | brlcad | hugs CIA-62 |
| 16:18.29 | CIA-62 | hugs brlcad |
| 16:19.45 | brlcad | claymore: cool -- I frankly don't know if I'll need it or how long it'll all take; if you're interested, I'll be meeting jason up at my storage units around 5pm today over in abingdon |
| 16:20.05 | d_rossberg | yes, the object (ant its derived classes) should be able to store all the values in the object |
| 16:20.22 | d_rossberg | look at m_name in Object for example |
| 16:20.27 | brlcad | d_rossberg: that's a damn creative use of the inmems .. neat :) |
| 16:20.44 | claymore | brlcad: I'll have to check with the better half to see when Date night starts :) |
| 16:20.54 | brlcad | claymore: okay, cool |
| 16:21.08 | d_rossberg | m_name will only be touched if there is no connection to a database |
| 16:21.52 | brlcad | claymore: see, he used Object :P |
| 16:21.56 | brlcad | grins |
| 16:22.57 | brlcad | claymore: oh also if you do come, there's a follow-up invite (my treat) for you and the Mrs to dinner downtown tomorrow, late lunch probably around 2pm at the brazillian place (my treat) |
| 16:23.41 | brlcad | calling in the reservation later today as soon as I know how many heads |
| 16:24.05 | brlcad | counts approx 7 + 2 kids presently |
| 16:24.37 | marko1 | brlcad: when I output with g-stl to an .STL file, how to I increase the resolution? I'm seeing large facets on my curves |
| 16:24.50 | brlcad | marko1: there are tolerances that adjust that |
| 16:25.05 | brlcad | [-a abs_tess_tol] [-r rel_tess_tol] [-n norm_tess_tol] [-D dist_calc_tol] |
| 16:25.10 | brlcad | careful there .. |
| 16:25.47 | brlcad | setting the wrong value there can very easily a) fill up your hard drive b) make you run out of memory c) cause tessellation to fail due to unresolvable degeneracies |
| 16:25.58 | marko1 | oh boy |
| 16:26.08 | brlcad | the normal tolerance controls curvature |
| 16:26.17 | claymore | brlcad: Tomarrow is a no-go for me. Gotta church function all day plus the Mother-in-law is up for the weekend. Just found out that she is coming up via my jeep, aka, I have to go to DC to get her. lol. Looks like I can't help you AND date night is off. |
| 16:26.19 | brlcad | abs is absolute computation tolerance |
| 16:26.24 | brlcad | (the more dangerous one) |
| 16:26.24 | claymore | pouts. |
| 16:26.32 | marko1 | brlcad: this is the shape |
| 16:26.33 | marko1 | http://prometheusfusionperfection.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/test3g.png |
| 16:26.36 | marko1 | any suggetsions |
| 16:26.40 | marko1 | for starting params |
| 16:27.00 | brlcad | claymore: ah, shame .. the brazillian place is awesome :) |
| 16:27.05 | marko1 | will be 500 mm across |
| 16:27.42 | brlcad | marko1: just for run, run: rtedge -s1024 |
| 16:27.53 | brlcad | s/run,/fun,/ |
| 16:28.21 | marko1 | k |
| 16:28.26 | claymore | brlcad: sounds it. especially if the waitresses are... oh wait. stop that train of thought ;) |
| 16:28.34 | marko1 | I see the man page |
| 16:28.35 | brlcad | marko1: as for starting params, hell .. I'd just try something and see how bad/good it is, then go up/down as needed :) |
| 16:29.03 | brlcad | a and b aren't likely .. just a scare tactic to make you be aware that you have raw control on the tolerances :) |
| 16:29.22 | brlcad | c is the most likely if you go too coarse or fine |
| 16:30.53 | marko1 | brlcad: are those options applied against the g-stl command? |
| 16:31.12 | brlcad | which ? |
| 16:31.26 | brlcad | the -a -r -n -D ? yes |
| 16:31.35 | brlcad | the rtedge thing was not |
| 16:31.43 | marko1 | I don't see rtedge in the docs |
| 16:32.14 | brlcad | did you run it? |
| 16:32.36 | brlcad | promises it won't do anything bad |
| 16:33.41 | marko1 | brlcad: of cool! |
| 16:34.10 | marko1 | brlcad: it made an ouline |
| 16:34.32 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:34.57 | marko1 | brlcad: so it's an outline, what is this? |
| 16:35.05 | brlcad | there are ways of layering the hidden-line rendering with the rt rendering too -- rtwizard tries to make it easier |
| 16:35.10 | brlcad | just a different visualization |
| 16:35.17 | brlcad | rtedge generates hidden line renderings |
| 16:36.06 | marko1 | brlcad: how is this useful for tuning my STL output? |
| 16:36.26 | brlcad | marko1: not in the least bit useful for that -- just thought you might like to see it :) |
| 16:37.00 | brlcad | discovering capabilities on your own or through docs can be daunting |
| 16:37.05 | marko1 | brlcad: it is cool! |
| 16:37.16 | marko1 | brlcad: perfect for a t-shirt |
| 16:37.51 | brlcad | as for the tolerances, I'd say try -n 1 and see what it does .. if it's too coarse or doesn't seem to change, try 0.1, then 0.01, then 0.001 etc .. or go in the opposite direction |
| 16:38.55 | marko1 | brlcad: ok, I'll try that... |
| 16:39.08 | brlcad | iirc, the default absolute and distance tolerance is 0.005 |
| 16:39.37 | brlcad | since your model is pretty uniform, you can probably savely get away with changing just the abs tolerance to 0.0001 or something similar |
| 16:40.09 | brlcad | it'll be a little trial-and-error but you'll see the number of polygons go up/down as you tweak values |
| 16:40.21 | brlcad | gives you a gauge for how detailed to go |
| 16:40.22 | marko1 | brlcad: how can I "see" the result |
| 16:40.28 | marko1 | I get stl files |
| 16:40.34 | marko1 | but I can't "see" them |
| 16:40.46 | brlcad | ah, you don't have an stl viewer? |
| 16:40.49 | marko1 | no |
| 16:40.55 | marko1 | recommendation? |
| 16:40.57 | brlcad | run stl-g |
| 16:40.59 | brlcad | :) |
| 16:42.10 | brlcad | stl-g to a new file, run rt on the command line (outside of mged) to view the object (it should be named all or something similar, mged -c newstl.g tops) |
| 16:43.04 | marko1 | k |
| 16:43.18 | marko1 | brlcad: this is fantastic help BTW, |
| 16:48.02 | claymore | likes snow :) |
| 16:52.31 | claymore | is OTL. |
| 16:54.54 | brlcad | marko1: glad to be of assistance, cool project |
| 16:56.12 | brlcad | mind if I share your project to the mailing list? |
| 17:05.42 | marko1 | brlcad: go for it |
| 17:18.56 | marko1 | whoa, that totally locked up my computer |
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| 17:25.44 | marko1 | damn |
| 17:25.50 | marko1 | had to hard restart |
| 17:32.23 | marko1 | brlcad:that kills my memory |
| 17:33.08 | marko1 | also seeing this |
| 17:35.26 | marko1 | WARNING: tesselation tolerance is 0.001000mm while calculational tolerance is 0.005000mm |
| 17:35.26 | marko1 | Cannot tesselate a TGC to finer tolerance than the calculational tolerance |
| 17:35.49 | marko1 | I get the meaning, how do I adjust calc tolerances |
| 17:35.56 | marko1 | is that specific to BD |
| 17:36.00 | marko1 | or rendering |
| 17:39.17 | marko1 | tol command |
| 17:59.25 | marko1 | brlcad: I'm at a loss, can't seem set the tolorance so |
| 18:00.07 | marko1 | I think is see ... |
| 18:00.58 | marko1 | got it |
| 18:02.46 | marko1 | ha |
| 18:02.46 | marko1 | do you guys use the cloud for your rendering |
| 18:10.25 | mafm | bye |
| 19:15.49 | marko1 | brlcad: is there a way to go from STIL to PNG in one step |
| 19:19.44 | marko1 | nm |
| 19:19.46 | marko1 | got it |
| 19:33.06 | marko1 | g-stl takes forever |
| 19:33.39 | OTL-claymore | sure does. :) any thing having to do with tesselation in brlcad is prone to heavy cpu use and long run times :) |
| 19:43.21 | marko1 | can that be optomised for gpu |
| 19:43.54 | marko1 | can it be parallelized easily? |
| 19:44.09 | claymore | its an area of brlcad that need a lot of work. |
| 19:45.05 | marko1 | i see |
| 19:50.23 | marko1 | has anyone setup a EC2 render farm? |
| 20:03.15 | claymore | not I |
| 20:05.11 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33246 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/docs/ (4 files): Updated Architecture to contain more sensible names. Generated new UML images. Updated wiki documentation at http://brlcad.org/wiki/IBME_Main |
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| 23:19.08 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 23:53.32 | Ralith | I may have asked this before, but |
| 23:53.56 | Ralith | does brl-cad incorporate any sort of utility to go from valid closed mesh (e.g. BoT) to solid volume? |
| 23:56.17 | ``Erik_ | there was an experiment to attempt that, uhm, 'beset' |
| 23:59.35 | Ralith | it's buggy? |
| 00:20.40 | starseeker | returns from national archives |
| 00:21.07 | starseeker | no Mark VIII yet, but more info |
| 00:21.24 | Ralith | Mark VIII? |
| 00:22.19 | starseeker | WWI tank |
| 00:22.24 | Ralith | ooo, neat |
| 00:22.29 | Ralith | that's what you've been trying to model? |
| 00:22.30 | starseeker | a.k.a the "Liberty" or "International" |
| 00:22.39 | starseeker | not yet - trying to find source info on |
| 00:22.53 | Ralith | with the ultimate goal of modeling? |
| 00:23.25 | starseeker | yep |
| 00:23.31 | Ralith | neat |
| 00:23.32 | Ralith | what for? |
| 00:24.14 | starseeker | primarily as an exercise and a way to stress the tools, while at the same time being able to use it to produce documentation that can be (eventually) public release |
| 00:24.41 | Ralith | eventually? is there a particular reason for it to take a while? O.o |
| 00:24.53 | starseeker | ever try writing documentation? |
| 00:25.11 | starseeker | and then getting it by brlcad's editorial review plus public release procedures? :-P |
| 00:25.11 | Ralith | I mean |
| 00:25.15 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 00:25.19 | Ralith | *formal* documentation. |
| 00:25.38 | Ralith | is used to thinking of documentation as a casual thing. |
| 00:25.56 | starseeker | gets warm fuzzies thinking about a nice 500 page book on modeling with BRL-CAD, lots of nice pictures and detailed technique discussion |
| 00:26.34 | starseeker | and just for fun an appendix with blueprint-style views of every part and vehicle assembly diagrams |
| 00:26.39 | archivist | 500 page! shouldnt be that hard to use :) |
| 00:26.58 | starseeker | Any CAD system will need that and more, if it's non-trivial |
| 00:27.31 | Ralith | sure. |
| 00:27.33 | starseeker | admits BRL-CAD's doc/work ratio is set a tad above average |
| 00:27.40 | Ralith | but casual documentation is still useful. |
| 00:27.45 | starseeker | but that's what the new modeler is for :-) |
| 00:27.49 | starseeker | Ralith: sure |
| 00:28.37 | Ralith | makes sense that brl-cad does have a particularly great need for the formal, though. |
| 00:28.42 | Ralith | especially given its use cases. |
| 00:30.12 | starseeker | There's good reason for a variety of levels of documentation - I tend to prefer to go detailed, on the theory that it's better to have something documented and not need it than to have it not documented and need it. That requires great disicipline when it comes to organization and clarity though, or it's just another big pile of paper |
| 00:30.47 | starseeker | gawks at scrollback length |
| 00:31.24 | Ralith | I interpreted 'public release' as meaning 'availability to the public at some point after its completion' |
| 00:31.54 | starseeker | right |
| 00:32.13 | Ralith | rather than 'publishing it when it's done' |
| 00:32.37 | Ralith | though I do think there's no harm in making incomplete versions available. |
| 00:32.56 | Ralith | identified as such, of course. |
| 00:32.59 | starseeker | Ralith: depends on how it's done |
| 00:33.04 | Ralith | ? |
| 00:33.30 | starseeker | usually when I'm doing something for the Army as a contractor in the documentation department, it gets done before it goes out |
| 00:34.07 | Ralith | but is that a requirement, or simply the way things tend to happen? |
| 00:34.26 | Ralith | brl-cad's open source nature suggests treating docs in a similar way to code |
| 00:34.54 | starseeker | Well, docs kind of have a dual nature - if you look at the .bib file, you'll see some Technical Reports listed |
| 00:36.30 | starseeker | Things with ARL-TR-**** numbers |
| 00:36.42 | starseeker | OK, one right now - I need to add more |
| 00:36.58 | starseeker | anyway, those are official army publications and as such have to go through a review process |
| 00:37.56 | starseeker | But many of them also contain useful documentation on aspects of BRL-CAD |
| 00:38.18 | starseeker | Of course, docs done strictly on the open source side do not have such constraints |
| 00:39.31 | Ralith | anyway, good luck! |
| 00:39.41 | Ralith | docs are never a bad idea, however long the process. |
| 00:39.46 | starseeker | Ralith: The other problem, particularly with my style of documentation, is that I can write a lot of stuff and then have it go out of date |
| 00:39.57 | starseeker | thanks :-) |
| 00:40.18 | Ralith | this doesn't strike me as a project which tends to change too drastically over time, though |
| 00:40.30 | starseeker | not yet :-) |
| 00:40.30 | Ralith | at least, not in unexpected ways |
| 00:40.50 | Ralith | hm? development ramping up? |
| 00:40.53 | starseeker | If we do move to an OGRE based GUI, that'll change a LOT of things |
| 00:40.58 | Ralith | ah yeah, that |
| 00:41.04 | starseeker | is thinking of VolII and VolIII |
| 00:41.18 | Ralith | but that will not necessarily obselete mged! |
| 00:42.14 | starseeker | MGED will likely become more of a "minimalist" tool |
| 00:42.24 | starseeker | although brlcad will ultimately call such shots |
| 00:43.27 | starseeker | I do agree though that the body of work poured into things like MGED and Archer will likely be preserved in some form |
| 00:43.37 | Ralith | Archer? |
| 00:44.03 | starseeker | um. Prototype viewer in Tcl/Tk, somewhat more modern feel |
| 00:44.07 | Ralith | ah. |
| 00:44.22 | starseeker | Try archer on the command line, if you have a recent BRL-CAD it should come up |
| 00:44.34 | starseeker | MGED has most of the useful features right now though |
| 00:44.45 | Ralith | is on the wrong system at the moment |
| 00:44.48 | yukonbob | howdy, cadheads |
| 00:44.58 | starseeker | yukonbob: howdy :-) |
| 00:45.12 | louipc | does archer work in linux now? |
| 00:45.26 | Ralith | there was a point at which it didn't? |
| 00:45.44 | louipc | whenever I tried it hah |
| 00:45.53 | Ralith | that doesn't mean it doesn't work in linux |
| 00:45.59 | Ralith | just not on your setup |
| 00:46.15 | starseeker | um, it just segfaulted for me |
| 00:46.19 | starseeker | so apparently not |
| 00:46.23 | Ralith | O.o |
| 00:46.25 | Ralith | weird |
| 00:46.26 | louipc | I don't think it worked on anyone's setup |
| 00:46.29 | Ralith | what was it developed on? |
| 00:46.44 | louipc | it just opened a little grey box for me |
| 00:47.23 | starseeker | just crashed for me when I tried to open a file |
| 00:47.38 | louipc | actually that's what the tkhtml3 help does if I use a non bundled tkhtml3 :/ |
| 00:48.29 | starseeker | louipc: really? |
| 00:48.31 | starseeker | what's the error? |
| 00:49.56 | louipc | I don't remember really |
| 00:50.25 | starseeker | hasn't tested nonbundled anything in a while |
| 00:50.28 | louipc | but the build system isn't really set up to detect and use system tkhtml3 either |
| 00:50.36 | starseeker | no, it isnt |
| 00:50.52 | louipc | I only added the --enable-tkhtml3 so I could disable it... and test or something :D |
| 00:51.29 | louipc | hah I thought the goal was to use all non-bundled libs for gentoo eh? |
| 00:51.31 | starseeker | I did include the latest trunk tkhtml3, so that might be an issue |
| 00:51.42 | starseeker | louipc: I'm still a little soured on that whole thing |
| 00:51.43 | louipc | oh |
| 00:52.02 | louipc | I have alpha16 |
| 00:52.09 | starseeker | ah |
| 00:52.24 | starseeker | hasn't tested that |
| 00:54.10 | archivist | starseeker, http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=82NKvZQ-9W8 |
| 00:56.40 | starseeker | cool :-) |
| 00:56.48 | starseeker | must go to gym, bbl |
| 00:57.47 | louipc | nice |
| 01:20.51 | ``Erik_ | archivist, put your little willy away. |
| 01:21.14 | archivist | :) |
| 01:22.30 | archivist | was searching for the Bullock Creeping Grip |
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| 02:01.52 | punkrockgirl | hi guys |
| 02:01.54 | punkrockgirl | im djing |
| 02:02.02 | punkrockgirl | if you wanna hear |
| 02:02.09 | punkrockgirl | www.troubleradio.net |
| 02:03.03 | Ralith | punkrockgirl, you have a popup (bad) that goes to a 404 page (worse) |
| 02:03.05 | Ralith | :P |
| 02:20.01 | punkrockgirl | i do? |
| 02:20.04 | punkrockgirl | its not my site |
| 02:20.06 | punkrockgirl | :( |
| 02:20.12 | punkrockgirl | but dont click on popups |
| 02:20.30 | punkrockgirl | my computer blocks them so i didnt know that |
| 02:26.28 | Ralith | it is a site you are associated with |
| 02:31.57 | louipc | make your own site! :D |
| 02:33.05 | Ralith | no u |
| 02:34.28 | louipc | I have one |
| 02:34.39 | louipc | but I don't have anything to put on it |
| 03:20.56 | punkrockgirl | oh i guess i could |
| 03:21.00 | punkrockgirl | but i dj on that guys thingy |
| 03:21.04 | punkrockgirl | so i use his |
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| 05:36.06 | starseeker | yuck |
| 05:36.30 | starseeker | 's attempt at putting together drawing images is a failure |
| 05:46.59 | starseeker | grr |
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| 22:39.45 | Ralith | brlcad: is there a reason burst doesn't seem to use vmath.h (insofar as gridrotate.c and idents.c are concerned, anyway)? |
| 00:00.14 | starseeker | Hmm - the copies did somewhat better, but whether it was the copy or the scan it looks like there was even then a little distortion on a couple of them |
| 00:00.16 | starseeker | Ah, well |
| 00:02.03 | starseeker | must once again give props to netpbm |
| 05:00.25 | brlcad | Ralith: because gary was constantly reinventing the wheel |
| 05:00.47 | brlcad | there's no reason gridrotate shouldn't use vmath.h |
| 05:00.47 | starseeker | Ah, there we go: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/USS-Monadnock.png |
| 05:01.10 | brlcad | not sure that idents.c would actually benefit |
| 05:01.54 | brlcad | starseeker: cool |
| 05:01.59 | Ralith | brlcad: it uses the vector element names, at the very least |
| 05:02.01 | Ralith | however: |
| 05:02.11 | Ralith | when I use vmath.h, I get undefined refs to a few vector funcs |
| 05:02.47 | Ralith | e.g. |
| 05:02.48 | Ralith | burst-gridrotate.o(.text+0xe1):/home/ralith/dev/brlcad/brlcad/src/burst/gridrotate.c:70: undefined reference to `Scale2Vec' |
| 05:02.57 | Ralith | I'm thinking it isn't linking to libbn |
| 05:03.04 | Ralith | or something along those lines |
| 05:03.16 | Ralith | any tips as to how to get that to happen? |
| 05:03.30 | brlcad | that's not the problem |
| 05:03.43 | Ralith | ah. |
| 05:03.48 | brlcad | it's saying there is a reference to Scale2Vec that isn't defined |
| 05:04.03 | Ralith | ... |
| 05:04.05 | Ralith | yes. |
| 05:04.15 | Ralith | and might it not be defined by linking in the bit where it is? |
| 05:04.24 | Ralith | Scale2Vec is indeed used. |
| 05:04.25 | brlcad | so you either a) need to define it (i.e. provide an implementation) or b) remove the references to it (which can be code or object code) |
| 05:04.58 | brlcad | Scale2Vec isn't a libbn symbol |
| 05:05.10 | Ralith | oh, they're implemented as macros in vecmath.h |
| 05:05.31 | brlcad | that would be a way to do b) |
| 05:05.39 | Ralith | are they redundant to anything, or would it be appropriate to move them into vmath.h? |
| 05:06.10 | starseeker | brlcad: that's cleaned up a tad - the (reduced size) original is here: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/USS-Monadnock_thefirstmonitor_NARA_RG19_136-9-49_Inboard-Profile-and-Main-Deck_28inx6ft_0.25scaled.png |
| 05:06.27 | Ralith | looks to be redundant |
| 05:07.30 | brlcad | most of vecmath (if not all of it) has a corresponding alternative in vmath.h |
| 05:07.42 | Ralith | that bad, huh? |
| 05:07.46 | brlcad | and sure, it would be very appropriate |
| 05:08.07 | Ralith | gridrotate should be covered fine by the tests, right? |
| 05:08.27 | Ralith | i.e. I'll know if I've messed something up? |
| 05:09.10 | brlcad | we don't have any tests (that I'm aware of) that exercise the burst code |
| 05:09.15 | Ralith | :/ |
| 05:09.23 | Ralith | well then |
| 05:09.24 | brlcad | write one :) |
| 05:09.26 | Ralith | I guess I'd better be careful! |
| 05:09.34 | Ralith | has no idea what this code even does |
| 05:09.39 | brlcad | some are dreadfully simple |
| 05:11.07 | brlcad | like how ScaleVec(a,s) is identical to vmath as VSCALE(a,a,s) |
| 05:11.18 | louipc | starseeker: nice |
| 05:11.20 | Ralith | yeah |
| 05:11.23 | Ralith | I can see that much |
| 05:11.38 | starseeker | louipc: thanks :-) |
| 05:11.41 | louipc | starseeker: I have some drawings like that of some commercial aircraft |
| 05:11.56 | starseeker | the beauty of this one is it's totally copyright free :-) |
| 05:11.59 | louipc | on paper though.. I have no idea how to scan those huge drawings |
| 05:12.02 | Ralith | in theory it's straightforward |
| 05:12.04 | louipc | ah sweet |
| 05:12.15 | brlcad | Scale2Vec(a,s,b) ==> VSCALE(b,a,s) |
| 05:12.31 | Ralith | yeah |
| 05:12.37 | starseeker | louipc: give me about 10 minutes and I'll have another one up |
| 05:12.38 | Ralith | it's very clear and comprehensible |
| 05:12.42 | Ralith | just apprehensive of a stupid mistake :P |
| 05:12.47 | brlcad | yep |
| 05:13.28 | brlcad | just do them one at a time, could even write a little test.c that exercised each one before/after with a simple test case input |
| 05:13.42 | Ralith | also, the emacs local variable blocks are very handy. |
| 05:16.28 | brlcad | how's that? |
| 05:16.56 | Ralith | it's always a pain to swap configs across projects of differeing styles (of which I have several) |
| 05:17.03 | brlcad | ah |
| 05:17.11 | Ralith | makes it that much easier to just jump into |
| 05:29.34 | Ralith | brlcad: alright to wrap proc-db/brep_[simple|cube].cpp in an anonymous namespace to prevent an enum conflict w/ vmath? |
| 05:29.50 | Ralith | a little hacky, but imo still a step up from the undef that used to be there. |
| 05:39.22 | Ralith | it built :D |
| 05:43.24 | louipc | woo |
| 05:43.39 | Ralith | regression tests seem to pass, if that means anything |
| 05:43.58 | starseeker | REALLY needs to get more RAM to deal with images of this sort |
| 05:47.21 | Ralith | somebody want to explain to me why line 35-36 of brep.h has #ifdef __cplusplus \n extern "C++" { ? |
| 05:47.43 | starseeker | Here we go: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/M2A4.png |
| 05:47.57 | starseeker | brlcad: That one you may like a bit better :-) |
| 05:48.30 | Ralith | that's really neat |
| 05:49.18 | starseeker | That one was a good exercise in cleanup techniques: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/M2A4_NARA_RG156_ARC-789126_fldr7_Left-Side_Elevation_0.5scaled.png |
| 05:49.53 | louipc | nice |
| 05:50.03 | Ralith | holy ramrape |
| 05:50.45 | louipc | ah removing the static eh? |
| 05:50.59 | starseeker | yep |
| 05:51.30 | louipc | are you going to draw them up in autocad or something now? hehe |
| 05:55.36 | starseeker | Ralith: If you think that one is bad, try this: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/full/USS-Monadnock_thefirstmonitor_NARA_RG19_136-9-49_Inboard-Profile-and-Main-Deck_28inx6ft.png |
| 05:55.45 | starseeker | louipc: Maybe |
| 05:56.08 | Ralith | starseeker: no thanks; it took firefox a few seconds to give me interaction back even with the former. |
| 05:56.19 | starseeker | Ralith: Yeah, sorry about that |
| 05:56.23 | Ralith | wait |
| 05:56.29 | Ralith | was that the boat you linked earlier? |
| 05:56.47 | starseeker | That was the original image from which the boat image I linked to came from |
| 05:57.12 | starseeker | I had to resort to netpbm to do anything with the original |
| 05:57.25 | louipc | firefox tells me that last one contains errors |
| 05:57.31 | starseeker | Imagemagick when down with nary a wimper |
| 05:57.36 | Ralith | stylistically |
| 05:57.42 | Ralith | if I'm wrapping a lot of code in an anonymous namespace |
| 05:57.49 | Ralith | should I indent said code another unit? |
| 05:57.56 | starseeker | louipc: The big one? |
| 05:57.59 | starseeker | I'm not surprised |
| 05:58.09 | louipc | http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/full/USS-Monadnock_thefirstmonitor_NARA_RG19_136-9-49_Inboard-Profile-and-Main-Deck_28inx6ft.png |
| 05:58.16 | starseeker | yeah, that's the big one |
| 05:58.48 | starseeker | Better to stick to the smaller one - with that view no important detail is lost at the lower res, really |
| 05:59.05 | louipc | yeah it's broken |
| 05:59.14 | louipc | libpng error: IDAT: CRC error |
| 05:59.17 | Ralith | it would make the diff a lot cleaner, but I'm not sure what The Right Thing is. |
| 05:59.38 | starseeker | louipc: It should like this better http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/USS-Monadnock-large.png |
| 06:00.32 | Ralith | starseeker: on that tank, what do the little crosshairs represent? rivets? |
| 06:00.33 | louipc | yep |
| 06:00.49 | starseeker | Ralith: I believe so |
| 06:01.27 | starseeker | louipc: I actually have an svg file from potrace with inkscape touchups, with the text added after bitmap export by the Gimp |
| 06:02.46 | starseeker | problem is the svg file is almost as big as the bitmap, due to so many control points |
| 06:02.53 | Ralith | heh |
| 06:03.06 | Ralith | crank up simplification a little? |
| 06:03.16 | starseeker | tried |
| 06:03.29 | starseeker | potrace doesn't seem to look for macroscopic "lines" |
| 06:03.35 | Ralith | :/ |
| 06:03.50 | Ralith | tried inkscape's native trace? or is the image too big to even attempt? |
| 06:03.52 | starseeker | it follows edges of features, and a "line" to it seems to just be a feature with a really wild outline |
| 06:04.08 | starseeker | Ralith: I think that's based on potrace |
| 06:04.42 | starseeker | autotrace is the only other free tracer I know of, but it really cranks away at this and I'm not sure how much better it would do than potrace |
| 06:05.54 | Ralith | actually |
| 06:06.12 | Ralith | I wonder if inkscape's simplification applied after the trace might produce usable output? |
| 06:06.23 | Ralith | you could even apply it selectively to big, simple shapes, although it'd take a lot of work |
| 06:06.35 | Ralith | I don't suppose you even really need a high quality vector of it |
| 06:08.05 | starseeker | Ralith: depends on the purpose |
| 06:08.31 | starseeker | Probably the way to go if I really needed it would be to flip up the bitmap inkscape and trace it |
| 06:08.35 | starseeker | by hand |
| 06:08.58 | louipc | or some cad program ;) |
| 06:09.14 | starseeker | potrace really is a help here though, since it make the noise easy to target and eliminate |
| 06:09.20 | starseeker | (relatively speaking) |
| 06:10.33 | starseeker | louipc: Yeah, actually we might have some image utilities that would be a help in this situation |
| 06:10.39 | starseeker | need to check it out |
| 06:11.28 | starseeker | Regardless though, these diagrams are pretty cool in and of themselves |
| 06:11.54 | starseeker | is afraid the scanner may have distorted 2 of the tank views... |
| 06:12.39 | starseeker | If you care to check out everything, just look in http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives |
| 06:12.56 | starseeker | watch out for the stuff in full however - it's REALLY big |
| 06:13.40 | starseeker | wonders why the ImageMagick guys don't incorporate netpbm... |
| 06:13.58 | louipc | what dpi is USS-Monadnock-large.png? |
| 06:14.08 | starseeker | um. good question |
| 06:14.27 | starseeker | the drawing itself was 6 feet long |
| 06:14.36 | starseeker | but that's been scaled a few times |
| 06:14.51 | louipc | ah wow |
| 06:15.10 | starseeker | that's why the original image is so incredibly huge |
| 06:15.32 | starseeker | and why my computer died of ram starvation when Gimp or ImageMagick tried to do anything at all with it |
| 06:15.34 | louipc | so that's only like 70dpi |
| 06:15.51 | starseeker | nods |
| 06:16.13 | starseeker | Because of the nature of the drawing though, it's not so critical |
| 06:16.25 | starseeker | stuff like the M2A4 is more critical |
| 06:16.30 | louipc | yeah |
| 06:17.27 | starseeker | should jot down a quick article about how he went from original drawing to final image... |
| 06:18.56 | Ralith | afks breifly |
| 06:19.04 | starseeker | afks? |
| 06:19.09 | Ralith | away from keyboards |
| 06:19.12 | starseeker | ah |
| 06:19.14 | Ralith | :P |
| 06:19.39 | Ralith | brlcad: I've got a patch ready for vector elements as an enum, btw; not sure if I should commit it w/o review |
| 06:34.41 | Ralith | returns |
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| 06:45.23 | starseeker | Ah, that's where I messed up with the Gimp - incorrect Tile Cache size |
| 06:50.31 | starseeker | no, still doesn't like the original tiff file |
| 06:50.39 | starseeker | needs more horsepower |
| 07:25.00 | Ralith | I am a little surprised that there isn't budget for uberpowerful workstations for you guys to use for stuff like this |
| 07:25.25 | Ralith | I guess that's what you get for making brl-cad light on hardware requirements |
| 07:58.33 | Ralith | hm. |
| 07:58.39 | Ralith | Anyone here tried g3d recently? |
| 07:58.51 | Ralith | it loads a blank window, cranks on the hdd for a while, then segfaults here |
| 08:06.14 | Ralith | polls brlcad |
| 08:15.03 | Ralith | if anybody's awake, anyone have recommendations for software for solving systems of linear equations? |
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| 15:30.30 | starseeker | Ralith: Oh, if I were using work computers it would be a different story |
| 15:31.18 | starseeker | Ralith: For liner equations software - If you're talking symbolic Maxima or Axiom are the free options |
| 15:31.44 | starseeker | Octave is pretty good for numerical stuff (or so I hear) |
| 15:32.51 | brlcad | tab-completion ftw |
| 15:33.28 | brlcad | you'd realize he's not here if you did |
| 15:33.32 | starseeker | Ah |
| 15:33.36 | starseeker | phooy |
| 15:34.17 | starseeker | brlcad: What do you think of that tank diagram? |
| 15:47.34 | brlcad | starseeker: it's pretty cool |
| 15:47.53 | brlcad | so you got some good materials when you visited (was that fri?) |
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| 16:56.44 | starseeker | brlcad: Yep, just not on the tank I was hoping for |
| 16:57.22 | starseeker | I made a copy of the list of what they do have - I'll show you on Monday if you're in |
| 16:58.49 | starseeker | Unfortunately copying them is a tad expensive (between copy and scanning just what I've got up now came to about $100) but the quality of the blueprints was too good to pass up, particularly as public domain (I'm pretty sure the M2A4 stuff is public domain since Rock Island was a government operation) |
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| 20:39.52 | Ralith | brlcad: ping? |
| 21:35.09 | brlcad | Ralith: pong |
| 21:36.11 | Ralith | :D |
| 21:36.14 | Ralith | get my message last night? |
| 21:36.56 | brlcad | I saw that you said the patch for the enum was ready -- go ahead and apply it and I can review it via the mailing |
| 21:37.20 | brlcad | also saw that g3d crashed on you, but no crash log to look into it ;) |
| 21:37.29 | Ralith | heh |
| 21:37.32 | Ralith | that's not even your area, is it? |
| 21:37.55 | brlcad | why wouldn't it be? :) |
| 21:38.00 | Ralith | iunno |
| 21:38.08 | Ralith | sort of assumed mafm was largely the sole contributor |
| 21:38.16 | Ralith | what with how you're giving priority to the geometry service, etc |
| 21:38.44 | brlcad | he has been, but there's no code "ownership" in brl-cad -- just points of contact, but any dev should be able to work in any other area so long as they're intercommunicating |
| 21:39.13 | Ralith | didn't mean to imply ownership so much as familiarity |
| 21:39.23 | brlcad | ah, well code is code :) |
| 21:39.34 | Ralith | indeed. |
| 21:40.06 | brlcad | code that another dev can't jump into and contribute to probably needs some usability/documentation/cleanup |
| 21:40.17 | Ralith | good point. |
| 21:45.48 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03ralith * r33247 10/brlcad/trunk/ (13 files in 8 dirs): Replaced preprocessor defines with an enum for vector element identification to reduce naming conflicts. |
| 21:54.07 | brlcad | cool |
| 21:54.09 | brlcad | ~ralith++ |
| 21:54.19 | Ralith | ^^ |
| 21:54.24 | brlcad | I can do some more extensive testing later tonight |
| 21:54.36 | Ralith | cool |
| 21:55.06 | brlcad | but looks good at a glance |
| 21:55.15 | brlcad | can probably go even farther with the comgeom/burst bits |
| 21:55.49 | Ralith | yeah, I debated killing the vecmath header(s) entirely |
| 21:55.57 | Ralith | but decided that it would be best to do that in another commit |
| 21:56.23 | brlcad | nods |
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| 11:58.42 | claymore | stretches and yawns. |
| 11:58.49 | claymore | Mondays suck. |
| 11:58.51 | claymore | Morning all. |
| 12:00.08 | claymore | starseeker: When it comes to modeling: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/National_Archives/USS-Monadnock-large.png , why don tyou try inverting the picture and then extruding it in brlcad :) |
| 12:00.08 | clock_ | I have a monday with date today, they somehow magically fail to suck |
| 12:00.31 | claymore | clock_: well thats true ;) |
| 12:00.55 | clock_ | lol :) |
| 12:01.03 | clock_ | What a simple method of making complicated shapes :) |
| 12:01.31 | clock_ | unless - it comes out he doesn't want me. Then this monday will suck 1000 times more than an average monday ;-) |
| 12:01.52 | claymore | Hell yeah. Extrude the X then the Y then the Z. then: r MyBadAzzMonitor.r u x.s + y.s + z.s |
| 12:01.55 | claymore | muwahahahaha |
| 12:02.12 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33248 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/typein.c: put variable declaration on the begin of the section so my old compiler understands it |
| 12:02.20 | clock_ | lol |
| 12:02.23 | claymore | then: mged> facetize MyBadAzzMonitor.s MyBadAzzMonitor.r and watch your computer cry. |
| 12:02.25 | clock_ | K&R compiler? |
| 12:02.25 | archivist | I expect starseeker to do that as an assembly of parts |
| 12:08.21 | claymore | I expect Radar Study LOD internal and external by riday. Now snap to it! |
| 12:08.31 | claymore | riday = Friday :/ |
| 12:08.43 | claymore | the puter eateded the F |
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| 12:17.30 | claymore | Mornin Markol and Mafm! |
| 12:19.02 | mafm | hi claymore, and the rest |
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| 19:20.48 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33249 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: More work on editing support for hyp |
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| 19:50.32 | IriX64 | hey ``Erik_, ... testing something, may I do a version on you ? |
| 19:53.08 | IriX64 | hrmph , all right :) |
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| 20:18.12 | IriX64 | see http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/JoveCygwin.tar.bz2 :) |
| 20:18.48 | IriX64 | works here :) |
| 20:20.14 | louipc | IriX64: still on windows eh? |
| 20:20.16 | louipc | grins |
| 20:20.33 | IriX64 | says WiniX, get it right :) |
| 20:22.05 | IriX64 | gives that jove back to you free of charge, thanks for the fun :) |
| 20:22.23 | louipc | I have jove but I don't use it |
| 20:22.45 | IriX64 | i should learn how to use it, seems decent enough |
| 20:23.03 | IriX64 | and it understands unix line endings :) |
| 20:23.05 | louipc | good editors are good |
| 20:23.10 | IriX64 | yes |
| 20:23.14 | louipc | I would recommend vi |
| 20:23.26 | louipc | or vim really |
| 20:23.36 | louipc | authentic vi is a bit primitive |
| 20:23.37 | IriX64 | midnight commander has a nift vim implementation |
| 20:23.46 | louipc | and jove is actually a bit primitive too |
| 20:24.15 | IriX64 | not writing a book :) |
| 20:24.18 | louipc | so you might do better with a more advanced emacs |
| 20:25.05 | louipc | hah you don't need too much capability for that |
| 20:25.17 | louipc | I think.. |
| 20:25.18 | IriX64 | true |
| 20:26.04 | IriX64 | did some of the /src/utils too, should i post them? |
| 20:26.42 | IriX64 | not sure how much need there is for them to be windows apps |
| 20:27.27 | louipc | post the full windows build of 7.14.0 ;) |
| 20:27.54 | IriX64 | aways from that :) |
| 20:34.12 | IriX64 | called RedHat, about Cygwin, the guy calls me back saying.. it's yours do anything you want with it, I left smiling :) |
| 20:35.25 | IriX64 | this is a longish upload it seems |
| 20:36.41 | IriX64 | its there look for CygUtil.tar.bz2 |
| 20:37.44 | IriX64 | my mistake damn i speak too soon wait a few minutes ill try again |
| 20:40.00 | IriX64 | trying again |
| 20:40.47 | IriX64 | jove is now in the util file :) |
| 20:44.53 | IriX64 | its too big my little site cant handle it :( |
| 20:51.47 | IriX64 | its 53 megs bz2ed |
| 20:52.04 | IriX64 | most of thats your stuff, there only one of my dll's in it |
| 20:52.31 | IriX64 | quota exceeded |
| 20:56.16 | IriX64 | reloaded Jove, do you want to look at the BitchX binaries? |
| 21:01.36 | IriX64 | BitchXCyg.tar.bz2 |
| 21:02.19 | IriX64 | if i find a place to put that util directory ill let you know, :) syall |
| 22:03.52 | brlcad | louipc: feeding the local fauna? |
| 22:07.00 | louipc | brlcad: hah! |
| 23:26.42 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:27.31 | starseeker | realizes rotating the A vector in hyp is kind of pointless |
| 00:27.50 | starseeker | need to restrict it to just the plane where it is legal |
| 00:27.58 | starseeker | meh |
| 00:28.14 | starseeker | will figure out how to do that later |
| 00:28.18 | brlcad | a twisted hyp? |
| 00:28.28 | brlcad | it could matter for uv mappings |
| 00:28.39 | starseeker | can we do twisted with this? |
| 00:29.11 | brlcad | doubtful, but dunno |
| 00:29.20 | starseeker | As defined I don't think so |
| 00:29.39 | starseeker | need more input parameters |
| 00:37.32 | CIA-62 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33250 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: Activate most of the edit entries for HYP. Need to do some work to restrict behavior of ROT A to something more useful - let H do the free rotations and have A rotate around H. |
| 00:38.14 | brlcad | http://www.jug.net/wt/slscp/sh2s.jpg |
| 00:38.25 | brlcad | configurable chord length and twist params? :) |
| 00:38.30 | brlcad | is kidding |
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| 02:22.00 | marko1 | anyone know what this means |
| 02:22.04 | marko1 | class_lu_vs_s: loop transits plane of shell/face? |
| 02:22.05 | marko1 | FAILED in Boolean evaluation: /bobbin_left |
| 02:22.05 | marko1 | 0 triangles written |
| 02:22.16 | marko1 | got it while running g-stl |
| 02:27.04 | Ralith | marko1: sounds like it it had trouble going from CSG to a mesh; happens sometimes. I think the general solution is to fiddle with the model a bit and try again. Not sure if there's anything specific you can glean from that error. |
| 02:30.48 | marko1 | ok |
| 02:30.58 | marko1 | not very reassuring! |
| 02:31.12 | marko1 | heh |
| 02:33.36 | Ralith | yeah, work's being done on a new -> mesh system, iirc |
| 02:34.11 | Ralith | it's not an easy problem to solve; I'm not aware of any free implementation without serious issues, and for all I know the commercial ones might have the same. |
| 02:35.27 | Ralith | marko1: This is really just a guess, but maybe you have overlapping regions? |
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| 02:46.07 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 03:06.23 | starseeker | brlcad: cool |
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| 04:40.49 | brlcad | woo hoo, networking |
| 04:49.36 | Ralith | networking! yay! |
| 04:49.47 | Ralith | wait what |
| 04:51.42 | brlcad | I've been without net in my new place.. until just a few minutes ago |
| 05:32.00 | Ralith | ahh. |
| 05:32.05 | Ralith | it is nice to have that remedied. |
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| 05:53.48 | HectorVictorious | what system specs would you recommend for smooth performance (not the absolute minimum) |
| 05:54.08 | Ralith | HectorVictorious: to do what? |
| 05:54.42 | Ralith | brl-cad can probably run to some degree or other on any hardware you can imagine; mged, on most. |
| 05:57.04 | *** part/#brlcad HectorVictorious (n=jlarigak@S0106001cf070388b.vs.shawcable.net) | |
| 05:57.45 | Ralith | o.O |
| 05:58.34 | Ralith | he PM'd me two lines of details then quit. |
| 05:58.35 | Ralith | huh. |
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| 12:36.49 | mafm | hi |
| 12:36.54 | claymore | howdy! |
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| 15:20.02 | starseeker | supresses the temptation to destroy his mouse |
| 15:20.20 | starseeker | random doubleclicks are a real problem, especially when trying to do graphics work |
| 15:20.41 | starseeker | anybody have recommendations for a good mouse that can take a real pounding? |
| 15:20.56 | starseeker | doesn't need 200 buttons, just something that can take getting run over |
| 15:21.11 | starseeker | + scroll wheel |
| 15:23.24 | clock_ | starseeker: so 199 buttons are OK? |
| 15:23.39 | archivist | starseeker, Ive been getting randomness from my mouse....done about 20 miles across the bench top over the years |
| 15:24.16 | archivist | mine a Logitech wireless |
| 15:26.31 | starseeker | clock_: Heh |
| 15:26.49 | starseeker | I just mean I don't need something robust AND highly complex |
| 15:26.56 | starseeker | archivist: Really. |
| 15:27.05 | starseeker | thought Logitech was good |
| 15:27.26 | archivist | about 6 years old now |
| 15:27.41 | archivist | really worn still going |
| 15:28.05 | starseeker | ah |
| 15:28.07 | archivist | has been good |
| 15:28.49 | archivist | did a 10 mile service the other day and stripped it down for a de gunge |
| 15:29.42 | archivist | this is a working bench not office! |
| 15:31.42 | archivist | so actually Im pretty happy with it, and have HP and Gateway badged versions for use at home and as a spare for when it really dies |
| 15:32.29 | starseeker | cool |
| 15:33.15 | archivist | only mouse to outlast this was a mouse systems mouse |
| 15:33.49 | archivist | and that was circa 1988-1998 |
| 15:34.51 | archivist | mouse systems worked very hard, was doing PCB design with that one |
| 15:37.27 | starseeker | remembers designs for the old symbolics lisp mice - metal components, built like tanks |
| 15:37.37 | starseeker | sorta like their keyboards :-) |
| 15:38.21 | archivist | mouse systems needed new feet and a shortened tail |
| 15:39.08 | archivist | actually got genuine replacement felt for the pads |
| 15:39.48 | clock_ | use a GPS receiver and translate the coordinates into the screen coordinates |
| 15:39.52 | clock_ | so called athletic mouse ;-) |
| 15:43.18 | starseeker | Hmm... Logitech LX3 Optical Mouse looks interesting |
| 15:44.08 | archivist | I stick with ball where I can, opticals get some surfaces wrong |
| 15:48.54 | starseeker | saddles up and heads out |
| 15:49.12 | claymore | Rawhide!!!! |
| 16:09.11 | ``Erik | I used to use a logitech mouseman 95, now I use a razer v1.6 |
| 16:10.37 | ``Erik | I think the shape of the razer is screwing with my wrist, though |
| 16:11.17 | ``Erik | I used a logitech rs 800 briefly, but it's not that great |
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| 17:24.20 | brlcad | speaking of tanks, drove past an m1 this morning on I95 |
| 17:24.33 | brlcad | undoubtedly on its way up to apg |
| 17:24.41 | brlcad | fun :) |
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| 17:39.48 | archivist | would be nice to drive a tank one day, over here for a pile of ££ one can for a day |
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| 18:09.22 | starseeker | brlcad: awesome :-) |
| 18:09.31 | starseeker | vehicles not to argue the right of way with :-P |
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| 18:45.30 | PrezKennedyJR | brlcad, there was an M1 on I95? |
| 18:46.27 | PrezKennedyJR | or was it on a flatbed? |
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| 20:30.10 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: ah, it was on a flatbed :) |
| 20:30.18 | brlcad | that would have been even more impressive |
| 20:31.09 | brlcad | I've seen them driving down route 40 before at high-speed, but only flatbedded on I95 |
| 21:21.42 | mafm | bye bye folkz |
| 21:21.55 | mafm | becoming an expert employment lawyer |
| 21:21.57 | mafm | :P |
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| 22:09.18 | PrezKennedy | i wanna drive an M1 on US40 |
| 22:09.43 | PrezKennedy | id be like that guy who stole the tank in California, except i wouldnt get stuck on a jersey barrier |
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| 22:37.48 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: you'd just drive it into the Bay? |
| 22:55.03 | PrezKennedy | no id drive it onto the base! |
| 22:55.05 | PrezKennedy | make it exciting |
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| 03:06.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33251 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/edsol.c: Too many controls for the need on hyp - reduce to what is needed |
| 03:22.33 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33252 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/db.h include/wdb.h src/conv/asc2g.c): Make asc2g aware of hyp, add includes needed for this to work |
| 03:36.53 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33253 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: Add ted support for hyp |
| 04:45.16 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33254 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/mirror.c: Add support to mirror for hyp |
| 04:47.15 | starseeker | blinks - apparently eto doesn't have analyze implemented either? |
| 05:03.45 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33255 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/anal.c: Stub out analyze for the hyp. Volume and area calculations for this sucker look like they may prove a real challenge. |
| 05:04.48 | starseeker | notices the tgc doesn't have a general surface area calculation either |
| 05:05.41 | starseeker | declare victory for now - looks like analyze in general needs some though and TLC - should its functionality live elsewhere? |
| 05:09.22 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33256 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: Add proc-db for creation of optical lenses using rcc and epa primitives by solving the lensmaker's equation. |
| 05:10.12 | starseeker | finally bites the bullet and updates the NEWS file |
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| 05:13.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33257 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO): Add support for editing hyp primitives to MGED. |
| 05:17.06 | starseeker | zzzz |
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| 11:15.31 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@elnet-111.lip.pt) | |
| 11:15.48 | mafm | hi folks |
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| 12:37.59 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 12:42.01 | mafm | still fighting with my bosses |
| 12:42.03 | mafm | :) |
| 12:42.12 | mafm | I go to lunch now, to try to recover |
| 12:42.24 | brlcad | sorry to hear that.. |
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| 13:51.06 | mafm | back |
| 13:51.12 | mafm | so how're you brlcad |
| 13:56.08 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:19.46 | brlcad | mafm: pretty good |
| 14:20.09 | brlcad | feels bad for the torture starseeker is presently going through |
| 15:23.55 | mafm | documentation? |
| 15:24.01 | mafm | I haven't been paying much attention |
| 15:37.20 | mafm | brlcad/trunk/src/mged/anal.c -- oh, I see the pain now |
| 15:37.46 | mafm | (under Modified Paths :) ) |
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| 16:27.34 | brlcad | mafm: heh, not exactly related, but funny nonetheless :) |
| 16:42.59 | mafm | :) |
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| 17:32.13 | Lint_Trap | hullo, anyone around? |
| 17:32.31 | archivist | wrong question |
| 17:33.05 | archivist | in irc just fire off a question and wait for an answer |
| 17:33.44 | archivist | some low traffic channels can take a few hours for an answer |
| 17:35.21 | Lint_Trap | okay: can anyone with experience with BRL-CAD as well as one (or many) of the expensive solid modeling apps give me a brief rundown of what the learning curve will be like for someone migrating from said expensive, gui-based apps? Specifically, I learned all my solid modeling on Pro-Engineer. |
| 17:36.28 | archivist | as a Solidworks user I would say steep until a nice gui comes along |
| 17:38.17 | Lint_Trap | I've done some 2d stuff in autocad that was all from the command line. do you think that would be comparable? |
| 17:38.25 | archivist | yes |
| 17:38.53 | archivist | and no as its solids |
| 17:39.13 | louipc | there is some functionality missing in command line too |
| 17:39.31 | louipc | you can't edit sketches |
| 17:39.36 | archivist | and I have not touched Autocad in a LOT of years (release 2) |
| 17:40.00 | louipc | yeah the whole modelling approach is different with solids too |
| 17:40.18 | louipc | I'd say that would be the biggest learning curve |
| 17:40.31 | louipc | CSG vs Brep anyways |
| 17:40.38 | archivist | have a play see what you think |
| 17:40.46 | Lint_Trap | in pro/e: you perform extrudes and revolves a lot. However, most are based on "internal" sketches. |
| 17:41.33 | louipc | yeah in BRL-CAD you work with 3d objects from the start. cubes, spheres, etc... |
| 17:43.30 | Lint_Trap | is it feature based modelling? |
| 17:44.10 | louipc | features like bosses, holes, etc? |
| 17:44.28 | louipc | there's nothing like that in brl-cad |
| 17:44.34 | louipc | you've got to do it all manually |
| 17:44.39 | Lint_Trap | hmm, okay |
| 17:44.44 | louipc | using cubes, spheres, cylinders, etc |
| 17:44.56 | louipc | subtract a cylinder from a part to make a hole :D |
| 17:45.02 | Lint_Trap | easy enough |
| 17:45.46 | Lint_Trap | for example, say I was doing an I-beam. In BRL I would not be able to draw the cross-section and extrude it, I'd have to create a rectangular prism and subtract 2 rectangular prisms from it |
| 17:46.03 | louipc | you can do that nowadays |
| 17:46.30 | louipc | the extrude |
| 17:46.40 | louipc | there's brep support |
| 17:47.06 | louipc | but the sketch interface ain't that great |
| 17:47.54 | Lint_Trap | is the sketch interface command line? |
| 17:49.48 | louipc | no it's GUI only |
| 17:50.00 | louipc | that's one thing I don't like about it haha |
| 17:50.24 | Lint_Trap | seems strange... may as well play on the strengths, right? |
| 17:50.25 | louipc | autocad command line made for quick work of sketching in my experience |
| 17:50.52 | Lint_Trap | exactly. once you were good, it was faster for many tasks |
| 17:51.22 | Lint_Trap | thanks for you help |
| 17:51.44 | louipc | yep. |
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| 19:13.52 | brlcad | louipc: you can edit sketches, there is a sketch editor |
| 19:13.57 | brlcad | it's just a little painful |
| 19:14.16 | brlcad | heh, and from release 2 .. we're not too far away :) |
| 19:15.05 | brlcad | ah you mentioned the sketch interface, cool |
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| 19:34.20 | starseeker | spooky |
| 19:34.32 | starseeker | and brlcad were just discussing sketch |
| 19:53.51 | mafm | bye, folkz :) |
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| 21:25.57 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/cvs.tar.gz <--- windows cvs client (command line driven) |
| 21:33.25 | IriX64 | brought up mged in 7.11 it goes looking for tc.tk copied tclinit to tc.tk and it comes up fine, gui has a problem though |
| 21:39.54 | IriX64 | gonna try my hand at 7.14.0, wish me luck :) |
| 22:13.45 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177680420.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 22:14.47 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/mCPrbx89.html <---- are these pastebins still allowed |
| 22:15.04 | IriX64 | the copy at the bottom is my way of getting around it |
| 22:15.07 | IriX64 | :) |
| 22:17.43 | IriX64 | cept the copys not right |
| 22:17.52 | IriX64 | :) |
| 22:38.59 | IriX64 | im not literate in cpp is this solver_test and vm_test needed for the build to be successfull? |
| 22:41.42 | IriX64 | i dummied out solver_test by providing a dummy exe file to keep make happy and did the same for vm_test, but am i going to need those at runtime? |
| 22:47.27 | IriX64 | not sposed to dummy them out :) |
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| 00:03.15 | IriX64 | regards |
| 00:05.10 | IriX64 | when i start from autogen.sh at configure time i get a whole lot of makefile.in seems to ignore the --datarootdir setting, this does not happen when i use the packaged configure |
| 00:09.17 | IriX64 | oh, version 7.14.0 :) |
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| 03:17.53 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/CygWinIrssi.tar.gz |
| 03:18.12 | IriX64 | no perl tho (sigh) |
| 03:21.28 | louipc | I think the irssi people might be more interested in that one |
| 03:21.51 | IriX64 | you mean if i got perl to work? |
| 03:22.03 | louipc | maybe |
| 03:22.22 | louipc | you'd have to ask them :D |
| 03:22.34 | IriX64 | heh *you ask them :) |
| 03:22.50 | louipc | nah it's not my build |
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| 03:23.19 | IriX64 | hehe i could say it's not mine either but id be lying :) |
| 04:28.28 | brlcad | IriX64: sounds like you have busted/old version of autotools if packaged configure works but yours doesn't |
| 04:28.36 | brlcad | they are rather different version to version |
| 04:41.36 | IriX64 | thanks brlcad |
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| 14:19.34 | mafm | hi |
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| 15:05.38 | *** join/#brlcad redvsblue (i=Pandora@c-69-247-220-102.hsd1.mo.comcast.net) | |
| 15:17.45 | brlcad | happy gobble gobble |
| 15:24.41 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 15:52.14 | mafm | brlcad: take it easy, boy! :) |
| 16:32.33 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14D9CC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:55.50 | mafm | bye |
| 19:19.50 | *** join/#brlcad marko1 (n=mark@24.145.6.79) | |
| 19:29.42 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177871937.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:30.29 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/7.14.0.png :) last nights effort :) |
| 19:39.44 | brlcad | IriX64: are you running mged twice there or is one console and the second a 'gui' attachment |
| 19:40.00 | brlcad | guesses twice |
| 19:40.25 | IriX64 | gui *from console |
| 19:41.07 | IriX64 | should have it shut down console ? mebbe |
| 19:41.17 | brlcad | no, that's right |
| 19:41.24 | brlcad | just wondering how you found it? |
| 19:41.26 | IriX64 | need both |
| 19:41.30 | IriX64 | ? |
| 19:41.37 | brlcad | no |
| 19:41.44 | IriX64 | followed gui command :) |
| 19:41.57 | brlcad | how did you find the gui command, though? |
| 19:42.09 | IriX64 | browsing code |
| 19:42.24 | IriX64 | sposed to be a secret ? |
| 19:42.31 | brlcad | no, just curious |
| 19:42.41 | IriX64 | heh cat comes to mind :) |
| 19:43.30 | IriX64 | kudos that was an autogen effort |
| 19:43.47 | IriX64 | or was it, wait |
| 19:44.38 | IriX64 | was your supplied configure effort sorry |
| 19:45.57 | IriX64 | gonna try autogen now, see you later |
| 19:51.01 | *** join/#brlcad ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) | |
| 19:51.01 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o ChanServ] by irc.freenode.net | |
| 19:56.43 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177871937.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:56.59 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/5vvPr953.html |
| 19:57.15 | IriX64 | tons of these starting from autogen |
| 20:00.19 | IriX64 | the other configures don't produce those |
| 20:02.22 | louipc | IriX64: so what are you working on? |
| 20:02.36 | louipc | just to get a windows build? |
| 20:02.58 | IriX64 | playing with brlcad again, trying to get it to build from a make distclean. |
| 20:03.03 | louipc | or cygwin build rather |
| 20:03.11 | IriX64 | yes |
| 20:03.28 | louipc | looks live you've accomplished that eh? |
| 20:03.39 | IriX64 | sigh brlcad won't fit on my space or id give it to you :) |
| 20:03.51 | IriX64 | no that was the distributed configure |
| 20:03.54 | louipc | that's OK I don't run windows |
| 20:03.59 | IriX64 | heh |
| 20:04.09 | louipc | oh it doesn't build from SVN? |
| 20:04.44 | IriX64 | SVN???? |
| 20:04.53 | louipc | SVN HEAD |
| 20:05.01 | louipc | that's where the latest development happens |
| 20:05.17 | IriX64 | dont have accxess to that im working with the tarball from sourceforge |
| 20:05.30 | louipc | you can check out svn |
| 20:05.39 | IriX64 | have cvs but thats 7.11.0 |
| 20:05.49 | louipc | you just won't be able to commit unless you're added as a dev |
| 20:05.58 | IriX64 | dunno if im ready for that :) |
| 20:06.28 | louipc | you only need two commands |
| 20:06.33 | IriX64 | give |
| 20:07.05 | louipc | tp://sf.net/proje |
| 20:07.05 | louipc | 14:40 < IriX64> sposed to be a secret ? |
| 20:07.09 | louipc | oops |
| 20:07.18 | louipc | http://sourceforge.net/svn/?group_id=105292 |
| 20:07.20 | louipc | see that page |
| 20:07.28 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 20:07.47 | louipc | make the checkout URL this though: https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad |
| 20:07.52 | louipc | err |
| 20:08.09 | louipc | make the checkout URL this though: https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk |
| 20:08.12 | louipc | rather |
| 20:08.38 | louipc | after you checkout you only need to do `svn update` to get the latest code |
| 20:08.45 | louipc | similar to CVS |
| 20:09.24 | IriX64 | ahhh don't worry about it man im just a curious hobbiest :) |
| 20:10.00 | louipc | you should be trying to do something useful with your hobby though eh? |
| 20:10.11 | IriX64 | if i go to svn id have to take it seriously :) |
| 20:10.26 | louipc | not really |
| 20:10.50 | IriX64 | ill file the url |
| 20:11.40 | louipc | yeah check it out. |
| 20:16.09 | IriX64 | recorded it and i do have an svn client so maybe... |
| 20:16.55 | louipc | cool |
| 20:16.59 | IriX64 | does it create a dir called brlcad-7.14.0 or just a brlcad dir? |
| 20:17.12 | louipc | just brlcad |
| 20:17.17 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 20:17.22 | louipc | there really is no 'version' |
| 20:18.02 | IriX64 | as gump told JFK ive really gotta pee, be right back :) |
| 20:18.15 | louipc | but if you file a bug report or something you'd cite the SVN revision number |
| 20:18.37 | louipc | which is 33257 currently |
| 20:28.20 | IriX64 | i dont file bug reports i just pastebin |
| 20:33.59 | IriX64 | do you have to specify trunk or is it automatic |
| 20:36.31 | IriX64 | louipc .... i'm 54 man, just have time on my hands :) |
| 20:43.43 | IriX64 | should package svn like i did cvs :) |
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| 21:55.34 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177593078.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:56.44 | IriX64 | louipc: i readily admit I don't know what the fark, i'm doing with svn, should i be getting /branches? |
| 21:56.58 | IriX64 | brlcad/branches |
| 21:57.36 | Ralith | IriX64, if you've got the time, you could always just check out the whole repo and see what you need from there :P |
| 21:57.48 | IriX64 | heh thanks :) |
| 21:59.15 | louipc | IriX64: not if you used the url I said. scroll up ^ |
| 21:59.50 | IriX64 | used the instructions on the page you sent me to |
| 22:00.10 | louipc | hah I said to use this: https://brlcad.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/brlcad/brlcad/trunk instead though |
| 22:00.20 | louipc | same instructions, but different url |
| 22:00.22 | louipc | :P |
| 22:00.31 | IriX64 | thanks man standby |
| 22:05.00 | IriX64 | thats better |
| 22:09.35 | IriX64 | oohhhh man... did i see a watcom makefile go by? |
| 22:10.06 | Ralith | O.O |
| 22:10.12 | Ralith | there's watcom support? |
| 22:10.27 | IriX64 | thought i saw somewthing say watcom |
| 22:12.05 | louipc | yeah you did see it |
| 22:12.37 | louipc | a makefile for the watcom compiler |
| 22:13.08 | IriX64 | maybe ill reinstall watcom :) |
| 22:13.34 | louipc | it's not the watcom you're thinking of |
| 22:13.42 | IriX64 | ? |
| 22:13.51 | IriX64 | c/c++ compiler |
| 22:13.52 | louipc | is it oh nvm |
| 22:14.52 | louipc | yeah there'd be no point to that |
| 22:15.03 | IriX64 | true |
| 22:17.01 | IriX64 | make *sure i don't have commit access i'm still learning how to drive this svn thingy :) |
| 22:18.03 | IriX64 | 33257? louipc check me |
| 22:18.56 | louipc | you don't |
| 22:19.03 | IriX64 | aww man theres no configure ;) |
| 22:19.16 | louipc | hah that was the point wasn't it? |
| 22:19.25 | louipc | to build from a totally clean source tree? |
| 22:19.47 | IriX64 | yes thanks for the help and positive attitude |
| 22:20.21 | louipc | cheers |
| 22:20.25 | louipc | have fun with it |
| 22:20.31 | IriX64 | i will |
| 22:20.43 | IriX64 | *much fun ;) |
| 22:41.02 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 22:57.30 | IriX64 | does tkhtml3 not able to find tclsh85.exe happen only on my system? or do other platforms suffer same symptom? |
| 22:59.11 | louipc | yeah tkhtml3 stuff is a bit wonky |
| 22:59.24 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 23:01.19 | IriX64 | whos right? tcl or the tkhtml3? i mean is it supposed to have the 85 or not? |
| 23:01.35 | IriX64 | several ways of fixing it |
| 23:02.12 | louipc | depends on your system |
| 23:02.50 | IriX64 | my tcl is generated without the 85 :) |
| 23:05.01 | IriX64 | heh same for wish |
| 23:06.13 | IriX64 | heh ill just hack make file (path of least resistancwe :)) |
| 23:07.02 | IriX64 | it made time to get layed ;) |
| 23:43.21 | louipc | IriX64: you can save your changes as a patch too try `svn diff` |
| 23:43.42 | IriX64 | thanks louipc |
| 00:27.54 | IriX64 | yay install time :) |
| 00:39.40 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/A19g2W87.html <--- install time blues |
| 00:57.28 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/7.14.1.png <---with a little persuasion it came up, this is off svn. |
| 01:41.53 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.194.73) | |
| 02:29.23 | redvsblue | troubleradio.net :D |
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| 12:43.33 | claymore | mornin all! |
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| 13:38.00 | brlcad | mornin' claymore |
| 13:40.56 | claymore | brlcad: hai! How was t-day? |
| 13:49.34 | ``Erik | mmmm, poussière de café |
| 14:05.10 | mafm | hi |
| 14:14.46 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
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| 15:13.49 | *** join/#brlcad joevano (n=joevano@bzflag/developer/JoeVano) | |
| 15:14.17 | joevano | doh, no brlcad here either :/ |
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| 15:34.34 | *** join/#brlcad claymore (n=claymore@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 15:34.57 | claymore | that was strange |
| 15:35.22 | claymore | :/ |
| 15:47.00 | claymore | kick CIA-4 |
| 15:47.11 | claymore | kicks CIA-4 |
| 15:47.11 | CIA-4 | ow |
| 15:47.21 | claymore | okay, just checking. |
| 15:52.04 | *** join/#brlcad erik_ (n=erik@66-111-42-110.static.sagonet.net) | |
| 16:10.31 | claymore | did bzflag.bz hiccup? |
| 16:11.40 | ``Erik | eh? |
| 16:12.05 | ``Erik | ooh, looks like it got rebooted |
| 16:14.14 | claymore | bummer. |
| 16:15.46 | ``Erik | happens to the best of them... only 104 days uptime before that one, though :/ |
| 16:17.00 | joevano | claymore, ``Erik : it did not reboot.. file system is full (/usr) |
| 16:17.19 | joevano | bzflag.bz reports 499 days up |
| 16:18.22 | ``Erik | erm, |
| 16:18.26 | joevano | ah.. that is just a news message :/ |
| 16:18.58 | ``Erik | heh :) |
| 16:19.05 | joevano | thats why I came looking for brlcad here, he wasn't in #bzflag |
| 16:19.17 | joevano | fired off an e-mail to him |
| 16:20.44 | joevano | i freed up a little space but those were just some old bzflag wiki backups |
| 16:21.03 | ``Erik | and it was an impolite reboot, it fired off fsck's |
| 16:21.16 | joevano | yeah |
| 16:23.37 | ``Erik | given that I'm consuming 48m on /usr, I think I'll opt out of cleaning up :D |
| 16:34.21 | claymore | Space hog! |
| 16:36.21 | *** join/#brlcad brlcad (n=sean@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 16:38.55 | ``Erik | so now we can pick on brlcad for rebooting the machine without warning! :D and doing it without umounting the drives |
| 16:38.58 | ``Erik | :D |
| 16:39.43 | brlcad | did no such thing |
| 16:40.05 | claymore | has a space 80 gig'er if ya need it :P |
| 16:40.43 | ``Erik | notes that the 'other' machine took a similar reboot a little over an hour before bz |
| 16:41.01 | ``Erik | I wonder if someone is wandering the datacenter flipping power switches off and on again |
| 16:43.54 | clock_ | 99/win 14 |
| 17:05.53 | CIA-4 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33258 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (Makefile.am load.c load_MySQL.c): break MySQL loader stuff out into its own file |
| 19:19.34 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177878899.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:20.06 | IriX64 | try... my site/7.14.1-round2.png :) |
| 19:20.54 | IriX64 | why does mged started in mged mode crap out if a select is done on the share directory? |
| 19:23.03 | louipc | what's mged mode? |
| 19:23.13 | IriX64 | gui mode :) |
| 19:23.25 | IriX64 | classic is mged -c |
| 19:23.30 | louipc | normal mode then? |
| 19:23.34 | IriX64 | yes |
| 19:23.38 | louipc | or default rather |
| 19:23.43 | IriX64 | right |
| 19:23.45 | louipc | thinks classic should be default |
| 19:23.49 | louipc | :D |
| 19:24.02 | IriX64 | afraid to learn new ways :) |
| 19:24.26 | louipc | you're opening a .g file from a shared directory? |
| 19:24.46 | IriX64 | no trying to open the share dir |
| 19:25.23 | IriX64 | status access violation like the dir is locked or something, but ill find the critter |
| 19:25.24 | louipc | because it's not a .g file that's why :D |
| 19:25.42 | IriX64 | share.g interesting thought :) |
| 19:28.39 | ``Erik | alias mged='mged -c' |
| 19:29.33 | ``Erik | doesn't understand what irix means by "a select is done" |
| 19:29.54 | IriX64 | mouse cursor on share dir and then left click |
| 19:30.05 | ``Erik | oh, 'open with' on a data file? |
| 19:30.17 | IriX64 | share is a dir not a data file |
| 19:30.22 | ``Erik | if it's a directory, it'll fail because you can't open a directory as a file on most os's |
| 19:30.52 | IriX64 | cmon now i had it working on 7.12.6 and below |
| 19:31.16 | IriX64 | changed my os tho wonder if i buggered something |
| 19:31.19 | ``Erik | http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d7d0c30df |
| 19:31.52 | ``Erik | um, what did it do on 7.12.6 and below? I should've failed (I wonder if someone fixed fruity behavior since then?) |
| 19:32.47 | IriX64 | opened the directory |
| 19:33.01 | IriX64 | this is from the gui ``Erik |
| 19:33.13 | IriX64 | comes up in gui mode |
| 19:33.51 | IriX64 | navigation of the file open button is whats being questioned here |
| 19:34.02 | ``Erik | ahhh, you mean you pull up the 'open file' dialog, select a directory, then click open to go in, opposed to doubleclicking it? |
| 19:34.11 | IriX64 | right |
| 19:34.41 | IriX64 | could be a platform thing |
| 19:34.52 | ``Erik | ok, that one may be a legitimate grievance |
| 19:35.00 | IriX64 | ahh |
| 19:35.10 | ``Erik | I just tried it on my mac and it just sits there when I click open, doesn't go into it or crash or anything |
| 19:35.31 | IriX64 | heh ill buy a (insert your machine here) :) |
| 19:35.40 | ``Erik | the guy who's been doing that stuff isn't in today, though (being post-turkey trauma day and all) |
| 19:35.54 | IriX64 | heh ok :) |
| 19:36.08 | ``Erik | hrm, 8-core mac pro with 16g ram, a 30" and two 23" cinemadisplays? d'no if you wanna |
| 19:36.20 | ``Erik | it's an awesome piece of hardware, but I wouldn't buy one myself |
| 19:37.08 | IriX64 | you just scared me a way that mist you see is me raising dust :) |
| 19:38.18 | ``Erik | a bit over 10k I think? |
| 19:38.58 | ``Erik | I just bought a new macbook, didn't go with the pro, a little more power for a lot more price :/ |
| 19:39.32 | IriX64 | my system isn't complaing of obsolence yet :) |
| 19:40.35 | ``Erik | my home server is a 650mhz p3 with 128m ram, my old laptop was a g3 700mhz with 650m ram... it was about time :) |
| 19:41.00 | claymore | ``Erik: How does wow run on the new machine? |
| 19:41.03 | ``Erik | I have an 850mhz athlon tbird with 384m ram that just needs a new cpu fan |
| 19:41.06 | IriX64 | complained that it needed more geritol than you had did it :) |
| 19:41.08 | ``Erik | awesomely, dave |
| 19:41.36 | ``Erik | even with all the updated graphic stuff in the new expansion that almost doubled system requirements |
| 19:42.05 | ``Erik | irix: prep-h, I do horrible abusive things to my servers O:-) |
| 19:42.31 | IriX64 | heh long as they say "yah master" i don't complain :) |
| 19:43.01 | louipc | it just sits there for me too |
| 19:43.13 | louipc | linux |
| 19:43.26 | IriX64 | ahh ill keep looking |
| 19:43.50 | IriX64 | tried to build termlib, cursor.c has issues i can't understand |
| 19:52.03 | mafm | bye |
| 20:06.43 | IriX64 | my loadavg is showing, gottta go ;) |
| 20:25.25 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 20:27.07 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177878899.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 20:27.42 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/oDXOsL61.html <---- louipc what do i do with it :) |
| 20:31.28 | IriX64 | took out everything but ${EXEEXT} :) |
| 20:38.08 | IriX64 | trying it now sigh :) |
| 20:45.42 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64_ (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177879232.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 20:46.24 | IriX64_ | louipc tell them it configures with tclsh now not 85, should compile fine. |
| 20:47.39 | IriX64_ | course i have been known to speak to soon :) |
| 20:51.20 | IriX64_ | good job, builds now. |
| 20:51.40 | IriX64_ | wonky eh, louipc ;) |
| 20:52.37 | IriX64_ | if anybody asks, i did ./autogen.sh |
| 21:01.55 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@70-56-27-199.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 21:06.38 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 21:36.30 | IriX64_ | http://rafb.net/p/WCgmfF56.html <--- louipc looksee > |
| 21:37.23 | IriX64_ | had to get creative with the prefix, farkles... |
| 21:40.53 | IriX64_ | tell *nix to put the bat away now :) |
| 21:42.25 | Ralith | Elapsed compilation time: 44 minutes, 15 seconds |
| 21:42.28 | Ralith | that must have been painful |
| 21:42.35 | IriX64_ | im patient |
| 21:42.55 | IriX64_ | error free run man |
| 21:44.41 | IriX64_ | sigh another 3/4 hour wait |
| 22:11.17 | louipc | hah takes me a good 2hr to build brl-cad |
| 22:15.00 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14F429.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:55.15 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177879232.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 22:55.35 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/VLcBVn69.html <--- wonky indeed louipc |
| 22:57.25 | IriX64 | is it because of my path? |
| 23:15.31 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177879232.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 23:16.26 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/shot.png <--- persuaded it to install and this is the extent of my artistic capabilities :) |
| 23:26.49 | ``Erik | no way |
| 23:26.58 | ``Erik | holy crap, a mork&mindy marathon on scifi |
| 23:28.07 | *** join/#brlcad marko1_ (n=mark@207-255-231-073-dhcp.jst.pa.atlanticbb.net) | |
| 23:29.21 | frozeniron | never seen it |
| 23:29.29 | frozeniron | looks interesting, tho |
| 23:31.26 | ``Erik | was a popular show int he late 70's, early 80's |
| 23:31.33 | frozeniron | wow, robin williams |
| 23:31.43 | ``Erik | is old :( |
| 23:31.56 | frozeniron | no, i grew up w/out a tv |
| 23:32.46 | frozeniron | someone gave me a commodore64, and i could not even use it |
| 23:33.54 | ``Erik | well, obviously, the first things you do are |
| 23:33.54 | ``Erik | poke 53280,0 |
| 23:33.54 | ``Erik | poke 53281,0 |
| 23:33.54 | ``Erik | then it's pimped, riced out, yo |
| 23:33.55 | ``Erik | (turns the background and border black) |
| 23:34.17 | ``Erik | with a disk in, you do load "$",8 to bring the disks directory into memory, then list to see it |
| 23:34.47 | ``Erik | or load "*",8 to load the first thing ont he disk into memory, usually followed by 'run' if it has the basic stub (or is a basic program) |
| 23:35.07 | ``Erik | :D thems was sweet machines, I did a little code poking on a coleco adam (z80 cp/m) before upgrading to the good old c64 |
| 23:35.36 | ``Erik | shuts up and installed vice on his laptop |
| 23:39.44 | frozeniron | yes, but you needed a tv to make it work |
| 23:40.27 | frozeniron | stupid newbie question... |
| 23:40.31 | ``Erik | the c128 had a d15 rgb plug |
| 23:40.49 | frozeniron | yeah, but i got a 386 instead |
| 23:40.50 | ``Erik | I think it was d15... was required for 80 column mode |
| 23:40.58 | frozeniron | correct |
| 23:41.41 | ``Erik | with the 387, the 386 was far more of a number cruncher than the c64/c128, but the multimedia on the commies stomped |
| 23:42.11 | frozeniron | i used it to play descent. that was all dos was good for |
| 23:42.17 | ``Erik | doom2 |
| 23:42.23 | ``Erik | wolf3d |
| 23:42.51 | frozeniron | doom |
| 23:43.06 | frozeniron | then i got a 486 so i could install linux |
| 23:43.14 | ``Erik | I'm gonna keep jacking my jaw until you ask your question, btw |
| 23:43.24 | frozeniron | o, rite... |
| 23:43.27 | ``Erik | 386 could support linux iirc, though I first tried linux on a 486 |
| 23:43.31 | frozeniron | old times... |
| 23:43.45 | frozeniron | i am working thrugh the gmed tutoiral... |
| 23:43.48 | ``Erik | redhat 2.0, slackware 3.0... ended up adopting dilinux for a while |
| 23:43.48 | frozeniron | mged |
| 23:44.10 | frozeniron | slackware 96-suse-gentoo (gentoo now) |
| 23:44.24 | ``Erik | <-- fled to fbsd after doing kernel development |
| 23:44.25 | frozeniron | how do do dimension lines? |
| 23:44.38 | frozeniron | or make something like a conventional print |
| 23:44.53 | ``Erik | um, we don't have any real dimensioning... if you know your object, you COULD theoretically make sketch objects alongside the real geometry |
| 23:44.55 | frozeniron | i had to do a screenshot and fix it in openoffice |
| 23:45.01 | ``Erik | or post-process it |
| 23:45.20 | frozeniron | post process? |
| 23:45.40 | ``Erik | yeah, crank it up in OOo or gimp and add the lines and text... |
| 23:45.41 | frozeniron | i feel that there would be great use in having that built-in |
| 23:46.02 | ``Erik | yeah, we agree, but historically the focus has been CAE, not CAD, and the paid work is all CAE related |
| 23:46.08 | frozeniron | yes... only problem is that the exported pic was only screen res |
| 23:46.21 | frozeniron | true |
| 23:46.33 | frozeniron | if i was a programmer, i would help |
| 23:47.08 | frozeniron | i am taking a print-reading class in school, and learning a bit about gd&t |
| 23:47.25 | ``Erik | um, it's on our long 'project vision' list, but *shrug* we have mebbe 3.5 developers and someting like 5-10 years of work demanded by the people who sign the checks |
| 23:48.35 | ``Erik | and it's a nontrivial effort for an open source developer to learn the package, much less contribute a major work like dimensioning :) |
| 23:48.59 | frozeniron | true, but worthwile |
| 23:50.15 | ``Erik | damn, this schtick is just painful :( |
| 23:50.24 | frozeniron | i really like what i ? |
| 23:50.44 | frozeniron | i like what i see so far from brlcad |
| 23:51.04 | frozeniron | o, morg&mindy? |
| 23:51.45 | frozeniron | my idea was to have a seperate application that can read the db, |
| 23:51.54 | frozeniron | then add all of the features there |
| 23:52.32 | frozeniron | think that would be better than cluttering the interface with something that not everyone would use |
| 23:53.48 | frozeniron | the end result would be that i could have prints, 3d renderings, and maybe cam stuff like g-code, tool paths, etc |
| 23:54.36 | frozeniron | all saved without a specific resolution |
| 23:55.23 | frozeniron | except of course rendering |
| 23:55.43 | frozeniron | awww... |
| 23:57.48 | frozeniron | i would like something to go between brl-cad and emc2 (open source cnc controller for machine tools) |
| 23:57.56 | ``Erik | hrm, we have "archer" which is an experimental gui |
| 23:57.58 | *** join/#brlcad docelic (n=docelic@78.134.197.167) | |
| 23:58.31 | frozeniron | archer at command line produces blank window |
| 23:59.05 | frozeniron | i will need to investigate |
| 23:59.06 | ``Erik | there's been talk about a g-gerber converter (twingy wrote gcam to satisfy his needs, no relation to BRL-CAD other than social... http://gcam.js.cx ) |
| 00:00.10 | Twingy | writing to gerber is easy, writing to g-code is hard |
| 00:00.26 | frozeniron | i believe that |
| 00:00.35 | frozeniron | taking intro to cnc... |
| 00:01.05 | frozeniron | it seems like a very poor language to produce code by machine |
| 00:01.16 | ``Erik | oh, heh, for some strange reason, I thought the g in g-code stood for gerber, my bad :) not my scene |
| 00:01.21 | ``Erik | waves at twingy |
| 00:01.30 | Twingy | hi erik |
| 00:02.04 | frozeniron | no, g and m code as in rs-274d |
| 00:05.45 | frozeniron | i also have the idea that instead of using g-code, just use brl format, with an extra file that defines tooling, etc |
| 00:06.46 | frozeniron | it would be awkward, but the resulting output would be much smaller and more precise |
| 00:07.26 | frozeniron | g-code has a hard time with complex surfaces because you have to define every point |
| 00:12.24 | frozeniron | is there a library for reading the db format? |
| 00:14.09 | ``Erik | libwdb and librt |
| 00:14.17 | frozeniron | thanks |
| 00:14.19 | ``Erik | libwdb is more about writing |
| 00:32.17 | *** part/#brlcad joevano (n=joevano@bzflag/developer/JoeVano) | |
| 01:06.35 | redvsblue | i'm djing if you guys care |
| 01:13.23 | archivist | looking at freetype to gcode atm |
| 01:38.14 | ``Erik | is making punker play cool songs on her intarweb dj thingiemajigger, is evil like that... the full version of moody blues - forever afternoon |
| 01:38.41 | ``Erik | all eight and a half minutes of it, mwahahaha |
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| 14:07.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03homovulgaris * r33259 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libpc/ (6 files): safeguarding variable values during solving process; adding store and restore methods in VCSet class and corresponding virutal method to VariableAbstract Class |
| 16:21.55 | *** join/#brlcad cybersunboy (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 16:22.57 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 16:23.20 | csanyipal | Hi, I want to ask a small question! |
| 16:24.23 | csanyipal | I maintain a small Moodle system on my home web site at http://csanyi-pal.info/moodle and have a courses for the BRL-CAD for my students. |
| 16:26.39 | csanyipal | Can I use the "Volume II â Introduction to MGED" so that I translate it all, or some peaces of the text in to Hungarian or Serbian language in my curses? |
| 16:30.06 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 16:55.13 | Axman6 | csanyipal: stick around for a while, this channel is very quiet most of the time. but brlcad will get back to you and let you know i'm sure |
| 17:04.20 | csanyipal | Axman6: Thanks! :) |
| 17:04.38 | Axman6 | brlcad: *poke* |
| 17:04.54 | Axman6 | he's probably asleep, but that'll make sure he knows someone needs him... |
| 17:05.21 | csanyipal | :) |
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| 21:41.15 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/todayscheckout.png |
| 21:41.33 | IriX64 | thanks louipc :) |
| 22:11.47 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14D6FD.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 22:11.53 | IriX64 | gonna see how much of brlcad i can build with mingw32 :) |
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| 22:14.58 | csanyipal | brlcad: If you return here, and if you will, you can aswer to me e-mailing me to csanyipal@gmail.com |
| 22:15.06 | csanyipal | I must go now, buy! |
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| 23:26.09 | IriX64 | carnage :) |
| 23:37.18 | louipc | IriX64: you only check out once. after that you `svn update` |
| 23:37.52 | IriX64 | why co works too got some update files like pcVariable.cpp whatever that is |
| 23:38.11 | IriX64 | but ill adhere to your standard and use update |
| 05:13.45 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 05:27.44 | csanyipal | Hi |
| 06:05.31 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@71-210-20-69.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 06:40.35 | csanyipal | Is anybody here? I have a question. |
| 06:44.11 | phreak4257 | i am here. probably cannot help, but shoot |
| 06:44.18 | csanyipal | ok |
| 06:46.20 | csanyipal | I want to use Documentation for my Moodle BRL-CAD course. May I use it to translate some part of it or all? |
| 06:47.23 | phreak4257 | i am just another user, and as such cannot grant or deny permission for anything... |
| 06:47.30 | csanyipal | ok |
| 06:48.02 | csanyipal | thanks anyway |
| 06:48.05 | phreak4257 | check the licenses, though... they look pretty friendly, so probably ok, but do check |
| 06:48.14 | csanyipal | ok |
| 06:48.57 | phreak4257 | btw, moodle? |
| 06:49.05 | csanyipal | yes? |
| 06:49.57 | phreak4257 | just looked it up... |
| 06:50.09 | csanyipal | http://moodle.org/ |
| 06:50.09 | phreak4257 | are you a teacher or something? |
| 06:50.15 | csanyipal | I'm a teacher |
| 06:50.22 | phreak4257 | where at? |
| 06:50.46 | csanyipal | in Europe, Serbia. I'm Hungarian |
| 06:51.05 | phreak4257 | ahhh... thus the translation thing |
| 06:51.12 | csanyipal | yes.. :D |
| 06:51.50 | phreak4257 | well, have fun with that, sorry i cannot help further |
| 06:52.02 | csanyipal | thanks anyway! :) |
| 07:08.31 | *** join/#brlcad hml (n=x@unaffiliated/hml) | |
| 07:08.40 | hml | how tightly coupled is brlcad and tcl? |
| 07:08.44 | hml | i'd really like to have a chicken scheme interface to it |
| 07:12.42 | yukonbob | hml: mged and tcl are tightly coupled, and likely archer |
| 07:14.20 | yukonbob | hml: but the core 'engine' is typically C libraries |
| 07:14.26 | yukonbob | ie: librt, etc. |
| 07:39.46 | hml | is there a publically downloadlab eset of brlcad models? |
| 07:42.20 | yukonbob | hml: there are some included with the distribution |
| 07:42.29 | hml | i'm looking for things like |
| 07:42.30 | hml | 1000 tanks |
| 07:42.34 | hml | 1000 planes etc ... |
| 07:42.45 | hml | trying to build generaative models for what tanks /planes / vehicles look like |
| 07:42.51 | hml | and then generaaating novel vehicles from my models |
| 07:43.46 | yukonbob | so, you're looking for thousands of examples, is what you're saying? |
| 07:44.19 | hml | yes |
| 07:44.32 | hml | this is also purely for academic / research purposes |
| 07:44.34 | hml | non-commercial |
| 07:44.36 | hml | if that matters at all |
| 07:44.50 | yukonbob | I don't know where you'll find that many models ;) |
| 07:45.00 | hml | i can find them; they're just not free |
| 07:45.15 | hml | i dont't hink going to my advisor and syaing: I need 50k to buy 1000 $50 3d models is a good idea |
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| 21:56.01 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/cxpH3E86.html <---- has this one been reported? |
| 21:56.34 | IriX64 | just change the name in the .h file to my_tie_kdtree and its happy |
| 21:59.16 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/bqyDAv73.html <-- and this one, i couldn't find a getloadavg function anywhere so i just stubbed it :) |
| 22:02.48 | IriX64 | and the compile churns on :) |
| 22:03.41 | IriX64 | louipc, i used update, works fine thanks. |
| 22:06.25 | IriX64 | and that bwish thing, and others for that matter, wherevever you included {TK} in the link you have to include {X_LIBS} and be sure x_libs has -lXft and -lXss |
| 22:14.26 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 22:15.09 | starseeker | auugh - no backscroll |
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| 22:39.58 | IriX64 | fbed.... is fraught :) |
| 22:44.46 | Ralith | fraught with anything in particular? |
| 22:44.50 | Ralith | or just fraught in general? |
| 22:45.20 | IriX64 | peril :) |
| 22:47.18 | IriX64 | for now ill just force the issue and carry on with what I *was doing :) |
| 22:48.45 | IriX64 | sigh... lgt = fbed :( |
| 23:47.26 | IriX64 | and a pocket protector :) |
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| 01:05.11 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/latestcheckout.png |
| 01:06.02 | IriX64 | think ill start using the blog if I can, hate advertising my name like this. |
| 01:09.31 | IriX64 | that one has everything but fbed and lgt :) |
| 02:43.49 | Axman6 | starseeker: arething in particular you missed? |
| 02:44.04 | starseeker | don't know :-) |
| 02:44.27 | Axman6 | well, i've got the scrollback for the last few days here if you want it :) |
| 02:46.57 | starseeker | Axman6: Anything interesting happen? |
| 02:48.29 | Axman6 | not that i can see... but i could paste the log, minus all the joins and parts if you like |
| 02:49.01 | starseeker | Nah, that's OK - if there wasn't anything hot it's no big deal - thanks though :-) |
| 02:49.16 | Axman6 | just trying to find when you left |
| 02:49.32 | starseeker | isn't sure - terminal session became defunct |
| 02:50.17 | Axman6 | ah, found it, been a while since you've been here. looks like quite a bit |
| 02:50.20 | Axman6 | 's happened* |
| 02:54.05 | Axman6 | bah, can;tfigure out how to save the window's log -_- |
| 02:54.31 | brlcad | will catch up with log after foodage |
| 02:57.07 | Axman6 | i got my uni marks back today, did pretty well :D |
| 02:57.46 | Axman6 | HD, 2 D's and a CR |
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| 04:12.53 | IriX64 | brlcad.... breaks gcc-4.2 alpaha |
| 04:13.14 | Ralith | that's probably why it's an alpha. |
| 04:13.21 | IriX64 | heh yea |
| 04:14.04 | IriX64 | trying my luck with 4.3.1 |
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| 14:34.53 | ``Erik | heh |
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| 15:34.02 | mafm | hi there! |
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| 16:40.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33260 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/ComboBox.tcl: Mods to fix the getText and setText methods. |
| 16:43.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33261 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/ (Ged.tcl Makefile.am): Added the Ged cadwidget. This widget mainly wraps libtclcad's ged object. |
| 16:43.36 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33262 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/tclIndex: Added the Ged cadwidget. This widget mainly wraps libtclcad's ged object. |
| 16:50.38 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33263 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libdm/ (Makefile.am labels.c scale.c): Added labels.c and scale.c for drawing primitive labels and a view scale. |
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| 17:34.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33264 10/brlcad/trunk/ (17 files in 8 dirs): |
| 17:34.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Mods to get Archer using cadwidgets::Ged. This required adding functionality to |
| 17:34.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: libtclcad/ged_obj (i.e. go_base2local, go_bg, go_bounds, go_faceplate, |
| 17:34.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: go_model_axes, go_mouse_ray, go_prim_label, go_screen2model, go_screen2view, |
| 17:34.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: go_transparency, go_view_axes, go_view_win_size). More structures were also |
| 17:34.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: added to ged.h (i.e. ged_axes_state and ged_other_state). |
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| 19:10.57 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/4id1kl64.html <--- are you interested in warnings suchh as these? |
| 19:14.40 | IriX64 | and warnings about antiquated headers |
| 19:39.57 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1096601317.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:45.17 | IriX64 | has replaced notepad with jove :) |
| 19:45.33 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/WPjv7q58.html <---- this type of warning |
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| 21:00.26 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/B6Bv9Q50.html <---- this was ${TERMLIB} i changed it to ${TERMLIB_LIBS} |
| 21:13.21 | IriX64 | wonders about that fbed and lgt being fraught crack last night :) |
| 21:16.54 | IriX64 | maybe i'll rename winsock.h, i get tired of editing brlcad_config.h every run :) |
| 21:37.20 | IriX64 | why is missing complaing that automake-1.10 is missing, i have 1.10.1 |
| 21:45.55 | IriX64 | mc |
| 21:46.48 | IriX64 | cheesey way of doing it add -L/${topbuilddir} -llibtermlib to LDFLAGS :) |
| 21:47.34 | IriX64 | libcursor likes it |
| 22:15.48 | IriX64 | bwish and mged both need -lXft -lXss added to x_libs |
| 22:19.13 | IriX64 | forgot the subdirector above plz forgive :) |
| 22:22.13 | IriX64 | cd rttherm |
| 22:23.09 | IriX64 | sampview in rttherm needs them too |
| 22:24.15 | IriX64 | so do png-test and bombardier in utils |
| 22:25.11 | IriX64 | err pl-dm in util |
| 22:27.25 | IriX64 | two i haven't figured out yet, but a dummy way of having the build continue is to do a cp fbed.c fbed.exe and cp lgt.c lgt.exe :) |
| 22:29.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33265 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/dm.h src/libdm/labels.c): Modify dm_draw_labels to return an int and declare in dm.h. |
| 22:33.46 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33266 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/ (brlcad/brlcad.sln g2stl/g2stl.vcproj libdm/libdm.vcproj): Remove libged from lib input list for libdm. Add libgcv to lib input list for g2stl. Update the dependencies for libged and g2stl. |
| 22:42.06 | IriX64 | btw, if you do a cp tclsh.exe tclsh85.exe html3 builds too |
| 22:43.57 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/5WLq4g39.html <--- but at install time i get this and i don't speak this language, help |
| 22:59.09 | IriX64 | ive adopted a rule of thumb, if ${TK} is in there it needs -lXss and -lXft :) |
| 23:01.06 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:36.04 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/classic.png |
| 23:36.12 | IriX64 | it built |
| 23:36.46 | IriX64 | can somebody lend me an fbed and an lgt, thats all im missing :) |
| 23:41.13 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/ys6iuR52.html <---- my configure line :) |
| 00:04.44 | IriX64 | microsoft in their infinite wisdom gives you 10 gigs of storage in your blog, but i cant for the life of me find a way to delete fils |
| 00:04.55 | IriX64 | files too |
| 00:05.04 | Ralith | why are you using a microsoft service to blog? O.o |
| 00:05.15 | IriX64 | cheap :) |
| 00:05.25 | Ralith | there are other, better, free services :P |
| 00:05.46 | IriX64 | name 1 |
| 00:06.13 | Ralith | oh, I don't know, wordpress? blogspot? |
| 00:06.29 | IriX64 | hosted by? |
| 00:06.56 | Ralith | oh, I don't know, wordpress? blogspot? |
| 00:07.24 | IriX64 | www.wordpress.com or org? |
| 00:08.01 | Ralith | which one offers a free blog service |
| 00:08.31 | IriX64 | dunno i haven't visited them im just asking cause you seem to have experience with them |
| 00:09.03 | Ralith | I suggest you dedicate at least the ten seconds require to test two domain names to considering them. |
| 00:09.29 | IriX64 | im catious |
| 00:09.34 | IriX64 | sp? |
| 00:09.40 | IriX64 | cautios |
| 00:09.40 | Ralith | cautious |
| 00:09.53 | Ralith | blogspot is highly reputable |
| 00:10.08 | IriX64 | so is microsoft :) |
| 00:10.08 | Ralith | iirc wordpress is too |
| 00:10.11 | Ralith | lol |
| 00:12.11 | IriX64 | many services offering those |
| 00:17.27 | IriX64 | should load the cygwin dll's and brlcad binaries to it wonder if anybody would try them |
| 00:18.08 | IriX64 | next build ill try to do that |
| 00:19.20 | Ralith | you're trying to build brl-cad under cygwin? |
| 00:20.19 | IriX64 | that screenshot is my effort with cygwin |
| 00:21.02 | Ralith | but... doesn't brl-cad run native? |
| 00:21.09 | Ralith | there's a .exe installer... |
| 00:21.19 | IriX64 | i know :) |
| 00:24.39 | Ralith | so why all the effort for what is ultimately a less efficient binary? |
| 00:24.59 | IriX64 | effiency be damned, its complete |
| 00:25.21 | Ralith | why? |
| 00:25.56 | IriX64 | things the windows build doesn't have yet |
| 00:26.02 | Ralith | like? |
| 00:26.21 | IriX64 | pick something |
| 00:26.31 | Ralith | mged |
| 00:26.49 | IriX64 | there does it include photon mapping |
| 00:27.12 | IriX64 | thats the raytracer tho |
| 00:28.27 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/7.14.1-round2.png |
| 00:28.33 | Ralith | does *any* version include photon mapping O.o |
| 00:28.38 | IriX64 | photon mapped havoc |
| 00:28.45 | Ralith | oo, shadows |
| 00:28.46 | Ralith | fancy |
| 00:28.56 | Ralith | needs some denoising though |
| 00:29.27 | IriX64 | so does this channel ;) |
| 00:29.41 | Ralith | not really |
| 00:30.02 | IriX64 | woosh... im talking about me running off at the mouth |
| 00:30.54 | Ralith | so? |
| 00:31.02 | Ralith | nobody minds |
| 00:31.12 | IriX64 | heh ok |
| 00:31.21 | Ralith | it's not like this is ##c++ or something |
| 00:31.51 | Ralith | a little offtopic encourages a friendly atmosphere |
| 00:31.52 | IriX64 | i worry that these builds are tied to my system |
| 00:32.15 | Ralith | that doesn't seem likely |
| 00:32.31 | IriX64 | found a cygwin mount point in my registry they better not have made the dlls go looking for that |
| 00:32.33 | Ralith | I'd think they'd work on any x86 system w/ the right cygwin dlls accessible |
| 00:32.40 | Ralith | don't think so |
| 00:32.43 | IriX64 | hope so |
| 00:32.50 | Ralith | iirc, you can just drop the dlls in the same dir as the .exe, or even in a standard search dir |
| 00:32.56 | IriX64 | u provide the xserver tho all right :) |
| 00:33.02 | Ralith | not that system[32] doesn't get cluttered already. |
| 00:33.25 | IriX64 | wouldnt put it there contained in the brlcad dir |
| 00:34.01 | Ralith | hehe |
| 00:34.04 | Ralith | make a portable brlcad! |
| 00:34.09 | IriX64 | yea |
| 00:35.00 | IriX64 | ouch 18 dll's |
| 00:35.20 | IriX64 | thats for ./configure --enable-everything tho |
| 00:36.33 | Ralith | eh |
| 00:36.35 | Ralith | not a big deal |
| 00:36.46 | IriX64 | true |
| 00:36.47 | Ralith | considering there are almost 400 binaries |
| 00:36.58 | IriX64 | they work man |
| 00:37.29 | Ralith | ? |
| 00:37.31 | IriX64 | if you run across something that asks for a dll let me know ill provide it :) |
| 00:37.43 | Ralith | I don't run windows |
| 00:37.46 | Ralith | so, uh, thanks :P |
| 00:37.48 | IriX64 | ah |
| 00:37.55 | IriX64 | :) |
| 00:38.05 | IriX64 | very few here do i think |
| 00:38.38 | Ralith | indeed |
| 00:56.00 | Ralith | hehe |
| 00:56.06 | Ralith | http://brlcad.org/~sean/ideas.html |
| 00:56.09 | Ralith | Modeling |
| 00:56.21 | Ralith | # <st>Model a moose</st> |
| 00:56.26 | Ralith | # Model another moose! |
| 01:07.14 | IriX64 | HAHA it works with Xwin32, im gonna package it :) |
| 01:07.46 | IriX64 | guess i better make it a zip file, names anyone.. |
| 01:10.53 | IriX64 | little bat file to set the paths and startup mged and everybodys happy |
| 01:12.05 | IriX64 | ill show you a moose :) |
| 01:18.57 | IriX64 | weeps, they give you 5 gigs but each file is max 50 meg |
| 01:19.09 | IriX64 | mine is 1.3 gig |
| 01:20.25 | IriX64 | sympatico won't handle it either, all I have there is 1 gig space |
| 01:39.03 | IriX64 | ill be back when i find some place to put it :) |
| 01:48.48 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@lns-bzn-45-82-65-182-56.adsl.proxad.net) | |
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| 04:29.34 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 04:31.12 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 05:13.53 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 05:16.01 | IriX64 | where would one place a Cygwin build of brlcad-7.14.1, it's a 1.3 gig zip file, way to big for my spot on sympatico. |
| 07:15.37 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-225-143.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 08:15.43 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33267 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc/Dll/BrlcadCore.def: added mk_hyp (for asc2g) |
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| 11:50.06 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
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| 12:15.49 | mafm | hi |
| 12:20.49 | claymore | hai mafm! |
| 12:21.02 | ``Erik | claymore, silence, I will beat your ass, boy |
| 12:21.03 | ``Erik | :D |
| 12:21.12 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@76-10-183-62.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 12:22.12 | mafm | bad ``Erik... let claymore to greet me! |
| 12:22.18 | claymore | cannot properly convey the amount of laughter that Erik's comment evoked. |
| 12:23.16 | claymore | watched 'Hancock' this weekend. Quite surprising actually. |
| 12:26.28 | claymore | I thought it would be just another Moderately funny Will Smith movie... had quite a bit more plot to it than the previews let on. Almost had a bit of M. Night Shamalan feel to it... |
| 12:30.39 | claymore | oh, and hai ``Erik ! |
| 12:31.24 | ``Erik | *wave* |
| 12:31.41 | ``Erik | are you opting out of the lunch gathering yet again? |
| 12:31.54 | *** join/#brlcad louipc__ (n=louipc@206-248-177-43.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 12:32.00 | claymore | wasn't in at work yesterday... whats the occasion? |
| 12:32.20 | ``Erik | um, it gets to be 11:30, that's the occasion |
| 12:32.28 | ``Erik | thursday is the branch lunch I think |
| 12:32.56 | claymore | yeah, not today. Did a ginormous xmas gift shopping run this weekend so I need to be a bit frugal :/ |
| 12:33.05 | ``Erik | <-- eats out ~3 days a week |
| 12:33.42 | ``Erik | yeah, I don't grok that, I'm a measly db2 and I still seem to have money to blow |
| 12:33.52 | ``Erik | of course, I don't have a whif or chillinz |
| 12:34.11 | claymore | yeah, a fam is 'spensive, but worth it imo :) |
| 12:34.22 | ``Erik | my gf has chillinz |
| 12:34.38 | claymore | lil dj's? |
| 12:34.43 | ``Erik | skeers me like mad, but *shrug* it's fun at the same time |
| 12:34.50 | ``Erik | heh, possibly :D |
| 12:35.05 | claymore | well, once they are potty trained, it becomes a lot of fun. |
| 12:35.36 | ``Erik | I bought the boy an electronics kit last year, he busted it out a week ago and got back into it, I assume that means I need another edutainment gift |
| 12:35.51 | ``Erik | and the 6yo girl, well, she wants girl shit, I guess |
| 12:36.03 | ``Erik | this is all highly disturbing and confusing for me, I'm not used to children |
| 12:36.16 | claymore | My oldest is into starwars and transformers. Just this weekend, he dressed up in his Bumblebee (transformers) Halloween costume and informed me: 14 years ago, i was severly burned in a horrible Hot Chocolate accident and they had to put me in this suit so I would live. Then they game me a lightsaber. |
| 12:37.05 | ``Erik | transformers was damn awesome in the 80's, and star wars was in the 70's... |
| 12:37.41 | claymore | get the 6yo girl a 13 peice Pearl Drumset :) |
| 12:38.04 | ``Erik | huh? "pearl drumset"? I fail to grok |
| 12:38.25 | ``Erik | I do not like the keyboard on the new mac stuff |
| 12:39.28 | claymore | just an example: http://www.guitarcenter.com/Pearl-Chad-Smith-Signature-4-piece-Shell-Pack-501402-i1429408.gc |
| 12:40.01 | ``Erik | no, she liked my guitar a lot |
| 12:40.09 | ``Erik | the boy didn't give a shit |
| 12:41.13 | claymore | Well, you were looking for 'girl gift' ideas, and based on what I have assertained from this irc channel, this gift would be ideal for Punk's lil gurl :) |
| 12:41.40 | ``Erik | http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=41982727&albumID=832752&imageID=13065948 |
| 12:42.04 | claymore | private profile. |
| 12:42.14 | ``Erik | doh |
| 12:42.43 | claymore | although, "Some of the public profiles I might find interesting" are borderling nsfw lol. |
| 12:42.52 | claymore | borderline even :/ |
| 12:42.53 | ``Erik | well, das yougn adores the guitar |
| 12:43.37 | claymore | good girl :) |
| 12:43.41 | ``Erik | yes, I am quite borderline, a 'similar' scan might bring quite nswf results O.o |
| 12:44.49 | ``Erik | I can get her baubles and as long as she has more than her brother, she's happy... the boy is 11 and I feel a certain commitment to make everything educational, which gets tricky |
| 12:45.47 | ``Erik | last xmas, I bought him an electronics kit... he liked it for a short period, went back to video games, then a week ago, he drug it out from under his bed and played with it again |
| 12:45.52 | archivist | CD of man pages |
| 12:45.57 | claymore | get him a laptop and a book: "How to make money playing WoW' ...set him on the path of studying business ;) |
| 12:46.36 | ``Erik | heh, no, he already wants to play wow too much, mostly when I want to play with erica :) |
| 12:47.09 | ``Erik | woops, 7:45, ti's drive time, be there in 45 |
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| 13:17.58 | brlcad | thinks he should give his sore throat one more day before he brings it in to share it with others |
| 13:18.29 | brlcad | hm, maybe a half-day late to give it some time to defester |
| 13:44.18 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.176) | |
| 13:44.32 | starseeker | brlcad: Nah, say home |
| 13:44.34 | sporty | starseeker: please check email |
| 13:44.40 | starseeker | would get it just as he starts to travel |
| 13:44.43 | starseeker | sporty: OK, will do |
| 13:44.54 | starseeker | sporty: Sorry, been busy at work |
| 13:45.00 | sporty | starseeker: i have a long-term question |
| 13:45.13 | starseeker | alrighty |
| 13:45.20 | sporty | starseeker: no, it was me who was busy at work |
| 13:45.40 | starseeker | np, work does that |
| 13:45.48 | starseeker | needs to run actually, bbl |
| 13:45.53 | starseeker | time to play in traffic |
| 13:46.15 | sporty | starseeker: is there any chance to see some first steps towards "automatic dimensioning" feature. I know dxflibs, which are a part of the foss... |
| 13:46.26 | sporty | starseeker: ok |
| 13:50.10 | sporty | starseeker: i've sent to wrong address, i guess |
| 13:51.47 | brlcad | sporty: our dxf importer/exporter are a better than dxflib in quite a few ways, but that gets us no closer to automatic dimensioning ;) |
| 13:52.49 | sporty | brlcad: no, i mean libs of program code from ribbonsoft.com, which are free and offer some basic views and dimensions -capabilities |
| 13:52.54 | brlcad | but that said, there are some first steps under way already |
| 13:53.09 | brlcad | one of the gsoc projects is heavily related to dimensioning |
| 13:53.30 | sporty | like what? I mean i really want that Pro-Engineer-like feature |
| 13:53.38 | brlcad | sporty: that's the same dxflib that i'm referring to |
| 13:54.04 | brlcad | their primary purpose is import/export of dxf -- *that* we do a bit better than dxflib |
| 13:54.33 | brlcad | as well as view rendering |
| 13:54.38 | brlcad | but that's another story |
| 13:54.59 | sporty | "gsoc" - Government Owes Secondary Concerns" ?? What's that!?? |
| 13:54.59 | brlcad | automatic dimensioning has a lot more to do with application logic that format support |
| 13:55.04 | brlcad | ~gsoc |
| 13:55.05 | ibot | from memory, gsoc is the Google Summer of Code, a program run annually by Google to provide (paid for) jobs to students to code on open source projects over summer. See http://code.google.com/soc/ for details. |
| 13:56.10 | brlcad | you can read about our 4 students and their projects at http://brlcad.org/wiki/Google_Summer_of_Code/2008 |
| 13:56.49 | brlcad | "Parametric Equations and Constraint Support" is the one that will eventually get us nifty *automatic* constrained and context-aware dimensioning |
| 13:57.25 | brlcad | can't wait for his D90 to arrive today |
| 13:58.15 | sporty | ok... I just see i'm really using e.g. pipe runs as models for analysis - as an engineer... Automatic dimensioning can dramatically reduce and change the process of the work... Week has 40 working hours, and sometimes it could be easy to create e.g. some plates with holes and facets for both, analysis and dimensioning |
| 13:59.53 | sporty | thinks D90 is just some modern mobile phone... |
| 14:00.13 | sporty | ah! |
| 14:01.13 | sporty | ok, 3, 2, 1, ignition, java -jar $HOME/toonel.jar, start! surfing web! |
| 14:17.54 | sporty | starseeker: ok, i've sent mail to mailbox, hope yours... reboot to windows, getting tea... tons of the things... |
| 14:19.29 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.176) | |
| 14:22.10 | brlcad | Nikon D90 ... and it just arrived |
| 14:22.11 | sporty | "I don't have my own opinion about this, don't think I'm intelligent" |
| 14:22.25 | brlcad | is a giddy giddy boy at the moment with his new toy |
| 14:23.52 | brlcad | sporty: I totally understand all of the potential benefits .. it's just a matter of horsepower and priorities |
| 14:23.53 | sporty | brlcad: and get the song of depeche mode - photographic: the lights on, switch on, the program of today... lights on, swith on, your eyes are far away... The photo represents you and the tape is your voice, la-la-la! |
| 14:23.56 | brlcad | we need more horses |
| 14:24.20 | sporty | brlcad: but... we don't have carrot to feed them? |
| 14:24.36 | brlcad | enlistens to depeche mode - photographic |
| 14:25.22 | brlcad | hm, it's a little ADD :) |
| 14:25.47 | sporty | what? |
| 14:26.14 | sporty | enlooks into Bloodhound Gang's ChasseyLane |
| 14:26.27 | brlcad | ~add |
| 14:26.28 | ibot | somebody said add was the auto descruction device in debian |
| 14:26.34 | brlcad | heh, well that's not right |
| 14:27.24 | brlcad | ~add is also sometime used to refer to Attention Deficit Disorder, see also ADHD |
| 14:27.25 | ibot | brlcad: okay |
| 14:27.55 | sporty | brlcad: don't understand you, i think you need to travel to Amsterdam like that guy at the Eurotrip |
| 14:28.04 | sporty | i mean with Nicon |
| 14:28.54 | sporty | ah!.. btw, can yo call some real uses of brl-cad? |
| 14:29.02 | brlcad | all I said is that the depeche mode song is a little hyperactive .. attention defeating .. |
| 14:29.21 | brlcad | i'd love to go to amsterdam |
| 14:29.39 | brlcad | oof, lots of uses |
| 14:29.53 | sporty | i mean, does e.g. army uses it as modeler of complicated topologies, do they try to "trace" lasers of new weapons > :) |
| 14:30.17 | brlcad | read the second paragraph -- http://brlcad.org/d/about |
| 14:31.09 | brlcad | I don't think that we've been used for any laser work, at least not directly, though I could be wrong |
| 14:31.29 | clock_ | brlcad: Photographic is an excellent one! |
| 14:31.46 | claymore | modeled a shark with a frickin lazerbeam on its head.... |
| 14:32.09 | sporty | hyperactive? but this is exactly what fiils me with energy... You know, i have such an old radio as those from 50th, with two 20-inch dynamics and lamps as amplifiers - so this song throw the masses of air in my apartment! |
| 14:32.10 | brlcad | one of the primary uses is to represent a given military asset (like a tank) and then the analysis codes (which are not part of BRL-CAD) then use BRL-CAD's ray trace library to query the geometry |
| 14:32.54 | brlcad | sporty: I can imagine .. just a bit much for 9am, no matter how giddy I am :) |
| 14:33.01 | sporty | claymore: i think you did it for Dr. Evil :) |
| 14:33.27 | brlcad | sporty: maybe he *IS* Dr. Evil.... |
| 14:33.45 | brlcad | puts pinky to his lip .. O.o |
| 14:34.07 | sporty | How abou "Always on my mind" of pet shop boys? |
| 14:34.53 | brlcad | heh, another 'old school' |
| 14:34.58 | brlcad | so 80's |
| 14:35.15 | claymore | likes his XSi... the D90 just didn't feel right. The 720pHD video was a tempting feature though..... |
| 14:35.56 | brlcad | loves how it feels :) |
| 14:36.10 | brlcad | looking forward to trying out the video feature |
| 14:36.22 | claymore | ...well i had a few lenses also, so that swayed me a bit ;) |
| 14:36.34 | claymore | but I hear the D90 rocks. |
| 14:36.53 | brlcad | and the high-speed SSD .. curious how fast full raw burst will go |
| 14:37.55 | claymore | my mother inlaw has the Rebel tx (aka 2+ years old now) and it will put down close to 10 shots a second in full raw. (JPEG is actually slower...) |
| 14:38.29 | claymore | our xsi clocks in at a bit slower than that, but then again its taking a 12mp image vice a 10mp of the xt |
| 14:38.40 | sporty | brlcad: oh... i'm... oh! |
| 14:38.41 | brlcad | i got a nice 15-105 to accompany my 50 and a tele |
| 14:38.54 | ``Erik | detonates |
| 14:39.30 | ``Erik | my fanciest camera is built into my laptop :( |
| 14:40.19 | claymore | early xmas gift brlcad? |
| 14:40.43 | sporty | i have no camera at all... i'm taking pictures of random ladies in my head, i can do about thouthand shots a minute! |
| 14:40.44 | archivist | wants a Canon body to go with lenses |
| 14:42.20 | ``Erik | hum, pg got noted on smacksnot |
| 14:44.37 | brlcad | claymore: I've had a new camera on my todo for about 2 years -- new place was just a good timing/excuse to get it |
| 14:45.33 | brlcad | and seeing the d90 fix the issues I had with the d50 and d40x .. it was the money shot |
| 14:46.03 | brlcad | sporty: isn't that called "browsing pr0n"? |
| 14:46.27 | sporty | "browsing pr0n" - what is it? |
| 14:46.39 | brlcad | wow, not on irc much are ya? :) |
| 14:47.01 | brlcad | ~pr0n |
| 14:47.22 | brlcad | porn ;) |
| 14:47.24 | sporty | "Productive Radical Zero(0)-No", what exactly means :Yes:? Or what? |
| 14:47.44 | sporty | brlcad: rather erotiqua |
| 14:49.56 | sporty | Does anyone played/ participated in rally as e.g. rally on cars? |
| 14:56.41 | brlcad | i'm sure 'someone' but apparently nobody here ;) |
| 14:57.05 | ``Erik | jay-lo does it, sorta, I think |
| 14:57.24 | ``Erik | I bought the car and am too scared to drive it, heh :D |
| 15:04.20 | sporty | ок, but i'm playing CMRR 2005 |
| 15:05.35 | sporty | ``Erik: why don't you try your car at remote icy spots? |
| 15:06.17 | sporty | we have about -55 -65 fahrenheit right now... |
| 15:06.26 | sporty | coldy... |
| 15:11.02 | sporty | What does "signal-processing" mean? signal-treatment or signal-processing? Can i say "it can produce images and signals" ?? |
| 15:12.22 | sporty | or does it "calculates" it? What is a suitable synonim for word "processing" in this case? |
| 15:14.57 | clock_ | manipulation maybe |
| 15:15.04 | sporty | ok |
| 15:15.27 | sporty | manipulation or treatment |
| 15:23.17 | brlcad | it means we have a variety of tools that will take a given data stream (1D, 2D, whatever) and perform operations on that (signal) data -- high pass filter, low pass filter, combine, blur, etc |
| 15:37.37 | sporty | brlcad: it means e.g. transparecy and reflectivity - i.e. analisys of e.g. airplane shape on the respective amount of reflected waves (of whatever spectrum) |
| 15:37.58 | sporty | brlcad: or is it banned in foss edition? |
| 15:38.12 | sporty | brlcad: my government wants to know! |
| 16:14.35 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 16:20.02 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33268 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libtclcad/ged_obj.c tclscripts/lib/Ged.tcl): Added local2base command to libtclcad's ged object and update cadwidgets:Ged |
| 16:27.34 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@75-119-237-223.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 16:38.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33269 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Activate wizard plugins and the primitive creation buttons in Archer. |
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| 17:16.27 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@89.180.146.57) | |
| 17:35.36 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.198) | |
| 17:35.58 | sporty | brlcad: are you a part of brl-cad team? |
| 17:36.40 | sporty | ...(or just a sophisticated djedaj of programming)? |
| 17:37.13 | sporty | if yes, tell me if you can catch the file (10 kb.) thru IM |
| 17:38.16 | sporty | starseeker: so? have you thrown a look to files? btw, i guess i've forgot your e-mail. Mine is ilyaglkn@gmail.com |
| 17:54.09 | sporty | ok, i have a chance to sleep at a bench - so i switch off my thinkpad r-series and will be off line few hours. Just put a wall st. journal as a blanket. Ah! had to sell my bentley - and have to sleep on a bench in a university! What a times. |
| 17:54.58 | claymore | stares at that last post..... blink.... blink.... |
| 18:21.18 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@206-248-156-251.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 18:26.11 | brlcad | english is a fickle beast at times |
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| 18:33.13 | starseeker | sporty: Um. Are these translations or creation of new MGED man pages? |
| 18:33.58 | claymore | brlcad: was more shocked at the content of the post.... |
| 18:38.37 | brlcad | starseeker: tab-completion :) |
| 18:39.17 | brlcad | claymore: oh, that didn't even seem odd to me for some reason :) |
| 18:39.43 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah, right |
| 18:40.00 | brlcad | i sent him an e-mail |
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| 19:38.52 | IriX64 | regards :) |
| 19:41.57 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/kWUfxp42.html <----- whats the story here, is this me or you? |
| 19:46.56 | IriX64 | you're probably wondering how i got it to install anyway, i reworked make so it has a -i switch, if -i is set it ignores errors from subprocesses and keeps on trucking :) |
| 19:48.23 | IriX64 | ill provide source if you want it, the binaries are unique to my system. |
| 19:52.12 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/XArEqM89.html <--- make -i install |
| 19:56.35 | IriX64 | tried to upload the binaries to hobbes.nmsu 3 times, lost connection every time, gave up in disgust :( |
| 20:03.20 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/d68nFM87.html <---- runtime happiness :) |
| 20:04.30 | IriX64 | Xwin32 is happy talking to mged :) |
| 20:05.01 | IriX64 | thanks for letting me ramble brlcad |
| 20:06.43 | IriX64 | still crashes when i do a file->open |
| 20:06.49 | IriX64 | from the gui |
| 20:09.08 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/gCPzNm99.html <---- this is the crash |
| 20:12.02 | IriX64 | bonus ogl attaches too |
| 20:12.30 | IriX64 | you guys write good code |
| 20:25.50 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/CdYT5317.html <----- by the way this was missing from configure.ac |
| 20:48.24 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/lEjS1X94.html <----- what my systems doing right now :) |
| 20:52.21 | IriX64 | for now i hard coded -lxft and -lxss into configure.ac till i can find a way of testing for them |
| 21:08.26 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/2Qk7W140.html <--- a clean starting from autogen, --enable-everything run, didn't trap once :) |
| 21:10.48 | IriX64 | tkhtml3 install thing is still there though :( |
| 21:20.15 | IriX64 | hah forced the issue and ive got a fresh build of brlcad |
| 21:30.01 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 21:30.05 | *** kick/#brlcad [IriX64!n=sean@bz.bzflag.bz] by brlcad (ugh, the channel rules haven't changed -- don't spew pastes and chatter (for nearly two hours!) if nobody is engaging in the discussion) | |
| 21:31.50 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:31.59 | IriX64 | msg received |
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| 23:02.48 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:13.22 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
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| 01:22.52 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/aYKzB432.html <----- this fixed myy libcursor problem :) |
| 01:26.04 | brlcad | IriX64: *what* fixed your libcursor problem? |
| 01:26.18 | IriX64 | the -L stuff i added |
| 01:26.43 | IriX64 | might not be what you and your people want but its a good patch |
| 01:28.18 | brlcad | then you should just say that instead of pastebinning the entire file without any hint as to what you did or why you did it |
| 01:28.36 | IriX64 | forgive, i was ecited |
| 01:28.37 | brlcad | otherwise you're just wasting people's time |
| 01:28.41 | IriX64 | excited too |
| 01:29.05 | brlcad | well, you were so excited that the fix isn't even in the link that you pasted |
| 01:29.36 | brlcad | more case in point towards why you should just share the minimum when you think you have to "fix" something |
| 01:30.05 | IriX64 | okay |
| 01:30.08 | brlcad | i highly doubt that "-L/${top_builddir}/src/o" fixed anything |
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| 01:31.02 | IriX64 | thats supposed to read -L${top_builddir}/src/other/libtermlib -llibtermlib |
| 01:31.35 | brlcad | I see you're still making random edits too -- TERMLIB_LIBS isn't defined anywhere and the -L you needed should have come from CURSOR_LIBS |
| 01:32.12 | brlcad | so you broke it and fixed it, congrats |
| 01:32.47 | IriX64 | well i am trying |
| 01:33.32 | ``Erik | diffs |
| 01:33.38 | ``Erik | we like diffs, not files |
| 01:33.56 | IriX64 | never played with diff ``Erik |
| 01:34.01 | ``Erik | well, start |
| 01:34.06 | ``Erik | svn diff |
| 01:34.08 | ``Erik | diff -u |
| 01:34.14 | IriX64 | where do they be sent to? |
| 01:34.15 | brlcad | we have had this talk before -- there are more constructive ways you could/should contribute |
| 01:34.18 | IriX64 | never mind |
| 01:34.33 | IriX64 | got it |
| 01:34.52 | ``Erik | if you just dump an entire file into a url, we'll probably ignore it |
| 01:34.58 | ``Erik | be succint, minimal |
| 01:35.08 | ``Erik | diff is a good way to do that |
| 01:35.18 | IriX64 | ill practice it |
| 01:35.24 | IriX64 | err study it first |
| 01:35.33 | ``Erik | in the unix world, diff and patch are the yin and the yang |
| 01:35.40 | IriX64 | ha ok |
| 01:36.05 | IriX64 | ill clean up my act |
| 01:36.16 | ``Erik | if you need help with those, let us know, I knwo I'd be willing to spend some time, but grok that it's critical, aight? :) |
| 01:36.30 | IriX64 | right :) |
| 01:36.55 | ``Erik | brlcad, I had something I wanted to talk to you about, btu I forgot |
| 01:36.58 | ``Erik | like a jr hacker, uh |
| 01:37.00 | ``Erik | ohyeah |
| 01:37.06 | ``Erik | version on mged |
| 01:37.18 | brlcad | que? |
| 01:37.26 | ``Erik | is that ok? can a jr hacker implement a -v on mged? |
| 01:37.31 | brlcad | oh |
| 01:37.44 | ``Erik | since mged is our primary binary exposure for most folk |
| 01:37.45 | brlcad | sure |
| 01:38.10 | ``Erik | and I coulda hacked it out in under an hour, but I feel like it'd be a valuable lesson to a new developer |
| 01:38.32 | brlcad | heh, "under an hour"? I'd hope so.. |
| 01:38.44 | ``Erik | yeah, well, 5 minutes sounded arrogant in my head |
| 01:40.15 | brlcad | case 'v': bu_log("%s\n", brlcad_ident("MGED R|_|L3Z! lol.")); break; |
| 01:41.38 | brlcad | so who they be? |
| 01:41.50 | ``Erik | well, but do we want to follow the rt example of including all dependant libraries? |
| 01:42.21 | ``Erik | I think maybe irix would be happy doing a real code submission opposed to build weirdness |
| 01:42.33 | brlcad | doesn't matter to me, so long as the version isn't hard-coded into a source file |
| 01:44.24 | brlcad | it does already set the version to the 'version' variable iirc |
| 01:44.41 | ``Erik | there is no -V or -v option, though |
| 01:44.59 | brlcad | yeah, mged -c test.g set version |
| 01:45.35 | ``Erik | I did an "mged -v" expecting to see "7.13.0", and it did not do that |
| 01:46.11 | ``Erik | given that 99% of users will assume 'mged' is "THE BINARY", ... yeah |
| 01:46.18 | ``Erik | know what I mean, vern? |
| 01:48.03 | brlcad | sure |
| 01:48.10 | brlcad | make sense |
| 01:48.59 | brlcad | only thing worth noting, though, is I don't think we have a single command that uses -v for version info .. the handful that use it treat is as a verbosity flag |
| 01:49.11 | brlcad | not reason to not do it, but just a sideline |
| 01:49.15 | ``Erik | hrm, would -V be better? |
| 01:50.10 | ``Erik | I was recently disappointed with how poor our versioning system was, when it noted, it did it well... but it was hard to invoke |
| 01:50.39 | brlcad | verbose should probably be -V, then version on -v |
| 01:50.44 | brlcad | along with long opts |
| 01:50.52 | ``Erik | we don't do long opts, do we? |
| 01:50.54 | brlcad | but that's a task for another day/time/person/place |
| 01:52.42 | brlcad | still have to implement bu_getopt_long |
| 01:52.57 | ``Erik | fightes the portability issue heh |
| 02:02.22 | ``Erik | fbed requires curses? has bob handled this? |
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| 02:18.10 | ``Erik | gentoo is for ricers |
| 02:23.09 | brlcad | fbed hasn't been ported |
| 02:23.22 | brlcad | none of the termio/curses apps |
| 02:41.47 | IriX64 | whats wrong with the Help->about window in the gui ? |
| 02:42.55 | IriX64 | or reading the freaking documentation and see what version you're *trying to use :) |
| 02:43.16 | brlcad | nothing, that's just a different feature |
| 02:43.31 | brlcad | what's wrong with doing cad with pen and paper? .. nothing. |
| 02:43.49 | brlcad | just some expect things in different ways, -v for versioning being one of them |
| 02:43.54 | IriX64 | mged --about |
| 02:45.51 | brlcad | we go for it |
| 02:46.01 | IriX64 | :) |
| 02:46.14 | brlcad | that's no less work than -v |
| 02:46.25 | IriX64 | could be easier actually |
| 02:47.02 | brlcad | nope |
| 02:47.13 | IriX64 | there currently are no -- switches on mged tho |
| 02:47.26 | brlcad | which is exactly why I said nope |
| 02:47.31 | brlcad | there's a reason for that |
| 02:47.32 | IriX64 | ah |
| 02:49.34 | IriX64 | hahh libcursor.dll.a |
| 02:52.46 | IriX64 | where do my diffs go when i send them tho, would hate to bugger anybodys work but my own. |
| 02:56.32 | brlcad | depends entirely what you are diffing |
| 02:56.35 | brlcad | and why |
| 02:57.00 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/VDCeHq87.html <---- you expect me to learn all this in a day :) |
| 02:57.01 | brlcad | pastebin to see if they're useful, then someone can review |
| 02:57.19 | brlcad | diffs shouldn't be quick fixes -- they should be proper mods that work for everyone |
| 02:57.30 | IriX64 | ahh ok but still if thats your code tree, i could screw up really bad |
| 03:01.50 | brlcad | it doesn't magically get applied |
| 03:01.59 | brlcad | it's applied after being reviewed |
| 03:02.17 | brlcad | just don't wast folks time with patches you *know* can't be applied |
| 03:02.27 | IriX64 | so its just a storage space with no chance of buggering anybody? |
| 03:03.25 | IriX64 | ill try to learn how to use, can i practice or is there a url i can practice on? |
| 03:04.09 | Ralith | practice what? |
| 03:04.17 | IriX64 | using diff |
| 03:04.32 | Ralith | diff is a program you use on your computer to get a computer-readable list of changes |
| 03:04.46 | IriX64 | i readily admit i know sfa about it |
| 03:04.51 | Ralith | if you're using svn |
| 03:04.52 | Ralith | which you are |
| 03:05.05 | Ralith | just go to the brl-cad root dir and do svn diff > somefile.diff |
| 03:05.23 | brlcad | IriX64: no, you're not expected to learn it all in a day .. but just because the tool has a lot of options doesn't mean you need them all either |
| 03:05.43 | brlcad | I highly doubt you know all of the options to bash, yet you use it every day via cygwin |
| 03:05.49 | IriX64 | thanks to both |
| 03:05.52 | brlcad | follow this: http://www.kegel.com/academy/opensource.html |
| 03:05.57 | IriX64 | true brlcad |
| 03:06.38 | IriX64 | bookmarked, thanks i will peruse it |
| 03:07.14 | brlcad | it'll take all of a half hour to read and follow at best, and should explain everything |
| 03:07.23 | IriX64 | thanks |
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| 05:31.35 | starseeker | ``Erik: "gentoo is for ricers" - them's fight'in words |
| 05:31.45 | Ralith | true, though |
| 05:31.46 | Ralith | :> |
| 05:32.09 | louipc | yep |
| 05:32.13 | starseeker | prefers "gentoo is for people who compile lots of random crap so obscure it has no package in any Linux distro" |
| 05:32.41 | starseeker | Linux From Scratch is for ricers :-) |
| 05:34.04 | louipc | well it's not so bad if you update rarely |
| 05:34.24 | starseeker | What, gentoo? |
| 05:34.30 | louipc | yea |
| 05:34.56 | starseeker | updates every few days when he's staying "current", otherwise every few months |
| 05:34.58 | louipc | or any source based distro really |
| 05:35.58 | louipc | starseeker: you should try arch ;) |
| 05:36.06 | starseeker | :-) |
| 05:36.40 | starseeker | did use Debian for a while, then got tired of tracking down -dev add-ons to packages so he could compile obscure mathematical stuff |
| 05:37.13 | starseeker | would probably consider Ubuntu today if he were starting over in distro choice |
| 05:37.38 | louipc | headers are included in arch |
| 05:37.45 | starseeker | Still, the gentoo forums are a truly awesome resource |
| 05:38.23 | louipc | how's the wiki doing nowadays? |
| 05:38.25 | starseeker | louipc: you use arch? |
| 05:38.32 | louipc | yep |
| 05:38.40 | starseeker | louipc: The gentoo wiki? good question |
| 05:38.43 | starseeker | checks |
| 05:38.54 | louipc | they were rebuilding it yeah? |
| 05:39.24 | starseeker | yep |
| 05:39.31 | starseeker | looks like they're still trying to |
| 05:40.06 | louipc | cool |
| 05:40.10 | starseeker | still thinks it's kind of unbelievable that their database had no backups and went down the crapper |
| 05:40.31 | louipc | heh heh |
| 05:40.39 | louipc | I'm not too surprised |
| 05:41.48 | louipc | I thought they lost it because the company that was hosting them was locked out of the data centre |
| 05:41.54 | starseeker | is worried that without the former pages as the core a "rewrite" will end up losing a lot |
| 05:41.59 | starseeker | louipc: right |
| 05:42.03 | louipc | they just didn't have off-site backups |
| 05:42.21 | starseeker | which I find surprising for such a major company resource |
| 05:42.26 | starseeker | er distro resource |
| 05:42.31 | louipc | yea |
| 05:42.41 | Ralith | how did that happen? |
| 05:42.47 | Ralith | also how does something that major not get backed up? |
| 05:43.08 | louipc | lack of resources? |
| 05:43.32 | starseeker | 's best guess is it was either unofficial or "pseudo-ficial", and thus not part of the distribution's failsafe mechanisms for websites |
| 05:44.08 | louipc | yea possibly |
| 05:44.26 | starseeker | Even the Google cache or archive.org's copy would have been a place to start though, assuming they had made them |
| 05:44.34 | starseeker | saw at least a few pages in Google cache |
| 05:45.49 | starseeker | They seem to have opted for a complete redo, which is dangerous because it throws away all the momentum built up (plus people will have to either re-learn how to do stuff or dig up a copy of the old page as a starting point, both potentially time consuming |
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| 07:47.54 | sporty | starseeker: so? |
| 07:48.19 | sporty | starseeker: was it yours mail box i've sent my email to? |
| 07:48.59 | sporty | starseeker: SiriusSnickersMars@candy.com , right? |
| 07:49.51 | sporty | or SeriuosSnickersMars@choc.cy |
| 07:50.14 | sporty | ah i guess you sleep... |
| 08:15.07 | sporty | starseeker: i need to know e.g. if i can use <pre></pre> tags in .xml |
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| 08:24.00 | sporty | Can "em" command help me to save regions as shells of 3D-bodies? |
| 08:24.35 | Ralith | sporty: shells of 3D bodies? |
| 08:24.48 | sporty | Can i save pipe as a shell - what if i want to mesh it then and assign a thickness? |
| 08:25.20 | sporty | Ralith: yes, exactly for FEM FEA - analizes. This feature exists in ANSYS.com |
| 08:25.29 | sporty | Why do i need this? |
| 08:25.49 | Ralith | you want to export a mesh? |
| 08:25.59 | Ralith | trimesh, that is |
| 08:26.01 | sporty | shells tremendously reduce CPU time needed for calculations |
| 08:26.51 | sporty | Ralith: well, i can mesh it with another program as e.g. geuz.org/gmsh/ - i want to export this shells as e.g. IGES or Ideas or something |
| 08:27.08 | sporty | trimesh ? I don't know this command |
| 08:27.22 | Ralith | that is not a command |
| 08:27.24 | Ralith | it is a noun |
| 08:27.26 | sporty | ok, will see |
| 08:27.35 | Ralith | so you want to export surfaces? |
| 08:28.00 | sporty | Ralith: yes, well, as an option to all |
| 08:28.04 | Ralith | there is a g-iges program which is not part of mged but is part of the greater brl-cad suite |
| 08:28.14 | sporty | ok |
| 08:28.19 | Ralith | I'm not sure how well it works or how to use it, but it probably does what you want. |
| 08:28.32 | sporty | Ralith: and itlies in /usr/share/brlcad ?? |
| 08:28.46 | Ralith | that would depend on your installation |
| 08:29.04 | Ralith | if you installed brl-cad to /usr/share/brlcad, the binary would be at /usr/share/brlcad/bin/g-iges |
| 08:29.16 | sporty | ok, right |
| 08:29.52 | Ralith | run it without arguments for help |
| 08:29.55 | sporty | so how about to export the middle of the pipe's thickness as a shell? I need trimesh? |
| 08:29.58 | sporty | ~trimesh |
| 08:30.15 | Ralith | what do you mean by "the middle of the pipe's thickness"? |
| 08:30.23 | sporty | ok, not right now - i will have checked this |
| 08:31.20 | sporty | i meant its wall's thickness - i would like to export pipe in describing of a shell or as a mesh |
| 08:31.40 | sporty | Ralith: ok, don't think about it now - i only study brlcad |
| 08:34.13 | Ralith | If you've modeled a hollow pipe, my guess is that exporting surfaces will give you two concentric cylendrical surfaces, one for the inside, one for the outside. |
| 08:44.46 | sporty | Ralith: ok... I mean another capability then. I need a "center" of the wall to create a surface and save it as still a "vector" graphics - or save it as a mesh (with relatively little characteristic length to prevent singularities in fem-analysis) |
| 08:46.18 | Ralith | a center? |
| 08:46.37 | Ralith | maybe you should just experiment with g-iges and see if it gets you what you need |
| 08:46.46 | Ralith | I'm having trouble understanding you |
| 08:47.17 | sporty | Ralith: a "middle" of the wall produces a shell of a hollow pipe, then i assign a thickness of the wall and have a pipe, made of shell finite elements. |
| 08:48.21 | sporty | Ralith: yes, i have not tried g-iges yet. I will've tried it. But i'm trying me english human language then :) |
| 08:48.25 | sporty | *my |
| 08:50.14 | Ralith | I'm not really familiar with it, but I thought finite element analysis needed a mesh |
| 08:54.35 | sporty | Ralith: it need a "smart" mesh to avoid faults - and saving "as shell" is smart - if you want to try relatively "rough" meshes and then more "accurate" ones. Or you might want a rough mesh at the centers (longitudinal) and accurate at the ends of a pipe. |
| 08:56.12 | sporty | well, i just fill xml from mged_cmd_index.html - and wanted to know a bit more, so don't, so don't try to understand what's on my mind |
| 08:58.36 | sporty | Ralith: do you know starseeker's email? |
| 08:58.46 | Ralith | afraid not |
| 08:58.49 | Ralith | it's probably not too hard to find |
| 08:58.59 | sporty | i send letters - and folks telll me who i am |
| 08:59.19 | sporty | Ralith: you mean Author's page? |
| 08:59.22 | Ralith | check the sourceforge developers list; that might have a way to contact him |
| 09:00.35 | sporty | my days' megabytes of internet equals one ise cream or just 0.3 usd... I have an agreement with mommy to stay far from sourceforge sites at a daylight :) |
| 09:00.52 | Ralith | heh |
| 09:01.03 | Ralith | price-per-mb does suck. |
| 09:01.12 | Ralith | brl-cad can probably do what you need; it was made for analysis in something like that vein, after all. |
| 09:01.22 | sporty | ...but i have a trick: java -jar $HOME/toonel.jar |
| 09:01.22 | Ralith | I'm not the best reference on it, though |
| 09:01.27 | Ralith | ? |
| 09:01.40 | sporty | What ?? |
| 09:01.48 | Ralith | w/e |
| 09:01.56 | Ralith | good luck contacting starseeker |
| 09:01.57 | sporty | using proxy for internet |
| 09:02.02 | Ralith | he'll probably be around later |
| 09:02.03 | sporty | ok |
| 09:02.20 | sporty | i know - but i will be offline |
| 09:03.58 | sporty | sudo standupandgo --clean=flat -Right now |
| 09:04.46 | Ralith | try starseeker@users.sourceforge.net |
| 09:04.55 | sporty | ok |
| 09:04.55 | Ralith | no idea if it'll get to him via that, but better than nothing |
| 09:06.23 | sporty | Ralith: maybe you know it: Can i use <pre></pre> tags in xml? |
| 09:06.42 | Ralith | honestly I have no idea |
| 09:06.45 | Ralith | try it and see? |
| 09:07.13 | Ralith | it depends a lot on what *kind* of xml (what you're doing with it), but even if you provided details I just don't know enough to tell you. |
| 09:07.48 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 09:08.37 | sporty | Ralith: i can not preview it on my local computer - se la we ;) |
| 09:09.30 | sporty | xml files of enlarged command reference of brlcad |
| 09:10.22 | sporty | i see it as text with tags, i can not "plug" openoffice to jre, i can not download too much from internet |
| 09:11.14 | Ralith | sorry, can't help |
| 09:13.01 | sporty | Ralith: why are you behind pc this time? it's probably night there where you are? Here where i am it is an end of a cold-cold day... |
| 09:14.29 | Ralith | why not? |
| 09:14.43 | clock_ | sporty: it's also pretty cold here |
| 09:16.51 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 09:35.55 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.129) | |
| 09:36.14 | sporty | sudo cleancarpet -! -@ -# -$ -% now... oh my... |
| 10:57.02 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.129) | |
| 11:07.26 | sporty | my new connection goes offline sometimes... |
| 11:07.39 | sporty | starseeker: are you here right now? |
| 11:17.46 | sporty | i've not used <pre></pre> tags, but there were random <para></para> as paragraphs... |
| 11:19.36 | sporty | starseeker: edit few commands on rus as final variant with that fields <refentry id="..."> |
| 11:23.31 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 11:26.13 | sporty | elite01: hello! |
| 11:26.28 | sporty | elite01: is it a morning already? |
| 11:26.47 | elite01 | sure |
| 11:26.50 | elite01 | hi there :) |
| 11:27.01 | sporty | and we have a dinner |
| 11:27.01 | elite01 | 12:27 local time |
| 11:27.22 | sporty | ah... you're in Europe? |
| 11:27.38 | elite01 | yeah |
| 11:27.51 | sporty | Come on! you're in east europe, man! |
| 11:28.06 | sporty | What are you doing there? |
| 11:28.16 | elite01 | eh, i'm in germany |
| 11:28.29 | sporty | elite01: what languages except english do you know? |
| 11:28.40 | elite01 | german, and a little french |
| 11:29.51 | elite01 | and you? |
| 11:30.01 | sporty | i have most of brlcad's commands as separate xml files, prepared for translation to number of languages - can you instead of e.g. "Provides a delay of the specified time before the next command will be processed." |
| 11:30.27 | sporty | i know only my native, english, and study french grammar |
| 11:30.43 | elite01 | ah, want me to translate stuff to german? |
| 11:31.04 | sporty | i mean you can edit it in plain text editor - all the text is already pasted at the place |
| 11:31.31 | sporty | elite01: not really - just *some* commands to boost humans to do it |
| 11:31.46 | elite01 | no problem |
| 11:31.58 | sporty | like in, make, quit, delay and those non-complicated |
| 11:33.00 | elite01 | yeah, i'll get on it when i have some time |
| 11:33.03 | elite01 | where are the xml files? |
| 11:33.12 | sporty | elite01: when starseeker will have edited my files I'd sent him properly - i will send you some commands. I think it's about a hour to spend to almost all commands |
| 11:33.53 | elite01 | sounds ok |
| 11:33.59 | elite01 | i have to go in a short while |
| 11:34.12 | sporty | elite01: later, when starseeker's mom will have given him butterbread as a dinner |
| 11:34.17 | sporty | elite01: ok |
| 11:36.10 | sporty | un garçon el tends to la femmé |
| 11:38.10 | archivist | wonders if the web structure for languages will be clean like mysql |
| 11:39.58 | archivist | note placement of version and language code http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.1/en/rename-database.html |
| 11:41.36 | archivist | the page name retains english regardless of language |
| 11:48.43 | sporty | archivist: ok, i just try to study it by means of attempts and mistakes. |
| 11:49.26 | sporty | archivist: is it a big web-page (in kilobytes)? |
| 11:50.23 | archivist | individual pages are not too large, but there are lots of them |
| 11:55.56 | sporty | archivist: i mean this page you've called - my traffic is limited! |
| 11:57.06 | archivist | not big at all |
| 11:57.42 | archivist | and that particular page has a link to japanese version |
| 12:13.16 | *** join/#brlcad gentoo_iron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 12:24.16 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 12:25.05 | IriX64 | louipc, i tried -diff, it did the whole bloody tree |
| 12:25.43 | IriX64 | do you have to say brlcad/src/other/libtermlib for instance? |
| 12:48.06 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.192) | |
| 12:48.35 | sporty | *connection goes offline sometimes* |
| 12:57.36 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/VFVPyY15.html <--- for interests sake :) |
| 12:58.22 | sporty | interests in what? |
| 13:16.57 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 13:35.45 | sporty | http://rafb.net/p/VFVPyY15.html <-- Who is Cassandra? Mrs. Irix64? Or you sister? Is she cute? Are her shapes resilient and beauty? |
| 13:36.02 | sporty | *your |
| 13:55.16 | sporty | "developer command" - like what, quickly! Is it like "commands of the developers of ..." or it is jst "commands (to be used) to develop images"? |
| 13:56.35 | sporty | i've questions of interest, you've got answers - let's have lots of fun, dudes |
| 13:58.02 | sporty | celebrates that fact that he've seen a *busy* day of another busy humans |
| 13:58.12 | sporty | *he's |
| 14:25.29 | sporty | i guess i'm offline again |
| 14:26.53 | sporty | strange... TV says people've started to eat each other due to the crisis |
| 14:27.37 | sporty | we, dudes of brlcad, must be robust - and eat our wifes instead of each other! |
| 14:27.45 | sporty | hello? |
| 14:28.29 | sporty | Bbbbbbbbwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaa-hhhhh-aaaaaaaaa-hhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!! |
| 14:32.04 | sporty | we can eat youkonbob... ;) i guess ours bearings can be Alaska or north Canada for this sake |
| 14:36.08 | sporty | Or e.g. PrezKennedy - he's old and not tasty i think - let's find some amazonia's women then! By means of his charizmata (i mean a gift of grace)... Uh i want into the eating-house... CIA-6: I want to sell my government for few pounds of potatos. What secrets do you want to know? Are you related to the CIA or FBI |
| 14:37.46 | sporty | People: tell me something! (But i gues, at *their* morning they will surely do!) |
| 14:39.21 | sporty | PrezKennedy: i still want to marry one of your daughter! |
| 14:41.36 | sporty | laptopheads and laptoplidcloses and iternetacessswitchesoffs and lots of superposition things happens at once. |
| 14:43.08 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 14:43.58 | PrezKennedy | shoots sporty full of tranquilizer darts |
| 14:44.33 | sporty | my as5, my beautiful as5 laptop is ruined! |
| 14:44.43 | sporty | PrezKennedy: You wil pay for it! |
| 14:44.56 | sporty | PrezKennedy: my rockets are at the Cuba!!! |
| 14:45.07 | claymore | 's eyes hurt after following this channel for a bit to long this morning.... |
| 14:45.30 | sporty | PrezKennedy: Immediately, tell me your location to die as the noble gentlemen! |
| 14:46.34 | sporty | kills PrezKennedy and marry both of his daughters at once. Happy End! |
| 14:47.45 | sporty | *marries |
| 14:51.32 | sporty | (Two young beautiful adies lick sporty's waunds, sporty feels good, sporty's a sporty!) |
| 14:52.06 | sporty | ok, going to see TV since the channel is dead. |
| 14:52.24 | sporty | uh! almost has gone to see TV! |
| 14:52.34 | claymore | There is 'Off-topic' and then there is *Off-Topic!' ;) |
| 14:53.07 | sporty | like #brlcad*Off-Topic ? |
| 14:53.22 | PrezKennedy | or #brlcad-offthewalls |
| 14:53.45 | claymore | Just saying that only certain Off-Topic topics will get replied to. |
| 14:54.05 | PrezKennedy | like hot chicks |
| 14:54.44 | sporty | ok, so is it morning there where you are? |
| 14:54.54 | claymore | sure is. |
| 14:56.49 | sporty | sitting here, where i am and loking there, where you are through the prism of the nets - i do not understand is it a morning or is it an evening like here where i am and loking there, where you are - and try to write complicated english phrases with no mistakes. |
| 14:59.03 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/ZTVcaf26.html <--- are you interested in warnings like this? |
| 15:01.05 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/N9nCL741.html <--- and this |
| 15:01.18 | sporty | IriX64: wait, i need a proxy for http |
| 15:01.26 | IriX64 | ill go back to skulking :) |
| 15:01.40 | sporty | IriX64: ok |
| 15:04.08 | sporty | IriX64: not really, i'm relatively new to brl-cad. I think you compile something under cygwin environment to launch *nix binaries in win os. Just compile it in linux, that's a way! |
| 15:04.53 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.192) | |
| 15:09.35 | IriX64 | delay.c in libged needs a #include<sys/time.h> |
| 15:50.25 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/xCIk1E40.html <---- this stops the build |
| 15:53.20 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/3fM1wA43.html <--- this too stops the build, am i out of line doing this here or is it welcomed? |
| 16:06.51 | IriX64 | bwish,mged,rttherm,pl-dm,bombardier all require -lXft -lXss to build |
| 16:08.43 | IriX64 | clone.c has a problem with obj_list its defined elsewhere, im changing mine to mged_obj_list and praying it doesn't screw anything up |
| 16:08.48 | IriX64 | in mged dir |
| 16:08.56 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 16:16.13 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-6 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) | |
| 16:17.17 | IriX64 | rtsrv.c tries to reinvent the wheel with a local copy of bu_bomb forgetting to change the names and it blows up at link time |
| 16:28.02 | claymore | ``Erik: Where you at? |
| 17:47.30 | ``Erik | at home, actually, what's up? |
| 17:48.53 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.188) | |
| 17:49.41 | sporty | yukonbob: i havew come with a tablespoon! |
| 17:49.53 | sporty | yukonbob: and it's crisis! |
| 17:50.08 | sporty | yukonbob: just care yourself |
| 18:01.52 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 18:06.56 | *** join/#brlcad louipc_ (n=louipc@69-196-180-29.dsl.teksavvy.com) | |
| 18:38.43 | sporty | channel is dead as never... |
| 18:54.05 | sporty | or my new connection is faulty |
| 18:55.24 | sporty | or it's a busy day, or it's abusy day, or people want some rest when the rest of the week equals to its behinning |
| 18:57.39 | sporty | brlcad: i can use Emacs (i mean i can easily compile it with on offline system) - what are its essental parts, why do "old" programmers like it? |
| 19:00.51 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 19:01.35 | sporty | louipc: have you ever used Emacs? |
| 19:01.57 | louipc | I used to use xemacs a few years ago |
| 19:02.21 | sporty | louipc: what are its essential parts, why do people like it? |
| 19:03.04 | sporty | I mean i'd used full set of MS office - with complicated formulae and so on - and emacs seems too weird by now |
| 19:03.12 | louipc | I think people like it because it's highly configurable with elisp |
| 19:04.17 | sporty | and what does elisp offers? Can i "write down" some formulas as those wth integrals and sums? |
| 19:04.25 | louipc | vi and emacs are also quite efficient at text editing once you learn how to use them |
| 19:04.39 | louipc | you never need to touch the mouse :D |
| 19:05.03 | sporty | ok, i think you mean they're really fast in comparison with those with GUI |
| 19:05.08 | sporty | right! |
| 19:05.10 | louipc | it's just a scripting language, yeah I guess you can do formulae with it |
| 19:05.31 | louipc | I'm not familiar with how to do emacs scripting though |
| 19:06.32 | sporty | ok... i will have compiled it with elisp manuals... i have found slackware 10 dvd - hehe, with sources, hehe |
| 19:06.49 | louipc | well that's what slack is all about hah |
| 19:07.35 | sporty | but it can not handle my new pc :( had to use ubuntu on offline pc - andd have no cheap internet |
| 19:07.48 | louipc | http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/elisp.html |
| 19:07.56 | sporty | ok |
| 19:08.31 | sporty | louipc: don't you know some good tutorial about python programming language? |
| 19:08.57 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 19:09.32 | louipc | hah good question. I've never looked at a tutorial I've only dove right into the code. |
| 19:11.29 | sporty | louipc: ok... i ust need to dove into few books right now - head is reeling ... |
| 19:13.24 | claymore | ``Erik: nadda, you just missed a rare occasion where i eat lunch out... nothing big. ;) |
| 19:15.47 | sporty | claymore: sometimes in the night, when i think it' s arainy day and i'm on my bike - i cry "more, more of the clay" - and scare mrs.sporty... |
| 19:15.58 | sporty | ;) |
| 19:15.58 | sporty | :-X |
| 19:16.06 | sporty | :-/ |
| 19:22.13 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 19:22.21 | claymore | ..... okay.... that's just plain odd. |
| 19:22.48 | sporty | yeah... |
| 19:23.07 | louipc | hahaha |
| 19:29.19 | sporty | What does words "new gui" mean? |
| 19:29.55 | claymore | 'new gui' == 'new Graphical User Interface' |
| 19:31.09 | sporty | claymore: yeah, i have asked with "Graphical User Interface" = "GUI" on my mind... What a new GUI? |
| 19:33.49 | claymore | There is work underway for a new GUI interface in the rt^3/src/g3d directory |
| 19:35.10 | sporty | well, ok, nice answer for that one non-initiated in programming (for me)... Simply into /src/g3d, where src = sources |
| 19:35.42 | sporty | claymore: will it hide a half of a screen? |
| 19:36.35 | sporty | claymore: i want to know, is it hard to "attach" new Qt design to existing foss program? |
| 19:37.18 | sporty | i mean i don't really know how to add it... well i need to strive... but you probably know people who tried to do this |
| 19:37.36 | claymore | define 'qt design' please... |
| 19:38.41 | sporty | uh... that Qt3 or Qt4 - common means of graphical interfaces to programs... ah i do not remember... |
| 19:41.18 | sporty | ...i have compiled such 50-megs tarball - and want to 'modify' some programs (if it will be easy for a non-skilled-non-programmer) |
| 19:41.24 | claymore | are you speaking of "Qt cross platform Application Framework" ? |
| 19:42.00 | sporty | i mean i did it on offline pc, where one mb equals one ice cream in its cost |
| 19:42.13 | sporty | claymore: yes |
| 19:42.35 | sporty | about its free version for non-commercial use |
| 19:43.36 | claymore | sporty: Well, I hadn't looked into that, but I can see that if we were to attempt to use that, there would be a massive amount of person-hours required to rework the existing brl-cad suite to use qt. |
| 19:43.36 | sporty | i want to modify one program (foss) - then do something in a long term... ah i just have an inspiration |
| 19:44.38 | claymore | the new gui, aka, g3d will (probably) not use qt. Developement of the new GUI is not at the top priority quite yet, but it will be eventually. |
| 19:44.41 | sporty | you mean it can't be boundled with qt? i thought it was some kind of a standart |
| 19:45.17 | claymore | I suppose the new GUI *could* use qt, but it would warrent a bit of investigation. |
| 19:45.24 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:45.27 | sporty | g3d - is it a name of a standard? |
| 19:46.43 | alex_joni | http://www.google.ro/search?q=g3d |
| 19:46.54 | claymore | sporty: no, g3d is the nickname for the new GUI that a GSoC student prototyped for BRL-CAD. The code resides in the rt^3/trunk/src/g3d/ |
| 19:46.59 | sporty | well, ok... i'm only about to arrange some commands right now... I just think i will know how to use qt soon... just don't know yet how to bundle it to the code |
| 19:47.53 | sporty | claymore: ok, i will not see into the trunk right now. Just interesting. |
| 19:50.10 | sporty | claymore: how do you think: does starseeker sleep right now? I have no idea if names shall be like 3ptarb1 or i can leave it as 3ptarb--rus |
| 19:50.41 | claymore | sporty: Pretty sure starseeker is at work and just a bit busy. |
| 19:52.01 | sporty | ok, but i'm drinking tea, made of dry apples, dendelion leaves and camomile |
| 19:52.39 | sporty | ...and smoking garlics' stems - i'm vegan... |
| 19:53.14 | claymore | just had Turkey, Roast Beast and Chicken for lunch. :) |
| 19:53.17 | sporty | and save money ...:-$ |
| 19:53.45 | sporty | thinks claymore isn't hurted with a crisis... |
| 19:53.51 | brlcad | sporty: 'brlcad' is me, 'BRL-CAD' is the software -- they're not the same thing (..at least not yet) -- referring to it in lower is cool, e.g., 'brl-cad' |
| 19:54.02 | brlcad | otherwise, you're driving me nuts :) |
| 19:54.13 | sporty | brlcad: it will be the same! |
| 19:54.39 | sporty | brlcad: ok |
| 19:55.48 | sporty | what do you eat when you feel a lack of attention? Don't say you drink coffee! |
| 19:56.27 | claymore | sporty: who are you talking to? |
| 19:57.30 | sporty | Ñо alive humans |
| 19:57.48 | claymore | drinks Mt Dew when needed. |
| 19:57.51 | sporty | you (_pl.) |
| 19:58.02 | sporty | Mt Dew? |
| 19:58.06 | claymore | doesn't like coffee to much. |
| 19:58.27 | claymore | http://www.mountaindew.com/ |
| 19:58.32 | sporty | i like tonic |
| 19:58.50 | claymore | and I be that tonic likes you too! |
| 19:58.58 | claymore | :D |
| 19:59.05 | sporty | claymore: ah, i know this from tv advertisings |
| 19:59.34 | sporty | claymore: i meant shwepps or any tonic, tonic with lemon and so on |
| 20:00.18 | sporty | is it possible to type e.g. 60 words per minute |
| 20:01.06 | claymore | yes. |
| 20:01.14 | sporty | really? |
| 20:01.46 | claymore | its been a while, but i benchmarked myself at ~73 wpm |
| 20:01.55 | sporty | i mean i want it. I'm using "Phonetics" layout for my native... Wow! |
| 20:02.17 | claymore | some people, mostly Data Entry Specialists, have been known to achieve 120+ wpm. |
| 20:02.27 | sporty | holy Key B. ART |
| 20:04.50 | sporty | claymore: i typed fastly on some layouts, too.. But i think if i put my fingers vertically - i could get arthritis with all these words... Using laptop, try to dramatically accelerate it... |
| 20:05.35 | claymore | its a hazard of the occupation, but one I will risk :) |
| 20:06.38 | sporty | claymore: btw, it is good idea to get some hikes in dirty clay - helps to skin and probably adds some microelements beneath the skin |
| 20:07.07 | sporty | *helps for a skin* |
| 20:07.12 | claymore | has kids. I get plenty dirty more often thank I like. |
| 20:09.53 | sporty | claymore: ok, but i would like some trophies along the rivers. I've used to do it on a bicycle. But a bike or a car is good, too. The point is non-angry tyres, which force you to stay in dirty from clay water for longer. aand don't hurt to mother nature too much |
| 20:15.32 | sporty | i like trophies on sake-bearing cars as some stock vehicles. When there is a prudence of fun... There's olways a way to use vehicles with rubber tracks when you really don't want to sit in a swamp... This interest was a first my mature interest in this world - and all i plan right now is related to this or snwboard or even sk8boarding, which attitude seems like too high for a while for my poor, wounded body. |
| 20:20.10 | brlcad | sporty: emacs is a programmable "environment" for just about any purpose with lots of macros and functionality specifically tailored to programming and programming-related tasks |
| 20:20.20 | brlcad | that's why many programmers like it |
| 20:20.40 | brlcad | it has a nasty learning curve, but it's well worth it if coding is a long term endevour |
| 20:21.21 | claymore | ide's >> emacs :D |
| 20:21.23 | claymore | ducks |
| 20:26.02 | sporty | ok, i already try to read elisp tutorial. I ant to know an easy way to handle simple calculations (and save it as text) - and to add complicated formulas as integrals & sums and so on. I need this because i'd used MS products for this earlier. Now i'm about open source - and i hope it will be a bit faster & simply |
| 20:28.31 | sporty | well, i need to sleep... on a bench, in a familiar university, - so as i could scare away mobsters at the darkness... Hard time for young man with non-cheap laptop and contributions to open source... |
| 20:29.04 | sporty | it's crisis... |
| 20:32.45 | *** join/#brlcad gentoo_iron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 20:33.46 | PrezKennedy | vi 4 ever!!! |
| 20:35.17 | brlcad | IriX64: thanks for the adrt build failures -- the rtsrv one, though, isn't an error (it's a compiler setting issue) |
| 20:37.03 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 20:37.55 | IriX64 | welcome, im still fighting fbed :) |
| 20:38.45 | claymore | |
| 20:38.54 | brlcad | g3d is just the presently temporary name for that effort -- it has (several) other names but is still effectively a prototype for the "new gui" effort (responding to backlog comments) |
| 20:39.14 | brlcad | sporty: it will be the same, but not yet |
| 20:39.40 | brlcad | emacs is an ide :P |
| 20:39.45 | brlcad | catches up :) |
| 20:40.05 | sporty | PrezKennedy: i can't not to kiss your daughters' hands and some other territories... Would you mind? |
| 20:41.21 | sporty | brlcad: i hope brl-cad's interface will be very new in wise meaning- it shall not hide half-a-display... |
| 20:41.33 | louipc | :O |
| 20:42.04 | sporty | brlcad: how much commands does brl-cad have? Something like 70 ? |
| 20:42.25 | claymore | just saw a Red Light |
| 20:42.25 | brlcad | if PrezKennedy has daughters, he's sure got a lot of 'splaining to do Lucy |
| 20:42.34 | brlcad | sporty: that is the intent |
| 20:42.53 | brlcad | there are just over 400 commands outside of mged |
| 20:42.54 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64_ (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 20:43.08 | brlcad | about 300-400 useful commands inside of mged |
| 20:43.20 | sporty | brlcad: i meant old mged_cmd_reference |
| 20:43.36 | sporty | there's about 80 commands |
| 20:43.57 | sporty | and binary files in ../bin directory |
| 20:44.28 | brlcad | there should be about 400 in the bin directory for a full-distribution |
| 20:44.30 | brlcad | you on windows? |
| 20:44.54 | brlcad | windows has much less unless it's a cygwin/mingw build |
| 20:45.12 | sporty | brlcad: i mean /html/mged_cmd_index.html - i'm editing it |
| 20:45.36 | brlcad | there are several mged commands that aren't documented in mged_cmd_index.html |
| 20:45.50 | sporty | i have xml files, which are ready to be filled with a number of languages |
| 20:46.09 | sporty | brlcad: like what? |
| 20:46.21 | brlcad | ./html/manuals/mged/mged_cmd_index.html is pretty old |
| 20:46.47 | sporty | "cleanmyapartment -R [-i -g -h -t] now" |
| 20:47.13 | sporty | brlcad: well, i still have not finished it... |
| 20:47.49 | sporty | brlcad: btw, am i right to use "I have" - or shall i use "I has" ? |
| 20:47.57 | brlcad | I have |
| 20:48.19 | brlcad | ah, looks like the command index hasn't been converted to docbook justyet |
| 20:48.33 | sporty | i also think "I" + "use" = "me use" |
| 20:48.33 | brlcad | so carry on! |
| 20:48.55 | sporty | i meant rus variant and then few variants, also |
| 20:49.00 | brlcad | not unless you're a pirate |
| 20:49.22 | sporty | not full, probably, for young students and scolars |
| 20:49.33 | claymore | arg! |
| 20:49.36 | starseeker | Be sure to keep an eye on the sourceforge svn trunk - we have someone adding xml files for MGED commands |
| 20:51.51 | sporty | brlcad: seriously, words in mged_cmd_index are very good, simple and non-complicated. The only sake to add other languages are: 1. for those who is in the scholl - but wants some first fast 'results' 2. for fast start with a program. Things like rt or modelling *do* need at least an english dictionary - and so on |
| 20:52.29 | sporty | starseeker: immediately, tell me your email while i'm trying to get another tea! |
| 20:52.30 | brlcad | sporty: how about for someone that doesn't actually speak any english |
| 20:53.13 | starseeker | sporty: I've seen your email messages, but I can't respond to them yet |
| 20:53.20 | sporty | brlcad: believe me, my friend who stidied german - can handle reading of mged cmd reference |
| 20:53.21 | starseeker | I have other priorities at work right now |
| 20:53.29 | sporty | *friends* |
| 20:53.43 | sporty | starseeker: only one question |
| 20:53.44 | brlcad | IriX64: your sources are out of date, so the errors are no longer valid |
| 20:53.57 | brlcad | remember to try the latest sources when you run into problems |
| 20:54.01 | starseeker | sporty: what's the question? |
| 20:54.27 | brlcad | sporty: your premise is still invalid if they don't have the same background as y ou |
| 20:54.38 | sporty | starseeker: <refentry id="echo--rus"> or <refentry id="echo1"> for russian, and <refentry id="echo--deu"> or <refentry id="echo2"> - for german? |
| 20:54.50 | brlcad | same reason why people translate anything at all -- you certainly don't have to, nobody is going to make you |
| 20:55.04 | brlcad | if you do, much appreciated -- I'm sure others will appreciate the translations too |
| 20:55.59 | sporty | brlcad: believe me, it is not so! People, who're far from pc try to model bikes from American chopper in 3ds max- without a background in windows' file structures. |
| 20:57.04 | brlcad | sporty: I have absolutely no basis to believe anything you say, this is irc :) |
| 20:57.25 | brlcad | still it's bogus |
| 20:57.32 | sporty | brlcad: how about this: "region" = region, "elliptical" = ellipticheskiy, and so on - same words, just their meaning is *same* |
| 20:57.51 | sporty | ok |
| 20:57.57 | brlcad | shouldn't use dashes on the 'id' attributes if we're to be consistent |
| 20:58.11 | brlcad | most elsewhere it uses dots as a separator |
| 20:58.22 | sporty | brlcad: ok then <refentry id="echo1"> and <refentry id="echo2"> |
| 20:58.28 | sporty | ok |
| 20:58.29 | brlcad | dashes where the symbol itself has a dash (like line-width) |
| 20:58.42 | sporty | ok |
| 20:58.45 | brlcad | echo1 and echo2 are horrible id's :) |
| 20:58.53 | brlcad | it should say what it is |
| 20:59.00 | sporty | brlcad: which then? |
| 20:59.35 | starseeker | sporty: For language identification, I think it should use the lang property |
| 20:59.36 | sporty | echo1 =rus, echo2=deutsch, echo3=... |
| 20:59.52 | sporty | starseeker: which field? |
| 20:59.53 | brlcad | e.g., "index.preferred.page.properties", "table.footnote.properties", "body.end.indent", etc |
| 20:59.59 | starseeker | e.g. <refentry lang="ru"> |
| 21:00.14 | sporty | starseeker: at which line? |
| 21:00.51 | starseeker | Uh... what do you mean which line? You're specifying the language of that refentry |
| 21:00.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33270 10/brlcad/trunk/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Activate Archer's wizard menu and primitive edit toolbar. Added commands for editing primitives via the mouse to libtclcad's Ged object. |
| 21:01.10 | sporty | i think i can add it at 5th or 6th line |
| 21:01.25 | starseeker | If you want unique ids for a command's refentry, do something like <refentry id="man.search.ru"> |
| 21:01.28 | sporty | starseeker: ok |
| 21:01.28 | brlcad | lang is xml namespaced too, isn't it? |
| 21:01.33 | brlcad | xml:lang="rt" |
| 21:01.36 | brlcad | er, heh |
| 21:01.39 | brlcad | ru |
| 21:02.03 | starseeker | not in the example here: http://www.docbook.org/tdg/en/html/ch04.html |
| 21:02.04 | sporty | <refentry id='b--rus'> |
| 21:02.06 | sporty | <refmeta> |
| 21:02.06 | sporty | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:02.37 | sporty | to:<refentry id='b--rus'> |
| 21:02.38 | sporty | <refmeta><refentrylang>ru</refentrylang> |
| 21:02.38 | sporty | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:02.58 | sporty | following a link |
| 21:03.06 | starseeker | I would do <refentry id="man.b.r" lang="ru"> |
| 21:03.19 | brlcad | ah, *docbook* has a lang attribute |
| 21:03.22 | brlcad | xml has one too |
| 21:03.25 | starseeker | er |
| 21:03.30 | sporty | starseeker: which is your email? that sm.........@yahoo or Cl...............@gmail ? |
| 21:03.32 | starseeker | I would do <refentry id="man.b.ru" lang="ru"> |
| 21:03.39 | starseeker | either |
| 21:03.47 | sporty | ok |
| 21:04.27 | brlcad | the id's don't mix with the english ones, they replace them -- can't they be/stay the same? |
| 21:04.29 | starseeker | It will be a while before I can refocus on documentation again though |
| 21:05.04 | starseeker | brlcad: Assuming there is no interest in using multiple language elements in a single document anywhere, sure |
| 21:05.06 | sporty | starseeker: i';; send you examples to check withing this hour. Then i will sleep. You can work. It's night in here |
| 21:05.08 | brlcad | which is what's cool about getting someone else to focus on it, just enough to get started ;) |
| 21:05.47 | sporty | ok |
| 21:06.17 | brlcad | just thinking simple is better .. mixing languages could get pretty messy on the build side |
| 21:06.31 | brlcad | unnecessarily messy -- at least on a per-file basis |
| 21:06.41 | starseeker | True |
| 21:07.02 | brlcad | they're supposed to be stashed into language dirs anyways, so having english in a 'ru' dir would be bogus in a way |
| 21:07.37 | sporty | "man.b.ru" lang="ru" - ok, this is a choice. but the rest of the file structure is as old as that search.xml - so... i'm about a final variant |
| 21:08.00 | sporty | starseeker: will wiki engine work with these files "as is"? |
| 21:08.28 | sporty | and: can i use wiki offline? what do i need for this? |
| 21:09.10 | sporty | <refentry id="man.b.ru" lang="ru"> |
| 21:09.25 | starseeker | wiki will not (yet) support these files "as is" |
| 21:09.35 | starseeker | extending it to do so is on my list |
| 21:09.51 | sporty | starseeker: how can i reduce your efforts? gimme a template |
| 21:09.59 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33271 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/libtie/tie_kdtree.h: spot a conflicting type error from irix64, needs to be stdint type |
| 21:10.16 | brlcad | ~sporty++ |
| 21:10.54 | starseeker | sporty: Any of the existing files in brlcad/doc/docbook/system/man1/ |
| 21:11.04 | sporty | starseeker: i can edit already-created files as youu wish. |
| 21:11.12 | starseeker | In fact, there is a file mged_cmd_template.xml |
| 21:11.16 | sporty | starseeker: ok, getting it |
| 21:11.26 | starseeker | but the main benefit for you is to do translations of the existing en files |
| 21:11.34 | starseeker | which are in en |
| 21:11.37 | sporty | starseeker: is this file big (in kb)? |
| 21:11.40 | starseeker | no |
| 21:11.48 | sporty | ok |
| 21:12.05 | starseeker | For id, just use the command name for now |
| 21:12.11 | starseeker | no man.b.ru |
| 21:12.22 | brlcad | huh, there is? I searched for two specific strings from the original html and couldn't find it |
| 21:12.23 | starseeker | If there are id conflicts, we'll work it out |
| 21:12.39 | sporty | i have about 30-40 files, those big as dm and so on. tiny files and files with *paragraphs* are on my list |
| 21:12.51 | sporty | starseeker: ok |
| 21:13.02 | brlcad | oh, oops -- index != template |
| 21:13.11 | starseeker | right |
| 21:13.42 | sporty | well, can i use tag <pre></pre> for paragraphs? |
| 21:13.49 | starseeker | I don't have a master index file that xincludes all the individual ones yet - that'll be what replaces the old appendix in Vol II |
| 21:14.03 | sporty | i mean that bold text from mged cmd index |
| 21:14.13 | starseeker | looks up the pre tag |
| 21:14.17 | sporty | starseeker: ok |
| 21:14.45 | sporty | starseeker: i would like to see off-line wiki engine in brlcad installation |
| 21:14.55 | sporty | ...when commands are separate |
| 21:14.58 | starseeker | pre isn't a docbook tag |
| 21:15.05 | sporty | starseeker: ok |
| 21:15.25 | starseeker | legal docbook tags can be found here: http://www.docbook.org/tdg/en/html/part2.html |
| 21:15.32 | brlcad | sporty: you mean brl-cad installation |
| 21:15.47 | sporty | brlcad: no, i mean you! |
| 21:15.54 | brlcad | an off-line wiki is kinda pointless :) |
| 21:16.29 | sporty | brlcad: but it looks good! big mged cmd index just frighten me! |
| 21:16.30 | starseeker | The off-line way to view these files is either to point a web browser to the html install directory or use the new tkhtml3 based doc viewer |
| 21:16.33 | starseeker | in MGED |
| 21:17.00 | sporty | inmmged? |
| 21:17.01 | brlcad | sporty: sure .. that just has nothing to do with a 'wiki' |
| 21:17.36 | brlcad | off-line viewing is great, breaking up the page and displaying just the information requested, searchability, better organization .. all great things |
| 21:17.43 | sporty | ok, i gree to use it in mged - but how will i interrupt it to add nes argument to the command line? |
| 21:17.56 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14CB01.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:18.05 | sporty | ok, keep on working |
| 21:18.09 | brlcad | sporty: you work on the conversion, we can work on the integration |
| 21:18.41 | brlcad | either breaking up the english and stubbing out more command files (using the mged_cmd_template) .. or by taking existing command files and translating them |
| 21:20.28 | sporty | brlcad: it's a double work - double work! |
| 21:20.41 | starseeker | Speaking alphabetically, we have someone who is already working on commands adc - dup |
| 21:21.05 | starseeker | you'll see those being integrated |
| 21:21.14 | sporty | i'm about an old cmd index - as i said it is quite easy to read it on english |
| 21:21.20 | brlcad | that's not double work |
| 21:21.26 | brlcad | the old is going away |
| 21:21.28 | brlcad | *poof* |
| 21:21.34 | brlcad | so you can help with that or help elsewhere |
| 21:22.11 | starseeker | I think he means it's not worth translating a lot of the docs |
| 21:22.13 | sporty | ok, i have about 30 files "as is", fully translated, i will send it today for an integration |
| 21:22.19 | starseeker | cool! |
| 21:22.27 | starseeker | thank you |
| 21:22.27 | brlcad | sporty: post it to the patches tracker |
| 21:22.34 | sporty | starseeker: no, i mean this: |
| 21:23.00 | sporty | The only sake to add other languages are: 1. for those who is in the scholl - but wants some first fast 'results' 2. for fast start with a program. Things like rt or modelling *do* need at least an english dictionary - and so on |
| 21:23.03 | brlcad | here, https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=add&group_id=105292&atid=640804 |
| 21:23.48 | brlcad | sporty: are you just wanting to argue or make everyone agree with you? it's not necessary |
| 21:23.56 | brlcad | if you don't want to do a translation, then don't do it |
| 21:24.03 | brlcad | justifying why is not necessary |
| 21:24.07 | brlcad | someone else will eventually |
| 21:24.13 | sporty | brlcad: it's fun i can eat one ice cream instead of each megabyte of internet traffic... I want to send 50 kb to someone mailbox, not to post files... ah... |
| 21:25.28 | brlcad | sporty: it's easier to track credit for the contribution if you go through the patches tracker instead of via e-mail, so that others can be aware of your contributions |
| 21:25.49 | brlcad | that also makes it easier to justify giving you commit access down the road if you're being helpful/productive |
| 21:26.19 | sporty | no, i've added pages "about" and "wiki" to dloman77 box - now i'm trying to disassemble old mged_cmd_index.html. i have about 200 kb of short commands. this will be translated shortly wilst i have a break in reading some my skilled books |
| 21:26.25 | brlcad | shows you can work with others well enough that you'd be trusted to make the changes directly yourself, submitting as patches helps that process |
| 21:26.54 | brlcad | sporty: did dloman77 ask for those changes? |
| 21:28.12 | sporty | it was rus variant |
| 21:28.35 | sporty | brlcad: you have it in your mail box, i bet! |
| 21:28.51 | sporty | and starseeker already have it, too |
| 21:30.43 | sporty | starseeker: btw, those my messages - don't even read it now - i have new and edited files |
| 21:33.22 | sporty | oh my lord... i still stay far from http traffic... I agree to short memory in authors page later, after all, when i will feel a vanity! |
| 21:35.45 | sporty | i guess i'm offline again |
| 21:35.53 | sporty | no.. |
| 21:42.05 | sporty | shall i leave this or it is not actual: Currently, only binary objects containing a uniform array of simple objects is supported. |
| 21:42.31 | brlcad | that's still true |
| 21:42.38 | sporty | ок |
| 21:43.10 | sporty | la-la(Alt+Shift)-ла |
| 21:43.40 | sporty | Ñ Ðµ-Ñ Ðµ = he-he |
| 21:44.42 | sporty | as you can see, main words are same |
| 21:47.01 | *** join/#brlcad gentoo_iron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 21:54.02 | sporty | "brlcad: that's still true" - shame on you! |
| 21:58.02 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-236-226.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 22:06.46 | sporty | again, stay far from http - staying far from http traffic |
| 22:07.13 | sporty | sending |part1| to starseeker |
| 22:15.07 | brlcad | sporty: that's not shameful |
| 22:15.37 | brlcad | non-uniform binary objects have such limited use (actually NO use to us without implementing other features that would use them) |
| 22:16.42 | brlcad | it's just that functionality was stubbed for non-uniform, so the statement is true -- it won't make coffee for you too, but since we didn't stub it there is no statement |
| 22:17.55 | sporty | brlcad: ok |
| 22:21.12 | sporty | ok... i wanted to add some "international" glamour with that ".../d/About" page and wiki and wiki rus references. Btw, how can i transform pdf-to-html to translate some pdf files from /d/documents? |
| 22:22.31 | starseeker | Don't know if it's any good, but there's this: http://pdftohtml.sourceforge.net/ |
| 22:23.38 | sporty | starseeker: i will starve the rest of the week if i will have gone to sourceforge - but i will go! |
| 22:25.01 | sporty | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:25.04 | starseeker | Even using a text browser? |
| 22:25.11 | sporty | proxy... |
| 22:25.17 | starseeker | is partial to links |
| 22:25.37 | sporty | starseeker: even pay 0.30 per each megabyte! |
| 22:26.00 | louipc | poppler is good for pdfto* |
| 22:26.02 | louipc | http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ |
| 22:26.07 | sporty | toonel.net |
| 22:26.39 | sporty | hope it has no dependencies on the different libs |
| 22:27.34 | sporty | 0.30 usd |
| 22:27.52 | starseeker | Here's the original links text browser: http://links.sourceforge.net/ |
| 22:28.01 | sporty | ok... but i can use it to read my books... |
| 22:28.39 | starseeker | There used to be services where you could order CDs/DVDs with whole linux distros on them |
| 22:28.46 | starseeker | perhaps that would be cheaper, even with shipping |
| 22:28.57 | sporty | starseeker: text browsers don't save traffic... when your web browser has images turned off |
| 22:30.10 | starseeker | Ah |
| 22:30.25 | sporty | starseeker: i know good asplinux on e.g. 5 cd s with tons of libs and everything - i do not know anyone with fresh version, don't want to pay 400 usd for 3-month professional support |
| 22:31.08 | starseeker | what's the latest version? |
| 22:32.22 | sporty | latest... don't know... it is a Fedora-like with rpms... My old version was too old for new laptop - and i had to install ubuntu from one cd |
| 22:32.44 | sporty | www.asplinux.ru |
| 22:34.00 | starseeker | Don't know if these guys are any good, but... http://www.osdisc.com/cgi-bin/view.cgi/products/linux/asp |
| 22:34.06 | brlcad | sporty: don't do pdf-to-html on anything |
| 22:34.18 | brlcad | we have the originals in other formats (whether they be docbook or msword or whatever) |
| 22:34.36 | *** join/#brlcad phreak4257 (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 22:34.41 | brlcad | those are much better starting points than the pdf unless you are just going to type everything in from scratch |
| 22:35.08 | sporty | brlcad: why? I want to "format" my skilled books (600 pages of plain inspiration) - and to translate some /d/docs |
| 22:35.15 | brlcad | those weren't made in a vaccuum .. we have the originals ;) |
| 22:35.55 | brlcad | i'm not saying don't do the translation -- i'm saying don't just start doing a pdf-to-html conversion |
| 22:36.00 | brlcad | starting with the pdf would be stupid |
| 22:36.05 | brlcad | we have better formats to start from |
| 22:36.06 | sporty | brlcad: ok, which one has a least size in kilobytes? send me one, i can handle it in a text editor |
| 22:36.28 | brlcad | i can send you volume 1 |
| 22:36.39 | brlcad | if you do a decent job on that, we can try 3 or 2 |
| 22:37.02 | brlcad | 2 is already docbookified |
| 22:37.08 | sporty | brlcad: ok, i'm waiting - at morning, one megabyte will be equal to one ice cream, now it's only 3 megabytes are equal to one ice cream.... |
| 22:37.11 | brlcad | that'd be the better starting point .. don't know about vol 1 |
| 22:37.27 | brlcad | sporty: huh? wtf are you talking about? :) |
| 22:37.34 | brlcad | you want me to buy you some ice cream? |
| 22:37.52 | sporty | brlcad: let me only to translate it, and "What size does it have"? |
| 22:38.10 | starseeker | volume 1 is small |
| 22:38.13 | brlcad | tiny |
| 22:38.16 | sporty | Volume one.... let me guess.... 980 kb ?? |
| 22:38.20 | brlcad | i don't remember the exact size, but it's tiny |
| 22:38.22 | sporty | come on! |
| 22:38.30 | sporty | tell me |
| 22:38.44 | brlcad | what part of "I don't remember" do you not understand? :) |
| 22:38.45 | sporty | and send now, not after an hour! |
| 22:39.08 | sporty | brlcad: ok, just tell me before you send it |
| 22:39.33 | starseeker | brlcad: Is that the Overview on the wiki? |
| 22:39.38 | brlcad | sporty: i'll probably post it and you can pull it when you're ready |
| 22:39.48 | brlcad | starseeker: yeah, is that docbookified yet? |
| 22:39.55 | starseeker | Don't think so. |
| 22:39.57 | brlcad | k |
| 22:40.06 | brlcad | good, cause I have that in italian too |
| 22:40.07 | starseeker | Was just thinking I can copy that text and send it to him, no images |
| 22:42.47 | brlcad | it's already neatly tagged somewhere |
| 22:43.06 | sporty | starseeker: right! |
| 22:43.22 | sporty | starseeker: this way work will be faster! |
| 22:43.37 | PrezKennedy | hey, anyone wanna go to Zimbabwe? |
| 22:43.47 | PrezKennedy | i hear their water goes right through ya... |
| 22:43.54 | sporty | e.g. save the file as "complete html", than send me only compresseg .html |
| 22:44.45 | sporty | PrezKennedy: i want to ask your daughters' hands, roasted with ketchup, on a lunch |
| 22:45.01 | sporty | PrezKennedy: it's crisis... and i want to ask your daughters' hands, roasted with ketchup, on a lunch |
| 22:47.04 | PrezKennedy | yes... i think... |
| 22:47.53 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 22:47.58 | brlcad | sporty: well you can copy the text yourself from the website then too :) |
| 22:48.02 | sporty | PrezKennedy: ok! quickly! i'm hungry ...for love... |
| 22:48.19 | brlcad | save the page, do your edits |
| 22:48.27 | brlcad | that's also tagged up well enough |
| 22:48.30 | sporty | brlcad: ha-ha - i will have to download .pdf file |
| 22:48.36 | brlcad | no, volume I |
| 22:48.50 | sporty | brlcad: ok, give me a link |
| 22:48.59 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/wiki/Overview |
| 22:49.09 | sporty | just don't... ah! /d/documents ?? |
| 22:49.14 | sporty | ok |
| 22:49.28 | brlcad | ah, yeah -- that's even a wiki page, so you could add the internationalization directly |
| 22:50.26 | brlcad | simplified version here: http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRL-CAD |
| 22:50.34 | brlcad | *very* simplified |
| 22:50.54 | sporty | stares at Bloodhound Gang - Ballad Of Chasey Lain |
| 22:51.11 | sporty | he's her biggest fan! |
| 22:51.51 | sporty | she have a lot of friends, he has a lot of time! Come on, sing it 2get there |
| 22:53.08 | sporty | why "simlified" read this: naturalstuff.110mb.com - second paragraph |
| 22:56.10 | brlcad | i'm saying the wikipedia write-up is a simplified version of the english variant |
| 22:56.38 | brlcad | and both of those are a simplified derivative of the wiki/Overview page (they started out as the same content) |
| 22:56.43 | brlcad | wanders off |
| 22:58.18 | sporty | brlcad: what if i'm editin that page - will you have to copy my new brave foreign words into some .xml file? |
| 22:58.44 | sporty | brlcad: do you know Charley Wuffles ? He's a singer? |
| 22:59.27 | sporty | Charley Wuffles = Charley Shean in "Two and a half men" |
| 23:02.44 | sporty | ok, going to drink my drinks and watch my watches |
| 23:03.07 | sporty | i mean going to switch off internet this day off |
| 23:03.18 | sporty | i mean going to quit the chat |
| 23:03.27 | sporty | i\m quitting |
| 23:03.42 | sporty | bye! see you |
| 23:03.46 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.188) | |
| 23:03.54 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.188) | |
| 23:04.19 | sporty | see you're sitting and do not answering! |
| 23:04.21 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.188) | |
| 23:04.37 | PrezKennedy | i want what he's on |
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| 23:26.41 | IriX64 | would anybody have any idea on how to solve the can't find -llibtermlib thing in fbed? |
| 23:28.00 | IriX64 | same in lgt |
| 23:29.32 | Ralith | IriX64: -l implies a "lib" prefix; try -ltermlib |
| 23:29.47 | Ralith | unless I'm missing something |
| 23:30.06 | IriX64 | ahh thankyou |
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| 23:52.10 | Ralith | brlcad: do you still have that paper on cutaway generation lying around? |
| 23:52.15 | Ralith | can't find where he put it |
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| 00:07.33 | phreak4257 | . |
| 00:08.05 | Ralith | ' |
| 00:09.26 | Ralith | vmath.h doesn't incur any dependencies, right? |
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| 00:34.32 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/7.14.1.png <---- finally |
| 00:36.11 | Ralith | nice |
| 01:45.10 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 02:03.48 | Ralith | brlcad: got some questions about vecmath.h (which I am very close to killing completely) in lgt |
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| 03:44.50 | gentoo_iron | . |
| 03:45.13 | Ralith | ' |
| 03:45.31 | Ralith | gentoo_iron: decide on a nick already :P |
| 03:48.31 | gentoo_iron | :) |
| 03:48.44 | gentoo_iron | stupid netowrk connection |
| 03:49.19 | gentoo_iron | if i have several nicks, it will try that instead of booting me |
| 03:56.25 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177592943.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 03:57.39 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/bang.png and hit.png :) |
| 03:59.16 | Ralith | IriX64: nice, although you might want a prettier view :P |
| 03:59.36 | IriX64 | couldn't find miss april or the paper moose |
| 03:59.50 | Ralith | the havok is nice |
| 03:59.56 | IriX64 | very |
| 04:00.01 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 04:00.06 | Ralith | but you're only lighting a fraction of the visible area |
| 04:00.16 | Ralith | not very fun to look at a big blob of shadow |
| 04:00.26 | IriX64 | thats the underbelly i rotated it |
| 04:00.32 | IriX64 | suns on top |
| 04:00.35 | Ralith | yeah |
| 04:00.37 | Ralith | render the top |
| 04:00.38 | Ralith | ^^ |
| 04:02.03 | IriX64 | reality is sometimes hard to understand |
| 04:03.09 | IriX64 | which would you like to see? |
| 04:03.28 | IriX64 | out of the examples, i don't draw |
| 04:04.50 | yukonbob | reads scrollback |
| 04:04.56 | Ralith | just commenting on aesthetics |
| 04:05.05 | Ralith | I can render it myself if I actually want to see something :P |
| 04:05.24 | IriX64 | would you like a top shot? |
| 04:05.29 | IriX64 | give me 5 |
| 04:06.28 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 04:08.27 | Ralith | IriX64: no, no need to spend your time |
| 04:08.32 | Ralith | like I said, I can see all I want of it |
| 04:08.42 | Ralith | got bored of raytracing the havok a long time ago :P |
| 04:14.52 | IriX64 | try brl-cad.png |
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| 06:12.23 | brlcad | Ralith: apparently not, because I don't remember said paper (cutaway generation) |
| 06:12.32 | brlcad | oooh, the siggraph paper |
| 06:12.53 | Ralith | yeah! |
| 06:13.58 | brlcad | hm |
| 06:15.09 | Ralith | also: lgt/vecmath.h defines EPSILON (which is used as you might expect) to a seemingly arbitrary value, and I haven't seen an obvious parallel in vmath.h . Should I copy that to vmath, use Vsomething_TOL, move the #define to the source files that need it, or what? |
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| 06:26.37 | brlcad | http://www.cs.washington.edu/homes/wilmotli/ |
| 06:28.30 | Ralith | ty |
| 06:29.10 | Ralith | oo, a paper on exploding things too |
| 06:29.44 | brlcad | don't move tolerances to vmath |
| 06:30.00 | brlcad | there "shouldn't" be any hard-coded tolerances in the public header files |
| 06:30.15 | brlcad | a couple have snuck in over the years, but they're the exception |
| 06:31.08 | Ralith | thought that would be inappropriate |
| 06:31.17 | Ralith | but what *do* I do about it? |
| 06:31.22 | Ralith | none of the other options seem particularly elegant |
| 06:31.36 | Ralith | and it seems a shame to keep vecmath.h around for that alone |
| 06:33.09 | brlcad | looks like it's only used in three files, and at least one of those is completely arbitrary |
| 06:34.04 | Ralith | so move it to a #define in each file? |
| 06:34.12 | brlcad | (reflect.c) .. so that could completely go away or be changed to some other "near zero" sanity value, or use some lgt global tolerance |
| 06:34.33 | brlcad | or a var in the main file, and just export in the other one/two |
| 06:35.29 | brlcad | it probably should just have a bn_tol in do_options.c and have that exported in ir.c |
| 06:36.02 | brlcad | i'm sure there's other places in lgt that could be managing tolerance better too |
| 06:36.23 | Ralith | I'm hesitant to dig into that without an understanding of what it's doing, though |
| 06:37.30 | brlcad | sure |
| 06:37.36 | brlcad | just thinking out loud |
| 06:38.11 | brlcad | the quick fix is just a fastf_t |
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| 06:39.23 | Ralith | so, drop fastf_t bn_tol = the value EPSILON has right now in do_options.c, and a matching extern in ir.c, and an independent #define in reflect.c? |
| 06:40.01 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33272 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/spltest.c: clean up the mess while reviewing where things were left off at with the old spline surface testing. |
| 06:40.09 | brlcad | fastf_t or bn_tol .. one's a single val, the other a tolerance structure |
| 06:40.18 | Ralith | oh, heh |
| 06:40.22 | Ralith | didn't know bn_tol was a type. |
| 06:40.51 | brlcad | fastf_t is a type too :) |
| 06:41.01 | Ralith | the _t clued me in on that. |
| 06:41.01 | brlcad | struct bn_tol and fastf_t |
| 06:41.06 | brlcad | fastf_t is basically a double |
| 06:41.08 | Ralith | as well as the numerous appearances in the code. |
| 06:41.23 | brlcad | but could be a float or some other (arbitrary) floating point type |
| 06:42.27 | Ralith | looks over bn_tol and opts for the simple fix |
| 06:42.40 | Ralith | seeing as that's all that's actually being used. |
| 06:45.06 | Ralith | any relevant naming conventions I should be reminded of? |
| 06:46.23 | brlcad | nothing relevant for that |
| 06:53.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33273 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/bspline/bspline.c: be a little more explicit |
| 07:00.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33274 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/bspline/bspline.c: ws and comment cleanup |
| 07:04.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33275 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/spltest.c: |
| 07:04.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: fix a memory deallocation error. since this is calling mk_export_fwrite |
| 07:04.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: directly (which is really just wdb_export()), it cannot use a rt_nurb_internal |
| 07:04.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: that is on the stack because ifree() ends up getting called on the internal |
| 07:04.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: during export. |
| 07:11.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33276 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 07:11.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: end of cycle review, pnts import and export were finished, but still would like |
| 07:11.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: to get file input support working (maybe a pnts command instead of typein). |
| 07:11.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: still need to do something with color and vectors for the wireframe and possibly |
| 07:11.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: raytracing too (big changes to support that, multi'region' primitives). also, |
| 07:11.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: incrTcl once again gets the shaft (but this time not even making the next |
| 07:11.32 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: iteration due to other priorities) |
| 07:13.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33277 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_shell-vtk.1: wrong title header |
| 07:16.33 | yukonbob | what's happening w/ incrtcl |
| 07:16.45 | yukonbob | is working w/ the 4.0a1 atm (on own 'puter) |
| 07:20.48 | yukonbob | hits hay |
| 07:33.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33278 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_shell-vtk.1: case consistency |
| 07:34.36 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33279 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/bot_dump.c: it's a lie, -v is not a recognized argument |
| 07:35.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33280 10/brlcad/trunk/ (NEWS TODO src/conv/Makefile.am src/conv/bot_dump.1): add an initial manual page for bot_dump in response to a request for one from the modeling team. this is pretty rudimentary documentation, but should be better than nothing. |
| 07:35.37 | brlcad | yukonbob: nothing |
| 07:36.13 | brlcad | the todo push back is on some configure cleanup that is still needed |
| 07:36.34 | brlcad | so our automatic system detection works better for mixed combinations of system/provided |
| 07:39.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33281 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: cliff added editing support for the hyp primitive to mged. (this is just a rewrite for consistency (past tense or fragment, lowercase mged on the one-liners)) |
| 07:44.53 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33282 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: cliff also added a new 'lens' proc-db for making exact optical lenses. (this is just a rewrite for readability, news should be worded for a wide viewship, as much comprehension as possible in the space given.) |
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| 10:00.36 | phreak4257 | . |
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| 12:21.58 | claymore | Morning all! |
| 12:22.02 | starseeker | grooves out on his working mouse |
| 12:22.04 | starseeker | morning! |
| 12:22.14 | starseeker | gears up for an early start |
| 12:22.23 | starseeker | yay 9am meetings |
| 12:22.36 | claymore | ewwww. |
| 12:24.32 | claymore | damn.... just looked. that 9 am meeting means *ME* too. |
| 12:24.38 | claymore | grumbles |
| 12:25.19 | archivist | har har nearly dinner time here |
| 12:25.48 | claymore | oh yeah... well.... um... i had dinner almost 12 hours ago... so there!.... yeah! ;) |
| 12:27.43 | starseeker | and rush hour traffic |
| 12:27.50 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 12:27.53 | starseeker | rushes to get into rush hour traffic |
| 12:28.44 | claymore | AudioBooks man! Its the only way to combat being surrounded by tons of metal piloted by idiots! |
| 12:29.41 | claymore | will be starting the Wizards First Rule series by Goodkind soon. |
| 13:23.01 | brlcad | 9am meeting? eek |
| 13:23.15 | claymore | looks at watch. |
| 13:23.32 | claymore | brlcad: that Lotus would come in handy right now eh? :D |
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| 13:27.57 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:38.57 | brlcad | will be 15 or so late unless car falls apart |
| 13:44.09 | clock_ | also wants to be 15 once more again |
| 13:48.40 | claymore | brlcad: I'll tell them the truth: You're stuck in traffic ;) |
| 14:01.01 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:11.20 | alex_joni | clock_: but you'll lose all you knowledge too |
| 14:40.50 | *** join/#brlcad frozeniron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 14:45.56 | clock_ | alex_joni: better losing knowledge than losing youth |
| 14:52.50 | alex_joni | clock_: that's debateable |
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| 14:54.43 | claymore | a person has control over losing knowledge, but no control over losing youth. best not to fight the inevitable and make the most out of the the time you have :) |
| 14:55.22 | alex_joni | there are cases where you don't have control over losing knowledge |
| 14:55.42 | alex_joni | but at that point loss of youth is probably irrelevant/irreversible aswell |
| 14:55.53 | claymore | true, but if you dive into details, then *any* philisophical debate falls apart ;) |
| 14:56.11 | alex_joni | divide et impera ;) |
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| 15:28.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33283 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/swidgets/scripts/selectlists.itk: Check-in for Doug Howard. |
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| 17:02.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33284 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/GeometryEngine/ (30 files): |
| 17:03.22 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177878798.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 17:04.08 | IriX64 | i could use some help |
| 17:04.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33285 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/GeometryService/Jobs/ (16 files): Architecture change: Converted all arrays over to std::vector or std::list where appropriate. |
| 17:04.43 | claymore | amen to that :D |
| 17:05.02 | IriX64 | heh fbed is giving me grief |
| 17:05.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33286 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/GeometryService/ (24 files in 2 dirs): Architecture change: Converted all arrays over to std::vector or std::list where appropriate. |
| 17:07.45 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33287 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/ (11 files in 4 dirs): Architecture change: Converted all arrays over to std::vector or std::list where appropriate. (Multiple commits where required due to the intermittent network issues here.) |
| 17:17.28 | sporty | IriX64: where shall i register myself to put my xml files prepared for international translations? Where's a tracker? |
| 17:24.00 | sporty | ok, will have started from logs of previous day |
| 17:25.25 | IriX64 | sporty, i have no idead man sorry |
| 17:25.35 | IriX64 | idea too |
| 17:25.48 | sporty | ok, i see logs - there's a link |
| 17:26.28 | IriX64 | good |
| 17:26.52 | sporty | not bad, heh |
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| 17:32.42 | claymore | hai ``Erik ! |
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| 17:34.40 | louipc | sporty: try the patch tracker. http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?atid=640804&group_id=105292&func=browse |
| 17:34.49 | sporty | ok |
| 17:35.20 | sporty | but i\m already trying to create an account |
| 17:36.06 | louipc | you'll have to create a sourceforge account I believe |
| 17:46.10 | sporty | i did it |
| 17:46.19 | IriX64 | cheers |
| 17:46.44 | sporty | i have created a cup of a tea... now about the account .. |
| 17:53.05 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.185) | |
| 17:53.57 | sporty | well... i can not log into my account. weak connection fot sourceforge traffic... will use e-mail |
| 17:54.03 | sporty | ...then. |
| 18:16.53 | ``Erik | yargh |
| 18:25.11 | yukonbob | "To err is human, to arrr! is pirate" |
| 18:30.46 | claymore | arrrrrrg! |
| 18:32.49 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33288 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Add code to support "more args" commands in Tcl land. Activate the "in" and "inside" commands in Archer. |
| 18:33.41 | claymore | More ARGS!!! ARG!!!!!! |
| 18:57.50 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 19:00.44 | *** join/#brlcad b0ef (n=b0ef@062016142244.customer.alfanett.no) | |
| 19:57.08 | *** join/#brlcad gentoo_iron (n=phreak@67-42-56-208.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 20:07.27 | brlcad | starseeker: turned off OCR? |
| 20:07.44 | starseeker | oops - not intentionally |
| 20:08.01 | brlcad | no biggie, have to turn them into images to color correct them anyways |
| 20:08.08 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.151) | |
| 20:08.16 | brlcad | hello sporty |
| 20:08.42 | brlcad | figure out your login to sourceforge? that is the best way to send stuff over (initially) |
| 20:10.23 | sporty | brlcad: i can not go to sourceforge due to weak internet connection. It interrupts |
| 20:11.24 | brlcad | what does that mean? |
| 20:11.38 | sporty | i'm using e-mails |
| 20:11.42 | brlcad | data is data |
| 20:12.04 | sporty | brlcad: yes, but e-nail - it is usually 10 kb of data |
| 20:12.14 | brlcad | if you can send and receive data over smtp, you should be able to do the same over http |
| 20:12.56 | sporty | brlcad: so i have to re-vise commands... Can i add <refentry id='man.c.ru'> ?? |
| 20:13.09 | brlcad | so browse with javascript disabled, stylesheets disabled |
| 20:13.20 | sporty | brlcad: but i pay 0.30 usd per megabyte and hate sourceforge.net |
| 20:13.26 | sporty | ok |
| 20:13.44 | brlcad | hell, use lynx |
| 20:14.13 | brlcad | images are the killer, turn off image loading |
| 20:14.19 | sporty | starseeker: i'm about to edit all my files again... |
| 20:14.20 | brlcad | so much possible |
| 20:14.40 | brlcad | it'll just be a LOT more effective as a tracker item then via e-mail |
| 20:15.08 | sporty | brlcad: everything is already turned off, and i'm using toonel.net for http and direct connection for downlos |
| 20:15.11 | brlcad | but if e-mail is your only option, join the devel mailing list and send them to there in patch form as attachments |
| 20:17.07 | brlcad | as for the refentry id, I don't personally see yet why those need to change |
| 20:17.13 | sporty | brlcad: no, don't have time to know how to create patches. I'm getting experience in translations. These commands i already have (first 50 or 60) - fully translated. The rest will be a bit more rough. |
| 20:17.18 | brlcad | you can mark the entire book/article/whatever as lang="ru" |
| 20:17.20 | sporty | brlcad: ok |
| 20:17.30 | sporty | brlcad: how? |
| 20:17.34 | sporty | as: |
| 20:18.16 | sporty | <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" lang="ru"?> ???? |
| 20:18.22 | sporty | right? |
| 20:18.42 | sporty | if so, then these commands are ready |
| 20:18.44 | brlcad | no, it goes on the book/article/chapter -- depends how it's broken out |
| 20:18.54 | sporty | ok, wait |
| 20:19.21 | sporty | ok, will decide with starseeker |
| 20:19.28 | brlcad | refentry lang="ru" iirc |
| 20:19.43 | brlcad | or it happens at a higher level |
| 20:19.58 | brlcad | they go into a "ru" directory already |
| 20:20.03 | sporty | <refentry id='c' lang="ru"> |
| 20:20.21 | sporty | brlcad: let them go to /ru directory |
| 20:20.27 | sporty | it could be better |
| 20:20.50 | louipc | sporty: are you using svn? |
| 20:21.12 | sporty | because i've asked elite01 to add some commands on another language - and i has told he can spend about an hour for them all |
| 20:21.22 | sporty | louipc: no |
| 20:22.06 | louipc | you can easily get a patch of your changes with `svn diff` though :D |
| 20:22.07 | sporty | louipc: i'm using cost internet connection - this is an only obstruction |
| 20:22.24 | sporty | ah... no |
| 20:23.03 | brlcad | sporty: so what *are* you doing? |
| 20:23.25 | brlcad | because if you're trying to help, you've being very difficult .. seemingly intentionally |
| 20:24.08 | *** join/#brlcad gentoo_iron (n=phreak@71-210-23-250.eugn.qwest.net) | |
| 20:24.18 | sporty | brlcad: right now i'm re-vising commands. E.g. word "combination" in russian will be "complicated object" - in those sentences whichmind primitives - |
| 20:24.20 | brlcad | there's a reason why certain methods and formats are preferred over others.. it's generally what's most time-efficient for everyone (patches being a big one) |
| 20:24.59 | brlcad | that doesn't sound right |
| 20:25.05 | sporty | but i thought svn are just a night-builds... |
| 20:25.37 | brlcad | svn is where all current development occurs |
| 20:26.14 | brlcad | which combination object isn't quite the same as compound object, nor complicated object.. |
| 20:26.17 | sporty | i think it could be a good idea to leave some words as combination as special terms. "combination"='kombinaciya' |
| 20:26.28 | sporty | that's what i do right now |
| 20:26.34 | brlcad | how do you refer to two things that are joined together using boolean operations? |
| 20:26.52 | sporty | ok, wait... |
| 20:27.39 | sporty | e.g. 'creates combination with name combination_name' |
| 20:29.08 | sporty | never mind, bad example. I think it could be great to edit commands on the site, after all. There will sure be people who can approve/disapprove commands on the native languages |
| 20:33.32 | sporty | brlcad: i know at least two manuals on my native. 'booleans' tend us towards complicated objects, where 'complicated' mean rather non-original, than "more simple vs more complicated". From this points of view, everithing is ok. I only think i need to re-vise all the commands again - and i want it to be a final variant. Unless it will lie in wiki. |
| 20:35.03 | sporty | i also want to leave e.g. 'regions', 'combinations', 'rubber band' as special terms. |
| 20:36.42 | sporty | i've understood that 'full' translation shall be used in other cases. B.t.w, one this manual about the commands is tiny-but-powerfull introduction in 3D. |
| 20:39.35 | sporty | louipc: so how can i create a xml-commands-rus-part1.patch ? I wanted to gzip it and upload through the tracker... |
| 20:43.00 | louipc | sporty: if you didn't alter any existing files I'd think that would be alright. Otherwise you'd use the diff command to make a patch. Read the man page to see how to use it. |
| 20:43.20 | sporty | ok |
| 20:46.14 | sporty | i think <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" lang="ru"?> - and i need to quit to find out if it right or not |
| 20:47.04 | sporty | don't write smth without me! If everything is ok, all user commands will be available soon |
| 20:47.09 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.151) | |
| 21:18.05 | *** join/#brlcad sport1 (n=mega@217.8.236.142) | |
| 21:18.52 | sport1 | it's ok |
| 21:30.02 | redvsblue | does erik's connection suck or is it just my imagination? :P |
| 21:42.14 | brlcad | it sucks when he's not paying attention to it |
| 21:42.37 | redvsblue | oh |
| 21:42.47 | redvsblue | well i guess thats good, it means he is being productive? |
| 21:42.50 | redvsblue | :P |
| 21:43.59 | brlcad | unlikely |
| 21:44.21 | sporty | brlcad: does the rset *don't gets a new* value untill it is explicitly supplied on a command line |
| 21:44.46 | brlcad | sporty: right, it's like "set" on the unix prompt |
| 21:44.55 | sporty | ok |
| 21:44.59 | brlcad | prints if you ask for stuff, sets it if you provide a value |
| 21:46.07 | brlcad | sporty: so what does this call it? http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constructive_solid_geometry |
| 21:46.16 | brlcad | complicated objects? |
| 21:47.07 | sporty | brlcad: ah, just combination=combination and region-region and so on. |
| 21:49.35 | sporty | brlcad: any mention call it "complicated vs. primitive shapes" - but here, on a sophisticated 'basis', combinations remain "combination" and regions remain "region" - these words only sounds more rough on russian, as e.g. german ones |
| 21:50.01 | sporty | i mean i do not change anything |
| 21:50.45 | sporty | this translation only helps to read through the manual more quickly |
| 21:51.16 | sporty | brlcad: I guess Rubber Band is... what is it? |
| 21:52.26 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177680157.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:55.20 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177680157.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:58.04 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/brl-cad.png |
| 21:58.07 | sporty | brlcad: <refentry id='rset' lang="ru"> - so i try to finish this long translation work more quickly. |
| 21:59.02 | sporty | IriX64: i can not download pics (mobile internet) - what do they use brl-cad for? |
| 21:59.23 | IriX64 | solid modelling and cad |
| 21:59.42 | sporty | cad? |
| 21:59.54 | IriX64 | computer aided design |
| 22:00.22 | sporty | i mean, only design? or they try to e.g. speed up the 'documentation' cycle |
| 22:00.36 | IriX64 | test it before its built |
| 22:01.13 | IriX64 | see how many rockets itll take before its destroyed :) |
| 22:02.09 | IriX64 | there's some others on the site too, all recent |
| 22:02.50 | sporty | IriX64: i'm about to use brl-cad this way: 10-15 minutes for geometry, fea, - and it's an analog, then again, 20 mins for geometry and fea - and these 2-3 times produces a good shape --> qcad (or some sophisticated cad package). Time is a problem... it's about 40-hours week... |
| 22:03.27 | sporty | IriX64: not tea - fea! |
| 22:03.37 | sporty | ha-ha :) |
| 22:03.44 | IriX64 | :) |
| 22:04.04 | sporty | i have new fea package cose-aster.org |
| 22:04.12 | sporty | code-aster.org |
| 22:04.38 | sporty | and few books to read till the end of this month |
| 22:05.03 | IriX64 | whatever happened to doxygen :) |
| 22:05.25 | sporty | doxygen? what is it? |
| 22:05.33 | IriX64 | documentation |
| 22:05.42 | IriX64 | pkg |
| 22:06.20 | sporty | doxygen - documentation of what? |
| 22:06.35 | IriX64 | anything you want to document |
| 22:06.45 | IriX64 | brl-cad used to use it |
| 22:07.09 | IriX64 | i think the switch is still there in ./configure |
| 22:07.20 | sporty | uh... but what have heppened with doxygen |
| 22:07.31 | IriX64 | replaced |
| 22:07.47 | IriX64 | html docbook and pdf i think |
| 22:07.59 | sporty | i have compiled gcc-3.4 and can not compile qt-opensource-edition |
| 22:08.16 | louipc | doxygen is really for documenting libraries |
| 22:08.30 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 22:08.43 | sporty | IriX64: what is a size of current brl-cad's linux package? same 12 mb? |
| 22:09.05 | IriX64 | the source is arounf 40-45 bz2 ed |
| 22:09.11 | IriX64 | around too |
| 22:09.45 | IriX64 | check sourceforge the project page they have binaries |
| 22:09.51 | sporty | no! i have 7.10.2 which is 12 mb in size, .bzip2 |
| 22:10.18 | IriX64 | no idea then i don't run linux |
| 22:10.31 | sporty | oh my god! i need... about 15 usd to download it! |
| 22:10.40 | louipc | 7.14.0 is 41M in .tar.bz2 |
| 22:10.51 | sporty | IriX64: do you run irix on 64-bit? |
| 22:10.52 | louipc | the source |
| 22:10.56 | IriX64 | ah your on a dialup |
| 22:11.11 | sporty | no, on gprs |
| 22:11.16 | louipc | sporty: ouch |
| 22:11.28 | brlcad | sporty: forget about putting a lang in there unless you hear something from starseeker as to otherwise.. just translate the body text |
| 22:11.28 | IriX64 | my nick has nothing to do with what os i use |
| 22:11.45 | sporty | brlcad: ok |
| 22:12.54 | sporty | brlcad: starseeker has told he will have to edit it, anyway - but i will have deleted lang from few last files - so all thw files will be clear |
| 22:13.54 | sporty | brlcad: what is "rubber band"? is it related to David bowie or iggy pop? |
| 22:14.13 | sporty | or zizy top? |
| 22:14.28 | sporty | or aa bottom? :) |
| 22:14.42 | brlcad | it's a marquee |
| 22:15.05 | sporty | ah! |
| 22:15.10 | sporty | aha! |
| 22:15.22 | sporty | i almost thought the same |
| 22:15.54 | sporty | i have called it "rubber gangsters" |
| 22:16.22 | sporty | "rubber gang" to be true |
| 22:18.22 | brlcad | IriX64: doxygen is for *code* documentation and hasn't changed in plan |
| 22:18.29 | brlcad | it's still what is being used |
| 22:18.37 | brlcad | docbook is for the end-user documentation |
| 22:22.13 | sporty | brlcad: what is a price of such a 'simple' cars as e.g. cheap sedan, new, there in u.s.? |
| 22:22.31 | IriX64 | sorry, i remember a --enable-doxygen in 7.6.2 :) |
| 22:22.59 | brlcad | depends, but anywhere from 10k to 30k |
| 22:23.12 | sporty | IriX64: it seems it exists in 7.10, but there's also a default value |
| 22:23.12 | brlcad | cheap is very observer-dependent |
| 22:23.39 | sporty | brlcad: i mean e.g. ford ....ah well the most cheap? |
| 22:24.21 | sporty | like 8999$ ? i want to buy a car for 300$ |
| 22:24.28 | brlcad | well I gave a range |
| 22:24.35 | brlcad | so the cheapest is one ends of that range |
| 22:24.46 | sporty | which is 15-20 years old |
| 22:24.58 | sporty | ok... |
| 22:26.02 | brlcad | you said new |
| 22:26.19 | brlcad | cars cost a whole lot more than $300 to make them in materials alone |
| 22:26.28 | sporty | brlcad: it is a macabre for me... |
| 22:27.32 | sporty | i will buy a set of car+some gasoline + snowboard and bmx for warm (> -20 celsius) days |
| 22:27.32 | brlcad | there is financing and used cars for cheaper |
| 22:28.38 | sporty | brlcad: ok... i will 'edit' the cars in a way i like. i wish i can buy lots of epoxy resin - it's a rare thing here |
| 22:31.56 | sporty | ok, i will go to see "two and a half men" at tv. i want to finish all the files (about 60) today, with no any additions as lang="ru". |
| 22:32.05 | sporty | i'm quitting |
| 22:32.10 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=mega@217.8.236.142) | |
| 23:48.05 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 00:41.06 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith_ (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 00:53.35 | ``Erik | pays lots of attention to his internet connection, has a faulty cable modem or wire or something :/ has to physically move the cable modem to another jack to trick it into resetting correctly :/ |
| 00:54.16 | redvsblue | but sometimes youre too busy napping at work to notice though |
| 00:54.50 | ``Erik | can't exactly stop and drive home to reset the cable modem in the middle of a work day O.o |
| 00:55.13 | redvsblue | too busy playing solitaire? |
| 00:55.13 | redvsblue | ;D |
| 00:55.21 | ``Erik | minesweeper |
| 00:55.26 | redvsblue | hehe |
| 01:02.24 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=z@217.8.236.134) | |
| 01:18.03 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 01:23.48 | sporty | yukonbob: hello |
| 01:54.55 | sporty | hello? |
| 01:55.06 | sporty | on-line :) |
| 01:55.50 | sporty | "america on-line" - "What is on-line?" "America, heh!.." |
| 02:00.12 | *** part/#brlcad sporty (n=z@217.8.236.134) | |
| 07:58.22 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:26.39 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 11:11.24 | claymore | yawns. |
| 11:11.27 | claymore | Mornin all. |
| 12:08.44 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 12:38.36 | starseeker | morning |
| 12:40.27 | archivist | I wish I could get out of bed as late as you lot |
| 12:48.03 | claymore | late? Early :) 0415 is my wake time! |
| 12:48.39 | archivist | 12:48 nearly dinnerz time :) |
| 13:13.08 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14DE44.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:26.14 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 14:19.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33291 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: |
| 14:19.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: add a slew of request from butler et al for a variety of productivity enhancers: |
| 14:19.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 1) support to 'search' to find objects with given attribute value ranges (like |
| 14:19.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: numeric region ids), 2) adding a color option to all of the drawing commands, 3) |
| 14:19.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: having automatic history recordation, 4) exec support for 'search', 5) argument |
| 14:19.26 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: aware commands for automatic object matching |
| 14:25.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33292 10/brlcad/trunk/BUGS: |
| 14:25.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: added more detail on the mixed-winding bot problems noting that the issue isn't |
| 14:25.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: isolated to nirt but is a problem in librt. if they're set to lh or rh, they |
| 14:25.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: won't render correctly (or at all usually). if set to no orientation, they |
| 14:25.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: don't report as hits (nirt). |
| 15:15.03 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33293 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/fast4-g.1: add a note about FASTGEN2 and FASTGEN3 support to the fast4-g manual page, with references to rpatch and patch-g. as well as cleaning up the manual page layout a little for readability. |
| 15:16.19 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33294 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: ws |
| 15:16.59 | brlcad | Ralith: nice work on the enum .. |
| 15:17.03 | brlcad | ~ws |
| 15:17.04 | ibot | methinks ws is short for workstation. White Space, or the country code for Western Samoa |
| 16:51.19 | Axman6 | i always wince when i see clock_'s quit message |
| 16:55.07 | *** join/#brlcad cad18 (n=506097ca@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 17:52.14 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (n=erik@ftp.brlcad.org) | |
| 17:52.28 | ``Erik | bitches s'more about his uplink crapping out O.o |
| 17:54.10 | Axman6 | :( |
| 17:54.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33295 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/nmg/nmg_mk.c: fix indentation, braces, ws |
| 17:55.23 | claymore | I think you need to tell Comcast that you are not recieving the service that is spelled out in your contract with them and therefore you are not liable to pay until its fixed :) |
| 17:57.56 | ``Erik | called 'em at one point when it wasn't working, they scheduled service 2 weeks later, and it started working again by then... :/ (plus I imagine I should clean house a little and hide the networking I have going on) |
| 17:58.26 | archivist | Axman6, you clocks old quit with as many chp types as he could think of |
| 18:17.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33296 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/nmg/nmg_mk.c: clean up comment style, doxygenify all the public funcs |
| 18:25.02 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33297 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/nmg/nmg_mk.c: reorder to remove the forward declarations, replace x%x with 0x%p where appropriate and quell all warnings |
| 18:28.45 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33298 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/ (archer/Archer.tcl archer/ArcherCore.tcl lib/Ged.tcl): Added more wrappers for cadwidgets::Ged method calls in ArcherCore. |
| 18:57.15 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1096601065.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 18:59.15 | IriX64 | ``Erik... just use printf("%s Version %ld \n",__FILE__,__VERSION__); ;) |
| 19:01.44 | IriX64 | warning... __VERSION__ redefine in (whatever.h) |
| 19:02.16 | ``Erik | huh? |
| 19:02.33 | IriX64 | im being silly :) |
| 19:03.08 | IriX64 | has archived brl-cad for a few days |
| 19:03.16 | ``Erik | should be more like PKG_VERSION |
| 19:03.18 | ``Erik | iirc |
| 19:03.26 | IriX64 | :) |
| 19:04.24 | IriX64 | i acyually put that in mged (mged -v foo) and i get mged.c 4.2.1 |
| 19:05.31 | IriX64 | heh use __LINE if you want details :) |
| 19:05.38 | IriX64 | err __LINE__ |
| 19:06.23 | IriX64 | caveat not all compilers support all three of these but most do |
| 19:22.34 | ``Erik | note that __LINE__ __FUNCTION__ and __FILE__ are compiler defined things, I'd imagine __VERSION__ is, too... for BRL-CAD version, you might want to explore the function brlcad_ident() |
| 19:22.55 | IriX64 | noted :) |
| 19:23.16 | IriX64 | where does it live so i dont have to grep the tree? |
| 19:23.27 | ``Erik | um, include/something.h |
| 19:23.39 | IriX64 | heh gee thanks :) |
| 19:23.50 | ``Erik | include/brlcad_version.h |
| 19:23.58 | IriX64 | much thanks |
| 19:24.05 | ``Erik | most of the libraries use it to create, like, rt_version() |
| 19:24.45 | ``Erik | src/librt/vers.c for example |
| 19:24.56 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 19:25.18 | ``Erik | and if you search for _version in src/rt/main.c, you'll see where that big version banner comes from :) |
| 19:25.55 | IriX64 | this changed when i introduced brlcad version 9.9.9 iirc :) |
| 19:27.08 | IriX64 | whoa, if the string is null print the version number?!?!?!?! |
| 19:28.15 | IriX64 | if (version[0] == 0) print the version blah blah |
| 19:28.46 | IriX64 | in version.h line 139 |
| 19:28.56 | IriX64 | err brlcad_version.h |
| 19:29.27 | IriX64 | door brb |
| 19:30.37 | ``Erik | snprintf(), to fill it in... otherwise, just return it (since we've done it already) |
| 19:32.05 | IriX64 | ahh thanks i ll open ver.c for example a littyle later ok |
| 19:33.18 | IriX64 | sn printf like sprintf? |
| 19:33.46 | ``Erik | yes, with a max size, google it :) |
| 19:33.56 | IriX64 | ahh ic fill the *whole string in |
| 19:34.10 | IriX64 | ahh thanks |
| 19:34.33 | IriX64 | case somebody absconded with the terminator eh :) |
| 19:35.29 | IriX64 | is this kind of stuff documented somewhere? |
| 19:35.57 | IriX64 | a master catalog or something of functions you expect people to use |
| 19:36.08 | ``Erik | um, the man pages? |
| 19:36.27 | IriX64 | that presumes you can install the beast :) |
| 19:36.40 | ``Erik | cygwin doesn't have the manpage set? |
| 19:37.31 | IriX64 | does but i rarely use it, so if i need a function like snprintf without knowing itgs name how do i man it? |
| 19:37.58 | ``Erik | apropos (synonym for man -k) |
| 19:38.38 | ``Erik | or go to http://www.linuxmanpages.com/ or something *shrug* |
| 19:38.50 | IriX64 | heh ok |
| 19:45.53 | IriX64 | IriX64@dee-f96eba0a615 ~ |
| 19:45.53 | IriX64 | $ ./test |
| 19:45.53 | IriX64 | File test.c Line 6 Compiler Revision 4202505 Time 14:45:21 |
| 19:45.53 | IriX64 | IriX64@dee-f96eba0a615 ~ |
| 19:46.02 | IriX64 | $hows that :) |
| 19:47.08 | IriX64 | drat i sed %ld instread of %d for compiler revision :) |
| 19:47.08 | IriX64 | rev is 4.2.1 |
| 19:48.46 | IriX64 | its right |
| 19:49.58 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/mLdNdB64.html heres the source heh |
| 19:50.54 | IriX64 | ``Erik, i haven't accepted, im just playing here |
| 19:51.13 | IriX64 | ill try to study some of your functions |
| 19:56.31 | IriX64 | ive gotta go, ill be back later on, ciao :) |
| 21:07.52 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33299 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Minor mods to ArcherCore - consolidate the command lists and a few name changes. |
| 21:22.43 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33300 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/patch/patch-g.c: ws, indent, and style consistency cleanup |
| 21:47.37 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
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| 22:11.16 | starseeker | brlcad: 4261666 facets |
| 22:13.35 | brlcad | cool |
| 22:13.54 | brlcad | that should be about 5-10 million points then |
| 22:14.23 | starseeker | tries to run bot_decimate and hangs MGED |
| 22:15.45 | starseeker | Ah, one maxed out cpu |
| 22:15.51 | starseeker | Sharks... |
| 22:16.41 | starseeker | It's all about edge_can_be_decimated |
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| 22:22.16 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1096601065.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 22:23.04 | IriX64 | apologizes, just realized what im doing here, i won't use your channel to test schtuff like this anymore |
| 22:24.39 | brlcad | IriX64: that was actally all on topic and interactive |
| 22:25.06 | IriX64 | well ... just in case anybody got discruntled :) |
| 22:25.14 | IriX64 | disguntled too |
| 22:25.24 | brlcad | it's the long drawn out soliloquys that get folks disgruntled |
| 22:25.38 | IriX64 | mea culpa :) |
| 22:25.40 | brlcad | and screenshots that are never of anything different.. :) |
| 22:25.50 | IriX64 | :) |
| 22:26.03 | IriX64 | are urls welcome though |
| 22:27.01 | brlcad | it depends entirely on the content |
| 22:27.07 | brlcad | it has to be something worthwhilee |
| 22:27.16 | IriX64 | any idea how long ago i stumbled into this channel looking to render miss april :) |
| 22:27.16 | brlcad | random urls out of context .. are useless |
| 22:27.33 | brlcad | i'm sure I could pull that up |
| 22:27.36 | IriX64 | ok |
| 22:27.39 | brlcad | has logs of everythin |
| 22:27.54 | IriX64 | how long has it been |
| 22:29.45 | brlcad | 16:29 -!- Hagar [n=Hagar@toronto-HSE-ppp4309004.sympatico.ca] has joined #brlcad |
| 22:29.51 | brlcad | that was on May 17th, 2006 |
| 22:29.58 | IriX64 | jeez |
| 22:30.15 | brlcad | so you count the days ;) |
| 22:30.23 | alex_joni | that was my birthday :) |
| 22:30.23 | IriX64 | then you taught me nickserv, did i ever thankyou? |
| 22:30.51 | alex_joni | brlcad: do you have logs when I stumbled upon brlcad first? |
| 22:32.07 | brlcad | as I said.. |
| 22:32.12 | brlcad | has logs of everything ;) |
| 22:32.31 | starseeker | ah, blackmail :-P |
| 22:32.39 | archivist | ew /me hides |
| 22:33.40 | IriX64 | back to play |
| 22:34.28 | brlcad | alex_joni: 15:58 -!- alex_joni [n=juve@emc/board-of-directors/alexjoni] has joined #brlcad |
| 22:34.32 | brlcad | Nov 17th, 2007 |
| 22:34.38 | brlcad | and no, I won't look anyone else up :) |
| 22:34.49 | alex_joni | heh, cool.. thanks for taking the trouble |
| 22:36.15 | archivist | I could self check but I think I deleted older logs on a disk full one day |
| 22:39.40 | starseeker | brlcad: I remember some discussion once about a higher performance alternative to using #define - what was the alternative? |
| 22:42.07 | brlcad | higher "performance"? |
| 22:42.17 | brlcad | #defines just get replaced during preprocessing |
| 22:42.23 | brlcad | not really a performance aspect to them |
| 22:42.31 | starseeker | Ah, ok |
| 22:42.36 | starseeker | compile time only |
| 22:42.46 | starseeker | nevermind |
| 22:44.26 | brlcad | the problem with them is that they are not compiler symbols, they're replaced before the compiler sees them |
| 22:44.53 | brlcad | which can have a variety of unexpected or at least undesirable side-effects |
| 22:45.05 | starseeker | nods |
| 22:45.07 | brlcad | that was the whole issue with vmath's X, Y, Z defines |
| 22:45.34 | brlcad | that's what Ralith just recently changed to an enum because of said problems |
| 22:45.50 | brlcad | since it wasn't a compiler symbol, you'd have something like: |
| 22:45.56 | brlcad | #define X 0 (in vmath.h) |
| 22:46.28 | brlcad | and then some other code (maybe openNURBS for example), that would have something like: int my_function(int X, int Y, int Z) { .... |
| 22:46.40 | starseeker | Ah :-) |
| 22:46.45 | brlcad | which would then become: int my_function(int 0, int Y, int Z) { ... |
| 22:46.50 | brlcad | which is a syntax error of course |
| 22:46.56 | starseeker | ow |
| 22:47.20 | brlcad | as an enum, they become compiler symbols and all is better with the world |
| 22:47.31 | starseeker | :-) |
| 22:47.37 | brlcad | but that's not to say that you always want to use enums either... :) |
| 22:59.44 | Ralith | ^^ |
| 23:05.15 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:30.44 | ``Erik_ | hm, it was much less cool when I first stumbled on BRL-CAD ... "qq, my job is going away" "send a rezoomy" "um, ok" |
| 23:41.07 | archivist | knows what "my jobs going away" feels like |
| 00:14.23 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (n=MinuteEl@unaffiliated/minuteelectron) | |
| 00:39.19 | ``Erik_ | abuses pastebin in horrible ways... http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/d47a95afd |
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| 02:07.29 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33301 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libgcv/Makefile.am: libgcv needs '-Wc,' too since it depends on librt which depends on openNURBS which causes the __Unwind_Resume linker failure if -fexceptions isn't used when compiling with gcc and using the latest autotools. |
| 02:16.19 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33302 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: fix the distcheck, missing g_qa from the dist |
| 02:44.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33303 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: |
| 02:44.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: provide the old-school preprocessor directives for the translation and scaling |
| 02:44.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: matrix components as an enum as well like was done for the vector components. |
| 02:44.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: wrap both as a typedef so that they can be categorically managed, compared, and |
| 02:44.24 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: used too. |
| 02:52.43 | Ralith | brlcad: remind me -- is it possible to get a 2d outline vector of a plane through a model right now? |
| 02:53.04 | Ralith | s/outline/intersection/ |
| 02:58.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33304 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: goodbye SHORT_VECTORS. remove the dead (slower, poor compile-time designed) code and greatly simplify++ the flow of the vmath.h header. |
| 03:39.20 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33305 10/brlcad/trunk/include/vmath.h: |
| 03:39.20 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: major consistency cleanup. make indent levels uniform. call out the macros |
| 03:39.20 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: that use a scope by putting the close parenthesis on the final line by itself. |
| 03:39.20 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: make comments consistently indented and spaced as well as other minor ws |
| 03:39.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: adjustments. |
| 03:47.43 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33306 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/deprecation.txt: the old _2D macros have been deprecated for a long time, but give them some down time in here before giving them the official axe. |
| 03:49.31 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33307 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/Makefile.am: fix g_gq typo |
| 05:51.34 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=z@217.8.236.173) | |
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| 06:13.37 | sport1 | doesn't work |
| 06:14.34 | Ralith | what doesn't? |
| 06:25.14 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 09:07.45 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
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| 11:30.27 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 17:13.48 | brlcad | hm, no cia notifications |
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| 18:58.55 | sport1 | starseeker: hello! |
| 18:59.36 | brlcad | sport1: hello |
| 18:59.41 | sport1 | yukonbob: i'm still hungry ;-) |
| 18:59.48 | sport1 | brlcad: hi |
| 19:00.31 | sport1 | brlcad: i have an advance today. the work just goes better: this is an example |
| 19:00.33 | sport1 | ÐÐ¾Ð¼ÐµÑ ident Ð´Ð»Ñ region иÑполÑзÑеÑÑÑ Ð´Ð»Ñ ÑÐºÐ°Ð·Ð°Ð½Ð¸Ñ ÑвеÑа из lookup table. ÐнаÑÐµÐ½Ð¸Ñ low и high - огÑаниÑÐµÐ½Ð¸Ñ Ð½Ð¾Ð¼ÐµÑов region ident Ð´Ð»Ñ Ð¿ÑименÑемого rgb-ÑвеÑа (0-255). |
| 19:00.43 | brlcad | cool |
| 19:01.02 | sport1 | as you see, some words are 'special terms' - i don't have to add |
| 19:01.11 | brlcad | sure |
| 19:01.23 | brlcad | that's good |
| 19:01.50 | brlcad | you'll be one of the most knowledgable people on all of brl-cad if you read/translate all of the docs like that :) |
| 19:02.11 | sport1 | ...adjectives on russian as "those things' that thing" - this is a way how complicated russian translation can looks like |
| 19:27.13 | sport1 | this is my finished work: http://www.ribbonsoft.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1808 |
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| 01:42.44 | IriX64 | regards |
| 01:50.28 | IriX64 | the licence says you have to give a copy of your source back to (I assume you people) if you plan to distribute binaries, does that apply too if you're not charging for your binaries? |
| 01:58.54 | ``Erik | yes |
| 01:59.14 | ``Erik | if you distribute binaries at all, you must make the source available |
| 02:03.46 | ``Erik | identity crisis heh :D |
| 02:05.47 | IriX64 | thank you |
| 02:05.50 | IriX64 | :) |
| 02:06.42 | punkrockgirl | im confused |
| 02:06.51 | punkrockgirl | how do you find an oper or staffer |
| 02:07.24 | IriX64 | slash msg help :) |
| 02:07.47 | punkrockgirl | ty :D |
| 02:08.27 | punkrockgirl | no suck nick |
| 02:08.31 | punkrockgirl | er |
| 02:08.32 | punkrockgirl | such :D |
| 02:12.55 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 02:16.01 | ``Erik | huh, wedding crashers is on tv tonight, I wonder how much of it was cut out |
| 02:16.03 | IriX64 | playfull tonight aren't we :) |
| 02:16.12 | smurfette | i was registering nicks :) |
| 02:16.27 | smurfette | but smurfette was taken but now is not :) |
| 02:16.34 | IriX64 | gloriaholy :) |
| 02:16.40 | smurfette | lol |
| 02:16.44 | smurfette | :) |
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| 03:30.00 | IriX64_ | how do you strip a library exactly.... play appropriate music :) |
| 03:31.54 | ``Erik | I d'no if stripping libraries or binaries would be useful to you, irix, it's generally a method for removing extra information from ELF or qmagic files to make them smaller on the disk |
| 03:32.37 | IriX64_ | just kidding around but thanks for the information |
| 03:33.55 | ``Erik | <-- points out that it's only on disk, when the library is loaded into memory, that extra information is not carried until the debugger starts interrogating it... and at that point, you want that extra info |
| 03:34.07 | ``Erik | on modern systems, anyways |
| 03:34.31 | IriX64_ | understood sort of like map xrefs |
| 03:35.12 | IriX64 | my famous cref file heh |
| 03:36.04 | IriX64 | stackdumps... im not too good with |
| 03:37.00 | IriX64 | wonder if i could turn this project into a watcom project |
| 03:37.00 | ``Erik | O.o I thought stack backtraces were one of the easiest ways to get bunches of info about the state at crash |
| 03:37.09 | ``Erik | punker, play, um, doors, uh, alabama song |
| 03:38.03 | IriX64 | -ltcl8.5 .. quit teasing ``erik, eith strip or leave :) |
| 03:38.41 | ``Erik | heh, tcl, ew :D |
| 03:38.54 | IriX64 | heh |
| 03:39.18 | ``Erik | I think all my systems are using libs with debugging symbols all in place, and I even have profiling libs installed next to 'em on several systems |
| 03:39.23 | ``Erik | pheer /lib/libc_p.so |
| 03:42.05 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/FT2Lkg68.html <--- master plz, what does it mean :) |
| 03:42.42 | ``Erik | hah, that's a crash with no debugging information present :D |
| 03:43.39 | ``Erik | 'frame' is the location on the stack, 'function' is the memory address containing the function called at that time, and args is what was on the stack or registers or whatever the call paradigm is |
| 03:44.08 | ``Erik | in a debug style build, it would say the function name and what the values of each argument are |
| 03:45.23 | IriX64 | so all i need is to enable debug build !!!!!!! |
| 03:46.32 | ``Erik | I d'no the windows environment... |
| 03:47.20 | ``Erik | on gdb based systems, if you're tracking a segfault or something, you set your CFLAGS to be something like "-O0 -ggdb", then run "gdb myprogam" and run it from inside of that |
| 03:47.44 | ``Erik | (-O0 is to prevent inlining adn stuff) |
| 03:48.14 | IriX64 | prefer cref, but ill study up |
| 03:48.25 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 03:48.42 | ``Erik | bob and andre did a lot of good work to make things compile in msvc, which would let you use the 'debug' target in that |
| 03:50.50 | IriX64 | cygwin != msvc |
| 03:52.08 | ``Erik | <-- aware of that, has used msvc, cygwin, mingw32, borland, pcc, etc on windows back in 'the day' |
| 03:53.09 | IriX64 | missed watcom :) |
| 03:53.26 | ``Erik | never used it, it seemed more focused towards the mac back in those days |
| 03:53.37 | ``Erik | and macs were for grandmas and art fags O.o *cough* |
| 03:53.43 | IriX64 | loved it's os/2 support |
| 03:54.42 | ``Erik | only used os/2 for a few minutes... was hooked on his c64 until '96, thinking all newer stuff was dos... and couldn't tolerate the suckage that was dos, had used cp/m before dos got popular so knew what dos was doing a horrible job of imitating :) |
| 03:54.47 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/Chat.png <---- barring that bug its usefull |
| 03:55.05 | ``Erik | and in '96, didn't last using dos6.22/win3.1 very long before wiping it and installing linux |
| 03:55.26 | IriX64 | heh cp/m and mp/m good ole days |
| 03:56.02 | ``Erik | you still haven't put the havoc in a box |
| 03:56.04 | ``Erik | ? |
| 03:56.15 | IriX64 | why the suns there |
| 03:56.31 | ``Erik | because you'll get much better results much faster if you put a box or sphere around it |
| 03:56.36 | ``Erik | so it can bounce the photons back in |
| 03:57.35 | IriX64 | ambient is a better test though |
| 03:57.52 | ``Erik | erm, not really |
| 03:58.23 | IriX64 | cmon whats the point of putting a light bulb in a box with a truck to see how it looks naturally |
| 03:59.18 | IriX64 | just a sec ill upload the photon map control sheet |
| 03:59.43 | ``Erik | because it's a global illumination algorithm, in atmosphere there's all sorts of refractions and reflections going on in the air as well as off objects, in space there's all sorts of object reflection? |
| 04:00.15 | ``Erik | I mean, there was just an article where a team measured reflections of light from a supernova 550 years ago (tycho brae's) |
| 04:03.00 | IriX64 | global illumination :) |
| 04:04.13 | ``Erik | you're using photon mapping, right? |
| 04:04.45 | IriX64 | yes, my site photon.png |
| 04:05.08 | ``Erik | if you dont' have a box around it, or something for the light to bounce off of and around, you might as well just be using shadow rays on simple raytracing :) |
| 04:05.08 | IriX64 | not torpedoes :) |
| 04:05.26 | IriX64 | i just like the name |
| 04:05.29 | IriX64 | :) |
| 04:11.17 | ``Erik | aight *shrug* |
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| 05:10.11 | IriX64 | is finally gonna retire cygwin for a while, ill drop in from time to time |
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| 08:04.36 | sport1 | drinks cocoa |
| 08:15.18 | sport1 | elite01: i need your e-mail to send you these .xml - 17 kilobytes. mine is ilyaglkn@gmail.com |
| 08:16.14 | elite01 | @blinkenshell.org |
| 08:16.24 | sport1 | ok |
| 08:17.57 | sport1 | elite01: ok, there also will be my variant in another folder |
| 08:20.39 | sport1 | ...as those with no some wrong commented as <!-- --> lines, tag <i></i> is inappropriate, too |
| 08:23.50 | sport1 | elite01: bzipped tar or e.g. .zip if you're in Windows client? |
| 08:24.18 | elite01 | anything, i prefer .tar.bz2 |
| 08:24.36 | sport1 | ok, i send it right now |
| 08:25.19 | Ralith | because 17kb needs compression so badly |
| 08:25.21 | sport1 | 80 kb (i have added some advertisement) |
| 08:25.41 | sport1 | Ralith: on gprs it needs |
| 08:27.26 | Ralith | someone's on gprs? |
| 08:27.31 | sport1 | oh... at a very 'busy' line - i don't even sure it can move to internet. |
| 08:27.34 | Ralith | that sucks :/ |
| 08:27.35 | sport1 | yes |
| 08:27.39 | sport1 | no! |
| 08:28.14 | sport1 | i liked it since i payed 4 usd for unlimited per month - but it was too slow/ busy at a day |
| 08:29.43 | sport1 | i think the mail has gone. I'm usually not sure - especially when it encrypts 300 kb-in-size files. |
| 08:29.59 | sport1 | Ralith: do you know some foreign languages? |
| 08:39.08 | elite01 | oh, the mail is there |
| 08:39.17 | Ralith | sport1: no, sorry |
| 08:40.02 | elite01 | your system time seems to be way of :) |
| 08:41.08 | sport1 | elite01: i work with radiation, and my laptop goes mad while i type :( |
| 08:41.29 | sport1 | Ralith: it's ok, i don't blame you ;) |
| 08:55.47 | elite01 | sport1, or anyone else, isn't 'dall' a synonym for 'erase'? compare the docs of 'dall', 'erase', 'erase_all' |
| 09:04.42 | sport1 | what does "file offset" means for debugdir command? |
| 09:05.05 | sport1 | elite01: d = erase, dall = erase_all |
| 09:06.21 | elite01 | hmm look at the docs for d and dall |
| 09:09.03 | sport1 | elite01: you can paste from mged_cmd_index.html - anyway, it will be a wiki - and someone will add examples && revise that what we write right now. |
| 09:16.09 | sport1 | -all deletes *implicitly* displayed objects from mged display, while d or erase - only explicitly-displayed ones, and all four commands do not scratch the database |
| 09:18.34 | sport1 | <para>ÐÑли Ñоздан новÑй region или ÑÑÑеÑÑвÑÑÑÐ°Ñ combination Ñоздана как region, - ÑÑой командой - Ñо region-specific аÑÑибÑÑÑ Ð±ÑдÑÑ ÑÑÑÐ°Ð½Ð¾Ð²Ð»ÐµÐ½Ñ ÑоглаÑно ÑÑандаÑÑнÑм (ÑмоÑÑиÑе regdef) знаÑениÑм. ÐÐ¾Ð¼Ð°Ð½Ð´Ñ comb и r Ñакже могÑÑ ÑоздаваÑÑ combinations. |
| 09:18.35 | sport1 | </para> some words remain english |
| 09:19.12 | sport1 | it's from 'c' command |
| 09:30.25 | Ralith | <3 unicode |
| 09:31.35 | sport1 | unicode, heh |
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| 10:32.07 | *** part/#brlcad mc96107_ (n=mc96107@adsl23-27.kln.forthnet.gr) | |
| 10:32.10 | sporty_ | Ralith: hi! |
| 12:11.10 | sporty_ | why don't someone writes something? wake up - and write! |
| 12:12.38 | sporty_ | i'm pretty sure it's a morning at brlcad's site and his wife makes him go to the church :) like Homer Simpson |
| 13:03.31 | ``Erik | hrm, it's 8am where brlcad lives right now |
| 13:05.45 | sporty_ | ``Erik: then he will go to the church right now ;) |
| 13:25.23 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:39.10 | sporty_ | starseeker: what are wavelets? as "small waves" or what? i mean overview page |
| 13:54.40 | sporty_ | "wavelet decomposition" - decomposition ..."by means of small waves" or "decomposition of small waves |
| 13:54.50 | sporty_ | ``Erik: ? |
| 14:07.45 | sporty_ | brlcad: "interrogate geometry" - does it means any special means to "geometrically interrogate" the geometry - except those as viewing if e.g. different parts intersect or not? |
| 14:08.22 | sporty_ | *Very questionable Overview page*. Still translating. |
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| 14:15.02 | brlcad | sporty_: wavelets is the name of the property, not implying 'small' |
| 14:15.06 | brlcad | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wavelet |
| 14:15.54 | brlcad | see the .ru version |
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| 14:23.30 | sporty_ | brlcad: gold (tons of which i could buy instead of damn internet traffic) saves me from wiki pages, at least at a daylight. arrrr............... terminal, turning on java -jar $HOME/toonel.har, sys serrings, wikipedia2text go! |
| 14:33.48 | sporty_ | probably, "discreet (digital due to divisions) description of analog waves with appropriate tolerances" |
| 14:38.29 | sporty_ | as 'decomposition of polynomials, which describe a function', so wavelets are about curves and lines of 2nd and more orders |
| 15:19.36 | sporty_ | can i add wiki instead of Butler et al ?? i mean a lik on overview page |
| 15:19.45 | sporty_ | *a link* |
| 15:26.05 | sporty_ | well, this will be adjusted later |
| 16:30.22 | brlcad | sporty_: yes, all of the docs can be (and are) easily changed if it's an improvement of some sort |
| 16:30.30 | brlcad | including indexing, links, etc |
| 16:35.18 | sporty_ | Currently, only uniform binary objects (arrays of values) are supported - is it true ?? |
| 16:38.44 | sporty_ | ah, i think i has already asked it, and the answer was "nothing else isn't actually needed" |
| 16:40.35 | brlcad | you already asked that a few days about about uniform binary objects |
| 16:41.15 | brlcad | we say that only because the implementation is fully stubbed to support arbitrary non-uniform .. not because anyone needs or wants it or knows what that even means |
| 16:45.06 | brlcad | it probably just shouldn't say anything that "only" them are supported |
| 16:46.02 | brlcad | as just about any data file can be represented as a 1-d uniform array of bytes.. :) |
| 16:56.08 | sporty_ | "Any data file can be represented as a 1-d uniform array of bytes." - One of BRL-CAD developers. |
| 16:56.27 | sporty_ | ...for sorta things" |
| 17:04.35 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14D2D5.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:25.59 | sporty_ | scratches interesting place |
| 17:26.03 | sporty_ | :) |
| 17:26.48 | sporty_ | it's a directory with last few commands to translate |
| 17:27.26 | sporty_ | thinks about PrezKennedyJR's daughters. |
| 17:31.09 | sporty_ | imagines their chest of drawers, the content of two upper drawers. it seems whole universe is in there! What a wonderful things! pants! |
| 17:42.16 | sporty_ | starseeker: i send you whole *current* material in its final edition, b-t-w send in parts less than 60-100 kb in a separate letters*. (Or i may not even download it when cell antenna is too busy.) |
| 18:06.06 | sporty_ | starseeker: I must say I've started to edit the rest of the file mged_cmd_index.html - and i will send you bits of html |
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| 19:47.45 | sporty_ | hope you sport or with wives or sport with wives - not behind TV in a sun day. |
| 20:05.13 | sporty_ | happy that he's finished some works - and feel a rush! sporty_ wants to write a bad word! Bad word! |
| 20:05.20 | sporty_ | ...A bad word! |
| 20:05.30 | sporty_ | :-[ |
| 20:06.31 | sporty_ | :-[ |
| 20:42.15 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-230-13.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:42.25 | sporty_ | hi clock_! |
| 20:42.42 | sporty_ | don;t you have a clean asphalt to skate? |
| 20:42.55 | clock_ | hi |
| 20:43.16 | sporty_ | clock_: i love that film "The rules of 5exual attraction" - i'm on bike in snow, do you? |
| 20:44.16 | clock_ | sporty_: do I what? |
| 20:45.05 | sporty_ | 1. do you skateboarding at this time and 2) do you like that film and 3) do you like to biking in snow |
| 20:45.55 | sporty_ | i mean you probably have no snow on the asphalt (yet) this time of year |
| 20:50.34 | clock_ | No I am not skateboarding at this tuime currently. I don't know the film and I like riding bike on snow |
| 20:51.57 | sporty_ | clock_: i'm too. But why don't you know that film? its german-usa film, as comedy drama |
| 20:53.42 | sporty_ | clock_: i need to convert 2D dxf to some format as e.g. STEP, IGES, VRML or BRep... Which one is better? Or all i have to do is a try to do it? i need dxf for gmsh |
| 20:58.44 | clock_ | I don't know :( |
| 20:59.49 | sporty_ | ok, i will tried it |
| 21:00.14 | sporty_ | clock_: what languages except English do you know? |
| 21:04.12 | clock_ | Czech German and Swiss German |
| 21:10.27 | sporty_ | Czech or Czech German? We have xml files of command reference. 5-6 hours of work |
| 21:15.51 | sporty_ | i mean if you think you can spend this time - i can send you e-mail immediately, it's only 18 kb in size. It's a bit boring - it's like Saturday activity |
| 21:22.07 | sporty_ | ok, i need to restart |
| 21:23.44 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 21:46.52 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=mariodot@bas2-sudbury98-1177593682.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:48.19 | IriX64 | ``Erik... cygwin apps using the dll, *need an entry in the registry for runtime, just took mine out and all apps don't run anymore (GROAN) |
| 22:02.24 | *** join/#brlcad sport1 (n=z@loft1436.serverloft.com) | |
| 22:03.24 | sport1 | clock_: i'm here again, updating the fairy site naturalstuff.110mb.com |
| 22:10.16 | sport1 | what an odd-head! Clouds in his coffee, heh.. |
| 22:15.44 | sporty_ | can someone say if this "vouz a lae" shall be written exactly so? |
| 22:16.58 | clock_ | sporty_: Czech and German. There is no Czech German. |
| 22:18.19 | sporty_ | clock_: btw, czech shall be familiar to me since i'm russian - and i saw that film about the bodyguarder and yound scolar lady - can you say something on czech? |
| 22:20.52 | sporty_ | clock_: so, elite01 has told he can spend some time to the german translation, and can you spend some time on a french one? But it's about 5-6 hours, and only "first" 60 commands of all 400+. I can send you english .xml with my examples - and a color example "Where to paste the stuff, du-uude??" |
| 22:22.46 | elite01 | waves |
| 22:23.19 | sporty_ | elite01: don't, just relax and imagine some beautiful ladies |
| 22:24.01 | elite01 | nice idea |
| 22:24.26 | elite01 | what if i'm female? |
| 22:24.28 | sporty_ | elite01: yeah |
| 22:24.44 | sporty_ | elite01: then i will imagine you :) |
| 22:24.49 | elite01 | j/k :) |
| 22:24.59 | elite01 | no females on irc, never forget that :D |
| 22:25.13 | sporty_ | oh my! :( |
| 22:26.30 | elite01 | i'm sorry |
| 22:27.37 | sporty_ | no, i'm quite robust to understand the choice to buy new computer was wrong. Should buy a bmx for warm winter days... |
| 22:28.30 | elite01 | i like driving around on my bicycle in the evening |
| 22:32.18 | sporty_ | elite01: i'm too, even in winter - the routes of my little town become... smooth and have a jumping-off places each 100 meters. But when it's less than 02- Celsius degree you have a chance to hit the knee with a handle bar - the lubricant in rear wheel freezes up - especially if you rode at rivers at sumer |
| 22:32.37 | sporty_ | *-20 Celsius degree* |
| 22:33.13 | elite01 | not exactly a warm winter day :D |
| 22:35.17 | sporty_ | i mean when the temperature is about -9 celsius, but when it's lower than -20 celsius - it's quite cold - and i just do it on my smooth diet when organism is able to heat the hands on handle bars. I do it in jeans, so i'm a though guy! |
| 22:36.18 | elite01 | hehe |
| 22:41.53 | sporty_ | most of the people who likes it are too young for me. And they don't cycle. I also like to bike through the snow on old opposite bmw-like bike. Its weight is about 200-250 kg or something when it's single. Two carburetors can eat about 7 litres of fuel per 100 km. I want to reduce this to e.g. 4.5-5 litres - but don't want to put a single carburetor for both cylinders. |
| 23:14.25 | *** join/#brlcad sport1 (n=z@loft1436.serverloft.com) | |
| 23:14.51 | sport1 | uh... |
| 00:01.20 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177593682.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 00:02.26 | IriX64 | apologizes to ``Erik for telling him an untruth, was my own code ``Erik, i stopped playing with the dll ages ago, inadvertent tied it to my system :) |
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| 11:42.32 | claymore | Morning all |
| 12:19.42 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 12:42.22 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33310 10/iBME/ (branches/ tags/ trunk/ trunk/docs/ trunk/include/ trunk/src/): Initial setup of project directories. |
| 13:44.02 | brlcad | mornin' |
| 13:44.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33311 10/iBME/trunk/ (16 files in 2 dirs): |
| 13:44.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moving iBME to its own module. rt^3 is developing in a bit too many directions |
| 13:44.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: and has become more of a 'misc' module. My hope is to streamline organization |
| 13:44.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: with iBME and pull over applicable aspects of rt^3 as iBME development |
| 13:44.58 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: progresses. |
| 13:45.01 | claymore | howd7! |
| 13:45.07 | claymore | howd7 even! |
| 13:45.20 | claymore | fingers are cold and slow :/ |
| 13:49.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33312 10/iBME/trunk/ (87 files in 9 dirs): |
| 13:49.16 | brlcad | claymore: i'm a bit concerned by that direction, to be honest |
| 13:49.46 | brlcad | it's effectively a fork |
| 13:50.57 | claymore | I have been thinking about the organization for a long while now, and, honestly, there are several distinctly different efforts in rt^3. |
| 13:50.59 | brlcad | it's also pretty natural for things to seem cluttered and messy when it's not code you wrote (whether it *actually* is or isn't) |
| 13:52.04 | claymore | And that the way that the iBME/GS/GE is porgressing, it was going to rapidly take over the rt^3 module... and i definetly don't want to step on peoples toes. |
| 13:52.37 | claymore | So the path I see is to seperate, evaluate and re integrate. |
| 13:52.47 | brlcad | it's akin to you saying, I don't want to play in that playground over there (where everyone else already is playing), come play in this new one I'm making over here |
| 13:53.30 | brlcad | I mean it's a *really* classic developer trait to do that .. but it's rarely *rarely* ever productive for long-term maintenance |
| 13:54.09 | claymore | brlcad: That may be your interpretation ;), but in reality is me stepping back, evaluating and coming back in a few minutes ;) |
| 13:54.38 | brlcad | like I said before, the 'rt^3' module is no different in direction than what you're calling the iBME module |
| 13:54.51 | brlcad | the projects, goals, and implementation pieces are even the same |
| 13:57.48 | claymore | To a point, sure. But like I said, I don't want to presume to start re-arranging other people's code when they might not have the same goals. |
| 13:58.00 | brlcad | we should have the same goals |
| 13:58.11 | brlcad | if we don't, then that's a much bigger problem that has to be addressed |
| 13:58.26 | brlcad | and not something that can be done later |
| 13:58.58 | brlcad | we should have the *exact* same goals frankly, and no work to date has led me to see anyone doing anything not within the same goals |
| 14:00.11 | claymore | :) if you say so then |
| 14:00.29 | brlcad | you shouldn't just start re-arranging other code regardless -- you should talk to those that worked on it, that's part of the collaboration and (more importantly) part of the long term maintainability |
| 14:01.51 | brlcad | it's also not "people's" code -- there can be stewards for portions of the code, but there aren't personal boudaries in the code |
| 14:02.09 | brlcad | there should be nothing that prevents anyone else from working on and improving *any* other code |
| 14:02.19 | brlcad | no matter who wrote it, how new or old that code has been there |
| 14:03.42 | claymore | when would be a good day to bounce some build system questions off ya? |
| 14:04.06 | brlcad | any day |
| 14:04.18 | brlcad | shoot |
| 14:07.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33313 10/rt^3/trunk/src/iBME/: Moving GS and GE components in adhere to rt^3 guidelines. |
| 14:07.45 | claymore | non specific, more general questions, actually. :/ |
| 14:09.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33314 10/rt^3/trunk/docs/: Moving GS and GE components in adhere to rt^3 guidelines. |
| 14:09.57 | claymore | the network connection here keeps f-ing up my commits... have to do them peicemeal :/ |
| 14:10.05 | brlcad | for what it's worth, here's a really good article from Joel that summarizes that trait aspect I was referring to |
| 14:10.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33315 10/rt^3/trunk/src/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Moving GS and GE components in adhere to rt^3 guidelines. |
| 14:10.16 | brlcad | they should be piecemeal to begin with :) |
| 14:10.37 | brlcad | moved this from here to there (because of blah reason) |
| 14:10.54 | brlcad | http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000069.html |
| 14:11.23 | claymore | exactly. Problem is moving 4 or 5 dirs is just a bit too much. Connection drops. grrr... |
| 14:15.11 | brlcad | hm, I haven't seen that on the mac |
| 14:17.15 | claymore | I would blame the ide I am using, but the internet and ftp are all flaky too. probably Windows :/ |
| 14:21.04 | brlcad | probably |
| 14:22.16 | brlcad | another good article from Joel (though not as poignant as the first), http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000348.html |
| 14:23.08 | brlcad | they breach into the higher level forkage issues (ala M3) pretty exemplary |
| 14:27.47 | claymore | good articles. |
| 14:28.04 | brlcad | joel is awesome |
| 14:28.30 | brlcad | i've not yet met the guy, but he has some outstanding articles and a couple really good books |
| 14:28.57 | brlcad | one little pocket book that I think every manager that hires a software developer (or computer geek in general) should absolutely read |
| 14:29.03 | brlcad | as in required reading |
| 14:30.24 | brlcad | "Smart & Gets Things Done", it's a great little guide to computer geeks, quick read |
| 14:35.00 | claymore | bookmarked that, thanks :) |
| 14:35.36 | brlcad | I have it if you want to borrow it sometime |
| 14:35.58 | brlcad | can be read in less than an hour |
| 14:37.41 | claymore | ha, now you sound like my wife. She downed the LotR trilogy in less than a day. lol. I don't read fast at all. |
| 14:37.45 | claymore | ADD maybe. |
| 14:39.50 | brlcad | heh |
| 14:40.45 | claymore | So, since you offered, how does the BRLCAD build system work ? :) |
| 14:41.39 | brlcad | we use what's called the GNU Build System aka the GNU Autotools aka .. Autoconf + Automake + Libtool |
| 14:42.54 | brlcad | I should prefice that the autotools are going to seem like hell BUT you should keep in mind that there is a reason that it is organized and implemented the way it is |
| 14:43.42 | brlcad | whether those reasons are good or bad today or even relavant any more are certainly debatable, but it's one of those high-hurdle devmanship projects that take a long time to become good at |
| 14:44.18 | brlcad | that said, it's by far the most commonly used build system too, by quite a huge margin |
| 14:44.54 | archivist | a black art build system :) |
| 14:45.05 | brlcad | there are a few others coming up in the ranks (cmake being a big notable one), but it's still top-dog and one that almost "does it all" and is usually pretty easy to find someone knowledgeable in |
| 14:46.10 | brlcad | so the build system starts with autogen.sh -- that is a script that I wrote that overcomes common configuration problems and "prepares the build system" |
| 14:46.52 | brlcad | it's effectively NO DIFFERENT than running a tool called "autoreconf" that sets the stage |
| 14:47.20 | brlcad | but as it's one step higher, it can actually detect, fix, accommodate, etc, other configuration issues |
| 14:48.30 | brlcad | so other starting point files -- there are configure *templates* (i.e. configure.ac or configure.in depending on the project, .ac in our case) and automake Makefile templates (the Makefile.am files) |
| 14:49.09 | brlcad | when you run autogen.sh/autoreconf, it turns the configure.ac into a configure shell script and the Makefile.am files into Makefile.in files |
| 14:50.14 | brlcad | when you run the configure script, it turns the Makefile.in files into a traditional unix-style "Makefile", and when you run "make", it traverses through the hierarchy accordingly |
| 14:52.21 | brlcad | if everything is set up right, the user that downloads a source tarball from us doesn't need the GNU autotools to be installed -- they merely need a shell interpreter to run the configure script and 'make' (and a compiler) |
| 14:53.31 | brlcad | those are bare minimal requirements that give a consistent and portable build environment |
| 14:53.55 | claymore | cool. thanks for that. No i just need to read up on make lol. |
| 14:54.39 | brlcad | actually, not much |
| 14:54.53 | brlcad | because you shouldn't really be writing much/any make logic |
| 14:55.27 | brlcad | you write automake directives, which basically amount to setting variables |
| 14:55.46 | claymore | Well, I am looking at the contents of the individual subdir makefile.am files. Just need to know how to define my own binaries and includes. |
| 14:56.04 | brlcad | it's usually a lot easier to (start to) grasp the gnu autotools by looking at exisitng projects than it will be by reading up on it |
| 14:56.16 | claymore | remember, I am a long time windows turd learning this for the first time :) |
| 14:56.17 | brlcad | if only because there are so many options, things you can and cannot do |
| 14:56.30 | claymore | kk, sound advice. |
| 14:57.09 | brlcad | actually, the minimal bits that are in rt^3 now for the previous code are a decent minimal starting point |
| 14:57.33 | brlcad | it'll take you through ./autogen.sh && ./configure && make should work |
| 14:58.02 | brlcad | so you can see some minimal stubbing in the top-level configure.ac file, and how the Makefile.am files are organized to build libraries and binaries |
| 14:58.14 | brlcad | and it only builds a couple, so it should be pretty straitforward |
| 14:59.07 | brlcad | the 'brlcad' module gets into a lot more advanced/complicated/special cases and logic/infrastructure needed to support the much bigger complexity there |
| 14:59.23 | brlcad | rt3's is nearly minimal |
| 14:59.49 | claymore | Excellent, thanks! |
| 15:01.11 | brlcad | so that's the 'easy' one to get up and running (someone autotool-enabled should be able to wrap everything you've done to date in less than an hour) if what you have compiles |
| 15:01.21 | claymore | Other question: in header files, is it a compiler specific standard to use a #if !defined(__MYHEADER_H__) for a file called myheader.h ? |
| 15:01.47 | brlcad | that said, you could also use cmake since it's not the main module -- but there the knowledge base is much smaller, we're just getting started with that |
| 15:02.15 | brlcad | mafm started his gui work for gsoc using cmake |
| 15:02.59 | brlcad | that's not compiler-specific, but yeah -- pretty standard to have headers protect themselves from multiple inclusion/declarations |
| 15:03.17 | brlcad | which was something I was going to change in what you have already, actually |
| 15:03.29 | brlcad | uuids in preprocessor directives is a bit nutty |
| 15:03.57 | brlcad | I mean it's clear why, but fugly as all hell |
| 15:04.12 | brlcad | the usual is something like: |
| 15:04.29 | claymore | right, I understand the multiple inclusion protection, its just the '__MYHEADER_H__' thing.. didn't know if that was just good practice or some sorta standard. |
| 15:04.52 | brlcad | #ifndef __MYHEADER_H__ |
| 15:04.55 | claymore | the UUID's are EnterpriseArchitect vomit. in process of cleaning it up right now. |
| 15:04.56 | brlcad | #define __MYDEAHDER_H__ |
| 15:05.03 | brlcad | ...contents |
| 15:05.04 | brlcad | #endif |
| 15:05.37 | brlcad | just good practice |
| 15:06.04 | brlcad | and if you want to get *really* pedantic about it, they probably shouldn't have a double-leading underscore |
| 15:07.04 | brlcad | even though that's what all of the brlcad module headers do (and what many/most projects use) |
| 15:07.30 | brlcad | "BC_MYHEADER_H" would be the non-offensive compromise |
| 15:07.39 | brlcad | or some variation thereof |
| 15:07.48 | claymore | Curious... whats the big deal with double underscore vs not? |
| 15:08.38 | brlcad | technically speaking, double-underscore preprocessor directives are reserved for the compiler to use for internal purposes |
| 15:09.05 | brlcad | the chance that the compiler would ever use something that conflicts, though, is absurdly small |
| 15:10.37 | brlcad | at least given the _H__ |
| 15:11.02 | claymore | hrm, okay cool. |
| 15:11.05 | brlcad | you can see the built-in preprocessor defines for linux with: touch file.h && gcc -dM -E file.h |
| 15:24.16 | claymore | thats a pretty neat trick :) |
| 15:28.08 | claymore | are the lines at the end of each file (aka //Local Variables: ) for emacs and other editors? |
| 15:39.38 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 15:43.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33316 10/rt^3/trunk/src/ (6 files in 3 dirs): |
| 15:43.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:43.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:43.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:43.37 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:43.53 | brlcad | yes |
| 15:44.30 | brlcad | they have a specific format that is recognized by some editors that help enforce/encourage consistent indentaiton and other whitespace rules |
| 15:46.15 | claymore | kewl, thanks again! |
| 15:47.12 | claymore | grumbles about the cruddy network io :/ |
| 15:47.22 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33317 10/rt^3/trunk/src/GeometryService/Jobs/ (24 files): |
| 15:47.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33318 10/rt^3/trunk/src/GeometryService/ (36 files in 2 dirs): |
| 15:47.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:47.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:47.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:47.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:48.29 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33319 10/rt^3/trunk/src/GeometryEngine/ (45 files): |
| 15:48.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:48.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:48.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:48.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:49.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33320 10/rt^3/trunk/include/ (4 files in 2 dirs): |
| 15:49.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:49.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:49.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:49.52 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:49.52 | brlcad | if you want to change anything about the 'standards' spelled out, speak up -- that is more so that everything is consistent than it is as a "thou shalt" |
| 15:50.11 | brlcad | and so we're not always discussing bikeshed issues that don't matter much ;) |
| 15:50.26 | brlcad | but there are a few things that are easy |
| 15:51.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33321 10/rt^3/trunk/include/GeometryService/ (5 files in 2 dirs): |
| 15:51.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:51.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:51.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:51.13 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:51.32 | claymore | Oh I will. I just need to understand al the 'current standards' and what they imply first :) |
| 15:52.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33322 10/rt^3/trunk/include/GeometryService/Jobs/ (9 files): |
| 15:52.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:52.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:52.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:52.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:52.45 | claymore | apologizes for the commit spam... can't seem to commit any more than 8-10 files at one time without the connection dropping. |
| 15:52.59 | brlcad | there is no such thing! |
| 15:53.11 | brlcad | you can't commit too frequently :) |
| 15:53.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33323 10/rt^3/trunk/include/GeometryService/ (9 files): |
| 15:53.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:53.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:53.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:53.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:53.16 | brlcad | you really cannot |
| 15:53.35 | claymore | has very evil thoughts.... |
| 15:53.38 | brlcad | I would have said there were at least four commits in there regardless :) |
| 15:53.58 | brlcad | seriously, it can/should usually be as often as you hit "Save" |
| 15:54.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33324 10/rt^3/trunk/include/GeometryEngine/ (16 files): |
| 15:54.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Changed header preprocessor directives so that they are NOT UUIDs anymore. |
| 15:54.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: Moved Header files to include/ directories. Renamed all file extensions from |
| 15:54.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: .cpp to .cxx per rt^3 standards. Added //Local Variables: blocks at the end of |
| 15:54.12 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: each file per rt^3 standards. |
| 15:54.28 | brlcad | the messages become much more meaningful the smaller the commit size |
| 15:54.38 | brlcad | and useful 10 years later |
| 15:54.43 | claymore | I am working on it. I just have to curb my pseudo-OCD towards 'commiting' vs 'saving' ;) |
| 16:41.26 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33325 10/rt^3/trunk/ (33 files in 3 dirs): refactored a few classes to use 'DbObject' instead of 'Resource' |
| 17:14.17 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14D2D4.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 18:12.43 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33326 10/rt^3/trunk/src/GeometryEngine/ (8 files): Cleaned up references in both cxx and h files after classname refactor. Individual classfiles in src/GeometryEngine now compile. |
| 18:17.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33327 10/rt^3/trunk/include/ (14 files in 2 dirs): Cleaned up references in both cxx and h files after classname refactor. Individual headerfiles in include/GeometryEngine now compile. Added 'iBMECommon.h' file to typedef UUID and URL classes until they are implemented. |
| 19:11.41 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33328 10/rt^3/trunk/ (27 files in 6 dirs): Cleaned up references in both cxx and h files after classname refactor. Individual files in include/GeometryService and src/GeometryService now compile. |
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| 22:24.57 | *** part/#brlcad prasad_ (n=psilva@static-96-255-52-7.washdc.fios.verizon.net) | |
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| 05:15.35 | *** join/#brlcad sport1 (n=z@87.118.102.154) | |
| 05:16.00 | sport1 | odd evening! |
| 05:16.27 | elite01 | early morning here |
| 05:16.39 | elite01 | hi :) |
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| 10:54.49 | sporty_ | clock_: hi |
| 10:55.54 | clock_ | sporty_: hi |
| 10:56.11 | sporty_ | clock_: do you work with CAM ?? |
| 10:56.30 | clock_ | If BRL-CAD is CAM then yes. |
| 10:57.41 | sporty_ | clock_: computer-aided manufacturing.. E.g. the way they produce wheels at the American Chopper show, or just a program for cutting and laser machines |
| 10:59.16 | archivist | many versions/meanings of CAM |
| 11:29.00 | sporty_ | archivist: do you know any languages except English? You can obtain free CAM Expert if you can verify automatic translation to the couple of languages as Fr, It, De, Sp, Po |
| 11:29.42 | sporty_ | i mean my work before brl-cad's translation |
| 11:30.19 | archivist | Im English only |
| 11:30.36 | clock_ | knows Czech well |
| 11:31.54 | sporty_ | archivist: ah ;( |
| 11:32.07 | sporty_ | clock_: tell something! |
| 11:32.14 | clock_ | what? |
| 11:33.43 | sporty_ | as where can i buy an orange sherbet (exactly what i need if i will be in Czechia ) |
| 11:34.58 | clock_ | I don't know what a sherbet is |
| 11:36.46 | sporty_ | clock_: then "what is a price for this amount of fruits" |
| 11:37.14 | clock_ | Kolik stoji tohle mnozstvi ovoce? |
| 11:37.46 | claymore | 'odd evening!' now thats an awesome greeting... gotta wrtie that down! :D |
| 11:41.57 | sporty_ | clock_: still can not understand why czech human language and russian are so different |
| 11:43.12 | sporty_ | as "skolko stoit tot kolichestvo fruktov?" |
| 11:43.35 | sporty_ | clock_: ah, comrade! |
| 11:44.28 | sporty_ | claymore: odd | even evening |
| 11:44.54 | brlcad | thinks he ate too much popcorn |
| 11:45.41 | sporty_ | brlcad: eat bananas, mixed with parsley or celery in a blender |
| 11:47.41 | brlcad | that sounds pretty disgusting |
| 11:48.07 | brlcad | aside from bananas giving me heartburn |
| 11:48.13 | brlcad | that just sounds nasty |
| 11:56.27 | claymore | lol |
| 11:56.30 | claymore | agrees |
| 11:56.46 | sporty_ | brlcad: this food or death, your choice |
| 11:56.59 | claymore | milk after an 'over-greese' incident involving popcorn usually works :) |
| 11:57.02 | sporty_ | brlcad: naturfood.net |
| 11:57.30 | claymore | sporty_: it doesn't matter what you eat if you are concerned about death. You're gonna die anyways! |
| 11:57.41 | sporty_ | brlcad: if exactly grease kills you - get cola or pepsy! they are acidic - this helps! |
| 11:57.42 | brlcad | sporty_: everyone dies eventually, regardless of choice |
| 11:57.50 | sporty_ | claymore: not me! |
| 11:57.54 | claymore | the choice is how do you want to live until death? |
| 11:58.04 | claymore | sporty_: You're not gonna die eh? |
| 11:58.04 | sporty_ | brlcad: Dunkan Mc Loud - not! |
| 11:58.08 | brlcad | if I have to eat crap to stay alive, that's not good living |
| 11:58.16 | sporty_ | claymore: yes |
| 11:58.46 | brlcad | thinks a bowl of cereal will do just fine |
| 11:58.54 | claymore | calls the men with the 'Happy Jackets' and tells them there is a pickup in Moscow ;) |
| 11:59.07 | sporty_ | brlcad: bananas, nuts, nettle, - mixed in salads for whole your family - isn't a crap. But you're right: I hate vegan smoothies |
| 11:59.58 | sporty_ | clay 'Happy Jackets' ?? Jackets? "Happy Sweaters" |
| 12:00.05 | claymore | brlcad: true, but the original premise put forth by sporty_ didn't address *quality* of life, merely life or lifelessness. Jokes become very un-funny when you take something black & white and drag it into shades of grey :P |
| 12:00.43 | sporty_ | i'm about to drink w1ne in another room, so excuse me for an hour |
| 12:00.44 | claymore | sporty_: http://images.google.com/images?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=&q=straight+jacket&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&resnum=4&ct=title |
| 12:00.54 | claymore | :D |
| 12:01.59 | sporty_ | claymore:but with my internet access, i'm out of images - btw, i will download my free QCad and CAM Expert this night, licensed versions! |
| 12:02.05 | brlcad | munches happily humming 'cinnamon tOASt crunch!' |
| 12:02.16 | claymore | nice! |
| 12:02.33 | sporty_ | brlcad: gluten will have k111ed you! |
| 12:02.33 | claymore | is a Life Cereal fan. |
| 12:03.10 | brlcad | sporty_: more likely that my car will kill me than anything I eat |
| 12:03.17 | sporty_ | cereals is a first step towards vegan -> strict vegan -> re-born in raw vegan with raw salads |
| 12:03.26 | claymore | Personally, I like a nice warm egg 'n' cheese sammich in the mornings. |
| 12:04.10 | sporty_ | brlcad: no! ok i'm going to drink w1ne! Excuse me, the 'liverstodeathers' ;) |
| 12:04.23 | claymore | adopts a mostly veggo lifestyle, but vegan is waaaay too overboard imho. |
| 12:04.29 | sporty_ | claymore: i like chese + garlic, do you? |
| 12:04.47 | claymore | livers-to-deathers.... that pretty much describes every last human :D |
| 12:04.57 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:05.12 | claymore | sporty_: as long as its on top of a fat, juicy steak, sure :D |
| 12:05.18 | claymore | lol |
| 12:05.32 | sporty_ | claymore: vegan is hard if you do not take those endorfins from raw, exactly raw fruits - this is a way America is! Raw bananas and ,sadly, tons of dead meat |
| 12:05.50 | sporty_ | claymore: steak, no, no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 12:05.56 | claymore | muwahahahaha |
| 12:05.56 | brlcad | mmm.. steak. |
| 12:06.05 | sporty_ | ok, i'm closing a laptop's lid |
| 12:06.44 | claymore | yes, refrain from talking to us blood thirsty meat eating Americans and drink wine! |
| 12:06.45 | brlcad | to go fire up the grill? outstanding ;) |
| 12:07.44 | claymore | I had a neighbor (when I was living down near DC) that grilled each Tuesday and Friday, year round. I have a picture of him shoveling snow out from around the grill so he could fire it up. |
| 12:08.13 | claymore | Now, I like a good bar-b-q as much as the next guy..... but that was rediculous imho |
| 12:08.50 | brlcad | i used to do that over in abingdon on my grill .. not quite that into a diligent routine, but I was regularly firing up the grill to toss on a steak while the ice cycles melted off |
| 12:09.15 | claymore | there IS something to be said about dedication :) |
| 12:09.23 | claymore | brlcad haz it. |
| 12:12.06 | claymore | FWIW, Hereos Season 3 is making up for Season 2's suckage imho. |
| 12:16.32 | brlcad | awesome |
| 12:16.49 | brlcad | I hope to catch up in a week or so |
| 12:16.59 | claymore | did that piece of TV awesomeness get delievered yet? |
| 12:17.07 | brlcad | sometime this week |
| 12:17.11 | brlcad | looks up the tracking |
| 12:18.20 | brlcad | awesome, looks like it'll arrive Thursday |
| 12:18.36 | brlcad | which is when my awesomeness couch and recliner both arrive too |
| 12:19.40 | brlcad | it'll be at another week and a half before the guys come out to mount the sucker on the wall though |
| 12:19.45 | claymore | So Thursday is the official Day of Awesomeness. Nice. |
| 12:20.48 | claymore | Do you have some sort of tv stand to make do until the mounters arrive? |
| 12:21.45 | brlcad | yeah |
| 12:21.52 | brlcad | I call it "the floor" |
| 12:21.56 | claymore | lol |
| 12:22.31 | claymore | thats astounding..... |
| 12:22.32 | brlcad | it comes with a stand, so it'll just sit there until it's time to mount, then it can come off |
| 12:23.46 | brlcad | presuming it *can* be mounted, that's still tbd |
| 12:24.03 | claymore | is it just too ginormous? |
| 12:24.59 | brlcad | it's about 115 lbs, which isn't "too" bad .. but it's not clear how strong the support structures are on the wall I'm planning to mount to |
| 12:25.52 | claymore | Well, if this tv is as awesome as you say it is, then build a small false wall with some hefty 2x10"s behind it! |
| 12:26.19 | claymore | add a bit of dry wall, and viola, dead sexy tv mount. |
| 12:28.54 | sporty_ | i've used to grow up green salad (a pound in weight) on organic compost beds. Good green salad = salad, grown upon vegetative stuff, not upon e.g. dry blood of animals - because living beings try to reach the balance "acidic - alkaline" - and the ground is ususally a bit too alkaline due to our ecology, gasoline use and so on |
| 12:29.00 | brlcad | that's a possibility |
| 12:29.42 | brlcad | but that's also why I'm having a crew do the install too .. so that if something does get screwed up, it's on their hands to replace/fix it |
| 12:29.50 | claymore | just 'rescued' some prime 2x8" this morning :) 10 of them 7'+ long. |
| 12:29.52 | sporty_ | i plan to sell it is amy second business |
| 12:30.04 | claymore | sporty_: 'second' business? |
| 12:30.13 | sporty_ | claymore: yes |
| 12:30.15 | claymore | sporty_: Whats the first? |
| 12:30.16 | brlcad | his first is a porn star |
| 12:30.17 | sporty_ | food! |
| 12:30.20 | claymore | lol |
| 12:31.01 | sporty_ | first - my skilled work (as "must-have money") |
| 12:31.11 | sporty_ | brlcad: right |
| 12:31.28 | brlcad | by day he's a gardener, by night .. *bom-chika-wah-wah* |
| 12:31.40 | claymore | brlcad: whats a good way to find out which errno.h and netdb.h a header file is including if there are several version of each file on the system? |
| 12:31.47 | sporty_ | brlcad: almost |
| 12:32.01 | claymore | University Parkbench Porn.... lol |
| 12:32.32 | brlcad | almost invariably /usr/include/errno.h |
| 12:32.54 | brlcad | but you can turn on the preprocessor debug flags to see for certain |
| 12:33.33 | sporty_ | brlcad: can I .Tar compiled source for new installation? |
| 12:33.52 | brlcad | hm? |
| 12:34.59 | claymore | I love how incredibly useless man pages can be at time. man g++, talk about info overload :/ |
| 12:36.30 | brlcad | heh |
| 12:36.56 | claymore | don't happen to know what pp flag to set do ya? |
| 12:36.59 | sporty_ | brlcad: what if i save compiled source as .tar - can i use it into fresh system with same libs & packages later ?? |
| 12:37.24 | brlcad | sporty_: eh, that's usually how binary distributions work, so yes :) |
| 12:37.35 | sporty_ | ok |
| 12:38.31 | sporty_ | Who's played NFS Undercover ? |
| 12:40.05 | claymore | Last racing game I placed was an old DOS based version of Nascar :) Unless you can count 'Carmageddon'.... now *THAT* was fun as hell... |
| 12:41.15 | sporty_ | claymore: i know carmageddon. That was fun as hell, especially that 70th or 75th level with a beach, full of virtual people |
| 12:42.09 | sporty_ | ...and e.g. that police armoured car, which tried to seize you... |
| 12:43.08 | claymore | 'Anti-Pedestrian Electro Bastard Ray' lol |
| 12:43.31 | sporty_ | brlcad: "he lets me to go" or "he let me to go" ?? |
| 12:44.09 | sporty_ | claymore: anti-pedestrian Electro-Bastard Ray? I played pc version - don't know what is it! |
| 12:44.15 | sporty_ | ah! |
| 12:44.56 | brlcad | sporty_: neither |
| 12:45.12 | sporty_ | they couldn't stay alive, heh! |
| 12:45.36 | sporty_ | brlcad: "he lets me go" or "he let me go" ?? |
| 12:45.37 | brlcad | "he let me go" (past tense) |
| 12:45.44 | sporty_ | ok |
| 12:45.45 | claymore | Terminolgy question: Would referring to the statement: '#include <errno.h>' best be said: 'Include the system header file errno.h' ? Whereas '#include "myheader.h"' is said: 'Include the user defined header 'myheader.h' ? |
| 12:46.34 | brlcad | claymore: it's a little more tricky than that, gets into some very subtle differences between <> and "" |
| 12:46.44 | brlcad | but yeah, you could surmise it that way for laypeople |
| 12:46.49 | sporty_ | claymore: this difference is only important for random wild lamers |
| 12:47.16 | brlcad | usually <> is system headers, usually "" is 'local' project-provided headers |
| 12:47.52 | sporty_ | ...who can not compile their version, ...but 'full' variant is better |
| 12:47.58 | brlcad | additionally, using a relative path ala "./filename.h" usually refers to an uninstalled private header |
| 12:48.16 | claymore | brlcad: Well, since I fall into the laypeople category, humor me :) Trying to find the option that shows what headers are being included. |
| 12:49.22 | claymore | But no path name indcates that it is either 'installed' somewhere on the system (thats in a PATH variable or some such) or has been supplied to the compiler via -I (or some other means) ....or am I way off? |
| 12:50.01 | brlcad | make CXXFLAGS=-H |
| 12:50.08 | brlcad | -H is to display headers |
| 12:50.57 | brlcad | even with a path name, if it's ralative, it uses either system search paths or -I provided paths |
| 13:02.45 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14C4C8.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:24.37 | sporty_ | i think i'm offline again |
| 13:24.47 | claymore | drunk? |
| 13:24.50 | claymore | :D |
| 13:25.03 | sporty_ | no! |
| 13:25.46 | sporty_ | /me re-arranges files - by-system-needed-files on offline pc are important |
| 13:26.36 | sporty_ | can cd be a safe place for files? what if i will have scratched it? oh my! |
| 13:26.48 | clock_ | sporty_: use optar then ;-) |
| 13:26.53 | claymore | oh my indeed! |
| 13:26.54 | sporty_ | need to clean the hdd (not my) |
| 13:26.59 | sporty_ | clock_: optar ?? |
| 13:27.08 | clock_ | sporty_: archiving on paper using laser printer |
| 13:27.12 | sporty_ | ~optar |
| 13:27.28 | clock_ | http://ronja.twibright.com/optar/ |
| 13:27.34 | sporty_ | clock_: i need to by printer for this |
| 13:27.42 | sporty_ | saves this link |
| 13:27.59 | sporty_ | but what if i scratch the paper ?? |
| 13:28.34 | clock_ | If you scratch little nothing happens |
| 13:28.34 | claymore | record it and sell the mp3 online..... "wika wik wik wika..." |
| 13:28.43 | clock_ | if you scratch too much, it may desync and you need to manually repair |
| 13:28.46 | claymore | dances. |
| 13:28.49 | clock_ | Or you lose some bits. But not all of them. |
| 13:29.47 | claymore | sporty_: Just make two CD's and keep one in a safe place while you use the other. |
| 13:29.56 | sporty_ | clock_: yes, and i probably shall scatter archives to e.g. 1000 kb pieces for e.g. cdrom |
| 13:30.04 | sporty_ | claymore: ok |
| 13:30.52 | claymore | only does the two CD back up for super important data. |
| 13:30.56 | sporty_ | claymore: my previous safe microwave oven wasn't safe! I couldn't even push the disk into the cdrom .. |
| 13:31.23 | claymore | .... you put a CD into a microwave oven? |
| 13:31.34 | sporty_ | i have two usb flash disks, 500 and 8000 mb |
| 13:31.50 | sporty_ | claymore: no, but i did it to destroy some data |
| 13:32.09 | claymore | ... ? what destroyed data? |
| 13:33.21 | sporty_ | claymore: yes, played in "spy & spy's secretary" with ms.sporty_ |
| 13:33.34 | claymore | 101% confused. |
| 13:33.55 | sporty_ | claymore: yes, data was destroyed - current has destroyed the metal coat |
| 13:34.20 | claymore | so you played 'spy vs spy's secretary' with a microwave oven and a cd-r and ended up with destroyed data? |
| 13:34.25 | sporty_ | hot sun can bend disks, also |
| 13:35.46 | claymore | was born & raised in the desert... so he knows about sun ;) |
| 13:35.55 | sporty_ | claymore: ended up with a number of psycho-physiological culminations with ms.sporty_ ...Some data had to be destroyed though. Such a tradition. Like "Mr. and Ms. Smith" |
| 13:36.46 | sporty_ | claymore: sand = offroad |
| 13:37.01 | claymore | sporty_: so what's that have to do with how the grass grows at the base of the Eiffel Tower? (aka claymore has NO idea what sporty is talking 'bout anymore) |
| 13:37.04 | sporty_ | ;) |
| 13:37.42 | sporty_ | claymore: funny thing, psycho-physiological culmination - just read about it! |
| 13:38.17 | sporty_ | claymore: that have to cultivate it, definitely! |
| 13:39.02 | sporty_ | updates his site's page |
| 13:41.09 | sporty_ | i just think two different flash drives are as reliable as two different cds |
| 13:41.14 | claymore | sporty_: There is some issues with the language barrier here. Going from CD-R data loss to microwave ovens to spy v spy to 08:36 < sporty_> i have two usb flash disks, 500 and 8000 mb |
| 13:41.40 | sporty_ | claymore: wait a minute |
| 13:41.46 | claymore | psycho-physiological culminations.... makes zero sense. |
| 13:41.54 | sporty_ | on ftp right at the moment ;) |
| 13:42.07 | claymore | 's mouse freaked out and did some unwanted copy/paste :/ |
| 13:42.30 | sporty_ | give her a cheese :) |
| 13:43.06 | sporty_ | claymore: do you have a mouse? it must be so smart to perform copy/paste!!! Whoa!.. |
| 13:44.00 | claymore | its also trained as an attack mouse and just so happens to be a great swimmer.... so don't anger me >8-) |
| 13:44.18 | sporty_ | claymore: ok |
| 13:45.21 | sporty_ | claymore: once i had destoryed data on cds in microwave oven. one in in a gas oven. It was needed for the government! |
| 13:46.03 | claymore | Well if your government needed you to destroy data on CDs for ANY reason... I sure as hell don't want to know! |
| 13:46.33 | sporty_ | claymore: no. i will have told you it! |
| 13:47.00 | claymore | doesn't not haz a headache now. |
| 13:48.56 | sporty_ | my copyrighted words: "People use simple words when they are in love - remember this truth. - i.g." |
| 13:49.27 | sporty_ | just digging my site (actually an ftp for storing data) |
| 13:51.45 | claymore | what is your site's address? Is it publicly available? |
| 13:52.59 | sporty_ | yes, same http://naturalstuff.110mb.com/ - but ftp for me only, not for all |
| 13:54.56 | sporty_ | these examples##,pdf will contain short examples analog->fea->analize->new->fea->some-inference |
| 13:55.16 | clock_ | analize |
| 13:55.26 | clock_ | does it have something to do with anus? |
| 13:55.57 | sporty_ | clock_: shut up! "analize" - if only to analize the science! |
| 13:56.09 | claymore | lol |
| 13:56.39 | claymore | sporty_: do you mean 'analyze' ? |
| 13:56.52 | sporty_ | claymore: definitely! |
| 13:57.59 | sporty_ | who likes "All the leaves were brown and the sky is gray" |
| 13:59.24 | claymore | California Dreamin' ? |
| 13:59.32 | sporty_ | by the time this science will be finished i will have a lot of time for snowboarding. Only an hour till the mountains...500 usd for boots&snowboard, 400$ new old car = jibbing and back-country |
| 13:59.38 | sporty_ | claymore: yes |
| 13:59.55 | claymore | what 'science' ? |
| 14:00.33 | sporty_ | claymore: and clock_ do you like "by the way" and e.g. "throw away your television" by rhcp ?? |
| 14:00.58 | claymore | not a big chili peppers fan... |
| 14:01.02 | sporty_ | claymore: "science" := more than 5 hours behind pc a day |
| 14:01.08 | sporty_ | ok |
| 14:01.44 | sporty_ | claymore: gwen stehani? i like tic-tac and the sweet escape |
| 14:02.18 | claymore | sporty_: okay, so for you its 'science' and for me its 'work' :) |
| 14:03.27 | claymore | Gwen isn't all that hard to stare at for a few minutes, but I generally don't like 'pop' style music. No Doubt has had a few good ones, but nothing that would make me buy one of their CD's |
| 14:03.32 | sporty_ | claymore: i meant 5 hours of 8-hours working day |
| 14:03.56 | brlcad | for me it's "fun" :) |
| 14:04.09 | claymore | sporty_: I know what you ment. and..... damn brlcad just beat me to it. |
| 14:04.24 | sporty_ | claymore: i'm a depeche mode fan, had full non-licensed discography in mp3 |
| 14:04.25 | claymore | glares at brlcad for stealing his joke. |
| 14:04.43 | brlcad | chuckles and gets on his way |
| 14:04.52 | claymore | 'non-liscensed' ? lol, does that mean illegal lol? |
| 14:05.15 | sporty_ | i also like 'counterfeit' of martin e. gore; sex pistols, massive attack, led zeppelin |
| 14:05.29 | claymore | wishes he could reach into his computer and throttle 'make'..... its whooping my ass :/ |
| 14:06.16 | sporty_ | claymore: 6 mp3 cds with full discography per, whole about 10 usd, ~'99 |
| 14:07.32 | sporty_ | have anyone seen "sketch show", that Britain one, where they help each other in toilet ?? |
| 14:11.40 | claymore | can't say that I have. The only real brit stuff i watch is Top Gear. |
| 14:21.44 | sporty_ | oh... "they" don't show it right now in Russia. I liked it. I'm looking Fifth Gear instead, but i like their lady a bit more than cars |
| 14:32.00 | sporty_ | ok, have to restart |
| 14:32.03 | *** part/#brlcad sporty_ (n=z@87.118.102.154) | |
| 14:33.12 | ``Erik | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:35.26 | claymore | because I am a noob, I will ask: if i am getting a '/usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lmylibrary' error from ld, and I know exactly where i have the .so, how do I force make to use it? |
| 14:37.18 | ``Erik | dislikes "./file.h", especially when abused like ".file.h" or "./FILE.H" (when it's actually file.h) |
| 14:41.15 | ``Erik | ok, all caught up |
| 14:41.35 | ``Erik | claymore: add it to the library search path, -L/path/to/mything/ |
| 14:41.57 | claymore | does it have to be absolute path or can it be relative? |
| 14:43.01 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (n=erik@ftp.brlcad.org) | |
| 14:43.12 | ``Erik_ | naturally my cable modem at home picks that moment to crap itself. |
| 14:43.25 | claymore | bummer :/ |
| 14:43.33 | claymore | does it have to be an absolute path or can it be relative? |
| 14:44.05 | ``Erik_ | claymore: use -L to add a library path for the .so file. If you're building the library and using libtool, treat the .la file like a source SOURCES=mything.cxx ${top_builddir}/libcrap/libcrap.la |
| 14:45.12 | ``Erik_ | it can be relative, but you might get malformed paths in the ELF header if you don't do everything exactly right (libtool was designed to solve the quirks of installing libraries on various OS's) |
| 14:45.33 | ``Erik_ | rpath is a bitch :D |
| 14:45.38 | claymore | actually, I am trying to get a makefile understand the location of a dependant lib. I am editing the LDFLAGS line in the makefile and am using the -L option, correctly as it may be, and ls is still returning a 'cannot find -lmylib' |
| 14:46.09 | ``Erik_ | here, I'll swing down and look over your shoulder, just gotta hit the head and coffee pot on the way |
| 14:46.22 | claymore | nice. danke! |
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| 16:17.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33329 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/master/ (main.c master.c master.h): abuse bu_debug to provide multiple verbosity levels |
| 16:30.51 | claymore | bah hell. Having trouble with automake: make[2]: *** No rule to make target `AbstractDbObject.lo', needed by `libge.la'. Stop. |
| 16:31.18 | claymore | whats that mean? Is it missing a header? some other source file is needed? |
| 16:32.26 | claymore | never mind. gnoob error. |
| 17:30.07 | *** join/#brlcad sporty_ (n=z@217.8.236.184) | |
| 17:31.12 | sporty_ | So can I download 32-bit 7.14 tarball? |
| 17:34.27 | sporty_ | ah, restart |
| 17:34.30 | *** part/#brlcad sporty_ (n=z@217.8.236.184) | |
| 17:36.01 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 17:36.06 | claymore | hai ``Erik_ |
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| 18:00.07 | sport1 | /nick sporty_ |
| 18:01.39 | sporty1 | starseeker: when do you plan to implement those translations - this month - or later? |
| 18:02.14 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33330 10/rt^3/trunk/ (72 files in 10 dirs): integrated iBME source into existing build system. Currently builds src/GeometryEngine/libge.la and src/GeometryService/geoservice |
| 18:03.22 | sporty1 | CIA-6: you're so... karamba! |
| 18:36.08 | ``Erik | it works again O.o |
| 18:36.23 | claymore | cablemodem? |
| 18:36.43 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 18:36.48 | ``Erik | cranks up some billy holiday |
| 18:37.02 | claymore | louder... i can't hear it! |
| 18:37.12 | ``Erik | how're your make/autoconf/automake foibles progressing? do you want a trivial example of something? or are ya good for now? |
| 18:37.56 | claymore | well, unless I am bending rt^3 over w/o knowing it... me thinks its working! |
| 18:38.08 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 18:38.34 | ``Erik | if you want y our brain to break, examine a generated Makefile.in, or do a diff -y Makefile.in Makefile |
| 18:39.09 | ``Erik | (learning to drive, one valve or bolt at a time) |
| 18:39.28 | claymore | nah, I am running out of napkins for the blood running out my ears already. maybe tomarrow. |
| 18:40.37 | sporty1 | ``Erik am i right to say: "you can convert files from a number of formats to other ones with those binaries in ~/bin folder." ?? |
| 18:41.24 | sporty1 | e.g. 2D dxf -> IGES |
| 18:41.32 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33331 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/tcl.c: Modified the rt_comb_get function (i.e. added braces around rgb and shader values when getting all attributes). |
| 18:41.42 | sporty1 | oh, no, bad examle |
| 18:42.03 | sporty1 | i'm starting to think CIA-6 isn't a human |
| 18:42.06 | ``Erik | you can convert to .g with any ${prefix}/bin/g-* |
| 18:42.15 | sporty1 | ok |
| 18:42.22 | ``Erik | you can convert from G to others using any ${prefix}/bin/*-g |
| 18:42.50 | ``Erik | we mandate .g as an intermediate format, we're not a generalized conversion suite |
| 18:43.26 | brlcad | hugs CIA-6 |
| 18:43.28 | CIA-6 | hugs brlcad |
| 18:43.29 | ``Erik | and almost every conversion is lossy and we are missing many round-trip things |
| 18:44.04 | brlcad | except g2asc and asc2g ;) |
| 18:44.16 | ``Erik | g2asc is lossy, though :) |
| 18:44.37 | ``Erik | if you have only v4 data, you can round-trip that... :) |
| 18:46.18 | brlcad | hm, what's lost? |
| 18:46.38 | brlcad | data may change on you, like sort orderings |
| 18:46.40 | ``Erik | metaballs, I think hyp was filled in, um |
| 18:46.57 | ``Erik | primitive stuff, new opennurb crap , um |
| 18:47.01 | brlcad | oh, but those are effectively experimental new primitives |
| 18:47.12 | brlcad | except metaballs.. that was supposed to be done? |
| 18:47.14 | ``Erik | not primitive, um, libpg stuff |
| 18:47.21 | sporty1 | hugs CIA-6 |
| 18:47.21 | CIA-6 | hugs sporty1 |
| 18:47.24 | brlcad | there is no libpg stuff |
| 18:47.27 | ``Erik | I didn't do the g2asc/asc2g stuff |
| 18:47.29 | brlcad | at least not yet |
| 18:47.50 | ``Erik | that's why I was bitching up and down about those being archaic and lame and talking about moving the read/write logic into librt (which I haven't done) |
| 18:48.51 | ``Erik | is going to try to get someting functional out of src/adrt for customers before vacation, so mball is low priority right now |
| 18:49.18 | brlcad | ah, I thought you had |
| 18:49.33 | sporty1 | i need 2D dxf -> .g -> e.g. IGES, STEP, I-DEAS |
| 18:50.49 | sporty1 | ok, have to change empty sim-card |
| 18:50.52 | brlcad | most of the serialization is handled via the ft_get() callback |
| 18:51.06 | *** part/#brlcad sporty1 (n=z@217.8.236.169) | |
| 18:51.09 | brlcad | sporty1: 2d dxfs "should" |
| 18:51.10 | brlcad | bah |
| 18:51.18 | brlcad | should import.. as sketches |
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| 19:08.03 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33332 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/dsp.c: comment out odd URI building |
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| 19:40.40 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33333 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libwdb/dsp.c: gut it, the VCS will tell the tragic tale |
| 19:41.32 | *** join/#brlcad sporty__ (n=z@217.118.79.35) | |
| 19:44.33 | ``Erik_ | wonders if he should've ordered a small sake O.o |
| 19:46.00 | claymore | can't handle your sake? :D |
| 19:46.17 | sporty__ | to love and to live |
| 19:49.33 | sporty__ | hole and lorry, my current line is too busy! to login by ftp! |
| 19:53.27 | ``Erik_ | feelin' a bit good, perhaps better than I should be :) |
| 19:53.44 | claymore | not the sake then, you just love your work! |
| 19:54.04 | ``Erik_ | I d'no, I was feeling pretty good about getting to commit this morning (even though it's lame) |
| 19:54.33 | claymore | well lame is cool too. otherwise I'm pretty screwed :D |
| 19:55.14 | sporty__ | to commit? yourself to belief? |
| 19:55.15 | sporty__ | i hope... |
| 19:55.27 | ``Erik_ | my valid verbosity levels are UNDEFINED_1 UNDEFINED_2 and UNDEFINED_3 |
| 19:55.31 | ``Erik_ | O.o |
| 19:55.39 | ``Erik_ | any more undefined, and it's too verbose |
| 19:55.40 | ``Erik_ | :D |
| 19:55.45 | claymore | lol |
| 19:56.29 | sporty__ | claymore: here's a letters when i type something - they appear when i push the buttons on a keyboard! What is is? |
| 19:56.29 | ``Erik_ | (and any more verbose and it'd be too defined) |
| 19:57.05 | sporty__ | i guess it's not a pdf book, so i must to read the book |
| 19:57.50 | claymore | sporty__: Is that some kind of riddle or did you just discover what the keyboard is for? :D |
| 19:59.01 | ``Erik_ | looks at the time, looks at where sporty lives, and ponders how empty the vodka bottle is :D |
| 19:59.36 | sporty__ | no, i just going mad seeing this 550-pages book with 8pt font... Oh my! |
| 19:59.39 | sporty__ | 20 mb of text! |
| 19:59.48 | sporty__ | i need to read it, better if withing two days! |
| 20:00.26 | sporty__ | ``Erik_: no, i have downloaded my CAM Expert - licensed |
| 20:01.47 | sporty__ | for former translations - now i'm about to reading a book about form-producing theories and e.g. feedrates of the mills |
| 20:01.51 | sporty__ | is not a programmer at all... |
| 20:03.25 | sporty__ | my lord, want to hibernate myself and male computer to read the book! |
| 20:03.27 | sporty__ | *make* |
| 20:03.27 | sporty__ | he doesn't agree! |
| 20:04.02 | sporty__ | sudo shutdown -me && +you now --charity-please |
| 20:04.16 | sporty__ | don't works! |
| 20:12.58 | claymore | seconds the vodka theory. |
| 20:16.31 | ``Erik_ | I hear russia makes some damn good vodka's |
| 20:18.04 | sporty__ | don't like the feeling alcohol dilutes fats all around the body. I like to bike instead. Don't even like "reinforced" wine... |
| 20:19.46 | ``Erik_ | I thought alcohol was unable to be absorbed by fats and carried a high caloric energy which'd often be converted to fat O.o |
| 20:20.06 | sporty__ | alcohol is our enemy - that's why i sometimes smoke garlic's stems |
| 20:20.19 | claymore | O.o |
| 20:20.41 | claymore | not that ``Erik_ would know.... :D |
| 20:21.17 | ``Erik_ | jiggles his buddha belly |
| 20:21.21 | ``Erik_ | 66 kilos of pure fatass, yo |
| 20:21.42 | sporty__ | not sure |
| 20:21.42 | sporty__ | i like champagne and wine (light wine) |
| 20:21.46 | sporty__ | i like to eat it over with bananas and apples and so on |
| 20:23.25 | claymore | i thought alcohol was the enemy? |
| 20:24.07 | sporty__ | ``Erik_: i've imagined you with short black hairs, in blue jeans and red t-shirt... And you? You're fat ??? No! |
| 20:24.07 | sporty__ | ``Erik_: 66 + 110 = 176 cm - this is your height, right? |
| 20:24.19 | sporty__ | claymore: it still is |
| 20:24.53 | claymore | so you eat the enemy eh? Want a cheezeburger? |
| 20:25.13 | sporty__ | claymore: no |
| 20:25.19 | claymore | :D |
| 20:25.32 | sporty__ | sporty__: :] |
| 20:25.48 | sporty__ | ;-[] |
| 20:27.13 | sporty__ | it's a morning of 48-hours day |
| 20:27.27 | ``Erik_ | 173cm, actually |
| 20:28.05 | ``Erik_ | (and, uh, long blond hair, blue jeans, and dark grey shirt, tyvm O.o ) |
| 20:28.24 | sporty__ | ``Erik_: i'm about 188 |
| 20:28.26 | sporty__ | i'm more beautiful then :) |
| 20:28.37 | ``Erik_ | o... k... ... |
| 20:28.53 | sporty__ | i can not send 5.9 kb to my site by ftm - only 20% is sent |
| 20:29.16 | sporty__ | j/k |
| 20:30.01 | sporty__ | i had dark grey jeans and green t-shirt |
| 20:30.05 | claymore | i d'no.... i have heard ``Erik_ is dead sexy :D You have to fight Punk for him though. |
| 20:30.44 | ``Erik_ | and punker doesn't fight fair, she's from missoura :D opening blow in a fist fight involves a pickup truck, followed by gleeful application of a 'tar arn' |
| 20:30.59 | claymore | lol |
| 20:31.28 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-243-249.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 20:31.38 | claymore | and not even a drunk vegan bicyclist can stand up to that! :D |
| 20:31.44 | sporty__ | once i had ixed old green + brown = jeans as in "Babies Got A Temper" by Prodigy |
| 20:31.46 | sporty__ | *mixed* |
| 20:31.46 | sporty__ | claymore: you've told you had hearth or what? |
| 20:32.01 | sporty__ | can ypu imagine, i still send those 5.9 kb to the site by ftp! |
| 20:32.34 | claymore | the hearth on my fireplace is rather nice. |
| 20:33.43 | claymore | if you meant 'girth' then my response is: "It was a joke you perv!!!!!" |
| 20:33.49 | sporty__ | "Preparing to copy 1 file (5.9 KB)" |
| 20:34.00 | ``Erik_ | build a man a fire, he'll be warm for the night... set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life |
| 20:34.15 | claymore | ``Erik_: Terry Pratchett :D |
| 20:35.04 | ``Erik_ | still hasn't gotten around to reading the discworld series |
| 20:35.36 | claymore | its great. I have only read a couple, but the wife is a subject matter expert on the series. |
| 20:35.46 | claymore | I have a few on CD if you wanna borrow them sometime. |
| 20:36.14 | claymore | is 'reading' Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth series right now. |
| 20:36.40 | ``Erik_ | hrm, mebbe I'll take ya up on that, I had the series on drive at one point, but had a drive failure I think (need to look into that) |
| 20:36.59 | sporty__ | i read Enid Blayton |
| 20:37.09 | ``Erik_ | is illiterate |
| 20:37.16 | claymore | is gonna leave a few minutes early to pick up a Redbox. Gonna *finally* see Dark Knight. |
| 20:37.22 | sporty__ | "The mystry of the golden key" |
| 20:37.35 | claymore | hey now, don't cut your ejucashun short. |
| 20:37.37 | ``Erik_ | the mystery of the golden shower? what? |
| 20:37.46 | claymore | vomits. |
| 20:38.06 | sporty__ | ``Erik_: golden key |
| 20:38.28 | claymore | hard to type when you convulsing with laughter..... |
| 20:38.36 | sporty__ | children detective system... ph... series |
| 20:38.48 | claymore | ne'way. i out. lata. |
| 20:39.07 | sporty__ | ok |
| 20:39.34 | ``Erik_ | later, dude |
| 20:41.49 | sporty__ | |_|: |
| 20:45.51 | sporty__ | "got to have a fun - it's all what make sence" |
| 20:46.06 | sporty__ | ah,,..,.,, haard to type... sleeping.... |
| 20:46.26 | sporty__ | turnc off turned on and sleeps |
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| 09:26.19 | mafm | hi |
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| 10:59.19 | sporty_ | hello? |
| 10:59.40 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 10:59.51 | sporty | hello, Ralith |
| 11:00.12 | Ralith | hi |
| 11:00.20 | Ralith | also gnight |
| 11:02.09 | sporty | Ralith: right, it's an evening. |
| 11:07.09 | claymore | Morning all! |
| 11:09.15 | *** join/#brlcad sporty (n=z@217.118.79.41) | |
| 11:16.29 | sporty | Ralith: what time? |
| 11:17.20 | sporty | adequate offset from your time =: my time! |
| 11:22.57 | claymore | sporty: East coast Usa to Russia is 8 hours time difference (aka you are 8 ahead) |
| 11:23.18 | sporty | 8 ahead or 8 before? |
| 11:23.30 | claymore | (aka you are 8 ahead) |
| 11:23.36 | sporty | you have another date then! |
| 11:24.04 | sporty | i read morning starts at Jaapan |
| 11:24.32 | sporty | i'm gmt +7 |
| 11:25.53 | sporty | claymore: i'm about 12 hours ahead - let me help you: tell me what do you need to know 12 hours ago! |
| 11:26.03 | claymore | is it 2:25 in the afternoon there? |
| 11:26.32 | sporty | claymore: tell me what do you know in future - to send it to "past you" |
| 11:26.48 | sporty | it is 6;00 p.m. |
| 11:27.47 | sporty | claymore: you have an unique chance! i'm few hours ahead! tell me what do you need to know few hours ago! |
| 11:28.06 | sporty | it's 6:25 i think |
| 11:29.41 | sporty | claymore: I have an evening of your morning then? Or do you have a morning of my evening? |
| 11:30.25 | claymore | sporty: are you in moscow? |
| 11:30.44 | sporty | claymore: in gmt +7, Moscow is gmt +7 |
| 11:30.58 | sporty | Moscow is gmt +4 |
| 11:31.18 | sporty | i'm like Bangkok |
| 11:31.23 | claymore | very strange then. every online calculator is telling me its 2:30 pm in Moscow. |
| 11:31.31 | claymore | checked three now. |
| 11:32.18 | claymore | .... how could you not see the difference between 2:30 in the afternoon and 6:30 in the evening so close to winter? Seems like night and day :) Do you stay indoors all day? |
| 11:32.30 | sporty | claymore: right, Moscow has 3:30 and I have 6:30 p.m. |
| 11:32.47 | claymore | oh, I thought you were in Moscow. Where are you then? |
| 11:32.50 | sporty | claymore: no |
| 11:34.24 | sporty | claymore: same meridian as Bangkok, south of Russia. 2 hours drive on car and I'm in those south mountains. The more south - the more it Himalayases me. |
| 11:35.21 | sporty | the city of steel workers, coal miners, and <!-- karamba --> |
| 11:36.06 | sporty | seriously, i'm too close to Japan time, which is too close to West Canadian or Alaskan time |
| 11:36.18 | claymore | Mongolia? |
| 11:36.32 | sporty | claymore: no, Russia |
| 11:36.49 | sporty | claymore: :-{ |
| 11:37.15 | claymore | i thought you said you were 2 hours south of russia.... and on the Bangkok meridian.. thats Mongolia... *confused* |
| 11:37.48 | sporty | i think time is a juridical fiction |
| 11:37.52 | sporty | claymore: i meant parallel then ? |
| 11:38.02 | sporty | meridian & parallels |
| 11:38.30 | claymore | So are you close to Irkustk? |
| 11:38.40 | sporty | right |
| 11:38.42 | sporty | close |
| 11:39.10 | sporty | but Irkutsk, not Irkustk |
| 11:39.26 | claymore | lol whooops. Fat fingers :) |
| 11:39.28 | sporty | it is an hour away from me |
| 11:39.36 | claymore | Angarsk? |
| 11:40.03 | sporty | claymore: Novokuznetsk, i'm from www.sibsiu.ru university |
| 11:41.39 | claymore | Wow, Irkutsk is only an hour away? You must drive VERY fast :) |
| 11:41.42 | sporty | claymore: if London is a zero gmt, and day begins in Japan - then time is a fiction and this fourth dimension do not really exists! (For that one who moves ) |
| 11:42.10 | sporty | claymore: no, an hour away in juridical time zones |
| 11:42.23 | claymore | Time is a man made concept. Its the only way our feeble brains can fathom why everything doesn't happen all at once. :) |
| 11:43.01 | sporty | claymore: you have a morning of my evening then? |
| 11:43.17 | claymore | I i get it :) Just by eyeballing the map, it looks to be ~1000 km :) |
| 11:43.20 | archivist | as a clockmaker I say time is real |
| 11:43.21 | sporty | claymore: what time? |
| 11:43.43 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 11:43.43 | claymore | Sure am. Send the sun over a bit quicker though, its kinda rainy and depressing. need some sun :) |
| 11:44.06 | claymore | Oh time exists archivist, but only because we say it does. :) |
| 11:44.16 | sporty | right |
| 11:44.34 | sporty | i'm eating in another room |
| 11:44.39 | claymore | Much like distance... it exists, but there are difference measures to a constant. |
| 11:45.43 | archivist | I fighting with a non working clock atm |
| 11:45.59 | claymore | what type? |
| 11:46.29 | archivist | a Merlin band clock |
| 11:47.25 | claymore | sweet :) |
| 11:49.02 | archivist | less sweet when badly made |
| 11:49.17 | claymore | sporty: My word Russia is a big place. I have only been to Murmansk/Severomorsk and just have never taken the time to look at a map of Russia and take in to account the map Key ..... |
| 11:49.38 | claymore | archivist: but still neat. Well, at least for me since I am not trying to fix it :D |
| 11:49.54 | archivist | had to remake parts |
| 12:01.04 | claymore | watched Batman: Dark Knight last night..... not as good as Batman Begins, but Heath's performance as the Joker was superb, imho. |
| 12:03.26 | sporty | claymore: say a word about Mrs.Batman! |
| 12:04.09 | claymore | the wife and I were making bets as to which villian's will be in the next one. I am almost certain of the Riddler, but she's got her money on Catwoman. |
| 12:05.14 | sporty | claymore: say a word about Catwoman! |
| 12:07.34 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:08.07 | sporty | claymore: my ate no-vegan fried in eggs+milk bread this time due to casualties. I wan to say i feel myself fatty life-looser. All the members of my body are full of this heavy things. Never more! |
| 12:08.55 | sporty | elite01: do you need QCad or CAM Expert - licensed, for some verification of automatic translation, Fr and De ?? |
| 12:09.24 | sporty | elite01: QCad and/or CAM Expert is what i meant |
| 12:09.59 | elite01 | eeh no idea |
| 12:10.03 | sporty | ``Erik: we had a nice discussion last time, you were a good guy |
| 12:10.06 | sporty | ha-ha! |
| 12:10.10 | elite01 | what kind of automatic translation? i'm puzzled |
| 12:10.39 | sporty | elite01: just edit e.g. |
| 12:10.46 | sporty | elite01: wait a minute |
| 12:11.00 | elite01 | i shouldn't be editing the xml files you sent me? |
| 12:11.09 | elite01 | *shouldn't i |
| 12:11.27 | sporty | elite01: it are different |
| 12:12.34 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33334 10/rt^3/trunk/ (57 files in 19 dirs): Added a simple C++ sockets library (socketcc) and a simple C++ wrapper around the pthreads library (pthreadcc). Added into the build system. Fixed a few svn:ignores here and there throughout the rt^3 dir heirarchy. |
| 12:14.32 | sporty | elite01: http://www.ribbonsoft.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1808 |
| 12:15.08 | sporty | elite01: this, read commented source of the pages at http://www.ribbonsoft.com/camexpert/manual_reference/ru/ |
| 12:15.42 | sporty | elite01: it is only if your skilled job need drawings |
| 12:19.52 | elite01 | ah, no, i don't really have any use for it |
| 12:20.07 | sporty | elite01: so never mind it |
| 12:22.41 | sporty | elite01: how are you with that files? I think you need some wine in cold Saturday evening - this is a source of kind words |
| 12:23.38 | elite01 | sounds like a plan :) |
| 12:23.49 | elite01 | i just translated a few short summaries so far |
| 12:23.53 | elite01 | i'm a little low on time |
| 12:25.14 | sporty | elite01: i'm too. I need to read lots of info - that's why i wanted to ask starseeker when will he implement this to server |
| 12:25.48 | sporty | elite01: i think i will translate it at weekends. |
| 12:26.11 | sporty | 1-2 hours of fast typing work - that's all |
| 12:27.48 | elite01 | hm, yeah |
| 12:28.02 | sporty | elite01: yup |
| 12:28.17 | elite01 | as in one boring physics lecture :) |
| 12:28.36 | sporty | elite01: right |
| 12:28.39 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 12:28.51 | sporty | elite01: You knew it! |
| 12:29.00 | elite01 | hehe |
| 12:31.50 | sporty | elite01: if you study physics, don't let your talent to go far: try something in www.geuz.org/getdp and www.geuz.org/gmsh, or e.g. www.freefem.org - this helps to remember formulae! |
| 12:32.48 | elite01 | hehe, luckily, i don't study physics :D |
| 12:32.55 | elite01 | not as a main course |
| 12:34.28 | sporty | elite01: architecture or mechanics? |
| 12:35.34 | elite01 | electrical engineering :) |
| 12:39.11 | sporty | elite01: try GMSH and GetDP then |
| 12:42.10 | elite01 | ook, thanks |
| 12:43.39 | sporty | elite01: it is more easy right at the moment - when you study this formulas. You also can discuss it with teachers and involve it into your term work |
| 12:45.18 | elite01 | alright, i'll take a look at it |
| 12:45.34 | clock_ | tarzeau: gehst du snoebere? |
| 12:46.38 | sporty | clock_: gehst! |
| 12:50.30 | sporty | elite01: it's about fem | fea - they can e.g. visualize the current in a mafnetron or model an electric machines. FEM | FEA for mechanics differs: it's separated from the physics to reliability and longevity. Forms & sizes of the details are in questions |
| 12:52.14 | sporty | brl-cad is a fast way to create geometry, the only way to manage complicated toologies on 'usual' pc with mean price |
| 12:58.48 | sporty | it's cruel: "i wanna play ultima online using razor" me: "razor probably don't want to play with you ;)" |
| 13:14.03 | sporty | hello? |
| 13:14.48 | claymore | hai! |
| 13:15.25 | sporty | claymore: hi! |
| 13:17.59 | sporty | so how do ya? |
| 13:18.01 | sporty | claymore: what time? |
| 13:18.01 | sporty | i have no watches in my computer... |
| 13:18.23 | claymore | 0818 my time |
| 13:18.39 | claymore | so..... 2018 your time. (I think) |
| 13:18.49 | sporty | claymore: morning? right! |
| 13:19.16 | sporty | "i don't care, baby, i'm not scared" |
| 13:20.27 | sporty | claymore: i still can send you important info from 'future you' to 'morning you'. |
| 13:21.17 | claymore | nah, nothing I really need to know. Thanks though. |
| 13:21.36 | sporty | As e.g. "Hello, claymore, i'm an 'evening claymore' - and i want to say: Don't eat that cheeseburger - or you will be half-a-pound heavier at the evening!" |
| 13:22.33 | claymore | Oh, no cheezeburgers for me. Big ol bowl of Beef stew! |
| 13:22.56 | sporty | cheeseburger <> applesuburban |
| 13:23.08 | sporty | antonyms ... |
| 13:23.42 | sporty | stew is a kid from griFfins |
| 13:23.56 | claymore | is that a book? |
| 13:24.21 | sporty | claymore: antonyms? applesuburban? Griffins? |
| 13:25.18 | sporty | Griffins = Family Guy |
| 13:25.26 | sporty | tv cartoon series |
| 13:25.55 | claymore | You lost me. I don't watch that one. Don't really watch any cartoons anymore. |
| 13:26.58 | sporty | "If you see grass in a pile, it is probably a compost bed." - the folks' poroverb |
| 13:27.45 | sporty | ..or AI, made upon a perl |
| 13:27.52 | claymore | Whats that have to do with the average airspeed of a laden South European Swallow? |
| 13:28.14 | clock_ | bin laden? |
| 13:29.01 | claymore | No. Not him. My post was just a joke. |
| 13:29.03 | sporty | ah?.. I just write sings like this: "Be a kind human of the world, yeah!" |
| 13:29.34 | claymore | I figured since you were being totally random, so would I :) |
| 13:29.55 | sporty | i was, heh... :) |
| 13:30.44 | sporty | âIt's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!â - Scooter's Move Your As5 |
| 13:31.22 | claymore | Did 'Scooter' do a song called 'Fire' ? |
| 13:31.42 | sporty | This my is my favourite: "Since all the words are just a vanity bag, shut up!" |
| 13:31.45 | sporty | claymore: yes |
| 13:32.27 | claymore | thought so. |
| 13:37.35 | sporty | Scooter has a nice thong "I'm Raving" - "...and do you really feel the way I feel?" |
| 13:38.01 | sporty | amd e.g. "Fate" |
| 13:38.12 | claymore | Unless Scooter is a chick, I don't wanna hear about any thongs! |
| 13:38.54 | sporty | claymore: hungry? |
| 13:40.02 | claymore | had a long night and is enjoying Beef Stew :) |
| 13:40.09 | sporty | claymore: "Roasted Apples", bananasuburban (as cheeseburger), grape juice, some green salad |
| 13:40.33 | sporty | ok |
| 13:40.51 | claymore | doesn't know what bananasuburban is... |
| 13:41.12 | sporty | banasuburban is kind of a raw vegan cheesburger |
| 13:41.21 | sporty | *bananasuburban |
| 13:41.40 | claymore | ~bananasuburban |
| 13:41.46 | claymore | :/ |
| 13:41.50 | sporty | banana <> cheese, suburban <> burger |
| 13:41.51 | claymore | talk to me ibot. |
| 13:42.23 | claymore | doesn't sound very good, actually. |
| 13:42.34 | sporty | claymore: you're not a comuter jeday, ha-ha! |
| 13:42.46 | claymore | If I want to eat a banana, I'll eat a banana. |
| 13:43.10 | sporty | claymore: why? It's like "Come on get a banasuburban!" |
| 13:43.35 | claymore | I have had vegan stuff before and didn't like very much of it. |
| 13:44.19 | claymore | But, as far as you have described it to me, bananasuburban is a banana on bread. |
| 13:44.34 | sporty | claymore: anyway, even the formula """vegan + sometimes a coffee""" is better than "80% steamed vegan ration + coffee + roasts-toasts-meats" |
| 13:45.08 | sporty | claymore: no, real vegan is e.g. fruit salad with veggy oil |
| 13:45.12 | claymore | i completely disagree. |
| 13:46.28 | claymore | Some parts of the world, like mine, do not have access to enough of the required fresh veggies to support a healthy vegitarian diet without suppliments. |
| 13:46.54 | claymore | As it is, I have to take iron suppliments because I choose to keep my red meat intake low. |
| 13:47.09 | sporty | claymore: well, i had problems with health - i have to e.g. look for chances something will be "diluted" in my organism when i'm on right ration - i mean e.g. those secondary trash at backbone and so on. Rode bike withing 5 hours at -15 celsius in thin gloves. Greatest metabolism ever. |
| 13:47.22 | claymore | So, I disagree with 'vegan is better'. |
| 13:48.03 | claymore | Vegan might work for some people, but not all. |
| 13:48.54 | sporty | claymore: i have only 3 month of summer - and i have only carrot, potato, apples (too little amount for a while) - any grass-like stuff as e.g. dry parsley, dendelion leaves and so on, beetroots, cucumbers (summer 'juicing') - and so on |
| 13:50.54 | sporty | claymore: vegan works after e.g. 6 months on such a diet - when your ferments can "forget" about the meat. "Grandeur disillusion FRME (for recent meat-eaters)" - this how this phenomenon is called! |
| 13:51.31 | sporty | claymore: we buy banana 1 usd per 1 lb |
| 13:51.48 | sporty | ah! |
| 13:52.02 | sporty | aaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh! |
| 13:52.11 | sporty | claymore: can you hear me? |
| 13:52.17 | sporty | aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111 |
| 13:52.37 | claymore | and I would be willing to bet that if the quality of the foods you eat are high enough, aka enough iron, then your can easily handle a vegan diet without fear of anemia. |
| 13:52.44 | sporty | RRRRRRRRaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazzzzzzzzzzzzzzz! |
| 13:53.32 | sporty | claymore: actually, it are my own organic veggies - grown upon a compost! |
| 13:53.56 | claymore | however, the foods available to me are pretty low in iron, so I need to either take suppliements or have the occasional raw meat. |
| 13:54.43 | claymore | So, again, vegan doesn't work for everyone. |
| 13:55.13 | sporty | claymore: the true: "After long-term raw vegan I can easily say if this food contain necessary for me micro-elements or not - just like a rat!" |
| 13:55.39 | claymore | I really have no idea what you just ment by that.... |
| 13:57.12 | sporty | e.g. when you're hungry, you can think: "Aha, i don't really want nuts - at least at the evening. I want some apples rifgt now - two acid ones, three with soft taste a bit later. I may want to cut these soft apples and mix it with veggy oil and some dry parsley." |
| 13:57.12 | claymore | But if a vegan diet works for you, then good for you. |
| 13:57.35 | sporty | claymore: no one has died from being vegan, and raw vegan |
| 13:59.17 | claymore | sporty: I beg to differ. There are quite a few cases of vegetarians developing chronic anemia and have died from infections. |
| 13:59.47 | claymore | however, in all fairness, vegans are not the only ones prone to anemia. |
| 14:00.06 | claymore | Also: A vegans die... just like non vegans. |
| 14:00.32 | sporty | claymore: it works for me, right. But, it can work for anyone. Just keep in mind strict raw vegan course when you will die from disease. I had problems. It is something weird when you feel this taste of bananas you ate two days ago in a mouth - dirty food do the same - but you can not feel dirty foods when you're not a raw vegan. |
| 14:01.07 | claymore | So, if you firmly believe that the diet you subject yourself to is the best for you, great! However, i know for a fact that it will *not* work for everyone. Such a generality is very narrow minded indeed. |
| 14:01.27 | sporty | claymore: no, i mean "general" cases - when some kids stop to feel bad since they go vegan (no bread) and so on |
| 14:03.31 | claymore | Vegans don't eat bread? That I don't understand. |
| 14:04.50 | sporty | claymore: people have no time and efforts to do everything rightly! On the third-fourth week of the vegan diet you start to feel so-called crisis - when e.g. you feel skin scratches and so on. Good soft diet as "Milk+fruits+veggies" till the end! |
| 14:05.52 | sporty | claymore: vegan dies from bread, to be correct. Meat is better, than any gluten intake |
| 14:07.31 | claymore | .... um you do realize that bread contains zero animal products.... right? If one chooses not to eat bread... than that has nothing to do with Veganism. |
| 14:08.39 | claymore | WHat? A vegan dies from bread? Thats just plain silly. |
| 14:09.03 | sporty | claymore: ~gluten, ~celiac disease |
| 14:09.04 | sporty | ok, let's have a meet at e.g. 2080 at Alaska: i will have come on a bike, though even snow - and you will be cute old guy, who will be so weak as old guys are! |
| 14:09.09 | sporty | ah, just try since people say |
| 14:11.05 | sporty | claymore: bread isn't a human food, that's all |
| 14:11.10 | sporty | claymore: vegans are bad vegans if thet ***had not unintentionally stopped to eat bread*** - e.g. on the third year after they'd stopped to use meat and eggs in their ration |
| 14:11.27 | claymore | heh, right. If you make it to 2080, then you're on. lol. |
| 14:11.37 | sporty | claymore: it's not a theory, all what i say about are testimonials. |
| 14:12.26 | claymore | Bread is too a human food. Bread has been around since the begining, way back when people lived much longer than we do now... and yet bread is not a 'human' food? lol. |
| 14:13.01 | sporty | claymore: then, ok, we have a meeting! in 2080, somewhere |
| 14:13.31 | sporty | claymore: you will bursting with envy! |
| 14:13.40 | claymore | I am begining to think that what your definition of vegan is a bit off from mine/the internet's |
| 14:14.05 | sporty | claymore: no, it happens due to feodalism (to store & supply with cereals is easier) and e.g. climate changes |
| 14:14.16 | claymore | Well, If i live to be 113 then I probably won't care about you or your veggies :) |
| 14:14.39 | sporty | claymore: mine is "raw vegan - or at least a vegan" |
| 14:15.11 | sporty | Alexander Chuprun 's book, Canadian Young Street Journal, or e.g. www.naturfood.net |
| 14:15.40 | sporty | there's english pages |
| 14:16.09 | claymore | Well now, Raw Vegan != Vegan. Thats something entirely different. |
| 14:17.33 | sporty | no, vegan = stop to eat meat & eggs. |
| 14:17.43 | alex_joni | that's vegeterian |
| 14:18.13 | alex_joni | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veganism <- for vegan |
| 14:18.20 | claymore | Veganism has more to do with the unethical use of animals as food than it does health benefits. |
| 14:18.23 | sporty | right vegan = some background as e.g. "wait 6 month - then you wil digest vegan food better, NO bread" |
| 14:18.43 | sporty | alex_joni: wiki has too conform pages |
| 14:19.01 | claymore | Vegans eat bread. Raw vegans do not.... per my interactions with them and what information is available on the internet. |
| 14:19.43 | sporty | claymore: no, raw vegans "tried to eat soaked cereals" - but "when stopped, felt better" |
| 14:20.07 | sporty | i think http://www.naturfood.net/english/ - i can not use http traffic at the moment |
| 14:20.39 | claymore | Then, again, your geographical area's ideas of a Vegan/Raw Vegan differ from mine. |
| 14:21.01 | claymore | Where i come from Vegans eat bread and Raw Vegans do not. |
| 14:21.15 | sporty | claymore: i live in a cold place. |
| 14:22.00 | sporty | we seed at may, harvest at september - that's all! |
| 14:22.23 | sporty | i like raw potato - and many like it. |
| 14:22.40 | sporty | *plant* |
| 14:23.13 | claymore | Whats that have to do with Bread? Raw Vegan's (according to my neighbors) don't eat anything cooked above 100 degrees F (Ithink)... and that includes bread. Vegans eat bread a plenty. |
| 14:23.44 | sporty | ok, i think i had good practice in english this day, let me gain some money - and in 2080 i will meet old claymore, in 2500 i will be a president of US! |
| 14:24.07 | claymore | I like potatoes also, very occasionally raw. Depending on the area of the world you live, thats an invitiation for death. |
| 14:24.07 | sporty | above 54 celsius degree, right |
| 14:24.54 | claymore | 2080 and 2500 eh? Well they will probably have you locked up by the end of the year if you keep spouting statements like that ;) |
| 14:25.02 | sporty | claymore: bread caused me headaches since 5 to 22 years old. I din't know a reason! |
| 14:25.23 | claymore | You probably have an allergy of some sort. |
| 14:25.25 | sporty | claymore: right, comrade! |
| 14:25.50 | sporty | i'm about an underground, dear revolutioner! |
| 14:27.04 | claymore | You are definetly unique. I mean that. |
| 14:27.16 | sporty | claymore: no, it was an excess of a gluten - this mucus like thing can also cause asthma... I feel, and i feel good, it's understood. And sometimes i'm sad, i'm sad and i want my dad |
| 14:27.48 | claymore | just experienced a Dr Suess moment. |
| 14:27.59 | sporty | claymore: have you played Grim Fandango ?? |
| 14:28.28 | sporty | it's a quest |
| 14:28.32 | claymore | Nope. A friend did... and i decided that it didn't look fun. |
| 14:28.37 | sporty | on pc, from '99 |
| 14:28.57 | sporty | but i didn't know english and it seemed cool |
| 14:29.59 | claymore | Final Fantasy 1-13 is more to my liking. That and occasion game of AOE or Civ |
| 14:30.21 | sporty | i don't know this games. |
| 14:30.48 | claymore | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy |
| 14:30.54 | sporty | claymore: do yu know "Dr. Metcaff" ? '98 game on ps, horrible quest? |
| 14:31.12 | claymore | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Empires |
| 14:31.33 | claymore | http://www.civilization.com/ |
| 14:31.40 | sporty | claymore: i saw game, but hadn't played - and my "http traffic" is a "http spot" this time of the day |
| 14:32.01 | sporty | claymore: it are non-cheap games |
| 14:32.26 | claymore | sporty: can't say that I have ever heard of Dr Metcaff |
| 14:32.29 | sporty | cheap game: spot, bmx, girl, 5ex |
| 14:32.38 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 14:32.55 | claymore | just curious... how old are you sporty |
| 14:33.16 | sporty | ah, 24 jack's as5 |
| 14:33.25 | sporty | and you? |
| 14:33.25 | claymore | pardon? |
| 14:33.35 | claymore | turning 31 this year |
| 14:34.09 | sporty | well, to be brave, 24 - but all the thoughts and interest are about the bikes, snowboard and so on |
| 14:34.18 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 14:34.45 | sporty | claymore: shall I write sir claymore ? ;) |
| 14:35.25 | claymore | Go right ahead. |
| 14:35.51 | claymore | Don't forget to govel before your superior thought. |
| 14:36.03 | claymore | *grovel |
| 14:36.20 | sporty | 31 is a pretty awful. what if i will have to say someone on bmx: "i'm 31" Awful... No, it will have not happened! I stop the time! |
| 14:36.46 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 14:37.28 | sporty | claymore: so, only 30-40 years to come? Time to think about the raw vegan! |
| 14:38.02 | claymore | Heh, well, its all about choices. Me? The last BMX i rode was the one I had when i was... um... 10. i grew out of those and got a big boy bike :P |
| 14:38.39 | claymore | sporty: Raw Vegan? Heh, not likely. That would bring about my demise much faster than 30-40 years. |
| 14:40.12 | sporty | claymore: you probably have a machine, producing a juice from carrot, apples, oranges? Use ati-oxidant from fruits & vegetables. It produces good breast & Co. Study children to love vegan foods. To be true, i have no idea what to do after work except bicycle or e.g. snwbrd in winter. |
| 14:40.50 | sporty | claymore: mind me in your demise, i will mind you - let's see who's right! |
| 14:41.03 | claymore | My family's diet is superb, thank you very much. |
| 14:41.38 | sporty | claymore: ok, but "armoured" means "protected"! |
| 14:42.46 | claymore | My oldest son could count to 250 when he was 30 months old and was doing basic arithmetic by 3. he is of the perfect height and weight and always has been. He is not a vegan. |
| 14:43.22 | claymore | So, to be honest, its a bit presuptious of you to automaticly think you know how to improve my family's health. |
| 14:44.21 | sporty | claymore: i mean e.g. cancer or problems with veins. Food theme is rather more intimate than e.g. words about the relations in the family. |
| 14:44.40 | claymore | If you want something to do after work, help out the common man. Volunteer at a local homeless shelter or soup kitchen. |
| 14:44.59 | sporty | claymore: rather to preserve since it usually goes down at 12 years old |
| 14:45.41 | claymore | Both my wife and I are very familiar with our family's health history and are on the watch for any of the genetic 'hand me downs' |
| 14:46.05 | claymore | I take it you have a child that is older than 12? |
| 14:46.55 | sporty | claymore: we have no it. I also have two backbone's breaks at different places (before i were 10) - so i'm in the situation painkillers vs. interest+sport when i'm behind pc. |
| 14:47.27 | claymore | so you have trouble sitting for long periods of time? |
| 14:47.50 | sporty | claymore: no, even doctors admit it. |
| 14:47.59 | claymore | admit what? |
| 14:48.29 | sporty | yes, but since i'm raw vegan - everything is ok - when i pay a time to do some sport as i;ve used to |
| 14:49.08 | sporty | admit that people start to "age" since 12 |
| 14:50.03 | sporty | these days i break my diet. All the same it was before - so strict raw vegans cures virtually all, just believe. |
| 14:50.22 | claymore | So... you broke your backbone twice as a child, and now that you have pain after sitting at a PC for long periods of time, you think the Raw Vegan lifestyle compensates? |
| 14:50.24 | alex_joni | some people used to say that about religion |
| 14:50.52 | claymore | alex_joni: use to say 'what' about religeon? |
| 14:50.57 | claymore | *religion |
| 14:51.26 | sporty | alex_joni: come on! religion is virtual, but i usually eat 4-9 puonds of raw vegan stuff a day! This what drives the health |
| 14:51.46 | sporty | claymore: that it cures |
| 14:52.11 | claymore | Okay, so what if studies have shown that a humans body begins to age at the 12 year point.... there still is no conclusive data to support the statement 'a vegan lifestyle makes you live longer'. nor is there anything conclusive to an opposite statement. |
| 14:52.17 | sporty | i can believe in sporty resilient women, which cures, though! |
| 14:52.22 | alex_joni | claymore: " strict raw vegans cures virtually all, just believe." |
| 14:53.18 | sporty | claymore: vegan style = more sport, more kiddish interests, more simple relations -> less nerves and so no, and so on |
| 14:53.35 | claymore | alex_joni: that does draw in interesting parallel. Since most (if not all) religions are based on faith (aka believing the scientificly unproveable) then the whole Vegan vs Non-vegan debate is also about faith... since nothing has been proven yet. interesting. |
| 14:53.53 | alex_joni | claymore: that's what I meant |
| 14:54.13 | claymore | alex_joni: That was me thinking with my keyboard... sorry :) |
| 14:54.49 | sporty | alex_joni: but i say i feel better when on raw vegan - i can cycling and not sit e.g. 30 minutes or so t the start |
| 14:55.14 | claymore | sporty: You still confuse me. Having an active lifestyle has nothing to do with being a Vegan... its just a smart thing to do to keep your body in shape. |
| 14:55.38 | sporty | ah, never mind long-haul debates - it is usually a fake! |
| 14:56.16 | sporty | claymore: when you sport, you need to be sure your veins pump good content |
| 14:56.28 | sporty | *pumping up |
| 14:57.41 | claymore | Good health = excerise >4 times a week, and monitor the quality and quantity of food you eat. period. |
| 14:58.09 | sporty | you may have e.g. a varicosis if you *have to * stay at work - on the legs after meattish ration, in the lower part of the belly - after bread-dish ration |
| 14:58.14 | claymore | I know quite a few Vegans who are in excellent health. I also know quite a few Non-Vegans who are also in excellent health. |
| 14:58.44 | claymore | Longevity of a persons life is determined by millions of variables... only one of which is the food they eat. |
| 14:58.56 | sporty | claymore: meat > bread - better than bread |
| 14:59.15 | claymore | So directly relating long life to the food you eat is foolish at best. |
| 15:00.01 | claymore | meat > bread? I disagree. They are both equally important to a balanced diet. When consumed in correct portions of course. |
| 15:00.15 | sporty | claymore: then i meant whole lyfestyle when i said about the longevity. E.g. TYou eat fruit salad when you hungry - just like young boy, not like "adult president of a firm" |
| 15:00.41 | claymore | ...... what? |
| 15:01.28 | sporty | claymore: Sir Claymore |
| 15:01.33 | sporty | :) |
| 15:01.45 | claymore | Thats better. Now kneel. |
| 15:01.51 | sporty | can't type anymore |
| 15:02.06 | sporty | kneekicks claymore |
| 15:02.29 | sporty | Sir Higher Sporty |
| 15:02.48 | claymore | i'll agree with the 'high' part. |
| 15:02.56 | claymore | :D |
| 15:03.28 | sporty | claymore: how about Discovery? Bear Grills? I mean rather non-complicated foods than any theory then |
| 15:04.08 | sporty | claymore: so how about to eat fruit salad? Do you like it? |
| 15:04.10 | claymore | Discovery.... the TV channel? .... the NASA orbiter? |
| 15:04.22 | sporty | claymore: yes, tv channel |
| 15:04.30 | claymore | I love fruit salad. In fact, I have some here to do with lunch. |
| 15:04.45 | claymore | What is 'Bear Grills' ? |
| 15:04.54 | claymore | to do = to go |
| 15:05.46 | sporty | claymore: what if you eat it today with some veggy oil to get fats, and tomorrow, and later? What will happen? Almost nothing! But you will be full of energy after few months |
| 15:06.09 | sporty | claymore: Extremal Surviaval Guide. |
| 15:06.13 | claymore | I am full of energy right now. Who said I wasn't? |
| 15:06.37 | claymore | Never seen that show. |
| 15:07.06 | claymore | I have saw a commercial or two, but I generally don't watch too much tv. Way too much to do around the house. |
| 15:07.32 | sporty | claymore: well, i know a source of a very inspiring words, and i have done it - i know what they say about, that's all. Nothing to do with talks and debates. Debates are always a fake, remember it. |
| 15:08.15 | claymore | Debates are only worthless if one of the sides has a closed mind. Otherwise they are very VERY worthwhile. |
| 15:08.20 | sporty | claymore: but i look it whilst the routin work behind pc, as e.g. awaiting the results and so on |
| 15:08.46 | sporty | claymore: but i have not inspirited you to evan try |
| 15:09.02 | sporty | i.e. it wasn't worthwhile |
| 15:09.23 | claymore | and that just proves that you either didn't listen to what I had to say, or didn't understand. |
| 15:10.28 | claymore | My wife and I have already tried as much of a vegetarian diet as we possibly can without running the risk of health problems. This is based on the foods available to us and our family's health history. |
| 15:11.01 | claymore | If the point of any 'diet' is to keep your body as healthy as possible, then thats exactly what we are doing. |
| 15:11.18 | claymore | Veganism is not the ONLY diet that promotes good health. |
| 15:11.47 | claymore | There is no conclusive studies to show if any specific diet is better than another. |
| 15:12.08 | sporty | claymore: i want to say raw vegan is a bit more than any human can write about. It's like... you feel a dick, you can end up some task withing 10 days and ten nights with no being tired and so on. Another way of metabolism, great changes in the organism. Later, you discover the changes past/now. And feel a fear that something can go back. Not much from theories actually. |
| 15:12.34 | claymore | If you honestly believe that Veganism is the best for you, then thats just fine! But don't presume to know that you know what is best for anyone other than yourself. |
| 15:13.07 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 15:13.25 | sporty | claymore: but i still can offer it |
| 15:13.42 | claymore | sporty: No need to offer when its already been considered. |
| 15:13.51 | claymore | .... and partially implemented. |
| 15:14.29 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 15:16.57 | sporty | will watch Tv and drink cocoa with milk since i break my diet these days. I wish i feel myself as best as before. Or i would finish current goals behind PC twice a faster! |
| 15:18.50 | claymore | So stop wishing and make it happen Vegan man! |
| 15:22.04 | claymore | You sure aren't gonna make it to 2080 and be able to laugh at me when you are sucking down Hot Cocoa while sitting on your butt watching TV! Remove the chair from your PC desk and jog in place while you work the Translations for BRL-CAD! |
| 15:22.12 | claymore | :D |
| 15:22.32 | claymore | I wanna see 30 mins joggin in place. Begin. |
| 15:23.11 | clock_ | claymore: I don't even have a chair on PC. I have a stationary bicycle instead of it |
| 15:23.20 | clock_ | claymore: so I can either stand, or sit on a stationary bike, or pedal the bike |
| 15:23.34 | claymore | does it power the electric generator that runs your computer? That's my idea of dedication! |
| 15:23.46 | clock_ | yes it did before the overvoltage protection blew |
| 15:23.50 | clock_ | now I have to design a better one |
| 15:24.03 | claymore | lol |
| 15:24.04 | clock_ | I will not run my PC again without overvoltage protection |
| 15:24.18 | clock_ | I already gave 400V to my laptop when it's rated to max. 357V (rectified 240V) |
| 15:24.27 | claymore | no offense, but thats a given :) |
| 15:24.34 | clock_ | yesterday I tried a 60W 230V bulb on 400V |
| 15:24.41 | clock_ | It's so hot it shines almost blue |
| 15:24.42 | claymore | lol |
| 15:24.44 | clock_ | like an A-Bomb! |
| 15:24.59 | claymore | oh, an A-bomb is blue eh? |
| 15:25.12 | clock_ | dunno. But as bright :) |
| 15:25.23 | claymore | :) |
| 15:25.32 | claymore | VRs are super simple and cheap. |
| 15:25.37 | clock_ | what is it? |
| 15:25.47 | claymore | Voltage Regulators |
| 15:26.11 | clock_ | I need something bit different |
| 15:26.13 | claymore | especially if the load is moderately constant. |
| 15:26.20 | clock_ | a simple VR would expose the machine to dangerous level of dry-run voltage |
| 15:26.37 | claymore | depends on how you build it. |
| 15:26.57 | clock_ | it's a self excited induction generator |
| 15:27.08 | claymore | ac or dc? |
| 15:27.17 | clock_ | an asynchronous 3-phase sine wave generator working on the principle of resonant circuit between the winding inductance and excitation capacitance |
| 15:27.30 | clock_ | so it has tendency to produce tremendous amounts of power under certain conditions |
| 15:28.07 | claymore | ... that doesn't make sense. A generator only makes voltage. power output is a function of load on the line. |
| 15:28.35 | claymore | is assuming 50 or 60 hz? or is it a high freg gen? |
| 15:28.37 | clock_ | here the voltage increases exponentially until something goes |
| 15:28.44 | clock_ | normally the core saturates and starts heating |
| 15:28.49 | clock_ | 50 Hz |
| 15:28.56 | clock_ | 25-30 Hz at shaft |
| 15:29.06 | claymore | whats the prime mover>? |
| 15:29.12 | clock_ | stationary bicycle |
| 15:29.15 | claymore | lol |
| 15:29.16 | claymore | okay |
| 15:29.35 | clock_ | without load it goes easily over 500V |
| 15:29.36 | claymore | so its variable frequency out put with a max of ..... 50hz> |
| 15:29.38 | claymore | ? |
| 15:29.44 | clock_ | the caps also have some limited rating I don't want to blow them |
| 15:29.53 | clock_ | no it's a variable frequency without any max |
| 15:29.57 | clock_ | you can pedal as fast as you want |
| 15:30.18 | claymore | whats the use? aka, what is it powering? |
| 15:30.25 | clock_ | powering? |
| 15:30.31 | clock_ | the use is for fitness and fun |
| 15:30.52 | claymore | so if there is no load, then there is no problem with anything the generator does..... |
| 15:30.57 | clock_ | ah yeah sometiems I connect a soldering iron sometimes a light bulb sometimes a fluorescent, or a laptop |
| 15:31.07 | clock_ | well it self-destructs |
| 15:31.09 | sporty | claymore: ok, but i translate behind old American Chopper series |
| 15:31.20 | clock_ | the produced energy is used to destroy it's own electrical components |
| 15:31.25 | claymore | so the various loads are AC loads? |
| 15:31.32 | clock_ | break the caps through, spark over the windings,... |
| 15:31.39 | clock_ | no it's DC loads |
| 15:31.46 | clock_ | I have a 6-way erctifier |
| 15:32.01 | clock_ | ordinary PC doesn't take 3-phase power |
| 15:32.11 | clock_ | maybe the future Windows Vista models will, but not the current ones :) |
| 15:32.28 | claymore | true, but wiring across two of the three lines yeilds single phase. |
| 15:32.43 | sporty | claymore: loads whilst the bad food = varicosis |
| 15:32.48 | clock_ | yes and also yields a lot of problems for the generator |
| 15:33.10 | clock_ | local winding overheat, decrease of efficiency, increase of vibrations, more problematic excitation... |
| 15:33.11 | sporty | clock_: i bet you know something about the motor-wheels |
| 15:33.18 | clock_ | what is it? |
| 15:33.39 | sporty | clock_: engine in the rim, ancor in the axle |
| 15:33.47 | clock_ | no I don't know |
| 15:33.53 | sporty | 2x2 bikes |
| 15:33.54 | claymore | there two options, that I can immediately see: add a shunt winding to the generator |
| 15:34.04 | clock_ | what is it? |
| 15:34.32 | claymore | or make a VFD (Variable frequency drive) and just use it backwards. |
| 15:35.07 | clock_ | VFD is too complicated |
| 15:35.24 | clock_ | What I want is a thyristor that gets triggered when the voltage exceeds safe level and shorts the generator |
| 15:35.25 | claymore | with an extremely variable prime mover on the generator, there is not all encompassing solution :/ |
| 15:35.50 | clock_ | The rotor demagnetizes until there is no current produced then the thyristor releases and the generator boots up again |
| 15:36.06 | clock_ | The result will be a jerk - release of torque on the shaft - and voltage limitation |
| 15:36.19 | clock_ | The reboot cycle will be covered by a large electrolyte |
| 15:36.29 | clock_ | and it will give a force feedback that youre pedalling too fast :) |
| 15:36.40 | claymore | well then, if you want low tech, just chain a bunch of zeiners in series with a high wattage resistor. That will shunt the extra voltage and keep output V from going any higher, all the while maintaining power to the loads. |
| 15:36.45 | clock_ | Also waste a bit energy by dumping the core magnetism, but I hope that won't be much |
| 15:37.04 | clock_ | that's a what I did |
| 15:37.11 | clock_ | with a 200W MOSFET on a massive heatsink |
| 15:37.31 | clock_ | The problem is when you short the output spin the wheel fast then the generator is not braking at all |
| 15:38.19 | clock_ | when you remove the short, the voltage builds up exponentially, braking the wheel suddenly and dumping all the joules into whatever you have there to consume the power |
| 15:38.19 | clock_ | resulting in a meltdown |
| 15:38.19 | clock_ | It's a resonant generator, a pwoerful beast ;-) |
| 15:38.27 | clock_ | With a 60W motor I can dar 280W of output ;-) |
| 15:38.30 | clock_ | dar -> draw |
| 15:38.33 | claymore | ... I am not talking about using any form of transistor. Just a bunch of Zenier Diodes in series with a high wattage Resistor. No shorting involved at all. |
| 15:38.45 | clock_ | zener diode can survive about 10W |
| 15:39.12 | clock_ | And your setup will consume power even when the critical voltage is not reached. I don't want this at all |
| 15:40.53 | sporty | claymore: do you have any electrical education |
| 15:41.18 | claymore | eh? um, no it won't. chaining Zeners in series cumulatively adds the breakdown voltage. Just put enough in to equal ~400V and the whole series won't conduct till then. |
| 15:41.35 | clock_ | yes but then all the power will dissipate on the zener |
| 15:41.36 | claymore | sporty: yes, i spent 10 years in the US navy as a Nuclear Electrician. |
| 15:41.37 | clock_ | zeners |
| 15:41.46 | clock_ | I said 200W transistor was melted. You can't even get a 200W zener |
| 15:42.09 | clock_ | it's a bit like compulsator ;-) |
| 15:42.28 | claymore | No, not all. Thats why the Resistor is there in series with the Zeners... to limit the max amount of current flow through that branch. |
| 15:42.32 | sporty | claymore: ok then. Because i shall know the same about the electric machines - and i only know some parts :( |
| 15:42.46 | claymore | and I know where to get 50W Zeners at a decent price. |
| 15:44.14 | claymore | So you make a 'zener branch' with enough 50W Zeners to reach the desired voltage you want to preotect against and rate the resistor to limit it to 50W max. Then you add multple branches in parallel to achieve the desired total Power Shunting you want |
| 15:44.27 | clock_ | sure |
| 15:44.29 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:44.35 | clock_ | but I think my thyristor solution is better |
| 15:44.44 | clock_ | it will not dissipate any heat |
| 15:44.56 | clock_ | all the heat will be dissipated in the asynchronous motor |
| 15:45.02 | sporty | ``Erik: hello! |
| 15:45.04 | clock_ | which has an integrated cooling fan ;-) |
| 15:45.11 | sporty | ``Erik: i wanted to ask you |
| 15:45.23 | clock_ | and I will get force feedback! |
| 15:45.36 | claymore | but you described several phsyical shocks that the motor will recieve.... that will destroy the bearings quickly |
| 15:45.37 | ``Erik | notes that humans are biologically constructed to be omnivores and need variety to be healthy... modern western diet is far too rich in meats and too lean in vegetables/fruits, but going vegan/vegetarian is also (typically) an unhealthy extreme, just the pendulum swinging too far back |
| 15:46.22 | clock_ | it will just stop braking and start again |
| 15:46.43 | ``Erik | also notes that recent theory asserts that by cooking food, hominids were able to free up large energy dumps of metabolizing raw food which went to the expansion of the brain O.o |
| 15:46.50 | sporty | ``Erik: is it a comon practic, that i'm in a time ceitnot - and plan to contribute to foss at the weekends? I have to take a solution these days. |
| 15:47.12 | sporty | i mean, how do you do it? |
| 15:47.22 | ``Erik | how do you do what? your query doesn't make sense |
| 15:48.22 | sporty | ``Erik: do you work on brlcad at weekends or at the weekdays? |
| 15:48.36 | claymore | If you short the output of a generator and intentionally cause an over current condition, both speed and voltage will naturally droop, causing the voltage to drop below the thyristor's set point... and it will turn off, removing the short... which will cause speed and voltage to jump up again... and the cycle repeats. very very quickly causing many many micro shocks to the generators rotor.... this eats the bearings alive. |
| 15:48.45 | ``Erik | usually weekdays, occasionally weekends (far less oftne on weekends these days, too busy playing video games or working on my house) |
| 15:49.17 | claymore | exactly why all big generators have overvoltage limiters that shunt output rather than short it and overspeed trips on the prime mover. |
| 15:49.29 | sporty | ``Erik: ok, i wante dto hear these words! Tell something else! ;) |
| 15:51.59 | claymore | the *ideal* solution is to have the VR control the rotor field in the generator, but since its self excited, thats not possible. The best one could achieve is by using a shunt field to suppress the rotor field :/ even that would be hard since I bet this bugger is small. |
| 15:52.07 | sporty | ``Erik: have you played GTA IV? |
| 15:52.32 | clock_ | Actually the dissipated energy will come from the charged excitation capacitors that will be discharged |
| 15:52.54 | clock_ | through some resistors that will prevent internal damage to the capacitor and triac, but still be low enough to reliably de-excite the generator |
| 15:54.02 | claymore | you could add a resistor across the exitation cap leads... make a continual discharge on them to cause them to achieve a lower steady state volt charge.... |
| 15:54.16 | clock_ | decreaes efficiency |
| 15:54.33 | claymore | more effiecient that a trashed bearing :) |
| 15:54.41 | clock_ | I don't believe any trashed bearing |
| 15:55.07 | ``Erik | it's not trashed! it's resting! |
| 15:55.24 | ``Erik | sporty: no, world of dorkcraft |
| 15:55.29 | clock_ | there is no reason for the bearing to trash |
| 15:55.54 | claymore | i have seen what rapid voltage/speed hunting does to bearings. not pretty. |
| 15:56.02 | claymore | but its your generator :) |
| 15:56.58 | sporty | ``Erik: world of enru |
| 15:57.06 | ``Erik | It's not pinin,' it's passed on! This bearing is no more! It has ceased to be! It's expired and gone to meet its maker! This is a late bearing! It's a stiff! Bereft of life, it rests in peace! |
| 15:57.08 | ``Erik | If you hadn't nailed him to the perch he would be pushing up the daisies! Its metabolical processes are of interest only to historians! It's hopped the twig! It's shuffled off this mortal coil! It's run down the curtain and joined the choir invisible! This.... is an EX-BEARING! |
| 15:57.42 | claymore | we lost a cap in the feedback circuit of the ACVR for an emergency generator once. Took a while to figure out why the large Turbine Generator that was in parallel with it was hunting so badly. |
| 15:58.06 | clock_ | what is ACVR? |
| 15:58.31 | clock_ | 1) this is not going to hunt, 2) this is not a Large Turbine Generator |
| 15:58.36 | clock_ | This is a Small Bicycle Generator |
| 15:59.00 | clock_ | Is fun when you spin fast and then remove a short on the output how the generator audibly skids on the tyre :) |
| 15:59.09 | claymore | Once we did figure it out (ala 8 minutes) we pulled the emergency generator off the bus and did an inspection. Rotor was burned from the hunting and we lost 5 mils of babbat in the bearing. had to replace all 4 bearings on the machine (each one is the size of a small car tire :/) |
| 15:59.29 | clock_ | what's babbat? |
| 15:59.48 | claymore | soft material (usually metal) inside a bearing |
| 16:00.04 | clock_ | was it a sleeve bearing? |
| 16:00.23 | sporty | claymore: the bearing of the glidness? |
| 16:00.33 | clock_ | Use Bones Swiss Pro Bearings they are made for skateboards they must survive some shocks ;-) |
| 16:00.33 | ``Erik | babbat or babbitt? |
| 16:00.39 | clock_ | charles babbage? |
| 16:00.47 | clock_ | maybe was it cabbage? cabbage bearing? |
| 16:00.49 | claymore | ACVR = AC Voltage Regulator. There was a DC and an AC side to the Motor Generator |
| 16:00.55 | sporty | sliding bearing? |
| 16:01.00 | sporty | babbit |
| 16:01.05 | claymore | babbitt perhaps. cant remember how its spelled lol. |
| 16:01.11 | clock_ | rabbit? |
| 16:01.19 | claymore | and it was ball bearing. |
| 16:01.29 | ``Erik | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babbitt_metal |
| 16:01.31 | sporty | Bo Babbit, britain goal-keeper 1878-1937 |
| 16:01.37 | clock_ | you should have used cube bearing |
| 16:01.54 | clock_ | or dodecahedron bearing. |
| 16:01.54 | claymore | 'its not going to hunt' ? But you described to me, earlier, how you expect it to do just that.... *confused* |
| 16:01.59 | sporty | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BoBabbit |
| 16:02.02 | clock_ | they don't run so smoothly but are more mathematically interesting |
| 16:02.09 | claymore | lol |
| 16:02.36 | ``Erik | I d'no, circles and spheres have all sorts of fun trig things, and irrational numbers, and stuff |
| 16:04.07 | claymore | ``Erik likes irrational things, from what i can tell. |
| 16:04.24 | ``Erik | you talkin' about punker, boy? O.o |
| 16:04.36 | claymore | you are Punker's boy... not me. |
| 16:04.45 | clock_ | 1they say plain bearings you say ball |
| 16:04.58 | claymore | who says plain? |
| 16:05.03 | clock_ | wikipedofilia |
| 16:05.36 | sporty | clock_: wikipedofilia lol it's too conform i guess though |
| 16:05.36 | ``Erik | ball refers to the runner, not the housing |
| 16:05.54 | sporty | Ball bearings |
| 16:06.20 | claymore | and there is babbitt on the inner and outer races of a ball bearing, depending on if you are talking about journal or thrust bearings. |
| 16:06.25 | sporty | bearings of sliding |
| 16:06.35 | clock_ | I always thought it's hardened steel |
| 16:06.56 | claymore | Some, more rigid, brearings probably are all steel. |
| 16:07.01 | sporty | clock_: it is hardened stil, right |
| 16:07.24 | clock_ | imagines a skater complaining about losing 5mils of babbit in his machine |
| 16:07.47 | claymore | There are tons of bearing types. We had ones with babbitt. |
| 16:08.33 | ``Erik | probably result in the wheel vibrating, so the bearing would be tossed and replaced without looking into why O.o :D |
| 16:08.38 | sporty | i think due to soft radial load |
| 16:08.43 | claymore | heh, well the tolerances between rotor and stator in this machine stated that 11+ mils of babbitt loss would result in rotor desctruction. |
| 16:08.56 | sporty | due to soft radial load |
| 16:09.05 | clock_ | what is soft radial load? |
| 16:09.21 | sporty | on the rotor |
| 16:09.26 | clock_ | and hard radial load? |
| 16:09.27 | claymore | direction that the rotor is applying force to the bearing. |
| 16:09.34 | sporty | or bearings' still would be hardened |
| 16:11.06 | claymore | radial loads tend to push out, or down due to gravity... so journal (radial) bearings would be appropriate. rotor loads like that of a larger Generator would yeild thrust on the shaft pushing it the direction of the prime mover, or away from it. Thrust bearings are appropriate for this load type. |
| 16:11.20 | claymore | but since both conditions normally exists, you need both. |
| 16:11.59 | claymore | and that is really the extent of my bearing knowledge lol |
| 16:13.14 | claymore | ``Erik: you in today ? |
| 16:15.15 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14DB9C.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 16:18.00 | ``Erik | yup |
| 16:29.44 | brlcad | claymore: gah .. socketcc is not compatible with our licensing |
| 16:30.45 | sporty | brlcad: can i get 7.12 source for 32 bit ?? (i686) |
| 16:30.49 | claymore | saw that. i am really looking at it for the style of implementation. |
| 16:30.54 | brlcad | they don't allow modified derivative redistributions, that's makes it incompatible |
| 16:30.54 | sporty | and brlcad - hello! |
| 16:31.29 | sporty | claymore: by the way, do you know other languages? |
| 16:31.51 | brlcad | sporty: sources are not platform-specific |
| 16:33.00 | sporty | brlcad: ...and compiler can rule this problem, right? |
| 16:34.03 | brlcad | claymore: not sure what you mean by style of implementation, but that basically means it cannot be used (at all, in any way, even as a reference, especially in the repository) without a relicense from the copyright holder |
| 16:37.29 | claymore | so you are basicly saying that I can't even look at the socketcc code because any code I write that even slightly resembles the socketcc code is a copyright infringement? |
| 16:37.58 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 16:38.04 | brlcad | that's the nature of a derivative work |
| 16:38.14 | claymore | Hrm, well then I am tainted and can no longer work on the project. |
| 16:38.36 | brlcad | puts the code you write (the socketcc *mods*) at risk |
| 16:38.56 | brlcad | not the usages of the library |
| 16:40.44 | claymore | I do not plan on modifying any of the base code. never did. I plan on writing something similar from the ground up, but i needed a reference or two to see 'how they did it' |
| 16:41.26 | claymore | if I did descide to use the libraries, I would extend it via inheritance, leaving the copyrighted code intact. |
| 16:41.36 | claymore | man my engrish is horrid :/ |
| 16:43.05 | brlcad | seeing "how they did it" would arguably be a derivative (as you are basing your implementation off theirs obviously) even if you write it from scratch -- that's where those "clean room rewrite" stories come from for developing drivers from proprietary sources |
| 16:44.09 | brlcad | that would be a valid "use" to just use them and extend via inheritance, but that is still lgpl incompatible for *our* distribution purposes |
| 16:44.26 | *** join/#brlcad thebishop (n=thebisho@67-134-234-189.dia.static.qwest.net) | |
| 16:44.46 | thebishop | is the new GUI in svn? |
| 16:44.49 | brlcad | it's usually best to try and get them to relicense under the LGPL or BSD license, or to avoid them entirely |
| 16:45.01 | claymore | So basically, I have to erase all references to those libraries and forget I ever saw them eh? |
| 16:45.04 | brlcad | thebishop: it's a "pre-alpha" prototype, but yes |
| 16:45.11 | brlcad | it's in the "rt^3" module |
| 16:45.21 | thebishop | brlcad, any screenshots? |
| 16:45.22 | brlcad | claymore: or contact the copyright holder |
| 16:45.27 | brlcad | thebishop: yes |
| 16:45.40 | brlcad | what's the interest? |
| 16:46.22 | brlcad | if you're looking to actually use it -- it's not ready for any use whatsoever, it's not ready for even kicking the tires |
| 16:46.48 | brlcad | it's only for developers at this point, emphasis on the pre-alpha, and emphasis on prototype |
| 16:50.19 | claymore | brlcad: how is lgpl not compatible with us? brl-cad proper has lgpl components, doesn't it? |
| 16:52.59 | brlcad | hm? |
| 16:53.01 | brlcad | we are LGPL |
| 16:53.36 | brlcad | we cannot bundle them because we are (predominantly) LGPL |
| 16:53.43 | claymore | ....so what did you mean by the statmement: ' but that is still lgpl incompatible for *our* distribution purposes' |
| 16:54.02 | claymore | i don't get it. |
| 16:54.57 | sporty | will share some mad-mad things soon |
| 16:55.04 | sporty | and weird, too |
| 16:55.14 | sporty | but not these days |
| 16:55.20 | brlcad | that clause in their source makes it incompatible with our source licensing -- basically it puts the sources in conflicting terms |
| 16:56.39 | claymore | the 'modified code cannot be redistributed' clause? |
| 16:57.11 | brlcad | you can't mix n' match licenses -- the terms have to be compatible for a distribution as a combined work, or you have to add explicit exemptions (which is a pita to maintain) |
| 16:57.42 | claymore | sighs. |
| 16:57.52 | claymore | so much for making *that* deadline :/ |
| 16:57.56 | brlcad | I just sent the guy a message |
| 16:58.11 | claymore | oooooh, i was just about to do the same. |
| 16:58.19 | claymore | guess I will hold off a bit then. |
| 16:58.31 | claymore | did you just ask him if we can have it under lgpl? |
| 16:59.47 | brlcad | feel free to send him a message too, tag teaming requests can often help ;) |
| 17:04.08 | claymore | is really tired. Youngest kept me up most of the night. My apologies I am coming off as grumpy. |
| 17:04.41 | sporty | claymore: wake up! |
| 17:04.46 | sporty | it's morning! |
| 17:04.50 | claymore | Oh I am awake. |
| 17:04.57 | sporty | ok then |
| 17:05.03 | claymore | In fact, I didn't go to sleep today ;) |
| 17:05.21 | claymore | got about 2 hrs down yesterday, just before midnight :D |
| 17:05.51 | sporty | claymore: mrs.claymore? |
| 17:05.57 | sporty | :) |
| 17:06.34 | sporty | :-D |
| 17:06.38 | claymore | that was before the 2 hours sleep. the rest of this morning was spent with my youngest (who is only 2) and the fact he didnt wanna sleep. |
| 17:07.32 | sporty | ah! if you would offer him veggies, he would sleep and imagine mrs.youngest :-D |
| 17:08.03 | claymore | good god man. Veggies wont solve the world's problems. |
| 17:08.32 | sporty | claymore: i think i will have two gorls, then boy - becasue i like ladies too much to give a born to the men |
| 17:08.46 | sporty | claymore: ok |
| 17:09.00 | claymore | heh, you act as if you have control over gender :) |
| 17:09.08 | claymore | laughs a knowing laugh. |
| 17:09.34 | sporty | claymore: true |
| 17:10.26 | sporty | i mean it will have happened: i'm overtake the wife,or wait, no, whatever she imagines she likes |
| 17:11.35 | claymore | Well, once you have a pair of little feet running around the house, you won't be so quick to whip out veggies to try to solve a case of the 'I'm not Tireds' :D |
| 17:12.33 | claymore | In fact, you just might be tempted to get the little bugger flying high on sugar so that when they crash you will get come peace and quiet. |
| 17:12.37 | sporty | claymore: not agree again, because you tell "common sence" while i'm about an experience |
| 17:12.51 | claymore | eh... what? |
| 17:13.24 | sporty | for me, most of the things i said is true - didn't want to emphasize it |
| 17:14.22 | sporty | ah! going to eat the cabbage! |
| 17:14.36 | claymore | Yes, you do that! Show that cabbage who's boss. |
| 17:14.56 | sporty | claymore: ha - ha ... |
| 17:15.07 | claymore | :D |
| 17:15.17 | sporty | :'( |
| 17:16.04 | claymore | Why the long face ? |
| 17:16.12 | sporty | there're no bad or too god things in a raw vegan world. only relations between genders |
| 17:16.20 | sporty | like an animals! |
| 17:16.37 | sporty | j/k |
| 17:17.58 | claymore | speaking of animals... I'm hungry :D j/k |
| 17:18.49 | brlcad | claymore: alcohol works well ;) |
| 17:19.25 | claymore | well seeing as alcohol is a poison and thats even *worse* than meat... i can't see how you would drink any! |
| 17:19.35 | claymore | but i don't drink at all, and never have. |
| 17:19.42 | sporty | speaking of hungry... raw vegan choice! |
| 17:19.44 | sporty | why do you have a time for chat? I don't have, usually =-O |
| 17:20.10 | brlcad | used to dip my pacifier in wine to knock me out in germany |
| 17:20.16 | sporty | claymore: what? you don't drink at all? |
| 17:20.20 | brlcad | (like once..) :) |
| 17:20.24 | claymore | lol |
| 17:20.34 | claymore | 'splains some things :D |
| 17:20.38 | brlcad | probably |
| 17:20.50 | brlcad | sporty: he's got good reasons |
| 17:20.58 | brlcad | to each their own |
| 17:21.58 | brlcad | guesses the fedex guy isn't coming |
| 17:22.06 | claymore | sporty: nope. There is no point imho. My take is that if you don't know how to have fun w/o it, then you don't really know how to have fun! |
| 17:22.13 | sporty | i have drinked less than 20 galnos beer in all my life, less than 5 gallon of wine, too |
| 17:22.46 | sporty | i have fun when things i'm in just like when i was 13 |
| 17:23.27 | sporty | i mean this non-extremal safe flatland, long-hauls and so on |
| 17:24.18 | claymore | is fedex guy bringing TV awesomeness? |
| 17:24.19 | brlcad | I don't know that I've ever drank to have fun -- it's like variety in food, I enjoy the variety of pallate in some drinks |
| 17:24.24 | brlcad | no, that's tomorrow |
| 17:24.34 | claymore | oh thats right... its only Wed. |
| 17:24.35 | brlcad | there was some cable foo that came yesterday |
| 17:25.06 | claymore | did he bring the 'self install kit' ? |
| 17:25.17 | claymore | :D |
| 17:25.21 | brlcad | yeah, that was last week -- ups left it at the door |
| 17:25.49 | brlcad | took a bit to find the socketcc guy .. that e-mail is dead |
| 17:25.53 | brlcad | he's moved |
| 17:25.57 | brlcad | found him, though, resent |
| 17:26.16 | claymore | so he was a student? |
| 17:26.23 | sporty | brlcad: are there a snow where you live? |
| 17:26.25 | brlcad | assistant professor or somesuch |
| 17:26.31 | brlcad | sporty: sometimes |
| 17:26.39 | sporty | ok |
| 17:26.54 | brlcad | not really cold enough today though, that's for sure |
| 17:26.55 | sporty | likes snow as he likes the nature |
| 17:27.00 | brlcad | ~weather kbwi |
| 17:27.24 | claymore | ibot doesn't like me... he won't talk to me. |
| 17:27.38 | brlcad | ~weather kbwi |
| 17:27.40 | brlcad | oops |
| 17:27.43 | brlcad | ~weather kapg |
| 17:27.53 | sporty | brlcad: how can i get a temp for special place of the world? I know coordinates |
| 17:28.08 | brlcad | sporty: hold a thermometer outside |
| 17:28.16 | brlcad | at those coordinates |
| 17:28.23 | sporty | brlcad: it's too simple |
| 17:28.26 | claymore | chuckles. |
| 17:28.35 | brlcad | then try holding it while on a unicycle |
| 17:28.40 | claymore | its 60 out? nice :) |
| 17:28.54 | brlcad | that's probably old, might be warmer |
| 17:29.06 | brlcad | kapg sometimes doesn't update very frequently |
| 17:29.19 | brlcad | might have been a couple hours ago |
| 17:29.36 | archivist | ~weather egnx |
| 17:29.43 | claymore | 63 according to www.weather.wrong. |
| 17:29.49 | brlcad | sporty: you'd have to know a weather station code |
| 17:30.11 | archivist | airport codes |
| 17:30.12 | sporty | ok |
| 17:30.23 | brlcad | airports usually have a weather station, so they're pretty convenient ;) |
| 17:30.28 | sporty | ok, we have one |
| 17:30.53 | claymore | archivist: whereabouts in the UK? (if you dont mind me askin) |
| 17:30.54 | archivist | I have implemented that function in my bot as well |
| 17:31.01 | brlcad | there are sites around the web, you can find the nearest |
| 17:31.18 | archivist | east midlands near burton on trent |
| 17:31.51 | sporty | brlcad: but it is not so "cheap&angry" as we say |
| 17:32.15 | brlcad | claymore: as an alternative, since it's probably a 25/75 that he'll consider relicensing, I'd suggest just working with boost threads |
| 17:32.24 | archivist | claymore, local town is Swadlincote where I work |
| 17:32.48 | brlcad | hears a truck outside, goes to check |
| 17:32.56 | claymore | archivist: Derbyshire ? |
| 17:32.59 | archivist | yes |
| 17:33.52 | brlcad | damn .. ups, not fedex |
| 17:34.05 | claymore | I think i have been through (or near) that area on a train a few years back. Pretty country :) |
| 17:34.24 | claymore | gets excited whenever UPS Clause brings me something. |
| 17:35.14 | brlcad | knows the feeling |
| 17:36.30 | brlcad | awww.. it needs to charge up first :( |
| 17:36.42 | claymore | cell phone? |
| 17:36.49 | brlcad | roomba |
| 17:36.55 | claymore | sweet! |
| 17:37.02 | claymore | I always wanted to get one of those. |
| 17:37.03 | brlcad | yeah, I finally caved in |
| 17:37.30 | claymore | 'course, i want to make the Lawnba, but I think it just might be too dangerous. |
| 17:37.42 | brlcad | especially with this big open area hardwood floors I have, I think it'll do good here |
| 17:38.00 | brlcad | jason and I have actually talked at *length* about such a device |
| 17:38.06 | brlcad | if I had a yard, I'd be working on that |
| 17:38.12 | brlcad | I hate mowing |
| 17:38.34 | sporty | can someone tell me about gps? |
| 17:38.41 | brlcad | you can actually get them now .. but they're a bit pricey |
| 17:38.52 | brlcad | sporty: yes, someone probably can |
| 17:39.05 | sporty | i want a cheap GPS. (no display) Will it have a compass inside? |
| 17:39.18 | claymore | did you see the article about the MIT guys (I think) that hooked a Roomba up to bluetooth, wired the controls through a cell phone and played 'frogger' on a busy downtown Boston street? |
| 17:39.23 | sporty | shall i pay regulary for satellites' use? |
| 17:39.24 | brlcad | sporty: http://tinyurl.com/644cnm |
| 17:39.46 | sporty | what is it? |
| 17:39.55 | sporty | cinnamon? |
| 17:40.09 | sporty | cnm... well, my http is locked |
| 17:40.10 | brlcad | claymore: hah, no I hadn't seen that |
| 17:40.29 | claymore | well, long story short, i lol'ed. |
| 17:40.53 | claymore | great pictures of the event. They lost btw. *need to find that link* |
| 17:41.34 | brlcad | http://store.irobot.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2591901&cp=2600059.2591511&parentPage=family |
| 17:43.13 | claymore | haha, i was way off. It was Austin and a laptop: http://news.cnet.com/2300-1041_3-6049976-1.html?tag=mncol |
| 17:43.47 | claymore | think the powers that be would get mad if we had a Roomba at work? |
| 17:43.51 | claymore | :D |
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| 17:45.27 | sporty | What is "Roomba"? |
| 17:46.14 | claymore | Semi-intelligent disk shaped robot/vaccum that automagically learns the layout of your house and vaccuums it for ya. |
| 17:47.37 | sporty | ah! But i would use a wet patch for both, wood and carpets |
| 17:48.10 | claymore | Dunno if they have a WetDrymba.... |
| 17:48.35 | sporty | claymore: i mean AI will kill us all |
| 17:48.56 | sporty | arttificial intelligence as e.g. homekeepers |
| 17:49.11 | sporty | androids and other sheet |
| 17:50.10 | claymore | true AI will never happen, its much like a paradox. But it makes for great Scifi movies! |
| 17:50.56 | sporty | ai on perl will be able - and we will have to fight with it. only robust will have survived. |
| 17:52.31 | brlcad | they call it the "scooba" |
| 17:52.40 | sporty | what? |
| 17:52.49 | brlcad | the mop version |
| 17:53.23 | sporty | it will have understood all the terms as young kids do, and make a solution, main solution |
| 17:53.25 | claymore | hahaha |
| 17:53.49 | claymore | GutterCleaningBot. |
| 17:54.08 | sporty | ha-ha |
| 17:54.12 | *** join/#brlcad Bman (n=erik@ftp.brlcad.org) | |
| 17:55.46 | claymore | brlcad: do you happen to know how much of the boost libraries are already in the rt^3 and/or brlcad modules? |
| 17:56.28 | brlcad | quite a bit |
| 17:57.11 | brlcad | none in rt^3 at the moment, but that is easily remedied |
| 17:57.41 | brlcad | there's a tool that will extract exactly what is needed for redistribution based on use, though |
| 17:57.58 | brlcad | so you don't really have to worry about it -- you just write your code and it'll figure out the subset |
| 17:58.07 | claymore | Hows that work? I am puttering around the boost site. |
| 17:58.29 | brlcad | i.e. you'd install all of boost on your system, and then just start using it |
| 17:58.54 | brlcad | then there's a tool in boost that will extract the portions of boost you're using when it comes time to make a distribution |
| 17:59.33 | claymore | ... so the whole boost library resides in the svn repository? Only portions are used when compile time comes? |
| 18:00.21 | Bman | boosts exists on the system, you run a program that parses your source and copies the minimal subset of boost into your directory, that gets added to svn |
| 18:00.47 | brlcad | right, only a subset goes into svn |
| 18:01.08 | brlcad | but you don't know which subset you need until you actually use it, so you install the full thing on your system |
| 18:02.19 | claymore | cool. Would you reccommend snaging one of the distros or getting the latest from their svn? |
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| 18:15.03 | brlcad | probably snagging a distro |
| 18:16.30 | brlcad | svn could be unstable, in a state of flux, etc -- should know the project or have a need before jumping that route |
| 18:17.11 | sporty | brlcad: so can i write complicate dformulae in emacs by means fo elisp? |
| 18:17.15 | sporty | claymore: ? |
| 18:17.25 | brlcad | sure |
| 18:17.55 | sporty | brlcad: you mean even integrals and so on - to solve and to print? |
| 18:18.10 | sporty | can i print it just like i'm drafting it? |
| 18:19.26 | brlcad | it's a full lisp environment, so you can write code to do just about anything |
| 18:20.23 | sporty | brlcad: but will it "paint integrals as e.g. latex" ?? Is LaTex the same, or it differs? |
| 18:21.09 | brlcad | your question doesn't make sense to me |
| 18:22.39 | sporty | LaTex and Emacs - the same? |
| 18:26.27 | brlcad | um, no |
| 18:27.10 | sporty | brlcad: is it true LaTex can write anything i want as e.g. diploma with formulas? |
| 18:27.14 | brlcad | one is a document preparation system, the other is a extensible, customizable, self- documenting real-time display editor |
| 18:27.23 | sporty | and can Emacs write formulas to paper? |
| 18:27.44 | ``Erik | emacs writes ascii files to disk O.o (gross simplification, but...) |
| 18:27.59 | sporty | brlcad: can i say "I'm using Emacs instead of MathCAD" |
| 18:28.00 | ``Erik | same as vim, pic, or notepad.exe |
| 18:28.29 | brlcad | sporty: your understanding really is bizarre. your questions make no sense. |
| 18:28.37 | sporty | ``Erik: what program shall i use to write formulas - instead of MS Word (full) for my diploma? |
| 18:28.42 | brlcad | you can say whatever you want |
| 18:29.08 | brlcad | if you're wanting to render formulas, latex is good for that |
| 18:29.09 | sporty | brlcad: seriuosly, can i use emacs instead of mathcad? |
| 18:29.25 | brlcad | seriously, that question makes no sense |
| 18:29.32 | ``Erik | a lot of people use emacs (or lisp) to write the LaTeX file, then use teTeX or LaTeX or whatever to compile the control file into a pdf |
| 18:29.41 | ``Erik | er |
| 18:29.42 | ``Erik | or vim |
| 18:29.43 | sporty | ok! |
| 18:29.47 | ``Erik | emacs (or vim) |
| 18:29.55 | brlcad | it's like saying "can i eat peanuts instead of doing jumping jacks" |
| 18:30.07 | ``Erik | mmm peanut jumping jacks |
| 18:30.14 | brlcad | the two have nothing to do with each other |
| 18:30.18 | sporty | ``Erik: i just has no chance to download latex... too big traffic |
| 18:30.36 | brlcad | then you probably have no chance to download emacs either |
| 18:30.38 | brlcad | it's big |
| 18:30.40 | sporty | brlcad: ok, just too new for too much information |
| 18:30.58 | brlcad | you seriously need a better internet connection so you can stfw |
| 18:31.11 | ``Erik | iirc, there are services online where you can select a bunch of files you'd like, then they mail you a cd burnt with that stuff (for a fee) |
| 18:31.15 | brlcad | and educate yourself better without being constrained per bit |
| 18:31.31 | ``Erik | or if you buy a linux or bsd distro, they mail you the cd's and have all this stuff on them |
| 18:31.36 | sporty | brlcad: i have emacs from cd , but i could download it if i want |
| 18:32.02 | brlcad | if you could download it, then you should be able to browse a f'ing wikipedia page |
| 18:32.33 | sporty | ``Erik: it's ok... after a month, i'm ending the education - will translate brlcad better |
| 18:32.52 | brlcad | http://www.osbr.ca/ojs/index.php/osbr/article/view/800/771 <-- notes the intro paragraph familiarity :) |
| 18:33.51 | sporty | ok, turning on terminal, java, browser, ready, set, go, !! |
| 18:38.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33335 10/rt^3/trunk/autogen.sh: set exec bit |
| 18:42.11 | sporty | brlcad: by the way, few weeks ago i didn't know a way how-to configure, make and make install! Is there anything like "Users' artworks" on the site - so as i can, well, see this: http://www.naturalstuff.110mb.com/ (the bottom) |
| 18:42.43 | sporty | i mean, i didn't know even about the irc... Well, i was a windows user... |
| 18:43.10 | sporty | can users create pages under wiki ?? |
| 18:43.40 | sporty | *Installation of BRL-CAD 7.10.2 in Ubuntu 8.04* |
| 18:44.16 | brlcad | looks |
| 18:44.32 | brlcad | sporty: yes, you can create new wiki pages just like on wikipedia |
| 18:44.34 | *** join/#brlcad cad75 (n=5bcb6016@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:44.36 | brlcad | it's a full open wiki |
| 18:44.51 | sporty | brlcad: later |
| 18:44.53 | brlcad | including translation pages, just don't know if there are any examples to start with |
| 18:45.10 | *** join/#brlcad cad13 (n=5bcb6016@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 18:45.24 | brlcad | you can't edit the drupal pages without having a permission bit set, but there's only a couple drupal pages |
| 18:45.52 | *** join/#brlcad archivist (n=archivis@host81-149-119-172.in-addr.btopenworld.com) | |
| 18:46.00 | sporty | when i will have re-installed the system - i will enlarge this tutorial - and then it will have a decent look |
| 18:46.14 | brlcad | sporty: "mged -n" is changed to "mged -c" |
| 18:46.18 | brlcad | -n is going away |
| 18:46.35 | sporty | brlcad: i'm still at 7.10 |
| 18:46.43 | brlcad | sporty: so? |
| 18:46.48 | sporty | oh my! |
| 18:47.33 | sporty | brlcad: and later i will have a short tutorial under the header "Users write: installation ...7.10 in U 8.04" |
| 18:48.41 | sporty | brlcad: i will delete rhese pages and files from my pc - i want to publish it soon |
| 18:49.21 | sporty | my site is awful. I'm still creating those examples it was created for. |
| 18:51.29 | sporty | so i'm using mged -n cup.g |
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| 18:53.41 | sporty | http://ribbonsoft.com/camexpert_doc.html (bottom) closes up my education as a translator. I will take some rest from this all - then will skate and type as fast as i can! |
| 18:57.29 | sporty | what is an international word for "distrib" ?? i know it must have less than 7 characters |
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| 19:07.24 | sporty | off-line again? |
| 19:18.33 | brlcad | sporty: all i'm saying is you should change the -n to a -c and it'll work on both the old and the newer versions of mged |
| 19:20.14 | brlcad | otherwise that documentation will quickly be out-dated |
| 19:21.08 | brlcad | distrib is distribution so share or give or publish, etc |
| 19:24.46 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-241-142.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:48.53 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 19:49.18 | csanyipal | Hi, is anybody here? |
| 19:50.20 | csanyipal | I want to ask about the tutorial: "Introduction_to_MGED.pdf", Lesson 3 |
| 19:52.11 | csanyipal | I have installed BRL-CAD 7.14.1 |
| 19:52.49 | csanyipal | When I create shapes sph1.s & rcc1.s then I get a big shapes. |
| 19:53.10 | csanyipal | I created these shapes with make command. |
| 19:53.42 | csanyipal | But when I create after that with in command the other sph2.s rcc2.s shapes, |
| 19:54.00 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 19:54.18 | csanyipal | these new shapes appeare in the Graphics Window so small that I can't even see it! |
| 19:54.43 | ``Erik | you're probably making them... tiny... :) try doing like "l sph1.s" to get an idea of the scale those are at |
| 19:54.50 | brlcad | csanyipal: run "autoview" |
| 19:54.51 | csanyipal | I must Zoom in to see it! |
| 19:54.56 | csanyipal | ok |
| 19:55.07 | brlcad | the 'in' command will not rezoom if you make something new |
| 19:55.24 | brlcad | the 'make' command creates objects that are relative to the size of the view |
| 19:55.35 | brlcad | 'in' uses absolute values |
| 19:55.46 | csanyipal | ok |
| 19:55.50 | ``Erik | "autoview" might be useful |
| 19:57.00 | csanyipal | now when I used autoview nothing happens. Must I use autoview before command make & in? |
| 19:57.02 | ``Erik | brlcad: preparing the crib for the new babies you get tomorrow? O.o |
| 19:57.27 | ``Erik | autoview just tries to resize the view to fit everything that's currently being displaye |
| 19:57.37 | csanyipal | ok |
| 19:58.59 | Ralith | defining a primitive with attributes which are relative to those of another primitive is parametrics, right? |
| 19:59.48 | csanyipal | I try to make a new tutorila for my pupils, and I translate the tutorial abowe mentioned to Hungarian. |
| 20:02.53 | brlcad | ``Erik: actually already prepped :) |
| 20:03.01 | brlcad | was waiting for a package to arrive |
| 20:03.51 | ``Erik | well, dmanit, stop that, when you don't answer your phone, I'm #2 on their list for question answering O.o :D |
| 20:04.13 | csanyipal | My problem is that that the difference between shapes maked with make command and shapes maked with in command is so big that even with command autoview I can't see the shapes maked with in command. |
| 20:05.02 | brlcad | Ralith: yes |
| 20:05.21 | ``Erik | if you 'l' the shape you used make on, it should give you an idea of what scale to use with your 'in' command |
| 20:05.38 | Ralith | Support for that's not too far along, right? Anywhere I can check to see status? |
| 20:05.39 | ``Erik | if make generates a 1m diameter sphere, then yeah, anything you make 1mm across is going to look tiny |
| 20:05.39 | csanyipal | ok |
| 20:06.26 | brlcad | Ralith: you can ask dawn on the mailing list, and/or check out src/libpc |
| 20:06.39 | brlcad | dawn doesn't make it onto irc very often, uses the mailing list |
| 20:07.03 | brlcad | csanyipal: that's because you're still showing big and small objects |
| 20:07.24 | csanyipal | ok I figure this out |
| 20:07.38 | brlcad | csanyipal: run "who" to see what objects are being drawn, you can "erase objectname" to erase it |
| 20:08.17 | brlcad | "e object" and "d object" are the same as "draw object" and "erase object" |
| 20:08.29 | csanyipal | thanks |
| 20:08.55 | brlcad | ironically, the letters reverse for the short-hand as they originally stood for "edit" and "delete", but those terms were misleading |
| 20:09.01 | ``Erik | heh, e for draw and d for erase |
| 20:09.48 | brlcad | don't think I even realized that little irony until I wrote it there either :) |
| 20:10.20 | csanyipal | so the make command make allways a 1 meter diameter sphere? |
| 20:10.43 | brlcad | no, the make command makes an object relative to your view size |
| 20:10.55 | csanyipal | ok, sorry, I forgat that |
| 20:10.59 | ``Erik | at the bottom of te window is a bunch of text, 'sz' is the view size |
| 20:11.09 | ``Erik | make uses that value in its computation |
| 20:11.38 | csanyipal | so I must mayhep to use the size command first |
| 20:11.39 | brlcad | try this: make sph sph ; zoom .5 ; make sph2 sph ; zoom .5 ; make arb8 arb8 ; zoom .5 |
| 20:12.01 | ``Erik | (and I guess the default view's sphere is 1 meter radius, not diameter) |
| 20:12.19 | csanyipal | ok diameter = 2 * radius |
| 20:13.42 | csanyipal | I want to say that that the tutorial is not so perfect.. |
| 20:15.21 | csanyipal | so the pupils in a secondary school can't to use it and to understand it when came to the Lesson 3.. |
| 20:17.30 | brlcad | csanyipal: which tutorial? |
| 20:17.39 | brlcad | the mged tutorial on the website? |
| 20:17.46 | brlcad | er, on brlcad.org? |
| 20:18.14 | csanyipal | yes, Introduction_to_MGED.pdf |
| 20:18.26 | brlcad | I can see how that'd be difficult for that age, they weren't the audience .. :) |
| 20:18.36 | csanyipal | pages 25, 26 |
| 20:18.49 | brlcad | if you write a much simpler version, be glad to put it up on the site |
| 20:18.54 | brlcad | and write an article about it |
| 20:19.02 | csanyipal | ok |
| 20:19.09 | ``Erik | or convert it to docbook so we can snarf it into the repo and improve it :D |
| 20:19.27 | brlcad | it's been on the todo for a while to write a "quick introduction to brl-cad" |
| 20:19.35 | brlcad | something less than 10 pages tops |
| 20:19.38 | csanyipal | ok |
| 20:21.02 | csanyipal | I'm a fraid about that that BRL-CAD can't to explain in less than 10 pages, however |
| 20:22.23 | brlcad | a huge portion could be, enough to give an understanding of how things are done and how to get started |
| 20:22.34 | csanyipal | ok |
| 20:22.42 | brlcad | mind you, 10 pages of text .. images could make that be a little or a lot more |
| 20:22.46 | csanyipal | I agree with that.. |
| 20:23.13 | csanyipal | yes |
| 20:24.08 | ``Erik | pheer the ultimate 'choose your own adventure' interactive BRL-CAD tutorial/cookbook O.o :D |
| 20:24.51 | Ralith | lol |
| 20:25.47 | ``Erik | (only half joking... there're 3 bazillion things you can do with it, so there'll n ever be a good single tutorial or intro... :D ) |
| 20:26.21 | csanyipal | ok |
| 20:27.45 | csanyipal | Now I'm going to find out how can I make better the Lesson 3 so that this problem never happen: the difference between shapes created with make and with in commands. |
| 20:29.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33336 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: ben's okay with it, include the name |
| 20:30.11 | csanyipal | the difference is so big, I want to lower this difference |
| 20:30.50 | Ralith | it might be better to clarify why there is a difference |
| 20:32.23 | csanyipal | no because then still nobody can't see the shapes created with in command |
| 20:33.01 | csanyipal | they are very small.. |
| 20:33.16 | csanyipal | like a dot |
| 20:33.21 | Ralith | size is completely relative |
| 20:33.29 | Ralith | it's only small if your view is set up that way |
| 20:37.09 | Ralith | csanyipal: actually, you could probably solve the problem just be modifying lesson 3 to use larger sizes for the manually created shapes. |
| 20:37.12 | brlcad | csanyipal: that's because you gave really small values relative to the view size |
| 20:37.55 | brlcad | you can make 'in' match 'make' |
| 20:38.44 | Ralith | brlcad: I just checked; at least here, following the instructions word-for-word, (including not erasing anything) makes you end up with a nearly-indiscernable sph2.s |
| 20:38.59 | Ralith | which is expected behavior and so on |
| 20:39.10 | Ralith | but at the point of lesson 3, a user might not expect that or know what to do |
| 20:39.44 | brlcad | csanyipal: think of the units you are using .. if you make something with the 'in' command that has values like 5.33 .. that's 5.33 millimeters (by default) .. if the view size is 2000, that's 2 meters .. |
| 20:40.21 | brlcad | so yeah, it'd be tiny |
| 20:40.36 | Ralith | the closest the guide comes to saying "this shape will be really tiny" is saying that the radius will be 3mm, without ever having described the size of the 'make'-created objects |
| 20:40.46 | csanyipal | I understand that |
| 20:40.56 | brlcad | make doesn't care -- it just uses the size of the view no matter how big or small it is.. if your view is 10 km, it'll make a 10 km box if you make an arb8 |
| 20:42.45 | Ralith | and the default view, at least on my setup, was large enough to produce this behavior. |
| 20:47.06 | csanyipal | Now I tried to size the view to 10 mm |
| 20:48.42 | csanyipal | and then the shapes created with make and in commands are wide apart very much |
| 20:50.21 | csanyipal | when I run autoview after |
| 20:53.59 | csanyipal | I run size after autoview and get the value of it: 2040 |
| 20:53.59 | brlcad | autoview resizes to fit whatever is being drawn (the 'who' command to see what is drawn) |
| 20:54.26 | brlcad | that means you have something drawn that is much bigger, you were just zoomed in |
| 20:54.51 | csanyipal | but when I began with the make command the size was 10 |
| 20:54.53 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik (n=erik@ftp.brlcad.org) | |
| 20:55.11 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33337 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/slave/ (load.c load_MySQL.c slave.c): re-order headers |
| 20:56.14 | csanyipal | ok, thanks, I must go now.. |
| 20:56.21 | Ralith | seeya |
| 20:56.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33338 10/brlcad/trunk/src/adrt/ (adrt.h master/master.c): make extra-verbose announce opcode names as well as number |
| 20:56.34 | *** part/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 20:59.49 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33339 10/brlcad/trunk/src/other/tkhtml3/Makefile.in: carry LDFLAGS |
| 20:59.51 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14DB9C.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:09.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33340 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/ComboBox.tcl: Set the borderwidth to 1 for the frame and menubutton components. |
| 21:13.08 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33341 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/lib/RtControl.tcl: Added code to insure the "Advanced Settings" dialog pops up above the main rt control dialog. |
| 21:25.48 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33342 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (expand.c ged_private.h importFg4Section.c put_comb.c red.c): carry const where possible |
| 21:28.43 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33343 10/brlcad/trunk/ (include/ged.h src/libged/Makefile.am src/libged/tire.c): Added Cliff's tire command to libged. |
| 21:33.36 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33344 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libdm/scale.c: add missing header |
| 21:34.31 | brlcad | ``Erik: where is the memory free'd for ged_put_tree_into_comb()? |
| 21:35.17 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33345 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Make use of libged's tire functionality. |
| 21:44.34 | ``Erik | erm, right there *point* |
| 21:44.48 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33346 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/put_comb.c: free the strdup'd memory |
| 21:45.03 | ``Erik | sheesh, you think I'd forget something like that? |
| 21:45.04 | ``Erik | :D |
| 21:47.18 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33347 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/put_comb.c: verify the immutable string, not the unallocated string. Verify the duplication succeeded. |
| 21:47.19 | ``Erik | is surprised brlcad keyed on a neglegible leak opposed to the show stopping bug |
| 21:48.30 | brlcad | ``Erik: show-stoppers aren't a problem .. 'cause they sorta .. stop the show |
| 21:48.49 | brlcad | the subtle ones tend to live forever :) |
| 21:49.01 | brlcad | and grow hair |
| 21:49.04 | ``Erik | until someone stumbles across that function with valgrind |
| 21:49.27 | ``Erik | <-- subtle like that O.o |
| 21:49.48 | brlcad | assuming they get through the other reports before it |
| 21:50.20 | brlcad | there's a few in the report now that I didn't see an easy fix for |
| 21:50.33 | brlcad | subtle leaks added a long time ago |
| 21:51.07 | ``Erik | if they're not easy to get rid of, that code is a candidate for heavier reworking *shrug* :) |
| 21:53.53 | ``Erik | too effin' hot in here, 77 in the office :/ |
| 21:56.48 | punkrockgirl | its cold outside |
| 21:56.52 | punkrockgirl | does the snowday dance |
| 21:58.29 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33348 10/brlcad/trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): remove isst client |
| 23:18.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33349 10/brlcad/trunk/autogen.sh: |
| 23:18.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: merge in changes from Sebastian Pipping's git tree, commit |
| 23:18.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 7fd089f2a40099db7c30a6a340b330f29ec4d8cd (Resolve code duplication on equal |
| 23:18.00 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: treatment of COPYING and INSTALL). refactors the backup handling into one loop |
| 23:18.01 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: for both. |
| 23:24.42 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 23:28.13 | brlcad | is amazed that the lil bugger wandered semi-intelligently around the entire rooms for nearly an hour with all these boxes and junk everywhere yet still managed to find its way back to the docking station |
| 23:41.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33350 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/put_comb.c: bu_strdup() to the rescue |
| 23:42.19 | ``Erik_ | shakes fist |
| 23:42.42 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33351 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/put_comb.c: oop, use bu_free on all of the callers. get rid of the dead code too. |
| 23:43.19 | ``Erik_ | what about the strchr stuff imitating strtok? bu_strtok()? |
| 23:45.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33352 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/put_comb.c: ws |
| 23:45.24 | brlcad | erm, they don't allocate memory do they? |
| 23:45.42 | brlcad | strdup is in there because of the allocation guarantee |
| 23:45.54 | brlcad | tok just points into the str iirc |
| 23:48.48 | ``Erik_ | strtok sets the char to null, sets a ptr and returns a ptr I think? I don't remember |
| 00:38.23 | mafm | night! |
| 00:50.48 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33353 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/search.h: fix for osX.5 |
| 00:58.07 | ``Erik_ | (has u_int in sys/types.h, but it wasn't being included *shrug* -> unsigned int was easy, hopefully not wrong) |
| 01:21.52 | *** join/#brlcad Twingy (n=justin@74.92.144.217) | |
| 01:34.41 | *** join/#brlcad rawer_ (n=ubuntu@217.8.236.161) | |
| 01:35.08 | brlcad | looked benign |
| 01:37.52 | rawer_ | brlcad: what are my regails when i'm coming into the channel, those in bold text ? |
| 01:38.16 | rawer_ | is it fun.fun.fun. - naturfood.net ?? |
| 01:38.31 | brlcad | rawer_: que? |
| 01:38.49 | brlcad | ~dict regails |
| 01:39.13 | rawer_ | i meant what does it write |
| 01:39.24 | rawer_ | does it shows my ip ? |
| 01:39.27 | brlcad | yep |
| 01:39.35 | rawer_ | which one? |
| 01:39.42 | brlcad | 20:39 -!- rawer_ [n=ubuntu@217.8.236.161] has joined #brlcad |
| 01:39.54 | rawer_ | oh... |
| 01:40.42 | brlcad | we do have cloaks that I could give out, but you'd still have to register to get one |
| 01:41.00 | brlcad | speaking of such, if anyone wants a cloak, lemme know |
| 01:41.13 | rawer_ | i don't need cloaks, i prefer some resilient as5 |
| 01:41.16 | brlcad | tears a big ol' hole into one of his walls |
| 01:50.10 | rawer_ | i will quit to re-install the system |
| 01:51.11 | rawer_ | brlcad: so what happens when i upload archive to into the brl-cad's tracker? |
| 01:51.28 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
| 01:51.40 | rawer_ | shall I save a link or something? |
| 01:51.54 | rawer_ | to give it to another human... |
| 01:55.40 | *** part/#brlcad rawer_ (n=ubuntu@217.8.236.161) | |
| 02:07.39 | brlcad | Ralith: you can put a link or upload it as an attachment |
| 02:07.55 | brlcad | you could also upload it via anonymous ftp to brlcad.org/incoming |
| 02:08.06 | Ralith | you probably meant rawer |
| 02:08.07 | Ralith | who just left |
| 02:08.10 | Ralith | >_> |
| 02:09.23 | brlcad | oops, yep I did |
| 02:09.34 | brlcad | read s/left/joined/ |
| 02:10.04 | brlcad | Ralith: well then maybe you can't upload it as an attachment ;) |
| 02:10.24 | Ralith | perhaps not! |
| 02:24.08 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33354 10/brlcad/trunk/autogen.sh: |
| 02:24.08 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: merge in more changes from Sebastian Pipping's git tree, commit |
| 02:24.08 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: fe2e3ecadce19faa426595da2572b090bd3769b9 (Add download code using wget or curl, |
| 02:24.08 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: as available). made a few mods to make the download of config.guess optional |
| 02:24.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: (and default to off for now) and toggleable based on a DOWNLOAD var. |
| 02:27.52 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33355 10/brlcad/trunk/autogen.sh: add command-line -d|--download switches for turning DOWNLOAD on |
| 02:41.20 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33356 10/brlcad/trunk/autogen.sh: apply Sebastian Pipping's 18a5403c34555594184b6d28c200cdefb778bfdd commit from his git tree (libtoolize detection added for config.guess download after autoreconf, add /me to authors) with a few minor mods. |
| 02:50.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33357 10/brlcad/trunk/autogen.sh: |
| 02:50.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: and the last change by sebastian pipping, from git commit |
| 02:50.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 320ee0c022636152b173ecd9b57a373fce02b1a4 (Separate availability check and actual |
| 02:50.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: download, report versions, add support for fetch). includes a few (untested) |
| 02:50.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: minor mods to push the actual download line to a one-liner. |
| 05:05.56 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedyJR (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 06:12.25 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 07:46.40 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 08:36.27 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 09:13.13 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
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| 10:53.17 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@172.Red-83-45-253.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 11:11.46 | mafm | ho ho ho |
| 11:53.46 | mafm | meh, nobody likes my santa's-like greeting :P |
| 12:00.44 | archivist | chucks a snowball at mafm bah humbug |
| 12:08.34 | mafm | :þ |
| 12:10.03 | mafm | christmas spirit is dead :P |
| 12:31.46 | claymore | Mornin all! |
| 12:32.06 | claymore | and no, Christmas Spirit is alive and well in my household. |
| 12:32.39 | claymore | The REAL Christmas Spirit that is... not the commericialized, overbearing Santa style Chirstmas ;) |
| 12:59.14 | *** join/#brlcad ``Erik_ (i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net) | |
| 12:59.57 | claymore | hai ``Erik_ |
| 13:08.14 | claymore | kicks ``Erik_ 's cable modem. Behave!!! |
| 13:08.53 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33358 10/rt^3/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): removed pthreadcc and socketcc (perhaps temporarily) due to licensing. Plan to replace with boost::asio and boost::threads |
| 13:14.46 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33359 10/rt^3/trunk/include/boost/ (198 files in 11 dirs): added boost::asio to include/ dir. 'Boost::Asio is a cross-platform C++ library for network and low-level I/O programming' |
| 13:34.46 | claymore | heh, compile error message: "../../include/boost/optional.hpp:15:39: error: boost/optional/optional.hpp: No such file or directory" -looks like the optional file isn't optional. :D |
| 13:35.01 | clock_ | hates boost |
| 13:35.25 | clock_ | I don't know what it is but it's often required by C++ programs and renders them unable to compile |
| 13:35.49 | claymore | boost is just a ginormous collection of libraries. |
| 13:58.36 | *** join/#brlcad brlcad (n=sean@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 13:58.46 | *** mode/#brlcad [+o brlcad] by ChanServ | |
| 13:58.54 | brlcad | grr. |
| 13:59.57 | brlcad | is getting unhappy with younder reliable isp of late being no longer reliable |
| 14:06.20 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@lns-bzn-59-82-252-133-172.adsl.proxad.net) | |
| 14:06.41 | PrezKennedyJR | brlcad, who? |
| 14:11.54 | brlcad | sago |
| 14:16.46 | brlcad | woo hoo, couch arrived! |
| 14:17.10 | brlcad | and my awesomeness bench made from old railroad ties |
| 14:17.28 | brlcad | two more deliveries to go! |
| 14:17.49 | brlcad | clock_: boost is only a pita if it's not managed properly, like any external dependency |
| 14:18.20 | brlcad | you really do have to use their tool to determine what is used and what isn't, so you get everything (or simply include all of boost, but that's a cop-out and massive) |
| 14:22.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33360 10/brlcad/trunk/ (6 files in 3 dirs): Added the TireWizard. |
| 14:35.50 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33361 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/tire.c: Removed leftover debug statement. |
| 15:10.57 | PrezKennedyJR | brlcad, i heard about the couch |
| 15:11.00 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 15:11.06 | PrezKennedyJR | get my mom and dad to buy a new one already! |
| 15:21.17 | ``Erik_ | takes off his pants and dances around |
| 15:35.52 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (n=MinuteEl@unaffiliated/minuteelectron) | |
| 15:38.46 | *** join/#brlcad claymore (n=claymore@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 15:41.13 | claymore | oddness. |
| 15:41.13 | ``Erik | and/or evenness |
| 15:41.40 | claymore | is hungry. |
| 15:47.48 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14FEBC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:13.53 | *** join/#brlcad ibot (i=ibot@rikers.org) | |
| 17:13.53 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
| 17:21.31 | brlcad | claymore: tv awesomeness is definitely > luncheon, but I'm still waiting |
| 17:22.10 | brlcad | the furniture is in, though.. really love this recliner :) |
| 17:23.22 | brlcad | was going to go to the luncheon if it arrived in time, but looks like that's a no-go |
| 17:23.29 | brlcad | the window was 10-2 |
| 18:02.08 | mafm | hmm guys, generic question about programming |
| 18:02.30 | mafm | in C/C++, the compiler optimizes i++ increments when not assigned? |
| 18:02.38 | mafm | or it does store the old value anyway? |
| 18:03.04 | mafm | (I know that it depends on the compiler and optimization level, but I mean in general and well known compilers) |
| 18:04.35 | mafm | that would be important, performance/storage-wise, in for() loops in example |
| 18:05.53 | elite01 | i bet most do, at least if i is a primitive type |
| 18:06.05 | elite01 | i still prefer ++i since it matches the intention better |
| 18:06.14 | elite01 | when in doubt, watch asm output |
| 18:06.21 | elite01 | (--save-temps or so) |
| 18:06.43 | *** join/#brlcad louipc (n=louipc@archlinux/trusteduser/louipc) | |
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| 19:40.40 | mafm | thanks elite01 (I read it before but forgot to say anything) |
| 19:40.41 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33362 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tirewizard/TireWizard.tcl: Indicate the units for various entries. |
| 19:41.05 | mafm | I think that the optimization only involves checking whether there's some use for the value to be returned |
| 19:41.10 | mafm | if not, the code is converted |
| 19:41.55 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33363 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tirewizard.tcl: Minor mod of an error message. |
| 19:52.46 | ``Erik | *burp* |
| 19:53.15 | claymore | wow... just wow.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_K-429 |
| 20:01.57 | ``Erik | heh, the guy who tried to follow procedure and saved lives gets punished, the guy who fucked it all up got promoted O.o russia aint' so different from the us after all! :D |
| 20:03.13 | claymore | I d'no.... the captain of a submarine forgetting to rig for dive? Thats pretty bad and deserves a bit of punishment :/ |
| 20:03.49 | ``Erik | yeah, but ordering underway without trained crew, ordering immediate torpedo range without the regular post-drydock shakedown? |
| 20:04.14 | claymore | oh yeah, thats pretty dumb to. Not arguing that lol. |
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| 21:39.37 | nixon-9 | dinner time? |
| 21:47.05 | brlcad | soon! |
| 21:47.36 | nixon-9 | brlcad: heck the mail box |
| 21:48.52 | nixon-9 | brlcad: give me a hint how to connect to windows from linux through the cable? |
| 21:49.07 | nixon-9 | 0-modem cable, two computers |
| 21:54.36 | ``Erik | gotta set up the, uh, tty |
| 21:54.52 | ``Erik | linux does that in, uhmmmmm, I think inittab? |
| 21:54.56 | ``Erik | to a getty? |
| 21:55.06 | ``Erik | then use like 'minicom' or 'tip' on the other one |
| 21:55.09 | ``Erik | tada! |
| 21:55.15 | nixon-9 | ``Erik: ok |
| 21:55.37 | nixon-9 | ok, i will try it at a very first time |
| 21:55.44 | ``Erik | knows how to do it on bsd or slowaris better |
| 21:56.18 | nixon-9 | wants it to be the best experience ever! |
| 22:08.38 | *** part/#brlcad nixon-9 (n=sporty@217.8.236.127) | |
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| 22:13.53 | brlcad | best experience ever.. |
| 22:13.59 | brlcad | then what are you using windows for? |
| 22:14.55 | i`lya | i`lya: right, heh... marry moment for both computers and me |
| 22:15.53 | i`lya | brlcad: it's not my pc, that with windows one... We have licensed windows at work, btw |
| 22:16.17 | brlcad | being licensed doesn't make the OS work any better |
| 22:16.46 | i`lya | the more reachable the internet - the more they forcce citizens to buy licensed software. not for homes, but at least for firms |
| 22:17.09 | i`lya | brlcad: but i can not say windows xp was unstable |
| 22:18.10 | brlcad | nobody is forced to buy anything |
| 22:18.49 | i`lya | brlcad: without internet, in '97 - we had to use illegal software |
| 22:19.19 | ``Erik | surely you could've started punching in op codes and bootstrapping a home rolled OS |
| 22:19.21 | brlcad | you along with millions of others, what's your point? |
| 22:19.38 | brlcad | and you didn't have to, there were other viable operating systems even back in '97 |
| 22:19.45 | ``Erik | or bought a copy of minix |
| 22:19.55 | ``Erik | or linux, or fbsd, or netbsd, or obsd, or ... |
| 22:20.16 | brlcad | I think that's right about when I make linux my primary, actually |
| 22:20.18 | louipc | linux wasn't so great in 97 |
| 22:20.37 | ``Erik | did it in '96 |
| 22:20.37 | ``Erik | late '96, like octoberish |
| 22:20.48 | ``Erik | feb-oct with winderz, it was... too much to bear |
| 22:20.52 | brlcad | louipc: neither was windows :) |
| 22:21.07 | louipc | well my sound card worked at least :D |
| 22:21.22 | i`lya | brlcad: linux + offline = linux on 5 cd, 3-hours installation, uh.... i played games to be true |
| 22:22.36 | i`lya | who remembers 4X cd-roms? my is right here, close to me. Can plug it thru ide->usb to laptop |
| 22:23.11 | ``Erik | heh, I had a 1x :D |
| 22:23.39 | i`lya | what a good time! Life was more simple! |
| 22:23.47 | ``Erik | used to buy 120 minute audio cassettes because you could fit more data on them, even though they went bad sooner |
| 22:23.57 | ``Erik | pheer my epeen |
| 22:24.05 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-234-121.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 22:24.34 | i`lya | ``Erik: they didn't went bad sooner! |
| 22:24.45 | ``Erik | they'd stretch and become unreadable |
| 22:24.48 | i`lya | they rule |
| 22:25.00 | i`lya | ``Erik: no |
| 22:25.39 | ``Erik | at least the coleco adam decided they were crap *shrug* I was buying the red and silver ones, uh, 'tdk' I think? |
| 22:25.45 | brlcad | i`lya: plenty of linux distros were on just one disc |
| 22:26.00 | ``Erik | in '97, many were on sets of floppies :) |
| 22:26.04 | brlcad | heck, even redhat only had two through most of the 90's |
| 22:26.07 | i`lya | brlcad: but they need libraries from iternet |
| 22:26.17 | brlcad | no, full distributions |
| 22:26.24 | brlcad | I did plenty of offline installs |
| 22:26.30 | i`lya | ``Erik: TDK, heh |
| 22:27.49 | i`lya | brlcad: 5 cd - i have told it about modern distributions (know 8 cd) |
| 22:28.16 | i`lya | those 3 cd i had contained more than one dvd with kubuntu |
| 22:28.53 | ``Erik | http://www.freebsdmall.com/cgi-bin/fm/bsd7.0?id=yVw7ircA&mv_pc=24 booyeah |
| 22:28.53 | brlcad | i`lya: you're jumping from 90's to now |
| 22:29.13 | brlcad | i'm saying back then it was just a disc or two and you were fine |
| 22:29.50 | i`lya | brlcad: but i could thnk about e.g. Need For Speed + wine + linux |
| 22:30.10 | brlcad | i.e. "without internet, in '97 - we had to use illegal software" is complete bull :) |
| 22:30.33 | i`lya | brlcad: right, but there were only illegal windows - for newbies |
| 22:30.59 | brlcad | huh? |
| 22:31.08 | brlcad | there was linux |
| 22:31.17 | brlcad | there was a bunch of other OS too |
| 22:31.50 | ``Erik | installed linux from 14.4k modem |
| 22:31.58 | i`lya | brlcad: right |
| 22:32.19 | i`lya | feel guilty |
| 22:32.51 | i`lya | i pay 0.10-0.30 usd / mb |
| 22:33.35 | ``Erik | sooo, back then y ou would've paid about a dollar for a functional linux download, hrm |
| 22:34.14 | i`lya | ``Erik: ah, i mean right now - but in a past, internet was a dream! |
| 22:36.24 | brlcad | that's what BBS were for |
| 22:36.45 | ``Erik | bbs's were awesome |
| 22:36.51 | i`lya | brlcad: i'm using it since '03 |
| 22:36.52 | brlcad | I paid into a local BBS a couple bucks a month |
| 22:37.28 | i`lya | brlcad: was it like phones just right at street? |
| 22:37.42 | i`lya | What does it look like, that BBS? |
| 22:37.44 | brlcad | (from panama) and the BBS would dial up the USA once a week to relay into another BBS that had intermittent internet connectivity |
| 22:38.35 | i`lya | brlcad: calm fun |
| 22:38.41 | brlcad | i`lya: it was on the computer, you'd dial into a bulletin board system -- text-only interface, apps, messages, games, mail |
| 22:38.44 | i`lya | or dead disko |
| 22:38.47 | ``Erik | remembers computer clubs, with boxes of 5.25" floppies sitting around with software and several machines with dual drives... people would bring a box of blanks and copy what they wanted |
| 22:38.51 | ``Erik | nutty stuff |
| 22:39.14 | brlcad | yeah, I remember doing that :0 |
| 22:39.31 | ``Erik | odd social events :) |
| 22:39.37 | brlcad | one guy would buy something, then everyone had it |
| 22:39.42 | i`lya | social, right |
| 22:42.48 | i`lya | how can i 'go back' in info files? |
| 22:43.04 | i`lya | is it e.g. Alt+Left Arrow? |
| 22:43.15 | brlcad | 'p'? |
| 22:43.27 | brlcad | 'p'revious |
| 22:43.32 | i`lya | ok |
| 22:43.51 | brlcad | 't'op |
| 22:44.20 | i`lya | brlcad: why do you know it? |
| 22:44.49 | brlcad | I don't, I just ran it and saw the menu :P |
| 22:45.14 | brlcad | it's a blend of emacs and vi behaviors |
| 22:45.20 | i`lya | whoa!:-/ |
| 22:49.16 | i`lya | brlcad: i think you know french, could it be? try to say something. |
| 22:50.23 | i`lya | like la femmé est l'amour (hope it means something :) |
| 22:53.48 | i`lya | brlcad: what if i try to edit pages "program-info.info" in the package "program-info.tgz"? will the menu work after that? Or i will have to re-arrange links in TeTex ?? |
| 22:53.57 | brlcad | je ne parle pas francais |
| 22:54.00 | i`lya | i meant info files |
| 22:54.47 | brlcad | i`lya: depends what edits you make |
| 22:54.53 | i`lya | brlcad: i read they grammar right now (this month) in attempt to know this language |
| 22:55.13 | i`lya | brlcad: adding/deleting random lines and letters |
| 22:55.50 | brlcad | why would you do that? |
| 22:56.00 | brlcad | actually, I don't want to know |
| 22:56.06 | brlcad | no, I doubt that will work |
| 22:56.09 | i`lya | brlcad: i'm a bad, bad man |
| 22:56.30 | i`lya | brlcad: i doubt, too - and will not even try it |
| 23:00.18 | i`lya | .info files are nicely arranged for learning something. Most of modern sources offer too big amount of information at once - we all will have big heads soon (will mutate towards virtual entities) |
| 23:58.50 | i`lya | brlcad: what time? |
| 23:59.02 | ``Erik | party time! |
| 23:59.07 | ``Erik | takes off his pants and dances |
| 23:59.15 | i`lya | ibot: time |
| 23:59.16 | ibot | You cannot understand nature's perfect time cube! (2008.12.11 23:59:16 GMT) |
| 23:59.24 | mafm | night |
| 23:59.54 | i`lya | ``Erik: don't get a flu, put on your pants |
| 00:00.11 | ``Erik | Thu Dec 11 19:00:05 EST 2008 |
| 00:00.40 | i`lya | ibot: are you at GMT 0 ?? |
| 00:01.17 | louipc | ibot is a bot |
| 00:01.27 | i`lya | ok, i need to quit |
| 00:04.46 | *** join/#brlcad i`lya (n=sporty@217.8.236.149) | |
| 00:05.01 | i`lya | ibot: time |
| 00:05.02 | ibot | You cannot understand nature's perfect time cube! (2008.12.12 0:05:02 GMT) |
| 00:06.47 | i`lya | has found an elegant way to get NTP support from ibot |
| 00:08.46 | ``Erik | why not just |
| 00:08.49 | ``Erik | y'know |
| 00:08.50 | ``Erik | use ntp |
| 00:11.56 | i`lya | ``Erik: i fear NTP |
| 00:12.13 | ``Erik | why? |
| 00:13.06 | i`lya | ``Erik: "N" makes you back hurt, "T" will stay above your grave, "P" - is another dangerous letter. |
| 00:13.13 | i`lya | *your |
| 00:13.42 | ``Erik | so what's the poison tonight, vodka or crack? O.o |
| 00:15.54 | i`lya | ``Erik: science! want to finish some projects. Dreaming about a smoothie: banana+frozen water + some sugar to boost my mind |
| 00:27.56 | punkrockgirl | why is erik taking off his pants and running around the room? |
| 00:28.14 | ``Erik | cuz I'm EFFIN' AWESOME, YO |
| 00:28.25 | punkrockgirl | oh yeah |
| 00:39.21 | i`lya | oh yeah, punkrockgirl! |
| 00:41.53 | i`lya | this day i'm finishing all except some program-like stuff and brl-cad works. "I want to be free - and I am free." |
| 00:43.20 | i`lya | But real freedom goes thru devotion to less complicated, less complete more simple - i mean e.g. raw vegan food style when i like to cycle 100 km under the rain! yeah! groovie, baby! |
| 00:43.57 | i`lya | *more complete* |
| 01:13.15 | i`lya | btw, can use jove (in attempt to use elisp) for formulas? |
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| 01:35.56 | louipc | jove is very minimal. I don't think it has lisp |
| 01:39.39 | i`lya | louipc: ok |
| 01:52.46 | i`lya | you have an evening of yesterday |
| 01:52.52 | i`lya | ha-ha |
| 02:42.56 | ``Erik | amusing, considering the original lisp (iirc) existed on an ibm 704 with something like 4k words of memory O.o |
| 02:43.32 | ``Erik | word was 36 bits? |
| 02:43.37 | ``Erik | *think* |
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| 03:04.48 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 03:41.14 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
| 03:51.33 | *** join/#brlcad starseeker (n=starseek@bz.bzflag.bz) | |
| 03:51.57 | starseeker | hmm, dead screen session |
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| 10:36.26 | ``Erik | yargh. |
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| 10:57.32 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:36.47 | starseeker | ``Erik: Second the motion |
| 14:00.53 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
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| 14:16.04 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:36.25 | ``Erik | wanders around a bit repeating questions to people who give elusive answers O.o |
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| 19:56.48 | i`lya | punkrockgirl: really a lady? |
| 20:00.03 | brlcad | i`lya: she's too good for you |
| 20:01.12 | i`lya | brlcad: oh, come on! |
| 20:05.46 | i`lya | friday, heh |
| 20:07.39 | i`lya | starseeker: hello! i wanted to ask you to download those files under my account on sourceforge. Let me send you account info. |
| 20:09.55 | i`lya | starseeker: i have only few xml -files with commands and about 100 kb of plain text of mged_cmd_index.html I plan to translate it in a short time and upload "into" the tracker. I will translate ~/docs then. |
| 20:11.29 | i`lya | i'm also creating lots of my skilled-job examples - that's why everything is so slow. |
| 20:15.24 | i`lya | starseeker: b-t-w, i'm separating "command promptst" from its full description in that plain text on russian. - So if you e.g. creating these xml-files from some template in some program (or e.g. by means of the script on "python) - it will be very easy to do it. Shall I "mark" paragraphs? |
| 20:17.51 | i`lya | brlcad: can i fill xml files by means of python programming language - from plain text with marks as e.g. *command_name*, **argument** **argument**, ***promt***, ****description**** - and so on ?? |
| 20:18.33 | brlcad | i`lya: you could, but that's also what docbook is good at |
| 20:18.39 | i`lya | brlcad: but i need to read another info, not about python p.l. - at least these week |
| 20:18.41 | brlcad | just put the real docbook tags, and then write a script |
| 20:20.37 | i`lya | brlcad: but i do not know scripting yet. Do you mean those tags as e.g. <arg>argument</arg> ?? |
| 20:21.07 | i`lya | brlcad: i can do it, but i will read about the scripting not as soon |
| 20:23.44 | i`lya | brlcad: so... i will look towards good tutorial on the python programming language theme (because of code-aster.org, which fea package uses it also) |
| 20:29.49 | brlcad | i`lya: yes, tags just like html .. docbook just has a handful of tags |
| 20:34.10 | *** part/#brlcad AddZero (n=user@c75-111-103-220.amrlcmta01.tx.dh.suddenlink.net) | |
| 20:46.36 | i`lya | then if i've used tags as <arg></arg> at both, command and Exmaples section - collation functions will be abit more sophisticared than just collation of tags |
| 20:47.25 | i`lya | brlcad: do you know Harvey Birdman ?? |
| 20:47.29 | brlcad | nope |
| 20:47.40 | i`lya | brlcad: ? |
| 20:48.09 | brlcad | i`lya: ? |
| 20:48.14 | i`lya | it's an "adult swim" on cable tv cartoon series |
| 20:48.35 | brlcad | it's a time of night that a particular cartoon network plays adult cartoons |
| 20:49.03 | brlcad | rather, yes I know of adult swim, but still don't know the reference |
| 20:49.13 | i`lya | brlcad: right, and since i look tv right now- i'm watching it |
| 20:49.20 | i`lya | brlcad: ok |
| 20:50.23 | i`lya | brlcad: i'm working at nights last time |
| 20:51.49 | i`lya | brlcad: is it true, that first macintosh was some kind of... 9 seconds to boot - and "unified" GUI for all, no variety of protocols, no variety of progs ? |
| 20:53.58 | brlcad | hm, less than 9 seconds iirc |
| 20:54.10 | i`lya | i mean, i think e.g. good 'beautiful' operating system of the future will have only one wireless protocol instead of bluetooth and wi-fi, - and so on. Because of a fact, that processors will be .. |
| 20:54.17 | brlcad | nearly instant boot |
| 20:54.39 | i`lya | brlcad: right! this is what i think about last time... |
| 20:56.24 | i`lya | i think modern systems are too complicated... I wish wi-fi can connect to bluetooth adapters... Capitalism... |
| 20:57.37 | brlcad | Jef Raskin talks about the boot up time in his book, "The Humane Interface" |
| 20:57.47 | brlcad | very good read, highly recommend it |
| 20:59.10 | i`lya | brlcad: is it free? |
| 21:01.55 | i`lya | brlcad: as a person of the world, i must say i think any art & things-we-play is a deviation from the calmness being found in contemplaining the another gender. Any technology could be more friendly & moving towards the ecology |
| 21:10.01 | i`lya | brlcad: do you have a car? if yes, front or rear drive? |
| 21:10.38 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-236-74.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 21:12.42 | i`lya | clock_: why don't sleep this time? |
| 21:20.03 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03r_weiss * r33364 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/ (Makefile.am dem-g.c): Initial upload of converter of USGS ASCII DEM file to BRL-CAD dsp primitive. |
| 21:27.42 | ``Erik | w00t |
| 21:28.11 | i`lya | ``Erik: still with no pants, ha-ha? |
| 21:28.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03r_weiss * r33365 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: Added standard header to dem-g.c |
| 21:32.02 | ``Erik | pants are for the weak |
| 21:32.17 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03erikgreenwald * r33366 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: features.h is not standard. Eliminate the _ISOC99_SOURCE line. Minor header section cleanup. |
| 22:01.02 | *** join/#brlcad b0ef (n=b0ef@062016142244.customer.alfanett.no) | |
| 22:45.33 | i`lya | ``Erik: can you advise me some good snowy wallpaper 1280x1024 ? |
| 22:46.10 | i`lya | like rally+snow or as Alta Badia in KDE |
| 23:01.27 | i`lya | /me imagines PrezKennedy's wife with no pants, and her with no pants, too |
| 23:01.59 | i`lya | ...and punkrockgirl with no pants, too :-/ |
| 23:23.06 | ``Erik | rolls up a newspaper and smacks ilya |
| 23:23.08 | ``Erik | no, bad, mine |
| 23:25.45 | i`lya | ``Erik: |
| 23:33.02 | punkrockgirl | ;P |
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| 23:50.08 | *** join/#brlcad sport1 (n=sporty@217.8.236.156) | |
| 23:50.25 | sport1 | goes mad |
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| 00:03.20 | ilya | what was written on my logging in ?? |
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| 04:24.14 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33367 10/brlcad/trunk/AUTHORS: richard gains code contributor status with the addition of his dem-g terrain importer, congrats and thanks! |
| 04:33.14 | mafm | night |
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| 12:23.47 | mafm | hi |
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| 15:56.02 | sporty__ | ***everybody relax today*** Let's keep a spirit alive! Come on! Hardcore! |
| 15:56.34 | mafm | O_o |
| 15:56.40 | sporty__ | ibot: time |
| 15:56.41 | ibot | 2008.12.13 15:56:41 GMT |
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| 18:21.32 | sporty__ | imagines how PrezKennedyJR's daughters draft themself in BRL-CAD suite 7.12 64-bit in GUI |
| 18:41.36 | sporty__ | (they create "no pants till the end" version and give it to sporty__, who gives him a kiss's last album, and a kiss) |
| 18:42.03 | sporty__ | and a kwiws |
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| 18:48.08 | sporty__ | "Ko-rotational Whit-Indirect (ah Wow!) S", a letter S made of love and passion (sorry, checking out my English skills again) - or just a kwiws. Kwiwses are very popular at the south of the eastern Europe withing a poor families where spouse can not take too much financial assets out from the business at a marriage. [kwiws latin smth. virtual" |
| 18:48.09 | *** join/#brlcad MinuteElectron (n=MinuteEl@unaffiliated/minuteelectron) | |
| 18:48.42 | sporty__ | *poor families* |
| 18:55.00 | sporty__ | just writing my own "fictionary" |
| 18:55.24 | sporty__ | who can add stories? |
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| 19:21.28 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/Project_Cassandra.png :) |
| 19:23.42 | sporty__ | ok, need to add proxy settings to the new browser |
| 19:29.32 | IriX64 | 's ears perk up, browser? i wonder... |
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| 20:43.47 | sporty__ | how can I ask ibot something without boring whole the channel? how can i IM to ibot |
| 20:55.11 | sporty__ | ibot: |
| 21:00.50 | sporty__ | ibot: time |
| 21:01.05 | ibot | You cannot understand nature's perfect time cube! (2008.12.13 21:01:05 GMT) |
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| 21:59.44 | ``Erik | my time cube is teh bettarz |
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| 23:07.21 | csanyipal | Hi, I have installed brl-cad 7.14.1. Are there in this version a tool to insert some text in a model? |
| 23:28.59 | csanyipal | Or can I export the current MGED display to an image file? Or can I edit an exported ps file to add some text to the image? |
| 23:31.04 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 23:44.07 | brlcad | csanyipal: there were some modifications to make it easier to insert text, but I've not tested them out to see how/if they're exposed to the user yet |
| 23:44.38 | brlcad | csanyipal: you can, though, export the current mged display to an image file (the wireframe) using the File -> Save View options |
| 23:45.34 | mafm | hi brlcad |
| 23:45.47 | mafm | how's the libged thingy coming along? |
| 23:45.53 | brlcad | there are options for plot (.pl) and postscript (.ps) options, and a variety of command line tools for converting those (e.g. pl-fb | fb-png) |
| 23:46.06 | brlcad | mafm: pretty well, it's almost complete |
| 23:46.56 | mafm | when it would be? I don't see a lot of activity for libged in the commits (although when moving I never put much attention) |
| 23:47.29 | brlcad | it's been non-stop |
| 23:48.49 | mafm | that means too much, or maybe not but all the time? |
| 23:49.48 | mafm | I saw some from Bob but mostly related to TCL |
| 23:50.05 | brlcad | there is libged work mixed in with what looks like tcl work |
| 23:50.18 | brlcad | the tcl work almost always followed a libged change |
| 23:50.22 | brlcad | that was his way of testing it |
| 23:51.12 | mafm | oh, I see |
| 23:51.45 | mafm | when everything is finishing, there will be somebody to guide me to continue the work, or it would be me having to do the design and all that too? |
| 23:52.35 | mafm | finishing->-ed |
| 23:53.54 | csanyipal | brlcad: Sorry, but I haven't that option: File -> Save View ... |
| 00:02.18 | brlcad | csanyipal: that was just from memory, it's on the File menu |
| 00:02.23 | brlcad | look for ps and plot options |
| 00:07.25 | mafm | brlcad: so? |
| 00:08.17 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, someone should help guide the work |
| 00:08.25 | mafm | fine |
| 00:08.29 | brlcad | there are three pieces |
| 00:08.37 | brlcad | libged, the engine, and the service |
| 00:09.10 | mafm | because I'll be finishing the degree's project hopefully, and I'm still a bit lost with all this really |
| 00:09.11 | brlcad | ultimately, g3d should get hooked into the latter service |
| 00:10.26 | mafm | that's David's one? |
| 00:10.38 | csanyipal | brlcad: ok I got now a file.ps and converted it with pstoedit in to a .sk format. Now I open it with skencil to edit it. Thanks! |
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| 00:16.14 | poolio | howdy all |
| 00:22.43 | brlcad | howdy! |
| 00:26.02 | csanyipal | Buy! |
| 01:00.11 | mafm | night |
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| 01:42.31 | poolio | brlcad: how's life? |
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| 01:43.24 | kanzure | Hello. |
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| 06:33.50 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 13:43.10 | mafm | hi |
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| 16:52.16 | brlcad | kanzure: howdy |
| 16:52.36 | brlcad | poolio: going great -- just moved into a new house |
| 18:04.14 | kanzure | Hi brlcad. |
| 18:05.21 | *** join/#brlcad DanielFalck (n=dan@pool-71-111-74-200.ptldor.dsl-w.verizon.net) | |
| 18:05.58 | kanzure | I've been busy working on a converting a thumbdrive into a live linux ISO so that I can recover a machine. I was playing around with BRLCAD, decided to switch the mouse out (to get me a wheel), and metal connected and the box turned off. Turns out I had a new kernel waiting to boot up, and now it panics on bootup. |
| 18:07.41 | DanielFalck | hi is there a web location with logfiles of this channel? |
| 18:08.49 | kanzure | Yes. |
| 18:09.24 | DanielFalck | ahha- http://ibot.rikers.org/%23brlcad/ |
| 18:26.39 | kanzure | http://heybryan.org/brlcad.html <- My compilation notes. |
| 18:45.02 | kanzure | 3~1~\ |
| 18:48.23 | brlcad | kanzure: those issues should already be fixed in the latest svn sources |
| 18:48.52 | brlcad | Xi not getting included has been there for a while -- configure warns about it (not that anyone notices..) :) |
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| 19:33.56 | kanzure | brlcad: Nah, I noticed configure complaining, even with --with-libs="-lXi". But whatever. |
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| 21:08.37 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
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| 22:49.09 | IriX64 | re's |
| 22:49.39 | poolio | brlcad: sweet. is this closer to baltimore? |
| 23:36.46 | brlcad | poolio: it's *in* baltimore, so yeah ;) |
| 23:43.24 | redvsblue | fyi: today is erik's bday :D |
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| 23:50.02 | brlcad | redvsblue: heh, thx |
| 23:57.49 | yukonbob | hey cadheads, a question: |
| 23:58.09 | yukonbob | what are your favourite cad/3d-gfx monthlies? |
| 23:58.42 | yukonbob | I was @ a magazine shop the other day, and looking at a magazine for 3d gfx when this question occured to me... |
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| 03:03.23 | brlcad | yukonbob: the only monthly I really care about are the monthly releases of BRL-CAD ;) |
| 03:04.58 | DanielFalck | hi brlcad, it's been quite a while since I have used brlcad. Is it now possible to extrude a dxf path into a solid? |
| 03:05.19 | DanielFalck | using some other program like qcad to generate the dxf |
| 03:19.41 | yukonbob | brlcad: :) |
| 03:21.25 | brlcad | DanielFalck: dxf's with closed-form 2D entities should now import as our sketch primitive |
| 03:22.03 | DanielFalck | ok, great |
| 03:22.07 | brlcad | sketches can be extruded (linearly) |
| 03:22.29 | DanielFalck | is there any way to generate taper? |
| 03:22.31 | brlcad | can't yet sweep them along an arbitrary spline path, though -- that work started this summer but wasn't completed |
| 03:40.34 | brlcad | depends on the shape of the taper and what's being tapered, you could use a separate boolean operation to cut accordingly |
| 03:40.45 | brlcad | alas, extrudes can't be tapered though |
| 03:40.59 | brlcad | at least not via a built-in taper value |
| 03:42.46 | DanielFalck | ok, no problem. thanks for the info |
| 04:10.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33368 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/extrude/extrude.c: ws & style consistency cleanup |
| 04:52.26 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33369 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librt/primitives/extrude/extrude.c: unbreak. macros are scoped, so have to use parens if we're going to put the semicolon. |
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| 09:31.25 | mafm | hi |
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| 11:27.40 | claymore | Morning all! |
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| 11:34.40 | claymore | yawns. |
| 11:44.21 | claymore | Here is a link to some photoshop artists' work. Some good, some strange.... http://psdtuts.com/articles/web/54-mind-blowing-digital-paintings/ |
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| 12:01.55 | claymore | anyone: If I build a library (aka boost) and want to include it in a C++ compile, its simply a matter of adding it to the g++ command line... correct? g++ -I ../../include -o myCppApp myCppFile.cxx /path/to/boost/system/build/gcc-4.1.2/release/threading-multi/libboost_system-gcc41-mt-1_37.so.1.37.0 |
| 12:02.35 | claymore | yet once I attempt to run myCppApp, i get the following error: error while loading shared libraries: libboost_system-gcc41-mt-1_37.so.1.37.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory |
| 12:03.01 | claymore | which tells me that either the library didn't build right or a path isn't set right somewhere.... |
| 12:03.06 | claymore | ... any help? |
| 12:17.11 | Ralith | claymore: you need to link the lib, too. I suggest you familiarize yourself with the basics before moving into things like multithreading and boost. |
| 12:19.25 | claymore | :/ well thats helpful, lol. |
| 12:20.50 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 12:21.29 | claymore | Ralith: I understand that I need to link the lib, and that is what I thought I was doing. hence my confusion and question. |
| 12:22.16 | claymore | are you speaking of using -l ? |
| 12:23.27 | Ralith | -I sets your include path and nothing more |
| 12:23.29 | Ralith | -l links a lib |
| 12:23.31 | Ralith | afk |
| 12:23.53 | claymore | thanks for confirming that |
| 12:28.03 | claymore | btw how is the weather over on the west coast? (when you come back from AFK) |
| 12:42.11 | claymore | ...strange, looks like the rpath isn't setting. :/ |
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| 13:52.51 | Axman6 | clock_: "XMLSLT UML RUP ITIL SQL Oracle Java SAP AJAX IIS ASP Visual Basic C# .NET IT" -- sounds painful :( |
| 13:54.08 | clock_ | lol |
| 13:58.54 | Axman6 | what are RUP and ITIL? |
| 14:02.00 | clock_ | Some kind of bloatware |
| 14:25.14 | ``Erik | a/det |
| 14:25.16 | brlcad | -L is library search path, -I is header include search path |
| 14:25.31 | ``Erik | O.o howdy |
| 14:26.18 | claymore | righto, got all that. libraries compiled and installed into ~/lib/ since I don't have access to /usr/local/lib/ |
| 14:26.29 | brlcad | -l is library to link with a preferential order for dynamic then static depending on the platform |
| 14:26.38 | brlcad | you shouldn't ever need to use full paths when linking unless you're doing something really wrong |
| 14:27.19 | claymore | however, I cannot get the linker to recognize that the .so's are in ~/lib... even when I feed them the whole path via -l and/or give them the appropriate name via -l and path via -L |
| 14:27.19 | brlcad | since you're autotools-building, you also shouldn't need to install prior to using the library (one of libtool's jobs) |
| 14:27.48 | brlcad | except for installing "all of boost" like was mentioned last week so you can figure out what to include |
| 14:27.59 | ``Erik | -L$HOME/lib |
| 14:28.12 | ``Erik | ./configure LDFLAGS=-L$HOME/libs |
| 14:28.31 | ``Erik | or sumfin |
| 14:28.55 | claymore | ``Erik: during the myCppApp build or the boost lib build? |
| 14:29.19 | ``Erik | gcc assumes a .so, um, so you need like $HOME/lib/libcrap.so for -lcrap to work |
| 14:29.36 | ``Erik | during your app build, whatever is looking fo rthe libs |
| 14:29.49 | claymore | hrm. aight, I have a few more things to try then. Thanks |
| 14:30.07 | brlcad | should be mycppapp build |
| 14:30.13 | ``Erik | I'm in right now, so if you get stuck, lemme know and I'll walk down |
| 14:30.37 | brlcad | boost will have had the path embedded as part of --prefix |
| 14:32.02 | claymore | righto, I have the 'make install' command reporting: --prefix=/home/dloman --exec-prefix=/home/dloman --libdir=/home/dloman/lib --includedir=/home/dloman/include |
| 14:32.34 | ``Erik | prefix should be sufficient, the exec looks wrong, the libdir and includedir are redundant |
| 14:32.35 | claymore | and that is as I had it before. :/ |
| 14:33.05 | claymore | ``Erik: Tell the boost guys :) they wrote the ./configure :) |
| 14:33.19 | claymore | I just copy/pasted it |
| 14:34.03 | ``Erik | heh, in the normal world, --exec-prefix will default to /home/dloman/bin, and the other two will be filled by the prefix arg :) mebbe boost does something special :) |
| 14:34.39 | claymore | ``Erik: LDFLAGS=-L$HOME/libs will set where the libraries will reside when all is said and done? |
| 14:34.56 | ``Erik | no, it says where to look for libs |
| 14:35.21 | claymore | oh duh, never mind. lol my bad. |
| 14:35.26 | claymore | info overlaod |
| 14:36.41 | brlcad | claymore: configure lines are almost always just suggestions/examples -- they probably wrote them all out just to show that they can all be overridden |
| 14:36.54 | brlcad | doesn't make them any less redundant, though (for lib/include) |
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| 14:52.11 | claymore | deflates. |
| 14:54.24 | claymore | ``Erik: got a minute? |
| 15:24.43 | ``Erik | detonates |
| 15:25.56 | claymore | esssplosion? |
| 15:26.07 | ``Erik | asplode |
| 15:26.24 | claymore | whoa now, thats at least a yellow light buddy. |
| 15:26.48 | ``Erik | settle down, boy, I'm with punker O.o |
| 15:27.18 | claymore | jams to Beastie Boys |
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| 16:05.48 | *** join/#brlcad kanzure (i=bbishop@66.112.232.117) | |
| 16:07.08 | kanzure | What's the difference between doing an mged command like "comb dome.c u part1.r part2.r part3.r" and "r mypartname.r u sphere1 sphere2" ? Is it just that g/comb doesn't operate on primitives? Seems like an extra layer of abstraction going on. |
| 16:07.37 | ``Erik | iirc, the onyl difference is that 'r' sets the region flag and 'comb' does nt |
| 16:15.03 | brlcad | kanzure: comb is for creating generalized combinations using any sort of boolean recipe; g creates combinations of only unions; r is for creating generalized combinations that are considered *regions* |
| 16:15.34 | brlcad | kanzure: regions are where something goes from being a pattern/shape/idea to physically occupying space |
| 16:20.27 | kanzure | The tutorial says that regions are just whatever it was before plus some material metadata. |
| 16:20.32 | kanzure | (the mged tutorial) |
| 16:20.47 | claymore | thats correct. |
| 16:21.37 | kanzure | Blah. I don't need tutorials. I need code :-). /me goes back to reading. |
| 16:25.23 | brlcad | kanzure: what's the difference between a blueprint for a car and a car? it's what it was befreo plus some material metadata (i.e. it occupies space) |
| 16:25.56 | clock_ | brlcad: the blueprint starts even in winter |
| 16:26.18 | kanzure | brlcad: Sorry, that doesn't work for me. I'm coming from a programmer's perspective; my "blueprints" usually contain some quite dense information, not just geometric primitives etc. |
| 16:26.29 | kanzure | has a strange background, so the terminology isn't synched yet. |
| 16:27.06 | brlcad | kanzure: one is an "idea", one physically occupies space -- organizationally, they're is no difference |
| 16:27.30 | ``Erik | just a 1 bit flag :) |
| 16:27.30 | brlcad | from a programmer's perspective, it's literally a boolean flag that is set |
| 16:27.35 | kanzure | Maybe it would help to know what other commands do when the region flagged is set/unset. |
| 16:27.44 | brlcad | but that flag changes the way things behave -- where overlaps exist |
| 16:27.48 | kanzure | ah? |
| 16:28.30 | brlcad | akin to "shape" vs solid |
| 16:29.25 | kanzure | So, I can (uselessly) have a shape that intersects itself, but if a region/solid had that sort of configuration it would be invalid? Is that's what's going on here? |
| 16:29.43 | kanzure | *intersects and goes through itself in a physically impossible manner, to be more precise |
| 16:30.09 | brlcad | right |
| 16:31.19 | brlcad | before it's a region -- if you union two objects together, it's the union of the sets they represent -- if it's a region and one is steel overlapping another object that is wood, that's invalid since you have two materials occupying the same space |
| 16:35.25 | kanzure | Neat, 'tree' shows me a boolean algebra tree. If I modify one of the primitives at some ridiculous depth in the hierarchy, is the entire tree modified, or is there a way for me to do versioning control on it? |
| 16:36.55 | brlcad | I don't know what you mean by the entire tree being modified, but there is no automatic versioning control |
| 16:37.02 | brlcad | at least not yet |
| 16:37.30 | brlcad | one of the features of the new geometry service is to provide automatic versioning control on all edits, comprehensive tracking |
| 16:38.14 | brlcad | or by versioning control, do you mean instantiation .. you have 20 crayons in a box and you want to make one have a bite taken out of it |
| 16:38.24 | brlcad | that's easily doable |
| 16:38.26 | kanzure | I think that's nearly the same thing |
| 16:38.56 | kanzure | that second case, of 20 crayons + a bite taken out could be done via copying the tree, but maybe I'm lazy and I do something "irreversible" and harm my precious tree |
| 16:39.05 | kanzure | I guess you already answered that though, it's generally irreversible at the moment :) |
| 16:39.08 | brlcad | no no, not at all the same thing -- by versioning control, I'm talking SVN/CVS style complete revision history of all edits |
| 16:39.23 | kanzure | yes me too, but I was thinking of an object-level for versioning control, not for the entire file. |
| 16:39.41 | brlcad | I mean per object too |
| 16:39.54 | brlcad | instantiation is a much different beast though |
| 16:40.43 | brlcad | in y our example, you could create a copy of the tree -- there are shallow (referential) copies and deep copies you can perform |
| 16:41.16 | brlcad | if you wanted to be safe, you could make a deep copy and do whatever you wanted, the original tree would be unmodified (as there is no association after the deep copy) |
| 16:41.22 | kanzure | but if I don't make a copy before I make a modification to a very integral component, then the overall tree is modified, even before I ask for the new tree to be recomputed? |
| 16:41.30 | brlcad | if it's a shallow copy, then it depends on the edits performed of course |
| 16:44.54 | brlcad | there is no "recomputation" that occurs, everything is instant -- but if I understand you correctly -- yeah, if you make a change, it's changed ;) |
| 16:45.18 | kanzure | ok, instant change propagation and such. |
| 16:45.34 | claymore | One must unlearn what they have learned... for there is no spoo..err, undo. |
| 16:45.39 | brlcad | much like the unix command line, very unforgiving -- modelers using the command line are expected to learn/know the implications of the various commands |
| 16:46.15 | brlcad | make copies of your .g when you're first getting started ;) |
| 16:47.30 | brlcad | kanzure: it's not so much that it propagates, either -- think of how the CSG hierarchy is stored in memory, it's a graph of nodes -- all you did was change a node, nothing to propagate/recompute |
| 16:47.55 | brlcad | something like the "tree" command just walks the graph and prints it while it walks |
| 16:48.52 | kanzure | right, and frankly I prefer the shell :) none of this engelbart mouse nonsense. |
| 16:50.17 | claymore | there are a few tasks in mged that can be accomplished *MUCH* faster via use of gui/mouse. The reverse is also true. Its a nice balance really :) |
| 16:50.45 | kanzure | Clicking a few thousand times with a mouse can get dull. |
| 16:51.31 | claymore | true dat. |
| 16:58.48 | DanielFalck | brlcad: I'm looking for a non-64 bit binary for linux on sourceforge- I don't see one |
| 16:59.10 | kanzure | DanielFalck: I ended up compiling one for myself the other day. |
| 16:59.42 | kanzure | DanielFalck: brlcad suggested to check the source out from svn to get around some minor annoyances in the configure-make-install process. |
| 16:59.52 | DanielFalck | ok, will do |
| 17:05.38 | brlcad | DanielFalck: look at the previous releases |
| 17:06.03 | DanielFalck | I found 7.10, but I think I'll build from svn |
| 17:06.08 | brlcad | a version or two earlier should work just as well unless there's some specific feature you know you need |
| 17:06.19 | brlcad | that works too |
| 17:06.30 | brlcad | should have another release up shortly |
| 17:15.02 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14EFE3.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 17:53.08 | brlcad | DanielFalck: build going okay? |
| 17:53.45 | brlcad | "sh autogen.sh && ./configure --enable-all --prefix=/usr/brlcad/rel-7.12.6 --enable-optimized && make -j4" should do the trick |
| 17:54.12 | brlcad | using whatever prefex and -j#procs you have of course |
| 17:56.32 | DanielFalck | it's making right now |
| 18:00.01 | kanzure | Is there a way for me to serialize everything I've done into a set of commands and scripts? |
| 18:00.40 | kanzure | ah, I guess just having the .g file means I can go back and modify objects with a script, so nevermind |
| 18:01.37 | kanzure | was writing a filter generator in python a few weeks ago that generated STL files, to link up to OpenFOAM for CFD, but this is looking like a better deal :) |
| 18:01.59 | brlcad | yeah, or if you run g2asc, it'll turn it into an "mged script" i.e., a brl-cad database in ascii form |
| 18:02.17 | kanzure | Thanks. |
| 18:03.09 | brlcad | mged itself is pretty heavily scriptable in a variety of ways too, an example of a few of them at http://brlcad.org/wiki/SGI_Cube |
| 18:03.58 | kanzure | yeah I found that page a few moments ago when I was about to start complaining about Tcl (I've been able to avoid it so far, you see) |
| 18:06.44 | brlcad | basically amounts to mged supporting single-command invocation, commands over piped or redirected input, commands loaded via the 'script' command, or a serialized subset using the ascii storage format |
| 19:32.14 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 19:52.52 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=WarLock@bas2-sudbury98-1128564944.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 19:55.57 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/mysystem.png :) |
| 19:56.22 | claymore | ......ewww vista.... ;) |
| 19:56.34 | IriX64 | heh fun stuff :) |
| 19:57.12 | IriX64 | its usefull..... it's building brlcad ;) |
| 19:58.33 | claymore | is getting ready to dump xp-pro for good at home :) |
| 19:58.45 | IriX64 | in favor of ... |
| 19:59.13 | IriX64 | mine dual boots, xp-pro or vista64 |
| 19:59.19 | claymore | Fedora, RHEL or ubuntu.... haven't quite decided yet. |
| 19:59.51 | IriX64 | no gentoo :) |
| 20:00.13 | IriX64 | curious about gentoo |
| 20:01.49 | IriX64 | this irssi was built on vista64. |
| 20:01.49 | claymore | I think starseeker is a gentoo fanboi.... |
| 20:10.27 | ``Erik | http://funroll-loops.info/ |
| 20:10.48 | claymore | dies laughing. |
| 20:10.59 | claymore | zomg so fast! |
| 20:11.35 | IriX64 | that good :) |
| 20:12.28 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/compilestation.png --- prefer this :) |
| 20:13.04 | *** join/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.43) | |
| 20:13.06 | claymore | ..i don't get it. Other than Vista, there is nothing funny there.... |
| 20:13.09 | claymore | :D |
| 20:13.17 | IriX64 | heh right |
| 20:13.47 | sporty__ | IriX64: that was nice link, that one to sympatico.ca |
| 20:13.48 | claymore | lol |
| 20:13.53 | claymore | +b on *!gentoouser@* |
| 20:13.59 | IriX64 | vista says. shhhh i'm pretending to be ubuntu ;) |
| 20:15.22 | sporty__ | IriX64: obviously, kde and kubuntu has more sophisticated features, such as an "aggresive" use of RAM when it loads whole .pdf into RAM - and tons of such features |
| 20:16.03 | claymore | "I essentially started using Gentoo because my ....ing KDE clock would never show the right time in Red Hat." -LOL |
| 20:16.21 | claymore | hates ``Erik now for providing this excellent distraction :) |
| 20:17.33 | ``Erik | *bow* |
| 20:18.36 | claymore | OPTIMILAZIATIONS....nice |
| 20:19.40 | DanielFalck | brlcad: thanks, I got the latest installed. Now I need to learn how to use it |
| 20:19.58 | sporty__ | Also, kde usually represents the true linux style: "Whole installation" = dozen of the web browsers, dozen of the text editors, and so on. Exactly this was a "taste of the linux" - at least for me when all i did in pc was in windows: games as nfs i, games as gta with english speech |
| 20:22.35 | claymore | wants to raise his iPod access time by 0.2% |
| 20:23.06 | ``Erik | I d'no, linux tastes kinda gamey... O.o http://www.churchofbsd.org/bsd-vs-linux-s.jpg |
| 20:23.43 | claymore | haha, t'n'a in red leather is >> than most OS'es. |
| 20:24.23 | claymore | fights a nasty headache. Cya tomarrows! |
| 20:24.32 | ``Erik | later, dude |
| 20:24.42 | IriX64 | salutes claymore ;) |
| 20:24.49 | claymore | oh yeah, thanks for the help ``Erik ! |
| 20:25.00 | claymore | IriX64: No saluting, I was enlisted :) |
| 20:25.09 | IriX64 | heh aright |
| 20:27.12 | sporty__ | IriX64: How do you think, what is a better name, Home page, or a Main page ?? |
| 20:27.47 | sporty__ | i mean, which one is essentially more suitable for web-sites? |
| 20:28.05 | IriX64 | startpage ;) |
| 20:28.17 | sporty__ | IriX64: right! |
| 20:28.54 | sporty__ | IriX64: how can i join to ibot ? Is it like """/join nick:ibot """ ?? |
| 20:29.04 | IriX64 | no idea |
| 20:29.09 | sporty__ | IriX64: ok |
| 20:32.20 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=WarLock@bas2-sudbury98-1128564944.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 20:32.34 | IriX64 | ^C the wrong window :) |
| 20:32.53 | sporty__ | IriX64: hello |
| 20:33.07 | IriX64 | ? |
| 20:33.20 | sporty__ | j/k |
| 21:17.33 | sporty__ | hello? |
| 21:17.53 | sporty__ | :-[ |
| 21:57.37 | IriX64 | grins, and says my clipboard is showing :) |
| 22:05.45 | IriX64 | mc |
| 22:18.23 | sporty__ | ok, irix64 has left the room, but we're keep' rock' on and our next guest is ... is... is... brlcad! |
| 22:18.44 | sporty__ | brlcad: how do ya? |
| 22:19.06 | sporty__ | brlcad: oh yeah, fine. |
| 22:19.33 | sporty__ | brlcad: what is a next primitive to be drawn? |
| 22:19.44 | sporty__ | brlcad: "um..." |
| 22:20.00 | sporty__ | brlcad: is it a shovel to kill me? |
| 22:20.19 | sporty__ | brlcad: "yeah, i think so":-D |
| 22:20.30 | sporty__ | goes mad from the boredoom |
| 22:52.23 | sporty__ | advances in his work. |
| 22:59.24 | kanzure | Are we pasting system screenshot links now? re: IriX64's link. I think I can win: http://heybryan.org/shots/ and http://heybryan.org/shots/inspiration/ for physicals. |
| 23:04.46 | *** join/#brlcad geocalc (n=geocalc@lns-bzn-38-82-253-122-178.adsl.proxad.net) | |
| 23:15.04 | PrezKennedy | i can top that, but first i have to get my gallery working again |
| 23:15.11 | PrezKennedy | so i can show you the picture |
| 23:15.34 | kanzure | Do you mean to say that you can top the phyiscal setup too? That's eight monitors. |
| 23:16.05 | kanzure | http://heybryan.org/shots/inspiration/notstevebutjoe/IMG_0865.JPG |
| 23:41.09 | sporty__ | i'm off: have nothing to show yet, but i'll have posted it soon. |
| 00:00.12 | kanzure | Hm. So I have a rectangle with a rectangle going through it, I take the intersection and that's a region. I copy the region, but then I have to individually move the two primitives to get the copied region to the location that I desire. Is there a simpler way to move a region and everything in it? |
| 00:00.55 | kanzure | s/rectangle/prism/ |
| 00:01.37 | kanzure | g |
| 00:17.26 | brlcad | blinks |
| 00:18.45 | brlcad | sporty__: wth are you talking about? if you're bored -- I'm sure I could find some feature requests that need to be implemented for you |
| 00:26.29 | brlcad | kanzure: yes, you can apply a matrix edit to the copied region |
| 00:26.45 | brlcad | oed / copied_region/path/to/primitive |
| 00:26.49 | brlcad | tra 100 0 0 |
| 00:26.50 | brlcad | accept |
| 00:27.12 | kanzure | can I do oed / copied_region \n tra x y z ? |
| 00:28.13 | brlcad | that is what copied_region/path/to/primitive does .. it moves "copied_region" .. not the primitive |
| 00:28.48 | brlcad | the reason you have to specify the path all the way down to a primitive is merely because of an implementation detail -- it needs a keypoint |
| 00:29.35 | brlcad | oed works with a left-hand and right-hand path .. moving the thing on the right |
| 00:29.46 | kanzure | Thanks. |
| 00:31.18 | brlcad | so if you have an object "top" that contains "a" and "b" primitives, you could "oed / top/a" or "oed / top/b" to use a or b as a keypoint on moving top; or "oed /top a" and "oed /top b" to move the specific instance of a or b respectively that top references |
| 00:31.55 | brlcad | there's a nice tutorial on OED on the website, http://brlcad.org/w/images/3/36/Object_Editing_-_the_oed_Command.pdf |
| 01:02.21 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177593586.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 01:02.46 | sporty__ | brlcad: today, i'm ending up another project. only brl-cad is left from all i've intented |
| 01:03.45 | IriX64 | it can now be said that wherever you have a ${TK} token in makefile.am, you need an ${X_LIBS} token and in X_LIBS include -lXss and -lXft, tk needs those man, and now mged and the rest build fine. |
| 01:09.38 | *** join/#brlcad mafm_ (n=mafm@172.Red-83-45-253.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 01:23.55 | PrezKennedy | kanzure, http://photos.mkweb.us/v/personal/DSCF1686.JPG.html |
| 01:40.14 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177593586.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 01:41.39 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/3mDWZk87.html <-solver-test.exe and vm-test.exe need this little ditty fixed |
| 01:41.47 | IriX64 | in libpc |
| 01:45.36 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/IqrVTk15.html <--pcVariable, on my system this is system declared, get multiple definitions if i dont comment it out |
| 01:46.06 | IriX64 | and now solver-test and vm-test build joy :) |
| 02:02.36 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=WarLock@bas2-sudbury98-1177593586.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 02:03.14 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/brlcad.png <--- on vista yet :) |
| 02:09.52 | IriX64 | use the pictures if you like, brl-cad has afforded me many happy moments :) |
| 02:22.11 | sporty__ | IriX64: what is on that picture? |
| 02:22.19 | IriX64 | havoc |
| 02:22.48 | IriX64 | err havoc.g :) |
| 02:22.53 | sporty__ | IriX64: what is its size and main colours? What resolution? |
| 02:23.02 | IriX64 | who cares |
| 02:23.21 | sporty__ | IriX64: i want to use it as a wallpaper |
| 02:23.36 | sporty__ | IriX64: gimme |
| 02:23.42 | IriX64 | download it |
| 02:23.56 | sporty__ | IriX64: what is its size then? |
| 02:24.20 | IriX64 | you're serious, you have to know its size? |
| 02:24.38 | sporty__ | IriX64: yes, i pay 0.10-0.30 per mb |
| 02:24.41 | IriX64 | my screen res is 1650x1040 |
| 02:25.03 | IriX64 | native res |
| 02:25.16 | sporty__ | sweet and :( - guess it's too big for a day, what size in kb ? |
| 02:25.29 | IriX64 | oh that just a sec... |
| 02:25.58 | sporty__ | IriX64: well, i can imagine, what colors then (light / grey) |
| 02:26.23 | IriX64 | 147,780 bytes |
| 02:26.29 | sporty__ | dark? or a light one? Why not "love" or "happiness" ?? |
| 02:26.34 | IriX64 | its full color |
| 02:27.30 | sporty__ | omg! no, i've used to spent less kb a day. Buy me an internet - and i will see links. Would you? |
| 02:27.53 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 02:31.36 | sporty__ | IriX64: o.15 usd / meg - to be exact. i would load e.g. "happines" - at least a tiny bit! :-] |
| 02:31.51 | sporty__ | :-[ |
| 02:32.08 | IriX64 | firewall that cant be messed with here sport :) |
| 02:32.29 | sporty__ | what do you mean? |
| 02:32.46 | IriX64 | im behind a firewall |
| 02:32.54 | IriX64 | cant dcc to you |
| 02:33.27 | sporty__ | IriX64: dcc ?? what is it? |
| 02:34.41 | sporty__ | IriX64: it's morning in here - and i'm working. You can imagine e.g. gilian underson (even in sexy poses) - and sleep with good thoughts on your mind. |
| 02:36.35 | sporty__ | IriX64: this is usually a whole kingdom - ladies |
| 02:36.40 | sporty__ | and computers are wrong :( |
| 02:41.35 | *** part/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.43) | |
| 03:03.03 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 03:56.03 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedyJR (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 04:20.03 | starseeker | idly wonders about designing a .gxml or .gml file format for non-tcl based ascii output |
| 04:20.30 | starseeker | then smacks himself for thinking of yet another way to keep his "primary" language xml |
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| 05:02.52 | Ralith | starseeker: if you added xml I would smack you |
| 05:06.13 | starseeker | Ralith: too late then - lots of docbook in there already |
| 05:06.35 | Ralith | that's a reasonable exception :P |
| 05:06.58 | Ralith | docs in xml is different than data in xml |
| 05:07.05 | starseeker | xml actually is a reasonable storage format if you aren't worried about being human readable, IMHO |
| 05:07.14 | starseeker | better to compress it |
| 05:07.14 | louipc | not |
| 05:07.29 | starseeker | the ubiquity of parsing tools is its own advantage |
| 05:07.35 | Ralith | starseeker: if you aren't worried about being human readable, use a binary format. |
| 05:07.42 | louipc | xml is uh kind of bloated isn't it? |
| 05:07.43 | Ralith | I mean, come on. |
| 05:07.51 | louipc | Ralith++ |
| 05:08.16 | Ralith | you can even make it safe to transmit by base64ing it |
| 05:08.50 | starseeker | Oh, it's bloated sure. |
| 05:08.54 | louipc | xml is nice as web markup |
| 05:09.01 | Ralith | and horribly painful to hand edit |
| 05:09.08 | louipc | or document markup perhaps |
| 05:09.38 | louipc | I am horrified to see it proliferate elsewhere :/ |
| 05:10.44 | starseeker | It's kind of one of those cases where universal tool support and "some standard is still better than no standard, however bloated" won out |
| 05:10.53 | Ralith | but we're brl-cad ffs |
| 05:11.03 | Ralith | make our own standards :P |
| 05:11.08 | starseeker | Heh |
| 05:11.21 | starseeker | Oh, the binary .g is clearly the winner |
| 05:11.31 | Ralith | 'xactly |
| 05:11.39 | starseeker | But when it comes to g2asc and asc2g, I can't stand the asc format |
| 05:12.02 | starseeker | too tied to tcl |
| 05:12.10 | louipc | someone has to innovate outside of standards |
| 05:12.13 | Ralith | hm. |
| 05:12.16 | starseeker | if we're going to have an ascii text representation, it should be tool agnostic |
| 05:12.20 | Ralith | that's a good point |
| 05:12.21 | louipc | standards are sometimes innovation killers |
| 05:12.28 | Ralith | louipc: only when abused |
| 05:12.29 | starseeker | and since we all agree .g is better anyway |
| 05:12.50 | starseeker | one thing that is for sure about xml is that it's tool/language agnostic |
| 05:13.01 | Ralith | still, surely there's some other standard that would work |
| 05:13.03 | Ralith | I mean hell |
| 05:13.05 | Ralith | JSON would do the trick |
| 05:13.16 | louipc | yaml! |
| 05:13.24 | Ralith | yaml is interesting but not a standard afaik |
| 05:13.34 | Ralith | it is agnostic though! |
| 05:14.10 | starseeker | if there is to be an ASCII representation at all, my feeling is that the only advantage is that it is (or should be) potentially readable (insofar as possible) by anything |
| 05:15.08 | louipc | why is there an ascii format anyways? |
| 05:15.25 | starseeker | I think it dates back to before the binary format was platform independent |
| 05:16.02 | louipc | oh |
| 05:16.07 | starseeker | Probably its sole remaining advantages are 1) it allows direct editing of the database by a modeler outside of any interface |
| 05:16.48 | starseeker | 2) it is archival in the sense that the geometric information can be (theoretically) recovered with virtually no knowledge of or support from any tool |
| 05:17.08 | brlcad | there are two versions of the ascii format, v4 and v5 -- v4 was specifically because the binary format was not platform independent |
| 05:17.59 | brlcad | the current v5 format is essentially an mged/tcl transcript equivalent to serialized command-line recreation of geometry |
| 05:19.10 | brlcad | v5 ascii is provided partly for backwards-compatibility/familiarity but more as a means to serialize the output to a readable form for debugging/inspection and external scripting purposes |
| 05:20.44 | brlcad | having an xml output format has come up before (g-xml exporter, xml-g importer), but it hasn't really solved any problem to date not already accounted for by another capability |
| 05:21.20 | brlcad | being xml doesn't give you a format standard, it just takes care of basic lexing -- anyone using your file still have to parse and comprehend the data/format |
| 05:21.35 | starseeker | sure |
| 05:22.30 | Ralith | but if well implemented, it could be easy to intuit the format sufficiently to reconstruct geometry |
| 05:22.46 | brlcad | that can be said of any format :) |
| 05:22.54 | Ralith | not without docs available |
| 05:23.43 | Ralith | if you gave someone a .g and said "this contains geometry," they probably wouldn't have a very easy time deciphering it. |
| 05:23.44 | brlcad | depends on the format, we've reverse-engineered several a format just by looking at the contents |
| 05:23.54 | Ralith | sure, but was it ever straightforward? |
| 05:24.18 | starseeker | winces in anticipation of a discussion of the meaning of "straightforward" |
| 05:24.34 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 05:24.45 | brlcad | as far as binary formats go, .g's are very easy to decipher -- and there is a spec for it |
| 05:24.57 | starseeker | sort of |
| 05:24.59 | brlcad | though the intent isn't for everyone to write parsers, that's what a lib is for |
| 05:25.44 | brlcad | it's probably 95-99%% accurate |
| 05:25.55 | brlcad | most of the ways its out of date are just due to age/maintenance |
| 05:26.24 | Ralith | brlcad: okay, but if all you have is a file, and you get to choose between an intentionally human-readable file and an intentionally computer-readable file, which would you select? :P |
| 05:26.32 | brlcad | docs have a maintenance burden just like code, just hasn't been a need to keep it up to date as often -- http://brlcad.sourceforge.net/newdb/newdb.html |
| 05:26.53 | Ralith | the former could probably be decoded in a fraction of the time of the latter, no matter how elegant the encoding. |
| 05:27.00 | starseeker | brlcad: Ah, is that the latest version? |
| 05:27.35 | brlcad | Ralith: that entirely depends on the situation, and is a bit of a loaded question |
| 05:27.48 | brlcad | because we already have/provide more than just a file |
| 05:28.16 | Ralith | well, I don't see it ever actually becoming a real world issue |
| 05:28.16 | Ralith | so w/e |
| 05:28.18 | brlcad | there's a lib, there's manpage docs, there's the spec, there's the entire source |
| 05:28.53 | starseeker | apologizes for digging up the worms... |
| 05:29.24 | brlcad | Ralith: hrm, you're saying the computer-readable file would be decoded in a fraction of the time or the intentionally human-readable file? |
| 05:29.44 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos_ (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 05:30.15 | brlcad | our experience shows the the computer-readable variant (i.e., our .g) to be *massively* higher-performance to parse than an encoded human-readable format |
| 05:30.36 | Ralith | brlcad: the latter |
| 05:30.40 | brlcad | our .g is nearly a direct serialization of objects as they are in memory |
| 05:30.49 | Ralith | I think you're missing my context |
| 05:31.09 | brlcad | okay, yeah -- that's what I'm saying too :) |
| 05:31.10 | Ralith | I'm talking about a theoretical situation where one has a file and nothing else. No BRL-CAD, no docs. |
| 05:31.14 | louipc | the brlcad format is open source, so it's not an issue :P |
| 05:31.18 | brlcad | you'd just said "the former" .. which was human-readable |
| 05:31.29 | Ralith | brlcad: which is what I just said again. |
| 05:31.46 | Ralith | for someon who has no docs or brl-cad tools, a human-readable format is easier to decode. |
| 05:31.53 | Ralith | as starseeker said, it is thus a more ideal archival format. |
| 05:32.07 | brlcad | ah, where by decode, you effectively mean reverse-engineer |
| 05:32.17 | Ralith | yes |
| 05:32.25 | brlcad | sure -- decoding binary proprietary formats sucks |
| 05:32.30 | Ralith | exactly! |
| 05:32.38 | brlcad | just not relevant to us :) |
| 05:32.47 | brlcad | like louipc said ;) |
| 05:32.53 | Ralith | assuming BRL-CAD tools will always be available to those who want them. |
| 05:32.54 | Ralith | which is reasonable. |
| 05:33.03 | Ralith | it's not like we're making a time capsule here |
| 05:33.22 | starseeker | looks over newdb.html |
| 05:33.57 | louipc | I would put the physical object in the time capsule and let them decode it |
| 05:33.58 | louipc | ;) |
| 05:34.14 | starseeker | Nah, cad model's better - cars rust |
| 05:34.32 | starseeker | http://www.allpar.com/history/auto-shows/time-capsule.html |
| 05:34.48 | brlcad | starseeker: fyi, with a bit of polish and clean-up, the v5 spec could actually probably be made an official mil, ansi, or iso spec |
| 05:34.56 | louipc | lol! |
| 05:35.02 | starseeker | brlcad: Cool! |
| 05:35.05 | brlcad | considered pushing it through several times, but then .. I always get back to "what problem are we solving" |
| 05:35.19 | louipc | starseeker: yeah I guess that is fail |
| 05:35.31 | brlcad | those three being in increasing levels of difficulty |
| 05:35.53 | starseeker | brlcad: Maybe I can update it off the clock |
| 05:35.57 | Ralith | it *would* be pretty cool to have it be a formal standard |
| 05:36.12 | starseeker | likes well done documents that don't solve practical problems :-P |
| 05:36.17 | Ralith | make it easy to advocate for use in other projects too |
| 05:36.44 | starseeker | is itching to docbook this sucker... |
| 05:37.04 | brlcad | Ralith: consider the tradeoff -- if you know it'll take up probably more than a man-year of effort |
| 05:37.13 | brlcad | pushing a spec through takes a *lot* of time |
| 05:37.18 | brlcad | and not just one person's |
| 05:37.23 | starseeker | louipc: I've got to remember to save links on that car - it's a perfect object lesson about archiving :-) |
| 05:37.50 | brlcad | would you rather have a spec and the same modeling interface, or no spec and a year's worth of progress towards a better interface.. ;) |
| 05:38.31 | brlcad | if you're going to work on something that long-term, have to weigh it against the other long-term priorities it'll eat away at |
| 05:38.32 | louipc | better interface |
| 05:38.51 | Ralith | brlcad: sure, I don't think it's actually worth putting the effort in |
| 05:38.55 | Ralith | but it *would* be pretty neat! |
| 05:39.33 | brlcad | even if flawlessly pushed through, a mil interface would probably take two years of calendar time, an ansi would probably take two to four, iso is mostly political :) |
| 05:39.52 | brlcad | absolutely, that's why I think about it too from time to time .. would be very cool :) |
| 05:39.53 | Ralith | I'd imagine it would be hard to politicise something for which there's little competition |
| 05:39.58 | brlcad | just hard to justify |
| 05:40.22 | starseeker | Ralith: Pro/E, SolidWorks, Unigraphics... |
| 05:40.29 | brlcad | oh, iso would be hard politically mostly because of STEP |
| 05:41.21 | Ralith | starseeker: target different audiences, and probably wouldn't care very much. |
| 05:41.26 | Ralith | (so I speculate) |
| 05:41.31 | brlcad | nobody likes affirming standards that directly compete |
| 05:42.29 | brlcad | STEP is basically the union of all CAD formats, even including subsections for just about every little quirk we support too |
| 05:43.21 | starseeker | Ralith: particularly when they serve to make free ($ and code) competitors more "valid" in the eyes of the world |
| 05:43.34 | Ralith | okay |
| 05:43.50 | Ralith | I was going to argue that they probably wouldn't care enough to dedicate the effort to fight it |
| 05:44.04 | Ralith | but then I realized that that was silly because we don't care enough to dedicate the effort to advocate it |
| 05:44.07 | brlcad | mil would be pretty appropriate since we could pretty easily sell it as being specific to the V/L domain |
| 05:44.21 | brlcad | but mil isn't quite as visible |
| 05:44.51 | starseeker | Ralith: I refer you to what Microsoft has done to the open office suite standard efforts |
| 05:45.16 | Ralith | starseeker: open office competes directly with word, and microsoft is known for its aggression :P |
| 05:45.22 | louipc | mil started arpanet, look how big that got ;) |
| 05:45.45 | starseeker | Ralith: If BRL-CAD continues to acquire features and open source community support, there are virtually no limits to its long term potential |
| 05:45.50 | Ralith | yep! |
| 05:46.01 | Ralith | its comptetitors probably don't realize that, though |
| 05:47.36 | starseeker | looks at clock and kicks in sanity - gotta get in there earlier tomorrow to finish scanning |
| 05:47.44 | starseeker | later all! |
| 05:47.51 | louipc | bye |
| 05:48.11 | brlcad | or just aren't worried yet, we have a few manyears of usability effort to get on their radar |
| 06:19.06 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 06:23.41 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33371 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob activated wizards in archer, added a new wizard for creating tires using cliff's tire proc-db |
| 06:24.16 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33372 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: reword -- bob *activated* wizards in archer, added a new wizard for creating tires using cliff's tire proc-db |
| 06:25.39 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33373 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: also similarly related, bob activated the primitive creation buttons in archer so users can create some of the supported primitives pretty easily |
| 06:30.43 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 06:38.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33374 10/brlcad/trunk/src/tclscripts/swidgets/scripts/selectlists.itk: |
| 06:38.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: partial revert of the mods made during 33283 where bob commited a new revision |
| 06:38.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: of selectlists.itk with changes from doug howard, but inadvertently clobbered |
| 06:38.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: basic changes that had occurred since for header/copyright updates and ws/indent |
| 06:38.57 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: style consistency cleanup |
| 06:42.07 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33375 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: bob applied a few tweaks (borderwidth, relief, selectmode, stickyness) to the layout of selection lists for doug howard. this should impact archer's layout. |
| 08:29.47 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.136.85) | |
| 09:47.12 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 10:55.32 | *** join/#brlcad mafm (n=mafm@172.Red-83-45-253.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) | |
| 10:57.05 | mafm | hi |
| 11:30.16 | AFK-claymore | howdy mafm! |
| 11:30.51 | mafm | hey claymore :) |
| 11:32.00 | AFK-claymore | whats new? |
| 11:36.02 | mafm | I'm at my parent's home (not basement, yet :) ) |
| 11:36.31 | mafm | I've been fighting with the lab but finally I "won" |
| 11:37.02 | claymore | excellent, so you have the rest of the month off (paid?) |
| 11:37.33 | mafm | up to jan 12th :) |
| 11:37.45 | claymore | dead sexy. |
| 11:38.08 | mafm | they're part of my holidays, so... :) |
| 11:38.20 | mafm | I don't receive compensations for the 2+ years worked, but since they didn't agree in cancelling the contract I woulnd't have that anyway |
| 11:43.47 | claymore | :/ |
| 11:43.54 | claymore | well, at least you are getting something. |
| 11:44.03 | claymore | any idea whats next on the horizon? |
| 11:44.22 | mafm | yep, time to work in my degree's final project \o/ |
| 11:44.53 | mafm | with friends of a free sw company, working with mobile stuff (maemo, gnome mobile, etc) |
| 11:45.04 | mafm | or e-learning projects in the univ |
| 11:45.14 | mafm | maybe the former for a while and then the later, still undecided |
| 11:45.47 | mafm | the univ is better for a while to finish my project |
| 11:47.33 | mafm | and it's a bit less demanding so I could devote more time to other projects (like g3d) |
| 11:48.01 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 11:51.10 | mafm | hi clock_ |
| 11:51.15 | mafm | anything new around here? |
| 11:57.02 | clock_ | mafm: hi |
| 12:05.24 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.130.127) | |
| 13:23.32 | ``Erik | claymore, are you in? |
| 13:24.53 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 13:25.09 | claymore | yuppers |
| 13:25.30 | ``Erik | I can't get a hold off boss or receptionist, I'm not making it in today |
| 13:26.16 | ``Erik | stomach is bugging me, couldn't eat lunch yesterday, almost had to pull over to puke on the drive home, cooked and promptly ignored dinner ... could you pass word for me? |
| 13:27.04 | claymore | sure thing.... not too many others are in also. |
| 13:27.34 | ``Erik | heh, quite a few people were coughing and not feeling well yesterday |
| 13:28.09 | ``Erik | I no one's answering the phone and I just don't wanna get gigged for not calling to notify :) |
| 13:29.15 | ``Erik | s/^I // |
| 13:32.51 | claymore | Okay. Ed just rolled in and stands informed. |
| 13:32.59 | ``Erik | ok, thanks |
| 13:33.22 | ``Erik | curled over at the stoplight in churchville fighting puke down was NOT a good thing :( |
| 13:33.35 | claymore | its funny that someone said 'Rain is coming tomarrow' and that there is a storm blowing in. I didn't even think of the other meaning till Rain popped her head in my office and asked were everyone was :) |
| 13:33.49 | ``Erik | ain't no way I'm vomiting in that car, and there was no way I could get to the side of the road |
| 13:33.54 | claymore | lol |
| 13:34.06 | ``Erik | ah, how's she doing? she's down in west virginia for school, right? |
| 13:34.29 | claymore | you'd be *very* intrigued to know that Top Gear pitted an M3 vs a Toyota Prius in a gas milage test :) |
| 13:34.48 | ``Erik | heh, wow, m3 runs ~21-22, prius should be getting low 40's |
| 13:34.50 | claymore | the Prius had to run 'full bore' round a track while the M3 Paced it from behind, not allowed to pass. |
| 13:34.57 | ``Erik | hahaha |
| 13:35.03 | ``Erik | so stuck in second |
| 13:35.04 | ``Erik | O:-) |
| 13:35.18 | archivist | I saw that one prius was useless |
| 13:35.18 | claymore | Since the Prius was at 100%, it was operating highly ineffeiciently and got 18 mpg. |
| 13:35.26 | ``Erik | wow |
| 13:35.35 | ``Erik | m3 will hit 80 in second, 120 in third |
| 13:35.51 | claymore | and the M3 was barely hitting 15%, so it got 19 mpg. |
| 13:35.53 | claymore | :) |
| 13:36.01 | ``Erik | and have enough low end that I can sit into 6th at 35 |
| 13:36.01 | claymore | m3 is more fuel effiecient at 45mph |
| 13:36.14 | claymore | archivist: That was was pretty funny eh? :) |
| 13:36.19 | archivist | yup |
| 13:36.39 | archivist | they are evil on some of their tests |
| 13:36.40 | ``Erik | of course, I have fits of stupid where I like to toe off, then go into second and open it up |
| 13:36.44 | ``Erik | :) |
| 13:37.10 | claymore | of course :) |
| 13:37.24 | archivist | I have seen the latest tests more fun to come :) |
| 13:37.45 | ``Erik | I saw a new m3 yesterday, I don't like the shape, but it was worth notice |
| 13:37.45 | claymore | bah, all i get is second hand Top Gear... hard to find on the stations over here :/ |
| 13:38.00 | ``Erik | bbc plays 'em often, comcrap carries it on 114 or something |
| 13:38.08 | ``Erik | if you have the digital package |
| 13:38.17 | claymore | its the timing of the shows that gets me. |
| 13:38.35 | claymore | and their 'onDemand' offerings are slim and change too often. |
| 13:38.41 | ``Erik | I'm awfully tempted to be a tivo or something up that alley |
| 13:38.44 | ``Erik | buy |
| 13:38.58 | ``Erik | mebbe rig a mythtv set |
| 13:38.58 | archivist | hehe live in England, get it on Sunday evening first showing |
| 13:39.21 | ``Erik | hey, archivist, when does the new robin hood start up again? |
| 13:39.22 | claymore | Top Gear is good, but not *that* good ;) |
| 13:39.36 | ``Erik | I enjoyed that show |
| 13:39.49 | archivist | no idea ``Erik not something I bother watching |
| 13:40.18 | ``Erik | ah, they had an awfully decent take on it, it wasn't completely glorified, but it was still kid lgoves stuff |
| 13:40.59 | ``Erik | personally, I'm apt to look for a darker meaner version, but *shrug* that's just me :) this went towards that direction |
| 13:41.14 | ``Erik | I liked 'firefly' a lot, that one had a lot of grim aspects, I think |
| 13:41.45 | ``Erik | heh, and I have voltaires candide on my bookshelf. W00t. |
| 13:42.35 | ``Erik | it is... the best of all possible worlds |
| 13:44.38 | claymore | been reading a *lot* of books recently.... have been re-evaluating my opinions on a bunch of books. |
| 13:44.48 | ``Erik | oh? |
| 13:45.15 | ``Erik | I've mostly been re-reading niven lately, though I have an urge to pull up like my cervantes and stuff |
| 13:45.28 | claymore | Anne McCaffery's Pern series is not as good as I thought it was ('cept the first one .. still amazing) |
| 13:45.30 | ``Erik | I mean, uh, I'm illiterate |
| 13:45.46 | ``Erik | I never got into pern, my dad was a huge fan, but I just couldn't groove to it |
| 13:46.03 | ``Erik | tell ya what, though, robert aspirin, effin' brilliant, the myth series, awesome |
| 13:46.17 | claymore | Tolkien has quite a few inconsistancies and so does C.S. Lewis. :/ |
| 13:46.22 | ``Erik | on par with doug adams, but without the geek worship |
| 13:46.54 | ``Erik | I think my next big endeavor is going to be partchets discworld series |
| 13:47.02 | claymore | Douglas Adams.... I found midly amusing... but not "simply amazing" as many I have spoke to referred to it. |
| 13:47.15 | ``Erik | his stuff was fun, not serious |
| 13:47.35 | ``Erik | the latest movie wasn't that bad |
| 13:47.45 | ``Erik | just don't expect too much :D it's fun camp shit |
| 13:47.54 | claymore | Pratchetts Discworld stuff is pretty good. Its definetly up my alley, humorwise. |
| 13:48.19 | ``Erik | heh, "make a man a fire, eh's warm for the night, set a man on fire, he's warm for the rest of his life" O.o |
| 13:48.20 | ``Erik | grim |
| 13:48.32 | claymore | Been on the fence about that movie... dunno yet. |
| 13:48.53 | claymore | grim? Nah, hilarious! Makes for a funny visual. |
| 13:49.10 | ``Erik | I don't think the movie did any serious injustice to the books... not anywhere close to other adaptations |
| 13:50.02 | ``Erik | heh, slashdot just had an article about torture in video games, I felt an urge to email an 'amen, brother' :/ |
| 13:50.06 | claymore | I think they are making movies out of a select few of Pratchetts works. |
| 13:50.41 | ``Erik | partchet and niven both comment publically about people wanting to make movies of their seminal works |
| 13:50.51 | ``Erik | pratchet, even |
| 13:51.01 | ``Erik | plus another t |
| 13:51.25 | claymore | I have seen Hog Father, and that was *okay*, but no where near as funny as Thud (which I wish they would make a movie out of) |
| 13:51.42 | ``Erik | I'd love to see a ringworld movie, I think the tech is just getting there, but the audience may not appreciate it all... I d'no pratchetts work, so I can't comment on that |
| 13:52.08 | claymore | I have Thud on audiobook CD and you can borrow it anytime. |
| 13:52.31 | ``Erik | hrm, might be worth shoving the disc loader back in my car :) |
| 13:53.10 | ``Erik | if you haven't checked out aspirins books, do it... it's good |
| 13:53.33 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14CDEC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 13:53.43 | ``Erik | he did two big chains, the 'myth' series which is fantasy, and somethin's mercenaryies, which is very scifi tech |
| 13:54.06 | ``Erik | I intend to purchase his full set |
| 13:54.48 | ``Erik | it's goofy, but it's fun :) |
| 13:54.59 | clock_ | is also goofy |
| 13:55.27 | ``Erik | I think if you appreciate monty python, you'll get a kick out of aspirins stuff |
| 13:55.33 | ``Erik | hi, karel :) |
| 13:55.54 | clock_ | ``Erik: hi :) |
| 13:55.57 | claymore | Well then, I will check it out sometime. Need to see if its on Audiobook :) |
| 13:57.53 | claymore | ``Erik: Whats the best way you have found to quickyl serialize simple structs in C? memcpy? |
| 13:57.56 | ``Erik | CLOCK! I want better animation shit, I started a procdb for metaball animation, tell me what needs to be awesome, or give me patches of awesome :D |
| 13:58.08 | ``Erik | um, look up "swizzle", claymore |
| 13:58.39 | clock_ | what is metaball? |
| 13:58.59 | ``Erik | gloppy surface things |
| 13:59.17 | ``Erik | http://www.petrileskinen.fi/Actionscript/MetaballPreview.jpg |
| 14:00.21 | ``Erik | claymore: if pointers are involved, it gets complex fast. if it's a very linear struct, you can just dump it (though doing ntohl/htonl stuff is better) |
| 14:00.55 | ``Erik | if it goes into a .g, it NEEDS to be endian agnostic. |
| 14:01.05 | claymore | right, I was looking at the same concepts earlier... didn't know it had such a flamboyant name though :) |
| 14:01.40 | ``Erik | that's why ya need high tech folk like me, who are more on the ivory tower side than anyhting else :D |
| 14:01.56 | claymore | ``Erik: endian agnostic... isnt any given bit arrayyy either big or little? or is there some other endian i don't know about? |
| 14:02.10 | ``Erik | ther'es middle endian that hasn't been used in 3 decades |
| 14:02.25 | ``Erik | and who knows what the future will bring |
| 14:02.42 | clock_ | ``Erik: do you mean PDP endian? |
| 14:02.45 | ``Erik | yeah |
| 14:02.47 | clock_ | 1 3 2 4 or how it was? |
| 14:02.57 | ``Erik | 18b, strip teh front and back for the core |
| 14:03.04 | clock_ | lol |
| 14:03.10 | clock_ | and 9 bit char |
| 14:03.40 | ``Erik | but you don't know what the future will bring |
| 14:03.50 | ``Erik | so don't plan around your assumpetions, be versatile |
| 14:04.56 | claymore | ``Erik: yeah, trying that. Which is why I am looking at a stream solution. |
| 14:05.13 | ``Erik | java's serialize does that for you, it's nice |
| 14:05.22 | ``Erik | c/c++ makes you do that by hand |
| 14:05.44 | claymore | I know :) I found a C++ implementation of java.io residing in Beecrypt (SF project) |
| 14:05.51 | clock_ | A portable program should run also on analog computers |
| 14:06.02 | ``Erik | in the C world, we generally talk bits and bytes, it's obscenely manual... c++ might try to hide that, but it may be a red herring |
| 14:06.21 | clock_ | Does BRL-CAD run on analog computers? |
| 14:06.29 | ``Erik | doubt it |
| 14:06.48 | clock_ | Why is it platform-specific then? |
| 14:06.49 | ``Erik | we demand posix plus some |
| 14:08.00 | ``Erik | if you whine about a single amchine that just plain doesn't matter, y'know, go fuck off, ... ;0 |
| 14:08.02 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:08.19 | ``Erik | I have other crap to deal with |
| 14:08.29 | ``Erik | know what I mean, vern? |
| 14:08.32 | claymore | I dunt think analog computers have too much of a use nowadays. Some, but very little in comparision :/ |
| 14:08.42 | clock_ | ``Erik: now you are quoting Theo de Raadt aren't you?" |
| 14:08.57 | clock_ | everyone has one analog computer in his head. I think they matter a lot |
| 14:09.07 | claymore | heh. |
| 14:09.11 | ``Erik | did theo say that? I thought I was quoting ernest from the 80's |
| 14:09.29 | clock_ | It sounds so rude that it fits Theo's anankastic personality |
| 14:09.38 | ``Erik | yes, theo is a dick |
| 14:09.57 | clock_ | I think if Theo went to a psychiatrist, the psychiatrist would just jump out of the window without a word. |
| 14:10.01 | ``Erik | I'm willing to be a dick, not quite as far as theo, but *shrug* |
| 14:10.42 | ``Erik | it may be rude, but seriously, where is the analog computer install base? are the interested in BRL-CAD? |
| 14:11.52 | clock_ | Is analog and digitall the only types of computer that exist? Or is there still something else? |
| 14:12.24 | ``Erik | tell me where BRL-CAD doesn't work. |
| 14:12.43 | clock_ | I meant it as a theoretical excursion :) |
| 14:12.58 | clock_ | ``Erik: actually yes! On ZX Spectrum! |
| 14:13.01 | ``Erik | yeah, well, this isn't a theorical issue, this is an engineering issue |
| 14:13.15 | ``Erik | heh, no one uses z80 anymore |
| 14:13.22 | clock_ | I find analogue computers somehow elegant and interesting |
| 14:13.40 | ``Erik | the russian trinary computer was interesting, but it failed |
| 14:13.56 | archivist | I have a Z80 in circuit emulator |
| 14:14.21 | ``Erik | the i386 sucks goat balls, but that's what we have, unfortunately |
| 14:14.30 | claymore | they're great for electrical and mechanical system calibration and testing... but outside of that...*shrugs* |
| 14:14.42 | ``Erik | the mac I'm using right now uses this crap chip |
| 14:15.02 | clock_ | The Zilog Z80 has long been a popular microprocessor in embedded systems and microcontroller cores, where it remains in widespread use today. |
| 14:15.48 | ``Erik | I loved the g4 and g5.. even the g3... but *shrug* my mac uses an x86, every winderz box uses an x86, ibm is dropping their high performance ppc for winderz chips |
| 14:16.09 | clock_ | but actually the ternary computer is another interesting idea |
| 14:16.25 | ``Erik | embedded machines seem to be shifting towards x86 |
| 14:16.27 | clock_ | The analog computers were built usually with opamps right? |
| 14:16.37 | ``Erik | it's really effin' sad, it's such a feeble arch |
| 14:16.58 | ``Erik | I don't like this, you're making me angry by making me admit it :( |
| 14:17.00 | claymore | opamps later in 'life' but tubes prior to that. |
| 14:17.14 | clock_ | I wonder what if someone built an analog computer full of microwave amplifiers mixers multipliers and lots of them |
| 14:17.21 | clock_ | Could it perform some tasks fast? |
| 14:17.34 | ``Erik | eniac was a gymnasium sized room full of tubes |
| 14:17.42 | clock_ | it was digital? |
| 14:17.48 | ``Erik | sorta kinda |
| 14:17.52 | clock_ | :) |
| 14:18.03 | ``Erik | eniac was decimal digital |
| 14:18.12 | claymore | ``Erik: Wasn't the largest source of grief for Apple computer buyers the price? As I remeber it, Apple dropped motorola's PPC in lieu of the x86 architecture for mainly the cost savings... |
| 14:18.18 | clock_ | analog is fun a simple element can have a tremendous computational power |
| 14:18.18 | ``Erik | and brliac was decimal digital, too |
| 14:18.32 | ``Erik | and later used "kings own" |
| 14:18.47 | ``Erik | thatwas the sattement, claymore, I don't buy it |
| 14:19.18 | claymore | problem with analog is that it is uber sensitive to drift in the components. Once an analog computer reaches a certain size/complexity, it would be spending more time down being calibrated that it would be spending being useful... |
| 14:19.33 | ``Erik | *shrug* my laptop runs firefox, Xterm, and wow... it's all good :) |
| 14:19.45 | clock_ | how would a firefox look on an analog computer? |
| 14:19.54 | ``Erik | blurry |
| 14:19.55 | clock_ | If you sneeze at it, the HTML elements wave around the screen? |
| 14:20.02 | clock_ | with ghosts in the picture |
| 14:20.12 | clock_ | can you adjust the antenna? I can't read this table ;-) |
| 14:20.19 | clock_ | Analog stuff has LIFE! |
| 14:20.31 | ``Erik | I almost vomitted from laughing, stop that shit |
| 14:20.58 | clock_ | and xterm... |
| 14:21.13 | ``Erik | I live in an xterm |
| 14:21.15 | clock_ | adjusting a sync knob until the commands stop cycling around the screen |
| 14:21.37 | clock_ | we have analog computers in our heads why do we build cold lifeless digital computers? |
| 14:21.58 | ``Erik | because boolean algebra is clean |
| 14:22.41 | ``Erik | we have the notions of "yes" and "no" in our heads |
| 14:22.44 | claymore | digital = faster :) |
| 14:22.50 | clock_ | we have emotions |
| 14:23.01 | clock_ | I think that's because computers were designed by people who are not very good in emotions :) |
| 14:23.09 | ``Erik | YOU may have emotions, I'm far more efficient :D |
| 14:23.16 | claymore | a digital computer can execute the crappy code we write in nanoseconds, yet it takes us hours/days to debug :) |
| 14:23.31 | claymore | skynet = computer + emotions. |
| 14:23.33 | claymore | no thanks. |
| 14:23.43 | ``Erik | but then arnie won't come visit :( |
| 14:23.47 | clock_ | inserts a PCB labeled "Firefox"into his |
| 14:23.57 | clock_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:24.22 | claymore | I'll take the Terminatrix in lieu of the Governator. |
| 14:24.31 | clock_ | imagine you have signal and you want to determine if it's 1MHz or 10 MHz |
| 14:24.46 | clock_ | With a digital computer you would need a powerful MCU, sample the signal and do some mathematics |
| 14:25.03 | ``Erik | ok, clock, build me a powerful analog computer |
| 14:25.04 | clock_ | With analog computer you just hook a gate, diode, capacitor and resistor and get the answer immediately with almost no power requirements! |
| 14:25.16 | claymore | nah, I'll just use the PCI mounted O-Scope/multimeter. Done. |
| 14:25.20 | ``Erik | I don't even want possession, just a shell |
| 14:25.21 | clock_ | lol |
| 14:25.23 | ``Erik | make it |
| 14:25.25 | clock_ | rack mounted :) |
| 14:25.46 | claymore | Erik in the Shell ... a new Manga. |
| 14:25.50 | ``Erik | it took me a while to grok why gate propogation time is important |
| 14:26.05 | ``Erik | and why 74xx series chips were useful at all |
| 14:26.10 | ``Erik | because I kept thinking analog |
| 14:26.14 | ``Erik | but they ARE useful |
| 14:26.28 | claymore | lol, yes, having a ff's failing to trip is usually a bad thing. |
| 14:26.41 | ``Erik | er, why use an 'or' ttl when you can just plug two wires onto the same bar? |
| 14:26.44 | ``Erik | O.o |
| 14:26.51 | claymore | hahahaha |
| 14:27.07 | ``Erik | well, that's the fucking issue |
| 14:27.11 | clock_ | ``Erik: to satisfy the EE professor? |
| 14:27.22 | claymore | "Lets see how this IC reacts when I hit the output with 5.5v of reverse voltage..." |
| 14:27.25 | clock_ | ``Erik: if you would see my electronics design, you would stop laughing |
| 14:27.29 | ``Erik | at the time, yes, but then I got the notion of stateful holding |
| 14:27.49 | clock_ | 15 HC gates in parallel driving a power LED, with their power being regulated in an analog way through a feedback transistor... |
| 14:28.00 | ``Erik | there're lots of places where it makes sense to go stateless holding, but sometimes, you NEED that ttl shit |
| 14:28.04 | clock_ | Signal processing from diodes capacitors resistors and Schmitt gates |
| 14:28.24 | claymore | 's favorite EE term is Schmitt. |
| 14:28.29 | claymore | :D |
| 14:28.32 | clock_ | Shit trigger is a great thing |
| 14:28.37 | ``Erik | piece of schmitt |
| 14:28.43 | clock_ | :D |
| 14:28.52 | claymore | Was the core of *MANY* jokes on the boat. |
| 14:29.20 | ``Erik | for those who don't know, claymore was tube sperm, enlisted on a sub |
| 14:29.21 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:29.44 | claymore | "Stick your head in there and check the doping of the Shmitt will ya? " - "Screw you!" :D |
| 14:29.45 | clock_ | what is tube sperm and what is a sub? |
| 14:30.19 | ``Erik | submarine, adn tube sperm is a derogary term for the folk serving |
| 14:30.22 | claymore | Bubblehead, Tuber, Subhuman.... yeah heard em all :D |
| 14:31.05 | ``Erik | I still like tube sperm :) |
| 14:31.25 | ``Erik | sorry, my dad was a jet mech on a carrier |
| 14:31.33 | ``Erik | I grey up on navy towns |
| 14:31.34 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:31.36 | ``Erik | grew |
| 14:31.57 | claymore | and that means he was a Surface Jerk and served on a Target :) |
| 14:32.13 | ``Erik | hehehe, well, he ain't got shot at |
| 14:32.27 | clock_ | what happens when you breathe all the air on the sub? |
| 14:32.29 | claymore | was death from below! |
| 14:32.32 | clock_ | Then you start breathing water? |
| 14:32.32 | ``Erik | good for me, he lived to donate for my existance |
| 14:33.01 | claymore | Its a requirement for all US Navy submariners to have gills and be able to stay underwater > 6 hours. |
| 14:33.02 | ``Erik | they hug their chest and pray that the bends doesn't take them |
| 14:33.19 | claymore | :D |
| 14:34.08 | claymore | Real answer: There are O2 generators, CO2 scrubbers and CO burners that replenish the atomosphere. |
| 14:34.09 | ``Erik | and, uh, vc aint no plain suface ship, it's got a flee to unfuck it |
| 14:34.47 | claymore | vc = ?? |
| 14:34.51 | ``Erik | if a vc goes down, it was an epic fleet fail |
| 14:35.00 | ``Erik | fleet carrier |
| 14:35.06 | clock_ | electronic warfare mast what can it be? |
| 14:35.09 | claymore | ah, cv/cvn |
| 14:35.10 | claymore | okay |
| 14:35.12 | clock_ | TV antenna for long winter nights? |
| 14:35.36 | ``Erik | cv, yes, I was backwards |
| 14:35.59 | claymore | Subrock >> cvn... but they won't let use us em any more :( |
| 14:36.01 | ``Erik | I'm sure all my fathers servies were cvn |
| 14:36.06 | clock_ | CO burners? Do you cook on town gas down there? |
| 14:37.11 | claymore | yes, we take 100+ km hoses with us. |
| 14:37.22 | claymore | :D |
| 14:37.38 | ``Erik | man, the riptide really fucks your duty on that |
| 14:38.05 | clock_ | Reactor sizes range up to 550 MW |
| 14:38.11 | clock_ | Hehe how many seconds from 0 to 100? |
| 14:38.12 | claymore | Yeah, it sucks really bad when the OOD turns the boat too quick and cuts the gasline with the screw. Cold cuts for the rest of the deployment :/ |
| 14:38.36 | claymore | clock_: Procedureally, about 5-10 minutes. |
| 14:38.45 | ``Erik | there's no way he can answer you honest on that, clock |
| 14:38.59 | claymore | if there is badness happening < 1 microsecond :) |
| 14:39.29 | ``Erik | military capibility tends to be an awful secret thing, don't evne ask |
| 14:39.57 | claymore | ``Erik: Thats kinda true, but since it's not like pushing the 'reactor gas pedal' down and watching the boat accellerate, then the question is vauge at best. |
| 14:40.18 | ``Erik | let it float, dude |
| 14:40.39 | claymore | the exact specifics are classified, but you can get the basic, and even advanced concepts of Pressurized Water Reactor theory on the web. |
| 14:40.56 | claymore | ``Erik: thats what we do with the contents of our San Tanks :) |
| 14:41.12 | ``Erik | 'cept when you dump over my planets, bitch |
| 14:41.32 | claymore | lol |
| 14:41.41 | claymore | sorry bout that. |
| 14:42.00 | ``Erik | I"m sure I'd crush you on fenix, so it's all good |
| 14:42.25 | claymore | Its impossible to defeat a foe that isn't there though :/ |
| 14:42.37 | ``Erik | when ya get there... :D |
| 14:42.48 | claymore | clock_: Nuklar Power fer Dummies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pressurized_water_reactor |
| 14:42.51 | ``Erik | I'm pissed off, wow isn't live |
| 14:43.32 | ``Erik | did you read up on the story about tamm, claymore? |
| 14:43.33 | claymore | that does suck. Today is a good MMO day. |
| 14:43.43 | claymore | linkage? |
| 14:43.49 | ``Erik | um, was on smacksnot |
| 14:44.08 | ``Erik | the dude who leaekd the illegal nsa tapping |
| 14:44.35 | claymore | no, missed that. |
| 14:44.51 | ``Erik | http://www.newsweek.com/id/174601/page/1 |
| 14:45.42 | ``Erik | http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/12/15/1851212' |
| 14:45.55 | ``Erik | sans the quote mark at the end |
| 14:45.57 | claymore | yeah, I heard about that. |
| 14:46.10 | ``Erik | disturbing stuff |
| 14:46.17 | claymore | he had no business blowing the whistle and should be locked up imo. |
| 14:46.35 | ``Erik | I disagree |
| 14:46.47 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 14:47.21 | claymore | Well, the way I see it, there are two completely seperate issues. 1) Illegal Activities by the Gov. 2) Divulging Government Secrets. |
| 14:47.55 | claymore | He was right and wrong. |
| 14:47.58 | ``Erik | yes, I believe that illegal gov't actities forgoe and protection |
| 14:48.08 | ``Erik | any |
| 14:48.13 | claymore | the gov also was right and wrong. |
| 14:48.27 | ``Erik | it's a huge risk to publicise them |
| 14:48.29 | claymore | the Gov had the protection of the people in mind, but went about it the wrong way. |
| 14:48.42 | ``Erik | I don't know if I agree with that |
| 14:48.50 | claymore | Tamm saw an illegal activity in progress, but went about addressing it wrong. |
| 14:49.30 | ``Erik | I think mebbe the administration thought that may've had the right notion, but they sure didn't do it right |
| 14:49.45 | claymore | The american government isn't full of angels, nor is it this horrible, completely corrupt thing. |
| 14:50.10 | ``Erik | I think I'd rather be subject to possibly foreign assault than gauranteed assault by those supposed to be protecting me |
| 14:50.28 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 14:50.36 | claymore | Anyone who thinks that the illegal wire taps were done for the sole purpose of 'personal gain' on a government offical's part... is, well, an idiot. |
| 14:51.19 | ``Erik | not personal gain, but it's an extension of an organizaions ability into previously illegal areas |
| 14:51.24 | claymore | You are correct in that the Bush Administration had the people's safety at heart, but again, not all of the administration are angles, nor corrupt. |
| 14:51.43 | claymore | Oh I agree 100%. It was an illegal act. |
| 14:51.55 | ``Erik | I'm sure they think they are working towards what they think is a safer situation, but they are curb stomping protections of americans |
| 14:52.05 | claymore | But then again, us civies probably hear about 1-2% of the covert operations that actualyl take place. |
| 14:52.35 | ``Erik | if that much, ... I'm not saying it doens't ahppen, I'm saying it's wrong :) |
| 14:52.55 | ``Erik | I mean, look at the deep throat sitaution |
| 14:53.12 | ``Erik | that was peanuts compared to what's going on now |
| 14:53.19 | ``Erik | but it was huge |
| 14:53.19 | claymore | Heh, then there is the whole ethical issue: Is something considered wrong if no one knows about it? |
| 14:53.22 | claymore | true. |
| 14:54.06 | ``Erik | I feel compelled to not condone or respect that crap that's being accepted now, it's illegal and abusive |
| 14:54.09 | ``Erik | *shrug* |
| 14:54.11 | claymore | My personal take is that all great nations fall, history repeats, but for us, I think we are going to tear ourselves apart. Not from an external source. |
| 14:54.43 | ``Erik | yeah, I'd kinda like the system to work at least as long for me and my children to die before it fails |
| 14:55.00 | ``Erik | I think bush et al is making that all happen far to soon |
| 14:55.12 | claymore | I kinda see it as a parallel to the whole justice premise: "7 guilty men go free before 1 innocent man is locked up" |
| 14:55.48 | claymore | Many many people would rather choose to have more planes rammed into buildings and buildings blown up before they give a little on their personal freedoms. |
| 14:56.27 | ``Erik | in most of the US, the guilty dude is still around to sue for his innocence, texan/bush philosophy advocates state murder O.o |
| 14:56.30 | claymore | bah, Bush is just the front man. The real people calling the shots are not well known :/ |
| 14:56.40 | ``Erik | yeah, I agree |
| 14:56.46 | ``Erik | but he IS the front man |
| 14:56.50 | ``Erik | so we can slap a name on him |
| 14:57.46 | claymore | Responsible, yes. The person accountable for the govs actions... probably not. I honestly don't think he is *that* smart/stupid. "Just sign here Mr President..." |
| 14:57.47 | ``Erik | I think cheney and snow and them have done far more evil, but *shrug* they're not the one with the title |
| 14:58.46 | ``Erik | <-- sure hopes shit changes come feb, might be looking for a new country to live in otherwise |
| 14:59.03 | ``Erik | :) |
| 14:59.10 | claymore | Anyways, as for the Tamm thing, illegal or not, State secrets are still State secrets. If he is let off, then it sends the message that "its okay to divulge secrets, given the situation." |
| 14:59.29 | claymore | and *that* will start the down ward spiral :/ |
| 14:59.50 | ``Erik | yeah, he broke the low, the question is wether it was acceptable... probably not, but it was something that NEEDED to be leaked, I'd imagine |
| 14:59.53 | ``Erik | I d'no |
| 15:00.09 | claymore | Yeah, tough ethics question... good case study actually :) |
| 15:00.20 | claymore | Both he and the Gov need to be put on trial. |
| 15:00.58 | ``Erik | were I on the panel, I'd probably claim him a patriot and be aggressive against the gov't |
| 15:01.12 | ``Erik | but I have my own bias here :) |
| 15:01.25 | claymore | I think if the illegal taps were an isolated incident, I wouldn't be so worried. |
| 15:01.40 | claymore | Heh, well that all depends on your view of patriot then doesn't it? |
| 15:02.08 | claymore | Because it could just as easily be said that he was a traitor and endangereg hundreds or thousands of American's lives |
| 15:02.09 | ``Erik | I like to note that in the 1700's, there were a bunch of terrorists that were doing insane things like isolated bullets from teh woods and no fair fights... that was the revolutionary war |
| 15:02.23 | claymore | yeah, i love that parallel :) |
| 15:02.36 | ``Erik | we exist as a country pretty much because of the thing we're fighting right now |
| 15:02.50 | claymore | Britan got whooped because they would'nt change military tactics. |
| 15:03.12 | claymore | And as you said, here we are 'not stooping to their level' to bring the fight to them. heh. |
| 15:03.38 | ``Erik | franky, I say lets walk away from the middle east, let israel get curb stomped, ... whatever *shrug* |
| 15:03.46 | claymore | amen. |
| 15:04.16 | ``Erik | every war isreal has been in, the US has done logistics for them... logistics is 90% of a war |
| 15:04.17 | claymore | Build more nuklar powerplants, pour $ into electric motor research and give OPEC the middle finger. |
| 15:04.19 | ``Erik | er, wtf? |
| 15:05.04 | ``Erik | waits for dudes in black suites to show up O.o |
| 15:05.21 | claymore | I say drop about 10-20 c-130's worth of guns and munitions inbetween Israel and the gaza strip and let them finish it... |
| 15:05.37 | claymore | but then again, its not our fight, and if it weren't for (mainly) oil, we could care less. |
| 15:06.00 | ``Erik | I d'no, it confuses me |
| 15:06.09 | ``Erik | especially with shit like the uss liberty |
| 15:06.19 | ``Erik | israel napalmed a US ship |
| 15:06.21 | ``Erik | wtf? |
| 15:06.40 | claymore | Nothing is black and white... |
| 15:06.49 | ``Erik | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident |
| 15:07.09 | ``Erik | yeah, but if you have fighter doing flybys and thumbs up, then turning and dumping munitions |
| 15:07.12 | ``Erik | that's effed up |
| 15:08.11 | claymore | True. But the whole nature of napalm is effed up too. |
| 15:08.49 | ``Erik | *shrug* hostilities are messed up, why can't we all just get along? |
| 15:08.50 | claymore | The Trojan horse is still a valid tactic. Non american ships fly american flags all the time |
| 15:09.05 | ``Erik | yeah,and american ships fly nonamerican flags |
| 15:09.21 | claymore | pppft, no, we dont do that! :D |
| 15:09.38 | ``Erik | the issue with the liberty is that there was close fly confrimation, then assault |
| 15:10.07 | claymore | like I said, its rpobably not as black and white as that :/ |
| 15:10.32 | ``Erik | *shrug* mebbe not, but how would you feel in that situation? |
| 15:11.19 | ``Erik | plane flies by, waving and stuff, it's all cool, it turns back and... well... starts dumping aoe killers on you? |
| 15:11.44 | claymore | depends on who i was. Am I the arrogant Israeli commander ordering the attack that would look foolish infront of his subordinates? Am I the Israeli pilot who didn't have to deploy the weapons? |
| 15:12.03 | claymore | Am I the Sailor caught by the most lethal of weapons: surprize? |
| 15:12.09 | claymore | etc |
| 15:12.11 | ``Erik | yeah *shrug* |
| 15:12.39 | ``Erik | I'd still be awfully carefuly if I were deploying lethal weapons |
| 15:12.46 | claymore | It would be nice to draw a line and state 'Good Guys and Bad Guys'... makes things easier. |
| 15:13.09 | ``Erik | that was the thing, there WAS that line drawn |
| 15:13.28 | ``Erik | this was a ship flying US colors, with american lookin' folk on it.. |
| 15:13.59 | ``Erik | and it was confirmed friendly, then turned around and attacked |
| 15:14.01 | ``Erik | wtff? |
| 15:15.49 | ``Erik | I d'no, it seems weird to me, but *shrug* I d'no, mistakes are made |
| 15:17.58 | ``Erik | I mean, if you ran surface, american flag, american vessel... flyby si all grins at you, then turn around and start dumping shit on you, uh, is that not a wtf? |
| 15:19.30 | brlcad | claymore: you should also take a look at the basic serialization routines that libbu provides (which librt uses to serialize data to .g files) - includes floating points type serialization (for non-ieee formats) |
| 15:19.40 | claymore | sounds like a similar ethical/moral choice that Tamm. I don't envy that pilot at all. |
| 15:20.05 | claymore | HEY get that Ontopic relatied stuff outta here! |
| 15:20.17 | ``Erik | no, libbu dont' give free endian trnaslation |
| 15:20.19 | ``Erik | :( |
| 15:20.37 | ``Erik | there are functions to handle that, but it's not free |
| 15:21.05 | brlcad | free? |
| 15:21.19 | ``Erik | you have to make the function call |
| 15:21.41 | ``Erik | you can't say "save this" and have it all happen |
| 15:22.12 | brlcad | sure, not arguing that -- just wondering where the "no, libbu dont'" comes from.. |
| 15:22.21 | brlcad | didn't say it was free |
| 15:22.35 | brlcad | said there are basic routines to help |
| 15:22.49 | ``Erik | you have to understand when to call the func, and then actually do it |
| 15:23.03 | ``Erik | htat's my argument |
| 15:23.11 | brlcad | who are you arguing with? :) |
| 15:23.27 | ``Erik | myself, apparently |
| 15:23.30 | brlcad | the goods are in htond.c htonf.c endian.c |
| 15:23.55 | ``Erik | there ain't no magic, that's wht I argue |
| 16:15.34 | claymore | wow up yet? |
| 16:21.18 | claymore | brlcad: Thanks for the tip! |
| 16:22.28 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03johnranderson * r33376 10/brlcad/trunk/src/librtserver/rtserver.c: MUVES3 package names have changed |
| 16:47.36 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33377 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/ (tankwizard/ tankwizard.tcl): Moved tankwizardIA to tankwizard. |
| 16:49.21 | brlcad | and xdr.c |
| 16:51.33 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33378 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tankwizard/TankWizard.tcl: Moved TankWizardIA.tcl to TankWizard.tcl |
| 16:57.13 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33379 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tankwizardIA/: Moved to tankwizard. |
| 16:59.49 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33380 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tankwizard/TankWizardIA.tcl: Remove TankWizardIA.tcl |
| 17:00.42 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33381 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/tankwizardIA.tcl: Removed tankwizardIA.tcl |
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| 17:18.40 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33382 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/xdr.c: fix typo in comment, these are alternates for the bsd [hn]to[nh][sl] byteorder routines. |
| 17:22.51 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33383 10/brlcad/trunk/src/archer/plugins/Wizards/Makefile.am: tankwizard was renamed sans IA suffix, fix distcheck |
| 17:45.06 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith_ (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 17:48.44 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33384 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/typein.c: Mods to keep variable declarations at the top of the block. |
| 18:32.21 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33385 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/libged/libged.vcproj: Added tire to libged build on Windows. |
| 18:40.29 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33386 10/brlcad/trunk/misc/win32-msvc8/tclsh/library/installTree.tcl: Added code to install the Tank and Tire wizards. |
| 18:49.48 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33387 10/brlcad/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): more repairs to the build, have to rename directories with a Makefile.am in configure.ac too, remove the IA. |
| 18:53.08 | *** join/#brlcad clock_ (n=clock@77-58-239-136.dclient.hispeed.ch) | |
| 19:10.33 | brlcad | claymore: brlcad.org/~sean/tmp/ByteBag.cpp and ByteBag.hpp |
| 20:42.47 | *** join/#brlcad kanzure_ (n=bryan@user-0vvd95g.cable.mindspring.com) | |
| 20:43.03 | kanzure_ | Hrm, so oed wants me to draw something first before I can use it. But what if I wanted to use the oed command from the shell? |
| 20:43.13 | kanzure_ | (without drawing) |
| 20:44.25 | kanzure_ | Ah, maybe this is doing the trick: "mged -c blah \"draw test3.r ; oed / /test.r/thing.s\"". |
| 20:44.52 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.141.158) | |
| 21:00.14 | *** join/#brlcad WhiteCalf (i=WhiteCal@whitecalf.net) | |
| 21:03.34 | *** join/#brlcad PrezKennedy (i=Matthew@whitecalf.net) | |
| 21:17.33 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=WarLock@bas2-sudbury98-1177879464.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:18.17 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/tty.png :) |
| 21:19.39 | IriX64 | i know it's off topic, but it's a good chuckle :) |
| 21:26.05 | madant | didn't get it :( |
| 21:26.53 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14CDEC.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 21:27.08 | IriX64 | windows is usefull, it can build gcc :) |
| 21:27.54 | madant | more like gcc is awesome can "even" work with windows :P |
| 21:28.12 | IriX64 | we'll see if they coperate |
| 21:28.19 | IriX64 | cooperate too |
| 21:34.36 | louipc | how does windows build gcc? o.O |
| 21:35.04 | archivist | see djgpp the work is done for you |
| 21:36.40 | archivist | or join the djgpp project and move it on to 64 bit |
| 21:38.15 | IriX64 | it's tied to the hippo :) |
| 21:39.06 | IriX64 | on a serious note if i download and install tcl/tk 8.5.5 on my system can i cut the build time of brl-cad? |
| 21:39.45 | louipc | of course |
| 21:39.55 | madant | considering the fact that tcl-tk build takes quite a large portion of the build time |
| 21:39.56 | louipc | I find opennurbs is the killer one |
| 21:40.03 | IriX64 | so itll hunt and find them? |
| 21:40.11 | madant | I think more than half is opennurbs |
| 21:40.17 | IriX64 | i see thanks |
| 21:40.52 | IriX64 | is it the same tcl though, or does yours have stuff theirs doen't |
| 21:42.02 | louipc | I should probably just disable opennurbs for my own builds |
| 21:42.22 | IriX64 | --without-opennurbs? |
| 21:42.28 | louipc | something like that |
| 21:42.40 | louipc | see ./configure --help |
| 21:42.46 | IriX64 | never tried, i usually --enable-everything |
| 21:45.11 | IriX64 | a lot of options, some seem arcane :) |
| 21:46.21 | louipc | --disable-opennurbs |
| 21:46.34 | IriX64 | thanks |
| 21:47.18 | louipc | not really arcane, just a little inconsistent I guess eh? |
| 21:47.26 | IriX64 | heh, yea |
| 21:47.45 | IriX64 | ill look again, when this things finished churning |
| 22:39.40 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 23:26.20 | brlcad | hey madant |
| 23:26.27 | brlcad | ltns, how's it going? |
| 23:26.59 | madant | hi :) |
| 23:27.07 | brlcad | louipc: inconsistent how? |
| 23:27.13 | madant | sorry about the disappearance :) |
| 23:28.10 | brlcad | it's okay, it's been quite a busy winter thusfar still |
| 23:28.36 | madant | :) i still have to check out mafm's interface |
| 23:29.22 | madant | How's the geometry engine coming up |
| 23:29.58 | louipc | brlcad: there's too many aliases, so a configure commands could be extremely varied |
| 23:30.30 | mafm | my interface is very shy! |
| 23:30.49 | madant | :D |
| 23:31.16 | madant | I am quite sure that lots of people like shyness :P |
| 23:31.19 | louipc | mafm: do you have a screenie? |
| 23:32.33 | brlcad | madant: slowly as of late (at least visible progress) .. trying to get the guy working on the geometry service to commit more frequently (hint-hint), but mged->libged refactoring is just about complete |
| 23:32.39 | brlcad | slowly but steadily |
| 23:32.43 | mafm | louipc: http://bzflag.org/~mafm/g3d-screenshots/ |
| 23:32.47 | madant | was just heading out to run my 5km @ 5am.. terrible at it :( 25 minutes |
| 23:33.18 | louipc | mafm: cool thanks |
| 23:33.40 | madant | mafm: i like grey.. the violet not so much :) |
| 23:34.23 | brlcad | mafm: you know that you're user page now comes up as the 9th highest rank if you search for "rbgui"? :) |
| 23:34.26 | madant | brlcad: it is a big job anyways :) |
| 23:35.02 | brlcad | madant: yeah, it is -- about three staff years of time in all I estimated over a year ago |
| 23:35.08 | mafm | that's because of google's pagerank, because brlcad is so famous :P |
| 23:35.12 | brlcad | we're more than halfway into it |
| 23:35.13 | madant | first time I heard righ brain games gui from mafm i though WTF :D |
| 23:35.53 | mafm | well, there are no many alternatives, outside CEGUI |
| 23:36.03 | louipc | hehe |
| 23:37.11 | madant | :) ok be right back after i hopefully improve my run :) |
| 23:38.37 | mafm | and rbgui is very slick compared to CEGUI |
| 23:38.57 | mafm | it seems on a dead end (maintenance), but well... |
| 23:40.46 | Ralith | it's not like we can't take over if it works well |
| 23:42.05 | mafm | it's a bit primitive, but well :) |
| 23:50.12 | Ralith | mafm, what's that 'camera' subwindow for? |
| 23:51.37 | mafm | it's a test to create a widget, IIRC |
| 23:51.43 | Ralith | oh ok |
| 23:52.02 | mafm | besides that, you can move the camera with those buttons |
| 23:52.03 | Ralith | I was worried it was supposed to be a useful interface |
| 23:52.15 | mafm | the round thingy is to center, the rest to move and zoom |
| 23:52.45 | Ralith | 'cuz really you'd want all that to be done with single-key shortcuts |
| 23:54.29 | Ralith | I'd imagine you'd only need an actual GUI for explicitly setting values |
| 23:54.53 | mafm | for the camera? everything works with keystrokes, yes |
| 23:55.25 | mafm | it was brlcad who asked me to create a test widget as part of the project, to test the suitability of RBGui to the task, or something to that effect |
| 23:56.09 | Ralith | seems like a fairly straightforward grid layout |
| 23:58.00 | mafm | the simple but especialized widgets are the ones of "rotations" |
| 23:58.27 | Ralith | ? |
| 23:58.46 | Ralith | what are those? |
| 23:58.56 | Ralith | isn't sure what to make of the bars of color |
| 00:01.26 | brlcad | is to blame |
| 00:03.05 | Ralith | blames brlcad |
| 00:03.16 | Ralith | so what are they? |
| 00:03.55 | brlcad | it looks like we very likely may end up adopting maintenance of a gui toolkit (whether it be rbgui, cegui, llmozlib, fork of blender's, whatever) to have something maintainable that will serve the long-term design criteria |
| 00:04.24 | Ralith | blender's GUI is libifyable? |
| 00:04.30 | Ralith | 'cuz they have a *very* nice GUI, iirc. |
| 00:04.42 | Ralith | (at least, I liked it) |
| 00:04.44 | brlcad | any code is libifyable |
| 00:04.54 | Ralith | libifyable for sane effort, that is |
| 00:05.48 | brlcad | given the scope and goals of the task, with one of the viable options being the near rewrite or unfinished implementation of one of the alternatives, a major refactoring becomes sane |
| 00:06.57 | Ralith | fair. |
| 00:08.57 | brlcad | as for "bars of color", don't know what you were referring to |
| 00:09.21 | Ralith | http://bzflag.org/~mafm/g3d-screenshots/brlcad_rbgui_20080824-1.png |
| 00:09.32 | Ralith | below the X/Y/Z rot numbers |
| 00:10.33 | brlcad | oh |
| 00:11.02 | brlcad | just guessing, but looks like progress bars representing the numeric 0->360 rotation value |
| 00:11.29 | Ralith | ah. |
| 00:11.49 | Ralith | in that case I'm still a bit confused as to what that dialog is testing |
| 00:13.21 | brlcad | I think conceptually, it was more just visual placement of items to test that rbgui could even do the basics |
| 00:13.27 | mafm | sorry for the delay Ralith |
| 00:13.33 | Ralith | no worries |
| 00:13.35 | mafm | yes, those are the things |
| 00:13.36 | brlcad | pop up a window with buttons, sliders and events, invoke actions, etc |
| 00:13.55 | Ralith | that seemed odd to me 'cuz of all the earlier screenshots showing more advanced tests |
| 00:14.25 | brlcad | Ralith: have you seen the IOE prototype? that has several design criteria that are very relevant for the new gui design |
| 00:14.41 | Ralith | I watched a bit of the presentation video |
| 00:14.45 | brlcad | k |
| 00:15.01 | mafm | they're RBGui::Widgets, specialized for the task (albeit very simple) |
| 00:15.09 | mafm | so if a text widget has setText, etc |
| 00:15.33 | mafm | these ones have the "setProgress" and "setLabel" and so on |
| 00:15.46 | mafm | so you can put that as a widget in any part, not having to create it anew |
| 00:16.24 | mafm | that's like creating a dialog window to be used in many places of the program, provided that the toolkit doesn't already provide one |
| 00:16.37 | Ralith | brlcad, seems like a nice set of concepts, but pretty divergent from standard paradigms |
| 00:16.44 | Ralith | then again, what 3D modeler isn't? |
| 00:17.00 | mafm | so it's not testing advanced features, it's just extending a widget to create a simple one |
| 00:18.53 | Ralith | hmm |
| 00:20.18 | Ralith | I wonder if blender could actually be easily extended to interact with the geometry service itself |
| 00:21.00 | Ralith | I suppose it's a bit focused upon mesh modeling for that to be entirely appropriate. Still, interesting thought. |
| 00:23.34 | mafm | btw brlcad, there's a new GUI on the block |
| 00:24.09 | mafm | althought quite new and still has to prove that it's worthy |
| 00:24.19 | mafm | osgWidgets, from OpenSceneGraph |
| 00:24.48 | brlcad | mafm: there's more than one |
| 00:25.02 | brlcad | I was just about to mention/remind the one I saw at siggraph this year |
| 00:25.09 | brlcad | from one of the g3d developers |
| 00:25.17 | brlcad | (the graphics engine) ;) |
| 00:25.38 | brlcad | http://graphics.cs.williams.edu/papers/GuiUniversalSIGGRAPH08/gui-poster.pdf |
| 00:25.38 | mafm | GNU 3D? :) |
| 00:26.42 | brlcad | http://graphics.cs.williams.edu/papers/GuiUniversalSIGGRAPH08/ |
| 00:27.32 | Ralith | oh hey |
| 00:27.35 | Ralith | now that's a neat concept |
| 00:27.36 | brlcad | figure 2 is a nice collage of the various features |
| 00:28.16 | Ralith | I want to play with this now |
| 00:28.17 | brlcad | the developer that worked on that is morgan mcguire, the code is bsd licensed |
| 00:28.30 | Ralith | yay! |
| 00:28.45 | brlcad | he said he thinks it'd take about a month for someone to port it to ogre |
| 00:28.54 | brlcad | (knowing nothing) |
| 00:29.11 | Ralith | oh right ogre |
| 00:29.12 | Ralith | damn |
| 00:29.31 | brlcad | it's already in the g3d engine, you can play with it there |
| 00:30.18 | Ralith | think that might be a viable ogre alternative long-term? |
| 00:30.43 | brlcad | not really |
| 00:30.51 | brlcad | ogre still has *way* more momentum and activity |
| 00:30.54 | Ralith | why's that? |
| 00:31.17 | Ralith | hm, scope is a bit large |
| 00:32.22 | mafm | WTH is universal pointer pattern? :) |
| 00:33.11 | Ralith | mafm, it's explained; seems to mean that you bind widgets directly to vars |
| 00:33.31 | mafm | yes, but it's such a new pattern that google doesn't know about it |
| 00:33.42 | mafm | I need to find a new oracle :) |
| 00:34.29 | madant | is still a 6 minute miler :( |
| 00:35.01 | louipc | that's decent |
| 00:36.15 | louipc | wow the world record is down to 3:43 |
| 00:36.26 | brlcad | that's just his fangled name for a concept that's been around for a while (though I forget the other names it goes by) |
| 00:36.39 | brlcad | you can do the same thing in tk actually, aqua too |
| 00:38.13 | madant | louipc: i think 5km in 12.37 minutes is even more freaky |
| 00:38.45 | louipc | oh yea |
| 00:47.37 | mafm | so what's the plan brlcad, test that one also? |
| 00:47.44 | mafm | it's separated in a lib already? |
| 00:48.24 | madant | too thinks Morgan McGuire's idea is neat |
| 00:48.36 | Ralith | doesn't make a good GUI alone though |
| 00:51.38 | madant | this work of mcguire looks neat too :) http://graphics.cs.williams.edu/projects/YangFan/about.html |
| 00:51.55 | brlcad | mafm: I think it would be good for someone(tm) should test that one out -- especially if it really is just a month's work to port it on over |
| 00:52.08 | Ralith | I still like the idea of Blender's GUI; it's had a lot of refinement for use with a similar set of requirements |
| 00:52.33 | brlcad | but sorting out the gui is still secondary to completing the gui infrastructure and engine/service work |
| 00:52.52 | Ralith | gui infrastructure? |
| 00:53.06 | Ralith | 'course, no point having a shiny GUI without the geometry service to back it |
| 00:53.32 | madant | nods with Ralith |
| 00:55.16 | brlcad | Ralith: basic classes in place to support managing a graphics context, the input controls for manipulation, how key bindings are managed, displaying "panels" and tabs of information, etc |
| 00:55.16 | Ralith | that said, I can probably be of much more use playing with a GUI than on the geometry engine. |
| 00:55.25 | mafm | I don't know how intricate is the GUI implementation with the rest of the engine |
| 00:55.40 | Ralith | brlcad, a lot of that sounds like stuff that would be provided by w/e GUI lib. |
| 00:55.55 | mafm | but in other GUIs porting means one week, or even one afternoon for somewhat knowledable people |
| 00:55.56 | Ralith | mafm, ideally, I imagine it would be fairly well abstracted out. |
| 00:56.25 | mafm | so low as to inject the input, and draw it in an object to be passed to the engine to render it |
| 00:57.11 | brlcad | Ralith: they can be, but some aren't -- think of it as the subset of things you'd still have to do regardless of what gui was chosen |
| 00:57.23 | Ralith | right |
| 00:57.35 | brlcad | or even better, what you'd have to do if you wanted to cleanly support multiple gui interfaces (not that we'd want/need to) |
| 00:58.28 | brlcad | but that separation of responsibilities -- e.g., a gui lib isn't going to manage or know about geometry, but the interface is at some point going to have to have a container for displayed sets of geometry |
| 00:58.40 | brlcad | much of that mafm actually already has done fortunately |
| 00:59.09 | brlcad | mafm: yeah, he said he ported to wxwidgets and java in less than a day for both |
| 00:59.30 | brlcad | the premise for a month was assuming a dev that had no knowledge of the lib and would have to learn where everything was |
| 00:59.44 | brlcad | unassisted |
| 01:04.10 | mafm | then that might take years :D |
| 01:04.59 | mafm | (unassisted, without idea of how engines work, etc) |
| 01:05.56 | mafm | anyway, did you check OpenSceneGraph? I recall you having a strong bias for using OGRE, but I don't know exactly if we talked about problems with others |
| 01:07.02 | brlcad | no, I mean his estimate that it'd take about a month was without him helping someone through the code -- about a month for someone to figure it out and port |
| 01:07.16 | brlcad | not someone completely involent |
| 01:07.30 | brlcad | and yes, I'm very familiar with OSG |
| 01:08.54 | mafm | why are you familiar with OSG? adn why did you favor OGRE? |
| 01:10.08 | brlcad | are you asking out of curiousity of as a means to justify not using ogre? :) |
| 01:10.22 | brlcad | I used OSG a few years ago for some test projects, have talked to their devs on a few occasions |
| 01:11.16 | mafm | curiosity, I like OSG better |
| 01:11.39 | brlcad | osg is very close in appeal as an engine, they ranked up in the top five easy, maybe even #2 |
| 01:12.32 | brlcad | they have a fair bit of complexity creepage, especially compared to ogre staying focused on rendering |
| 01:13.25 | brlcad | their docs, support, and community aren't nearly as easy/quick/effective to work with as some of the other engines |
| 01:14.28 | mafm | docs for starting up are hard, yes |
| 01:14.45 | brlcad | ogre has some outstanding leadership, steve is a really great guy to work with, the devs are exceedingly helpful |
| 01:14.56 | mafm | which are the others in the top? |
| 01:15.07 | brlcad | assaf was in the middle of porting bzflag to ogre by the time the gsoc mentor summit was done |
| 01:16.04 | mafm | uh, bzflag is in ogre... interesting :D |
| 01:16.21 | *** join/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.40) | |
| 01:16.24 | brlcad | they just really have their act together and are organized for long-term growth/maintenance compared to OSG, which is a lot more academics that throw in features from time to time with a lot more half-hazard less-dedicated leadership |
| 01:16.36 | sporty__ | brlcad: need help |
| 01:16.48 | brlcad | mafm: it's not yet, we've just been in talks and evaluations about adopting an engine for a couple years |
| 01:17.07 | sporty__ | brlcad: Question: dxflib code: key/value pairs - is it eaxactly a way the code looks like? Or it is just a low-level API for Dxflib? |
| 01:17.42 | brlcad | sporty__: we don't support dxflib |
| 01:18.03 | brlcad | or have anything to do with them |
| 01:18.14 | mafm | well, nice anyway |
| 01:18.29 | mafm | I don't have really objections about using OGRE |
| 01:18.29 | brlcad | we have a prototype port of bzflag to crystalspace already |
| 01:18.31 | sporty__ | brlcad: i want your answer as a programer's one for ***another*** translation. |
| 01:18.53 | sporty__ | brlcad: it is question about the DXF-files |
| 01:19.10 | brlcad | sporty__: so then ask a generic question that has nothing to do with dxflib |
| 01:19.20 | sporty__ | brlcad: i do |
| 01:19.27 | brlcad | asking me about dxflib isn't going to get you an answer ;) |
| 01:19.30 | Ralith | brlcad, is that bzflag 2? |
| 01:19.40 | brlcad | Ralith: nope |
| 01:19.53 | brlcad | maybe 2.2 |
| 01:20.13 | Ralith | engine change seems like a pretty big thing for a minor release |
| 01:20.28 | sporty__ | brlcad: Am i right to think real .DXF files consist of key/value tuples? Or am i just a sad looser? |
| 01:20.40 | brlcad | the CS port is pretty much a stalled/dead effort right now, but there have also been tests using three or four other engines too |
| 01:21.00 | brlcad | it just made the most progress in a short time (because it got a core dev excited for a couple weeks) |
| 01:21.13 | brlcad | sporty__: it sounds like you're a sad loser :) |
| 01:21.23 | brlcad | they're more complicated than that |
| 01:21.23 | sporty__ | brlcad: seriously, please |
| 01:21.36 | brlcad | hey if you want serious, don't ask stupid questions :) |
| 01:21.47 | sporty__ | brlcad: that's why it is only a low-level API, right? |
| 01:21.57 | brlcad | it's not an API at all |
| 01:22.00 | brlcad | it's a file format |
| 01:22.17 | Ralith | :P |
| 01:22.38 | sporty__ | brlcad: yes, but is it exactly a format, or these key/values pairs represent a way of low-level programming?? |
| 01:23.02 | brlcad | that question fails to parse, rephrase |
| 01:23.10 | sporty__ | brlcad: is it a syntax of DXF, or something .. |
| 01:23.19 | brlcad | is DXF a syntax of DXF? |
| 01:23.48 | brlcad | stop saying "it", replace with a different word |
| 01:23.49 | sporty__ | """key = value""" = syntax (within the headers of) DXF-files ? |
| 01:24.27 | brlcad | dxf files do not entirely consist of key/value paris |
| 01:24.44 | brlcad | there is statefulness in them that a parser has to be aware of |
| 01:25.13 | sporty__ | brlcad: but are these "tuples" or "pairs" just a ***particular*** part of the syntax? |
| 01:25.37 | brlcad | as opposed to what? |
| 01:25.57 | mafm | brlcad: crystalspace? in parallel with OGRE or was decided to use that one finally? |
| 01:26.04 | brlcad | sporty__: are you asking if there are any key/value pairs in the format? |
| 01:26.16 | sporty__ | brlcad: exactly |
| 01:26.17 | brlcad | mafm: it doesn't work like that |
| 01:26.47 | sporty__ | brlcad: and surely just love any your word ;) |
| 01:26.51 | brlcad | sporty__: there are key/value representations *somewhere* in the format, I'm sure |
| 01:27.00 | brlcad | just like there are key/value pairings in .g files too |
| 01:27.10 | brlcad | that just doesn't mean the whole format is that way |
| 01:27.46 | sporty__ | brlcad: ok, i have an answer to my question |
| 01:27.47 | brlcad | sporty__: "and surely just love any your word" doesn't make any sense to me either |
| 01:28.07 | sporty__ | i'm about the Dxflib Programmer's Manual |
| 01:28.24 | sporty__ | brlcad: it's all right |
| 01:29.31 | brlcad | mafm: picking up an engine is a major endevour, so testing out various engines have been mostly independent (some in parallel, some collaborative, some not) activities |
| 01:29.44 | brlcad | depends heavily on which dev is doing the work and what's being looked into |
| 01:31.17 | brlcad | it's a major undertaking because bz already has it's own rendering engine and opengl is just about *everywhere* in the game client code, so cleaning things up is a bit of a chore |
| 01:32.25 | mafm | I guess so |
| 01:32.54 | mafm | but I was curious in the case that you finally disregarded OGRE and chose CS instead |
| 01:42.49 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 01:45.33 | brlcad | nope, it's still an open item until it's "done" |
| 01:47.43 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 02:14.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33388 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: autoformat, style and ws consistency cleanup |
| 02:20.59 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33389 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: use libbu facilities where appropriate, bu_log bu_exit BRLCAD_ERROR/OK status codes |
| 02:24.44 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33390 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: don't need signed keyword, it's signed by default |
| 02:25.44 | mafm | I see |
| 02:25.53 | mafm | well, I'm going to sleep soon |
| 02:26.00 | mafm | have a nice night/whatever :) |
| 02:38.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33391 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: restructure reduce the logic nesting, simplify; remove a few obvious comments; more style cleanup |
| 02:38.36 | sporty__ | mafm: you can imagine someone from "the malibu beach" TV series (ladies) - who's drafting in BRL-CAD suite in attempt to build some another brave new vehicle |
| 02:39.23 | sporty__ | ...and do it right in that red swim suits, two ladies behind one personal computer! |
| 02:40.08 | mafm | nice thing to imagine before sleeping.. :) |
| 02:40.41 | sporty__ | ...it's getting "just a bit hot" - and voila! they want to dry each other with a tiny towel! |
| 02:40.48 | sporty__ | mafm: yeah |
| 02:41.27 | sporty__ | mafm: could be real |
| 02:42.17 | mafm | it happens all the time among computer geeks, yep :D |
| 02:44.05 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33392 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: quell compilation warnings. curious unused arguments for process_manual_dem_max_real_elevation() and it's nearly identical cousin func. |
| 02:49.29 | mafm | bye! |
| 02:58.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33393 10/brlcad/trunk/src/conv/dem-g.c: some last touch-ups to restore some of the comment alignments and use multiline comments in (just some of) the places where the comments spanned multiple lines. |
| 03:00.25 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33394 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bn.h: quell warning, extern is not at beginning of declaration |
| 03:01.27 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33395 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bn.h: oh, right, they go inside |
| 03:04.03 | *** join/#brlcad pacman871 (n=Timothy@pool-71-170-39-105.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) | |
| 03:06.15 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33396 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bn.h: comment consistency/ws cleanup |
| 03:10.56 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33397 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: richard added a new dem-g terrain importer as part of getting up to speed with some of the proc-db basics. |
| 03:15.21 | *** join/#brlcad madant (n=madant@117.196.130.146) | |
| 03:19.19 | starseeker | Ah, starting to get the hang of this: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/MarkVIII_Rock_Island_bw.pdf |
| 03:21.04 | brlcad | neat |
| 03:27.00 | sporty__ | what is its size? in kb? |
| 03:27.30 | sporty__ | .bz - belgian? |
| 03:27.44 | brlcad | ~bz |
| 03:27.45 | ibot | well, bz is Belize |
| 03:28.00 | sporty__ | a city? |
| 03:28.21 | sporty__ | ~nkz |
| 03:29.06 | sporty__ | ~time |
| 03:29.06 | ibot | 2008.12.17 3:29:06 GMT |
| 03:32.22 | brlcad | you don't know if belize is a city or not? |
| 03:32.56 | brlcad | suggests an encyclopedia |
| 03:37.36 | kanzure_ | hrm, pipe append with mouse is neat, but "append" isn't a command? hints? |
| 03:39.27 | brlcad | kanzure_: you can "press" the edit menu options via the command-line |
| 03:41.24 | kanzure_ | hrm, the naming convention is odd, what's going on? "press help" -> says I can do "press accept", where accept is Edit->Accept (or really just 'accept' as a command, but anyway) |
| 03:41.30 | kanzure_ | so is it press -> directly to the command? |
| 03:42.37 | brlcad | there is an "accept" command just because it's so frequently used |
| 03:42.46 | brlcad | "press accept" is the long variant |
| 03:43.02 | brlcad | press "Move V" |
| 03:43.06 | kanzure_ | in particular I'm looking for what "edit -> append point" is when I've done 'make thing.s pipe'. |
| 03:43.20 | brlcad | so probably: press "append point" |
| 03:43.33 | kanzure_ | unknown operation |
| 03:43.39 | brlcad | case? |
| 03:43.47 | kanzure_ | yeah :( |
| 03:43.55 | kanzure_ | okay, so how do I "virtually click" or specify a point? |
| 03:43.58 | kanzure_ | this isn't asking me for a parameter. hrm. |
| 03:44.15 | brlcad | good ol' "p" command? |
| 03:44.18 | brlcad | p x y z |
| 03:44.23 | brlcad | (guessing) |
| 03:44.49 | brlcad | have to trace into the tcl to see what command the mouse event is actually bound to |
| 03:45.09 | kanzure_ | yep, that does it |
| 03:45.33 | kanzure_ | thank you. by trace do you mean that I should just go look at the sources? or is there some other method that I should know of? |
| 03:50.36 | brlcad | kanzure_: actually I meant that I should go look, but yeah, you could go look too ;) |
| 03:50.49 | brlcad | and yea, I meant the sources |
| 03:58.16 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6 (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 04:04.25 | brlcad | kanzure_: also, if you've not seen it, the mged quick reference sheet in the docs section on the website might be of use to you |
| 04:05.02 | brlcad | it covers commands like press and p |
| 04:06.04 | *** part/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.40) | |
| 05:02.06 | *** join/#brlcad Dr_Phreakenstein (n=phreak@216.151.24.198) | |
| 06:17.42 | brlcad | that's quite a name Dr_Phreakenstein |
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| 06:51.43 | Dr_Phreakenstein | well, thanks |
| 06:52.25 | Dr_Phreakenstein | . |
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| 11:42.36 | mafm | hi |
| 11:45.57 | madant | howdy mafm :) |
| 11:57.09 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 12:01.41 | claymore | morning all! |
| 12:02.33 | madant | :) sunset here :P |
| 12:04.32 | mafm | past noon here! :D |
| 12:04.51 | claymore | madant: India? |
| 12:05.02 | mafm | however, for IRC greeting purposes, joining is "morning" and going away is "night" |
| 12:05.04 | mafm | :D |
| 12:05.22 | madant | claymore: yep |
| 12:05.47 | madant | mafm: like erdos's when did you arrive |
| 12:08.54 | mafm | madant: erdos? |
| 12:10.02 | madant | Paul erdos, the eccentric and probably most prolific mathematician of 20th century :D |
| 12:10.37 | madant | "When did you arrive" = when were you born :) "Supreme fascist" = God, "epsilon" = children etc.. |
| 12:11.59 | mafm | lol |
| 12:12.05 | mafm | then it's the same, yep |
| 12:12.20 | claymore | heh, women="bosses" and men="slaves" ...nice! |
| 12:14.10 | madant | :) logical |
| 12:14.31 | claymore | lol, of course you'd think so :P |
| 12:14.50 | madant | huh :O i am a a slave myself :D |
| 12:15.15 | mafm | you are a zero slave yourself |
| 12:15.18 | madant | my name is a bit confusing in American circles i guess :P |
| 12:15.42 | madant | in india there are lots of guys named dawn. but i guess not a single male dawn must be there in us :) |
| 12:16.52 | madant | and i was particularly impressed by Erdos (+Euler) proof for the divergence of inverse sum of primes |
| 12:20.31 | mafm | I mean zero because for him, himself was 0 |
| 12:20.32 | mafm | :D |
| 12:20.49 | mafm | so you are 0 as yourself, slave as a man |
| 12:20.58 | madant | ;P |
| 12:21.10 | mafm | weird guy, yep :) |
| 12:21.24 | madant | prolific |
| 12:21.32 | claymore | madant: Sorry, I thought I heard somewhere in conversation that you were married :) |
| 12:21.42 | madant | :D |
| 12:22.49 | madant | Even erdos's idea of god having a book of all the nicest mathematical proofs is quite nice.. this book dedicated to him is indeed such a pleasure to read.. :) http://books.google.com/books?id=KvQr9l0wgf8C&printsec=frontcover&dq=Proofs+from+the+book&ei=y-5ISeroL4bWlQTTkJnjDg |
| 12:23.03 | claymore | brlcad: Just fyi, but I am not commiting right now simply because I am evaluating a few different angles for the serialization part of the GS. |
| 12:23.47 | claymore | ``Erik: How ya feeling? |
| 12:24.54 | claymore | brlcad: bytebag = sexiness. |
| 12:30.04 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03d_rossberg * r33398 10/brlcad/trunk/include/bn.h: scarcely imaginable this code was tested before check in ;) |
| 12:44.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03davidloman * r33399 10/rt^3/trunk/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Added ByteBag.hpp and .cxx |
| 13:57.02 | ``Erik | alive O.o stomach's bugging me, couldn't really eat lunch on monday and almost lost what little I did get down on the drive home O.o a lot better today, though :) |
| 13:58.02 | d-lo | good deal! WoW servers ever come up yesterday? |
| 13:58.39 | ``Erik | yeah, I played a little, but spent most of the day asleep |
| 14:08.26 | brlcad | d-lo: that was all in good fun :) |
| 14:09.28 | d-lo | brlcad: BaCk OfF Okay?!?!!11!1! |
| 14:09.29 | brlcad | like I keep saying, can't be too frequent |
| 14:09.48 | d-lo | if you want me to start commiting all my 'essssperiments' then sure :) |
| 14:09.54 | brlcad | sure |
| 14:10.19 | d-lo | grins evily. |
| 14:10.32 | brlcad | that's often very useful actually -- part of the revision history intent is to see why code evolved in a direction it did |
| 14:11.08 | brlcad | if you see a piece of code for serialization tried out paths A and B before ending up at C -- a lot more insightful/useful that just seeing it at the end-state of C |
| 14:11.55 | d-lo | if you say so! I need to get stuff in the repo so I can work on it over the vaca. |
| 14:12.01 | brlcad | especially since many devs will go through the same thoughts and wonder .. well what about A and B? .. and proceed to make changes thinking nobody tried |
| 14:12.15 | starseeker | Got the size down to 10 megs, automated the color removal part :-) http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/MarkVIII_Rock_Island-bw.pdf |
| 14:14.46 | brlcad | starseeker: nice cleanup! |
| 14:14.51 | brlcad | you know the macs have an automatic size reduction filter yes? |
| 14:16.32 | brlcad | (and acrobat of course gives you obscene knobs on the quality encoding controls) |
| 14:16.59 | starseeker | brlcad: size reduction? |
| 14:18.41 | brlcad | yeah, though looks like the default is already "too much" |
| 14:19.23 | starseeker | do you mean autosizing the pdf for viewing? |
| 14:19.41 | brlcad | no, sizing the file by re-encoding the image data |
| 14:20.02 | starseeker | Oh, ok |
| 14:20.12 | brlcad | just didn't know if you'd tried it |
| 14:20.16 | starseeker | did that one in Scribus actually |
| 14:20.55 | starseeker | notices the scribus dpi resample, tries it... |
| 14:21.22 | brlcad | says let them be huge |
| 14:21.38 | starseeker | 300dpi max... yeah, that'll be huge :-) |
| 14:21.40 | brlcad | not like someone else is ever going to do this -- the higher res the better, so long as they're clean and readable |
| 14:22.23 | starseeker | is saving the original scans, the color "clip outs" that constitute actual content, and the processed b&w cleaned up image :-) |
| 14:22.26 | starseeker | plus the pdfs |
| 14:22.59 | starseeker | doubts the museum will know what to do with any of it, judging by their websites, but oh well... |
| 14:23.06 | starseeker | does :-) |
| 14:24.01 | starseeker | hmm, actually 300dpi was a bit of a downsample |
| 14:24.03 | starseeker | interesting |
| 14:24.21 | starseeker | takes it down to 9.7 megs |
| 14:24.29 | starseeker | negligible on this one |
| 14:24.53 | brlcad | d-lo: fyi, the bytebag classes could use some work -- the toND and fromND wrappers, for example, are now pointless (they originally did something different on windows) |
| 14:24.53 | starseeker | needs to make a wiki page with the image processing details |
| 14:25.27 | brlcad | the error handling could be probably obliterated with a non-exception-generating approach |
| 14:25.33 | brlcad | with guarantees on memory and such |
| 14:26.00 | d-lo | is working it right now. There were some blantant OO violations too :) |
| 14:26.13 | brlcad | but the typeless streamability of the packing and unpacking mechanism is the nice part |
| 14:26.20 | d-lo | Just poking and prodding to see what the intent was before I go a-changing things. |
| 14:26.51 | brlcad | hrm, what blatant OO violations? |
| 14:27.29 | brlcad | that was also a version from like .. a long time ago, probably not the latest but close enough |
| 14:27.31 | d-lo | char * data was set to public when it didn't need to be. |
| 14:27.38 | d-lo | simple fix. |
| 14:27.52 | d-lo | also looking into why all the 'friend' statements are there. :/ |
| 14:27.58 | brlcad | ah, sure |
| 14:30.27 | d-lo | also am moving implementation *out* of the header... just for uniformity's sake. |
| 14:31.09 | brlcad | yeah... there was a reason for that -- but unless it was documented, I couldn't say off the top of my head |
| 14:31.34 | d-lo | well, they were only the simple getters 'n' setters |
| 14:31.44 | d-lo | and the very well could have stayed put. |
| 14:32.08 | brlcad | i mean why all the streams are friends |
| 14:32.51 | brlcad | the header bit was undoubtedly for inlining |
| 14:32.53 | d-lo | well, it *obviously* has to do with the member access... just trying to extrapolate the pro's and cons from that approach. |
| 14:33.32 | d-lo | its more learning that figuing out what/if he did anything silly. |
| 14:33.32 | brlcad | especially with old compilers, you would *only* get actual inlining if it was in the class declaration |
| 14:33.57 | brlcad | regardless of the inline statements and practices elsewhere, they just wouldn't do it |
| 14:34.03 | d-lo | inlining == speed ...right? |
| 14:34.16 | brlcad | yep |
| 14:34.31 | d-lo | does that count as premature optimization :D |
| 14:34.36 | d-lo | ? |
| 14:35.23 | brlcad | it wasn't done beforehand, it was part of another code originally (and later part of a small handful of codes) |
| 14:35.32 | brlcad | it was refactored into the header |
| 14:35.45 | brlcad | where having a revision history would possibly help ;) |
| 14:35.55 | d-lo | cool. Does Jason pop in here often? |
| 14:36.18 | brlcad | not really often, no -- but he's an easy phone call |
| 14:36.39 | brlcad | that was a long time ago for him, though -- hehe, dunno if he'd even remember why |
| 14:37.17 | brlcad | this was before he even started down the M3 and java path, used to be a top-notch c++ programmer |
| 14:37.35 | d-lo | ...till java got him? :D |
| 14:38.11 | brlcad | nah, java just annoyed him slightly less -- just about every language frustrates him :) |
| 14:38.34 | d-lo | none good enough? |
| 14:38.48 | brlcad | pretty much |
| 14:51.05 | d-lo | interesting approach to it alright.... |
| 14:58.26 | d-lo | brlcad: in the << and >> operator overloads that deal with std::strings, do you know why he had the 'string length' parameter variable? aka, WID_8, WID_16, WID_32, etc. Whats that for efficiency? |
| 14:58.47 | d-lo | Whats == was |
| 15:09.34 | brlcad | glancing through it, yes -- I think the point was to store the length with only exactly as many bytes as it needs |
| 15:09.58 | brlcad | almost undoubtedly, that was for space efficiency |
| 15:10.39 | brlcad | so if the length was only 58 chars, it used one byte -- if it was 588 chars long it used two bytes -- if it was 58888 chars long, it used three bytes, etc |
| 15:11.29 | d-lo | actually, it looks like it switched on a preset width, set at instantiation of the object.... neat :) |
| 15:12.02 | brlcad | at one point, bytebag was part of a larger effort to rewrite librt's I/O layer in C++ -- where it has a lot of performance requirements to even do as well as what it does now |
| 15:12.45 | brlcad | that's just initialization |
| 15:12.52 | brlcad | look for the "this stupid function" comments |
| 15:13.26 | brlcad | if you were packing a string, you had to set the width of your bytebag |
| 15:13.58 | brlcad | that's undoubtedly about where things were a work in progress -- didn't actually have any strings being packed |
| 15:14.22 | d-lo | was thinking about an optimized byte array concept a few weeks back. Need to write it down and play with it sometime. |
| 15:14.53 | d-lo | lol , yeah, I saw that 'stupid function' :D |
| 15:15.00 | d-lo | i love comical comments. |
| 15:16.25 | brlcad | libbu has a "variable length buffer" vlb set of routines that might be useful for packing binary arrays of data without having to manage memory (there's a similar stl and boost interface to such as well) |
| 15:18.17 | d-lo | it does seem like the actual storage part of bytebag is a re-invented wheel.... i was just thinking of that very thing. |
| 15:18.32 | d-lo | does vlb store *only* bytes? |
| 15:18.46 | brlcad | opposed to what else? |
| 15:19.14 | brlcad | you pass it a pointer and a length, it puts that many bytes into an array that is automatically grown as needed |
| 15:19.21 | d-lo | as opposed to all the other data types. Maybe I worded my question poorly. |
| 15:19.43 | brlcad | I wouldn't use it for serialization by itself |
| 15:20.06 | brlcad | it could be the memory management portion of something that does, though, for example |
| 15:20.39 | brlcad | not suggesting using that in particular, just wanted you to be aware of it since it's related |
| 15:21.11 | brlcad | you have the benefit of working in C++ where the default stl data containers are available to you, some of which are outstanding |
| 15:21.17 | d-lo | right, I was thinking of: a) revamping the how the bytes are stored inside a ByteBag, b) building similar << >> overloads on top of a vlb, or c) replacing the byte storage in a ByteBag with a vlb. |
| 15:21.24 | d-lo | ponders. |
| 15:21.25 | brlcad | bytebag was written before stl was prevalent |
| 15:22.32 | d-lo | also looking at some ByteInputStream and ByteOutputStream implementations I found. |
| 15:22.55 | clock_ | What exercise do you do for biceps brachii? |
| 15:23.55 | brlcad | clock_: everything around them, especially your tris and shoulders |
| 15:25.33 | *** join/#brlcad Elrohir (n=kvirc@p5B14FBE1.dip.t-dialin.net) | |
| 15:38.12 | brlcad | d-lo: using std::vector or std::string for the memory management would probably be how I'd approach it if needed, but then I'd probably just use it first too so I could evaluate the baseline/current behavior and performance with it in place |
| 15:41.00 | d-lo | brlcad: are you gonna make the 1300? |
| 15:41.05 | brlcad | the itch to change the code because you can look under the hood and see ways to make it better is pretty strong, I'm sure .. but must fight those urges :) |
| 15:41.13 | brlcad | d-lo: of course |
| 15:41.35 | d-lo | lol. |
| 15:41.43 | d-lo | must... fight.... urges..... :) |
| 15:42.09 | d-lo | well, its actually stemmed from looking at how to gut the exception throwing. |
| 15:42.13 | brlcad | that's the problem with some of the "fun" code .. it's fun because it's actually kinda easy |
| 15:42.48 | d-lo | there is a check for bytesRead >= bytesFilled that throws an EmptyError |
| 15:43.02 | brlcad | that was part of my point yesterday, no so much what you were doing, but more that that sort of code takes up the same amount of time but is very often (very) short-lived code too |
| 15:43.57 | brlcad | there's harder code to be written for certain :) |
| 15:45.07 | d-lo | which led me to see there were two 'postions' being tracked.... which begged the question 'how could that be done easier?' |
| 15:45.14 | d-lo | so, here i am :) |
| 15:45.41 | brlcad | exceptions are supposed to be exceptional too, could just ignore them, or rip them all out too |
| 15:46.01 | brlcad | make them asserts |
| 15:47.15 | brlcad | a failure in serialization isn't something that should happen outside of a bug that creeps in, hard failure wouldn't be unwarranted |
| 15:47.57 | PrezKennedy | hey brlcad, what sort of recliner did you get? |
| 15:48.45 | d-lo | brlcad: righto, thats another thing I was looking for: failure modes. I don't really see too much of a danger with bytebag |
| 15:48.54 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: a rock-solid snazzy leather one |
| 15:56.56 | d-lo | heh http://www.wikihow.com/Turn-an-Oversized-T-Shirt-Into-a-Hot-Mini-Dress |
| 16:05.01 | d-lo | how would I 'include' headers/source from the brlcad module into rt^3 without duplicating files? |
| 16:05.14 | d-lo | or is the answer simpler that I am making it out to be? |
| 16:18.30 | *** join/#brlcad SWPadnos (n=Me@dsl107.esjtvtli.sover.net) | |
| 17:06.49 | brlcad | d-lo: you should assume it's all installed, so you use it like you'd use stl headers or libpng headers/libs |
| 17:07.20 | d-lo | alrighty. what about compliation testing then? |
| 17:07.27 | brlcad | e.g. source file/header might just #include "bu.h", use some libbu routine |
| 17:07.55 | brlcad | that then implies you need headers search paths to find the header and a lib search paths to find -lbu |
| 17:08.17 | brlcad | which is all configure.ac's job and decls in the Makefile.am files |
| 17:08.36 | brlcad | there is a brlcad-config binary that reports the cppflags and ldflags |
| 17:08.57 | brlcad | e.g. brlcad-config --libs bu |
| 17:09.30 | brlcad | and brlcad-config --cflags bu |
| 17:09.58 | brlcad | there are other things you can ask for from brlcad-config (and if things aren't right there, they should get fixed -- that's infrequently tested internally) |
| 17:10.10 | brlcad | should all be right though |
| 17:10.51 | d-lo | okie. thanks! |
| 17:26.05 | kanzure_ | I don't know why I'm making this harder than it is; I just want to plot a spiral made out of the pipe primitive. So when I plot the points, it's always telling me that the points are wrong because of the bend radius being too small - so I increase the bend radius, but then the points are out of alignment. So I change the points by some factor of 10, and then the points are too close, or too far, etc. Any suggestions? I'm just plotting wi |
| 17:26.44 | kanzure_ | and by plotting I mean I'm generating the "p x y z" commands, I'm not aware of internal plotting functions beyond scripting. |
| 17:28.09 | d-lo | kanzure_: what *exactly* is the error message you get that is about 'bend radius being too small' ? |
| 17:30.59 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33400 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libtclcad/ged_obj.c: When refreshing the display, temporarily turn off the zbuffer IF the framebuffer is active AND the zbuffer is on. This fixes the problem of having the wireframe partially bleed through into the rendered image. |
| 17:44.13 | kanzure_ | d-lo: Bend radii (2.40603e+09mm) at ( 18577.5 -71662.6 -4.81201e+09 ) and (2.40603e+09mm) at ( 18577.5 -71662.6 4.81209e+09 ) are too large |
| 17:44.16 | kanzure_ | for pipe segment between ( 18577.5 -71662.6 -4.81201e+09 ) and ( 18577.5 -71662.6 4.81209e+09 ) |
| 17:44.19 | kanzure_ | last segment ( 18577.5 -71662.6 4.81209e+09 ) to ( -2827.43 3.11624e-12 0 ) is too short to allow |
| 17:44.22 | kanzure_ | bend radius of 2.40603e+09mm |
| 17:44.24 | kanzure_ | and on and on for the 1k points that I'm plotting |
| 17:44.53 | d-lo | okay, thats actually telling you that your bend radius is too large, not too small. |
| 17:45.07 | d-lo | is the pipe of a constant diameter from end to end? |
| 17:46.36 | d-lo | if it is, then my suggestion is to set the overall pipe bend radius to 1/2 of the outer diameter. |
| 17:46.51 | d-lo | it will not look like a spiral yet. |
| 17:47.20 | d-lo | once all your points are in the correct position, start bumping up the bend radius for the whole pipe untill it starts to give you errors. |
| 17:47.38 | d-lo | apologizes for his bad spelling :) |
| 17:48.30 | d-lo | well, off to a meeting :/ |
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| 21:10.04 | *** join/#brlcad IriX64 (n=IriX64@bas2-sudbury98-1177879116.dsl.bell.ca) | |
| 21:16.28 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/workmode.png <--- the hippo at work :) |
| 21:41.54 | *** join/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.35) | |
| 21:43.24 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/eLuXlY18.html <---- been fighting this for a while, any idea whats wrong here? |
| 21:43.55 | IriX64 | thats in librt |
| 21:44.04 | IriX64 | comb.exe |
| 21:44.34 | sporty__ | IriX64: i saw this page, don't know |
| 21:49.21 | sporty__ | IriX64: you can forget about this particular broblem and model another models |
| 21:50.05 | sporty__ | maybe, those restrictions for ms w. os ? Brl-cad has some restrictions in there |
| 22:03.57 | *** part/#brlcad sporty__ (n=sporty_@217.118.79.35) | |
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| 23:49.25 | Ralith | brlcad: you around? |
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| 02:39.54 | mafm_ | night |
| 02:57.04 | starseeker | is intrigued by the "DocuPen" scanner |
| 03:05.48 | starseeker | can't figure out if it can do 8xN scans where N > 11 |
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| 03:37.47 | starseeker | Hmm, apparently the manufacturing quality sorta sucks |
| 03:45.25 | starseeker | grrr - this is insane |
| 03:45.59 | starseeker | HP creates one decent handheld 10 years ago, discontinues it, and I don't see a successor product except for this "DocuPen" |
| 03:46.50 | starseeker | begins to suspect they don't want to hurt their $20000 wide format scanner markets by introducing something else that can viably scan them |
| 04:02.32 | starseeker | meh - even if the DocuPen were OK, it has no Linux support |
| 04:25.09 | starseeker | Ah, thought so - old Mustek scanner was non feeder |
| 04:31.01 | starseeker | Logitech too |
| 04:31.11 | starseeker | astonishing everyone abandoned them |
| 04:31.31 | starseeker | with optical mouse technology you could track where your scanner is relative to a large page |
| 04:32.48 | starseeker | eyes Logitech Scanman but doubts he can get it hooked to a modern laptop |
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| 06:49.19 | brlcad | Ralith: not really, lot of distractions tonight |
| 06:50.25 | Ralith | kk |
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| 10:40.25 | mafm | hi |
| 11:57.23 | d-lo | hai mafm! hows the holidays/vacation going? |
| 11:59.21 | mafm | busy packing/unpacking and working in my project |
| 11:59.24 | mafm | otherwise all right :) |
| 11:59.29 | mafm | and you? |
| 12:07.44 | d-lo | busy busy. Family visiting soon, work deadlines, etc. |
| 12:07.52 | d-lo | but generally good. |
| 12:15.27 | d-lo | get that new job lined up? I can't remember if you said you had or not. |
| 14:15.40 | mafm | lining up |
| 14:15.47 | mafm | in fact I had to chose between two |
| 14:16.00 | mafm | maybe I start in one and end up in another in a few months :) |
| 14:16.12 | mafm | but yes, a bit of rest in the meantime :) |
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| 17:41.56 | d-lo | rather quiet today... |
| 17:42.16 | brlcad | everyone is apparently busy coding |
| 17:42.40 | brlcad | (slaps knee) |
| 17:42.45 | d-lo | wants what brlcad is on :D |
| 17:43.55 | brlcad | squeals with glee as the bot wanders around cleaning |
| 17:44.21 | d-lo | lol, so I take it you like it? |
| 17:49.33 | brlcad | yep :) |
| 17:50.29 | brlcad | only issue thusfar is it having trouble getting onto a thick area rug I got, bumps into it like a wall unless it approaches from an angle |
| 17:51.46 | brlcad | next project: attach a wireless webcam to it |
| 17:52.09 | d-lo | nice :) |
| 17:57.03 | d-lo | brlcad: make a little ramp for the bot and see if it can understand a 'one-sided' wall :) |
| 17:57.29 | brlcad | it has a cliff sensor |
| 17:57.41 | brlcad | to prevent it from flying down stairs |
| 17:58.12 | d-lo | so.... the ramp would be a 'door' and the area rug would be another 'room'..... neat :) |
| 17:58.48 | brlcad | ah, you mean for getting past my problem? |
| 17:58.52 | clock_ | brlcad: yeah with skateboard it's the same |
| 17:59.28 | d-lo | brlcad: yuppers. I am curious about how adaptive a roomba is.. |
| 17:59.36 | clock_ | Is it equipped with AS (Artificial Stupidity)? |
| 18:00.22 | brlcad | d-lo: not really adaptive, you can tell it uses a fairly simple FSM |
| 18:00.45 | brlcad | with the carpet, it actually hits a wall sensor on the front that presses a lever in |
| 18:00.55 | brlcad | because the carpet is about .5" thick |
| 18:01.38 | brlcad | so the stop is more mechanical -- if I can ramp it up slightly, it won't press the bar in |
| 18:02.00 | brlcad | but doing that without looking like ass will be a little tricky |
| 18:02.33 | d-lo | put 22"'s on it. That should get the clearence :D |
| 18:02.44 | d-lo | and it would look dope yo. |
| 18:03.34 | d-lo | heh, someone has www.pimpmyroomba.com registered lol |
| 18:04.06 | brlcad | http://hackingroomba.com ;) |
| 18:04.37 | brlcad | ooh, a roomba painter.. that could be fun in the basement |
| 18:05.55 | clock_ | the Electrolux Trilobite is supposed to have more advanced algorithm with room mapping |
| 18:07.13 | clock_ | The easiest way to create a robot that can map a room is... find a women and wait 9 months |
| 18:07.43 | brlcad | i'm pretty sure there's a step missing in there |
| 18:07.44 | d-lo | clock_: You missed a critical step in that process that many many men have problems with :) |
| 18:09.46 | clock_ | After computer geeks figure out how to make artificial intelligence in robots |
| 18:09.55 | clock_ | I think the next step will be how to make social intelligence in geeks |
| 18:11.01 | d-lo | heh, well, with a girlfriend-bot, i dunno how important that second step will be to geeks anymore :/ |
| 18:11.47 | clock_ | With a reprap inside to create babies |
| 18:12.36 | d-lo | blinks. |
| 18:12.51 | d-lo | okay. this went Matrix quickly didn't it. |
| 18:14.04 | d-lo | bah. its 78 in Orlando :/ |
| 18:14.05 | clock_ | I wonder where homosexuality comes from |
| 18:14.12 | d-lo | is mildly jealous. |
| 18:14.19 | clock_ | Meybe it's a forgotten debug testing routine from the development |
| 18:14.25 | d-lo | now there's a topic I won't touch. |
| 18:14.57 | brlcad | clock_: san francisco so I've heard |
| 18:15.04 | d-lo | lol |
| 18:15.25 | clock_ | brlcad: :D |
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| 19:46.46 | DanielFalck | brlcad: could you point me to some documentation on how to use the sketch and extrude commands? the wiki just shows a little info on get and put |
| 19:47.15 | DanielFalck | I'm learning the basics of mged and the manual seems to show these commands as experimental |
| 19:54.38 | brlcad | DanielFalck: they sort of are in a way just because the editing interfaces on sketches is rather poor |
| 19:56.31 | brlcad | they're also often generally just not a favored modeling practice since it's based around the traditional 2D approach |
| 19:58.11 | brlcad | probably easier is to see an example, http://brlcad.org/tmp/sketch.g |
| 19:58.23 | brlcad | there is one sketch and one extrude in that file |
| 19:59.24 | brlcad | if you edit that existing sketch, you should see the sketch editor where you can make edits and see how it affects the resulting shape |
| 20:02.32 | DanielFalck | what I plan on doing is converting shapes in a dxf file in sketched shapes and extrude them |
| 20:02.50 | DanielFalck | into |
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| 20:05.41 | DanielFalck | thanks |
| 20:05.53 | brlcad | so you run dxf-g, it should create a sketch for you if it's a 2D entity we recognize |
| 20:06.25 | brlcad | then you create an extrude that uses it, the "in" command is probably the easiest to start with (just type "in", it's interactive) |
| 20:07.53 | DanielFalck | great |
| 20:08.18 | DanielFalck | V =vertex |
| 20:08.21 | DanielFalck | H= height |
| 20:08.34 | DanielFalck | A =? |
| 20:08.39 | DanielFalck | B = ? |
| 20:08.56 | DanielFalck | K = ? |
| 20:09.10 | DanielFalck | I see u_dir, v_dir when listing |
| 20:09.53 | brlcad | k is unused, ignore it |
| 20:10.12 | brlcad | a and b are orientation scaling vectors |
| 20:10.22 | DanielFalck | ok, thanks |
| 20:10.54 | brlcad | usually easiest to just make them 0 1 0 and 1 0 0 so that the sketch is just oriented in the x/y plane |
| 20:11.09 | brlcad | where 1 is whatever scaling factor size you want to make it |
| 20:11.22 | DanielFalck | how can I skip K - when I hit enter it persists |
| 20:11.31 | brlcad | 0 |
| 20:11.33 | brlcad | 1 |
| 20:11.35 | brlcad | whatever |
| 20:11.39 | DanielFalck | ok |
| 20:11.46 | DanielFalck | that worked |
| 20:11.47 | DanielFalck | thanks |
| 20:13.15 | DanielFalck | so in theory, I should be able to use brlcad in batch mode with my own scripts and convert a friendly dxf file to a sketch, extrude it, do whatever operations I need to, then export to my other applications |
| 20:13.34 | DanielFalck | this will be very helpful |
| 20:13.39 | DanielFalck | thank you |
| 20:16.46 | DanielFalck | http://imagebin.org/33941 |
| 20:21.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33401 10/brlcad/trunk/ (5 files in 5 dirs): |
| 20:21.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: this has come up several times in the past. remove the 'in' command prompting |
| 20:21.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: for a seemingly mysterious 'k' option. the option was for a keypoint parameter |
| 20:21.10 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: that was never utilized. since this is technically an experimental primitive, |
| 20:21.11 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: it doesn't need to go through deprecation but it probably should still be stored |
| 20:21.13 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: in the .g since it's been around for so long. |
| 20:23.31 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33402 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: someone(tm) should clean up extrude dbio when we break proto for v6 |
| 20:23.45 | brlcad | DanielFalck: yeah, that's the basic idea that should work |
| 20:24.04 | brlcad | mind you, the dxf->sketch path isn't heavily tested -- let me know how that works out |
| 20:24.49 | DanielFalck | ok, will do |
| 20:26.11 | brlcad | DanielFalck: that's a really curious image -- did you modify the sketch.g I gave you or something? |
| 20:27.04 | brlcad | it's the right shape, but it's extruded too much |
| 20:27.51 | DanielFalck | brlcad: I typed in 0 1 0 and 1 0 0 for a and b |
| 20:28.07 | brlcad | ahh, you recreated the extrude |
| 20:28.12 | DanielFalck | and I extruded it myself |
| 20:28.21 | brlcad | gotcha |
| 20:28.24 | DanielFalck | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:28.57 | brlcad | just making sure the extrude didn't export to stl/dxf/whatever with a bad vertical scaling or something.. :) |
| 20:30.53 | DanielFalck | I would like to model screw threads at some point. Is that something that I should try to do with brlcad (after I learn more)? |
| 20:31.35 | DanielFalck | with a lot of rotating/translating |
| 20:37.01 | brlcad | clock actually has some nice threaded bolts that he scripted a while back |
| 20:37.15 | DanielFalck | cool |
| 20:37.46 | brlcad | took forever to raytrace and even longer to tessellate to a polygonal format, but it actually worked |
| 20:38.04 | DanielFalck | I don't see him here. does he show up here much? |
| 20:38.48 | brlcad | ~seen clock_ |
| 20:38.50 | ibot | clock_ <n=clock@84-72-91-240.dclient.hispeed.ch> was last seen on IRC in channel #brlcad, 2h 23m 25s ago, saying: 'brlcad: :D'. |
| 20:39.07 | DanielFalck | ok thanks |
| 20:39.24 | DanielFalck | I'll watch for him |
| 20:39.42 | brlcad | he's usually here, probably went to take a nap |
| 20:43.23 | brlcad | ugh, it's on one horribly asslow net connection, but you can see pics of it here: http://ronja.twibright.com/3d/hardware_4.png |
| 20:43.41 | DanielFalck | nice |
| 20:44.04 | brlcad | [1-6] are other images |
| 20:45.01 | brlcad | basically tranlated torus at an angle makes a nice cutout |
| 20:46.55 | DanielFalck | thanks. I found the source file |
| 20:49.37 | DanielFalck | very nice |
| 20:58.55 | DanielFalck | he used a truncated general cone |
| 21:01.26 | brlcad | ah, I vaguely remember that |
| 21:01.42 | brlcad | used a constructive approach instead of carving/subtracting |
| 21:02.25 | DanielFalck | so, I plan on using the bash terminal more than anything and I'm getting along pretty well using mged in -c mode |
| 21:02.37 | DanielFalck | I can list out his components pretty easily |
| 21:02.42 | brlcad | one of the best features of mged ;) |
| 21:02.53 | DanielFalck | with a "mged -c hardware.g l hex6_3_6.9.s" |
| 21:03.16 | DanielFalck | I was reading your SGI script |
| 21:03.21 | DanielFalck | pretty nice stuff |
| 21:03.36 | brlcad | i even use that for interactive stuff, but the downside is you don't get tab-completion |
| 21:04.05 | brlcad | tried to show several of the scripting methods in there |
| 21:04.37 | DanielFalck | I'm not a bash scripter, but I am starting to understand a little of it |
| 21:04.52 | DanielFalck | I mostly just play with it |
| 21:05.05 | brlcad | sh scripting is pretty simple |
| 21:05.10 | brlcad | there's so much you can't do ;) |
| 21:05.24 | brlcad | so it confines you to just a few basic syntactic structures |
| 21:05.32 | DanielFalck | I'm a CAD jockey at work. I play with python at home |
| 21:05.59 | DanielFalck | so I'm just getting dangerous : ) |
| 21:06.16 | DanielFalck | "erase your harddrive in 5 easy steps " : ) |
| 21:06.55 | brlcad | hm, I should have renamed i and j "long" and "short" or something |
| 21:07.09 | brlcad | 5 easy steps?? |
| 21:07.11 | brlcad | it only takes one :) |
| 21:07.19 | DanielFalck | that's true |
| 21:07.23 | DanielFalck | one command |
| 21:08.12 | brlcad | sudo rm -rf / or sudo cat /dev/random > /dev/hda1 come to mind ;) |
| 21:08.24 | brlcad | or "fdisk" |
| 21:08.38 | jonored | Any particular reason mged -c doesn't get tab completion? (I've probably asked before...) |
| 21:09.29 | brlcad | jonored: mged -c should have tab completion |
| 21:09.43 | brlcad | running mged -c file.g some_command doesn't .. because mged isn't running |
| 21:10.06 | DanielFalck | you just can't tab complete something inside it |
| 21:10.16 | jonored | ...Right. Apparently it's just my install being broken. |
| 21:10.38 | DanielFalck | what are you typing in exactly? |
| 21:10.38 | brlcad | jonored: ehm, what version? |
| 21:13.02 | jonored | I was probably remembering something from a previous install that had other glitches anyways. It works now... |
| 21:17.40 | jonored | 7.14.0 and it works fine... although is tesselation of pipes supposed to be working? |
| 21:19.20 | jonored | g-stl sort of thing? |
| 21:27.28 | brlcad | yes, pipes should tessellate |
| 21:28.03 | brlcad | tessellation in general is a bit of a hard problem, though -- it's not robust depending on the numerics |
| 21:33.19 | jonored | *nod*. Would self-intersection be likely to break things? mged is actually crashing when I try to do E on this object, but I also don't trust that I've got a functional install - I'm building it through an ebuild I don't entirely trust not to mess things up. |
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| 22:01.37 | DanielFalck | brlcad: could you give me a lesson on how to import a sketch into a *.g file using the mged -c classic mode ? thanks |
| 22:01.51 | DanielFalck | or even in mged graphical mode |
| 22:07.15 | brlcad | DanielFalck: yeah, but I'm right about to head out the door, have to be probably later today or tomorrow |
| 22:07.25 | DanielFalck | ok no problem |
| 22:07.34 | DanielFalck | I'll study the wiki more |
| 22:08.04 | brlcad | you can play with importing a sketch using that .g I gave you |
| 22:08.11 | DanielFalck | ok thanks |
| 22:08.12 | brlcad | run mged -c sketch.g get sketch |
| 22:08.19 | DanielFalck | ok |
| 22:08.21 | brlcad | then reverse that with put |
| 22:08.29 | brlcad | bit of reverse-engineering |
| 22:08.31 | DanielFalck | thanks |
| 22:08.42 | brlcad | but basically there are codes for each segment type for the sketch and their values |
| 22:09.54 | brlcad | jonored: certainly shouldn't but possibly could |
| 22:10.09 | brlcad | crashing during E is a problem that should be happening |
| 22:10.21 | brlcad | er, shouldn't :) |
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| 23:46.10 | PrezKennedy | unplugs Axman6's connection |
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| 00:11.25 | ``Erik | heh, I didn't know there was a crash after you do E O.o someone alert the ravers! |
| 00:11.33 | ``Erik | happyhour? damnit |
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| 01:40.38 | ``Erik | wow, he's as bad as me :D |
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| 02:23.20 | mafm | night |
| 02:25.31 | Ralith | Axman6: fix your net :P |
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| 03:25.03 | n8r0x | is there a .deb for the latest brlcad? |
| 03:25.13 | n8r0x | i looked. |
| 03:26.13 | Ralith | n8r0x: what distro are you using? |
| 03:26.29 | n8r0x | debian |
| 03:27.52 | Ralith | weird, looks like you're right |
| 03:28.39 | Ralith | you can always build from source |
| 03:28.53 | Ralith | surprised we don't have a .deb release anywhere obvious |
| 03:28.54 | n8r0x | i tried. |
| 03:28.58 | n8r0x | but i don't get mged. |
| 03:29.08 | Ralith | what did you do to build from source? |
| 03:29.22 | n8r0x | ./configure ; make; make install ; |
| 03:29.45 | Ralith | n8r0x: is your environment set up correctly? |
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| 03:30.02 | n8r0x | what do i need it set to? |
| 03:30.08 | n8r0x | i know where brlcad's directory is ... |
| 03:30.08 | Ralith | set what to? |
| 03:30.12 | n8r0x | /usr/brlcad ... |
| 03:30.22 | n8r0x | but there's no mged in that directory... |
| 03:30.28 | Ralith | of course not |
| 03:30.37 | n8r0x | or is there a new way of running brlcad? |
| 03:30.41 | Ralith | no |
| 03:30.54 | Ralith | here's what I have in my .profile |
| 03:32.00 | Ralith | export BRLCAD_ROOT=/usr/local/brlcad |
| 03:32.00 | Ralith | export PATH="$BRLCAD_ROOT/bin:$PATH" |
| 03:32.00 | Ralith | export MANPATH="$BRLCAD_ROOT/man:/usr/local/man:/usr/share/man" |
| 03:32.00 | Ralith | export ITCL_PATH=$BRLCAD_ROOT/lib/itcl3.4 |
| 03:32.00 | Ralith | export ITK_PATH=$BRLCAD_ROOT/lib/itk3.4 |
| 03:32.05 | Ralith | you will need to change BRLCAD_ROOT, of course |
| 03:32.58 | n8r0x | are you not using debian? |
| 03:33.51 | Ralith | I don't believe that is relevant. |
| 03:34.14 | Ralith | mged should be in /usr/brlcad/bin/ for you |
| 03:34.43 | n8r0x | i know it's not. i'm curious. |
| 03:34.48 | Ralith | kk |
| 03:34.51 | Ralith | I'm on FreeBSD |
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| 03:35.23 | n8r0x | that's great. is there a port or a pkg for it? |
| 03:35.33 | Ralith | yeah |
| 03:36.15 | n8r0x | n8@paranix:/usr/brlcad/bin$ ls *mg* |
| 03:36.16 | n8r0x | asc-nmg comgeom-g g-nmg nmg-bot nmg-rib nmg-sgp |
| 03:36.18 | n8r0x | that's what i've got. |
| 03:36.26 | Ralith | weird |
| 03:36.27 | n8r0x | mged is simply not there. |
| 03:36.35 | Ralith | are you sure there weren't any errors when you compiled? |
| 03:36.54 | n8r0x | ... checking ... |
| 03:37.00 | Ralith | there's a lot more than that that has 'mg' in it, mged aside |
| 03:37.03 | Ralith | you're missing quite a bit |
| 03:38.33 | n8r0x | all i need are the sources right? |
| 03:38.49 | Ralith | assuming you have all of the sources, yes |
| 03:39.05 | n8r0x | there's just one .bz2 file... |
| 03:39.07 | n8r0x | that's what i got. |
| 03:39.19 | Ralith | where'd you get it from? |
| 03:39.27 | n8r0x | sourceforge |
| 03:39.40 | Ralith | link? |
| 03:40.12 | Ralith | http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=105292&package_id=113368 is what you want |
| 03:40.27 | n8r0x | http://brlcad.org/d/download |
| 03:40.36 | n8r0x | and then i clicked on linux. |
| 03:40.45 | Ralith | that's not sources |
| 03:40.55 | Ralith | you want to click on 'source' |
| 03:41.15 | n8r0x | well i was getting to that. |
| 03:41.28 | n8r0x | and then i noticed there were no 32bit bits... |
| 03:41.34 | n8r0x | so i switched to sources. |
| 03:41.36 | n8r0x | and here i am. |
| 03:41.39 | Ralith | 'k |
| 03:41.43 | n8r0x | no x11 support, config says. |
| 03:42.10 | Ralith | you probably don't have all the -dev packages you need installed |
| 03:45.01 | Ralith | n8r0x: that solve your problem? |
| 03:46.32 | n8r0x | no. i have to do something else, i imagine. |
| 03:48.14 | Ralith | like what? |
| 03:48.27 | Ralith | just install xlib-dev or w/e debian calls it and see how far that gets you. |
| 03:48.34 | n8r0x | ah. |
| 03:48.59 | Ralith | (why binary-based distros never seem to install headers by default I'll never understand) |
| 03:52.02 | n8r0x | ... installing. |
| 03:53.14 | n8r0x | configure: WARNING: X11 support is enabled but the Xi library was not found. |
| 03:53.19 | n8r0x | that's the problem :( |
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| 03:57.13 | n8r0x | i normally use freebsd btw. |
| 03:57.34 | n8r0x | so 7-14.0 is in ports or pkgs? |
| 04:02.02 | Ralith | it's a little bit behind |
| 04:02.04 | Ralith | I compiled from source |
| 04:02.09 | Ralith | by hand, that is |
| 04:02.18 | Ralith | then again, could be it's been updated since my latest ports sync |
| 04:02.24 | Ralith | n8r0x: you can install Xi pretty easily I'm sure |
| 04:02.25 | Ralith | bbs. |
| 04:04.26 | n8r0x | this is bizzre. |
| 04:04.33 | n8r0x | *. now it's failing. |
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| 04:22.49 | n8r0x | what precisely is Xi, Ralith? |
| 04:22.58 | Ralith | no idea |
| 04:23.19 | n8r0x | bombardier.c:36:16: error: tk.h: No such file or directory |
| 04:23.22 | n8r0x | bah. it's bombing. |
| 04:23.55 | Ralith | like I said |
| 04:23.59 | Ralith | you need all the -dev packages |
| 04:24.05 | n8r0x | oh. |
| 04:24.09 | Ralith | :P |
| 04:24.13 | n8r0x | how do i know what i'm missing? |
| 04:24.20 | n8r0x | i already installed xlib-dev. |
| 04:24.25 | Ralith | look up the dependencies |
| 04:24.55 | Ralith | then install all the corresponding dev packages |
| 04:24.55 | n8r0x | bah. i'm surprised there isn't a 32bit .deb for it at all. |
| 04:27.13 | n8r0x | i think i know what may be wrong. |
| 04:27.16 | n8r0x | this is etch... |
| 04:27.37 | n8r0x | and the current version of brlcad is interested in lenny. |
| 04:27.41 | Ralith | unlikely |
| 04:27.52 | Ralith | brl-cad is very good at compiling on just about any system |
| 04:27.56 | Ralith | assuming you have all the deps |
| 04:28.10 | n8r0x | is there a list somewhere? |
| 04:28.17 | n8r0x | i've been relying on the error messages. |
| 04:31.25 | Ralith | look at configure's output for starters |
| 07:30.23 | starseeker | gets 1/10th through the final pdf build of the Mark VIII handbook, and decides sleep is now in order... |
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| 12:33.59 | mafm | hi |
| 12:35.58 | Ralith | hey |
| 12:36.17 | Ralith | mafm: I was wondering -- is there a reason you didn't hook the new GUI's command line up to a TCL interpreter? |
| 12:42.38 | mafm | because I don't know much about TCL, for once |
| 12:43.07 | mafm | it just didn't occur to me |
| 12:43.11 | mafm | :) |
| 12:43.55 | Ralith | kk |
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| 14:07.50 | brlcad | moin d_rossberg |
| 14:08.36 | brlcad | Ralith: the goal for the new modeler is to be able to have pluggable interpreters |
| 14:10.11 | brlcad | sitting on top of the generalized command interface, bind through either via a swig-style interface or manually hook in the four or so that would be nice to have from the start (tcl, posix shell, python, lisp) |
| 14:12.14 | ``Erik | ruby? lua? perl? |
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| 14:21.38 | d_rossberg | brlcad: good morning |
| 14:23.12 | brlcad | ml? tcsh? scheme? java? php? |
| 14:24.11 | brlcad | there are good reasons for lots of languages, but in-order, the highest return on investment is to work on those four in that order first .. |
| 14:25.00 | brlcad | if they're done, it conceivably should be all set up to hook in most languages then because it will cover interactive and non-interactive, procedural functional and object-based |
| 14:26.40 | ``Erik | *shrug* perhaps :) |
| 14:27.04 | ``Erik | last time I threw out a survey, perl was very high on the list of what people wanted, but that was many years ago |
| 14:27.57 | ``Erik | notes that lithp ith teh aweshome becauthe it doeth all three of thothe paradigmth O:-) |
| 14:28.28 | ``Erik | I'm still a bit freaked out about dynamically redefining classes on live data with CLOS |
| 14:31.45 | ``Erik | helpdesk sucks, this is day #2 that they're just not answering their phone |
| 14:33.06 | archivist | helpdesk and xmas is an oxymoron |
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| 14:58.47 | brlcad | doing those first doesn't mean !perl |
| 15:00.40 | brlcad | or any other language for that matter -- if someone wanted to work on their favorite language X, so be it -- just not what our priority should be on to implement first |
| 15:01.32 | brlcad | tcl and shell because that's our existing interface/userbase/knowledgebase, and it unifies our two command-lines |
| 15:03.07 | brlcad | python to get a fairly modern OO lang and (more importantly) it leverages the blender scripting userbase |
| 15:03.54 | brlcad | lisp is mostly a leverage on the autocad userbase since that's their scripting layer |
| 15:04.43 | brlcad | from there, it's mostly language zealotry or more obscure justifications for anything else -- those four have the biggest impact potential |
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| 19:13.18 | ``Erik | hum |
| 19:13.52 | ``Erik | richard was in asking questions that pose an interesting scenario that may need to be addressed |
| 19:15.26 | ``Erik | ptr = malloc(zomfghuge); if(ptr) dograndthings(ptr) else /* ohs noes, little memory available */ dolotsoflittlethings(ptr); |
| 19:15.55 | ``Erik | s/malloc/bu_malloc/ uh oh, no way dolotsoflittlethings() is ever reached, no graceful recovery, pandas are sad all over |
| 19:16.20 | ``Erik | I recommended using regular malloc carefully and commenting on the decision to him, but it may be a valid things to look at in libbu? |
| 19:20.11 | ``Erik | (plus, mentioned mmap to him, we'll see what happens *mwahahaha*) |
| 19:30.11 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33403 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/mged.c: If fail to open an existing database, reset dbip and material head before returning. |
| 20:22.48 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03r_weiss * r33404 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/tedit.c: ws |
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| 21:42.00 | brlcad | ``Erik: bu_malloc has a graceful recovery path, you BU_SETJMP |
| 21:42.22 | ``Erik | hrm, from inside of bomb? |
| 21:42.39 | brlcad | no, in your code before any code that might bomb (like bu_malloc) |
| 21:42.59 | ``Erik | ah, in bu_exit |
| 21:43.13 | ``Erik | was looking for longjump |
| 21:43.22 | ``Erik | I'll walk around the corner and let him know |
| 21:44.02 | brlcad | if (BU_SETJUMP) { BU_UNSETJUMP; dolotsoflittlethings(); } bu_malloc_or_else_stuff(); |
| 21:45.18 | brlcad | the code will jump to the BU_SETJUMP position so usually have an if/else, and do recovery in the if-section and work in the else-section |
| 21:45.38 | brlcad | most of the converters do this already, see for examples |
| 21:45.53 | brlcad | since the nmg routines throw bombs left and right as part of their normal operations |
| 21:47.32 | brlcad | mmap() is probably still a better way, or working in a stream fashion so you never have more than a little bit in memory at a time |
| 21:49.31 | brlcad | bu_bomb() calls longjmp() if BU_SETJUMP is set |
| 21:50.58 | ``Erik | he claims he needs to make many passes of the data |
| 21:52.07 | ``Erik | bu_exit() calls longjmp, actually, but *shrug* |
| 21:54.58 | brlcad | er, no it doesn't.. |
| 21:55.11 | brlcad | at least not directly |
| 21:56.51 | brlcad | src/libbu/bomb.c .. bu_exit() is the tiny func at the bottom, line 199, no longjmp() |
| 22:00.30 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33405 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libbu/bomb.c: why do we bother to init the vls in bu_exit() if we might not use it |
| 22:06.45 | ``Erik | oh, my bad, heh, saw the macro fu, thought that was it, but it's over on 118 |
| 22:07.55 | ``Erik | wonders if we need bu_mmap() to wrap the winderz CreateFileMapping/MapViewOfFile charlie foxtrot |
| 22:12.29 | brlcad | this guy seems to have some wrappers, http://www.genesys-e.de/jwalter/mix4win.htm |
| 22:13.32 | brlcad | but yeah, doesn't use either of those two -- Map |
| 22:13.42 | brlcad | MapViewOfFile is probably the way to go |
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| 22:56.04 | Ralith | brlcad, so, using SWiG to bind all the editing functions? |
| 00:01.03 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33406 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/ (Makefile.am human.c): Stub in a procdb for the purpose of creating human-type models - right now the idea is to serve as a framework where work can proceed - no actual geometry creation takes place yet. |
| 01:51.22 | mafm | night |
| 04:41.24 | brlcad | starseeker: memory leak on the vls |
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| 05:52.16 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33407 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/human.c: Free vls strings once we're done with them in human.c |
| 05:53.20 | starseeker | brlcad: See if this looks like an improvement on text readibility for the Mark VIII article: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/MarkVIII/MarkVIII_Rock_Island.pdf |
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| 06:10.20 | brlcad | starseeker: not particularly |
| 06:10.34 | brlcad | it's worse in some places and worse in others |
| 06:11.39 | brlcad | the per-letter errors are pretty drastic |
| 06:14.20 | brlcad | you can see a nice comparison here, http://brlcad.org/tmp/compare.png |
| 06:15.29 | brlcad | overall, obviously darker but words like "weigh" and "when" there are noticably worse |
| 06:18.01 | brlcad | and you still have a vls memory leak in there |
| 06:28.04 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33408 10/brlcad/trunk/src/proc-db/human.c: Free the vls string in the help function. |
| 06:28.20 | starseeker | brlcad: Any suggestions for algorithms that can be used to enhance text? |
| 06:59.07 | starseeker | I'm trying various edge detection routines, but none will produce error-free results by the nature of the input data |
| 07:15.50 | starseeker | tries thresholding + Gaussian blur to coax faint pixels into the limelight... |
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| 13:40.10 | brlcad | starseeker: for that data, probably a mix of localized fuzzy (i.e. magic wand) selection and color curve (mostly constract) enhancement |
| 13:55.55 | brlcad | oh nice, the smart shapen filter in PS does a pretty decent job by itself |
| 16:18.54 | DanielFalck | brlcad: is there any way to create 'pipes' with brlcad? I think there is something related to creating wires/pipes from reading the source, but I haven't seen the docs on it. thanks |
| 16:19.38 | DanielFalck | I want to be able to produce elbows that are tangent to straight pipes |
| 18:04.45 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 18:04.46 | brlcad | DanielFalck: yes, and it's even called the 'pipe' primitive ;) |
| 18:05.07 | brlcad | there's a mini-tutorial in the Principles of Effective Modeling doc on the website |
| 18:06.01 | csanyipal | Hi, again, a small problem with rytracing on Debian GNU/Linux Etch system with BRL-CAD version Release 7.14.1 |
| 18:08.31 | csanyipal | I have selected Underly option in Raytracing Control Panel and when click on Raytrace button I can't see the wireframe of the shapes2.r in the Lesson 4 in the tutorial Introduction_to_MGED.pdf (34 page). |
| 18:13.44 | brlcad | howdy csanyipal |
| 18:14.05 | brlcad | csanyipal: we were just talking about the underlay/overlay bug yesterday |
| 18:14.26 | brlcad | it's been there for a while, was just recently fixed in archer but not in mged yet |
| 18:14.45 | brlcad | csanyipal: Misc menu, turn on the Z option |
| 18:15.09 | brlcad | and maybe toggle lighting, it's dependent on which of those are on/off |
| 18:15.55 | csanyipal | ok, when I turn off Misc / Z option, I can see the green wireframe. Thanks! |
| 18:16.04 | brlcad | sure ;) |
| 18:31.26 | DanielFalck | brlcad: thanks- found the document and section on pipe |
| 19:35.33 | DanielFalck | brlcad: sorry for the next question: are there any examples showing actual use of pipe command with actual points and radius' given? the 'effective modelling' doc give theory, but I can't find any examples. |
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| 19:36.04 | DanielFalck | using the gui, one seems to have no way of editing parameters, that I can see |
| 19:52.08 | DanielFalck | I'm using "put {p1} pipe V0 { 0 0 -1000 } O0 500 I0 125 R0 500 V1 { 0 0 1000 } O1 500 I1 12 |
| 19:52.08 | DanielFalck | 5 R1 500 |
| 19:52.08 | DanielFalck | " |
| 19:52.13 | DanielFalck | and it works |
| 19:52.26 | DanielFalck | but - is there a simpler way? via command line |
| 21:18.24 | brlcad | DanielFalck: parameters can generally be specified via the 'p' command |
| 21:19.11 | brlcad | you could use the 'in' command |
| 21:19.42 | brlcad | you could also create a pipe and then use the sed command to edit the pipe, and combinations of push "menu option" coupled with 'p' commands to add/set values |
| 21:33.46 | DanielFalck | brlcad: thank you |
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| 22:19.16 | csanyipal | so long! |
| 22:19.22 | brlcad | cya! |
| 22:19.22 | *** part/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
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| 22:53.14 | starseeker | raises eyebrows - the Google tesseract engine did a decent OCR on page 84 of the handbook |
| 23:18.23 | starseeker | not perfect, but ok |
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| 23:59.05 | sporty_ | PrezKennedy: i still want to marry 'em!! |
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| 01:37.02 | starseeker | Hmm, this is interesting: http://www.discover.uottawa.ca/~qchen/my_papers/master_thesis.pdf |
| 03:21.42 | brlcad | starseeker: did you see the sharpen comparison? (can you read psd's?) |
| 04:06.57 | starseeker | brlcad: I saw the comparison image you put up on bz |
| 04:08.03 | starseeker | er brlcad.org rather |
| 04:09.32 | starseeker | Does Gimp have anything like Photoshop's intelligent sharpen? |
| 06:32.58 | *** join/#brlcad CIA-6 (n=CIA@208.69.182.149) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] | |
| 08:37.57 | starseeker | brlcad: Or there's the good old brute force manual solution: http://bzflag.bz/~starseeker/MarkVIII/Rock_Island_transcript.pdf |
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| 17:11.27 | brlcad | starseeker: I think manual is the way to go if hardbound is the end goal ;) |
| 17:11.29 | brlcad | looks great |
| 17:20.39 | brlcad | otherwise, this looks like it's doing a similar algorithm via manual steps: http://www.gimp.org/tutorials/Smart_Sharpening/ |
| 17:25.03 | jonored | Seems like it should only be a bit of scheme work to make that into automatic... |
| 17:32.41 | brlcad | ah, and looks like he redid it with a little fewer steps: http://www.gimpguru.org/Tutorials/SmartSharpening2/ |
| 17:36.25 | brlcad | yeah, script-fu or python-fu should do the trick to tie it together into an automation |
| 18:10.44 | DanielFalck | brlcad: fyi- I am happily making coils of pipe in brlcad this morning. It's the little things in life .... |
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| 20:26.51 | brlcad | DanielFalck: hehe, totally understand ;) |
| 20:27.48 | DanielFalck | brlcad: here's another question for you: is it possible to extrude a different closed shape along a path, similar to 'pipe' |
| 20:28.11 | DanielFalck | like a triangle to make a thread form? |
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| 20:31.21 | brlcad | ahh, alas, no -- there was a summer of code project to implement exactly that but it wasn't completed |
| 20:31.42 | brlcad | the project involved implementing revolve and sweep, they only got through most of revolve |
| 20:31.43 | DanielFalck | ok, no problem |
| 20:32.07 | DanielFalck | so we can't revolve a profile yet either? |
| 20:32.38 | brlcad | no, revolves are mostly complete -- there are a few loose ends still but most of it is done |
| 20:33.16 | DanielFalck | that's good news. I'll be using a lot of 'revolve' commands- I do a lot of turning on cnc lathes |
| 20:33.48 | brlcad | the biggest part of revolve that wasn't completed was support for bezier curves -- right now it's limited to line segments and arcs iirc |
| 20:34.10 | DanielFalck | well that's perfect for me- I only need lines and arcs for what I do |
| 20:34.21 | DanielFalck | can you give me a little lesson on trying it out? |
| 20:34.31 | DanielFalck | I compiled svn this week |
| 20:35.25 | brlcad | have you made an extrude yet? |
| 20:35.32 | brlcad | making a revolve isn't much diferent |
| 20:35.44 | DanielFalck | oh yes, got that working |
| 20:35.57 | DanielFalck | thanks for all the help , by the way |
| 20:44.49 | brlcad | so with revolve, you make a sketch -- ideally one that is a right-contour of your shape with positive values -- then create a revolve that positions and uses that sketch with an angle of revolution (see the 'in' command) |
| 20:50.22 | DanielFalck | so is the command 'in rev1 revolve' etc... ? |
| 20:57.29 | DanielFalck | brlcad: what is the 'start plane' in revolve? thanks |
| 21:04.48 | DanielFalck | ok, got it to work |
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| 00:53.25 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/fqubIR96.html <--- outta my league here, i don't parle` cpp too well. |
| 00:54.03 | IriX64 | used ./configure (svn as of half an hour ago) |
| 01:01.40 | *** join/#brlcad novakyu (i=novakyu@lecont-156-003.Physics.Berkeley.EDU) | |
| 01:01.49 | novakyu | hi |
| 01:02.43 | novakyu | i have a question about converting from BRL-CAD to a format that can be opened in other 3D CAD programs like SolidWorks and Unigraphics |
| 01:03.14 | novakyu | i've tried converting to a few formats like IGES and DXF, but none of them seem to work at all |
| 01:03.58 | novakyu | VRML produces something that does resemble the original drawing, but a lot of details are wrong and i get lets of web-like things. |
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| 01:55.48 | *** join/#brlcad Ralith (n=ralith@216.162.199.202) | |
| 03:15.59 | brlcad | novakyu: so what was your question? |
| 03:34.49 | DanielFalck | brlcad: I seem to be getting tessellation failure when trying to do a g-stl of a revolved part. Any ideas on how to trouble shoot it? thanks |
| 03:35.30 | DanielFalck | doing " g-stl -o prof2.stl prof2.g rev1" |
| 03:48.10 | novakyu | brlcad: i have a part drawn in BRL-CAD |
| 03:48.43 | novakyu | i want to send it to someone who uses Unigraphics or SolidWorks, but i can't seem to convert it to any compatible format |
| 03:49.26 | novakyu | i've tried some of the g-* converters (without special options), but doesn't really seem to work |
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| 04:53.37 | brlcad | DanielFalck: ah, I'm pretty sure tessellation of revolves has not been implemented yet |
| 04:53.59 | DanielFalck | that would be the reason. thanks. |
| 04:54.14 | brlcad | novakyu: yes, I understood that -- but you said you had a question -- what's the question? :) |
| 04:54.36 | brlcad | DanielFalck: hm, hadn't thought of that for the way you're using it.. |
| 04:54.44 | brlcad | kinda critical, my bad |
| 04:55.07 | brlcad | maybe someone(tm) will get ambitious over the next week |
| 04:55.12 | DanielFalck | is that one pretty involved to finish? |
| 04:55.19 | DanielFalck | ok |
| 04:55.20 | DanielFalck | thanks |
| 04:55.32 | brlcad | not really, no more complicated than extrude |
| 04:55.57 | DanielFalck | when you get a chance, try it out a bit and see what you think of the implementation |
| 04:56.13 | DanielFalck | seems a little weird to me or I'm probably missing something |
| 04:57.17 | brlcad | something in particular seems wierd? |
| 04:57.37 | DanielFalck | I don't really understand the vector in start plane part |
| 04:58.11 | DanielFalck | say I try and revolve a rectangle that has corners at 0 0 and 6,4 |
| 04:58.15 | DanielFalck | around the x axis |
| 04:58.29 | DanielFalck | I take it that the vertex is 0 0 0 |
| 04:58.38 | DanielFalck | and the revolve axis could be 1 0 0 |
| 04:59.39 | DanielFalck | I don't know what vector in start plane should be (without just screwing with it and coming up with stuff by trial and error) |
| 05:00.29 | DanielFalck | revolving around Y I used 0 0 0 0 1 0 and 0 0 1 to get what I thought it should do |
| 05:00.46 | DanielFalck | so I'm just clueless as usual : ) |
| 05:00.55 | brlcad | the vector in start plane sounds like the rotational orientation |
| 05:01.23 | DanielFalck | ok, as in what direction to rotate? |
| 05:01.34 | DanielFalck | cw or ccw depending on the vector |
| 05:01.36 | brlcad | so it's revolving around the x-axis in your example, but where is the starting point -- that'd be the vector |
| 05:02.00 | brlcad | no, the rotation is probably purely based on the revolve axis |
| 05:02.04 | brlcad | 1 0 0 vs -1 0 0 |
| 05:02.06 | DanielFalck | ok, so vector is starting point |
| 05:02.34 | brlcad | basically |
| 05:02.56 | brlcad | basically defining a starting "L" for the rotation |
| 05:03.04 | DanielFalck | ok |
| 05:03.17 | DanielFalck | 2 vectors then |
| 05:03.20 | brlcad | right |
| 05:03.30 | DanielFalck | ok, that makes sense now |
| 05:03.35 | DanielFalck | right hand rule |
| 05:03.43 | brlcad | better be :) |
| 05:04.16 | DanielFalck | another tesselation clue that I should have caught was that rendering doesn't work |
| 05:04.37 | DanielFalck | I just got some random pixels in the frame buffer |
| 05:04.53 | DanielFalck | so the mystery is solved |
| 05:05.03 | brlcad | hm, ray-tracing should be all working |
| 05:05.14 | brlcad | ray-tracing doesn't involve tessellation |
| 05:05.29 | brlcad | did the wireframe look right? |
| 05:05.30 | DanielFalck | actually, it worked in one case, but not in several others |
| 05:05.36 | DanielFalck | the wireframe was ok |
| 05:05.45 | DanielFalck | I can send you the offending file , if you want |
| 05:05.54 | brlcad | then probably some rendering bug -- you're probably the second person to try using it |
| 05:06.17 | DanielFalck | I generated a dxf of an odd shape and revolved it |
| 05:06.57 | brlcad | hm, yeah, post up/send your .g |
| 05:07.11 | DanielFalck | where at? |
| 05:07.14 | DanielFalck | email? |
| 05:07.49 | brlcad | mind filling out a tracker? it'll get more visibility |
| 05:07.56 | DanielFalck | ok, can do that |
| 05:08.01 | DanielFalck | I can attach the file |
| 05:08.11 | brlcad | https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=add&group_id=105292&atid=640802 |
| 05:08.12 | DanielFalck | I have a sourceforge account |
| 05:17.12 | DanielFalck | Ok, added to bugtracker |
| 05:19.47 | brlcad | cool, thanks |
| 05:25.52 | DanielFalck | should I put in a request for completion of tessellation, or is that already on your list? |
| 05:27.23 | novakyu | brlcad: oh, the question would be ... how do i convert from .g to a format that's readable by SolidWorks or Unigraphics? |
| 05:28.18 | brlcad | DanielFalck: can't ever hurt |
| 05:28.26 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33409 10/brlcad/trunk/TODO: implement tess() too |
| 05:28.43 | brlcad | there were a few remaining items, but tess specifically wasn't listed (but is now) |
| 05:30.50 | brlcad | novakyu: that would be one of the exporters that you've been trying to use, g-dxf g-iges g-obj g-stl g-x3d are all probably formats supported by those two |
| 05:31.22 | brlcad | the issue is more the geometric representation transformation that occurs when you go from our format to one of those |
| 05:32.08 | brlcad | ours predominantly uses implicit geometry (smooth surfaces) .. not a faceted geometry, so it has to try and tessellate the geometry to do the export |
| 05:32.57 | brlcad | tessellation is a rather tricky business -- very sensitive to tolerances, geometry, model size, geometry in use, operations, and proper region levels |
| 05:40.54 | DanielFalck | brlcad: sorry I put that in the wrong category. I'll be better next time. thanks |
| 05:43.29 | brlcad | no big deal :) |
| 05:43.38 | brlcad | thanks for taking the time |
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| 05:46.49 | brlcad | speak of the devil :) |
| 05:46.55 | pacman87 | just read the email ;) |
| 05:46.57 | brlcad | howdy pacman87 |
| 05:47.04 | pacman87 | can i get a copy of the *.g, too? |
| 05:47.12 | brlcad | pacman87: it's on the tracker |
| 05:47.28 | brlcad | see the one the image was moved to |
| 05:48.23 | pacman87 | ok, thanks |
| 05:48.36 | brlcad | https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=detail&aid=2457559&group_id=105292&atid=640805 and https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=detail&aid=2457527&group_id=105292&atid=640802 |
| 05:48.47 | brlcad | the bug is the latter |
| 05:50.02 | pacman87 | ok, thanks |
| 05:50.12 | pacman87 | this semester got pretty busy for me |
| 05:50.38 | pacman87 | last week of class i was up for 52 hours trying to finish everything |
| 05:50.52 | pacman87 | senior design project and another project |
| 05:51.04 | DanielFalck | what's your major? |
| 05:51.09 | pacman87 | ME/EE |
| 05:51.13 | DanielFalck | wow |
| 05:52.12 | pacman87 | well, time to check out a new copy of the source |
| 05:55.27 | brlcad | pacman87: sounds like it's been fun :) |
| 05:55.56 | pacman87 | for certain definitions of "fun" |
| 05:55.58 | brlcad | understandable that you've not been around -- that's a nice workload there |
| 05:56.09 | pacman87 | 17 hours, 2 labs all engr |
| 05:56.19 | pacman87 | including the sr. design project |
| 06:06.27 | pacman87 | compiling, time for bed now |
| 06:06.32 | pacman87 | back to work in the morning :) |
| 06:08.22 | novakyu | brlcad: so, you mean i have to play with options? |
| 07:08.24 | brlcad | novakyu: that's a start -- also making sure that the geometry you're trying to export is properly modeled |
| 07:42.29 | novakyu | so, here's some problem i've been having, then. |
| 07:43.47 | novakyu | when i have a region with two rcc shapes (at right angles, just touching or crossing each other) and i export that to VRML, i get webs between the two rods |
| 07:44.06 | novakyu | is this just an issue with VRML or does it sound like i'm doing something wrong? |
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| 09:44.30 | mafm | hi |
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| 12:57.51 | skitter | halo, halo! |
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| 14:37.30 | brlcad | howdy |
| 14:37.55 | DanielFalck | good morning brlcad |
| 14:38.00 | brlcad | mornin! |
| 14:40.16 | DanielFalck | your sgi script and the pipe command have given me an idea...maybe not a good one, but I think I could probably use brlcad to simulate machining away blocks of steel - ala cnc machine code |
| 14:40.33 | DanielFalck | kind of a 'backplot' of the cnc code |
| 14:41.22 | brlcad | that actually sounds pretty cool |
| 14:41.31 | DanielFalck | start with the block of steel and nibble away at it with a solid in the shape of the end mill/cutter |
| 14:42.35 | DanielFalck | with the revolve command it might even be possible to show a shape being turned |
| 14:42.36 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:42.55 | brlcad | that would look pretty interesting unevaluated |
| 14:43.15 | brlcad | and then the raytrace should show what evaluated will look like |
| 14:43.21 | DanielFalck | I'll keep learning brlcad and see what I can do |
| 14:43.32 | brlcad | presumably the cutter head would be the pipe diameter? |
| 14:43.39 | DanielFalck | yes. the final raytrace would be very realistic |
| 14:43.53 | DanielFalck | yes, the pipe dia |
| 14:43.59 | DanielFalck | for a ball end mill |
| 14:44.11 | brlcad | nods |
| 14:44.17 | DanielFalck | many many cylinders for a flat end mill |
| 14:44.31 | DanielFalck | cones for engraving v-bits |
| 14:45.23 | DanielFalck | looking at the sgi script, animation is surely possible- so that would be good too |
| 14:45.41 | DanielFalck | ah, the dreams I can come up with :) |
| 14:46.54 | brlcad | yeah, that would be awesome |
| 14:49.46 | DanielFalck | the 'help' command in mged is very good for me |
| 14:50.03 | DanielFalck | I'm exploring |
| 14:50.37 | brlcad | :) |
| 14:55.58 | starseeker | is freezing |
| 14:56.23 | starseeker | note to self - check weather report BEFORE heading to work |
| 15:22.53 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33410 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged.c: Modified ged_open() to acquire a new RT material head. |
| 15:25.31 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33411 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.c mged.c mged.h setup.c): Initial modifications to make libged commands available to MGED. The first test case exposes the gqa command. |
| 15:32.09 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33412 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am attr.xml): Add attr command Docbook, Janine and Cliff |
| 15:34.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33413 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (cmd.c mged.h setup.c): Exposing libged's tire command. |
| 15:38.04 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33414 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am autoview.xml): Add docbook autoview man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 15:42.44 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33415 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bev.xml): Add docbook bev man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 15:51.33 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33416 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/Makefile.am: Add docbook bot_condense man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 15:52.28 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33417 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/bot_condense.xml: Uh, yeah... add the man page too, not just the Makefile.am change... |
| 15:55.07 | brlcad | go go janine go :) |
| 15:56.30 | skitter | brlcad: who's janine? One of PrezKennedy's daughters? If yes, I want to marry her! |
| 15:57.13 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03brlcad * r33418 10/brlcad/trunk/NEWS: more conversion of documentation to docbook format, thx janine (and cliff via proxy) |
| 15:57.40 | brlcad | skitter: i'm sure she's somebody's daughter, but not PrezKennedy's |
| 15:58.05 | skitter | brlcad: is it a song? |
| 15:58.49 | brlcad | is what a song? |
| 15:58.51 | skitter | brlcad: "go janine, go, ...yeah! go janine go" - is it a song i don't know? |
| 15:59.19 | brlcad | it may be, but if it is, I don't know about that song either |
| 15:59.51 | skitter | brlcad: am i right to think i need to add final version of my work into the brl-cad's tracker - and wait untill someone can implement it? |
| 16:00.20 | skitter | brlcad: then what do your words "go go janine go" mean? |
| 16:00.55 | brlcad | you should add the final version of your work to the tracker and get one of us to review/commit it, yes |
| 16:01.16 | brlcad | those words express appreciation and excitement for the progress janine made this week |
| 16:01.34 | brlcad | see all the cia lines preceeding |
| 16:02.39 | brlcad | starseeker: and the news line isn't to diminish your efforts on that item -- just sharing the love |
| 16:03.11 | brlcad | welcome to add yourself in |
| 16:03.37 | brlcad | needs to get it tagged today before parker does too much damage :) |
| 16:05.02 | skitter | ok |
| 16:53.28 | starseeker | brlcad: np :-) |
| 17:01.29 | skitter | starseeker: or brlcad: am i right when i think if i say to my folks my account on sourceforge.net - they can see what have i up-loaded to open source projects? |
| 17:04.16 | brlcad | skitter: if they know the project, sure |
| 17:04.30 | brlcad | or from your account, you can certainly see your submissions on your user page |
| 17:05.41 | skitter | brlcad: but can this account show my 'feats' to random users? |
| 17:08.28 | skitter | i mean i can not browse rules and terms of sourceforge to-and-fro - can users "go" to, say, skitter-z-skater.sourceforge.net - and see what projects i am in and what exactly am i do for those projects. Have to save non-cheap internet traffic - that's a source of my lame questions :( |
| 17:08.42 | skitter | also, eyes pain from computer last time :( |
| 17:09.02 | brlcad | skitter: you can show your feats to random users by showing them your user page, otherwise the contributions are spread out across the projects you contribute to |
| 17:09.19 | brlcad | if they're all with one project, then yeah, it's pretty easily to get the summary from any of the tracker pages |
| 17:10.38 | skitter | brlcad: ok, i will keep it on my mind next time i will re-arrange my page. i have only 100 kb of plain text of mged cmd index - and i'm re-vising old xml files with aspell and try to smooth it. |
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| 18:54.31 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33419 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bot_decimate.xml): Add docbook bot_decimate man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 18:58.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33420 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bot_face_fuse.xml): Add docbook bot_face_fuse man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:03.36 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33421 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bot_face_sort.xml): Add docbook bot_face_sort man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:08.54 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33422 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am bot_vertex_fuse.xml): Add docbook bot_vertex_fuse man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:16.40 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33423 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am build_region.xml): Add docbook build_region man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:22.33 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33424 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am c.xml): Add docbook c man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 19:28.14 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33425 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am cat.xml): Add docbook cat man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 20:03.27 | *** join/#brlcad skitter (n=ubuntu@217.118.79.41) | |
| 20:04.18 | skitter | brlcad: where can i get GL/glu.h in ubuntu? there's somethng wrong - insatiable dependencies and so on... |
| 20:04.44 | skitter | *impossible dependencies* |
| 20:05.12 | skitter | ibot: glu.h |
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| 21:39.42 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33426 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am center.xml): Add docbook center man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 22:07.06 | yukonbob | tosses a wrench after skitter |
| 22:07.16 | yukonbob | gotsta stick around if you want an answer |
| 22:07.30 | archivist | he got answer next door |
| 22:07.51 | yukonbob | 667, the neighbour of the beast |
| 22:08.01 | archivist | he was loading EMC2 |
| 22:09.54 | yukonbob | ?"emc2" |
| 22:10.53 | yukonbob | eletro-magnetic colander ver. 2? |
| 22:11.56 | archivist | cnc control software http://www.linuxcnc.org |
| 22:12.50 | yukonbob | nice... |
| 22:20.44 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33427 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am color.xml): Add docbook color man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
| 22:24.35 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33428 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am comb_color.xml): Add docbook comb_color man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
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| 22:31.19 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33429 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am copyeval.xml): Add docbook copyeval man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
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| 22:35.23 | CIA-6 | BRL-CAD: 03starseeker * r33430 10/brlcad/trunk/doc/docbook/system/man1/en/ (Makefile.am copymat.xml): Add docbook copymat man page - conversion by Janine and Cliff |
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| 00:45.55 | mafm | night |
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| 10:28.46 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:55.05 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 13:57.50 | Axman6 | i love thew pace of this channel |
| 14:25.48 | PrezKennedyJR | in another two hours i can respond to that |
| 14:25.49 | PrezKennedyJR | :p |
| 14:44.37 | brlcad | Axman6: surges for several days on end, and then hours and hours of silence? :) |
| 14:44.56 | Axman6 | more the other way around, but yes :) |
| 14:45.18 | Axman6 | uh, pretend i said that in half an hour, ok? |
| 15:01.59 | brlcad | k ;) |
| 15:03.15 | Axman6 | so, any big brl-cad news? |
| 15:06.43 | brlcad | how about that we just had our open source anniversary and I plan to hold a bug fix and feature request competition? |
| 15:12.09 | Axman6 | which anniversary? |
| 15:12.59 | Axman6 | Feature request #1: new awesome maya photoshop like interface, that doesn't need the commandline at all! fuck yeah! |
| 15:13.54 | archivist | solid woksalike interface :) |
| 15:14.17 | Axman6 | pure mouse gesture interface! |
| 15:16.18 | brlcad | heh |
| 15:16.54 | brlcad | well for the competition, there will be something for folks that make a request, but they will have to be limited in scope to small incremental improvements |
| 15:17.03 | brlcad | something that can be done in less than two weeks |
| 15:17.27 | brlcad | but even the feature request submitter will get something iff someone else implements the idea |
| 15:17.39 | brlcad | (or more if they implement the idea) |
| 15:37.38 | brlcad | ideas are cheap, carefully thought out ideas are slightly more valuable, ideas that are detailed enough to be implementable are even more valuable, but ideas that are actually implemented is where the money is at ;) |
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| 19:24.30 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33431 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Exposing ged_view_update(). |
| 19:29.27 | CIA-33 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33432 10/brlcad/trunk/src/ (libged/ged.c libtclcad/ged_obj.c): Moved some initialization code for "struct ged_view" from libtclcad/ged_obj.c to libged/ged.c |
| 20:14.21 | *** join/#brlcad csanyipal (n=csanyipa@91.102.231.33) | |
| 20:15.58 | csanyipal | hello |
| 20:16.43 | csanyipal | BRL-CAD 7.14.1 |
| 20:17.26 | csanyipal | In MGED when I Create a shape, I get it in the Graphics Windows in Edit mode. Is it a normal behavior? |
| 20:17.46 | csanyipal | When I created it from the mneu |
| 20:17.51 | csanyipal | menu |
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| 22:39.33 | IriX64 | http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/JustCompiled.png |
| 22:43.46 | IriX64 | same url finished.png :) |
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| 05:38.24 | csanyipal | Hello! |
| 05:39.29 | pacman87 | good evening |
| 05:39.48 | csanyipal | Here is Morning. :) |
| 05:41.11 | csanyipal | I have BRL-CAD version 7.14.1 |
| 05:41.37 | csanyipal | When I create from menu a shape, I get the shape in Edit mode. Is this a normal behavior? |
| 05:44.32 | pacman87 | i just use 'in' from the command line window |
| 05:45.35 | csanyipal | ok but I'm translating the Introduction to MGED.pedf tutorial and I want to know.. |
| 05:45.45 | pacman87 | if you wait around for a few hours, you should get a response from someone more knowledgable |
| 05:45.46 | csanyipal | |
| 05:46.15 | *** join/#brlcad skitter (n=ubuntu@217.118.79.42) | |
| 05:46.53 | skitter | will it be possible to edit pages in wiki, in "~/ru/wiki" folder? |
| 05:49.22 | skitter | ...and to ratify the changes made by this wiki's user then? |
| 05:50.13 | csanyipal | I must go now in the school to work.. so long.. |
| 05:50.45 | skitter | if yes, i need to re-vise 60 or so commands, part of them could not be viewed thru wiki engine, i think. |
| 05:51.08 | brlcad | csanyipal: that is expected/normal behavior |
| 05:51.24 | csanyipal | brlcad: thanks! :) |
| 05:51.45 | skitter | csanyipal: try to imagine that female-teachers teach you particular study-cases & put their clothes off simultaneously - helps!!! |
| 05:52.03 | csanyipal | skitter: :) |
| 05:52.06 | brlcad | skitter: you question doesn't make sense |
| 05:52.16 | skitter | brlcad: ok, great. |
| 05:52.16 | brlcad | it's a wiki, so if you can edit it, you can edit it |
| 05:52.52 | brlcad | "~/ru/wiki" doesn't exist |
| 05:53.04 | skitter | brlcad: then i need to transfer the rest into the xml. but i will have to do it manually |
| 05:53.20 | skitter | brlcad: well, i meant... |
| 05:53.35 | brlcad | all of the docs are going to end up in docbook format, regardless of where they are now |
| 05:54.03 | brlcad | ideally we will eventually have a means to edit the docbook masters through the website somehow |
| 05:54.11 | brlcad | whether through the wiki or some other means |
| 05:54.21 | brlcad | so that editing can be bidirectional |
| 05:55.15 | skitter | brlcad: i have loaded bad pages into the tracker - can i delete them and upload the new ones, as "finally translated" and "these ru .sml need a syntax check" ?? |
| 05:58.45 | skitter | brlcad: what if docbook has two paragraphs and an <arg></arg> arguments between them? will the wiki engine determine the grammar and build the page rightly in this case? |
| 05:59.40 | skitter | ok, i see i can not delete them if i hadn't logged in when 've uploaded them... |
| 06:03.23 | brlcad | skitter: they're your tracker items, you can remove the files and/or add new ones or add more |
| 06:03.29 | brlcad | s/more/multiple/ |
| 06:03.39 | skitter | i think 1. i can not use programming to spread the text into the xml - and do it manually (more time, less healthy) 2. someone will modify xml - and i will check commands in wiki then (being able to edit 'source' xml in a right way by means of e.g. tracker). So i plan to upload the rest (it means whole work is finished) - and wait untill |
| 06:04.42 | brlcad | if it could be easily programmed into docbook/xml, it would have already been done |
| 06:05.20 | brlcad | the "right way" is in the svn revision control system, that's where the official versions reside (or will reside) |
| 06:05.35 | skitter | brlcad: yeah, the formula "s/more/multiple/" = "sexy / more / more then more" means the way software develops |
| 06:05.38 | skitter | :) |
| 06:06.08 | skitter | brlcad: where is a root of svn? |
| 06:06.53 | skitter | uh... i can speed up the work then! |
| 06:07.46 | brlcad | substitute / this / that / |
| 06:08.08 | brlcad | the root of svn .. is in our subversion repository |
| 06:08.10 | skitter | brlcad: your strange slang says nothing to me! |
| 06:08.22 | brlcad | it's not slang, it's basic regular expression |
| 06:08.24 | skitter | brlcad: and? |
| 06:08.57 | skitter | brlcad: basic regular expression for humans are "i love you" and so on... |
| 06:09.12 | skitter | brlcad.org/wiki/SVN - 9k ?? |
| 06:09.14 | brlcad | and people only get commit access after they show competency with the commit rules, patch submission/application processes, and general well-being integration with existing developers |
| 06:12.12 | yukonbob | waves in |
| 06:12.15 | yukonbob | hello, cadheads |
| 06:12.37 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob |
| 06:13.47 | yukonbob | brlcad: 8.5.6 released today... |
| 06:16.46 | skitter | no, previous upload wasn't under my account or failed. |
| 06:16.48 | yukonbob | ^--- tcl/tk, of course ;) |
| 06:17.23 | skitter | ok, reboot |
| 06:17.26 | *** part/#brlcad skitter (n=ubuntu@217.118.79.42) | |
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| 06:33.12 | skitter | brlcad: is this a trunk http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Upload ? |
| 06:33.36 | skitter | brlcad: or only through the sourceforge? |
| 06:44.51 | skitter | finally goes to fatty sourceforge |
| 06:47.37 | skitter | hucleberries fatty sourceforge at a day light ever! woring thru starseeker... wil have emailed him |
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| 07:05.18 | skitter | ok, quitting |
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| 08:37.31 | skitter | starseeker: final edition of the comands (lesser part) are in your e-mail box. Hope its syntax is good and all we need is just to turn wiki to quetion this files somewhere at the ~/ru folder on a server. |
| 08:39.45 | skitter | i said lesser because either those commands have left are tiny or my mged cmd index 7.10.2 isnt too new |
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| 10:47.34 | mafm | hi |
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| 13:27.49 | Axman6 | merry christmas from Aus cadheads :) |
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| 15:04.43 | brlcad | thx Axman6 |
| 15:25.34 | ``Erik | *readreadread* |
| 15:25.56 | ``Erik | wouldn't a flat end mill head in a straight line be subtracting an arb8, not a buttload of cylinders? |
| 15:27.27 | ``Erik | 668 would be the next door neighbor, 667 is across the street :D |
| 15:29.00 | ``Erik | notes that asking for a commit bit makes it take longer to get a commit bit |
| 15:29.22 | ``Erik | okie, all caught up, time to ignore ya'll for a few more days :D |
| 15:30.33 | brlcad | I don't think he even knew what he was asking for or implying |
| 15:31.20 | archivist | heh I think he does know |
| 15:32.09 | archivist | coming at it from a machinists view |
| 15:32.19 | brlcad | doubtful, asking if http://brlcad.org/wiki/Special:Upload is a trunk is silly, his complaints about sf.net are about simply loading the http pages |
| 15:33.15 | archivist | sees talking about different people |
| 15:38.54 | DanielFalck | ``Erik: yes you're right about the arb vs. a lot of cylinders |
| 16:04.22 | WhiteCalf | ahaha its the one day of the year my brother is working and im not |
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| 17:19.00 | playfulhotgirlis | "dbconcat database_file [prefix]" or "dbconcat [prefix] database_file" ?? what order of the arguments? |
| 17:21.06 | playfulhotgirlis | time |
| 17:22.26 | brlcad | dbconcat [-p|-s] file.g [prefix|suffix] |
| 17:36.54 | playfulhotgirlis | brlcad: sweet! |
| 17:56.07 | *** part/#brlcad playfulhotgirlis (n=ubuntu@217.118.79.39) | |
| 19:29.33 | mafm | bye |
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| 22:32.52 | Axman6 | now this has some interesting models for some adventurous brl-cad user to replicate: http://www.dimensions-math.org/Dim_regarder_E_E.htm |
| 22:41.37 | alex_joni | Axman6: those are some really cool animations |
| 22:42.04 | Axman6 | the whole series looks worth watching, i'm up to the 5th episode atm |
| 22:42.42 | alex_joni | just started with the 2nd |
| 22:43.55 | csanyipal | Hi, I try to make s model for the explanation of the azimuth in my translation of the "Introduction to MGED" tutorial. |
| 22:44.14 | csanyipal | I made a model for this purpose, it can see here: |
| 22:44.16 | csanyipal | http://s520.photobucket.com/albums/w327/csanyipal/?action=view¤t=2_Lecke_XY_sik_proba.jpg |
| 22:45.03 | csanyipal | I ask how can I make a shape that is on this picture abowe a curve arrow? |
| 23:23.08 | Axman6 | csanyipal: just curious, which language are you translating to, and is 'sik' plane in it? |
| 23:25.22 | csanyipal | It is in Hungarian and yes, sik is a plan. |
| 23:25.38 | csanyipal | this plane is an arb8 |
| 23:26.02 | csanyipal | 1 mm high |
| 23:26.09 | Axman6 | righto :) |
| 23:26.28 | Axman6 | it's been a long time since i've played with brl-cad actually. need to check it out again |
| 23:26.32 | Ralith | what happens if you intersect a true plane with a volume, anyway? |
| 23:26.40 | Ralith | (i.e. arb8 with only 4 unique coords) |
| 23:29.49 | csanyipal | Ralith: If I understand you correct, you get a plan that isn't an infinite plane. |
| 23:31.01 | Ralith | csanyipal, but what happens when you intersect that with a volume? |
| 23:31.48 | csanyipal | Ralith: theorethical, or in MGED? |
| 23:32.08 | Ralith | as rendered |
| 23:32.19 | Ralith | mged won't care |
| 23:32.55 | csanyipal | Ralith: first, I can't to create a plane in MGED.. |
| 23:33.02 | Ralith | yes you can |
| 23:33.07 | csanyipal | how? |
| 23:33.11 | Ralith | arb8 with all points on a plane |
| 23:33.34 | Ralith | iow a rectangular prism with one dimension = 0 |
| 23:33.35 | csanyipal | You mena an arb8 that hasn't a hight? |
| 23:33.43 | csanyipal | mean |
| 23:34.16 | Ralith | that is one example of the set of shapes I described. |
| 23:38.21 | csanyipal | So, to get a "curve cylinder" I must first to make a torus, and two planes and then with boolean regulars I must to get an intersect of these shapes? |
| 23:39.51 | csanyipal | Are there a simpler method for this? |
| 23:46.56 | Ralith | what's a "curve cylinder"? |
| 23:47.14 | Ralith | look at the mged quick reference sheet; there's lots of primitives that might be what you want |
| 23:50.32 | csanyipal | "curve cylinder" doesn't exist I just call it this way to explain somehow what kind of shape I need.. |
| 23:52.37 | csanyipal | This shape is on the picture in the "Introduction to MGED" tutorial at the page 18. |
| 23:53.02 | csanyipal | The "Azimuth, Elevation, and the xyz Coordinate System" picture |
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| 23:54.23 | csanyipal | this is the shape that represents the Azimuth on this picture |
| 00:11.20 | *** part/#brlcad misteriexous (n=ubuntu@217.118.79.39) | |
| 00:12.39 | csanyipal | so long |
| 00:34.55 | brlcad | there is also a "plane" primitive .. the "half" halfspace primitive will make an infinite plane |
| 01:10.06 | Ralith | brlcad, ah, cool. What happens when you try to intersect something with it? |
| 01:25.53 | brlcad | it does what you'd expect -- it's "half" of infinity, so if you intersect a vehicle with it, you'll get a cutting plane |
| 01:26.11 | Ralith | oh |
| 01:26.14 | Ralith | not the kind of plane I had in mind |
| 01:26.29 | brlcad | what did you have in mind? |
| 01:26.38 | brlcad | it's not infinitely thin |
| 01:26.53 | Ralith | infinitely thin was what I was going for |
| 01:26.57 | brlcad | ah |
| 01:27.10 | brlcad | solid modeling, everything has to have a thickness ;) |
| 01:27.17 | Ralith | that's what I thought |
| 01:28.10 | brlcad | it would be interesting/useful to have a user-specific non-zero thickness parameter, but then that wouldn't be a halfspace any longer unless they specified infinity |
| 01:28.35 | Ralith | nothing wrong with a rename. |
| 01:28.52 | brlcad | you can get the same effect with two halfspaces that overlap with whatever thickness |
| 01:29.02 | Ralith | thought that might work; neat |
| 01:29.37 | brlcad | it's not an optimized primitive, so depending on what you're doing -- you might be much better off using arb8's anyways |
| 01:29.47 | Ralith | optimized? |
| 01:30.23 | brlcad | it'll slow down a ray-trace rendering |
| 01:31.12 | Ralith | ah. |
| 01:31.58 | brlcad | most of the primitives are optimized, but not the way that one is implemented given how it extends to infinity -- every ray has to test against it |
| 01:32.31 | Ralith | seems pretty quick to test against, though |
| 01:32.37 | brlcad | so like if you wanted to chop an object in half, it'd usually be much faster to use a box instead of a half |
| 01:35.01 | Ralith | so I think we've discussed this before but I don't recall the details and I have more questions anyway; what is/will be the most effective way to get a 2D slice through an object with as little data loss as possible, for purposes such as g-code generation? |
| 01:35.56 | Ralith | the best I can come up with right now is make a very thin slice and do a orthographic render at very high from directly overhead, then fit splines to it. |
| 01:36.06 | Ralith | but that's really cheating. |
| 01:36.15 | Ralith | at very high resolution* |
| 01:45.04 | brlcad | that's a perfectly viable approach actually, not far off what some of the commercial engines do effectively |
| 01:45.40 | Ralith | yes, it would *work* |
| 01:46.14 | Ralith | but I'd feel so much better about a workflow that didn't deliberately drop information and then desperately try to reconstruct as much as possible |
| 01:46.49 | brlcad | naturally ;) |
| 01:47.24 | Ralith | not to mention the complexities and accuracy issues of path tracing algos in and of themselves. |
| 01:48.41 | brlcad | you could get that pretty accurate just because you'd have knowledge of object boundaries |
| 01:48.57 | brlcad | mostly limited by your sampling resolution, which could be pretty intense as needed |
| 01:49.03 | brlcad | but like you said, less than ideal |
| 01:49.50 | brlcad | the alternate approach requires brep support to be complete |
| 01:50.25 | brlcad | you'd request a brep outline for all objects and then project them onto a plane |
| 01:50.59 | Ralith | so is brep support something that's being evaluated, or even developed? |
| 01:51.22 | brlcad | it's the top-priority of the year, been under development for over a year now |
| 01:51.34 | Ralith | oo! |
| 01:51.37 | Ralith | encouraging! |
| 01:51.42 | brlcad | there's basic support in there already |
| 01:51.50 | Ralith | how far along would you say things are? |
| 01:51.54 | brlcad | some forms will even ray-trace correctly |
| 01:52.04 | Ralith | forms? |
| 01:52.29 | brlcad | different types of surface evaluations |
| 01:53.11 | brlcad | if you fire a ray at an object, do you get 1, 2, 3, 4, ... N intersections with the surface, when are you inside/outside, how to deal with numerical instability, etc |
| 01:53.30 | Ralith | ah. |
| 01:53.32 | brlcad | there are a lot of problems that need to be solved still, but this is being driven by several priorities |
| 01:53.40 | Ralith | great! |
| 01:53.41 | Ralith | :D |
| 01:54.02 | Ralith | this is one of the things I like about BRL-CAD |
| 01:54.14 | brlcad | the brep/nurbs work is the foudation of interactive (opengl) visualizations, step conversion support, and more |
| 01:54.41 | Ralith | as a project, it has a great tendency to already be working on all the really neat ideas that you generally don't see bandied about outside of theory. |
| 01:55.52 | Ralith | so that's how it relates to the tesselation stuff. Remembered you saying something about that last time this came up but didn't follow the connection. |
| 01:56.21 | Ralith | thanks for the info :) |
| 01:56.43 | brlcad | the same thing that would let us ask for a contour for projection onto a plane to get splines is basic to the brep form |
| 01:57.17 | brlcad | from there, you can easily tessellate as it (presuming we have implemented csg evaluation of brep-on-brep objects) |
| 01:57.36 | Ralith | what field of study most completely encompasses this sort of thing? |
| 01:57.48 | brlcad | http://brlcad.org/BRL-CAD_Priorities.png <-- bottom-left priority |
| 01:57.56 | Ralith | computational gemoetry? |
| 01:58.27 | brlcad | er, loosely/sorta/not-really |
| 01:58.48 | Ralith | didn't think so. |
| 01:59.03 | brlcad | it does and it doesn't -- CG covers some of the fundamental algorithms and generally assumes clean numerics |
| 02:00.05 | Ralith | 'clean numerics' meaning no loss of precision due to fp inaccuracies etc.? |
| 02:00.17 | brlcad | from there you can build up the more complicated algorithms, but without resorting to fixed-point arithmetic (and taking a massive performance penalty -- like two orders of magnitude) there are lots of practical implementation problems that still have to be addressed |
| 02:02.37 | Ralith | so *is* there such a thing as a formal field of study covering this sort of real-world implementation? |
| 02:02.58 | Ralith | (also: that poster is beautiful. Who put it together?) |
| 02:04.46 | brlcad | there's lots of work in the area of solid modeling research -- an acm conference dedicated to it as well as a few others |
| 02:05.50 | brlcad | there are just literally hundreds of algorithms and issues in any given CAD or solid modeling system, boundary structure evaluation just being a small set of them |
| 02:06.37 | Ralith | of course. |
| 02:09.26 | brlcad | oh, and I put that poster together |
| 02:09.59 | Ralith | nice! |
| 02:10.01 | Ralith | what'd you lay it out in? |
| 02:10.09 | brlcad | hm |
| 02:10.41 | brlcad | probably either Pages or InDesign, don't recall |
| 02:11.07 | Ralith | pages? |
| 02:11.38 | brlcad | it never went out to the list because it got a less than favorable review by one the editors at arl, said it was too confusing and too many words |
| 02:11.55 | Ralith | bah. |
| 02:12.01 | brlcad | http://www.apple.com/iwork/pages/ |
| 02:12.11 | Ralith | it's a technical subject. Walls of text are par for the course. |
| 02:13.26 | Ralith | unless it was supposed to be some sort of general-audience PR material, but I can't imagine what most of a general audience would want to do with BRL-CAD in the first place. |
| 02:16.32 | brlcad | audience was general user community, anyone that would care what our high-level roadmap looks like |
| 02:17.24 | brlcad | so they did have a little bit of a point, whether it matters for this was arguable, but it was enough to not send it out without thinking about reworking some parts |
| 02:21.40 | Ralith | ah well. |
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| 03:01.49 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/ushWLt28.html <---- 3 or 4 of these went by, do you know or care about them? |
| 03:04.00 | IriX64 | or is my compiler in error :) |
| 03:08.06 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/NItopl53.html <--- this too my compiler presented me with |
| 03:12.02 | IriX64 | sigh... i wish i'd never dropped out of special ed :) |
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| 10:09.14 | mafm | hi |
| 10:23.48 | csanyipal | hi |
| 10:25.11 | csanyipal | Ralith: when I create a plane as arb8 shape with zero hight, then I can't raytrace it, in the framebuffer it can't see. Why? |
| 10:26.23 | Ralith | csanyipal: as far as the raytracer is concerned, if it doesn't have volume, it doesn't exist. |
| 10:38.00 | csanyipal | Ralith: OK thanks! |
| 11:01.33 | Axman6 | ha, set brlcad to checkout about 12 hours ago... came home, it was asking me to if i want to accept the ssh key -_- |
| 11:02.19 | Axman6 | s/set brlcad to checkout/set svn to checkout brlcad |
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| 14:01.49 | brlcad | csanyipal: I was saying yesterday, there is an infinite-plane primitive -- it's the "half" halfspace primitive |
| 14:07.26 | csanyipal | brlcad: thank you, I find it, and tried it out. |
| 14:09.58 | csanyipal | Still I don't know how to create the shape that is on the picture "Azimuth, Elevation, and the xyz Coordinate System" in the tutorial "Volume II - Introduction to MGED" at page 18. |
| 14:12.10 | csanyipal | That shape shows the angle of the Azimuth. |
| 14:13.03 | brlcad | I modeled that, what would you like to know? |
| 14:13.21 | brlcad | it's a pretty simple shape |
| 14:24.08 | csanyipal | It's difficult to explain because of my "weak" English. |
| 14:26.15 | brlcad | I went to some intricate lengths to get exact cuts and no overlaps with very specific shapes in mind -- but the basic shape is that of a torus with arbs cutting off the portion I didn't want and a tgc on the end |
| 14:26.19 | csanyipal | The shape looks like a part of a torus and have in front a trc Truncated Right Cone |
| 14:26.37 | brlcad | basically |
| 14:27.05 | brlcad | it could be done a little more easily using a pipe, but I didn't know it back then |
| 14:27.20 | brlcad | one pipe with a tgc, no need for subtracted arbs |
| 14:28.25 | csanyipal | But can one bend a pipe? |
| 14:30.31 | csanyipal | And how to direct the tgc in the right direction? |
| 14:31.13 | brlcad | of course you can bend a pipe, that's what they consist of -- bend segments and straight segments |
| 14:31.33 | csanyipal | Aha, there is a bend point! |
| 14:31.49 | brlcad | trc's are the same as a tgc, just a specific subcase |
| 14:32.01 | csanyipal | I try the command in pipe.s pipe |
| 14:32.05 | brlcad | all the conics end up being a tgc as it's a general case |
| 14:32.23 | csanyipal | yes |
| 14:32.29 | brlcad | the tgc is specified with a point and a vector -- that puts it in the right direction |
| 14:33.10 | brlcad | there are just additional vectors for orienting and sizing the top ellipse and base ellipse caps |
| 14:33.27 | csanyipal | tgc has a Vertex and a high vector and radius of base and of top |
| 14:33.53 | brlcad | few more parameters |
| 14:34.18 | brlcad | sounds about right for the trc |
| 14:36.21 | csanyipal | I know that but when I want to give the values (x,y,z) for the high vector then .. OK, I'll try it out now. |
| 14:37.23 | csanyipal | thanks for the advice about pipe! |
| 14:37.30 | brlcad | start with something simple so you understand the shape, and turn on your model axes so you can see what direction is what |
| 14:37.55 | csanyipal | yes, I did that alreday.. |
| 14:38.01 | csanyipal | already |
| 14:38.26 | csanyipal | o |
| 14:38.28 | csanyipal | ok |
| 15:17.12 | csanyipal | brlcad: If you have i little time: I don't understand at pipe the points for the pipe and bend points |
| 15:18.03 | csanyipal | mged> in pipe.s pipe 2 0 0 0 0.1 1 100 100 0 0 0.1 1 50 |
| 15:18.41 | csanyipal | give to me a right pipe and not a bended pipe |
| 15:23.53 | csanyipal | brlcad: OK I find a tutorial for the pipe in the Volume III - Principles of Effective Modelling |
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| 22:19.30 | misteriexous | i have a grammar check languagetool.org + new java6.0 engine |
| 22:19.57 | misteriexous | (just want to know an exact time at ibot) |
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| 00:02.58 | mafm | night |
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| 10:48.18 | mafm | hi |
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| 15:16.35 | ``Erik | top level half royally screws the geometric tree |
| 15:16.45 | ``Erik | sssllloooowwww raytracing |
| 15:24.29 | ``Erik | I feel dirty for dorking with a linux machine, apparently redhat has something called 'yum', but I still feel dirty |
| 15:25.23 | ``Erik | bought punker an 'aspire one' leenewx subnotebook |
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| 19:40.36 | csanyipal | Hi |
| 19:41.05 | csanyipal | I need some advices about giving a bend radius for a pipe. |
| 19:41.30 | csanyipal | Here is the screenshot of the MGED's Graphics Window: |
| 19:41.32 | csanyipal | http://s520.photobucket.com/albums/w327/csanyipal/?action=view¤t=how2_bend_pipes1.jpg |
| 19:42.50 | csanyipal | This is in Top View. |
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| 21:06.18 | IriX64 | ``Erik... that pick problem is driving me snakey, http://www3.sympatico.ca/mario.dulisse2/mged.tar.bz2 if you want a peek |
| 22:21.41 | csanyipal | I have created a pipe with 2 endpoints. I want o give to pipe a bend at middle of the pipe. What to do to get a bend pipe? |
| 22:23.19 | csanyipal | I tried from Edit menu Set Pipe Bend but what to do next here? |
| 22:24.38 | csanyipal | Must I have a pipe with three points to get a bend pipe? |
| 22:25.35 | csanyipal | Or can I get a bend pipe with two endpoints pipe? |
| 22:27.36 | csanyipal | The bend points are virtual so I can't set any Bend point, isn't? |
| 22:29.08 | DanielFalck | I might be able to help... |
| 22:29.24 | DanielFalck | let me find a way of posting something |
| 22:29.50 | DanielFalck | I did an 'elbow' by making a pipe with 3 points |
| 22:30.14 | DanielFalck | I'm not sure how to dump output for you to see |
| 22:30.28 | DanielFalck | let me private im you |
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| 01:21.25 | mafm | bye |
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| 07:37.23 | csanyipal | Hi, |
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| 11:54.21 | mafm | hi |
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| 15:52.28 | csanyipal | Hi, how can I set the Key Point when I'm editing a shape? |
| 15:55.22 | csanyipal | I want to move a point in a pipe but how can I determine which point to be that for moving? |
| 16:05.57 | csanyipal | OK I find it.. |
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| 22:47.54 | csanyipal | Hi, just want to ask about editing pipe. |
| 22:48.37 | csanyipal | I selected a pipe and want to change the Point OD. |
| 22:49.31 | csanyipal | I selected from menu the "Set Point OD" and type the command "p 3". |
| 22:49.42 | csanyipal | Then I get an error message: |
| 22:49.53 | csanyipal | Error: A solid editor option not selected |
| 22:50.26 | csanyipal | Why get I this error message? |
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| 00:00.44 | IriX64 | is there a way to ensure installation of the tcl/tk lib distributed with the source? |
| 00:05.12 | IriX64 | http://rafb.net/p/32rctE14.html <--- i get this at startup |
| 00:11.48 | IriX64 | never mind, --enable-everything says itll build this time, thanks. |
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| 08:03.59 | csanyipal | Hi, I try to install BRL-CAD from SVN source on Debian GNU/Linux Etch system, but the installation fails at make command. |
| 08:04.50 | csanyipal | I get the error message: |
| 08:04.52 | csanyipal | dm-ogl.c:134: undefined reference to `ogl_interface' |
| 08:05.04 | csanyipal | dm-ogl.c:141: undefined reference to `_ogl_open_existing' |
| 08:05.16 | csanyipal | mged-dm-ogl.o: In function `Ogl_doevent': |
| 08:05.25 | csanyipal | dm-ogl.c:158: undefined reference to `glXMakeCurrent' |
| 08:05.28 | csanyipal | etc.. |
| 08:05.54 | csanyipal | I have installed nvidia driver with glx. |
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| 12:37.02 | csanyipal | wow! I delete the brlcad directory, download from SVN again, compiled and build brlcad, and get the working BRL-CAD with Archer too, with Tire Wizard and raytrace!! |
| 12:41.08 | csanyipal | But, in Archer there isn't tool to create a Pipe, only arb6, arb8, tgc, sphere, torus, but not a Pipe.. :( |
| 12:46.11 | csanyipal | but I can to make a pipe in the command line prompt. Thanks to the Developers! |
| 13:18.13 | *** join/#brlcad Axman6_ (n=Axman6@pdpc/supporter/student/Axman6) | |
| 13:46.45 | csanyipal | But there isn't an Archer Help!! |
| 14:11.03 | csanyipal | In Archer, how can I select for Edit a created shape? |
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| 15:59.27 | mafm | hi |
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| 18:09.21 | brlcad | csanyipal: still a bit of holiday delinquency going on -- sorry for all the lack of responses :) |
| 18:26.09 | csanyipal | brlcad: no problem.. |
| 18:27.16 | csanyipal | I see that Archer isn't working as I would expected, so I return to MGED.. |
| 18:29.24 | brlcad | yep, archer is far from fully functional, but definitely improving fast |
| 18:29.34 | brlcad | as portions of mged are migrated over to archer |
| 18:35.57 | brlcad | csanyipal: if you see problems with archer, you could send them to the brlcad-devel mailing list, get the attention of Bob .. it's his baby and wants to make it better |
| 18:36.43 | csanyipal | brlcad: OK |
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| 20:06.16 | csanyipal | I try to put some text into my model with command: |
| 20:06.44 | csanyipal | in Xchar.s ebm |
| 20:07.26 | csanyipal | and enter the name of the file.bmp, |
| 20:08.15 | csanyipal | width, height, and extrusion distance |
| 20:08.53 | csanyipal | but get in the model something that I can't to recognize as a X character. |
| 20:09.35 | brlcad | file.bmp is a windows bmp file? |
| 20:09.38 | csanyipal | yes |
| 20:09.49 | brlcad | the "bitmap" is an actual map of bit values, an old school unix file format, not bmp files |
| 20:09.51 | csanyipal | I made it with GIMP |
| 20:10.06 | csanyipal | aha |
| 20:11.27 | brlcad | save out a black and white image as png file, then run png-bw |
| 20:11.43 | csanyipal | OK |
| 20:11.46 | csanyipal | thanks |
| 20:11.53 | brlcad | that bw file should be the right input format iirc |
| 20:33.55 | csanyipal | brlcad: I tried that, but still can't get an ebm that looks like X character. |
| 20:36.18 | brlcad | then it's still not the right data |
| 20:36.45 | brlcad | ah, perhaps that bw's are 0-255, and it's literally looking for 0-1 values |
| 20:37.00 | brlcad | lemme check |
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| 20:42.56 | brlcad | csanyipal: try using this png, http://brlcad.org/tmp/primitives/ebmtitle.png |
| 20:43.02 | brlcad | it's 954x202 |
| 20:43.54 | brlcad | that's the png that was used as the starting point for the example primitives |
| 20:44.11 | brlcad | I don't have an install here, or I'd give it a try |
| 20:51.17 | brlcad | may need to run bwthresh 128 < file.bw > file2.bw |
| 20:52.32 | csanyipal | brlcad: thanks |
| 20:59.57 | brlcad | hm, looks like bw is right -- and it only cares if it's zero or non-zero for the hit/miss |
| 21:07.24 | csanyipal | I downloaded ebmtitle.png, run on it: png-bw ebmtitle.png > ebmtitle.bw |
| 21:08.40 | csanyipal | and run: bwthresh 128 < ebmtitle.bw > ebmtitle2.bw |
| 21:10.53 | csanyipal | then try in MGED |
| 21:11.04 | csanyipal | in Xchar.s ebm |
| 21:11.16 | csanyipal | enter the file path |
| 21:11.37 | csanyipal | Enter width of bit-map (number of cells): 10 |
| 21:11.45 | csanyipal | Enter height of bit-map (number of cells): 10 |
| 21:11.47 | csanyipal | Enter extrusion distance: 10 |
| 21:12.05 | csanyipal | but get nothing in the Graphics Window |
| 21:45.14 | csanyipal | I must go now. |
| 23:25.38 | *** join/#brlcad ries (n=ries@190.12.51.7) | |
| 23:26.15 | ries | Hey All, is brlcad a parametric solid modeler? |
| 23:34.07 | ries | Ooo never mind.... it doesn't seems to have a GUI |
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| 00:36.28 | elite01`bday | ries, there's mged |
| 00:36.38 | elite01`bday | and, uh, some new prototype gui, see topic |
| 00:36.45 | elite01`bday | i have no idea since i didn't use brlcad for quite some time |
| 00:38.30 | ries | elite01`bday: okey... I am looking for a free/cheap solid modeler with parametric capabilities |
| 00:38.32 | ries | that's how I found nlrcad |
| 00:38.55 | elite01`bday | no idea what you mean by parametric capabilities |
| 00:39.01 | elite01`bday | but i guess brlcad will do just fine :) |
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| 00:50.38 | Ralith | elite01`bday, parametric is things like 'sph1.s has a radius equal to the diameter of rcc1.s' |
| 00:50.52 | Ralith | afaik. |
| 00:52.28 | Ralith | ries, brlcad *does* have a GUI, it's just not very intuitive. |
| 00:52.41 | elite01`bday | oh, no idea then |
| 00:52.53 | ries | Ralith: I was reading one tutorial.... let me check the link... |
| 00:52.54 | Ralith | also, parametrics are very WIP to the point of being unsupported currently, I think. |
| 00:53.12 | ries | Ralith: what is WIP? |
| 00:53.16 | Ralith | work in progress |
| 00:53.21 | Ralith | ries, read the introduction to mged pdf available at brlcad.org |
| 00:54.12 | ries | Ralith: I looked at this one : http://brlcad.org/wiki/SGI_Cube |
| 00:54.18 | ries | But got scared by 'The Script' |
| 00:55.23 | Ralith | that's not a tutorial |
| 00:55.38 | Ralith | that's a demonstration of control through an external program |
| 00:55.39 | ries | hehehe I must have looked wrong.... |
| 00:55.46 | Ralith | read the pdf |
| 00:56.02 | ries | Ralith: I am currently building a CSS router (2440 x 1220 in size) |
| 00:56.12 | Ralith | a what |
| 00:56.14 | ries | could I use blrCAD be used to create designs? |
| 00:56.22 | ries | then 'some' other tool to make cut paths? |
| 00:56.30 | Ralith | you mean CNC? |
| 00:56.35 | ries | s/CSS router/CNC router/ |
| 00:56.39 | ries | yeaaa my bad... |
| 00:57.04 | Ralith | I know someone who's currently working on a program to generate toolpaths for additive rapid prototyping |
| 00:57.12 | Ralith | you might be able to adapt that for subtractive |
| 00:57.39 | Ralith | brlcad can also export STLs at a sacrifice of quality, which can then be fed into most other tools, like GCAM |
| 00:57.52 | Ralith | which will generate subtractive toolpaths |
| 00:58.00 | ries | I will give brlcad a shot... see how it works |
| 00:58.13 | Ralith | it's a lot of work to learn, and isn't the best for creating original designs yet |
| 00:58.46 | ries | Hmmmm ic.... |
| 00:58.55 | ries | how is brlcad used currently then? |
| 01:00.14 | louipc | gcam takes stl? |
| 01:02.47 | mafm | bye |
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| 03:52.01 | Ralith | louipc, no idea. |
| 03:52.21 | Ralith | I'm not really sure what gcam does at all |
| 05:57.03 | DanielFalck | pycam takes stl files and creates cnc toolpaths |
| 05:57.09 | DanielFalck | it's on sourceforge |
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| 12:51.21 | csanyipal | Hi, |
| 12:52.59 | csanyipal | I made a symple model of the xyz coordinate system using shapes as: rcc, trc, pipe |
| 12:53.47 | csanyipal | Working on it I think about that, that I wish to have in MGED a line shape. |
| 12:56.46 | csanyipal | But this line shape should be using only ashelpers, and after work is done, it sould be deleted. |
| 13:01.36 | csanyipal | I tried also to insert an ebm but with no success. Are there any tutorial, or documentation for ebm? |
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| 13:12.24 | mafm | hi |
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| 17:58.59 | PrezKennedy | pokes brlcad |
| 17:59.12 | PrezKennedy | how did i know youd be the first to see my invitation on there? :P |
| 19:32.03 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: beats me :) |
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| 00:00.32 | yukonbob_ | hi cadheads |
| 00:15.33 | brlcad | howdy yukonbob_ |
| 00:28.44 | mafm | quiet night, like the christmas son :) |
| 00:29.06 | mafm | song* |
| 00:32.47 | brlcad | :) |
| 00:52.07 | mafm | well, time to sleep |
| 00:52.08 | mafm | bye! |
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| 12:35.40 | csanyipal | Hi, how can I set my Country so if someone see my info thatn he can to see it? |
| 12:35.49 | csanyipal | sorry.. |
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| 13:03.24 | csanyipal | Hi, |
| 13:03.49 | csanyipal | I try to insert ebm in to the model with MGED. |
| 13:04.28 | csanyipal | I have an image saved from the GIMP as .xbm file |
| 13:05.38 | csanyipal | I saved it as X10 bit format. |
| 13:06.16 | csanyipal | I can to open this file with an editor and can to see there in the file numbers. |
| 13:07.23 | csanyipal | The numbers are eg.: 0xffff, 0x03ff, 0x7fff, etc. |
| 13:10.11 | *** join/#brlcad elite01 (n=omg@unaffiliated/elite01) | |
| 13:11.32 | csanyipal | When I type the following command at mged> prompt: in szoveg1.s ebm brl-cad.xbm 100 20 40 |
| 13:12.03 | csanyipal | I get only an arb8 shape and not a text: BRL-CAD. |
| 13:12.22 | csanyipal | Can anybody help me with this? |
| 13:29.20 | csanyipal | When I add in the abowe mentioned command the real bitmap width and hight than I get an error message: |
| 13:29.32 | csanyipal | rt_ebm_import() file 'brl-cad.xbm' is too short 101097 < 192708 |
| 13:29.32 | csanyipal | rt_db_external5_to_internal5(szoveg1.s): import failure |
| 13:29.32 | csanyipal | db_recurse() rt_db_get_internal(szoveg1.s) FAIL |
| 13:45.35 | mafm | bye |
| 13:54.21 | brlcad | csanyipal: set your country? |
| 13:55.05 | brlcad | if anyone really cares, a quick search on your IP indicates somewhere around/in Serbia .. you mean on irc or in mged? :) |
| 13:56.09 | brlcad | csanyipal: that's the same as I said before -- that's not the right file format, it's not an xbm (but that was a much better guess than a bmp) |
| 13:56.57 | brlcad | did you try using the sample png I gave you? try the png-bw on it? and try creating an ebm with that |
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| 15:28.48 | csanyipal | brlcad: for the country question: it's been posted here by my mistake. |
| 15:29.12 | csanyipal | brlcad: finally, I have success with ebm! :) |
| 15:31.07 | csanyipal | brlcad: I'm using the sample png You give me. Tried png-bw on it. Then tried creating an ebm with that.. |
| 15:31.31 | csanyipal | brlcad: and finally I have success. |
| 15:33.22 | csanyipal | brlcad: It seems to me that that I must to type the real width and the real hight of the png in the command for inserting ebm. |
| 15:44.43 | csanyipal | brlcad: well, I made a png image wit a X character, and image has white background and black foreground. |
| 15:45.22 | csanyipal | brlcad: with this png I get in MGED the X ebm, but also that X char is in an arb8. |
| 15:46.28 | csanyipal | brlcad: So it seems to me that that I must to edit this png in GIMP so I get the black background and white foreground and try with that png.. |
| 15:48.55 | brlcad | yes, the ebm has to match the image dimensions, not the 3D dimensions you want to end up with |
| 15:49.14 | csanyipal | brlcad: And finally, I get the X character as I wish!! |
| 15:49.19 | brlcad | great :) |
| 15:50.02 | brlcad | and yeah, values are zero->nothing, nonzero->geometry |
| 15:50.13 | csanyipal | brlcad: Thanks again!! |
| 15:50.38 | csanyipal | brlcad: aha, I understand now! |
| 15:52.52 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, i saw the picture of your car |
| 15:53.08 | PrezKennedy | freakin awesome, i think you need to come visit and take me for a ride! |
| 15:57.42 | brlcad | PrezKennedy: thanks, it is pretty sweet! |
| 15:58.36 | PrezKennedy | you should convince my dad to get one |
| 15:58.42 | brlcad | a bit tricky to get in and out of, but well worth the ride ;) |
| 15:59.19 | PrezKennedy | how high does the speedometer go? |
| 15:59.41 | brlcad | mm, 180 or something |
| 16:00.16 | brlcad | iirc, top speed is rated at 160 |
| 16:01.56 | PrezKennedy | i want one! |
| 16:02.12 | PrezKennedy | actually... i want a delorean, but id take one of those too |
| 16:02.13 | PrezKennedy | :p |
| 16:15.07 | brlcad | http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/3083/delorean1rh9.png |
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| 17:04.33 | PrezKennedy | brlcad, definitely |
| 17:07.00 | Axman6 | brlcad: got a link to a pic of your car? i'm curious now |
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| 20:18.31 | brlcad | Axman6: sure, http://brlcad.org/~sean/elle.jpg |
| 21:08.53 | ries2 | brlcad: that is a very nice color and good looking car you have there |
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| 21:32.39 | Ralith | brlcad, that's your car? Nice! |
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| 21:57.39 | csanyipal | I made a small tutorial for EBM and try to put it on brlcad/wiki. |
| 22:37.08 | csanyipal | I made it: http://brlcad.org/wiki/EBM#Inserting_ebm_in_MGED |
| 22:37.16 | csanyipal | What do you think about it? |
| 22:39.12 | brlcad | csanyipal: fantastic :) |
| 22:39.18 | brlcad | ries2: thanks |
| 22:39.18 | csanyipal | :) |
| 22:41.06 | brlcad | yeah, that looks really nice |
| 22:41.08 | ries2 | brlcad: if I may ask.. what brand is it?? |
| 22:41.14 | brlcad | ries2: Lotus |
| 22:41.21 | ries2 | smoke..... |
| 22:41.29 | ries2 | that's a really nice one.. |
| 22:41.33 | Ralith | never imagined you'd be the one to have a car like that |
| 22:41.44 | brlcad | Ralith: oh? :) |
| 22:42.10 | Ralith | has never associated technical people with ubercars |
| 22:42.13 | ries2 | brlcad: brlcad makes money??? :) |
| 22:42.17 | Ralith | hehe |
| 22:42.24 | Ralith | so it would seem. |
| 22:42.35 | brlcad | is a workaholic, loves to code |
| 22:42.45 | ries2 | hehehe good... you deserve it!!! |
| 22:42.55 | Ralith | well, nothing compares to an enjoyable well-paying job |
| 22:43.34 | brlcad | love what you do, find someone to pay you to do what you love, be one of the best at what you do .. makes a lot of things possible ;) |
| 22:43.52 | Ralith | I can only hope to do the same someday |
| 22:43.58 | brlcad | yeah, I'm not a gearhead to say the least .. all of my previous cars have been crap and I drive them into the ground |
| 22:45.22 | brlcad | but this car is a lot like code optimization, just got around to optimizing my transportation |
| 22:45.58 | ries2 | brlcad: I do the same... I have a car I like very much myself (A grand cherokee limited V8) |
| 22:46.15 | ries2 | a lotus here in Ecuador wouldn't do much joy here ... I wouldn't even get home with it !!!! |
| 22:47.05 | brlcad | jeje |
| 22:48.00 | ries2 | brlcad: you are spanish?? |
| 22:48.42 | brlcad | bilingual, de panam? |
| 22:49.50 | ries2 | ??? |
| 22:50.09 | ries2 | I am dutch, just happen to live in Ecuador |
| 22:50.23 | brlcad | ah, :) |
| 22:50.59 | brlcad | I'm not human, just happen to live on Earth |
| 22:52.17 | ries2 | that happens.... welcome on planet earth then... |
| 22:52.22 | brlcad | thx |
| 22:58.00 | csanyipal | I have the EBM tutorial in the DocBook.xml format now, but this page hasn't css page.. |
| 23:00.08 | csanyipal | If you think that that this tutorial is useful to include it in to a brl-cad release than I will send it.. |
| 23:00.45 | brlcad | csanyipal: absolutely -- little tutorials like that are gold |
| 23:01.09 | csanyipal | OK how to send it together with three images? |
| 23:01.20 | brlcad | sure |
| 23:02.38 | csanyipal | all together |
| 23:04.15 | Ralith | brlcad: I think his point was that it can't be fed to a web browser yet. |
| 23:15.39 | Twingy | PrezKennedy: http://js.cx/~justin/images/justin_bttf.jpg |
| 23:16.08 | PrezKennedy | nice |
| 23:16.16 | PrezKennedy | i love that car |
| 23:16.41 | PrezKennedy | id settle for one without all the nerdy attachments though :p |
| 23:17.29 | brlcad | Twingy: hehe, nice -- where is that? |
| 23:17.40 | Twingy | universal studios |
| 23:17.41 | PrezKennedy | looks like universal studios |
| 23:18.00 | Twingy | same car they used on wikipedia |
| 23:18.01 | PrezKennedy | was that the ride attraction they had? |
| 23:18.15 | Twingy | yes |
| 23:19.04 | PrezKennedy | i think they closed that finally didnt they? |
| 23:19.15 | Twingy | dunno, that picture was from 2005 |
| 23:19.56 | PrezKennedy | i went and saw it back in 1995 or 96 |
| 23:20.07 | Twingy | ditto |
| 23:20.32 | PrezKennedy | mom has all the cool vacation pictures |
| 23:20.36 | PrezKennedy | she needs to scan them |
| 23:27.32 | Twingy | brlcad: do you know of a light weight opengl volume rendering engine other than vre? |
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| 23:44.44 | pacman87 | brlcad: i just bought one of those too, except i was playing forza :) |
| 23:57.49 | csanyipal | so long! |
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| 01:54.29 | Axman6 | brlcad: oh damn, just woke up and checked out that link for your car, i'm very jealous |
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| 04:16.03 | Scott_ | hi, has anyone here had problems with adobe fonts? |
| 04:42.52 | yukonbob_ | hello, cadheads |
| 04:52.15 | Scott_ | i dont think anyones really here |
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| 09:37.10 | csanyipal | Hi |
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| 15:01.58 | brlcad | Axman6: thanks, I'm pretty happy with it ;) |
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| 15:27.31 | mafm | hi |
| 15:27.56 | brlcad | howdy mafm |
| 15:32.43 | mafm | howdy :) |
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| 15:53.12 | *** topic/#brlcad is BRL-CAD Open Source Solid Modeling || http://brlcad.org || http://sf.net/projects/brlcad || GSoC 2008 Highlight: new prototype gui, check it out! || Source Release 7.14.0 is now posted (20081108) | |
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| 16:35.38 | yukonbob_ | morning cadheads |
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| 16:40.26 | Axman6 | happy new year yukonbob_! |
| 16:40.38 | Axman6 | and hello from the future! |
| 16:41.09 | Axman6 | 2009 is better than anyone exer dreamed! flying cars cost $5US, and run on CO2 from the atmosphere! |
| 16:41.23 | Axman6 | and with that lovely news, i'm off to bed. night all |
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| 18:13.02 | PrezKennedy | unfortunately 2009 is when the world flooded and became a horrible kevin costner movie |
| 18:13.11 | PrezKennedy | so the cars may fly, but they have nowhere to land |
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| 19:57.31 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33434 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/regdef.c: Mods to get current values. |
| 19:58.33 | mafm | bye cadheads :) |
| 19:59.12 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33435 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ged.c: Minor mods. |
| 20:00.40 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33436 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/vutil.c: Modified ged_view_update to call gv_callback. |
| 20:04.01 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33437 10/brlcad/trunk/include/ged.h: Activate struct ged's gv_callback and gv_clientData members. Added a few function declarations. |
| 20:04.53 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33438 10/brlcad/trunk/src/libged/ (arot.c rot.c scale.c tra.c): Split out the arg parsing into separate functions. |
| 20:07.30 | CIA-31 | BRL-CAD: 03bob1961 * r33439 10/brlcad/trunk/src/mged/ (42 files): More mods to get MGED using libged. |
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